The Joe Rogan Experience - #1044 - C.T. Fletcher

Episode Date: November 28, 2017

C.T. Fletcher is an ex-powerlifter, actor, and video-blogger. He is a 3-Time World Bench Press Champion and 3-Time World Strict Curl Champion. https://odysseynutraceuticals.com

All right, CT, we're live. What's up? Hey, finally. Finally. Across the table from Joe Rogan himself. My pleasure, man. I watched your Netflix documentary today. Did you?

It's great, man. It's intense. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. When I first saw it, I was like, what is this going to be about? But you get into it and you're like, whoa, there's a lot going on in this documentary. That guy says more than fuck, huh? It's not just that.

It's like they just went deep into your life and to everything, the struggles, the heart condition, the whole deal, man. Yeah. It's heavy. They did a pretty good job. Yeah. So where are you standing now, like health-wise? Oh, okay. Yeah. It's heavy. They did a pretty good job. Yeah. So where are you standing now, like health-wise? Oh, okay. Yeah. I fought my way back. And just recently, this June, I had another setback, had another major setback, had a heart attack out of the blue. And I thought I was a goner again,

Joe, but I'm still here. So you had a heart attack. They fixed your heart. They put in an artificial valve. And then what happened with the second? Okay. That lasted for 12 years. I had 05. I had to open heart surgery. I actually passed away or flatlined three times during that surgery. And then this past June, out of the blue, I'm thinking, well, it's not really out of the blue. I kind of had a few signs, but I thought I, you know, I didn't think it was that serious. And then I had another heart attack sitting on the couch at home. And I thought I was gone for sure, man. Well, what's confusing to a lot of people is you're obviously this like

intense, healthy guy and you're, you're fit and you're healthy guy and you're you're fit and you're lifting weights and you're looking jacked like is it a condition that you were born with a genetic condition it is most definitely hereditary my mother and all nine of her siblings all passed away from heart related problems and my mom had the CHF and lungs. So none of them lived past 72. My mom died at 63. They all passed away from it. How old are you now?

I'm 58. And so you've gotten through two of them so far. Yeah, so far. And what did they do after the second heart attack? Well, the next thing, I had a pacemaker installed, and I already had the metal valve, and I think they've done just about all they can do to this one I got with me now. So they tell me the next step is a transplant.

Man, that's intense. Yeah, but you know what, Joe? It's not so intense for me. I think I have an advantage to somebody else who might be getting the news. And that advantage is I've been through so much already, man, until, you know, it's just when you flatline three times, it ain't too much else can, you know, throw you for too many loops. I got a lot of faith.

Yeah. Now, so are you in line for a transplant now? Is that how that works? Yeah. Well, it's a really long process to even get on the list. So I'm going through that process now. I'm almost through the end, but it's a really long process. They presented my case to the doctors who perform

the actual transplant. And they said that I'm a good candidate and everything's looking up right now, except I may have a little throwback. I had a cancer biopsy yesterday. And if that's positive, then that's going to hold me up a little bit. Oh, Jesus Christ. man. Yeah. Fuck. Yeah, I know. It's just crazy because when you look at a guy like you, and you look at you, especially when you're in your prime, you think there's nothing that's going to stop this guy.

Shit, I didn't think so either. I mean, I feel like your muscles are strong, your heart's a muscle. Shit, his heart's got to be ridiculous. Yeah, I thought so. I thought I was indestructible, Joe, but obviously I was wrong. Well, you pretty much, I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but you pretty much became famous

from the internet, right? Oh, definitely. And that's what launched you, right? Definitely. Nobody knew who I was until I was 53 years old. When I was world champion, nobody knew or gave a fuck about who 53 was.

So that's pretty much when I found out about you then. When you first started making YouTube videos, that's when I found out about you. I think someone on Twitter sent me a – people send me cool shit on Twitter all the time. I retweet it or I'll find out about it and send it to other people. And someone sent me some – well, I've seen a bunch of your videos, but one of them was you working out with Tyron Woodley, UFC welterweight champion. And I was like, Jesus Christ, he's going to break them. He got Tyron doing all these crazy supersets and all this different shit.

So have you worked with a lot of MMA fighters? Not a lot, but a few. Oh, man. Are we going to talk about the fake feud? Oh, that wasn't a—yeah, we could talk about it, but it didn't. It wasn't a fake feud. Oh, man. It really –

Your light is killing me. Oh, yeah. It just keeps lighting your face up. We've got to talk about it. We've got to talk about it. Well, people thought that we were really upset at each other. The debate was, and this is a constant debate in MMA, whether big muscles enhance you or hurt you. And my take on it is they do both.

My take on it is the bigger the muscle, the more power you have. And I think Tyron is a perfect example of a guy who's figured out how to use them perfectly. Like what he does is he conserves his energy, and when he sprints, you can't stop him. So like when he's in the cage and he has these moments of explosion, the amount of horsepower that he can generate in a short period of time is just above and beyond everybody else in the division. And it's a terrifying thing for everybody in the division. But he can't operate at the same pace constantly like some of the guys can. Some of the guys who have less muscle, they're carrying around less mass, they have less oxygen requirements, they can go longer, but they just can't generate the same kind of power but what tyrant's figured

out how to do pretty brilliantly is how to conserve his energy into these bursts and and then now like his big criticism earlier in his career was that he would gas out as he got into the later rounds but now he's able to fight five rounds no problem. He just fights it at his pace. Exactly. But that's not exactly I want to start it with this, Joe. Okay. Now, for all the people

who said that I would never be able to sit down across the table from Joe Rogan, I want to take a special moment to say fuck y'all right now. I'm here and I attacked Joe Rogan

on the internet. I attacked him and I want to explain. I got the opportunity to explain to you. It's true. I did attack Joe Rogan and I want to have the opportunity to explain to you why exactly I did that. Okay.

And I want to do that because I don't want you to think I'm just an asshole. No, I didn't think you were an asshole at all. It didn't bother me at all. Oh, okay. It didn't change my feelings. I never attacked you back. No, you sure didn't. But you know what you did do, Joe?

What? What that I couldn't get you to do before that was you actually talked to me. You tried to talk to me before that? I wanted to to me you're trying to talk to me i wanted to talk to you i didn't know that i had people uh you know because i'm really cool with a lot of ufc fighters and uh i i said i wonder if even even knows when i had people that was especially set out to keep uh tagging you until you we're going to get you on the podcast people try to do that that shit does not work this is the best way to not get on the podcast is to get a bunch of people

to try to get you on the podcast hey Joe hey Joe we want to have CTO and you know my response is always you know Joe he probably don't even know who the fuck I am man just you know quit tagging me he don't even know who the fuck I am, man. Just, you know, quit tagging me. He don't even know who the fuck I am. Just quit tagging him. Don't bother the man. That was my, you know, response to them all the time, all the time. I just said,

look, don't bother Joe. He's busy. He don't know who the fuck I am. I'm not, you know, not in that league. So don't even bother him. Then I said, well, you know what? I got these fighters. I know all these fighters and they friendly with me. I said, maybe Joe do know who I am. And I'm like, you know what? After a while,

maybe Joe just don't like my ass. So I said, you know what? So when the Tyron Woodley thing came up and Joe was talking about the muscular guy, I said, well,

you know, here's my opportunity. I said, hey Joe, you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. And as soon as I said, hey Joe,

that motherfucker don't know what the fuck he's talking about. Then you responded to me. hey, joke, that motherfucker don't know what the fuck he talking about, then you responded to me. Well, I responded to you because I like you. Oh, wow. That's why I responded to you. That's why I didn't attack you back.

Yeah. I get why people, here's the thing, I get why people would think that I don't respond because I don't like you. I just can't keep up. There's no way.

Oh, man, I understand. I found out I have 1.6 million fake followers, though. Oh, wow. Or at least, apparently that's not a real good measurement. You know, the Twitter audit, it's just people who don't use their account to tweet. Maybe they just check Twitter. I don't know. I don't know whether or not.

But I've never paid for any of the fake ones. They might be Russian bots. I don't know what it is. But there's too many people. Yeah, it is. If I look at my mentions, and then at least 1% of them are assholes. So you read one asshole's thing, it's like, fuck this. Just put your phone down.

So it's not a matter of me not liking people. It's a matter of me being in an impossible situation. There's no way I can keep up with all those people. You're the only one guy. I understand that completely. I am the only one guy. I don't let anybody fuck with my Twitter. There's no way I can keep up with all those people. You're the only one guy. I understand that completely. I am the only one guy. I don't let anybody fuck with my Twitter. Nobody's doing that. That's all me. Wow. Yeah, so

if you get a tweet from me, it's from me. There's no way I can keep up with all of them. So people that try to talk to me and get a hold of me, if you think I'm ignoring you, it's just... I'm ignoring everything. Yeah. Well, now I don't feel so bad. Well, yeah, that was it.

I wanted to get your attention. I was trying to get that. So that's why I came out with the attack. Well, it worked. Yeah, it did. I was trying to be nice for all this time. Sometimes I'm an asshole. Then he responds.

I said, oh, man. I said, hey, look, okay, Joe, you're absolutely right. I jumped on you. I shouldn't have jumped on you like that. But we do possess a little difference of opinion on the muscle guys. Yeah, you do. So tell me what you think. Okay.

I was trying to explain that I know you have to have known guys like this that are naturally, naturally just more muscular, more built, and they look like they lift weights and work out, but they don't. Right. Guys like, you know, I know this guy, uh, Herschel Walker. Sure. Outstanding athlete, you know, and, uh, Bo Jackson, for example, outstanding athlete, you know, and Bo Jackson, for example. These guys, fantastic athletes, muscular, very muscular guys. But I think if you were born, born muscular, there's a difference in a guy that goes in the gym and works out three, four hours a day and adds muscle on. He started out, you know, a normal guy. But if you were born with that muscle,

then you were born with the cardiovascular system, the lungs, and whatnot, to support that muscle. And you take it way, way back to guys like Jim Thorpe, okay, head and shoulders above all the other athletes of his era because he was born that way. So he was born, the good Lord give us the cardiovascular syndrome, the lungs and everything to, you know, to go along with that extra muscle that we were born with in some cases.

In some cases. Now, I thought that you were making a blanket statement, and it covered a lot of, you know, that all muscular guys are going to tire out because of the extra muscle. And I disagree because I think if they were born with that muscle, then they were born with the support system to support that muscle. I think there's a lot of logic to that. I think it makes sense. But I do think that if you have a certain amount of muscle, like there's just no way you are going to be,

you're going to have the same cardiovascular capabilities as someone that's built like a marathon runner. You're not going to have, the marathon runner has, there's advantages and disadvantages, I think, to all sorts of body types, especially when it comes to fighting. There's a big advantage to being powerful. It's scary. Look, you look at a guy like Woodley, you go, oh shit. You know, like, you know, you can't stop him. Like the only thing that's going to stop him is him getting tired or you got to catch him when he's coming in right he's just faster than you stronger than you so there's there's benefits to that but i think that when it comes to like there's no you're never going to see a marathon runner that's built like woodley they just don't exist so even though

he has the the cardiovascular system and the support system that's designed for that build that he's born with, he still is never going to be able to compete with like an elite triathlete because your body has to be smaller. You have to have less oxygen requirements, less weight that you're carrying around. There's just no, there's no way, but there's benefits. There's certain, it's a real, it's a real like balancing act, I think at MMA, because you have to have some muscle. You have to be able to get guys off you. You have to be able to get guys off you. You have to be able to get up from the bottom.

You have to be able to explode. You have to be able to close the distance quickly. There's a lot of real benefits to being powerful. But then it's a balancing act. You're right, Joe. But here we go. It's not just muscle. You don't see marathon runners that are, you know, 250 pounds either.

They can be fat, smooth, butterball, and still, you know, it's not because of the musculature that they, you know, just bigger guy, period, would have a hard time being a marathon runner. Sure. So the musculature, that's where we have a little, I don't think it's the musculature because that musculature, if you're born, if you're just born more muscular. And you can look at little kids in grade school and you'll see some of the kids are going to have a six pack. They're going to just be built better than the other kids. And if that muscle, you were born with that muscle, in my opinion, it's just my opinion, Joe. If you were born with that muscle and that musculature, it's not going to be detrimental. And your system is made for it.

It's a little major system. But you're right. You won't see anybody built like Tyron Woodley running in the New York Marathon or winning the New York Marathon. He could run in it. He could run in it, but he won't win it. He's going to be a little bit behind. He'll be right behind Oprah. Yeah, and me.

Oprah doped into the marathon in like 4 hours and 20 minutes recently that's pretty fucking impressive and me she would beat me man yeah you're right but I think that that's just a bigger person period

yeah how they're defined or the definition of musculature you know I know Boss Root and I talked to

Boss Root a little bit about it and I said hey man Boss you're built like a fucking statue and shit. And he goes, oh, man, he was quick. Hey, man, but I don't lift weights. And I said, you're proving my point.

