The Joe Rogan Experience - #648 - Adam Scorgie

Episode Date: May 14, 2015

Adam Scorgie is an independent filmmaker, most commonly known for his work on The Culture High, The Union: The Business Behind Getting High & Ice Guardians. http://www.theculturehigh.com/

Hey! about like how cool it was where because you were busy as shit when you did the culture high because everybody always asked being you know fans of the show they're like man rogan seems so cool i'm like you came to edmonton to do that you're doing your show it was after your show pack show at the the river creek yeah and then we started the interview at like 11 we didn't get done till 1 30 in the morning then you had to fly out in the morning yeah it was a couple hours later i leave yeah like i just think your fans should know how cool it is that you you do so much to try to help other people I'm really appreciate it man that you took the time and and did that when crazy you flew in that day did your show went For dinner came afterwards bust out two and a half hours and flew home a couple hours later. I think that's really cool, man Oh, well, thanks man. There's not that hard just talking. Yeah

But you know how to talk? I can do that. But the documentary was really good, man. Culture High was, I mean, I was wondering. I was like, man, where are they going to take it? Because you guys covered so much of marijuana prohibition in the union. There's two documentaries that Adam's done. The Union, which is all about B.C. and what's going on in British Columbia as far as the economy,

which is just inexorably wrapped up in the cannabis market. It's really kind of crazy. The world of British Columbia, like literally the economy up there would kind of implode if pot went away. Well, they compare like tourism is number one, and then it was like a close second. Because how do you determine exactly what black market money is but it was in the estimates were not being questioned at the five to seven to nine billion dollar range of the black market of the marijuana industry right so so much weed so much being shipped and majority of it at that time was going to the united states right yeah yeah so we looked at that because originally the reason we did the union and looked focused so much on the BC industries, I looked at getting into it.

I came back from New York and all the guys that like I went to school with and stuff were growing and we're doing really well. They had nice new houses, new Harleys living on the lake. And that's even where the name, the union came up from when I was like, dude, what the fuck has he been doing? He's doing really well. And they're like, man, he's in the union. I'm like, which one I want to sign up. And they're like, he grows dope. And I'm like, oh, that's how he's doing really well and they're like man he's in the union i'm like which one i want to sign up and they're like he grows dope and i'm like oh that's how he's making his money so yeah well that that first documentary was really fascinating and it put you guys on the map

and it took a while before you decided to do another one on pot yeah you would like i was like where are they going to come up with other shit to talk about because you covered everything so thoroughly well thank you we were the same problem like brett was really stressed about that the director like he was just like man he's like i thought i did it all in the union like what what what can i do but the fans really wanted another one like when you had me on the last time we were doing the kickstarter campaign and we were just receiving thousands of messages and everybody's like you gotta do another one you gotta do another one so brett really dove into as you saw human culture and politics right and then kind of fitting we went big into looking at the how policing has changed in our culture because of the drug war where one of the biggest assets that police had is information

to prevent new crimes but something that's happened almost strictly because of the drug war because of the way that the ratting system goes like, Hey, we catch you for minor possession and you've already got parole. You give us the bigger guys and we'll abolish your thing and you won't go to jail. Well, people saw their brothers,

cousins, mothers, family members getting arrested for simple possession and serving two to three years that they were like, well, I don't want to talk to the police anymore. So when a violent crime happens, rape,

murder, something really heinous, you don't want to talk to the cops. Cause you were like, well, I don't want to talk to the police anymore. So when a violent crime happens, rape, murder, something really heinous, you don't want to talk to the cops because you're like, he might start grinding on me for simple drug possession or something like that, right? Right. And the cops we interviewed said like during their career, they specifically witnessed the change. Like in the beginning of their career when they're in their 20s, they go through communities and people would come up to them and want to see their badge

and take a picture and see their handcuffs. And it was like, cool. By the end of their career, they would drive down neighborhoods and nobody wanted to talk to them. Right. Because it just felt that they're warring on us. It's us versus them versus being, you know, serving and protecting the community. Wow. That's fucked. The, the, the scene where the guy has his dog shot or the cops break into his house and there was nothing there. I mean, he had like paraphernalia. They found a pipe with resin, shoot his dog, his little kids. I mean, you and I both have kids. Like, could you imagine people coming in your house, like shooting your dog in front of you? And it was a little yappy dog. It wasn't like some fucking

werewolf Weiler or something like that. It was just, it's so sick because they do it to intimidate the people and to let the people know they mean business and because they can. You know that story about the mayor who lives outside of D.C.? They accidentally did this to him? Yes, I heard about that. It would have been a good story. I was wondering if you were going to cover it in the documentary. It's a crazy story for folks who don't know about it. This guy, the, apparently the postman was having pot shipped to this house

because he knew that this was on his route. So he would just intercept it. And so like, he knew that the package was from his friend. So he would, he would look at all the packages that came to this guy's house and because it was in a nice area, a lot of people wouldn't question it. Well, somehow or another, the DEA got wind of this. They realized that a package was coming to this guy's house. And so they just decided to raid the dude's house. They kick in the door, wave in the full four. All you heard was, Papa, don't hit me.

They shoot the guy's dog, and then they ran out. They had labs, which are like the friendliest dogs ever. The dog ran out into the yard to hide, and they went and found him and shot him you know i mean they executed him they shot two dogs and then they zip tied the family um and this guy was a fucking mayor you know and he's like oh you cunts i can't believe but it's kind of good for not for the dogs obviously to get shot but for a guy like that to see like this is what happens when you're a regular person. If they don't know you, you know, they don't know about your relationship with City Hall or any of that nonsense. They just, this is how they treat you if they can.

Well, and then you can imagine if you're from a lower economic situation, right? Now you're stuck in the legal system. Good luck, right? Trying to get out of that and fight your way out. You are looked at as a criminal from day one, even if you're innocent. get out of that and fight your way out you are looked at as a criminal from day one even if you're innocent and we go deep into the asset forfeiture laws in the film too right where they take everything in certain states and then you have to prove that they didn't have the right to take in the first place that that wasn't proceeds of crime right go in and take it's

funny because that opening scene like people are shocked by it but i've we've received a lot of people that were really like huge. They are so mad. They're like, that was not needed in the film. It's ridiculous. I stopped watching as soon as you put it there. Well, they're babies. They need to realize this is what's going on. You're doing a documentary on disturbing things.

You want to leave out the disturbing things from the documentary on disturbing things? Exactly. In the theater, when you watch it with a crowd, which is always my favorite part as a filmmaker, when you can really see it having an impact and you see the audience right there that wakes everybody up the credits come in and it's like boom that happens and everybody's like oh shit okay we're going on a ride here right yeah yeah that's well it's an awful ride you know that that really hurts my feelings that one that's uh that's hard to deal with that asset forfeiture law is really fucked too there's a guy who is a store owner and uh he had made apparently he made too many deposits that

were less than uh ten thousand dollars in cash and they accused him of you know i guess they have some some thing called structuring or something like that and the idea being like i'll pull this the uh image or the or the story, rather, because it's kind of a fucked-up story, man, because this guy was just a store owner. I mean, there's no evidence whatsoever that this guy has done anything wrong. I mean, he's doing all these interviews in his store. He would take some of the money from his store.

You know, I don't know if he put it in a safe or whatever, and he would get up to, you know, $8,000, $9,000, and just go deposit it in the bank yeah i thought there was no big deal the dea came in and just stole all of his fucking money like literally stole all of his fucking money and now this guy is stuck and now you have to go spend all the money to try to argue yeah more than they stole i'm sure you know it's crazy well that's the part you, through both films that was so, I think, shocking for us is when you sit down with all these ex-law enforcement. Because in the cult ride, we sat down with Sean Dunnigan, who was a former DEA analyst.

And you sit down with... Yeah, you got it, Jamie. That's it. I just pulled it off of... Here's this gentleman. He's a convenience store owner. Structuring policy. So what is that?

If they see too many deposits just conveniently under $10,000, they consider it? Yeah. I mean, but this guy, he just owns a convenience store. He gets cash. I mean, it's all right there. It's all super obvious. And the guy's gone, you know, public with it all. So it's a massive embarrassment for the IRS.

It's just evil. It's just the fact that they think that they can do this. There's no evidence whatsoever. Suspicion of structuring is what they call. And by the way, that violates their own requirements. They have

requirements that you have to meet in order for them to take the money if they accuse you of structuring. There has to be some evidence whatsoever but there's nothing and there's continuing to pursue it well the DEA's been getting hit hard lately because you've seen Michelle Lionheart step down right she's a fucking dummy oh my god that lady's so dumb well that clip is so good I mean it's been all over but we use it in the culture hi yeah right where that guy just grills mean, it's been all over, but we use it in the culture high, too, right? Where that guy just grills her, right?

It's like, is meth worse for you than marijuana? Oh, all drugs are bad. Again. All illegal. Again, all drugs are bad. Yeah, that part. She's so dumb. It's amazing that that lady figured out a way to get that gig. She is so poorly equipped to discuss the nature of addiction and drugs in front of the whole world like that.

You could see her deer in the headlights look like, did you fucking prepare for this at all, lady? Well, that's I think Cenk in the film, he does a great part where he explains. He's like, you know, Obama could have picked anyone. He's like, why did he pick the most right winger Republican? He's like, because in that way, he'll see more moderate and it might help him to get votes in the future. And, yep, that's exactly what it is. It's just he's really good at playing that stupid fucking politics game. Well, it's that line that Cenk used in the film that I love,

and he's like, and that's what nobody gets about Obama. He's a politician just like the rest of them, right? Don't be mistaken. There's no other way to get to that position where you're going to actually get in the White House. You're one of those two guys. You know, the Commission for Presidential Debates is a privately owned institution. A lot of people don't know. When you see those guys that are debating each other on television,

you figure, well, those guys are the most popular candidates. Not exactly. They're the ones marketed correctly and have the money behind them. Yeah, you have to, just in order to get into the Commission for Presidential Debates, to get into the debate, you have to have 15% polling in five polls, and they can choose those polls. They can just go and decide. Who chooses?

Who chooses that? The people that run the Commission for Presidential Debates, which is owned by some some multinational corporations? And there's a bunch of bunch of fuckery involved. Well, they let Ron Paul in or excuse me Um, the fuck's his name the old dude, but Ross Perot Yeah, yeah, well fucked everything up for everybody. Yeah, Ross Perot people don't remember Ross Perot He was this crazy, Texas who accused essentially the IRS and the Federal Bank of running this crazy pyramid scheme. He was talking about the Federal Bank and the Federal Reserve long before anybody ever understood that the Federal Reserve had nothing to do with federal.

They call it the Federal Reserve. It's a privately owned company. Yeah, it's kind of hilarious that all of our money goes through that. I mean, the hustle runs so deep and has been going on for so long. But Ross Perot was this billionaire dude who, this is pre-internet, and he bought out time on television and put his own television show on and had, like like fucking charts and graphs and showed where the money was going.

And everybody was like, whoa, whoa, what? Like he was the big, he was like the first blip of this information, uh, getting it out there to the public that is now like all over the internet, all over the internet. You know, like people of this day and age, like you taught, you could talk to the average 20 year old kid today and ask her Like how the Federal Reserve works and I bet there's a lot of them that'll go. I'll tell you exactly how it works Yeah, or if they don't know shit They don't know exactly they're at least hip to it that it's a private corporation and they're

Definitely that access you guys talking about a lot here on the podcast, but that access to information is change the game There's no more of those I used to call them toppers in high school that like whatever story you had like you had a cool story and they'd be like here on the podcast but that access to information has changed the game there's no more of those i used to call them toppers in high school that like whatever story you had like you had a cool story and they'd be like yeah well this one time i'd like like now you can be like okay so when were you there and you said you met such and such celebrity well he wasn't there on those dates right he was touring like now you can call out that bullshit yeah you could snopes it or like the urban legend that was you know when i was in it was like, that guy did so much acid, he thought he was an orange or a banana,

and now he's just scared, don't peel me, don't peel me. And now you Snopes, and everybody's like, no, that's a common misconception of a guy that, I'm sure maybe somewhere down the road there was someone that thought something similar, but that was like the scare story urban legend that you'd heard when I was going to high school. Yeah, I didn't even find out. I found out about Snopes through the rocket one, where the guy tied a rocket to his car and flew into a mountain and died. I remember hearing about that, and I was like, what? It was like one of those

Darwin Awards one. But then Snopes was like, eh. I don't think so. It wasn't true? It might have been. The thing about that is, for sure, if someone has a rocket and someone has a car, there's someone dumb enough to try to strap those two things together and see what's up. It's not outside the realm of possibility.

Absolutely not. It's not saying a guy went to the moon and found a hubcap. After inheriting a nightclub for several years when I was younger, I've seen tremendous amounts of stupid things happen, especially when they're under the influence of alcohol. You can't put it past what people will do. Every time you you've seen it all a new one comes by and you're like Okay. Now I've seen it all Well, that's how the whole political system is is capable of working in the first place is because like people really are dumb

They really you really can trick a good giant chunk of the people and we were talking about before but the Commission for presidential debates giant chunk of the people. And what we were talking about before about the Commission for Presidential Debates, now it's because Ross Perot came in and fucked up everything. And he's probably the reason why Clinton got elected in the first place over Herbert Walker Bush, the old man Bush. But now because of that, it's like virtually impossible. They jacked it up from 5% to 15%. And you would have to spend, they think that a conservative estimate is $250 million

just in order to reach 15% in popular polls, in like any popular polls. And so to get five, and also they would have to pick those five. Like they could pick a few that you weren't in, you know, or that you didn't poll well in. Like, oh, no, you know, it's not consistent. Like states that you definitely don't match with the overall consensus. Yeah, it's just it's so it's just really weird that it's been so long and this hustle

has been going on for so long and no one like no one in the political system, no one in like the Supreme Court or in Congress, no one is stepping up to say, hey, why exactly do these guys get all this money? There's some weird people in the Supreme Court that are on there. Oh, for sure. I actually started looking that up from guests you'd had on here that talked about that, and I started looking up some of those people. I'm like, are you kidding me that this guy's in a position of power?

Like, that's fucking scary. Clarence Thomas. I'm like are you kidding me that this guy's in a position of power like that's fucking scary Clarence Thomas remember all that shit with him and Anita Hill and the he was at the pubic hair and a coca-cola and he was a sexual harasser But that could have been bullshit, too You know that's a good way to defuse somebody you know to say he's talking shit about you know sex in the office And I just think that we've reached this weird point where the age of information and the old guard, the way politics has always been done, which is through deception and cronyism and horseshit. It's like they're not compatible with each other because the age of information is going to slowly but surely expose all these things. And certain things like, I mean mean i firmly believe that the internet is

the primary reason why marijuana is legal in colorado marijuana is legal in washington dc marijuana is legal and which is really kind of crazy when you think about it that's when it's changing all over the world like that right and i would totally agree we put that in the culture high right that's the because now you know when politicians like in the union we have that clip of ronald reagan and he's in that i don't know what press conference but he's like you know there's this new information and these sign and i'm i'm you know surprised the media hasn't made it more available but they then they have but they believe marijuana could be the most dangerous drug that is in use in our society today remember it's that clip we have in our trailer well nowadays you can literally be

like okay i'm on web md Like what study are you referring to? I'll look it up right now and come to my own conformed conclusion. But when he was doing those press conferences, you're like, hey, this is a man of stature and power. He's got information we're not privy to. Like, man, it is bad. He's got scientists that know shit I don't. So now that's just pulled out of the woodwork. Like you see it in with Mitt Romney.

We have some good clips of him where they kind of challenge him on things, right? And like the old Barbara Bush of like, just say no to drugs. Like, you know, we show that scene with Jade and David, right, 500 seizures a day. And then he's taking the non-psychoactive CBD and now he's having one to two seizures a month. Which by the way, is my friend's child as well.

A different kid, but my friend's child had the exact same situation. And it's working great for him? Fantastic. His kid was having massive seizures all the time. moved up to seattle so that he could get him on cbd oil yeah and now they're gone like and the kid is much more engaging he talked he's like pretty severe autistic yeah well and that's something with jason he's not sure how much was from the condition or how much was from the medication that Jaden took for, you know, the first seven years of his life. He'd had over 25,000 pills,

right? A lot of them psychoactive pills. And it's sad that your friend has to move to another state in order to get something that is working. We had a local girl in Kelowna to Kyla Williams that we did that. We, we did a screening there and we raised a whole bunch of money for and presented a check for three grand and they came to the screening and same thing they're fighting on the front line saying that because Canada has this real hokey thing with it like it's federally approved due to a court case right where they said it's unconstitutional to deny people that are getting relief from something right so the Canadian feds have they dance around saying well we don't approve

of it but if people are seeing benefits we can't prohibit them from getting it so you can get like a license in canada that will make it anywhere across the country that allows you to use it but they don't allow concentrates um like oils or edibles or anything like that so for kyla who was only two or three at the time, essentially they're saying she has to smoke it. And her parents are like, that's ridiculous. Like we should be able to get the oil because that's considered a

concentrate. Right. So they're like, well, no, we're going to, and her grandfather is actually ex law enforcement. And he said,

I'm going to break the law. I used to think like everybody else. Cause I used to arrest when people would bring up the marijuana medicinal argument as a law enforcement officer. I'm like, that's a bunch of hippie bullshit until it happened to my granddaughter. Now I see what everybody was arguing about. Right. And I'm going to fight just as hard so that my daughter can get access to safe medical marijuana that works for her. And she's responding tremendously. Like she's got her life back. She's focusing now.'s focusing now seizures are she's been seizure free that's great to hear man it's great to hear but it's it's sad to hear that it's so difficult to get it's sad to hear that it's it's such a complex issue but it's so simple i mean

there's a plant it grows naturally and it's really good for you and it's that simple the end right and it has benefits and if you regulate it and control it like other products recent studies have shown This is one of the most dangerous plants ever observed. Well, I love a dangerous and strychnine I will know what they always bring in the well That's what everyone laughs in the theater when you bring up the popcorn analogy They're putting they're like they're like yeah, they're like, you know, if you eat a pound of salt you'll fucking die, right? He's like, but if you put a little bit of salt on popcorn, it's actually quite good. It tastes good, right?

Like, you can't, like, yes, people can abuse just about anything. Yeah, a pound of salt will fucking kill you. You could go buy a pound of salt right now. I mean, any liquor store you go to, you could drink yourself to death quite easily. You just go and just pick up a couple bottles of Jack Daniels and you're off to the races. It's over. Former nightclub owner I've seen, there's nothing more destructive than that stuff. Nothing.

It's horrible. Nothing. It's horrible that that's our sanctioned drug. Like, we would have a totally different culture. And the evidence is coming out of Denver. Denver has the lowest DUI rates they've ever recorded. They have lower rates of assault and murder than they've ever recorded. There's all these crazy numbers that are coming in. And then the tax revenue is off the charts.

They're making so much fucking money They have to give it back to the people and sadly that's the only thing that's probably gonna push a lot of other states That's not sad though. It's good. No, it's good It's good that's how but it's sad that it's I always get scared when it's the wrong Moral reason of why they're doing it right where it's that's the only reason and a politician will sell you on like well We want to help the people but it's really to make their pockets bigger yeah i mean it is sad but that's the nature of the beast that's like getting angry at a whore that she sucks your dick now she wants money i thought it was good you were really moaning you probably enjoyed it come on good point we're not friends they're

whores they're all politicians are whores man i mean that's really what they do that's their their their job is to be fake and to get really good at being fake and figure out where the tide is turning. Lick their finger and put it up and find out where the wind is going. That's the exact thing we have you doing in the culture, right? We're going to go where the wind blows, right? We're going to go. It's from my hunting experience. Actually, you put powder in the air when you hunt.

Shoot some powder up in the air and it takes you where the wind. Unless we see the wind. Yeah, like baby shot. It's like these little things. You puff them in the air and it tells you which way the wind's blowing. But I think that what's happening now with information is because the fact that all these studies are out and all these people that are involved in law enforcement have the opportunity to know someone who's benefiting from it, cancer or whether it's people that have severe epilepsy, whether it's autism. There's so many different possible medical uses that could touch these people.

