The Joe Rogan Experience - #984 - Yvette d'Entremont

Episode Date: July 6, 2017

Yvette d'Entremont, also known as SciBabe, is a public speaker, science blogger, and former analytical chemist. She has a background in forensics and toxicology.

5, 4, 3, 2, oh what's happened? Jamie went three toes. How are you? What's going on? Doing good. How are you doing? Good. Welcome. Thank you for having me. Thanks for coming on. You wrote an article and I tweeted. Let me tell you about my chiropractic journey. I had a podcast that I did with my friend Steve Rinella a few weeks back. Gotcha. And he has a brother that has a herniated disc real bad. And he's got atrophy in one of his arms because he's got a pushed nerve

and you know, the whole thing, bulging disc. Not good. Yeah. And we got to talking and I said, look, that guy's got to do something about it right away. Because the more time you spend with an atrophied arm, the longer it takes to rehabilitate that. And it's a pretty common injury with martial artists yeah yeah that's something get get yourself to a physical therapist yeah right away and get an mri and then spinal decompression the whole deal and do everything you can science based absolutely so he goes uh what do you think about chiropractors and i go so i say i think chiropractors are bullshit and And then he goes, really?

I go, yeah. I go, I've just had bad experiences with it. And then I've read some things about it being bullshit. And then I got home after the podcast and I smoked joint. And a lot of times when I smoke pot, I feel bad about some of the things that I've said. I rarely do. Do you? I smoke more than the average scientist.

My boyfriend is director of R&D at a pot lab. Oh, well, there you go. Science, pot science. There is some pot kicking around on a regular basis. Well, we get it free from a bunch of people. I have to tell people at shows, and no disrespect to people that offer it to me. I'm like, please don't give me any pot. I can't take your pot.

I have too much pot. We have a similar problem. Yeah. Um, so anyway, I smoked the pot and then I go, God, maybe I'm a dick. Maybe I was rude saying, cause I know people that are chiropractors and I know they're nice people and I know they mean well. And I'm like, maybe I'm a dick. I think that's accurate. I think they mean well. Some of them. Sure. Yeah. I think they're wrong, but they mean well. So, um, I go, Yeah, I think they're wrong, but they mean well. So I go, maybe I was being a dick.

So then I Google chiropractic, and then I start reading. And I spend hours and hours reading about the history of, I'm going to say this in big air quotes, chiropractic medicine. And I go, holy fucking shit. Not only do I not feel bad now, now I'm angry. Don't feel bad at all. And this is to all you people, and I've got a ton of messages from chiropractors that I'm sure are nice folks. And they're really upset because they like this podcast. And they're like, you know, you're shitting on my business.

You have to understand. I'm sure a lot of you mean well. I'm sure a lot of you do well. I'm sure a lot of you mean well. I'm sure a lot of you do well. I'm sure a lot of you try really hard to help your patients. And I'm sure a lot of you incorporate a lot of other stuff like massage and cold laser and real science into your therapies. But the origin, the original guy who created chiropractic medicine was a complete, total bullshit artist. Fucking whack job. This guy right here. This character.

Daniel David Palmer. So he started out. He's a magnetic healer in Davenport, Iowa. I mean, the whole thing is 100% horseshit. And I mean, we, this article that we wrote, we sent this through, I mean, normally my articles, they go through at least, you know, two editors, give or take. This one we put through, I believe, three editors, a fact checker, and

our lawyer to make sure that we were bulletproof on it, because we wanted to make sure that we, you know, that we didn't say anything that could get us sued, basically. And a lot of the information from this came directly from his book, from his own book. So we weren't taking anything out of context. One of the information from this came directly from his book, from his own book. So we weren't taking anything out of context. One of the quotes on how chiropractic started came directly from

the book. And he, after cracking a half deaf person's or a deaf person's spine, depending on the retelling. That was what Jamie just had pulled up in that article. Pull that back up, Jamie, so you can see that. He claimed that he cracked a deaf person's back and restored his hearing. Now, a couple of things could have happened here. Either, one, there was no actual medical consent given because this person was deaf. So I'm not sure how that came about. Two, he didn't actually restore the hearing because there are no nerves in the spine connected to your hearing. Or, you know, three, this guy is just spine connected to your hearing. Or, you know,

three, this guy is just lying. Like there's, there are a couple, you know, and we're not sure what happened, but he like, there are still, and you know, chiropractic could have done a few things with this. They could have disavowed what happened and said, you know, we still have a system by which we can really try to relieve pain through spinal manipulation. But no, there are still articles out today from chiropractors today that try to claim that, yes, indeed, he did restore hearing. Because I'm like, no, could you guys just maybe back down on some of the nuttier claims? Because there is some minor evidence that you can relieve back pain, lower back pain with spinal manipulation. And there are chiros that are

trying to be science-based with this. But the of it is so ridiculous and they try to back down on nothing and that's not how science works science works with the newest evidence and it tries to figure out what's real and what's not and they try to double down on all the craziest stuff and i think there are chiros that are trying to fix the field maybe and say, you know, spinal manipulation can help with back pain. But that's not what this claims. It claims that you can fix everything in the body through these vertebral subluxations that have never been shown. What is a subluxation? All right. So there are a couple, there are two terms being used here and chiropractic uses it incorrectly and in medicine we use it correctly. So a subluxation, the actual medical term means that a joint pops out halfway.

So you have a dislocation, which is a complete separation of a joint, basically. And a subluxation is a partial dislocation. I know because they happen to my shoulder. They're a fun party trick. I'll spare you. But a subluxation in the chiropractic sense, they use this medical term kind of incorrectly. They say that your spine can be somewhat out of joint, basically, and it causes all your health problems. Like your pancreas is malfunctioning because your spine is out of alignment. And that's never been proven to happen.

And they claim that they can put you into a state of health by massaging your back. And here's what's important about this. This was created out of thin air by a guy who was a quack. The origin is not based on years and years of medical research. None of this, all of this came from the 1800s

from a guy who was completely full of shit. Yep. And he was a magnetic healer. Now, magnetic healing, like you can still see at the store these little like knee braces that have magnets in it. Guys, save your money.

Just get a regular old knee brace. If you feel any relief from one of those magnetic braces, it's just from the brace. It's not the fucking magnets. Or a placebo effect. Yeah, exactly. Placebo effects are, I mean, the placebo effect is a real thing. You can get some relief from that, but don't bother. Which may also account for some of the pain relief from chiropractic medicine.

Absolutely. I mean, they're doing... Air quotes medicine. Exactly. Like they're doing some massage along with what they're doing. Right. And some of them... That's a problem because massage actually helps.

Yep. And there are studies that show people who go to a massage therapist or a massage practitioner tend to get more relief than people who go to a chiropractor. So please go to a massage therapist. Go to a physical therapist. Those are your science-based practitioners. Chiropractic, it started out of bullshit and it stayed directly in bullshit. But here's the thing.

There's no reason that anybody would have, from this guy, from this one original guy who created it, this guy who's a magnetic healer, who came up with this, somehow or another it slipped through the cracks. Yeah. I mean, that's what this is. I mean, they're running around calling themselves doctors. So this guy said to me, one of these guys who got angry at me, I've gotten at least two dozen maybe angry messages from chiropractors. But one of them, the guy said, does a podiatrist go to medical school? Well, the fuck, they go to podiatry school. Not only that, they have a medical residency

that they have to do for three years. They actually go to a hospital. They have to work in a hospital. And podiatry is like an actual science of studying the foot. And some of them are, I could be wrong on this. Someone go ahead and please fact check me. I believe some of them are, I could be wrong on this. Someone go ahead and please fact check me. I believe some of them are podiatric surgeons. Like they have to know

all the anatomy of the feet in order to treat actual foot conditions. They are like, these are part of the medical system. Chiropractic works kind of separately and on theories that have never been proven to work. They can't even do imaging. Like half, I believe something like half of chiropractic clinics don't even have x-rays. So how can they show you 100% for sure that what they're claiming is happening in your back isn't happening? And I read, I mean, these are statistics that I found straight from chiropractic websites, from their organizations. And I had this referenced in the article. I just, I'm blanking on which place had this. One of the chiropractic boards that does large-scale surveys within chiropractic.

About half. There were a lot of places. A lot of people, I'm sure, said to you, but my chiropractor is good. My chiropractor doesn't do the bullshit stuff. And a lot of my friends said that, too. They said, no, they just crack my back. They don't try to sell me any bullshit supplements. About half of chiropractors do the bullshit stuff.

They do the extraneous wellness stuff. So if you're playing Russian roulette and you have a 50% chance of getting a bullet, are you going to do that? No. I don't want a 50% chance of having a bullshit doctor who's like, well, maybe your cold's really a germ and maybe it's Ebola.

I don't want the bullshit doctor. I want the guy who knows what he's talking about and this is what you're getting with chiropractic. You're getting a bullshit doctor and it's even if you're... But it's not a doctor. Yeah, exactly. Isn't this part of the problem? They call themselves doctors. I didn't know until this year

or until when I was checking in on this. They don't go to medical school. They go to chiropractic schools. Now one of the biggest chiropractic schools in the country is Palmer Chiropractic College, and it's named for D.D. Palmer, the guy who launched this bevy of bullshit on us. It's made after that guy? Named after... The guy who claimed to heal the deaf guy?

And it's one of my... Now, this is crazy. So this is going to be a fun story. By fun, I mean horrifying. One of the guys I went to undergrad with went to Palmer Chiropractic College. Now, the acceptance rate, 100%. Tuition, $34,000 a year to learn how to crack baby spines. Now, the guy I went to college with.

Well, you say baby spines. Some people do it. Some of them do. Now, it is a growing field in chiropractic. This one guy said, this is hilarious. He said, you're saying they crack baby spines. It's a gentle manipulation. Like, why? Here's the thing. Why?

Why the fuck are you manipulating babies? There's no evidence whatsoever that helps babies. The babies aren't complaining about back pain. Yeah, no, here are the two things that I've heard. One is that it's so gentle it wouldn't even bruise a tomato skin. Then why are you doing it? Why? No, the other thing they say is.

Because it's bullshit. Yeah, it's because they can charge parents. That's why. The other thing they say is, well, from doing that, you, because, and this is, this infuriates me so much. They say from manipulating the spine, because the spine has, you know, within those bones, they have the spinal column. And the nerves control everything in the body. And so from stimulating the nerves, you can give the infant all the immunity it needs to not need their vaccinations. Wait a minute, wait a minute.

Oh yeah, they claim this shit. Hold on a second. Hold on. You got to be real specific. Who is claiming that by manipulating a baby, they don't need vaccines? I understand this is not all chiropractors, but the American Chiropractic Association, this is fairly well cited within the article, the American Chiropractic Association, they are generally anti-drug. They want to use the least amount of medical interventions possible. And chiropractors are not, in most states in this country, they are not cleared to either prescribe or give vaccinations.

