The I Love CVille Show With Jerry Miller! - 303 Alderman Rd: 6-Unit Townhouse Application; 303 Alderman: $835K Sold On 6/12/24, $1M Ask

Episode Date: July 31, 2024

The I Love CVille Show headlines: 303 Alderman Rd: 6-Unit Townhouse Application 303 Alderman: $835K Sold On 6/12/24, $1M Ask How Will Lewis Mtn Neighborhood Respond? How Much Will Each Townhome Sell For? Reaction: City’s 4.7% Storefront Vacancy Rate Do Storefront Tennants Matter For Local Vitality? Market St v. Court Square Parks: Worst One? Austin, TX Slams Brakes On All-Electric Bus Fleet Read Viewer & Listener Comments Live On-Air The I Love CVille Show airs live Monday – Friday from 12:30 pm – 1:30 pm on The I Love CVille Network. Watch and listen to The I Love CVille Show on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, LinkedIn, iTunes, Apple Podcast, YouTube, Spotify, Fountain, Amazon Music, Audible, Rumble and iLoveCVille.com.

Good Wednesday afternoon, guys. I'm Jerry Miller, and thank you kindly for joining us on the I Love Seville Show. It's great to be with you on a glorious and gorgeous afternoon in the heartbeat of the city we love dearly so much that one of our businesses has been monikered, I Love Seville. Today's program, we'll talk storylines and topics that I think are important to you, that Judah thinks are important to you. We relay those storylines to you on all social media platforms possible, and we ask that you, the viewer and listener, offer some perspective on what we're talking about.

Like the show, share the show, challenge us. Yesterday I learned from John Blair on LinkedIn about Dr. Meg Bryce's appointment to the Virginia Board of Education. She is currently appointed, but if a majority doesn't happen from both the delegates and the state senators, and it has to be a majority per each house, she can then be removed from the Virginia Board of Education.

John, after I read your comment on the show yesterday, we heard on the talk show from seven viewers and listeners that had similar confusion as Judah and I, that responded via messaging platform, social media, and said, we did not know that either. We were wondering the same. Thank your listener for explaining it to us. Seven different people and Judah and I. So I think you helped educate quite a bit yesterday.

That's what we want with this program. Let's just be a water cooler of conversation. So on today's show, did you send me headlines via email, J-Dubs? Not yet. On today's show, we're going to talk 303 Alderman Road. Sean Tubbs has great reporting on this. I want to make sure I'm giving Sean Tubbs some props. His Info Seville, his Town Crier Productions, his Charlottesville Community Substack, fantastic

source of content. Sean Tubbs, you're an excellent journalist. One of the best we have in this community. 303 Alderman Road. It sold on, was it the 12th of June, Judah? I want to make sure we have the date right. I'm going to go to the GIS and confirm. We have on the headline June 12th. Let me confirm on the GIS, which I have in front of me. 303 Alderman Road sold in June of this year, $835,000. The buyer, Evergreen Builders. We now have some insight into what will be built because there's an application in City Hall about this project. I initially thought, it was June 12th, so the headline is correct.

Great work, Judah. I initially thought that this $835,000 purchase was going to be remodeled and rehabbed and then listed for $1,500,000 as a single family detached home. I saw that as the easiest path to profitability, the path with the least resistance, the least friction, and the quickest bag of money, the quickest bag of profit. You buy something for $835,000, you put $300,000 into it, you sell it for $1.5 million, you walk away with what? $300,000, $400,000? I mean, let's do just some back of the napkin math. $835,000 purchase, let's say you put $300,000 into it. That means your pot committed $1,135,000. Let's say you sell for $1,500,000.

You subtract the $1,535,000, $1,153,000. What was the number? $835,000 plus $300,000 equals $1,135,000. You sell it for $1,500,000. That leaves meat on the bone of $135,000. You sell it for $1,500,000. That leaves meat on the bone of $365,000. Of that $365,000 with closing costs, realtor commissions, build in a little margin.

Let's say you're walking away with 92% of that $365,000. Let's call it 92%. Build a conservative model. You have a nice chunk of money right there. You have a nice chunk of money, right? This is the question I have for you. If you're not going the path of least resistance, and now we know they're not evergreen builders because there's an application circulating

in City Hall for a six-unit town know they're not evergreen builders because there's an application circulating in city hall for a six unit uh town home project on that uh piece of property the structure do you have a picture of the rancher that we can put on screen yeah luke cole deserves some props the young logan foster realtor with a very bright future he sold sold this house. He marketed it. He initially listed it for $1 million. He found a buyer that paid $835. He made a nice commission. The buyer is going to put six townhomes there. The buyer's a builder.

They're going to tear down the rancher. They're going to put six townhomes there. The question I have is what is going to be the asking price for the six townhomes? And here's the follow-up question I have for you. There's the rancher on screen. Here's the follow-up question I have for you. If these townhomes come on the market due to be Wickhour, Jack of all trades, Jack of all wits, star of our show, if these townhomes come on the market at $700,000 each, on average, $700,000, right?

