The Joe Rogan Experience - #1260 - Lennox Lewis & Russell Peters

Episode Date: March 7, 2019

Lennox Lewis is a three-time world heavyweight champion, a two-time lineal champion, and remains the last heavyweight to hold the undisputed title. Russell Peters is an actor and standup comedian, currently touring internationally all over the world.

Just don't crash as much. Don't think that's the issue? Four, three, two... This time we're live. Ladies and gentlemen, we are live with the great and powerful Russell Peters. Hi. And one of the baddest motherfuckers to ever get into the ring. Lennox Lewis.

Don't mess with the best. That's a fact. You're walking around On this earth One of the baddest Motherfuckers of all time Verified 100%

Feel good about it too It's gotta feel good Yeah don't get in any fights But you know what else You have your wits about you 100% You're smooth and relaxed You know

How did you do that? I started out that way It's like You know How did you do that? I started out that way. It's like, you know, apple don't fall too far from the tree type of thing. I've always been that way. Collective thinker. Soft spoken.

And what you don't know about me, what you don't know about me, when you do know about me, you love me even more. Do you exercise at all anymore, boxing-wise? Yeah. Do you hit the bag? Well, not hit the bag. I'm more into working out with the weights.

It was hard for me when I retired. That was the worst part. What was the hardest? Just saying, okay, I'm eating more, so I need to exercise. I'm not doing no exercising. But when I start exercising, I'm training for a fight right so it's like okay training training why am i doing this i'm not gonna fight but i'm still training for a fight so mentally i have to say to myself well let me try the soft things you know let me play tennis and all these different sports which i can play and that kind of helped me a lot better yeah that is

an interesting thing with Fighters A lot of times When they're done They're done Look at my Donna Yeah well he's Apparently gotten back

In shape again He's back in training camp But my Donna got big You know why Because he probably Got an Instagram People started talking shit Because he's kind of fat

That's what made me Want to lose weight Really Yeah People talking shit People were like Holy fuck Did you eat your

whole cast you do look like you're losing weight though you look pretty slim i think i lost 21 pounds with our uh with our dear friend john jack machado well hey jujitsu will peel that weight off yeah that's a fact yeah that's some strenuous shit you ever thought about doing jujitsu lennox he's scared of me he won't do it whoa let me tell you when i was was growing up, I had friends that did wrestling, I had friends that did kickboxing, all these different mediums. And we would always practice with them, whether it's wrestling, whether it's kicking, whether it's doing whatever, play fighting. You did all that stuff? Yeah. Because everybody always wants to test a boxer and say, well, you know, how does he fare up against a karate guy?

How does he fare up against a kickboxer? How does he fare up against an MMA guy? Yeah. They always fare financially better. So, you know, for me, I didn't really throw my weight around like that. You know, it's like, don't mess with me. Okay, if you mess with me, something's going to happen. And then they don't really throw my weight around like that. It's like, don't mess with me. Okay, if you mess with me, something's going to happen. And then they don't really mess with me.

I kind of carry myself like that. Because I'm so serious at sometimes. They can sense the seriousness of it. Serious, but still easy going. So there's no reason to push you. Right. I'm silent, but violent. Ooh, I like that.

Silent, but violent oh i like that silent silent but violent it is an interesting thing though about about fighters is that you're when you think of exercise you think of exercises you're preparing for a big violent event yeah whereas for most people they just don't want to be fat they want to look good they want to get in shape and you know it's a lot of people on instagram they're just working out really hard every day but there's no reason right you had a They want to look good They want to get in shape And you know It's a lot of people On Instagram That are just Working out really hard Every day But there's no reason Right

You had a reason Yes Yeah So when the reason's gone It's like Hmm Now what How do I maintain this shape

Without maintaining that lifestyle Yeah You think of another reason Yeah Oh Like you You know You look good by the way

Thanks He does look good Lennox has seen me Since I was 147 pounds Really You were 147 pounds Oh, like you. You look good, by the way. Thanks. He does look good. Lennox has seen me since I was 147 pounds. Really? You were 147 pounds at one point, then? When I first started boxing, I was 147. How old were you?

15. Oh, okay. I met him probably when I was 16. Oh, really? No kidding. You guys have known each other that long? Yeah. I know his parents. Yeah.

Wow. And his mom and his brothers. Wow. We're back. We're deep. That's crazy. And his mom and his brothers. Wow. We're deep. That's crazy. A lot of people don't realize that. It was like, you know, I see him as a big star now. I've seen him in movies and commercials rescuing people.

You know what I mean? I'm like, yo, this is the kid. You know, he's grown up. He's on TMZ. I literally used to sell him mixtapes in the 90s. He was already world champ, and I'd be playing a mixtape. He'd be like, yo, sell me that. And I'm like, I just made it.

He's like, I'll give you 20 bucks. I'm like, you just made $100 million. Can't you give me 100 bucks? Yeah, well, you know, everybody was making tapes back then. You remember those days where people were aggressively trying to sell tapes on the streets? I wasn't even trying to sell it. I was just playing it in my car, and he was like, you know, sell me that.

He had the new shit going on. You know, he had the real shit, so I had to get it. I didn't have that contact to get the music, so he had the music contact. A lot of people don't know, Russell's a legit DJ. I reluctantly gave him those mixtapes. Reluctantly. Yeah, it's a good move.

When you see him wrestling with people on TMZ, you see that shit? Where they're wrestling with the Jewel Thief. I was trying to see what happened after. He didn't throw no punches, though. I was coaching. I was yelling, get his neck. Get his fucking neck. If you watch it, you see I went for his arm to pull down to get his neck.

And then the other guy in front of him pulled him down and I couldn't get the neck. Could you tell us what happened? I mean, all I've seen was a guy walking out and you grabbed him. No, if you watch it. There it is. There it is. Here it goes. Here it goes.

Okay, so here's what happened. Let me tell you what happens. I'm there looking at a ring, right? Yeah. And that guy's sitting down. Earlier I had checked to see if the door was open. He went out to spit and now he really, he thinks the door's open. So now out to spit, and now he really thinks the door's open. So now he thinks he's just going to get up and walk away with this ring.

This is where he makes his little move. And then they lock the doors, and then I'm standing there, and I'm like, what's going on? And I'm like, he takes a swing at my friend's father, and then I go, no, no, I tried to get his neck, and that guy pulls him, you see? There's a lot of opportunities to get the neck there, son. No, but I'm trying.

He's a big, strong fucking guy, too. No, you've got to go over the top. I was trying, but I had three layers on. I had a jacket, a sweatshirt, and a long-sleeve shirt on. That is an issue. So then I try to go for the arm. But everybody sees everybody's in my way. So I'm like, give me the arm.

Just let me get the arm. Move, Dad. Move, Dad. Amazing. There you go. Who's the guy in the big chain? Who's the guy in the big chain? That's Uncle David. And there I go. I get the arm. Who's the guy in the big chain who's the guy in the big chain that's uncle david and there i get i get the arm the backward baseball i'm pushing the arm down and

you'll see i lock the wrist here as soon as i lock the arm he says he says okay he stops moving right there he goes okay okay okay yeah and i got the wrist you see the wrist a little wrist lock steven seagal style that was my fredson Pichal lock Oh there you go Wrist locks are legit He got up again? No no no This is just a different angle Oh different angle

I want to know How far we was going to make With a ring You see You see that wall Where my cousin is hiding? Yeah When he was trying to get out

He whacked his head Against that wall Oh no And he cut his ear open The thief? Yeah So whatever happened to him? He got arrested

Cops came Where was this? In Toronto? No, New York City No shit Right in the jewelry district Wow So it's funny

Wow, you're a hero What an ill-planned out move Yeah You don't think that they know That people grab things and run away? Well, there's that And apparently this guy Had been coming to the store

For six months Scoping the place out. Oh, that's hilarious. He scoped it out poorly. That's hilarious. Yeah, just silly. Do you have to go to court or anything with that? I don't know. I haven't heard anything since.

Do you worry about that? All I was trying to do was hold him there because all the doors were locked. I'm like, it doesn't make sense to get into a scrap with the guy. If I could just put him in a chokehold or a lock, then until the cops come. But the thing is, you could injure him. If you injure him, then they sue you. Believe it or not. Really?

Yeah, as ridiculous as it sounds. How does that work? Well, Russell's not really a law enforcement officer. I know, but it would have been dangerous for everybody in the store if he was running wild. True. I mean, look, he's lucky you didn't crack him. Yeah. I just locked him up, and I said, all him yeah you know i just locked him up and i

said all right as soon as i locked him up he goes okay and i go okay good and then he had one knee uh one knee down and one leg up and i kicked that leg out so he'd be on both knees get rid of his base that's right i was trying to move his base move the base okay i got a question okay now if the whole thing happened again how would you do things different i would have told everybody get out of my way so i can get him in a choke and hold him. Okay. Would you just put him to sleep? Yeah.

Just put him to sleep. Lay him down. Yeah. Lay him down. Tuck him in. You went back home and obviously feel good about yourself. Did you kind of run the whole thing through your mind a couple of times? Like, yo, this could have happened or what could happen in this situation?

No, I started thinking after if he had a gun or if he had a knife but i'm like if he had a gun he would have pulled it out right away wow yeah yeah you know he's not here to surprise you with a gun he's here to scare you with the gun well if there's all that many dudes on him too good luck pulling that gun out yeah yeah one of us would have got shot but they're probably not probably not if you you probably got real urgent if you saw him reaching for something yeah it would have changed yeah i think knees to the head would have kicked everything everything i know i watch a lot of karate movies there's different things you could do like you ever want to practice karate you ever like want to do something different that's why i was asking you about jujitsu because you know when you're a world heavyweight champion

boxer after a while like what other shit can i learn? I kept arm locking them when we were in England. I kept hugging them and putting them in an arm lock. You know, great Bruce Lee fan. I love fighting movies. And martial arts has always been a part of my life. And I say that because every fight I fought, before I fought that fight, I watched a martial art movie. Really? Yeah.

Like what? Like Chuck Norris, Bruce Lee, that kind of shit, Jackie Chan. Five Deadly Venoms. Oh, the real shit. Yeah, so, you know, those kind of movies. Carter Wong type stuff, you know. Yeah, I like that. And that just got me in that mental state, like, you know.

Do you watch MMA today today yeah do you would you ever watch it and go if this was around when i was fighting would i do this um the only thing i think about that because you know like i said i was in the wrestling in in i did wrestling when i was younger and boxing as well so i didn't know they could combine them to until i got older but you know my focus was more on boxing. But if they got paid a lot of money, I probably would have done it. Yeah, that's how a lot of people feel, I think. I think right now the money's not quite there.

It's for some people like Conor McGregor or Ronda Rousey. But for the other folks, it's not enough to get a guy like Earl Spence to jump over. But for the other folks, it's not enough to get a guy like Earl Spence to jump over. No, and then I see a lot of, I've seen some boxers actually good at boxing, actually just win the fight on boxing because they're so good with their hands. Yeah. But your stance has to be different. You can't have your lead leg out in MMA.

That's the problem. Well, you can't stand it sideways, yeah. Yeah. You've got to square up. Your leg will get lit up. I don't know. I stand sideways even in the fight because I know

I stick that leg out there for them to come come at and obviously you know it's easy to grab a leg but to me

I don't think fighting should start that way anyway nobody when you start fighting usually punches are thrown quick and it lasts a couple seconds nobody really just goes

for your legs unless they they say okay I'm gonna go for his legs and take him down nobody in the just goes for your legs unless they they say okay i'm gonna go for his legs and take him down nobody in the mma they kick your leg yeah they tell you can't walk the kick leg kicks are brutal you ever been leg kicked yeah yeah it's rough a guy hit me in the leg one time and it's like i couldn't move and i'm like thinking if we got in a fight kick me in the leg and they gave me a dead leg like this i don't know what i would do so yeah

and if it's a guy like your size like a rico verhoeven like who's a glory world heavyweight kickboxing champion they just keep their hands up and chew your legs up one or two shots your legs and it's a horrible feeling like yeah it's like it doesn't move right it's like it just gives out you're right on the side of your knee oh oh oh well you know what you know what he used to do? You guys look like you've accepted that. I go mad. Someone kicks me in my leg and is like, yo, you kicked me in my leg. I don't think anybody's kicking you in your leg anymore. Did you ever see when Shannon the Cannon tried some kickboxing?

No. Shannon Briggs fought Tom Erickson. Oh, he got the shit beat out of him, didn't he? No, no. He fucked him up. Really? Shannon got leg kicked, kicked though and he said he he you know shannon talks he's hilarious he goes champ he goes it hurts so bad but i try to

play it off champ he got hit with one leg kick then he got a hit with another one but he he touched him with like a jab to the body and tom erickson got a little cocky here it is right here he uh he he fought when he was in this transitionary period, and they offered him a lot of money. Right there, he got leg kicked by this guy. And the guy, Tom Erickson, that he fought is really more of a wrestler. He kicked him twice. And then Shannon, he actually broke it down for us on the podcast, but he said his leg was hurting so bad, and he tried to goad the guy into thinking that he could punch with him.

See, he got hit again. He's like, oh, Jesus. He's letting him hit. I would knock that guy out. Yeah, but you think you would just let him do that. But once you get hit with one of those things like that, it's so crippling to your leg. You don't move right. No, you're right.

Because like I said, I got hit there and I was like, my leg couldn't move. The thing is that Erickson fucked up. You put Shannon to sleep, didn't you? Yeah. It was a great fight, too. Erickson tried to box with him for some strange reason. He got into this crazy idea, like right there. Boom.

He got clipped. Good night. Yeah. And that's it. He's got the one. Chill, champ. Chill. Was that kickboxing?

Yes. Kickboxing. Because they're wearing gloves. And no shoes. Boxing gloves. No shoes. Aren't you supposed, isn't Shannon Briggs supposed to at least kick a couple times? Well, you know, if he knew how to, but I think he went into there thinking, you know, I'll

just crack him with a punch and knock him out, which he did. You know, he ate a couple of leg kicks. But it's hilarious when you hear him break it down. He's, how old are you now? Who, me? Yeah. I'm under 100. Under 100?

Yeah, under 100. But you can't be any more than like what are you 45 47 how old thank you very much thank you very much are you older than that 50 you don't want to say you're a great guy you're great you don't want to say how old you are people have internet out there so they'll just look how old is he 53 you look great thank you you do right doesn't he he He always looked good. But when you were, like, you were one of those guys who did the smart, you retired and you just retired. Yes.

You know, which I respect so much. We were just talking about Marvin Hager the other day. Same man. When Marvin Hager retired, he's like, good night. Take care, everybody. Lost a controversial decision to Sugar Ray Leonard. 1987. He said, take care.

I'm going to go do some movies and that was it he just never came back it is so rare that a fighter does that well you know what Marvin was disheartened like a motherfucker

for his boxing though he hated it he was like I'm out yeah yeah you know boxers go through so much and

it's like when they know when it's time when a boxer says it's time to quit they know it's time because they've gone through so much and they realize that it's a lot of hard work. For me, I've been boxing since I've been 15. So, you know, in training, hundreds of hours training, hundreds of hours working out, resting, working on technique, sparring, all these different things after a while you know you

have to reach you reach that height where you say okay that's enough and sometimes you know people managers and trainers and promoters they don't want to tell the boxer that's enough because that's how much they're making money off of that boxer every time he steps in the ring right so um did you have a conversation with emmanuel stewart about it absolutely yeah and who who made the decision did you guys make it together uh i made the decision he wanted me actually to go on really yeah because i wanted to you know tyson was my main nemesis and um you know he's a boxer that i would i definitely wanted to fight before retiring and i didn't know if it was going to happen or not.

So I actually stuck around for a couple more years for that fight to happen because I didn't want, throughout history, people would be saying, oh, Tyson would have won or Lewis would have won. I wanted them to know who would have won. Right, right. And then after that, after the Tyson fight, you know, Manny said, listen, Klitschko's around. That's the new generation. You can beat the guys from this generation and the guys from the next generation.

I'm like, yeah, that sounds good. So he kind of talked me into doing that fight because I wasn't really going to do that fight. And then that was a year after Tyson, and I didn't really want to box him straight away. I wanted to box somebody else because the main nemesis was Tyson. And, you know, once I beat Tyson, you know, I could relax a little bit. I relaxed for a year. And then getting back into boxing, I boxed Klitschko. It was my first fight, which was a mistake.

Took the fight 17 days notice. At my worst, I beat him at his best. Why was it such a short notice fight uh because the opponent that i actually picked to fight didn't fight didn't want to fight me he actually said no who was that supposed to be uh johnson from uh oh yeah kurt johnson from nova scotia you were doing him a favor i think Klitschko felt that he was doing him a favor. Listen, let me take the fight.

