The Joe Rogan Experience - #1445 - Andy Stumpf

Episode Date: March 21, 2020

Andy Stumpf is a retired Navy SEAL and was also a two-time wingsuit world record holder. He hosts his own podcast called “Cleared Hot" available on Spotify.

Two, one. Andy Stump. How are you, buddy? I'm good. What's going on? A lot. There's a lot happening. Do you have a hot take on this, Andy?

What's your hot take? I get text messages from people saying, you know, give me the inside scoop as to what's happening and what I should do. Yeah. And I don't have a good answer. I have the same information sources that everybody else does. My concern is not that we shouldn't protect people that are sick and people that are old. My concern is that these decisions are being done by politicians and that they want to do this so that they can be elected come re-election. They don't want people to be upset at them for not acting. And so they're making these decisions

and they're not showing us exactly how they're going to get out of this. Like when you're shutting down Los Angeles for a month, just the staggering amount of people that are going to be in debt. And there was some number that we looked it up recently of the amount of people that live check to check. It's crazy. It's like half of America. The average American, the stat I saw was that they cannot absorb an expense outside of the normal over $400. Right.

That's gone. That's already gone. So already most Americans are fucked now just with this dip. And then they're talking about extending this to April 19th. I just don't know if they have a plan. I don't know how they're talking about extending this to April 19th. I just don't, I don't know if they have a plan. I don't know how they're going to buy their way out of this. How do you help those folks? I mean, I'm the wrong person to ask about that, but I would hope at least that the politicians, I'm sure there's an aspect always, if you are a politician, in the back of your mind, I have to conduct myself in a

way where I can get reelected. Like everything is probably viewed through that. But I would hope at least that they're viewing it through the humanity perspective. And as far as the decisions they're making, I don't think anybody knows what to do. Yeah, I don't think anybody knows what to do either. They feel like they have to do something so they're doing something we all need to look at idris elba because that guy looks fucking great he does he's still he's he's got it he's got it and there's i mean he seems fine tom hanks he says he's just kind of tired it's i i can't make heads or tails of it because if you go the longer you spend on your phone i think the more or your computer i think the more confused you'll actually become because i don't know to be honest who's

telling the truth and who is not there's stories of people saying hey i tested positive for this i don't have any symptoms hey i live in italy three people are dead in my hallway and i got sick and i don't feel that good and then you watch people walking around in zombie apocalypse suits with, you know, mop level four gear on, not listening to, you know, how, you know, we were walking on the beach yesterday. And, you know, there's people, there's huge social bubbles. They don't want to be near each other. from what I'm reading, and again, it's so heads or tails, you know, you basically have to be coughed on or sneezed on or touched a surface that one of these infected people have touched or close proximity. And there's people on the beach walking around in hazmat suits. It's a wild time.

It's a wild time because of that, because there's no clear information and because you're seeing some people that look really healthy and then you're seeing the stories that come out of Italy. One thing to take into consideration with Italy is Italy has one of the oldest populations. They have a lot of old people and a shit ton of smokers. Those two factors are huge here because this is a respiratory disease. Well, don't they also have, in comparison to the rest of the world, more generations living in a single household? Yes. Which I would imagine is going to be, as those generations move on, you're going to have higher risk people living with people who are lower risk

but might be transmitting it. Yes. That's the real concern. The real concern is you're going to transmit it to your grandma or someone who's sick. There was a guy, it's weird how the news gives you these stories because there was a guy that was 34 years old

that died and they said he just got back from Disneyland. You're like, fuck, I thought you lived forever once you go to Disneyland. This is crazy. He just got back from Disneyland? How? Like, the fact that they put that he just got back from Disneyland, it's all heartstring-pulling stuff. But then if you go deep into the story,

this young man just got over testicular cancer. He had bronchitisitis and he had asthma. So there's a lot going on there. He had the deck stacked against him for sure. He had the deck stacked against him. He's immune compromised for sure because of coming off of the testicular cancer. And then on top of that with asthma and bronchitis. And then he gets a respiratory disease.

Those are the people that really have to worry. And I really wish there was a clear way to help them other than shutting down everything for a month. I was talking to Evan Hafer this morning, called out of the blue, and we were having kind of a conversation about this. And he brought something up that just about the narrative. And to me, what's happening right now is it's interesting from a couple of perspectives. For one, I've traveled the world enough and seen people living in a variety of different living conditions that right now, in my opinion at least, people are getting a glimpse into what it is like to live in the non-first world. Where when maybe you don't even have a grocery store, but if you go there, you can't get everything that you want. And you can't travel when you always want to, and you don't have the freedom of movement that you want.

A lot of people live their life, take the virus out of the equation. A lot of people live their life day to day in situations just like this or much worse. So I think it should be eye-opening hopefully for people that there's a thin margin between the excess and luxury that we have in the first world and how fast that can be removed and we can start stepping down that staircase. And it shows to me – I try to view the videos that you see online of people fist fighting for toilet paper. I think those are the anomaly and I try not to let the anomaly paint the norm. I don't think most people are doing that. But there are people that are doing that. And there are people who are going in and they're hoarding and buying. I don't think – like toilet paper is a good example.

I can give you 15 different ways to wipe your ass without toilet paper. Yeah. Like you're going to be OK. Like do you have a garden hose? I mean we can start there. I'm not saying it's the most sanitary, but yeah, I've, I think I've wiped my ass with a handful of gravel one time. Cause that's all that I had. I'm not recommending it, but I'm just, you know, really? Oh, for sure. Gravel? It was what was in like close. Yeah. I mean, why not? I've, I mean, I have had many. Make it cleaner. I didn't really check. I didn't have too much time. But I've had many days where I started with two socks and ended with one.

I've had T-shirts that became tank tops. I mean, there's options that you have. None of these I'm recommending for anybody. But what I'm saying is the toilet paper is not going to make the difference between life or death. It's a weird one to hoard. It's a weird one that people are freaking out about. Because they're scared. I would think it would be food.

Well, but they're scared. I would think it would be food. Well, but they're scared. And I find that when people get scared, like we were talking about right before we went on, when people get drunk, a couple of the layers of their protective, like this is who I want to portray myself, it starts to strip away. And what I see are people who are super concerned about me and far less concerned about we. And the conversation

I was having with Evan was, you know, it'd be great if we were talking about, you know, the people who are going to get crushed, and I'm not, you know, an economic expert by any stretch, but are the ones you already talked about are living paycheck to paycheck. How about the elderly who are in the high risk category that are on social security fixed income, and they can't even go out right now because they don't feel comfortable getting groceries that people are going to get destroyed and i would love to have a conversation about a social construct or relationship that we have where we start talking about you know what are we going to do to get food and aid to these people what are we going to do to come together and help everybody out instead of assholes and target hoarding toilet paper.

Yeah. And it's, to me, a lot of that is driven by fear. And a lot of it is driven by panic. And believe me, I'm not an expert at all, probably on anything in my life. But one thing that I have some experience in is surviving and thriving in high risk situations that are high stress, which is kind of what's going on right now. It's a different type of stress. And the most dangerous thing you can do is lose control of your emotions or let your emotions take over your decision-making cycle,

which is what I see people doing, and it's so dangerous. And I think we need to start finding ways to back away from that and start talking about the we greater than me. I don't think there's a toilet paper shortage. There's a shortage of people with common sense who are buying too much toilet paper, which is freaking other people out. So they're buying too much stuff, which they don't actually need, which is freaking up. You know what I mean?

It's just this cascading effect. Yeah, it's a fear cascade. Yeah. It's not good. It's not good. It's also, this is the first time we've, as a nation, have been tested like this with a crisis where the country had to shut down. We don't have any experience in it, so we don't know what to expect. What I hope is it gives me a little bit of flashes is the right after 9-11, because we have had times where the country shut down, but it was very, very brief.

But I remember like the solidarity after 9-11, it was all about we and not about me. And I hope that it trends that direction because who knows when this is going to end? I mean, my kids are out of school, I think for the year. Yeah. I think mine as well. And you know, what if you're a single parent and you have to work and what if your kids are getting two of their three meals per day at school? And I, you know, the school system in Montana where I live is already, you know, they're actually doing a really good job.

Come to these locations, you can get free meals, but that's assuming the kid has a way to get there because- Well, Montana's scalable, that's assuming the kid has a way to get there. Well, Montana's scalable, right? There's a million people in the entire state. The state's fucking massive. It's not out of control. California has 40 million fucking people in this one spot. It's so preposterous.

Yeah. And there's so much poverty. There's so many people that were barely hanging on as it is, and now they're off the cliff, and they don't know what to do. And there's no real protection set in place now to keep them from being evicted i don't believe you know i don't unscrupulous landlords people that have been looking for a reason to get rid of these people in the first place fuck man who knows who knows what's going to go on it's real confusing it's real confusing and have you seen the stats like the here i'm going to show this to jamie maybe we could put could put this up on the screen because it's really kind of crazy that this is the choice

that they've made to shut everything down. Here, I'm sending this to you right now. Well, it's funny, right? They made that choice last night. So we got here Thursday, so a day before they made that decision. And the decision was made last night and went into effect. And exactly the same amount of people are still out. Yeah, exactly the same amount. I mean, there's no real law. I mean, it's more of a recommendation than anything, but they do have to close businesses. Well, I think they're hoping that people do buy into a social contract.

Like maybe we can care about the we over me. But I just – you see people not doing that when they're pressed. Yeah. And that gets rough. So here's the numbers, right? Hospitalizations, intensive care unit admission, case-by-case fatality percentages reported

for COVID-19 by age group. So this is up until March 16th, which is a couple days ago. So 0 to 19, there's 123 cases. 1.6 to 2.5 were hospitalized. Zero ICU, zero fatality. So then you get 20 to 44, that's you. 705 cases.

14.3 to 20.8 hospitalizations 2 to 4 ICU and 0.1 to 0.2 case fatality now you gotta think those people are pre-existing conditions just looking at those numbers 45 to 54 that's my age group 429 cases, less for some weird reason

21 to 28 hospitalization That's my age group. 429 cases, less for some weird reason. 21 to 28 hospitalization. 5.4 to 10.4 ICU. 1.4 to 2.6 fatality. Again, you've got to think those people have preexisting conditions. And it gets all the way up to really old. Let's go to 85 plus. That's Callen's age. That's Callen's age.

Yeah, high risk. 144 cases, 31 out of 144 to 70 hospitalizations, so 31.3 to 70.3 hospitalizations. Six to 29 ICU fatalities, 10 to 27. So the vast majority of fatalities, you're looking at people between 75 and 84, which is 4.3 to 10.5, and then 85 plus, which is 10.4 to 27.3. So it's really obviously not good for really old people. It looks like you got a 25% fatality rate at the worst case scenario for hospitalized people that have the case. But again, for young, healthy people, it's not the big monster that everybody thinks it is. I mean, there's people running around terrified that are young and healthy. The real concern is older folks.

Well, there's other spectrum too. There's the young people running around terrified and healthy, and then there's the people who are mobbing beaches in Florida on spring break saying – Our future leaders? Fuck it. Did you see that video? They'll be gone by the time they're the future leaders, but yeah. It's hilarious.

And you have to assume, though, that those numbers are completely inaccurate. I would imagine the number because of the lack of testing but the percentages are probably still the same you know i think there's probably just bigger numbers yeah it's uh well kids are just gonna be kids man you get 18 year olds on the beach in florida they're there to fuck they're not they're not worried about catching the covid 19 they don't even know what the fuck that is. Their brains aren't even formed yet. Yeah. As my nine-year-old says, they have mushy brains.

I was trying to explain to the nine-year-old what the development of the frontal lobe is. And I'm like, you know, because we were just talking about, I talk to my kids like they're kids, but I also talk to them like they're adults. I do the same. In that I lay things out and then I explain. So I lay things out like then I explain. So I lay things out like I'd lay to an adult. And then I'm like, your frontal lobe is a part of your brain that makes the decisions and it's not fully developed until you're 25 years old. And so

you see the little nine-year-old brain spinning. I go, it's not really ready yet. She's like, so it's like squishy brain. I go, exactly. Perfect nine-year-old vernacular. I like it. This is how she explained it to my wife. And then her and I had this little conversation about squishy brain. And I'm like, this is what the frontal lobe is. This is like when you see people that are young, they're doing stupid things. It's not even necessarily that they're stupid. They're just acting. They're wild.

You know, they're free. Their parents probably tell them what to do too much. The school tells them what to do too much. Their job tells them what to do too much. And then they're out to do too much. Their job tells them what to do too much. And then they're out, and they have a couple fucking Miller High lives in them, and they're like, fuck. Fuck the COVID. I don't give a fuck.

By the way, have you seen the coronavirus song yet? You posted it. I saw it. You need to see it. I watched it. You need to see it again. You need to see it again. Jamie, roll it.

We can't play it? No, no. No? Let's see. Poppy gets taken down. Do you really think so? Definitely. You need to respect other people's intellectual property. It wouldn't help. It wouldn't play it? No. No? That's the thing. The copy gets taken down. You really think so? Definitely. You need to respect other people's intellectual property.

It wouldn't help. It wouldn't help them? It's not how it works. But, I mean, is that on Spotify? Or even, do they have a label? They definitely could. I think they're comics. They could go on and take the video down.

I don't know. We're trying to help you guys. Sorry. Go to my Instagram. I was just going to say, that's where I saw it. Yeah. I might have watched it five or ten times. I'll play it if you want me to.

No, that's okay. You're right. I'm being an idiot. But the gentleman who made it, these guys, one of them reached out to me and I fucked up. It's Reggie Bay B-E-E-2. And then there's a fucking Reggie Bay B-E-E-2 underscore that's a fake account, those cunts. And so I accidentally tagged the fake account at first. I was going to say, that's how mistakes happen.

But now I got the real account. Well, it's just some fucking hoaxer who's pretended to be him. Which one's fake? The fake one is the one that has the underscore after the two. Oh, okay, okay. Those pieces of shit. How's your... That's the real dude.

Reggie Bay B-E-E-2. I mean, how's your wife think about what's going on? Um, she's not concerned about us. She's concerned about her mom, you know, which we should be. And I'm concerned about my parents as well. Uh, you know, and, uh, more concerned that people are freaking out and that, you know, there's a lot of people around us that have never been tested, and they're not good under stress. And this is a very unusual stress because there's no clear answer, not from the president, not from the doctors. No one has a real clear answer of how to fix this, when it's going to be fixed. And when you hear things about, like, a vaccine will be available in 18 months, you're like, what?

When you hear things about like a vaccine will be available in 18 months, you're like, what? Well, and if you continue reading, that says if it is available in 18 months, that would be three times faster than normal. Wow. So that would be on the very front leading edge of what would be possible to get into people's hands. Normal would be 3x that. And Osterholm, the guy who was on the podcast that really sparked a lot of people to take this very seriously. It was an excellent podcast, by the way. Yeah, he's amazing.

And he said that they could have had a coronavirus vaccine, that once SARS happened, SARS, which is also a coronavirus, they could have worked on developing a coronavirus vaccine then, and that we are far too flippant about how we approach these things. And if it's not there right in our face, they don't allocate resources towards those kind of things. I think our society is kind of defined by its excess and luxury. And when you live in that environment, and I'm not saying it negatively at all,

but if you live in that environment, if you never leave that environment, if you don't bend yourself before the world bends you a little bit, shit's going to come off the rails when you get pressed. Yeah. And that's where the behavior of people scares me far more than the actual virus itself. I mean, I have no control over if I get the virus and how that plays itself out for me. I cannot control that, but I can control my behavior

and how I act and try to exude calm, like when it comes to my kids or my family, my friends, and my social circle. I act and try to exude calm, like when it comes to my kids or my family, my friends and my social circle. But yeah, I wish, I hope that people on the other side of this, because it's not going to be the end of the world, but I hope on the other side, it gives them a greater understanding and appreciation and perspective of what we have, how lucky we are. And then just maybe to think about, you know, the people, what's the obesity rate in the U.S. right now? Very high. 40%? Yeah.

How about we work on that just a touch considering that's one of the highest risk factors, right? Instead of allowing that excess and luxury to define you, how about – That's something you can control, right? At all times. Yeah. You can't control whether or not you have a disease or whether or not you're old. But you certainly can control whether or not you're fat. you have a disease or whether or not you're old, but you certainly can control whether or not you're fat. The problem is people, in my experience, spend a lot of time, energy, and effort

focusing on things that they cannot control. And that is definitely one thing that I learned from my old job is that at some point you have to surrender the emotional and mental horsepower on the things that you can't control and only focus on the things that you can, which is specifically yourself. Like you can't control what happens to you, but you can control how you receive what happens to you. And being scared, allowing that to make the decision-making process for you is what gets people in substantial trouble. Like I'll give you an example from my old job. Getting shot at is not awesome. It's actually, it can be quite terrifying. getting shot at is not awesome. It's actually, it can be quite terrifying. And the number one rule of a firefight, if you get into a gunfight, is to win. But the first thing you need to do is you

need to shoot back with overwhelming fire superiority, and then you have to maneuver, right? So you have to pin your enemy in place, and then you have to maneuver. But let's say they, you get ambushed, and you're on the receiving end of that. And so you take a knee behind a wall, and bullets are snapping over your head, and you don't want to move because you're scared and you think I'm going to die. So you have fear of death, which is totally real and it can paralyze people. And instead of moving, you sit there and other people maneuver around you. That fear of death preventing you from doing the things that you had control over, shooting back, maneuvering, coordinating with your team, that fear paralyzes you and external circumstances or the enemy that you're fighting will maneuver around you and then

they're going to end up killing you. But the reason you didn't move is you allowed that emotion to take over your decision-making process. You have to detach the two. Jocko talks about it a lot. And it's just reinforced constantly in training and in operations overseas. And that'd be like, that's because people ask me like, what should I do? And my biggest thing is just try to remain as objective as possible. You see people freaking out. That doesn't mean that you need to freak out. And you know,

another way I've had it described to me that made a big influence on me and the way I think about things. If you think about two circles, like an archery target, but there's only two circles, there's a, the bowl, the 10 ring, which is super small. And then, God damn it, Dudley, where are you when I need you? What's the big ring? On the outside? Yeah, like a five. I guess. It goes 10, nine, eight, out. Whatever the lowest scoring ring is, that would be the other one. So you got two circles. And the big circle is your circle of concern. And the small circle is your circle of influence. is your circle of concern and the small circle is your circle of influence. I see and the dangerous thing that I see often is people spending all their time with their energy and effort on the circle of concern. What's going on in the stock market? What's going on on Fox News? What's going

on on CNN? Sharing back and forth things on Facebook that probably half of them aren't even true anyway. No research put into it. Is there going to be enough toilet paper? What do I do about this? And they don't have control over any of those things. But that's the stuff that they're worried about. And the only thing that you should spend your time, energy, and effort working on are the things directly inside of your circle of influence. And even inside of that one, there could be the circle of control.

