The Joe Rogan Experience - #93 - Eddie Bravo (Part 1)
Episode Date: March 28, 2011Joe sits down with Eddie Bravo. ...
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The Joe Rogan Experience
Brothers and sisters, lovers and children,
Brian Redband and Eddie Bravo are in the building.
What's up?
Hello.
Much respect to the Korean zombie.
Eddie Bravo is wearing a Korean zombie shirt.
And what this means for you non-MMA people,
there's a guy named Chan Sung Jung, they call him the Korean zombie, that's his nickname.
And this weekend on Saturday night at the UFC against Leonard Garcia,
he pulled off the first twister ever in the UFC.
And the significance, of course, is that Eddie Bravo, our guest today,
actually invented the twister.
No, I didn't invent it.
Well, you invented the set-up.
The set-ups, yes.
The finishing move, no.
It's an old wrestling move.
But people used to finish people with it in wrestling?
You can, definitely.
But did they do it your way with the S-grip on the forehead?
I thought that was all your innovation to turn into a submission.
No, no, no.
People were cranking.
I don't know if they were cranking it exactly the way I crank it, but I'm pretty sure.
Had you seen other people get submitted with it before you ever started doing it?
In high school, I wrestled a couple of years and I wrestled in Santa Ana High.
And in ninth grade, a guy named Jesse Barrios and another guy, his buddy is the one who showed me.
I can't remember his name. I couldn't even remember
it from my book, but Jesse Barrios
is his friend. Santa Ana High School
1985. If anybody out
there is from that, there's Jesse Barrios
friend, the other leg rider on
that wrestling team. Fuck, I don't know
what his name was. Anyways, he showed it to me.
And both of those, and in wrestling
leg riding is for weak people.
And all that means is we're so weak, we need to use our legs a lot more than the big, strong dudes who are wrestling and hitting the weights and had big chests and shoulders.
Those guys really didn't rely on their legs as much as the weak guys like me.
I would skip weightlifting practice.
I was in the back where I was hiding.
I was weak even back then.
I was a terrible athlete.
I've never been a great athlete.
So I had to rely on using my legs.
And I thought, you know, they came to me.
Jesse came to me and I go, dude, you'll be perfect for this.
You know, because they knew I'd just get smashed
if I try to go heads up with people.
So it's a pinning move that I learned in wrestling.
And I got pretty good at it.
That was my shit, even in high school.
That was the thing I always tried.
I got some cool-ass stories that maybe one day I'll talk about them.
But I have some cool wrestling stories.
But anyways, I sucked at wrestling. I only had one takedown in two fucking years. I sucked.
So I just totally relied on leg riding and using, it's actually called the guillotine.
It's actually not called the twister. It's called the guillotine. But when I started
doing it in jujitsu, Higgin Machado and Jean-Jacques Machado would just call it the twister because the guillotine already existed. There's a lot of people out there that think that I
took this wrestling move and I said, I'm going to try to fool the world and change the name
and say I invented it. There's thousands of people that think that. It's hilarious. In
my books from day one, it was the guillotine.
Hold on a second.
You're being a little bit modest because you invented all these setups and turned it into a very high percentage finish.
Yes, yes.
You invented a lot of setups from a lot of different places.
Yes.
Where it became, I mean, none of that stuff existed.
But this is the transition.
So I ended up quitting wrestling.
The work ethic you need to be a good wrestler is something that is just not in my body chemistry.
I was not made to work really hard physically.
I hated work, regular jobs.
I knew that's why it was all about rock stardom or playing football.
I just wanted to be like a famous dude who just played for a living and got paid and was fucking adored by everybody.
That's what I wanted.
I didn't want to work.
I hated work.
Of course.
Who doesn't want to work?
Oh, my God.
Work actually killed me inside.
So it drove my artistic side.
So once I realized that Mexicans don't play football, I'm like, oh, my God.
I was in ninth grade and I was the slowest motherfucker out there.
And that was it.
You know, I had these dreams of playing football or making it in music.
Football was crushed in ninth grade.
Once everyone starts growing, you know what?
Junior All-American and peewee football, that's fucked up.
I played defensive lineman and middle linebacker in football.
I actually thought I was going to be a defensive lineman and a middle linebacker because when you're eight and you're
nine, everyone's the same size. And you know, you really did some brainwash going on that really
thought I was going to be a football player. I really thought I was until ninth grade. Shit.
