The Joe Rogan Experience - #2327 - AJ Gentile

Episode Date: May 27, 2025

AJ Gentile is the creator and host of "The Why Files."www.thewhyfiles.com Visit www.squarespace.com/ROGAN to save 10% off your first purchase of a website. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The Joe Rogan Experience. Trained by day, Joe Rogan podcast by night, all day. We're doing this? Yes. I'm glad you brought. You did not have to do that. I appreciate it. I fucking love your channel, dude.

I've spent countless hours watching your hilarious videos. So cool that you've even found it. Well you know Gino told me about it a lot. Your brother Gino who I've been friends with for years told me about it a long time ago that you guys were doing this and I was like really? Alright. Interesting. And then I watched him like this is fucking great. It's right up my alley You would show clips all the time and it would drive Gino nuts And then finally it it got named Reggie Watts was here He's like you ever hear of the wife else you guys are talking about moon landing shit, and you're like what's that and? I don't know a week or two later Gina gets a text. Are you the wife files?

He didn't tell me the name of it. He was so yeah it's a great show dude it's like everything I'm fascinated by Anunnaki, Aliens, Secret Bases, how did you get involved with making a show like this is this something you've always been interested in all what I mean like grew up Art Bell yes dad is there he is. There he is. I mean the goat. The goat. Dad was an overnight cop so always overnight radio and so it was always Dr. Demento. Yes. You remember him? And Art Bell. So I kind of grew up with the weird stories and it just got in the Twilight Zone. We watched as kids. It was like required watching from dad in the old black and whites, the classics.

So that was always in there. So I'll skip 20 years. We had a podcasting studio in LA on Sunset. We were doing pretty well. Hosting a lot of shows, guys you knew, like when COVID hit, Kill Tony came and worked out of our studio, Jeremiah, Metzger, all the guys.

Didn't make any money, but it was a cool setup. But then they locked down the city impossibly. And we didn't really know what to do. Then they set fire to the city somehow. And the wife and I are racing down Hollywood Boulevard being chased by people with bats and boxes of Adidas. And we were like, this is too much. And we just started packing.

That's it, we got out. And I didn't know what to do. So I'd been working in showbiz, not super successfully like on the cusp, but I'd been a professional host, editor, producer, writer for TV. So I was like, YouTube, easy, I'm a natural. So I started the channel talking about science

and weird stuff, and it was the hardest thing I ever did. It was like impossible to do. I started out like following all the consultants. High energy, smash the like, be a youtuber, top 10 list. And I did that for a little while. It's like no one's watching, this feels stupid. And then I just I said fuck it, let me just talk about the shit I wanna talk about. So I think the first like good one was Operation High Jump. You know, Admiral Byrd goes down to Antarctica with an armed fleet, supposedly looking for Nazi UFOs,

and it's a six month mission, and in like a few days they have to turn back and it's crazy stuff. So I did that story and it got a, I think I got 50,000 views on this. I don't think I saw that one. It's an old one. What happened in Operation High Jump? All right, Admiral Byrd goes down, this is just after the war.

Remember the Nazis were fleeing to South America, so mostly Argentina. So the Nazis had established or tried to establish a base in Antarctica, that's true. It's New Schwabenland. Now, people say they were trying to build a Nazi base and all that stuff. They were really just looking for a whaling station to get oil. So Hitler didn't want to rely on outside sources. So anyway, after the war, they go down there. We still don't really know specifically why.

It was supposed to be just to see how our aircraft would operate in cold weather. That was what they said. But this was a fleet that was armed to the teeth. Like super, like armed. The first helicopters were the destroyers. So they go down there. It's supposed to be a multi-month mission, maybe six months. They get down there and in like a matter of weeks, maybe even

fewer, they just bail. And no one really knows why. There's a press contingent there. No one knows what's going on. And Admiral Byrd starts giving these weird interviews. And the first one was in Spanish. It might have been either Argentinian or Brazilian newspaper. And he talks about how there could be these craft that attack the United States from the poles and craft that can fly pole to pole and people were like what is what's that and just sparked this crazy stuff and you can hear him talking about these things so high jump goes down there to look for stuff we don't really know why they left Admiral Byrd was talking about

these crafts Admiral Richard E Byrd his famous guy flew the North Pole like a super badass He was on paper the the commanding officer, but he preferred to just fly his plane and do stuff So the legend is they get down there Admiral Byrd takes his plane Starts flying across Antarctica and sees patches of green. He doesn't, can't believe it. And he's on the radio saying, I'm seeing this, rolling hills, sun is shining, he keeps flying, it gets greener and greener and then he's like, I just saw woolly mammoths. Woolly mammoths grazing in the green and he keeps going and he's on the radio and then he's talking, I'm seeing

all this stuff, the sun is bright and then radio contact goes out. He's flying and flying, suddenly he's engulfed in light and he doesn't know where he is. The green is behind him, he's just flying in light, just trying to get his bearings and then up beside him, two flying saucers just kind of next to him. Almost like the F-16's trying to wave you down, two flying saucers.

And he looks over and they have swastikas on him. And he's like, oh, oh, so he's on the stick and he feels the stick shaking and then the stick just goes dead. And then he goes down with the UFOs and they just land into a cavern in the hollow earth. Right, so that's how that happens. And they take Admiral Byrd out and they're tall aliens. With swastikas on their crafts. On the crafts. Like the ancient symbol. I don't know, it would be reversed, right? Well, I think there was a bunch of different versions. I think the Nazi one it was like kind of tilted. Yes. But there was a bunch of the Hindu ones and a lot of the Japanese ones for thousands of years

yeah a positive symbol of life and we don't know how they were oriented because I debunked all this I'm telling you the legend right because that's kind of my format right right I get it I get you excited we should explain that to people you get everybody all jazzed up and at the end you kind of I get you excited. Which you explain that to people. You get everybody all jazzed up and then at the end you kind of... I get so much heat for it. Yeah, it's fun. And I watch the numbers. As soon as I say, but is it true?

Everyone's done. Nobody wants to know the truth. Nobody wants to know. They want to know fun. And then I get the hate mail. You ruined it for me. So what is the truth? The truth is a lot of that comes from Admiral Byrd's diary, which was discovered years later, which was not his diary.

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh uh, right. Horsetail. And he flew the North Pole, not the South Pole. But here's the interesting thing. He was in a single man aircraft that only had so much fuel. He was, which can only fly for a little bit. He was out of radio contact for three hours, nobody knows where he went.

What was his take on it? We don't really know. That's it? That's kind of- So it's just he went radio silent for three hours, then the legend grew. It's like he did that interview as soon as they got back, and then something must have happened because he got real quiet.

But he would go on TV and he would talk, but the poll to poll thing was he was just warning that the polls are a vulnerable space like we need to keep an eye on the North Pole because if there's a base on North or South Pole you can attack from there so let's keep an eye on that was kind of his point mmm the the Antarctica situation is very strange because I don't know if you ever saw the Sean Ryan show where he talked to this guy that worked with the neutrino Detector down there and he was yeah, have you seen that?

I haven't seen Sean do it, but I know the guy and the guy was saying that it's not just a neutrino detector it's a direct energy weapon that can cause earthquakes and This is like the DEWs US has always been fascinated with the direct energy weapons. Right. That's where that like the harp conspirs. The US has always been fascinated with the... The Directorate of the US. Right. That's where the like the HARP conspiracies come from and all of that. And if you don't know what HARP is, that's the High Altitude Rural Research Project. This array of intent is in Alaska. That's built by the US government to study the ionosphere. But for some reason, it costs hundreds of

millions of dollars. And when you look at it you're like where the money go. It's like a building's a box and there's a bunch of antennas. Where I'm getting at is this is an array that can ionize parts of the atmosphere. So I did an episode on project Blue Beam, which is a conspiracy about how the United Nations or the shadow government will create these holograms in the sky and that will force one more government. We can get into it if you want to. Yeah. But I kind of debunk it saying holograms need a substrate, you know, you need clouds, glass is really what you need. But then the technology has gotten to the

point where you can ionize atmosphere and create things in the atmosphere. So something like HAARP conceivably could create something up there. Something visual. Something visual. And I've heard people say that you know the UAPs, UFOs may not be real they could just be holograms for some reason. I heard that too. Yeah. Or a combination of many different things. Yes. I think it's probably a lot of different factors that people are seeing. You know I was watching a video the other day I'm not sure if it's real but I put it on my Instagram anyway on

my story because it was just fun of ball lightning which is real but this ball lightning was moving around a parking lot and it was extraordinary. Is this one? Oh yes. The plasma lasers that the Navy apparently has the ability to make stuff like this. 3D images in the air. Yeah. They can also make them make sounds somehow too. Yes. Which is interesting. Well because you're just vibrating air molecules. So in Project Blue Beam, the energy comes from a satellite array. So can satellites do that yet? If it can, they won't tell us. But that could be a way where you could throw off the enemy or freak people out and pretend

that there's some sort of an alien invasion. It's really just a hologram. Really just a hologram. Really just a hologram. And that's, you know, that's Blue Beam is supposed to get rid of religion because what will happen according to the legend is the holograms will manifest as whatever deity is dominant in the area, whether it's Jesus or Buddha, whomever.

And atheists will see different things and people will just freak out. Nationalism will go away atheist will see different things like why because according to the legend the the array with the technology wouldn't will manipulate your mind again Harp has been accused of this because you can manipulate someone's mind with electromagnetic frequencies at the right frequencies so they could just tell you to see something.

So like that specific? That specific. Allegedly. Now I debunk a lot of it because the story originally came from a Canadian journalist named Serge Manasse, fascinating figure. He comes out with this theory that's bonkers, and then the Canadian government takes his kids away because they're homeschooled. He gets harassed by authorities.

He gets hauled off to jail for spreading disinformation, dies of a heart attack the next day. So then of course, that's just like, that lights the fuse. And I was like, what did he find? So, and he talked very publicly about all of this. So that's supposedly how it happens is they manipulate our minds, they show us what we want to see. And then it's not like we

won't resist authority. We'll beg for it. We'll just beg to take take our freedom, take our rights, keep us safe. Whoa, because something huge is happening and we need to consolidate. I feel like that's what would happen. Well, I'm sure you've seen the Howe put off thing. Did you see when Howe put off George Bush during his presidency they floated the idea of disclosure. Did you ever see this? I didn't see it but I know how it's worked very well. So what Howe said

was he and several other scientists were brought aboard and they were given a task of writing pros and cons to disclosure. What are the things that are going to be disrupted and what are the things that's going to benefit society and attaching numerical value to each thing? And all the scientists at the end of the day showed that the numerical value for con was far higher. Like, it was going to cause much more disruption than it would be beneficial.

And so they decided not to disclose. But what they were telling how was this was what you were planning for was retrieved crafts, not of this world, and biological entities that the United States government is in possession of. Should we disclose this? Right. I think I've definitely heard that. I don't know if is that connected to the Brookings report if I'm getting that correct? Which one's that? I forget when it would even come out. Here's all the CYA's. I'm an expert on nothing. I don't know anything. I tell stories. Me too. Okay. How can you talk about planet serpa if you've never been? Just I just like this Is all due respect that's gonna go on forever forever. You've never been never been

I hope he's okay. Douglas Murray's a lot of fun. Oh, he's great. Um Yeah, so I'm not an expert anything so I don't know when Brookings was but it was the same thing It was a recommendation from the government that looked... 1960. Ah, same thing? Well, I don't know about the exact same thing, but uh... same kind of thing? Proposed studies of the implications of peaceful space activities for human affairs, commissioned by NASA and created by the Brookings Institute, collaboration, long range study. Same result. Don't do it. Yeah, I think they're probably right, but also I wanna know. Well, that's, that's put, puts us in a pickle, I think,

is let's say it's real. I wanna know too, but I don't want the Chinese to know. And I don't, I definitely don't want Iran to know. So I understand. Why do you not want them to know? Maybe we could all get along along if we realize that there's actual aliens that are visiting us. I mean, wasn't that the Ronald Reagan speech in front of the UN? You've seen that, right?

Sure. Yeah, the famous speech. But wasn't the SDI part of that speech is we'll all get along, but we're going to have laser weapons in space just in case we don't? Wasn't that that same speech? It might not have been, but it was about that same time. And that was all smoke and mirrors. Right, the Star Wars thing was fake, right? Couldn't get it to work. It was all fake. So maybe we'll all get along. Boy, that sounds

nice. But you know, Iran produces brilliant people, so intelligent, great engineers, doctors, all of that. But the government is bananas. Yeah. So, I mean, you don't want to have brilliant scientists working like that. I mean, we had brilliant scientists working for dictators in the past and it was not awesome. Right. Like the Nazis. That's who I mean. Yeah. That's who I mean.

So... Yeah, it's really sketchy if they get the technology. Right. Well, this is what Hal Puthoff said. He said that the government of the United States has at least 10 of these things and I said well other governments have them? He said yes and I said well do they have similar numbers? He's like we believe so. So they don't know. So essentially what he was

kind of alluding to is that there's basically like a kind of Manhattan project to try to back engineer these things and whoever figures it out first is going to have a massive advantage. Right. And it would be nice if it was us. It would be nice. Hal Putoff has been connected to a lot of disinformation campaigns. I love the guy and his work but he has been connected to disinformation campaigns with known disinformation. Think about what subjects. subjects about disclosure like you heard the name Richard Doty. Yes, okay, so I mean Yeah, let's have some coffee I'm off booze right now

For forever no not for cheers. I just needed a break It was becoming a little bit me too like a habit you too. Yeah,'ve been off for two and a half months. Maybe even a little more now Yeah, I just for I just decided one day. I'm done And then I feel great feel better. Oh my god think clearer wake up feeling better I have a nightclub some I'm a nightclub my comedy club all the time And you know everybody's buying shots and you don't beer you want this after a while you're like god I feel like shit yeah you do you know but I'm at it's like the illusion is that you won't have fun I'm having the same amount of fun it's so much fun of course I guess I

get I'm funnier because I know what I'm talking about yes and I'm not embarrassed the next day you just it just doesn't kill your inhibitions, but that's It's overrated. It is it's fun. I've had a good time boozing, but yeah enough I'm allowed to go back at the first of the month Yeah, I just needed you need to quit vices once in a while if anything just to should prove that you can yes Yeah, it's a good thing just to prove. Mm-hmm. That's doesn't have his hooks in you right yeah, I can quit whenever I want it's I know but can you I've taken a few? Days off of social media, and I always feel better, but I always go right back in I don't know Why I hardly ever look at it It's just a massive distraction like I don't read anything about myself

But I'm always but more so I'm always at, but I find a lot of interesting things too, especially on Instagram, but more so now than ever, my screen time on my phone is dedicated to YouTube. It's like when I come home, especially at the end of the night, come back from the club, I'm tired. I want nonsense. I want Bigfoot. Same. I don't want to think too hard.

I want, you know, I hard What you know I want you know Bob Lazar I want Bigfoot Yeah, I want you know ancient civilizations. It's just me and the dog watching TV. Yeah, you know everyone's asleep That's that's my favorite because no booze for me doesn't mean no gummies So I have a gummy in a Bigfoot episode, I'm having a great time. That's the one that I wish was real, but I'm 99% Jura Torshid. But I also wonder, I wonder like, I wonder if under certain conditions it's real. Like this is my thought. This is gonna sound squirrely I think under heightened states of anxiety and fear when you're alone in the woods

Maybe it's possible that The barrier between dimensions is slippery and you can see things that you would ordinarily never see Like it might not even be as simple as this is a biological creature that lives here on earth with us, but no one's ever found a body. It might be weirder than that. It might be these are some sort of hominid from somewhere else that can can appear. This episode is brought to you by Squarespace. Our great site, joerogen.com, was built using Squarespace. Our great site joerogen.com was built using Squarespace. But did you know that Squarespace also gives you everything you need to offer services and get paid all in one place? Whether you're doing stuff like using the built-in appointment scheduling

for consultations or even email marketing tools to pull off events, Squarespace has all that plus invoicing and online payment tools that make conducting your business a breeze. Try it free at Squarespace.com and use Squarespace.com slash Rogan to save 10% on your first purchase. Native American legends say exactly that, that it's this creature that lives between worlds. And the same with giants as well, they have the legends of the red-haired Giants that were chased West and glad we're getting to that Getting just yeah because the Giants thing is weird when you go into the store, and I watched your episode on Giants I loved it. Maybe it was this

Sonia oh that was yeah, that was GE Kincaid and Smithsonian cover. Oh, yeah, Grand Canyon. That's a good story Well the whole Grand Canyon thing is bananas. Like there's areas of the Grand Canyon you cannot explore. You cannot go. You cannot fly over. Right. And you can't fly under the rim. Yet when you go to those bad places suddenly while white plane flies over under the rim black helicopters show up. I showed on my episode. I showed the black helicopters showing up. Like they do show. Yeah. I show the black helicopters showing up. Like, they do show. Yeah. Like, they are protecting something.

Something. It's not as simple as this is a dangerous area, because you can go to any dangerous area. You go to just to the normal tourist area, it's like, be careful. People fall, two people a year fall. Yeah, someone fell recently. Did it?

Yeah, an influencer. Of course, taking a selfie. But the Grand Canyon, there's been these crazy stories of people finding these Egyptian, these caverns with Egyptian artwork and hieroglyphics and these stories of artifacts that have been removed from there.