Right, right. You're proving my point, dude. And that's what I'm saying. If you were born that way, you didn't go in the gym and lift weights. I don't lift weights. I don't like to. You're proving my point, Boss. You're right. You don't

you know, you didn't get that muscle from going in the gym and pumping iron and getting it. You were born that way. And so Well, he was born that way, but Boss also does a tremendous amount of plyos, like a lot of explosive stuff, like all of his bag work. You ever see Boss hit

the bag? Oh my God. Tremendous. Oh man, that dude is bad. He's ferocious. Yes. And everything he does, he does like with a thousand percent effort. So, you know, his workouts, like he would tell me that the way he would work out was when he would prepare for a five minute round, when he would start to get in shape, he would go as hard as he could for like a minute and then like be exhausted. And then he would work himself up to a minute and a half, then work himself up to two minutes. And then by the end of his training camp, he'd go five minutes full clip.

I'm like, that's a fucking crazy method. It fucking worked. But in, you know, against that is boss's body started to deteriorate because he's so goddamn tough. Like he has no cartilage in his knees. His knees are completely shot. know against that his boss's body started to deteriorate because he's so goddamn tough like he has no cartilage in his knees his knees are completely shot he kept shooting cortisone on all of his joints like whenever he'd have injuries so his joints are all fucked up he's got tendonitis everywhere wow it's just he's his mind was too strong for like the vehicle that it was carrying

his mind around wow yeah he's ferocious. Yeah, he's one of the best of all time. What do you think about Matt Hughes? I love Matt Hughes. Okay, how's he built? He's built like a tank. Have you ever seen him gas out? Well, no, but, you know, Matt Hughes in his day,

let me see how to put this. First of all, he's not built like a tank like maybe the way Woodley's built. He's a little bit more slight than Woodley, but still pretty goddamn thick. But also, what he was able to do, too, was he was such a good wrestler, he was able to dictate where the fight takes place. And a good wrestler can control situations, take guys down, and then once you're on top, you get a break.

You could rest, and then he would use you're on top like you get a break you know you can you could rest and then you know he would use his ground and pound and submit guys he was one of the first guys ever too that was a high level wrestler that started submitting dudes yeah submitted george saint pierre yeah i remember that george is good good friend of mine too also built really well like a brick shit house, another one. And cardio is pretty damn good. Not bad. Yeah, you're making my point. Well, I just think there's requirements, right?

Yeah. And if you can get into a physical shape where you can use those muscles the way you need to do, the way you need to do inside the octagon, I mean, there's obviously a great benefit to being muscular. Well, I think that guys that were naturally born like that, and I think St. Pierre and Hughes both were, I mean, wasn't Matt a farm boy? Oh, yeah. Yeah, I think those guys were born more muscular.

Sure. His brother's built just like him, too. Yeah. Yeah. And if you're born like that, then I think, you know, but the guys that go in the gym and put on muscle, they add the muscles of what I call built muscle. So they have smaller hands, smaller frame. Yeah.

When you got that built muscle, that built muscle tires out real fast. And I agree with you 100% on a guy that has built muscle. That went into the gym and pumped iron and got his muscles that way. I agree with you 100%. Joe, you're absolutely correct. He's going to tire out those added-on muscles. The oxygen is going to suck the wind. And he's going to be tired as fuck in no time.

Are you aware of Francis Ngannou? Oh, yeah. He's fighting this weekend. And Francis Ngannou just broke the world record for the most power ever shown in a punch. They have this machine that they use worldwide. It's widely accepted that this is one of the best ways to measure a punch. It's this large pad, and you hit it with full power, and it generates it.

Francis Ngannou beat the second place by some insane amount of power. I mean, he's a ridiculously powerful dude. Oh, my God. He scares the shit out of everybody. Here he is right here. So they show this is this thing. It shows what the original world record was, and then Ngannou broke it by like 3,000 pounds or some shit.

Oh, my God. Look at that. Yeah, he's ridiculous. He's terrifying. You know, they found this dude. Yeah, he's ridiculous. He's terrifying. You know, they found this dude. He was a homeless guy. He was homeless? He was homeless living in France.

And he made his way into a gym. I believe he wanted a box. And when they brought him in, so I guess his, let's see, 129,161 units. The previous one was 114,000. Like, what in the fuck? And Tyrone Spahn, who's a beast! So, Francis Ngannou, who's fighting this weekend, who is

fighting Alistair Overeem, who's another beast. Fantastic fight. Any predictions? Chaos. I predict chaos. That's a safe prediction right there. Yeah, I think that's the same. I predict chaos. That's the same good prediction right there. Yeah, I mean, I was talking about this on my MMA podcast that Alistair's been stopped. I think in MMA he's been stopped at least 11 times. And I think he's been stopped three or four times in kickboxing as well.

There's like 14 KOs plus knocked out in his career, either TKO'd or knocked out. That's the guy that's got to be worried about getting hit by the guy who's got the world record punch. Yeah, it's going to be youth and exuberance versus experience. Craftiness. Yeah, craftiness. Very crafty.

That's what it's going to be. I agree. The consequences of Alistair getting hit, though, are so grave. Ngannou is so terrifying. Yeah, yeah. And you think, I mean, possibilities are pretty good. Yeah, it's very interesting. I mean, Ngannou was supposed to fight Junior Dos Santos at one point,

which was also a really interesting fight. But I think the Alistair-Overeem fight is more dangerous for him, but also it's going to let everybody know. Because Alistair's at the top of the heap in the heavyweight division. Ngannou can get by Alistair Overeem fight is more dangerous for him but also it's going to let everybody know because Alistair's at the top of the heap in the heavyweight division and if Ngannou can get by Alistair most likely he'll get a shot at the title very soon. Right, so what do you think of his ground game? Well, we don't know too much about him

other than he submitted one guy in the octagon and we know that he does have submission skills. He was one fight by submission. I think Anthony Hamilton. But I think he's, first of all, every fight starts standing up. You've got to get through hell to get that guy to ground. Good luck. And he's been taken down before and survived and came back to knock the guy out.

And he's also still learning and growing. Yeah. I mean, he just started, really. Pretty much. Yeah. He's only been doing it for a few years. learning and growing. Yeah. I mean, he just started, really. Pretty much. Yeah. He's only been doing it for a few years. He's terrifying. Yeah.

Potential is unbelievable. Yeah. Well, you know what I think he represents? I think he represents a real world-class athlete that's fighting in MMA. Whereas, like, maybe that guy would have gone to football or somewhere else in another era. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. But now that MMAma is you know

it's like i say think the same thing about john jones like john jones i think could have done anything but john jones got into mma and you see what happens when you see a real world-class athlete oh man john's uh uh i like john and i got to meet him a few times and he told me that he listens to me before he goes out and you know before he goes out and fight and I thought that was a real honor for him to say that he likes this I am the one speech that I

did and he always said say it along with me C.T. we were standing there yelling in his phone I am the one and he goes out and kills people. He does. He's a murderer, man. Yeah, I hope he sorts all his problems out.

I don't know what the fuck's going on with this recent positive drug test. So we'll see. It seems like the only guy that can beat John Jones is John Jones. Well, that's what they used to say about Tyson. Yep, and it's true. And it was true. It's true. You won all of your world records

drug-free. Yeah, 100% drug-free. I was drug-free for 37, 38 years, but I did try. I did try roids in 1980

or 81, I believe it was. Before it became illegal, I tried them. What'd you try? I tried. I went to a doctor, and I don't know if I should say this fucker's name because he might still be alive, but the same doctor that Arnold and all the guys who were in the magazines. I thought everybody was drug-free. I didn't think.

Right. I didn't think. Right. Because nobody talks. It's a weird thing about those magazines, right? Yeah, yeah. Everybody would talk about the creatine they're taking. Brings chain amino acids. Yeah. Oh, fucking, man.

I couldn't wait to go out and get some of them amino acids and shit, man. So they got me for sure because I thought that's what they were taking. But I won a couple of little contests, and the guy who was promoting the contest came to me and said, what are you taking, CT? And I had 20-inch arms then. I thought everybody, I thought every fucking body that's seen those magazines or honored anybody else was drug-free. He goes, what are you taking? And I told him amino acids and shit, and he goes, oh, man, what kind of steroids are you taking?

I said, what's that? And he said, you don't know what a steroid is. You didn't even know what a steroid was? I didn't even know what the fuck it was, man. Wow. I'm from Compton. So he told me, you know, you got to go to this doctor. And he gave me the address and everything.

And I said, I don't know if I should say the doctor's name. But I still remember. And I went me the address and everything. And I said, I don't know if I should say the doctor's name, but I still remember. And I went to the doctor and got up to my nose and ears and shit and listened to my lungs and gave me a prescription for Deca. Yeah, he gave me a prescription for some Deca-Dirablin. And I took it right to Kaiser Pharmacy. And the pharmacist, I said, you know what this is and I said yes fucking steroids I think and he said yeah it's bad you don't need this shit well look I'm gonna give it try I want to be a professional bodybuilder they

told me if I want to be a professional and be like Arnold Franklin the rest of guy I got to take this shit so I want to take it and he gave it to me uh grudgingly he got filled with prescriptions for me i took it off and i took my deca and then uh went back to the doctor and he gave me no trips for uh testosterone so i took deca and testosterone and did you notice a difference fuck yes yeah fuck yes i noted the difference but you got off of it yeah i got off of it but i had uh i had reason i had reasons and you want me to tell you what those were sure okay it worked it definitely worked uh i got fucking hard as you know just tight as fuck. But it also

I don't know if it does this to every one of the people when I tell them about this sometimes. Nah, nah, you must have been an asshole before. And that's quite possibly true. Because I was pretty much an asshole because of the way I was raised.

I had a bad attitude going in. So when I got on the scene, it seemed to amplify my bad attitude. And I had a short fuse. Was this a UFC fighter named Short Fuse? Ed Herman. Yeah, yeah. Well, I should have had that nickname way before Ed Herman, man, because I had fucking Short Fuse and everything, everything pissed me off.

So I had a really bad attitude. I was married at the time. You know, I had a real bad attitude with my wife and she couldn't do shit wrong, Joe. I mean, nothing, man. But, okay, that was part of it. And another big, big fucking thing with me is what I love more than muscles and lifting weights and fast cars.

And I love all that shit. It's sex. And a big, giant, big old giant thing. When I rolled over to have sex and nothing was happening, I said, fuck these steroids. Fuck these steroids. So this, when you got off of them? Yeah.

Nobody told me. Yeah. The crash. Yeah. It was like, oh, you got to take this, this other shit to make this shit.

Clomid. Yeah. I'm like, man, fuck that. Anything. Joe, anything.

That kills your boners. Fuck it. Fuck it. Fuck it. Oh, no, no. Anything is going to do that.

I'd rather be 110 pounds soaking wet and still be able to get my boner. Yeah. Fuck that. It must have affected your lifting, too, because what comes is a giant dip in your natural testosterone once you get off of it, right? It's bad, huh? once you get off of it, right? It's bad, huh? It was the,

because I decided, fuck this shit, fuck this shit. How long were you on it for? A total of six months, but what they do is, they told us back then, you do two months on and two months off. So it took longer, so I do two months on,

I take two months off, two months on, two months off. Right, right. That was the... Protocol. Yeah, that's what they months off. That was the protocol. Yeah, that's what they told us. That's what Dr. Man, whatever his name is, told us how to do. So it was a total of six months, but it took longer than that because I had two months off in between, two months off.

And that stuff, it definitely, definitely. But what they don't tell you is when you stop taking this shit, when you just stop taking it cold turkey like that, every fucking thing that you gained during that time. And I gained, you know, I was ready for, I had one like little small body boom contest.

I thought I was ready for fucking Mr. America after this shit, you know, like, Oh fuck. I'm, I just I was ready for fucking Mr. America after this shit. You know, I'm like, oh, fuck. I just got so much tighter and I had more veins and shit than ever. And I'm like, oh, man, this is great shit. But when you get off that shit, everything that you gained, you lose it.

And then some. I lost any strength gains that I might have got from it or any you know the hardness i mean i had to start from lower than where i was before i started taking it right because your testosterone's all gone they say you do gain something and you keep something once your body normalizes you know you do have some sort of gains that's one of the arguments that they say about people that have taken steroids and gotten off of them that if you can normalize your testosterone you're still going to have an advantage over people that have never taken it before

but i don't know i don't know how true that is i felt like that uh uh every single thing gained that i possibly i think i i mean i felt like I lost ground, actually, because I just stopped, you know, cold turkey. And I think I actually lost ground. Are you supposed to wean yourself off? Is that how you're supposed to do it? I think so. But, you know, but I'm telling you, when I roll over, you know, I'm fucking 21 years old. And I thought that sex every day was the normal.

