The Ins & Outs - Landscape Designers & Bathroom Lighting

Episode Date: April 8, 2025

On this episode Polly lets us know why you should hire a landscape designer over going at your garden DIY.The ladies discus new perfumes and Jojo lets us know the best lighting for cellulite. Plus, what's the best way to store your outdoor furniture?This week's episode is brought to you by The Odd Company. Each of their fully sprung mattresses originates not from an automated, mechanised production line of machines but instead a wooden work bench and the careful hands of a skilled craftsman. All their mattresses are handmade using some of the finest natural materials and techniques which have been honed and perfected over generations. Check them out here https://oddmattress.co.uk/ InstagramPodcast - @the_insandouts_Jojo - @houseninedesignPolly - @pollyanna_wilkinsonProducer Andy - @andy_rowe_WebsitesJojo - https://www.housenine.co.uk/Polly - https://www.pollyannawilkinson.com/Pod Rowe Productions - https://www.podrowe.net/ Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Your customers are scrolling past your social ads, using ad blockers, and paying for ad-free streaming. But when they're listening to a podcast, they're hearing Acast ads, which are 4.4 times more engaging than with display ads. So, if you want real attention, start advertising on podcasts with Acast. Start today at go.acast.com slash ads. Green, the color of true elation. Pine on a summer's day. See, I've been waiting for you, waiting for you. Hello Inns and Outies, and welcome to this week's episode of The Inns and Outs with myself, Jojo Barr,

and the lovely Pollyanna Wilkinson. This week's episode is sponsored by our friends at The Odd Company. If you have a tricky or indeed odd bedroom that doesn't fit a standard size mattress then these guys will make it for you. All of their mattresses are handmade using some of the finest natural materials and techniques which have been honed and perfected over generations and every single one of their beds and mattresses is made to order to your size and shape and handcrafted by the loveliest bunch of people I should know because I had the pleasure of meeting them at last year's Decorex and when I eventually come to do my garage extension up in the loft we have a very tricky space that I'm building in these really cool twin bunk beds

and they are not standard size and therefore the lovely bunch at The Odd Company are going to make me a couple of these unusual sized mattresses. So I am very excited I have just had my little one's headboard arrive and you're quite right speaking about those odd sizes because actually he's got a slightly weird size bed at five foot six so I needed a custom headboard for that that would fit so I went with the bold beauty in a praline which is like this sort of beige-y toned scrumptiousness which Jojo I feel you would very much approve of. I tell you what we do use a lot is is if you're ever looking for a short mattress so if you've got a sort of quite narrow room and you have to have the bed coming out of one wall, you can actually shorten the length of the

mattress of the bed. So they will literally supply the divan base, the mattress, headboard, whatever it is, awkward shapes and sizes. Anyway, do go and check them out. Their website is oddmatress.co.uk. On this week's episode we talk new perfumes, Polly advises on why to hire a garden designer over DIYing, we talk wisteria on pergolas, storing outdoor furniture, best lighting for cellulite and of course waters in and out this week. So let's jump on in. Hello, hello. Hello sweet cheeks. How are you my love? So let's jump on in. Hello, hello. Hello sweet cheeks. How are you my love?

I'm so well. How are you? Oh I'm good. I'm good. I'm just loving this month. This month is just glorious, isn't it? I mean I don't love this month. I'm dragging my way through the school holidays. Oh of course. See I don't know what's wrong with it. I just love it. Like a dead corpse. I'm quite lucky because I've got girls, which means I can sort of take them with me. You know, they love coming to the studio and they come on jobs with me.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Lovely for you. I know. Sorry, pal. So cute. What are you doing? There's lots of football camps. The camps, yeah, but there aren't loads of camps available yet. They kick in next week, so it's's a juggle. It's lovely, it's just you know when you everyone's gone away on skiing and all sorts of fabulous holidays and I haven't booked anything so it's my own fault. Oh dear. Special precious time, I'm thriving and I love it anyway.

I've got some exciting news to share. What is it? I haven't actually shared this with anyone apart from my subscribers. You're not? Yes, I'm pregnant. Am I? Fuck. Mother of God. I wouldn't dare, but I don't think my body could do it. I just don't, I don't even think I'd crack.

I think I'd literally crack. I'm recording a documentary. Oh. Yes. about what? Basically about the life of an interior designer what it takes to be a designer behind the scenes following all our projects following essentially a project from start to finish and but in a in a very very No holes barred way and it's's very fly on the wall-esque. Are you gonna show the bits that go wrong?

