The Joe Rogan Experience - #2015 - Zach Bryan

Episode Date: August 1, 2023

Zach Bryan is a singer-songwriter and country musician. His most recent releases are the album "American Heartbreak" and the EP "Summertime Blues."  www.zachbryan.com

The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day. What's happening, baby? How you doing, Joe? Good to see you, brother. How you doing? And we're drinking Bud Light, ladies and gentlemen. Sorry, guys.

Sorry. We're fucked. There's nothing wrong with it. Mm-mm. People are so... Cheers, sir. Cheers, brother. People are so silly.

We were just talking about how silly it is. One person made a really stupid decision, and now everybody's decided that Bud Light is the enemy. But that's like this thing that people do in America

where they just decide, now I hate these people. These people are the enemy. And, you know. And it's over. Yeah, and it's over. The reason, I've been drinking Bud Light

and Budweiser like my entire adult life and then on on twitter i defended my my sister's spouse and people were like people were pissed and i was like i'm so i didn't mean to do this it was crazy and travis tritt came after me and i was like he didn't come after me travis tritt is so respectable and he's like a good guy and i met him at the two-step in where you were and it was just it was cool to get to talk to him about it and see like two different views. And it was cool sitting in the room with him and hearing it. Well, you know, people, just the culture war in this country is so goofy.

It's so overblown. And a lot of it is people just not talking to each other. It's people talking through social media and talking through narratives. It freaks me out. It freaks me out. And being so public, you too, as well and it's just it freaks me out yeah it freaks me out and being so public you too as well it's so scary i feel like it keeps people from being who they actually are oh yeah which is terrifying because every time i get anywhere i'm like shit man i can't say or do this and then when you do it's fucking it's crazy it's like there's a lot of

self-censoring but i think it's important to speak your mind. I think it's getting better. Yeah. It's just more people have to do it. And then more people, you know, people are worried about the repercussions. But you have to understand that when you're a person like yourself or a person like me, you're communicating to millions of people. And so you're going to have a certain percentage of them that are upset at everything you say. everything you say whether you say you like to eat meat or whether you say you think robert f kennedy jr is a good guy or whether you think that you know whatever the fuck you think and you only have one you only have one life man allegedly yeah i guess i'm not sure about that

i'm not sure about that i uh have a feeling you've been here before no i uh i saw your podcast like two years ago two years ago about the infinity thing yeah and. And I kept telling people about it in Oklahoma and stuff. I'm like, what the? Isn't it weird that that freaks people out? It freaks people out. I love life. I love my family. I love my friends.

I love my job. I love existing. I enjoy it very much. But if I had to do this over and over again forever for infinity, it's a weird feeling. It freaks people out. Have you seen that Black Mirror episode? No. Not to be that guy.

No, no, no. I've seen a bunch of them. There's a Black Mirror episode where they're in a cabin, and this guy's in prison for infinity, and he's talking to this guy over and over and over again. Wow. And there's the new one. The new season came out, and same thing. They're in space, and they're coming down.

I'm not going to ruin it. No, no worries. It's crazy. It's an amazing show. It freaks you out. It's my favorite show. It's a great show. My wife won't watch it with me. Really? She thinks It's crazy. It's an amazing show. It freaks you out. It's my favorite show. It's a great show. My wife won't watch it with me.

Really? She thinks it's scary. Really? She gets freaked out by it. Yeah, she doesn't like things that could be real. I get that. I get that. A lot of people, like, when I bring it up, they're like, I don't know.

And I'm like... Did you ever see Heavy Metal? Uh-uh. That's the one where the robots are chasing this lady. Oh, yeah. The dogs. I didn't like that. I stopped watching it.

That one freaked me out too much I was like no way that's so close to real well the one about the murdering too there's a one with this chick like murders oh yeah and she gets in this like white lie of trying to hide from it like she's like hiding it from her kids and stuff yeah yeah crazy wow it's just it's so close to real. It's so close to real. There was a World Economic Forum video that they just put out about people going to work and wearing earbuds. Have you seen it, Jamie? Going to work and wearing earbuds that monitor your brain waves and the brain waves are going to tell whether or not you're being productive or distracted and in this video this woman is kind of fantasizing about a guy she works with and then catches herself doing it and then some guy gets busted for like is this a show what is this it's just a video explaining how in the future you're see if you can find it i mean i'm seeing the people talking about it dude you saying this reminds me of yesterday i was in walmart and i was like walking around and i was like looking for something to buy and one of the girls I asked the question to shed an air button or an air pod in mm-hmm

And I was like why would you do that? You're like walking around working people are asking you for help and stuff and she's just walking around like listen to it She's like talking to people with and listening this music. Yeah kids do that today. My kids do that Yeah, one year open. I was kind of I didn't mean it I didn't mean to be an ass but I was like I was talking to the guy at the Here it is. Yeah, that's it. Check this out.

Yeah, check this video out. This is bonkers, dude. This is really... Oh, it's like one of those training videos. Yeah, and she's wearing these earbuds in your beta brainwave activity right before an alert popped up telling you to take a brain break But what's that unusual change in your brain activity? This is not the one I saw. Okay I was gonna the one that I saw that's that's scary than a black mirror episode But this was the other ones more scary because it talks about like self centering at work and monitoring your thoughts at work I can see it. God. I sent it to somebody. I can see it.

What the fuck did I send it to? I mean, this video on TikTok seems like I just saw the brainwave thing you just said. Oh, come on. Like that? That's the same video. Yep, this is it. This is it. Oh, it's just a little later in there?

This is it, yeah. Okay, so I had only seen part of it. That's it. Keep it rolling. Oh, you got two going. Oh, my God. This is a nightmare. This is Black Mirror.

This is what I hear at night. Oh, this is fine. Let this play. No, it's before this. It's before this where she's fantasizing about this guy. Yeah, that's it. That's the guy. How do you smoke pot and watch stuff like that?

I love it. That's crazy. Back up. But you can't help fantasizing. Your mind starts to... Could you take a quick look at my brain data? Anything to worry about? The doctor.

Your mind starts to wander to the new colleague on your team. No way. Who you know you shouldn't be talking about. Come on. Given the policy against intra-office romance. But you can't help fantasizing. Just a moment. Come on. What? Imagine all the shitty things you've thought of at work. I know.

And your boss knowing. Congratulations on your brain metrics. work and your boss knowing. Congratulations on your brain metrics. So you get bonuses for thinking a certain way.

Where is this from? The government has subpoenaed employees brainwave data from the past year. They have compelling evidence that one of your co-workers has committed massive wire fraud. Now they're looking for his co-conspirators. You discover they are looking for synchronized brain activity between your co-conspirators. You discover they are looking for synchronized brain activity between your co-worker and the people he has been working with. While you know you're innocent of any crime,

you've been secretly working with him on a new startup venture. Shaking, you remove your earbuds. You know what's crazy about that? You know what's crazy about that? I feel like the world right now with all of our phones is the same way. Because your phone knows everything about you yeah and people can do that but it's not the same but it's like it's getting there it feels like the idea of being able to collect data on

everywhere you walk i remember when i was i guess it was like i want to say it was like 99 2000 was the first gps thing that i had and you would load it I think with CDs or DVRs I remember when Garmin's came out my grandpa was going crazy yeah he would put it on the dash of his truck and he's like we're going to Texas and we know where we're going yeah you had a map with you all the time but the one that I had in the early days you could I only had California because that's all the data could fit and the California data was on like a CD-ROM or a DVD. I can't remember which one it was, but you had to load it, I remember. And it was kind of clunky, but I was like, this is wild. This is like very early on with that kind of electronics.

Thinking about it now, like what's freaked me out the most in the last year of my life has been friends of mine and people that I've met and things. I got a flip phone like six months ago. I was like, man, I called you on it. When I first started talking to you, I was on my flip phone because I was talking to a friend of mine and it was like,

they were like, well, how are you going to track? How are you going to know where your friends are at? Like with the tracking on iPhones and stuff like that, you can like see your friends. I'm like, what do you mean? I don't think we're supposed to know where we're all at. And it's scary as shit. Why do I want you to know that I'm at my house

or if I'm, even your best friends in the entire world're all at. And it's scary as shit. Why do I want you to know that I'm at my house? Or if I'm... Even your best friends in the entire world, our parents never did that. It's weird. You know, it's crazy. It's weird. And then some people are going to want to know where you are all the time. Why won't you let me know where you are, Zach? Yeah.

It's six years. It's like seven years ago. I deleted Snapchat. Because I saw the map with all the fucking heads on it. Yeah. Yeah. And kids are growing up like this, bro. It's crazy.

My kids use that constantly. They're always tracking their friends. And I'm 27. I'm not allowed to say that yet.. It's crazy. My kids use that constantly. They're always tracking their friends. And I'm 27. I'm not allowed to say that yet. You're still a kid. I don't know what age that is where you can start saying the kids, you know, which is cringy to say. You can say it at 27.

After 25, you can kind of say it occasionally. That's how I feel. Yeah. After 25, I was like, holy fuck, man. Life is not. Then once you're 30, you're like, oh my God, I'm a grown up. I was told at 30 you feel more. I was told at 30 you feel more settled.

It depends on who you are. Sometimes people aren't happy at 30, and then they start panicking more because they haven't gotten anything done. I don't know about your 20s. I don't know what you did in your 20s, but my 20s have been like this crazy roller coaster that it hasn't stopped. And I'm like, holy shit, this is what they meant by the 20s. Yeah. Psychotic.

I mean, you're just over being 10 Yeah, literally 10 17 years ago, and you think you know everything and we're 22 and 23 It's so scary of course decisions and shit. You make it's crazy. You got into You got into making music Well, I say you were successful making music while you were still in the military, right? Yes, how old were you? successful making music while you were still in the military right yes how old were you 22 when I started Wow I started putting videos on Twitter and it was psychotic it was crazy because I did it like I get all these messages all the time from people who are like hey man I was around when you release heading

south I've been here from the beginning and I'm like Wow really the very beginning you know and I started putting videos on Twitter back in like 2017. And then I just kept doing it and doing it and doing it. Because I was in the Navy. I had a lot of shit going on. I didn't believe in therapy because that's crazy in the Navy, you know. And I started just making music. And I started posting them on Twitter.

And I'd get like five or six likes. And I didn't care. It was nice. It was nice to go home. It was nice to go home it was nice to go home and feel the way I did and write and put music on twitter I don't know it's kind of my validation in the world of I can write a song at least right and then man one I was I was training in Florida and one day I put like four or five videos up and they just went like crazy viral and I was like

cool neat and then my life just kept going up and up and up and i was like at that time did you have any what were your your aspirations about recording no i didn't even know what it was that's why all my beginning records are shitty you never they're not shitty but see when i recorded this when i recorded this i was about to like go inside i was like whatever i'll just throw this on the internet. This is like an iPhone. And it was the number one voted Reddit video in the entire world, I think. I don't know.

But I was getting calls from people. I'm like, what the hell is going on? Everyone at work is like, you're going viral. I was like, what? And we're literally learning how to load missiles and shit. I'm like, cool. Sick, man. It's been crazy. And I never in my life envisioned being a musician ever really period no i thought i was

gonna my old man was in the navy for 25 years he was a master chief my mom was in the navy my grandpa was in the navy both yeah just that that like whatever and i was like i'm gonna be in the navy till the day I die, probably. Until I retire, at least. And that was it. That was going to be my life. And I was thinking about it yesterday, how crazy my reality is now. Like, coming back to Oklahoma and being around people

and people, like, coming to get me in diners and being like, take a picture of me. I'm like, what is going on, man? There's, like, 700 people hating me online. I'm like, bro, I didn't fucking mean to do this i don't i'm sorry it's crazy wow i just kept going kept writing so when you made your music you just made it for fun you make it make it for yourself like did you plan on no i just wanted to be a writer i think writing is like the most beautiful thing in the world because i used to read like steinbeck books and stuff when I was a kid and

I Just thought it was so crazy that someone could take words and put them on a page and it would make you feel something Not to be deep either. I mean that like you can be reading a book and feel something like Visceral and real from a page on a book. Yeah ink and you're looking at it and I was like, that's crazy so I started writing poems and stuff when I was a kid and It's just ink, and you're looking at it, and I was like, that's crazy. So I started writing poems and stuff when I was a kid. And those turned into songs because writing poems is lame, right?

Not really. Now that I'm 27, I know that it's not. But when I was a kid, I thought that. And I was like, what way can you write poems and it's not weird? That's why I started playing guitar. Yeah, poems are one of those ones people are embarrassed to say they do. Exactly, yeah. And I don't get that nowadays, but i do if you're you know why 17 why because the people that aren't embarrassed when they talk about poetry are annoying yeah they are they're annoying oh man that's the problem

people talking to me about writing i'm like man you suck dude please please don't i don't want to read i don't want to hear it i don't want to hear it man some people just want to unload on you because it's almost it's almost embarrassing to write vulnerable stuff. Yeah. But it's not at all. At the same time, it's like you have one life, you know? But it connects with people so much. The vulnerable stuff, it connects with people.

It resonates with people so much. And people act like you should be ashamed of it. Well, it's just... People are ashamed of emotions for some strange reason. It's strange. It's really weird to talk to people about it. It's just people are ashamed of emotions for some strange reason it's strange it's really weird to talk to people about it it's very stupid it's very stupid at the same time so many people are drawn to them like i have so many happy songs and people always love my like darker ones and i'm like this isn't my fault you guys all lean towards this it's not i think what stems from is people criticizing people who lose control of their emotions,

like people who are too emotional. So like it could be any little thing that goes wrong in their life and they break down, start crying and think the world is out to get them. Like that is, that's annoying to people. I agree. And in harder times that is really looked down on because those are the people

that don't carry their own weight. Those are the people that get in the way. Those are the people that don't carry their own weight those are the people that get in the way those are the people that panic and battle those the people that can't control their emotions so when we think about someone who's exploring their emotions or expressing their emotions we like kind of automatically think about the most annoying aspect of expressing your emotions other people in your childhood who were just crying all the time. Yeah, well, there's some people that just like, anything that goes wrong in their life,

they think the universe is out to get them. Like, God damn it. Like, have you ever seen Africa? You ever seen like people that are living in third world countries? You ever seen people that are walking from Guatemala to try to get through to Mexico to get to America? Wake up every morning so happy to breathe here in America. I wake up every morning like, holy shit,

this could be so much worse. Yeah, that's like when this whole border crisis thing is going on. I'm like, listen, if I was living in Honduras and I had no way of making it, and I knew that I could walk all the way to America, my cousin

was going to do it, my brother was going to do it. It's going to take us two weeks to walk to America. I'm like, let's fucking go, man. Otherwise, we're stuck. And you have to think about that being a story in itself. Yeah. Like, for you as that person who's like, I'm going to go make this trek and make this journey in my life to make it better. That's like an odyssey, right?

Well, people do what they have to do in order to make their life better. like an odyssey right like you're well people do what they have to do in order to make their life better and when there's nothing you have to do because your life's pretty fucking easy then people find all sorts of stupid shit to complain about because people have there's like a level of dissatisfaction that most people just contain all day long and a lot of it is like they have a lot of dissatisfaction about their own self yeah and they don't address that. So instead, they find all this dissatisfaction in the world. But whatever that percentage is, whether their life is unbelievably brutal or whether their life is really easy, they still want to spend 30-what percent fucking complaining about shit.

So they find dumb shit to complain about that means nothing. It's weird you're bringing this up because I posted on my Instagram I had to bring it up but I posted on my Instagram last week this thing called the catastrophe of success have you ever read that? No. By Tennessee Williams there's this paragraph at the end he talks about how success just made him like you gotta

sorry I'm so sorry no don't pause it you gotta read this you know then that public somebody you are when No, I want to read it. You got to read this. Yeah, yeah. Okay. You know then that public somebody you are when you have a name. Yeah, you can read it. Okay. You know then that the public somebody you are when you have a name is a fiction created with mirrors and that only somebody worth being is the solitary and unseen you that existed from your first breath and which is the sum of your actions and so is constantly in a state of becoming under your own violation. And knowing these things, you can even survive the catastrophe of success.

Wrong paragraph. I had one job. It's the one above it. But it talks about what you were just saying, that people get so content in their lives that they make, like the only thing worth it in this life is conflict. Yeah. You have to have that conflict in those stories and those things that make you suffer

to be happy and content, which is just crazy to think about. Yeah, it says, this is an oversimplification. One does not escape that easily from the seduction of an effete way of life. Is that how to say that? I don't know.

A feat? How do you say that, Jeremy? You got it. A feat? Killed it. One of them? I got it with one of them. The first one?

That's one of those things I've only read. I've never like said out loud. I've never seen that word till I saw this. I was like, no way, man. You cannot arbitrarily say to yourself, I will not continue my life as it was before this thing. Success happened to me. But once you fully apprehend the vacuity of a life without struggle, you are equipped with the basic means of salvation. you are equipped with the basic means of salvation.

Once you know, this is true that the heart of man, his body and brain are forged in a white hot furnace for the purpose of conflict, the struggle of creation, and that with the conflict removed, the man is a sword cutting daisies. Sick. That that's amazing.

That's sick. That not privation, but luxury is the wolf at the door. And that the fangs of this wolf are all the little vanities and conceits and laxities that success is heir to why then with this knowledge you are at least in a position of knowing where danger lies and people People who are content that's what it means Yeah, you won't be happy without the conflict of you need struggle and that's very

unfortunate that's what i've dealt with a lot lately in my life and like the touring life and things like that being successful in anything it's just hard i think which that's so i'm not trying no it is but i'm not trying to bullshit anyone and yeah of course it's not like you're coal miner exactly i'm not being like in the 1800s yeah and you're 12 yeah it's fucking complicated it's complicated is better to say than hard it's also super bizarre because there's not a lot of people you could talk to about it of course yeah there's no one who relates it's hard but it's not try to talk to a bunch of different people about it like early on and everybody has a different take on it and some

and it's interesting to see like some people as time has gone on they've dealt with it less and less well which is crazy to think about. You would think as you went along the route. You'd get better at it. Yeah. Yeah. A lot of things. It's just been insane.

And that really, every time I feel however, I'm like stressed out, I'll just read that. I'm like, cool. Everything will be all right. For me, that's why exercise is like a key component of my mental health regimen. It's more mental health than anything. Personally, because when I was in the Navy, I was running like, I was running marathons like on the weekends. Because I loved it so much. Running, I've always ran like a lot.

And I've lost that along the way of being a musician. And I've noticed a decline in like how I feel like uh energy wise yeah you know what I mean yeah and it's freaked me out so every morning when I wake up to play a show I'll always go on a run now and I always try to tell other comics that like because a lot of comics do not like to take care of themselves it's like part of the fun of being a comedian you're just lazy and crazy and you're doing drugs has a musician too yeah it's a part of the thing but I always tell them your body is literally the race car that you're maneuvering around life in. And if you can give that race car more horsepower, if you make it more robust, it works better.

It works better with everything. It thinks better. It handles emotions better. It sleeps better. It eats better. You'll be smarter. And people don't want to believe that because it's easier to not. But it's also more fun.

But fucking lazy. It's also fun, though, to not care. To go crazy. But then you realize it makes it so much worse. That's what happened to me last year. Because, I mean, I wasn't, like, being crazy. I wasn't, like, shooting up or anything. But we were just drinking so much, and we weren't, like, working out.

Right. It was just, like, and I woke up one morning. I was, like like working out and like, it was just like, and I woke up one morning, I was like in New York city and I'm like, man, I feel just bad. I shouldn't feel like this at eight in the morning. I haven't done anything.

And that's when I started like addressing, I called my dad. I'm like, man, I gotta do something. That's the real problem with booze. That's the real problem with booze. I noticed.

Yeah. It is so much worse for you than weed or mushrooms or anything else. Booze is the worst. It removes all of your am I being an asshole filter? So you're fucking loud. So people get loud and confident and uninhibited

and then you feel terrible the next day. Exactly. It's the worst drug. But it's also really fun. It's the most fun thing you can do. It's, it's pretty fun. People give me shit all the time because my sister, my sister sobered up a long, long time ago. And, um, we always talk about it with each other in a way of like balancing our lives and things like that and drinking and all that. And, uh, every time I talk to her, she's like, well, why don't you just quit drinking if you feel bad all the time? And I'm like, become become a musician it's a great time to be at like that night at the mothership and stuff like

you go down and you start drinking with your friends and things it's when it gets out of hand that it's not okay yeah it's a balancing act for sure did you see Huberman's podcast on alcohol no I didn't sure it's terrible I watched it yeah no I watched I watched that man I was like never but really yeah it's scary he was talking about man. I was like, I've never put the getaway. Yeah, it's scary. He was talking about it, and I was like, I probably was drinking a beer because it was like 8 p.m., and I'm like, oh, shit. He was like, no, this is, he did not, don't quote me on this. He was like, this is, it kills you.