I mean, you just, that's what you get married for, so you can have sex every day. Man, that's one of the benefits. And if I can't have sex every day, then, you know, something's wrong. Like, fuck this. So I just, that was my normal, normal thing. And I'm pretty sure that my wife at the time probably didn't think that but you know i was like she probably got tired well this motherfucker but you know that was uh she got a break when the steroid things we got a little break for

the first time ever you know he was married like you know like oh no no no no anything that's gonna fuck with that fuck that's what gets people back on it. A lot of people get psychologically addicted. Of course. I mean, who, I mean, you jacked. I talked about it, you know, and I was interviewed in magazine articles and stuff

a few times when I was world champion back then. I brought it up in the articles. I never thought it was anything to hide, you know, or anything like that. I brought it up in the articles. I never thought it was anything to hide or anything like that. I said, yeah, I wish that I had never done it. I wish I could say now that I have a perfectly clean record. My training partner, Richard Schoen, we've trained together for 20 years. And this guy, perfect record, never even tried it.

But he was stronger than me. His mind was stronger than mine. I had peer pressure and wanting to be in the magazines and wanting to make a living doing something that I love instead of punching a clock every fucking day. That appeal was too great for me as a young guy for me to pass it up. I wanted to do something that I loved and make money at it way back then. But I wound up working at the post office for 28 years.

Well, it makes sense. I mean, it definitely makes sense that the appeal would be so strong. And it's a very, it works. I mean, that's the big reason why people want to take it out of sports. And I don't know if you ever watched that documentary that's on Netflix called Icarus. Have you seen that? No, I haven't seen Icarus. Icarus is all about the Russian anti-doping state-sponsored program. The Russian, well, I should say pro-doping. Oh, yeah. They literally gave steroids to every single one of their athletes. That makes more sense, yeah. And it's a crazy documentary, man, because the guy, Brian Fogle, who's the director, is also, he's in it because he was an amateur cyclist and what he wanted to do is an experiment so he ran or he cycled this race one year totally

clean and then the next year he went to this russian doctor and said just fucking juice me up to the gills like let's do this and they just shot him up with everything and in the process of him getting to know this doctor the scandal broke out about about the Sochi Olympics, about the Russians cheated during the Sochi Olympics. And it's all documented in this film as the news is breaking. And then the guy who's the Russian doctor has to flee Russia. He leaves his family behind. They take his family's house and they take all their money. And they're basically making his family homeless to try to get him to come back to Russia.

He's in protective custody in America right now, and he detailed the entire program. Everyone was hot. Everyone. Everyone was on something. They won 13 – what's hilarious, they just took some of the medals away, and the medals they took were the most bullshit medals. None of the important ones.

Like rhythmic gymnastics. You can have this one. Wow. They took like four bullshit medals away. But they kept the big ones. Yeah, they kept wrestling. They kept all the big ones. Wow.

That's bullshit. It's bullshit indeed. I did see big, strong, fast. That's an interesting take, yeah, right? Because they're pro-steroids. Right, right. Yeah, that is interesting. They are pro-steroids. Right, right. Yeah, that is interesting. They are pro-steroids.

And a lot of people are. Yeah. A lot of people are. Well, the argument is, I mean, I see it in terms of fair competition. I see the argument against it for fair competition. It makes sense. But, like, I also see the argument in terms of, like, if you're going to be taking amino acids and creatine and all these different things that do give you some sort of a benefit. Why not take the shit that gives you the real benefit?

who decide to take Roids because, like I said, I'm a 21-year-old kid, and I took them. So how the fuck can I talk shit about anybody who decides to make the same decision than I did that many years ago? You know, I'd be a hypocrite asshole if I was, you know, to do that. be a hypocrite asshole if I was, you know, to do that. As long as everybody in the competition that you're in, whatever that competition might be, if you're fucking

flipping pies or whatever, whatever the fuck it is, cut and grab, whatever the fuck it is, if everybody else in there is doing it, then it's a level playing field. But when you got guys that are trying to compete naturally against guys that are trying to compete naturally against guys that are not, then it becomes

unfair. So if they have a division and they do it a lot in these weight lifting contests and things now, they have divisions that are called natural divisions and they actually test for steroids and stuff like that. And maybe they should do something like that

for the fighters today we don't test you guys if you want to fucking you just come on in here and whatever you bring with bring bring what you got yeah they're kind of doing that in japan really yeah japan has an organization called rising where it's essentially an offshoot of pride or at least some of the people are involved that were involved in pride and pride like I had Ensign Inouye on the podcast, and he was talking about his Pride contract. He said it specifically stated, we will not test you for steroids, like in all caps and shit.

Damn. No wonder you had some fucking animals in Pride, man. Pride was, in a lot of ways, in a lot of people's eyes, that was the golden age of MMA, in terms of just sheer performance. Oh, man. But you've got to wonder, like all those guys, like Fedor and Cro Cop and all those guys in their prime, how much shit were they on?

Were they on things? I mean, nobody wants to talk about it. If that's in the goddamn contract, I would suspect that maybe they possibly were. And people want to say Fedor, who most people think is the greatest heavyweight of all time, or at least it's an argument, right? He was real good friends with Putin, who is at the head of the Russian state-sponsored doping program. What are the odds that they just let him compete clean? What are the odds they didn't juice him up? Yeah.

They're not testing you? I don't know. I don You know, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. He didn't have a steroid body, though. Well, you say that, but in the early days, he sure as fuck did. Really? Yeah.

Pull up that picture of Fedor with the kettlebells. It was a famous picture of him. You know, he was a big proponent of, I mean, he didn't lift weights, per se. Right. He did, like, kettlebell exercises, which are weights. Yeah, yeah. But not exercises which are weights yeah yeah not like you know bench press right that kind of shit curls he did a lot of um plyos and a lot of uh explosive uh strength training exercises and things like that but this when you still get this picture like he was pretty fucking jacked and he would definitely knock your fucking head yeah oh he's an animal yeah he kind of looks like a power lift yeah exactly he was built and in his early fights was very built. And then later in his career, there's a lot of

things going on later in his career, but it seems like when he came to America, one of the first things he did, if he was ever on anything before, he wasn't on it when he came to America. It looked like he also stopped weight training and only concentrated on sports-specific exercises, which a lot of people disagree with. Some people say that you have to have some kind of weight training. You have to have some sort of strength and conditioning program. Of course, I'm from that background. I would say yes. I would agree with that.

I think so, too. I think you need both, and I think you certainly need skill. That's the most important thing. But in order to really highlight that skill, you've got to have that body up to full potential. You've got to be peaking. You've got to be ready to rock and roll. My boy Matt Mitrione. Mitrione knocked him out. Knocked out

Fedor. That was huge. That's a huge feather in his cap. That's my buddy. I love that guy. He's hilarious. Oh, he is. Funny, funny dude. Super cool. Super cool. That's my buddy. Yeah. I love that guy. He's hilarious. Oh, he is. Funny, funny dude. Super cool. Super cool. Yeah, funny dude.

We had lunch together and got to know him even better, man. We had been talking and shit. I get to talk to a lot of fighters, man. I really... Well, you're an inspirational dude. People like you. Yeah, you know, I'm just blessed man i i tell you what i have no idea why that you know the first video i did for youtube the strongest man you never heard of i don't know why people

watched it i'll tell you why because it's because it's fuel everybody who wants to do something in their life has ups and downs and we need fuel like i I'll tell you, I got some fuel today when you were in front of those kids in Compton and you were talking to them about obsession being a good thing. If you want to be great at anything, I wanted to shut that fucking TV off and go run the hill, man. The fuel like that is important for people. Like seeing someone like you get fired up and talk about things.

It energizes the people that are watching. Like every time you put out up and talk about things, it energizes the people that are watching. Every time you put out one of those YouTube videos and a million people watch it, how many of those million people engaged in an activity that maybe they weren't going to do that day? How many of them went to the gym when they weren't going to go to the gym? How many of them just decided to get their fucking

career in order, get their life in order, get their shit together when they maybe weren't? We need each other. People need each other in a weird way. And people need people like you. You know what? The reason why I surprised you, George, because I told him right in the video,

if you don't like what I'm saying, turn the motherfucker off. Perfect. I mean, don't fucking, I don't care. Look, I didn't even, I didn't know that they paid you. You know, that YouTube was, I don't get, look, I didn't even, I didn't know that they paid you. You know, the YouTube was, I was broke as fuck anyway. I was walking back and forth to the gym to train people. I didn't have any, I was a horrible personal trainer.

People would come, you know. First of all, I went to try to get a job as a personal trainer at a lot of different gyms. And they would ask me if I had my certificate. And I said, look, I'm a six-time world champion. I don't need a fucking certificate. I know how to lift weights. And they'd go, oh, yes, you do, motherfucker. If you don't got the certificate, get on.

So I would leave with my little plaques and shit under my arm. And I got turned down a bunch of times. And then finally I went to a hardcore gym and they said, hey, ain't you CT Fletcher? Yeah, yeah, man. Hey, well, we know, you know, I had to go to the, but I went to these chain gyms and they would turn me down left and right. Yeah, you can't go to those places.

Get the fuck out of here, man. They're not for you anyway. Yeah, oh, no. And I had to, like I said, I was a horrible person. You'd be breaking those people. People would... They would quit. Oh, my God. They'd come in and they'd say, oh, no. And I had to. Like I said, I was a horrible person. You'd be breaking those people. They would quit. Oh, my God. They'd come in and they'd say, hey, one session, one session. They'd pay me for a month, but they'd train one time with me. And they're like, hey, no.

And I'm like, hey, if you go pussy out that fucking fast, take your fucking ass back on. Here's your money. Take your fucking money. And I needed that fucking money too Joe I needed it bad man like I said I was walking because when I had my the heart condition

I used up all my sick leave and stuff I was working at the post office I used up all the sick leave and they let me go they let me go from it the thing is you can't get let go from a government job

it's bullshit you can't I'm a living example so they let you go because you're sick? Well, I used up all my sick leave and everything. I had a rough recovery. The recovery was rough.

So I stayed out too long. They gave me so much. I stayed out too long. So my sick leave was all worn out, and they actually let me go. And they actually let me go. But before they let me go, they granted me a full, you know, health related. They gave it to me for a year. Benefits?

Yeah, everything for a year. And then unexplainably, the same doctor who granted it to me, which was their doctor, took it away a year later. So a year later, broke as fuck. I don't got no job. I don't got no benefits. After working for 28 years there, I don't got no job and I got no benefits. After working for 28 years there, I don't got no kind of retirement, no nothing. So I'm walking around. That's when I'm trying to get a personal

training job. I'm walking around trying to get a personal training job and they finally gave me one at a hardcore gym. They gave me a personal training job. I mean, like I said, I didn't have very many clients at all. The guys that I called the original Iron iron addicts are the guys that stuck with me. And, you know, even I put them through hell, they liked it, they'd come back for more,

they couldn't. Those are guys that I call the original iron addicts. Yeah, there's some people that are just not going to have the mental fortitude for that. But you're, that's like, for someone starting out, it's kind of crazy to go to you. Yeah, yeah. No, I'm definitely not for the beginner or the average guy. No, no, no, no, no. I mean, what you were saying to those kids is very important.

Like, there's a difference between the kind of effort and focus that you want to put in in order to get yourself fit. I just want to be in good shape. I just want to be able to do 10 pushups and 10 chin-ups and normal shit. There's a difference between that person and the type of person that's gonna seek out excellence. The type of person that's gonna go to a guy like you

and go, listen, I just want every day to give 100%. I wanna drain myself on that bench. I wanna drain myself at that squat rack. I wanna have nothing left when I leave here. Can you do that? Most people are going to go, fuck that. It sounds good. Yeah, fuck that. After like three weeks of that, your fucking joints are aching and your body's falling apart. No, fuck you, CT. I'm out of here. Keep the money, man. Sometimes, I mean, it would show up once and I didn't see him no more. No explanation. No, didn't even say,

one person told me to go into the bathroom. I never seen him no more. No explanation. Didn't even say. One person told me, go into the bathroom. I never seen him no more. Go in the bathroom. Fuck it. I'm never coming back. Did you get a lot of injuries when you were training? No. I was lucky in that.

My first career as a power lifter, I didn't get injured. I never had any injuries. And I didn't get injured. I never had any injuries. I didn't wrap up. Really? Really, man. That's crazy. I had bones. My bones were really strong. Tendons? No shoulder problems? No shoulder problems.

