The Hope Hotline - Breaking Down The Wedding Vows

Episode Date: March 18, 2026

The Hope Hotline | S04-E16 | 03-18-2026

Real talk. Hey, do this. Here you go. I'm so glad you could join us today. Been on and all over the place and didn't know what time it was. Hello, everybody. I was like, we have one minute. I'm like, I think I saw her.

So unprofessional. Hi. Welcome to the podcast. How's it going? It's pretty good. Yeah? It's pretty good. Yeah.

You know what you could do next time? Hmm. Start out with your side. Okay. And leave my side blank. Okay, we'll do that. And then introduce, like, all the openers. Okay, let's do that.

I love that idea. Good idea. It's a great idea. Nobody knows. Well, it was, we, none of us really, we realize, like, oh, it's 40 seconds, so. Time flies. Yeah, it does fly. And that's how we solve problems.

Absolutely. On the spot by having a problem. Correct. I love that idea. My color rains off, so I'm just going to mess with that for a second. Yeah, they did. because I wasn't sitting here. Place you got to see.

Okay, so today, today we are going to talk about something that, you know, people know my disdain for marriage. Wow. Okay. I mean, I love marriage. There we go. But my disdain for,

my disdain for people who don't take it seriously. Oh, there it is. Okay. I literally hate it. Okay. Same. For here. Me too.

You know what song my mom hates? What song? The Bruno Mars song. Which one? Oh, which I don't, I don't know really that much about Bruno Mars. Let's do something stupid and get married tonight.

Let's, um, yeah, don't say it again. Something dumb to do. Um, I think I want to marry you. And my mom's like,

do something dumb? Like, this is marriage. Like, what do you mean? I was like, that's true. I know.

Good point. And here we are dancing to it. I know. I didn't even, you know what, I've heard that song, I didn't know what that was about. I didn't, I was just, it was a, yeah, it was like a theme, yeah. To do. Hey, baby, I think I'm gonna marry you. Yeah, oh, I thought that was about somebody who was in love and that.

It is. It's, but that they, like, he was actually proposing, but seriously, not doing something. Have cocked. Something dumb to do. I think we're taking it too literal, but yes. Oh, well, that's bobsky. I'm just saying what my mom said. Well, I agree with your mother.

She's always right. Well, I don't know about that. But in my opinion, right now, she's always right. Yes. I, I don't know. Was this our idea last week? And I think you suggested it or who suggested we do this this week on wedding, on marriage vows.

I don't know. I think it was just in the middle of, I was like this. Like, we need to do this. It was last week. It was last week. And I love the idea. Weddings. I think we were talking about marriage, wedding.

Oh, wow. That's it. Yes. That's it. June is coming. That's, you know, the month of love and getting married. Yeah. My birthday is well.

What a great man. Bring it back to tell you. And gay pride. Don't let's up. Oh, yeah. Oh, my gosh. I think Trump got rid of gay pride. Yeah, I think we switched it to a different, something else.

I think he got rid of the month of pride. Mm-hmm. Although I'm not a huge fan of his right now. a couple reasons. I am a huge fan of him for other reasons. Like, whatever, this isn't a political show, so I'm not going to get into that right now. But tonight. Watch the podcast. Tonight at 9 p.m. Tune it. Oh my goodness gracious. You know, I'm not going to go there. Okay. I'm going to leave it alone. Back to wedding vows. You know, if we don't get started on this, we probably aren't going to finish it. And Friday, yeah, let's do it.

We have a wedding. We're headed to a wedding. Yeah, we're heading to a wedding. So we can't do this and make it go into the next. Should we do an episode at the wedding? Oh, we can judge their vows. Yes. I'll go live.

I can promise you, I know what's not going to be in there. Okay. Go ahead. It's not because of them because it's just the way it goes. But you want to do your thing really fast and then we'll get going? Beauty. I'll go really fast. Okay.

So if you're on Facebook, hello, if you want to hop over to Rumble, Talia is going to put the link in there from me because she loves me. And we've got a live chat going on. We got Sharon and we've got court there. And if you're watching, because I can see the little number. If you're watching, say hello. And of course, YouTube's available as well. And the audio podcast is always available after the show.

If you're watching the replay, you can always say hi through the replay because we love knowing who's watching. And we love hearing your comments, even though we don't see them live. you guys know we're all on TikTok so please come over follow share do all the things we love having you a part over there and hopefully the algorithm switches for us because it's silly right now pastor tom has both his preaching and also his tlp clips like hope was just saying he has a podcast monday through friday 9 p.m and he goes over everything that's going on right now so if you're watching things you're not in a chair like you i don't know just all it just gets a little bit chaotic like what to believe what's true what's not uh follow pastor tom

follow his TLP, the Tom Leapley podcast, follow all of this. Yeah, you can see the clips, but you can actually go and watch the full episode on Rumble, YouTube everywhere. So, Facebook. Oh, no, it's not on Facebook, but there's a link to go there if it's easier for you to find the link. Our Foundation Church Worship is also on there, so go follow that. Natalie will be here April 15th, so please send all of your questions in. If you don't have any, don't worry, I've got a lot of good ones. the no podcast Friday. So don't forget, if you come and tune in, we won't be here. So,

but we will be back next week. And don't forget, Easter is coming. We have two services last Sunday. It was so, so full. So I'm expecting some big services on Easter, bring everybody you know, bring your neighbors, bring your friends, bring your mom, bring all your people. And then register. So we know which one you're coming to. And even sooner is going to be Crave. So that's is Saturday, March 28th at 7 p.m. Definitely also think about who you can invite to these. They are a great time to just set aside time to worship God and to just enjoy some moody lights

and really just be able to just lay it down. I love Crave. I think it's awesome. Such a good time. So especially if you have people that love worship, like bring them in. Bring them in. That is all.

I'm fighting with my bangs. I cut them. And my hairdresser, which is the thingy, so she's going to be all over me. But whatever. She is. I hate when I have problems.

But, okay, let's do sponsors really quick, and then let's get going. Because I actually, we've talked about marriage so much, but I really think the vowel part hits home. It really does. And I learned, I learned some stuff myself.

