The Joe Rogan Experience - #1982 - John Hennessey

Episode Date: May 5, 2023

John Hennessey is the founder and CEO of Hennessey Performance Engineering, Hennessey Special Vehicles, and the Tuner School. www.hennesseyperformance.com

the Joe Rogan experience Mr. Hennessey Mr. Rogan fun hanging with you today it's been a blast we have that fucking vehicle that you have built is the most ridiculous thing I've ever been inside of my life I can't believe how fast it is. We only did a speed limit today, right? Yes, but we got there very quickly. We got there very quickly, yes. 1,817 horsepower and 3,000 pounds,

so you've got some power-to-weight ratio to work with there. That's like 700 more horsepower than a Tesla Plaid. Yeah, it's like taking a McLaren 765LT and adding a thousand horsepower to it. Something nobody needs, but we've sold 36 of those. The Venom F5. What happened to you in your life that you needed to make these preposterous cars?

Well, you know. What is going on? Yeah, there it is. That's the Venom F5. How did you get to be this guy? How did this start out where you're making these 1,800 horsepower cars? It's probably kind of like, you know, the pool hall deal when we were younger. Like, I didn't have a good relationship with my old man. He was a car guy, but we didn't get along.

And I don't know, maybe 60 years later, you know, I'm 60 now. I've got, you know, I still feel like I got a little chip on my shoulder or something to prove. Maybe a little bit less now, but for sure. Isn't it interesting that you would never want that for your son? No. But boy, is that a great motivating factor for success. For sure, yeah. I grew up in kind of an abusive situation and neglect,

and now all of a sudden I've got all this motivation or have had all this motivation for the last 40 years of my business career, so it's been good. It's funny because you would never want that for your children. No, I mean, it's amazing how well it's worked out for people like you or for me. Yeah. I mean, I, you know, I don't think everybody out there that has some level of success has not necessarily been abused and motivated by negativity, but I can definitely see with our five kids with the nurture mainly from my wife, hope, um, they're going to turn out just fine and there'll be plenty of successful, but you know, that's just, I don't know your story, but that's, that's my, that's my road.

It can lead you to be very ambitious and very successful, but it can also just fuck your life up. Oh sure. And you can be very ambitious and very successful and also be like happy. Like that's possible too. That's possible too. Yeah. You don't have to have a tortured childhood. For sure. No, I'm very, very blessed.

I mean, you know, to have an opportunity to build toys for people, you know, whether it's a, you know, a seven, 800,000 horsepower pickup truck or a Venom F5, you know, we were talking earlier about first world problems, right? Yeah.

Something nobody really needs. Nobody needs to go to comedy show show mma but they do it for entertainment i tell people all the time we're more are the stars up there yeah they fly am i right after the rick flair gummy bear and they're gonna really start flying yeah yeah so uh now feel very blessed and we're definitely uh you know people come to us because they want to entertain themselves with their vehicles that's a great way of looking at it too, because that's really what those kinds of cars are. Like when I try to describe my love of old muscle cars for people, because, you know, they kind of are not super reliable. They're not so great at handling. And, you know, so I turn them, I get them done into resto mods, but still they're,

but when I drive them the experience is entertaining it's like a ride like i'm not just in a corolla i'm not just in some quiet subaru i'm in a ride but does it take like when you drive your land cruiser you drive you know one of your older cars does it take you back to that time either when you had that car you aspired to have that car you knew the guy or the girl that had that car kind of growing up, and you wanted it back then, but you didn't know how you were going to get it?

Oh, yeah, for sure. With my Chevelle, definitely. Because my Chevelle, I have a 1970s black with the white stripes, the Tuxedo Chevelle. Sure. And when I was a kid... Cal induction?

What's that? You got the Cal induction in the hood? Yeah. Yeah, L6. Well, it actually is a 454 under the hood, and Colvin,y colvin's colvin you know yeah okay he's the man big viper guy yeah fucking love that dude yeah he hooked up the cowl so that it when the ignition those vacuum hoses get old and crack and yeah it's uh

when i was a kid when i was about 16 years old one of my friends picked me up his friend had a 1970 chevelle we were going somewhere and uh i just remember getting in the backseat of the car going how is it possible that this kid owns this car yeah this is crazy yeah it was the best looking car i'd ever seen in my life on those 70 series tires and guys used to back in the day when i had a 69 olds 442 convertible and if you didn't have the posi rear end you had the one the one tire fryer, you know, she did the burnout and you got like one stripe going about 400 feet down the road. Yeah. Yeah. Those old cars suck to drive though. Oh my God. If you drive the old ones that don't have resto mod components, like roaster shop components, they're just terrible. Yeah. They're

so bad. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I saw my wife for my 60th last year, my 60th birthday. She and the kids bought me a nice 69 Olds 442. So it's nice enough to where I'll drive it, but not so nice that I don't want to drive it. And I just, man, when I drive that thing, it's the slowest, least powerful thing in the fleet. But it just kind of brings me back. I got this jam box I put in the backseat, the turtle box. And I just turn on my ACDC and go out cruising around. You don't even bother installing a stereo in it. If it dies at the stop sign or if it

you know, we'll probably put an LT4 or an LSA in it. We'll LS swap it at some point. Do you think you'll do something to the chassis? It would probably need that, but you know, I like a scary ride that kind of entertains me, you know. So, maybe to some degree. I mean, we do want to have a balanced, safe car, but you know i like a scary ride that kind of entertains me you know so uh maybe to some degree we i mean we didn't want to have a balanced safe car but uh you know the old saying

bob lutz who used to be the president of chrysler back in the day when i first met him he had um he was working for bmw in germany he had a pretty fast motorcycle he's out tooling around germany and some dude just rips past him on the autobahn and he pulls into the gas station this is old guy and bob goes up looking at his bike it's like is that a turbocharger on your bike this dude this is like the early 70s and the german guy says yeah yes young man this it has a turbocharger and bob says how much horsepower does that bike have he says well probably 200 of the tire and bob's like what 200 of the tire he's like isn't that too much horse bob is saying to this old german guy isn't that too much horse? Bob is saying to this old German guy, isn't that too much horsepower? And the old guy looks at him and says, young man, there's no such thing as too much horsepower.

Bob told me that story like 30 years ago. I was visiting him up in Detroit. And I think to some degree that's true. That's a good story. You want to have it balanced. You want to have it safe. As long as you're not there for the end. As long as you're not in the ditch.

As long as you're not there for the accident. Right. The thing about motorcycles is not there for the accident. Right. The thing about motorcycles is the consequences are so grave. Well, sure, yeah. I've had a few. I busted up my knee and spent a week in the hospital when I was in high school. And I guess now the term they use, and it's to some degree donor cycle. Yeah.

My boys all like to ride. We ride KTM. We ride dirt bikes up in Colorado in the summertime. But I'm like, on the road. You've got to be careful up in Colorado in the summertime, but I'm like on the road. You got to be careful because even back in the day, if you're riding, you know, they're distracted drivers. Now everybody's on their fucking phone. Nobody's paying attention to shit.

So bad. You know, so. There's so many people that are just addicted to their phones and they can't put them down while they're driving. It's so wild to see. Yeah. I mean, every now and then I take a car service to the airport or something. And if you're not driving, you can just like look out the window.

Just next time you do that, just look out the window. More than half the people are fucking not even looking at the road. They're on their phone. Yeah. And they're supposed to be driving or they're putting on their makeup. One of the things I love about Apple CarPlay is you don't have to take your hands off of anything. Absolutely. You can just say, hey, Siri, play.

Yeah. It'll play a song for you. Yep. That is the wild, like I do that shit with my daughter because my daughter daughter's into Taylor Swift, and I don't have Taylor Swift on my phone. But I could just, while we're in the car, you want to listen to something? And she brings up a song, so I just say, hey, Siri, play. And then, bam. Like that, it's playing it.

I mean, it's- CarPlay works really well. It's incredible. It reads your texts. Yeah. It sends texts for you. It's fucking amazing. Have you ever put CarPlay in any of your old cars?

They have retrofit kits now for that of stuff i have but honestly when i'm driving those old cars i don't i don't like to sometimes i don't even like to listen to music yeah i really just want to hear that engine sure sure you know i'll listen to music sometimes but i'm it always gets annoying i want to hear that engine i want to hear that yeah you want to fucking feel that V8. Whoa. Spin the tires a little bit. Not too much. Yeah.

I just, there's something about cars that I guess it was because when I was a kid, it represented freedom, right? Because you were in high school. If you didn't have a car,

you had to ride the bus. Status. Yeah. Status for sure. Chicks for sure. Friends maybe, you know. It was really more impressive for guys than it was for girls. Sure. The kinds of cars I like, girls are like, this fucking thing stinks. Yeah, status for sure. Chicks for sure. Friends maybe, you know. It was really more impressive for guys than it was for girls.

Sure. The kinds of cars I like, girls are like, this fucking thing stinks. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Smells like gas. I went to this Jesuit high school up in Kansas City called Rockhurst, and I was a little guy and total nobody. I was on the wrestling team, and I think I was in the 98-pound weight class when I was a freshman. Anyway, I was a total nobody, and then I bought a motorcycle from my dad when I was like a sophomore. And I remember the first time I rolled into school, I was late. And there's like

this quadrangle where I could like pull right up to the door. And there's all these windows that are open. And all these guys like rushed to the window to hear what this loud motorcycle was. And all of a sudden, I had status. All of a sudden, I was not a nobody. I was like, who's the wild man in the little kid in the motorcycle? That is the thing, right? If you're a kid showing up at school in a motorcycle, you're a wild man. Sure, yeah. Yeah, so same thing.

I had my car crash, and the guy that lived across the street from me had this old 442 convertible. It's kind of a crazy story. My old man was an insurance adjuster, and he was going to buy this car from this body shop for like a couple hundred bucks, and he told me it was going to be my first car,

blah, blah, blah. And like a month goes by, I'm like, hey, hey dad when when we get in that car and he just kind of ignored me and just kind of blew me off and the next thing i knew the neighbor across the street had that car wow so the torture if i didn't get the car and now i got it now i gotta drive i go home every day on my motorcycle and look at the neighbor across the street who had the car so when i had my motorcycle wreck i had two bikes So 16 and I'm trying to fix my bike. And the guy across the street worked at this Ford factory up in Kansas city. And he offered to help me with the bikes. And I ended up making a deal with him and I sold him, I trade him the two

bikes and I paid him like 50 bucks a month for a year or something like that. And I bought, I bought, I bought the car back with my own money. So I'm like, F you old man. That's awesome. It was fun. Yeah. What, when you first got into cars, uh, like what were the cars you, were you always into American cars or were you into a lot of foreign cars? You know, I mean, back in the, back when, you know, muscle back in the, growing up in the seventies and eighties, I mean, it was all muscle cars. So, you know, you see the guy with the Chevelle or the Camaro, the 70 and a half Z28. How old are you? I'm 60. Okay, so you're a little older than me. I'm 65.

Yeah, so I just grew up around muscle cars. And then fast forward, you know, went to college for a few years, dropped out, moved from Kansas City to Texas. And back then, like in the 80s, the German cars, or they had these rally cars over in Europe. And they called, it was the group B rally cars and they call them the killer bees because they got so fast back like in the mid to late eighties that, that the crowds would like bunch up in the road waiting for these, you know, rally cars blasting by at 120 or whatever. And they knew where the rally cars were because the helicopters were chasing them, you know, kind of spot and form or the TV camera. And then one time the cars got so fast that they would like hit the,

they got ahead of the helicopters and these group B rally cars like landed on people and killed a bunch of people. So they call them the killer, killer B. So I was really kind of enamored with like the Audi Quattro. They went to Pike's Peak and they raced at Pike's Peak. And that's really kind of what got, so it kind of, you know, shifted gears from American muscle to now kind of this higher tech German all-wheel drive turbocharged stuff. And then I started a small environmental cleanup like an asbestos abatement business back in the late 80s.

And made a little bit of money. Wasn't dating my wife. Wasn't married yet. And so I read in Motor Trend magazine about this guy named C. Van Toon. He was actually the editor at Motor Trend magazine about this guy named C. Van Toon. He was actually the editor at Motor Trend back in the mid to late 90s. And he had bought an Eagle Talon, this is like 1990, put a roll cage in it, and he goes and enters the Pikes Peak Hill Climb in Colorado Springs. And I read that and I'm like, oh man, my name's not Andretti or Antra. I can't just show

up to Indy, but maybe I could do that. And so made a little bit of money in my asbestos business. I was reading the car magazines and I'm like, I'm the kind of guy, whether it's then or now, I don't really want to do what everybody else has done. I'm a contrarian by nature. And you know, if everybody else has raced in Porsches or whatever, so I'm trying to find something that I can afford, but this high tech that I can modify to race at Pike's Peak. And I read about a car that came out that year. It was the Mitsubishi 3000 GT VR4. So it was all-wheel drive,

twin turbo V6, four-wheel steer. I had a Mitsubishi Starion. Yeah, those were cool. Those are coming back. That's kind of Radwood-ish. 3000, yeah, just type in Hennessey 3000 GT and you'll probably see something pop up. Now that I'm thinking about it, I had the Dodge version of it.