Wow, even Dorian. Yates is all fucked up now. I had him on the podcast and one of his arms is just jacked. He can't do push-ups anymore. His shoulder is all fucked up now. I had him on the podcast, and one of his arms is just jacked. He can't do push-ups anymore. His shoulder's all fucked up, and all the connective tissue's torn off the bone. Well, yeah. It's amazing that you must have excellent genetics in that sense.

That's what I credit, too, exactly. It's just the genetics. As much as my dad, I hated him growing up. I got to credit Buddy Fletcher for that, man. I hated the dude growing up, Joe. I really did. That was a big part of your documentary, man. That was intense.

When you told that story about getting a gun because you were supposed to go and apologize to the teacher because you had said something to the teacher. You were disagreeing about evolution. And your father got mad at you and said, you're going to go apologize to the teacher. But the teacher was sick. Yeah. And you didn't even get a chance to say, no, she was sick. You just said no. And he broke your nose.

Yeah. That's a heart-wrenching story as a father yeah yeah that's uh that's buddy fletcher's rule right there man i mean he tell you to do something god damn you better do yeah so when i when i went uh after you know growing up like that i i was uh i grew up uh in fear yeah i was afraid of my dad all the time. And, uh, but growing up with, in the Buddy Fletcher's household, when I went into the military, it was a piece of cake,

man. I was used to it. I was already, you know, used to, yes, sir. No,

sir. I was standing there at a tent and saluting and shit and, and doing impossible shit or whatever he asked me to fucking do. I was already used to it. So the army was, you know, I shit already been doing it. I was crying was, you know, shit I already been doing. The other guy's crying and shit.

I've been doing this my whole fucking life. No problem. How did you get on YouTube? A guy came into the gym and he said, his name was Arash Babu. I got to give Arash credit for that. He was at Strength Project and he had a big following already on YouTube. And he said, Hey,

can I interview you for YouTube? I don't know what the fuck is YouTube. And he said, well, it's this social media thing. And I had one question. Can I say whatever the fuck I want to say? And he said,

yeah, you can say whatever the fuck you want. I said, can I cuss? He said, yes, cuss all you want to. I said,

fuck it. It's on. Let's go. That go that guy man think about how that works like one thing leads to all these other things like that guy coming in and talking to you led to you inspiring countless millions of people like that's crazy it is absolutely crazy joe i never thought i never thought in a million years that something like that would happen. I never did. I always wanted, as a kid, it's funny, I wanted to inspire people because my dad was a preacher.

He's a Korean War vet and a preacher. So I grew up in a super religious household, super religious. Everything was a sin. Every fucking thing was a sin. You couldn't do shit. You know, dating girls, that was a sin. Going to the movies, that was a sin. Listening to whatever kind of music.

If it wasn't gospel music, it was a sin to listen to. Everything. I'm telling you. Everything was a fucking sin. So, but, you know, Buddy Fletcher is, you know, I recently since his last heart attack, I recently went to him. I was waiting for 58 years to hear an apology from him that was never going to come. And it was eating me up, tearing me to fucking pieces, man, because I was, you know, being an old dude, I would wake up at night punching and kicking and shit. And I'm still fighting Buddy Fletcher at 56, 57 years old.

I'm still fighting this dude because I'm still carrying around this hate. I hated him, but it was OK because the hate was mutual. I don't think I just hated him. He didn't hate me. He told me. He got up in church and he made an announcement. He said, hey, look, I know what it is between that son, which was me, and pointed at me, and that son right there. I get along with the rest of my other brothers, no problem. But he hated me.

And he says, because he's so much like me. That's why I hate him. And once you know that, that's why we can't get along. I hate you because you're so much like me. Jesus. Yeah. So I was like, hey, no problem. I hate your ass too.

Did you guys never worked it out? Oh, yes. We did. We did. But it was, have you seen the movie? I hadn't. It wasn't worked out during the movie. I still didn't like him during the movie.

They asked him, do you have any good recollections of when CT growing up, when his childhood, do you have any fond recollections of you and CT as a kid? And boy, I was looking at him. I was waiting. I really wanted to hear if he was looking at him and I was waiting. I really wanted to hear if he was going to fabricate something. Because I didn't have none. And I'm like, I want

to see what this motherfucker is going to say to this questioner. And he didn't have any either. And I was like, okay, cool. But I was ready to stop the fucking movie and just make an ass out of myself. Like, no, that's bullshit we ain't that you ain't one fucking time that we ever did anything pleasurable together motherfucking and i

was ready to go off but he didn't have any so when he didn't have any files okay now that's the same recollection that i have but i really didn't uh forgive him until his last heart attack in june and what happened then when i had the heart attack in June, it seemed like a revelation came to me. And it was like, it's not hurting him. It's not hurting him at all. My dad is 86 years old. He's fine, man. He's like, you know, I don't think he thinks

that he has anything to be sorry for. I think he thinks he's done a fantastic job of raising me. And I was just waiting on an apology that was never going to come. But it was still the hate that I had for him was eating me up. So I had to get that burden off me. And I think having that last heart, I didn't want to die carrying that burden with me of hating my dad. So I went to my dad and I asked him to forgive me. Whoa.

Yeah. Damn. Yeah. How did you say that? What did you say? I said, you know, look, Dad, I have blamed you. I told him that I had recently had a heart attack. And I have blamed you my entire life for a whole lot of things that went bad or went

you know that i always you know blamed you for and and i'm and i'm sorry i you know i don't you know i don't want to blame you for that anymore and would you please forgive me for carrying this against you for my you know my whole life i don't want to die letting you think that I love you, man. And I want you to know that. Wow. Yeah. How good does that feel? I can't. I don't wake up punching and shit anymore. I'd probably

be out of breath if I did anyway. But I don't wake up with those nightmares. I haven't had that nightmare since then. Wow. How did he react to that? He was fully accepting of my apology. He graced me. He graciously accepted my apology.

So do you communicate regularly now? No. No, still don't. Still don't communicate regularly. I just really wanted to, you know, get that off my chest. Just release the burden. Yeah. I just really wanted to get that off my chest. Just release the burden. Yeah, I just really wanted to get that off my chest and release that

burden. I'll probably try to communicate more after I get this new heart. You know, it's kind of fucked up but in a way, and I don't know why this is, but sometimes people that have gone through terrible childhoods

they recognize what it means to be a good father. Oh, man. I see you with your kids. I see it in the documentary, and I see how your kids are around you here. Yeah, yeah. They came with me. Well, shit, they want to meet Joe Rogan, too.

But, yeah, I have a super, super time. Yeah, I have a super, super time. I mean, I want to make sure that if somebody asked my kid, you know, 20 years from now, what do you did this together. My dad was, he was, loved me to death. I never had one doubt in my mind that my dad loved the shit out of me. I don't want my kids to grow up, you know, like I did. So I put forth an extra effort to make sure that, you know, that's not going to happen. So in some sort of a way, it turned out to be positive because you're such a doting father. You're so into it. I mean, it's so obvious that it's like you the the negative consequences of how your dad treated you like it came out of you the opposite way yeah i made it i made it a fucking point man because it's it's miserable on

that kid but but also joe you know what good came out of that the childhood that the kind of childhood that I went through I get and I'm sure what I get is just a tinge of what you get but it's so many thousand thousand people that contact me tell me hey man my dad you know I had a fucked up childhood and I see how you were able to come out of that or some kids kids contact me now that I'm going through a fucked up childhood, CT. And because you made it, because you were able. So that when I look back and I used to think, why did I have to go through this? Why did I have to have such a fucked up childhood?

It's because of that, because I can talk about my childhood and it helps so many other people, so many other kids that are going, oh, Joe, I look back on it now and I say it was so worth it that it wasn't even funny, man. It's so worth it. Everything that I had to go through, wanting to hide every time I heard my dad's keys in the door, wanting to just, you know, run away from fucking home. I hated my childhood, but it was so worth it. Everything was so worth it. Just being able to help one kid who might be going through the same thing. It's so fucking worth it.

I count it as a blessing, man. It's just a blessing. Seeing that right there, that attitude is the reason why people are attracted to you. Because you really do like helping people. Like, you really do. You're happy that you suffered so that you could help other people. That is one of the reasons why people are so attracted to you. Wow.

Yeah. I guess. But after I tell them, hey, look, turn me the fuck off. Yeah, but you're just trying to weed out the weak. I mean, it's not even the weak. It's the people that aren't willing to take the leap. Like you can't have any excuses. Like the excuses are a real problem with people.

Oh, my God. It's a real problem because you give yourself a way out. You can fail at things. You could try and not be able to do it. But the excuses for why you can't do it or why you're going to fail or why you don't feel up to it today or why you're tired or why you have other things on your mind, why you have other things you have to deal with first before you can start working out. That's all bullshit. Oh, yeah.

And I told them. Yeah, you did tell them. Yeah. They needed to hear it. Wow. People need to hear that shit. Yeah. They need to hear it because they create their own boundaries.

They create their own borders. They create their own obstacles. They create their own things that cannot be surpassed. And all those things are just products of the mind. And it's just the ego protecting you from failure, from protecting you from that horrible feeling that you need to experience in order to move forward. If you want to move forward, you got to experience some falls. You got to slip. You got to fall down. You got to get back up. You got to try and fail. Because if you don't fail, that means you weren't trying hard enough. Because nobody's just fucking excellent at everything.

All the time. All the time. It's impossible. It's impossible. If you're a good person, that means at one point in your life, you fucked up. Yeah, exactly. Because you figured out how to be a better person. Exactly.

There's no other way around it. No one's just great from the womb. I mean, unless you're the Dalai Lama or Buddha or some shit, no one is great from the womb at anything. That's correct. Or Buddy Fletcher. Yeah, or Buddy Fletcher. Being a human, being an athlete, being a whatever, a doctor, whatever the fuck you are trying to do, if it's difficult to do, you're going to fuck up along the way, and some people can't handle the fuck up.

They can't handle it. So they don't even try. They don't even try. Exactly. They can't oh it's my thyroid uh oh it's you know i just i have a problem with my metabolism or oh you know uh i i have a chronic fatigue syndrome just fucking get up and go just one foot in front of the other keep moving just keep moving yeah tomorrow do more good night fuck it get up in the morning. Oh, the alarm clock? That means you get up. No, you get the fuck up. No.

Press that button, get the fuck up and go. And if you don't have an out, if it's impossible to not get the fuck up and go, then you just do it. So just don't allow that other part. Don't allow that, I'm going to hit the snooze button. Fucking snooze button is the worst shit that's ever been invented.

Do you really feel better after nine minutes? That shit doesn't do you any good. Just get up, bitch. Just get up. Ooh, Joe Logan said this. Get up, bitch. Get up. Get your fucking ass up out there, goddamn bitch.

People need to hear you. You should do, that's one thing. Here's a business for you. You should do ringtones. Ringtones and alarms. Like an alarm. A C. Here's a business for you. You should do ringtones. Ringtones and alarms. Like an alarm, a C.T. Fletcher alarm. Every morning, instead of beep, beep, beep, beep, just you saying, get your fucking ass out of bed.

I don't want to hear no excuses. You know what? I do something similar to that now. Yeah? Yeah, I've been cussing people out my whole life for nothing. And I got this thing, Book Cameo, Iron Addicts, bookcameo.com. You can find me on there. And the people pay $25, I think, $35, $35, one of them, for me to cuss them out.

Yeah. So I get on there and cuss them out for two minutes, two minutes straight. I cuss them out, call them all kind of motherfuckers and shit that I've been doing my whole life for nothing. And now, you know, the people pay me to do it, man. And it is wonderful. It is wonderful. One guy told me, I want you to cuss my ex-wife out. Yeah, yeah. That's a problem.

Yeah, exactly. Some fights. So I had to let her know right up front hey this is not me saying this you did it anyway yeah oh yeah i did it oh yeah i did it i would have said no no no i did it yeah i said this is not me saying it this is gregory and gregory said he told me you leave him the fuck alone and he is not interested in your ugly ass no more. Oh, my gosh. Stop stalking him, bitch.

But this is Gregory talking, not me. So if you get your gun and shoot anybody, make sure it's Gregory and not my ass. Did she ever get a hold of you? No, no, no. Ooh. Yeah. Yeah, you don't want that conversation. Well, I'm expecting her to book one for Gregory's ass.

Yeah, there you go. Oh, that's a good way to keep the business going. Come back, yeah. Yeah. Well, I really think that those videos that you do are very important. I really do. You know, I think that inspiration. There's like a people, for some reason, there's a bunch of people that like to mock that stuff.

They like to, and most of those people are out of shape. Yeah. They like to mock that, and they like to make fun of it. are out of shape yeah they like to mock that and they like to make fun of it and i'm not talking about comedians i'm talking you know which is they could be really funny doing that but i'm talking about there's a lot of people that sincerity like for whatever reason bothers them and sincerity when it comes to inspiration and motivation those kind of things like some and for some, some people overdo it. Like, you go to some people's pages, and their Instagram page is just all a bunch of quotes.