And what do you have control over at all times? The things that come out of your mouth. How you behave. Whether or not you allow your emotions to override your decision-making process, the way that you communicate, whether or not you decide to work out as opposed to shoving 4,000 excess calories in your face every single day. If you focus on those things and put your time, energy, and effort in there, you're going to get through stressful situations just fine because you actually have more mental capacity because you're trimming off other things that you can't control. The thing about things that you can't control though, some people are, they're, they're thinking that this is one of those things that if

you were a paranoid person and you prepped and worried about the future, you would have already stockpiled enough food and toilet paper and ammo and all these different things so that you were ready for this. Whereas people that were just concentrating on day-to-day life didn't act, didn't think. It's probably a balance in between. I mean, is it reasonable for everybody to have five years of food at their house? I don't think so. I mean, that's basically military MREs and I hope you enjoy taking a shit every two weeks. You know, those things, man, you will shit the clay man.

Dude, those mountain ops. Oh my God. The last time I ate mountain ops, when I went on a hunt, the farts that were coming out of my body were some of the worst smells. I didn't know I could produce. And I know that they taste good. They do taste good. And I know it's good to have, you know, freeze dried or dehydrated meals. It's very lightweight. You can pack them out really easy. But Jesus Christ, what is happening internally? I lived 90 days one time purely on military MREs, which stands for meal ready to eat. It was the initial invasion of Iraq and that's all we had. And so there's a couple of versions, but there's a cold weather

version. And when I was in at least, it came in a white bag. It was for like Alpine cold weather operations. So it had more calories and it had more tasty things in there. And we had our hands on those, but you know, there's some good ones like beef stew was my favorite. I think it was meal number eight. And then there's some terrible ones. We called it like five fingers of death. It was hot dogs. And I don't know when or where these fucking things were made. But I mean your bulletproof vest could barely contain it if you were to throw it.

This is like eating a cylinder of titanium. They were disgusting and I can't recognize the meat source. And at first it was like, okay, I could eat the main meal. And then my appetite started going. And then, so there's crackers that come with it. So I could eat those because they'd come with like jelly or peanut butter or jam. And there's actually a full economic system inside of the military trading that shit. Like you can stock up on peanut butters and get some strawberry jam. And there's some pound cakes that are good. The lemon poppy seed pound cake is the best. I don't care what anybody says. And the longer it went, the less I could eat. And by the end of that, I was just

eating Skittles. It was all I could do. And then we get this care package right before we left Baghdad. And it was like a pallet of Girl Scout cookies. And like the entire unit, I mean, not everybody did this, but basically we were ineffective for 48 hours because guys' stomachs were so destroyed from eating all of the MREs. And you'd see guys just take a sleeve of Thin Mints and just baaah. And then it came with coffee too. And so guys are just laying on there because we were staying, you know, you'd think it's like this high speed, sexy stuff. We were staying in cots in a totally gunned-out airplane hangar at Baghdad. And there was pigeons flying over us and we would shoot them and they would spiral into people's beds and we would celebrate.

And guys are just laying in their racks just like – just shut down. Those MREs will fuck you up. Oh, God. And they're so calorically dense. Like you need to be drinking like eight gallons of water a day, and you're still going to be like, I haven't gone to the bathroom in four days. I think I might die.

Yeah, I always wondered. I mean, I was eating a can of sardines the other day. I was like, how can you keep fish fresh in a fucking tin? Is it the idea that there's no air in there? Is that all it is? Don't they cook it and put it in there right at the end of the cooking process? I guess. But then like, how's it in there? What the fuck's going on? How's it okay? I don't know. It's weird. But sardines are disgusting. So I

don't ever- I like them. See, that's in my circle of concern. I'm not worried about it. I like sardines and oysters. Do you ever have smoked oysters in a can? No, that sounds disgusting. Delicious. I like them. The latest addition to my diet is I started buying diced clams and adding it to clam chowder. That's about as controversial as I get with my... Are you a straight meat and potatoes guy? You're one of those fellows? I am not exploratory with my food at all. Well, you eat a lot of wild game. Well, yeah, but that's awesome. I have a lot of elk and a lot of deer, but I don't need to go into the sardine world. For some people,

that's exploratory. Well, I've stuck with it now for a few years. I would say, I'll put it like this. If I go to a foreign country, I'm looking for something that I recognize. I'm not interested in sampling the local cuisine. I've had some bad experiences. Is that why you're gun-shy? Like, if you go to Thailand? Thailand, so I've been to Thailand a bunch, and I love their cow pock guy, the chicken fried rice. I can eat the shit out of that.

That's it? But I'm not touching a balut. Yeah, balut's rough. We served that on Fear Factor. My Filipino friends were laughing. They were like, dude, that's a delicacy. Like, we love balut. Eat that little embryo.

Well, that's disgusting. So we were there. Apparently it's delicious. As a new guy, and they're like, dude, that's a delicacy. Like, we love Balut. Eat that little embryo. Well, that's disgusting. So we were there. Apparently it's delicious. As a new guy. And they're like, here's Baluts. You will eat these because we're hazing you. And it's like, awesome. Oh, they haze you?

They give you a delicacy? I don't think a fermented rotten egg. You just got to change your mindset. Is it fermented? Balut fermented? Oh, yeah. They bury those things. Is that the same thing?

Because there's the 100-year-old egg. These are not 100-year-old, but these are definitely buried fermented. Like when you're peeling off the egg, it's purple. Oh, see, that's weird because the balut that we serve was not like that. Maybe there's different ways to serve it because the purple stuff, that's that 100-year-old egg stuff. Maybe there's like fermented balut and then regular balut. I just started throwing up before I put it in my mouth so there's just disgusting and of course we weren't sober either so the the eggs that we serve people on fear factor we

were serving them hundred-year-old egg that was the other thing that we served they're not really a hundred-year-old egg it's just an expression but it's uh that is the I think the idea is that they cook them and then they bury them in the ground or something like that. And the gelatinous outer area that used to be the white of the egg is like this black jelly. It's like black jelly. Yeah. So we should put that in our mouth. That sounds great. But see, Chinese people love it. There's a lot of people that actually enjoy it. Apparently the most disgusting food, and this is coming from the late, great Anthony Bourdain, that he ever tried was fermented shark from Iceland.

He said there are no words to describe the putrid, disgusting smell and taste. And he's like he couldn't imagine that people would ever acquire a taste for this. And it's a fermented shark. And he said, I don't remember what the history of eating those things are. I mean, it must have come from some time of great famine where this is the only thing they had. I've had shark before. Not fermented. I enjoyed shark when I was growing up, actually.

What the fuck happened where you're not supposed to kill sharks? Like now if you catch a shark, people think you're a monster. It's like shooting a baby deer. I'm not a fan of the man in the gray wetsuit. I've spent enough time in the water. I don't. I just. No.

Stay away. I'm not a fan either. And I watched that movie the other day with my family. What is the new 47 meters down or something like that? There's a couple of versions. Well, I don't know if that, but there's the Sharknado. There's the. That one's ridiculous.

Yeah. This one is more like a shark. This one's more less ridiculous. Yes. It's a bunch of hot girls in bikinis that go cave diving and they find blind sharks that live deep in the caves and then they get a spoiler alert. Some people get fucked up. Here's an idea. Don't go cave diving.

Just stay out of the water. I'm not interested in cave diving. I'm not a fan of the water anymore at all. Anymore? Were you ever a fan? I mean, I grew up in Santa Cruz. Were you a surfer? Doing junior lifeguards. I mean, I surfed. I wouldn't call myself a surfer. I could like stand up and fall over on a board. Right. It's like if you've

gone fishing twice, you're not a fisherman. No, but I grew up on the beach in my summers and did junior lifeguards. And then you go get tortured with water and spend an immense amount of time in water. And you're like, I'm completely good. I don't want to ever go in here voluntarily again. Good call. Yeah. Yeah.

Water's weird. It's like I enjoy the fact that it's real. I like the fact that there's like there's an alternative world that's connected to us. I have snorkeled several times, and I enjoyed it for brief periods of time, but I'm always very relieved when I get out of the water. How deep was the water? Imagine you snorkeling in like three to four feet of water. No, we were probably 12, 12, 15. Not that deep, though.

Yeah. I was with Dudley and my family. Oh, you guys were in Lanai, weren't you? Yeah, yeah, yeah. We were in Lanai. We went snorkeling. It's fun. It's kind of cool.

You see some turtles and shit and some fish. Not that many fish. That's what was kind of weird. You know, like you would think, oh, there's a whole world down there. Yeah, but why would the fuck they be by the people? Why would these fish be hanging around while these assholes are peeing? I get it. You know?

Yeah. The ocean's another one, too.eing? I get it. You know? Yeah. The ocean's another one, too. You've got to surrender a little bit. Yeah. I mean, you've got no control over that sucker. And you can try to control it. I've watched people try to control it, and they just get crushed. Yeah, and if you see something, you know, see something underwater, like, you're basically at its mercy.

It's like if you were in a wheelchair. Oh, it gets better. It gets better than that. Yeah. So imagine doing dives in water that has, you know, the phosphorescence. So when things move through it, it'll light up. Close. Yeah. And you're always with the dive buddy and we'll do a lot of closed circuit diving. So you're rebreathing oxygen. You purge your body of the, what is it? Carbon

dioxide. And you have a chemical scrubber that scrubs out the carbon dioxide. So it goes in one side and it goes through this loop, so there's no bubbles. You can stay underwater for a long time. I think you talked with Trevor about it a little bit, the stuff he was diving. So you're with the dive buddy, and we'll do, or they will still do now, like long-distance underwater navigation. And you would think there's some high-speed computer. You have a depth gauge, a stopwatch and a compass.

And that's your entertainment for the sometimes four hours that you're underwater. Jesus Christ. Mind you, only one of the two people is holding this. The other person has zero entertainment for that time period because you're just along for the ride as the buddy. So you're holding onto their elbow to pinch them to make sure you're still there. But most of the time, like if you're the driver, the person navigating, your buddy will stay on one side of you. And you know that you're there because they'll check in every once in a while and squeeze your elbow. And I had on more

than one occasion, diving in the dark, weird noises under there because with a rebreather, you don't have the as you exhale. So you can hear the crackling and the eating and boats come over your head. It sounds like you're going to die at any time. And perhaps I have an overactive imagination. I'm just, you know, I've watched Jaws too many times. So I'm sitting there trying to navigate and then just thinking like, oh my God, we're going to get eaten by a shark. But my buddy is on my right-hand side and you'll get slammed by something on your left and you'll just see it go off in the phosphorescence. The question is, do you look or do you just keep your head down and keep going? What do you do?

I just kept my head down and kept going. Because you can't do anything if you look. I couldn't do anything. And if I had looked and I had been a shark, I would have probably killed myself just doing a nuclear submarine porpoising out of the water. So what do you think it was? Probably a sea lion or a dolphin, or it could have even damn near been a shark. But it happened to me on more than one occasion and to more guys than you would think.

You're just under there and something bumps into you and you know it's on the opposite side of your dive buddy. It is not an awesome experience. How many guys get lost to sharks doing that? I don't know of anybody in the seal community who has been lost due to a shark attack. That's amazing. Isn't that amazing? Well, I mean, the stats are on your side. Yeah, but still, you would think one guy, like, I know guys

have been struck by lightning. I wonder what your odds are lightning strike versus shark attack. I bet it's way higher lightning strike if you're outside than if you're in the water. I know of them canceling dives because there was shark activity in the area. But I don't know of a single guy who's actually had an interaction where they got bit. Wow.

That's pretty impressive. I would imagine there would be a few losses over the years. Well, if you think, like most of the diving I did down in San Diego, you're not diving out in the ocean. You're diving in the bay. Like you're going in shallower water. You're in and around the piers. And I'm not an expert on sharks by any stretch. So I don't know.

I don't think that's necessarily their natural habitat. I think they might be farther out. Dude, they're out right off of Malibu. They didn't even realize how many of them there were until people started flying drones. So they fly these drones like a couple hundred yards off of people surfing. And there they are. And there's fucking great whites swimming around. And you're like, what?

Ocean will fuck you up. You have no control over that. And again, so in that moment, you're like, I had these conversations with myself. You just get slammed and you see it out of the corner of your eye. It's like, yeah, that didn't happen. Let's just keep going. Four hours. That's about the longest I've been underwater yet.

Exhaustion dive on a Draeger. In those rebreathers, some people have episodes of epilepsy or of seizures when they use those rebreathers. Oxygen toxicity is an issue. And then because of the chemical scrubber, of course the chemical scrubber reacts negatively to water. So we should put it in a container and then submerse it in the water under pressure. Oh, Jesus. And it's held on by a hand-tightened screw. Oh, God damn.

It's crazy that it works. It works really, really well until it doesn't. And you see people do the nuclear submarine out of the water ripping their mouthpiece out because it's called a caustic cocktail. Oh. There's one-way valves in each of the hoses. So the loop has to be correct and continuous. So when you exhale, it needs to go into the scrubber. And then when you inhale, it needs to come because if there was no one way valve, you know what I mean? The oxygen would flow through the system without being able to recharge. Cause if you inhale enough, it'll give you another hit of pure oxygen and it can

continue that cycle. But so it, the canister will hit of pure oxygen and it can continue that cycle. But so the canister will start to fill up and you can hear it too. Like after every dive, you maintain your own gear, but you'll dump out the canister and the chemical, it'll turn, at least the stuff that I was using when I was in, it'll turn like a purplish color as the effectiveness is starting to reduce. You can actually do more than one dive with it because you open the containerplish color as the effectiveness is starting to reduce. You can actually do more than one dive with it because you open the container up and you make sure that the chemicals are OK. And then you tilt it over. And on every dive, water starts coming out of it. And you can hear it on dives too. It will start gurgling a little bit as you're inhaling.

Oh, no. Oh, it's – and again, you can spend time worrying about that or you can just drive on and deal with – if it becomes an issue, you can deal with it at that time. What do you do if it becomes an issue? You have to get to the surface. And then what do you do? You got to get fresh air. You need to wash your mouth out. You need to get to a higher level of care. So if you are two hours into a four-hour swim with a rebreather and you pop your head off the surface and you're gagging, what do you do?

There's always a safety ratio in those training evolutions. So you're going to have a diving supervisor. While everybody's underwater, you're going to have a pretty robust network of people that are up there for safety. So the dive has been planned. You've probably already coordinated with, you know, where the nearest chamber is. You've notified the chamber that you're diving. So if you have a pressure-related issue, you know where the nearest chamber is. You've notified the chamber that you're diving. So if you have a pressure-related issue, you know where the nearest hospital is. You have a primary, secondary, and tertiary medical plan.

And I think – I forget what it was, but I think it was one dive soup per maybe four dive pairs. And you dive with buoys in training. So there's boats that are up top that are not only are they there to help in case an emergency would come up, but you know, boats don't see those little buoys because it's just a little orange buoy traveling along. And at nighttime you put, you know, chem light glow sticks on them, which nobody is looking for. So boats are up there to basically push other boats away. So you'll get up there and you literally just, you know, you wave your hand and the boat will come over and they're going to get you to a corpsman, which is, you know, the medical personnel on the Navy side of the house. And they're going

to start treating you right there. But the chemical, the cost of cocktails are gnarly. I mean, guys will just come up projectile vomiting. It doesn't happen that often, but every dive you dip, you dip that thing over and the water starts coming out of it. Oh yeah. Jesus Christ. It's just crazy that it does work, that you can breathe underwater with no bubbles. It works well. It works really well. Most of the time, you're limited by the amount of oxygen in the cylinder, not the effectiveness of the chemical scrubber itself. How long is it supposed to last for?

I do not know off the top of my head, but an exhaustion dive on a dragger, for me, you could go somewhere between three and a half to four hours. Wow. Which is just, it's mind numbing. That's crazy. You could just breathe into that thing. It's super quiet. The only noise that it makes is when you have a demand valve that kicks in, it'll give you

a hit of that pure oxygen. That's what it sounds like. And then other than that, that's what I'm saying. You can hear so much more. You hear all the crustaceans down there and all the clicking. You can sneak up on animals because you're not making as much noise. It seems like it would be a good thing to wear if you were scuba diving or you were spearfishing, rather. It's limited by the depth because if you take oxygen down to depth, that's where you're going to get the O2 toxicity issues.

So on those dives, we're talking 20 feet to the surface is where you need to stay. Oh, that's it. Oh. Yeah, fuck that. It Yeah. Oh. Yeah. Fuck that. It won't work. No. Unless there's awesome spearfishing at 20 feet.

I heard spearfishing is the shit. Everybody that's done it says it's amazing. It's like hunting underwater. I'll never be able to tell you because I'm not going to voluntarily go in the fucking water. Well, it's understandable. You did your time. Dude, I didn't know.

I was listening to your podcast. I didn't know that you were involved in the rescue of Jessica Lynch. That was the second target that we hit in the first invasion of Iraq. That's crazy. It was an odd series of events. We went over there. I had just finished the selection process for the East Coast Command, and they actually – there are, what would be the best way to describe it? There are multiple squadrons inside of that command, all tasked with, they all have the same skill set,

but you need multiple, so one can be on deployment while another one is training and the other one is resting. You want to get into a rotation cycle. So at the end of selection, an X number of people get partitioned off to each one of those. And it takes time to get up to speed because the selection tactics and the way that you train are, they're good, but you get better as you were working with the guys with more experience, specifically the real world experience. And so they pulled us out of selection about a month early and sent us over to augment the Karzai detail in Afghanistan at the very tail end. I mean, nothing happened.

We basically, you know, you're a deterrent at that point. And it's one of the worst missions because you can't – it's very reactive security detail stuff. You can't really do anything until somebody else does something. So you're already behind the power curve. It's my least favorite mission set, I think. But we came back from that and then the intel started kicking off for Iraq and they sent us over to Saudi Arabia. And we were there for probably somewhere between seven to ten days. That's where I watched Bush give the speech.

You know, Saddam Hussein has, I think it was 24 hours to comply or turn himself in, whatever it was. And we had already taken a look at – we knew before going over there that there were two or three objectives that we were going to look at. So we had already basically planned missions that we were going to do. While we were in Virginia Beach, we were planning for stuff in Iraq. So we continued the planning in Saudi Arabia. And the number one – the first target we hit was the number one chem bio target in Iraq. So to do that, you have to get all your shit on. It's called MOP gear, mission-oriented protective posture. It's like a chemical chem bio suit, gas mask,

which compounds a lot of stuff. You have all your normal shit on anyway. Like there's guys carrying quickie saws in a hazmat suit with a gas mask on breathing through a blower on their back overworking the blower. And it's amazing how close to suffocation I've actually come inside of those gas masks. It's the worst feeling ever. Like you're sucking so hard for air that the mask is like sticking up against your face. Because you're not supposed to be physically exerting yourself while you're wearing that thing? Is that the idea? It's harder. It'd be like putting a, because there's a canister on the side. And how much weight are you carrying around? In those days, it was probably body weight plus 8,200 pounds.

Jesus Christ. That was about average. And it trimmed down after that because the actual amount of real world experience at that time was low and it drastically increased. So you'd be like, you know, I think I need this pocket. And then you wouldn't need it for a month. I need to get rid of this goddamn pocket because it carries sweat. Like backpack hunters, same kind of thing. Oh, yeah.

