The Joe Rogan Experience - #1530 - Duncan Trussell

Episode Date: August 31, 2020

Duncan Trussell is a stand-up comedian, and host of his own podcast “The Duncan Trussell Family Hour”. His new show “The Midnight Gospel” is now streaming only on Netflix.

the joe rogan experience train by day joe rogan podcast by night all day hello joe how are you my friend i'm great man i'm psyched to be here cheers sir cheers brother Hare Krishna great to see you always that's good my friend these are strange times and we're both departing this land

I know for greener pastures I keep thinking back to when we first became friends and the strange path since from there to here and all our predictions and all the things that we we never would have imagined this you know specifically like that there would be this

fucking global pandemic that we would suddenly be like some kind of like refugee is way too dramatic a word for it but suddenly just part of this diaspora of comedians pouring out of la like and not just comedians but just people leaving man well um i talked to joey today from new jersey called you know i called him he's in new jersey and it was just such so strange i'm like, you're in Jersey? He's like, that's right, motherfucker. Yeah. You know, he's all happy in Jersey. You know, he was the last. Like, you leaving was intense, but I was still like, you know, maybe we'll stick around and see what happens.

And then, like, I'd been getting all these, you know, the problem with me is, like, I get weird vibes all the time. And, like, the last time I was on here, I legitimately thought a meteor was going to hit the earth. I really thought that. So I work very hard on not listening to that part of me most of the time. But I was getting this real weird vibe from L.A. And I'm like, come on, man. You're just superstitious. It's probably nothing.

And then my wife would say, I'm getting a really weird vibe. Like, maybe I don't know if we should stay here renting. We should stay in the place. And I didn't want to tell her, oh, I've been getting a weird vibe, too, because I didn't want to amplify whatever that was. And then I got on the phone with Diaz. He's like, yeah, I'm leaving. Getting the fuck out of here. And that was it.

Diaz was telling me Burbank was sketchy where he lives in burbank's my neighborhood turned to shit like instantly dude it's like yeah it's it's it's not and it's not just any one thing you know it's like not just like some of the stuff i get stuff had to get shut down and because stuff was shut down it got a little more weathered than usual and it's like the you know the homeless encampments i was in echo park man and like i really feel like you know like the red state people one of the things they love to tweet is like don't bring your liberal bullshit here right and they're right well this that's where i'm eating shit a little bit because you know i am i do still believe that we need to decriminalize drugs, that the drug policy is bullshit, the way we're handling it's all wrong.

But there used to be a way that they could get people who were camping out on the streets. And a lot of the times that was possession of illegal drugs. And because that stuff got removed, suddenly you were witnessing like, holy shit, man, there's people who are making like real, like rational decision from the perspective of a heroin addict, which is they love heroin so much. You know that Doug Stanhope joke, some things are better than life. Like they love heroin so much. They're addicted to it they love it and the shelters that are apparently available won't let them do drugs in the shelters they want you to kick it yeah and so that's ridiculous but now i could be wrong about

that but that is what i've heard is one of the reasons these people are staying out in the street is not because they don't want to be in a shelter it's because they don't want to be prevented from getting high yeah and so this has produced this like situation in a lot of the big cities which is we're seeing like massive tent cities and by the way the tent city thing aesthetically it's not uh it's not the best look but the stuff that i began to experience in echo park man i took i took my kid to the playground right and there's like a dude that looks like he emerged from a time portal from an apocalypse you know what i mean i'm not talking about like you know run of the mill like somebody who's a junkie who's like i'm talking like covered in like soot, like pure dilated eyes, not wearing like, you know, the disheveled clothes you might expect from someone who's been addicted to heroin for a long time. But like wearing like like he broke into wherever the costumes from Mad Max were like some kind of weird leather vest thing and like,

like creepy fucking cutoff shorts. And he had a machete and he's throwing it into the ground of the playground and pulling it out. Like he's practicing throwing a machete. I'm with my fucking toddler, man. And you know, it's like,

it's so obviously we didn't go to the playground, but that was, you know, my, you know, it's like, so obviously we didn't go to the playground, but that was, you know, it was not uncommon in that area to see completely naked people. Just not that that's bad, but not naked like the way I was. Covered in dirt, wandering aimlessly. Even worse than wandering aimlessly, wandering with what seems to be a purpose in their eyes. Some of them seeming like they're late. Where the fuck are you going naked that you're late for? Like, are you being summoned?

Like, that was, but that wasn't just it, man. You know, it's a lot of other things too. And it all just started piling on top of it. Dude, I don't think this is sustainable. Living in giant groups of people. I think when it works great, it was wonderful. When LA was working well, it was fantastic.

When the comedy store was packed and restaurants were doing well and the economy was doing well and the crime wasn't high, it's great. But when things go bad, there's no sense of community. So then there's a sense of like people capitalizing on other people who either own stores or who

aren't home or whatever. People who are desperate. There's too many people. If you're in a community that's a small town and something goes wrong, you can kind of bunch up together and help each other. Because you feel like you need each other and you feel like you're a part of something. People don't feel like they're a part of something here. They're all transient. Everybody's moved here from someone else, from somewhere else.

Everybody thinks they can go somewhere else, and they can, and they probably will. I mean, we all came from different – you were North Carolina. I came from New York at the time. We all – everybody who comes to L.A. in show business, God, what are the percentage of – how many do we know that are just straight LA? Like, Christina Pazitsky, she's straight LA. Who else? Sebastian came from Chicago.

Theo came from Nashville. Nashville is where he came from? No. Louisiana. That's right. I mean, Joey, obviously Jersey. Yeah. And all over the place. It's a gypsy town. Which is something I've always loved about it i've loved that element of like just this wild vortex of artists and narcissists and people

who've just gone insane and like it's a lot of the sparks fly in in that kind of insane cauldron of identity all that stuff is super cool it's beautiful that's one of the things i loved about is like the place we all know this is not the place is the place where you make illusion yeah that was the idea you make things that aren't real seem real and people like to watch that that's the whole tv movie industry the whole place is based on it creating an identity that you like somehow monetize or a studio makes studio monetizes your identity or something. It was something magical and beautiful in all of that. But it seems like there's a real emperor

where there's no clothes thing happening right now. Not just in LA. And I feel bad talking shit about LA because man, she's been so good to both of us. I mean, this city is like, I will always love this place. The problem is not the city. I've been thinking about this a lot lately. And here's an issue.

I am progressive on just about every issue across the board. Yeah. Gay rights, civil rights, women's rights, whatever. Women's right to choose, fill in the blank. Pro-Medicaid, pro-universal basic income, pro so many things. But there's a thing that happens in large cities, where large cities are always blue. And I'm trying to figure this out. Because like New York, and I used to think it's always because they're educated.

And educated people are more likely to be compassionate, and compassionate people are more likely to be Democrats. But there's a balance that has to be achieved. And when the shit hits the fan, you need law and order. And I think that some people who are Democrats, who are progressive people, they don't understand that aspect of human nature or they want to deny that aspect of human nature. Like when the mayor of Seattle was dealing with that whole six area Lockdown and little small little country that they had put up barriers and shit And they're like literally were had armed guards there that uh was it called again

Chop chop or chas right the mayor said maybe this is our summer of love Like no it's not summer of love some people took over other people's businesses with force, just because they think the way you think, or they subscribe to liberal ideas like you. You're a liberal too, so this is like your gang of thugs that you have to support when they take over other people's businesses? No, we have to be able to call out everybody. And just because somebody is on your side,

you can't let them take over city blocks and just institute their own government and then say it's the summer of love. This is crazy talk. And this is how this is gets, gets cities destroyed. And this is what gets the police defunded. And this would, would get people saying crazy things like we, we need to disband, release everyone from prison and no more prisons and no more laws, no more police. I'm like, no, the way things go well is you have to be safe. The only way you're safe is if you have a strong military and a strong police force. And there's something about liberals that don't want to believe that.

They see the bad cops, they see these videos and we all agree. We've got to get rid of bad cops. They've got to reform the police. They have to. But those are not all the cops. That's crazy. You just only see the bad. No one's filming excellent interactions with friendly cops and compliant people. That's not what you're filming.

It's not going to get a lot of YouTube downloads. But that's the majority of these interactions. But we have this distorted perception based on what we're exposed to, which is viral videos of cops being cunts. Because there are cops that are cunts. Because there's people that are cunts. And there's, who knows how many fucking hundreds of thousands, if not

millions of cops there are. The odds that they're not hundreds and thousands of cunts is outrageous. Well, you know what I've been doing with this whole fucking thing, man? Because if I get, because you know what I've been doing with this whole fucking thing, man? Because you know me, the way my mind goes is not going to be like red state consciousness

when it comes to that shit. Because when I saw that autonomous zone pop up, I'm like, let's do it, baby! Spread it out! Come on! But what did you think would be good? What good could have come of that? Well, I mean, the history of America is beautiful, yet somewhat like there's a mania, a utopian mania in the heart of, I think, the American spirit.

Which is like Americans identify with this. George Carlin did a great job of desiccating it by saying it's called the american dream because you got to be asleep to believe it i love that joke but i love the american dream and what's so beautiful about it is it's this idea of like i think together we can do something new that's going to be better than anything that happened before and from that spirit you get all great innovation that goes across all political ideologies. Right. So to me, you know, and they always call it I've always loved that. They call it the American experiment.

Fucking love that, man, because it's an experiment. It's like, let's see what we could do here together. And for an experiment to work, we need to be able to look at what didn't work in the experiment and improve upon it now that being said it's like for me i've been trying to like pull myself out of the even though i identify as a progressive i'm going to vote democrat i'm that's just what i'm going to do but that being said i try to pull myself out of that because i don't want to be cubbyholed man and i have a lot of friends who are like hardcore conservatives and i know that there is this idea and i have a lot of friends who are like hardcore conservatives and i know that there is this idea and i think a lot of the the idea gets perpetrated by people who are into tribalism blue red and so the the blue people they propagate a conceptualization of the red people which is

kind of what you said though well they're not compassionate yeah it's like shut the fuck up ridiculous get the fuck out of here. These are some of the most compassionate people I've ever met in my fucking life. They would die for people that they've never met. Don't you think a big problem is the figurehead right now in the Republican Party is Trump? Yes. And Trump is such a polarizing figure, and he doesn't seem to have much empathy, if any. No.

You don't know who he is really because you don't talk to him privately but his public persona is that of a winner who doesn't give a fuck and you're fired that's a non-empathetic perspective and we associate people who support him with also lacking empathy then you add into it children in cages

at the border and you see those videos you know what bothered me more than anything about the kids in cages? There was one video that really bothered me where Mike Pence went to visit. Like he's on the ground, like next to the cages. See if you can find that. Mike Pence visiting the border cages. Now apparently these cages had been put up through Obama.

And that's what's interesting about this whole border wall and border discussion and immigration discussion. Because Obama, particularly when he was running for president, he was very tough on illegal immigration. I mean, he said a lot of the same things that Trump said. If you listen to the speeches that Obama said, people believed him and agreed with him because it wasn't a Republican talking point. It was just a safety talking point. it wasn't a Republican talking point. It was just a safety talking point. And it was also a way that he could get people that were more concerned about the problem

with illegal immigration. He could tie that up with just saying, listen, we have to follow the rule of law. And they had these talks and they built these cages. They did that during the Obama administration, right? Yeah. So here's this. So these are the guys that fled from Mexico and who knows where else and came through the Mexican border. And then Pence is standing there in front of these guys.

So imagine you're a dude, you live in Ecuador, and you make your way up through Mexico because you have a fucking dream. America is the land where people can make it. There's this guy who fights in the UFC. His name is Marlon Vera. He's a bad motherfucker, and he just won this weekend. I believe he's from Ecuador, right? That's Marlon's? Yes.

Yes. And he talked about it in his victory speech. He was talking about, you know, hey, man, you can actually do it. He came over here. He was talking about it in the countdown show, too. He came over here. He lived a year without his family just building up money and fighting to try to get money to bring his family over. And then he brought his family over.

And then as time has gone on, he keeps winning. He's on like a seven-fight win streak. And now he's like a top ten contender in the UFC. And he could have been one of those dudes. That's right. He keeps winnings on like a seven fight win streak and now he's like a top ten contender in the UFC and He could have been one of those dudes. That's right See this this this is not these are just people that are in a fucking terrible place They're trying to get out putting him in cages like it just it's a bad look and it's an even worse Imagine you're that guy who comes over from Ecuador and you're in this cage and you see Pence He could touch him you could touch him if that cage was in you see Pence, he could touch him. You could touch him.

If that cage wasn't there, you could reach over and touch him on the shoulder. He's right there. The fucking guy who's second in line to the most powerful army the world has ever known. Trump's the commander in chief. That's number two. And he's right there in front of a cage and he doesn't seem to care. Like play this. It's weird i don't know how

i want him to to look but he's not like looking at the people he's kind of like looking away he's kind of like ignoring the people i mean i don't know what you're supposed to do are you supposed to look at them would that would it fill you with sorrow and despair would you not be able to rationalize and disconnect yourself from the humans that are suffering? When you think about all of us, we're basically the products of a fucking enormous chain of events. Not one thing, but look at, they have foil blankets, man.

I mean, this is crazy shit. They're stacked in there, stacked on top of each other, wearing foil blankets. Yeah. It's terrible. And it's, look at that guy of each other, wearing foil blankets. Yeah. It's terrible. Look at that guy. He's thinking about his kids. Yes. He's got a family back home.

No, no, no. His kids got separated from him. That too. That's what he's thinking about. Could be too. And again, man, it's like I keep trying to get out of the – I keep trying to get out of – because this is what I've realized, because I love flipping through.

I go from, I will jump back and forth from, like, Fox News to CNN to MSNBC. I'll check out some Tucker Carlson, blast over to Rachel Maddow, find these, like, polar opposites. I feel like what's happening, just as a result of the entertainment that is news, is that we're getting a very non-nuanced, we're being told what we are, basically. Do you listen to or watch The Hill?

No. You should watch Rising, The Hill. It's Crystal and Sagar. And Sagar is a Republican and Crystal is a Democrat. But both of them super smart and really rational and they're honest they're honest and they're nonpartisan they break things down based on their honest interpretation of what's going on yeah and it's so refreshing these two right here crystal ball and Sagar and

Getty they are fucking fantastic and I love the fact that they're friends, yet she's left, he's right. And it's not bullshit. They're not frauds. You think her real name's Crystal Ball? If I... My last name was Ball. I'd name my daughter Crystal. That's dope. Come on. You would not name her... I'd call her Magic Crystal Ball.

It's like, I don't know, man. Why not? Well, because then every... Because you you do that and you're gonna like i didn't even notice it until now because i'm not name-a-phobic i'm not name of it's my name is duncan i am yeah how do you think i i just i'm sensitive to names like that because if their real name is crystal ball be a third grader named crystal ball Well, third grader, you might be able to get away with it. But 10th grade, you're going to get tortured. By the time girls reach 15. And Crystal Balls.

Yeah. Yes. Oh, my God. It's like a never ending. Anyway, to me, it's like the propaganda. It's propaganda. And the reality of it is I'm trying to well, what do we all have in common? It sounds like a cheesy thing.

And what we all have in common is we want to be happy. When I talk to my liberal friends, they want to be happy. When I talk to my conservative friends, they want to be happy. And then you add to it. Now, this is where shit gets weird. A lot of people want to be a hero. And why wouldn't you? A lot of people want to help other hero. And why wouldn't you? A lot of people want to help other people.

They have a service mentality. They would they want to die for something good. A lot of people really do want to help. And then that's to me where the problems start is because that's being subverted. And the way it's being subverted is, you know, it sucks, man. When you're around somebody who's telling you how you feel. Yeah. Have you ever had that happen?

We were around someone. They're like, why are you unhappy today? And you're not unhappy. But if you're not careful, you'll be like, maybe I'm unhappy. And then you become the unhappy thing

and they've sucked you into a thing you're not. And so for me, this is the danger of the news is they kind of tell us how we are, how we feel. First of all,

this ridiculous red, blue bullshit. It's like, stop. I mean, every single person I've ever met would— I don't think I've ever met anybody who wouldn't try to help someone who is drowning. I think most people I meet are like that, and I think that transcends politics. But somehow they've got us thinking we're all different and separate. And then on top of the thing that really bothers me and annoys me, obviously, man, I'm no fucking Trump fan.

That guy's a lunatic and he's driving people crazy. But what bothers me is it's like he's driving people nuts. And it's just the way he said it. And what bothers me is that the response from like really intelligent people who consider themselves liberals is they're shaming these people. They're shaming them. They're saying, oh, they're idiots. They're rednecks. They're dumb.

They're peasants, stupid peasants. How could you like him? It's like how they liked this guy because they thought that he was going to help their families. They were fucking they were not doing great economically. They bought into a thing and they invested themselves in it. And if they are starting to like, it's dawning on them that they succumb to another American tradition, which is the con artist. This is an American tradition. It's American to be a con artist and it's American to get sucked in by one.

Happens to the best of us. It's happened to me at a Grateful Dead concert. We wanted to buy a hundred hits of fucking acid. This son of a bitch got us a sheet of acid, convinced us to try to sell it to make more money, to get more acid. We left there with one mushroom stem on the way back to Hendersonville.

I've been conned. I know what it's like. It's a very American thing, but it's like... So there was no acid at all? Dude, no. We took our money to buy acid and then he's like, no. We took our money to buy acid. And then he's like, we could sell this acid and buy more acid. And then we're like, yeah, let's do it. And then he sold the acid, I guess.

And then we were going to buy more. The point is- He started a business. My friend almost gave him his fucking car. This was a very charismatic hippie. He looked exactly the way you'd expect him. A fucking hippie bandana, big hippie beard. Some people are good at that, and it's weird.

And they do weird things. Like, they talk a little too close to you. They make you uncomfortable. Yeah, they use neuro-linguistic programming. They just get you. They know how to talk. You know, when I used to work at Newport Creamery, I'd work the register sometimes, and we had lessons on how to deal with flim-flam artists.

That's what they called them, flim-flam artists. So they would teach you. So we had to sit there and be taught, like, how someone will fuck you up. Like, sell something that costs $3, and they'll give you a $20. And they'll say, hey, can you give me a $10 and a $5, and then the rest in quarters? And you're like, what? How much is that? And then before you know it, he's saying something else and talking over you,

and you think you owe him $40. Like you're giving him more money. He's like, I gave you a 50, so you give me the 20, that 20, and then what is it? It was $3, so you owe me $47. So before you know it, you're giving money away, and you don't understand what's happening. Especially when you're a kid. I was like, I think I was 16

when I was working there. I was a monkey. Basically a monkey. Right? And you know, these people travel all over the place and they do this to folks. They just trick them. They pickpocket them. Like, watching David Blaine do car tricks, okay? From as close as you are to me. I don't get it. I don't know

what he's doing. He could get me every time. He's gonna trick me every time. He's so good at it. And there's guys that are I don't know if. I don't know what he's doing. He could get me every time. He's going to trick me every time. He's so good at it. Yeah. And there's guys that are, I don't know if they're at that level, but there's guys at a level that you or I can't perceive, and they'll steal your watch. Yeah.

There's guys who can get your watch off. Yeah. They can get your watch off. I don't know how they do it, but it's a known thing. It's a known thing that guys know how to get your watch off. Fucking guys. I mean, how many videos on YouTube? There's awesome videos of like children doing this to people you could see like kids like get trained to do this

It's like they it's hacking our operating system essentially He stuffed a card into my friend Jeff's watch band and Jeff didn't even know was in there He's like look it's there and he's like what he looks at his watch, but he like pull it out It's the card he was looking for what? He looks at his watch band. He's like, pull it out. And it's the card he was looking for. Folded up, tucked into his watch band. You're like, what did you just do? So if that guy's a thief, if he was like some, oh, is this someone stealing something? Yeah.

There's a whole genre of YouTube video. Oh, boy. Look at that. Wow. Little tiny kids. Yeah. They're trained. Wow.

They're trained to steal shit. They practice. Yeah, they practice to do it. I mean, this is just, look, we see this on the human realm, and we're like, oh, my God, they're children. You see a coral reef and a little fish come and take food from another fish. It's, like, just totally normal. I mean, it's not even, this is just part of being in a hive. Did that guy just steal that guy's watch?

Is that what just happened? Bro, back that up. That was crazy. Look, watch how this guy bumps into this guy. He takes his watch Watch this Is that what he did? No, no the guy still had a watch on. What did he steal? You'll never know I'm I'm too high for this. I'm too high for this, but I've never seen anybody take someone's watch off

But I know it's a real thing. Like, guys can actually take your watch off. Yeah. I mean, like, one with a strap where they do the buckle. It's annoying for you to do. Yeah. Dude, I, like, to me, this is a natural part of the environment we're in. How many things camouflage themselves as other things take energy out of a system using the camouflage? It's completely fucking normal.

Sure, it's nature. Nature. Yeah. And so you get this Trump, and you get people who fell for it. And now those people are deeply invested in that like magic trick, which he did. And by the way, this is another thing. It's like, look, you don't have to like somebody like I don't like Charles Manson. Yeah.

But man, I do recognize like how fucking entertaining he is. You know what I mean? Like that's a very entertaining cult leader. Similarly with Trump, not a fan. You know, the moment he said he implied you should shoot looters, all that. Look, we can go on and on with anti-bullying. I'm not talking about that. I'm saying the problem is that our tactic as Americans is not supposed to be we listen to the state and get our cues about how to be good people from the state our as americans what we do is we have like basic fundamental ideas that are really fucking

beautiful one of them being that we like believe that people have a right to be free and seek their own personal happiness that's beautiful man that's not we shouldn't have the state telling us different versions of what that is we we have to be intelligent and autonomous enough to do that for ourselves and then from that like really be a united states and and like what's happening now is these motherfuckers uh are not unifying us this is supposed to be the united states of america that's what it's supposed to be so if you're in a government official here and you're doing a thing that's making it all divided and fucked up and you're telling lies and you're shaming people for telling the truth, it doesn't matter if you're a Republican or a Democrat. Whatever you are, as far as I'm concerned, anti-American, which is like, man, Americans and fuck anybody who gets mad at me for saying this.

Americans are beautiful people. We both tour. We get to meet people all over the fucking place and talk to them. And they're always generally wonderful. Yeah, some of them will take your fucking watch. You know what I mean? But still, you know, in general.

In general. That you encounter very... When things were going well. See, this is the thing that shifts everything is COVID. The reason why everybody's ramped up. I mean, it's no small feat. It's not just about getting sick. It's about everybody being scared that they're going to lose loved ones or they're going to die or they're going to lose lung function.

You can't work, so you're worried about your income. There's so many people whose businesses are eroding right before their eyes. I mean, imagine if you own commercial real estate now. Jesus Christ. And you start thinking of the prospect of leasing a building that you invested all your money in out to some folks. They're not going to have offices like that anymore. People are going to do shit from home. There's a lot of people that are actually more productive working from home.

I know. It's a fucked up time. So everybody's on eight. Everybody's walking around on eight trying to keep it together. That's right. And so a guy like Trump exacerbates it because he doesn't ever come out with a unity speech. Yeah. It's always like a strong, he's always the strong boss.

You're fired. I'm the man. Yeah. I mean, this is the message and it works with a lot of people. It's a good, look, it's, it's like comedy or music. Not, not everything works on everybody, but there's a lot of people that vibe with his fucking real cartoonish version of being the boss right but it's not a bring everybody together thing and that's this is what we need we need the guy in the movie that stands

on top of the hill the guy that says we have more in similarity than we do that we disagree with. Yeah, man. We're together. We're friends. Most people, most of our issues we could work out amicably. We could talk. Most of our issues. The vast majority. And we need to not just dwell on those, but embrace those.

Like embrace all the things we like. We want safe schools for our kids. We want safe streets. We want safe schools for our kids. We want safe streets. We want a fucking bridge maintenance so the bridges don't collapse. We want everybody to be okay. Yeah, man. We want no crime. We don't want unjust prison. We don't want people being unjustly accused and then sentenced to life in jail and other people to work forever to get them.

We don't want any of that. We don't want any prosecutors that hide evidence that shows that a person was innocent that's real today in 2020 yeah they don't even get in trouble for it yeah man it's right it's it's true and i think that the only the maybe this is naive i think we got to get over our addiction to the person on the hill we got to get over our addiction to the idea that the way we govern is the only way to govern. That's it. And that's why when I see that, what was it called again?

A Chaz? You know, again, like, Yeah! To me, it's not, to me what I'm seeing there is at the very least a radical experiment and a potential. Now, it's a temper tantrum by some 20-year-old kids who hate capitalism.

How old were the founding fathers? That's a good question question but they didn't have YouTube. I think they would have formed a much better opinion. Well the whole and this is the other part of it like so I keep thinking about and again man this is where my case is going to start falling apart but that's okay I don't mind if my case

falls apart. For me it's I keep thinking like okay so what are they telling us now? They're saying well either you're a socialist or a capitalist or a communist and tell me what kind of isth I am or what ism I'm into and I keep thinking like, okay, so what are they telling us now? They're saying, well, either you're a socialist or a capitalist or a communist. Tell me what kind of is I am or what ism I'm into. And I keep thinking like, man, isn't it possible with all the technology we have that there's a new ism? That no one doesn't have the first part of the word attached to it? Good point. part of the word attached to it good point so it's like and and so at the very least if you

meet someone who's like in passionate in a real way not in a bullshit way by the way man because like there's a big difference between like you you know right away when you run into somebody who's trying to tell you how to be it's horrible it's a even even if it's in a light way it's such a it's so dronesome Some people want you sick some people want you to stabilize and like unbounce them one one things for sure people don't want you to Know you are because if you know you are they can't tell you who you are But but you know if you run into someone who's legitimately you turn a utopian here We go get ready to lose fucking viewers right now, baby utopian here we go get ready to lose fucking viewers right now baby p this is where people press stop on spotify go on to like listen to like my favorite murder or whatever but

i was at burning man and stop stop stop stop stop hey man i am sure burning man is like everything else in the world there's a lot of profound conversations and few of them that want to make you just bury your head in the sand. Definitely. But one, this guy came up to me. You're just getting these great chats. And this guy came up to me. We're just yapping. And he said, do you think world peace is possible?

He wasn't being a missionary or anything. Just asking. Just asking. It's a real question, but it's so cliche that it seems like a joke question that a moron would ask you. Yeah. Isn't that funny? Yeah. What would you want more than that?

World equality, world financial equality, world peace. There's like four or five things you would ever say. Like, look, that might cure up a lot of shit. Yeah, that's right. But to ask it is so cliche. You could do it at Burning Man. What? Well, that's it.

World peace. is so cliche like everybody's like burning man what well that's it that's world peace well you know and that's the other thing if like let's say you're at the venice boardwalk and some son of a bitch dressed like uncle sam comes and asks you that you're gonna like go the other direction like fuck you like you're just gonna leave right maybe if you get out of nicaragua man yeah yeah but but yeah he was actually somebody who's really into buckminster fuller and i think that was something buckminster fuller put out there, which is like this question is very important, and you should ask yourself this as an individual. Because if you think world peace is possible, even if you acknowledge that maybe right now it's not possible,

but if you can invent in your mind some technology, or even if you can invent in your mind like an X, like an algebra for a thing you don't have the space for yet, but it could be, if there's any sense thing you don't have the space for yet, but it could be. If there's any sense in you at all that world peace is possible, then from that point forward, you should be part of whatever it is that's going to make us have that great utopian ideal that transcends American borders.

And because that's the other problem is the American dream thing. It's confined. It's not the American dream. It's the other problem is the american dream thing it's confined it's not the american dream it's the human dream the human dream is the intuition we all have that there's a way for us to be on the planet together that doesn't involve blowing each other up right and that's i think it's possible i think it's possible i just don't know how it would be how to get there necessarily but i think it's possible and one thing's for sure whenever you get a trump or any fucking pundit blowing out divisive shit into people's brains they are not drop if there's like a scale one side's world peace one side's chaos they're dropping they're dropping their their pebbles on the chaos part of the scale and it's like why do

you think they're doing that because man let me tell you there's a lot of money to be made in fucking chaos man there's a lot of money i mean isn't that what an engine is an engine is kind of like controlled explosions do you remember when trump talked openly once about the military industrial complex yeah and they said they want to go to war yeah and you're like what the problem is he says so many other things that are ridiculous. I know. If only he just said that. If only he just said that. The problem with him saying that is you can go, yeah, yeah, yeah, but he also called this chick he fucked a horse face.

Like, you know, and you go, oh, yeah, that's not nice. Yeah. He had a thing there. Like a moment, like an Eisenhower moment, not quite as eloquent. But when Eisenhower was on television and he warned people about the military industrial complex as he was leaving office. That's to this day like one of the most profound speeches I've ever seen. Yeah. It gives me a chill.

Because I think, well, this is black and white from how many fucking years ago? Yeah. If this shit was going on then, it's not like it stopped going on. Didn't stop. See, one of the reasons why we're in such a fucked up space politically is because this is the first time where politics have been really exposed to the general public by the internet. Like you have a different access to politics you never had before.

You have real time things breaking. You find out, like if someone, like Gavin Newsom said he was going to take a pay cut. He didn't. Fox News prints this. It goes wild. And you get all these stories like, oh, would you have known that before cell phones and the internet? You've never known that he didn't do that. You would have to

be a person who's really into politics. And there's not that many of them. Most people are busy. So now, politics relies on scandals. And scandals are what weasels people through. That's it. So the thing about scandals is not everybody's a good person. And if you do a lot of fucked up shit but you own it the way Trump did,

people didn't count on the asshole vote. Because there's a lot of assholes out there. And finally they had a king. They're like, this is our king. Fuck you. MAGA. They wear the fucking sunglasses and they talk shit to Ted Cruz at rallies. Those guys finally had a king.

And that's like, we didn't, there was no king on the other side. There was no king, the compassionate, intelligent king who actually made sense. Well, that's the sad part. That's what we don't have. Think how depressing your very astute observation is in the sense that the idea was we weren't gonna have a fucking monarchy here yeah that was the whole point and now we elect a monarchy yeah yeah that's the whole point man and it's like and again it's like look if like if you start playing the game that you're the smart person in the room and that if people disagree with you, they must be dumb.

If people have different ideas than you, they must be stupid. And then you start shaming them. What can you what all you're doing is creating this like you're going to create a reaction to that. And the reaction is going to be a celebration of every single thing you're with your great, vast, elite intelligence deriding, you know. elite intelligence to writing, you know? And so I think, you know, that's the problem is it's like, it's just there's nothing worse than when like people who are legitimately smart, have read a bunch of fucking books, have got master's degrees,

have not developed enough compassion to understand that just about every single person on the planet wants to be happy, wants to have a full stomach, doesn't want to hurt anybody, and would run into a building on fire to save somebody. Most everybody, I would say. I would say at least 90%. A large percentage. A large percentage. And these motherfuckers are shaming them and telling them they're idiots or they're stupid

or this and that. It's like, fuck you, man. You don't know what these people came up through. You don't know. These people were born in houses filled with fucking methamphetamine smoke whose parents were like you know absolutely fucking insane and they still managed to get out and get a job and have a fucking life and pay taxes and now your fucking ass is going to tell these people who didn't have the fucking trust fund that you had that got you into the fucking ivy league university They're fucking idiots. Shut the fuck up.

Stop. They're not. And then I'm shaming those people. That's the problem. The idea is like- You're not shaming them. You're just honestly illuminating their current situation. Let's just-

I don't think it's shaming them. It's time to let go of the whole snooty thing. Also, on the other side, it's time to let go of every single one of these people must be burning candles to Moloch in their backyard thing too like let's let go of all those stories for a second i'm not saying there aren't people burning candles to malik i've never definitely are i've never met the bohemian grove video is that malik yes that's malik the owl god when alex jones isn't it just an hour john ronson's no it's molek they were talking about is it molek is how you pronounce it according to alex uh john Ronson's. No, it's Molech. They were talking about it.

