The HoneyDew with Ryan Sickler - 326: HoneyDew Podcast #326 | Philip Bowen Finds Fiddling Through Sesame Street

Episode Date: March 24, 2025

My HoneyDew this week is musician Philip Bowen! You can listen to his music on any streaming platform. Philip joins me in the studio to Highlight the Lowlights of growing up in West Virginia and chasing his dream of making music. He shares insights into his Lebanese heritage and the cultural diversity of West Virginia. We also discuss the challenges his community has faced amid the opioid epidemic and the lasting impact it has today. Philip opens up about balancing corporate life with his passion for music—until he finally took the leap to pursue it full-time in 2020. CATCH ME ON TOUR https://www.ryansickler.com/tour Nashville, TN - March 28-29 Los Angeles, CA - April 8th Madison, WI - April 12th (Special Taping) SUBSCRIBE TO MY YOUTUBE and watch full episodes of The Dew every toozdee! https://youtube.com/@rsickler SUBSCRIBE TO MY PATREON - The HoneyDew with Y’all, where I Highlight the Lowlights with Y’all! Get audio and video of The HoneyDew a day early, ad-free at no additional cost! It’s only $5/month! AND we just added a second tier. For a total of $8/month, you get everything from the first tier, PLUS The Wayback a day early, ad-free AND censor free AND extra bonus content you won't see anywhere else! https://www.patreon.com/TheHoneyDew What’s your story?? Submit at [e-mail] Get Your HoneyDew Gear Today! https://shop.ryansickler.com/ Ringtones Are Available Now! https://www.apple.com/itunes/ http://ryansickler.com/ https://thehoneydewpodcast.com/ SUBSCRIBE TO THE CRABFEAST PODCAST https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-crabfeast-with-ryan-sickler-and-jay-larson/id1452403187 SPONSORS: The Farmers Dog -Get 50% off your first box of fresh, healthy food at https://www.TheFarmersDog.com/HONEYDEW PLUS, get FREE shipping! EveryPlate -New customers can enjoy this special offer of only $1.99 a meal. Go to https://www.everyplate.com/podcast and use code HONEYDEW199 to get started.

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please contact Connects Ontario at 1-866-531-2600 to speak to an advisor free of charge. I'm headed back to Zanies in Nashville, Friday, March 28th and Saturday, March 29th, Madison, Wisconsin. I'm excited to announce I'm shooting my next special at your club comedy on state. I was there not too long ago, had such a great time, such a great club that I'm excited to work with them and bring you my next special. Two shows Saturday April 12th. Get your tickets now at RyanSickler.com The Honeydew with Ryan Sickler.

Welcome back to the honeydew, y'all. We're over here doing it in the night pan studios. I'm Ryan Sickler, Ryan sickler.com, Ryan sickler on all your social media. Starting this episode, like I start them all by saying thank you. Thank you for supporting this show. Anything I do, if you want to come see me on tour, tickets are on my website at Ryan sickler dot com. If you got to have more of this show, then I can't tell you enough. I've said every week for years now, you've got to have the patron.

It's five bucks. I've never raised it. It's not getting any higher. It is this show with y'all. The Honeydew with y'all is the wildest show on Patreon. It's five bucks. And I promise you, you're going to hear stories there. You're not hearing anywhere else in podcasting. All right? If you or someone you know has a story that has to be heard, please submit it to honeydewpodcast podcast at Gmail.com and hopefully we get to do an episode together. That's it, man. That's the biz. You guys know we do here. We're highlighting the low lights and I always say that these are the stories behind the storytellers.

And I am very excited to have this guest here. First time on the do. Ladies and gentlemen, Philip Bowen. Welcome to the honey. Do you feel about it? Let's go. Thank you for having me, bro, thank you for being here. Yeah, man. Before we get into whatever you'd like to talk about today,

right there, plug all of it, go ahead. All right, listen, I'm a musician, so please go listen to my music wherever you get music, Spotify, Apple, Amazon, however you do your thing. You can find me out there, Philip Bowen. My debut album is called Old Kanawha, and then my next album is on the way. And we got singles coming out starting in March. So whenever you're seeing this, got new songs out there for you to listen to. And then you can find my tour

dates and my merch on my website. It's just philipbowemusic.com. Bowen's the last name, no pun intended. I know. It's interesting. It just worked out. So, you know, we met today in person. We were communicating through Instagram, which is something I really don't, like when I see people hit me up, I'm like, this ain't even real, you know what I mean? I'm like, this is some fucking bot or whatever, but it's a pleasure to have you here. I've really looked into your music and stuff since,

and I'm a big fan. Thank you. But let's go back to the beginning. So you're a West Virginia boy, is that right? Yeah, man. Is that born and raised? Born and raised, born and bred, baby. Tell us, because you're outside, you know,

I'm from Maryland, as you know, and I've spent some time in West Virginia, real West Virginia, like Paul Paul, West Virginia. Come on, deep cut. Deep cut. Deep cut. Okay, Paul Paul, double two Pauls. Seriously, deep cut, yeah.

Just saying it twice. I spent some time in Paul Paul. Yeah. Yeah. Tell us. But you said something to me about how diverse West Virginia is. Because when you think about it, I'm myself included, you just think it's a bunch of hillbilly whites. That's right. Yeah. So let's talk about it. Yeah. So I mean, it's a lot of immigrants in West Virginia. My whole family, my mother's side is all Lebanese immigrants. What brought them to West Virginia? So they came over, my great grandparents

literally came over on the boat, late 1800s, early 1900s to Ellis Island. And then they either stayed there in Brooklyn or they went to find work. And so a lot of the Lebanese came and they could work in the coal mines. That's, okay. My grandfather opened a little general store and ran it with,

my mom has a few sisters, so they all just ran the family grocery store in this little coal town in West Virginia. Now, Lebanese for your family, West Virginia, but is also a big area where there's a Lebanese community? Yeah. There is. Yeah, Charleston, West Virginia, and it's a lot of the Catholic, Greek Orthodox, Syrian Orthodox Leban Lebanese. So like whatever you want to call that, like the Christian, Lebanese, that whole side of the country. Like a lot of those immigrants found their way to West Virginia and it's like Irish immigrants. I had no idea. Yeah. Yeah. Still white skin, but just different. Still white skin. So we get like a little olive oil tone sometimes.

Pepper type of oil. Yeah, that's it, that's it, bro. That's why our state food is the pepperoni roll. You ever had a pepperoni roll? You mean this like a piece of pepperoni with some dough around it? With just like the homemade dough. That's it? That's it, that's the state food, that's all we got, man.

That dough, that. That and hot dogs with slaw on it, that's all we got. That's our calling card, that's our calling card. Oh, man. Okay, so your mom's Lebanese, dad's white. Just he's what I think of West Virginia. He's a good old boy. Okay.

Yeah, country. All right. So what's it like growing up? How many siblings do you have? Yeah, I grew up in a very small town, USA. What's it called? Montgomery, West Virginia. Okay.