So if you can manage to get a family to come into you for pretty much all of their medical needs, that increases your bottom line. And it stops, you know, and you can just say, we can do everything for you. But of course a chiropractor isn't cleared for vaccinations. Of course. They don't give vaccinations. That's not their thing. And I mean, there's one state in this country, I believe it was Wisconsin, where they were trying to get chiropractors to be able to give pre-sports physicals. And in some cases, the pre-sports physical is the only time all year when a student will see a doctor. So this is infuriating. So

like whenever a doctor, and I mean, this is like, can look at the ACS website. There's put a couple of links to it in the article where they say, you know, they're they're not very pro vaccine. I mean, their language on it is under the condition of freedom of choice, medical choice. And it's like they don't say straight out vaccines don't work. They're bad for you, but they're kind of they're wishy washy on it. And they're not they don't say vaccines work and you should get them. But a couple of chiropractors will try to say we don't need vaccines we can increase your immune system we can increase your immunity by you know pressing on the spine there's zero evidence zero evidence and i'm like do me a favor uh tell me which spine which part of the spine you press on to give a child immunity to measles and polio give me tell me give me the titers test that child's

titers to show me that they're immune to polio now from you touching their goddamn spine. Maybe it's like, how about this? How about I'll punch you in the back? I'm not going to punch a chiropractor. How about I just give you a few little pokes in the back and then you're going to be immune to smallpox. Just let me know how that works. But I can't get behind a system that has no evidence and tells me it's going to make children immune to deadly diseases. Here's the real question. How did it get this far? Like how did this guy who's a magnetic healer who had no background in medicine come up with this system and then have it spread all over the world? It's such a good story, isn't it? People love a story that says

that you can heal them without taking dangerous drugs. And at the time, medicine wasn't... Well, forget about dangerous drugs. I mean, even just helping you with anything. It's really... It's partially because of when it came up because we only found out 50 years after this

that frontal lobotomies were a bad fucking idea, and that thalidomide was going to kill babies. So we were, we were really fucking bad at medicine when this came up. And we're, I mean, we're way better at it now, but we still don't have the answers to everything. And that's kind of, I don't want to say a failure of the medical system, but it's just a sign of where we are now. So think about the number of people who have sent us anecdotes saying, you know, I was in miserable pain and my chiropractor was the only thing that worked. And it's like, maybe you needed to get a, you know, get to physical therapy for longer term pain. But these people that are still going to their chiros, it means they're still in pain and they should go to a physical therapist for, you know,

a couple months of therapy that will eventually strengthen their backs and take care of those issues and, you know, get a massage. But they're going to their chiro because medical has not said, you know, we don't have a tricorder that can scan you, show the exact thing and say, here's the exact medicine, drug and thing that will fix you. It's kind of, and I hate to use this term, but it's out of the failures of the medical system that something like this has shown up. So we're not perfect at medicine yet. And that's why alternative medicine swoops in with bullshit. Well, it's just a matter of innovation. It's like there's a certain level that the medical community is at right now. It's pretty staggering what they're capable of, but it's still growing and learning and we're in a constant state of progress. But what's shocking to me is how far this medical healer or magnetic healers

quack idea got. I just thought it was based on something. I mean, I really did. I've been going to a chiropractor for years or different chiropractors for years. And one of them was like, this guy used to go to in Hollywood,

he's like 140 bucks. Literally he would take care of you for like 10 minutes. He would rub your back a little bit and massage a little bit. The massage. And then he would pop it and then go, oh, we got it. We got it. And I'd be like, okay. And I would think, all right, man, maybe I'll start feeling better now.

I've got a foam roller for 20 bucks that I can lend you. It'll crack your back really well. Well, yeah. It's just stunning to me that insurance companies pay for it and that it's been around so long. How did that happen? How are insurance companies paying for it? There was some lobbying

and I don't think I put this into the article, but there was a lot of lobbying from chiropractors in, I believe, the 70s that pushed the American Medical Association and the insurance companies as a whole to kind of accept them as being medically a part of the system. And that's part of why more and more insurance companies now will cover them and accept them. And even though like most doctors won't, like a lot of doctors won't refer you, they'll kind of be like, well, you can look into Cairo.

Like there's still from a lot of doctors pushback, but there's a little bit more coverage now just because of a lot of lobbying in the seventies. Now, if chiropractors do have a center or a treatment center or whatever it is, and they have a bunch of different methods that they employ, this is not saying that those other methods might not give you some relief, but the actual cracking of the necks and the cracking of the back, there's virtually no evidence that that heals anything. Heals no. Or stops any, you know, promotes your immune system functioning better or anything like that. All these things that it's based on.

It's precisely. Like, the big thing is that, I they're if they were just claiming we can reduce your back pain if that was the only thing they claimed i probably wouldn't have written the article you know but what they're claiming is that they can fix all of your health by realigning these vertebral subluxations which have never been proven to exist so like what are they doing when when your back pops what is actually happening? It's like, I wish nitrogen being released or something. I think it's just moving around air bubbles. Like, I mean, tiny little bits of bubbles and yeah, they are like, they're,

I don't think realigning is the right word, but you know, they're, they're doing, they're, they're moving around your back in a way that it kind of naturally moves because you can kind of move and twist and your back will pop,. But they're doing some manipulation of things that kind of naturally happen to a spine with a tiny little bit, I mean, tiny bit of degeneration with age. I think I'm not exactly the right expert to explain this type of thing. An osteopath would be a better person to explain this, because there are people who are a little better at spinal manipulation than a chiropractor, which is a DO, an osteopath.

So in this country, we have MDs and DOs, and they both can practice medicine. What does DO stand for? Doctor of Osteopathy. I believe that's the correct term. And my doctor is actually, my primary care is an osteopath, and he's given me a spinal manipulation once where my back was killing me, and we had no idea what it was. given me a spinal manipulation once when my back was killing me and we had no idea what it was and it turned out i had a broken rib which was not a good time to do a spinal manipulation you've got a rib broken right on your spine uh but it was like he um the difference is an osteopath never claims that they're um they're cracking your back fixing your pancreas yeah exactly they're they're giving

you uh they're giving you your vaccines they're doing you know they're going wow there's something Fixing your pancreas. a part of their care and they try to do science-based, you know, manipulations for the potential help of back relief. But they don't, you know, they don't want to do that long term. They do it minimally. At least that's been my experience with it. And it seems to be like there still seems to be, I'd say at best, weak evidence that it helps with back pain. But the problem is they usually do it with other things that also have been shown to

help with back pain, like massage. Like I said, it's at best it's weak. And also just rest and time. Yes. Rest, ice, anti-inflammatories. So you're looking at all these different factors. And well, I went to a chiropractor and he helped me. Did he?

Are you sure? Yeah. And I think it's funny the things that chiropractors add into it. Because one of the things that I went into in this in this article, because we we really like diving deep on some of the things that we investigate. And it's like I try like I'll admit I'm biased when I go in because I go after a lot of kind of some of the naturally things. And I'm not I'm not anti-natural. i i'm not 100 against like just weird homeopathic stuff it's funny because we can we can go into some of it's real right like garlic really is good for infections there's some stuff that's legit garlic good for your heart ginger i love

like when i have a stomach ache i'll go for ginger before i go for herbal remedies at work it's there there are some herbal remedies that i'm like absolutely keep them in your in your cabinet i'm i'm not against them but i'm against people taking things without evidence and I think that's the thing like try try absolutely to look for the hard evidence before you waste your money and I think that's the thing that people have fallen into because they'll say oh it's natural it's better it's like is it because polio is natural and I don't think it's very good for you like but I know I know that's a straw man fully aware of it but I also think think that people should ask for evidence. And you never mind ask for it.

Demand it before you give somebody your money. And that's what people haven't done with chiropractors. That is a very good point. And it's, you know, I think people deserve evidence. And I think that's something that hasn't been out in the public sphere. Like there was an article I was trying to write a while ago. I forget the exact topic, but one of my editors was sending it back to me for edit.

She's like, I read the... Her comment back was, well, I've been reading this a lot online. A lot of people have been saying this. I'm like, a lot of people have been saying is not evidence. That's the exact opposite of it. I'm like, here, I put in the peer-reviewed data on this.

That's a lazy editor. I didn't work with her again. A lot of people have been saying, yeah, you can't do that. That's not, and I mean, this is why I like the editors I'm working with now quite a bit. The problem with this whole clinic thing, though, is that they don't have to have any sort of background in kinesiology or in physical therapy or in any of these things. And so they incorporate all these other modalities, all these other methods of healing you, but they don't have to have a background

in education in those things. And they're calling themselves a doctor. Now there is one thing I've heard of, and this is why I'd say don't go to a chiropractor because you don't know what you're going to walk into. But I have heard a couple of times, this being the case, where a chiropractor at first, they go to school for physical therapy.

And then they find they can't open their own clinic, even if they've got like an MBA and a physical therapy background. They're like, how do I open my own clinic? And they realize if they just go to school for chiropractic, they can do the physical therapy work they want to and offer a spinal manipulation on the side. Now, how long does it take to get a degree in chiropractic? How long does it take to get a doctor? Three, four years. I mean, it's a lot of school, but think about it. But what do you learn?

How to crack spines. But here's the thing, though. If it's created by a guy who's a quack, what the fuck could they possibly be teaching you for four years? They do learn some anatomy, but it's like they also learn some bullshit along with it. So I'm like, I wonder. And I mean, this isn't isn't i get it this isn't all chiropractors obviously but like i know the and it's hard to figure out which one you're going to walk into that's going to be a bullshit artist and not so like i i did want like this isn't this wasn't the point i was going to bring up in an

article that was going to have a specific point of view but like i know there are some out there that say i you know i want to give people physical therapy. I want to strengthen up their spine. I want to get them out of here in less pain. So that if they injure themselves again. They know they can come back to me. And trust me with their spine. And also give them some relief while we're fixing them.

So you know this is a thing that happens. But I don't think it's all the time. It's I mean it's clearly not all the time. So you know you're going to have some really moral people in every field and you're going to have some really fucked up ones in every field. Like we were, one of the things we touched on in the article were these very social media savvy people. And this is something that drives me fucking crazy. You have to hunt and peck through their websites to find that they say that they're a chiropractor. They just say doctor everywhere. Doctor.

And they're giving recipe ideas. And they're talking about the adrenal glands. And the adrenal glands, they're not anywhere near close to the spine. And this is a thing that they're talking about. I'm like, the adrenal glands, they're part of... But are they talking about manipulating the spine to help the adrenal glands? They're talking about... One of the things they talk about a lot is adrenal fatigue syndrome, which has never been proven to be a thing.