I've been training for two years for this guy. I'm ready. And then we'll give you the first shot after I win. That's what was promised to him. Vitaly has such a weird style, didn't he?

Yeah, he did. And that's that kickboxing style coming into play a little bit because he would throw a punch and lean back like this. And that's the first time I've actually seen that style yeah and you know if i didn't reach out with my right hand as far as i did i would never have caught him with that cut and it was that long

right hand that caught him just at the end of my punch when he leaned back and he couldn't lean back anymore that made his eye cut yeah he was a very strange fighter in terms of his style just the way hands were always down there's a very weird way of moving very unorthodox because he was such a big guy he was six foot seven yeah there was he was probably the biggest guy you fought right yeah could take a hell of a shot you never fought gonzalez did you michael grant was big. Gonzalez, I boxed in the Olympics. Jorge Luis Gonzalez? That was his name, right?

Yeah. Cuban guy? Yep. There you are. Look how weird the way he fights is. Just such an awkward way of moving. He hit me good with the right hand. Yeah.

So I held on. You see me holding him around the neck? Yeah. I learned that from Muhammad Ali. He said, if you hold a guy around the neck, you can tell when he's going to move. Mm. Wow. But he was good in the first few rounds.

After the first three rounds. What people don't realize about this fight, I wasn't fighting for 12 rounds. I was fighting to knock this guy out. Because you had it in your mind. Yeah, I had it in your mind. Yeah. That was the strategy going into it. This is the first time you ever see me going forward in the fight. This guy's bigger than me.

I'm coming forward. And I'm throwing punches. He's catching me. But those were the early rounds. Although he's two inches taller than you, you look bigger than him. He's a big fella. Physically. Physically.

Yeah. You're wider. You know, when you look back on your career, do you have a most satisfying victory? Yeah. What is it? I've seen Rockman. I was going to say that.

I was going to say the rematch. The first or the second? The second one, motherfucker. Jesus Christ. You Wally. When a guy beats you like that, and then you know you could have beaten him or you should have beaten him,

is that what bothered you so much? No, you know what really bothered me is the fact that I gave him an opportunity. I gave him a fight when I'm basically waiting for Tyson and I have to keep busy. I'm looking down the list of who to fight. He's number seven. I realized that he's durable. He's not one of these guys that get knocks out easy. So I wanted to give my fans, you know, a proper fight.

Box the best guy out there. Not box the easy guy that's easy to get knocked out. I don't want to go home in two rounds. So, and then another reason, a lot of people don't know. I went to Africa to fight because Muhammad Ali went to Africa. He fought in Africa. So I wanted to do that. I wanted to be, I wanted to fight in Africa.

You know, I say, I'm a world champion, so I need to fight all around the world. So that's what made me go to Africa. The only thing about Africa is I didn't know that it was such a high altitude up there. And for me to have a fight, I should have got there a lot earlier, but I was doing Ocean's Eleven at that time. People said, oh, you were doing a movie. I wasn't doing no movie. I was sitting around half the time waiting for them to change the lights then go out and go out there

for two minutes and then go back and sit there for another two hours while they change the lights so were you training at all when that was happening yeah i was training but it wasn't like there it wasn't the conditions of training you know i needed a bag i needed sparring partners i need to be uh up there a lot sooner. So you just kind of exercised. Climatized, yes. How many thousand feet was it above sea level? Higher than Big Bear.

It was Cape Town, right? So more than six? Yeah. Wow, I didn't know that. Yeah, it was kind of weird because when I started working out, I was like throwing punches. Then I found myself going, so i had to take two steps back and i'm like oh no don't tell me this fight's gonna be one of those fights where i have to take my time so i basically went out there taking my time i realized he's dealing with the same thing i'm

dealing with although he was there a lot earlier but you know i had a couple things going wrong boxing at four in the morning uh they couldn't find a big enough ring. Then when they put the ring together, it was like 18 by 19. And then the punch that actually hit me, I actually thought I was going to block it, but it came around this side. I put my hand up to block it, but it came around, hit me. One of those things where a man threw a terrific punch, which my chin happened to be in the way of. What is it like when that's over and you're sitting there and you know you lost,

but you know that under the right circumstances, this guy is not at your level? In fact, my problem was solved before I got out of the ring. I knew what I did wrong, which was the greatest thing that ever happened to me. It's like, on another day,

he wouldn't throw a lucky punch like that. It wouldn't hit me. And he wouldn't have a ref that, you know, was on his side as well. How was the ref on his side? When I say the ref's on his side, you know...

He called it a little early, I would say. I got knocked down in the second round. I'm the champion. Right. At least give me a chance. Not wave the fight straight away. Right, right, right. You know, you've seen the Deontay Tyson Fury fight.

Like, you know, if that was the ref, he would have counted him out straight away. Yeah, that's a good point. Probably would have stopped it at the press conference. That fucking 12th round, that right left that deontay landed the fact that tyson got up and then won the remainder of the round that is crazy yeah i'm so frustrated that fight's not happening again man every you know i'm looking at the heavyweight scene and um i'm looking at obviously um joshua joshua from england and you know he had the opportunity to fight dionte and didn't take it i'm like if that was me i would have took that chance because you never know what happens down the road like what's happening now and uh you

know to me he's being put on the shelf now he has to box somebody that nobody really wants him to box who's he fighting next? Baby, Baby Miller. Oh, Big Baby Miller? Big Baby Miller. Yeah. You know, Big Baby Miller, I haven't seen too much of him. I don't know too much about him, but, you know, he talks a good fight. I know he weighed over 300 pounds at one time.

He's a big baby. Yeah. And, you know, now he's got an opportunity to fight Joshua, so he's taking full advantage of it like he should. But I don't see anything in his history to show me that he can beat Joshua. He can bang, though. He can bang if you're there to bang. Joshua's got feet.

He's going to move. He's not going to stay there and bang. He's an excellent boxer. Yeah, he's going to be a smart boxer in this fight. we'll see right i mean never know yeah i mean this these are one of those things where i think this is where anthony's got to be extra careful because miller's going to train twice as hard and if joshua doesn't train like he's fighting dionte right he's gonna he may take it for granted make a mistake and you can do that i've done that i've done that it's and it's nothing it's nothing that he's done on purpose it's not it for granted, make a mistake. And you can do that. I've done that. I've done that. And it's nothing that he's done on purpose.

It's a mental thing. Yeah, it's a mental thing. Like when you fought Marvrovich. Yeah. That guy wouldn't go home. Wouldn't go home. That guy wouldn't go home. He gave me a lot of trouble.

I was at that fight. Gave me a lot of trouble. Lennox boxed this guy around the ring for 12 rounds. Like literally the guy's head's snapping back And this guy's not going anywhere He was going nowhere That's gotta be a weird feeling too When you know how hard you punch

And you see a guy just eating him Like some people just are built weird They just can take a shot No I learned that coming up I learned that like Some guys that are tough to the head Are weak to the body Some guys that are tough to the head are weak to the body. Some guys are tough to the body, weak to the head.

And some guys are just made out of rocks. Yeah. Yeah. It's almost like ignorant bliss. They just don't know they're supposed to feel pain. I don't know. I mean, I really think it's a physiological thing. I think some guys can just take a shot.

They're just built better. Sometimes I've been in fights where I've gone in and a man's hit me on the chin first couple minutes. And it's like he just glanced off my chin. I was like, I ate it up. Ate the punch up. And it didn't hurt me. And it was like, what happened to that punch? It was so hard.

It hit you on the chin. Everybody was saying, yo, did you see that punch? You never felt it? I'm like, no. And when I look at tape of it, it's like, wow, I did get it. Did you see that punch? You never felt it? I'm like, no.

And when I look at tape of it, it's like, wow, I did get hit. Is it because, like, are there a bunch of factors? Like how much you got hit in training? How well you feel coming into the fight? Where you're at in your career? Yeah, there's a lot of factors. Like, for instance, let me give you a wicked factor. If you haven't boxed for two years and all of a sudden you step into the ring and it's a title fight and you box you can the first good hit you get is going to concuss you really because you haven't been getting those

hits for that like two years now this man hit you with two years uh um and you're getting used to it and you've you felt it and you've gotten over it you need to get over that hill is it a mental hill it is a mental hill because even for me me, when I haven't fought for a while, you know, I go out there. Until I get hit, once I get hit, that wakes everything up. It's like, yo, this is not supposed to go like that. You're not supposed to hit me. I'm supposed to hit you. So I get going.

So the Haseem Rahman fight, after it was over over were you worried that you were going to get a we're not going to get a rematch yes i was very worried in fact we chased him to three courts around the world and he didn't want to fight me and i you know if i was in this position i wouldn't want to fight me either because uh you know i'm coming back for revenge. Plus, there's a big money fight out there with Tyson, which he so happened to say after the fight, no more Louis Tyson, no more Louis Tyson. And he actually left South Africa without visiting Mandela. Like, why you go to Africa and not visit Mandela? I did.

He just wanted to get out of there. Yeah. Take that belt. And that $7 million that he got off of Don King. So the fight got made again because after the third courtroom, the judge says, whose signature is this? Haseem said it was his. You signed it? Yes.

Well, you got to give him the rematch. You signed it to give him a rematch, so you have to give him a rematch. So he didn't want to hear that. So I was happy. Got the rematch. You signed it to give him a rematch, so you have to give him a rematch. So he didn't want to hear that. So I was happy. Got the rematch. How long did it take? Two years. Two years.

Wow. And there was all those brawls. Remember the ESPN studio when him and Rockman got into a fight? Yeah, that's right. They knocked over the table and everything. Yeah. Lennox was wearing his big Steve Harvey suit. Did you?

Steve Harvey suit. Let me tell you, it was a Steve Harvey suit, too. Because I had the slipperiest shoes in the world world i didn't come there to fight right i came there to like you know do press those slippery shoes are the worst if anything goes down you got those leather shoulder shoes oh my god on carpet you just no legs just give up i went that's when you got to learn jujitsu yeah now when you were in that time period I don't remember did you have fights in between?

yeah how many fights did you have after Rockman? oh no I didn't have no fights in between no fights in between no no I just trained for Rockman

just waited yeah so it took you two years two years god that must have been so frustrating it was it was because you never know

if you're going to get the fight or not or you know these guys are running from you they signed to fight a rematch because you never know if you're going to get the fight or not. These guys are running from you. They signed to fight a rematch because now they didn't want to sign it. I remember when that right hand landed. I remember I was watching at home and I threw my arms up in the air. I was like, oh, shit. Yes.

Rockman went to sleep, sleep. Boom. Sleep, sleep. It was a hammer. Let's check this out, man. I mean, for a long time coming, you're waiting for it. You know, for this fight, Rockman couldn't catch me because my speed was different. You know, in South Africa, it was a lot slower.

Now, he got kind of a little frustrated because he couldn't catch me. Boom. Yep. Oh, man. Over the top of the shoulder. Joe Cortez, let him count still. Oh, that was Over the top of the shoulder. Joe Cortez, let him count still. That was a phenomenal. That was probably one of the most satisfying one-punch knockouts I've ever watched.

Yeah. Because I knew what you had gone through, and I knew, like, everybody knew you were one of the greatest of all time. And to have you get KO'd like that, first of all, it endeared people to you in a way. Because it showed your vulnerability, but also your character and your ability to come back, which is not easy, man. When you get stopped like that, like psychologically, it's got to be fucking with your head. Let me tell you, the first time I lost, everybody was coming up and shaking my hand and said, well, what are you going to do now? I'm like, what do you mean? What am I going to do now?

Yeah, well, what are you going to do now? I'm going to go back and win my championship i said okay you know they didn't think it was gonna be possible but i'm thinking muhammad ali gained the championship three times yeah so i've only lost it once i can do it again it takes a special person to do it and i can do it do you do you feel like there was like two stages of your career like pre-Emmanuel Stewart and post yeah absolutely there's two sizes of them too then if you look at in service like he went from like a like a skinny a skinny kid to a man like a just giant fucking man out of nowhere yeah um the pre the pre-Emmanuel Stewart was obviously you you know, me learning how to be a professional, learning to fight pro.

And then once I got to Emmanuel, we just like, yo, he said, hey, you're a great fighter. You know, you used to move around a lot. We've got to bring that back. I'm like, okay, cool. So the movement he brought back, he taught me a couple of cronk tricks, you know, that check hook and different things that the cronk fighters do which works well um and uh you know he was easy to understand and what what i liked about him what he said i can do i could accomplish he just told me what to do i'll do it yeah if he said len we need to win this round i'll win that round you know yeah you had that kind of

relationship right he was really one of the great masters you know there's there's certain masters when it comes to like boxing training like when you would hear him discuss fighters like i really loved hearing him do commentary as well yeah because he would discuss fighters and what they need to do and he was always just dead on he just knew things he understood boxing so comprehensively he just knew what a fighter needed to do so i was so excited when he started working with you because i was like well that's that's exactly what lennox needs so was hbo because you know it's funny i'll do fights on hbo and they would say oh he's doing this he's not doing this he needs to do more he needs to throw the jab more

then emmanuel started working for me and he's like oh he's doing the jab he's doing well I was like oh this is what you need you need a great coach anytime you're going on TV that the commentators respect then they'll talk good about the boxer

but if you're not a good trainer it's like what do they need to talk about they talk a lot of shit in boxing commentary oh yeah

and they let you know whose side they're on yeah they always let you know you could talk about how they're guiding your brain to watch the fight. Well, they also talk a little shit. It's more like sports commentary.

Like mixed martial arts commentary. I don't do that. I don't really talk shit ever. I mean, occasionally if something's egregiously bad, I'll talk about those real issues here. But I try to just you're very neutral technically i try to compliment both of them hard i try hard at that because i wasn't always you know i've had and i'd learned how to do it on the job nobody really knew how to do there wasn't a lot of people doing it before i started doing it well it sucks for you

because you're fighting with all the fighters yeah it's hard when you watch a friend of yours fuck up another friend of yours yeah that's hard what about uh A friend of yours Fuck up another friend of yours Yeah That's hard What about A friend of yours That's doing something wrong That needs to do something right Do you tell him? Yeah I tell him privately Ah

Mostly See for me I would like to I wish I was like that I wish I could do that But you know People want more truth out of me Yeah

So I try and bring it across In a soft way And not make it too harsh I would bring I would say There's issues Like I see something If it across in a soft way and not make it too harsh. I would say there's issues. Like I see something. If I see like a vulnerability, I'll discuss that.

But if there's something that someone needs to work on or do, I'll try to pull them aside. But most of them know. MMA fighters, I'm sure a lot like boxers, there's different kinds of humans and some of them are just fucking wild. like boxers, there's different kinds of humans, and some of them are just fucking wild. And those wild ones, you know, a lot of times they never become champion, but they're the most exciting people to watch. Like Mickey Ward. Like Mickey Ward's fights with Arturo Gatti,

they're some of the greatest because the way they matched up, I would never want one of my friends to fight like that. Yeah, two lunatics in one ring. Oh, my God, man, those fights were chaos, though. Everybody knew that those guys were never going to beat Maywe guys were they're never going to beat mayweather they're never going to beat the best guys but god damn they were fun to watch yeah yeah some of the craziest they were like our generation's uh uh prior argue almost almost except they went back and forth and back and forth you know who was it that uh had an arm injury and still boxed was it nicky ward no wasn't

it bernard hopkins when he fought antoine eccles he uh i might i might be wrong you mean like a permanent like a broken arm someone got their arm broke in uh or pulled out either you know i think that was uh it was antoine eccles it might have been against hopkins or was against somebody but somebody the guy picked him up and slammed him and he dislocated his shoulder and then the ref was like should I stop the fight

he's like no no no and he knocked the guy with the left hook after he just can't beat him with his left hand Hopkins got slammed and they stopped the fight

and then he came back and won the rematch remember that yes but I recall I recall the guy knocking him out in the next round

with his left hand only. Was that Hopkins? It might have been Hopkins-Eccles, if I'm not mistaken. I'll tell you what, man. One of the hardest fights for me to watch was Hopkins versus Joe Smith. That was a bummer. He got knocked out and fell out of the ropes and landed on his head. I was like, man, that is just, first of all, the fact that there was no padding on the ground.

This is Bernard Hopkins. He's one of the greatest of all time. And this is how this is set up. God, they don't use, they don't put padding on the ground. They need to have something there. Like maybe more of an apron. No, they have to put more people around the ring. So anybody comes flying out, it's like, yo.

