The Joe Rogan Experience - #402 - Bryan Callen

Episode Date: October 9, 2013

Bryan Callen is an actor, stand-up comedian, and host of his own podcasts: The Bryan Callen Show and The 10-Minute Podcast, with co-hosts Will Sasso and Chris D'Elia.

The Joe Rogan Experience. Showing by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day. Our delicious and nutritious bulletproof coffee and my friend Brian Callen's here. Ladies and gentlemen, that's the new song. I like that song. And my friend Brian Callen's here. The podcast is, well, there's a Brian Callen podcast... Can you imagine if we had to make this is a Brian Callen podcast,

this is Fighter and the Kid. The 10-minute podcast and Fighter and the Kid. God, does the kid stop? You don't stop. I'll tell you what, you don't. Well, I get to do it with Brendan Schaub, so I love his take on fighting and then mine, and he gets so mad at me

because I just basically do all my research and ask everybody about the fights. Brendan is a bad motherfucker, dude. That submission that he hit Mitrione with, that was beautiful. That D'Arce choke was... He did eight pull-ups the other day with 125 pounds hanging from his waist. Strict pull-ups, not kipping. I believe it.

He's a serious grappler. That guy can... He is strong as shit. You know, he took a lot of heat for that Gracie match, that Matt Amoris match, because he basically just didn't engage for a while. But there were many moments in the fight where they were engaged. There were many moments where that cyborg guy had him in his guard, and he's a dangerous motherfucker cyborg,

and Brendan defended every single one of them. Sticking his hand in his throat and just stopping that cyclone guard. He stopped everything perfect. But that's a tricky game you're playing with that guy. People don't respect that. That cyborg dude is a nasty motherfucker when it comes to jiu-jitsu. His jiu-jitsu is really, really, really high level. If there's anybody who's earned the nickname cyborg just by the way they look, it's him.

I felt immediately bad about my genetic structure, about my fucking bone structure. Well, there's a few cyborgs for people who don't know what we're talking about. There's a problem. There's a bunch of cyborgs in Brazil. Okay, there's Chris Cyborg Santos, who's one of the best women fighters in the world,

really nasty Muay Thai fighter. There's her husband, Evangelista Cyborg. And then there was this guy, Roberto Abru. Is that how you say his last name? I believe it's Abru. God damn, he's nasty. He's got a crazy guard. He goes under guys and then rips their legs apart.

Ain't too bad as a takedown artist either. Well, he's a tank. He's a tank of a human. And look, Brendan didn't... He did a lot of just keeping this guy off of him. He did a lot of that. But there were many moments where he was in that guy's guard. Yeah. I think it was eight times at eight points.

Seven times went down. Okay. That's kind of – the fact that he was able to do that is very impressive. You're just grappling. Look, if they were striking, Brendan would probably – there's so many positions you wouldn't get caught in because you're smashing guys. You're hitting them with punches. Cyborg wouldn't get out of the first round, and he would know that.

Well, not only that, that whole position changes entirely. Like, the guard, everybody looks at the guard in MMA, and the guard in MMA is one thing because guys aren't hitting you, or guys are hitting you, rather. When you're in straight jiu-jitsu, the guard becomes infinitely more dangerous because you're not going to hit that guy on the bottom. So he can grab a hold of you he can do things he can be wide open and still control you as soon as you add punches it

changes 90% of the jiu-jitsu because that's when you're hanging you in the face right and now you see a lot of guys very few guys now will close their legs in MMA because you're taking away two of your weapons you know it back in the day you know you you you you the guys a lot of guys will try to stand up immediately and stuff like that. It's a, it's a very, very precarious position to be in. Really depends on your style. You know, there's still guys that attack, uh, off of their back in a full guard, like Vinny Magalhaes.

Well, look what happened. Look, look what, uh, uh, Pettis did. Yes. That was a beautiful move, man. Perfect. Old school Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. It's still relevant. Yeah.

It's still relevant. There's openings just like a right hook is relevant. The idea goes away. It's crazy. It's a wonderful move, man. Perfect old school Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu. It's still relevant. It's still relevant. Absolutely. There's openings just like a right hook is relevant. The idea goes away. It's crazy. It's crazy. They're all there. All those techniques are there.

Well, you've got Jake Shields, Damian Maia, what you're calling that. That's today. I have a point of view on that. Well, I'll tell you what, man. Damian Maia is a motherfucker at 170. You think? Look what he did to John Fitch. What worries me about Jake going down to 170

is that Jake looks unhealthy when he does it. I mean, maybe he's got that back in order, but I've seen him in the weigh-ins where I'm like, Jesus Christ. He walks a 205 or something. I'm sure. He's a big fella. He's a very strong grappler.

But at 185, he beat some dangerous guys man he put he put robbie lawler he tapped him he fought a five round fight with dan henderson that was one of the greatest comebacks in the history of dan henderson's gorilla strong from dude and dan henderson tagged him in that first round i mean tagged him like there's not a whole lot of humans that could have survived that he got hit the first round Jake Shields showed like the rarest of rare chins because Henderson connected flush on the chin and he got out of that round and started taking Henderson down I think Henderson like went into that fight with something wrong with him. Someone told me that he had back issues. So it could have been, and I'm not trying to make any excuses for Dan.

I'm sure he wouldn't have made any either. But a lot of times when you're seeing a guy in a fight like that, that's what you're dealing with. You're dealing with a guy goes in there and he's got something wrong. And sometimes they throw strategy out the window and just go after a guy. You go to your happy place you know sometimes you know you got to play it safe and you know hope that you can get through the injury when i saw damian maya um what are you talking about with jake seals when i saw damian maya control uh john fitch for that long yeah get us back and just basically ride him like that you know i think that Damian Maya is striking from what I understand is really

grown leaps and bounds and he's he's he can keep the fight on his feet and a lot of people say that he's if he does that with Jake he's going to tag Jake up but then if he goes to the ground there's nothing that suggests that Jake is going to be able to like I think his takedown rate Damian Maya's a wrestler is like 90 percent or something like he's really effective on takedowns as well so it's going to be interesting he's a very special grappler he's a very special grappler as a wrestler is like 90% or something. He's really effective on takedowns as well. So it's going to be interesting. He's a very special grappler. He's a very special grappler.

His area of improvement has all been his striking, catching up to the point where he could use his grappling more effectively. The Rick Story fight was even more impressive than the Fitch fight to me because Rick Story is fucking gorilla strong. That kid is stupid strong. And Maya got a hold of him and never let go. I mean, it was... Isn't that crazy?

The way he did it, it's just so relentless. Chasing him down, holding singles, tripping him while he's holding a single, dragging him to the mat, dragging him to the mat, dragging him to the mat, dragging him to the... And then finally he's got his back. And then once he's got your back, death! When he's got your back, death. When he's got your back, death. And you know what they're finding, and this leads to this book called The Sports Gene

I'm obsessed with right now. And a lot of people, he's a sports illustrator, I think Mark Epstein or David Epstein, a science writer. And they, why is it that say, you know, they were trying to figure out why a chess master, first of all, what they found is anybody who's going to be really good at chess, a grandmaster or a great athlete, you can almost always tell by the time they're 12 years old. And there are a few outliers.

But just by the way they behave and the way they work and stuff like that. And it's not the 10,000-hour rule actually is a very shoddy rule because some people can take 4,000 hours, other people can take 25,000 hours, other people can take, you know, 25,000 hours. It all depends. But one of the things that they found about people who master something, like great wrestlers, great judo guys, great boxers like Floyd Mayweather, is isn't even so much that they are faster or stronger. Experience, you have to have a certain hardware, what they call a hardware, like a genetic hardware. You got to be, you know, You have to have a certain hardware, what they call a hardware, like a genetic hardware.

You've got to be, you know. But experience, like a Damien Maia when he rolls, experience allows the human mind to be able to chunk information. He's able to chunk shit in larger quantities. So what he's doing is he's reading signals way before. He's reading signals that you're giving him, even tendencies, and he's able to make assumptions even if he's not aware of it. He's able to jump three moves ahead because he's making assumptions. He's already predicting what you're going to do. You're thinking about it and he can tell by the way you're shifting your weight from years of experience, oh, I've been here before, and he compensates much faster than you do. And that's the difference. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

That's a mind blower. It's a mind blower. So he's recognizing patterns before people make specific memories. He's memorized the board. He's memorized every conceivable position on that chessboard as a jiu-jitsu player. That's exactly what great chess masters are able to do. They can show a great chess master obscure games with obscure things For three seconds, and then they can read they can tell you what exactly what they get where everything was

It's really terrifying when you're rolling with a guy who's really really fucking good Because one of the things is you feel the progressions you feel like you're okay like you're trapped in his full guard. Oh shit, now he's got my arm. Oh shit, now he's locking the shoulder. Oh shit, now it's tighter. Oh shit, now I'm in fucking real trouble. It's like there's a real progression. It's not like a wild scramble where someone catches a guillotine.

It's a real... And you are dictating to an extent, whether you know it or not, what he's going to do next in the sense that when he moves you have a compensation as you compensate he's already ahead of you people will never understand that if they've never played chess

or if they've never done jiu jitsu or boxed or whatever but boxing I think there's less dimensions to it just because of the fact that it's just hands but then clearly you see a guy like Floyd Mayweather I think there's less dimensions to it just because of the fact that it's just hands. But then clearly you see a guy like Floyd Mayweather who can keep boxing against the best guys in the world and barely get hit. And the reason is exactly what they were saying is that Floyd Mayweather, when you box, you learn all the different patterns, right? There are different patterns that you learn.

Footwork here is that what he's able to do is he knows that if he, based on this pattern, he learned how, okay, you create this opening, then you step to the side and you do this. What he'll do is jump to pattern three. He'll literally anticipate. He can see that you're moving over here and he's so far ahead of you. That's why it's impossible to touch the guy. He's seeing before you throw the punch based on your body language and based on where your eyes are, he's able to chunk all that information so quickly that he is, the minute you think about it, the second you think, oh, I'm going to do this, he's already headed. He goes, oh, he's going to do this. And now his hand's up before. Well, that's so interesting because it's

hard to explain sparring, I think, to someone who's never sparred before. And to a lot of folks, when you look at it, it looks like one guy's trying to hit the guy, the other guy's trying to hit the guy, and they kind of meet in the middle and figure out who hits who and when. There's a lot of weirdness to sparring. There's a rhythm to it. It's a very strange thing. And getting him to think something and then capitalizing on, you know. Getting used to being hit, too. There's that.

You have to be able to keep your shit about you while things are flying at your face. Some people just see things fly at their face and it's really hard for them to calm down. Well, your instinct is the hands go up and your head goes down. And it takes a long time to work that instinct out of your body, being able to look, see a punch in your face, basically. Well, unfortunately, a lot of people's instincts is to actually look for the punch. They have their head straight up in the air. They're like, what's going on? They're trying to see things more clearly, so they're sticking their neck up and getting cracked.

That happens in a panic mode. You see a lot of guys in a panic mode. They'll drop their hands down. I'll never forget there was a fight in front of the comedy store one night and i don't know who started what i have no idea what was going on all i just knew is that these two guys were in this really heated exchange and one guy was a white guy and one guy was a black guy and uh the white guy went into full slap panic standing square and just literally doing this. It was so crazy.

It was so crazy. He was just, he had a full meltdown. First of all, I couldn't believe he was about to have a fist fight with this guy who clearly looked more physically strong, much larger, looked like an athlete. Yeah. You know, and so I don't know what happens. I saw the slapping and the freaking, and then a bus drove in front of him. Oh, no!

And I couldn't see anything for like, you know, 15 seconds or whatever it was until the bus was gone. And then, boom, the white guy's down flat. Jesus. So in between him flailing, he got smashed. He was completely unconscious. Yeah. On the concrete in the street.

All you have to do is get in a ring, just playing around with a guy who can actually, I always say that people, if you think you're a tough guy, get in a ring with any cruiserweight who's even an amateur, who's been boxing a long time, you won't touch him. And he'll hit you once and your whole life will change. You'll be like, I don't want to ever do this again. And guys that are really good with footwork,

they always make you feel so stupid. Because if you're a person who's never, you're going to move forward. You're off balance. And this guy is going to be moving, and you're going to be like, because if you're a person who's never you're gonna move you're off balance this guy is gonna be moving on and you're gonna be like oh you're not even there like oh Jesus like you know it's a language they had an amazing spirit experiment in this book where Major League Baseball players almost all of them are off the charts visually they have 2010 2017 vision there's almost no really great hitters there I don't think there are any who have even 2020, 20 vision. They almost all without

a doubt have vision that is off the charts. They're in the 0.1 percentile. I'm talking about all major league hitters. And the book is very eloquent about this. And so they took Albert Pujols and who, and Alex Rodriguez and some incredible hitters, like the best of all time of their generation. And one of the things they found is that when a baseball comes at you at 95 miles an hour from 60 feet away, you have to guess where it's going. You're not going to see it.