And so they become very skeptical. Like one of my good friends, he's a hardcore Republican. He's really silly. Like he's one of those dudes. Like he told me, he tried to tell me Obama was a Muslim. We're at a party. We're at a fucking party. I laugh at that stuff from Canada.

I think that's really hilarious. You know, Obama's the biggest Muslim in the country. Okay, dude. All right. But this guy, his mom got sick and stage four cancer. And the CBD oils helped her tremendously. And now he's become this evangelist for it. I mean, he's still not engaging in it himself. he you know you could benefit from it it's like all the things that people don't want

out of pot or what are the things that pot are good for like this thing about like i don't want to lose control like do you you really do want to lose control you just don't know like your ego has this fucking terrible grip on you and it's putting you in this very confined way of looking at the world. You have a very confined, narrow gap that you're looking at the world through. And things like marijuana will open that gap up and allow you to consider or reconsider your positions on all these things. And that's one of the most terrifying aspects of it to politicians as well as to law enforcement, because the idea that they've been wrong this whole time and they're going to somehow or another have to justify all the different shit that they've done. It's like once the cat's out of the bag, like it is in Denver, like it is in Washington state, that cat is going to get out of the bag everywhere. Washington State, that cat is going to get out of the bag everywhere.

And like you said, the internet is allowed where all those individual personal stories all over the world can be shared in real time. But you have HD on your phone, right? So you can film like Jason did that with his son, Jaden, where he recorded like how the medication was working, the pharmaceutical and like in real time, like here's what it's doing. He's now having tremors. He's now having this from, you know, so, and then you can put it on the internet where other people can get informed.

Like you couldn't do that years ago. Right. It was like an urban myth way down. I heard it might work. Even we have a, we have a personal clip that's in the DVD extras of the culture that didn't make it in the film, but it's about Dr. Lester Grinspoon, right? The first Ivy league doctor to start coming out with the real scientific evidence to cannabis. And he all did it on a bet to Carl Sagan.

They were best friends. And Carl Sagan used to smoke three to four joints every day and go work at NASA. Holla! And discover, hey, some of the greatest theories to this day. You've interviewed Neil deGrasse Tyson. Like, Carl Sagan is who everybody aspires to. And Lester, this is what's kind of funny about the story, is he went to prove Carl Sagan wrong. He said, he's like, I'm, you know, I'm a physician.

I'm from Harvard. Like, Carl, that's just going to kill you. And Carl would be like, oh, relax, Lester. Have a puff. Like, it's not a big deal. So Lester started looking into the literature and started pulling it from all the different universities. And then realized that he'd been duped. He's like, you'd be fucking kidding me.

I'm a Harvard professor. And I was telling all these people and I was completely wrong. So then he wrote his first paper, which Harvard totally tried to back out of. And they didn't want to give him his professorship of marijuana reconsidered. And then he wrote marijuana, the forbidden medicine. And then just as fate would have it, his son, Danny, gets diagnosed with leukemia at 11 years old. And he's ashamed of himself at the time that he didn't. He's going through the

regular treatment through the oncologist, going through the chemo and everything. And Danny was getting really sick and the nausea affected his son more than anything, right? His kid would be terrified for a week in advance of how sick he was going to get. And finally, another physician was like, well, Lester, I read your stuff. Have you tried cannabis? Like the stuff for anti-nausea seems to be amazing and the science is there and he was like well i don't want to upset harvard and danny's like too young and then here's the kind of the kicker of the story that's so funny is that they go to the very place that prohibition's supposed to keep it out of his mom and danny just go themselves

because they're willing to try it they've read his paper at the manuscript they go to the local high school, right? And Mrs. Grinspoon and Danny ask their friends. Within 10 minutes, they got the weed, smoked it. And his oncologist said, like, right out of the thing, he's like, what did you guys do differently with Danny? He came in, took his therapy, left, and actually ate a full six-inch sandwich, where usually he was puking for three or four days, right?

He was actually able. And Lester's like like it gave my son an extra two years of life because he could battle the nausea and keep some nutrition down it's those little wins with health that goes such a long way when you're in the cancer thing right like if you're able to eat a little bit of food and get a little bit of nutrition and that little bit of nutrition helps your body to fight back on its own on top of the medication and that's where people can get caught up on the other side. We're like, it's the cure. It's the cure, not the cure, right? As we interviewed oncologists, cancer is individual specific, DNA specific, gender specific. So what might work for you might not work for somebody else, but that doesn't mean that if it does work for someone,

that shouldn't be a viable option for them to use that. It's unquestionably a very effective treatment. There's been many, many peer-reviewed studies that show that without a doubt, cannabis has a positive effect on people with cancer. Whether it's helping them sleep, that's another big one. It gives people sleep, which helps your immune system, which helps your immune system fight off cancer. It helps inflammation, which also helps your body fight off cancer there's and it helps inflammation which also helps your body a lot of stuff in inflammation there's just so many so many factors that it's just it's gross man it's gross it's gross that we're in this position where we actually have to

debate this this is like you and me sitting down talking about the benefits of drinking water yeah but if you drink too much mineral water. That fucking water. That water is what these hippie kids are on. They're fucking. I just think it's a matter of time, and hopefully we'll see it in our lifetime. I'm still amazed that it's still illegal. I mean, I remember when I was a kid in high school, I used to think it was the dumbest fucking thing ever. I couldn't imagine that it had some, and I didn't even know the facts of it.

I mean, all I knew was that, like, there was drugs drugs and there was pot and pot just kind of made you dopey. Yeah. But alcohol was legal. And I remember like, I remember the first time I ever got drunk, I was at my friend's house and we were listening to like fucking the doors and Led Zeppelin shit and drinking Jack Daniels. And I was like 14. I just never should have. I was threw up in a cab. It was disgusting. Every, everything about it was like 14. I just never should have I was threw up in a cab disgusting every everything about it was completely disgusting

But I remember like the next day like this horrible hangover this pounding headache and thinking how the fuck is that? Legal like you could just drink whatever you want It's not even like they distributed to you like you know like if you go and you say you get Adderall or Oxycontin or some sort of strong prescription drug, it comes in pill form. It says, take two pills. They give you a bottle of Jack, and they're like, good luck, fuckface. Then they advertise it like it's the sexiest thing ever, right?

Like, it's beautiful guys that are clean cut and girls that are smoking hot, and you're having a drink and everything's perfect As a former nightclub owner I can say it hardly ever looks like that It's messy sweaty like it's not when I see those commercial my that's very funny I was like you should film in my bar a little bit. It doesn't look like I mean, and I'm not anti-alcohol. It just it just staggers The imagination really there well and here's a point I thought about when we were doing the union, like as a nightclub owner, and it was an interesting self-reflection that came through because I was on the other

side of weed. I was very anti when I was younger because I bought into all the bullshit. As was I. And when I owned a nightclub, when we started doing the union and you started learning so much, I remember like after interviewing Norm Stamper, the former police chief of Seattle or Dr. Lester, like my mind would be spinning for two weeks. I'm just like, I can't believe this. I started looking at everything different.

And then here I was, a nightclub owner, serving people booze that they want. And we're supposed to not over-serve. But if you find me a bar, I will find you a time when they over-serve. People come up, they're like, I want six shots. You're like, well, no, actually, you're only supposed to order one per person. So can you get all six people to come to the table, please? The only bar where they don't over serve is at Disneyland. Yeah.

Probably that is right. For real. If you go to the Disneyland hotel, they're strict as fuck. Like I tried to order four drinks. They wouldn't even give it to me. They give you two drinks at a time. You're like, what? Like a shot and a beer.

That's it. You know, I don't even know if they have shots. I think they're like mixed drinks. That makes sense, but that's Disneyland, but I'm not surprised But when at the bar when we had it like I thought about like, you know And you've seen it too I've ever ever you talk about like, you know seen the odd bar fight and stuff thing when something like that happened I put it back to if it was in prohibition days, right like a fight happens a guy gets knocked out really bad Well, if it was during the days when you weren't supposed to be serving alcohol

I can just imagine what they did with the severely injured guy. They probably just threw him up the street and said like, call an ambulance. So it's not anywhere near us. Otherwise we go down. Right. Whereas at least now, like, you know, yes, there's problems associated with alcohol. There's, there's almost nothing we're going to do in society. That's not going to have some kind of problem or social aspect where we're going to have to adapt and make sure it works perfectly. Right. Particularly alcohol.

Particularly. Yeah. And I'm not anti-alcohol. And neither am I. I used to serve it. How can I? I used to sell it and make a profit. But it is the number one drug when it comes to like social problems, domestic violence,

like so many different things go wrong when people drink and it's everywhere. And the idea that somehow or another they've been able to demonize marijuana which has the complete opposite effect show me a group of potheads that are engaged in gang violence like they're beating each other up they're meeting in the fucking park and duking it out it's not gonna you're not going to i mean show me a bunch of people that are smoking pot that are you know running around uh getting in bar you know pot bar fights it doesn't isn't it it's the opposite it is the and it was something that i i witnessed organically when i was going through the discovery with the union like because at that time i own the bar right so i'd see every weekend it was like fight someone drive and what's crazy about booze the effect it has on people sometimes like people

will fight their friends like they'll get drunk and like all of a sudden I'm like dude you guys are best friends and now you're willing to strike him in the face just because you're a little drunk like that's crazy but then we went to hemp fest where there's like 50,000 people smoking weed no fights it's like nothing it's everybody's like you bump into someone like terribly sorry man like sorry dude all right I'm like wow I remember pointing that out being like I can't believe there isn't like because we we had a room full of 200 our capacity was only 235 and i mean there's fights

all the time well imagine if you had like 50 000 people at tequila fest imagine what kind of a disaster that's the start of the zombie apocalypse right there yeah you would be like just a patch of people eating each other it It's a fucking horrible drug. But again, I support it. It's just I just keep thinking that we're in the transitionary age. We're in the age where people are finally getting it. And that this what's happened in Seattle and Colorado and Washington, D.C. is the first blip of this new movement that's going to spread across the country.

And and the politicians are are gonna have to adapt because Politicians are whores and that is the good thing about them. Yeah, their their ideology is based entirely on which way the winds blowing So because of that, it's kind of cool Well, it well it's it's a business right there Prime objective is to win and get elected because not only them but all the people that worked with them campaigning for the last year They lose their jobs too, right? So get that Chris Christie fucker. Do you see that guy? He's still saying that marijuana is dangerous and addictive me why he's just Ridiculously obese they just I've heard I think it's so accurate. He's so disgusting

They just did they just did a report rather they said he spent $82,000 in food nfl games of taxpayers money are you kidding me i did not see that eighty two thousand dollars in food at nfl games wow this fucking guy who is morbidly obese just overflowing out of his shirts and his pants just clear food addiction and eating addiction like clearly a hundred percent and with by the way you know i had this guy dr dan Dan Engel on the other day was talking about the, he works with people with addictions and trying to treat these addictions. Like food addictions and sugar addictions in particular are one of the most difficult

ones to treat because you've got to eat. Everybody eats. It's not like heroin. Like you can kick heroin and no one's like, dude, you got to do a little heroin. You got to stay alive. Like you don't have to do a like heroin. Like you can kick heroin and no one's like, dude, you got to do a little heroin. You got to stay alive. Like you don't have to do a little heroin. Jamie and I were talking to this before you arrived and food, sugar, processed sugar was artificially put into the majority of our foods like back in the seventies and eighties

so that you have a taste for it. That's why we're so addicted to like, like it's in things you don't even think about. Spaghetti sauce, sandwich meats, things like that. You look, you're like, there's sugar in this? Like it's in everything. I tried to, I go through the rings where I'm like, okay, I'm going to go two weeks without sugar. I've never succeeded. I fail all the time. I went a whole month without beating off once. Shut up. I'm documented it on my blog, on my website. I would fail that addiction test. Well, I did it because I had to do it. You know, I didn't have to do it, but I had to do it

because I said I was going to do it, you know, and didn't have to do it, but I had to do it because I said I was going to do it. Yeah. You know, and I wrote about it, but it was just ridiculous. Did you find yourself becoming more aggressive? No, just horny all the time. Like, people give me a hug

and I get a heart on it. I'm like, what the fuck? It's, when you, you, you know, say you're not going to,

you don't realize like, how much jerking off is like maintenance. Like, it keeps you clear. Like, you don't have the, this overwhelming need,

this pulsating, overwhelming need. You know, have this overwhelming need. This pulsating, overwhelming need. If you go 30 days without beating off, you'll kind of understand that. Most people don't do that unless they have a really low sex drive. Never gone that long. But sugar,

I've never tried. I very much limit my sugar. I limit my sugar. Try that too, but I've tried a few weeks just to very much limit my sugar I limit my sugar try that too but I've tried a few weeks just to really cut it like really look at everything and and Other than even then it I'd never succeeded, but I'd like fruit and stuff like at least natural sugar I wasn't as much but just process I'm like I'm gonna try to get nothing processed, but then I have kids and stuff and the cupboards full of shit And then I'm right fuck it. I'll grab one of these yeah

My wife brought home Krispy Kreme dough those are crack kids and stuff and the cupboards full of shit. And then I'm like, Oh fuck it. I'll grab one of these. Yeah. The other day, my wife brought home crispy cream. Oh, those are crack. Those are already. Yeah. What have you done? There's no way.

If those came in the house, I crushed the whole thing. They're brutal. They're brutally good. Um, you got to get the cream filled ones because the, the regular ones, they're only good.

Like right when they come out of the oven, but the regular ones, the cream filled ones are good for days I haven't had those one ladies cream filled so we don't have Krispy Kremes not in Canada too much we have Tim Hortons Tim Hortons can't carry Krispy Kremes jockstrap okay that's a whole I've eaten Tim Hornet Tim Hortons doughnuts they're dog shit there are're alright. They're okay in a pinch. They're good, man. Which ones are you on? No, no, no.

They're way better than Dunkin' Donuts. No, they're not. That's not true at all. Dunkin' Donuts is fucking disgusting. No, that's not true at all. Boston Cream Donuts, those fucking, you ever have one of those? Dunkin' Donuts, Boston Cream. Tim Hortons are delicious.

They're not the same. Canadians. Canadians are so into being Canadian. Yeah, we are. We love it. Guys love being Canadian. We are proud. It's a great country.

Don't get me wrong. My favorite country other than America, without a doubt, is Canada. And they're the nicest people. And it's one of the reasons why it's so difficult to get up there. That's why people always say, when are you going to bring Joey Diaz up? Joey Diaz has arm kidnapping on his resume. It's very fucking tough to get into Canada with arm kidnapping. You can't even get into Canada if you had a bar fight.

Now both countries, same in the US, if you have a DUI, you can't come to the United States from Canada and you can't come from the US to Canada. If you have a DUI, you are restricted from travel. Yeah, that's a good one. You know, if we could keep more people from driving drunk, it would be

a way better place. But Canada is particularly stringent on the amount of people and the type of people that it lets in. And it's one of the reasons why I've always said it's such a nice country. It's like you guys, like you value good behavior up there. You value nice people. Well, another thing that's a big advantage for us, like when people make comparisons, because the culture is very similar in some ways and very different in a lot of ways. I find the United States is very polarized in there. Like, it's much more like, are you Republican or Democrat?

Are you left or right? Are you religious or not? Not to say that doesn't exist in Canada, but I don't find it as intense as it is in the United States. But we have such a small population. Right. Like, there's more people in the state of California than our entire country. Yeah, which is really weird. So we don't have to deal, like, when you get more and more people you know things get more and more complicated

There's different social structures and history and religious and you guys are dealing with shitty donuts So there's that too. I mean you're always having to Tim. What are Timmy's are awesome. That is awesome. It's awesome barely edible This much much, much better. I highly disagree on that one. They're good, man. I'll give. Krispy Kremes are awesome, but Timmy's are a close second.

Not even. No. For up there, you have no choices. What else you got? I tried Dunkin' Donuts when I lived in New York, and I thought they were disgusting. Please stop. I have no idea what you're talking about. You're making me sick.

Isn't it weird? Like, we would give a fuck. Yeah. If you enjoy something I don't. It's like, that's fighting words. You dissing my Timmy's? What, you use Windows, dude? You should get a Mac.

Well, I don't even get in. I just have an old beat-up laptop that still survived, and it's a Mac. I've had it for like eight years. It still works fine. People almost get mad at you. Well, at least now with the new film We're in production for you like because you back up all your footage so we bought one through the production So I get that one when it's done. I'll take what operating system using feral house cat

It still has one of those DVD drives I have one of those On my other laptop This one doesn't have it I have a USB one which I've never used I bought it when I'm like I'm definitely going to need this I've never used it once DVDs are done It's just like those goddamn floppy disks When they got rid of the floppy disks

Everybody's like Steve Jobs what the fuck is wrong with you Are you crazy No floppy disk And then he was right because everybody's like, Steve Jobs, what the fuck is wrong with you? Are you crazy? No floppy disk? And then he was right. Interesting, in the movie industry, though, is they haven't been able to recover what DVDs used to make. Like, digital downloads, not there.

It hasn't been. It's called piracy, son. Look it up. If anyone knows that, I know, like, the Union had been seen millions of of times and we still hadn't got into the green with that one wow yeah millions of times where that's crazy there's just 10 sec if we just got 10 cents a download we would be doing really good you'd be rich as fuck rich as fuck it's like five five million if you look at all the different places where it's been illegally downloaded we've we stopped calculate where you just add up on youtube and it's like five six million That's a real issue when it comes to making a documentary, isn't it?

Getting the funding. Really tough. Because docs are, in Canada at least, we're fortunate because we have the tax credit system and there's a lot of grant programs so that Canadian artists can still survive. The problem with that is you have Canadian content laws. Yes. So you got some dog shit that sneaks through. Sneaks through. I wouldn't say sneaks through. Sneaks through?

I wouldn't say sneaks through. I'd say majority of it is. But docs, the good thing is, is all it has to be to qualify as CanCon is as long as the crew is Canadian producing it, right? Okay. So like, The Culture High is a Canadian content film, but that doesn't feel very Canadian, right?

It's much more about US politics and it's all featuring US and very Canadian, right? It's much more about U.S. politics, and it's all featuring U.S. and international interviews, right? Docs is the one that really works well for it. You guys have that Mark Emery guy up there, too. That's a strange case. This guy, because it's polarizing on both sides in both ways. Like, that guy was selling seeds, which were totally legal in your country.

And the local law enforcement was not willing to prosecute him. So the DEA came in to extradite him. And we talked about that in the union where it was just like, look, it's the same as if we bought a machine gun from the United States. Not legal in Canada. But we don't extradite the guy that bought it to the United States or like, you know, we don't go to the United States and say, Hey, your guy sold a gun to Canada. He has to come up and serve time in Canada.

We arrest the guy that bought it. So with the seeds, the same thing with Mark, right? And he was giving, he was paying taxes to the government. They had no issue on the seeds that he got arrested for. Yeah. And then he was giving to, you know, drug rehabilitation clinics and a whole bunch of things. It's almost like in that case, the government's kind of in on it because they're taking money.

Like, you guys took the tax money and then you still sent him to the United States to be prosecuted? And they had to sign the official release to allow him, right? Why would they do that? That's where it was funny because a lot of people, I mean, you know, Mark Emery's really aggressive and he wanted to be a martyr and he, you know. That's the polarizing aspect of it. And it gets tough because a lot of people, I mean, Mark Emery's really aggressive and he wanted to be a martyr.

Yeah, that's the polarizing aspect of it. And it gets tough because a lot of people didn't like the way he did things. But some people that were not in the argument were too much, were just against giving up a Canadian citizen to go serve time over there. They should be. That was the one that everyone was kind of on his side, being like, that shouldn't be done. You know, we should not send him over there for laws that, you know, he didn't order the seed, somebody else ordered it to the United States. He shouldn't be sent down there to go serve his time. He just got out of prison like a year ago.