That's how they do it in Japan. Like in Pride, they would have guys waiting by the side of the ring to stop guys from falling on the ring because they would use rings which i don't recommend for mma there's pros and cons the pro is that the the cage the cage kind of like you can kind of hold a guy against the cage yeah you can't really hold a guy very well against uh against ropes here it is right here see he i mean like he fell boom like right on his head man i mean i think that's concrete yeah it is he went through and if somebody helps you up the fight's over yeah is that it yeah you're not you get disqualified the minute somebody helps you back into the ring oh really yeah you have to get up on your own and

get back in on your own people know about that hey yeah you're good that's interesting little details kids they could have ruined the fight for him if he was okay yeah like if he was okay if he fell and then someone helps him get back up yeah the tech oh that's interesting yeah somebody be shouting don't touch him don't touch him get up but nobody knows if he's all right or not right especially when you see him land it's human nature to run and help well it's also he's 50 or 51 yeah it was right wasn't he 51 yeah he was not young yeah in that fight when you see a guy like him like how the fuck does a guy like that defy the odds and defy time i mean it's just a skill level experience experience intelligence and hopkins is an intelligent fighter he's like you know you watch him fight he's smart

yeah he doesn't spend one day out of shape yeah and he eats clean and doesn't party yeah he's still to this day i follow his instagram he's always training he's always exercising still looks slim still looks good yeah he's got true focus yeah yeah it's interesting that he became that way like in his estimation because of prison time. You know, going to prison turned him into a disciplined man. You know, like, realizing, like, this is rock bottom. I fucked up. I need to get my life in order.

Yeah. And did. And, you know. Imagine the people out there that commit a crime, spend three, four years in jail because of some stupid crime. They could spend that time training and being a world champion yeah at something yeah at anything well just just develop use that time to develop yourself develop your mind you know i mean when when hopkins was they were already writing him off when he fought felix trinidad remember that i I mean, everybody thought Trinidad was going to run him over. Do you remember the shit he pulled in Puerto Rico in that fight?

Oh, man. He threw the flag and they chased him to the stadium. Oh, my God. And he had to make that like six or seven foot jump to the ground. And he was scared he was going to break his leg. Hilarious. I forgot about that. That was crazy.

They chased him out of the stadium. Yeah. Well, I'm sure Tito had so much on his mind in that fight, so much emotion. Hilarious I forgot about that That was crazy They chased him out of the stadium Yeah Well I'm sure Tito had so much On his mind In that fight So much emotions You know

And then That was the mental warfare That Bernard brought into that one For sure But then also He was just Too good Yeah

He was too good I mean he was just And he was too big He hit too hard Like Trinidad really was A lighter weight fighter than that He was a junior weight fighter than that. Yeah, it was a junior middleweight.

Yeah. Broner did that same thing. Almost got done, too. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I was like, whoa. Yeah, exactly. Threw it down. Oh, man, that was crazy.

Yeah, that was crazy. And, you know, this was, I think Bernard was like 36 at the time. Look at him. They're all swinging at him and shit. That's that jump he had to do. He was trying to get out of there for real. If he just turned, they would have stopped.

If he turned and went like, they would have probably went, oh, what am I doing? Chasing a tiger? Yeah. You didn't chase a tiger and you catch it. You got a real fucking problem.

You know, did you ever have any thoughts at all once you finally retired? Like, maybe one more. Did you ever have any thoughts like that? you know I told people like I'll take I'll take my pajamas off for a hundred mil mmm serious come with it baby show me the paper mmm but who would have to be against AJ maybe no no but when you had

beaten Tyson you'd beat Tyson that was kind of at the end of his stage too, right? Yeah. He wasn't the same guy. I looked at Tyson's history. He's coming from the same history that I'm coming from. And he spent some time in incarceration. While he was in incarceration, I'm still out there fighting and and training hard he didn't have that right in there so when when he came out it's like you know he's training again he's doing what he what what he knows not what he loves but what he knows that's

what's going to make him some money that's going to put um food on this table so it's like i look at old time fighters and say what made them stay in boxing so long? That's the only thing they knew. Right. They're not going to be no singer or dancer or whatever. They only know boxing, and this is where they get their money from. So that's what forces them back into the ring. Especially olden days.

That's why they were called prize fighters because they wouldn't make enough money to make a living unless you were like a huge like a jack dempsey or a ray robinson ray robinson fought way way way past his prime again because they were making good money at the time but not the money that they would have been making if it was today well there was no i mean you know you had to go see it live you know like how much did you get paid for the radio who was that fight on the radio was it jack demp Gene Tunney that was the first million dollar gate? I think so. It was one of those.

Ray Arcel did that fight, I think. Isn't that crazy? What is a million dollars back then, too? That's a lot of money back then. That was in the 1920s, right? Yeah. Did you say Jack? Gene Tunney, Jack Dempsey?

Gene, yes. Gene Tunney. Yeah. When Tyson was in jail, he must have been doing something Because he came out jacked Like he looked good Like he came out looking different Than he ever looked Like six pack

Fully built When he fought Peter McNeely He looked scary He looked terrifying But like physically He looked really good too Like he looked better Than he ever looked

Like more whipped Than ever And when he went in He was a little chubby Yeah Well you know What is it a do in there? Yeah,

it's nothing else. Enough weights. Yeah, so. Fuck dudes. That's what I hear. I don't know. I mean,

how many dudes before it's enough? Depends on how much time you're in there for. Yeah, that was him when he came out. Yeah, he was shredded. Yeah. And he was so much more muscular.

So he's probably, he probably couldn't do any sparring. I doubt they had a a heavy bag but they probably had a weight room you know yeah but you can fight you can fight in prison yeah he was like 28 29 there it depends on what prison right yeah yeah no i'm saying even fight just fight oh fight people yeah yeah yeah you know what you know somebody would have tried to start some shit with oh i'm sure i'm sure if not a guard even you know yeah i bet i bet he had to listen to a lot of shitty things from guard it's funny when i seen him be arrested taken from the courtroom and they got they must have got the biggest guy they could ever

get to go put handcuffs on him or something like that um anyway situation that yeah i hope a lot of people stay away from. Yeah, when he went away, did you feel like, damn it, I'm going to miss out on that fight that I want? Yes, straight away. It's like, oh, no, I'm going to have to wait and delay my retirement. Oh, so you were considering retirement even before he was incarcerated? Yeah. Wow, interesting.

But then you were chasing the bow fight. Bow fight, chicken bow. You know, you figured that... Chicken bow? Is that what you called him? Yeah, chicken bow. You called him Ridiculous Bow. Ridiculous Bow, Chicken Bow.

Tried to pick a fight with me the other day. Did he really? The other day he did? Yeah. Where? At a fight, it was in LA, where they called all the great ones on, Jerry Cooney, me, Foreman, Spinks was there. And what was he doing?

He wanted to stand beside me and take a picture. I'm like, dude, you can't stand beside me. He goes, I'll stand where I want to stand. I'm like, dude, you're going to have to move. So Jerry Cooney kind of helped us out there. Wow. And saved him. Because he can't really speak.

He's had a rough time. Yeah, he can't. He's had a rough time. Yeah, the difference between a guy like you who gets out, who speaks perfect, and a guy like him, he's the warning. That's the warning to the young fighter. You see the older guy who, who you know i saw an interview with him and it was one of the saddest things i've ever seen it was horrible because i i go back and i think about those fights with holyfield those fucking crazy wars insane and you know you see

he paid that price man he he paid that price and you can hear it when he's talking now it's rough it's hard to listen i think the good news is now we're on the other side of fighters coming out that punchy. I think with all the rules and changes that have been made. What changes? You won't meet as many punchy guys as you met from back in the day. Like, you listen to Purnell. You listen to Riddick.

You listen to Meldrick Taylor. Is Purnell bad now? Yeah, he's a little. And Purnell never even got hit that much. He was the best. But I think Purnell is probably more from, you know. Cocaine makes you slur your words? I don't know, man. bad now yeah he's a little and pernell never got hit that much he was the best but i think pernell is probably more from uh you know cocaine makes you slurry words i don't know man you know you do enough shit in your life he drinks he drinks a lot i was drinking i got drunk with

pernell once well there's a lot of one of the things that they say with older fighters is uh and even older football players is they become addicted to alcohol because like they're they're searching for something to try to like recalibrate their brain. There's a scientific explanation to it. People talk about people with traumatic brain injury often become alcoholics. It's like they're trying to get some sort of a dopamine rush. You could also use the alcohol as a justification as to why you're slurring your speech. Well, I know a dude who's an MMA fighter.

He's punchy. He's had a bunch of shots. And this motherfucker will have one drink, and you can't understand a word he's saying. It hits them so hard. So hard. It's confusing. It's like, how are you that drunk? And then you realize, oh, this is both things.

It's both things. It's the brain damage and the alcohol combined. The wheels come off the car. It's bad. Yeah, it's awful. But you've made it out perfect, man. You nailed it. So far, so far.

So far. Yeah, years will tell. Yeah? Do you worry about that? Not really. I try and keep my mind active. I play a lot of chess. Yeah.

How often do you play chess? Every day. Really? Yeah. Do you play online? Do you play competitively? I play online. Yeah.

Whoever jumps in the battle. How good are you? Pretty good. Very. Yeah? Yeah, pretty good. He's a bully. Did he play you?

He is, no. Can you play chess? He used to get mad at me because I'd go to his house and he'd be like, you want to play chess? I'd go, I don't know. Just play. I'm like, I don't know how I play. Just beat his house And he'd be like You want to play chess? I'd go I don't know Just play I'm like I don't know how I play Just beat me

And he'd be like Get out of here Just move Bring me someone who can play Do you study chess? Not as much as I should I just play often And you know

When you play often There's you know People will come out With the same moves And it's like Oh I've seen this move before I know what to do right uh but you know it depends there's people that use their pawns to to wage war use their um the knights or their bishops in combination so it really depends on what type of player they are i'm a you're right i'm a bully player i like playing yeah you know

what he is the joe rogan of pool to Lennox of chess. Well, listen, in my defense, Lennox challenged me. He wanted to play. He thought he could play. Just so people don't know. Don't challenge anybody on their own table. Lennox challenged Joe to a game of pool before the podcast. And Joe fucking cleared the table before Lennox could get one shot off.

Yeah, it was good. That was the warm up. Well, I won the second game, too. Yeah, it was good. That was the warm-up. Well, I won the second game, too. Yeah, you did win the second game as well. I'm still warming up. All right, we'll kill back. He's got time deficit. That's a crazy game, though, on that table,

because that table has four-inch pockets. That's my practice table. I'll show you a four-inch pocket. Hey, whoa, where are you putting it? I have a regular table at home. Well, not a regular table. It's a diamond. It's got four and a half inch pockets. It's still a little tight. A normal like if you go to a pool hall,

they'll give you a five inch pocket or a five and a half inch pocket. Yeah, I got a pool table at home. It's got buckets. I got the abyss. Yeah, this table you can't miss. And it's dirty right now too. So it's even the cloth is slow. So balls don't drop unless they go right through the center.

What type of cloth is that? Blood cloth. Yes, that's the best one. Yeah, it's the best. Yeah. It's a great table. That's a 1972 pool table. Oh, really?

Some guy had it in his basement forever. And my friend Donnie sold it to me. Yeah, the guy just had it sitting in his basement. It's in perfect condition. It's a basement find. basement find yeah man that's a hard table to get it's a gold crown too you know somewhere in california you know what i love about that table what guess what what you don't have to walk around and take the buckets of balls out of the yeah yeah that's annoying yeah it's like ball return they're all there boom. Boom. Yeah. Those, those holes. Yeah. I got those. I got those.

It's annoying, but you probably have like a decorative pool table. Yeah. It came with the house. You have a beautiful house. I've never been there. You've been invited many times. Yeah. He's been to my house when I was with my parents.

He never come to my house as a, as a solo man. Now, um, when you play chess, um, are you like, do you get ranked um are you like do you get ranked are you like a league what it is is your your your points go up so i'm at 11 11 11 000 1100 right now sorry what is that like well the rankings are like if you know if you're up to 14 you're a master so you're closing in on being a master well i wouldn't call me a master yet but you know obviously if i get that i'm i'm trying to get as high as possible but if someone talks shit and they're like lennox i want to play you some some not pool some chess you'd be like oh okay yeah straight away what's one of the most mentally intensive games it's probably one reason

why you stay so sharp yeah i would imagine yeah there's a time restriction 10 minutes so you played that that where you hit the slap the clock yeah well on 10 minutes for a move or 10 minutes for the whole game for the whole game oh damn whoa on the on the um it's a fast game yeah on the computer once you've made that move the time goes over it just resets so it's good now do you ever go like to was Washington Square Park and play those dudes? Done. Really? Yeah. Yeah. That was fun.

They talk a lot of shit, huh? Oh, yeah. They're good, too. They're good. The guy I was playing was talking a lot of shit. Yeah? Yeah. Did you beat him?

Oh, no. Wow. You should have hit him. Why did you have to ask that question? It was just fun playing him. Does it have to be a winner all the time? Those guys are masters. It's true. They i mean good they got nothing else going on well i mean that's all they want to do i mean when you get really good at chess and i'm not really good at chess but i have friends

that are they explain to you like it becomes your whole life like you start thinking like as you're walking down the street you're thinking about chess you just it becomes a thing where it's just everything it's all it's. It's such an intense game. Yeah, I play like at least four games a day. Wow. Online? Damn. What's your online name?

Do you use an online name? Yes, I do. You don't use your real name, right? I'm going to get it right now. Uh-oh. Uh-oh. Let the shallons. Because I made this name a long time ago.

Look at you. There I am, Washington Square Park. Look at that. Playing some master. uh-oh let the shalom because i made this name uh a long time ago and see you there i am washington square park look at that playing some master is that mc supernatural no i don't know who that is those dudes love that game though man i mean there's those guys who are there if you go there they'll be there every day they fucking live for it you know it's um it's one of those things i really admire i really admire people that get get really really good at chess inter 2000 inter 2000 yeah what does that mean that's well it was supposed to be interpol 2000 why it's like the name interpol it sounds official when people when people are playing

playing this interval i think this is the government I'm playing. You know what I mean? It's the European CIA. So if you're out there and you're playing Inter 2000, you're playing Lennox motherfucking Lewis. Yeah. I was going to put my real name, but I don't want everybody to try and beat the champ. Well, now they're going to try to beat the champ.

Champ's retired right now. Let it be known that Lennox Lewis is one of those dudes that walks around with no case on his iphone too and it's smashed is it smashed if i tell you what happens what happened i was doing something and all of a sudden you know my wife said do this and i went and it flew out of your hand yeah but you have the biggest hands of any human being i know and uh and there's no there's no phone that's gonna be big enough unless you carry an ipad let me tell you i don't know who makes these iphones but they make them to slip out of your hands i think they do they really do like put something on that that's grips why don't you have a case that's the first thing i did was put a case on right and then um i forgot what i had to do you have to take it off to charge it up or something

what you got the wrong case you got the wrong case who sold you a case whoever sold you a case is an asshole I guess doesn't have a thing

where you can just stick a hole in it you don't have a run JRE case look at these guys they're all challenging me are they now yeah I gotta boycott

this game right now they're gonna come after you now now that they find out they can play you. I like that they're doing it while we're doing the podcast live. Hey, look, he's going to get obsessed. The wheels are spinning. The competitive drive.

Let me tell you, my wife gives me problems on this. She says, you know, he's playing chess. Women don't understand you playing chess and focusing. I'm trying to tell her, listen, I'm up to this score point. Don't interrupt me because it affects my score. But I need you now. I need to do,

we need to do this. Just five minutes, please, five minutes. You know, she's looking at me weird, but she's gotten better. She's actually,

are you playing chess? So, you know. And then she leaves you alone? Yeah. That's good. I think because I got mad a couple of times.

Ah, probably. Yeah, big bully with his wife. Yeah. That's good. I think because I got mad a couple times. Probably. Yeah. Big bully with his wife. Do you ever play chess with people other than Lennox? No, I can't play chess. I don't know. Good.

I can't either. Maybe you and I will play together. We should really learn the game together. Yeah, we'll learn it together. I don't know how to play it at all. Finally something Joe can't do. I want to video this game. Damn, it'd be fucking disgusting.

Well, you know what? You could coach this game. Damn, it'd be fucking disgusting. Well, you know what? You could coach the game. No, this is the first time I would ever see a chess game turn into checkers. Oh, man. It's like, wow. That's it. We're fighting. How rude.

How do you play this game again? How rude. All this coming from a man who doesn't really know how to play pool. Oh. Shots fired. Shots fired. You're right. You're right.