In between Boomer and Smithers. Montgomery, very small town. I had heard of you. You had heard none of them. Yeah. And so like 30 minutes from the capital city, which is Charleston. Okay. And I have an older sister, Laura, who's a couple years older than me and a younger brother, Patrick, who's two and a half years younger than me. And so a family of five, my parents still together, you know? So that's a blessing. You know, they had a good family unit growing up,

but big fat Greek wedding style family on the Lebanese side, you know, like I knew my I grew up knowing my third and fourth cousins. It's a huge family. I love that shit. Extended family on her mom's side. Yeah, extended family. You got a bunch of cousins running around with you and stuff. Same age, same age.

Lots of cousins of same age. And then because it's like Appalachia, small town, especially. It's very much one of those towns where nobody locks their doors truly. Still to this day, very few people lock their doors. Is that right? Yeah, so your best friends are like just, like sometimes my friends would come over to the house

when I was gone and I'd walk home, my mom would be like making them food. They'd be waiting on me to get home, you know, that kind of vibe. So very cool place to grow up. Not a lot to do sometimes, but a cool place to grow up for sure. Yeah.

And then what's dad's side of the family like? Dad's side is definitely not as close, not as big. We had like lots of siblings, but on that side, you know, my dad has four siblings. Most are in the area. Some weren't in the area. Lots of cousins, but not as close. But you know, like the area of the country where I'm from to the opioid epidemic is real bad, real bad. And it's not just in my family, it's every

community. I mean, it's everywhere now too. Everywhere, bro. Everywhere. So I grew up, I had like first- What would you say? Is this a lower middle class neighborhood growing up or- Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there's not a lot of affluence in Montgomery or this county. I grew up in one of the poorest states in America. So there are some like wealthier cities and communities,

but they're mostly like around Charleston or up in Morgantown. There are some pretty wealthy communities, but for the most part, it's just working class people, kind of looking out for each other, stuff like that. But during this time, especially during the really bad opioid epidemic, you might have somebody get hurt playing football or something, and the doctors are prescribing them like thousands of opioid pills, you know, you know, kind of touting it as a miracle drug, as all this was going on. There's

these like pain clinics and stuff like that. So it was just going out of control real fast, like, you know, get in one house and everybody in the house all of a sudden is like hooked on it. So it just happened to any of your family or? Yeah. I mean, I had some cousins. I mean, to this day, like I have, you know, addiction has been a close friend, unfortunately, to our family for a long time. Like I've had cousins that have gone through this and then, you know, I write about this, I sing about this all the time. Like it's truly, you'd be very hard pressed to find a friend or a neighbor like growing up in that area that didn't have like a one-to-one connection in their

immediate family that had gone through it. You know, it's just, it's just a, it's a true like disease there, man. So it's, it makes it a challenge because they're like, it'll change somebody almost overnight. It changes the whole family. Yeah. What, what did your parents do for work? So my parents both had really interesting careers. My mom, like, you know, they both grew up very poor, very poor.

And they're both very intelligent, smart people. My dad ended up getting his computer science degree. He worked for Union Carbide and Dow Chemical as a computer software engineer guy for a long time in West Virginia, no less. So he was working at Union Carbide until they got bought out by DuPont or Dow Chemical. Then he worked for them, like doing some consultant stuff. And then my mother was a nurse anesthetist at the local hospital.

And she worked at the same rural hospital for over 40 years. Never changed to a different hospital. So she just provided care for people in our community for her whole career. They both recently retired, like within the last two years. So yeah, my dad traveled all the time for work. He was always traveling for work, you know, cause not a lot of computer software work going on

like in rural West Virginia. So he was always going to like Delaware or New York or overseas. Sometimes he would do that, but we just, they never wanted to leave home. So in terms of like living outside of West Virginia. So that's where we stayed. And so what are you in line of kids? In the middle. The middle. I'm in the

best spot. You are. Yeah. I always like be in the second. I mean, I'm by four minutes, but I'm still a second one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm the middle child. Yeah. So, you know, and like music is a big part of everything you do in Appalachia. That's why I think so much good music comes from there, but like literally. Let's talk about that. So it was not just for you, that's a big part of the community there? Yeah, I mean, I mean, it was,

we came from a musical family. Like my mom wanted us all to like learn some kind of instrument growing up just as a, okay, my sister was a great piano player. My younger brother also plays the fiddle slash violin. I've been playing the fiddle since I was four years old. But- Really?

Yeah. Why the fiddle? What made you pick up a fiddle? I was, I saw this guy, there's this like a very famous violinist named Itzhak Perlman and he was on Sesame Street. And I was like, I was obsessed with Sesame Street when I was like four and five years old.

Sesame Street made you become a, how about that? Yeah, shout out to Sesame Street. Shout out to mother fucker Sesame Street. Yeah, like four and five years old. Sesame Street made you become a, how about that? Yeah, shout out to Sesame Street. Shout out to mother fucker Sesame Street. Yeah, they wrote me in, man. And I was like, as only a four year old can be, I was so obsessed. I wanna learn the violin, I wanna learn the violin. So this small little community college in our town

had a very small music department. And shout out to Dr. Meyer. I think he's still doing his thing somewhere, but he's an oboe player. He didn't know violin, but he knew music. Mm-hmm So he's like why don't meet a lot of? We have like a rural West Virginia oboe player band teacher trying to teach me fiddle violin and Such a fucking anytime I hear oboe, I think of like Peter Wolf.

You know what I'm talking about? That's what they would make us study. And it was on record when they make us study. It was all he's gone through the woods. It's all oboe. That's like weird. We're posture. They got to have a planet. Yeah. Oh, has such a very distinct sound.

Yeah, man. Yeah. So he was the guy that sort of like says between Sesame Sesame Street and him, He sort of tapped into it Huh? Yeah, so it wasn't because your dad was playing a fiddle or mom or was around the house No, nobody played fiddle, but no my dad loved that kind of old country music Can I just ask you people yell at me for interrupt? Yeah, of course. This is my own ignorance. I'll take it What is the actual difference between a violin a viola? And a fiddle.

A great question. So violin and fiddle, no difference except for how you play it, just how you play it. What's that mean? Give me an example of how you play it. You might be thinking of classical. Sure. Yeah.

Ba ba ba ba ba ba ba ba. You know, like, wanna give you an example? Okay. Oh yeah, hell yeah. Hopefully this isn't like screaming hot in your mind. So this instrument is either a violin or a fiddle depending on how the person plays. And the type of music you're playing.

So maybe like, you know. What is this, violin? Violin might be, you know. Oh yeah. You know, you're thinking like, you go out to a fancy dinner. Fiddle is, you know, like. Yeah.

Yeah. That's what I'm saying. Yeah. Exactly. Violin doesn't want to make me yeehaw. No, I'm not gonna do that. Like, you know, Fiddle, you got some stank on that thing. I mean, like, so you're feeling something.

