The I Love CVille Show With Jerry Miller! - Should City Council Have Saved Reid's Grocery?; City Street That Changed The Most From 2020-25

Episode Date: January 8, 2025

The I Love CVille Show headlines: Should City Council Have Saved Reid’s Grocery? City Street That Changed The Most From 2020-25 City Street That’ll Change The Most From 2025-30 Eljo’s Has Been Sold – New Buyer Starts 2/10/25 If UVA Paid Real Estate Taxes, This Is The Impact Entrepreneur Travis Wilburn’s Positive Impact Mortgage Rates Hit Highest Level Since 07/2024 DOJ Sues 6 Top USA Landlords For Price Fixing Read Viewer & Listener Comments Live On-Air The I Love CVille Show airs live Monday – Friday from 12:30 pm – 1:30 pm on The I Love CVille Network. Watch and listen to The I Love CVille Show on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, LinkedIn, iTunes, Apple Podcast, YouTube, Spotify, Fountain, Amazon Music, Audible, Rumble and iLoveCVille.com.

Good Tuesday afternoon, guys. I'm Jerry Miller. Thank you kindly for joining us on the I Love Seville show. It's great to connect with you, our second show of 2025. And today's show is pretty loaded with content that's local for you, the viewer and listener. Take a look at the screen if you're watching the program and you'll see the topics or the headlines we want to cover today. I'll give you a brief rundown of what we're going to cover for those that are listening in their car or enjoying this in podcasting form. I want to ask a question that is circulating on the interwebs, circulating on Reddit, circulating on the social media platforms of your choice. And a lot of folks are asking the question, should city council have saved REEDs? Should local government have stepped in and saved this institutional grocery before its impending closure that has been foreshadowed for an extended period of time? Certainly the closure of REEDs has been foreshadowed for an extended period of time. Certainly,

the closure of Reed's has been foreshadowed since the back end of the pandemic. I want to unpack that topic. Should local government have saved Reed's Grocery and look at it even more broadly, what is the role of local government as it applies to the business sector in our community, helping, assisting, etc. I want to talk on today's show, which city street, which street in the city of Virginia, as the city of Charlottesville, Virginia, has changed the most from 2020 to 2025? And then I want to ask you this question, what city street will change the most from 2025 to 2030, the next five years? That's an interesting topic for Judah and I.

The Thurstons at Eljo's Traditional Clothes behind Barracks Road Shopping Center have a new buyer. Very positive news for the new buyer the business has been sold which we're we're very excited about the new buyer will start february 10th 2025 we'll talk about that and we'll we'll we'll use that as a platform or as a a trampoline or springboard to ask what what what retail will look like in 2025 for successful retailers and for unsuccessful retailers. I want to talk on today's program, the impact of the University of

Virginia paying real estate taxes. Now, the UVA Foundation pays real estate taxes, guys, but the University of Virginia itself does not pay real estate taxes. And Michael Payne, and he's been kind of the ringleader here, Judah, the champion of this payment in lieu of taxes program for the University of Virginia. Michael Payne has tried to use his position on council to push the University of Virginia to start paying taxes of some capacity, and he's done it again over the holiday break. And he's tried to quantify the impact of those taxes as it applies to public schools.

Judah's going to put that in perspective for us today. On today's program, I want to talk about Travis Wilburn. He first arrived in Charlottesville in 2000. Interestingly, I first arrived in Charlottesville in 2000. Interestingly, I first arrived in Charlottesville in 2000. I believe Travis is a product of James Madison University, JMU. I've known Travis for nearly 20 years. When Travis was working as a sales executive for Bill Chapman and Blair Kelly's Seville Weekly as kind of the rainmaker or the kingmaker, the guy who came in and helped close the deals for the account executives when it came

to selling a print product. Today, Travis's impact on our community is pretty damn significant. And as we learned today, Travis's company, Stay Charlottesville, is now the operator of a six-room boutique hotel at 400 West High Street. And he's also the operator of the 200 South Street Inn next to South Street Brewery. So I want to put in perspective Travis Wilburn on today's program. I hope somebody that's watching or listening to the show will let Travis know that we're going to highlight his influence and impact on our community today. Also on the program, it looks like we have cut off on my Facebook page, J-Dubs. I restarted it. It should be going now. You restarted it? Yeah. Okay. And are we connecting on all other platforms? Yeah.

Okay. Just want to make sure. Also on today's show, I want to talk about the Department of Justice. This is a crazy story. The Department of Justice is suing six of the United States' countries, six of the nation's top landlords for price fixing. Six of the country's top landlords for price fixing. We'll talk about that today. A lot we're going to cover on the program. Judah, before I weave you into the discussion and ask you which headline is most intriguing to you, I want to give some love to Charlottesville Sanitary Supply. Our friends Andrew and John Vermillion on East High Street, a 60-plus-year-old business. Charlottesville Sanitary Supply has had a positive impact on our community.

