The Joe Rogan Experience - #421 - Christopher Ryan

Episode Date: November 27, 2013

Christopher Ryan, Ph.D. is a psychologist, speaker, and author of New York Times best seller "Sex At Dawn".

Joe Rogan Podcast, check it out. The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day. When a man tells you that he's shit into a pig's mouth, you look at him differently forevermore. You look at bacon differently. Well, I want to go hunting pigs. I'm going to do that soon.

I think I'm going to go and do that this January. You ever read Michael Pollan's essay about hunting wild boar? No. In Sonoma? No. That's an excellent essay. I think it might be in The Omnivore's Dilemma, or maybe it was published separately. I don't remember where I came across it.

Sonoma's a big area for them. Yeah. Northern California has a huge issue with pigs. Yeah. Yeah, and Spain. There are wild boars all over the place in Spain. Did you know that wild pigs and domestic pigs, like wild boars, like those crazy-looking evil boars, they're the same animal? The exact same animal.

Yeah. Really? No species difference? No, no, no. According to Steve Rinella, it's the exact same animal. species difference? No, no, no. According to Steve Rinella,

it's the exact same animal. Steve Rinella is, without a doubt, the biggest animal expert that I know. He's the host of Meat Eater, that hunting TV show. Right.

I just got done hunting with him in Wisconsin for deer, which are fucking everywhere. Oh, my God. You know, people that, like, worry about deer hunters and what deer hunting,

like, it's evil, it's cruel, like, people have no idea how many deer there are. Like, these guys, they're asking to's cruel. Like, people have no idea how many deer there are. Like, these guys, they're asking to kill deer. Like, they have to make extra days. There's no predators, exactly. There's coyotes, which kill the fawns.

Yeah. And they kill wounded animals, like, when an animal gets wounded. But, man. Well, I grew up in Pennsylvania where there are no coyotes, right? So there were no predators. There were, like, two mountain lions still in the mountains somewhere. But they were everywhere. Everywhere.

I mean, I've hit four or five deer in a car. Yeah. And I moved out of there when I was 17. So that's two years of driving. My folks used to live in Harrisburg. Oh, really? Yeah. Yeah, mine too.

We couldn't drive at night. If you drive at night, you better go 10 miles an hour. Yeah. Because they were everywhere. They were in their driveway. They eat your marijuana plants. How dare those cunts. They eat flowers too. They love in their driveway. They eat your marijuana plants. How dare those cunts. They eat flowers, too.

They love roses. Wow, I had a crazy dream that I just remembered because of that. That I brought a bunch of roses in for a friend to eat. And he was eating them, telling me how fantastic they were. And I was just taking it for granted. I didn't want to eat these roses at all, but I got them for him. What a strange dream. Valentine's Day.

But it wasn't like roses like a bouquet with the leaves and everything. It was like a plate, almost like a tray that you would get at Wendy's, one of those fast food trays, stacked up with roses on it. You served him man roses. Yeah. It was like, hey, man, I got you some roses. You could eat these. He's like, yeah, try.

They're fantastic. And I remember trying them, and I'm like, man, I don't get it. Sounds like American beauty. It's's like, yeah, try. They're fantastic. And I remember trying them, and I'm like, man, I don't get it. Sounds like American beauty. It's a fucking strange dream, man. And the fact that I just remembered it when you said that. Yeah. Like deer eating things. Let's see what else we'll knock loose.

Yeah, dreams are a motherfucker, man. They're so weird how, like, in the middle of the day, you're like, oh, yeah, that was from my fucking dream. Like, why can't I remember that? What is the mechanism? Have you ever figured that out? Yeah, there's a chemical that your brain releases that erases memories. What is it? As you're waking up.

I don't remember the name of the chemical. But there's another one that stops you from moving, right? So you won't hurt yourself. It disconnects your volition from your body. And that's why you have those night terrors, you know, where you hear someone come in, but you can't move. You ever have those? No, you think that's what it is,

but it's really aliens, bro. Could be aliens. It's fucking aliens, all right, man? What is it with aliens and anal probes? Well, I think it's bullshit. That's what I think it is. And I think people who are crazy are worried about their ass all the time.

Worried someone's going to put something in there. What's the name of the singer who used to be married to the bike? I'm sorry. Lance Armstrong? Lance Armstrong, the singer. Sheryl Crow. Sheryl Crow. Do you know this weird Sheryl Crow alien thing? No. Okay. I may be the only person in the

world who's ever noticed this, but she's got a record that came out and there are two songs on the record. There's one called Maybe Angels, and it's about, the lyrics are like, my bags are packed if they ever come for me. You know, I know my sister, she knew Elvis. And so all this kind of like,

it's sung from the perspective of someone who's waiting for aliens to come and take her away, right? And then there's another song on the record called Heaven's Gate, which is, I don't really know what that song's about. Months after this record came out, the Heaven's Gate cult in San Diego all killed themselves because they thought that there were aliens behind the comet, the Hale-Bopp comet, that was coming to take them away.

They all had the same sneakers on. Yeah, exactly. They were all wearing Nikes, I think, right? Purple Nikes or something like that. And you know, one of the people in that sect was the nephew of Lieutenant Uhuru from Star Trek. Whoa. It's weird. But anyway, that happened after she released this record.

So, I mean, that's pretty weird. You got a song about aliens coming to take you away and another song called Heaven's Gate and then... Well, maybe it was about that Warren Beatty movie that was really weird. You got a song about aliens coming to take you away and another song called Heaven's Gate. Maybe it was about that Warren Beatty movie that was really terrible. Those were a bomb, yeah. Maybe she was like a Warren Beatty fan when she was younger or something like that. I've thought of that as an alternative hypothesis. Didn't she just have butt cancer too?

Oh. She did? Yeah, didn't she just like survive? No, she had breast cancer, I believe. I don't think it was butt cancer. Girls don't get butt cancer as much as they get breast cancer. Breasts are apparently very vulnerable to cancer. Yeah. Well, you know why? Why? No. Because the cells replicate much more often and much more quickly in breast tissue than in other tissue. Oh, which makes sense because

they have to in order to swell up and morph and become milk bags. Yeah. Ovaries, too, right? You think about ovaries every month. And ovarian cancer, another very common cancer. And it's, I mean, here's another angle on this that I'm working into this book I'm writing. You know, think about how many times a woman menstruated before agriculture. Ew. I don't want to. Now you made me.

Okay. But how many, so a woman came into, became fertile at 18 or 19 because they had low body fat. So they menstruated later. Oh, really? Whereas now girls are menstruating at 8, 9, 10 years of age.

But the sort of typical hunter-gatherer human thing, it starts around 18. They'd be having sex before then, but there was no consequences because they weren't ovulating. So they got roped into sex. That's the trick.

Well, I don't know about – well, anyway, so just to follow this line. So they start having sex. They get pregnant. They have a kid. They breastfeed for two and a half, three years typically, right? So that's a period of like four years when they're not ovulating because women typically don't ovulate when they're breastfeeding, especially if they have low body fat. And then, okay, they start ovulating again. They might ovulate a dozen times.

They get pregnant again, another kid and so on. So you add it all up. You find that a typical human before agriculture, female, ovulated maybe between 50 and 80 or 100 times in her life. You look at it after agriculture, like now, women ovulate 300, 400 times in a lifetime. Sometimes a day. Some of them.

Some of them seem like they're on the rag all day. On a weekend. Their whole life. They're spent bleeding. So that stresses women's bodies a lot because every time they go through that cycle, as you say, their breasts are swelling, things are changing. What do they attribute this change in the amount of menstruating women do? Is it just food?

It's higher body fat, which gets them started earlier. But it's also that women aren't having as many kids and they aren't breastfeeding their kids. So a woman in an agricultural society or now could have a kid, kids on cow milk immediately. So then she starts cycling again. What's the numbers on people who breastfeed and people who don't? Almost all my friends whose wives had children, they breastfed. Yeah, I don't know. And you'd have to also think about how to judge it.

You know, how long do they breastfeed? I know one lady who didn't want to breastfeed because she didn't want her nipples to get ugly. Yeah, a lot of women. Does it stretch it out or did it? It didn't do anything to my wives, but to some people's nipples. Well, some people are more susceptible to stretch marks too. Like I've met people that had a kid and it just wrecked their body. I mean, it looks like they were attacked by a bear, you know,

like just claw marks all over their stomach. And then you see some girls, they have a baby, and then like three weeks later, nothing even happened to them. Like it doesn't even make any sense. That's genetics. Genetics, they vary substantially when it comes to the elasticity of skin, apparently. You see that in mixed martial arts. Some guys get cut really easy. And it's not just the shape of the bones. That's been argued. That's the shape of the bones around the eyes. There's some people that just have much more tender skin. There's guys like BJ Penn. BJ Penn's fought like, god,

I don't know how many times. Champ of two weight divisions. I've never seen a guy cut. He never gets cut. He gets beat up. I mean, he's had fucking wars. Eyes swollen. No cuts. It's weird. Some guys, you just, a punch misses them and they cut open. It's a very strange thing. I think it

goes that way with vaginas as well. Like some girls' vaginas, they snap back into action. And other ones, it's like you just shot a bowling ball through a chicken. You know, it's just, what are you going to do with this? You're going to stitch up the outside and pretend you're not fucking a canyon after that? You know, it's just genetics. We were talking about Dan Savage earlier. He's gay, right?

So he's not real into vaginas. That's what I hear. And at one point he wrote in his column that for him vaginas looked like canned hams that had fallen from the sky and the cans split on impact. How rude. It did not win him a lot of admiration from the ladies. It's so silly to say, too. They don't look anything like that. It's a shitty comparison. Well, you know, what's he know?

Right, but I mean, it doesn't look like a can ham that fell from the sky at all. No, it looks like a strange gelatinous alien that's trying to steal your sperm. That's what it looks like. The mouth of some strange creature. It's just some succubus. It's just there to pull genetic material out of your body,

which essentially the vagina is, other than being a point of pleasure in a place where you pee. Looks like your predator mask. Yeah, a little bit. That was in my last special. I was talking about my wife saying that uncircumcised dicks are ugly, and I'm like, have you even seen your vagina? Do you know what that thing looks like?

Yeah. The extra skin on that might be the best looking part of it. Yeah. Genitalia, you know, it's all in the eye of the beholder, right? Exactly. You gotta be in the mood. Especially if you're really wanting it. Yeah. Well, then it looks better. Yeah. That's when it becomes delicious. When you're all excited. So there's many things that have caused people to start menstruating later in life. Yeah, primarily less breastfeeding, less amount of time, and higher fat diets. What percentage of women breastfeed? Yeah, and you're going to want to look on cross-cultural stuff, too. No, I'm going to go to the first website I find, and I'm going to say it like it's fact,

because that's what you do. That's how it goes. The CDC, Center for Disease Control, would they know? Yeah, they'll know about America, sure. More mothers are breastfeeding, but overall rates are still low. 90% of families exclusively breastfeed for six months. Wow. How many?

90%. And they're saying that's low? They say, they're saying that overall the rates are still low is what they're saying in this article. I don't understand that. That doesn't make sense. It's on CBS News, too. What are you saying, you fucks? Did I read this wrong?

Is that possible? You know, and breastfeeding also relates to what we were talking about earlier with the bacteria and the intestinal fauna and all that. Babies that are born vaginally pick up bacteria, especially skin bacteria, that stays with them for life. Whoa. And they found that babies who are born through cesarean don't have that and are more likely as a result to get infections and various fungal infections in their skin. Sweet. I got pussy bacteria on me. Yeah.

You want to get as much of that as you can. And then breastfeeding as well. The first few days of breastfeeding, I think it's called colostium. There's a substance that comes from the breast that isn't – it's mostly stuff other than milk, really high fat. Colostrum? colostrum, I think that's the word how dare you just spit that out you know what you're talking about you don't even know how to say it

but I know what it tastes like you can order that you can buy it at Whole Foods from cows oh from cows? you don't want cow colostrum? sure you do, it's healthy it's rich in human growth hormone

or cow growth hormone it's very similar so listen to this statistic this is pretty crazy I'm sure you do. It's healthy. It's rich in human growth hormone or cow growth hormone. It's very similar. So listen to this statistic. This is pretty crazy. They're not saying how many people do it. What they were saying was if 90% did, this is how much lower health risks food have. Oh, right, right. I can't read and talk at the same time. But infants who are breastfed for the first six months have a 72% lower risk of hospitalization for lower respiratory tract infections

and a 64% reduced risk for nonspecified gastronomical tract infections, 58% risk reduction for the intestinal infection necrotizing enteroculitis in preterm infants and a 27 to 42 percent reduction in allergic diseases in breastfed infants. That's amazing. You would be an asshole to not breastfeed your kid if you could because you're like setting this up, this kid up for like a life of much more likely infections, much more likely allergic reactions. And those are big numbers. Yeah, and that's just the stuff that happens when it's still a kid. There's evidence that there are lifelong changes in immune response based on whether or not a kid was breastfed.

The World Health Organization recommends that babies should be exclusively breastfed for the first six months of life and then receive a combination of breast milk and easily digestible foods through the age of two. Wow, you should still have breast milk up to the age of two research shows that if 90 of families exclusively breastfed for six months almost 1 000 infant deaths could be prevented annually and 13 billion would be saved in medical costs each year according to the u.s department of health and human services office on women's health. That's amazing. I mean, I know there's some issues that some women have. Some women's aerials aren't set up for breastfeeding.

And some of that can be helped with pumps too, apparently. And, you know, some people, they just don't have the fucking time, unfortunately. And also, it's a social thing, you know. In the United States, it's still seen as a shameful sort of something you should do in the bathroom. There are states where it's illegal to do it in restaurants or in public. There's a lot of bullshit women have to contend with in addition to the biological stuff. Yeah, doing it in public is a rough one. In Spain, it's like everywhere.

In India, women are breastfeeding everywhere. Yeah, but those are Spanish tits and Indian tits. No one cares. You've got a nice American corn-fed tit, and you can't just have that out there in the breeze. I sat next to one on a plane just last week on the way home from Vegas, and the whole time I just had my sunglasses on

staring at her nipple. It was great. You're a fucking creep. Would you? No, I wouldn't. I'd be respectful. You're the reason why people are afraid to do that, you fuck. Wait, was this a corn-fed?

That's so stupid, man. This was just a nice fat titty. Why would you do that? Because she was Wait, was this a corn fed? That's so stupid, man. This was just a nice fat day. Why would you do that? Because she was hot. You're just being an asshole. Okay, anyway, more than 70% of American women don't follow the new recommendations. So that means that 30% of women breastfeed. That's crazy.

So this is a more accurate statistic as to how few actually breastfeed. 70% of American women don't exclusively breastfeed their babies for the first six months. So they might be mixing formula in with that. I'm not sure. I'm not sure how it works, but that's not good. You ever heard about what Nestle did in Africa? No. With the formula. They had a bunch of formula that was, it was too old. It was expired. They hired guys to go around Africa wearing like lab coats, looking like doctors, trying to convince women to use this formula because they were going to just throw it away. So they sold it really cheap in Africa. Now, these are women who otherwise would breastfeed, which is really good for their kids. But because these guys are wearing lab coats and speaking with authority and all this scientific bullshit, a lot of women, tens of thousands of women, started buying this formula.

Mix it with the really shitty water that they've got there. And all these babies die all over Africa. Nestle got in big. This was like in the 80s or 90s. There was a worldwide boycott of Nestle because of this. It's corporations. It's the idea that you have to make money for your company, period. You have to make money.

Did you see today the Supreme Court agreed to hear a case to decide whether or not corporations have religious rights? What? They've already determined they have the right of free speech, which is translated into unlimited spending on political parties because that's considered speech, Citizens United. And now today they agreed to hear a case because these companies that are owned by religious radical right-wingers don't want to have insurance for their employees that cover birth control. So they say it's their right as a corporation not to do this, even though it's the national law, and the Supreme Court's going to hear the case. Wow. So they say it's their right as a corporation not to do this, even though it's the national law.

And the Supreme Court's going to hear the case. Wow. That's hilarious. Yeah. I mean, when people talk about Frankenstein, you know, this whole idea, like, or will robots ever take over? It's like, dude, it's done. Yeah. Look at a corporation as something we created, legal structure that we created, that has already got more power than governments or religions.

It's taken over governments. Even if you talk to people, they say, yeah, but there are good people in that company. Sure there are, but the company doesn't give a shit, right? Because they'll die and they'll have new people. It's like a structure that has taken control of the planet and we're just part of the structure. We're like working for this monster. Yeah, it's all about ones and zeros. And when it comes down to only being responsible for your bottom line and having an obligation to shareholders to increase the money every month, that gets really weird because it is sort of a machine.

And it's each person has to go home and say, hey, what can we do? It's business. It's business. It's what we do. Right. Like, what do we do? We're plugged into this weird machine. And what are the machines doing?

