The James Donald Forbes McCann Catamaran Plan - Faux Real in Conversation

Episode Date: February 12, 2025

Go see Faux Real on tour: https://isthisfauxreal.com/TOURSee the beautiful music videos: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCj1J9o5u3dEQWCMRT3OYwmgCatch them on the gram: https://www.instagram.com/isthisfauxreal/?hl=enTune in to the James Donald Forbes McCann Catamaran Plan: https://pod.link/1600020707Buy the book: https://www.jdfmccann.com/booksListen to the album on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/artist/2AmTKUd2n9VwRgzQHfr7rAJoin the Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/jdfmccannArtists to check out:Yalcy: https://www.instagram.com/yalcy__/Sean Nicholas Savage: https://www.instagram.com/seanicholasavage/Ryder The Eagle: https://www.instagram.com/inlovingmemoryofryderKirin J Callinan: https://www.instagram.com/kirinjcallinanValgur: https://www.instagram.com/soyvalgurNuha Ruby Ra: https://www.instagram.com/nuha__ruby__ra__/?hl=en Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Thank you for listening to this episode of the James Donald Forbes McCann catamaran plan. If you'd like to listen to bonus episodes, go sign up to the Patreon. That's Patreon.clom. Clom? Ah, we f***ed it. Anyway, you'll look, you'll find a way. Catamaran plan! Hello and welcome to this episode of the James Donald Forbes McCann catamaran plan. Earlier this week I was fortunate enough to go and see a band called Fahreel perform in Austin where I presently reside. It's Virgil and Elliot. I've been aware of their music for some time.

Didn't know they were from Luxembourg. That was very exciting. Let me tell you, one of the best performances I've ever seen in any medium ever. And I had to leave 10 minutes early to do my own gig, a comedy show across town, and I was devastated to have to leave. They were that good and I'm very blessed that they sat down for an interview. What hope is the last interview on the James Donald Fours we can't get a Moran plan that takes place outside without a industry standard camera and Windguards for the microphone so we were there and this it looked like a great neighborhood in America this If I was in Australia, and we were living next to this park. This would be great children can run around

Yeah, and in America. it's a real viability. So yeah, a lot of disruption and shots at night. No way. Oh, it's exciting. It's a great time. The kids love it. For real. Where am I?

There. I'm a big fan. I've a second sweat in, what is it, early 2020? 2019. It was late 2019 Yeah, I got sent up by friend and it's great and I I bring your names up all the time I did a podcast with Karen J. Callen that couldn't come out because I was in Ohio and I was very depressed and every time I watch it. Okay, I can't do it. All right, too sad, but I your music makes me question But your music makes me question like meritocracy in a serious way because it's so good and it feels very popular and it feels like the right like it feels pop music and I feel like

it should have I feel like you should be winning Grammys for what you're doing. I feel like there should be no impediment between that and a massive audience. And then I go well whatever failure I have it's okay because Pharrell aren't the number one. You know. I'm glad that makes you feel that way. You know we're working hard at it but but I'm glad it makes you feel that way. I mean it's a perfect level of homoerotic incest brothers. I love the dance moves are tremendous. Thank you. I'm not gonna goof out about it, we'll just do a normal podcast but I had to get that out of the way., get it. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. Ah And it's you're on tour now for the album, correct? Yeah, so we're

Doing the second show of the faux ever tour tonight in Austin, Texas And this is our first like proper American headline tour. Yeah touring the album Did you come here for South by Southwest so we years ago? We've been to Austin quite a lot. Over the years. Several times for South by. Three times, I think. And each time we've packed it the fuck out. Yeah.

Like 10 shows or whatever. So we've got a little bit of an audience here. And it's cool to come back here, like not during South by. Because obviously we're getting some more Austin, like proper Austin experience. Oh, I'll be out there Austin oh the proper experiences out there boy. Let me tell you get on 6th Street at night And it's there's a man with a snake. Oh, yeah, he says we've taken photos with him Yeah, it's a beautiful first time we were in town like I think the first day we were here

We'd outside the big church on SoCo. We like, yep, this is a perfect Texas content. Yeah the internet agreed Well, there are have you been to the Barton Springs? Oh, absolutely. That's number one. I did my first ever flip there Oh nice. Yeah, that's a that's a big one. Oh first flip I fell over on the concrete on the way to do the flip and I'm you still went for the flip Yeah, that should have been a bad portent. That's grit. That's determination.

Yeah, most people would take that as a bad omen. No, some people were watching me getting ready to do the flip. I couldn't back out of the flip. I was devastated. Front or back flip? I only did the front flip. I'm told the back flip is easier. The back flip is easier.

It feels like a bigger mental hurdle to get over. It is. But physically, it makes more sense. He's a back flip guy, and I'm a front flip guy. Yeah. Well, I'm an all flips guy. Come on, let's be real here. OK, here we go.

I'm also not doing good flips. Like, I didn't get especially airborne. This is kind of a great diving body. I just kind of fall forward long enough to. Oh, I flail. It's like monkey style. But isn't it a joy? I mean, just spinning through the air.

Barton Springs is a very special place. I understand why Austinites have it deep in their heart. Actually, if we have time before soundcheck today, I think we're going to try and go for a quick tip because the weather's so nice. What is? Unseasonably warm, you know? It's a... man, it just doesn't stop the heat. There was like one week of gray and then it was over.

Well, it usually abates during South By when the weather is fucking terrible. What, it's like rainy and drizzly? Yeah, it's rainy and windy and it's like cold and dreadful. I've never been here for South By, South or East. In Adelaide we're against it because we were sister cities with Austin for a long time. Oh really? And they were going to bring the festival to Australia and then they didn't. Everybody goes with Sydney. We suck. It's fine. We know.