And for more than 60 years, Charlottesville Sanitary Supply has been your sanitary supply source. Online at charlottesvillesanitarysupply.com. Support the businesses that you want to see survive another 60 years. And I certainly want to see the Vermilions with Charlottesville Sanitary Supply make it not just 60 years, but perhaps well past that, definitely well past that. Maybe when I'm even six feet under, which I hope to God is 60 years from now. Judah Wickhauer, if you can go to the studio camera and then a two shot, I'm going to ask you like I always do, which headline is most intriguing to you and why? My friend, the show is yours. I can't wait to unpack the Reeds topic of should local government have saved a business that was that

was struggling for the betterment of the community but i don't want to steal your thunder which headline is most intriguing to you and why i think that uh i'm interested in in i mean we it's a it's an ongoing long ongoing discussion whether uh whether or not UVA should be paying money, paying taxes on properties that it currently has exemptions for. And I think it's a discussion that's worth having. Logan Wells-Claylow, welcome to the broadcast. Thank you for watching the program. We will talk about that. The first headline, let's put that on screen if you could. City Council, should it have saved REITs?

You want to start with some compelling commentary for the viewers and listeners? I don't know if it should be saving individual businesses. Maybe a better question is should city council be doing more to help middle businesses? There was an interesting, someone made an interesting point about the fact that the middle business is struggling because it's not, it can't.

You got to explain what a middle business is first before you make that. That's what I'm trying to do. Yeah. So there are businesses that are cheap. Obviously Amazon, Walmart, places that usually large corporations that have economies of scale, they can spread across America and give everyone, you know, low prices. Then there are places where you get your, you know, your specialty items, not always necessarily specialty, but places like Whole Foods, Costco, World of, what's that place I'm talking about?

Ivy Road. There's the grocery chain. Foods of All Nations? Yeah, Foods of All Nations. That's not a grocery chain. That's local. Yeah, I know that. I'm not talking about necessarily grocery chains.

I'm talking about the different types of offerings. One of them is cheap. That's usually the bigger chains. One of them is specialty items. Foods of All Nations does a good job of having a good selection. They do a lot of good stuff. And obviously, they're not going out of business. So what is it that makes these middle businesses that can't do the cheap and can't necessarily or don't necessarily have a, you know. Value proposition.

Yeah. Is there a way to keep them in business? Isn't that up to the business owner to figure out a value proposition that they can provide their customers? Sure. But we've been talking recently about losing what, 185 years worth of institutional knowledge in Charlottesville because of businesses going out of business. Lumpkins is closed. Moose's by the Creek closed. Blue Moon Diner closed. Not all of them needed. Mel's Cafe closed. Reed's closed. Mel's Cafe closed because the founder died. Blue Moon Diner closed because the owners chose to retire.

Moose's by the Creek closed because the owners realized that their real estate was in limbo with the passing of a, I don't want to call him a slumlord, but frankly speaking, that's probably what he was. So they made a different decision. I don't think we can say the fate of Reed's, the outcome of Reed's is extremely different than the outcome of Mel's. It's extremely different than the outcome of Blue Moon Diner. The extremely different than the outcome of Blue Moon Diner, the extremely different than the outcome of Moose's by the Creek. Right. So was that lament just a kind of like waving goodbye to those places? Does none of it matter? Does it matter that they go out of business? The circumstances may be different between those and Reed's, but the fact of the matter is we're losing another longstanding Charlottesville business. Of the businesses that we highlighted, Lumpkins, Reed's, Moose's, Blue Moon Diner, Mel's, we're talking nearly two centuries of serving our community. Almost 200 years of serving our community, those businesses

combined. Yeah. Reed's closed because of a failing business model. The other ones closed not because of a failing business model. Yeah. I pointed that out. Reed's closed because it struggled to find its value proposition. The other ones, that was not why they closed. Right. I know. Reeds closed because it did not evolve or transform into the needs of a post-pandemic consumer. Okay. You disagree?

No, I don't disagree with you. You don't disagree? No, I don't disagree with you. You don't disagree? No. Okay. The value proposition of REITs, probably its most important value proposition, was the butcher. Was the butcher. Was there an opportunity to transform the business into more of a butchery. And less of a. Grocery retailer.

Perhaps. Perhaps. Right. Staying in the grocery business. Where you are selling goods. For pennies of profit. Is not a business model. That is sustainable anymore. Especially. With the internet Internet and big box stores

cannibalizing what Judah has called middle market businesses. Do we start taking bets on Market Street Market? Neil Williamson, welcome to the broadcast. Join us in the discussion. Viewers and broadcast. Join us in the discussion. Viewers and listeners, join us in this discussion. You think Market Street Market, which is literally right next door to where we are sitting right now doing our broadcast,

is in peril? No, I didn't say that. I'm just asking, should we start taking bets on it? I mean, ultimately, I guess, does bets on it? If, I mean, ultimately, I guess, does any of it matter? Do we care? Is it just a kind of, do we, do we say, okay, that was a bygone era where businesses could survive and thrive and that no longer exists? Do we just consign our cities to having food deserts, to middle businesses not working anymore? Or do we find a way to make them work, to help them work? So here's, I'll further set the table of this topic.