So the story is, it shows up, I believe, in like the Phoenix Gazette, it's 1903 or so, and the explorer is G.E. Kincaid, and he's going down, he's looking for gold deposits or whatever. This is just before Teddy Roosevelt made the Grand Canyon a preserve. He was a naturalist. So he finds these steps that are clearly man-made, he follows the steps up in there's a cave and he goes in there and he describes hieroglyphics that look Egyptian but are not quite. He finds a statue that he describes as like Buddha-like. Not Egyptian, not human, but sort of like Buddha and all these

weapons, shields, gold, all sorts of stuff. He keeps going. He finds a deserted city in the caves, and all these tunnels and caverns go everywhere, and he's trying to map everything. He comes out, and he goes back to town, and he gathers together a group that we're going to go, we're going to go find the stuff again. And people are excited about it.

And a couple of weeks go by, and everyone's gathered to go on the expedition. He never shows. The expedition goes nowhere, and that's really the last we've heard of it. Really? And is there any photographs or anything? No. There never is of this stuff. Right. Just descriptions? Just a great story. Well the great part of the story is the fact that you actually can't go there. And just the idea that there's an area where the military is protecting people from being foolish, that doesn't make any sense.

Nobody asks why. Right. Like nobody asks why. It really bothers me about that story and all of these, whether it's disclosure or whatever. I don't hear anyone asking why. Well, they won't let us. Well, who's they? Someone's in charge of stuff that's not the president. Right. Or Congress. So who's they? Someone's in charge of stuff that's not the president. Right. Or Congress. So who is it? So, you know, I-

Is it possible there's some sort of a government installation down there somewhere? You know, it's all going to be woo-woo conspiracy stuff, or it's real. Or GE Kincaid found something, and someone got to him. But if GE Kincaid found something, why would they want to hide some ancient civilization discovery, particularly in the early 1900s?

Like, why? For what reason? I don't know why Graham Hancock is marginalized now. Right, but wouldn't you think that there's less of a grip on that stuff in the early 1900s? Yes, I would think so. Yeah. So my guess would be treasure and money. That would be my guess.

Is it shows up in the paper, the government goes down there, like there's a lot of stuff down here. Let's grab it, send it to the Smithsonian, who keeps 99% of the stuff under wraps. They have a billion items that nobody can see. And then that's the end of it. What the fuck? Which I would love to know the official reason see if you can Google Is there an official reason why you're not allowed to go to certain areas of the Grand Canyon? They use a VPN there, brother

the story I was looking at a Article about the original article and it says that the two guys mentioned might not have even existed, right? original article and it says that the two guys mentioned might not have even existed right there's no evidence of them GE Kincaid and another guy named SA Jordan oh so it might be just a story that someone printed some horse shit when I was looking into one of these things before I found something explaining that back in them like early 1900s when newspapers were a really popular thing to read I don't know if it was like a game or if there was actual prizes people would play or like amongst themselves to try to Get fake stories printed

You could get the craziest story printed you win my 500 bucks or I might be wrong But I think Jordan was connected to the Smithsonian He's according to I pulled this from the Smithsonian debunked Which I mean obviously they would if this is the way we're gonna go with it But them debunking this and they gave two links, one to the original 1909 article and one to a 2008 update. And that's where I was pulling that from. I don't trust the Smithsonian. They're exempt from all kinds of stuff.

Yeah. Well, like, there's a law passed not too long ago that if you have Native American artifacts that are important to that culture, especially burial artifacts, they must be returned. Unless you're the Smithsonian, then you can make you can make a case that you don't have to give it back. How do they have so much power? It's a government agency. Smithsonian is a government? Oh, I didn't even know. I thought it was a private agency. So there's no official story as to why this area of the Grand Canyon is off-limits. For your safety.

The forbidden zone they call it. Yeah. It's all I can find. That's fucking weird. That's fucking weird. This story comes from the very area that's forbidden. That's fucking weird. I think-

What are the odds? I don't believe in coincidences, so. A lot of these stories come from places you just can't go. Has anybody tried to hike in? All the time! Or raft in? Yeah, did they get busted? And busted, yeah. And arrested.

Really? You can find online, I wish I knew the names, of a team that went up there. That's who found the black helicopters. And I used them in the video. And I credit them so you can find their videos. They're up there for an hour, hour and a half trying to find stuff and what they found up in that forbidden zone is anchored into the ground a giant hook or like a loop. Like what would you use that for? And that would be to repel down. That's

the only reason that would be there. There's no explanation for what is this. They also found artifacts from that era, from the early 1900s, artifacts that people were there. So it's possible that they repelled that, like they might have been standing right above that entrance. And there are reverse angles of that rock face that look a little weird. It could be pareidolia, but it... What's pareidolia? Pareidolia is the mind's ability to see objects in random noise. You know, it's something we evolved to, you know, to see predators in the forest. That's why if you see a cloud that looks like an Abraham Lincoln...

Right, right. It's not Abraham Lincoln, you know, it's pareidolia. But debunkers will always fall on pareidolia. So so like the real believers they hate that word God that would be imagine Everything would have to be rewritten If they found some evidence of a lost civilization with no connection to any known civilization That was advanced that was living in the Grand Canyon. Did you ever think about going? To the Grand Canyon?

To go and just be an outlaw and go see. How would you get in though? I mean, if they have black helicopters and they're scanning the sky, or scanning the ground with some sort of a drone or a plane... We go in, we live... Are you planning something? No, no, no, hold on, no. What should we do? We go in, we live. Are you planning something? No, no, no, hold on, no. What should we do?

I'm in. I don't have a contract, all right? So this is already dangerous for me sitting here. But I got your back. If I go? Yeah. Because even if they drag you out, questions have to be posed. Right.

Why couldn't I go there? What did he do wrong? Well, he violated this area. Okay, well, how come? Yeah, well, when you think about how dangerous the Grand Canyon is overall, there's not a safe area. It's literally a canyon. You could fall at any of a million spots along the way to your death. Have you been there? Yes.

It's incredible. Incredible. You couldn't paint a better picture, but as you get closer to that edge, you can feel your amygdala going, oh, back up. Yeah. Like it's seriously dangerous. Yeah. Yeah.

God, the problem is I want to believe. Same? With all these things. Yeah, same. Most people enjoy your show. I want to believe. With all these things. Yeah, same. Most people enjoy your show. They want to believe. That's why it's so fun. And I don't believe most of the stuff I talk about. But when I approach a story, I try to find as much evidence as I can to support it, and

I also want to find the other side. So then what we're left with is some truth. And not all stories can be fully debunked. And I've had my mind flipped a couple of times, you know, Crop Circles, Hollow Moon, some really crazy shit have flipped me around. Crop Circles is a weird one. So weird. It's a weird one because when I first saw them, I'm like, what is that? And then I saw that these guys were doing them with boards and string. I was like, oh, it's just people being silly. And then I watched a whole documentary about how the energy that bent these things over caused these nodes to explode as if they'd

been cooked in a microwave. Correct. Like what? And then you find out that the actual stocks are woven together. Correct. It's not that they're pressed down, they're woven together. And that these are complex geometric designs that would have taken people weeks to map out. And there's no footprints leading up to it. There's no roads, no machinery, no evidence of any use of any kind of machinery, and these things appear like that.

Like people have flown over an area and then flown back an hour or two later, and there's immense football field size, perfect geometry that no one can explain how it was created. Correct. So the nodes in the stalks, the node is like a knuckle on your fingers. So those are there for phototropism to bend toward light. So what you're talking about is these things are bent over. They're bent over at right angles. It can only be done with high energy. But also around these crop circles they're finding microscopic metallic spheroids in around the circles. And that's

not conspiracy theory. They're finding them and there there are these magnetic fields around the circles and you can see videos online of people going into these crop circles and their their hands start to get red things are happening to them so I went into crop circles thinking was all guys with boards but then when you watch people with boards make a crop circle, it's a mess. They can't do this. And you cannot bend the nodes of reeds and weave them together in a perfect, you can't do it. So that was, as I'm doing the research, I'm like, all right, 99% of them are fake, but there's this 1% that I cannot explain.

The famous video where you see the orbs circling around the field in England and then the crop circle slowly starts to emerge, has that been debunked? Semi, it's controversial because the guy who released that video, I don't know his name off hand, allegedly went to a visual effects house. Oh boy. And released it. But they somehow put that thing together in a matter of hours, which is suspicious. So in my episode on it, I said, alright, here's what the skeptics say.

But, you know, in the 1990s, they do that kind of VFX work because it looks real. I don't know. To me, I'm on the fence about it. It's very convenient that they got the footage. It is. It's very convenient that they got the footage. It is. It is. Operation Blackbird was a famous operation in 1990 to try and capture the footage live by a great researcher named Colin Andrews. He's the guy that does the books on crop circles, right? Yes. Yeah, he's all in. He's all in and he got a lot of support for Blackbird and not only did nothing happen,

he was totally embarrassed by it. And it was all like streaming live and a lot of people were involved. He's embarrassed. We find out later that while they're like waiting for the circles to happen, just a few miles away, there's a top secret military operation doing whatever they're doing. He doesn't know why. And then he gets a knock on the door from someone, you know, men in black, whoever it is, that first offers him money to stop his work, then threatens him

with whatever, threatens his family, and he doesn't know who this guy is. They go back and look at the tapes and he sees the guy in the background, like one of the TV crews. So the theory is some type of intelligence was embedded into Blackbird made to discredit him and that was kind of that was kind of the end of Colin Andrews because he was he was a legit researcher at that point now he's a now he's fringe now he's pseudoscience but I get into that the episode that was something I discovered I never knew that there was intelligence involved I didn't know that there was a military op which is confirmed it's all it's it's wild so do you think they discredited him on purpose yes

interesting to make the crop circle thing looks foolish but like what is the crop circle thing like what is the out of the believers what is the best theory the believers is that it's a it's a way to message craft or it's a landing site or it's some type of communication. But why would they do it in wheat fields? I don't know it doesn't make sense to me if you have the technology just you know yeah pick up the phone you know you there's better ways than just mowing wheat down but I don't understand. Do you know the one about the the Mandelbrot set? I've seen it. Yeah, I think that one is really weird because I think it coincides

with the fractal creation of the Mandelbrot set by these people that are into this kind of geometry and fractals they're like someone made the Mandelbrot set, which is essentially an infinite fractal of like, spectacular design. And this is before Lorenz and the Lorenz Attractor, I think it's before that, isn't it? I don't know.

Before it was mainstream. Yeah, before it was mainstream, yes. And then when this thing appears, and people are like, well what is this design? And then they connect it to this Mandelbrot set, which is, someone would have to have some very esoteric information. And it's the Mandelbrot set using Fibonacci numbers and the fee, the golden ratio. It's accurate.

It's accurate down to inches. Yeah. You can't do that. Well maybe you can, but like how and how long would it take and how much planning and how many people and what would you use? Like what is the technology that would use to bend those things over that way and weave them? It's very weird stuff.

It's weird. Because it's these, you know, the way these fractals work, this ratio in the in the geometry is like their specific Sizes this one is half the size of that one which is half the size of that one And it goes on and on forever and when you see it all see if you can find the Mandelbrot set It's the most spectacular crop circle. It's weird. It's really weird because it's fucking enormous Mm-hmm, you know and it seems so stupid Wow, there's a whole bunch of them the man abroad set is the one with the look like a heart About that one right there. Yeah, that's it. That's the man abroad set. Yep, and there's some other fractals there as well

Article it says these two guys took on the challenge and did it for a TV show on the BBC They did if you watch him do it. It's clumsy AF. Yeah, it doesn't look as good like Like trying to find because I know they always say that these guys did it but like Good you can't really see it there, but those flattened reeds. They're they're woven together With the weird some of the weirder ones go back to other crop circles, you had some other images before that. There's some other ones, those ones, those spirals. Like that one right there, yeah, yeah, yeah. That is fucking wild. That's wild.

Like this is multiple football fields, long and wide. So, how? Make that one a little bigger please. And one of these, I don't know if it's that one in particular showed up right next to Stonehenge like yeah like a tennis ball throw away like that is Crazy to not first of all if you're on the ground all right just the measurements alone To make each one the equal distance between circles You know in the whatever six different Blades that you have that stem from the center. They're all the same distance, they're all the same size. The small circles are the ones that are most interesting because how hard is

that to do? Right, right. And they're uniform and it's like what is that? What the fuck is that and? Who's do if that is a hoax? It's so bizarre that it's only these two goofballs that were making really shitty ones with boards and strings And yet there's hundreds if not thousands of these like really complex ones Yeah, those those are the guys that are, you can see them doing it live. And with those guys, there's no way they had enough time to do all these things. And it looked terrible.

Janky, look, he's just trampling it. Yeah. I mean, look, you can certainly make crop circles with a string and a board. You certainly can make crop circles. And it always gets connected, like believing in aliens and everything else. But it's not not no one's even saying aliens like what it could be some sort of energy From something that we possess some something that humans possess that they somehow or another

Aim at these areas like what is that one above it go that one right there above like right there What's up fucking that thing look at that? They are in the same count 80% of them come from the same County in England No, it's all also weird now people correct me in the comments But I believe that middle piece of geometry is a hypercube isn't it isn't that a four-dimensional cube? I? Don't know a tesseract Like what the fuck how long would that take? That seems like that would take a long time to do.

Stonehenge is under constant surveillance and circles show up overnight. Very weird stuff. There's an interesting conspiracy to... I mean, what the fuck, dude? ...to crop circles that we can get into later. Wiltshire has the most crop circles in England. Yes. And it's mostly in England, too, which is also weird. And it's mostly in Wiltshire. Man, like, is there some sort of

a theory by the Cooke's? Lay lines. Lay lines. That they're happening on these segments of energy that intersect. What is that black and white one Jamie? Click on that one. It's just a different. No, no, no, no, no. Oh, sorry. That one. What the fuck is that? Wow. Wow, on a mountain. That's crazy. That could be in sand, I think, because it looks like sand dunes. Whew.

Is that what that is? Notch, circle 16. That's crazy. I've never seen that one, it's wild. I mean, just the amount of time that it would take to do these things. So, ley lines. So this is the theory? That's the theory. I mean just the amount of time that it would take to do these things so Lay lines, so this is the theory. That's the theories. Have you heard about lay lines?

Kind of it's this this um alleged grid of energy that circles the earth and Almost like how magnetic fields work and this these energy lines have intersection points and on these intersection points are things like Stonehenge, Giza Whoa! It's in snow on a mountain in France Wow! Where are the tracks in? What? You know it

Okay what the fuck is that? So this is No footprints, no tracks No footprints right here Yeah but that could be That could be the people that discovered it. Right. Oh, this is a guy that did it though.

Oh, the guy. It's an artist that did this. The guy actually did it. These aren't crop circles. This is an artist doing it. That's kind of what I was trying to say. Fucking incredible. An artist did that?

Yeah, it has the guy's name on that first picture we had here. Amazing. Simon Beck. So the artist's angle is a conspiracy angle. There's a man named John Lundberg who was part of a group called Circlemakers.org, which is an art project and also a sociology experiment. He would make fake crop circles to see how people would react. Years later, Lundberg and some associates created a documentary called Mirage Men, which

is an excellent documentary. It's mostly about Richard Doty and his disinformation campaign on behalf of the Air Force to discredit the UFO community. D drove Paul Benowitz nuts. Bill Moore who's the guy who essentially brought Roswell out to the public. Bill Moore was taking payments and being fed information from Doty to muddy the waters in the UFO community. He finally came clean in 89, was booed off the stage at MUF, and everything just unraveled. So it's all disinfo. They booed him off the stage? Because he finally said, look, I've been working with the government.

A lot of the stuff I've been saying, they told me to say, Majestic 12, all this stuff was coming from Doty, and they didn't want to hear it. They didn't want to hear it. His career was basically over that day. Wow. Bill Moore. There was no Roswell story before more before his book and You know that was Doty so the the documentary about Doty Was directed and put together by Lundberg and his associates Lundberg was one of the original Circle-makers that would make these fake crop circles to see how people would react. I just thought it's an interesting connection but it's interesting because

Clearly some people are making these but like what was the origins of it? Cuz I'm sure you've seen that image from the newspaper of the devil with a scythe You know what I mean, and they're talking about crop circles like back in like the 17 and 1800s? 1678. Yeah, 1600s. Wow. First crop circle ever reported was in 1678. According to the story, farmer, the crop mower were arguing about the cost of harvesting the farmer's oat field. The farmer was furious at the mower's price and stormed off swearing that the devil himself should harvest the crop. That night, a dazzling light lit up the oat field and in the morning the farmer discovered perfectly round circles in his

Crops he was so frightened by the circles which he thought could only have been so neatly mowed by the devil or some Infernal spirit that he abandoned any attempt to harvest the field That's a little sketchy You scared of circles come on pussy Really though? If there were crop circles in my backyard, I would be a little nervous. I would be curious. It's not Terrifying right they're not something that would scare me away from harvesting my crop No, I'm more afraid of the government than ammo. You know that's not

No, but it's like what it so ley lines? So these things are to differentiate areas so they could see them from the sky? Is that the idea? The ley lines are the are the energy lines. Mm-hmm. Whatever a mystical energy it's not a scientific energy and where the lines intersect is where you see sites like Machu Picchu, Giza, Stonehenge, all these ancient sites. There's the ley lines But ley lines is you know, it's it's semi debunkable because if you if you connect enough lines you're gonna find patterns You're gonna find geometry, right? Right, right, right. You go looking for it, right? Yeah Very just very weird stuff

The I like I said, I used to think it was total nonsense until I saw some documentaries on it where they were talking about the nodes and they were talking about some of these things are just so complex and they appear so quickly. The nodes and the braiding to me was like, okay, now I gotta change my approach to this. What do you think it is? Yeah, I don't know. I think it's beyond us. It's just, we're just monkeys trying to guess math.