I had the Conquest. Yeah, the Stealth. Oh, the Conquest. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, so you had one of those. Those things were sick. Yeah, those were cool.

I loved those things when I first saw those things. So I took it and raced it at Pike's Peak and didn't win anything. Those things were the shit when they came out. Drove it to Pikes Peak, drove it home. I did a couple races. If you type in, yeah. You know what's crazy? Does Mitsubishi.

There you go. That Motortown article. There's Bonneville. Mitsubishi doesn't make anything like that now, right? Mitsubishi, I mean, a good friend of mine, Joe Jacuzzi, he's with GM now. There were some really great folks at Mitsubishi, and maybe they've just kind of gone on to other things. But, yeah, the VR200.

So I learned the first rule in car racing. Well, the first rule if you want to make a small fortune in the car racing business, you start with a larger fortune. And so I'm going and I'm doing these races. I think I've heard that before. And I'm going to Pikes Peak, and I do these open road races in Nevada where you go out at night. They still have it called the Silver State Classic.

They take Highway 318, which is about south of Ely, so about four hours north of Vegas, and they shut the whole highway down and they let these cars go out on a Sunday morning and go out and haul ass. And so the first time I did it, my average speed for 90 miles was 164 miles an hour. I did 90 miles in 34 minutes in that car.

Jesus Christ. And, you know, the first time I did it, I didn't even have a roll cage, which is pretty stupid. But after I did all this stuff, so I'm engaged, planning a honeymoon, we bought a house. I like to say we bought furniture, but my wife corrects me on that. We just bought, but we inherited furniture from her family. I think all I brought to the marriage was a mattress and a box spring and a desk maybe and a Mac. Anyway, so I did all

that. I'm doing all these races, come home from the honeymoon and I look at the bank balance. I'm like, man, I used to have some money in the bank before I got engaged and bought a race car and raced all over the place. And I thought, you know, I really like doing this car thing. Maybe other people would pay me to modify their cars like Carroll Shelby, like Alois Roof with Porsches, Reeves Calloway. And so October of 1991, we opened up Hennessy Motorsports, and I hired a mechanic and got a toolbox, and off we went. And that kind of led into the JDM market. What kind of cars are you modifying back then? So, yeah, dude, anything that would roll in the door. And I kind of had a little bit of notoriety from the Silver State race.

So, you know, it was JDM, so it was Supras, 300ZX Twin turbo, you know, so Grand National Supras. So the Mark IV Supra, you know, the Cyclone, the Typhoon. Oh, the GMC pickup truck? Yeah, that had a little 3.8 liter single turbo V6. And so then a guy calls me up in early 93 and he said, hey, I've got one of the first Dodge Vipers coming. It was actually a model year 92, but they had some production delays. So the car didn't come out to the spring of 93. And he says, hey, I bought a Viper and I want to take it to the Silver State race. And can you help me put the safety equipment and help it pass tech? And I said, sure. I said,

but I'll make you a deal. If you let let me modify it I think I can get another 100 horsepower to that Viper and I'll do it for free I said I won't even charge you to do it I said the only thing I'll ask in return I'll take you out to the race we'll support you we'll I'll bring my mechanic we'll look after your car after the race if you'll again my buddy Joe Jacuzzi was with Mitsubishi at the time said hey I'll take you around LA and I'll introduce you to the editor at Motor Trend and Hot Rod and Car Craft and Road and Track. And sure enough, we did all that. And I initially did it with my 3000 GT,

got some articles off of it. And I'm like, when I was doing that back in the early 90s, this is before social media, this is before YouTube, no internet. And so the only way we knew about car stuff is we did car magazines, right? And so I'm doing all this for a couple weeks with Joe and going around. I'm thinking, man, I've been gone a long time.

I did this race. I go to talk to all these media guys. And Joe's like, just be patient. When the magazine comes out, if they like you and they like your car and they write something nice about it, your phone will ring. And sure enough, the phone started ringing. And so I did all that with the Viper. And then. How did you get 100 more horsepower?

You know, the Viper is a big, um, you know, eight liter V10. And so back in those days, the exhaust system sound like a UPS truck. They still kind of sound weird. It's two five cylinders basically is what it sounds like. So we freed up the exhaust. We did a colder intake. We poured in polish the head. So we got, we bumped it to at least 500 horsepower. Then we started doing cams and stroker motors and eventually turbos. And basically from 93 through, for the next 10 years into the early 2000s, I would say we were on the covers of 30, 40 magazines, including all the major buff books. Isn't it crazy when you think about the progression of cars and power,

that if you go back to the original Viper, it wasn't really that fast? No. Compared to today? What did it have horsepower-wise? The original was 400, and then they went to 450. So 400 is like, I mean, you get a regular Mustang GT, you're getting 460. Yeah, yeah. Right off the factory floor.

The new Dark Horse would be 500. And I mean, you could take a Tesla Model 3 and beat an old Viper. I mean, back in the day. But it was so torquey. And it was just so outrageous. It was raw. It was raw. No anti-lock brakes.

That's true. It was kind of scary. We spot a lot of tires. But, you know, pretty cool car for back in the day. And, again, me being the contrarian, there are plenty of other guys out there modifying Corvettes and Mustangs and things like that. Of course. I'm the guy that wants to be different. So if you guys are modifying those vehicles, I'm going to modify the Viper. And so that just kind of built up our, so our business kind of grew from just a small tuning shop to a larger scale tuning shop. And

then we added it up, well, maybe a year ago. That's from 91 through about a year ago, we had modified about 15,000 vehicles worldwide. Yeah. Wow we did mail-order for a while and some of that was mail-order but last year we built we modified five hundred and sixty four vehicles last year so when did you start getting to the shit you're doing now like you know you've made me a 1000 horsepower TRX yeah that car is so stupid yes it's just a fit but it's so, the problem with it. And the brakes are good? Because I was worried that you would end up in the back of an 18-wheeler.

No. I drive it very responsibly, believe it or not. I just love the fact that it has so much power. And it sounds great. Oh, it sounds amazing. It's very comfortable. Yeah. And also, because it's high up, you get a great vantage point.

You get to see accidents before they happen. If you're stuck in the highway and there's some wreck, you can just go through the grass and go into the feeder road yeah you really could do that I mean the other thing is like like when I'm driving like my older cars like I've got a Cadillac CTSV wagon manual and I'm pulling out of a store and some lady at Christmas a couple years ago runs into me because she didn't see me so I do like like driving something bigger like that because if they run into you it's not going to do that much and and they generally see you and want to not run into you my land cruiser well this this uh the trx has steel bumpers too yeah my land cruiser also has rock sliders yeah side of it and so because it's lifted if someone's going to t-bone me they're going right into the rocks yeah it's going

to be worse for them than it is for you for sure it's just there's so many fucking bad drivers out there well yeah we could talk at length about that, but I think a lot of that boils down to like, if you look at Europe, you look at Germany, getting a driver's license in Germany is a serious deal. It takes two years. It costs about $2,500.

Getting your driver's license in Germany, there's Germans are so serious and they're serious about their cars and about their driving and about the Autobahn. But getting the driver's license in Germany is similar to getting a private pilot's license over here. Wow. Yeah, and so why don't we do that over here? Well, that would be a higher barrier for a lot of people, and so car companies want to sell cars, insurance companies want to sell insurance. Also, maybe people don't need to learn how to drive that good.

They just need to pay attention and don't go fast. Yeah, that's true. I mean, I don't know if it's speed, but it's just paying attention. You know, I mean, our kids all just, you know, in the last 10 years all went through driver's ed, and I think they got, you know, some decent training. But, you know, to your point, like lane discipline, like, you know, if you're the slowest guy out there, get in the right lane. Yeah.

You know, if you're going a little bit faster, you go in the inside lane. But just that, you know, that drives any serious driver crazy is when somebody's on the left lane. Yeah. You know, if you're going a little bit faster, you go in the inside lane, but just that, you know, that drives any serious driver crazy is when somebody's on the left lane going 49. Which is, that doesn't bother me. Okay. It does bother me,

but it doesn't bother me like not paying attention. The not paying attention thing. The distracted drivers. Right. It's wild. Yeah. Well,

and I would put some of that on the OEMs. I think the OEMs to some degree try to make the cars like nannies, like whether it's autopilot or adaptive steering. I think, OEMs to some degree try to make the cars like nannies, like whether it's autopilot or adaptive steering. I think I had a friend of mine's dad when I was in high school, I'll never forget. He said, Hey kid, you know, if you want to stay alive, don't use, if you're driving at night, don't use cruise control. I'm like, well, why not? Well, you set your cruise

control, you got your tunes going, you're a little tired, you fall asleep in the ditch, right? So I think that, you know, I would almost say that to some degree that the nannies to try to protect drivers all of a sudden become, well, maybe I can crawl in the backseat and take a nap. Here's a tip for anybody that might be driving and you're worried you're going to fall asleep. Get, bring a washcloth with you and ice cubes. Like get a wet washcloth and then put ice cubes in that washcloth and just rub your face. Okay. It'll keep you awake the whole time. It's not painful.

I used to slap myself in the face. That's what I used to do. So you'd be out on a road trip and trying to drive through the night. I've done all that. It's because I was doing standup comedy at night and I was delivering newspapers in the morning. So I was always fucking tired. We've got a lot of things to talk about. You delivered newspapers?

Fuck yeah, I did, dude. Which one? I was 12 years old, Kansas City Star. Nice. And dude, I mean, I'm getting up at like 3.45, 4 a.m., delivering papers for two, two and a half hours. And dude, like on a Sunday, which was- Did you do it on your bike?

No, I'm in the back of this paper truck, and this guy had the route, and then we would have to roll the paper and put it in this machine and crank this thing. It would tie a little knot with some string around it and fucking toss it out the window we're going by you know like dogs are barking at you and it's snowing and it's cold and then i'd be the you know i would do some of that but all of a sudden there'd be like an apartment complex well here's your stack of papers and i'm out toss on my people's doorsteps and like on like a juicy day we might make like three dollars and 25 cents and so what we do, we go to 7-Eleven and we blow half the cash on freaking nasty burritos and big gulps and crap like that.

But that was just kind of what we did. But that's what we had to do. So you're doing papers while you're doing stand-up? Yeah, I was doing newspapers from the time I guess I was probably like 17 or 18 when I first started it. Maybe it was a little, yeah, somewhere in that range. And I did it for the Boston Herald, I did it for the Boston Globe, and I did it for the New York Times. Nice. And so I had, at one point in time, I had a huge route, and I even got a van.

I had like a cargo van. So you had your own deal, You weren't working for somebody else. No, I was working for a dispatch. Okay. So you would get a job working for the Globe. Okay. And you'd go to the dispatch and they'd give you a route. Yeah.

So they give you a map and all the houses that are on it, all the addresses. Right. And then they would give you stacks of newspapers. Yeah. And you had to fold them while you're driving. Yeah. So you're driving. You pull up in front of the house.

I had a stack of papers right next to me and I would just go like this, grab it, zap, zap, and I had these plastic bags that were hanging from my rear view mirror. So I'd go, wham, wham, and then chuck it out the window. Yeah, I think we started going to the plastic. So I did it from, I was probably 12 to maybe 14 and then one of my relatives was in a hospital

in South Kansas City, St. Joe's, and I found out that they did not have a paper route in the hospital. And I was able to kind of get that. I was able to get that franchise. I was making like back in the day, maybe 80 bucks a week, which is pretty good money back then. Yeah. I was doing so many newspapers that I actually was, that was the primary money that I was making. So this was when I wasn't really making much money teaching. You were a teacher too? I used to teach martial arts. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So I actually used to teach at Boston University. Okay. It was actually a pass fail A. So it counted towards your GPA. Okay. So I would tell everybody, if you just try, you'll get an A. And it's a real A. So just try.

Just show up and try. If you can't make it. I like your story when those guys were following you and fucking with you and you're like, Hey, you want to come up to the door? That was hilarious. That was so dumb. You want to get your ass whipped? Come on. It was hilarious. Cause they were, they just kept saying that I needed to give them money. And then I said, and then where are you going? I'm like, I'm going to go teach class. You want to come up and watch? Yeah. Right. You want to come be there? And like, they're standing there

in front of the Jaehyun Kim Taekwondo Institute, and they're looking at me. They're like, you're teaching? I go, yeah. Uh-huh. Yeah, I'm a black belt. I'm teaching class. I'll fucking kill you, man.