Oh, I like that. Mm-hmm. Good. Like elementary stuff that you go, of course. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But because marriage is just so, marriage is taken so laxadaisically in the decision of it that I don't even think people realize it either.

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of mind every mile. You can contact them by reaching out to them at 941-4-60-3962. 9-4-1-4-60-3962. Back to me. Okay, so I think a lot of times when people get married, they think more about the wedding day than they actually think about the wedding vows. What do you think about that, girls? 1,000 percent. It's about the wedding, not the marriage. It's like all that time, all that money invested into that one day. And not many people will do counseling or talk to other people or read a book or anything.

They're just so focused. I just don't really think that a lot of times when it comes to when somebody, first of all, I don't think a lot of people pray and say to the Lord, is this the person you, you should have me marry. 100%. That in and of itself, in my opinion, is far more important than the vows themselves. Because if you know God has put you and this person together, like it pretty much doesn't matter. Literally.

Yeah. Like the vows are the vows, but you're stuck. Right. And that's why with me when I went through what I went through in my previous marriage, like I made a vow like to my husband at the time, of course. but more so to God. Like I didn't know divorce. My family didn't know divorce.

His parents didn't know divorce. I never in a million years did I ever think I'd have divorce as something I went through. And so when I made that promise and something bad happened, I was like, well, I said for better or worse, I made a vow to God. Like, I can't just dip, like, how do you just dip out on a vow? So I did take it seriously. And although I didn't pray going into it, like, am I supposed to marry this person? But when I did do it, I had enough understanding of God and covenant. And when you make a vow, you keep a vow.

Yeah. Well, because a vow is like a covenant, right? And what is a covenant? It's a contract. A lot of people don't realize that. I didn't know that a covenant was in contract until like probably 15 years ago. Maybe slightly a little bit longer. It's going on 20 years.

I did not realize that a covenant was actually a contract, biblically speaking, had no idea until the Lord said to me, I'm going to make a covenant with you. And that after I was like, well, what is a covenant? And I started researching it. And then I realized, holy mackerel, the Lord just said, I'm going to make a contract with you. And he told me exactly what was going to, what his contract with me was. and I've watched that contract unfold before my eyes. But, like, when you're making vows, like, you are contractually obligating yourself to that person and God.

And a lot of people eliminate the God factor. And that's one of the reasons why Tom doesn't just marry anybody. And there are pastors that will marry people left and right. and they do it because it pays. They get paid. Find a notary. I mean, a pastor should really, really be concerned about who he's putting together. Because when you join these two people together, you're joining them in a covenant with God and two people.

You better make sure. I mean, that's serious business. And I think people take it super lightly. And I think pastors take it very lightly. And as lightly as sometimes people go into it, which is because of the divorce rate is so high, I truly believe that a lot of people go into marriage very lightly. Otherwise, divorce rate wouldn't be so high. Correct.

Yeah, that's the fruit of that. Yep. And the divorce rate inside the church is just as high as outside the church. And it used to not be, but statistic show it's right there. I mean, it may be a few percentage points. It's marginal. It is so marginal, Vanessa, that I agree with you. It is, I mean, there's not enough digits to separate the difference.

There really isn't. It's pretty sad, actually. It is. It's very, very sad. We have common vows that, like, when I got married, probably when Vanessa, you got married. They started changing. When did you get married? 2008.

Okay. maybe what's happened is is a lot of people have gone away from the the common vows and like for better for worse for richer for poor sickness and health a lot of people are going have gone away from those and they started writing their own dangerous yeah dangerous because it becomes sappy love story like milk toast like you lose what the real value of what you're doing is true between the two parties when you remove. And do you know where those vows came from?

They actually came from, not specifically, well, they came from an epistle, but I think it was in Ephesians. But they were derived from that, and they were in like a prayer book, and I think it was a Protestant prayer book that they came from. So they weren't just made up willy-nilly.

They were actually made up, based on what Ephesians says, what a marriage should look like. And when we take the Bible out of things, again, we remove the importance of what we're doing and the contractual agreement. See, a lot of people, and I do, listen,

I take the marriage license very seriously. I think you, if the rule of law is you get a marriage license, then, and you had to file a, decree for divorce back in biblical times, then you probably need to focus on that and make that very, very important too. But without the vow, who needs a marriage license? So the vow should be even more weightier than the license. And I just don't think it is. I think, I mean, very people use marriage vows. I haven't gone to a wedding where we do. When Tom marries people, we use the marriage vows.

Have people asked to write their own? Yeah, but it's very, very rare. It's very rare that people have said, can we repeat our own? I don't, maybe one off here or two there, but when Tom does marry somebody, he uses the marriage vows, which I'm very, very grateful for.

I mean, how many, you guys have been to way more ratings than I have lately. Do you see the lighting vows or are they mostly? I can't remember. I know. I just came, like, this all just made sense to me recently, too, because I was, I don't know where I got into it,

but I was like, where did the vows come from? Like, who decided what the vows were? So I did this, my own study on it. And so I was like, oh, yeah. No, we definitely should say the vows. And it's from the book of common prayer. Common prayer. God bless you.

I could not remember it. Yeah. And I'm like, oh. And then I, like, oh. And then I, like, read it, and I'm like, oh, yeah. Was it Protestant? What was the book? Book of Common Prayer is from, is it Catholicism or is it from Protestant?

No, it's Protestant. Thank you. Yeah, the Common Book of Prayers. I thought it was Protestant because. I forget it, but it did say which thing. But it's from the epistles of the Ephesians. Right. Right.

For the epistles, yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. So when I was like, oh, yeah, like, these should be vows. because at first I thought they were like not personal. But I'm like, but why do they have to be personal? You know, like I started like working through what I've been taught my whole life. So I didn't actually realize that.

So when we did go to weddings, like I didn't have an opinion on it, except that I was like, oh, yeah, that's nice. They're personal. But I didn't think that seriously about it. And now I'm like, oh. So I've seen what people are doing now is that they are having their time at some point with their spouse where they do do like their own personal vows. but then at the actual wedding ceremony, they're saying the vow, vows, right. Yeah, people are, yeah, Chalia was telling us about that. Like, people are doing their little lovey-dovey.