Yes. Are you? Yes, yeah I am. Oh, that's good. And we're using about four projects as case studies. And I was so nervous, because I emailed the clients to sort of say, like this is obviously gonna be top, you know,

very private, I'll always keep, you know, your privacy means the most to me. And recording this documentary, I was so nervous. It was the one thing I was the most nervous about is actually asking clients whether it would be okay. And they all came back saying, oh my gosh, how amazing. Yes, of course you can use the house and we'd be honored and like really lovely, like really exciting. Oh, that's good. But I'm so excited to be able to really share what goes on in a busy design studio

and what it takes to get a project from concept to completion. Because there's so much hard work and time hours and resource and blood, sweat and tears. And I know we're not here saving the world, guys. We're not pretending to be saving the world. One room at a time. One room at a time. One room at a time. But we're making little sanctuaries so that when you are out there saving the world, you've got somewhere nice to go back to. Love that. But it's just a really, I'm going to find it quite liberating to just share because I think it's so misunderstood.

This industry is so misunderstood and I hope I do it justice. I hope I share what it's so misunderstood. This industry is so misunderstood and I hope I do it justice. I hope I share what it's really like. I nearly had a breakdown actually on Monday when she was filming me. So I was like, oh, I don't know if you should get this bit. And she's like, no, I will. And I was like, okay.

Yeah, it's much more important. I think for me, I would hate it if it was you wafting around carrying a coffee and always looking amazing. Screw you. Oh, there was a bit of wafting. I mean, of course I am in a wafting bit. Like I've you wafting around carrying a coffee and always looking amazing. Oh there was a bit of wafting. I mean of course I am in a wafting bit. But if it was just like oh here I am in in practical clothes just faffing with a fabric sample and some coffee and nothing else but actually if it's which is absolutely not what it's all about. No I keep saying to her because I'm like even to the team when I'm like you know Liv who's

producing it when I said when Liv's coming in and don't please don't suddenly make everything look pristine because it's just so yeah no it is so not like that honestly. You hunched over a computer with the like claw hand. Yeah just us all rushing around like people sitting on the floor in corridors or on stairs because there isn't enough space for us to all be having calls or like it's just a mess and it's but it's brilliant it's how it's creative and it's what it should be like but I think there's too much of this kind of it's all so perfect. Oh I'd much rather see that I can't stand it just makes everyone feel like a failure if it's all like a polished manicured. I'm very very aware of that and I'm very aware that sometimes even instagram

it's so easy to just show obviously all the all the good stuff. And that's, you know, the finished portfolio is the end result of what is years of hard work. And, you know, so it's, I'm really looking forward to it. I'm obviously slightly nervous about how it's gonna be received. It's gonna be on YouTube. So it's gonna be, I don't know how many episodes we're gonna be actually making of it yet, but I suppose it'll

depend on how well it's received. And the first project will be our newlyweds house because it's the first to finish. Oh well, I'm looking forward to seeing that. That little beauty. Those arches are looking pretty sexual. There's a whole lot of arches going in there. Beautiful, beautiful. Delish.

So how are you my darling? Catch me up on what you've been up to. Well, it's an exciting time for me, but for very different reasons because I'm going to become a chicken mother. You're not. I'm going to be a mother of chickens. My envy is running so deep. I'm just so excited.

It's all because of just this wonderful neighbour who is letting us rent this little patch of land beyond our garden, or I couldn't fit them in, the garden's not big enough. But we've got just enough to have some no dig beds and the chickens. And I'm getting, so put a call out on social media to find out about chickens. And everyone recommended the egg-lou by Omelette.

Have you heard of them? Yes. They're like the go-to, aren't they? Everyone, because they're not made of wood, because apparently there's mites. I'm learning. I'm learning, guys. Bear with. But they're less likely to get mites. Way easier to clean. So we're just waiting for the chicken run and coop to arrive. Big tip, get one with an automated door. That's what everyone said,

otherwise you have to get up early in the morning to let the girls out. And now really all I'm agonizing about is what chickens to get and what to call them. What sort of, my favorite, so I think my, do you have a favorite chicken breed? I do. Well, I've got two. Tell me.

I like the bantams, which are the ones that look like they're wearing flares. That's one of mine yet too. And apparently they're good layers. And I like the silkies, which look like I've got two I like the bantams which are the ones that look like they're wearing flares That's one of mine yet and apparently they're good layers and I like the silkies which look like they've got like a massive Fluffy crazy hair. We have the same favorites. Well funny. They're the most my favorite But silkies aren't good layers apparently. Oh, they are they're not they're not They're not so if I had them it would be a vanity chicken like it wouldn't not. They're not. So if I had them it would be a vanity chicken like it wouldn't. I bet you're a good layer. Pop out an egg or two. I've been known. I love a good lay. Can't remember what it feels like actually. No. It's been a while. Oh dust bowl down there

is it? Oh we always have to take it down a notch don't we? Let's take it back to the chicken. But no, so I'm actually, I'm considering right now and I'm trying to decide if it's respectful or not, naming them after great women in horticulture. Yeah, I love that. Yeah. I mean, obviously you've got to name one. I wasn't sure if that was disrespectful.