As best I can tell, their entire purpose is taking part of the earth and turning it into shit. You know? Like, destroying everything that's beautiful and digging big holes and turning it into shit. You know? Like, destroying everything that's beautiful and digging big holes and turning it all into plastic that then floats in the ocean. Some, you know, and when you're involved in the manufacturing process, most. Except for Ting.

Ting. It's not really a corporation. It's sort of a company kind of a thing. I gotta say, last time I, one of the times I was on your show, you were talking about Ting. And I had an iPhone. I don't know if you remember it. I was like, damn, I would get Ting if I didn't have this fucking iPhone. But I got so tired of bullshit with phone companies, like the hidden charges and the sneaky bullshit. And I really admire this philosophy of like, hey, here it is. You get what you pay for.

We're not going to fuck around with you. I ended up selling my iPhone. I got a Samsung just so I could go with Ting. Good for you. Which one did you get? The Galaxy S4. It's a nice phone. Yeah, I saw you went with the other one. I got this bad boy. That's a monster.

Yeah, this is the Note. Oh, you got the Note. I thought you got the Note 3. You had another one a few months ago. I got an HTC One. Yeah, I saw that. Yeah, this is the shit, though. This is the one I really love. Still using it? Oh, yeah. I love the fuck out of that phone. Does that have the little pen?

Yes, the stylus. I write my comedy notes on it. Like, I don't need to bring a notepad with me anymore because I have an endless supply of pages. And I can file them on the phone.

Like, I can shuffle through all my notes. I can put them in folders. It's amazing. Dude, I got to stop coming on this show. It costs me money every time. I got to buy a new phone.

I'm going to have to go buy a Note, get a Porsche. Well, the Galaxy S4 is pretty sweet. It is sweet. You don't really need to get another phone. It is beautiful. I mean, just the screen, looking at photos. I don't watch videos and stuff on the phone, but I like looking at the photos. And, man, like go back to an iPhone after that.

It looks so small. The Internet is the biggest difference in the experience. I mean, because this, the note is enormous. Yeah. When you're looking at a screen, if you're looking at a photograph on the screen or if you're looking at a website, I mean, it's goddamn huge. I mean, look how big that is. Yeah. I mean, it really is like a tablet.

You get an awesome view. And, you know, I carry a purse. How dare you? A Merce. I like it. I wish everybody did. Yeah, so you've got room for that in there. Yeah, I put it in my a purse. How dare you? A Merce. I like it. I wish everybody did. Yeah, so you've got room for that in there. Yeah, I put it in my back pocket.

It fits easy. Oh, really? Yeah, it's no issue at all. But I'm 100% in favor of the Merce. I think I'm disgusted by the fact that we can't wear a purse. It's rude. We can. We just have to take back the Merce.

Take it back. Yeah. I consider it more than a Merce. I consider it my Kwai Chain Kane bag. Really? Remember Kwai Chain Kane? Yeah, I do. Kung Fu?

Yeah, he had a bag. That's right. He had a really shoulder bag. Yeah, a little leather thing. He kept his necessaries. I tried keeping my laptop in one of those because I wanted to look more sophisticated. I feel like I'm in my 40s now. I should probably grow up.

It didn't work. I went back to a backpack. Backpacks are more effective. Wait for yours now. I should probably grow up. It didn't work. I went back to a backpack. Backpack's just more effective. Wait for your 50s. No, I give up. I just got this new shirt. It's like a hoodie. I don't have it on right now, but it has a man,

like a fanny pack built into it kind of. That's clever. So you have your two hands in your pockets, and then there's this middle thing that's just like a fanny pack. Yeah, it's a Velcro. You just open it up, and it's like the hundreds.'s just like a fanny pack. Yeah, it's a Velcro. You just open it up, and it's like the hundreds. That's like a baby step. That's the gateway drug to fanny packs.

Yeah, and it's cool because I use it like crazy, and it just looks like you have a little stomach of gear. Yeah, and some girls like guts. You'll find them that way. There's girls out there that have fetishes. There's guys like pretty feet. Some girls like guts. Really?

Yeah, I've heard. Not enough of them. Not enough of them? It's an evolutionary advantage. There's more guts out there, so they start gravitating towards them in order to ensure that their seed gets spread. Right. And a lot of the guys with the guts have money. Yeah, I think a lot of people have given up on quality, and they just want to get the job done.

And they pour it in a storm. Guts are warm. Well, physical attributes are not nearly as necessary as they used to be. When our society gets more and more safe, it's less and less a requirement to be physically sound or strong or not look like you're going to keel over in a minute. Now they have life insurance policies. It's actually beneficial if you marry a fat guy with a bad heart.

Exactly. Ladies. Kill when you will. Yeah, if you marry a guy who's got sleep apnea, he's 100 pounds overweight, and he's also on a gang of pills, just wait it out.

Get a nice life insurance policy. Make sure the medical stuff is all documented because he's going to kick over eventually. How long can he last? Get him involved in sports. Say, honey, I want you to start losing weight. He's going to kick over eventually. How long can he last? Get him involved in sports. Say, honey, I want you to start losing weight.

Let's go scuba diving. Get him involved in some stupid shit that he can't do. That ticker will just give the fuck out. And then you rake it in. Hand gliding. It's evolutionary, right? I mean, there's got to be. Gold diggers have to be a part of evolution, right?

I mean, it has to be a part of evolution right i mean it has to be some some form of an equation well is that a serious question because not really but it's like what we're talking about like corporations being machines i did write a book about that you know so i gotta like yeah yeah all right gold digging yeah well we we wrote in our book actually we say darwin says your mother's a whore i had business cards that had that quote on the book because darwin's theory is that women traded sexual access for goods and services right right gold diggers essentially and the sort of mainstream view since darwin has been that that's women's nature and that men's nature is to be the provider. And so the women are trying to rope in the best provider and all that. But that we

basically call bullshit on that in our book. So how do you call bullshit on it? What's the. Well, you know, aside from all the evidence that our ancestors did not evolve in nuclear families, in our bodies and in our, you know, it's 300 pages of evidence. But essentially what we say is, no, women have sex for the same reason men do. It feels good, and it's a way to bond with somebody. It's not about getting something from the dude. Because when you actually look at hunter-gatherer societies, hunters go out of their way to make sure that nobody knows who killed the animals. Like the hunters will exchange arrows and stuff before they go hunting. The guy who brings the animal back to the village often generally is not the one who killed it.

There are all these very powerful ways that societies make sure that nobody gets proud and nobody gets too much credit and everything's spread around evenly. It's fierce egalitarianism is what the scientists call it. And it's not because they're, you know, noble savages or some shit. It's because that's the best way to mitigate risk in a hunter-gatherer society, right? So like you go hunting today, you get a deer. I didn't get one. I might not get one for a week, right? But you're not going to get one every day. It's sporadic. You come back, you don't have any refrigeration anyway. So it's not like you could keep it all for yourself and your wife and your kids, right? And it mitigates risk.

Everybody eats. You know, whether you get it or I get it, we all eat. Plus, we're all really highly interdependent. So the last thing we need is you and me fighting over who's a better hunter and, you know, who's fucking whose wife and all this kind of bullshit because that splits up the group. So what we argue in Sex at Dawn is that human sexuality was actually a way to bond the group together. And people were having sex with different people simultaneously and raising children together. And this obsession with paternity, which is assumed to be part of our DNA, is actually a response to agriculture, which is just 10,000 years ago, which is like 5% or less of our existence as a species. So it's a response to staying put, which allowed people to make much larger civilizations.

Yeah. Yeah. In a nutshell, essentially it was when people stayed put, they could accumulate resources, right? Whether it's domesticated animals or land or buildings or wheat or whatever. And so once that happens, then there's a completely different sense of property, right? Because in a hunter-gatherer society, there's very little property because they're nomadic. So you don't want to carry shit around, right? And whatever there is, is shared. And when you shift to agriculture, suddenly there's a lot of property and it's not shared. It's hoarded. It's controlled by individual families or people.

So that's when paternity becomes a big deal because you've spent your life accumulating all these resources. You want them to go to your sons, right? And it's also, interestingly, the first time that people really understood that sex caused babies, because before that, everybody's just having sex and women are having babies. There's no reason to think that sex is causing the babies. Right. But then when you've got domesticated animals and you see like, oh, OK, the black bull fucked that white cow and now we got these black and white calves. Oh, right. I get it. Right. So you start putting that together when you're living around a lot of domesticated animals and breeding. And so that's when women became the property of men. If you read the Old Testament, it says, thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife.

It's about property. Yeah. It's not about respecting his marriage. Read it in context. Nor his house, nor his ox, nor his slaves, nor his she-ass, whatever a she-ass is. So it's, you know, keep your hands off your neighbor's stuff, and the wife is just part of his stuff. So that's radically different from the way men and women interacted in hunter-gatherer societies, where women had very high status, equal to or sometimes higher than men's, because the women supplied over half of the calories that people lived on. The gathering is what brought the food in every day.

The hunting was an occasional bonus. So the women were involved in plants and harvesting fruits and vegetables and things like that. Small rodents, yeah. Small rodents? Yeah. Ladies, take care of the small rodents. We'll go get the elk. You can't handle anything large.

So because they brought in small rodents, they were the kings. That kind of makes sense. Well, they were like mom. They were there day in, day out. Dad's like, hey, like occasional party. Dad brings home a deer or something. Wow, that's interesting. How do they know this for sure? Well, you look at, well, which aspect of it? The whole story? The aspect of women being, you know, having a... The higher status and all that? Matriarchal.

In that case, primarily, you're looking at anthropological research that's been done by people on hunter-gatherers, right? There's still some hunter-gatherers in the world. In the 60s and 70s, there were a lot more, and a lot of people wrote their research on that. So there's a pretty sizable research on hunter-gatherers. And what you find is universalities. So whether you're talking about Inuits in Greenland or Australian Aboriginal people or Papua New Guinea or the Upper Amazon, you find these similarities or universalities among all the different groups.

So you say, okay, look, if this is common to all these groups from all over the world, then it is characteristic of hunter-gatherer societies. And we know our ancestors were hunter-gatherers, so therefore we can extrapolate. Wow, that's interesting. So what about money? How did that factor into it? Because when you started not just accumulating material possessions, but actually start figuring out finances and figuring

out money and the monetary compensation for work and things along those lines. Like how did that factor into the male female relationship? Because men physically being stronger, were able to do things being more aggressive, were probably pushier when it comes to acquiring that money. And then they found themselves in an imbalanced position where the men have more financial worth than the woman. Yeah. And the women generally have zero financial worth. It's not just that the men are, you know, slightly higher. You look at women in societies like early agricultural societies in the Middle East and, you know, as recounted in the Bible and so on, a woman's only access to the things she needs,

food, shelter, status, things like that, is through a man. It's through her father and then through her husband. Well, the Middle East, they take it to the next level. You can't even show your face. Yeah, because you're the property of the man. He doesn't want that being shown. You're walking around with a fucking tent over your head

every day. I mean, that's the biggest, like, you want to talk about, like, the weak-ass approach to life. They can't drive. Like, I mean, in 2013, Saudi Arabian women are battling to drive. They're risking their lives to drive. Just to fucking, they won't let them drive. I mean, it's, like, dude, you guys got to relax your grip. All you Saudi Arabian men, you're fucking yourself over.

Has no one taught you what having character is? Has no one taught you what being a bitch is? What kind of a man wants to keep his wife from driving and wants her to wear a sleeping bag everywhere she goes? You're fucking ridiculous. The idea is ridiculous. She can't show her face like this. She's got to go through life like she's a bank robber.

That's so fucking dumb. In 2013, the fact that that still exists, I mean, what is that an echo of? What caused all that? Is it a scarcity thing? Well, I think it's an echo of these early days when women became the property of men. And honestly, you know, someone I was talking to recently just at dinner, an American woman, said in the 60s, in the 60s, she couldn't open a bank account without her husband or father co-signing the bank account.

It's because she was a silly bitch. She was going to go crazy with her money and buy purses. I don't think so. And we have no money for baby formula. I don't think so. Yeah, I mean, it's not that long ago that we were, we're still, you know, fucking women over in lots of ways. But as far as that, you know, the whole Middle Eastern thing,

I think that's a reflection of this notion that women are the property of men. Now, why were women the property of men. Now, why were women the property of men? Partly it's, as you said, questions of upper body strength and the way men organize politically more effectively than women did. And so men took control of a lot of stuff. Also the need for armies because agricultural societies expand. And that gets us into what we were saying earlier about corporations, right? That's when you get these institutions that where growth is a central characteristic of that institution. You know, I think it was Edward Abbey who said growth for its own sake is the ideology of the cancer cell. It's also the ideology of corporations, of agricultural societies.

You know, we talk about growth, right? Oh, this year's growth rate is whatever. You know, everything's always got to be right. 100,000 new jobs introduced by the president. Exactly, right. What we need to be, one of the things I'm talking about in this book I'm working on now,

it's called Civilized to Death, is the whole idea of progress stops making sense if you're going in the wrong fucking direction. If you're going the wrong way, the last thing you want is progress. You want regress. We don't want growth.

We've got to contract, get fewer people using fewer resources. There was a fascinating thing that Terrence McKenna once said about a mushroom trip. He asked a mushroom, how could anyone possibly save the path that humans are on? And they said very simply and very easily, each parent, each couple should reproduce once. You know, two people, they have one kid, everybody relaxes. The whole, the resources relax, everything relaxes. Like, there's plenty of fucking people, okay? There is zero worry that people are going to go extinct.

But then the problem is, how do you go to those people, like those crazy people that were on that TV show that had 19 children? Remember those people? First of all, what is she in labor for, like three seconds? It's like that Monty Python. Does he actually have sex with her, or does he just jerk off into the abyss? How are those babies actually fertilized? That woman, how could you tell that woman she can't do that?

I mean I think it's a freak show. I think resources-wise, like I have three kids. It's hard. It's hard to give them all the time that they deserve. And me and my wife have discussed that when it comes to the possibility of having more children. I said, I think we should really concentrate on raising the ones we have. Like they're fun and it's great. And they need a lot of time. Like children need a lot of time. And I enjoy giving them that time. But I think that if you have another kid around, everyone

gets a little bit less time. And I think in that getting less time, there's some benefits, the independence aspect of it, as long as there's love and there's comfort. But I also think you can teach kids a lot of shit, you know, and you can teach them a lot, especially if you really are into it and you concentrate on it and you read a lot of books on it, which I'm really involved in the idea of raising kids. Like I'm raising little human beings. So the conversations that I have with them are all geared towards that that like it's geared towards enlightening them as to the world and it's sort of guiding them is how to how to treat people how to be nice to people how to be nice to your sister like be nice to the to people don't don't get angry at things for no reason look at it this way instead of that way and i think that kind you know you're gonna miss a lot of that when you have 15 16 kids you're

gonna like do you guys just shut the fuck up just shut the fuck, you know, you're going to miss a lot of that when you have 15, 16 kids. You're going to like, you guys just shut the fuck up. Just shut the fuck up. Organize teams. You, you're responsible for your little brother. You're responsible for her. And that's what those people did. Those people have like every kid has a chore and every kid. That's how you raise zombies.

I mean, these kids, they're not going to know what the fuck is going on in the world. Like they're going to need someone to help them. Every day is spent doing tasks. And your life is basically religion, homeschooling, and these tasks. That's those kids. That's the 19 people. What are they, the Duggins? Is that what they're called? I think so, yeah. See if you can find that. I mean, look, I don't think you can tell those people not

to do that. I think this is America. America's got its faults, but- But think about it. They only neutralize like eight gay couples. Neutralize? What do you mean? Well, I mean like if they've got 19 kids, you average it out They only neutralize like eight gay couples. Neutralize? What do you mean? Well, I mean like if they've got 19 kids, you average it out. Like you've got eight gay couples who don't have any kid or adopt a kid, which takes it out of the other pool. And mathematically, you can have outliers like that because there are lots of people like me who don't have kids. Right. I mean, I think the way to do it is to remove the stigma around not having kids and to encourage what Sarah Herdy calls alloparenting.

And this gets back to the whole hunter-gatherer thing. Like, kids are raised by everybody. Yes. You know, they say, you know, oh, two parents are better than one. Yeah, that's true. But you know what? Five parents are better than two. Right. It takes pressure off you, right, because you know, oh, two parents are better than one. Yeah, that's true. But you know what? Five parents are better than two. Right.

Takes pressure off you, right, because you get frustrated. You get tired. You know, their mother gets tired. And it also, it's enriching for the adult. I love being around kids. Yeah. For a couple hours, you know. Right.

Yeah, no, I know what you're talking about. And I can flee, you know. We had a party at my house the other day. And there was a gang for Halloween. There was a Halloween party. And there was a gang of kids over. And it was fun. It was fun talking to other people's little kids and, you know, seeing how they're different

and how they behave different. They have different ideas about stuff. And, you know, there's nothing wrong with that. This is the family, the 19 folks that live at home together. Nice house, though, for 19. Guy must be making some good bank. Be paying for all those kids. Maybe he just loves to fuck.

