The Hope Hotline - Wise > Smart

Episode Date: April 10, 2026

The Hope Hotline | S04-E20 | 04-10-2026Subscribe to my podcast: https://rss.com/podcasts/thehopehotline/

Hello and welcome to the Hope Potline. Thank you for joining us this gorgeous Friday. The weather has been amazing. I don't know why I talk about the weather other than. It's super important to me, but. It is super important. Well, we had a tough winter. It was a lot of cold, so it's pretty beautiful.

I know you do, but. I enjoyed that winter. Okay. I got to use my fireplace. I used so much wood. It was unbelievable. I know. I know.

Awesome. Yeah. Okay. Loved it. All right. obviously does anybody know why we have

so much wind right now there was like a front hanging out over us is that why it was just stuck yeah is it still stuck it's on its way out so I think we're done crud I felt like Hawaii for a short period of time or Aruba have you ever been to Aruba I've never been to Hawaii or Aruba

I just heard it's windy 24 7 for like nine months straight what I'm kidding you what month did you go August or like July or. And it was windy. I went in January. I don't remember it being windy.

I think December and January are the only two months that are not windy. But all the other months are. Is it hot windy? It is. And if you're sitting on the beach, it's like the sand is like, oh. Oh, that's hitting her face. See, I hate. I'm not a fan of Aruba.

Good to know. I know. I wasn't either, actually. After, after, what's the girl's name, Holloway? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Aruba was ruined for me. Mm-hmm.

I can't think of it without thinking of her, and that makes me sad. Not that I'm afraid to go, because ain't nothing yet. Nothing's going to happen to me, but I felt bad. Yeah, that was pretty terrible. That was terrible. I don't like it. Not good. Not good.

That guy, is he still alive that killed her? I think he's dead. No, I think he's in jail. He is in jail. He killed somebody else after that. No, he didn't. Yes, he did. He killed another girl.

That's how they found that he. Oh, wow. This is kind of coming back to me now. He had to admit, or he ended up admitting to killing Natalie in jail. Okay. Okay. This is kind of coming back. Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yes, he killed another girl in Italy or somewhere. Yeah. In Spain or something. Yeah. Somewhere in Europe.

Yep. Because he was European. I think he was like from the Netherlands or something. Yes. Okay. Yes. He was something like that, like Holland or. I don't know why.

Yeah. He was, his dad is some big cahoonahuna, somewhere. Oh, no way. Oh, yeah, yes. Like some judge or something. That is crazy. That is crazy.

So he almost got away with it. Almost. But as the Lord says, whatever is hidden in the dark will be brought to the light. I was thinking. Uh-huh. I just, I was thinking. Mm-hmm. Watch it.

Yeah. Watch yourself. Mm-hmm. If you did something and you don't think anybody's going to find out about it, they will. Think again. Think again. It's going to happen. It's just like that woman out there that's somewhere in the Bahamas that the husband said,

she fell overboard. You know that one right now, right? Oh, yeah. Super sad. Yeah. He's in jail. I mean, he's now arrested. Actually, there's a small group of moms, like stay-at-home moms.

They now, like every month or however long they choose to do this, but they take one cold case. and they've actually been able to solve like crimes. And it's just these moms that do it out of like just pure boredom. And yeah. And they've been able to like solve cold cases. And once they solve them, they go on to the next case. Do the people get out of jail? I don't know.

I didn't look into it. Wow. And I don't know how true it is. I saw that on. Well, what's so funny. is we are such a monitored country or world now.

Like the boat, the stuff on the boat that the guy didn't even think, I guess he doesn't know what his yacht has on it. Proved, he wasn't even on the boat with her when he said that he was paddling. So, hello. I know. There's cameras everywhere.

There's Life 360. I know. There's all these things. Even the ring cameras. Ring cameras. We'll get like notifications that the police officers are asking for rings in certain areas if you want to give it to them. And I'm sure they can grab it if I wanted. Back in the day, it was the Wild Wild West. Nobody knew or any.

Oh my gosh. Back in the day, I could have killed somebody and gotten away with it now. I don't know how my mom raised children back then. That's so scary. Like sending us off to school. Because back then people were not as crazy and perverted. I mean, back in my day, I'm way older than you guys. I'm going to say millennials.

I lived in New York City in the 90s. 80s, 90s, 2000s. Yeah, it was way different. That's way different world. Back in my day. I was in the 70s going to school. You guys were normal. Elementary school.

High school was 80s, mid-80s. I'm an 80s high schooler. I'm the ones that you see in the pictures, the big hair. I love it. Yes. Yeah. That was, huh? You had the hair spray and the teasing.

Oh, my gosh. So much hair spray. It was great. It was great. Blue eye shadow. Oh, blue eyeliner. I have a, or I had actually, even worse. I had blue mascara and I wore it every day.

Yes. Every day. Yes. I did too. I used to do it. Every day, me and my girlfriend, we both had blue eyes and we wear blue mascara along with like a pink. Yeah. It was awesome.

Let's bring it back. I did the brown lip liner. Oh, same here. With the pink lipstick. Same here, girl. I had no lips. At least you had lips. Yeah, I had no lips.

Oh, my gosh. It was the thing. It's like what you did. I was working. You were in high school. I was working in a war like that. That's crazy. No, I was in high school.

Yeah, yeah. Not me. I was going to the clubs. You're in the club. In your business casual pants. Or my sweatshirt and jeans. Really? Just depends.

Oh, yes. And the thing is, is I will tell you this. I would go and dress up. You know, if you go, certain clubs you go and you have a certain attire, right? And then you go to a different club and you wear sweatshirt and jeans. And I would be mess with more in the sweatshirt and jeans than I would if you dressed up. Yeah, that makes sense. That's interesting.

I literally, like. It's true because I could look homeless. okay, at home. And Jeff is like, you know? Let's, you know. And I look, I have like food stains on my shirt. I know. They don't care.

It doesn't take much. But I'm just saying, like. But you would think if you're like in your nice attire. Right. I know. But I think when you're dressed down, they think you're easy or something. Even though I would be in a sweatshirt and jeans, I was covered from head to tell. Not that I ever went to the club.