You've got to name one after me. Do you want, no, because what happens if I was like, oh, the fox has got Jojo? No, but yeah. Okay. Yeah, okay. Do you want, no, because what happens if I was like, oh, the fox has got Jojo? No, but yeah. Yeah, okay. So you're going to do dead people. I was going to do iconic women in horticulture like Gertrude, Vita, Beth. Yeah, love that.

As long as that honors them, I would hate, I would like to be named after a chicken. I'd think that was really cool, but I don't want to be hate... I would like to be named after a chicken. I'd think that was really cool, but I don't want to be disrespectful. Would you like to be named after a chicken or would you like the chicken to be named after you? I'd like to be named after a chicken. Oh, this is just getting so silly now.

It's so silly. Stop being so silly. So silly. So obviously to keep the foxes at bay, the reason obviously the egg lue is so good, isn't it? It's because it actually has a solid. I mean, they don't look as pretty as having a lovely wire sort of container, but it keeps them safe from basically they go away at night.

Yeah. So, I mean, we have foxes in the day here that will just boldly walk through the garden. They drive me crazy. So the only time they'll be able to be sort of roaming around the garden is when I'm in the garden with them gardening so the chickens will be we're gonna have a big run for them instead which means they can be out and about but safe from the foxes and that's a sort of fox-proof wire cage that you can walk into essentially it's a big cage and age yeah but that should keep them safe, I've been told. Oh my god, you're gonna have to,

you're gonna go in there with your cup of tea in the morning, you'll be like, hello girls! That's exactly what I'm just gonna go hang with the girls. Hello girls! Hi girls. Put a little chair in there, sit with them. You pick them up, can't you? I definitely want to handle them from an early,

I need to learn all of this, because I want to understand how to make them friendly. Okay, there is an account, and I cannot remember it and I hate being that person. It's like, oh there's that account. I can't remember. There's an account of an amazing lady who basically sells chickens, owns chickens. She's so cool. Well let's find out what that is. Arthur Parkinson has a lovely book about it as well. I'll share. I'll find her and I'll share. But I did follow her because I, do you remember when we very first moved in we were looking at getting chickens?

Yes, and actually Brad keeps talking about getting animals in the paddock He said let's get animals in the paddock and I'm like babe. We have to first replace About I don't even know how many meters of those make it meters of fencing We've got so much work to do before animals would you get? We've got so much work to do before we actually get any animals. What animals would you get? We'd like a pig. I love a pig. A pig. Just a singular pig.

A pig, a llama. Right. A little horse, a donkey, chickens. Okay. I love that you're just going to get one of each so they're just all going to be quite lonely. They're just going to be mates. They're just all going to be mates. It's going to be like Charlotte's Wed. I was going to say, there's the makings of a children's book in here. Pigmy goat.

Yeah, but I was like, the thing is about all these things is that when we go away on holiday, or we go anywhere, people have got to look after them. They don't just look after themselves. And it's probably going to be hundreds of pounds worth of food and maintenance and upkeep. So let's just prioritise. Let's just get the house done first, babe. Yeah, one thing at a time. I must admit, we did prevaricate

over whether it was too much of a commitment. And I did ask quite a lot of chicken owners who all said, if you get the automated doors and things so that you're not down there opening and closing it every morning and night, it's less work. Yeah. How was the lifespan of a chicken? Let's Google that, because I think we should find that out.

Am I committing to sort of a 14 year situation here? Because I just think it's, it is a big decision. I think it's chickens aren't just for Christmas. Absolutely not. Five to 10 years. Chickens live for 10 years. Oh God, I really need to sit with this. No, no, it's good, it's good.

And it's- If you're thinking of going off traveling anywhere, make sure that you've got a local chicken mama who can come and sort of like a chicken babysitter who can come and help. Here we go, Silky's lived for seven to nine years. Wow. An Easter Eggger, what a name, eight to 10 years.

I cry every time I lost one. I mean, no wonder people get so attached to them. That's a long time in the family. That is a long, well, I know, but I think you're doing well if you can keep them alive for that long because of the foxes, right? So it's, I'm worried about the foxes. But anyway, that's my huge exciting news. We've wanted chickens for a long time and very excited.

I will keep you updated on on their progress. Let's keep that chat going. And I've got something to tell you. Oh, tell me. Oh, I interrupted you. You go first, my dear. I will go first. But only because it's brief and because I'm interested in your take.

Mine's very brief. On my travels through TikTok, as you know I like to do, I have come across something called the 30 plus club. Have you heard of this? No, but I'm way past that now, sadly. It is an adult disco. Oh, I get that. I don't know how an adult disco. Oh, I know. I don't know how to describe it.

Yeah, you got me interested. 4 p.m. till 10 p.m. Very much my liking. Only over 30s. Okay, yes. No phones. Tick. Tick.