Yeah, yeah, exactly. They're in the promise room. Oh, my gosh. Okay, really quick, really quick. Side note from Friday. Side note. Have you watched it? Of course.

Okay. What number are you on? Are you done? Are you done? newest. No, no, no, no, no, I haven't. What number episode are you on? I think whatever the first came out, whatever first one's the last one of that one. So maybe five. Okay. There's, there's only eight. Okay. And today is the day that six and seven come out. Oh, today? Today's the day. Okay. Trust me, I know. I'm embarrassed. But trust me, I know. What number are you on, Vanessa? Are you done? Either four or five. Four or five. Yeah. Yeah. Does Jeff love it? Secretly, I think he does. Jare's counting down the days until the next one comes.

Jair loves it. Loves it. Oh my gosh. I'm sure Jeff does, but he just won't admit it. Of course not. Chair's like, pride comes before the fall, Lips Moss. Jare's like, this is really weird because I would have been the old guy

because he thinks he's 20 in his head. And so he's like, I would be the old guy on the show. I'm like 100% you would be. Me too. It was so funny. Me too. I would be the old one too. I know.

So the first couple, I literally thought to myself, that could be me, maybe. I'm 58, though. How sick is that? Crazy. Because all the old dudes? Yeah. Nah. Nah, not happening.

Not that that guy's too much for me because he ain't. None of them were really good looking enough in my eyes. Like, I mean, hello, Tom. So you got to beat Tom. That's going to be a hard beat. But I'm just saying, none of them were good. good looking enough as far as even the younger ones to kind of like maybe go hello so talia doesn't know anything about the the show okay so don't say anything are you going to watch it it's a netflix

like love is blind yeah i'll watch it the age of attraction have you watched it okay clips don't do it justice so you don't know how old anybody is and you go in and date and then you find out in the promise room how old they are and they don't look like their ages So some people are way older And dating So like your mom dating Tommy But it's only revealed in the promise room Right

In the promise room where they share their love Which is when you made the commitment And you can back out But you're off the show Yeah Mm-hmm Yeah Yeah

Okay I'm just saying Age doesn't matter Right That's what they say That's what they say No some of the ages matter Oh

100% If I wasn't a Christian, I'd be in it for something else. Okay? But that's it. Because I wouldn't be in it for any serious relationship. I mean, one of them saying he's not. He's like the 60-year-old. Like, he's made it very clear that he's in it for other reason.

Okay. Pretty disgusting. Sorry about that. I do have a question, though. Sorry. Back to what we were talking. Yeah, because we are going back to. Let's go back.

Because I'm just trying to, now I'm trying to think of all the weddings I've gone to. You're saying the vows that they should say are what? Can you read them to me? I'm going to do it right now. Yes. Okay. Let's do it. Yeah.

The main things are the ones that I'm going to mention are the main, the most important things. I mean, vows say a lot of things, but the main crux of a vow starts with for better for worse, for richer, for poor, sickness and health. Because that's the commitment you're making. making to the person. A lot of times, what is that? Tell death to us apart. Which we're going to break down each one. Okay. That's serious.

It's serious. It is. And here's the problem. Most people never, like, you're talking to a very forward thinker. I'm always thinking, what does that look like a year? Five, ten. Yeah, each decision. Yep.

Like, like marrying somebody, I'm like, can I be with this person and can and I deal with their crap for the rest of my life. And nobody thinks like that. Nobody thinks because they're all about how I feel right now in this very moment. Yeah. And that's a very, that's a big, big, big, big mistake, big mistake, especially if you haven't dated the person for very long because you don't know them. So you're only basing your decision unless God's told you, which there is that caveat, and it does happen.

I mean, it does happen for people that have been together for less than a year. It does. Is it the norm? No. But it does happen. I've known people that it's happened to. And they're happily married, and they knew beyond a shadow of a doubt. God told them that that was the one less than a year.

And I'm like, well, if you know that, then you know beyond a shadow of a doubt, you heard the voice of the Lord both parties. I said get married now and don't wait. What's the point in waiting? Okay, but if you don't know, which is the case most of the time, and you start dating somebody and you marry them and you haven't dated them for a year, you're crazy. You're literally insane because you don't know that person and you're basing your life. Mm-hmm.

On earth forever. Yeah. Stuck to that. Right. that's a big deal all because of how you feel right now insanity in the moment i think a lot of especially worldly couples they go into marriage and their wedding with divorce as an option i agree if it if it doesn't pan out the way they think it's we're getting a divorce yeah agreed without hesitation because their parents are divorced right or or like that's just or like

normalized. It is. Their friends are divorced. I mean, it happens is what they'll say. It happens. He fell out of love. Which we're going to hit. But for better for worse.

And what people think that means is life will have its ups and downs. For better or for worse is not life will have its ups and downs. That's just not the truth. What it really means is, and I may have a list. Worse could mean financial. hardship, health problems, emotional seasons. Okay, people forget about there are emotional things that people, marriages go through from having, when you have children, through hormonal changes, to losing jobs, like,

are married to a workaholic. Like, you are going to go through potentially emotional situations and you've got to be able to withstand the test of time. If you have somebody who battles depression and you didn't, when you married them, I'm talking about majorly unsaved, but it does happen with the saved. If you marry somebody and they were strong

in their walks with God but then grew weak, you're going to have to stick it out. You don't get to leave. And that means they're walking through a time of depression. You're going to have to stand strong and help them get through that. And it doesn't matter. how emotionally you feel about the situation, you're in it to win it. That's how it is.

Disappointments in life or career. Okay, most people think that, well, let me just say this, most people think only of the better. And then they underestimate the worst. Yes. That's just the way it is. You better know. Like, you better think, like, if you are 25 years old and you're thinking about marrying somebody, you better think about 50 years, 60 years of being married to that person, what will that look like? And you better decide, is that the one that God has for me? A lot of people just refuse that. If God said yes, then you're going to be like 60 years is going to be sweet. That's my ride or die. Like, it's going to be, no matter what comes our way, we win every time. even when it looks like you're going to lose, you're going to still win.