Leave me alone. You want a few broken ribs? Don't let me kill you. Exactly. It was so funny. It was like the least nervous I've ever been as a young man. Yeah. It was like the perfect, it was like the whole reason why I got into fighting at all is because i was terrified of being bullied yeah and so to have this moment happen while i'm

walking on the street and these two guys start fucking with me and and i'm not rattled at all yeah and then i get to that door and i tell them i saw the video i just laughed my ass off that was awesome how so when you were doing so you started off off in MMA or you started off in jujitsu. I started off in Taekwondo. Taekwondo. Yeah. Well, I started off in karate first. I went to Esposito's Karate Academy, which was in Newton, Massachusetts, where I lived.

But it was hard to get there. I didn't have a car. And it was like you had to take buses. It was a grind to get there. But Boston was pretty easy. I just had to walk to the T, which was like I had to walk a mile and a half or something like that. And then I would get to the T, which is the train that would take me right into Kenmore Square, which is right where the school was. From the time you started to the time you felt like you had some skills or a little bit of confidence, how long did that take?

Six months? Well, I was obsessed. I mean, when I started, when when i was 15 i was there every day okay i mean every day i didn't take any days off right i was obsessed and i i became a black belt in two years no shit yeah i was i was teaching like almost right away like like right after, um, I think when I got my blue belt, I started teaching, um, private lessons, like for the new beginners, I teach them form and stances and how to get your, your hips into things. And I was just teaching them like basics.

Right. And that helped me a lot because there's something about teaching that like really sort of accelerates your own learning curve interesting and so i was obsessed with it and i was i was competing already i started competing like right away okay white belt you're what 16 15 15 all right and so uh you know they would take you to these tournaments like so all you had to do is like be at the school and everybody would sort of carpool and then when i was a kid it was like they would kind of take care of me and bring me to these places.

Right. And you're in this fucking gymnasium, and there's this other dude across from you, and you're about to try to kick each other unconscious. Right. This is wild. Yeah. And I became obsessed with it because it was so insane.

Yeah. It was like to go from regular life, just Right. You know, just being a kid. I liked to draw. I was an artist. Yeah. So all of a sudden I'm like traveling around the country. Right. Fighting.

Yeah. It was so nerve wracking and so hard to do. It was so challenging. It was such a freak out to do it. And I became so obsessed with it. Did you have an instructor that like really like invested into you? Yes. Yeah.

I had several. But this guy, like invested into you? Yes. Yeah, I had several But this guy Michael O'Malley in particular and this guy Jaehyun Kim who is the he's the head instructor of the Institute And he was like very famous Taekwondo instructor. I got very very lucky when I went to that place in 19 Whatever 80 whatever was here one or 82 when i first went there it was um one of the best schools in the world okay just i've fortunately walked wow in that door just just just random i could have walked into a bad karate school i would have known the difference i was 15 what the fuck would i know but i happened to go i walked up i was actually leaving a baseball game and i was going uh told a story i'm sorry if people have heard it before, but I was going home, and there's a long line to get to the T, because everybody was leaving Fenway Park.

Yeah. And so we walked by the school, and I said, let's go up and see what the fuck's going on up here. And we walked up the stairs, and as I was walking up the stairs, I kept hearing this sound, like, whomp, whoop, whomp. And it was this guy, John Lee lee who became a mentor of mine okay and he was a national champion at the time and he was training for the world cup and i think he was 27 or 28 years old so he was in his absolute prime and i got to see this guy kick the bag and i couldn't believe it it was the force that he was generating. Well, that's you.

That's you now. Like, I mean, I've seen videos. I haven't seen you train in person. I learned from him. It's like, you know, one whack of your leg and you got some broken ribs. Yeah, but I learned it from that guy. I mean, I learned it from, I mean, he most certainly helped me many, many, many times. But watching him, I learned it from him.

I learned that that was possible. Like, I'd never known that a person could do that. Like, the, many times. But watching him, I learned it. I learned that that was possible. I'd never known that a person could do that. The amount of force. I was like, that is insane. So you were doing that and you were tossing newspapers around the same time. Yes. So newspapers was your income source, but fighting was your passion and cost of money for travel or whatever. It was a good way once I got out of high school.

It was a good way to generate some money while I was doing this crazy thing where I was trying to make the Olympic team for Taekwondo. Really? Okay. Yeah. So I was competing. I won the Massachusetts State Championship like four years in a row. Okay. And I was competing in the nationals.

And I never – I couldn't win the nationals. I came close a couple of times and I got in the finals of the U.S. Cup with this guy, Kareem Jabbar, who was the national champion. It was a very disputed, close decision that I thought I could have got. So I was at that level. I was like right close. But unfortunately, then I started kickboxing. And when I started kickboxing, immediately I realized how helpless I was against someone who had really good hands. I was getting fucked up

kickboxing. Okay. And then I kind of lost my faith in Taekwondo because I realized how limited it was because they don't punch to the face. Okay. So you get like a, it's, you get the most amazing leg dexterity because you're learning how to primarily learning how to kick. They have some of the best kicks, but you're so limited in your ability to defend your face from punches because when punches and kicks are thrown together to your face, it makes things so much more complex. And when I was learning that I was like, I lost like some of my faith in Taekwondo. Wow. So I had a few kickboxing fights and then I was doing standup at the same time. And I knew I had to pick one of the other. Where did standup come into that whole program? How

were you when you started with that? Well, I was thinking about it when I was like 19 one of the other. Where did stand-up come into that whole program? How were you when you started with that? Well, I was thinking about it when I was like 19 or 20. Okay. You wrote your own stuff? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, just like it was horrible. Right, yeah.

But you're the kind of guy that like you don't put your balls out there and you won't mind getting punished for something you want to try. Well, I was just curious. Like I'd seen, this is what it was. I have a very good friend to this day. His name is Steve Graham. He's a good buddy of mine. And Steve, when I was 15, when I met him, he was an ophthalmologist.

And like he'd been on the US ski team, like a fucking wild man. Just done a lot of stuff, like super, super duper smart. And he was like in his 30s and i was like 15 and uh we we used to train together all the time and when we would go and fight in tournaments i was the guy who made everybody laugh because everybody would be nervous we would be all scared because we're gonna go fight yeah or when we're about to spar everyone would be super nervous sparring was scary yeah yeah yeah and i was the guy who like you could cut up and crack jokes because i realized that there was like tension in the room and then i

could get attention okay from cracking that tension all right i could get attention from like making everybody laugh and so i started i would do like impressions of guys we knew having sex and like just stupid shit and it was so dumb but steve is the one who told me uh steve and this other guy ed shorter wow he was a friend of mine too he just said you really should be you should do stand-up like you could do it i'm like dude you think i'm funny because you know me i'm like other people gonna think i'm an asshole like my sense of humor is so fucked up but so then i went to an open mic night and when you go to open mic night one of the things that's good about open mic nights is like, if you compare yourself to like Bill Burr or Dave Chappelle,

it's like, it'll blow your, you won't be able to, you can't imagine ever reaching that level. Right. But if you go to an open mic night, you realize, Oh,

these people are terrible. Yeah. So I might've sucked that bad. Everybody's terrible when they first start. That's funny. Me included. I was terrible. And so when you're around these terrible comedians, you realize like, oh, okay.

This is how it works. And then when I was at an open mic night the first time, a couple of real top level pros stopped by and did sets. Like this guy, Teddy Bergeron, who did the Tonight Show back in the day. And he was like, heance abuse problems, but I'm telling you in 1988 there was no one was better There was people that are at that level, but no one what he was so smooth Wow so polished and his material was so interesting and funny and I remember what I had done my stupid little set I barely got a few laughs right and then I was like maybe I could do this maybe I could do this and then I Went out and watched that guy then I was like maybe I could do this maybe I could do this and then I went out and watched that guy I was I

just quit he went up and just it was so polished so it was he was in such like ease on stage but he's done it a thousand times thousand times so this was and he was in his prime right he he had one of the best sets I've ever seen on a tonight show he was he was, but then he went off the rails. He went off the rails, and he just had some problems. So did you learn how to deal with hecklers early on? Oh, yeah. You always have to learn how to deal with hecklers.

Yeah. You're going to learn. Yeah. Well, you're going to have some moments where you fall apart. You're going to have some moments where it works out great. Yeah. It's a long, bloody process. Right.

I compare it to trying to build a mountain one layer of paint at a time. Oh shit. It takes so long, it takes so long, it's so brutal. But to me it was a way that I could exist in the world that wasn't a regular job. I was, whatever it is, it's ADD or whatever the fuck I'm at. I just couldn't sit still,

and I couldn't be involved in anything that didn't freak me out. I only wanted to be involved in things that scared me. So you were the original fear factor then. They cast you for a reason in that deal. They cast me against one. A couple of the producers didn't want to cast me because I was making fun of it. Right.

I went in and When I did the audition for it that they wanted to be scary like fear is not a factor for you Like they were interviewing like sportscaster type dudes Yeah, and I went in there and you know I thought like this is I was I had a deal with NBC and I think it was to do a sitcom Pretty sure was and so I went in to talk to them they said we have this thing yeah I was like what are you doing and like well we want to present it to you so I go there and like they're sick

and dogs we're gonna put you in a cage with a bunch of centipedes well it was it originally a show in Holland okay it's called now or Neverland okay I think that was called what it was called and so this company bought it and then they put it on TV in America and they needed a host and then you know they came to me yeah and I was making so much fun I was high I showed up hi I was like I'm gonna have this meeting with all these Hollywood people I was getting weirded out by those meanings right I like to show up hi uh huh just to feel them out you know and I was I was just making fun of it like you're gonna sick dogs on people on TV that is funny stupid I. And I was just making fun of it. Like, you're going to stick dogs on people on TV? That is funny.

That's so stupid. I was like, how long before this gets canceled? I was like making all these jokes about like how ridiculous it is. You're going to stick dogs on people. So you were doing the standup in Boston. And then what made you think to move to, like, did you go on the road up in the Northeast? I moved to New York. I moved to New York first.

And that was in the very early 90s. Okay. I met a manager who's still my manager to this day when i was an open mic in boston and then he moved me out to new york okay so i lived in new york for a few years then i got a development deal to do a sitcom then i came out i came out to hollywood okay yeah but the whole time playing pool yeah you and i played pool before you play good pool dude you play good rusty but you're not yeah but you know what you're doing for me you know what you're doing like i watch you hit the ball you know what you're doing it was fun yeah kind of bring back some memories you know how to play pool like some people just play pool they're just knocking balls around but

i'm watching you get out i'm like okay you know how to play pool it's complicated we'll say it is complicated you got a tough table man yeah yeah those tight pockets yeah a little snooker table difficult shit yeah well that's right. Yeah. Yeah, what Kennedy say, we don't do these things because they're easy. We do them because they're hard. Do them because they are hard. Hard. Yeah. Exactly right.

So when I moved to LA, I fucking hated it. Yeah. But I could go to Hard Times. Yeah. And that was, to me, there was two places that were mecca in LA. So those were like Comedy Club? Okay. No, no, no.

Comedy Store was the mecca for stand-up, but Hard Times was the mecca for pool. Oh, really? Oh, yeah. That's where Keith McCready came from. Oh, yeah, yeah. Hard Times was this place in Bellflower, and you'd go down there,

and I would compete in the Sunday tournament. I mean, I never came close to winning it, but I would get in it all the time and get my nut shot in. But you could play Rodolfo Luat. You could play Ef Reyes really you could play Max Eberle how cool you could play John Mora you could play just stone cold killers in an open tournament you could play Efren Reyes wow like it's just a random draw yeah so you go in there and then you know there's a field of I don't know how many players before it fills up it fills up every weekend right and we

Would go there on Sunday you get there early I played Oscar Dominguez or I played his dad Ernesto Ernesto Dominguez killer This is like killer Mauro Pais these guys were killers And you would go there and watch literally the best pool in the world Wow all in Bellflower, California And there was a lot of gambling matches yeah Yeah, yeah, sure. It was awesome I love that place. Yeah, that was that was like one of things that saved me Okay that and going to there's a few other places that I went House of billiards and Sherman Oaks is a great place Okay, okay pool there Hollywood billiards. Okay in Holly. I played there. Yeah, unfortunately that went under yeah

So like that kept me going right we still do an MMA then well still I was doing martial arts. Yeah I was in jiu-jitsu. That's right Marshall. Yeah, I got it. Yeah, that was when I really got into jiu-jitsu I got into jiu-jitsu in like 96, right Yeah, well, yeah, I was actually at the same gym that Vitor Belfort when he was making his debut in the UFC I was training at his gym Okay, because it was it was Carlson Gracie's Academy, which was in Hollywood. And I was learning from his coaches. It was crazy to watch Vitor. How did you connect with UFC and Dana White? Back then, so when Vitor was making his debut, Campbell McLaren-

Is this like late 90s? 97. 97, okay. So Campbell McLaren, who was one 90s 97 97 so Campbell McLaren It was one of the producers of the UFC okay. It was a good friend of my manager Okay, and they were just having a conversation when he said hey You know just he was you know randomly talking to him about I gotta hire a new guy to do interviews we need someone to do interviews and My manager said Joe is obsessed, he watches them all. Like, he's really obsessed with it. Maybe he would do it. And so they get us on the phone.