Music from our youth. Oh my God, take me there. Right. When? Yeah, that's it. It's essential London. I really want to do this because I think a 4pm dance, you know, you could just go 4-6pm and go out for dinner. You could be in bed by 9. It's also a work- it's basically a workout too. Yeah.

I love this idea. Especially if it's just 90s classics. Yeah, it was they were playing Fat Man Scoop on the video and I was like, that'll do it. That'll do it. Absolutely. So I think we should get a big gang of innies, outies and in-betweenies to a 30 plus club night, day, afternoon. A night.

We will not be answering listeners' questions. How fun would that be? We'll be dancing. I just wanna go for a dance. I just, I felt recently, the only time I get to dance is at weddings and they don't really happen anymore. Everyone's married. I've sort of almost, I used to think I was quite a good dancer

and then now occasionally if I'm not dancing in the kitchen when there's some music's on and I'm doing this thing where my hands are doing something weird and then the kids are just looking at me like, mom, what the fuck are you doing? Like sit down. Which they used to love when they were really little, they love it. Now they're just like, what are you doing? Like, sit down. Which they used to love when they were really little, they love it. Now they're just like, what are you doing?

And then, but I feel like I'm dancing in a weird way that I just don't know if it's very cool anymore. How do kids dance these days? Well, kids don't really, do they? No, they don't have a lot of fun. The youth of today, do they? Just worrying about things. Let's just go and throw some shapes around and see what sticks. Let's do the old lawnmower. Do the old lawnmower.

Yes. The old shopping trolley. Yes. In the shopping trolley. What would one wear? You probably don't, it doesn't even matter. Let's just go, we could go, we could just go 90s. Oh God stop it.

Scrape the hair up. Little bits of hair like this. Let's go pull it down really get the gel through them. Yeah, gel through those bits there. Love it. Might even trim my eyebrows especially. Get them nice and thin again like the like the cool kids are doing now. Nice and thin. Dark lip liner. Love that. Bit paler on the inside. Maybe do a Nike crop top. Stop it. Little butterfly clips in the hair as well or not? Yeah, maybe one of those big belts. Stretchy plastic choker.

Yes, snap band. Yes. Stop it. Slouchy pirate boots. Definitely bum bag. I think we've got the makings of an outfit here. Oh my God. It's gotta be a pair of Britney's denim shorts.

Like those sort of. Okay, with the pockets hanging out the bottom. Yes. That's a treat for everyone that's going to be there. Hopefully that's the only thing that's going to hang out the bottom. You can look forward to it. Right. Okay, well that's a date then.

I'll look up the next one and we'll go. Yes, good. Can we actually genuinely... Well, that's my news, Dancing and Chickens. What's yours? I've got myself a new perfume. Tell me more. Well, I am the fussiest person in the whole world when it comes to perfumes.

I've been wearing the same perfume, Dior, since I was probably in the 90s. Which Dior? Probably since I was 16. J'adore. J'adore. And I've worn it for so long. I've just decided that I can't keep wearing it anymore and I get sent this amazing gift box by Fern. I love their perfumes. They are so delicious.

So those are my carry around in the day. But I found a new one by Jo Malone as well. It's wood sage and sea salt. Oh, is that quite a mask smell? That sounds quite mask. No, see if I read that I wouldn't like it, but it's just got me. It's got me good.

So I finally feel like I'm in a groove with, now I wear that sort of a bit on the evening because it's stronger because it's like more of a sort of cologne you know stronger. Yeah. And then my ferns I wear in the day and I'm just I'm just feeling like I've hit my scent. Do you get compliments about your smell? I do. Do you? I do if I just but yeah. Just your natural mask. It's just my smell. Without perfume, I get it all the time. Like, you smell so good. Just on the tube.

Hey, what does that smell? It's just me. That's just me. Oh, de jojo. Oh, de jojo. Bottle it. Yeah. Anyways, that's my, that's my,

what do you, what do you wear? What do you smell of? I wear Diptyque. I can never pronounce it. Oh,tyque. I can never pronounce it. Oh, capital. I am obsessed with it. And it is the one thing that I get stopped. Like even the builders, they'd be like, you smell nice.

I'll be like, oh, thank you. Really? Yeah. Love that. This is consistently people comment on it. It's an amazing smell. I love it. Yeah. Oh, that's my ride or die. I've done that for about four years now. I don't think I'll ever leave it. It's an amazing smell. I love it. Yeah. That's my ride or die. I've done that for about four years now. I don't think I'll ever leave it.