Yeah. It's all other people saying shit, which is fine every now and then. Every now and then, yes. Yeah, but it's like your diet. Yeah. Like, you know, it's okay to eat a piece of cake every now and then, but don't eat cake all day, bitch. Oh, yeah, you're going to fucking wind up hating cake.

That's what's going to happen. Exactly. Yeah. And if you see just nothing but inspirational memes all day long, you're like, this is not working anymore. They don't get in. Right. It's too much. But a real person, a real person

like you who's already accomplished a shitload of things, who understands the benefits of real hard work and intensity and focus. When you do those videos, man, I get fired up. I get fired the fuck up. I do those videos, man, I get fired up. I get fired the fuck up. I see those videos and I just want to go to the gym right away and just get fucking fired up.

See, I didn't even think Joe Rogan knew who the fuck I was, man. I knew who you were. That's why I didn't get upset when you were getting mad at me. Yeah, Joe doesn't even know who the fuck I am, man. No, people know who the fuck you are, man. I mean, how many millions of people have seen your videos? Oh, maybe, yeah, one or two. That's a lot man. I mean, how many millions of people have seen your videos? Oh, maybe, yeah, one or two. It's a lot. Yeah, you know, quite a few people have seen it,

and way, way more than I ever thought would, that's for sure. I mean, you go on YouTube and you tell people, hey, turn me the fuck off. How many people are going to keep watching it? The motherfucker says, turn me the fuck off. I don't give a fuck if you watch me or not. You don't like what the fuck I'm saying? Turn it off, motherfucker. How many people

are going to keep watching after you say it? A lot. A lot. The ones you want. Oh, my God. The ones you want are going to keep watching. Man, Russia. I've been able to travel the world, man. Due to this, due to Arash Babu coming in

to Metro Flakes. Isn't that crazy? Yeah. Going all over the world. I've been to Army Base. I've been to Russia, Australia, Germany. I've been all over the fucking place. Fuck you CT. I had so many people at the airport in Russia and they all had beers. They all had fake beers. The women,

men, everything. About 120 people met me at the airport. And here's this poor kid from Compton, you know, and that who a lot of times I didn't think I was going to make it out of my childhood to go to Russia and have all these people with these beards on, you know, to steal your motherfucking sets. Man, Joe, it's like sometimes I think I actually did die on that

operating table and now I'm in heaven man I'm just this is my heaven you know what I mean so it's it's just fantastic it is unbelievable

and I'm sitting across the fucking table from Joe Rogan I'm sitting across the table from C.T. Fletcher and after all these motherfuckers

said oh yeah it's this big giant feud between Joe he'll never you'll never be on everybody who said I'd never be on this show, fuck y'all. It didn't bother me for a second.

I was never upset at you at all. And I could see your point of view, and I could see why you'd be upset at my point of view. I get it. It didn't bother me at all. I don't take things very personally. No, you haven't. You know, and immediately, when you responded to me,

I said, hey, Joe, you're absolutely 100% right. You know, I just want, I really wanted to get your attention, man, more than anything. I thought I did feel, you know, I felt we had a little difference. It's a slight difference because I agree with about 90 percent of what you say. It's just a slight difference that we don't agree on. And as soon as you say, hey, man, you know, hey, man, you attacked me like a fucking wild man. Yes. Yep, I did.

You're absolutely right. I apologize for that. I shouldn't have came at you that way. And that was the end of the feud right now. Now can I be on your fucking shoulder? Well, shout out to Kevin Pereira for getting us together. Yeah, Kevin. Hell, yeah, man.

Thank you. Thank you. So he's doing something with you right now? Yeah, we're doing this Patreon campaign, which I'm going to be honest with you, Joe. I hate to ask anybody for anything. I hate that. I've had a job, a working job since I was 12 years old. At 12 years old, I worked in a gas station pumping gas,

and it was during the fucking gas crisis when the gas lines were super long. But I've always worked for it. I hate asking people. And this Patreon campaign is like asking people to help me. Now that I'm not able to travel the world, I'm not able to get out there and promote things like I used to. Patreon is a way that they can support me. And it's called Defying Death.

I wanted to call it my last will and testament. Because if I don't, if I'm not successful in my fight and if I don't get a heart transplant, I do get a heart transplant and rejects it. And I'm dead. I have a record. There's a record. And I thought last will and testament would be the best thing to call it because if I lose the fight, then people can go back and see and hopefully get some benefit. They can see how I faced. You know, you hear a lot of people.

I have so many people telling me, oh, CT, don't worry about it. We're praying for you. We got your back. But, hey, none of that matters when you're in that operating room, man. I appreciate the good wishes and the goodwill and all that. But in the end, you got to face it. It's a solo experience. You have to face death. Everybody will. You have to face death on your own and nobody else can step in for you and die for you or it's how you deal with it.

So this is a permanent record of how I deal with, you know, being in a situation where I could possibly die. And I want people to be able to look at it just in case I make it, don't make it, whatever. They can look back and say, well, this is how CT dealt with it. He's facing a transplant. He didn't make it, but he went in with a shit ton of faith. And he believed he was going to make it. He believed he was going to make it. And if I don't make it, fuck it, I ain't going to know nothing about it anyway.

You guys be able to talk all the shit you want to. But I went in with a very positive attitude. I want to be able to see that. Now, when they do a heart transplant, have you talked to anybody that I went in with a very positive attitude. I want to be able to see that. Now, when they do a heart transplant, have you talked to anybody that's had a heart transplant? Yes, I have. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, that those are the people that I really, really want to hear from.

Yeah. Because they can. And I appreciate it. I get a shit, shit ton of well wishes and support. And I think from iron addicts all across the planet. I mean, they're all behind me and I really, really appreciate it. But I actually it's easy for me to say, hey, Joe, be tough. You're going through. I know you're going through this thing, Joe, but I want you to be tough. I want you to hang tough and I want you to, you know, I'm I'm rude.

I ain't tough. And I want you to, you know, I'm I'm rude. But have I actually gone through when I'm asked the circumstance that you're facing, the difficulty that you're facing right now? Have I actually had any experience with that? Because it's hard for me to listen to you to tell me to be strong and be tough about getting a heart transplant. And, you know, you ain't never had nothing but a fucking hangnail or something. You know, if you've actually been through something something then i can listen to you a lot better it's like a fighter a guy who's never been in a fight trying to tell a fighter what to do right in his next case right hey you get in there i want you to put this on put this right that fight yeah i'm not gonna be listening too hard to a motherfucker that don't have no experience.

Experience is, to me, still the best teacher. Especially something like a heart transplant. Yeah. I mean, what percentage of people have ever even had, I mean, how many people have successful heart transplants a year? Do you know? You know, I've tried to look it up, but they don't give you too many numbers on. I think that the survival rate is 75 for the first. No, I think it's higher, 80 percent for the first year.

Now it was lower, you know, years ago. But now it's up to 80 percent survive for the first year. And you have to take some pretty intense drugs just to keep your body from rejecting the organ. Right. Definitely. But I'm taking a shitload of drugs right now. What do you have to take now? I have 15 different pills, 15 different drugs that I take every day just to survive. And what are they all for? To get water off my lungs and lower my blood pressure, kidney, all kind of fucking different

pills, Joe. And just to, they supposedly help me function. And then sometime I honestly think they fuck me up. Some of them fuck me up. It's hard for me to, you know, function properly on a daily basis. Just a day of feeling normal. If I can feel normal for the whole day. Oh, that's fantastic.

Not good or, you know, great. I feel great today. There's no such thing as me getting up and saying I had a fucking great day today. But if I can just feel normal for that day, then that's fantastic, man. And this is since June. Yeah. So before June, you were fine, even with the artificial heart valve? I wouldn't say I was.

Yes, for 11 and a half of those years. But six months prior to the heart attack, I had signs. So you started feeling it coming. Yeah, yeah, I had signs. Did you do any cardio or were you doing any cardio before? Not really. You know, the way I work out is kind of cardio. You'd be sweating, you know, a big puddle of sweat on the floor.

Like Cali Muscle, I remember I put him through a workout. I trained a lot of pro wrestlers and stuff, too, when I put him through the workout. And Cali Muscle had the best, he said, G-Willigers. That was the best one. He said, damn, CT, you're fucking crazy, man. But that was the best. G-Willigers.

Yeah, G-Willigers. He's bringing it back. Yeah, that's bringing it way back. That's like Andy Griffin's show. Yeah, G Willikers. He's bringing it back. That's bringing it way back. That's like Andy Griffin's show. Yeah, right. Exactly. Cali was on Fear Factor. Yeah, was he? Yeah. I didn't know that. Yeah, yeah.

How'd he do? He fell off of a car. Oh, wow. Didn't work. They had him suspended over a... See if you can find that. It was giant. Wow. Too big. It was giant. It was one big. The dude was giant. It was one of those stunts where you had to carry your own weight, like climbing over things. Oh, shit.

You know, he's like close to 300 fucking pounds. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So he's doing that. It's just, it was the wrong stunt for him. Yeah, I bet it was. I adopted that guy. He's my son now. He's fucking.

He's got an interesting story himself. Oh, my God. He's got a hell of a story. He's got an interesting story himself. Oh, my God. He's got a hell of a story. I saw his YouTube story. Yeah. Yeah. Hell of a story, man. He's real good.

And the good thing about him, he's the same way on and off YouTube. Yeah. He was a very friendly guy when I met him. I enjoyed talking to him a lot. He's jacked as fuck. Oh, yeah. Definitely. Definitely. He's got a galley muscle.

He's jacked. Yeah. I've interviewed. One of my Cali Muscle was jacked. You know, I've interviewed, one of my favorite interviews was Hoist Gracie. Really? Yeah, I got to interview Hoist Gracie and it was incredibly we had some incredible similarities

in our train of thought and how we think. Yeah? Yeah. He told me that on the day of a fight, he made no plans for after the fight no plans no we're going out to dinner you're gonna celebrate none of that he was he said i was completely 100 prepared to die in that octagon and i'm like fuck yeah damn that that that resonated with me so hard because I remember my last contest cuz you know they told me about my heart valve in the 90s in 95 on my last contest greatest bench press in America

they say you know mr. first you can go out there and in front of all those people and in your valve could break, and you could die right there on the bench press in front of all those people. Are you going to go? And I looked at him and I said, fuck yeah, I'm going. Are you out your game? My doctor looking at me like I'm crazy. I'm looking at him like he crazy. Fuck yes, I'm going.

Hell yeah. You're mine. What a glorious way. What a glorious way. What a glorious way to go out doing what I fucking love to do, what I've trained to do my whole fucking life in front of all these people. Oh man, I couldn't ask

if I was writing a movie script, it couldn't be any better. Wow. Fucking died right there on stage in front of every fucking body bitch person. So I felt the same way so I felt the same way I felt the same way that voice grades me and it just really made me feel good that I wasn't the only crazy motherfucker on the plane he's definitely crazy he's the most important figure in the history of martial arts I think so

his UFC won in 1993 changed the world yeah change the world because people thought that you had to be like the bigger guy and then all sudden he showed he showed that, no, there's this thing called Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu. And this dude coming out wearing pajamas is just going to fuck all you people up. Yep, he sure did. Changed the world of martial arts. Everybody started training Jiu-Jitsu. Oh, my God. I didn't even know what it was.

I had no idea what it was. No idea. Yeah, as soon as it came out, I was like, I'm enrolled. I went to Carlson Gracie's. I went to Hicks and Gracie's first, then to Carlson Gracie's. Yeah. And I think that is why I'm going to blow some smoke up your butt there, Joe. I think that's why you're such a fantastic analyst.

I think that's why you're the best at what you do, because you get your ass in there and you actually experience it. And when you say a hold or you see an omoplata or whatever, you know what the fuck you're experience it. When you say a hold or you say a platter or whatever, you know what the fuck you're talking about. I think that helps, but I think I'm very, very fortunate that I have a series of jobs that help each other. Yeah. And that being a comedian and being able to talk on stage in front of all those people, I'm comfortable.

I'm comfortable in front of a microphone doing a podcast. And I'm comfortable, and I love MMA, obviously. I'm a huge fan of martial arts. So it's my chance to express myself about something that I really enjoy, and I don't feel burdened down by the moment of the camera on me. Right, which is harder. It helps me. Which is harder, the performing in front of a live audience and you being a comedian or what you do for the UFC? Oh, UFC is way, way easier. Oh, yeah. It's very. Yeah. Than performing in front of a live audience and you being a comedian or what you do for the UFC. Oh, UFC is way, way easier.

