The HoneyDew with Ryan Sickler - Jamie Kilstein

Episode Date: March 13, 2019

Dewers! My HoneyDew this week is Jamie Kilstein. You ever slap your dad’s glasses off his face? Jamie has. He also opens up about mishaps, mistakes and where he is now. We cover a lot in this ep. Subscribe, rate & review! https://TheHoneyDewPodcast.com

Whoa, what are you listening to this for? Wait, who's talking? You know you're driving a 2024 Ford Escape with available Alexa built-in, so you can change the music. Oh yeah. Alexa, change station to 99.2. See? Purchase a 2024 Escape ST-Line all-wheel drive with Tech Pack at 3.49% APR for 72 months with down payment. That's just $267 bi-weekly. Cash value of $40,294. Plus, eligible Ford owners get a $1,000 bonus. For details, visit your local Ford store or Ford.ca.

You're listening to The Honeydew with Ryan Sickler. Welcome back to The Honeydew, y'all. It's another Wednesday. You're doing it over here at your mom's house. I'm Ryan Sickler. All social media, Ryan Sickler. My website's ryansickler.com. Get that album out there, y'all.

Get a hold of yourself. Available everywhere you get good music. Get it. April 4th through April 6 6 phoenix coming out to the house of comedy very excited to get out there and do some shows april 26th and 27th i'll be at the vegas festival and as i've told you uh june shows in richmond maryland and atlantic city with with tommy buns and then august 1 through the third house of comedy minnesota i'm not sure if those tickets are on sale yet um again every week out there doing it you're doers

you just are out there doing it i appreciate it i see your stories i see you guys commenting you're funny as fuck always you always have been you're really good and um i appreciate the support the honeydewpodcast.com is the website that's where you can get all the information i'm about to tell you you're like where the hell i can get it honeydewpodcast.com email me at honeydewpodcast at gmail.com social media we got facebook over there the honeydew podcast twitter at honeydew pod there's a group page on facebook already with quite a bit of followers for only a few weeks in i'm very impressed and appreciative of that but get over there and also subscribe to the official page that i set up you know i mean i

had people i paid to do that shit um and thank you guys for listening got another great guest for you this week here um you know i said you know what the show's about and he said i'm not right for all the shows but unfortunately i'm right for this show so uh i'll introduce him on that ladies and gentlemen welcome to the honey do jamie kilstein hi buddy how you doing bud uh i'm legitimately so excited to do this show i love it one and uh and two when i read what it was about just like fuck ups and like uh mistakes that actually was my first name yeah oh yeah my uh i wasn't sure how marketable no so i i named my podcast fuck up pod with jamie kilstein and my agent and like i have the art and everything if you go to itunes it's still that art because it won't switch it out and he was like yeah can

you not do that it won't trade it no no they well i don't know why uh it traded out on everything else but now it's the jamie kilstein podcast but yeah i did the same thing and uh and so i was like i've never been i've never i usually don't write people to do their podcast. We were talking about this off air. I'll never text Joe and be like, hey, bud, because I'm scared, too. But I saw yours and what it was about, and I was just like, man, I have never been more qualified for a podcast in my fucking life. Yeah, when I said to you, do you know what my show is about? I think you said something like, unfortunately, I'm not perfect for a lot of podcasts,

but I'm right for this one. I was just telling you, I wrote down a list of terrible things that have happened in my life, and it looks like a comedy set list. I love preparation. I gotta believe you probably weren't prepared for any of these events. No, not at all.

Oh, and by the way we were i was we were just laughing as i'm just like listing my like litany of issues where i'm like oh and i might have an eating disorder and the divorce i forgot i also like dropped out of high school like everything we're gonna cover it all right uh but before we get into it please promote anything you want yeah so um i have a a podcast. It's called the Jamie Kilstein podcast. I like it a lot. We talk about depression and stuff like that. And I've had people from like UFC fighters to like Moby to comics, you know.

And then my Twitter is at Jamie Kilstein, where I'm trying desperately not to stir shit anymore. And then my Instagram, which is my happy place, which is just like cats and fighting, is the Jamie Kilstein. And then if you have a fucking comedy show, book me. I'm going to be recording a new album in LA at some point. So I'll announce, but some point really soon. So if you follow me on socials, then I'll announce it there.

Great. So I wanted to go. What if I left right after that? That was it. That would be a honeydew episode, bro. So I asked you, you're originally from Jersey. Yes. Right?

Let's just start there. Yeah. So I grew up in Jersey, which kind of meant the whole chip on your shoulder about New York. Where in Jersey? So I was actually Central Jersey, in between Princeton and Trenton, so literally middle class. And I grew up very poor. It is, right? It's directly in the middle, and Princeton.

Was it Trenton in the middle of princeton trent was it trenton makes the world takes oh yeah but like one of the letters has been out on that sign for so long and it's such a depressing metaphor i don't remember what letter somebody took the e somebody took it we need to make another e uh yeah it was uh uh terrible and so i grew up like kind of more like white trash poor where our town was kind of getting gentrified around us so it was when all these like developments with the kind of houses that looked all the same were coming up and like now i go back and i'm like oh this is like a fairly wealthy town it was called pennington new jersey uh it was like a fairly wealthy town but i grew up like right around class war time where like me and the other public school kids

were getting stoned and like vandalizing the private school which was like you know the fancy where all the fancy kids went and so grew up in jersey um i'm one of five kids um i'm like i am what's the do they say that the oldest the oldest is supposed to be the responsible one but like i am the i'm the fuck up and you're the oldest yeah like in order it went i dropped out of high school then my sister dropped out of high school but got her ged then her masters damn that's a hell of a jump yeah dude then my next brother got into a good college, like D1 wrestler. Then the next brother got into an Ivy League, but he dropped out.

But now he's in like fucking Yale Law. He's great. And then the youngest one got into fucking Harvard. And so it literally went. You are the honeydew. Yeah, dude. And like just it went in order. Like my parents kept like kind of correcting.

Or has at least. It went that way. Or at least been in Ivy League. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And now both my brothers are at Yale Law. It's insane. And yeah, so I dropped out of high school. How does that happen?

How do you get the dropout? Yeah, I mean, do you just start fucking up in ninth grade? Are you really smart and you're not good at school? How do you go from being a fuck-up? Oh, that just reminded me of another fucking tragic story. so that's a great question by the way so thank you what um so i was always like mediocre in school i was the things i loved i was great at so got into you know auditioned and got into jazz band playing drums but i didn't know how to read music i just got a hold of like the the song that we were going to audition with pretended to read the music, you know, cause I loved music.

So I could sit there and play guitar, play drums for hours. Um, you know, when I started standup, uh, I would take the train in every fucking day to New York, uh, to do like an open mic, then like come back to Jersey. I squatted illegally in a dorm while handing out flyers at the Boston comedy club. I lived out of my car for two years. Like when I love something, I go fucking nuts. It's like the addict brain, but I don't have like my ex wife would,

she was one of those people who she was like, yeah, in college, like I could just like get drunk and like write a paper. And I'm like, I just couldn't do that. Like all of my learning disabilities, which there are many,

um, kick in when it's something i don't give a shit about like i can't but then but if i'm interested for some reason it just like all goes away and i can just hyper focus on it so i was mediocre probably until like sophomore year when things get like hard and uh when it's like real like real shit and like i but like i failed spanish one every year um i failed gym class i failed gym class how do you do that uh i'll tell you how you get stoned to pretend you don't have your shorts and then you just walk outside and what you just sit on a bench yeah i would just sit on the bench super high and i'd

listen to my Walkman. And I was like, this is infinitely better than whatever fucking dumb variation of dodgeball they're playing. So I did that. Yeah, there's so many variations. So, yeah. Oh, my God. This is great. Where's the headline?

What if I get hit in the head? That was always my favorite. The kid that got the most damage in the concussion, he gets to stay in for another fucking hit. We used to hit people in the head. Oh, yeah. No, no. You can stay in, bro. Hit you in the head.

It's so violent. Oh, my God. Yeah. We would play dodgeball on little scooters. I feel like the teachers just ran out of sports, and so they just came up with just different versions of dodgeball. And so anyway, so. Go pump up with golf carts today, dodgeball. And like, so anyway, so. Go putt-putt with golf carts today, guys.

All right, that's interesting. And so, yeah, so I was failing everything. And then I actually. But for lack of effort, it sounds like not really because you're dumb. No, so your read was, well, again, I'm like, i'm dumb in a way where i'm dumb where i can't like i can't like put together shit i can't read instruction but i like read like three books a month but their books i if they were assigned to me i would not be able i got you know yes but you were right so i had a curriculum yeah yes um hence comedy um so i

but what you said was really interesting and it reminded me of something tragic um where i had an english teacher and he was the cool the cool teacher and i have fucking dad issues and was just like desperate for a male role model so it always like i think i made him a healy i like made him like make me like a mixtape it is shocking i haven't been molested it is shocking i have not been molested you asked the male english teacher to make you a mixtape a hundred percent there are i can count there are at least five times coming to me right now that I should have been molested. I fucking I talked to a guy. I talked to a guy for two months on AOL Instant Messenger who was pretending to be Mick Foley, my favorite wrestler.

And he was going to train me to be like a hardcore wrestler. And I was like, this all this adds up. Oh, my God. You got catfished on that. Dude. Yes. I met Mick Foley. got catfished on that? Dude, yes. I met Mick Foley. Hold on. We're going to come back to Mick Foley in a second. I have to ask you.

How did he make you one? What did he do? Did he just send you to fucking fuck out? No, he made me a cassette because he played guitar. Wait, originals? A mixtape of originals? No. That would be great. Yeah, that i would have deserved to be molested this no no he was like a guitar player and i was a guitar player

so it was the first time i heard stevie ray he got me into stevie ray vaughn he got me into like really good music all right uh by the way i realize now where this story is going this is not good at all okay so then um so he made yeah uh long-haired dude he would just be the more of an influence real yeah yeah and he would be the thank you that's a much much better way to put it i hope there's not a fucking molester out listening to the show. Be like, that's what I'm going to call it. That's what I'm going to call it. And so he made me, yeah, he was just a fucking cool guy that was like, we're reading outside today. And everyone was like, oh, we love you.

And I would start telling him about, like, when my mom would relapse, I would, like, talk to him about it. He was just, like, a guy I could go to because I didn't have a good relationship with my dad at the time. And so your mom would relapse from booze. Well, then. Yeah. Then it was booze. And and so. There was one day I remember this so specifically and this ties in the dropout thing.

We were reading Joy Luck Club, which was one of the books i was like ah like i like i try every time i tried i was just like i don't fucking i can't and and that's the thing dude if i if i was growing up now i would be on so much medication um but back then i feel like i just missed the cutoff of when they started like over and look, a lot of people need medication. Right. But like we, we do over describe, uh, subscribe, uh, whatever. All the scribes.

Yeah. Yeah. All the scribes. And, uh, overprescribing Jesus Christ. Uh, and so, you know, like nowadays, like they would have just given me like a bunch of pills and I'd just be like, no, just give me a book. That's not the joy luck club. Like just, that's all I need. You know, like nowadays, like they would have just given me like a bunch of pills and I'd be like, no, just give me a book. That's not the joy luck club. Like just that's all I need. You know, like how about five choices? Yeah. Yes. Oh, that's actually, that's like super solid idea. And, uh, and I'm sure at some schools they do do that and do stuff like that. But

anyway, I remember he asked some question about the book and I answered the question and I was right. Uh, the problem was he knew he was like, did you read the book? And answered the question and i was right uh the problem was he knew he was like did you read the book and i was like or did you read the chapter and i was like no and he was essentially figured out that i could get charles was predictable saw the end of these can uh yeah and but i i could hear the conversation they were having about the characters and whether it was as a writer i could be like this is what i would have done or probably more just like i have good intuition with people i'd be like that's probably where this is going. So he knew I was answering the question correctly, but I was also bullshitting and didn't read it.