And I never was a person that picked people. people up and went home with it. I didn't do that. That's not. First of all, like I've said before, my girlfriends, like we watched out for each other. So there was none of that if you wanted to do. If you did, you probably weren't going to stay in the group very long. Right. Natalie in Aruba needed more friends like that. Like you don't let your friends, especially we were all drinking. So, and there was usually one person that was the more stable of the bunch. Not much more, but at least a little bit.

A little bit, yeah. We had to get home. Right, of course. But you're like, what do you think and letting your friends go off with somebody? Like, even back in my day, when really, nothing really happened if you did. But, yeah. What are you thinking? No, absolutely not.

Mm-mm. No way. No way. That doesn't sound smart at all. No. It still happens today, though. People are going, are you laughing at me because you did it. Because no, because our conversation today.

Oh. I was seeing if you caught on. Oh, because of being. smart. I bet you're not smart. Not smart. Not smart. Not smart.

When I grew up, we're going to talk about being intelligent, using your, being smart versus having wisdom today. And when I grew up and I would tell my, talk to my kids, I wouldn't, you know,

everybody is like, they'll say stuff like, that's so stupid. Why did you do that? And, but I had somebody when my kids were like, um, Tommy was probably,

third grade, Norman was first grade or something like that. I had somebody who told me something really smart. They obviously, you know, they were Christian and their family was a hot, freaking mess.

But you can, you can, you can, there's kernels of, of, uh, well, there's a wealth of knowledge even in idiots, right? So,

or people are a hot mess. This person said something, to me and I thought that you are a hot freaking mess but that is actually really really smart what you just said and what they said was is you know the Lord looks at our heart and that's how we raise our children we raise our children with everything of being about about their heart and so from self-esteem to correction and not that I live by this all the time because I was an idiot truth be told um but

One of the things they would say, the things that they said is words do matter because they plant seeds, right? And it's absolutely true. So one of the things that they said is, and they weren't correcting me, they were just in general talking about a book that they read. And they bought it for me. And they were like, this really is a fantastic book. And I didn't read the whole thing. But one of the things it said is instead of saying something is stupid, which I would say, we use, we used. the word stupid in our house. I mean, listen to Tom from the platform. I mean, he says pretty much

whatever. But no cussing, nothing like that. We didn't call each other names. But which she said is instead of saying something along the lines, was that smart? Was that a good idea? Was that that was a stupid thing to do or something like that? She always would say, and she even did this with her kids and I was like, and her kids were older. And they were terrible, but well, To your face, they were really good, but behind the scenes, some of the things that they were doing were perverted and completely. It was a hidden secret until it all came out. And so, but one of the things she said is she would always say to her kids, was that a wise decision to make? Or using the word wisdom with a lot of things because really that's how we're supposed to walk in wisdom.

And I started saying that myself to my. kids I was like that's a I'm stealing that good things we should steal I always think like for me and I think you guys would say the same is I think the best compliment you can give to anybody is when you duplicate something they do absolutely if you like something that somebody does and you copy it well don't be offended that they copied it actually be like like yeah yeah I'm doing something right somebody saw something good they're copying when I did And you shouldn't, you should be flattered by that instead of bothered by that. And so I started, I would always say to the kids, I would be like, was that a wise decision?

Were you using wisdom when you did that? And so it really, a lot of people want their kids to be so smart. We're very competitive, right? My daughter was homecoming queen. So it's based on looks. It's based on athleticism. And then there's, it's based on intelligence. none of those things did you do to get.

All of it is a natural God-given talent or skill. But wisdom is one of those things. If you're intelligent, you didn't do anything to earn that. So you might not be prideful in that. But wisdom is one of the things that you have to ask for. Not everybody is wise. Not everybody can be wise. Because you can be, but that's something you have to earn.

You have to work for. It's like intelligence is a lot of times high IQ. You can't make yourself have high IQ. I mean, you can try and learn and learn and learn and learn. But it's one of those things that you're given. But wisdom everybody can have. Yeah. Everybody can have.

It's not like looks. A lot of people, as hard as they try, unless they get plastic surgery. And even then. And even then. Yeah. It's not going to happen for them. Right. Okay?

Like, it is what it is. It is what it is. And you may want to be, you may want to be the greatest baseball player there is out there. But you're knee-knocked. And it's never going to happen for it. Knee knocked. That's so specific.

It's never going to happen. So, like, what are you going to do? Nothing. Nothing. Nothing. But wisdom. But wisdom. That's given to anyone who asks.

What is that? I said, that's given to anyone. anybody who asks. That's good stuff. It's great. Like you can, like wisdom is key. When I thought about talking about this, I thought of Jeff, Vanessa's husband. Because one of the things that your husband does every single day is he reads a proverb every single day.

So he's, it's supposed it because he wants to be wise. And there's something to be. A lot of people will read it, but they won't comprehend it or apply it. Apply it. Thank you. You can't just read it. It's not, if it's just words on a page, then that's how you, it will exist in your life. True.

True. But if you can sexually understand it, adhere it, apply it, and live it, wisdom will radically change. Because it's like, wisdom and discernment are like, they're key. They're huge. 100%. They're huge in how they can

math like it's how it can master things for you. Mm-hmm. Yeah. It's just, it's amazing to me. Like for me, one of the greatest, I'm going to go straight to it.

We'll do sponsors at the very end, but if we have time. But one of my favorite Bible story because here's the thing. You can have knowledge and you can have knowledge being smart. You can have, like, you can read a room that's not always discernment. Like, I'm not the greatest of discerning people, but I can read people really good for the most part.

But that's just because of dealing with people for so long, that people by nature are certain personalities. like that test you can take that these are five different personalities people are always going to line up to that to a certain extent and you can use that skill but that's a skill that's not really discerning which i think discerning is more spiritual than anything else um but you can have those things and you can still miss it big time yes for sure but when you have wisdom it's almost like you can't miss it because God is going to, God is in the midst of the wisdom. He kind of like just dictates it and shows you. And there are certain times, because I do pray for wisdom,

there have been certain times that I've looked at something, and I've wondered, how in the world did I know that? Yeah. How did I know that? And I knew it was the Holy Spirit. There was no other way. The word is very clear that Jesus is the one with that skill that he can give you. But we'll get to that scripture.