The human eye cannot register in time to actually see and hit the ball. So what great hitters do is they're able to actually see the seams on the ball. They're able to see the seams on the ball. And through years and years of how those seams are rolling and how that seams on the ball, they're able to see the seams on the ball, and through years and years of how those seams are rolling and how that pitcher throws the ball, they're able, if they're very good, if they're very good, 30% of the time, they're able to predict and start swinging

basically when he lets go of the ball. So that's why curveballs and shit work. Yes. Because they can change where the ball's going to be. They change direction, but also the way you hit a curveball if you're really great is you can see the way these guys can literally, because they have such good eyes, can see the pattern of the red strings coming at you at 95 miles an hour.

They can chunk all that information quickly enough and start swinging low as opposed to high and connect. So you have to guess. Now, they take the greatest hitters in Major League Baseball, and they take a female Olympic softball pitcher who pitches underhand. Now, the distance is about 40 feet, a little bit more than 40 feet. The ball's coming over at about 60 miles an hour, not 95 miles an hour. And she pitches underhand.

Now, these are the best pitchers, and they hit a much smaller ball at 95 miles an hour. Now, these are the best pitchers, and they hit a much smaller ball at 95 miles an hour. She struck out every single pitcher over and over and over again. Because guess what? They were novices. Because you know why? They couldn't guess. They were looking at a very different ball.

They didn't have the strings. And she was pitching underhand. So there was no way for them to predict anything. They were swinging blind. And they were as bad as you and I. How about that? That's amazing. So the more you learn, the more we learn not only about – you have to have a certain hardware, we know, as an athlete.

You are never going to be – you and I are never going to be sprinters. What? It ain't happening. Sorry. Shit. Because we don't come from West Africa. I was never a very fast runner. It was I.

We're European, dude. Short legs, it's not going to happen for us. You have much longer legs than me, though. Not really. I got a long torso. It's very unfortunate. You're a mess. I'm a mess.

It's why we go to Montana. I got seven layers on. I can't stay warm. And you're all toasty because you're built like an Inuit. I'm built like a fucking tulip. Well, I just dressed right. You were wearing cashmere.

That's true, dude, because I'm a very classy guy. You were wearing cashmere. That's true, dude, because I'm a very classy guy. You were wearing cashmere. Three layers. I was wearing real hunting gear. I was wearing Ryan Callahan stuff. I brought three expensive layers of cashmere. Wool. It's all about wool.

Wool's amazing. Yeah, wool's amazing. It's amazing that in this day and age, that's the best shit. It's like a wool blend. No shit. Even after all these years. Because if it gets wet, you want to be in wool. They say cotton kills, right?

Yeah. It does. Yeah. Yeah, you can get sweaty in the cotton, and it sticks to you and cools your body down to the point where it gets dangerous. You can get hypothermia. It's just like being wet. And it's not like you're going to take the clothes off.

You're outside frozen. Yeah. So you're fucked. No thanks. Yeah. Don't want to die that way. Wool is what's up. Wool is amazing.

And they also, in this book, they also talk about the Iditarod and different cultures of how, like, when you're closer to the equator, you want longer limbs. Why? Because it's a larger area of space for you to get rid of heat. So if you look at, for the most part, people from Africa, Kenya, for example, they have a very different structure. Their bodies are structured differently. They're also born at a much higher altitude. You're not beating a Kenyan in a long-distance race. It ain't happening.

Don't they run down animals until they die? Persistence hunting? That certainly was the – if you read Born to Run, that's certainly what our ancestors did. And that's why human beings are the best long-distance runners of any animal, period. We can run longer than any animal, any antelope, any horse. We can run for a day if you train for it, and no animal can do that. Then tell me this. Why don't cowboys ride people?

Ah, shit. I knew you were going to ask me a math question. How come cowboys ride horses and horses walk all day? I don't get it. You and your parables. This is fucking stupid. This is bullshit. Sensei Joe.

How the fuck could a person have more endurance than a horse? That might be one of the dumbest things I've ever heard in my life as a human. Well, that's what happens when you have me as a guest. I can't buy that in any way, stretch, or form. People ride fucking horses, man. Not only can a person ride a horse all day, but they're on the horse. The horse is running with a person on them.

And a pack, saddle, guns, if you're a fucking real man, if you're traveling with rifles, like Clint Eastwood in My Forgiven. And my trench coat. I can't buy that, son. No, it's actually a fact. It's actually a fact that human beings are the best long-distance runners of any animal.

How could it be better than a horse? Because a horse actually cannot run after – if you had a horse run for 26 miles, you can have a horse walk. If you had a horse run for 26 miles or 30 miles or whatever, it would start to break down. Really? Yes. And it will not do that. You can't get it to do that. Even a wild horse?

They never run long distances ever. So they're just running away from cheetahs and shit like that. Yes, they run and stop. Cheetahs. Cheetahs. Why can't a wild horse die of zebras? Cheetahs don't even kill zebras. It's so stupid.

You know why you can never domesticate a zebra? They've tried a thousand times. Their dicks are too big. Nope. That's a good question. Good answer. Good answer, sir, but you're wrong. Do you know why?

Why? They cannot. Because a zebra will bite you. That's one thing. Horses will bite you. Wild horses will bite you. Guess what a zebra will do? Hold on, and it won't let go. Oh, God. Oh, yeah. No, a zebra will hold on to you and start twisting. So, that's

a good time. Oh, my God. So, it bites you, clamps on you like a pit bull with a super long, gigantic, powerful jaw. Yep. You are never domesticating a cheetah. I mean, never domesticating a zebra. You're never riding a zebra, and they've tried even crossbreeding it with other animals. Ain't happening. They fucking hate you.

Okay? They're nasty, striped motherfuckers. Yeah. I would imagine they would be cunty. They have to be. You're out there living with fucking crocodiles to the left of you and lions to the right. Sucks. Life as a zebra. That's got to be. You're out there living with fucking crocodiles to the left of you and lions to the right. Sucks. Life is a zebra.

That's got to be the worst life ever. You can't afford an ACL tear because you don't have a year. That's funny you say that. I was in Colorado recently and I saw a deer with a broken leg. It was so sad. It was a deer, a female deer with her baby. Why is my mouth watering when you say that? Keep going.

Because you got high before the show. No, I just love venison. Yeah. The poor deer's bone was actually sticking out the bottom of its leg. And it just made me think like instantly about medical care and about being a human and how much we take for granted the ability to repair ourselves and the ability that doctors have and the ability that doctors have, you know, the ability that they have today of fixing so many ailments with the human body.

I went to Springfield. I went to the Lincoln Museum. Lincoln lost three of his children, Tad at four, Willie at 11, and then his other son at 17, both to typhus fever. And I thought to myself, the president of the United States lost three of his kids to disease. Back then that was so commonplace, and he had one child left. son at 17 on both to typhus fever. And I thought to myself, the president of the United States lost three of his kids to disease. Back then, that was so commonplace. And he had one child left by the time he died, I believe. And think about, you and I have kids, think about the misery of a

four-year-old losing a four-year-old, 11-year-old. We can't imagine it. That was the norm back then, burying a child. Why? Didn't have vaccines, didn't have antibiotics, didn't have anesthesia, didn't have medical care the way we do now, and didn't even know really what pathogens were. So when diphtheria and typhus fever and things like that rolled through, you know, this is why I get so mad at the anti-vaccine movement. Pick up a history book, pick up a history book and see what happened before we had that kind of healthcare. We owe a great deal to people like Jonas Salk and the inventors of things like the smallpox vaccine. Those were horrible. Not just diseases, but also surgery, like what they're able to do today. I mean, there's the first ever FDA approved bionic eye is ready for commercial

launch in the U.S. What? Yeah. Pull that up on my, uh, pulled it up on my, it's on my Twitter feed. I put it on there this morning. It's on CNET. Dude, we are meshing with machines. Yeah, there's a little commercial that plays before it, but it's incredible. They've been working on this bionic eye, and the first ever FDA-approved bionic eye will soon be launching commercially in the United States. The device could help tens of thousands of people suffer from a rare degenerative eye disease. So is it an actual eyeball or something? I don't know.

Oh, my God. But it's allowing people to see. I think it's something you wear like glasses. It attaches to the optic nerve or something? Oh, whoa. This is crazy. Oh, my God. This is some super cyborg shit.

Let me see. Yeah. This guy was a blind guy. Now he's moving around. Let me see. Yeah, this guy was a blind guy, and now he's moving around. This is insane. He's got these glasses on, and he's doing all kinds of different shit. This is really kind of nutty.

Let's hear this. Attorney Dean Lloyd suffers from retinitis pigmentosa, a degenerative eye disease which destroys photoreceptor cells and impedes a person's ability to detect light. This is nuts. I saw nothing except maybe I could ascertain daytime from nighttime. That was the only thing I could perceive for 17 years.

Now, a device 20 years in the making that will soon be commercially available in the U.S. is helping patients like Lloyd. A perception was sort of like a flash of light or a star that you might see in the sky. Well, now I can see boundaries and borders. The Argus II by Second Sight was FDA approved earlier this year, and patients are being screened at the 12 major U.S. hospitals chosen as implant centers. And you can hear it beeping away. The device includes a chip with an array of electrodes that's implanted on the retina and glasses with a video camera that wirelessly transmits images.

It converts that video into a 60 pixel image that then delivers electronic impulses to the 60 little electrodes in the chip that then stimulate the retina to generate a perception or message that the brain can then interpret and understand. The device doesn't restore vision but patients can detect light and dark thus identifying an object's location and movement. I walk down a sidewalk from a bus stop to my office on a daily basis and I can see where the grass comes up to a sidewalk that's like concrete color. The device is not going to enable them to drive a car or read fine prints on a newspaper, but that it might help them enjoy better quality of life.

Some patients report that they can see the outline of... But it's a start. It's a start. It's a start, you know? I know they have implants now, too, for certain things that go wrong with people's eyes. Like someone was talking about their grandmother. Was it Kathleen Madigan was talking about her grandmother driving all of her friends around

because she had her eyes fixed? Oh, yeah, you told me about that. Yeah. I'm not sure if it was kathleen um whoever it was you know we're getting close to i just can't as i'm reading this book the sports team i'm like when are they going to come up with gene doping where i can my whole body can be ridiculously fast twitch i think you're going to be able to be a zebra one day well i think it's going to be that crazy that's what craig venter says right you're going to have a brain inside a zebra's

body you could be able you could do whatever the fuck you want. Check this out. This is what I blew my mind about this. So if you take a huge guy like Alistair Overeem or, you know, Brendan Schaub, do you know how much more his skeleton weighs than, say, mine? I'm a 170-pound guy, but I, you know. Probably a lot more. Yeah? Of course.

6.5 pounds more maybe. Really? Yes. Isn't that crazy? That's it? Yeah, because you have to look at it as a bookshelf. Some people have a wider bookshelf, but actually the bones themselves are six, you know, they're a little bit wider.

The structure of your skeleton is a little bit like inches, like inches, like say three inches in leg bone is a lot, right? So now you're 6'5 or whatever. Right. But that actual scaffolding allows you to put on um i think uh i can't remember what the ratio is but like 1.1 pounds of muscle can support 11 pounds i mean a bone can support 11 pounds of muscle or whatever so are you a doctor like no but this is in the book but i was amazed at that like a huge guy only his bone structure

is only 6.5 pounds heavier i would have guessed nfl lineman yeah i would have guessed like much much heavier no the rest is bones and and the rest is muscle and tendon and tissue it's crazy amazing well that's a lot of fucking weight and muscle and tendon smashing you down with the extra six pounds yeah yeah it is it's weird though that it's only six pounds i was amazed at that i'm a wealth of information ladies and gentlemen i would have assumed it was way more than that i would have assumed it was like 50 or something crazy. No. I'm getting them on my podcast. I'm excited.

Well, body weight is a fascinating thing to me because I watch how these guys cut weight for fighting. And it's just really shocking what's possible. Like water, right? How much water you lose. Well, there's different guys do it a different way. Some guys lose all their body fat first and then they dehydrate. The discipline that it takes to get

to your optimum weight, like Damien Maia is finally at 170. For a long time, he fought at 185 and he just couldn't overpower these guys like that. He's dealing with a lot of guys that were really physically strong, like Anderson. Anderson's very physically strong, so even if he could get a hold of Anderson in that fight,

which he really had a hard time catching up. Have you talked to fighters who talk about how strong he is? He's very physically strong. It makes sense. Damien, yes. I mean, Anderson, yes. Anderson's very physically strong. You can tell in the Rich Franklin fights, when Anderson locks a hold of him with the tie clench,

it's a nasty tie clench. I mean, it's really good. And Rich Franklin's a very strong guy. And Rich Franklin, up until that fight, had never really been dominated in a fight. He had some good fights, some wins and some losses. He fought well, you know, all throughout his career. That was the first fight where it looked like he really just, he was on another level. The guy he was fighting was just on a completely different league.

And a big part of that was Anderson controlling him in the tie clinch. Controlling him and just blasting him with knees. His tie clinch is death. That's a strong guy. Plus he has one. You don't get to have that kind of one-punch knockout power and be able to submit guys with triangles as well unless you have some physical strength.

How tall is Anderson, would you say, really? 6'2". He's 6'2", not 6'3"? Maybe 6'3", whatever it says. Well, I mean, how much shorter is he than Jon Jones? Jon is not just taller. Jon's just much bigger. Yeah.