I play billiards. Billiards. Billiards. Pocket billi. I play billiards. Billiards. Billiards. Pocket billiards. Pocket billiards. You ever play three cushion billiards? You know what that is? One, two, three.

And then you have to get in the hole of the. No, there's no holes. Is that the one with the bumpers? Yeah. Well, the whole table is a flat. Oh, you have to touch it. Yeah, yeah. That's Russian.

Russian. Isn't it Russian? No, but I mean, Russians play it. It's a big, it's real big in South America. It's real big in Mexico. It's real big in South America. It's real big in Mexico. It's real big in parts of Europe. Real big in Asia. Yeah.

It's a different game. There's two different color balls. It's either two white balls and a red ball or two red balls and a white ball. Or sometimes it's a yellow ball, a red ball, and a white ball. And the idea is you make contact with one ball, and then you have to hit three cushions and then make contact with the second ball. Wow. Yeah, it's very complicated. And is it good to watch?

Well, if you know how to play it, it's good to watch. But if you don't know how to play it, it's – the thing about what I like about pool is I like when the balls disappear. Like you make a ball, it goes away. It goes in that hole. Bye, bitch. You sink the ball. It's got a finality

to it it feels good but with that it just clicks it's like just ding ding ding click but the people who love it love it it's a very intellectual game because it's all about geometry it's all angles and spin and you know i'm not good at that either yeah it's it's tricky it's a tricky game i'm not good at it i know it a little bit what's a tricky game. I'm not good at it. I know it a little bit. What about table tennis? I can't play that. Table tennis.

No, you'd fuck me up. High-end coordination. Oh, yeah. I'm sure. Yeah. One thing I learned is you can't do too many things. It will fuck you up. I have a real problem with Quake. You know what Quake is?

What's Quake? A video game. Jamie's been fucking me up lately. Quake? Yeah, we got a computer room set up in the back. It gets intense. Yeah.

What is this quake? What is the object? It's a 3D game where it's a computer game. You have all these weapons. You run around picking up weapons and you're on a map.

So it's just like, every map is different. But you do this in real life too. I don't know why you're playing it on a video game. What do you mean? You're out there hunting. Yeah, but that's in the forest. That's different. But you do this in real life, too. I don't know why you're playing it on the video game. What do you mean? You're out there hunting. Yeah, but that's in the forest.

That's different. I'm looking for meat. That's a different thing. What kind of meat are you hunting for? Elk, mostly. Elk and deer. Nice. Yeah, I bow hunt.

Do you cut it up same spot? Well, you butcher it. You quarter it up while it's there so you can carry it out. But you want to protect the meat, so you really want to get it out of the woods first and cool it off. That's what you want to do. What do you do with all the leftover? Leftover?

Like what leftover? The limbs and stuff. Yeah, like the paws. Like the bones and shit like that? Leave them. Leave the bones. You don't bury it? No, the animals will eat them.

Oh, okay. Yeah, if you leave the bones behind, then nothing goes to waste in the forest. Oh, yeah, yeah. I mean, if you shoot an animal in the forest and leave the bones behind, something's going to eat it. If they don't eat, they'll eat most of it. You know, they'll find it. Bears will find it. The ecosystem will take care of it.

Yeah, everything. Rats, everything. Everything will take care of it. Now, how do your children feel about you doing those bad things to this animal? Listen, as big as you are, you have to eat meat. There's no way you're a vegan no i eat meat yeah definitely eat meat yeah um then my kids have used to it because i've been hunting since they were little so they've eaten bear and deer and elk they eat it

all the time do you cook yeah all the time that was bear taste here's a question for you good do you wash your meat do i wash it do you wash your meat do you like my dick is it no no no it's funny a lot of people take it that way it's like you know when you're cooking it's like you're taking the meat from the butchers you don't know where it's been and right what kind of so you rinse the chicken or whatever yeah you rinse it or put some vinegar over it and rinse it like that so that that's what I mean by wash it. Well, when you're cooking it, you're cooking the outside. And anything that might be bacteria is going to get killed.

The real issue is when you have an animal that has parasites. That's the issue. So if you're like cooking a deer, you don't have to worry about that because deers are herbivores. And herbivores don't really have parasites. But you can get, well well they can get some there's some worms that they do get but most of the time that's some pork isn't it no that's what pork definitely can the pork you get trichinosis that's pretty serious that's pretty serious shit i do enjoy me some pork though you heard me man the devil's beast lennox swine bridget swine you don't eat the pork no he used to be arrested he can't drink oh that's right no you know there's there's a

jerk chicken all day i love jerk chicken jerk chicken it's hard to find a mox tail out it's hard to find a real good jamaican restaurant though is there one in la none that i found i've been here 13 years and I can't find it nowhere. You know where they have good jerk chicken? Swingers. You know that- Oh, the Cavion 3rd or Beverly or something? Wherever it is.

Is it Beverly or 3rd? Yeah. They have good jerk chicken. I'm going to check it out. I need Oxtail. Maybe your standards are higher because you're actually Jamaican. Right. But for me, it's tasty.

I might be off though. Have you been to Jamaica? No. You need to go. Do I? Yeah. Okay. I think you would like it there.

I bet I'd love it. It's very important to go to Jamaica because everybody always tells you different stories and stuff, but it's a paradise over there. Is it? Yeah. What do you like most about it? That you can see different colors. Because I spent a long long time in london

and when i left london to go to jamaica i was like wow all these different vibrant colors even in the water and the colors in the trees you know when you're driving around london it's gray right gray yeah you know different cities they're gray so i like i like contacts with contact with plants vibrant yeah energy yeah and all that so you know that's the interesting thing you know a lot of So I like contact with plants. Vibrant. Yeah, energy. Yeah. And all that. You know, that's the interesting thing. A lot of people do forget that you were from England, right?

And that there was a stigma with English boxers for a long time. And you broke that. Yeah. You were the man. What was the stigma? Because I heard it was all British boxers are horizontal. Yes. Well, they were more vertical.

They would stand straight up and they would have like that European style. But it was like Henry Cooper. Remember when Henry Cooper dropped Muhammad Ali and then they cheated and cut his gloves? Yeah. But I mean, he was sort of one of the last great English boxers before you came along. And then for a long time,

there was guys that were pretty good, like Frank Bruno, pretty good. But then they would get in there with guys like Tyson, and they would always wind up losing. So everybody had these, like, this is our guy. This is the one. And Frank Bruno, damn, did he look the part. Yeah.

Was there ever a man more jacked as a heavyweight boxer than Frank Bruno? He didn't have an ounce of fat on him. Jesus Christ. He was a Goliath. He was carved out of granite. Oh, yeah. I mean, nobody's, there's never been a better built boxer ever. Well, you'd look at Frank Bruno and you'd go, how does he not kill everybody?

He's so big. Let me tell you, you should see Frank Bruno now. He's still chiseled. Really? Yeah. Really? Phenomenal genetics. Must be phenomenal genetics.

Even at the age of like 65. Wow. Remember back in the day we used to think evander same thing oh yeah oh yeah well evander you know people forget he started out as cruiserweight he was a much smaller guy light heavyweight actually was he in the ufc i mean in boxing yeah didn't he win the oh no it was no he won the light heavyweight title from um dwight muhammad khan no that was no that was cruising yeah it was aowie. No, that was Cruiserweight. No, that was Cruiserweight. Yeah, Cruiserweight. Yeah. It was a hell of a fight. That was a hell of a fight.

That was like his big fight to prove himself as a professional. Because Cowie was tricky. 5'7", 200 pounds. It was a weird fighter, man. Well, that was the American Olympic trials, right? Yeah. Well, Cowie was a professional fight. That was for the Cruiserweight title.

It might have been Eddie Davis. No, let me tell you, he had a lot of... Look at Frank Bruno, still looking good. You got to see him with his shirt off. He's still cut. But you could tell. Yeah. Skinny-ass legs, though.

One leg kick. He's got a problem. How long? Damn, though, he does look very good. At one time, he had big legs. Yes. Maybe when he was fighting me. Well, go see Frank Bruno back when he was in his prime as a boxer.

He was gigantic man He was a sculpted as a boxer ever gets he really look at him. He really won. That's not even a good picture No, it's not one of the best Yeah, he was so jacked Yeah, how he was a crazy Camden buzzsaw He was such a crazy fighter because he would pull his shorts up to here. And he was 5'7". And he would tuck down.

And he was super wide. And he would fight with that Philly shell and come in real low. He was a very difficult guy to deal with. Very difficult guy to deal with. Don't see those styles anymore. No. No. Now, when you watch boxing today, who really stands out to you?

You know, all the champions right now, they didn't get to be champions for no reason. Yeah. And, you know, each one of them have different qualities. You know, even, well, let's look at the heavyweights. All the heavyweights, the top three heavyweights right now, they're all over six feet five. Yeah. And they all have a different style which is good because you know reminds me of when me and holyfield and tyson were around we all had different styles which makes

great fights now it's to guess which style is going to beat which style you never know because they're all similar you know they all all three of them have knockout potential and uh you know they're boxing to win so what we want to see we want to see who would win out of them. Deontay Wilder, to me, is the most perplexing because he hits so hard. It's almost like he's got magic in his hands. He makes guys fly across the ring, and he's only 209 pounds. And he does it off balance. Yeah.

And he does it with both legs in the air. Well, you know, he made the Olympic team and won a bronze medal a year and a half into boxing. Oh, yeah. My problem with the new division is that they don't have the amateur pedigree. What about Ortiz? Ortiz is great,

but Ortiz is much older than he says he is. Is he? What does he say he is? 40-something? Like 40 or 41? How old is he? I'm hearing stories that Ort he is 40 something like 40 or 41 how old is he i'm hearing stories that ortiz like 49 how do you know um somebody told me about from the amateurs i remember seeing him in the amateurs in the 80s and i'm like what they always say that about cubans

though yeah because they say that same shit about yoel romero he says he's 39 yeah he just fought on the weekend or two weeks ago right yeah a couple weeks ago in one stoppage right no i think it was a decision was it if it wasn't i thought it was a late round stoppage unless he just fought again he just fought like last weekend or two weeks didn't he fight like two months ago too no no he just fought no that was a stoppage and this fight just happened oh so he's very he's being very active yeah yeah he's trying to come back what do you think about that like how active you think a boxer should be um what really comes down to, this is how it goes. If you're starting boxing, obviously you want to have as many fights as possible to get that experience level.

So as much as possible, it's usually four fights a year. And then as you get better, it drops to three fights. And then when you're the champion better it drops to three fights and then when you're the champion it drops to two fights so um that's that's the progression of fighting you can't like for instance how many fights did deontay have this year maybe two right right you know it's before when he was starting out he would have like three to four yeah he's very angry that this rematch is not happening and i i side with him was it tyson who pulled out tyson got a deal with espn yeah yeah well and it's a it's a big deal because uh you know talking about chess match i think that's he's pulled off the greatest chess

match move there is first he comes over from england He takes the challenge with Deontay. Joshua didn't. He boxed. He had a great fight. Now he's put himself right up with all three of them who are on the same line to me. And then now for the rematch, people want to see Deontay

and they want to see Tyson Fury again because the first fight was exciting. Joshua, who's he fighting? You know, he's going to fight Big Baby. Nobody knows him. Right. Everybody knows Deontay. Just boxing fans know.

That's about it. Everybody knows Tyson. Everybody. And especially after that fight because it was such a spectacular fight. That knockdown was insane. Oh, my God. The first knockdown was great. The second knockdown was preposterous.

So the fact that he rose like Lazarus. Yeah. I mean, it was insane. Oh, my God. The first knockdown was great. The second knockdown was preposterous. The fact that he rose like Lazarus, I mean, it was crazy. And then won the rest of the round. He gets tagged a few times and starts boxing and then even tagged Deontay. I still had him winning that fight. It was close. Ooh, Tyson. I think boxing won that night. Both guys guys looked great and uh boxed well and made

an exciting fight that the rematch obviously everybody wants to see the rematch again so when the rematch happened that that put um anthony joshua on the shelf yeah in my eyes now it's put him on the shelf a bit longer yeah with this espn deal and you know tyson fury's boxing in front of um the public yeah uh anthony joshua and dionte they're pay-per-view right you know who are they gonna fight pay-per-view nobody wants to see no silly fight they want to see good fights yeah you know it's it's a great move by tyson fury it's a great move but the first fight, the fight ended in a draw, right? Yeah. Yeah, so in the draw,

Deontay keeps the title, but at least Tyson walks away like saying, look, I won the decision. I feel like I should have won the decision. There's a dispute. There's a debate about it, but everybody wants to see that fight.

Yeah, I mean, a draw is not unreasonable. But Tyson could lose to somebody. Yeah, but all of them can lose to somebody. They Tyson could lose to somebody. And if he loses to somebody, they can all lose to somebody. They can all lose. Yeah. You know, while they're mucking around saying, oh, I'll fight this or I won't fight until next year, somebody might lose. This is what happens.

And now none of them can fight each other because if Joshua fights Fury and loses to Fury, Joshua's star goes down. If Joshua fights Deontay and beats Deontay, the Tyson-Deontay fight's not that exciting. Right, but if Joshua wants real respect, he's got to fight either Fury or Deontay. Those are the big fights. Those are the big fights. Obviously, he gets respect. He's the heavyweight champion of the world. But split.

That's a weird thing, too. I'd like to see Joshua Ortiz. That'd be an interesting fight. It would be an interesting fight. Because Ortiz can box and hit. Joshua Ortiz, that'd be an interesting fight. It would be an interesting fight. Because Ortiz can box and hit.

Yeah. Well, that was what showed how goddamn powerful Deontay is, that Ortiz was winning that fight. Yeah. And then I think it was the 10th round he caught him. I think it was the 7th or 10th. I don't remember. But I remember when he caught him, I was like, God, that guy, even late in the fight, that guy carries that power.

Ortiz is past his prime. Let's slow down there, Lewis. Yes. Past his prime. He's slow down there, Lewis. Yes. Past his prime. He's a good fighter, but give him like 10 years. Yeah. And he would have beat these guys. He would have given them a good fight.

But right now, he's obviously older, and he's an old fighter. Yeah, well, they caught him doing some steroids, which is a lot of times guys get older, they try to juice up the old body. Yeah, so when you reach that point where you need steroids, mentally it affects you. You go into the ring and it's like you're missing something, something that was there in the past and it made you feel good. Now I don't feel as good. Right. When you were fighting, did anybody that you were fighting, did you suspect that they were on something?

Yeah. A couple times. Yeah. But the good thing is that I know is I realize steroids can never get this strong. Your chin. Chin. Yeah. So you can take as much steroids as you want, but I'm going to hit you on the chin.

Right. You can't put muscles on your face. Yeah. Right. You can't put muscles on your face. Yeah. Yeah. And then, you know, these body punches, you can't protect around here. So they'll affect you as well. So that's where, you know, when you're hitting guys around here, body punches and you hit them on the chin. Doesn't matter.

Doesn't matter. But don't you think that it does, it makes them stronger physically, gives them more vitality, might make them able to absorb more punishment? For a minute. For a minute. Just for a little bit. Yeah, for a little bit. Who'd you suspect was on something when you fought him? I don't want to say.

You don't want to say. Let me say. Yeah, go ahead. I think Evander. I think. Evander was the first guy, as far as I'm concerned, was the first guy on steroids back in the day. Very likely. You look at the fucking size of that guy in the late 90s, especially when he fought Lennox.

Have you ever asked him if he's been on steroids? No, I've never actually hung out with Evander. Oh, okay. I might have met your victory party 20 years ago. He did hang around with the guys that were into it. Yeah, then Mark, whatever his name was, he was the first guy to have like a strength and conditioning coach and uh well and all that kind of stuff a dietitian spinks did when he fought um when he fought larry holmes he same guy mackie shillstone yeah mackie shillstone got him in shape for larry when he was coming up from light heavyweight yeah that's the same guy that

evander used and they were doing it was really interesting because at the time the the conventional wisdom was that boxers should not lift weights. And Evander was lifting all kinds of weights. And he put on all this muscle. But really, he was only about 200, 205 pounds when he first fought. But then fucking traps. Oh, yeah. Jesus Christ.

He was built. I mean, he was built. It was a perfect body. Yeah, look at that. That's not steroids? Look at his neck. That's not steroids? Look at the neck. That's steroids, buddy, right there. No, not necessarily.

You definitely can get that big without it. I mean, there are guys. The word's alleged. Yeah, alleged is a good word. But it's also possible to get that big with steroids. But it's not just steroids, too. It's EPO. Look at that one up there.