Should local government have saved REITs? Local government is working, local government is at the table with Anthony Woodard and Piedmont Housing Alliance with trying to bring a grocery store on the corner of what is that? Cherry Avenue and Ridge Street at the gateway of Fifeville, the former location of Kim's Market. Is it on the corner? Literally at the table of this development project local government. And some are saying

if local government is actively trying to build a grocery, bring, attract a grocery store to a historically black neighborhood, Fifeville, an underserved neighborhood, a food desert neighborhood, Fifeville, prospect. Why did they not offer the same energy or effort to a grocery store that's been around for what? Nearly 75 years, 60 plus years? What was the number from yesterday's show? I'd have to look at my notes. Yeah, I think that's close. Why don't

they do the same energy or an effort for a business on Preston that is also serving a multiple marginalized neighborhoods, historically marginalized neighborhoods. That topic is an interesting discussion. I am a staunch free market guy. I'm a guy whose firm has been in operation for nearly 17 years. That's crazy to say. Almost 17 years in May, I will have woken up every morning as a self-employed business owner looking to get out of bed, put my clothes on,

and figure out that day how we're going to make a living for team members like Judah and my wife and our two sons. And over that nearly 17-year period, we have constantly, and you've seen a lot of this as the right-hand member of the team, the transformation or the pivot or the multiple iterations of the business. From a business that initially started as an advertising agency to one that now does business brokerage services, has the most executive offices under ownership of anyone in the city of Charlottesville or Alamo County. We have the most, 24 of them. Venture funding for businesses looking to grow and expand, helping connect wealthy investors to the business owners that need it. This podcasting

network, right? So we've had to evolve. Unfortunately, the grocery model did not. If local government gets involved in the business sector, that's a Pandora's box of trouble. Because if you start helping one business and one vertical, then the other businesses that make up other verticals will want the same. Why aren't you helping us? Then there's also the issue of, are you preventing growth in an industry in a, you know, should REEDs have evolved? Look at what local government did with the downtown mall business owners that have restaurants, where local government said, we want a say in what your outside patios

and awnings look like. The types of umbrellas and coverings that you're going to use to protect your customers from inclement weather. That minor, I don't think it's minor. I think it was pretty significant. I think it was stepping out of line for City Hall to say that. But when City Hall said, we want to determine what your awnings and your shades and your umbrellas look like in your alfresco dining settings, that raised a ruckus so loud that the restaurant owners on the most important eight blocks in a region said, what the hell are you doing? Leave us alone. We're just trying to pay our bills. Now you're trying to tell us what our tables need to look like and our umbrellas are supposed to look like? You're already taxing us to death with the

meals tax. Interestingly, Fluvanna County is considering a meals tax now. For that county, I actually think the meals tax is a good idea because it could potentially alleviate some of the stress that flucos have with homeownership. Another source of revenue for Fluvanna County. That's a topic for a different day. The one interesting wrinkle with should local government have saved reeds. This is the interesting wrinkle. This is tied to food and water. This is tied to food and water and people needing it to survive. And some people having

no other source for food and water in a neighborhood that perhaps is most in an area that is perhaps most restricted with vehicle ownership or lack thereof. So the folks that are making the argument that city council, city hall should have stepped in and offered REEDs a lifeline, saved REEDs, either by advertising REEDs a little bit more, by helping REEDs from a tax abatement standpoint, by helping REITs from a real estate tax abatement standpoint, by helping REITs by doing a shop local push. This is what some of the folks are saying on the internet boards. They are basing that argument on,

this is what people need to live, food and water. And they're basing that argument on, this is what people need to live, food and water. And they're basing that argument on, local government is already involved with another grocery store as the crow flies that is probably, what, half a mile away? If that, as the crow flies? On Cherry Avenue, right? I've made the argument on previous shows that Alamaro County and Charlottesville City are huge advocates for housing affordability.

The city of Charlottesville has built the crossings, that building next to McDonald's and Wendy's, right? Right across from the county office building, right behind Millie Joe's where Millie Joe's used to be. The crossings is a transitional apartment building for folks that are house that were houseless offers them an opportunity to be in a house, an apartment as they transition up the housing ladder cost a hell of a lot of money to build the crossings. The city and the county bought a hotel, converted the hotel into housing for folks that are trying to transition up the housing ladder. And I've said on this program, if the city and the county were economically sound in judgment, they would have gotten involved with the purchase of Cavalier Crossing as instead of letting a Northern Virginia real estate investment trust, a REIT, purchase Cavalier

Crossing for pennies on the dollar only to put some lipstick on the bank and two and three X rents and basically creating a large population of Cavalier crossing and pushing them into maybe homelessness they were paying five or six hundred a month to rent a room can't pay five or six hundred a month to rent a room anywhere else except for maybe eagles landing maybe eagles landing we broke the news on the i love seville show that a henrico based real estate company, Levy & Co., purchased a majority stake in the villas at Southern Ridge. The villas at Southern Ridge. I own a condo there.

Rental property. Intimate knowledge of this deal. These folks got a steal. I've made an argument on previous shows, why aren't Alamo County and the city of Charlottesville looking to purchase existing housing stock, like Cavalier Crossing, like a stake in the villas at Southern Ridge, and utilize the existing housing stock to create these transitional housing environments for folks they want to help through their housing ladder climb from homelessness or houselessness into a roof over their head.

