The I Love CVille Show With Jerry Miller! - Charlie Rogers Joined Alex Urpí & Michael Urpí On "Today y Mañana" On The I Love CVille Network!

Episode Date: March 28, 2024

Charlie Rogers, Chair of The Charlottesville Scholarship Program, joined Alex Urpí & Michael Urpí On “Today y Mañana!” “Today y Mañana” airs every Thursday at 10:15 am on The I Love CVille Network! “Today y Mañana” is presented by Emergent Financial Services, LLC, Craddock Insurance Services Inc and Matthias John Realty, with Forward Adelante.

Good morning everyone and welcome to Today y Mañana. I'm Alex, this is Michael. We're very excited to have you joining us this morning. It's a bit of a chilly morning. Yeah, but spring's kind of on its way here. It's slightly warmer, it's nice and wet. I hear the weekend weather's going to be nice, maybe in the 70s. It'll be nice, like a sunny Easter. Yes, so that's good news coming. So don't worry about it. I feel like the weather is going to start to heat up. I sensed it even though it rained yesterday evening

as I was heading back to my car from work. It was drizzling. There was kind of that scent in the air of the spring rain as opposed to winter rain. It was like a warmer rain. Winter rain is kind of that one you get outside and you feel in your bones. You're like, man, I feel

damp and cold. This kind of just felt like it was a warmer rain. Because winter rain is kind of that one that you get outside and you feel in your bones. You're like, man, I feel damp and cold. But this kind of just felt like, oh, it's just raining. Exactly. You put on your rain jacket and you're like, okay, it's not too bad. Exactly. But it's still a good day, a good weather to grab your traffic on Wednesday, get to a cozy place, and watch some Today in Mignogna. And especially because we have a great show lined up for everyone today. We're going to be joined shortly by Charlie Rogers.

He is the CEO of Innovative Software Solutions and the chair of the Shartsville Starship Program. We'll talk some CSP. We'll talk some navigators. We'll talk some vision. And then later in the show, Michael and I will cover some finance topics, including using your 401K for a down payment on your home, financial literacy, and some positive financial news. Good. We want some positive news.

Yeah, well, every time I have Nick on, he always talks, you know, he's Debbie Downer. I know, yeah. Sometimes he would be like, oh, I got a good stat, and then you listen to the stat. I think it was like for the Christmas show. Yeah, like a positive statistic. And we're like, that's actually negative statistic. That's actually bad. Yeah.

He finds a way to make good things bad. I mean, I guess that's the nit factor. That's the nit factor. But we're going to do the opposite today and we're going to beat the Goldilocks. Exactly. How about that U of A baseball team? We're not talking about basketball. We're talking about baseball. Well, U of A baseball had a good stretch. Yeah.

They won 2 out of 3 against Wake Forest, which was the number 17 in the country at the time. We saw them win, what was it, 6-2? Yeah. Against William & Mary. That was fun. We were losing 2-0, and then we had a six-run inning. Yeah.

We were including an inside-the-park homer. Yeah, well, no, you call it a Little League homer because it was like two errors. That's a Little League homer. Some guy hit a bomb, and then there was another guy who hit a ball where we were sitting but we had decided to move earlier. Well, a certain person. Yeah, Nick said, oh, let's move over

here because of the sun. And I said, watch. Someone's going to hit the ball over there and they literally hit it. Well, they ruled it a foul which I still think was debatable. But it would have been nice to catch that. If we were there and caught it, they would have ruled it a home run. I know. That's what would have happened. Nick tossed the team a run. But we'll just have to nice to catch that. If we were there and caught it, they would have ruled it a home run. I know. That's what would have happened. Nick tossed the team a run.

But we'll just have to forgive him for that. Thankfully, he's not listening this morning. He's with clients. We don't have to have his questions. Yeah, we can say anything we want about Nick. Let's be honest. We usually do anyway. We do anyway.

But it was a fun time to see the game. Yeah, we're aching to get back. I mean, the scoring runs like crazy, which is great. I mean, it makes it a more exciting game. It does. I mean, we did really well against Pitt. I mean, Pitt is not a great team, but we swept them this past weekend. Oh, you can't do better. And then we won.

I think we won on Tuesday as well. Yeah. So that's a great... No, I mean, like you said, the scoring runs, there's still a little bit of a worry about the pitching. Like you said, they're scoring runs. We're still a little bit worried about the pitching. We're giving up a lot of runs. I feel like Coach O'Connor, he's a good pitching coach. In other words, I would be more worried

if the pitching was good, but the offense was not good because his expertise from what I understand is pitching. It's always nice that if you're a little shaky in an area where you know your coach can improve and teach your players, it gives you some hope for later on in the season

because you have time to get better. Yeah, but hopefully the improvement starts coming a little sooner rather than later because at the same time, you don't want to necessarily be winning games like, what were you telling me, like 12-10? I think we won like 12-11 this week. Yeah, you don't want to be on that threshold because God forbid your offense is like, oh, we had an off day, we only scored five runs and you lost 12-10. It's a little curious. You don't want to be on that threshold

because God forbid your offense is like, oh, we had an off day. We only scored five runs and you lost 8-5. You're going to be happy. You don't want to put pressure on the offense to feel like they need to score 10 runs every day in order to win. It's one thing to be winning 7-4 and you're like, okay, the pitchers are doing great, but it's not terrible.

Let's try to keep it on the double digits, guys. Exactly. Thank you to are doing great but it's not terrible but I mean let's try to keep it on the double digits guys exactly exactly thank you to Jara Lucrecia Morales muchisimas gracias for watching the show this morning always appreciate it

one of the great owners of Sombreros right here on the downtown mall I think Sombreros is like one of those places that like if you ask people

like one of their favorite Mexican restaurants they'll always say Sombrero yeah it's a hidden gem. People either don't know they exist, or once they

know that they exist, it's like they've immediately vaulted to one of their favorite Mexican restaurants. Exactly. Just a great shout out to them. Appreciate it. Of course, appreciate being here on the I Love Seville Network set. Appreciate our great partner at Emergent Financial Services

and, of course, our great partners of Emergent Financial Services and of course our great partners of the show at Credit Sirius Insurance, Mattias Realty Forward, Adelante. Of course appreciate all of you joining us. Be sure to send us any questions, comments. We will be sure to read them on air and yeah, we had some

great people that tuned in last week to hear a little bit about the eligibility. We had Stephanie from Charlottesville Scholarship to hear a little bit about the eligibility. We had Stephanie from Charlottesville Scholarship Program talking a little bit about the April 1st deadline to apply, how easy it is to apply at seavillestarlership.com.