Oh man. When, when I was in sixth grade, I was supposed to make the football team because in my
neighborhood, in my neighborhood, uh, I was pretty, I was a pretty good football player around Mexicans from like a really poor neighborhood.
I was pretty badass.
But when you go to school, when you go, when I went to sixth grade and in junior all American, you know, football, peewee football, I was pretty, I was pretty good.
But once people start growing and start changing in sixth grade, I went to sixth grade and I didn't make the football team.
They cut me.
I was supposed to be the football star.
I was so embarrassing.
But it was flag football.
It wasn't tackle.
So in my head, I'm like, wait till ninth grade when I get to high school.
I'm going to play some tackle.
I'm going to show you what the fuck's going on.
So that's what I was thinking.
I go, fuck this year.
Fuck sixth grade. So seventh grade, I transferred myself to a school far away that I only went to
because there's more stories where I was driven away from my junior high school.
So I went to another school.
I tried out for the football team in the seventh grade.
I got cut again, but it was flag football.
But I was so embarrassed that I told my friends growing up, all my kids,
I told them that, yeah, I made the team, second string quarterback, but you know what?
I got in a fight, so they had to cut me, man.
It sucks.
That's the story I told them.
I told the kids that I grew up with, thought I made the team, but I got cut because I got in a fight with a dude.
That's hilarious.
I kept that going that's
so i was so embarrassed that i didn't make the team i was so embarrassed and then in the eighth
grade one of one of my uh the guys that i grew up with went to that school too he made the team he
was awesome i didn't make the team again he never brought up the fact that he never asked anybody
didn't he make the team last year that never never got brought up. They never humiliated me.
Maybe they were talking behind my back.
Like, I don't know.
No one ever brought it up, but I did lie about it.
And I'm coming clean with it now.
I totally lied about it.
Don't you think for dudes that competition like that, any kind of competition, whether it's football or wrestling or anything,
it's so important for kids when they're growing up to know how hard it is if you really want to get good at something?
Oh, yeah. Don't you think? Yeah something oh yeah yeah yeah you gotta tell mexicans listen if you're mexican and you think
you're gonna be a football player look at reality listen to me look at reality there's not that very
there's one mexican and he plays quarterback you think you're gonna be him get out of get out of
football get that shit out of your head if you're mexican unless you got some tall motherfuckers in
your family there's a couple mexicans out there, but what are the odds?
Cain Velasquez could have easily made it as a
football player. Maybe. Maybe. You think maybe?
Dude, there's a lot more than just
being an athlete. Everybody's an athlete in football.
You've got to have some serious skills and serious magic.
He could have just been a really strong, athletic
guy. Look at Matt Mitrione.
Strong and athletic. Matt Mitrione's
a fucking athlete.
So do you think that
if those guys came over
to the UFC,
those super athletes,
those NFL dudes,
do you think that, like,
that's what we're seeing
with, like, Jon Jones?
Because that's the talk,
that, you know,
Jon Jones has two brothers,
I believe,
that are playing football
right now.
I mean, we've seen...
Yeah, it's incredible.
I mean, he's...
Jon Jones is...
He's a super athlete.
And there's dudes
that are super athletes
that are in maybe other sports and we're
starting to see him in the UFC.
That's like a big topic of discussion.
Like what,
how much of a difference does like serious athleticism make?
It makes a huge difference.
Hell yeah.
John Jones has been a fucking doing,
he's been doing mixed martial arts for only three years before that.
He was a wrestler.
Yeah.
I mean,
that's incredible.
We're going to,
you know what?
It's already happened in boxing
Just look at what happened with boxing
Culturally
Look what happened
It's interesting though that football
I guess it's just where the money is
The high money ones like football and basketball
They get the best athletes
Even though the UFC has been around now
Since 93
It's not been like a real accepted
Mainstream thing but for
like the last five or six years right wouldn't you say yes yes you know it's it's the super athletes
that start jujitsu early wrestling their whole lives and striking early they put it together
like the ruffo brothers yes it's the best athletes that start off like the ruffo brothers you know i mean it's
some some people can start off with jujitsu and wrestling and striking early and achieve so much
physically from it but still they weren't born with the athleticism you know what i mean you
got to be a natural it's got to all come together you got to have all the pieces together to make it
a natural it's got to all come together you got to have all the pieces together to make it in the big sports that we see today i mean like foot you can't start start playing football when you're 22
and make the nfl if you do that's it may have happened once or twice some african guy i don't
know it may have happened you know what i mean uh you know one of them matumbo mckembe guys that
started playing basketball for 18 months and he's in the nba you know what i'm saying every now and then you get those freaks but generally 98 of the time
look at what's going on with all the sports they just go and find that dude and say hey you want
to play basketball i don't even know i'm just picking it up it's one of those one of those
dudes i'm sure minute bowl uh akumbe matumbo I can't even say his name. But one of those dudes, I'm sure, started playing basketball late.