Yeah, and he's, you know, he's back to his old ways and smoking pot and making videos and all this stuff. I mean, they didn't put a dent in it. They actually did make him a martyr, you know. It was in the transcripts. We showed in the union that they said this is a dent to the legalization movement and everything. It was much more of a political arrest for the DEA than it was anything else.

And actually, the prosecutor that helped send him to the... has actually come out recently and said we should change marijuana laws and not put people... He still thinks that sending Mark Emery away was the right thing to do as the prosecutor, but he thinks that the law should now be changed because they're draconian and they really are i mean it's there's no argument about it there's no no one can make except dancy

grace did you see her argument with two chains yes i see all her stuff i post them and tweet them they always get a good reaction with her. She's adorable. She's almost like a plant. She's almost like a plant by the marijuana industry to try to like the marijuana community to try to like make the ultimate dumb villain that epitomizes the anti-legalization movement. Marijuana makes you fat and lazy. No, but then she'll say the exact opposite of that, right? It makes you psychotic!

Rapists! Exactly. Well, I have to believe with her that she doesn't even believe all of her I have to think it's like when you had Dr. Carl Hart on the show and he talked about going on Bill O'Reilly. And he was saying how he was great right before we started rolling camera

then when we rolled camera he was totally different andReilly, yeah. Right? And he was saying how he was great right before we started rolling camera. Then when we rolled camera, he was totally different, right? And he was trying to get at me, and he was living the character. I'd have to think that Nancy Grace is the same. No, I think you're probably right. I think there's a lot of those folks that are in that public eye that are involved in the business of getting eyes on them. And they know that controversy is what sells. That's how you got to do it you know they're Nancy Grace the effects of Nancy Grace I want to hear this Nancy Grace debates Nancy Grace yeah no

effects look at her Nancy Grace that Trayvon Martin did have marijuana in his system at the time he died. What difference does that make? Because I've seen too many felonies. She's debating herself. And I don't mean pot sales or growing pot like this guy up in Connecticut. To me, it means that he is less likely to pick a fight with someone. I mean, people on pot shoot each other. Isn't it true that when you smoke pot,

you just want to lay on the sofa and eat? People on pot kill families, wipe out a whole family. The common connotation of pot goes with lethargy, with the munchies, with wanting to eat, with being laid back, not with chasing somebody down, jumping out from behind bushes, beating them in the head until they're pulpy, and basically starting mortal combat. That's not what you typically equate with smoking a doobie. That's hilarious.

Or I've got to be smoking, or I've got to be high on pot. So can you clearly say Nancy won the debate there, debating herself? I feel like Nancy had all the good points. Yeah, well, she's a business person. Her business is Nancy Grace. The business of Bill O'Reilly is Bill O'Reilly's got to get in your face and call you a moron and shut you up. Because Bill O'Reilly is playing to that 70-year-old man with a hearing aid. That's his audience.

That scared man that's afraid that Mexicans are going to move into his neighborhood. His hands are shaking when he gets, where's my remote? Where's the remote? Where's the remote? And the wife is just a prisoner of this guy's fucking theory. Yeah, and no one's allowed to touch the remote for this TV. That's the Bill O'Reilly fan. He just admires Bill O'Reilly.

Well, that was part that Brett really wanted to tackle in directing the cult try, was that part of the media, right, and how it's become such a business. And Cenk brings that down really great in the film, of breaking down the history of media and how the airwaves were originally given to get news we'll give you the airways you give us news but then anytime they tackle the subject they kind of conflicted with the political views of washington they're like okay wait a minute we don't want you talking about that news right we don't want you talking about that and then they realize they can make money off it and started getting sponsors and then it was like okay well we can't touch subjects like this and when you had jank on your show we touch on that whole msnbc thing that he had right where

he goes in and he started pushing buttons of both sides and saying oh they're both corrupt and then it's systematically corrupt right because you're funded by people to argue points based on campaign money that you got there's a great point that brett fought hard to have in the film that the audience seemed to really take to when it released. Well, it illuminates the issue. The issue is it's not as clear as like some people think this is bad for you and some people think this is good for you. And, you know, here's the debatable evidence. There's no debatable evidence.

You look at the evidence, you go, okay, well, there's no one has ever died from it ever. No one has ever got cancer from it ever No, I mean all this idea like that. I love when they start going like what's his name Gabor Matei? How do you say his name Gabber Matthew? Yeah, I've only seen it written. I haven't heard it So trust me we were the same thing I would tell you What one of the things that he talked about was the instances of psychosis and which is fascinating because you know they're both it's caused psychotic episodes in some people no it actually doesn't they're the uniform number of psychotic

episodes and people is pretty much it's in line with the population and if you have a hundred people one of those people is going to have issues and when if you have 100 people that smoke pot and one of those people has issues, you can't correlate that with pot. You just can't. Because the number's the same. We break down the schizophrenia clip. We have like a two-minute clip. I don't know.

Did you give it to Jamie? It's on YouTube. If you just go to Culturize Schizophrenia and it's got all of them breaking it down. Yeah, because you guys did a great job With that documentary and I want more people to see it It's just more the more these things get out there The more people see this more people see the Union and there's so many of them now There's so many of these documentaries now. It's just well and the greatest let's play this which

Schizophrenia Schizophrenia just one spliff and you will go mental the more you mess with cannabis the more it can mess with your mind they're even worse in the UK for seven years as a researcher were devoted to schizophrenia. I can tell you, that is ridiculous. We looked at the evidence. I think we must have gone through about 2,000 papers. And it doesn't cause schizophrenia. Maybe there are some individuals with schizophrenia

in which the illness is brought on perhaps a little earlier because they smoke cannabis. There often is what's called a precipitating event. A precipitating event is something like an important loss of a person, a severe car accident. It certainly can be exacerbated by a number of drugs. You know, a bad alcohol trip, that could serve as a precipitating event too. The fact is schizophrenia has a prevalence of about 1% the world around. Cannabis use, let's start with the 60s, it's gone up like that. So you've introduced this new thing if it's schizophrenogenic we should see a significant uptick in schizophrenia. We

should see more people with schizophrenia. Schizophrenia has stayed just like that. In all of the epidemiologic studies that I'm aware of, there is no uptick. So if marijuana causes schizophrenia, it was introduced, now we should have more schizophrenia. We don't see that. We would certainly see some little rise in that, given the numbers of people who have used this. You really don't need to strip this back and address this from a neutral platform to understand that anything to do with mental health is such a tenuous issue built upon different contributing

factors. And by applying it all to cannabis, you are possibly doing more harm because you are negating all these other factors that certainly play a part. That guy summed it up perfectly. Perfectly. Negating all those other factors. Life is a series of factors.

And that is doing much more harm because you're not looking at all the other things you're trying to find it just it's because of this it's because of that right instead of you know looking at the broader picture like oh maybe there was mental abuse maybe there's neglect as a child and then gabber really does a great thing where he talks about addiction and how early childhood development and how the brain grows so rapidly that it develops, you know, certain things that those end up becoming the crutch for you later on because you had neglect when you were younger or when you had this, right? It stems so much from early childhood. In fact, he did a study

because he was a Holocaust survivor, right? His family, they escaped. And when he was perfectly healthy baby, then all of a sudden he became really colicky. So his mother called their physician and was like, oh my God, I don't know. know he's not sleep he's screaming all night and the doctor said well mrs matte if you don't mind me asking you're jewish correct and she said yeah what does that have to do with anything said we have an epidemic of jewish babies uh that are colicky now ever since the war has been announced explain what colicky is for people don't have kids colicky is like kids that just non-stop cry they're always like why is it called colicky i don't have kids call. He is like kids that just non-stop cry. They're always like I was a cold colicky I don't know I'd we'd have to look that up jam not done

But they like I've never experienced with my children fortunately But I've had parents that literally said they see how they could go to post-mortem depression like they just the kids do not sleep They're always uncomfortable screaming like crazy all night like 8 12 hours a day to where you think they're gonna scream themselves to where their heart Might stop right it's panicky. You get, so the physician had announced that and Gabber looked at the study and be like, well, what would infants or children know about the war and Hitler? Why would that make them colicky? Well, what are children? What's the only thing they're growing on and absorbing at that young age? Their parents who are now stressed. They're in fear. They're scared of what's going to happen in the war. They're scared about going to prison camps.

And that fear and tension and arguments and everything else is already affecting the young child to the point where they start to become, like they can feel that, right? And he goes on, I don't want to just keep running clips, but there's another great clip if you want to go look. The Business Insider picked it up, the addiction side that Gabber breaks down

So con like he does it like to put in one sentence. He says it this way He says, you know, although the addiction itself is a problem and we should be concerned about it. It's not the problem It's the addicts attempt to solve a problem in the first place Yeah that is a really good bit that really good clip rather and the the Yeah, that is a really good bit that really good clip rather and the the talk about genes and then how it affects the way Genes express themselves like that's that's really crazy. Like I didn't even know that we didn't know that like I remember actually can make you addicted to things and and the Childhood there's a study that he references that showed that children that had had loss in the family, divorce, abuse,

were 600 times greater. Let's play it. Go to business. If you go Business Insider, the Culture High, it has the addiction clip. Yeah, I just think that all of this information, like what we just played about schizophrenia, this about addiction and genetics, and the the evidence now it's just so overwhelming that when you have a nancy grace or you have you know like the old ronald reagan clip it becomes almost comedy it's like it's so preposterous but the thing is like and you had a

dr carl hart talked about when he was on your podcast so they don't want to come on like it sucks going on their show because that's their realm where they can get you on points and they can get because sometimes you can get a certain doctor, like Gabor Maté, if you can let him talk and really explain it, he'll sewer you. But if you were to debate and get points that win and overshout, he might not come off. Well, those shows are a joke, man. Any of those shows where they have, like, Anderson Cooper is standing there and he's talking to five different people that are in five different locations

and they're all yelling in and you know, have earpieces in. This is arguably the worst way to communicate ever. Like, get any one of those fucks on a podcast and sit down with them for three hours and then you'd find out what they're really like. Like Nancy Grace. You imagine Nancy Grace on a podcast talking about marijuana for three hours? Do you know, if she couldn't leave, if she couldn't leave, she couldn't leave she couldn't go this conversation is nonsense mr. Rogan you're wasting my time can we set up a pay-per-view event to that and she would

just run away she would not they would not come there's no way she would because if she did I mean you wouldn't have to yell at her you wouldn't have to get angry you would just break it down over and over again do you know how ridiculous it's like show her the facts. Show her her own debate against herself. You know, all these people that are doing this. Fat fuck Christy. Get that dummy.

You know, I'm a fat shamer. I'll tell you right now. I'll fat shame the fuck out of that fat fuck. I don't believe in fat shaming. I think it's nonsense. It's goddamn nonsense. I'm not into it. And that guy is a dangerous person.

Those words that come out of his mouth in a position of power will affect people. There's young children that hear what he says, they listen to the news, and they will start to believe that stupid shit. And people that are way more scared to admit maybe they made a mistake and correct it and will continue a lie and push that ideology on people for that that is I Mean you had Steven Pressfield on here, but the war of art right talked about that like how resistance can push you like rather than Overcoming that resistance admitting that there was a mistake like hey, I was wrong right I made a mistake Which is nice to see dr. Sanjay Gupta come out and at least like you know say like I was fundamentally wrong about the research I presented

Yeah, he's he's got a lot of courage for doing that but yeah, the Denial of the truth is bad Not just for the people that you're delivering the truth to but also to yourself Because you know in your heart of hearts that you're a bullshitter. If you are somehow or another pushing some nonsense, false narrative just because it reinforces what you've already said, and you find that over and over again with humans.

They just don't want to ever admit that they were incorrect or they got bamboozled. Scary. I mean, that's what keeps me... Did you see the Going Clear documentary? Yes, yes, I did. I just watched it the other day. Goddamn fascinating.

But it sort of touches on that a bit because you see these people that didn't want to admit that this religion, quote unquote, that they'd gotten into was a bullshit. Someone created it. A really retarded science fiction author created a gigantic religion. It's hilarious. You have to actually give him props that he was able to just say religions are the most profitable thing because you don't have to pay tax and i'm the science fiction writer and once you get whatever what's the level like ov3 then you actually get the notes from him of what the religion is and i love where they have paul haggis on at that point and he's like what the fuck is this he's like what the fuck is this he's like i was into the all helping people and trying to make

the world a better place and do all that he's like but once I read this he was like I'm not into this whole thing the Zion ruler or whatever Z new Z new that's what we also kind of realized that the the L Ron Hubbard himself was very much like very likely like having mental health issues yeah and he was trying to self-diagnose yeah and and that's why I what I one of the things I actually like about Scientology and You know I don't want to bash. I don't know enough about it to bash it other than the really scary retarded shit Yeah, but there's the I've known some people that have been in it And they've been like really goal-oriented people and they really like have been focused

And they like try to get their shit people and they really like have been focused and they like try to get their shit together. And one of the guys that left, he said that he left Scientology as a religion, but he still believed in it as a, as a, as a practice, as a practice for like mental, like awareness or for managing the mind, you know, cause I think the, a lot of their principles, a lot of the ideas came from psychology And they came from I mean he had some some like almost like self remedy sort of ideas of how to like manage his craziness and manage his mind and I

Don't think it's all bad. No, but isn't that isn't that ultimately would like for to me I thought like all ideology like some of the ideas of like treating others as you'd want to be treated yourself. Like, isn't that what they all stem from? But then like Scientology in the film, at least in other ones, then you get people in positions of power in those places. Right. And then it starts being, no, no, no. It's the way I depict these readings. Right.

And if you disobey, then you burn in hell or whatever. You're you're that's always like i read a lot of them like i grew up around um uh east indians and seek and a lot of their stuff i liked where like the original seek temples had all four entrances saying all people are welcome right and that all rivers essentially flow to the ocean meaning there's no one right way to find enlightenment or be a better person yeah and but then you know i'm a big fan of the Sikh religion Yeah, I've met a lot of those guys. They're very cool. I wish they would cut their hair

So much so much of what they're doing is like I like the way they behave I like that They're not they don't proselytize. They're not rude about it You know and when they dress up for their weddings their shit looks way better than a tux Yeah, I think they have some crazy marijuana drink, too, that someone told. I think it's called Bang, B-H-A-N-G or something like that. But it's like marijuana mixed with yogurt. There's like a certain sex of. Yeah.

See if you can find that, Jamie. There's certain sex of the Sikhs who they drink this marijuana yogurt combination. It's like hash and yogurt. I just think it's sweet that when they go to the wedding, they have the fucking sword and their paw on their thing. I was like, man, we get a tux and a tie. They dress up like emperors with weapons. I was like, way cooler.

Yeah, I'd much rather dress like that. Yeah, no, they, I mean, I'm like, here it is, B-H-A-N-G. A beverage prepared from the leaves and flowers of the female cannabis plant has a long history of use in the Indian subcontinent. With the buds of the plant maturing in the spring, the preparation of B-H-A-N-G, I think it's called bhang, has traditionally been associated with the harvest festivals of Ola Mohala or Hali in March and Vaisakhi

Vaisakhi in April although drugs and alcohol are permitted in Sikhism N-I-H-A-N-G-S Nihangs, I don't know are traditionally very fond of Bang which they call Sukhni Dhan meaning

giver of peace, that's right or Sukha Prasad or called Sukhni Dhan, meaning giver of peace. That's right. Or Sukha Prasad, or peace giver. Yeah, I agree with all those things. Yeah, Sikhs got it right. Take the bong, be happy. Be the bong. Be happy, be happy.

Let's play that thing about genes, man. The business inside of it, yeah. Because this is pretty powerful stuff addiction the most frequently cited perceived harm associated with marijuana sexy voice is addiction not bad you do know it's addictive highly addictive right because i believe it is addictive and it leads to more serious drugs but in order to understand addiction in relation to marijuana one must first have an understanding of the psychology behind addiction in the first place, one must first have an understanding of the psychology behind addiction in the first place.

It's interesting to see or to ask who becomes addicted. People can have sex without being addicted to it, they can go shopping, but some people become severely addicted to all these pursuits. Is a pack of cards addictive? Well, no, or yes, depending on the individual. So it's the same process no matter what the addiction is. The only difference is really is that the substance addict

is getting the dopamine from an outside substance, whereas the behavior addict is having it triggered from the particular behavior. If I speak to a group of 100 people or 1,000 people and I ask, well, how many of you have addiction issues to any substance, a number of you will put their hand up and say, what did it do for you? Not what was bad about it, but you already know that. But what did it do for you?

What was positive in your experience of it? Well, it gave me a sense of peace. It gave me pain relief. It made me feel more connected. It made me more confident. I could speak now and interact with other people. In other words, the addict is just after wanting to be a normal human being. And the real question is, what keeps them from having those qualities in their lives and what happened to them? And so that the addiction should be seen not as the problem,

although it is a problem, but it's not the problem, it's the addict's attempt to solve a problem in the first place. The adverse childhood experiences studies done in California looked at conditions such as physical, sexual, emotional abuse in a child's life, the loss of a parent through death, or a rancorous divorce, or a parent being jailed, or a mental illness in the parent, or addiction in the parent, or violence in the family. And for each of these adverse childhood experiences, the risk of addiction goes up exponentially. the risk of addiction goes up exponentially. By the time a male child has had six of these adverse experiences, his risk of having become a substance-dependent, injection-using addict is 4600% greater than that of a male child with most of these experiences. Why is that? It's because that trauma shapes the brain in such ways

as to make the addictive substances more appealing to the individual. That trauma also gives that person the pain that they will try to then escape from or to soothe through the addictive behaviors. It's the social and emotional environment that shapes the actual biology of the brain. So if you understand somebody's addiction you have to look at what created pain in their lives. The person who occasionally has a beer, occasionally smokes marijuana, but genuinely they have no negative consequences. It does not impair their health, does not endanger their lives, it does not impair their personal relationships. You can't call those people addicts and you can't call those behaviors addictive.

Addicts! There's a real distinction between the use of substances and the addiction to substances. Which then brings us to the war on drugs. Basically, the war on drugs is being waged against people that were abused and traumatized in children and have mental health problems. There's enough punishment in there, in the negative consequences of the addiction, that we don't have to add punishment onto that.

How great, like, you nailed it. The number of deaths around the world from cigarette consumption is 5.5 million, according to the latest estimates. Annually, cigarettes kill as many people as were killed in the Germans' anti-Jewish genocidal campaign. So we have a holocaust annually owing to cigarettes. If you smoke more than two packs a day, the risk for developing lung cancer was 20-fold. That's 2,000%

based on the largest case control study ever done. There was no evidence that marijuana increased the risk of lung cancer. Boom! You've got to have some consistency. Oh, who's this guy? A million different drugs that are sanctioned by the society that don't have that happy ending.

That you take too much and you're fucked. I've got a friend whose auntie had to go to rehab for buying two boxes of Krispy Kremes every day and eating them in the woods. Don't say Tim Hortons. Notice how you didn't say Tim Hortons? He's from the UK. Krispy Kremes are legal.

I will fight any man, by the way, who suggests that. I'm with you, buddy. I got your back. And dying. Yeah, you didn't use salt right, dude. You fucked up with salt. If you just threw some salt on popcorn, it's actually quite yummy. You know, but what'd you do, you stupid fuck?

You ate a pound of salt and you died. Doesn't mean we should outlaw salt. Our society doesn't object to people jumping out of air. We heard of Graham Hancock through your podcast. That's how we ended up getting interviewed. He's awesome. Our society doesn't object to people climbing mountains. We heard of Graham Hancock through your podcast. That's how we ended up getting interviewed. He's awesome. So good. I love that guy.

Mountains. Occasionally people fall off mountains and do harm to themselves. We're cool. We're just rehashing all this stuff. Graham Hancock is actually involved in a fascinating debate right now with this guy, Zawi Hawass, who's the head of, I think, the head of Egyptian antiquities. He's sort of the guy, the disseminator of information in Egypt when it comes to like how people have access to the pyramids and all the different structures.

And he's been, um, going at it with this guy because the guy is unable or unwilling to reconsider a lot of his statements about the age of a lot of the ancient Egypt monoliths and all these different structures. You know, they've got some. Gobekli Tepe is putting a big fucking hook into that, right? Well, he pretended he didn't know what Gobekli Tepe was.

