The Joe Rogan Experience - #216 - Chael Sonnen

Episode Date: May 14, 2012

Joe sits down with Chael Sonnen.

The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. You fucked up Rory's voice though, man. All respect to Rory McDonald. We need to get a better copy of that recording. Yeah, we can get one. I'll get one from the UFC. UFC pulled all the YouTube videos down within minutes. Oh, did they really?

Yeah. Well, ladies and gentlemen, what is your new book called? Voice of Reason, your VIP pass into enlightenment. Voice of Reason. Voice of Reason, written by this guy.

Chael Sonnen, ladies and gentlemen. Chael P. You're here. I'm here. And by the way, on that commercial you just gave, that has got to be the single greatest guarantee in the history of fair trade.

You don't even have to send it back. You just call. It's your word. You go, listen, man, this isn't working. And they refund it. That's amazing. We had to make it the first 30 pills because the way we had it set up was any order. You don't even have to send it back. So then people start selling it on eBay. I'm like, all right, well, you can't be that honest. Yeah, it's like the IRS. It's basically you're counting on honesty. It's for oversight. But I like that. I mean, I can tell you from personal experience,

I wouldn't do that. I mean, if it tell you from personal experience, I wouldn't do that. I mean, if it didn't work, I wouldn't lie to keep a couple of pills. I think honesty, I like it. Well, I think if you have a product and you believe in it,

you would want people to buy it more than once, especially if it's something like a vitamin supplement. Sure. So I'm just letting them know, you're going to like it. It fucking works.

It's a fascinating little, you ever get into vitamins, nootropics, anything like that? Yes, in college. And I was sick all the time. I was getting sick three times a month, even if it was for a day or something. And my mom said, look, you've got to get started on a multivitamin.

Do you think this is also because of wrestling? Like you're just training hard all the time? Yeah, you're kind of in a good Petri dish for sickness. You're malnourished. You're overtrained. You're not getting enough sleep with all the road trips and different time zones. Perfect Petri dish to get ill. And I started on a multivitamin known as Centrum Complete, which has less nutrients than dog food. That's what my doctor told me.

But it worked for me. Those small nutrients made a big difference. So when I realized, geez, I haven't been sick in a year, then I really started getting involved. And now I want some really good stuff you can't even buy over the counter. You've got to have a doctor order it. It's called USANA. It's very powerful. You know, 4,000 milligrams of vitamin D. How do you spell it? U-S-A-N-A.

USANA. USANA. And it's a combination of vitamins? What happened? Yeah. Something just happened? Some short something. Quick blurb.

I get it too, but we're back. Combination of vitamins. Combination of vitamins and minerals. Yeah. And you can't get it in a GNC or something quick blurb i get it too but we're back um combination of combination of vitamins and minerals yeah and um it's you can't get it in a like gnc or you cannot no and you know and again let me tell you okay most vitamins are 10 effective 90 marketing we all know that about nutrition gnc type things the ones that really work are 10% marketing, 90% goes into the lab and making them. Now, that very statement I just gave you may in of itself be the marketing that the people have put out. I don't know, but that's what USANA is doing.

You can't buy it. You've got to order it. They don't have enough to mass produce it because it's so potent and effective. But I have had a number of doctors with extensive reading say, listen, this is the one. So do you have to – you don't have to have a prescription. You can just order it from – No, absolutely not. Yeah, but you just got to have a doctor's office call up and, you know, an 800 number.

A doctor's office has to call up for you. They got to call it in for you. You know, that's something they tried to get going years back. They tried to label vitamins as nutraceuticals, and then they were going to have it so that you needed a prescription to get vitamins, which gets a little weird. You know, I mean, I would appreciate a little regulation so we know exactly what the fuck is in everything, because right now it's a little Wild West when it comes to things like supplements.

But I just think that having to go to a doctor to get some vitamin D, that seems like I don't want that. Yeah, no, I hear you. But that comes back to my point that it's 10% effective, 90% marketing. How many things at GNC are made in the same lab, but they're packaged different, and whoever can get the word out more. And I can tell you, I've tried everything at GNC on the off chance that something might work.

I begged my dad to take me there when I was 12 years old, and whoever the most muscled up guy or whoever the most handsome guy, whatever it was that attracts you when you're vulnerable at that age, that's who I'm begging my dad to put 40 bucks down and buy me the protein drink for. So I fall for it. I mean, people always fall for it. So yeah, they don't have oversight. It's trial and error. But what's not? Yeah. Yeah. What isn't? It is kind of crazy, but there were a few things that actually did work, but they got rid of them very quickly. There was one called Mag 10.

They used to have to go into that little glass cabinet with the key to open it up. You couldn't even get it out of the regular part. It's like a video game. Right. Yeah, you had to let them know, like you wanted some porn. I mean, your porn was testosterone testosterone pills and mag 10 was fucking real they got rid of it really quick you would take an absurd amount of pills i think it was like 10 pills there were these clear pills but you would take i don't who knows what kind of fucking damage

it did to your liver but oh my god you'd feel like a fucking raging animal like i didn't get yeah oh you're saying it worked okay great worked wow yeah I gained a lot of muscle on it man I gained like 10 pounds of muscle on it in like eight weeks and it was legal you could buy it at GNC you could do like six to eight week cycles on it and it was such a steroid it was so obvious because as soon as I got off it my dick would just crash my body would crash I was like wow I was like wow this stuff even though it's something you buy at GNC, essentially, it's just like doing a steroid. So, essentially, they discovered

something that the government hadn't yet, and they got it. That's going on. There's a drug out there right now, and I shouldn't call it a drug because it's not, but it's a natural product known as Kratom. I don't know if you've heard about this, but it is absolutely an opiate. It's absolutely a painkiller. And, you those drive-thru espresso places that they've got?

We've got a place like that in Oregon, and the guy sells Kratom, and he makes $150,000 a year. And it's completely legal. The government has not caught on that this is a painkiller. I mean, you get a high, you get a low, you got a crash. I got a buddy that's coming off of painkillers. He got addicted to the Vicodin. And what he's doing is he's going and buying this Kratom for $10 a pill. He buys five. It costs him $50. He goes every Sunday. And when he shows up at 10 a.m., Joe, there's a line waiting for this stuff. It's a drug, but it hasn't been found illegal yet. And I'm saying that because the story you just told about being able to buy a steroid over the counter, people are going to think that's not believable that happens all the time the government just hasn't caught on yet well they and i don't know that they should well i don't

are they going to be able to like when when balco came out with that clear stuff that the clear you know clear right yeah it was like somehow or another undetectable how you know how many more of those are are possibly out there? I mean, how hard is it to do something like that? Sure. Well, I wouldn't know, but from what I've told and I read about this stuff all the time is that if you simply get yourself a good chemist, he goes in, he changes one molecule, one element, and all of a sudden the strand is something else.

You've got your band list. You change one molecule. It doesn't fall into that category. They're looking for things in that category and they pass you know it's olympic year and we see this every games where an entire country comes out looking different than every other athlete the whole country looks different like okay guys you're all looked at that way this whole team has gotten this much stronger and more shredded and times have picked up and everything from track to pole vault to to to swim everybody's better from your country what are you doing and

then 10 years later you find out and it gets added to the band list it gets really creepy when you start thinking about shit like cycling and you see all these dudes getting convicted and all these dudes turning on i had a friend who was a professional cycler and he told me everybody was on crazy shit he said they all are he said there's no way you can compete at that level oh you're talking cycling as the uh professional cycle sure and i'm thinking we're talking about you know shooting up on and off of uh regulation okay so we're talking we're talking i'm at olympic cycling that i'm with you like the or any any high level cycling lance armstrong type tour de france shit like you you almost have to be on something to compete yeah you know it's it's I'm with you. Or any high-level cycling, Lance Armstrong-type Tour de France shit.

You almost have to be on something to compete. It's getting really weird when it comes to those types of sports. And what about when a guy gets caught, and so then instead of just going, yeah, listen, I've got to take my medicine, he's got to bring everybody else down. He becomes the tattletale. Come on, what's happening here? That's not the way it works you got brought down

you got you gotta take your medicine yeah by jose canseco's uh that whole book and publishing and and you know tell him how it was really going down you know i mean that really cost him people's love sure like for his whole life yeah like that guy if you ever read his twitter it's not comfortable right now i never have well he's got some dark shit in there you know about what it was like when he had money and now that he's got nothing he knows what people really like and you know it's it's pretty dark and in all a lot of it the hate that this guy gets emanates in the fact that he ratted out his friends sure well i think there's something to that you know i really do i mean i even as a kid nobody likes a tattletale nobody likes tattletale even though

he was telling the truth yeah that, that's the other thing. I did see a lot of stuff that he did with his book, and I did find it to be pretty genuine. I tended to believe him. A lot of people go, oh, he's an admitted cheater. How can you believe him? I was like, well, I think he's being pretty candid right now. I do believe him.

Well, when we start seeing guys like Mark McGuire shrink down right after he's done playing and then admit that he was on steroids or you see Barry Bonds and how big he got. It's almost like, man, how much regulation do we really need of the human body? What the fuck is wrong with what Barry Bonds did? He took something that made him stronger. Shouldn't we be interested in stuff that makes you stronger and makes you healthier? When you look at a guy like Barry Bonds, like that guy, he looks like he was 30 years

old. He got better when he was older. You know, that's as a professional baseball player. That's amazing. Shouldn't that be something that we would like look into and say, that's a good thing? You know, don't you want Roger Clemens to keep throwing fucking heat deep into his 40s? Like, why would you want to stop that? Sure.

But don't mix the argument. I mean, of course, we love medicine and advancements, and that's wonderful. But if you're talking about rules within a sport and you want to just keep it out for whatever reason, but if that is the decision that we're going to keep it out, well, then the guy can't bring it in and cheat and lie about it. I think that was the debate. But I hear what you're saying. I mean, if it is making people healthier and better, then good for them.

And by all means, we should advance knowledge and technology in that area. But that doesn't mean that it's okay for sport. That's up to the governing bodies. Right. But, I mean, that's what's going on in California. They just recently ruled on testosterone replacement therapy and also medical marijuana. And they ruled positive on both those things. And if you're doing testosterone replacement,

and isn't that essentially the same thing? That's essentially the same thing as doing human growth hormone or anything along those lines. You're doing something to stop the aging process. You're doing something to enhance the hormonal balance of your body. Well, it's been deemed legal then. So it shouldn't be an issue, right? Well, look, if it's legal or illegal is where it all comes into play. I can tell you, I went

through this in California and they're acting as though they're just made it legal. That's not true. It's always been legal here. Their commission just didn't always recognize it. I went through this in California. So what was the official designation that they recently bestowed on it? That they would allow a disclosure process. Here, let me talk about myself because, you know, I was such an expert on this because I had to go through it. I go out. I tell them I'm on testosterone. I say, can I compete in your state while on testosterone?

That's what you've got to do. You've got to get permission. Yes, go ahead. So I do it. I take my test. They come back and they say, hey, you're on testosterone. Well, guys, you didn't need a urine test. I told you that well in advance in writing, and you told me I could be on testosterone.. Well, guys, you didn't need a urine test. I told you that well in advance in writing,

and you told me I could be on testosterone. They go, well, we don't like this. But you made the rules, and you told me I could do it. So it just ended up in this really weird area where they said, okay, but you didn't disclose it properly. And they started changing the argument. It just got really weird to where we could never narrow them down. So they finally have come to some resolution within their own body.

And, you know, in the state of California, I don't want to turn on and throw stones at them. I want to be pretty diplomatic with them. But, look, they are not transparent. And for you and I, two experts and authorities in this sport, to still not be completely clear on what their ruling was, I think speaks to their lack of transparency. And if they don't want people to keep stubbing their toe and breaking rules,

just make it clear so that we know what the rules are. It seems like they're dipping their feet in the water to me. They constantly do that so that they can then pull back out and go, that's not what we said. Yeah, it seems weird. Well, I mean, they're in a tough position, too. It's a pretty thankless job to be the head of an athletic commission, and there's very few guys that do it and do it really well.

But, you know, it's not an easy job trying to figure out what's fair, trying to figure out what the playing field is, especially as science and medicine advances. You know, I like the idea of a guy like Roger Clemens being able to play baseball because he's taking human growth hormone and doing testosterone. It doesn't bother me. Like, it really sucks that this guy guy that he can't actually just say that he can't just do that especially in a sport like baseball where i mean what what how is it going

to hurt somebody i mean i mean even if he is enhanced it's he's not going to hurt somebody that's where it gets weird like an mma that's like the weird weird the real questions in mma is like i mean if you really have something in your body that makes you like hyperhuman, you have like hyperhuman levels, which people can do if they, you know, if they use testosterone replacement or something else unethically. Sure. You know, I'll tell you, Joe, one thing I admire about you, you are oddly comfortable in your own skin. You know, you have no problem admitting anything and being a real open book. And so I think that's one reason why you can't relate to roger clemens is because you know you're like look this is who i am and this is what i do but

that's a very rare trait you possess that but not a lot of people do everybody's got their secrets not necessarily on this topic but in other things of their life where they keep it private i think this is your rare this is a weird thing where you know his sport does not allow you to to do that to your body but i think it's a silly argument when you're looking at a guy who's an older man like he is like how else do you expect him to be able to do that do you know anything about the how the body ages because guess what at a certain point in time his body doesn't recover enough anymore he can't throw the heat but now he can he can because he takes this stuff isn't that stuff doesn't that mean it's like good

for you isn't it like good for him like shouldn't you be looking at it that way so there's such a weird fucking narrow band of like what is what is cheating you know what is what is legal what do we allow well it's going to be a certain point in time when they're going to start genetic engineering and what do you what what is everybody going to do there's going to be a fucking pill that take and it turns you into thor you know what are you going to do are you going to do? There's going to be a fucking pill that turns you into Thor. What are you going to do? Are you going to not take it? Why would you not want to be like a superhero?

If I could give you a pill that lets you fucking fly through the air and become bulletproof, you wouldn't take it? Of course you would take it. It would be amazing. No, I like your argument. And again, it's Olympic year. Olympics are my favorite sport. I don't watch professional sports, but I love every four years when the games come around. So you might hear me reference it a few times today. But, you know, listen, athletes used to be done at 23 years old.

That was it. I mean, 23 was it. If you made 22, 21, that's usually it. Now, you know, look at the last games in Beijing. We had Dara Torres. She was 40 years old. We're going to have 40-year-old athletes on our Olympic team this year vying for medals. And that's a tremendous compliment

to medicine that's a tremendous compliment to technology and what we're discovering here in america and abroad and then not label it don't label it as drugs or label it as cheating look at the fucking advancement look at what it look at what's happened sure well and it's real interesting you know because the only time you're in hot water is if it's a banned list but you know that's junk science and it changes constantly. Things that weren't legal are legal, that are legal aren't legal. You know, a testosterone replacement, boy, that's just got such a bullseye on it. But there's a number of performance enhancing agents that are perfectly legal.

And, you know, you've got to still be within your limits. Caffeine comes to mind, as a matter of fact. You know, you want your caffeine levels as high as you can get prior to competition in my opinion you know i can tell you for my body that's when i do my best but you still got to be within the level and there's a lot of things like that what's the legal limits like a cup of coffee yeah essentially you know if you report compare it to no dose which is something you can buy at a local uh convenience store you can take two of them is that how you do it do? Do you regulate it that way? That's how I regulate it, just because there's no problems if you do that.

It stays in your system about four hours. You'll be tested within that, but you're fine. But coffee can vary wildly, right? It absolutely can. There's people that say, and they'll block you. An athlete, a lot of fans don't know this, when you go in the locker room, you cannot have anything other than a closed bottle of

water. They want to see you open it. The reason, they're just trying to protect you. If you go in there with a coffee you cannot have anything other than a closed bottle of water. They want to see you open it. And the reason, they're just trying to protect you. If you go in there with a coffee, you know, they'll bring you in there five hours before your fight. You come in there with some kind of a drink. It could have something that you don't know about. But, you know, I mean, the caffeine is just one that I'm mentioning. But there's a number of performance-enhancing things. And if a guy takes the time and gets surrounded with the right people that look into that,

because often it's overlooked but you know supplements diet vitamins as we talked about earlier these are this is a very important element and if a guy inundates himself and finds where his level should be and he's legal then he's legal good for him and so many people want to point a finger and say there's something wrong about but there's not and the science continually change continually junk science. You can't get – you bring five doctors in here, Joe, you get five different opinions.

And you know what? It's also assuming that nature is fair, which I think is ridiculous. There are some people that have fucking incredible genetics, and there's some people that literally can't compete with them. Absolutely. They just physically can't compete with them. We both know guys who have been non-athletes that have tried to wrestle and they just couldn't

do it. There's guys that are born with freak bodies. There's guys that are, without a doubt, they're gifted genetically. That's not fair either. Should we round people up by genetically what's their disposition?

If you really want to look at it, like, what's fair? Sure. Like, it is not fair that, you know, you can get a guy like, what's his name? Jonah Hill? Yeah. Right. And a guy like Melvin Manhoof. Sure, Melvin Manhoof, exactly.

John Jones. There's no way you can tell me that those dudes have the same hand. Sure. Someone got fucked yeah yeah the guy the guy that you want to win is whoever worked the hardest right showed the most dedication has the best skills and that is a fallacy some guys will be born with a better skill set than other guys will be able to learn over a lifetime they just are you know you see it with speed you see it with the ability to jump jump. And it's just a natural thing. There's some guys that will take testosterone and still have a lower level than a

guy that was just gifted with it. And you see it all the time. So I get your point. Yeah. It's not a fair playing field. The idea is that your mind can allow you to overcome the disparaging genetics. Your mind and strategy strategy is important just as important as being physical but that's always assuming that big strong people are dumb and guess what a lot of them aren't sure a lot of those big strong naturally gifted motherfuckers are also really quick and they think quick you know i mean look a guy like mike tyson people would always talk about how you know mike tyson wasn't bright my mike t Tyson was a fucking boxing historian. And maybe he wasn't educated, but he figured out the best style for his body. He figured out how to break a man down.

He figured out how to put up a pace that other guys just couldn't deal with. And if he could just punch faster than everybody else could, no one could fuck with him. He figured all that shit. There's an intelligence to that. To get excellent at anything requires an intelligence that's what's really scary about a genetically gifted guy they could easily be really smart Burt Sugar just touched on that same topic with Mike Tyson and he said he is very smart he goes I'm not saying he's intelligent I'm calling him smart he's very smart now I don't personally know what the distinction is that he was getting at I think

it meant you know some of the bad decisions that Tyson made around town. Have you seen Tyson, by the way, the show? He's doing this new show. I heard it's amazing. I heard it's amazing. Do you know anything about it? I've known nothing. I just know he gets up and tells stories.