I'm like, fuck yeah, I'll do it. And they're like, you got to take a propeller plane to Dothan, Alabama. I'm like, I'm in. Let's go. And so next thing you know, I'm on these fucking puddle jumper planes flying to all these weird, because it was totally illegal in most states. And this was like. 97.

Yeah. They had that like those, I think, what, Dana bought it from the guys that did the- Bob Meyerowitz. The whole thing in the bar where they beat the crap out of each other. This was before Dana owned it. This was Bob Meyerowitz. Oh, really? Yes. I worked for SEG, which was the original company.

This was long before the Fertitta Brothers came along with Dana and all that. That's how I got back into it. I quit. I did it for about a year and a half, maybe two years, I did backstage interviews. And then there was an event in Japan. I'm like, I'm not going to Japan. I don't have any time. It literally was costing me money.

I loved doing it, but I could make more money doing a comedy club over the weekend than I could going. They weren't making any money, so how are they going to pay you any money, right? Exactly. There was no money to be made. There was no money for the fighters. I mean, it wasn't a bad, I wasn't getting screwed. It was just, that's all it was. Like, we would go to these, like, half-filled high school auditoriums.

Right. There was no one. Because a lot of states were banning it and stuff like that back then? Yeah, it was very hard to get sanctioned. Right. That's why we had to go to, like, Dothan, Alabama. Right. It got banned in New York, actually.

My first event was supposed to be in New York, but they banned it in New York right before they did the event, and they moved the event very quickly, like overnight, to Dothan, Alabama. Were the boxing promoters trying to shut it down? Yes, 100%. Okay. 100%. And there was also like, there's so much shenanigans that goes on. There's unions.

Right. If you're not paying them, they're not going to let you play. That's how the UFC stayed out of New York State forever. Okay. The UFC just got in New York legally. God, how many years ago was it? It wasn't that long ago. Wow.

Like crazy recent. Yeah, crazy recent. It doesn't make any sense. It was in every other state it was legal. 2015, 16, wasn't it? Somewhere around then, right? Wow. Let's see what the actual... I mean, I never

thought about the politics of it until we were just chatting, but... Well, back then, it was like, it was scary. Like, what is this? No one knew what it was. You didn't have all these years and years of guys like Hoyce Gracie and George St. Pierre and Kamaru Usman. We didn't have anything to draw from. 2016, which is so crazy.

New York, the last state to approve it. New York! That's crazy cuz they're dirty politics Yeah, the guy who was holding holding it back. I believe he got arrested for corruption See if that's true Wow There was a senator that He got busted for some shenanigans But he was part of the problem holding it back right but in the beginning I could see why they would hold it back like you're watching these

guys headbutt each other right they can they could see all the blood and everything and crazy remember they see the foot stomping at all well foot stomping still you can see that yeah okay but what you would see back then was like nut shots you roll out to punch people in nuts brutal I'm just straight up street fight this is there's a fight with Keith Hackney and Joe's on and Keith Hackney is on top of Joe's on and Joe's on is like cranking on his neck and Keith Hackney's just punched him in the nuts just a little cup yeah but even so so whatever you're still getting punched

in the nuts yeah you have a cup on it hurts like hell yeah yeah so like back in those days I kind of understand why someone who didn't understand what was going on would think this should be illegal. Yeah. I totally get it. Right. And it was like they had to develop rules. So they developed weight classes and then they developed rules. But I was kind of already on the way out by then.

And so in 98-ish, 99, I quit. And then the UFC got purchased by Zufa. Okay. And that was in like 2001. And I went to one of their first events. Okay. Vladimir Matyshenko fought Tito Ortiz, and it was right after September 11th. Okay.

And Tito Ortiz, they used to have these elaborate walk-ins with like lights and fire and shit. And Tito Ortiz is walking into the octagon with an american flag and the place goes wild wow just why that's cool because it was like right after yeah september 11th sure it was like holy shit people needed a break from all of that yeah serious stuff and in during that fight the pay-per-view went out and like the people didn't get to see the last rounds of the main event. It was a huge disaster. The UFC had to give back who knows how much money because it was like their big event in Vegas and the pay-per-view fucked up.

So Dana bought it yet at this point? It was the Zufa, which was the Fertitta Brothers and Dana. They're the organization that bought it. So the Fertitta Brothers bought it and then Dana was running it and this was the Fertitta Brothers and Dana. Okay. They're the organization that bought it. So the Fertitta Brothers bought it. Right. And then Dana was running it. And this was the very early stages. And this was, you know, there was no TV to speak of that was showing the UFC. They had to get this deal on Spike TV to put it on television. Right, right, right.

That was like years in. So this is like 2005. Okay. So we're like four years later. These guys are hemorrhaging money trying to make this thing happen yeah and uh when when when that was going on nobody took it seriously like everybody thought it was just like isn't that when they came up with the idea of ultimate fighter is that kind of maybe what exactly they paid for everything they paid to put the show on they i think they

even bought out the ads and they took care of the whole thing they put it on television it was like a hail mary and it was a fucking touchdown wow and stephan bonner uh rest in peace he just died and forrest griffin had the most insane fight in the finals of the ultimate fighter wow and people were just calling friends up you gotta watch this this is insane because the viewership skyrockets during the fight yeah sure because it's so wild right and that fight made the ufc that fight made the sport really because then people are like what is this okay then they put on another event yeah and the other event got fucking huge and then chuck liddell came out to the yes, and when Chuck Liddell was the champion Chuck Liddell was so Fucking terrifying yeah, he was this do-or-die

Berserker he would just come at you just swinging bombs take one on the chin knock dudes out his fights were Wild he didn't give a shit He was the the real reason why the UFC became uber popular because you would watch the ultimate fighter it was a wild fight a great fight but then you need a destroyer right you need a destroyer and that destroyer was Chuck Liddell and for the run where he was at the top where Chuck Liddell was just murking people so he was kind of like the Michael Jordan in that he basically took it well the sport to another level well you know he know, he was an exceptional champion. Okay. But I wouldn't say he was the Michael Jordan. Okay, fair enough. He had the

most fan-friendly style you could ever imagine. He would just come after dudes and smash people. He was never trying to win decisions. Chuck Liddell was trying to send you into the dream world. Okay. So he was an entertainer. He was Maximus the... Yes. When he he was very he was maximus the uh yes he was when

he would win he would throw his arms back like this it was crazy see if you get see if you get a video of chuckledale knocking someone out and then celebrating because it was like this iconic primal rage celebration and when you know you can only fight like that for so long sure here's the reality take the toll of physical damage on the body and the kind of sparring that you have to do to fight like that Yeah, but when he did it my god It was glorious his fights when he when he knocked out Tito Ortiz like oh my god. He was a monster, right? He was a monster. Yeah, he was just smashing people and he was a really good wrestler too. So good luck taking him down Wow Yeah, so this is I mean this is Chuck with a fucking mohawk He was just smashing people. And he was a really good wrestler, too. So good luck taking him down. Wow. Yeah.

So this is Chuck with a fucking mohawk. I mean, look at this fucking savage, dude. Oh, my God. Look at this. Look at this. Look at this. Look at him. Look at the celebration. Bro, I'm telling you, when Chuck Liddell was in his prime,

he was one of the most terrifying fucking human beings that's ever walked the face of the earth. Wow. You can't do this for that long. There's only so many years a man can do this for like this. But my God, Chuck Liddell was so fucking entertaining. He was a destroyer, man. He would just come at you. I mean, look at this shit.

He's so terrifying looking. Tattoo on his head. Mohawk. Built like a brick shithouse just throwing fucking hammers. Who's the destroyer? Who's the up-and-coming destroyer today? Oh, did you see that Babalu knockout? Back that up again.

This one was insane. Oh, with the leg? Dude, he would do that to everybody. He was just smashing people. Wow. Yeah, he didn't know what defense is he's pure offense all the time he had defense but he didn't he just he fucking threw caution to the wind man the guy just came after people and he was so mean but that also made the ufc because that guy being at that was the figurehead that was the big guy

he was the the face of the company because he was the guy that like if you the casual fan when you talk to him like have you seen the chuck liddell fight right you're gonna see the chuck liddell fight yeah so that like that that also took the sport to the next level so from throwing newspapers to stand-up to pool to new york then hollywood ufc interviews when what what motivated for podcast you were so far ahead of your time on that Well, I wasn't really there was other people that were doing at the same time They like Adam Carolla already had a podcast mark Marin already had a podcast There's quite a few people that were maybe your style just just stuck in group. Well, it's just um, I think I Got into it because of radio really okay

doing like opiate anthony show mostly okay when you do you do radio for a while then oh yeah everybody did and when you would do radio in the morning like you the opiate anthony show in particular you'd go there and you would hang out with comics so it was all just us shooting the shit having a great time yeah and when i would leave there, I'd go, God, that's so fun. I love doing that. I wish I could do that all the time. Okay, all right. And Anthony Cumia, who was Anthony from Opie and Anthony, he built a studio in his basement of his house in Long Island.

And he used to do a show called Live from the Compound. And he had, like, a green screen behind him. He'd play karaoke with a machine gun. He was always hammered. It was hilarious, but he would just stream it on the internet and i was like that looks like so much fun maybe i should start doing something like that yeah and so then i went to tom green's house and tom green uh he had this crazy setup i might have went to tom green's house before anthony had his thing in the same time yeah but tom green had like the tom green show that he was doing from his house right so he's's doing a talk show and he set up his whole house like a television studio. That's on the internet

so we have all these cables running to a server excuse me a server room and So I thought like wow maybe I should do something like that like I got it like there's something to Doing something on the internet like maybe a lot of people aren't gonna see it, but it'll be fun something to doing something on the internet like maybe a lot of people aren't going to see it but it'll be fun yeah sounds like your motivator was for fun not trying to grow some big audience or make a bunch of money at least to start with i mean even like i do it the exact same way now as i've always done it i just do it all myself like in terms of like who i want to have on i decide what day they're coming on and how to do it yeah and i And I only talk to people that I'm interested in talking to. I mean, the depth of what, like, you could have, like, your own Rogan encyclopedia books,

but all these people that come on that a lot of people never heard of and have all these interesting facts and opinions and I find it fascinating. You definitely could learn some stuff. You know, you definitely, I mean, you could talk to some, I've had this, like, unexpected education where I get to talk to all these fascinating people and pick their brain. Yeah. And, you know, it's like you don't really get a chance to talk to people just like this. Right.

Just you and me looking at each other eye to eye, no phones, no people around. Right. Just for a conversation. That's it. That's all we're trying to do. And to be able to do this like all the time, it just, it's a real pleasure. It's like very, it's very real pleasure it's like very it's very fortunate it just seems like it's your own your own personal curiosity on different things that you like and

or that you're interested in whereas it seems like you know you flip on tv the people are getting interviewed it's all part of some sort of a it's all by design to some degree you know you got the right pr firm the right publicist there's also with those things the problem is you know just like with uh Factor. You have to hire somebody. You have to hire a host. Okay, yeah. So if it's Fox News or if it's CNN, they have to hire hosts.

Right. And sometimes those people are annoying. And sometimes they're not annoying when you hire them. And then they become annoying as they get more popular and famous. And then you've got to fire them. So when you do this, do you have to prep much? You get on the internet? You guys do a little bit of research for you.

Or you just fucking roll in and just start thinking and talking. Well, I do have a guy, my friend Matt Staggs, who does some research for me on some things. He'll send me some briefings or some videos or some stuff I should watch. Right. And then with people that have books, I like to, especially if it's something complicated, I like to listen to the book on audio. Yeah. So I'll listen in the sauna.

I'll listen when I'm driving. I'll get a sense of what they're doing. And then there's some subjects that I don't have. Like with you, it's like we're going to talk cars. Yeah, yeah. I'm just curious. Well, it's just been very fascinating for me. I mean, we've known each other for a couple,

ever since you got to Texas two and a half years ago, something like that. Just the more I get to know you, you ruin me with that fucking raptor well yeah that's what we do right keep them coming back right that thing ruined me i was like this is crazy yeah what have you done yeah yeah have you by the way on uh have you experienced the raptor r yet i have not it looks amazing though i'm a ford fan expensive uh but we we're working on a thousand horsepower package for Velociraptor 1000, so it would compete

with the Mammoth. Well, maybe we'll have to. Yeah. I'll keep you posted on that. You know what I really miss about the Raptor? Yeah. The visibility. Yeah.