That's a let down. I will cover this. I feel like Austin, like it's grown a lot over the last 10-15 years. And like there are still like good nice old weird things in Austin that you can do in E-Cat living. But it's a lot of medium density housing 40 minutes away. Like it's just big sprawl yeah it's it's very hard to walk in a city it's pretty quintessentially American in that way did you grow up in France or America we grew up in born in Paris and then grew up in Luxembourg get out of town all places no and then moved around Europe when we graduated high school we wish to remain as we are I think that's their motto

How do you know that? I've got a friend who's just moved to Luxembourg. Really? No. He discovered like remote Luxembourg citizenship and So you get like free admission to the university and you get to live there well, it's like every day in Luxembourg is incredible the Pope was here and Yeah, all the houses are nice. He's like learning French, he loves it. Berlin is like not that far. Yeah, Brussels, Paris,

they're all the corner. Amsterdam. They're all like two hours away. Just get on a train and you go. You cannot catch a train anywhere in this country. Yeah, I mean, there's only freight trains in Texas right there. There's a freight train right there that would wake me up repeatedly.

Yeah, there you go. You can't resist, it's just over that creek. It won't take you anywhere but wakes you up, it's just so rude. I mean you could definitely have a swag and get on in an old-timey fashion. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You could get somewhere in two hours but who knows where. Probably just out of town.

Yeah, probably somewhere you don't really want to go. To wake up. It would be great. So yeah, Luxembourg, that was kind of a, it was an interesting and strange and good place to grow up. You had children in Luxembourg. Yeah, and then I moved back to Paris after I graduated high school. This guy went to London, did our own things and yeah, now we're in beautiful Los Angeles. Why? What took you to LA? and now we're in beautiful Los Angeles. Why?

What took you to LA? Music, I mean. Yeah. Yeah, just, we both felt like we'd been in our respective cities in Europe for long enough and we felt the pull of the US music scene. So we have American citizenship, our father's American, and we'd never lived in the US until now.

And I guess there was some kind of like America-shaped hole in our hearts somewhere. That's beautiful. It's a big hole. Yeah. It's a giant hole. Luxembourg-sized hole could go undiagnosed for years. And let me tell you, it did. It did. We only rediscovered it recently. Yeah. We're like, what's that? No, I don't know, you know, it's

grown up in Europe like around these different places and just like I don't know I think also just like Paris never really felt like home even though it kind of was and London was definitely never like really home I think we wanted to be in the same city. Yeah That was that was the number one impetus for that is that we were we wanted to be in the same city. Yeah That was that was the number one impetus for that is that we were we wanted to take the take for real further and by you know, and we needed to Yeah, be in the same place for that. It is a I mean, this is what America is. There's so many people There's so much money. They like going out to do things. There's opportunity here, but there is something to be said for

European style cities of getting around going down to do things. There's opportunity here. But there is something to be said for European style cities of getting around and going down to the Boulangerie. Don't we fucking love it? There's a Boulangerie. If we could complain about that for a moment, that would mean a lot to me. There's a Boulangerie sized hole in my heart, I'll tell you that. Australian cities are built much more like European cities.

Oh no, more like European. So we have big, sprawling suburbs as well, but the downtowns, you can just walk around you can live There's very nice Adelaide City is we don't even call it. We call it a CBD There's a central business a central business district. Yeah, um downtown has a rougher edge than you would find over here But this this thing of coming here and being like there's no city like city after city that I tour to yeah There is no it's like eight strip malls connected by four freeways I mean there's this there's this can there's this anecdote that I read I keep on going on about it There is not. It's like eight strip malls connected by four freeways. And you do the best you can.

There's this anecdote that I read, I keep on going on about it, but of these touring mishaps over the years of various bands. And this one band in the 80s or whatever from England who had a show in Los Angeles and they drove to LA and then they drove past it and they didn't even notice that they had gone through. You very much. They were in San Diego, they were like, wait,

how did we miss Los Angeles? And it does kind of feel like that. Because you think of it being, you know, La La Land and Glitzian. I remember the first time I saw the skyline of LA. I thought that is smaller than Perth. Yeah. This is unbelievable. I can count them on my own, like one hand, and one of these guys. Now it goes on forever. Yeah.

And it's beautiful and diverse. I enjoyed first time there. I got off at the airport. I had a 12-hour layover. I thought I'll walk around LA. I didn't know that was not possible. I had a suitcase. I went to Venice Beach.

Huge mistake to do that at 10 in the morning. With a suitcase? With a just da da da da da da da. Just walking like the most beautiful gay bodybuilding guys on the beach and the richest people on the Esplanade and maybe a hundred schizophrenics shouting into the ocean it was really it was something and then after that I went I wanted to go to a library to hang out for a few hours and the library closest to the airport was Inglewood and I got to go to Inglewood

and that I felt more comfortable there than anywhere else like it's like oh this is a real community yeah this is a real like city it's a bunch of LA seems like it's a bunch of places looking at each other. It's an agglomeration of different cities yeah and it's but it's fascinating like that and for us coming from where we were coming from it felt really exotic and really new and really fresh we were considering moving to New York because we knew New York we family there and yeah and our families from there that felt like a closer move but then we were like wait that's just we're just gonna replicate our our European experiences on a slightly bigger scale. It does feel like Europe on steroids.

You know. That's a friend said that when they were over there recently. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But then we went to LA and played a bunch of shows and just kind of got stars in our eyes. We were like, wow, this is... and we made fast friends with key people there who are still in our community today. A bunch of people actually. And actually one of the first times we met, well, the first times we went was with Kieran Jake Allenan who we were just talking about. I met Kieran in LA the first time I went to LA and it blew my mind. I was a fan of his music and then became friends with him. But he like introduced us to just like a whole bunch of people within a week that we spent together. He's an unbelievably connected man. It's true and actually Elliot met Kieran here in Austin the first time we came South by South by. Does he also communicate with you with a series of strange haikus and line

breaks is that all of his takes that's that's I don't think he's ever done a normal text or normal it was very strange to meet him after texting for some time right oh you're an extremely normal thing like we can just talk you're a guy you expect him to like go off and hike who's the whole time Yeah wizard poetry. Yeah, I was kind of looking forward to I feel that and I think For the most recent video with the guy with the long the long penis video long man the long shlong video Someone came to a show I was doing in Adelaide and said have you met Kieran Jake Allen? I was like, yes, he said I I have to show you. And he just showed me a video he'd made on his phone

of a guy with a long penis. He's like will you show this to Kieran? I was like okay. And I'm glad it worked out. But that is so often how things creatively work out. Is that you gotta be in place. Oh so that was the info behind the. He just, he came to me and said please,

let me show you the digital, it's big penis. It goes on, it's the whole world, the world's a penis. And I can see how that I think He will go for you. I don't know if you'll respond. No, I'll send him something that that video is just outrageous And it's maybe the best video come out This year Well, I'm heartbroken that it feels like the machinery for music videos. You have such great music videos Thank you. I don't know how long it takes to work on the dance moves.