Yeah, but this is in the 80s and 90s. The good stuff wasn't available back then was it? Oh yeah What are you kidding me man? Those Russians had everything back then man I mean the eastern block women They made world records That was when he was a cruiserweight

Look how thin he was Yeah but you can't call them women if they had mustaches Or penises Thick beards and fat dicks They set records that still to this day haven't been broken wow and because they really were not women i mean they were women with massive amounts of male hormones in their body flojo yeah she she's i think still sets the record right now for what whatever it was and she was also someone That was accused of doing things

Yeah, I mean look Track and field According to Victor Conte Who was the Balco guy I had him on my podcast He was the guy that Got the clear to Barry Bonds And all those guys

Supposedly undetectable steroids He said track and field Is just a dirty sport Just like Tour de France Just like cycling He's like it's a dirty sport Just like Tour de France Just like cycling He's like it's a dirty sport You got Carl Lewis trying to call out Usain Bolt now right? What are you showing us James?

This is the top 100 meter times All the names crossed out Oh wow Steroids Wow It's only one but Usain Bolt God damn Well that's like when Lance Armstrong won the Tour de France

And they took his title away. If you had to give that title to someone who didn't test positive for anything, you had to go back to 18th place. Wow. That was a dirty sport. You know, Bill Burr said it best. He's like, our psycho is better than your psycho. You were all dirty.

It was a dirty sport. He was just better at doing that sport while being dirty yeah if everybody's dirty then it's fair well he won he won while everybody was cheating and i mean did he have so is it still cheating if everybody's doing it it is and it isn't i mean it is definitely cheating but everybody's cheating it's weird it's not good see good. They went after the wrong thing. People are looking for drugs to help them get stronger. It's natural food that makes you stronger.

It's what you put into your system. I know Jamaican food is great. Yams, plantains, everything. Bully beef. You know what's better than that? Steroids. Steroids are way better. Oh yeah, yeah. Bully beef. You know what's better than that? What's that? Steroids. Steroids are way better. Oh, yeah, yeah.

They work instantly, but, you know. They're so much better if you just stay on them. Like, guys like Lance Armstrong, I mean, they proved it. You almost can't do Tour de France the way they were doing it without some sort of chemical help. I've heard it argued by physiologists. They say it's actually better for your body to be on steroids while you're doing something like the Tour de France because you give your body a chance to recover because they're doing so much work over the course of this race that without having some sort of chemical enhancement of your ability to recover, you're just not going to be able to do it healthily. Your body can't do that on its own. You get that rhabdomyosis that those CrossFit people get. That's when your body starts breaking down muscle tissue and it becomes toxic.

Oh, yeah, yeah. Pollutes your liver. How do you do that? They work out so hard. People have died of it. Fighters have died from rhabdomyosis. Wow. It's from overtraining.

You overtrain, which is a big issue with fighters Some fighters can train too much And a good trainer knows how to pull you back And so that you're peaking When you get into the ring But sometimes people are so mentally strong They push themselves through even when they're exhausted Because they think that's the way to victory

Hard work What's up Jamie? Yeah your piss comes out looking like coke comes out looking like coca-cola that's what rhabdomyelosis piss looks like yeah wow yeah that's that's a sign your body's breaking down your muscle is uh all your your proteins in your body are breaking down and your body is getting poisoned by it people die a lot of crossfit people get it what are your kidneys what do you do in that situation do you uh take a rest a leave of absence or do you go see the doctor and they can give you some pills to put more things that you need in your system i think you have to go to the doctor

almost immediately i think they have to do uh you pretty much your body goes septic on you yeah it's very dangerous and a lot of these crossfit people you know because it's a competition and you're competing against all these other people and you're doing these massive repetitions and some of them because they're not really conditioned for it yet so their body's just the muscles not really acclimated to this kind of workload and this shit starts breaking down wow what do you do these days like exercise because you still look great yeah i ran 10 miles this morning Whoa Yeah man

What Thank you Where'd you go I mean where I went On the road But where'd you run On the beach Oh okay

Yeah woke up And took a shower Nice So you're still You did that Yeah Okay I feel like I don't know you anymore

I ran You guys don't even catch the joke I ran 10 miles And I woke up And took a shower Oh Bigger than a joke You're a comedian You're supposed to know that But listen Listen Listen Alright That's a bad joke You guys don't even catch the joke. I ran 10 miles and I woke up and took a shower. Oh. Bigger than a joke.

You're a comedian. You're supposed to know that. But listen, listen, listen, all right? That's a bad joke. First of all, sit down. Tell him. Tell him. First of all, sit down. You know, he used to do this shit to me back in the day.

I'd be at his house and I was like, I'm in his basement. I go, it's starting to rain. I go, Len, I got to go outside and close my sunroof. And he's like, no, hold on a second. I'm going to tell you a story. I go, Len, let me just go close my fucking sunroof. He's like, hold on. Let me just tell you a story.

And I'm like, dude, it's raining and my sunroof is open. Are you going to pay for my fucking car to get fixed? He's like, hold on. Yo, there's this guy, right? And I'm like, come on. And he goes into this fucking long story. And he goes, he's trying to get out this window. And I'm pulling his leg.

And I'm pulling his leg. And I go, and he goes, just the way I'm pulling your leg right now. And I'm like, fucker. Do you ever do yoga? Yes. You look like a guy who'd get into yoga. I actually hurt myself doing yoga.

Really? Yeah, I'm so- It's much harder than it looks, dude. I'm flexible. Like, if I stand up, I can put both my hands on the ground like that. Wow. With my legs straight.

But somebody told me, oh, you know what you gotta move your bum cheeks a little back and that helps you get down a little more and my okay cheeks a little back pop after a couple days it's like you know I'm walking around saying I hurt myself and it goes yoga yeah yeah I hurt myself too I'm like I didn't know you can hurt yourself in yoga you can hurt yourself in yoga yeah my doctor told me a lot of people come to him with injuries back injuries from yoga what is that mentally saying that you can do it when your body's saying you can't

or just doing something wrong just doing something wrong especially if you do it too hard too quick like yoga is like anything else i mean it's exercise you definitely can hurt yourself do you do the hot yoga or cold yoga I haven't tried the hot one I want to But I do I do cold yoga I like hot Because I think

Your body gets Yeah It's also Torturous I like that aspect of it And also There's a Harvard study That's going on right now

Where they're trying to find out If there's the same benefits That you get from the sauna You get from doing hot yoga When your body gets Really overheated like that It produces Heat shock proteins And it alleviates um a lot of inflammation in the body wow that's why the the sauna is so good for you because uh the dry sauna yeah dry sauna your body

get you get in there your body's like what the fuck is this and so it produces these cytokines these heat shock proteins and it's fantastic for people just for my hands don't hurt when i'm in the sauna you should get one in your house man i got one i got a sauna oh it's nice right yeah you should go in every day man dude you should be in there every day especially because you're doing jujitsu now you know after training it's fantastic for you i just go sit in the tub with epsom salts that's good too that's good too i don't think that works epsom salt makes it it makes you feel good going to bed. I'm nice and relaxed. I go to sleep. Aromatherapy type of thing.

It smells good. But it's not that. There's magnesium in it. Epsom salt, your body absorbs magnesium through your skin. It's one of the best ways for your body to get magnesium. It's actually through Epsom salts. I'm going to take more of that. I have a float tank.

You ever do a float tank? Is that the cold water one? No, no, no. It's a tank of water that's heated to 94 degrees, which is like the surface of your skin. And there's 1,000 pounds of Epsom salts in there. And you lay in it and you float. You're like your body, half your body's above the water. And then you close the door.

Total silence, total darkness. It feels like you're flying through space. It's beautiful. You would love it, man. Yeah, yeah. Especially being the cerebral You've been telling me About this one for years

Dude I got one right here I know Anytime you want But isn't it kind of gross To sit in somebody else's No First of all It's only me

I'm the only one That sits in it And I know how gross you are I'm clean right now This massive filtration system It's like There's got a commercial Filtration system

I can just drop in And my jaw Is going to go float Anytime man Just text me And I'll have Jeff come by And open it up for you Or do it while we this got a commercial filtration i can just drop in and my job is gonna go anytime man just just text me and i'll have uh jeff come by and open it up for you or do it while we're doing a show you have to be naked when you do it yeah yeah you gotta be naked hey don't don't have to worry don't be scared everything floats so anything that's in there will be floating yeah i'll show you the whole system and there's an ozone system that purifies the water it goes

through this commercial filtration system it's heavy duty stuff man it's pretty intense because they've started these floatation tank centers now yeah they're everywhere yeah they're so you were talking about this for the past 10 years more yeah i had one in 2002 i remember you when i went to your house back in the day when you're doing the when you were doing this podcast out of the house yeah i had one in the basement yeah yeah what about um the ice one oh that's great yeah yeah cryotherapy and there's a place down the street from here about a couple miles away 250 degrees below zero i thought you would have had one of those too no that's like you have to get like nitrogen tanks and shit and i worry about that stuff exploding you know some shit

going wrong and you're getting maimed. So do you enjoy doing commentary too? Yeah. I love giving my opinion. People always say I've got unusual opinions. They've never heard that before or never heard it put that way. So I can give you from a fighter's point of view. I've been in boxing for so long, there's different experiences that I've gone through.

So, I'm happy to share them. But you don't ever work out boxing wise anymore. Yeah. But you don't hit a bag. My son's 15 and I know he wants to box. So, anytime we get a chance,

you know, I'm always training him. How big is he now? Six feet. Jesus. He's taller than you. Tyson's son. Tyson's son is 16.

Oh, Miguel, yeah. Tyson's son was saying that he wants to box too. Tyson's like, listen, man. No, Miguel's not built like that. But he's also saying, listen, you grew up soft. And he's saying, you don't want to meet someone like me. The way he was. Yeah, I know Mike's kids. He's saying, you don't want to meet someone like me you know like the way he was yeah i know i know you don't want to meet some animal like me you know like when he was

fighting like he like he thinks of what he would have done to his own sons like oh don't do that like he was talking about on the podcast and his son miguel's a really talented kid like musician wise could play like seven different instruments he speaks Spanish wow the kid's really and he's a really smart nice kid well Tyson's a smart guy he's not

like he has I think people mistake Tyson for being a dummy he's very smart he's very very intelligent well read boxing is

in at least some levels a very very intellectual pursuit yeah you have to have a strong mind to be able to dodge those punches get in pursuit yeah there's you have to have a strong mind to be able to dodge those punches get in and get yours in that you have to you have to be able to sort out

that problem there's a problem in front of you the problem is another man who's the same weight as you the same size as you he's got gloves on just like you do and he's trying to do what you're trying to do to him and you have to do that within seconds yeah boom yeah punches thrown at you what do you do what's what's the rebuttal yeah people don't understand they think just because someone doesn't have the best vocabulary or because they don't have a a comprehensive education that they're not intelligent and that's a big mistake no Tyson's intelligent uh I remember going to the Catskills when I was uh I won the world junior championships in Santo Domingo, Dominican Republic. And I remember the American team was saying, oh, well, you never fought the

best. I'm like, didn't fight the best. I thought Americans said the best team. Yeah, but one guy, he doesn't like taking planes and his manager don't like taking planes either. So I'm like, who's that? And they told me it was Mike Tyson, custom model. So me and my trainer, we left Canada and we drove all the way up there. And while we were up there, Razorotic was up there. And they said, oh, Razorotic came, didn't spar with us. I said, okay, I'll spar with you. I'm here for four days. So first time Tyson actually met me, you know, he was a nice guy, really nice guy.

He took me in his room, showed me some old flicks that I've never seen before of old-time fighters. He would tell me about each fighter like he studied them. And then, you know, this is where he got his old style, his style of fighting from. And first day in the gym, Bell went. He came across, and he was trying to kill me. Like, you know, I did my Muhammad Ali thing, obviously stayed away from his power, but the first day was really hectic,

and then the second day was a little hectic, and it got better as it went along. And the last day is, I got actually the better of him the last day, and I remember Customato saying, Mike, you're going to meet meet him someday don't you do that and that always echoed in my mind that will we ever fight will we ever fight because custom model said that we're gonna fight wow and it did happen and there's footage of it yeah wow

lennox has the footage of it footage of the training sessions sparring how old was tyson at the time tyson was like a he was about 52 no no How old was Tyson at the time? Tyson was like a, he was about 52. No, no. How old was he at the time? Oh, at the time? 15. He was younger than me. I was 17.

He was about 17. Wow. Yeah. I was 18. No, he was younger than that. That must have been crazy. Yeah, because it was 84. It was before the Empire State Games and everything.

You went up there before you went to the 84 Olympics. Yeah, yeah. Well, it must have been crazy, though, knowing that you guys were going to be a part of boxing history. Knowing that all the way back then and being a teenager and standing in front and hearing Customato scream that out. That must have been intense. It was intense because Custom Mata wasn't that loud. When all of a sudden he became loud, it was like everybody listened. And then there's certain ways that you get across to people.

And some people, you have to shout at them. Did you ever wish that you fought him in his prime? In essence, I did fight him in his prime. And when you say prime, I was in my prime too. But you fight him in his prime and you know when you say prime i was in my prime too you know but you were definitely in your prime you were you were but i feel like his enthusiasm had waned before then you know um i'll you know this is my perception yeah how i look at that whole thing is mike tyson was an early bloomer i was was a late bloomer. So when both of us meet, there's never a perfect time.

Perfect time for us is when we meet in the middle. Right, right, right. And if he won, maybe people would look at it differently. It's because you beat him and beat him so soundly that people look at it

like maybe his time had already been gone. Yeah, Lennox turned pro after Mike had already had a defeat. Wow, no kidding. Lennox turned pro after Mike had already had a defeat. Wow. No kidding. Lennox turned pro in 89. Wow. I never even thought of that.

And Mike lost in January of 89. Look at that. Yeah, this is us up in Catskills. Look at you. Look at Kevin Rooney. Wow, that is crazy, man. God, that's crazy. He was built back then, too.

He had a big neck. Yeah, he was always doing those neck bridges. But he also just had freak genetics. I mean, just a phenomenal genetic specimen. You know, I had Teddy Atlas in here. And Teddy Atlas used to take Mike to the smokers when he was 13. And Teddy was joking around about it. He said, everybody always lied about how old people were.

They would tell you the kid was 16 and really he was 20. They always did that. And he said, he goes, uh how old is this kid he goes 13 he goes what does he weigh he goes 190 pounds what the fuck teddy come on he's like i'm telling you he's he's fucking 13 what do you want so you know nobody would believe it because he was such a specimen i watched that one yeah teddy was great man Do you think he should have stayed with Teddy? Should have stayed with Kevin and Teddy. Well, he definitely, you know, he was so wild. Like, how could you tell him what to do back then?

That was part of the problem. I mean, he was never, no one ever prepared him. And this is one of the things that we discussed on the podcast was that he was a 12- old 13 year old boy and he was getting hypnotized he had came from a terrible background it was there was no love he was abandoned and all of a sudden he's getting love and attention for something and this one thing was this man who was telling him you're going to be a great fighter you're going to be a world champion and he would hypnotize me saying you don't exist the task exists you know you're going to work the body and destroy this man and he would tell he would put these thoughts in his head and mike couldn't wait

to just get out there and fuck people up because that's where he got the love that's where he got the attention from but he never turned never told him how to shut it off he never i mean he didn't have time to work with him because he was he was on his way out he was dying when he met mike and so he only taught him how to destroy. He never taught him how to cope. He never taught him how to understand that there's going to be a lot of shit coming your way. And you got to know what that is. And don't get caught up in that hype train. Don't just don't get wrapped up in Hollywood.

And, you know, he wound up marrying Robin Givens. And, you know, I don't think Cuss foresaw all that other bullshit. No. How could he have? No, if Cuss was around, Mike would be totally different. He would have been a different man. If Cuss lasted another 15 years. Even if Jimmy Jacobs

had lasted another five years. Maybe, yeah. It would have helped, but I mean, it's like once you're once removed from Cuss, it's like Kevin Rooney was once removed from Cuss, right?

And then Teddy Atlas was way more of a hard liner. You know, Teddy Atlas, you couldn't put any bullshit with. You know, and like those other guys you just gotta go, and then you got to Aaron Snowell and all those guys

that were with him. Yeah, those guys were bummed. Richie Giacchetti. They just didn't, they didn't, they could have never brought Mike to the dance. Right?

They got there when he was already at the dance and they're just trying to like maintain things and he's not listening to anybody. Mike Tyson. They also weren't boxing people as far as I was concerned.

When he was up with Cuss, he was, he was in listening to anybody. He's Mike Tyson. They also weren't boxing people as far as I was concerned. When he was up with Cuss, he was in a good situation. There was a lady in the house cooking meals. They had Cuss there being a father figure, talk to him every day. And that's what young kids need. They need that to be spoken with by older people. And a lot of young people nowadays are not even respecting the older people, but they can gain a lot of information from an older person.