It's way, you can see out of the side mirrors way better. Yeah. The TRX is rough. The TRX is rough. The Ford's got the aluminum body and chassis. I mean, I think both trucks are a hoot. Oh, no. I love the TRX the trx it's just

the visibility that's the only issue i have with it it's an amazing truck yeah i fucking love it yeah i love what dodge did and i really love what you did too what dodge did like the extra power and they gave us a good platform and the brake upgrade package that you put on it yeah it's a big difference big difference it's it's fucking magical i love that thing but the visibility from the raptor was way better yeah yeah i mean design with the f-150 where they have it is there it is yeah yeah and so that's got the supercharged 5.2 liter v8 that's in the gt500 and we should have our prototype up and running soon i'll like the name better too yeah i have a problem with the name mammoth okay. I love the truck, but I got a problem. Tell me. Because it

used to be a Tyrannosaurus Rex and you changed it into a lesser animal. Yeah, I guess a T-Rex could eat a woolly mammoth. I never thought about that. I wish we talked. Guess what? Next time we're doing a branding exercise, you'll be the

consultant that I could never afford to hire you can't well I'll just do it for free but you can't have like a like a dinosaur yeah like the whole reason

why it's a TRX is because it kills the raptor right of little bitch ass velociraptors fucking with the Tyrannosaurus Rex it's over so that's the whole idea

and then you turn it into like something that like people kill with sticks yeah so so what so what people let them out with sticks yeah pretty much yeah it's funny and then probably the asteroid did it yeah but yeah so i but other than that i love it i told you i saw one in vegas yeah it was

orange like a matte orange like oh that looks like orange yeah i never thought i wanted to drive an orange car in my life until i saw that they're're hard to get, but we can get them. They got yellow now, too. Do they have yellow? Yeah, yeah. Called Rampage Yellow. My friend Tony has a yellow C8 Corvette. Tony Hanchcliffe?

Yeah. You saw Tony. Sure. He has one with yellow with black stripes. It's fucking awesome. Yeah. I was like, I never thought I'd like a yellow car. Yeah, we actually just came out with a 700 horsepower supercharged package for the C8s.

We've only been working on it for almost three years, but just finished it up a few months ago. How much better is the handling on the Z06 with the wider body and the wider tires? Yeah, I mean, the Z06 is lighter. It's got aero, carbon brakes, carbon wheels are options. I've only driven it. So our chief development driver was with GM for 38 years. His name is John Heinrasey. We call him Heinrocket.

He's our chief engineer and development driver for the Venom F5. And so he just got his new Z06, C8 Z06, with the Z07 package. So you've got the cup tube, Michelin tires, and the carbon splitter and rear wing. I just drove it on the road, but I think if you took him to Kota, both

bone stock, I'm guessing your 10, 12 seconds a lap difference. I mean, just massive. Now, if you drag race, I mean, of course, the Z06 is going to win by, you know, in the quarter mile would probably win by five or six car lengths. But the problem with the Z06 now is they've been having supply chain issues. I've got an early one on order, but I think the car's been out for nine months, and there's less than 100 with the Z07 package on the road.

So, cool car. I hope to get mine and a lot of bang for the buck. I almost liken the new C8 Corvette almost in any form. Well, the Z06 to kind of like the 458 Ferrari is kind of where it was. Do you think it's possible to make a car like a Corvette with entirely American parts and American labor. Entirely. Look, American OEMs can do whatever they want to do. I think what Chevrolet's magic has been with the Corvette is to deliver that much value and that nice of a car in the volumes that they do and at the price point that they do.

It's crazy. When you think about how much that car costs and the capability of it, just the bone stock Stingray. Yeah. I mean, I'm sure the... So the Z06 is out now. Likely the next iteration that comes from Chevy is the ZR1, probably 850 horsepower, twin turbo. So it's like a twin turbo version of the 5.5 liter dual overhead cam motor in this current

Z06. That car is going to be 150, 170 grand. So that car will be as fast or faster than a McLaren or Ferrari that costs two or three times the money. So their trick is they know how to deliver great value. Now, we've got a neat niche where we can build our own car from the ground up. It's all carbon fiber. It's all completely bespoke.

It's American design and American build. But that car is two to three million bucks a pop. GM are the masters of being able to scale it in masses so average people or somewhat average working folks can afford to buy them. Yeah. When you're in that car, you're like, what does this cost? Yeah. This car's ridiculous.

Well, the sticker on them, like my friend Hein Rockets, I think he paid 160. You try to find one on the street that you can buy. You mean a 06? A 06. I was talking about the Venom. Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah, yeah. You get in that thing, you're like, how much is this car?

Yeah, yeah. But look, the Venom F5, what's cool about that is I'm 60. Maybe I'm around another 25 years. Maybe I'm not. I don't know. But I think I would like to see, you know, I'd like to have ultimately when we're all done with production, I'd love for each one of my five kids to have one if I'm able to do that. Anyway, I'd love to see, you know, our grandkids sell it at, you know, Barrett Jacks or RM Auctions at some point down

the road for, you know, four or five X, you know, maybe like a McLaren F1, like it'd be $20 million someday. I respect that you can drive that on the street. I respect that you can drive it, but you really should drive that only on a track. I mean's like yeah when you're in it you're like yeah yeah we even like when we're driving like we you know driving if you still have your test supply i drove mine up here you know the performance that the thing's capable of you you you should not use on the street you know sometimes there might be a place where you know you could go out and just have fun with yourself or your buddy but uh but yeah same thing i mean the f5 you know go out and just have fun with yourself or your buddy. But, yeah, same thing. I mean, the F5, you know, go – forget about 0 to 60.

0 to 60 is a metric from 60 years ago. Let's talk about 0 to 200. It'll go 0 to 200 miles an hour in 10 seconds. A hair under 10 seconds. It's as fast as or maybe a tiny bit faster from 0 to 200 miles an hour as compared to a modern Formula 1 car. Jesus Christ. Yeah, power to weight ratio-wise. But it's built in America. You know, our guys just 100 miles down the road build them from here. as compared to a modern Formula One car. Jesus Christ. Yeah, power to weight ratio wise.

But it's built in America. Our guys just 100 miles down the road build them from here. And I think they'll be very collectible someday. So we'll see. How many are you gonna make? So we built 24 VINEMA 5 coupes. Those are all sold out.

We're now producing the Roadster and the Revolution. The Roadster, open top, go out on a sunny day, have fun. The Revolution is more track-focused. Now, it's like our GT3 RS. It's a track-focused car, but it's still road-legal, has AC and all the comforts that you would have as an Apple CarPlay. More track-focused than that car? No, that is the track-focused version.

Yeah, no, no. If we, no. I'm like, how? Yeah, so we're doing 24 of those. So we're going to build all in about less than 100 cars, 99 cars. I think right now we're, like I said, 36, 37 orders. And anyway, the cars- How long does it take you to build one of those?

12 to 15 months. And is it, how much of it is carbon fiber? Like- 100%. 100%. Yeah, I mean, all the body work, all the chassis is all carbon. Everything. Yeah, there's some aluminum and some steel substructure,

but everything's carbon. Wow. Yeah, there it is. That's the roadster. That particular, the blue car, belongs to a guy named Dave Linegar. You want to talk about a wild man. Let me see what the side image looks like, what it looks like with the roadster.

Wow, that's pretty. Yeah, Linegar found a Rem looks like with the roadster. Wow, that's pretty. Yeah, Lineker founded Remax Real Estate way back when. Anyway, that's his car. That's my head of design, Nathan Malinik. But, you know, this is one of these deals to where if I knew today, or if I knew back then what I knew today, I don't know if I would have done it. Maybe I'm a little bit like you walking into the dojo. You ever see those gifts?

How pretty that is. You ever see the gifts where the guys have the telephone pole and they're busting somebody in the balls with it? Uh-huh. You know, I think that, and I didn't know what I was biting off when I went down this road, but when I started in 2013,

it was just kind of an idea and a sketch, and then I got interested in it, and then we built the design model. Shell helped us build a design model. We unveiled it at SEMA in Vegas in 2017, and then I had orders, and I'm like, now I've got orders. I've got a design, but We unveiled it at SEMA in Vegas in 2017. And then I had orders. And I'm like, now I've got orders. I've got a design, but I've got to engineer this thing.

Dude, that thing looks so good. It's such a beautiful car. That Roadster one, that blue one. Yeah. Oh, my God. That's so beautiful. Well, and the sound. What did you think of the sound when we're just out here ripping down the road?

It's very raw. Yeah, it's very raw. So it's that 6.6 liter twin turbo V8, pushrod V8. We've nicknamed the engine Fury. So ask me why we named the engine Fury. Why? No journalist has ever asked me this question in the automotive world. So we named it Fury because the car is designed to compete against the best from Europe.

So Bugatti, Aston Martin, Ferrari, Gordon Murray. And so one time like we're developing the engine and I think we had, our target was 1600 horsepower. We managed to get a little over 1800 and I'm watching reruns on TV with my wife, my wife's asleep. It was a Brad Pitt movie, Fury. So it's those scrappy tank guys. They're over in Germany and their tanks all busted down. And then here comes two or 300 Germans and they basically fought him to the death, you know, like scrappy Americans that they were. So I thought, I'm going to fucking name my engine Fury because it's designed to go over and fucking beat the Germans. Scrappy American.

We'll see. We haven't done it yet, but we're working on it. I love it. Yeah. So is that a car that you could enter into races? Like, would you consider racing that thing? So we've had customers ask us, would we be interested in building a dedicated race car? And it's something we haven't made a decision on, but the answer I lean towards, you know, generally, you want to build a faster car?

Well, hell yeah. If somebody wants to buy it, I'll build it. But then the question becomes, we have to kind of go two directions. Do we want to just build a fun, like something taking the circuit of the Americas that our customer can do out and have fun with? Or do you want to conform to race series? All of a sudden, if you're in race series, if you're in Le Mans, you know, something, a world endurance championship, you have to conform to all kinds of rules. I'm not a big rule guy. I'd rather just kind of build my car, do I kick ass. But I think, I kick ass. But I think there is probably some demand to have a dedicated track car where you've got a full road cage, all the safety equipment, the Halon fire extinguishing

system, and everything else that you would expect. But right now, I mean, like I said, we're building, the coupes are sold out. We're completing the remaining run on those. Yeah, there's a revolution right there. Yeah, that belongs to a guy. We actually went to the same Jesuit high school back in the late 70s. He was a senior, and I was a freshman. And we never knew each other, but when he ordered the car, I found out he was from Kansas City and went to Rockhurst. And he has his own private test track just up outside of Kansas City.

Yeah, you're just driving through the country, and you see this fence with like you know privacy and on the other side of it's this gentleman's 3.4 mile private racetrack that we get to test that that's when you know you're really balling he's balling pretty good you get your own racetrack he's done all right oil and gas guy and smart guy and been a really really great client so i used to think that when i would watch top gear watch the yeah watch the Stig roll around the track, I'm like, they have their own track. Well, yeah.

So Top Gear tests on an old runway southwest of Lennon, and it's called Dunsfold. So they ran it, so they have their own. But I've been there before. I was actually, I brought Steven Tyler over there like 10 years ago to be interviewed by Jeremy Clarkson and those guys.

So he was a client. We built a Venom GT for him. And so we're hanging out. And I got to see him go out and do his little celebrity lap around the track. You know, if you're ever over there and you want to do a celebrity, the star in the reasonably priced car, I'd connect you with those guys. They're great. Oh, that's hilarious. Yeah, it's fun.

And so I think they're – but now you've got Chris Harris and you've got Clarkson and Hammond and May. They moved on to Amazon. Are they still doing it? They are. Yeah, I was in London a couple weeks ago and I saw Richard Hammond. What's the Amazon show called again? The Grand Tour. Right.

The Grand Tour. And so Clarkson started – Clarkson's kind of a wild, bombastic guy. He started a show about farming. He's got a farm out in the country. And I think that's really kind of taken off. So I think that's his new gig. But I think they still do a season a year. And good entertainment, good proper car stuff. Yeah, they're fun. He's a fun dude. Yeah. What did he punch a producer? They pulled the show? Well, I know a little bit about that. So we had a Velociraptor truck that we were up in Canada with these guys. So this

has been back into 2014. And so I'm working with the producers and they're like, when you're around the talent, don't talk to them, don't spend time around them. I'm like, I'm around famous people more than these guys. These guys are a lot more famous. I mean, I don't care that they're a big deal. So anyway, so the producer's kind of being a dick. And so we show up with these guys, and then we're like, provide the vehicle. And they're going to go cross-country through Canada and through the mountains and do all this crazy shit. And then they're going to go up on the mountain. They're going to rescue Richard Hammond, who's at the top of the mountain.