I don't know what comes first, the dance moves or the songs, but the outfits, the fringes, the fringe era was... The fringe era was the whole thing. Sensational. Yeah, yeah, it was really a moment in time. We still have a vault with all our fringe, but we've moved on since then. Did you have to comb the fringe? The long fringe? Well that was part of the problem is it was very hard to maintain and wash and everything so we just kind of you know started thinking about alternative outfits and solutions but

yeah thank you. The videos, this guy's a director and you know by, or used to be I guess. Yeah, I don't know, it's just like all the other shit we make with FauxReal where it's just like, at first it's just like, okay, what's the best and easiest and most like, wow way we can represent what we're doing here. We just really break it down to its core essentials and just like, okay, like how is Faux Real best enjoyed? Like just like, boom, just the two of us performing. So you know the first video we ever released, which was Second Sweat, that song, it was just like, all right, it's just gonna be like, like you're going to a Faux Real show and you don't know where you're getting into,

so it's just us with the stage costumes, nothing else, just empty warehouse, you know? Yeah. And then we just kind of built it a little bit by a little bit from there, you know, kind of build the story with every video and just like, you know, more outfits, more more setups, more whatever. It seems like the live show and you have it like you have a backing track and it's to you with microphones. That's it. It seems like that is the would be the best way to to in terms of ease

and being able to show up and do a thing. But then to make it difficult for yourselves, I like very much with the outfits and the dancing and the... put the attention where it should be, where it's coming a real difference. You have to have some hurdles in order to overcome. That's what makes a story worth telling. You know what I mean? And I think it was... but it's funny because people are like, oh my god, you guys are so lucky. You have this super light setup and you can just tour so easily. We're like, no, it's the other way around.

We started this project and we came from very much a band background with amps and gear and stuff like that. We were like, let's do the opposite of that. And that's genuinely terrifying. And actually, the first time we came to South by Southwest, we were like, okay, now we have this ultra light light setup let's buy some plane tickets and go to Austin during South by yeah and figure it out and that was also in no small part inspired by the way Al Cameron a few years prior had done a similar South by. Backing track in the saxophone? Backing track in the sax and like the street corners in Austin during South by

and we were like yeah, that's brilliant and Yeah, that was that was part of the thinking for sure. Yeah, and we just showed up, you know Obviously people booked their South by shows like however many months in advance and we just literally rocked up like two days before the festival Started and asked this do you want to do you want us to cut you out of this video? Really? All right. It's just from filming the- have a good one, sorry. No, you can do it. I absolutely don't mind. I just wanted- I wanted a view on me to cut you out of it. I don't know. But...

I just thought I would be polite and ask. No, that's all good. Have a good one. Ah, the beautiful train going by. Nice. Well, this is... Oh yeah, that'll keep going by. If people can hear it, it that's great I want them to be able to hear it have a little depth that'll go on for the next yeah four minutes we're living in the real world take a break here no no no how through this is because as a stand-up you just go and they have a

microphone there for you and it's very easy, but it's very lonely. I feel you have a better... you get to go together. That's so crazy to me, because yes, we experience a similar sort of thing, where it's like an empty stage and two mics, but we do go together, and we have very much like, you know, there's songs to keep us to a time constraint and time limit and stuff. If I just had to walk up on stage alone in normal clothing and just talk into a microphone, I would... Brothers, dreadful. I would have a heart attack.

Sounds so terrifying. Yeah. I mean, the bad thing is I think that you, the work is done, you're doing the new stuff as a comedian. What I envy very much is you get the album to come out, you know, the song comes, as I avoid this peach cobbler on the table, you get the album to come out and then you know the songs that people will like and you get to sing them for people.

Hey, the grass is always greener on the other side. You must get bored eventually. Well, because that's what every touring musician will tell you, it's like, oh, I can't be bothered to play this fucking song again or especially that hit that we put out like all the way at the start of our career and we're still having to play it every time. It's like, you know, I just want to play all this new stuff so you know oh there's two sides of the coin but I think for us also the we used to do it more like stand-up comedians where we didn't have

any music out for the longest time the whole start of the project there was no songs or one song out and we booked all these shows and went in completely cold because the crowd had never heard of us which was really good like training ground you know because when you have to convince people that you're worth their attention you know you know oh i know it's look it gets you excited was there a song called fancy man classic classic man excuse me i remember reading that in a comment i've never heard it that never heard it. That one is in the vaults. It never got released and we stopped playing it for some obscure reason that even we don't know.

The people seem to have called out for it. It was a popular... It was a fan favorite during the start of For Real. And who knows, we might just bring it back one day out of nowhere. It was good. It had some good moves, you know. It had some good moves. I can't remember them. During the start of For Real. And who knows, we might just bring it back one day out of nowhere. It was good. They had some good moves, you know. They had some good moves. I can't remember them. Me neither.

It's funny, the buried classic, because Tusk, I think, was like that. They would just play that casually for years as a warm-up song, and then a sound guy at some point said, we should probably put that out, that's pretty good. I remember there's a rapper called Lakutas who was touring with Das Racist many years ago and he did a song called Dennis Quaid Bitch and that was the whole lyrical component. He said I'm Dennis Quaid Bitch, Dennis, Dennis Quaid Bitch. He never released it but everyone there for a moment, this is the number one hit single. Got the tight guy.