The gear that I wore towards the end was substantially different than the gear that I wore towards the beginning. I trimmed, I mean, I think I probably had 10 magazines on me, like that first target. I think the last deployment I did, I would carry four, four and one in the gun and no pistol. So things changed over time. Just for weight.

Just for weight and for ability to move, because then I would need less food and I would need less water and I'd actually be mobile. But on this target, so it was a four-hour helicopter ride in. We're sitting there. We have all of our mop gear on but not our masks. And we're doing a mid-air refuel on a C-130. So you had a 47 double, you know, the big double – not propellers.

It would be rotor blades on top of the helicopter. They're hooked up next to a C-130 in-flight refueling. Missile goes underneath. The C-130 is like, see you boys later. Bombs out. And it like – So the C-130 bailed when the missile flew under? Oh, fuck yeah.

I don't blame them for that either. They're literally a flying fuel tank. But I think they had gotten enough gas. And we had to hit the tanker on the way back as well. So you're just sitting there waiting for three and a half, three and three-quarter hours. And about ten minutes out, you start getting your gas mask and stuff on because you've got to stuff the drape. And night vision goggles. Have you ever looked through a pair of night vision goggles?

Yeah. Your field of view sucks. It's terrible. It's weird. Which is why you notice when people are actually using them, they will all constantly have movement in their head because they're increasing their field of view and up and down. And that's when you can orient them to a good offset to your eye. Now imagine putting a gas mask in between your eye and the lens of the night vision goggle. Oh, Jesus. So you're taking already a limited field of view and putting it into a soda straw. So, and mind you, this is the first combat target I've ever been on. So, and you're

18. Oh, no, no. 22? No, I went through. How old are you? Me, 42. I was in my, at the time, this was in 2003. It was 25. Okay. 25. But you, you enlisted when you were really young, 17? 17, junior in high school. I signed the paperwork when I was a junior in high school. You still got to graduate and then continue on. But I was in like the third or fourth 47 that went in. So you finally get all your stuff on and you have a blower on your back. So there's ways that you can help the canister. If you just have the canister on your mask, it's a lot like breathing through a few straws shoved in your mouth.

If you maintain a low enough heart rate and you're totally chill, you're fine. But as your heart rate goes up and your demand, you know, for oxygen goes up, you're really limited. So they have, you know, you can put them on your back. It's a blower. It's a battery powered blower that will basically push air into the mask. And it gives you, I would say more buffer space. It's like almost like a positive pressure. And if you're not doing much, it's actually really nice. It's just jamming air down your face. And it works well unless you put your weapon sling over the top of that tube, which is exactly what I did, which was awesome. Oh, it was great. I had a great first experience. I lost my nods on my first target ever. I went back and got them, but it was a fucking shit show.

What's nods? Night vision goggles. Oh, okay. Things that you need to see at night and we'll get in trouble for if you lose. It was terrible. So we come in, number one chem biotarget in Iraq. And we had looked at it from the perspective of like air conditioning specialists and from architects to what we could encounter on the ground, potential threats, satellite imagery of historical stuff. And we get there. And by the time I even got on the ground there was already a firefight going on the helicopter that i was in had 27 rounds come through the helicopter not a single person was hurt like guys are like reaching up to like scratch their ass and like a round would come

through and dismiss everybody jesus christ well i take that back uh the door gunner standing next to me got shot right in the head and about a minute out that was my first exposure to combat just over and helicopter lands and you go and by the time i got to the front door of that structure i was probably as close to being unconscious due to asphyxiation as i often am doing jiu-jitsu getting choked out like the world is just coming down. And instantaneously we could tell that it was an agricultural school. Like the intelligence was so horribly and incredibly off when it came to that. So I just ripped my mask off at some point

because I would have rather died from whatever horrendous disease could have been in there than suffocate. And then, you know, we cleared through it and I knocked my night vision goggles off with a sledgehammer and I had to go back. It was a shit show. So we get back from that. The next morning we wake up and I knocked my night vision goggles off with a sledgehammer. I had to go back. It was a shit show. So we get back from that.

The next morning we wake up and I remember having a cup of coffee with a buddy of mine. I was like, hey, man, I don't think we're going to get out of this if things keep going like they did last night. And shortly after that, a few days after that, we got word that Jessica had been captured. So we forward staged and went up to Nazaria. And the information that we had going into the hospital is that it was a fedayeen hotbed, like 50 to 500 people was the expected amount of resistance that we could have.

And we could fit 27 people in the helicopter. So that's what we launched with in the back of our head. And fortunately, we didn't meet any resistance inside of the helicopter. So that's what we launched with in the back of our head. And fortunately, we didn't meet any resistance inside of the structure. And it actually was kind of business as usual, looking back, like there was nothing exciting about that target whatsoever. People in the modern day, if they were to action that target now with the experience that they have, they wouldn't even register on the radar scope. The amount, the little amount of resistance that was encountered outside of it just would be another day at the office.

There was a public story of that. And then there was a lot of dispute about whether or not that was accurate. There was a, like, I remember she actually took some heat. She cleared up a lot of it. She, well, she was not responsible for a lot of the things that were said because she was deep into the repatriation process into i mean her she's fucked up to this day when i met sat down i probably get to sit across the table she had never sat down and talked to somebody who was there it was when did you meet

her i went had again yeah i had her on your podcast when uh it was one of the earlier episodes i went where she didn't listen though i didn't even know you had her on so she told her side of the story i told my side of the story and we were able side of the story. And we were able to like fill in the gaps. And we sat across the table just like this. And she still wears a brace. She came and gave me a huge hug. I mean, I didn't know what to expect. What happened to her physically?

Man, I don't have the exact details. But from my understanding, the vast majority of her injuries came from when her Humvee wrecked. I do not believe she was buckled or strapped in. So she got just pounded and she was not treated well. You know, it's guys are going to get the same. I mean, bottom line, you're going to get raped if you're a male or a female. Really? Oh, yeah, for sure.

And you get captured. Oh, yeah, you're going to for sure. If you're a male or a female. Really? Oh, yeah, for sure. If you get captured? Oh, yeah. You're going to for sure. If you're a male or a female? If you're a male or a female, you're not going to have a good go of it for sure. And, again, I'm not an exact expert on what happened specifically with her. But from my understanding, she experienced that as well as all the other medical issues. But when we – she was in bad shape when we pulled her out of the hospital for sure. But then, so, and I remember

there were two people with us that were carrying video cameras and there was a little bit of footage that was taken from that, like when she was in the hospital bed in the hospital and a lot of the rest of it was from the cameras on the helicopters and some – the sensors overhead. But the narrative from that, not a word was said by anybody that was there executing that objective or from her. And I think my hypothesis is we were a month into that war. A lot of that war was based on we need to go rid this country and this dictator of their WMDs. We hadn't found any from a PR perspective wise, it wasn't probably going as well as they wanted it to do. And they wanted to have a PR victory,

but the stuff that was said, the stuff that made the news, all this stuff that got blown out of proportion, none of that came from the people that were actually there. It came from all the layers on top. What was blown up? Because I'm trying to remember. I remember some of the first reports, they were saying that she was going to be the first female Medal of Honor recipient, that she had fought until she had her, you know, she expended her last round and then was finally overtaken. And you talked to her and she never even loaded her weapon. Her weapon jammed.

She never said that she fought. You know what I mean? I remember people talking about it. She never said any of that. So who do you think was doing that? Was that the government's PR? I think people are often in a rush to talk in an educated manner about things they know nothing about. I mean, it takes time to understand the details of what happened. She was not in a head

space to give a debrief. You know, she was literally being flown probably to Germany for her first round of countless surgeries. And she's going to need to spend time with a therapist and a counselor. I would assume she would. Obviously, I can't speak for her. But they're going to want to do a robust medical treatment. And that's really not the time to dive into the details of her exact actions. And we left the next morning and flew into Baghdad like three days later. It was just another day on the job and you were off and running you just had it was cool because uh it was the first rescue uh US POW since World War II and so the rescue of her was she was rescued from the hospital correct and so they had abused her and then taken her to a hospital I get a little grainy on the details of what happened in between

the wreck and when we picked her up because there are conflicting narratives. There are, I don't know what the correct word would be, stories or there are reports that they attempted to put her into an ambulance and bring her back to U.S. forces. But at that same time, the Fedayeen were using ambulances as basically military fighting vehicles. So they said that when they tried to do that, the ambulance was shot at, which makes sense if there was a trend of people using an ambulance as a military vehicle, that would make sense and they would get turned around. So they might've tried to bring her back. You know, that hospital was being used as a fed-a-ine staging point because they're, I mean, they're not dumb people. They understand we're not going to likely bomb hospitals or religious structures. So use them to their military advantage.

Wow. Wow. And this is your second real. Yep. Wow. Crazy. I mean, that story was a giant story in the media about the war and people trying to sort out what was true versus what was the publicity narrative. I would say on average take 90% of what you hear off the top.

90%. Yeah, it was interesting for me when I was listening to you talk with Trevor. People are super fascinated by war and combat and I wish they wouldn't be because it's not fascinating. It's actually really simple most often. You're not out there reinventing the wheel. You're doing the simplest of tactics that you can because they're almost always effective. You can build complexity, but you have to have a mastery of the simple first. It's not a crazy, unique experience.

It doesn't give you any insight or special powers i mean it just doesn't make you unique it's just a it's a bizarre occupation but it's not to me at least it's not fascinating and i wish other people were less fascinated by it because then they would be less likely to be taken advantage of by people who are snake oil salesmen how so like what way i mean you ever heard of stolen valor yeah and the shit that people try to pull when it goes that route and it's enticing in a wartime environment. You know, the vast majority of the military doesn't see combat. I think 15% or less actually engages in direct combat. But you go to a bar and it's like, oh, man, there's a lot of combat vets in here.

Like, every single person in the military is telling war stories. You know what I mean? Like every single person in the military is telling war stories. You know what I mean? And that is to a degree I would say harmless unless you start attaching your identity to that and you start leveraging people's fascination. You know, oh, look at this person. Look what he did. Let's have a relationship with that person.

Let's give this person this. And then they start, you know, to me, the biggest threat to the veteran community is veterans themselves getting so tied to an occupation. Instead of trying to figure out who they are, they get stuck in the rearview mirror looking at what they used to do. You know, because it is what you used to do. It's not who you are. And people who can't disconnect those two things, I think that they struggle. And you see guys looking for handouts. And then, you know, the more that you can create this dossier of who you are, it's amazing. I mean it opens doors.

It really does. My background is 100% a two-sided knife. It will open doors. And some of them I'm not qualified to walk through. But they will open it because of what they think or are fascinated by what I used to do. Well, it's fascinating for people because they're never going to experience it. That's good. They shouldn't. I hope they never have to. Right. But it's still, I mean, you understand why that would be compelling to at least try to understand it or process it in your mind for someone who isn't going to experience it. Like for me, like when me, when I talked to you or if I talk to Jocko or anybody that's had a lot of experience, I am fascinated.

And I can understand why it would be something that you would want people to not be fascinated by. But for someone on the outside looking in, like I want to know what that's – because the only experience that we can sort of absorb is film. Like we could either watch Restrepo or watch – you know what I'm saying? We talked about this last time I was on. It's the only thing that – And again, strip 90 percent off the top. Yeah, I'm sure. They're terrible.

Yeah. Yeah. But at the same time, other than a pure documentary, films are there to make money. They're there to put butts in seats. So I get it. They're in this tug of war between entertainment and authenticity. And I have a limited exposure to working in the entertainment world on the technical advising house.

And if there is a struggle often between entertainment and authenticity, authenticity loses because it's not that fascinating. It's slower than people think. It's quieter than people think. Isn't that the case with every single subject that they try to capture in film? Probably. Yeah. I mean, it's basically everything.

Yeah. From romance to fighting to everything. It's like it's a bullshit version of it. I mean, I think that's one of the reasons why so many people have these weird expectations of relationships. They watch too many Ryan Reynolds movies and they really think that this is how it's supposed to go down. The notebook? I mean, these movies are really essentially what people use as a guideline for what the ideal relationship is. Instead of a really good relationship that you're aware of that actually exists.

Yeah. I think people should use caution on anything that they see on a screen of any size, whether it's from iPhone to iMacs, just strip 90% off the top. Well, especially a screen where people are literally pretending. Yes. They're pretending to be at war. Meanwhile, there's fucking camera guys there

and actors and any cut. Good job. Okay, we're going to have to touch up the blood. Get him more blood. Let's spray some sweat on him. Yeah, they're talking to the VFX dude. Okay, we'll get have to touch up the blood. Get him more blood. Let's spray some sweat on him. Yeah, they're talking to the VFX dude. Okay, we'll get that explosion in the background. Give me an aircraft carrier going this way.

Yeah, I mean, how could you ever make that authentic? I think Trevor and I were talking about Saving Private Ryan and the storm in the beach at Normandy. It was probably the only scene ever in a movie that accurately represents what it must have been like at that time. Or close to. Some of them get it right, like snippets. I actually think we talked about this last time too briefly. Like Black Hawk Down gets a little bit right. You can get an understanding of like the confusion, the sense of losing utter and complete control, not knowing what to do next, having limited information, having to make decisions on limited information,

having to make decisions where somebody might live and others might die. Like you can get snippets of that, but I don't think there's any one film or TV show that captures it really accurately. Well, it's weird to me, too, when there's someone who you know, like Marky Mark. Like here's Marky Mark. He's in the movie. It's Mark Wahlberg. It's Tidy Whitey Boy. But it's Mark Wahlberg.

It's not Marcus Luttrell. Yeah. Like I know Marcus. That's not Marcus. Yep. That's Mark Wahlberg. It's not Marcus Luttrell. Yeah. Like, I know Marcus. That's not Marcus. Yep. That's Mark Wahlberg. Yeah. But he's playing Marcus.

So it's like, wow, this is weird. That's weird. That's inescapably weird when there's a person who's like a super famous guy like Mark Wahlberg who's been in a fucking million movies, but he's playing someone else. But you know it's Mark Wahlberg. Yeah. So there's this weird sort of thing you're supposed to do. You know, there's this suspension of disbelief that you have in every movie.

But look, it's got to be the weirdest fucking thing ever to see someone who you know play you in a movie. I think I would just skip that whole process and be like, hey, let me know how it goes. Just don't even watch it? I think it would be, for me, I'd be like – first off, nobody's ever written a book or movie about my life because, again, exceptionally average military career-wise. If they did, I would say you go have fun and I'll let you know what I think of it. I wouldn't want to be involved in that at all. Yeah.

So. Yeah. I think that's a good call. Yeah, I think that's a good call. The whole famous guy playing someone else thing has got to be so fucking strange. If you're that person, if you have an – like Jessica Lynch. If they did the Jessica Lynch story and Scarlett Johansson played Jessica Lynch, she'd probably be like, what in the fuck is going on?

That's the – That'd be a mind fuck for sure. Yeah. Yeah. That's Scarlett Joh'd be a mind fuck for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Well, that's Scarlett Johansson. That's not me. What? Bitch, I never said that. That is not how it went down.

What the fuck did they do to my story? Authenticity versus entertainment. Yeah. I mean, that's just how it goes in every movie. Yeah. It's just Foxcatcher is a perfect example of that. I've used that example many, many times. What's that one about?

Mark and David Schultz documentary or film. It's with Steve Carell. And who plays that handsome fella? Channing Tatum. Channing Tatum. Another one of them super handsome fellas. He is a handsome man. Plays Mark Schultz, who was one of the greatest wrestlers

America ever produced. And his brother Dave Schultz, who was one of the greatest wrestlers America ever produced. And his brother Dave Schultz, another equally impressive wrestler. Just top of the food chain, world champion wrestlers. And the movie just distorted everything. Just twisted up everything about their career. And did they even need to? No. Here's the one example that I always use, and I'm sorry if you've heard this before, but the fucking end of the film, Mark Schultz in the movie has a UFC fight.

And in the real world, he had a UFC fight against Big Daddy Goodrich. Big Daddy Goodrich is a pioneer of MMA, a famous fighter in the world of fighting. I mean, he's a legend, right? And Mark Schultz mounted him and beat his ass. I mean, he's just a top of the food chain Olympic gold medalist wrestler. Just took him down at will. Just what you would expect. Yeah. And never fought again because he had a wrestling contract.

He was coaching, I believe, at Brigham Young. And they didn't want him to do it. This is back in the early days of the UFC, too. It was bare knuckle, the whole deal. But in the movie, he fights a Russian guy. Why do you have him fight a Russian guy when he fought Big Daddy Goodrich? Gary Goodrich is a famous fighter. Who makes that call?

Some fucking asshole. Because in the world, I'm watching it, and I'm like, that's not who he fought. Why did you change it? Why did you change it when you could have just had a guy play Big Daddy Goodrich? Yeah. And then have been like, oh, that's the guy playing Big Daddy Goodrich. Okay. At least they're not fucking me.

But when I see this Russian guy standing there and then Mark Schultz gets into the cage to fight this Russian man, I'm like, what are you doing? Why'd you do that? Why did you change history? Did it ruin the movie for you? Everything ruined the movie for me. Okay. So many things ruined.

So it was ruined before then, but you stuck it out. Well, Steve Carell was excellent, and Channing Tatum was excellent, too. It was good acting in the movie, but I knew that a lot of what they were portraying was not accurate. You know, they were making it look like Mark Schultz was, like, down on his luck and not doing well as a wrestler. He was dominating. He was a fucking stud. And then at the end of it, they just took so much license for entertainment to twist up this real-world event.

It's a real thing that happened. I mean, that guy, what the fuck was his name? DuPont did shoot Dave Schultz. He really did shoot him and murder him. He really was a fucking crazy man. And Steve Carell did a great job of playing that guy. But they did so much Hollywood fuckery to a real story. And that sucks because if people, like if I watched that, I wouldn't know the backstory.

I would assume that that would be an accurate portrayal of the history of it. And it would change the course of at least what I thought about it. Yes. There was a lot of weird stuff too. They made it look like they were doing coke and they insinuated some freaky sexual stuff. It was like there's a lot of weirdness in that movie. We were like, why are you doing this? But this is just Hollywood, man.

This is just what producers do. They think they know better and they want to make something exciting. And so they fuck with reality to turn it into a based on an historical event or based on a real world story. How you just described how you feel about those type of movies is exactly how I feel about them. Just a different genre. Yeah. Oh, I'm sure. I mean, but even more insane, right?

Because it's war, which is the highest stakes that anybody can, I mean, when you come to, if you're involved in any very intense, difficult encounter, I think war is the highest stakes, the highest level of all those things. In terms of time and the time it takes to achieve the end state, for sure.

Well, and also the results. Like what is happening? Well, it's people trying to kill other people. They're trying to kill you. You're trying to kill them. You're trying to achieve a result. And then the consequences of failure are devastating. Yeah, they're drastic.