Or just keep them affordable. Or just keep them affordable. Instead, what the city and the county are doing is giving bridge loans to Habitat for Humanity to buy our trailer park. That bridge loan is going to come at taxpayer expenses, at least in the short term term until it's paid back. And not if it's paid,

if it's paid back and nothing is going to materialize for that trailer park for three years. And frankly, it's more than three years because they have to give those 63 families in that trailer park, 36 months of keeping the trailer park as is before they can do any remodeling or any construction yeah so we're probably looking five years or six six before that turns into anything instead of spending money on projects that are years away from materializing why not

purchased existing at a lower clip right so. So if I'm using that logic, city and the county, local government, are getting involved in the free market. They're already choosing. They're choosing to get involved in the free market. I mean, they're already choosing winners or, you know, or losers. Not to help losers.

Bingo. So if I make an argument that the local government should purchase existing housing stock to create housing affordability, doesn't that argument also apply to food and water? Good. Aren't Pavlov's needs food, water, and shelter? Am I being a hypocrite by saying, I sincerely mean this, answer the question,

viewers and listeners, answer the question, am I being a hypocrite by saying the Charlottesville local government and Alamo County local government should have purchased Cavalier Crossing or should have purchased these other housing structures that we knew, I knew were for sale. Others knew for sale instead of building something from scratch, but they should not get involved in saving reeds. Am I being a hypocrite there? Or is it completely different?

That's tough. I mean, I don't necessarily think that city council should have saved Reeds specifically. I think, for me, the better questions are, are they doing enough to help businesses like Reeds? And I don't know the answer to that. Are there ways that the city council could make a better environment for places like Reed's to continue thriving or to start thriving? Respect. Spencer Pushard, welcome to the show.

Bill McChesney says, no bailouts for local businesses. No bailouts. Derek Bond, who's a business owner, owns the melting pot and owns Moe's original barbecue. He says, of course they should not have saved reads. Neil Williamson,

the president of the free enterprise forum shares a link in the comment section of my personal Facebook page that creative destruction is part of business. I agree that creative destruction is part of business. But I will also make, I'll add to that. The creative destruction that is part of business gives the edge, the market edge, to well-capitalized, big box, economies of scale and vertically integrated entities. They get the edge during creative destruction. And that's what I'm worried about and why I asked earlier whether or not we're just is this just uh okay we're waving goodbye to whoever doesn't make it and then uh we lament the fact that uh you know everything is owned by Amazon um obviously that's not true right now but how long before we look back and say ah uh you

know we didn't help any of these little companies and now people from Henrico or big business came in to Charlottesville bought up all the land, bought up all the businesses and now we've got a homogenous all the old places are gone and it's just big box brands. Derek Bond says, stop bailing out businesses

and instead cut taxes across the board. That should be their only role in this local government. I am of that mindset as well. The excessive tax... I'll put this in perspective. We spend the holidays every year in South Hampton, New York. I like to call it on the show South Hampton, New York, instead of the Hamptons. Less bougie. We go to Irish bars and restaurants and eat out often during this period.

My wife and I, and I think I posted this on social media, my wife and I, because my in-laws were watching our two children, my wife and I were able to get a couple date nights. Frankly, day dates. Dates during the day. On one of the dates during the day,

we went to this place called Buckley's 2. It's an Irish bar. I had two beers. She had two beers. The two beers I had were craft IPAs. The two beers she had were craft IPAs. It was not happy hour. We were not there during happy hour. It was actually before happy hour. The cost of those four beers was like 18 bucks. A piece? No.

Total? Total. The taxes on the four beers we had was less than the taxes that I pay here in Charlottesville city. And the total bill for these four beers was six to $7 less than the total bill for four beers that we would have had here in Charlottesville, Virginia. It absolutely flabbergasted me. Wow. Flabbergasted me. The excessive tax nature of the city is only creating a gentrified city. And we already hear that the city manager

is already politicking or talking with the media, there goes Lloyd Snook, already politicking with local media that we're going to have to find some money for a budget that's increasing already. Where's that going to come from? It's going to come from more taxes. Eventually, we're going to have such an excessive tax meals, tax environment, real estate tax environment, personal property tax environment that the middle class won't be able to afford to live here. Forget the lower middle class, forget the working class. They already can't afford to live here. They already can't afford to live here. I love going to play, to work out or play squash over at the Borset on Ivy Road.