I should remember that. Don't steer people wrong. I don't want to steer people wrong. Seavillestarlership.com, I was right. This week, we're super excited to bring on to the show Charlie Rogers. He is the CEO and then the founder of Innovative Software Solutions, local company. Well, I should say local company with national reach here in Charlottesville, Virginia.

I like it. But also the illustrious chair of the Charlottesville Starship Program. So, Charlie, thanks so much for coming on this morning. Thank you for having me. It's always love having you on. We had a, thanks so much for coming on this morning. Thank you for having me. No, it's always love having you on. We had a blast last year when you came on. And kind of just wanted to bring you back to talk about, I think, probably the other half of Shartfield Starship Program that we love, which is the Navigator Program. Oh, absolutely. But first, for, like, new viewers, maybe tell us, like, a little bit about yourself, how you first became involved with CSP.

Right. So just a little bit about myself. As Alex said, my name is Charlie and I've been in Charlottesville for almost 30 years. Met my wife in Charlottesville. We had our nine kids in Charlottesville. Wow. I'm part of several boards, one of which is CSP and then also own a local company, Innovative Software Solutions. And I know everybody heard blah, blah, blah, nine kids. But I have an amazing wife. And every day I go in from 8 to 5 and I make sure I hurry up and get home at 5. And as she says, she no longer has to deal with nine kids by herself. Now I'm 10.

So the reason why I got involved with CSP is the impact that someone had on my life when I was a first-time college student living in the projects, trying to go to college. No one in my generation had ever gone to college. And I went to college and spent a semester there and got to a point where I felt like I needed to quit. I needed to quit because I had, things were getting tough. I had no one to talk to. I had no environment in which I could say,

hey, what's going on? Why is this? You know, and but when I eventually did graduate and it was because someone did come into my life and they provided some counseling, they provided some resources that I needed. They gave me some idea of what it takes to get through a college. And I remember when I graduated, I said, what that person did for me, I want to do for as many people as I can. So that was my inspiration to get involved with, at that time, I didn't know it was going to be CSP, but that was my inspiration to get involved.

And then once I graduated and started working at GE, and I still had that desire, but that desire really hit on the forefront when I started my own business. And I realized that that person who came into my house that one day and helped me and started that path has allowed me to be on a journey that has me sitting in my own business. I said, now is the time for me to do it. I think about all the people you employ. Just think of the impact that one person encouraging you has spread out to so many people that now benefit from you owning, having started this company, which

would never have happened. It would have never happened. In fact, if that person hadn't come and counseled me, I wouldn't have nine kids either. My kids are very grateful for that person who came to, because that kind of led me to interning at GE and meet my wife here. Wow. It's a beautiful thing. Yeah. And so then you were led, then eventually the opportunity came to join. Then the opportunity came to join CSP, which, you know, it was a great day, really, because I remember sitting down at the table with the Dan chair, and he was explaining CSP. And the whole time he was explaining CSP, the light bulb was going through my head thinking, this is what I've been searching for, an organization that's been around for almost 20 years, that's helping kids that's coming out of high school. And a lot of these kids are first-time graduates, just like me, right?

So I'm like, those are younger, better-looking me's. A lot of me's. And I said, you know, in the heart that was in CSP to help these kids get into college. And what I love about CSP, and we're probably going to talk about this, is that CSP doesn't just provide financial packages, but it also provide a care package. And we could talk a little bit about that. Absolutely. Yeah. Let's talk about this. Absolutely. Yeah. No, let's, let's cover that. Cause I mean, obviously we, we talked with Stephanie last week, right. That, you know, over the lifetime of a scholarship, it's $1,300. And it just, each time you renew, it goes up by 500. So it's 2,000, 2,500, 3,000, 3,500. Right. So it's, it's, it's great. I mean, it can be, it can be deferred if you go to community college. It's just, it's such a flexible program. And really, we work with kids to make sure that if they do run into a tough spot in that first semester, it's not as though, oh, well, too bad.

Oh, absolutely. I mean, there's literally a committee of the program that's there to say, okay, what can we do to help you renew and get that next year of the scholarship. I mean, what we've learned and what CSP has learned is that love, love that has no conditions, it bridges social and digital divides. And that's what CSP is doing for these kids. It's bridging divides that they've had to deal with most of their lives, financial divides, social divides, digital divides. And by having access to $13,000, having access to a team that's there to support them, being their biggest cheerleaders, it gives them a chance, a reassurance, a confidence and encouragement to go to college. And just like me, when I got to that point where I wanted to quit they can always look

back maybe not on the family because a lot of times again they're first generations. Sometimes yeah their parents or siblings have not gone to college sometimes they're literally the first person ever in the generations of their family to go to college but they can get in those tough

situations and then they can reach back on a phone call, or text, or email, or in person, to someone that's been there where they are, knows what they're going through, and can give them some counseling. Absolutely. And like you said, one of the beautiful things you touched on is every scholar that's paired with a Navigator. You're part of the Navigator program yourself. What's kind of been your experience as a Navigator?

It's an amazing experience because it's allowed me to relive my college life, for one thing. But what's amazing about it is that some of the same issues that I was dealing with when I was in college, the college kids are dealing with even now. And I know my particular navigator that I'm thinking of right now went off to Syracuse. And I'm not going to hold that against her. It's forgivable.

It's kind of forgivable. I almost forgave her until she offered me a T-shirt with Syracuse on it. Then I said, OK, then you push it. But she, in her first days in college, was dealing with some of the things that I had to deal with. Give me an example. I had never been to college, right? So I had no idea what college was like.