Is it Molech is how you pronounce it? Molech the Owl God, according to Alex. John Ronson and Alex Jones, they snuck into Bohemian Grove. This was when everybody was saying it was all bullshit. And I say this many times, and I'll say it some more. Give me that lighter. You got it, Fred. Alex Jones, he's made some mistakes, and some big ones.

But he's also actually exposed some real shit. And he owns up to the mistakes he's made. They're not good. He doesn't think they're good. There's a thing about finding conspiracies everywhere that's not good for your brain. I really believe this. I think that if you go looking for those things and that's all you look for and you look for them all the time, you can get real paranoid and real crazy. And then there's also a bunch of people that are trying to stop you from doing that because you do expose some crazy shit.

You know, he was talking about Epstein a long time ago. I know. A long time ago. He was saying there was a fucking island and they take all these rich politicians and some celebrities and they bang these kids. And I was like, come on. He was telling me this a long time ago. So he's also the one who told me about Bohemian Grove well I actually watched it for that's I think this tape was

actually made before I met him so he went and snuck in to this place where like former presidents go there's a photograph of it's uh Ronald Reagan with Herbert Walker Bush and a couple other people all standing around and it's like these are the people that used to hang out at this place and they would put on robes and they would worship an owl god and they would burn an effigy. And they're playing, and Alex snuck in

and made video footage of this shit. And no one's denying that it's real. This really did happen. So they're in with these bankers and former presidents

and they're dressed like druids. Yes. And some guy brings over something that's an effigy that's supposed to be a body, a wrapped up effigy. It's a bunch of sticks in a blanket, but it's shaped like a body. And they drop it on the fire, and they're all worshiping an owl god. Why is that bad? Imagine if you saw those, if that's what your business is,

just finding those things. How crazy do you think you get? First of all, wait. Then you add in vodka and head wounds. Wait, hold on wait go to the vodka and head wounds part what do you mean south jones okay i got you a lot of vodka and he had a bad head injury god damn it man when i was in liberal arts school man there's this great teacher who changed my life sam scoville and he one of the things he taught was so beautiful he still teaches there one of the things he taught was figure out a way to take in all information and then filter out the shit that's not real

and keep the real stuff. And like, you know, Alex Jones is like, let's, yeah. Some of the stuff is real. Take what's real and throw out the rest. There's a good chunk of it that's real. Like, I remember he was telling me that there's governments using chemicals that turn frogs gay. I was like, what? What are you talking about? He goes, yes, he goes, pesticides that turn frogs gay. I was like what what are you talking about? He goes yes, he goes pesticides are turning frogs gay, and I'm like that can't be real. No there really is that true Yes, there's pesticides that change frogs genders what yes Yes, but some pesticide fucks with frogs genders That sucks

Maybe it doesn't I it depends on the frog. Maybe it's awesome for the frog. Maybe frogs don't give a fuck because they've never been taught homophobia. Why would they care? They don't care who they fuck. But there's a real thing that... See where you find that? It's a pesticide that has some sort of an effect, an unintended effect on frogs' genders.

Dude, that's another thing that people don't talk about. Pesticides that have been used in golf courses and there's people who live around those. That's a chemical dump. Yeah, golf courses are fucked up. Pesticide atrazine can turn male frogs into females. So this is a fucking pesticide

that changes the gender or should I say the sex? Is it the same thing? Sex and gender? Hey, I'm not getting sucked into that fucking black hole, Rogan. You can keep that shit to yourself. But hey, I'll get sucked into another black hole. Isn't that crazy, though? Well, yeah.

Before we get into that stuff, I want to say this real quick. Okay. Is that camera on me? Friends at the Bohemian Grove. Future friends, I should say. I just want you to know, I don't know much about you. I know Alex Jones, you know, probably on vodka drinks.

I don't think he was then. I think he was sober. He started drinking after all this. Please don't fuck this up for me. Sorry, sorry. He had an infiltrator. Look, I went to a summer camp. We had bonfires.

We wore robes. I mean, not like maybe what you do. I just want to say, hey, come on invite me please i won't tell anybody anything i've heard you guys are pretty awesome actually what i've heard is the idea was to get a bunch of hardcore neocons together and then mix some artists in in the hopes that like having like brushing shoulders with artists would in some way shape or form loosen some people up a little bit. And I've also heard you have a tram

that connects campsites there to other campsites, meaning you just get in the tram and suddenly you're hanging out with Dick Cheney. Listen, I won't tell anybody. I got a podcast. I won't even tell Joe. Let me in. I'll worship Moloch. I won't worship Moloch if it means

hurting people. But I don't understand why people are upset about fucking... By the way, that fucking video. Why? What's wrong with worshiping? Nothing. You're getting so excited. This is the thing that I get confused about here.

Okay. It's like, in our country, we've got people who are Christian. Yes. And that's a beautiful thing. And I do love Jesus. I was reading the book of Mark today regarding the parable of the sower. But that being said, I don't think it's fair necessarily to tell people they can't worship an owl or burn an effigy in front of an owl in some kind of symbolic, magical ritual that represents the disintegration of your negative energy or whatever it may be. I really don't know.

But to me, that's the other problem that's happening right now. Superstition is running rampant. I'm friends with lots of witches. I know a few Satanists. I know a few people who are under the occult. And I don't know a single one of them that would tolerate child abuse. I don't know a single one that wouldn't kill somebody. Some of them would kill people if they thought they were hurting kids. And make it so that nobody found the body.

Some of the Satanists I know, they would kill someone probably. I don't know for sure. I'm not trying to throw any Satanists under the bus, but I'm just saying this idea that we can't have alternate pagan religions in our country without immediately being associated with human sacrifice or child abuse, I think that goes against the american spirit it's like look because people don't want to subscribe to your particular like very popular global religion doesn't necessarily implicate them in like something that is truly a horror which is human trafficking so to me this is the problem is like man we got to be a little bit more nuanced in our apprehend or in our conceptualization of

these people again i don't know what's going on at the fucking bohemian grove but from what i've heard it's basically a summer camp for billionaires where they try to get artists in there to like loosen them up a little bit that's what i've heard i could be wrong who told you this is this i honestly can't fucking say hmm interesting look man i don't know and i know i've seen the video bohemian grove have you seen it the the ritual in front of the owl guy have you seen it yeah dude go come with me to burning man and you will see that oh i'm sure every 50 feet look i don't think it's that big of a deal i really don't if it involves hurting kids it's a big deal and if these motherfuckers are doing anything that involves human sacrifice hurting human beings

in in in a in any application of that of course then it's the worst thing on earth and i'm so sorry that i said anything about it but i don't think i don't think that's what this is i mean obviously what we're seeing is not that we don't know what, obviously, what we're seeing is not that. We don't know what else happens. But what you're seeing is them burning sticks in front of this owl god. And it's like this crazy speech they're giving while it's going on. It's really weird. Hey, can we hear some of it, the speech? I don't know where the speech is in the video.

I found another video where they, like, stabilize the footage. Oh. It's, like, speech is in the video. I found another video where they stabilize the footage. Oh. It's like a caption. But I mean, before this, nobody really believed it. Listen up. The fire shall have its will of me. Beyond all care. And all the winds, big memory without doubt.

Hail, fellow ships, eternal flame. Once again, this summer sets us free. And now they're lighting the effigy on fire and everybody's cheering. It looks fine. Stanley Kubrick had this quote once to Nicole Kidman. I think it was. And they were working on Eyes Wide Shut. See if you can find what she said about

the elites that he had said. I know I saved it. I can find it if I have a chance to look at my laptop. It was something about him talking about the powers that run the world and that they all have something on each other

and that's how they all can stay together. They all compromise each other. That's what Skull and Bones was about. That's what all that stuff's about. So he had a much more concise quote on that. But when you see something like that, you go, well, maybe it's fun that they do it that nobody knows they do it.

You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Maybe it's like one of those rituals where you get together, your dad thinks it's hilarious and you both put your hoods on. You go out there and you burn the owl or you burn the sticks in front of the owl and what's fun is that you're not supposed to be doing it

and it's a secret but nothing really is happening. That's also on the table. Yeah. It's possible but it's fucking weird man. That was weird. Imagine if there was no Catholic church. Imagine if you are a billionaire. That's what you're doing with your weekend?

But imagine if there was no Catholic church and there was one video of a mass. Right. We would be like, what the fuck? Right. That's fucked up. What is this craziness? Imagine any religious ceremony if there was only one version of it. Because I'm not trying to reduce it to summer camp fun or even fraternity games.

Who knows what it is, right? You can know what it is. Yeah, they'd have to tell us. But we just see something crazy. But it's not evil. I mean, what is it? Well, for me, it's a question mark. I don't really know.

I just dress weird. My tendency whenever I have a question mark is to assign malevolence to it just out of a basic kind of weakness in my own bias. If I don't know what a thing is, like when you're waiting for the doctor to call regarding some scan they just did on you. If you have the slightest fear of death or any kind of bias in you, then that space in between when you— Maybe we're overlooking this. and you then that space in between when you when maybe we're overlooking this maybe it's like their version of renaissance fair and people just want to escape reality and pretend that they live with moloch the owl god and throw a fucking hood over your head and yes please and peace be with you

yeah i mean it could be some kind of like pagan celebration right you know and if you look back at like the history of paganism or hedonism, Terrence McKenna does such a great job talking about the Eleusidian Mysteries and all these things that aren't really quite as accessible as the main religions of the world. All the religions of the world, they have

this beautiful quality in them, depending on the religion. And generally one of the qualities that's so beautiful is a mechanism of self forgiveness and a mechanism of purification that a general assessment of the human condition is being somewhat Depraved. I how many like the puking in ayahuasca you're purging yourself from your darkness the confession booth in Catholicism maybe you could say in Gnosticism, like true Gnosis, or in Buddhism, like connecting with the actual reality versus your overlays of reality. It goes on and on. This is all within

each one is this idea of like, there's a way for us to ritualistically create, if you want to be a pure scientific materialist, a beautiful placebo effect that gets you to drop some of your neurotic qualities or at the very least reset your intention to make the world a better place and anything whatever that I don't care what the fuck it is whatever it may be if that's what it's all about is a recognition like man you

beat yourself up every day you're so hard on yourself you beat yourself up for all the shit you did in the past and we live in a world right now where there's not much tolerance. There's not much forgiveness. And anything that allows a kind of like steam valve from which all that shit can get released. So from this day forward, you're born again. You're brand new.

I don't care if it's an owl. Man, if you think that's crazy, look at Main Street Disneyland any night. That's some crazy shit to watch, too. And some people's entire lives, I'm not being changed from having a great night anywhere. So, you know, to me, it's like ritual is not scary to me. What's scary to me, though, is anything that objectifies humans, enslaves humans, hurts kids. Sacrifice. Yeah, human sacrifice, any of that stuff.

And if that's what's really happening there, I truly don't know. Then I completely apologize for any defense of it. It's just sticks. The question is, was it always just sticks? Did it used to be people? Did they used to sacrifice a person? Did they stop doing it at one point in time? One widely cited Nicole Kidman interview was made up by the fake news site News Punch.

You sons of bitches. God damn it. They got me. They got you. Does it say what the quote is? Yeah. What is the quote? He said that Hollywood's run by pedophiles or something.

I found the Reddit page where it was put up. damn they got me glad i asked you hey you want to see something real creepy can you jamie may i ask you to look something up look up the that there's a video of a van that was actually used for human trafficking i saw that that shit is chilling terrifying chilling and it's like to me it's like, to me, it's like, man, if we're going to be, it is, there's anybody who is at the helm of the ship that's fighting those motherfuckers right now deserves medals. And I hope that they never stop what they're doing. I just want them to be very precise in their attacks. That's all.

Don't dilute your position by getting caught up in something. And again, I am not, I'm already going to get attacked for this saying like Doug, it works for the blah, blah. I don't. I don't. I'm a Buddhist and I go to Ram Dass retreats and Burning Man. But if they invited me to the Bohemian Grove, I'd go. And if I went there and I saw that. I was going to say Stanley Kubrick can keep a secret.

We can too. Are you saying you would go to the Grove with me? Yes. That'd be awesome. I wouldn't tell anybody. But you know, if you and I were invited there and we saw anything happening that was anything to do with like what people- I would think it would be a trap and they would be setting us up.

They would put on like some sort of fake thing just to make us look like fools. So we talk about it on our podcast. Do you know, man, if we ever do a movie together, that's the movie. Like it should be all of your friends going to the bohemian get invited the bohemian girl exactly right like i become friends with some guy who's like a banker who really likes comedy yeah right and then this guy tells you he gets drunk one night like i know the illuminati they're real the bilderberg group it's real like what yeah man jackal island it's a they made the federal institute it's not even from America man and you're like what

what and then this guy starts unraveling the tale of America can I tell you something crazy the Federal Reserve yeah people in my family used to own parts of Jekyll Island okay tell the story of Jekyll Island because that's what I'm talking about if people don't know it well here's the problem I don't know the story

like I remember hearing some shit I have like two paragraphs in my head memorized i remember hearing people in my family had some claim on land there and that they sold it and i since then i was just kind of resentful because it's like they sold it for nothing and like if they'd held on to it like you know i would be at the fucking bohemian grove and so jackal island supposed to be the place where they invented the Federal Reserve, right? I went there. There's a great hotel. Is that it, Jamie?

What does it say? Listen, this is all disclaimer. I forgot where to look. All three of us are morons. Yes! That's one thing that drives me crazy. There's one of the things about silencing people that are crazy online. I can tell when someone's crazy

and part of someone being crazy is you see these crazy people and you go oh i think they might be crazy and then you look into it you go yeah none of their none of what they're saying makes sense they actually are crazy but damn that was pretty close yeah dude you gotta be the thing about people saying things that other people disagree with when they want to silence those people is you don't think that other people are smart as you you're thinking that's going to work on other people if someone's saying that the earth is flat and there's lizard people that control the sunrise if that was you'd go okay you know what i'm saying yeah it wouldn't work yeah so why not let someone say it so if someone says it doesn't work on you yeah but what are you worried about you're worried it's going to

work on somebody else yes that's what you're about? You're worried it's going to work on somebody else. That's what you're worried about. That's the weird thing about COVID, because it's the one thing where you're not allowed to do that anymore. Because if you do anything that goes against the government bylines, anything that goes against what the World Health Organization thinks you should do, or CDC thinks you should do, you get kicked off of YouTube. You get silenced.

Everybody gets removed, whether you're right or wrong. It's the one thing where you can't talk crazy. You can talk crazy about the earth being hollow. You could talk about beings that are made out of light that fly in and out of our consciousness. And that's responsible for all of our ideas. Yes. And you could talk about how there's an application that's coming in 2023. It's right now being vetted by the NSA to make sure that we can use it so we can communicate with

the aliens you can have all these wacko videos where you're making up and no one cares but if you say that masks don't help and what we need to do is uh get healthier they'll remove you from youtube well that's the fire in a crowded theater thing yeah like you can't yell fire in a crowded theater so so like the pro yell fire in a crowded theater. The problem with it is, to me, is I have gone through every single stage of grief over YouTube. Mask is a bad analogy.

Maybe a better analogy is you can open up businesses as long as you do it carefully. I used to love YouTube, man. I used to love it. I still love it. What I loved about it in the old days, I still love it. I still go on it every day, but what loved about it in the old days, I still love it. I still go on every day, but what I loved about in the old days is what you're saying. No one's putting a cork in the champagne

bottle. It was wild. It was a museum of madness. And what was even better is the algorithm was working in your favor, so it's like, punch in hollow earth. That's gonna take you all the way to like some crazy deep shit. And never once in all my explorations on

the early days of youtube was i like this could be real it was more like wow look at how all the different versions of reality that people are processing and and it was a joy but i think what happened probably is like people realize like god like what we've got. You talk about this stuff, man. The nightmare, and it will happen, when primates figure out how to use friction to make fire. You talk about this. Yes. And that's a nightmare for the planet.

You think the fucking shit's bad now. Wait till the chimps figure out guns. Yeah. Just fire. Just fire. Just figure out how to make their own fire. Think of like the beginning, the proto-homicide shift into like figuring out.

That's a really good point. You know, this is trouble. It's a really good point. Think of how many people died in the beginning of like discovering fire. Oh my God. How many experiments were done with fire? How many things were just set on fire?

How many people just burned? I can eat it. I bet you can eat it. Let me eat it. I'll get its energy in my body. Holy fuck. He melted his face off. You know, so similarly, like with the Internet, we have this new fire.

And like people who are like in the conduits of the fire, I think they're having this really rotten come to jesus moment where they're like because i think a lot of these especially if you look in the silicon valley these people are freaks the early day like the people making technology they're nuts i've seen you that steve jobs thing with him in a commune or whatever these people are fucking crazy but i think they're recognizing that like it it's like okay the internet is the new fire yeah and and so and they're starting to understand that like because of them because of their intentional manipulative coding because of their deep study of bf skinner and behaviorism they've

produced this hyper seductive semi- sentient information dispersal device that is driving people who don't have the immune system to data that you're supposed to naturally get from school crazy. That's what's happening. And so people are going nuts because it's like. Well, add that with the addictive quality of technology. Those two things together. addictive quality of technology those two things together the addictive quality of just looking at like your phone and getting information off your phone and then add it to all this stuff that you're saying yeah man and and it's a crazy combination and there i think google and youtube and as much as like you know and i do think censorship's fuck i would hate to be in anybody's

position there because on one hand you're looking at like a very liberal very beautiful idea which is like everyone should be allowed to say whatever they want to say and then it's meeting like well but what about these hyper charismatic seductive people who like hitler you know what i mean like so now you run into this terrible place of like and also we know that there's people who don't quite have the ability to discern what's real from what's not. But we allow, this is my beef. We allow some of that because we allow evangelists. I heard Robert Tilden on one of his shows. He goes, every time you write a check to me, Satan gets a black eye.

That's good. Dude, it was in my act for a while. I was like, where's my checkbook? You Satan, you son of a bitch. Dude, it's... Imagine you could steal money that way. Look, man, I don't... But you know what I'm saying?

Yeah, I do know exactly what you're saying. And it's like this type of con artistry. Also cigarettes. It's like this type of con artistry., generally it seems like there's some kind of grandfather clause on specific styles of con. Of thievery and murder. Yeah, yeah. Cigarettes.

They know they're killing people. Imagine if you had bubble gum that killed a half a million people a year. It's like bubble gum, but people are just dying. Stop selling that shit. Stop. What the fuck are you doing? What are you doing? You're seeing. Well, people have a right to chew their bubble gum.

A lot of people like bubbles. That's all it was. You chewing bubbles makes you happy and everybody's dying of cancer. And this company's making $500 billion a year or something. How much do they make on cigarettes? Let's guess. How much would you think the annual...

By the way, I want to say this before. This is a box of cigars, okay? Mike Binder gave me that, and he gave me that one over there. Another box of cigars. I'm not anti-tobacco in any way, shape, or form. I'm a pro-free choice person. You absolutely should be able to smoke cigarettes, and I think you absolutely should be able to sell them because I don't want to roll my own.

And if I want a cigarette, as a grown fucking man, I want to be able to have a cigarette. But cigarettes do kill a half a million people in this country every year. Yeah. Or they're going to die anyway, right? Cigarettes kill them early, or they die directly because of diseases that you can get from smoking cigarettes. And their kids get sick. Dude, the worst, man. Kids that live in...

Greg Fitzsimmons, he has lung problems to this day because his parents chain smoked. And they lived in Massachusetts, so it's cold. My mom did, but she quit when I was really young. She quit when I was like six, I think. Were you in the car with her when she smoked? I must have been. With the windows up?

Well, we lived in New Jersey, so it was cold in the winter. I'm sure I was. I don't think she smoked in the car with her kids, though. Dude, do you mind if I have a little more of this? I don't fucking have a in New Jersey so cold in the winter I'm sure I was I don't think she smoked in the car with her kids though dude do you mind if I have a little more of this thank you it's so good uh I I remember Fletcher North Carolina middle of winter you'd go down and wait for the bus my friend Jimmy Fink I think it was Jimmy Fink his mom would like let us get in her car to wait for the bus it's wonderful very sweet but also I think and I'm Fink. His mom would like let us get in her car to wait for the bus. It was wonderful.

Very sweet. But also I think, and I'm sorry, Jimmy, if you're out there. I know we haven't talked in a long time. I still love you though. But like, and I'm sorry if it's not you and I'm getting confused here. But I just remember she smoked and like there was smoke in the car. My dad smoked. I would ride in the car with him on trips and he would smoke and you'd breathe in the smoke. And like, so, so to me, like where, and again, like this is always the problem, which is like, clearly we need regular, there has to be some regulatory principle in the world.

If there are people who steal watches, that means there's going to be groups of people who get together and talk about better ways to steal watches. If there's groups of people who get together and talk about better ways to steal watches, and then groups of people who get together talk about better ways to steal watches and then we create a way for them to form a thing called like a corporation you know what i mean you got you need to regulate that that's why we need regulation yeah so but then the problem is is like who does the regulating and what what's the incentive for you to regulate is there a financial incentive yeah what regulators get paid an exorbitant amount of money let's say you and I start a vape pen company that is a nicotine vape pen. I like what you're thinking. And then we start pouring money into people who are against tobacco, knowing if we can make tobacco illegal, but keep the

vape pens legal, we're going to become the new tobacco. But here's the thing about vape pens. This is the real thing about vape pens. Some of them are not good for you at all. They're real bad for you. And there's a connection, they're saying now, between COVID and kids that vape. Kids that vape dying of COVID or getting serious COVID problems. But it makes sense. I have a friend who's got a kid that sucks on one of them things all day long just just vapes constantly kids vape and these kids that vape all the time like the oils that you're taking into your lungs

that's not healthy the idea that it's not cigarettes so it's healthy no it's there's a lot of evidence that points to some of those companies that make those oils They don't do it in a way where you know There's like different kinds of oil yeah And they have different the different reactions to the heat and some of them are like apparent am I saying this right? Let's check on this What is the problem with the different types of vapes because I think there was one type of oil that they're using you know Cuz they have to they have to somehow another mix

One type of oil that they're using, because they have to somehow or another mix. The same with the marijuana ones. You have to mix this stuff with the THC in some sort of chemical. But it's different. You can do it organically. I know they've done it with coconut oil. I know they've done it with things like that. It's the same way with hash, man. I think it's like the way people make hash varies.

In some people, there's a healthy way to make it yeah and they're obviously the way using the most chemicals is the cheapest and so there's certain types of hash that you i think are derived and again my friends out there look i don't know but it's something like butane someone told me this at a marijuana store i can't remember what but like cheaper. I think the concern is the oil. Like what kind of oil? I know there's one guy that was selling them with MCT oil. Okay, here it is. Authorities in the Food and Drug Administration and Centers for Disease Control and Prevention

still aren't sure what's causing the dangerous trend, but theories range from issues with vegetable oil and vape juice to the idea that doctors are just now taking note of a problem that's been percolating for a long time. So, okay. So that was the speculation that people were using. Like if you try to cook, okay, and you try to like sear a steak and you do it with olive

oil, you're going to fuck it up because olive oil, it's not like something that you really sear something with. Like you put olive oil and you don't want to get it that hot. Olive oil is more something that you'd like to saute with but other oils like avocado oil or Or beef fat like that stuff is amazing because you can get it really fucking hot and it has a very very high Temperature where it turns to smoke right so it's like healthier for you the idea So if you're misting this stuff into your lungs you you don't want it burnt. Right. Right? You want something that's more... So I would imagine

if you're using these cheap... This is, again, I'm a moron. I'm not a scientist, but we're doing science. If you're using a vape pen with, like, some really shitty canola oil, and you're getting that burnt spray inside your lungs, like, that could be terrible for you. Terrible. You got some fucking GMO

corn syrup bullshit in your lungs yeah you know the haunting thing man you go to a pharmacy right and you watch as the pharmacist dispenses the drugs how careful he is right like they are like so careful in their administration of these pills because they know if like if for one second you give someone xanax when they were supposed to get penicillin, you killed somebody, right? So you have to be very careful. But like, meanwhile, look at us right now, Joe. Did you do a test on that bottle of booze?

Are these, I didn't even, I honestly, it was embarrassing. I'm like, I don't know how to light this blunt. But then like, I'm smoking something called dad grass. I don't know what's in this shit. I don't do any studies here. That's for people who love Steely Dan. I do love Steely Dan. I do too. Some great fucking songs. You know what's in this shit i don't do any studies here that's for people who love steely dan i do i do love steely i do too some great fucking songs you know what i mean i'm saying like the general like in in america and anywhere the general sense is i'm gonna eat it if you give it to me especially

if it's in a colorful box right and then you're like it must be okay and and the problem is is like sometimes it's not okay look Look at thalamide, man. Like, you know, look at like the big moments in history when it was shown, like, actually sometimes the stuff we sell you- Is that thalidomide? Thalidomide. Yeah, thalidomide. That's the stuff that gave kids birth defects.

Defects, yeah. Or what was that radioactive shit they painted on watches? Oh my God, dude. We did a whole show where we talked about all the diseases that people got from iridium. Was that what it was, Jamie? What was the radium? Radium or iridium? They were using it for all kinds of things

and people's faces were rotting off. Yeah. Literally, they have holes in their face. They were painting it on watches because it would glow. It was cool looking. So similarly, it's like... They were using it for makeup, I think. Yeah. And here we have the internet. Here we have the fucking internet.

Suddenly we have a hyper, a way to like super connect with every single person on the planet, but not just connect with every person on the planet. We have an artificial intelligence based on a neural network. I don't understand how it works. Suggesting who you should connect with. You know what I mean? work i don't understand how it works suggesting who you should connect with you know what i mean it's like is the internet the thalidomide technological thalidomide are we looking at i think so is that what we were dealing with right now and like i think we're on a spaceship and we

haven't quite figured out how to slow it down or where the brakes are or how to go left or right yeah but the spaceship is being propelled by thoughts and ideas and social media and world events and drugs and sex and politics and power and control and it's all just hurling through space and while while it's all happened we haven't quite figured out where the brakes are or what's the best way to be harmonious with each other so we're all in this constant battle for control thinking that once we get in control, we're going to set this fucking ship straight and everybody's going to be cool.

Finally, we're going to get along because you're side one, but you're still going to have half the fucking country that hates you. Half the country that doesn't agree with you. Half the country that has to be really tolerant in order to engage you in any of your ideas and admit that you're right.

And this is what we're doing. And it's not real not real it's not real I don't think it's real I think a lot of the people that have ideas in one way if they could just talk to people in in in in the realm of the area where they have disagreement I bet they could work it out I think the problem is more people not talking than anything Joe tell me about the spaceship idea some more. Because I don't think you're saying, knowing you like I know you, I wonder if you're saying that metaphorically or like if there's. It is metaphorically, but it's also actual. We are on a spaceship, whether we like it or not. We're spinning a thousand miles an hour and we're driving through infinity at a pace that if you if it was small and it passed by you

you would go holy fuck yeah what was if it was if the earth was the size of a baseball and it whipped by you in real time the way it's moving through the universe you'd be like fuck yeah that's what the earth's doing but the earth is huge yeah it's huge and yet it's tiny and earth's doing. But the earth is huge. It's huge, and yet it's tiny. And it's surrounded by things that are enormous. We've got a sun that's a million times bigger than us. Just a fireball in the sky that all life on earth depends on. A very clear space between earth and the sun. A perfect balance.

Perfect balance between this in unstoppable heat and just keep the water melted don't boil it man and we're hurling through infinity and while we're doing that we're trying to pick who gets to be the leader to steal your tax money there you try to tell you you can't go to a beauty shop I don't want you getting a cough that's right trying to tell people stay home stay home Trump's trying to tell people, stay home. Stay home. Trump's trying to kill America.

Yep. It's the wrong approach. The approach they should make should be all about positivity. Everybody who's voting knows who Trump is. Everybody knows about the riots. Everybody knows all those things. Talk about what you want to do. Talk about what you want to do. Don't talk about how bad

the orange guy is. Tell me what you want to do. Don't use woke lingo. Don't you fucking do it. Don't you do it. Tell me. Tell me. For real. Don't bullshit me. Tell me what you can do to fix this. Just that. tell me you want to

bring everybody together just that everybody right wing left we got to meet concessions we got to figure out like where we meet in the middle there's much more that we agree with than we don't agree yeah much more let's concentrate on that stuff and let's be nice about this other shit yeah that's right that's it yes look it sounds like you know what you're saying it's beautiful and the what's one of the qualities that's beautiful about is simple that i when i saw i got to see the dalai lama speak once and it's like wow you in person no and uh he was at a like an event right but you were in the audience yeah i was in the audience so he was there he was there audience. So he was there. He was there with his translator.

It was beautiful, man. The vibe in the room was so sweet. And like, you know, to go back to what you were talking about earlier, some people will tell you a stupid thing, like a thing on the side of a cereal box. Dude, I apologize for that. Be kinder for... Oh, I'm so sorry.

But you know, I could tell you, Joe, you know what the world needs love I do like cliches though sometimes sometimes they're accurate depends on who the cliche is coming from if they're sincere so the Dalai Lama is on stage and he says

you can always be kinder and it was like you could feel this wave rushing out of him it was like the essence of Buddhism just rushing out. Everyone simultaneously thinking like, yeah, he's right. And it transcends politics. It transcends geopolitics. And that is why what you're saying is so beautiful because it's the same thing, which is like, you know, like this planet.

We're so lucky to be on a planet going that fast and and and like we're so lucky to get a chance a little peephole into time we're not here that long i think this covid thing gives us an opportunity to realize how lucky we really are i do too i mean for the people that are struggling right now financially or struggling with their health it doesn't you know it doesn't register with you. And I'm sorry about that. But I think for the people that aren't fucked by this, there is a moment where we get to realize like, oh, okay, we were taking this for granted. We thought we had all this thing wired in.

They didn't have it wired. I mean, they got rid of the Senate. What was the pandemic? There was a pen. The White House decided like a year before Corona decided to get rid of the pandemic. What was their response? What was the actual office? No, like he got rid of the whole office based on it.

They dissolved it. Just imagine. Imagine if like there's an asteroid. Like when's it coming? 40 years. Fire everybody. Fire everyone. We're fucked.

We're fucked. Just fire everybody. The more tests, the more sick people we have. Stop the tests. Fire everyone. We're fucked. We're fucked. Just fire everybody. The more tests, the more sick people we have. Stop the tests. Just fire. They did that for real. I know. I know.

So from that, what did they teach us? They taught us that we have to depend on each other right now, not the state. Well, I think they should give people the opportunity to do what they want to do. I say this too much. I say it in almost every show, but you can't tell people they can't work. It doesn't make any sense. You're not smart enough.

For you to say that the only thing that matters is whether or not these people expose themselves to the virus, at this point, I think that's ridiculous. But can I tell you the problem? Something else matters. I'm sorry to cut you off. But they have to acknowledge that something else matters. They have to acknowledge that the financial problems that people are going through are almost insurmountable. They have to acknowledge that.

And that destroys a lot of people. It creates a lot of depression, creates a lot of suicide, creates a lot of drug abuse, creates a lot of turmoil and a lot of mental health issues. That's a fact. It's true. So we're taking away people's sovereignty. Look, man, if you want to, that was another great American tradition. If you want to kill yourself. Well, you can do it with so many other ways.