Oh, I've got to tell you one story. So let me set the scene real fast. Dana White went and saw this. Dana got invited. He and Mike are buddies. So Dana, he's backstage. He's having a great time. All it is is mike tyson goes

out he's got a microphone he tells stories of his life and they've got a production so if he says you know don king in a story boom don king's face pops up behind him on a big movie screen so he's telling this story and he brings up the robin givens era where you know where he's beaten robin givens and he's doing these horrible things to her and he's going listen the one thing robin never told anyone is that i was seeing her the whole time. You know, the whole time we were still seeing each other. Now he didn't use the word scene. I'm sure you can fill in the blank, but he's seen her the whole time. So he says, you know, one morning at 1am, I drive over to Robin Givens house, my mansion that I bought her that I'm not allowed to go to. And I'm ringing the doorbell. And this isn't all that uncommon

because I do this a lot, except today she doesn't come to the door so he says I'm walking around the house I'm looking in the windows about 15 minutes later I see her pulling up the driveway in a Bentley that I bought her that I'm not allowed to drive so she's driving my car she's coming to my mansion it's one in the morning she gets out of the car she brought someone home with her so she brought a guy home to see her into my mansion in my car that I'm not allowed to be at. And when the guy gets out of the car, do you want to know who it is? And on the screen, up pops Brad Pitt. He was a waiter and she picked him up that night.

It's before he ever made it into the movies. So Brad Pitt's sitting there going, hey, man. Hey, buddy. You know, I don't really know much about this. I know who you are. We were going to watch some TV, man. And Mike Tyson says, I could kill you right now. And nobody would.

And Tyson walked away. He did the right thing. He got in his car and he walked away. But how great is that story? That's a great story. Holy shit, Brad Pitt. Oh, my God. And somewhere his production crew found an old picture of Brad Pitt.

Some of them are out there where he's in the chicken suit somewhere in L.A. trying to make it. It was one of those old school pictures before he ever got his break. Robin brought him home to Mike Tyson's house. Terrifying. That must have been. Jesus Christ. Hey, man. Let's be cool, man.

Isn't it crazy that someone can get married to someone, just marry someone really rich for a couple years, and you can just get fucking paid? You can just get fucking paid. A girl can do that. A girl can meet a guy like Mike Tyson, trick him, marry him, manipulate him, rope him in, ride it for a few years, and then just reap the rewards. Yeah, and in this era of reality TV, we all know when that's happening.

It's just the guy does. Like, does Chris Humphrey really think he was in a real relationship? I mean, God bless him. I hate to see that he got his heart broke, but I'm watching it from my couch on a biweekly basis when the girlfriend's forcing me. I'm like, Chris, this isn't an actual romance, man. This isn't how this works.

Do you really think you're getting married to Kim here? I think he thought it was real. The whole rest of the world is going, you've got to be kidding me. He would say insulting shit to her that you should never take from a mate. He said something, and I was on

a soup with Joel McHale. That's his name? Oh, yeah. Very funny guy. He's got name? Oh, yeah. Funny, funny dude. Talented guy, by the way. Very funny guy. And he's got this sketch they're doing about Kim Kardashian and Chris Humphries that he said, why would you care? He said something there on the air like, why would you care? In a few years from now, no one's going to care about you anymore anyway. Oh.

Yeah. And everybody clapped and we laughed and I cried for fake for TV. But for real life, I look at it and I go, well, man, could you imagine saying that to your friend? What a cunt move that would be to say to your friend. If my friend said that to me, I'd be like, bitch, what the fuck am I doing hanging around with you? I would cut that guy out of my life instantly because I'm not capable of saying something like that to a friend. No, it's accurate, but it's mean-spirited. But it might not even be accurate.

Who the fuck would have figured out that she would be able to do what she's doing right now? That girl's making $60 million whatever a year. I mean, it's incredible. Who the fuck, what, he's going to see that she's not going to be able to figure out how to ride the tide? Maybe she can. Maybe she can, stupid. She already did. Sure.

Look what she did. I mean, it's, look, she's no genius. But there is genius in what she's done. There's genius in making she's done there's genius in making a living by just being a person yeah oh absolutely it's very rare i mean you see it all the time america always has to have somebody it's usually some famous blonde she pulled it off as a as a brunette you know she's your pam anderson's your marilyn monrose uh well she also pulled it off with a fuck tape with a black dude. Yeah. Which is very powerful.

I've heard that. Get out of here. You heard. I don't know much about that. Yeah, well, it's okay. Speaking of, and it wasn't the gentleman involved, but Reggie Bush was at the last UFC. It was kind of cool to see him out there supporting him. Reggie Bush has my car.

Right this second? Yeah, yeah. He's literally in your car? I sold my Barracuda, and the owner that I sold it to sold it to Reggie Bush. Well, that sounds like that's his car. You do know how a sale works. Well, yes. Well, it was my car, I should say.

I should have phrased it better. I apologize. You got me. I had a 1970 Barracuda. I wish him luck with that fucking thing. Yeah. Well, you need to be clear. You've got a lot of tough guys as friends.

I mean, I see Reggie Bush rolling around that car. I'm going to go take it back in honor of you. But now that I know, it's okay. It was a fair sale, and he's got the title. Not only that, it was set. I mean, I see Reggie Bush rolling around that car. I'm going to go take it back in honor of you. But now that I know it's okay, it was a fair sale and he's got the title. Not only that, it was sad. I didn't even change hands with him. Yeah, he was dating Kim Kardashian. I know this. Why do I know this? I know not who the president of Poland is. I have no idea. But yet I know who Kim Kardashian was dating before she married this other fellow. Yeah. And I'm doing my best to act like, oh, I barely watched that show. But, yeah, I knew it too. I guess I should be ashamed as well.

Well, you are so good at promoting online and promoting in interviews. Have you ever thought about doing some sort of a limited version of a reality show? No. Not too intrusive? I appreciate the compliment. No, I never have. You know, reality tv is still pretty new and to some generations they don't know that um i i you know i like it i'm a big fan but uh

you know i got asked to do the ultimate fighter our reality show in our in our industry and i just passed it just was you didn't want to coach you know i i would i love coaching i coach a kids team what i didn't want to do was go to ve for five weeks. And now with the new format of live every Friday night on FX there, it's a 13-week process. That's what Dominic and Uriah are going through. That's a long time. It's a long time. It's the little things. You can lose chunks of your soul in that place.

For example, I have a dog. I can't bring him. Where am I going to put him in Vegas? Is Dana going to get me a yard somewhere? It's kind of too much to ask of anybody. I can't go 13 weeks without the little guy. He'd forget who I was. He's the smartest dog.

That's cute. What kind of dog is it? That's cute. It is cute. Please say poodle. I love dogs, man. He's a rescue dog. He's a terrier.

He's a mix. I actually don't know what he completely is. How long have you had him? He's a cute dog is what he is. Three years. So you wouldn't... You could get's a cute dog is what he is. Three years. So you wouldn't. You could get a place. You could rent a place with a yard.

I guarantee you. Yeah. No, you probably could. There's probably some fancy schmancy high roller gambler type dude that would love to rent his house out to Chael Sonnen for a couple months. All right. Well, there you go. Then maybe I will coach the reality show after all. You've saved the day.

It would be fun to watch. I'll tell you that. Yeah, I appreciate that. I think that show picks up the one problem i have with the show because there is some reality tv i like for example big brother i got pretty into there was this crazy guy in there named will for one season if you ever watched it i'm not seeing any nods i'm assuming nobody said he was fantastic it's absolutely fantastic because he'd go into the dark room and he would just tell the truth you know know, I'm going to tell this girl this and I'm going to stab her in the back on Friday and I'm not even going to clean up the bloody mess.

You know, he would say these crazy things and then he would do it and then he won the whole show. At any rate, the problem the Ultimate Fighter has is they put them in teams, but there is no team. And so, you know, they'll go have a, the team will do a fight. And if your team wins, you know they'll go have a the team will do a fight and if your team wins you need to win something you know on the apprentice with donald trump if your team wins boom you get a night out of dinner you know or whatever it is or you get to go meet with this guy or y'all get some money there's no team concept why am i cheering for my opponent i want whoever the toughest guy is whether it's on my team or their team to lose and then i want the next toughest guy to lose

i'm in this to win this for myself and it's really important that those guys start to get that uh and so they either need to do away with the team concept or they need to have a team reward so there's a reason you would cheer for one side or the other at this point there's no point so they just just camaraderie for the sake of camaraderie right and then as the numbers dwindle down all of a sudden hey you were on this guy's team now you're over here and they mix it. And I'm a supporter of our show. The last thing I'm trying to do is put down the show. But, I mean, from a critical standpoint, I'd like to see a reason to cheer for a specific team

or just don't even put them in teams. I think it's just fun because the guy who's the coach, I mean, like especially this one right now that's going on with Uriah and Dominic Cruz, what I like about it is they're constantly talking shit to each other, and it's just another way to try to win. It's another way to try to win. Sure. It's another way to try to win with a team. Sure. And people love to be a part of teams, man.

They like to pick team windows. Oh, I'm on team Apple. People love that. I only get droids. Sure. I like the droid platform. People love to be on teams. Sure.

You say soccer, but I hear that ice cream sandwich is the shit. Actually, have you seen the note? Yeah, it's amazing. How crazy. That thing is like this big. I love it. Are you going to urinate, Chael Sonnen? Chael Sonnen is healthy.

That motherfucker drinks water. I got to drink a gallon a day. I'm sure. Mike Dolce, by the way, just texted me. Yeah, go right down there to the left. Mike Dolce, who's a fitness expert. He was a former fighter and a professional bodybuilder, I think, at one point in time, or powerlifter, something like that.

Super smart dude when it comes to nutrition. So he's going to come on the podcast, and I'm going to have your diet straightened out, kid. Mine? Yeah. I need to address certain issues with you. We're going to get you on all vegetables from now on and do some yoga. I ate animals last night. What'd you eat uh i had foie

gras uh and i that's for the only for a couple more weeks in california i know but this place i went to it was called animal and i highly recommend it it's in hollywood and it's just animal it's every single crazy they had veal brains they had they had you know pig sliced pig head i don't even know what that is. My uncle used to cook lamb brains. He used to cook it on the grill. What's brains taste? It doesn't seem like a good idea to eat brains, right?

It was okay. It was really inexpensive. You know, it's like peasant food. It was peasant food. And then it become slowly, it became like sort of chic, you know, fascinating that you're eating organs and brains and stuff like that. But it wasn't, it's not the best tasting stuff. But foie gras is.

That's amazing. You got me addicted to it right before it's about to get banned. Yeah, I took Brian to this place, Noir, that's right down the street. And they have foie gras there for only two more weeks. These motherfuckers, these silly bitches. You silly liberals. What have you done? You got rid of the best tasting food

You're gonna kill the duck that would you really care if someone overstuffs this duck before you kill it? Did you even watch the videos they ever see them Oh force-feed a duck they take the duck They stick its stupid head under this faucet. They pour some grain down its throat and they pull it off It takes five seconds and you think that that's terrible. That's terrible to an animal that you're gonna kill and eat really it takes five ten seconds it's not screaming in pain it's it's for a human it would totally suck to have a food shoved down your throat but they they have a completely different capacity like absorb grains and stuff i mean it makes their their liver swell up it's like it's not good for them but it makes food. Is there a humane way to do it? That is a humane way to do it. It takes five or ten seconds a day, if that.

It's really quick, man. I've watched them do it. It's ridiculous. They take the thing. This is what we do. We grab them by the neck, and you stick its mouth on it, and they get sort of used to it after a while. They just kind of like stat there.

They pump grain down their throat, and then they let them go. Then they're done for the rest of the day. They wander around. Eventually, they're going to fucking kill them. down their throat, and then they let them go, and then they're done for the rest of the day, they wander around, eventually they're gonna fucking kill them, I mean, that's why they raise them, I mean, are we gonna slowly regulate that away, I mean, this is not real cruelty, veal, to me, is far more cruel and legal, and I'm more attached to veal, because it's a mammal, I don't give a fuck about ducks, you know, if you take a duck, and you stick it in there, and you fill it full of grain, I don't feel bad, I don't, ducks, I don't give a fuck about ducks. If you take a duck and you stick it in there and you fill it full of grain, I don't feel bad. Ducks, I

don't really like them. I'm not like a fan of ducks. I don't like any birds. I don't really feel any affection for birds, but animals I do. We can do that for little baby cows and bend them up and feed them milk and keep them in the dark and they never get to move around. That's legal.

Veal's a tough thing. I really like Veal, but if you see how that's done, it is tough after that. I tend to agree with where you're at because I'm from the country. I'm from farm. I see this stuff all the time. People are just trying to get by and support their families, but I am surprised to see you take that stance.

I'm very impressed by that. I didn't know you had an open mind. I thought you were narrowed in. I've misread you, Joe. What did you think I was like narrowed like hippie style? Yeah, narrow hippie style. Yeah, very liberal. No, I'm a second amendment. I heard that you moved to Colorado at one point.

And I thought, well, what's Joe doing there? That's a – I don't really – that's where I really learned to not like hippies when I lived in Boulder. Sure. That's when the reality of the hippie truly set in. That's when the reality of the hippie truly set in. It's like if you're around hippies, at least 7 out of 10 of them are not going to have their shit together. Sure.

7 out of 10 of them are always going to need to borrow sugar. 7 out of 10 of them, their car breaks down, they need to borrow yours. They just can't quite fucking get it together. Well, the eco movement's a tough movement because if you go all the way with that, if you go all in, you've got to start killing people. You're anti-human. Yeah.

Right, because the human's the only thing that hurts the environment. We're fucking the craziest parasite of all time. We're sucking all the fish out of the ocean. They say within like 100 or something years there'll be no more wild fish in the ocean. I mean, it's incredible. So we're sucking all this,

and then we're throwing all our trash in there so there's this gigantic like island of floating plastic as big as texas in the middle of the pacific and it gets bigger every day i mean we're crazy if you look at us from like if you were an alien species and you were observing earth you'd be like look at this one thing just fucking everything up like wow yeah for sure if, for sure. If you really wanted to go eco, you'd have to start killing people. You'd have to shut down power. Everybody gets a bike. Either you take a bike there or that's it. And hopefully you don't get stuck somewhere north.

You didn't build your stupid house somewhere where it fucking freezes in the winter. Because if you did, well, guess what? That's just where you are. That's where you're going to be walking around now. And I hope your food supply lasts. I hope there's plenty of animals around you you got to make sure you keep them coming because you don't you don't have cars anymore stupid right cars are bad for the environment yeah i'm glad that you recognize that though you know because i hear this eco

freako talk all the time it's like you know be real careful because you're anti-human if you know if you want to go all the way with that and most topics that you get passionate about you know a guy that's willing to chain himself to a tree to stop construction gets pretty wacko. It's like, make sure what you recognize, you're turning on us. You're choosing us over a plant. Make sure that you at least acknowledge that. Yeah. Well, my issue that I've always had with people who are not just vegetarians and vegans,

but are really kind of aggressive about it and the way they fuck with you. Sure. You know, hey, man, I just want you to reconsider. I just want you to think about what you're doing. You're killing life too, stupid. I fucking love plants. They're beautiful and gorgeous. And you have to kill acres of them every year just to keep your stupid fucking fat face alive.

All right? That's an animal. That's a life form that is life you're eating life you're eating plant life right you know you can't get by without eating life all right life eats life period so shut the fuck up i got a chapter in my book on this very topic about cutting down trees and it's like listen the older and bigger the tree the better with me if you're going to cut it down you know let it go let it make some sunlight and let a couple of new trees pop up. That's the way that it works. And we use those trees and we build our houses and paper. And it's an absolute necessity. But those are here for us, not the

other way around. And you hear these eco-freakos. Of course, they only come out when CNN or some local camera crew is there. It's often about them, not about the environment. And that's where real frustration comes in. But I hear what you're saying. In fact, we were talking about Kardashian a minute ago. Somebody just recently threw flour or something on her over in England, and she's pressing charges. It's like, hey, there's other ways to do it. Anything you do needs to be nonviolent.

If there's anything we learned from Gandhi or Martin Luther King, it's you don't come around using violence to get attention. That's where the Unabomber went off course. When people were spraying people's fur coats with red paint. Sure. I mean, come on, man. Oils. Yeah, you assaulted someone and this very thing, one of the resources of that animal's body is now you fucked it up and ruined it.

And people quit listening to your argument. you do that list i'm out they listen to your argument and you have made that animal's death really kind of worthless now because they're gonna have to throw this coat away because you you spray painted it like a fucking asshole i mean it's it's ridiculous point now they're gonna have to go get another one to replace that one so right the punishment becomes the crime i get it well the whole thing is stupid. It's stupid to try to enforce your opinion so aggressively with pain. You know, that's assault. You're a fucking asshole.

You'd be an asshole no matter what side of the argument you were on. Sure. You picked the side and you went full asshole with that argument where you, you know, you run out and try to assault Ted Nugent. You know, it's like that kind of shit. You know, it's like, oh, he likes to shoot animals. Well, why don't you go down to the fucking... Go down to the butcher.

Go down to that place where a thousand cows a day have to stick their head into a metal trap and a fucking piston slams through their head. Go after them. What are you saying? Are you saying that every animal that's ever lived should just live forever and take over the earth? This is stupid.

You gotta eat some of them. Well, it's the food chain. It's natural selection. There's no way around it. And unless you want wild predators roaming around keeping the populations down, you're going to have to fucking kill them. So few people understand that. They don't understand how important hunting is for population control. They don't get that.

They don't understand how important it is for traffic safety. Sure. People who don't live in rural areas don't. I drove home once. I had a gig in western Massachusetts, and I was living in New York, and you have to drive down, I forget the name of the turnpike, but I had to go 20, 30 miles an hour because deer would just dart in front of the car, dart in front of the car. I mean, it was an infestation.

Sure. I mean, I've never seen anything like it since. I might have seen 200, 300 deer in a night driving down this road. It was incredible. Maybe I'm exaggerating. Let's say 50 deer. Let's say 20 deer. If I saw 20 deer, I'd be shocked.

I saw a lot of fucking deer. I saw them all over the place. If you saw three deer, most people can't relate to that. And that's where our votes come from is the city. And it's like, man, you've got to listen to these folks in the country that are dealing with these actual things. Those things can fuck your car up, man. Real dangerous. People die all the city. And it's like, man, you've got to listen to these folks in the country that are dealing with these actual things. Those things can fuck your car up, man. Real dangerous. People die all the time.

There's a fucking wild video, recent one of a kid who's on a motorcycle. He's going 80-plus miles an hour, and he hits a deer. And somehow or another, he hits it perfect, dead on, so he doesn't even lose control of the bike. He just, wah, boom! And he pulls his bike over, and his friend comes over.

He's like, dude, you could have died. You could have died. Did you just see what that? He goes back, and the deer is just cut in half. Literally, the deer exploded on impact. That is amazing. I have not seen. That is absolutely amazing.

I'm glad the guy didn't die. I thought that's what you were going to say. No, the guy didn't even waver. I mean, he didn't even lose control. It was like, boom. He never lost control of the bike. Just cut it in half like a saw, you're saying, basically. Yeah, basically.

At 80 fucking miles an hour. Jesus. The one time speeding saves a motorcyclist in a wreck. Yeah, no kidding, right? That'd be interesting to talk to a physicist. If he was slowed down, what would have happened? Would he not cut it in half? It would have been him.

I don't know. Well, because, yeah, it's like 80 miles. And I was like, oh, boy. You know, just bang to run right into that. Just probably just exploded. Wow. But the kid lived. And there was another video of a guy.