Right. And so that day he took me aside in like this little room and told me something that like should have gotten him fired. But arguably saved my life where he was like it was out of a fucking movie where he literally goes you're one of the smartest kids I have just so you know oh sorry you're one of the smartest kids I have

you have a 12 in my class and this isn't like a 12 out of 15 I didn't go to some weird private school oh yeah 12 out of 100 I'm never wrong. You ain't even a teen. Dude, by the way, the disappointment in your voice when you said 100,

it just reminded me. I'm like, oh, my dad issues are still there. I was like, oh, no, I disappointed him. That was more shock. Okay, great. Yeah, 12 out of 100. What the fuck did you do? Nothing. You just signed hand in one paper in, bro. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Answered that one question about the Joy Luck Club. I let him make me a mixtape, and he felt so bad. He's like, I guess 12. And so he literally said to me, this is such a fucking movie moment. He goes, school, just so you know, school's not for everybody. And then he gave me his fucking copy of jack kerouac's on the road and was just kind of like that's all i'm saying and that was really huge for me because i assumed that high school dropouts were literally just criminals

you know we didn't have we didn't have google then dumb people yeah we couldn't just like look up like all the famous actors and you know comedians and people who dropped out of high school. I literally just thought, yeah, it was just garbage people. And so once I heard that, I was like, oh, interesting. And that that kind of did it for me because I knew that I either wanted to be in a band or do stand up. knew that i either wanted to be in a band or do stand-up and the way i tried to like sell it to my parents were like i'm a mess right now i'm just getting like hammered every day and you're drinking too uh yeah yeah you're still what 16 17 no actually i was smoking more pot then i uh was like a bit of a jam band kid and i I didn't start drinking probably till around 17, 18 because I didn't start drinking till I did stand up.

Because when you're doing stand up and they're like, well, we're not going to give you any money. Yeah. But you can get a free beer. You're like, all right. Yeah. Like I want to earn something. And so that's when I started drinking. and so that's when i started drinking but i told them i was like you're gonna go into so much debt for me to i i can't focus on this

and tutors and if you're gonna put all that money i mean they don't have money for tutors but i was like let's just fucking say i get into college by a miracle um it's gonna go to waste and my dad was always like well what if you went to like music school? And I was never again, I couldn't read music. I couldn't. I was like, it's going to ruin it. It's going to ruin the thing I love. And I'm not going to be good at it. You know, and every time I've tried to take lessons or learn music theory, I'm like, I'm just not good at it. And so, you know, I was like, I treat and i did uh stand up like a job i will treat that i will go in every day i will do these open mics i'm gonna write i'm gonna research

i'm gonna you know and they said no they were like absolutely not you know whatever so then i get fucking mono uh this is my junior year so i get mono and i'm out for like months yeah i was gonna say and people are just bringing me homework and i'm just throwing it directly in the trash i'm like i got mono yeah i couldn't do the work when there was an adult teacher trained how to teach me i'm not gonna fucking do it in my room like when i'm like listening to fish and like are you out of your fucking mind so i was just like and i think probably subconsciously i'm like i'm just gonna get in too deep and that's what i did and i never went back but then actually there was this like brief trickery that happened where my mom

was like you have to over the summer. She was like, you have to go in to sign official papers to drop out because I was an idiot high school dropout. I was just like, that sounds right. And I went, there aren't papers you have to fucking sign at all. It was a fucking trick. It was an intervention where it was her. Is that what happened? Yeah, it was her guidance counselor.

I think my dad, and the principal. And I remember feeling so betrayed. And I was so scared, too. By your mom or by everyone? I mean, kind of by everyone. Yeah, it was the only time I was, like, frozen. Where I literally, well. It's hilarious.

You weren't even going to drop it out. No. Yeah, I couldn't even drop out correctly. I couldn't. You got to show up here okay oh yeah let me come through yeah you're back in school now fuck so they ambush you and do what do you do i just nod my head i just nod my head and try to cry that's it no i was just like all right sure oh yeah yeah and i'm just like in tears like just like biting my lip and they were like

all right so i should so over the summer i I probably watched Good Will Hunting or some shit. And I motivate myself that I'm going to do it. And I bought binders because that shows you that you're serious. And I bought trapper keepers and folders. And I was like, you know what? I'm going to fucking give it a go. If I have to go back, I'm just going to fucking do it. Just some wave of inspiration hit me.

And I go back. And I just remember the math class I was sitting in. And I was just like i i have no idea what this guy yeah i was always that way dude day one i was like i have no idea what you're talking about with you on that but i was so disappointed because i was like i was gonna give it everything and i'm like i'm gonna keep trying like i always quit shit and i'm not gonna quit and then like three days three days of this happened three four days this happened then i see my guidance counselor from the ambush in the hallway her job to a 15 see dreams do come true

and uh and i was like i see her and she goes how's it going and i was like you know it's tough but like i'm trying and it's getting a little better every day. And she goes, just this year and next year, and you got it. And I was like, what? Because they didn't tell me that in the intervention. Are you a senior at this point? I thought I was. I see. But I was repeating my junior year, essentially.

And then I would have to, to make up the credits, be a senior again. And if she doesn't slip and say that, you don fucking know that no i mean maybe yeah i mean they definitely didn't tell me during the intervention i was like maybe i was so upset but i'm like they were just like come back and that makes sense right and so uh i go cool cool cool i'm gonna go to the bathroom uh and then I left. That was it. Well, I actually had, now that I think about it, there were three teachers who told me when I came back that year, they were like, I'm really glad you're back. If you need anything, come to me.

So I was about to walk out. And I was like, I'm going to see these three teachers. One of them did not show up where he said he was going to. Really? Yep. We were going to meet. He had, like, hall monitor duty. He wasn't there.

The second one, the gym teacher, I go, hey, man, I really need to talk to you. And he goes, I can't talk right now. And I go, but remember when you said you really, and he goes, is it drugs? And I go, what? And he goes, tell me, is that why you were gone is the drugs and i was like no it's not drugs he goes all right i gotta go and then he's fucking nothing else just like walking and then

the third guy i care if it's drugs are you holding if it's not i gotta get out of here yeah and uh and so then the third one i see in the hallway and he goes where are you supposed to be and i go i really need to talk to you and he goes are you supposed to be in class and i go yeah but i really need to talk to you and he goes i'm gonna call the principal and then he three chances for people yeah so he walked in to call the principal and then i walked out and then later he got fired for uh fucking a student did he yeah yeah and i think i wrote him like some like fucking mean letter where i was like serves you right you piece of shit uh oh that was awful um and so uh so then i go to walk out and i see my fucking band teacher this is a tragic story but it gets i forgot this kind of redeems it i see my

band teacher my band teacher was my favorite his name was mr swabadison and mr what swab swabadison okay and uh he was so weird and he had a fucking temper and he was really funny like really weird dry sense of humor one year for halloween because we were like kind of like fake enemies you know what i mean uh he like he would always take my walkman and stuff like that but i would also i would skip lunch and i would he would let me play drums uh in the band room during lunch. And, you know, one year he went as me for Halloween. Like just like the punk teenager, like backwards hat, Walkman, like sunglasses. And probably like some Grateful Dead shirt or some shit.

Just the best. He was the best. And my junior year, I really let him down because that was the only class I was doing good in. But I just stopped going to rehearsals. I was just like doing drugs. And so I actually avoided him. I hadn't talked to him. So even though he was the teacher, I would consider like besides an English teacher, like a hero of mine or whatever, he wasn't the one of the ones I was going to go to.

But you pass the band room as you're exiting the school. He wasn't the one of the ones I was going to go to. But you pass the band room as you're exiting the school. So as I'm leaving, after these three teachers like bailed on me, I go to walk out and swabs there. And I go, hey, man, can I just go play the drums? And he just goes, yeah, just don't tell me where you're supposed to be. And I was just like in that moment, I was just like, I'm so sorry. You're the one I let down so much.

So I went and I played drums and then I fucking left and I did the dramatic, like, slow motion, saved by the bell, like, finger salute to the school. You did? You gave a turnaround salute? Oh, fuck yeah, I did. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like the 80s movie. Yeah, and then I probably, like, lit a cigarette. Yeah, to be clear, I was the worst.

I was like, this isn't a heroic drive-by story. I was a piece of shit um and so versus the heroic dropout story yeah yeah that's true out there yeah like bill or steve jobs didn't he although wait he may have hit women i don't fucking know um but so anyway so uh that the so i drop out that english teacher um who gave me his copy of on the road so i start doing comedy blah blah blah just to like end this story the fucking english teacher when i did conan i went to find him like on facebook because i wanted to be like dude like you're the reason this happened. Also fucked a student. Had an affair with a student.

Got divorced from his beautiful wife. Then fucking killed himself. Oh my. Yeah. Damn. And I was just like, what do I do with this? How'd you find that out? Just by looking him up.

I found some fucking newspaper article. And then I sent it to my family. I'm like, did you guys know this? And they're like, yeah, we didn't want to tell you. know this and they're like yeah we didn't want to tell you and i was like we didn't want to tell you i was like i've been like unstable for quite a while and uh so they would just hide things from me every once in a while and um so yeah super fucked up and then when robin died there was part of me that was like uh because robin used to talk to me about my depression like he would call me about my depression and shit about Robin Williams.

Oh yeah. Yeah. And like, um, Oh right. I told you off there kind of. Um, and when he killed himself,

you know, there's always a selfish part of you and something like that happens where my first thought is like, like the two people who believed in me killed himself. I'm like, what does that, where does that leave me? Like I am fucked.

Like those are the people who believed in me. All right, cool. Um, so yeah, so he killed himself dropped out um but then i had this really cool moment where after i did conan i went back to see my family in jersey and i was really sad about finding about mr i mean not not just sad but like shocked on so many levels where i'm like oh my god like was he this terrible person um i mean just anytime happens, you get that sick feeling in your stomach where, you know.

And then, of course, I'm like, what if I emailed him sooner? Although I guess he still would have fucked the student. Because I was like, you know, because at first, before I found out the backstory, yeah, that's what happened. Before I found out the backstory, I was like, what if I emailed him sooner? I would have told him that his life as a teacher was worth it, and he

inspired me to go do comedy, and now I'm living my dreams. I'm like, oh, he fucked a 17-year-old? All right. You were not meant to send that email. That is not on me. Yeah, yeah. That's not on me. My email could have been evidence for who knows.

I think we got another one right here, man. It's probably been going on for decades. What if you made her a mixtape? What if you made her the same mixtape? Then I'd be mad. Then I'd be kind of jealous. I'd be like, is Stevie Ray Vaughan on that? Fucking whore if you made her the same mixtape then i'd be mad then i'd be like kind of jealous i'd be like steve ravan on that fucking whore yeah so uh what if i started that whole pattern he's like i can just give mixtapes to students all right and then this fucking girl falls from oh jesus so anyway so yeah so i drop out

start doing stand-up uh so can i ask you this what is going on in your home life that is you said your mom's relapsing so what is home life like and you don't and school's not an escape from that where would you rather no i would rather be at home um school i was just funny enough not to get like totally the shit kicked out of me um i would get made fun of a lot i was sort of like you know the friend to girls i was in love with i didn't have a girlfriend till i was like 18 um i didn't have a first kiss like my first girlfriend was my first kiss was the first girl i slept with um and and i just felt fucking dumb you. I was just not good at it. And to go somewhere that you are not good at for eight hours is a fucking nightmare. And I didn't have many friends. I didn't have any

many good friends. Like I said, I could skate by. And so my home life is this really interesting thing where it's simultaneously the greatest thing in my life and it was like really tragic where exactly what you mean yeah and i think maybe it was because i had a lot of siblings and like they're so fucking funny and they're so cool and it you know what it's like it's like uh it's like war buddies you know like people who fucking serve together you're just like that's what it's like it's like uh it's like war buddies you know like people who fucking serve together you're just like that's what it is we've been through this together yep and we were just like you know mom would relapse and would deal with it and then would like walk around the neighborhood and like tell each other simpsons quotes until like we like didn't want to cry anymore and then would go back and would deal with it and that was actually how i the reason i got

into comedy whenever i'm sure you get this question but whenever i would do like interviews and people would be like were you the class clown i'm like are you out of your goddamn mind the class clown was a fucking hack who would call me a faggot and beat me up and just make funny voices always funnier than the class oh yeah i don't need to prove no exactly i just sat in the back sadly after the class clown kicked the shit out of me and would like write jokes as like a defense mechanism where I'm like, that's why I got in a comment. And the interviewer is always like fucking horrified. freeze-frame panic and it wouldn't be until someone made a joke always inappropriate because of the situation uh and the more inappropriate the more it would make give you that like guttural laugh and then once you laughed you're like now we can figure shit out now we can battle plan um and you know that's that's why so at home are your parents still together at this point when

you're in high school they were together for a lot of it. And my dad was trying to make it work. And he had, like, huge anger things, which we thought was him. But then he got divorced from the lady who kept relapsing. And suddenly, like, was, like, so happy and nice and is, like, wonderful and supportive. And we're like, oh, that's my dad. That's what happened. Took a while to see that. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Stop playing that one, Dad. Sorry, man. that's what happened and uh yeah yeah we were can you play that with that sorry and this poor fucking guy just having to do five kids having yeah having to deal with my mom then like not wanting to because he wouldn't want to bad mouth her to us because he's a good guy it is the it is the running theme on all these episodes so far of the good parents have done even didn't matter how bad it got the one thing that everybody said really made a difference so far is that the other pair now i'm sure they get in the car and shut the doors and be like this motherfucker well but not in front of the fucking kid well they would but but then what was worse is he didn't do that but because we were pieces or i was a piece of shit he would come home after dealing with my mom dealing with this and i was just like fuck you dad i'll listen to my music and like i'm like oh i'm such an

asshole with what he was going through so they got divorced my mom fucking i was in high school blamed me for the divorce because the fight that put it this is so insane the fight the fight that put it over the edge was me wanting to go to a party and my mom said yes probably because she was drunk and my dad said no yeah yeah i'll see you i'll see you there i'll fucking out drink you pussy and then and my dad said no because he's a responsible parent who i hated and they got got into this huge fight. And that was technically the last fight before they got the divorce. The problem is that was just a straw camel's back thing. Sure, yeah.