Six times $700,000 is $4.2 million. Have we created affordability in this neighborhood and in this city? Housing activists, upzoning activists will say this. Hey, at least it's not one unit being sold at $1,500,000. They will say, hey, it created six additional units of housing in the city that was previously one unit. They will say, hey, any additional supply is good for the ecosystem because more supply could create price stability. They will say, hey, this happened in an otherwise expensive neighborhood. They will say, hey, this is an example of what could happen for

future development. I will push back by saying this. If these units come on the market at $700,000 each, have we truly created affordability for the city? Or have we created an example, a microcosm, a barometer of what other projects could become? Roger Voisinet, he and Richard Price, both friends of the program, came on the show and they highlighted about a month ago one of the best shows we've ever done, the Woolen Mills project that Roger and Richard and a local builder are doing. They're taking a small house and they're adding three additional houses to the lot

for a total of four units. They're subdividing the lot and they're creating four units that they're then going to sell. Those units are going to be selling in the high 600,000s. High 600,000s. High 600,000s. And Roger has built-in efficiencies that perhaps this project does not have. of how you can speculate, purchase, develop, and resale at a very high price, and what does that do for affordability truly to the city? Very curious to hear what the viewers and listeners have to say.

Very curious to see how the Lewis Mountain neighborhood will respond. The Lewis Mountain neighborhood, a tony, affluent, well-located neighborhood with movers and shakers. The neighborhood, I would bet you right now, the majority in the hood are like, holy crap. One of our houses just turned into six units. We're going to have 6X the vehicle traffic potentially. We're going to have 6X the demand on our sidewalks and our roads. And this is going to impact our quality of life, and folks are nervous.

Anyone you want to go with this, Judah Wickauer, I'm going to also offer some reaction on this topic. The show is yours, Judah B. Wickauer. Viewers and listeners, let us know your thoughts as well. Travis Hackworth, welcome to the program on Danville. I mean, doesn't this increase... What's the word I'm looking for I get that these aren't going to be

affordable housing units but rather than I mean you mentioned most of this rather than one unit being sold for one million whatever you've now got six units that

we would guess that will be filled by people with money but doesn't that any additional supply people would say additional supply is good for affordability because additional supply stabilizes price points

and what Judah is trying to say is any kind of productivity, housing productivity is better for affordability because we have now more options on the market. And if they're expensive, those at the top of the pay chain, the pay scale, are going to go out for these expensive units as opposed to pursuing units in 10th and Page, tearing them down, and building a 4,000 McMansion in its place? Not to mention the fact that despite the fact that I think the rezoning,

I think one of the eventual effects people would like to see it cause, have, is definitely affordability. But I don't think that's the main goal of the rezoning. Oh, that is the main goal of the new zoning ordinance. The primary mission of housing activists for pushing the new zoning ordinance through from draft to official ordinance is more supply for affordability. That is the primary goal. That is 100% the primary goal. I don't mean to cut you off here, but I need to push back on what you said. That was 100% the primary goal. What do you think the primary goal was? And let's rotate those early lower thirds on screen. Ray Cadell, welcome to the program. The lower thirds tied to the Lewis Mountain neighborhood and 303 Alderman Road.

What do you think the primary goal of the new zoning ordinance was? I mean, wasn't it to create more... What's the word I'm looking for? Supply? No, no, no. I'm drawing a blank on the word I'm looking for? Supply? No, no, no. I'm drawing a blank on the word. What are you saying here? I'm willing to listen here. The amount of units that you can put in one spot. What is that?

Density? Density. Increased density. Wasn't that the goal? Yeah. Primarily to increase density and secondarily to make housing more affordable. The density increase was with the focus, the mission, the influence of more supply, stabilizes price points, and drives affordability. That was the goal of the NCO. And activists, livable Charlottesville housing activists will say, this is an example, 303 Alderman Road, get the lower thirds on screen, rotate that photo in, is an example of taking one unit and turning it into six.

This was one of the theories that our former mayor, Nakia Walker, did not understand. She kiboshed or voted against many projects because they didn't meet her specific standard of affordability, where other folks, including Michael Payne, who was a smart guy, he understood it. He said, we just need supply, Mayor Walker. Any supply is good for affordability, because the wealthy will pursue the wealthy units, and they won't go after the upper middle class or the middle class units and tear them down and rehabilitate them or buy them and remodel them.

Right. Okay. That's the idea. That's the whole concept. I want to ask you, the viewer and listener, this question. Deep throat. I'm going to you first. John Blair, I would love to go with you second on this topic.

I want to ask you, the viewer and listener, this question specifically. Evergreen is a fantastic builder. I hope Evergreen hears that I'm giving them props. Evergreen, you're top notch. That Spanish hacienda that you built in Ivy, next to that lot in Ivy where you're going to develop a beautiful single-family detached home, that Spanish rancher that you did with the stucco white outside, you did that beautifully. You know exactly what I'm talking about, Evergreen. You beautifully did that. You exit a beautiful playbook out there in Ivy by buying that land and remodeling that Spanish rancher and selling it for a nice chunk of change. This is the question I have for you, the viewer and listener.