And it's another helmet cam. Same thing. And another one where a guy on a motorcycle hits a deer. But he loses the bike. And he was wearing, like, full leathers with pads, like racing shit, where they have like those really hard plates in the body. And he got up and he was fine. And he was like telling people, look, this is the reason why you need to wear all this shit

because something like this can happen, and this just saved my life. Sure. But it's a – oh, that's the video. It's about 30 seconds in when he hits the deer. Oh, wow. See that? That was it. Oh oh you're kidding me no back it up a little wow he does keep control of that bike yeah well he he's a good fucking rider too you can totally tell because he didn't lose it at all he's a bad motherfucker because when that deer hits him he has a little jiggly moment see that and see that little jiggly moment going

80 fucking miles an hour he hits a deer this is a bad motherfucker station will people i mean did this go viral do people probably know what we're talking about here oh yeah a lot of people know about this like i got a bunch of tweets about it and so then uh his friend comes running over and they go back to see and it's just splattered well i sure am glad that guy's okay that that would not have been pleasant i love bikes but I can't do that. I can't fuck with crashing. No. You know, there's something about riding on something that you have to balance.

Are you a rider? Do you have a bike? No. Ooh, see that? You see the deer? I took my safety lessons, and I was ready to get a bike, and I saw one accident, and two friends saw two other accidents in, like, the course of the course of three days involving a bike. Wow.

Yeah. One of them, someone on a phone hit a car or hit a bike, just fucking nailed it. Wasn't even paying attention. Guy goes flying off the bike. Another one, a friend of mine was riding through the canyons. He hit some salt or some gravel or whatever the fuck it was. Lost his bike, ripped his shoulder apart. And then it was actually right around the same time that Frank Mir got hit, too.

When Frank got hit by a car and broke his femur. Broke his femur. He was, like, on his honeymoon, I think. Wasn't Frank on his honeymoon? He was definitely on vacation. I know he was on vacation. But he was on his honeymoon. I'm pretty sure it was in Vegas that it actually happened.

I thought it was overseas, like the Bahamas. I might just be adding that element. I used to be a historian, Joe. You used to not need to consult an internet if you had me around. And now there's been so many shows I've lost track. You're thinking about Tito Ortiz. Tito Ortiz was in Jamaica, and he got hit by a bus. Yeah, that is what I'm thinking of.

Him and his wife were on vacation. I thought that's what happened to Frank. I thought Frank was hit by a bus on a motorcycle. No, no, no. Tito and his, I think it was his wife, they were hit by a bus when I think he was on like a moped or some shit like that. I thought that was Frank hurt. No, I'm buying the story. Yeah, that happens, man. There's only so much data. Sure. Holding your brain after a while. Those those stories get a little squirrely. Yeah. Frank was hit, I think, like right in Vegas. And some guy just fucking ran a red light, slammed right into him, broke his thigh, sent him flying through the air,

and it took a long time for him to come back. He's a really impressive case of a comeback. He's gone. Well, because it didn't go real smooth. It didn't go smooth at all. You look at like the Brandon Vera fight, the Pepe De Pano fight. It's like, wow, what happened to the former champ? What happened to the dynamic Frank Mir that, that burst onto the scene, you know,

the, the one that beat Pete Williams with that crazy arm bar from the guard. I remember, you know, Frank Mir was a beast. And so that, that set him back, man. That was a pretty, pretty grueling injury. Yeah. He's one of my favorite guys. I really like him. Very smart guy.

I enjoy Frank a lot. His wife's real nice. You know, he's a local Vegas guy. He's a great commentator. Second amendment guy. I enjoy Frank a lot. His wife's real nice. He's a local Vegas guy. He's a great commentator, too. Second Amendment guy. He's a very good commentator. Very much a Second Amendment guy. He commentates better than the interviews that he cuts.

Sometimes he does an interview and people are turned off by him. They think he's putting out an attitude. I don't see it, but I read and hear about these things. But he doesn't do any of these. He's a totally different persona when he's commentating, and I like that. If he doesn't see it, he doesn't say it. He's pretty fair. He's a smart dude.

He's a very smart dude. He's a Kindle with him all the time. He's got guys constantly reading. I've had some really heavy conversations with Frank Mir. And, you know, that's why he's so good at jujitsu. He's got so much technique, too, because he's like, you know, he's like an encyclopedia for shit. The fact that he caught Noguera in that Kimura and broke his arm, the jiu-jitsu world just exploded when that happened.

Frank Mir, not only did he, he did it when Noguera instigated the ground game because he had Frank Mir hurt and he wanted to finish him off. And that just shows you what a bad motherfucker Frank Mir is. That's crazy that he bested Noguera on the ground and finished him. While dizzy. While dizzy. I mean, if that guy's not underrated, damn, that's really fucking impressive.

Oh, he's got his positions for sure. And I was cheering for Frank in that fight. I was happy to see him win as a fan. But I took no pleasure in seeing Noguera injured at all. Not like that. That was a rough one. That was a really hard one to watch. But Noguera's back.

Somebody told me Noguera's booked for a card coming up. He's booked for a card coming up against Czech Congo. Yeah, against Czech Congo. So he shook it off. You know watch. But Noguera's back. Somebody told me Noguera's booked for a card coming up. Booked for a card coming up against Czech Congo. Yeah, against Czech Congo. So he shook it off. You know, good for Noguera. I don't know how. Wow, that's amazing, isn't it? I mean, how the fuck did...

I don't know what they did. I don't know if they used plates or what. I don't know how they put it back together again. Yeah, that was fast, but good for them. And Mir, he's going to go fight for the world title against Dos Santos, who I will never underestimate again. I thought Dos Santos was dead in the water with Vel velasquez i thought it was a waste of a fight i couldn't believe i i will never underestimate dos santos again he can throw heat man he can

throw heat you know and i was really looking forward to him against alistair alistair and him would have been a very interesting fight man you know because alistair is such a pure stand-up guy and alistair is so good at incorporating leg kicks and knees. He's got a real tight guard, especially now that he's so big. He kind of punches everything over, protects himself well. He's a dangerous guy to anybody that has to enforce a stand-up strategy. If you want to just go and box with that guy, he's got so many other tools other than just boxing.

And he's so so many other tools other than just boxing. Right. And he's so technical with his attacks. It's just it sucks that he, you know, whatever his issue was. He's saying, I think, that he got some medication that, you know, some doctor gave him that had testosterone. And he didn't realize it. And it fucked up his testosterone to epitestosterone. I don't know what happened. I don't know the story behind it. But I guess he's suspended for like nine months now, something along those lines. Well, that was interesting.

You know, that whole case was interesting. And yeah, you know, let's jump off that topic as quick as we can. But you know, one thing about that, he took a substance test. He took four, two of them were surprise tests. No substance was ever found. And he came forward later and kind of volunteered, Hey, it looks like I might've taken some testosterone, but that wasn't what the test showed. The test didn't show anything. It just said, hey, there's something with your TD ratio. Let's try to figure out why this happened. The media really got that wrong. Well, here's what you've got to understand, Joe.

I'm really glad you asked this. Here's your T and E. Okay, here's your T, here's your E. So they're very close to epi testosterone. And they're very close. They're usually even, one-to-one. Some commissions allow a four-to-one or even a six-to-one difference. But the reality is usually even one-to-one. Some commissions allow a four-to-one or even a six-to-one difference, but the reality is most are one-to-one.

Now, if your testosterone went up or if it went down, that gap is your ratio. With the same set, if your epitestosterone went up or went down, that gap is your ratio. That's why it's a very disingenuous test. So when a guy has a TDE that's elevated, the media immediately assumed that he took T. His T could have been in the gutter. His epi was at the norm, and he could have been unhealthily low. Now, I understand that that—

Really? There's no distinction? It's extremely disingenuous. You will never find an endocrinologist not one in this country literally this is a challenge you won't find one no matter how disgruntled you won't find one to come on and tell you that it's a it's anything other than a disingenuous test for testosterone and these commissions are missing this left and right really and it's it's absolutely horrible you know in some commissions they'll they give you just enough rope to hang yourself they say listen you're allowed go ahead take testosterone but

make sure you're within the levels like no wait a minute that's not how it works there's a testosterone level you need to figure it out through taking blood well we can't afford that well you can't tell a guy he can take testosterone but he can't elevate so it's a financial issue as far as the accuracy of testing? You have to understand this. Alistair was 14 to 1. A guy could be 100 to 1 and still be within the legal limits. A T to E ratio does not pertain to anything, and you won't find one expert. Now, I didn't say a doctor.

I said an endocrinologist, not one expert to tell you differently. Really? It's absolute junk science, and they continue to push it. And it's only urine recognition that does this? Yeah. It's where they look for it? Yeah, it throws off your TDE. Well, his T could have been up, his T could have been down. His E could be down.

But listen, a guy has every right to manipulate his testosterone. Every right. The question is, how did he manipulate it? Did he use a legal substance or an illegal substance? question is how did he manipulate it did he use a legal substance or an illegal substance and alicer's test four of them two that were surprised showed no substance was found now i understand if you wanted if you and i's format right here we we're just two guys talking we can share our opinion but if you're a media member if you sit behind a desk you wear the suit you collect a paycheck at the end of the night you're you're branded an analyst by your affiliated network you can't come out and say that he took testosterone when the

test didn't show that he was never even accused of that and you know from mark cuban's tax write off that nobody watches those guys couldn't have missed the boat anymore they took pleasure in coming out and outing him for something that the commission never accused him of espn missed the boat everybody got this wrong and they were quick to say that, oh, he's taking testosterone. Well, not according to the test. In HDNet, I don't think it was anyone other than Boss. Boss was pretty sure that he'd taken something.

And he's got his own thing, you know, Boss, with Golden Glory. He's very loyal to Golden Glory, which I really admire with him. But, man, don't let that cross over. If you're behind that desk, you've got to tell the story the way it happened, and they didn't. It's hard. It's hard. I've done commentary before for friends, and they didn't like what I said, and they got mad at me. And I would go, listen, man, I have to say what I see.

And if I see you're doing something and then you get caught doing that, it's because I have to say it. I have to tell people what to look for. That's what commentary is. I can't pretend that something different is happening so that you feel better about it when you listen to it, but then the million people who hear it are not getting an accurate account of what's going on. We had this

conversation, Joe, in a bar, you and I, in Boston, and you told me a line, and I've stolen it. I've used it all the time because it's very accurate, where you simply said, if you don't see it, you can't say it. You can't go out trying to hype a fight, go, this guy's stand-up looks great, if it doesn't. If his stand-up looks shoddy, well, then his stand-up looks shoddy. It's not your job to try to cover for him as an analyst. And I've taken that with me, and now I'm behind the desk in the suit. And I took that one

line and I've educated other people to just simply with that one line, if you don't see it, don't say it. Yeah, you have to let people know what your real opinion of it is while being respectful. And that's where people don't understand. If I'm accurate about something, it's not disrespectful. It's just uncomfortable. It might be uncomfortable for you, but to label it disrespectful, you're not seeing what I'm saying. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with you as a human. I'm saying you might do a technique wrong. You might have an opening.

It's not a disrespectful thing. But to a lot of fighters, your entire identity is wrapped up in what you do. But you owe that to the viewer. That's who's paying to hear you, not the fighter. I can tell you. I thought I beat Michael Bisping. I thought it was pretty clear. It's very close.

You had a different opinion. And I never sent you a text or was upset with it. You have your opinion. And when you're on the mic, it's your job to share that opinion. You know, my opinion but i should clarify that my opinion actually changed when i watched it again when i watched it again i i thought your takedowns would have won it yeah i appreciate you know i had it the same way and i'm pretty objective i'm not afraid to go look i pulled one out it's hard though when you're

watching it live you know quite honestly i honestly get a better view of fights a lot of times from watching it at home the experience of it on pay-per-view is fucking great. I mean, they always get to the right angle immediately. It's never like, you know, sometimes I'll look up and, you know, Herb Dean's right in front of me. I can't see what's going on or someone's in a post. I don't know what's going on in the box. Like when Alan Belcher and Husamar Paul Harris went at it. Good job, Belcher and Husamar Paul Harris went at it. Good job, Belcher. When they first went to the ground, I didn't know that Belcher,

he instigated that position from the shot. You know, he's the one who pulled him into that position, and I didn't realize it. I thought that Paul Harris was diving on him because I couldn't quite see what was going on. So you do sometimes get a better view of a fight from watching it at home. Sometimes you get hyped up in the moment, too. It's hard to.

And off topic, but speaking of Belcher, you know, Dana gives a fight of watching it at home. Sometimes you get hyped up in the moment, too. It's hard to... And off-topic, but speaking of Belcher, you know, Dana gives a fight of the night. Fight-er of the night easily was Alan Belcher. You know, Paul Harris is scary. He's flat-out scary. Nobody wants to fight him because if it doesn't go well, you're going to sit out for six to eight months. He's going to rip your legs apart.

Yeah, it can go really, really bad. For the folks who don't know anything about the UFC or jiu-jitsu and you're just listening to this podcast, Paul Harris is one of the weirdest specialists in all of the UFC because his number one thing is ripping guys' knees apart. It's terrifying. Weird build, weird technique, hard to deal with. Huge Hulk-looking dude.

Yeah, short. 5'8 and just built like a brick shithouse and just dives on your leg and rips it apart. Horrific. The way he wins, people are screaming in agony. And Alan did a great job. Amazing. I was happy for him. I'd like to see Paul Harris win too because of his backstory.

Everything he's overcome. He's a great story too. I'm a huge fan of technique. Paul Harris' technique. It's not just his physical strength. His technique is masterful. The way he laces up leg locks on guys. The way he hit Misenzio.

I mean, the way he laces them up, it's like it's so pure. There's no fat in that technique. You know, I'm a fan of that. But I'm also a fan of a guy like Alan Belcher just figures out how to deal with it. I love that. I love that he just works specifically with guys like Dean Lister. And instead of saying, well, we want to avoid this, he was like, fuck this. I'll go to the ground with this guy. I don't care.

I'll go to the ground with him. And I think he blew his mind by doing that. I think Paul Harris was – He blew mine. Yeah. He blew mine. When he started going for the twister, I was like, if he taps Paul Harris, this would be the craziest fucking thing I've ever seen.

Yeah. Because he talked about that in his interviews leading up. I'll go to the ground. I'll put him in an ankle lock. I was like, sure, how many guys say? And then he went out and did it. I mean, he didn't go for the ankle lock, but he went out and did it. He backed up what he said.

Good for Belcher. You know, Belcher's had moments where I watch him and go, you are amazing. Yeah, he's a great guy, too. On a bad night, he's still very good. But on a good night, that guy's amazing. Good for Belcher. Yeah, and he's had some tough times, you know, with his detached retina he had for a while, which is very scary times you know with his uh detached retina he had for a while which is very scary you know to imagine i mean you're a professional fighter and you start

to lose your vision because of fighting so they have to repair your eyeball and then you know you have to have the confidence and the courage to go back out there and keep throwing leather and letting people punch you in that surgically repaired eyeball yeah so he was off for a long time i mean you know how hard you have to work to make up that ground of those six months you lost, and now you've got another four before. You've got to work double time, triple time. It's incredible. Just to catch up.

How long does it take just to catch up? So happy to see Belcher doing well. Yeah, oh, yeah, it takes just to get back to where you were. No improvement in technique, no improvement in conditioning, just to try to catch up. How long does it take to develop the wind for a five-round fight? For your rematch with Anderson Silva that you're training for, how long are you in peak, ridiculous, hard training to gear up for a five-round fight?

The answer I give, because it's a lifetime. It's a lifetime. I worked so hard until I was 23 and finished wrestling to go six minutes. And it was so difficult to go six minutes at that pace of a wrestling match. Now 15 minutes. Oh my goodness, it's so hard. When you start to break into those 25 minutes, I don't know if the human being is meant to do that. St. Pierre keeps taking a lot of criticism. Well, the reality is you're asking him to do a monumental task, which is to go hard for 25 minutes.

It's an impossible task to ask somebody. And there's a saying in boxing that if you go for the knockout, you will not win a decision. And you need to make your choice now. If I go for the kill, you know, Dan Henderson style, and you don't get it, and then you realize that Shogun's still alive and you've got to hang out for 25 minutes, it's not going to be a pretty 25 minutes. What a crazy fight that was.

Yeah, you've got to pace it. And a lot of people go, well, Dan Henderson's not in shape. Well, that's not the case. Dan Henderson's a human being. And human beings get very tired when they go for the kill. So you've got to plan it right. And George does plan it right. Now, if you want to see an exciting fight, shorten the rounds,

and George will go crazy. I guarantee it. He did before. So you think it's just a matter of the human body has to work too hard to fight at a high clip for five rounds? You know, 25 minutes is just too much. Nobody sprints for 25 minutes. How would you have it?

Would you have it? I always felt like it's kind of interesting. There's two schools of thought. One of them is that MMA is more difficult than boxing, and maybe the rounds should be in shorter length. But then the other school of thought is, but it takes a grappler a long time to get his opponent down, to work so hard for a takedown,

and then only have like five seconds left on the clock. That sounds ridiculous. You need a five-minute round at least. You take a guy down within the first couple minutes. You have time to work. You hold him down. You finish him. You have time to work. I hear you. But the competitors in no sport set the rules. It's the fans. It's the audience that sets the rules. So it comes down to what's more pleasing. But you are a fan as well. You are a fan as well. So as a fan, taking yourself out of the equation, just objectively with all the knowledge that you have, what would you think would be the

better format well it is how i would answer you professional boxing is viewed to be very boring so so they call boxing very boring ah boxing so boring that's not true boxing is fantastic go watch the amateurs it's three three minute rounds they throw punches and flurries non-stop for nine minutes so boxing boxing is very pleasing. Professional boxing, where you're asking a guy to do 12 rounds at three minutes, 36 minutes is unpleasing. Commentators have developed this feeling out process. There is no such thing. It's an unwritten agreement. You and I are going to go box. You and I both know we can't go 36 minutes. So I'm going to stand around and move around a little bit. You're going to stand around and move around a little bit. Once we get to round five,

now we both can do seven rounds. Let's go ahead and fight. There is no such thing as a feeling out process in boxing. I boxed for years. There's such a thing as surviving a ridiculous time frame that's put on you of a half of an hour. And so if you have a guy hurt, but he's

got a good chin and you go for it, you're fucked. You're screwed. I mean, that is the saying. That doesn't mean you're not going to find exceptions to the rule. But, yeah, the basic belief in boxing, and I believe it too, if you go for the finish, you will not win a decision. Eddie Alvarez. Does that name ring a bell? He's over in Bolitor.

Eddie Alvarez talks about this. You know, you got five rounds. How are you going to do it? Eddie says, I don't train for five rounds. I train for two. And Eddie Alvarez was like 32-2. He he had an amazing record and he finished guy after guy but he also had a totally different approach i'm gonna go for the kill if i don't get it yeah i acknowledge i'm in trouble but 32 men didn't have an answer for it and i really i really liked when eddie said this he and i were in bodog together and i heard him say that thought oh that's hyperbole and i

started watching no he's serious he trains to sprint and finish you and he does guy after guy. And when it doesn't work, well, he's got problems. Melvin Manhoef, I heard you bring him up earlier. You know, Melvin will do the same thing. He's training for three minutes. Yeah, three minutes of fury. Well, that's one of the reasons I love K-1. I love watching high-level kickboxing.