And if you know that, if you know that's your person, the better for better for worse, both of them will feel the same way. The better will feel great, the worse, you'll feel great because you know you're going to get through it with that person by your side. You wouldn't want to do it with anybody else. Ladies, your opinion. So true. And it's at the end of the day, because people take. take Bible verses and then like twist them to like say like, but yeah, but he's not pushing me

towards God anymore and he's not, he's not, he's not, he's not, blah, blah, yeah. And it's just at that point, like most of the time when I deal with people like that, it ends up being like they've already checked out and there's really nothing to do at that point. So it's like if you don't take it that seriously before, like you have to like make a decision, like draw a line in the sand. Like for better or worse, until death do us part, period. Yep. Like it really has to be like a line you draw in the sand. Because if there is any of that, that little tiny bit of like, well, if he does this. Yeah. You'll look for it. The second you don't feel like you're feeling loved or like you said, like a season comes up. And one of the other things I heard is like at some point, like your parents are

going to die. They are. And are you going to be able to go through that process with this person? Like, like, is that who you want with you? Like you said, you're right or die. Is that like you have to really do have to think of these things. And some of them are. sad. When you get married, you are now, to each other, you are the primary family member. Right. Right. Yeah. Yes. Everybody else is secondary. Secondary. Secondary. Are you okay with that? Right. Are you, like, think, 30, 40, right. It's not me and Kylie anymore. You know what I mean? Like, it's now, like, you pass them on and now, like, you guys are going to make decisions together, like, all of them. Yeah. And yeah, it's, so is that what you want? Is that like, picture yourself 40 years from now. Are you still okay with that?

Right. I know. I love the forward thinking thing because if you do that, then you'll never look back and be like, oh, I've never even thought of that. Or even this, like picture the marriage you want. Picture it. Picture it. Imagine it. And then take the steps that it requires to get what you want. Right. Does that mean you have to like lay down your pride sometimes or your idiosyncrasies? That too. of people want to keep those. Yeah. And you can't a lot of times when you're married. Because your spouse doesn't like them.

Right. Or your future spouse won't like them. 20 years end, they're going to be like, okay, that's got to go. When you were like 18 or 25 or when I got married, 28, that was okay. But you know what? That's not going to work anymore. We're older now. Right. Like all of those things, because you've got to think, like everything you, are right now is not going to be able to be that way 20 years down the road you are going to radically

change if you want a peaceful marriage what does it require yeah it's so true it's laying down all all of it's it's surrendering it's submitting to one another and growing together yeah instead of you growing and you expecting the other person to grow and then somehow make it fit it doesn't it doesn't you have to grow together correct mm-hmm yeah the next one is for richer for poorer. What people think that means is we'll stay together, even if money is tight. But what it really means is you are pledging

that money will never determine the value of the marriage. Because you know what happens is a lot of times, Jared and I talk about this, is that all of a sudden, like, the wife and husband build this whole business and they had nothing. And then all of a sudden, they get money. And then all of a sudden,

they're not working this thing together. you know what I mean? And then all of a sudden, usually, it's typically the husband, all of a sudden wants to trade in the wife for somebody younger and less. I've seen it. And they built this whole thing together. And they trade that in for... Yep. It's us against the world. Right. And now it's like, I was pretty good. Yeah. It's easy now. And then the little young chicky-poo's come calling, because you know why? You got money. Yeah. And that's it. That's it. Then you trade it. For temporary.

Yeah. But on the other side of that. Yeah. So then, yeah. But money is one of the top stressors for most marriages. 100%. Statistics show that hold on, let me look, because I looked at this, 20 to 40% of divorces involved financial problems. 100%.

20 to 40%. That's high. Yep. So high. And it's not usually because of you have a lot of money. No. It's because you don't have any money. Right.

Or you're on a tight budget. and money will cause people to fight. Yeah, whenever Jeff has clients, married clients come in and they have separate accounts, he'll look at them and say, oh, you guys don't trust each other. And it's true. It's so true. And he said that to one client. And they got so offended, so offended.

And they were believers. They were Christians. So Jeff gave them scripture. And they went back home. They didn't say anything. And then Jeff got a call saying, you know, we want to sit down and meet with you again. And they came in and they were like, yeah, we were mad with what you said, but you're absolutely right. We went home.

We talked about it. And now we have a joint account. Way to go. Well, here's the, sometimes I agree with you. The reason why somebody doesn't trust somebody is because somebody spends and the other one doesn't. Yeah. Or they both spend. and they want to spend their money on what they want to spend their money on and you ain't

touching my money to spend it on what you want right yep which is not good uh that's selfish i mean and i mean seriously if you're saying i'm going to have a separate account because i spend too much and you spend too much or i spend too much and you don't spend any and you're going to have separate accounts it's selfish on both parties one is the party you're party that spends too much, you're not conscientious and respectful of the other person. Maybe they're a tightwad, though. I take that back. Because some people are so freaking tight with their money that you can barely, like, if you spend two cents, they're having a fit over it.

Right? So that's got its own problems because there's fear for them that they won't ever have enough. So they won't spend it because of fear. or being obsessed over finances, or the person that spends too much doesn't respect the other person and honoring what they have. And the person that won't share doesn't the value the person that they're holding their money back from.

Right. Both are selfish. Both are selfish, but for different reasons. Yeah. Even the tightwad. I can't stand cheap. It's one of the things me and Tom talked about before we got married. And then I saw how he tipped and I'm like, we're in great shape.

Yeah. We're in good shape. It's true. Watch how they tip. That'll tell you a lot about a person, how they tip. It tells you a lot about a person. It really does. It sure does.

And how they treat the people around them. Uh-huh. Even service workers. Specifically service workers. Absolutely. Service workers. You are a lot from people. Oh, yes.

Because how they do that will be how they treat you later on. you need a whole year. Absolutely. To observe. Dating is for discernment. You use your discernment during dating, okay? You don't use your discernment after you're married. You're married.

You're tied together. Now you're committed. You are absolutely committed. And a lot of times it's opposite. People commit during dating and then they want to discern later. Absolutely not. I'm sorry. That's a hundred with regrets.