You know, how do you deal with this situation? Yeah. Well, you know, you hear from an older person, it kind of makes your mind think and say, you know, you're right. It works for them. So anytime I get a chance to talk to kids about, you know, their life and where they're going,

I always take that opportunity. Well, you're such a great example of a guy who has done incredible things but you've come out on the other end with with wisdom and lessons and honesty and you can talk about things and people will listen to you in a way that you know a lot of kids they don't want to listen to someone who ain't done shit right you need to talk to some guy who's just some boring dude who wants to give you advice. Like, hey, fuckface, how about get your own shit together? Tell me what to do, bitch. But when you're Lennox Lewis and you talk to a kid,

they go, oh, okay. Mr. Lewis. You know, chess master, world heavyweight champion. What's that school you got in Jamaica now? You got a boxing school there now, right? Yeah, Lennox Lewis League of Champions. Ooh.

Yeah, it's for young kids that, you know, learning how to box. We teach them how to box. We teach them life skills as well. Because what we realized that, you know, a lot of the kids just want to talk. You know, there's nobody around them to talk. Nobody listens to them. And when they hear other kids' stories, they feel a lot better. It's like, yo, you know, I was going through that and I liked how he dealt with it.

You know, it's like this is know i was going through that and i liked how he dealt with it you know it's like it yes this is what we're what's missing nowadays yes the relationship with kids you know uh talking to them you know just ask them how they are yeah ask them what they're doing what do they want to be right right right yeah and and then have some place where they can go yeah and then have something that gives them a sense of value you know and that's what a lot of sports does do to children it gives them you know you you, you know? And that's what a lot of sports does to children. It gives them, you know, you realize if you work hard and you try something and you study it and you get better at it, you feel good.

Like you accomplished it. You got through whatever the sport is. A lot of the kids that come boxing, I've never tried it before, but once they try it, it's like, wow, they learn new things about themselves. Even the training of boxing yeah you know the fact of let's run a mile they never ran in their life now they've run half a mile didn't make the mile but the next day next day they want to try the mile and you just it shows

them that if you keep working at something you'll accomplish it you know don't give up don't all of a sudden you tried it and it's like oh no it no, it's not for me. Keep trying it. You don't know it's not for you until you keep trying it and then realize it's not for you or for you. What are you going to do if your son wants to fight? Let him. Yeah, I think your perspective would be very different than Mike's. Yeah, for me, you know, I'm not forcing my son to box. But if he wants to try it, let him try it.

His father used to box, so why not try something his father did? Maybe he has the gene for it. Right now, my son plays basketball. He wants to be an actor. He loves boxing. He can do anything he wants. All my kids are talented, and I see the drive in them that I have and their mother has, so I know that they're going

to be successful you know they've they're they're basically i'm trying to help them to become successful in the future and give them the tools to become successful in the future as well good for you man a lucky young man yeah i mean you know and young women too yeah well what a great situation to be your son you know i mean and your daughters as well but for sure but i mean to be your son if you really do have a desire to box would you start training him i'm training them already oh shit yeah it's like you know um you know i was talking to george foreman the other day and his daughter one of his daughters were fighting isn't her name george yes everyone's name georgina or something right some crazy shit he's got like eight georges in his house yeah i said and i'm watching her fight but they know by

the tone apparently which one it is so strange inflection on the i'm watching her fight and i'm like george you need to tell her some stuff. I know there's some good things you can tell her or even get her a proper coach or help her. I don't want her to fight. That's all you have to say. But if you don't want her to fight and she's fighting, you're not going to help her.

She's going to get hurt, so you might as well. I think she's stopped already anyway. My approach to raising kids is I don't i don't have any input onto what they do i don't i don't i would never tell my kid i don't want you to do that because it's not my life it's their life i give them guidance if i can i'll talk to them about what they're doing if i can but they also have to go out and do it themselves you know i really firmly believe in that like you got to go do it yourself but if you want to do it that's your thing i try to convince my daughter to want to do jiu-jitsu really i said sweetheart i'll get you a pink gi if you want my kids were doing

martial arts for a while my middle daughter was doing jiu-jitsu and my youngest daughter was doing mma but she got bored with it after a while which is cool too you know 10 and 8 you know who knows maybe they'll come back to it but yeah you know i kind of whisper to my son right now you need to do some wrestling glenn get him in jujitsu i'm telling you do you think you fight mma um you know i don't know what the future holds he may fight mma you know he's gonna listen if he's gonna fight he should box why just because of the money factor yeah do you know what i mean honestly i mean yeah but if you're a heavyweight you know if you're a heavyweight he's definitely gonna make a lot of money yeah well he sure certainly will be like if you met lennox's brother dennis they're nothing like

lennox's bones i mean you know you know god damn i got a decent fist but a heavyweight it's like a child holding a fist yeah i have pretty big fists, I have a pretty big fist, but yours are gigantic, man. You know? You're a huge human being. You know? Your kid's going to be a heavyweight. Oh, he's going to be a heavyweight. He's already a heavyweight.

Listen, he's six foot, and he wears size 15 shoes. He doesn't need to fight. He just keeps a pair of his shoes by the front door. He's 15, so I think he's gonna He's gonna outgrow me That's like a puppy Yeah Yeah Oh he's gonna be enormous

Like a great date Why do kids outgrow their parents? I don't know I think it's food I think they get better food than us Yeah I think you know You think about like

How much protein children have now If you ever go back and look At like how big men were During like the Civil War period They were tiny They were like 100 pounds Yeah They were tiny little people.

Cause nobody had good food. Like everybody was like barely surviving. Everyone was scraping by. It was bread and water times. Yeah. Like the people that made it across the West. You ever see photos of those folks? Those skinny rickety looking people just starving to death.

Tougher than we could ever be. Oh my God. They were a little wolves. Oh yeah. They're up in the early in the morning working. They had to survive. Yeah. It's just,

but now today kids are are getting massive amounts of protein and they get vitamins and vegetables and drinking all this milk. The food's got shit in it. Oh, yeah. There's that too. There's that too. But I just think it's just an abundance of nutrition. I mean, when people were smaller, a lot of it was because of malnutrition. Like, look at Asian folks. Like, a lot of Japanese folks used of malnutrition. Like, look at Asian folks.

Like, a lot of Japanese folks used to be much smaller. Now they're pretty fucking big. You're getting some really big Japanese fighters. Like, they're larger people. Those guys are huge. Because they're eating better. You know what I wanted to ask you? Please.

Conspiracy theories. I know you have some. Yeah, I got some. I thought I was listening to you about, was it something about Martians the other day? That was probably Alex Jones. Probably Alex Jones. Was it Alex Jones? Alex and Eddie.

Oh my God, I saw an amazing NASA shirt I was going to buy for Eddie the other day. Yeah, Alex wore a NASA shirt just to fuck with Eddie. I watched it. Yeah. Yeah, Eddie believes shit that even Alex thinks is ridiculous. Like, what conspiracy theories do you want to know about? No, I'm like, let me hear some. Well, I believe less and less

than i ever used to population control do you believe that no i don't believe that i don't believe there's any concerted effort um like where there's a bunch of really rich people that have decided to euthanize a bunch of people to keep the population low i think that is that's paranoid i think that there's probably some people that go, you know what? We would be a lot healthier if there was less people. But there's no obvious effort. The population keeps fucking growing.

Imagine if you were the all-powerful, all-knowing people that are running the world, and you're doing such a shitty job of population control. Yeah, I don't know how you're going to control India and China. You're not. You're not. You're not getting in these fucking dirty villages and trying to stop people. You're not doing it anywhere.

Even in this country, people are fucking like wild animals and just shooting out kids. I got a kid coming next month. Jesus. Hey, I got three kids. Yeah, like, look, it's just the way it is, man. People like to fuck. They like to make people. Well, in China, you only allowed one kid.

No, I think they lifted that. They lifted that because a lot of people were drowning their daughters. It was horrible shit. Wow. They were killing. This is the rumor. It was that people wanted a son. If they had a daughter, they would.

Yeah, daughter was like the lose for you. Yeah. And to me, a daughter's a win because they're so much easier to deal with. Really? I find with my daughter, we're like this. Yeah. You know what, man what man i mean just be happy but i got a i got a guy coming a boy coming next yeah you gotta have the yin and the yang

a little joseph lennox lewis peters coming next month joseph lennox rogan peters he's gonna be amazing i'm so happy that you gave him my name yeah that's beautiful i was gonna give him your middle name but i didn't want to do that to him. What's your middle name? Well, yes, my middle name is Claudius. Claudius? That sounds like a Roman emperor. I, Claudius. I, Claudius. There you go.

Beautiful. Hey, man, I know you're supposed to get out of here at 2 o'clock. Do you have a hard out? No. No? You can stay? Yeah, absolutely. Good.

It's beautiful. Let's keep talking. Beautiful. Yeah, so back to your question. I think there's definitely some people that are influencing the way the world works for sure. But I don't think there's anybody that's really trying to control population. What about this one? Do you think the Russians put Donald Trump in the president's chair?

I think the Russians absolutely wanted Donald Trump to win. Absolutely. I think the Russians absolutely wanted Donald Trump to win. Absolutely. And I think they definitely undermined our democracy through various methods of manipulating people through social media. In fact, I have a woman coming on very soon. When is Renee DiResto on? This week?

Next week. She's on next week. And she actually studied it and wrote this very comprehensive report about it. It was on Sam Harris' podcast and detailed millions of interactions with Russian bots and Russian fake accounts and these troll farms that would create memes. And they did a bunch of different things. They didn't just try to pump Trump up, but they also tried to get people against each other and cause all sorts of civil arguments

and all sorts of unrest online. They organize these meetings. They organize one pro-Texas meeting across the street from a pro-Muslim meeting. They did it on purpose. Oh, I remember that. They did it all through Facebook to get these people to fight with each other. Wow. They're doing these things to try to get people to take sides and to get people to be angry at the other side.

They did a lot of shit like that, real sneaky, sneaky stuff that we probably do in foreign countries all the time. And we're mad that they're doing it to us because now they're doing it through social media. Well, if you think about when we were growing up in the 80s, 70s, and 80s, all the imagery we saw of the USSR was very dark and gray yeah and it was very uh oh yeah barren and it was destitute well some of it was true though yeah but that's all we saw and then all of a sudden that lifts and these hot fucking russian chicks show up i'm like where

were these bitches this whole time where was she in the propaganda that's so true you never saw the hot russian ladies they're some of the hottest women on the planet. Yeah, they used to show us these big manly women. What do you want? And now you're like, well, hello. Where did that one come from?

They were hiding. Yeah. Yeah, I have two friends that are married to Russian ladies. They're very happy. Now the question, because you're American and everything,

I'm not American, so is this wall ever going to get built or what's the situation i don't i think it was more of a campaign rhetoric thing you know build that wall build that wall so he's kind of staying with it i mean i think he wants supporters yeah i think he's got to kind of do something right once you say that you're going to build a wall you got to kind of do something but they ain't shit been built yeah we're two years into the president they haven't built shit well there's a year left in the year and a half left in the president there is some wall there's some wall that's up but

there's also some big ass gaps and the idea that they're going to stop drugs from coming over from that wall is great now the wall looks like leon spinks's mouth you son of a bitch People forgot about Leon Spanx man I remember my parents Were hippies right But when Muhammad Ali Lost to Leon Spanx And then there was a rematch We watched it on television

Everybody Everybody wanted Ali to win People forget that Ali wasn't just A great boxer And the heavyweight champion Of the world He represented

People that were Against the war He represented people that were against the war. He represented people that were against all of the discrimination and all the racism that people had experienced in the 50s and the 60s. He was a different thing. He represented the hope of this new generation, that this athlete would take a stand. And he said, no fiat kong

ever did anything to me and i'm not going over there and fighting anybody and they took away his ability to earn a living for three fucking years prime years and he was a hero a real social he could have he could have given in he could have given in he could have got a cushy job like elvis or some shit you know and they would have had him go over there and you know just just to make it look like he was doing something he's like no no fucking chance you know he stood up for it my my parents were hippies wanted wanted him to win i mean my mom didn't give a fuck about boxing but when i was what he stood for i was a little kid i remember watching this on tv thinking this is crazy my parents want to watch a boxing match

because of what he stands for. My dad felt that way about Joe Louis and Robinson. Well, when Joe Louis beat Max Schmeling. Oh, yeah. Same. It was a very similar thing. He was beating Max Schmeling for the world. Like, it wasn't, I mean, I feel terrible for Max Schmeling because, I mean, he was probably just caught up in all that shit.

Max even said he wasn't part of it. He was just a pawn in the game yeah i'm sure yeah i'm sure what about jack johnson that's my favorite that's the craziest i mean other than lennox lewis jack johnson's my favorite that's the craziest of all stories right he was he was incredible that guy must have experienced and the shit he said back then yeah he would slick talk you bad my favorite one there's a meme a photo of him in his car as i don't even know if the story's true about the 50 yes yes i don't have change i'm coming back tonight same speed yeah he got pulled over going 50 he had to give the guy 50 that was the

fee he gave the guy 100 he goes what's this for he goes i'm gonna come back later that night same speed motherfucker then there's the story of him getting in a taxi And getting in the backseat of the taxi And the guy goes I don't drive Niger's And he reached over Pulled the guy into the backseat Got in the front Drove himself to where he had to get to

And the guy's like Where's my fare? Because I drove myself And he got out I wonder if that's true You know he could wrestle too These are all in his book You know he wrestled?

This video of Jack Johnson wrestling He had like a 13-inch wrist. He was a gigantic human being for the time, but I think he was only 6'2". Yeah, but he was a big... They called him the Galveston Giant. Yeah. And people, GQ magazine rated him as best-dressed athlete of the century in 2000. That's the wrong century.

Well, you know, of the 20th century oh right get it oh yeah in 2000 they did it oh okay yeah the whole 20th century the backtrack yeah well you know i mean i don't think any of us could even imagine what it must have been like when he won the title and the kind of hate that he got all the people that wanted him to be killed but the shit he did was so gangster oh yeah he would hit you see your knees buckle and hold you up and say he would say things to that he got, all the people that wanted him to be killed. But the shit he did was so gangster. Oh, yeah. He would hit you, see your knees buckle, and hold you up. And he would say things to the guys, not yet, sir. Really? Not yet, boss.

Not yet. You're going to have a longer night than this. He would just torture these guys. Yo, this guy knows boxing. Did you ever see his fight with Stanley Ketchel? Yeah. Yeah. The Boilermaker?

Yeah. Stanley Ketchel dropped him. Yeah. That was supposed to be an exhibition. And Stanley Ketchel was a middleweight, right? Yeah. Stanley Ketchel dropped him. Yeah. That was supposed to be. Jack Johnson. It was supposed to be a. Exhibition. An exhibition mountain. Stanley Ketchel was a middleweight, right? Yeah.

Yeah. And then he hit him. Oh, okay. And then his teeth got stuck in his gloves. Yeah. He smashed him. Wow. Yeah.

He had a fascinating style. When they had those little gloves. Yeah. What you guys don't realize, I was going to say, the little gloves, horse hair. Yeah. Different world. Yeah. Yeah. Little gloves were hard. You break your fucking hands real easy, too, in little gloves, horse hair. Yeah. Different world. Yeah. Yeah, little gloves are hard.

You break your fucking hands real easy, too. But they hurt more. Because they were not padded. That shit hurt. Well, it's like MMA gloves. Yeah. MMA fighters find out the hard way. You can open up with boxing and not even worry as much about what you're hitting.

You cannot do that if you're fighting bare knuckle. No. Have you seen that bare knuckle boxing thing they're doing? I was just going to say, what're fighting bare knuckle. No. Have you seen that bare knuckle boxing thing they're doing? I was just going to say, what is this bare knuckle resurgence? I think these guys are tough.

Yeah, they're definitely tough. But you got pro boxers going in it now. Yeah. Who went in it? Somebody, a decent name was in it recently. Well, a lot of UFC fighters.

Yeah, no matter how. Their careers are over. Yeah. They've gone in. It's like rugby or football. Right, right, right. The rugby guys are tougher Yeah. They've gone in. It's like rugby or football. Right, right, right. The rugby guys are tougher than the football players. 100%.

Yeah. Yeah. The Italian guy is in it. I saw him doing the bare knuckle thing. Italian guy? Yeah. He was a UFC fighter. From Italy?

No, no, no. An Italian-American. Hmm. Oh, Phil Barone? Yeah, Phil Barone. Wasn't he doing the bare knuckle? Yeah, he did one. Yeah.