Yeah. But, you know, it allows you, you can take those experiences and do amazing positive things with them. And Jocko is an example that I would point to with that. Not everything that happens in the military applies to the civilian world. You just can't take a lot of the things that the military does and apply them. But some of the things you can do are the leadership lessons, which Jocko does. But some of the things you can do are the leadership lessons, which Jocko does. I mean he's freaking amazing at it, at taking those lessons and applying them and talking about them in manners that people can adapt them.

But not all the experiences are that way. But we should, I think, because people are fascinated with it, take what can improve society. And so we don't have to relearn the lessons because, you know, I can't speak for Jocko, obviously, but the things that he learned and he talked about in his books or continues to talk about, those were taught to all of us inside of the military. And then somebody taught the person who taught us, like those have been passed along. We need to spread the word a little bit farther and wider. And that's what I'm saying. It opens some doors and we're qualified or I'm qualified to go in that door but in other doors I'm not qualified to go into mmm but if they're all open and you have your choice you know you can get yourself in trouble but

I mean Jocko was one of the he's an example that I point to all the time of somebody who is taking those lessons that people are fascinated by and recapsulating them in terms that they can apply in their everyday life. Yeah. There's certain human beings like him that are their fuel. Like you, you can go to him and it'll change your state. Like you could go to Jocko's Instagram page and watch one of his videos and it'll enact a physical change in your state and it'll go, fuck it. I'm going to the gym. And you literally will go do something i'm getting my shit together i go the opposite i see his watch i'm gonna get

the fuck out of my screen i want to start a hashtag like up at a reasonable hour i just want to fuck with it for like a week i was i was i would like wake up at 4 20 and like hashtag up before jocko people got pissed and they didn't realize that we know each other. Like I want to write a book, you know, instead of extreme ownership, it's like extremely limited ownership. You know, there's no bad leaders, only bad teams would be chapter one. Oh, that's hilarious. And just go the other direction.

There's no bad audiences, only bad comedians. Yeah. Yeah. I think Jocko is, it's interesting that people would get mad at you because he does have this profound effect on people. They're willing to defend him. But that's also you reading comments. You shouldn't be reading those. Sometimes I have idle time.

I don't make good decisions always. Go to YouTube. Watch a fun video. Cats or something. YouTube comments. Well, that's – is that the worst of the worst? Yeah, that's the bottom of the pit because you gotta realize who's leaving YouTube comments. You think Michael Jordan's out there

leaving YouTube comments? No. Does LeBron James take time between practices and leave YouTube comments? Probably not. No, it's failures for the most part. It's people with time or people that are at work and fucking hate their job and they have free time where they can just leave comments.

And this is one of the reasons why so many of them are toxic. Super judgy. I'm just basing it on what I believe to be fact. I mean, there's reasonable comments. I've actually like there's some like technology is something I'm very fascinated by. And I'll go to a technology YouTube page and watch like someone doing a review of, say, a new Linux laptop. And then I'll go into the comments. There's no negativity. It's all nerds just talking about different builds and what they do for the kernels and

this and that and how they break this down and restore that. And it's different. It's like for them, it's like this is just an area of expertise and fascination. Yeah. But when it comes to social things, though. Oh, boy. That's when things get wacky. When it comes to political things, that's the grossest of the gross.

Right? Anything involving MAGA, like just – you're not going to learn anything from that. You're just going to – It gets a little Western in the comments for sure Oh, it's just mutations. It's just yeah, and this part of that. It's like these natural systems Like this too much comfort too much idle time not enough Stimulation not enough adversity not enough accomplishment. And unfettered access to information. Yes, and bitterness and angry and a keyboard that works.

And there they go, off to the races, just typing, fucking spewing out hate. I'll read it every now and then, not mine, but I'll read other people's just to see what the fuck people are up to. And it's disturbing as shit, man. What's crazy to me is when I see people responding in the comments to toxicity, like, what do you think? You're going to change people's minds? And what it actually does is let people know that you are paying attention.

So it increases the toxicity. In my experience from what I've seen, they're like, oh, he took the time to read the comment and reply. Game on. Yeah. Game on. Yeah. It's not good.

Well, you're dealing with a specific type of person, the type of person that's willing to leave a comment on the YouTube page. And it's just the overall... I can't say I've never left one. You've left them? I have left a comment on a YouTube page from time... Like in my earlier days. Oh, when you were young? Yeah, it was like last year. Mean stuff? No, my policy on social media is that I refuse to be mean. I won't name call. And oftentimes when people are being dicks, I'll just tell them, thank you. You've definitely changed the way that I think about this. I appreciate you taking the time and effort for this well-articulated thought. Just fuck with them. Right. Yeah. And then they twist into fucking orbit.

That's true. That definitely can happen. And that's the best time to walk away is after the nice thank you for your dickish comment. Just let them twist in the void. Yeah, let them twist in the wind. Just like, sorry, I'm off. It's just a weird thing, man. I mean, there's no way, obviously, to engage one-on-one in a physical way with all these people that are leaving comments.

But if they did, if you just sat down with these people and talked about it, it would be a very different sort of engagement. It's just such a poor way to exchange information anonymously. Well, they wouldn't say it to your face anyway. They would change the verbiage that they used in a face-to-face conversation. Yes. They're emotionally heated. Again, a lot of it, I put back to people letting

their emotions drive their behavior and the way they communicate instead of detaching from that and being objective, which is easier to let the emotions do it when you're angry at a keyboard to be very hard to do face to face because there's consequences to your emotional. There's consequences for sure. But there's also, you realize what a cunt you're being. If you say something really mean to someone, even if you say something mean to a small girl this 100 pound girl in front of you and you say something mean and you see her so that you feel bad unless you're a sociopath you know and then you know there's there's issues with that as well they're out there they are out there man, man. I know a few. Uh,

they, I went to, uh, I went through buds with a sociopath. The honor man of my buds class is still in jail for chopping people up and then disposing of their bodies with his wife. Really? Yeah.

Who were they chopping up? Uh, I don't know the people, but they would, uh, bring people back from, I know it happened at least once. It might've happened multiple times.

But they would go to bars, find a couple, continue the after party afterwards, elicit an argument, some type of exchange. They killed I believe it was a man and a woman, chopped him up. He used to work at a grocery store chain. So he knew that they – the very cyclical removing of the garbage cans there, they got sent to the landfill more often. So he disposed of the bodies in multiple grocery store garbage dumpsters. And then they eventually got caught because in the middle of the night, they broke into a Hooters to steal T-shirts and got caught by the cops. to a Hooters to steal t-shirts and got caught by the cops. And I believe it was in her purse.

They found a Spyderco knife with like hair and like basically tissue still on the knife. And I think the woman's ID. Whoa. Yeah. High level criminal. They really thought this one through. And that's the only way they got caught? That's how they got caught.

Imagine if they didn't break into Hooters. Yeah. Oh, of course. Well, first off, why the fuck are you breaking into Hooters for t-shirts? Clean your knife, you dirty bitch. But again, so this is sociopaths out there. And this is another thing that I try to tell people often. The best people that I ever was around in my entire life was in the SEAL community. And my mortal enemies and the worst people I've ever seen on the face of the earth was in the SEAL community as well. He was the honor man in my BUDS class, which if I look back, he had passed more evolutions from a statistical perspective than anybody else in the class. They weren't actually viewing him through the lens of, is this person honorable? They weren't grading him by his integrity, but it just goes to show you that no selection process is perfect. And if you

can't separate an individual from an occupation or a uniform or a black belt, right? If you think that because you have a black belt that you're going to be an awesome person or because somebody is a SEAL that you're going to be a great person, stand the fuck by. And it's not the norm, right? I'm not, I'm not, I don't want him as the anomaly to paint the norm, but it's important for people to remember that those people are out there. And again, they can leverage from my background. They can leverage the fascination, the curiosity, people wanting to give back. I mean one of the most common questions that I get from people is how can I thank people for their service?

I'm like, well, A, just say thank you. And then my answer to them is B, is provide them an opportunity if you feel it's necessary, but don't allow them – don't do anything for them and don't give them any special treatment. Make them earn it. Because then you can get a true look at the individual as opposed to perhaps just the shiny object that you were focusing on before. Interesting. So treat them as an individual. Thank them, but treat them as an individual and judge them based on the merits of their behavior and their worth. 100%, not off the merits of their background. If you have a job, you know, you're like, hey, I want to provide opportunities for veterans. No problem. Provide the opportunities for veterans, but treat them exactly like the person who is in the cubicle next to them, if

it's in that environment, obviously. And if you hold the person that was a non-veteran to a certain standard, you better hold the veteran to the same standard. Don't let them get away with anything because it doesn't help them either. It helps everybody in the organization if you set the standard and make sure everybody holds it. It's insidious to an organization to set a standard. And well, why is this guy getting special treatment? Like, dude, he was a SEAL. It gives a fuck. Is this guy getting special treatment? Be like, shh, dude, he was a SEAL. He gives a fuck.

It's just a job title. And if that person is sociopathic or they are, you know, there's a bell curve. There's a top 10% and the top and the bottom 10%. If he's in that bottom 10%, by holding him to that standard, you're going to get an objective viewpoint of that as opposed to just being blinded by whatever it may be. It's interesting, but only you can say that or someone in your position can say that. It's very difficult for someone who's a non-veteran to say anything remotely close to that. Well, I hope they listen then because they don't need to say that. They just need to act. They need to just live that.

They need to structure their organization with that framework so it's objective, not subjective. It's like people look at being a SEAL. It it's objective, not subjective. There's this like people look at being a SEAL. It's not a Harry Potter wand. I have probably a familiarity and comfort with weapons and tactics more than your average person. But if I'm being completely honest about my old job, I could teach a monkey to do most of the things that I did. I'm serious. I could teach a monkey to do the things that we did. We're not out there doing nuclear physics.

You're out there doing, you know, we find an individual. How are we going to get there? Okay, let's figure out how we're going to get there. We train to those standards. We get on target. Everything is based on tactics and standard operating procedures or TTPs, tactics, techniques, and procedures. And everybody is trained to those standards. So you know what to expect from somebody, whether they're from an East Coast team or a West Coast team,

you can meet in the middle and we all are taught to clear rooms the same way. And it's just, it's not complicated. Actually, the way to make us less effective and efficient would be to make it complicated. The simpler that you can make it, the better you're going to be. us less effective and efficient would be to make it complicated. The simpler that you can make it, the better you're going to be. That makes sense. I mean, it makes, but it's also the mind of a SEAL, like the type of person that can get through buds. That's complicated. That's complicated in just being able to control your mind. You know, one of the things that you said in one of the, one of the times we talked about it was someone who's able to keep their world small. We were in Utah. Yeah. I'm like, that's an interesting way of looking at it. Keep your

world small. Like people. That applies to what's happening right now too. So what you're talking about, you know, buds is a physical test. You're actually, I would say, having gone back as an instructor, which I learned much more about the process applying the curriculum as opposed to going through it, because as a student, you're just like, ah, I want this day to be over. As an instructor, you can kind of – and you also don't really know what you're going to do the next day as a student. As an instructor, I can look at the entire curriculum and the story arc of where you start on day one and the product you're going to get at the end. It's a physical test, but we're using the body to test the mind. We're stressing the body. We're going to make you tired, hungry, hypothermic. We're going to get you so exhausted to the point that you're going to hallucinate. And then we're going to take a look at how you behave. Do you value we over me?

One of the first things they do in BUDs, you're explaining the concept of a swim buddy, and you don't get to go anywhere farther than six feet away from another human being for that six month time period. That is the opposite of most people's mentality. And you can test it early on, you'll yell at them, and you'll say, hey, you got 30 seconds to go run out to the ocean and get wet. And in the first few days, they just take off and they start running because they forgot about their swim buddy. They're me centric. And so you bring them back and you punish them, the individual that made that choice. And then also the swim buddy, you know, to reinforce that people, there are consequences to other people from your behaviors. And after about two weeks, you really can't separate people from their swim

buddy. So it's a lesson. And it's at a beginning point where you can instill this philosophy of we is greater than me. And it's one of the most beautiful things, I think, from the SEAL community. If you talk to people, or my experience has been is in talking to people, in their most dire moments where things are getting the worst, they're often more concerned about the people to their left and right than they are about themselves. they're often more concerned about the people to their left and right than they are about themselves. My biggest fear probably, I know what it was in the SEAL community, but to this day, is that I am not going to be there when somebody needs me. That was my biggest fear in the SEAL community that I wasn't going to live up to the standard of the people to the left and right held at me and that they were going to suffer for it. I was more concerned about letting them down than myself getting hurt or killed. And that starts with that ethos from

SEAL training, but it's not a complicated course. We're stressing the body to stress the mind. And if you look at the people who make it through, so when I went back as an instructor, as a student, when you're going through training, if somebody next to you quits, you never see them again. Like there's no, hey, dude, what the fuck are you doing? Like they're just gone. And you continue on with your day because you just want to graduate the program. As an instructor, you can talk to those people and you can ask really important questions. And my favorite question is why you said you, this was your lifelong goal. This is all you've ever wanted to do. You left a D one scholarship to come here because you saw no, for yourself, no value in the higher education and you wanted to come to the SEAL community and you quit. Why? Time and time and

time again, the answer I would get from the students is they got overwhelmed. So they were doing the opposite of keeping their world small. Because there's two ways you can look at BUDS. It's 180 days long, I think plus or minus one or two. Or you could look at it as a sunrise and a sunset 180 times. So you could look at a pie and go, oh my God, I have to eat this whole thing. Or you can look at a slice and eat the slice and not worry about the rest of the slices and keep doing that and doing that until the training process is complete. Hell week is another good example. It starts Sunday in the evening and ends Friday in the afternoon. and you get about two hours of sleep on Wednesday. That's it. It's horrendous to go through and it's pretty entertaining as an instructor because you can just totally fuck with the students because

they're off their rocker by Tuesday afternoon. But almost all of the attrition occurs from Sunday night until I'd say Tuesday morning. And beyond that, you're probably going to make it through because you've invested so much. But the advice that I was given when I went through was don't look at Hell Week as a five-day pipeline. Just make it to your next meal. They have to feed you every six hours. So if I can stack six hours on six hours on six hours and just focus on getting to the next meal, it doesn't matter how much I'm in pain. Doesn't matter how cold I am. If I can just get to the next meal, I'll get a reprieve, a mental reset, and I can continue on. That's that in combination with some, you know, the mental toughness is how you approach and set

your goals and then resilience. And my definition of resilience would be the ability to get bent and come back stronger than you were before. The way you do that is by bending yourself as often as possible, which you do all the time by running sprints. You know what I mean? You're doing that stuff. You're mentally tough because of that. And if you can apply that resilience to approaching – setting and approaching your goals from digestible perspectives, you can accomplish an insane amount. So that's really what – I mean, it's a physical

test, but we're just testing the mind. Can the individual ignore the big and focus on the small? Can you do the step that you need to do and not get overwhelmed, regardless if you're tired, exhausted, hungry, cold? I mean, that's really all it is. It's not a complex training program. There's the ocean, there's the beach, there's some telephone poles, there's some boats. And then later on, we introduced scuba gear and towards the tail end of it, you know, some demolition and pistol and rifle. How many days can you stay awake for? Where it becomes dangerous for your health? Yeah. I don't know. It's dangerous for their health in Hell Week. And what the students probably don't realize is there is a huge safety network for them.

You don't see it as a student because you're so just task saturated. There are MDs walking around all over the place. There's people constantly, you know, we're checking the temperature of the water. We'll take core body temperatures on the students. We're keeping a very good eye and we're buffering them because by about Wednesday, they're brain dead. I don't know how long you could stay awake without suffering some severe physical consequences. So they literally get two hours of sleep in the whole week? You might get a little bit of break time.

It's actually on the wall at the Bud's compound. It pays to be a winner. And the inverse of that is incredibly true. It does not pay to be a loser in the SEAL community. And for clarity, loser is anything other than first place in the community that I came from. The podium has one platform, not three. So if you win, you might get 15 minutes off while we're hammering the shit out of the rest of the class. So if you win a task.

If you win a task like in Hell Week, you'll sit by the – Tasks such as? A boat crew race is a perfect one. Jamie can pull up a picture. It's Bud's Hell Week boat crew race. And there'll be students running with boats on their heads. And people get bald spots from it, and we'll do races like, hey, take that boat that's supposed to be in the ocean, and you're going to run with it on your head. There's a crew of seven people, three people on each side and the leader in the back. And at the end of four miles, we'll be done with this.

The winning boat crew will get a little break, and the losing boat crews will get remediated. Four miles. Sure. With a boat on your head. Yeah. You know why? Because it's fun to paddle it in the water, and you can surf it, so fuck you. Yep, there you go.

Yeah, look at that neck on that front right guy. Yeah, he might have some disc issues later on in life. But they'll do short races. They'll do long ones. How much does that boat weigh? That's a good question. It looks inflatable. It is.

It's an IBS, inflatable boat small. But still probably 150, 200 pounds. And then you've got to imagine sometimes there's water sloshing around in there. Sometimes it'll get sand in there because we do let them paddle. They'll do races where they have to run, go out past the surf zone, flip the boat over for no reason other than it's difficult and it forces them to get wet, right the boat, come back in, continue the race. So if you win that, you might get 15 minutes while we're remediating the class. And we know what's going to happen in that 15 minutes. You see people sleeping, standing up. You see people face down on a

high-lick track in the sand sleeping. They're sitting there sleeping and it's kind of just a reward and you just leave them alone. So you let them sleep for 15 minutes. We'll give you a little bit, yeah. And then wake up, bitch. Pretty much. Back to work. Get right back on that ocean. Wow. Five days of that. Yeah. Hmm. You learn about people

in that. You learn a lot and you see people push to the point where do you care about me over we and we get rid of the people who cannot prioritize we over me. Arrogance comes out. You see it a lot in the leadership as well. The students are largely the same. Like from a physiological perspective, there's ones that are faster runners and from a contractile potential, like more stamina or cardiorespiratory endurance. But most of them are the same. It's like probably like a 3% difference between the students. But these little pods of seven people, some of them can

work together and they're just crushing it. And other ones you'll see, you know, there's oars in the boat. So when they run, they're stuffed on the top and you'll see they'll be out paddling. And then you'll just see a sword fight start with people just knocking each other's heads off with oars. Really? Oh, fuck yeah. Because look, I mean imagine how exhausted you are. You are so exposed and raw, so suppressed as a human being like from all the physical tools that we have that the real person comes out. And sometimes boat crews will just eject a person.

They will hate that person so much because they might be selfish or arrogant or they're not pulling their weight and they will just harp on that person or beat the shit out of the person and eventually they'll end up quitting. Now, when they do get in a sword fight, what do you do? Do you kick them out if they get in sword fights or do you let them sort it out? I'm going to let them sort it out. Wow. Plus they're out in the water and I'm not going out there.