It's all this religion stuff just to keep them all around. Just loves sending it in. 19 kids seems a little excessive, but again, I don't think... It's always anal. Not for really religious people. I think it's in the Bible. Oh, really? People pick and choose what they like about the Bible.

That's why they get religious tattoos. Did you ever's in the Bible. Oh, really? People pick and choose what they like about the Bible. That's why they get religious tattoos. Did you ever think that... Were you raised religiously? 21. That's a family of 21. Yeah, there's this new one called the Bates family,

I guess. Oh, God. They're taking on the fucking Duggars. Yeah. The Bates. They're still growing. Look at that creepy fuck

on the left. Yeah, I was raised Catholic. I went to Catholic school. All right. I went only for one year. Yeah. But luckily, my mom and my dad split up when I was about five years old. And it's like that old world New Jersey sort of Italian and Irish mix.

Everyone was fucking Catholic. And everyone went to Catholic school. But for me, it was very enlightening. Like I gave up on religion when I was six years old. I gave up on religion in Catholic school. I was like, obviously, this is not real. Like this is very obviously not. Not buying this.

I was like, there's a God. And I wasn't saying that there was no God, but I was like, this shit is just crazy people. This is just more crazy people that have figured out how to control a bunch of assholes and scare the shit out of them. I could see that as a six-year-old, that this crazy lady who was teaching this class was just an evil, demented woman, a hateful, horrible woman who had nothing to do with what everybody had told me God was about. Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah, my parents were raised Catholic in that part of the country. And I saw a lot of that. But I was thinking recently, like, you know, you're talking about anal sex and Christians and all that. I wonder if if we're sort of shooting ourselves in the foot, those of us who are trying to, you know, move away from shame and hang ups and stuff. I wonder if the people with the shame actually have better sex. Because it's intense. No. You don't think like a priest fucking a nun out behind the church in the woods knowing God's watching. You don't think that's like a

really intense fuck? No, because I think you're dealing with so much guilt. That neutralizes. I hate guilt. Yeah, guilt's useless. Guilt's fucking gross. It's one of the worst feelings you can ever feel. I mean, I think there's reasons for it. It's to guide your behavior in a way that you don't have any guilt. But it's also you can get fucked over and create associations very early on about things you really shouldn't be guilty about.

Like masturbation. Right. Like someone was telling me, hey, you know, man, you should cover your camera on your laptop because there's a camera on the laptop and the fucking NSA can spy in on you. And I'm like, good, they'll catch me beating off. That's all you're going to get. I'm not doing anything bad. I'm beating off occasionally. Am I supposed to be ashamed of that?

But for some people, it is a shame. Like, wait, Mr. Ryan, we have photographic evidence of you masturbating. Like, good, release it. Let the internet see. Release the hounds. Let them know that I'm just like them. This is just my dick, okay? It hurts.

I got to get rid of some stuff. I've often thought, like, that would be a great political campaign. Like, the guy who, or the woman who says, all right, I'm running for president, and let's get this out on the table. Right. Right here. I tripped a lot in college. I've tried coke. I've tried heroin. You know like I fucked whores like just get it all out there

and see how the country responds to that you know well this guy from Toronto is essentially doing that Rob Ford you know Rob Ford is sure Rob for what are you pulling up Brian Rob and that's a spied on porn yeah I saw the plan to discredit radicalizers yeah like if you're in tranny porn, they shouldn't take you seriously. Sorry, we're not allowed to say tranny anymore. Tranny's a new transgender porn. Can't say tranny. They get upset.

But cabbies, you can still call cab drivers cabbies. So let's hang on to that while we can. Let's hang on to that before the fucking super sensitive police breaks that down too. They're cab professionals. They're not cabbies, asshole. You cisgendered asshole. I get so much of that stuff, man. Of course you do.

There's a lot of disenfranchised people out there that want to blow a horn on anybody who'll be an earshot. But it's so frustrating. I just had this today because yesterday I released a podcast episode with a transgender person. Yes, tell me about this a wonderful person i met i met her at a party and i at first i didn't realize she was transgender what's her dick taste like um sorry coconut now that you mention it um but uh anyway i so i released this thing and i get an email today from from someone i know who's

cool who's smart and and she's like, she's a lesbian. And she's like, well, you know, she was upset because the transgender person dresses like a conventional woman and associates with this sort of conventional vision of womanhood. And so the lesbian is saying she's supporting a paradigm that makes me feel bad, that makes me suffer. That's hilarious. It's like, Jesus Christ, the lesbians are fighting with the transgender people? No wonder nothing ever gets better. Yeah, I had a discussion. The assholes stick together.

I had a discussion with this radical feminist woman about, the discussion originally started talking about transgenders and about how transgender man is, you know, man to woman, is a woman now. And I'm like, hmm, okay. That's interesting. I'm like, I'm more than willing to call them a woman. I'm more than willing to call them whatever new name they want or whatever they want to be called. It's not my...

Names to me are fucking ridiculous. I understand that we need them. You know, I can't be like, ah, oh, yeah, I know all you well I don't have to call you Chris why do I write him it's it's silly and they come out of the fucking Bible you know st. Christopher st. Joseph say like you might as well they're random a lot of them are random you might as well call

us you know by number but what we were talking about which which got really weird was we were talking about traditional roles and um and things that women do that discredit other women and she was talking about makeup and high heels and i was like whoa whoa whoa whoa okay i know for a fact that if you see a transgender man wearing makeup and high heels you don't have a problem with that at all do you and she's like you're right and i go what the fuck is that about i go if a guy is dressing up like a woman, if he has a sex change and becomes a woman, you're like, you go, girl.

But if a woman wants to wear high heels and let her ass hang out of a skirt, you think that there's something wrong with her. I'm like, that's ridiculous. You're just closed-minded. You're just very rigid in what you expect from other people. And yeah, for sure, there's some women out there that put on a big show to get sexual attention, much like a peacock male spreads his feathers. I mean,

they're trying to get attention and it's effective. I think a lot of the problem that people have with that, that they don't want to admit, is that it bothers them that people are attracted to that. It bothers them that people are not as attracted to them. There's a lot of ugly women who are mad at pretty women. I mean, it's not fair. Life is not fair. And until they come up with some sort of a genetic remedy, which I believe is within 100 years, they're going to be able to take you

and turn you into whatever the fuck you want. If you want to be a unicorn, if you want to be the Hulk, I think they're going to be able to do to your body whatever. I think there's going to be elasticity to our genetics and the design of the human being will invariably be manipulated. They're going to change it. So you're going to be able to look like a beautiful woman if you want to. And I think when that comes, man, it's going to be a weird time because, first of all, it's only going to be available to the elite at first. There's going to be these glowing, perfect specimens that everyone's going to want to fuck.

No one's going to want to fuck a regular person with a mole. She's got fucking weird teeth. And maybe they'll become exotic. Or they'll become exotic. Most likely not, though. Most likely to be like cell phones. Only rich people have them at first, and then within a few decades, everyone's going to have them because it's going to get cheap.

I don't wonder how weird it'll be, though, because I think we'll be trained for it by our avatars online. So we'll be accustomed to taking these other forms, you know? Well, there's that thing, though. I mean, this is the thing about competition and the thing about it really does boil down to that. People feel like if you're attractive, you're taking something away from them. Right. from them right like i i was at a wedding once and there was the bride at the wedding was furious because some other woman that one of the guests had brought in was dressed really sexy and she

had this banging body and um the bride was fucking crying like that this was her big day and this fucking bitch came in and she's wearing wearing this outfit. And it wasn't anything crazy. It wasn't like she was wearing fishnets and a bra and was like, kapow, why get married? Look at this shit. This is what you're getting out of me. This is out here on the market, fuck face. And you're settling for cold mashed potatoes. And the woman was attractive as well.

The bride was attractive too. And they were clearly in love, and it should have been a celebration. It should have been joy. And all she could think of was this bitch was upstaging her on her fucking day this bitch was

why the fuck did he bring that bitch you know why the fuck did she dress that way at my wedding apparently like no one knew her

she was a guest you know a friend of the guest fuck you know that competition thing is weird because people feel like

you're taking something from them if you have like if you always wanted to play basketball but but you're 5'8", and like me, I'm 5'8", and I wish I was as tall as that Mao Ying guy, whatever the fuck his name is. What's his name, the big giant Chinese guy? Yao Ming? Whatever his name is. Shaquille O'Neal.

Let's go with Shaq. I did Fear Factor with Shaq, and I stood roughly dick height to him, and it looked like I was his child. What did his dick taste like? It didn't taste bad. It didn't taste bad. It tasted like a basketball. A little rubbery.

A little basketball. A little on the rubbery side. Very dark. Yeah. You know, it's like you can't get mad at Shaq for being seven feet tall, okay? If you want to play basketball, obviously that's not the hand of cards you're dealt, my friend. Right. And who gives a shit? Because, I mean, the assumption underlying all these things is zero-sum thinking. Right. You know that? You're familiar with that?

Yes. Famine thinking. Right. Exactly. And famine thinking came onto the scene after agriculture. Before agriculture, hunter-gatherers, the way anthropologists describe it is there is an assumption of plentitude in hunter-gatherer societies. And in farming societies and every society since then, there's an assumption of scarcity. It's a completely different way of looking at the world. You also see it in, we were talking about religion, you see it in agricultural societies. The gods are angry, jealous, temperamental, perverse. The gods in hunter-gatherer societies are giving.

They're not even giving. They're just like a source of richness, right? It's a completely different way of looking at life, the world, each other. It's amazing. But they never invented shit. They invented sharper arrows and things along those lines. There was no cell phones. If we're all hunter-gatherers, there'd be no internet.

There'd be no podcast right now. You wouldn't be wearing glasses. Shit would be weird. I probably wouldn't need glasses. Do you think the glasses, is chemtrails making your vision go bad? Yeah, the chemtrails in my eyes. It's the birth control pills in the water.

World Health Organization works for the New World Order. The people that lived in these hunter-gatherer societies, though, they were very happy. I don't necessarily want to do what they do, but they were very happy. Well, you know, yeah. I mean, this is what this book's about, right? Sex at Dawn, by the way. People are, what's this fucking book's name?

Oh, actually, I was thinking of the other one, the one I'm working on now. Oh, the new book. It's called Civilized to Death. And it's about the modern world in conflict with our evolved nature. But Get Sex at Dawn now, read that before the new book. When is the new book going to come out? About a year after I write it. You haven't even started?

How dare you? How dare you come in, mispronounce colostrum. Fucking son of a bee. You son of a bee. I'm busy. I'm busy. I'm busy. Listen, you are. You are very busy.

Duncan got me into this podcasting shit. I didn't even know what a podcast was when I met Duncan. Well, I'm glad you did. It's so much fun. I love it. I wouldn't write books. If I could do this for a living, I would just hang out and talk to cool, interesting people. It's a more effective way of distributing information, too.

I'm amazed how many people listen. We're getting like 15,000, 20,000 downloads at this people. It's a more effective way of distributing information, too. I'm amazed how many people listen. We're getting like 15,000, 20,000 downloads at this point. That's a lot. Yeah. That's really good. Not Rogan numbers, but it's... Well, whatever. I mean, we started out, Brian and I, we got like 100 the first day we did it.

Yeah. 100 people watching on Ustream. You guys are doing the video from the get-go. Yeah, we started doing the video. We're one of the few that doesn't... We don't do any editing of our shows. They air, warts and all, they go out there. You know, some people, originally the big knock was that that was very unprofessional, that we should edit it.

But there's sort of a thrill to it that people know. I think people appreciate the authenticity. Yeah. Yeah, it's like you're here. I think people appreciate the authenticity. Yeah. Yeah. It's like you're here.

And also the conversations that we're having, like this conversation with you, you can not just acquire information much more easily than reading, but it also stimulates your desire to acquire new knowledge in a way that I don't even know if reading does. It's like you get inspired by a variety. It's almost like a magazine. You get inspired by a variety of different ideas, and then you can go pursue those ideas on your own. But they open up doors, and doors to me too, not just to the listeners. There's a lot of just having these conversations, being able to sit down with a guy like you for three hours and just talk. How would we do that? If we did that normally, if we decided to have dinner together, we would be, what are you going to eat?

Oh, this this year is really good. And we'd be with other people and they'd be having their thing. And, you know, you're right. It's extremely efficient. I mean, my favorite thing about it is exactly what you said. It gives me a reason to sit down for a while with someone who otherwise might not make time for me, you know, or have time. You know, they've got to think about their effectiveness. Well, and also the committing to sitting down for like three hours because we're calling it a show.

The committing to just sitting here and doing this. You know, it's not like checking your phone or I'm going to, what's on TV? When does this start? Is this season of that in? And, you know, look at this magazine I got. Who took this picture? You know what I mean? All that stuff. Yeah. it's like life is a distraction this is almost like focus yeah you're gonna lock yourself in clink across the table in a weird way we would never really sit you know we'd sit on a couch you'd be over there i'd be over here we'd chat and

you know watching a fucking tv probably most likely taking most of our time or there'd be a music playing or something. There'd be something going on where you're adding to the distraction of life itself. Feeding each other flowers. Feeding roses.

Yeah. Feeding you a big fast food tray of roses. What a strange dream. I think Shaq's dick tasted like rose petals. I would wonder what some,

one of those weirdo dream expert people would, how they would decipher that. Like what would be their. Google it. There's a lot of dream dictionaries online. Well, you remember Stanley Krippner. He's a dream expert.

Yeah. I don't know what he would say about that. Feeding the man roses. Without the thorns, interesting. Yeah, it was just petals. Yeah. It was just petals. Maybe it was deers because I know the deer.

So did you bag one? Yes. Was it buck season? Doe season? Well, it's both. It's kind of a sad story. Oh, it was fawn season? No, no, no.

I didn't shoot one of those. But eating rose petal, dream interpretation. Really? It's on my Islamic dream. Oh, my God. My Islamic dream. Please shut this off. Shut this off before we get jihadded.

I had nothing to do with that. I shot a buck and wounded a doe. I dropped my rifle because I fell and apparently the scope was off on the rifle. The animal got wounded in its leg and we had to follow it, but we couldn't

find it. We found a blood trail and we followed it for several hours the next day, even looking for it. We couldn't find the deer, so it got wounded. It was very, very depressing, very sad. It was like two extreme opposites. The buck I shot died instantly. I have a large caliber rifle. 270 Winchester? 300 Win Mag.

300. And the idea behind it was, like, I want to make sure that nothing gets wounded. I want it to be as painless, as quick as possible. I had my rifle sighted the day before. We went to a range. I shot a gang of rounds. I shot 90 rounds before the day before we left and another 20 the day of. And I've been practicing a lot.

So my accuracy is excellent. I was ready to do it. And the idea behind it is very simple. I mean, hunting is a very thrilling thing. What I want to do this year, and this is in no judgment of anybody who's not doing it, but I want to be able to know exactly where all my meat comes from. And I want it all to be wild meat.

I think it's better for you. I think it's an ethical, much more ethical way than factory farming, certainly, and even more than agriculture because that animal is living its life completely free and wild until the moment you pull that trigger. And so my idea was to get all those ducks in a row, make sure that I'm shooting at an animal that I'm definitely going to hit. The crosshairs are lined up on it perfectly. Fucking scope is off.

Scope is off, and the animal got hit in the shoulder. So I wasn't sure if that was what the case was or if I just missed. You know, there's so much adrenaline going on, and it's so depressing and so sad. So I went to a range, and I went with a marksman too and one of the guys were with knows how to sight rifles and he's like yeah this is off this is off quite a bit was off by like six inches at a hundred yards which is quite a bit I mean you mean you fall and I was walking around these slippery hills of snow everywhere and logs and these big stupid moon boots that I was wearing

that were there were insulated boots that i was wearing that were um there were insulated boots that were good to like 40 below zero but you can't fucking walk in them i mean they're enormous and they're stiff their ankles don't bend so you're like frankensteining exactly like ski boots but they keep your feet warm but i fell and uh huge huge depressing moment very very sad i mean it's like the animal will die, and it's probably dead already. And if not, the coyotes will eat it anyway. It's part of the cycle of life. And they're trying to get rid of as many deer as they can up there.

They have a lot of deer. And the deer are damaging a lot of their—they're trying to replant forests up there. And deer eat all the saplings. They eat the leaves off the oak trees and things along those lines. They kill people in auto accidents. They do. But I was obviously trying not to do that. Yeah. I was trying to make sure that it died instantly, like the first one.

The buck I shot was dead within seconds. It was boom. Then did you have it cleaned? No, I did it. Oh, you gutted it? Yeah, we gutted it, butchered it, everything. Hung it up on a tree? It took hours.

We did it in a garage. We skinned it and the whole deal. And it took hours to cut it down and to portion. But this is the right way to do it. The last time we did it, we sent it to a butcher. I have no idea if that was even my deer that I got back. It tasted delicious. It was awesome.

But I didn't see it. I didn't see the whole process. And to me, it's like I was missing a step. I wonder that when you get the ashes back from someone who's been cremated. Yeah, who the fuck knows? Like, really? How do I know what's in here? It's a stack of newspaper.