And then like, and then they take out. What kills me is all of what that, what you just said. Yeah. And then they resent the person. Right. And I'm like, you agree to it. Nobody forced your hand. We're not doing this.

Yeah. Like, but then you resent them. Right. You said yes. Right. Oh my gosh. You played a part in it. You could have to rush into this.

You could have taken your time. Mm-hmm. Not too much time, okay? But you can take your time. Yeah. And discern. See how they handle conflicts. See how, what happens during emergency situations?

Like, how do they, when they get mad, what do they do? These are all the things that you need to observe. And then you, at the end of the day, are you okay with that? Yep. Are you okay being married to that? Yep.

And if you're not, then walk away. It's not going to magically change once you get married. It's going to, if anything, marriage amplifies. It does. And here's the thing, maybe they are the one for you. But maybe they need time to grow up.

True. So maybe you feel like they are the one, but maybe you need to like be strong enough. to say, you know, you are the one, but you need to walk through some stuff first, and then we come back around. If God says they're the one, they'll come back around.

100%. True. I know of what I speak. But you got to trust God in those things. Absolutely. In sickness and in health. This one is shocking. I was shocked when I found out the statistics on this one.

what people think it means is if one of us gets sick we'll take care of each other well that is not what it means guys means you're committing to love a version of your spouse that may not look like the person you married and a lot of people don't ever think about that yeah I know Tom did Tom literally thought because all that mattered to him and he was like if something happens to her like disfigurement or or whatever because he had no faith at the time. But all of those things, he thought about all that. He's like, can I do that?

Am I capable of that? You better be mature enough to be able to handle that. Yeah, 100%. Otherwise, don't get married. Yeah. Can I share a story with you? Yeah, please. So before Jeff and I decided to get married,

or we were engaged, he had a colorful past. So he decided with my help to get tested for, for everything. I got tested for everything before I got tested for everything before I got married. I did too. He got tested for everything and before the results came back I sat down and I was like if something were to come back because the likelihood was high. Right. Was I okay? Because we were engaged. Was I okay going and marrying him at that point? If let's say AIDS came back. Yeah.

if whatever came back. And I had to make a choice before I saw the results whether or not I was going to make that commitment. And I chose, yes, I was going to make that commitment. Why? Because the Lord had already told me that that was my husband. So I was not going to be disobedient. But I did.

I had to sit with it. And when the results came back and he was squeaky clean, I was like, thank you, Jesus. Yeah. Well, you know, Eric Gagnon has a fantastic story because Eric Gagnon was HIV positive. Yeah. And his wife, who is now his wife, they were either engaged, they were engaged or they were dating. And she did the same exact thing. She said, you're my person. I know God told me you're the one. So it doesn't matter your HIV positive. And then it was healed completely of it. He has no, I mean, his blood work comes about perfect. He has got no HIV in his body. Wow. That's incredible. I don't know that story. That's crazy. Yeah. So, but she knew it. It didn't matter to her. She was like, I'm. marry you. And they have two beautiful kids, healthy.

He's healthy as a horse. Like literally healed 100% of HIV. HIV positive. I know. So like I don't suggest people do that unless you know. But a lot of people, I don't suggest it because most people never ask God. Right. Like they never pray, which is insanity to me.

Like how do you choose your mate for the rest of you. your life without God approving of it. I just don't get it. Get this with the statistics show of this. This is crazy. If a woman gets sick, 20 to 21% of marriages end in divorce or separation. If the woman gets sick. If the man gets sick, two to three percent of marriages end in divorce. Just goes to show you who's really committed and who's not. I was shocked. by that. That is shocking. That's a huge difference. Huge difference. Like women are like nurturers, though.

We're devoted. Right. And I just... We're loyal. I know. And especially in those situations, like, immediately would, like, go to mother and, like, take care. Yeah. And men aren't always, like, nurturers. No, they're not. And it's too much work and it's selfish. It's too much for their mental capacity to handle. That too. Right. Mentally. Yeah. And to overcome. Yeah. And they're problem solvers by nature. Maybe this is a problem they can't solve. Right. So, yeah, that's true too.

Never thought about that. Yeah, for sure. Let me just tell you this. Sickness can bring physical, not if you're a believer, guys. Right. Okay, this does not apply for us who believe and have faith. So let me just preface it by saying this. But if you're not a person that believes like this and you're watching the podcast,

then you need to think about these things. Because you have to have the faith to know that no matter what comes your way, no, you know, Psalm 91. It'll hit your right, you'll hit your left, but it ain't going to hit you. That's the way it is. Sickness can bring physical change, emotional strain, caregiving roles, which I think is why men leave right there, which is what you were saying, the caregiving part.

Long seasons of sacrifice. That's the other one, why men, I think, leave. Absolutely. But as soon as the romance leaves for men, I'm gone. I think it is true for a lot of people because they live in their carnal. fleshly feelings versus commitment, contract, devotion. Right, right. Yeah.

Yep. Yep. To love and to cherish is another one. What people think that means is love each other deeply. It doesn't mean that at all. They actually mean two different things. Love and cherish mean two different things, and they're two different levels of commitment.

Love is choosing the good of the other person And it's not a feeling It's a commitment Two different things Love is a commitment It is not a feeling And Cherish is protecting their value and dignity Which I think we

Most of the time This is why women I think women I think women are more guilty of this Because we by nature talk Can talk way too much but I find like the cherished part of things women don't respect their spouse and they do talk down or talk poorly about their spouse and you can't cherish something if you are

speaking negatively about it. Like when you cherish something you hold that thing deeply. You respect it, you love it. you care for it, it's precious. True, very true. It's out of the ordinary. Yeah. Okay, it is not something common.

If it was common, then you would, some people might, but you'd just marry anybody. But this person should stand out above everybody else. Like, they should stand out above the rest. So they're not ordinary. They're out of the ordinary for you. That's why you choose them. Yeah.

And I think a lot of times people choose their mate, maybe because they are like everybody else, or you don't find or you don't know your worth, so maybe you're just happy somebody will even pick you. And so you don't cherish it because you're just glad you're picked. Because you never thought it would happen for you. I don't know. I don't understand how you can't cherish what you feel like you've been blessed with.

because if you find that person, if you find that mate, I mean, you should feel blessed that that came your way. Like, God gave you your person. I don't know. I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong. But go ahead. What do you think?