Yeah. With the fiddle. And so. So you learned violin first? Yeah. Yeah, but then because of where I was and because of what I've always enjoyed, like fiddle just became a part of like, you know, first? Yeah. Yeah, but then because of where I was and because of what I've always enjoyed, fiddle just became a part of who I was.

There's this festival in West Virginia every year called the Vandalia Gathering. It's just a big bluegrass Americana, folky kind of festival. And it's literally all these people just get in a big field around the capital. And there's a fiddle contest and a banjo contest. And when the contests aren't going on,

people are just standing in circles playing tunes. And that's how you learn. It's like their drum circle. It's very like, like. And then what you're all like playing together and then you step in the middle for your little. Everybody takes, everybody takes, it's called a, it's called call and respond kind of playing.

So, you know, da da da da da, and then you step in, you shred a little bit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Shot this way, old son, all right. And you, you know, you're trying to, you're doing your thing and like, you kind of, you shred a little bit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Shot this way, old son. All right. And you're trying to, you're doing your thing and like, you learn how to listen musically, which is like really important. I mean, not only is it important musically, it's important in podcasting.

It's important in life. No doubt. So many times, just don't fucking listen. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So it's a cool, it's a cool culture of music there. I mean, it doesn't matter if it's somebody died or if there's a birthday party, people are bringing their instruments and there. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So it's a cool, it's a cool culture of music there. I mean, it doesn't matter if it's somebody died

or if there's a birthday party, people are bringing their instruments and there's music coming. Maybe you said, and I forget, what did mom and dad play? Anything? You said mom wanted you to be, but did she play anything?

This is not going to be the answer that you're expecting. My mom, no, she sang a little bit. She enjoyed singing. She had an instrument. But she liked Broadway. So not maybe what you're expecting from her. My dad played the trombone. No, that's what my daughter's playing an instrument. But she liked Broadway, so not maybe what you're expecting from her. My dad played the trombone. No, that's what my daughter's playing right now.

He played trombone in band or something, you know. And listen, we love him. And he still played it? Yeah, he's an amateur trombone enthusiast. Does he still, now that you're aware, you're like, let me get my trombone out. Does he? Yeah, man. Sometimes I'll be like, he's like,

what if you did, do you think this could fit in there? I was like, I don't know if this fits in the the, you know, but and he's always trying to like arrange my stuff. If I, if I, hey, dad, listen to this mix we got the studio. What if we, what if we did, you know, he's very into like that whole music thing. And he, and my dad like was like leading the singing choir director at our church growing up, this little country church and stuff like that. So very musically inclined, just loves music. So yeah. So who's the first person that you see or experience or get a lesson from? Who is the person that shifts you from violin to fiddle? Man, that's a great question. I remember the

first time I saw one of these fiddle competitions. Cause I know I just asked you a question, I'm interrupting, I'm sorry. No. But you saw violin on Sesame Street. Yeah. And that turns you on to violin. What, what Sesame Street did you do fiddle? It's the first time I saw,

I went to that Vandalia gathering I was telling you about and I see this like five piece band get up and they're just singing this kind of like mountain music. And it was like, it was the standard kind of bluegrass band. It was like violin, banjo, mandolin, a stand up bass guy playing the guitar. And it's like the bluegrass and jazz are kind of like first cousins. It's like the there's the structure of the song, but it's like improvised every time. It just feels alive.

And I'm just like, just like, and, and like I would hear music from people like, this like very folky Americana stuff, like I still, John Denver, I love John Denver. Oh, bro. Love John Denver. Isn't he from West Virginia too? Or he just have a, or is he? No, he's, you know, Country Roads of course,

but you know, like. He has such a love for West Virginia. Such a love for it. And then I want to say he's from Colorado, which maybe is, but then the Denver throws me off. And I'm like, I can't fucking, I have to look it up. Yeah. It's that, I think, hearing, like, later on,

hearing the storytelling in the songs, like people from like John Prine and, you know, even like James Taylor, like the way he tells stories, I fell in love with that kind of music. And so when I would hear the fiddle used in that type of music, like Alison Krauss, like people like that, I was like, this speaks to me. Like, this speaks to me.

And that's what I wanted to do. Which is why I ended up learning the guitar later on is because I can't play that and sing like the stuff I'm writing. This is also something we were talking about. So you can't play and sing at the same time. Which is interesting. Not with that.

I was just telling my daughter that B.B. King could not play and sing at the same time. And yet he's still a legend, a hall of famer, one of the most influential musicians of rock and roll. You know, like it's wild that you don't have to be this perfect person. I'm almost with the fiddle, the way I experience it is so like I'm so in it when I'm playing the fiddle. It's very hard for me to come out of it and like do something else.

Whereas the guitar, it's like my rhythm instrument or whatever and singing is the main thing I'm trying to get across. So it's not as, it doesn't take up as much space in my brain necessarily, like the fiddle does. You know, it's hard to explain, but so I love playing the fiddle, it's a big part of my life, but like if I wanna sing,

I gotta have the guitar most of the time and then I can You know switch them back and forth. So when's that first moment you saw that when's the first moment you finally let yourself? Fiddle, okay. The first year I entered the fiddle contest was at five years old So yeah, my parents have a video at somewhere and I get up there I'm like, I'm gonna play now, Camp Town Races. And I have my boots on, my big old cowboy hat and all this stuff. And this is like, as you know, the drug with performing is this feeling of like, I played the devil out

of that little thing. I had like a 1-16th size violin, fiddle. And you play and you finish and people are like, yeah. And that's like, that feeling, I've never forgot. From that first time I did that, that's the drug. Like, oh man, that's it. And that's like, like I'd say you've been chasing it ever since.

And that is the, I loved how that, I love being able to like, when you're doing something like that, when you're performing and you can feel people like emoting or energizing back at you from performing, there's nothing like it in the whole universe. It's like when you're singingizing back at you from performing, there's nothing like it in the whole universe. It's like when you're, when you're singing a song that you've written and you hear people

singing lyrics back to you, like the first time it ever happened for me when I was playing this little show in Nashville, I got so choked up. Like I just couldn't believe that it was happening. And it's like, you know, you're like, oh, this is, this is it. Whatever I got to do to keep doing this, I will do it. You know? So it's just, there's nothing like that. So that's, I caught that bug when I was like five years old and it was hard to shake that. And then when did you decide this is something I think I want to take seriously as a career

and not just sit down on fucking Friday after work or Saturday and locally fuck around. Yeah. I mean, I thought I wanted to do it in college. You know, like I had a bunch of friends I played in a band with in college. You know, I would go play. I went to college in Tampa Bay in Florida. Okay. And we would go play at these little beach bars and coffee shops. And there was this place called Captain's Pizza. And this guy would, as long as we would just keep playing, he would keep bringing us like pizza and drinks until we stopped playing. So we played for like three, four hours, you know?