It's three rounds. Big matches are three rounds. I mean, I used to love watching those three round K-1 fights because it's about all those guys could take. The way they were going at it, the clip that they were fighting at,

I mean, if you go back and watch like Jerome Labanner versus Peter Ertz, they're just fucking swinging at each other. And they take turns knocking each other down.

Ertz knocks down Labanner with a high kick and then Labanner starches Ertz with a left hook. Both guys just got fucking waylaid on each other. They kick like you'd swing a baseball bat. I mean, it's just violent. You know, hey, speaking of the K-1 and guys that did well, what's up with Bob Sapp?

Now, these aren't real fights he's going to do in these countries, right? Is the opponent in on the gang? Like this guy that hits him after the bell for five seconds. You know, Puginowski's a gentleman. He's a sportsman. He's going to punch somebody after the bell, unless in the back you worked it out. Hey, let me cover up and act mad about it. I mean, come on.

That whole thing looks so fugazi. That couldn't be real. Bob Sack gets a paycheck. I mean, this is my opinion. It doesn't look good. The whole thing was bad. And I think what made it worse was when Puginowski kept hitting him after the bell. Like, come on, Pugin.

You're not going to do that unless you know this looks this looks awful it's like when Dan Severn and Shannon Rich did their uh their work you know Dan come on man you're caught on this this is brutal this is brutal and your interviews after the fact are worse than the poor job you did in the ring at I didn't see that fight oh Oh, you didn't see it? Do you know what a roundoff is from gymnastics? It's a gymnastics. It's like a hand spring. It's a hand spring, and you'll usually turn.

Dan Severin hit one of those in the fight. I'll just let you know that. Shannon did something, and Dan Severin hits a roundoff in the middle of the ring. What? Oh, God. It was so bad, Joey. What? And then after the match, they do their interviews and their interview

dan severance cover-up of the work was worse than the work well i was just fortunate to get over on shannon rich he's such a great competitor you know shannon rich has never won a fight dan severance a former multiple-time world champion you know absolutely legendary in our sport i was just fortunate to have a good enough training camp to go. Wow. Dan, you got to stop, man. You got to stop. We've all been in the locker room and Shannon Rich walks in and says, who wants the night off? All right, Shannon, I guess I'll take you.

You know, this isn't a secret in the industry, Dan. You know, come on. You got caught. Just call it what it is. Wow, that's weird. Well, he always did a lot of pro wrestling as well, didn't he? Yeah, horribly. I mean, he got a stint in the WWE, and they just couldn't use him.

They said, look, you got to go. Just not entertaining enough. He just didn't get it. He couldn't work. If you watch his Shannon match and you see how bad he did it, it was so bad, man. It was so bad. This was the brilliance of pride. And I get heat when I talk about Vandalay and Crow Cop doing their fake matches.

But in America, if you're going to do a pro wrestling match, both guys will sit in the back, and they'll come up with what they're going to do. They call it their spots. Okay, you do this, and I'll do that. In pride, what they would do is the promoter would visit one locker room. So if you're going to take on Vandalay or Crow Cop, your promoter shows up, boom, here's your 10 grand and here's how this fight's going to end. Vandalay isn't privy to that. So when the guy goes down, his celebration is genuine because he doesn't know that the guy

got his locker room visit. It's the same thing with Crow Cop that thought one leg cemetery and one leg hospital. No, Crow Cop, your legs aren't knocking people out the promoter visited the back beforehand that's what's not gonna and then i made this public i added these guys because i don't like either one of them well there were absolutely some legit knockouts for sure like vanderlei and crow cop the second oh sure when he kicked his head yeah i remember that fight i enjoyed their first fight too when vanderlei won well i think they called it a draw it was a draw because vanderlei won you know per per our scoring system. Yeah, I agree.

You know, but as soon as I said, also Goodridge and Coleman, all these guys going, yeah, he's right. It was a bunch of payoffs. Well, there had to be Takata and Coleman. It's like, yeah, I mean, come on. Remember Takata and Coleman?

Yeah, you'd have to put on your Columbo rain jacket to figure this out, you know. Excuse me. Pardon me. Excuse me. How come I'm 22-0 in Japan and can't win two straight in America? They offered Eddie a fixed fight. Let me let you know. Excuse me. Pardon me. Excuse me. How come I'm 22-0 in Japan and can't win two straight in America?

They offered Eddie a fixed fight. Let me let you know. Eddie Bravo? Eddie Bravo got offered by a not-to-be-named Jabbitt to lose. Or to win, rather. Oh. To beat Tokoro. They were going to have it set up.

But meanwhile, it could have been a double cross where he goes there and he thinks Tokoro is going to lay down and Tokoro beats the shit out of him. That's what we call the screw job finish, Joe. The Montreal screw job is what we call that. Yeah, there's a word for it in the professional pool, too. I think it's double dump. I think you dump both ways. Ah, I see.

Is that what it is? Yeah, because pool has a real hard problem with that. Like, say if I'm a pool player and you're a rich guy, I say, listen, Shale, I got a fucking game and I can't go wrong here, buddy. I am robbing this guy. Come on, let's put up 500 bucks and let's make some money. And I go to them and I go, listen, here's the deal. I'm going to lose and we'll just fucking split this 70-30 and cut it up right now.

We got ourselves a big chunk of cash. Wow. And so there's no real match going on in the first place. Sure. They had already decided that they were going to dump and real match going on in the first place. Sure. They had already decided that they were going to dump and they were going to split up this guy's money. That's him and a friend got together and they pretended to be rivals so they could gamble and he would dump to this guy.

I can't fucking make a ball. I don't know what's going on. Sure. Sure. They just cut off that dude's money. A little typical Diggs town hustle. Sure. And then, you know, the two of them get together after the show and split up half that guy's

money. Right. Or 70%, whatever they agreed upon. Different guys would make different deals. But it was always a big problem to the point where they had the only time Vegas allowed them to gamble on pool ever. They set it up so it was one of their big tournaments. And all they did was they found who was the number one guy least likely to win. 40 to 1 odds?

Okay. We're all going to let that guy win. We're just going to gamble all of our money and fucking get paid. Right. Allegedly. Yeah. Allegedly. Well, that's unfortunate that happened.

I mean, I can see where that would happen. But that is unfortunate because in some weird walk of society, that is sport. That does involve timing and accuracy and training. So it's unfortunate when guys do it. But I think I get it. I mean, I guess I understand it. I don understand. I can understand betting on yourself. I can understand if you're some wild motherfucker like Bernard Hopkins says, I'm going to go bet $100,000 on myself, you know, because that's how much I know I'm going to win this

fight. I like that. I don't like the option of doing it the other way. Betting on your opponent and taking a dive. The fact that that's possible, the fact that you could get your friend to do it, the fact that there have been unethical dumps before, without a doubt. Sure. No doubt about it. I mean, we all know of them.

I don't know if you've ever bet on a UFC fight, but I don't know if you haven't, then you wouldn't know this, but the way it works, in a lot of gambling halls, you would imagine, well, if I show up, it's four to one odds, and I put 50 grand down.

I got 50 grand at 4-1. It doesn't work that way. If you go to bet at a sportsbook in Vegas on a UFC fight, this isn't the same for everything, but for UFC, because there's not enough money coming in, you can only bet X amount at a time. Then they reset the line, and then you've got to bet it again. How much is the number?

Well, I bet on Henderson when he fought Vandele. Now, this was a number of years, I think 2006. Could have been 2007. And they only let me bet 500. Henderson was a 3-1 underdog, so I go 500, 500, 500. And I got to my $3,000 limit. And I had to go to three different casinos. Now, I'm quite sure with the influx of the sport that it would be closer to 10,000.

But I'm quite sure it's not over 10,000. How confident were you, though? That's pretty fucking badass. Just keep going to casino after casino. I felt good. Thinking that Henderson's going to win. It was good, you know. And, you know, that's when Vandal, I mean, nobody could beat Vandal.

He had that reputation like Mike Tyson was hanging on to for a while. You know, but you're talking about Dan Henderson. You're talking about one of the baddest dudes to ever live. He's a fucking tank. He's something else, man. And I knew it was going to be a good fight, too. I didn't know it was going to be a walk in the park. But you got to bet on your guy.

Yeah. Well, you know, Henderson is a fucking tank, man. He's a tank. He's one of those dudes where you pat him on the back and it feels like there's something wrong. Like, why are you so dense? Right. Like, what the fuck is this? And he turns around to look at y'all stiff.

He can hardly move. If his teeth are out, oh, hey, what are you doing? You know, gives you some insult of some sort of some sort that's his way of saying hello. Some mean-spirited knock that for some reason is charming when he does it. That's the only song he goes, what, did you get another fucking tattoo? I go, you sound like my mom. He always has something mean as his greeting. This is my favorite Dan Henderson story.

We were in Caroline's Comedy Club in New York, and there was this guy that was heckling. He wouldn't shut the fuck up. And I go, listen, man, if you don't shut the fuck up, I'm going to have Dan Henderson come over here and hold you down while he fucks your girlfriend. The crowd goes nuts, and Dan goes, why would I hold him down when I could just stare him down?

I'm telling you, the fucking place erupted. The fucking place erupted. And it was like one of the creepiest things I ever heard a man say to another man ever. Like, you could see the dude. The dude just wanted to crawl out of the room and just hide somewhere. The feeling of looking over at that fucking savage after he just says something like that to you like oh let it change let me get out of here well and henderson broke etiquette you know there's an etiquette amongst men if one guy's with a girl and one guy's not you you're always wrong you let him slow you let him look like a hero you know then it comes back to you someday

well i think in that situation it was there was 350 fucking people in that crowd that guy was a jackass. He was drunk. Dan Henderson was there. And he was like, well, I'll shut this fucking dummy up. Right. Oh, I like it. It's a beautiful line.

Yeah. He essentially trumped my heckler comment. I had shut him down. And then Henderson came along and put the nuclear bomb on top of it. Right. He put the verbal H-bomb on it. The verbal H-bomb on top of it. That's good work by Dan.

It was very good work. On the spot like that, the best line youbomb on it. The verbal H-bomb on top of it. That's good work by Dan. It was very good work. On the spot like that, the best line you could have ever written. You can't write anything creepier than that. Why would I hold him down when I could just stare him down? A guy has to think like that. In order to have that thought in his head, in order to be able to say that verbally, I mean, if you're going to be a writer and you're going to come up with that, it might take you six hours alone doing cocaine and drinking coffee to pretend you're the type of guy that would think that way,

to have that line come out of your character's mouth. It took Dan Henderson one half of one second. He just waited. Well, this is the same guy that volunteered to fight Dos Santos three weeks ago to move up arguably two-way. Because truly, he's a middleweight. He chooses to fight at light heavyweight. Yeah, he doesn't like cutting weight. Right, so truly he'd be going up two-way.

Yeah, anyway. He's great. He's a fucking animal. He's something else, man. He's an animal. And those guys, they almost all come from wrestling. The guys like that Henderson stock, there's guys that can push through pain,

and then there's wrestlers. There's another level of mental strength, of the ability to endure. And what you were talking about going through when you were a kid, like being malnourished and fucking traveling on buses and wherever the hell you're going to these different wrestling meets and not getting enough sleep and how difficult. And you had to do schoolwork as well and how difficult all that is. The mental toughness that wrestlers develop

from that ridiculous first of all for fucking cutting weight all the time just to be able to people like to feel good when they compete they like to feel great and charged up and confident i had so many friends when i was wrestling that would be like there was this kid named mark collins who's a really good wrestler really really good but he would he would cut down to like 118 pounds he was a little guy anyway but he would cut down to like 118 pounds. He was a little guy anyway, but he would cut down like real. Maybe I'm exaggerating. Maybe it was like 120 something.

We were in high school. It was 118. It used to be 118. Was it 118? It used to be. But the fucking guy was never happy. He would always just have this dour look on his face. Life sucked.

He was just walking around, just always hungry. And, you know, it stunted my friend Steve's growth. My friend Steve, all of his brothers are like 6'2", 6'1", 6'3". Big fucking guys. He's 5'6". Goes all throughout high school just fucking dieting. Going through regular wrestling and then going off to camps and never allowed to actually eat full meals for a normal long period of time

and grow like a normal man. It's like he essentially grew up impoverished. Right. You know? Yeah, and it's tough. You talk about how hard the weight cut is. And for us, for our sport of MMA, it's a 24-hour weigh-in. You weigh in, the show starts 24 hours later.

In wrestling, it's a one-hour weigh-in. And not only that, Joe, the national tournament, the whole reason you wrestle, is a three-day tournament with hour weigh-in and not only that joe the national tournament the whole reason you wrestle is a three-day tournament with three weigh-ins so you weigh in you do two matches you cut weight that night you weigh in again you do two matches you cut weight that night you come back for the championship so god yeah so i mean you're talking guys that aren't sleeping they're just they're just they're cut weight non-stop boom time to wrestle i mean how do you know how do you do it and it really is where the rubber meets the road sometimes the best wrestler often that had the best season 35 and oh will not even place at the national tournament because you know where he used to

weigh in have 24 hours get on the mat he'd win a dual meet tournament style one hour way and you're on the mat next morning weigh in again and so is that like um indicative of a style of competing like some guys like frankie edgar don't cut any weight at all other guys is that the case in wrestling as well like some guys would try to cut the most amount of weight sure but other guys would think that the best way to do it was be entirely healthy and just be natural and deal with a guy yeah yeah you see that all the time you know and there's some guys that well i got a little bit more speed this guy you know he's going to come in the ring at 220. I'm going to come in at 204, but I'm going to be a little bit faster than him.

And that's where Dan Henderson's made a living. Yeah. You know, Dan Henderson's beat multiple heavyweight world champions, one from Big Nog to Fedor. Those are heavyweights, but he used that little bit of speed. Didn't he get armbarred by Big Nog? Yes, he absolutely did, but that was the rematch. He fought him in a tournament called King of Rings. Okay, so that wasn't really MMA.

You weren't allowed to do certain things like strike on the ground, right? Well, there was some stuff that was held back, and you could strike on the ground. I want to say it was open palm. You know, open palm. Definitely no soccer kicks or pride rules, but I mean, it was considered. I considered MMA, absolutely. He fought Gilbert Ivo, because when you're on your feet you could do everything right it was something about with the takedown i believe was an open palm to the head isn't that crazy when you see like a boss rooting style pancreas fights what a weird fucking hybrid of the two for folks

who don't know you were allowed to kick with you know you have these like boots on that had shin pads on them but you weren't allowed to punch the face. Instead, you could slap people. Full blast. And Boss Rooten figured out a way to pull his hand back way far. And when he would throw slaps, I don't know, I can't even bend my hand back the way he would do it. And he would essentially be punching you with his palms. Yeah, the palm strike.

Yeah, he got so good at just punching throwing like punching techniques in the palms whereas everybody else had kind of like they hadn't figured that out yet and they were slapping each other yeah boss was a master i loved watching bosses old fights over there but some of those were for gazey too you know some of that pancreas stuff you'd want you're gonna wait a minute yeah come on no doubt no doubt there was definitely some some fixed fights it's weird that some guys don't want to admit that. But now I think they should. I think they kind of owe it to history. We know that there was a lot of real fights for sure.

But there was no question about it. There were some that were a little funky. But that goes back to the point I made earlier that both guys aren't necessarily in on it in Japan. Crowcopter, those guys really think they won. And if you tell them they didn't, you're talking about really hurting a guy's feelings. He'll get fighting mad over that that you go hey listen what fights history will will come out and and show itself for what it is but you know what fight that's really hard because i don't know all those guys named but but cro-cop fought one guy that wore a

pro wrestling mask he is a pro wrestler he wrestles under the name of uh uh dos caros yes uh alberto del rio is what his name but of course you already know that that's what he comes out and says he's a very funny guy and he's talked about it a lot of yeah they brought me around anything about i gotta fight this crow cop he's eventually he's gonna throw a head kick and i gotta make it look real you know he's talked about crow cop would would he'd be stunned to hear that i i believe i believe crow cop did not know that these were fake now i didn't have that realization when I first outed him. I came to, when he responded, I thought, you know what?

He's either an Academy Award winner or he truly doesn't know. And then you start to hear from some other guys where they go, look, you didn't always know. The promoter would come to your locker room. So that wrestling guy, when Krokop kicked him, though, he really fucking kicked that guy in the head. It's just the guy sort of like just took it. Yeah, and the guy's just got to go down and boom the referee was bleeding the referee with blood was coming through the mouth well this could be is that the same guy yeah and if it wasn't if it was fake what a fucking great touch because the mask if they had like a little

blood packet there and when cro cop slaps it blood comes out i mean what a great touch that would be but you know you see a kick coming you go okay this is the one i got paid for you take it it could cause a kick i had a buddy that went down he was by no means doing a dive he was just ready to quit he was just he just wanted out of there so you know and fighters will do this a lot where something's not going right and they got it's time to go home and you know they'll usually the rear naked choke is the big one for hey get me out of here but uh so my buddy decides that he's going to go down on a fake knockout so we're in bodog in costa rica dan this guy named dan stevenson the big viking guy used to fight in the ufc a couple times named christiansen is that what his name was anyway dan throws the punch my buddy jeremiah goes down the punch missed jeremiah goes down but the referee troy waugh

doesn't catch it in time so now my buddy who's out cold, well, now Dan Christensen's going to come down for the finish because the ref hasn't called it. So my buddy who's pretending has to come back to life. He has to come back to life to lay there and go for TKO. So when you watch the replay, you're like, wait a minute, I thought you were out cold. How come when he came down, it was pretty bad? But you see that stuff all the time.

And that's not to say the sports fugazi. That's just competition. What you're trying to do, what I'm trying to do when I'm fighting, is make the other guy quit. What he has to do when he's ready to quit is make it look like he got, you know, that's just part of it. And nobody wants to talk about that. In fact, one guy did. One guy talked about it in Ohio.

I can't think of what his name was. A former UFC fighter, Rashad, kicked him in the head. Sean Salomon. That's what his name is. Sean talked about it. this wasn't my night. I gave him an arm, and I tapped out and got out of there. He was very candid. He got in trouble for it.

He got in Canada because they thought he was throwing a fight. But what he was doing was he was letting people into the psyche of an athlete who's breaking. He's breaking, and it's an ugly, deep secret. And we've all done it as athletes, whether it's in practice or in the ring, and we're greatly shameful of it. So what he did is he just let people in and goes, look, this is what happened. I broke down mentally.

The commissioner comes out and suspends him for it. It's like, well, commissioner, obviously you've never competed. We can see that. Yeah, that's ridiculous. That is exactly what it is when a guy gives up an arm. He's trying to save himself. Yeah, he's trying to save himself. He's saving a little dignity.

I got caught. Yeah, that is an issue. The real issue of people regulating athleticism where they don't understand the psychology behind being an athlete, especially a combat athlete. There was an issue that I had, and we don't name any names here, but it was when someone had questioned you about you fake tapping against Paul Ophelia. Paul Ophelia.