He's got one of these Breitling watches where you pull out the little cord and it tells the satellite that you're stranded. So it gives your coordinates to get rescued. Anyway, so now the producers are saying, well, you know, you can't go up on the mountain while they're filming. I'm like, okay, but listen to this. I'm going to go watch football. It's the playoffs.

I'm going to go watch football. And if something breaks and you need us to help you, we're not coming. They're like, oh, then they change their tune. Like, okay, we'll come with this and finally it all it all it all turns out fine well that producer i won't say his name but that producer that was being a massive dick and maybe he was just doing his job like two weeks later they're somewhere else and they're in england and jeremy may you know jeremy's gets a little bit of a temper and these guys work long hours and maybe they hadn't eaten and the producer guy was fucking with him and jeremy fucking whacked the guy and i'm like i wanted to fucking punch

that guy a couple times too but i can't do that and i don't want to get arrested in canada anyway yeah so they they canceled the show yeah and it didn't jeremy and him make up but they're still like uh you know i'm sure that's all you know know, water under the bridge. But Jeremy, so Jeremy, Richard Hammond and James May were all very tight. I've spent time around them. And then the other guy that's behind the scenes, but just so talented, his name is Andy Willman. He Steven was being interviewed by Jeremy, I noticed that the interview went on for like twice as long as it probably should have. And I don't, I get claustrophobic, so I don't like being in tight crowds. So I'm kind of hanging towards the back of the crowd that they're filming all this live and then they aired it later, but they're filming in front of a live audience. And here, this, this guy that looks like he's a homeless dude, wearing a t-shirt, looked like he hadn't showered in about a week. He's standing there making notes.

And I realized that was Andy Willman, the producer of the show. And so what Jeremy's doing, he's telling all these jokes and asking these questions. And Andy is using the live audience as his focus group. Oh, they laughed at this. Oh, I don't think this is as funny. And that's how they edit it before it gets transmitted to the rest of the UK and the world. Interesting. I thought, that is so clever.

That is so smart. It is smart. And I don't know if that's comedians or entertainers kind of. But you would think to some degree you want to improve your crap. But he's got a quick turnaround time. So he's got another show he's got to do the following week. So he's just like, Jeremy is doing all this stuff. And sometimes they laugh and sometimes they wouldn't.

But this guy was definitely paying attention. That show, Top Gear, did Tesla dirty. Yeah, they did. They did Tesla dirty. They did all kinds of crooked shit. But they did Tesla dirty. I mean, they pretended the car ran out of batteries. Oh, yeah.

The car didn't. So they had, like, they're pushing the car. And, you know, I think they had a lawsuit about that, correct? They probably did. But that goes back to, like to what we were talking about earlier. Find that out, Jamie. It just seems like... That was dirty.

It seems like everybody has an agenda. So what was the agenda behind that? Was that just the... Well, they wanted to create an entertaining storyline. They do. They'll throw your ass under the bus in a heartbeat. That was what it is. Yeah.

Oh, Tesla attempted to sue the BBC for libel in March of 2011. The courts ruled in favor of the BBC, saying that no viewer of the show would be likely to reasonably compare the Roaster's performance on the show with its performance in the real world. That doesn't make any sense. Yeah, no. They got railroaded. British court sides with British corporation that's owned by the British government against American company. Oops. Yeah, they got railroaded.

Yeah, they did. The idea that watching this thing break down wouldn't influence you to not get one. Yeah. These people are testing it and it breaks down. Look, those guys, good or bad... We should just say what happened. Yeah. While we're saying it. Because their car didn't really break down. Right. They faked it. No, they faked it.

And they did it just to sort of make a point about what could happen with electric cars, but it's a fake point. It was a manufactured deal, to your point. But they just want eyeballs. Well, they definitely did that. The more controversial, one time when Jeremy was driving this truck and they were like, what would happen if we ran into a brick wall?

He ended up going to the hospital and getting broken ribs and whatever else, just to shoot the video of this guy. So they'll do anything. Who ran into a brick wall? Jeremy Clarkson. He did? Yeah. With a truck?

It's on YouTube. And he went to the hospital? Yeah, they got a video camera. They got a GoPro inside. And he, I mean. He went to the hospital? Yeah, he went to the hospital from that. Why would you do that?

They did. And they, because of pretension, dude. These guys were the masters of jumping the shark season after season after season you heard about the deal

when they went to Argentina what deal let me see let's go one step at a time let me see the truck slamming

into the wall yeah before we get to Argentina yeah because I just can't believe that they would

just drive Clarkson top gear full acceleration truck crash no each guy had to do it

and they're all wearing their safety equipment it might have been 20 miles an hour i mean just just run as fast as you can into that wood wall over there and it's gonna fucking hurt you know so yeah i think you could legitimately you could die oh yeah oh it's one of these trucks yeah oh boy yeah look at this he's going pretty good bro he's going very fast that is so crazy so do you think these guys give a fuck about hurting elon and his company just to talk is so they want views oh my god i mean oh shit he's lucky he has teeth he's lucky he has a neck yeah like his neck's got to be fucked up from that yeah we did a thing with them a grand tour in detroit about five years ago and he you know maybe he's got a good chiropractor he looks like he healed up but man that that's pretty

gnarly that seems like it could cause permanent damage and so they would do stuff like that well and that even happened recently disc cause slip discs worst injury he suffered on the show another one another one of their guys and they're in the current crew, I forget his name, maybe Pato O'Rourke, but anyway, he had a bad car crash that canceled the whole season. Really? The rest of the season. Yeah, and again, nobody really knows the details, they're not showing anything,

but I hear it was pretty painful. Yeah, so. When you watch that image, he reaches for his neck, like, immediately, and you see how his head violently snaps. Yeah, I don't know how it doesn't break your neck. So just stuff like that. When we were in Canada with the crew,

we were hanging out with the crew, and so they went down to Canada. They weren't in Argentina. They went to Argentina, excuse me. The gummy bear's kicking in, I suppose. They're in Argentina, and so one of the cars, they rode on the car. They're doing this cross-country thing. They're kind of poking fun at the Argentinians when they lost the Falcon war back in the eighties to the Brits. And, and the story was that these,

these guys were getting chased out of the country. Like people were going to like looking for them. If they found them, they were going to fricking, you know, beat their ass pretty hard or worse. beat their ass pretty hard or worse. And so I'm talking to the crew and, um, you know, the, the presenters were able to get to Buenos Aires and were able to get out of the country, but the crew was still there. And people are like, they're calling the embassy. They're like, you know, what can we do? The fucking locals are trying to get us. And so I guess the present, this is the, again, this is what I'm hearing from the crew when we were in Canada with our Velociraptor is that the presenters got out. The crew were stuck fearing for their lives, like hiding out in places, trying to make it to the airport to get home. And then so when the whole shit hit the fan, the presenters in England felt bad for them.

So they bought them all first-class tickets business class for him from argentina back to the uk but then the question becomes kind of given the pattern of wanting to further jump the shark and look i'm a i'm a if i climb a mountain i want to i want to climb the next mountain so i get that to some degree but did these guys actually like try to stir up the locals by putting shit on their car to fuck with them? Of course they did. Yeah, just for notoriety. I mean, I would think so. 100%.

Why else would you do it? Because you're trying to be nice? Yeah. I don't know if they knew it was going to go as far, but it's kind of a shitty deal where they skated out of there. And their crew was literally afraid they were going to get fucking beat to death. I imagine they did. Yeah, yeah. And I'm hearing this from the crew,

and this auto had gone down like 30 days before. Jesus Christ. Yeah, yeah. It's kind of interesting, but, you know. Well, it's a wild show, but it's a fun show. It's a fun show. It's a fun show. They're irreverent, and they fuck with everybody,

and yeah, have they gone too far a few times? Sure. But I think they're, you they're just trying to entertain. Well, he does entertain. When Jeremy Clarkson reviews cars, when he's really enthusiastic about it, he's reviewed some Ferraris. That guy's word was like

it would either make you or break you. That was probably from 2005 to... Ferraro had about a 10 year period now you got Chris Harris who's friends with our mutual friend Matt Ferro in California

yeah I've had Chris on the podcast before he's great he's probably one of my favorites we had dinner with him in London a couple weeks ago just couldn't be any finer

yeah him and Matt are two of my favorites for reviewing cars yeah Smokey Tire's awesome yeah yeah yeah it's just car entertainment you know has sort of come a long way.

Right. There wasn't really that much back in the day. Right. I mean, what kind of, there was not really a show like, once Top Gear came around, then people realized how entertaining it is just to like see cars and hang out with cars. Yeah, right. Now, I think really one of the best of it is Jay Leno. Like, Jay Leno's garage is fantastic. It is great. It's very good. Yeah, right. Now, I think really one of the best of it is Jay Leno. Like, Jay Leno's garage is fantastic.

It is great. It's very good. Yeah, yeah. He loves cars so much that it's like, it's so contagious. I don't know anybody that knows more about cars from A to Z, from steam cars to hyper cars to race cars, everything in between. Jay Leno is literally a walking automotive encyclopedia.

Yeah, I don't understand the steam cars. Well, yeah. He's got ones that he drives around automotive encyclopedia. Yeah, I don't understand the steam cars. What are you doing? He's got ones that he drives around that aren't even supposed to have rubber tires, so he had to put rubber on these steel wheels so that it's legal to drive around. Did he ever tell you on a steam car, you're heating up this boiler

and the boiler's got water in it and that turns into steam and that's what makes it go. But when you run low on water, if you're not careful, it'll explode to so you have to turn off the heat and so so this came up because i was in jays one time and i saw one of his steam cars he's talking about i'm like what's the garden hose in the back seat for it's like well you know i'm over at uh driving through burbank and uh you know his his start running out of water so he's able to shut it down so the so the engine doesn't explode.

And he goes up and knocks on some little old lady's front door and says, you know, ma'am, can I hook my spigot up to your, my hose up to your spigot? I need to put some water in my steam car. Imagine Jay Leno showing up at your house. Oh, yeah. Wanting to borrow water. Right, yeah.

Yeah. That's some crazy shit. Yeah, he's got an insane collection. I can't even believe how big it is. When I was there, I thought it was just one of these buildings. Yeah. Oh, it's the whole block. He has 11 buildings like that.

Yeah. They're all kind of daisy-chained together. Yeah. It's incredible. And motorcycles, too. Yeah. Yeah. We did.

Jay's been a customer, gosh, almost 30 years. He had the first black gen one Viper. And so he wanted to do an exhaust and intake and a three 73 rear end gear. And so we're scheduled to go out there. And, and I just talked to him like on the phone one time and I only dealt with him. I didn't deal with any assistants or handlers. And so I just dealt with him on the phone the one time. And then I, my wife had our first child, we had a miscarriage and so I couldn't go. So I just dealt with him on the phone the one time, and then my wife had our first child. We had a miscarriage, and so I couldn't go, so I just had somebody call out there to his office,

say, John can't make it. He didn't give me any reason, and dude, like two days later, flowers and a card showed up to our house, and to this day, I do not know how Jay knew that we had a miscarriage or even knew my home address, but somehow he found out and sent flowers. We've been friends ever since. That's yeah that's a special dude for sure super passionate

super influential you know another thing i learned from jay that's cool so whether it's a 2.7 million dollar venom of fiber evolution or one of our you know velociraptor mammoth trucks whenever i'm out in public with one of our vehicles or if i'm in like a cars and coffee car show jay taught me that I said what got you into cars Jay well when he was 12 years old there was like maybe a 55 Jag parked out in front of a store and he was admiring

it and the guy came up to the car and says hey kid you like the car and he says yeah and the owner said would you like to sit in it and so I've seen Jay at a bunch of car shows so if you're somewhere south of 12 years old and you ask him nicely he'll let you sit in his car so we do the same thing

and so when they kind of start queuing up and I get the 14 year old I'm like no no no he goes to those cars and coffee stores he takes all kinds of shows so when Jay was doing tonight's show that's when I met him and we did several projects for him he'd have it

come out to the show but he was always so busy like i would just like see him in passing and he's so like high functioning adhd um dyslexic which my son cole is too just like his brain just moves at a million miles a minute so like a sam hey jay how you doing blah blah blah in and out in and out get in his next car and go. But then when he retired from The Tonight Show, a whole different Jay. Just like you could have a conversation with him. He wasn't thinking about all the shit he had to do. And he's so much better at that show because it's so much what he's actually interested in instead of just the job of hosting The Tonight Show. And the mistake that I made growing up is like he would do comedy on would tell com do comedy on you know in the tonight show well we always thought it was funny we would watch it

but then years later maybe 10 years ago i got to hear him do stand-up and i'm like it's so much more edgy you know my wife will only handle so much like if you get it it's like a certain level of crude she won't go so i have to go by myself. So he's like right there on the edge of certain ones. Jay Leno's on the edge? Really? Oh, dude. I thought so. So Shell had a big launch for a new oil product about 10 years ago when we were there.