No. It's good when you find your smell. Right. Let's do some listeners' questions. Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Enough of that. Jibber, jibber, jibber up, jibber, jabber. Do you remember the brand that popped up while you were scrolling your social feed? No? But I bet you remember who sponsors your favorite podcast. That's because 74% of listeners recall the brands they hear when listening to podcasts. If you want your business to be top of mind, podcast advertising with Acast is the way

to go. Book your campaign today by visiting go.acast.com slash ads. I've got one I want to ask. This is from Rosanna. Should I use tie backs on my curtains or leave them to hang freely by themselves? Tie them or let them be free? That's an interesting, do you know what? There are tie backs and there are tie backs. I rarely use a tie back. I think there's a time and a place for a tie back. I do think if you're very restricted on the window reveal on either side of your window and therefore you've got to

bring your curtains almost sort of covering quite a proportion of your window, then I would say they're quite good because they do help pull the curtains back and let more light into the room. So in some instances they can be really useful. Especially in places like bay windows, if you've got a bay and the two little end, you know the two little smaller windows on the side, sometimes because of the reveals there you can't bring the curtains around onto the outside walls and they have to almost cover those. That's a good place to have a tie back sometimes. But I tend to, in general, I tend in my designs to not use them.

Okay. Well, there you go. There's your answer. That was a quick one. So we're going to do another one. Okay. This is from Tamara. She says, I'm planning to renovate our bathroom this year and have a question about lighting. I really dislike how the current lighting makes me look as it emphasizes my cellulite. Oh, babe, it's been there. I want to feel comfortable in my own skin, not be constantly reminded of every dimple on my body.

Yes, babe. What type of lighting in the bathroom and in the shower is most flattering? That's such a good question. I hate downlights. Make me look like I'm dying. Sorry, downlights, there's no place for a good question. I hate downlights. They make me look like I'm dying. Sorry, downlights. There's no place for a downlight. Get those downlights out of that bathroom. Get those out of there. No one wants to see themselves lit up like a

Christmas tree, I'm sorry, at any really ever. The only time I think downlights are ever required is in a shower because they have to be because they're waterproof and you need obviously light in the shower. So I'd put one, let's say take a let's take a three by three bathroom, a shower room. Yes. That's three by three. So you've got shower in the corner, you've got your vanity with your mirror above and then you've got your loo. Do we want to put a bath in here? No, let's not put there's no space for a bath in here. Okay. It's a big shower. Sure. I would put a central flush mount fitting. Must be IP rated obviously because it's a bathroom. Got it. Nice IP

flush mount fitting on the ceiling. That usually would have like a frosted glass, you know that lovely white opaque. Love it. Well done Polly. Well done. Diffused. Diffuse the light in there. Thank you very much. Diffusing light is going to make it softer so it's going to create an all-over light as opposed to a directional light that's kind of shining down on you so that will beautifully light the room softly. Over your mirror you want a mirror if possible you want a light on either side of your mirror and the reason for that is that it's going to light proportionately your face on the left and the right and the front. Good tip. So it's going to give you all over lovely, natural, soft, creating that still soft all over natural light, great for things like makeup. In the shower you would then have one down light, which would be IP shower rated in the shower and that's obviously going to light the shower up as well, especially cleaning. Okay. And that is it my

friends. That's all we're having. That's all you need. That is all you need. You don't need one of the loo, you don't need to light yourself up where you're sort of sitting on the toilet. That is sufficient lighting in a bathroom. That's four, you've got four lights in a three by three room. Fun fact. That is totally sufficient. You do not need to put four down lights in a three by three room. Fun fact. That is totally sufficient. You do not need to put four down lights in the ceiling in the bathroom, otherwise you will cast those little horrible light shadows down your body

and you will pick up every little dimple. No one wants that. Every single woman on the whole planet has, but we don't wanna be highlighting those. We wanna be feeling good about ourselves, okay? Fun fact for you, pal. Mariah Carey has a clause in her contract that she will not be photographed with downlights. Maybe we should all have that. I think I should

put that clause in my contract. I'm going to put that in, not that I have one, but if I do. For your clients. Do not photograph me if a downlight is on. Any point. If anyone comes at me asking for autographs when my documentary's out, listen, no downlights. No, she's really strict about it and I respect it. I respect Mariah. I never thought I'd say those words. I respect her music. So right, let me hop into one for you, my darling. Where should we go? Out to the garden. Running out to the garden. I've picked this because I like the name. This is by Fluffy Farmer.

Fluffy Farmer is asking, pergolas with and without wisteria? Pros and cons, please. Oh, great question. The old, should we put plants on a pergola one is always a really tricky one to answer. So I love it if you grow things up a pergola in terms of softness,

makes it really romantic and look beautiful. However, you have to be mindful. If you put plants on a pergola, number one, it will be darker because you're instantly almost putting a roof on it, so to speak, by the time it grows over it, and particularly with something with wisteria, which is really rampant. If you think about that in mid-summer when it's completely like day of the triphids, it will cover the pergola. So if you want shade, go for it. If you don't, think twice, or there are other things you could use. The other thing to think about with pergolas, which we often talk about and people

don't consider, is if they've got a dining table under it and you've got plants above your head, you are more likely to have insects fall on your head or on your food. Oh, yes, of course. It's just a really small thing. And obviously, I love the nature of it. So I would be like, yeah, do it. But you are, you have a natural living thing above you. Leaves might fall on your head. Insects might fall on your head.