I'm going to let them sort it out. Wow. Plus they're out in the water and I'm not going out there. A lot of the times you're watching it through binos. It seems like that's one of those things that once you get through, and once you get through BUDS and once you get through Hell Week and once you get through all the difficult physical tasks and you actually become a SEAL, how many people maintain that sort of Goggins, Jocko level of discipline and keep

training constantly? And how many people do the bare minimum? It's hard to say. There are people who slip. What are the requirements once you've gone through all that shit? There's very few. And I can only speak from when I was in in 2013. I left the last day of June of 2013. So if it has changed since then, I don't know anything about it. But, you know, the Navy, obviously, it's a Navy SEAL. So you're governed by the United States Navy, they make you do a PRT, a physical readiness test, which is running pull-ups, push-ups, sit-ups, and a swim, I think, because we're SEALs. And your wife could meet the standards. My 11-year-old daughter could probably meet. They're not crazy is what I'm saying. So the bar,

if you trip over the bar at that point, your hamstrings don't work or you suck. But there are varying levels. There are people who are very like the individuals that you're talking about. And then there are others that will let it slip and they slip a percentage point over time. There's some obese, disgustingly overweight SEALs, not many, and everything in between. So it would be hard for me to give you like exact numbers on that. I would say more guys trend towards the Jocko Goggins realm because it's a very self-critiquing community in most ways. It's like working inside of a piranha tank and if there's a drop of blood, they're just like, yes, I'll eat you now. We're very hard on each other for sure. How many of them are involved in martial arts? How many of them are involved in martial arts? Again, hard to say because I know it has drastically changed since I was in.

The amount of – so I was telling you before, I sat down with Henner Gracie yesterday, and we were just talking about – a lot about his interaction with law enforcement and how they got started, and it was with the Rodney King riots. Actually, I didn't know that, but that's when they started interfacing with law enforcement. Really? Yeah. He had his dad, the generation before him, they started sitting on a panel, you know, talking about, I think, essentially combatives with the hand-on-hand type stuff with the LAPD. But that's where it started, and it's grown since then. When I went through, I don't remember much discussion of martial arts at all. There was prisoner handling or detaining people and cuffing them.

The terminating point would be to get their hands behind their back and flex cuff them. We didn't use metal handcuffs. We would use tie ties just because you can put a lot. You can slide them in your gear and just easily cinch on them. tie ties, you know, just because you can put a lot, you can slide them in your gear and just easily cinch on them. But I think that it has drastically changed since I have been in. And I think a lot of that, though, is driven by individuals. I mean, I'm sure you see it. I mean, I feel so stupid being late to the game to jujitsu. And I know that it is definitely, I don't want to say invading all of those communities,

but that might be a good term, infecting. There's a groundswell from guys who are learning on their own. So it's increasing, but it was not prevalent when I was in, unless you were an individual practitioner doing it on your own or had a buddy that would do it with you. Really? That's interesting. I would have assumed that it would have been a core part of training, like from the beginning, just to build character and to understand what happens if you do lose your gun or if you are in a situation where you don't have a weapon. Well, there's not a lot of situations in real life that you can point back to from my community where that has happened.

And quite frankly, ego gets into the way. And you'll hear guys say things like, well, why do I need to – bro, I don't need to go hands-on with anybody. This is all I got right here. Right. And that's purely just ego. And what ends up happening is – and I was talking with Henner about this yesterday and I have a much better understanding of it now. You can elicit actions from people if you don't know what you're doing. If you do have to go hands-on and you're trying to detain somebody, but you're asking about how much I weighed, right, how much gear I had. So I usually would float somewhere between 205 to 215 when I was in.

So add 80 to 90 pounds on top of that, and now I'm kneeling on your back, right? But I don't understand weight distribution. I don't understand leverage. I don't understand the way that the joints move that well. And you're trying to comply, but I'm applying so much weight to you that it's forcing you towards a fight or flight situation. And you can increase the deadliness of these situations unintentionally and get yourself into a position where you might have to take somebody's life, but they didn't deserve it. It was actually your fault because you drove them to that point, because you were not judiciously applying the pressure that you needed to. Well, you see that with police when you watch videos of cops trying to detain suspects,

and then they lose control of the situation. And it's purely because they don't have an understanding of how to control a person. They run out of tools. I have a ton of empathy for law enforcement. If you're out on the streets and you have verbal commands and then a taser and maybe a pepper spray is in there somewhere, I don't even know if they still use that. But then your next resource is a gun and you rapidly go through all those options. I understand how those situations occur and I'm not trying to justify them in any way whatsoever, but I understand what happens when you reach the limits of your tools and you're left with what you think is a life-threatening situation. Henner has some great videos of breaking down what goes wrong with police when they're trying to detain someone. I mean, it's oftentimes two and three on one, and they wind up getting killed.

There's videos of guys having a suspect on the ground and a suspect who's not trained in martial arts. But unfortunately, the cops aren't either. And they're doing these stupid things and hitting this person and trying to control them. And then the guy gets out, gets to his car, pulls out a gun and kills them. And I've watched a video like that recently. So the guy who got me into jujitsu is a sheriff. And I actually just – the only reason I started is because I wanted him to shut up. I had known him for like a year. He's like, jujitsu. And for me, it's like the harder you push that at me, I'm like I'm not doing it ever. I don't care.

Oh, you like carrot cake? I'm never having a piece of carrot cake. I will not have a piece. So we were at my house, drunk, downstairs at the bar. And he was just like, you know, we were standing there drinking. He tried to put me like a standing head and arm trying. He's like, this is how I would choke. He was like, if you start right now, you'll never tap me. He was a four stripe white belt at the time, got his blue belt shortly after. Oh, that's hilarious. If you start right now, you'll never tap me.

So he claims he didn't say this. He said it. So I went to a class like the next day and, uh, this? Fuck that. He said it. So I went to a class like the next day and fell in love with it. And he got pulled into and started jujitsu because a buddy of his got into a damn near life or death fight where I live up in Kalispell. Sheriff's department doesn't have that many people on shift and a response time of 20 to 30 minutes is possible for sure. So this guy goes out and he's in the fight for his life and like two feet of snow in the wintertime. Oh, Jesus. And I think one of the first things that happened was his radio

got ripped off. That's a fucking problem, right? If you need to call for backup. But fortunately, they have procedures like, I guess if you check in and then for a certain period of time, like if you don't,

people start moving their car in the right direction, start coming to you. If you don't check in in a longer period of time, you know, the lights and sirens come on. So other people came.

He was okay. And he just got his brown belt not too long. He's a savage. So what happened to him? Obviously, I wasn't there. But it was – he pulled somebody over for a particular reason. I don't know what it was. And this is an interesting thing too that I've come to understand better, developing friendships with law enforcement.

thing too that I've come to understand better, developing friendships with law enforcement. You know, they come up to a car and they're just, they're doing a stop and it's another touch point for their day. But somebody in a car might be in the back of their mind thinking, oh my God, like I have a misdemeanor or a felony. I might be going to prison for the rest of my life. So two very different head spaces as they converge. In this instance, I believe there's a pistol that was in between the driver's seat and the little center console. The individual went for it and somehow they came out of the car and it just became a scuffle at that point. And they fought until other cops arrived and basically dogpiled on the person and ended it. And it was over.

I believe they were at that for like 10 to 15 minutes. Jesus Christ. And for people who don't understand how hard it is to go that hard for 10 or 15 minutes, I believe they were at that for like 10 to 15 minutes. And for people who don't understand how hard it is to go that hard for 10 or 15 minutes, I mean, fuck. Well, if they weren't in shape and that guy was, that would have been death. So he found jujitsu and he just got his brown belt. He's awesome. But he started my buddy who made that comment. And then I have started, they'll do defensive tactic stuff. I've helped him out twice where I'll just go and I'll be a role player.

And I'll just, you know, lay there on the ground and put my hands underneath my chest and they have to try to cuff me. And it's an eye-opening experience. I mean, I've been at this for 18 months. I'll be the first to tell you. I don't know shit. I'm at the point now where I'm starting to realize how little I actually know. You blue belt now? Correct.

Yeah. And it's like a foreign language. Like I can kind of see a little bit of the alphabet, but don't even think for a second that I'm trying to put together words yet, let alone sentences. And so I'll go and, you know, I did. I was the role player for two of those. And it was interesting. I saw some of the same stuff where you can elicit responses for people. Like I was resisting, but not a crazy amount.

And the amount of pressure that they started like applying to me, grabbing fingers and pulling my fingers back, it almost to me – like I wanted to ramp it up just like anybody else would. So they're – without that skill or without that tool in their tool belt, you run out of options. And it's – I mean they have a dangerous job as it is. And so after doing that defensive tactics, it's actually why I created this shirt. What is that shirt? It's Street Blast Gym International? SBG is where I train. It was founded by Matt Thornton and my coach was was Travis Davis, and he was here the last time.

And that's the same SPG as in Conn? Ireland? Yeah. Yeah, Cavanaugh's one of the coaches. So, where did it start? Matt Thornton started it. He got his black belt from Chris Howder. Okay.

Chris Howder's a Machado guy. Correct. Yeah. So, Higa Machado, I believe, Howder, Matt, and then my coach, Travis, who you met the last time I was on, is the owner of the SBGs. But you talk to these guys and we do this session and you can see that their eyes are kind of wide. Like what the fuck just happened? And then the next thing they want to know is about cost. And Travis does an awesome job.

And I think it's SBG wide. They will give a discount for law enforcement, but I feel like it's so important for them. And I want them to be better at doing their job for my family. So I literally just made this shirt and every penny that goes from the sale of the shirt, I'm going to start doing scholarships, not all the way for the guys, because they need to have some skin in the game, but I want to get as many law enforcement and first responders on the mats as possible. So I want to lower the cost working with Travis and the SBG organization to start with to just get people in the door. Because I mean, you know, there's probably better than anybody like you don't actually have to know that much to radically increase your safety, especially if you're dealing with somebody who doesn't know

shit. Yeah, the average blue belt could manhandle the average human. Yes. And imagine if every police officer or first responder had that ability, whether it comes to dealing, because you know, these guys are not dealing with people. It's not like, Hey Joe, it's great to see you today. Nobody calls 911. It was like, Oh my God, let me tell you about the most awesome day that I just had. Are you ready for this?

Fuck. It was my birthday. We had a party. There was a cake. The presents were amazing. No, it's like, oh my, they're going to crisis. They're dealing with drunk people. They're dealing with people who are on drugs. And I don't want to see anybody get hurt or killed, specifically them. So I want to have more tools and I don't want them to have an economic buffer to that. So trying to raise as much or not raise as much money, but sell as many shirts as possible and then go all that money towards scholarshiping those guys. That's awesome. Into the organization. I love it.

That's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. I think all martial arts. I mean, I think they should learn striking for sure. Yeah. But I think that out of all martial arts, jujitsu for a law enforcement officer is probably the most important because the struggle for a gun or the struggle for you know getting a hold of someone pulling a gun and being able to control their arm and getting a hold of them it's so critical well you can stop stuff early too like

even just a simple arm drag yeah like you can right you can see people's body language like oh okay oh you don't know shit this is well or this is about to get a little while they pull it back yeah or you see in front of you and. Yeah. Or you see people start to clench their fists. Right. Like you can see those behaviors in a simple arm drag where you can step behind and control the other arm. Like for a law enforcement officer to understand that concept, be able to do that. Right. You're already in control.

Yeah. Whereas if you don't, you see the guy and the next thing you know, you're in a boxing match. It's like, I don't know, maybe you were a gold gloves boxer and maybe your teeth are going to get fucking knocked out and you're going to get a knock your family's going to get a knock on the door yeah so easily yeah yeah um i always try to tell people you know what for every law enforcement video that you see where things went wrong when someone was a piece of shit and some cop did something horribly abusive you got to think of the millions of interactions that cops have with people that don't go that way. Yeah, you're looking at it.

You're getting a very biased perspective of what it's like to be a law enforcement officer. And then on top of that, I'm a big supporter of law enforcement, always have been, because I'm a person who understands the necessity. I understand what a lawless world would look like. And people only want to look at the cops that have done poorly but it's like what you were talking about with seals with anything the bottom 10 the top 10 there's there's a certain type of person that's a police officer there shouldn't be a cop they just shouldn't be a cop and a lot of times those are the ones you're seeing in these situations and also a lot of times when you're looking at these videos, you're looking at someone

who's got severe PTSD, untreated, unrespected. They're encountering every day, they're encountering liars and thieves. And at any moment, they're pulling somebody over and they could lose their life. At any moment, they're looking at this car and it's got tinted windows. They don't know who's in the backseat. And they're like, fuck, is there a shotgun pointed at my face right now? And you don't know the headspace of the person that you're in. Like I said, it's so interesting to me to hear them.

They're like, hey, man, I want to go home at the end of the day. This is my job. Like I have a family. I have kids. I work for 12 hours, 10 hour shift. I'm not trying to ruin anybody's life. But, you know, I saw somebody swerving across the road. It's my job and obligation to pull them over.

I don't know what the fuck is going on in that person's head. And then those two things can combine, and it's like, whew. Yeah. It's a tough world. I have nothing. I have a ton of empathy for people who operate in that world. And if you've never had to make decisions like that in time-compressed environments, it's hard to describe. Yeah, and I was driving down the street once in L once in LA and there was a billboard where they were

trying to hire police officers and they were touting how much money you get paid. And I remember thinking, looking at that billboard, that is one of the worst pieces of motivation. Like if that's your motivation to be a police officer, look, you can get $35,000 a year to start. Like, hey, get out now. Get out now. Because if you don't truly love the idea of being a law enforcement officer, if you're not truly in love with that, like, and you're just saying, oh, this is a good way to make 50 grand a year. There's better ways to make 50 grand a year that aren't going to have a risk to your life on a daily, hourly, minute-by-minute basis.

What you would want is everyone who's doing it to want to do good for the community and want to make the world a better place. That's ideal. And then you get varying levels in between that and the people that are just doing it because they don't have another way to make 50 grand a year. Yeah. Yeah, it's, and then- It's kind of the same as military too.

You know, the military is a stable paycheck, But if you're coming to the military for the money, you're probably better off doing a shorter tenure or tour. If you want to stay for longer and you want to dive deep, it probably, at least from my opinion, would be that you need to have some sense of purpose or calling that is coming from that occupation as well, because you're not, you're not going to get rich in the military for sure. What you get out of that though, the one thing that I noticed from military folks and just from whether it's team guys or just, just people that have, there's a level, the level of discipline that I know that you have, you know, if you, if you've had a successful career in the military, particularly if you're a team guy, there's a level of disciplines that you have

that gives me comfort. I'm like, I know this guy's got his shit together. I have selective discipline. Yeah, but you can turn it on. Up at a reasonable hour. Some people can't turn it on, though. You can turn it on. I can.

There's something about wanting to sleep late just to say fuck you that's kind of appealing as well there's the the guy that gets up at 4 30 every fucking morning like jaco it's possessed it's understandable he's he's got a demon in his head you're not you're not putting that fire out with regular water yeah but there's a the discipline is the big thing man the ability to push through successful in the military because the – and I think this is a reason why some people will struggle when they get out. The military is a very task-centric organization. They will set for you parameters, left and right boundaries.

And they'll say if you want to get to X, Y, Z, you're starting at A. These are the things that you have to do. The people who are efficient at traveling from A to Z are the ones who are disciplined to take that next step. They keep their world small. They focus on the breadcrumb in front of them. And once you do that and can understand that concept, you can apply it to any aspect of your life. What gets some guys, and it got me too, when you get out, you're like, well, who's going to give me the task? Right. Well, who's telling me what needs to be done?

Right. Well, who's telling me what needs to be done? Right. And the answer is you. So you see guys, they're just wildly entrepreneurial because they'll find something they're passionate about and then they apply that same concept of just continuing to go forward. They'll have micro failures, but they don't allow micro failures to impact macro outcomes, right? Because, again, small versus large.

Yeah. And you'll see them bounce around and they it is largely that discipline and it's there's no secret recipe to it it's like people again choco's hilarious this people like choco what should i do to eat better and his response will be eat better you know he answers their rhetorical question with a portion of the rhetorical question yeah choco of the rhetorical question. Jocko, how do I clean up my diet? Clean up your diet.

Like, it's not rocket surgery. Well, there's so much of what's going on with people is that they just want to talk. Well, it's easier than action. They just want to talk about it. Yeah, they want to talk about it. Like, how should I get going? What should I do? Like, what's a good way to do it? And you can give them a little bit of advice.

Like, my advice is always write things down that you want to do. What do you want to do? Well, write yourself down a schedule every day. Write yourself down a schedule. I mean, you might have to adjust it based on time constraints. But if you just write down today, I'm going to run four miles. I'm going to do 500 pushups. I'm going to do a thousand sit-ups. I'm going to do this and that and that and this, and then check it off. Do those things. If you, if you could just write shit down and make sure you do it every goddamn day, write down what you have to do that day,

it's amazing what you can accomplish. My list would have none of those things on there. Well, you don't have to. I'm not running four miles ever. I think I ran four miles last year. Well, you fucked up your hip in getting shot and you really... Best part about getting shot, no running.

Can you run distances and stuff or or do you still have nerve damage? Yeah, my leg is, I have, the neuropathic damage is going to be there forever. I can run, my gait is a little bit messed up, so then I have weird compensatory issues. That would be a real issue for joints as well, right? It's not smart, maybe. Yeah. People, let's just say on one of my ankles, I can tolerate a foot lock a lot better than the other one, and people, I'm just looking at them, and they're just like, I'm of my ankles, I can tolerate a foot lock a lot better than the other one.

And people, I'm just looking at them and they're just like, I'm like, yeah, I'm good. But is it because you can't feel it? Oh, yeah. It's totally fucking the ankle up. Oh, that's not good. Yeah. But it's good. You make eye contact with them and you can see they're just like, I don't feel comfortable cranking on this more.

You know what I got into, man? got into man when i um i suffered this uh insufficiency fracture um with uh i i got enough of fall skiing which is my oh my fucking hate skiing i ski because my family likes to ski this is me skiing don't get hurt don't get hurt don't get hurt don't get hurt didn't get hurt all right let's do it again but this time i got hurt this fucking lady she was a noob and she didn't know what she was doing she slid she could she was on this little side hill trying to put her skis on and she just right into the trail right when i was coming around a corner and i was like i'm gonna kill this lady uh i gotta i gotta wipe out and i wiped out crack my fucking head but slammed my knee really hard and i knew something was wrong then i went and got it checked and i did an mri and it's actually a fracture in the shin bone. So I go, okay, great. So the doctor's like, you can't run for six weeks.

So I got into stair mills. Stair mill? Those fucking things that just keep going? The perpetual staircase? Dude, I didn't think those would be that hard. I believe, you know, people are like, stairway to heaven? No, that's the stairway to hell. Turn that bitch up to 15 and good luck with you.

Good luck with you. And the beautiful thing about it is it's zero impact you're just stepping it's you're just stepping and god damn what ferocious cardio you can get out of those things yeah throw a weight vest on there too that's what i'm talking about or you know they have this uh atlas pack that the outdoorsman's outdoorsman's.com makes have you seen one of those's the one where you put the plate on the back. Yes, that's the shit. Because you can get 90 pounds on that motherfucker. You can put 245s. And it sits well. It sits very well. It doesn't slop around on you. Exactly like a real... It's a rucksack. It's a military rucksack frame. Exactly. It's perfect because the frame

is for pack. Outdoorsmans make an excellent hunting frame, a pack pack it's like a really sturdy pack that i learned about from remy warren and steve renell and these guys just swear by this this one backpack frame because it's like super sturdy and it's just excellent for packing out like elk like you know you've had to pack out an elk before yeah you don't know what weight is until you're going uphill with a fucking leg on your back, you know. With a backpack with no frame. Yeah.