Much of the staff that works there is commuting from 20 to 45 minutes away. One of my favorite staffers is legitimately commuting 50 minutes to work. They had to close the club early because they were mindful of their staff's safety. And I said, why is it being closed early? And then I started thinking about it. These folks are driving 50 minutes one way

to get to work. Back roads. That's why they closed. Should reeds have been saved by local government? No, it should not have. The difference, and I'm going to answer my own question and explain why I'm not a hypocrite. I'm not a hypocrite when I say that local government should buy Cavalier Crossing, but should not save REITs, even though they both fall under Pablo's needs of food, water, and shelter. The difference is local government is not actively building grocery stores with local government or taxpayer money. Local government, however, is actively buying, actively building, subsidizing housing affordability or affordable housing. The crossings

is a good example. Converting a motel into housing is another good example. Giving loans to Habitat for Humanity for the purchase of a trailer park is a good example. And if they're already doing that, then they should become more efficient with how they do it. They should not, however, launch a new endeavor of spending more taxpayer dollars or raising the tax base on all of us to get into another way of trying to help the community, basically funding a grocery store. You disagree with me? I want to hear a sound

argument of why you should. I would love to hear a sound argument. Carol Thorpe, watching the program, Jack Jewett District. Cut taxes, reduce regulations, and red tape. Make sure you get her photo on screen. It's

nice to have the Queen of Jack Jewett in the mix. She says, cut taxes, reduce regulations, and red tape, and local government should stay out of it except to help evenly promote local businesses where appropriate. That's all. I agree. I agree.

I agree. Neil Williamson, many lessons learned from day drinking in the Hamptons, my friend. Many lessons. Some I'll save for some other shows. Philip Dowell, thank you for watching the program. Diana, I always mess up your last name. Is it Sabitri?

she disagrees, vehemently disagree she says it's not affordable at all Charlottesville and she says this is turning into an SHIT place oh she's saying it's not affordable at all

which are you saying, which is not affordable I'm curious I'm curious of what you're saying she also says the restaurant on the same block it's not affordable at all. Which are you saying, which is not affordable? I'm curious of what you're saying. She also says the restaurant on the same block has been five or more different things. Your other comment I agree with, but it's stranger danger. Don't try calling it a bodega when it has the same issues. And it's S by tree is how I say her last name. Do you think the Market Street market is in peril over here? I know it can't be easy for them. I don't know if they're in peril or not. This is what would be

a very damning situation for Charlottesville. Reeds is closing. Right? Yeah. If Market Street Market also closes, then you have a significant food desert in the heart of the city. And people are throwing shade at bodega owners.

Are you seeing the shade that's starting to pop up on the convenient and bodega owners? I don't understand that shade. I'm not sure what you mean by bodega. You don't know what a bodega is? You don't know what a bodega is? Generally speaking, but are there specific places that... A bodega is a convenience store that sells a little more grocery.

Okay. And they're commenting that bodegas have prices that are not advertised and occasionally goods that have been spoiled that they're still selling. So would that be places like some of the Mexican markets? I think the most elevated bodega air quotes is probably the, the Bel Air markets, the tiger fuel markets. Those are elevated and those are executed flawlessly. I've said on this program before the food and beverage business that's doing the most gross revenue outside of Starbucks and Chick-fil-A are the markets at Bel Air. I challenge anyone to find me a food and beverage

business that's driving more revenue than the markets at Bel Air. You've kind of got a captive audience. Captive audience, fantastic food, great goods, prepared meals, and those French bread sandwiches, those things are selling gangbusters. Maybe Bodo's competes with them, but I still think the markets at Bel Air supersedes gross revenues from Bodo's because Bodo's has what, four locations? Is it four now? Three locations.

You got Preston Avenue, 29 North, UVA Corner, right? Those are the ones that I don't know if, yeah. How many market street, how many Tiger Fuel markets are out there? A dozen? Who knows? The Suttons are crushing. Crushing the Suttons.

John Blair on LinkedIn. You are not a hypocrite at all, Jerry. There is an actual shortage of working class housing stock in Charlottesville. There is not a shortage of grocery stores or groceries in Charlottesville. Bingo. That's true. You said it more succinctly than I did. I'm going to respond.

Not all in good areas. Well, not all in areas where they're needed. I don't even buy that. Okay. Okay, I'm going to push back. Respectfully, I'm going to push back. Everyone's pushing for a grocery store on Fifeville, right? How far is the food line from Fifeville?

It's got to be less than a mile. That's easy to say when you've got a vehicle. I'm not saying you're wrong. It's on a bus route. I know. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'm sure the people that wanted in that area would rather not go as far. The food line...

Even if that's not very far to your mind. I'll add a different pushback perspective. The food lion that is next door to Fifeville will 110% have better prices than whatever grocery store, if a grocery store materializes at the old Kim's Market. There's not a chance in H-E-double hockey sticks

that the Fifeville grocery store will be able to compete with the Food Lion price points. That's fair. Not a chance in hell. You see the same thing at Market Street Market, but they still seem to do brisk business. The Market Street Market model is different. The Market Street Market model is capture white-collar professionals during the business day with convenience.

You talked about a value proposition. This is why I don't think the Market Street Market is in peril. The Market Street Market, their value proposition is convenience. That's why they can overcharge on price. You talk about foods of all nations. Foods of all nations' value proposition is convenience and location. They've got a damn grocery store next to Bel Air, Lewis Mountain, Ednam, Ednam Forest, Farmington, and probably the most lucrative two mile stretch in central Virginia

Ivy Road what's foods of all nations value proposition convenience and location what's Market Street markets value proposition convenience what's Reed's value proposition exactly exactly it may have been convenience for some people Convenience. What's Reed's value proposition? Exactly.