I don't know. Every time we make a guess on this show, someone's laughing. Of course. Someone's like, they think it's a landing site. Well, it's one of those subjects that if you even entertain it, you're almost immediately a fool, which I'm super comfortable with being a fool. I entertain a lot of foolish ideas but that one is particularly foolish because people always point to those guys with

boards and I'm like not so fast yeah those guys with boards definitely made some circles but this is there's some of them that are really spectacular. They are. And it just doesn't and and when you factor in the nodes, and you factor in the weaving, and then these incredible geometric shapes, like how are you even mapping that? Like how are you doing that? How many people are involved?

How long does it take? I, you know, it would take people so long, it would never be that accurate. Yeah. With, you know, with ropes and boards, and boards, I just don't see it. Right, but it leaves you with this weird mystery. It's like, what? What is this? I wish I knew.

It's one of those things that, like, it's almost like the universe is laughing at us. Every now and then it just shows you something that's so goofy that you have to go, well, what is real? You know, a great, it was a hoax, but a great crop circle was the Arecibo response. Do you know that's like so goofy that you have to go, well, what is real? You know, a great, it was a hoax, but a great crop circle was the Arecibo response. Do you know that one? Yes. That was a great one.

Yeah. We sent the Arecibo message out, but it had all the symbols on it. It sent it back with like a half of you, an alien face. Right, and it showed where in their solar system they lived, what their DNA was like. Yeah, it was a great one. Who did that one? I don't know who did. I don't know if it was circle makers. I don't know was like. Yeah, it was a great one. Who did that one? I don't know who did it. I don't know if it was Circlemakers, I don't know who it was, but it was a hoax.

But it was like a really well thought out one. Well that one kind of looks like a hoax. Like it's so on the nose, you have an alien face in the Crab Circle. Wasn't that different than the Arecibo response? Is it? I forget. I think they were related. I'm not sure though.

The response I thought was so cool. I thought the Arecibo response was aligned with that UFO thing, the alien face. See if you can find the crop circle that says it, Jamie. You could be right. As soon as you see the alien face, you're out. I think the Arecibo response is next to, there it is above that, Jamie, you just had it.

If you scroll, go to the top, right there, bam. Okay, so that's different. That's different, but there's an Arecibo is the answer. That's an album cover for someone on Apple. Right, but the crop circle's a real crop circle. Somebody actually made that thing. And that's a message in that circle, that spiral is a message. look at that one to the right

There is the areceba response down there with the humanoid face. Yeah, that's it. That's it Very weird, so that's a hoax. That's a hoax, but boy. It's a good one. It's a fucking great one Go back a couple posts Yeah right there that one on the right hand side. That's crazy. It's the small circles that get me. Well, it's fucking, if it is a hoax, it's amazing. That is just so weird.

But again, it's like one of those, it doesn't, it's not satisfying. No, it's not. You know, there's like one of those like it doesn't it's not satisfying no, it's not No, there's not like every it just at the end of it. You're just like I don't know That's why the worst question is what do you think it is? Oh, right? I was hoping you had something stupid No, I don't know man. Yeah, I don't know either But I do know that I want to believe which is always the problem with me with all these things. You know, I want to believe the base is in Antarctica.

I want to believe that there's pyramids up there, all that stuff. Yeah. And when you find out something's debunked, how do you feel? Oh, you know. Are you okay? Yeah. I mean, disappointed, but... But there's a party that goes, yeah, that's probably right.

Well, I think most of them are bullshit. I think like most UFO sightings are bullshit. Most UFO sightings are probably people seeing experimental military aircraft and things along those lines. Satellites, that's a big one. Like those, the Starlink ones, just fly across the night sky.

And people are like, oh my God, it's an alien. an alien it's not an alien you could see with your naked eye yeah but if you didn't know what it was it looks like a fleet it does ships flying across the sky and the way that they alternate lights it looks like there's an intelligence to it right yeah yeah I've never seen anything myself. Have you? No, Gino has. What did he say? Gino saw, and I think maybe Jeremiah said he saw the same thing. Gino saw a giant orb of light over the Pacific Ocean and he watched it for a long time.

And I said, where's the photo of it? And he said, I was so in awe, I didn't even think to get out my phone. I was like, man, but that's a common thing you hear. Right. Is you're just so in awe I didn't even think to get out my phone. It's like, man, but that's a common thing you hear. Right. Is you're just so in awe you don't think I gotta... Right. Selfie this.

Right, you probably, if you actually saw something, there's a high probability that you'd be so freaked out you'd be just in the moment like, what? Yep. And you know, Gino's legit. He's not bullshitting. Not a bullshit artist. Yeah.

Now I've talked to quite a,. Dave Foley had a sighting. He saw something. Do you know, talk to David. They saw the same thing. Mmm. Yeah. Well, there's always the question of like, what's going on off the coast. And I'm sure you're aware of this one. We actually talked about it the other day, but we never found it. There's a structure that's off of Malibu in the deep water

that was available on Google Maps. Was a structure that's off of Malibu in the deep water that was available on Google Maps. Was a structure. Was. And now it's blurred out. Yep. But it looks like there's openings in it, there's a top that's flat, it looks like... Looks like a base. Looks like a base. Looks like a base.

Yeah. You know, if... And now it doesn't. Now it just looks like blurry water. Yeah, like why does it look different now? Like what's going on? With a gun to my head, all the weird stuff is in the ocean. It's not from another planet.

Really? No, I don't know. Who knows? But it makes a lot more sense that the stuff we're seeing, it's the best place to hide. It's just deep water. So not from another planet originally? Like maybe originally and that's where they make their base? It's hard for me to square how to travel great distances.

It's hard for me to square that. You know, I know that we've got the Albuquerque Drive and Warp Drive and all these theoretical things about compressing space time and all of that. You know, I get it. But it's hard for me to think that that's solvable but what is interesting is maybe another species evolved alongside of us a long time ago and has been here a long time and said you know what let's go here's this is where we go to avoid cataclysms and geological instability let's go into

water that's a weird one though because like what kind of technology are you utilizing? How did you achieve that level of technological superiority and not completely control man? Because if I was an intelligent species that was capable of developing bases under the water, I'd be super concerned at all the different things that human beings are doing to ruin things. Like if we had chimps that all of a sudden had flamethrowers and they were lighting the jungle on fire, we'd probably take their

flamethrowers. So like we would turn off a nuclear reactor. Yeah. Right. So we talk about humans. If this theory is true that they evolved here, there were no humans. Humans are 300,000 years old. That's not, it would take whatever species a lot longer than that to evolve to this technological level. We've seen the craft just zip into water with no displacement. Right. You know, where are they going? And there, there are unnamed whistleblowers, you know, anonymous sources that say there's a, there's a base near the Bermuda Triangle. The Navy knows about it. They know not to get close. It moves around a little bit.

I'm going to do an episode on it soon because it's just too good not to. Corroborated by another biologist who said he worked with the retrieval team and yes, there's stuff. And what this base does is it, from raw materials, creates craft to go on specific missions. So it's always the question, you know, why is there a saucer? Why does it look like a pyramid? Why is it this? It's because they're custom built for a mission.

And there's an AI and a species down there, and they say, we're going to go survey Mount Haze in Alaska, super fascinating place. So we only need a scanning gear, some propulsion, and we just build it. It fits in an orb, send it out, does its thing, comes back, and then it gets broken down to its parts. And then another mission, build it up. It's going to be a triangle. It's going to be this or that. Does its mission, comes back and then it gets broken down to its parts. And then another mission, build it up. It's going to be a triangle. It's going to be this or that.

Does its mission, comes back. To me that makes good sense. A good way to do that, a good way to conserve resources, not have to go out and get stuff. I like the theory. That's a fun theory. It's a fun theory, yeah. It's a fun theory also that if you were creating bases here, like say if they're

coming from somewhere else and they want to visit us, it would be far more logical to develop some sort of a base with resources and you know where you could observe things and they can exist there completely undetected and then be able to go to wherever they're from back and forth But when they're here on earth, it would be undetected. Right. And the ocean is literally 70 something percent of the earth's surface. And we've mapped I think two or three percent of it. Yeah. It'd be a good place to hide in plain sight. That's what I would do and to make things from raw materials, meaning like molecular level stuff, you're I mean you're totally off grid. You know, we don't need to strip mine, we got everything here. Right, right. And if you have something that's a transmedium vehicle, so it doesn't displace the water, it works on some sort of a warp drive or something. I think you have to get into inter-dimensionality then and all. It gets a little wild.

But if you're not displacing air or water, that means you're phasing through matter. Right. Which is theoretically doable because everything is mostly space. Well, they said they've mapped things going under the water 500 knots. Right without making a splash. Yeah no ripples, no discernible waves. Greg Louganis right in there. Nothing. 500 knots under the water. I mean what the fuck could do that? The amount of energy you have to have to go through that much resistance of deep water 500 miles an hour 500 knots right look at how when they do missile tests from subs how those things are just like ah trying to get out of the water yeah

and these things just go yeah and nothing well that's the weird ones and but that would make you also think like maybe it is a hologram because if there are these transmedium things but the thing is they're seeing them with radar. Right, which means heat signature or mass. Right. Or electromagnetic displacement. Or if it was, if it is some sort of photons, like some sort of a projection,

would that not have some kind of a heat signature? It would if it was ionized air. Mmm. You know, that would be plasma, so that was hot, if that's what it is. But when they go into the water, we see them under the water for a second, and you don't see any refraction. Right. So that kind of screws up the holographic projection theory a little bit because there's no light refraction. Mm-hmm

So how did you do that? Yeah, no, I'm asking you how do you do that? I don't know either. I mean, that's my answer. Yeah, I Mean you've had physicists on here that I've seen go. Oh Yeah Well, the really crazy ones are the ones that the fighter pilots have seen. Because, you know, particularly Commander Fravor and the other people that were on that mission with him. So two separate jets, you have four people that are eyewitness to this thing. And then that there was something actually under the surface of the water, like an aircraft carrier, enormous thing, that this tic-tac is hovering above,

and then that thing descends into the water. The tic-tac turns towards them, jamming their signal, is hovering in space, and then shoots off at such an insane rate of speed that most of the things that we have on Earth would just disintegrate and fall apart just from the sheer pressure Of course and from the inertia. Yeah can be done now if I were doing an episode on on tic tac or go faster gimbal

I would be remiss if I didn't include Mick West's analysis of those and I know you've talked to him make on and off He's like a professional debunker. He is he wants to debunk things that I don't think can be debunked He does he approaches it as it's definitely fake and I'm gonna show you everything is definitely fake almost to the point where I'm like Who you working for? Everyone thinks we're CIA by the way, I mean you oh yeah reddit is convinced. I'm CIA. Oh That's me too. That's why my channel blew up in two and a half years because the CIA CIA is back Oh, I've heard that before I've heard that about many people. Mm- many people like the reason why they got successful. I've heard that about me, too Yeah, like go back to 2009. We have 200 viewers like the CIA suck back then

Dude I remember just watching you in little squares on you stream just like the top of your head and Brian and Duncan I mean, that's what if Gino's like you got to watch Joe Rogan's show on on Ustream. I'm like what are you talking about? He's a comic. He's like he's got Graham Hancock on and I went oh I gotta watch that and that's that's when I started watching. I think Graham was our first serious guest. So it was Duncan and I and we're in my house and Graham flew from England. We ate pizza in my kitchen. It was the first time I got to meet him. I was so pumped because I've read his book in the 90s. Same.

Yeah, Fingerprints of the Gods, amazing book. From Art Bellis, who told me about it. Yeah, I remember my wife was like, you should read like real archeology. I'm like, no, this is fucking interesting shit. Why shouldn't you? Is your wife a scientist or something? No, no, no, she's just a little more serious than me.

Yeah, my wife. She's a little smarter than me. Same, same. But it's like, I still to this day will pick up those books and read them. And it's like, I do not think that modern archeology has the full story, and I've seen the way they behave. I saw the way Flint Dibble behaved with Graham.

They're gatekeepers. They don't want anyone to have any information that they don't have. So even in the face of very compelling information, they dismiss openly, quickly, without any consideration. They just want to dismiss it. And then they want to pretend that any archaeologist that presents any kind of information that fucks up the narrative isn't immediately attacked. And they are. Their careers are ruined. Whether you go back to Clovis first or any of these

different archaeologists that have proposed alternative theories of the human timeline, all of the conventional archaeologists, all the mainstream people attacked them. Randal Carlson, Robert Shock, John F. West. If I'm a student. I'm a shock. Yeah, West. Mm-hmm If I were advising grandma would have said don't do that debate. Don't do it There's no way to come off. You're not going to convince anybody and you're just gonna come off not looking great. And And I've seen His response on his own site. He's even said that was probably a mistake He wasn't prepared enough, but you'll never be prepared enough for a professional debunker

You just won't be though. I have too much. So I told him don't don't go in don't go into the lion's den Well, the problem was he wasn't being honest Flint was not being honest about the information that we have particularly about offshore shipwrecks It was just not honest. No, you know and the amount that they have discovered, not honest. And Graham didn't know that at the time. And also the timeline of how old these are. When you get to 5,000, 6,000 years, there's no ship left. All you have is the pottery and whatever's

on the ground at the bottom. And if you're talking about 10,000 years, 15,000 years, who's to say that that's not completely covered by sediment by then? And it probably would be. Well, you know, I watched a little of Zia Was on here. That's all you need. Just a little. For that episode, you get it.

I couldn't believe he was still doing it. I mean, maybe he was around when they actually built the things. I think that was probably the best advertisement for alternative archaeology you're ever going to get. When you see the guy that's the gatekeeper and how close-minded he is. He didn't mention the capstones, the limestone facing from Torre,

he didn't even talk about it. Well, also, this just saying it was the national project and that's how they were able to get 80-ton stones 500 miles away through the mountains on sleds. Like come on. The Aslan stones are from 1200 miles away. Yeah.

You know the Tora stones are I don't know 20, 30 miles away or whatever. Why about those Lebanon stones at Baalbek? Baalbek they can't, how many tons is that? You need a person standing on it to even see the size of, you've never seen the Balbek stone if you're listening, the thing is it's like a skyscraper on its side. Yeah. And it's one solid piece.

And it was moved there. Yes. See, pull up the Balbek stones in Lebanon, because there's stuff that's above it that is like of a more recent time period but it seems to have been put there on top of these older stones that are so big they don't make any sense like that's just one of them that was quarried but not moved but the ones that are in place go to the ones like see like these ones the ones that are above so they're

the lower stones and the ones above you don't realize how big they are unless you can get a human being to stand next to them but right they are preposterously big like there you go right like you 15 feet high 30 40 feet long I mean they're shown metrics, so I'm confused. Incredible. Right. And who did it? And when?

When was that done? And then there's like Malta, like that stuff that they think Malta was constructed when the sea levels were much lower. So there was a way to make a path to there from Italy and from these other places sure because they found Neanderthal bones there and allegedly giants built that in Derinkuyu and all the hidden cities underneath Cappadocia and Turkey that they're finding are connected. Those are nuts. No one knows who made them. No one knows who made them and they can have thousands of people living underground. They can bring fresh water from the aquifers, they can bring fresh air and circulate it,

they have defensive mechanisms with these giant stones, and nobody knows how they made them? Yeah, and who? And why? Yeah. Great Flood. Yeah, that's the theory, right? The theory of the Great Flood,

and then the Younger Dry Ice Impact theory destroyed the atmosphere where there was this like, above the earth, which is like chaotic and they sought refuge underground. I lean more toward that the ice sheets melted from a solar event than an impact, but it certainly could be either. I mean... Well, it could be a combination of things. Could be.

Because it's also, they think there was more than one. The impact event happened. They know this based on core samples, iridium, the nanodiamonds that come from impacts. This is the Greenland impact. Yeah, not just Greenland, North America. They think it happened. I think they found the evidence of this stuff, like 30% of the Earth's surface where they believe these things had hit.

I think we got bombarded. Right. So that would be like flying through an asteroid field like the Leonids or the Perseids and the Taurus. So the remnants of some giant object that is rubble and we just fly through it, which means we fly through it frequently. We fly through it twice a year. But we don't always, you know, most of the time we get lucky and it's not really a hot

one. But like what happened there are big uska Tunguska right that's that's great No7 and in the same month that we pass through that comet field. That's right. Yeah, right That's over Siberia and that was an air burst I believe there's no impact crater right but it's flattened like millions of square miles of tree and still fucked to this day Yes, yeah. Yeah, there's images of that if you want to look up that there's um there's actual like film of it it's crazy it looks like

a bomb went off yeah we're in a shooting gallery you know earth is flying through a shooting gallery there's 900,000 near-earth objects that are just hovering around out there and NASA says we track most of them. The... Because in those fields with the Perseus and Taurus, there are big objects. There are Earth killers in there. Oh yeah. You know, an Apophis is lurking.