If these six townhomes come on the market for $700,000 each, has it backfired? I put on Twitter here in a chain with Todd Rath, Todd Rath's the owner of Blue Toad Hard Cider and Matthew Gilligan, that those units are going to come on the market at $700,000 each. Todd Rath just responded to my tweet. He said this. This is great from Todd Rath who understands real estate. He said I'm not going to argue with the $700,000 per unit. And then he responds, going from $263,000 to $4.2 million via regulatory change unlock of economic value. Think about that. If they get six units and they're applied for six

and they sell those six at seven a pop, 4.2 million, the city wins big time with tax revenue. Hugely with tax revenue. Six additional houses to tax. Evergreen is making some bank on this deal. God, Evergreen, you guys, well done. Like seriously, well done. You buy something for 835, what's the cost for construction on that? What do you call it? 300, 350 a foot? Is 350 a foot? Oh, Deep Throat

has already got the modeling done for us. I love the viewers and listeners. Let's go with the modeling from Deep Throat right here. The application is a SHMP special. Justin SHMP watches and listens to the program, follows us on Twitter. He is a mover and shaker when it comes to these applications. This is what Deep Throat says. The application is a Schimpf special. It requires a variance even under the new zoning. The total footprint, 6,000 square feet. So call it 2.5 stories, 14,000 square feet total, divided among the six townhomes. I'm guessing these will be close to one million and will be rich students buying them. Damn! Deep Throat continues. God, you guys make us better.

This is all we want the show to be is you guys offering content like this to the viewers and listeners and we're just the vehicle for the content. Deep Throat continues. I'll start from the beginning. this is such a damn good comment. The application is a Justin Chipps special. It requires a variance even under the new zoning. The total footprint is 6,000 square feet.

So call it 2.5 stories, 14,000 square feet, divided among the six townhomes. Deep Throat guesses these will be close to $1 million each, and it will be rich students buying them. Each of these units will cost more than the house it replaced. Each unit, 2,200 square foot each, $300 per square foot to build, 650 to build, 140,000 in land cost, means the rock bottom is 800,000 a unit. Personally, in their shoes, I would have just gone for subdividing it and selling it for two custom single-family houses.

I would not even need to do it spec. You could find a family that would buy the land at markup and do the cost plus on the build. Much better business, Deep Throat says. He's pushing back on Evergreen's model right there. He's predicting it's six units coming on the market at a mil each. He's predicting that the cost to build each one of these, and this guy knows this. This guy is not trying to dox the man. This guy knows this stuff. $800,000 a unit

to build. So he's saying, there goes Cliff Fox, the commercial broker I was on the phone with the other day. Love Cliff Fox. Actually this morning. So $200,000 per unit, 200,000 times six units, million two, potentially right there of meat on the bone. Think about that. I said, put some lipstick on the pig, 835. Put the lipstick at 300. That lipstick on 300 takes you to 1,135,000. I said, sell it for $1.5 million. And I said, walk away with $365K plus minus your realtor fees. My situation, they would have walked with sub $300 and profit.

Sub $300. This situation, they're walking away with potentially north of $1 million. and profit. Sub 300. This situation, they're walking away with potentially north of a million dollars. Shows you why I'm not a developer. Shows you why I'm not a developer. The risk they're taking is significant. The carrying cost they're taking is significant. Curious to see what kind of financing they have on there. Curious to see what kind of interest rate

they have on there. Curious to see what the monthly debt service is on there. Curious to see what kind of interest rate that they have on there. Curious to see what the monthly debt service is on there. Very curious to see how quickly they can get these units on the MLS in a sale capacity. Curious to see if they pre-sell these units. Who wouldn't want to live in the Lewis Mountain neighborhood

if you're a grad student? There was an, I looked at, before we bought our house at Ivy, my wife and I looked at a home in Lewis Mountain. The home in the Lewis Mountain neighborhood. I wish I could find that home. I wonder if my wife can text me what the address was of that house.

There was a home in the Lewis Mountain neighborhood that traded next to Hillary Lewis's house. Remember Hillary Lewis? She used to do a show on the I Love Steve-O Network. Before she moved, we're on the street, I think she's in Nashville right now. She's a fantastic person, Hillary. Nothing but the best and wish her luck if she is in Nashville. There was a home next to hers. She did a text message

introduction with me and those owners, and we talked briefly about a deal, a broker and a deal off market where everyone could win. They were Darden students that owned this house. It was a darling, charming, updated, gorgeous house. Gorgeous house. Gorgeous house. And these Darden students, literally, two Darden students, a couple, man and gal, both at Darden, both come from high dollar jobs before putting the high dollar jobs on hold to pursue masters in business where they can then, after two years of Darden, get even more high dollar jobs. And they bought this house and in two years after buying

it, it appreciated, we're talking like 25, 30, 40%. Now they bought it a great time during the pandemic. My wife and I love that area because we could walk everywhere with our kids, our Bambinos everywhere. She was walking to the farmer's market, Hillary from Lewis mountain. Nice. But the point is this, you have students at Darden that are coming from finance jobs where they worked at, they took four-year undergraduate paths at fantastic universities like UVA, University of Michigan, shout out John Blair, go Big Blue. Yale, Princeton, Harvard, Harvard, shout out Deep Throat, props to you for the Crimson Cornell Dartmouth, Penn Wharton School, they go to these

four year undergraduate schools they get a job in finance working for Blackstone for example, shout out to my wife who worked at Blackstone for almost a decade you work at Blackstone for 8-10 years 6-8-10 years

you're making $ buck 90 plus bonus. Your bonus is your down payment on your house. You do it with a couple, with a partner, a significant other like this family, these two people, Lewis Mountain. They were probably clocking 200 each at least plus a bonus of 50 to 75K. They said, hell, let's leave Manhattan. Let's go to Darden. Let's go buy a house. They took their bonus where they probably each got 75k in bonus,

used that as the down payment of the house. They were paying a mortgage for themselves as opposed to paying a rent to a landlord. They said, we're going to live in this darling, charming, fantastic Lewis Mountain location and walk to school or have a two-minute Uber to school, and then we're going to sell it and cash out dollar-dollar bills, y'all, once Darden is over.