Get some of that party. Good luck with that. Yeah. The difference between a backpack with a frame, like a really – like a Kafaru, a really well-made outdoor-centric backpack versus some bullshit backpack that's just designed to have like a laptop in it and you're trying to carry shit around in that yeah there's a big difference and just the just the way the the loading shelf is and the way that straps in and the angle that it's supposed to sit on your back there's all science to it so with these uh outdoorsman's frames you get like the best aspects of an outdoor pack but you have this big big-ass post on the back just like an Olympic bar.

You slide those plates on it and clamp it down. It all sits perfect. You get an insane workout with one of those on and one of those stair mills. Oh, yeah. It'll change if your normal workout is without that and you just start light, people. It does some amazing things for sure. Did you at any point in time consider using her as a jump instead of wrecking? No.

Like catch some sweet air off her back? I couldn't. I was turning the corner. She was right there. It was so quick. I had to wipe. I was going to kill her. I was like, if I hit her.

I don't think you would kill her. I was going pretty quick. You could have gone up and done like the little skis to the side. I'm not good at that I'm not very good at skiing I'm competent at skiing But I was like I mean I wasn't going to kill her But I would have maybe broke her leg

Yeah You know I mean I don't want to break some lady's leg I was just coming around this corner and I see her I see this I don't have control thing And I'm like fuck she's going And then I see kids this way. I'm like, I can't go that way. Shit.

And it's just time to go down. Sacrifice the body. Yeah, my head was the weird one. Were you wearing a helmet? Yeah, but I was dizzy for the rest of the day. I was like a little out of it. I was like, oh, I got my bell wrong. Concussion, you think?

Ah, for sure. Something happened. Yeah. Because it was a bang. It was hard packed snow. And my legs went up, and my head went down. It was a big bang. I have a strong neck, fortunately, so there wasn't as much rattle as could have been. Yeah.

And I kind of knew it was coming. You know, I was like, oh, here we go. But I was, my bell was wrong for sure. And then because I was a little dizzy afterwards, I went to, I was with my 11 year old and we were going onto the ski lift and I just, I was out of it. And I, you know, the things come around and I timed it wrong. I'm like, fuck, I went too soon. I'm stuck.

And I'm like, I can't go. And I fell down. And then this lady had to help me get back up because I was just out of it. I was just like not quite there. It was very embarrassing. Sounds like you suffered a head injury. Yeah, I definitely did. But it was only like for the day. The day I was just a little out of it. But the next day

I was fine. I woke up prepared for the headache. There was no post-sparring headache that I used to get all the time. I got my bell rung pretty good, I think about a month ago, actually on the mats. I was climbing on a guy's back. It was a good lesson for me too. I was-

Did you slip over the top? No, I got both of my hands involved and he rolled and snapped my head into the mat and I didn't have a- Oh, face planted. But I, and I didn't, again, I don't know shit. So I'm learning and it's a mistake that I haven't made since then. But yeah, I had my hooks in and was kind of just getting too involved in that drastic movement, and it was a full whack in the same thing and the headache for a few days afterwards.

Dudes get wild when they try to get out of things, and that's a particularly dangerous move when someone's on your back and you decide to slam them into the ground. It's kind of a dickhead move, really. Well, it would have been okay if I had had at least one post. But like I said, I wasn't thinking about that. Was he standing? Did he try to stand? No, he was turtled.

Oh. I don't think I would crawl on somebody's back if they were standing. My game's not very advanced. Your jujitsu is probably different than mine. But even taking someone's back standing is tricky as fuck because they can just throw themselves backwards and on concrete oh that's a game over it's a death sentence i mean that's what i actually thought about that afterwards because you will see people who

you know i'm here because i want to learn to protect myself in the street and if i had done that on the street and had my head cracked on concrete I'd either been waking up in the hospital or not at all you got to kick their legs out in those situations if you have someone's back and you're standing you gotta you gotta I mean the the options that exist that don't exist in jiu-jitsu one of them is you kick their fucking legs out if you have someone's back you know you actually kick their leg. You don't just jump on them with the hooks in on concrete. It's just too dangerous.

Before you get to that position, you want to yank them and do something, trip them, do something to get rid of their base. But someone who's strong, that's so dangerous. Because someone who's strong can carry you on their back and then just throw themselves backwards. I mean, even hardwood floor, anything. Or even against a building or a car.

Yeah, anything. Anything. You want to get them to the ground. You want to get them to the ground. Or a standing guillotine. When you're in a front position, that's another one that's really fucking dangerous, man. A guillotine? Yeah.

Guys have gone for takedowns with guillotines. Like I said, a guy shoots in for a takedown, and a guy grabs a guillotine and pulls back, and then this guy's head is the first thing that hits the ground. Oh, because he's tucked under their armpit? Yes. Okay. A guy on Team Alpha Male, on Uriah Faber's team, wound up getting paralyzed for life that way. Yeah, in training.

On the mats? Yep. Fuck. Yeah, in training, shoots in for the takedown, and the guy gets him in a guillotine, and all their weight together falls on this guy's head, and his neck compresses, and his neck breaks, and he loses his ability to move for the rest of his life. That's a common one, in fact. Not common, but it's happened multiple times that I'm aware of.

And, you know, you've got to imagine it on the street. You know, someone tries to take you down on the street, and you elevate and go into a guillotine position, and they fall down and slam their fucking head first. You're going to crack it open probably too. Yeah. There's so many. I mean, one thing that is a good criticism

about jujitsu is the lack of takedowns and um that is a real factor in any sort of real world situation the hope is if you're in a bar or something like that there's a scramble most things wind up on the ground that's true until you deal with a skilled opponent. And if you deal with a skilled opponent who has takedown defense, and then you're stuck in the situation where, oh, now you're in a realm where you're a white belt, and this guy's a black belt. Like, if someone is a wrestler who can strike, it's a terrible position to be in. And we saw that with a lot of, in the early UFCs in particular, a lot of jiu-jitsu black belts just didn't have takedowns. And then they would get involved with a wrestler who would easily stuff their takedown, and the wrestler was a better striker.

And those guys got fucked up. You had to imagine that would be a quick bout. It's not good. I mean, the only thing a lot of guys did was they would follow their back and try to pull guard and try to entice a guy into coming to their back. And then they would kick off their back. Like Hickson used those tactics when he fought Funaki. Like up kicks? Yeah, and he actually wound up fucking up Funaki's knee by kicking at his knee, hyperextending his knee from his back.

Oh, rugged. Yeah, that's a common technique. You know, a guy standing over you, and you're on your back, posting up, and you hyperextend his knee. It's just like judo is the best, in my opinion, for someone who's wearing clothes. You know, I think every jujitsu guy would really greatly benefit from having a good comprehensive knowledge of judo. How deep would you go?

Judo is a good thing to learn, man. Just period. First of all, those guys are so freaky, chimp strong. Some of the freakiest chimp strong guys I ever rolled with were judo people. Because judo players, man, they're just all – everything is constantly this. They're constantly grabbing and everything is hips, torque. The torque and rotation. There's so much explosive movement carrying a human body.

So they're doing explosive movement like sandbag training with another 200-pound person all the time or larger, particularly like women. Like Ronda Rousey, do you know how goddamn strong that woman is? She's freakishly strong. Oh, I bet. Because her whole body was designed to throw bodies around, throw a human body. I mean, it's like you think of weightlifting, right? Like, when are you ever weightlifting your whole body?

Well, maybe if you're squatting or maybe if you're bench pressing, if you're exceptionally strong. Or deadlifting. Yeah, or deadlifting. Those are like the compound movements, but like curling or triceps. None of those things, overhead press,

very rarely are you using your whole body weight that way. I don't think it's advisable to do that with your whole body weight. And your whole body weight that way. I don't think it's advisable to do that with your whole body weight. And your whole body weight is way more difficult to control because it's moving and resisting. Try picking up a dead body, a person who's out cold. It's fucking hard. You've got to scoot. A person your weight.

If I had to pick up a dude who's 195 pounds and I had to pick him up and he's out cold, fuck. That's hard. Now put 80 pounds of gear on him. Yes. I could only imagine. And guns dangling all over the place. So with a judo player, imagine that, but imagine that person also resisting.

They're some of the freakiest, strongest people in the world. I just sit down when I start with judo people. I'm like, ha-ha, fuck you. Good move. Good move. I watch them over in the corner and I hear just theo people. I'm like, ha-ha, fuck you. Good move. Good move. I watch them over in the corner, and I hear just the whoosh. I'm like, okay, I'm going to sit down. It's a beautiful thing to learn, though.

It's a beautiful thing to learn if you can get someone that will really work with you and who's technique-oriented, not someone who just wants you to spar all the time. Because one of the things that happens with judo a lot when people are just getting involved in it, there's a lot of scrambling on the feet that could put your legs in a compromised position where your knee blows out. How much, just in your time watching the UFC, how many of the takedowns do you see are judo based? It's not that often, but some guys are really good at it.

And the guys that are really good at it, it comes up. You know, there's some guys. Back when Cairo Parisian was fighting, Cairo was a great judo player who was in the earlier days of the successful UFC, was one of the better judo guys. And he would hit hip tosses and all kinds of different judo throws all the time. ronda of course you would do it all the time too but with ronda that was basically the only way she would take you down was with like upper body grabs she'd grab she would her move was like to grab with grab the head and then take people down with that and and use judo but it does happen but it only happened you know it

happens with skilled players yeah but when when it does happen it's like only happens with skilled players. Yeah. But when it does happen, it's a big surprise oftentimes. Like, whoa. Well, and those people are the anomaly too, not the norm. I mean, they're too trained fighters at the apex of their sport. Yeah. You know, somebody with a moderate level or understanding of judo is probably not going to have that difficulty in a bar. Right. Yeah.

Right. Well, nor is a bar. Right. Yeah. Right. Well, nor is a wrestler. Yeah. You know, I mean, just, and again, with wrestling, see, I always say that if a kid wants to learn martial arts, like there's a lot of good things they should learn, but one of the things they should learn first is wrestling because it sucks so hard. It sucks so hard. It'll teach you whether or not you really want to fight, whether you really want to

compete. Yeah. You know, I've heard horror stories. Actually, Callum last night was telling horror stories of wrestling and wrestling camps. With cashmere shirts on? Are you talking about that? Yeah.

I need to determine whether or not he was talking about his experience, other people's experience, or he was making up every goddamn thing he was saying. It's hard to tell. Yeah. He definitely knows how to wrestle. He sells it so well, though, that I don't even care because it's so entertaining. He definitely could wrestle. Yeah.

I got count involved in jiu-jitsu in 96, but I stuck with it. Yeah. And he— Did not. He sort of drifted in and out. He told the story last night of basically why he stopped. He was watching—I think it was—he said Henzo was giving basically a little bit of a deeper dive onto a finer refinement of a technique. Instead of having your hand in this direction, rotate it the other way.

He said he just stood there and realized, I just don't care anymore. That was the end of it. Well, Callan is one of those guys that gets into things for a little bit and then bails on it. He's like the same thing with hunting. Yeah, like the bow in his garage that he's never once used. gave him a free bow i know he showed it to me the last time i was down he's never even drawn it back i think it's so it might have the plastic on the string so you can't draw it back son of a bitch yeah he uh promised me he's gonna come over and learn he was telling me last night he's like i need I need a tactical shotgun. I was like, oh, fuck, here we go.

No, you don't. I was like, Callan, what makes a shotgun tactical? He's like, the ability to go boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. He's like, but I need a short barrel. And he's like, seven rounds, and I'm going to use birdshot. I was like, fuck, man, this is getting worse every time. He's like, birdshot's what I need, right? Birdshot'll do it. I'm like a bird shot's great for birds but so he basically wants a huge shotgun with like a huge magazine tube

but a barrel that sits two feet back from the magazine tube so he'll just bounce stuff yeah the the trajectory of callan and i with hunting it shows like the difference between us as humans like in 2012 we both went hunting for the first time. Yeah. And since then, the only time he's gone hunting is with me. And since then, he's killed, well, he killed a deer with me. And then. I'm assuming rifle.

I think that's it. Yeah. I think that's it. We went turkey hunting. I got one. He struck out. We went blacktail hunting on Prince of Wales in Alaska. We both struck out.

And then we had a bail a day early because of a storm coming in. We were going to get trapped. That was the most miserable trip ever. But it was really educational. Wasn't that a meat eater show? Yeah. I watched that one. Fascinating.

You guys were like, hey, we can get a plane in right now. Well, we were about to get stuck, and I had gigs. I was like, I can't cancel gigs. I mean, this is fun and everything, but there's a real possibility I might not be able to get out of here. You guys didn't see shit the whole time. Didn't see shit. We saw a couple deer, and we saw, they saw some black bear. It was just, it was strategically the wrong time to be in that area, but it was very educational.

What was educational was like how good the sun felt when I came back. Like it's always sunny in LA, but I called Rinella up when I got back and I was like, dude, I have never been happier than today. Like I know it was miserable up there. Because you think one of the things that was like, it wasn't that bad. But what sucked is there's no dry. There was no dry. There's never dry.

You thought, well, I'll be in the tent. I'll be dry. No, there's no dry. I got up to take a piss one night and I turned on my headlamp. And all I could see inside the tent was water vapor. Just droplets. And I was like, oh, was water vapor, just droplets. And I was like, oh, there's no dry.

No. And that's getting into every fiber of everything in that tent. I had a wet sleeping bag, which is adorable. Wet sleeping bags are adorable. It's like, I don't even know why I have this on. I hate the water. I would not go there. But it was fun.

It was fun. The camaraderie was fun. It's always fun being with Callan and the meat eater guys. They were great. And we did wind up starting a fire one night with Fritos. You know, Fritos are excellent fire starters. The chips? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Those greasy little fucking cunty chips. Those things- First off, those things are fucking delightful. Very delicious, right? Like I said, I have selective discipline.

They stay lit for a long ass time. You just light them with a lighter? Yeah. Yeah. They stay lit for a long time. It's kind of crazy. And so then we got a little twigs. Whose idea was the Cheetos? One of the guys that worked there, someone knew it. Someone knew it. And then we lit the Cheetos or the Fritos rather. And the Fritos lit these little twigs. Fritos are delightful. Cheetos are cunty. Cheetos are not as good as Fritos. They look good because they're big and fluffy, but it's so much kutch, kutch, kutch before you get to the real. There's like air in them.

They're bullshit. I think they're delightful. No, no, no. Cheetos. Cheetos, yes. I'm on board. Cheetos are bullshit. Fuck Cheetos.

Yeah, there's too much air. Fritos, that's an honest snack. And you can use like a spoon if you get the party size. That's true. Yes, I'm on board. Cheetos are bullshit. Fuck Cheetos. Yeah, there's too much air. Fritos, that's an honest snack. And you can use like a spoon if you get the party size. That's true. Yes, you can. And you can also use them to start a fire. So we lit the Fritos and then we put the twigs over the Fritos. We got a little fire going.

We were so pumped because everything was soaking wet. So then we started like looking for areas that were less wet, you know, like under lot or, you know, like on the backside of trees, we carve some bark off of those. And then we got some wet logs and put it close to that to try to dry it off. But eventually we got to, we had a whole day, like from like maybe like three in the afternoon to like, you know, three or four in the morning where there's no rain, which is crazy. It never happens up there.

It's the rainiest place in North America. And we actually got a fire going. It was fun. But then when I got back home, I remember thinking, man, this is why you have to suffer. Because I feel so good. Like I've never feel this good about California. Like usually the rain, the sun is just always there. You just take it for granted. But this day I was like, oh, the way it felt on my face. It was like I was on a happy drug. I was like, I felt so good. And I called him up and I go, dude, I've never been happier in my life. And I think that's one of the things like you really have to get into

those valleys to appreciate, to really hit those peaks. I think that's what's going on right now. As you're saying that I'm thinking about like literally what's happening in this country. And I hope that, you know, we get to the point where we see the sun and we feel it, but then we have to also not forget. I think you're a hundred percent right. I think we have it really, really easy in this country. And what you were saying about, this is the reality of third world countries or places where, I mean, you're under a military dictatorship where you can't get food. You can't travel wherever you want to. You don't have the freedom to move about whenever you want to. And we're in this weird situation here today in California. They've put this lockdown on everybody where supposedly until April 19th, you can't have

a gathering of more than 10 people and you're all essential businesses are supposed to be closed. Like, well, fucking good luck with that. Yeah. Good luck. Good luck. Good luck with a whole month of telling people they can't work. This is crazy.

Good luck with a whole month of telling people they can't work. This is crazy. I had an experience that stuck with me that I use as like a lens of context from overseas. And it was from Afghanistan. I was in a sniper overwatch position. And I was watching a – I was on one side of a valley. There was a unit on the other side of the valley and there was a village in between. And I watched an individual come out in the morning to the only water source in the valley small stream and watched him just take a shit in the water oh jesus christ and then later on in the day another person came out and

downstream of that took a bath in the water and later on in the day a woman came out with two kids and got their drinking water downstream from both of those things and went back to their house. And it's like, okay, we have it really, really good. Really, really good. Really, really good. And in that village, there was probably a light bulb. Why did he take a shit in the river?

Maybe he didn't have any toilet paper because the grocery store was out. He just wanted to wash his ass. Why not? Yeah, I mean. So that's the thing about people. It's this willingness to do something that you know is going to negatively impact others, but you don't care because in the moment it's good for you. Like when you see someone throwing a cigarette out the window of their car,

that's a perfect example of that. They don't want that cigarette in their car. So they just say, oh, somebody else will handle it. Yeah. But if you see enough of those things are in that, it reframes the way that you look at what people complain about. And I have thought about that day very often because in that short period of time, it's just like, well, I don't ever really have that much to complain about. Like what's going to go on right now for the next few months, I would guess, maybe the rest of the year is going to be horrendous. And I hope that everybody makes it out okay on the other side.

But the reality is people are going to die and it's going to suck and it's going to destroy families. And the economic destruction will probably be worse than the physical destruction from a death side of the house. But we're still going to be okay at the end of that. And even as if it gets horrendous here, we are doing so much better than so many other people on the face of this earth. Their daily best is not going to even approach what it's going to look like at our worst as we navigate our way through this. My biggest concern is not just the deaths, which is a big concern, not just the financial crisis, which is also a big concern, but it's also the government gobbling up freedoms in exchange for the illusion of safety. That's a real concern.