And then you guys can. can add your two cents because I really want to hear what you have to say because you guys have been talking about this, which was shocking to me when I told him, this is what we're going to talk about today. And they were like, we have been talking about that. So I'd love to hear your two cents. But my favorite story, and we're going to read it really quick because it's only like 12 verses. It really reveals the difference between being a smart person and having a great intelligence level versus having wisdom. Some people know this story. And then there's other people who don't know this story.

But when I read the story when I was younger, when I was way younger, I realized, I'm like, how, that was the smartest thing ever? How did he know to do that? And it's Solomon. Solomon is the wisest man. And the reason he was wise is because when the Lord offered him, Solomon, just if you don't know,

Solomon was David's son, whom he had with Bashiba. and so something made out of bad was used for goods. That is just how great God is. So when the Lord offered Solomon, you can have anything you want. Instead of having wealth, long life, all these different things, he said, make me wise, which made him have all those things. Not a dummy. First Kings 316 through 20 says, says Solomon judges wisely.

Do you guys love the story or what? Love it. Yes. It's actually been in sitcoms. It was actually in the sitcom Seinfeld. Mm. Mm-hmm. Okay.

The sitcom Seinfeld used this exact storyline. Smart. For something different between Kramer. Huh? That was very wise of them. It was. Some people went right over their head and others like me. I was like, that's pretty great that you did not.

It was between Kramer and the, a lane and a bike. Okay. And Newman, who was the judge. But if you ever want to go and look at it. But sometime later, two prostitutes came to the king to have an argument settled. Please, my Lord, and this is what they're saying to Solomon. Please, my Lord, one of them began.

This woman and I live in the same house. I gave birth to a baby while she was with me in the house. And three days later, this woman also had a baby. We were alone. There were only two of us in the house. But her baby died during the night when she rolled over on it. And then she got up in the night and took my son from my, from beside me while I was asleep. And she laid her dead child in my arms and took mine to sleep beside her.

And in the morning, when I tried to nurse my son, he was dead. But when I looked more closely in the morning light, I saw that it wasn't my son at all. And then the other woman interrupted, it certainly was your son and the living child is mine. No, the first woman said, the living child is mine and dead, and the dead one is yours. And so they argued back and forth before the king. And then the king said, let's get the facts straight. Both of you claim the living child is yours and each says that the dead one belongs to the other. All right, bring me a sword.

So a sword was brought to the king. And then he said, cut the living child into and give half to one woman and half to the other. And then the woman who was the real mother of the living child and who loved him very much, cried out, oh no, my lord, give her the child. Please do not kill him. But the other woman said, all right, he will be neither yours nor mine. divide him between us. And then the king said,

do not kill the child, but give him to the woman who wants him to live. For she is his mother. And when all Israel heard the king's decision, the people were in awe of the king, for they saw the wisdom God had given him for rendering justice.

When you have wisdom, you can look at a situation and you can look at it in a whole different way to figure out how to resolve or how to walk through or how to deal with something. Whether it's yours or somebody else's.

And that's exactly what Solomon did. He looked at a situation that really wasn't going to affect him, but needed to be, he was the judge. So he needed to have the wisdom to be able to give the correct ruling of what was being asked. And a lot of times we are missing that in the judicial system. Yeah. Big time. But we are missing it in our own lives when we're dealing with our children,

when we're dealing with our spouse, when we're dealing with friends or just life in general. When wisdom would help us so much. Yeah. Ladies. I was just reading while you were speaking about Solomon

1st Chronicles 28 and it's David. David's about to pass and he's talking to Solomon. And he's telling Solomon. And Solomon, my son, learn to know the God of your ancestors intimately. Worship and serve him with your whole heart and a willing mind. For the Lord sees every heart and knows every plan and thought. If you seek him, you will find him. But if you forsake him, he will reject you forever.

So take this seriously. The Lord has chosen you to build a temple as his sanctuary. Be strong and do the work. And I wonder if that influenced him to ask. the Lord for wisdom. That's interesting. I've read how he, how David set him up

before he passed. Yeah. And it was like, yeah. That was great advice. Mm-hmm. That was powerful. Yeah.

So, and that soon after the, he had a dream and the Lord, you know, was like, what do you want? Right. He's like, give me wisdom. I like it.

In this life, really, like, life is a series of decisions. It, yeah, yep. And if you don't make the right ones, they can turn your world upside down. Correct. A simple conversation can go one way or whole other way.

And probably is very clear about shutting your mouth because, and about the tongue, because, I mean, things can go really bad or they can go really good for you. And a lot of times, everything that people, base everything on is what we say and how we say it. And wisdom's powerful. I mean, actions, wisdom is in actions, but a lot of times your wisdom is in what you say. And convey, I don't know, it's like, it's crazy. Yeah. And it's, that whole thing emphasizes to me how important my words are towards my children and how I instruct them. onto the Lord.

So when it matters, when they're at that crossroad, when it matters, they have that to kind of like go back to and refer back to. Because I wonder, I wonder if David's instructions to Solomon influenced him heavily to ask the Lord for wisdom in that time. I don't know. But like being smart for me is like you're leaning on your own understanding. which is another scripture. And you're so limited.

And because my mind is so limited, I only use what, 10% of it. And I don't know all things, but you know who does know all things? Yeah. Holy Spirit. The spirit of truth. And so for me, wisdom is so much more,

more valuable than what I can come up with on my own, for sure. Like, who would have thunk to say, give me a sword? We'll divide the kid in half. It's genius. that I know I literally was like that is so wise genius I don't know if I yeah I would not be able to come up with that on my own it's not possible right but that's what wisdom will do for you

it's powerful Tracy do you want to say something um yeah I have a verse and this came up because when you are in some form of leadership everybody has opinions right and so everybody has a way that they think that they would do it. I talked about this, obviously, last week and on my Instagram story, and it, like, kind of seeps into this as well because, like, people think that there is a, like, a good idea, but, like, you know what God told you to do, and it looks different than, like, they would do it if they were in your shoes.