Yeah. Quite a few MMA fighters.? Yeah, he did one. Yeah. Yeah. Quite a few MMA fighters. Melvin Gallard did some. Yeah. It's, you know, but it's sort of a last resort kind of thing, trying to pick up a paycheck. You know, Chris Lytle did it. You know? It's just a hard way to make a living.

What about 1FC? What's this guy knocking at the door? Is he saying the time? Tell this motherfucker to sit down. It's your boy. Who, my guy? Yeah, he's knocking on the door. Who, Eddie?

Yeah. The Mexican? Yeah. No, he's good. Don't even fire him. He's trying to get in. The other guy's talking to him. So Lennox's fella is talking to your fella.

My assistant? My assistant knows better. Well, people get silly. It's like a good meal, you know. Once you're enjoying this meal, you just want to finish it. I know. What do they have you doing after this? Just more interviews.

They got me busy. Boring-ass interviews, though. What are you promoting? Promoting the fights. Which fights? We haven't talked about any of them. Yeah. Hey, you couldn't promote a fart at a bean-eating contest.

We're talking about chess and get the fuck out of here. You get the fuck out of here. Tell your boy. I'm good. I'm good to fart at a bean eating contest. We're talking about chess. Get the fuck out of here. You get the fuck out of here. Tell your boy. It's you. I'm good. I'm good, Eddie. Don't worry about me. I've already told them.

I don't have to be somewhere until 4.30. I'm going to put some two-way glass there where we can see out and they can't see in. That's a good idea. Yeah. Silly boy. Trying to interrupt podcast. Fucking Eddie. Jesus, Eddie.

Sean Porter is fighting this weekend. Who's he fighting? You guessed from Cuba. Oh, they said you guessed. I'm like, I don't know who. It should be a good fight. And this is on? This is on Fox PPC.

Oh, nice. Porter's a champ right now, right? He won the title from Thurman, didn't he? Yeah. Or did he win it from danny garcia danny garcia i don't know don't you watch boxing aren't you a boxer yeah of course jesus tell me i'll tell you anything about the heavyweights are you doing commentary on this last beat danny garcia yes yeah so you're doing commentary on this? Yes. For Fox? Yes. Nice. It should be a good fight.

It should be a very good fight. Yeah. Yeah, there it is right there. Oh, he grew his hair out. Every time Sean Porter fights. Who's that smurf? Oh, it's Lennox. Every time Sean Porter fights, he's always a serious brawl.

This guy reminds me of the old time fighters the way how this guy fights. You know, it gives you a lot of pressure. He's on you. Somebody needs to help him tie his tie though. He doesn't mind

taking the shot to punch you. So, he mixes it up. He's a tough guy. That's this Saturday night? Yes. Nice.

Yeah, there's a lot of great fights coming up. The Mikey Garcia, Earl Spence Jr. Excited about that. That's a very good fight. Makes out the Mikey Garcia Earl Spence Jr. excited about that that's a very good fight makes me nervous though

it makes me nervous why? that's a great fight that's what everybody wants to see it's a great fight but I like Mikey Garcia but to me it's like I like both of those guys

I like them both I think Mikey's plus in this fight is that Spence hasn't had pressure like this and Mikey doesn't tank out on anybody. He does not gas out and he's not afraid to mix it up with you. What about the size difference? That's what I'm worried about. It's the size difference, the weight difference.

I would have preferred Mikey had one more fight before he fought Spence, but they know what they're doing. He's ready. He's whole family's boxing specialist. I've trained with his brother before with with robert have you really yeah yeah really yeah no shit yeah look at you great gym so you jiu-jitsu with john jock machado you're boxing with robert garcia lomachenko was there training

damn yeah teddy's up there right now working with that uh light heavyweight russian character oh the uh that uzik yeah yeah that kid's amazing. Yeah, Uzik. Yeah. I trained with, I trained over at Goosen's gym over the Christmas holidays. Oh,

did you really? I hadn't boxed in two years. Oh my God, I suck. My fucking hands hurt. I'm like, God, fuck this sport.

Your hands itself? My hands were hurting after like, God. Were you, did you wrap them? I wrapped them. I may wrap them too tight.

Fucking, you got soft hands. Don't make me square up, kid. It's been two years. I was like, ah, how did I do this? You got to do it slow. Jump back in slow. You know what it was? Because he knew I used to train back in the day.

So he was like, I wanted to look good. And I'm like, ah. OK, let me help you. You know what you do? See, this is where the martial arts comes in, buddy. Get this thing of sand and you just start punching it. Sand. Toughen you up a little bit.

Toughen you up with sand. Toughen you up, son. When I said my hands hurt, I meant like the joints. My joints were hurting. Well, you know what people do? You ever see rice bags? They stick their hand in rice bags. They do a lot of this inside rice bags.

That apparently is very good for your hands. I did that, but my mom got mad I was fucking up her rice. So what did you do about it? Your hands. I went home and just soaked them. If you just get back to doing it it'll come back to you

yeah I know I figured that much but I'm like bring a tennis ball everywhere I'm just like I'm going to stick with jujitsu

it doesn't hurt as much jujitsu doesn't hurt your hands? no I wear those little luta gear guards what? luta gear

have you seen them? they got these little finger guards they actually help what are they? strengthen they make a two finger and a three finger

I have no idea what that is I wear the three finger it. They make a two-finger and a three-finger. I have no idea what that is. I wear the three-finger. It's just like a little cut-off glove for your fingers. Really? Holds them together. This ninja thing. It's nice. Does it give you more traction, too?

Not necessarily, but it keeps your fingers together. It keeps them from separating so you don't fucking pop your finger out. That's probably good if you're a guitarist or some shit, huh? Probably. My mom uses them, too, for arthritis. Oh, look at that. That's it? Yeah, that's guitarist or some shit, huh? Probably. My mom uses some two-froze. Oh, look at that. That's it? Yeah, that's the two-finger joint.

Wow. I use the three. I've never even fucked with those. Yeah. I'm old school, bro. I just tape my shit up. Yeah, but you're also fucking gorilla strong. It's weird.

Why is it weird? Because it's like playing with a fucking silverback gorilla. Even when I watched your role with John Jack that day, I was like, you want to roll? I go, no, I don't. I'll do it now. But then I'm like, no. I've been doing it a long time, man. I started jiu-jitsu in 96.

We're rolling tomorrow, right? Yeah, tomorrow. I'm calling him now. We're going to probably roll around 8.30 in the morning if that's cool with you. Yeah, that works. Yeah, we could do that. What's different about jiu-jitsu and wrestling? What's the difference? Depending upon whether or not you use that works. Yeah, we could do that. What's different about jujitsu and wrestling? What's the difference?

Depending upon whether or not you use the gi, the gi is a big factor because you could grab a hold of that. It makes you more defensive-minded because you can get caught in things, you can get caught in submissions easier. Submissions are the big thing, obviously, but I do a lot of no-gi.

I have a black belt in no-gi jujitsu and gi jujitsu. I actually prefer no-gi. What do you want to do tomorrow? We do whatever. We do gi. I don't care. Just to slow it down.

I just don't use it. I just don't use the gi. I let people grab mine, but I try to use arm bars and chokes and things that I would do no-gi. That's how I trained from gi to no-gi so that I could do both. I just decided that I'm just going to train in the gi like i don't have one on like let people grab i'll be i'll be i'll recognize that i have it on so people can grab me but i don't grab theirs i just use overhooks and underhooks and okay i was trying to make a joke out of no gi oh somebody having the gi joe's a gi lord It is definitely a slower game Like older dudes

In particular They seem to like the gi Because they can kind of Control you It's good for you And it can also be Used against you Which is bad

Well it's If you have a winter coat on man Like I always said That the worst thing To do Is get in a fight With a judo black belt When you got a winter coat on

Oh yeah Or even a suit Even a sweater like that It's good yeah yeah we're looking at you it's all gravy yeah you uh you got your blue belt now right yeah when you uh when you think you get a purple belt you're on your way right i gotta get some stripes i talked to jj about it i go dude i'm trying to train more so i can get a stripe because yeah you're due for a stripe i go well come on i gotta fucking train more so i can get the stripe i don't want yeah, you're due for a stripe. I go, well, I got to fucking train more so I can get the stripe. I don't want the stripe.

I want to earn the stripe. Are you doing things other than your jujitsu training in terms of physical training? Maybe little dumbbells and yoga ball. Yeah, that's it. You should get a trainer. Get someone like, it'll make a big difference. It's like, think about your body as like a race car, right? If you could just lift weights and your race car would go faster, wouldn't you do that like if there was a thing you could do you know i do my little

dumbbells but uh dumbbells but my elbow freaking hurts lately so like this is the thing i was talking about this is the thing i was talking about what do you do a tennis elbow right i i was having a problem with my elbow you you hold it like that. Like you twist it like this. And then you untwist it with your arm. So you hold it like this, twist, and then untwist it. You do it slowly. And it works on these tendons, the same tendons that you get with the test. But it's just so shitty how I got it from fucking sleeping. Could we have him try that right now?

Let's see. There we go. Damn, that's a lot heavier than it looks. So you twist it. And then untwist it. Yeah, like twist it like that, right? And then level it out and then slowly untwist it. That's good.

Yeah. You just got to do it over and over and over again. A little bit. It's far more dense than it looks. Yeah. It's great for your tendons. It specifically works this part of your arm, like down in here. Now you just look like you're jerking off,

Len. That's good, too. You know what else is good? A roller. When you have one of those cords. Those foam rollers? No, a cord with a weight at the bottom of it, and you gotta roll it with your wrists. Oh, yeah, we used to do that in boxing back in the day. Those are great. People just used to fabricate them in the gym. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I remember those. Yeah, like a stick with a roller. Those are great, yeah. I have one of those out there, too. It's just, that's one of the day. Those are great. People just used to fabricate them in the gym. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember those. Yeah, like a stick with a rope. Those are great. Yeah. I have one of those out there too. It's just, that's one of the best

exercises. Yeah, for your forearms, right? Yeah, for your forearms and gripping and just have that kind of strength. Good.

You would be awesome at jiu-jitsu. I guarantee you because you're a chess player and jiu-jitsu is very cerebral. You know? It's very, it's like,

it's, boxing obviously is very cerebral too but you're limited in your weapons you don't have a certain amount of angles you could punch from whereas jiu-jitsu there's an endless combination you get you get you get some time to think some in certain positions yeah i had a teacher that did a kato yeah yeah uh wrist locks that's what he did to that dude the jewelry shop did a half half a kato half jiu- locks. That's what he did to that dude at the jewelry shop. I did a half a keto, half jiu-jitsu on him. He gave me, he did something to me and I realized, okay, I got to watch out for that.

It's where, you know, a person manipulates your bone and then drops their whole weight on it. Oh, yeah. That shit could break your hand too though. If you don't go with it, it'll break your hand. Fredson. Fredson Pichow does that shit to people. Yeah. Marcelo Garcia's tapped people out, like high level people with wrist locks in jiu-jitsu tournaments yeah john jack was showing me like how to wrist lock a guy while you're done like damn yeah it's like it's not nice don't do it to people but you can do this

if you want yeah there's some nasty shit the thing is like there's no end to jiu-jitsu there's no end and there and yeah there's no like these are all the moves and that's it the people keep inventing moves constantly i just found out a new move yesterday when rubber guard assassins on uh instagram right they figured out some crazy uh kimura you do from a closed guard that leads to a triangle i'm like what the fuck but you gotta like you somebody has to let you do a lot of those things to some of them yeah but sometimes people don't know what you're doing they don't even know you're letting them i'm always concerned about rubber guard with your knees like fucking up your knee joints because you got to be very flexible to get that rubber guard in yeah just stretch yeah yeah stretch get yourself rubber guard i don't know

what that is it's where you put somebody in between your legs when you describe it sounds so gay uh you put a put somebody between your, and then you pull your leg over their head, but their head has to pop through. Now you're controlling them. You can hold their head this way. It's a lot of fucking rubberiness that I don't have the ability to do. It was invented by my friend Eddie Bravo, but there was some guys who would play high guard before that.

He just put it into a more, there it is. That's a good example of it. That's what it looks like. So he's pulling down using his, his leg and his arms to control a guy and wraps him up and. While he's down. Yeah.

Well, yeah. So he's on the bottom. It looks like a Gracie move. It is. Well, it's a jujitsu move. So it's a Bravo move.

All jujitsu essentially. That's Eddie right there.ie move. It is. Well, it's a jiu-jitsu move. It's a Bravo move. All jiu-jitsu, essentially. That's Eddie right there. Yeah, there he is. Eddie and Joe came up under my teacher, and then Eddie took it to another level from there. Well, Eddie just branched out and went into no-gi. He's much more concerned, but he has a black belt in the gi as well. Much more concerned with no-gi techniques want the Techniques that would work in mixed Martial arts so in mixed martial arts

You don't have the collars to grab the Sleeves to grab so he wanted to invent a System that you could use especially When you have the ability to fight off Your back it's very when you fight That's Ben Saunders who's like one of The best at it in MMA and if you get Wrapped up you're on top of a dude and

he wraps you up with his legs like that it's very it's very demoralizing yeah you get so trapped yeah human nature tells you when you're on your back and there's a guy on top of you you're in trouble but in jujitsu you're like that's fine yeah if you got a good guard like john jock yeah yeah wow you have any interest in that? Where do you live these days? I live in Canada. You still live in Toronto? Yeah. I was in Jamaica for a minute.

Yeah. You were living in Jamaica for a minute? Yeah. That was fun. I love Toronto. It was one of my favorite places on the planet. That's where you first met him. I introduced you to him. Yeah.

I was telling him earlier. At the nightclub. Yeah. I took Joe to a nightclub to meet Lennox. And I remember that meeting though. Yeah. That's when, what's his name was playing? Scratch.

Scratch was playing? Scratch. Scratch was playing, and everybody was there. Toronto's just such a perfect city. It's like the people are nice, but it's urban. Like, it's very populated. There's a lot of people, but they don't have that asshole vibe that, like, New York has. I think it's the fifth largest city in North America. Is it? Yeah.

Let me tell you, they're building like mad over there. A lot of condos made out of glass. Rent is market. But tiny little places. Well, there's so much cool shit there. And now that weed's legal, it's probably booming in Canada. But weed was never really an issue there. If you got caught with it, just give it, stop it.

But now it's like you'd go to the stores. You know, the stores On the street Like Is it that easy over there Is that how they got it Oh yeah Yeah I think they have A couple stores

We saw some We saw some stores They're opening Like about 25 or 50 In Toronto So the government's Giving them It's a great place man

I did that place That you do That uh The They're Canada Center Oh Scotiabank They call it Scotiabank now The Canada Center. Oh, Scotiabank, yeah. They call it Scotiabank now. Yeah, I just did it in November.

He came. And then you were there, I think, like a month before me when I left. Yeah, yeah. I was there before my Netflix special came out, and it came out in October, so I think I was there around then. Yeah. Yeah, I fucking love it up there, man. That's probably one of my favorite cities to visit.

Come on back. I love it. Massey Hall. Love that place. Yeah, we did that together. Yes, that was fun, man. You, me, and big j oh that's right that's right that's right yeah that was a good time man the ufc's they're always great too yeah good support they love it up there yeah well it's just toronto's just such a it's such an unusual city like canada in general

like i'll ask you this why are people so nice they're so much nicer than americans it's uh i don't know it's different there's nice americans when you say nice you're saying they're more polite yeah more polite yeah i find that too i think americans are nicer on as far as um have you been to new york lately yeah i love i love here's the thing. Canadians are polite, but we'll talk shit about you when you're not looking. I'll take that. I'll take that over being rude in my face. But Canadians can also get freaked out by people being forward, which Americans are considered very forward.

And, you know, it's an outgoing thing. So, whereas an American would be like, hey, yo, I want to ask you something. Canadians are like, oh, why is this person so aggressive? Whereas a Canadian would be like, excuse me, I'd like to ask you a question. Yeah, that's true. It's very similar, but just different approaches. Why, you know, as far as like stand-up comedy, is there, how good is the community in Canada? Is it like the community in in america

where there's a lot of up-and-coming people or is it there's a lot of comics in canada a lot of great ones come out of canada um the problem is there's no um the money's not there so no matter touring around yeah like like the clubs once you get you know the clubs tap out at like maybe you'll make let's see what that, six shows on a weekend. A good headliner can make $1,200. That's it. I mean, that's pretty fucking insane. Yeah, it's rough, especially if they're selling out and making drink money.