Oh, yeah. It's very, very – I wouldn't say it's easy because you have to have – you have to understand what you're talking about. You have to have a lot of information in your head and you have to really care. Yeah. It's my job just to represent the experience that these guys are going through. When I think about commentary, I'm thinking about these guys have been through months of training camp. They've dieted. They've cut weight to get down to their weight class.

They're rehydrated. There's so much emotions and intensity. It's just my job to honor their experience and to do my best to make it fun for the fans at home and make it dramatic. That's all my job. They have the hard job. My job is just to not fuck up and to try to describe it in the best way that i can it's way easier than stand up i i i the live

art oh shit i i know i'm just being uh well i can imagine i'm going around the world giving uh speeches and uh and seminars in front of live audiences. It's much easier for me. And this is a big-ass thing, but it's much easier for me to sit across the table from Joe Rogan and talk to him than it is to do those people shooting all kinds of questions at me. It's odd, right? It's got to be odd for you to experience this late in life, too. Oh, man.

If I was 21, I couldn't do it. If I had to sit across the table from Joe Rogan at 21 years old, I'd be too fucking petrified to do it. You think you would? Yeah, I know I would. But once we started talking, I think you would loosen up and then you'd be yourself. I'd be choked up. For a while, maybe. I'd be too fucking choked.

I'd be tight-tongued. I wouldn't be able to talk. Once, it's Just people relax. I don't think so. I was too wound up emotionally as a 21-year-old. Who isn't? Oh, man. I could imagine.

I was talking with a buddy of mine because I started stand-up at 21, and I was like, what the fuck did I have to talk about when I was 21? I didn't know shit. Wow. You literally don't know anything. I didn't know you had been doing it that long. Yeah, yeah. I started at-up at 21, and I was like, what the fuck did I have to talk about when I was 21? I didn't know shit. Wow. You literally don't know anything. I didn't know you had been doing it that long. Yeah, yeah. I started at 21.

Wow. I didn't know a fucking thing. So what are you now, 35? 50. What? I'm 50. You're fucking 50? Yeah, I'm 50.

You old bastard. This guy's fucking 50 years old. Yeah. I started in August 27th, 1988. Wow. You look good for 50 years old. Thank. I started in August 27th, 1988. Wow. You look good for 50 years old. Thank you, sir. Thank you very much, man.

You know, I dyed my beard for the Joe Rogan show. It looks good. It's fucking black as fuck, man. What's it like when you don't dye it? It's white as fuck. Is it? 100% white? I'm giving Santa Claus a run for his fucking money, man.

You look good with a black beard, though. I had to make that motherfucker black. Blacken that shit up. Who gives a shit? Shit, yeah. You look good with a black beard, though. I had to make that motherfucker black. Blacken that shit up. Who gives a shit? Shit, yeah. I know I do. I know just for me, I better start paying me

for this fucking shit, man. I've been advertised for them fuckers for years. They should. Yeah. Why not? Get in there with that comb, right? Hell yeah.

Get in there, work it out. Making that shit black. So how often do you do your YouTube videos now? We release a new one every Saturday, and they have changed so much. Last week I had a cooking show. Oh, yeah? Yeah, a vegan cooking show.

Oh, yeah, you're doing all the vegan diet now, huh? Well, you know what? I can't call myself vegan. I call myself plant-based. I started out saying I was vegan, and then I realized how crazy them vegan folks is. And I said, you know, I'm not vegan because I'm not doing it because I'm thinking about the animals. And, you know, vegan will fuck your ass up about that shit. They're super serious about that.

I'm not doing it because of that. I'm doing it for health. There's a lot of people that are vegan that are vegan for the right reasons. They're vegan because they're conscientious, because they want to do it for health, because they want to have the least amount of impact on the environment, because they don't want animals to die. But then there's a lot of people that are vegan that really just belong to something. They could have been in Scientology.

They could have been a Mooney. They could have been anything. They found that, and they ran with it, and now they are fucking ruthless against people that aren't in that group. And they generally give like good-hearted, kind-hearted vegans a bad name. Oh, man. And it's a small percentage. But a lot of these motherfuckers, they have like vegan in their online name. Yeah.

And they attack. Like you look at their comments, they're all attacking all these other people constantly. Oh, my God. Yeah. Like, you look at their comments. They're all attacking all these other people constantly. They're just angry people that found a reason to be an aggressive person. Like, you found a green light. Oh, this person's not vegan. I can attack them. And you're the reason why the world, you're responsible for all the pollution and all the crime.

Did you know that if you were vegan that this would be less suffering? Oh, my God. And they do the worst job of promoting veganism because people see those crazy assholes and then they go, fuck these people. I'm going to go eat a steak just for you, bitch. I'm going to shoot this fucking cow right in the dick and I'm going to eat him right in front of you. Fuck you, man. Well, I didn't want to be associated with them, that radical part of it at all. So I stopped saying I'm vegan.

I just don't eat meat. I would like to get you connected to some real nutrition experts that could break down why that might not be the best idea and what is important in your diet in terms of essential fatty acids and healthy fats. A lot of people think that refined carbohydrates are the big problem with heart disease. Refined carbohydrates and sugar is what contributes to heart disease. You know the whole thing that came out pretty recently in the New York Times at an expose about the sugar industry having paid off scientists in the 1950s to put the blame on saturated fats and cholesterol instead of sugar. Wow. Yeah, it's a complete, total, fabricated conspiracy by the sugar industry because they were doing these tests and they were realizing, like, holy shit,

like sugar fucks people up. It's terrible for you. And so what they did is they literally bribed scientists, and not that much money, which is kind of crazy. In the 1950s, they paid them something around $50,000. And I don't even know if it's $50,000 today. I think it was the equivalent of $50,000. And these people just fabricated these reports and got everybody convinced that saturated fat, which is an essential part of the human diet,

and cholesterol, which is literally the substrate for hormone production. Like cholesterol is important for your body. And that these things are responsible for heart disease and not sugar. Wow. Refined sugar and refined carbohydrates, they're completely unnatural in the human body. You're not supposed to be able to just scoop up a fucking tablespoon full of sugar and dump it in your mouth. It's not real in the world. Like if you get sugar in the world, it's attached to an apple, you know?

Yeah, yeah. That's true. If you get carbohydrates, get sugar in the world it's attached to an apple you know yeah if you get carbohydrates it's in plants it's fiber you're eating and your body knows how to process that your body doesn't know what the fuck to do with bread especially the bread that we eat today sprayed down with fucking all sorts of shit to prevent pesticide all these pesticides and it's they they changed the wheat and made it more complex gluten, so your body has a harder time processing it. There's a lot of bad food that people eat. It's safe to say you're not a vegan.

No, I'm not a vegan. But I respect the people that are doing it because they're doing it because they don't want to cause harm. And I respect the people that are doing it that think they're doing it for their health. But I've talked to a lot of vegans that were formerly vegans, especially Chris Kresser, who is an actual scientist and is one of the leading experts on the real issue with the vegan diet and how it does work for some people. Some people with their biological requirements and their physical requirements in terms of like what their activity is, they function fine on a vegan diet. As long as they're careful, they make sure they get enough B12, they make sure they get enough B12,

they make sure they get their fatty acids, make sure they get their essential fatty acids from coconuts and flaxseed oil, and there's avocado. There's a lot of different ways you can get oils for your body. But your body needs that shit. It's essential. There's a lot of essential things. I would love to connect you with these guys.

And I'm open to it. I'm very open to it. I changed my outlook after you with these guys. And I'm open to it. I'm very open to it. I changed my outlook, you know, after this last heart attack. I changed my outlook completely. That's what made me even try the plant-based diet. You know, I have a supplement company that's iron and explain. It's a hardcore, hardcore. It's billed as for the hardest core motherfuckers on the planet.

What kind of shit? Yeah, you know, pre-workouts and pumps and stuff. But after that, I started another brand, Odyssey Nutraceuticals. It's completely different. I named it Odyssey because that's what I consider my life is, is an Odyssey, a bunch of different. I got one hell of an odyssey going on. But anyway, it's plant-based protein. It's very health conscientious. It's a very health conscientious...

I'm a fan of plant-based protein. I think pea protein's really good. I love hemp protein. That's my favorite. I think hemp protein's very easy for your body to digest. The real problem with a lot of plant proteins is, I mean, if you just eat just plants, especially eating whole foods, you're not

necessarily, your body's not breaking it down the same way your body would break down a steak, say, or a grass-fed beef. I'm going to send you a sample of my shit. I would love to get it. And you tell me what you think. And Odyssey Nutraceuticals, I'll have to get that in on the air

before Joe kicks me the fuck off. What is the website? Do you have a website for it? OdysseyNutraceuticals.com, man. All right. Go check it out. I got to get that shit in before you kick me off the air. I'm not kicking you off yet.

You know, when we were going back and forth, I remember one of the questions that I had to ask you. I said, what is I-S-Y-M-F-S? What the fuck is that? Because it's on the end of your thing all the time. And when you told me, I was laughing out loud in front of my computer. It's still your motherfucking set. That's exactly what it stands for, Joe. I love that.

But if you, it's really based on my mom. My mom's the reason why I'm not completely retarded. I mean, I think I'm semi-retarded reason why I'm not completely retarded. I mean, I think I'm semi retarded, but I'm not completely. Oh, retarded, that's not a, I shouldn't say that. I still allow it. Okay, thank you, Joe. It doesn't mean a disease. Right. It means a dummy. Yeah, I'm not completely

retarded because of my mom. I'm a believer in intent. I think your words should just be noises that you make that convey intent. I don't think they should be magic noises that you can't say. Yeah, ooh, god damn it, Joe. you make that convey intent. I don't think there should be magic noises that you can't say. Yeah, ooh, goddammit, Joe. Ooh, that was deep. You said a lot there.

I think people are too sensitive, and then on top of that, people are looking to tell you to not say certain words. Don't say that the R word is the wrong word now. It's problematic today. Oh, my god, Joe. Yeah, so it came from my mom. My mom was, I tell you, her and all her siblings died from a heart related problem. So she was sick most of her adult life.

That's where I remember mostly. I remember very early when I was very young, my mom being healthy. But she was sick most of her adult life. Most of my memories of my mom when she was sick. But every day, every day. And I mean, she was really sick in and out of the emergency rooms. But every day, every day, and I mean, she was really sick, in and out of the emergency rooms. If you ask my mom, hey, Mrs. Fletcher, how are you? She would say, I'm blessed. Her standard answer was always, I'm blessed. And the reason she told me the reason why she would say that is because I'm still alive. I'm not dead.

So if I'm still alive, I still have life. I still can go on. I still can make a change. I still can make a difference. I still can make a difference. So I got it from her. No matter what the situation, how bad it may seem, people complain about me. You're still alive, motherfucker. So your set is your life.

And you're still alive. You still have a chance to make a difference. You're still going. What's the worst thing that happened? I could die. Okay, well, if you ain't dead, motherfucker, keep going. If you ain't dead, it's still your set, motherfucker. It's so simple.

Yeah. So, yeah, she was blessed. And that's why I always, you know, people are like, how you doing, CT? I'm blessed. No matter what the fuck's going on. I'm still alive, so I'm blessed. That's awesome. People need to hear that.

They do need to hear that. And they need to hear your attitude about excuses. Because both of those things are very important. It's very important for people to process because a lot of people have bad patterns in their mind. These bad patterns are just the way they've interacted with the world, the way they've approached all sorts of different problems. They have these patterns, and they fall right into these patterns.

And maybe they learn these patterns from their family. Maybe they learn these patterns from their environment. Maybe these patterns are like defense mechanisms to keep them from challenging themselves but you got to recognize what those are it's not you like you're not a lazy fuck but you've been behaving like a lazy fuck what you are as a human right and you could be anything you could just decide to you know the story of david goggins david goggins damn that sounds like maybe seal yeah yeah yeah yeah i just recently looked him up he was super fat yeah fully out of shape like like literally like on death's door health wise he got picked on in school and stuff like that fucked with just but decided yep enough is enough just literally in his own mind decided he was going to win the world

record for chin-ups. Decided he was going to be like this incredible endurance athlete. Did it. Just did it. Just does it. Just forces his mind. And he has this thing that he says that I think about whenever I'm tired. He said most people quit at 40%. Wow. I believe that too.

I believe that too. Most people get a little tired and like, like oh fuck this yeah you know but you couldn't go further you can go further yeah man yeah I just recently

read on watched a video of him somebody sent it to me he's a savage he is man just a straight mental savage oh I love it

I love those guys those people are important you gotta know that those people are out there and him in particular he's really important because he was super out of shape. Yeah. It's not like he was always this ripped super athlete.

Like he was like fat and terrible diet and poor health and poor depression, the whole deal. Yeah. And just tightened it up. And now he's an animal. Now you can't fuck with him. Fucking decided. Yes.