Exactly. It was the butcher. It may have been convenience for some people. Right? Right? Carol Thorpe, Jerry, on a side note, I may have to come in for a new photo or send you one. I have lost 130 pounds since that photo was taken.

Congratulations on your transformation, Carol Thorpe. Please send a photo to me and Judah via Facebook Messenger, and we will update the photo that we put on screen for you. New year, new you. That's great news. Carol Thorpe, great news. Carol Thorpe. Great news. Georgia Gilmer and Diana are having an exchange in the comment section on the I Love Seville Facebook group. All right.

It's 1.15. We're 45 minutes in. What's the next topic? Oh, this is an interesting one. Roads that have changed the most. All right. Put that lower third on screen. Ladies and gentlemen, from 2020, which was the start of COVID, until 2025, which is now. Good God, it's been five years, Judah. From the start of COVID to now? Almost five years. 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023. All of 2020. All of 2021. Okay.

Almost five years. All of 2020 is one year. All of 2021 is second year. All of 2022 is third year. All of 2023 is fourth year. All of 2024 is five years. Almost five years. Almost five years. We have seen this city

change dramatically. Which city road in Charlottesville, Virginia has changed the most in the last five years? I'm talking a 10.2 square mile city. I'm not going to include Albemarle County in this discussion. It's just entirely too broad, although that could be a topic for a different day. I'll offer one suggestion. Is there any road that's changed more over the last five years in Charlottesville City than Preston Avenue. In that five-year period of time, we saw Dairy Market be birthed and come to life. We saw Dairy Central, the commercial and apartments around Dairy Market,

birthed and come to life. We saw a friend of the program, Dave Fafara, purchase and remodel that Shenandoah Joe's shopping center. He owns an ownership stake in that. Superfly Brewing is over there, right? Yeah. stake in that. Superfly Brewing is over there, right? We saw Chris Henry buy that historically African-American church and turn it into a wedding venue on Preston Avenue. We saw Preston Avenue expanded. Was it expanded to four lanes? Can someone help me out on this? Viewers and listeners,

help me out on this. Did the Preston Avenue expansion happen over the last five years? Kevin Higgins, any viewer and listener, can you help me with that? Did it expand over the last five years? Give me one road that has had more of a significant transformation in the city of Charlottesville than Preston Avenue from the year 2020 to the year 2025. I'm open to your suggestions, Judah.

I can't think of anything else. Kevin Yancey says West Main Street. I'll push back on Kevin Yancey, the mayor of Waynesboro. I don't think West Main Street's transformed much in the last five years. If it was up to Kathy Galvin and Heather Hill, former city councilors, we would have used free money from the Commonwealth and the University of Virginia to build the West Main Streetscape Project.

Livable Charlottesville, Matthew Gilligan and Stephen Johnson, the urbanist lobbying group, they poo-pooed and kiboshed the West Main Streetscape project. And instead, that money, some of that money, went to the reconfiguration of Burley Middle School. West Main Streetscape never materialized. And one of the most important gateways, Gateway to Charlottesville and Gateway to the University of Virginia, never amounted to anything. It's still the same. In fact, I would say I've been in this community 25 years in August. That's effing crazy to say. Longer in this community than the community I was raised in. And the 25 years I've been in Charlottesville,

West Main is the same? With some exceptions. What? Quirk Hotel? I mean... Jeff Levine? Building the apartments around Blue Moon Diner? What has changed? I mean, that corridor between, what, like,

10th Street and the bridge? Were there all those hotels now? All right, I'll give you that. I'll adjust my comment. In the 25 years that I've been here, the flats, Korn Capshaw's apartment tower was not there. And the standard, those apartment towers next to the flats were not there.

But that did not happen over the last five years. That's fair. Over the last five years, nothing of significance has happened on West Main Street. West Main. But over the last five years, Preston Avenue has significantly changed. Significantly changed.

And I'll use this as a segue into our next topic if you want to put the next lower third on screen. Which road in Charlottesville over the next five years, from 2025 to 2030, will change the most? This one may have some competition. I still think Preston Avenue will be number one. You think it's going to change that much in five years? I think Chris, we know Chris Henry owns the Preston Plaza where Integral Yoga is and those charming, eclectic retail stores are, right?

We know that he, whether he chooses to pursue them or not has plans for phase three or the next phase of dairy market, right? Will a community allow him to do that? God only knows. I will say this. As the community continues to gentrify and as 10th and Page continues to gentrify,

there's going to be less community memory, less institutional activism, less, I'll rephrase that, less institutional activism memory. And less people to care. Exactly what I just said. You said it more succinctly. As the community gentrifies, less people will care as development happens. Because they will have less ties to the community to outcry said development. But this topic is an intriguing one

because High Street and Cherry Avenue can compete with Preston Avenue for the street that could change the most over the next five years. I'd love to see it be High Street. I'll straight up cut to the chase. Chris Henry is to Preston Avenue as Anthony Woodard is to Cherry Avenue. Woodard owns Cherry Avenue.