Oh, definitely. Every time. It definitely does. Every time you drink. And I was like, man, I gotta. It's poison. Yeah. Because I'd stopped drinking. I thought, man, I thought I was being smart.

And like last year, we were drinking a lot of whiskey. And I was like, I'm going to stop drinking whiskey I'll stick with the light beers just the beer I started drinking beer and I felt worse you're getting a lot of carbohydrates I didn't realize that, I woke up every morning full and I'm like, I just can't eat breakfast and it was just crazy

so many calories if you're drinking 12 beers, that's a shit load of calories and I mean our days are so long like being a musician people don't realize how much fucking time you're just waiting around

right cause you get to the venue early and then you wait around all day to play and then you play and then afterwards everyone wants to talk so you're like up

for like 18 hours and there's beer involved in everything and you don't even mean to do it but you're like man at the end of the night you're like

I gotta eat something man it's crazy there's stages of guys everything, and you don't even mean to do it, but you're like, man. At the end of the night, you're like, I gotta eat something, man. It's crazy. There's stages of guys drinking less, and one of them is they go to the tequila stage. Tequila doesn't give you hangovers, man. Tequila's bad, right? Don't they do that? That's like one of the stages.

You even saying tequila makes me want to just gag, man. I can't do it. Even the smell of it freaks me out. That's probably my favorite drink. Interesting. Yeah. Wow. Now. Yeah. Wow. Now.

It doesn't fuck me up as much as other ones. When I'm purposely trying to get fucked up, it's whiskey. Yeah, me too. That's why I had to stop drinking it. But the older I get, the more I realize, dude, you're not invincible. You can't do this. Man, it's crazy. Your body starts declining, and you're like, I got to do this. Do you ever do IV vitamin drips after you drink?

I tried them once, and it made me feel worse. So now I'm like scared of them. Yeah, I did it at a festival one time because I was just, I did ACL and I'm not, ACL is amazing and everything. It's awesome. But man, I woke up the next morning and I was like, I can't, man.

Really? It was like 5.30. I had like the 5.30 slot and we had been driving all night. I was like, man, I can't do this and Danny's like here do this IV it'll make you feel better and I did it and I went on stage I was like oh this is terrible really I had a great time and the show was fine but uh but you felt worse I did feel worse it gave me a headache for some reason that's interesting yeah what oh hmm I don't want

to throw any companies under the bus but I wonder like what they put in it. There's always those IV companies at the festivals and things. What you want to get in is glutathione. That's a big one. It actually helps your liver process alcohol. A lot of people take glutathione while they drink to actually help their liver process. I was literally about to ask, can you do it simultaneously? Yeah, you could. Be needled up and drink it at the same time?

You could. I think that would be cumbersome. But a lot of people take liposomal glutathione. It's a way it gets in your bloodstream better. You like squirt it into your tongue. I've tried that before. But generally, you're rehydrating and you're getting like a full panel of vitamins. You're getting zinc.

You're getting vitamin D and B and a lot of take a lot of high dose vitamin c it's good for your body for sure of course and when you're recovering from a night of drinking it's good to like give your body the the you know the building blocks to try to get it get your shit together wow to speak about technically my body like hit a wall because i was so i was so like in the navy and it was so physical like it was so physical and like you had to be in such great physical shape and then like all of a sudden it was like out right do whatever you want yeah now it's like you're free and I was like okay let's go it was crazy it was crazy I waited like eight months to it was just such a crazy story

and then when I when I finally had freedom I kind of overdid it do you ever think about taking like a trainer with you on the road I think we're doing it next year. That's a good move. But there's something in me. It might be my ego or whatever, but there's something in me. It's like, no, you can do it yourself. Well, you can, but will you? Exactly.

That's what's hard. If you haven't so far. It's so unexpected. Well, I mean, I have. But you know what you could do? You could make an agreement with the guys that you work with like where everyone's gonna do a specific amount of working out every day like you're gonna do like x amount of days a week and you have to do with each workout 20 minutes of cardio 100 push-ups that's cool too it builds

camaraderie we've been doing better this year on the road but if you like have something like that where everybody can complain about it and talk shit about it and have fun with it. That's when people do their best, man. When there's a market they gotta compete with. It's cool. It's also like a bonding experience and it's also you know, it's a shared experience. It's like you're having a fun time and you're getting stuff done and it'll

force you to do it. Like you hold each other accountable and just do it for a month. Only thing I'm gonna do for the next month is play pool. Yeah. You gotta get better. accountable and just do it for a month. Only thing I'm going to do for the next month is play pool. Yeah. Yeah. You got to get better. Go get a pool, man. Yeah.

I play a lot though. It's not fair. I thought, I'm telling you when I say we did too. Yeah. A lot, like too much. People like refer to it when they're talking to me. That's how, so being, that's crazy. Well, there's pool that you play in a bar, like on a bar table.

And then there's tournament pool that you play on a tight-pocketed table. When I showed up and the guy started telling me the rules, I was like, I'm sorry. What? That's for nine ball. Of course. Yeah, but we play eight ball. It's the best game in the world besides maybe like poker. I love it.

Me too. I love it more than anything because you have to execute. It's one of the rare games where it's not just knowing what to do and figuring out little puzzles but you have to execute like you have to control your body you just put words to how i feel about it too yeah i've always thought that i'm like how is this game so damn fun i think that's the same thing that people get with golf you know because you have to execute you have to make the shot golf man you play golf no i don't but jamie's an addict i can't do golf jamie just got back from a tournament i can't do golf something about it i just can't do you'll get there it's got to be the shorts i'm just kidding i'm just kidding i i a lot of my friends do play golf and they

always try to get me to play it's a super addictive game that's the only reason why i've never messed with it really i just i don't want to get addicted like tony hinchcliffe and him and ron white and a lot of my good friends are full-on golf junkies. Really? They can't stop playing. I've been living in the Northeast and there's a big, it's like there's a lot of, I feel like in golf you have to go out and like, there's a lot of work involved in getting into golf. Same with like sports like lacrosse and stuff like that. There's just like a lot of shit you got to have to play.

Oh yeah, golf. You got to have, how many fucking clubs do you have have you're supposed to have 14 or so in your bag plus your shoes it there's rules about what you gotta wear out there yeah i just thought it was annoying carrying a pool cue on the road like taking a pool cue 60 pound bag i feel like a dork when i do that if you walk into you're not a dork if you do that because some of my friends do it but you walk into a bar with a pool stick it's like yeah and also people are like they don't want to play you

at that point I don't at least if I'm in a bar and a guy brings a pool stick in and like a glove I'm like okay but the thing like I never played pool much

in bars that's what you're saying out there yeah real pool halls yeah does that make a difference yeah way different

maybe that's why I think I'm so damn good yeah you're playing lemons yeah that's crazy but a lot of pool players good. Yeah, you're playing with lemons. It's crazy. But a lot of pool players that are really good go to bars because people do think they're good at pool. And they'll go and talk shit.

Hustle up, man. Someone will try to gamble. The next thing you know, they're walking out of there with $10,000. I have a bunch of friends that have done that. We do the dumbest shit at bars when it comes to pool because we'll all be drinking beers all night. It'll be midnight and someone's like, I'll bet you on this one and then like the whole bar will like get around you know just watch us play it's crazy yeah it's psychotic yeah gambling

it's okay scary dude i was in vegas with dana white taylor lewin who else was gambling will compton who else was gambling that was well well was gambling? Yeah. And Shane. And Shane Gillis was with us and Jamie. And Dana White was gambling, and he was down $600,000 playing blackjack. I was like, no, don't do it. Taylor was telling us. So we were backstage with Shane. Shane Gillis was doing a show at the Mirage. I came to hang out.

We're all having a good time. And then he goes, hey, we're going to go gamble with Dana. I'm like, oh, my God. Do you know how hard he gambles? He's like, I'm up all this money. Taylor's like, I'm fired up. Dana shows me how to bet. We get there.

Taylor's down $120,000 in the first five minutes. But it can also go the other way. Yeah. That's why people do it. That's why it's so terrifying. It did go the other way. He made his money back, and he won like 65 grand, I think. And then he backed out.

People will just gamble on anything, which is cool. I do this thing every year where I go to the casino and I'll put X amount of dollars on red every time, no matter what. And I've never lost, which I'll probably lose now that I jinxed it. But like every year, once a year, I'll go and put money on red just to say again like whatever good i can't go to the casino man it's scary man i was we were in um i don't know we were like in um it's freaky like in uh arkansas and oklahoma missouri states like that if you go to the casino i was at the hotel like even the hotels at casinos are scary you're like i'm gonna send you something but your stains on the couches man you're like what's going on you go downstairs and like your

buddies are like smoking cigarettes and like with those fucking sticks on the lottery machines or what the slot machines it's like a it's like a dungeon and you're like oh no offense to anyone who gambles but it scares the shit out of me i'm'm like, bro. It should. Yeah. It triggers some things in your brain. There's certain things, though. This is Dana. He's on vacation in the Amalfi Coast. Bro. And this fucking dude brings a casino.

He had a casino come to him. Bro, who's that kid next to him? That's his son. That's crazy. So he's, look, he's got stacks of cash. That's baller, man. Good for him. No, it's not.

That's sickness. Who knows? He brought a goddamn casino to his boat. My thing is, man, if you can do it, you should do it if it makes you happy. Wow, look at you. All open-minded. No way. I guess.

I guess the last year of my life has made me like that. Well, that's a good way to be. No one lets you do what you want to do. Or me do what I want to do. Like when it comes to socially. do what you want to do. Or me do what I want to do. Like when it comes to like socially like on the... Well what do you want to do? I just think everything is so micro-analyzed.

Yes. You know what I'm saying? There's so many voices. That's what it is. Agreed. Like we were talking about earlier. Like if you go on social media and you read comments about you you're reading the opinions of literally millions of people. There is no way they're all going to be positive. It's like gambling, man.

It's either one way or the other. It's crazy. The problem with social media, though, is the negatives far outweigh the positives in terms of the way it makes you feel. Like when you see someone get ganged up on in the social media, I've seen it happen to people where they're like they say something on a podcast that people disagree with. It's some culture issue or medical issue and people get really mad at them and then you go to their timeline you see all these people hating on them i just imagine like what that does to your psychology to your mind when you're reading all like if you read a hundred things that like zach you're a great guy and then one guy you fucking

fraud you piece of shit i know who you really really are Oh, yeah, well being from my being from like individually it freaks me out Individually like from the inside out and also if you see someone get Ganged up fucking socially run. Yeah What freaks me out is like what would have that person done artistically if that wouldn't have happened right? What would have that person done for the great for the good of people? Sometimes you know I mean have happened right what would have that person done for the great for the good of people sometimes you know what i mean like if they wouldn't have been either way depending on what it was i mean either way it's like fucking scary there's a thing that people do with what it is is they're terrified

of it happening to them so people know it's a thing that people can gang up on people and they're it's the same reason why people jump people by like 10 guys will beat up one dude like you're terrified of that ever happening to you and And when it's happening to someone else, you just jump in and gang up on people. So it doesn't happen to you. It's like a thing that people are doing or they're so afraid of being ganged up on social media that they just gang up.

The most neurotic people are also like oddly the most aggressive about attacking people. It's weird. I saw on here like two years ago sapiens that book yes uh i read it because of this podcast and in that book somewhere it says that like people are only supposed to be in groups 150 people like villages yes yeah and i had this rant in denver colorado like two weeks ago we played red rocks uh and um everyone afterwards went out to the pool like pool bar and we were all just hanging out

and we were walking home and I grabbed my phone because I was fucking, I mean, we drank too much, obviously, because we had played Forest Hills in New York and then we went to Red Rocks and we just were celebrating because it was a big deal to us, at least.

And I was walking home with like eight other guys and I had my phone and I was like, man, screw this. And I just threw it behind me because it's scary, man. There's so many fucking people. Right. Right in the palm of your hands. Well, you know what that's from?

That's from how we evolved. Yeah. That's what they think at least. That's what some people think. It's Dunbar's number. Dunbar's number. And it's more complicated than like 150 people. It's like there's tiers of people.

There's people like family and very close friends. And then there's like a tier above that. Like people. It's like there's tiers of people. There's people like family and very close friends. And then there's like a tier above that. Like people, that's the tiers. So like there's five people that you're like super close with. And then there's 15 people that you're slightly less close to. And then it goes all the way out to 1,500 people. And imagine the vulnerability it takes to be you or me. And like in your life, a lot of people think they know you at the 150 level.

But you know, you don't know me personally i don't know 150 people yeah off the top of my head what is this one jamie i'm just trying to find one that has the explanations of it on the screen yeah how many friends can a person have i think about this more often than i should when it comes like looking at my phone and like seeing how many followers i have or the bullshit that that comes with being socially active you know know, it's crazy. Well, it's something to think about because what I think is happening is human beings evolved in these tribal groups. And now we're evolving a new consciousness that is actually global because it went from

being in small tribes to larger communities, agricultural communities, cities, millions of people, countries, and now the whole world. And that's a completely new way of interacting with people that has never existed in the – It's so much heavier than people make it out to be. I feel like people are taking it lightly, which obviously a lot of people aren't. I don't think they're aware of it. I think it's just something that you're kind of dealing with because it's just there, you know, you're tweeting and you're looking at the news and you know, the news cycles. Now the news cycle of literally 8 billion people. I haven't talked to anyone like this in like four years because I'm

so fucking scared, man. Not scared of anything in particular. I'm just not scared of the world either. But you know what I mean? I just like, it wasn't worth it to me. Right. Not in an arrogant way. Just in a way where it was like, man, why? Right. I make enough, I write enough music. Like, you know me from that.

Right, right. I just didn't feel the need. Why risk people getting pissed off at you? Yeah, about something silly. Yeah. And I went back to Oklahoma recently. I've been in the Northeast for like two years, three years. And I went back to Oklahoma, man, and I had some time off,

and I just sat in the grass, sat in a field like I used to when I was a kid. I was like, man, oh, that Duncan Trussell episode with you? When Duncan Trussell was like, man, there's probably some sad sack sitting by a waterfall with – he didn't know who's mad at him or who he should be scared at. You remember that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Crazy that he said that.

I'm like, he's right right man. Duncan's a genius He is a genius and watch I watch his episodes religiously on here because he's just so beautifully like articulated That's how he is all the time, too It's so funny because like we did two episodes kind of back-to-back we did one where we dressed as doctors And what was the other one? I remember make the fucking you guys had the but I saw a fucking fanboy But we do we've got way too high. Yeah, fucking fanboy. What we did was furries. You guys got way too hot. Yeah, we couldn't. We respect the furries because, like, they're putting in work.

They're putting in work, those furries. You guys are talking about it. I was like, holy shit. I can't believe this realm of people exists. How crazy. Somebody had a good idea the other night. They're like, you should make every guest dress up. No matter how, like, how important they think they are, world leaders,

make them put on clown costumes. You can do the show, but you have to put on a clown costume. I could barely put on a shirt this morning. I was like, what do you wear? What do you do here, man? I've never done this. I saw this Johnny Cash shirt sitting in my closet. I was like, this is perfect. This is the perfect shirt for the show.

I thought you were working out in it. I was like, okay, shit. I should have did it. I shot bows this morning, got a little workout in, came straight here. Where do you shoot bows? Around here? At your place? Yeah.

Yeah, I have a range. No shit. Yeah, I have a range in here, too. I can't imagine you just waking up and being like, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to head over and shoot some bows, man. It's good for your mind, man. It has to be. Anything you focus on.

Yeah, I mean, forget about bow bow hunting But just archery Shooting at a target is so good for your mind That's why Doing anything, writing for comedy probably Writing music Dude you're just focused And I wish I could just be in that state forever All the time

But you don't man You gotta love it like you love sex You don't want to fuck all day every day You'd get bored true i'm there i mean i'm not there now i love making music and stuff but like even touring like playing the same songs right i love doing it because the people are so beautiful and the people who come to the shows are so like moved by it and i'm but like people like look at me and they don't realize that i played the same show x amount of times and i'm so blessed so lucky but

sometimes man i'm like halfway through my set, and I'm like, give it all you got, man. Give it all you got, no matter how many times you've sang it. Yeah, you just kind of reset. Like those people are seeing you in many – you know what I call the Joe DiMaggio principle is that Joe DiMaggio was playing once, and I think he was like 40 years old, and he slid in the third base,

and the third baseman said, why do you play so hard you're already Joe DiMaggio true and he goes because somewhere out there in the audience is someone who hasn't seen Joe DiMaggio play and I don't want to let him down my dad says that to me every time I go on stage and I think about it too I think what I do when I go on stage I look out at the audience and I pick out one like kid whether whoever it is I pick out one kid, whoever it is. I pick out one kid who's in it, and I'm like, man, this one's for you. That's how I do it.

So religiously, because it's kind of a paradox, man, because you write the music or you write a skit, and you care about it so much. And then every time you play it, it feels like you're almost giving a little bit of it to other people. And at one point, you're singing the song,, it's so sad because you love the song so much but you've sang it so many times. So when I look at the kid, whoever's out there, I'm like, that's it.

That's why I'm doing this, man. Let's go. Let's go. Because it means so much. What does it feel like when they sing along? Is that wild

when they know the lyrics? This year's been weird because like last year was such a crazy year for us growth-wise. People used to love it now now i'm like i'm getting no arrogance attached i'm just getting big enough to where people are like man i go to his shows can't even fucking hear him sing because everyone's singing everyone's singing

along yeah and it scares me a little bit because i fear that like what if there's like some like 50 year old woman or 50 year old man who's like sitting in this house and he's like, I'd really like to go to a Zach Bryan show to hear him sing these songs. Then you go to one of the shows and it's all these fucking reckless kids just doing it, man, shirtless. And the 50-year-old's sitting back there like, damn it, I just want to hear him sing it. Yeah, but they should be just

taken in that experience. That's what it is. You're not going to change it. No way. Stop singing. Hey, stop singing. I'm trying to listen to zach that guy sucks man whoever that guy is sucks ass man i hate that guy stormed the capital yeah of course of course of course and it's so sick man because we got we had charles wesley godwin on the on the road with us like the the first year and the second year and it's like such a it felt like when i was watching him open for us or whatever i'm not even trying to plug him but when uh he would be singing and like you'd be like these weird fucking like 2000 cap 3000 cap like roller rinks and all these american venues

like you ever been to the majestic you know in detroit majestic yeah and uh the venues like in san francisco the uh the warfield you look around and all this architecture is so beautiful. And you're hearing your opener sing and you're like, this is a chapter in something. This has got to be something. This is beautiful. There's all these 18 to 25-year-old kids just giving their everything to be there for you. And you're like, man, this is crazy. This is what you see like on on whatever

like you read this shit in books or whatever when i was in greece uh last week i got to see guns and roses in athens they're always playing not in america bro my dad always is like i saw them in japan i'm like why i think they played everywhere i think they play a lot in america too but of course just dumb luck that we happened to be there and I ran into Axl Rose at a restaurant and Axl invited me to the show I'm like oh shit this is wild and we went and watched Guns N' Roses

these dudes are 60 years old and just killing it murdering it for 3 hours I don't get it I love that man do your thing it was intense and it was like 95 degrees out. We were talking about earlier how hard the road is and stuff.

And I see these older guys doing it. I'm like, man, what's going on? Well, Mick Jagger, when the Rolling Stones were here, they played CODA, the Circuits of the Americas. Oh, yeah. My friend owns it. And he was explaining to me how they brought two trailers. Two trailers that are just Mick Jagger's workout equipment. Yeah. Two trailers full of shit. Still moving, man.

I mean, every day that guy works out. Every day. Has to. He has to. Like we were saying, it'll kill you if you don't. He's Biden's age. That's crazy. Bro. That's insane. He's Biden's age. I want to talk. Look at him out there. And doing

what I do at 27 I look at this and I'm like he looks great yeah and dude he's moving around you know like he's not stationary

he's not like just standing there singing the songs he's dancing as a young person man look at him go as a young person

that's not easy no man these guys because they're devoted, man. They're so into it. And the show was epic, right? So it's at this outdoor racetrack and they have these giant fucking

screens, this huge stage, and you're seeing Keith Richards and Mick Jagger right there. Come on, man. Right there. Dude, I'm telling you, it was like being on drugs. Dude. It was like a psychedelic experience. I couldn't believe they were really there. Those guys are so iconic.