Right. And so you have to reconcile that with God, and you have to say, God, like, I get what they're saying. It makes sense, but something inside of me is telling me this isn't your way. And then it might look bad because you're not activating, you're sitting still, you're not doing like leadership things, but really you're just being obedient to what God told you, which is wisdom. And so wisdom doesn't always look like it's smart to other people

because they didn't get that revelation. They're not in that position to have to make those decisions. And I know for me personally, as a leader, there's times where God's like, do not reach into this pot. It is not for you. Nothing good will come of it. If I need you in it, I will get you there. And there's been times where I'm like, yeah, but I'll, but I have like, but it's my heart and I just want to make sure.

And he's like, don't do it. And I don't. And it pans out and it makes sense later on. And he's a good dad. So he'll always give you like opportunities when it's appropriate. But like if you trust him, the timing works out. And it's more efficient. You know?

So that's like what's really big for wisdom for me. And like James 317 is, but the wisdom from above is first of all pure. It is also peace-loving, gentle at times, and willing to yield to others. It is full of mercy and good deeds. It shows no favoritism and it's always sincere. And so what Vanessa said, wisdom is from above. Which you both took two of my scriptures that I have. I'm sorry.

How dare you. We'll circle back to it. We'll circle back. Just show how smart you are because. I know. But I love that. Scripture is huge. Like I've got to base everything on the work.

Everything. Everything has got to go back to it. everything and we were actually we just had some conversations in our fortress youth spam chat and some conversation got brought up and I'm like but what Bible verse is that it's confusing but like what's the Bible verse there is none so therefore you can throw it out yeah it's really easy yeah it's really easy to throw out what you believe when there's nothing in the word to back it up right because it eliminates any confusion that's being created in your mind right and that's where people kind of get stuck is the confusion well like but we're at this position and you do this and it's like

Right. In the world, like, yeah, maybe that's how they do it. But like, when you know that God told you to do something or the scripture told you to do this and your flesh wants to do the opposite, you don't. Exactly. If you start to micromanage the Lord. And then it's that. And I'm not going to do that. And that's not even my personality. No, at all. That actually stresses me out to micromanage stuff. So I know. I hate, I hate micromanagement. Right. I mean, it feels like uncomfortable already. And then God's like, that's, like, that's because I told you not to. But then there's times where he's like,

you need to, you need to confront this. You need to have this conversation. And it's uncomfortable to my flesh, but I know I have to do it. Yeah, because sometimes it's, and you know what the two is like, I think sometimes when you hate micromanagement, you think that any type of management sometimes feel like it's micro.

True. So that's having to overcome that too. It's because more or less is like you just, I'm like, it'll get done. Right. Not because you're a procrastinator. You just believe in the people that you've put the tag. But for me, I hate, like, because I'm usually Tom's person.

So I have to manage what I have to manage. And then he has me manage what he has to manage. So, like, and if he gives me a task, then I literally have to be on that task more than I would be on my own task. Yeah. So that makes me uncomfortable. So it makes you even more of a micromanager. then when you're like having to like deal and walk through some of the stuff that as a business owner as a church and people think that they know what they know but they know nothing about the real

situation then they have their thoughts and opinions and you can't tell them because first of all it's another business right but second of all it's like wouldn't be wise would not be wise to talk about it or to go into any great detail it's impossible to tell every single detail of every conversation that was had. Even when Jared comes back from meetings, he tries to tell me everything. It's not possible. It's impossible.

And sometimes it leaves me with questions. So either I have to ask the right questions or I just have to let it go and be like, Jay, I trust you. Or open up AI. Or scan the document. Yeah. And have it do the work for you.

Exactly. And summarize this meeting. Summise this. Summise, but that's applying wisdom too. Even in that. Like when you, question what somebody else is doing, wisdom would probably tell you if you trust them, then trust them.

And know that if they make a mistake, then they'll fix it or it was a mistake. Right. But you have to trust them or otherwise either don't work for them. Right. Right. Or don't attend. Right. And that's how I feel about the Lord.

Like I trust him. Like I trust him so much that he never fails. He's always faithful. But people do fail. It's neat for me, like you're, but you're an all-in girl. Yeah. I am. I am.

Yeah. Okay. And most people don't feel like that about the Lord even. Because there's still so much of control. Like, they would say, no, no, no, I do. I do. Then I would say, why don't you pay time then? Right.

Yeah. Why don't you believe in healing then? Mm-hmm. Like, because it's clear in the word that both of those. things are a given. They're like there are a contract with you so you don't but you're an all-in girl though so to me that's like that's a given that you would do that and it's because he has proven himself faithful every single time but you yield yourself for me to be all in no no no no no because there's two sides to this you yielded yourself to him for you to be able to see that right

And then you're able to apply it from experience. So faith becomes very easy when you see him over and over and over again as you yield yourself to him. Right. His faithfulness. Most it is like narrows away and few there be that find it as far as becoming saved. That still is an application that is within your Christian walk. Many people won't take the narrow road to have the closer, more faithful, more, more, a holy driven relationship with the Lord.

Yeah. They just don't. They just want to get in and whatever it takes to get in. They'll do that, yet still live the life that they want. You're an all-in girl, though. I mean, you're like one way, one or the other. That's it. But most people are not like that.

Right. And our church is full of them. True. Most of our church is full of all in. because the ones that want to live in the gray, they never make it. They go right on down to the... You get so uncomfortable? Yeah, they head on right down back to the Ark Church.

Or to a church that preaches the Ark message that has... Doesn't... is another the name. It's true. Because there is nothing that challenges them. It's everything that makes you feel comfortable. And you're barely going to skate in to heaven if you get into heaven in some of those conditions and places. depending on what it is.

So, but for me, you being like that, like, you're rare, though. I mean, Vanessa, it's a rarity. I don't want to. I don't want to. It is a unicorn, though. I know. It is. And it's sad.

Yep. But. Because there's a better way. There is a better way. There's a better way. And even when you show it to people, you like, you want it for people. I know. They have to want it for themselves.