But my mom literally was like, if you didn't want to go to that party. And I was like, I swear to God. When did she hit you with that? Right on the spot? On the spot in high school throughout the divorce. It was because I wanted to go through the party. And I was like,

or could be the fact that you've been arrested several times. Like DUIs and blah, blah, blah. But she literally blamed me. So she's been great recently. Is she sober now? I think. But your dad never was a – did he ever struggle? My dad drank once in college and went through up.

And now he'll have a beer yeah uh no he's like so responsible and but my mom i remember i went home to visit over like thanksgiving or christmas and it was all the kids and so we were telling like dark stories we were telling talking about like me being a fuck up we're finally making fun of like what happened to me um we're talking about like my mom boozing blah blah blah we're all laughing because that's what we do with like our sad shit yes that's why you have this show yeah and uh i remember because we're all laughing i was like hey since we're like telling fucked up stories this is the last year dude so i'm like 35 years old i was like hey mom remember

when uh you tried to blame me for the divorce and we all start laughing and my mom goes well if you didn't want to go to that party still holding the fucking line dude still is just determined because i and i was like you know that like definitely fucked me up right like that a hundred percent is still a psychological issue with me and so yeah so they got uh they got divorced i hated my dad me and my brother like didn't talk to my dad we like blamed him because my mom so you're living with your mom then living with my mom all five kids um anybody go with dad no not really did he stay close he stayed close in this and he actually told me this the other day because i was struggling really bad with my depression for the first time last week and the

first time in a while and uh you know he was telling me about that where you know to me and i think probably your listeners too it's like your parents even when they're in the shitter even when they're struggling they still have this very superhero like them or not quality where you're like well you're fine you know what you're doing you know you're my dad you have to and he reminded me and i didn't think about this he reminded me he was like after the divorce you know my dad was the one with the good job my mom wasn't and he took a seven we had like a decent house um and he went to a 700 a month little like almost like studio this like weird little house just because he wanted to be near us oh i know the feeling and literally this place is cute as hell uh but i love it i really like it uh it's like the nicest couch too uh but i uh so he told me that

and i was like wow not only that but like me and my brother nick weren't even talking to him and he still like it wasn't like all right fuck you guys you know he like paid my mom like child support way longer than he needed to like all this stuff like didn't really fight shit in court like i kind of did the same thing he was just kind of like blah just take it um and did you see him, though? Kind of. But you guys didn't want to. No. Yeah, exactly.

Like, he would come over. My brother would just silently give him the finger. And my brother was, like, 16. They're, like, best buddies now. But, like, I mean, must have been just. And he just poker-faced it. Like, didn't show that he was probably. I don't know if I could do that.

Destroy. Yeah. He should have beaten the shit out of us. I don't know if I could do that. We were such fucking animals to this guy. Did you ever try to give your dad a go? You ever get to that point? Dude, so...

I did it one time. I did. I did. I did. Well, I'm going to be real clear what I tell you. One time. Oh, okay. One time I tried that shit.

See, here's the problem. Remember how I said my dad like drank once and he threw up and he never drank again my dad's my dad's a dork and so like we could all take my dad and so the time i the time i did it oh my god god i was the worst okay two things actually one time he was raising his voice at me and I was screaming at him and he started screaming at me because he did have like a temper with like he would yell. That was like his big thing. And I like started getting into his face and he literally like went to put him to like put his hand on my shoulder. And I like fucking dramatically threw myself back like threw myself into

a vase and the vase shattered and I was like you hit me I'm leaving like I'm gonna call the police and he just looked at me like you know I didn't do that and I was just like fuck and I was just like lying in glass so that was ridiculous and then yeah yeah yeah

and he just like no empathy not like even trying to play that. And I wish I could get that. That's Phil. That's Phil Jackson's then right there. Well, yeah, it was insane. I think honestly, I think he was just like going so crazy that he just like didn't have words to to to describe how much we were torturing him as a human being. Because so the time I stepped to him we were at a wedding

so dude it so ties into that where so remember i said I didn't have a girlfriend until I was later. When you're a teenager, when you're a loser, unpopular teenager, you either have to beeline it for the new girl on her fucking first day before someone lets her know who you are as a person. Hey, real quick. Hey, Janice. Janice, come here real quick. Where am I have to make you fall in love with me before you literally talk to anybody. Anytime there was a new girl, like my heart would just beat out of my chest because I'm like, this is my only chance. Or, or, or vacations.

Vacations were the time when you could do it. You could be whoever the fuck you were. And so when we went away for this wedding, I met a girl. And I never met a girl before. So whose wedding is this? It was my uncle Chris's wedding. Is that your dad's brother?

It's my mom's brother. Mom's brother. Chris is getting married where? Where are you going away from Jersey to where? In Hawaii. My mom's Hawaiian.'s brother chris is getting married where where are you going away in hawaii my mom's hawaiian yeah so yeah yeah so uh we went to hawaii and we stayed at this hotel and there were these two sisters and i was like i'm gonna talk to both you like for the odds and then like fucking figure it out and we would take these dramatic walks and this girl's name was eden and i had fucking like dreadlocks at the time because i was all into fish yeah dude again i was a fucking piece of shit. And she

was like, I'll hook up with you, but I don't want to hook up with someone with dreads. She said that? Oh, yeah. By the way, my parents had spent the entire year, my parents and teachers were like, you gotta get rid of those dreads. You gotta get rid of those dreads. And I was just like, I'm never gonna get rid of these dreads. One girl said it. Dude, we spent

two hours of her combing it out in the bathtub before we hooked up i'm gonna know this girl for three days and i'm just like whatever you want and so she combs them out sounds right and then uh she has me finger and then uh my dad goes we have to go to a wedding and i go no like they flew me to hawaii to go to, and I was just like, you don't understand. I'm in love. I'm in love. Dude, I fall in love with.

Look at the tub. That's all my hair. I did that for her. For my, what's your name? Eden. For Eden. Or her sister. She's the one that seemed to like me more.

I don't care. Hope her sister doesn't like dreads. I'm kind of committed. That would hurt so bad and so uh by the way if you take your dreads out you're supposed to shave your head because that's what i was gonna say i thought you were gonna say nope she just nope nope brushed him i was in so much pain and uh so my dad was like you have to go and i was like i'm not going and spend my time with my girlfriend how old are you again at this point probably like 17 yeah and uh and then uh he goes get in the car and i fucking

i didn't it was like the girl i just slapped him you slapped your in front of the girl in front of the girl in front of my family and And I remember his glasses just did, it was the saddest thing I've ever seen in my life. They just went crooked like that. And again, he was just stoically looking at me like, I can't believe my life. How can he not just react? Because I think he was just so sad, like, this is the life I've chosen for myself.

And I remember the second his glasses started to go crooked in my head i was just like no fuck shit like i regretted it immediately and he's just standing there with his dumb fucking glasses tilted and i just like i didn't say i smelled your finger i did i get it by my get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. I get it. Go be a man. What did he slap on me? Which just makes sense. Was that even? Nice to meet you. I, uh, no, I, dude, I just hugged him. I just like.

Immediately. It was just like slap, glasses, me feeling so bad. Every nice thing he's ever done to me flashback. And I just hug him. And. Did he hug back? He didn't hug back. He was just like, like in the car and

i was like okay oh i haven't thought about that so fucking long um you asked good questions sir uh yeah so that that uh that's great i tried to give my dad a run and it was not a good situation it was in my his mom's house yeah my grandmother's house she's sitting right there he's standing next to her in the recliner my two brothers are over here on the couch and i'm running my mouth and she's telling me to shut up and he's telling me come on come on she's like do not do this do not and i went for it man whoa she's screaming my two brothers are cheering like they want to see me get my ass beat by Dad. That old man. He wasn't even old.

He was probably 40. He just picked me up and was like, ah. I was like, ah. I couldn't breathe. Point made. We're good, Dad. We're good. I cannot take you.

Yeah, that's like the Mr. Miyagi moment where you're like, train me. Yep. Yep. A hundred percent. Well, the thing was, because I've been thinking about this a lot where like i told one story about my dad it's like the one piece of stand-up i stand by on like some of my old albums where i told this like long story about you know when i realized my dad was like a good guy and like trying to sort of make up for it and like it was this whole ordeal like i tried to make up for it i end up getting like arrested it's a thing but like um but i don't want to do

bits but the premise of it is essentially like me for the longest time just being that artsy teenager that's like fuck my dad my dad doesn't get me he doesn't let me whatever and like i think a lot of people hit this point in like either their 20s or 30s where they realize that like the reason you hated your parents is because they were like decent people you know what i mean like that's sort of the premise of it where i'm like oh most the shit that i despise my dad for was him looking out for me i mean when i think about how mad i got at them for not letting me drop out of high school or go to that fucking party or go to that fucking they would still be together they would be re they would be renewing their vowels on the big island right now

yeah it uh it was just crazy because the reason i chose my mom and that's where i was going to ask you next yeah well as as i'm like telling the story i'm like this is probably a question because you're allowed to do more the eyes and that's it strongly watched on you that's it i couldn't do anything with my dad and you know there's part of me the big thing when you live with an alcoholic or a drug addict is the the biggest question is always you know you're always blaming yourself and so the biggest question is always, you know, you're always blaming yourself. And so the biggest question I would always have was, you know, whenever she would relapse, I'd be like, all right, well, last time I was trying to be really nice and supportive. I was like helping her.

And maybe that was too nice and she took advantage of it. So now I'm going to be like a dick. I'm going to be like, you don't fucking drink. Like, we're going to like whatever. Like, we're going to leave if you do. And then she relapses relapses and then you go fuck i was so mean to her like that's why she relapsed you know what i mean especially when you're a kid and these are a hundred percent issues that i i still have in relationships and i've still been working on is like you don't have to be the hero you don't have to try to fix everything. I had a lady say one time to me, just last year.

Yeah. And I was like, you know, especially as a guy, I feel like I do it more often than maybe a lady. And I could be wrong, but so often someone says something and I'm just like, oh, my, it was right fucking here. I'm too busy looking over here and above it and under it and around it. And I was like, God. And she just said to me, not everyone wants to be saved. Yeah. And I was like, oh, yeah.

Yeah, my ex said that to me, too. Oh, yeah. Some people just don't want to be. It's not like you can if they have to be willing. And I was like, oh, yeah. So she was like, stop doing that shit. By the way, to go even fucking deeper on that, it's like sometimes you think, think me that you're being a good guy and you're actually just doing it for you. You know, like sometimes it's like, am I actually trying to save

you or am I doing this for my ego? Or am I doing this because I was so fucking happy? And this is my biggest problem currently is I'm so fucking happy when someone wants to date me that I will ignore all of the fucking terrible reasons I should not date that person. And then when it doesn't work, assume it's my fault and be like, I will fix it and I will put it together. And I've gotten way better about it. Like this year, I think is the first year.