Yeah, that's the problem is that the club, I liken it to the UFC almost to a certain degree. It's not about the comic. It's about the name of the club. Like Yuck Yucks. Yeah, Yuck Yucks is about Yuck Y yucks it doesn't matter who's there it's about yuck yucks the ufc is about ufc doesn't matter who the fucking fighter is they used to have that attitude at some of the clubs in la you know that was one of the reasons why they had that big comic strike way back in the 70s yeah it's because people felt like the you know the comics were the ones who were providing the art form but the clubs are the ones who are making all the money and they were like hey you know you're you you're at the improv or you're at the comedy store.

You know, the pay scale at these clubs is the same as it was in the 80s, which is fucking horrible. Like, I take people out on the road with me, and the clubs will pay $50 for an emcee for the weekend and $100 for the feature. And I'm like, that's fucking – that's what it was. I started in 89, and that's what it was back then.'s crazy it's still like that and i'm like that's terrible like how are these kids gonna make a living well in a way it's a lot like boxing because like when

people think that boxers make millions of dollars because floyd mayweather make 100 million dollars in a fight and that is true but if you look at the undercard like there's guys that are fighting for chump change i mean and they are going through a long camp let me tell you do you remember your first paycheck yeah what was your first boxing paycheck five thousand wow that's because i'm coming i'm coming out of the olympics baby yeah that's true but even still that's five thousand dollars for a fucking professional fight but you also had signed a million dollar deal oh yeah it's gonna add up after a while yeah i mean you're you're an exception i mean there's guys fighting out there for like 800 bucks you know what i mean yeah 800 try 500 300 yeah yeah so you know another thing that disturbs me about mma as

opposed to boxing is the uh win lose bonus i don't like that i think a fighter i think a fighter should get paid what they're supposed to get paid. No one's trying to lose. And if you're trying to lose, you're never going to be able to compete at the highest level anyway. These guys are pouring their heart and soul. They're giving their body. They're literally sacrificing their health.

And they might get fucked out of a decision. And because of that, they lose 50% of their money. So some incompetent judge, which in boxing is everywhere. Adelaide Bird. How dare you? There was even worse than her. There's people that don't even do it anymore because they get chased out of the game.

Every time I listen to the – that's when you're a fan of the sport, when you hear the judges' names, you go, fuck, not that guy. Yeah. There was a lot of them, man. There was a lot of them. But imagine if 50% of your purse goes away because someone doesn't know what the fuck they're doing. So wait, the win-lose bonus, they're guaranteed a certain amount. They're guaranteed a certain amount, but that's to show.

Like, say this. Right. Like, say maybe you would get 10 and 10. So you get $10,000 to fight and 10,000 more if you win. Right. But it's crazy. It's oftentimes 50%. and the idea is that you're going to give these fighters an incentive to put on a better show but i think i don't like

and then fight of the night yeah i don't like when people fight any different than the way they're fighting when they're fighting the best and the smartest right i think you should fight intelligently you shouldn't engage in a wild brawl because you want some performance bonus. Because they'll give out performance of the night or knockout of the night. Can you lose and still get the fight of the night bonus? Yes.

Cerrone's got a ton of those. He's got a ton of bonuses. But I mean, that's him though. He would fight that way if you gave him a guarantee. Oh yeah, Cerrone's a beast. He's a perfect example. If he knew he was going to make a half million dollars a fight no matter what he would fight exactly that way that's how he fights and i think that's how that's how it should be he's an anomaly though because he

grew up with money didn't he like a decent he grew up with a decent lifestyle terribly poor he wasn't wealthy i thought he had money i thought he could grow up with with a decent amount of money that's the way i was sold it. I don't believe so. I don't want to speak out of school, though. Me neither. But I have always been like he's fucking. BJ Penn did. You know, BJ Penn is a legend.

BJ grew up with a wealthy family. They're wealthy. He just was a fighter. Who was he fighting? I just saw somewhere he's fighting someone. He's going to fight Clay Guida. Yes. That's a fucking odd one.

I thought he retired. He did. He got bored. So he still wants to do it he actually looked very good in his last fight up until he was a very exciting fighter back in the day he's still a wild man yeah he's still a while but he got leg locked by ryan hall who's just this phenomenal jujitsu player and he he caught him with a he he did a uh uh emmanari roll and caught him at a leg lock and just fucked his leg up. Imanari roll. Yeah.

Are you talking about? It sounds like something you eat at a sushi place. Could I have an Imanari roll? I think it was an Imanari roll. Imanari is this very famous Japanese fighter who is a phenomenal leg lock artist. And there's actually two moves. There's an Imanari roll and there's an eminari which an eminari comes from um uh omoplata an omoplata is a shoulder lock i think it's a

portuguese word i think that's what they call it i mean it gets your it's from your leg it's a yeah it's a shoulder lock and then the eminari is while you're locked up in the omoplata you grab like a grip underneath the guy's chin and you yank him back. It's a nasty. I'll show you tomorrow. I hope not. I really hope not. Can't we just have a friendly roll? We can, but if you catch yourself in an omoplata, it's coming.

You know what's funny is when I'm a big fan of the in-arm choke, which I know is your favorite. Head and arm? Yeah. You mean over like that? Yeah. And then John Jack now calls it the Joe Hogan

someone do it get the Joe Hogan and that's your move you've actually it's now your move at the gym well you know sometimes you have like

techniques that you you hit so often that you just know when they're there and you can close them up real quick that was always my shit that's what I've been

ever since then I've actually been working on that well you know somebody guys did it to me and it's such a suffocating feeling when someone's on top of you and you got your arm pinned here then next their arms across your neck and you're like it's such a and you make that noise funny enough oh it's a horrible way to get choked out with the esteem a lot i like when guys get locks named after them how do you get out of it well you have to put your hand on your ear like you're answering the phone. That's one.

The first thing is you're trying to create some space here so that you don't go to sleep. You've got to give in to the fact that this guy is choking this side of your neck for sure. So the arm is coming under here and it's wrapping around here. And if you just go like that and it's down or like that, it's going to get smushed. You're getting smushed, right? So you've got to bring this thing in here. You're trying to create a little bit of space. And then you hope this motherfucker gets tired of squeezing your neck.

And then you're trying to get in here and create a little bit of space. That's what you're trying to do. Just give me a little bit of space at a time. Just a little bit of space. Get a little bit of space. It's all just a little bit of space. Get a little bit of space. It's all just a matter of little inches, little tiny micro movements. But when someone has your arm wrapped up like that and they have that arm across your neck and they're crushing you with their body weight and then they get their knee on your solar plexus

and flatten you out and squeeze down, it's horrible. Are there fighters in other countries that don't go in mma but they're unbelievable fighters but they're not trying to show anybody that they're unbelievable fighters oh like kung fu guys yeah no no those guys all get fucked up and they try to they think they do it because you start believing it and you have your students and they believe you're the master and there's a lot of videos. There's a bunch of those videos. I'm that guy who'd wear the orange Shaolin suit and he would win in these really hokey fight contests.

Then he'd get into the big ones and he'd just get the shit beat out of him. Yeah, he was kickboxing. He actually had some skills. I used to watch his shit on YouTube. He could do a little bit, but what I'm talking about is these chi chi masters like those those ones where you put uh seems real or those are so sad real as fuck yeah yeah mcdo yeah um uh mcdojo what is the mcdojo life on instagram has a shitload of those

yeah those make me laugh they're so sad oh yeah that's what you put you put seems legit yeah well a lot of these guys they'll go and fight a real fighter and they think they actually know how to fight and they just get concussed they just get smashed open you know because you know why why because they don't get hit yeah they don't get hit that's why that's why i love boxing you know boxing you spar all the time you get hit all the time so you know in a real fight boxers have been hit you know guys that do kung fu and all those things they don't get hit so when they do get hit in a real fight it's like it messes them up it's like oh no what do i do now didn't see this coming yeah yeah practical application the difference between practicing and you know thinking there's so many of these

oh what is this guy doing i haven't seen this one is this a new one i just picked one that that guy in the black key looks like he's gonna fuck this dude up it's a very gay looks like the carpeting in my bedroom oh my god what are these guys oh oh did you see that oh it's did you see that i wonder why they're wearing such weird geese and everybody everybody clapping they're really black belts are in that class? God damn. These silly fucks. They really believe that.

I bet that guy could get them to suck his dick the same way. I know people who really believe that their teacher can do that stuff. Suck it. Suck it. They're called priests. How dare you. It's weird that those people are still around in the day of video cameras, that you can still have this.

But, yeah, what you're saying is perfect. Even what you were saying, that if you hadn't fought in two years and then you would get in there and get hit, you're like, whoa, okay. Let me see. I've seen Keith Thurman do that. Really? Oh, in his last fight. Yeah. Yes, I saw that too.

And Lopez isn't a banger by any means. He looked a little off though. Yeah. Right. But Keith Thurman had to suffer through

that one little concussion, concussed I should say, and he was all right after that. If you hit him with that same shot, he would have took it even better

because he got over the hump. I still gave that fight to Lopez though. A lot of people did. Yeah, it was a close fight, for sure. And, you know, it was Thurman's big comeback fight. I mean, how long had he been out? Two years, at least.

Was he injured? He was injured. He had some sort of shoulder, elbow. Yeah. So, you know, but that's also one of the things that makes it so interesting. You know, I mean, and when a guy does come back from a devastating loss and you go, okay, like Manny Pacquiao when Marquez knocked him out. Woo! I mean, crazy.

That was a bad one. That was a bad one. That was a bad one. That's going to cause some slurring later. Maybe. It's like, you know, you make a move. It's a good move. But then you've moved into the man's power punch. And he hits you. And, you know, there's no second chance with that one.

Yeah. And Marquez, I mean, he's an interesting case. You know, I mean, he's obviously a very, very talented fighter. But as he got older, he got physically stronger. He got bigger and stronger. Mexican supplements. Mexican meat. A lot involved. Clam butyrol meat.

Monkey juice. There's a lot involved there, right? I mean, and he actually was working with Manny Pacquiao's old strength and conditioning guy, and Manny was the guy who was always accused of doing stuff. Oh, you're talking about Alex Ariza? Yeah. I mean, Manny went up eight weight classes.

I had Alex Ariza train me before. Yeah? When I was doing my special three years ago. Look at him. Jacked. Is he still fighting? No, he's retired. Marquez is done?

Yeah. Good for him. They're talking about Floyd. They're talking about doing a Floyd Pacquiao rematch. I'm not really excited about that. You know what I'm excited about? I want to see how much money Floyd Mayweather can make. I'm excited.

I mean, look, the fucking, the fact that he talked everybody into that Conor McGregor fight, and he made more than $100 million for that fight. Wait, isn't that Tenshin kid fighting again? He's fighting somebody else now. Nazukawa? Yeah. He's a badass. Yeah, no, but he's supposed to be fighting another.

Another boxer? Yeah. Oh, I think you're right. Probably a lesser one, but, you know. Well, tension is 126 pounds. Yeah, so he should fight somebody that size. I mean, the fact that he fought Mayweather at all, and people are like, oh, it looks like it was a fake fight. No, that's what it looks like when a 126-pound fighter fights one of the best boxers of all time.

Yeah. That's what it looks like. That doesn't look fake. He did fall very dramatically because he got his fucking brain rattled you know oh it's a giovante davis oh my god giovante can't make that weight anymore either giovante can't even make the weight he's at now but they don't have him make weight that's the thing they just have him fight i mean floyd didn't make any fucking weight did he what do you like do you

like the way one fc is doing their weight thing yes that's pretty cool a lot yeah for people don't know they they don't let them cut weight they they they do hydration tests so there's no dehydrating yourself so if you weigh naturally you walk around 185 pounds you're gonna fight at 185 pounds you're not gonna fight at 170 or 165 like a lot of these guys do that's good yeah i'd love yeah that's good because uh the hydration aspect of even in any sport taking that liquid away from the brain yeah you know your your body needs liquid yeah it needs uh it survives on liquid and it makes your bones brittle it's it's terrible for you in every way it's terrible for your performance your internal organs a lot of guys have kidney failure when they're cutting weight for weigh-ins. That's the beautiful thing about you being a heavyweight, right?

Yes. Man, I didn't have to take off my clothes. I can weigh whatever. But there was always that fighting weight where I would be perfect at. Manny was good at that. Yeah. How much do you weigh? Okay, don't move from there.

What was it, about 240? No, 235. 235 was perfect. Knew you were on. Yep. Yeah. Now, what kind of nutrition did you follow when you were fighting? Did you take specific vitamins or did you drink specific things?

No, just Jamaican food. Jamaican food. Yeah. Angelo Dundee asked me that same question. Yeah. He said, what do you eat I said my mother's food He said

If it ain't broke Don't fix it That's a perfect Angelo Dundee quote Yep Yeah he's another one man Remember that With Sugar Ray Leonard

Against Thomas Hearns You're blowing it kid Yeah And he gets Sugar Ray Leonard Get fired up And he goes out And stops him the next round.

There was a lot of good trainers back then. Eddie Futch, Georgie Benton. Yeah, Georgie Benton, yeah. Bless his soul. Good trainer as well. It's so important for a young fighter to get hooked up with the right trainer. Right. You know, we got on that for a second.

I think part of the problem with a lot of the young kids right now, they need to get good trainers. Yeah. Good trainers really help your game because even helps you with the TV. the problem with a lot of the young kids right now they need to get good trainers yeah good trainers really help your game because even helps you with the with the tv because um i was saying today that when a man you uh came into my corner hbo started talking about me better before that he was like oh he doesn't throw the jab enough he looks like he's tired the fight when i went with manny they were like praising me oh he's doing good now man he's behind him like he's tired the fight when i went with manny they were like praising me oh he's doing good now man he's behind him now he's a trainer of champions so

trainer really helps your your game were you were you with manny when you fought mercer yes that was a war yeah that was actually no i wasn't i wasn't that mercer fight he actually taught mercer helped me out because before that fight I was always fighting guys that hooked hooked around body shots and hooks

so I kept my hands like this at the side of my face then and then I went into that fight got a fat lip I hated

I hate getting fat lips in my fights it's like you know hey did you win the fight yeah it didn't look like you you're good to get a fat lip from you know so i kept on walking around with a fat lip and then i got you know i got a good picture of you i got a good picture of you me and lloyd and you got a

fat lip it's right after one of your fights from like 97 and then then man he said you know what you're doing wrong he said you need to put your hand in front of your mouth. I'm like, okay. So even if a guy throws a punch which doesn't slide through, it's going to hit your hand. And he said, you can move your hand two inches to protect yourself from a hook, can't you? And I said, yeah. Oh, okay, you're right.

After that fight, no more fat lips. But I used to hate Getting fat lips Boy can everybody Look at you funny That's hilarious Well but having A great trainer

Is so important In MMA as well I mean And there's not That many of them It's like you really Have to find the right ones A lot of good trainers

Are just former fighters Now right Well there's that Yeah but You know Someone has to be A real You can't just be

A trainer Or just be a former fighter Rather You have just be a trainer or just be a former fighter, rather. You have to be a student to really understand the game. Like, Emmanuel was only an amateur fighter, right? He never fought professional. And he was one of the greatest of all time, unquestionably. Like, everybody respected him. And so soft-spoken, you know, but just knew.

Just knew how to raise fighters. And you think about all the guys, Gerald McClellan, Tommyy hearns all the great fighters that came out of that camp the only problem i have with you know old-time fighters is like you know some some old-time fighters were bad fighters now right now they're training a young kid the same way right and it's not it's not positive it's like you're teaching them the bad tricks yeah but then there's guys who are better as trainers than they were as fighters like Freddie Roach. 100%. Yeah.

Freddie Roach is recognized as one of the greatest trainers for sure alive but as a fighter he was a journeyman. Kevin Rooney was a good trainer in his day. Yeah.

And he got knocked up by Arguello in the second round. Well he was a good trainer with Tyson but he never really developed talent outside of Tyson. I think he developed

a lot of alcohol that's what. Oh. Hanging around with Mike and he's got tigers on a leash. And then Buddy had a good run for a minute, Buddy McGirt. He's still training fighters.

Yeah, I've trained with Buddy before. Did you? Oh, good. Yeah. He was a great fighter. Buddy was a great fighter. Yeah. Great dude.

Yo, you haven't trained with me yet. What are you afraid of me, guy? Listen, man, your phone keeps blowing up and you were supposed to be out here an hour ago, but I appreciate your time, man. Thank you. It was an honor to sit here and talk to you thanks for having one of my favorites of all time appreciate it russell i like you too thanks man you're my favorite guy to get choked out by sweetie we're gonna have some fun tomorrow jesus lennox lewis ladies and

gentlemen thank you everybody that was great