Apophis is the big one. That's due to fly by in a few years. What's that one? That's a giant asteroid that's, I think it's due to fly by maybe 20, 30 something. How big is that one? I'll get it wrong. I mean, I'm going to say a million things wrong today. I'll hear all about it. But it's a planet killer. Like it's a civilization ender and it's going to fly near, like we're going to be able to see it during the day. 375 meters across, about the size of a cruise liner. It will pass within 32,000 kilometers of Earth's surface on April 13, 2029.

Now stop there. That's about, that's closer than the moon. Whoa. I mean, way closer than the moon. Yeah. So that's what, about 70,000 miles where the moon is? 250. 250 250 300

So we're gonna see that what? You don't want to see that in this you don't look up and see that well, just knowing that ones far larger of pass through mm-hmm and Then we know for sure a bunch of hit you know for sure you know Chichen Itza that one All right chick Shalhoub, but that was that wasscience until that father or son went down there and found it. And that wasn't that one. I think that was when I was growing up, the dinosaurs died. That was a conspiracy theory, the asteroid.

And they found it, I think around 1980. They found the Yucatan impact, yeah, under the ocean. And the Iridium yeah matches it uh-huh yeah all that is really spectacular stuff it it's just like when you look at the moon you see the craters all over it and realize okay this is what happens when you don't have an atmosphere and you also don't have water and you could see everything that hits like the whole thing the whole thing well why covered but why are there so many fewer impacts on the other side are Are there? Fewer. Really? I can't, I don't know. The moon, I have, I have a,

it became a saying on the show, I even have a t-shirt, the moon is weird. Yeah. Like, Gino's my weird topic guy, it's like, what should we talk about? He's like, do hollow moon. So I went into that story thinking, this is the dumbest shit I've ever heard. Right. The moon is hollow. And I'm doing the research about halfway through, I'm like, do hollow moon. So I went into that story thinking, this is the dumbest shit I've ever heard. The moon is hollow. And I'm doing the research about halfway through, I'm like, hmm, the moon is weird. And then by the end of my research, I was convinced that clearly the moon is a hollow spaceship

that was brought here from another part of the galaxy. And it's here and the lizard people are absorbing our soul energy. That's the only explanation for it. Probably not true, but man, the moon is very weird. Well, it's also weird that the alignment and the size and the distance of the moon makes the eclipse perfect. Like, what are the odds of that? What are the odds that it is the exact distance from the Sun so that when the moon and the sun align, it's exact.

Right, it's like a 400 to 1 ratio. It's exact. It's nuts. But you could debunk that by saying the moon is getting further and further away. Right, but why is it perfect? I mean, we have not found a planet in this solar system or anywhere else that has a giant moon right next to it Core the size of the earth we haven't found it. Yeah We're the only one with it And there are ancient legends that talk about a moonless sky and when the moon arrived and when it arrived it it caused

caused a great flood What are the ancient stories of a moonless sky? Where are they from? Ancient Indian texts will have it, but also native legends will have it about a moonless sky, and then the moon arrives. When do they think the moon arrived? It's hard to tell.

I always go to younger dryas, younger dryas, but who really knows? The earth was apparently just covered in this haze, just very wet, very hazy, maybe like Venus or something like that. Then the moon arrives and all that water from the atmosphere drops down to Earth. The tidal forces are crazy, there's a huge flood and everything just settles and then the moon is here and the moon is now like the guardian of the planet, which it really is. We couldn't

really survive without it. Because it stabilizes our atmosphere, right? Stabilizes our orbit. Our orbit and our spin and our axis. When there's a major earthquake, the earth changes speed. Like measurably if there's a big earthquake. And if there's a lot of those, that could throw you off the axis, but the moon steps in like a bouncer and settles things back down. Hmm. So the idea would be that some sort of a superior civilization

place the moon there to ensure our survival? I don't think they care about us. Really? No, I don't think so. How come? Again, we're in very speculous territory because nobody knows. I don't think they care about us. Really? No, I don't think so. How come? Again, we're in very speculous territory because nobody knows. Right. But I would think it would just be for resources.

Hey, this place has a lot of stable water. That's it? That's useful. Don't you think they would be fascinated with us as an emerging civilization? And like I always say, that if we found a planet that had cave people on it, like just starting to learn stone tools And stuff like that we would for sure be interested in them

We'd be so fascinated and we would probably try to accelerate their learning curve. You think we would yeah Definitely. Yeah. Yeah. Well think of what a lot of these jerk offs have done with like Uncontacted tribes and stuff like that. We're always trying to intervene and do something with them. You know the dark forest theory? No. It's Lucian Scherrer who wrote the three body problem

and all those. Oh. Dark forest theory says that if you attain a certain level of technology, the best thing you can do is just be quiet. Because the universe is a dark forest and the first person to stick his head out dies Because you don't want a competitor in your region

so as soon as a Culture gets close to some technology that could make that they're on a path to threaten you you got to take them out You got it. You got to halt their technology and three body problems is kind of based on that. That's what they do in the books and That seems to make a little more sense to me than sort of this altruistic, hey, let's help them, you know, the Star Trek approach, let's make first contact and all of that. You know, I like, you know, human nature is a tricky thing. We're very selfish. You know, you and I might want to see those people and help

them along, but there's a lot of people that would not want a competitor in the neighborhood. Well, yeah, maybe, but what if they don't even think of us as a competitor? What if they're so advanced? Like, if they're millions of years advanced? Wouldn't they... Like, this is the thing that Diana Pasolka and Gary Nolan and a lot of these people that study crashed retrievals, there's a term that they use that these are donations. These vehicles are donations and the idea is we're supposed to look at this and formulate new ideas through reverse engineering.

And there's circumstantial evidence that that's true. If you look at Bell Labs and all the crazy discoveries after Roswell, like we're using cathode ray tubes and suddenly transistors are made in silicon semiconductors and wireless transmission and Bell Labs is all these leaps forward. Fiber optics. Fiber optics, laser technology came out of Bell as well. And, you know, the retrieval experts say that fiber optics fiber optics laser technology came out of Bell as well and

You know the retrieval experts say that fiber optics and lasers for sure is reverse engineered and It kind of makes a lot of sense because it seemed to have come out of nowhere Suddenly Bell Labs has it you know, but you know, it's My question is where where is the stuff, you know, we've got World War II, we go into Korea in 1950, and at the time, Russia had the MiG-15, was basically on par with us. I think we had the F-86 at the time, and MiG might have even been better.

So that would have been a great time for some advanced tech. But America did catch up and exceed the Soviets about 51-52, you know, during Korea and then has been superior ever since. But you would think that after 47, with the Soviets there, let's get some of this anti-gravitic stuff going. Yeah, maybe the problem is that you're working in this very compartmentalized environment, so you're not allowed to share with all these different scientists. So because of that, there's no collaboration, which is necessary for real innovation. You have to have experts from a bunch of different fields analyzing all the different aspects

of it. This is what Lazar pointed to the problems that they were having at S4 when they were trying to back engineer this stuff. He's like, you can't do science like this because everything is so top secret and so compartmentalized. The metallurgists were not allowed to talk to the propulsion's people and no one was allowed to talk to anybody else. And everybody was just like, what the fuck is going on? What are these things? They didn't even tell him allegedly, if the story is true. They didn't even tell him where this thing came from. They show it to him and there's a United States flag sticker on it and he's like, oh, this is ours

Oh that makes sense. And then he's examining he's like, oh, no, it's not like there's no seams in this thing Like what is this? What's what is the metal? Why is it designed for something? That's three feet tall Like there's no controls inside this thing. Like what is this reactor? How does this thing work? There's a chair. Yeah. You know, there's a couple of chairs. It looks like there's a neural interface maybe.

You know, you hear a lot of the scientists, their frustration. Like if I could just talk to these guys, you know, I'm picking up an EM field from this. The metallurgist would be helpful here to tell me what's going on. You know, I keep coming across spinning mercury all the time. Spinning mercury. The spinning mercury engine has been part of the lore since ancient India has the Vamanas, you know, those crafts. If you look at the ancient texts, it may have been in the Mahabharata. Yeah.

But they allude to this liquid metal. And then you fast forward to like the Nazis building the bell, the D-Glock. That was a Mercury engine. And then we fast forward a little further, Mark McCandlish and the ARV vehicle, the flux liner, that's spinning Mercury engine. So spinning Mercury keeps popping up. And spinning Mercury would cause some type of field what that would be I'm not a scientist or physicist. I'm not sure but it would certainly throw off a bunch of ions that could maybe be harnessed or used for something

What it's like we're trying to explain things to us based on our current understanding of technology like glass was invented a long time ago but imagine showing up with a brand new Samsung Galaxy s25 ultra with gorilla glass you know in that thin frame and looking at what the fuck is this there'd be statues of you for a thousand we you know what glasses you know what metal is right well this is glass and metal. You're like what? What? No, what the fuck is this? We took sand and made it real hot, and it made it clear.

Huh? What? Right. You can drop it on the concrete and it doesn't break. What? Yeah. So just our current understanding of technology based on the origins of that technology, just metal and glass.

You know you show someone metal and glass is thousands of years old, show them what we have now with metal and glass, they'd be blown away. And you just keep going, keep going, go a thousand years from now. What does it all look like? It's like probably some sort of gravity propulsion system, probably 3D printed so there are no seams.

Right. And that's the frustration about disclosure is how far? Could we be by now right you know had had there been disclosure in 47 or whatever There's even more of a Psy op if it's all bullshit Like it's a Psy op if it's at if it actually is like wow the government is actually really good at one thing They're good at keeping secrets about UFOs. That's right But if they're not if if it's all bullshit, like boy, how weird that we've been like focusing on this nonsense, like as a culture,

it got in the front page of the New York Times in 2017, but meanwhile it's all nonsense. Right. That's almost less likely. Well, if you look at what Doty did in the 70s and 80s with Paul Benowitz, when Benowitz discovered this advanced technology on Kirtland Air Force Base. He called the base and said, hey, I think there's UFOs. So they send Doty out. He was Air Force Intelligence, OSI.

They sent him out to Benowitz and he's like, Paul, I think it might be UFOs. It is aliens. And Paul gets a little bit wacky and he starts intercepting signals from outer space and they're sending him messages but it turned out it's really the NSA running into the house across the street and Paul is committed at some point. And then Dodie over the years changes his story and says no a lot of it is actually true. But Dodie has also said as recently as 2019 Hal Puthoff tried to recruit him for a disinformation campaign with ATEM. Really? So Hal Puthoff has been a part of disinformation campaigns.

Allegedly. Allegedly forever. And what have they been doing with these disinformation campaigns? What have they been trying to muddle. Just to keep guys like you and me fascinated and trying to figure stuff out while they can just operate their advanced technology in peace. Like let them think it's aliens and UFOs, that's fine. What a dirty thing to do to us.

Filthy. In the 50s, they were very public about anti-gravity. It was in the papers. You know, the G-engine, they were talking about it. And then suddenly quiet. Yeah, Jesse Michaels talks about that all the time the Townsend Browned Yes, yeah Ning Li remember her story the physicists who do right and then she died in a car accident

I was came back from China oops oopsies Mm-hmm. Yeah Yep, so that was so that was AC gravity if you guys want to look that up. She used to give talks and all of that. She was funded by DOD for $400,000, so we know that for sure. And then she just goes dark. She goes dark for 11 years, shows up, I think, in 2013. She's back, 2014, she gets hit by a car.

Why is it so fun? I don't know. Mark McLennan just found all that stuff, ended up killing himself. All this stuff is so fun, which is why the Y files are so good. Because it's like, I always get the same feeling when I watch your show. It's like, oh, what is the answer? What is real? What is it?

But it's, what is it about us that's so intrigued by these mysteries? I mean, there's so much that we know that is real. Just the nature of the cosmos itself, of black holes and solar nurseries and all the wild shit that's absolutely real. But there's these things that are like, yeah, but what is that? I don't think enough people are interested in it, to be honest. I think that's part of the problem. Well, don't you think it's because, for the most part, it's dismissed?

And if you engage in it, it's like if you're a normal person, not like you or I, but if you're a person that has a job and an accounting firm, you're a very respected, legitimate person, especially pre-2017, 2017 pre the New York Times article and you want to start talking about like gravity propulsion systems that the government's been hiding and it is back engineering programs they've got crash UFOs and there's one of them it's only like a couple hundred feet wide but you go inside of it's the size of a football field yeah or the one in Korea that's so big they had to build

a building around it because they couldn't move it right I want to know what that is same same I don't I wish more people were interested in it I'm I would almost be willing to run for president just access just for president the company would be in shambles but everybody would know everything about UFOs dude you have no shot. Oh, I have no shot. They would kill me for sure. I can't believe the things you say are news. Yeah, well it's because news is like really dead.

Yes, that's true. News is slow. They're angry about independent media. Well they are, but it's also the news is not, so their business is just clicks. And what better way to get clicks than I said something crazy so then you know and then it also kind of supports the idea that we need to be gate keep and someone needs to you know be able to stop us from spreading misinformation or my favorite term malinformation.

This is something that came up during COVID that we need to stop the spread of misinformation, disinformation, and malinformation. Malinformation is real information that is true and accurate, but would be negative in its impact to society. Which is crazy. It's bonkers. We can't live in that society. Well, they're making us infants, right? They're saying we can handle this, but the vast majority of you,

even though we're all supposed to be equal and the government's supposed to be working for you and serving the people, no. We will have this information and we will know what we're doing and you won't be able to have access to it because you're not ready for it because you're too stupid.

They lost. They lost already. They just don't know it yet, but they lost. They lost a long time ago I'm gonna I'm gonna put out an episode about how dragons are real and when I get to the defunct I'm gonna say nothing. They're real peace out Triangular spacecraft. What is this? someone down a lower rabbit hole and found a

Patent that exists or did exist it was abandoned in 2006 This could be the I forget the the title. Look at this. The SR, was it 7RB? Was it T3B? This is like the ones that they always see, like the Phoenix lights and that one. So it says, a spacecraft having a triangular hull with vertical electrostatic line charges on each corner that produce a horizontal electric field parallel to the sides of the hull. This field interacting with a plane wave emitted by antennas on the side of the hull generates

a force per volume combining both lift and propulsion. What? Wow. It gives all the math but like I don't know how to do this math. Oh we need to get Eric here. Someone can look at it and be like that's not real. Get Eric Weinstein to like do that math for us. It hasn't been made obviously, that's not real. Get Eric Weinstein to like do that math for us. It hasn't been made, obviously.

Or that we know of. Or it has, Jimmy. And I'm surprised it's not classified. There's other, according to this article though, that's where I found it, it's what it was about the T-3B thing. Right, so that's your real experimental aircraft. Does America have a reverse engineered UFO? This goes back to 1991 with the desert storm.

There's reports of what they call a TR-3A, Whoa. This goes back to 1991 with the desert storm. There's reports of what they call it a TR3A, which looks a lot like what the stealth bomber kind of is, but also... Whoa. Yep. No confirm. TR3B is said to be like nothing we've seen before. This was what I got to from liquid mercury.

I was trying to find stuff about it and there's theories that people say that like this is probably what they're running off of. It's supposedly powered by a reverse engineered anti-gravity drive that was recovered from a crashed alien spacecraft. The TR-3B is where reports of UAP performing seemingly impossible aerial maneuvers intersect with stories about very real aircraft. Read the next paragraph. There are lots of claims over the internet about TR3B's anti-gravity drive, most of which include using nuclear power to rotate highly pressurized mercury

to produce plasma and in turn a gravitational field. Whoa. Something about the mercury. Have you ever heard Eric Weinstein talk about this, there's a college in upstate New York that has an incredibly overqualified physics department and they're attached to a hedge fund that does Bernie Madoff type numbers. Yes. And he thinks the whole thing is a cover for some sort of advanced physics that they have

been keeping a lockdown on. And it would make total sense. I mean, SRI would be another good example of that, right? Where Hal was in the 70s, with Project Stargate and all of that. Yeah, the idea that the government can't keep secrets, like, what about Epstein? Come on. People ask me all the time.

That's in front of everybody's face and they've kept the list a secret. We're never gonna see the list, stop asking me. You're not gonna see the list. Why not? Because everybody, all your heroes are on it and they're kept the list a secret. We're never going to see the list. Stop asking me. You're not going to see the list. Why not? Because everybody, all your heroes are on it. And they're on it a lot. That's never coming out. Yeah.

And I have a friend that thinks like a lot of the world events that you're seeing, one of the reasons why people support it is because of Epstein, because of the list, because people are compromised, because no one can talk about things, which is really why why so the government can keep some secrets Manhattan Project They yeah, they did a great job with that and that was one that you know I mean it was a race between us and The other foreign powers they were all trying to come up with a nuclear bomb first. We did it first

the idea that there's no way that we could have some sort of advanced propulsion system and that modern physicists would be aware of the state of the art and they would tell you, yeah, no, this is not possible. I don't think that's correct. I think you could probably, if you were working on something and you had a very specific hierarchy and you were really good at compartmentalization and you were recruiting these people at a very early stage in their career, people with promise, these geniuses, giving them a very high salary, a prestigious position, but then everything's locked down.