I love, you know, I love a sleeper hit, you know, where it's like. Yeah. The secret in the back catalogue. single. I love a sleeper hit, you know, where it's like... It's a single in the back catalogue. And then in years, I think Radiohead did this for years, that they would have songs that would just never come out. You had to go to a live show to hear. Well, that was the whole premise of the start of our live show. People were like, can you send us some music? And we were like, no, actually. You have to come along to the show. You have to come to the show. And that the first time we showed up in this city We were literally knocking on doors at different clubs until somebody our friend Sean Dickerson actually opened the door and was like

What do you guys want and we were just like we just had a briefcase and we were dressed up in our car Used car salesman suits and we were like we just want to play a show Just and he was like, what do you make like can I listen and we were like no you can't but trust me it's really good he was like alright whatever fuck it I'll take a chance he got us our first show here and then it kind of snowballed a few doors from there it's funny but yeah but also that kind of like you know that terrifying feeling of just like empty stage mic that we were just talking about like That was very much the reason for which we were like, okay

We can't just go up there and just sing we have to do something. So yeah, let's dance Yeah, at least if we have a dance routine, I want you know We know what we're doing at the very top level in stadiums. People have choreographed dances Yeah, very few indie musicians. I feel There are people who boogie there people who have some moves sure but full choreographed dances. Yeah. Very few indie musicians I feel. There are people who boogie, there are people who have some moves, sure. But full choreographed dances with the audience? I feel like this is a niche. Yeah, it was just, I think it was to get rid of nerves, you know, initially. Because we didn't really know what to do with our hands and feet on stage because we

were just used to playing instruments on stage and we were like, what the hell are we going to do with our limbs, you know? I was terrified, I was in a couple bands, I was so scared, it was so much scarier than stand up. Because I feel like you don't 100% know how it's going, unless it's like up and dancing music and you can see that everybody's moving. If you're playing like a restrained guitar piece,

it's very hard to tell how that's being received until the end of the song. Stand up every six seconds, you know exactly how it's, you can hear the loudness. But you know there's... Respond. I think the crowd reaction also is sometimes, sometimes it's very obvious, but sometimes it's very random. You can put your heart out on the stage and deliver what is actually a stunning performance

and get tepid reception. And if the crowd is drunk and partying already, you can do whatever and people are gonna cheer and whoop. You can coast up. You know what I mean? So that's not either... Well, how helpful is the room? What are the best rooms you've ever played in? What are the best rooms in America?

There's some storied ones, but... Oh, hello. Isn't that nice? I love that. You get so many birds. You get hummingbirds. I saw hummingbirds for the first time that blew my mind I could learn the blue J's. We love the grackles were big fan of the grackles. Why is it grackle? That was that a black like modular sense. Yeah Keeping it right for the grackle programmed the glitchiest birds man. I'm gonna miss of the Western world I'm gonna miss living here.

My daughter learned how to do the monkey bars on those monkey bars. Excuse me. I didn't it's just was convenient to do it here I thought it would be a cool place to do it. That's a memory lane for you. Oh Haunted. There's a statue of an armadillo butterfly bat over there It was for a young Hispanic quarterback who was killed in his prime and I think the 70s and his parents built this park for the community. Wow. Oh that's the titular Ricky Guerrero. That is Ricky Guerrero. I was accidentally calling it Eddie Guerrero Park for a long time after the wrestler. No it is. And you know it's like there's an Australian cafe not far down that way. Is there? Get sick of the American coffee. It's very nice. We really fixate on the coffee. I know, yeah.

I think it's the only thing we... I've had some thoughts about it as to why we... It takes a long time to get good at cooking, you know, to become a Michelin star chef. But if for six months all you do is work on your coffee making skills, you can become actually one of the better coffee makers. So I think it was the fastest way to go. We can do something well in the culinary sphere. It was lazy.

Good way to think about it. It's lazy. I like that. I like that theory. But if you're good at something, you know. Oh, it's beautiful. We needed to be good at something. This is hard to have no, I mean,

are you the biggest Luxembourg cultural exports? No. Who's number one? Brian Mulca of Placebo went to our high school in Luxembourg cultural exports? No. Who is number one? Brian Malko of Placebo went to our high school in Luxembourg. That was kind of the claim to fame of the school. He famously hated his time there. Really hated it. Which I can understand. When you're a teenager growing up there, it feels very small, very quickly. Because it is. It's tiny. And I think, you know, whatever cultural offer was, you know, around at his time was probably

hell of frustrating and dismal compared to what even we got to experience. But we still felt that way and I think that pushed us into making our own stuff pretty early on, which was a great motivator. Hopping on the proverbial trains to go visit the next city and catch gigs wherever and discover all of that. This is a gift, I think. Oh, 100%. I'm very grateful for having grown up there now in hindsight, and when we go visit we still have a lot of connections there, although no family left but a lot of friends, and we're going there on this tour actually.

Where do you play in Luxembourg? What is it? But that's the thing, it's like... a lot of connections there, although no family left, but a lot of friends, and we're going there on this tour actually. Where do you play in Luxembourg? What is it? But that's the thing, it's like- That's a great room, you were asking about good rooms. That's a really great room. We're playing, we played there on our last, we did a stopover on our last tour, we're going again,

it's called the Gude Velen, which means the good savage. It used to be, that same bar used to be called DeClick, and it was owned by- They changed it to the good savage. It used to be, that same bar used to be called DeClick and it was owned by... They changed it to the good savage? Yeah, because change of ownership. Yeah, but the good savage feels like a name that you might have to change from in this political milieu. Oh, you think... I think going to... I think it's a reference to Russo, you know, like the...