I grew up in the projects. First day of school in the projects, you come to school, you look that. I mean, you have nice clothes on, the brand new shoes. I mean, so my first day in college, I went there with this nice two-tone jeans. They weren't styled back then. Had this nice shirt on, had my coat and everything. And I get there and I see everybody with shorts t-shirts and just the first two minutes in college I realized I'm in a different environment that I've never been in I have no idea about this environment someone needs to help me along and the same thing was the issue with this navigator right not only I mean not just but this this this student is that they were going to Syracuse, right?

First of all, they would be out of Charlottesville where they grew up, right? And then also they were in America for only like eight years of their life. So then they're going to this whole new environment where they know nothing. And so being able to be connected to that navigator before she entered college and say, look, this is what's going to happen. OK, first day of school, don't go by that nice dress. Don't go by the nice, no, no. You're an adult now. Right?

And you're paying them, actually, to teach you. Right? So you need to focus on your education. But just having that little conversation with that person probably saved them a headache just getting into her first day in college. I think. But we are able to touch on many topics like that. There's times where she had a situation where she had two or three exams in one week and also wanted to go to a Syracuse football game. And she was just confused, and we talked about it.

And I gave her some ideas of how I handled situations like that when I was in college, how I ranked my major class higher. I always wanted A's in my major classes. But in the other classes, you want to make sure you get at least a B. You want an A. And I just went through how I strategized and some of the things. So that, I think, helped. At least I want to think it helped her.

It didn't convert her from Syracuse to Virginia, but I think it's helped her. It helped the Syracuse picture. Yeah. No, I mean, and sometimes, I mean, it's basic things. I'm thinking like some, because I've been lucky enough to serve as a navigator too. And sometimes it's as simple as,

okay, because, I mean, all the scholars that go through the program, they're amazing, high-achieving kids, right? And I think sometimes there's the temptation that when you go to college,

right, to be like, okay, well, I'm going to take 16 credits this semester. I'm going to take 16 credits this semester. I'm going to nail this. I got straight A's in school. I can handle, you know, four-hour class, four four-hour classes. But sometimes it kind of takes someone who's been through that to be like, you know what?

Take. You only need 12. You only need 12. Take the 12. And then next semester you can need 12. You only need 12. Take the 12. And the next semester you can take 16. Exactly. So take it easy. Don't panic.

If you get, if you're used to, don't be like me. Like if you're used to straight A's and get that first B on a test, don't have a complete nervous breakdown. That happens. You're like, you're entering a new level of competitiveness. What was expected in... You think about most high schools, right? Your teacher tells you, this is your homework. It's do that sweet. Do this. Do that.

You wanted to... My dad always says, you wanted to college. And first class, he says he never forgets first day of class. He sits in there and the professor's like, well, I'm sure you all read the syllabus and read the first chapter because that's what it says to do. Let's get right into it. And you're looking around and you're like, what do you mean? I had to know what to do before the teacher told me? Yeah, exactly. It's a different level of responsibility once you kind of jump into college versus like high school.

Yeah, you're still getting told everything to do. You're on your back. College is like, you're on your own. If you don't follow these directions, that's your problem. It's a different responsibility jump to go from high school to college. A lot of people are lucky that their parents, if their parents have gone,

their parents kind of let them know, hey, just so you know. But if your parents haven't gone to college, they don't know to tell you that. And that's where navigation helps. And you guys touched on some really good points. In self-directed learning, so self-directed learning, a lot of the students, none of the students, basically, understand self-directed learning.

When they're in high school, the teachers tell them, hey, we're going to have a test. We're going to study these days together, we're going to have a test. We're going to study these days together. We're going to read this book. And they give you all the details from A to Z of what you need to do to be prepared for that day. Whereas in college, it's self-directed. You know that, hey, in two months, you have an exam or you have a midterm or you have something, but you may not talk about it until that day that the exam come about. So you have to sit down and plan, okay, before I take the exam, I have to have these three books read, you know, plan that out. So we did talk about some of those things.

It's pretty amazing. I love how you touched on the A, B, C one. We had that conversation. That's why I was trying to ask her to sort based on what's your major, what's not your major. Okay, you know you can, you know, you may not be able to get an A in everything because in my case, this person had like 16,

no, 19 credit hours her first semester. So I hadn't had that lesson with her. And she was a double major, but, but you do touch on many, many things that as navigators, it's kind of fun reliving that. It's like having a grandbaby, right? You know, when you were in college, it's like you're the child, but then you have a grandbaby and you can, it's more fun and you can talk to them and uh and you don't have to live it yourself but yeah um being a navigator is as experience as much as we try to give experience to the student it's really it touches us right because um for me it it allowed me to give back um me to see other people have some success and me be a part of helping that person have

success in a tough environment. I mean, like I say, self-directed learning environment is much different than high school. You're away from family, you're away from friends. And so navigation is definitely beneficial for both me and the student. And the student. So what are some of the typical things, like for people, if someone's out there saying, okay, this sounds great, I would love to be here, what are some of the typical things that you're kind of expected to do as a navigator? What are typical things or frequency with which you have to do them, stuff like that? Well, so that's a great question.

Typically with a student, when you're a navigator, you try to keep in contact with them at least once a month. In my case, I try to keep in contact with them almost once a week in the beginning, because in the beginning, when they first start school in their first semester, it is the hardest time for them to get acclimated to everything. But you try to talk with them at least once a month. And that can be via text or email, phone call, in person. So I try to always manage when that person will be back in town. Or if I'm on business travel and I'm going to be in that area,

I try to have lunch or something like that so that you can have some face-to-face. Today we do a lot of virtual, that you can have some face-to-face. Today we do a lot of virtual so you can have virtual conversations with your person. But your job is to, one, help them navigate college in those scenarios, but also, two, keep them apprised of what's going on in CSP

so they know when they need to resubmit their applications for the next year, what scholarships are available, so that you can continue not only supporting them with care, but also continue supporting them financially. Absolutely. Yeah, that's a key element, because sometimes, like, depending on, just obviously not every student has a different personality. So depending on the student,

sometimes they may not buy you a Syracuse T-shirt. You know what I mean? But to be there for them, to communicate, because sometimes, I mean, I've had some students wear Navidata where I just kind of checked in monthly, sometimes heard back, sometimes didn't write. But then there was a time when they needed some help with the program, and they knew that if they reached out to me, I would answer.