And that's exactly what they did. I bet you you could pretty sell these units. Rob Neal watching the program, his photo on screen. What a great location for a big VA.A.F. donor from out of town to buy a townhouse halfway between Scott Stadium, the John Paul Jones Arena and the Dish. Then simply Airbnb it on days you're not using it. Bingo. Bammo. If that's what happens here, has it really created affordability? But those people were going to buy places anyways, right? Would those people, would they have bought in neighborhoods that were marginalized,

where they had to rehabilitate and remodel and reconstruct? Or would they buy something brand new, soup to nuts, that needs no work? I don't know if that's entirely fair. I was hoping you would push back on that. Make your point. I think it's a fair point that you're going to make right here. Not that I'm anticipating what the properties that you're talking about, but eventually you're going to get some trickle down. someone else to buy another place and whether the chain is two houses long or five houses long, eventually somebody is going to end up grabbing one of the lower income housing spots. And this just creates a space in that chain. That's the argument that Livable Charlottesville is going to make. That's the argument that Bee Pinksottesville is going to make. That's the argument that B. Pinks is going to make.

Major Payne is going to make. That's the argument that Nat GBT is going to make. That the Snookinator are going to make as well. And I kid because I care. I love those guys. That's the answer that Lloyd Snook is going to make. Brian Pixton is going to make. Michael Payne is going to make.

Natalie Orsham is going to make. Juan Diego Wade's going to make. That's the argument that Stephen Johnson's going to make, Matthew Gilligan's going to make. That's a fair argument. So I'll push back on that argument. If these come in, my number is low. I said 700,000. I take a step back and say, I'll heed to Deepthroat on this.

He knows this better than I do. If he says they're coming in at a million each, a million each, I ask developers across central Virginia and out-of-market ones as well. Do you now have a blueprint to significantly drive up the cost of extremely limited housing in one of the most coveted-to-live cities in the United States of America. Because of the fact that any house could be bought and have six units put on it? The pay on the zoning and what the new zoning ordinance allows. Yeah, which could five X or six X the worth of the property. You've got a builder that paid $835,000 to tear

a house down. You've got an in-market, local Charlottesville builder that paid $835,000 for dirt because of its upside. Yeah.

And it's going to carry debt for 12 to 24 months before any kind of revenue generates. This is risk. This is effing risk. Is it really though? Is paying $835,000 for dirt and then spending what's the man saying? $800,000 times six, 4.8 million? Judah,

he's saying, and he knows this, 800,000 times 6, 4,800,000 to build, plus the 835 for the dirt, $5,635,000. Plus the debt service. That's effing risk. That's why he straight up is saying this and he's pushing back on this. He says, I would much prefer slicing it into two, selling each lot for $600,000, family builds and pays 15% contractor fee to Evergreen

on a 4,000 square foot build on each lot, higher end, 400 square foot build on each lot higher end 400 square foot so-called 300,000 contractor profit on each at minimum so you make 600k on the build and 400,000 on the land profit much less risk that's fair then he says we'd be lucky if it's just darted students the real bad scenario is if someone who has discretion over where to live and they would have chosen elsewhere without this option. They will create more demand for housing with all the services they consume. I guess my point is there are already very few people here that can afford

one million for a townhouse. So this is a draw for people from out of market. You will loosen the market in D.C. to Charlottesville. Rory Stolzenberg responding here. Planning Commissioner. He says this. That would be great value. The median house in Lewis Mountain is assessed at $940,650. I guess they'd be priced a bit higher.

Great opportunity to soak up demand from tenured professor types in a wealthy neighborhood instead of the 10th and page flips point you're making yeah and i understand the point that uh that deep there is making but saying that is it really fair to say that uh projects like this popping up are going to draw outside buyers? Are outside buyers looking at Charlottesville waiting for something like this to happen? And is the response to just not build? John Blair, your comments on deck. How many people can afford a million dollar townhome? Not me. And if you were local and you could buy something that was a million dollars, a million plus. Would you buy a townhouse? Would it be a townhome?

That's a fair question. Or would you be pursuing an out of market buyer that doesn't want upkeep? That just wants to be able to come in for a long weekend, a football game, reunions, a basketball game, a baseball game. Why no upkeep? Because it's an effing townhome. Townhome's less upkeep than a single-family detached house. Okay.

Right? You with me? Not really. How so? Why is there less upkeep? Yard maintenance. You still have a yard. Much smaller than a single-family detached house. That's true.

I would imagine the townhome is going to have some kind of shared association of costs. Possibly. I wouldn't imagine one of the townhomes is just going to be able to just do, and maybe I'm wrong on this, if you have a townhome and you've got a problem with the roof, are you just going to be able to put a copper roof on your portion of the townhome and the other five townhomes are going to have their own roofs? Wouldn't that look a little odd? I would imagine there's going to be some kind of association there.