Exactly. But they would say that works for you, but that doesn't work for me. And you can say as how much as you want. No, it can. You just got to do what I did. And they'd be like, that's too hard. But you don't know what I've been through. It requires death to self. You literally have to die.

But you know what kills me too is Tracy, what you said is such a great point. They'll say, but you don't know what I've gone through. But the thing is, I always want to say, you don't know what I've gone through. Correct. exactly what are you talking about right you don't know what I've gone through right and listen if anybody wanted to say that about Vess and Vanessa I would seriously be like hello I know yeah I've seen it I mean I've been with Vanessa I've been with them when they were beaten battered and like crawling in the door but they were still coming in

when a lot of people would have said I'm done right and the beauty of doing it God's way I don't, I don't show any evidence of that. None. I don't smell like the fire. I don't smell. Yeah. Right. And that's, and I'm not special.

And that's the thing. Like, God doesn't have favorites. Like, if he's going to do it for me, he can do it for you. It just requires complete surrender. Yep. It requires you to not be Lord of your life. Die to die to yourself. Yeah.

It really does. And, like, I will say this. Like, a lot of people want, like, what you guys have. Okay. But they, don't want to do what it takes to get what you have. Okay. And what I mean by that is, okay, Jeff, living in his office, studying, studying, studying, listening to one thing after another, reading one book after another, you raising the kids while he's at meetings like three to four

nights a week and never complaining, moaning, groaning, complaining, nothing. When the money's not coming in, but the work has to be applied. And, And like a lot of people don't want to do that. They want to get the end result, but they don't want to do the hard stuff to get there. I've literally heard people complain about a spouse owning a business or somebody in a professional field. And the wife is having to like take on stuff. And she'll complain about it, make it hard for him. And they want the other side of it, but they don't want to put in.

what it takes to get to the other side. Right. Okay, that's not how it works. And that's not how it works and your Christian walk. Exactly. It's so frustrating. Shut your mouth.

If you want to get to the other side, do what it takes. That's so true. Oh my gosh. Do what it takes. I mean, I literally was a single mom for so long because Tom either worked night shift.

He worked night shift. Then he would do details and then he would do the church at night he would do we have things in the evening and then he would do church on Sunday so he would we'd have a Tuesday night crave we'd have a Wednesday night youth

and he did both of those and then we would have a Sunday service and then he'd go back to night shift or went to work all day I mean it took a long time to get to where we're at and there was a lot of sacrifices along the way.

People are not willing to do the sacrifices. They just want it now because we're a microwave world. That's not how it works. Didn't he have a hub too at one point? Yeah, we've done young adults or not young marids. We've done all kinds of bug studies. Yeah, I remember sitting at a hub. Well, that was craved and that got changed from Crave to just a Bible study.

So we went from, yeah. And I can tell you how many times we host. at a hub at our home and you guys came. Like, you do you have to. Yeah, we've gone to plenty of them. Not because we were watching, but some of them we were watching. But then some of them were so good that we were like, we're getting fed. Yeah.

That's good. And as we're in it. You were all in from the beginning. We'd have people at our house every day on every Sunday. Yep. From 20 to 60. Like, like, like, I know. Yeah, because like, I know.

It was nuts. I don't know what I was thinking about. But it was, and we paid for the whole entire thing. Like Tom and I, the church didn't pay for that. Me and Tom paid for that. That was a lot of money. But we sacrificed our home because of the vision. And like a lot of people, they want it, but they don't want to do what it takes.

And I just am like, that's not wise. You need to understand them. There's no wisdom in that. Right. Exactly. You've got to do tough things. Yeah. And some people think that they are, and that's even more frustrating.

Because they're delusional. Because they're delusional. There's this level of delusion. And they just are like, yeah, but I am putting the work in. But you know they're not. Right. There's no risk at all. It's just, well, I go to work every day from 9 to 5 and then I go home.

And then I'm so tired when I get home. Like you actually ask them. And they're like, oh, yeah, not really. I mean, yeah, when am I supposed to do it? Right. You're not doing it. So it's like that delusion that they believe it. They don't even read the Bible.

Right. That's, I mean, if you can't simply make sure you read the word every single day. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Like, how are you going to do it? I know. How are you going to do it? How are you, I'm not just talking about doing a ministry.

I'm talking about simply getting ahead in life. Right. And either owning your own business or becoming something in the company that you work for. Mm-hmm. Getting a, going from, because listen, every time I've worked for a business, which hasn't been very much but anytime I have I've always had promotion on my mind. I'm like I will be here but by this date I will be here and then my next goal is my plan is here like yeah that's where I mean yeah that should be it true yeah and a lot of people aren't reading their words so they're not tithing and they're like

why can't I get ahead well you're not tithing but I mean and it's this like this vicious cycle of just self-sabotage. And eventually it's too tiring, so you just stop. Yeah. You don't try anymore. And sometimes, I will say this, sometimes because even we've experienced, sometimes when it looks like failure, like you're about to fail, you're not, you're about to fail. You're actually transitioning or you're about to go to the next level.

Right. I mean, if we read, if we would have had that mindset, we wouldn't be here today. Because there were many, many times. And even some of the greatest pastors I've ever listened to, Andrew Womick tells the story about he's in a board meeting and they're telling them, you're done. You have no money. You need to shut the doors. You're done. And he was like, okay, if that happens, then the Lord, then Lord, I know you'll take.

me, if this door is closing, then you have another door opening for me. So I'm not done. It's just you're transitioning to me to something else. He didn't accept it to look like failure. He accepted it to say, okay, I've played this out. I've done my part. All that God has called me to do, I've stayed close to him. I followed his instruction. And I'm doing, I am now going to fulfill the next thing that he has for me. Whereas a lot of people look at. at that as failure. I don't look at it as failure if you have actually done what the Lord's told you to do and you have tried to fulfill each step. Now, have you made mistakes a long way? Who doesn't? Who doesn't make mistakes along the way? But if you've had really conscientiously

tried to go in every direction he's led you to and it still leads to what looks like failure or ends up transitioning you out, that's a transition that's not necessarily failure. Now, sometimes we fail and we failed. And there's a lesson that needs to be learned with that. So you never do it again. But don't always look at it as that because this church wouldn't exist today. If that's what we would have thought. If that's what we would have, there were times like Andrew Wama, it gets a phone call.