Okay, as long as we make 20 in tips, we split it between seven guys, you know? I would divide this seven, I don't know, you know? And then, but you know, I was like, like the pressure of graduation gets closer. I had some friends that ahead of me moved to Nashville. We're selling everything we have, we're going to Nashville. And it was like going terribly for them.

So I had this big fear of becoming a starving artist. And so I stopped. I just stopped. I went to grad school. My parents were pretty ambitious people and I was like scared to death of like not being successful. So I went and got my MBA in marketing, went to business school, worked in the corporate world

and I would just do this for fun. Like I play at weddings here and there. I go play a little open mic here and there at a coffee shop and I wouldn't tell people I would do it. And I'd write at home. And then right before COVID, I had got invited with a friend to go to Nashville to a music conference. And the whole way home, this drive from Nashville to Detroit. I'm miserable, bro. I'm absolutely miserable. Can't think of nothing else. And I just made this commitment and this card is still on my studio desk at home.

I was like, all right, in 2020, every single day, I'm gonna do something music related every day. And I'm gonna see what happens. I'm gonna run this thing into the ground. And that's kind of how I started chasing it down. And then it was a very transformative like two years. I just was relentless. I would work all day, my corporate job,

put the kids to bed, and then I would do these two, three hour live streams because everybody's stuck at home. I would do 12 to 15 hours of live shows from my house every week. And then- Just like at home. And I had, I didn't know what I was doing.

Like this is a beautiful streaming set up with all these cameras. I didn't know what I was doing. This is a beautiful streaming setup with all these cameras. I didn't know any of this. Just so you know, when we started podcasting long before video and everything, we were doing it out of my apartment before we had kids sitting on the couch doing that. Even this honeydew, in between the crab feast and the honeydew going to YMH Studios, I knew I was going, but they didn't have it all built out yet. So I want to say it's the first 12 episodes of the Honeydew actually were done in my old single dad place from the kitchen table, audio only, where I lived with my daughter at the

time. I feel that. I feel that. Even this show. Yeah, but it's an interesting, either you're crazy or you just have a drive. When you are the person like, you're doing that for like five people or I was at least 10 people, 15 people. And I just played for two hours and I would make like a few dollars in tips. And I remember I had like in my basement, I had a couple of like old lamps duct taped

to the beams in the basement to try to, I was like, how people's lights look so good. So I got a couple of pillowcases and like did it around the, which was like I burned through one of them and got real as it gets so hot, you know, all this stuff. And I had the old pair of iPhone headphones I would use as a mic and like dangle it down up here, just trying to figure out how to make this stuff work.

And I would record songs by doing video takes on my iPad because I didn't know how to record. I would extract all the audio and put it on Spotify just to give people something to listen to. And so this was like a couple of years of this. Isn't it funny too that we all try to make these pretty things and we try to make it perfect. Boy, it's his name Oliver Anthony that did the song on,

and you can hear the crickets in the background. And I'm like, what the fuck are we all cleaning up all these? Perfections for when he's got all the fucking nature behind him and stuff I felt like it added a layer to yeah something that it's been missing, you know, like people love to see that whole Taking that journey with you like I'm like I told you this when I got here today. I Remember driving to these things I would be doing, listening to like the Crab Feast. That's crazy, for real?

Yes, or like my brother and I would be driving somewhere and I'm like, why am I even playing this stupid gig? It's like I'm paying me nothing. And I have these long drives, but like I don't like to listen to music when I go on trips, because all I do is music all the time. Right, and I don't listen to podcasts,

I'm listening to music. Exactly. So I found the craft feast. And it would give me, I'm not just saying this because you're in the room, but it would give me so much, like, OK, I can laugh a little bit. I can de-stress a little bit, whatever. And anyways, it was just people in my life were like, you got this corporate job

that you worked and got your master's degree. Like, I was making pretty good money in the corporate world. Why, like, why, do you realize what the odds are to do this, to make a dollar off, to make even a dollar off a song is so hard. And I was like, you don't understand, you don't get it. You know, I mean- It ain't about that dollar.

Ain't about that. I mean, I need that dollar. I need it, I need it. I need it. I need it. I need't about that dollar. Ain't about that. I mean, I need that. I need that. I need it. Get a little tight, get a little tight. But you know, and now that I can do this for, and support my family with music, there's nothing like it. But it's, it's been a grind, bro, to get there and anyways.

I think people tell me all the time, like I was a supervisor at UPS, shout out to UPS Baltimore, primary one, Joe Avenue. And that would have definitely been, I would have rose the ranks and been in this corporate, you know, they might be a corporate 100 company or fortune, excuse me, 100 company. Now they were 500 when I was there. So yeah, to leave what everyone else would look at is like this good paying job and you got the insurance, the safety, the security, all that. Yeah. But that's not what's fueling you inside.

And that's kind of how I knew, like for me at least, like I've had a really good stabilizing influence. My wife has been the greatest. Like everything I've done, or like what's going to go do, or anything that's big that's happened for me, I'm like, oh, I got mountain stage, or I got this, or I got that. She'd be like, of course she did.

I knew you would. Of course she did. Go do it. Do blah, blah, blah. It was like, and like, truly like, I don't know how I found this woman because like before this person in my life, Jamie was my wife's name.

I like, I- You ain't gonna believe it. I lived- Jamie get your hands in! No way! I thought he was home with the kids. Who's got the kids? That's my favorite thing ever, dude.

I know, that's my favorite thing in the world. I told you guys, I'll steal that every time. People fall for it every time. That's a nod to the feast right there. That's my favorite thing in the whole world. I wish, I said, I wish we had video of the crab feast because I would cut a montage of people that would, they always look.

You're like Mr. Sowin, so who was the guy you said originally, I was gonna do it there, but who was the guy used to, they would, they always look you like Mr. So and say, who was the guy you said originally I was going to do it there, but who was the guy used to the doctor? Oh, the teacher at school or Dr. Myers. I was going to hit you with a Dr. Myers and people still would turn and look, they can't help but turn it. Yeah.

Yeah. So it's, it's a, that's, I almost retched a couple of times. I laughed so hard at that bit, man. I'd be like, I'd be like like these people would not see it coming. And then you hit it with that. It was for us. And we didn't even care if they liked it. We didn't even care if they liked it.

I'm laughing before you even finish. I'm like, bro, it's so funny. You can't believe this is unbelievable, man. This is crazy. It's crazy. And people be like, oh my God, are you serious? Look, I can like visualize. We had a lot of budget to bring some.