You're welcome to kill yourself. You can go BMX flipping. No one's going to stop you from doing flips with your motorbike. That was the whole point. I mean, that's like, remember when everything got safe? Like the whole point, there was a time when everything was like all gonzo and the problem is you're spreading it right so it's not just you and your motorbike it's you crashing your motorbike into a crowd of people that is that's one of the problems there's a lot of that's a good way of looking

at it honestly yeah but the bigger to me the bigger that is a problem and it's fucked the bigger problem is okay so you own an applebee's or whatever right and suddenly the government's like okay everyone can go back to work but no one solved the problem you the owner own an Applebee's or whatever. Right. And suddenly the government's like, OK, everyone can go back to work. But no one solved the problem. You, the owner of the Applebee's, calls the general manager like, hey, dude, get the waiters, wait staff back. We're opening it up. You're not going to be there. You're going to have the general manager come in and you're going to have the waitstaff come in. Now, the waitstaff have been living off of unemployment benefits supplied by the federal government that sometimes are more than like what they were making at the place. That's not a bad thing. But all of a sudden what happened is prior to a true reduction of this pandemic that can kill you, most of the time it doesn't, but you might be the one who

steps on the landmine. All of a sudden they they just decided, well, the economy needs to work. So now your unemployment benefits get cut off, and you have to go back to work. But they haven't solved the problem yet. So you become the person who has to bear the weight of the failed approach to the disease. And that's why it's fucked up. Yes, you're right. Man, my friend runs the new california barber shop in echo park brian he's one of my best he started off as my barber

he became my best friend he's one of the coolest people i know and like i like it like one of the reasons i want to leave la is because that shop can't open that's where i used to go to get my beard trimmed in my but it wasn't just that was The hangout. It's a real barbershop. You have these great conversations. You meet people. He's gotten me into a sublet once when I needed to be in L.A. for a little bit. One of the sad things about being bald, I never really developed a relationship with a barbershop. By the time I shaved my head, it was too late. That's a good thing to do.

You can get a nice straight razor shave. There's something about that, that's like for girl with girls it's acknowledged that a lot of ladies like beauty salons they like to get their nails done they like to get their pedicures they enjoy it yeah i really like yeah that's all been shut down here right right and like it sucks because that that i loved going there And it's like, but, you know, the thing is, like a lot of people, it's not time to go back to work because if there is a true risk that from making minimum wage, you're going to get a disease that probably won't kill you because you're a waiter. Applebee's, you're probably going to be OK. You're taking your vitamins, but you might be living with your aunt who has Alzheimer's disease and you're going to fucking kill her because you picked up a little bit of it and the reason you're going to kill her is because you had to go back to work because your benefits got cut off.

So it's like, this is why it's a very complex, fucked up problem that really, it's like, yes, for me, a person who, I'm doing great. I want everything open. I want to go to Guitar Center.

Guitar Center is open, but I don't want to stand in line. I want to go into Guitar Center. I want everything to be the way it was. I want to go to Guitar Center. Guitar Center is open, but I don't want to stand in line. I want to go into Guitar Center. I want everything to be the way it was. I'm probably going to be okay. But this is, again, it's like this is a complex problem. I don't buy into the idea that the whole thing's a scam. I think we've got exactly what that asshole, why did I say asshole?

Too much booze. He was actually the opposite of an asshole on your show. I'm like calling a doctor an asshole. Remember the Joe Rogan questions everything? The virologist who told us there's going to be another great pandemic six years ago? I've talked about this before, but we should tell people. Duncan and I were in Galveston, Texas, and we went to the Center for Disease Control and went to the very place where they experiment on Ebola and all these crazy diseases that kill you instantly.

And Duncan and I were in this building, and we were watching. We walked through a window that takes you. There's another window behind that that's like this plexiglass sealed room, and they have spacesuits on and tubes. And I'm like, hold on, hold on. So there's some shit in there that can kill everybody like a hundred percent like it's right there and they were doing tests on it and so these people are wearing like space suits and they're walking around with these horrific world-killing diseases

yeah man and remember we missed the flight yeah we did we missed the flight we had to get there we were just high as fuck at the airport talking. And the flight took off. Duncan and I lost total track of time. We were barbecued. Did we take edibles? Dude, I don't remember. We did something.

We were so high. We forgot we were at the airport. We might have took edibles. My custom is to take an edible in the car. My custom. That's because it takes time to get to the airport. And by the time you get to the airport, the absurdity of it all just kicks in in full steam. Because it's like, I have no control at the airport. The airport is a place where you just want to give up complete control.

Yes. And when you're super duper duper high, that's a fun ride. The best. So you and I were just sitting down talking about life. And that plane went, choo. And we're like, where's the plane? Like, the plane left. Like, what?

We didn't just miss the plane by, like, 10 minutes. Like, 40 minutes. It was the ultimate dumb stoner moment. Like, if we weren't on our way to film a television show, we would have looked like the biggest losers. We looked like losers anyway. But we had fun. And we took one in the morning. And we got there with very little sleep.

We made it. We made it. But being in, like, the Galveston, Texas Centers for Disease Control with got there with very little we made it but being in like the galveston texas centers for disease control with like very different this is the um this is done this is duncan went to some preppers this is one that i really love because i didn't get a chance to be with you so i got to watch it you know like from the clips and see what it was like when you why didn't you get to be at that i was doing something else we were trying to film two things at the same time i think that, that time. You know what, man? I was really like, not annoyed, because I love doing the show, but I'm like, of course

he doesn't show up to this motherfucker. Because suddenly I end up deep in a cave. I'm deep in a cave. I would have totally done it. But I think it was when there was a bunch of things that we were trying to film and we were short on time, so we couldn't do things together. But remember we did the Skinwalker Ranch one together? You were so pissed.

It was so fake. The problem was when we got there, right when we got there, we heard this preposterous story from this person who threw a cigarette on the ground after he- That's what set you off! 100%, yeah. Because I'm like, this is a moron.

He threw a cigarette on the ground in the forest. This is a moron. Like, we drove here for- And he's lying. We're the moron who's lying i'm like oh great great i actually asked him to pick it up i'm like come on man i remember that moment dude and it but that it's just like you can't it's a beautiful utah forest you smoke a cigarette and you throw it down you step on it like you're not my kind of person joe here's the

reason you're so american you really do believe in a utopian ideal. And Joe Rogan questions everything for real. Both of us. This is what I realized years after. We both had a sense in our heart that we might really find proof of something big. And we went into it with that attitude. We did. But we were so high.

We believed what we were saying. Dude, that's the funniest thing about it. It's like, you know, most people when they do these shows, they're not going into it thinking like, I'm actually going to uncover something. Yeah, of course. They don't go into it thinking they're going to uncover something. They go into it thinking, this is all a bunch of bullshit

and I'm going to do something. I'm going to be like, or maybe they think maybe it's real or whatever but the main thing is they they don't they talk they they pretend it's real that's the thing they pretend it's real we didn't pretend it's real and we also went into it like two guys who were more high during true. You will not find. That's me, barbecued, looking for Bigfoot. Dude, I was barbecued. We were so high, dude. And this guy, we don't need to blow

this guy's spot up. Look at me, my hipster face. Oh, boy. People love, maybe he believes what he's saying. Maybe all that stuff that they were telling us, they really truly believe. But they were talking about like bulletproof wolves that appear out of mist and all this stuff. To me, that moment was when the show went south.

And what was really funny was like, the last thing the Sci-Fi Network wanted was for you to like actually like begin to like realize that maybe we're not going to find UFOs. And they started getting unhappy, I think, with the situation. Oh, they did get unhappy. There was actually a conversation where they're like, is he trying to debunk these things? Because they have all these shows on UFOs and all these shows on ghosts. And then they have this comedian asshole with his asshole buddy, and they're both high as fuck.

And they're like, this is so fake. an asshole with his asshole buddy and they're both high as fuck and like this is so fake like this is so but we wanted to know we wanted to know we wanted to know if it was real or if it was remember the alien artifacts part do you remember that part there was someone who collected all these alien little bits of dust and metal you don't remember it probably i remember i remember that because i was already given up on that point I noticed a pattern unfortunately and I feel real bad but it was really a personal thing because I was dealing with my own

nonsense my own inclivity my own inclination to believe ridiculous stories even today like with the Pentagon story about them having recovered a craft not made from this world. I'm like, please don't let it be a misquote.

I don't want to read the misquote, man. I don't. So I know that there's a real pull to believing in bullshit. There's a real pull to like manipulating the actual facts of Roswell so that it appears the government absolutely 100% colluded to keep the alien crash from the general public and there's no way it could be a weather balloon. I don't know if that's right, man, because I know it in myself. Because I see it in myself. I see that dirty little asshole that wants to believe in Bigfoot, that stupid fuck.

They're like, hey, hey, hey, maybe it's a bear. Maybe it's not a lost monkey species, but I want to believe so bad. I don't think that's a dirty asshole. But this is me. This is me. I've worked on this. This is something that I've spent a lot of time thinking about. There's a lot of people out there that just lie.

They're not thinking about anything. But the same way, they want to believe too. They want to believe in UFOs. They want to believe in Bigfoot. They want to believe in all these things. They want to believe in UFOs. They want to believe in Bigfoot. They want to believe in all these things. They want to believe. Yeah. And it's not their fault.

They grew up in a fucked up town and their friends were probably all drunk by the time they were four and the whole thing's a mess. And here they are stuck in this situation where they're just making shit up. And here you and I are standing there going, I don't think this guy ever really was kidnapped by Bigfoot.

Yeah. And we get to hear these ridiculous stories. And there was too many of them, man. Everybody we talked to had this real obvious psychological bend to them. There was always like, and no one had a steady chassis. No one who you were talking to, right? Yes. You remember the fucking Bigfoot guy that said he would chop his pinky off to find out if Bigfoot

was real? He was a professor. He was a professor. I forget. We had him on the podcast. We had the foot, the footprint. Dr. Meldrum. Dr. Melcher, right? Meldrum, yes. Thank you, Jamie's the wizard. Dr. Meldrum. Dr. Meldrum,

he said he would cut his finger off to find out if Bigfoot was real. Would you cut your finger off to find out? No, I don't care. Listen, I hope it's not real. I hope it's real. I don't care. Either one would be awesome.

What data set would you cut your finger off? I would cut my finger off to know if there was an intelligent design to creation on Earth. I would give them the very tip of my pinky for that. But then what happens? Then you run around with this information you can't share with anybody and you're freaked out all day? Well, no. Then I try to contact that thing in a more intense way.

I mean, like the – The tip of the pinky is not a bad thing to get rid of. Yeah, for like knowing like whether there's – like, again, you have to like – It's a week. First of all, what kind of computer are you working with that you're going to have to take your pinky and drop it in to get truth out of it? It's a stupid computer.

You shouldn't trust it. If you ever want to feel what it's like to be like three again, make your thumb wrestle your pinky. Your pinky's like shit. You have no power in your pinky. Your pinky's so weak. That's what it's like to be like a three year old straining against your older brother Get off me Get off me asshole

You got a pinky That's right What a bullshit little digit What does that thing get used for What does it get used for Say that again I dislocated both of them You dislocated them

Your pinky They don't match up Oh dude Oh damn Oh that's weird Yeah So one go I dislocated both of them. You dislocated them? Your pinky? They don't match up. Oh, dude. Oh, damn. Oh, that's weird. So one go. Basketball, yeah. Oh, that makes sense.

Jamming them and all sorts of shit. You use it for holding wine. You need it to, like, extend when you're drinking. You need to. Yes. Look, man. It's very important. I think that.

Pinky's out. Don't you, like. I hurt my pinky doing that. Wrestling with my thumb. Like, legitimately, it hurts now. It's so weak. But I do so much with my hands. I do so many chin-ups.

There's some reason for it. So many kettlebell grips, and it's mostly these other fingers. Even when you draw back a bow, my release doesn't even have a pinky thing. I draw back with these fingers. This bitch ass just hangs around for the ride. You're so mean to your pinky.

Why do you do that to your pinky? I love my pinkies. Yeah. I love them. They're great. I don't want to miss them. But think of the name itself. But it's weird how weak it is compared to all the other digits you have.

And they named it a pinky. Like, the whole thing is, like, messed up. The whole thing does sound like, it is a very, like, weak. The name pinky itself is is like, you know. I will fuck you up with this finger. This finger right here is strong as fuck. This finger gets a hold of shit. This is a strong finger.

This is a bullshit finger that's not hurting anybody. We got. They're all in the same hand. Listen, everyone belongs on the hand. Like we have to forget the pinky. If you were as strong physically as your small toe. Wow. That's crazy.

That's life. Just everything can fuck you up. Every pebble is murderous. Jumping off stairs the wrong way. You stub your toe. You want to die. That's who you are. You are as strong as your little baby toe.

Your little baby toe has zero power. Grab your little baby toe and wrestle with it has zero power grab your little baby toe and like wrestle with it real quick it has nothing it's a mess it's a baby yeah they call it a baby toe because it's like a it's not babies are stronger than your baby toe yeah yeah well look it's a bitch ass little limb that's yeah that would that's the funny thing about the human sentient projection into time it's like we're probably like the little toe of the universe you know like we have just enough realization to know that we're something we're this hilarious intersection of like you know meat and what appear like a real feeling of like

you know i do feel like uh bias aside if there isn't a part of you that hasn't like really come to the conclusion there seems to be a part of you that doesn't get touched by reality, some eternal part of you that has met time and space, I feel like most people get that sense. Kids feel that. They know that. They just actually know it. But to me, I think maybe what we are in this little temporary whatever it may be, whether it's an aquarium, whether it's a training facility. I think it's probably a training facility. You know, like.

I don't think it's that. I think it's a process. And I think the process has to be tumultuous because if it's not, nothing gets done. I think the struggles have to exist because if there's only harmony and peace, everybody gets stagnant. That's right. There's a steady push towards ultimate technological innovation. That's the steadiest push. If you look at the human race in terms of what it makes, what does it do?

At the end of the day, if you have these bees and they have all these different social things they do and all these different things they do for covering territory and ground and all these different Aspects of being a bee and laying the larvae inside the honeycomb, but what do they do? They make honey. They make honey bitch. That's what they do. They make honey. What do we do? We make robots Yeah, we make computers we make technology. Yeah, better every fucking year. We don't make better laws every year like no No, we don't revise that shit. We got stuff written with fucking every year. No, no, no. We don't revise that shit. We got stuff written with fucking ink from charcoal. That's right. It's like in the archive somewhere.

What we do is we make better shit. Every year we make better shit. And our goal is just keep making better shit. And I'm obsessed with better shit. I'm obsessed with cell phones. I'm obsessed. I love Unbox Therap um any any of those shows marcus brownlee when they doing these unbox videos and talking about the newest latest and greatest

technology and they're showing these 120 hertz screens and these fucking cameras with 100x amazing but what are we doing we're moving ourselves closer and closer to some kind of technological superiority. And along the way, we're losing our humanity. And that's the weirdest, most ironic part of it. Along the way, we've never been in a greater technological era. If you look in terms of the things that are consumer electronics that get released right now, whether it's laptops or iPhones or, you know, Samsung Note 20s or whatever the fuck they are.

These things are insane, right? Never been at a time like this before. This is like, this has peaked also. When have we ever had a time where there's riots in every city? Every city all across the country. And it's all, a lot of it is things that most people agree with, right? When you say, especially if you say something like Black Lives Matter, I want to, let's have a vote. And a lot of it is things that most people agree with, right? Yeah. Especially if you say something like Black Lives Matter.

Let's have a vote. How many people don't agree with that statement? Forget about what everybody wants. Oh, the Marxist thing and these people, they want to destroy the nuclear family. I don't know if they do or they don't, but most people, I bet, who are a part of that movement don't even know what that means. They don't know all that shit. They just don't want people to get killed by cops. That's it.

That's it. And it's not like Michael Che has a great bit about it where it says like, that's not even asking a lot. Like matters? Like Black Lives Matter? Just matters? And people are like, man, I don't know. Yeah. It's this is the strangest time for us socially because of COVID.

This is the strangest time because of the economy. The strangest time because us socially because of COVID. This is the strangest time because of the economy. The strangest time because Trump is president and there's chaos and the guy who's running against him is older than him. And you're like, this is madness. What is happening here? And no one knows when the fuck people are going to be able to go back to work. And there's all this chaos and all this anxiety. It's all happening together at once. I know, man.

I know. That's what this is. You know and that's what this is You know, this is what I love like I were my medic. I work with a meditation teacher David Nick turn he's brilliant and One of the things he tells me and I really this is an example of how cool he is This is when all the New York Times shit came out About the aliens. I call him him i'm like david new york times aliens and he's like wow wow and then his response was duncan where do you think thoughts come from do you think they are

born from something that was his response to me telling about aliens was the question where do you think thoughts come from or thoughts like born like the way well it's a good question it's a great question i still haven't figured it out i've asked if ideas were aliens i've i think that if you think about a cell phone right i mean obviously there's a collaborative effort involving a lot of people that understand all sorts of different aspects of technology but ultimately it has to be an idea someone has to have the idea to come up the original motorola phone the fucking. Someone has to have the idea to come up with the original Motorola phone, the fucking brick, and then they had the idea to innovate

and keep getting better and better. And these ideas eventually lead to this thing that can open your car door, turn your lights on in your house, you can FaceTime your kids. It's a crazy, crazy, crazy thing. And it's all coming out of ideas. Where do they come from?

That's the question the question is is it an inherent part of being a human being because like all other aspects of human beings we are not a single organism we are a a biosphere the human organism is essentially an ecosystem the human organism has untold trillions of bacteria in our gut, right? We have it on our skin. We have all sorts of weird life forms that we live synergistically in this space as a person. Why wouldn't we think ideas would be a part of that? They might very well be a part of that. And the healthier your mind is, the more you're able to live with ideas, the more you're able to live with ideas,

the more you're able to bounce ideas around like ideas as a life form, just like the health. Like if you use antibacterial soap all over your body all the time, you get sick. Yeah. Right. You get fucking rashes and shit. Cause your body,

it kills all the good bacteria too. Yeah. It's like, man, I, I, the, I love the question because like one of my favorite acid trips was I was, like, listening to Beethoven.

Oh, wow. Oh, man. And I, like, I don't know how it happened, but, like, I was, like, I, like, had a little, like, this beautiful girl. She was so beautiful. And, like, I was at her house. We're listening to Beethoven. I was tripping. And I started thinking, and it was just like romantic and cool. But then I started thinking like, somebody thought of this. And then I started thinking, but where did it come from? Like, if they thought of it, what was it before they thought of it? This didn't exist before Beethoven. So where was it?

And I remember as I was thinking that on the best, still to this day, the best acid I ever had. What's the difference? I'm not much of an acid connoisseur. What's the difference between really good acid and mediocre acid? Apparently, it has something to do with the mechanism of production, right? The way it's... Yeah. Yeah.

Which is like, listen to like Kid Charlamagne by Steely Dan. It's all about one of the great, Owsley, one of the great LSD chemists of our time, who I met his wife and I asked her this question, like, why is some, why is acid not as good as it used to be in the 60s and her response was people aren't perfectionists anymore honey that was literally we will sell no wine before

it's time yeah it was like I don't know but I mean that's a thing that we want with whiskey like that's one of the things about Buffalo Trace, who bottles this stuff. Yeah. They taste everything. So good.

And if it's not good, they're connoisseurs. Yeah. So I understand that you would want that with acid. The problem is that acid's illegal. That's the real problem. The problem is you have some fucking space daddy some dude who's at the the top of the fucking helm of this spaceship as it hurls through infinity space and they they don't want you they have to be space daddy if it's the president united states that's space daddy right yeah the

president of the united states is space daddy he is the fucking leader of the the greatest army the world's ever known he's at the helm of the global empire he that's space daddy and he's we're going through space so if we are a spaceship the president united states is space captain kirk he has to be right yeah yeah well it's not the space daddy that's made lsd illegal what's made lsd illegal was an earlier space daddy yes 1970 space daddy that tried to disband the civil rights movement yeah by making drugs like all schedule one drugs. That space daddy did it. But the good news is like they're at least at the very least they're letting people like look at how what it is and like how it affects the brain. And they're beginning to understand that they're like everything we all knew.

There's no point getting resentful about it, but we all knew this. We all knew this. But we're all like, it's being validated. Thank God. And it's very sweet because it's a, it's a healing drug, especially when used in,

and with therapy, you know, and it's healing. It's a very powerful, beautiful, wonderful thing that exists on the planet that anyone could have access to, especially if they like stop this ridiculous prohibition and lifted the prohibition.

I'm not saying like, don't prohibit heroin, prohibit heroin, prohibit methamphetamine. But even, even any prohibition, the problem is I don't want anybody doing it, but I shouldn't be able to tell you not to. That's the problem. That really is the problem. The problem is I shouldn't be able to tell you not to. That's the problem. That really is the problem. The problem is I shouldn't be able to tell you not to. That's right.

And it's certainly like- Because it's too slippery. But you shouldn't be able to, like there shouldn't be a five-year mandatory minimum for LSD. I mean, that's madness. No, that's madness. And it really does heal people. It's a healing. So look, you do your own, like do your research, look into it. Have you read Chaos?

No. The Tom O'Neill book? No. Oh my God, dude. One of my favorite podcasts Have you read Chaos? No. The Tom O'Neill book? No. Oh my God, dude. One of my favorite podcasts over the last year I did was with Tom O'Neill and he's Greg Fitzsimmons' neighbor. He was Greg Fitzsimmons' neighbor for like 20 years in Venice. Wow, cool.

And the whole time he was Greg's neighbor, he was working on this book. Now Greg never brings someone to me. Never. Never says, dude, you got to have this guy as a guest, ever. So out of all these years, Greg's like, dude, this guy you need to have on. Never. Never says, dude, you got to have this guy on as a guest ever. So out of all these years, Greg's like, dude, this guy you need to have on. This guy researched Charles Manson for 20 fucking years. He was originally just writing an article. He was writing an article, but as he's writing this article, he starts uncovering more and more crazy shit. And he goes deeper and deeper

into this where 20 fucking years later, he finally puts out this book. And this book is basically detailing a CIA LSD operation where Charles Manson was getting dosed in prison, allegedly, and he was being treated at this free clinic in Haight-Ashbury that ran for more than 50 years and closed three months after the book was released. They ran this fucking free clinic where they were dosing hippies and they were testing them. They ran Operation Midnight Climax. It was all part of MKUltra.

He's detailing step by step all these people that were directly involved in not just Charles Manson, but in fucking Jack Ruby and all these other political figures in history. And it's like, what in the fuck? All these mind control CIA LSD experiments that were real.

And Charles Manson was a part of that. Yeah. Allegedly. And Charles Manson was dosing up these hippies and not taking it himself. He was using the techniques that they allegedly used on him for like seven years while he was in federal penitentiary. What a mess. This is the problem with like anytime power. You've got to read this book, man.

Look, I've read a lot about the MKL. But this one's crazy. This is the problem with like anytime power. You've got to read this book, man. Look, I've read a lot about the MKUltra stuff. But this one's crazy. This one's different. It's just specifically what they did to allow Manson to run free and build these murderous hippies and get them high on LSD. This was all a part of this thing to sort of demonize the anti-war movement. There was all these different strategies they were doing to demonize the anti-war movement. Yeah, because you take LSD and war seems ridiculous. You take LSD and money seems ridiculous. You take LSD and anything that doesn't have to do with love seems insane.

And the problem is, is like, you know, and this is, you know, all the psychedelic bullshit aside. If you just look at like basic Buddhism 101, I was in some. Prior to this pandemic, my favorite conversations were in Uber's Man. And I'm riding this Uber. And this Uber driver, who's clearly a Buddhist, he's got a Buddhist statue on his dashboard. So we start talking about Buddhism.

And we're talking about it. He said the coolest thing I've ever heard regarding Buddhism, which is he's like, do you know how you look at letters and they you think that they're a language what are you before that it's so cool holy yeah yeah yeah thank god there's people like that in the world i know well that's a true buddhist that's a true missionary missionary. But in that, an LSD will return you to that state. So it will drop you under all of your apps that are running on the operating system of your consciousness for a little bit.

Some people hate that because they've so identified with the apps that the moment they can't cling to the app, that they become this thing before the language, which is why some people on a lot of assets can't even, they can app that they become this like, you know thing before the language Which is why some people on a lot of asset can't even they can't talk they talk at babies. Yeah, but but What's happening is you're encountering like? original sentience prior to conditioning and that's dangerous to Any kind of power structure like if I'm trying to implement a hierarchy I Any kind of power structure. Like if I'm trying to implement a hierarchy, I depend on your consciousness flowing into these rivulets that are language, morality, ethics, the entire structure of whatever I'm like trying to like tell you is the way things are. And if I can do that, then I can own you because suddenly your morality isn't real morality your

ethics aren't real ethics your idea of what's right isn't necessarily what's right it's what's right for capitalism what's right for communism what's right for this or that if I can tell you if I can make your moral compass point away from service in any way shape or form i can control you forever and so anything that gets in the way of that is really like generally like delegitimized by power structures i mean it makes sense like the problem is you're dealing with a with there's a combination of morality and a game and the game is trying to make money like when you have numbers you know i'm reading this book right now i'm listening to it on tape um it's called uh irresistible i keep forgetting

this dude's name who uh who wrote the book but i'm listening to it on audiobook it's uh adam alter and it's all about addictions it's all about particularly how addictive games are insanely addictive like games like Tetris and Candy Crush. Insanely addictive. Where they've made billions and billions of dollars on Candy Crush. Yeah, it's so crazy. People can't put it down. Like Farmland made fucking unbelievable amounts of money. Crazy. There's something about numbers. Like you see, you look at your bank account. You go,

I've got $15,000 in the bank. I can't believe this. That's pretty fucking good. I remember when I was broke. And then you go, you know what? It would be great if I had 50 I'd just like to get 20 this year. I'm just gonna cut back on going out to eat I'm gonna do that. I'm gonna put five away and then you're like, you know what? I need to make more That's what I need to do. I need to make more money. I wanted to put in some overtime I'm gonna talk to the boss when I look I'm dedicated. I don't give a fuck a lot of people get tired I don't get tired, dude I am dedicated to this fucking job and I want to move up in this company.

Locked in. And the boss is like, yes, come on aboard, slave man. You're going to work for the corporation 18 hours a day. It's great. You're getting paid well. Don't get me wrong. You're not really a slave. But what you are is a slave to your own idea of what success is.

You're a slave to the idea that numbers equate success. You don't notice, man. You don't notice. You don't notice. You get used to everywhere you live. It's nice if you live in a place that's safe. After that, I'm telling you, you don't notice. You know what you notice? You notice when your friends are around you and you're enjoying each other's company and you're laughing and having fun. You notice those things. Yeah. You notice if you do something and people enjoy it. You notice if you have a good interaction with someone at a store.

Like they go, no, you. And then you go, no, you. And then you're both smiling and laughing and everybody's, you haven't, those are nice moments, man. We have those. We still have those. Like you let somebody in front of you and they give you the peace on, you give them the thumbs up.

And these moments are still here, man. They're more than they're not. It's not like everybody's just stabbing everybody every way you look. Most of the interactions that people have with each other all over the place are positive. It's a very small amount. The problem is these small amounts make it on fucking YouTube and then that's all I can watch.

I just watch these fucking people in Portland beat the shit out of each other and kick some guy in the head when he's sitting down when he apparently drove too close to these Antifa guys. And they made him get out of the car and they're searching his belongings. This guy runs up behind him and kicks him in the head and knocks him unconscious. Horrible. And I'm like, God damn it. Horrible. It's not most people most of the time.

And the problem is that's what everybody's going to pay attention to. That's what everybody's going to share on Facebook and Instagram. I saw that fucking video in my timeline like 30 times. But this is what I love about humanity. If you strip away the story and you see a person getting kicked in the head, honestly, man, I don't care. In general, I don't care what that guy is. Don't kick him in the head honestly man like I don't care like in general like I don't care what that guy is don't kick him in the head here's the problem dude it's a natural inclination to want to fight the opposite of your tribe yeah when you're

16 years old or however old that kid was the kid who kicked that guy in the head he looked young to me I could have easily done that when I was 16 easily yeah I was so dumb if i was in the streets at 16 he was dumb and we pulled some guy out of his car that someone said tried to run us over and the guy's sitting there easily me or any of the people i hung out with would have punched that guy or kick that guy that's the compassion normal it's normal yeah the problem is the tribal war that we have going on. That's the problem. But what you just said, that's the truth.

That's the truth. And it's compassionate. This is a stupid kid. He was a fucking, I think he worked at the airport. Whatever the fuck he was. This is a stupid kid. And what he did is wrong. He got caught up in the wave of violence.

The mob mentality. It's normal. We have to figure out listen man here's the thing we must discover you're not first of all you're not going to find this on the map i like going off the map but there's not a map for this so that's liberating to me we got to get off the map number one we got to get off the map like first everyone this is what's so crazy people are really legitimately tuning into like the like human trafficking in the united states it's a big business it's one of

the biggest businesses actually human trafficking yeah i was reading a post today that somebody sent me and i don't know if it's verified or real or whatever where a girl was saying that she was headed to a bathroom at a gas station somewhere. And she noticed that someone had their camera turned around. So they had the selfie camera on while they were on FaceTime. And they pointed to this lady and they said, what about her? She heard her say, what about her? Do you like her? And the girl looked at them and the lady turned and looked at her and she ran back to her car got in their car and the guy who was with them went and ran up to the side of

the car like she thinks they were trying to kidnap 100 they were and that that happens that happens that happens that's a real business this is not like this is not a fucking story this is not a magazine article where people are you know know, someone wrote some fiction. This is, right. And the funny thing, not funny, but what's ironic

about the sudden horror at human trafficking is a lot of the very same people who are fighting against this thing that they're realizing is happening in the country simultaneously

don't want to look back into the history of the United States, which was 100% based on human trafficking hundred percent our country's foundation is human trafficking they fucking kidnapped black people and made them work for free and somewhere in between that horror and now people have gotten this delusion that that stopped it didn't stop our country is was literally founded george washington did you know this was the number one slaveholder in

virginia wherever the fuck he was he was the number one slave supposedly his wooden teeth thing it was slave teeth yeah he was the number one slave holder yeah did he have wooden gums is that what it was i don't know the whole wooden tea thing was a replacement of the truth which is this motherfucker was a human trafficker so people try to like they try to revise so the idea is like you know let's look at this look at this washington's dentures were likely sourced from the teeth of slaves sourced thereced! There you go! They're gonna say sourced! That wasn't sourced, they were ripped out of the fucking mouth of human hostages. Don't say

sourced! I source avocados to my fucking Mexican restaurant. I don't source teeth, motherfucker! Why would you use that language? Why would you use that language? Yeah, it's not sourced! Go back to that, Jamie, can I read the rest of it? Um, records at Mount Vernon show that he bought teeth from slaves.

Bought them. But that's records. Who knows if the slaves actually got the money? The poor and enslaved had been selling teeth as a means of making money since the Middle Ages, which were sold as dentures or implants to those of financial means. Either way, man. dentures, or implants to those of financial means. Either way, man.

So, you know, Jeffrey Epstein sourced teeth from some of the young girls he was fucking, and it was actually common for the young girls to sell their teeth for money. Like, that right there, that right there is the root of the fucking problem, which is like, this country, George Washington was a human trafficker who had in his mouth the teeth of people that were kidnapped. He was making work for free. This makes Dahmer look like a fucking Boy Scout. Can you imagine? Look at this quote.

ledger on May 8th 1784 he paid six pounds two shillings to Negroes for nine teeth on account of dr. Lemoine so he paid six pounds two shillings I don't know how much that is who cares before nine teeth so this says it's this is he's paying it to the slaves? It actually says they don't know if they were slaves or not. Probably paid it to the doctor to extract it. Jesus Christ. But it wasn't, so there were free black men that lived in America, but what was the percentage versus slaves and free men?