Exactly. So that it was kind of like, did they know that you're there? And the time will come where they're like, ah, you know what? I have a question about the program. I'm switching schools, and I'd like to see if my scholarship money can follow me there. And they knew, ah, you know what, I should probably talk to my navigator.

That Alex guy who called me there. That guy keeps texting you. You know, he might know something. You know, one of these days. You know, especially because of the renewal, that it's, you know, March 1st every year, it's great to just ping them a couple times

and say, hey, just so you know it's March 1st, because you know what, they're going to be busy they're going to be, because spring break usually hasn't started yet, so they're probably having those last couple tests before spring break and they might slip their mind like, oh man I've got to just, it's a super easy renewal

but they just have to remember, oh yeah, I got to renew to get my extra $500 on top of my renewal. Absolutely. Which is a key element of it, but it's a great, it really is a great opportunity. David Riddick, thanks for watching

the show, says, Charlie, great advice. Great advice. Thank you. We can see why his scholars love him as their navigator yeah this is fantastic so one of the other things I wanted to touch on

is obviously you know CSP we talked a little bit about Stephanie last year about how one of the beautiful things about the Charlards for Scholarship program is that having started as a $250,000 gift from the city, it's now grown through great stewardship to over a million dollar endowment,

which we've used. It's not just that it sits there. I mean, that endowment basically funded an increase in the size of the scholarships a few years ago. We were able to boost the size because we said, you know what, we're raising money that pays for the scholarship, but let's do a little boost using the endowment.

And I know since you've been chair, you've had a vision for where CSP can go in the future. So maybe speak a little bit about where do you see the Starship program in the future? Yeah, so, and like you said, it started in 2001 with that $250,000 from the city council. So they wanted to get a city council prop. Yeah, absolutely. And we've been able to grow that to about $1.1 million in the endowment.

At the same time, we've been able to distribute $961,000 in scholarships. Right? And so 188 students have come through our system, and 89 have gotten their degree or their certificates or whatever they needed to continue their career. And we have 35 students currently in the system. And as you mentioned earlier, they're going to get about $13,000 in the totality of their four years with us. And we started looking at what does the next 10 years look like? What does the next 15 years look like? And we started looking at

a vision where these kids, when they become a part of CSP, can come out of college debt-free. So we're starting to look at plans where, you know, that endowment, this 1.1, how do we get that endowment to 2, to 3, so that we can then have a return from that endowment that can help support what we raise and actually fully fund kids from Charlottesville and our local kids to go to college. In order for that to happen, we need the whole community to come together. Absolutely.

We need people to step up to be navigators, people who have been to college, who have who can who feel like maybe they were first time college students that can come back and give back to the community. We need navigators. But we also need people who are interested in. And, you know, they've graduated. They have some success in their life. And they have, you know, resources that they can share because their heart is for the community and for the kids. So we need people who have that kind of heart to also go to that website you mentioned, sevillecholarship.com, and become a part of this family. Because I think if we all come together and build an ecosystem that can properly nourish our local kids we'll find that we have some superstars that maybe you know they're coming up from a background that's a little hard but we can get them we can marry their educational aspirations with true opportunity yeah right you know right now a lot of those kids feel like they're divorced of opportunity.

I don't have opportunity. We can come together and give them opportunity. So I'm excited about the 1.1 and taking that $250K to that 1.1. Great job. But we still have a lot to do. Because we want that day where kids graduate from Charlottesville High School

and five, ten of them getting total rise to UVA, VCU, JMU, and whatever. And it started from this conversation today. So we need people who are interested in helping us get to that vision to reach out to us. There are several new ways, right, to get, like if you're a foundation or you're a corporate, like a local company, there are ways, right, to get, like if you're a foundation or you're a corporate, like a local company, there are ways, what are some ways that you can be particularly involved beyond just saying, oh, you know, I'll donate a couple here or a couple there? I mean, other than, you know, giving Alex like, you know, hundreds of thousands, make sure he's taken care of it,

keep this show going. But what we do have is we have named scholarships where a business or family can create a scholarship that completely takes care of one kid or two kids. And there's more we can give you on that. I think I have a limitation of like a few minutes here. I don't have three or four hours, right? Yeah. So I can't go into that totally. But with NAME scholarships, we have a plan

that allow it to be perpetual. And that scholarship, once you give it, we can then have it take care of a kid going through college, or two kids, depending on which plan you choose, to go through college from, you know, freshman year to senior year and keep that continually going.

So we have those kind of plans. And then we also have, you know, where you can ad hoc donate as well. But there are many options to donate. And if you go to seavillscholarship.com, we would definitely love to hear from you. Absolutely, yeah. I mean, there's a way to donate right on there but also there's a contact form where you can kind of reach out to us and say

okay what are my options can I do something like a star there's a great local company that said hey we want to fund three kids for the time being it's kind of an ad we want to fund three kids over the next six years to go and learn that if their dream is arts or design, we want to be involved in that.

We have some like the Preston Pointer scholarship where a family said, here's what I'm going to do. I want this to be perpetual. And we worked with them. Okay, what do we need? What kind of installments can we do to say that this scholarship will go forever? You will never run out. Never run out. And a great example of that is, you know, Charlottesville is a great technology hub.

There's a lot of technical companies in Charlottesville. It would be nice if some of the technology companies come and say, hey, look, I want to support five kids that's interested in STEM going to college. And so how much do we need to donate for it to be perpetual? One-time donation that could be perpetual to support five kids that's interested in STEM, that's interested in computer science, that's interested in design or whatever.

And so we are definitely open to those type of things as well because that's how you can take kids that don't have opportunities today and give them opportunities tomorrow. Absolutely. Absolutely. So there's so many ways to find out more. Like Charlie said, SevilleStarship.com has pretty much all the information you need. Again, if you know kids that are going to Charlottesville High School that live in the city limits or adults that work for the city or for the school system, the city school system, the application deadline is April 1st. And so you can still apply. You can still apply for it. And that can be done online very easily.

So even if you're just finding out about this today and you're like, oh man, in three days, how can I do it? You can do it in three days. Oh, absolutely. You can do it in less than 24 hours. Oh, absolutely. Pretty much.