Decided to. Yeah. Yeah. That's you. And anybody can do that. All the people out there that think they're lazy, no. You've been behaving like a lazy person. You've been following lazy patterns.

If you just decide tomorrow, first of all, if you decide tomorrow you're going to be a disciplined, focused person, don't expect to have the kind of energy that someone who's been disciplined and focused for years has because you're not going to. That's right. Your body's not going to be conditioned for it. Your mind's not going to be accustomed to the strain, but you can still do it. Right. You just you're just going to get tired quicker. And then hopefully by next week, you'll have more endurance. And then by the week after that, you'll have more.

And if you keep building six months from now, you'll be unrecognizable. That's right. If you stick with you, you definitely will. But everything's got to start from right there. That's why you're important. That's why you're important. That's why your videos are so important because your videos i guarantee it i don't know the number but i want to say a hundred thousand people probably watch your videos and change their life i guarantee you that's real i don't know that it's it's a lot more than i thought it's a lot that's a lot i bet you've changed people's entire outlook on things. That's giant.

That's everything in this life. Because you can get information. Books are wonderful. Documentaries are wonderful. What's really great is inspiration. The fuel, the little push, just a little push just to get you moving. Sometimes that's all it needs. And then next thing you know it.

And then people like you, because you've had a lifetime of this discipline and dedication and obsession, that reinforces it in people's heads. Like, I want to do what CT does. I want to be like that. I want to have that kind of energy and focus. Joe Rogan, have you ever thought about getting into octagon yourself? I want to ask you that. I'm too old now. I almost did at one point in time, but not at this point no you know what earlier yeah well when i was kickboxing man i got a lot of fucking headaches and i was really worried i i came from a real meathead gym and we did like

hard sparring and i did a lot of hard sparring there's one kid in particular who is a really good boxer and we beat the fuck out of each other oh and um the problem is like i would go home and you know this was going on over a few years i would go home and my head would be pounding just boom boom boom lying in bed and i was thinking what am i doing myself am i gonna be stupid when i get older am i gonna not know where i am am i gonna be stumbling on my words i was terrified of brain damage. Yeah. Because I've always been a very curious person, and I've always been fascinated by the way you can change the way you think about things. That's why I'm so excited about talking to you,

like inspiration and motivation and even information, like having these things in your mind. You can forge these things together to make your mind go in a certain direction. So the quality of my thoughts has always been very, very important to me because I know that that's what made me successful in all the different areas that I've chosen to pursue. It's like the quality of your thinking and being able to recognize what's good and what's bad. But the mind itself, if the mind itself is compromised, then you're not going to be able to do all those things you want to do. For sure. You're not going to be able to appreciate life if you don't remember where you are and you don't know how to talk anymore.

And I was around people that I was watching their ability to talk and their cognitive functioning decay. Fighting is glorious, but you've got to know when to stop. You've got to know when to stop. And for me, when I stopped, it was 1989. There was no UFC. There was no money. There was no money in kickboxing. I think I got offered a fight for $500.

I was doing amateur fights, and I got offered a pro fight for like, it might have been $400. I don't remember how much it was, but I was like, what? I was like, that's crazy. Like, I'm going to train for months and maybe get my ass kicked and maybe get head kicked for like 400 bucks. And I was getting these headaches. The headaches were bad, man.

And so I just decided early on. If the UFC was around back then, I'm most certain I would have pursued it. But I'm glad it wasn't. You did whoop a fan's ass one time, didn't you? A fan? Well, not a fan. A guy talking shit. Oh, the guy on Fear Factor? No, I just grabbed him.

I thought he was going to hit me. I didn't hurt him. No? No. He's just crazy. I just tied him up. I got him in a Muay Thai clinch. I was thinking of choking him, but I was like, I better not choke him. Because if I choke him, you know, maybe they could sue me. So I just decided, I decided if I grab a hold of him and grab him by the back of the head, he'll probably realize once I lock on to him that he's pretty helpless.

Yeah. And he'll probably stop. And he kind of did. He kind of just flailed around a little bit. But he's like, when someone grabs your neck, there's something about controlling someone's neck. It's a very, it just does not feel good. No. Fuck no, Ben.

I mean, you feel powerless. That was a guy that he had attacked a counselor before on another television show. And he had thrown his girlfriend to the ground or his wife on another television show. Oh, my God. And they had told me about him before he did the show they're like this guy's a serious hothead we're thinking about not having him on the show at all but we thought it'd be good drama just but be careful and so he punched some guy or she punched some guy on the show and i said the wife punched a guy who was those heckling him

and i said you can't hit someone i go just because you hit your husband doesn't mean you can hit other people. And then the guy got in my face. And there's a lot of it that wasn't on film that they didn't put on TV. But I pushed him out of my face. He goes, don't touch me. And I said, or what, bitch? What the fuck are you going to do? And he got in my face again.

And I pushed him again. And then I said, this is just too tense. I go, I'm just going to grab this guy. I'm like, I'm not getting punched in the face. Because sucker punches happen. Yeah. Especially if you're not ready to get punched and you get punched, you can get fucked up. Oh, hell yeah.

Especially if you don't think someone's going to punch you and then they do. So I'm always thinking when someone raises their voice, they're ready to punch me. Right. I'm just going to clamp down this dude's neck, get a hold of him. So I just grabbed him. I didn't hurt him. Yeah, I was fucking, that made me a, I always liked Joe, but I was a fucking Joe Rogan fan. He called the police on me, though.

The police had to go over the, he claimed I hit him. He claimed a bunch of shit. The police had to go over the videotape. They had to show all the footage from all the different cameras. Yeah. Wow. See, I never really hit him. I was a fucking real Joe Rogan fan after that, man.

Fuck yeah. You have guys challenge you to fight over social media? No. No? I mean, idiots maybe. Yeah. I'm friendly. Yeah, I know, but there's idiots.

If in real life when people meet me, I'm always friendly. Yeah. There's so many idiots on social media. There's a lot of idiots. I know you've got to have somebody. Oh, Joe, I'll kick your ass. Well, see, the idiots are the reason why I never was getting your information in the first place when you reached out to me. Because I'm not paying attention to anything.

Right, right. If I dip my toes in the water occasionally, I'm like, see what the fuck's going on in the world. Like, oh, what the fuck. Yeah, that's enough of that. Fuck out oh what the fuck yeah that's enough of that fuck out of here yeah I've seen too many people it starts their

their day off in a bad way and they get obsessed with it and they start going battling back and forth with people in the comments

guilty yeah guilty is what I saw you doing that after you and I had the discussion you were going back and forth with people

oh Joe Rogan has got some fucking fans, man. They wanted to fucking string my ass up, boy. How dare you talk to Joe like that? I said, motherfucker, this is between me and Joe. The fuck you got here? Yeah, they want to jump in. Yeah, oh, they wanted to kill me and fucking assassinate me and Joe.

Well, they want to make you feel bad. That's what they really want to do. They want to figure out a way they can point out that you're wrong to make you feel bad. That's what they really want to do. They want to figure out a way they can point out that you're wrong or make you feel stupid. Yeah. They just, it's almost all of it.

Almost all of it is unhealthy people. Unhappy. Right. Maybe not bad people who are doing this, but it's an unhealthy practice to just lash out.

There's not even people that are really in your life. Yeah. It's one thing to have a debate about things. And I think this is where we as human beings have to learn how to use social media better because there's nothing wrong having discussions about things, but you got to figure out a way to do it where you're not just trying to hurt someone's feelings all the time and lashing out. Cause that's what a lot of it is. It's just bitter, very small minded squabbling. Even if

you're using big words, the intent behind it is very small minded. Exactly. I ask people send me videos of their work. They've been working out all the time. And, uh, you know, some of them are not doing it correctly.

Right. But I don't criticize people. I, I never, you know, because the real, most important thing to me is that they're trying. They're actually in there trying. They're trying to do something.

But, man, the people, other people don't look at it like that. Oh, you're fucked up. You're doing that fucking wrong. You're fucking, why, you don't know what the fuck you're doing. They jump on them immediately, you know, and try to discourage them. People that are at least trying to do something, they'll try to discourage them, people that are at least trying to do something or try to discourage them and it's got,

there's so many fucking experts out there. Oh, you're not doing this correctly. Your form is fucked up. Yeah. Like,

man, why do that? I mean, if you really want to do that, then direct message to people. Right. If you're really trying to help them,

direct message. Why put it out there so everybody can see it? You know, you're just trying to draw attention to yourself. There's a lot of that, right? Yeah. Oh, it's a lot of it.

They just want people to look at me. I'm an expert. I don't know what the fuck I'm doing. Fuck them guys. I don't like them. Yeah. And what's interesting, too, about exercises is there's some things that are debatable in terms of the way to do it and the way not to do it.

There's not necessarily always a consensus about how someone's doing something right, whether it's like, you know, like there's just a lot of people online that are just making a lot of noise. Yeah. It's hard to figure out who's right and who's wrong. Yeah, well, I think it's only right and wrong for you. I mean, you try. If Joe Rogan tells me I have to do something a certain way and I try it and it works for me, then fuck, I'm going to do it.

Right. If it works for me, if it works for me, because we all are so goddamn different. Yeah. We're not, nobody is exactly the same. Yeah. So when somebody, somebody says, now if somebody says they got the perfect routine, it's going to work for every fucking body, then that guy you got to be leery of. He's full of shit. Yeah. Because nobody has one routine that's going to work for every fucking fight.

It's just impossible. It's not going to happen. Yeah, I agree. And I think especially it's really interesting with MMA because the fact that Hoist Gracie burst onto the scene in 1993,

that was not that long ago. Right. I mean, that's really, 24 years is not a lot of time. It's just too similar or it's too close. And so there's all these different methods

that have been sort of devised along the way. And nobody really, I mean, until someone comes along, you know, someone's like an Anderson Silva that's like super successful doing it one way. And then you go, well, how the fuck is he doing it? We got to do it his way. Yeah, but you're not him. Right. Like maybe you started out as a wrestler, whereas he's a Muay Thai guy. Maybe it works good for him, but maybe you need a different approach.

And nobody really knows how to do it for you. You have to kind of figure out your own way. Exactly. And you've got to hone it and tweak it along the way while you're competing. Yeah. It's hard. Yeah. Well, the real innovators or the real guys, you know, I'm sure that they did that.

They're not trying to copy. Yeah. It's so important to be an original. Damn near anything. I mean, if you're set out to try to be Joe Rogan, you're going to fail, motherfucker, because it ain't but one Joe Rogan. And so try. I tell you that all the time. Hey, CT, I want to be just like you.

Don't be just like me, motherfucker. Be your damn self. Be yourself, man. Don't try to be just like Joe Rogan. Be yourself because you can't be Joe Rogan. It's hard to tell people that, though. If you see someone who inspires you and you admire them and you want to do what they're doing, it's hard. But everybody starts out in the beginning, especially when you're a young person, when you admire someone, you kind of copy a lot of their mannerisms and the way they do it.

But eventually you got to find yourself. Oh, yeah, definitely. I used to go around. I felt like a butterfly, like Muhammad Ali. I was Muhammad Ali when I was a kid. And I wanted to, you know, I wanted to be him. And then I wanted to be Bruce Lee. And I got into fucking point karate, you know, point tournament.

Oh, were you doing that a lot? Yeah. So you didn't know that. No, I didn't know. I was a point fighter. And I came very close. God damn it. Thai bowl.

Thai bowl. Billy Blanks. Billy Blanks. Came very close to fighting Billy Blanks in Long Beach Arena. Ed Parker's Camp Boca Ratty put on the International Karate Championship every year. And I was very close to fighting Billy Blanks. And every time I see

Billy now, I say, Billy, I thank you so much. Because the guy, when I see him in the finals, Billy fucked that guy up. It was supposed to be point, and he knocked the motherfucker out. Well, Billy fought, even in point, they would hit each other hard. Oh, hell yeah.

You know, like, Billy was knocked out before, too, in point karate tournaments. People got knocked out in those tournaments. Yeah, I mean, they should. I know, I know. And they made them fight after they got knocked out. Yeah. Nobody knew any better back then. Bring yourself back.

Yeah. Revive yourself and keep fighting, man. Yeah. It was pretty good. I loved I loved martial but my favorite sport I think bar none

of all not overweight lifting MMA is getting really close it was really close but I think it's boxing you love boxing more oh

I love it I love it man who's your favorite fighter do you have a favorite oh man oh that's really hard as a a role model I guess Muhammad Ali would be my favorite as a role model,

but not because of what he did in the ring. It's more so because of what he did outside the ring is why I hold him in such high regard. But Roy Jones Jr., of course, Mike Tyson. Roy Jones Jr., oh, my God. In his prime, there was nobody like Roy. Oh, my goodness. Roy was on a completely different level. He wasn't even jabbing.