And he's like a fucking machine gun, dude. Like you get about, so in that 45-minute set, you get at least an hour and a half worth of material. It is just coming fucking rapid fire. That's interesting. I gotta go see him live then because I haven't seen him live in a long time. I don't know where he's working out

or if he just does big shows. I don't know. Because he used to do Comedy Magic Club every Sunday. I see his stuff pops up on my social media feeds like when he's around in the area. So he does shows. But it would

to your point, reach out to him or I'll give you his number and you reach out to him and have him come do the mothership. Yeah, for sure. He used to be really respected as like an edgy comic when he first started. In the 1970s like when he would do,

like I guess it was the early 80s or late 70s, we'd do Letterman. I used to watch him on Letterman. He'd wear like a black leather jacket. What year was that? This would have been probably mid 80s, 84, 85. And they used to do a little gag called, Jay, what's your beef?

Eh, what's my beef? Kind of a grumpy old man program. But yeah, I always thought Jay was pretty good. You know, I was a big – I loved Carson when Carson was on back in the day, too. So you just kind of go from one to the next. But I'm like, you know, some of the current stuff, you've got Gutfeld who's funny as shit, but the other guys are just – It's a hard gig, man. Yeah. Because you have – there's so many restrictions.

Like, first of all, you're talking to someone very quickly. Yeah. If you're going to talk to them about something complex, something that's difficult to grasp. That's why the Plumform podcast works, right? 100%. Okay. Because if you're just talking to someone and you're talking to them for five minutes and then you're going to commercial, it's like you can only get so into the subject. Yeah.

And some subjects deserve more attention. They deserve time. And you really can't do it on those shows. And then also you're censored. Right. So you can't say certain words. You can't speak your mind. You'll have a producer in your ear telling you what to do. And then on top of that, you have these commercials. You have to wait for the commercial. Then you've got to build momentum back up when you're back. All right, we're back. You know, like, why are we back? Like, what is this? Like, it's the worst way to have conversations. And that's essentially what those things are. Right. What those things are is just, it's like short attention span, quick soundbite conversations that are not satisfying. Right.

That's the problem. Yeah. To get a satisfying conversation, you need to talk to someone for a long time. Okay. And so they're crippled. Right. It's like they're handicapped by the system that they exist in. Okay.

There's nothing you can do to fix it. I don't know, man, but it just is, was it that much different from when Carson and Lena were doing it? I mean. Yes, because there's podcasts. Today's a lot worse. Well, there's podcasts now. Oh, so they have competition.

No. There was nothing else to watch back then. Now people see it. This is what it is. It's like they see the difference. Because if all the only conversations you see with people having on television are on things like The Tonight Show, then that seems normal. Yeah. But as soon as you can have long form, full, uncensored conversations.

Deep dive and pack it all. Yeah. Okay. That's when it becomes awkward. Because then you're like, why are they doing it like this? Interesting. This is an uncomfortable way to watch people talk. And also like someone sitting there and you're sitting next to him in this weird way and you're facing a crowd.

You've got a live audience. It's all weird. There's so much weirdness to it. That's funny. It's just not a good way to have a good conversation. Right. You know, and all it was really was an advertisement for whatever the fuck that person was selling okay so if this is a book or whatever sitcom a new record yeah movie yeah

that's really what it is yeah it's not you know and Jay Leno didn't get a chance to pick the guests like he wasn't like up to him you know well he did tell me uh this is we work with him on a project a couple years ago we're just sitting in a truck bullshitting. And I kind of asked him, I said, so since you don't do the Tonight Show, do you miss any of that at all? He's like, no, not really. He's like, I wasn't really big on going to movies. So if somebody's coming on the show, I'd go watch the movie just so I knew what to talk about. He's like, I'm really not into celebrities and I don't go to the movies that much.

I do my car thing. I'm really not into celebrities, and I don't go to the movies that much. I do my car thing, you know? Well, for Jay Leno and for all those comedians that lived back then, the Tonight Show was the holy grail. Oh, for sure. It was to be the host of the Tonight Show, the host of the Letterman Show, the host of some late night show. That was the holy grail.

So they all wanted that. And so when you get it and you realize like oh is this really what i wanted it just was it's it was a thing that it seemed like no one could get right and back then if you got it was a big deal sure and if you were the host of the tonight show was a big deal right and nowadays it's like it's just another show right you know it's just another thing that's on television they gotta compete with you well they're not even competing it's like they're competing with netflix really okay they're competing with things but if they for conversations yeah they're competing well bill maher is a podcast now there's a lot of great

podcasters if you want just free entertainment in your ears you could there's so much there's so many different crime shows and so many different stand-up comedians have podcasts and so many scientists and right fuck man i mean you comedians have podcasts and so many scientists. Right. Fuck, man. I mean, you could just be entertained forever. So breaking into that is hard. Right.

And when you're on a television show, you're kind of depending upon people flipping through the channels. Or people that are accustomed to watching it at 11 p.m., let's turn on the late night show. Right. You know? Huh. It's kind of a trap, though. It is. It's a trap. I had. Right. You know? Huh. It's kind of a trap, though. It is. It's a trap.

I had no idea. They don't grow. It's like they're very, they're like the viewership of those things just keeps dwindling. So where, like, the young comedians, where do they, so, you didn't get your big break

by going on Lena, or going on Carson or something like that, but, like, you found the right manager. It's like for a young comedian that's trying to get going, how do they get discovered today? Oh, the YouTube. Okay. YouTube, internet, social media.

Someone could be funny and have one clip about one subject that resonates with people, and they throw it up on their Instagram, and then it gets reposted and shared. They put it up on Twitter, it's on YouTube, and then bam, all of a sudden they're famous. It happens all the time now. This is a great time for people to get their stuff out there. Probably the greatest time ever.

So if you've got talent, you can't keep it down. Yeah, it's hard. At least people know about it. I mean, there's definitely some people that get better breaks than other people. That definitely happens. But at the end of the day, really, it's about becoming undeniable. And if you can just put your stuff out there, enough people love it yeah so that's where they get their big break today well you know um back in my day i got on um uh the mtv half hour comedy hour that was

like the first television show that i did where i got attention from it and then i got a development deal so that was like the pathway back then it was like you would do a stand-up comedy tv show and then you try to get a sitcom and everybody just wanted a sitcom or they wanted to host the tonight show or host the jimmy kimmel show or whatever get your own show but there wasn't a lot of those did you ever do it do you i mean you did fear factor but do you ever host like a show like where you're interviewing people or i did uh i guest hosted once uh later with greg kinnear he was out of town yeah and i okay. And I guest hosted it.

Okay, okay. It was fun. I enjoyed it. But it's still very limited. It's just not the same thing. Yeah. It's like doing this is like the perfect version of conversations for me. Some people like it more restricted and they want to be wearing a suit.

They want the lights and they want the crowd and they feel like it's more of a show. Sure. I get it. There's all kinds of different things that people like. But for me, this is the most fun way to be wearing a suit. They want the lights and they want the crowd and they feel like it's more of a show. Sure. I get it. There's all kinds of different things that people like, but for me, this is the most fun way to do it. Yeah. How's that gummy bear treating you? He looks a little faded.

I'm buzzing pretty good. He looks a little faded, fella. Yeah. Doesn't he? I can smell it. I can smell you went to the dark lands. I brought my son. He can drive me home.

Good. No autopilot for me tonight. Yeah, none of that. That's funny. That's Ric Flair. Good. No autopilot for me tonight. Yeah, none of that. That's funny. That's Ric Flair. Woo! Woo! Woo-choos.

Texas has got to get its shit together with weed. It's weird that some weed is legal. I think it will. That weed is legal. Like Delta 9 is legal. I've got a quick weed story for you. So this ties into Cold Plunge. So I got diagnosed as ADHD back in the late 90s.

I'd been married for a while, and we're having trouble. My counselor gives me this book and says, answer these 100 questions, and if you're more than 80 of them, then you're ADHD. I was 98 out of 100. So I started taking Ritalin, okay? And I've been taking Ritalin for almost 25 years. So fast forward to a couple months ago, I go to my doctor, to the clinic, to go get my prescription refill because it's a controlled substance like Adderall or opioids or whatever else. And look, for me, it just wakes me up in the morning. I don't drink coffee.

And it kind of helps me stay focused on the stuff I've got to do and better follow through and focus. And so I go in and the nurse says, well, we have a new policy at the clinic. In order to get a refill for Ritalin or any other controlled substance, we have to drug test you. And I said, okay, all right, whatever. Once a year. And so I started filling out some paperwork.

I'm like, she's like, okay, well, tell me now when you want to go pee in the cup. And I said, you're going to drug test me now? I said I said I'm 60 years old I've never been drug tested in my life and it just pissed me off I'm like I'm paying money to be here I just want my Ritalin so I stopped taking it and so like for 30 days I'm kind of like oh man I got a little less energy a little less focus well then I've been watching you and other other friends cold plunging are you allowed to just get off of Ritalin like that? Can you just cold turkey it? You're not supposed to cold turkey it, but I did.

Were you on a fairly low dose? Yeah, I was 20 milligrams in the morning, 10 in the afternoon, but I normally didn't take the afternoon. But here's what I found. For the 30 days following, it wasn't that hard of a real transition. I was just a little more lethargic and needed to get to the gym more. But what I learned was is that my level of aggression with my kids, my wife, my employees was ratcheted down by probably 20%.

From the cold? Or from the Ritalin? So this me stopped taking Ritalin. Okay. And my resting heart rate was lower. And so I thought, what can I do? So Ritalin was just jacking you up. It was jacking me up.

But it had been jacking me up for 25 years. And then friction, I would have it with employees. I would want to get into tussles on just stupid shit. And so this recent revelation is the clinic wanting to drug test me so I could get my Ritalin refill. Me not taking the Ritalin, I believe, my wife and kids at least tell me this, a few employees, that I'm just, you know, I don't have to take gummy bears to calm down at times. Right. I'll take a gummy bear sometimes to go to sleep. But then I thought, okay, well, what can help kind of replace, kind of give me that kick in the ass in the morning. So kind of wake me up and get me going.

And I'll go, I'll go do an early workout, a boxing workout a couple of times a week. But I'm like, I need something else. I've been seeing you and other people doing the cold plunge program. And that's like, and I had done it a few times before I got off the Ritalin, but I thought like, okay, the last time I did that, that like gave me like this boost of focus, like this mental focus and more calm through the day. So I bought a cold plunge tank and I got it about three weeks ago and cold plunge maybe five days a week in the morning.

And I don't know, maybe it's just because it's a combination of it's something that I really don't want to do and it's really hard to do. And when I say that to myself, I'm like, that's the very reason I need to go do it. And then secondarily, just like it shocks my system and all of a sudden it just wakes me up. So I'm like, you know, so if you're listening out there and you're on Ritalin, your kid's on Ritalin, you know, I'm not a doctor. I'm not telling you what to do. But I am saying that I got off of Ritalin and now I can kind of backfill that boost energy in the morning by doing a cold plunge. That's interesting that you were on it for 25 years and you're able to get off of it in 30 days. Yeah.

What did that transition feel like? Because I would imagine that you'd kind of become dependent on the feeling that you get from that. So I would run out from time to time. I never felt dependent on it, but I did feel lower energy, especially probably the last 10 years. As I've gotten older, I'm like, okay. You know, I've never really been a morning person. I used to, like, up until maybe 10 years ago, I wouldn't go to bed until 2 or 3 in the morning, and then I'd wake up at 7 or 8 the next day.

But anyway, so Ritalin just kind of gets me going, helps me focus, stay on task. But it probably starts wearing off kind of by mid-afternoon, but I just didn't. The thing about that kind of stuff to me is if you can function as good as you're functioning without it, I wonder, because we think of medications as being necessary. Yeah. We think of things like that as being necessary. Like this is what you need. It'll straighten you out. Is it? I mean, is what we're missing, at least with some people, is what they're missing, physical activity and stressors, things like cold and heat and things like a morning workout. How many people are just going to a pill and not doing those other things

to see if like, maybe there's a more healthy way to approach this. Yeah. I mean, I mean just how much, you know, how much time like do I waste just glancing at my phone? Who texted me? What's on the news? What about pool cues? Whatever, you know? And so one of the things I noticed when we first installed it, maybe it was the first or second time that I cold plunge at home. Like I was kind of had this euphoria. I don't know if it's kind of a little bit of a dump of endorphins or dopamine or what, but just kind of me being happy.