Sometimes I wonder if they ever think about it. Like, do they ask themselves the same questions that I ask myself? Or, uh, not that sounded shitty, but like, since I'm smaller, obviously, like, watching those guys, I wonder if they came up and accidentally became legends. Or like, they... Well. They were so young. When they hit the scene, you have to stop and think about the 1960s. Was their dream to become massive musicians? No, I don't think anybody could have imagined they could have been the Rolling Stones.

That's what freaks me out. There's no way anyone can imagine being the Rolling Stones. Exactly. You think Taylor Swift imagined she'd be Taylor Swift? No way. Nobody. Maybe. Maybe.

Maybe. Maybe. Maybe. Maybe. Maybe her. But for most bands, the Maybe. Maybe. Maybe. Maybe her. Yeah. But for most bands, the idea is just to try to be successful. There's so many talented people, too.

Yeah. That's what freaks me out being me. I know like three chords on the guitar, and I'm like, ooh, what's up? And there's so many people that I get in these circles of these astounding musicians who aren't nearly as big, and I almost have like that, I have a real guilt of that, you know? I'm like, what the fuck am I doing? Why the fuck am I on stage, man? You're incredible.

You're on stage for your songwriting and your voice and your songs, man, and your music too, but it's like the combination of the things. And it's, you know, to toot your horn, man, it's uniquely authentic. It's just very, you have very authentic music. You can kind of tell when someone's bullshitting. For whatever reason, it feels like you could take, like, a certain amount of it.

Like, there's a certain amount of sugar that you can take in food before it starts getting gross. You know, where you're like, oh, this is so sweet. That's why the writing's so important. Like, it's, man, I can't do it. The writing is excellent. I can't listen to, um... Corny writing? Personally man i can't do it the writing is excellent i can't listen to um corny writing personally i can't well and there's no comedy and you gotta like love it to love it

but yeah like people in the car with me like what the fuck are we listening to and i'm right oh it's an indie song i found and i'm like the pretentious asshole you know you're that guy no i'm not no way like i usually put on like the barnyard shuffle 50 of the top hits when people are with me but when i'm alone you know what i found man i don't know if you've ever heard this song but um my friend brian simpson turned me on to this song and this song should have been a gigantic hit i hear those all the time. Should have been a... I mean, I hear this song. I'm going to send it to you, Jamie. What's it called? It's called I'm Alive.

Hold on a second. Let me find it for you. By Johnny Thunder. I'm Alive by Johnny Thunder. Here, I'll share it with you, Jamie. Man, I always want to be the guy. You got it? Yeah, I heard it.

You got it, Jamie? Listen to this man So this is a song from 1969 I believe And it was re-released Sometimes in the 2000s They probably thought the same thing as you But this is

Listen to this Oh man Come on How the fuck did this not make it? When did you hear this? My friend Brian just sent it to me He's like, you gotta listen to this Dude, you wanna be on the highway right now

Fuck yeah I wanna be dancing right now In a 69 Camaro Let's go Oh, shit. How good is this? That's crazy. So good.

You hear shit like this all the time. That's why I feel so bad on stage, man. Yeah, this is a guy from 1969. Sick cover, too, man. They had it right. They had all the art right. Yeah, I mean, that, dude. It's good.

Like in the 60s and 70s. Everything you see is just right. This one is particularly good. It's bigger. It dude is good. Like in the 60s and 70s. Everything you see is just right. But this one is particularly good. It's bigger. It's so good. And I'm like, a guy that can do this? This is like a world-famous, gigantic music artist. Someone who can do this?

This guy's a star. Well, it only takes once, too. If you put this on whatever people are using now. Yo. once too. If you put this on whatever people are using now. Yo! Oh! Dude, we gotta go run around, man. This is on our pre-show playlist at the Mothership.

I'm gonna start walking out to that. When we're hanging out in the green room, we listen to that. Well, there's a huge resurgence in music right now because of TikTok and shit like that. Yeah. Because people are like... Finding old stuff. Finding old stuff, which is a beautiful thing, also a scary thing, but I don't know anything. But it's cool because if one person that was big or whatever used that,

it might have a brand new life, which kind of stinks for the Johnny Thunder was his name. I think Johnny's dead. Which is, isn't that crazy? Like the Van Gogh thing where he knew he was going to be a famous artist and he like, I don't know if this is Van Gogh or I don't know if it's another one, but there was an artist back in that era of people who, my producer, Eddie, he used to tell me

this he said that uh one of those guys painted his entire life he would paint in like coffee shops and stuff and he would tell his buddies or whoever he would say i know one day these are going to be these are going to be worth something and then he like lived his life died and then 200 300 years later or 100 years later whatever he he got famous for and so it's like that's like the whole plant a tree and watch it like if you plant a tree you'll never see grow yeah plant a tree you never see it big whatever that shit is i know what you're saying you know what i'm saying yeah yeah and this johnny thunder somehow or another it slipped by how how old is he uh when he died his real name trying to look stuff up about him right now.

His real name was Gil Hamilton. Tom Jones covered it. Wow. I found a Ghostface Killah song that sampled it. Oh, nice. But yeah, I'm trying to look it up. What year did this guy? I think it said, well, the cover was 69.

His version, I'm Alive Thunder, 68. So Johnny Thunder's version was first, right? And then the 69 version I've also heard. Tommy James and the Shondells. Yes, it's not as good. He had to have wrote it, right, obviously? I think Tommy James and the Shondells wrote it. There's a Don Fardon.

But if he wouldn't have sang it like that, man. Oh, he sang it so good. Yeah, exactly. That's a weird conflict in my head, too. Right, that's a thing that's a thing right covering thing is weird i don't cover on stage because i'm i'm young i don't know right i don't act like i'm better than a cover i just i don't know like what i stand by well it's like do whatever you want to do man whatever resonates with you so but sometimes people just have a feel for a song and they want to redo it. When I knew everything at like 20 or whatever,

I used to hear covers and be like, wait a minute, you're ruining the feeling of a song. That writer wrote it and it means the world. Don't mess it up. Some covers are fucking amazing. I agree. Like Stevie Ray Vaughan's cover of Voodoo Child. Come on.

Some of the best songs of like ever were covers. Yeah, there's some amazing. Oh, on the wash tower? Oh, yeah. Oh, my goodness, yeah. Oh, right, that's Hendrix, right? He covered Dylan. And then, yeah.

Dave Matthews. Dave Matthews. Yeah, have you seen the live one where they're all on stage and just, it's nuts. And something recently in my life I've like started delving into, this is crazy to me that people don't even, and this isn't an issue I have no problem with this but people don't even give a shit about who wrote whatever if it sounds great which is cool in a sense but in my life even as like a writer or whatever I just now started going to the song credits like looking and it surprises me every single time because there's

people who you don't think would write something that did write it or someone who yeah sounded so great covering a song that you think they wrote it and then you go to it and there's like eight people writing it and you're like what this is crazy you know i just found out that mae west was a writer and mae west got arrested for writing i think it was a play she spent eight days in jail let's see yeah west yeah it was about sex there was something about sex that she got arrested for yeah maybe I spent eight days she looks like she looks like a badass oh she was a badass what did she do we actually have her couch yeah so the yeah Mitzi owned her couch and Mit Mitzi's son gave it to me. And so that's in our green room at the mothership.

We have Mae West's couch. I was trying to get it out. We reupholstered it. That's fucking crazy. Where was it at? Was it like in New York? It was at Mitzi's place. Where's Mitzi?

Who's Mitzi? Oh, I'm sorry. Mitzi Shore was the owner. That's that lady. She was the owner of the comedy store. Oh, wow. Okay. Members of the cast of Sex were hauled.

So the show was called Sex. She was such a hoe. Who'd have thought, man? What a powerful lady. February 9, 1927, Mae West, the original Cardi B, went backstage of a performance of her play Sex and found herself surrounded by

officers from the New York City Police Department's Municipal Vice Squad, which rounded up the cast and put them into black police vans. West was a smart-talking, wise-cracking, blonde bombshell of the 1930s cinema, famous for some of the sharpest and most suggestive one-liners in the history of the movies. As both a playwright and a screenwriter, she wrote many of those lines herself. She was like one of them original boss bitches. That's insane.

It's great to imagine. All these boss ladies now, like Cardi B's a big one. Who else? There's a lot of like, I guess you could say Lizzo's a boss lady. Who's a boss lady? Beyonce. Beyonce's a boss lady. Oh, yeah, the queen of them all.

Taylor Swift's a boss lady. There's a lot of boss ladies now. It's crazy to think about. They can say whatever the fuck they want. They're amazing, too. But back then, like in Mae West time, like someone who was like a badass lady. It was unique and they didn't care. Who wrote a play called Sex.

Yeah. Like in the 20s. That's nuts. That's nuts. So probably she didn't get arrested for that. I think she did. I mean, I think that's why she spent eight days in jail. Oh my goodness.

That was what they arrested her for. Yeah. That's crazy. What was the official charge? The charge was kind of interesting. So much time hasn't passed since this shit's happened. Like, my grandpa was born in, like, the 20s. Listen to what the charge was. Giving a performance not tending to advance the morals of the spectators.

Whoa, man. That's wild. Wow. That's wild. Wow. That's wild. She got arrested for giving a performance not tending to advance the morals of the spectators. That's amazing. Because it was all backed by, like, back in the day.

It was all, everyone just was so, everyone was really religious, man, morally. It was also, you could starve to death super easy back then. Wait, why do you say that? I mean, obviously, yep. Wait, in the 20s yeah dude that was the great depression like i'm a dumbass to come out of the depression 1927 was a great year was the great depression i thought that was like 1919 or something yeah right around there so people are still recovering from the depression my grandmother kind of never recovered from it. My grandmother used to, when she died, when they were cleaning out her house,

they found coffee cans filled with money that was stuffed away in the walls. That's what? Yeah, they were always worried. 1929. Yeah, because the Roaring Twenties. The Roaring Twenties and stuff from the 20s. Exactly. So this is exactly that time period that she made that play, which is wild.

Yeah, you would think people would want to go watch it. Get their mind off being so depressed, man. I don't think they had any money. And also I think it was like a hopeless, helpless kind of depression where everything crashed all at once. Like the banks collapsed. Well, everyone was like... What caused the Great Depression? It was the stock market crash, right? Yep. These motherfuckers have been monkeying around with numbers. That's insane. Well, everyone was like, you know, what caused the Great Depression? It was the stock market crash, right? These motherfuckers have been monkeying around with numbers for a hundred years.

I know, right? They've been fucking everything up for that long. Making insane amounts of money. For that long, man. Insane amounts of money. Like, that game, that financial banker game, like, oof, those guys. Well, being from Oklahoma, you hear a lot about, like, the Dust Bowl and shit, too, when the Great Depression came by.

And I'm like, how much shit did people have to go through, man? Right. Because it was like, I don't know. I'm not a historian. I'm sorry. You're not? I know. You hear shit about the Great Depression and the Dust Bowl hitting Oklahoma at once. And I'm like, bro, imagine complaining about how your coffee tastes, you know, like in the morning for us.

your coffee taste you know like in the morning for us it's like these people would wake up and like have to fucking be be just in the great depression and like lift their plate up and yeah it's just nuts to think about bro i mean there's a great um book rather a biography of this guy i think his name was danny mcgurdy i think it's called mc McGurdy Life of a Pool Hustler. And this guy was a pool hustler during the Depression. And he talks about being so hungry, just knocking on people's doors and begging for food. No shit. Going from town to town, being broke, trying to hustle people out of money. He wrote a book.

He obviously succeeded at one point, right? No, they wrote a biography of him. I think a guy named Robert Byrne wrote the book. Did you find it? I have it at home. I was telling you- But it's like you're just you're absorbing like the this that that those times were so desperate. Hopeless and desperate. Which is a scary place to be man. It's surprising the more people, this is really dark to say, but it's surprising the more people just didn't go off the deep end and like just Cared, you know, that's I'd have this. I think I talked to you about it last time I'm fucking annoying man. I tell my friends about this all the time like on the bus

uh I I lived in new york for a little bit And I lived like by the empire state building just because I wanted I thought I was some fucking I don't know I just wanted to get out of oklahoma for a little bit and go somewhere that I'd never been before. So I moved to New York City and I lived by the Empire State Building and every morning I would look up and see the Empire State Building. And one time my dad came and visited me and we went up and I was like, I'm a dork when it comes to like touristy stuff.

I love it. We had our, I love New York shirts on, our hats. And you're up, they, have you ever been in the Empire State Building? Yes. They have that simulation where it's like, you go in that floor and you see all these like hardened men like building and riveting the fucking oh yeah and man people were coming from uh like Iowa and California wherever the hell look at this guy adjusting that bolt dude it's probably making a dollar a day people don't have this anymore i

don't think they don't have the thing where you're like you're like struggling away and your family is whatever kind of person that could do them this is like an athlete like you have to be we talked about there was a guy recently we talked about on the podcast that to this day fixes shit like that i don't know what country he was in i don't know if it was america or somewhere else but this dude was climbing these fucking beams, these metal beams like an athlete. I was watching him do it. I'm like, I can't do that. So not only is he skilled, but he's carrying

tools and he can physically do things that I can't do. I'm watching him climb. Watch this guy. Okay, well there's another guy that's doing the same kind of thing. He's got a harness on. The other guy didn't have a harness. There's no way regulations would let someone do that in america it's probably somewhere else that is that is fucking wild you ever you ever seen like linemen oh now he doesn't have a helmet

people people who work on lines and stuff like the power lines is that my uncles did that growing up that's why i wear dog martins because my grandfather wore them and he would put his spikes on oh and my cousins and shit just climb poles like in 20 seconds they go up there and they're just like touching shit that can kill them all day and you're like oh my god it's crazy and they do that man it's nuts you ever i was watching this um i don't know it was a balloon or something that flew into these power lines and holy shit would. What, did it explode or something? They exploded. I think it was Mylar balloons or something like that.

They flew into these power lines. Is that what it is? Oh. These are other balloons that are caught. So this guy has to imagine just thinking you have to touch that thing, even knowing that it's not going to get you, understanding how electricity works. Just imagine wanting to be in contact with that amount of electricity.

Dude, you ever seen that guy who does it like in Montana? I don't know where it was, but he flies around on a helicopter and he gets in a basket and has this stick and he puts it out there. For lightning? Yeah. Oh, no, not for lightning, but he's fixing the... People don't think about where the power comes, like all the power. He does it out of a helicopter? Yeah.

He's hanging off a helicopter Just like messing with wires Oh my god Yeah This guy Oh my god This is the exact thing man No I look this shit up

Because my uncles do it And I'm like No fucking way man So what is he doing? Someone's gotta fix him When they go down And stuff like that This is so wild dude

It's crazy So this guy has to climb On these things? In Oklahoma Yeah It's a big economic? In Oklahoma? Yeah. Oh, no. It's a big economic thing in Oklahoma. What is he doing?

He's gonna climb in that? Yeah. What the fuck, bro? And that thing will just kill you, man. Dude. This is freaking me out. Well, he has... You know those Kevlar...

I don't know if this is right, man. I'm not a lineman, but... Look at that guy's going the other direction. You know those Kevlar suits that, like, shark people wear? Mm-hmm. They wear the same thing. The metal thing, I think. I don't know if it's the same shit but

So you don't get shocked Is that really going to stop you from getting shocked? Well it just prevents, it conducts a lot So it goes around your body as opposed to in it That's what that thing's doing? That thin little cloth that you have? Crazy man People do shit like that?

That's why those Empire State Building guys are so crazy One of those guys just died Some guy who was one of those climbing skyscraper daredevils. In that photo? Were they eating lunch? No. I don't know. Kelly Slater just sent it to me.

Want me to send it to you? That's why I don't get it. I respect it a lot. He was 30 years old. He fell off a building. Oh, that's so sad. He plunged 68 floors. Bro!

It was last seen knocking on window outside. I wonder why he was knocking. Because he wanted to get in. Of course. He couldn't figure out how to get in. He fucked up. That's scary. Somebody closed the window.

He climbed out. Somebody closed the fucking window. Oh, man. I wouldn't be disrespectful. I was wondering why he didn't just like. I think. I'm just guessing. He climbs up.

I don't want to be disrespectful to a man. I don't know what happened. I don't know if he just climbed out on the ledge. That's my worst fear, bro. You ever run on the... Bro, my hands are so sweaty right now just looking at that. The Golden Gate Bridge. Don't do this to me, Jamie.

Yeah, I can't do it either. Don't do this to me. I'm not a hot guy either. Not now. Not after that guy just fell. Have some respect. That's him? That's what it says.

Don't show me this, dude. Oh, that's sad, yeah. Don't show me this. That's crazy. Don't show me this. That's crazy. I don't get rock climbers at all. Bro, I've had Alex Honnold in a couple of times. He's a fascinating't show me this that's crazy i don't get rock climbers at all bro i've had alex honnold in a couple of times he's a fascinating guy i respect that i've watched all

of his stuff and the jimmy uh jimmy chin i follow him on instagram he's like always not to take away from alex honnold but dude jimmy chin i like followed him on instagram and all i see on his instagram page is him just like getting into Antarctica water and fucking skiing down mountains. I'm like, bro, what is your, like, how are you, you just do this, man. It's crazy. He's just doing nothing but wild shit. Nothing but wild shit.

And I think that's beautiful. And he has, he has such amazing footage and it's so cool to me that people can just devote their lives to showing that kind of thing. Did you ever see The Alpinist? Yeah. Yeah. Sad. Sad, but also, I mean, wild.

It's sad that his life, but. It blew my mind. Just the experience he had in the small amount of time that he was alive were so over the top to a normal person's life. How old is Alex? Alex Honnold, if I had to guess, what would you say, Jamie? 32? 37. 37?

And he was like the alpinist. I'm not comparing the two at all, but how old was the kid? What do you like a kid? This kid was pretty young. He was like 18. Yeah. Or something crazy. Well, he was getting so bored with free solo climbing that he was ice pick climbing on glaciers.

Yeah. So there was overhangs, like these massive ice overhangs. The videos you see him where he was just and he's climbing up these fucking things You get your either dude, dude. That is the crazy way to climb. That's so insane Imagine the strength to who's doing he was doing this shit Wait, is this the alpinist commercial? Yeah Yeah This is the I mean he was climbing things That nobody was climbing And what stinks the most is Yeah

Look at And he had like that Girlfriend who like loved him so much And she was so sweet about it She was like It's what he's It's what his passion is Dude

There's certain people That are just wired Way different He did all that crazy shit And he did such an amazing climb And things And he was just with his buddy In Alaska doing a I don't know if this is true,

but like a simpler climb, and that's when he passed away, and I'm like, man, that's got to be heartbreaking. I don't know if it was simpler because they died in like an avalanche. That's so, that's heartbreaking. I think he was climbing some insane peak when he died. I want to say it was in Argentina. Where was it when he died? I forget where it was, but it was crazy.

They couldn't retrieve his body. I remember watching The Alpinist and watching the whole film, and at the end, it just hit you with it. And at the end, you're like, wait, what? What? Yeah. Wait, what happened? What are you doing?

It was crazy. Oh, this is sad. It was Alaska. Okay. So after summiting a new route in Alaska's Mendenhall Towers with partner Ryan Johnson, the pair sent messages to friends and family from the summit, but disappeared while descending after being hit by a storm. Search and rescue teams discovered the rope several days later in a crevasse near the

base of the route, leading to speculation that the duo was struck by a falling rock, base of the route, leading to speculation that the duo was struck by a falling rock, I don't know what a cornice is, or an avalanche, while descending. What you don't? A cornice? What is that? I'm just kidding. I got no idea. Cornice?

Though the bodies were never recovered, so they only found like ropes or a cornice. That is so heartbreaking. And they were trying to call the family and friends. Massive hardened snow at the edge of a mountain cornice. That is so heartbreaking. And they were trying to call the family and friends. Massive hardened snow at the edge of a mountain precipice. Oh, interesting. Imagine just saying that in casual public. Learn something new every day.

You know, expecting people to know what you mean. Like, how pretentious. That guy's an asshole, man. That guy's an asshole. You're at a party? That guy's talking down to you, man. Yeah, I agree. For sure.

The worst kind of person. Yeah. A cornice. Oh, yeah. Everybody knows that, bro. Hey, man. Everybody knows what that is. This is what I person. Yeah. A cornice. Oh, yeah. Everybody knows that, bro. Hey, man. Everybody knows what that is. This is what I know.

Yeah. It's common snow terms for a thousand. I rock climbed like two times in my life, and I was like, I can't do this. I can't. You guys are crazy. Are you scared of heights? Yes. That's interesting.