It's not your grandma. It's like cocaine. And they just mix it with shit. Yeah, it's just like they cut it. They cut your grandmother with newspaper. You might want to check out that book I mentioned earlier, The Omnivore's Dilemma, Michael Pollan. Because the idea of that book was just he said, I want to make one meal where I know where everything came from. Well, I'm doing that now.

I'm growing vegetables. I ate broccoli from my garden last night. I have a pretty serious garden now, and it's getting bigger. And I have chickens now. I have 14 chickens, and I just ordered seven more. I'm getting seven more. Where do you order them from? Like online? There's a chicken factory. I don't know. I'll show you. It's a lab that makes chickens.

You order them online. They send them through the U.S. Postal Service, actually. They get there next day. Yeah, and they're fine. What do they call the reds? Something reds? Do you know what the breed is? There's a gang of different breeds. We have a bunch of different types of chickens. So you're getting eggs from them? Yeah, I get fresh eggs every day from these chickens.

And then on top of that, I'm getting vegetables from the garden. And I'm trying to go, by the end of 2014, my goal is to be all game meat. Because I think if you're going to be a meat eater, and I've been a meat eater my whole life, I want to know where the food comes from, one. I mean, it's great if you can go to a farm that you know the guy's taking care of his cows. Like Doug Duren, the guy whose farm that I hunted on this weekend, he has cows, and he grass feeds them. He even gave me some of his meat, and I was happy to get that. I mean, he gave me a couple of steaks.

You know exactly where that came from. I know exactly what he feeds it. He knows exactly what that cow's been through. There's no hormones, no bullshit. They're just cows eating grass. This is what it's supposed to be. But most of the time, you don't know what that relationship is between the farmer or the butcher.

And you can assume it's bad. If it's industrial. Certainly if it's factory farmed. And also the fact that most of the steak that we're getting is fed grain. And those animals are not supposed to be eating corn. And antibiotics. Out the fucking ass. And one of the reasons being is because their body doesn't process corn well.

Right. So they get all these abscesses and all these issues with their stomachs. Yeah. Look, you know, again, I'm not trying to judge. I'm not saying go out and do what I'm doing. But I think knowing what I know about the whole process seeing documentaries like Food Inc knowing what I know about I don't want to do that

I don't want to be a vegetarian but if I had a choice between being a vegetarian and keeping the factory farm system in place the way it is I'd probably go with being a vegetarian I would just eat eggs and vegetables and things along those lines.

But I like meat. And I think there's a lot of health benefits. So you're taking responsibility for it. Yeah. I think there's a lot of health benefits to meat. I really do.

I find it delicious. And I've always said this, but it's not like those animals are going to live forever and become magic. I mean, they have a short lifespan. Deer, if deer is lucky as fuck, they hit five years old. Yeah. They have to short lifespan. Deer, if deer is lucky as fuck, they hit five years old.

They have to be lucky as fuck to not get eaten by a predator, hit by a car, shot by a hunter, or froze to death, which is the big issue with deer, especially in non-farmlands. See, in the place where we're at, these deer are fat as fuck because they're grazing on crops. They're eating alfalfa they're eating on these uh a lot of these places they actually grow food plots just for deer because deer hunting first of all the opening day is fucking crazy we were out there it was like 5 30 in the morning we were out there an hour before it got light and you hear as soon as the sun starts cracking you hear boom. Boom. Yeah.

That's awesome. Boom. It's like you're at a war zone. Deer day in Pennsylvania. Yes. It was a school holiday. Yep. Remember that?

Yep. Yep. I remember seeing people driving home from hunting with like a dead deer strapped to their pinto. Yep. Yep. Yeah. Yeah.

You got to be careful first day of deer season. Yes, you do. A lot of dogs and cows get shot and hunters. Yes. So were you wearing like orange camo? Yeah. No, no, no. Orange, just orange, bright orange vest. We were in a blind sitting there at zero degrees outside. Up in a tree. No, no, no. One time I went up in a tree, but it was for a short amount of time. I only hunted up in a tree for about an hour. Most of the time was in a blind that was on the ground. It's intense because it's nothing, nothing, nothing.

You're waiting. You're freezing. I mean, fucking freezing. It's fine if you're walking around. If you're well insulated and you're walking around, it's actually kind of pleasant because you feel warm because your clothes are good. You're wearing wool and down and all these different things.

But when you just sit down, nothing fucking keeps you warm. You have to tense your body and release and tense your body and release. Those chemical bags? Those help. They keep your feet warm. I didn't figure out those until the second day. They made a big difference. And you put them in your gloves, you hold onto these little bags, and they help. But your face is still falling off. You're still

sitting there, freezing your dick off. Your nose will not stop running. But it's quiet, quiet, quiet, nothing, nothing, nothing. And focus. You hear a snap and you look over like, oh you look over, like, oh, shit, there's a deer. Oh, shit, there's a deer. Yeah, it was pretty exciting. It was very exciting. We had to decide whether or not the deer was big enough for me to shoot, because this guy

is trying to raise large deer on his property. But since they're trying to get rid of as many as possible right now, because they're growing, he kind of gave us the green light to shoot a younger deer. So the deer was only like two years old. They like them to grow like five years. They get these big, crazy antlers. But, you know, big antlers are cool, but I was doing it for meat. Like that's what I want to do it for from now on.

I want to just try to do that every few months and bring back, you know, 100 pounds of meat or shoot an elk, you know, shoot a large animal and just try to live off wild animals. You know, my wife's from Africa, from Mozambique. I'm leaving in two days. We're going to Mozambique. First time ever for me to be in Africa. Whoa.

But one time we were, she was raised in a rural, her grandmother's house was in a village, African village, and she spent weekends out there all the time. So anyway, one day we're in Amsterdam. We're sitting in Amsterdam. It's a beautiful spring day by a canal, and these little ducks go by. And she's looking at these ducks, like really staring at these ducks, and she's got a weird look on her face. I said, what are you thinking? She said, oh, I was just thinking how much I'd love to kill that duck and rip its guts out and stuff it with garlic and herbs and rosemary.

Let me and my grandmother. And like my wife grew up like, you know, wringing necks of chickens and ducks and geese. And, you know, like it's no big deal for her. You know, it's like whatever. That's what you do. She thinks we're silly. Americans are ridiculous with our disconnect from where things came from. Well, there's this woman that I know who's raising her son to be a vegan.

She wears a leather jacket, she's got leather shoes on, and she eats meat. Oh, but he's got to be a vegan. She wants the kid to be a vegan. The kid's fucking three. That's fucked up. Yeah.

Somebody needs to call Child Protective Services. You mean, I don't know what kind of B12 they're giving the kid. I mean, hopefully they're giving them B12. They say a lot of people, they get their B12 actually from insects, from just the mean, maybe, hopefully they're giving them B12. They say a lot of people that they get their B12 from actually from insects, from just the amount of insects that you eat inadvertently. That are mixed into your burger.

Yeah, mixed into your vegetables. Oh, not burger. I started taking B12 every day a couple weeks ago. It's such a great energy boost. Fuck yeah. It's great for your body, too. You know, Trumetech Sport, one of its big ingredients, besides the cordyceps mushroom, is B12.

Fantastic for endurance. I mean, they used to give it to us intramuscularly when we were wrestling. If, like, someone was feeling tired or down, they'd shoot you, give you a shot of B12. Because a lot of guys were drained as fuck from losing weight. And they'd give you a shot of B12. Didn't Air Force pilots use that as well? Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

A lot of people. The best way is the shot. There's sublingual. There's actually a good company that makes a spray that you use sublingually. It works pretty good, but nothing beats the old injector. Bang, B12 right in your system. Yeah, that's a big issue with vegans, not getting B12, because primarily I think it comes from animals.

But they actually brought this vegan couple to trial for uh manslaughter murder or whatever it was because their child died from malnutrition because the kid wasn't getting enough b12 their baby died because they didn't give it the proper vitamins because they insisted on a vegan diet so and not harming animals they harmed their child you know life eats life and that's a real issue. Factory farming is evil. I agree. I'm with you.

I think, you know, it goes along with the same thing that we were talking about earlier with corporations being that we lost our, we lost the script, and humanity is not favored over finances, over ones and zeros. Humanity should be favored above all else. It should be the most important thing. Exactly, the corporations should be serving us. Yes yes how did we end up serving the corporation well they are us and they are because there's it's a because it's a game because it's a you know a cumulative game you can figure out how to acquire more and there's clear benefits to being you know the guy who has the giant

mansion who gets driven around to rolls royce like you know Like, you know, he's got a G5. He flies his own jet. You know, there's all those benefits in being that ruthless fuckhead. But, you know, I mean, maybe I'm going to sound like one of these vegans here, but I've known a lot of these guys with the yachts and the mansions, and they're not really happier. They're not actually happier. In fact, a lot of them are much less happy than, certainly, than people suppose. Because when you get that much shit, then your life becomes about your shit.

Yeah. You got that much money. Where are you going to invest it? You know, people are always trying to get it from you. You know, what is it? Freedom's another word for nothing left to lose, right? That's a different kind of freedom. But I think there's a middle path.

There's nothing left to lose, right? That's a different kind of freedom. But I think there's a middle path. And I think we make a mistake by assuming that people are necessarily going to be happier when they get more. No, money is one. There's a broad range of needs that a human has. And in this society, you need a little money because you need to be able to figure out how to pay for food and shelter. The studies do show that happiness goes up from like $7,000 a year to $40,000 a year.

And then after $40,000 a year, it tapers off. Hmm. Yeah, I was thinking once your needs are met. Once your needs are met, that's not – everything after that is not about happiness. Like I was explaining this to a friend of mine that one of the big things that happened to me when I started doing well and started making enough money. I mean, it was not rich by any stretch of the imagination. But when I first started doing well as a comedian was that I didn't feel worried anymore about where my bills are getting paid. Because every month was like a fucking terrifying struggle to pay for food and pay for gas. And it was always like barely under the wire.

I'm paying my rent three days late every month because I didn't have it. You know, it was just, it was always like that. And once that was alleviated, it was a huge pressure release. That's what makes you happy. When you can go to a restaurant and not worry about what you order, you know, that makes you happy. Everything after that, you get used to. You get used to a big house

just as nice to have a small house you know sometimes a small house is better it's cozier everybody's connected they're all just you know that's the thing the the greatest predictor of happiness once you get past that level of subsistence or you know you can take a vacation you're not worried about paying your bills and all that the greatest predictor of happiness is community a sense of community interconnection with other people. And the, you know, shooting ourselves in the foot with the wealth is that one of the things that happens with wealth is that we become isolated and insulated from other people. You know, and what's the difference between comfort and numbness? You know, I mean, I used to travel backpack all over the world and sometimes i'd

meet somebody and they'd be like oh you don't know man you gotta you gotta come with me on my private jet you know we stay at the five-star hotels and those people didn't see anything yeah you know the five-star hotels are the same wherever you go you know like it's different beach out front but that's it you're not really meeting any of the local people. Yeah. I mean, yeah, whatever. You know what I'm talking about. There's an isolation that comes with money. And I'm not just talking about wealthy people. I'm talking on a social level as well. We're much more, Americans are much more isolated socially than Indians or Cubans or Brazilians of lower classes. We pay for the money is what I'm saying. Yeah. I, I see that. I mean, it makes sense. And I think that society as a whole gets really weird

when you have cities too. You know, Jim Norton, who's a good buddy of mine, lives in an apartment in New York city and he lives in a building with probably a thousand people. I mean, I don't know how many people live in the building. I go, who do you know in that building? And he's like, he goes, I don't know anybody. He goes, I say hi to my neighbor every now and then. I've seen him a couple of times, but he goes, but I don't know anybody. So it's even more crazy because unlike a community, like your house is next to your neighbor's house and you see him mowing the lawn, you say, hi, so what do you do? Oh, I'm a printer. Oh, cool. I write books. And you have a little chit chat. Well, hey, if you ever need anything I'm next door that

doesn't even go on and there's a thousand people living in a box stacked on top of each other and that is the norm as instead of the village like one of the things that I found really fascinating about your book was sex at dawn was the way you described the interconnectedness of these small societies that the idea of promiscuity that we have today, our idea of it is someone going to a bar and picking up a stranger, a total random stranger, and having sex with someone all willy-nilly and crazy. That's not what promiscuity originated as.

It originated as just having sex with a bunch of different people that were also in the tribe. And it was the norm. And you knew them. Yeah. Like you've known them for years. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. So we try to make a big point of that so that people wouldn't get confused by our use of the word promiscuity. Because as you say, it means now screwing a stranger. And people don't recognize that in prehistory there really weren't any strangers. Yeah. You know? So you're talking about that apartment building and how nobody knows each other.

It reminds me of a book I just read recently researching, this other one, called Paradise Built in Hell. And it's studies of the way people react to disasters. of the way people react to disasters. You know, in contemporary mainstream economic theory, which is sort of based on the idea that we're all selfish and trying, you know, self-optimizers, always looking for advantage for ourselves, that's sort of like built into economic theory, would predict that in disasters that people would be even more like that.

You know, they'd be even more protective of their resources whereas what actually happens is that in disasters people start helping each other strangers you know like those people in that building that's when they'll meet each other when there's an earthquake right and like holy shit did you feel that or you know twin towers people were so happy after that and i think that's also why people enjoy, I'm not sure enjoy is the right word, but you ever heard of Sebastian Junger? Yes. His book War. I saw him being interviewed about that. He's a CNN correspondent. Is that what he is? Well, he's a war correspondent and he was embedded with a Marine platoon in the Korengal Valley for like six months in Afghanistan. And this was like they were at the tip of the spear, right, where they were getting

attacked every day because they were like in this point in a valley where the Taliban were above them on the mountain shooting down into their base. It was just a horrible thing. So he was there and for six months, I think. And he was being interviewed about the book. It's called War. And they said to him, so why did these guys do that? I mean, they don't care about geopolitics. They're not thinking about oil pipelines and Chinese expansion, whatever the guys in the Pentagon are thinking of.

Why the hell do they do it? And his answer was love. That's what makes these guys go to war, love for each other. are thinking of, why the hell do they do it? And his answer was love, right? That's what makes these guys go to war, love for each other, that they have a sense of community when you're under fire, right? Like we talked about a disaster in New York or an earthquake or whatever. But imagine like every damn day is an earthquake and you're with the same dudes every day and you're depending on each other constantly.

It creates deep bonds of love that people really miss when they're gone and i think those are the bonds our ancestors had yeah there's an intensity to life in those circumstances and an immediacy yeah you know because any day i mean you were out hunting when you fell that gun could have gone off and you could be dead now no i didn't have bullets in the chamber i'm not retarded okay. Okay, well, I'm illustrating a point. A hunter gathers out with his fucking poison-tipped arrows. If he trips, that could be. Well, yeah, you could fall and break your neck.

Or a leopard can kill you or a snake can get you or whatever. The immediacy of death is, I think, something. It's a tonic. It makes life immediate and exciting. Do you think that maybe that's one of the reasons why people feel so unfulfilled is that they're not experiencing highs and lows they're just experiencing a drone like a daily drone of traffic

and a job that's mundane is that what causes all this depression? yeah I think so and suicides and all sorts of horrible results of this is it what I said earlier what's the difference between comfort and numbness all sorts of horrible results of this. Is it what I said earlier? What's the difference between comfort and numbness?

Right? Comfort is, think about what we associate with comfort. Pillows, blankets, sleeping bags, jackets, cushions, things that stop us from feeling. Right? That's what comfort is. It's a lack of feeling. It may be a lack of negative feeling, but if you block negative feeling, you're also blocking positive feeling.

Antidepressants. They don't just make you stop being depressed. They make you stop feeling. They take the highs and the lows. They take numbness. They make you numb. They create numbness. Exactly.

Yeah, there's a lot of people that I've talked to that have had them and then gotten off of them. They're like, I just lost time. It's like that year meant nothing there was like there was missing time yeah like that year was just a series of things that went on that had no emotional connection to whatsoever and that's the antidote for this crazy society that we live in that's completely unnatural and this all the all the the the the reward systems that are set up in our bodies from thousands of years of DNA and learning, all that stuff is just never appeased. There's no real thrills. There's nothing.

Your real thrill is like going and buying some illegal drug from someone and just closing your door and doing it when no one knows. Fuck you. I'm doing heroin. Yeah, and there's a ritual. I mean, a lot of the junkies find the hardest thing about kicking heroin is the loss of ritual and community. The junkie community. The junkie community. You're hanging out with the same people.

You know, you've got this thing in common. You've got the ritual, the burning, the measuring, the syringes, the whole shit. Yeah, I mean I've been interviewing a lot of addiction specialists recently. Did you have Carl Hart on here? No. Oh, he's cool. He's a really interesting guy. What does Carl Hart do?