Bought a lot of Cherry Avenue during COVID. When people were scared. Look at the purchases on Cherry Avenue for Woodard owns Cherry Avenue. Bought a lot of Cherry Avenue during COVID when people were scared. Look at the purchases on Cherry Avenue for Woodard. Strategic purchases done during the pandemic, and we're going to look back at those strategic purchases as absolute steals for Woodard. Chris Henry is to Preston Avenue as Anthony Woodard is to Cherry Avenue. High Street could change,

but the linchpin for change on High Street, the Bo Carrington-Wendell Wood project, never materialized. Now the linchpin for change on High Street is what? Kim Cosner? The Cosner family? Is what? Is it the Silvermans that own

Rivanna Rafting? Rivanna River Company? Is it the Silvermans? Sounds right. Gabe, is that right? Sonia Silverman? What's Sonia? Come on, memory?

Let me find it real quick. Sonia? What are the, what's, come on, memory? Let me find it real quick. Sonia? What's Sonia's, what's Sonia's man's name? My point is this. You have the Silvermans who own silver, silver, sorry, silver is their last name. I'm looking it up right now. You have a small, this is the difference, J-dubs. You have Gabe and Sonia Silver. I'll never forget that again. You have Gabe and Sonia Silver that are determining the outcome in a lot of ways, along

with Kim Cosner for East High Street. Gabe and Sonia Silver own a handful of parcels on East High Street. They're small business owners. The difference between Gabe and Sonia Silver and Kim Cosner on East High Street and the other real estate owners on East High Street and the future of Cherry Avenue and Preston Avenue is quite stark. Woodard owns Cherry. They're well capitalized. They're developers, access to capital and have proof of performance of change. Henry, well capitalized, developers, proof of performance of change. There is not that level of organization or access to capital or proof of performance to change on East High Street. So my bet over the next five years is that it's going to be Preston Avenue and Cherry Avenue

as the two streets in the city of Charlottesville most noticeable in their change. Time will tell. And if you're an investor, let me tell you right now, you want some free advice, not even going to charge $2.95 an hour for this. I'll just give it to you pro bono. If you're an investor and you have some money to spend, you want to do a 1031 exchange, you start scooping up some parcels next to Cherry and Preston. You start going after Prospect. You start going after Orangedale. You start going off the side streets on Cherry. You start going off the side streets by Rose Hill, behind Botos, Henry Avenue. there's upside and opportunity there.

Anything you want to add to that before we go to the next topic at the 126 marker? Yeah. What is the next topic? If you could let me know, sir. We've got Eljo's. All right. This is good news. Trent Thurston, known Trent for 20 years, the son of Miles Thurston. I used to do a radio show on Fox Sports Radio, a talk show on Fox

Sports Radio and ESPN Radio. Trent Thurston used to come on the drive time show that I used to host often. Diehard sports fan. Um, Trenton, Miles Thurston are the owners of Eljo's. Eljo's has been around since 1950. It's 74 years old. It's about to be 75 years old. It's nearly 75 years old.

First started by Ellen Joe brothers on the UVA corner in 1950. Joe graduated from UVA in 1949. L, his brother, dropped out and they opened the business on the corner in 1950. Miles Thurston took it over from the brothers, brought in his son, Trent. Here's the good news. The business has been sold. The new buyer will be announced, ladies and gentlemen, on February 10th, 2025. That's like a month from now.

The new buyer is committed to changing the lineup of inventory of what is sold and utilizing social media and digital marketing to help create a runway for success. Congratulations to the Thurstons for selling their business. Congratulations. To the new buyer who takes over, we won't steal your thunder. You make that splash and that announcement. Not my announcement to make. I'm very excited to see with what you do with the community landmark. Very excited to see. And a perfect segue to this is the future of local retail. What is it? Is the future of local retail having a streaming, a live streaming setup or set or stage or studio in your store where someone that can talk, someone that looks good on camera or speaks well on camera

or has a personality that can be portrayed on camera and into a microphone is able to talk about what you can buy from them, whether clothes or widgets or inventory, and then you sell those wares in live streaming capacity like QVC 30 years ago, everyone can QVC now. Oof.

Why do you say oof? I mean, we've got a limited amount of time in the day and a limited amount of time that we can spend. Bandwidth to enjoy content? Yeah. I hate to say that, but I'm pretty sure that's the future of what we're looking at. You disagree?

No, I don't disagree. I wonder how much it's going to help. Amazon is now having live streaming for its resellers. Yeah. How much of that is getting viewed? How much of, that's also a large corporation. It's not a large corporation that's doing the streaming. It's resellers are doing it.

Individuals that have Amazon stores are doing Amazon Lives and selling their goods through their Amazon stores and their lives. Like this show, for example... To catch streams like that. This show, for example, one of the things I want to do

for the first quarter of this year, and this is right and you know, this is right up your alley of what you do here is this show should be streaming on Amazon live each day. Why wouldn't we stream on Amazon live every day? Everyone's on it. We stream everywhere else. And now Amazon gives us live streaming abilities. We should be doing it. I would like to see, by close of business January, the show streaming on Amazon, please.

I had a very informative interaction with John Blair on Facebook. And you know that I respect Mr. Blair tremendously. And he was talking about the headwinds that retail, and I'm going to get to his comment, that retail is experiencing. Headwinds that we've covered very well on this show. There's no labor. There's no labor to work. And the labor that is prepared to work is extremely expensive.