And my take on that is for you to ask a man what he's thinking right then in the middle of an incredibly emotional situation where he's losing a fight he knows it's over he got locked up in it and he's thinking there's gotta be a fucking way out of this there's gotta be a way you want to win so bad you say something that you're ashamed of later and but to say that that thing that you were ashamed of that you did represents your character or your sensibilities or your honesty i think is a bit disingenuous to be judged in that moment and that vulnerable awful devastating moment yeah is not right it's especially for someone who has when you have competed at a high level for a number of years like you have it's almost

like you could be considered like almost like a slightly crazy person like your fanaticism for victory your your need to compete and excel it'd be the only way to get really fucking good is you got to be a little crazy you just have to be and you got to want to fucking win you can't be happy with any any other result you cannot be happy or you've got to want to fucking win. You can't be happy with any other result. You cannot be happy or you won't achieve your full potential. And that sometimes equates to people fucking up. It sometimes equates to breaking. It equates to mental lapses.

It equates to a lot of different things. You know, I had to respond to that. I had a person, again, let's make sure we keep him unnamed, but he wanted a response to that. I'm going, geez, you know, if I'm to be candid with with you if i get tapped out in front of a sold-out audience that was aired on live worldwide television and i then lie about doing it the only person i'm lying to is myself you know that's it the only if i'm trying to fool so if i'm in denial you know and me i could be anybody could be chael or I could be Fighter X. But if he's doing that, look, the only person you're lying to is yourself.

Did the guy file a complaint with the commission? Well, that's within the rules. What did the guy do? If he's forcing you to make a ruling, go ahead. But like you said, and let's also not forget. When you file a complaint, how much of that is gamesmanship? Because you're trying to get a rematch anyway anyway and the whole game is about making more money i'll tell you what joe in my entire career i couldn't name one person that's ever filed a complaint i know they've been filed

but i literally couldn't tell you one guy that's done it and i know some guys think hey listen there was a misapplication of the rules i really like a review and i understand that but again i couldn't say state a case for you but you know there's there's other things like the first amendment i've got the right to say i didn't tap in any single fight that i want okay the second one fight ends the marketing for the next fight begins and if a fighter chooses to do that he's got everywhere there's nothing within the rules of a commission to say what a guy is going to say in his post-fight interview. That's silly. So you will say, you're essentially admitting that you will say untruthful things just in order to keep the hype going

and that people should not misinterpret. This is a blurry line. Yeah, for me, no. A pro-wrestling blurry line there. I'm not saying that for me. But if I'm saying me, I just mean an athlete in general. It could be any sport. But first off, an athlete is not under oath.

So he can come out and say whatever he wants. He's just a person. And secondly, if one competition ends, it could be baseball or fighting or whatever, the makings and the matchmaking and the shuffling and the politicking for the next event begins. And for somebody to come in and want an answer for that and try to attempt to regulate you is beyond inappropriate. I mean, I would want to say it's illegal. Again, it comes down to First Amendment.

A guy can say whatever he wants. In a post-fight interview or post-match interview or game or whatever it is. I want to take myself out of this now, you know, person in general. Come on, he can say whatever he wants. Especially if you're considering that part of you as an athlete to be sort of performance art. You have an act, and that act enhances your overall brand. When you go out there and you talk a bunch of crazy shit, whether or not you believe

in it, and people start talking about you, it becomes monetarily advantageous to do that. You make more money that way. Brock Lesnar. Yeah, perfect. I think a perfect example, UFC 100, all of his fights. Brock was always fun to listen to. You want to know who else is fun? It's Quentin Jackson.

Yes. Quentin finishes a fight. We all sit there in the living room. Wait, wait, wait. Quentin's about to talk, and he says something funny, whether he gives you a hard time or he's inviting people to an after party. Wait, wait, wait. Quentin's about to talk. And he says something funny, whether he gives you a hard time. Black on black crime. Inviting people to an after party. It's funny, and that's part of the show that people paid for.

So that's not to say a fighter or, again, any athlete has to do that. But if he chooses to, he's got to be considered outside the scope of the regulatory body. I mean, talk about them overstepping. That's beyond inappropriate. Regulatory body. I mean talk about them overstepping. That's that's beyond inappropriate Well, I certainly think you should be able to ask a guy after he's fucking taking a shower and tell us what happened I fucked up. I said I didn't tap like I was just losing my mind in there Sure, but but even if he doesn't if he wants to take it to the grave. Yeah, let's not forget the guy doesn't know you anything He's not under subpoena. He owes you nothing including the truth if that's his choice

So for a government official because that's how this started that's his choice. So for a government official, because that's how this started, as you were talking about government, for a government official to get involved and act as though he's going to suspend or uphold somebody's license because he didn't like something that he said in the media is inappropriate. I agree. Now, what happened to you? I'm fascinated personally by big leaps in development.

I'm always fascinated when you hear about a guy, well, yeah, he was a blue belt, and then something happened. He went into a few seminars, and before you know it, he's fucking killing everybody at the Mundiales. You went from UFC, was it UFC 60 that you you fought jeremy horn yeah you were having some tough fights man very impressed that you know that by the way good job thank you see a lot of shows um i can't remember where my fucking car keys are but i'll tell you random ufc facts i have no idea where i put my cell phone but but you um you fought jeremy horn and then something happened between then and when you had a resurgence, which was, say, what do you attribute your resurgence to? Like, what year do you think it really started?

I know where you're going with this, and let me jump ahead. You know, what you're saying is, hey, I had some major submission problems, and all of a sudden I started submitting some guys. Not just that, man. You became a more confident guy. I don't want to undermine your confidence before because i didn't know you i meant uh i mean the way you presented yourself i should say um you you got way better at marketing yourself and you started fucking dominating top flight it's like you hit your own you had a personal wall and you got through that fucking thing you got through that fucking thing and you made a big leap you know and when when you fought nate marquardt i think

that was the fight that really opened up a lot of people's eyes it's like whoa like chael sonnen's a motherfucker i remember me and eddie bravo had dinner after that and i was like how about that power double god damn it's like nate could not keep you off of him and we were we were thinking about it and was like wow what a nightmare it's like you had not keep you off of him. And we were thinking about it, and it was like, wow, what a nightmare. It's like you had figured out a way to get all of your potential out inside the Octagon. What happened? I appreciate that. And, you know, you don't know in training either.

For me, I had a fight with Yushin Okami. He was ranked number two in the world, and I was just one of those guys that was kind of looked at as a top ten. That was right before I fought Nate Morikawa, and it gave me a lot of confidence. But here's what happened, Joe. I have never lost a round of fighting. And when I say that, sometimes the guy will laugh because I've lost some fights. But I've never lost a round. I've never had a fight where a judge ever scored a round against me until my last match with Bisping.

So at the point of your story, though, I sit down one day and I'm looking at it. I'm on SureDog.com. I bring myself up. I'm looking at my record. I've won every round I've ever fought. I've never been in a tough fight. I've never had stitches. I've never broken it. I've dominated everybody. And I've lost eight fights. And I lost all of them by submission. And I lost all of them in the second round. And I'm staring at that on the computer. I'm staring at these numbers like a CEO would his spreadsheet. And I'm saying there's something going on here. And it's not physical. There's something going on that I can dominate eight minutes of a fight, seven minutes of a fight, nine minutes of a fight and find a way out time after time after time in the same round with the same move. And so I find

I wouldn't got I wouldn't got help. I wouldn't got professional help. And I sought out a doctor, Ed Versteg. I hate talking about this because this was a real turning point for me is when I went in, worked on sports psychology, got hypnotized. I was never the same. I was never the same in practice. My attitude was different. Controlling my diet, being disciplined, falling asleep. The way I approached battle, the way I approached the second round, everything changed. And it changed to the point where I hate to say what I just said,

and now it's too late, because I felt like it was my secret. I discovered, and I don't want other people to know, I'll write about it someday in a book, I'll talk about it when I'm retired, but I'm not going to tell anybody, because it's competitive edge. And when I started seeing a sports psychologist, when I finally came clean, it was like being an alcoholic. Before you can get help, you've got to admit you have a problem. And when I finally admitted I got a problem, when I finally said it, when I finally could acknowledge and look somebody in the eye and tell them this is what's going on, I'm finding a way to lose as opposed to win. I work harder than these guys.

I've been at this longer. I'm losing. I know how to stop submissions. I'm finding my way to lose as opposed to win. I work harder than these guys. I've been at this longer. I've I'm losing I know how to stop submissions. I'm finding my way into them I'm finding a way out and that's what's happening I had to acknowledge that and once I did it I I never lost again I lost to Paulo which was you know the controversial one I lost to Anderson after dominating him. I've never been beat since since I saw this doctor.'s incredible. Now, Joe, let me ask you a question. Are you ever allowed to give a shout-out on the show? Do you ever say hi to anybody? If I was to say hi

Brittany because my girlfriend just texted me and said she's watching the show and I mentioned the name Brittany to earn myself special points, is that going to tick you off? I'm not even going to say Brittany if that's going to be a cheap plug and you're going to get mad. I'll do it. Hello, Brittany. Thanks for tuning in. Thank you, buddy.

You're welcome, pal. Very nice of you. That's a beautiful story, man. I knew there must have had to have been something on the mental side because I remember, as you do, that the Yushin Okami fight was an excellent performance. And I remember being real impressed with that, but even more so impressed with the Nate Marquardt fight

because I knew that Yushin was a grappler, and I wasn't surprised that you were a stronger grappler than him, but I was surprised that Nate Marquardt fight because, you know, I knew that Yushin was a grappler, and I wasn't surprised that you were a stronger grappler than him, but I was surprised that Nate Marquardt just couldn't stop you from taking him down. He just could not stop you. And the way you were doing it, you were ragdolling him to the point where you were like, Jesus, like, this guy's a fucking nightmare for a lot of dudes, man. And we started, like, then we started doing the matchups. You know, you start thinking in your head, what about him?

But when you fought Anderson, man, whoo, that was a crazy fight, man, for four minutes or for four rounds. And how many minutes into the fifth round? Four minutes and 31 seconds. But who's keeping track? Four minutes and 31 seconds of a five-minute round. Motherfucker. What was that like?

What was that like when it happened? It was devastating. I'll tell you what. I had no idea what was happening in? What was that like when it happened? It was devastating. I'll tell you what they, I had no idea what was happening in that fight. None. And, uh, when the fight was over,

I was devastated. And they, they, they, I came to, and I said to the ref, you know, the typical thing,

like a doofus, what happened? Right. The referee, Josh Rosenthal is a fantastic referee. Simply says you tapped out. And he looks at me for a response like I was going to argue, and I simply say, I believe you.

Now, I knew that because ESPN zoomed in on that and showed it, but that's all I said. I said, I believe you, and that was it. Do you remember what happened when you were – did you think of tapping and you went out? Like, what happened? I remember falling asleep. You know, it's a very weird experience if you've ever been in it.

And I know you practice it, so you have been. But it's a very weird experience, you know, when you're actually going to sleep, but you're trying to stay within reality. And I remember having a dream thinking, well, if I tap, I could get out of this. Now let's not tap. The fight was over. So you had already tapped and you didn't even know. I had already tapped.

I hit his foot. And I didn't fully know what happened. When it was over and I came to, I didn't fully know what happened when it was over and i came to i didn't fully know what happened i'm trying to figure out what just happened yeah most people by the way who have never been choked out will never be able to understand that they'll call like fake tap and this and that but unless you've done if unless you've been choked you really don't understand how confusing it is sure there's a lot of guys who don't they don't know what happened right when they wake up it's a mess and i'm one of those guys.

I was with the other people where I would always see fighters go, what happened after they got knocked? I said, come on, dummy, you know what happened. No, you don't. You sure don't. Especially from a concussion. Especially from KOs. You absolutely don't know.

So aside from being choked, don't forget I've got fatigue issues. I've got blood and Vaseline in my eyes. I've got exhaustion. I've got anxiety. I'm a normal human being. I feel exhaustion. I got anxiety. I got anxiety. I'm a normal human being. I feel every emotion. So many people say to me, oh, you're never scared.

Come on, I'm a human. I feel it all. But, you know, so I lose the fight. We go in the back and they bring me the fight of the night check. They pay you immediately if you get a bonus. Boom, here's your check. And I remember thinking, you gave me that out of sympathy because that was such a boring fight. You know, nothing happened. You gave me that as sympathy. I'll take it. You know, I'm fighting back the tears. I'm just devastated. You know, I'm absolutely devastated by this defeat. And later the fight gets named not only fight of the night, it was called fight of the

year. We won the award from a fighters only magazine, which puts on the award show, uh, for fight of the year. So it ended up being a really good fight. But my point that I'm trying to get at is that's how out of touch I was with what was happening in the ring. At one point, my cornerman told me it's round four when it was round five, or he told me it was round four when it was round three. Whatever it was, the corner had the rounds off. The instruction I was getting was a little bit off.

And I just didn't fully know what was going on. And in this next fight, I'd like to, you know, as I visualize and plan for it, that's one of the things. I'd like to be a little more aware and a little more in touch with what's happening. But it's hard. It's hard in the octagon, man. A lot of stuff goes out the window. You get hit. You get kicked.

You get – it's tough. It's tough to stay focused. How tough is it to describe to someone who's never had that experience? It's almost impossible. You know, I almost can't do it. It's like when, you know, an executive director comes at you and wants to know, like we were talking about earlier, hey, why'd you do this? And you're kind of going, you know, I don't really know how to put it into words. And I don't mean this condescendingly but obviously you've never been in that spot because it's one of those indescribable feelings and when you have

victory that's also an indescribable feeling when you make that walk in front of 17,000 people screaming cheering booing whatever it is that's also an indescribable feeling so it's a very unique sport and you know people will always ask me on game day, are you ready? Are you excited? And are you scared? You'll get these questions and the answer is no. But I can't tell you what I am either. For all the human emotions that have definitions, I don't know how to describe what it's like on fight day. It's a combination of many things. And if we're going to be truthful, most of them are unpleasant. It's a combination of many things. And if we're going to be truthful, most of them are unpleasant. It's a very stressful situation. You know, you're walking into battle,

you've prepared for this, and it's all on the line and it's on the line in front of everybody. And there's a great relief if you have victory and a great despair if you have defeat. Absolutely. Proportionately. You used a very interesting word there that surprised me. You said relief. You didn't say happy. You said relief. And Joe, you could not be more correct. I had a fight with Brian Stan after I was out for 14 months dealing after the Anderson loss.

I had to deal with the commission. I had to go back and deal with these guys. I got this suspension. Everything puts me out for 14 months. It was 8 days later before I was back to myself emotionally because all I was for that week plus was relieved. It was the ultimate exhale of my life. I wasn't happy I won. I wasn't excited.

I was relieved it was over. I was just relieved that I made it through. You know, from the weigh-in to the process to the licensing to the battle, I made it through and got out of there. That's very interesting that you used that word. Well, I used to experience that relief from Taekwondo tournaments, which in comparison to MMA is absolutely benign. I mean, it's not even remotely as draining, as physically demanding, as scary, you know, all of the above. But I still would get a great relief when I was done.

You know, I'd go through a tournament. It'd be over. I could rest for a couple weeks. I wouldn't have to think. And then when I finally stopped competing completely, it was the weirdest feeling ever, this weird feeling of not worrying about six months in the future, like don't have a drink now because if you do, what if you wind up getting drunk and then you can't train as well tomorrow

and then six weeks in the future you're off and you lose because you fucked up and you slacked off. There was always this impending doom cycle. With MMA, it's got to be 100,000 times that. Now, Joe, last time I tried to sneak out of here to go to the bathroom, you made an announcement, chill, you're going to urinate. Don't tell anybody. It embarrasses me. I like to sneak out like a little kid. I'm sorry You made an announcement. Chill, you're going to urinate. Don't tell anybody. It embarrasses me.

I like to sneak out like a little kid. I'm sorry. So don't mention it. I won't say anything. Okay, I'm going to run out, but I don't want you to tell everybody. I won't even talk about it. Are you going to snap one off? Okay, now, Joe, I want to tell you this, though.

Okay. When I come back, because I don't know what our timeline is, but I have a story that I want to make sure I tell. Do you know who D.B. Cooper is? Yes, I do. Bring him up when I come back. Okay. Powerful chill son. Is he making a poopy? do you know who D.B. Cooper is? Yes I do. Bring him up when I come back. Okay I will do that.

Powerful Chelsan and ladies and gentlemen. Is he making a poopy? I don't know what he's doing. I don't ask a man. I ask a man what kind of movements he's doing. So that note, that Samsung Galaxy note or whatever. Oh we're talking about that giant cell phone. It's amazing.

Has no one seen it? It's pretty much maybe this phone. It's amazing. Has no one seen it? It's pretty much maybe this big. It's 5.3 inches. 5.3. So it's almost like a small Kindle or something. It's a small tablet, and it's a phone, and it slips into your pocket, and it has a crazy processor, really ridiculously fast, giant screen. You can draw on pictures like suck it, I'm here with stupid.

You can take pictures and you can draw on them. When you i'm here with stupid you can take pictures and like you can draw on them when you watch web pages on it it's incredible it's the best cell phone web experience ever there's been a lot of talks that the ipad is going to have a smaller version like a seven inch version unless it's a phone i don't give a fuck if they should make a five inch phone just make it stop it we like big. I use my phone half the time to look at my email, half the time to you know, I mean, between 50 and 60% of

the time is not making phone calls. It's doing other cool shit. Getting online. You don't think a pocket thing is going to be a pain in the ass? I bet that note is just a pain. Like having an old trio in your pocket or something. I'm glad you asked this, Brian, because I have recently gone back to the fanny pack. I got a new one.

I ordered one from Roots because Andrew Dice Clay had it when we were doing the podcast with him the other day. Remember that? Yeah, you got jealous of us. I did get a little jealous of his fantastically designed fanny pack. I was like, that's a real goddamn fanny pack. So I ordered one online, and two days later I got it. I'm very happy.

So I'd carry that note around gladly inside my fanny pack. I'm bringing back the fanny pack strong. By the way, shout out to Chris Lieben. There was photos of Chris Lieben in Hawaii wearing a fanny pack. Way to go, Chris. Well done. Keep on rocking in the free world. You know, you bring up Chris Lieben.

If I can jump in here real fast. I don't know if I'm interrupting something. But I threw an event. I threw an event. It was like an after party with jail. And it was a colossal failure. Nobody shows that. We got 18 people.

We got this whole bar to ourself. You know, we got drinks. We got a DJ. It's a massive failure. So we end up turning the radio off. And we all just end up sitting down and talking. And by the end of the night, it couldn't have gone any better. I know everybody.

Okay, this guy's on his honeymoon. This guy's wife bought him presents. These guys, it's their anniversary. I know everybody in the room. I know them by name. I know what city they're from. We spend about three hours talking, and I'm telling them stories. I'm telling them stories of UFC, behind-the-scenes stuff, you know.

And I'm running out of stories. They're like, tell us another story. And I'm like, you know who has great stories? It's Chris Lieben. The problem is he never answers his phone. So they're like, call Chris, you know. So I'm getting peer pressure here. So I'm calling Chris on speaker.

I call him. He answers his phone. I go, Lieben, it's Chael. I'm at an after party. You're on speaker. I got about 20 people here. They can all hear you. I've been telling stories, and I'm out.