K or C? C. He's a neurology professor at Columbia University. H-A or H-E-R? H-A-R-T. H-A-R-T. No, I think I sent you an email about him because he was coming out to do the Bill Maher show

like a month ago or something. He's got a book out called High Price. And it's sort of an autobiographical account of him being born in Miami, wrong part of town. He's a black guy, low income. And I don't remember if it's his brother or his, you know, buddies growing up, most of them are in jail. You know, a lot of, he grew up in that like inner city drug scene, right? And through good luck and some people who were impressed by him, he ended up getting a PhD and now he's a tenured professor at Columbia, but he's a dude from that world. And so he's talking about drugs with a very knowledgeable

realistic understanding of what they are and what kind of people use them and why they use them you know and so his he argues that you know drugs aren't addictive what's happening is these people are in this absolutely impossible situation and as you say they like go get the drugs and get behind the door and say fuck you because it's like the only the only escape they've got

yeah they're unfulfilled the idea of the hunter-gatherer being a fulfilling life like that lifestyle being a fulfilling life has really been appealing to me lately

one of the reasons why I started this this project of 2014 to live off only game meat because I started seeing these documentaries like the Warnerer herzog

documentary on the taiga happy people oh that's a fantastic film isn't it i mean i love everything herzog's done yeah i've seen all of them but that's a wonderful one yeah there's a realness to those people yeah and and then there's also these alaska shows that i like like a life below zero is one of them was all people that live either below or right above the Arctic Circle, or right below or above the Arctic Circle. Some of them 140 miles above the Arctic Circle. I mean, they're just fucking freezing their ass off. But they're happy.

They have a task they do. It's not my life. It's not what I want to do. They're missing a lot of things that I enjoy, you know. But there's something about this life that they're living that creates these stable, happy people. If you look at reality shows, like reality shows drive me fucking crazy. And I think they should, because there's something about putting people on television for no reason

and then following them because they're on television for no reason. Like keeping up with the Kardashians, like the Kardashians are just some some normal folks i'm sure they're no better or no worse than most of our neighbors but when you're following these unexceptional people that have nothing to contribute there's they're not doing anything they're not releasing songs they're not writing books they're not contributing to the the cultural awareness there's nothing going on there but yet you follow them anyway because they're being broadcast and it becomes something that you're locked into. But you're dealing with people of an exceptionally low character, nonsense talking. You listen to the things they care about, the things they say. They're essentially children eating the fat of this society,

this oozing, big, fat, sloppy society that just lets them pull up to the trough and feed. And because of that, they never are pressured to develop character and true identity and be exceptional people in the way that these hunter-gatherer people are. I've watched these subsistence shows. You're dealing with these really solid people. They get up. It's fucking 20 below zero.

They have to feed their dogs. They have to pull together these salmon wheels to gather up all below zero. They have to feed their dogs. They have to pull together these salmon wheels to gather up all these fish so that they can feed their dogs. If they don't get 200 fish, 200 pounds of fish, they're going to have to kill one of their fucking dogs because they can't feed the goddamn thing, so they have to put it out of its misery. This one guy was talking about how he had to kill all his

dogs one year. He had to kill all his fucking dogs because he couldn't feed them. I mean, these are different kinds of people than someone like, I hate red shoes. Why did you give me red shoes oh my god my feet are fat they're not fat shut up she knows my feet are fat and then you cut away and she's always telling me my feet are fat and then when i say my feet are fat she's like no they're not well make up your mind bitch i mean that kind of nonsense distraction when you come home from a day of work and you're all fucked up on Zoloft and you're just staring at this stupid fucking show. Like, what is that?

What is that? continue buying things and becoming a part of this weird process we have where all we do is just create new items and blocks of fucking things and stuff your house filled with shit that you buy. And everything that you buy just continues to contribute to this process of constantly creating new shit. That's it, man. Keep running on the wheel. Instead. All they care about is that the wheel keeps spinning faster and faster if possible. It doesn't matter why, right? I mean, I remember listening to this interview with a football coach a few years ago.

It was a great, great moment. They said, I don't remember who he was, but they said, what's the key to being a great coach? He said, well, you've got to be smart enough to really understand the game, but not smart enough to see how little it all matters. I thought, well, that sums up just about everything, you know, because if you think about it, you realize, like, this is all bullshit. You know, this the entire enterprise of Western civilization is not leading to happiness. It's leading away from happiness. Higher suicide rates, higher depression rates, higher lack of life satisfaction. Plus, we're destroying the fisheries.

We're destroying the fucking planet, you know, bit by bit, bigger bits all the time. What is the point of this? You know, people say, well, but, you know, look at the pyramids. You know, we created the pyramids. Cell phones, blah, blah, blah. But none of that shit matters unless it contributes to human happiness and it's demonstrable that it doesn't right therefore i mean i i hear you you say well i'd miss this i'd miss that i'd miss a lot of

shit too there's no doubt about it in the book i'm not advocating that we go back to hunter-gatherer societies although partial steps like what you're doing are great not because it's going to save the world but because it'll enrich your life and your kids lives yeah but uh you know the whole like i'd miss this or that thing is kind of like a non-issue because if you were raised in that society then you wouldn't have it you wouldn't know to miss it right right so it's not about you or me becoming hunter-gatherers. It's about looking at these two approaches to life independently and saying, okay, the people who are born and raised in those traditions, what's the outcome?

Who's happier? Who's better off? Who has greater life satisfaction? Who has better health? You know, look at all these different parameters. There's a great book, Don't Sleep, There Are Snakes. It's about the Pinaja people of the upper Amazon. This missionary went to live with them. And he's the only Westerner who speaks their language. It's a very unusual language, Daniel Everett. And so he went to live with them, learned the language, and eventually they convinced him to adopt their spiritual traditions rather than the other way around.

He abandoned the church. I don't remember which church sent him. But he talks a lot about happiness, satisfaction. He says some psychologists came and visited the village when he was there. And these are hunter-gatherer people with very little contact with the outside world. And the psychologist said, man, I've never seen anyone happy this much for this. And he said, the way you judge it is you take videos and you look at how much of the time they're laughing or smiling. Right. And he said, they laugh about everything. Their house falls down. They're laughing. Someone, you know, you're embarrassed, you laugh, like everything is about laughter.

It's very interesting society, a real look into the mentality of these people. One of the things that's really striking about them is that they don't, you know, we're talking about focus, right? They don't have a sense of future or past that extends beyond, past beyond the generation of the grandfathers. So when the missionary showed up and started talking about Jesus, they'd be like, okay, did you know this guy? And he's like, no, no, this was a long time ago. Did your grandfather know him?

No, no, this was before my grandfather. End of conversation. They were done. They're done. That's like, then it's meaningless. Wow. You know? There's no connection between you and this story.

I don't want to hear about this. Fuck it. They just walk away. That's intelligent. Absolutely not interesting. Yeah. I mean, that doesn't, you know, obviously it's nice to have history. You know, we have a lot of it and you can learn a lot from reading about amazing shit

that happened a long time ago that's documentable, but that's pretty funny. Yeah. Yeah. reading about amazing shit that happened a long time ago that's documentable but that's pretty funny yeah yeah we would the problem we have is it's so deeply ingrained in our idea in our idea of culture so deeply ingrained that when you're talking about happiness that happiness without money like without success is like come on you is like, come on, you know? Like, we don't buy it. Like, if you're talking about, like, a guy who's got a, you know, half-million-dollar house, and, you know, he drives a Cadillac and works all day, and you're like, well, listen, you know, we've decided to start a commune, and we're going to be really happy. We're going to grow our own food.

What are you going to do for money? We're not going to have any money. Get the fuck out of here. Look at this house I got. Look at this car. Come on, I need to pay for gas. It costs a lot of money to just the electric bills, $500 a month. People get this idea in their head that this thing that you're doing, this part of this role that you're playing in this society is the only way to be happy. It's inevitable. Yeah.

To step outside of that and have a radical restructuring of what you do is really impossible. You know why? Because you're always going to have to pay taxes on that fucking house. You're always going to have to pay. Even if you buy your house, even if you own your land, you don't. Sorry. Every year you have to pay fucking property tax. Period.

In Spain, it doesn't work that way. It shouldn't work that way. Yeah. You pay the tax up front when you buy it, and then you're done. That's it. It's yours. Unless you're talking about gigantic chunks of land, like if someone's got a goddamn huge cattle ranch that's got 3,000 acres. And it's obvious they're using up a lot of resources, a lot of water.

You should probably pay some sort of a tax on that. But if you're just a guy who's got a $150,000, $200,000 house, and you worked your whole life to earn that house, and you bought it and paid for it, you should be fucking done. Just like you're done with your car. You don't have to keep paying your fucking car every year. You don't have to, like, what's your car worth this year? Well, you owe us 10% of that, boy. I paid it already. What are you talking about?

I paid sales tax. You guys got a cut when I bought the fucking thing. Why do you keep getting a cut every year? What is this property tax nonsense? It's stupid. It's ridiculous, and it keeps you on the tit. It keeps you on the tit. You can never just go off the grid. One of the shows that I watch is a show called Mountain Men. And there's a guy named Eustace Conway. And he lives in North Carolina. And this guy is totally off the tit. All right. All he does is live off the land. He's got a generator that uses river water. The river water spins this wheel that creates electricity, and that's how he powers his

bandsaws. He cuts his own wood, chops it. He has a couple thousand acres out there, and he lives off deer meat that he shoots. He lives off chickens that he raises. He's off the land, grows his own kale, the whole deal. But his big dilemma? Paying his fucking property tax every month. So every year, you know, he's got to figure out how to sell things. He's got to chop wood and sell wood. He's got to do all these different things. When really he paid for all that shit. We should just leave that guy alone.

Right. He's not hurting anybody by living off the land that he paid for. Like, get the fuck off his back. Yeah. But they're always going to do that. They're always going to that they're always gonna keep you tied in if they can if they can figure out a way to keep sucking money out of you and it's essentially a justification for the incompetent system the system is so fucking

filled with just just gross misspending and misappropriation and mismanagement of funds. It's so gross and sloppy and bureaucratic. They need everybody to be on the tit in order to feed that stupid, inefficient machine. Hear, hear, man. Hear, hear. When you were talking about Alaska and getting off the grid and all that, I had a transformative experience

the first time I went to alaska i i was in college in new york i was studying literature and one of my teachers was a visiting professor that i got to be friends with was the youngest person to ever be a professor at oxford he's like a real big shot at oxford i mean since 1261 or something this guy's the youngest person to ever be a professor wow how old was? 21 when he was a full-time. Anyway, he's a very well-known guy. Indira Gandhi was his godmother. He's written a bunch of books and all this. And he was a friend of mine and he was, I was in my, I skipped my junior year of college

and so I had one more year of undergraduate and then I was going to go to Oxford for my PhD thanks to this guy and his connections. I was going to like study literature there, do a PhD, and by the time I was 30, be teaching somewhere, hopefully have tenure and be all set for life. So I skipped my junior year because I found a loophole in the student handbook where I could like scam through, which I've done like every school I've ever been in, every job I've ever had, I find some scam, right? So I, I, uh, scam my way out of junior year. And I said, I'm going to go to Alaska cause I want to see the frontier. So I hitchhiked from New York to Alaska, had all these freaky adventures, as you can imagine, right? Went to prison, got shot at,

you know, all this crazy shit happened. And I met people along the way who picked me up, especially like in Yukon and in Alaska, who were so fucking kind. Yeah. So competent. They'd take me home. You know, they'd feed me, introduce me to the wife, the kids, you know, or women who'd stop and pick me up, just trusting, like, hey, whatever, you know, really self-sufficient people. They built their own houses. They had healthy

relationships. They knew how to fix their own cars. They were really self-sufficient. None of them knew anything about the fancy schmancy literature and philosophy that I was studying. Right. Like I had, you know, the collected poems of D.H. Lawrence in my backpack and they'd never heard any of this shit, right? But when I compared them to my professor friends back at school, I was like, wait a minute. These people don't know any of this, you know, elite knowledge. But they're really happy people and they're healthy people and they have good families and they're decent and they're kind and they're generous to me. And then I imagine one of them, you know, stumbles into Princeton, New Jersey, or you're where I was going to school in upstate New York. And my professor friends,

you know, come upon them. They'd laugh at them. They wouldn't help them. They wouldn't be kind to them. They wouldn't. And my professor friends like had to call a fucking electrician to change a light bulb. Right. So it's like, well, wait a minute, what do I want to do in this life? Where am I going? So that's when I just said, all right, fuck it, no grad school. And I wrote to the guy like, sorry, not going to Princeton or Oxford, not going to do any of this. Till I'm 30, I'm not going to make a commitment to anything. No job, no woman, no grad school, no med school, nothing. I'm just going to float around the world and have adventures. Wow, that's a fucking cool story. I love that idea.

That's really cool. I found that. I didn't go to the Yukon, but I went to Anchorage. Recently with Ari, right? You guys went fishing. We went fishing. Were you in the Kenai Peninsula? South of Anchorage?

Quite honestly, I don't remember. I don't remember what river we were on. I don't remember anything. We had a great time. We caught some salmon and we did a show up there. But I felt that way as well about the people. There's a self-sufficiency to a lot of the folks that live up there. Even in Anchorage, which is a city, it's a real city.

They have hotels and gas stations and the whole deal. We went to the movies there. It was 10 o'clock at night. It was bright out. Yeah. It's very weird. It's very weird. The bars with no windows.

Yeah, you can't. You can't have windows because people are in there drinking. You don't want to see the fucking sun come in your eye and let you know what a loser you are. Exactly. Yeah, and people will make better decisions if there's light on them. We don't want that. Do they still have, like, handgun permits where you have to leave your gun at the door when you go into the bar?

Yes, some places. Like a gun check. Yeah, you have to check your guns when you come in because everybody's got guns. Get shit-faced, then you pick up your gun on your way out. Yeah, that's the best time to get it after you've gotten a bar argument. But you find people, they were very kind and very cool and very competent, as you were saying. And they're people that are also dealing with nature in a way different level. They're dealing with weather, you know, real weather.

And we don't have to do that, especially in California, which is the most ridiculous and retarded state in the country as far as the way people behave on the norm. Don't get me wrong, I love it here and there's a lot of cool people here and all my best friends are here. But the reality of California is that we don't have to deal with weather at all. The worst thing we have to do is press a button. Oh my God, it's hot.

You press a button, it's not hot anymore. I mean, as long as the power stays on, really not that fucking hard to deal. But if you're living in Alaska, you have to take precautions every year. You have to keep a candle in the back of your car. You have to keep matches. You have to keep blankets with you at all times because your car could break down. You could be at the side of the road. No one could be on the road. And that candle might keep you alive. You have to light that candle in your car with all the doors shut. And that's the

only way you're going to stay warm and stay alive. There's a lot of that kind of thinking going on there and then when someone sees you pulled over the side of the road they're not like oh who's this creepy fuck you know in Sherman Oaks that's pulled over to the side of the road with its hazards on I'm not stopping for this guy they're like oh he was this person this cut you know kindred soul out here in the middle of the woods that got fucked and this could be me yeah on in. Do you guys have cell phone service? No, if we drive five more miles, we get cell phone service. Hop in the car.

I'll take you to where we can call somebody. Yeah, there's not... But your professor friends, to not pick them up, would be right where they live. That's the crazy thing about it. It's like, you're right that the professor probably wouldn't pick up someone who was broken down on the side of the road,

but they're right to and not doing that if you live in a city because you never know what the fuck you're going to get. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. You got to participate in the world you're born into whether you agree with it or not. Yeah. You know, sorry to interrupt you. What you said about California, that also ties to the origins of civilization, actually, in a funny way.

One of the leading theories for why Europe became more advanced, used in quotes, right, is because people had to think twice there. People, they had winter. So when you build a house, it has to be better engineered. The best engineers, you know, the best cars, German, you know, they're not Italian. Because in architecture and all this stuff you see in Europe, the Mediterranean countries are sloppy, right? The houses aren't insulated. They're not – the fittings aren't right. You know, people, like, show up late.

The whole mentality is kind of lazy, fair, whatever. Well, that's the weather. It's a reflection of the weather it's a reflection of the fact that they're not battling weather for their lives right so there is a competence and a sort of carefulness and a you know checklist if you're a pilot you use a checklist because if you don't you're you're a dead pilot you know it's like that in northern climates as well it develops a certain kind of approach to life that's much more competent and then on the other hand you got places like brazil where the weather's fantastic and the people are like laughing and they're on the beach they're

smiling and very friendly and very warm and that's also because they don't have to they don't have to deal with any bullshit they're all wearing flip-flops i mean nobody has to worry about nothing it's no matter what the the you know time of the year is, it never gets cold. There's people in Rio that are surfing 24 hours a day, seven days a week. They can do whatever they want. There's no sharks down there either. I think recently someone got bit by a shark in Brazil. It was like a really, really rare situation.

So they're like surfing in perfect water. It's like bath water. Hot women. Beautiful waves. Hot. Hot, hot. Hot. Everything's great. I know you like Werner Herzog.

Yeah. You ever see a documentary called Bus 107? No. It's called? It's not Werner Herzog, but it's a documentary that will blow your fucking mind. I know you're into Grizzly Man, too. Love it. Yeah.