Yes. I'm fearful of dangerous things. Whoa. Heights are dangerous. Jesus, dude. That's how you had to take the picture. Oh, my God, sir. But like I was saying, man, these guys. And look at that camera.

That camera's like a typewriter. What size is that goddamn thing? Bro, I fear that we'll never get that ethic back, man. Slippery ass leather shoes. Who does shit like that anymore? Who's that determined? Human beings are- They built the Empire State Building in two years.

I can't believe it. Sorry if I'm interrupting. No, did they really? Two years, man. Yeah. Dude, that's what I'm talking about, about the Empire State Building. That was such a beautiful fucking dream and ethic, and people from like Iowa and shit were like going to New York to build it because it was such a beacon of hope.

Hard times create hard men. Yes. Hard men create easy times. And it's so easy to think now, being in my position or whatever, like, oh, man, I wish I had an Empire State Building to build. But sometimes I got a song on the new album called Tradesman. Sometimes I wish, man, that I was, like, just doing something that gave purpose. You know, and obviously music does, and it's amazing that I get to do what I get to do. But, yeah, one year and 45 days, less two years one year in a month when i saw that

bro and this is in the 30s man imagine how determined men had to be bro or women like two but fucking a well it was all men doing that construction of course but the people at home and things like that who were taking care of those guys. Oh, yeah. And obviously I say that with respect. But just the human beings that were involved in the actual maneuvering and construction of that thing, like those are, that's extraordinary human beings. Hard, hard men, man, who like wouldn't stop for anything. And they knew what they were doing. How many of them died? How many people died during the construction of the Empire State Building?

They knew what they were doing was important. How many take this? What do you think? How many people died during the construction of the Empire State Building? They knew what they were doing was important. How many take yes? What do you think? How many died? There's 3,400 working on it. Okay, fair enough. Sorry. I thought you were going to give me the answer.

No, no, no. I'll give you something to build it off of. 3,400. 17 deaths. 17? Yeah, I say 17. 84? Whoa.

I'm going to say 84. Okay. That's pretty high. 84? Whoa. I'm going to say 84. Okay. That's pretty high. Five. Five. See, that's even more incredible. Five workers died in a slip and fall or struck by accidents over the 13 months of construction. Slip and fall.

In the 30s, you would think they all fell off of there. So in one year, four dudes fell from the sky and just splattered on the concrete. Bro. And I wonder- And everybody else has to go to work the next day. And they can't, I feel like back in the day, people were like, hey, shut up. Don't talk about it. Don't talk about it.

Because if they talked about it, I bet, I bet if they talked about it, like people would be too scared to do it. I think they just accepted the inevitability. They were devoted. Is what I'm trying to, like being in the Navy and things like that, man, like when you, not to be that fucking guy, but like you see, but you see you have kids working for you, 18- and 19-year-old kids, and you see just how people work nowadays is a little bit different. Same goes to me. I'm not any better.

I'm just saying those people who are building the Empire State Building were so devoted to the one task at hand, and they fucking did it in a year and 45 days. Those are different humans. They are, truly. One of the first incidents occurred while the building was still under construction. A worker who was fired from the job took his own life by jumping down an open elevator shaft.

Oh, God. When was it built? Oh, my God. Same time period. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. As the Great Depression, like, 29 to... It opened in 1931, so there we go.

What a beacon, man, for these fucking... For America. Because that was the tallest building in New York, I think. Oh, my God. To build that and be like, oh, yeah, Americans did that. We did that, man. Holy sh... What?

Someone jumped from the 86th floor and didn't die. Oh, God. It says a strong gust of wind blew her body back towards the building, and she only fell like one floor. Yo, I'm good, God. It says a strong gust of wind blew her body back towards the building, and she only fell like one floor. Yo, I'm good, man. I'm not going anymore. I'm not going anymore, man. No, that doesn't make any sense.

Have you ever been to the— Just the sheer amount— The lucky one. But the gust of wind had to be coming up under her. Was she lucky? I wonder what she was like after. It gets windy up high, I'll tell you that. Right, right, right. But is it possible

that like a hundred plus pound person could be slowed down by the wind to the point where they don't die? It doesn't sound right. Maybe. It seems off. Never know, man. You ever done it? I have not. Who knows? That's crazy. Crazier shit's happened. People have

fallen out of planes and survived. Like Skyjumper. I mean, uh... that just might have been a big ledge and she didn't you know she didn't jump out far enough you ever skydoped? it says she landed on a

three foot ledge about 20 feet below oh okay so she fell 20 feet yeah but it says she was on the 85th floor she jumped from 86

and landed on 85 alright that's it? I'm not discrediting the lucky one I mean that's what this says. I'm trying to find the year. Oh, so she was found laying on the ledge.

See? 85th floor ledge. That is the lucky one. I bet she was fine. Oh, good Lord. One time I fell 35 feet, man. That's far, man. I broke both my wrists,

both my collarbones. It was crazy. Oh, shit. And my buddy Graham, my guitarist now, I was like 15. He had to carry me up a mountain. Oh, my God my 35 not a mountain 35 feet ledge on a river it was nuts it's crazy it was a rope swing you do a rope swing yeah I can do a river

mm-hmm a man I thought I was so tough they were like we were young there was girls there I'm like man I'm gonna go the tallest rung I'm gonna do this but your boys being boys and like I climbed to the very top and tied it off and i went off forgot to untie it yeah and just immediately stopped and rolled down like rocks and i landed man this is why this is crazy but this is why one of the reasons why i like believe in god because i went and rolled and tumbled and my my head landed exactly where we'd been putting our feet all day long. So it was indented. So both my collarbones broke because I landed in that hole, and it hit like that.

And it was crazy. And I got up, and I didn't even feel it. I was in so much shock. And I went to climb up, and my wrist popped out. It was great. It was nuts, man. I'll never forget it. So you both both arms? My sophomore year in high school, man, I. It was great. It was nuts, man. I'll never forget it. So you both both arms?

My sophomore year in high school, man, I had like two casts. I was in a wheelchair. Yeah, it was crazy. How long did you have to keep them on for? One of my arms was in a cast for like three months. And the other one was like, I think, probably like two weeks, three weeks. Holy shit. I'll never forget it, man.

It was crazy. Holy shit. Yeah. Isn't it wild how when you get injured, you so appreciate not being injured. You don't realize. When I'm running a lot, sometimes I get this weird fucking feeling of like, oh, man, you got legs. Right. This is cool.

This is cool. And obviously, I mean that with sensitivity to anyone who can't run or anything. But sometimes I'm running, I'm like, wow, this is so beautiful that we can use our fucking legs and things like that to move. Yeah, if you're an able-bodied person, you're super lucky. You're solely like.005% of whatever. People realize it once they get injured.

Once they get injured, that's when they start going, oh my God, I'm vulnerable. Like I could be in pain all the time from this thing now. Yeah, like any time I've ever been sick, I'm this thing now. That's how you yeah like any any time I've ever been sick. I felt like that's how I'm like man, I can't believe we're just in a constant state of like I

Guess at a younger age being okay And what we were talking about earlier like working out as much as you can because old age is scary And I'm 27 but when I think about being older and I think about like arthritis and like All the shit that happens like your parent like our parents when they get sick and stuff, it's like our grandparents. Man, you got to take advantage of it now. Yeah. No matter who you are, when you're 98, you're fucked.

Yeah. Doesn't that scare you? Like what's the most fit 98-year-old person? Find the most fit 98-year-old person. I saw this video the other day of a 102-year-old climbing Yold climbing Yosemite and he climbed with his granddaughter and I was like That's crazy. I don't I just think I was gonna be a goner by like 40 not in a dark way But maybe they just want if they want to die. Why not die doing something they love I agree. It's how A lot of people feel about a lot of stuff and I don't know how i don't know did you ever see the documentary dirt bag it's about this famous climber who was uh just like this legendary

climber i forget his name but he basically just like slept in sleeping bags and slept on people's couches like this whole time and didn't give a fuck about anything but climbing and mapping out his climbing roots. And like these detailed maps of the roots. It's Fred Becky. And no one can say he was wrong, which is crazy. Play some of this because in the beginning it's really interesting to hear him talk. In the beginning, like hear him talk. In my head I thought he was young.

That's crazy. What's that, Jamie? There was music and shit still going on. Oh, okay. I can listen to that song head, I thought he was young. That's crazy. What's that, Jamie? I got, there was music and shit still going on. Oh, okay. I can listen to that song again, man. It was great. Yo. So this dude was like old as fuck.

Created his own culture. He became a culture of one. It's a grandfather. Sick video, wow. His name is everywhere. He was there before of one. It's a grandfather. Sick video, wow. His name is everywhere. He was there before the rest of us were. That's sick. He knows more about the mountains of North

America than anyone that's ever lived. One track mind most of the time. If it wasn't on women, it was on climbing. Fred was lively and addictive. There's some sort of magnetism there. Right now, I don't know what I'm doing except tomorrow. I have no idea.

As kids, we were together all the time. Our relationship deteriorated because he continued to climb, and I did not climb anymore. Fred was only focused on climbing, and he never felt sorry for you. If you're climbing, you ended up in a divorce. Whoa. Totally obsessive.

That's who Fred is. Dude, he's just sleeping on the ground. Yeah. Everywhere. Some people may think it's an adventure to go on a cruise ship to the Mediterranean. To me, it's no adventure at all. Somebody bombs the ship. That's insane. I can't think he'll get the recognition that he really deserves.

It's a really good documentary. That's insane. I can't recommend it enough. It's fascinating. When did it come? It was a few years ago I saw it. I don't know what year it came out. That's wild. Six years ago.

Six years ago? It's really good. He just sleeps on the ground. What's weird to think about is he just never stopped wanting to do that one thing. And for some reason, that haunts people. Is that a bad thing or a good thing, you think? Here's what's weird. If you saw him sleeping on the ground like that, and he was 20 years old, you go, oh, you know, he's a kid.

Yeah. Still living his life. Why is it when you see him when he's 70 years old like that, is it so sad? Because we have a thing everyone has to abide by in our lives, you know? Right. Which I think is, I don't know, I think it's good for us. It's good to have a thing everyone has to abide by in our lives, you know. Right. Which I think is, I don't know, I think it's good for us. It's good to have that thing? Yeah, I think it's good to, like, evolve past.

Not if you're that guy. I guess. That's what I was asking, like, who knows what's right. I think we have to realize that everyone is not wired the same, no matter what we think. And everyone thinks everyone should be. Yeah, everyone thinks that everyone should be wired exactly the way they are. And then when they aren't, they're pissed. Yeah.

It's just not the case. They want to control. Yeah. It doesn't work that way. Want to control, yeah. That's how I feel with everything sometimes. That's why I get so frustrated with people. Because everything I do, someone has an opinion or whatever. And I'm like, this seems like you just want me to be who I'm not when it comes to these these sorts of things that's just you're probably if I had a

guess you're probably taking in too many opinions of course man you know you should probably have as little opinions coming in as possible I think you know what you're doing deal deal isn't it crazy man it's nuts just stay away from other people's ideas. But also, like, I feel like people didn't grow up in this. I feel like people, this is a whole new world now. Yeah. Like, when I was talking to Travis, I respect him after talking to him and things like that. And we were talking and he was telling me about all these things. And I was like, I feel, and indifferently, I was like, man, I feel like we live in two different realms of music and things like that.

Because I feel like the world's so different now from when the whole Nashville scene was back then. And it's just funny to get to talk to other people and hear about their experiences and how they, I don't know. What's the big difference? I feel like radio was a huge thing. It might still be, but I feel like radio was a really, really big deal back in the day. And it's still a big deal, but it's becoming smaller and smaller and smaller. Yeah, nobody really, I mean, I'm sure some people do, but the amount of people that listen to radio now has to be.

I've been surprised by it lately because I've been going to the lake and stuff. I've been going to birthday parties and things, and I've heard a lot of radio and I'm like, oh wait people I guess people still listen to the radio. Can you make radio sound good? Like it was always like a lower quality signal, right Jamie HD radio now, but it's still using the same technology, you know, it's still spreading out radio waves But is it as good sounding as like like streaming xm sounds better right sure yes and then streaming's the best sound it's all compression it's gonna be people really care though most don't yeah a lot of people don't even realize they just want to hear it loud turn it up

that's crazy about like writing music and stuff like that because the first records and stuff they were so bad we recorded on like one at like this this kind of microphone And we didn't know what we were doing so everything just kind of sounded shitty But it was like a like renewed my like faith in humanity because no one gave a shit They were like no these are good songs man. We like them. It's authentic. Yeah, it was cool Yeah, there's something to be said for things being not that professional Mm-hmm, you know it's like it shows you more of who the person is i agree yeah as long as it's legit i guess the worst thing is fake authenticity you say you say that but like there's like um

all the rate oh man can't can't man i don't think people give a shit man that that much at least like, like the songs on the radio and things like that, they're all... Well, there's two different things going on, I think. There's people that are making songs that they think are going to be hits. And then there's people that are making songs because they want to create something special. I think there's two different things that are happening. And some people are really good at that one thing where they make hits. And they make these kind of catchy songs.

And maybe they don't resonate with you, but they resonate with enough people that they become real successful. But it's like, you know, it gets to all kinds of different levels. Like it gets to like the Milli Vanilli level, right? Where they created a fake band and they had these guys go out and lip sync it. That's insane. Yeah. I feel like that was more acceptable back in the day I feel like people are really hitting on the whole like real in this thing nowadays

When back in the day I feel like there were just mega stars who just did whatever like me like all the lip-syncing and things like all the Do people still do that today some people do right? I think I really know like I've seen oh didn't Cardi B Throw a microphone she got very angry. She's the two microphones though. I saw't really know. Like, I've seen... Oh, didn't Cardi B throw a microphone? She got very angry. She threw two microphones, though, I saw. Was the music still playing? Was there a drink in there? Yeah, she was rapping, if you will, over her track without the vocals taken out, which

they do sometimes. It's very... Yeah, it's very, like... It's very gray. It's like a gray area for me, but I don't... It doesn't make sense to me, because when I play... I'm sorry. Is that why the girl threw the drink in there?

No, but they also, also like getting way too deep. Some contracts, they might not pay for you to do the real performance. They might just pay for that, and you have a different fee for that performance kind of thing because it's less of a big thing for them. Yeah, less risky. It was like daytime in Vegas. Do people get mad when you do that? In Vegas, in the daytime party, why would you?

You're not, you know, you're just happy that they're there. Do you remember when there was a girl who got caught doing that on Saturday Night Live? That's what I was talking about when I brought it up. The whole like conspiracy behind lip syncing and stuff. But today production is so like fucking in everything that like people will just say they're like, it's a backtrack. When in reality, it's like a lot of their performance. And there's like a word for it they're like it's a backtrack when in reality it's like a lot of their performance and there's like a word for it now so it's okay i think man i've never like like dove into it or anything but it's kind of sucks when i got my boys up there like trying

busting their ass fucking trying to hit every single note right right which is a lot of beautiful bands who still do that to this day but you you hear about like a lot of like click tracks and shit like your in-ears, and it's like, oh, man, we rehearsed a lot to make this sound almost as good as that. It's a playback track or whatever. It's crazy. Yeah, that's a weird controversy, I guess,

with people, right? And I forget words all the time, which is crazy. I was at a festival two weeks ago, and I was playing in front of fucking 25,000, 30,000 people. And I was playing, and I literally blanked on it, and I had nothing. I got nothing. Oh, my God.

And I'm like, what'd you do? I just said, hey, I'm going to restart it. I forgot the words. And people were like, yeah, I mean, it makes sense to me, but it's such fucking, it blows people's minds. I'm like, no, I'm singing this stuff. Well, it's also cool for the people, too, because you get to see something that's rare. It's not just a regular performance you silly people are so inhuman to me when it comes like watching people perform I'm like how the fuck

How are they doing it you know yeah, because when I'm performing I like I'm I going crazy in my head I'm like don't forget it Forget it you got it. You got look at the kid have you ever taken anything from memory like nootropics or anything like that You know those those are? Budweiser every time. Budweiser will do a different thing. Yeah. Yeah.

I don't know if Budweiser is bad for your memory, but I don't think it's good. Can't be. The other guy, Huberman, said it kills you. Yeah, it's relaxing you. Yeah, it's crazy. But there's a bunch of different things that are called nootropics, and they're vitamins nutrients that you could take that actually help your memory they help brain function my buddy austin he takes

them all the time yeah he makes it a huge deal when he does too he makes a big deal of it he jokes about it man he'll he he doesn't like he jokes about it man he'll like take one and be like hey guys i'm on on it right now i can do anything you want it's crazy man but i've never felt like i needed to. I feel like I've done a pretty good job of remembering every word I've ever written when it comes to being on stage. But not even just for that. It's like it increases whatever the fuck is going on in your head when you're conscious. You know how you're awake and you're know, but you vary day by day.

You vary in like how well you can talk. You vary in how well you think. You vary in how much energy you have. What nootropics do for me is they can get you to a point where like there's less of the negative and much more of the like communicating and being able to think and being able to remember things at the peak of your abilities. Wow. You want to be closest to that. We joked about taking one before I came on here. Did you?

Yeah. You want to take more than one. I think I took like six. I take six at a time, those alpha brains. Because I like being quick. I mean, everyone likes being quick-witted when it comes to just speaking and communicating And things like that. I just like my brain working better. I guess like sometimes you feel fucking foggy That's what I mean when I said I forgot the fucking song that I've sang a thousand times

And you do it you do you fucking idiot? I'm sure and every time I get off stage I'm like holy shit, but that's touring too right you getting worn out man. Yeah, I think so Like how many months have you been looks like the longest run you've done? At the beginning of the year, when you saw us in Austin, two step in started our like Europe run into the May run, which was like 60 days. It was, sorry. It was absolutely insane.

And at the end of it, we ended at Railbird in Kentucky. And I just laid in the grass and i was like thank god it's crazy man but then you see fucking mick jagger and stuff doing it you're like man why am i complaining shut up you know you're like get on stage bro i don't think mick drinks anymore that checks i've been there too well it's been a weird i guess it's been a weird conflict in my head because i don't like take anything I don't like take pills or anything getting on stage is scary I mean like normal pills like beta blockers

they keep you from freaking out but dude I have like have you ever taken those? no I've always wondered I've taken them one time and I took them and I was like this feels weird man I'm not like in it because I get really bad stage fright

like super bad stage fright and i like but then as soon as i'm on stage i'm like oh this is sick i don't know where it comes from so it's right before every time just before and i i just like my whole body locks up and i'm like you can't do this you can't do that oh we're doing it oh okay cool and then i'm doing it i'm like why are you freaking out i think it's just because you love what you do and you want to do it great. Yeah, nervousness is a good thing. I think there's a certain amount of nervousness is a good thing. And I'm grateful for it.

Yeah, it puts you on edge. Truly, it's nice. Because your performance is like, when I saw you live, you're so hyped up, man. So it was really exciting. It was really fun. And you have to be nervous before every show to accomplish that. I just want to be hungry man You know like I miss yeah, I don't miss it I still am but I just always want to feel that I always want to feel like I'm proving something

Every single time you can keep that I know I know and it's been beautiful to see that over the last three years Cuz I thought at this point I'd be like oh Man, it's beautiful. It's cool. I think if you love what you do you can keep it. I think there's just as You're gonna get more and more successful, it's going to get more complicated. Your life will get more complicated. It gets more intertwined and it gets more public. And you're going to experience a lot of success. And when you experience a lot of success, then it becomes weird.

And then you have to readjust constantly to this dealing with that new way of life readjust this new you know new amount of pressure that people have on you to adapt yeah adapt it's crazy to think man i i remember like when it all first started i was like oh this is it i did it yeah and it was like two months in i had no i had no idea i got it i got a steak dinner bought for me by like a label or something i was like man if all i get from this is steak dinner then i did it and it's just it's been really beautiful to like watch it unfold and see how it all worked out that's awesome it's crazy it's absolutely crazy yeah it is a crazy story right it is yeah and being in the navy for like nine years beforehand is even crazy because no one ever talks about that i'm like like, bro, I busted my ass, man.

I was like in Africa and fucking Bahrain and stuff. And I was like. What'd you do in Africa and Bahrain? I was a, this is a crazy story in itself, but I won't tell the whole thing. Tell the whole thing. Shit. Okay, so. Crack open a second Bud Light and let's go.

Like I said about my dad, he was in the Navy for like 25 years. So I was, hey, man. Look at you. Hey, man. Dork, bro. I've always loved Dressed Blues, though. That is sick. You ever heard that song, Dressed Blues, by Isabel?