So it's something to think about. But you could also train the wisteria so that it sits along the front of the pergola rather than potentially going onto the roof, so to speak. Make sure it's a really robust pergola because wisteria are heavy and put on huge amounts of growth. And also obviously make sure that it gets enough sun because wisteria are heavy and put on huge amounts of growth. And also obviously make sure that it gets enough sun because wisteria, a lot of people make the mistake of putting wisteria on their north or east facing houses and really it needs loads of sun to thrive and to flower. So people will often be like, why isn't mine flowering?

And it's usually because it doesn't have enough sun. So just make sure the position is right. But I mean, I love a wisteria. I'm just about to put one on my back wall of my house actually. Do you know it's funny you say that when we moved into our house, we've love a wisteria. I'm just about to put one on my back wall of my house, actually. Do you know, it's funny you say that when we moved into our house, we've got a wisteria that sort of goes up over the porch, then the other side is a climbing hydrangea. And the two were completely intertwined and overlapped and it was a little bit crazy. The wisteria very sadly has sort of slowly died. And we are obviously a North East facing house, so it gets that morning light. But actually, when we first moved in, there was quite a lot of wisteria and it was flowering quite nicely, now it sort of died. I wanted to

get a new one put in when we come to do the house. But on the side of the climbing wisteria, which has got the climbing hydrangea, which has also got a bit of wisteria, it's wrapped itself around the drain pipe and it's literally pulled the drain pipe so it's completely bent. So our downpipe that goes down the corner of the house. So we're actually going to have when we come to the house to take that off and replace it because it's bending completely bending it looks a bit bit scared yeah and both of those climbing hydrangeas really rampant as well so again it has to be on a resilient surface. There was an amazing wisteria at the Mutton at Haisley Heath the pub that we, over there and they had in the

garden this, when they bought the house, bought the pub there was a pergola when it was sort of half the garden and this wisteria that we were like determined was dead. I mean it just looked dead as a door now and then sure enough it just sprung back to life in the most almighty way and it's massive this thing is just covering this whole pergola but you're right that if it wasn't strong you would probably pull the whole thing down totally because they really do get going they're resilient plants as well people are quite scared about pruning them but you know that they're quite

hard to kill I'm gonna ask you another one Paul as you gave me a double whammy there this one's from Milroy what are the three reasons you gave me a double whammy there, this one's from Milroy. What are the three reasons you should hire a garden designer instead of DIY? Thought you'd like this one. Ooh, just three. I mean, do you know what? One of the things that we have learned through doing this is that the money you spend on your design with a designer,

you will save on mistakes, regrets, bad decisions. Yeah, that's a really, really good point. So it's that value for me. And actually, we've had a few clients recently who've been like, we really want to work with you because we know that we will avoid the mistakes. You're going to introduce us to the right contractors. So we're going to be in really safe hands. We're not going to make the mistakes.

The plants are going to thrive and be the right ones. So actually, you could see it. And also, the money that we will save the clients through plant supply, through introducing the right contractors, it sort of pays for itself. So that's your number one reason is because technically, it pays for itself through good design. I think the second thing is there's no way in hell that you would know what the right materials are.

And why would you? It's not your job. We have laid different sandstones, different limestones. We have trialed all sorts of different formats. We know what grout works. It's the detail and the expertise you're paying for of being like, you don't have to guess anything. We will tell you everything. We have clients that go, oh, I've ordered a few samples myself. And we can go, that sample is rubbish because of this. That one looks bad in this color. We've tried this before and it doesn't quite work and this is why. So it's, you're

paying for years of experience and knowledge in that regard in terms of, it's always a bit insulting actually when clients go off on their own and go I found a different stone, what do you think? And you're like obviously we've considered that, we've tried it before, we've seen it before, we've seen it late, you know, as if we haven't. So that would be another one is just the expertise in terms of what materials are the right materials. And then I guess maybe, maybe a more practical one would be time in terms of like, if you've got the time to do all of the research and to look up every single plant, and it's spread and it's light needs and how it interacts

and then, then, you know, do it. That's one of the reasons I wrote the book was you can design your own garden, create a beautiful one if you want to. But it's a bit like me with the house, Jojo, isn't it? I didn't trust myself that I could do the best possible job for my interiors. I'm sure I could have done a respectable job and it would have been nice, but I know that there would have been things where I would have gone, I shouldn't have chosen that floor. I shouldn't have done that paint color. I'm just something isn't quite right and I don't know why. And it's, for me, the actual, the peace of mind of knowing it was all the right decisions has been such a comfort because there's

no agonizing over it. And actually, I don't think I would have enjoyed all of the decisions that needed to be made inside as well. So it was such a relief to hand that over to you. So I think a lot of it is also time and confidence. Yeah. What do you think? I mean, what's the same for interior? It's the same.