It's that easy. So definitely encourage people to check out sifostarworship.com. Charlie, thank you so much. Thank you for having me. It's always a pleasure and an inspiration to have you on. And thanks so much for coming. So same time, same place next year. Gotcha have you on. Thanks so much for coming.

Same time, same place next year. Thank you. Take care. Maybe a little earlier next time. This way it gives people more time to apply, right? Oh, yeah. Next year we'll probably do some of these shows in February. January, February.

Because the typical application deadline is March 1st. Ah, okay. But we moved it to April 1st this year because there was a delay in federal student loan forms that some kids needed to verify their income. So we wanted to give them more time because they were getting some of their information later. But April 1st. Although there's never a deadline to be a Navigator. Literally, you can just go to Star Wars. First, you can reach out to me. If you want to reach

out to me on Facebook or put a comment saying you're interested, we can definitely get you that information. But you can also reach out through the email on seabirdstarship.com and say, hey, I'm interested in being a Navigator. Tell me a little bit more about it and we can get you those applications as well.

Pretty great stuff. It was great to hear how scholarships really help in our youth. Oh, absolutely. It's important. There's been a lot of impressive kids that are kind of following in Charlie's footsteps. Yeah. And it's good to have someone along the way too, especially if they don't have anybody, to help kind of like you said, guide them or navigate in this case.

Guide them towards like – it can be daunting. Like I remember the first time I went to college too. It was like your first semester, you're just kind of like deer in headlights. You're like, I don't know what's going on. And if you make that mistake, like I had you and Pops and Nick who had gone before me to be like, no, don't take that class. It's going to be too hard. Or like don't take this take this many credits you kind of were able to ease your way in you kind of go into like all right let me maybe i should take statistics oh maybe i kind of was one of those like all this work is a lot of these kids let's face it they were high achievers yeah in

you know what i mean they're competitive smart kids so the like that personality your your goal is gonna be like, oh man, let me like... Well, it's like, maybe it's a comparison that people might not know, but it's like going from AAA baseball to major leagues.

You'll see so many young kids who are doing great in AAA and then they go to the majors. And man, it's like they go from bad in 315, AAA to bad in 200, the majors. And the pressure is

to get through that. Exactly. Can you get through that? It's nice to have somebody say like, hey, listen, you're going to figure it out. Don't worry about it. Versus, like, you're going there, and you're like, oh, man, maybe I wasn't that good. Maybe I really wasn't that small. I got a 75 on this test. I've never got a 75 in my life. What do I do? You know, the Alex effect, you know? I didn't have that effect. I got in that stuff all the time. It's like, oh, 75. I got worse.

You know? So, it's like, ah, 75, I got worse. You know? So, it's like, it's okay. Nick and I were on the other boat. I thought Nick and I did this but I don't feel like I'm all the way on. Exactly,

exactly, exactly. But yeah, no, it's such a great program so I really would encourage people to check it out to be sure.

And now we'll talk a little finance. Yeah, I know you wanted to talk about a couple things. Yeah, I kind of wanted to cover today because I had seen an article in the news about this, but it's funny

because it was an article about something that has actually occurred. We've had people ask us these questions, which is should you use your 401k for a down payment on a home? So apparently more and more people are doing this. They are pulling money out of their 401k.

And now we're talking pre-age 59 and a half. In other words, you're using it to purchase a home, but you're not actually already in retirement. Okay, so is there a penalty if you... Okay, there is. That's the key. So what happens is you have to deal with a 10% penalty for early withdrawal as well as income tax on what you withdraw from your 401k. So when you add it together, assuming – I mean the effective tax rate for most people is probably somewhere in the 20%, 22% range. So imagine that plus 10%.

So basically, I take out $10,000. I have to pay $3,000, rough estimate, in taxes? In taxes, yeah. So I'm only getting $7,000. So you're only getting $7,000. That is the key right there. And so what often happens is that you need a certain amount for a down payment. And let's say, I think there was some great math on this

in the article that I was looking at. And let's say, for instance, let's say that you need $20,000 down payment. Right. That's very typical. So if you do about, if you do like, you know, if you're doing a 20% down, that's a $500,000. Actually, no, it would be more than that. It's not even that big of a house, home purchase, right?

But let's say you need $20,000 as a down payment. You know, you can get it with 10% down or something like that, right? You think, okay, I just need to pull $20,000 out of my 401k. And people know, okay, yeah, I'll be foregoing the future growth of the $20,000, right? Instead of that growing, it'll be in my house. But, hey, maybe my house will go up in value a little bit, right? The issue is you have to deal with federal tax withholding when you withdraw. And many times, depending where you're withdrawing from this 401k, that is not optional.

In other words, that depends very much on what 401k plan you are dealing with there are going we have encountered some 401k plans for clients where if you want to pull money out even if you intend to then put it into another retirement account if you do an indirect withdrawal to then put in they will automatically withhold the 20 federal tax you can't say no i'll pay it next year. So in other words, you say, okay, I want 20,000. Well, if you say, I want 20,000, you're not going to get 20,000. You're going to get 20,000 minus 22%. So if you needed that for the down payment, you're like, oh man, how much do I actually have to take out? Well, the answer is, for instance, in this hypothetical, if you needed a $20,000 down payment, you would actually need to withdraw $30,000, $33,000 from your 401k. In other words, if you withdraw $33,000, $20,000 is what's going to show up in your bank account.

The rest has been automatically withheld. So now you think about it. Okay. What, it's not 20,000, that future growth that I'm missing out on. It's $33,000. And this, I mean,

this is an example that they, they took the 33,000 and said, what happened assuming 7% growth and by the time

you're 85, so this is a 30 year old, so at the time you're 85, I mean a 30 year old so the time you're 85 I mean you're probably a little less if you want to 70 75 yeah that money would have grown to 1.2 million big 33 33 thousand dollars at 7% a year for 55 years yeah is I mean that's that's a little optimistic on both ends so to be fair like that the 7% is not true I mean 8% was a little optimistic on both ends, though, to be fair. The 7% is not too – I mean, 8% was the average. We use 6% very commonly because we tend to lean on the more conservative side.