Who cares? The main thing is this asshole who's in statues everywhere was a kidnapper who took teeth out of people's mouths and put it in his own mouth. That's fucked up. Everybody's fucked up in all of our holidays.

Columbus was one of the worst people of all time. When people are defending the statues, it's like, shut the fuck up. Here's the thing, man. Should you allow people to just pull down the statues? Yes. Really? Yep.

What do you think? Because, do you think, here's what I think. What if there were Jeffrey Dahmer statues all over LA? No, you make a good point. But maybe we should educate people on why you feel so strongly about, like, the George Washington statue or even the Thomas Jefferson statue. A lot of people are arguing that Thomas Jefferson, that, you know, he's a piece of shit and we shouldn't respect him either.

Do you think that all those statues should come down or do you think it's more of an imperative for us to understand that in the world of 1776 or in the world of whenever, when did Washington get here? What was George Washington's first years in America? I'm not in any way, shape, or form giving anyone a free pass on owning slaves. I don't think anybody thinks you're doing that, man. That's not what I'm saying. Anybody who thinks that about you is stupid.

But what I am saying is, I think human beings up until... He was born in Virginia. Oh, he was born in America. Great grandfather. George Washington. One of the first real Americans. 1656.

Jeffrey Dahmer, one of the first real Americans. That's it, fuck it. I'm getting a George Washington tattoo. Joe! I'm in, I'm in! What's wrong. Joe! I'm in! What's wrong with you? He's American! No, look, can I... Yeah, go ahead.

The statue question. This is what I think. Okay. Either take the statue down, or put around it the number of slaves he had. Build statues for all the slaves he had. So if George Washington had 4,000 slaves, there needs to be a field of slave statues around the George Washington statue that you have to walk through

to get to the George Washington statue or just pull it down. Because you know what? It's easier to pull it down. No, no, no, no, no. You're right though. Have the slaves and have some of them missing teeth

because they sold it to him because they needed some... We'd have to find out if he really bought teeth from slaves or if it's just regular folks who needed money. Just have the whole story there. Like that needed money. Just have the whole story there. Like, that's all.

Just have those stories so people realize what's happening. What you're saying is perfect. Like, if you're going to have a guy who victimized, I mean, everybody did it back then. Everybody of wealth did it. It was a normal thing to do to have people that you owned. As crazy as that sounds to us. crazy as that sounds to us dude i think that the world before mass communication before the post office and certainly before any kind of uh boat travel when when everyone was just either on foot or on horses was undeniably impossible for us to understand because they were so savage there was very few rules people were

just dying of syphilis and every other fucking disease that came around the bend whether it was the flu or the plague there was no sanitation everyone was a rapist it was just a a wild barely human thing that would occasionally paint cool things and write things down and compose music, but lived in a savage environment that's almost unrecognizable for us today. I don't, look, and again, man, like I'm presenting a counterpoint to you that I don't want people to pray upon me for the counterpoint saying, oh, woke Duncan had a baby, got all woke.

But I do want to present a counterpoint with the intention of like, let's look at like that. Maybe that is actually part of the conditioning, which is like if like so if your country is based on human trafficking, which to this day is happening. Well, this country is based on human trafficking, which to this day is happening. Well, this country is based on human trafficking. This country is based on, and it's also based on human sacrifice. It's also based on us killing the people that were here first. That's right. And we've been at war for 92% of our history. And many of those wars are based on nothing.

So, you know, people are up in arms about the Bohemian Grove, but it's like, give me a fucking break. Look at Vietnam. That's human sacrifice. There was money to be made from killing people, and they made money. So we have a country that's based on human trafficking and human sacrifice. Nobody wants to talk about it. The idea is the exact same thing that all abusers do to people they've abused.

They want you to, number one, forget it. And if you start remembering it, they tell you you're crazy or that you're fucked up so the idea is that like the world prior to the united states was a savage world savage africa was not savage these were very advanced people but because like the europeans were were savage were brutal people they went in there and fucking just started chopping people up. These are people who had a natural innate trust for other humans and they were like, put your hand out, slap, go get some gold or I'll cut your other one off. That's what they said when they came here to North America. It was hills have eyes level. So the hills have eyes roll into all indigenous cultures.

They're in tune with the earth. When she gets weird, they move. Look, I'm not saying... No, but here's the thing. I've been spending the last six months deeply engrossed in Native American books. And they weren't that nice? Not at all, dude. They ate each other.

The Nez Perce were, like, practicing cannibals. The Nez Perce? Yeah, the Nez Perce Indians were practicing cannibals. Okay. Listen, man. The Comanches killed everybody. They were brutal. They killed everybody. They killed brutal. They killed everybody.

They killed each other. They killed Native Americans. Their main thing was raiding. They'd raid tribes and steal and kill and murder and rape. The idea I've heard, and this may not be, I didn't look into it, and I apologize to the people who told me about this idea because I wish I'd researched it more, but I'm going to put it out there, is that Africa was a really ancient culture. Dude, Africa's where Egypt is.

Yes. Wrap your head around that. That's what people don't recognize. And people were sending people there to get educated before slavery even started. Dude, before they burned the Library of Alexandria, that was the place where everybody would go to learn things. Yes, and so we fucking went in there and just wreaked havoc. Not us. Not us. It wasn't us. We can't say we fucking went in there and just reeked havoc. Not us. Not us.

It wasn't us. We can't say we. I'm sorry. You're from North Carolina. I love that I burped, right? I was born in New Jersey. We can't say we. We can't.

You made a very profound point and I burped. But we didn't do it. No, I don't mean we. I don't mean we. I'm not saying I'm directly connected. I'm just saying for me me it's like the any time i get around any situation where someone is making it so i can't say the truth right i get really annoyed yes yes and which is why you're a comic it freaks me out yes and it freaks me out and so

the reason that the whole like the whatever the particular movement is. Like when Trump is at Mount Rushmore. And that's Lakota, right? That's like sacred land. That's like sacred land. But they went in there and they chopped up a mountain with a bunch of slave owners' faces. And Trump's like, it's the best mountain on earth.

It's like, it looked better before you put the human traffickers on it. How about the fucking hilarity of him suggesting that his face should be on it just to rile people up? There's some part of you as a comic that has to appreciate that. I'm sorry, Joe. I'm going to admit that's true. When I saw that he was suggesting that his name should be on Mount Everest, or not at Mount Everest, Mount Rushmore,

I was thinking immediately, like, oh, my God, he's moving them into Checkmate. Dude, look at my fucking Twitter. I've been, like, seven different personalities designed to rile people up over the last month. That's all you do with this QAnon thing. Jamie was hoping you would come in as your QAnon character. It's fine. Look, no. But should that person be president?

No. Listen, but that's hilarious. In this madness, with all this crazy, there's no such thing as gender world, for a guy to come around and say, I want to put my face on Mount Rushmore. This is part of that that I like. Well, listen. I'm going to be honest. I'm not a fan of his lack of empathy

that's what beautiful that's what's beautiful about you is you're not afraid to admit something that i think is really important to admit which is like dude there are like there are there's a continuum of reality and there's swaths of that continuum that are amazing. Like, I don't know if you've ever been in a situation where like, maybe you're in a kind of like relationship that's not great. But there's a piece of that relationship that is so fucking hot and so sexy and so beautiful in the midst of all the madness that it almost like makes the madness make sense. Right. That's a right that's a that's a or or certainly like there's certain like substances i imbibe that if you look at what they do to my body

it's like terrible but like that sliver of whatever it is is great so anyway what i love that you're not afraid of doing is like putting out there like look man it's not like people are one thing but here's a thing too i'm not a willing victim of gaslighting you can't you can't do that to me right i'm not interested you know i don't need anything from you i'm not interested in you gaslighting me i know when someone's putting on a show i I had an email from a guy who I like who told me to stop talking about Joe Biden because all the problems are because he has a stutter. I'm like

listen man, when you're 74 or however old he is, he's older than that, right? The wheels come off, man, on everybody. Right. I don't feel as sharp at 53 as I did at 33. how about that yeah the reality is there's days if i'm not on top of my fucking game i get real spacey yeah what happens in 25 years

come on man are we pretending that we live forever you we need young vibrant robust people with a lot of energy who are also advanced thinkers. And right now, they don't have any one of those people in the race. We've got craziness in the race. Well, no. You know, man, the thing with Biden is, like, forget about Biden. I'm voting for fucking Biden. You're going to suck my dick.

I'm voting for Biden. Do we have to do that? Are you going to do it anyway? I'll tell you. Do we just not suck my dick. I'm voting for Biden. Do we have to do that? Are you going to do it anyway? I'll tell you. Do we just not suck your dick? Why can't I get a blowjob on top of voting for Biden? I mean, you can, but it seems greedy. It would be nice.

Look, I'm sorry to be aggressive, man. This liquor, it's bringing out something bad in me. That's what I love about whiskey. Whiskey's been responsible for some of my favorite conversations. Look, man. Shout out to Buffalo Trace. The reality of the situation is like Biden, I don't like his policy regarding drugs, and I'm very resentful of a lot of the things he's done,

and I'm also very resentful of the fact that that's what I'm like being, that's the binary that I'm being forced to contend with here. That's the resentment, right, is that we only have these two sanctioned choices. And if you're a good person who doesn't want people to die in the streets you you have to vote blue that's it period that's it and the initial phases of it when i was trying to like i was hoping bernie would be the fucking front runner and i'm like i fucked bernie up dude bernie got attached to some jokes. What do you mean? Bernie came on my podcast, and I did a very lukewarm endorsement of Bernie.

Look, I can't do stand-up right now, so I'll just tell you this. Bernie did this very lukewarm. I did a lukewarm. I said, I'll probably vote. I had my friend Barry Weiss on from the New York Times, and she said, who are you going to vote for? I said, I'll probably vote for Bernie. I said, he makes sense. I like what he stands for the guy's been a rock solid his whole life he's always believed like it would be good to have a

change where someone gets into office we go this guy really believes in justice he's not greedy he's not beholden to corporations he's a well they ran with that and then all these people that were in competition with Bernie started pulling shit that I've said on the podcast. Yeah. Drunk, high as fuck. Yeah, that sucks. Stand-up comedy.

Put it in context. So annoying. Put it in quotes. I remember that. And there was one of them. I read this article. It was like on a real newspaper where in quotes it said he believes that lesbians lack the lower back muscles to fuck a woman correctly. What?

This is a piece of my act. It was a bit. It was a bit about a conversation that I had at a bar. I was with a friend of mine at a bar. And there's this lady who's really aggressive. Who's making out with her girlfriend. And she yells over at us. She goes, sorry boys.

She only likes girls. And I got my own dick. She says this to us Yeah, so I go where is it and she goes it's a strap-on and I said Having a strap-on thinking it's a dick is like having a lighter and thinking you're a dragon Plus everyone knows that lesbians lack the proper lower back muscles to fuck a woman correctly It was like I was in this sparring match as a verbal sparring match with this crazy lady That's what I said.

You can't just take that part out and put it in quotes and say, I really believe that lesbians lack the proper lower back muscles to be in a loving relationship with another woman who's also a lesbian. That's not what I said, bitch. I can't trust you on anything. How am I going to trust you with Russia or climate

change or anything when you lie about jokes? Because they didn't want a guy who wasn't beholden to the system. So there was two people that I was to trust you with Russia or climate change or anything when you lie about jokes. Right. Because they didn't want a guy who wasn't beholden to the system. So there was two people that I was interested in. Tulsi Gabbard, she's been a congresswoman for six years. I love her. She's served overseas twice. Rock solid.

She's a real leader. And they didn't want to have nothing to do with her. You know, Tulsi is a plant the Hare Krishnas sing to. Good. I hope they get in. Let's give it a chance. Maybe they're right. They've seen those Hare Krishnas.

I mean, I'm like really eating my ass here. Because there was a period where I'm like, you know what? Fuck this. I'm not going to let the fucking Democratic Party shove this motherfucker who's like, who's like pro all these- What happens if he dies? Kamala becomes president and then does she have to get a new vice president? Who does she get as a vice president? I think she would have to get a vice president. She gets AOC. I love AOC. Because you don't have to be a certain age to be vice president. Dude, I love AOC. I don't give a fuck what anybody says about her. She's wonderful. I love her. She's awesome.

Eat me alive! I don't care. Look at me. Who cares? I think she's awesome. I love her so much. And I'm going to get shit for it, too. But I think the errors that she makes, she makes because she has this idea that she's trying to do good. I really believe that.

She's also 30. Yeah. How fucking dumb were you when you were 30? Right. You know, one of the things about Bridget Phetasy. That's a great point. Bridget Phetasy, who's hilarious. That's a great point. Bridget Phetasy's amazing.

What happened here? You have to be 35 to be vice president. Sorry, AOC. Hang in there in the wings, baby. We will vote for you, AOC. We'll pick you up in term two. I will vote for you. I think she's trying to do good.

But Bridget Phetasy, who's one of my favorite people to talk to, she said that when she read a diary that she wrote or a journal that she wrote when she was 24, she's like, Jesus Christ, I was AOC. And now she's like much more of a centrist. In fact, she's always mocking woke shit. And she's like, but I was like full on woke when I was 24. I get it.

It's a thing of a person being a good person who's compassionate, who wants to do good for people, who thinks they're moving in the right direction. But the problem is it's not in a line with the understanding that we have currently of psychology and of how people behave and of laws and the idea of punishment and crime. You have to have some of that stuff. You have to have incentives for people to do well, but you also have to have disincentives for them. They have to be punished if they commit crimes.

You have to have law and order, but you have to have compassion. You have to have goodwill, but you have to have law. You have to model it on good parenting, man. Yes, that's what it should be modeled on. And also good community. I think parenting is one aspect of your ability to develop growing up. Neighbors are important too, man. Friends.

Absolutely. Uncles. All those people are important in your life. Aunts. Your grandparents. There's a lot of shit going on. It's input coming into a person. I just love thinking what's outside of propaganda.

Parenting, it isn't outside of propaganda but you can look like as a parent i can see like look it doesn't matter what my ideals are regarding regulation forest is not going to be allowed yeah to go into the pool unless i'm there with him 100 he'll die he'll die so there's like real like there's like a true like to me, there's an eternal sort of path in like looking at what good parenting is across cultures. And you realize like, you know, you're an idiot if you think that people in the vast number of humans on earth, if you think people in that vast number aren't insane, like what percentage are insane? Well, you're insane. Everybody's insane. Well, I know, but I'm-

What is sane? That's the problem. Like what is that metric? You know, a fucking yard is three feet. No, I'm- I'm talking like people who are like registered sex offenders or, you know what I mean? Like that pathos, like true narcissist, true sociopath. Like we live in a world where from

time to time but it's still a spectrum right because like what if someone's sane but they're a gambling addict and they keep losing all their family's money every year on poker games right we got to figure out a way to help them without simultaneously creating tyranny have you fucked with ibogaine no i don't want it man i'm terrified of that shit i haven't fucked with ayahuasca i smoke dmt from time to time but i'm scared of six-hour DMT trip much less Ibogaine freak Have you done Ibogaine? No, I don't have any like physical addictions that I'm trying to kick Or real personal addictions I've kind of got those things dialed in in terms of my workout and you know work schedule and family schedule

It's pretty good right now. I got a good harmony. I got a good rhythm and I'm going to keep that up. But people that I know that have really needed it are people that got hurt and then they got prescribed pain pills and the pain pills is what got them. I know quite a few people that have turned to the Ibogaine, two good friends that have turned to the Ibogaine and it knocked friends that have turned to the Ibogaine and it knocked them right off of the addiction

and right back on path. And it's really disturbing to me because it doesn't seem to be killing people and it's not legal. And I think going forward in this country, we're going to have to come to grips with a bunch of shit. One of the things we're going to have to come to grips with is we've got,

and this is not a bad thing, okay? If any company is allowed to donate to a political candidate, any company, a fucking, you know, any company, chocolate company, a company that makes cars, then a drug company probably should too. If they're allowed to sell drugs, maybe they should be allowed to give money to corporations or give money rather to politicians that are running for government. Why not?

Everybody can do it. Who's to say they can't and the fucking guys who make cars can when they're polluting the air? Okay? Who knows? But at the end of the day, we have to go, yo, there's a lot of people getting hooked on these pills. Yeah, man.

There's a lot of people ruining their lives in these pills. And we're turning a blind eye because there's a lot of money involved in these pills. Yeah. And it's weird. It's weird. It's weird like the cigarette thing. If we're so worried about 170,000 people dying of COVID, why aren't we worried about half a million dying from cigarettes?

Yeah, man. Why aren't we worried about all the people that are not just dying, but losing their fucking, their sanity on opioids? How many people in this country are hooked on fucking pain pills? I mean, do we even know the real number? Because how many people are functional, where they're hooked on it, but they're just like taking one or two a day, and they're just going to work every day? Yeah.

And they just stay in a steady haze of fucking working for fucking, you know, Hertz rent a car, and they just deal, and they've got a prescription, so it's all good. Doctor says heroin's good. Brave new world, baby. Brave new world. This is all, these are all the things that I think of. And it gives me, this is the perspective that I have in this day and age right now, as I'm talking to you, a place of humility.

Because I'm more aware now than any other time in my life that no one is in control this thing and that we all have to just stop thinking that daddy's gonna rescue us that's right because there is no daddy Garcetti's not your daddy Gavin Newsom's not your daddy no Donald Trump's not your daddy now Nancy Pelosi is not your mama no none of these things these are just people. And we have to look at this in an objective. First of all, anyone who's famous, anyone.

I don't care if you're Donald Trump or Nancy Pelosi. Those are famous people. Everybody knows their name. Everybody knows what they look like. That's a wild way to live. That's a wild, crazy way to live. That's a crazy way to live. And then you're out there also dictating what people can and can't do.

And you're also dictating where the taxes go. You're not. The idea is like by becoming famous, you become antithetical to the very thing that you're representing. So how can you represent it anymore if you have. I'm not saying you can't. But I'm saying that's a different ride. That's a different ride. That's a different ride.

That's a different ride than a regular person. Yeah. If you're a famous person and you're all of a sudden at the helm of an empire that's dropping drone bombs on people. Fuck you. Whoa. Shouldn't the greatest government be a government that has an idea of eventually there'll be no more government? There should be, but then you have shit like 9-11. You go, what happened?

We get attacked. But did we? I don't know. I don't know what happened. What happened? I don't know. Who trained those people? Who designed that?

A lot of things happen afterwards that people will say, did those things that happened afterwards happen because, and this is my belief, my belief is that all the things that happened after 9-11 in terms of like the Patriot Act and all these other things, they happened because people were taking advantage of an opening where they recognized a lot of people were scared. And then they started implementing these ideas that they would love to do during peacetime, but they would never be accepted. The dogs of war.

But this is my interpretation. Some people are under the impression that they actually orchestrated the event and then afterwards implemented these new rules and everybody went along with it because the event they orchestrated. Now, I'm not saying I know that that's not the case. And on blowing up a jet airliner and blaming it on Cuba. They were going to arm Cuban friendlies and attack Guantanamo Bay. They're going to do whatever they could to get us into a war with Cuba. This was signed by the Joint Chiefs of Staff. They're like, I like it. I like deception.

I like what you're going to do. You're going to kill people. Woo! Let's go to war, baby! Go to war. If they did that in, was it 62 or 63? Who knows how that's evolved? Right.

Why wouldn't that evolve? Everything evolves. Okay? Technology evolves. Our understanding of biology evolves. Everything evolves. Everything evolves. You know what evolved? What evolved was not the technique. What evolves. Everything evolves. You know what evolved?

What evolved was not the technique. What evolved was the story. The technique seems to be the same. You look at the news, that Putin opponent, he fucking keels over in an airplane moaning. On a plane, all he had to drink was tea.

The Kremlin apparently says we wish him a speedy recovery. And everyone's like, what the fuck? And it's like, wait, actually, the use of poison in imperialism is a pretty classic, basic technique. Not just in Game of Thrones, but in general, if you're an imperialist and your interest is power you you use whatever technique you have to use doesn't that technique and using it in that way point to this thing that we're really worried about what we're really worried about is there this there's this underlying narrative that's going on where these elites are battling it out and these warlords yeah these evil sociopaths

around the world are battling it out. Well, they don't think they're evil. But they don't do it. They don't just have a guy just fucking blow his brains out on the airplane and then just jump right off on the tarmac and then he gets rescued by the Russian police and then nobody says anything about it ever. No. They do it in a weird sneaky way.

Yeah. Where it's like there's some plausible deniability involved. Right. Well, number one, they don't think they're evil. Putin doesn't wake up in the morning and look in the mirror and go, I'm an evil jackal. What are the henchmen of the apocalypse? Putin probably wakes up in the morning. I imagine he stretches.

He looks at his phone. He's got texts from his friends. He's like, that motherfucker. Fuck that bitch. And then more than likely he probably exercises. And I bet a lot of times Putin wakes up in the morning and he's like, I don. Fuck that bitch. And then more than likely, he probably exercises. And I bet a lot of times, Putin wakes up in the morning. He's like, I don't want to go to work. I bet a lot of times, he's like, god damn it.

I just want to fuck off all day. Then he has to go to work. He's stuck being Putin. Trump wakes up in the morning. Same problem. He's like, this sucks. He's drinking Diet Coke, watching Fox News. I promise you.

Tweeting out crazy shit. He wakes up in the morning, takes whatever the fucking drug he's on. What do you think he's taking? Dude, I don't know, but I want some of it. Well, if you had to guess. He's on some kind of amphetamine. He's on amphetamine, I would say. I don't know what it is.

Some sort of diet pill. Yeah, whatever. Was it ever confirmed that that whole thing where they said they found the very Dwayne Reed Pharmacy in New York City where he had been taking amphetamines? I'm not going to beat up somebody for being on drugs. Listen to me, man. He's 74. He wins. Okay? If you can make that much

money while you're on amphetamines and you don't die, then they're right. The doctors are right. The doctor's like, it's safe. He's like, are you sure? I want to make money. I want to keep going. I don't want to sleep. Just take this shit. You don't have to sleep. And he just keeps going. He rattles off fucking campaign speeches and hops in a helicopter and flies a thousand miles away. Find me a 70-year-old not on drugs, and I will give you $100.

Give me a fucking break. You're 70. You're going to die in like 20 years. That's so true. You're going to die. you're gonna die in like 20 years you're gonna die when I'm 70 oh my mouth is gonna be like a baby bird

underneath any drugs that anyone wants to put in of course we're both high now yeah drugs are fine like I don't care if Trump is on drugs or Putin's on drugs whoever's on drugs it's like the point is like these the problem is that like we like to imagine like Trump wakes up in the morning and is like

let me destroy this country Trump wakes up in the morning in a haze he takes some weird drugs he tries to remember what he's doing i promise you every morning he thinks to himself why the fuck did i listen to my kid i guarantee it was this kid who's like dad you gotta run for president no no no no no no you don't think you think no. I don't think he wants to be president. No, no, no, no, no, no. It was Obama talking shit about him. Oh, my God. 100%.

When Obama was doing that dinner, you know that thing that they do every year where they have Canadians go up? Yeah, yeah, yeah. What's it called again, Jamie? The Press Roast. White House Correspondents Dinner. Yeah, White House Correspondents Dinner. Yeah, White House Correspondents Dinner. And Donald Trump's in the audience, and Barack Obama's going deep, and he's hitting it with some bombs. It was good.

It was good. And one of the things he hits them with is, here's one thing I am that you'll never be, President of the United States. And everybody goes, oh! It's like, you know that meme with the kid in the hoodie? Yes! With the glasses, and he's just standing there, and all the other kids are running around going, oh! It's like, you know that meme with the kid in the hoodie with the glasses and he's just standing there and all the other kids are running around going, oh! He's so much a demon! Can we hear some of this

or are we getting in trouble? I don't know. It was a brutal roast. Is that like public domain or anything? I don't know. Do you think he wrote it? Do you think he wrote it? I don't think he wrote it. Oh, sure. He would write that because Trump was a part of the birther moment. But here's the thing. Honestly. Oh, sure. He would write that because Trump was a part of the birther moment. But here's the thing. Honestly. Legitimately.

I hope he was born in Kenya. I hope they pulled it off. Because I don't care. Because my grandparents were born in Italy. I don't give a fuck. Right. I don't need you to be born in this patch of dirt. You know why? Because I'm not a fucking idiot. I don't think you should have to be born

on a patch of dirt. Who cares? Look, should you have to be born not a fucking idiot. I don't think you should have to be born on a patch of dirt. Look, should you have to be born in fucking Calabasas in order to be the president of Nobu or whatever? That's a bad example. Do you have to live? It's a restaurant. It's a sushi restaurant in Malibu. Do you have to live in the town? What are you saying? Oh, the patch of dirt is significant.

Where was you expelled out of the vagina? I moved here when I was 13 minutes old. Is that okay? What if my mom shat me out in the middle of a plane on the way across the Pacific? Who cares? Am I American? Who cares? It's stupid.

It's dumb. It's dumb. It's fucking dumb. Well, that's like geospatial centrism. I hope he's born in Kenya. I hope he admits it. I hope he says, oh, and by the way, I was born in Kenya. Oh, shit. If Obama wanted to, you know how you have that, everybody has one friend, you're like,

please come out. Come out of the closet. Please. Yeah. Please. You'll feel better. No one will care. There's never been a better time.

I'm not saying Obama was born in Kenya. I believe everything he says. I believe he was born in Hawaii. But part of me wishes he was actually born in Kenya. And he waits until after the election. And if Biden wins, he just gets in the moment. By the way, I was born in Kenya. Oh!

And the whole audience just goes, bah! The earth turns into a sun. Everything would erupt. Man, I gotta pee. I gotta pee. Go pee. But what are you gonna do when I go pee? Jamie has the editing equipment.

Oh, right. He's the wizard. Don't take your headphones off. Headphones, don't run away. You're wrapped behind the back. That was close. I don't want it to end. We don't have to end.

Okay, great, great. There was one thing that I wanted to make sure. behind the back that was close i don't want it to end we're not we don't have to end okay great there was one thing that i wanted to make sure um when we decided to go to spotify what that one of the first things i thought of is duncan trussell has to be episode number one that was like a legitimate thing i thought because there's something about my relationship with duncan it's very unique like he brings things out of me. He, he puts me in a, when you're around certain friends, they put you in a state of mind that you don't go into when you're not with them. When I'm with Joey Diaz, one of the things that I love about Joey Diaz, what I'm always smiling when I'm with Joey Diaz, first of all, cause he knows I love him. I've, I've loved him forever. We've been friends forever. Every time I love him. I've loved him forever We've been friends forever every time I see him I hug him so because he knows I love him when we're around

He just starts talking shit. He said he gets loose because he knows that I'm his number one fan and Another person like that is Duncan when I'm around Duncan There's something like we do to each other like we're like some sort of a weird epoxy where you mix it together where he puts my mind in a place that it doesn't ordinarily go to automatic I think I genuinely believe there's ideas that I form when I'm talking to Duncan like ideas pop into my head when I'm talking to him that they don't get there anywhere else and it's it kind of goes in with what we were talking about, about that other guy's idea of thoughts

and my concept of ideas that maybe they're a life form. Maybe they're just like E. coli that lives in your gut or the flora that's on your skin. And that different people have different combinations of those things. Just like some people, you just don't vibe with them. You talk to them. You just want to get away from them as quick as possible. You're like, oh, this person's so annoying. And you can't help it for whatever reason.

It's like they say that women, vermin-wise, like women can smell a man's clothes. And they can sort of, I don't know if this is true but i read that they can accurately depict if they smell a man's clothes whether or not they should be attracted to that man whether or not they're genetically they they match up well with that man but that gets fucked up when they're on birth control yeah that's when they're on birth control it gets confused yeah it's well it's it in sex at dawn, but it was a real study. And there's a real concern about that, that people are, you know, we're losing some of our senses.

Dude, I was in a relationship with a woman who got off birth control and stopped wanting to fuck me. And I remember, like, hearing that and, like, being able to refer to the moment that she seemed to be really into me. But then she got off birth control and suddenly her real intuition was like, you don't want to make babies with this guy.

This guy's fucked up. And she stopped. It was real. I remember the moment it happened. It was so bizarre. It was great. By the way, I'm glad. Because the baby that we made is so beautiful.

Have you heard this shit about how the egg picks the sperm? Have you heard about this? The egg does? This is the new research. As dudes, we're always like, well, we make the cum. And there's a sperm that makes it to the end of the race. And that's the one that makes the baby. So in our minds, it's like a sperm that makes it to the end of the race and that's the one that makes the baby. So in our minds we're like, it's like a sperm that won a marathon gets into the egg as a

reward for winning the marathon. But now the idea is the egg actually is like the sperm are running to the finish line and the egg sends out chemicals to destabilize certain sperm and picks the one that fits best with the Whatever the plan of the egg is look at that human eggs use chemical signals to attract sperm humans spend a lot of time and energy choosing their partner new study by researchers from Stockholm University and Manchester University and Hs Foundation Trust shows that choosing your partner continues even after sex human eggs can choose sperm it's the goddess baby dudes it's like the last

fucking bashing we had was this idea that we had this athletic little bit of our come that made it really the mother egg the pics I come come to me come to me in the rest of my back back to mama Sends out signals to destroy certain sperm trying to make that made it all that way Choosy eggs may pick sperm for their genes defying Mendel's law. We're done. But then again the sperm that get there Those are still at the front of the pack. Yeah, like in price is right But most likely the egg, you know the eggs, like, and price is right. Most likely, the egg's going to be like, look, I want the best sperm,

but the best one's going to be the one that's there first anyway. Dude, it's very... Maybe it's both things. It's good. It's sweet. It's sweet. It's kind of both things, right? Yeah, but the final decision's the egg. Bitch-ass, lazy sperm

that just bounces off the head of the rugged sperm and, like, winds up plop. Wow, can't believe you chose me. It's like, I didn't. Shit, now I have a nerd. And the egg gets really pissed because it's not a precise mechanism. There's a lot of chaos going on to encourage entropy and to encourage innovation. They figure out the better version of the species to get into the egg.

Sometimes there's a head butt, and then the dum-dum goes right in head first, and bang. You got a kid that's not that bright. You don't want that kid. But then that being said, so on one- Those kids are supposed to get eaten by coyotes. On one level, it's great because it says, actually, the goddess chooses everything. But then on another level, you've got Hitler.

Exactly. So Hitler's mom's egg had a bunch of other sperm that were like, we've got Hitler. Exactly. So that Hitler's mom's egg had a bunch of other sperm that were like, we're not doing a genocide! And what's the connection with what we talked about before with Hitler? Amphetamines. Yeah. Hitler

was all about, they would inject coke in him, and testosterone in him. There's a legendary story about how Mussolini wanted to talk to Hitler about pulling out of the war. And Hitler showed up, shot up with cocaine and testosterone and just, I don't even Mussolini know what the fuck he was saying. But he sweated on him until Mussolini relented. Dude.