You got my fourth grade science teacher in here. I'm back there. This is crazy, man. I can't believe this, dude. Oh, I'm straight up here. What? Yeah, that's me, bro. All right. You know what time it is? It's time for a fresh approach to dog food, and that's where the farmer's dog comes in. Developed by board certified nutritionist, the farmer's dog is human

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and it's just getting you through and you're just fucking like, I want more. And at what age do you say, fuck it then, and you go for it? You say right around the pandemic? I started, yeah, 2020, I started at 35. I'm trying to like restart and in your world of music. Is that late? Yeah, it is. Yeah, it's super late. I feel old as hell every time I do anything. Okay. But now there's lots of people that are like my age, like doing things. But yeah, sometimes I'll go like there was times I would go have like a big open like I opened for Wyatt Flores last year. He's a really big country artist, but he's 26. So I'm like 38. Yeah, but you also started at five. And if you probably would have stayed the course, you'd be 26 doing this. I tried to put that, I tried to put that away. You've been fiddling for a long time. You just ain't been in the music world.

And I had a lot of songs like in my back pocket that I had never finished and stuff like that. So it was just like, at first I would really stress about that, but there's no mistakes in the timing of it. I really believe that. Like I'm not able to write the stuff out right now because I've got some more life experience. I've had some loss. I've had some, I can think back on some of the insane like relationships that thankfully I was able to like navigate away from and things like that. And so you can use all that ammo and create. And I'm like, you know what? Every, literally every day I get to do music for a living is a great day because there was so long. I thought that dream was completely dead for me. I've got letters in my studio of people sending me rejection things about my songs. Like, no, no, no, it's too hard. You're too old. What is this?

I don't like this, blah, blah, blah. And people will line up around the block to tell you what you can't do. And so for me, like just being here doing this or getting to work out and do work in music and do the things I get to do is like the best thing ever. So I just try to take it a day at a time, you know? Try not to get buried in like what if, what if, because I was killing myself with that for a while. And that's at 35. 35. 35.

And then when do things start to get a little, like where you're like, okay, I'm going to go, I got this. Year three was very transformative, like where, you know, I got- Is that pretty quick too, three years in? It was. It was pretty quick. Starting late, but getting a window. Yeah. But I was kind of charged up too from like previous life experience. So like in the same year, oddly enough,

I had a little taste of success. I had won a couple of like little contest things and stuff like that. I won this like TikTok's greatest talent thing. I won like 10 Gs and it was exactly what I needed to finish recording my first album. But then I got so burned out, I was gonna quit everything. And then at the end of 2022, and then in 2023,

in the same year, I got all this crazy, all these doors were just opening. I got like, you know, I was on mountain stage on NPR. I was on AGT. I made it through to like the finals or the semifinals. I was on Americana Fest. I got to play at WVU, like my favorite, my favorite team and my home state, you know,

all these cool things. And all these great gigs started happening. I had to play on stage with Darius Rucker that year. Wow, okay. At Big Slick. So shout out to Eric Stonestreet for having me be a part of that. So all these crazy things

that I would have never dreamed possible were all happening in that year. So like the last three years, especially, I've been just like truly life-changing for me in order to be able to just do like, like is my job. Like this is so crazy. So what was the first thing you got where you're like, oh shit, okay, this is this is a little bit bigger than fiddling down at the fucking VFW. Yeah, yeah. To think that either mountain stage or the first time I got called to do the Bluebird Cafe, which is this famous place in Nashville. Yeah.

But it's like an invite only thing. As a songwriter, it's a huge credibility thing. You have to be invited to go and then if your songs pass, the first time you play there, if when you're done they tell you like, hey, thanks for playing the Bluebird. We can't wait to see you again. That's a great industry wise. That's a great thing in your life. If they kind of tell you like, thanks for coming for playing the Bluebird. We can't wait to see you again. That's a great, industry-wise, that's a great thing in your life. If they kind of tell you like, thanks for coming,

good luck with your career, you know, not great. So I got invited to do that. It went really well. I felt great. And then Mountain Stage, that kind of changed my life, because I was in such a huge audience, you know, in the music world. And what is that?

So NPR Music does two things. They do like Tiny Desk and Mountain Stage. And so it's recorded live in West Virginia. It's live on every NPR Music does two things. They do like Tiny Desk and Mountain Stage. And so, it's recorded live in West Virginia. It's live on every NPR station in the country. And then they just replay it over and over. And one of my songs ended up being NPR Song of the Week. And they just, it was like this song about Okinawa. And they just played the heck out of the song.

How's it? Can you play a little bit of it? Yeah, yeah. I mean, there's like this little fiddle intro lick I got on the guitar. You know, it's you know, like a little fiddle lick and then I'll, I'll grab, I've been watching Yellowstone. You got a lot of that going on right now. Yeah, dude. And it's like, um, yeah. So, now. Yeah, dude. And it's like, yeah, so, so this this song I put out with a really good friend of mine who's been good to me, this artist from West Virginia named Charles Wesley Godwin. And he was kind of blown up around the same time. And it's about this river that runs in my backyard, you know, and it goes like this. It goes like this. levels tea table if you can climb to the top you can see the air mode waters of the old canals well there's the new and there's the golly but they're a little too rough the green briar and the holly but they ain't deep enough. Well there's a place in

the valley that runs wide and free. She's the mighty old canola and she is home to me so that's like you know some of that song thank you and that's the very song that i got this like really insane rejection letter on from some record company in nashville that was like ah pass not good but bluebird liked it bluebird liked it it was on mountain stage it's my biggest song i've ever put out and i played that for the guy i recorded it with and this is another thing i try to get through to people too, that especially if you're going into the arts, if there's someone judging, then it's just one person, one person, one person. And, and that day they might be having a shitty motherfucking day.

Who knows? It's just one, but no matter what, it's one person's opinion. It's just a gatekeeper, move on, go find another person that loves that. That's really good advice. For a few years, I was really like, I didn't want to sing in front of people because I had written this song for a college girlfriend. And she was like, oh, like that was really pretty, but you have kind of a weird voice.

Just like I was 18 at the time. I was like, what? And she was like, no, it was really beautiful. What? Yeah, I was like, what? I was like, no, it's fine. I'm fine. I was like, I got back to my car.

I was like, oh my God. And I was like, what? Like I have a weird voice. And then like at 18 that stuck with me and I was like, oh man, like I don't know if I wanna, but she was the worst anyway, but anyways, but so for a while, like that kind of stuff like can get in your head and kind of mess with you

and blah, blah, blah, but you gotta just kind of like, you know, you're one-on-one. So you gotta like embrace whatever makes you unique, you gotta hold on to that. You just know everybody else has already taken. Come on. That's what they say. Come on.

Yeah, exactly. So, excuse me, how does AGT then come about? AGT had reached out to me. What year were you on, 22? I was on season 18, which was like 2023 was the year I did it. So the producers had reached out to me the year before to do it, and I did not want to do it. I was just really nervous about it. I was like, am I going to be like into like a talent lock or something where if I

play my stuff. I see if you're like stuck in a contract. Yeah, which is really prevalent at the time. And then they reached out to me the next year and stuff had grown for me a lot, like online and everything. And I was like, listen, we think this would be really good for you. And basically, unless you win the whole thing, there's no talent lock to even be worried about. So you can make that decision when the time comes that we think this would be great for you.