It's not recognized as a as a disorder anywhere within the medical care system. Now, you can have a couple of different disorders of the adrenal gland. You have Cushing syndrome. Like there are a couple of different things that can go wrong with your adrenal glands or little glands that sit on top of the kidneys. But this is I mean, the specialty, I believe, hold on a second, having a blonde moment on the words, but like there's, or on the subspecialty, but the specialty for which you're going to study the adrenal glands isn't even a specialty that chiropractic has. So it's like, if you want to know about your, if you're having issues with that, like it's like the, the things that chiropractors seem to harp on right now are a lot with, uh, immunology or a lot with, uh,

sorry, just having a complete blonde moment on this. Uh, but there are, there are specialties that chiropractors seem to harp on a lot lately. And it seems to be the type of things that are very nebulous and very hard to, uh, to nail down when someone's having an issue with it. And these are, these are things that chiropractors just don't have the training in. So essentially someone's putting up a health website, and they're claiming to be a doctor, and they're offering all this advice on diet and all these different things. But when you get to what is their degree in, it's not a real doctor.

It's a chiropractor. And basically the type of advice they're giving is take all these herbs eat uh you know eat an alkaline diet which is again bullshit it's there's one of my favorite things with the alkaline diet is they're always like drink lemon water i'm like that's acidic which i might know from my chemistry degree yeah what is the premise of this alkaline diet because i remember people were pushing that a while back. They were saying that you could cure cancer and shit just by having a diet that's alkaline instead of acidic. And I was like, what? blood is between, I think, 7.35 and 7.55. Different organ systems have a fairly tightly controlled pH. Your urine can vary a little bit depending on what you've consumed, but there's, you know, there's a tightly controlled pH within your body. If you suddenly go, you know, if suddenly you have a pH of 10, which is, you know, fairly alkaline, your friends are going to miss

you at your funeral, hopefully. So that's what i got on that but like so you have a high ph you're dead yeah i mean if you're suddenly because you know that's a that's an alkaline ph if you're suddenly really really alkaline we're we're gonna miss you um that's what would cause someone to be that alkaline uh drinking a a bunch of lye? I don't know. There's something really wrong with your ability to filter things out of your body. It's just not a thing that happens to a healthy human if you're all of a sudden really alkaline. But this diet won't do it, especially when the things that they're recommending are like lemons. it especially when the things that they're recommending are like lemons like and one of the things they say is oh well your body takes that acidic fruit and turns it alkaline i'm like

go to school more where are they coming up with this stuff like this is just nonsense that someone's just repeating online and yeah like and the things i say like the the diet they've designed is a fairly low calorie diet like it'll make you lose weight but it's not going to make you go alkaline and it's not going to fucking fight cancer like it's well if anything the reduction in calories would probably be good because you lose some body fat and you probably have less inflammation and it's like yeah it's there are there have been shown to be you know links between lower uh lower body fat and and lower uh incidences of which is, you know, that's a good thing. Losing weight if you're overweight and you're having medical problems from it, overall good thing.

But there's no shown link between this specific diet and a lower incidence of cancer or any other disorders. But it's just like... It's a fat. It's just one of those things. It's so silly. those things remember when people were wearing those holograms attached to a rubber band around their wrist and do you remember these stupid fucking things do you remember him Jamie you remember him right so I think Gwyneth Paltrow has gotten in trouble for selling them on her like website oh the stickers that fucking bitch no offense Gwyneth it's but I might have I might have said some mean things about Gwyneth and my life.

There's been a couple of things about her lately in her fucking nutty website. You're supposed to wear a rock inside your vagina. Isn't that one of those things? I call them pussy rocks. Yeah, pussy rocks are hilarious. I guess it would strengthen you. If you want to strengthen it, just

do kegels around a dick. That's my method. Works out well for everyone Maybe if you can't get a dick or rocks, a good way to go Gwyneth Paltrow wants to heal you with magic stickers Jesus Christ, bitch She's getting paid though, I'll tell you that There's a lot of dummies out there

That are sot-nomming all the way to the ATM machine She has proof that bullshit sells way better than science I do not have her salary. Oh, wait a minute. You could rebalance the energy frequency. I didn't know that. Hold on a second. She's discovered something about stickers.

If you take these stickers, and if they're made with the right material, you just stick them on your body in the right places, and they, in quotes, rebalance the energy frequency in our bodies. Hmm. They're made out of NASA spacesuit material. And NASA said it was a load of BS. But hold on a second. I don't think that NASA's right.

Gwyneth Paltrow's been in a bunch of movies. Hold on. Stop scrolling. She was an Iron Man and not science. It says Gwyneth Paltrow's goop website, a lifestyle business, lifestyle, which sells all things Gwyneth, advertised these stickers are using NASA spacesuit material, which presumably was the source of their magic healing properties. Jesus fucking Christ.

She's special. The stickers are not made, and this is what NASA says, they're not made of spacesuit material. Not that spacesuit material has healing properties in the first place. It doesn't. But the quote from the former NASA scientist Mark Schellhammer Schellhammer?

Schellhammer? He goes, wow, what a load of BS this is. Obviously. Goop quickly updated its site. Now it doesn't claim anything about NASA spacesuits and its stickers. But it didn't dial back any of the magical healing

claims here's what goop says now in an article called wearable stickers that promote healing in parentheses really you fuck human bodies operate at an ideal energetic frequency but everyday stress is an anxiety you're giving me stress you bitch you can throw off our internal balance depleting our energy reserves and weakening our immune system. I'm fucking imagining thinking that you could put a sticker on you and it's going to heal you. Body vibes. Stickers. Oh my god, they're called body vibes.

They come pre-programmed. Oh fuck, they're programming them. I didn't know that. To an ideal frequency, allowing them to target imbalances. You motherfucker. You fucking crook. Don't you have enough money, bitch? Jesus Christ.

Apparently the residuals on the Iron Man movies just weren't enough for her. God damn. 60 bucks for a 10 pound? Holy shit. 10 stickers for 60 bucks? That's... Oh my God.

I am in the wrong industry. Apparently I need to start selling some fancy motherfucking stickers. No, you don't. No, you don't. But look, this is a very controversial subject, right? Like anything that's not regulated by the FDA... Like I'm a part of, in the interest of full disclosure, part of the company Onnit, which is we sell supplements.

But the supplements that we sell, we control everything that we sell. So we make sure that we do testing on it. The supplements that we sell, like this shit, AlphaBrain, did two double-blind placebo-controlled studies at Boston Center for Memory that showed increase in verbal memory, increase in a bunch of different things. What was the other one? There was reaction time. But there's a whole, there's actual scientific studies on nootropics.

They've been around for a long time. I'm curious about them just because, like, I haven't looked into them enough. And I know they're kind of, they're new-ish, you know, into the supplement market. So, like, I kind of want to look into them. And I don't know enough to comment. They're essentially the building blocks for human neurotransmitters, which your body uses, the nutrients your body uses to make human neurotransmitters. There's nothing woo-woo about it, nothing crazy.

It's all backed by science. But when we started putting them out, there was a lot of people that were claiming bullshit. You're selling snake oil. So we had to control these studies, and we had to and we had to pay for them at the Boston Center for Memory. We also had to make sure that we put a full 100% money back guarantee on any of the supplements where you don't have to return them, just say they didn't work for you. We're trying to make it as clean as possible. This is stuff that I use. I find benefit in it. Let's see what people think about it and let's make sure that we have studies.

But when you sell things like stickers, like there's no fucking studies on stickers. And one of the Palteros said, like when she was on Kimmel a few weeks ago and he was like, so how does this work? Eventually just came out and said, I don't know how any of this shit works. It's like, yeah, because you're selling rocks for your pussy. Does she have somebody else that doesn't maybe? And they're just unscrupulous? No.

She's a part of it? She's a CEO and she's apparently in all the meetings for it. Is she just busy reading? Reading scripts and shit? Look at this. Look at this. Anti-anxiety. Unicorn skin.

At the beach. Beauty sleep. Wait a minute. One of each vibe. One of the vibes is at the beach? Chill. It's a vibe. That's what the pre-programmed as.

That better make me. Oh, they're chilled for self-love. One of them is chilled for unicorn skin. If it's chilled for self-love, I demand an orgasm within three minutes. I don't think it works that way. Yeah, I don't think so either. It just gets you feeling good about yourself.

It doesn't get you like rocked out. But these things are like, you know, it's really weird. It's, like, I'm not a big fan of the government stepping in and, you know, regulating everything. Because I know there's a lot of supplements that actually do work. And for them to be, to get passed by the FDA, you have to go through these exhaustive tests. Clinical trials. They cost hundreds of thousands of dollars.

It's a huge thing. It takes a long time. And, I mean, here's the thing. I think that the reason I'm a fan of at least some amount of government regulation on supplements is to stop very unscrupulous claims. Because especially with some of the supplement industry, there are claims that there are certain things in a package. And after some independent testing, you'll find that some packages don't have what they claim in there.

It was something like a third of supplement packages didn't have any of the ingredients in there, or they had less of it. And I'm like, that's not good for the consumer. So I wish there was a way to regulate it a little bit better, at least. I just don't think it should be the consumer. So I wish there was a way to regulate it a little bit better, at least. I just don't think it should be the government. I think there should be some sort of an independent company that works in a very scientific way where you can hire them to test your stuff and run these tests where you can show, there's

got to be some way to show that there's no collusion, that there's no bribery, that everything's above board. But I don't know what the fuck that would be. I don't know how that would be. I'm not sure how it would work with, I mean, it's like, I know the FDA has issues. I know that drug approval definitely has issues. Like there have been drugs that have been passed that have had issues. Well, they sell fentanyl. That's all you need to know.

They sell Oxycontin and fentanyl and people are prescribing shit that takes forever for people to get off It's a massive addiction rates. It's things like fentanyl have some some very limited Purposes like I've been put on fentanyl for pre surgery before just sir. No, they put you on it just to put you out Let's get this check. Hi. I was I remember about 30 seconds, and I was told I threw up while I was under, and I don't remember. Yeah, now I know that I can't have fentanyl. But they just put you on to put you out. But that's one of very few ethical applications of fentanyl. I did my master's thesis on prescription opiate abuse trends and toxicology.

So this is a sphere that I know pretty well. I mean, it depends on like I did my master's thesis on prescription opiate abuse trends and toxicology. So this is this is a sphere that I know pretty well. But this is that's kind of one of the things with painkillers is that there's there are ethical prescribing practice with it. There are ethical ways to manage patient use of it. And then there are really horribly unethical ways that it can be prescribed and managed over time. And this is this is something that the FDA hasn't managed well. This is something that a can be prescribed and managed over time. And this is something that the FDA hasn't managed well. This is something that a lot of doctors haven't managed well. And it's like we, I mean, we started this when they were like, let's go on a marketing campaign for OxyContin. And it just kept getting worse from there. It was like, there has to be a better way to manage what we're doing right now with it.