What's the good savage? The noble savage? The noble savage, exactly. But anyways, it's the good the noble said the noble savage exactly? But anyways, it's it's buddy's average gets a little pushback in the current even Savage the number one even the number one. Yeah, right. It's still frowned upon you think Excuse my terrible nicotine habit. Oh, please. Please please indulge. I'll do it. I'll do it vicariously through you But no, so that's a room where we grew up playing a lot of shows, like our sort of high school projects. Like first shows. First shows were there, very sweaty, very drunken times. And then now we can go back and sort of have a, yeah, it's a small room. It feels like the floorboards are creaking when everybody's jumping up and down. Do you feel this

was a joy getting to have the creative development in a place where it didn't necessarily matter? I don't know how to describe that. Like I started out in Adelaide and a lot of good people come from Adelaide with stand-up and there are some good bands that have come out of there. But I think because there's a sense that you can do whatever you want. Because there's no public eye and there's no competition. Yeah. Or it's... Like I think if you're starting out in LA, something in your mind... Oh, 100%.

...permanently would be going, if I'm very good... No, no, no. ...this could be it for me. A big break coming. So, I'm super grateful not to have grown up in that sort of environment for our creative purposes. Yeah, and I think, you know, in many ways,

like, it's not something I've really thought about like that, but could definitely be responsible for the shit we're making not really fitting in any kind of obvious box I think like I don't know where it's like because we didn't have you know we've been part of like a scene here and there in Paris and in London in Luxembourg whatever scene you know we were in that but it was like never a kind of globally recognized you get to be D class a there were there were no there were no magazines writing about what was happening in Luxembourg you know what I mean ever culturally speaking like this and this has changed and they're doing

good work but like it's yeah it was it was an interesting interesting but I think not have that can be good I I mean again, yeah, one of the, at some point, when there's a scene and people start fitting into it in a way that doesn't make sense. I don't know how many plaid wearing long-haired, slightly detuned guitar bands came out of Adelaide back to back where everyone was allergic to choruses, because that wasn't, people would look down on you for that. But, uh, it broke my heart. Excuse me. Where was Silverchair from? Silverchair, intriguingly from Newcastle, tiny steel town.

So they were very free to go and do their own. Also their most interesting work had no impact in America at all, I think. Frogstom, the Nirvana stuff blew up big. And then after that, I don't know if you followed their later work. No, see, I'm living proof. Daniel John's very straight. He did some nice Beatles, the electro, we had felt strange piano ballads after that. Huge in Australia. That sounds great.

Because I think after the original work, the hard men of Newcastle had an excuse to listen to a man on the piano. It bore out his feelings. Oh, yes, I get to be sensitive behind doors. Oh, it's a beautiful, do you know the song Delight by Common? I don't think I do. There are times when you need someone I will be by your side Oh baby, it's just a beautiful

great chorus, there is a light, the shine special for you and me, And it's so saccharine. And I was at a black nightclub and all these guys are singing, these big, strong, tough guys are singing this beautiful, strange, special for you and me. And it's like, this has given you an opportunity to touch base with that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's really... Because this is someone you respect and they've given you the sense of the moment. I see that. I see that. That's a good... we're gonna listen to that in the car right after this.

Oh, now you've heard my version. I don't know that you'd ever want to go back and hear true. I like your version. I was in there. No, if I could sing it would be great. If I could sing. If I could sing. It's a great perverse that he's done that. Yeah, very perverse. Um, like, like much of his work. These bangs happen, that was a balloon. That was a balloon. Let me tell you, at night, the bangs in this neighborhood were out of control. It's one thing I will not miss. The gunshots in the air, you wouldn't get.

LA is very tightly gun controlled. Texas, they love just celebrating. Texas is definitely on the wilder side, but LA still gets... A little loose. A little loose on that side of things. Echo Park has been massively gentrified over the last I don't know what it is 15 years but still there's still some so I was I know nothing about it elements I think there's a Lightspeed Champion lyric about it but I don't know what that oh yeah there must be he's had he's had a big creative change and I know him, I've

met him, I love the Lightspeed Champion work. We're a huge Lightspeed Champion fan. But also before that Test Icicles. That's three absurdly different careers. True chameleon. I was blown away by that, I loved that as a sort of in my late teens I think I was am I crazy to think that this is kind of the album cover of that record was kind of in this Vibe I'm picturing something more like the Daft Punk record That's something else we're gonna listen to on tour. Yeah, I guess so test icicles

I mean, I mean what a fucking name I think I know and then I only went back because of the I thought this man with a cardigan was in a Yeah, I'd call Bay. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's true. He's tied up because a few very stark like Creative like shift big shit and like that but he's and then producing for the stars. Yeah, yeah killing it It's do you do this would you I mean he's now in his like what? Classical music. Is he doing the classical music phase? Classical music, I was on the blog back in the day and that would always he would always venture a string quartet or something and then yeah and then just disappear back into the other thing he was doing. Yeah but I think he's kind of

gone full into that as far as I know. Great. Mad Props to it. Beautiful to see. For sure. And here. Dev Hines! Check him out! Dev Hines, everyone. I want to... I want to... I did a... there was a show called Rage was the music video show in Australia. You know, like someone come and go here are my favorite music videos. I always wanted to be invited onto that and I never did. I'm very unsuccessful in my own country. The Prophet, you know, all these things. All the best Australians are, don't worry about it. I think yours was the first video that I, when I made my own, just on YouTube,

I thought that was handy. And I was so happy to have it there. But there's not, you have the best music videos that anyone's making. I think they're up there. They're in the top A tier of the categorization. That means a lot to me. How do we get great music videos out to people?

Because the old machinery, MTV's not playing music videos the way they used to. It's very sad. It's true, it was such a key component of like the music we were listening to as teenagers was how we first heard the music was usually like on TV with a video and that would like kind of sear it into your brain forever and ever. Oh yeah, and I mean very responsible for you know, the kind of world-building we're yeah doing with this project

You know where it's like so Linked, you know the performance and the visuals to the music. It's all like, you know, just that package But it's true. Nobody pushes those music videos onto unsuspecting teens anymore Not in the same way and I think I think that's a sad thing. Yeah, I mean, you know, la-di-da, a million things with the democratization of like, fuck, I said that word weirdly, but you know what I mean? Democratization.