I don't know if that's true. McKenna used to talk about alcohol in this way. Like, we survived alcohol. Well, he talked about alcohol being the differentiation between the ancient psychedelic cultures, the, like, Choctaw-Heok that worshipped the cattle, which, like, shat on the ground the mushrooms grow from, and they had all this mushroom iconography,

to when they started preserving things and preserving things in honey, which meant fermented honey, which meant mead, which meant alcohol. And then they switched to an alcohol-based society when they couldn't grow the mushrooms anymore because of climate change or because they were moving

and moving in different directions. This is what I think happened. This is where I disagree with McKenna. First of all, how confident are you? Not that confident. The fact that you say, I disagree with McKenna. I was about to apologize to Dennis McKenna. First of all, how confident are you? Not that confident. The fact that you say, I disagree with McKenna. I was about to apologize to Dennis McKenna and say,

I acknowledge I'm a complete dope. He disagrees with his brother sometimes. Yeah, but he disagrees in the way an ethnobotanist disagrees with a scientist. Not in the way some fucking guy. Somebody literally goes at night, goes to read a conspiracy and disagrees. Who's literally on a show called Joe Rogan

questions everything. We investigated UFO materials. I'm sure like Stephen Hawking disagreed with Albert Einstein. You went into a bunker to talk to a dude who's going to start a cult. And you're like,

hey, you guys grow tomatoes? No. Like I'm... I remember coming back and I'm like, what was that guy like? He was a really nice guy. I'm like, well, get a nice guy, digs a hole in the side of a fucking mountain and parks his SUV. This guy's crazy. Bro.

It's so stupid to say I disagree with one of the great minds that I acknowledge that. so stupid to say i disagree with with like one of the great minds that i acknowledge that but uh you know to me like this is where this is what i picture happening so okay we're storing our mushrooms in jars of alcohol right we're storing our mushrooms in jars of alcohol and the rich people the elites eat the mushrooms they all trip out in their little orgiastic fucking awesome thing and then who's left the people whose job it is to put the mushrooms in the alcohol and what's left these jars they have a little bit of booze in them and some mushroom residue they drink it and then they start you know like that would be the beginning of like getting fucked up on alcohol i i i guess what i'm saying is like i i imagine that like really like if you look at like

okay mushrooms or lsd or any psychedelic it teaches you you're a we not an eye you're a we not a me and and and and booze what does it teach you you're a me when you're all pissed off on booze a hundred percent of the time you're not angry because you're like worried about the conditions of the world you're usually angry because someone like what's funnier than when you like insult an alcoholic how many times you've been around like a have you ever heard of alcoholics feelings where you say to them hey you're an alcoholic and you see that look in their face where they recognize that you're telling the truth yeah then. And then it really hurts. Yeah. And they get mad at you. Yeah.

Yeah. Dude, like, alcoholic outrage is one of the most, like, desperately sad things to witness. There's nothing worse than a drunk whose feelings are hurt. Because usually their feelings are hurt because... Because you told the truth, too. Yeah. Yeah. They don't want the truth. And so...

Because their condition depends on lies. So... Well, it's a weird... Like, one of the things about alcohol is, like, it don't want the truth and so because their their condition depends on lies so well. It's a weird Like one of the things about alcohol. It's like it sort of narrows reality Yeah, you know like if you think of one of the things that I really really enjoy about edibles There's a thing that I enjoy when I get so paranoid and so freaked out that I don't think I'm gonna make it Yeah so paranoid and so freaked out that I don't think I'm going to make it. And then I come down from that and I get to this place of humility. And that's one of my favorite places to be as a person. When I'm coming down from like a horrendous edible high and then all of a sudden I'm like real thankful that it's over.

I just want to be friends with people. There's that space. yeah like there's that space and it it sort of brought like the world broadens your danger broadens your humility your humanity your vulnerability broadens and then it comes back to a manageable level and you recognize that it could be so far worse than what you're experiencing currently and it's just your perspective that's fucking things up because right now with you and me right here no people have ever been more comfortable in the history of humanity no we're both in love we both have children yeah both drunk and high love each other making each other laugh yeah anybody in this position that looks at things incorrectly but like our problem is

always perspective our problem is always not recognizing how good we have it when we have it that's right dude this is like there's a buddhist teacher jack corfield who says tend to the part of the garden you can touch and also chogyam chompa rinpoche when one of his books one of the things he said was look it could he any minute it could be there's an ism that's good there's an ism that's the right way to be like it could be socialism communism who knows capital he didn't say that but right there could be an ism that works right because we we can't we can't accept the fact the isms of the past are the only ones that are ever going to be available that's crazy there might be a utopian ideal that is applicable to the now or just better but what he said what i love about what he said is

it doesn't matter if you can't find peace in your own home yes if when you're in your own home there's disharmony if you're in your own home people are unhappy in your own home, people are unhappy. In your own home, people are freaked out. Then why would you even think about socialism, capitalism, or communism when the pixel of society is the house, the householder? And if within that pixel there's division, then of course in the world that division would be like made into some monstrous thing so even down to the core to the singular you as a human who are you okay well yeah do you have your shit together or no sometimes yes sometimes sometimes yes sometimes no and everybody wants to point at people who don't go look at you you don't have your shit together, Duncan. I know, I know. You got three quarters of your shit together.

That's not helping me get my shit together. That with your white privilege. But I'm trying to be better. I believe you, but you must be punished. I'm not sure for how long. Well, that's aggression. Silence. I want silence from you for an extended period of time.

I'll give it to you. On the side. I'll give it to you. The further the silence, the more you're going to appease people. You can wait 10 years and no one, like four people will be upset. 10 months. To me, it's like, that whole

ball of wax, man, is like, dude, once I started, the thing is, when all this shit happened, and as a comedian, I was, like, really afraid to get into, like, even, like, a little bit of studying the shit people were upset about. Because, like, no, like, comedian in their right mind wants to be identified with, like, some woke-ass comedian because it's embarrassing. But then when I started looking into it, then I found out about the George Washington shit. The George Washington shit is super creepy. Creepy. looking into it and then i found out about the george washington shit the george washington shit is super creepy creepy because there's no way if those teeth were valuable that people

weren't murdered for their teeth that's it like there's no way people weren't like just held down and they got their teeth stolen or they were told that they were going to get money and they weren't and they were many of them were had been raped But here's the thing is the real value in getting outraged at shit that happened hundreds of years ago or is it is it an acknowledgement of First of all the fact that we all agree we can do better That's what the turmoil the turmoil exists all of its social economic the turmoil exists because We haven't really come to grips with whether or not we can all get together and be cool with each other all the time.

Yeah. So there's always some sort of turmoil. And when you look at turmoil in terms of like whether it's financial turmoil or social turmoil, we're always trying to figure out like who's being the asshole. Right? Yeah. Don't you feel like that? What do you mean?

When you see anything that's happening, like when you see a government getting overthrown, when you see war, you always feel like, who is being the asshole? Any kind of turmoil. You mean you try to find the perpetrator of the difficulty right what's causing it and is it possible that most of this shit could be avoided and what's stopping most of it from being avoided when you look at any kind of any time a government like any kind of country in invade anytime a country invades another country anytime bombs are being dropped from drones like what can be done to avoid this? That's right.

What can be done? Dude, man, I started this fucking pandemic philosophy club is what we call it with like my friends, Marcus and Brandon. What's up? We don't even do a podcast. Every Friday we just get together and talk. And they like Midnight Gospel. That's how I got lucky enough to meet them.

Midnight Gospel is an amazing show. Thank you, brother. Can I just say before we get going, I'm really proud of you. Thank you, brother. Really proud of you because it represents you as an artist more than almost anything any of my friends who've ever done has done. Because you're so

weird. And it's so weird but it's so funny and it's so amazing. It's amazing. They let us make it. I can't believe they let us make it. Praise Odin for Netflix. Praise Odin. Praise Odin. What they've done is amazing, but what you've done is somehow or another encapsulate some

of the things I love about you, how weird you are. You're not like anybody else. When you came here today, one of the things I said to you, I go, dude, I go, you're the only guy that I like listening to your ads that's sweet I do thanks man your fucking express VPN ad is a hilarious ad it took so long I didn't even know if it was an ad thank you it was just so crazy but you're the best I want to say this to you you are the best that I've ever seen at reading ads. Out of all the people that I've ever heard who read ads, your ads are the most entertaining. You're very sweet, Joe.

And I'm not going to get in a cock-sucking competition with you, but I wouldn't be here if not for you. And that's the truth. And I'll never stop saying it. And I will never stop being grateful to you. But I wouldn't be me if it wasn't for my friendship with you either. That's very sweet, man. It's true. I appreciate that.

We all benefit each other. Yeah, but I don't mean to cut you off. I'm so sorry. By the way, I had a little bit of booze, so forgive my impetuousness that I would suddenly interrupt you, but you do have a history of finding young comedians who are like, and you do

help us a lot, and we are eternally grateful to you. And I don't care if you don't acknowledge it. You won't acknowledge it, because if you did, you're afraid you'll go crazy I'll tell you from my perspective it's not that I'll go crazy it's that I have to do it there's no ifs ands or buts it's a path it's like if you're going

down if you're on a fucking one of those water slides and you're going flying down you're just going that way if you're a good person and you love comedy and you love comedians and you have friends and you want to see them happy and you want to see

them successful and you know they're good and you know it benefits not just them but you to elevate them I'm like hey check out Annie Letterman hey check out everybody whoever it is I want them to know that my relationship

with them anybody who's listening to this podcast or anybody who listens to my stand up or watches it it's genuine that's who I am so if I find someone who's awesome I want you to know about it I don't want to get paid for it if I find a great band I start talking about it on Instagram I find a great application

I tell people it's cool I have the obligation. I didn't know if I did or I didn't. Not every comic does that. But I didn't. I don't think I'm in a position that everybody's in. It's a weird spot. And might I say, I'm so glad that Annie Letterman is someone that your attention

has fallen. She is so funny. She's so funny. Her podcast is so fucking funny. I'm sure it is, but dude, her and Whitney, this is what happened. We were at the comic store the other night. Mike Binder is doing his whole Showtime documentary thing, so we're all on the roof. It was fun, man. I got to chat with Paul Rodriguez.

Very cool dude. I really never got a lot of time talking to Paul Rodriguez before. He's really cool man he's really couldn't in some good car good good stories about South America and Latin America and Mexico where comedians who actually got jailed yeah really interesting shit and Bill Burr was hilarious and Annie Letterman was on fire and then there was Whitney Cummings and Jay Leno and we had a good fucking time, man. And Mike Binder.

It was a really good fucking time. It really was. It was, first of all, it reminded me how much I loved that place. Like, I walked in there. I was like, God damn. I got so emotional when I walked in the door. But when I had Whitney and Annie together and they're talking shit to each other I'm like these girls are so funny and they love each other

they're really good friends and I said Whitney was scheduled to be on the podcast and then I said to her I said do you care if Annie comes I want Annie to come but it's up to you she's like fuck yeah so I brought Annie in too and the two of them together dude they're savages that's the future of female comedy and the two of them together do their savages That's that's the future of female comedy truly and the future of

Podcasting because there's all these like like that's a popular thing now like guys We fucked did they're killing it and then there's the call her daddy that shows killing it like They're on a different vibration than you Duncan Trussell, but there's a really popular sort of segment Yeah, and these two girls together two hilarious stand-up comics, talking shit together on a podcast. I'm like, you guys have to do it. But they're also like, you've got to admit, they're gonzo. Like the Hunter S. Thompson thing.

They're full gonzo. Both of them are terrifying in their own way. Yes. You know what I mean? When you encounter either of them. I have to help them, right? You have to help them. I have to help them do a podcast. It has to be Annie and Whitney

because the A's make you find it quicker. The world deserves it, but I remember going to do Annie... It has to be Annie and Whitney. When I went to do Annie Letterman's podcast, I won't give anything away, Annie. What happened? I can't say it on... It's not legal but like i remember

like leaving there being like wow holy shit like i remember leaving there just thinking like whole not just that not whatever i'm saying right now i'm saying like realizing like i i've always loved chatting with any letterman we have great conversations but i remember like getting into where she lived and looking around and realizing like well she's formed some kind of cult i don't know what it is she's really funny man she's so funny and and like that like just that moment of like wow like you're you're like both of them well that it's the thing is is like this uh acknowledgement first of all you your your podcast has a cult following and you've hit this like weird place and i think you feel very similar to the way i do that when you find someone who's extraordinary you want to let everybody else know yeah exactly we both have that yeah have that. Yeah. All of us have that.

Joey has that. Ari has that. Ari is one of the best. If you're Ari's friend and you have a special coming out, Ari will promote the fuck out of you. He's amazing at that. He did it for Joe List. He's done it for Mark Norman.

And he's helped get guys on my podcast. And I blow them up. Because if you're friends with Ari, you're friends with me. But we're all like that. Diaz, Red Band's like that. Tony Hinchcliffe's like that. Everybody will tell you all the people around them that are killing it.

And I think that's real important, man. I think it's an important thing to get out there. There's a frequency that we're all sending out, and it's a frequency of camaraderie. It doesn't matter if you're wrong sometimes or it's just like sometimes you fuck up like we're all like trying to go the right direction but you know when we're talking about that dumb sperm that clashes heads with the alpha sperm it just accidentally slides in that shit is gonna happen that's right all these things are gonna but we we have to move

forward in the spirit of camaraderie. And this is like the big test. Let's, can we for a second just draw, I don't care. It's so cheesy. And you've heard, everyone's heard you talk about the Comedy Store. Let's just spend a second with the Comedy Store, man. Because like for me, and this is the truth. And like, you know, I was talking to Ari.

He's like, you never went. I'm like, I was going up like twice a week, but even if I wasn't. He said you never went? No, for a second. Because twice a week but even if i wasn't he said he never went no for a second because he did you worked there dude that's how we became i know but from ari saw me in a really dark period where i was like not showing up for spots and he rightfully judges me for that but like it's okay i was that when you were living with me that was after i was living with you i went through a dark period I took it for granted and I deserve no no no

but Duncan you've just always been complicated it's not you're complicated I was having a conversation with someone and they were saying like it's okay to have a loose chassis but you gotta stay on the road I try to stay on the road but I love the comedy store

I love it with all my heart. Dude, when you and I became friends, we should tell people. You and I became friends because I would call into the Comedy Store and I'd say, Hey, I'm here Thursday, Friday, and Saturday. And you'd be like, Cool, man. Hey, did you fucking see this thing? That this thing is happening in Nepal where all these people are getting together. They're all seeing these crazy conversations that go on for hours.

You'd put me on hold. You'd take another call. And then we would talk about fucking Terrence McKenna and Graham Hancock. The best. Dude, we would get baked on the phone where Duncan Trussell was a Comedy Store employee. And I was at home.

And we would get high. And we would just start talking about aliens and ghosts. It was the best, Joe. It was the best. Man, that place is a temple for real. Dude, but you and I became like phone pals. That's how we got to be friends, and here we are right now. The funny thing is the conversation we're having is no different than the conversation we had when I was working there.

I was saying to Jamie when you left and went to pee, people bring things out of people. And it's something that I don't think people like to admit. But sometimes people bring bad things out of people and sometimes people bring good things out of people. And when I'm with you, I'm different than when I'm not with you. Yeah, man. I

really don't want this conversation to end. I'm not going to get all sappy and sentimental. Will you fly to Austin occasionally? Anytime you want, man. I'll come anytime you want this conversation to end. I'm not going to get all sappy and sentimental. Will you fly to Austin occasionally? Anytime you want, man. I'll fly you out. I'll come anytime you want. But to me, it's like... This is my solution to all this.

I'm just going to fly people out and put them up and pay for their food. It'll be great. Get them massages. It'll be great, man. But all that being said, I don't think anyone can understand what it's like, unless they've been there, to get off stage at the comedy store. And you have a good set, maybe, but you're working on a joke and you get off stage and suddenly Whitney Cummings, who's like a very rightfully successful, brilliantly funny person, stops you and says, hey, what do you think about this addition to your punchline? You know what i mean like those moments are so so like so like because because in that moment there isn't like a hierarchy like in that moment there isn't like look i made like shows for network tv dude one of my proudest moments as a comic i was at the improv and this was like 2003 or some shit like that and

Louis CK sits in the back of the room and takes notes and then we get off stage and he actually asked me before he goes you mind if I watch and like you give you some like like give you some notes I go dude I fucking love that yeah and then after I see a bunch of really funny suggestions. I don't remember if I wind up using any of them, but it was just so fun, so fun to hear him and I talk about like bits and the fact that he would like sit down and watch these bits. That's it. That was the, that's the, so to me, like, you know, and I, like I would always tell

Aaron, my wife, I'd always say like, always say, there's no comedy store anywhere else. I want to be here. I don't think it's impossible to make that somewhere else. This is the whole reason why I'm interested in moving to Texas. I don't believe that we have to be tethered to this machine that makes things that we don't do. This machine makes music, this machine makes movies, and it makes TV shows, and we don't do any of those things.

Right. We're in a totally different business, and I don't think we have to be connected to any sort of legacy entertainment structure. It doesn't make any sense. Legacy entertainment structure. They're just trying to siphon money off of you. Right.

It's just like, they're missing the point. Like, I wanna tell the truth. I don't wanna just sell things right i want i want i want to say what i'm thinking right now whether it's good or bad or angry or sad or remorseful i want to be able to say it anytime i want to say it and this is not acceptable in the the the regular old school legacy medium that that that, that people are thinking of as, as mainstream media. And it was mainstream media like 20 years ago or 30 years ago.

But what we're, you and I are doing right now is writing on a fucking cave wall compared to what's coming. What you and I are doing right now compared to what the fuck is going to happen when Elon Musk starts producing this whole neural link. Yeah. Yeah. And then they, they, they develop some sort of fucking satellite network where everyone's connected

and reading each other's minds all over the globe. Dude, this is cave wall scratch tickets bullshit. I know. We're playing tic-tac-toe by the fire. But this is to me like the poignant thing about like Neolithic structures. It's like you see the Neolithic structure and you know, like, fuck, man. People spent a long time building that. And in the process of building that, they became friends and they shared stories.

And it was really beautiful. But now all we see is some old eroded shit that we don't know anything about right yeah so to me what's beautiful is like you are absolutely right this thing we're doing right now it's it doesn't matter if what we're doing is like morse code it's gonna be gone it doesn't matter if it's a million years but it won't be a million years it won't be that long before our conversations seem dated but you know what we're doing also we're doing the same thing that beethoven was doing where they were making music at a time where you couldn't record it so you had to write it down yeah we're doing this some clunky like if you could listen imagine if you could listen

to the actual orchestra that was playing like beethoven fifth symphony. Oh shit, that's crazy. Can you imagine? Bro. Whoa. Also being in context. That's crazy. Of never having heard The Doors. Whoa.

Never having heard Hendrix. People cough. Yeah, right. Never having heard any of that. Only being in that era. Wow. And sitting in the audience. Dun, dun, dun, dun.

Dun, dun, dun, dun. Dun, dun, dun, dun. Dun, dun, dun, dun. Dun, dun, dun, dun. Yeah. Dun,da-da-da. Da-da-da-da. Da-da-da-da. Da-da-da-da. Da-da-da-da. Da-da-da-da. Yeah. Da-da-da-da. Da-da-da-da. It would be crazy. Is that Beethoven's Fifth?

Did I make that up? Jamie, act like. No, no. It was a terrible impression. It was like, who am I? Yeah. But think about how powerful that is. But imagine being there in the moment when it was first released.

Yeah. And no one could record anything. And now it's echoing. You had to write it down in some weird, they had to develop a language for music. Say what it was, yeah. I mean, you could be a badass guitarist in 2020 and not have any idea how to read music.

Yeah, that's right. Right? That's right. You could like watch videos and just decide, I'm just going to go full Stevie Ray Vaughan. Some people don't want to know how to read it. Yeah, they want to be able to just free. Oh, what's the earliest recording of that?

Is this hooked on? Can you play that? Or we get in trouble. You can't play it. That is it. That's it, right? That's Beethoven's Fifth? I mean, bro. Imagine being alive back then when you never heard any shit like that.

Dude, I was sitting in the audience. Do you remember when Notorious Big I.G. B.I.G. Big I.G. Biggie. Remember when Biggie came out with Hypnotize? No. Do you remember?

How old were you? I don't know. The year. I don't know. I have to do math. Biggie Hypnotized seems like 95 because I was on news radio. And I remember driving to work. What year? 97.

97? Yeah. So, okay. I was on news radio from 94 to 99. So, I was on news radio, and I remember driving to work and hearing that going, whoa. They just cracked through some new level. Yeah. Biggie biggie biggie. Can't you see sometimes your words a hypnotize me great song Oh my god, but it was just it was something about it where I was like, oh Somebody figured out a new level of the video game. Yeah

Of course he did dude, you don't understand what it was like back then. No internet. You would see him on MTV with piles of cash. Yeah. There was no accountability. That's so cool. Like, this is the, like, there's a concept in Buddhism, which is like, if you want to really-

This one hasn't even started yet. It's just- That's so funny! That's just helicopters and shit. How many helicopters do you need? Look at him. Look at him, Biggie. Man, do you know how many fucking amazing songs we missed out on?

Because Biggie and Tupac didn't get together and smoke pot. How fucked up is that? Just have a couple of drinks. Like, somebody had them tricked that they were enemies. Imagine if Biggie and Tupac were just like me and Stan Hope or like comics. Yeah. Like comics who just like,

what the fuck are we? We should love each other. We're the only ones that are like, how many goddamn MCs are there? How many rappers are there? How many standups are there? There's so few. There you go.

We should be so happy. We can't. That's that kind of talk will get you killed because that's the last bastion of the thing that wants to keep us limited, man. It's like that's the idea. But even them, man, I'm telling you, for them, they need to listen up. I know you want to have control.

But sometimes not having control is better. Like here's the thing in archery. Let me tell you something about archery. There's a thing about archery where it's very few people can what they call command shoot. What that means is when you draw back the bow and you have your finger on the trigger, you just decide when the arrow is going to go. Okay, sure. Most people don't do it that way.

And most people who do these big tournaments, like even the Olympics, they teach them to have a surprise release it's a psychological trick where you're using a certain type of release where either you have your finger on a trigger and you don't push your finger you just let your back muscles pull it because they're crude muscles or you use what's called a hinge when you slowly pull in the hinge the arrow goes but you don't know when it's going to go. Whereas a trigger, you know exactly where it's going to go. But there's something about knowing exactly where it's going to go where you just fucking tense up. That's cool.

You twitch, and it's hard. It's hard to keep your mind in order where you just go, especially if you're shooting in a tournament. You're in the Olympics, gold medal round. So very few people in the Olympics allow their brain to decide when the shot goes. Isn't that interesting? Yeah. Yeah, that's beautiful. I get what you're saying, too.

There's the mind of no mind, the ability to get out of your own way. And for archers, the best way to do this is either in the hinge release or a release with a thumb where you pull through with your back muscles and it makes the thumb trigger go off. So cool. This thing is dangerous. This thing's dangerous because you develop what's called target panic. And there's people that never, like my friend Cam Haynes, he's a freak of nature. He's never developed target panic. And he shoots like this.

He sees things, he shoots at them, and he's perfect. He shoots 140 yards. Boop, pop, balloon and shit. But he also runs a marathon a day. He's like a freak of nature. He's a very rare human. But you can't bank it on those people. You've got to think about the rest of the folks.

For the rest of the folks, the whole idea is like getting rid of anxiety. And what's anxiety? Anxiety is pulling a trigger. If you're in a gold medal round, you're like, I just hit that bullseye. This is it. America wins. Ah! And you just flinch.

There's just a little thing that happens to you that you don't want to happen. And your arrow just goes four inches shy of the mark. Got it. Fuck. Love it. Yeah, that's the, so that is the, so like, and I'm sorry, every podcast I do with you, I talk about Buddhism, but I don't care. I want you to talk about Buddhism.

Okay, thank you. So what I love about it is like, so everybody gets caught up in the first two ideas in Buddhism. The first being life is unsatisfactory. The second being the reason life is unsatisfactory is because you think it's a way that it's not. Now this gets translated in a lot of- Let's break that down. Life is unsatisfactory,

and the reason you think life is unsatisfactory is because. Well, life. So the best way to put it would be, have you ever been with someone in traffic in L.A.? And they're angry. Me. Okay. Me. But when have you ever been.

By myself. Right. But that's literally the way traffic is in L.A. Yes. Yet somehow, because you drove that day into traffic, you got into your head, this would be the one day in LA where there wouldn't be traffic. No. Honestly, I keep it together. But I do. I do.

I recognize that it's knocking on the door. It's like, come on, be a bitch. Freak out. Yeah. I really do keep it together. But this is also the real argument for microdosing. Because if you could just microdose, there would be so much less negative interactions with people, whether it's on the highway or anywhere.

No one who's microdosing on psilocybin is going to yell at you from across the street, put your fucking mask on. No. They're not going to do that. You're going to let them be themselves. Dude, I want to be the person that makes people smile. I don't want to be the person that makes people mad. I don't either.

And this is something I'm consciously thinking about more and more as I get older. I want us to do better. I really do. This is one of the reasons why I have this idea of starting over in Texas. I have this idea of disconnecting from all these old hubs and this idea of what we're doing. We're putting out content into the world. I don't believe it. I don't believe it has to be from a media center.

I don't believe it has to be from New York or L.A. I don't believe it. And I think I want to prove to myself that it doesn't have to. I want to go. One of the reasons why I wanted to go to Texas is because it's like almost like there's a certain mockery to living in Texas, you know, especially for someone like me. I wouldn't want to be you. Like everything you do is to study. And like I like I like being free of that magnifying lens.

But, you know, to me, like whenever I'm thinking about, like, you know, it's fun to think about what's the root problem here. The root problem seems to be centralization. It's like wherever centralization rears its head, problems emerge. The root problem is compassion. What do you mean? The root problem is compassion. That you mean the root problem is compassion that we don't make our decisions based on compassion we make them based on beneficial

markers of improvement whether it's financial improvement or land grabs or that's the problem the problem is that we we we have these things in our head where this is what's the most important and this is what's not as important. Like love is important, but if you see two people that are, you know, they're in love, but you don't like either one of them,

you, do you feel like that's the same kind of love as two people you admire? They're together. Yeah. Right. Like how many people, who do you know? Like,

all right, I'll give you one. I do Laird Hamilton and Gabrielle Reese. I'm friends with those two people. They're super athletes. She was a super athlete in volleyball, and he's one of the greatest big wave surfers the world's ever known. I'm friends with them.

And when I talk to them, if I talk to them, either on like we do a little FaceTime the other day, and I get out of it, I go, We did a little FaceTime the other day, and I get out of it. I go, I want to be somebody who makes me feel, or I want to be somebody who makes somebody feel the way I feel when I talk to them. That's cool. When I talk to those people, I'm like, these are superior people. Like, Laird Hamilton's a weird dude, but he's also like a superior human who does these crazy pool workouts with 70-pound dumbbells. He gets in the fucking sauna

at 250 degrees and rides an airdyne bike with oven mitts on. Jesus. Yeah, they're freaks. He wears oven mitts because it burns his hand? Yes! 250! 250! 250! You needed some point! He was like,

I gotta put on oven mitts! But he doesn't get out of the sauna. And I said to myself when I got off the phone with him the other day, they're really nice people. They're really, really, they're genuine people. And this is one of the things that happens. And it's a weird thing that happens when you become more and more famous. You get more and more comfortable talking to other famous people. You know, so you talk to famous people and you realize, oh, they have a hard time talking to people because other people think

they're weird. Yeah. So they have to find famous people that are also nice. Right. And so that's how I feel about them. So I get off the phone with them and I'm like, like, you can be, you can be Gabriella Reese and you can be Laird Hamilton and still come out and be a really cool, friendly, inspirational, genuine person.

Yeah. And I'm like, I want to make somebody else feel the way those people make me feel. Yeah, man. And that's what I felt like. I love that. That's it. That's the best thing we can do for each other. That's the answer.

And that's, if anything has ever come out of this podcast that's been good, it's that it's given people a perspective where there's a potential where maybe there are limited ideas of what they're capable of in terms of their own personal happiness or their own success in whatever their chosen endeavor is. Maybe it's not really limited. Maybe they can just shift their consciousness, and through effort and focus, they can change their destiny. Maybe it's true. Well, the reason I say centralization is because like

the first and a very natural reaction to being associated with a body would be that you would centralize on the identity that you're in you know if i step on your if i stomp on your foot you're gonna feel pain yeah so why wouldn't you centralize on this identity that you're in so and again like right now with the science we have it can't show us what I think it will eventually show that our sentience isn't limited to the body, that we're a field of consciousness that's kind of getting associated with like particular like quantum clouds of meat that we thought. And they interface with other sentient bodies in a way that makes them unique to the relationship between that person like i bet you're different with your wife than you are with anybody you've ever met that that is true yes but that's also like one of the great like right now one of the big ideas such a cool idea too is like on stage off stage so uh how are you acting when you think you're

on stage in other words like when you're in front of like this is the best part about covid there's no on stage exactly that's it but it's the only good thing about covid for me well there's actually i'll tell you some other great things about covid it taught us that that we can telecommute and businesses still work and that transforms the landscape but like like the onstage, offstage idea or the way like Cho-Gim-Tri-Va-Rin-Fa-She puts it is some people at the end of the day, they go home and they sit on the couch

and they go, but they only let themselves do that at the very end of the day of work because they've produced in their mind a situation where this is me relaxing and this is me working. Here I am with my family. Here I am with my coworkers.

So this differentiation produces a kind of neurotic, kind of split personality way of being, which is like really all those, you don't need to wait to get home to sit on the couch to go, that's where you're at now. That's actually every single thing. But the story you're telling yourself produces moments where this is a relaxing time and this is a non-relaxing time. But it's just a story, Joe. That's the idea. And compassion is, I think the the beginning of recognizing like you

know how many people have you met i'm sure and i know my life changed when i went to the doctor with my swollen fucking testicle that by the way before i went to the doctor i would look at myself in the mirror and think man if they were symmetrical i would feel awesome like it felt good to have a big ball. There was like... I literally was like, goddammit, if there were balls... You were happy about the one big ball. It looked powerful. I'm not gonna lie, man. Have you ever seen Joey Diaz's balls?

Yeah, like that. They're preposterous. He feels like that every day. They don't even make sense. So, like, for a few months... Jamie, have you seen Joey's balls? See if you can pull up the picture of Joey on stage They don't even make sense. So like for a few months... Jamie, have you seen Joey's balls? See if you can pull up the picture of Joey on stage where he's naked with a... He had a...

I can't show. I know, I know. But just for me. He had a safety pin and a towel around his neck like a cape. And this was for my 1999 Warner Brothers CD called I'm Gonna Be Dead Someday. We took these crazy pictures in the main room of the comedy store. Dude, I was there. You were there for those pictures?

The matador outfit. I was like, there was some drama about it. You were there for that? You guys snuck in and took the pictures. Were you working? I was a talent coordinator. You guys snuck in, took the pictures. No, we didn't snuck in.

We talked to whoever the fuck it was it was me was it scott day or tommy i'm sorry i feel like i was there when i have i could be wrong but i remember the matador pictures warner brothers did it maybe i'm wrong they made calls no i remember that door picture was real i'm sorry but i remember a moment that i was i think i was a talent coordinator where suddenly joey there's pictures of joey Diaz in a matador outfit. There's the funniest thing you've ever seen. But Mitzi caught wind of it. That's what I remember is there was some drama around the situation.

Like the pictures themselves were like not just funny. They were like kind of artistic. They look cool. There's a picture of Joey and he – please someone find this. It's in – I think I have the CD, so I have it. That's so funny. It's on the CD, so I have it. Because when I'm moving, I'm going through my shit,

and one of the things I found is those old I'm Gonna Be Dead Someday CDs. That's 99. I became Joey Diaz's associate and best friend around 96. That's when I met him. I could be wrong about when I was there. I just remember there was some drama. You might have been there if you were there in 99. When did you start working?

I don't remember the exact date. I just remember there was some drama around. I think it was before your time, man. I want to feel like it's before your time. It could easily be that Mitzi caught wind of the pictures late or something. You know, like it could easily. I just remember there was some drama attached to the.