In that meeting, in the middle of that meeting, his wife gives him a call and says, hey, somebody just sent in $60,000. And that's exactly what they needed to keep the doors open. Because that was faith. what looked like it was wasn't and if he would have let them close it up right then right where would he be now like his ministry wouldn't be what it is right and i would say that to you just because it looks like failure doesn't mean it is don't quit right unless the lord shuts the door and you know it's definitely shut and that just means you're moving it to something else right and you have to

be faithful in that that's using wisdom versus looking at things in your own mind because the scripture is true my ways are higher than your ways my thoughts are higher than your thoughts and your thoughts are your smarts your brain power not what wisdom tells you right and you have to make sure that you stay in line and in tune with that um but okay do you guys want to add anything because i'm going to go to my first thingy okay so wisdom actually starts at proverbs 9 10 and it's and it starts with a foundation Okay, and this scripture is so good. It says the fear of the Lord is the foundation of wisdom. And Tom uses this scripture all the time.

The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom is what the New King James Version says. But the NLT says is the foundation, which I actually love because to fear him means that's your foundation. Yeah. And I never looked at it like that until I heard that scripture. I'm like, that's good. Yeah, that is. It makes sense too. It does.

Feels accurate. It does. Again, it goes right back to what you and I, all three of us, we're talking about. God has to be number one. At the end of the day, God has to be number one. What are you putting in? Because what you put in will be what you get out because that's wisdom. So it's just like Vanessa is saying she puts her complete trust in him,

meaning he's number one. If he's not number one, understand. you'll walk by your own intelligence, you'll walk by your own smarts, but you will not walk in his wisdom. And you have to have an understanding of him to be able to walk in wisdom. Because he is the one that's going to help you make your decisions.

Not you, not your own brain power. Proverbs 313 says, Joyful is the person who finds wisdom. I mean, that's not hard to understand. If you want joy, then be a person that's wise. For me, I will say this. For me, I think that scripture right there is radical. I don't want to be depressed.

I don't want to be down and out. I would rather be joyful. Well, if in order to be joyful, I need to be wise, I'll do it. To me, that scripture is life-giving, life-changing. Yes. Most people live in anxiety, anxiousness, and depression. Yes.

And like. No joy. No peace. No peace. It's just completely absent. And you're smart. And you have a high IQ. Right.

Yeah. But you have no wisdom. Right. Because you have no joy. Right. Right. And what you make in your own, you have to sustain in your own. And so when God does it, then God has to sustain it.

And I'm like, God, you do it. Like, this is way too big. And you have to be able to say that. And I think some people are just too prideful. And they think, well, I'm so smart. I got straight A's. I did this. I did that.

And I'm like, yeah, but like, you have to sustain it. That's exhausting. Very much, though. Thank you. Very much stuff. And when you rely on your own understanding, you're literally telling the Lord, I think I can. do this better than you. Right. Oh my gosh. Which I can't. Which absolutely not. I know.

It's just so true. So true. Yeah. When you like go and like I think a lot of people what they do is they look at like patterns too. So like those patterns like trump what the word says. So if they start seeing patterns whatever play out, they're like oh well yeah. I'm like I remember the last time that happened. So I have to protect myself or you know I have to get out before. it gets bad again or then they're making decisions based off of obviously their own understanding but it's patterns they've seen. Life experience. Life experiences, situations, yeah, everything.

But how wise were you in that life experience? Right. Right. I know. If the Lord tells you to do it, then it won't be the same as it was before because you're in a different place. Right. Right.

Yeah. It's totally different. Totally different. Totally different. And that's a trust, like that's even, almost feels more trusting because you know what the last one did. And then this time you're like, all right, God. Yeah. And how much does that say to him when you say, it didn't work out last time, but I did it on my own?

Right. This time you're telling me to do it and you're going to go with me on it. Yeah. So although I'm nervous and hesitant, I trust you. I trust you anyways. Yeah. Yeah. So we're going to do this together.

We're doing it together. Huge. Ecclesiastity 712 says only wisdom can save your life. I never knew. I have read that scripture. I cannot tell you until I was looking up scriptures with wisdom in it. And I went, holy moly. That's in there.

That's in there. I cannot believe it. So that basically means I made a list. You can have money. You can have opportunity. You can have popularity. You can have success. which is all the things in my head, when I made this list,

those are the things that people care more about than anything else. Oh, yeah. In my head, there's probably others. I don't know what they are. But those are huge. Because to me, that's what everybody I know is striving for. But without wisdom, I wrote, it can be fleeting and gone quickly. So all of those things, money, opportunity, popularity, and success.

when you have no wisdom, all of that is fleeting, and it'll be gone just like that. So how great is it? Right. It's not that great. It means absolutely nothing. So why not just get wisdom? And like when Solomon said, when the Lord said, I'll give you everything. I mean, I'll give you anything you want. And he said, wisdom, he got all of that. He got all of those things that I just said. People traveled to see Solomon and to hear him speak. because he was so wise. Right. They traveled to see him. He's pretty popular. Yeah. And the moment he started leaning on his own understanding was when he.

Went to hell in a handbass. Yeah, literally. The Lord said, do not marry foreign women. What did he do? Married foreign women. Now is it. Cucidines. That was not.

That was nothing. And he had it. I know. He had all of those things. Come on. I know. And as soon as he started walking in his own understanding. Yeah.

Well, that's First Corinthians 8. One says knowledge puffs up, but edify loves. So when you're being smart, you're so smart, you get very prideful. And we know people like that that are so smart. They're in their niche and they're so good at their niche. Yeah. They're not even willing to hear anything else. Like, as a business owner, it's very hard to hire somebody that's excellent at leak detection

because they come in with this. Well, I'm already good at this. And we're like, yeah, but we do it differently. Like, we have like a process. and we have people that like, I don't care, I'm just going to do it my way. Those people never stay with us. No. They're not the ones that didn't know but had great character, are not prideful,

are willing to learn, are willing to do something different. They always stay with us. Yeah. They make it. They will. But they didn't come in with bad habits. Right. Or just thinking they're so much better than everybody.