I didn't one time wonder where's my phone, what's going on. And my counselor tells me that just by looking at our phone, sometimes that gives us a tiny little dopamine hit. Yeah, it does. Look at the phone. It's also just an addiction. You're just looking for new information constantly you're always looking for some new picture or no new new video new thing to like stimulate you so that's why i found the cold plunge kind of just for for a period of time i'm like it's like i was just it

was calm it was like zen it's like me being up in the mountains looking at the trees and just kind of being a peaceful moment without having to you know know, take a Ric Flair gummy bear. What definitely makes you so happy when you get out of it. Yeah. When you get out of it like, whoo. I'm happy just because I'm not freezing my balls off anymore. Yeah, it's that. But it's really just the rush of endorphins.

You feel so happy. Yeah, that's true. You ignore epinephrine. Our family's doing it. My wife did it. My daughter comes over and does it. Son's real athletic. He's got two scoped knees.

And so he thought he tweaked his knee playing pickleball the other day. And he did it and said no more pain. So, I mean, you as an athlete, I mean, and still probably training pretty hard, do you find like when your body's getting a little worn or your joints are a little sore, does a cold punch help you too? I do it every day, so I don't know. Okay. I mean, I still have joint pain. Okay. I still have like some stuff.

But that's just what comes with the territory. Yeah, it is what it is. You just get accustomed to being in some sort of pain most of the time. Right. Okay. Especially jujitsu. Jujitsu training, you're always hurt. There's always something going on.

What do you still carry to this day that you got hurt doing back in the day? Oh, I've had a bunch of surgeries. I've had my knees reconstructed, both my knees reconstructed. It's a lot of it is joint stuff and back stuff. Everybody that I know that does jujitsu has some sort of a back issue or a neck issue. So does weed or hallucinogens, does that help any?

Is it more for your mind stimulation or relaxation or does it help with any of your injuries? I think, well, I don't know if it helps with injuries. It definitely reduces inflammation. But there's a good argument that maybe inflammation is good for some injuries. Oh, really? Yeah, because it's how the body is healing from it. Okay.

Like there's a – Unless it's your arteries. What's that? Unless you've got inflammation in your arteries. Yeah, that's not good. But inflammation from injuries. Got it. So there's like two schools of thought.

One school of thought is you should ice things immediately and calm down the inflammation. And the other school of thought is really what you need is heat and motion. And you need to kind of like let the body do its normal process. And there's a reason why it's inflamed following an injury. It's sending a lot of blood to that area. It's trying to fix it. I don't know. I'm not smart enough. I've heard from very smart people, both things you should do. I've heard you should ice things and I've heard you should never ice things. I don't know

what to say about that, but I do know that it does inhibit your growth and gains if you do it post lifting. So like if you lift weights and then you jump into the cold right afterwards, the reduction of inflammation actually equals less growth. So you get less what they call hypertrophy. Did you talk about some guy that was doing cold plunges before his morning workout? That's what I do. That was boosting testosterone? Yes, we read about that. There was a guy that he got, he had some sort of a test that showed that he might have cancer. And they wanted to put him on certain medications. And he said, I want to try doing a ketogenic diet and doing the cold plunge every day. And so this guy shifted his diet and went to doing a cold plunge every day before his workouts and his testosterone rocketed.

All of his problems went away. He started feeling way healthier. But I think sometimes people need like a little bit of a wake up call just to kind of straighten up your diet. And maybe it doesn't need to be keto, but maybe the benefit wasn't really from him doing keto, which may have been a benefit,

but it also might have been when you're doing keto, you're not eating any bullshit. Like you can't eat potato chips. You can't like drink soda. You only get a certain amount of carbs per day. So you're trying to get your body into this state where it's just burning fat. And just by doing that, you're eliminating bullshit. And that's probably what's fucking with people

more than anything. It's just bad food. Do you cook your own food? Do you have somebody? Yeah, I cook my own food. Yeah, I cook a lot. What, um, wow's just bad food. Do you cook your own food? Do you have somebody? Yeah, I cook my own food. Yeah, I cook a lot. What, um, wow, gummy bear moment. Gummy bears are your friends, but sometimes they fuck you.

They leave you searching for your thoughts. Yeah. No, I love cooking. I really do. I love cooking meat, you know, especially like game meat, like wild game. Yeah, I see your Instagram with some of that elk stuff. Looks like, man, I'll be right over. I love love it i love cooking ribeyes too right because i like to eat i eat mostly meat so i eat i try to eat a lot of fat because uh i'm not getting much else do you

take so like when you go to you know go on the road for a fight or doing stand-up you bring like a cooler you bring your bring your stuff some restaurants. Okay Yeah, you much do much with intermittent fasting. Yeah, I do that all the time. Okay, generally I do at least 14 hours Okay, so I generally like to work out in the morning fasted. Okay, you know, okay But it depends like sometimes like if I go if I have a show late at night Like last night my show was pretty late, right I wasn't home until like two 30 in the morning. So then I had some food at night cause I was just exhausted and tired. So then I ate, then I went to sleep and I woke up later. So when I woke up, I just ate and then got my shit done. Cause I'm like, listen, the fasting's out the window. I got tanked last night. Let's just like

get something in and you know, get, get the sweat going and let's get rocking and then kind of get your body back on track. But I do the cold plunge before anything. Okay. Before any of my workouts. I'm going to try that out. I'm so accustomed to it now, it still sucks. I still hate it.

I still think about checking it out. But it's necessary. Well, it is really good for you. And I feel so great when I get out of it. And more importantly, it's made my body much more resilient to cold like I warm up really quickly Yeah, like once I'm out I could do the three minutes and I remember the first time I did I was fucking cold for so Long oh you fucker. Oh you fucking bitch you dummy. What's wrong with you? Why are you doing this now?

I get out. I'm like woof like my body's completely adapted to it. So I can start working out right away. How cold, what temperature do you find it? 34. Oh, you go that low. Yeah, I do 34 for three minutes every morning. Wow. Do you have a chiller? Do you have ice or both?

I have a Morosco cold plunge at home, a Morosco forge. And here we have one called a Blue Cube. Okay. And they're both very, very good. I want to see that. I bought one from Renew. I'll show you the Blue Cube. Okay, okay. It's'll show you the Blue Cube Okay

It's out here The Blue Cube We have at the studio And the Blue Cube They're upgrading To this fucking insane one They have now That's like a river

Okay So you don't get A thermal layer Okay Over your body So when you sit In the cold water The water's constantly circulating

Exactly So it just Like you're sitting in a river Keeps sucking Okay It never stops sucking Oh that's gonna super chill your ass Yeah because when you get

In the Morosco, it's amazing. And look, it ain't easy. Three minutes is a grind. At that temperature? Oh, my gosh. But after a minute and a half or so, it gets more relaxed. Okay. And that's because you develop a thermal layer.

Because when you get out, you know how your body gets like super red? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right? That's what that is. Okay. That's your body is forcing blood to try to warm up your skin that's in contact with this cold. It's trying to prevent you from hypothermia.

It's giving you some insulation. Yeah. Yes, yes. Okay. And so this blue cube one doesn't allow that. Okay. Because it's like constantly running. Flowing through.

It's constantly flowing. So it's torturous. Wow. Yeah. I'm a wuss. I'm only down to 55 degrees. Oh, that's ridiculous. I know.

I shower in that. That's outrageous. You get ice cubes coming out of your shower. I like cold showers too. Yeah? In the winter, it's the. I know. I shower in that. That's outrageous. Ice keeps coming out of your shower. I like cold showers too. In the winter, it's great. I love it. I love it in the winter. Oh, in the winter, it feels so good. I love doing it right after the sauna. Yeah. Right into the cold shower. That's what I was going to ask you. So what rotation, where does the dry sauna come in with the cold plunge and the workout? It depends entirely on what kind of workout I'm doing. All right. Like what I really generally like to do is I like to work out by doing a cold

punch first always. And then I will have like whatever workout I'm in and I'm doing hard cardio. Like if I'm doing bag workout or something like that, then I go right into the sauna afterwards because my heart rate is jacked. So when my heart rate, like when my resting, my heart rate after rounds, like I'll do like 10 rounds on the bag and And it's still beating fast when I go in.

And then because of the heat, like it's a static form of cardio. So when you go in. You're extending your workout. Exactly. I'm extending my workout just sitting there and listening to a book. Okay. So I'll just put, if you want to do that though, get AirPod Ones, the originals. So slide out or?

No, the original ones don't overheat. Oh, really? The other ones die out okay every fucking i've tried a bunch of different companies a bunch of different air they all die except the original regular airpods whichever one they sell they'll sell like a gen two but it's not the new ones yeah it's the old ones yeah the ones in the little tiny case yes sure those ones don't die okay Because they have less shit in them. Interesting. The other ones have noise canceling and all that. They die quick.

The pros, they eat a lot. Yeah. And it's always the left one because I'm sitting with my left side to the heater. Okay. So it made me conscious of like switching sides. So cold plunge, workout, if you got your heart rate up, definitely go straight into the dry sauna. Yeah. And then do you ever rotate back?

Sometimes even when I lift weights, I'll go into the sauna. It depends on how much time I have. But what I really like is a sauna at night. Okay. I really like that when I come home from the club. Relaxes you for bed. Relaxes you for bed, but it also centers my mind. And it gives me an opportunity to have just a little bit more adversity at the end of the day.

Go through 20 minutes of this fucking 189 degree sauna and steam and just and listening to something generally i'm listening to a book okay and uh i'm just in there just thinking about shit yeah because it's like it's good alone time i need alone time like i it's very important when's your alone time that you're not listening to the book you're not think thinking about you know learning when i'm working out when i'm working out okay yeah when i'm working out it's just alone time yeah you know like if i'm hitting the bag either i listen to music or sometimes i don't listen to anything i just i just want to hear the thumps i just want to hear the one you ever been in a fast go-kart like not a fast one we We were in Thailand.

Okay. I think it was in Thailand with my family. Yeah. And we went to this place. They rent go-karts. Yeah. We were whipping around. Yeah. They were fun as shit.

We were racing each other. It was a really good time. Yeah, but like a really fast, like a track-focused go-kart, like for me, like that's something that will take my mind off of everything because maybe a little bit like boxing or something in that if I'm not focused on what I'm doing, I'm either going to fucking lose or get fucking hurt or both. Yeah. And so anyway, I just skiing fast and go karts are what take my mind off of the world.

But without getting hurt, you could do that with pool. That's what I like about pool. True to some degree. And that's what I like about archery as well. With archery, it's like when you're drawn back. A little bit of zen. And that's what I like about archery as well. Archery, it's like when you're drawn back.

A little bit of zen. Yeah, there's a thing that's happening where it's so difficult to do that all you're thinking about is that thing. And it's very mind-cleansing. Fred Bear said that, something about a troubled man and a bow. Fred Bear was like one of the original pioneers of bow hunting in this country. But pool, to me, is like one of the ultimate ones because you can do it at any time you want. Anytime you have time, I can just go out there

and set some drills up or just run some balls and it just frees my mind. Yeah. Because you know, you're a good pool player when you're making a long shot, especially a shot on that table.

Right. And you know you have to get pinpoint position on the next ball. There's like so much going on. Did you ever play any street pool growing up? Yeah, I did. Okay.

Yeah, I did. Okay. Yeah, I did. Okay. I never really played one pocket, but I played a lot of street pool. I played a little bit of one pocket. It's just kind of, it's like a chess match. It's boring as shit.

I like action, you know, so. I get it. Yeah. It's hard to do. I get, it's a great gambling game. Yeah. Those guys who, that are really,

the Tony Cho hands of the world. Grady Matthews. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Those, I mean, you know. They're just masters is what they are it's an intellectual game yeah Efron Reyes is amazing yeah yeah but it's not my thing I like rotation

right right I like breaking yeah I like running out all right man I'm I'm your I'm your pool table day just let me know we're gonna do this hour and a half drive up yeah factory we had a good time yeah it was fun which is sure didn't have enough time that's all good that's the thing it's like you just get warmed up when you play for like an hour or two yeah well listen brother

i appreciate you coming here and i love your cars man and i appreciate you making wild shit because i just i just love that you do that you just make wild shit you know like whenever i look at your uh your website he's like he's got a thousand horsepower camaro like what the fuck are you doing an exorcistist. Jesus Christ, man. That's what we do. Everything is just so bonkers over the top. Over the top. All of it.

The GT500, not fast enough. What does it only have? 700 horsepower? No, we built 1,000 horsepower. Yeah, exactly. But from the factory. 700 from the factory. We built 1,000 horsepower GT500 for Jim Farley, the CEO.

And his son went out and drove around Monterey, California last August and had a blast with it. The fucking videos that you guys have of people sitting in the car and you see the acceleration. Oh, my God. Yeah. I love that you're out there, brother. Appreciate you very much. Appreciate you. And thank you for being here.

It was a lot of fun. Thank you. Awesome. All right. Goodbye. Thank you.