And it's not being done yet. So, yeah, obviously, this has nothing to do with Gwyneth Paltrow. But I just think that there is some sort of an independent company or some sort of an I mean, not I keep saying business, but there's so many problems with doing that. And there's also problems with having the government do it. I just don't think they've been adequate so far. problems with having the government do it. I just don't think they've been adequate so far. And the FDA stepping in and regulating all vitamins and making, you know, they wanted to do that for a while. They wanted to call them nutraceuticals. They wanted to have prescriptions for vitamins and things along those lines. But the problem with that is I don't want to have to go to

the doctor to get multivitamins, but I do want to make sure that the multivitamins that I get are pure. Or safe. Or not just safe, but that what you read. What you're asking for. Are you looking for B12? I want to make sure I'm getting B12. The other question is, how much of a vitamin do you need? And I think that people buy vitamins indiscriminately because we really don't.

The average person doesn't need to take a multivitamin in the day if they're eating a healthy diet because you get pretty much what you need on a daily basis if you're not somebody with an absorption issue if you're not somebody with uh any like any dietary issues you're generally getting what you need out of your diet um i think people do if your diet is really healthy it's but most people do not have a really healthy diet most people are getting about what they need out of their diet like most people seriously in america it's i mean if you're we have some of the poorest, most people are getting about what they need out of their diet. Most people? Seriously.

In America? I mean, if you're- We have some of the poorest diets ever. People are just eating processed bullshit. Well, no. If you go to the doctor and get the average person, I'm guessing you eat fairly healthy. Yeah. But the average person, if they go to the doctor to see if they're deficient on anything, they're not going to be deficient on anything.

I've been deficient. I've gone and gotten my blood work done several times. I've found I have deficiencies in niacin, deficiencies in vitamin D. No, I I've been before, but that was right when I was diagnosed with celiac disease. So I was, I, I, I was deficient on a few things, but you know, that's, that's an issue with wheat and you have an issue absorbing food. Yeah. So, I mean now, well, now that I've been, it's, it was, I was at the skinniest point in my life And then I stopped eating wheat and I gained weight So because suddenly you're you're right. I kind of you know they they heal and you're able to absorb calories

I have a friend who's got a son who they was trying to figure out why he was so small He just he couldn't eat and he was never hungry and he would eat and he would get sick You're everything is miserable. Wheat. He's got a wheat allergy. He's got a corn allergy. Oh, Jesus. Everything was just making him miserable. Yeah, this poor little kid.

I mean, I got quote unquote lucky. I only got symptoms when I was an adult. And it was, you know. So you ate wheat all throughout your childhood years. No problem. No problem. And I mean, I was even overweight as a kid. So then when I was an adult, suddenly horrible symptoms showed up.

How does that work? Do they have an idea of what causes that? Celia can show up or the symptoms of it can show up. Like you always have the underlying physiology and just all of a sudden symptoms can just show up. So it's like lying dormant and then all of a sudden it becomes active. I mean, I kind of I had a bunch of health issues just kind of show up in my twenties. And I mean, I started, I'm like, all right, I got to start taking care of myself. Started going to the gym, ran a few marathons, lost a lot of weight. And like, even when I was suddenly at a healthy

weight, it was like, I couldn't stop losing weight because my, uh, my, my intestines just weren't absorbing anything. And that's not a, that's not a thing you see coming. You're like, I'm at a healthy, why isn't this stopping? And it was not good. But, you know, eventually it was funny because the gluten trend or the anti-gluten trend had already shown up. And a doctor suggested to me, well, have you tried going gluten-free? And I'm like, oh, that's a silly fad.

Three months later, diagnosed with celiac disease. I'm like, if I hadn't been so skeptical of everything. I don't think gluten-free is a fad. I don't think gluten is the best thing for your body. I think that it's okay every now and then. But I think that essentially what you're getting when you're eating processed grains is you're getting something, your body is, it's kind of alien. Your body doesn't exactly know what to do with it. Well, there doesn't seem, here's the thing, tests keep showing there doesn't seem to be a problem with gluten if you don't have celiac disease. And it's- But what does that mean by a problem with gluten if you don't have celiac disease.

But what does that mean by a problem? Is it like for optimizing your health? Is it something that you should have in your diet all the time? Or is it something that, I mean, it really does convert to sugar. Everything converts to sugar. Your body converts everything in some way, shape, or form into usable fuel. And the usable fuel is, you know, eventually glucose or NADPH. There's everything in your body gets converted to sugar when you use it for fuel.

But if you eat a piece of salmon or if you eat a bowl of pasta, there's a very different reaction to how your body absorbs these two things. Yes, this is true because all calories aren't the same. Right, they don't both get absorbed to sugar. But avoiding gluten and switching over to say uh you know all rice uh isn't you know that's not going to change uh far that all that much in your body in terms of what's in terms of the biochemical mischief unless you have a gluten allergy like that's but there are levels in sensitivities but there's there's also levels

to that too right like there's some people where it's like minorly sensitivities. But there's also levels to that too, right? Like there's some people where it's like minorly irritating and there's some people that have extreme issues with it. Well, here's at this point, and this is why I always say at this point in our scientific knowledge, because scientific knowledge can evolve and we can learn new things. You know, at one point, the thing that started off the whole gluten trend was a kind of poorly designed study where they had a small sample size of people and they designed it just to test you know gluten versus a non a diet without gluten and they came to the conclusion that about 20% of people just based on this very small study had a bad reaction to gluten now and well then these people came in saying they had stomach problems now these people it turned out they looked at it and said,

there's no, afterwards the scientists all sat back and said, why were only about 1% of people having celiac disease, and then all of a sudden 20% of people are running around like gluten's making their dick fly off. There's something up here. So they made a better designed study, and they took out common, they did kind of double blind, and then did a better designed study and they took out common, they did, you know, kind of double blind, did a better design study to say, we're going to take out all these other causes of gastrointestinal distress and we're going to try to make this double blind. And they

figured out it was the FODMAPs. It was, there were these short chain oligosaccharides that can pull water into the gut and cause some gastrointestinal distress. And it was really closer to between like one and about 5% of people that were having any issues with gluten. Now the problem is that- What was causing that though? The gastrointestinal stress in the one to 5%. So 1% is celiac disease for sure. 1%? Yeah, 1%.

Is that really what is across the board with people? 1% is celiac. Wow, that's really high. That is fairly high. Now here's the thing, That higher percent of people, that 2 to 5, here's the question. Now, they're still trying to figure out why some people seem to have an issue with gluten. Now, I could be wrong. This is just off the top of my head. It's what I remember from the study, but I've had to cite it a few times, so I think my knowledge is accurate. Feel free to fact check me out at home. But the thing with those extra percent, they're trying to figure out

why they might have an issue with gluten because they, you know, like wheat is, you know, you think of it as a carb heavy thing, right? And gluten is a protein. So that other few percentage of people, they're trying to figure out why the gluten does it because gluten is in a few other things. It's in barley, rye and rye. So what they figured out is that, or this is the going theory right now, gluten can cause a small reaction in the stomach where you produce this protein called zonulin that can cause an increase in inflammation. This seems to be, and this is what I, this has only been one study that I've read on it. It seems to be relatively new. They're still looking into it. So there's a chance that people might be in the two to 5% that can't handle it because of that.

It could be another component of the wheat, barley, rye that's causing it. But gluten in and of itself, it's not, you know, it's unless you are one of those people that has an actual reaction to it, perfectly fine. Go on to have, you know, go have a sandwich. So, but you know, if you want one, but if you want one, yeah, I, you know, I cut back my carbs pretty heavily over the last couple of years and I've had really good results with it. It's, I mean, if you're someone who's trying to build muscle, you know, it's not even just that. I just think that just, it eventually it becomes too much sugar. It's too much sugar in your body. If you're eating a lot, remember back when you used to have that food pyramid and the bottom of the food pyramid was all breads.

Yes. I mean, you know, I mean that's, it's kind of interesting cause that's like still in like Dr. Seuss books that I read to my kids. It's like, wow,

they haven't figured this out yet. Like you're not really supposed to eat that much bread and pasta. It's not supposed to be the most thing. It's, and it's fun. I think one of the funny parts of that is like, is that back in the day when that was made, I think slices of bread were much smaller. Were they? I that's part of it because i just think people didn't know as

much back then well i think that's part i think there are a few things that are going on with it one is that we're really bad at counting calories and we uh we were chit-chatting a little bit before he showed up um is that there are uh they now have a way of tracking how many calories uh people take in a day uh this drink that can, I forget exactly how it works, but you can take a drink and it will, you know, count the number of calories you've had in about the last 24 hours. And they've found, there's this drink, I forget, I forget exactly how it works. It's, I'll find, I'll shoot you the article after this, but this was, they, it was, God, I need to find this article, But it was, they could do this and they were tracking how registered dietitians versus, you know,

the average Joe would, you know, could count because they were, you know, count down how many calories you had in a day. A registered dietitian who, you know, really well trained on dietetic type stuff versus average person counting their calories. The dietitian was off by about 200 calories. Average person was off by about 500. About what they were guessing? About what they were. I mean, they were trying to. That's not too bad. 200 over, you know, several thousand, which is what most people take in a day.

But think about it. If you're trying to lose weight and you're the average person and you're off by 500 calories and that's how, and you're supposed to, you know, in the course of a week to lose one pound, you're supposed to have a 500-calorie caloric deficit. There's your deficit. It's not there anymore. So people are really bad at tracking their calories, and they're really bad at knowing what a portion size is. So one of the best ways I've seen from the personal trainers that I confer with is weighing out your food. It's much harder to make a mistake that way.

That is a good way. Another way is there's a bunch of companies, I don't have any affiliation with any of them, but there's a bunch of companies that make pre-packaged meals that are healthy. And they'll tell you exactly what the portion sizes are and exactly how many calories are in and what the nutrients are in that package. And that's a good way to do it too. So there's no guesswork. Yeah. And here's one of the other things, like I don't think carbs as in and of themselves are evil. I think you have to burn what you take in and you have to balance your carbs, your fats, your proteins, uh, and you'll be okay. And it really depends on what you're doing for exercise. And a lot of people overestimate how

much they move under or under, yeah. Overestimate how much they move, underestimate how much they eat. Uh, and like, I'm friends with a lot of people in the fitness community, a lot of, uh, weightlifters and depends on what they're doing. If they're on a bulk, their calories will go up to 3000. If they're on a cut, they're like, I'm on, they're like, I'm on poverty carbs right now. So it's like 50 carbs over the course of the day. You're talking about bodybuilders. Oh yeah. It's there. That's so unhealthy. It's so crazy that we think of that as a healthy thing. It's funny. Cause like during the, like the year when they're not training for a competition, it looks fine. And then when they're six weeks out from a competition, they're like, I have a cup of water a day. I'm like, this is not good for you.