That felt good. No, just like how everyone can shoot anything any time now, and it's like, you know, people are posting new music videos to tick-tock like every day basically now yeah more and more effort going into smaller and smaller things in a way so it's like what's the actual impact of putting like something that's deemed more like high art onto like a platform like that and like you know I gotta tell you my perverse joy is when people I'm in a new city and the people advertising their terrible songs and music videos on Instagram and you'll be you know like they narrowed eyes into

that city I'm like clicking along and then it's like they push it through the genuine schizophrenic having a folk album and you get to just I would never get to see that if they hadn't for some reason put $35 into an ad yeah right now this is the new public access TV, which is kind of amazing, actually, that not everything is super curated. And you get the psycho stuff as well as the good stuff. And it's great. The curation falling apart is in some ways great.

Very nice. The gatekeepers are gone. It also does make it harder to amplify and to find good things. Like if I'm just waiting through shit for days. I read something crazy, like the amount of songs that come out every day on the platforms is like, I can't, I don't want to, it blew my mind. Yeah, yeah. There was this one day at the end of 24 that they calculated that on that one day there

was more music that came out than the whole of 1981. And that, you know, just to give you a sort of... I'm pretty sure that was the first thing you... Perseverative, and yeah, no, exactly, that's the kind of figure I'm talking about, and it's just like... Yeah. On one side, it's like almost disheartening, because you're like, how do you cut through all of that?

But on the other side, it's completely freeing, because you're like, fuck it. Yeah, I'm going to do what I want, we're going to have the audience... I'm going to do exactly what I want, and there's no more gatekeeping. It's just like you find your audience, and your audience finds you, you know? I think rappers have an easy time of it because everyone gets a feature and the albums are so full of features So it's easy to put people on. Oh, yeah, and there is less room for that in Non-rap music. Yeah. Yeah, I agree. But it does happen sometimes I enjoyed that metronomy album The collab yeah, that was one of the records in And I think it was, we felt it was really cool of them to sort of use their, you know,

their clout and their influences as like a bigger indie band to like kind of push that and be like, no, we're gonna take all these like lesser known people that we really fuck with and put them on our, with our name on it and just like Put it out ASAP, you know, I think that's a great Great thing. It's democracy falling up into What would what does Socrates say? It shouldn't it shouldn't work that way. It shouldn't become Was it when a small group of people run the show? Oligarchy oligarchy. Yeah,'s meant to go straight to tyranny. I think. Straight to tyranny. I mean artists have to be tyrants in a way, you

know, like our... I'm thinking of Ian Svanonius, another artist and friend of ours who wrote a few books about bands and the... Yeah, highly recommend. Dynamics of Band. He wrote this book called the supernatural strategies for what is it? Starting a rock and roll band. Do you feel tyrannical with your, like, obviously the videos and the music are meticulous. Oh yeah, there's definite tyranny within Phil Real. Between us, but from us onto the world and yeah, it's all different levels of Terran I kept in its place tyranny can be very beautiful Yeah, there's no democracy involved I think of like Stanley Kubrick making people shoot eyes wide shut over a year and a half

Yeah, just to get it exactly Nicole Kidman's bum has to be exactly as I wish it to be it's it's strange because It's the only time that I become a I guess like a bad man is in stand-up I used to like I directed a couple comedy musicals and I'm so loosey-goosey go with the flow every other time of my life but when it comes to what's on stage you go no yeah we're doing it right yeah I think it's also like that feeling where like you know it's a it's a big effort it's a lot of work and like if you're not really doing it exactly like you want then why yes you know what's it's not really worth doing it yeah of

course a lot of people would disagree with that I'm not sure I fully agree with that either but it's like yeah it's a push and pull between that and the feeling of like wanting complete control and also having to let go because you collaborate there's other people on set you you entrust some decision making to other people and all of a sudden you have. And allows for like beautiful accidents as well and things that will take it to somewhere you never thought would be like even possible.

But it is very, the fear that mediocrity creeps in must be, I mean comedy, I let no one touch it. This is like, someone will suggest an idea and I think that's probably a very good idea. I cannot allow that idea to... I don't know why, I'm very distrusting. Because it's not yours. Yeah, something about... I mean what is the creative impulse that one is listening to to determine if something

is good or not? I mean, you know, we're guilty of something similar, you know similar with our first record where we, at some point along the road, we're like, no, we're going to have to be the writers, producers, arrangers, everything on the record. This needs to be the most DIY thing ever because it needs to be unfiltered, pure, like for realism, like from the source. And then we can open it up kind of thing you've got to know what it is before you let other people come and manifest it Exactly with each other I mean to have the two of you being creatively

you must butt heads at some point Oh yeah of course we do but where are the big arguments? There's quite a lot I guess like you know in terms of workflow like we work in maybe slightly different ways, which have become very complementary. And it works great.

But that's kind of sometimes where we butt heads, where I'm very OCD about a lot of things, especially in terms of meticulousness and process. He's a list maker. And I'm not. I think that's what it boils down to really at the end of the day. He'll make a very, very meticulously detailed list about what needs to happen in a certain color coded song and it's all color coded and there's dates and it needs to happen.

I'm much more like, I can be a lot more up in the air about it. It feels like a good, look at that, It's the shirts. It's the in yang. Yeah it's been a lot of how this project has been like working and kind of Living on healthy and you feel they need to explain when you feel passionate about something Creatively are you able to put it into words as to why you think that's a good idea or are there times where you go? This simply has to be the way it is because I feel very strongly about it. That's one thing that works very seamlessly with us I think is the fact that we don't need to explain much to each other because we have such a history of like the same, you

know we grew up in this like in this listening to the same things and looking at the watching the same films and so we have an understanding of like what the other sees in a thing and they don't have to be like we have to do this because of ABC and then ABC you know it's like very instinctive yes and I think we trust each other's gut feelings so there's a layer of communication there that doesn't have to exist because that's when things get a little fucked up when you can't communicate things properly. I'm thinking about this a lot, but in the bigger industry, creatively, when you have to explain something, it can be impossible.