Like if I don't think things are going to, if I think they're going in a bad direction, like I will very maturely and gentlemanly like end it. Um, but before I mean, dude, I had a girlfriend once once my last like serious girlfriend who uh on our first date i'm like so what's the thing you need to like work on in relationships

and i'll tell you the thing i suck at and then we'll know and we can you know i don't know i like thought it was a good idea you're like hey yeah well if you throw a grenade on the table and then we'll see who dies first uh yeah here's what she actually says she goes i get really jealous sometimes over nothing then occasionally i'll get uh and then i get very mean and occasionally violent and i was like i'm in like 100 percent. Let's fucking do it because she was gorgeous. And anytime a gorgeous girl wants to fuck me or date me, I think it's a mistake. There has been some clerical error.

I am standing where like a hot person should stand. And I'm like, yes, fuck. I don't care because of my head. I'm like, you're so much hotter than me. I'm going to give you zero reason to be jealous. This is great. And I remember my brother called that day. He like what does she look like man and i was like oh blonde hair blue eyes perfect body covered in red flags like so fucking many reasons i shouldn't have done it but i it is that

that part of me where i'm like i shouldn't be loved the fact that someone is and that's why i move too fast in relationships too because i'm like well now you're here and surely by now you realize this is a mistake so i have to like lock it down so like we have to move in together because then by the time you realize it's a mistake there's leases involved and furniture and obstacles and cats and then you're not going to fucking go anywhere and so it's just real but it does come from that sort of like, I couldn't fix the mommy relationship. So like, I have to make this work. And if not, it's my fault.

And there have been relationships where it's been my fault. I know that. But there have also been ones where it wasn't. And I still would take the brunt of the blame. So yeah, so my mom, so one of the reasons that i still kind of blame myself is there is that phase when i was living at home that i didn't know what an alcoholic was i just thought my dad was a fucking nerd like i didn't know that like when she was like he won't let me have one glass of wine it's like of her second bottle where i'm just like oh my dad's a fucking coward you know what i mean like my dad

can't hang um and so essentially the the sort of deal we had was i won't tell dad she's drinking she won't tell dad i'm smoking pot so i thought it was great so again did she catch you or were you just honest with that uh probably both uh and there were there were days where she would come home and i think probably on the days that she wanted to get sober that she would suddenly yell at me and i was like what the fuck you're cool mom you know and did she work uh she had like part-time jobs um and here's the thing about my mom is she's a wonderful person um i i said this when i remember saying this in high school so much it was like a a a go-to line where i'm like i wish she was a cunt i wish she was fucking mean i wish you fucking hit me

because then it would have been so depressing right i would have just been like fuck off like i just wanted to cared but i like really love her and she's really fun like she's such a good storyteller like i get i get that from her um she's really sweet like she's such a good storyteller like I get that from her she's really sweet when she's sober it's just like addiction is fucking addiction and narcissism like so many times I think addicts try to

try to figure out well that's narcissistic to say that you caused this divorce is ego all over it or like there were times where she would be sober and even while she was sober, she was like, you know, I could probably drink if I want to. Or like, you know, if your dad didn't, blah, blah, blah. And it's like, oh, you're not going to stay sober

because that's not sober thinking, you know? Like if you're still blaming other people, if you're still whatever, I'm like, I agree that substances are physically addictive and are hard to kick. But I think a lot of times people don't examine the why where like, for me, I like I'm stopping drinking this week. I don't get drunk. Really? I don't get blackout drunk. I don't, whatever. I just know I'm going to it for the wrong reason. So I'm trying to figure out like the why. And until I figure

that out, like just going to put it on hold. Um, cause I do that with food. I do that with drugs. I do that with sex, um, with everything. So I hold. Cause I do that with food. I do that with drugs. I do that with sex, with everything. So I'm like, I definitely have an addict. I think I'm too much of a control freak and I don't like being wasted. I just, I don't like being not in control. I think the reason that I'm not dead or just a delinquent in rehab is just because I'm a control freak or just a lightweight pussy. It's, I don don't every time i get

like semi drunk i'm just like i hate this i hate it i hate it and then i i can stop but i like being casually tipsy it's hard for me to be around comics who are drinking um and not want to drink because i want to feel i want to fit in i I feel I feel like I don't belong. You know, Tripoli asked if I was going to like the the Brody Memorials and stuff. And I was just like, I don't know if I'm part of the community. And he's like, what are you? He's like, yes, of course you are. And I was like, oh, like my friend Kelly Carlin had told me the other day. I'm like, I don't know if I'm a comic.

She's like, you've been doing comedy for 17 years. I booked you on your first. like you're a comic and like but it's just that imposter syndrome and blah blah anyway i've gotten so sidetracked but uh yeah so i lived with my mom because you let me smoke weed and then i let her drink and it was this just like terrible trade-off um during that time you're failing out of high school yeah or or i already dropped out or already dropped yeah yeah and then where's your next move from there so my next move is i mean i live oh my god i lived with my mom till i was probably like 2021 i was actually the only time i dated a comic was i was like 21 or 22 and she was like 10 years older than me and she would like come over and like sleep on my mom's couch uh and one day i got home and my mom has like her head down in the kitchen and my younger

shorter scrawnier brother is standing there with his hands on his hips and he goes jamie we need to talk and i go what okay and he's like uh we have to talk about your living situation and i was like what the fuck is happening and he was like we're gonna need you like we're as in me and my me and he's speaking for ma yeah he's like we're gonna need you to leave and i was like am i getting kicked out of the house by my younger brother uh how old was he i mean dude he must have been like 16 that's a lot on his shoulders he was like a little sophomore with his fucking big glasses just being like he ain't gonna back these guys off my face these glasses are staying on uh yeah my dad's just cowering in the bushes

Like peeking over Did he do it yet? Did he do it? And then he kicked me out And I had to live And you went? I had to And I went to live with

And I remember screaming at my mom Being like is this true? I was going to say you didn't fight or you just walked out Is this true? Is this true? Is this true? And she just had her head down. Did she nod or anything? Kind of.

And then the older ex was like, well, you can't live with me. And I was like, cool. So I went to live with... I was working at a toy store. A local one? A local one. And I went to live with my boss. I was going to live with my boss at the toy store that I eventually got fired from.

But you slept at the toy store? No, no, no, no, no. I slept in. Oh, that would have been good, though. No, I slept. It's going to be in this castle back here, guys. Yeah. I like the Lego one more than the Playmobil one.

No, I lived in their house. Was this house a weird house? Like a guy that owns a toy store is in a weird place? It was like a little Willy Wonk-ish, but it was dope. And they were also kind of hippies. It was like a very wood panel fireplace. And she would sleep over, and it was good. She'd still be coming over, huh?

She still came over. All right. And then I would drive her like two hours to North Jersey because she worked at a Verizon. And I would go to drop her off being like, I'm a pretty good boyfriend. And she would be like, turn your music down and drop me off at the corner so they don't see you. And I was like, all right, cool. Bye. Two hours.

Yeah. And then I would drive back to the owners of the toy store's house. yeah yeah and then i would drive back to the owners of the toy store's house uh and so um and then i got fired from there for fucking stealing what'd you steal just money to go to like fucking fish shows probably over time just like a couple hundred bucks but it's like these people were housing me and how do you catch you just counted the drawer one day and like i was like no well some days i was like i was just in such a panic because i felt like such an asshole where i'm like am i that was the first moment i'm like am i a bad person like before i was like i'm a fuck up but that

was like i'm like they gave me everything and i just stole money um and i remember being like no well you know how some days like the register was over? That's because I felt so bad. I would put money back. And they were like, what? And I remember she told me, she goes, because this is when I was doing comedy. I was doing open mics and stuff. And she was like, I hope you become a star. And I just started sobbing.

And I've never seen her again. And I had this dream of like getting like incredibly famous and like buying them like a thing again it was like a couple hundred bucks but it's just horror like it haunts me they get a reason to toy store out of business yeah yeah exactly they're doing fine i fucking checked they're doing they're okay fine yeah yeah what if she also killed herself uh all of my friends anyone who supported me is dead um yeah so uh so i was living there then eventually and are you keeping in touch with your mom and dad at this point yeah yeah i mean i i don't actually you know i i don't remember i mean i must be because i i'm

still seeing my siblings and stuff like that and And then I finally moved to New York. So is that what you're doing? You're working toward comedy at this point? Yes. Okay. Yeah, so I'm still taking the train in, and my home club was the Stress Factory in New Jersey. So I would do guest spots there.

And me and Julian McCullough, we were the kings of that Wednesday open mic. And then eventually I would do guest spots. day like a host didn't show up so i got my first paid gig was like 15 uh emceeing for jim david but then the guest spots that were great they're fucking hard because you literally have to follow a prank phone call on stage um but i so i would either crush or just death but what was so cool is like they get a list comics so like it was the first time i met norton and attell and lewis black and like you know all these like amazing comics um and you know because i was doing guest spots and was like 22 i would

then say like i opened for them you know yeah and um and so yeah so i was doing that and i was going to new york and then eventually i moved to new york and my friend who was a comic um had like an extra bed in her nyu dorm so i just uh made friends with a security guard by teaching him some like muay thai shit because he was all in the ufc and then uh and i would i just squatted there for you knew you probably beat his ass yeah and i just like squatted there for like a year damn um started handing out flyers uh at the boston it was like so you lived on a college campus for a year yeah and did not attend the college didn't attend i wonder how many people out there live on college i don't know yeah and her roommates to their credit were just these all all these just like gorgeous model fashion students and i just didn't say a word would wait

till they left like it wasn't like nerds i'm like i'm gonna fuck them all because i was just like a loser and so i would just wait till they left and then i would like take a shower and then i would just wander around the city and go write jokes um then around like three o'clock i would go hand out flyers with like i was on like pete holmes like original like flyer squad and i would like stand on the corner looking at the comedy cellar wishing i was playing there instead of the boston uh i would hand out flyers for hours throw half of them in the trash and walk around when i would get depressed then do like a five minute spot to like a couple fucking like tourists who barely spoke English because everyone else left after like Chappelle came.

And, uh, but it was still great. It was still, you know, at the time I, I, I loved it, you know, like you look back and you tell these stories where you're like, yeah, like hand out flyers for like five years. Oh, we should have unionized. You know what I mean? Like that's illegal. Uh, but it was just fucking great, man. I would just like smoke cigarettes and watch Chappelle and like, you know, desperately try to ask like the David tells of the world for like advice or how do you get an agent? Just all the dumb fucking questions you ask like geniuses when you're starting out. And that was where Marin found me and he started taking me around the city.

Like he would drive me around the city to his spots and I would just watch him. Uh, I remember watching him right after nine 11. It was one of the first comics I saw period. And also one of the first comics I saw talking about nine 11. And it was just, it was so fucking cool. Cause he's such a good writer. And, uh, and it was so fucking cool. Because he's such a good writer. And it was so cool. I remember his first joke was, I hope I don't butcher it.

But it was like, he was like, right after 9-11, my agent called me. And he was like, he was like uncomfortably quick. And goes, he goes, hey, so you got to move to L.A. now? And then Mark's joke was, he was like don't you guys always get earthquakes and he was like new york may be the target of terrorists but la is the target of god and it was such as fucking and it killed it and it was it was such a brilliant way to do it because it was like i'm gonna do a 9-11 joke and it's not making fun of it and it's it's gonna it's essentially gonna be a new york la joke but really fucking dark and real and and it was so cool to see that like that's what comedy could do and i remember um uh i did a guest spot for a tell

that weekend and a tell was so upset it was at the stress factor and we didn't know if anyone was going to show up but they let me do the whole weekend vinny let me do the whole weekend and we didn't know if anyone was going to show up. And they let me do the whole weekend. Vinny let me do the whole weekend. And we didn't know if anyone was going to show up. And I remember Attell was really affected by 9-11. He was just like, they tell me to bring canned goods. So I bring canned goods. They tell me to bring dog food. I just bring dog food.

He was just walking down there every day being like, ugh. And sold out. All the shows sold out. Wow. Because that's what everybody wanted. Yeah. You know what I mean? And they were fucking great.

Everybody killed. I was not good. And I can't? And they were fucking great. Everybody killed. I'm not good. And I can't imagine the jokes I was doing. Everyone killed. And it was really cool. And again, yeah, that's something I haven't thought about in so long. But it was, it's great. And that ties into a lot of what I've been thinking about recently.