Well, it's good for you to protect yourself that way because I used to watch American Idol back in the day and I feel like they would take the top 10 of them and put them on a tour, top five and stuff. Not just the winner, there were a few people that were locked. Exactly. And how I understood it was I was like they would take the top 10 of them and put them on a tour, top five. Exactly, even stuff. Not just the winner. There were a few people that were locked. Exactly. And how I understood it was I was like,

unless you can like, so I think they had backed off of a lot of that. And so when I went out to Pasadena to do it, so I got to skip a few of the steps. I got to, I didn't have to go wait at the convention center all day in one of those big lines and stuff like that. I went straight to auditioning in front of the judges. OK. So they flew me out to Pasadena, and I actually took the lines and stuff like that. I went straight to auditioning in front of the judges. Okay.

So they flew me out to Pasadena and I actually took the guitar and the fiddle. I wasn't sure what I was gonna do, but when I got there, and it's kind of like mess when you get there, like you're walking in, okay, Ryan, all right, you go over here. All right, Phillip, all right, you're a talent audition.

You're gonna, I forget what the word was. You're gonna go in this room. So they were like, no, they say, you're a novelty act. to go in this room. So they were like, no, they say you're a novelty act. You go in this room. So the people that are like the dancing banana, they're like the novelty acts, they're going in a whole separate, they get, they have different catering, they're all this, you know, it's like, it feels weird, you know, you're like, are you a talent audition?

You're coming over here. Yeah. And you know, whatever. So, um, but in my room, there's everybody and their mother is singing and I don't see any other fiddles in the room. None. I'm like, all right, well, I'm not going to sing.

I'm not like a belter, but I don't, this is, this is, I'm going to go all in on the fiddle. And if I play an original on there, I'm not going to get paid for my original. Like I'm not going to get paid for that, playing that on TV. So because I would decided so late, I was like, I got to pick a song that can clear legally at enough time. So I was talking to my music producer and I was like, I gotta pick a song that can clear legally at enough time. So I was talking to my music producer and I was like, what if we do System of a Down? He's like, what?

Yeah, like what if we do System of a Down, like, you know, dun-da, dun-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. Can you play what you played? Yeah, kind of, it's kind of hard without the track, but like, you know, like, so I walk out there with this like really old- Do you want me to put the track on Spotify right now? Yeah, you could do it.

Yeah. What song? It's, oh, you know, what's that? You know, it's like a you wanted to, oh my gosh. My mind is like blank on this song right now. Chop Suey. I was just about to say chop Suey.

Okay, you ready? So yeah, I'm ready. Here we go. You can blast it. So this is playing, right? I'll just start shredding. I'll just start shredding. You know all this stuff right? Do it. Yeah. You know, I'm just like shredding with this song and because I was like, I got to do something that's very unexpected. So they're coming out expecting me to play some bluegrassy, twangy, hokey dokey cowboy hat stuff.

So I come out there with my flat bill, whatever. I'm wearing tennis shoes, not boots. And they're like, what are you gonna play? I'm like, I'm playing chop suey. And they're like, what? And I just, and it's like that, Pasadena Civic Auditorium is massive. It is massive. And it's full, full.

I start shredding, bro. And before I'm 30, you know how like when you're performing you can feel when you have the audience on your side? I'm 30 seconds in, every single person is just on their feet, they're vibing. So I knew in the audition, I was like, I got it, I got it. I'm through. Like, so then like, you know, there's a little bit of-

Who are the judges for you? It's Simon. Simon, Howie, Sophia, and Heidi Klum. Heidi Klum. Yeah, so it's pretty, it's pretty cool. But you know, as soon as you? Simon? Simon, Howie, Sophia, and Heidi Klum. Heidi Klum. Yeah. So it's pretty cool, but as soon as you walk off the stage, like the lawyers there, and they're like, all right, listen, you can't post about this. You can't talk about this.

We'll call you by this time if you're going to make, if we're going to air your audition, even though you got all yeses, that doesn't mean we're going to air it. And then we're also going to call you if you're coming back for the live semifinals. I was like, what thought I was through? We'll see. The executives have to pass you. Oh, so all this, you're like, what? Like executives?

But then like the rest of that week, these people from NBC who I'd never heard of were coming to find me. And being like, oh, you just keep doing what you're doing? That's what we wanna see. Just more of that, more of you, talk more, just give us more of you. So I knew I was coming back, you know?

So then I went out, The Lives is where it gets like really serious. Like they put a lot of production money into you. I had like a full band behind me. And where do you go for that? Same, it was still in Pasadena, but you're just there for much longer. I was there for like several weeks.

And then, you know, preparing for like, cause it's like, it's truly live TV when you actually perform. So I just give a wish list of what I wanted. I was like, I want a full band. I really want Pyro. Like if I'm going to do this on TV, I want like some fireworks or something.

They give it to you? Yeah. Like if you, if you go watch my, like, like my live set up on the edition, like at the end, I like hit this. It was so hard for me to nail this timing and the choreography, like I finished, I raised my fiddle up in the air and right, my fiddle goes up on the edition. Like at the end, I like hit this. It was so hard for me to nail this timing and the choreography, like I finished, I raised my fiddle up in the air and my fiddle goes up in the air.

There's like, kaboom. That's all I got. Just one of the fireworks and everything, you know, just to have fun with it, you know? And it was, it was cool, man. And did you do the same song? No, I did, I did a drop kick Murphy's. I did shipping up to Boston.

Okay, yeah, yeah. Da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, da, Play a little of that one. You know? And that's like a layup but it's shipping up to Boston. Okay, yeah, yeah. Da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da I had like a, the band was like, like an accordion, a full drum, electric guitar player and a bass player. And we just rocked, bro. It was so fun. And you get like two minutes to do whatever you wanna do. And then Terry Crews comes out and like crushes your hand.

I forgot Terry Crews. He's like ripping his shirt every time he moves. I forgot. He's like, ah! And they got this thing backstage that'll show you how many people are like watching live. So right before I walk out, he's like, hey, Bowen, look at that. I was like, and they got this thing backstage that'll show you how many people are watching live. So right before I walk out, he's like, hey, Bowen, look at that.

I was like, what is that? He's like, that's how people are watching, no pressure. And it was like 8 and 1 half million people live. And when I walked out onto the stage, my family's in the audience, all this stuff, I've got like 60 little body packs on me. I go stand in my spot and there's like a two minute countdown to when the live teams start.

That's what I wanna ask you, how long you get? Two minutes? get to about two and a half minutes and they're going to show a little like 30 second video hit of me that I'm live. And I got there and I stand in place and all my packs fall off. Batteries scatter. So I'm like in front of several thousand people. How what happened? I don't know. I don't know.

And this wardrobe person who I'm very close to by this time, you know, these old girls come running out on stage. It's okay. And then the tech people are picking up the batteries, putting the passports on, they just roll down my pants. Like, cause I'm like, they got to fix everything. So I'm standing spread eagle like this in the passing of the Civic. Arms out.