No. It's beautiful. It's beautiful. But my dad was in the Navy for like 25 years. And my mom was in the Navy. Like I said earlier, my grandpa was in the Navy for like 25 years and my mom was in the Navy like I said earlier my grandpa was in the Navy and so growing up when I was like 14 years old I was like man I'm gonna be in the Navy that's all I want to do I want to like die for this country man his best country in the world I want to

be in it I want to experience that whole like Empire State Building thing where yeah you're devoted to something yeah and so I turned 17 and my dad was a recruiter in Oklahoma and i was like okay cool so he like helped me get recruited and i was supposed to go in the navy as a diver but shit fell through my dad was like it'll be fine you'll get to boot camp and they'll ask you if you want to be a diver and then you can just say yes and it'll be fine so okay sick it's like get on a fucking bus and i'm like let's do this and i was nervous i was scared man i was terrified because as like a kid you don't really know what to expect in the military

and um i like end up at boot camp which is crazy and i was terrified and then i realized it was all just kind of routine and stuff like that and i got out of boot camp actually no that's not the whole story i was trying to be a diver and and uh one day they were like hey you're gonna get to you're gonna get to reclass what you're doing and they gave me like two options and it was like be a master at arms which is like a cop in the military or be a aviation ordnanceman which is like the dudes who like load the bombs and things on planes and i was pissed at my dad i was like what the hell man i thought you said i was gonna get to be a diver i called him i'm like dude you suck man

and so my buddies were all aos which in the navy they're all fucking made fun of because they're all like big old dumb idiots and then i became an AO and I went to A school to be an AO. And it was amazing, man. I met some of those beautiful people I've ever met. I've learned more than I've ever learned. But while I got stationed in Nebraska and I hate this. I'm not going to oversell this because I don't want to sound tough. But I trained to be a SEAL for like two years with this guy named Senior Chief Lundquist out of Omaha Nebraska and I trained really really hard I took a bunch of these PSTs

and I would call my mom like every day she would ask me how far I ran how far I swam how how many like how much I lifted and shit and then I don't take it lightly either I never I'm not tough it never happened but I wanted to go to Bud's really bad. Cause like I said, I wanted to do something that was greater than myself. And then the day, the day my package came back for the seal, the Bud's thing, my mom had died. And I was like, well, fuck man, this sucks. This is crazy. And all the while I was an AO and I hated, I hated it. I was like, oh shit, now I got to be an ordnance man. And, um, when she passed away, I was like, man, I don't want to do that. I don't want to,

I don't really want to pursue that. So I bitched out for sure. And I wish I wouldn't have sometimes, but like life is crazy. And my chief, my chief was like high ranking. He looked at me and he was like, man, you want to go out there and die or something? Why do you want to do this so bad? And I was like, I guess you're right. And it's one of those stories in my life where i kind of i look back and i'm like man if things would have been different what would have happened but uh she passed away and then i moved to washington to be an ordinance man and as soon as i fucking landed in washington they sent me they sent me to the desert this balrraini desert, to learn how to build missiles and load missiles. It's crazy.

And it was sick, man. It was beautiful. You had to build missiles as in load them or as in disassemble and reassemble? And this is different from EOD. There's Explosive Ordnance Disposal, and then there's AOs, which AOs are kind of just like the little tiny baby cousin of not even, they're not even connected, EOD they're some badass guys, AOs are just the dudes who build, load, arm and

dearm the bombs that are on the planes that are taken off just build bombs, no big deal yeah, it's cool man, it's neat but fucking it's crazy, so I was in the desert man, I was fucking like 19 years old, like oh shit, okay I'm here, and I was a the desert, man. I was fucking like 19 years old. Like, oh shit. Okay, I'm here.

And I was a sand sailor for sure. I never like was on a ship. And so that was my first deployment and I fell in love with it. I wanted to do it like always. I was like, this is amazing. I had this really great gunner. Gunner is like your officer above you. And he just inspired me so much to be the best that I could be like every day.

So I'd go into work and be, dude, I was a fucking kiss ass like in the navy everyone hated me because i was like let's do it let's go to war man let's go and we were just doing simple shit like eating dinner you know and uh but i i fell in love with it and i wanted to do it forever and so we would like launch planes out and like do the keys and shit to arm the missiles that took off and things like that. And I forgot what your damn question was. I'm so sorry. Like at the very beginning. I don't remember what the exact question was either. Oh, yeah.

Just being in the Navy in general. And what was it? What were we talking about? We're talking about something in specific. I know. Specific story. Exactly. And I said I didn't want to tell the whole story.

God damn it. Oh, I was just saying that I was in for like nine. I was in for like nine years and no one ever talks about that shit now. And I was like, but, and then I went to Djibouti, Africa, which was crazy. That's right. I asked you about Africa and I asked you about Bahrain. Yeah. That's what started it. Yeah.

And then I was in Africa for like, dude, I've been in Africa for like a year of my life. I was deployed there twice. And it's like, I loved every second of it because I'd wake up at 5 a.m. every morning and like go eat breakfast. Go like load your plane. Go eat lunch. What part of Africa were you in? Djibouti. And where's that?

The horn. It's like right on the edge. Either top or, I'm going to sound like an idiot. Was there a lot of wildlife? No, we were stuck on the base. Oh. The whole time. You an idiot was there a lot of wildlife no we were stuck on the base oh the whole time you can't even go off the base it's crazy it's called camp luminaire yeah and it's but it's cool though because there's like eight gyms man and like food that's all you do and you're as happy as you're happy as fuck because it's so simple that is wild and you go

to breakfast workout go do your job workout that's what it looks like there no way a little shittier where we were man it's cool and so you're just on the base and that's it yeah and then every every more like whether there's like cluster bombs or whatever you'd like go you'd go assemble them or load them and shit and it was it was really crazy yeah and then like I said that one day I just like ended up like it was overnight one day I just went to fucking Jacksonville Florida and was playing my guitar on Twitter and it's like blew up and then my chief was like hey man it's crazy you got a fucking this is a this is a conflict of interest man you can't cuz I was famous yeah I was like I think

they were scared that I would show up to work and just be like fuck you guys man i don't need this you know it never happened i would never do that because i was so devoted to being in the navy but they thought you they were losing all power over exactly which is crazy to think about man and i had this fucking my uh my gunner one day comes up to me and he's like hey man this is getting is getting crazy. You gotta get out of the Navy. I'm like, okay, whatever. Do I have to? And he's like, yeah.

And I was like, I'd rather not. And he's like, okay, too bad. And then he was like, okay, you'll be out of the Navy next week. And I'm like, that's crazy. All right, been doing this for eight years now. And then it took eight months to process me out of the navy and it was crazy because every

day i would go into work and think like oh this is my last day in the navy cool for eight months this is my last day you gotta work as hard as you possibly can man make it count make it count make it count and every day i'd go in and just bust my ass and then dude fine like six months in i'm like i'm in the fucking navy forever, man. Sounds good. Jesus Christ. Why is that? Is that just standard for paperwork? It's never happened.

It's never, like, I think, don't quote me, but like Elvis Presley was the last guy who got like honorably discharged out to make music. And I'm not like being arrogant in that either. I think that's true. Damn. It just never happens like that. There's been a lot of stuff with like NFL nfl players who are like at the academy the naval academy who like are really good at football and getting drafted the nfl they have to like get transferred out and stuff like

that but it's never happened like some joe shit the ragman ao like me and that's when i knew it that wouldn't do when my gunner called me that day and he's like pack your bags i was like holy oh this is that serious i called my dad day and he's like, pack your bags. I was like, holy, oh, this is that serious? I called my dad. I thought he was going to be disappointed because he was a master chief and stuff. And I was supposed to be a master chief. My dad had like a bottle of whiskey when I was a kid that said Master Chief Brian on it for me when I made master chief. Wow.

I thought when I called my dad, he'd be disappointed. But he was like, hey, man, come home. Do it. And I thought it would flop. I thought it'd be nothing in a year. But you were already successful online. Yeah, exactly, exactly. But I still, I never, like, played a show or anything.

And then we went, like, I got out of it. Do you remember your first one? Oh, yeah. What was it? It was the pageant in St. Louis, Missouri. How many people? There wasn't a very first one. This is unfair to say.

Like, my best friends in Washington when I was in the Navy, I used to play at this place called, I used to play, like, shitty acoustic sets at this place called Off the Hook, where, like, all the sailors went, like, on the weekends and shit. And my best friends, Austin and Kramer, they used to come to the bar and watch me, these two fucking dudes just looking at me play.

And every time I'd finish a song, they'd clap for me, man, because they're real friends, you know? And that was like the very first show I ever played. But the pageant in St. Louis, I got out of the Navy, and here's what's weird for me, because musicians have a...

I'm talking way too much. I apologize. No, you're not at all musicians have usually a pipeline which drives me crazy i don't know why but they have a pipeline of like oh man i played small bars and then i played bigger small bars and then i played the bigger bigger small bars then i went to medium venues and then i went to bigger medium venue and they have this like thing where they're proud of it of course which i would be too that's a journey but when i got out of the navy i was already like there so i like hopped on a fucking tour bus so hey you're going to the pageant in st louis play how many people is that i think 2,000 2. Wow. Which was crazy for me because I never played a shit.

And people blame me a lot for this shit. Like, they get mad at me. And I'm like, bro, I didn't fucking do this. I didn't mean for this to happen. Why are they mad at you? I agree. And it freaks me out, too. And I just, like, I wish I could just talk to people and be like, hey, man, this is all.

There's a phrase that I've heard that I've repeated way too much but i'm gonna say it one more time um this i forget who who said this but we'll we'll look it up all criticism is the tragic result of unmet needs so people who feel like they should be you people feel like man the arena shit i was thinking about that before i got here yeah there's something to that there's something to like what what you do with your. If you're a big old hater, Marshall Rosenberg, father of nonviolent communication, said that every criticism, judgment, diagnosis, and expression of anger is the tragic expression of an unmet need. Peace requires that we develop the skills to recognize the needs, feelings, and values that influence our perspective so that we can respond. I forget what it's not.

Wow. I don't know what the rest of the article says. That's just the highlight. But whatever it is, oh, so we respond appropriately. Often we react to situations and people that push our buttons, that have recognized that our emotions are simply a guide to uncovering the unmet needs inside. Instead of looking outwards in blame and judgment, self-awareness helps us see our role in each interaction. That's insane. Beautiful.

Brilliant. And I get that, but you're like empathetic to those people. You can't be empathetic to someone who's mad at you because you're successful. I learned the hard way. We did a whole bunch of shit with ticketing and stuff like that. We tried our best, actually.

As a man, I was like, okay, I'm going to fix this problem, man. This is happening. I remember we were having a conversation on the phone about it. Yeah, exactly. I was like, man, it's me. I'll be the guy. I'm going to do this. And then I did it, and it was just...

Theo was on the video and stuff for it. I put out the scalpers. I was like, I'm going to make everyone register. We're going to show IDs at the venue. Tickets are going to be $150 no matter what no matter what i don't care and um fucking backfired on me because people were just so angry at me about it and i was just trying to do the right thing and so it kind of where was everybody angry at you no some of the people happy with you of course it's hard to Yeah, that's the problem. Exactly. It's hard to tell. That's the problem. And that's why in that Dunbar's number, those five close

confidants, those are the ones you need to be able to have a conversation with about that kind of shit. And that's the thing about my life, which is, sorry, that's the thing about my life, which is so crazy is because I have so many people that are so close to me and they know why i do what i do and the feelings that i feel and why i'm why i try so hard and why i do this why i do that same with everyone's life but it's hard i think to be a figure or a big figure and say one thing to those people and then the public eye sees something else right and it's like damn tried tried my hardest you know it's crazy man it was nuts it was like psychotic like we're saying though someone there's always going to be someone that's upset and if you have people upset at you even if it's a small percentage of the

people that that feeling is magnified it feels way worse but their feelings are valid though too like those that small amount of people whose feelings are like that. I have that problem. It depends on what we're talking about. Very true. It depends on what we're talking about. I mean, sometimes it's valid, but sometimes it's just a pure expression of that paragraph that that guy wrote. Yeah. Very, very true.

It could be that. Because there's a lot of people are upset because they didn't figure it out and they didn't get the breaks they thought they deserved. figure it out and they didn't get the breaks they thought they deserved and they didn't get opportunities or they got a bad roll of the dice in terms of like their life and where they grew up and and they get really angry when they see someone who hits the lottery and some people hit the lottery you know they respect i think most people respect a long grind to be like the rolling stones like if you're the rolling stones like how can you not respect that the guy's 80 he's up there still killing concerts and killing and probably when they were a younger band they yeah grinded and grinded and grinded in those like

i was saying earlier with those small venues those medium venues and things like that so nobody would hate on the rolling stones no but someone would hate on you because you're new so it's this new thing with this guy like he didn't even have to try that he didn't even play this motherfucker was in the navy this is bullshit i've been on the fucking road since i was 12 and people forget man about the fucking like four or five hours a night I spent after a shift in the Navy, like, doing the shit, writing songs, getting good at writing songs. People forget that it takes a lot to be a good writer. Yeah. You know, and I'm not talking out of my ass.

I'm saying that that's one thing in this life that I know that I've earned because I've written so many things. And I've had so many shitty songs that I've, like, and I'm like, come on. Do you write pen to paper or do you write with a laptop or a computer? Pen to paper. I can't. I have fucking 70 notebooks in my truck right now. Wow. Because I just, and they're all like.

Do you store them? Do you like store them like, like images of them or anything? No. No? I think it's kind of cool. It is cool. It's very cool. It's not fucking.

Super valuable. I know. Last year I had a buddy buddy we were at the studio in Times Square and he had this backpack on my notebook four of my notebooks were in it

with like every like yeah I don't know if I should say this but uh like every song I'd written in the last like two years and it was dude that's scary

left it oh crazy man no crazy man oh my god did you freak middle of New York City I was terrified but left it. Crazy, man. No. Crazy, man. Oh my God, did you freak? Middle of New York City.

I was terrified. That's why I don't know if I should say it. Someone's going to fucking go on a scavenger hunt and look for it. They're going to find your fucking songs and try to sell them back to you. It's crazy. Maybe you can get a reward. Put out a reward.

Maybe some kid... How long ago was this? November last year. Homeless people wipe their ass i know exactly man think about that bro yeah i wonder if imagine if there was like a fucking super hit i think about it all the time like something in the orange and it's out there and some homeless guy's wiping his ass with it right and he loves it and he loves it man it feels great i think about it so every morning i wake up i'm like fuck man who'd have thought maybe someone will find it i think everything happens for a reason though yeah so maybe maybe i had a fucking shitty album in there oh i doubt it dude it's crazy but yeah i'm pen to

paper for sure are you when you write your comedy are you i write on the computer i don't you think that hurts it no i can write faster and your comedy is hilarious i'm just asking if you think it makes a difference in writing pen to paper. It hurts it in terms of memory, yes. So I write pen to paper when I'm writing stuff down before a show. So I'll write on index cards and I'll write on my notebook before a show. So I'll write out key bullet points, key important parts of a bit. But when I'm writing, I don't want to be hindered by time.

So if I have a thought, if I'm sitting there and I'm writing, and I can type be hindered by time so if I have a thought if I'm sitting there and I'm writing and I can type without looking so as I'm sitting when I have ideas I can get them out I can write appreciation like that, that quick but if I have to write

a P-O it takes too much time I'm the opposite man I'm an ass, I'll takes too much time. Yeah. I can... I'm the opposite, man. I'm a fucking... I'm an ass. I'll, like, take as much time as I can writing the song. But that's nothing wrong with that. Of course, yeah.

I know a lot of comedians, like my friend Mark Norman. He carries a stack of index cards in his pocket. It's, like, that thick. Why are you so worried about wasting time? No, it's just better for me with thoughts. With time, like, the more... Like, when I'm writing something out, if I have a thought and I got to capture it, if I can get the words onto the screen quicker, then I have less of a chance of not. Forgetting it or something.

Yeah, not holding on to the idea. Wow. Because if I have to write out a word and they're like, fuck, what was I saying? Where did I go with this? And they're like fuck what was I saying where did I go with this? I want to I want to be real sure that I have like a flow of ideas to documenting the ideas Ideas to expanding on the ideas, and I don't want to be herky-jerky touch typing

I've been pointing and I don't want to be I mean not you know poke typing Yeah, I want to be able to just write when I can just write It's so much I can get so much more done. So I can write paragraphs. And the more paragraphs I write, the more there's a chance that there's something fertile in there. Something great in there. And then I take those things and I take them out. That's happened to me before.

And I put them in another file. You forget some shit. Always. Oh, it's terrifying. I know. Always. I have great ideas in the middle of the night. I'm like, I'll remember.

Never remember. Never remember. I'm like, this one I'll never forget. Melodies are weird. Melodies are really weird. Yeah. How do they come to you for the most part? I just have to have a guitar.

I'm different than a lot of people. A lot of people, it just pops in their head. I'm like, no, I got to sit with my guitar for like 10 hours. Yeah. And play. It's such a different but the same thing. I feel like writing comedy is probably similar to writing songs in a way how do you get jokes in your head you have to write and you have

to think and you have to hang out with your friends a big one is hanging out with our friends like so you know you've been to the the mothership and see how we all hang out together everyone's talking shit and laughing and we're like there's so like the other night ron white was telling this story and i said did you have you told this on stage? And he goes, no, I haven't. I go, fucking please do. You gotta. I'm like, that is a giant chunk of material.

I'm like, please write that down. That is hilarious. He's done that like three or four times. But funny people are just funny people. Ron White is so funny. I wish I could meet him so bad, man. Oh, you can meet him. You can meet him.

I remember being a kid. I'll set it up. Are you in town tonight? I'll have you meet him. I'll meet Ron. Dude, he'd love to meet you. him so bad, man. Oh, you can meet him. You can meet him. I remember being a kid. I'll set it up. Are you in town tonight? I'll have you meet him. I'll meet Ron. Dude, he'd love to meet you. He's the fucking man. My daddy forced me to watch him, man, when we were kids.

And not that he's getting old or anything. I'm just like, remember that fucking dude? He's definitely getting old. We all are. Do you remember that? He's awesome. The four dudes, when we were younger, you'd get it on DVD. It was like Larry the Cable Guy, Ron White, Jerry.

It was huge. That's what made Larry the Cable Guy, Ron White, Jerry. Yeah, Blue Collar Comedy Tour was huge. That's what made Larry the Cable Guy. That's what made Ron White. Jeff Foxworthy was already really successful. It was huge. Everyone watched it. I remember my whole family was talking about it in Oklahoma like that. Huge.

I'm like, ew. It was huge. That's crazy. But I've learned that. What you were saying about, that was really beautiful what you said about you have to hang out with your friends. It's a big part of it, right? Like communication with each other, talking about stuff.

People want a lot from you as well as me as well as whoever. And if you're touring all year and you're playing these shows and you're on a bus and you're going in an arena and out of an arena, you're not living these things that you can write about. And when you're a writer, takes it like bothers you a lot because you're like oh like i have an album coming out soon and i'm like damn man i hope it's good enough because i've been fucking touring for three years because i haven't gotten to live the things that i want to write about yeah like those amazing songs that people want that it takes it takes like experience in this life it takes living which is such a paradox because it sucks because you want

to be playing the songs you've written in the past but you also want to be writing the songs you have in the future you know it's nuts well i mean you your songs in the past are always going to have but it's when there's an exciting artist like yourself and i'm a fan i think you're awesome thank you joe and when i listen to your I'm like, this motherfucker could write songs like this forever. There are certain people that, it's like Dave Attell, like my friend Dave Attell. Dave Attell can write funny jokes forever. Forever. When he dies, he will be funny the day he dies.

But is he funny because he's relatable? No, he's just awesome. He will be funny the day he dies. But is he funny because he's relatable? No, he's just awesome. He's just so good. He's so polished, and he's the most underappreciated stand-up of our generation. I feel like an asshole for not knowing him. He's so fucking funny, man. I'm going to let you know. He's so good.

He's hilarious. Is he at the Mothership ever? Yeah, he's been. He's been. He's also, he's in New York most of the time. That's where he lives. But he's a legend. Like a comedy legend.

And a legend amongst comedians, like universally loved amongst comedians. And he just fucking – I would never imagine a time where that guy's not going to come up with something funny to say. No shit. It's not going to exist. Just like you. I'm not going to imagine a time unless you fall apart on us. Yeah.

Well, it's a nonexistent fear. I remember when it all – I fucking hope so. Keep it together, bro. Well, it's a non-existent fear. I remember when it all, when it all, I fucking hope so, man. Keep it together, bro. You too. I mean, you're on the other side. You had to have times in your life where you, like, in fame. I don't know, man.