Oh, the music in Grizzly Man. Oh, no, no. I'm thinking of Into the Wild. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Anyway, this film, is it Bus 107? No. Is that coming up?

It's Bus one something. I don't remember which number. But it's a Brazilian documentary, and it's available with subtitles. It's about this guy who tries to hijack a bus. Whoa. And his idea is just to grab some money and jump off the bus, but there's some cops going by and they stop

and the bus gets surrounded and then suddenly it's not at all what he intended. He didn't intend to be on this bus with 30 people holding them all hostage, but now he's there and then the TV cameras show up, and there are helicopters, and there are TV crews all around, and it turns into this national day where everyone in Brazil is watching this dude on the bus.

Live coverage. Wow. It's like the OJ. Bus 174. 174. A highly recommended documentary for insights into Brazilian life and just something you'll never see it's like Grizzly Man in the sense that

there's a lot of actual footage used in the documentary so you get the interviews and stuff but then you've got the footage that the TV crews were taking at the time there he is wow it's very intense

wow that's fucked were taking at the time. There he is. Wow. It's very intense. Wow. That's fucked. Okay, I'll check that out. Yeah. Yeah, I think that a certain amount of nature, having to deal with a certain amount of adversity, develops character.

It's one of the issues that I have with modern life as far as people just getting a nice safe job is that you don't really have to deal with too much adversity. There's not a lot of risk involved, not a lot of fear. And parents like that for their children. They're like, take a safe job, Johnny. You get in the union,

you got a good career there. Good government job. Yeah, but when you do that, when you reduce those risks, you also reduce the excitement of life. You take away some of the thrill of life. Yeah. My whole life I've been a thrilled junkie, you know, in more ways than one.

I've avoided the fear, like the drugs and the things that can really fuck up your life. I've avoided all those because I've seen them happen before. But if I didn't avoid them, I for sure would have got hooked on something. You know, I'm a crazy person. You have an addictive personality? Fuck yeah, for sure, 100%. Yeah, but I funnel it into being addicted to positive things. Right.

Like I get addicted to martial arts or I get addicted to stand-up comedy or I get addicted to, you know, things that I like. But those – they're thrills. That's what I'm addicted to. I'm addicted to martial arts. One of the things about it that was so exciting is regular life became so much more manageable when four or five days a week I was fighting for my life. It's like there was a reality of a mad scramble with some crazy brown belt who's got a nasty guard. And you guys are doing battle.

He's trying to choke the blood out of your neck. And because of that, everything else I would do would be so much less threatening. Yeah. And so much more in context. It would give it a context and it would give it a perspective. That's a good point. And it also cleanses the mind to be terrified.

Yes. I mean, I rode a motorcycle for seven years in Spain. I had a BMW. Oh my god, in Spain? I rode it every day, every night. That's so crazy. Yeah, I used it for work. How many accidents? You know what? A lot of near misses.

Some crazy near misses, but I never dropped it whoa that's amazing i've dropped other motorcycles i almost died on a motorcycle in uh well i almost died on that one but that's another story but the the first time i almost i took a bike a trail bike i laid it down and slid under a barbed wire fence. Oh, my God. When I was like 14. Oh, my God. That could have just shredded you. And then the next time I was in Thailand, I was in Chiang Mai, Thailand, and I rented this Suzuki 185, like a small light bike. And I did like a six-day trip around the Golden Triangle in northwest Thailand, which borders Burma and Laos.

And it's where like 80% of the heroin in the world comes from. It's also where I tried heroin, which was a weird time. Did you try an injection or did you try smoking it? No, I smoked it. Smoked it. I met these two British guys. It was such a weird thing. And I remember exactly when it was because I got up early, like 7 o'clock in the morning,

to watch Mike Tyson fight James Bone Crusher Smith. Oh, I remember that. And it was being shown in this little bar cafe in Chiang Mai near where I was staying. And I got up early because I wanted to see it. And these two British dudes and me were the only ones there. And they were junkies. And they were like super high class dudes. Like one of them, his uncle was in parliament.

And the other was the son of a very famous writer whose book I had read, actually. Wow. I won't say his name, but very well known. He won the Booker Prize and big deal. Anyway, these two were junkies. He won the Booker Prize and big deal. Anyway, these two were junkies. So the one dude was in Thailand ostensibly to be an actor in the taping of Good Morning,

the filming of Good Morning Vietnam, the Robin Williams film that they were taping at the time in Bangkok. That was the story he gave his parents. Bullshit. He was just getting high all the time. And then his friend was like, I got to go save him. And then so he came and now he's getting high all the time. And I met the two of them at this Mike Tyson fight. And so, and I had always, you know, my, my thing about drugs is I'm not, I don't have an addictive personality. I'm too lazy to be addictive, honestly, really. So I, I do things, I get the thrill out of it and i try to be careful about it and you know i like to do things in the place that it comes from right i've done ayahuasca in brazil

and peyote in mexico and so i'm in northern thailand in chiang mai it's going to be the cleanest best quality heroin ever and i meet these two guys and they're into it and they've got all the contacts and all that and uh so we got to be friends. And, you know, they invited me to get high. And I was like, okay, look, I've never done this before. They're like, no, no, we got you. No worries. So we're sitting in their room and we did the Chase the Dragon, you know, where you put the heroin on tinfoil.

Because the flame can't touch the heroin. It's like. It'll ruin it? Yeah, I can't go to prison for saying this. Right. Talking about this. This is all fiction. But you know what?

Non-Americans, if you admit that you have ever used illegal drugs, they can they stamp your passport. You're never allowed in the country. I have two friends that happened to. So if you're in another country and you start talking about using drugs like on another podcast, they can. Well, I don't know. I don't know about podcasts. But what happened with this friend, she was coming back from amsterdam she was a judge in the cannabis cup competition she lives in vancouver and the plane she changed planes in seattle and they took her and said so

what were you doing in amsterdam and she told them and they said so have you smoked marijuana she said yeah and they stamped her password she's never allowed in the u.s again because she smoked marijuana in amsterdam wow and another guy i know is a psychiatrist a canadian psychiatrist who had worked with lsd psychotherapy and they stopped him at the the drive-through border you know at vancouver and interviewed him they they wik him. And they're like, oh, you did research with LSD. Have you ever used LSD? He said, yeah. Stamp. Wow.

Dude's never allowed in the country. That's crazy. Is that only America? As far as I know. Canada's rough. If you get drunk driving in America, good luck getting into Canada. Oh, really? Oh, yeah.

Yeah, a lot of fighters have issues getting into Canada for fights. A lot of comedians have issues. A lot of comedians have had issues getting into the Montreal Comedy Festival, which is one of the

big events for stand-up comedians. Because of drunk driving convictions? Yes, because of drunk driving convictions. Or any domestic violence or anything

like that? Yeah. Eddie Bravo had an arrest for having a gun on him legally. He was working for a check cashing place and he used to have to carry

large sums of cash in his car to another location. And so he would leave with the check cashing company, and he had a registered concealed carry permit for a gun. And so he got pulled over for something, and he had to tell the cop, officer, I work for a check cashing company. I have a legal registered handgun in my car right now. It's loaded. And then they go, OK, hold on a second. We're going to put you in handcuffs. We're going to run this.

So they run it. They go, OK, checks out. They let him go. Because it was not even supposed to be on his record because it was all legal. It doesn't matter. Every time he goes to Canada, they sit him down. Tell us about this.

You have a gun on side you right now? You take a gun? You try to go for the border? No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I was working for a company. I was allowed to have this gun. He's got an extra hour every time he goes into Canada. That happened to me, actually.

Pushing an immigration. Going into Canada. What was your issue? Well, they asked me if I'd ever been convicted of a crime. And I said no. And, you know, I go sit down and then they call me over and they said, the guy's like, you said you'd never been convicted of a crime, correct? I said, yeah. He said, is there anything you'd like to say about Fairbanks, Alaska in 1983?

And I was like, yeah, I got busted in Fairbanks you know for eating a Snickers bar in a fucking grocery store and not paying for it but I did three days it was Memorial Day weekend I did four nights in the prison and then the guy said you know 20 hours of community service

and this will disappear from your record if you don't get arrested in a year so I always say no because that because I wasn't convicted of anything. And they said it would be taken from my record. And the guy's like, no, the fact that you were not Alaskan, so you're from out of state, meant they couldn't strike it from your record. And it's on your FBI record, which is what we get in Canada. You're a snicker thief.

Yeah, I'm a snicker thief. So he's a cool guy. I did four days in a federal medium security prison with no underwear. For a Snickers? For a Snickers bar. What do you mean with no underwear? Were you wearing anything or just naked? I was wearing shorts.

Why did you tell us that? Yeah, why didn't you have pants at the grocery store? Why did you tell us about no underwear? Because it makes it more harrowing. Come on, man. I was 19 years old. Were you very twinkish? I was tw years old. Were you very twinkish? I was twinkie.

I was very twinkie, yeah. So you were worried. It was all going to go down. I mean, I would have been worried if I were wearing anything. A fucking Snickers bar. Yeah. Isn't that under the amount of money that they could even bust you for something? Maybe not in the 80s.

Reagan was in president. They were trying to fucking be tough on crime. Just say no. Yeah, and also I had a... I mean, what happened was we got in from this 10-day hitch with these two guys I'd met on the ferry coming up the Inside Passage, and we had this long hitch through the Yukon Territory,

all this crazy shit, and we get to Fairbanks, so the first place we go is the laundromat because we stank, right? We didn't have that special soap. Defense soap. Defense soap. And so we went to the laundromat.

We put everything possible in the washer. So all three of us were wearing shorts with no underwear, boots with no socks, and a jacket with no shirt. And then one of the guys was like, oh, he wanted to go to the grocery store because there was a pay fund. He was going to call his girlfriend to let her know that he'd arrived on time. And I was like, all right, I'll go over with you. And the other guy is going to stay with the bags or backpacks and all that shit and, you know, watch the clothes. So I went with him. Somebody was on the phone.

We started pushing a cart around. We were like, you know, Soviet immigrants, like, oh, so many kinds of, you know, food here. Because we'd been living in the woods eating nuts and chocolate and LSD for the last 10 days. And so he opened a thing of kefir. It was the first time I'd ever heard of kefir, which is like liquid yogurt. Yeah. And drank that. Great for your body.

Acidophilus. And I, for some reason, ate a Snickers bar, even though I'd been eating chocolate. Not much imagination there. And then he used the phone. We ditched the cart and we left. And so there's some security guy had seen us and turned into a thing. This cop showed up and I had a knife in my boot and some grass in my pocket, both of which were legal at the time in Alaska, but it was enough to make this cop not like me at all. And he was like this, you know, Napoleonic cop kind of situation. And he didn't like smart ass college kids from outside coming into Alaska in the summer.

Stealing Snickers bars. Fucking around. Yeah. Fucking around with Kiefer. So he took us, he handcuffed us and took us to prison, Fairbanks Correctional Center. Did you not have the money for the Snickers bar? Yeah, we had plenty of money. You just didn't want to pay for it?

But it was like, well, you tell it to the magistrate. Oh, you mean for that? No, that was just like, I don't know what the fuck that was. You were just young and being silly. We were just dumb and maybe there was a line or something. I don't remember. But we pretended we were shopping. So we put dog food and shit in the cart.

And we ate our stuff and put the package like we were going to pay for it when we checked out. Right, right, right. So I don't know what we were just being dumb. But, yeah, so we ended up being taken to this prison and I had a pipe too. Yeah, because I remember when we were did the intake, the guy that like the prison dude who booked us and you know did the whole intake thing i i was joking with him i was like yeah i'm not gonna get that pipe and grass back am i and he was like i don't think so man i was like well you know it wouldn't bother me if it just disappeared and was never even registered because grass is hard to come by in alaska right wasn't that

and so we sort of had a little understanding like i'm cool you're cool because he was like what the fuck? Snickers bar. Why would this guy? What's wrong with that cop? Did you, like, hit him or something? No, you know, he just had a hair up his ass. Right.

So this guy was cool. He saved us. Because what he did is he said, look, I'm not going to put you guys in with the general population. You're going to sleep in the gym at night. You've got some cots. You sleep in the gym. You never let the other one out of your sight the whole at night. You got some cots, you sleep in the gym. You never let the other one out of your sight the whole time you're here. You go to the bathroom together. You go to the

showers together. You watch each other's back and you'll get through it all right. And we did. It was wild. And this was like 83, I guess. And so there's a lot of money in Alaska, right, from all the oil. So the prison was plush. It was like every meal was all you can eat. Really? Salad bar, whole wheat rolls, white rolls. Wednesday was prime rib day where the cops could pay a buck to eat with the prisoners. Really?

Yeah. But the catch was you only had 20 minutes each meal. So I remember like one day we're sitting there at this table. We're like 19, maybe 20, something like that. We're sitting at this table and the guy across the table looked like Charles Bronson. You remember him? The stash and the tats and all that. And we were just like, this dude was shoveling it in.

And he looks up at one point and he says, this is the best fucking prison I've ever been in. Yikes. He's got a laundry list of prisons that don't meet that criteria. Didn't meet the standard. Yeah. His story was he found a dude with his wife and he beat him with a lead pipe and he didn't know if he was dead.

But as soon as it happened he got in his car. He was from New as it happened, he got in his car. He was from like New Mexico or Arizona. He got in his car and drove to Alaska because he knew he'd get picked up and he wanted to get picked up in Alaska because he'd heard the prisons were much better. That's hilarious.

So he might have beat a guy to death and said the way to deal with this is to go to a place that has awesome prisons. And that place just happens to be on the exact opposite of the continent. That's fucking far as shit. It's a long drive. How long does it take to drive to Alaska?

Can you actually drive straight to Alaska? Yeah, the Alcan Highway. Whoa, what is that like? It's bumpy. Or at least it was in the 80s. Shitty, huh? Yeah, yeah. Because, you know, every winter it gets all torn up.

Yeah, how many lanes is it? Most of it's two lanes. One on each side? Yeah. So you can get stuck behind some asshole that wants to go 40 miles an hour? Well, there's a lot of passing. I mean, a lot of it's just flat. Because, like, the Yukon's tundra.

Right. It's just like being, you know, it's just flat, scrub, plants. I can't imagine someone driving all the way the fuck to Alaska. That just seems insane. I just drove to L. That just seems insane. I just drove to L.A. from Vancouver by way of Utah. How long did that take? Ten days.

Ten days? But we stopped and went hiking in Utah. Okay. You made a trip out of it. Yeah. How many hours was it actual driving? I don't know. It was about 6,000 kilometers, I think, which is around, what, 4,000 miles, something like that, 3,800. Yeah, something like that.

I think it's 2.2 per. Yeah. Yeah, 2.2 kilometers per mile, something along those lines. 100 kilometers is 60 miles. 100 is. Something along those lines, yeah. Like 60 miles an hour is 100 kilometers. 62, I think 62 miles an hour.

Yeah. That's. Utah's great. Yeah, Utah's amazing. It's so beautiful, man. Mo hour. Yeah. Utah's great. Yeah, Utah's amazing. It's so beautiful, man. Moab. Oh. Yeah, we were in Moab.

And then I'd been wanting to go to Moab since the early 80s because I read this book called Desert Solitaire by Edward Abbey. You ever read that book? No. Oh, it's a great book. Essays about the desert. Edward Abbey was like a redneck philosopher hippie i mean he just integrated these world he was like a like who's the singer willie nelson he's like a willie nelson kind of author you know like country guys from pennsylvania originally but he moved out west in the 60s and

got a job as a fire lookout in uh arches national monument or one of those parks or maybe his canyon lands right there and spent the summer by himself in this house you know just with his incredible view looking for lightning strikes and uh and he wrote about he wrote essays and the book became this cult word of mouth classic it's probably sold a million copies by now wow it's a great book. So I'd wanted to go there since I read that book in the early 80s. And this was the first chance I got. Man, it's amazing.

So nice. I have a good buddy who was living outside of Salt Lake for a while. And then he had to move to Arizona. And he fucking hates it. He had to move there for work. But he just ranted and raved about how great Utah was. And then I went up there this winter to go skiing for the first time. I suck at skiing.

That's beside the point. It's so beautiful up there. So goddamn gorgeous. Yeah. Rolling hills. And then we were there this summer. We went there the winter to ski, and then I was there this summer filming the TV show, the sci-fi show.

One of the things we did was in Utah, and everything was fucking green and gorgeous, and you just get to see what it looks like when it's not covered in snow. It's like, oh, my God, this is paradise. Go to the Red Rock country. Yeah. Down Moab, you know, the arches. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's just phenomenally beautiful. There's still some sweet spots in this country. Yeah, I mean, the thing for me, I shit on america a lot anyone who follows my twitter feed sees me bitching about america constantly but the thing america's got that europe doesn't have is just incredible natural beauty and large scale you know it's not some little park you know like the grand, Yosemite. Yeah, but there are just massive chunks of amazing. All these parks around Moab are amazing.