You know, even if it's a two-inch thing, that two inches is a million miles. Jon is a big dude. Well, with those long arms. Yeah. And Jon's a master at distance about using that. So if you're a smaller guy and you're dealing with a guy like John,

he's going to fuck you up at a distance that you can't touch him. Yeah. I mean, he's the master at that. If you watch his fight with Rashad Evans,

you watch his fight with Quentin Jackson, he's the master at keeping guys in the end of his shots. Right. Like, and they come at him,

nope, hands on the shoulders, pushes him off, kick to the leg, pushes him off, back to my range pushes him off back to my range back to my range back to the range where only he can hit you so he's like sniping at you and then when you come out him he just controls you and then on top of that he's got the great wrestling yeah so it's like if you actually do clinch up with them guess what he's ridiculously physically strong very technical good rest and he's a

really good fucking wrestler he He's got real skills. Plus, he'll do wild shit. You know, he'll throw dudes. He'll launch dudes through the air. People forget about that. He hasn't been doing that. You know, I mean, John was like smashing guys in the beginning of his career. Like the Dantes fight, like the first fight where Gustavo Dantes, when he was in the UFC,

he launched that dude. I mean, launched him. It was crazy to watch. He's way stronger than people think. Is that the right name? Yeah. No, he's very strong. He's very strong.

Man, that last fight was incredible. Him and Gustafsson. It was one of the most amazing fights, I think the most amazing fight I've ever seen. And that's saying a lot because you've seen a thousand fights. Yeah, I'm pretty sure. I mean, it's hard to say what's the most amazing fight I've ever seen. And that's saying a lot because you've seen a thousand fights. Yeah, I'm pretty sure. I mean, it's hard to say what's the most amazing. Yeah. But it's fucking right up there.

Well, certainly it was shocking, right? Yeah. Yeah, it's right up there. I wonder how they're going to adjust their training for this next fight. You know? That's a good question. I'm really looking forward to Junior DeSantis Kane Velasquez

fight because... Andre Guzmão. That's who it was. It wasn't Gustavo Dantes. Gustavo Dantes is a jiu-jitsu guy. My apologies. It was Andre Guzmão. That was when he first started launching people through the air. Spinning elbows. That was just a few years ago, man, which is

really weird. That was 2008. It's incredible. It's incredible. It seems like three months ago. Amazing. And I'll tell you what, man. I've seen him in some tough fights. I've seen him in some really good fights.

I've never seen anybody get that close to him as Gustafsson did. Well, the one thing I noticed when they lined up, and you and I were right there cage side, the one thing I noticed was that Gustafsson is taller than John. He's an inch taller. I was like, what are you talking were right there cage side. One thing I noticed was that Gustafsson is taller than John. He's an inch taller. I was like, what are you talking about, dude?

Yeah. You know? He's a big dude. 6'5". Dude, that guy got a lot better. He got a lot better. I think only 3.5% of Americans, I think it's that, are 6'3 or over. Isn't that crazy?

There's an inside the UFC thing they're doing about Gustafson when they showed him training uh up for the fight and the the attitude that this guy has this guy's like he's straight viking straight fucking it's all stoic straight viking dna one of the things that he said he said uh i'm never satisfied he goes the life of an elite athlete is you're never satisfied you can never be happy with what you did because then you're going to get fucked up. You know, it's like that was his attitude. Great attitude. Every day, no matter how dominant he is, like, and that was like how he seemed,

like, after his fight. Like, after his fight, he was like, you know, hey, you know, it was what it was, and, you know, John's a good fighter, and that's it. I mean, he let it go. Moving on. Moving on. Well, I think he realizes that this is the part

of a trilogy that, you know, there's no time to relax. Well, I wish he realizes that this is the part of a trilogy that, you know, no time to relax. Well, I wish they would just get right after it. I mean, I'm torn because I really want to see Glover versus John. I think that's a really interesting fight. And Glover is a fucking killer. He's a killer. That guy's dangerous.

Glover is very, very, very, very high level. He's on the Brazilian wrestling team, too. He's a wrestler as well as a judo guy. He could have easily been a world champion by now in any other weight class with any other set of circumstances. If he had been in the UFC earlier and had a chance to fight against higher levels of competition just six, seven years ago, he could have been a champion. That's no bullshit. That's legit. He had a big timetime visa issue. But if you look at the highest-level guys, who knows who's going to win when they get in there, but you all know who the top guys are. And on any given night, in a lot of circumstances, like the 170-pound division, George dominates that division. George has been beating everybody.

But the reality is he's surrounded by a bunch of murderers everywhere he turns. And at any given day, one of those guys could get him. Carlos Condon almost got him. He head kicked him and dropped him. Matt Serra got him. He was the only guy to ever really get him like that. Matt Hughes got him, caught him with an armbar back early in his career.

But when you look at the amount of murderers in his division it makes you realize how good he is oh my god I mean Carlos Condit is as good as it gets

he's even better now I know Condit's even better now he looks stronger yeah he's even better now he got that loss

made him take it to the next level he's just phenomenal his fucking last fight with Martin Kampmann he's a beautiful man I mean I watched his fight with Diaz.

I was rooting for Diaz because I love Diaz. Because Nick Diaz is my hero. I just love his attitude. And every single girl that is watching Carlos Condit, including mine, is literally doe-eyed. And I literally felt bad about myself and jealous. And I couldn't have been rooting for Condit more. And then I watched him just keep turning that corner. I was like, you got to give it to this guy.

He's like a bonafide New Mexican cowboy. He sure is, man. What a stud. He's a bad motherfucker. He's getting better, for sure. Genetically, he's got much longer legs than I do, sir. Oh, he's very tall. Yeah.

He's very tall. And he knows how to use it. And one of the things that he has that a lot of people don't talk about is his fitness. His fitness level is, like, very elite. The pace that he has that a lot of people don't talk about is his fitness. His fitness level is very elite. The pace that he can keep in a fight is one of the things that always worked with Nick Diaz, his ability to outpace guys. There's times in a fight, and if you've never fought before, it's hard to imagine, but there's times in a fight where one guy is coasting or where you sort of almost agree to coast

or where everybody relaxes the aggression a little bit, like in a tough fight. A 25-minute fight is an eon. Yeah, because you don't go 100%. You have to pace yourself. Well, Nick Diaz can go just a little bit faster, a little bit longer, and he can go round after round after round.

He could do 30 minutes of MMA. It's called doing triathlons. Exactly. It's called long training or overtraining. It's not overtraining. No, no, they call it long training. Yeah, his endurance is insane. I mean, it's insane. So he would just get on guys like a guy like Paul Daly just get on him and stay on him. Just go after him, talk shit. It's one of the reasons the old school boxers, the coaches, would have you run for an hour and a half slowly, not long. They keep your heart rate up at a certain level. It's kind of like triathlon training. Back in the day, as a boxer, they would make you.

If you're fighting a 15-round fight, good luck. They would make you literally run for an hour and a half to two hours. And it wouldn't be long running. It wouldn't be hard running, but it would be running. Right. And they never really found a substitute for that particular kind of training for for fighting because it it puts you into a cardiovascular state you know where where you will you will be able to sustain for for a long time and man just having

been a wrestler six minutes is is an eon nine minutes in college freestyle is a nightmare um i can't imagine 15 i can't imagine 25 minutes when you're mixing and punching, kicking. You truly have to be a freak. And even being able to, your VO max being, some people just either have it or don't. That's another genetic thing where you can either use oxygen more efficiently when you're boxing, wrestling, cycling, running. Some people just convert oxygen in a much more efficient manner into their red blood cells than do other people. So your VO max can be worked on for sure. And you can, you can increase your cardiovascular, but some people just have a jump on it, you know, like depending on what your genetic makeup is.

So like when, you know, there's a really funny Bill Burr bit where Bill Burr went on Conan O'Brien and was talking about Lance Armstrong. Have you ever seen it? I loved it. I loved it. Pull that shit up. Pull that shit up. Let's play that because it's hilarious.

I love Bill. Because it's so fucking true. Bill Burr on Conan talking about Lance Armstrong. It's genius. Yeah. Come on, sociopath. Bike. Yeah.

Well, it's, his take on it is so dead on. Like, they're all on drugs. Everybody was on drugs. Like, my friend and your friend, you know the guy, we don't have to say his name, who was a pro cycler at one point in time. He knew about this. He's always said this, like way back in the day. He was like, look, they're all on trucks. He goes, I was on it. Everybody on the team was on it. He goes, you would hear

guys get off the bus in the middle of the night and unrack their bike because they had to go running because their EPO was making them fucking crazy. God. Yeah. Whatever it does, it makes your heart beat funny and you start feeling weird. You're basically gumming up your fucking, you gotta blow out some

blood. Yeah, that's exactly right. That's exactly right. And my problem with Lance Armstrong was that, not that he even did drugs, but that he destroyed other people who accused him of doing drugs and brought lawsuits and everything else. Yeah, he used his influence and money to do harm to people. He's a bad guy. And people who were calling him out on it were calling him out because they wanted everyone

to be, you know, at a certain point in time. Well, they were also subpoenaed. Some of them were subpoenaed. Some of them didn't have a choice. They were brought up on, you know, when the U.S. government's going, you know, you better tell the truth. You're going to jail. You're going to tell the truth.

And the argument against it, or the personal freedom argument, I don't think really works in this one, because I think you have to know exactly what everyone's doing to find out if it in fact is safe. Because when you're dealing with, this is an extraordinarily dirty sport, extraordinarily dirty, like perhaps 90 plus percent of the top people and a hundred percent of the winners are doing something. They're taking blood out of their body. They're putting it back in their body. That's super common. They like to do that one. They like to use EPO, which does the same thing through a chemical. They're all on testosterone.

It's actually been argued that it's safer to do the Tour de France. Notice I say France. It's beautiful, right? That's amazing that you just did that. I never would have expected you to do that that's awesome the tour de france it's like i said notre dame one time i said another name the this one doctor

was saying um that it actually might be safer to do it on the drugs than to do it off because it's such a strain on your body when you do it without the reserves they're talking about like it's all about your ability to recover from what you're putting out and how much can you put out and how much can you recover and how well do you know your body? Well, at a certain point in time, these guys are in their late thirties and they're recovering like young pups, like 18 year olds. You ever see an 18 year old get a scratch?

It's gone tomorrow. It's not true. They just heal up. They're like the Wolverine. Yeah, they're healed. Well, do you remember how hard your dick was always hard when you were 18? God. Those levels of hormones are never reached again.

I never forgot one time I was thinking about this girl. I was young. I was 23. I was in New York. I was on my way to theater class. And I'm walking down like Lex. And I'm just thinking about this girl. And I start getting the fucking chubby as I'm walking.

And I was wearing these pants. And I hear this big, very gay black man go, oh, he got a hard on. And he started walking. This is in New York? Yes. And he started walking along with me and kept looking. He had packages in his hand. He kept looking, going.

And he was just so into me. And I was like, I got to get this thing down right now, and I got to get out of here. He followed me for a block. Yeah, gay guys will hit on you just like guys will hit on girls. He got a huddle. Like, everybody who thinks that because someone's gay, I've actually been talking about this on stage, that they're automatically going to be nice, you're crazy.

Like, that's a person. Goddamn right. Everybody should get their first, you know, blank slate. I agree with that. Gay, straight, black, white, Asian, whatever. Whatever, whatever, whatever. Who cares? You're a person.

The rest of it is a complicated human being. Yeah. The rest of it gets real freaky. Just because you suck dicks doesn't mean you're awesome. Fuck no. Nor does it mean you're that nice or that he won't tackle you at the knees. Yeah, there's a lot of weird people out there, period. I'm sure there are guys, you know, that look at you and go, you know, there are probably, there are gay rapists, like there are straight rapists.

I mean, it all, the whole human spectrum exists within whatever you are. It has to. Yeah. I mean, if there's bad people, there's bad people in every single walk of life. There's all sorts of possible combinations of people, how they turn out. But, you know, those days, those hormone days of the 18, like, I look back on that sometimes. And I'm like, how was I ever expected to make decisions for myself back then? I was this crazed, hormonal mess,

as was everyone I was friends with. You have the greatest metaphor I've ever heard in my life. One of the greatest bits I've ever actually in my life seen anywhere. To me, what it's like for a guy to have a hard on when he's younger is like like you're in the back of a bus and somebody else is driving that bus and that whole bit you did to me top five greatest bits of all time i don't have that on anything you don't no oh my god you're crazy that's a genius bit that's like that's a bit i got a lazy with and i sort of abandoned it i would have it and i'd let it go that blew blew my mind. That was literally so inspiring I went home and I started writing. It's funny because that bit

was a bit that would work really well or there was too many dance moves in it. That's what Tom Segura calls it when you're jazzing up a bit. Whatever, dude. You're physical but that thing, I don't care how many dance moves you do in that. Anybody doesn't think that's genius. And by the way, it may just be that it's so good people are actually just watching.

Because I wasn't even laughing most of the time. I was just watching it so fascinated with the metaphor and how you were doing it that I was just like, this is the greatest thing I've ever seen in my life. I'll put it on the next special. You know what? Give it to me. I'll put it on. It's too late. Come on. Don't be a baby. Just give it to me. I want to do it on my next special.