Do you imagine what it must be like living like Manute Ball?
It's like you're living in dollhouses everywhere.
Everywhere you go, they're dollhouses.
Everyone's building is built for dolls.
You have to hunch everywhere you go.
At what height?
Naturally for girls, taller guys, guys naturally the taller you are the more
attractive you are naturally but what what exactly what size six eight six seven does it become a
turnoff to girls because there must be a turnoff point or are they turned on by guys that are seven
foot three do that does a guy a girl look at a guy seven foot three and it's totally attracted
him he's seven foot three so rare i love him so much or is it like that's too tall i don't like
him that tall it's ridiculous yeah you know what i mean what is it well they would also worry i
think evolutionarily about that is this real is that a real word uh about the baby getting too
big inside of them and get stuck coming out of their pussy and just blow it all out.
If you've got a seven foot three dude,
you imagine how big his fucking babies are.
If it's half his baby,
you know,
you got a 15,
20 pound baby inside your hooker.
You know what?
I will say this though.
I am not attracted to,
I'm not attracted to real tall chicks.
I'm just,
you know,
and especially when they get fucking ridiculous.
If a girl's six foot one usually they gotta be
they gotta have really pretty faces
usually their bodies start to get out of whack
you know what I mean
but I have
looked at big tall ass chicks
and when you see them in public
the thoughts will race through my mind like
damn that'd be nice just to pump a load
into her and see what my baby would
see what my boy would turn out like how proud i'd be of that fucking kid you know what i
mean he's six foot three and that's my son can you imagine he's six foot five and that's my son and
he's beating ass todd duffy looking dude that's my son that'd be cool dude how cool would that be
can you imagine that's what you look for in a girl that's how you who cares what she looks like
just give me a son keep on two conversations at the same time can you imagine that's what you look for in a girl? That's how you hunt a girl. Who cares what she looks like? Just give me a sign.
Hold on, we can't keep on two conversations at the same time.
Can you imagine that's how you found girls?
That's like how you went to go date girls just by looking at them as a mother to a child, like a super athlete.
Like you only wanted to date.
I think that's what that dude who, Zulu, remember Zulu, the guy who fought Hicks and Gracie?
Yeah. Zulu, the guy who fought Hicks and Gracie, he has this story about the way he described it was a large negress and that he knew that she would make great babies for him.
So he found her and he described what he did and how he shot loads into her to make a boy, that he knew that the way he was doing it was definitely to make a boy.
He had some method.
And then Zulu came out.
Dude, I would pay 50 bucks. It's a great story. I would pay 50 bucks right now if you said i got the dvd the documentary of that
i would go i'll give you 50 bucks for that i would even go 75 bucks but i'd go you're
you're that's a lot but god damn it i'll still pay for it that's an awesome story you imagine
how much of a pain in the ass it must be if you're a kid and your dad was some fighter and you're supposed to be a fighter too you're like god damn really i can't just have fun
i can't just go hang out no i gotta go in a fight oh shit or like any profession like his son his
son didn't really seem like he wanted to be doing that right you know i mean it's almost like i mean
you almost have to if your dad is zulu you know your dad is this famous guy who
got in a bare knuckle cage fight with fucking hicks and gracie back in the day maybe he maybe
he wasn't into and he kind of got just like you know what i i don't want to work a regular job
i got a name i could actually fight but he did do jujitsu though he was all right at jujitsu he was
like a purple belt back when he fought so yeah he was doing juiu-jitsu. So in a weird way, Zulu, like,
jiu-jitsu beat Zulu,
but Zulu's son was into jiu-jitsu.
That's pretty cool, right?
Yeah, do you remember
that Hicks and Gracie footage?
For those of you who don't know,
Hicks and versus Zulu
was one of the very, very first
like no-rules fights,
you know, that was like
where they planned it out.
They had a whole arena
full of people in Brazil
checking this out.