Cell phones, email, they're under constant surveillance, and if somebody steps out of line, like the lady in Maryland, the Chinese lady. Yep. A lot of them. A lot of them go that way. Yeah. You know, I'm very, I'm skeptical about a lot of the whistleblowers, especially the ones that come out of Air Force intelligence and all of that. Me too. Even when I'm talking to them, I'm like, hmm. Well I mean, you know, I have, I kind of have that needle of skepticism and it starts with,

do you have a background in intelligence? Yes. Military intelligence, Air Force intelligence. Are you still on the payroll? Did you get your information cleared from the Pentagon? Yeah. Do you have a book? Yeah. And it all goes, did you release some photos that were fake? Yeah.

I'm over here. Then you go Bob Lazar, he has none of that stuff. Did the government target you? Did they try to discredit you? Have you been ostracized? When Lazar came out, I think it was to George Knapp, he didn't say his name. He didn't have any books. The first book I think was with him and Jeremy in 2019.

So Lazar to me is the most credible of the whistleblowers. But Jeremy and George just had a whistleblower a couple of weeks ago who's pretty credible. He's a young guy, he's clearly nervous, and he has some very interesting information about what is it, immaculate constellation. Which guy is this? I don't remember his name, it's very new.

Is that the bald guy? No. No. The bald guy I guy? No. No. The bald guy I think is Air Force Intelligence, this is a kid whose career is ruined. He's maybe in his 20s. You can see he's clearly nervous. And what is his claim? His claim is that he was going through some files, he's got top secret clearance, and

he found the Immaculate Constellation Project. Basically a PowerPoint presentation. And his job was just to sort these files. And he's looking through it, and suddenly it's like, whoa, this is about recovery and alien craft. And he did the right thing and went to his superiors and said, you know, there's a leakage. I saw information I maybe wasn't supposed to. I'm just letting you know. And his superiors were like, eh, forget about it.

And he's like, and how is it? It's just no reprimand, no nothing. I just went back to work. But he was too fascinated by the document. So he kept pursuing it and pursuing it. And now he talks about it. I don't know his name, but if you track down, you know, Jeremy and George, George will find it easily

Mmm, that's the kid. Yeah. So here's a way that I would kind of Try to debunk that if I was being logical if I was the government and I Did have some very sophisticated propulsion system That's beyond the understanding of what we think to be current state of the art physics. Like far beyond that. I think I might release a bunch of horse shit about UFOs. 100%.

Yeah. I might put a bunch of that stuff out there to say, well, it can't be ours. It's not ours. It's not of this world. Muddy the waters. Yeah. Not of this world. Muddy the waters. Yeah, not just that, but attach like really kooky stuff to stuff that's real, so that you think the real stuff is kooky. Right, like the drone scare, remember that?

That was very manufactured and the press was all over it. We don't know where the drones are. They're all flying over the military bases, all that stuff. What do you think that was? I know what it was. I've seen the NOTAM reports. I don't you know what a no time is no, that's a notice to airmen so pilots private pilots get warning of no fly zones and Usually you'll see a lot of swaths carved out It's like Air Force ones flying through but for some reason this no time reports have all these little circles all around that

you can't fly through where the drones were and I've seen that and When did the drones they suddenly stopped when right right before inauguration day? Yeah, and did no and no one talks about the drones anymore. Yeah, it's gone gone I mean it was mainstream news all over the place and they had people nervous. Yeah They had them nervous and I think that was the point So you think they did it as a Psy-Op just to see how people would react? I do and remember I know nothing but that is my opinion is that it was a Psy-Op and that most of

this is. If there are visitors and they are from somewhere else wouldn't the best way to prepare us is to start flying a bunch of like really wacky shit that we have in the air and not explain it. That would be a good way to prepare us. Get us comfortable with seeing things hovering over New Jersey that defy what our understanding of drone capabilities are in terms of the time that they can stay in the air. Some of them were in the air for five hours. But if that was the reason to get us ready, it backfired because it freaked people out. People were very nervous about it. So our military installations are vulnerable. People were very frightened. That was the other thing. Wright-Patterson Air Force Base had some drones and then they

had to shut the base down. And Wright-Patterson is like ground zero for all of it, Project Blue Book. Roswell went there. The second crash. What's the second crash? The second crash was some miles north and west of there. And you'll hear Doty talk about it. And that's where other pilots were recovered.

I think the total of five are- Pilots? The EBEs. The EBEs. And according to Doty and others one of the EBE's was stayed with the government I think in Los Alamos for five years till 1952 there was IBA 1 or whatever he liked strawberry ice cream who doesn't who doesn't right I'd be the first thing I'd do if I went to Planet Serpos. What's the ice cream like here? Well, just the idea that they would eat,

like we eat, seems crazy. Right. And then also they could breathe our air. Like, what are the odds of that? Well, you know, the theories are, you know, we never see alien shit or whatever, but there's always a rebuttal. Is that, you know, they have a metabolism that absorbs nutrients and their waste is recycled and all of that Something like that well they do seem genderless Mm-hmm genderless giant heads you know I always say that the archetype like the the grays like close-encounter grays if you go back to like

Neanderthals, and then you go back to like Australia Pythagoras covered in hair Heavily muscled and then you go to like the average dude who plays Call of Duty, you know, like what do we do? I play Call of Duty. It's fine. It's great game. But you know I'm saying it's like people become like these frail Muscle-less things and then your head keeps getting bigger and bigger as the mind evolves and then human Capabilities increase in terms of like our ability to communicate telepathically all these different they no need for mouth noises anymore So your mouth shrivels up this little slit and why the eyes so so big and black because you're evolved underground Oh, I thought it was like sunglasses built in well. It it could be the same. Like, that's what I thought. I'm like, well, that looks like sunglasses.

Right. Like, if you're gonna protect your eyeballs, if like your atmosphere is far brighter, and you know, you have to be able to see things. I think that was, there was one retrieval story that had that, like one of the black eyes was half open, that they thought it might have been something. Like a little shield?

Like a shield. Like, that's a legit recovery story. I can't remember it might have been something. Like a little shield? Like a shield. It's a legit recovery story. I can't remember it offhand. Like camels have a weird shield over their eyes for sandstorms. Right. Yeah, like they have like an eyelid, a clear eyelid that covers over their eyes, that they can like go through sandstorms and not get blinded. You know, it's an interesting point that you brought up about Neanderthals is, and a lot

of people don't know that just about 50,000 years ago Neanderthals had basically an empire Yeah. over all of Europe and for hundreds of thousands of years. For hundreds of thousands of years and then suddenly boom they're defeated by frail, weak, hairless humans out of caves. And it's attributed to, we figured out a bow and arrow. We could harass from a distance, projectile weapons. And that's how we defeated this vast empire of Neanderthals who were not stupid.

Bigger brains than ours. Bigger brains than ours. They had art, culture, music. They trained in warfare. They had art, culture, music. They trained in warfare. They had organized warfare. I mean, can you imagine staring down the barrel of a division of organized Neanderthals coming at you? Right. Like, essentially super athletes.

Yes. With chimpanzee-like strength. Right. And speed. Yeah. And intelligence. And we came out of the caves and defeated them. Okay.

And eyes so large that they think their eyes might have been, they might have been able to see nocturnally. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I love that episode you guys did on Neanderthals. You debunked it at the end, but the idea that they were like more ape-like than they were human, they looked like monsters, dark skin, fangs. Yeah.

That was a cool episode. They were mostly debunked, but yeah. But I mean, there probably was some hunting of humans. For sure. And when you're dealing with something that's a far superior physical specimen. Yeah, when you hit... Much denser bones. Sure.

Much stronger than us. And when we know that we have some of their DNA in us, and it's, you know, when you hear, oh, we interbred with them, that's not precisely how it went down most likely. It's most likely the women were carried away. That's how the interbreeding happened. Yikes. Uh-huh. Yikes.

Or horny men found some lonely Neanderthal lady. Some dude's like a big lady. There's no shame in it. Yeah, a big, thick shame in it yeah some fucking warrior children just want to be cut someone's just got dense bones you know I'm looking for a lady with a dense head let's have a dense baby yeah what are their fucking language sound like it's like the we used to think of them as being really stupid and until they realized that their

brain mass is actually larger than ours and they were capable of language and all these different things. Like, okay. Like, how did we beat them? I don't know. That is a puzzle. You know, the answer is projectiles. Well, it kind of makes sense.

I mean, if we were the only ones to figure out bows and arrows and adilatles and all that kind of stuff, maybe. It would work. Yeah, especially if we organized, you know? But you could still overwhelm how, you know, you could overwhelm a few archers with just, we would just throw bodies at it. You know, warfare's been fought like that for humans forever. Maybe their language is too crude to allow for that kind of communication like to strategize and

You know I'm saying like maybe their language is like very crude normal day-to-day stuff. I'm hungry I want to fuck like right kill these people it was not complicated enough to say like we had an issue here, right? Here's the issue. We got to get around them from the back end you know and you guys got to distract them from the front and this is what we'll do you know I mean that's the only thing that makes sense yeah but it still doesn't make complete sense to me why were their brains bigger than ours that's the weird one like we associate larger brains with more complex thinking so why would what we think of as the most brutish version of human beings? I don't know but don't Neanderthal brains even though

they were larger had fewer convolutions. So really do we know that? That's part of my research which you know most of its bullshit but that's what I read. You know large brain but not as powerful. Interesting. So maybe the large brain was attributable to physical capability. Just the fact that you can produce music tells me so much about your brain. And they produce music? They produce music. How do we know that? We found relics and artifacts of it.

Of musical instruments? Instruments and cave writing and all that stuff. They used needles and thread to make clothing really mm-hmm Wow yeah very strange that we beat them. That's a Neanderthal tool Flute some sort of flute whoa a bone flute Made with the bone of your defeated enemy. Yeah some dude you ate. Mm-hmm made a flute out of his shin That death whistle back then too, that's sort of musical Oh the ass I think that's not the same but I think that's well, that's great. That's a scary one

Yeah, Brian Callan blew it on this show in 2019 and kovat started right afterwards. That's some of the demons. Yeah. Brian, do you remember that? Yeah, it was just January 2020. Oh, OK. It was like weeks before. Weeks before the lockdown? Uh-huh.

COVID was already here. It might have even been closer. I think COVID was already here by then. It's like with the anti-gravity. Why can't we cooperate with the Chinese? Yeah, nope. Nope. Well, we kind of.

We know how to do that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, nope. No, well, we know we kind of we know how to do that. Yeah Yeah It's also fascinating to me how many different versions of human beings existed, you know There's the hobbit people the island of Flores, right? That's a fast Floriances so like that this is whatever it is. Yeah Yeah, the three foot tall little furry creatures that they think get tools and yep wore clothing and all that jazz

Yeah, and there's even the different branches like Cro Magnon is not really from our branch. That's really that's a different Yeah, we branch from a different branch So that is Dennis Ovens, Dennis. Oh, right. And then the what are the big head people that they just found recently This is like super recent like there was a an article that was made in December of 2024 About this other new branch of the human species that had much larger heads than ours and they think it was like it's really thick muscular like heavy human being Was it called again? Jularin.

Yeah. Big head people. Yeah. So they disappeared around the same time as the Antals 50,000 years ago. Have you seen the images of what they, the reconstruction? Go to some of the drawings of what these people look like. They look fucking insane. Were they taller?

I do not know. I don't know how tall they were, but they looked fucking cool as shit. Yeah. There was like a jacked one, wasn't there? Yeah, that's the one I want. Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh uh, no. That's one, but that's not the one we were looking at. We were looking at one that theorized that it was completely covered in hair. Interesting.

Yeah. So this is a very recent discovery. So how many... this is the thing. I think something like 90% of the species that have existed we don't have fossils for. But that... well, I mean 99% of species ever existed are gone. Right, but fossils are very difficult to happen because it has to happen in a mudslide, somehow the body has to be preserved, then it's mineralized. Right, I don't know how many dinosaur complete fossils we have, like a T-Rex, I don't even think we have a complete one yet, but

one or two billion T-Rexes lived and died on the planet we have a couple of skeletons right billions right yeah and it just makes you wonder when they're finding things like this in 2024 how many are yet to be discovered i mean how much of the ground's surface has really been excavated to a very high level right yeah very little Yeah. Very little and it's very difficult to even dig there. I mean, what's happening in Turkey is a shame with Gobekli Tepe, you know, just paving over it and planting orchards on top of it. They've taken down the orchards.

They did? Yeah, the olive trees, the problem with that was that, and this is Jimmy Corsetti had talked about this long ago, that the issue with them doing this is the roots are gonna destroy the artifacts below and like no no no no it won't and then turns out actually it is so they had to pull them and so they they pulled the olive trees but they planted them purposely over the the area which is like I'm glad Corsetti's out there I like him and I know him pretty well and great the Turkish government I think is banned him

means trying to get him in trouble here trying to get him sanctioned sanctioned how do you sanction the guy off YouTube for what look when you were when when CNN was going after you and they were like trying to get Spotify to to cancel you creators like me who go against mainstream were very nervous because if YouTube just pulled my show, I'm kind of fucked. Right.

So it's like if they could take down Joe, we're done. But Spotify, with a lot of respect, hung fast. Yeah, we've talked about that. If I wasn't on Spotify and I was only on YouTube at the time, I might have been fucked. Because they were taking people down for actual, real, truthful information. Yes. That was, in their eyes, malinformation that would cause vaccine hesitancy.

Still no apologies. No. But it was a risky time to be non-politically correct before it was safe to. Yeah, it was a very dangerous time and weird because it's like instantly dangerous. Like it wasn't like that before. Then all of a sudden, like anything you could say could get your career ruined.

Yep. And again, everybody turned out to be right. Everybody was right that masks don't work. Everybody was right that the vaccine didn't stop the infection, didn't stop didn't stop wasn't a vaccine It wasn't a vaccine. It has a bunch of side effects. The the pangolin is nonsense. I mean we knew that all of this It was just intuitive. Mm-hmm The lab leak theory was racist. It was racist. Oh my goodness the our word

They tried anything they tried anything they could to silence any opposition. Why we're gonna say something Do you mind you're gonna say you got a quick question? I think I forget we steamed over it But we're talking about like the weirdness of that time about how dangerous it was like, you know, it was real touch-and-go It was real weird There's like a lot of forces that were trying to get me removed Because I was talking to people that they were deeming quacks. One of them, which is Robert Malone, who has nine patents on the creation of mRNA vaccine technology. These are rock solid credentials these people had. They weren't kooks like Jay Bhattacharya. All these people like Stanford, MIT, Harvard, all the people from the Great Barrington Declaration,

these are the legitimate researchers and scientists that didn't agree with the narrative, and they were getting them removed from Twitter. And they had awards through their careers, highly revered and respected, and then suddenly no. It didn't matter because these people, unfortunately, had a conscience, and they were saying, well, this is not what I know. I am an actual expert, and I do not think that the information they're giving out is correct So I'm gonna speak my mind and then just they were just and then there's also a concerted effort by Fauci Like and his group to go after these people. Yes attack these people publicly. Yes, and

When it was very early on I forget even what, I had a release not that in some paper, criticizing a lot of this and lockdowns, like my dojo was closed down, was trying to fight with masks on. So I was angry. And then within weeks of that, it suddenly became politicized. And I was like, now I'm fucked.

And now it's a political issue. How is this a political issue? But it was, it was politicized. And I don't know why. I don't know why it was all shut down. I think it's all just money. I think the vaccine companies wanted to make as much money as possible. And then anything that contributed to vaccine hesitancy was not for the greater good of public health. It was because the more vaccine hesitancy, the less profit they would have.

I think it's real simple. Ugh. Yeah, it's gross. I agree, but that's really gross. It is gross. But it's also gross that they would prescribe it for children because it was totally unnecessary. So the only reason why they would prescribe it

for children or mandate it for children to get into schools because they wanted to make as much money as possible. And they made an insane amount of money. So it did work, it was effective. But boy, it destroyed a lot of money. So it did work. It was effective, but boy did it destroy a lot of credibility It certainly did it definitely worked Where my wife was working? They it was a mandatory vaccine situation, but it

She was working remotely so didn't really have to get it But I can see that the narrative was starting to catch with her and I'm like honey hold fast This is it. This is a story, you know, it was a left-wing company and I'm like honey hold fast this is this is a story you know it was a left-wing company and they're just following the narrative they don't just hold fast and don't get that shot and she didn't. Yeah luckily I know people that did I know people that have real fucking problems right now. Same. Yeah. Like they got long COVID suddenly. Yeah it's weird that long COVID is something that mostly affects people that have gotten vaccinated but they want to call it long code they don't want to call it vaccine injury

No, this is the whole thing is like very creepy because it just shows you if something is like very clear and obvious and it's a real disease and we know the origin of it now and we know that all this stuff has been done to obscure it. How many other elements of society, how many other stories that are in the news have also been distorted and twisted around in order to promote a very specific narrative and how effective have they been at doing this? It's not like this is the only time they've ever done this. So COVID was kind of a window into disinformation and about how the government can use these ploys and manipulation and using these tactics of humiliation, humiliating these established scientists, ruining their careers, attacking their credentials.