Which I'm shooting in January, I think. Where are you going to shoot it? I think, I don't know yet, but I have an offer to do it down in Orange County. Oh, cool. Yeah. But, you know, we'll see. I'm trying to do way more comedy clubs than- It's the greatest, man.

Yeah. I've been, the last couple of weeks, I've been doing, I did a bunch of the improvs. I did Brea, Ontario. I did the Comedy and Magic Club. I'm doing all these club dates. I'm having so much fun, man. It's really like the shows are, the intimacy

of the room is something I'm really in love with again. I was in Springfield, Illinois, which is I'm sorry to everybody from Springfield. It's not a place you'd go for really anything. How rude.

No, but the people are great because they all grew up together. They all know each other since fifth grade, so it's a really great community. So they're all just fucking each other, right? Great crowds.

Good luck. Yeah, yeah. Sneak tip. Everybody around town. Just banging. People that fucked in high school and now you're married to somebody else

but you live down the street. There's a lot of drinking. Walking the dog. What are you doing? Drinking? Well, the problem is they all complain about the fact that you can't get away with anything because everybody knows you so you have to be on your best behavior all the time you can't be anonymous which was really interesting so it's like a small-scale model of the future

internet that's exactly right it's like a giant facebook yes everybody's banging everybody everybody knows it everybody's watching everything you do. But I was thinking that I love going on the road like that because you have these intimate experiences with a bunch of strangers and because there's not a lot to do, I'm sitting there writing the whole time. It's interesting, too, when you're talking about that, about this

small town and everybody knowing everybody. You know, Dr. Chris Ryan, who I've had on this podcast for, the guy who wrote that book, Sex at Dawn. Oh, yeah. When he talks who we've had on this podcast before, the guy who wrote that book Sex at Dawn. Oh, yeah. When he talks about promiscuity and primitive cultures, which is basically fact, okay, what they're basing it on is almost the same thing as a small town. It's everybody knowing everybody.

They're in these small groups. Everybody knows everybody, and everybody fucks everybody. That's right. And it happens all the time. Everybody does, right? It happens all the time. That's what happens when you get down to a group of 50 people. And they've found that even as crazy as it sounds, that small groups of people that are involved in dangerous situations, they turn to wife swapping, like fighter pilots. Wow. Fighter pilots on a regular basis wife swap. Cops wife swap.

Really? Yeah, because they love their wife. And if they're dead, they want someone else to love their wife too. That makes total sense to me. And they want to be there almost while it's happening. You introduce someone to your wife, she's a really special person. He's almost accepted a new reality. And that reality is, my lights are going to shut out any second now dude i'd way rather have you married my wife and raising my kids than anybody else i know that's that feeling

you know what i'm talking about that's that feeling that's that feeling is that you would know that i could trust you could trust me and you know or vice versa i could trust you that's life man that's what people do when they get to small groups. They bond up, and they breed with each other in order to form love bonds. That's so interesting. It's more about love than it is about being a freak. And the weird thing about that word promiscuity is the original origin of the word means mixed. Mixed sex.

Sex with you, sex with her. They were fucking each other. They were having gay sex. Like, a fucking each other. They're having gay sex. Like a lot of people throughout history were having gay sex. That's absolutely fact. And that's one of the interesting things about, look, I'm just talking here. I'm not advocating gay sex, but what I am saying is it's very strange that in groups of men, when men were warring and when they were off fighting in wars and disappearing together and through the woods for six months, they were out banging each other and killing each other.

I mean, they weren't just killing each other. Yeah. They were banging each other, too. That was the idea behind the Spartans or a lot of cultures that separate men and women for a long time. There's a great deal of, because guys are fucking animals, right? Yeah. You you see some dude is smaller and kind of effeminate and you're like i'm gonna fuck that guy today you know well they didn't just do that they also formed love bonds because they knew that they were most likely going to die i think when your reality gets radically altered

like you're in a situation like a fighter pilot is or like a person who's perhaps going off to war you're dealing with a very real scenario of the end of your life. It's really funny. My buddy is one of these CIA paramilitary guys, a real badass, and he works with all the special forces guys, right, like the Delta guys and the SEAL Team 6 guys. And they were all up in arms. He was in their barracks in one of these groups,

what they call a CAG, a combat action group. I love how they break everything down in three letters. Oh, yeah, CAG, CAG. And these guys are like a real badass, like a triple nickel A-team, whatever. And they're all like these guys, and they're all complaining about the don't ask, don't tell,

like gays in the military. And meanwhile, he looked at him and he was like, you guys have Trojan call names, you shave your forearms, you guys are wearing vests and nothing underneath. If you could, you would frost your hair, but there's no frosting area. And by the way,

you guys are literally spotting each other's hips as you're doing slow grinding pull-ups, oiling your muscles down. This is the gayest. There's not a girl within fucking five miles. You guys have your appendant area because you're all top secret. This is the gay, you guys have your appended area because you're all top secret.

This is the gayest community I've ever been a part of. It's like the, and all like really good looking, young, muscular shit dudes who have names like Spartacus

and Achilles. Okay, break it down worldwide in this day and age. Yeah. How much gay sex is going on during times of war? Is it 50% of gay sex? I know that if I was in a foxhole or a prisoner of war camp with you, I would probably, I

go, dude, you smell like such a man. Let me clean your back. Let me scrub your back down. You're all dirty on your back area. A few months, you just give up. That's it. You're out there in the woods. I've just never been attracted to a dude

is the only thing. It would have to be a radical changing of your... It's like when you start eating squirrels. Like, okay, we're trying to stay alive here. We're eating squirrels. I'll eat a squirrel right now. I'll just nip his tail off. Shooting rats. Some parts of the world actually, they eat squirrels on a regular basis.

Squirrels are actually delicious. In prison, though, I mean, there are a lot of groups that stay pretty. I don't think there's a lot of, you know, they say that if you're in a gang, you're pretty much not fucking each other. Those dudes aren't fucking around. I don't know about that. I don't either. I don't want to say anything either.

I don't know. Yeah, I don't want to either. I don't know. You know, I've always just joked around that, like, it's a weird thing that humans just morph like that. They morph and they just decide, okay, now I'm gay. Well, you ever notice men, when you get close to a guy, if you're on a wrestling team or you're on whatever you are, if you watch MMA guys in the back when they're about to go to a fight, they're hugging and kissing each other. There's a deep, deep bond that's formed with training and then going to war together like that.

And they're kissing each other. That's not gay, bro. That's not gay. No, it's not. But I'm saying that there develops a very deep kinship bond. And if my dick falls in your mouth, that, in my opinion, is getting ready for a fight. That does not mean.

Well, the idea would be that they would fight harder for their lover. That would be the idea. The idea would be that they would fight harder for their lover. You know, that would be the idea. The idea would be that they would fight. Well, look, Achilles from Homer, Achilles, the greatest warrior of mythological times, his lovers killed. He had a lover. He had a male lover. Alexander the Great had his best friend and lover. He killed him apparently when he was drunk in a drunken rage.

But that was his lover. A lot of the great fighters and warriors traditionally were gay. Yeah, it's amazing. Why did Alexander lose his temper? He'd only killed a few thousand people before then. Weird that he killed that guy he fucked too. He'd only conquered the world. I mean, how many people did he kill with his own hands?

Well, they don't have anything about that, but they do know that he was so strong. He could be in a full suit of armor and jump up on his horse. He was a short guy, but he was very powerfully built. What? Yeah. He could jump up onto a horse? He could literally launch himself onto his horse. A lot of legendary stories about his physical strength.

That sounds like a crock of shit. He was very strong. He was very squat and thick. Yeah, yeah. Fuck that, dude. Big, big, big. Like two small Pajaras type? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

That kind of build? That's what I believe. Just short, gorilla-like? You see his two small Pajaras type. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That kind of build. That's what I believe. Just short, gorilla-like. You see his shoulders? Pajaras? Yeah. You know, he went down to 170 for tonight's fight? I don't know how.

He looked like death. He looked like death warmed over. Really? Yeah, but looked fucking shredded. Pull up an image. Paul Hares Weyan. P-A-L-H-A-R-E-S. Paul Hares Weyan. You see him at 18-H-A-R-E-S, Paul Hares Weyan.

You see him at 185. He looks like this giant He-Man, and now he's still really muscular. Yeah, he's my weight. I'm walking at 170 right now. I can't imagine that. He's shredded, shredded. And then he's going to rehydrate. He'll probably be at least 10 pounds plus heavier tomorrow.

So he must have just dropped his body weight. Explain how you were saying that the way a lot of guys lose weight, they'll drink a lot of water and then – That's how you lose the water weight. There's a lot of shit that has to happen. You have to get down to a certain target weight before you can lose the water weight. Like if you're – like say if you're a big, strong guy like Paul Jarares, there's a lot of extra muscle going on there.

And there's only one way to get rid of that extra muscle. Lose the muscle. You have to do it slowly or you have to make sure that when you're eating, you're taking in less calories than you need. If you take in less calories than you need, your body starts to eat itself. Oh, so you actually have to do – you do have to restrict your calories that way. Certainly. There are guys who have to do that. It depends on how big you are and how much, you know. It's also like how did you get that big?

And are you still doing whatever you were doing to get that big? You know, like what are your hormones? Are they being manipulated? Are they natural? There's a lot of variables because the assumption always is that someone is innocent until proven guilty. So the assumption is always that you're not doing anything unusual. But when you see, like, a fucking super strong muscular guy like that, you always have to remember

that there have been people that have been caught doing drugs. There have been many, many, many, many ones. And in fact, one of them was Paul Harris. He got caught with elevated testosterone levels. So I don't know who he is, and I don't know who isn't. That's what he looks like now.

God. Shredded. I mean, that's... But when he got onto this, like, he looks okay right there. I imagine that's before he had his full body drain. Your body's not that different, my friend. How tall is he? He's like my height, probably, maybe even shorter than me.

He might be 5'7". He's such a tank, man. I've never seen a guy that's that successful, that well-built. That's not a normal frame for an MMA fighter. No, that's a bodybuilder. He's got to get back to his jiu-jitsu, man. That guy's jiu-jitsu is fucking ridiculous. He's ridiculous.

There's videos of him rolling with guys that are really high-level guys. That's what he used to look like at 185. Yeah, he's a freak. Well, he's got this ability to launch himself onto a submission that you can't stop. He gets a hold of your leg, and he just yanks and spins, and it's like a crocodile got a hold of your leg. You're fucked. He just rips that shit apart.

Yeah, scary. Because his jiu-jitsu is very high level. It's not just that he's super, super physically strong. Yeah. There's a video of him rolling with some pretty high level guys. And he takes this guy down, drops him, side control, spins, gets his back, and chokes him. All in like, he's a very high level guy. He's rolling with all in 30 seconds.

Mayhem. He runs through. There's a thing of him putting mayhem in an armbar. Yes, yeah. I talked to Mayhem about that. He was like, well, I was drunk as shit the night before, so he said he's still a badass. I'm sure Mayhem was, but who wouldn't lie about that?

No. But Paul Harris is a beast. Yeah, he's a beast. He's a beast. He's a beast. His leg locks are fucking things of nightmares. Yeah, Nate Marker, when he fought him, I was talking to him way before he fought him,

and he said the guy's got nasty leg locks and all he did was drill how to get out of those leg locks. Yeah, and the guy was pointing to Nate's legs as if Nate had oil on them.

Yeah, that was weird. No, I broke a sweat. Yeah. It was smart. That's what you do. You break a sweat. You get really sweaty. You don't have to be oily.

If you're just sweaty, that's good enough, man. Exactly. So they checked his legs and they're like, nope, there's nothing on there. That was a really weird thing where he pointed and then he got, and then Nate

just jumped on him. That's him getting Ivan Salivary. That's his first fight in the UFC. He took Ivan Salivary's back like a ghost. God, you better start tapping. He takes their back and then he fucking throws that armbar over the top. Oh my god. Yeah, he's nasty, man. Oy yi yi. That's a beautiful submission. So that's what I'm saying

about Pajara. He's not just but then he's fighting that dude Mike Pierce you know that's happening today that's today in South Brazil Mike Pierce is a motherfucker dude that guy's a motherfucker he's got a head like a fire hydrant his heads that wide he punches holes through people's faces he's tough as shit he's a a fucking really strong wrestler, like really high level. He's an attacking wrestler. Very, very aggressive wrestler. And his game

up against the cage, like dropping punches in on dudes, is very high level. He can get guys, control them up against the cage, beat the shit out of them. Get their hips up in the air and just start pounding them. He beats the shit out of you and then takes you down a few times, beats the shit out of you some more, but he can knock you out with one punch.

Yeah. Like, he's got one-punch KO power. I don't want to hear that, yeah. He's an animal. So if Paul Hares, it's all, like, there's a lot of questions, like, how much did Paul Hares lose in getting down to 170? How much does he have left in the tank?

Because if you lose that much weight, it's very possible that you did it wrong. Or it's very possible that it wasn't really attainable goal within the time period he tried to attain it in and so unless you get an expert like a Mike Dolce type guy to go over your weight cut with you like body fat measurements water who's my doctor Mike Dolce is a guy used to fight and he was in the ultimate fighter and then since then he's gone on to be like a fitness consultant for fighters but he's very knowledgeable and be like a fitness consultant for fighters.