Bro, every day. Every day. I'm like, keep it together, bitch. You gotta do it. Every day. Every day. And that's why you're getting that fucking cold plunge, man.

That's why I do all that torture shit I do to myself. I'm doing it because I'm smart. I know what I'm doing. Bro, you've inserted yourself into everyone's head every morning. It's infuriating, bro. Every time I wake up, I'm like. I know what I'm doing. Bro, you've inserted yourself into everyone's head every morning. It's infuriating, bro. Every time I wake up, I'm like, fuck, dude.

Gotta go. How about Joe's doing some shit right now, man? Yeah, and I think that, too. I think that. I do. I do it for myself. Like, I do it anyway. But I do think, imagine if people were watching you and making sure you're not half-assing this.

That's another thing about me and you i guess but like you gotta keep going gotta keep going you can't stop even if it sucks that was a that's a crazy thing to think about like along your along your journey no matter what if it's bad or not if your jokes are bad if my songs are bad yeah you can't you have to write the bad jokes and you have to write the bad songs and you have to keep going because if you don't, you're never going to write the good one. Sometimes I would imagine, like I've had bad jokes that like, I was like, I can't figure out what to do with this. I have an idea, but it's just too clunky.

And then like two years later, I revisit it. Oh, yeah. And now I have a new premise that ties in with it. I'm like, oh, yeah. Oh, my God. It slips like a glove. It makes sense. Perfect.

That's what writing songs is like too Because you write three lines Yeah, that's what I was going to say You have times where you write a song and you don't like it But then you come back and you have new ideas And then something from that song That's how all songs, for me, are written Except a few of them Here's what's interesting

I don't want to say huge Come on and ask The big ones that I've written, the ones that were successful, they were always two-minute songs that I sat down and just fucking jotted and then did a video and then people loved them. And I was like, shit, man. But the ones I think about a lot, the ones that I write and write, write, they're always like no one really cares about them.

It's funny. I'm like, fuck, man. Maybe I should just get drunk and write write they're always like no one really cares about them it's funny I'm like fuck man maybe I should just like get drunk and write really fast I think Sturgill Simpson said that about you can have the crown like that one song I fucking love that song Sturgill's so good man what a hero

he's the fucking best dude all those guys are he's off the grid now living on an island good for him yeah that motherfucker doesn't play bro I follow a fucking Instagram called where is Stgil simpson you follow that one too and it's just like random shit he's doing no i just wait for text messages he's one of those guys you you like you just watch him exist you're like man i love him to death i wish i wish i could meet him or whatever dude i will hook it up if he's in town if he comes visit sometimes i feel bad because

like i said i know like three chords and shit and Sturgill's writing songs about like metaphysics and all that. Well, you know, Sturgill was... Yeah, yeah, that one. That's the one, bro. Go down, bro. It's so funny. There's all these fucking crazy pictures of him with puppies and shit. He's a wild bro. He's such a man's man, bro. I love him to death. Yeah, me

too. I love that dude to death. I'm so curious about him, man. When I first had him on the podcast, I had heard there's a psychedelic country guy. And I listened to a couple of his songs and then had him on the podcast. And I was like, I wonder if this guy's going to want to play music. I wonder if this guy's going to play music. I wonder if he's going to just want to hang out. And we just fucking smoked weed and talked shit.

It was amazing. It was amazing. I can't smoke pot, man. But you can. It's totally possible. I guess, yeah. I hate't smoke pot, man. But you can. It's totally possible. I guess, yeah. I hate to sound like a bitch. Do you get paranoid?

We smoke a lot of pot. Well, I used to smoke a lot of pot. Well, after I got out of the Navy, obviously, I was like, okay, I got to do it now. Because I didn't smoke. I didn't do drugs for like nine years. Right. Obviously. Because you tested.

Every day in the Navy. Right. And I didn't even know it was a thing. And then my buddy JR, he smokes quite a bit. And there's nothing wrong with it. But, man, I lived in New know it was a thing. And then my buddy JR, he smokes quite a bit. And there's nothing wrong with it. But, man, I lived in New York for a little bit. And one night I got some gas station marijuana. Gas station marijuana.

From a fucking corner stop. And I smoked it. And I was on this scaffolding thing in New York looking at the stars. And I thought everything was fine. And then all of a sudden my world collapsed. Which is such a bitch thing to say i don't really know i thought my fucking body was collapsing and i thought you know it's crazy it was like a positive feedback loop in my head and i was like oh man my body's collapsing i'm

fucked and i called my sister my dog's running around the apartment i'm taking my shirt off bro my dog's running around with me i'm like you gotta stay on the phone with me i can't do it oh my god it was crazy so many people have had that experience but yeah I know and it's like you just gotta do it enough to do it

but I don't really like there's never been a part of my life where I wanted to do it enough to get to the point where I was okay with it you definitely don't have to and I take like two hits with the guys out there

and shit like it's no big deal there you go that's all you need but every time I think it's a different thing I'm like okay this is the time

I'm gonna fucking lose my mind you just went way too deep you take you do mushrooms occasionally yo i've been known to do some yeah i've been i uh i love i love shrooms a lot i think they should be not just legal but we should have centers where people who are educated in the right dosage and the right you know for whatever it is for a person. If you want to achieve a certain thing and they should have like screenings and like mental health screenings for people and then they should have guided psychedelic experiences. And I think it would make the world a better place.

Don't they do that shit with like Klonopin or something? I don't know. No, no, ketamine. But I don't think it's, ketamine. They definitely do it with ketamine. I don't think it's for everybody. It's not for everybody. I don't think. No, no, ketamine. Ketamine. They definitely do it with ketamine. I don't think it's for everybody. It's not for everybody. I don't think anything's for everybody.

I think there are some people that have psychological problems and they shouldn't do anything that perturbs their normal state of consciousness. Wow. I've heard that said by experts, so I'm just repeating that and I agree with it because it makes sense to me. But for a lot of people, having a psychedelic experience where you get to see yourself outside of yourself is very beneficial that freaks me out when you talk about like dmt and things like that even on the show yeah like i hear you talk about stuff like that and i'm like dude how the fuck does someone just do that to themselves not in a bad way i mean that in like a in like a trip way or like if you were to do something like that i have that i have that i

got a funny story to tell you but i have that fear in me that's like or like if you were to do something like that, I have that, I have that, I got a funny story to tell you, but I have that fear in me. That's like, man, what if it goes wrong? Yeah. What if you never come back? Exactly.

Like we've all heard about, was it Keith moon? Who, who was it in a, who was like the first guy that they said went cuckoo from acid? It was the dude from Pink Floyd, right? No, why? What's that?

That's not right. That's the guy. Ken Kesey's like the... Ken Kesey was like the father of the psychedelic movement. He was one of the fathers of the psychedelic movement. I bet back in the day it wasn't as... Sid Barrett? Probably wasn't as good.

Sid Barrett, right. Sid Barrett was the Pink Floyd guy, right? And he went crazy from LSD. Yeah. But didn't someone else go crazy as well? It says Sid Barrett is one of the most tragic stories in rock and roll. What do you mean go crazy? Sometimes, well, you know, Howard Stern talked about this once too.

He said that he took a lot of acid one time and he was really fucked up for a long time and he's really scared that he wasn't going to come back. Because there have been times where people have had whether it's lsd or some mind-altering substance that for whatever reason that we don't totally understand they they fucking go and never come back that's so weird like why would you ever do something like that maybe it was brian wilson did he go crazy from no disrespect to anyone That sounds as an interesting album Brian Wilson from the Beach Boys

Wasn't he the guy that was also tied up with Manson? He was tied up with the Manson family Well that's where he was going Right Manson wanted to make music with him And he was trying to force him to like do it Right So that's probably why he was doing all that acid

And he made him do acid? Because Manson was doing acid Manson was Dude Manson for the millionth Manson was... Dude, Manson for the millionth time, I'll talk about this, how Charles Manson ruined Dennis Wilson's life. Oh, it's his brother. Brother of Brian Wilson. Never went

to dare. So Dennis Wilson was like the guy who was going to manage him, right? Or something like that? I believe so. Something like that. He was looking for his house, I think. The Manson family most likely was like a CIA project. Most likely it was a project of MKUltra. And it's documented by this guy, Tom O'Neill in this book called Chaos. It's an amazing book that talks about the CIA's LSD program. They were dosing people all

over the place with LSD. They had a thing called Operation Midnight Climax where they would go to a brothel and they would have 3D or see-through mirrors so they could see through and watch the Johns. And the prostitute would give the John a drink that was laced with acid. So this guy would take this drink and just fucking trip balls and they would monitor them and they would talk to them and then they did a bunch of different things where they had the the LSD studies that they did out of Harvard that actually created most likely was a factor in creating Ted Kaczynski because the Unabomber was a part of those LSD studies and then he's rising a pineapple Express while he was tripping balls was thinking that technology is gonna kill all the people so he has to kill the people that are making technology and by the way I'm not condoning what he did but it it's logical yeah it's logical if you that's what episode of Black Mirror it's

logical it seems like it would be an episode of Black Mirror where the the computers become far more intelligent than human beings and they have no use for them anymore and they in fact they find human beings to be a problem. Like that's the idea that you're going to create a new life form that's far more intelligent than you. I'm going to sound dumb. And that technology is going to take over people. You think it's? No way.

Me and Danny talk about it all the time. Well, people smarter than me don't think it's going to happen. Like Marc Andreessen. I feel that way and I'm not smart at all. Sometimes we talk about it and I'm like, dude, there's no way in hell that people let things get that far to where I don't think we have a chance. I don't think we have a chance.

Against it or for it to happen? This is the problem and I'm not saying that capitalism is a bad thing, but when corporations are primarily around to make money and they have an obligation to their stakeholders, they're always going to make money. If this new frontier is opening up and it's called artificial intelligence and you're a part of that

and you start making money doing that that fucking train is on the tracks baby and there's no breaks we you're not going to stop them from making art they're already got chat gpt they can have fucking conversations oh yeah right And can diagnose illnesses and tell you how to fix your car. I have this problem where I believe in humanity though. I do too. No, not that you don't. I wasn't like inducing that. I was just saying that. I'm just a realist. Yeah, but that's just a little crazy. Listen, man, they're not going to stop making it. So if they're not going to stop making it, where's it going to go? It's going to go to a life form. It's just a matter of how much time does it take? I don't understand the technology, so I can't say that it's 50 years from now or 100 years from now or five weeks from now.

I don't know. I don't know what it is, but they're going to be able to create a life form. Wow. They're already—dude, this is going to be— This is what I don't understand. Sorry for interrupting. No, please. This is what I don't understand.

You see those videos. You've been seeing them for like five years of like those weird like robotic heads talking That look like real faces and things like that and this is really elementary. I just mean like those weird Bald mannequin looking heads. Okay, like a robot looking AI looking things right? That's what happened in for five years Oh, yeah, when's it when's the winds like what everyone's scared of gonna? Well, they've got some pretty sophisticated ones out of, I believe, Japan now. There's Whitney and her robot. Oh, I thought you were just pulling up pictures of girls, man. I was like, what the hell?

That's my friend Whitney Cummings, and that's her robot. So Whitney Cummings' robot can talk and say things, and she has it say jokes. That's a fucking nightmare. It's hilarious. Not Whitney Cummings twice, but the fact that there's a robot. She thinks it's hilarious. That's so scary. A ton of inappropriate jokes about that robot. The robot does?

No, she puts him in the robot's face. She's holding its face. Yeah, she took its head off. This is very rudimentary. That kind of robot. Yeah, that's what I mean by that. I feel like everything you've seen online when it comes to AI and things like that, it's all, which is even scarier because who do you know? Like what's going on somewhere else when it comes to AI and things like that?

I think we're only, what we're learning from like chat GPT is that just from scouring the internet, you could have a program that's so powerful that it could answer any question you have in very complex ways and paragraph after paragraph this has been interesting in the music industry because people like people fucking every day man 20 people send me a song by an ai bot that i wrote and it's almost insulting because like i see the songs and it's like it's crazy to see the lyrics that these AI bots come up with I'm like man I gotta write fucking better songs can you see it I'm like man I wrote that

to this AI bot and it scares the shit out of me but I'm also like when I think of my head and like think about what I can write personally from my heart I'm like there's no way AI has ever it's not going to be able to replicate what your lived felt experiences can convey in a creative way. Which I think people are smarter than people think.

And I think that'll always reign supreme. But I think it's going to make some hits. Yeah, there was like a bunch of them. There was like a bunch of them. Well, that Drake song. Yeah, I was going to mention it, but I didn't want to. Like, it was huge. Apparently it was huge.

Yeah. Look, it's going to make some hits. look it's gonna make some hits and that's not against drake that's drake can still make hits too but ai can make drake hits and that's what's crazy it's like um when you get to a certain point like if you have a certain style of music like i wonder if it can do jazz i don't really have a real understanding of jazz I feel like it would be easier to do jazz than write. This is not an insult towards jazz musicians. I respect them. I Feel like it could do jazz well because it has so many notes in perfect like Slides and things to go off of when it comes like songwriting it might be a little different

Imagine if it did jazz better than the jazz musicians and everybody got mad. That'd be crazy. Oh Jazz musicians would be pissed. They'd be so mad. They'd be so mad man. There'd be a bunch of fucking Breweries just up in flames you go into some independent coffee shop And they're just Austin and there's an this jazz playing some fucking but it's AI jazz, but it's amazing You know like oh my god, because if AI is that smart some dude with a bass just fucking piss right if you think about what like every they say i don't know anything about music let me just say this real quick but they say that every note is apparently been played like all of them right yes okay i don't know if this is true but bach uh don't i don't know anything

about music either but bach when isn't AI then? Isn't that a program? Jamie, you're freaking me out, man. But no, that's the same thing. No. That's the same thing. No, no, no, that's a program. Those pieces of paper or those holes in that paper or whatever the fuck that thing is, that scroll.

But what's artificial intelligence, right? That's the same thing. You're feeding it a bunch of shit to then recreate without a person. Yeah, but it's not growing. That's mechanical, bro. It's not growing. That's mechanical. It doesn't's not growing. That's mechanical. It doesn't grow inside itself.

That's why AI is fucking scary. That's like saying an automatic watch is artificial intelligence. Or like factories are artificial intelligence. Because all the gears are spinning and ticking and keeping perfect time. No, that's mechanical. That's engineering. You know what? Have some respect for engineering.

I'm with him, man. That's what, I feel like that's what Andreessen was sort of saying. Like it's just like reading off of the internet the internet and saying words that sort of to us make sense. Sure, for now. Did you guys see Ex Machina? That's the thing people have been saying forever, though. Did you see the Black Mirror episode? With the AI and the likeness thing?

They can steal your likeness and they create? I think I saw that one. Did I see that one did i say that one maybe i didn't and the tiktok fucking things are i'm not saying this exactly this has just been around for 150 years and it's uh very close to it this replaced a piano player you know from the wild wild west but it'll always play the exact same thing yeah and it sounds the exact same every time you play oh so they have the wild wild west they would have that old as shit yeah these are really old see that's what I'm trying to say about people.

They keep saying that. Sounds like someone's playing it. That sounds like a place where someone's getting shot. Right? How did they make that? When'd you say it, Ken? These are old. I don't know when they were first invented, but these are not new, and they're old.

Got to get one of them, man. Alarm clock. We should have one of those in the studio. Got to. See, that's not, you know. Bro. How much do you think one of those in the studio. Got to. See, that's not, you know. Bro. How much do you think one of those costs? A player piano. Right now? We should have one in the studio.

What's a player piano? Is that what it's called? That's what it's called. We should get one of them old ones. Supposedly a player. It would be dope just to have one just for the vibes. Put it in here, man. So next time this comes up, you can just play it. There's no room in here. We have the perfect amount of things that are in here it there's no room in here we have the perfect amount of things that are in here

we have no room in here but out there it's beautiful thank you beautiful thank you very much I'm scared of artificial intelligence I'm scared of all of it

because I think human beings are going to become obsolete and I think we either are going to merge with technology which we're kind of already doing Elon always points out

that we're already a cyborg we just hold our phone yeah you're connected with it in a very very strange way Elon always points out that we're already a cyborg. We just hold our phone. You're connected with it in a very, very strange way. You can't exist without it now. It's hard to. You can, for sure.

A lot of people do. Christopher Nolan apparently does. Apparently he doesn't have email, nothing. You've got to talk to him. And you aspire for that sometimes. Like in your head, you... Sometimes, but I like... First of all, I like the distraction of my phone sometimes. If I'm bored, I like to sit and watch pool matches on YouTube.

Agreed. I like to watch fights if I found out about fights. And I get to watch results. I get to watch things that maybe I had missed on other organizations outside the UFC. I can watch them on my phone. I wonder why you're so... Yeah, I wonder why people are so... I personally, the age that I'm at, you're older than me, but like I feel ashamed of...

Your phone use? Looking at my phone so much. Yeah. And I think that might be like an immaturity thing. You know what I mean? Where... Well, it's... I can't monitor myself and I like just...

It's addictive. I tweet some heinous shit. Do you? I tweet some crazy shit. People are always like, man, what's going on? And I'm literally just like 3 a.m. on a Tuesday and I'm like man fuck it you know and i just get up and people i'll wake up the next day and people like hey man you good i'm like yeah it's a song lyric or something like yeah it's crazy i like doing it's like like i said i haven't talked to someone like this in so so long

that like my fucking crazy tweets are the only thing that people know me by and i'm like man i gotta clear some air bro it. It's so crazy. Do you think about not tweeting sometimes? Like it's not worth it? I actually recently deleted my Twitter. I go through these phases where I'm like I do it so much that I'm like man, get off of here for a second. I don't know how the

fuck Elon does it. I have that stuff. Dude, he changed the world today. He made it X, right? Yeah, it's X now, officially. Do you, right? Yeah, it's X now, officially. Do you tweet ever? Yeah, occasionally. I read things more than I post things. Do you run your own Twitter?

Yeah, but I don't want to engage with anybody. See? The back and forth that people have with people, I am so not interested in doing that. There's something in me where people respond, I'm like, what? No, it's not like fans responding. Oh, I see.

It's people getting into conflicts on Twitter twitter and i think that's ridiculous i think it's the worst way to communicate it bothers me a lot and i think people i see some people all they do is just lash out at people and that is a hurt person that's what that is that's all it is it's like it's not a healthy way to live your life but you have to empathize a little bit inside yourself, too, with those people. Sure. Because sometimes people tweet at me and I'm like, hey, man. But I don't tweet back ever. I always control myself most of the time.

I'm not. Yeah. Don't quote me on that. I have friends that tell me about tweets that they read. Isn't that crazy? I'm thinking about fucking telling that guy to fuck off and, come on, man. Stop reading that shit. Yeah, it doesn't matter that much, I don't think, at the grain.

But it is interesting to read all these different people's opinions and thoughts. I do love that about Twitter, that you'll get these hardcore leftist perspectives and hardcore right-wing perspectives. I think as much as it makes people uncomfortable, you have to have a place where everybody gets to talk it out. Everybody gets to talk. And it's beautiful. The loony people that think that fucking nuclear bombs aren't real.

Do you know that's a big one that's going around the internet now? Nuclear bombs are not real? Yeah, nuclear bombs are hoaxes. It's a hoax. Okay. It's the latest. Oppenheimer was bullshit, man. It's semi-connected, I think, to flat Earth.

Let's go. I think it's semi-connected to dinosaurs aren't real. It's like a three-pronged attack of idiocy. Let's go. Get those guys together, man. I think it's semi-connected to dinosaurs aren't real. It's like a three-pronged attack of idiocy. That's crazy. What's their main reasoning behind nuclear bombs? Well, I just think they're big bombs. Just not nuclear. Yeah, there was like some

Twitter thread I was reading where they were talking about how nuclear bombs have to be fake because Hiroshima and Nagasaki don't have any nuclear fallout. That's, I've been there. When I was a kid, I went. I saw the museum, bro. Dude, if you're a little kid

and you're walking through. I wonder, I seriously wonder how many of these people that are having these conversations online are like Russian agents or they're feds or they're like somebody who's just designed

to make people stupider i should worry about the same thing now everyone who tweets at me is a russian agent bro i'm saving the world baby seriously wonder because you remember when uh free bleeding was a thing on 4chan and they talked some feminists into not wearing tampons and just bleeding in their pants as a sign of empowerment free i wasn't a part of this movement, no. Free bleeding. But it became, people actually did it. Some people actually did it.