Things get lost in translation. People interpret it however they're gonna interpret it, but when you don't, there's not always a justification for something like that. It's just it has to be like that because it has to because it's gonna be good. Yeah, and one of the one of the best I think explainers of this whole Thing was that the late great David Lynch. Yeah, famously was always saying like No, like I'm not gonna write about they sensitize to the banks. It doesn't move

You know, it's like I Critics can write about my films like I'm not, I don't need to tell anyone what they mean, you know. Even I don't know what they mean kind of thing. He was like the film is the explanation. If it works it works. It works it works and that's it. I remember I watched a video of him smoking his American Spirit cigarettes, getting very

angry during the filming of one of the later Twin Peaks seasons. And he's going like, they're giving me no no time we need time to play to get interesting things like that he's there he doesn't even know what he's looking for but he's finding it he has a framework and he'll find it eventually absolutely yeah and I mean that goes with this whole like you know catching the big fish yeah like meditator he read that the other the other week actually so it's such a I don't know this hold on oh catching the big Fish was this book that he wrote, which actually I think he wrote to raise funds for his meditation foundation.

Okay. So it's a book about how, you know, he famously, Lynch famously practiced Trisodental Meditation for... Hold on, let me check that the video's still going. For one second. Are we still going with the video? I worry that I didn't put it on airplane mode, and if I get a text or something, hey, great. I'm no good at the transcendental medication

being in the moment. So the book is about sort of the intersection of his meditation practice and what it... And creativity and workflow and like... But it's a lot about like harnessing ideas and catching them as he says because he says you catch them. He says the deeper you go, you know, the deeper you go in the psyche that's where you catch the big fish, that's where they are, you know.

If you stay on the surface, you don't really catch them. You catch the small fish, the small idea. So you got to go deep in there. That's where things like sort of source. And there's no really explaining it. It's just, that's what your mind does. And I don't know, that sort of, yeah, strikes a chord, I think, for sure, with us. And when it's good, it's good to know it.

I mean, it must be very, all those balloons will be gone at some point. I mean, it's hard, because the business is pushing you against that at all times I would have to think they want you to have you know you got a product by a certain date and in a certain style and Of course you know money is nice because you can exchange it for goods and services is what I always say But isn't it yeah, that's that's one of the good things about money for sure as goods and services but I think you look at

Not to sound pedantic or anything, but like if you look at the history of art, you know, yeah From like centuries back like it this was always a thing like the artist was being paid by a rich patron to do you know paint a fresco on the ceiling of some chap, of the family chap or whatever. And then, and then they would come in, the patrons would come in like months later and they'd be like, first of all, this isn't even half done. Second of all, why is everybody naked? Like none of this is good.

And it's like, no. And the artists would be like, no, but this is art. And it'd be great conflicts. And they go broke and they die of dysentery and some ditch. And I think that's always existed, that sort of industry versus like art. Like, and I think it's integral. It's an integral part of the art practice.

So nice not to die in a ditch. It's good not to die in a ditch. She'd be good not to die in a ditch. I'm listening to, there's a podcast at the moment that's just come out on the rest of history about, they have one episode about Mozart and one on Beethoven. And so like, Mozart is the first to to go like I'm not gonna have a patron I'm just gonna make my work. I'm gonna make the work. I want to make and everybody was like you're insane

You're gonna die It's sort of like shifting to the first what musician bedroom musician. Yeah, I'm gonna sit here. I'm gonna Mozart is better. I just figure I knew how to take I'm making his words not lo-fi because this 47 dudes but uh, but then like the economics change by a certain point and you don't get to choose the economic Milieu in which you're living in to make the way you live in the world That you get taken care of and you know, if you have children you can feed them but uh That is secondary to making the work that you want to make I think

Which is sad and hard, I'm sorry honey. It's difficult. It's difficult, but I think the great balancing act between selling your soul and dying in a ditch, that's where a lot of the flavor is, you know? Well, who's... I mean, Austin, I think, to bring it back, and we should... Quick promotion of the tour. You're doing a lot of dates all across America, and where are...

In Luxembourg? So, we started in Mexico a couple days back, and we're now touring all over the US, a bit of Canada, and then we're going over to mainland Europe and then the UK. That would be so nice. Yeah. I wanted to get that out before but now i forgot what i was gonna say i was gonna say austin careful, bitch got me

it's fine, if i get messy i get messy i think austin has been a nice weird i mean they keep austin weird is the thing they always say but it has like attracted a bunch of people who you can have a quieter cheaper life than l.a. here oh yeah and still feel like you can tour places i think bill callahan's been here for a long time. I cannot find him. He's uh... He seems like an elusive character. Called the record label. There was just a guy there who was like, I'll put that through. I'll never hear back, it's fine. He's out there doing

something. I think Willie Nelson is still here. Oh he's holding the whole thing together I think. Yeah, think probably when he got behind the scene The great passing of energy. Oh, I mean, then it'll just be a bad tech capital. Yeah, I mean, yeah again push and pull But the Austin definitely has that I mean there's and they the Move over between like Austin and LA is quite porous There's a lot of people from Austin who end up in LA and I think vice versa because yes yeah, it's not it's not too far in terms of climate and vibes and

It doesn't feel especially Texan you drive a little bit outside of Austin and then very quickly the hats come out and yeah, and Yeah, weird things like I said a Dallas McDonald's and someone that did flower arrangements on the tables that little flat while you know this weird some sort of weird something else now that he's going to be the dot as i have my mcgriddle i'm looking at a beautiful flower for you had the mcgriddle no i'll let's uh... so give you kill you

that's the start of the wondering that the size of people here it's i think largely attributable to the mcgriddle well it's like uh... yesutable to the McGriddle. Wow. It's like yes like a waffle McMuffin. Yeah. It sounds amazing. It does actually. I can't say enough nice things about it. It's making me hungry. It's changed me and improved me. I have no idea how long we've been going for. We've been going a minute but it's been it's been flowing. Well I want to 50 minutes. 50 minutes is good. Look at that beautiful squirrel. Oh but it's yeah. Austin's weird and wonderful in many ways. A lot of people are already lamenting the change but.