That lady was so nice to me. She loved you, man. She loved Joey, too. She loved Joey. She loved both of us. She had the funnest thing with like her idea of us together. She loved that we were together, that we were friends. She was a wild beast. She was a wild lady. She together that we were friends she was a wild she

was a wild lady she was wild dude that was a real guru like mitzi shore was an actual guru yeah listen man i tell everybody if there's a one human being that's the most important human being in comedy ever that wasn't a comedian it's mitzi shore that's why she's on the wall of this room she was i'm taking her with me, man. Not only that, the movers don't take her. I take her. Mitzi's coming with me on the plane. Yeah, man. She was real.

Listen, that's coming with me on the plane. No bullshit. Yeah. The reason why that's up on the wall after the movers have gone is that's coming with me. That's Mitzi. Yeah. She gave me my future. No, she was wild.

She was a wild animal. She was a crazy lady. She's a perfect person to run the comedy store. Well, no, she had to be that way. You can't have... If you go through, there's photos in the album where you can see Joey with a cape uh with a cape he had this uh oh god damn i know i can i know i have it i know i have it somewhere i'll find it it's on one of my folders you know what was in her when you walk into her house joey diaz cape balls i'm looking you know

what you know what was in her house on doheny when you walk into her house no that so on her house when you walk in the first thing you see is what do you call it when people sew and they make art with so crochet a crocheted picture and on it it said dying is easy comedy is hard that's the first thing you said eyes on yeah yeah it like it is true and like that that was what's beautiful about her is she understood how hard comedy was i told you the story of her getting robbed right i told you that story which story is that tell me so like here's how cool she was and i i can't remember the name of the comic but she was giving him spots i can't remember the name of the comic

this was in the early it's better you don't tell yeah it's better i don't say so this motherfucker needed money and he robbed the van she was in the van like apparently she like, at gunpoint took the cash earnings of the club at gunpoint. Like, took the money from her. And she knew who it was somehow. She could tell somehow from the mask. He didn't do a good. She just knew. Right.

And I remember her saying, like, yeah, he robbed me at gunpoint, but he's funny. But he's funny. But he's funny! That was her, but that was her. Can you imagine? If you really think about it, you get robbed at gunpoint by a comedian, and you still give him stage time. What the fuck is that? Well, a that's a guru that's a guru

that's not a huge that's not a normal person anymore that becomes like that i've never had that sort of a relationship with any human ever you know i i sought her out when i was living in boston really yeah you knew about her oh dude when i was an open miker okay I had gotten obsessed with comedy for six months before I could ever do an open mic night because I erroneously assumed that you had to be 21 to be able to get on stage turns out you can be younger

but you just can't drink they watch you but you can be a 19 year old and do stand up I didn't know so August 27th 1988 when I turned 21 I went on stage and when when I went on stage I remember thinking I remember like really clearly thinking like how weird is this job there's a there's a bunch of people out there they could just talk and they can make a living yeah how weird is this job? There's a bunch of people out there that can just talk

and they can make a living. How weird is this job? What did you think the first time you ever went on stage and you talked into a microphone? Hello? Hi? My name is Duncan Trussell. So weird. Like when you look back at those

times, like how do you feel? you feel like it's not even you i met that lady when i met mitzi shore and when mitzi shore passed me at the comedy store i remember thinking when i was in 1988 in boston there was this mecca there was this place you had to go where richard pryor filmed live at the Sunset Strip and Sam Kenison used to do stand up and fucking Howie Mandel went up and Rodney Dangerfield

and David Letterman God damn I gotta get to the comedy store that's all they wanted to do I didn't want to get anywhere else there was one part of me

that wanted to go to Houston cause I had heard that like Sam Kenison did these wild shows in Houston I wanted to go to Houston but the big heard that Sam Kinison did these wild shows in Houston. I wanted to go to Houston. But the big thing for me was I got to get to the store.

And when I got passed by that lady, dude, you know, it's one of the reasons why I feel so compelled to help people on this podcast. It's because I feel like when that lady passed me, I was like, holy shit.

Like, I'm a real comedian now. Yeah, man. Like, I don't have to be scared. I just have to keep working. Yeah. I got passed. Yeah. By the godmother, the real godmother.

Yeah. Like, you worked for that lady. That's right. You were there all the time, man. I know. Can't go back. You were there all the time, man. I know.

Can't go back. She made us. She created an environment that accelerated comedy. Yeah, man. She pushed comedy because she kept it together, but like at the fucking highest RPM, like at 9,000 RPMs of the engines going. She kept it together. She let these comics be wild. You remember when Ari slapped Bobby Lee?

Of course I remember. Do you know that's when he started getting spots? Is that true? Yeah. You know how I know? Because I was jealous. I was a talent coordinator. I remember Ari's gradually unraveling into his comedic self.

And I remember Ari smacks Bobby Lee. There was a fight between Ari and Bobby Lee. And I remember as a talent coordinator, that was when Mitzi started getting... He's now a comic. Somewhere in that throwing off of rationality. I don't know what it was, man. Here's the most important part of Mitzi. She was a woman. She was a woman and she encouraged chaos.

She wasn't remotely concerned with safety. She wanted wild people, man. Dude, she wanted me to be wild. That's what she wanted. She wanted wild that's what she wanted she wanted wild comedy she wanted kinnison she wanted prior she wanted everyone that came in between damon wayans yeah man she wanted she wanted wild she wanted martin lawrence she wanted wild she wanted yeah she wasn't domestic she was feral mitzi was a feral lady mitzi was a feral lady. Mitzi was a human. I mean, what we call human now, people think of as feral

or what people... No, I mean, but when I say feral, I mean... I know what you mean. Exceptional. She was wild. She didn't have anybody else's rules

holding her back. No, no. And she didn't fucking care. She didn't care. She didn't care about money. She was all, fuck you. That's the most important thing about her

is like having a club on the sunset strip and not making decisions based on money yeah because let me tell you man as a talent coordinator there are plenty of times where people wanted to film some shit in the main room where they wanted to pay a lot of money and she'd be like no get it now tell them well we should talk about that because that was like one of the things about that club was that like you could never film anything there. No! That was one of the most amazing things about Ari

filming his special there. It was a really cool thing he did. It was also like an acknowledgement that the world had changed. And that was one of the reasons why I was willing to come back because Ari filmed his shit yeah in the or well she would have i i really do believe she would have approved that eventually but somebody would have got involved they would have fucked it up she would have made him jump through some hoops it wouldn't have been that easy like she would have made him do some

crazy and she's right here's the thing she's right you know i didn't i didn't cash any of my checks you probably know that oh i remember i don't like when i was working at the store i just wouldn't cash my checks and then they would go hey we have like all this money that you i just like can i donate it to the sound system you bought the sound system i did that too but that was that was extra that was on top of that well because the sound system was fucking up and then you bought it and all honestly mitzi didn't want you to do that because like that was the thing like she wrecked she was smart enough to know if i let a comedian buy the sound system i can't like honestly give them spots like so i knew that was the case but i was like at this point she's giving me spots every

fucking weekend. I just want to help out. Let's stop playing games. Like, come on. You know what I'm doing. I'm out here doing my best stand up I can. We got a fucked up speaker system. Let's fix it.

It was fucked up. I put a DAT system in there. I put a mini disc. And I wanted to have it set up so anybody could, like, if you had a mini disc, remember the mini disc days I want to have it set up so anybody can like if you had a mini disc remember the mini disc days of course dude it was so important before smartphones to be able to record your shows yeah it's so big and you don't record and listen to all of them but the option to be able to do that is so huge even if you're not diligent you still gain like 10, 20% of like a tightening of your act.

Dude, the comedy store at that time, for lack of a better word, was an art cult. Yeah. That's what it was. It was a cult. And like it was a cult that was like for sure, like all cult systems are based on like a strong, charismatic central leader. And that was Mitzi. Based on like a strong, charismatic central leader. No, it was Mitzi.

But you know what? As a man, I was happy to relent to Mitzi. Well, yeah. But there was a thing for me as like this macho man. It was important. It was hard. It was important to relent to Mitzi. You had to. But it wasn't just that I had to.

Mitzi. You had to. But it wasn't just that I had to. I wanted to. To show respect. To show that I got it. To show that I know what you did. Yeah, man. Like that lady, man, when I was in fucking Boston in 88,

I would hear about her. She loved comedy. And I'd be like, this one lady did this? Like, yeah, she was married to a comedian but it didn't work out and she's Pauly Shore's mom and I would hear

these stories and I'd be like that's crazy this one lady just figured it out and she was wild and she liked the party and she liked men

and she was just a wild lady but she was brutal with you she didn't like your comedy she would just tell you you were done she would just tell you you were done she

would just tell you if she thought you weren't funny you were done dude she put her hand on my wrist and she goes you're really funny and i'll never forget that oh it was like 1994 i was like oh my god well she wouldn't hand that out lightly man that was the thing is like she was like that i've been around it man like so it's so weird i i'm so lucky because i got to be around like ramdas of mitzi shore and like they're similar in a way yes they are similar yeah there's a there's a lot of differences you don't like This idea of what we think of as perspective. Realization. Yeah.

Dude. Mitzi was an artist. 1994, when I was six years into comedy, her putting her hand on my wrist and telling me I'm really funny changed my life. that like will never be captured is that it's not just that here you have this like tiny woman who is tiny tiny but it's not just that you have this being be so careful when i would hug her yeah right remember hugging mitzi yeah yeah well she was a gangster i mean that was all like the thing about mitzi was like no like imagine imagine like the best thing to think of is like think of your most like outlaw comedian. Then imagine a person who built a saloon within which those comedians could be grown to be more of an outlaw. There was no Kennison without Mitzi Shore.

That's right. But then the most to me, like with Mitzi, if you were to and she would never allow this. She'd already if she heard me and she would never allow this she'd already if she heard me saying any of this shit she'd be like you're fired but like if you were gonna write a mitzi bible and you wanted to like base the whole bible on one thing it was something she told me so many times as a talent coordinator and i like to fantasize she thought i was funny but as a talent coordinator something she told me over and over and over again regarding comedians was, you don't need them. They need you.

That was her, like, core thing, which is, like, the moment that a comedian starts thinking that they need this system, then they degrade themselves. They have to understand that their comedic ability and who they are as that persona, which she would say is like, they're iconoclasts. She meant like, you're not going to find anyone like this ever again. And that's who she was trying to find. She would say, therefore you it's supply and demand which is like there is nothing like you but there's a lot of things like them so if you think that you need them you will degrade yourself as an artist that was her main core truth which is don't get caught up in the thing they're going to try to teach you which is you need them you don't

need the manager you don't need the agent you is you need them. You don't need the manager. You don't need the agent. You don't need the studio. You don't need anything because you are funny. You are the fucking nuclear isotope generating energy. And if you get lost in this insanity that you require the system to be great,

not only do you grade yourself, you degrade an art. But, you know, this is one of the things about recognizing what Mitzi Shore did and a lot of Bud Friedman, a lot of people who own clubs. Roddy Dangerfield. Yeah. Is it's not just about the ideas and getting the ideas out in a way the audience can digest.

It's setting up a club. It's bringing people in. it's setting a standard where people know hey man david letterman came out of here robin williams came out of here yeah okay bill hicks came out bill hicks was a fucking doorman here sam kinnison came out of here okay yeah this is the motherfucking comedy store yeah there's a standard. And that's a factor too, man. You can't let the artist completely be in control because one charismatic artist

with a lot of fucking song and dance moves can trick people into thinking things that aren't necessarily accurate because of charisma. That's true, man. She figured that out, though. Yeah. And we need another one of her, man. You're never going to get another Mitzi.

But we can carry on her legacy. We all learn from her, you know. And I think she was uniquely qualified to run the comedy store because she wasn't a comic. She had no desire to be a comic. But she was married to a comic, and she knew exactly what comics were. Her son was a comic. She knew exactly what comics were and she wasn't stupid. She was smart and she was... but she also didn't give a fuck. There's a rare group of people that legitimately don't give a fuck.

She didn't give a fuck. If Mitzi Shore was alive today, if we could somehow or another go back in time and grab Mitzi Shore from 1974 and bring her to 2020, she would just be running shit. She would just be running shit. First of all, she would have

a hundred girls under contract for OnlyFans accounts. She would just run people. I'll tell you the one time. That part's not true. The OnlyFans. The OnlyFans,. She would just run people. I'll tell you the one time. That part's not true. The OnlyFans. The OnlyFans, it's conjecture,

but I'll tell you the one time. Do you have a problem with OnlyFans? The porn site? It's not a porn site though. It's like girls can do whatever they want. I don't have a problem

with sex. Like I have a problem with my own inability to like regulate my desire to cum. But I'm like, I can't get mad at the world for that. I had a conversation with someone and they were saying, well, also, she has an OnlyFans site.

I'm like, hmm. If I had big tits, I'd be getting paid for those big tits. I'm so tired of these sex negative fucks, man. It ramped up during the lockdown, though, because it became an easy job for a lot of people. If I was 22 and I had big tits and I liked to do squats and I was sitting around thinking, do I want to work at Burger King or do I want to shake my ass for $10 a month for 35 000 guys yeah it doesn't have to just be that though either it's not just a porn star you can do whatever you it's patreon for right you know this is madness so only fans can wear a bikini you could just do yoga but joe in like a dimension

where like being funny is getting people to come you'd be like the top porn star in that dimension it's just that's a weird one right like getting people to come it's be like it's a porn star that dimension It's just that's a weird one right like getting people to come it's so specific. It's what's a big deal It doesn't matter. It shouldn't be a big deal, but yet it is like if you find out that somebody came It's not a big deal. It shouldn't be but it is it is right now because we're lunatics like we hate life like we're exactly Yeah, we're so death centric that like the anything that's the source of life which is a hand job a blow job fucking we look at that as like being depraved you know well it's it's really just some sort of weird canyon ladder in between

two fucking cliffs between this and what is going to be available for people in just a few years. There's going to be virtual sex. You got to have Riley Reid on, man. She's so great. Like, I don't know. You have her on and I'll take my pants off. What I'm going to do is she's so funny.

She's goggles on this. This is the future. Goggles. Put goggles on. You lay back. You're in another world. Well, yeah. I mean, that's heaven's heaven but like but is it

yes no what's wrong with coming because there's one percent of your brain that knows it's bullshit why there's no real girl and they don't really like you and your jokes suck and you kind of smell and you didn't brush your teeth that good yeah Yeah? Yeah. But she's like, I love that part of you. No, the girl. Oh, no, no, no, no, no. If the girl really did love that part of you, that would be extraordinary. See, that's the beauty of alcohol.

Alcohol is, you're hanging out with a girl who's got a like Hello Kitty tattoo in between her thumb and forefinger and you guys are drinking, you're having a good time and you're like, I love you. And she's like's like i love you too and you just give each other a hug it doesn't even have to be sexual that's where alcohol comes in where where what do you mean what do you mean i'm following you in the aisle the hello kitty the where does alcohol come in that's where alcohol comes in and like it allows you to take chances and hope that the other person doesn't have ulterior motives.

You both release your ambitions. Let's go to Vegas and get married. I don't even know you. Let's go crazy. How crazy is it we think fucking's bad? It's not that we think fucking's bad. It's that we worry you fuck too many people why is that a trick too many times you're like one of those people at one of those david blaine street shows

and you're like it's gotta be the queen of hearts trust me isn't that wild it's like it's the great it's one of the great things it really is one of the great things. Like, think of, like, any time, like. You know why? Why? Because we're concentrated more on innovation and progress in terms of numbers. So weird. But earning money and getting new projects passed through, they take precedent over everything else so sick it's weird

but it's just it's a weird game this is what I'm getting out of this book Irresistible it's like there's things that we have in our head

where we're we have these they're wrong we have these ideas of what we need right in order to be sufficient. We're operating from the wrong principles. Wait, I'm sorry, Joe.

I gotta pee. I've been holding it for like 10 minutes. Go pee. Go pee. I don't want it to end, man. We don't have to end. Go pee. This is the first show ever on Spotify.

I can't believe I get to pee here. I gotta go. I looked on your... Go pee, bro. Go pee. I wasn't even in the bus. Jesus, go. I looked on your, your go pee, bro. Go pee. Jesus. Go pee. No voting. There's no voting. God, isn't he funny? I wasn't even in the voting. Duncan Trussell. I wanted you to be guest number one. It's important. Guest number two. Miley Cyrus.

That's right. Number two. That's what I said. I said guest number two. You don't even listen. We're like an old married couple, Jamie. I said guest number two. I'm drunk. I'm high. Guest number two is Miley Cyrus. Guest number

three, Mike motherfucking Tyson. How about that? Jamie, are you concerned at all about moving to Texas? No. That's what I like about you. It's one of many things.

But you're ready to roll. I should just tell the people at home, I brought it up with Jamie, I'm like, I'm thinking about moving to Texas. Jamie goes, okay. Is that accurate? Yeah, I mean, it's going to happen.

Something was coming. Some change, something's going to happen. Something was coming. Some change, something was going to happen. What did you think was going to happen? What was the worst case scenario, like Montana? No, I didn't think that was going to happen. I don't know. I just didn't want you to not want to do it. I wasn't worried about it.

Good. I'm happy. There's a, you know, it's hard. good happy this uh you know it's hard I feel like I'm prolonging this out of a neurotic

you're not prolonging anything this is fun Jamie and I just had a love fest oh that's great I do feel like I'm doing like

I was asking Jamie if there was ever a time where I was telling him we're moving to Texas where he was like oh like I don't want to do that

but he's like no but when I brought it up I'm like what do you think where he was like, Oh, like, I don't want to do that. But he's like, no. But when I brought it up, I'm like, what do you think? And he's like, okay. That's cool. I do feel like I'm stretching it out. It's like, man. What does it mean, man? This is the first episode on Spotify.

I love that. It's supposed to be you. I love it. It's supposed to be you. It's beautiful. But also there's a piece of me that like. Duncan, I think we can work things out together. I really do.

I think you and me together have a unique perspective, and I'm not bullshitting. I agree. And I don't think it's- I'm not taking ownership, and you shouldn't either. It's the two of us together. I know. There's a weird thing that happens. I feel it, man. Like, look, it's my favorite thing, which is why I don't want it to end, which is why

I'm like- like, look, man, I'm a Buddhist. I know I'm going to die. What does that mean, though? When you say you're a Buddhist, shouldn't we have a new thing? You said like communism, socialism. I love it, Joe. I love it. Can't we have a new one?

I think we can, but I do want to, like, the reason I'm going to speak up for Buddhism in general, and I agree with you. The reason I'm going to speak up for Buddhism in general, and I agree with you, and what I love about Buddhism so much is that, man, what's great about it is it invites you to reject it. It says to you, the first part of it is reject this if you can. If you can find a flaw in the thing, reject it. And also, if you can find a legitimate legitimate rejection then we will add that to the like what buddhism buddhism yes so that's what i love about it because it's more of a process that's that's perfect yeah it's perfect and it has to be that way it has to be that way but if you're thinking about how to progress with ideas yeah man you have to be able to say hey bring me a counter idea that makes more sense

and I'll reconsider it. But it's what we were talking about earlier. People are married to their goddamn ideas. It's sad. It's, it's, it's not just sad. It is sad for sure. But it's also, it's bad for all of us. And it's, it's one of those things that we should recognize just like, you know, like a negative feedback, like, Oh, I'm so fat. fat oh I'm such a fucking loser everybody admits that that is not good for you and it actually hinders process progress I think that it hinders progress as well

I think we have to look at things in a more positive way that's so weird dude there's this teacher Jack Kornfield he's so smart he's a Buddhist teacher in the early days of the Ram Dass retreats i would do these podcasts with him and i remember being like i want to get in shape i feel like i'm fat and what he said to me was get in shape

because you love yourself not because you hate yourself don't get in shape because you are angry at who you are right now. Get in shape because you think you deserve to be in shape. That's cute. That sounds like a guy who's never been fat. Listen to me, pussy. Hey! Competition's real, motherfucker! Sometimes you just gotta get in shape

because you don't... Look, fat shaming works. That's what people don't like to admit that shame makes you fucking lose weight cause you don't want to feel bad and then you feel good because you lost all the weight I have to stick up for Jack Kornfield because he is one of the great teachers I'll stick up for him too and you would love him

I love him if he's friends with you thank you Joe but I do have to stick up for him but just like an example of how badass this person is do you want to move to texas no i can't i'm going i'm not saying sure i don't want to be local i have an idea i think you and i together can fix a lot of shit what's the plan man you and me do like a weekly podcast one a week joe and duncan i love it live from austin i love it but it's not gonna happen in austin why not oh we'll zoom for a while until you come to your senses man we'll do it off camera this conversation i love this conversation though listen man i'm not bullshitting i'm not bullshitting i would do just about anything for

you joe i would do just about anything for you, Joe. I would do just about anything for you. I know you would. I would. Now, look, I got to stick up for this teacher, though. And I'm sorry. We can zoom it. We can zoom it. Hold on. What teacher?

Jack Kornfield, Joe. Oh, yeah, the Buddhist guy. I love you, man. I love you, too. But you got to understand, this is like a person who has deeply impacted me. And he was a monk. And I know him as a friend and like he's a monk. Okay. In the sense that he went,

here's what's cool about him. He went to, he became a monastic Theravadan Buddhist and he like took a vow of silence for like two years. So for two years he didn't talk. Is it possible he didn't have anything good to say? Oh, no. No, man.

Jack Corfield! Look, listen. I really, like, he really, like, I'm sorry. I don't mean to be sentimental about somebody. I'm just joking. I know you're joking. When did he die? He's alive, Joe!

I'm sorry, sorry, sorry. You said sentimental. I panicked. I mean sentimental only in that, like, I wouldn't want to do anything that would, like, negatively impact, like, a real- Can we get him on a show? First episode? He would come on your show.

You, me, and Jack Kornfield. You would love it. You would love him. How about that? Our first episode that convinces you to move to Austin, Texas. I would come to Austin, Texas to meet Jack Kornfield. Would you move? No.

What if I bought your house? Would you live in it? Joe, I love that you would buy me a house, but I wouldn't move. Isn't that what's cool about us? Like, one of the cool things about us is you could say I will buy you a house. That's not why I would want to be with you for

the house. I know. I know, man. And I understand. But like, for me, it's like, off camera, I will talk to you about the reason we made the decision. Oh, listen, you made an amazing decision. Your decision's way better than mine but i don't i'm jealous i don't want to be local like to me i get it that we let's do a zoom show let's do a zoom show or let's you and i have known each other for so long we could do both or either exactly we could do zoom shows that's what i think we could do live shows i just think like the the

right now the best thing for the world is not to imagine that you have to be in any given gps coordinate i think that yeah the best thing for the world is to begin to realize like we don't need to be tethered to a a particular locality like this is the problem it's like it's it's a bit of the problem but it's also in recognizing that it is an actual like it's a thing that you factor into the world that you see but how relevant is it to day-to-day operations right that's what i'm talking about right that's that to me like the gift of covet has been like people have begun to realize, keep your circle small. Google is doing fine,

and no one's going to Google to go to work. Twitter is doing fine. No one's going to the Twitter building to work. Netflix. What do you mean? Do they have jobs? Dude, people are all working remotely. No one's going to Netflix. Oh, what you're saying is that

the businesses are doing well, but no one's going to the actual business. They don't have to. Why do they have to? Exactly. Dude, that, to me, that is the, if you want to start really restructuring society, let's start with a superstition that you need to be in proximity of another person's body. But goddamn, that kills New York City.

Yeah, it kills L.A. too. It kills both of them. It kills L.A. That's why I want you to come to Austin. Dude, I will be at, whenever you want. I'll come to Austin. Duncan, come bring your baby. He would love, I can't wait for you to meet Little Forrest.

He's so brilliant. But my point is, look, man, my point is, like, we can't be centralized. Like, look, you're going to be in Austin. I'm going to be in a certain place. I don't want to say it yet. It's a bunker outside of Nevada. Yeah, I'm going to be in Nevada.

Somewhere near Barstow where the bats take over. We're going to fight against centralization so that we don't have to get chained to shitty cities. Like, that's the whole point is, like, look, if anything happens after COVID that's beautiful beautiful it will be that all the commuters say to their bosses wait a minute for the last six months i've been zooming in for these fucking conferences and your business is doing just as well as it did when i was driving an hour to get there an hour back and then the moment that happens we break the back of addiction to being in a metropolis. Now we have a global society. Now it's not just that you have to have some person who's like living in an Angeleno. It's like you could have someone from any part of the planet.

Centralization seems to be the fundamental problem in the sense that it worked. We needed to centralize prior to the internet. But now we don't need to centralize. It's better for everybody if we take into account every idea. It's better for everybody if we take into account all the dumb ideas and smart ideas and let them battle it out. Yeah. Let's find out who's right. Yeah.

And you got to be real careful people who think that they're right and the other people are wrong. It's what we were talking about earlier that bums me out the most about the Democratic Convention. I would just like... Forget about whatever you don't like about Trump. Tell me what you're going to do.

Don't tell me how bad the orange man is. Tell me what you're going to yeah how you gonna fix it how you gonna fix it yeah what are you gonna do we can do about flint michigan's water what are you gonna do about the fucking earth is heating up what are you gonna do about there's no fish? Where's the fish? What are you gonna do? Nobody has an idea.

They just want to talk shit and make sure everybody's trans. I would rather them talk shit and make sure everyone's trans than be like what's happening now. I don't mean that trans people. I'm with you. I know. Here's what's happening now. I don't mean that, trans people. I'm with you. I know. Look, here's what's funny to me about your whole pushback against the trans community.

It's not. It's only pushback against trans people competing as females and fighting. That's it. And other athletics, a little bit, but fighting in a big way. To me, the part of it that's interesting is i know you well enough to know that if and prove me wrong here but if there was a technology that could turn a guy into a woman no they could not just turn a guy into a woman which is very funny because right now that's what we're doing and it makes sense because it's like right now what we know is men and women right so

that's where we're at so right now as far as our understanding of what can a human be if you want to break it into a binary we've got men and women right but that's pretty limited to me you know what i mean and i get wanting to be a woman and i think that you joe rogan if there was a technology that could instantly turn you into a woman, you wouldn't hesitate to turn into a woman. I'd like to feel a dick inside me. Yeah, exactly. That's what I'm saying. As a woman?

Yeah. I don't think it would make me gay. No, exactly. It doesn't make you gay. Trust me. As someone who's felt many dicks inside of them, it doesn't make you gay. I'm just kidding. If you could be a woman and actually be attracted to a male for 18 hours, you're in love.

You would do it in a second. Imagine if you have an Oculus Rift and they make you go through a bunch of waivers and they say, Duncan, if you do take the next step, what happens is you become a woman who actually feels the way a woman feels when she's attracted to a man. And a guy with a dick like a battering ram. Let me try it. Is just going to send it home. See what happens. And you can't wait.

You want to feel him come inside your upper rib cavity. I want to feel it. Sign me up. Yeah. Who cares? The point is like, but some men, the weakest among us would be scared of that experience.

Right. Well, you'd be scared that that experience weakens them and turns them into something that they, they, they dismiss. But how hilarious is it that they decide, sorry,

Joe. No, no, it's their own issue no it's the the experience that literally made them exist on the planet they feel like if they were to feel it it would be something against who they are which is insanity in the sense of the very seat the very feeling of a cock blowing cum inside your body you switch spots with your woman imagine if the only way a woman was willing to marry you is if you become

the wife and she becomes the husband and you switch consciousness you have to feel it Duncan I love you I love you too Priscilla I want to know what it feels like to be you yeah I want to be with you yeah but I want I want to be you. Yeah. I want to be with you. Yeah. But I want, I want to be you for four years. Yeah. Let's swap identities. Imagine a four year contract. Yeah. Where all of your secrets

get downloaded into your wife's brain. Let's swap. He likes feet. That's not a secret. Imagine though. No, that's the idea is like the point is like

right now we're like terrestrialized like like we're the reason we're hanging out on planet earth

is not because we decided to be here we're hanging out on planet earth because there's not other planets that we could fly to

but even if we could we haven't figured this one out yet right but slow down if there were other planets and we could get there trust me in. But even if we could, we haven't figured this one out yet. Right, but it doesn't... Slow down. If there were other planets and we could get there, trust me,

this is what's funny to me about, like, Lindsey Graham. I love Lindsey Graham. He's such a fucking asshole, but I feel for... I have a weird connection to him. He's such a fucking asshole. But, like, Lindsey Graham,

I have the feeling that if suddenly there was, like, the ability to travel through space He would leave the planet within seconds. He would just be gone the Lindsey Graham is like here's what I think Religious guy. No, he's a politician Lindsey Graham is just like like religion He's like poor Lindsey Graham, man. He's like he like got is a weak chin. I

Have a weak fucking chin, man. No, you don't. Yeah, dude. Not like that guy. Wait till I shave my beard. No, listen, bro. That guy. No, Lindsey Graham.

Look, I know Lindsey Graham. He like got sucked into a dark vortex. He's a sweetheart underneath it all. And also, he's like, he's like a gay dude, you know? He's like a gay dude who like has. But what I'm saying is like. What is he saying? What? He's a gay dude he's like a gay dude you know he's like a gay dude who like has but what i'm saying is like what is he saying what is a gay dude that has like a man lindsey graham causes problems because like a dude that what he like is a he's a he's a suppressive being that like it's like

aligns with closet no not a closeted thing it's not the gay dude is in the part the it doesn't matter if lindsey gra. That's not what I'm saying. But you brought it up, so it must matter. No, what I'm saying is his shit came out about him being gay, and then he had to fight it, or there was something I felt bad for him. In that regard, I feel bad about it. But don't you think for him, even,

it would be, if he just said, I'm gay. Yeah, it would be the best. Or I'm not. That's the argument against these two ideas if you could turn into a woman Right get fucked like you just said would you be gay? No you would be a woman who got fucked But like somehow if like you're if you've decided to centralize on your masculine identity and someone fucks you, now you're gay. The whole conceptualization of gayness and straightness is just monkey talk.

Is the problem the word itself? The problem is the binary. The definition? Gay, straight? It's a binary, dude. It's like, look, I don't know. Whatever the fuck it is that you think is like limiting your ability to experience pleasure on the earth is satan and it's like if that thing is telling you that you're a

dude and this is the only way you can feel joy but on the like simultaneously you're like hanging out with a guy who's like the same gender as you and you're falling in love with him and then you're you're pretending you're not because because like some devil voice in your mind is telling you, that's Satan, man. That's evil. That's fucking evil. It's dark. It's dark.

And I'm not deriding Lindsey Graham's sexual proclivities. I'm just saying. I know he's not actively gay. I don't know that. All I'm saying is when I pay- Why are you shaming him? I'm not shaming Lindsey Graham. I feel like you are.

No, I'm not. I'm saying- I feel like it would be nice to admit your privilege. I hope Lindsey Graham is listening to this because I'm not i'm saying i feel like it'd be nice to admit your privilege i hope lindsey graham is listening to this because i'm not insulting you my friend you can hear from my voice that i'm not insulting you i'm just saying darkness my old friend no joe i'm telling you if lindsey graham could fly off the planet he would that's what i think i fly off the planet with a man's mouth on his penis. Who wouldn't? I would do that in a second.

I don't care who it is. I don't care if it was what fueled the spaceship or didn't. That would be amazing. Why wouldn't you do that? How awesome would that be? Imagine if it was the mountain from Game of Thrones. That guy's blowing you as you fly through space. And your orgasm extends to eternity. Yeah, the whole gay straight thing really falls apart.

Pink Floyd, I wish you were here. No, it's the sound of silence. I was trying to work it in there, but I can't find the cue. But the gay straight thing falls apart if we stop being terrestrial. Like, the moment you're not on the planet anymore, it's all planetary-based memes, man. It's like the moment we're, like, released from the gravity well, all the stuff that seems so important to dumbasses. Yeah. Which is like, what?