It was like a troll? It was a troll at first. And I think a lot of these things, whether it's flat earth or whether it's nuclear bombs aren't real, I think it's a lot of crazy people and a lot of people that watch too many YouTube videos. But I also think some of it has to be someone that's like monkeying with people's ideas like throwing preposterous ideas that are well articulated out there to get people to believe in nonsense and then argue about it when we did the

uh the ticket master stuff and we made it a big deal uh my managers they came to me like hey man you got to be ready for bots and things online oh yeah to manipulate how you're feeling and make you respond in a way where we'll also manipulate the conversation about you and you get upset it's not just manipulate how you feel it's manipulate how the people that are really like maybe someone doesn't know how to feel about what you did and they're like uh i mean i think he's doing it for us and then you go and read on twitter that guy's a selfish piece of shit, that guy this, that guy that.

You're reading all these horrible takes that might not even be real. They might not be people or they might be engineered by people through multiple fucking sock puppet accounts. If you go to like a famous person's like Twitter and things like that, you can look at who's following in them

and like if you like scroll down, like this is fucking psychotic that I know this i don't do this myself i just know from talking to people and things if you like scroll down you can see like just fucking like hundreds and hundreds of bots and stuff like that oh yeah who are just tweeting crazy shit but their accounts aren't really like like three people follow them and they're following like 600 people and all the 600 like famous people and they're either saying like nice shit or mean shit and you're like this is weird it's weird what's going on man it's anytime there's culture war stuff like anytime there's stuff about like trans rights or anytime

stuff about ukraine war like these right like uh anytime there's an abortion debate, you will read these comments. I'll go through the comments. That one's a big one. The Roe v. Wade one's a big one. If you go through those comments and you read them, some of the people, you look at their page, like I'll read like some preposterous take on things, and then I go and read their page.

I'm like, oh, this isn't even a person. Yeah, yeah, and a lot of times it's in politics and shit like that. When I said that shit about like, whatever, light because my fucking sister spouse is transgender i like i like hired a security guy for a second i was like man this is crazy people are mad at you yeah and not being a bitch either i was like man it's kind of scary bro i live in a city i don't people to come for me because a lot of people were such a dumb reason to get i woke up on a saturday bro, and I had a dude tell me I was like a Nazi and a mutilator on my Twitter. And I was like, bro, what the fuck are you talking about?

It was psychotic. It was crazy. Well, there's people that feel there are some people that feel like supporting that idea is going to make more people try it. And it's going to make more people regret having gone through transition. And so they really highlight the transitioners. So people have one side or the other side. They either look at it like it's only a good thing to live your truth and to be trans, like you should get on hormone blockers as early as you can,

and that's what that person, the secretary of health, who's that person, the secretary of health that used to be Rachel Levine, right? That's who it is. Was saying like what if you're going through puberty but it's the wrong puberty like what if you're going through puberty and it's painful for you because you're it's not you like look you're still a child like the idea that for ideology we're gonna abandon this thing that we have always known which is that children are very impressionable and very malleable and that they can be manipulated and that also they can change their minds. And there is a ton of stories about girls who were tomboys when they were younger and

just became regular women. And there's also tons of stories about guys who are feminine when they're growing up and they became gay men. And some of my gay friends feel like this idea that like those people should become trans is probably homophobic and that someone encouraging them to become trans if that's the case is homophobic but as a human being you only have one sorry i was gonna say because he was saying that and this is true that in iran i believe they have like a large amount of transgender women and the reason being is that homosexuality is illegal

yes it's it's strange so because it's illegal the way they get around that is some of these men become trans whoa which is wild obviously like in the middle east there's a weird i don't know anything like actually but in the middle east there's a weird feeling around it like if you're walking around because i was i was in bahrain and like that, and you'll go out in town, and there's like a femininity to like a lot of the guys, and you're like, oh, that's kind of. Listen, there's a certain percentage of guys who are gay in all of the world. Yeah, of course. It's just a part of being a person.

And that's what, like a lot of this stuff that came out about the whole like transgender thing with me, I'm not defending anything either. I don't care. My sister is gay and she married a transgender person and they're both close to my heart. And all I know as a human being and a man is to love them because they're my family. Of course. And that's it. Of course.

I don't care what anyone is doing. I don't care if you support the kid thing or not. I just love them. And that's what being a human being is, is knowing your own perspective and working from there. And I didn't realize it was going to start such a battle defending someone that I love so much. You know, because they're such a funny, amazing person to me that I've spent so much time with and I have utmost trust in and respect for. And that is my picture in my head of a transgender person. So I don't have the perspective.

That's how all people should be looked at. Exactly. As individuals. And respected. And individuals are what we should concentrate on. But the problem is everything's so tribal today. Oh, yeah. That's why this bud light thing went so bonkers because they the people that enjoy bud light are completely the opposite

tribe for the most part well i think a large number of them than the tribe that's into following dylan mulvaney i've never cared about anything that my entire life how these fucking people care so much about and i'm like dude you are... They felt like it was taking over their thing. It's like if Fox News went all gay. If Fox News just became the gay news. And they're like, no! We can't do it, no! And every anchor was gay,

and they talked about everything from a gay perspective. So much hate, man. You know, like, let's look at gays in Ukraine. And, you know, no matter what it is, let's look at it from a gay... People would go would go crazy yeah i can't imagine waking up with that much on your heart i think that's what people felt like was happening with the bud light can and what what like bothered me a lot it was like i empathize like i i see both sides and like people think i didn't i was like oh man i get it man i understand both both of these realms of people i'm like

the problem is people take it serious forever. They've been Bud Light drinkers for fucking 30 years. And they'll die on this hill, man. And all of a sudden, now, fuck Bud Light forever. I don't care, man. And you just see Modelo cans everywhere, bro. You go to a show and there's fucking Modelo everywhere. And you know what makes me mad is I've drank

Bud Light so long and it's such a great beer and I can't even drink it. People fucking look at you weird and I'm like bro I don't I'm out of all of this I just want to drink a Budweiser bro I was reading about

this bar owner that stopped selling it because people were beating people up that were buying it that's crazy crazy I can't imagine

buying a Bud Light one day just getting decked in the face for no it's just a beer it's just a beer you fucking leftist

you suck you die you got everything that's wrong with this fucking country that's how this shit is gonna fucking take over you gotta punish these people this american flag them all the thing that's going on though is uh people are getting fired like regular folks that work in breweries are getting fired because the demand is down so if the demand is down the production is down the production is down jobs are down and that's uh an unintended consequence you were talking about that earlier before we got on here and you were saying they were down like the market cap or whatever let's see what the

number is like what is uh i've been checking the stock every day but i guess it's more than 20 billion they've lost more than 20 billion dollars you don't smoke cigarettes in here do you no yeah go ahead go ahead yeah we got a fan it sucks the cigarettes out because we have, we smoke cigars in here. Don't smoke, man. Don't smoke, man. They lost a ton of money. The point is, it's not good. It's real bad. And it's who the fuck saw that coming? Who thought that people were going to be that upset? That's what blows my mind is that so many people. My life's. You don't hear a lot of stories where the population can actually control the company's share price and thing. And, dude, there's a part of me, like the humorous part of me, where I'm like, holy shit. Good job, guys, man. You fucking killed it. But it's so wrong. They definitely can if they have a point.

Bud Light sales down by 27.1%. I don't even know what started it is what's funny. Dude, I got on Twitter one day just like everyone else and out of context responded to somebody. And everyone hated me all of a sudden. I was like, holy shit. I think what they're saying was just

find out what the market cap loss was. Just Google Anheuser-Busch market cap loss 21. Just Google Anheuser-Busch market cap loss $21 billion. Google that. That's heinous. That is crazy. What does it say here?

$27 billion. Bud Lightmaker, Anheuser-Busch, InBev has lost a whopping $27 billion in market value in the wake of his star-crossed partnership with Dylan Mulvaney. Most recently slammed by a 4% stock drop this week. That's June 2nd. So that's more than a month ago. This is July 4th.

It says it's $6 billion. It's different. Is that $60 billion or $6? how do you hate something that much man six billion oh i was looking at all the zeros with no how they have all those zeros with no fucking commas that's rude i was in like an emotional isn't that ridiculous i was in a pretty weird place when all this stuff happened too because there was like a shooting in uh in colorado or something where some dude some some guy he like ran into a transgender bar or something where some guy, he ran into a transgender bar

or something, a gay bar or something and just killed a few people and it was crazy. My sister was really emotional about it because she's gay. Wasn't that like a non-binary person too? That was the, I don't know what that was.

That was a crazy one because that was the son, I think, of a guy who was a former guy. A guy who was an MMA fighter. Wait, which one? Who was also a porn star. The bar? Yeah. Isn't that scary?

Yeah. Terrifying. My sister was really, really up in arms. She was really emotional about it. She's my best friend in the world. I would do anything. Just like you would probably. Do you have any siblings? Yeah, I have a sister and i she's my best friend in the world i'll do anything just like you would probably for you have any siblings yeah i have a sister and she's my best friend no matter what that's awesome thick and thin but that's why i didn't love my sister

too she's awesome exactly and you would defend her to the bits right so this is like some just really ill person who went into a bar and started shooting people but i i don't know like what the motivation was but i don't either my sister my sister was saying that like um uh they were under she was under attack and things and i'm like i don't like i just didn't like as a as a younger guy i just both ends because she felt like it was an attack on gay people exactly and i i talked with her about it like as just a normal person i'm like is it an attack on your people or is it a is an individualized event that's terrible and and heartbreaking and things like that and i think it's that because i think that person like i said i think that person was a member of the lbgt i'm pretty sure people are just

scared man that's so shitty Or something along those lines. But either way, it's a human being doing something evil to a bunch of other human beings. It's crazy. Times now are crazy, man. It's wild. Do you think it was like this when you were younger where things were polarizing? No. No.

What do you think changed things? Well, for one, the communication. No. What do you think changed things? Well, for one, the communication. For one, social media has exacerbated the gap, has made us more divided, I think, than ever before. Because people huddle up in these echo chambers. You think it made things better at all?

It made access to information better. It made people more informed. But it's difficult to navigate those waters, and not everybody's going to do it. Some people are going to crash on the rocks, you know, and I think that it's a new thing that people are trying to navigate. I think there's a lot of people that are horribly addicted to it. And, um, they're, they're just constantly involved in these interactions with other people. And most of them are feuds and disagreements and they're trying to one-up each other and trying to post facts and dunk on people. I always question validity of artists and things now.

Do you think people are better for it or worse for it when it comes to talent? Does the cream rise to the top faster now or does it just make everyone great i don't know how to word this make everyone great how what do you mean myself uh like um when i started putting videos on twitter and things like that i wouldn't have been discovered in the 70s because i would have just been playing guitar around a fire do you think and there's i don't mean this for my own ego i'm just saying in general do you think, and I don't mean this from my own ego, I'm just saying in general, do you think people are more talented for it because they have to compete with millions and millions of people now?

Or do you think people are less talented for it because millions and millions of people are getting famous? every other generation with every other kind of art form and even most sports, the generations as they progress, they have the benefit of learning from the previous generation. So we all imitate each other, whether it's like Mike Tyson imitating Jack Dempsey style or Stevie Ray Vaughan imitating Jimi Hendrix style. We all learn from our predecessors. And when you have access to all of the predecessors, which is what you have today You're gonna get an insane amount of talented people There's always gonna be certain like the idea that everyone's gonna be soft and society soft and no one today could do that No, there's still people that can do it

They're gonna rise. They're always going to be here. There's always gonna be exceptional human beings There's people that are driven to do things just like that guy was driven to climb fucking mountains. Some people are driven to make great music. They're driven to write good books or great books. They're driven to make great films. People are always going to be driven. And they have the benefit of having seen Apocalypse Now and having listened to the White Album. And there's so much that people can absorb,

so much greatness and so much. If you were an artist in the 1800s, like how much impact did you get from other artists? Because you wouldn't know that much, right? Did you ever hear Caribbean music? There was no hip hop. So you're not just inspired by other people. 100%.

And now we're all just inspired by each other. So we're making better things. If you use your brain wisely, that's the key. If you use your brain wisely, you can be constantly inspired and enjoy all these people. Or if you use your brain like a fool, you'll be embroiled in conflict constantly all the time. And always fucking arguing. Yeah. It's not good.

Waking up angry. And having the least charitable view of every person you talk about. It's got to be the worst life, man. It's not a good life. It's not good for you. It's just not. And people don't realize it because they feel that they're just ignored or this is the way they get attention or whatever it is.

It's just a super unhealthy way to interact. And I see people doing it on Twitter that are my friends. And I'm like, bro, you're killing yourself. Like you're giving yourself stress levels from being in these constant Twitter battles. You're distracting yourself too. I think being in the Navy and things like that, it always scared me because we used to have chiefs and things talk about like the Chinese and the russians and like everyone going to war and things like that and i always would look at like the younger sailors and i'm like oh man sorry are we going to be okay if anything terrible

happens because these guys aren't paying attention distracted they're not they're not like um yeah and i'm not saying that i'm tougher than anyone ever i never will i'm just saying when i joined the navy since i had so like you were saying about artists you're you're inspired by the people around you so my dad and my fucking mom and my grandpa they were all in the navy and i was inspired to be in the navy and like fucking fight for my country and shit like that and i wonder now if people are like forgotten country-esque, like that kind of shit, like what the movies are about. Like the wartime movies and things like that. There's no great war like Fight Club said, you know. Like I fear that if things were to happen, would people have that American spirit?

Like that Empire State Building spirit that made things like so fucking legendary and like the pictures that you see of those guys climbing on the buildings. Well, that's what the propaganda that we always get That says this how China thinks about us and this is how Russia thinks about us This is you know, like you always get that from a lot of like the hardcore right-wingers That's what their perspective is that China and Russia are making fun of us while we are Arguing about gender wars and whether or not, you know, a trans woman can use the woman's bathroom and, you know, and we're concentrating on these silly things about what, what is your pronoun? And meanwhile, they're trying to make people as manly as possible. And they're trying to figure out a way to continue to feminize America.

That's like the grand conspiracy. That's insane. But you see, dude, you see those Chinese marching videos and things like that? And I say that with respect, but like, you see all these like, yeah, it's crazy. They're all like, they're all in sync and things like that. Some severe discipline. And there's also like, there's a rejection of feminization there. They did something recently where they they outlawed boy bands.

Whoa. What did they do? Like BT. Yeah, that kind of stuff. Like K-pop bands. I was reading this. I'm the worst at this, where I'll read a headline, and I go, I got enough information.

I know now, man. I know it all now. I read one paragraph in, and then I got distracted by a phone call. See if you can find that, Jamie. China banned boy bands. I found an article from 2021 saying that. No, it was a real recent thing. I know, but it says the same thing.

Okay, China to ban sissy boy bands. I want to know who quoted that. Who said sissy bands? Right. Is that a Chinese interpretation of a word? There's not a guy on TV saying we gotta ban sissy bands. I don't know. Right. Is that a Chinese interpretation of a word? There's not a guy on TV saying we got to ban sissy bands. The state regulator is calling for a boycott of pop acts that don't conform to macho standards as well as overly entertaining and vulgar internet celebrities and influencers.

That's crazy. Get out now. But do you think that's propaganda? It's hard to say. I mean, we don't really know. We're just guessing, just like they're guessing. Unless you can read Mandarin, unless you have boots on the ground over there so you really know what's going on, unless you know exactly what's going on in terms of how much censorship are they involved in really.

How about the face ID system? How often are they using it?? How about the face ID system? How often are they using it? Is that everywhere? The social credit score system, is that all real? Like the central bank digital currency, is that all real where it's tied to the credit? What is – is this ubiquitous? Is it through the entire country? Is it – what is this?

Like what are we looking at? And it's hard to say because I'm sure there's propaganda that comes from both sides. I'm sure there's propaganda from them. There's propaganda from us. It's hard to say today what exactly is going on, but it seems like they are doing things, at least in some videos that I've watched, where that sort of technology

where they were talking about with the ears in that cartoon, they're doing something similar, at least a test version of with children in classes where they have this headgear on and the headgear is monitoring whether or not the kids are paying attention i i was thinking i i'm going to college right now and i was taking a proctored exam the other day and i was talking with my buddy about it and he was saying that we might sound like idiots if this doesn't exist but they were saying that like in the classrooms in like china and things like that or whatever country um they have like video cameras that monitor where eyes are going that's what they were talking about in this thing that's so these kids had these headsets on and they were monitoring their faces to make sure that they

weren't looking at their phones and they weren't looking somewhere else. And then this headgear they had on, it was indicating whether or not they were paying attention. That's crazy. Yeah, so I guess it's like a different frequency. But doesn't that make you a different person when you're cheating in class as a fourth grader? Doesn't that make you resourceful? It does a little.

That's why I believe in the American... I'm conflicted in my own head because all these... this has nothing to do with what we're talking about. But a lot of right-wingers and left-wingers, I feel like they have the wrong idea of what the American spirit is. But also, on this hand, I'm like, America is the best country in the world. We've got to figure it out. We're like, the American spirit is alive and well, and I think we'd be fine if it came down to it. If we fall apart to totalitarianism, it's a giant blow to humanity. Because if totalitarian reaches a place that has the most freedom, and the problem with freedom is people are willing to give it up if it suits their side.

And you're hearing this from people all the time. You used to hear it from people on the right, but now you're hearing it from people on the left where they're willing to silence people's free speech if they think that what they're saying is dangerous. And you can't do that because no one gets to decide what's dangerous and what's not dangerous. Because if you allow people to, they keep moving that fucking goalpost and then they'll silence you. And then if you're a liberal and you vote for this and you want this to happen, then it gets in place and and then a Republican wins, and they use that same thing to stifle liberalism. It's all competition. So this is the kids with the things in their head, and that green light is apparently,

or one of the different color lights. White means you're offline. It looks so happy. So it means you're not paying attention. This is a Black Mirror episode. Yeah, this is wild. And so they use facial recognition to make sure the kids are paying attention. Who owns the Wall Street Journal?

Look at this facial recognition. I do not know. Look at their facial recognition. How wild is that? That's what I was talking about with the proctored exam I was taking. Yeah. Imagine. But, dude, there's such a fine line between, like, safety and cheating and, and like is it good or bad well it's not cheating

but but it definitely is enforcing uh concentration so is the if the results are better like right if they get better grades is that worth it to like completely give up freedom like that and to have a fucking headband and then people don't rise to the top either if they're great at least probably still will. Because, like, even if you're paying attention, you might be just a dumbass. You know, whereas some people are paying attention and they have brilliant ideas. Like, you're always, I think there's always going to be competition. Whether you're focusing, there's going to be more competition, probably,

because more people will be forced to be disciplined. You know, forced to, they'll be forced to do the work as opposed to, like, fucking off and, you know, procrastinating. Yeah, but those people do amazing shit, too. They do. Like, the shitty guys, man, in class. I was shitty. Yeah. Man, I never had good, I was always shitty.

Right. Like, teachers hated me. And if you want good songs. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, what if, dude, and also, like, I don't have kids yet. If your kid came home and was like, hey, I had this headband on today that was making sure I didn't look to the paper next to me, how would you feel about it? Not good.

I would not be into that. I would not allow that. Exactly. I would find another school. I just think you have to have a certain amount of freedom, especially coming from a person like me, who's a creative person. Like I do, what I do doesn't, it didn't exist when I was a kid.

It's a new thing, like to be able to podcast or standup always existed. But that's also like, it's a very creative thing. It's gotta be a new thing now. You gotta be able to have freedom. Podcasting is fairly new, right? It's like 20 years old. But standup is, you know, 100 years old or whatever it is.

But the most recent versions of it, you can't have that unless you have freedom of expression. You can't have it. It won't exist. China's primary school stops using headbands to study people's concentration levels after public outcry. Oh, that's good. That's good. Well, that's good that there's a public outcry. This was four years ago this article got

posted. Interesting. And it's weird that this video's been going around even recently. Yeah, interesting. It's just people reciprocating information. Well, the outcry probably just keeps continuing because people are terrified of that being the dystopian future that we're all monitored constantly

by Big Brother and that we give into it because we want a little bit of comfort, which is what's fucking scary. That's what's scary, that people taking advantage of bad situations. And, you know, if something breaks out in this country, some kind of a war or something really scary, you have to be very careful of anybody whose solution is to take away your rights to protect you. You've got to be very careful of that because that's what tyrants do, and they've always done things like that.

Always. And they have all the information. Yeah, well, that's the other thing that's crazy. They have all your data. They have everything. They have your geo-tracking location. They know where you are constantly. From the time you were a kid, for me at least.

That thing on your fucking iPhone can track you, and you can decide to let your friends track you, other people can track you too. That's scary, man. That's freaky, bro. That's fucking freaky. I can't do it. I can't do it. And every, the internet's weird.