You know, when I used to be in that very political social justice crowd that would attack comics, that was just something I forgot where it's like, yeah, comics talk about horrible things because usually a, we've experienced it. And two, much like with my mom and stuff, like once you can break the ice and laugh about it, now you can have a conversation, right? And, uh, so yeah, so i was doing that and i opened for mark a couple times um stanhope brought me out a couple times like i kind of just fell in with like the outcast scene um you know like was obsessed with like yeah norton attell patrice i mean those comedy seller lineups then the comedy seller lineups then compared to the store lineups now, you know, where every night it was just, yeah, it was Chappelle, Attell, Patrice, fucking Norton, like, Louis Black. Like, it was just crazy.

And that was kind of, like, you know, then it was just, like, the classic New York, like, experiment with drugs. Fuck a couple waitresses. Like, think you're good at stand-up not be good at stand-up like so you would i i'd said you you said divorce yeah so are you how do you find your wife is it during this when does that all happen like you're doing comedy getting married in new york okay all of that okay so this is a story i actually haven't told this one's gonna be this one will be tough uh so it'll just be tough because for anyone who's like followed any of my life it ends terribly uh but it's a really sweet story in the beginning um you know we were like 22 when we met um how'd you meet so we at so at that point i had to get a job because i couldn't live on the campus anymore so i got a war uh a job at graduated

nyu graduated nyu dropped out of high school graduated graduated at NYU. Still failed gym class at NYU. And they... So I worked at Borders. The Borders and Columbus Circle. Like right on Central Park. And I worked at Borders in New Jersey. Also got fired for stealing

from there. This was before I moved. I forgot about that. I worked there for like two weeks and got fired. Money there too? Books. I stole books and comics. And I remember I called the boss. Because I couldn't get – I was like, how am I going to get a real job anywhere? Like I dropped out of high school.

Everyone's trying to get jobs in New York, like all the actors and stuff like that. But I was like, a bookstore is the only place i could feasibly work and i went in there and they loved me on the interview and they were like all right we'll just call your old store the fact that you have experience like we can probably get you in right away and i i literally i called this woman and i was like i was like julie i don't know if you remember me but like blah blah blah i was like look i'm a changed man like essentially i just gave her this whole speech i'm like i've changed this is all i have i need this please and she's like i don't know what i'm gonna do and i was like just please god do the right thing and then she didn't tell me

what she was gonna do and hung up and then i got hired so either they didn't call or she gave you yeah respect uh again she probably fucked an employee and has killed herself by now so uh so uh so i work at borders and it's funny it's not funny it's terrible but i essentially got like i got me to me kind of tood um for just being a dick and cheating on my wife um but actually this i also haven't told said publicly my wife and i met when she had a boyfriend that i had a girlfriend we cheated on our first date together she started working at the bookstore and our first you met at board that boy yeah and our first date was a double date with her boyfriend and my girlfriend and at the end of the night both of our partners were like wow you guys really hit it off and we're like huh and uh had you been

cheating at that point no that was the first day yeah yeah oh yeah totally and they both noticed that you guys connect yeah yeah and she did i don't think she cheated i think she broke up with him um and i was living with my girlfriend that's right oh my god poor jen i forgot about jen yeah so after the dorm thing i had a girlfriend and we lived together i think about her still because i'm like those are simpler times uh and yeah so then i ended up with um with my wife so we have this like incredible relationship i feel like it's the first like she's just really book smart and uh i have a chip on my shoulder from dropping out of high school so like you know i actually like read on

the road for the first time and like we like yeah like read the beats together and like ginsburg and we were like getting high and fucked up and um and all this stuff and we ended up moving in with these two gay dudes who lived uh who, who also worked at the bookstore. And like you walk in and there was just like a giant fucking like dildo hanging above like the kitchen sink. And we like lived in like their closet. Like literally we lived in their closet. How hilarious that you guys lived in the gay guy's closet.

I know, I know. We were the shamed ones. They had to hide us. Like their parents are coming over. They're like, leave the the shamed ones. They had to hide us. That is hilarious. If their parents are coming over, they're like, leave the dildo up, but can we fucking shove the Charles Bukowski wannabe in the fucking closet? Yeah.

He's insufferable with his poetry. Oh my God. And so we just did that. So I was doing unpaid spots uh she realized she wanted to be a writer and so she started writing how long were we together we were together for like 12 years wow that's a long that's long and i thought you were gonna say yeah no no no uh and so what so so the part that's hard because I feel like sometimes, and maybe this is just me, but sometimes like in relationships, you fall in love with like the story. Like I love our

story so much. And I loved our story so much that when I should have got out of the relationship, I think I held onto that, you know, um, where, you know, I got to a point where we were so miserable at the bookstore. We would hide under the desk. We would like so we didn't have to deal with like customers. Again, we're in our 20s. We would like it was romantic. We would like like I wanted to be a writer.

So we would like write short stories to each other or like I would write like a sentence of something and hand it off to her and she'd write it. you know it was very jim and pam before the office we would like pull pranks on the mean kids and like you know fucking tag their stuff with security tags and watch them get patted down when they just wanted to go on their lunch break and like uh it was great uh it was exactly what a relationship at that point you know in your life should be and how old are you like 22 23 that's when you got married no your life should be. And how old are you? Like 22, 23. That's when you got married?

No, no, no. Well, that's when we got together. Gotcha. And so then what happens, and this is kind of how I made it in stand-up too, what happens is we, God, I haven't told this story in so long. So we, she breaks down crying one day at the bookstore. Uh, and she's organizing those, you know, there's like little gift books you get like at the register at like Barnes and Noble.

She's organizing those. And that's like her fucking breaking point. Right. And I was like, what's the matter? And she was just like, I just can't do this anymore. And I just had this like romantic idiot moment where I'm like,

come here. And I like took her behind the, uh, the, the business section of the bookstore ironically and was like we can leave I was like if we can figure out a way to get a car we can get the fuck out of here we can do what we said we've always wanted to we can like be fucking Kerouac we can I'll play gigs of like coffee houses or whatever all we need is enough money to get to the next gig. And then that's what we do.

And she was like, we can't. And I was like, you just cried while organizing tiny books. It doesn't get worse than this. We can do it. So we do it. We get a car. The first day we have the car. Are you guys living together?

Well, we're living in the gay kids closet. So we're going to leave New York. Now you have the car. Are you guys living together? Well, we're living in the gay kids' closet. Okay, so I just did the closet still. We're going to leave New York. Okay. Now you got a car, though. Yep, now we have a car. So we get a car. We go to say bye to my parents.

My dad sees that I'm wearing my little brother's socks, starts screaming at me. Now he finally loses it. Everything. He's just having flashbacks You got your little brother's socks on God damn it It was the glasses

It was the vase All of it came surging into my brother's From out of nowhere You know he wears ankle socks It was probably that he was so scared That we were hitting the road so i blamed him for this so we leave we were gonna go to my brother's basketball game we go fuck this we leave we immediately get rear-ended by a drunk driver oh god whole car smashed back

of the car smashed because it's a saturn which is made out of like magic and like plastic like it's just done it's fucking done they had those weird it was either like white wine or like that turquoise they have with the automatic seatbelt yeah it was that it was that that's what it was you guys saved enough money to get your car you're like two figures up we're out of here rear-ended by how far away we're like around the corner from my come on so here's what was even more fucked up it was uh it was like a firefighter it was like a drunk firefighter guy because he still had his fucking pants on like the firefighter pants on and across the street there was a cop and the cop was pulling over a woman so like all these jason born fantasies

i have about like what'll happen if i get mugged or whatever i'm like not even thinking about that because i'm like all right there's a cop right there. So I'm like, hey, man, to the cop. And it was loud. I was going to say, is he seeing a plow? Yeah. And he's like, hold on. And he's leaning.

Hold on. He's chatting up this chick. No. Swear to God. And meanwhile, I keep checking on my girl. She's being like, are you OK? And she's shaking, but she's fine. And I've never gotten into a car accident before.

That was the first time I got hit. And the guy gets out of the car he's like oh sorry man he's wasted and i go to the cop i go hey man i think you got to get over here and he's like hold on and then he gets shitty with me and there's part of me the conspiracy part of me i'm like does he know this motherfucker is it like cop firefighter hom? Because what happens is this guy goes to make the slowest getaway I've ever seen in my life into his truck. He just slowly starts backing up and gets into his truck and starts to drive away. And I'm like, hey, man, he's going away. And the cop's totally ignoring. And the guy slowly just goes into a 7-Eleven parking lot.

Cop finally comes over. He's like, where'd he go? I'm like, fucking I don't know, man. That way? Cop doesn't catch him or does. And was like, get out of here. Stop drinking. And the cop's like, yeah, I don't know what to tell you.

Does nothing. Literally does nothing. Nothing. So we drive the car back to my mom's house. At the time, my mom is dating this guy who's the worst. Like, big crucifix necklace. What do you mean big? His name is Dale.

Like, big. Like, it would be okay if he was a rapper. But is it like that? You know what I mean? It spins. But, like, just a white guy named Dale. Cool chain, Dale. Like, half a mullet.

Like, just the cliche guy that you don't want your mom having sex with. Just a white guy named Dale. Cool change, Dale. Like half a mullet. Just the cliche guy that you don't want your mom having sex with. And I am ruthlessly mean to Dale every time I see him. However, on this night, I come home and I'm like some fucking drunk firefighter. Like hit her car and the cop ignored. I don't know what to do. And Dale fucking seizes opportunity where he's like, I'm win this guy over and i'm gonna keep fucking your mom where he's like hey you want to go fucking find this guy and i was like let's fucking do it and my cross yep everybody hands on my cross dude i jump into his car i've never been in his car before there's

another cross hanging from the mirror a truck uh he's over here the cross in the mirror and he's he's like all right man let's go and so we go and he's like, all right, man, let's go. And so we go. But then he would go back and forth because it was also the first time he got to, like, talk to the son. So he'd be like, man, we're going to fucking get this guy. I'm like, yeah, man, we're going to do it. And there'd be a pause. He's like, no, I really care about your mother. I'm like, not now, Dale.

Like, we're not doing this. We're just there's one job. We have one job at hand. How does he get this guy? Okay, right, right, right, right, right. And then it'd like stay in his lane. But I feel like he tried it a couple times. She's a special lady.

And I'm like, no, not okay. We're not talking about you fucking my mom, Dale. So then, so then, so we get to this first firehouse right and I'm like really the first fire now I'm nervous because like isn't that a stereotype that firefighters are like alcoholics or whatever

I don't know what it is but I'll tell you this you go into a bees nest accusing one of their own of rear-ending you drunk I don't know if I'd have the balls to do that so this is what i'm nervous about so i go up and like dale fucking stays in the car i just realized that my cross just take my girl yeah i would rub it kiss it kiss it for good luck but is that how it works is that how religion works kiss the cross um and so uh so he goes so i go up and i i like i knock

and this older uh guy answers and i was like he just let you stay in the car i mean he's oh yeah uh and i'll just be here at mccross's maybe he was like he was rehearsing to drive you there yeah and so i go up and i go hey uh i'm so sorry if this comes off wrong i'm not trying to be like an asshole or anything, but my car just got rear-ended. I know the guy was a firefighter. I don't know if he's here or whatnot, but like he had like the uniform on. And like, again, I'm not trying to like be offensive or whatever,

but is there someone that it could be here? And the guy was like, oh man. Yup. Yeah. Yeah. He's been good for a while and i was just like wow for real yeah yeah and uh and i go is he is he here and the guy was like uh yeah he looked so upset he was like ah damn or whatever and he goes no he's not here right now but you know this is bound to happen and i I was just like, uh, would you have, like, a picture of him, or I'm like, I have to do something, like, I can't afford to fix my car.

He was like, yep, yeah, I'll go get it. He goes, gets a picture. Uh, it's not him. It's just some other drunk fucking firefighting asshole. Dude, it was just, like, some fucking, like, backwards hat with, like, an acoustic guitar in the woods. fucking firefighting asshole plowing people out there it was just like some fucking like backwards

hat with like an acoustic guitar in the woods like one of those like definitely singing a Dave Matthews song and I was like no man dude I swear to god we go to two more both of them like I'd get to the door get the same HBO and they'd be like

oh Gavin no don't tell me fucking get a picture. Nope, Matt. Every fucking firehouse had that fucking on the wagon, off the wagon guy. Waiting for somebody to fuck up. Dude, and we don't find them. Literally. Oh, but now I'm not terrified of firefighters.

That's pretty much all that happens. So Car Get Smashed, we spend our only savings fixing the car. Because it's literally, Saturn's, it was literally made of plastic. So we spend our only savings fixing the car because it's like it's literally Saturn. It was literally made of plastic. So the whole back. So I think we only have like three grand. That was it. All done.