But it's not a crazy number, the 7% average. Maybe 85%. I mean, you're probably not. The 85% is pretty old. But, I mean, if you go to 75%, I'll bet you that's still around $750,000. Because if you assume it doubles every 10 years, it's probably somewhere around $700,000. So, in other words, what your real question is, is am I willing to fore around $700,000. In other words, what your real question is is am I willing to forego $700,000 in the future

for $20,000 now? That's really where it comes into play. It's also a sacrifice of money because you are losing that $13,000 that you wouldn't necessarily lose if you decided to withdraw 20 years in the future when you're over 59.

Well, in the future, you'll still get hit with the income tax, right? But A, your income tax rate will be lower but not the 10% penalty. And that's the real kicker because the only ways to avoid that penalty are twofold. One, you have to already be 59 and a half. And two, if you are, I believe, 55 and you get laid off or fired, you could then take money out of your 401k without the penalty. But we're talking – in other words, a lot of people who are doing this are not even 50 yet because this is a – in other words, because of the competitive nature of the housing market, they're saying, well, can I be more competitive if I make this down payment? And the issue is you are getting hit with some very serious taxes and penalties when you make this decision. And you have to make that decision whether it's worth it.

Exactly. Exactly. So the – now what I will say, what I wanted to encourage people that there – it's not as though there are no options for using retirement savings to make a down payment. What you need to really consider, particularly if this is still several years away, is do I want to be putting money in a 401k or a Roth IRA? Or if you have a Roth 401k option. Because Roth money goes in post tax. In other words, you are not, you don't save any taxes going in, but there is neither a tax nor a penalty to withdraw the contributions. Now there is if you do an IRA, correct? If you do a traditional IRA, you're in the same boat as a 401.

But if you do a Roth IRA or a Roth 401, they are designed so that you can do something like this because the contributions, whatever you put in, can always be taken out as well as a certain portion of the earnings. If you are using it for a first-time home purchase and you've had the Roth IRA for five years, it doesn't mean the money you took out has been in there for five years. You just have to have started the thing five years ago so this is a great tool if you see a home purchase in your future this is a potential tool

that you need to be looking at in other words you need to weigh the 401k which is I'm saving money on taxes now and I might get a match versus the Roth IRA or if your employer employer allows it, Roth 401K. Now, Cass, the question about the Roth 401K, does that also have an employer match or no? Depends on your employer.

Typically, they do. If your employer is doing a match, I don't believe they can exclude Roth 401K. In other words, if they're offering a match on a traditional 401K and they also offer a Roth 401k, I believe they have to do the same match. Now, your match will be in a different account, and you won't be able to touch that. You will be able to touch your own contributions, which go into the Roth 401k portion. Understood. So that's the TV. It's just not all employers offer.

That sounds very rare. Well, yeah, the Roth 401k option is more rare than the traditional 401k option. It's becoming increasingly common, but not all employers offer the Roth 401k option, in which case you then need to look at a Roth IRA. Now, that's certainly still doable. You just won't get a match for putting into a Roth IRA. But as long as your joint income is below $200,000, and I think it's like $130,000 for a single filer, as long as it's below that, you can put money into a Roth IRA. And you can put $7,000 a year at this point.

$6,500 if you want to count it as last year's. And then you can do another one for this point. $6,500 if you want to count it as last year's. And then you can do another one for this year. So there are ways to kind of, what I think people need to look at is how do I put together the jigsaw puzzle and maybe who do I need to talk to to help me put that together. So that maybe I'll forego a little bit in match

and or tax savings by not doing a traditional 401k but I'm going to want that flexibility by having money in a Roth IRA so I can use it for that down payment. If you're already in this boat, in other words, you don't have any Roth money,

there are some options. You really need to look into whether you'd want to do a loan out of your 401k because you can borrow against your 401k and not pay the penalty of the taxes but then you have to pay whatever the interest is and you do need to pay that back or you will start getting hammered so the assets well you can't you can invest them they can remain invested they can remain invested you're not limited there but of course you will be able to take those out

if you have a loan against them. That's a great question by a jury in the studio. Yeah. So you can't double dip. You can't say, hey, I've got a $50,000 loan against my 401k and I also want to take money out of my 401k. That's not going to happen, right? Got it. And there are limitations there. The moment you fall

behind paying that back, they're basically going to treat that thing like a withdrawal. And so now you've got interest, you've got income tax, and you've got penalties. So you need to be very careful with making that decision. It is a possibility. You'll see some articles online that will recommend that as an alternative. I would say you need to be very certain that you can make that make do. I would say that's a last resort if you're like, I have no other alternative, but I don't want to get that hit.

So you need to be very careful with that. So those are kind of the two things really that you're looking at and the issue is you just need to be very careful because you're going to be, that penalty is just such a killer the penalty and the withholding because I would say 8 times out of 10 you cannot delay withholding

to the next year, in other words you can't say I want my full $20,000 and next year I'll pay the taxes on it. Eight times out of ten from a 401k, if you ask for $20,000, you're going to get less than that because they're going to automatically withhold your federal taxes.

And then you have to hope for a tax rebate if that was too high of a number. And was this something that was common like maybe 10, 20 years ago people withdrawing from their 401k pay for houses or is this something that people are starting to do now? It tends to crop up in times when people are having trouble coming up with the money. That's what I was wondering because we've read articles about people also basically because of inflation, people not being able to afford groceries or rent, they're pulling out of their retirement accounts, whether it is just for basic expenses.

Oh, yeah. Last year saw a record number of withdrawals from 401Ks. So, I mean, granted, if you're doing it to pay for groceries, it's probably because it's your last resort. You know what I mean? And I wouldn't, depending on how the math shapes out, I'm not sure I would say go into credit card debt rather than that because probably if you're doing it, you're already in credit card debt. It's hard to know sometimes because at the same time, newer generations sometimes don't think like we do. They're more like, no, I still want to go on that $5,000 vacation. I'll just use the 401k to do it.