Well, it's not good for them during the time where they're cutting and shredding. That's what I'm talking about. When you see a bodybuilder on stage and they're shredded and they have zero body fat. We get down to probably like 3% or four percent or something like that. They're dying for water. It's so unhealthy. It's like they're literally on death's door, but they look amazing. Yeah.

They're shredded. You can see every last sinew and fiber of their muscle. But that's someone who's like in a really bad place. Their kidneys are like that close to passing, to going away. It's not good. It's definitely not good for your body when they're in that performance zone. It's so weird that that's like what we really enjoy looking at though. The rest of the year though, they eat, and I mean, it's my, my trainer is a, is a bodybuilder and it's like what he has me on for,

for weight loss. Isn't that crazy? It's about 1600 calories a day, a fairly okay balance of proteins, carbs, and fats. And it's like, at first he had me on a much higher amount of carbs. I'm like, he's a bodybuilder and he's got you on a diet. Is he a dietician? No, but I've, wait, no, but I have consulted with a dietician too, because I have these, you know, these are the people I consult with for my writing. And they were like, yeah, that looks all right. You're not, you're not anything crazy. And it's like, because of my height and weight that I started with at first, he had me at 1800. I'm like, I'm not quite losing here. Uh, and he's like, let's go down another couple hundred. So it's, you know, and the way

they started out with is always, you know, your weight times 10, and then they bust up the, you know, carbs, proteins, fats from there. Um, and you know, if you need to adjust, go from, you know, go from there. And it's like, I started with lifting because And, you know, if you need to adjust, go from, you know, go from there. And it's like I started with lifting because I, you know, because I've screwed up my joints so badly from the amount of running I've done that I'm like, all right, I will try weight lifting. And it's been kind of fun. I've enjoyed, I've enjoyed learning how to deadlift. That's interesting. So you've screwed your joints up from running, but not from lifting weights? Lifting has been a little easier on my joints, actually.

Strengthening your joints, maybe? Yeah. I mean, I have a kind of a bit of a joint condition. A condition? They pop partway out of the socket. And what's that from? You're hearing all of my medical stuff. I apologize.

It's called Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome. Do you want to see it or no? You can do it? Yeah, I can pop my shoulder halfway out. Okay.'s see so most people when they stretch they stop like here right mine keep going whoa yeah but i've had like this one's had three seems like your shoulder's flexible yeah but i mean this you've had a bunch of dislocations if you can see it's popping a little bit right there but yeah it's like my hip pops part way out depending on that i can't i can't really do something that you can strengthen to keep it from happening yeah like the more weight lifting i do the less popping it does but it's been i mean this is way less bad than it

was a few months ago before like you could visibly see the pop like you can still feel it but it's there's the problem with being hyper mobile like that is your uh you leave yourself open to a lot of different injuries from uh you know from like basic movement can make something snap. And it's. Well, I think this goes back to what we were talking about when it comes to people that have back issues. is exercising my back and yoga and doing a bunch of different things, stretching and making sure that my core and my spine are very strong. And that's something that kind of gets ignored by a lot of people that have back issues. It's like one of the reasons why you probably have a back issue,

whether it's a herniated disc or a bulging disc, is that your back is not strong enough to sustain whatever load you're putting on it, whatever exercise you're doing, whatever movement you're doing that's causing it to pop out of place. The issue is most likely that you are not strong enough. And a lot of that comes from a sedentary lifestyle, comes from sitting at a desk all the time, comes from poor posture. There's a variety of different factors that are not addressed by chiropractors or by other people.

And if they are addressed by a chiropractor, well, that's one good thing that they're telling you. I mean, it still doesn't take away from where this whole thing started from. Yeah, I mean, it's not always the case that back injuries come from that. Like sometimes it's just you did, like your disc was going to degenerate. That was written into your life. was going to degenerate that was written into your life. My boyfriend did nothing to screw up his back, and just a disc started degenerating, and he was a rock climber,

and there was no known injury. It just happened. How do you know that, though? When you're talking about someone having an issue in their disc, is it from continual use? Is it because they're not stretching? Is it because they didn't have enough strength in the back? I mean, those are all really valid questions. And it's like, there's, you, you never know what, like it's, you never know what's going to be the

cause of it beforehand. That's why preventative medicine is hard, but that's why I always say, get to the gym and lift some weights. It will at least, if there, if you're someone who is prone to having a back issue, because you know, there are some people who are prone to it. What does that mean? Why would they be prone to it? Well, in my case, I have scoliosis as a part of the other stand-lows. That's a different thing. That's why I say prone to it.

But prone to disc degeneration? Why would someone be prone to that? Degenerative disc disease. I don't know if that's... Actually, I'm not sure. That's a very disputed thing. Yeah, I really don't know off the top of my head. So I don't know if that's something that you're...

If that's written to your DNA or if that's something that you injure and it just gets worse. Well, I think that's a lot of it. I think that's what I've been talking to people that work on people that have bulging discs and doctors that are, I mean, there's some new therapies they're doing for that. Now, one of the things they're doing is they're injecting stem cells directly into the discs. Yeah. It's very new and they're doing it on some fighters. Huh? Yeah. I'd love to see how that pans out. Yeah. Well, they've got some really promising results apparently. And so they've just started it within the last six to eight months. Yeah, I mean, like the biggest issue I have is that I have a, and I mean, it's not a bad enough case of scoliosis where I need surgery or a back brace.

It's just enough to be inconvenient. So it's like I'm, my big thing I'm doing is, all right, if I can lift and keep my back strong, it will stop me from having surgery eventually. And back surgery is just almost never a good thing to hear because they're always like when you fix something surgically, there are just almost always complications, especially with your back. So I'm like, if I can keep rods out of my back, I'll be very happy. Well, you know, I've had some surgeries that were very effective. I have knee reconstructions to both of my knees have been reconstructed and it turned out great. But I have had friends that have had some back issues, especially fusions, that have been a big nightmare. Yeah, that's what I'd probably end up with because like middle of my back, it just kind of goes. And I'm like, this is not something I like.

Do you do yoga? I've been told. It's funny. I love yoga. And I've been told it's not good for people with Ehlers-Danlos. So I'm like, I don't. Who have you been told that by not good for people with ehlers-danlos so i'm like i don't have been told that by uh my uh my rheumatologist and it's like that's like but i i there are still some yoga moves i do just be uh at the end of my workouts because they feel they feel great to

stretch out my back and they feel like they strengthen my core quite a bit why do they say it's bad for you because of how like i because of how hypermobile i am like it's i'll do downward dog and it doesn't even feel like it stretches me because i'm hyper because i'm so flexy to start with that doesn't make any sense but you're still strengthening all those muscles that support your spine why would that be bad i i got nothing i you can deadlift and you can't do yoga that seems ridiculous it doesn't make any sense at all welcome to a really weird disorder it's is that what it is or is it doctors that don't really exactly know what the fuck they're talking about because there's a lot of doctors you get injured and they're like well you got to stop doing

anything it's and it's a thing where it's like eller stanless is a weirdo disorder like you're basically your collagen is not able to heal itself or stay kind of in shape uh as it used to or it's okay to deadlift it's deadlift has been fine like i i got and it's okay to deadlift? Deadlift has been fine. It's partially that you're not stretching, you're strengthening, or you're I don't know how else to phrase it. You're not stretching your body into weird

positions. You're tensing everything. But there's a lot of yoga that's not stretching. It's strengthening. Like when you're standing there's a bunch of stretches, but obviously there's a lot of yoga that's not stretching. It's strengthening. Like when you're, you know, you're standing, I mean, there's a bunch of stretches, but obviously there's a bunch of things that do stretch your body out, but there's a bunch of things that are just strengthening exercise. No, it's like, here's the thing. You have an F, you have a really good point. And I don't, it's, this is just what I've been told from a doctor who in, in all honesty, I don't know how

well he knows Eller-Stanloss cause it's a rare disorder yeah well i think doctors like to say don't do that yeah it's a big thing it's when you've especially something injured don't do that and it's weird because the things they've told me to do seem so much more uh intense than yoga like what um it's i mean i've been told go ahead and bike go ahead and uh and uh deadlift go ahead and bike, go ahead and deadlift, go ahead. And for fuck's sake, they've told me I can rock climb, which is a thing. That's one of my other exercise-y things. But yoga, they've said, is off limits. Do they know yoga?

I mean, this is the problem. When people say don't do yoga, I always think they think of somebody who's bending over and touching the back of their head onto their feet. I think the reason is because they know how flexible I started at. So they think I'm going to pull something out more because of how, like how much I'll push the condition that's already there. And I think that's the concern. So the problem with someone saying don't do yoga is like, well, yoga encompasses a tremendous amount of different movements.

And it's very, it's, I find it really strengthening. Like, and I was surprised cause like I used to, I used to be kind of that runner chick who was like, I don't have time for yoga. It's boring. And then I started trying it. Um, of all people, my boyfriend tried, uh, dragged me to a yoga class with him and I, I left and I'm like, I am destroyed. That was the hardest thing I've ever fucking done. Like, Oh my God, my arms were dead afterwards. Yeah. It's very hard. Now what made you decide to write this chiropractic article and what's been the feedback from it? Oh, God. So my editor, and this is the editor that I worked with at Gawker, at Cosmo, and now she's at The Outline and I love writing there.

And we had talked about doing one on chiros for ages and we got to The Outline and it was like, what do we have on the table for next month? She like want to do kairos i'm like fuck yes i do what did what was your thoughts on it before you wrote the article before i wrote the article i knew that the guy who i knew that a lot of kairos did a lot of crazy things i knew they adjusted infants that they had claimed i knew about the vertebral subluxation theory and that that was bullshit. And I knew that a lot of them on social media were crazy. Like one of the people I reported on was Billy DeMoss. And he thinks chemtrails are real. He's a whole cluster of fucks.

No vaccinations. Oh, my God. Like it's some of the... He's a chemtrail guy, huh? That's fucking hilarious. If you're bored, go for like, go for 10 minutes and read up on billy demas he's fun um and it's just he's and it's funny because i was not i'll get into that in a minute but like we um i learned a lot doing this because i didn't realize that uh dd palmer the guy who invented it he he got most of

his information from doing seances with a dead doctor. That blew my mind. I'm like, I had to, I'm like, I know it's late and I'm a little high right now, but I had to have hallucinated that. Like, you know, read it again the next morning. I'm like, nope, that's for real. Like it was, and nobody in chiropractic questions this.