What do you say, Norma? Norma says she doesn't think I'm wrong at all. I have a unique perspective on this only because I went through a divorce. Yeah. And I didn't have a say in the divorce. Like, it was served to me. And there was infidelity on my ex. this part. So I, like, I was just put in a situation where I had to just end the marriage. And there

was nothing I could do or say about it. And it's a very weird spot to be. Yeah. When one day you you have marital control where you're like, you know, but you're my husband and I'm your wife and you have to make these decisions together. And one day they're like, I don't want to anymore. And you're like, what do you mean? No. Like, it's the weirdest feeling when you go five years and, because we were only married for five years. And have kids. And have kids. Yeah. And they're just like, you can't convince them to do it. To change. their mind. Anything. Nothing. That's crazy. Yeah, it's the weirdest thing ever. So when you've experienced that and then you get remarried,

and Jared also had been through a divorce. So when we, like, we do cherish each other. And it's, and it's because, like, partially because we know what it's like to lose something that you didn't think you would ever lose. And although it's the best thing that ever happened to us, it's, we still have that perspective of like, we probably didn't cherish our marriage before the way that we do now, because we know what it feels like to lose something. Oh, yeah. I feel, I don't, okay, I feel like that about my walk with God. Yes.

To be honest with you. That makes so much sense. Because when I was saved, then walked away and then got my eye. When you, it totally changes your perspective when you come back to the Lord and you lost. Yeah. Because you made the decision to lose it. Yeah. But like it literally mentally changes your perspective on everything.

True. Like the value that you have for it is way more. Yeah, exactly. Because you know what it's like without it and you're like, holy crap, that's pretty rough. I ain't doing that again. It's crazy. Exactly. So I kind of know what you're saying.

That's exactly what it is. And like I knew I was supposed to be a wife. Like it felt like something was taken from me. Like even that like identity. Yeah. I didn't feel less than, but I knew it was for me. Like I knew I was supposed to be a wife. So I'm like, how does he just get to decide?

I can't be a white. Like it was the weird. It's just the weirdest thing when you never ever, like, expected it. And then, yeah, so then you value it differently when you know it, like, Jared could one day be like, you know what? Not really. But he could be one day, be like, I don't want to be married anymore because it happened before. Like, it's not too far past anything. And so you just, I don't know, you just cherish it different.

You don't feel like. It's crazy. Yeah. I know. I know. Do you know that what they call that is lack of connection, love and cherish? when people stop loving and cherishing one another, it causes a lack of connection. I believe that.

And do you know that the statistics are higher for this than they are for the other stuff as far as divorce rate goes? I totally believe it. It's nuts. It's 40 to 50%. I totally believe it because that's where you see where the breakdown is. I see that. I see people break down and you hear them talking. If you hear them talking bad about somebody, eventually you resent them.

Yes. And you have no respect for them. them. Yes. Which is the cherish part. Yes. Yes. Which means the love part no longer exists because the love part's the commitment. Right. Yeah. There's no patience. Love is patient, kind, gentle. Like, none of those things can exist when you are, like, there's resentment. Yeah, absolutely. When you don't cherish somebody, you start to resent them. Yep. Yep. Because love is the commitment. It's an action. Yep. Yep. Yep. And cherish is honoring something. Yes. Yeah. Or they respect. heart love. And once you lose that, but that makes sense why it has a higher divorce rate,

then there's forsaking all others, which is adultery. This one's by far the biggest reason of divorce, which was shocking. Adultery is? Yeah. Because one, it's either, let me see, three out of one or two out of one divorces. The statistics are slightly different. Some say it's three out of one and then some statistics show it's two out of one. Divorces are caused by some form of infidelity. I don't know if that means like an emotional affair. Okay.

Pornography. Okay. or adultery, the full-blown. But that's how high the statistics are. Three out of one to two out of one. That's nuts. That's crazy. That's crazy.

What people think it means is don't cheat. But what it really means is marriage creates a new form of loyalty. And a lot of times people do not walk into marriage with loyalty on their mind. They don't. you're promising to be loyal to this person thick and thin nobody else and that's where like parents getting involved when you're marrying somebody who's still emotionally connected to their parents loyalty is going to be torn yeah you cannot do that like the marriage that we're coming to like we're going to uh this Friday both of them are old not older but they're in their 20s and

both of them still live with their parents, or one of them doesn't anymore, but just moved out because they bought a house. But I would say definitively, I know one of them is definitely not connected. I mean, they're not connected to the parent. Do you know what I'm saying? They may still live at home.

What my point is is they still live at home, but that doesn't mean that they are emotionally, like, connected to the parent. Does that make sense? Whereas there are some people that don't live, live at home, they have their own place, but mommy or daddy or both still run their life. When you get married, that ends. The Bible is very clear about that.

Very clear. The umbilical cord is cut. There are no nuances in that. None. Leave mother and father and become one. Yes. I know. Very clear.

You cannot have all boundaries, all that, that goes. Those boundaries, and that's with friends. Yeah. That's with family. That's it, right? Friends and family? Friends and family, yeah. Yeah, parents, yeah, you're...

Those, yeah, they have, you have to have boundaries for all of that. Right, because that's how emotional affairs... Well, that's exactly what I was thinking when you said that. Yeah, the boundaries aren't there. Yeah, when you said, you know, one out of three, one out of two, like, I was like, yeah, because it makes sense because when there is not cherish and there's not love, then you're looking for it somewhere because we need it. Exactly.

So if you're not getting it from God, you're. guess where you're going to get it from the random employee that comes and says the right thing to you because the enemy knows he wants to destroy marriage so it's so easy you just send the right person in they say the right thing and then there are women who like successful married men and cops yep hey listen listen that right there yes it's a den of thieves and a sheriff's police department or whatever it is it's a den of thieves and i don't mean to thieves as in wealth. They do. They still each other's spouses.