It's been happening for a long time, though. Yeah, but it's also whenever there's a real crisis, there's always an excuse to pass legislation that diminishes our rights. I mean, it's just it makes it easier for them, makes it easier for them to do what they perceive to be their job. Only if people are scared. Yeah. It's, you know, because they're finding the seams in people's attention span. They're instead of being objective, they're being emotional. And that clouds your vision and it clouds your judgment. And when they're not paying attention because they're scared because they're online all goddamn day, looking at people taking pictures of the empty toilet paper aisle in the grocery store, other people who might have

malicious intent are moving on that man intent and nobody is paying attention to it. Yeah. That's where a lot of people that the more, what's the best way to say, I'm trying not to use the word retarded conspiratorially minded that don't think very well the first term was accurate they think of it in terms of a gigantic conspiracy and this is all set up people take advantage of moments

and that's the difference that's what really happens where there's moments where they can pass something like the Patriot Act or the Patriot Act 2. They do it. It's not because they've set this up to pass that. No, they use it as an opportunity because they know that people are scared and they use it as an opportunity to further diminish our rights because it makes it easier for them to control us. And that's a real concern right now.

It's a real concern right now. And it's something that people go, oh, that's the last thing you should be thinking about. No, it's one of the things you should be thinking about. There's many things you should be thinking about right now besides your safety and your health and not spreading a disease and making sure you wash your hands

and stay away from old people and maintain social distance. All that stuff is important but also recognize what the fuck these career politicians and these career lawmakers and these career people that are in charge of controlling mass groups of people. Any laws that help you, any rights that help you, it makes their job more difficult. And that's something to be concerned with right now. I think fear is totally natural.

I think if you don't experience fear, you might trend towards the sociopathic side of the spectrum. But it's totally natural. It should be expected. But you have a choice in how you receive what is going on. And you can allow the fear to cloud your judgment and drive your decision-making process. Or you can recognize that the fear of something, you know, fear of death overseas isn't what keeps you alive. Objective, analytical thought process and doing the things that need to be done keep you alive regardless of how scared you are or fearful you are. That's what keeps you alive.

It's okay to be scared, but just don't let it take over and control you. What the fuck is going on in Russia right now? Are they getting this? I haven't heard a goddamn peep about Russia. I haven't either, actually. That's a good question. I haven't heard a goddamn peep about Russia. Like, there's very little discussion about whether or not they've gotten it.

I know that it exists in Korea. I know they've got it in South Korea. I've seen the maps where they color code it, you know, the circular. It's got to be. Coronavirus. Russia doctors say government is covering up cases. Well, there you go. Of course.

Of course they are. Well, this is what we have to really worry about with a dictatorship, right? That's when Trump loves covering it up. What would be the benefit of doing that? What would be the benefit of covering it up? Superiority. You want to claim superiority over the Western world? It's a false superiority because at some point the scales are going to tip at a point where you can't cover it up.

Yeah, but that's part of their whole long game. Their whole game is about superiority and propaganda. It's a big part of what they do. I mean their gross domestic product is so small. Their GDP is that of a very small European country. And yet we look at them as, look at that, number of coronavirus cases in Russia. Not good. Oh, okay. They got plenty. 253 cases. Oh, only one death. But that's them saying that. How the fuck do we know? Because we've had over a hundred deaths now,

right? There's a hundred deaths in this country, I believe. And I still think that those numbers are incredibly low. I think a lot of people are probably dealing – if you look at how they describe the symptoms, I bet a lot of people have already dealt with it and don't even realize it. I think that's absolutely true. You look at Idris Elba. How many people are like that guy who are fit and got it and had no idea? So why did he get tested then? I think he got exposure to someone else who had it.

And so he felt that to be a responsible person. To be precautionary. He was going to self-quarantine and test himself. Then he turned out to be positive. But, you know, he's updating everybody on a daily basis on Twitter. He was concerned also because he has a pre-existing condition. He has asthma. Okay.

Even though he's a stud. You know that guy had a Muay Thai fight? No. He did? It was fucking good too. He's good. Yeah, he guy had a Muay Thai fight? No. He did? It was fucking good, too. He's good. Yeah, he fought his ass off. I think he won.

I think he won a decision. It was a good fight, though. I watched it on YouTube. Yeah, he trained Muay Thai for something. This can't be recent. Yeah, yeah. Wow, he was a movie star. Shut the fuck up.

Yeah. Dude, he's an animal. I love that guy. That's awesome. Big fan. You've got to assume that there are other people, though, out there who have no idea. Yes. Just rolling around. That's why, I fan. You've got to assume that there are other people, though, out there who have no idea. Yes.

Just rolling around. That's why, I mean, I bet the numbers are way higher, but the ratios are probably similar. Well, a lot of those NBA players that tested positive for it show no signs. But you're dealing with super athletes, right? With incredible bodies. Probably the lowest of low-risk categories. Super healthy individuals in the prime of their athletic peak. Here he is right here training.

Dude, he's – I mean this is not a good example here because this is just him tired, hitting the pads. But he's got skills. There's a video of his fight. But you can see him here hitting the bag. Not bad. I mean he's no fucking Giorgio Petrosian. Yeah, but he's not doing it professionally either. Yeah, but he's fit and he's got skills.

He does everything correct. He's holding his hands up. What's on his left ankle? What's he got there on that left ankle? It's taped up. Probably fucked up his shin sparring. And so he probably put some heavy pads on it. Probably fucked up his ankle.

You know, like you kick elbows a lot. Have you done much striking training? See his knees padded up too. Zero? Yeah. You kick a lot of elbows, man. You kick a lot of elbows? Yeah, accidentally.

Those people are- There he is right here. Look at him. He's fighting. This is him fighting. There's a good video of it. It's a real fight. It was for a documentary, right?

So it's Thailand. So he did a lot of training in Thailand. By the way, Wally's a fucking huge movie star. You know, and- His shorts are so unacceptable. Yeah. You could see him getting better as he was doing it, but he's doing like legit sparring, you know, getting thrown down, the whole deal.

I didn't know you could throw somebody down if you caught their foot like that. Oh, Thailand, it's a huge thing. In Thai boxing it's a big part of the sport is throws, not just throwing someone from that position, but just throws. They grab each other by the head and throw each other to the ground, sweeps,

catching the leg. Look, here he is, man. He's in his fucking 40s too, by the way, when he did this. And decided to train and actually have a real fight. Let's see some of the footage of the fight. It was a pretty good fight. And the guy he fought, man, was not playing games with him. The guy he fought was trying to fuck him up.

I get nothing but respect for people who willingly step into that arena. I know, but it's just so rare to see someone who's a bona fide movie star that's willing to do this. He's a bad dude, man. Well, it probably says a lot about his character. I mean, getting ready for that is not, it's not a stroll down the beach at sunset. No. No. And according to all who trained with him, I mean, the guy trained as diligently and as hard as anyone that's a professional fighter. He just really went after it and really uh took it and took the approach of like that this is a life lesson and he's going to go at it with a hundred

percent of his being and i just i'm a big fan of this guy i'm a big fan of him as an actor but when i found this out and i watched this i was like okay this guy's a real fucking deal and there's very few people that would do this when you're absorbing those knees and those kicks to the high leg what what's walking like the next day after that? It's terrible. It's terrible. Even just training when you get hit with, um, with pads on someone has like big ass shin pads and they, they dig a shin into your thigh. It just gives in man. Everything just like is horrible. It's like a Charlie horse times a hundred. But then think of someone who can really kick, you know? Yeah.

Think of someone who can really fucking turn their body and turn their weight into it. You know, I've had people ask me to kick them in the leg and I'm like, dude, I'm not kicking you in your leg. Cause if I kick you in your leg, I might break your fucking leg. Why would somebody ever ask? First off, drunk people being silly, people being silly. People being silly. Silly gooses. Just kick me one time in the leg. Just don't do a full blast.

I'm like, if I'm kicking you, I'm kicking you full blast just because you asked. Just because you asked because you're so fucking stupid. But I'm not going to do that. I could tear your knee apart. You think it's fun. It's not fun. No, thanks. The shin bone is such a nasty bone, too, because it's really kind of designed for slamming into the meat of a thigh.

It's got a blade to it. And if someone's good at it and they're chopping, either chopping up or chopping down with that, it cuts your muscle in half. It pushes. It's like the edge of the shin just separates that muscle tissue. It makes my stomach hurt listening to you describe that. It's terrible. We had a fighter who fought on the last UFC, the one in Vegas. And he, in one of his fights, his last fight, he had something called compartment syndrome.

Pull up the card. Let me tell you who this guy is. Pull up the card for the last UFC I was gonna pull it up on my phone the last UFC that was in Vegas There was one of the gentleman that was fighting on the undercard who has a scar that goes from the top of his thigh All the way down below his knee. Yeah, he found it beautiful put that up on the screen So this is from one of his fights do I not want to look at this? Yeah, look at the screen look at the screen. So this yeah from one of his fights. Do I not want to look at the screen, Jamie? Look at the screen.

That was the tissue in his leg. That's a tube to drain it. Everything had gone gray and he was in real danger of losing his leg. Austin Hubbard, right? That's the gentleman's name, right? Yeah, okay. Go back

to the image of his thigh, please. Wow. So John Anik showed it to me during the broadcast. I was like, holy fuck. Like, I had heard that he had- Hold on. That gray is live muscle? Well, it doesn't look like live muscle tissue.

Well, it's broken down tissue. But all of that is from absorbing shins. So punishing shins to his thigh had made his legs swell up to double the size that it normally is and then caused like this horrible condition called compartment syndrome i believe that's how you say it and so they had to open up his leg and yeah compartment syndrome is what it is i had never heard of that before and i've seen seen a lot of them. I mean, I would imagine it's probably similar to what Uriah Faber had when he fought Jose Aldo. Fuck. Did you ever see that fight?

No. Uriah Faber versus Jose Aldo was the worst punishment I've ever seen anybody take to their thigh. And Uriah— Uriah took the punishment? Yes. He was fighting Jose Aldo when Jose was in his prime, and he tortured Uriah's left leg so badly that Uriah documented the post-fight and then recovery of it. I mean, his leg had turned to this horrific shade of purple, doubled in size, and he wasn't

the same person for months. Can you get rabbed up from that, too, from the muscle tissue breaking down and entering the bloodstream? That's a good question. I don't know what you get. Whatever it is, it's not good. I don't think Uriah got compartment syndrome because he didn't have to get cut open like Austin Hubbard did.

But you think of it, it's fairly rare in terms of the amount of fighters that we see fight. I mean, I've seen thousands of fights. I've only seen one person have that injury to the extent that Austin Hubbard had it where he had to get the slice down the middle of his thigh. I take it Uriah lost that fight. Oh, yeah. Yeah, but, man, what heart he showed because most people would have quit.

I mean, he was so punished. His leg was so horrific. See, if you can get an image of Uriah Faber's leg post-Jose Aldo fight, it was crazy how bad it was. And he just kept eating those leg kicks that was when Aldo was in his prime his leg kicks were so fast it's one of the weird things about him today because he's still he's only 32 believe it or not Aldo that's Uriah's thigh afterwards oh my yeah well that's long afterwards that's long afterwards i mean that's him many weeks later but like right post fight there's a bunch of images that he shared on social media uh go yeah

that's what it looked like like look at his leg look at that leg i mean that is fucking crazy look at his calf i mean it looks like a fucking linebacker's calf. It's just all swollen with blood and pus. And it's from Aldo just destroying that leg. Amazing. Just amazing how tough he is that he endured that. You guys can have that cage shit. It's fucking Muay Thai

and that shit is just the worst punishment on your legs. Yeah, I enjoy watching it, but no. Thanks. Much like the ocean. No. Yeah, I enjoy watching it, but no. Thanks. Much like the ocean, no. Yeah, it's a smart way to look at it. I don't know how we got into compartment syndrome. Oh, Idris Elba. Yeah.

Coronavirus. Yeah, the fact that he's, yeah, he's a uniquely fit and tough guy. But the thing about the shin, if someone just does it gently, like Jon Jones did it gently to Jim Norton. My friend Jim Norton has had a series of fighters who have done things to him, like put him in chokeholds and arm bars and leg kicked him because he asked him to do it. And gently, just gently, just gently, just gently. Don't kick me too hard. And Jon just kind of thumps him, just gives him a little thump. Nothing like what Jon's capable of, just a little thump. Did Just gives him a little thump. Nothing like what John's capable of.

Just a little thump. Did it fold him? And he's like, ah! And he falls to the ground. It's fucking horrific. It's horrific. Just folds him over. Yeah.

There was a guy named Pedro Hizzo, and he used to fight in the UFC in the heavyweight division. And he fought Randy Couture. And Randy Couture's leg was so fucked up from that fight that it took him six months to recover. Six months to recover from the leg kicks. He's the hardest kicker I've ever seen in all my years of watching people kick legs. I saw Pedro kick the bag at Beverly Hills Jiu-Jitsu in like the late 90s.

I was there, I forget what I was there for, and Pedro just happened to be doing a workout on the bag. And this was like the early days of big gyms in Los Angeles. There wasn't a lot of them. There was Hickson's Place and then Horian had the Gracie and Torrance and then there was Beverly Hills

Jiu Jitsu was like this kind of high end mixed martial arts place they were putting together and Pedro was there training and there was this 150 pound heavy bag and Pedro leg kicks this thing, just whoop, whoop. I watched his bag bend in half, and then he does it again, whoop, whoop. And I just thought, like, oh, my God. It's unnatural.

He's got tree-trunk legs, huge legs and perfect technique. And Marco, who watched, watch this. This is Pedro. Watch this guy. Watch this. But look how he digs into it. Do it from the beginning again. Is that from the beginning?

Look at this. Thump. Pedro has the hardest leg kicks I've ever seen in all my years of watching people kick legs. My man did a full 360 rotation. And he went flying through the air. Yeah. Like he literally lifted that guy. Powerful mustache.

Dan Severin. Yeah. And Pedro would just lifted that guy. Powerful mustache. Dan Severin. Yeah. And Pedro would just fuck people's legs up. Oh. He stopped Dan Severin with leg kicks. Did he blow his knee out on that? Oh, yeah. I'm sure he did.

Fuck. I'm sure he did. He blew everybody's knee out. Pedro was a monster. A monster with the leg kicks, man. Look at that. He just fucked people. He fought Rico Rodriguez, and I remember he leg kicked him once,

and you could see the look on Rico's face. He was like, fuck this. So every time he came close to doing that, Rico would just drop to his back and try to submit him. Pedro was a devastating kicker, just fucking devastating. One of the best. I'm not a fan of the Speedos. I'm glad that it's moved beyond that.

Yeah, that was an early Brazilian thing. They used to fight with Speedos. I just, I'm glad that it's moved beyond that. Yeah, that was an early Brazilian thing. They used to fight with Speedos. I'm not exactly sure why. I can't think of a single reason why that would make sense to me. To fight another man in Speedos. Less things to grab. I think that's what the idea was. Less things to grab. I'm gonna accept some more handles for people to grab onto than rolling

around in fucking grape smugglers. Yeah, there's something about those that are particularly offensive, right? Like a girl wearing a bikini bottom is not offensive at all, but a guy wearing a Speedo is very offensive. Like, why is it seeing more of a man's thighs is gross? I have no answer for that. But it is.

Yeah. If I see a guy on the beach in a Speedo, I judge him. You better have a French accent, motherfucker. You better be from a country that doesn't know any better. If you're American... Yeah, you better have been raised wearing those things. Like, if we went to the beach and Dudley showed up in Speedos, I'd be like, hey, fuckface,

what are you doing? Yeah, I would have a serious talk with him. I'd be like, are you okay? You live in Iowa, bro. You can't be wearing Speedos. Where'd you get that? You have a midlife crisis you want to tell me about? Yeah, we'd have a chat. And if you're going to do it, if you're going to roll inos where'd you get that you have a midlife crisis you want to tell me about yeah we'd have a chat and if you're gonna do it if you're gonna roll in speedos wear a fucking thong less to grab on to less to grab on to well have you ever seen the thai cups thai steel cups what's interesting is they still for some strange reason i'm pretty sure

please google this are thai steel cups still allowed in MMA? I know Kenny Florian throughout his career as a fighter wore a tie cup. Is this what you're describing? Yes. It's made out of metal. It's a cup made out of metal. So the ties, it's a very uncomfortable setup, right? And what they do is they take this tie cup and they tie it on. And it's tied on the side.

It's not a jockstrap because ties aren't playing games. Are you talking like a rope, like cinching? Yeah, cinching up your asshole, G-string style, deep into your asshole so that after your fight is on, you've got a bunch of torn tissue up there. I mean, you're going to have some problems. That's how you do it. Yeah. If you're going to do it, do it like that. Clamp that bitch in there, lock down.

And if you get kicked in the nuts wearing those tie cups the guy who kicks you is the one that's hurt yeah yeah and if you're not gonna wear that and you want to get the mental advantage wear the thong but on backwards it's not just that but in jiu-jitsu it's a spectacular leverage point like if you there's this hump a steel hump where your dick is right and if you get an arm bar there, you're facing... Yes. My friend Amir Renovardi, I rolled with him once and he mounted me and drove his dick into my chest with his steel tie cup and I was like, fuck! That's really painful! And he's like, yeah, that's why I wear it. I was like, wow!

I never even thought of that! Because instead of that position being just a bad position to be in, now it was really fucking painful. Few people can say they've tapped to a dick. I didn't tap to it, but it was hurt. I tapped to something else. Here's the deal, though. I bet some people have.

Oh, yeah. You would tap to it. Yeah, if you didn't know what the fuck you were doing, for sure. Like if some guy got on top of you and it was your first rodeo, and he's got a tie cup on, and he's literally in your sternum. Well, especially if they're skilled and they know how to apply pressure. Yes. Dude, it was painful.

And I was like, oh. But it opened up a door. I was like, well, of course. But then we were talking about leverage points. And I was like, well, a leverage point, like for, I don't, I believe they're illegal in IBJJ tournaments and a lot of jujitsu tournaments because of the fact that it creates this fulcrum. Why would you wear a cup when you roll, though, anyway, if it's just jiu-jitsu rolls? I got my dick busted once.

I wear a cup when I roll. Do you really? Yeah, Diamond MMA cup. Diamond MMA makes these amazing—I'll get you one. You should wear it. Protect your dick. Protect your dick. How did you break your dick?

My friend Einstein did it. Shout out to Einstein. Scott Epstein, he's the instructor at 10th Planet West LA. It's not, it wasn't his fault. It was just a thing that happened. He was trying to pass my guard and he was trying to slice his knee through and he landed firmly

on my dick and I didn't have a cup. I thought everything hurt, but we kept going and blah, blah, And he landed firmly on my dick and I didn't have a cup. And so, uh, I, I thought everything, it hurt, but we kept going and blah, blah, blah. The end of the workout, I went to the locker room and my jockstrap was filled with blood. And I was like, well, that's not good. And so I peed and all this blood came out and that's not good. And the, but my dick didn't hurt that bad. So I was like, okay,

do I go to the doctor or do I treat it like my nose? So I treat it like my nose. Good call. Cause if my nose is bleeding, I was like, well, it happens all the time. I'm going to treat it like my nose, at least for a little bit before I have to go to the doc and say I broke my dick. So I decided, well, let's see if it still works. So I went home and jerked off. well, let's see if it still works. So I went home and jerked off.