Are you in the dark a little bit at least while they're doing your video? A little bit, but they're like testing out the spotlights. Yeah, yeah. And like, I met the judges several times at this point. Like they're all like, and I'm facing them. So I'm like, you know, Howie's like cracking up. Sophia's like winking at me and smiling.

And I'm just like, they're like, we have plenty of time, don't worry. They're rolling up my pants back again, putting my belt on, don't move. So I'm just frozen. All right, good. Three, two, one. They run off stage.

And I was just like, my hands were shaking. I was like, oh my gosh, cause it's like the timing is so exact. So doing that stuff live is very, I was, I had been out there so long. I was really ready to just be, I'm excited to do this and get my little minute, but I'm, I didn't have a desire to go out there

and like live in Las Vegas for a couple of months. If you win, you get a Vegas residency. That's not my bag. I wanted to go like do my shows and stuff. So. How far did you get? I mean, it's the top five in the semifinal. Wow, you did.

I got beat by a dog, man. Ha ha! Stop beating me! What did the dog do? Some magic and flips and blocks and water tricks or something, man. Fuck that dog. How's the dog, that should have its own category.

People with pets should be in their own thing. I think it was wonderful, like, as a dog in a, you know, I mean this in the best of ways, but like a blind girl playing piano and a dog. I'm like, I'm not gonna, I mean. Wait, do blind girl play with the dog? No. Oh, and she lost two?

She lost two, bro, to the dog. I was like, I remember looking at Terry backstage, like man, this is messed up. Like, they put, you know, you come up with your group, they put you in the spotlights. And if you wanna vote for Phillip, you know, whatever, pound, whatever. If you wanna vote for Miss Sunshine over here,

and then Rufus the dog, and I'm like, man, like, it's tough. You can't put a dog in there. Everybody's voting for the dog. I'm getting no sympathy vote at all. So shout out to the like, man, like, it's tough. You can't put a dog in there. Everybody's voting for the dog. I'm getting no sympathy vote at all. So shout out to the dog, man. So let's go back a little bit and tell me some times where you really were like, I'm fucked this, I'm getting out of this shit here.

Like this is- For music? Yeah, this is not for me. Yeah, I thought I had some stuff cooking a little bit and I was like, I'm gonna get out in front of people and start singing again. And it was almost five years ago to the day. It came up on my Facebook memories the other day. And I had a gig at a local coffee shop in Detroit area.

And I went and I played my heart out, man, for like three hours, bro. And the people are talking the whole time, literally nobody cared. And I made for three hours of work, I made $7 in tips, $7. And the staff felt so- And how old are you at this time?

30, I just turned 37. Even hearing the third. Oh, bro. I'm like some of these people's like great uncle's age in the coffee shop. Yeah, I'm playing this like folky, you know. Seven dollars. And this 20 something barista, she felt so bad for me.

She was like, we thought it was really good. And they gave me a bag of old scones to take home to my family. Here's some day old scones. Here's some day old scones, man. And I went home and my wife was like, how'd it go, babe? And I was like, honestly, like it sucked. Like it was really, that's very soul crushing, you know?

And like the next weekend I had to go out and I had to play like a private event. And it was for a community college's presidential inauguration for a community college. And they had a sandwich buffet and make it, I had a sandwich artist there making sandwiches for people. And I got my sandwich wrong man. I said anything but tuna man and they brought me like a big old foot long tuna sandwich. I hate tomatoes and olives, tomatoes and olives on it. And I was you know, I was playing about

one of these big old you speaker day-ish things. It was just awful. People with the full overhead lights on got paid a little bit to, got made like 500 bucks, got paid. And then I think the difference between, like I said, talking to you now and not is probably like the next day when you get up and like,

okay, I'll do it one more time. One more time. But being at 37, taking home $7 from a gig is like, it's brutal. It is brutal. And do you have kids at that time? How many at the time? I got three. I got three. Did you have all three then? No, two. Two? My son didn't have to witness that, thank God. That's the other thing though, is like, you know, it's a little bit of mental illness to be like, I just made seven bucks and I'm going to have another kid.

Yeah. You gotta fucking go. And I didn't take my kids to anything I did for the longest time. Cause I was like, the first thing I ever took them to go see me do was when I got mountain stage cause it was like big theater and it was full. And I was like, this is what I do.

You know, cause I was like, it's soul crushing, man. You go out there and like, I would love to say that I was always like, I would just be like, I'm gonna go play some music for people and go work. I'll be home later. I wouldn't say nothing about anything I was doing. And I stopped telling like a lot of friends

I was doing things to, like I post stuff on social media, but like doing those kinds of gigs is not exactly like, you know, awe inspiring to your friends and family. Your aunt Martha's on your Facebook being like, don't you have responsibility? You know what I mean? It's hard, bro.

So very soul crushing, you know? And then I, and I, especially people that knew I was having this other corporate thing and I would see people from my, popped up on my old LinkedIn and stuff like that. Being like, do you need a job in project management? You know, it's hard. That's what I wanted to ask you.

What would you be doing? This actually helped me a lot. So my whole, my MBA and my whole experience was in like digital, like digital marketing. So actually when I was starting it out from like the digital, that's why I was able to grow my social and stuff as I basically treated myself like I would have treated a client.

Like if I wanted to grow this from the ground up from day one and make this like a moneymaker, not just like paying the, not just scraping by, like how would I try to grow this like business from a digital perspective? So I tried to treat my like online presence like that when I was trying to really grow it. But I would have been doing digital project management for clients and all that stuff. I say all the time, I had all these production jobs while I was still doing comedy.

Everybody's like, you got a day job? I got a job, motherfucker. I don't know why you keep needing to put the adjective day in there. I do stand up at night and I have a job during the day. Exactly. And it was in production. And I realize now I'm so glad because I've been able to build these studios myself.

Exactly. And figure out how we want to do the lights and what looks right and sounds right. Yeah. I remember Jamie Foxx saying, I saw him give us, said this a lot, he gave his Oscar speech after Ray. And he said that when he would come home a lot, his grandmother would make him play piano before he was able to go out and play or do anything.

And he fucking was pissed. Like, I want to be out there playing with them. And she's like, you will, you'll be out there, play the piano. And he said, now, it all made sense. Like, I'm playing the piano in Ray. I wouldn't. So that's what I wanted to ask you. You also seem to be, all of us these days,

with the digital age. But does this happen for you without the digital age and you putting a footprint online? I don't think it would have. Because you said they came found you after a while. Yeah, I don't think it would have because, because especially when I like was really trying to get it going, I got really discouraged at first

because the world shut down. It's like, where am I gonna go play at? There's nowhere to go play. And just to basically keep the promise to myself, I was like, well, I'm gonna just do it online and see if anybody will listen. And so like, I think being able to grow something there allowed me to skip a few of these steps,

like in the country music world, where people are going down on Broadway and playing at these bars, playing cover songs for four or five hours at a time. I got to skip some of that, like, grant work because I had, like, a following. So when I was starting to release my own stuff, I had an audience ready to receive what I was putting out,

and I had an audience all over. So there had been some challenges to that, but without the digital thing, I don't think it would have been possible. Like it made me have some good leveraging at the table too when I started getting some, you know, offers for certain things. And I'd be like, no, I want to keep all my own. I want to own my music. I want to keep it. I'm not interested. So because I had some juice on my own, I was able to like say no to certain things, which I would have had to be like, no, I'll take whatever you got. I'll take it. I'll take the $7 gig.

Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. So it really helped me a lot. Like it's good and it's bad, but it helped me a lot to get like some people noticing what I was doing and all that kind of stuff. What advice would you give to your kids or anybody out there that's wanting to do this. I think one of my favorite things about doing this for a living is that I would give them the advice that like, it's not always probable that you're gonna be able to do what you love for a living, but it is absolutely possible.

And I think that the whole thing with that, the biggest thing I've learned through all that is, and we alluded to this earlier a little bit, but it's so everybody bars from everybody else, that's fine. The biggest thing I've learned through all that is, and we alluded this to this earlier a little bit, but it's so everybody bars from everybody else. That's fine. But you have to just keep what makes you you. And you know, my grandpa was a big like gardener, very like apple at your man. And he was very fond of this saying that like the day that you plant the seed is not the day that you eat the fruit.

And I think of him saying that all the time. The days that I get to eat the fruit is a very good day, and I would just tell them that. Just keep planting seeds, keep planting your seeds, stay yourself, stay yourself, stay yourself. Don't for anything change that part of you, what would you say was the most, well, I want to say singular most important thing, but what was it that really made you say, I got to fucking do this?

What was it that made Philip Bowen say, you know what, if I don't fucking go for this, I'm never going to be happy? I think there was a day where I know exactly when this was. I was working this job and they were getting invested in by this venture capitalist group, which is an interesting breed of, no offense to anybody, but basically what happens in these situations is they come in, they try to build up the company as fast as they can and then sell it off, right? So they were going to work this thing to the bone, get as much as we can out of it, build up the value and then throw it out.

So I remember being in my bed, we have a newborn, my son, and I remember my phone being on the nightstand like buzzing with emails and texts for an answer on like stuff like work stuff two in the morning, two thirty in the morning. I get up, I get up early, I'm getting pinged at like seven in the morning. For people that don't care a hell of beans about me, whether I live or I die, it's just about this somebody else's dream, you know? And I remember just truly kind of crashing out and being like, man, like this, I am going to die on the vine if I keep,

I cannot go the rest of my life doing this work. It means something to provide for my family, but it's meaningless to me. So like, there'll be many days where I would just shut my laptop and just play music in the room. That's how I would deal with life. I have all my instruments in my office.

And so I was like, either I'm gonna like die at 45, or I'm gonna like pursue my dream and whatever happens happens. And so when I went and I just, I have to do this or I'm going to die. And that's truly how I feel. I was like, I cannot do anything else. But I think that you, I really believe you have to feel like doing that because month like 36 is way different than like month two or three. It's so fun at first. Okay, we gotta get a website. Let's get an Instagram handle. Let's, you know, when you're like, you know what it's like,

okay, you're still doing this, bro? You still doing this? Oh, you're still doing that? Oh my God, you know, that's hard. So people ask, are you still doing comedy? Have I seen you in anything? Have I seen you doing this? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's hard. So you almost have to feel like you have to do it or else, which is how I still feel. I'd love doing it, but it's not always easy. It's still work, but you know. Do you think that if you don't find music that you end up being one of these people in West Virginia that does have a pill problem and gets stuck.

I do. I mean, I think that, I don't think it's an exaggeration for me to say like, not to be a downer here, but like I think music has saved my life in multiple ways. You know, we had a really, really awful, like very difficult loss in our family, like in between kids two and three,

like very late in the game, you know, seven, eight months, bro, like very awful. What happened? Like you're losing a child, you know? You lost a child. Well, like, you know, like as a- Oh, your wife was pregnant. Yeah, but like very, I mean,

not that it makes it any easier, but like- No, 100% hear what you're saying, I'm just being clean on it. No, whatever that was, like so- Is that a stillborn? Yeah, yeah. Because they have to deliver that thing. There's a delivery happening.

And everybody knows at this point. Oh, thank you. And truly almost killed me, honestly. I'm a very glass three quarters full person. I'm a pretty positive person. And I don't think I'd ever really had words for being that, like that feeling of being that blue. And I, you know, like I just, I had nothing,

I just took I had nothing, I just took everything out of me. I remember driving to the hospital and being like, not again, not again, not again. I just was so, you know, we had one happen in between kids one and two, but it was much earlier. And I just was like, it's just devastating. It's awful. And so to go through that and then feel like

you're also questioning everything about like, can I actually, like, what am I doing? This is not, you know, people telling you go get a real job, you know, like blah, blah, blah. So I think if I wouldn't have had this as a means to like express, I'm not good at talking about negative things in a conversation, but I, the way that I'm the best at doing that and working it out is by writing about it. So if I can like get it out of my system

or you know work through those feelings like and write a song or work through it then I can survive. And you know music kind of helps me do that. So not to be like it's really a downer story but it's true man. Like I really don't believe I would be the same person at all if I hadn't been. I believe you, dude. This has been great, man. Thank you for doing this. Yeah, man, absolutely. How about I ask you advice you'd give to 16-year-old Philip Bowen and then you fucking play us

out of here with maybe you want to do some country road? Yeah, let's do country roads, bro. I would say advice to my 16 year old self. Oh man. Advice to my 16 year old self would be to... I'm gonna think about that for one second. I would say like no matter what, no matter what, like, no matter what you're hearing on the outside noise side of things, chase the dream. Chase the dream. You know, it's never too early.

The practical stuff will always be there. And you just try your best to believe it. You are enough. Try to believe in yourself. Because I think the self-doubt really put a stop on that for the longest time for me. Not thinking that there was a place for me to do whatever I was doing And so I think the advice I would have given to myself was like just go for it. Let's do it great job Yeah, man. Go for you, dude. Yeah, man. I'm happy for you, man. We're getting there

Let's hear some country road, man. Why don't you play us out here? Oh, I won't make you a fucking play for two hours the song of songs, man Got seven bucks anywhere Okay, I got't make you a fucking play for two hours. The song of songs, man. Let's do it. Got seven bucks anywhere? I got, I got seven for you. Almost heaven. West Virginia. Blue Ridge Mountain, Shenandoah River.

Life is old there, older than the trees, younger than the mountains, blowing like a breeze. Country roads, take me home to the place I belong West Virginia mountain mama take me home country roads yeah as always Ryan Sickler on all your social media, RyanSickler.com. We'll talk to y'all next week. You