And I'm like, just such a shame. Okay, you're good at that one thing, but like we're doing more. Like, don't you want to be able to manage? Don't you want to be able to teach? And they're just, and we don't, we don't, want to teach it that way. Like, it's fine. If you find your own, like, rhythm and stuff, like, that's great. But, like, we want to be able to teach people the way that we want to do it for purpose, you know? So it is, yeah, wisdom is very, very, very important. It's key. Knowledge. You

have to be very careful with your own knowledge, your own understanding. Which is my next topic, which is God's wisdom versus your understanding. Yes. You're welcome. Yeah. Thank you. You segued even though you didn't know it. Proverbs 3, 5, through 6 says, do not depend on your own understanding, which is, I think, one of the things you were talking about, Vanessa. That means your logic is not the high authority. Right. Yes. Thank God.

I'm so limited. Like, so limited. Well, listen. I'm not going to insult my intelligence too much, okay? But without God, I might not be able to fight myself out of a paperback. Right. Like I, for real. I am like, there are so many times in life that I say, or I am in the thought process of,

I have no idea how to do this. So, Lord, you're going to have to show me now. Yeah. Well, that's like all the creative stuff that I do for church. Like, I've always been so intrigued by creative design. Like, I've always been, like, an interior design and all that. But, like, I just couldn't seem to do it. Like, I put it together and it looked like a mess.

Yeah. And then so every time I just would pray when I first started here, you guys needed a lot of design stuff. and I was like, okay. And so I would just like sit and I get inspired. And then I pray and be like, God, make this work. And somehow it just like would come together. And I was like, this is crazy. But I knew I couldn't do it on my own.

I knew I couldn't. Yeah. I think, I think, I mean, I think the best businesses that aren't like secular businesses, not that the, what I should say is, like, I would say your business is secular yours. even though it's Christian owned. Right. The thing is, is even in businesses versus in church, all of that stuff, if you allow the Lord to be the thing that created it creatively or whatever the case may be, if you let him lead

and guide it, like it will, you'll think of things and you'll do things that you never even. Yeah. 100%. 1,000%. When Jeff, beat you. When Jeff sits with clients, especially new clients, he has an open Bible on his desk. And he'll go, even to clients that aren't believers, he'll go, I plan to plan for your retirement according to what this says. Are you okay with that?

Never once someone one said, no, absolutely not. No, don't do it. That's crazy. Because they're stupid if they say no. They're like, yes, please. Wow. That's very interesting. That's like, because I'm going to, I'm going to be held accountable one day.

It's true. Are you okay with that? And they're like, yes, please. It is. It's true. 100% true. It's crazy. Yeah.

I think that if people would just yield themselves to the Lord and everything that they do, he would blow their mind because your steps are ordered. So the step is going to be successful. It's going to make you prosperous. Because there's certain things that he's word says. But also, like, you're going to literally do and say and go places that you just never thought was in your future. Right. Because of it.

I don't know. Proverbs 14.12 says there is a path that seems right, but it ends to death. So your path is. if you do it in your mind and in your understanding, understand that it leads to death. It does not lead to life. You are not a great navigational system. True.

And like I just said, he said that he has, your steps are ordered. He has a direction for you to go. If you decide to take that over, understand it's not going to go the way you wanted to. and I hope people are, I've done that with my life. I've said, you know what, I'm going to do my own thing. And it literally led to destruction, a baggage that I literally was able to drop off somewhere and not carry anymore.

But it's not good. And those are things that you can, you can't get that time back and you can't change it. You can only become better from it because he'll work all things together for his good. but don't go your own way. Right. You will not be happy if you do. And a wise person learns from other people's mistakes. So be wise.

Be wise. Heed instruction. Yeah. I know. Because it's not good. And being in youth ministry, the hardest part is watching youth kids go back to their old vomit. It's like the dude.

And they know. Come on. Like they know now, you know. And you see the freedom that comes. from it but I mean their home life is terrible whatever they're coping and and you see them go right back to old vomit and I'm like so sad it is it's familiar because it's very familiar and even though as dysfunctional as it is it's comforting I know right it's familiar and so it and I don't get dysfunction I I literally do not get the I mean so many

homes that are not Christian, but even homes that are Christian. Yeah. Live in chaos. Yep. Yeah. Yep. Like, I don't understand what is so appealing about that. I don't.

Like, I do. You know what? It just came to me. Wisdom. Wisdom. Let's hear it. I do because it's the lack of a spiritual walk. So you know how when you open the word and you see something,

in it and you're like oh my gosh and it like it gives you like a little bit of a high it gives you like this uh kind of a rush do you know what i'm saying sure do well they don't have that so they have substituted it for substituted it with the other which is you we we need highs we need like not that you need to have a high but yeah there's something good about that dopamine hits yeah that's so good kind of thing. Because they don't put in the effort to do what spiritually edifying and spiritually good for them, they'll get it somewhere else where it's entertainment. Whereas the word is entertaining if you let it be or you'll find entertainment somewhere else.

And if it ain't in the word, then it's of the devil. It's one or the other. You know, you are going to be one or the other. And so if it's not something that he would do, then it's of the devil. And you'll get used to that. And that'll be something that you dwell in. And eight. Clock and eight.

Clock and eight. That's so good. No, it's so true because the other day I was reading and I got like this revelation and it like aligned with some stuff in our life. And I was like, oh, my gosh. Like this is crazy. Like I never put it together that way. And then I watch other situations and people are like looking for that high.

and like, well, this isn't going this way and this isn't. And I'm like, who cares? Yeah. But you're right. Like there is stuff that I'm getting from ministry and from the Bible. And it does. It's enough dopamine for me. So I'm not looking to manifest it or manipulate it or manufacture it in another area.