When they go to actual, you were telling me this before the show and I stopped you and said let's talk about this during the show. When you said you've talked to chiropractors that were in the middle of chiropractic school and they read about this stuff and they were like, what in the fuck? It's sort of like that did you ever see Going Clear, that Scientology documentary? Oh, that was a good one. Yeah, but

like when Haggis gets to a certain stage of the Scientology where they give him the written notes by L. Ron Hubbard and he's like, what in the fuck is this? And you're $300,000 in and you can't leave. So I got two emails from chiropractors. And it's like I couldn't put their names out publicly, but I got two emails from chiropractors and I checked in and I'm like, these are indeed chiropractors. I went to their websites. They were absolutely on the level that said they went to chiropractic school and partway through they realized it was all shit.

One of them even said they wouldn't refer people to a chiropractor. Like, it was nutty. And one of the guys, he sent me to a forum in which chiropractors bitch about the field of chiropractic. What do they say? They were like, which part of this is bullshit? Do you guys believe in the vertebral subluxation theory? And they're like, no, subluxations don't exist. Like, you know, if you want to do this ethically, just, you know, take people in who have injuries,

try to do some physical therapy, get them stronger and get them out in as few sessions as you can. So they're essentially like unlicensed physical therapists. And like, it's funny because I'll occasionally pass by a chiropractic clinic where I see them saying back injuries, work injuries, you know, sports, physical therapy. And I'm like, OK, if I ever wanted to go to a chiropractor because I'd lost my mind and couldn't find a physical therapist, that's the type I would go to. But, you know, if you ever see them advertising magic crystals and aura healing, fucking run, run. magic crystals and aura healing fucking run run like this is there are a few of them out there and i looked at one of the guys websites who emailed me and there was an faq it's like do you have to keep coming back forever no we try to get you out in as few sessions as possible i'm like oh

i have hope but like there's there's a woman who's still like the basis of it is bullshit so it's like even if you're trying to get me out as few sessions as possible. You're still like, but there was a, it's funny. There's a woman, her name is Britt Marie Hermes. She was, she went to school to be a naturopath and she graduated, became a naturopath. And she realized after a short period of time that it was all bullshit, like naturopathic doctor. And she's like, we can't actually treat people. We have to send people to real doctors.

The advice we're giving is all based on misdirection uh and complete shit and i i i'm so uh in awe of the fact that she went through this she like and these people what one of the things they said was you know i was in all this debt i figured just you know i'm like paul haggis you know i'm already here may as well keep going brit, you know, I'm like Paul Haggis, you know, I'm already here. May as well keep going. Brit said, you know, it doesn't matter. I realized I was in a profession based on bullshit. I had to leave. And you did have some people that you talked to that were chiropractors that were in the middle of it and they realized it was bullshit and they had to stay and they stayed because like, what the fuck do I do? I have to get my money back for my student loans. And I'm like, you know what? You could have gone like you weren't, you can get like,

I mean, I say this as someone who got, went into a lot of debt for my student loans. And I'm like, you know what? You could have gone, like you weren't, you can get like, I mean, I say this as someone who got, went into a lot of debt for my real degree, go and get another degree. If you're smart enough to have gotten at least your undergrad before you went to Palmer chiropractic. Do you have to have an undergrad before you go to Palmer chiropractic? I believe so, given that it's a doctorate program. Now, one of the guys that I went to undergrad with, now he was, he was smart. He had a biology degree, and he was there on scholarship. He was one of the smarter kids in the bio program. Like, he could have gotten a real doctorate if he wanted. He went to Palmer, you know, same school as some of the chiros in this article.

And it was funny. Like, my editor that I worked with on this piece asked me, so the doctors that you're concentrating on on this piece, are they the exception to the norm? Is this how regular chiropractors work? I'm like, let me go look at my friend from college's little chiropractic page. And I looked. He adjusts infants. He claims that he can stop bedwetting from adjusting a seven-year-old. I'm like, oh, my God.

I'm like, this is. And like I'm sitting here going going my god like this this guy that i went to school with who seemed you know he was smart he was like this is i was i was kind of like and i wasn't it was hard to be mad i was just disappointed in this person are they just stuck in this system i mean is that what it is there's like a bunch of people that are also doing the same thing and they just kind of get caught up in the momentum of this idea i think they hear it from a bunch of people who they think are experts like their teachers and they're they're going no this is accepted so we're going to take it it's like you know what if you like if i saw

people in science like because i i promote a lot of things that you know we might disagree on but you know i promote a lot of ideas in science that i've seen the evidence for and i've seen a lot of it like what would we disagree on um you know, some dietary things I would guess. Like, because, you know, we can hash them. Like, I don't know. What are your thoughts on GMOs? I think genetically modified foods is apparently almost everything that you buy at the supermarket. Okay, we agree on that then probably.

Every tomato you buy, every orange. If you look at a piece of corn, oh, it's organic. That shit is genetically modified. It's been modified for a hundred years. You gonna make me cry tears of happiness i've talked i had kevin folton before yeah i was so happy you had him on because he's never in california brought he we went out we went out for dinner that night he takes a lot of shit because monsanto has funded some of the studies that they've done but the studies are real and the studies have i mean you can see the results they're not manipulated yeah kevin it's it well actually you

know they funded his communication program so that he can come out and do things like this and they they never funded any of his research that's right you're right i misspoke and no no it's fine it's but you know what here's uh and this is what where he got a lot of shit was um was that he said i have nothing to do with monsanto um and like i i think if he just said you know what they fund my communication program but they don't have anything to do with my research nobody would have uh i think people still would have been mad but i think people would have been far less mad and i feel so bad that he went through everything with that because there was tricky if you do anything with monsanto it's tricky yeah i mean i just took a tour there and I got hate mail.

Yeah. Like, and it's, I mean, we were so careful because I was out there for other business and they were like, oh, you're going to be out in Missouri. Come have a tour. Like they didn't pay for it. Because of the Death Star. It's, oh yeah. And I had so much fun.

Like it was, there was, they have a lot of really cool tech there. And if you were ever in the area, they'd gladly show you around. So they were nice to me. It was funny. of really cool tech there and if you were ever in the area they'd gladly show you around so they're they're they were nice to me it was funny one of the one of the rumors that i heard about that was they only have organic food in the cafeteria i'm like i'm taking i'm taking my camera around and taking pictures of everything the word organic is such a weird word too it's like what's organic and what's not now it's like it's it's it's a very weird definition organic uses pesticides and that's something I think people see.

Does it? Yeah, absolutely. I thought that was the whole point of organic, is that you don't use pesticides. No, I'm sure there are some organic farmers that don't use any. That's possible. Let's Google this. What defines organic food? Let's find out what is the accepted definition of organic food.

Do you want to hear it from me and then from Google to see if I'm accurate? All right. So organic food works by certain farming standards or agricultural standards, and they can use certain pesticides. In most cases, these pesticides are derived from natural sources. Not always, but most of the time. And some of these pesticides include pesticides like rotenone and the pyrethrums. of the time. And some of these pesticides include pesticides like rotenone and the pyrethrums. And also, if you're familiar with BT corn, the BT toxin is also used in organic farming. Because it's a naturally occurring toxin, it can be used and sprayed topically on organic produce. So a lot

of these, the things that we think of as just conventional farming practices, definitely used in organic farming. It doesn't make it any better or worse. It just, in a lot of cases, it's a little more expensive, partially because of the certification process and partially because it uses older farming techniques that need, you know, a little more land, that type of stuff. It also uses till farming practices that, you know, digs up the ground a bit more and can release a little more CO2. So in general, I tend to... Oh, here we go. Here we go.

Simply stated, organic produce or other ingredients are grown without the use of pesticides. Synthetic fertilizer... Excuse me. Hold on. Sewage sludge, genetically modified organisms, or ionizing radiation. Animals that produce meat, poultry, eggs, and dairy products do not take antibiotics or growth hormones. Hold on.

The U.S. Hold on. Sorry. The USDA National Organic Program defines organic as follows. Organic food is produced by farmers who emphasize the use of renewable resources and the conservation of soil and water to enhance environmental quality for future generations. Organic meat, poultry, and eggs and dairy products are made from animals that are given no antibiotics or growth hormones. Organic food is produced without using most conventional pesticides.

Here we go. Fertilizers made with synthetic ingredients or sewage sludge, bioengineering, or ionizing radiation. Before a product can be labeled organic, in quotes, a government-approved certifier inspects the farm where the food is grown to make sure the farmer is following all the rules necessary to meet USDA organic standards. Now, the one thing on there that I'll disagree with with their first paragraph, as they say, without the use of pesticides,

in the second paragraph it says organic food is produced without using most conventional pesticides. You see that slight little slight of hand? Well, one of them is theirs, and the other one is USDA. Exactly. Little slight of hand there. And I mean, if I may ask, would you like to Google pesticides? Well, hold on a second.

Let's Google what pesticides can be used and still make it organic. That's exactly what I was going to request. It's organic pesticides approved for use in the U.S. Here we go. Now, what are the fears of pesticides, right? People are worried about toxins getting into their food, getting in their body, and cancer. I mean, I understand that fear partially

because I went through it quite a bit. Like when I got sick a few years ago, like my first symptom wasn't celiac disease. It wasn't my joints popping out. I got the worst headache of my life one day and it never went away. Like that, that'll make you scared to death of everything around you. Like I went organic, I went vegan, I went, I'd cut everything out of my diet because I was scared that, you know, like you get, you feel like you're getting stabbed in the eye constantly. You're going to cut everything out of your diet. And this happened all at once? One day, worst hit. And I was working and at the time

I wasn't working in the pesticide lab yet. I was working in a drug analysis lab. And you were worried that that was what was going on? That sometimes you'd absorb some of it or something? I was, well, it was, I was, um, the thing that i was worried because i was at the time i was i was there was much more side than there is here today i was there was much more of me than there is here today i was um i'm five nine and i at the time weighed almost 250 pounds i i needed to lose a little of me but it was like all right i'm eating shitty food i should probably try eating healthier but i mean never mind just more salads. I'm like, I went organic.

I just cut everything out of my diet. So there was a bunch of issues. It was dietary as well. I mean, yeah, like I cut a lot of things out, started working out everything. But you know what? I still needed medication because it turned out there was just a, it was just, I had, and we figured out the headache was linked into the Ehlers-Danlos syndrome. And there are some to clarify everything.