Exactly. I got this free money in the 401k to do it. Exactly. I got this free money in the 401k. Whereas in the previous time you would have been thinking like, no, I'll keep the saved money for cut your vacation in half. Exactly. So a lot of that depends on the circumstance. But we did, there were a record number of withdrawals from 401ks last year. But I think the

question of whether you need to do so to make ends meet is a different one because your alternatives there are credit cards, payday loans there are no good like if you need it for groceries there are no good options there if you need it for a home version the purchase the question is is this is this now then the right time for you right so you just need to be very careful with that decision. And I would say if you have time, begin to look into those Roth IRAs because that's going to be a much better tool for you than a 401k or a traditional IRA. So let's say someone has a bunch of money in a 401k.

Can they move some of that money from a 401k to a Roth IRA without getting a penalty or no? Not without paying taxes. But they won't get a penalty. So depending on how it works, that's a good question. or no? Not without paying taxes. But they won't get a penalty. Depending on how it works, that's a good question. For the 401k to Roth IRA, I'm not 100% sure. If you can

go from a traditional IRA to a Roth, you just have to pay the taxes. It's called a Roth conversion. The issue there is there are some limitations. If you decide to do some of it, you may not be able to limit how little you do. In other words, sometimes if you go to do a Roth

conversion, you can't just say I want to take $5,622 and convert it. You may be forced to do more than that. And it'll be on top of your current income. So that's a tricky one as well, but it is a possible option.

I wasn't sure whether someone was like, oh man, I have for example, $80,000 on a 401k. I want to cut it, but I don't want to pay that penalty. Can I convert $40,000 to a Roth and then pay the taxes and then decide to withdraw it so I don't have to pay the penalty.

There are some things you can do there that you have to be careful about. But, yeah, there are possible ways to avoid the 10% penalty. You'll still get hit with the tax. You'll always get hit with taxes. You can't avoid taxes. Yeah. You can't avoid taxes. But the issue is you're taking money that was growing tax-free, paying taxes on it, and then no longer having it invested where it was.

And don't forget, when you do a Roth conversion, you've now paid double tax on it. In other words, you are basically paying tax and the future growth of that. If you then pull it out, future growth of that money is taxable. So if you do the Roth conversion, then take the money out of your Roth. Now you've made it taxable money again. So it is a tricky solution there. But it is one. And that's a good point.

That's something for people to look at, particularly if you have it in a rollover IRA But it is one. It is a good, and that's a good point. That's something for people to look at, particularly if you have it in like a rollover IRA or something like that. So anyway, that's something I've been seeing pop up and we've had some questions about. So just do be,

do be cautious because, and then do the math on that because I think, I think what trips people up is they may know the penalty and the taxes. They don't realize that the withholding means they

need to withdraw much more than they think they will. You can't take the $20,000, get the $20,000, and then pay taxes next year. You're going to have to pull out $33,000 to get your $20,000. And I can't even imagine if you need to pull something like $40,000. I mean, you're talking about $60,000 of flats. It's a very big number, particularly

if you need that money for the down payment. That's something to keep in mind. Thankfully, you're talking about like $60,000. It's a very big number, particularly if you need that money for the down payment. Yeah. That's something to keep in mind. Thankfully, you had pointed out some news to me that people are becoming more financially literate. In what sense? In the past. They had done a recent survey, and more people were answering questions directly. Well, that's what they say.

I'm not sure how much I believe it, but that's what the article said. So particularly, I think the number of people who answered the questions, these were questions of what is average life expectancy, knowledge about the markets, different types of investments, so forth. People who had a financial advisor answered much better. They were much more proficient on theicient. Well, because it's very informative. I know we've had some clients who knew nothing about the market. Every time they come and talk to Xavier or Alex, they were asked questions and questions.

Xavier would kind of go over it. They were like, oh, wow, I feel like I learned so much. This is one of the benefits. You kind of get a nice little teaching lesson on exactly what's going on with regard to markets and investing. Exactly. Which I mean I consider an important part of actually having a financial advisor. I mean if you have a financial advisor and you come out of the relationship with them after like 10 years and you still know absolutely nothing about what on earth they do for you, that advisor is probably not doing a good job.

You should know something. He should be able to explain to you, at least in layman's terms, what he or she is doing for you. It would be like if you have a mechanic and after you've been to this mechanic for like 10 times and every year you go to them

and they fix something in your car and after 10 years you're like, I have absolutely no to them and they fix something in your car. And after 10 years, you're like, I have absolutely no idea what my mechanic ever does to my car. I have no idea. Well, the problem is sometimes it's terms that you have to learn terms.

Because you can go to a mechanic and say, the carburetor mixed with the ignition. No, but he should be able to explain to you, hey, there was a problem with your steering. I fixed it. Yeah, but the way they explain it sometimes is you have to take a step back. Because sometimes when people are more knowledgeable, they don't realize that certain terms don't register in your head.

I mean you could be explaining what exactly you're investing, but if you're using like yield and dividends, people will be like, oh, yeah, what that is. That's how the advisor would explain that. Yeah, but people also have to say, oh, what's that? Oh, exactly, what's that? Because if they don't ask for an explanation, sometimes your assumptions you people not okay okay like your assumptions well i guess they understand what you're talking about yeah that's true you know i mean sometimes it has all the mechanical yeah the carburetor was a worker so we had to read and you're like yeah okay okay okay and then it's like you leave and then i haven't if you ask the question wait what's that what does that do

okay where does that connect but then which which hand would you trust more the moment if you ask the question he explained it controls your steering or the one or the guy that just spits out more terms that you don't understand because you're going to feel like one of them like okay yeah i trust this guy the other one you're going to be like he does he just not want me to know what he's doing yeah but you hopefully you have the wherewithal to understand what's like you know jarnigan is that the word jarnigan what's the word where it's like someone's spouting nonsense? Jargon. Jargon.

There you go. Yeah. Speaking like jargon. It's like, wait a second. I feel like all these big words are coming up. Yeah. But not lots of sense. But that's what I'm saying.