And what other things have they used these on? What other geopolitical aspirations have they masked in all this bullshit? The whole thing is just, it's very disconcerting to find out that the people that have been running the country are super comfortable with lying. Here's the good news is the irony of COVID is the forces that were forcing us to be locked down and stay home gave rise to independent creators and journalists and independent thinkers and folks like you. And because of their forcing the lockdowns,

they destroyed their own industry. Yeah. And there's no going back. I mean, I haven't watched MSNBC or Fox News in years. And you turn it on, it's like, oh, this is just I hear the same stuff from the left and the right. I just hear the same stuff. I get my news from YouTube, from all different sources. And that's what I want. And they destroyed their own industry. Yeah. And it's interesting to see, like, what is it going to look like, you know, five,

10 years from now? Because five, 10 years ago, you'd never, 10 years ago, you never would have imagined that CNN would lose all its credibility. No, that would, we watched Desert Storm on there. Everything. Everything. Always, when you wanted to get the news. And it was always, also, CNN was thought of being

as this sort of non-partisan environment for the news. It just showed you what the news was. And then somewhere along the line, it became very editorialized, very opinion-based, and very, you know, these people telling you to do your own research. Do not do your own research. Like, imagine saying, don't read. Right. Don't read. You're not smart enough, AJ. Right. You think you can go read. Right. And absorb information. You're not smart enough to absorb information. Leave that to the experts.

Don't listen to Rogan. He takes horse pills. Got that from his doctor. Well, it's also calling it horse dewormer was so stupid because everybody knows it's used on humans. Oh, ivermectin's in my cabinet. But it's just a simple Google search would tell you that something's wrong. That's required medication for foreign service. Yeah, so it's one of those things where you wonder after something like that has been happening, well, this seems like a playbook they're really comfortable with using.

How many other things do they use this on? Like what other aspects of society are just complete horseshit? When did it really start? Right. You know, probably- Probably during the 40s. Maybe even before, because if you read War is a R a racket by Smedley Butler, that was 33 general Butler Yeah, the business plot general. Yeah. Yeah, he was a very very honest guy

Yeah, yeah, if you guys don't know the business plots worth looking into that was it they tried to recruit him to overthrow the government Yeah, yeah, cuz he had all the troops at his disposal. Yeah, that was wild. They were going to have a coup. They were going to have a coup. In the United States. Mm-hmm. Yeah.

And nobody has answered for that. No. That's the JP Morgans and that whole set. So this kind of thinking has been going on forever. And then there's also kind of gatekeeping of information, like hiding the truth from people in order to preserve narratives, in order to preserve power and authority. Well let's connect, let's go back to Butler for a quick second.

You've got Tesla who gets funded by JP Morgan to create wireless technology, but Tesla gets a little ambitious and says, I'm going to do wireless communication, but I'm going to take your $150,000, I'm going to do do wireless energy and we'll do free energy around the world." And Morgan's like, how do you put a meter on that? Tesla's like, what do you mean? This propel mankind forward. Morgan pulls his funding, tells everyone in the investment class this guy's a kook and if you invest with him you don't do business with me.

A few years later Wardenclyffe Tower gets torn down Tesla dies in poverty. Yeah. And where are those 20 boxes? Yeah. And why was the government so quick to respond to that crime scene? Yeah they showed up at that guy's house quick. They gathered up all that information. I wonder what they got from that. Uncle John Trump there was in charge of that. Right. What did they get in those boxes? Donald Trump's uncle reviewed Tesla's death ray ray secrets and found mysterious royal letters I think they well he looks like a Trump doesn't he he kind of does Trump look like you didn't do the comb-over Wasn't he working at a Wright-Patterson as well was he?

for this Wright-Patterson is a weird place Like they think that that's where one of them is. Yes. Yeah. You know the Nixon story with Jackie Gleason? I know that Gleason was into UFOs. Tell the story.

The story is Gleason got into UFOs because him and Nixon were drinking one day. And Nixon was like, you want to see some shit? I wish I was drinking with that suit. And then he takes him, flies him out to wherever the base is and shows him a crashed UFO and these bodies that they have in freezers. And it was Ry Patterson? I do not know. I do not know.

I don't know if Jackie Gleason ever said. The story came from Gleason's wife and it was an article in some sort of a magazine but then there's the house that Gleason built in upstate New York that looked like a UFO like Gleason built a home Yeah, that was like like a disk. I'm gonna look into this. It's such a good story I wonder where they went really would have been in Homestead Air Force Base might be in Florida in 73 I think that's where they were when they were playing golf and That's where they were when they were playing golf. Embalmed was reportedly showing embalmed bodies of four alien beings.

Dun, dun, dun. So Nixon exposes UFOs to a civilian, and then it does not go well for Richard Nixon after that. Well, I think what went badly for Richard Nixon was that Richard Nixon was inquiring as to who killed JFK, and he said he thought he knew. And he was kind of talking about it publicly. And they're like, okay.

And they had already brought in Gerald Ford, kicked out Spear Agnew, they got rid of him. Gerald Ford, who was also in the Warren Commission report. That's right. And then all of a sudden Nixon and Watergate happens. Nixon the most popular president of all time. And it turns out that Bob Woodward was actually an intelligence agent and this is his first project ever Operation mockingbird and then the people that were involved in the break-in all FBI They don't work G Gordon Liddy. Yeah, the whole thing is a coup. Hall was a coup

All was this yeah, and we're all parroting, you know, Nixon was a crook. That guy was a crook He was this or that like they did a great job. The Psy op was wonderful. I'm a patsy Yeah, they say it over and over. Mm-hmm. Yeah, it's all really really interesting stuff, but it's just You know What would come what it boils down to with stuff like your show like how much of it is? How much is real, you know, and when have these mysteries, one of the amazing things about mysteries is you're never going to run out of topics. No.

There's so many of these things. And as long as there's a US government, I'm good. As long as the CIA exists. They're always going to be hiding something. Oh, yeah. But the fun ones are always the alien ones. That's the most fun ones. The ones the ancient civilization ones Like what do you think when when you go over the Bob Lazar story? Like what what do you how much of you think how much of you cries bullshit? How much of he's like hmm? I'm more on the home side. I think he's the most credible whistleblower because he Didn't profit didn't profit and they I mean they prosecuted him for running a prostitution ring

you know. Which maybe he was. Which I think he was. He pled down to pandering. They also raided him during the Jeremy Corbell documentary while they're filming the documentary the FBI raided his facility and they said they were looking for something. And supposedly he has a version or a sample of stable element 115. What? That's supposedly.

Yeah, and that's supposedly what they were looking for. Well, of course. Supposedly he had gotten that from the lab and when he was at S4 and that he had managed to smuggle out a stable chunk of this element 115. And there was a video that George Knapp had from back in the 80s where Lazar was demonstrating how this stuff bends light and what it does, like it has weird effects. How soon after that raid was, 115 is now called Moskovian, how soon after that raid was 115 synthesized?

I think it was synthesized in Russia. It was synthesized by a particle collider. And so when they got it, it was a very temporary, quickly dissolving form, but they proved its existence. And supposedly, what Lazar is saying, wherever these beings are from, they obviously have a completely different environment and they have a stable Version of this this element. Yep, and this element is crucial to this gravity propulsion system It's a part of this reactor gets bombarded with radiation produces this gravity field allows you to just slingshot through the universe

I Don't know. Are they working to stabilize it? I don't know what's going on behind the scenes, man. Why would they raid Bob Lazar? That's that spectrum of believability again. Here's a guy who's being attacked and tormented. In the middle of filming the documentary. I mean, I just had my first IRS audit.

I don't know how you're doing. Oh, what'd you do? I didn't do anything. I don't work in weed anymore doing. Oh, what'd you do? I didn't do anything. I don't work in weed anymore. What do you think they were auditing for you for? What, when you go over all your episodes. I'm sure it's just a coincidence. What do you think, definitely a coincidence.

What do you think are the most problematic? Most problematic for me are probably the CIA ones. The one I did that ended with the Agent Orange kind of expose was kind of a dangerous one. It was the dark history of DARPA and all the bad stuff that DARPA's done since its founding. It's done some horrible, horrible, horrible stuff. And that was an episode I was afraid to release. There's been a couple of those. MK Ultra is kind of afraid to release. There's been a couple of those. MKUltra is kind of afraid to release, because I named names. A scary one was how Lyme disease might have been a lab leak.

Yeah, that's a weird one. Bobby Kennedy fully believes that. It was Eric Traub was like the chief Nazi bio warfare specialist that was brought here, Operation Paperclip. We do know that there have been some studies done Where they were trying to devise diseases that they could aerial spray? Whether it's through bugs or something onto a population Overwhelmed their medical system so they'd be easier to defeat that's documented

Yeah, the entire enemy super weak everybody's weak over there and then also documented is Some ticks got out Then to do some ticks got out So it's you know when you look at lime, Connecticut as ground zero and it just spreads from there and there was no lime disease before That's a scary one to release. Yeah But whenever I get into operation paperclip, I always hammer home, these are Nazis. You know, Wernher von Braun is not a hero. He's a hero, but he's not a hero.

You know, a lot of these guys, these are all evil dudes. And most of the Operation Paperclip is just bringing over intelligence assets. They don't like talking about that. It's the 1200 scientists that we learn about. It's not the 6000 intelligence agents that just lived here And on the 70s and 80s right all with their fucking dueling scars on their faces mm-hmm Scary looking dudes like right out of Indiana Jones right SS on the shoulder and that's what was a part of NASA

That was running NASA right Warner von Braun was an actual Nazi and he was the head of NASA. And SS Nazi. So the V-1 rocket program killed 3,000 people in London but killed 30,000 Jewish slaves building the rocket. 10 times more people died building the thing. And if you didn't work hard enough in the rocket factory, they would just hang you from the rafters. But von Braun said he didn't know anything about it. And all of his team said, we didn't know hard enough in the rocket factory. They would just hang you from the rafters. But von Braun said he didn't know anything about it.

And all of his team said, we didn't know anything about it. Okay. Well, that's convenient. Well, every time I bring up someone who's from there, I just remind everybody, these are Nazis, these are liars, these are bad dudes. That doesn't mean, you know,

they didn't do amazing things for America, because you could do both. Yeah, that's what's weird. You know, the V-1 rocket eventually becomes Saturn 5, which takes us to the moon, allegedly. Allegedly. That's allegedly. Yeah.

That's my favorite one. Same. Did you ever see the episode I did with Bart Sabrell? Yes, and I talked to Bart from time to time. Boy, he's all in. All in. For decades. Eventually, I'm going gonna do a conversation podcast and

he'll be one of the first guys I have on. I had dinner with Bart Sabrell in like the year 2000, 2003 or something like that. I had dinner with him in Los Angeles. I had seen a funny thing happen on the way to the moon. Which, what year was that? Great documentary. What year was a funny thing happen on the way to the moon, which what year was that great documentary? What year was a funny thing happened on the way to the moon released? So it was like shortly thereafter Somehow I do I do not even remember how I got connected with him But we had dinner in Los Angeles at this Italian restaurant. I sat down with them 2001 2001. Yeah, so it's probably around 2003 that Bart and I had dinner and then you know 22 years later, I had him on the podcast.

He's still going after it. Oh yeah, yeah, he still emails me and I'm like, Bart, I'll have you on. I'm still building the studio. Well, he's so all in on this. And the more you talk to him, the more you go, god damn it, he might be right. He might be.

I debunk a lot of his claims. Which, not all of them. You know, like the parallel shadows and how a shadow on the moon should be completely black but that's not really true. And shadows... Well, things are reflective and the surface is reflective. That's part of the issue. But the parallel shadows are fucking weird.

Like, you could find a reason why these intersecting shadows could exist, but it also could be more than one source of light. Sure. There's more, there's a lot of weirdness to it. And shadows are not parallel. They don't work that way. Shadows disappear to the horizon. There are no parallel shadows.

Right, but going in completely different directions is very odd. It's odd, but... It's very odd. That's not nearly as odd as... I mean, there's so many different things. You know, there's so many things. Like how goofy it looks when that craft lifts off from the moon and takes off into space. It's wobbling around like it's on a fucking string.

It looks like it's on a string and... It looks so fake. The camera tracks it nicely. Pans. But it's- From where? From, from, From Houston.

From Houston with the, what, seven second delay or whatever. How about the fact that Nixon is on the phone with them? In real time? In real time. Like, you don't go to a delay. That would be with 1969 technology Communicating like one of the reasons why Gus Grisham You know though this is the big theories that crush Christian was murdered because he wasn't willing to go along with it

Gus Grisham hung a lemon on the lunar module because he wasn't wasn't able to communicate with the tower From earth it the communication system wasn't working. And he's like, this is a fucking lemon. And he puts a lemon on a coat hanger and hangs it on the thing. And then... Well, let's go back and look at the original films and we may be able to learn something. Oh, they don't have them anymore. Gone. They're gone.

They don't know. What about the telemetry data? That's really important. Gone. Oh. The episode I did on the moon, which is a fun one, I even have a NASA scientist saying we don't know how to redo the technology, we just lost it. Didn't write anything down or nothing. And then there's the reality of the Van Allen radiation belts.

That's true. That could be explained scientifically. Can it? The radiation is high particles, high voltage, all that, but they're spread wide apart, so you just got to go really fast through them. Right, but it took hours to get through it. It did. It did, but they still were moving fast.

Or it would kill everybody. Or it would kill everybody. This is one of these theories. And that's why nobody but the Apollo astronauts ever got through that. What I would say is, like, they never even flew a chicken through that shit and had it come back alive. No. And they're just going to try it out with people?

Lyka the dog did not survive when they threw Lyka up there. Well how about Operation Starfish Prime where they shot a nuke into there to try to blow a hole through it and it wound up making it more radioactive? Of course. They thought they were going to blow a hole in the Van Allen radiation belt so they could just pop through that hole. Right. And now thanks to that we've got the South Atlantic anomaly belt so you just pop through that hole right and and now thanks to that We've got the South Atlantic anomaly where there's just no protection anymore. We appreciate all that

They pull out the power in Hawaii right yeah, they fucked up the grid. They were detonating nukes in space Really crazy people in the 1950s and 60s were buck wild they were they were just they had so much power There was no internet There was no oversight, and they were doing things so like we're completely new like nuclear bombs And they're like let's see if it does this even Oppenheimer. They didn't know what was gonna happen they had a more than zero percent possibility That it was gonna cause a chain reaction that would destroy the entire environment of the earth. Yes. And they were like, let's see.

Well, we got to try it. There's only one way to know. Right. Detonate it. And something like Bikini Atoll, which I think was Castle Bravo, was like three times more powerful than they thought. You know, it's like we're going for 10 kilotons, but we got 30? Dude, you got to carry the one. Be careful.

Be careful. Just be careful. I don't even know why we messed with it. Yeah, it's well, it's too late. Too late. The genie's out of the bottle. So if you had a bet, if you had $100,000 and you can bet we went to the moon, we didn't go to the moon.

Well, that money's not enough, but gun to the head. Gun to the moon, we didn't go to the moon. The money's not enough. But gun to the head. Gun to the head. Gun to the head. We went to the moon without people. That's what I would go with. But let me preface by saying, on my head, I'm like a bobble head.

I go back and forth and I can be convinced one way or the other, it's a very complicated issue. Like I can be convinced both ways. There's also the weird footage that looks like they're on wires, where they're pulled up when they fall down. You could see the reflections. Yeah.

Yeah, I get into a- Weird. It's a good episode. I get into all of that at Cover Bart. Buzz Aldrin knows how to throw a shot. Kinda. He didn't get his hip into it. Hold shoulders.

But it's also the thing is that every other technology from 1969 is cheaper, easier, and faster to reproduce today, except the moon landing. That no one has ever done it again. No one has ever even been a deep, not human beings, have ever even been a deep space. I don't know why. If we could 3D print anything, why don't we send a 3D printer up into orbit, and then every time Elon launches a Starlink, just bring some substrate, bring some wire, and just deliver it there.

Because you're going to do 10,000 of them. Just bring some wire, bring some wire, bring some aluminum, and we can just build this stuff in orbit. We don't have to worry about escaping gravity. Just build stuff up, 3D print stuff in orbit. Hmm. It sounds a little more complicated than you're making it out to be, but I see what you're saying. You know, the film footage, the loss footage that Sabrel had is also very compelling, where it looks like they're filming the moon from, you know, 30,000 miles out, but then when they pull the covers off the windows, it shows you they're actually

in near-Earth orbit. It fills up the whole window, and they even say in that film, we've got the camera right up against the window, no one can get in between it. But then someone walks in between the camera and the thing. Someone walks by, and then you see what looks like a piece a piece of plastic Oh, uh-huh. Yeah, then everything opens up. Uh-huh That's a hard one to explain it is and not for public display not for the break. That's absolutely right It's and also the why would you ever? Delete all of the original film

What why would you destroy the original film? Why would they lose the telemetry data? And we don't even have a direct feed because they broadcast the feed on a wall and then pointed a TV camera at the wall. Yeah. And that's what we see. That's why it looks so shitty on television in 1969. Because the networks were like, hey, can we get the live feed? NASA's like, ah, you don't need that. It's so weird It's weird. It's a weird one It's also just weird that we keep saying we're gonna go back and we still never even get out of Earth's gravity Or never even got our Earth's atmosphere

Well, I was orbit rather as soon as the Chinese start mining like helium 2 or whatever We'll get we'll get there and people always say oh well There's photographs of the the lunar lander on the moon you can see it like Hmm how'd they get that buggy up there? How'd they piece that buggy together? Yeah, tiny ass fucking lunar module because you can't see the tracks up there if you know if you believe the stuff Where was that mean how easy is there's there's video of me selling Kentucky Fried Chicken? Oh, I got to look that up. There's like you know I'm saying I gotta write that down might not me selling Kentucky Fried Chicken. Oh, I gotta look that up. You know what I'm saying?