Some people, when they have one autoimmune, they can tend to cluster. So there's that's I was lucky caller one million. But that was that was the thing with it. But I tried, you know, I looked into this and I fell for all of it. Like so all of the the pesticides are killing you. It's the toxins. So, I mean, I understand the fear of the people who were like you it's the toxins so i mean i understand the fear of the people who were like i need to cut toxins out of my diet do is there any foundation

in truth i mean nothing like pesticides are not bad for you well no pesticides here's the thing there is a little bit of truth that sells the lie is what i will give this because i you know i used to work with bulk quantities of pesticides at my last lab and that was kind of what sealed the deal for me that these when they're in your food are not gonna hurt you because the amount of testing we had to go through and the amount of regulation I think regulation in this case is a good thing because it will stop a bad pesticide for making it to market and I want that regulation there because I eat the food too. I don't want anyone's child

to ever get hurt from something that me or another, like I don't work there anymore, but you know, that I had any work in getting on the market. I don't ever want that to be the case. Of course. But once upon a time,

the pesticides we had on the market were much less targeted to hurting the weeds and could hurt people too. Like arsenic, arsenicals, sulfuric acid, those were early pesticides, Paris green, totally toxic, especially to, to the farmers and to the even to the farm equipment, the stuff we have now, far less toxic. And I mean, people say far less, though, is it toxic? It's, I mean, I'm going to qualify this answer. And I mean, I'm not I'm not qualifying it to back off from it, but everything is toxic in some doses.

Like water. Yeah, exactly. Like if you drink too much water, it'll kill you. But I mean, so Roundup is one that people are really scared of, and it's one that a lot of people know about. Right. There is a great graph on this showing how less toxic it is than the pesticides it replaced. Because we didn't go from using no pesticide to using Roundup. And I know someone's going to correct me saying it's an herbicide, but herbicide is,

pesticide is a blanket term for all things that kill stuff in farming. So before Roundup, I believe the one we used was cyanazine. I could be wrong on this. But the one we used before Roundup was, in terms of the LD50, the lethal dose for about 50% of the population, it was 10 times higher than Roundup. And now we barely sell any of it. Right, but is the issue just lethal dose or is the issue having some sort of toxicity that affects your body, creates cancer? Right. And I understand that's a question that people keep coming back to. And part of the reason that people are suspicious of it is because of its use with the GMO.

And these things go through hundreds of tests and years of testing. And because of the suspicion with Roundup, it's gone through continual testing. They've tested to see if it accumulates in breast milk. It does not. They've tested to see if it causes cancer. Doesn't seem to. And they've tried. They've used it at higher doses. But they've done it with mice and rats, right? They've tested in humans. It's been on the market for 30 years.

How do you test it in humans? Hey, dude, I'm going to see if I can give you cancer. But I mean, like, it's been in the population or it's been used now for, I believe, 25 years. And there doesn't seem to be the only the only apparent increase in cancer is because we're living longer now. And when you have any population that lives longer, you have increased incidence of cancer. Like we're not dying from polio anymore. So we're dying from something like unfortunately, we're not going to live forever. So yeah. But so there's this but this toxicity issue when it comes to Roundup or when it comes to any sort of pesticide.

When you're talking about herbicides, herbicides are what kills the plants, right? Kills weeds. Absolutely. Pesticides kills bugs, right? Pesticides are, it's the blanket term, insecticide kills bugs. Okay. So pesticides, the whole- Blanket term, yeah.

Yeah, okay. So what's the most controversial? Is it Roundup? Roundup is controversial, and I think the reason that it became controversial is because people heard, all right, you have to genetically modify the plant so that the Roundup doesn't kill the plant, and it's this whole thing just to make money for Monsanto, and how dare you make money? And I think that was why people got mad was because of the genetic modification Lincoln

with Roundup and it's you know it's a new technology or you know it's it's one of a it's a newer technology and it kind of made people a little aware of farming for the first time and like I go to farming conferences a lot of times to talk about how to communicate agriculture and I'll sit down and ask farmers you know know, what do you plant? Why are you planting it? What do you think of GMOs? Do you use Roundup? And do you buy from people other than, do you buy from Monsanto? And do you buy from people other than Monsanto? And that handful of questions will tell me, well, I mean, if I, I wish I had more videos of this, but like there's, there's a video at some point on my site with two farmers who buy from Monsanto and buy from other companies.

And one of the reasons I asked that is because there's a rumor on the Internet that if you buy from Monsanto, you can only buy from Monsanto. Just not true that, you know, every genetically modified crop is is is, you know, just is made to be roundup ready. is made to be roundup ready. Again, not true. That people are dying of cancer from just being around roundup. And recently they found that one of the reports that went through the IARC, the place that declares things cancerous on their group 1-2, 2A, 2B cancer classifications, one of the reports was falsified that declared Roundup cancerous. Now, we also have to put that-

Falsified by who? By the person who is, I have to hunt down this report, but the person who was trying to say Roundup is cancerous. Why would they do that? Because of a little bit of suspicion of Roundup, because it's been, people have kicked around that it's causing cancer or, you know, that your spleen to turn radioactive for, you know, forever. And it's... So is this like a chemtrails type thing? A little bit. It becomes one of the things that people talk about in terms of conspiracy theories. And it just, it gets put into the public sphere so much that people start to believe it. And here's the thing. If I saw firm evidence that Roundup had caused

issues, I would say right away, just get rid of it, take it off the market. And I keep on not seeing firm evidence of it. Like one of the, there was a study, there's this group moms across or moms across America. Um, and it's, I take, I always get my scientific information from mom groups on the internet. Um, but this group, this group decided to do a breast milk study to see if Roundup accumulated in breast milk. And the way the study was done was they just had women indiscriminately send in containers of breast milk to them. And they declared like the amount of Roundup to be ridiculously high in the breast milk. And I'm like, do they just tell women to spray like pump bottles like of roundup into these containers and then test it? But it turned out, and this is just

from knowing how analytical techniques work, like I used to design the techniques by which we extracted, you know, target pesticides from a matrix and, you know, analyze them on our big overpriced machinery. But a woman who is a breast milk researcher out of the University of Washington was like, this doesn't seem right. So she designed an experiment to test if Roundup was accumulating in breast milk. And she had it verified by an independent lab. And they tested women specifically who worked in agriculture. And she had their breast milk tested

specifically on days where they were spraying roundup and there was nothing found yeah but that's someone who's not necessarily eating the food that someone was working with the food or working with roundup right it's and you would expect that if it was being sprayed well think about it this way but isn't that the issue though not to interrupt you but the issue is people eating it it's well think about it this way if it's in the food supply, wouldn't they be eating it as well? I don't know. I don't know what their diet is. If you're getting it from people's breast milk, and those people say, there's Roundup in my breast milk, and I've been eating genetically modified crops.

Well, the other question is, if these are the people that are following Moms Across America, and their whole thing is that Roundup is the devil. So you think they're falsifying evidence? I think that it was not a well-controlled experiment, and it would be interesting to see how the experiment would come out if the person who runs Moms Across America, Zen Honeycutt, how it would look if Zen were to look in on every step of the process with Dr. Shelley Maguire to see that these people ate food that should have been sprayed with Roundup and worked in the field, and then at the end to see if their breast milk came

out with nothing in it. But don't you think that there'd be more likely to be some sort of conspiratorial collusion with people that actually work in farms that use Roundup rather than someone who's just checking their breast milk? Wouldn't you think that if someone's trying to prove that Roundup isn't showing up in breast milk and you've got a bunch of people that they're living relies on using Roundup? Well, the farm workers themselves, they'd want to be safe, right? Maybe. And I say that as someone who's worked at a pesticide company. And when I worked there, I mean, I was just an analytical chemist. I'm not someone who had any investment in keeping that company safe from being yelled at.

I wanted to be safe from the stuff I was working with. Right, but I find it weird that you feel like there's some sort of conspiracy with these moms that are checking their breast milk, but you don't think there might possibly be some shenanigans involved in the people that actually need Roundup to make a living. No, I understand what you're saying, for sure. But part of the reason why I think that Dr. McGuire would have conducted a better study was, number one, independently verified. Number two, knows how to do collection, evidence, or not evidence, conducted a better study was number one independently verified uh number two knows

how to do collection uh evidence or not evidence uh specimen collection accurately and number three monitored and independently verified from an outside lab so it's like we don't have and when when moms across america was asked uh to show their data and how they collected the samples. They weren't willing to share all of their data on how specimen collection was handled. What was their excuse for not sharing? I don't recall off the top of my head, but it seems suspicious to me that they weren't willing to disclose that. That's very suspicious. When you do an experiment, everything... I used to work under GLP standards, which basically you throw out a glove, you have

to write it down. And that's part of the standards on how you get a chemical into use in agriculture is you really have to be careful and forthcoming on how you do your work. Was the amount of pesticides that they found in breast milk uniform? I believe they didn't find, I think they were only testing for Roundup and they found there to be, they didn't find there to be even trace amounts, which I was kind of surprised at. I would have expected something. I mean, in the Moms Across America stuff. They found a lot.

Yeah, but was it uniform? No. Did everybody have like a similar amount? No, they found the amounts varied and they were so high it was like it was just. Almost like somebody dripped some in there. Yeah, it was suspicious. And that's why I was like, I don't like that was why I didn't buy it. The other thing is they used a technique, an analytical technique that was used for water.

And that's why I'm like, this is not like not all techniques use for all work for all chemical matrices. Like this is not like not all techniques use for all work for all chemical matrices. So that's another reason why, you know, a different lab was probably better equipped to handle it. One specifically that analyzes breast milk. So it's I think like the other thing is, you know, that the other lab, the other lab kind of had a bias going in because their whole thing is how Roundup is bad. So a lab that's like, I just want to know if, you know, moms are being harmed, if there's something in the breast milk, that seems like a lab that, you know, went in just wanting to know. The other lab went in saying, I hate Roundup. So if, you know, I would have, if Roundup had been found in the test that Dr. McGuire's lab had done,

I would have happily accepted those results because it almost wouldn't, it would have surprised me not in the least if it had been found, but I was kind of glad that there was nothing there because it means that babies aren't getting a concentrated dose of this just because you don't want extraneous chemicals

going into the food supply. So were they only testing people that worked in these farms? Was that the idea with the second test? I think they did. I don't remember off the top of my head, but I know one of the groups they did test were women on testing days. But think about it this way. They're not just spraying it.

They're also possibly eating food that's had it on there. Yeah, but that's possibly. I would be more interested in seeing it 100% sure that these people were eating food that had been sprayed with Roundup. And that doesn't make sense to me that they didn't do that. I want to have a look at the study again myself just to be sure of what the conditions were before it. I'm curious about both tests. Have a look. We can have a quick peek after it for Dr. Shelley Maguire breast milk roundup study. Yeah, the whole thing seems a little weird to me. It's weird that one group tests high, one group tests not at all.