I'm saying like a good financial advisor and a good relationship with them should lead you to a point of having some kind of knowledge. If you've been with, that's what I'm saying. If you keep going back to the same mechanic and 10 years later you keep giving him all this money to fix your car, but you never, you know absolutely nothing. You don't even know if he's fixing your steering or your engine. All you know is that you give him money every year and every year your car seems to be okay, right? You're probably not going to be thrilled with that relationship, right? And it's a similar

thing with a financial advisor. After 10 years, if you're like, I know nothing about stocks and bonds. I have no idea what I'm invested in. For all I know, he's got me all in cash, right? Then it's probably not a good relationship, right? You should have, you should come out of it with some kind of basic knowledge. Because these aren't tough questions. I mean, some of the questions were like, what's basic life expectancy? So if you're working with a financial planner, and your financial planner is like, don't worry, if you do this, you will make it to basic life expectancy.

Am I out of money? Yep, sorry. If you think that's 95, and it's actually 78 for women. 79 for women or 77 for men? It might even be 68 for men. No, it's not 68. It's the average life. No.

I think it's like... You already failed the test. I already failed the test. I already failed the test. No, you're right. I think you're right. Yeah, 78. I was off by a number.

So it's 78 for men, right? If you are thinking that when your financial advisor says, yeah, we run your financial plan and you're good till average life expectancy, right? If you think he means 95 and he actually means 78, you're on two different – you've got a big problem. Because you think your money is going to last you until 95. And he thinks – he's like, well, on average, it will last you until about 78. Or if you know that at 78 is life expectancy, but you don't know that the standard deviation of that is 10 years. In other words, half of people will live 10 years more than that. You'll be like, oh, well, most people die at 78.

Well, no, no. There's a 50% chance that you will actually live to 88. And if your money is actually running out at 79, then the fact that your financial advisor tells you that you're going to make it past life expectancy is kind of a meaningless, it's maybe not as comfortable. So you should have some kind of basic knowledge. Unfortunately, a lot of people actually failed that one

they thought 85 you were even worse you got 68 you're not going to have a terrible life we die young we die young I mixed up what number came in front

but in other words if you think it's 85 although I would be on the better side. If I think it's 68, I have to worry more. No, because then you'll know it's the reverse. And you'll be like, oh, I'm more than good enough. Oh, okay. I'm going to take 68. But the problem is a lot of people think it's 85.

Most people apparently thought it was $85,000. So they're thinking that their plan makes it to life expectancy that it's $85,000 when it's not. So it's just important to know that information, learn about it, talk about it, make sure that you're learning from your financial advisor. So yes, that was a... I think we covered two important topics. I think the first one is probably a little more important than the second one. But that's okay.

Well, the first one can be a big mistake. The second one though can lead to a series of little mistakes that would make you feel a lot less comfortable than you really are. Yeah, I think it's just getting to a little know about exactly what your financial advisor is doing with your money. It's never – it's always – it's your money. So it's good to ask questions of like, okay, what exactly is the plan here

and what exactly have me invested? What's the, you know, like you said, the financial plan. What's the end goal? When can I retire?

How long will my money last? Like these are important questions that, you know, you should probably try to get answers to. Exactly. And also learn

the life expectancy. Exactly. Don't think it's 68. Yeah. Or 85. Or 85. it's 68. Or 85. Or 85. It's actually 78 for men. For men it's actually a little higher.

It's a little higher for women. Women love longer than men. Maybe they don't do as many crazy things. Someone's got to do the oil rigs and stuff like that. Exactly. Exactly. Alright well this has been a great

show. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed talking some finance with you. Had fun, of course. Always good to talk to Charlie and get his story. And next week, also going to be a great show. Yeah, look at the guests. Four great guests.

Two sets of them. So we're going to be joined next week by Michael Slon and Christine Fairfield from the Oratorio Society of. So we're going to be joined next week by Michael Slon and Christine Fairfield from the Oratorio Society of Virginia. They're going to be coming back. We were talking Beethoven's Ninth. I know. You and Nick must have been, what's it called? Seven Heaven when you heard that.

I mean, we have seen it before, to be fair. But, I mean, it's been like what, eight, nine years? It's been a while. And we saw it at theK Jr. Performance Center at Charlottesville High School. It's not that it's a bad venue, but the acoustics are not good.

So where is it going to be? Old Town Hall. How are they going to fit everybody? Apparently they're going to fit it. Wow.

So I'm looking forward to that very much. Because last time they did it there because they didn't think they Because I think they didn't think they could fit, but maybe this

year. Yeah, all the violins are going to be looked on like this. It'll work. I'm looking forward to it tremendously. So we'll talk that. And then Leanne Clement and Bridget Eversol are going to be coming out from Charlottesville Opera

to talk about their two performances. They're going to have The Elixir of Love. It's the opera by Donna Zetti. Very funny and enjoyable opera. And then The Music Man is going to be their musical for this year. And that's coming up soon, like June and July, right? I think so.

All of these are coming up soon. I think it's going to be May, June, July. Wow. So if you like music, you are in for a treat. Good music. If you like good music. You are in for a treat this summer. Very cool. Alright. It should be an exciting show next week. It is. It's going to be a lot of fun. I don't know who's on with it.

Nick and Xavier are going to probably fight to see who's on. Exactly, yeah. Because they both enjoy coming on with Michael and Christine and Leanne. So it's going to be a lot of fun. So, Joy, having you on. I'm glad to be back. It's been a while. I think it's been maybe over a month. Yeah, a few weeks.

A few weeks. I appreciate everyone who tuned in today. Dr. Elizabeth Irby was able to tune in today, so thank you for watching. She's got to watch. She's got to watch. Thank you everyone, of course, for tuning in. Appreciate it. David Riddick, thanks for your great comment.

Lucrecia, thanks for watching this morning. Grady Rudolph, thank you so much. Shannon Connors, thanks for watching this morning. Grady Rudolph, thank you so much. Shannon Connors, thanks for joining us. Rosalia de Rosalia Cordaro. And me at Mitchie, thank you for watching the show. Always appreciate all our great viewers. Be sure to send us any people you would love

for us to feature on the show. Always love to feature great non-profits or entrepreneurs here in the area. Of course, thank you to Judah behind the camera, making us look good. The I Love Siebel Network set, Emergent Financial Services, to our great partners,

Mattia Sion Realty, Credit Series Insurance. Thank you all for watching. Thank you for co-hosting with me today. Happy to be here. We look forward to seeing you all next week. But until that time, as we like to close it out, hasta mañana. Good job, fellas.