Yeah. That's so good. See, it is good. If you are like, if you are really walking in what he's called you to do, there's too much like there's too much good yeah it's like what trump said you're gonna get tired of winning okay he ain't winning right now sorry to say and I ain't I'd love to start seeing it again but with God you're always winning you're always winning so like don't let man be your your inspiration let the Lord be it but with God you're always winning man there's life right

and there's so much peace attached to it and so much joy attached to it and it's it's not heavy and it's no oh it's just your light when and when you see the other stuff he carries a load exactly but when you see the other stuff I'm really looking this way even though but when you see the other stuff because it's exactly what you're saying Vanessa when you see the other stuff you recognize you and you go that's not for me I want no parts of it I'm going to actually go in the other direction of this because that smells right that's no good And let me tell you, there are moments where I'm like, in my flesh, I'm like, oh, I'm going to, I'm going to, what I've surrendered, I'm going to, I'm going to go grab. And I will go grab it.

And I'm like, oh, oh, no, this feels too heavy. Actually, Lord, here it is. Like, I don't want it. Oh, yeah. This is not for me. This is no. I trust you. Right.

So true. Yeah. That's a good check. Yeah. Check some balance right there. Literally. You start to feel heavy. Like, was it you picking it up?

Or did God give it to you? Like, what? yeah. When the peace lifts. When the piece lifts, I know. I'm like, uh-uh, I'm picking up something that is not designed for me. It's not in my strength. It's not designed for me to hold.

So funny, because I was talking to somebody who had family, some family stuff going on about, oh, I don't know, a few months ago. And they walked away from all of that stuff, right? The family members were dealing with. And they were trying to help this. family member overcome it and get through it and they literally

and this is either a week or barely saved person at the time and they said they could the more they tried to help them and this is for a long period time they tried to help them so it wasn't like two days the more they tried to help them they could

sense old things that they had left start creeping back anxiety and all this other stuff they started feeling it rise up inside of them they were literally they said to this family you know family member I'm going to stop like I've told you all that I can tell you I've given you the instruction I've given you the word now it's your time either you take it up and you carry it the mantle that's been given to you and I've helped you with but right now your stuff is coming on to me yeah and once that starts happening I have have to pull back. Right. And that's wisdom. And that is wisdom. It is. And some people won't get that

until you're in the situation and you've done everything you can and God says walk away. And that doesn't feel loving and that doesn't feel kind and that feels like you don't care. And it's not your ways are higher than yourself. Exactly. Right. And you'll know. And then you'll feel the peace return because it lifted and now it's going to return when you do what God tells you to do. And you may see that person become successful because they have to stand on their own two feet. Or they'll stay in the same place and get worse because they were never going to do what you said. Right.

It didn't matter whether you stayed or went. The outcome was going to remain the same. True. And that's wisdom to know that you might not even be able to change it. So even you being in the situation, if God says he doesn't want you there, that means you even being there won't change the situation. And you're blocking the person or, you know, yeah. person that is the lesson to learn.

Right. I know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's so true. You are literally a roadblock for that person. Right. 100%. 100%. Yeah. And the Holy Spirit will tell you. He will. I'm going to stop. I'm going to do our sponsors really quick. And then, yep. When it comes to knowing what your home is really worth, precision matters. Since 2005, real estate appraisal associates has been one of the South West's Florida's most trusted names in certified residential appraisals. They combine accuracy, integrity, and efficiency, so you're not left guessing or waiting weeks for answers.

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Baptism. Thank you. God bless you, child. Baptism this Sunday. Yes. So good. Yes. So good.

I know. I love how we do it too. I love that it's during worship. So good. Because it's a celebration. It is a celebration. It is exciting. Yes. It is so exciting. I always cry. Every, every baptism. Of course you do. Every time. If you didn't, I wouldn't know what to do. I know, literally. Wouldn't have any idea. I know. I'd be like, you don't cry. No. Are you didn't cry? I know. I would be shocked. Shocking. Watch me not cry on I know. You better. McKenzie is getting baptized. You have to cry. Who? My daughter. When did she decide this?

She was like, I don't even know why I haven't got baptized yet. Good for her. I know. How flippin exciting is this? I know. Is her boyfriend getting baptized too? Yes, he's very excited. Rock the house, baby.

I know. We got a bunch of youth kids getting baptized. How many do you know? Did Heather tell you how many we have baptized? Wednesday it was 38. Total. Are you kidding me? Yeah.

But remember we did 80 one time? Oh, that's true. We did. That, so we're okay. I thought we were never going to stop dunking. Never, I know. Poor Travis. I know.

That was something else. His arm must have been so sore the next day. I can't even imagine. Tom just has to lean in. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's it.

That's it. That's powerful. I know. I know. I love it. That's awesome. Now, that might, that might be a toughie for me. That's it.

Because Kylie, I almost cried with Kylie. I know. I cried for Kylie because Alice, and was crying when Kylie got baptized. Yeah. She was like bawling. I was like, oh my gosh, what are you bawling? Why are you crying?

That's touching. That's moving. Yeah. One of our teens, her parents are, I don't think there are Jehovah's Witnesses anymore, but they were at one point. Oh, wow. And her and her brother are the only ones in their household that are believers. What?

And so her parents are coming to support her getting baptized. it's so special weren't they last Sunday yeah they were there sat last Sunday for Easter Sunday and they agreed

to come back I know God do a work I know I prayed over them too while they were sitting there I know it worked

yeah it worked pricked that hard pull them in yeah I know I know yeah

so special it is unbelievable it's awesome when kids can be the thing winning their parents that's what it impresses me

so much it's a more common thing in youth group that I actually did an altar call on Wednesday for anybody who was believing for their family members. And I had about probably 20 kids come up and all of them were for mom and dad. Yeah. Or mom or dad or both, yeah, but it was all their parents. Isn't that crazy? Literally. Yeah. And they're there standing there for their parents. Right. I'm so glad my parents were saved. I know. Man. I know. I mean, I have often thought to myself, girl, you were lucky. even though I walked away for like five years.

I know. I'm like, man. If they weren't saved, I know. Like, where would I be? I was lucky to grow up in a Christian home. I know. Yeah. Yep.

I don't know what that would have been like. Me either. Thank you, Jesus. I didn't have to find out. Praise the Lord. See you on Sunday. Yay. Thanks for joining us.

Bye. Real talk.