It's all weird, but so is this artificial intelligence thing that we're talking about and then this UFO thing. Like, why is that, why is that, like, in the mainstream discussion so frequently today you think it's a distraction from someone i don't know man dude aliens are real right i did that was decided i will listen i don't know but i think it's very unlikely that we are the only consciousness in the universe the the only intelligent, conscious, communicating being other than like whales and orcas. So if that's the case, so if there are things out there, it's very likely there's going to be many more than we can even imagine.

And it's very likely they're going to be older than us. So they're probably a figure things out. if they evolved in a stable atmosphere in a place that doesn't have meteor showers slamming into it every few thousand years like earth does maybe they got way further ahead of us very quickly you know maybe they didn't have to go through all the brutality maybe they never had dinosaurs maybe they didn't have to have an asteroid hit them to kill off the dinosaurs maybe if maybe they're like small lizard intelligence that evolved and they're way more advanced and they're way more advanced like a million years but did you see the court you saw the court case right like yes i'm very closely watching the guy being like yeah man we got we

got aliens in the back bro he definitely didn't say it like that but he um he said that there um are reports that indicate that there are biological entities that they have stored in freezers that are of alien, whether it's interdimensional or from another planet, something very different. And they have crashed vehicles, not just one, but many, as many as 12 crashed vehicles. And then there is a UFO crash retrieval program. And they believe that this program was probably what they used when they went to Brazil in, was it 96? The

Virginia case? That long ago. There's a case in 1996 that James Fox did a great movie on called The Moment of Contact. The Moment of Contact is all about this one town in Brazil where everyone was there when this UFO was over their city.

Was there evidence? Were there videos and things like that? Well, there's a guy who died who carried the body to a car. He carried the body to a car and they brought it to a hospital and the hospital's like, get that fucking thing out of here. And they brought it to another hospital and they're like, get that fucking thing out of here. This happened? Yes. That's all documented. And then the guy, who's

a soldier who carried this alien being, that guy died of a horrible bacterial infection they couldn't cure. They didn't know what the fuck it was. He died really quickly. Within two weeks, he was dead. No, man. And he was a young, fit guy. No way.

Yeah. That's scary. They have a fucking giant UFO monument in the middle of the city. When you enter into the city in Virginia, there's a huge UFO there. And James Fox is like, he's filming all this and talking to these people this guy who was the police he was a police officer that investigated the crash when they brought him to the scene they brought him to the woods to the scene of where this thing supposedly crashed the guy breaks down starts crying i mean he's fucking weeping we. So either he's the greatest actor in the world.

Why was he weeping? Because he was there? Because he remembered that thing. He remembered seeing that crashed UFO. He remembered seeing this alien body. And these girls, they talked to these two girls that ran into one of the things that was still alive. And they described it.

There's an actual statue of it that we have in the studio or in the comedy club. Yo. And that's them today. That's them when they were little girls and that's them today. The whole town saw it, man. The whole town. Like he kept interviewing people after people that talked about it that were there. It's crazy.

What's he describing that stick for? I wonder what that's about. I think he's probably describing the impact, how the thing slammed into the ground. There was a crazy lightning storm, apparently. And this thing fell in the crazy lightning storm. It got hit and disabled and crashed into the earth. And apparently, the Air Force sent something to retrieve it. So the Air Force flew into Virginia, Brazil.

And that's all been documented by James Fox, too, that they did send a plane there to go retrieve this thing. And now that this guy has come forward, and then the government is allowing him to say it. I was about to ask. Yeah, so the government is allowing this guy to say they have a retrieval project. And this is all like they're allowing him to say these things.

I wonder why. Well, he only can stay within the lines. Like, and you saw that during the testimony. There was multiple questions. How careful he was about it. Yes. There was multiple questions they had where he said, I can't answer that. I can answer it.

What is it? What is it called? An ESCIF? Is that how they say it? So ESCIF is like the way I've been, is explained to me. Make sure this is right. It's like a completely soundproof room that has no electronics. Okay, here it is.

A sensitive compartmentalized information facility. It's an ultra-secure room where officials and government contractors take extraordinary precautions to review highly classified information. So they go into this very, very protected room, and then they'll break out these laptops, and they'll break out these these photographs and videos and they'll show them what these things are. They'll show them the biological entities. They'll show them the crashed UFOs. They'll show them the high resolution videos of these things hovering over military bases. They'll show them all the reports of them shutting down all the nuclear systems. It's wild shit if it's true. But it doesn't feel true.

Why would it not feel true? I don't know. Because maybe if aliens are real, maybe if this disclosure is so real, maybe it's so mind-blowing that it just feels like nonsense to me. But something about it just feels a little fake. You said the UFO thing happened in 96? I think the Virginia, Brazil one was 1996. Yeah.

If it's been around for that long, why is it just now? Well, there's Roswell, New Mexico. It was 1947. The Roswell, New Mexico crash was on the front cover of the Roswell Daily Record. I have it framed. It's the front cover of the Roswell Daily Record. They talk about a flying saucer that crashed in a ranch and so these people or these military people who were there reported initially who is the guy like pull up the Roswell

story this is a crazy story you know so that that was on the front page of the Roswell Daily Record. RAAF captures flying saucer on ranch in Roswell region. No details of flying disc are revealed. And then they talk about the people who are involved. It's really difficult to read the print in this image of it. Someone has to approve of this getting printed and things like that. So I feel like if this information- Then the next day, they said, oh, it was just a weather balloon. Sorry, I made a mistake.

And so they had this press conference where they posed with these pieces of aluminum foil and like very clear weather balloon. The problem is all the eyewitnesses have a very different account. They talk about this kind of metal that you could crumple up in your hand. It was light as a paper. And then you would open it, it would go right back to its original form. They talk about these pieces of metal that were impossibly strong, but impossibly light. And they had some kind of writing on them that looked like Egyptian hieroglyphs or some kind of ancient, some kind of symbols on it that they didn't know what the fuck they were. They looked very alien.

And they talk about biological entities that were in the crash that they transported to this funeral home. And there's this documentation of them making these small coffins. And there's a lot of weird shit where people that were there talked about seeing the bodies. There's multiple versions of the same story. Now, it could be just nonsense. It could be like a folklore thing that people just started talking about and everybody ran with it

and then it becomes like a tourist trap. Like people go to Roswell to fucking... That'd be crazy. They do. Economic booster or something. It is an economic booster. UFO freaks go to Roswell, New Mexico every year. Do you ever think you're going to be that old person in those old videos

that you think, like, when you used to watch about aliens they'd be like, man, I saw the saucer in my backyard, you know what I mean? I hope so like in the future, you're just the guy on the video not you, either, I'm just saying imagine if that is you, like imagine if you're on tour and you guys are

out in the middle of nowhere and you're at a fucking truck stop, you pull over to take a leak, and you step outside, and there's a fucking UFO. I've seen it. You have? Taking shrooms, yeah. Ooh. Yeah, I walked outside, saw a UFO. Probably, really.

You just probably can't see them. Exactly. The shrooms reveal them. No way. That's crazy. Well, it might be. But they're getting more and more real now. It's freaking me.

It might be more complicated than we're thinking. Interstellar stuff. Not just interstellar, but interdimensional. And what does that really mean? What does that mean? And maybe there's certain times where we have access. We don't know how to do it. Like we can't just go there,

but maybe there's an opening and maybe they have access to us. Maybe they can create these openings and just appear. Maybe they're from something that is so different than what we're experiencing here on earth that we can't even understand what the fuck they're talking. There might be a million years more advanced than us in a completely different dimension and they figure out a way to visit and they can figure out a way to just just show up and hover and move around things look if we can send a probe to mars and elon can shoot a tesla into space oh yeah who the fuck knows what some insanely advanced civilization that has no like war like primate behavior like we do like maybe they've completely evolved past that maybe they have no jealousy and rage and envy no way they've engineered negative emotions out

and maybe they read minds and maybe these things are just insanely advanced and it's their job to help usher in other civilizations into the next stage of existence, which would be an existence without war and violence. An existence where human beings sort of achieve almost a hive mind. That makes the whole God conversation crazy. Well, God might be the universe. That makes the whole God conversation crazy. Well, God might be the universe. Instead of thinking that the universe created God, the universe might be God. It might be conscious.

The whole thing might be conscious. Why not? When I look around, though, here's my thing. Sometimes when I'm like running or like hiking or I'm on the lake or I'm playing a show and everyone's singing back to me or I feel a certain way towards someone or whatever those moments are like too grand and like beautiful to like not believe in God for me you know what I mean you ever feel like that you ever been on a mountaintop and you're like oh man this is crazy I believe in something I think the problem that people have is the word. And when you say God, people automatically think of this very rigid, organized religion perspective that's based on ancient scripture.

Yeah, it's ruined it for a lot of people. Yeah. And that sucks. Whether it's the God of, you know, whatever religion you choose to believe in God. There's a bunch of different religions. A lot of them believe in God, right? But if you don't want to think that there's something going on, something like insanely complex that's constantly moving, at least in our lives, in our existence, constantly moving in this ever-evolving direction Why it Is it possible that this is how the universe creates more?

Universes and the universe creates new things and these things become more and more advanced and everything continues to always advance Just like we were talking about it doing with music and movies. Maybe it's how it does it with planets. Maybe it's how it does it with everything. Like things constantly get better. And the beings get better at manipulating reality. They get better at creating black holes and being able to pass through wormholes and being able to manipulate space-time.

How did you get to that perspective if you're from, like, Boston and things like that? Did you grow up in the Catholic Church? Well, I was Catholic Church when I was a kid. Did Catholic school for first grade. But then, you know, we got out of it. It was a horrible experience. Not good. And then I kind of fell out of religion as a young kid because my Catholic school school experience was so bad it's like a really mean nun wow who taught first grade but

it was also a good lesson that like there's people like that in the world because i never met anybody like that before like religiously mean like about god and things like that everybody in my life was nice to me i was a little kid yeah so everybody's nice to me my grandparents are nice my uncles are nice everyone's nice yeah and then all of a sudden you're in the school where this nun is a cunt and I was like, oh shit I didn't know there's people like this out there like this crazy I didn't know there's gonna people but just just mean to you for no reason not if not yell at you if you did something wrong, I experienced that every kid does but mean to you like like corporal punishment scaring you telling you gonna

Oh, yeah yeah she hit people rotten house with rulers but tell you're gonna make i'm gonna make you sit on a nail in the closet you're not gonna be able to go home you're never gonna see your parents again like crazy see growing up i had to op like religion and things was was so nice to me because i grew up like in a baptist church and everyone was like loving and shit like yeah there's something about that catholic guilt you know there's there's he it's you it's weird i i've been around and i'm not saying catholicism is weird but it's it is a weird there's a strictness to it that makes you feel unwelcomed yeah and there's a lot

of these uh priests they like to drink which is insane they like to get fucked up this this priest give gave my grandmother her uh my grandmother her last rites, and he kept saying her name wrong. And people had to correct him. Like, her name was Josephine. He was saying, Geraldine, left behind, a great family. He's like, it's Josephine. Her name is Josephine.

He was just going through the motions. And I remember seeing him before they started the thing and looking in his face and thinking like, this guy is drunk a lot. Like he had those gin blossoms all over his nose and his face. Like when he was just talking to people and everything? When he was getting ready and setting up, I was looking at his face like, wow, this guy looks super unhealthy.

Communion wine, baby. Yeah, well, not just communion wine. I'm sure they're getting drunk. That's not allowed, right? I don't know. Is it allowed? But imagine your occupation does not ever allow you to be in love. It makes me...

Did you see that Mark Wahlberg movie? Which one? Where he gets paralyzed and he just wants to be a priest? No, I didn't see that one. Oh, my goodness. You've got to watch it. I forgot. Father Stew.

Father Stew. You have to watch it. It's so good good all he wants to do is be a priest and he there's like a there's a girl in it and there's some big actress actresses and actors in it and he like falls in love with her i don't even remember what happens but he gets paralyzed and things and i'm not gonna ruin that movie either but it's okay it's a new movie i think it's on came out within the last year i think there's so many movies out. It's impossible to keep up. I got this crazy story.

I was in Chicago. It involves the church that I grew up in and things like that. When I was a kid, 13 and 14 years old, we used to go on all these mission trips as a church. We used to go to Chicago to this place called Maywood. We would help all these kids out and run a VBS. There was nothing pretentious or weird about it. We would just go and play kickball with kids and like talk about God and Jesus and things and it was this park in Chicago that we would always go to like Maywood Park

and it's kind of the rougher side of Chicago but like being a kid I was naive to that so I didn't know so it's beautiful to think about that I had no idea that it was like the rougher part of town it was just fun for us and, we went back to Chicago two weeks ago to play, uh, the Windy City Smokeout. And I was there and I was there for three days. So I didn't really have anything to do. And one of the days I was off, I, um, I wanted to go to that park that I went to when I was 13. So it's been like 17 years or 15 years since I'd been there. And I, I haven't talked to the pastors and things that I had like we had pastors growing up I don't know about Catholicism but they're just called pastors like the guys who are over you and um

on the way there I had no idea where I was going I didn't even remember where this park was in Maywood Chicago I didn't know where Maywood was so I just typed in Maywood into the uber app and my it was so beautiful man like the uber started driving me out there and I was riding out there and I was like, where is this park? I have no idea and uh There was just the the stories all over the place. Sorry, but when we used to go on that mission trip Chicago had been flooded really terribly and there was this lady named miss barns Who I had who I had like helped clean out her house when it flooded really bad

And uh, she'd written me letters while I was in the Navy, like letters throughout the years, and I would write her back and things like that, and I would send them back and forth. One day I sent her a letter, and it was sent back to the sender because she had passed away. And I had known when I saw the damn back-to-sender thing. So I'm on my way to this old church that we used to do these missions out of,

and I'm calling my old youth pastors. And I'm like, hey, where's's this park at where's this church at and finally I get in touch with this guy named John who lives in Maywood and he sent me all the addresses to like the park and the house and everything and I go out there and it's been 15 years and I'm sitting in this park and it's a Friday at like 6 p.m. and when we used to go out there they used to be just be all these kids and things like that playing kickball and like in the basketball in the basketball courts and at the park and like there was an American flag hanging up and stuff and I went out there and there was nobody and it was completely desolate it was 5 p.m. on a Friday in the summertime and I was just sitting on the I was sitting on the bleachers and I was looking around I was like man

this has got to mean something. It's got to mean something terrible or crazy. Are people just inside now? Do people just hang out inside? And then I went to the house that she had lived in, Ms. Barnes, the one that I'd cleaned out from the flood, and no one was there. And this John guy who I'd gotten contact with had bought her house, had purchased her house, like the mission guy and that's like those are the

reasons why i believe in god because that was crazy like i was driving out there and i had no idea where i was going what i was doing and it turns out the guy i talked to was the guy who purchased miss barnes's house who i who i'd written letters to all those years and i'd been to that park and everything meant you ever like ever go back to somewhere you spent time as as a kid? Oh, yeah. Isn't it weird? It freaked me out a lot. I was listening to music and I was walking around

and I remembered stepping in the same places. What was weird for me when I went back to the town... Sorry that was so random, man. It just reminded me of going to church and things like that. Not at all. When I was a kid and I went back to my town where I grew up, what was weird was I had these memories that were just basically

like placeholder memories. They were like framework where I knew the specifics of stuff, but I didn't really have a memory of it until I went there. And then all of a sudden like everything filled in. That's what freaked me out. I was at the house and things like that and I was walking around. I was like, oh my God, I remember lifting this here and, like, kicking this ball here. Yeah, it fills in.

That's, like, the nostalgia of all that shit is nuts, man. I'm not even that old. You know what I mean? Yeah, but things from your childhood, like, that's a long-ass time ago. You know, you think of how much different you are from when you were a kid. That dimensionally freaks me out. Yeah, it should. I was talking about

it last night man i was in this dude i mean i was in this fucking kiddie pool in this yard and i was like talking to someone about it i was like the reality of then is the same as the reality of now but it's all so different and weird that's got to be a some weird dimensional thing man where it's like that existed too like each day is the same yeah and you think about it and like is your nostalgia like a fucking what are your memories man like what is this like how does how does that mean less than the present well they're definitely shaky you know we all know our memories are shaky unless we're like even if things like your songs like stuff you wrote like you have to concentrate on them right you're you wrote them and sometimes you can forget the words. Yeah, of course. Like, memory's weird. And memory of, like, specific things from the past is always slippery.

Until you're there again. You're like, oh. It really freaked me out. It really freaked me out to be sitting there. Because I remember, like, my dad with hair and shit. You know what I'm saying? And it was like, I called my dad when I was there and I was like, man, this is nuts. Do you remember your friends when they were in high school and now you see them now and they're all grown up and you're like, I called my dad when I was there, and I was like, man, this is nuts. Do you remember your friends when they were in high school, and now you see them now,

and they're all grown up, and you're like, what the fuck? And they're all engaged and having kids and shit, and you're like, wait, this came out of you? What's going on? I remember you throwing a tequila bottle at Coach Craig's house. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, and now all of a sudden they have kids of their own. You're like, whoa, this is wild. And some of them, you're like, oh, yeah.

This is wild. I guess, man. This is wild. Yeah. Damn. It is wild. Damn. It's fascinating. Becoming an adult human being is fascinating. And then as you're becoming an adult human being,

more and more other people are becoming adult human beings. They have a different way of living their life than you do. And that's why every generation looks at the new generation, oh, these fucking kids today. And everyone says it, and I've been feeling it so vividly what scares me the most about growing up

is having songs it's gotta freak you out too about having podcasts do you ever feel like you're gonna look like having all these songs from the time I was 22 to now

sometimes I'm like I've made peace with it it's just what I do I have conversations with people like my kids are gonna hear it one day yeah my kids listen to my podcast before.

Specific ones, especially people that they like on it, artists that they like. They'll listen to this one. Like your most vulnerable moments, you know, your kids. Sure.

Yeah. That's beautiful though, man. That's cool. It's, you know. We're fucking talking about aliens, man.

That's crazy. Well, sorry to your kids. That's a fascinating thing to talk about. Yeah, it is. My kids talk about it too. It is. Everybody does. It's one of those things where it's like if it's true it's real the whole map that we have of reality is very different now these things really are visiting

and they really are these super sophisticated creatures that have been here from the beginning they have been around as long as the earth's been around they've been visiting and checking in on us it'll change it'll change the trajectory of the entire universe like it'll it'll like that's why i brought god up earlier that's why i went in that fucking chicago story but like it'll change how people have lived their lives for the last yeah 600 years which is scary man that's gonna do something terrible is it though is it scary or is it good is it just or is it good? Is it just or is it just is is it just is it just just is life this is life This is what it is like you can just decide you wish we're living in 1967 when you had a fucking Call on a phone that was give her meditates

Sure, really yeah all the time. Is it is it added just like purely I do it when I want to clear my thoughts I do it in the sauna because it's a good way to concentrate while I'm cooking myself. Yeah. I've tried to before. Sorry, the way you said that, like everything just is. Yeah. Isn't that the thing?

Isn't that what meditating is? It's like everything is coming and going. For some people. For some people, it's just a chance at stillness or attempt at stillness. You know, but it is what it is. If the aliens are real, we're not going to be able to change it

because we don't like it. Yeah, true that. Just have to deal with it. Just have to deal with it. World of War stuff. We live in fascinating times. Isn't that like a curse? May you live in fascinating times?

Who said that? Isn't that... I think that was like an ancient curse. People have had to have talked about this forever though Oh yeah Like forever you know

Like that's why I get freaked out by conversations like this I'm like man are we just No because this is a different time I mean this is a time where you're having congressional disclosure This is the time where people who are on the inside Are being allowed to talk about these things May you live in interesting times A Chinese curse would say May he live in interesting times. A Chinese curse would say, may he live in interesting times.

That's a Chinese curse. Interesting. That's insane. There you go. And we definitely live in interesting times. We're just writing songs, man. Aliens exist, and I'm just writing songs. And just living life.

That's insane. Listen, man, I think we did like three hours. Oh, no shit. Yeah, time flew by. Wow, yeah, it kicked me out, man. Great time, my friend. Thank you. shit. Yeah, time flew by. Wow, yeah. Kicked me out, man. Great time, my friend. That's crazy.

It was awesome. Wow, this is a pleasure. And I really appreciate you coming in. It's been fun hanging out with you. I loved your show. And I'm a fan. And I appreciate everything you do, man. Thank you, Joe.

It was a good time. I appreciate it. Let's go. All right. Hell yeah, man. Bye, everybody. Have a good evening.