Okay. Shared call structure. He's like, God, I love this show. Rob Neal, if I was that UVA fan from out of town, I don't consider a quarter acre lot or a place downtown. Now that new product with no maintenance sits 200 yards from every athletic facility. That's it from Neal. Rob Neal, damn good. John Blair, I promised your comment. Thank you for the kind words earlier in the program. But as to the question about these townhomes, I think we need a concrete number. How many new housing units have been constructed in Charlottesville in the calendar year 2024? I would love to hear that number. You can't evaluate whether any of these townhomes will matter unless you know the actual number of units being constructed in the city. Fantastic point from John Blair. Fantastic point from John Blair. You get these

fantastic individuals' photos on screen? Yeah. You're so good, Judah. Doing a damn good job today. Douglas Smith, welcome to the program. Mark Stapleton, welcome to the program. Nick Poncelin, welcome to the program. I'm sorry if I'm butchering your name, Nick. Bill McChesney sent you an image. Do you want to get that out? They will park. He says this is permit parking. I sincerely ask this question. If you are local and you can afford a million plus, would you buy there? When you could buy a million plus in Ivy, on Rugby, North downtown. Oh, Bill McChesney, deep throw, push, offering you some insight.

These have garages, Bill. These have garages. Oh, nice. And we need to highlight the amenity effect. This is a point that our number one in the family has made many times. a citizen or a buyer of this kind of magnitude, this kind of wealth, they drive what's called an amenity effect, where they change the amenities that are offered,

services that are offered, food and beverages that are offered, around where they live. They gentrify the providers that offered around where they live, they gentrify the providers that are around where they live. When you have a neighborhood full of wealthy people, you're going to have service providers that cater to what the wealthy in that neighborhood want. It's called an amenity effect. And that's how local mom and pop businesses get gentrified as well. That's fair. Anything you want to add to this? Jack of all trades, jack of all wits. I value your opinion. Not right now. I'm getting photos. Let's see.

Here's a follow up point I want to see on this. Rogers project in Woollen Mills, I hope Rogers is watching this program. Rogers project in Woollen Mills where he's taken an existing structure and he's going to keep it and complement it with three additional houses. 1,500 square foot cottage type houses with unfinished basements that are going to sell in the high sixes he anticipates. That project or 303

Alderman Road. Those two may be your first to market with the new zoning ordinance. I want to see which one's finished first. I think they all know the community is going to be watching them extremely closely. Extremely closely. And I think we have now a blueprint or a barometer for any in market or out of market developer to say, holy bejeebus, this is what we can do, and this is the money we can make, which could conceivably drive speculation to levels of expense that we have not seen.

Oh, man. Anything else you want to add? Or should we go to the next topic? We can go to the next topic. Lower third on screen, my friend. What is it? Oh, and Janine Hu said, your contributions have been absolutely wonderful of late. Philip Dow, thank you for retweeting on Twitter. We've got the reaction to the storefront vacancy.

Oh, the storefront vacancy? Oh, the storefront vacancy? Okay, this is a respond and react from yesterday's show. Do you have that article up? I know it was from yesterday. I think it was from NBC 29. Oh, let's see. If not, I can paraphrase. Yesterday, 29 News ran with a story

quoting the Assistant Director of Economic Development in City Hall, saying that the vacancy rate in the city of 4.7% is nothing to be worried about. I pushed back on that saying in a strong economy, the vacancy rate is less than 1%. And I said, that's 4X what the vacancy rate was prior to COVID during a strong economy. We're 4X greater our vacancy rate now than we were in 2019 when the economy was crushing. I gave it some thought today on the think tank, and this is what I was thinking about on the tank. Does the tenant matter?

We can go on the downtown mall and say, oh, some of the storefronts have been filled. But if some of those storefronts have been filled by the parks and rec department that was moonlighting a city hall when a flood hit city hall, when some of those tenants have been filled by CRHA, when some of those tenants would have been filled by what's the hope operation that's run by the city I should have looked at the sign is it Operation Hope I think it's like a a rehabilitate

not rehabilitate what's it called when you take someone that's faced time in the slammer and you help them re-assimilate into the community? There's a phrasing for that. I'm drawing a blank on it. Anyway. Anti-recidivism?

What is it? Come again? Recidivism is like the rate with which people go back to committing crimes but i don't know if that's i'm talking about there's a storefront under the market street parking garage the storefronts in the market street parking garage are owned by the city and where basheer's taverna used to be next to the wedding dress store there is now a storefront that's managed by the city that helps people re-assimilate, rehabilitate, re-enter society. Job placement, consultation, etc.

So this is what I was thinking about. You tout a 4.7% vacancy rate not being a big deal. It's 4x higher. What are you doing over there, by the way? I was looking for the article. Okay. And the storefront that you're talking about. 4.7, yeah, right next to the wedding spot.