But he's very knowledgeable, and very knowledgeable about cutting weight. The guys who he's trained with that have listened to him and have cut weight because of his methods have come in in vastly better condition than they did when they were doing it on their own. He's just an expert. A guy who knows where your body's at, knows how to give you the right nutrients, knows how to cut the things out that are going to make your body's at, knows how to give you the right nutrients, knows how to give you – cut the things out that are going to make your body naturally lose weight and keep unhealthy foods. What are the guidelines for the USC?

There he is. That's Mike Dolce. Very good dude, too. I actually think I've met him. What are the guidelines for testosterone replacement therapy or hormone replacement therapy? It's a very good question. It varies by commission. It varies by country. So you can have a certain number of nanograms per unit of blood of testosterone?

The problem is, this is a bunch of problems, but the problem is, first and foremost, that it's very variable, meaning that if you take it, your levels between today and tomorrow, You take it, your levels between today and tomorrow, where they're going to be at, depends entirely on when you injected it. It depends entirely on what kind of stuff you put in your body, what kind of testosterone. It depends entirely on whether or not you've injected it or whether you apply it to your skin. A lot of people just apply it to their skin. So with all those variables, there's a lot of room for fuckery.

So what you could do is you could start it out. I'll give you a way to cheat. Start it out where you take the needle every week, and you're only allowed to get X amount per week. But then every time they're going to test you, they're going to give you a certain amount of knownness. They can't just show up. The only people that can just show up are VEDA, VEDA testing, or WADA, or WADA, or VADA. Either one of those. There's two different organizations. And I think both of them do that random thing

where they wake you up at eight o'clock in the morning and test you. Yeah. So the problem is, if you're willing to gamble, the way you gamble is you shoot what you're supposed to shoot and then you rub cream on top of that so you have the level that's like really uh hard to drop which is the injectable level the injectable level stays that level for a very long time apparently like if you take it your your level it'll be in your skin you be in your system at a certain level testosterone yeah testosterone it for it's like a slide or six days yeah it's like five or six days the cream only lasts 24 hours so you put the cream on your body absorbs it and that's a wrap yeah so in other words you would put you if you were inject it why would the cream on top of that, wouldn't that spike your testosterone even more?

Depends on whether or not you're going to get tested. If you can get tested that day. Like say if you wake up in the morning and you know for a fact there's no one who's going to test you today. You could rub that cream on your body, work out, and then conceivably the next day. You're back down to. Even when you show up at the gym, they come in and test you. You're okay. But meanwhile, you have more than the prescribed amount of testosterone cycling through your system.

And you're using that extra testosterone, that extra human level of testosterone as a performance enhancer because you're recovering in between fights. Even if when you fight, you are fighting and you pee after the fight at a level that's acceptable. What was your level throughout the camp? That's what we need to know. And it's hard to tell. You can have random ones. This is all going to be such ancient history in about 10 years anyway, because with gene doping and when they can pinpoint and they can kind of like block a certain amount of myostatin, et cetera, and things in your, in your genes and it's safe and it's safe. Now the question becomes, why is it illegal? Like now it's just a question of who has the best geneticist, who has the best doctor to compete. It's really an interesting thing, what it says about competition

now, as we learn more and more that, that winners have to have a certain hardware, and then the software is training and stuff. But without the hardware first, without the mainframe, you're fucked. Yeah, John Jones has a Ferrari body. Correct. There's no getting past that. No. Your stupid-ass Volkswagen diesel that you have there is never going to beat a Ferrari. It's like this guy in the—

Unless the Ferrari breaks down. This is true. That is just like in the racing. There's a guy named Stefan Holm who is one of the greatest high jumper, and he's 5'11". Stefan Holm? Yeah, he's a Swedish guy, 5'11". He became obsessed with high jumping, but only was 11. Most high jumpers are 6'7".

Really? Yes. And he trained and trained and trained and trained. And he became so good. And I think he's won, look him up, but I think he won an Olympic gold and several and train. And he became so good. And I think he's won, uh, look him up, but I think he won an Olympic gold and, uh, several world championships. His Achilles tendon on his jumping foot is, can withstand, it would take 1.8 tons to pull it apart. Like it's, it's literally the hardest. It's three times harder than a regular man. Imagine if that was your dick.

Yes. Yes. You could hang telephone. Just be wrecking it, dude. And so he's training, training. Is this the kid? Yeah, that's him. Now, when he jumps, his head almost touches his heels. That's how flexible he is, right? How long is he? He does this. How long ago did he do this?

Record. I don't know. You see how he touches his face like that? Yeah. He has a ritual. He puts his shoes on the same way, everything, right? Oh, no, he doesn't really. Yeah, and he jumps.

Look at how high he jumps, right? That's insane. Yeah, it's ridiculous. He's like a cheetah. Uh-huh. Now, that came from years and years of training. That's insane. And everything else.

Show that again. And he's jumped more than anybody in the history of high jumping. This is insane. Look how he flies. Yeah. And you see how flexible he is. That thing is tall, man. It's 7'8".

Look at that. That's incredible. 7'8", or 7'9", or something. He's got, you know. Wow. He looks crazy as fuck, man. Yep. Imagine dating that guy.

Yeah. So along comes this guy from Barbados or something. He's Canadian. He's this Barbadian guy. And he's like six, like five or whatever. And they were talking and he was saying, he was talking about, he was like dunking a basketball. Like he was just dunking in crazy ways. And he really didn't play much basketball.

He was just jumping. And so he starts talking to this high jumper who says something to the effect of, you know, yeah, but high jumping is different. He goes, I bet you I could jump like over that thing. And it was 6'5 or 6'7 or 6', you know. So before the day's over, after like four jumps, he jumps, he clears 6'8, 6 feet 8 inches with no technique, literally jumping over it. So the track coach comes out and goes, that's not possible. Now, what are you talking about? And he goes, come.

And he goes, wait, he's jumping 6'8", never jumped. That's not possible. I love how you dramatize these like it's an ABC after school special. You put in the dialogue. You got it, dude. You have a guy with a different voice. It's not possible. You got to delineate the characters, man.

I see what you're doing. He says, it's not possible, Rock. It's no way. There's no way. And he goes out there and sure enough, this guy jumps. I think in eight months

of practice, and this guy, Stefan Holm, has been practicing his whole life. In eight months of practice, and he didn't practice much because he didn't really want to.

He's like, whatever. He won the world championships. He jumped eight feet or he cleared eight feet or something crazy. That's insane. Yeah, something insane. Never been done.

Eight months. Actually, plateaued. Never been done, eight months. Actually plateaued, never got better because he just didn't really want to train much. But he had an Achilles tendon apparently that was like two times longer than the average person. Just born with a certain symmetry. Wow. Just certain mechanics. Yeah, where he was able to jump. And so no matter how much you trained, some people are going to jump and run faster and swim better. Mechanics are gigantic.

One of the really gigantic ones is punching power. The mechanics of punching power, like the natural-born punching power. There are certain guys that are great, great fighters. But they just—perfect example, Wayne McCullough. Wayne McCullough is a great fighter a multiple time champion and and a really cool guy on top of that he's uh i've met him a million times hanging in vegas and he's a super super good guy wayne mccullough was a bad motherfucker he's calling the pocket rocket and his his number one issue was that he couldn't knock guys out with one punch.

He was a volume combination, very technical fighter. Like a Bisbee or something. But very relentless, relentless boxer. Just really excellent. If you wanted to learn how to box, you could watch one of his bouts. Wayne McCullough is a style that you could emulate and be, like, incredibly successful. He was a beautiful fighter. And, you know, that kind of a guy, there's no way they're going to have

that sort of Tommy Hearns power. Right. Like, Tommy Hearns had this insane whip power in his right hand that you cannot teach a guy. And you either have that or you don't. Wayne McCullough is a brilliant, brilliant fighter. But the difference between what he could do

with one punch and what Tommy Hearns could do with one punch is like the difference between getting hit with a pebble and getting hit with a fucking nuclear weapon. Or getting hit. A better example is Is that McCullough right there? Is that McCullough? Oh, that's Wayne dominating this dude.

He's an animal, man. He was an amazing fighter. Show some of this. We got such shitty resolution. What's with the gross music behind that? Is there a soundtrack to this thing? Yeah. Wayne McCullough was an animal, dude.

He would just get on top of dudes. These fucking Irish fighters, man. Oh, man. Savages. Yep. Barry McGuigan, he was a savage, too. Savages. So tough. Tough fucking guys. Look at him moving his head, always stepping, always stepping. Savages. Barry McGuigan, he was a savage too. Savages. Tough fucking guys. Constantly. There's no breaks for you son. No breaks for you son. Every round was him punching you

in the face. He would just wear on motherfuckers. Tiny guy too, right? He doesn't have a very large frame. But those kind of guys, he'll hit you a bunch of times, but he'll just continue to hit you at that. I mean, he could certainly knock me out if he punched me in the face clean. No doubt about that. But what I'm saying is the difference between what he can do and a guy like Mike Tyson could do. You can't teach that.

Mike Tyson could murder people. If you go back to when Mike Tyson beat Michael Spinks and he fucking hit him with that hook to the body and dropped him. Spinks said, what happened? He didn't even know what happened. Spinks got up and then he uppercutted him through the ropes. It was just boom, son. I've never seen anybody hit like him. It was ruthless, man. It was

ruthless. He could just smash you with one shot. Some guys can do that. Some guys just can't. They can't. They never will be able to. They just do not have the ability to knock a guy out with one shot. It's that speed, too. His ability to turn his body like that. It's just so

ridiculous. The fights that I would have loved to have seen, if you could give me a machine that would allow me to watch fights throughout history and see who would beat who, I would take the prime Mike Tyson versus everyone. That's what I would take. I would take the prime Mike Tyson versus everyone. That's what I would take.

I would take the Tyson package, please. I'd go back and see Tyson fight Jack Johnson. I want to see Tyson fight Jack Dempsey. I want to see Tyson fight Larry Holmes in his prime. Frazier. I think Holmes would have beaten him. No, no, no, no. That incredible jab.

Don't get crazy. That jab he had? Don't get crazy. He was still pretty fucking good when Mike Tyson put him to sleep after two rounds. Larry Holmes was still pretty fucking good back then. Tyson was something special. And Larry Holmes was a great, great, great boxer. No doubt about it.

It would have certainly been much more competitive. If you got the Larry Holmes that fucked up Jerry Cooney, if you put that Larry Holmes in with Mike Tyson, that's a different Larry Holmes. Yes, it is. By the time they fought, Larry was 36 years old. He had a long career. He was such a good fighter. He's in the pantheon of great fighters, Larry Holmes. Yes, it is. By the time they fought, Larry was 36 years old. That's right. He had a long career. He was such a good fighter. He's in the pantheon

of great fighters, Larry Holmes, without question. Well, his boxing is some of the best heavyweight divisions ever had. He was Muhammad Ali's

sparring partner. If you watched that movie When We Were Kings, Larry Holmes is his number one sparring partner. Have you ever seen him? Yeah. And in a lot of ways,

Larry Holmes, in history, doesn't get the respect that he's due because he came after Ali. Yeah. And he was the guy who beat up Ali. Yeah, that's right. When he beat up Ali, people never forgave him for that.

And meanwhile, he knew Ali so well, they'd been sparring partners. Yeah. And those last days of Ali, those should be the last days of Ali's career should be followed by every boxer very close with a fine-tooth comb. So this is Larry when he had already. But you know what? Here's another another thing here's the real deal larry did not face the kind of opposition that mike tyson did he just didn't yeah he just didn't yeah you know larry fought a lot of good guys but his division was particularly weak and when tyson came along it was like pinklin thomas tony tubbs all these guys, all these guys that were very good fighters, but they just weren't like this motherfucker.

Look at how fast Tyson was. He was scary as shit. And his footwork was amazing too. Look at this. And he just had to hit you once. And he was so good at that bobbing and weaving style. He got lazier as he got further away from the custom model training. When the custom model died, they said that was the beginning of the end.

Well, also left Rooney. When he left Rooney, you know, those guys had a falling out. I love that peekaboo style. He got away from that style. And he also got away from someone who's not bullshitting him. And that's what happened.

And that's where he went from being the greatest in the world to like slowly but surely getting beaten by guys. And then the Buster Douglas fight, which is like the perfect storm. Douglas comes guys and then the buster douglas fight which is like the perfect storm douglas comes in and douglas his mother just died and he did not give a fuck and he wasn't scared at all he lost his mother so just came in and boxed the shit out and a huge man by the way yeah like i was watching him jab tyson and t Tyson's head go back like that. Yeah. You see Tyson's head snap back as Buster Douglas is just throwing those amazing jabs. Dude, Buster Douglas in that fight put on one of the greatest performances in boxing history.

It was brilliant. It wasn't just brilliant because he was fighting Mike Tyson. It was brilliant, period. It was a tremendous fight. He finally fought up to his potential. Buster Douglas was always a talented guy that was kind of a little lazy, but not in this fight.