I need you to tell one. And he's like, you want to tell him a story? Why don't you tell him about the time that my mom hit a deer, loaded it in the back of her hatchback, forgot about it for two weeks, then her and my uncle come over, throw it on the kitchen table, cut it up with chainsaws. I'd been in my room. I'd been punished because I got sent home from school in a detention.

So they make me sample the meat to make sure it's not rancid. And I end up in the hospital for three weeks with E coli why don't you tell him that story he doesn't miss a beat he just rattles this story off he puts this whole party on its head i mean these people nobody left they are in shock including me i'm in shock wait a minute your mother i gotta go chris i gotta. And I just hang up the phone. And because he did that for me, because he told the story to this disaster party that I threw, I've always been grateful and indebted to him. Like, Chris, I owe you one. You know, you saved me. So there's my shout out to Chris Lee.

But how's that for a great story? That's a fucking great story. Oh, it's insane. Holy shit. What a childhood. Wow. Oh, he can go on and on. Chris has some other great stories, you know. Wow. Some guys have a rough man. That's insane. Holy shit. What a childhood. Wow. Oh, he can go on and on. Chris has some other great stories, you know.

Wow. Some guys have it rough, man. That's rough. Wow. That sucks. Yeah. Chris's aunt and uncle greatly raised him. So he goes out on, what do you call it, jet skiing or whatever,

whatever you do on the water skiing. And he's out with his uncle, and his uncle uncle is drinking and they T-bone a boat and his, his aunt, the uncle's wife is back on the shore sunbathing. She doesn't go out with them. They T-bone a boat and they hurt the people. So the people, the wife goes over and they're helping the wife of the other boat is going over. So they get the husband and the wife on the boat and you know, she's not that bad, but she fell over and her boat doesn't run anymore. So the uncles tell him listen listen i've been drinking i don't have insurance but i really will make this up right with you if you just don't call the police so as a matter of fact here's my name here's my number just please call me and let's

settle this so yeah anything just get us to shore you know i gotta get the hospital how my leg looked at they pull up to the shore. The aunt stands up because she sees there's some woman on the boat. She wants to know what the hell is going on. So she gets a little bit closer and she sees this woman is holding Chris's uncle's piece of paper with his name and number on it. She has no idea she's been T-boned. She has no idea they've rescued him, taken him to the hospital and it's her husband's fault. And she sees the number with his name on it says that's my husband bitch and slaps the woman who's on her way to the hospital because she got t-boned by the uncle so this is chris's childhood so you know you like the chris

liebens i could go on and on and on as a matter of fact i bought for a hundred dollars i bought a bunch of chris lieben stories but they back. Yeah, but then he started telling people that these were his stories. It's like, Chris, that's not your story. That's my story. That didn't happen with your uncle. My uncle did this. And I got the idea from a Seinfeld where Kramer bought a bunch of Peterman stories. So I paid Chris and everything.

He took the money, and then he still was trying to claim this stuff happened to him. So it didn't really work out for me. How did you keep this story straight in your head? Well, I just knew because he's got three crazy stories. How many did you buy? I bought them all. I bought the whole gamut. We went to Japan together.

It's a nine-hour flight. And so he told story after story. So I bought it. I said, I'll give you $100 for those stories. But he didn't know how it worked he apparently thought this was some funny deal where he takes my money and goes buys a little sake and sushi for just like no no those are now my story he didn't get the gig he didn't get it so he double crossed me took the money and he took the stories back i got nothing i'd write my own book i'd write my own stories chris lieben stories

would have been better oh that, that's fucking hilarious. I've never heard of anybody buying someone's stories before. Yeah, I paid $100 for it. That was a lot of money, but I only got $1,000 for the fight over there. Holy shit, that's funny. Oh, my God. That is ridiculous. Now, what the fuck was it like going to Brazil?

You went to Brazil recently. You know. After all the shit that you talked about Brazil And Minotauro And the Nogueira brothers Okay now that's funny Thinking that a bus was a horse That's funny you say that Because

Good for you Because sometimes When you're talking about Nogueira People forget there's two Right And there are brothers You know And you need to be specific

You know Are you talking about the big one Or the little one Are you talking about the fat one Or the bald one Are you talking about the one That used to be good Or the one that never was

And it's important That you say that So good for you for saying there's brothers because a lot of people just think it's the same guy filling in but it's actually two what was it like when you went to awesome you want to know what i had a great time did you really britney gotta go uh you know we go out with dana um and we were only there for four hours and you, you know, first off, Rio's beautiful. And I've been to Brazil before. In fact, I was at Abu Dhabi, one that you were at. I don't know if you would have known who I was back then. But when Eddie beat Hoyler, what was it, 2003, I believe, in Sao Paulo.

In fact, I was there. Ryan Parsons was with us. At any rate, I've been to Brazil before. Were you there with Matt Lindland? And I loved it. I saw Matt. Yeah, I wrestled myself. I lost to Kakariko, Mr. Guillotine. remember that guy yeah strong anyhow luther livre speed up the

story so we get there and we've got our own security detail and it's tight i mean these are these are some bad looking dudes and i'm surrounded with tough looking guys all the time this was a whole nother level man these guys got the scars these guys got the bullet holes these guys all the time. This was a whole nother level, man. These guys got the scars. These guys got the bullet holes. These guys got the stitching and the whole bit where you get. Anyway, we're with we got this bad team. Now, I've never been on a helicopter, but I love carnivals. I love rides. So we go everywhere by helicopter, which apparently is extremely common in Brazil. It's like the number one heliport country in the world. So these are good helicopters with pilots. They're very reputable. And next thing I know, we're up in the air.

So this is the ultimate carnival ride. Now, we're there on a gorgeous day in Rio, which is a gorgeous city, and we've got it from a bird's-eye view. I mean, I would take that whole trip, all the risk, all the danger, everything that I had to go through for that 15-minute helicopter ride. I'm a Catholic. I went over this church that's like one of the wonders of the world. It's not quite as, you know, eighth wonder of the world like the pyramids, but it's close where you look at it and go, how in the heck did

you build that hundreds of years ago up on this cliff? There's no roads up to it. You got to walk. It's just incredible. Well, there's a lot of speculation about the history of Brazil that's come into light recently. I think there's some Roman artifacts they found, some really ancient stuff, and there's some dispute about they found some offshore wreckage or something like that. So they're now thinking that maybe the Romans had even visited Brazil even before the Portuguese. Pretty amazing country when you stop and think about the history of it. Beautiful place. I have a feeling when you stop and think about the history, the history of it. Yeah. You know, so place I have a feeling when you ask me, what was it like?

I mean, how are we received? Yeah. Is there any threats? And, you know, the way I like to tell it is that it was it was a scene, man. It was we were we were we were down in the trenches over there. But, you know, the reality, I really liked it there. And it's interesting. Everybody knows who we are there. You know, if I want to be famous in America, Joe, I got to go to a fight. If I go to a fight, I'm a big deal. If I'm not at a fight, I'm not.

I'm just a regular guy, which is just fine. But, I mean, you know, sometimes people lose sight of that. And in Brazil, they all knew who we were. You know, they definitely knew Dana, and they all knew who I was. And I mean all of them, from the bus drivers to the people to the working the desk, to the cops, everybody, the people at the airports. And here's how Dana described it to me. He goes, chill. Everybody watches a playoff game for the NFL in America, right? Everybody watches. I go, yeah, everybody watches it. Playoff. He goes, okay. That everybody is 15 million Americans. He said in Brazil, 80 million Brazilians tuned in when Vandalay, or rather when Anderson and Vitor fought.

So those are the kind of numbers. That's how inundated people are with this sport. And that's prior to us bringing them this new ultimate fighter with Vandalay and Vitor that's airing. So what I'm getting at is this sport's huge over there. And until you're there, you don't realize it. And so at any rate, you know, I'm getting recognized left and right. And that's fun. That's fun for my ego.

I'm having a good time. You know, I'm somebody and they want to talk to me. They want an autograph. They're all very nice. Now, I didn't really have time to exhale and enjoy this because I've got so many death threats that are very legitimate. You know, guys not only tell me they're going to kill me they're telling me how they're telling me when they're telling me the the lake they're going to drag my body into you know i've got this security team because the ufc's been warned you know so i'm on edge constantly and i see some kid is that the kid is that the is this the guy you

know i'm constantly looking around i'm only human this is how my mind's working. So by the time we left, the experience was great looking back. At the time I was there, you're on edge. You're looking around. Who's the guy? Who's the guy? My dad had a real basic rule when you thought you were in trouble. Don't let anybody within arm's reach. If the guy comes within arm's reach, hit him. Don't wait for this first punch crap. If you feel you're in danger and he gets within arm's reach, you strike first and get out of there. Everybody's on you like this. So I'm going against the most basic rule my own father taught me when I'm seven years old,

and that's let people in close when you're scared. So I've got my back up against the wall. You know, I'm following his second rule, but the first one's completely, completely broken. But, you know, we had a good time. Were you, like, the fight was supposed to take place, for people who don't know, the rematch between Chael and for folks who aren't following MMA.

A lot of people that listen to this podcast aren't even MMA fans. After the Anderson Silva fight, you said a bunch of crazy shit about Brazil. You insulted them quite a bit. And then they were going to have the rematch in an 80,000-seat soccer arena in Brazil. But unfortunately, because the UN is having a visit there two days before, there was no hotels. It was logistically almost impossible to bring that many people into an 80,000-seat arena. It wasn't going to happen. So it's been moved to Las Vegas.

Was that good? Were you happy when it was moved to Vegas? You know, if I had to, if I have to answer you yes or no, the answer is yes. But there's also a tremendous no. And the no is simply that I was going to get to be part of history. And the current record is Toronto, St. Pierre versus Shields, 55,000 live. We were going to do 80,000 to 100,000 live. And that would have been very hard to beat. So I could have taken that record for not only currently, but maybe into my future years and pass that story down to generations.

And, you know, again, that's an ego boost. And there's something to be said for that if we're being candid that I'd want. The other side of it is, geez, I don't want to fly 14 hours anywhere while I'm cutting weight. Now, somebody has to. Anderson did it the last time, and we fought in California. So in fairness, I'll go out there. How much does Anderson cut? I don't know.

He probably weighs about 220. I've been next to him, and he looks as big as me. I'm right around 220. He's a little taller, so it's hard to judge. But, you know, look, Anderson lives in California, so he flies two hours to Vegas. I'm in Oregon. It's two hours to Vegas. We both got home fielded, man.

What's the difference in that aspect of it? Yeah, the cutting weight, it's a very strange aspect of MMA, isn't it? It's really almost like an art and a discipline in and of itself. And a battle. You could be a black belt in cutting weight or you could be a white belt. And to compare it to being like martial arts, like you said, it is. Some guys are skilled in it. Some guys are experts.

You got your Mike Dolce's. They got more secrets than you could imagine to get weight off. Yeah. And other guys aren't. Other guys starve because they don't know what else to do. Or they miss weight. We see guys miss weight too. and that's a big deal. When you sign a contract, that's part of it.

You've got to honor that. How much of your thought process would have been dedicated if there was a fight? How much of it would have been just to be worried about your safety constantly, worried about your food being poisoned, worried about someone fucking with you? I mean, what would it have been like to compete under that sort of an environment? If folks who don't know, I've never seen a crowd more nationalistic than Brazil.

It's amazing how patriotic they are. They get it right. That's the way you should be. They get it right. They fucking get it right. You should back your guy. I like that. They do that in England,

but in England they also, when a fighter wins, a guy wins, they applaud his skill, even if a guy beats a hometown guy. You know, I've seen it in London. I've seen them applaud when a fighter beat a local English guy when they were talking afterwards. But, man, that doesn't happen in Brazil.

Mike Pyle won. He beat Ricardo Funch. They were all together chanting some sort of gay slur, some Portuguese gay slur. And I was like, wow. No, I'm aware. You know, that's unfortunate when that happens you know you don't want to behave like a savage or uncivilized i mean we

are in a society here and if you're a fan you buy a ticket you can cheer boo whoever you want but that's where it ends don't touch a guy yeah i won't touch i don't like all the fans i like most of them i don't like them all but i never touch one but the same thing goes for them if you're a fan you don't reach over that rail and slap at a guy and throw your drink on i mean that's what do you think it would have been like though if you had won in brazil in front of 80 000 people it would have been a scene i don't think they could have controlled it they swore that they could they'd have presidential security there they were planning to have the president of brazil there so they'd have their secret services like guys you can't do it you

know there was just a soccer game there was just a soccer game. There was just a soccer game, and 73 people were trampled to death. You know, you can't control crowds when they decide to storm. You just can't. It's displaced responsibility. I'm a sociologist. I've studied this. I've written papers on displaced responsibility. You can't control that, especially when I'm the main event.

And the relevance to that is it means the beer started pouring five hours earlier. So now you're not only talking an insightful crowd, you're talking about a drunk crowd. And what I'm referring to is if I beat Anderson up, I go into Brazil, I stomp their hero, and then I'm going to do an interview with you. And it's not going to stop. And I'm not going to apologize to any one of them. So how they thought they were going to control that, I don't know. What did you think was going to happen? I think it would have been bad.

I think it would have been very, very bad. And I would not have backed off one bit. Why is that? Because I'm not going to change. I'm going to dance with the one that brought me. I'm going to be aggressive. I'm going to be in your face. I'm going to get my mind right, my approach right.

I'm going to do my job as soon as Bruce Buffer gets out of my way. And that's it. And I can't change. I mean, I don't know how to change. This is what I'm programmed to do. And, you know, I hate to talk like one of those maniacs. I'd have given my life, blah, blah, blah. But, Joe, I swear to you, hand to God, I'd have given my life to win that

championship if I had to. Whoa. I mean, let's not forget forget this isn't tough guy talk. I signed the contract to go to Brazil to do the fight. And in my heart, I thought, I don't know how this is going to go. I made my mother promise she wouldn't go. You know, my mother doesn't get it. She's an older woman.

She's got a ruby or a diamond on every finger. You know, you don't go into South America like that level on a fight. It was just one of those deals. But, look, this is what I'm going to do. Wow. That's a crazy stance, man. That's a crazy mindset. I agree.

I don't know that I'm proud of that. I don't mean to sit here and sound like a big tough guy. That's not really what I'm doing. I'm just trying to be candid. But this is what I'm going to do. I've worked my whole life for it, and if this is how it ends, this is how it ends. But I'm going to get that before I go.

You can't really discount the amount of uh a boost the hometown fighter would get from a crowd like that or the amount of shock the uh the opponent would get from 80 000 people booing you and you were ready to jump right into that well that was one of my favorite things you know some guys beg for applause i mean i've seen've seen some fighters. It hurts their feelings. You know, Jon Jones, gosh, he hates if anybody boos. And I'm on the other side of that, man. I just, I like it. I like it. And I love it when they cheer, too.

You know, I'm not the guy that feeds off negativity, but I do feed off of it. You know, if a guy will pay $3.50 for an overpriced drink at the MGM and throw it on me, that's a compliment to me. You know, if I've incited him that much, he's a fan. How often does that happen? It's happened a few times, you know, where they've thrown something. I've actually never had a drink. I had one guy so mad he took his own hat off his head and threw it at me. He missed, but, you know, you get the point.

I kind of felt like I almost wanted to hand it back to him. But, you know, it's one of those deals. But, you know, they get so insightful but you know don't forget the other side of that coin not only are they upset with me but they're cheering their guy you know if you want to back your guy you're a fan man you work hard for that money you took the night off you know you talk dad into bringing you out to the fight be a fit don't touch anybody but be a fan even if that means to boo. So what? That's interesting.

That's a very interesting point of view. I would prefer people not boo because it's kind of cunty, and it's disrespectful for someone who is doing what is essentially the most difficult sport known to man and doing it for your amusement. And just because it doesn't go the way of the fighter that you like, you're going to boo and hiss and say stupid shit. That shows a massive level of immaturity that I don't necessarily think we need in this world. I think it's 2012. These stupid asses need to catch up.

That's what I think. I think that's a fair opinion. When I hear people boo at a good fight, I'm like, that can't be anybody other than a fucking moron. And I hear that. I'll hear that at places. And sometimes I bite my tongue and sometimes i don't but when sometimes people are booing a good fight a good positional battle you know a good they don't understand it so they're booing or it goes to the ground so they're booing it's just uh it's so it's so stupid and disrespectful meanwhile

these same dumb fucks will sit there and watch baseball they'll watch a live baseball game one of the most boring events known to man, something that you could never introduce to another country in 2012. You could never bring baseball today. They'd be like, bitch, that's boring as fuck. Silly, hit the ball with a stick game. You look at football, and people just adored in this country. Again, good for them.

But in a four-and-a-half-hour NFL game, there's seven and a half minutes of action. If you start the time and you turn it on. I can't play along that that's exciting. I don't know that I have ADD, but I do for that. And then you're going to take a break.

And then these big lards, they're all muscled up and they run to their mailbox. They've got to stop at the neighbor's lemonade stand. They're so out of shape. You know, these guys, they play for seven and a half minutes. You know how many times they go to the water bucket? What are you doing, guy? How are you possibly tired?

I've been sitting here doing your show for several hours. I don't need anything to drink. You know, they're drinking down this Gatorade. I don't get it. You know, and some people cheer these guys. It's like, you know, good for you. I know I'm the minority. I'm the one missing out.

My life would be better if I could really get into sports and have something to do on Sunday. Why would it be better? Because I'd have something to do. Go fishing. I used to have to count down UFCs, which were five a year, you know, six a year, and then Pride would do four or five. You know, I would count those days down, literally count them down.

Me and my dad would be talking, Tank Abbott's going to fight this guy. Let's not miss it. We gonna have a party and uh you know so what i'm saying is if i could get in that same passion for other sports i'd have a better life i'd have hobbies i have something to do like my friends that sit up and they watch sports center and somehow they're entertained by that i don't think that's good i think you're better off without it i don't i don't think it's bad to have one or two sports that you're into. There's nothing wrong with that, but I know guys who their whole life is just following other people doing shit.

I hear you. I hear you. That happens a lot. I can't get behind football. I appreciate it. I respect them as athletes. Some incredible athletes in football, but to me, it's just, I don't care what you do with that ball. It doesn't mean anything to me. No, I understand. I was on Jim Rome earlier today, and it's

like, you know, Jim, how many times have you had to sit here and interview a golfer or a tennis player or a NASCAR guy? Could you imagine being a NASCAR? You push your foot down, you make left turns all afternoon long and somehow that's a that's a meaningful event to society. And I'm scratching my head going, you know, I wish that I was one of those guys that enjoyed this but I I don't get you're making left turns all Sunday afternoon it's one of the most damning appraisals of America yeah and I just I don't understand it you know I'm talking to Jim Rome and it's like you know Jim good for you you finally got somebody you know you're welcoming he is very welcome he's an absolute ally to the ufc you know dana white went on a rant one time it was great against espn where he you know dana was mad esp and then he finishes by

going well the only thing good is jim rome you know he did he made sure to give jim that prop because jim deserves it he's one of the those leaders that came out and he embraced uh martial arts and the ufc and to be specific yeah good for him i'm glad he did that. Now I want to tell you this story. Please. Okay. So I wrote this book, The Voice of Reason, which comes out tomorrow.

Let me get myself a chipbook. A VIP pass to enlighten. Thank you very much. VIP pass to enlighten. It hits the bookshelves tomorrow. It's available right now at Amazon.com. This isn't a plug for the book. That was the plug.