And it's really funny, the debate. But it's a similar thing. Like a guy who's been saying something for so long that there were no cultures more than 5,000 years ago that were capable of sophisticated construction methods. And he's just said this for so long that now the evidence has come out. Gobekli Tepe is 12,000 years old. There's no doubt about it. It is 100%.

And isn't there two? Graham was saying there's two other ones that the initial tests are coming out. There's like one in Australia and another one in Indonesia that was found. And he said it's more and more like his original theory that he was poo-pooed on is now seeming to be more and more correct oh yeah between him and randall carlson i mean they've really uncovered a lot of issues that there was trying to date the history of civilization and also the history of cataclysmic disasters was it's very problematic because there's very little evidence and it's really difficult but over the the past decade, more and more evidence from geologists, like all this nuclear

glass that they're finding, they do core samples. They dig down 12,000 for 12,000 years. They get like a 12,000 at 12,000 when they get to 12,000 years universally, like across Europe and Asia, they find this, it's called, find this it's called i think it's called tritonite it's nuclear glass and this nuclear glass it exists in um nuclear explosion test sites and also in meteor impacts and so this stuff being spread out all over the place they think that there was a pounding that this earth took a fucking pounding by meteors somewhere around 12,000 years ago, and it could possibly have been the reason why the Ice Age ended, and also could be the reason why a massive amount of animals went extinct almost instantaneously.

Woolly mammoths, saber-toothed tigers, like 60% of all land mammals. And it could be the reason why there's these ancient structures that date before Gobekli Tepe or before you know it 12,000 years ago someone covered Gobekli Tepe That's how they know the reason they have a uniform age of the dirt that is Covering Gobekli Tepe so for they explained it. This is all not fringe stuff either by the way. This is all like legit they explained it. This is all not fringe stuff either, by the way. This is all like legit archaeologists. They're absolutely certain that

someone covered that 12,000 years ago. Well, how old was it when they covered it? No one knows. So, you got something at least. You can't test stone. Yeah, it's bio-carbon, like living things, right? That you can carbon date, right? That's how they tested the age of the pyramids. They tested

the material that's between the stones and, you know, the biological material, whether it's wood or things along those lines, you could test that stuff and get pretty accurate readings. See, this is what's so awesome about your podcast. When we try to put a little bit of technology in the culture, how it's radically changing things. Like, I mean, anyone I put onto your podcast gets hooked. And in fact, I've joked, cause I've been in things where you bring on such interesting people that got me to research things that I would have never looked into before. Like go back late Tepe.

The way that I even knew how to pronounce it was because we'd heard Graham Hancock on here. We, when he did his war on consciousness bit, Brett and I were like, we need to get that guy for the fucking film. Like he has to be interviewed. Um,

and then, you know, when I met with graham hang but the information and getting people to look at new ideas and great perspectives and the platform of having people come on here for a good two three hours to really communicate things like that trickle effect i've witnessed it i've seen people that have like been inspired by your show that have lost it they're like man you're the guy that did the union the culture high like joe show i I use on it.

I've lost 60 pounds. Like I love your stuff. I've changed my perspective. Like I've witnessed how it's already having a trickle effect of putting out, just getting new information on there, getting people to think outside the box. Like when we talked earlier about the ego kind of preventing you from sometimes progressing. Yeah.

Well, you have a lot of great people. You stress it on here all the time, but other people, you have great interviews that do it too You stress it on here all the time, but other people, you have great interviews that do it too. I found for me even at times, there's times when I'm like, you know what, I should self-reflect.

I should get back into boxing and martial arts and maybe my ego is getting swelling. It's good to get into that and I left going back to, I boxed competitively when I was younger and I love going back in there now and getting beat up by these young guys because it's Really humbling right bad for your brain though, dude. Yeah, I don't super bad for you. Well, you know, I

Just to the head aren't good try yoga I've been doing a lot of yoga lately do that. Well, I'd also for the ego to My daughter wants to now get into jiu-jitsu. So we're gonna do jitsu is great. Yeah, I love jiu-jitsu What I love about jiu-jitsu is it doesn't have the striking. I mean, I grew up a striker. Yeah. My whole, I mean, the reason why I became who I am,

I think, is because of the trials and tribulations of martial arts and going through competition and all the fear and the overcoming that fear and all that stuff. I mean,

and also like the self-reflection, the fact that it makes you very objective about your abilities. You have to assess yourself in a very, very clear way. Otherwise you're going to leave vulnerabilities and you're going to get hurt. I couldn't picture who I'd be without my boxing coach

and putting like, it was very good for me in my teenage years to, you know, build confidence, humility, because the first time you get in any sparring session. You get lit up session you get lit up But that's health like other than the actual physical brain It's good to realize that you're not the man at everything right and but you can't be it takes a long time to be the man I mean, how do you think Floyd Mayweather got to be 48? No and untouchable Fucking countless hours in the gym

I mean you could call that guy a wife beater and a piece of shit and a dummy and he can't read and you're probably right about all those things. But what you can't deny is the hard work that he put into that craft paid off and anyone that thinks they're just gonna figure that out right away, you're just not. From the little bit of boxing I did,

you're not figuring it out right away. There's some physical gifts that some people bring to the table unquestionably, but it's one of those things that you just have to work really hard at. And my belief is that when you work really hard at something and you get better at something, that thing becomes a vehicle for developing your human potential. And then you can transfer that same sort of energy and focus and the lessons that you learn from that into all different walks of life. The more extreme the situation is, the more difficult the task is,

the more you learn about yourself in pursuing that task and the more beneficial it is to you outside of that task. I couldn't agree more because, you know, a lot of complications when I first did the union and getting into the industry and getting like, you know, I wanted to be able to story tell and make films and documentaries as my living. But it was the union. That was your first one, right? First one. Well, you really knocked it out of the fucking park. Thank you.

For your first project to be that good. Thank you. But to make the finances and deal with the, as you know, you're very familiar with the film industry. Not really. Well, the entertainment industry, I'll say, um, you know,

took a while, but you know, I, I even put it on my business cards. I put creative hustler because I think some of the things of overcoming adversity and objections and the work you have to put in that I learned from boxing and applied really well to being like constantly rejected, being told your idea is stupid.

Like so many people said the union would never work. Like you're dumb. That's a pop movie. Who wants to see this? And then when it blew, I actually have, you know, our distributor took it as a favor to somebody else saying it will never have any commercial success. What year did you do that? 2007.

That's crazy. That was almost 10 years ago. That's so weird. Eight years ago today. Yeah. Weird. And it's kind of amazing that that was your first film. I look back now and I don't think I, you know, we couldn't have done any better.

It was, you know, like you said, a grand slam for our first film. And then since then, I've been very fortunate to work on lots of other great docs. Like we worked on I Am Bruce Lee then. And then I did The Good Son with Ray Boom Boom Mancini. I don't know i don't think you've watched the good son but i've heard amazing things about man that you want to talk about a guy that overcome adversity like you're a boxing fan so you know ray's story a little bit right but as a kid his dad was a number one contender right but then was drafted to the war and wasn't able to fight took shrapnel came back into the ring was never the same fighter got beat up damaged damaged his eye.

So at 10 years old, 10, Ray makes a promise to his dad, Dad, I will win the world title that you so deserve to fight for. And his dad's like, Raymond, don't go through it so hard. 21, Ray wins the world title and gives it to his dad and says it's finally where it should be after 42 years. And then Ray's whole reason for getting into boxing was for righteous reasons to win a world title for his father. And then in his third title defense, he takes the life of a father in Dooku Kim when he kills Kim in the 14th round, and Kim had only found out two or three months before he was leaving to fight Ray that his wife was pregnant. He never even got to meet his son.

So in The Good Son, Ray meets the son of the man that he killed 30 years later. Jesus Christ. Yeah. Oh, my God. Being a part of that, and Ray is, and then three months. How does he handle it? Ray had come to peace with it a long time ago, right? But he really wanted to do this for G1, right?

Because G1 wanted to meet him and wanted to put at rest and let him know that, you know, it was just two warriors that went to war. But for the ending of that fight, you know, the fight itself is a great fight. Oh, yeah. Dooku actually wrote in his notes, we found all this stuff because we went to Korea and interviewed his trainer. I know the whole story. And he actually wrote, like, I will die in the ring tonight before I leave. actually wrote like I will die in the ring tonight before I look that was his he came from nothing in Korea like banam nor like right next to the North Korean border slept in a pen with a whore like poor poor he fought to eat so fighting

Ray was his chance at success he was not going to lose that fight and the first four rounds I mean he takes it to Ray right they go hard they go crazy fine so you know now going on this journey with these docs, like, now I'm hooked. I don't want to do anything other than docs, because you meet Ray. Ray is such an amazing individual. Like, I mean, his brother was murdered three months before he won his world title.

That still did not detour him, right? He stuck right in there, won his first world title. When you watch the doc, like, if you were to script what happened to him with, like, him promising since he was 10 years old to win a world title his brother getting murdered three months before he wins then tragically taking the light like you'd be like this is a ridiculous script this is too fantastic like too bullshit but it really happened to him sometimes people's lives do play out like a ridiculous movie and nothing but amazing great things to say about ray you an

amazing individual are you a fan of documentaries you like a warner herzog fan or anything you yeah i i don't like any particular one person just i do love doc so like i for me when i was hooked and i think i might have said this last time i was on the podcast but when you're in that audience and your documentary has an emotional connection with the audience and you see them like when Ray's film like people are crying like guys I know they're full motorcycle guys that I was friends with like they're crying in there in front of the dude you made me cry in front all the boys and you know when Jace and David and his son Jaden are on there with the things and people are crying like and you see it has that impact and then you see it being you know universities and stuff people

reaching out to me saying I used your film as a catalyst for my graduating argument. And it's tough to just want to go make an action film where everybody's shooting each other later. Right. Or it's tough when you see something that is not only a great story, but has emotional impact. Right. Well, when done correctly, the medium of documentaries can have an amazing impact. You can remember things i think it is the best as long as like it's done correctly like the information it's like it's not michael

moored yeah you know what i mean yes unfortunately he can do so good but then he pushes it too far for me i'm like leave the facts yeah don't make someone look stupid it doesn't really help it's not not necessarily bad to make certain people look stupid if they are stupid. What you can't do is edit little snippets to fill your narrative. And, you know, that's what he's guilty of. You know, like he's done more harm than good. And he got lumped into that group of guys that people will automatically, like, knee-jerk, call deceptive. I think he did some great work.

I think Bowling for Columbine was fascinating. And Roger and Me, I think, is great. That's his best one. Yeah, and that was his first one. And I think that was the purest one. And he really built the industry. He set the bar. He was like the Michael Jordan for it.

He made feature docs mainstream. Yeah, and the Bowling for Columbine, did he even get into mental health issues and prescription drugs? And I don't think mostly about guns mostly about guns. It's not a gun issue. That's a mental health issue We did I wrote this on Twitter, but I'll stand by it This country has a mental health issue disguised as a gun problem and that's that's really what it is Well, look at when we just had what Gabber explains, right? Like it's early childhood And then yeah

If someone gets a dangerous weapon in their hands when they have mental problems bad things can happen And it's so hard to fix people of that it's so hard once once your mind has gone down this awful path of Addiction and childhood trauma and all these horrible life experiences and you have compensated or undercompensated or overcompensated and you're affected by that and like the idea of becoming a balanced human being it seems like unattainable it seemed it's it's incredibly difficult for these here's the crazy part you don't know i had one of my best friends going through went manic bipolar right like he had a big event that caused it and he was wrongly

prescribed some antidepressants. And one summer he just started acting really sporadically out of character. Right. But this was before this was in 2003, the same year that my, my father passed away. So it wasn't like you, none of us put our finger on it right away. Like, Oh, you have a minute. Like people are just like, you're being an asshole. Like why have you changed? Why, why are you so spread? Like, cause it wasn't common knowledge. Like you don a men like people are just like you're being an asshole like why have you changed why why are you so spread like because it wasn't common knowledge like you don't and people that have it happening at the time they don't wake up in the morning and be like hmm i think i'm imbalanced and i have a mental health issue right you have to go cease and then someone's like hey i can like once he sat down with someone it was two seconds they're like you're bipolar right like

then they started doing the blood tests and they started testing to see what would work. And now he's super successful. He's balanced it. He's taking his lithium. And so certain drugs can literally stop that. They can nip that in the bud. If you get it right. If you get it right.

But you have to be very careful. Like one thing he was very good at is he didn't want to stay on antidepressants. Right. So the lithium balances him. But then they originally they wanted to get him so he like his arm looked like a heroin addict for a while he was getting all these different tests and see what what because uh like carisandamaria broke this down too there's very different like inhibitors and neurohibitors when it comes to antidepressants right he wanted to

wean off of that so what a lot of them encourage which comes back to kind of we're saying like diet exercise a lot of these things weigh into mental health, right? You can't just throw it on the drug, right? Like, Oh, you're an addict. Like, so he's very big on, he runs marathons, he exercise, like, and that really helps, you know, the natural endorphins and stuff that he needs. So he doesn't have to be on antidepressants, right? He works out crazy. He doesn't drink alcohol because that's a depressant and that can cause

things. So even if it's a business meeting or something, he'll try to be very, maybe, you know, he'll have a social beer or something, but he tries not to drink too much because he says, he's told me that he's like, if he does for a few businessmen,

he's like, I can feel it the next day. I can feel I'm a little off. I'm a little cloudy, right? Like my cognitive functions a little slower, right? So he's like,

I try just to stay away from, for me. Cause I know that it can be problematic. Well, he got, it sounds like he got very lucky that they came up with medication that can treat him. I know a dude who was always a little off. And then over the last four or five years has become just a complete paranoid. I mean, I want to say paranoid schizophrenic. I don't know, but I mean, he literally believes that everything is a conspiracy. Everything in the world is tied to mind-controlled tests. And, you know, it's sad to see.

It's just one of those things. Like, you know, you run into people like that and you just go, man, that could be me. Like, I could be trapped in that hell, too. And I'm super proud of my, because like you said said he's one of the only guys i know that is really like he's awesome now he's really made his life successful like a lot of when he was diagnosed he started sending us like stuff to understand bipolar where it's like 85 of them die it's not a good like either um you know abuse of substances car accidents because things become a video game right like he talks about it now joking about like

he's like man when i was in my crazy days like i used to ride my my dad's motorcycle going 80 kilometers an hour having a cigarette like on the highway right like he's like i was crazy like i right it's like i didn't smoke before but all of a sudden now i'm smoking and like like he was just like i was out of my mind spending money sporadically and and but the the crazy part that i was really trying to hone in is you don't wake up and know right you don't no one tells you right like luckily enough he had a great strong family and people that were like let's talk to someone right because you're not the same like within three month period you're fighting with everyone your friends and your emotions

are like you're crying one minute then you're mad and and luckily like you know not a lot of them have a high percentage but he's doing extremely well mental health issues have such a stigma in this country people don't want to admit they have mental health issues they're they're connected the perception by a lot of people is connected to weakness well you know a depression is a big one he couldn't get a job for the longest time because he'd be honest about it and people didn't want to hire him. And I was like, dude, that should almost be like, like once he's like, listen, I'm balanced, I'm treated. Like they were like, no, we can't take that risk. Like he was looked at like a leper. Can you blame them? I mean, you don't know whether

or not they're balanced. You don't know whether or not it's going to keep working, like whatever medication they're on. I mean, I kind of get it on both sides I certainly think that for a person searching for a job that has mental health issues It's it's a huge bummer that people can't respect the fact that you've taken all the steps and gotten your treatment And now you're a healthy person But if you're some guy who's running some office somewhere and you want to keep the peace you want a friendly work environment Everyone to be family and get along together and you got this dude Who's on 15 different kinds of fucking pills to keep himself from running head on in the walls.

You know, I could, I can, I can understand it, but I think that the mental health, the stigma, especially the stigma on depression. I mean,

I have a Cara Santa Maria who's in the culture high. It was a good friend of mine. We heard her on here as well. That's where your podcast inspired a lot of the people. That's awesome. Well, my podcast inspired me too. I mean, it's awesome. Well, my podcast inspired me, too. I mean, call it my podcast, but what it really is is like it's a door that I found.

Conduit. You're getting good conversation. That's really what it is. It's some sort of a strange antenna or a path or a channel in the river or whatever it is. And I opened it up, and I'm like, oh, look at this. And then all the people are coming through. But it's not like people say, Oh, you're doing a great service. Well, kind of doing a great service to me too. Like that's the number one benefactor is me. Cause

I get these conversations with all these fantastic people like Graham Hancock or Neil deGrasse Tyson or, you know, Brian Cox. And these are like these brilliant, brilliant people. And you have these fascinating conversations. And I get so much out of that. I mean, I'm just, I'm constantly curious and constantly filled with all these new ideas. And it's amazing for me. It's amazing. So same for me.

Like I listen religiously. Like I, I don't listen when my kids are in the car because they can go off on tangents at times whereas I'll try and then I'm like okay way too many f-bombs I was in my car the other day and I turned it on and it was the Sirius replay because you know we're on Sirius satellite and it was my voice and the kids sat down I'm like get the fuck out of it you fucking moron daddy is that you is that you daddy Is that you, Daddy? Like, what? Daddy doesn't talk like that.

How dare you? Turn it into some sort of a joke with the kids. But I can't even go on, like, when I, anytime I'm going on a long drive, like, if I don't have podcasts, I'm not going. Like, I can't listen to music anymore. I need to. And now I got hooked on Dan Carlin's Hardcore History. Oh, the best.

So good. The best. This new one, this, this uh the one that he just put out he's got this this series out in part six just came out and it's blueprint for armageddon it's all about world war one my buddy was just telling me he's like adam he's like skip the mongols go to that one no no don't skip the mongols the mongols is still the best this is this is awesome it is a blueprint for Armageddon is fucking awesome. But the Mongols is epic.

I'm loving that. I can't believe. I mean, you've crushed it to death on here. But, like, how good those guys were riding horses and shooting fucking bows. They were like. I wish I could see it. Yeah. You know, there's a guy named.

I think his name is Lars Anderson. I don't know if you've heard of him before. I haven't heard of him before, but he's famous on the internet over the last year or so for developing these ancient archery techniques that were lost. And he has looked in these ancient texts and photos of how there's one way of holding bows and arrows that we have today, and one way that he thinks that they did back then where they held all the arrows in their hands instead of in a quiver yeah they held them on their hands and they could literally rapid fire several hour arrows in a second and he thinks that this might be one of the like lost techniques that these ancient archers use see this guy here lars anderson like look See this guy here? Lars Andersen. This guy can shoot things that are in the air. You gotta see

how good this guy is at this. How quick. Look, he throws a tennis ball, and as the tennis ball bounces in the air, look at this. He can shoot it with his fucking... He's shooting it with his leg. He's got a bunch of amazing videos where he

shows all the different things he could do look how quick He can shoot this he throws the arrow up in the air. I Mean it's incredible. That's insane. He shoots things in the air before he's coming down with the bow To he shot two in like a second and that's the bow in his left hand He can do the bow in his right hand bow in his left hand. He can switch back and forth either way I mean I socket yeah, I mean this guy must be like autistic in his right hand, bow in his left hand. He can switch back and forth either way. Right in the eye socket. Yeah, I mean, this guy must be like, he's autistic.

I was just going to say, how many hours of practice is that? He just shot an arrow. Look at this. He's spinning this wheel and as the wheel spins, he's shooting the arrows into the wheel. Look at this. He's going to bounce off this thing. He shot two arrows before he hit the ground. Three arrows in a half a second. Look at this. He's going to bounce off this thing. He shot two arrows before he hit the ground. Three arrows

in a half a second. This is incredible. Don't try this at home. But I think it would be fucking amazing. So what he's doing right now is he's going to spin and shoot the arrow in the air. And he dodged one there. Yeah.