Alaska, the whole fucking state is just off the charts, man. Yeah, really nice. We were in Seattle for the sci-fi show, and Duncan and I went to Mount Rainier. And we drove off. By the way, it's only like 50 miles outside of Seattle. And you're in the mountains. From Seattle, it's like a cloud. Yeah.

It's massive. Massive and gorgeous. And it sort of highlights that city. I think it's one of the reasons why that city is so cool. It's got the ocean there to keep you humble. And then it's got this massive mountain. It's like, listen, bitch, you ain't shit. Relax.

Yeah. But when we drove up there, I mean, Duncan and I just could not stop, like, rolling down the window and just sticking our heads out and go, God, is this real? It's so gorgeous. Yeah. Just deep, rich green with, like, low clouds everywhere because, you know, you're pretty high altitude up there in the mountains. And it's just the fog and the clouds and the trees. And it's just so alive in the air. You feel like you could eat it.

Is that when you were squatching? We were squatching. Yes. It's a technical term. I'm glad you used that. I follow your movements. Yeah. People who are not squash enthusiasts, they don't know the right terms.

They might say you're out big footing. That's not correct. No. We were squatching. Big footing. That's snowshoeing. You might be out wasting your time. Hey, easy.

Well, one of the things that the guy said that we went squatching with, this guy Steve, very, very cool guy. The both guys we went with were very, very nice guys. They seem cool, actually, in the show. Yeah. Very, very cool guys. Seem pretty chill. Yeah, and one of the things that they said was like, look, man, even if there's no Bigfoot, we're still out here camping. Yeah.

We're having a good time. It's beautiful woods that we're in. And I like that attitude. Well, that's what people say about fishing. Yes. And hunting as well, although it sounds like your trip wasn't as enjoyable sitting in a freezer. It was enjoyable still. I liked it.

I like suffering a little bit. I think it's important to get the fuck out in the woods you know and hang out with your buddies and you know have a good time the guy on the land his name is doug um he took me to this one spot we went hunting and i went up in the tree stand and he he likes to do a lot of his hunting walking around and so he said let's let's split up for a. I'll go this way, you sit in the tree stand and maybe me walking around, sometimes it'll scare a deer towards you. And when I was sitting there,

it was just me alone for like an hour and there wasn't a single sound. Every now and then I'd hear like a little squirrel chip but there was no TV cameras this time. We had basically finished filming what we needed to film for the show. So just me sitting up there in the stand like looking around waiting for a deer to show up, but just

soaking in the beauty of the woods. And it's the driftless area of Wisconsin, which means it's the area that the glaciers didn't flatten out. So it's all hilly and gorgeous and woodsy everywhere and just creeks and just god damn it, it's

fucking beautiful. Just fucking beautiful and quiet and peaceful. And I felt like just sitting there for an hour did me good. Just like it cleaned me out somehow. It cleaned my spirit, you know? Yeah. You mentioned weather earlier. And we were talking about, you know, the cleanliness of fear.

Yeah. And there's something about weather that I find deeply relaxing. Yeah. Like a strong, like a storm. Yeah. A tropical storm, a hurricane. You know, I'm like one of those guys, I would tie myself to a tree and just like watch the hurricane come through.

Well, you can't do that. You get hit in the face by a car. That's the downside. Yeah. You're like tied, a fucking tree comes by and takes your head off. You shouldn't do that. You can't duck, yeah. But I agree with you, though.

As long as I know it's not life-threatening, a good thundershower is beautiful. Well, even if it is life-threatening, I mean, that's even more cleansing because it's good to be fucking terrified. A little bit. It's good to – I mean, for me, anything that reminds me of how insignificant I am is really liberating. Yeah. And the problem is when I get caught up in my ego and, you know, whatever the bullshit is that I need to deal with and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Right. And I forget how, you know, it's like the football coach who, you know, isn't smart enough to know how little it all matters, you know?

Yes. It's like I never want to forget how little it all matters. I agree with you. Because then you're screwed. I agree with you 100%. I think it's really important. I think, as we were saying about weather, that dealing with weather is important too. Just to know that you're humbled by nature upon occasion.

It's one of the things I like about when it rains in L.A. and everybody has to go, oh, okay, yeah, this could happen too. There's people that complain about it, but I love the fact that they're introduced to the reality of the fact that you're living on a planet with an ecosystem. And it's variable. It's very variable. Right. Yeah, something that cuts through your – I mean, I used to love it when the lights –

Your apathy. Yeah, and your – Complacency. You know, the infrastructure that – yeah, your complacency. Exactly. I mean, one of the cool things – and I've lived in India for months at a stretch, and one of the cool things there is that electricity would go out, like, constantly, you know? That's so cool. Yeah.

No, it's not. No, it is cool. Fucking terrible. That sucks. Your food goes bad while they're all covered in flies. That place sucks. Keep me from going there, please. You never been to India?

No, no, no. Oh, dude, you got to hit India. I don't, though. That's what's interesting. You don't though that's what's interesting i don't i don't i don't like indian food i love indian food i fucking love it yeah there's a dish named after me lamb rogan josh oh it's not named after me it just happens to have wait i had that last night it's delicious and somebody fuck, someone last night told me that story, showed me that recipe in her cookbook, and said something about the person who named it got you confused with Seth Rogen or something, or Josh somebody. No, it's an old dish. Is it an old dish?

Yes. Then what the hell was that bullshit story that she was telling me? That person's fucking retarded. Oh, my God, you're hanging out with a monkey. That dish has been around forever. Yeah. Let's find out how long Lamb, Rogue, and Josh has been around. I was hanging with this really sweet woman in Vancouver one night, and Lay Lady Lay came on.

And she said, do you know Dylan wrote that song for his dog? What? I said, what? And she said, yeah, his dog's name was Lady, and he wrote the song for the dog. Okay, this is... You know, her ex-boyfriend had told her that. This is from Persia. It's one of the signature recipes of Kashmiri cuisine.

Rogan means clarified butter or fat in Persian, while Josh means heat, hot, boiling, or passionate. Rogan Josh thus means cooked in oil at intense heat. Another interpretation of the name Rogan Josh is derived from the word rogan, meaning red color, the same Indo-European root that is the source of the French rogue and the Spanish rojo, and Josh meaning passion or heat.

So there you go. So this is old shit, man. It's not named after you. No, no. She's an asshole. She should do a Google search before she fucking spreads her nonsense. It's not me or that

beautiful Seth Rogen fellow. Which, by the way, I watched his last movie. This is the end. I just watched his last movie, This is the End. I just watched it. Holy shit, is that funny. It is funny. There are some fucking funny, funny, funny moments in that movie.

How good is Craig Robinson in that movie? Craig Robinson. Michael Cera was my favorite. The guy that was thinking the code. Oh, he was great, too. Everybody was great. The double blowjob in the bathroom. How about Kenny Powers?

How about Kenny Powers? Oh, my God. It's a fucking amazing movie. Scary movie, also. The double blowjob in the bathroom. How about Kenny Powers? How about Kenny Powers? Oh my God. It's a fucking amazing movie. Scary movie. Awesome. Scary, yeah, yeah, yeah. But fun, man. They're all just

taking the piss out of themselves. That's what I love about it. Yes, yes. They're all like... I love how Craig Robinson has a towel everywhere he goes

because he sweats so much which is so true about Craig in real life. He's always got a towel on stage with him. Oh, that was a really, really funny movie, man. That was a good movie.

Did I ever tell you there's this one video of a fight that broke out in a gymnasium, and everyone even used to have towels more back then? Because the towel thing is kind of new. In the last 10 years, rappers started having towels all the time and stuff. The towel thing is new? Yeah, where they just carry around towel all the time no you've never seen it yeah yeah so there was this fight that broke out in this gymnasium and they showed the video lasted to like everyone got out of the gymnasium and on the ground was just

towels and the stickers from people's hats it looked like it was a joke that's hilarious a big rap battle with towels and stickers yeah remember when remember when they used to wear the tag on their hat? Yeah. Hanging from their hat like Minnie Pearl from the old Opry? She was the original gangster. Minnie Pearl. From the grand old Opry. She always had a tag on her hat, man.

I don't know what that was about. Did you hear about that waitress in New Jersey? Yes. Oh, my God. Yes. it's a fucking gross story do you know the story uh not yet about the uh the lesbian woman she was working as a waitress in this oh she got some nasty note yeah she got some nasty note that said we're not going to leave a tip because we don't agree with your life story apparently it's a hoax no yes

seriously yes the family started getting shit. I didn't hear that. The family brought in the actual original receipt. You know how you get a customer copy and a merchant copy? Yeah. Well, the customer copy was the one that she left. But the merchant copy, she left blank. You know how sometimes people fuck up and they fill out the wrong one?

Well, they had the customer copy. They had a copy of it. They saved it. And the merchant copy, I don't know if somebody Photoshopped it. I don't know what the fuck happened. You can reprint these out. So all she did is just reprint it out and then write it on there. And she wrote on it in a hoax to try to draw attention to herself.

And people have been sending her money and stuff. Yes, thousands and thousands of dollars that she was going to use and she was going to send to something else. And, you know, I mean, I don't know if, who knows? I mean, we're accusing her of hoaxing it, but it might have been something that her staff did. Right. It could have been a hoax on her.

Yes. No one knows. And so I think it's, we shouldn't definitely not accuse someone or, you know, say that she did it or that she was a liar. But somebody fucking hoaxed it. What's interesting is that, I don't know if you heard, the family said that the only thing they could think of is that the hostess says Dana is going to be, or Dan's going to be your waiter and be here in a second. And then when she came up, they go, oh, you're definitely not a Dan, you know, or something like that, because her real name's Dana. Right. And so she kind of might have taken it as, oh, they're calling me a guy, you know, and

that's why she got mad at these people. Yeah, but that still doesn't mean that you should hoax that and write a fake, I mean, obviously. So did they actually did leave her a tip? Yes. They left her 20% or 18%. What? A credit card statement.

Yeah, they left her, like, the right amount. It reminds me, like, five years ago, I read this story in the International Herald Tribune about a guy. This relates to what we were saying earlier. A rich guy, millionaire, big house, who decided to give it all up and give everything away and live a simple life because that was happy. It would make him happier and this and that, right? So when I started working on Civilized to Death, I had this clipping that I had kept for years. And so I Googled the dude to see what's happened with this guy.

Is he still happy or does he get another job? What's going on? Turns out the whole thing was a hoax. Oh, wow. That he owed a bunch of money and he figured out that he would get more money if he auctioned his house so what he did was he said like and he went to a public relations company and they came up with this whole plan wow they're like he was going to renounce his wealth and all that but really behind the scenes he had to make money to pay off creditors whatever it was and the guys

going around the world still giving talks charging lots of money to give talks about how wonderful it is to give up all your money. It's all a fucking hoax. Oh, my God. That's hilarious. Yeah. That's hilarious. This family, apparently, not only were they not homophobic, they actually wouldn't vote

for Governor Christie because he didn't agree with gay marriage. So this family was very progressive. Right. So it's like, you know, she fucked whoever did it fucked up. They fucked the wrong people. Well, they just did something gross. They did something gross and fake. But that's the world that we live in, man.

You know, until we figure out how to tell whether or not people are lying, we're going to be dealing with this nonsense for a long time. Well, she's the one that came out and said, look what these people said and put it on her Instagram or whatever she did. That's actually a good point. so that that showed the wrong amount on there mm-hmm and so they have a credit card statement like going no this is the right amount here is my actual copy receipt so she had to have done it it must most likely unless someone tricked her and I took the good bill away and then wrote on the other one a fake signature. You have to find out the signatures match.

And then wrote on the one with the fake signature. Find out who the fuck wrote that. They have handwriting experts. They can tell if it's a woman's writing or a man's writing. Or transgender. Hey, easy. A cabbie. Could be a cabbie's writing.

A cabbie. Yeah, I don't know. I think you're going to have bigots for sure you're always gonna have bigots but you're also always gonna have like people that are crying out for attention and pretend they've been a victim of bigotry you're gonna have rape but you're also gonna have false rape accusations too it's like that's one of the reasons why i'm i'm really against gender uh identity in the fact that not not gender identity, but sticking with your gender, like, uniformly and prejudicially, like always. I'm on team penis, you know.

I think that's ridiculous. I think sticking with your race just is ridiculous. Sticking with your nationality, equally ridiculous. I've met fantastic people in England. I've met some awesome folks in Canada. It's stupid. It's like to categorize people or to like, I'm a fucking Patriots fan and those Giants could suck it. And it's the same thing. You're doing the same thing. And it's dumb. And it's just as dumb on all sides. And until that's resolved, you're going to always have this,

these cloudy situations until it's impossible for someone to rape a woman which is never gonna happen probably until you know we figure out there's no I mean this is a lot of steps before there's any no violence and no rape there's gonna be a lot of steps for there's no theft it's gonna be it's good probably we're not gonna see it in our lifetime but it's possible and that's the only way we're not going to see it in our lifetime. But it's possible. And that's the only way we're going to have real harmony. And these, I don't know necessarily how much pro-vagina or pro-men's rights groups, I don't know how much those things fucking help anybody. They create dialogue, I guess.

But I think they also divide in a lot of ways. And when people hear the word feminist, they almost automatically think, oh, she fucking hates men They're just really into women it creates like a rift when you hear men's rights organization. What do you think I think? Misogynists I think fat lazy misogynist who women don't like so they come up with a bunch of reasons why women suck Yeah, you know and that's not necessarily correct on either side, but it's still that's the automatic stereotype that Waitress who lied about an anti-gay tip has told far worse lies.

She used to tell her friends that she had survived brain cancer, that she did when in Afghanistan and all her people in her army thing blew up and she was the only survivor, which she never even toured in Afghanistan. That's pretty incriminating.

That's not good. That's too bad. Let's get off her. I don't want to dwell on that poor soul. You know, I agree with what you're saying. I think that the source of all these problems is scale. It gets back to population levels and the size of communities, right? Have you ever heard of Dunbar's number? Yeah.

So when you get above Dunbar's number, other people become abstractions, right? Stalin who said- 150 people. Right. Stalin said one death is a tragedy, a million deaths is a statistic, right? And it does become like that. So if you're, you know, like in her case, she might say might say well i wasn't lying to anybody i didn't know those people right you know people sending me money they obviously they can spare it you know

and i need it and you know you can make all sorts of excuses because you're not talking directly to the person you fucked right you know right whereas when and it's the same thing in the legal system you get minimum mandatory sentencing you know so all these people are going away to fucking prison for 15 years of their life. And the judge is like, this dude's sitting right in front of me. I can see this person as an individual. He doesn't deserve this. But because it's institutionalized, I have to do it. And so I really think that as long as we're living in these massive societies where we're constantly dealing with people we don't know in any personal way, there's always going to be that sense of emptiness and the abuse of trust.

Yeah, I think you're 100% right. I think we have a real hard time dealing with large numbers of people. You get this weird detachment, like I was saying about Jimmy Norton living in this box with a thousand people that he doesn't know. And also, I wanted to get back to this. We were talking about earlier about New York after the Twin Towers. We filmed Fear Factor in New York, and I think it was 2002 or maybe 2003 at the latest. And it was palpable how friendly people were and what a change it had made and what a sense of community. We had a woman who was with us

who may or may not have smoked some of my weed and she was one of the crew and may or may not have been ready for some of my weed and blacked out and actually fainted on the street and we had to catch her. We were all sitting around. I'm like, you guys want to get high? Maybe.

Allegedly, I said that. And we went outside, and she literally lost consciousness. So the firemen came. And when the firemen came over, first of all, they could have been more friendly. And they were really nice to her and everything. But the amount of love the firemen were getting from people on the street,

like waving to them, honking at them, you know, like just yelling, shouting nice things across the street, you know. Somebody yelled something about, you know, I love first responders or something along those lines, and they waved to them, and there was like this feeling of appreciation and camaraderie. Think about the American soldiers going into France in World War II, the amount of love they were getting. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, man, yeah. Save us from this fucking horror. Yeah, I mean, it's real life. And that's the thing, man. We can go through an entire lifetime without ever really experiencing real life.

We don't see death. I mean, I don't know how many dead bodies you've seen, but, you know, I think my grandmother is the only dead body I ever saw. And I had to kiss her on the fucking lips, which was pretty creepy. I saw my grandfather. Yeah. Same sort of situation. Do you ever, you know this mortician, ask a mortician, Caitlin Doty? She would be a funny guest for you to meet or just to hang out.

She's like a hip, young, sexy mortician. Oh. She's got a show called Ask a Mortician that gets hundreds of thousands of hits. A hip, young, sexy mortician. Yeah. Okay, Ask a Mortician. Ask. That sounds ridiculous.

Yeah, I had her on my podcast. She was fantastic. She's just fascinated by death. And, you know, there she is. Whoa. She's just fascinated by death And there she is Whoa, she's pretty hot Damn, she's hot from mortician But still, that's just so weird Can't do it

And her story is cool, man How cool could it really be? Well, she's I mean, it's really cool Because the thing is We come to these moments in our lives Where we have to face death And we get some creepy dude in a bad suit, you know, selling us overpriced. By the way, what's going on with a $12,000 hermetically sealed stainless steel coffin?