So at the time, one of the reasons that I I I we started like touring is I was when I wasn't getting booked at stand-up clubs I started to do like slam poetry because my shit was really political and I saw a deaf poetry jam and with like most deaf and I was like oh I just need to say my shit fast and then I'll be funnier than all these guys so cool and so I show up at like these slam poetry places and I started winning all of these like big slam poetry. Like I played at the Paramount Theater in front of like 3000 people. Yeah. I got like fifth in the world my first year.

Yeah. Doing slam poetry because again, no one was funny. And I was like, oh, good. Like comedy. You were still mixing humor with your. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. And it was filthy too. Cause you could, you could get away with it then kind of but because i was like i'm too political for comedy so maybe i'll be the funny guy in poetry and then right away these like two short-haired ladies from deaf poetry jam uh they got offended at one of my jokes and they wrote a response poem to me that they were performers yeah and they uh and they performed she wrote i used to have this my first like big laugh line joke was like uh please take a mind this is like fucking 12 years ago um

was i was talking about like gay marriage and i was like at least if two like gay guys get into a like there's not even domestic violence or something like at least if two gay guys get into a fight like that's called a fair fight or something like that and it was like an applause break line and uh and the 3000 applause oh yeah huge and then uh and then she like wrote a poem like to the stand-up comedian thinks domestic violence, like gay domestic violence is funny. And like, I didn't even know that was an issue because I was like a dumb kid. And and I was like, fuck, man, even back then, because I was so depressed. I remember I start crying because I was like, I went I wanted to be a stand up and then I was failing at stand up.

So I became a slam poet which is literally like a step away from mime. I'm like, here I'll find a community. Surely there will be no infighting because we all have to support each other because we're doing something stupid. Honey, dude, you're right out of fucking slam poetry, bro.

Right away I'm in trouble. And you were fifth in the world. I was fifth in the world. That's not how you do it. You were five in the world. I was like, fuck. So I started doing... So then, so Allie and I start driving around the Saturn.

We get it fixed. And I'm doing like half comedy gigs, half like slam poetry nights at like coffee houses and stuff. And this is when my space was happening. I think Doug promoted me or I opened for Doug a couple of times and Stan Hope. And there was no plan though. It wasn't like, we're going to drive our car to LA to get to the comedy store. It was like, we just didn't want to work at that bookstore.

So we're going to drive anywhere until we get discovered. That was the plan. So like there was one time where we went from like Ohio to Toronto to Ohio because there was two different slam poetry nights on a Tuesday and Thursday and we had no money to stay anywhere on a Wednesday. So we drove to Canada like we just did that and we did it for two years until we came to LA once I remember Mark Maron gave us like the most depressing Los Angeles tour where he's like that's where this guy OD'd that's the store where this yeah it was just like it was just it was horrific and like that was the first time we got into a fight because Maron was so blunt where like the only time Allie and I got into a fight because marin was so blunt where like

the only time ali and i got into a fight were like after spending like two hours with mark marin ali was like what are we doing i'm like i don't fucking know like everything all my dreams were just like popped and uh and we go to albuquerque new mexico and we take mushrooms in albuquerque new mexico and i'm supposed to have a gig in San Antonio the next day, but the next day it snows in Texas, and Texas doesn't know what to do when it snows, so Texas closed. Texas closed.

There was no Texas. They closed, y'all. They didn't have salt. They didn't have anything. Texas was done. So we stayed in Albuquerque, and this guy was like, well, there's this arts festival. If done so we stayed in albuquerque and this guy was like well there's

this arts festival um if you want you can take my spot and i was like yes uh okay and so we stayed with this family we stayed with this family in albuquerque um and in the closet where they in the closet yeah yeah they they uh They moved us up to like, we stayed in like, I feel like a kid's race car bed. That's flashing back to me. And so, you go to the show

and the way the show worked, there was a show called The Reptilian Lounge where it was a variety show and you would pay your $10 cover and then they would give you back that $10 in quarters. The reason they gave it back to you in quarters was depending on how much you liked the act,

you would then hurl quarters at the stage and then sexy burlesque ladies would come and they would pick up the quarters and then they would count your change and then you would get paid. I made like $35, which for quarters, like- That's a lot of quarters. Crushed it. That's a lot. So Paul Provenza was there in albuquerque for some fucking weird

reason i didn't know paul and i was just doing slam poetry at the time because i assumed comics hated me or whatever and paul's smoking in the corner and he calls me over and i'm like is that the guy from northern exposure like i just didn't know like who he was before the aristocracy made the aristocrats i think and uh yeah it been. And he goes, was that like some fucking poetry shit? And I was like, yeah. And he was like, you're a comic though, right? And I go, what do you mean? He was like, I could tell.

You're like a comic. You're just doing something weird. And I was like, yeah. I mean, I was a comic. He's like, no, no, you're a comic. And I was like, oh, all right. And then he was like, what's your story? And I'm like, we're living out of our car. And he was like, all right, give me like a couple of weeks. And I don't know what that means,

but I'm just waiting and waiting and waiting. And, um, we, uh, my, my ex and I, uh, we didn't have any money or a place to stay. So we went to a meditation retreat, which is very popular now. Um, but at the time we just saw it was free vegetarian food and room and board and donations only so we're like all right we're gonna go there so we went there you weren't allowed to that's tight i didn't know that's good yeah well done right there and so we uh it had we you weren't allowed to bring books or phones or anything inside and they locked up our car and by the second day i was freaking out so much waiting to see if paul was gonna write me um that i snuck out uh i snuck out and i got my phone and i brought it back in and paul wrote

and he's like i have a gig for you it's a thousand dollars most money i've ever made and like i'm including like jobs um uh it's in china so i get to go to china and so i was like i yeah i'm like i have to get the fuck out of here and he was like then i'm gonna call he called robbie who was working at montreal at the time all these and just started telling everybody about me and uh so i was like i gotta sneak out of here so i go to the meditation guy i go hey i have to go i'm like pretty sick and he goes people say that a lot but are you really sick and i was like yeah and he was like i'm like i'm throwing up and i gotta go and he was like let me see the throw up and i was like that's weird like no let me see that and he was like why don't you wait one more day and i'm like what the fuck am i like it felt so culty i'm like i'm being like locked in so i

was like i gotta go rescue my ex and so or my wife and so i uh i run over to the girl's side of the camp and i was just just like, and I saw them. Oh, they had you separate? Yeah, because you're not allowed to talk. It's a silent retreat. And so I scare the shit out of the line of girls. And I go, hey, Allie, we got to get out of here. I think it should be like, let's do it.

And she's like, I'm actually having a really good time. Can you just pick me up after? And I'm like, cool. So sorry, ladies. And then I ran to my car, busted through, and I left. Call Paul. Paul sets it all up. Um, and that was when, like after meeting Paul, it was kind of when we were like, okay, I'm like, I can now make a living as a comic essentially.

And then we moved back to New York. Um, and just between like, I was starting to get some road work and like uh paul would take me overseas so i would most of my career when i was really political i would make most of my money in like australia in the uk and doing like edinburgh like the fringe festival and i would make a bunch of money come over to new york where i mean dude i played the sydney opera house with uh it was me reg me Reggie Watson Christopher Hitchens on the main stage of the Sydney Opera House and I couldn't get booked at like the New York Comedy Club like no fucking

when I got back like that was like my that was my life yeah I remember my dad once my dad still will like he would like accidentally be like a dick where I like sent him I got this like five star review and like the Scotsman the Guardian or something and I sent it to him being like love me and he wrote me back and he goes I'm really proud

of you and he was like one day you'll get reviews like that in America and I was like I know you're trying to be nice but Jesus man could you have just ended with I'm proud of you and hit send uh and so that was kind of my career so I've made all my money overseas. That's how I started making a living as a comic and then would continue to fail in America. And like so I would only even play the clubs like stand up New York. I would only play for auditions like I wasn't passed at any of the clubs. I was never passed at the cellar or anything like that. I would just if Montreal was doing an audition um i would get in there and then i had this kind of crazy year that was like the year i was almost famous where like

my montreal auditions went like this i got booed off stage my first montreal audition yeah robbie said it was the worst audition he ever saw um because i was still trying to do the slam poetry stuff and and it was about hurricane katrina and our racist response and it was at the comic strip live on like the friday eight o'clock show uh and the only black guy was the host and i remember everyone was booing there was this one big dude in the front row who looked like a like disgruntled oilman from like fucking friday night lights and he was like i think it was mike brit he was looking at mike and he was like get him off and mike just shook his head like, no. And so I was just like, you know, we're a racist country.

Like, just awful. And boot off stage. I run out. Me and my ex, we run out together. And we really did have each other's back, like, back in the day. Like, that's why the story is kind of, like, hard to tell. But, yeah, we ran out. So I got booed off stage the first year then the

next year i got new faces then the year after that i was the robbie told me i was the first comic to get new faces and then do a one-man show the next year and the only reason i'm piping myself up is because it's about to drastically go downhill anytime you guys yeah i can hear the clicks at the top of the roller yeah anytime i say something good about myself it's like and then i was discovered by robin williams like we know where it ends it ends terribly with me and so yeah the year i got a one-man show this is fucking wild there were three comics at this one little theater that seated probably 100 120 people it was me patrice and bill burr damn like those were the three one-man shows um and my new faces class was great my new faces

class was like pretty much all of the comedy store people it was like eric and eliza and mo uh it was great and so the reason i'm like saying all this is because just nothing happened and i was sort of the guy especially because i was political that people were like hey i really like what you do and i'd be like thanks man you want to do something together like oh no jesus christ i'll get fired like uh no no no no no and i just got really depressed and i started to feel like well this was it like i did con Conan and apparently they got so much hate mail. Really? Yeah.

They told you that? Yeah. I did a rant thing. If you watched it, I did well. But I was always pissing off both sides somehow. always like pissing off both sides somehow where it was like it was like against like the war but it was also like while obama was technically the one still doing it you know like i i feel like all the like easy paths i like never like even now like i'm like i don't i'm never gonna do a fucking trump joke i never like i just like i don't know like uh yeah i was political like after 9-11 when like

nobody could be and then finally we got obama and i'm like well i still don't like killing civilians so like i'm still gonna do that um and then even when i got my progressive audience i feel like i started like trying to push them a little more and i don't know um i mean comedy is not fun when everyone agrees with you you know, it's no fun. And I eventually did get stuck in an echo chamber on the progressive side after this. So after I kind of, I feel like I exhausted everything. I did New Faces, I did the one-man show,

and I'm like, literally nothing. I mean, no acting auditions. I'm not really getting clubbed. There were a couple clubs that headlined me um i feel like i headlined like the laughing skull like and like but like i was just in that weird point like kind of where i'm in now was like a little too big to feature for people um but not big enough to headline and like i didn't want to like go back like living out of my car and like doing like bar gigs um and so we had this podcast we started a very political podcast and originally the podcast uh this is me and my wife uh oh yeah

so we got married uh well it wasn't see i mean this is this was the problem with the relationship is it just became a partnership and a best friend thing where we didn't have a wedding i've never had a wedding i've never had a honeymoon um we went to City Hall and we did it because we're like, we're finally making a living. So let's like celebrate it. And we were told that we could get a tax break or something. And so we did. And we were at this podcast network. And the podcast network was like one of the first podcast networks there was this like even before wtf like we were like kind of like early on with the podcast and uh and so the uh the network we became like pretty popular right away and they wanted us to take advertisements

but we were like you know like radical progressives where we're like, we're not going to take advertisements. And to be fair, they wanted us to have AT&T. And this is when we were attacking AT&T for the domestic wiretapping. It's like, what are you going to be like? If you want to get spied on, be spied on by the best, like AT&T. So we quit. And we quit, and we were like, I guess we'll try to do the podcast independently but that was our main source of income uh until fucking fringe festival right

in the summer and right around that time uh I'm headlining at the punchline in San Francisco and uh I hear Robin Williams is in town. And I wrote Paul. And I'm like, this is a weird ask. But I'm like, do we know anyone who knows Robin? And I guess Rick Overton was out there at the time. And Rick's always liked me. And I think Rick brought, yeah, he did. He brought Robin.