Well, he shoots the arrow in the air as it's coming towards him. The guy shoots an arrow and as it's coming towards him. The guy shoots an arrow, and as it's coming at him. Holy shit. But I think to see the Mongols and how they had done it must have been really, it would be really amazing if someone was alive that had the kind of proficiency that they had back then. They would wait until the horse was in mid-gallop, so all four legs were off the ground before they released the arrow. Yeah, so that it didn't shake. It was insane when he was explaining it. I'm like, that doesn't even seem possible.

It's possible. I believe. They would just time it. I mean, it seems totally possible. If you could see that guy shoot three arrows in.6 seconds. I mean, one of my buddies that plays football, he was talking about how they learn how to run on a treadmill to be more like a gallop so that they don't waste energy.

So, I mean, you could see how you could. He was just explaining it to me. I hadn't, didn't get to see it. And he's like, yeah, we learn how to. So it's like you can do strides on the field so you don't burn out. You're like, you can learn to kind of gallop until you have to really press, right, and get in there so you can keep your momentum up. Huh. So it's like less, you know, like me, I'm very heavy footed if I run on the treadmill.

I'm like, palm, palm, palm, palm, run on the ground like there's a way to be lighter kind of like you know sprinters are much more on their tippy toes for a part of it right right well they say that you're really supposed to run on the ball your feet yeah and that like this heel running that we've all gotten accustomed to is actually the design of running shoes and the people creating these running shoes with these really thick heel pads they've actually changed the gait of runners yeah jamie you're a runner right that's do you run with uh those kind of uh running shoes uh yeah i'd actually use like the nike free run they're actually really thin not as thin as like a converse but pretty close to that it's almost like running barefoot just with a little rubber on yourles so you run and land on the ball your foot and use that to cushion

Yeah, yeah, it's weird like you switch those work as like a little bit of a spring for you Yeah, your toes work as yeah It's like a shock absorber and if you run heel like everybody is used to it's like super bad for you Super bad like you can just feel it when you get you know I've been recently trying to get back into shape is every time we go on road trips for filming, we eat like shit. We're late hours working. You get out of whack, right?

It's when I get home and I can feel it the first couple of weeks I'm on the treadmill. I'm heavy. I've kind of lost my rhythm. I'm like clunk, clunk. I can feel the extra weight in my joints. But then once you get, I kind of get back, I'm like, okay, now I've, it's weird to correct and I'm not anyone professional correcting me or looking and seeing if I have the right shoe or whatever, but even I just notice like, okay, I'm starting to get my rhythm, start

to pace a bit better. I'm not so heel bang as I'm running. Well, I run on the balls of my feet when I do it, but it always feels like I'm falling forward or something. You know what I mean? Like it changes the way, I'm not really feeling like I'm falling forward, but you know what I mean? I've got it like, am I doing this the right way?

You know, like I feel like I'm doing something wrong. Yeah. When I run the real way you're supposed to run. Well, because your body's adapted and molded to the way that is. So then you just go and change it. It's like, well, you know, similar to martial arts when you're like, I'm a boxer stance, right? So if I was going to go, but that doesn't work for fighting MMA, right? My stance would be side.

It's much easier for a takedown. I'd have to adapt, and that would be really awkward for me at first. Takedowns is a consideration. Leg kicks is a huge one. Yeah, for boxers to get lit up there. You have to stand sideways more or parallel more. It's just one of those things where I think if you watch kids run, you kind of get a sense like, oh, this is just natural for them.

They run on the balls of their feet totally naturally. And then we have, through those weird shoes, we figured out a way to kind of come up with a new way. And that way has been adopted across the board as people think it's the right way. Well, look at you. You have young kids and I have a boy that's three and he's always falling forward because he's so tippy toe heavy when he runs right now. Right. Yeah.

And when I go to his daycare, I see all the kids are doing like they're so giant heads to imagine if you have a fucking head like a little kid like I have a four year old and her head is like almost as wide as her shoulders. You really think about how big their fucking heads are. Imagine if you had a head that went all the way out to the side, you know, like one of those, like you were a furry. You're one of those dudes who has a mascot head on. Yeah, they fall forward. There's too much weight.

Their weight's all out of whack. My boy bails all the time because he's too fat. Yeah, all the time. But then gets right up and keeps going. Yeah, I think that whoever invented the running shoe with that padded heel, it's really kind of amazing how much of an impact that's had. But it works when you're working your regular day job, though, and you're sitting on your heels all day, right? That's when you run. It's still bad for you. Even those shoes, like, those shoes are bad to walk around in. right that's still bad for you yeah even those shoes like those shoes are bad to walk around in the guys who are back experts spinal correction people they say that the issue of like changing

the way you stand like giving yourself an incline like because of the fact you have heels on like girls that wear high heels or dudes who wear cowboy boots or shit like that it's super bad for your back it's like giving your back this weird sort of oh this is the they had those um that's like those barefoot technology shoes yeah that people were wearing for a while I tried wearing those for a while they were so ridiculous you know why I stopped wearing them I couldn't wear them on stage and you know those where they called BT something barefoot you weren't allowed to wear them on stage no no no you rock in them they have like this uh they don't have the heel they have like a big flat part uh a big like thick part in the middle sort of yeah and the idea is this barefoot technology is like that you got to kind of you're constantly correcting

because you're kind of stepping on this odd sponge, and then it gives you, like, you're burning off more calories, and you're using your balance more in these stupid shoes. This is the idea behind it. But didn't that all get debunked that it doesn't actually? Well, I think Skechers, put that up again, Jamie? There's some sort of a giant class action lawsuit, and the, oh, consumer injury lawsuits.

I didn't know about this. Is this new? Yeah, this year. Oh, this is new because there was class action lawsuit and the oh consumer injury lawsuits i didn't know about this is this new oh this is new because there was a class action lawsuits and now there's but is that for that shoe or is that for that toe shoe that you're talking about no this is shape up shoe with that rocker thing oh yeah that thing looks ridiculous yeah i'd have troubles walking well it's totally ridiculous but it's the same exact style of shoes as barefoot run technology shoes, whatever the fuck they're called But those these things they're supposed to like you're supposed to be like constantly correcting almost like you're on a Balance bar or something like that Look at this if you or a loved one suffered a broken hip broken ankle stress fracture or Achilles tendonitis

That could be the result of wearing toning shoes like Skechers shape-ups, we want to hear from you. You may be eligible. Oh, the fucking hounds are out. You may be eligible to receive compensation for your medical bills, lost wages, pain, and suffering, or other damages. What other damages can there be? No, I couldn't get laid, man.

Stress. This fucking shoe I was wearing. Wearing stupid fucking shoes. It ruined my confidence and prevented me from getting job and no girl would look at me Yeah, I started taking mental health medication Yeah, those um those shoes were quite popular for a while But I couldn't wear them on stage because you can't stand on your heels like you're kind of rocking a little bit like if you try to sit back like you can't like you can't like just because you have this like like hump in the center of the shoe okay it's really

really stupid I try to wear things as flat as possible my favorite shoes are chucks converse all-stars I like those are my favorite because they're super simple they're really flat there's no heel and those you they're the best for working out too because you can like you push off the ground you work out Chugs yeah, yeah, or barefoot. I like to lift barefoot, but if I'm at home I lift barefoot from at a gym They make you wear your shoes because because that little thin layer is gonna help if you drop an 80-pound dumbbell on there Right that will save your toe. I guess it probably helped a little you know I think it might help the cut

I don't think it'll help the bone, but it might help you split and open. It's just strange that, like, this style of shoe, like, these aren't chucks, but they're the same thing. It's a really thin sole. That's flat. No fat cushion on the bottom. Like, those running shoes with the fat cushion by the heel, supposed to be really bad for you. Supposed to be. Like, also, a wallet in your back pocket Supposed to be really bad for you. Supposed to be. Not, like, also a wallet in your back pocket.

Supposed to be really bad for you. I have a fucking Costanza wallet, but I put it in my, I always wear like a sports coat so I can put it in the side pocket there. Now people are going to know to pickpocket you, Adam Scorgi. They can't get it out. They can't get it out. I'll tell you, it'll get stuck if they try to. I switched to one of these recently, a minimalist wallet.

It's just a little tiny one that I put in my front pocket. No more fanny pack? I have a fanny pack still. You haven't given up on that one? No way. I'm never giving up. I'm not giving that up. It's the best thing.

I travel too much. It's the best thing for travel. I put it on. Everything's always right there in the front. I don't have to reach my pockets on airplanes and everything. And then when I go through the TSA, I just click, put that sucker in the basket. It does make sense. Let it go through. I get out of there, click, put it right back on, and everything and then when I go through the TSA I just click put that sucker in the basket does make sense through it does it click put it right back on and we're off it does make sense when you break it down that way so I'm always thinking brother oh he's thinking oh he's breaking shit down

I read I just don't understand how the fanny pack got out of favor I just refused I refused to accept it never Never had one. Satchels. People in their satchels. It's also an extra carry-on for you. It's like an extra little bag. Yeah. Yes, you can live with that one. Well, that's right when you were thinking, I was like, actually, I might have to rock one of these for my product.

Because I have my passport and, like, my green card and everything. And, like, then you've got, like, for us to cross with film gear, we have to get, like, they're called pocket letters. So that shows that a Canadian production is hiring Canadian workersadian workers we're not taking american jobs we're just simply interviewing american subjects and so i have to have all that documentation and a carne for equipment to show that we're not selling our equipment that we're bringing down and the whole work so having that would actually be pretty handy where i could have like all my stuff in there and just take it off to go through the the belt i had this one lady, only one lady ever on a plane tell me that that was a bag

and that that bag had to either be put in another bag or tucked under my seat. And I go, what are you talking about? It's a pocket. It's a pocket that's in the front. It's just not attached to my pants. She's like, it's a bag, sir. I go, it's a fanny pack.

It's a fanny pack that's connected. She made me stuff it in my backpack. Oh, you're really going to make me take this off and put it in my backpack? For takeoff and landing going to make me take this off and put it in my backpack? For takeoff and landing, you have to take all back. Go on, lady. I've been on a million flights. This has never happened before.

It gets so ridiculous to me when someone tries to get the gold star. You can travel a ton, like the same airline and everything, and then one day someone else is like... Yeah. I try not to argue because always I'm filming, so I just don't want any reason, especially if I'm going in Canada. I'll argue a bit more, but if I'm going to argue because always I'm filming so I just don't want any reason especially if I'm going if I'm going in Canada I'll argue a bit more but if I'm going to the United States we have a chance to not let me in I just Or anywhere in the world, I'm just fuck yes, sir. Yes, sir. Yep. No problem

Yeah, I had a guy pull me out of line last time I went to Canada It was really I was on my way to do the UFC. It was kind of interesting. The guy, he, what is that called? Not pattern you. What is it called? Oh, randomly select? Not randomly selected. What is it called when you target someone of Middle Eastern descent?

What is that called? Profile. Profile you, yeah. Yeah, so the guy looked at me any goes come here, sir I talked to you for a second and like out of nowhere. There's a line of people. They're looking at everybody goes You're pretty big guy. What do you do? You know like like what I do like what are you talking about? What do I do like what did I do wrong? Yeah, and he goes uh he goes. What are you here for I go? I work for the ultimate fighting championship. He goes oh

What's up, Joe? And then he was cool with me. But I was like, but if he wasn't cool with me. He looked at me like, what are you, bringing in steroids or something? You lifting weights? You got any rocks in that fucking backpack? It was like, I didn't do anything wrong. I had all my paperwork.

And I had my passport. And I had gone through. And the guy's like, come here, sir. Can I talk to you for a moment? He did not recognize me. I had a through, and the guy's like, come here, sir. Can I talk to you for a moment? Like, he did not recognize me. I had, like, I had a Vortex hat on. Yeah. You know, like, fucking just a, I was just, looked like a normal dude.

But for whatever reason, I don't know if he decided, like, we're going to, like, target people who look like they lift weights. Or people who look like they might be shady. I got flagged for a while where I was pulled every time I went to Vancouver Airport. Because one time I was leaving, it was weird. My wife had got me a new bag it came with like she bought me some cologne and then it came it was a Calvin Klein bag like just a duffel bag that came with the cologne so I packed my stuff it was like a two-day trip to New York it was when I was first doing the union I was looking for crews and I was interviewing producers and stuff like that and it was just a quick trip but then I came back and then they pulled me aside and then they tested my bag.

And they're like, your bag is tested positive for cocaine. And I was like, what? I was like, bullshit. I was like, show it to me. I was like, I didn't know, understand at the time. And they're like, we found cocaine all over your bag. I'm like, bullshit. Let me see.

There's no cocaine in my bag. And they said, no, no, no. Well, like we tested it. There's particles. Why would it be on there? Do you do cocaine? I'm like, never in my life. Not even tried it.

They're like, well, how is it all over your bag? I'm like i'm like i have no idea and then so we run in the back for hours and they're like they're like hey quit playing this game we talked to your friend i'm like good well he would have told you the same thing so i was traveling with a friend i was like he would have told you the same thing trying to go good cop back yeah yeah he's like he told us the drill and i was like what what drill yeah that we went to new york we're looking at developing a documentary and then and it finally came down to where i said okay like tell me how this particle thing works because i did the night deposit for my nightclub the night before right and they say a large majority of money especially in nightclubs and stuff i ask cocaine on it right

people do a rail wipe their hand grab the bill and i'd done the cash deposit for the nightclub right before our flight i'd put it in that bag, went to the night deposit, put it in the bank, and then I flew out at like 6 or 7 in the morning, like packed my gear and stuff. So I said, could it be that like cocaine was on the money that was then in my bag, that then they're like, yes, we can trace particles like that. I'm like, well, then there's your answer. But then they looked at my club, strip club, cheetahs, this, that, and then there. Then it was just like we were in there longer, and it was like, time i came back and here's the interesting thing is every time i came back

through vancouver you got flagged they'd pull me aside pull me and finally i was so mad it was like one in the morning i was like please just don't pull me aside i'm so tired i gotta drive to the outskirts of vancouver to stay at my buddy's place i just want to go to bed it's gonna make three please go to the side i'm like so i was so mad i just laid on their metal counter i was tired because you know, they do the thing where they put you over there and then nobody comes for like half hour. Yeah.

Just make you sit there. So I just laid, I started napping. It was exhaust. Like one 30 in the morning coming back from New York. I laid up there and the girl comes to get down. I'm like, I'm tired.

It's one 30 in the morning. I'm really tired. And I'm not playing any games. Like she, and I finally just said, why am I getting pulled over all the time? I've never broken a law. You can't like,

there's nothing every check your thing. I've never done anything. I've never brought over items that I shouldn't. I haven't mean. And she's like, well, the big problem is, is that one time your bag got tested. And I was like, I explained that and that should all be in the notes. Right. She said, yeah, but we always don't trust it when you say you don't do the product. Right. And it's all over your bag because then we think you're a smuggler. She's like, you're almost better to just say, yep, I did some cocaine with friends or or whatever and we don't have any on me and i was like but i don't i don't do it i'm not gonna say i did it she's like well that's why they think you're maybe a smuggler you're doing quick trips to new york it's on your bag well it's like the

guy who got in trouble for structuring you know it's like it's like the same you did it similar to what it is so we're gonna take your money Was just cash They have a bunch of different techniques That they teach these knuckleheads To try to like recognize shady people And so they like think they're Fucking spies or like think they're detectives Like staring at everybody

I don't know about that Jamie Vernon Look at his face I saw a deceptive tick sir And I immediately pulled him out of the line I actually got the guy really pissed off I don't know about that Jamie Vernon. Look at his face. I saw a deceptive tick, sir. And I immediately pulled him out of the line. I actually got the guy really pissed off. Because I used to get, these were the Canadian guys. And I'm a Canadian.

So I was like, you can't kick me out of my own country. So I'd battle with them a little bit harder. And the one guy asked me, he's like, have you ever done a narcotic? And I was like, no, never done a narcotic. He's like, have you never smoked weed? I'm like, that's not a narcotic. Narcotic comes from the Latin word meaning narcosis, causing a sleep-induced state, which is usually applied to opiates and heroines and stuff like that i was like i was like marijuana is a psychotropical drug i think he was just like psychotropic psychotropic right that's a tropical is like a part of the world and and uh and he was

just like let's not get to the nitty-gritty i said no no you're a border guard you're asking me questions i'm answering honestly so if you're going to ask me questions you make sure you answer the you ask me the right one and i will give you the correct answer and he was just like go right you can go that's the difference between canadians and americans americans they're like fuck this guy make him wait canadians are more willing to admit defeat. Excuse me, sorry. Yeah, I just think that the whole border thing is fucking ridiculous. It's really ridiculous. Well, and I had that debate with one of them, too.

I'm like, do you guys know where you're starting? Like, the big guys smuggle hundreds of tons, like, through transport ships. I've got one carry-on. How much are you getting today? Well, you know how few of those transport boxes ever get checked off when you look at those gigantic freighter ships and they're just covered in those boxes the vast majority of those boxes never get searched well look at howard marks from our film the cannabis smuggler from the uk he was great genius way to put in there what he's like i made deals with the road manager of pink floyd genesis because he's like of course they're even if they did the test thing back then they're like it's a band of course there's weed and stuff and he put it all in there and smuggled it across yeah hash right

inside those speakers and all the different he's an old school legend yeah where's that guy now where does he live actually unfortunately he's still in the uk can't really leave the uk i don't think but he just got diagnosed with unoperable colon cancer. So he's taken a turn. He's bald now going through things. He's going on kind of a last tour, and there's a doc being done specifically just on him and his role. But, I mean, a brilliant character. I love watching him in the theater.

Everybody's laughing when he's on. He's hilarious. He's got great charisma. Yeah. One of the things I thought was really hilarious about him was what he said that if he could do it today he's like i'd crack it up he's like i mean i loved it yeah that was great such a great honest answer and he's just like he's like i suppose if i could get away with it i'd crack it up today i mean i loved it well it sounds like he was having a ball ball he loved it he was like a rocker like and

he yeah he he and then the other part that's funny too is when he talks about the dea and It sounds like he was having a ball. A ball. He was like a rocker. Yeah. And then the other part that's funny, too, is when he talks about the DEA, and he's like, they say it was 50 tons, but I know. Of course, you're a transporter. You know what you're getting and receiving. He's like, I know it was only 30 tons. I know how much I was making off of that. Yeah.

He was amazing. He was an amazing part of that. It's just so important to recognize how silly this whole war on drugs has been and how ineffective this whole war on drugs has been. And that these guys who were the enemy are these charismatic, really hilarious, nice people. That actually spent lots of time and effort to try to change the laws. And we asked him, we're like, you were making a profit on it, though, wasn't he? He's like, I just feel that it'd be like a rocker. I was only going to last so long and kind of just do it as long as I could until I went down, right?

What's next? Are you going to do another documentary on weed? Yeah, actually, we've got, not on weed. I'm done on weed. How can you? Colorado. No, we're done on weed. I've got two in the works right now. We actually just got one approved by Robbie Knievel called Chasing Evil.

Oh, wow. That we're looking on all about how he was chasing his father's legacy and then ultimately surpassed it. And then his own father actually was threatened by his son rivaling his thing. So it becomes pretty dark. And then also another one that I've been working on for years to get the finance together. It's Ice Guardians, all about the role of NHL enforcers in the history of fighting in hockey and how now it's being weaned out of the game, where it started,

why it evolved over the years. It's called the pussification of the world, Adam Scorji. Pussification of America. Yeah. Why are they taking fighting out of hockey? How dare they? You take away fighting out of hockey you know what you got figure skating with a black tic tac yeah well there's there's some very interesting uh dynamics

that plays into it because such a fast game and you're on a foreign surface with razor blades on your feet and sticks and you know a lot of the pro because we didn't just interview tough guys we're interviewing superstars and stuff too right that? That said like, look, I played my best games when I knew there wasn't a chance a guy was going to lift his stick and hit me in the eye or throw an elbow, it was going to be a concussion. He's like, yeah, you can get suspended or get a fine, but nothing is more intimidating

than when you have a six foot six killer that he comes and leans over your shoulder and says, if you play reckless like that again, I'm coming, right? So intimidation where it's, it's a fascinating dynamic that's been argued, like kind of like the marijuana thing where there's always the, you know, black and white, but there's so many other nuances to it. And for me, the story I thought that's always been missed is these guys are amazing, charismatic guys that were so selfless, willing to fight on ice, bare knuckle, no weight class, to make their dreams of playing in the NHL come true and protect their teammates.