In this fight, he fought like a fucking king. He hooked off the jab better than anybody I've ever seen in the heavyweight division. And look how big he is, too. The way he hooked off the jab, though, dude, I mean, it was really like Ali-esque. I mean, it was beautiful. He was firing the jab though dude i mean it was like really like ali-esque yeah i mean it was beautiful he was firing the jab and hooking off it and the fucking power bomb left hook that starts

this off watch this shit look at this jabbing just tagging him tagging him look at that look at that left boom he catches him with that right uppercut first and then that power left i mean that is a fucking beautiful combination man in heavyweight boxing there have been very few combinations that were that gorgeous to watch watch that again play that unbelievable just the way he fires in the jabs he's firing jabs in on tyson's face sets him up for the uppercut, lays a trap for him, fires in these jabs on him, lays the trap for him, and then sends the uppercut up the middle. What's this, top? When he finally fires this off, man, that's like,

it's one of the great performances, man. Look, jab, jab, jab, jab, jab, jab, jab. Boom! Oh, and there's a hook. He set a trap for him. God. He set a trap for him. God. He set a trap for him with that uppercut. Yep.

That was a beautiful combination. And that's just an example of a guy. I mean, he might not have been able to maintain that. He might not have maintained it after he made so much money off of this fight and after the Holyfield fight that he lost afterwards. He had a moment of greatness. I mean, he made a tremendous amount of money. And maybe he just, after his mom died, he didn't want to do it anymore.

Maybe the Tyson fight was just such a high watermark that he was done. But no one can take this away from Buster Douglas. That this night, it wasn't just that he was fighting an under-trained Tyson. It wasn't just that he was fighting a guy who underestimated him. It was that he came to give zero fucks. He came to give zero fucks and show what he's capable of, and he trained like a motherfucker for this fight. He came in in incredible shape, throwing bombs here.

I think it was in the 10th. Did he stop him in the 10th round? A lot of guys that came in against Tyson were already beat, too. In a lot of ways, they were just so afraid of his punching power. I believe it was the 10th. I believe it was late in the fight. It was also, by the way, after B so afraid of his punching power. I believe it was the 10th. I believe it was late in the fight. It was also, by the way, after Buster Douglas had been knocked down. Yeah, it was the 10th. I remember

that so well. He'd been knocked down, I think, in the 8th or the 9th. I didn't know that. Yeah, he got dropped. Tyson clipped him with an uppercut and had him hurt. Look, man, that was a fucking masterful performance. And it wasn't the right Tyson. I mean, I would have loved to see that Buster Douglas against a Tyson that fought Marvis Davis. Yeah, they said said he wasn't training as much as he should

have then and that was when he was starting to get called the scariest all-time tyson was the tyson that was still trying to prove himself yeah if you look for tyson versus marvis frazier that's the motherfucker that's the boogeyman that's the boogeyman because you watch tyson and you you see marvis frazier across the ring from him and you see Tyson warming up and you're like, I'm about to witness an execution. And you see Joe Frazier trying to pump his son up, tell his son to box, and that guy walks in there and he can barely breathe because he knows what's going to happen.

I mean, he's so nervous. He's in the ring with the peak Tyson, the peak ferocity, because the peak really wasn't even after he had become the champion. The peak was on his way up. Look at him. Look at the build on him. It's ridiculous. I want to know how you think he'd do in MMA against guys like Jon Jones.

Yeah, this was before he fought for the title. I'm pretty sure. Let me absolutely. I believe it was when he was on his way up and everybody was shitting their pants. Look at him. Because he was on ABC, I think this was. Look atitting their pants. Look at him. Because he was on, like, ABC, I think this was. Look at Joe Frazier. Look at it.

They're like twins. They're like twins, man, he and his dad. Yeah. Joe Frazier was a great fighter. Look at his dad. Look at his dad right behind him. Yeah, he looks just like him. But Marvis was, like, more slight in frame.

He's not that slight. Well, more slight than him. Not slight compared to you. It's true. Look at that. Look at Tyson. Tyson is just built to administer an ass kicking Look at that. Look at he's like he's like it's like a joke. He's like a cartoon character Yeah, he actually fought twice after that before he won the title. So you're dealing with a guy who's 20 years old here This is this is up jump the boogeyman. I didn't get the look on Marvis Frazier's face

Look at this Fra on Marvis Fraser's face. How long did Marvis Fraser box? Not long. I think this was it for him. He might have fought one or two times after this. Might have grown up too wealthy or something. Well, this is a terrible beating. Growing up too wealthy, maybe, whatever. There's no way he was going to beat this guy.

Poor or wealthy. Look at this. This was two completely different types of human beings here. Look at this fight. This is an assault. This is not a boxing match. This is a boxing match between the son of one of the greatest fighters of all time and a murderer. I would have loved to have seen Frazier in his prime fight him.

Yeah, but could you imagine the horror of being a guy like Frazier and seeing your son just get destroyed? Look at the movement of Tyson as he sets himself up for those punches. That's another thing. Take a look at that again. Back that up just the last combination when he cracks them. Just watch the feet of Tyson as he's throwing these shots. He's adjusting constantly as he's throwing these bombs. Look at this. Look at this. Boom. Watch this. Move backwards, backwards, backwards. Boom, boom. There's these little subtle movements to get himself into perfect position. That was

part of the genius of Tyson that a lot of people don't notice. When a lot of people watch guys punch, they assume that he's just standing there punching the guy. No chance. No, he's constantly moving. He's just always in the absolute perfect position to punch. So as he's unloading these combinations, he's moving back slightly back in. There's a genius and a brilliance to Tyson's destruction of Marvis Frazier and a lot of other people that a lot of other fighters that people don't respect or understand because they don't know how difficult it is to just just to punch a guy standing in front of you this many times and the way Tyson is doing it with movement is ridiculous look at this boom boom now watch his. Watch. He slides back and then perfect position. Bing. Perfect position. And then he looks at Marvis's head, swings again, sets him up. Bing. Right hand. It's almost the left is measuring the right. Bing. Left hand. Everything is perfect. The accuracy of both the hands and the feet is stunning. It's masterful.

Yeah. So they're not, you're not just. He was excellent. He was very technical. He was an excellent technical boxer. That's what they said, how hard he worked at footwork. He was a perfect executioner. Yeah.

He was a perfect executioner. Perfect executioner. He was more muscular there than any time in his career. That's upjumped the boogeyman, Mike Tyson. That's when Mike Tyson was the scariest motherfucker ever. Ever. Forget about Sonny Liston. Forget about Jack Dempsey. career. That's up jumped the boogeyman, Mike Tyson. That's when Mike Tyson was the scariest motherfucker ever. Ever! Forget about Sonny Liston. Forget about Jack Dempsey. Forget about Jack Johnson. They were all great, but that

Mike Tyson was the scariest motherfucker of all time. That was the boogeyman. I never saw that. I actually never saw that. He almost died. He was a destroyer, man. Would you agree with them at this point?

Most definitely. Anytime my manager and my trainers feel that I'm confident and they're willing to put me in the title and they're sure I can beat the champion, I'm sure I can beat them also. Of the three champions, who would you like to fight and why? I'd fight anybody my trainer put me in with because I'm confident I could beat any fighter in the world.

What do you think of the three champions? They're all good fighters because they have to be a good fighter. You can't take nothing away from them to become the champion. But I'm confident. I'm ready. I'm ready when my trainer tells me. Good, Michael. Let's take a look at the replay. In my opinion, that guy does not get all the respect that he deserves. I think he's the greatest

boxer of all time. Really? Mike Tyson? I think in that time period, I think Mike Tyson's the greatest boxer of all time. Because he's not just a great destroyer. If you Ali. Because he's not just a great destroyer. If you're watching how he's landing these combinations and how he can force his will on fighters, in my opinion, he's the most devastating boxer, period,

that's ever existed. But just he couldn't continue it for a long time. Right. You've got to put it in perspective of what he was capable of doing. Just because he was only capable of doing it for a few years, it doesn't mean he didn't do it. People try to judge people overall on an overall career. I don't.

Because as a person who's had some competition in my life, I know how difficult it is to maintain even the mediocre level of performances that I achieved. And I know that to be a world champion like Mike Tyson... The training alone is soul-numbing. It requires madness. It requires madness. What do you think of that, Tyson. The training alone is soul numbing. It requires madness. It requires madness. What do you think of that, Tyson, with someone like.

Crushes everybody. What about right today? Crushes Klitschko. Really? Crushes him. You think so? Crush, crush. The Mike Tyson of Up Jump the Boogeyman, Mike Tyson, runs through Klitschko like a wolf through a pack of sheep.

Really? I think he crushes all of them. Even Lennox Lewis? I just think there was a time period where he could not be beat. Lennox Lewis as sheep. Really? I think he crushes all of them. Even Lennox Lewis? I just think there was a time period where he could not be beat. Lennox Lewis as well. From what I've seen. I've never seen anybody go through people like he went through Frank Bruno, like he went through Larry Holmes.

Razor Ruddock was a giant man. Never put Razor Ruddock away. No, but he knocked him across. Literally knocked him across. Yeah. You know who put him away? Tommy Morrison. Tommy Morrison.

Tommy Morrison TKO'd him. He left-hooked him. Kind of a questionable stoppage. A bit of a questionable stoppage. He unloaded a combination that I think he could have let it go on a little bit. I think maybe they wanted Tommy to win. A little bit. A little bit.

A little bit. The guy looked okay. He looked okay to me. A little bit. I've seen later stoppages is all I'm saying. That's all I'm saying. Fix could have been in a little bit. I think Mike Tyson, if you put him in, like if you had a time machine and you could get all the money from 1926 or whatever the fuck,

Jack Dempsey was the champ, and put him in with Mike Tyson, just bring Mike Tyson. Mike Tyson would run through him. I don't know enough about, I've never been K-Tied. I've never seen anybody with my eyes hit harder than Mike Tyson. I think he's the hardest hitting. Well, I think guys probably hit harder. Like Ernie Shavers. They say, but I guys probably hit harder. Like Ernie Shavers. They say, but I never saw him fight.

But Ernie Shavers was a far, is built different, couldn't move as fast. And it wasn't just the fact that Tyson could hit you so hard. He was so accurate. And that's what people don't understand. There's a brilliance to his movement. It's not just punching power. There's been guys that have ridiculous punching power.

Ernie Shavers is one. People always bring up, Tommy Hearns is another one. Ridiculous punching power. There's been guys that have ridiculous punching power. Ernie Shavers is one. People always bring up, Tommy Hearns is another one. Ridiculous punching power. In the heavyweight division, there's quite a few guys. George Foreman, of course. One of the greatest punching power guys of all time. It's not just punching power, Tyson. It's the brilliance of his movement. There's an accuracy of that combination that's just spectacular it's amazing to watch it's real artwork so for a guy who knows how difficult it is to land shots like that on a moving opponent having seen so many different fights in my life i've never seen a striker that could fuck with prime mike tyson i think it was the perfect combination of emotions and this massive desire

to be loved needed and perfect athleticism, ridiculous genetics, incredible willpower, and the perfect trainer in the perfect moment of his life, like a movie, man. Customato was a boxing genius, a guy who had been around the sport his whole life. And he saw this kid and he was like, holy shit, I'm going to take this kid in. Like he hadn't had anybody like that for a long period of time. From the dude that, Floyd Patterson. He had Floyd Patterson back in the day. And then he had the light heavyweight champion. Didn't he have Ali for a while?

No, no, no, no, no. That's Dundee. Yeah, that's Dundee. Customato had Floyd Patterson. That was like probably his most famous fighter. And he had Jose Torres the guy who went and wrote a tell all book

about Mike Tyson the young Mike Tyson and then he had Tyson and he knew when he had Tyson he had Teddy Atlas of course too and a couple other guys

and Teddy was working with him back then but do you hear the Tyson in the Upjump the Boogeyman Mike Tyson when he's talking

after he's like he's confident but he's not crazy he's not eat your babies yet he's not I'm a pet you with confident but he's not crazy he's not eat your babies yet right he's not i'm a pet you if i can't be beat it can't be disturbed i eat your children that mike tyson very good mike tyson different that was a different mike tyson yeah that was a mike tyson who was already redlined he'd already seen too much he'd already been through too much he'd already

partied too hard he'd already already lost 300 million dollars there was already too much about losing that much money by the way crazy crazy life around him 300 million dollars there was already too much about losing that much money by the crazy crazy life around him when you see him there in there in that image and then up jumped the boogeyman he's a young man he's living in the Catskills New York in an old man's house and he's being taken care of like a plot a prime like like the best prodigy a master could ever have in his last days of life. It's like an incredible story that's out of a movie. You have a boxing master who's not just a boxing master, but a master of psychology

and the psychology of combat sports. And he has stories to go along with every one of his lessons. And he puts this kid in harm's danger, in harm's way over and over again, slowly but surely in amateur boxing competitions while teaching him all these psychological principles. And this kid can recite them back and forth at you. And as long as he's under the tutelage of this great master, he's almost invincible.

And then right after his master dies, that's when shit starts getting crazy. That's when he loses himself. And that's when he's not that same guy that same guy after years and years of not being around cuss anymore not having that sort of relationship figure not just a father figure but the masterful mentor that every young athlete wishes he came across when he was an orphan yeah I mean his his story is so incredibly unique you know and I think they did a good job of touching on certain aspects of it in that movie with Michael Jai White.