Yeah constantly. I mean I think it's happened in the last 10 years. It's weird to think that a thing can change so quickly. And then I felt bad about all the skyscrapers getting thrown up and then someone told me listen it's they're all parking lots Yeah, like it just used to be So like there was a beautiful historic market. That's yeah I was just vacant lot. There's a vacant lot and now it's a glass tower that contributes about the same to the

Overall good community few I start just for me to complain about that. What's now hot on? What would you like to in terms of putting people on you know? who do you think is doing interesting work now that you would like to celebrate all right here's a few off the top of my head um first off one of our very favorite uh artists songwriter producers who is uh opening for us tomorrow night in Denton, Texas, where I believe they are from, somebody called Yalkey. Yalkey. Yeah. Y-A-L-C-Y.

Y. C-Y, I think. We gotta look that up. Yeah. I'll find out. I'll put a link to it. Really good music. Incredible, incredibly

criminally overlooked.ally overlooked let's say but already has a quite long history of history sorry of amazing underground mix tapes and music that's been floating around Austin and you know the general area for some time now like our friend from Texas put us on to him. There's a few artists that we're lucky enough to share the stage with on this tour that are really I was mentioning Montreal where we're sharing the stage with Sean Nicholas Savage who's a friend. There was a long stretch the Kieran J. Callen interview that will never come out about Sean Nicholas Savage. He's a very...

And I got put onto... Influential man. Life is Crazy. Mm-hmm. I was walking around New York listening to the first track off that... Yeeeeeah, it's from tonight! Yeah, yeah! I... It's so beautiful.

He's writing a Disney soundtrack. Yeah. He constantly... His songs are unbelievable. We were lucky enough to be the recipients of a secret link to his upcoming record on the last tour that we listened to in the car a lot. So there's that. Another dear friend and performer that we've shared the stage with a few times is someone called writer the eagle Okay, writer with a why I highly recommend checking that out one of you know, like one of few true true artists true artists like great romantics and like

Just absolute puts out record souls like just record after record of like heart-wrenching drum machine ballads and tours like a madman completely alone I mean with his partner now Bambi who's also an amazing artist in her own right but he's written on art like you know nice thing to be on the road with your woman despite the fact I'm guessing Bambi's a woman, just by the name Bambi. Yes, yes. Writers and man, Bambi's a woman. But, I mean, other than the fact that he's a dear friend of ours, like his music is genuinely

like some of the... Yeah, unhappy rotation. Some of my favorite music that's coming out. I listened to Kieran's latest record, On would be when it came out. I thought it was brilliant, maybe his his best yet I thought that as well I thought it was also I mean he it's very noisy and it was maybe the most turbulent year of my we moved here I got three small kids and the wife and I was unemployed and we had no car and that record came out and it was just like that is how it feels inside my brain yes yeah it is a 22nd harpsichord solo at the end of a song about a young man being killed in a

car. That is how I feel. Couple more would be another sibling duo from Oaxaca, I believe, called Valgur, who opened for us in Mexico City. Oaxaca in Mexico. Oaxaca. They're based in Mexico City. Oaxaca in Mexico. Oaxaca. They're based in Mexico City. They have been for the last sort of 10 years.

They opened the show last night and two nights ago in Mexico City. Really incredible stuff. Sort of lo-fi, like 80s inspired ballads, but it's kind of liturgical and like ritualistic. Video game, like otaku kind of liturgical and like ritualistic. It's video game, like otaku kind of liturgical, 80s bubble gum pop. Like it's incredible. Great. Brother and Genesis, Evangelion. Yeah, yeah.

Okay. Totally. Even the imagery. That's the only two things coming together with liturgy and the anime. Yeah, yeah. It's kind of in that world. That was an amazing... And a last thing that comes to mind is...

The last artist is our friend Nuh-Hah Ruby Ra from London. Really dope, kind of like doom pop, kind of like alt-rock-y. It's hard to describe, but I just highly recommend checking that out as well. Also an incredible live performer and dear friend. She's kind of the punk priestess of the East London underground scene and revered as such. She's been holding it down and her records are simply great. So worth a check out. Look, I appreciate that.

I appreciate your time. I hope this tour is a beautiful, creative, and financial return. The road is tough. The road is tough. The road is long. The road is tough. But I'm glad you're doing it. I have a show tonight at 9 and 10.55 also on Sixth Street.

But I'm going to waddle down. So if I leave 25 minutes in, it's not because I'm having a bad time, it's because I have to go and talk about my work in a room. We're gonna make sure that first 25 minutes is jam-packed for ya. Jam-packed.

If you would, I'd appreciate it. I'm looking forward to it. Spoiler alert, it is. It is. All right. Thanks for your time, James. Thank you so much. Cheers.

Thank you. Ken Amaran, ho! The podcast is about me buying a boat. Oh nice. I never talk about it. Hey, we hope to get you on the water. Well look, at some point, I will say this, are we still going on the video? Alright, here's an idea right now.

I had ages ago, but at some point, if I can become successful enough, I think it would be cool to have, I would call it, Boatapalooza. Because I'm trying to get $500,000 for the boat, and music festivals in Australia, the dollar's very weak at the moment, but we used to have great music festivals, and they've all been shutting one after the other. I heard about this. To start a truly great music festival, just in Adelaide, in the hills potentially. There was a nice one in a mall that shut down called Arcadia, that's how we all met Kieran

in Adelaide he came and he headlined this very strange abandoned mall gig and did not play the hits played strange industrial guitar music for 40 minutes. Sounds perfect. It was really great but look if you could come on and help program and perform in if we have the money there's Bota Palooza I have no plans to make it happen I'm remembering it now as an idea I had a year ago back back when I had more hope and ambition. Sounds awesome. We would love to be involved in Bota Palooza.

That's right up our alley. I'll hold you to it. Yeah, yeah, please do. It's a verbal contract. Right here, right there. Alright, you've got things to do. You've got to rivet a swim in. Thank you so much.

Cheers. What a joy. What a night. Thank you. Pleasure. Thanks for having me. Cheers. What a joy. Pleasure. Thank you. Pleasure. Thanks for having me. Just do a quick clap.

Ted Meeks. It will make your life easier.