I gotta write that down. It might not even be Kentucky Fried Chicken, but there's AI video of me hawking all kinds of stuff that I've never even seen. You show up in my feed, and I'm like, oh, he's selling chicken. It's all fake. But that is easy to fake, because it's blurry, blurry nonsense photos. In my episode on the face on Mars I show exactly how NASA copy and pasted cloud formations you literally see it's the same cloud

formations and then you see the Mars photos they copy and pasted chunks on Mars they did that like I didn't make that up I just mean by that they copy and pasted chunks on Mars you've got this Martian Rock face I don't EI of Sidonia is where the face was and the alleged city and all that. What about that square? And the square is crazy. The square, but that's a recent one that we've been seeing. That one's nuts.

Sidonia was one of the original landing places and they changed it at the last minute. Why? I won't land there and go to the face. Let's see because if you don't know the story about the face on Mars, the first image is it does look like a face, and then suddenly the images got blurrier, and then it was just kind of a plateau. It was, you know, pareidolia. It wasn't really a face.

Right. Well, then land there. Drive, you know, Sojourner over there. Whatever. Let's have a look. What's crazy is that the face is right down the street from the square yes the square to me is way more compelling than the face because if the second images were more clear and it really is just how do you say that word again pareidolia pareidolia that's really what it is that kind of makes sense because the first one's like real blurry and shitty and it's from the 70s true right but this square is nuts right

it looks it looks geometrical, right angles. And an actual square, or at least similar to a square, it looks like a structure made out of right angles and it's on the fucking moon. I showed it to Elon Musk, he's like, oh, very interesting, we should probably go up there and look around. We should, I mean, they're finally admitting

that Mars used to have an atmosphere an atmosphere and and oceans giant oceans They're finally found frozen water on Mars. Yeah, which is like, okay. Yep Well, if we go back millions and millions of years like what what did it look like? What was going on there? Remember they sent Joe McManigal to remote view back on Mars. Oh, what did he say? He said he saw giant tall beings there in a very advanced society and Joe McMonigle was part of the project Stargate Remote Viewer. So he goes into his thing and he's drawing the aliens and the cities and all of that, but he didn't know where he was looking.

They wouldn't tell you at first. And then he's done, he comes out of his trance, whatever, opens the envelope and it says Mars with coordinates 1 million BC or something. He said he saw stuff. And Stargate again with Ingo Swann saw all kinds of stuff on the far side of the moon, which I don't see, I don't hear covered a lot with Ingo, but he remote viewed the moon because he always wanted to do more stuff. He's like, I don't want to look at a bridge.

I'm going to go to the moon. And he said he saw structures on the far side of the moon that sound a lot like Karl Wolf disclosed in 2001. What did he disclose? Karl Wolf, Air Force Airman, he's basically a technician. Think of a Xerox repairman. He has to fix some imaging equipment for NASA slash DoD. It's images from the Moon Surveyor. So he goes in, it's a dark room, the guy's working there.

The guy's like, Carl, look at this. It's pictures of the dark side of the Moon. He sees domes, towers, roads, all kinds of stuff. I can't believe it. And Carl goes home and he told his wife, I can't wait to see this on the news. This is crazy what we found. Like, there's a civilization on the news. This is crazy what we found. Like this is a civilization on the moon.

And it just goes away. And Carl Wolf said he saw that. If you- Remote viewing. No, photographs. He saw photographs. He saw photographs of it. He saw photographs.

Who took the photographs? It was the moon surveyor satellite that takes pictures all the time. It's like we have images. We have stuff around the moon surveyor satellite that takes pictures all the time. It's like we have images, we have stuff around the moon. I don't know why there's no webcam. You know, I don't know why we can't just tap into the image. Throw a satellite up there. Something, they're there.

Just send a signal back. I read that they just got like 5G working in space. Send us a signal. Put a webcam on the ISS. Let us tune in." So Carl Wolf saw that stuff. Ingo Swann saw the same things, but he saw actual beings there. And he said they were able to sense his consciousness. And he like snapped out of it. He said, aliens are on the far side of the moon and they are not our friends. So very interesting story. Ingo Swann, very interesting cat.

So what took these photographs? Oh, the moon surveyor, lunar surveyor, satellite. None of that stuff's ever been released? Oh, they released a lot of images from the far side, but they released what they release. That's why we know there's fewer impacts on the far side, because we've seen those images. But there's no images of these domes or whatever?

No, no! I've seen some that maybe are faked, that look pretty compelling. I forget what episode I had to show them in, but when I found them, it was mind-blowing. And I can't find them again, for some reason. Like, I wanted them for another episode, and I can't find the photos, which is always suspicious to me. It's like suddenly the thing is blurry off of Malibu. You just can't find the stuff. But my gut tells me something's going on up there,

someone's aware of it. And I just, I'm dying to know what it is. It would be unbelievable if Mars was the first planet that had life before Earth was capable of supporting life. It reached a very high level of sophistication and then started seeding Earth. Right. Panspermia theory. I believe we have at least one rock from Mars that just landed here. I think we have one of those. So for maybe a giant impact or something through some of just landed here. I think we have one of those. So for maybe a giant

impact or something through some of Mars over here. But the idea I think is that their atmosphere was deteriorating or that they were getting further and further from the Sun. Their magnetic field was weakening, strips away the atmosphere. And so this would be the thing if you were a super advanced civilization the race would be get so advanced that you could leave your planet. Yes. And that's the only way you're gonna survive because eventually your planet is going to move over millions of years further and further away from the Sun not able to inhabit life anymore. Right so maybe send your DNA or whatever to the third rock or

Anunnaki or Anunnaki. That's the good one. Yeah, they show up everywhere That's the ultimate one. That is the big one that the Anunnaki is the big one. That's a that's a good one That's that's one that makes you go home because it shows up everywhere shows up in the Bible It shows up in the Mahabharata. It shows up in ancient Chinese literature. It shows up everywhere. Not always called the Anunnaki, but the Anunnaki and then they have their servile species that could be the Nephilim, could be the Giants. And then they take these primitive humans, give them just enough intelligence to mine, you know, mine the gold. It's part of the lore. Yeah It's a good one. Oh, it's the best one. Mm-hmm. It's the best one because When you do look at ancient Sumer and you you look at their detailed map of the solar system

Like what the fuck is that? Like how did they figure that out right like you're talking about 6,000 years ago They had depictions of the planets all in the proper area like they weren't the exact right size but like the bigger ones were in the place where the bigger ones would be the smaller ones in the place where small ones would be was representative and the Sun looks like a Sun like it's got the rays around right showing that this is the center of the solar system. Right, and this is how many thousands of years before Copernicus, right? Didn't even know. Something I don't think,

doesn't get enough attention is when these ancient cultures are obsessed with equinoxes. A lot of people think equinoxes when day and night are the same, but that's not what that is. When day and night are the same it's called the equilux, and it's different for everybody on Earth, depending where you are. And equinox is when the Sun is over the center of the Earth's equator. Well, how did you know there was an equator? So Stonehenge is aligned to the equinoxes. How did you know there was an equator? And how was the pyramid, the sizes are directly divisible to a number like 43,200 that could

be factored in to calculate the circumference of the Earth? So you can calculate the equinox. How did they do that? Right. And how is it pointed to true north, south, east and west? How did they do that? Why does it mirror the stars of the Orion belt? But mirrors them 30,000 years ago because of precession.

Right. So I'm in the camp that the Egyptians found the pyramids, not built them, but I'm glad Zahi's not here. Well, that would, you know, get you to the ancient civilization theory. But when you're looking at an ancient civilization that is as complex as Egypt and then you factor in the Anunnaki story and all these other things you got to think like why were the Egyptians so advanced like where did they learn this from Christopher Dunn has the answer you know the power plant power plant yeah we think you know it's one of my favorite episodes because I you know know, you can either watch

my stupid thing with the fish or the better thing is to just buy Chris's books and read the science. Oh, don't be a sheep. Don't be a sheep. The next one's going to have taxes on theft. For people who don't know, if you haven't watched the show, Hecklefish Talks Shit from the Aquarium during the entire show, it's's really a funny little it makes the show fun because those like shows you're not totally taking it seriously you have a talking fish who talks shit to you the

entire time what I'm trying to do is take weird topics complex topics break them down make them accessible to everybody have a good time get you thinking on your own if I get things wrong that's okay as long as you go out and just get interested in stuff. That's what I'm trying to do. Have fun and get you interested. Have you been looking at all under the structures underneath the pyramid? Yes, I'm skeptical of that research. Because if you look at the imaging, I don't see the coils or any of that stuff. I don't see it. They also said they found the tomb of Nefertiti. No, the tomb of Osiris. It just looked like splotches on radar. And they also haven't released any of that information

to the scientific community. Nothing's peer reviewed. But when it first hit the news, I was like, that supports the power plant theory, the coils and all that. But I have a feeling that their research will be debunked hope I'm wrong really well they they really released more of it and the because they released more of it in the conversation that Graham Hancock and Brian Murorescu had with them well they were initially skeptical

well they've come around more to thinking that these guys might be on to something because they've done this multiple times now with multiple scans, they keep getting the same results. And it does kind of look like coils. When you look at the images, first of all the pillars, the fact these pillars are uniform and they see, and then the fact that the structure goes down two kilometers into the earth. Like maybe people 4,500 years ago were so motivated, as Zowie said, that it's like, this is the project of the entire country,

the pride of the country. Okay, maybe, maybe, but two kilometers down, like we're starting to get real crazy. I mean, if you look at the, like the Kufu pyramids, like perfect, and then you look at the pyramids that were built later that we know were Egyptian built, and it's like the Timu version. It's like we know were Egyptian built and it's like the Tmoo version

It's like you didn't you're not even it's like a mess. It's just a pile of rocks Yeah, we're where the Great Pyramid is precise And there's no reasons for these different chambers and the chemical residue why and why are there copper? Rods going down into the aquifer, which is exactly the technology Tesla was using at Wardenclyffe Tower, the same exact technology. Why? You know, there's hydrochloric acid, we have evidence of that. And we've got the zinc sulfide, and it creates hydrogen atoms that go up the gallery, and

then there's an opening that's exactly the right wavelength for hydrogen to flow through, and it resonates at 440 Hz and it makes an F sharp chord and you've got the, it's tuned inside the king's chamber to exactly that chord. Or, you know, maybe it's just a place for a dead guy. You know, why use rose quartz, which is so highly, you know, rose granite is so dense with quartz, it's very rare, but it creates a lot of piezoelectricity when you apply pressure to it. And hydrogen could do that if you pumped it through the king's chamber. It's so fascinating to me that the gatekeepers are so reluctant to even consider any possibility

that it might have been something other than what they've initially asserted. It's frustrating, but it ruins their career and their reputation It's like everything you said was wrong over time I have a buddy who just went to Egypt and he hired these two Archaeologists to take him on a tour and both of them are saying there is no way the original the the actual Mainstream story is accurate. They're like there's no way like this stuff is beyond and then as he was like going through it with him He said he was just fucking blown away He said I haven't been but he said you can look at it all day on television and on your laptop

When you go there you just like what the fuck I'd love to see it. Yeah, we should go together. Let's do it Zahi wants me to go with him, but I just don't think I could I think after an hour I'd be like dude. I gotta get away from you. Yeah. You're freaking me out. He'll ruin everything. I discovered this. This is my discovery.

Yeah, it just... He didn't even mention the limestone from Tor. Didn't even touch on it. What's the significance of that? It's a great insulator of electricity. It's also mined from very far away. We know it was definitely great insulator of electricity. It's also mined from very far away. We know it was definitely there. Herodotus talked about the limestone pyramids that could be seen from the mountains of Arabia.

So Herodotus, they were still there. We know that the limestone facing was there because a lot of it was looted after a couple of earthquakes. They built bridges out of it. You can go touch it. It's there. But he didn't talk about it. But if the pyramid power plant theory is true, then you use limestone as an insulator.

Inside you've got the granite, which creates this piezoelectricity. And then you've got this other limestone in between that kind of keeps everything modulated. So if it was a power plant, like what was it powering and how was it doing that? That's the big problem I have is you know so with Tesla wanted to project this energy into the ionosphere and then we can everyone could tap into it with some type of Receiver like a radio, but there's no evidence I can find of them powering anything so we can make the the argument that maybe if the capstone were gold

This energy could resonate through the center of the pyramid, come up through the golden capstone, and then go straight into the ionosphere. And we know that the pyramid will resonate at certain frequencies and amplify it. That's been tested at about 200 meters is the ideal wavelength. But the only other theory is the obelisks at some point

were these receivers. But there's no evidence that they powered anything. But maybe they used the energy for something different. I don't know. And if we're looking at the wrong timeline, if we're not really looking at 2500 BC, if we're looking at 30,000 BC or something even before that, which is also a weird thing that Zahi dismissed. He dismissed this idea of the King's List that goes back 30,000 years. Right.

Yeah. And he says that just... Meet! Right, just meet. Yeah, we know exactly. Also, he said he didn't believe in carbon dating, which is like... Yeah. Well, that's convenient.

That's convenient. Yeah. To not believe in carbon dating. And what about rock dating? That, you know, that is a thing with certain types of rock. Limestone, not so much, but something like igneous rock, you can get a pretty good idea. Yeah, the whole thing is very weird.

It's so weird because it's so vast and so spectacular that no matter what you think, no matter what theories you have, you still have to look and you go, how the fuck? Like it's so nutty that you can't even imagine people making it right Not people as like we consider people today like if a civilization today if we let's say for some reason No one had ever visited a part of the earth and then they went to a part of the earth and they saw people with these structures today

We were like what happened? How did you do this? We would think they were wizards wizards above a million three hundred thousand stones Mm-hmm hundreds of miles through the mountains you carried the big ones for the inside the King's chamber you put them up 130 feet up in the air with a ramp. Yeah, I don't think I don't think so, but it's all just if they did How where that technology go where that construction knowledge go like where did their engineering go? I how are people that advanced that long ago? You know, I I like the acoustic levitation theory is an interesting one where they use sound vibration to lift heavy objects. We see that occurring throughout history as part of lore.

But even in the 1930s, a British, maybe he was an archaeologist, naturalist, went to see Buddhist monks and using instruments, he watched them levitate heavy objects. And there's film of it. This is all the legend. And when he went back to the UK, they seized the film. But they were using instruments and chanting to levitate these rocks up a cliff face to build whatever they were building. Well, how about that wacky dude in Florida that made the Coral Castle?

Oh, yeah. That's Edward Lee Scanlon. I found, it's hard to find, but I found him using levers and pulleys and stuff to do it. It's still amazing what he did. Yeah, by himself. By himself. He's like 5'1", 190 pounds, and I think that door is tons, and you can push it with your finger.

That door in the Coral Castle is amazing. And supposedly did it for his girlfriend. I didn't read that. For his beloved, yeah. He did it to impress a lady. You went too far, man. You don't have to do that. You just buy a nice car.

Don't do the, she doesn't care. Anybody can buy a nice car. I'm gonna rock this chick's world. Literally gonna rock her world. She's gonna see my cruel castle and be like, this motherfucker's the one. She bailed. You bail if a dude builds you a castle. You're like, uh, look at the one. She bailed. You bail if a dude builds you a castle.

You're like, uh, look at the time. Gotta go. Yeah. When you do these shows and you've amassed this channel now with all these fascinating things, which ones to you are the most exciting to create? The most exciting? Like one of the ones you get really jazzed about.

The ones that kind of shatter my belief system. Like the hollow moon or the crop circles. The idea of the moon being hollow is because they shot something into the moon and it rang like a bell. Right. Right. Well, a few things. You know, one was they deliberately crashed their rocket into the moon, and there was seismology, you know, seismographs were placed in the moon to check what would happen. And it did reverberate, but mainstream science says

it reverberates because it's extremely dry, and that's why sound waves travel like that. That's what they say. But other scientists have said it seems to be, if it's not hollow, there are hollow cavities within the Moon. And why do they think that? Just the way that the sound travels and just how... There are parts of the Moon where the surface dirt is... Let me get this right.

Where the surface dirt is older than the dirt underneath. The soil on top is older. The only way you can do that is through excavation. Moonquakes. Yeah. And the moon had volcanoes on it at some point. Passive seismic experiment-sized monitors were placed during the Apollo 12 mission, remained active until 1977, recording both natural and human-made moonquake alike.