I mean, look, it does obviously come down to financial in a way. I mean, you can try and do, that's why we created our virtual designs that we can sort of help slightly hands-off so we can still design it for you. But then you can sort of implement it so we can give as much advice as we can from afar and then you can go away and implement it yourself. I think it's having the knowledge and the expertise and the technical ability. It's the technical, there's so much technical involved.

Huge amounts. You know, like you'll see, you know, our newlyweds project, we've designed this shower enclosure that is just absolutely stunning. It looks like a conservatory. It's basically like your Alitex greenhouse, but it's a conservatory, it's a shower room. The amount of time and effort that's,

or you know, resource that's gone into designing just that and site meetings and back and forth with the contractors and things, because we know what it is that we're designing, we understand about where tiles should meet marble and levels and you know nosings and all these things that you just, you have to really know what you're doing to get it right. So yes, I think if you want to create something really different and if you want to create something that is really considered, you can usually tell if you want to create something really different and if you want to create something that is really considered You can usually tell if you walk in someone's house or indeed garden if it's been designed Yeah, or you can sniff it out instantly. It's one of my favorite things to do is go someone's been here

I can feel it actually do do that's really made me think because the other thing is it's not actually just the aesthetics of it It's the detail so I can see and it's fast, it's always fascinating when I see people on social media that have done their own garden and they'll post about it and they'll be very popular. And to the untrained eye, they look cracking. But to the trained eye, you'll notice you'll be like, oh, those steps are the wrong height. That can't be a comfortable walk up or, oh, shame about those rises or shame about that grout gap. Like that could have been so much more special if that had been thought through. So there's a degree of all of those details that we know from experience of having done it all sorts of different ways of being like, oh, could have been even more special if they'd have done that.

I think you've got to remember that when you're, and I've had it before with clients who have, openly just having discussions a discussion before they decide to make the decision. And they will literally have the contractor starting on site and there won't be any proper plans, they won't have any elevations, there won't be any drawings. Now I don't see how a house can turn out right unless you're working with a design and build team where the builder has a in-house design team whose understanding of really tricky details or because they're gonna keep asking you how do you want the skirting to meet this the architrave do you want it to sit on top

or next to it how much you want to stick out with this molding do you like yeah you've got to pick every little beading every dado rail every shaker star paneling how wide you want the shaker how do what's the molding that's going inside? The details is an extraordinary number of decisions. The details is unbelievable. I mean the amount of details that are involved in designing a house properly is huge. But and there's therefore I think and I genuinely mean this if you are going to do it yourself it is a full-time job and you can't tell me it's not a full-time job and people that have the time to take off basically off work to oversee a contractor and the designs and you know

then then good for you that's great but I do think you'd otherwise you need a team in place to make sure it's done properly those you will live with regret. Hmm that was a fun question thank you for that one It's nice to justify our work. Do you remember the brand that popped up while you were scrolling your social feed? No, but I bet you remember who sponsors your favorite podcast. That's because 74% of listeners recall the brands they hear when listening to podcasts. If you want your business to be top of mind, podcast advertising with Acast is the way to go. Book your campaign today by visiting go.acast.com slash ads.

Right, back indoors for God's sake. Back in. I've got a light one for you that stick with light. Oh yeah, from last week. And this is from Alice. Would you suggest wall lights for rooms that have very low ceilings? Definitely yes but you'd still want to keep it depends on the wall lights that you're going with don't forget wall lights it also depends on the size of the room and it's

very specific to the room because I would like to encourage wall lights. Yes wall lights great but wall lights also knock out any ability to have pictures. So if they have very low ceilings and you still want pictures on the walls then actually maybe consider going with a picture light which will raise the eye up because you're taking the light up the wall and then you're having pictures underneath. The pictures themselves will act you know like give a bit of interest and reflect the light from the picture light so that can be quite effective. I don't know what the height your ceilings are but I would try and avoid putting any definitely don't put anything like down lights in there because you'll have them very low

they'll be sort of almost at eye level. So wall lights are nice otherwise just do really nice low level lighting you know a couple of picture lights around the room and then just get everything else on on low level, you know nice picture lights table lamps Reading reading lights. Yes It's lovely. If you have a couple of walls where you wouldn't put artwork then then wall lights could be lovely Just fit them at the standard height. Don't drop them any lower because the ceilings are low You still want to fit wall lights at around about center point one