I didn't see it. Michael Jai White did a great job. He's a bad motherfucker. And you believe him when you look at him that he's a beast. Michael Jai White, he's a really talented striker. Have you ever seen that guy work out before? No. The actor who played Tyson?

Oh, really? He's had a lot of Kyokushin fights. Oh, really? A lot of them, yeah. really he's had a lot of kyokushin fights oh really a lot of them yeah and he's he's a legit black belt and like several different i think more than one different martial art he's a legit black belt wow yeah there's also you see like you ever watch those videos where he's done a bunch of martial arts movies you see michael jai white throw kicks like that motherfucker's got perfect technique with everything he does he's like a really high level black belt in striking.

Wow. So his movements when you watched him play, it wasn't offensive. Right. But I don't think they captured the madness that was his childhood and how it led to him. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe if I went back again, I would say that I just forgot about it. I don't think you can. I don't think a two-hour movie can capture what what forges someone like a phenomenon like mike tyson the movie's never going to capture

the real thing nobody would have thing that we just watched what's amazing about it is not just the fact that we were watching a guy punch a guy and do all this is the fact that it actually happened that is a video of reality that took place that's undeniable and we saw something incredibly special happened i think what's even just as amazing in some ways just from an american like phenomenon you know as a as a figure of the 20th century is the fact that he has a one-man show that sells out all over the world in theaters dude i have a picture with him is like one of the happiest moments of my life. Me, like, first of all, the fact that- Did you go to that show?

No, he was at the UFC. He's been to the UFC many times. All right, all right. I've got a picture of him. I put it on Instagram. And it was like, I've never been more proud. It's weird that he knows who you are. Yeah, he was-

You know what I mean? He's like, man, you're that weed dude. I saw that thing with you on TMZ. That's the same thing as where Lawrence Fishburne came up to me and he goes, hey, I want to meet Joe Rogan, man. Bring him over. I was like, you can meet my buddy. I'm sure he'd love to meet you.

That was so weird, man. I'm telling you, that was another one. The first thing he said to you, he goes, I'm a fan, man. You were like, yeah, well, I'm a fan of yours, too. No, that's Morpheus. What the fuck? Morpheus wants to meet me. Yeah, that was really cool.

He's a very nice guy. He's a great guy, man. I spent two months with him coming out in a movie. I'm so proud to be in a movie with Lawrence Fishburne, man. Yeah. I'm always like, there's certain guys like that level. with him coming out in a movie i'm so proud to be in a movie with lawrence fishburne man yeah i'm i'm always uh like there's certain guys like that level like you're always like wow i can't believe i'm talking to you well didn't you know nick nolte pretty well back in the day nick nolte is the most down-to-earth you will ever meet yeah nick nolte i ran into him at fry's electronics

and uh he's like oh oh, hey, Joe. I'm here buying a video card for my kid. Do you know anything about these things? He had a list. He had his glasses on. He's going over lists. He sounds like he's about to have a heart attack sometime. His son was really into computers. He's hooking his son up with some stuff for his computer.

Fry's, if you've never been there, is like fucking geek heaven. Have you ever been there? Dude, I've been there with you 15, 16 ago and i never forgot this this is literally 16 17 years ago and you were not only were you on the internet or something but you you you literally went to get a more memory for your computer and you came out with a switchboard i'll never forget this i was like dude this guy's a genius. He must be a scientist. I was like, more memory? I didn't even know what the

fuck you were talking about. And you bought a switchboard that you were going to put into your computer. Well, it's just memory sticks. It's not difficult. It was very strange to me. I remember just clipping it in place. It's not hard. Memory is one of the easiest things to ever add to. You were online so far. You were online five years before I even had an email.

Well, I was online because of my friend Robbie Prince. Robbie Prince, a hilarious comedian from Boston that I came up with. And Robbie was, he sold computers before he became a comedian. And so when we were starting out together, we were both in California around the same time, around 94. He was out here doing some stand- around 94 um he was out here uh doing some stand up and I I was out here and um he took me to an apple store no it wasn't even apple store it was comp usa there might not have even been apple stores back then and I don't remember you took me to buy my first computer yeah remember that yeah totally I was like get on get online bitch

yeah you're like it's gonna be a little expensive we should buy I was like okay yeah what do I get get this get this get this I walked out with like some crazy amount of money with you know it's a was a smart move though and you need to get on it more you're really bad with your we're talking about this my tweets promoting yourself and tweeting and stuff and also you you got a lot to say man you know i'm glad you're finally doing that in these podcasts and i think you should write too i think you should write a blog I am writing now and I you know I'm really excited the podcast thanks to you like just having done it and what I like the difference is what I do is I'll take I read a book that I think is great and I get if I think it's somebody who's got something to say I will put him on the podcast

and I have these conversations with these fucking award-winning historians like Charles Mann who just I just did a podcast this guy wrote 1491 1493 sort of the world before Columbus and the shit I learned about like just like basically things like why in the south black they use black labor as opposed to white indentured servants was because they were resistant to malaria they were just able they had a genetic resistance. Or the fact that tomatoes and potatoes, you know where they come from? South America. And Europe, Italian food for 500 years is basically fusion cuisine.

The Italians didn't grow tomatoes until they got them from South America. What the fuck? Yeah. Potatoes changed the landscape because you could grow them underground. When did they get the tomatoes? The Columbian Exchange, just in the 1400s, when Spaniards and French were coming into South America and this area, and they would bring pigs with them so they could eat them on board. The pigs would escape into the forest. They carry a lot of communicable diseases

to humans. That's how they think a lot of these communities, these vast communities of Indians. And Charles C. Mann said that there may have been up to 50 to 80 million inhabitants of the United States when white people first came here. How about that? That's what most... Holy shit. This is the kind of shit I'm talking about.

So, you know, you hear about this stuff, and they were all decimated by disease. I mean, literally, and it could have been as easy stuff and they were all decimated by disease. I mean, literally, and it could have been as easy as when they were coming up to Mississippi Delta with their pigs. It could have been 60 people brought diseases that no one had any fucking, you know, resistance to. They all died. So when they came back, the entire area was abandoned. It was just pottery and stone and nothing was there that's so crazy because you know we're always taught that there was nobody here oh my just a few Indians 50 to 80 million according to the latest

estimates by historians now and archaeologists paleontologists so the numbers are vastly larger than we thought and any that I mean a, I mean, a good percentage of it was straight genocide. I mean, there's a lot of genocide involved as well. People weren't very nice to each other. The Trail of Tears and all of the... I mean, the reason why they still have reservations to this day. But even long before that... Long before that, though, was disease. What they think is that disease really, truly decimated 90% of the population.

Well, you know what? I don't think it's even important to differentiate what we don't actually know long before it was diseased, but we do know two things took place. History is way too muddy, I think, to do that. But I think we do know two things. We know they definitely got a lot of diseases from Europeans, and they definitely were murdered by Europeans.

Yes. We know both. Yes. So I think when you say, well, this happened first, and then it happened second, boy, that gets squirrely when you're talking about 1492. Sure. That gets real squirrely.

We also know they were very warlike with each other, by the way. Oh, yeah. Savages. Columbus and those people were all fucking savages. Everybody. Everybody was different. It's so strange. Slavery was the order of the day.

One of the great turning points in history was the abolitionist, the worldwide abolitionist movement, the worldwide movement to end slavery was done so, like nobody thought, these were like fanatical, usually religious people. At the most part, slavery, if you think about it throughout the history of human, was the order of things. It was just the birth you took. Everyone from Aristotle to Socrates, they all had slaves. I mean, it went all the way up until the idea that you could actually change how we look at humanity as you're not chattel, you shouldn't belong to somebody, was so not in people's pantheon. When you were conquered by another army, you were simply sold into slavery. A Constantinople, which was a civilization that stood for a thousand years, it was the

heart of Christianity when it fell in the 1400s. Those that weren't put to the sword, the rest of them, probably 50 to 100,000, were just sold into slavery. And that was the order. That's what you did. So sorry, I know you got a family and stuff. We're taking your kids. Stop it. And the brutality is beyond what people commit. Again, I think it has to do with what people are used to. That was what they grew up with. That's what they saw. That's what they were used to.

When you were talking about Lincoln's kids dying, that was even worse back then. Way worse. There was a wellspring of misery where if you had an abscess in your tooth or rheumatoid arthritis. That's it, bitch. It's a wrap. You die. You get a wellspring of misery where if you had an abscess in your tooth or rheumatoid arthritis That's it, bitch. It's a wrap. You die. You get a staph infection. Take care!

Any scratch you get from hammering nails to try to build the house to keep your children, you might lose your hand. That's right. Super possible. That was it. But what the other side of it was, that kind of contact with humanity was a great deal of trade. And so potatoes kept Europeans alive because you could grow them on the ground. other side of it was that kind of contact with humanity was a great deal of trade and and so

potatoes kept europeans alive for because you could grow them on the ground they're not as vulnerable as wheat wheat in the wind will you get a hail storm potato stand to the ground when a marauding army comes in to take all your shit they're not looking at the ground you got all your food and a sweet potato uh and even a potato but you can you can basically with a sweet potato and even a potato, you can basically with a sweet potato and with milk, with milk products, you can live, you can thrive. So you had entire communities in Europe who were building and Europe was built essentially, a lot of Europe was built not just on bread but on potatoes. When potatoes came in and tomatoes and you had milk products like cheese, you're basically fine. You will be fine. You'll grow into a big, strong boy.

Well, nutrition is such an underrated aspect of why people succeed and why they fail. And not just in terms of nations, but in terms of human beings that you know. The people that take care of their nutrition and give their body nutrients, their bodies work better. Their brain works better. They make more sense. It's really that simple. One of the turning points in American history was when we got rid of hookworm. There was a scourge of hookworm in the South after the Civil War.

Do you know that they're trying to give people hookworm to cure asthma? Really? Did you? Because it makes you anemic. There's something that happens with hookworm. That's interesting. Hookworm stops asthma. Really? Did you? Yeah. Because it makes you anemic. There's something that happens with hookworm. That's interesting. Hookworm stops asthma. Wow. And so there was a doctor that was trying to

inject hookworm into chronic asthmatics. Wow. Because they get into your feet. Doctor infects himself with hookworm for health experiments. This guy had... So he swallowed a camera to film the action in his stomach. He infected himself. His name is Dr. James Logan. Infected himself with these hookworms

and then swallowed a pill, a little tiny pill camera to find the action in his gut. Wow, that guy's a gangster. That guy's a gangster. That's a doctor that did that. And hookworms make you anemic. They rob your body of iron. And you have no energy. There's a straight dope. Will hookworms relieve my asthma?

Wow. That's awesome. Through the body. Dr. Quentin Bickle and his team have lined up a special scanner which can see through the top layers of dr Logan's skin before placing a water droplet containing 50 hookworm larvae onto his arm That will write to your arm into my skin like straight away or is it gonna take well That's one of the things we don't really know so Okay, apparently whether or not this is does nothing to do with whether or not hookworm

cures asthma, unfortunately. Hookworm, it's in this guy's body that they can see with a camera. They were a real scourge, and once they created outhouses and people weren't going to the bathroom in the great outdoors because everybody walked around on bare feet, it changed the entire

landscape of the South and changed their entire economy because you had communities where 90% of the people were anemic and had no energy to work from hookworm. That's incredible. So that changes your whole – It changed everything. Everything. You human being is a machine.

If you're not going to be able to take care of the pathogens, the diseases and stuff, and people don't feel good, they're not going to be able to do anything. It's like the importance of sleep. I'm having a sleep expert on the podcast because sleep is way more important than they thought. Way more important. It's huge. We are all chronically under stress. If you're not sleeping and hydrated, then everything else falls out. Everything else is bullshit. You know, and I encourage people this, and I can't stop saying it. I'll say it again. If you can, if you have access to an isolation tank, please do it. Please. The relaxation that you get from one hour of a

sensory deprivation tank is like sleeping the best eight hours of your life. God, I've got to get one. Your body feels so loose and good when you get out of there. It's amazing. And you've never had to change the water because nothing's growing. Of course you change the water. Yeah, you change the water. Yeah, it only lasts like a couple of years and you have to swap it out. I mean, I've had it for five years, the most I think I've ever had. But Crash, the guy who runs the Float Labs, he services it if you have a unit in your house. He comes to my house and services it.

The place to go, though, is near you. I mean, you can go to FloatLab.com. It's in Venice. Yep, been there. I loved it. It's a fucking incredible place. I thought I'd be there, like I thought I could only stay there for a half hour. I'd be like, I'd get bored. Two hours went by, I didn't even know. Yeah. I couldn't believe it.

You should be doing that all the time, dude. You should be doing that all the time. You've got some cash. You should get one of those in your fucking house. You really should. It's one of the greatest things you could ever have. I mean, I have access to the most incredible environment on Earth in my house on a regular basis. It's changed who I am as a human being.

When I get away from it and I don't do it for a while, I start getting squirrely. It's like I need it. It's like I need to get back in there. It's a balancing act. Where'd you learn about it? I saw that movie with

Altered States. Who the hell was that? I heard they're's uh that's uh come on William Hurt yeah William Hurt is it yep

yes it's William Hurt yeah he's a bad motherfucker yep and that's a terrible movie by the way try watching it now oh god it doesn't hold up not at all

it's terrifying I was like how did I think this was good what was I retarded back then like it's almost like I'm emerging from my own yeah yeah own idiotic shell. Because there's weird things about these movies that we just accepted a few years ago.