But it is a den of iniquity, really, I should say. It is. Like for drinking to the parties and the drinking and the infidelity. And some of them aren't married, but they're still messing with married people. They're messing, two single people messing with each other. It's not. it's true not good it is not good yeah true so I think with the loyalty thing like maybe people go into it like oh yeah I love this person I'd be loyal but then there's no boundaries put up and so they are bringing like old friends

in or like it just there's no boundary they don't even think to do boundaries and so yeah if you don't have boundaries and a marriage that you both agreed upon it's not going to work it's not going to work because the enemy wants to destroy it. 100%. Yes. True. Jeffrey tells me all the time, whenever he gets complimented,

like, oh, you look really good in your suit. He'll go, thank you. My wife picked it out. Always deflecting. Always. To make it known. I'm very much happy. Yeah.

And even to a man's mind. Yeah. Like there's even no place. Like it literally just bounces off, like a reminder all the time. Like, I don't know. It's good to be safe. Yes. It really is. I mean, I mean, that, I don't know how people get married without the vows.

I really don't. 60% of marriages end in divorce because of adultery. 60%. That's staggering to me. Do you want to hear a fun fact? Yeah. I, Jeff and I set our own vows. Personal vows.

Oh, my gosh. I believe it. I probably did too. I don't want to. number. We wrote our own. Yeah. But you didn't do both? No. I think we might have done both. I think I did. I think we full on did our own. Was it like he'll take the trash out for me and you'll be blacked out. I just want to throw up on I hear people say stupid crap like that. Like I vow to take the trash out for you every night. Oh my gosh. I just, I just want to throw

up. Follomely vowed to cut down the pepper tree every spring. I know, I know, I know. I know. And you wanted to stick by them. I have a headache. It's true. It makes me want to vomit. It's true.

So ridiculous. That's when you don't take marriage seriously. When you're saying crap like that. When you're getting married, sorry Tracy if you said that. I did not. Thank you, Jesus. I take the trash out. I don't know what I said.

I blacked out. So. I think we just did our house. But in my heart. I knew what I was. I did these, though. Saying I do too. I did my, I did extra in mine.

Did you? Which, yeah, and people gasped. Like, literally. Was it inappropriate then? Mm-mm. No, but it's what people don't add in anymore, which we'll get to. But till death do us part, let's do this one. And then we're going to get to the next one.

Okay. What till death's do as part, most people think, we'll stay together forever. And forever isn't, they don't think until I die. Okay. They're just like forever. Like, they don't realize what forever really is. But that is, like, you have made a lifelong covenant with somebody until they ain't breathing or you're not breathing. That's serious business, guys.

I'm so committed that it's not until death for me. Because you're going to be married to heaven. That's how I feel like. Tom and I will be in a mansion together. Oh, yeah. There is nobody else I want to live with in my house. No, me either. Right.

It ain't happening. Yeah. It's 75% of divorces cite lack of commitment. We just grew apart. I love that one. It makes my skin crawl. But it should be no matter what we're sticking together.

And Jesus made it abundantly clear in Matthew 196, since we are no longer two, but one, let no one split apart what God has joined together. Pastors need to pay attention to that part. what God has joined together. Remember, when you marry somebody, you're putting God in the center of that and make sure that they both know him,

serve him, and he's Lord of their life. And God has told them to get married. Otherwise, don't marry him. Yeah. And for me, what has been eliminated, and I put it in our vows, I put it in when Tom Marries people, I put it in.

They have to say that. Women do specifically, love, honor, and obey. So love and cherish is usually what the man said, and the woman would go love, honor, and obey. And I literally said love, honor, and obey in my vows. And the pastor took it out, and my mom made sure that he got put back in. Oh, wow.

Wow. Yep. Because, and when I said obey, people were like, because, first of all, I was saying obey. The room was packed. True. But the thing is is Ephesians is very clear about a husband and a wife's role. And we are to submit. But here's the thing.

We're to submit to one another. Correct. There is a difference. But we as women should cherish that we get to obey this priest of our home and that he will give up his life for us. We got the easy part. They got the hard part. And people remove that all the time. Love, honor, and obey.

Like there is something important when you're standing before that man and you're telling him, this is my vow to you. And you're basically giving all of you to them. And then you need to stand, like literally, after you say that, you need to do it. Right. Can't be just words. And what happens is a lot of times people think that their marriage vows are just like words on a page. No, they're actually a contract.

You have committed yourself to these vows, to this contract, to this covenant, to this person. And when you say, I do, you are now bound by the I do. There's no going back. None whatsoever. You should embrace it and love every minute of it if you pick the right person. If you choose wisely, you will. If you don't, you'll regret this decision for the rest of your life. There's no two ways about it.

Go ahead, girls. Want to say anything? I'm going to tell you this. I wanted to know why the word obey was removed because we removed it. Do you know that it says in the 1960s through the 1980s, it started around that time. So beginning, doesn't that make sense, though? Because like free love in the 60s, but liberation of women. So it started in the 1960s through the 1980s.

and many churches and couples began removing it. The church did. Wow. Not just the couples. And they did it for several reasons. One, cultural shifts about authority because people started to view obey as outdated, unequal, and implying control. Number two, misunderstanding of biblical submission.

It is misunderstood as domination, loss of voice, or inferior. And then number three, couples started. writing their own vows, vows, v-O-W-S, not vowels, vows. Vowels. Many couples replaced traditional vows with, oh my gosh, emotional promises. I hate this one right here.

I hate the emotional promises, but storytelling. I hate vows with storytelling. Can't stand it. Or what? I said, I'm going to do that on purpose. Oh, my gosh. I'm going to tell a story about you.

Or romantic, language. Again, vomatosis, aliosis. Like a poem? No, like with, yeah, like, like a lot of fluffy, empty sugar plum. Yes, words. Pumpkin pie. Just so full of crap when they're talking. It's just full of fluff. Like a whole lot of things that they think the person wants to hear, but they actually are only saying that. It's like what we see on Facebook. Don't bring up Facebook. That's the romantic language I'm thinking of.

Exactly. I'm going to throw up. It's as bad as watching somebody get their feet washed. I literally saw something yesterday where I was like, that's so fake. I know and you know it. It's so bad. It's like you know everyone knows it's fake. But they don't care.