A 4.7% vacancy rate. Yeah. And a tenant roster that now on the downtown mall has parks and rec, Charlottesville redevelopment housing authority and this operation, I forget what the operation is called. My point is this, does it matter? I think the type of tenant matters is my point. One kind of tenant will drive economic vitality. Other tenants close at 5 o'clock and aren't open on the weekends. If we start filling empty or vacant storefronts with city-run divisions that close at 5 p.m. and aren't open on the weekends, is it a net positive?

Right. A center building on the downtown mall and the city filling Bashir's Taverna with a rehabilitation re-enter society storefront. And the Parks and Rec Department, that this is not a net positive. Yes, it impacts vacancy rate. But it doesn't help in any way the downtown mall. Fair. So we should push back on all statistics. Yeah, I agree with that.

I think that's all fair. And yeah, I agree that having places that are only open during the day, having restaurants that can't survive opening longer hours. I know it was disappointing to me to see some of the places that were no longer open throughout the day,

walking around the mall for the same reason you're talking about. You're walking by a bunch of places that are closed. What's the appeal? Home to Hope. Home to Hope is what it's called. The city's Home to Hope program is located at 105th Street Northeast inside the Job Center. Home to Hope serves clients using authentic lived experiences to impact and inspire time-served individuals by introducing resources, providing peer support, and advocating for fairness, thereby advancing our community.

I love this organization. I got no beef with the organization. What I'm saying now is going to be manipulated by somebody saying Jerry's throwing shade on Home to Hope. I'm not throwing shade on home to hope. I'm not throwing shade on home to hope. I love the concept of the city providing a, what is it called? A time introducing resources to time served individuals. That's work smithing right there. These are folks that did time in jail. My point is this. You have a storefront next to the Ting Pavilion that is attracting folks

and everyone deserves a hand up and a second chance, especially if they're rehabilitated, to the downtown mall that have served time in the slammer. Right next to the Parks and Rec's department and half a block away from the Redevelopment and Housing Authority. And all three of those counties filled vacancies and not empty storefronts.

But is that a net positive for economic vitality downtown? That's my point. And I'll catch heat for that. I think it's a good point. I will catch heat for that. But it's a point that must be made. Yeah. John Blair on LinkedIn. Notice that both of the projects you're mentioning, Rogers

Project and 303 Alderman Road are four unit and six unit projects. Notice they are not ten plus unit projects. As you and Judah know, that keeps them from the inclusionary zoning provisions. If you truly want know, that keeps them from the inclusionary zoning provisions. If you truly want the nightmare for the housing advocates, it is the following. Three or four small projects like this per year with 750,000 price tags are built, but literally no projects

of 10 or more units are built. You're not adding enough units to affect demand at all, but you've destroyed the ability for projects that would have a demand side effect to be built. That's better than I can say. Yeah. That's better than I can say. And now I go to my Gmail, I search inbox, affordable housing, I use it as a search function, I scroll down to the email that I sent to myself. There's got to be a better way of doing this. I need a notepad. You emailed yourself a note?

Yeah. Could be a better way of doing this, right? That way I can have it at my disposal. I need to put it on my Mac, on my... I can't even find it now. Stuff you do on the fly during a talk show. Oh, I found it. Affordable housing requirements in the city of Charlottesville. 10% of units on developments that are greater than 9, so 10 plus. 10% of the units have to be affordable for 99 years at a 60% AMI. That doesn't pencil out. You do a project that's 10 units or more, 10% of that project has to have a 60% AMI tenant for 99 years. How do you even do that? I'm curious.

You can't do it. What the hell is that right there? I wish we could have put that in the Market Street cam. That was a hell of a tank. It was a tank going down Market Street. No doubt. You can't do it. It doesn't pencil out. That's Mr. John Blair's point. Would you have to retain

control of it yourself in order to... It's a nightmare. No one would do it. 99 years. Mr. John Blair's point is you're just going to get a bunch of threes and fours and fives and sixes below the ten and they're all going to come on market at $750,000 plus per unit which has just created an amenity effect and further gentrified the community.

Next headline, if you could read it on screen. Read it on air, my friend. Kevin Higgins has got a comment. I think the question is how AI will eliminate jobs and how that will impact the ability to continue to buy $1 million town homes. It's like the tsunami that everyone started at on a beach before they realized what was happening. Affordable housing is a great question, but I think we prepare for AI as a bigger one. It's going to affect real estate in a huge way.

I'll push back on that. I think AI is uncharted territory. We don't know where it's going to go. I think the impact of artificial AI is a little further than we anticipate. And I think AI is still going to create wealthy, wealthy individuals that are going to want to live in awesome areas like Charlottesville. folks that understand opportunity in business and see opportunity out everywhere are just going to be malleable and pivot into the opportunities that present themselves. You're doing the eyebrow raise here. Who does the eyebrow raise like that? You're doing the Dwayne the Rock Johnson right there. Look at Judah doing the Dwayne the Rock Johnson.

Why the eyebrow raise, Judah? Push back. I want you to push back. I crave push back. I feel like we're in the nascent age of AI where we were one time with a lot of the

factory innovation. People thought, oh, we're going to make factories run more efficiently. That means that the people working at the factories will be able to make more money. And what ended up happening is a lot of those people ended up getting fired because now you can run the factory with a tenth of the number of people. And I feel like AI may seem like

a godsend for certain things, but I think eventually we're going to start seeing jobs. People are going to hire one person to punch some stuff into an AI generator and do what they had ten people doing before. It's called a bank ATM.