are low you still want to fit wall lights at around about center point 175 centimeters from the ground up. That's good tip. That tends to be a good height around 175, 170 to 180 centimeters you want to put fit wall lights yeah unless it's a drop unless you've got something with a big drop. Have a look obviously the light you're choosing but center point tends to be around there. Do you know what I'm loving now which I think is a really nice touch is these rechargeable picture lights. Because you know if you're not redoing the house and you don't want to run wiring through and re-plaster and everything I think they're genius. They are genius. Clever right? Okay I'm going to do a little quick and dirty here for you my darling. This one is by Adobe. Adobe's asking

need new outdoor dining table and chairs but no garage for winter storage metal wood or composite please okay yeah this one comes up a lot and good for you to think about this now because as I said a couple of weeks ago now it's the time to be ordering your furniture so um yeah if you can't I mean not a lot of people have enough storage space that they can put all their outdoor furniture in a garage or somewhere I certainly don't so I, this comes down to practicality versus aesthetics, because I know loads of people love the kind of, for want of a better word, sort of rattan or plasticky ones that are just bulletproof and you can leave them out all year and I understand. And they like, there are certain gardens where they suit them. And if you go for ones like,

there's a lovely company called Bramblecrest, I really like that. There's a lovely, and obviously, they are bulletproof. I'd still cover them in winter, I don't love just leaving furniture uncovered anyway, just because they do get a bit manky, so I'd still put covers on but raise them up and cover them anyway. If you're going to go with timber furniture, which is my favourite, it adds a softness to a space and I think it makes the garden feel more gardeny, then go for a teak. It's really hard wearing, hard wood. If you go for anything softer then it won't last as long, particularly if you have to leave it outside. So go for a teak and you don't, I know when I say teak a lot of

people think oh it's sort of really dark and oppressive and orange. But there are, my new furniture is just arriving which is teak and it's a real pale teak. I'll share a picture of it. It's stunning and I will be, I can't store it, so I will be lifting it up in the winter and putting robust covers on it and bringing the cushions inside. I would never leave cushions outside year-round. Or metal can be great too. You can have really beautiful powder coated ones or the zinc ones as well. Absolutely stunner. So as far as I'm concerned, you can't go wrong if you cover them appropriately in the winter. So that's my take on that. Brilliant. It very much depends on the style of your garden, doesn't it?

Oh, totally. Totally. I mean, to put a really modern metal piece of furniture in a cottage garden would just be such a shame. It can really let the look down. So you've got to feed off what's going on in your house and the style of your garden just as much as you do the sort of practical side of things. And that's what makes it look good is balancing the two. Okay. Brilliant. Thank you, my darling. On that note, what is in and what is out this week? What's in for me is hair dye. Okay.

She's flirting with going brunette. Are you? Yeah. Are you? I. Are you? I mean, that is my natural color. I see that for you. I see that for you. Let's try it.

Do you know what? It's the color. It's the being told I'm an autumn that's got in my head and I'm like, I know. And I have brown hair. I just dye it. Yeah. Okay.

I can try it. What's the worst that can happen? I'm worried it might look a bit. Do it, do it, do can try it. What's the worst that can happen? I'm worried it might look a bit... Do it, do it, do it, do... We'll see. What about you? Okay. Give me an out. What's out for me? My tennis racket.

I love tennis. Do you? Yes, love tennis. Probably my favourite sport to play, I'd say. We have never talked about tennis before. We've never spoken about tennis, no, but it's coming up to the season. It's just, you know, it's the, well I mean tennis is all around but I'm a fair weather tennis player. And I've got Ziggy playing tennis. Notice that I just get Ziggy into all the things that I want to do. I was going to

say, how's that piano going? It's not getting much action from me at the moment. Tennis! Ziggs is playing tennis every Saturday morning. And we're going to start Rocky as well on Sundays. Fun! And I thought whilst they're now playing, I can play with a girlfriend of mine. So I'm going to get back into tennis because it's a sport that I love. It's meant to be one of the best sports to keep you young. Did you know that?

I didn't. Have you done padelle or pickleball as well? Those are fun. No, I haven't tried any of those yet. I haven't. They're all a rage. Please try them. Yeah, all a rage aren't they? We're now getting being asked to put pickleball courts into gardens. That's when you know it's... Aren't they supposed to be very noisy though? Oh I don't know, I've not really thought about it. Okay. Okay. All right. All right my darling, well that was a lovely episode. We love you all. Just leaves Polly with one little last thing to ask. Don't forget to like, subscribe,

and share with your tennis teachers. Yes, share with those tennis coaches. We're knocking balls around. I've just got visions of you with the skirt, with the famous picture where she's tucking a ball in her pants. That's you, JJ. More likely that my pants will be unwrapped holding my hair up on my head and that kind of mum forgets to take my

thong out my hair in the morning. Love it. All right. Not the dirty one from the night before. Oh lovely. Mmm fragrant. On that note, bye.