Human-made moonquake. Also, why are they doing that? Why are you trying to make moonquakes? In fact, moonquakes happen fairly regularly. A space debris-like asteroid hits the moon more frequently than Earth because the moon's atmosphere is much less dense. Right above it, it described that the Apollo 12 mission was the first human-made moonquake they detonated or they crashed the module back on the surface.

One ton of TNT. Good idea. First human-made moonquake to take place, the PSC size monitors, oh, seismometers, record the resulting vibrations which were much bigger and lasted much longer than the scientists had anticipated. They were far different from the earthquake vibrations we're familiar with. And that next paragraph said it's because the moon is 60% as dense. It doesn't mean it's hollow, but it's just different.

Right, right. So if the collision theory is true, which is the mainstream theory, then the moon was made mostly out of Earth's mantle, which will be less dense, is what. It just kind of clipped us. Yeah. But the moon is weird. Yeah. So the hollow moon one freaks you out, crop circles. Crop circles. You know, those are the fun ones. I do the government conspiracy ones are interesting

to me, but a lot of times they make me angry. So it's not really fun, but I think it's important to see people. Like the CIA stuff, MKUltra. MKUltra and Agent Orange, that stuff really makes me angry. Yeah. You know, the DARPA episode, I end up kind of losing my temper and crying a little at the end, which I didn't mean to do. And it was just in the course of the research, just that's what happens, things start to

unfold. I just wanted to see DARPA's history. And as I'm learning about it, it's like, oh, these guys did some bad, bad stuff. And then when you get to Vietnam, and you know, you got the chemical company Dow Chemical and DuPont and all this creating Agent Blue, Agent Purple, Agent Orange. And more American soldiers got sick than actually got killed in the conflict. You know, I dedicated the episode to my father-in-law who had all kinds of injuries from Agent Orange.

The government denied any responsibility for years. They finally agreed to a settlement in 1981. He applied for his benefits and the government made due. They kept their word. He got his settlement 40 years later. Jesus. And even that's never going to be enough to deal with all those health problems. Right.

So your country needs you and you answer the call. And then when you need your country, take a number. And your country needs you based on a false flag. Gulf of Tonkin. Yeah. Which is also very dark. LBG. The idea that they fake attacks to get us to go to war.

And then there's Operation Northwoods, which is a really wonky one. That was the one to get us into Cuba. That was probably the beginning of the end for Kennedy. Because I believe Kennedy put a stop on Northwoods. And Bay of Pigs wouldn't allow air support. Right, he got screwed on that. And the Bay of Pigs, that was the end. That was where Kennedy says, we need to start again.

We got to dismantle this and start again. I can't rely on my intelligence community. And Eisenhower, he talked to Eisenhower a lot. And Eisenhower gave him advice and said Watch out for the CIA Keep an eye on them because remember when Eisenhower left he gave that famous farewell address where he said beware of the military industrial complex You make war profitable. You're gonna have more war because America was never like that before, you know We kept we had a defensive military not an aggressive military forever Prophet is where the devil does his best work.

That's right. Yeah. That's right. That's from the Bible, isn't it? It might be. But that's really what it is. If evil is real, justification for evil, like if you have a compartmentalized situation like they do with corporations where you have this diffusion of responsibility because you

have a bunch of people that are all working together. Hey, it's not my, I'm just working. This is part of my job. And then you have a responsibility to shareholders to make maximum profits every quarter. And then you justify all kinds of things and you get rewarded. Great job. You did a great job, AJ. We like how you made those profits. You got a nice fat bonus. And then, you know, you drink yourself to sleep every night. My step-sister just retired from Gr Grumman she worked in top secret programs she won't tell the family what she did. Dun dun dun. She wants to live. Good keep

your mouth shut lady. Keep it shut. Lisa be quiet. I'd keep my mouth shut too. She never said a word. Why would you? No. It's not worth it. No. It's not worth it. Pension's too good. Also you don't want to die you know it's just like they's not worth it. Pension's too good. Also, you don't want to die, you know? It's just like, they get rid of people. If you're in the business of killing people, which is what military contractors are, they are in the business of killing you if you get in the business of killing people. They're like, oh, we just have to kill one more person and then we can kill a whole bunch of other people and make a lot of money? Yeah. Of course. Oh, look, he's got, he had a heart attack. Whoopsies. He fell out of a hotel window. The Frank Olsen

murder is, is taught by Israeli intelligence as the perfect murder. Which one is that? Frank Olsen was part of MPH Ultra and was starting to have second doubts about it. So they sent him to a psychiatrist who he didn't know was actually worked for Sidney Gottlieb and was, you know, into programming and he was freaking out. And he's up in a hotel room with someone else from MK and he falls out the window. But if you look at the window where he fell, it's like, you know, two feet by two feet. You can't just jump out the window. So he was found on the sidewalk by the doorman.

That's Frank Olson worth looking up. He was drug-for talking to his family afterwards. They gave him 750 grand. That's right. And it took a lot of- Not a file or claim. Right. Right, it was, be quiet.

We'll give you the money, but be quiet about it. So I mean, it's all real, and it's just... Yeah, just the stuff that's undeniable is enough to make you just go, whoa. What is happening? What is really going on behind the scenes? You know, the MVA Ultra, the testimonies from the women is really heartbreaking to watch them. You know, the sexual abuse that they endured for years at that – you know, the whatever that was, that lodge on the water near D.C. and just tortured and crazy stuff.

Operation Midnight Caller, you know that one? Which one's that? That's – it happened in San Francisco where they had agents hiring prostitutes and they... Oh, Midnight Climax. Midnight Climax, behind the two-way glass. Nuts. Nuts. Bunch of weirdos.

Tax dollars at work. Yeah. And it's because they had no oversight. No. You have ultimate power. It's all totally deniable. And it was, I think it was Nixon who banned it in 72. It might have even been 69 before he came in. They kept doing it anyway. Same with bio weapons. They were ordered by executive order to get rid of their bio weapons and it was found out years later. They were just

stockpiling them. They still had them. And you know they still do. Uh huh. Yeah. Yeah. Do you hesitate sometimes when you're doing these government cover up ones? Yes. Yes. Yeah. You know I don't want to say I'm a- Cause they're dangerous. They are. Bigfoot's not dangerous.

No, Bigfoot's not gonna hurt me. Bigfoot's a fun one. He's fun. UFOs are fun ones. Different dimensions. Fun stuff. Yeah. It's hard for me because I consider myself a patriot, very, very like pro-military, pro-law

enforcement, but also anti-war and pro-criminal justice reform. I'm very politically confused. Me too. I just like fairness and transparency, that sort of thing. Yeah, you like to think that our government's good. I do like to think that, and this journey has shown me that it's mostly not. You know, it's really mostly not, but it's a government made of men, and men are flawed and selfish, and men will hurt each other.

And there's also justifications that can be made for doing terrible things, because there's terrible people out there and you have to stay ahead. Always. Yeah. Don't become a monster when you're fighting monsters. That's exactly right. And this collateral damage is just part of it. Yeah.

So we give them a settlement, stay quiet, but this is for national security. Yeah. Great or good. What other ones have freaked you out? It's hard to say off the top of my head. MK Ultra is a tough one. I have covered Northwoods and some of those. Operation Gladio was a crazy one.

That was where the CIA was killing civilians after World War II. Alan Dulles, I'm going to do an episode on Alan Dulles, the Dulles brothers, their connection to the Nazis and all of that. That's going to be a dangerous one. What were they doing? They were killing people for what reason? So we had to fight communism, communism, communism. So they trained a secret army, a civilian army in Italy to bomb civilians and then blame

it on the communists. The communists at that time were the most popular party in Italy, you know, post-war, because they had just went through fascism, right, with Mussolini. So you just, it always swings too far the other way. So we swing way the other way. Communism very popular, can't have that. So civilians were killed in bombings by the CIA trained guerrilla army and they were trained by a Nazi general who was tight with Alan Dulles.

And this was planned during the war. While American GIs were being killed fighting the Nazis, they were already planning this next phase. But civilians died in massacres, and they blamed it on communists, and it was denied and eventually it came out. It was called Operation Gladio. Gladius is the sword of the Roman soldier. How did they kill the people?

Bomb. Car bomb. Car bomb was a big one. I think it was in Milan, but there was a few. And they were just blaming the communists, just to stop communism. Because it was a huge... Italy was a lot of turmoil. I think it was called the years of lead or the decades of lead, something like that. Because people were just getting killed all the time. I don't know how many constitutions Italy's had since World War II, but it's probably over two dozen at this point.

You know, it's a chaotic place. Wow. That's my people. It's my people too dozen at this point. You know, it's a chaotic place. Wow, that's my people. It's my people too. We're goofy. Nipale dan. Gizidishi ke fa. What about the Richard structure? You know, people ask me about that, the eye of the Sahara.

I usually say, you know what, go to Corsetti, go to Bright Insight, go to Randall Carlson. Corsetti's the most, Randall Carlson doesn't believe that that was Atlantis Right corsetti makes a very compelling case mountains to the north river to the to the south the circular Yeah, centric rings the concentric rings to the correct size Yep, the fact that there's still salt on the ground there. I want to believe it Yeah, you know and then there's like when you pull back and you get the satellite image of the surface and it looks like it was just completely deluged.

It does. Yeah. Well, we know for a fact it was deluged. Yeah. It just doesn't line up with Atlantis. I mean, Carlson has shown us how the surface of Africa was just altered by the flood. So it all lines up, but there's all these leaps that we have to make.

I enjoy making them. But on my show, I try to let people know, look, I connected some dots here. I had to fill in some gaps with a little bit of creative license. But if you're interested, go pursue it, go learn more. I want that to be Atlantis.

Yeah, it seems like Atlantis was a real place. Because, you know, once they found out that Troy was a real place, Troy was also dismissed. Yes, it was. They found out, no, Troy actually existed. It doesn't seem like any of those stories were bullshit. It seems like they were historical accounts. And the thing about Plato's writings about Atlantis, he talks about it having existed 900 years prior, which lines up perfectly with the Younger Dryas. Right, and he learned it from an Egyptian priest who learned it from someone else. So the story goes back beyond Plato, if you believe Plato, which

you can, you can believe Plato. Well, he was writing about a lot of things. And it's just so fascinating when we think of that kind of historical record keeping, that you're getting these depictions of what kind of a civilization existed thousands and thousands of years ago. Right. So with Homer's Iliad, what did they think he was writing about? A fictional place? I mean, that was this... I think I said 900 years. I meantad, what did they think he was writing about? A fictional place? I mean, that was this... I think I said 900 years. I meant 9,000 years. 9,000, right, right.

9,000 years, yeah. Which is like, first of all, how do you get 9,000 years of history 2,000 years ago? What are you even getting? Yeah. How are these stories, how are they documented? How do they pass them? How did they pass them on?

Like, who were the original people? What's the actual version of the story? Like, which one is more accurate? Epic of Gilgamesh, Noah's Ark, which, like, something seems to exist in almost every ancient civilization. They all have a flood myth. Yeah.

And, you know, Gilgamesh and Noah's Ark, it sounds, they're very similar stories. And you know, Gilgamesh and Noah's Ark, it sounds very, they're very similar stories. And there are other cultures that have a Noah's Ark story. Yeah. Yeah. That's my favorite currently. I've seen like a ton of videos. And I think Jimmy Corsetti does the best job about the Reichardt structure. But he's all in on it. Yes. And I think, like, it doesn't look natural. No, it doesn't. It doesn't. It looks like exact, but he's all in on it. Yes. And I think, like, it doesn't look natural. No, it doesn't. It doesn't. It looks like exact, and it's like, what a coincidence,

that it matches the dimensions of Atlantis, as described. And it's in the right place. So, you know, when people argue for Bimini being Atlantis, it's like, they didn't know what any of that was, but they knew what North Africa was. Right. And also, it's so close to Egypt it's so close to what we already know was a super advanced civilization that existed there's been no excavations of that I don't believe so are the resharp structure what have they done like deep 1974 was discovered this on artifacts Looking right now. So I was about to show you this isn't a great example, but there's other

This isn't it Another eye that looks similar to it in the same area interesting I said and then the comments say that there's even two or three of these well And I was reading a Stephen novella's breakdown of Jimmy's video. He says he's leaving out some known facts, like there was a canal that connected each of the circles that isn't apparent in the reshot structure. But those are the things I was just getting at right now. This looks like canals. Well, that's a different one. This isn't the reshot structure.

Right, right. Show the reshot structure. And the reshot structure is strange because the coloration is different than the rest of the... Mm-hmm. That was also the depictions of the colors of the rocks is the same. Red and black. Yeah, like that is fucking crazy. That's crazy. It is. The one guy who found artifacts said there was some stuff like out here on the outer

circles but not very many inside. Well, the question is like how big was the catastrophe and how much would be left and what would you actually see? You know, like how much was the structure altered by whatever the fuck happened? Right, so when we talk about ancient advanced civilizations, we're not talking about more advanced than us, we just mean advanced. So people will say, well, where's their plastic? Where's their...

Yeah, but it doesn't have to be the same kind of advanced. It doesn't. Combustion engines, all the different things that we've done, electronics, like we're just assuming that technology always goes in the exact same path. Whatever the fuck they were doing, whatever we know they were doing in Egypt was extraordinary in terms of their ability to core the drills, when they have these cores, like high speed drills that seem to be, if not diamond tipped, something of a similar vein that allowed them to dig into that fucking granite like that How do they generate 2000 RPMs or whatever? How could they do that? Yeah, it's all freaky man

Like the history. I mean Graham has the best Depiction he said we are a species with amnesia. That's the perfect way to say You know, it's a shame that he's marginalized, but I like that Netflix is stuck by him and yeah pumping those out Well, the facts are the facts, you know Just the the structures that he's uncovering when you're looking at Gunn and Padang, when you're looking at all these different places, when you look at, you know, just Machu Picchu, all these different places. Like, what the fuck was going on? Like, why is this stuff so complex? Why is it so fascinating? And why aren't we allowed to ask? Why aren't we allowed to investigate it?

Yeah. Remember when, when his ancient apocalypse season one came out there was a British newspaper said Graham Hancock is the most dangerous man in the world. Those guys are just dumbasses. Well they always want to connect it to white supremacy which is so crazy because Graham Hancock is the furthest from a white supremacist. He's married to a woman of color, he's like the sweetest nicest guy, he's a vegan. Of course, he's like

he never said they were white folks. No, no one says that. And who cares? I just want to know who they were. Well they couldn't be white folks because white folks don't live there. No. Like if they're Egyptians, they're Africans. Right. The Africans were the most sophisticated civilization that we have ever seen that existed at that point in time. We don't know if they're as sophisticated as we are, but we know they did some stuff back then that we're not capable of today. And that's real.

It is. And we don't know how. We don't know what technology they had. But here's the thing. If it's not from 2500 BC, but it's really from 30,000 BC, what do you think would be left? Only maybe the stone. That would be it.

That's part of the problem. I mean, steel, any kind of metal, gone. It would only take 100 years for Manhattan to be covered by vegetation. Right. A thousand years, the skyscrapers would crumble. Right. Ten thousand years, it'd allers would crumble. Ten thousand years it would all be washed away. Right. A hundred thousand years? You're not going to see jack shit.

Nothing. Nothing. Yeah. Who was that British archaeologist that we brought up the other day, Jamie, where he has this really good point that human beings have been essentially the same form for the last three hundred thousand years. Like it's not outside the realm of possibility that we have achieved very high levels of sophistication multiple times and have been knocked back down to the stone age again by cataclysmic events. Right. And that makes a lot of sense to me. That is just part of a cycle. You know, the doomsday clock is kind of a real thing. You just get to a level of technology where you just are too dangerous for your own good.

We're not sophisticated enough for nuclear weapons. We're not smart enough to have those. No. Well, that's the hope, is that that's what the aliens are here for, to go, hey, hey, hey, hey, hey. Right, because they have. Yeah, put that down. But then why did they allow just the United States to detonate 60-something bombs?

Well, here's the thing. Two of them that caused mass death, right? Hiroshima and Nagasaki. But that's also when the UFO started showing up in mass. I have this comedy club called the Comedy Mothership, and the rooms are named Fat Man and Little Boy. Okay. And the reason why is because in UFO folklore, after those bombs were dropped, that's when

the mothership started showing up. Right. Yeah. And in some tests, you can see stuff in the sky in the films. I think you can see something at Castle Bravo. Could be wrong, but there are some tests where you can see stuff in the sky. Like, what was that for a few frames? Like they were keeping an eye on it.

I hope they are. Yeah, that hope they are. Yeah, that would be nice. Please. That would be nice. Well listen, AJ, I love your fucking show. You provided me with hours and hours of entertainment. It's an awesome program.

You do a really good job. It's really well done. I don't know who's doing it with you and how you promote, how you produce it, but you guys fucking kill it. Thanks man, great team. It's a great show. The Y- It's available on YouTube four point seven three million subscribers So I'm not alone and you guys have only been around for how many years now to 2020 that's amazing five years

And you already have almost five million subscribers CIA It's a great fucking show that's what it is so I'm glad we finally did this appreciate you very much man, and if you ever got anything crazy You want to break it here? We're ready for you. I've got an episode coming out You want everybody to know about come on back. I think we probably do this a hundred times Thank you brother appreciate you all right bye everybody Thanks for watching!