It's called the ordering kiosk at McDonald's. It's called Grubhub. It's called Uber Eats. What's the point you're trying to make? Technology is always advancing. And technology is always going to chew up, spit out, destroy, murder and kill human capital because it's more efficient and it's cheaper. But when we got bank ATMs, people pivoted into other stuff.

Did it screw the window teller that was aging that said, do you want them in large bills or small bills? Yes, it did. But did that next generation that was going to fill a bank still figure out a way to work in finance? Of course they did. Fair enough. Did it screw the person at the register that said, can I take your order, please? Or do you want to supersize that Coke?

Yes, it did. But did it create a new generation of workers that were able to design and develop and build and install kiosks and storefronts all over? Of course it did. We just pivot. I'm less worried about it. But I understand why people are worried about it. Yeah. What other headline are we missing?

Let's see Market Street versus Court Square Parks you got the photo? look at this photo that Judah took from Court Square Park look at this hold on this is the park

with the courthouses you got the lower third on screen? you're doing an amazing job today. I think I need to get the, just a second. Court Square Park, it's got a bench that's been picked up. How strong do you have to be to pick up this bench? Hold on, I'll have it screened in a second. It's got to be multiple people that picked up this bench.

There it is. That did this to the bench. Could one person do this? Maybe it would... Would it have to be the Incredible Hulk? The Undertaker? Would it have to be Dwayne The Rock Johnson? I think with a little elbow grease, you could manage that one person. But taking a steel bench,

picking up, moving it, and lifting it? Is it on screen? Yeah. Look at the screen, viewers and listeners. Make sure we have that right lower third on screen too. I'm sure you do. How long has this been there? I'd say it's been there for two, at least two weeks. This is right in front of the courthouses.

It's just to the side, yeah. Of the courthouses. Yeah. Someone picked up a steel bench and put it where? Where is this over? It's like a... This is along the parking on...

What's this resting on? They're like stone benches. Concrete benches. How has this not been repositioned to where it should be? I mean, you can see the other one is on the far side. This was on the near side. The attorneys?

The Commonwealth attorneys? The judges? I saw somebody yesterday sitting on the stone bench with the metal bench behind them. Did you take a photo of that?

No, I didn't take a photo. But, I mean, I've thought about trying to move it myself, but, I mean, you know, I'm guessing that the reason it hasn't been moved is because everybody has come along, seen it, and thought,

that's not my job. The reason it hasn't been moved is because it's heavy as duck. Quack, quack, quack. One would imagine it is. Okay, that's the reason it's not my job. The reason it hasn't been moved is because it's heavy as duck. Quack, quack, quack. One would imagine it is. Okay, that's the reason it's not been moved. I mean, I'm pretty sure. Throw it on your back, putting a bench back where it goes by yourself?

I'm pretty sure I could manage it. It wouldn't be easy. Just take some, you know, you have to wiggle one side out, wiggle the other side off. That leads us to believe. It's doable, but. Ask this question. Court Square Park versus Market Street Park.

Which is the worst park? You want to answer that one? Which is the worst park? That's a tough one. In one park you've got benches that have been picking up by Hulk Hogan, Sergeant Slaughter, The Undertaker, Rey Mysterio and the Luchadores, Dwayne The Rock Johnson.

Along with brick walkways that are crumbling and areas that should be grass that are just dirt and leaves. It used to be Sandersville. And now still usually contains some number of homeless people. An eclectic contingency. Definitely. Sometimes welcoming, sometimes unwelcoming. Leads us to believe which is the most underachieving or, egats, the worst.

I would say Court Square needs the most work. Court Square is a catastrophe. I agree with you. At least Market Street Park can say we're a block of flat green grass in an urban environment. It could use some more trees, maybe. At least its

benches haven't been incredibly hulked onto other benches. I think it's because they're bolted down. They bolted down? I didn't see that. They recently pulled up some of the benches that they had in Market Street Park, and they re-sodded one area with grass and set up some concrete that they could bolt the benches into.

Well, it looks like they need to bolt the benches in Court Square Park. Yeah. The cobblestone is cumbersome at best. Yeah, you can't bolt it into a brick that's... McChesney, Mayor of Magentire, neither of those parks are tourist attractions anymore. I would say that's correct. Now they're asking the city residents and taxpayers,

give us your feedback of how to improve the parks. Start taking care of them. That's my feedback. Don't let people sleep in them. Keep people from boozing and... I mean, can you really prevent somebody from smoking weed in the park anymore? Not really. Not really, right?

But is it fair to say you could prevent them from drinking in the park? Open canister? Yeah, I mean, if you catch people, but that means you've got to have somebody patrolling the park. Basically you're saying both parks, including the parks where people go in front of the judges and the lawyers about breaking crimes, go ahead and smoke the weed and drink in them. Yeah. Do you want to hire a cop to sit at the park? Okay, policeman. Do you want to hire a cop to sit at the park? Okay, policeman. Do you want to hire a policeman to patrol the park?