And I remember hearing his laugh. Like the punchline's dark. can't really see like towards the back and I could sniper point to where Robin was sitting because it was booming and I just put on like the show of my fucking life I was just like this is

like literally just like for this dude and I remember telling the story about my dad and I remember I remember doing this music rant about like the, the corporatization of music. And cause Robin afterwards was like telling me all these stories were like Miles Davis and see Miles Davis back in the day in like New York. Cause I like name checked Hendricks and Miles Davis and Robin comes backstage and I'm just instantly comfortable. Like there are celebrities I'm not comfortable around. There are comics who are, haven't been doing it as long as me that I'm just instantly comfortable. There are celebrities I'm not comfortable around. There are comics who haven't been doing it as long as me that I'm not comfortable around.

I was instantly comfortable. I don't know if you ever met him, but I was instantly comfortable. Where he was just as animated and just as frantic with his words and his hands, but he was quiet. And he was kind of looking down. So it was like a hushed version of that energy. And right away gave me this big hug, like thanked me for like comping him. Really? No, no, no.

I didn't comp him. But he thanked you for that. Just the most humble. Yeah. If they see him walking in, they're like, you can just come on in. Through the back. While in the beginning, I was like, I went to Molly. I was like, I have a name for the guest list.

I was like, can you just write Robin? And she looked at me like, all right. Yeah, like I didn't know if he was going to come. And then he literally was like, what do you need? And I was like, anything? Like literally anything? And within a week, I was with CAA. He did that.

Yep. I had his managers. This guy, Larry Bresner. Larry passed, but, um, this guy, uh, Jonathan Brandstein, still my manager. Um, he was under Larry and he manages like Norton and like those guys and Amanda's Patrice like back in the day. And, uh, had that, uh, I did this solo show at UCB in New new york and uh people online said that they were just like

confused industry like talking being like yeah i don't know who this guy is but like robin called the office like he just went fucking nuts that's all someone sent me like a timeout london interview where they were like who are your favorite comics and he's like joan rivers and jamie kilstein like everyone's like who like like no one knew who i was but he he just made it his point. Word got back to him that we quit the podcast. And he called me one day and was like, how much did you guys make? And I was just like, you know, it's not going to sound like a lot, man, but it was like our rent. It was like 2000 bucks a month. And he was like, cool, cool, cool.

And then like his accountant called me and was just like, hey, we're going to start sending you a check like every month. So like Robin, we didn't have sponsors for the podcast paid for the podcast are you fucking serious for a year that's fantastic yeah and uh and more importantly i love hearing that yeah well and i i i didn't want to do like a bunch of places asked for interviews after he died and i didn't want to do any but then i ended up i did like an msnbc one and i think i wrote one piece. I forgot for where. But just because I wanted people to know. Yeah, those are great stories.

You don't ever hear that. No. And like, you know, I mean, what was cool was, like after he died, I was reading all these stories. Some from famous people. Some from nobodies like me. And everyone had a story like that about Robin. It was the same with Brody, right? Where you're like, wow, you two made everybody feel so special.

And you were the only ones in the world. And that was Robin. And so he did all that. And like I said at the top of the show, and more importantly, he would call me every time I wanted to quit. He would call me when I was depressed um and like talk me down like again and like that little whisper um and and that was big and you know he was the one who convinced me not to quit uh and then he died and then i fucking quit because i was just like i got nothing like it's when you know i mean joe's so good to me now uh but it wasn't like joe and i were fighting because

so at the time like at this point i was getting much more social justice warriory because our podcast was getting much more political well when the podcast first started it was just my fans so like i could talk about gay rights but also like say faggot without like suddenly having like a barrage of protesters like outside never obviously in a hateful way but like it wasn't uh language policed i guess is what i'm trying to say and but then like uh ali started writing for the nation and then our audience started becoming like a little more political. And then it became about 50-50.

But the comedy fans didn't really they were just there for the laughs. But the political people, anything that offended them, they would write. Now, look, I've had people be like like back in the day, I had a gay rights joke and I had the word faggot ironically. And like a gay kid asked me really nicely. He was like, hey, I love the joke. I love the material faggot ironically and like a gay kid asked me really nicely he was like hey i love the joke i love the material that word really affects me maybe you can like think about it and i stopped doing the joke right like that's fine easy that's a great way to approach somebody just maybe you can consider that yeah and and him telling me his personal story oh my god and also uh i realize i haven't said anything funny in a while. This is horrifying.

So at first, at first I was like, you know, I did the leg. Like, because I was defensive in my head. Now I'm like, man, that kid handled it perfectly. But I was bummed out. And also, like, you're insecure as a comic. I'm like, that's one of my only applause break jokes. You know what I mean? But I'm also like, if I'm pretending to defend gay people and a gay person's like, hey, by the way, when you say faggot, I think of when I got the shit kicked out of me. And I'm like, sorry, bud.

This is for the other gays. Then it's like you're not doing what you say you're doing. So there was part of me – so I took it out for a little while. But then I remember I was doing this show at the Broadway Comedy Club, which is kind of a nightmare of a club, and I was bombing. It was like very touristy audience. And the joke was, again, guys, I promise I'm a good comic. I'm just telling you the bad jokes for the story. But it was like it was about Texas, and it like texas's motto being like uh don't

mess with texas and i was like that's the only uh state where the motto is a threat and i was like if that's the one they went with what did they pass up like texas you better back the fuck up faggot blah blah blah so on my set list it would say texas that's what the joke was um and i'm bombing in this crowd and i'm looking at this very like kind of bro-y looking crowd and in my head i go i'll do the faggot joke now i'll do the texas joke i'll do the faggot joke because they're gonna laugh at that right and that's when i was like that's why you are you are doing it for that word you know and so i do it and of course joke fucking kills and i'm just like oh i'm garbage and uh and then uh and then i go to do uh that show the green room um which is paul show and i

had this clip on there that went viral and that was kind of one of the things that helped me blow up um where i was the new guy and i was on the show with ron white lewis black and kathleen madigan like oh like three fucking powerhouses right and i was like the nobody and paul wanted to set me up to do this rant and like i did in front of ron it went fucking great and like whatever but paul loved that texas joke and he was like hey i'm gonna like do a thing where i can put like you and ron against each other and like you can tell the texas joke and i was like i don't know man like some kid came up to me and he's like dude it's a joke it's comedy and i'm like all right so came up to me and he's like dude it's a joke it's comedy and i'm like all right so i'm gonna do the joke but like a week before i got a fan mail from this like kind of like rich san francisco fan of

mine like beautiful older like blonde hair uh has kids married and she goes i just want you to know i know i shouldn't but i've been letting my kids listen to your stand-up and they taped uh they taped one of your stand-up pieces for you and they wanted me to send it to you and my heart sank because most of my pieces are like ranty and long-winded i only have one joke that is like joke format and that is this this joke and i open the video and i put headphones in so no one can hear because i fucking know what's coming and it is just like a bunch of like hitler youth motherfucker like blonde hair blue eye atrial in fucking unison like it is a chant i taught them where they're like you better back the fuck up faggot i was like yep nope never

doing this joke again that's when you retired yep so i go to tell paul i'm like i'm not gonna do the joke there is a point on my episode in the green room where paul's like so jamie uh has some thoughts on texas and i was like hell of a place and he's like can i have the thoughts of texas and i was like nope i was like austin's cool and like ron must have jumped in to like save something but yeah that's when i was like, Austin's cool. And like Ron must have jumped in to like save something. But yeah, that's what I was like. So the reason I said that is just because like I'm not above changing jokes, right? But our audience was getting to the point where, I mean, I called a politician an idiot once.

And we got an email saying that idiot is ableist like it was just the worst of the left right now which i was part of a hundred percent i was part of where it's almost just this like hipster like you were offended by that well i was offended by the live version or like whatever where it's like they have to just outdo each other and usually quite honestly it's upper middle class white people who are saying this and black people are like, oh, we got other shit to deal with. Like we have real problems that aren't on Twitter. And but that was our audience. I mean, I said this on Rogan's show, but my sort of topping like my breaking point was some kid wrote in and was like, hey i wrote you a while ago and like my doctor said i was gonna die if i didn't lose weight because i was like morbidly obese and uh i guess i emailed him a bunch of like vegan recipes and i found him a jujitsu place in baltimore and i'm from in baltimore yeah yeah so that's where this kid was from i still remember it and uh i think it was

crazy 88 was the was the school um and he's like, just, you know, like, I lost all this weight. My doctor said he's never seen something so impressive. I'm entering my first white belt tournament. And I'm like in tears reading this on the show because it's so fucking inspirational. We get like 10 emails the next day saying that by reading his email, we're fat shaming them. Oh, my God. I wouldn't be able to do it. I want to apologize.

And that's what I was like. Look, it's one thing like the idiot thing like that's fucking stupid whatever but like this is like you're saying you're showing me that all the republicans that i'm cursing out about are right and that you're all these like sad whiny victims where i'm like you would rather that guy die than you take like a little bit of responsibility or just say like because at no point were we like hey fatties do jujitsu or we're not gonna fuck you like it was literally we were just like this kid's story we never even said so you guys should lose weight it was like this kid did something fucking inspiring it's motivational yeah he was like my kids aren't gonna see me die and that's when i was like, oh, are my side?

Like, are we pieces of shit? But at that point, you know, Robin had died. Joe didn't like me. And I was just like, I don't have friends. Like, I had my new faces run. I did my one late night spot. And I was like, I don't have friends in comedy. And this podcast is really paying my bills. And because

I'm not confident from the high school dropout and I'm in this scene with a bunch of academics who essentially say that I'm the problem just by being like a white dude, I'm very quick to being like, yeah, I'm probably the one who's wrong. Like know what i mean like with the fat shaming with everything where i just kind of like stood back and just kind of went with it and kind of became one of those like pc warrior dudes um and then yeah then when it all came fucking crashing down the only people who reached out to me were like rogan stanhope and like provenza and comics and all those all those progressive people who talk about like being that none of them none of them i disappeared for a year after like talking about suicide being suicidal like went silent no more

social media nothing um look it would be one thing if i was like accused of like fucking rape or groping people but like nothing like that even remotely close to that happened and yeah comics reached out to me and when i went i had a girlfriend at the time um and uh but yeah it was just comics and that was that reminder that it's just like oh yeah we're all like fuck ups but it's funny that like comics aren't given second chances when all comics do or give other. I agree. And not only comics, too. But in my life, I tend to see the people who've been most damaged and most hurt. They tend to reach out.

Yeah. You know, not all of them. But it's like, wow, I don't know necessarily if you want to help or you just want to be there. You even know how to help all the time. But it's great to have that. Yeah. want to be there you even know how to help all the time but it's great it's great to have that yeah i remember i did um i did burke chrysler's podcast and he was like he was like i know you're not going to believe me but i kind of envy where you're at right now and i was just like don't uh

you're wrong uh but he was like getting to rebuild getting to start again there's something really exciting about that and And for me, when all this stuff was happening and, um, uh, you know, the divorce happened and, uh, fucking feminist blogs are writing about me. Uh, I, I was like, nothing good can come out of this. Like I'm all about the mentality of, you know, it's like with jujitsu, like you get choked out. Great. Now I'm going to be more careful about like, you know, I'm going to watch my neck a little more and I'm all about the mentality of, you know, it's like with jujitsu, like you get choked out. Great. Now I'm going to be more careful about like, you know, I'm going to watch my neck a little more and I'm learning from that. Right.

There's that whole self-help like you're either winning or you're learning. And it's very, very true. But I was like, when you're. When you had a marriage fall apart and you had consensual one night stands and stuff like that. And actually, most of those one night stands, me and my ex-wife were trying an open relationship publicly. We even announced it, but they didn't write about that because that doesn't fit the narrative of like feminist guy likes to fuck. And. And. Oh, right. this guy likes to fuck um and uh and and uh oh right so i was like there's no lesson i can learn i mean like the lesson is i should have gotten out of my relationship um i should have

been brave enough to like confident enough to like get out of it but like i didn't um but i was like it's not like i'm a sex predator and i have to go learn how to not be a sex predator i was like what the fuck am i gonna get out of this but like years later it's like well what i got out of it was like i lost everything and now i'm not going to take advantage of anything whether that's friendships whether that's you know i think i said this on bird's podcast, but this sums up who I was, where I would be like on Twitter yelling at people and someone would be like, hey, Jamie, your mom's on the phone. And I'd be like, tell her I can't talk.