That part has always been lost in the argument, is how selfless they were. And you want to talk about humility, I kind of compare it to what you and Eddie Bravo were talking about jujitsu, where it's like the douchebag eliminator, right? Like someone comes in, I'm the biggest, baddest, and you get like the 16-year-old to pretzel him three times. Well, with the enforcers, they've all been where they've been knocked out or they've lost a fight or something so they're humble as shit they don't know any given day their career can end they get sent to the minors they that does happen to those guys they get beat up real bad too and they're never the same never the same mentally

or they get knocked out and then they have can so the humility of them they're some of the greatest athletes i've met like getting to work with these guys. For example, we interviewed a guy that won a Stanley Cup with the Kings. He was a Princeton graduate, Kevin Westgarth, graduated with a degree in psychology. Super intellectual guy. And in college, they don't allow the fighting. They don't have fighting and they wear full cages instead of open visor or open mask. So he got drafted to the NHL to play for the Kings, and they wanted that physical presence that he brought.

And he got knocked out in a game against, it was like two years ago in Calgary, and we asked him, like, what was the first thing that went through your head, like when you woke up and realized, like, you're in front of 16,000 people, hundreds of thousands of people on Hockey Night in Canada have been watching, and this part almost brought us all to tears

when he was like, well, once I realized where i was and what happened i was like shit he got me he's like and then the next thing i realized is like wow i let my team down i was like so injury knocked out everything the first thing you're thinking about is that you let your team down he's like yeah he's like i really you know i'm supposed to be the guy there that they depend on that's the backbone to give them it you know, strength and everything else. And I'd let my team down. And several of these guys had said that, and that selflessness that they are willing to give to their team to help them win. That to me is so much more, you know, when you're going through the journey of a documentary, so much more compelling than just statistical arguments and stuff like that.

Yeah. I always wondered like when you see violence in NHL or football, I wonder how much longer that's going to be a part of society. It's interesting. It's very interesting how, like, but then UFC has never been more popular, right? There's arguments that it's oversaturated. I disagree. I think it's just, I think what there is is there's eb it's oversaturated. I disagree. I think it's just, I think what there is is there's ebbs and flows. Yeah.

And it's depending upon a bunch of factors. Dominant champions, champions get dethroned. There's new guys coming up, but they don't have the same, like Chris Weidman, although he beat Anderson Silva twice, better than Anderson Silva, arguably, especially today, still doesn't have the name that Anderson Silva had. George St. Pierre, sort of same thing. Robbie Lawler, who's currently the champ, doesn't have the name that George had. Although, you know, he'd probably be favored if George and Robbie fought today.

Robbie'd probably be favored. I think George is far more popular. Yeah. And that's just one of those things. Like Brock Lesnar. Yeah. Cain Velasquez does not have the popularity that Brock Lesnar had. Obviously, in a different reason, because, for a different reason, because he was the

WWE champ and big pro wrestling guy. But he was very loud and spoken, and, like, he was almost a perfect villain, right? Yeah. And you wanted to see him lose because of some of his antics and the way he acted. Like, I'm a ridiculous fan. I watch all the time. Yeah, me too. Yeah. I get what you're saying.

Like, GSP in Canada, I mean, you're talking about a god there, right? Yeah, but not even just in Canada. All throughout the world. I mean, he has so many characteristics, so many character traits. Just, he was an honorable martial artist who is a great fighter. Yeah. That's what he is. And a well-spoken guy.

And just, he's so classy. Like, everything about him. He's just, he's a brilliant person. Well, and that's what I think some of the other fighters may not have, is that, I mean, you had the full package with GSP, right? Like, physically, he looked astonishing, too, right? Like, if you were to look, you're like,

oh, wow, I can see how he's a champion. Like, he's ripped, he's this. Very polite, always, like, after a fight, I want to give my guy credit I know he'll be back stronger and more competitive next time like that's much more marketable other guys You know don't have like Cain Velasquez. I love and I think he's a destroyer But he's much more monotone like he doesn't have I think that would have been fine if he didn't get injured so much I think what's held Cain back is he's only fought a few times over the last four years.

He just keeps getting injured. Shoulder surgery, knee surgery. I mean, he's had one after the other. He's had several knee injuries, two separate shoulder operations on both shoulders. operations on both shoulders. I mean, his mental toughness and his drive and the training routine that those guys go through is just so un-fucking-believably brutal that his body just can't keep up with it.

That's what I was going to say, because he puts a pace for a heavyweight that you just can't, I mean, lightweights can't put the pace that he puts on. He really does out-condition. I get exhausted watching him. He out-conditions guys when they, like, guys who train at AKA. He'll talk about, he out-conditions Walter Weitz. And they can't believe it.

He out-conditions some of the 155-pounders. It's crazy. I mean, he's moving around 100 more pounds. And somehow or another, he can keep up with them and surpass them. He's a freak. But I think the injuries is what has held him back from being insanely popular. Because he's huge in the Mexican community. He's going to fight in Mexico.

They're fighting Fabricio Berdum. Lots of fights. Great fight in June. And I can't wait to see that fight. And that's going to be in Mexico City, which is going to be really crazy because they're fighting at, I think it's 7,000 feet above sea level. It's very high altitude. Mexico City is no joke when it comes to altitude. Like, you really feel it well i know even uh we go to park city my family has i was in park city and just in utah the

elevation up there my dad i thought my dad was having a heart attack the first time we went skiing he fell off the first run was panning he's like i'm like dad are you okay and he's like oh i think the elevate like i'm having troubles breathing yeah and then after a few runs we kind of got a little bit adjusted but it was interesting to see I was like wow I can't imagine in fighting like that's just going down skiing like yes It's physical, but not like not like competing in any kind of fight game. Did you ever see mark hunt versus Ben Rothwell? That was a fight that took place in Denver. Yes. Yes. I did yes Ridiculous these guys were so tired so tired. They were just like swinging from their shoulder joints by the end

were so tired. So tired. They were just like swinging from their shoulder joints by the end. I mean, it was all will and heart after a certain point in time. There's just no energy left.

And we've never had like a real long heavyweight fight at high altitude other than that fight. I think this last one between Fabricio Verdum and Mark Hunt ended in the second round.

Yeah. Fabricio caught him with a knee. But like, they get into like a Junior Dos Santos versus Cain Velasquez type fight, which those fights were fucking brutal. I don't think Junior's ever been the same since then. I don't think he has either. It seems to have affected.

Didn't he get really sick from overtraining in one of them? Yes. He fought in the second fight. He had what they call rhabdomyelosis, which is what those CrossFit people get. I think I'm saying it right. Yeah. Yeah. That, um, that comes from your, your body just over-trained fight. So I think it was that, and it was also the fact, the brutality of the fight itself, and then also perhaps overtraining to prepare for Kane's insane cardio. You know, because Kane just, he brings it on a level that, and a lot of it, according to the guys that train with him, is genetic. Like, he can just take three or four weeks off, like, get injured, something like that,

come back, outwork everybody. Well, you can, I compare, and in my very limited boxing career, but when you talk about, I hear you talking about, like, you can't train power, right? Like, that's something, like, there's genetic aspects

in the way your body is. You can't train a certain amount of power. Certain amount of power. Yeah, like George Foreman type power. You either have or you don't. When I boxed, that was one thing. I was very young. I was 15 at 135.

But I mean, at that weight, I hit really hard, right? Straight right hand was really by the end of my sparring partners. They'd only put me in with 25 year olds because they are worried that if I lost my temper, I might hurt the necks of 15 year olds, right? Like not trying to sound like a Hercule, but just that was my, you know, for me, that came instantly. The first time I started learning focus pads, for me that was there. You know what the problem with that is, with a lot of folks, is that they rely on that and they don't develop the skills like the guys, like a Wayne McCullough or like a guy who doesn't necessarily have brutal one-punch knockout power.

Even Julio Cesar Chavez, arguably one of the greatest of all time, didn't have that vicious one-punch power, but he just would go at you with accumulation of perfectly placed punches. I would bet on that any time that that better conditioning will, because it really, and we're going back to the mental thing, especially if a power puncher, if you fight that guy that just, he's not going down, and he's got that chin, and you hit, and like you said, then you're over, you're like, okay, okay wow this guy might have to actually like outlast him condition wise and start being like then all of a sudden you already start second guessing yourself and you're losing you're like oh shit like i i saw it in the um uh showtime pettis the last fight when he got caught

in the eye right and he took it for who's the the brazilian that he fought as a boss dos andros i thought i saw it then i was like wow he looks like he might be second-guessing himself right now He's like holy I can't get space from this guy I can't I can't impose my will and once that mind starts turning that you start second-guessing like is my I Had it in the ring my loss where it was like I I Got whooped because I was relying too much on my power, didn't train enough, and then got beat.

That's the same thing with jiu-jitsu as well. I always tell people, if you really want to learn jiu-jitsu right, learn it from a small guy, because small guys rely on perfect technique. If you look at the really big, physically strong guys that are good at jiu-jitsu, there's a totally different style that they have than, like, say, a Barrett Yoshida or a Hoyler Gracie or an Eddie Bravo or, you know, there's a bunch of those guys that are smaller guys that have a Leo Vieira perfect technique. And you need perfect technique when you're a physically smaller person because when you're in the gym if you go like you go to John

Jock Machado's Jiu Jitsu Academy or whatever you're you're gonna roll with a bunch of different people like somebody might roll with you You're probably like what 215 pounds or something like that to 10. I've come down a little You might roll with Jamie who's like 170, right? What's that? 175 Some of that what you've been i'm saying yeah like there's and you know if you're a small person like no one if i got if i weigh 150 pounds i'm not gonna out muscle you i have to figure out a way to work around you i have to figure out a way to get your back or have

to figure out a way to use technique only because i can't overpower you but you can overpower a lot of people yeah and big man jujitsu is kind of shitty jiu-jitsu. Because big men are just always trying to force their way into things. A lot of wrestlers have that as well. Because wrestlers are used to fighting guys in their weight class. They're used to, or wrestling rather, guys in their weight class. And they're used to just grinding and full power and speed and explosion. And be a harder worker and all that stuff.

Whereas with jiu-jitsu, it's about moving around it and it's all about- Or the chess game. Yeah, well, it's just about understanding technique and positioning. And if you learn from like a Guy Mendez or something like that, the Mendez brothers are famous for being small guys who just tap much larger guys on a regular basis. And it's just that pure technique, understanding the leverage, understanding the positions. And you only get that from being smaller. And I think if you look at a guy like Floyd Mayweather, Floyd Mayweather has a bunch of

knockouts in his career, but he just does not have the kind of one punch knockout power that a lot of other fighters do. Even combo knockout power, he doesn't have it. Also, he's so fucking smart when it comes to boxing. Yeah. Doesn't have it. Also, he's so fucking smart when it comes to boxing. He's so fucking smart that he realizes the most important thing is don't get hit.

That is the most important thing. Well, for your health and for scoring and for the whole work. For everything. I mean, what he does to people is shuts all their offense down. You just can't hit him. He's moving. He's popping you with a jab. He's popping you with the right hand.

He's clinching. He's getting the fuck out of the way. And he's not going to stand toe-to-toe and dig his heels in and try to swing with you like some fighters would do. Like some fighters who would make things exciting. Yeah. You know, like a Mickey Ward or an Arturo Gatti. Like those two guys would get together and fucking go to war. Well, like Ray Mancini. That was his style, right?

Is that he could out-condition you. Out-condition you. Out-will you. war well like ray mancini that was his style right is that he could out condition condition you will you ray actually was really disappointed that they took away the championship rounds like after his fight because boxing made a ruling to try to it wasn't just his fight it was a compound of a few other things but they no longer had fights past the 12 round right and ray he's like i guess like he's saying the science doesn't show that you take any more damage in those rounds and in the first rounds when a guy's strong and crisp right like he's saying, the science doesn't show that you take any more damage in those rounds. And in the first rounds, when a guy's strong and crisp, right, like you can still deliver the same amount.

And for Ray, he's like, those were my best rounds. Like when you would tire and you'd almost want to give up or your will would break a little bit, he's like 12, like 13, 14, 15. That's when I'm coming on strongest, right? Let's see if you really have what it takes to be a champion. Well, you see that with some guys, like Mighty Mouse, Demetrius Johnson. He's a perfect example of technique. Mighty Mouse is the 125 pound UFC champion and a guy, in my opinion, who's the best overall pound for pound fighter ever. That's why I believe he's the best. Why do you think that he's not like, I mean, I'm a fan, so I know who he is, but why do you think he's not as known? Because he weighs 125 pounds.

Just the size? Look, I'm 5'8", and when I interview him in the octagon, I look like a giant. He's a small guy. There's just no getting around that. There's a reality of physics. And people just want to see. Look, in his last fight, he finished the fight with one second to go in the fifth round of a fight he was totally dominating. He went for an armbar and got it with one second to go. Yeah.

Against Horiguchi, who's this badass motherfucker. Horiguchi's a maniac. You know, he fights, he's got this wild, aggressive style. Couldn't hit Demetrius. He's just so good. He's just so good. He's so slick and he's he epitomizes the technique the technique and knowledge and Strategy angle of fighting everything he does is technique knowledge and strategy He's not overpowering anybody or muscling or taking one to give one none of that nonsense

There's zero that nonsense going on so my opinion like when I look at like you know people say well John Jones is the best. Well, he's certainly one of the best. Like, look how tiny he is there. But that's him making weight, though. He'll gain a little bit of weight after that, too, before he gets into the octagon. He's very sucked in there, which is also an unfortunate aspect of fighting. And also an interesting aspect, like with Daku Kim, they started making weigh-ins the day before, which they didn't during that fight.

And another interesting thing is that almost all the deaths that have happened in boxing, a vast majority of the serious injuries, came from guys who cut a significant amount of weight. And when you cut that weight, you put your brain at risk, apparently, because you dehydrate everything. And it takes a long time to rehydrate your brain fluid and spinal fluid and all that stuff. When you're sucking yourself dry, you can't spit. People don't know what it's like. It's a horrible feeling. I did that for one of my – that was actually the fight I lost was when I really depleted myself and was spitting in a cup and putting a garbage bag over and skipping and running. Wrestlers constantly do that.

I mean, they brutalize their body doing that. And the difference between wrestling and fighting, though, of course, is that when you're wrestling dehydrated, you're not getting kicked in the head. Kicked in the head might actually, well, I don't think it's better, but at least it would be quick. You get kicked in the head. It's over, I don't think it's better, but at least it'd be quick. You know, you get kicked in the head. It's over quick instead of taking a barrage of punishment. Yeah. I mean, you see some fights where they go on for 10 rounds of just a beat down, dum-dum-dum-dum,

and then finally the guy will collapse in the 10th round. You're like, how much can the brain take? You know, how much, and especially a brain that has already been significantly weakened by dehydrating. I hate dehydration in fighting. I think it's the number one problem that the UFC has, other than some issues with different rules and knees on the ground. There's a few other issues. But I think the number one safety issue is dehydration. And I don't know how to stop it because people are always gonna try to get that competitive edge You would have to like get everyone together and say can we just make an agreement where we just fight at the weight that we?

Are you know you're gonna have one fucking guy fuck that up even if you did if I'm a jerk 90% of the fighters are on you're gonna have a few of those guys that No doubt no doubt. I mean What's interesting with the headshot cuz ray I talked like raising great shape. How's he doing now like mentally fine? He had a cat scan He's like he talks a little he talks a little but his dad did the same thing where they just talk with their Animated and their hands like his voice sounds a little it's a little slurry It times when he it's funny when you put him like because when we toured the film and you go to festivals and stuff and you

Get in front he speaks Immaculately, right? Gets excited. Yeah. But when you kind of just hanging out, sometimes it kind of stutters a little bit. Give him a couple of beers. He says that he's had a scan and he said he's like no bad scar tissue and stuff like that. That's incredible. But he was very good.

As soon as he ended his career, though, he didn't even spar. Like as I asked him, like, oh, do you still work out? And he's like, yeah, I still hit the bag and run. I'm like, do you spar? He's like, no, no, no. He he's like i put all my wars when i competed as soon as i stopped no more sparring i don't care if it's a friend that wants like done good for headshots were over right well sugar ray leonard is kind of the same way sugar ray leonard uh you know you could tell there's a little loss there yeah there's a little struggle when sugar

ray leonard has to talk about things you did pretty well there's a little there's a little struggle when sugar ray leonard has to talk about things you did pretty well there's a little there's a little hitch in his step as opposed to when he was younger but you know as far as the amount of fights that guy had championship fights against guys like tommy hearns marvin haggler i mean roberto duran he fought some of the best of the best to get through that and be a regularly functioning man in his 50s, then there's also depression. There's a bunch of things that go along with head trauma that we're starting to find out about that, man, if they could figure out a way to mitigate that or fix it once it's become an issue. Because it's one of the few things that once the function is compromised, there's really not much they can do about it. They can repair your shoulder, you know Well, isn't it because you talk about alpha brain a lot and wasn't the original guy that started looking into new tropics like a football

Player that had a whole bunch of no, he's definitely not the original guy Bill Romanowski But that's how I found out about it. He has a great product that you could buy right now It's called neuro one. Yeah and neuro one, I found out, there used to be this show in San Francisco called Sarah No Name on Alice. There was a radio station called Alice.

And I'd do the radio station all the time. And No Name was one of the DJs. Yeah. He was friends with Romanowski and Romanowski would train him and take him to work out

with him and stuff. And Romanowski gave him this tub of this stuff that he had called Neuro One. He gave him some sample packs to give away. And I took it, and I was like, whoa, this stuff has got something in it, man. And he was like, it's for brain function. I was like, well, what does it do?

And he goes, and then he explained it to me. And then I, there was, I don't even think there was Google at the time. So I had. That's like ancient. We're talking about the olden days. Oh, yeah. Well, this is when I was doing morning radio. I haven't done morning radio in a long, I occasionally do it, but I used to do it for

every gig I did. I'd have to do morning radio to promote the gig. So I, um, I go and start looking up, uh, various things in nootropics and I found out about paracetam and all these, that was how we eventually got into developing alpha brain. That was how we eventually got into developing AlphaBrain. But NeuroOne, Romanowski developed because he was having issues with his cognitive function after a series of concussions. I mean, playing in the NFL, who knows how many times that guy got concussed. I mean, it's just up in the air.

So he took a proactive approach to dealing with it and built up this line of products and what does it like it like an alpha brain in that one are there any benefits kind of like a like just a vitamin if you take it on a regular basis for people that have had head trauma can make things like I know it's not a miracle pill that's gonna correct it but I wouldn't even want to speculate quite honestly I mean I take it all the time but I take it from memory I take it for brett brett like raves about it when he was writing the culture high like that was part of that he's like adam you need to get me alpha brain when i'm writing like he for him that's his thing he's like

when i'm writing and being creative he wants alpha brain it's not going to turn us a dummy into a smart person no but what it what it will do is it, you know, the human neurotransmitters, and this is obviously coming from an untrained, uneducated monkey when you hear me talk. But human neurotransmitters, essentially everything that your body has, right? Your body is developed based on the building blocks that you put into it, nutritional building blocks. I mean, that's the only thing your body takes in. Other than that, you literally can't replicate all the cells in your body without food and nutrition. I mean, that's literally what it's there for. And the more healthy precursors for neurotransmitters, the more healthy foods,

the more healthy nutrients you take into your body, the better your body functions, period. And they've isolated a bunch of different nutrients that can help your brain function better. And there's not just this stuff that's an alpha brain. If you just Google nootropics, you know, and I try to be as even about this as possible because even though I'm a part of on it and I sell it, I want, I want everybody to understand like this isn't voodoo it's not snake oil it's not the the Boston Center for memory that did the tests on alpha brain is a very well respected institution we brought them to separate double-blind placebo controlled studies the one was a pilot study that was 20 people the other one was 63 people and both of them showed

improvements in memory improvements in memory, improvements in executive function, improvements in reaction time. And it's not mumbo jumbo. It's all based on what does your body need to produce human neurotransmitters. There's certain nutrients. Take those nutrients. Your body will produce human neurotransmitters more effective. What is the benefit?