And a young Hicks and Gracie, who was like 18, I think,
he was a representative of jiu-jitsu,
fought this giant super athlete black dude named Zulu.
And this guy's just yoked.
He's just slamming him.
And Hickson eventually gets his back and strangles him.
And it's one of those all-time great videos where people watch it.
Like, jiu-jitsu guys back in the day, it was like,
this is proof, man. This is proof. Like, jujitsu guys back in the day, it was like, this is proof, man.
This is proof.
Like, look, if you get a good jujitsu, you can overcome a guy like this.
And he's only 18.
It was like a big fucking deal.
And the footage is so bad, but it looks cool.
It's like 50th generation.
All that footage, it's dudes taping it off VHS.
Somehow it got the DVD and then a copy.
And it already started off as terrible footage.
Now it's like silhouetted kind of.
It's like a yellow and black and orange type thing.
But it's classic.
One of the coolest things that I ever got out of being famous
was I got to have dinner with Hickson.
That to me was one of the coolest things ever.
I had dinner with Hickson and then we went over his house and we watched fights and he broke down what dudes were doing wrong
he was watching mario sperry fight in coliseum and he was just talking about space he was talking
about i give no space i give no space he was talking about so like such an intense dude you
know like he was talking about you know like his like his philosophy on jiu-jitsu.
Very simple.
We start at zero.
And from zero, we're going to one.
And we're not going back to zero.
And then from one, we're going to two.
From two to three, to checkmate.
That's where we're going to go.
And I was like, God damn!
You get the chills talking to him.
You're like, I'm sitting here talking to Hickson motherfucking Gracie,
and he's giving me some intense life philosophy on how he strangles dudes.
He's into it.
We're watching all these fights, and he's breaking shit down.
We watched the Funaki fight with him and Funaki.
Those Hickson fights, man.
God, I wish there were more of them.
So annoying, man.
So annoying that you don't get to see
the best supposed representative ever of jiu-jitsu
at the time fighting those guys.
You know, fighting all Mark Coleman's
and all the fucking guys that everyone was scared of.
Mark Kerr and all that shit.
How fascinating would that have been, man?
Fuck, that would have been awesome.
Damn.
That would freak me out.
It really would.
It would freak me out to sit and hang out with Hickson Gracie.
He's cool as fuck.
That would freak me out.
He's a super nice guy.
His son is cool as fuck, too.
Nobody else in jujitsu that would freak me out like Hickson.
You know what I mean?
Marcelo Garcia, to me, Marcelo Garcia is the number one jujitsu guy that's ever lived.
I think Marcelo Garcia is the number one guy that's ever lived.
You know?
But Hickson is the most mystical and rock star-ish.
You know what I mean?
He's like...
Motherfucker was in The Incredible Hulk.
You know what I mean?
You saw The Incredible Hulk with Ed Norton.
When Ed Norton is learning how to calm and control himself,
Hicks and Gracie slapping him in the face.
That's,
that's the man.
Yeah.
I would freak out if,
if,
uh,
if like me and Hickson,
which are sitting there talking to jujitsu.
I mean,
it's not out of the question that might happen in the future.
For sure.
It might,
it might not.
I would love it.
I would,
that would be a fucking dream of mine to hang out and talk jiu-jitsu and break shit down to the core.
For the people who don't know the history, Eddie Bravo tapped Hickson's brother, Hoyler, in Abu Dhabi in 2003 in this giant upset when Eddie was at Brown Belt.
And he caught him with a triangle.
So there's like perceived animosity sometimes
because of that but there's none exists you've never been anything but respectful of any of
those guys you know it's just there's uh i know that they were trying to do some sort of a rematch
with you and hoyler but uh yeah i guess that was yeah what happened is a promoter called or emailed me last October, October or November.
And it was a guy that I've done privates for.
I know who he is.
And he's really high up in jujitsu in the Middle East, in Abu Dhabi.
And they're putting together, they were putting together a no-gi world championship in Abu
Dhabi.
They never had a no-gi world championship in Abu Dhabi they never had a no-gi
one they're doing gi world championships out there but the no-gi ones they wanted to have one in
April and they asked me if if they wanted to have me and Hoyler as a super match but they never
contacted him they told this is what happened then I emailed him back and I'm like, you know me, I'm down to rematch Hoyler anytime. I've always been down.
I've never been the one denying it.
I want one more match.
I want to train him.