What the fuck are we saying with that? Yeah, we're saying we're ripping you off. Yeah. Joey Diaz has a good line on that because one of his buddies that he went to school with, his family owned a funeral parlor. And they were just pretty open about what a ripoff it is and how they scam you and how they get you in a period where you're in great grief. And they say, you know, wouldn't you like to represent your family in a very beautiful way? And we can offer this fantastic walnut-lined coffin. This is the finest velour interior.

Oh, finest velour. And, you know, these people are, they don't want to feel bad that they're not taking care of their loved ones. So they spend insane amounts of money. And then there's a scam where even if you want to cremate someone, you still have to embalm the body. So they have to embalm the body, prepare it for preservation. You know, the embalming, body. So they have to embalm the body, prepare it for preservation. You know, the embalming, Caitlin, and I talked about this, that's American. Nobody else embalms bodies. Really?

Yeah. This whole, like, take out the blood, put in toothpaste, that's American. And you know where it came from? Where? Civil War. Really? Yeah, because they wanted to, so many guys are dying, and their families wanted to bury the body back home on the farm.

You know, so the guy dies down the guy dies down in wherever, Georgia. They have to get the body back to Pennsylvania. It's going to rot because it's going in a wagon behind a horse or something. So that's when they started the embalming thing so they could get the bodies back home. And it just took off and became an American tradition. And it became also one of those things where it becomes part of the system. You know, once something is in the system, it becomes an issue where it's really difficult to change that.

It becomes, you know, it's like one of the problems with making drugs illegal. It's like, well, okay, what about all these people that make their living off arresting people for drugs? Right. You know, and that's one of the main issues as far as lobbying is concerned is prison guard unions. Prison guard unions spend a lot of money to make sure that certain drugs remain legal or illegal. And the companies that make these private prisons. Yes.

The state has to guarantee them a 98% occupancy rate. How crazy is that? So you've got to come up with the bodies. Oh, my God. That's so fucking crazy. A funny example of that is in Spain. Well, funny, but, you know, less tragic, I guess, example. In Spain, they've got an industry of dubbing films and TV shows. And it's really advanced.

So, like, the guy who does Woody Allen always does Woody Allen. So Spanish people associate that voice with Woody Allen. And apparently it's a real art form, right? Whereas in Portugal, subtitles. Everything's been subtitled forever. So there's no tradition of dubbing. There's no dubbing industry in Portugal. So you go to Portugal, everybody speaks English.

The guy checking you, you know, taking your money at the gas station speaks English. Because he grew up watching American programming with Portuguese subtitles, hearing the voices speaking English, right? Just pick it up. Spain, nobody speaks English. So people like me go there and make a lot of money teaching English because they've got this stupid dubbing system. So they're probably like two dozen, three dozen people make a living doing this and they're completely fucking the entire country just so they don't lose their jobs. That's fascinating. Yeah. Hundreds of millions of euros spent, if not billions, on English classes.

And it's completely unnecessary. Just get rid of those 30 guys who make a living dubbing. And everybody will have to learn English. Or not. Well, they won't have to learn it because they'll grow up watching it on TV and hearing it. Wow. That's wild. Yeah, there's a lot of weird things like that where something becomes a part of the

system and even though it's illogical, it just remains because it's a tradition. That keyboard right in front of you. Yeah, QWERTY. Folks don't know. Explain that. Well, the keyboard, the layout of the keyboard, the placement of the letters is the way it is because of frequency of use. And so they tried to space the letters out so that you wouldn't hit two letters that were next to each other where the arm came up on the typewriter so that the arms would tangle.

So they tried to make it so that the arms that came up would be spaced out. So they laid out the keyboard that way. So it's a very inefficient way to have a keyboard because it's based upon the demands of a machine that no longer exists. It's not based upon ease of use. Right. Which, I mean, really that's a metaphor for society in general. Yeah. Is what I've been saying the whole time.

Like the interests of the corporation, the interests of these institutions supersede the interest of the person. So people always say to me when I get into these arguments about human nature, like, yeah, but we're people. We can decide. We can free will, yada, yada, yada. But you do want a shoe that's more or less shaped like a foot. But, you know, you do want a shoe that's more or less shaped like a foot. Right? If your shoe strays too far from the shape of a foot, you're fucked.

Right. Yeah. And so, yeah, the keyboard's a good example of that. Have they made one that's like, oh, this would be the... Oh, yeah. There's a much more efficient key layout. But the problem is you would have to, first of all, you'd have to change your key. You'd have to bring it to a place and get it done. Or if you have an actual external keyboard, you can get it and learn it.

But it's really weird. And you'd have to relearn. Yeah. Yeah, so there's this vested interest. I can type pretty goddamn fast, and I don't have to look at it. I can just do it where I'm talking to you. As long as I feel those little nubs on the F and the J, I'm good to go. But I know where the system is i know where everything is yeah apparently though it's not the best way

and the other way is like statistically quite a bit faster it's like esperanto what's that esperanto is this um like an artificial language that was invented, I think, late 19th century. Not Ebonics. Do you know that I, on my resume, I have Ebonics to English translator. That's a good move. I have been paid. Really? I have been paid to translate from Ebonics to English. So you're like that lady on the movie Airplane.

I speak Jive. I speak Jive. Exactly. This friend of mine was- How much did you get paid for that? I got paid pretty. I speak Jive. Exactly. This friend of mine was... How much did you get paid for that? I got paid pretty... I mean, whatever. It was back when I was

teaching English in Spain. I was living in Barcelona. This friend of mine was... A Spanish woman was a translator for an independent film festival that they have every year in Barcelona called InEdit. And so she calls me up

and she says, Hey, Chris, do you understand black people? And I thought she meant conceptually, you know. It's like, yeah, definitely. Some, you know, whatever. As much as I understand anyone. And she's like, no, no, the way they talk.

Like, oh, yeah, whatever. So the story was that that year the films were all about the original bebop guys, the origins of hip hop in Brooklyn in the 70s, I guess, and Delta Bluesman. And so these Spanish translators who spoke English very, very well would listen to these dudes and they couldn't understand what they were saying. So they had me come down. At first they had called a black guy, but he was British and he didn't understand them. Right. So then they're like, well, I know a white guy, but he's American. So I my job was to go down, sit there next to a translator, watch this DVD with the pause thing and just, you know, pause. Like, you know, the dude would be like, yeah, we're up in my crib. And it's like, stop. That means they went back to his apartment. I didn't even have to translate it into Spanish. I also was the in-house editor and translator for the biggest porn company in the world. Whoa.

Private. Yeah. In-house translator? And editor. Yeah. So you had to translate American porn to Spanish? Again, what I pretty much did in that job was translate from bad English to better English. Because they had someone else who would like do the rough translation

and then they'd email me the documents and I just had to go through and clean it up. And there are funny things like, for example, in German, tail, the word tail refers to penis. So I remember one of the first ones I was translating, it was like for some hardcore porn mag, you know and and there were two dudes wagging their tails yeah and one of the dudes or the woman looked at the dudes and was and was like oh you guys have nice tails or nice tail and i was like whoa wait a minute in english tails you know the woman it's completely different but anyway that was a that was a weird gig that was that was the

gig that strangely enough led me to meet paulo cuello the brazilian writer you know him no he wrote the alchemist like i've heard of that best-selling book in the history of humanity what is the alchemist about the alchemist is this um is a story about uh the prod prodigal son. It's what Joseph Campbell called the hero with a thousand faces, right? It's a guy born in southern Spain, goes on a quest, goes through northern Africa, meets all these characters, and they give him challenges and tests and things. And then he goes through the tests, and he goes back home, and he finds the treasure he was looking for all the time right the odyssey it's the same story it's not a good book i'm not recommending it it just sold more books than any book since the bible really yeah it's a huge bestseller wow paulo cuello is an industry like you go to a bookstore there will be a paulo cuello stand with but they're not good books they're it New Age bullshit. It takes the oldest story in the world, retells it, and calls it new and makes a lot of money.

People love New Age bullshit, though, don't they? They do. The knowing that something's wrong and searching for an answer and finding one that has the most mystical qualities attached to it, that's New Age bullshit, isn't it? It is. Do you know Jamie Ian Swiss, the magician? No. I was interviewing him. He's like the world's most famous close-up magician.

He'll do shit in front of you on a table that will blow your fucking mind. Anyway, he said the worst. He said smart people are the easiest to trick. Really? Yeah, because their attention is predictable. You know where they're going to look. You can pull their attention where you want. They're well-trained.

Kids are really tough because kids will look where they're not supposed to look. Right. And he said he hates doing magic for new agers because they already believe in all this bullshit. So it's like you already believe that Crystal's going to save you. Then, you know, what I do isn't really going to impress you. It's like selling fake real estate to mentally handicapped people. Yeah, there's no challenge. What are you doing there?

It's like what Bernie Madoff did, that's a goddamn scam. A very sophisticated scam, and probably there's a lot of satisfaction in tricking all these really smart people to give you your money. Yeah, but it's also very simple, right? You just lure them in with more money. More money. You know what works for them. Even though people were looking at the numbers going,

this doesn't even make any sense. Where's this money coming from? This doesn't make any sense. You can't do that trick on someone who's not greedy. It's true, right? Yeah. Somebody who's frugal and smart and conservative, they're like, this does not seem like it makes sense.

Ooh, I'm going to get out. I don't need it. But Spielberg is like, listen, I'm telling you, the guy's giving me 20% of my investment. So many people lost money with that guy, too. Like, big, big, big people. Lots of fucking money. Lots of money.

Yeah. Yeah. I was working in the 80s after Alaska. I went there two years, and then I got this job in the Diamond District. You lived there for two whole years? Well, two summers. I worked in a cannery the first year and on a boat the second year. A fish cannery? Salmon, yeah. What do they do? Howy the first year and on a boat the second year. Fish cannery? Salmon, yeah.

What do they do? How do they do that? Do they boil the fish and then just chop them into cubes? Oh, no, man. It was very intense. I worked in Kenai, Kenai Packers. Still remember them. Respect.

And I lived in my tent up on the bluff. You lived in a tent? Yeah, all summer. Like an individual tent? Like a small tent? Yeah. Or like a big tent where a bunch of people lived in it? No, it was just my tent.

Not like a circus? No, it was a three-man geodesic dome tent. And at one point, we got eight people in there having a party. Yeah, that was pretty fun. In the rain. We all had to sit with our legs over each other in a circle. And we're passing the wine and the joints around in the circle oh wow and uh playing footsies that was the first time i ever saw anyone light a fart that was a that was a historic moment in my life i've never seen that i've saw i saw it in a video online nope it it does it eliminates the stink

yeah yeah kills the methane, right? Yeah. And so I was living there. So the way it works is the fish come in and, you know, you can get jobs because when the fish come in, they have to process them. Right. Like fast because they're rotting. Right. So the fish come in. They go through this.

They come off the boats. They go through this machine, this big clanking,anking you know machine that they called the chink and i thought it was called the chink because it like you know and one day i asked one of the the foreman and he said oh no it's called the chink because chinese used to do that job and the job was to rip off the head and and get the as much of the guts as possible so then if the fish go onto these conveyor belts and they come down the slime line and that's where I was I was a slime monkey the first year so you stand there you've got its piping cold water spraying on a cutting board you're wearing rain gear earplugs because it's so loud you You got a knife in your hand, gloves, and you're just gutting the fish all day.

You're getting what the chink missed. Sometimes it missed everything. So you have to take off the head, the fins, get the guts, get the bloodline off the spine and the back. stuff into a chute, which I later learned goes into tanks that are sold to pharmaceutical companies because the fat from the internal organs in the head of the salmon is the base for a lot of cosmetics. Whoa. And then the other, the fish, assuming the fish is in decent condition, goes onto another conveyor belt and then it goes down into the canning section where it's chopped and placed in these cans so it's just chopped right did you have lived some really crazy

adventures you've had a pretty wild and broad life well that was the point right i wanted i mean when i was 20 i was like you know fuck it i'm gonna die someday but it's so romantic that you actually like engineered that you know a lot of people don't you know they said maybe they rich, crazy life, but it's because they were an alcoholic and they were running from the law. But with you, you made a conscious decision to have this adventure. Yeah, it was definitely intentional. And, I mean, it helped that I didn't want to have kids, right? So that removed that whole area of problem for me. And it also helped that my parents were sort of upper middle class and really good people.

And they were like, you know, the only thing my dad said, that first year in Alaska, I called, I said, look, I'm going. I'm going to Japan. I'm just like, forget college. I'm alive. You know, also about the time I discovered acid, by the way, which just helped. A wonder, a connection maybe? And my dad was like, look, Chris, which helped. I wonder, connection maybe? And my dad was like, look, Chris, you know, I'll support you in anything you do.

But please, for me, go back to school, finish, get your degree, because it's going to be so hard to go back later. So for my dad, and really, to this day, that's like the only thing he's ever stepped in and said, please, trust me on this. I went back to school, but I said, I'm not going to live in the dorms. I'm not, because I went to the school full of rich, spoiled assholes. I mean, George Bush's niece was in my class. The heir to the Spalding fortune was in my class.

So I lived in my tent in the woods behind the art museum. That's awesome. Yeah. Dude, I love talking to you, man. It's so much fun. We're out of time, but we could do this all day. Yeah. Dude, I love talking to you, man. It's so much fun. We're out of time, but we could do this all day. Yeah.

We could do this like 100 times a year. You got a gig tonight, right? Yes, yes. We're at the Ice House. It's sold out, though, so go fuck yourselves, folks. If you're trying to buy a ticket,

too late. Tough shit. You snooze, you lose. I was going to ask for one. You could get in. Come on, son. He's sitting on my lap. Come on.

Get some rose petals. Listen, he's going to look at you like you looked at that nipple on the plane. Some rose petals. Feed each other rose petals. Yeah. Come on. It's rose petals. Listen, he's going to look at you like you looked at that nipple on the plane. Some rose petals. Feed each other rose petals all day. Yeah. And think about breastfeeding on planes.

Let's do this again, man. Yeah, anytime. Bring Duncan in here. I was trying to, well, Duncan, who knows? We'll talk about that off the air. Yeah, yeah. That would be great. Duncan, Daniele, the whole crew.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Daniele Bolelli came on. We've been doing that more lately, having a couple people on. We had Brian Callen and Tom Rhodes on last week. I had Dan Carlin and Daniele Bolelli. That was really fun. So we'll do this again. Yeah.

Always a pleasure, my friend. Always a pleasure. I really enjoyed it. Sex at Dawn. Please buy it. Go buy it. It's a fucking fantastic book. And if you're thinking about breaking up with your relationship, it'll push you over the edge.

I'll tell you that. It'll give you that extra push you might need if you're in a bad one to be free and to go fucking with no underwear in Alaska. Hey! We will see you tonight. If you want to come down, it'll be tonight is Red Band, Matt Fultron, Sam Tripoli, Brian Callen, Dom Herrera, and me. We're going to have a hell of a show.

It was supposed to be Greg Fitzsimmons, but unfortunately he has to pick up his mom at the airport. But Greg will be here on the podcast this Friday, so we should have a good time as well. And Greg has a new special out that I listened to on the way home from the Irvine Improv a couple of months ago, and it's really fucking funny, really good stuff. So we will see you soon, my friends.

Mad love to all of you. Thanks to Carbonite for sponsoring the podcast. Go to carbonite.com. Type in the offer code JRE for a free trial. Thanks also to Ting. Go to rogan.ting.com and save yourself some money on an awesome company, a company that really does have an ethical solution to all your cell phone needs. Thanks also to Onnit.com.

Go to O-N-N-I-T. Use the code name Rogan and save yourself some money. But this Friday we have an even better deal. This is Black Friday, and shit's going to get crazy. Save massive amounts of money, 25% off supplements, 15% off foods, 10% off fitness packages, plus an additional 5% off orders over $150 or 10% off orders over $250. So for big orders, that's like

35% off supplements and 20% off fitness. It's very powerful. And that's it. You got something going on? Yeah, this weekend I'll be with Joey Diaz in San Diego at the American Comedy Coast Saturday. I'm going to be at his show, but he has shows Friday and Saturday. And then December 11th, I'll be in San Jose Imp Diego at the American Comedy Co. Saturday. I'm going to be at his show, but he has shows Friday and Saturday. And then December 11th I'll be in San Jose Improv at the

Comedy Palace with Brody Stevens and Sam Tripoli and probably a bunch of other comics there. Good googly moogly. You can't miss it. December 13th I'm at the Crest Theater in Sacramento with the lovely twink Tony Hinchcliffe. And then on the

27th, I'm at the Mirage Hotel in Las Vegas, Nevada with Joey Diaz and Brian Callen. Shit shall be crazy. All right, we love the fuck out of you people and we will see you soon. Keep it together, bitches.

We're all in this as one. Big kiss. Mwah!