You would put your mouth on a penis? You must be crazy. Imagine if it felt amazing. Imagine like, man, I've never blow a fucking guy. And you get that dick in your mouth. And the moment that sperm hits your tongue, it's like pop rocks. Yeah. Pop, pop, pop, pop, pop.

And your brain goes, oh. You and I, man, we will suckle on a mucus thing that's like a like the vagina we'll do that we pride ourselves on it we pride ourselves water park slide that's what i love so much about christina pozitsky's instagram she does these like fucking hilarious tiktok clips that she recovers from TikTok and there's a whole genre of TikTok of these creepy fucking pervs who are like showing how

they lick pussy and like the whole TikTok is based on them like going it's so fucked up but it's like a guy will in the masculine sense will go down on a girl yet the concept of having a dick in your mouth it's considered to be like fucked up like you must be like a

complete like you something about you is weak you know I think we're gonna have to contend with that is what's this What's he doing? He does like how Like watch You gotta watch it man What's he do? I don't know I just checked her Instagram now

This guy does like Eating pussy TikToks That's what he's doing? Yeah watch watch Just watch This one doesn't do it He like eases into it Her

By the way Her Instagram The TikTok she does Like She should do a whole show Based on her Like she She like curates The most fucked up TikToks you've ever seen.

Isn't that important? Like TikTok, whether it's TikTok or Instagram or any of these things. Isn't that important? It's just a random one. How did I do that? It kind of is, right? Yeah. Yeah.

Lowering the boundaries, like dropping down the boundaries for people to be able to enter into the world of expressing whatever weirdo idea they have or video of them doing backflips onto a fucking whale, whatever they're doing. Yeah. Yeah. It's a bad, I don't like TikTok in the sense that like my wife isn't. I never even opened it. She's into TikTok and I don't like it because she's always looking at TikTok. And then I'll be like, really? You're looking at TikTok? And she'll be like, you're on Twitter all day long.

You should get off Twitter. You should read this book. I hate Twitter. This book, Irresistible, it's a mind blower, man. It really is. Because it lets you realize that as much as we're at each other's throats right now, I don't know how much of it is our fault. And I think we could have been a lot better off if someone decided, instead of trying to make money, that they would recognize that this strategy of whether it's social media, likes, or Twitter or Facebook,

or whether it's showing you the things you get angry about and you comment on on Facebook or YouTube, like whatever we're doing, ultimately we're changing the path of the way people think. We're way more malleable than we like to think we are. Way more. Right. And I think people that have a voice, it's you or i or ari or

bird or tom or anybody who has a podcast in particular because if you have a podcast at the very least no one's telling you what you can't talk about right no one's put dunk in i i love that segment but when you're talking about people people not conforming and trying to figure themselves out, people are thinking you're non-binary or somehow or another you're not woke. Sorry. I'll repeat what I said. I'm sorry. I'll revise. We're in the middle of a storm, Duncan.

Yeah. middle of a storm duncan yeah well we with the main thing the most important thing i think in the storm and it's easy to forget is is that like you and i and everybody we run across i've yet to meet somebody who's a real monster man there's a few but even them they just need hugs they're also very unique when you run across it's very unique and like the anytime I feel like this is where I'm like I'm attuned to this anytime I get the sense someone's wanting me not to express myself that's where I get really locked in and really like and I get the whole like anti-woke thing because nobody wants some fucking liberal baptist piece of shit to tell them how to be. But, you know, man, like the moment on my Instagram, I did a Black Lives Matter thing. That's the only time anybody told me to shut up.

No one told me to shut up before that. But the moment I did a thing that was in alignment with like Black Lives Matter, there was all of a sudden like this weird similarity of people hitting me up being like, you fucking woke me. There was a lot of blowback from that. And also- When you say a lot, like how many? Enough that like I noticed it. Right.

But if you tune in at any- Not a huge percentage. Any part, Like 30 messages? How many messages? No, not 30. Just enough where I really. 10? I'm going to say like.

5? 15. 15. Enough where like I realize. How many Instagram followers do you have? I don't remember, dude. I can look it up right now. Like 200,000 or something.

That's a lot of people, man. No, but I know what you're saying but it was like i realized that like my thinking regarding being like even remotely and a political activist was being shaped by my fear that a tiny percentage of my audience would reject me and that's what i'm saying is like i was letting my ship get steered not by my own intuition or not by my own sense of like fuck man like that fucking george floyd video that's unforgivable that shit's fucked up you know it's it's both it's unforgivable any man that would do that to another man, that man needs help.

I bet he didn't think he was going to kill that guy, but he tortured that guy for eight minutes and 46 seconds. It's like that guy needs a DMT trip. He needs something. He needs to recognize who he is. It's also, Duncan, I think we're asking people to do things they're not really qualified to do. They don't have the tools to handle it. They don't have the infrastructure to handle the load of pressure that comes in. I just feel like all these people that – and then right now we're so anti-cop.

It's like it's over the top. Well, look, man, what I love about you is that you're like not afraid to say a thing like that. And like I think if we're going to go if we're going to move forward right now, we need cops. But no, if we're going to move forward, what we need is not just cops. We need compassion. Like if we're going to move forward, what we need is it's like, look, man, you're right. This country was completely founded on human trafficking. You're right that your idea that like the way like if you have a particular complexion in this country, shit is immediately against you.

You're completely right about that. immediately against you you're completely right about that you're right like the thing is is like this is the problem is like and i think this is an important question for everybody to ask themselves is how do you act when you're right that's how that's how you can really tell a person like you know i think honestly i think we are looking for change the way we see change in ourself like we see a potential for changing ourself we see change in ourself. Like we see a potential for change in ourself. We see something wrong. We go, I got to correct that. And then we think that society can do that too.

But society is like a battleship. It's like a 500-meter-long steel structure that has to – planes land on it. That's it. Yeah, that's it. That's it. That's a good description. It's got to turn. Yeah, that's it that's it that's a good description it's got a turn and then people are like fuck you

we don't like people from fucking Muslim countries fuck you trans women are real women yeah right and it's this battle to try to like navigate this enormous metal structure through the fucking ocean.

Right. That's where we're at. That's where we're at. That's why you got to do a podcast with me, Duncan. Anytime. I'll do anything for you, man. We got to work this out. We can work it out.

I mean, the answer is- Jamie, I'm not wrong, right? No, but- The answer is compassion, Joe. There's lots of ways to do it. No, this is what I'm thinking. You and I have a very unique frequency. Yeah.

Let's do it! This is why it's important. Because when you and I get together, and I firmly believe you and I can do this every goddamn week. I love it. Especially if we only saw each other once a week. It's the best. I'll fly you in.

I'll fly in. You can come to Austin once a week. We can Zoom. We can Zoom. We can do whatever. I'll fly to North Carolina. I'm not going there. I'm going to Colorado, man.

I meant Cuba. Yeah, man. Like, I love it, Joe. I mean, to me, like, you know, that's what I think is so great about the fact that you got to be the person that you are, that you got to be the spotlight, got to be on you as it is. And the reason it's on you and the reason I take such, I really like not much offends me, man.

But when people start attacking you, I do like I have to fight against my offense because I know you. And so when people are fucking their arms against you, I feel really depressed because I know you. And so when people are fucking at arms against you, I feel really depressed because I know you. And you are one of the most progressive people I've ever met. And so when people start falling upon you

because you have like fucking nerds like Ben Shapiro which by the way you shouldn't have that guy anymore. He's a dork. Come on. Come on. Those conversations are important. I think what's beautiful about what you're doing is you're opening. I would not open up the, by the way, Ben Shapiro underneath it all.

I know that you and I would probably have fun, but I know that right now where you're at in your incarnation, you're a fucking dork. You know what I mean? Like he's a dork. He's a dork. But what's so confusing. He's a nice guy. That's what so confusing. He's a nice guy.

That's what's confusing about him. I like him a lot. You look at him, and he's all, like, beating up What's-Her-Face about the thing and that embarrassing thing. The music video, he's like, and they were doing fornication. Can you see me and Ali Makovsky talking about Wet House Pussy? Oh, God. Like, that thing Shapiro's doing. It's so embarrassing, Joe.

I get it. And, like, that dude is, like, an embarrassment. But I don't think what people admit when they look at Ben Shapiro is, like, there's a piece of you that's like, I'd have fun with him. Like, it'd be fun to drink with him. He's probably cool. But he's, like, right now. I don't think he drinks, but he's a nice guy. He's a good person.

I'm not bullshitting i look again i think our job right now is not to alienate we have to like involve that's why i have him on that's that's why i know you're doing it joe he's an i'm telling you right now ben shapiro is a nice man he's a nice man i see him i hug him every time i see him and i don't hug him to be fake i hug him because I genuinely love that guy. He's a nice guy. Look, I think some of the stuff he's propagating in his philosophies is legitimately deranged. Bro, he's wearing an outfit.

It's a costume. It's not. I mean, he. Ben Shapiro could never take off the yarmulke, shave his head, tattoo his chest with an eagle, wear a bikini. He's got an outfit. But it's not his fault. I'm telling you, we all come from a different spot. If life is a race, it's not like everybody's on the same starting line.

People on starting lines are like a mile behind yours they're so far away they're all different and they here's the thing even if people are wrong about many things or even i'll explain this better even if you disagree with the way people feel about so many different things it doesn't mean you can't be their friend. It doesn't. And I'm telling you, we got it wrong, man. That's so sweet. Here's what's important. What's important is whoever that person is, they got to be sincere.

Now, as soon as you feel like someone's a grifter, you got to cast them out. Right. You got to cast them out. That's cool. Because they got to figure that out on their own and they got to apologize. That's cool, man. You got to, listen, you can be be wrong but you have to be honest and if you're just bullshitting then i can't hang out with you dude let me ask you ben shapiro's not bullshitting

i don't think he's bullshitting i just think he's like a little like antiquated in his eye look man i i like i'm not like the whole ben shapiro thing, that's – of all your guests, it's the one – He's a great guy, man. If you met him, if you and I and him went to a steak dinner, we'd have a great conversation. I hung out with him at the – what's that steak house? The Boa? Boa in Hollywood down from the store on Sunset. I had a great time with him. He's a good man.

I don't care. I genuinely like him a lot. When he texts me, Ben Shapiro texts me, I look at my phone, I'm like, Ben Shapiro, I like that guy. I like him. Look, as far as I'm concerned, if you're going to create what I think could be created by humanity, we have to create the engine not of rejection but of acceptance, which meaning that if you've got a charismatic Finn Shapiro avatar in the video game, in the simulation that we're in, there's a way to reabsorb him into reality

that isn't like the way people currently see him. If he's willing to relinquish his ideology. Yeah. And he has a very strict religious ideology. Yeah, he's stuck in this little thing. But I think that's helped him. That little thing. Look, if you figure out a way

to do something that helps you past most of the people that you're competing against, but ultimately hinders you against the people who learn your lessons plus other lessons and aren't hampered by ideology and they pass you.

You have to, there's a moment we have to figure out when you're going to let go. He seems to have a very like clear mind. That's what's cool about him. He seems to like have a very insightful mind. I like that. I just feel like something about him, it like smacks of like the Nazi intellectuals. Yes, it does. But he's Jewish.

And here's the thing I love. When people get mad at me that I talk to them, I'm like, listen, just does, but he's Jewish. And here's the thing I love. When people get mad at me that I talk to them, I'm like, listen, just listen to what we're saying. Listen, he's not a bad guy. You might not agree with him, but me and him are having really good conversations about why I feel

like you can't tell an 18-year-old kid, just pull your pants up and don't shoot anybody. We're having these really nuanced conversations and he's allowing me because he knows i like him so you're like the bohemian grove but it's no he knows i like him like ben shapiro and i don't agree on many things but he knows if i see him i go what's up man how you doing i hug him and it's genuine that's cool i really care about that's the whole. That's the whole point. So if he and I are sitting

right here and we talk about stuff, he knows that if I don't agree with him, it doesn't change my feelings about whether or not I'll hug him or I love him. That's it. That's the problem we're all facing. We're all facing this problem where we identify with ideas.

Whereas I think we can just do our best to make good with where we stand right now as a human and when we encounter other humans let's take ideas and put them in front of us and let's cross

our arms and let's go over these ideas without any attachment. That's where it gets hard because most of us don't have enough personal satisfaction in our own accomplishments to relinquish this idea that our ideas are not ours. That our ideas are just

a mathematical problem. It's a fucking Rubik's Cube. It's a fucking game of Clue. Like, who knows who did it? Is it Charlotte in the fucking library with a rope we don't know so this thing that we're doing

as people today is we're scared and one of the things that happen when people are scared is they pull back you pull back, you put up fences you wall off you protect your tribe your tribe guys you decide what you can say what you can't say yeah you decide who's the enemy and who's who's good and

who's bad and everybody walls off and my thoughts are that's a trap and that is just something that we've been involved with forever, from the beginning of time, from single-celled organisms to small mammals to human beings. We've been involved in this weird trap of competing against each other in the wrong way, competing against each other in a way where ultimately somebody gets victimized. I think the best competition is keeping the other competition alive, competing against each other while helping each other. And everybody gets by. Everybody gets better.

And even people who are not doing well, you tell them why they're not doing well. That will force you to do better. All of the people that are trying to take your position, if there's a ladder, you say, this is why you fucked up. And then you'll do better because they'll do better and then everybody does better yeah there's no stagnation i get it it's just like the part like you're in a you're in a like brutal position you're in a really brutal position like and no matter what i don't see how you can resist it like the problem with your your position is you have this like powerful voice That's the problem is you're a signal booster.

I also got a NASA suit and I can hold my piss for four hours, son. How have you not pissed? But to me, the bizarre, the difficult situation you're in is like, you get Ben Shapiro on, you signal boost that, whatever that is, I don't know what he is. By the way, he's not a bad guy.

Ben Shapiro, I'm not trying to attack you. You're fucking, like, whatever the thing you did with, like, attacking the music video. What ass pussy? That was an embarrassment. That was a mess. That was a mess. It was a mess. I get it.

It was really sex negative. It was so stupid. He seemed like such a nerd, a dork. And also, anybody who's going to, like, do gonna like do that you like feel like they negate whatever their philosophical Ideas by attacking the thing but it was a but however He's doing the exact same thing that Trump does when he gets attention He's saying something about something that's culturally relevant and he's taking a contrary position and he's generating likes. He's generating interest. Right. He's like a

he's a salesperson for negativity. If I was his best friend and Ben and I were sitting around, he's like, you think you're supposed to ask them? I'd be like, okay. Okay, yeah, you probably should because like ultimately people are going to fuck with you

but my position is it's better if you have vulnerabilities. If there's something you've done that's really stupid, it's probably better for you when you shit on things. Yeah. And I think that's a good argument for coming out against wet-ass pussy. What's wrong with wet-ass pussy, by the way? Nothing. But a guy like Ben Shapiro, he shouldn't be right too many times. Part of his charm...

It's his failure! Part of his charm is he casually... He's got to say some shit that only a fucking dude with a yarmulke says. It's not that he's a bad person. What do you mean a dude with a yarmulke? There's a lot of Jewish... Listen, listen. I love Ari, but he doesn't wear a yarmulke says. It's not that he's a bad person. I love him. What do you mean you're doing a yarmulke? There's a lot of Jewish. Ari's Jewish. Listen, listen. I love Ari, but he doesn't wear a yarmulke. You're saying the yarmulke

means fundamentalism. You don't have to wear it! We're in space! We're flying! You've gone from rejecting spaceship... Here's us as a golf ball. Flying through the universe. Impossible. God, Joey.

Impossible. Look, man. I didn't want to get... I don't care about fucking Ben Shapiro. I don't care. Thank God you're the first episode on Spotify. I don't care about... Thank God.

Legitimately. What are we, four hours in? Who cares? Plus. I don't care about Ben Shapiro. I don't care. You should. He's a nice guy.

Who cares? That's my... No, he cares. Listen, if I hug Ben Shapiro,iro i really hug him i love that guy he's a sweetie i'm sure he's a sweetie but when i meet him he's a nice guy look man it doesn't matter like here's a deeper point man and i don't mean to do this every time i'm on but you have such a such a crazy power that if you're not careful, folks from deep, dark wells of perspective are going to infiltrate your shit. Dude, have you watched that great documentary on the white Aryan folks? Man, it's fucked up.

Dude, why you got to gotta go there give me that lighter here you go like yeah you look at like these people are very organized man it's like they're organized is what I'm saying and like and again I'm not saying Ben Shapiro is this person he wears a yarmulke he's Jewish I don't know much about him

I don't care listen to me all those people that are organized they come hang out with us. Give me a hug. You don't want to give them a hug? Relax. Why? Just relax.

All those people are just people, man. Like a white supremacist? They're lost. Imagine if you gave a white supremacist five MEO DMT and let him sit on a couch one of them brown suede couches take three big hits and then as the first one as they're exhaling

yeah yeah yeah yeah and then he gets sucked into the center Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And they get sucked into the center of the universe, and they realize there is no center because there is no boundaries. It's all connected. That's crazy.

You're in a soup. You're in an infinite soup of ideas and biology and thoughts and prayers and love and hope and happiness and jealousy and anal sex. And it's all together with cartoons and pop music and cheeseburgers. Just a bunch of different experiences all fucking stitched together in some sort of macrame. You're saying there's a redemptive possibility. And then the aliens land.

Yeah. Look, man, this is the way I see it. I don't know, man. Who gives a fuck? Like, really, it's like, you know, the reality of it is, is like, we are in a very bizarre period period in time which is that you and i we became friends on the phone having these same conversations and now you say a thing that flies in the face of the particular like default reality of our time and you start trending on twitter you know like that's like some of our community, like, the way I know you right now is like

you trending on Twitter where I'm like, what the fuck happened? But the joke's on them because I don't read Twitter. You don't go on Twitter at all. I don't read it. I post things. Like, today I posted Allie Letterman made some masks. I post her masks. Joe, it's just weird because it's like, you're like a...

But it's not me. It's what they think I am. It's who they decide I am. Yeah, but you have to watch out because people are going to's like, you're like a... But it's not me. It's what they think I am. It's who they decide I am. Yeah, but you have to watch out because people are going to, like, try to exploit you. That's the main thing is, like, people recognizing what you are, who have political agendas, will infiltrate your shit and then start blowing out their radioactivity into the world, right? That's a fear. Like radium?

Like face rot and shit yeah yeah exactly like they'll get in they'll get in there and then like all of a sudden like you accidentally start exhaling shit that's like that that you know you don't agree i know you don't agree with like ben shapiro listen it's not that i don't agree with ben shapiro and i definitely don't on many things and he and i talked about it it's that I don't want to abandon him. Oh, that's cool. I don't think he's worthy of abandonment because I think he's a good person.

And I think many of the things he says, he says because he's rewarded for saying controversial things on the internet and many times make sense in a logical way if you don't take into account all the different situations that lead to a person becoming who they are in 2020. Right. Slavery and Jim Crow laws and all these different things we all have to deal with. But I think he's a good person. I really do. I think many times, like, the things we say, we're half defensive and half promotional.

You're saying things because you think that people are going to react in a certain way. Yeah. You don't necessarily mean it. And you also say things because you've seen the contrary to that poorly worded, and you decide you don't agree with that and so you want to counter it. But I think the problem is in ideologies. More than anything, if I'm really being objective, I always feel like our problem is purely in ideologies. Because we just get committed to one side or the other and ideas to one side. You're right or you're wrong. And I think if we could just divorce ourselves from ideas and

divorce ourselves from all ideologies and just look at something honest. Like you come to me and I come to you and I go, hey man, what's up? I go, what are your intentions? My intention is to live a harmonious life with my neighbors. And I said, mine as well.

Okay, good, beautiful. And you hug each other and you go, what do we have to do about taxes? Man, if we lived in a community where I felt like, hey, if I pay more in taxes, people will have their kids in a better school and the water will be purer and there will be less crime, I would fucking 100% sign up for that. Of course. But I don't think the people that are taking that fucking thing and running with it know what they're doing that's right that's the

problem you believe in the idea of democracy you just don't believe in the organizational facility that's like administering democracy i've been to the red line of human beings. I know where people fall apart. I know the red line. I know when the RPMs hit. I know when people bitch out. And I know I'm not gonna bitch out. And if you're gonna bitch out, I know if you're bitching

out and you're also making you're making laws. Right. What are you saying? What are you doing? What are you doing? What's going on? Who are you? Why are you deciding what people do? We shouldn't have any figureheads.

That's right. It's dangerous. Alpha champs are dangerous. Take it from me, a person with a big platform. Yeah. You shouldn't listen to me. You shouldn't listen to you. You shouldn't listen to Burt Kreischer.

You shouldn't listen to Tom Segura or Ari Shaffir, or Joey Diaz. Name all the people you love to listen to. Sam Harris, don't listen to them. Meaning, listen to their show, but apply to whatever they say. Your own objective opinion. But how weird is it that people will focus that you have Ben Shapiro on this podcast, but they don't focus that you have Bernie Sanders on? But they do. They do focus.

But what I'm saying is people in the left will say you're a monster, that you would have Ben Shapiro on, and they completely forget that you gave one of the great potential socialist presidents of our time a platform that you supported. They forget that. And Andrew Yang and Tulsi Gabbard. To me, that's the part that drives me nuts. It's like, why do they forget that?

Because I'm a savage. That's why. What do you mean? I'm a savage. I'm a fucking cage fighting commentator. I commentate for UFC. I do stand-up comedy. I do wild comedy. I'm a wild person.

It's a different thing. I understand. It's just that we have to stop trying to push people down in order to push ourselves ahead. And if we just all look at it like, look, there's things about all sorts of aspects of society

that I don't agree with, that smart people disagree with. Right. I don't know if they're right. I don't know if I'm right. I don't know. I would like to talk forever to people that are vegans. My friend John Joseph, he's the singer the the crow mags he's a fucking interesting dude man you know and he he's a he's been a vegan forever and he's like

a super fucking strong guy like mentally physically does trilons. I want people to think different than me. I want them to. I want bad motherfuckers to have completely separate ideas of how the world should or shouldn't work. What is wrong or isn't wrong. What's right or isn't right. What's privilege. What's bullshit. I want everybody to come to the table clean right I want everybody to come to the table warm

I want everybody to hug I really do and I think we're all scared and I think it fucks up everybody and if everybody who wants progress Doesn't want people to feel good about running into each other and talking things through We're going into this thing with the wrong energy Right the right energy is going into this thing going listen. I Didn't ask to be born you didn't either right here. We are 2020 yeah trying to figure the world out, but let's just admit the the idea of wrestling between

Gay and straight black and white and female, those are so dumb. I don't want to do that. I don't want to do that. I want to be – I want to talk to honest and dishonest. I want to talk to secure and insecure. I want to talk to loving and hateful. I want to hug people that need it. I want to figure out a way where we can get through this in a better state than we were five years ago, ten years ago. Let's get through this with food and water and realize we did need a fucking Amex Platinum card.

Hey! I don't want a fucking... I don't want it! I don't want Google Home! You're going to be president. No, I don't want a fucking I don't want it I don't want Google Home you're gonna be president no I don't want to be president I don't want any president that's what I want I want no president

they're gonna run this in your anti-campaign but you're gonna I could see it happening man we should postpone the election and try to find a better way to do this no do the fucking election get Biden in there. Get a non-lunatic in there.

What we need is romantic tension between a 24-year-old, like, super liberal, super attractive woman. Yeah. And, like, a 32-year-old Navy SEAL who's also married. And no one cheats on anybody, but they have this sexual tension, and they keep it together. And they work their way through veganism. What the fuck? What are you talking about? I'm trying to fucking fix the world, Duncan.

I'm trying to tell you that all the things that we see, pros and cons, pluses and minuses. Yeah, man. I'm just trying to figure out like we got to the election and suddenly it's this erotic romance between this 24-year-old. That's so much better than a

fucking guy with fake hair and some dead man weekend at Bernie's with a cop shoving her hand up his ass and walking him to the aisle. Here's the thing that I don't understand. In sports, somebody in any fucking sport, if they're not doing great that night, the coach pulls them off and puts someone better in. Here's the thing, Duncan Trussell. No one wants that spot. Their replacement? No one. that spot. The replacement?

No one. Why? Who wants to be president? I would love to be president. Fucking look at your face. Oh my God, Jamie. I don't want to go through an election, but I would like the joy. Listen, elections are so archaic.

That's fucking wood stoves. Yeah, but I would love to be president. Being president would be so fun. Would it be? Here's the best part. You could exonerate all your friends. That is the most ridiculous thing about being president. You can just decide.

You're out. I'm going to pardon! You're out. By the way. He's a bad guy, but he's a good guy. And here's a really important thing The Trump administration just let out One of the great LSD chemists of our time

Who's that? I can't remember his name it's so sad Don't say it You already blew up that guy's spot That was throwing cigarettes on the ground in Utah No look His name deserves to be spoken You know who contacted me recently?

Who? Do you remember the Neuro Soup story? William Leonard Picard. Do you remember... I'm so drunk. Me too. Do you remember Neuro Soup? Yeah, yeah.

She was a girl who was on YouTube, and her and I went back with her. This is an interesting thing. She had a detailed account of how she put DMT up her asshole. She dated William Leonard Picard. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's the guy that had the LSD lab in the middle of the bunker. And the DMT accelerator pedal.

He contacted me. Okay. From prison? I don't know. I just got an email. It's not my main account, but I was like, hmm, maybe that's real. But that lady, she had a whole YouTube series

about different ways she took drugs. Yeah. And one of them was she took DMT up her asshole. It was a bad trip. She had a bad trip. Yeah,

but part of me was like, that girl. DMT up the ass. That's a rare human. That's a great night. A rare human looks at that DMT nugget, that little Cocoa Pop.

Whatever it is. Honeycomb Cheerios. I want that in my life. I want to be around someone who's like... That's so free. Put it up your asshole Would you even consider it? Yes, really? I would put DMT at my ass. I've thought about after I heard about it It's a good way to let the universe know you give up it's the end

it's the video game it's the part of the video game where you're like done come move to Texas please North Carolina is bullshit or wherever the fuck you're moving to

why do we have to be localized Joe you don't want to live in Tennessee I want to no I look we don't have to be locked into any place if I bought you a house we don't have to be locked into any place. If I bought you a house. We don't have to be locked into a place, Joe.

I appreciate you. And by the way, I know you. I want to fix things. I know that you buy houses for your friends. I want to fix things. So sweet that you would say that. But look, we don't have to be spatially disconnected. I think we can fix things, Duncan.

We can... You're already... Look, man, you're already fixing things. I think you can help me. I will help you in any way I can. I'm we can fix things, Duncan. We can. You're already look, man, you're already fixing things. I think you can help me. I will help you in any way I can. I'm better with you. I'm better with you than without you. Listen, man, I'm better with you than without you. That's real. That's real. It's true.

You and I both talked about this, not just on podcasts, I think, but even on phone calls. When we do podcasts, I feel like you bring me to a place that i don't really get without you yeah we're friends i really feel like that because i've known you so long like i remember when you had this breakup and we lived together and you called me up but i don't know what to do i'm like fuck man come live with me yeah i was so happy i was one of the comics that

you evolved and when and also like in that that moment where I was living with you, it wasn't, like, some kind of, like, national lampoon vacation thing. You were, like, really serious with me. And you were not serious all the time. We had a few, like, really serious talks. And in those serious talks, you, like, helped me realize that, like, I had to stop being so flippant with my life. And it was really good.

And you weren't fucking around. It was cool. And it was very sweet. And I'll never forget it, man. Well, you know what I wanted to say to you? When you see someone who is at a bump in the road, many things can happen, right? Yeah.

And for you, I wanted you to know that, like, you can most certainly get upset along the way at different, or you can be almost immune to all the bumps in the road. Yeah. It's really how you decide. And if you decide you're this fucking peter pan character and just like float through this like there's ways that you're lucky in ways that other people that live in afghanistan and the congo will never understand you're never understand no man you weren't letting me do that but man. You weren't letting me do that. But you and I, when we were hanging out together, I was like, I remember the moment you called me. There wasn't even a half a second between you saying, I was like, yay, Duncan's going to live with me.

That's sweet. Yay. That's sweet, man. And I wanted you to get in the tank. And I got, yeah. Oh, that's great, man. I love it. And like, I'm not trying to, like, your perception of me may even be different from mine.

But like, one thing that happened, I have a few memories of that incredible gift that you gave me. One of the memories is riding up to your house. I don't even know how you got into my car that you would be in my Mini Cooper, which was red at the time. I remember that. We're driving up to your house. I came to visit you. We're listening to Elliot Smith. I'm playing Elliot Smith.

Yes, he's talking about fucking morose things. And you are this. So I remember like, and I've been listening to that nonstop. So we're riding up this hill to your mansion and listening to Elliot Smith in my Mini Cooper. So this is like, this is before your podcast,

but before you become like what you are now, just imagine folks listening, riding in a mini Cooper with Joe Rogan and our cherry red mini Cooper trying to play Elliot Smith for him because it's really been moving you. I'm not playing it for you because like any other reason, this is what I've been tuned

into for a long time. And so we're riding up this hill to your mansion and I remember you look at me in this way that only real friends can do this. And you look at me and you go, you have to stop listening to this. You were like, you can't listen to this anymore.

This is terrible. This is hurting you. And it wasn't listen to this anymore like this is terrible this is like hurting you and it was it wasn't from a judgmental place or a place of musical brilliance it was a friend being like dude you are depressed that guy gives out a vibration yeah he was he was incredibly depressed and and incredibly talented a terrible nexus. So good. And he was a trap. But like, it's a trap, but it is a trap. It's like you can squeeze out some really super positive juice

and then to the left of your body, you're filled with cancer. Like that's, that's the problem. That's the problem with people that there's, there's so many different things where people are depressed and morose

and they're talking about really dark things. But dude, it wasn't just you. So I get to your house, I'm in this mansion all of a sudden. That was when you had a fucking piranha tank. Do you remember that? You had piranhas. I remember.

So all of a sudden I'm in a mansion where there's a piranha tank, and Eddie Bravo... I remember because I was going up to hide smoking, because I was addicted at the time. Serious? Yeah, and I remember I was sneaking up to smoke, going up like to fake to like hide smoking because i was addicted at the time and so yeah and i remember like i was sneaking up to smoke and at some point eddie bravo i'd like gone up this hill to like like hide smoking and every eddie bravo walks up the hill to me and it's like imitating smoking to me making fun of me for being addicted to cigarettes.

But like, but like, you know, you know, but Joe, you know what happened? Like if I live, this is where I really go back. And I think Eddie Bravo in that moment,

I'm like, what a prick. Don't tell me not to fucking smoke. Cut to me sitting in front of a doctor being like, well, you have cancer in your balls. And I, and I,

and I remember like referring back to that moment where he's like stop smoking yeah you know what i mean which was cool it was like like there's so many like in those moments well there's a thing where you can do where you can protect people temporarily from their emotions but you won't protect them from the consequences of their actions that you see that maybe they don't. And I think we're all responsible for our friends' blind spots. And when we see blind spots, we go, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey. There's only so much you can do, though.

There's only so much you can do. Eddie Bravo could have, like, turned into a dragon and been like, stop smoking. Cigarettes are creepy, right? Nicotine's a very addictive drug, man. It gets you. It gets you, yeah. It gets you in a weird way. But he was legitimately trying to get me to stop smoking.