I'm done. Okay. I want to tell you a story, and I've only told this story twice in my life, so I don't know if I'm good at telling it. I told this, see, when you write a book these days, you don't actually have to write anything. You talk it all out. It all goes into the, you know, stents of whatever they call it, and then they go back and they type it out for you. So I tell this story, and I know who D.B. Cooper is, okay? I know who D.B. Cooper is. I know who D.B. Cooper is. My whole family knows, and it's been like a family secret for a number of years.

So you know who the guy is. I know who he is. He's alive and well. And a lot of times over the past few years, somebody will be on their deathbed. This just happened about four years ago. A guy's on his deathbed, and he comes out and says, I'm D.B. Cooper. And he tells his whole family, and they go to the media. And the media jumps behind and says, well, it must be true because why else

would you want to go down as a criminal on your deathbed? And I'm sitting there and I told everybody that would listen when they look into these facts that this guy's putting out. I assure you that won't be DB. I told everybody, but I never told them why I never told them how I was so confident. It's my big, big worldwide news. DB CooperB. Cooper case finally saw. And then they unraveled it. And sure enough, it wasn't. But I told everybody that wasn't him. Well, the reason I know it wasn't him is I know who D.B. Cooper is. My whole family knew.

And it was a secret. And my father passed away. So now my oath to keep it a secret has also passed away. I don't feel that I can't reveal the story. He's alive and well. I know exactly who he is. So I tell the story in my book. And, you know, there's a lot of things that happen in the D.B. Cooper case,

and so I need to really make this shorter. I could take up your whole show with this. For folks who don't know who D.B. Cooper is, why don't you explain that? Very famous. He's the world's most famous hijacker, and I believe he's the most famous, one, because he was never caught, but two, he may have been the first hijacker. You know, I want to say this happened like in the 70s. And D.B. Cooper hijacks a plane.

He makes it through security. Security is totally different back then. Gets on board. He's in a cheap disguise. He orders the plane be touched down, says he's got a device, a bomb, a bomb in his bag, shows it to a flight attendant. They touch down. There he is, brings him up. Now,

that's a sketch deposit. Of course, nobody knows what he actually looks like, but that's the sketch deposit, if the viewers can see that. So at any rate, they touch the plane down. They bring him his $200,000 in cash and unmarked bills, and they go back up. Well, while they're up, he parachutes. They don't know he's got a parachute. Now, where the story gets interesting is he was never found, but the money wasn't either. No sign of him was found. His parachute wasn't found. His body wasn't found.

And one of the things that was a problem is where he jumped was a mass forest. I mean, miles upon miles, hundreds and hundreds of thousands of square acres of nothing but forest. So basically, what any expert would say is, look, he didn't make it. If he even made the fall, he would have been eaten by coyotes or bears. There's good reason why we never found his body, and it's not because he made it out of there alive. Okay, now you need a couple of those details. So how do I know him? Well, a family friend, and I put this all in the book. I put all of this in the book, and the publisher didn't use it, and the reason he wouldn't use it is because I won't tell the name I tell the whole story I'm about to do that for you now but I don't reveal the name he goes with had a name I can't use I go wait that's ridiculous I can touch on every single detail you know and I'm telling my publisher

going hey I don't think you know who D.B. Cooper's I think you should I think you should google him you know there's movies made on him prison break just had a character pretending to be D.B. Cooper is. I think you should Google him. There's movies made on him. Prison Break just had a character pretending to be D.B. Cooper. Folklore has been made out of this guy. Well, where this guy jumped was government land, but that land backed up to Indian land, and this gentleman was part Indian, and he grew up in this forest. This is where he spent his summers. Months after months, they would go out and camp in there, you know, in between school breaks. From the time he was a little kid all the way on, he knew right where he was jumping. And if anybody could have made it, it was this guy.

Now, my dad grew up with this guy. He was a family friend. And back then, parachuting, well, much like now, is very uncommon. If somebody does it, you go tell all your friends, I found this parachuting class, and I'm going to do it. They take pictures, and they show it. This guy was taking parachuting lessons. He didn't tell anybody.

And he started taking motorcycle classes. He wasn't telling anybody. He was racing these bikes. That's what my dad personally believes, though he never got the story, that he parachuted, had a hidden motorcycle, and rolled it out. That's my dad's personal theory. So, you know, all this stuff comes down and many years later, the statute of limitations is up. And all of a sudden, this

guy starts collecting a pretty good assortment of toys from shotguns to four wheelers to motorhomes. My dad's known him his whole life. He knows what the guy does for a living. He knows what his wife does. And he, what the heck's going on here? You know, how come, where are you getting all this money? And the guy says, well, you know, I'm an Indian. And when you reach a certain age, you get some Indian money. And there's some truth to that. There is Indian money that's given out if you're a native living in America. But you're talking about like $1,800 a year.

And when you get older, about three grand a year. This guy came into a wide assortment of money. Well, the sketches came out of db cooper and it's a spitting image of the guy that picture that we looked at yeah it's just well there was different ones of him in the disguise with the mustache and the whole bit but it's they're going hey wait a minute this looks just like you so uh you know one night my aunt asks him they're they're they're at dinner they're all family friends my parents are there friends. My parents are there. My aunt and uncle are there. This guy and his wife are there.

My aunt looks across the table and flat out says, are you D.B. Cooper? And he said no. But the way that he said no told everybody there that he was, and they never brought it up again, ever. Now, as it came out and my uncle asked him a little bit in private, hey, well, you know, that other night we were having some Chinese food. Well, my parents and uncles weren't the only one that thought he was. The government did too.

So the FBI had visited this guy, and then he even moved away for a while, went to Arizona, and then slowly came back. But, you know, he was talked to by the FBI. They thought he was D.B. Cooper as well. So when my dad was on his deathbed, he and I had a, you know, you ask me whatever you want, I'll ask you, and I'll tell you how the story really happened. It was a bit of a fun moment between father and son.

Everybody leaves the room and says, hey, what really happened that night when you came in at 2 a.m. smelling like bourbon? What really happened that day the principal called and claimed that you and your friends were. So we kind of go back and forth. And I ask him flat out, is blah, blah, blah, D.B. Cooper? And my dad said, well, all the evidence is saying that he is. Your uncle believes it.

Your aunt believes it. Your mom believes it. I don't think he had the courage. I don't think he was. So my dad's final ruling on his deathbed was no. He said he wasn't. But he's D.B. Cooper. I know. think he was. So my dad's final ruling on his deathbed was no. He said he wasn't. But he's D.B. Cooper. I know who D.B. Cooper is.

Absolutely. There was another theory that D.B. Cooper was a serial killer, that he was a guy who had killed his family, I believe. Let's see if we can find that. What are you looking up? Dead Coopers? Is this some chick who's claiming? How is he looking this up so fast?

It's like you or I have the thought, and he's got it on the screen. How is he doing that? He's got nimble fingers. That's very impressive. But I tell this story, and they don't put it in the book. He goes, listen, I can't put it in the book if you won't say the guy's name. I go, well, it's my father's story, and I can't do it. I can't do it.

It's a pretty goddamn good story. That's one of those rare folklore-type stories. Yeah. It just gets passed on and on. And the guy jumped in washington state you know the jump db cooper high and he jumped and watched the guy lived in oregon that's where he went so you lived in oregon most of your life yeah i'm still there bigfoot yes or no well absolutely yes really yeah but you know the bigfoot makes it sound like you're some

conspiracy theorist i believe they're a sasquatch uh and i believe this because people that i believe and trust including a doctor has said look i know where they are and it's very hard yeah he says it's very hard to get to and he's got this plan he's got this big grand plan he's a survivalist got this whole plan lined up about how we can get to him and his personal belief and you know it's just a theory but he lives in that park because bigfoot's supposed to be from the northwest yes he lives in those hills where all these Bigfoot stories come from. And he's like, look, it's not a Bigfoot like it's some wild monster living out there. I believe there's a pack, a family of Sasquatch that just haven't been discovered.

We haven't photographed and learned about them. I believe there's an entire tribe of these Bigfoot. Wow. Well, how come no bodies, no nothing, no good pictures? All the pictures are bullshit. All the stories have holes in them. tremendously tremendously you ever watch finding bigfoot or yeah i do i'm embarrassed to admit to you that that i think there is a sasquatch you know because i know the kind of people that that well i'm asking because you lived up there and that's where most of us yeah northern california they talk about the bodies

but the truth is what bodies do you ever find? You know, bears are out there, coyotes are out there. Do you ever walk through the forest and find bear carcasses or coyote? You know, you sure don't. And to your point, there's a number of hoaxes. There's a number of guys

dressed up in a stupid outfit that you could buy any Halloween, run through while his buddy records it, and they stick it on the internet. I get that there's hoaxes, but there is some pretty good footage. You know, you said there was none. There's some pretty good footage. You said there was none. There's some very good footage.

As a matter of fact, I've done a lot of work in the movie business and stunts and stuff. And this topic comes up on Hollywood sets. And these are the best guys on earth for designing things to look like humans. And they've said that there is one video where, as he moves, the muscles and the body part move. one video where as he moves the muscles and the body part move and and stunt coordinators and makeup and costume people in hollywood say there is no costume created to do that okay they don't all say that some of them oh you i would love to hear what you say some of them do say that and i think they're idiots and i think if you look at that that's a man in a fucking monkey suit and it's not even a good monkey suit and And the man who did it, this guy

Patterson, look up the Patterson Bigfoot footage. The guy Patterson was a con artist. Not only was he a con artist, he was arrested for writing a bad check to buy the very camera that made that video. Him and another guy conveniently went looking for Bigfoot and found

the video. I would be embarrassed if you break this right in front of me, because I've looked into this, too, because I live in that area. I find it fascinating. I believe it's very possible. You know one of the reasons why I believe it's possible? Because Jane Goodall said it's possible. Yes, this is the exact video. That's a guy in a monkey suit, bro.

That doesn't even look good. That looks stupid. Look at his big, fat, stupid fucking shirt he has on. Big, hairy fucking shirt. And big, stupid looking shoes. That's a terrible monkey suit. and he's just hunched over. See, that looks good to me. Eh, come on, man.

That looks good to me. Back that shit up again. There's other ones, Brian, that have been leveled. See, that's the footage of him falling down. Some people have sent it through computers. There you go. You see a better video of it. No, no, we just saw back then. You just you just had it in the middle. It's a better

No, again. I do want to be clear before I become the conspiracy theorist. Oh, that's what it is I'm sorry the beginning of his zoom. I don't believe there's one monster. I believe that there's a family of animals Yeah, and it's told us by a guy that I try that's best. I look at this somebody ass fucking legs Well, I gotta tell it is not that's so so stupid you're making a pretty darn good case right now pause that shit i'm gonna have to say i i'm starting to rethink but this is pause that shit come on look how dumb that looks it's got tits too what's that they have double d's is that is that what gorillas have get the fuck out of here bitch, bitch. That's fake. That's fake as fuck. I have a good fake meter.

And it just looks at that thing. I look at his big, stupid looking shoes that he's wearing. Those aren't feet. Get out of here. That's a fucking monkey suit. It's not even a good one. They took a video of a guy. The guy just so happened to be out there looking for Sasquatch.

And I fell off my horse. And immediately while I had my camera ready, we saw the Bigfoot just strolling along out of care in the world. Let's make sure in fairness that if we dissect that video and we decide that video's garbage, that doesn't make the whole theory garbage.

I do not believe in Bigfoot. And one of the reasons why is because the area where most Sasquatch sightings are is right at the end of the Bering Strait. And between Alaska and the northwestern coast of the United States, that's where all of the Sasquatch sightings, a huge majority of them, were for a long time. They started spreading out all throughout the country. And who knows how many of them are bullshit. The number is weird. But the American Indians had over 200 different names for Sasquatch.

Or 20. Something with a 2. A bunch of them. And they don't have a lot of mythical animals. This was a real thing that they thought lived amongst people. And it's a real animal that used to actually live if you follow the Bering Strait in Asia it's called Gigantopithecus it was an eight foot tall like primate. A huge Bigfoot it was essentially Bigfoot it is the

exact animal you know. Now I want to tie this school of thought that you know I said yeah I think there's a Sasquatch and then we both agreed on this video we have different opinions of the video however if we prove the video one way in my favor or your it doesn't it doesn't prove the answer to our original thesis which is their Bigfoot and you see this flaw

this pitfall as we like to call it in human thinking when it comes to alien encounter how many times have we seen somebody that says hey guess what I was abducted by aliens and i was given a special power in fact to prove it i'm going to go ahead and make that light turn off by sitting in my chair and not touching it and that will prove to you that i was abducted by aliens and given this power so now i sit here i make that light turn off okay i've got a power

to turn that light off but having that power does not prove that i was given that power by being abducted by aliens. But there's a pitfall in human thinking. And oftentimes if you can get people to believe one thing one way or the other, they can then connect that to a completely isolated and separate incident. Which is what I don't want to happen with the video because I'm realizing right now I'm looking like a real doofus after looking at that video. I'm going to need to get my evidence together and come back. That video was actually, not only was it proven a hoax, but the guy who played Bigfoot wound up confessing. So, yeah.

Or is that the conspiracy? Yeah, it could be. It could be just a guy. Look, anytime there's some sort of a serial killer, people will come out of the woodwork to claim. Like the D.B. Cooper thing, the same thing. People are full of shit. People are crazy. Absolutely. But that just stinks to me. Like the D.B. Cooper thing. The same thing. People are full of shit. People are crazy.

Absolutely. But that just stinks to me. I look at it. It looks stupid. I hear people, experts talk about it. I'm like, bitch, what are you talking about? That doesn't even look remotely real. Sure.

It just looks dumb. And the way it was created is just the odds of this guy finding it. No one else has gotten a good photo of it. But that doesn't mean that it can't be real. If you fly over the Pacific Northwest and you see how dense that part of the world is, I don't think a lot of people really truly understand the amount of acreage of really almost impassable rainforest

you deal with in the Pacific Northwest. When you fly over these areas where these people are talking about sightings, and they don't just have sightings, by the way. They also have real sound effects. These sounds that are some sort of primate that's screaming out. And they've sent these things to experts, you know, people who are trying to detect hoaxes, you know, and these people that have been on camping and hunting trips have recorded these things. And these are primate noises. They don't

know what the fuck it is, but it's a primate noise. And one of the guys that I think is a real credible guy that has had an encounter is Les Stroud, you know, the survivor man? Yep. That guy was staying in Alaska. He was doing one of those survivor things in Alaska. And he said that he was asleep and he was inside his tent or trying to sleep. And in the middle of the night, he heard primate noises. He heard primate noises in the woods near him. And he got out of his bed to try to look. And he heard just something running and crashing through the trees when it heard him. And to this day, he has no idea what the fuck it could be.

He said it couldn't have been a bear. He goes, it was very clear primate type noise. Something along those lines. Something that's just not a bear. And whatever the fuck it was, he said it was very clear primate type noise. They're like, something along those lines. Something that's just not a bear. And whatever the fuck it was, he said it was enormous. It might be possible. There's enough dense forest that there might be just a few animals. I mean, try finding a fox.

Good luck. Go try to find a fox. The other day I was driving in Studio City. I saw a coyote. This motherfucker just wandering around. Go try to find a coyote in the wild. Go look for one. And there's millions of those cunts. Coyotes are everywhere.

To live in the Pacific Northwest, to be a primate, it might be possible. Sure. Well, and then when you talk about the theory of evolution, so you're talking about a Sasquatch, you're talking about a derivative of a human, so you've got to assume that they're a little bit more intelligent than, say, a coyote. If it's hard to find a coyote, it's going to be very hard to find a sasquatch if it's true i mean i'm just fueling the fire again i don't want to come up with the guy i believe it because the guy i happen to trust just says look i think it's true and so i'm choosing to believe him more than i believe

the evidence how many people do you know that have seen one me at zero zero yeah i'm at zero yeah even the guy i trust has never claimed that he's seen one. He just said, look, I've looked at the evidence. I just think they're there. Jane Goodall, she's a monkey expert. She said 100%. Really? 100%, son. So there.

Why are you shaking your head? You don't think so? No. What do you think? No. What's the number you think? I think the whole thing's bullshit. 100% bullshit?

But that comes back to alien encounter. You get people who used to work at the Pentagon and NASA that come out and claim there's aliens. Of course so. And again, it's a flaw in human thinking because the guy works at nasa what nasa's got 3800 desk you don't think a crazy person can get a desk there every now and then the same thing goes for the pentagon i used to work at the pentagon the pentagon's never employed a madman get out of here right okay show me an alien you know show me an alien don't don't give me a a pitfall human things. I actually cover this in my book. It's on page 92 in The Voice of Reason.

I talk about human pitfalls, and it's why we're able to believe such outlandish and crazy things. Do you remember year 2000, Y2K? We all went into a panic. I stayed home with water and canned foods. I stayed in as well. I didn't have my supplies. I should have. I was at college.

I didn't have money for the water or canned foods. But yeah, we all buy into it. And it's this hysteria with no evidence. Yeah. Real loose evidence. 2012, December 21st, end of the Mayan calendar. That's another one, huh? Except recently they found newer versions of the Mayan calendar that they had never discovered before

that were more complete that go far past December 21st, 2012. By how far? 10 more years of money making? Yeah. You know what I mean? Ballin'. You got 10 more years of ballin', son. How you feel about that?

You know, thank you for that line. You finally contributed to today's show besides setting the whole thing up. Nice to see you pipe in over there. You look like an intelligent guy. You just haven't said much today. You think he looks like an intelligent guy. I was really saying, Chael Sonnen,

he knows how to read a man. Right up until that. He's got all these wires, man. I know he's done something today that we couldn't. He's got an odd form of intelligence. It's true. What would you describe it as? What I meant by my encounter is that it was 10 more years for the people that are

behind the whole thing to make more money. Oh, to say, oh, we said 2012, we made 2022. There's what, books? There's fucking products? Well, do you remember that one when we had Pinch back in and he's like convinced that something's happening? It's like anytime you're convinced of anything, I'm like, what? You know it's going to go down?

The economy's falling apart right before our eyes. Can't rebound? Hasn't it been around a long time? Exactly, yeah. Isn't it kind of flexible? it been around a long time? Exactly, yeah. Isn't it kind of flexible? Isn't there a bunch of people like fucking with it right now and trying to put it back together again?

You think they're not going to be able to figure out? Meanwhile, they figured it out in the first place and do you even barely understand it? Because I barely do. I watch the stock market scroll across my screen. It might as well be Mayan hieroglyphs. I don't know what the fuck that means. Do you know what any of that stuff means?

No. Yeah, and yet it ones without us. Yeah. No, the bottom line is relax. It'll'll it'll it'll work itself out yeah things might get tough but how spoiled are we anyway you know i i always hear these debates on education it's like well look when my father went to school that wasn't all that long ago not my great-grand my father just my dad when he went to school in high school if you went for four years you graduated that was it there were not standards set. You must pass this class. You got to have algebra and you got to have geometry. And if you show up for four years,

you get a degree. And, you know, back in the olden day, there was no first grade, second grade, third grade. They all went to school together. Everyone in the neighborhood showed up to the same school and the teacher taught them all. And those are the same people that have now built our bridges and our churches and brought us technology and evolved into Steve Jobs and Apple and Microsoft and Bill Gates and these wonderful things. So apparently the education system doesn't necessarily need this great revamping. I mean, before we even had textbooks and computers, people were learning and people were doing great things in this country. So, you know, we've gotten so spoiled and we've turned weak. You know, we've become feminized and our masculinity is gone in a lot of things, such as having grit and digging deep. And if the economy sucks and you've got to find a better way and you've got to cut back, then that's what you've got to do.