I mean, we all know the issue with Market Street Park is not going to go away. What's the issue with Market Street Park? People come from Haven and hang out at the park. You're saying the park is a hangout? It's right across the street from the Haven. I'm asking, the park is a hangout? It's never going to change. Yeah, it's a hangout. I mean, I know when I used to walk Liza that way, I knew exactly where I would find people. Think about you every day. Alright, so the advice we're offering, keep the parks

clean. Keep the benches off of each other. Bolt the benches down. Judah says I have to take off the suggestion list, telling folks not to smoke weed and drink alcohol in the parks. You can go up to them and suggest that, but I don't know if it will stop them. My barometer for how often the parks were checked out back when I had Liza was how long it would take them to refill the doggy bags. Because when they'd run out, people were letting their dogs do their business all over the park. I mean, that's why I would always,

every time I'd go buy one of those things that had them, I'd grab a couple, put them in my back pocket. That way, if I came across one that was empty, I wasn't just letting Liza go wherever she wanted and leaving it there. She was such a good person. Fantastic human being. One of the best human beings I know.

But as I was saying, my barometer for how often those parks are checked out and cleaned up was how long it would take them to put in a new roll of dog bags once they ran out. And sometimes it would be a week or two. Which tells me that they're not regularly coming to the park, picking up trash, doing whatever, making sure that the park benches are not sitting up on other park benches.

And their Parks and Recs department is literally a block over. The Parks and Recs department is a block from Court Square Park. I don't know if that's where the type of people that would be checking this thing out would... That's where their bosses are? Yeah. And you're saying that bench has been in that position for two weeks? Yeah.

Last headline, Judy B. Wittgower, Jack of all trades, Jack of all wits. Fantastic human being, best human being, one of the best human beings I know. What do you got? Austin, Texas. All right, this is a quick one. This is human beings I know. What do you got? Austin, Texas. All right, this is a quick one. This is from Deep Throat.

I'm curious about this. Austin, Texas made a push for electric buses. Does that sound familiar? Very familiar. Capital Metro in Austin, Texas is slamming the brakes on an ambitious goal of transitioning to an all-electric bus fleet, citing problems with the range of battery electric buses. Austin voters were promised a transit system with exclusively electric vehicles when they authorized a tax increase in 2020 to fund the Project Connect, the largest transit expansion in the city's history.

Zero-emission buses are required and don't blast hot exhaust in the largest transit expansion in the city's history. Zero emission buses are required and don't blast hot exhaust in the faces of people on the sidewalk, they were promised. Honestly, we thought and hoped that the technology would progress a little faster than it has, Cat Metro CEO Dottie Watkins told this media outlet. The biggest downside of a battery electric bus today is its range. The diesel buses can run from early morning until past midnight. A battery bus only runs about eight hours before it needs to be recharged, creating tough logistical hurdles and scheduling routes. Yeah, I can imagine. Make it make sense. Make it make sense. What is the number one goal, the number one objective or mission for a public transit system?

Get people from A to B. Get people from A to B. Efficiently. And on time. We're going to prioritize tin cans that make the efficiency of the routes worse. Because they're better for the environment. I'm all for a good environment and a great environment. But do we realize that the only people that are getting screwed here are the folks that are on the financial margin that need the public transportation? When you have electric buses and they cannot run because they don't

have range, it's not the folks that have cars that get screwed. If anything, they are better off because they're not encountering buses on the roads. The ones that are getting screwed are the folks that need the transportation that can't afford the cars. And now they can't get from point A to B on time and efficiently. Well, that's only if they can't get the routes going, like you said, efficiently and on time, it sounds to me like this would be an everybody problem because in order to make sure all the buses are running efficiently and on time, based on if you're trying to keep the same schedule, it seems to me you'd need, I don't know how many

extra buses, but you'd have to be able to cycle the cycle through the buses on a, you know, a fairly, uh, regular basis. You'd have to take, you have to take a bunch of the buses offline to charge them. And, uh, so let's say you've got, let's say you've got 16 hours worth of the buses moving around the city. You'd probably need double the number of buses, right? There it is. Which would cost us more money. Very well said. How about this paragraph? Deep Throat. Make sure we highlight this paragraph. Are you ready? Mechanical problems coupled with challenges and procuring parts and doing repairs mean battery electric buses are often unavailable for service. In the year 2022, almost 52% of e-buses were down on average in 2023

the number of vehicles out for repair improved to 50% of the fleet being down from what? 52? it's so bad it's hysterical that's so bad, it's hysterical.

That's progress. Well, Jerry, that's progress. We have a 4.7% vacancy rate. It's only four times higher than it was during 2019 during a strong economy. Oh, and of those vacancies, we're filling the storefronts

with the Redevelopment Housing Authority, the Operation Hope, the Home to Hope, let's take folks from the slammer and put them back into society and have them hang out on the downtown mall by the shops, the jewelry stores, and the restaurants, and the bars and music venues, and by the Parks and Recs Department.

All those storefronts that are now full are going to close 5 o'clock when the downtown mall just starts going and they're not open on the weekends. Yeah. Make it make sense. That's the last edition of the talk show. Judah Wickauer was on point. I was so-so today.

Thank you kindly for watching us. You guys have a good afternoon. Today y mañana, tomorrow at 10.15 a.m. It's funny to say that. Today y mañana, tomorrow at 10.15 a.m. It's funny to say that. Today y mañana, tomorrow at 10.15 a.m. Not today. Today y mañana. Thank you.