I know. I know. Because they are just like the language, like what they said is probably true. But it's like I know you don't speak like that. Yeah. let alone half the time some of these people don't feel like that. True. Most.

If you have to put that out, if you have to put that out, that means your actions don't follow your words. See, for me, I am not saying this because it's me. That's not what I'm saying. But what I am saying is I don't do that every now and then. And it's never really Tom and it's my kids for like birthday or something. And that's even every now and then. But I'm not going to put that stuff out about Tom. And the reason is, is because my actions should be more profound than the words that I say.

If your words don't follow your actions, you're full of crap. Let your actions speak volumes versus this. It means nothing. And most people, their actions defa what the words are said that they say. Just perform. Just perform like you love one another. that would be great. And then nobody needs to see you post a daggum thing.

True that. Because I'll be honest with you. Yeah. I'll be honest with you. I don't really give a flying flip how you feel about your spouse or your girlfriend. I really don't care. Like, why do you think all of us care about how you feel about your spouse? Say that in the bedroom.

Like, literally, to me, it's like PDA. Save that for when you're together. We don't care. We don't need to see it. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, why do I care? How you love your wife or your husband so much because of this, this and this? Like, what makes you honestly believe the rest of us want to know that?

We don't. I don't care about that. Hope, what if I want to share my undying love for you? Can I do that? Yeah, today after the podcast. I'm going to. I'm going to post on Facebook. No.

No. On Facebook. No, no, on Facebook. You can do it straight to my face. The reason people do that, though, the reason people post those things, though, a lot of times is they want people to think more about them than they actually want about the person they're talking about. And that's the God's honest truth. That's the truth.

They want people to think, I'm such a great husband. I'm such a great wife. Look at what I, how I value this person. It's more about them that really is about the person they're talking about. in my opinion. They want people to want what they have. Yeah, which is a lot of times crap. Yep.

Just, just let your actions follow. Don't, like, you don't need to say anything. Just let your actions speak volumes. Traditional vows focus on the covenant, the commitment, and the responsibility. And if you choose to make up your own vows, go for it. But you devalue things because modern vows. often focus more on feelings, companionship, and personal fulfillment. Yep.

That's dangerous. That is true. Ephesians 521 says, submit to one another out of the reverence for Christ. So whether you're going to say the vows, whether you say the traditional vows or not, or you make up your, at the end of the day, it doesn't change a dagum thing. You are committed, you're in a covenant, and you're contractually obligated to the other. the person. So you better know what you're getting into. And a lot of people don't even know what the traditional vowels mean anymore because they're not even talked about in church. Right. Right. True.

Yeah. True. It's just very, very dangerous. So I think I'm done. All right. So I think I'm going to have to do a vow renewal. Oh my gosh. Can we go on the beach? Yes. I'll go Facebook live. Yes. Yes. I want to be on Facebook live. Oh my word. And why would that be? Because I made up my own vows. Now I need to do it the right way. She did it wrong.

It's not even a real marriage. Yeah. Personal vows privately. Yeah, yeah. That's the newest trends. That's what's happening right now. 100%. I didn't do that.

So I need to do it again. For me, like why do you have to say all of that? You should have been saying that the whole entire time you were dating. Hope, listen, remember how you're just a special lady? Some of these things won't make sense to you. Some of these things are just not a hope thing. You're a traditionalist. I wrote a lovely letter to Tom.

You're just reading the letter to him. Yeah. Why do you? Because Hope, some people like this stuff. Like, it makes them so happy. Their love language is words of affirmation. I wrote a letter. And I gave a gift.

And they wanted to see their expression. I don't need that. And share their feelings and hold hands and look deeply into their eyes. That makes me sick. It's all a farce. It's all. It's all fake. It's a farce.

Yeah. It's the posture of your heart. For sure. 100%. No one's filming it. It's just for that. Okay. Just don't let Hope ever see this.

No. I don't want to see it. I just, I literally cannot tolerate it. I'm like, come on. I know, I know.

Because so much is, it's so. I know. You're not wrong. A lot of the times people aren't doing it for the right purpose. So they spoil the good ones. It's like one bad apple, you know?

You know that you know they're doing it for. It's performative. It is. It's all, and I cannot stand that. I know. And you know it is because you know the behind the scene. So then you're like,

is anybody even doing this? It's a lot of hooey. I know. And I can't stand the hooey. I know. I know. I get it. I do get it.

And it wrecks it. Right. Right. That's all I got to say. So if there's any brides watching. Yeah. Just hope what's your traditional vows. Traditional vows.

Do your traditional vows. Because we will be judging. You'll be a rarity. We will be looking and listening. Unless Tom marries you. Yeah. Then you're good. Then it's probably not going to be a rarity.

Is he marrying Josh and Kaley? Mm-mm. Okay. So. I don't know who is. I'm sure it's somebody great. Probably somebody that's a family. family friend or so there's a chance there's a chance that there's going to be personal vows oh my gosh

if they start doing personal vows everybody's going to look at us everybody's going to look at me i'm going to literally turn red i'm going to start recording i'm going to be like hope don't stop the wedding hope don't sit next to me you know how they ask for like whoever is against this wedding yes you know what we'll do if they two traditional vows we're all going to go like this yes my well I'll take a selfie. No, it's the middle finger. Oh, because they ate it. They ate it up.

Left no crumbs. They ate. They ate. They ate it. That's right. If they do, if they do their own vows, then we're just going to be like, I'm going to literally be sweating. Whatev's.

You're going to be that person that stands up when. Oh, yeah. I object. Yeah, you're going to. I object. Try again. Try again. And you're going to like walk up there and take over.

Tell the, tell the person to sit down. repeat after me. Kaylee, if you did not say... Should I text Josh? Should I warn him? That's true. Chat GPT did. Okay, people, we're not going to see you to Wednesday of next week.

I'll miss you guys. We will. We'll be together. I know. We won't miss us. You won't be with us, maybe. But we'll miss you. Yeah, but we will miss you.

So that's it. We'll see you next Wednesday, unless we see you at church on Sunday. Yeah. Which hopefully we will. Bye.