The rents are escalating at a very quick and aggressive clip. Right? The consumer is less inclined to walk into brick and mortar and more willing to purchase online through e-commerce and have the goods shipped directly to them. And because the consumer is more willing to do that, there's more competition than ever because any Tom, Dick, or Harry can buy goods or sell goods

from any zip code in America, if not the world. Yeah. Right. Throw in the fact that we have numbskulls or numb nuts that are choosing to raise taxes and aggressive clip on everything, everything. And it's encouraging people to shop in different areas. I was absolutely flabbergasted that the cost of four beers in the Hamptons was 30% less than the cost of four beers here in Charlottesville City. That is nuts. Nuts! Holly Foster, so glad you and Judah are back. I've been watching on YouTube while also watching News Nation live coverage of my child's hometown,

Pacific Palisades, burnt to the ground. Very upsetting. I've also been watching that, Holly Foster. My brother lives in Los Angeles. I lived in Los Angeles. My brother is less than a mile away from where this is happening. As you rotate the lower thirds on screen, it's the 133 marker. Some of these topics are going to be half to save for tomorrow. I want to talk about the DOJ suing six of the nation's top landlords tomorrow. And I want to talk about mortgage rates hitting the highest level since July 2024 tomorrow. We'll talk about UVA. If UVA paid real estate taxes, the impact it would have tomorrow. I'll close the program

with the impact of Travis Wilburn. Someone texts Travis Wilburn and let him know we're talking about him. Can you get the Travis Wilburn lower third on screen? You don't know Travis, do you? You can put me on a one-shot then. He's been here since 2000. I also arrived here in 2000. I think we're relatively the same age. Travis, you may have me by a handful of years, my friend, although you're aging quite well. I first met Travis when he was literally slinging and selling print newspaper ads for Bill Chapman and Blair Kelly with Decevo Weekly. He was the guy that would often come in in the bottom of the ninth inning and close the deal. I was like, this dude's got skills. This guy, Travis, has got skills. I remember him having a nose for the deal and being able to put a deal together.

Then I came across Travis again when we were both owning and operating, not together, but actually competing deal sites. Remember Living Social and Groupon, those deal sites, right? Travis owned one. Was it called the Seville Saver? Something like that.

And then I owned one called Catch My Fire. That's when Judah first started working for the business. Judah developed the logo for Catch My Fire. Remember? Yeah. We designed and developed. I got a developer friend to design and develop a discount deal site called Catch My Fire. Remember? Yeah. We designed and developed. I got a developer friend to design and develop a discount deal site called Catch My Fire, catchmyfire.com, which I sold, sold for five figures. And he had a discount deal site of his own. And we, in some ways, we're competing

discount deal sites. There's an article that Dave McNair wrote for The Hook about our discount deal sites somewhere out there. Came across Travis again. I don't think he sold his. Maybe he did. I definitely sold mine. Then I started running into Travis on the downtown mall as he was becoming more self-employed and rolling out kind of a hospitality, short-term rental, luxury rental, Airbnb behemoth. And he's had a lot of success with that. The news recently broke that Travis and his firm, Stay Charlottesville, are now the operators of the 200th South Street Inn, the inn next to South Street Brewery, and 400 West High Street, which is a couple blocks from here.

Close to the intersection of what, is that Ridge and McIntyre, or McIntyre and High Street? I get the roads confused. Very close to the Albemarle County Office Building. It's, yeah, Ridge, McIntyre. That intersection, or like the Wendy's and McDonaldald's there's a six-room hotel right there at 400 west high street so travis is going to be the operator of these two of these two ends these two hotels and i want to highlight because he's in some ways a behind the

scenes guy travis i hope you hear this This guy is an evangelist and a champion for Charlottesville and Alamaro County and the region. And he utilizes his platform as a short term rental and luxury rental and hospitality aficionado to champion and evangelize our area in positive ways. He's also very quick to point out behind the scenes what is wrong with the area, which I respect. So many of us are unafraid or so many of us are afraid to point out what's wrong with the community. I catch so much heat for saying, why do we have 200 houseless folks around the downtown mall? And people are saying, you lack empathy, Jerry. I'm like, that's BS. I'm all for giving them a hand up, not a handout, but a hand up. But that hand up should

not be around the most important eight blocks in the region. It just doesn't make economic sense. And it's hurting the economy of this region. And I stand by it. And he makes comments like that too, and I respect it. I respect it. So if you see Travis, congratulate him as the new operator of 400 West High Street, the six-room inn kind of close to the Wendy's, the McDonald's, the county office building, and 200 South Street Inn, the inn that's next to South Street Brewery.

That's pretty big for the founder of Stay Charlottesville. Congratulations. That is the Tuesday edition of the I Love Seville, or Wednesday edition, good Lord. The Wednesday edition, it's already hump day. The Wednesday edition of the I Love Seville show. We'll talk some of the topics we didn't get to tomorrow on the program.

For Judah Wickauer, my name is Jerry Miller. So long, everybody. Thank you.