Oh, man. He was leaping in with a left hook. Yeah. And he was muscular, too, Joe. Oh, yeah. And he was weird shaped, too. Yeah. His biceps were giant.

Jack. But he had small triceps. Yeah, his biceps were giant, man. He went all the way up to heavyweight. Remember that? And won. Yeah, beat Johniceps were jacked, man. Went all the way up to heavyweight. Remember that? And won. Yeah, beat John Ruiz for the heavyweight title. Dude, I remember.

You don't want to talk about boxing. Yeah, yeah. No, man. I'm all fucking boxing. Yeah, me too. God, man. Really. Well, I'm a fan of boxing, too.

You know, even though I work for UFC. MMA is your number one, though, right? Well, I like MMA better because anything can happen. You can get head kicked. You can get kicked down, strangled. There's so many possibilities that it's more complicated. What I call MMA, I call it high-level problem solving with dire physical consequences. Ooh.

That's what it is. Excellent explanation. Yeah, because you've got all these tools. You have all these tools. He has all these tools. You go in there, and you try to figure out who's got the best approach and who's going to be able to use their body who's going to be able to use their talent their skill their dedication who's going to be able to figure out a way to solve your problem wow what do you think about nate dees he's a bad motherfucker i love fucking i love nate dees man

i met him at a at a fight a ufc fight and he was the humblest. He was so nice, man. He goes, you know, I'm not fucking Jack like you, but I do my thing. And I'm like, fucking you're a fucking killer, man. Yeah, he's a great guy. But he's another guy who's a perfect example of how you can't make everyone train the same way. He's incredibly successful. But a lot of his training is not weightlifting. He does triathlons. Yeah, yeah. I mean, he does triathlons yeah yeah i mean

he does his jujitsu and his kickboxing and all the other stuff but on top of that like he does crazy endurance work yeah and nick and nick and i love both them brothers man and i met uh king mo uh he was real cool i mean a lot a lot of guys at fights. The most famous referee. Big John McCarthy? Big John McCarthy. Excellent guy. He was really friendly. He's a very good guy.

I couldn't really figure out why these guys liked me so much. George St. Pierre, he said, I want you to make a special video for me before one of his big fights. So I'm spitting all over the mic and shit and I'm making fucking hardcore and then he made a video back for me and I had his fucking George St. Pierre had his fucking phone number and he calls me and says, CT, I want to

can you do a one-arm pull-up? I said, no, I can't do it. He said, I can't either. Let's see who could be the first one to do a one-arm pull-up. I said, your own, George. And I'm like, I don't know. I couldn't do it. He said, I can't either. Let's see who could be the first one to do a one-arm pull-up. Say your own, George. Wow. And I'm like, I don't know. I couldn't really understand why fighters like me so much. I couldn't understand why they like me so much.

Fighters need motivation. Man, I guess so. That's what it is, yeah. That's a big part of it. Well, because you're real. You're 100% real. You are who you are. You don't put on any false airs. It is, yeah. That's a big part of it. Well, because you're real. You're 100% real. You are who you are.

You don't put on any false airs. But also, inspiration is critical for fighters because they're always tired. They're always trying to find the energy to keep going. They're always trying to find that push to get up and keep going. When you are two months into camp and every day is a grind and you're just exhausted. Man. And it's repetitive. You're constantly drilling, constantly sparring, strength and conditioning.

You're swimming, you're running, you're doing this, you're doing that. And then the impending moment of that fight is constantly looming in the background of your life. There's no escape from it. And like you need like sometimes you need like a C.T. Fletcher video to get you over the hump. Wow. I guess. I mean, because I have the utmost respect for fighters, boxers, and MMA guys especially. I mean, anybody. The guy who gets knocked out every time he steps in, I respect the fuck out of him

because he had the testicular fortitude to step through the fucking gate, man, and get in there and actually do do you know joe i know you know but people don't understand how much it takes to just take that trip down and actually get in that cage and face another man who's trying to take your fucking head off yeah that that takes tremendous. I remember how much it took fighting at the Long Beach Arena and just the crowd there. And there's nothing compared to MMA crowds. And they have people.

That crowd makes a big fucking difference, Joe. It makes it. I got so fucking nervous. Everything that I had learned, I fucking forgot. As soon as that guy kicked me upside the head, I forgot every fucking, every cotta, all that shit went right out the window, and I went and tried to kill him. I forgot everything,

and I went straight to Compton, man. I forgot all my cottas and everything, man, and I, it takes a tremendous, and that's why I respect the guy so much, because I have an inkling of an idea. I don't have a real idea because I've never done this, but I have an inkling of an idea of what it takes to actually get in that octagon and be for all those thousands of people. And when there's millions of people watching on TV and perform.

Oh, it's amazing. And rise, and rise to the occasion. rise to that fucking occasion. Yeah, some guys actually literally fight better than they train. Yeah.

They're better inside the cage and there's the rare human being that when the chips are down, when it's difficult, when the situation is intense pressure, they shine. Wow.

They're at their best. Do you have a problem? Do you think you would have a problem in your youth if you got a guy in trouble to pound on that guy? It's hard if you've been hurt before and you know what you're doing to the guy. You know, I think a lot of guys get very upset when a referee doesn't stop the fight in time. And I think for good reason. Like, they'll look at the referee and go, what the fuck?

How many times do you want me to hit this dude? He's barely defending himself obviously he's out but you know in the moment the heat of the battle and you catch someone you're smashing them you know it's like uh i think it also depends on what how you feel about that person like the recent fight between uh tj dillashaw and cody garbrandt yeah this intense intense feud and then finally um tj catches him, drops him, and then puts him out. And you can tell when he's smashing him, when he's out, you know, he's not thinking good things about him. He's not thinking about letting off the gas.

No, he's trying to kill him. And then when Cody got up and he was just still dazed and TJ's in his face, screaming in his face. There's nothing like fighting. No, it's nothing like it. It's not like any other sport. I talked to a UFC fighter. I'm not going to mention his name because I don't know if he wants me to or not,

so I'm not going to do it. But he told me that he goes into some fights, not all of them, having a real fear of hurting his opponent. And I think it's really hard to do your absolute best when you have that fear of, you know, doing real damage to your opponent. It's one more element. I think this guy, I think he would be a champion if he completely get rid of that. It's very hard.

But when you're going in the ring hoping, and it's your job to stop this guy, to stop your opponent. And if you're going in there hoping that you don't hurt him, then I don't think you can perform to your utmost capabilities

if that's really foremost in your mind. I don't want to hurt this guy yeah i think fighters only have a certain amount of time they can compete as well before the overwhelming reality of what they're doing sets in i mean in the beginning when they're 19 20 21 they're just fucking full of piss and vinegar and shit and lightning and kicking people in the head and just yeah every day it's just chaos and then as time goes on you deal with your own injuries you you start to see people just suffer the repercussions of a career in combat sports

and then as you get older you just realize like what this is really that you're doing so you think rumble johnson was really smart i think rumble rumble is the scariest fucking guy 205 pounds terrifying right and then decides after a world title fight like i don't want to do this yeah Rumble is the scariest fucking guy at 205 pounds. Terrifying, right? And then decides after a world title fight, like, I don't want to do this. Fuck this. I don't want to hug dudes, get hit in the head. He goes, I'm not really a fighter. He goes, I was a really good athlete.

I'm real good at it. Take it easy, everybody. Man, you know, I talked to Rump on social media back and forth with Rump. Really cool kid. Very good guy. Really cool. And I respect the fuck out of his decision, man. I respect the...

But he's talked about coming back now. Yeah, you know what? I mean, I'm sure that something is going to make him an offer that he can't refuse. Well, he's very marketable, I'll tell you that. Yeah, yeah. A guy who can do what he can do to people. Destroy people, man. Just fucking destroy them.

He's a good example also of someone who cut weight when they shouldn't have. Yeah. I hate weight cutting. I think it's the worst thing that fighters do to themselves. I think it's even worse than fighting. Why? There's guys that get organ failure. A woman just died in Australia who was cutting weight for an amateur kickboxing fight.

Oh, my God. It's just a terrible, terrible practice that people do. But he was one of the biggest weight cutters ever. He was well over 200 pounds getting down to 170. And when he was at 170, he was smashing people. But as long as it was quick. Because he had dehydrated himself so bad that when he'd get into the third, fourth, and fifth round, he just had nothing left.

He just was so drained. At heavyweight, he would be fucking terrified. Terrifying. Terrifying. Oh, my God. Yeah. If he really wants to do it. Maybe he just needed a break.

I mean, who knows? Sometimes guys just need to take some time off and chill. I think somebody's going to offer him because he's very marketable. I think he's in the weed business now. Yeah, I did see that. I'm like, what? Go rumble. Pble puppies or two yeah you got a few things going on yeah he's got a kennel yeah yeah he's involved in some businesses and you know he's obviously not damaged like when you talk to him right he's

totally exactly yeah he's totally there he's not suffered the damage that a lot of fighters have suffered so if he does did decide to get out now he's at a good place in his life where he's totally there. He's not suffered the damage that a lot of fighters have suffered. So if he did decide to get out now, he's at a good place in his life where he's accomplished a lot. And he's also going to walk away unscathed. Yeah, as long as he can make money doing other shit, I don't see. He would just touch people. Just touch them. Boom. And you would see the lights go out.

Oh, my God. Like Glover to Sheriff. Nobody ever did that to Glover like that. Yeah. One uppercut. Blam. And it's over. It's out. Oh, my God. Like Glover to Sheriff. Nobody ever did that to Glover like that. Yeah. One uppercut. Blam. And it's over. It's over.

Go home. Yeah. Yeah, I want to see him punch that thing that Francis Ngannou punches. He might be right up there with Francis. I would like to see that, too. Rumble's a terrifying human. Terrifying. You know, it's a very interesting sport to follow because there's so many exceptional human beings that are competing in this thing,

that are involved in this high-level problem-solving event. It's just you see these human beings that are pushing themselves, their minds, their bodies to such extreme limits. It's very valuable for people. Much like I say your videos are very valuable, they're very valuable for people to be able to watch someone competing at such a high level. Oh, my God. I mean, I'm a pay-per-view nut, man. If I ain't there in person, I'm buying it, Jack.

I won't miss it. Yeah, me too. Did he fucking say me too? That's true. But I am a fan. You're fucking at all of them, man. I'm not at all of them. That's true.

That is true. I have seen a couple. Less of them than ever before. I have seen a couple. I'm down to just North American fucking at all of them, man. I'm not at all of them. That's true. That is true. I have seen a couple. Less of them than ever before. I have seen a couple. I'm down to just North American pay-per-views now. That's all I do. Yeah, yeah. Really?

Yeah, it's too much traveling, man. Flying Australian shit. Yeah. It just breaks you down. I couldn't, oh yeah, I couldn't imagine because like before, you know, I had the heart attack, I was traveling. Every weekend I'm in a different city, man. Yeah.

Really, it will really run you the fuck down, man. Yeah, it will. But I know my traveling schedule had to be nothing compared to yours. One year was rough. One year, I think I did 24 events. That was the most I ever did, 22 or 24, and it was crazy. It was like every other weekend, I was flying somewhere. Wow.

That was before someone else started doing like picking up some of the the work like the ufc then hired a second commentary team and they started doing the right fox sports events and different events yeah you got other shit going too man and i have a family you know i still have time for all that shit but i still enjoy it i still love it of course how many uh uh comedian gigs do you do? Well, I work all the time. I'm working tonight at the Comedy Store tonight. I'm working tomorrow.

This weekend, I'm working in Detroit the night before the UFC. I got a couple shows in Detroit. So I'm always doing stand-up. Damn. But stand-up is, like, in a lot of ways like an athletic event in that you have to be in shape for it. You can't get out of shape. If you get out of shape. If you get out of shape,

you'll be rusty up there. How you deal with hecklers, Joe? Just shut them down. Just shut them down. Most of the time, most people don't heckle. It's the rare dummy that steps out and wants to bark at you.

You will get a rare dummy. A rare dummy every now and then. Rare dummies exist, man. Yep, they do. So listen, brother, I got to wrap this up. Okay. But I wish you the best, and I really appreciate you coming here, and I'm really excited that we got a chance to talk.

And what I said I really mean. I think you're very valuable, you know. I think what you've done is, I mean, I know it just kind of came to you out of nowhere by accident, but I think you've helped a tremendous amount of people, and I know you've helped me. Oh, man, Joe, I appreciate that so much, and I appreciate the opportunity to be on your show. I feel like I finally made it, my Joe Rogan experience.

Well, listen, man, keep us posted with your health, and we're going to send you all the best positive energy and wishes we can, and I really hope you get that transplant and everything works out well, and we'll have you in afterwards, and we'll talk about it, man. God bless you, Joe. C.T. Fletcher, ladies and gentlemen.