The benefit is you don't have to search for words as much. You'll have better cognitive function, and you react to things quicker. You'll have better reaction time. I mean, it makes perfect sense. I know just basically when we go on road trips and we're shooting and we're working long hours and you're trying to get to interviews because when you're doing interviews for docs, they're free interviews. So it's on those person's time we set up, and then we're trying to make theatricals.

You've got to set up the light. They're long days. And we go eat like shit, and I'm crushing energy drinks. I feel it at the end of the week. My body's like, what are you doing to yourself, right? Then when I get back and I start eating good fishes and vegetables and protein, then I'm like, oh, now I feel better. And sleep.

There's very few things as important as sleep. I mean, you need all those nutrients, but if you take all those nutrients and you're not giving your body a chance to utilize them and recover and rest, you're not going to have the benefits. There's a guy we had on Dr. Andrew Hill who has a product that I really like too called True Brain. And he gave us some at the studio. I like that as well. It's a different formula than Alpha Brain. But there's a bunch of these different formulas. You can find a bunch of them online, experiment, try it out. What we try to do with AlphaBrain is make it as ethical as possible.

So, like, if you take, this is a 30 pill count. If you take this, you got 90 days. If at 90 days you say this stuff is bullshit, it's not doing anything, you get 100% of your money back. You don't even have to return the package. And the only reason why we did that is because, like, what's the best way

to ensure that no one is gonna complain about being? Ripped off, but still people I was gonna say people probably still found a way Oh, yeah, man people people get angry, but they're always gonna be angry at everything you use if you don't believe in nootropics Don't buy them that's fine But if you Google it or if you just go to the on it website and breed all the research on alpha brain Read all the references if you don't think that there's something in all that then just walk away from it just just but if you if you're interested like you know and people say it's not worth it what it to me

cognitive function is one of the most important things to me the way the quality of my thinking the way my brain works. I've experienced dull thinking. I've been disappointed in my thinking. I've been disappointed in my process. And I've also been like, Ooh, I'm on right now. This is great. I'm getting things done. And I try to steer towards anything that gets me to the I'm on. And the nutrition is the biggest one for me, without a doubt, the biggest factor in how my brain functions is eating a lot of vegetables and eating healthy foods and keeping away from shitty foods, keeping away from sugar. If I do all that, I guarantee I feel, I know I feel a difference. I feel a difference in the way my brain functions.

I'm the same way. But when we travel, sometimes it gets tough. It's the most hard. I need to start getting some of your nature box snacks. That's what I need to start hooking up. Those are pretty good. Yeah. Well, just eat fruit too.

You know, when you're on the road, go to a supermarket. You know, if you're on the road supermarket, you can go, go to the fruit aisle, get some apples, get some oranges, get some bananas and leave them in your hotel room. You know that you're going to ensure that you're going to be taking in fresh nutrients. Yeah. It's just a little trip to the supermarket. It's not that hard. A lot of times hotels-

You need to start putting that into the line items of things to get done. You know what I get too, man? When I go to, I get kombucha. I don't have one right here. Oh, I know kombucha. Oh, dude, that's big. For probiotics, as far as like your immune system health, it is like one of the best things i i love it it makes a huge impact i very very very rarely get sick and i travel a lot i don't get sick lots i'm

fortunate there knock on wood i'm good with that but i just feel i i get run down i put on weight and then i get it in my face right away i'll see pictures when we're on the road i'm like fuck i was eating bad and like my face gets pudgy. I see it right away. That's inflammation too. Like sugar. Yeah. Well, that's what you're crushing energy drinks and all that crap. Those are acid in a can. Like you can feel like when you burp them up and stuff, you're like,

that is acid. I'm surprised it doesn't just eat through my stomach and leak out of my belly button. I'll tell you what though. Red bull is fucking delicious. It is delicious. I drink assholes put in red bull to make it so yummy. I like the taste. I like the taste too make it so yummy. I'm with you.

I like the taste. I like the taste, too. It's good. I crush those. When we go on the road, we actually had a joke. We had our sound guy when we were filming The Culture. He came in our van, and he's like, why does your van smell like Red Bull? We're like, look at all the cans in the back.

We were crushing Red Bull, and we're like, that's why it smells like Red Bull. That stuff is super bad for you, though. So bad. Especially when you drink those big ones, like a gas station. I don't want to ever go. I've really been good at that, that I don't ever drink more than two of the small sugar-free. That's the most I drink. Back when we were working in the cult, there was days I drank like four or five, giving myself.

That's really scary. Yeah. Well, there's a gas station that I go to that sells them, and they have the normal-sized ones, but then they have these giant Yeah, I like what the fuck those look like a heart attack in a can to me I'm scared do they say more than one portion on it when you read the giant ones does it say like three? Servings or something sneaky I thought it said that on the small ones I do not drink more than one can per day

And then now you have those giant bullets when i'm like they just get if they give it to you and just write somewhere in the fine print there's four servings per can you know like they're good yeah they're good yeah because they'll say like one serving is 200 milligrams of caffeine four servings per can wait a minute how oh hold on how much can you drink before your dick explodes how much do you drink before your fucking head oozes out of your ears well i always wonder when i see someone that's really overweight and they're crushing one of those giant, I'm like, man, you're, you're putting your heart at risk. I'd have to think like that. Yeah. I had a friend who used to carry one of those monster energy drinks with him. You literally

never saw him without one of those things. He was completely addicted to them. He was drinking them all day long. And, uh, he went, he went to a spin class and he went to a spin class with my friend and he was fucking dying in the spin like he literally had to get off the bike like his heart was pounding i'm like dude you're on speed yeah you're on speed you've probably taken a thousand milligrams of caffeine the last few hours well since there's been no regulate or there's some regular but you've been hearing about uh young kids and stuff on sports teams having big problems right or the five-hour energies and stuff, right? Killing people.

Five-hour energies kill people? Well, not just one. I thought that was like a low caffeine. But some people, when they're studying or something like that, they crush four or five, right? Yeah, but I'm pretty sure five-hour energy drink is low caffeine, and it's like vitamin B12 and a bunch of other shit. Double-check that, Jamie. Google and see if there's, to make I'm not yeah speaking out of my ass But I thought I'd read some articles on that of people that you know, they were looking at the cause of death

And it was like really high Caffeine levels or or what's the like grana seed or mao hung that's in a lot of those things Yeah, we're on a go on a seed so yeah, that's a natural form of caffeine right isn't it? I think it's similar That's a natural form of caffeine, right? Isn't it? Or some sort of similar stimulant? There's like a mixture of them that they would put in because when ephedrine was taken out of a lot of them, then they put those in. Ephedra. Did you ever have rip fuel? You ever try that stuff?

A good buddy of mine who's a big fan, he'd love a show. My buddy Jared was addicted to, we joke about it, like in the morning I'd hear him because we roomed in New York and I'd hear the ch-ch-ch-ch of his bottle, and he would take the ephedra like a daily routine. Okay, so look at this. The Extra has 230 milligrams of caffeine. The regular one has 200 and decaf. What is decaf?

The 5-hour energy decaf. Get out of here. So how much is that compared to a cup of coffee? I think 200 milligrams is a Starbucks large, like a venti Starbucks, I think, right? Google that. Find that out. But then what's the other stuff in it too, right? Is there a mixture, if you do a lot, of the caffeine and the...

Sodium, vitamin B12, large B12. Wow, look at that. 8,333% of the daily value. Yeah. So 500 MCGs of B12 folic acid. What'd you do? Oh, that kind of shows the comparison there to Red Bulls and stuff like that. Niacin, which is healthy for you.

Energy blend. Look at this, though. What is that? Energy blend. Where do you see that? Right there at the bottom. Taurine, which is funky. Yeah. How do you say that right there at the bottom taurine which is funky yeah what how do you say that glue called glucuronic acid uh malic acid a couple different um amino

acids caffeine so there's more caffeine on top of it and the energy blend right or is that blend where the caffeine comes from i guess the caffeine comes from that blend yeah so what is um what is um in a car one is like oh two and a half cup notice how they have dunkin donuts coffee not tim horton's because so one of those is two and a half cans of fucking red bull yeah see so that's what i think the articles i saw whoa i'm totally wrong on this because the commercials would say that it's the same as a cup of coffee. Whoa. That's weird. Yeah, I thought they were saying that, you know, and again, it goes to that abuse thing.

Just some people are overloading when they're doing schooling. They're crushing like five. Well, they're that big. Yeah. It's a shot. I mean, it's like it's easy to do two or three of those. If you do four or five in a row, yeah, you're taking in 1,000 milligrams of caffeine. I had no idea.

For some reason, I thought it was like 65 milligrams. Okay, Red Bull, Rockstar. Where's the coffee? It doesn't have coffee on this one. Well, just find out what a Starbucks is. Find out what Starbucks coffee is. I think that Red Line was like a really scary one. Did you ever have one of those?

No. I don't even know if those are around anymore. I drank a half of one of those once, and I read, and it was one of those several servings per can. It was not a big can either, but it was like, whoa! I actually had a day in one of our shoots where I had too much energy drinks, and the next day I actually felt like I was really hungover. 16 ounces, 330 milligrams?

Holy. What? Hmm. Find out if that's universally true, because I've seen it at different numbers. What's that? Yeah, I don't know if that's... 330, 415 for the Venti. Oh my goodness.

260 for a tall? That's incredible. Wow. That is crazy. A tall has 260 milligrams. But you know, here's the other thing. If you get a coffee from a diner, like a regular cup of coffee, it's way less than that. Yeah.

55. Yeah. Yeah. Eight ounce. Yeah. What is it? Five. That's decaf it that's decaf the 55 123 eight ounce yeah okay eight ounce brewed cup of coffee from a regular you know place is somewhere in the neighborhood of 133 if it's instant coffee it's 93 that's a big difference yeah 133. If it's instant coffee, it's 93. That's a big difference. 133 and 260.

Fucking A, man. And 330 for a venti? That's insane. That's a lot of goddamn caffeine. Daily limit. So, yeah. So, if you had, you know, 400 is supposed to be the daily limit. And if you have students doing four or five of those five-hour energies, right, you're going up to 1,000. You're putting yourself at risky levels.

And it's so easy to do. It's shot. Done. our energies right you're going up to a thousand you're putting yourself at risky levels and it's so easy to do it's so easy just done it's energy things are weird man because they're so prevalent we're always looking for that boost that little pick me up but we don't want to take pills yeah pills are bad drink but like you said i'm like if i give myself a treat now because i try not to have energy drinks on the weekend i'll be like i'll have a sugar-free red bull and a snickers right like i'll go get you. Yeah, yeah. Get a little crazy.

Get crazy. Because, well, the kids are eating sugar all fucking day long, so I get jealous because I... Do you let your kids eat sugar all the time like that? Not all the time, but they're so bad. You just said you did. No, well, they get into it. My boy is such a little ninja. We put all the candy, like, way high to where I have to reach up.

And he pushes the goddamn stools. It's in a pantry, opens the door, pushes it up and he'll get up there and reach up the licorice. And then we come down, we're like, Hey, where'd you get that? And he's like, from the pantry. How old is he? Three. How about you keep an eye on your three-year-old, you fuck? Jesus Christ.

Just letting him wander around. What about the knives? Let him pick up the, where'd you get the gun, son? What? Uh, found it. We just let him play with the butcher's knives not the other ones Yeah, it's the sugar thing is a big draw for kids man It's crazy when you see you like my daughter had a party recently

Yeah, and when it came time to cut the cake those little motherfuckers come over with a glaze Cake they were asking me. I have a big piece. Yeah, I have a bit of whipped cream all the whipped cream Yeah, the little crazy little eyes. Little crazy sugar eyes. It's just weird. Like you're giving them a drug, you know? Yeah. Delicious drug.

Fucking cake's awesome. I'm not anti-cake. Yeah. But I'm just saying there's something weird about seeing like little five-year-olds just all glassy-eyed lining up to get cake. And it's all they, like, I mean, we're really big on like, you know, and our kids are pretty good. Like they eat fish and they eat vegetables, but they they, like, I mean, we're really big on, like, you know, and our kids are pretty good, like, they eat fish and they eat vegetables,

but they always want, like, I mean, when it's time for candy, that sweets is what they're pushing for all the time. It's really unnatural. The concentration of processed sugar in our foods is so unnatural, and the body's just not designed for it, and the rush that it gets for it, you know, for that, it's like, your body wants to

recreate that rush. Like, kids fucking love it. Like, find me a kid that doesn't love candy. You know, they all love it. Just, it's gross. And there's probably a documentary in that. There, I, it's an interesting one, because a lot of times when people will, there's not too many that come and try to, like,

debate me on Twitter and stuff. They don't last very long if they do, and they try to bring up wicked, stupid arguments. Like, well, you can abuse marijuana. And I was like, yeah, you can. Shut up. You can abuse just about anything. That's a silly argument It's so stupid those arguments are so they're mind-numbing to me. Yeah, like the Nancy Grace one I mean, there's a there's a picture of me and Nancy Grace side-by-side where Nancy Grace is talking about yeah

Yeah, no, I don't wanna makes you fat We posted that and it got like some of the more like 14,000 likes or something like that It's the whole thing silly if you're a lazy person you're going to be a lazy person It's that simple and even a person who's like really fit and healthy might occasionally like tying one on with their friends It's fun. Sometimes it's just Moderation, you know, there's there's plenty of things that you can do that aren't necessarily healthy if you do them all the time But there you're not to really pay the price. Yeah, this is a – I've been treated –

But this was the thing that came up with the law enforcement we interviewed. If the whole idea when you hear the other side is to reduce harm, right, if that's what they're selling you on, like, look, we can't allow marijuana because we're going to reduce harm. because we're going to reduce harm. Harming somebody further with a criminal record, taking away their right to education, preventing them from job opportunities, and preventing them from traveling is far more harmful than not only just marijuana, but a lot of other illegal drugs too.

Because statistics show even the most addictive drugs, I think even heroin, the highest is like 30%. A lot of people have used drugs and then don't continue to abuse them. Well, that's kind of a false narrative though, because it's that no one is really trying to protect anyone They're just trying to utilize the claws and the law that allows them to imprison you. Yeah, that's really what it is And they they get People to fill their prison they get people to go through their legal system. So they validate the legal system. They validate the amount of police officers that they need. They validate the

amount of prison space they need. And it all feeds into this business, which also you guys talked about in the culture high. Oh, big on the law enforcement part is a lot of people's favorites, right? Well, because it's terrifying when you realize that there's so much momentum behind that. And there's so much, they have so much motivation to keep those laws in place so they can continue arresting people because if they don't that industry implodes 50% of the law enforcement and the arrests in this country have to do with nonviolent crimes that involve drugs it's a scale at burns who closes the film right that was a co-creator of HBO's The Wire he's the cop that you see throughout the film that's like he's scary when you sit down with him and he breaks it down how it is right and when you think about

Seizures of assets and stuff like you don't get to do that for murderers and rapists although you should So they're incentivized like murderers and rapists fall below as far as profit incentive for Precincts because they don't get to take their money. They don't get asset forfeit drugs. They do. Isn't that crazy? Crazy. Like if you're a murderer or a rapist, they can't take your TV. Yeah. But if you got to like a roll of joints in a plastic bag, boom, they just come in and start taking your shit and sell it. laws that are in place it's almost overwhelming and I think for a lot of people we get really frustrated because it seems like there's you can't fix it all like I'm 47 I'll be 48 in August which means I'm almost 50 um you know I'm a fucking middle-aged man and if I'm lucky I'm a middle-aged man I'm a grown-up 100% grown-up right this is as grown up as you get. And yet I'm still immersed in this system that has been in this position or in a similar position since I was a child. Yeah.

Very little has changed, you know, so there's been some movement towards sanity and clarity and legalization and freedom. But there's still this asset forfeiture thing, that guy with the convenience store, they're stealing his money. And, you know, the numbers that they've posted of asset forfeiture take that guy with the convenience store they're stealing his money and you know the numbers that they've posted of uh asset forfeiture takeovers over the last year or two it's staggering and it's un-fucking-believable how much money it is well and the murder conviction rate that we brought up in the film how it's actually higher earlier because the cops say one of the biggest things is that resources we no longer have communication with the community so we

can no longer prevent the crimes. Even with all our technology, forensics, DNA, everything else, murder conviction rates have gone drastically down. Yeah, they've turned cops essentially into glorified revenue collectors. That's what they've done. I mean, could you imagine, we were talking about this once, could you imagine if they made soldiers write tickets in Afghanistan? You know? You imagine if soldiers had a quota quota and they had to get money from the Taliban.

Hey, you fucks, I saw you making an IED. You're doing court on Tuesday and here's your piece of paper. Like, no, what? No, soldiers are over there doing soldier type shit. Well, cops should be doing cop type shit. They should be arresting people for committing dangerous crimes that, that put us all in, in, in harm's way. Well, even Sean Dunnigan, who's the former DEA analyst that we interviewed with him, he talked about his dad. It was a B cop in New York. And

he said, when his dad went to work, it was like a sports coat, his shirt, his badge, his gun. He's like, and that's how we work the beat. He's like, now it's military boots and these things. He's like, how do you, how does the community feel like you're part of the community when you're dressed like a soldier? Like right away, you know, impressions and stuff, that all matters, right? Like you don't feel, communities don't feel welcome when that comes in. It feels like there's a major problem. But if a beat cop's got a sports coat and his bulletproof vest underneath his dress shirt and he's working to be like, Hey, like, look, there's a missing girl. Is there been anything suspicious?

Well, there's a house on the end of the street, but when military soldiers come up, you're like, kind of like, whoa, are you going to come raid my house? Are you going to come beat us up?

Right? Like it's not where a community wants to welcome them and considers them part of the community. I think it also does something for the mentality of the people that are wearing the military garb too. Absolutely. You pull up in a tank, you're going to have a totally different attitude than you step out of a

fucking crown Victoria. Exactly. That was those things called those police cars. Yeah. LTD crown Victoria. Is that what those things are? Yeah. You know what I mean?

It's like you police officers should be respected and appreciated members of the community that you call upon when the shit hits the fan. And when you put them in a position where they're arresting people for pot or you put them in a position where they're being forced in these asset forfeiture situations, even giving them the license to do that becomes problematic because when you tell someone it's okay for them to do it, then they don't even have the opportunity to go, well, hey, morally, is this right? Well, it doesn't matter if it's right. That's the job.

The job is take the money, arrest the guy. That's the job. And then you become used to that job, and it becomes fuck them, and then it becomes us versus them. And that attitude is the worst aspect of the relationship between law enforcement and civilians. We need law enforcement. We've talked about this situation that happened in Baltimore where an RT reporter was filming these young kids that were jumping around and saying a bunch of shit. And then one of the kids takes her fucking purse and runs.

And she's chasing after him. Give me my purse back. Give me my bag back. And as she's chasing this kid, a cop grabs the guy. The cops grab the guy and get her purse back. Give me my bag back. And as she's chasing this kid, a cop grabs the guy. The cops grab the guy and get her purse back. Like, you see, like, everyone's so down on the cops. Everyone's so anti-law enforcement. Well, here is a situation where law enforcement actually did its duty.

And it happened in the midst of chaos where law enforcement has failed. You know, chaos. Law enforcement killed somebody. There's these huge riots that have come up because of that. This huge separation between the community and the people that are supposedly protecting that community. And this huge rift. But then you see, like, oh, okay. Like, there is a time where law enforcement is not just beneficial, but necessary.

I mean, there's no question you need law enforcement. I mean, there's no question you need law enforcement. It's just interesting interviewing a lot of these very respected police officers and how they really talk about how it was the fundamental breakdown of dividing them, making them the enemy, like the drug war. To them, they just said, look, I saw it. It separated communities. It made us look as the other. Because look, Joe, we both have children.