Eddie Brock was a good man. That was a sweet moment. When I look back pre-cancer, I always think of that moment. It's like, man, you thought that guy was such a cunt. You thought he was such a cunt. Because you didn't want to quit that habit. Yeah! Yes, yes, yes. But you look back, he wanted me to do better. such a cunt like you thought he was such because you didn't want to quit that yeah yes but like if

i i always like but you look back like he wanted me to do better he didn't want me to get one of my balls chopped i got i got luck i got lucky because like it didn't spread through my whole body and i didn't die two choices right now i can pee my pants or i can run to the bathroom and we stop it and then we come back no don't stop it i've never had it where you run to the bathroom and we stop it and then we come back. No, don't stop it. I've never had it where you go to the bathroom. Talk to Jamie. We're five hours in? How many hours? It doesn't matter. I gotta pee so bad. This is amazing. Talk to Jamie.

I've been dying for this moment. Jamie, just so you know, through the years of us doing Rogan, I usually am the one who has to go to pee. But in this moment, here I am with the one who has to go to pee but in this moment here I am with the thing happening and

you know it doesn't what does he do in this spot when the guest leaves does he say pull something up he just yaps well gang subscribe to my patreon forward slash DTFH Philip, just talk. He just yaps. Yeah. Well, gang. He's really good at it.

Subscribe to my Patreon, forward slash DTFH. We have a Tuesday, we have a meditation. Wednesdays, we're doing a Dune book club. It's amazing. The book Dune by Frank Herbert is incredible. Fridays, we have a family gathering.

It's just us hanging out, but join us there. You know, the truth truth is it is a simulation you know and we told you that before you linked into the thing and we told you it would wipe your memory and that you would feel like you are uh helpless in the sense that the thing you are right now you don't know what the power that you wield. So you chose that. Just so you know, we said that in this moment, we would do a thing where we alerted you

of the fact that you had been, you had intentionally decided to dive into a simulation, making you limited. You're very powerful. You're Thor. In the human world that you're in right now you're actually thor you uh you're you're a powerful norse god that has gotten sucked into a very temporary like magic spell that isn't even that powerful compared to the

powers in the world we come from but right now you have become convinced that you are a limited identity in the mortal realm, which you requested, by the way. You said, I want to be an insurance agent, real estate agent, school teacher, psychologist, fireman, cop. I wanted to be a pilot, somebody who was a flight attendant, someone who worked in a museum, teacher, somebody who was a historian,

a failed writer, a failed comedian. And you became this temporary thing, but the truth is, you're a god and you're confused. Joe, welcome back! Oh my god, I peed so hard. It was amazing. I don't want to do it!

I just want everyone to know, if you're like, no one should have this amount of influence. No one. No one should be able to say things that affect politics and social ideas. You're right. I agree with you. Right. I didn't want to do this. This is a weird thing.

Yeah. But I'm doing my best. What are you going to do? Stop? I'm not stopping. You're going to retire? Because no matter what you do. It's like jujitsu. You can going to retire? Because no matter what you do, it's like jiu-jitsu.

You can't go for a choke just right away. You can't just dive on a choke. Yeah. You've got to slowly cook the person. Slowly. Work through positions. What's the choke here? Rear naked.

Rear naked. You get the mount. You let them buck you off. You get half guard. You hold on. You escape side control. You try to mount again. They turn over. You get half guard. You hold on. You escape side control. You try to mount again. They turn over.

You get their back. Hooks in. Squeeze. Jesus Christ. Takes time. Takes time. All things take time. Don't you worry, though, like that, like, what if, like, and again, like, we've been going on so many hours now.

So now at this point, I'm just pulling. How much time has this podcast gone on? Four minutes and 40 seconds. But don't you worry. Four hours and 40 minutes. Joe, don't you worry, though. That's five's first episode. We're right.

I was right. I knew it. You knew it. I'm like, Duncan has to be number one. Do you know you had to be number one you know you had to be number one when you invited me on i didn't even i tried not to think about it because i was so flattered you have to be i felt darkly flattered and then i and then i went on your like subreddit i saw the don't read that the votes for who are crazy people i saw the votes for who would

be on the number one thing i I wasn't even listed, Joe. Those people are fools. No, they're not. I actually. Listen to me. They're fools. I know what I'm doing. Look at this fucking knife, dude.

Tuck more custom knives. Shout out. But like, not to like, I do feel like. Those people are fools. They're wrong. Listen, you have helped me in many steps of the way because you and I as friends, we came from different backgrounds, but we're both very compassionate and very interested in exploring alternative ideas, both of us. You and I have had so many conversations where you said something to me and I went, hmm, damn, maybe, huh? And I've had to reconsider the way I was focusing in on something.

And because I respect you, and this is something I've said of Ari as well, and Joey, and even Eddie Bravo, and Jamie, and all the people that I'm around. If you say something to me, I consider it like I'm thinking of it in a different way. Like if you say, i don't think that's a good idea because of this i go huh okay tell me why right and i i'll let it go i i'm i don't want to be i don't want to cling on to that early idea man and i think that's half our problem that's half our problem you know i've always felt like a weird sense of guilt about Eddie Bravo, man. Because, like, Eddie Bravo... Want me to do that?

Yeah. Yeah, thanks, dude. I always felt like a weird sense of guilt about him. Jamie said yeah! I thought he was going to cut his finger off last time he did it. I felt like a weird sense of guilt about Eddie Bravo. Because, like, and I don't agree with all his conspiratorial ideas. No, I don't either, but neither does he.

But, dude, this is an important thing But dude, this is an important thing. Like, this is an important thing. Like, not only did he tell me to quit smoking, and then I got one of my fucking balls. And I got one of my balls chopped off. Well, he was right about that. Right, but I want to tell you another thing he said. Hey, don't eat shit.

He said another... Cheers, brother. He said another thing to me. I do feel like it's worth mentioning. I've always felt a weird sense of guilt because I think I judged him harshly, and it makes me feel like a dum-dum. Because he's like a jiu-jitsu master. He's my master.

If someone said, who's your master? I'd say first, John Jock Machado, second, Eddie Bravo. One of my best friends is my master. So I always felt i always had this trick at the very least a trickling sense of like man i think you're wrong about your judgment there but it's dangerous yeah it's dangerous kill you yeah well that also talking that's the problem anytime i've been talking to him i'm always a little bit like nervous at any moment i could die it's like a pet snake yeah like what if

some at some moment you do like go insane and decide to kill me i won't i won't i feel like that around who joey joey diaz yes what do you think he would kill you no no no no but he's so wild he's so crazy he's like a bear i want to keep feeding. Joey Diaz is like, you know. He's the goat. You know that, right? Well, I do. He's the greatest of all time. There's no one who's ever been funnier.

I've seen Joey Diaz hit frequencies. I've never seen anybody else hit. Yeah, he was hanging out in like around shambhala which is like the place like my meditation teacher's teacher was teaching boulder yeah man so we encountered some like beings there that were like really advanced and like he he actually he like digested some of that stuff like he he's wild. Joey Diaz is wild. Remember like to me, like the thing that like, you know, one of the aspects of this particular moment in the Kali Yuga that's so fucked up. This is Kali Yuga, right?

Yeah. It has to be. Well, Kali Yuga, like a lot of people. Explain. So Kali Yuga, it's the age we're in right now. Explain the Yugas. So the Yugas are like vast spans of time and we're considered to be in the Kali Yuga, it's the age we're in right now. Explain the Yugas. So the Yugas are like vast spans of time. And we're considered to be in the Kali Yuga.

But this is like something that was actually predicted several years ago. Yeah, well, like thousands of years ago. But in terms of like people recognizing this right now as Kali Yuga. The Kali Yuga. There's like, you know, differences in what part of the Kali Yuga we're in, but there's no difference in that we're in the Kali Yuga. Explain the Yugas. I'm sorry. The Yugas are a period of time

that one of the ways to like that they get represented is like, imagine a dove flying through the sky with a silk scarf and the beak and the tip of the scarf brushes against the peak of the Himalayas. So the amount of time it takes for one of those peaks to get pushed down to a valley, that could be considered a yuga.

It's actually, in Hinduism, it's a period of time. And people argue about that length of time. It's negotiable. It's negotiable. But there are certain symptoms for each yuga. And so the Kali Yuga, the symptoms are you can't remember very well, your memory's all fucked up, you're impetuous, you're fast in your decisions, you're easily addicted.

You know, if you look back at the history of hinduism the vedas were originally sung so they were memorized and people would sing them they would sing them and they weren't written down writing is considered a degradation yeah yeah it was written down because they heard it and then they they like it was written down later down the line the idea was you didn't need to write anything down because they heard it. And then they like, it was written down later down the line. The idea was you didn't need to write anything down because you would memorize. I remember when I was a kid in high school, my friend Brian Cattrall going through all the numbers he'd memorized. And it was so many. He had so many phone numbers memorized because we didn't have phones.

So you had to memorize numbers or write them down in a little pad so what we consider to be technology is really a crutch to make up for our idiocy in the age of the kali yuga which is what we're in right now and a lot of people get confused because they think kali means kali the goddess of destruction how many yugas i'm not i think four Three or four. Do you know? I don't know the answer. I only know the... Jamie's like, this is an eight-hour podcast. I don't know how to look this up right now.

You have to give him overtime pay. I've been trying to figure out, not that I want to end this at all, but this being our first Spotify podcast. It kind of has to be two. We have other things. I don't know how they're going to deal with this file and whatnot well we're right now at five hours into the podcast right how many hours yeah five hours we should just make it two two and a half hour podcasts i feel like i've been stopping it shouldn't we i don't know how i don't want to end spot spotify i know what i'm doing

this is why i brought Ducking on I'm gonna miss you man you're not gonna miss me I'm gonna be around you come on dude you don't wanna live in South Dakota I'm sorry I forgot South Dakota my sweet home fuck Arizona

sorry I'm going to South Dakota and I can't wait but dude it's rough to come in here and see people. Because look, man, here's the main thing. It's like, we're not packing. Yeah, dude. But we're not packing ourselves up because of some like, like, like, Toner S. Thompson thing.

We're packing ourselves up because the country we were born into has fallen into the throes of a really dark period induced by a once in a hundred year pandemic. That's what I'm saying. But why do you want to live in a place where none of us are living? Why not think about that? I know why I don't want to live in Austin. I know that. Why?

Why? Well, because I'll tell you why, Joe. If you really want to know the real dark reason, because you announced it. You know what I mean? Had you not announced it, it might be a different story. But you and Elon Musk. It was going to get out anyway. Yeah, but Elon's coming to Austin.

You're coming to Austin. We're talking about it. I know. So welcome. Austin. Tom Segura. That's Silicon Valley. No.

Yeah. Yeah, dude. Yeah, I'm sorry, but that is what you have created by your... I'm not sure. I do. You know, Matthew McConaughey has a great idea. What? He wants to make a primer for people moving to Austin where you say, hey, don't turn what

you escaped from into the place you're going to. Oh, shit. That's brilliant. Yeah. escaped from into the place you're going to. Oh shit, that's brilliant. Don't turn the place you're escaping to exactly like where you fled. Yeah, I get it. He's right.

This is what we were talking about earlier. We were talking about defunding the police and defunding ICE and defunding all this nonsense. Let's just figure out a way to be nice to each other. Yeah, man. I agree.

And I don't think that's based on any locality. No. So the Austin thing, like offline, I'll tell you my decision. Offline? I did think about it, Joe. I thought about it. What turned you off to it? Well, you know, my feeling is, I'm stammering because it's like telling you why

would reveal where i'm headed and i don't mean to be like like all magical about that but the main thing listen let me say where you are headed is a great choice thank you brother i've been and you fit in there like a pea in the pod I might wind up being there you might baby I'm ready to keep moving cause that's that is what I feel this is the thing

I think about the Spotify deal and just the idea of what a podcast is moving forward I want you to be involved that's why I wanted you to be number one

and thank you Joe legitimately you and I have some of my favorite conversations thanks brother I love you man I love you too we've been friends for a long I love you man. I love you too. We've been friends

for a long fucking time. Yeah man. I'll be involved with anything you're involved in. Let's do it. I meant that and by the way not to go back to Eddie Bravo apologetics but I didn't finish my point back then and I think it's an important point to make. He said to me something that was so

fucking weird when he said it and this was on top of him taking on a missionary stance with my inhalation of tobacco smoke. So by then I was already like over. A little defensive. I was defensive and I didn't, I was like, I was too dumb at that time to like recognize like, shit man, this guy's got a fucking like, he's a jujitsu master. So what he's saying is not coming from, like, a place of someone who, like, hasn't, like, worked really hard at a particular.

Right, he's saying just don't kill your body. Yeah. But one thing he said to me, which is, I always think back to it, because I remember when he said it, I was like, you sycophant. And what he said to me was exactly what's happening to you right now. What did he say? He said, you have no idea what's going to happen to him. He's going to be like, he's going to be so huge.

And I remember him saying it. This was fear factor. It was not like a safe assessment, man. It was like when he said it to me, it felt culty. It felt fucked up. felt fucked up it felt like it felt crazy right and it was i remember him saying it to me and like being like man you're i didn't you would think that. But, you know, it's weird that he's right.

You know, that's what's weird about it. It's like, this is your first episode on Spotify. And it's crazy, man, because like I get and I'm honored, deeply honored that you invited me on. Well, there was no second choice. Do you know that? Thank you, brother. You were first choice. I'm deeply honored.

Across the board. When they said, who Thank you, brother. You were first choice. I'm deeply honored. 100% across the board. When they said, who do you want to have first on Spotify? Before they said Spotify, I said, Duncan Trezor. That's so cool, Joe. I appreciate it, man. So cool. And I really believe what I said, that I think you and I have different shows. There's something about you and I together that is different than just me by myself.

Yeah, man. We're friends. We're not just friends, man. We've known each other for so long, and there's no doubt. We've tested each other back and forth and up and down and left and right. We know we love each other. If you call me up at 3 in the morning, Joe, I need your help. I am fucking there, dude.

I'm a commando. I'm ready to drop in from a helicopter. I'm going commando I'm ready to drop in from a helicopter I'm gonna save you and because of that because of our long relationship we've been friends for so long dude I mean

how long when did we like 90s when did you start working with the story? 90s dude we've been friends since the 90s so more than 20 years. Yeah. You have seen me go from being the town court of the comedy store to being someone supporting themselves off of their comedy, man. You've seen me go from like, you were friends with me when I was like, no one would have like ever gambled on

anything happening with me other than Philly. No, not no one. Just no one stupid. I saw it right away. The moment I first saw you do Little Hobo. Yeah. Dude, I saw you do Little Hobo in the OR and I'm like, oh my God.

Yeah, man. But you keep doing that. To me, like, that's the thing yeah man but you keep doing that to me like that's the thing is like you keep doing that like that's the reason that you deserve what you have you really do like all the haters all the people who are like

I get the haters it's like it doesn't work the trick is it's like I get it someone explained it to me they're like when you look at people that are doing really well especially if they all socialize with each other it becomes like a walled garden and it feels like it's alienated it feels like you're you're

isolated you're locked out and it makes you feel bad it makes you feel shitty yeah and that's the problem that's what you didn't do that dude you hated me you It makes you feel shitty. Yeah. And that's the problem. That's the problem with a lot of people. But you didn't do that. Dude, you hated me. Just so you know, like, when we first met. I never hated you. No, you didn't hate me, but you were irritated by me. Because, like, you don't remember when we first met.

It was in the ballet room. I was with Princess Corey, Corey Como. And, like, I was trying to, at the time, I was really was really into like it wasn't even called trolling them but it was like saying a thing opposite to what you should say and I remember like something about you were a contrarian I was being a contrarian and something came up about marijuana

you mentioned marijuana I'm sitting with Corey I was already nervous around you because at the time you were like you know you were still like at that time you were still like in this incredible trajectory. And like I made a stupid joke about how weed was like bad. You know, I'd come from like I was like, you know, there's never been a time that I haven't been high for years.

And, you know, especially then. But I made this dumb joke about how weed was bad. then but I made this dumb joke about how weed was bad and I remember you looked at me with such like a scathing look of like because you had just started like understanding how wonderful marijuana

was and you really thought I meant weed was bad and I remember Corey gave me this look of like no Duncan no don't don't do the joke it was a terrible moment because you weren't you weren't in a place where you could even like you weren't tolerating that because you were getting high and starting to realize that it wasn't probably well I think when I first started

smoking pot I became a zealot like real quick yeah because I realized I had been lied to that's it and I had misunderstood the idea of what marijuana was. I became a zealot. That's what it was. You were a zealot in the look you gave me. For sure. I remember the way you looked at me. I realized like, God damn, I bet he hates me forever.

No, never. But today, in the same situation, I'd be like, ha ha. Yeah, right. I would think it was funny. You were defensive. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was a zealot. yeah i was a zealot i was certainly a zealot once i first experienced marijuana i i became a zealot but you and i had

such awesome conversations we had most of our conversations when we first became friends on the phone i would call you up i go yo dude i'm here uh tuesday wednesday thursday friday what's up what are you doing man like dude i read this Aldous Huxley book and you start telling me about some crazy shit yeah and you and I would just go I mean it would be like a significant chunk of my day on like Mondays when I call in is that you and I would have these cool conversations so you take me on the road with you we go to the Irvine Improv we're driving back from the Irvine Improv in your car I'm so stoned you're playing Terrence McKenna Terrence McKenna is talking about the singularity and he's talking about like this idea that we're accelerating towards this

point in the future novelty yeah and I'll never forget that ride back from the Irvine Improv I'll never forget it because like, I'd never heard that Terrence McKenna speech. I knew about Terrence McKenna roughly from like, you know, I had encountered him in my earlier years as a psychonaut, but like something about that particular lecture that you're playing, something about leaving something as weird as a comedy show and this idea that he was saying,

and this is the part that still sticks with me to this day, which is, you know, look, we are heading towards a point of concurrence of events that is known as the singularity, and that the closer we get to it, the more we're going to experience these things, tachyon particles being blown backwards through time that will produce these events in history that we call novelty and something about that ride back and just that moment me listening to it i started thinking it wasn't like i even thought this isn't

real i thought that is real and so here we are now 2020 in the middle of a pandemic, you've become what has been described as the Oprah for men. For Oprah. For Oprah. And you are someone who great leaders and principalities are trying to get into this podcast. Do you remember when you lived with me and I started buying Buddha shit? Yeah, man. You already had the Buddha shit. But I started buying all i like bought

a shiva i bought this giant bronze shiva yeah they're like and you go hey you know why you're attracted to this right yeah i will that's what that's the thing that weirds me out about you man that's the part that where i'm like oh i get it it's like well there was some realization that happened and you're picking up on that and so because you're picking up in that you have ganesh out here and you have all these like eastern symbols but i just think they look cool no no that's what i think well yeah you think that you think they look cool but also you happen to have this massive audience uh regardless of whatever that is i just remember that uh that right i remember that right back and i remember like i remember like thinking like you

know i think there's something real in here like i think what mckinnon is saying is probably true you know and i think this uh pandemic i think this pandemic represents something he predicted, which is we're in a novelty wave right now. This is, it's been, it's been a century since the last pandemic. No one here knows how to deal with this. So now we're in a novelty wave and maybe. We got lazy. We didn't take into account all of the possible variables.

And a big one with this administration was pandemics yeah man but not just that it's like the problem is like where you're kind of in a bit of a bind is that all this human attention has been placed upon you and you have to wrestle with your identity because that's why i need you to move to austin like you don't need me in austin help me come on you don't need help i can't do this i'll help you i'll be i'm always there for you man but the problem is is like you have this burden of attention and it's like it's a it's a real like for whatever reason like some like you people have decided you're you're one of the magnifying glasses focusing this beam of attention into the world and so within that is all this room for disaster it's like you know what i mean like

disaster is the perfect way to put it yeah oh my god yeah someone pays attention to every aspect of your life there's so much room for disaster yeah man but i think at a certain point in time it's like there's a sacrificial lamb a person who lays himself down on the cross is that you no all of us it's all of us but you know it's but you know, really you are in a bit of a bind because it's like, look man, here's what I love about not being George Washington. I didn't have to make the decisions he made. I'm reading this book Dune. It's so beautiful.

If someone says, Duncan, I know you only have 14 teeth. I don't have to make the decision. But I can sell you all the rest of them. I don't have to be Moses. I don't have to i don't be 14 shillings i don't be jesus i don't two pence i don't have to be 13 pounds i don't have to be any of these people man i don't want to be them i would not assign myself to that incarnation but like in dune i'm reading this great book dune by frank herbert it's so good

and in in this desert world there's these beings called the fremen they're like they they like have become they represent complete complete attunement with nature and so at this wonderful point in the book this imperial like galactic representative of this imperialism is like sitting in a like canyon with all his wounded men they're almost done and the fremen one of these tribal beings is saying to them you have to make a water decision and what they mean by that is your wounded men you have to pick one of them to die and will render their body into water because in this world there's no water so you have to make a water decision and the fremen is interacting with a being in this pure way which is the only

way you can act if you're truly into one nature you're innocent and it isn't like dark or anything it's like you have to make a water decision and the being is saying to him like hesitating and the fremen is saying to him do you want me to make the water decision for you? And they don't mean it in an aggressive way. They mean like, would you, you love these people. Would you give up the decision to us? Wouldn't you be enough to make the decision yourself? Fortunately, in the book, one of them dies and they're able to like rend their body into water but what i'm saying

is like these being the position of power and all the whole series of dune is based on this problem which is like if you get saddled with any kind of power even if it's a even if you want to pretend it's a kind of clownish power you are still in a very difficult situation because you have to make a water decision like you will have to make a water decision. Like, you will have to. Like, if you're Trump and you're a clown president or if you're Obama, you're some advanced president. Wait until you're lost. There's only 20 of you.

Yeah, man. Someone's got to become water. You have to make a water decision. If you're the president, there's 335 million people. Everything you decide is a water decision. That's a little easier. But if you're on Lost, there's 13 people left. Yeah, man.

It's brutal. It's brutal. And no matter what trick you try to use to deal with it, no matter what trick you use, you're still forced into this terrible... It's a predicament, man. It's a Chinese handcuff situation. It like chinese handcuffs are bullshit it's not a chinese handcuff that's ever been invented it's gonna hold me down it's a creepy place chinese handcuffs are like this yeah well yeah i know i know man but it's ultimately it's like damn feel bad. It's like, I never want you to trend on Twitter. Whenever I see you trending on Twitter, it really sucks for me because I'm like, fuck, is he okay? That's what I hate about Twitter is people will trend on Twitter.

You know what I'm saying? I do. I get it. I hate it because I'm like, shit, was he in a car accident? I think it's just stay off Twitter. Yeah, you're right. I got to stay off Twitter. I just don't think it's good for you.

yeah you're right I gotta stay on Twitter I just don't think it's good for you the problem is you're interacting with people that don't they're not communicating first of all and foremost maybe they're not communicating with people that are right in front of them so they don't feel

social cues they don't feel empathy and so they're talking in this weird way that's only existed for like fucking 10 years. It's at Duncan Trussell on Twitter. Follow me. Duncan Trussell on Twitter. No, you're right, man.

I agree with you. Two S's, two L's. No, Jaron Lanier. You know, like the idea is like get the fuck off social media. I agree. I don't think that's right either. Is it weird for this to do? I think. I think. I think it's inevitable. I think that's right either. Is it weird for this? I think,

I think, I think it's inevitable. I think it's too big, too much of a part of everything. I think there's no, I don't think there's a future in telling people to stay off it. I think there's more of a future of telling people to understand what it is and manage it. To look at social media, to look at Twitter and Instagram and all those things

and understand what they are. I don't think you have to get off, but you should spend a lot of time outside of that. I got to get off there, man. It's not good to read comments. It's not good to Google your name. I don't think that's good. And that's how, when you see me and you see i'm okay that's why because i don't do that those things you get crazy should we cut ourselves for a

spotify should we like do like a little blood brother ritual where we cut our fingers and like that's how you get your fucking covid test earlier let's do it we're like covid we don't have we don't have covid anymore should we like do a slice no come on it's good why not Duncan all great all great rituals are based in like some kind of blood bond do you think

there's this honestly if you didn't know me if I wasn't your friend would you think there's a responsibility that I have that I'm not meeting no I think you're meeting I think the problem is like no matter how you like it's a responsibility that I have that I'm not meeting? No, I think you're meeting. I think the problem is like no matter how you like, it's like the it's hilarious in the in Star Trek, you know, Captain Kirk. If you're going to be like someone who like gets to be a commander of a starship, you're given a problem that is unsolvable. So no matter what you do, it's you can't win no matter what.

It is unsolvable. So no matter what you do, you can't win. When you get to a certain level of power, any decision you make on some level is wrong and right simultaneously. This is quantum computing, my friend. So I do not, you know, in my analysis of your podcast and all my deep judgmental qualities, I do not see what you're doing as being wrong at all. I see sometimes you make naive decisions that I would make too. What would you say? I think sometimes you have people on who later found out to be like, at least in the moment they were on the show, a little like fucked up.

For sure, in the early days. I had an issue in the early days where I didn't want to admit that I was getting as many views as there was. And I would do a show, and I was just like, no one's watching this. And I would have some crazy person on. Yeah. Maybe there was a few that I was like, I shouldn't have talked to that dude. That dude was fucked up. Yeah.

But that was a learning process. There's a thing about doing a podcast where there's no school for it, right? There's no way to figure out how to do it perfectly. It's not like learning how to play piano. It's real linear. There's all these weird ways to do it, and no one knows. So, unfortunately, I was, like, I guess, like, second generation. First generation is for sure Adam

Curry he's the pod father and then there's like Adam Carolla there's a few other people but I came right after that 2009 so no one knew what the fuck we were doing and I think there was a

certainly been some times where I didn't want to admit that it was reaching as many people as it was. Yeah. You can't think about that because it makes you feel crazy. Well, that's why I want to have you on because I knew we were going to get drunk and get high. And the first episode would be as preposterous as an episode could be. Yeah. And then from this, you can have people on who are real pundits or whatever.

Or not. like have people on who are like real pundits or whatever i mean look man anyone ever i've ever talked to anytime i've ever been in a situation where people are talking shit about you or like questioning my friendship with you because i think because i'm because you had this person or that person on if i'm friends with you something's weird with you or me or whatever i all i always and will forever stand up for you, man, because I know you. And to me, it's like, look what you got into this ridiculous predicament. Like, you're in a bind, man. You are.

You are in a bind. And it's a beautiful bind, and it's a beautiful it's a beautiful bind but it's a real it's a real problem and but like because of your heart which is very open and very sweet you allow this like you allow everyone to have you allow a lot of people onto your podcast that don't make sense according to the zeitgeist and some people get mad at you and they pounce and and i always feel so rotten about that because it's like man you don't understand this is a real progressive like you're looking at someone who is exactly the being that you would hope would be the like result of like great government and great education and you're fucking attacking an ally that That's the part that gets me up,

where I get really bummed is it's like, man, you have to understand that person. Look, if you ask me, I feel like Duncan, should I have Ben Shapiro on? I feel like no, no, no. There's so many better people to have on than that guy. But that doesn't mean you can't have those other people on too.

Well, if you listen to me. But I would say to you, I go, listen, man, I know what you're saying, but if I just took you to dinner, you, me, and Ben Shapiro went to some fucking kosher joint. I'd love hanging out with him. I guarantee you'd like him. No, I know that. He's a good guy. The problem is not him. The problem is all the people's reactions to him and him right there's

two things there's two things the things that he said and the reactions yeah man and the fact that he's kind of weaponized their reactions yeah he's a good guy look i don't i to me it's like i i would i would be so bored if you only have people on this show that I agreed with. It would be such a shitty show. But I do have a rule where I won't have anybody on anymore unless I feel that they enter into those arguments with good faith. Yeah, man. I know that. And I feel like Ben Shapiro, he enters into all discussions with good faith.

He's not an insulting guy. He and I have had interesting conversations about gay marriage, interesting conversations about all sorts of aspects of society, racial relations, Black Lives Matter. And he and I have talked about it in a very respectful way, even though we disagree. There's been no insults. There's been no shittiness. And I think that's the problem with putting a guy like that on some sort of a standard traditional talk show. You have him on and some social justice warrior and they argue with each other and you get a host and you break every seven minutes to go to commercial. You don't find out what he's about.

He's not a bad guy, man. And he gets shaped as much by those seven-minute segments where you're battling it out with someone trying to get sound bites as you and I do by three-minute spots at the comedy store trying to pass open mic night. Based on this podcast, you would imagine that I have a chip on my shoulder about Ben Shapiro, which I really don't. I don't think you do.

The reason I brought up Eddie Bravo is only because I think what you're doing is really sweet and good, and I think your heart is in the same place it was when I met you a while ago, which is pretty bizarre. They would somehow maintain a thing that's integral. You meet people out here who go through rough patches and they're not who they portrayed themselves as initially they're actually like con artists or fuck-ups or like bad temporarily i think people get better but sometimes they're

bad temporarily but you you really like have like maintained this think, a really beautiful kind of North Star regarding your ethics and your consideration of things. So, yeah, man, I'm like, I'll do anything for you, really. I'm one of your great devotees. I'll kill for your joke. You're starting a cult. I'm one of your great devotees. Yeah. I really am, too, man.

I'm one of your great devotees. Yeah. I really am too, man. I feel like, like legitimately, honestly, I feel like I've been tested where I've been given an opportunity to help other people. And I feel like it's, there's no controversy in my mind. My mind knows the right choice. Yeah, man. And so I've always tried to promote all these different comics, and I think that that's

what we should all do with each other. I don't think we need to make all the money. I think you need to make some money. I need to make some money. What do we need, man? We need barbecues and fucking margaritas. We need hugs and a good sound system.

I'm not a selfish person. I've seen a lot of people system. But I've never seen you be selfish. I'm not a selfish person. I've seen a lot of people be selfish. I've never seen you be like, this is the thing. I don't care. But here's how I'm selfish. I'm selfish and then I'm not selfish. Because I know that being selfish is negative to you. Oh, right.

It's bad for you. It's dangerous. It's sloppy. It's weak. It's some bitch ass shit. So I never, I'm never selfish right because i'm selfish because i don't want myself to be a bitch you discovered a like thing i figured it out when i was uh jealous i figured out when i was younger i remember watching comics who were better than me when i

was like 21 and i was thinking like god fuck these guys how did he come up with that joke and then i and i i don't remember when it happened, but it was early. Like, 21, 22. I remember catching it and going, oh, I caught a bad pattern. Like, I got this pattern where I'm jealous. Yeah. Or I could be the way I was before I ever got into comedy, which is inspired. Instead, I was jealous.

Right. And so it made me realize, like me realize oh I've got a bad pattern that I'm chasing this bad pattern do you remember that time Joe that we drank a bowl of blood in front of that Moloch statue it was chicken blood yeah it was delicious

whatever look I feel like is this the longest podcast ever look it doesn't matter. What are we at? We're done. I got to pee again. Let's wrap it up.

I have to pee again soon, too. But what are we at? Five and a half hours. It's over. We did it. I think Kevin Smith was five hours. We won, Joe. Thank God.

You think you should do this in two podcasts? I think we should. Whatever you want to do with it. I don't care. Right? Listen, Spotify, don't get greedy. We gave you a six-hour opening podcast. God bless you, Spotify.

Five and a half hours? Thanks, my friends. It gets better. There's going to be actual scientists on this show if you keep listening. I will talk Duncan Trussell into doing regular podcasts. No problem. Either through Zoom or Skype. You already did it.

Anything. I have thoughts. I have ideas. I want to help. I would have this conversation if we were recording. That's the funny thing. I feel like I've been extending it. Just because I want to keep talking.

I know. Me too, man. We're going to help. All right. How to kush that. Jamie, I'm sorry. Big kiss. We should have done the blood ritual.

I would have cut myself. We fucked up.