This is him. It's based on the work of a great man, a fascinating man named... What the fuck's his name? John Lilly, Jesus Christ. What the fuck's his name? John Lilly, Jesus Christ. John Lilly wrote The Deep Self, which is a fascinating book on floating.

And he also invented the sensory deprivation tank. And Lilly did a lot of weird shit, like interspecies communication work with dolphins, where he'd take acid and put himself in a sensory depth tank near where dolphins live. He did a lot of freaky shit. And his work was, you know, he was known to be like one of the most daring of the psychedelic adventurers. Lily was thought to be like a true madman. Like he would shoot ketamine and get into the sensory depth tank.

That was the big thing with him. My friend Todd actually has Lily's tank He actually owns Lily's tank Lily gave it to him and the first time he ever went into a tank Lily put him in his tank Lily had two tanks side by side and they would do ketamine together What is go ketamine is it's a fucking cat tranquilizer It's a it's a psychedelic apparently but a very dangerous one very hardcore very addictive one by the way not just psychologically but physically addictive one of the rare physically addictive psychedelics and um apparently lily loved it and the way it's described by mckenna i've never experienced uh ketamine but the way mckenna describes it is he believes that one of the things you get in a psychedelic, like a mushroom, is that you're not just getting a substance interacting with your brain.

You're actually getting a database of experiences. And that's one of the reasons why when you take ayahuasca, you see jaguars and black people and snakes is because that's what they see in the forest. In the forest, they see jaguars, they see black people, and they see snakes. That's who lives in the forest. In the forest they see jaguars, they see black people, and they see snakes. That's who lives in the forest. So when you take it, you're literally not just taking this substance that interacts with your brain, you're also taking this incredible database of experiences, which is why

so many people have extremely similar accounts of the trip. Their trip reports are very similar when it comes to ayahuasca. And the idea is ketamine. The idea is that ketamine is a very recent drug. So the amount of trips are very small. So when you do the ketamine trip,

it's not this overwhelming rush of mandalas and patterns and geometry and information and Egyptian iconography. You don't get that in ketamine. You get like an empty building. Like you're in some strange place, but you're the only one there ketamine you get like an empty building like you're in some some strange place but you're the only one there like you're going through these giant empty and occasionally someone's watching you occasionally you'll see like a lurker who's looking behind

walls and they're they're paying attention to you but it's like you're in this freaky psychedelic journey where very few people have gone before so you might not even encounter other experiences or travelers. But if you do it together with someone, apparently you can go somewhere together. And this is what Lily used to do. Lily used to, like, he asked my friend, he goes like, do you want to do ketamine with this? Because it was the first time that he'd ever done an isolation tank. He's like, sure. He's like, I couldn't say no to John Lily, who's holding a fucking syringe full of ketamine. He had it prepped for him.

And he's like, bam. I would have. He hits him intramuscularly. And then apparently my friend was yelling some shit out. I don't know. Todd McCormick, he's much better at telling the story than I am. But he apparently had yelled out. And so Lilly went to go rescue him.

So Lilly banged himself with the ketamine, gets in the tank next to him. He has two tanks. Hops in the second tank and meets him on whatever fucking channel he's on. Wow. Yeah, and he literally has a physical memory of Lily coming and communicating with him in this ketamine world. Wow. That's also been established of certain tryptamines like ayahuasca. One of the elements in ayahuasca is this plant, this chemical called harming. And when they first identified it,

they were going to call it telepathy because when they took it together, they encountered this group state of telepathy that they all recounted. They all recounted the same experiences while they were taking this ayahuasca. Or similar enough in their description because they were so fantastical, it was hard to really wrap your head around exactly what you saw. But it was similar enough that they were convinced that they were having some sort of a group psychedelic experience. that they were convinced that they were having some sort of a group psychedelic experience. And it supports the idea that when you take a psychedelic drug, it's not simply that your brain is interacting with a chemical.

Because in reality, that's all your brain does all day. It reacts to stimuli, reacts to love, reacts to hate, reacts to stress, cortisol levels, adrenaline. There's a constant soup of chemicals that are influencing whether or not you think one way or another, whether or not you get excited, whether or not you stay calm. So the idea is that this one chemical, which is produced by the human brain and is so closely replicated by DMT, by ayahuasca, by mushrooms. Mushrooms are really similar in their chemical structure to DMT. So the fact that mushrooms are really similar to natural human neurochemistry is pretty fucking freaky. And the fact that when you take these things,

you have these weird interdimensional hallucinations where you feel like you go somewhere. I had the weirdest thing. When I took mushrooms, I took a three hour shower and I kept seeing myself from the side. Like I kept seeing my profile, which was terrible. I was like, that's a terrible profile. I have to do something about that. It's a disastrous profile. I have, I have, my chest is going in. I got to barrel it out. I got a lot of bench to do. Uh, and then I kept seeing somebody in the corner with a whip, uh, like

who was kind of telling me to tell the truth, you know, what wasn't whipping me, but it just like this, I kept feeling this presence of a, this person with a whip saying, you know, I think it was my, my, the side of me that was the truth and not lying. You know, I realized that a lot of my life was a lie. Um, cause I was young, I was young trying to do, I was living other people's lives. I was, I was listening to other people and it was a very, very profound trip in a sense. And I actually, uh, after, after I got back to normal the next day, I had a, I kind of did a real reassessment of my life. I have to say, I, I kind of was like, I'm not going to be, I'm going to do what I want to do and listen to my own inner compass. And I haven't been doing that. I've

been influenced. You're very different than when you were, when I first met you, you're very different. You're very different in your good. Yes. Much, much, much better. And not that there's anything wrong with you back then. You were awesome. So if I met you in 1994 today, if I met the 1994 count, I would still be your best friend it's not that you were no but I know you were way more um under the control of other people other directed yeah it was weird like and I would I've always been well I had that luxury I had that luxury you didn't so so the world was a dangerous place for you I had a lot of fallbacks and I think it allows you the luxury of not having to think for yourself I think that one of the. I think that one of the fallbacks of having a supportive home structure, which is a good thing, but when you have to fend for yourself in a lot

of ways, and I did to an extent, but I always say to young people, it's normal when you're young to be overwhelmed by forces you can't explain. There's a lot of mystery in the world. And you will be directed other ways. And your job as you get older is to find out who you are and what you're supposed to do and where you're supposed to place your energy on your own terms. That is the communion you have with yourself. That is the idea. So that, you know, for me now at this age,

you're not going to fool me. There's no mystery. I know to an extent there's a lot to learn, but I know who I am. I know what I'm supposed to do, and I know why. And that's a nice place to come to. That's one of the reasons I love stand-up so much, by the way. It's kind of one of the things that I think is wonderful. It's such a privilege, I feel, because I get to express myself in an original way. And that challenge never goes away.

And it's always changing. It's one of the things that is fun. You and I go do the road. One of the bonding experiences, I know you feel the same way, is when you watch your friend growing as an artist, growing in his self-expression, and constantly changing and having to change and and being relevant to whatever is going on with you at the time and having the ability to be uh generous loving open pals where you're not worried about the other people getting success competition there's a lot of that in the artistic communities whether it's music or whether it's comedy there's a lot of that in the artistic communities, whether it's music or whether it's comedy, there's a lot of that. And I think one of the best things that we've ever done

is sort of eliminate that from our entire group of people. Like we have an amazing group of people, whether it's Ari or Joey or Duncan or Red Band or all these people that we're hanging around with that are up there and they're doing things. Like, we are all having fun together. That's right. Like, no one is like, you know. And everybody brings their own talent to the stage. Tom Segura. Tom Segura is brilliant, man.

You know, there's so many good guys now. And to have all the Hinchcliffe, Tony Hinchcliffe is a hilarious guy. I worked with him Sunday night at Ontario. He was fucking hilarious. He's constantly working, too. These guys are constantly working and growing. He's fucking hilarious. He's constantly working, too.

These guys are constantly working and growing. And when you have a group like that, everybody inside grows. Everybody that's connected. There's no scarcity. It's not like there's a pie. You have the bigger piece. There's no scarcity. That's where people, I think, fall into trouble, where they think of the world as a pie. And he's got this much, so it means I don't have as much.

It's not true at all. That's a great point. It's a great point it's a great point and you're you're one of the best at describing that that that that mindset and you've never had that mindset it's one of the reasons why we've been good friends from the moment that we met i just i knew there's you don't have any douche in you no no because i look at it as inspiration yeah so if i see a friend of mine becomes very successful you know when i watch uh what the success you've you for yourself, to me, it's very inspirational. The jealousy doesn't ever play a role in it.

Jealousy, in fact, is a false emotion. And you can have it. We all have. We all want something. You get worried about your own accomplishment when you see somebody being really good. You're like, oh, I'm being lazy. You just got to approach that energy in a different way. That energy is going to be there. No problem.

It's a good thing. Yes, it is a good thing. You could look at yourself unfavorably and that's where the jealousy comes from. Don't let the energy, don't let that energy don't let the energy say, fuck that guy. He's just lucky. He's just good at playing politics. It never helps you and it's a lie. It is a lie and even if it isn't a lie,

who cares? It has nothing to do with you. Who cares? If you see a guy and that guy hit the lottery and got on a TV show and, you know, it was like Friends or something like that. Not Friends, but, you know, one of those kind of shows. And then all of a sudden he's doing headlining clubs and he really shouldn't be on stage at all. What do you give a fuck?

Who cares? Who cares? You know what happens to me? If I see somebody who's really good, first of all, I spend my time with people who are good, and I watch my friend kick an ass like you or Segura or someone like that. I get so pumped. It just says to me, I feel like I'm in the right company. These people are inspiring me to move forward and keep.

I want to see what I'm capable of. That's what discovery and invention is what separates human beings from animals. Well, it's also as a creator. The beautiful thing about your act is that you're creating something. What I always said to you when I first met you, I was like, why are you not like putting more emphasis into your stand up? First of all, you're trying to do what these guys want you to do. You're doing this weird alternative thing where you're being like real like unthreatening on stage. You weren't even being yourself.

And I was like, this is weird. And then you're always constantly politicking for your next gig. Yeah. And your primary gig, like you were looking for the primary gig. And I was like, Jesus Christ, your primary gig's right here. Yeah, stand up, not acting. You didn't do comedy for a long time. Eight years. That is so fucking crazy to me. Isn't that crazy?

It's so crazy. We were friends during that time. I know. I never did stand up. I didn't start doing stand up again until I was like 36 or something. That's so weird to me, man, because you were always so funny. Yeah. Well, now what I see, you know, I'm just about to shoot my second hour here,

and things start to gel. I can't believe I spent so much time not doing it. I can't imagine my life. You need to listen to me more, bitch. I know. By the way, I'll tell you what, I'll be in Houston. I'll be in Houston Improv, then Buffalo, and then Calgary. I'm all over the place.

Go to briankelland.com, and you'll see my schedule. You'll see my schedule. You're doing some really funny, weird shit on stage right now, man. Thanks, buddy. You're hitting your stride. I appreciate it. You can tell you've been doing all these sets. That's really what it's all about.

That's one of the things about doing clubs as opposed to doing theaters. I'm liking doing five sets in a weekend. That's one of the things about doing clubs as opposed to doing theaters. I'm liking doing five sets in a weekend. It's a beautiful thing. Once you get in comedy shape, though, you've got to get in comedy shape. You've got to get used to doing those long sets. It's so crucial.

Yeah, because you've got to be really, especially with second shows, like second show Saturday night, you've got to be real careful on your set list because you can get lost in what you've done and haven't done because the shows start merging together.

They start becoming one show. It gets real weird. Yep. I have got to run to go do the Fighter and the Kid podcast. I've got to do another podcast and if I don't,

Brennan Shaw will take a big warm hand in my face and I don't want to deal with it. Yeah, don't let him do that because I have to be there by 3.30. He's a big man. He's got large hands.

Let's end this. Houston Improv, Brian Callen, is available this weekend, you freaks. So let the freak party roll out to the Houston Improv and support,

and I guarantee you you will laugh your dick off. I have told people about you for many, many years, of course, but lately on Twitter I've been getting a lot of tweets of people that went to your show

and had a fucking blast. Thanks, buddy. I feel good. We're going to schedule some dates. We're going to do some dates in the future, too, like we just did. Yes, we are. Brian and I just, we've worked together a couple times now. Vegas, and we're so stupid. Why did we wait this long? Well, it's only a total blast. Let's

go. Why did we wait this long? Then we eat duck at like 3 in the morning. That was amazing. LegalZoom.com Use the code word ROGAN, and was amazing. LegalZoom.com. Use the code word Rogan and thank you to LegalZoom.com. Thanks also to Stamps.com. Use the code word JRE for your special offer and thanks to Onnit.com. That's O-N-N

O-N-N-I-T. Use the code word Rogan and save 10% off any and all supplements. We'll be back tomorrow Thursday with my boy Justin Collett from TheActionReport.com and we'll see you then. Until tomorrow, Thursday, with my boy Justin Collett from theactionreport.com. And we'll see you then. Until then, big kiss. All right.

Later. Later. Later. Thank you.