If something happened to them, you want justice to be done. And then if Cops are coming like what happened did someone go missing did someone hurt them you want that there? But if that communications broken and it feels more like now I'm getting interrogated well What did you do and they come bullying you and we found drugs? Maybe it's your fault that this happened It's like no someone hurt my kids like just focus on them There's also that's also just dummies that are cops. The problem is there's not a lot of, like in Los Angeles, they have these fucking billboards trying to get people to become cops. Because nobody wants to be a cop.

It's an incredibly tough job. It's fucking super dangerous, massively stressful. The PTSD these guys get, nobody brings up. Everybody talks about soldier PTSD. Very few people respect the PTSD that cops have because they fucking have it, man. You know, a friend of mine was telling me about this guy who jumped off of a building and all these cops were around and they were taking care of the situation. Then they, uh, one cop showed up with donuts and they started handing donuts out and these guys are eating donuts while they're,

you know, taking witness accounts and dealing with this. They're just so over it. They're just so over it. Like they watch this guy splatter and become asphalt pizza, you know, jumped off of a building, and they're like, all right, another day in the job. Like, ultimately, that has got to fuck with your head. Oh, one of my good buddies from high school has become a cop in Canada, and he was talking about some of the first, like, first dead bodies I saw was someone that blew their head off with a shotgun. They had used, because you have to use, like, a stick in order to reach it or something and then their whole face had caved

in and they were the first ones on scene and the smell and i was like dude i like how do you even react that he's like i just pretend it's it's like a video game right like i just i have to kind of zone out and wait for the cleanup crew and i couldn't imagine seeing that even once a year if you had to come up on that kind of stuff like right and they're seeing it all the time and everybody they run into on a daily basis is either lying to them or nervous about meeting them or is hiding something or you know it's just fuck man i mean it's a terrible job it's it's really hard to do and made way worse by the drug war way worse way way way worse that that fucking scenario where those guys and when it starts out your film, where those guys shoot that dog, that just should show you right away, we're talking about pot.

Yeah. We're not talking about anything that's going to hurt anybody. We're talking about pot. And because of that, these guys felt like they had the writing on the paper that allowed them to go in there and shoot a dog and scare the fuck out of everybody. To break into your house at three in the morning with your kids in the house and shoot your fucking dog. Meanwhile, if that was handled better, I mean, it would be a complete, like, what do you got in there? Well, it was a pipe. Okay. Well, I guess we'll give you a citation.

I mean, do they even give you a citation when you have a pipe? I mean, what are they going to do? You're going to write him up, make him go to court or something? Okay. Just don't shoot his fucking dog. Like, the whole thing is just, it's insanity. And it's insanity on almost like a fictional level. Like, it seems like it's fiction. Like, it's a work of, like, it's some crazy George Orwell book from, you know, the olden days before we figured out how to live life. But we haven't figured out how to live life. We haven't figured out.

If there's anything I've learned, we haven't figured out shit. But don't you think that because of these kind of conversations and because of the Internet and the backlash that all these archaic drug laws and drug policies have had, the backlash has been unprecedented. The amount of people that react to it today as opposed to the way they treated it in the 80s during the Reagan administration, it's very, very different. It is changing.

I mean, it's changing all over. I mean, the UK is challenging right now. Portugal decriminalized all drugs 10 years ago and had great success. In fact, we interviewed one of the scientists that went and researched that for a little bit, Dr. Julian Hoopert in the UK. And he said everyone that was against them originally bringing in that bill is now can't believe that they were fighting against it.

Like violent crime has gone down. They said now we can focus on the hardened criminals and the big traffickers and less time. And the people that have substance abuse, they've seen teenage youth down, all these things down, like all the horror stories you're hearing. And then Uruguay and Canada's changing policies and US, every other state seems to be challenging seen teenage use down all these things down like all the horror stories you're hearing and then

uruguay and canada's changing policies and u.s every other state seems to be challenging looking for medical legalization or then full legalization like as the end of the film kind of says like the house of cards is collapsing fast and things like these podcasts and access to information and getting the even the way we release the film where we put it on Vimeo right away, where everyone in the world could get it. And then now it's on Netflix in, I think it's 70 different countries and 14 different languages. Like you didn't have that years ago, right? Like now it's Portuguese, Dutch. I see, it feels great when you work so hard on something, then you can search, you know, on Twitter and we go on there and we'll search the culture high and you'll see in Dutch and Spanish and Portuguese people saying, wow, this changed my mind. It's amazing. Like you

didn't have, you weren't able to reach out like that before, right? There's a time and connectivity with podcasts and internet. We talk about this in the film. You kind of go over it actually, like it's changing so quick and you can't bullshit people the way you used to. Yeah. And it's, it's only getting getting more and more involved in people's lives. It's only getting more and more invasive. The word invasive sounds negative, but technology has allowed information to get to you so quickly. It's virtually impossible to lie about facts now.

It's just too hard. It's just too hard. I mean we're gonna come there's gonna come a point in time sometime in our lives where all this stuff has reached some sort of a boiling point and that boiling point is it's gonna make us look like fools for going through our lives the way we did like in the 80s in the 90s it's gonna really make society look like a bunch of monkeys with guns and badges and Pieces of paper with things written on it and and then we acted on those like we're gonna look just as

Ridiculous as the people that were involved the Inquisition or the people that were burning witches in Salem all that's actually I don't think they really Burned witches do you know that that's kind of made in a drown them Yeah, they drowned them like which it was a lose-lose where it was like if you don't drown your witch Yeah, and if you do drown, sorry, we fucked up. Do you know what they think was the cause of all that? Do you ever read into that? They think it was ergot poisoning ergot is a type of fungus that exists in wheat that has a similar effect to LSD and They believe that it was because of a late frost and that a lot of the wheat got damaged And it causes this fungus to grow in the wheat like they did some samples

core samples of the dirt and they found like some certain climatological clues that lead them to Some certain climatological clues that lead them to believe that that could have very possibly happened That er got poisoning in the week caused people to have these crazy acid like effects, and they thought they were bewitched That makes perfect sense. I'd read some of the stuff to where it was some people were having Mistresses and stuff like that and it was a way to shut up the lower people like the common Yeah, just be like you you're a witch, right? Honey, she bewitched me. I didn't look deep into that, so.

Maybe. Well, I'm sure people have done horrible things in the past, and they will continue to do so until we can read minds. I think that's going to be the big one, man. Once we have some sort of a way to read each other's own mental database. Well, I've heard you talk about that

in the podcast. And I agreed so much where it's just like if you took lying off the table instantly, it was like you were tapped in. And it was like as soon as somebody said something, it was like we were all tapped into Google. Like essentially it was built in. It's like, oh, he's lying. Like I've got the information. That's bullshit. Right?

Like not only that, forget about even information. How about your own thoughts and feelings? Like don't be a bull. Like if you're not a politician or a bullshit artist like if i could see if i could look at you and i see green which means everything's groovy yeah and then as soon as it turns yellow like oh adam might be bullshitting yeah that'd be good we went red yeah i mean that's not outside of the realm of possibility they've already shown that they can tell there's certain things that they could read in a person's brain if they're being deceptive. And they've even used fMRI in a case in India to convict a woman of a crime because she had what they call functional

knowledge of the crime scene. And it's very controversial. And neuroscientists- FRI, what's that? F-M-R-I, which is functional MRI, magnetic resonance imagery. And, you know, MRI they have if you have an injury. Yeah, yeah. Look at the tissue. Functional MRI is a type of MRI they use to scan brain activity. And they believe that this is like the baby steps to being able to actually read the mind definitively.

Like right now they're getting these signals. The signals are very controversial because some people say, well, having a functional knowledge of the crime scene could have been imparted on her by the case, by the evidence, by reviewing the evidence with the lawyers. Like somehow or another they could have imparted this somehow in her mind or you know being interrogated or investigated about it um but the point being that they're starting to hone in on various aspects of the brain and various like whether or not you're deceptive or nervous or whether or not like and who knows like right now this is like the this is the morse code of my Suppose to high-speed video on Vimeo. Yeah, what we got now Yeah, you know I mean think about the difference between just a couple hundred years ago if you were on the other side of the World they were to send a series of fucking BBB BBB and technology is accelerating at a pace that we've never seen

Things are coming out every day, and I can't even believe in like like 3d printing blows my mind i don't know how they're like printing ears and like organs like what are they using as material i don't understand that i don't i don't get how that works it's well the organ thing is not 3d printing what the organ thing is they're taking tissue samples and stem cells and they're they're using skin cells to create new bladders for people they they built this woman an esophagus. She had esophageal cancer, and they used a 3D printer to make the scaffolding for the cells, and the cells grew,

and then they replaced her esophagus. Fucking bananas. But I think the exponential growth of this sort of technology, if you apply it, look at communication, you apply it to Morse code, to high-speed video that's available streaming on your phone. Yeah.

It's an amazing leap. I think that same thing applied to the mind and to understanding the signals of the mind is going to almost leave us in a position where we have no choice but to be honest. And when we have no choice but to be honest, we're going to live in a different world. There's going to be no more cults. The whole Scientology thing is going to go out the window. The Vatican collapse. All that shit's going down. And it's going to go down just based on information

and truth. The ability to recognize that someone, and it's still, opinions are still going to exist. There's still going to be debate. You know, you could believe what you're saying and be truthful in your opinions. Then it'll come a matter of the distribution of information, disproving you and getting into you and then finding out, oh,

well it's purple. He's self deceptive. Like this is what's going on. This guy's got a blockage in. Yeah. Cause I mean, if that's something that really fast me and going clear is just like how this guy that seemed to have some kind of mental illness he was trying to diagnose himself, like constantly putting him, how he was able to convince people so emphatically to like follow him, like where he had them out on a ship and he was hiding in country.

Look at your shirt. Yeah. Look at your shirt. You see that shirt? Yeah. That's a chimp. Yeah. Yeah.

That's the problem. We have chimp DNA still in our system. And that on it chimp that you're wearing on your T-shirt chimps. That's a big part of our fucking ancestry. The following alpha male behavior. And, you know, ultimately that's archaic. And ultimately this this need to find someone that it used to be the tribal leader, the old gray man with the scars that learned from all of his mistakes and could impart his wisdom on you and make your life a little bit easier because this guy's already learned these

things and he can yeah he teach me I mean we all know that we all had mentor figures when we were growing up a person was older than us that perhaps had more wisdom or life experience and could cut a lot of the learning Stages out cut a lot of the the pitfalls that you might Experience the trial and error and I think that you know That's that's a big part of what's wrong with people as we we get scared when we don't have answers What about the part that was interesting to me? That was like how you even had people like like Paul Haggis and stuff like got caught up in that where he was really young though yeah

you know when you're really young you really impressionable and I could have got sucked into Dianetics when I was younger I know I could have the beginning parts of it are pretty can like you said the science like making well like I was like I could see how I I think I got tested like several years ago they going here like what are you thinking about right there and it was like like they were trying to hand out pamphlets actually right by the, where the hotel where we're staying. They're like here.

I was just telling my, my buddy that came with me, Trent. I was like, that's it. That's signed. They say like, do you want to do a personality test? Right. Like that's how it starts. Right. Come on the little.

I did one in 2008, 2007, 2008. And, uh, yeah, I held onto the cans, like the whole thing and the the the meter but the guy who was doing it with me was like kind of depressed he was very like low enthusiasm it wasn't pitching it very well at all he's just a bummed out dude and you could tell like he just really wasn't into it give a shit it was weird he's just he kind of had to do he was only gonna pay 25 cents or whatever like the slave yeah the c- right that they get yeah the sea or insanely low you know i went on uh like a youtube watching binge after i watched that documentary and that david miscavige whatever the guy's name is his his own niece wrote a book about him and you know she

was one of the people that was in the sea org and like there was this yeah she got interviewed by what's that fuckhead's name from england took over for Larry King for a while before they ousted him? Piers Morgan. Oh, Piers Morgan. She was on his show and just talking about the ridiculous existence that they lived, you know, maintaining all these different properties and all these different things, essentially through slave labor by all their employees and how they discouraged them from having children and they would try to get them to have abortions

and just like, oh, it's awful. It was the thing that scared me the most about it too is that I could really see a lot of similarities to other ideologies and the way that it managed its way. Like it almost like- It's a virus. When you learn requirement-based selling, right? I used to come from a sales background. There's the way that it managed its way. Like it almost like it's a virus when you learn requirement based selling, right?

I used to come from a sales background. There's a way that humans can, you find their business motives and buying objectives and you can kind of circle around and get them emotional buys. There's ways that just humans kind of react, right? You get them excited. Well,

does this bug you about your business or when you like a solution to that? Yes, I would like a solution to that. Right. And then you can, and that you'd see the similarities when I was watching that, like, yes, Scientology and that movie freaked me out, but I was like a solution to that, right? And then you can, and that you'd see the similarities when I was watching that. Like, yes, Scientology and that movie freaked me out, but I was like, man, I could see how so many others would get you looped into that, right?

Like make you feel good and then make you feel part of a team and then suck you in on this and give you up your money. The whole thing freaked me out. I thought Alex Gibney did great. He's the top dog for docs right now. Like Alex Gibney is the guy that as a documentary filmmaker we look up to like he's the one that he definitely did a great job with that documentary but the the scientologists are hounding him now yeah what do they do like how are they hounding him what can they do i don't know other than they should just watch it yeah and go maybe we're crazy yeah smoke a joint watch

that shit and go god what are we doing what are we doing? What are we doing? This guy was nuts. Maybe we can change it a little bit and make it better, right? When we see Tom Cruise salute LRH, we did it. That part was really fucking scary to me. It's amazing. I love it. He's saluting him like he's an apostle. He's like, we've done it. Even better.

It's like he's military. And then they give him that ridiculous- A giant gold medal. He's all excited. Like, yes, here's my medal metal his metal is like a fucking Flava Flav clock one They just created for him. It wasn't even according to the film It wasn't even something that was there before they just wanted what's-his-name that Muscovich Created it to be like to kind of bring him back in like you're getting this metal that like nobody else gets it's amazing It's really beautiful.

And if you're a fan of human folly, I'm a big fan of folly. I love when people fuck up. Not necessarily that I want people to fuck up. I just love clear, undeniable craziness. That kind of stuff. Seeing Tom Cruise standing on a podium with this fucking gold medal talking to that guy saying i've never met a man more honorable more noble like i've been saluting we did it we did it that part almost as i was watching it almost seemed like

a movie clip to me like he was in character I was watching it being like this is real They like it really had this this wasn't yeah, that guy's amazing Tom Cruise is amazing Amazing in that he's just so first of all brilliant actor Yeah, but just so goddamn wacky off the charts wacky, but you've covered that perfect on the podcast I couldn't agree more where when you become Really famous world famous to where like you know nine out of ten people know your name and you just have yes how about ten out of ten yeah tom cruise it might be like it might be more than nine nine point eight it's like 999 out of 100 at the very least right yeah i i would say so you just have nothing but yes men saying everything you did like you

come up with an idea that's clearly crazy as you're saying are ridiculous but everyone around you doesn't want to get you upset or get fired so they're like no no no that's great that's brilliant you can save the world you are well when you're like a tom cruise and you're like literally 999 out of a thousand people know who the fuck you are like what it's probably more than that right don't you think it's more than that i would say it's out of a hundred thousand people three don't know who Tom Cruise is. I would really be willing to say that. I'd put money on that.

Maybe 10. Maybe 10. Yeah, and maybe little kids, but adults. Yeah. From 18 on. Let's go from 18 on. It's like so close to 100% know who he is. Yeah.

It's so close. I think, you know, I had Dom Herrera on the podcast yesterday. He's friends with Cher. And he used to open up for Cher all the time. And would ask She's been famous since she was 19. Yeah, and she would ask him questions like what's it like out there? What's the what's it like? What are people like like what's it like to go to the movies? And he like made her like come out with him in Montreal. He's like what'd he say? He said leave the top hat and cane at home and just come on outside And she's just so weirded out by people because she's been famous for so long that she's completely alienated.

And I think Tom Cruise is very similar to that. He's been a movie star since The Wanderers. Like, what year was that? The Outsiders, rather? Yeah, The Outsiders. That was like 81 or something like that, I want to say. I mean, something incredibly long ago. What was it?

83. So, hey, 1983, he's been a fucking huge star since. I mean, that's insane. Insane. That's 32 years? Is that right? How is that possible? 32 years, it looks exactly the same.

He's a fucking vampire. That's what he is. He fucking looks really good. He's in good shape. Amazing. How old is he? He's like 51 is. He fucking looks really good. He's in good shape. Amazing. How old is he? He's like 51 or something? Looks great.

Looked a little worn out in that Cameron Diaz movie, but do a movie with Cameron Diaz and see how you turn out. 52? Handsome bastard. But look at this.

He's a fucking metal. Him with the fucking metal with the giant, the giant sign, the globe behind them. What's with all them? I don't get it. What's with all them metal With the giant The giant sign The globe behind them What's with all them I don't get What's with all them

Wearing like the military outfits Like with the badges Like they won They went to war Yeah they They wore it against Xenu They beat Xenu Oh

It's fucking Oh look Xenu Wow I just I'm a It's just a really big fan Of wacky people like that that are so over the top,

but yet so undeniably successful and so brilliant at what they do. What's that movie, Tomorrow, The Day After Tomorrow, The Edge of Tomorrow? Edge of Tomorrow? Is that what it is? I really loved that movie. Oh, the recent sci-fi? Science fiction movie? It bombed.

I thought it was a great. Did it bomb? Yeah, they didn't do well. Really? Yeah, it didn't make. It's probably all of his wackiness. The wackiness is probably catching up. Oh, I think...

I mean, I'd heard that just its opening months was not good, right? They were not what they were expecting. But when you watch the movie, I agree. I remember thinking that was one of the best movies that came out that summer. It was a really good story. It was very unique. Very well done. The way they made the aliens was very different.

And the concept of redoing the day, I thought it was great. I really enjoyed it. Did it not do well? I don't know. Well, I know he experienced a big drop in his popularity or the way people respected him. After he did that interview with Matt Lauer. I thought it was the Oprah one where he was crazy on the couch. Chicks love that.

I'm in love. Please. Yeah. That is not how a man ever behaves when he's in love ever are you sure that is a guy who loves dick who's pretending to be in love with a chick he's got a whole team of people covering up for the fact that he loves dick but um no he did that matt lauer one where he's getting on Brooke Brooke shields for being on antidepressants. That's right That's right. He said you can just correct it with exercise and well you can help it But I mean the idea that you you understand what's going on in her brain like I'm sorry, dude

What kind of research have you done? Yeah about especially what kind of tests have you run on Brooke in particular? But he's on but he's cold trickle so he knows what's up, right? It's cold trickle days under culture But he's cold trickle, so he knows what's up, right? What is cold trickle? Dave's Thunder. Cold trickle. Oh. I don't know how you remember that. I remember him from Top Gun.

That was a big one, too. All right, Adam Scorgi, we're out of time, dude. But thank you very much for doing this. And thank you very much for putting together two fucking amazing documentaries. The Union and The Culture High. It's been a real honor and a pleasure to be in those. Joe, no. I appreciate it.

Thank you, man. Like, not just for being a part of those and dedicating your time, but always promoting and helping. You've really helped our careers, so I can't thank you enough. I'm happy you're around, dude. Keep doing what you're doing. I'm going to try, man. Do some more cool shit. Keep going.

I'll have you back on again. All right, man. You can find Adam Scorgy online. What is your Twitter handle again? It's Adam Scor with a G. Like, score like a goal, because that's how my name is pronounced. And there's also the Culture Hive OneWord which is available.

Also, it's the Twitter handle and it's available right now on iTunes. It's available on Amazon Prime, Google Plus. Basically any platform. And it's on Netflix International in 70 countries in 14 different languages. It is fucking excellent. It is really excellent.

Thank you, my brother. No, thank you, man. I appreciate it, Joe. All right, you fucks. That's it for this week. We'll see you next week. Much love. Big kisses.