But granted, Barrett, you don't you don't go build a hole in a cave somewhere and wait for the end of the world. Man up. a hole in a cave somewhere and wait for the end of the world man up well one of the issues with you know trying to get by in today's society and bringing your kids into schools is that there's a lot of fucking people out there that have done a real shitty job of raising kids a real shitty job and when you put your kids around them, your kids are in danger. There's liabilities and there's all kinds of bullying and stupid shit that goes on and crime. And if you can't figure out a way to get your kids out of those situations, they never even have a chance to let the system work on them. A big part of what school is is sending your kid to some sort of an awkward fucking prison

that they're stuck at for many hours a day, especially if you lived in any sort of economically compromised situation, any sort of place where there's a lot of poor people, any place where there's a lot of people that are down and out, and there's a lot of fucking shitty parents, and you got to go to school and deal with gangbangers and all kinds of other craziness while just trying to stay alive, trying to stay healthy. Fuck learning. Good luck. Half this country, good fucking luck trying to stay alive, trying to stay healthy. Fuck learning. Good luck. Half this country, good fucking luck trying to learn something in public school. And how much energy are politicians putting on that? How much has anybody changed budgets where they're enhancing school budgets

and paying teachers much more, trying to make it commensurate for what it's worth, make it commensurate, rather, for what it's worth, like a doctor? Having a good teacher is just as important as having a good doctor. You're having someone that develops the way you fucking think about life, not just shows you information that you need to memorize for some stupid fucking test that you're not going to absorb anything out of. They show you how to think. They show you how to live your life. They show you good examples of people who have lived quality lives and they get you to think and pattern your thoughts in a certain direction.

And most kids aren't even getting that today. Most kids are getting a shit fucking experience in public school. That's what the problem is. Sure, people need to man up. Absolutely fucking for sure. But that comes, it also comes with having kids and raising your fucking kids and being a man in the first place, raising your kids properly and correctly. Well, how many people are doing that, man? It's a small percentage. It may be 30%. Let's put a number on it. Let's go crazy and say it's 30%. That means you're dealing with 70% possible fuck ups. And not every kid that comes from a fucked up household becomes an asshole, but goddamn, a lot of them do

How many times did you have to deal with kids in high school and in college even there were just a fucking mess all the time And it was always because of the way they grew up It would always because their brother fucked them over their parents fucked them over Nobody paid attention to them and that poor asshole just gets jutted into the school system and has to fucking figure out his own way To the surface of the water. That's the problem. It is partly because people are weak and sissified in this country, but it's also because the system is run by cunts. The system is run by a bunch of greedy cunts that don't pay attention to the most important resource this country has.

It's children. The most important resource. You want to have a great, powerful country? You've got to have a smaller percentage of losers. And how do you have a smaller percentage of losers and how do you have a smaller smaller percentage of losers well you have to go into the fucking places where there's the most losers economically and help those fucking kids joe you're on fire right now it's true right going i'm a sociologist this is what i got my degree in you're on fire right now you're saying this in a simple matter

but this is actually very deep you know the first time i ever came to one of your comedy shows you know i went through school i went got certified smart i sit in on lectures i've written papers i read every book and get my hands on i left your first comedy show i've never thought more than i than i did at your show and i thought i can never tell him that or he's gonna go you're listening to a high comedian you know i'm gonna look like a fool if i tell him this but i couldn't disagree with you more but you know when you say very simple things like marijuana has never killed anybody and 14 people died last year because coconuts fell on their head. We're not making coconuts illegal.

I can't help but look at that and have to think and rethink my stance. And I'm like, I don't want to agree with Joe. I'm on the right. He's on the left. I don't like this. But why don't I like it? Because he's making a damn good point. And what you just said could be two or three chapters

in any sociological book, and you are right on the money. Well, I mean, I'm not on the right or the left. I'm on the right about a lot of shit. I'm on the right about guns. I'm on the right about punishment. I'm on the right about a lot of things. I'm on the left when it comes to people having fucking freedom. Maybe you're a libertarian.

I'm much more of a libertarian than i am a liberal you know there's a lot of social i believe in a certain amount of social darwinism you know i think but i don't think it should ever apply to children you know i think if you want to be a fucking loser and you want to go out in your life and fuck it up that's one thing but i think a tribe protects its children you know and if we are anything in America, I think we're a tribe. We're a community. We're one gigantic fucking tribe. And if we have any kids that are out there that aren't getting taken care of,

then we're failing. We're failing. So that's our foundation. So it doesn't matter what the fuck we do at the very top of the apex with traveling to the fucking moon and working on the Star Wars program. That doesn't matter if our foundation is full of shit so the very way our society is constructed it's to let you know that the people running it are fools it's like a roadmap to retardation you see it real clearly connect the dots oh you're just a bunch of greedy douchebags this is it real simple again that's

sociology you're not talking psychology you're talking sociology right now if you were the i'm completely with you if you were the president how would you fix all this chill son and how would you fix this world well that's such a deep question i think about that a lot you know i ran i ran for office i know you did all them estatesmen i you know and you know i want to be president of brian stan and he's got the resume he can fucking do it he literally could become the president of the United States. I'd vote for him in a heartbeat. Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, he's got a guy that corners him named John Bartis.

John Bartis helped to get Newt Gingrich elected. He's out of Georgia. Brian's out of Georgia. And that isn't to brag on Newt Gingrich. What I'm saying is Brian has the people around him that know how to do this. I mean, this guy's an All-American from the Naval Academy. He's a war hero. He's a sports hero.

And he's as squeaky clean as they come. Oh, yeah. And he's intelligent, articulate, thoughtful. People love him. Great guy. When I make that comment of he could be president, people don't understand. No, no, no. He really could be the president.

And he should run. And I like to throw these plugs out there so that the right amount of people will push him. That's how we got George Washington. It's not a job he wanted to do. People came to him and he was finally willing to do it so anyway i have no idea what we're even talking oh what would i do if i were the president you know you'd elect brian stan yeah i would yeah i i would definitely bring brian stan into a cabinet role he you know he would be somebody that you would listen to a true leader of men but uh you

know look there's so many things that need to be done but the first thing that i would do is rampage as a vice president you know what i imagine i would quit lying and and every politician in the country from the state level to the federal level have all in the last four years which is two cycles if you're in the house have all ran on the same thing every one of them unanimously in the country all 50 states jobs in the economy. They got to quit. No politician has ever created a job, ever, unless it's a state job. And don't bring up state jobs where you're taken from doers and given to non-doers, okay, where you're taking tax dollars from hard workers and giving it to people that are, you know, in a state job. And I'm not saying those aren't important, but don't count that as creating a job. Look you're a lawmaker joe you can do two things and two things only tax and regulate and neither taxation nor regulation is good for

job growth and they need to come clean and just say that so you think state jobs are bad for job growth because they're they didn't come about organically yeah i just don't think you can count it you know when you're talking about creating jobs what you've done is grow the size of government so now we've got more big brother we have more regulation more people looking what's an example I don't think you can count it. You know, when you're talking about creating jobs, what you've done is grow the size of government. So now we've got more Big Brother. We have more regulation, more people looking. What's an example of like a bullshit state job that they can create? I don't think.

Well, okay, let's look at the Department of Education. Let's look at the Department of Health. You know, what are these guys doing? You can't get two nutritionalists to agree. You know, you can't get them to agree. There's so much done on nutrition. You know, there's books written on blood type. Some people need more saturated fats.

They love to do this whole thing about saturated fats. They're doing it right here in California. You can't give out a Happy Meal. If it's over 500 calories, it can't include a toy. They're coming down on McDonald's as opposed to telling parents, hey, take responsibility and regulation. Now, what if your kid's an athlete? What if your kid's wrestling like I had to do as a kid?

I need calories, and I also happen to need fat. So don't come out and tell me that it's not important. I should be able to have two Big Macs. And if it comes with a toy and it helps me to pull through your drive-thru as opposed to your competitors, that's called capitalism. And for the government to get involved is beyond inappropriate. You know, you brought up Barry Bonds earlier and Mark McGuire, and I don't care what those guys did either because i don't follow baseball but what i do care about is that government

got involved they had a congressional hearing for congress to get involved with sport is beyond inappropriate and those guys you know that's what they should have said and if i was a congressman up there and my fellow congressman it it's my turn to spock. I'm going to say shame on you and shame on you to the fellow congressman. I'm going to say get out there and do something relevant. And if people want to quit going to the ballgame, capitalism will fix that sport and nothing else. The market will dictate where that silly sport is. And it's a self-regulating sport, too.

They choose to agree on what is in the contract there's a reason why the nba doesn't test for marijuana because everybody would be tested positive those dudes are blazed to the gills yeah so it's not like well we're gonna eliminate all illegal aspects of any basketball game no they have shit they agree on and shit they don't agree on and they put things in contracts just to make sure that they can you know they can they they each side enforces their point but it's it's a lot of it is ridiculous completely ridiculous and congressional here congress you're gonna sit down with the people that are involved at the highest level of our government and you're gonna debate the hit the ball with the stick game sure oh the guy's too good at it he's taking some extra chemicals and it makes him really good

to hit the ball with the stick game. And those little kids that are watching at home are going to be real disappointed, man, to find out that that guy took some extra stuff that makes him better at the hit the ball with the stick game. Right. The fuck, man. No, I think it's shameful. I think it's shameful that Congress got involved in that. And I think, you know, to call a congressional hearing, they call it a number of ridiculous things. They call it on the poor guy from BP because they got an oil leak out in the ocean.

Now, that's horrible, and I don't want to see the ocean get a leak, but I assure you BP, who's making money, doesn't want to see a leak either. Yeah. They want to see that taken care of. They want to get that cleaned up. They want their shareholders happy. Well, it actually turned out in the BP case that they had actually cut corners to save money and made a shoddy product.

That was a real fucking disaster. That's a different situation. That's a company that was, you know, they're responsible for that. They fucked up. They didn't build the, there's two different ways to build that valve, and they didn't build it. They took a shortcut to make it happen quicker. And they'd been warned about that too. That was a fucking tremendous disaster.

We had members of Congress going on shows and telling pundits, hey, listen, we need to get the military out there. Now, of course, they don't say what the military's going to do.

What's the military going to do? They're going to shoot it? Shoot the oil. They're going to shoot at the oil? I mean, what are they possibly Well, they were talking about dropping a nuke. This was the answer

by Congress. Somebody was talking about dropping a nuke and closing on, that's how they're going to close off the oil while dropping a nuke on it. It's ridiculous.

Could you imagine what that would look like? the british guy and just dolphins and whales flying into the fucking sky right have you ever seen the video the photograph of that uh the bomb that they blew off in the ocean brian pull that that picture up it's nuclear test ocean pacific something It was incredible. I don't know what year this was. It was a long time ago. But the actual explosion from this nuclear bomb that they dropped in the ocean, the water was so much bigger than they thought it was going to be. They set all these battleships around it like they were going to monitor this thing

and see what the impact was. The battleships just got fucked. They got flown sideways. It's like miles high water straight up into the air. It's incredible. Now, while we're waiting for the video, I'm going to play the one-up game. And I don't one-up you. I'm going to come in second here, but I want to relate.

I had a friend that had to do two years in a military prison because when he was in Iraq during the War of 92, way back, but he was in my neighborhood, he shot a camel with a law and a law is a rocket launcher so they're out in the desert they got nothing to do a camel goes by and he shoots this thing so you're talking about wanting to see a picture I don't like that the camel had to give his life and you know

as the rumor goes they're quite coveted over there I don't say this to be disingenuous or denigrating but I'm told you can even marry one over there whether that's true or not, I don't know. It's that serious. He shot it with a rocket launcher. I don't want that poor camel to have to die, but I do want to see

that. If there was a video or a footage and my buddy had to do it, the guy in my neighborhood has to go to military prison for two years, I at least need to see what happens when a rocket meets a camel in the desert. Why did they put him away for so long? Two years is a long ass time. Extremely disrespectful. I mean, you're really talking about offending people in that part in the desert. Why'd they put him away for so long? Two years is a long ass time. Extremely disrespectful. I mean, you're really talking about offending people

in that part of the world. See, we don't understand that. I don't get it either. I was a camel. I watched one of those Anthony Bourdain shows, those reservation shows where they cooked a camel. Anthony Bourdain style. They killed a camel and cooked it.

Yeah, they slow cooked it underground. It's like, whoa, you're eating a camel? I didn't even know they ate camels. I guess when you're stuck out there and there's nothing but camels, you've got to make do. But it was like a special dish that they would only have at certain times. I was in trouble because I talked about the people on the streets of Manus in Brazil eating monkey.

Well, it's true. They do. And it's like, listen, now, before you think I'm making fun of you, you might want to know we put in hot dogs right here at Yankee Stadium here in America. We eat some pretty weird stuff, stuff too but it happens to be a true story that they do eat monkey in brazil but the point that i'm getting at is they eat weird stuff around the world man right and i think i i personally like it when i travel i like to try some of that weird i don't want to eat snails i eat pig intestines and turkey but i didn't know that's what i was eating

i think the mere word intestine is disgusting and I was pretty upset when I found out I did. You never had snail? Like escargot? Yeah, I've had escargot on a cruise ship as a kid. Delicious. My dad tricked me. I don't like it. I do like caviar.

Now that I've gotten older, I didn't like it as a kid. But when the Russians come over for a wrestling or a duel meet, or even the Russian fighters, they all bring caviar that you can trade with them. Trade means you give me money, I give you caviar. Is it worth a lot of money, their caviar? Russian caviar is the most famous kind of caviar. It's kind of like a Cuban cigar. If you can get a hold of Russian caviar, especially back

with the USSR before the breakup of the Soviet Union, it was almost impossible to get Russian caviar. That's one of those weird things. So we deemed it to be a little better than it actually is, but it is coveted. If you can get it and it says Rush on the label, you'll be the hit of your neighborhood party.

Yeah, like you said, like Cuban cigars. I've always thought it was weird that it's an acquired taste. It's so expensive and it's an acquired taste. Why would you want to acquire a taste for something that's really expensive that you initially don't like? Sure. It tastes like salt. I happen to like it because now they've eased us into it because they roll all of our local

sushi rolls in a type of caviar, real cheap, that yellowy stuff. But, you know, I've learned to like it as I've gotten older. There you go, ladies and gentlemen. I really like to just tell people that I have caviar. Great American, loves caviar, Russian caviar. Anything else? I'm going to wrap this bitch up, bring it home. I had a great time.

I got to tell you, I had a really good time. I learned some things about you today. You're not just that pothead comedian I thought you were. You got Second Amendment and some deep thoughts. And, you know, whether you know it or not, you're a sociologist. Listen to some of your arguments today, whether you've been certified in it, like I went to school or not. You're a sociologist, and I admire that.

Well, I'm just a stand-up comedian. I think as a stand-up comedian you have to understand human beings to understand yourself in order to move forward to advance to evolve you got to understand human beings you got to understand yourself you know it's just uh my observations are just a part of life cool just like yours just like your book vip past enlightenment what's the first part of it voice of reason voice of reason which you can get right now on amazon you could just go if you have of reason voice of reason which you can get right now on Amazon you could just go if you have a Kindle and get it you should get a Kindle because they're fucking awesome They are great. Sorry about my mom's my mother's Day present. I just got her a candle. No just a book

Yes, and now I could just send her books now. Yeah, that's cool Yeah, oh that is a great service and it's amazing. It's a the fucking battery lasts forever I have a Kindle the battery lasts forever it looks great it looks like printed word you can even like make the the print larger or smaller like me i'm going blind so i have to make the print larger so it's amazing it's an amazing product i have an ipad and i'll watch books on that too i like the effect more the scrolling but it's better on the eyes the kindle i think the kindle's a superior device it's the shit book guy myself i like audio i love audios if they're read well but every now and then like i i bought a couple stephen king books that were written or read by stephen king those are fucking terrible yeah roger ebert

roger ebert's new book is not he shouldn't have done it himself roger ebert he's kidding that's a bad joke the guy's got no jaw. Right. I know who he is. Don't do that, dude. That's some bad karma coming your way. That's like that show that takes you out JFK. I was at the Tom Likas show. Tom Likas. And they... Come on.

Yeah. How rude. How rude. Anyway, that's the end of this show, ladies and gentlemen. If you want to follow Chael on Twitter, it's SunnenCH. How did you get that one? Why not just Chael Sunnen? I didn't know much about Twitter when I set it up.

I bet they could change it. Yeah, and I wish it was Chael. Somebody else told me at a marketing meeting. Tell the UFC to go after that. No, somebody's got it. Unless it's an actual Chael Sonnen, which I doubt. How many Chael Sonnens have you ever met in life? I've met a few Joe Rogans.

No Chael Sonnens. It's an unusual. You can get that shit on Twitter. That's SonnenCH. Yeah, and you say Tell the UFC What does the UFC have a department Who do I call The Twitter department

And say go after that Call Donna I'll call Donna Joe said Go after that The Twitter department I bet someone I bet whoever has the Chael Sonnen

He would probably be happy To give it to you Hey douchebag You squatter Stop hiding And holding on to Chael Sonnen's thing Just give him the password Well I take it from When I could just stare at him

I was going to say the same thing Actually it wouldn't work that way Because you want to get all your followers And bring them over there How many followers you got? I got 152,193 Not that I keep track or anything You can't not have that

So you got to have to figure out a way To get Twitter to merge the two They did with me I had a different Twitter name And they merged it and made it Joe Rogan. Oh, excellent. Yeah. I think I bought it. Yeah, you did.

Did I buy it? No. I bought MySpace. Oh, that's right. I bought my phone. What a waste. My crony Nick over at Tapout is friends with the creator of Twitter, so maybe we can put him on it.

Maybe we can have him go after it. Let's make it happen. All right. So it's Sun and CH for now on Twitter. And thank you to everybody that tunes in. Of course, thank you to the Fleshlight, our sponsor. Go to JoeRogan.net. Click on the link for the Fleshlight.

Enter in the code name Rogan and you will save yourself 15%. There you go, Skipper. Ha! We're also brought to you by Onnit.com, makers of Alpha Brain, New Mood, Shroom Tech Sport, and Shroom Tech Immune. For all information on all of those products, go to Onnit.com.

That's O-N-N-I-T. Use the code name Rogan and save yourself 10%. Tomorrow, we're going to be here with Michael Rupert. That's right, Michael Rupert, former L.A. narcotics officer who busted the CIA selling drugs in the hood. That's D-A-H-O-O-D. And he'll be back to spread more what, Brian?

Fox magic. Fox magic. That's right. We'll see you guys tomorrow. Chael Sonnen, you're the fucking man. And good luck to you, sir, in your rematch for your title, right?

Is it your title? It is my title. Undefeated and undisputed. That's it, folks. Boom.