I'm tweeting about feminism. You know what I mean? Like, that's who I was. I was acting like such a good guy online, but I was like, you know, I fucking cheated. I wasn't calling my mom. I like wasn't like really talking to my family at all. There was a period of two years where I stopped talking to my brothers and like to everybody in my family. And it's like, I was selfish and I was really depressed. And instead of dealing with it and going to therapy or training harder or whatever, uh, I just isolated

myself and, and I thought everything revolved around me. And that was something I did, uh, in in relationships and friendships that i i've definitely changed and i've worked really hard and i'm like a fucking great boyfriend and brother and stuff like that now um so even you know so there there is stuff you can learn from like rock bottoming but i think a lot of it is just gratitude that's the goal though you know a lot of a lot of people are so quick to shit on someone for something and ruin a career over something someone said a while ago regardless of the the field they're in yeah um and obviously there are some blatant ones that you can't overlook but to me the ultimate um apology is to change the behavior like you have to let the person make the mistake in order to see it, understand it, and then change that behavior.

And if you do change that behavior and you look back on it and you're like, yeah, I was wrong. That was really fucked up. And now I see it. Then I think that's the best thing you could. It's the only thing you can ask someone to do. But it affects you. Like where because we carry our phones everywhere. If I was a teenager

i would i mean fuck man i'm 36 i'm trying to kill myself three times like if i was a teenager with social media three times why are you not telling me that yeah yeah oh well i mean we can um yeah no we can totally do it so i i i tried to kill myself wow well how were you the first time uh i guess let's just say twice because i feel like the first time was like i like was like high school when like everyone's like almost slipped my wrist over a girl um but like i didn't actually do anything i just like thought i was going to and then i was just like oh wait i'm a coward uh i'm not gonna slice of my wrist yeah uh no so when i when i was cheating when i was having this affair so i, like, one affair before the open relationship.

And I couldn't get out of it. And I was going to jump off the bridge, like the Brooklyn Bridge. But there were all these, like, gated things. And I'm afraid of heights. And I was just like, no. It was all bad. Like, ow, all bad. I'm like, also, I'm like the guy, like, just like I fucked up dropping out of high school i'm like i would fuck up sue it i would be like the fucking dude who just like

breaks both of his legs and then spends the next 20 years like sadly trying to wheel myself into traffic and shit like that while cars like swerved perfectly around me like you know you're in a viral video like this guy's lucky day yeah yeah there are different remixes like different songs yep yep yep oh man yeah yeah yeah every time a politician like says like a faux pas just like cuts to me swerving yeah that's uh that was that and then i kind of fucked up this the well then the second time was i mean i the only reason i I haven't gone into total details is cause one, uh, uh, this podcast I've talked for a very long time. Um, but also like, you know, I've talked about it on Rogan's and Bert's and I feel like a lot of most people know, but essentially when I was super political, I was labeled as, as

like male feminist. I leaned into that. I was labeled as like male feminist. I leaned into that. And then once this girl I had the affair with, you know, found out we were in an open relationship. She just like went on some fucking message board and was like, who's been wronged by feminist Jamie Kilstein? And out of the like hundreds of girls I've slept with, one girl was like, he flirted with me on Twitter. And then another girl said that I called her a road fuck on my podcast. And then there's a Jezebel article about it.

And that but the headline is like sexual misconduct. And it's like that looks like I raped somebody or groped someone or it'll say like abuse allegations. Not saying that like calling someone a road fuck is an emotional abuse and that i've never put my hands on someone i've never i don't fucking make first moves i'm a comic i hate rejection like jesus and like i uh uh so so that's it that's like the the the cliff note uh version of it but i felt awful with the affair thing um and so i kind of was just like i'm in too deep are you in touch with your ex at all no i had to write her today about like a money thing um how long have you been separate or divorced like three years we've been separated uh and then the

affair was like six years ago and at the end of our relationship, we were public about it. We tried an open relationship to like save it. And, uh, it's awful, man, because like, I don't know, like Bert was,

Bert was like, she really done you wrong because it was, so what happened was, so these girls like made the article, like they were making complaints and they were writing to my wife being like we're gonna say something blah blah blah and i was in touch with my my wife about it and we were like trying to figure out like fuck this is crazy what we're gonna do and then one day i was at jujitsu and i went to my phone and i guess i don't know if she got pressure i don't know if she got pissed at me i don't know if she was embarrassed like but on her like verified facebook was like i'm now aware of the allegations against jay and like made it very

like lawyerly and that actually kind of gave the story like that's what burt was saying that kind of made the story blow up because suddenly you know she's never said i did anything to her um but that kind of it blew up because of that And at the time I was with that girlfriend, the really jealous one, and she was visiting her family in San Diego or no in a Sacramento. And I was like, well, fuck, if she gets jealous, uh, there's no way she's going to be with me, uh, when this shit breaks. So that's when I started like planning the suicide thing. I'm like, I have nothing, but yeah, yeah like that i fucking wish i didn't do and i wish that like i don't care that she wrote that facebook post um she will never be my friend ever um she will never think that

see any even hear my defense um i mean everybody everybody in my old life pretty much wanted me ruined right away they were just like take it all i don't care um and but i i fucking i wish she didn't have to go through it and like i think about her and i hope she's okay like uh and that's me trying to be like i'm just a good guy. Like, no, no, no. You genuinely mean it. Well, I generally mean it. And also it's probably a little bit for me too. You know, it's probably, it's probably so I don't, you know, cause I still, even the stuff that wasn't my fault.

I mean, fuck dude, when there's a headline about you and the word sexual or like, I, like the reason I've gotten into relationships that I shouldn't have or like I've like fallen for one night stands is I think I'm just so desperate. I mean, I go on first dates and before a girl kisses me, I feel like I have to tell them like I'm like a registered like sex offender. We're like I remember I made friends with a guy. He's divorced from this famous musician and he I have a wedding ring tattoo and he has her name tattooed uh that's how we became friends we're like hey we both made a terrible mistake uh let's hang out and we went to hang out and this was like my first sort of friendship like since i like kind of reappeared and i like sat him down on his couch i was like there's something you need to know about

me and he was like bro i thought you were going to tell me you're a fucking rapist. Like I had a woman who spoke at the woman's march call me the day after it happened to be like, yo, that's fucked up what those girls did to you. And like, that makes my job harder to go after. Yeah, of course. Because it's like, that's the problem.

What's happening is, you know, you can bitch all day about like guys who are falsely accused. There are still more women who don't get justice for their assault uh then there are guys who are falsely accused with that said when you either falsely accuse a guy or you conflate a bad relationship with emotional abuse or whatever you're making it harder for women you're i mean you saw how like much backlash the me too movement got after the aziz story because that's when it started to creep into like what is that should he his life be ruined for that you know um that's when shit started to get weird so uh anyway uh i don't remember the question whenever i talk about

this like oh so so dates like i don't uh like i even if it's a fucking. Do you date now? Yeah. I mean, I date a lot. I've had a bunch of girlfriends since it's happened. All of them have known about it. And. Do you find it harder to date now? Yes. So, the reason that. They're really not.

I've ended the relationships. I've ended all the relationships. And I think they should have been casual dating. But because of everything I went through and my issues from before, the second it seems like a girl wants to be in a relationship, I have this fantasy of getting to be normal again. And getting to just like have a family and have kids. Me and my ex-wife were never going to have kids because we were like the progressive fuck kids whatever. And I'm like

I was convinced I'd be a terrible dad. And when I stopped doing comedy I started teaching jujitsu and I was teaching adults but I also started teaching kids. And every parent was like you're great with kids. And I was like what the fuck? And you had a great dad. Yeah. I know. Yes. And I was like I had great with kids and i was like what the fuck we didn't fucking have a great dad yeah yeah i know yes and i was like i had no idea so i'm like now i like i want a family and i want to fucking move and like dude the idea of like road fucks is

like oh like i i was never even a one-night-stand guy like i fell in love with my first one-night-stand like i'm a fucking dipshit romantic um i was just in a relationship that was a friendship and we didn't know that and so uh like i hated having the open relationship the open relationship felt like i was still cheating like it was awful and so so anyway so so i got in these relationships recently i think because i just wanted to fucking end like dude I go on Tinder dates. And before the girl. I've never done an online date. It's awful. It's awful. And before I kiss the girl. I literally feel like I have to tell them this.

And I tell them. You tell every girl this. Yeah. Because it's like. Isn't it weirder to like. Oh yeah. If we like have sex. And then they Google me.

Yeah. And I've had girls be like. You don't need to tell them that. And I'm like. I just. I don't fucking know tell them that and i'm like i just i don't fucking know man and so yeah it's horrible i was on that celebrity dating site which is so it's such trash there's a celebrity dating dude it's awful it's called raya you have to be like invited or verified or whatever and because all the girls are so hot there's like no bios

you just you pick a song and then it's just a, a, a, a, a song. Yeah. And it matches you up with a girl. No, no, no, no, no. So you, you like, like if you're a girl, you pick like a song. It's always some terrible club song. And then it's just a slideshow of pictures. So there's no need for a bio because they're just like, we're hot.

And it's just terrible club songs and hot girls. I had, I went on two dates. Both of them thought I was a, I just wrote writer instead of comedian. Both of them must have thought I was more famous than I was because they both just tried to pitch me scripts about their life story. It was a fucking nightmare. But my last name was on there. So on Tinder and stuff, your last name's not on there. But on this, my last name was so i had girls there

was one girl who's really cool we were like texting like regular texting on the phone we like exchanged numbers and her last line to me was i'm really excited about our date tomorrow and i bought us tickets to a show and then the next day i got a text that said i'm really uncomfortable and have to cancel and i told my sister that I was like, do you think this is about like my Google? And she was like, no, no, no, no. I was like, but I didn't say anything in between. I'm really excited. You know, I think I said like me too. Maybe that was the, I shouldn't have said that. I did put a hashtag. And, and that was it. I was like, oh, right. So like I got off that site and I was just like, Jesus,

man, am I too much of a delinquent to be on like a trash dating site? And like, and it's hard because I know it's a small percentage of people who know. I mean, the majority of your listeners probably didn't know. And that's why I think about, I'm like, do I even talk about it? Is there anything like I'm going to do this new standup album? And there's part of me that I'm like, I have a lot to say about it, about shame, about extremism on both sides about, but also I'm like, I don't want to be that guy. And also I'll tell you off air, a lot of the stuff that was said about me wasn't even true. Um, even if it was true, it's still not a crime or anything more than what comics talk about on stage like sleeping around blah blah blah um but a lot of it wasn't even true and i'm like

if i really wanted to like defend myself or go into it i'm suddenly gonna be sound like a men's rights activist where like i don't i've had people like i said i've had amazing women in my life women fans women dm me being like yo what happened he was fucked up i'm so sorry blah blah blah everything's getting crazy i've also had the fucking guys who write you and you're like hey man i'm so sorry what happened to you and you're like oh thanks so much man they're like we gotta stop these whores you're like nope nope nope you're not mine you're not with you're not with me man you know and like so it's it's just like it's this weird thing where like creatively and for

my wellbeing where it's just like, I survived suicide. My girlfriend saved me like comics saved me that I'm like, do I really want to, you know, start that again? Do I really want to, you know, there's part of me that I'm like, I just want to talk about like fucking easy, like dating and fucking fucking drugs i never just talked about shit like that i'm writing jokes you should definitely talk about that yeah and it's great but also like this shit's really interesting and there's part of me that i'm like but i'm like i don't want to be the guy like i don't want to be the guy i don't want to be the guy. I don't want to be on Twitter fucking attacking me too.

I just want to be a comic, you know. Well, I'm going to say this. We're there, bro. Yeah. And I'm glad you're the guy that came on here. Oh, good. I really appreciate it. Come on and open it up. Oh, yeah.

Sorry I got weird at the end. That whole fucking. I should have just kept. It's a safe space, bro. It's a safe space. Good, good, good, good, good. and oh yeah sorry i got weird at the end that's that whole fucking i should just save space um will you please one more time promote whatever you'd like podcast social media all that yeah uh albums books dates websites just fucking where is it all book me on your stand-up shows that's all i want i just want to be a fucking comic again. That's the big thing. I'm on Twitter, at Jamie Kilstein. There's a Facebook, too. Instagram is the Jamie Kilstein Podcast.

It's a Jamie Kilstein Podcast. Free on iTunes and all those places. And that's it. Dude, thank you so much for coming on. Thank you, man. I am Ryan Sickler on all social media. RyanSickler.com. We'll talk to you all next Wednesday.