So when I went home and jerked off, it was like, you ever get an egg and there's kind of like a half a chicken in that egg? It's like blood and like chaos. Oh, fuck, Joe. That's what the load looked like. I was like, well, it still works, but that's not supposed to look like that. So I said, let's touch and go. Let's see what it's like in the morning. And in the morning, it's like my dick just seemed normal. It seemed fine. I peed in

the morning. There wasn't any blood anymore. So I kept an eye on it. Then eventually I didn't do anything. But I was super concerned. But I immediately went and got a really good cup. Does it change the way you roll at all? No. I just feel like it'd be uncomfortable. No, no, no. You don't even notice it. You don't even notice it. My favorite are the diamonds because the Diamond MMA Cup is a compression. It's a cup that curves under so it goes like to the taint, but it's in compression shorts. So it's really snugged down.

Okay. And it's designed that way. And he gave me a bunch of them to give him away. So I have one for you. Who did we give one away to recently? We gave one to somebody that was here. The Doom guy. Oh, Hugo. Hugo Martin, recently? We gave one to somebody that was here. The Doom guy. Oh, Hugo. Hugo

Martin, who is one of the, shout out to Hugo, who is the creator, one of the creators of Doom Eternals, this new amazing video game that's gonna ruin my life. The best I could find is this here. Shall wear a groin protector of their own selection as type proved by the commissioner. Yeah, see? So it doesn't say. Yeah, you have to.

That's MMA. Oh, okay. I thought this was the IBJJF. Yeah, see? Shall? Yeah, you have to, but that's MMA. Oh, okay, I thought this was the IBJJF. Yeah, see? It says male mixed martial artist shall wear. Okay. Now, of a type approved by the commissioner, the commissioners may say you can't wear a steel one. But Kenny Florian throughout his whole career wore a steel tie cup.

Cut to... The IBJJF says you can't do that. Yes, you can't. Okay. There it goes. Hard material. That's right. Cannot be fashioned of hard material that may cause harm to a permanent out. Okay, see, that's why.

Because the steel cup is a significant advantage. If you get into a position and you're in an arm bar position. It's like doing an arm bar over a rock. I was going to say, it seemed like it would supercharge any leverage points. Yes. Yes. It has a big effect. It's really good.

But Kenny said that he never had to worry about getting kicked in the nuts because it always hurt the opponent more than it hurt him. And then Thai fighters. I mean, you think the way Thais kick, they kick better than anybody on the planet. And they're always throwing leg kicks. So the possibility of kicking the nuts is always there. So with them, that Thai steel cup was imperative. And they went for function over comfort. So the Thai cup is just not a good time.

Got to sidetrack to answer a previous question too. Oh, okay. In France, loose-fitting trunks are not allowed to be worn by men. So you have to wear a tight-fitting. Who is the governing body on this fashion? Someone who loves dicks? They want to see the outline. It's super creepy. They want to see what you're smuggling.

I was digging into that. Who's enforcing this? I don't know. Monsieur, monsieur, your shorts are too loose. What do you have in your shorts? That's probably why James Bond's always wearing Speedos

and not isn't he British? he's hanging out in villas and chateaus this is true he's just complying with the local laws that's true I guess good point Google tie steel cup

yeah I need to so you can see what this bad boy is. Now, I don't recommend this for rolling because I think it's rude to your training partners. But like I said, my friend Amir, he fucking opened my eyes to it because I never thought about it that way. See, that's what it looks like when it's fully leather. Oh, that's a diamond one. See, that's the one that I use. That's the shit.

And like I said, I'm going to give you one before you leave here. You'll swear by it. Just one good dick injury and you're going to go, okay, this is not worth it. And again, I was doing jujitsu for probably 12. There it is. That's a Thai steel cup. I was doing jujitsu for probably 12 years before I had this dick injury. So it's not that common.

So that bottom strap of the old Thai cup. Right through the crack. Right through the crack. Right down the old tie cut right through the crack. Right through the English rear. Right down the old pipe. Yeah. Woo! Yo, thank you.

Not comfortable. I'm sure it sucks. But I think in a tie fight, it's probably mandatory. Or, yeah, that might be good in a gunfight, too. It might ricochet someone. Yeah. Right. If someone wants to kick you in the nuts and they're just hitting metal.

No, thank you. Yeah. Well, that's what Kenny said. Kenny said, listen, if somebody kicks me in the nuts, it's bad for them. Makes sense. Probably wouldn't do it twice. Yeah. I mean, you rarely see nut shots in tie fights.

And I really think that's probably a big part of it is because they know there's a fucking steel cup there. Just a barrier. Plus, in a fight like that, I don't think a nut shot's necessarily going to end it, do you? Well, nut shots can do terrible damage. There was a guy that fought in the UFC, Brian Green, and in sparring one time, he decided to not wear a cup. I think it was like just the last couple rounds of sparring, and he just said, look, I'm just going to go light or whatever. Some guy kicked him in his nuts and his nut exploded. So he lost one of his testicles.

You got to think of how hard a person can kick. You know, think about a guy like Stylebender kicking you in the nuts. Think about, you know, like a real good kickboxer kicking you and it hit that little mushy little organ that makes all your jizz. Probably pressed it against something hard. Just flatten it and splatter it, and it can never heal. Yeah, they explode, man. Your balls can explode.

Not good. So that's what happened to this one gentleman who was a professional fighter. He was a militant guy, I'm pretty sure, and lost a ball. What do you think is going to happen with professional fighting as this goes on? In what way? With the UFC? With the UFC? Yeah, the cards that they have lined up.

Dude, they're going to fight on a battleship. They're going to take Khabib and Tony and put them in international waters and helicopter everybody in. I don't know, honestly. I don't know. I mean, they can't have the crowds. No, they can't have crowds. Not for a while. I mean, this fight is supposed to take place April 18th.

That's not that far from now. Where is it supposed to take place? It's supposed to be in Brooklyn, but it's not going to be in Brooklyn. They've already shut that down? Yeah, they've shut it down. This is, they don't know how long it's going to take for this virus to run its cycle. Yeah. And it could conceivably take a year.

I don't know, man. That's the weirdest thing about all this. It's like sometimes when I'm in bed at night, like I'll get up to take a leak or something like that. I'll go, this is crazy. Like no one knows what's happening. No one knows what's going to happen. And then we're relying on politicians to make these decisions and these choices. And based on disease experts who weren't adequately funded or prepared to take this on in the first place. Apparently, the Trump administration had gotten rid of the pandemic office. There was a whole office that's supposed to be- I've seen both yay and nay on that one. People are like, fact-checked it is not true. And then other people are saying that he did.

That's a good question because the woman who asked Trump caught him off guard and he wasn't aware of it. There's so many stupid fucking, there's this one lady that there's this video of her saying, I heard that someone in your office referred to it as the Kung Flu. I saw that. Yeah. Like, is this the time to worry about this? Who's the person? And he goes, who?

Who did it? They didn't know. And then they did the same thing to Kellyanne Conway. And they're asking her. And she's like, well, do you know my husband's half Asian? My children are Asian. Do you think I'm right? I'm not going to deal in hypotheticals.

She's like, well, this is a nonsense conversation. But it's this goddamn social justice narrative that people are still trying to push, even in times of crisis. Who called it the Kung Flu? Like if Bobby McFuckface called it Kung Flu and you got a video of it, hey, Bobby, don't do that. That's kind of fucked up. You don't even have a name? You said you heard someone called it the Kung Flu? And this is what you want to talk to the president

about? You have one goddamn question? The name of a thing? How about are we going to die? Circle of influence versus circle of concern. Also this is something that they know makes people upset and is something they know that can get a rise

and something they know that can get traction in terms of a news story. Which is the exact opposite of what they should be doing. Exactly. Well, this is what you, you know, the one good thing about this is it highlights how much nonsense we put credence to, how much nonsense we spend time paying attention to. And that stuff, when you're just trying to get food and toilet paper and stay healthy

and not get a fucking killer disease, all those other things throw, they get thrown out the window. And that's the good thing about this. That's the, one of the only good things. The other good thing I think is I'm hoping this gives us a greater sense of community. I mean, I'm hoping that gives us a greater sense of community. I mean, I'm hoping that people come together. I really do. I really hope people come together and they realize that this is, we have had it so easy. And it's one of the reasons why we've been complaining about stupid

shit is because we had it so easy. Yeah. And I hope it tightens this social contract that we should have where we're taking care of older generations and everything in between. Yeah. And I hope they do. If they didn't used to have a pandemic department that was shut down, find out if that's true. Since we're here, we are in the middle of talking about this. Did the Trump administration close down the pandemic office? I've seen multiple posts where it said they did and then multiple where it said they did. That's the problem with today. There's so much bullshit out there, Andy.

So much bullshit. It's so hard. And it, Andy. So much bullshit. It's so hard. And it's easy for guys like us. We have hundreds of pounds of meat sitting around. Our families are fed. We don't have to worry about it like a lot of people do. Would you give that meat away to people in need? I'm giving that meat away. I'm giving it to all my

friends. I'm giving it away to a lot of my friends. But I try to give something to Duncan, but his wife won't let him come back. Why? Did you guys get in trouble? She's scared. Yeah, she's scared. Yeah, she's scared.

Well, they're new parents. They have a one-year-old. She's a young gal. Yeah. His outfit was amazing. I know. Yours was not bad either. Yours was not bad.

Well, I've worn that one many times. That's my. I'm two-stoned. Yeah outfit NASA suit sunglasses It's a power move though. Yeah, you could just sit there. Yeah, I'm in space bitch Yeah, meanwhile Duncan's got a face mask on a ghillie suit sunglasses those fucking ghillie suits are so uncomfortable Fuck he kept falling down. Like I was saying, you're like a fat white trash lady in Florida that's got a halter top. Oh, yeah. And it's just like you got to kind of keep pulling that thing up while you're yelling at your husband. The concept is great.

They don't work. It's just so heavy. You sweat your ass off. It's exhausting. Just take all that shit off. Yeah, I would feel like just Sitka subalpine camo would be just as effective if you're hiding. When I went through sniper school, they gave you a ghillie suit. And before this, it was the shooting phase first and then the stalking phase.

And you're like taken off burlap and these intricate patterns. And we did stalking out in Nyland, which is the deserts of high desert of California by the Chocolate Mountains. And there's just a couple. It's sparse. Some trees, some brushes. And you're wearing a ghillie suit fuck me and you're like crawling and the sun is hitting you and it's like it's glowing it's just like ah and then so you spent like months getting these things ready and then you just got scissors out just cutting all of this crap off to reduce weight well it is the the light reflects to it differently it has so what you're better off doing is just grabbing local like foliage in the area and just jamming it in there oh okay and you can move it's just they're miserable it was a horrendous

experience the idea of camo with animals is so interesting to me you know because uh when when i found first found out that animals don't see things the way we see things, they see movement. Yeah. But it makes sense. You know, like they have to. That's what keeps them alive. Something twitches, like, what the fuck was that? Was that something real?

Have you seen an elk kind of look in your direction, not even sure what you are? Yeah. And they're like, what are you? Yeah. Like, bitch, you don't even know? Yeah. And it's like this weird movement thing where they're like just waiting to see movement. If you don't move long enough, you could stay still long enough.

They just go about their business. Yeah, but then they come check back again. That's when they bust me. Duh. You get impatient. Yeah. Sometimes, from time to time. Now that you're living in Montana, how often are you getting to go hunt?

You know, I actually didn't use my Montana tag last year. You didn't? I had success in Alberta. I got didn't use my Montana tag last year. I thought I had, uh, success in Alberta. I got a bull there and a mule deer. And then I had success on that last day in Utah and I didn't, I didn't have the room for any more meat. So I ate my Montana deer and elk tag. Oh, wow. Yeah. Well, good for you. Yeah. The opportunity is there for sure, though. I almost feel like, for me, I would have maybe gone and donated the meat. Because it's like, one of the things about, and people say, why would you do that?

One of the things about hunting is, I think you have toitsu or a lot there's a lot of things where the experience is so intense and so alien from everyday life that you have to be accustomed to like one of the things about fighting that i always found like i fought way better when i fought often because of like like one of my biggest uh tournaments that i won was the american open that i won right i fought one week and then i fought the next week. And I'm like, God, I feel so normal. It feels so normal to fight. Like I just did it.

There's a currency aspect to it. Yeah. Yeah. It's the same thing in all this stuff like the skydiving and base jumping stuff I used to do. The more you do it, you're on autopilot. Yeah. You get used to that experience. Yeah.

The farther from the exposure, you're like exposure you like it doesn't feel quite right or then you start like is this how i do this like is this how you route that my first hunt every year is always weird that's one of the reasons why i really like going to lanai first because first of all there's like an actual ethical imperative to kill animals in lanai like they have to be they need you to be a savage murderer they don't know yeah they fucking have 30 000 deer in a tiny tiny island with 3 000 people yeah so they need you to do but and murderer in Lanai. Yeah. They fucking have 30,000 deer in a tiny island with 3,000 people. Yeah. So they need you to do, but, and it also, it's really hard to do.

Like bow hunting on Lanai. One of the things that Dudley and I found out and Cam on our last hunt last year, we go, how many people are bow hunting this year? It's like a lot. Like, well, how many people are successful? He goes, we had 150 hunts, 150 hunters last year. One was successful. Everybody else pulled out the rifle.

We're like, what? Whoa. One guy was successful bow hunting in the time that we were there to the time that we were there again in a whole year. One guy. Holy shit, man. They're so wired. I mean, I don't have to tell you. Yeah, I was there.

It was humbling. It's crazy. But you do get a bunch of reps out. If you had a little rust you need to knock off, that is where it's going to – you'll be – Yes. If you get in the zone there and you can start getting in on them, you are going to be a ninja on some western Rocky Mountain stuff. The one axis deer that I shot last year, Dudley and I crawled for a good solid hour and a half until we got to position. I mean, we fucking creepy, creepy crawled until we got behind this bush.

And then I shot this deer like 50 plus yards from my knees and whacked him. And it was like, that was a hard earned kill. And that's a far shot on one of those things. Yes, because those fuckers are so fast. We have a video of me shooting one at 80, and the deer is just sitting there eating, feeding. The arrow, because I have a lighted knock, the arrow's tracking in flight, headed to the pump station. 15 yards away, he hears it, and he's gone. So this arrow's going 290 feet a second 15 yards away from him he hears it

and he's gone and then by the time the arrow got to him his physical body was no longer there it's like here he is it's going right there and then the arrows on he's like chomp bye when i was there with barclow he had a cameraman behind him and i think his shot was inside of 40 and the guy was taking high speed pictures just and you see the arrow release and the animal is calm and in the next frame the striations that are visible in the every to include like its nose every muscle in the animal and the arrow is just like a little bit out of the bow and then by the time where the arrow hits the thing is just like a little bit out of the bow. And then by the time where the arrow hits, the thing is like halfway off the frame. Yeah. What we found is you got to hunt them in the afternoon because it's windy and they don't hear anything.

We had four days out there where it was like just enough wind that it would swirl. And Barkle and I just trudged through and just discussed the most optimum ways to commit suicide in the evenings. Cam shot one bedded at 70 yards. He hit a frontal shot at 70 yards right in the pump station. Because he's Cam Haines, because he's a savage. But it's like the perfect shot at 70 yards. And that's how you do it. They don't hear it because it's so far away.

And the thing was bedded and it was windy. The first one I actually shot there was bedded too. Yeah, that's the way you do it. They don't hear it because it's so far away, and the thing was bedded, and it was windy. The first one I actually shot there was bedded too. Yeah, that's the way to do it. If you can catch them bedded, at least you have this window where they have to get to their feet before they can run. It's not a big window. That's not a big window. Well, you're talking about an animal that evolved to get away from tigers.

Yeah. No, I've never been around an animal that was more tuned up or keyed up than that. And also the pressure. They get hunted 365 days a year. And then there's snipers that come there every day just to reduce the population. Because they have to, right? They have to. But also they feed the locals.

They eat great. Yeah. I mean, they're eating the best meat on earth. Hard to describe to people how good axis deer is. So delicious. It's so delicious. I prefer elk over it, but just by a touch. Well, it's a little more tender than elk, which is

interesting because they're so fast. You would think, like, I had some elk last night. It was delicious, but like, there's a chew to it. You know, elk is like, I like it, but my kids are like, this is so chewy. How was that elk heart you made? Fantastic. Elk heart tacos. So good.

I'm going to take a hard pass on that. You don't eat the heart? No. I'm not exploratory with my food. I'll eat tacos, but I need it to be out of the sirloin. Well, when I went carnivore, one of the things I started eating is I started eating a lot of liver. Organ meats? Yeah.

I buy a lot of beef liver. I buy that all the time. Whenever stores have it, I buy beef liver. It's really good for you. I'm going to take a hard pass on that too. It's good. Leave it off for me. That's fine.

You can have all of that. Beef liver, eggs. I've been eating a lot of eggs. The best I ever felt was when I went carnivore for a month, strict carnivore for a month. I didn't do anything but carnivore. Occasionally, I'll have a grape or something like that, and maybe I ate an olive. Why did you come off of it? Oh, because i just committed to it for january yeah and i'm not really off of it i just i'm mostly eating that way and then occasionally i'll fuck off and have a

piece of apple pie like during this uh apocalypse i've been kind of eating whatever because i'm figuring like while this apocalypse is going on i just going to take in calories because I don't want to be a prissy diet person when all I can have is rice. Variable discipline. I'm in the same way. I can eat an entire trash bag full of popcorn, and I will sometimes. But it's just the concern is it could get to the point. I don't want to have my body adjust to eating regular food

when that might be the only thing available. I'm really concerned that we could come down to a supply chain problem and a food problem if that does happen. Look, this is one thing. This is one thing, a virus. What if one thing gets compounded by solar flares that knock out the power grid or an earthquake or multiple things that could happen simultaneously at any time. We're going to find out who people really are

really fast. Yes. Alright, Andy. We just did three hours. We did? Yeah. That's how you do that, I guess. How crazy is that? Three hours and ten minutes. It's over. It's 310 now. Is it 310 or we did three hours? It's 310. Alright. It's over. It's 310 now. And we did it for, is it 310 or we did three hours? It's 310.

All right. It's 320. It's according to that thing. Which one's right? Is this one? It's 310. It's 310. Oh, that one says 310.

Oh, 320 is the date, you fucking retard. How dare me? All right. Love to you all. Thank you, everybody. Andy Stumpf, thank you. Tell everybody your podcast, Cleared Hot, available on iTunes, everywhere you look, your Instagram and Twitter.

Andy Stumpf, 212 on Instagram, a stump, or Andy Stumpf 77. You can spell that for people who can't. A-N-D-Y-S-T-U-M-P-F, as in go fuck yourself. Oh. 2-1-2. Oh. All right. Thank you, brother.

Appreciate you, man. Yep. Thanks for having me. Always fun. Bye. oh all right thank you brother appreciate you man yep thanks for having me always fun bye