It is, I'm going to say, it is easy to screw up a study using, if you're not sure the parameters you're supposed to use in an analytical, in a chemical analysis thing, because you can have interfering species that come up with the same peaks at the same time. So the other thing is, like I said, the biggest thing is we don't know the collection parameters for the one that Moms Across America did. Right, and they won't tell us. Yeah, I mean, the other thing is Dr. McGuire was doing it through a university, and she could have been in a lot of trouble if she'd falsified data or done a test that was purposefully misleading. Right.

So that's... What are the pesticides? Did you Google the pesticides that are acceptable? Yeah, there's a... Can you put them up? There's a long list somewhere, but I had it somewhere. It's on the USDA.gov website. It's like the standards of what they use to put stuff on and off of it.

Okay. And there are organic standards that allow some substances, but they're mostly trying to get out synthetic substances. However, there are also some synthetic substances that are allowed, too. Interesting. And this is to label something organic. Right. And then there's a board that votes on it from time to time if somebody wants to bring something up and disagree that it shouldn't be on that list.

Isn't that weird, though? I mean, most people think you say organic. Most people think there's no pesticides. Most people think you're just growing plants. Yep, and that's, it's, and I mean, they sell that so well, don't they? Yeah. For instance,

pheromones. Pheromones. Pheromones. Oh, pheromones, not pheromones. Pheromones have long been used as effective, non-toxic ways to confuse insects. What? That might otherwise infest organic crops, especially fruit. So they put some certain smells to freak bugs out.

Likewise, vaccines for animals are important disease prevention tools against many infectious diseases, blah, blah, blah, especially since antibiotic therapy is prohibited in livestock. I'm picturing an anti-vaxxer staying away from organic produce because they vaccinated it against bees. Well, you could always grow your own food, folks, you know, and not put anything on it. But I think large scale domestic agriculture, if you're talking about these gigantic fields, nothing could be less natural. It's not normal to have a thousand acres of corn. It just doesn't exist in the wild. And when you do that, you're going to run into a lot of problems.

I always go back to the argument of nothing we're doing is natural anyway. Nothing. Not a thing. We're sitting in an air-conditioned studio in California that we'd probably be, we'd be dead with a lot of the things that we don't have that's, you know. How about food? There's no food around here. Where are you growing food?

You know, no one's growing food anywhere near us. There's nothing that we enjoy that's natural anymore. Ice cream's not natural. And it's goddamn delicious. You got to get a freezer. How do you get a freezer? I'm like, you want natural bear attacks, asteroids. Well, I think there's some.

Those little sticker things that come out of trees. Those are all natural. I thought you were going to say stickers like goop stickers. Those goops. Jesus made those himself. What's up, Dan? I found something on the company that made those stickers. I was going to bring this up a second ago.

I went to their website, and they have this thing called a digestive solution energy card. Oh, Jesus fucking Christ, Gwyneth Paltrow. Digestive solution energy card. What in the fuck is this? Now, look at this. You can now, in all caps, bold letters, boost your body energy signature, all bold. I'm not high enough for this. By simply placing this digestive solution TM

energy card under your food plate. Holy fuck! And the beverage of your choice and receive energy from the card instantly. You motherfuckers! The energy card has a magnetic strip embedded in the back that holds digitally enhanced

information that once your food or beverage comes in contact with it, the energy is delivered immediately to the food and beverage, thereby boosting the energy to your food to maximize the nutrition you consume. You fucking criminals should be in jail. You guys are monsters. Gwyneth Paltrow just broke my brain. Look at this shit.

The Digestive Energy Card. Digestive Solution Energy Card is an energetically enhanced product. What? Yeah. What the fuck? Hold on a second. Look at that sentence. The digestive solution energy card is an energetically enhanced product.

That's shit English. Our engineers have achieved the correct ratio response of frequency signatures through a technology that matches the same energy you receive from the nutrients you get from the food you eat and drink. You know this guy's wearing toe shoes when he wrote this, right? We consume food. It converts into chemical energy, which provides the nutritional needs for energy and growth. This connection is defined by the laws of thermodynamics that requires all humans

to burn food for energy. You guys are fucking cunts. What is the name of this company? This is Alpha Biocentrics. Oh, no.

Cunts are warm, lovely places. These people are assholes. That's a vagina. It's a totally different thing. Suggested retail price, $79. Oh, my God.

The card is guaranteed for two years. It looks like a credit card for anybody that's just listening. It is a credit card. I mean, it's 100% bullshit. Like a hotel room key, basically. God damn. How the fuck does someone get away with this? This is horrible.

I have no good words for this. Can you just imagine the idea that you could put a card under your food and it makes your food better? I'm trying to figure it out because they're saying it energetically enhances it. Does this mean it adds calories to it? That's nutrients. Nutrients. Whatever the fuck that is. Laws of thermodynamics.

They keep using these words. I don't think they know what they mean. Yeah, well, there's a lot of people that like to use those science-y words, right? It's like chiropractors. Yeah. Subluxation. They always say that. I remember them saying that all the time, too.

One doctor adjusted me. Five minutes, right? $140. Then he goes, make sure you drink a lot of water. I'm like, why? To wash the fucking taste out of my mouth? You asshole. You didn't do anything.

This is crazy. Wash the bullshit down. Yeah. wash the bullshit goes goes better with now what is the response been oh I mean you must have gotten a lot of a lot of swearing Oh God Twitter hey Twitter was an angry place I'm still getting angry tweets like people that use it or from chiropractors themselves fewer chiropractors chiro practice and a lot of people who who love chiropractic themselves fewer chiropractors some chiropractors and a lot of people who who love chiropractic and are mad at me because i think people think i'm calling them stupid for using chiropractic i'm like no you got you you it's not stupid they got me too they've got a lot

of us and i mean it's like i would basically be calling half my fan base uh stupid if if that were the case and i'm not and I felt kind of bad because a good friend of mine, like she, like after she gave birth, she had like a severe enough injury that she could barely walk. And a chiropractor basically from massaging the area got her up and walking. And she's like, and the thing she said to me was, I'm tired of being called a lemming moron. I'm like, I never used, number one, I never insulted people who used chiropractic. And number two, I definitely didn't use those two words. And I think people got the impression that I was calling everyone who used chiropractors dumb. And it's like, that's never the point of my writing. It's like, you're not the moron for falling for this. They're the assholes for selling

it to you. I don't even know if a lot of them are assholes. Cause I don't know if a lot of them have even looked into this. You know, I've talked to some chiropractors about this stuff that's been going on over the last couple weeks since your article and since I did my podcast, since we've talked about it several times. I just don't think they understand the origins of this. Or that the stuff they're selling isn't considered scientifically valid. Right. If you're a kid and you're getting out of high school and you're going into college and you want to get involved in something therapeutic and chiropractic medicine seems

like a good thing and you start going to chiropractic school, you might not even know. And I really do sympathize with a lot of chiropractors who are out there that have emailed me like, hey, man, what you're saying could potentially destroy my business. that have emailed me like, hey man, like what you're saying could potentially destroy my business. I understand and I sympathize, but you've got to understand that if I knew about this and I didn't talk about it, that would be more horrible. I have a responsibility if I find something out like this,

like the guy who invented it is a fucking quack and a magnetic healer and you're not really going to medical school. There's a responsibility that you have to say something about that. And I just think people are thinking about themselves. They're thinking about, you know, hey, I've got bills and hey, I've got this and I've got to practice and I've got this. Find another job. Yeah.

I don't want to be the guy that tells you what to do, but you can't get upset at someone saying something that's, if I made up the fact that chiropractic medicine was founded by a magnetic healer and a quack, who by the way was killed by his own son. Do you know the story behind that? Somehow I missed that. He was run over by his son. His son ran him over with a fucking car and they think he might've done it on purpose. And the son apparently was a fucking huge fraud.

And the son went on to be the one who promoted chiropractic medicine. It was really promoted by the son. Yeah. It's in the Wikipedia. Pull up the Wikipedia on chiropractic controversies. There's a real theory that the son murdered the dad and the son murdered the dad to take over the business. And then he's the one who pushed chiropractic medicine. I think we had to cut it off at some point because the article

was 4,000 words. Yeah, I'm sure. Right? Here we go. What do you got here, Jamie? This is Wikipedia. This is death. It says there's a book about it.

Okay, a homecoming parade. That's hilarious. Injuries by his son. Wow. Yeah, he fucking ran him over. His son ran him over. Jesus. Attempted patricide yeah oh that's uh that's fun there was speculation that it was an accident but instead wow a case of

attempted patricide hmm that's but that it was not an accident hmm Hmm. No one knows. So who knows? I mean, you're talking about some shit that went down in the 1800s or actually 1913, I guess, huh? So 1913, BJ Palmer ran over his dad, DD Palmer. DD. And yeah.

And that guy is filled with fucking problems too. If you look into him, the son, apparently the son was a massive fraud. So in a sense chiropractic medicine was founded by a quack and promoted by a fraud who might have murdered his dad oh well you know how the fuck does it get so far that's the the most stunning thing about it it's it's a thing where like it it took root before like you know like i said before real

medicine was was starting and it just it kept going like while medicine was making attempts at other things and some of them failed and some of them stayed like think about around that time was when bayer was like we have a numerical cure heroin like that right there was a lot of shit going on yeah so i mean like they were canes and coca-cola yeah like they were trying at real things and failing but at least they were they were. Cocaine was in Coca-Cola. Yeah. Yeah. Like they were trying at real things and failing, but at least they were, they were trying. Like these guys were like, Hey, we had a seance. Check this motherfucker out. And like that didn't work so well.

Without the internet, people would not have had this information. Like when I first started going to chiropractors was probably 20 years ago. No one had this information. It was, it wasn't available. No one knew. You just thought, Oh, he's a doctor. It says doctor of chiropractic. Oh, he's a guy who studied chiropractic medicine.

And I love that so many of them just say doctor and you have to dig through their website for where it eventually says chiropractor. How can you fucking call yourself a doctor if you don't go to medical school? Shouldn't there be some sort of a national standard? It's funny because a lot of them, like I, and I don't know if this should bug me or not, because like you'll see doctor somewhere and the MDs will say MD really carefully or pediatrician, although be very careful to say what type of doctor they are. If someone like now I'm very leery if I just see doctor because I'm like, all right, are they like what breed of doctor are they? Do they have a PhD? Do they have are they a chiropractor? Like if I see doctor and then I see some bullshit on their page, I'm like,

what type of doctor are they? Because like, everyone wants you to think like, or I think people just want you to think that they're a medical doctor. And that title has a lot of weight, so people will take shit advice if they see DR period in front of the name. Bill Cosby was a doctor for a while

until they took it back. Apparently people were taking some drugs from him They just didn't know it They gave an honorary doctorate doctorates are also weird, right? Cuz if you get a doctorate you can be called a doctor it could be dr Cosby but you don't have to have a ter also we need a new word for that It's someone who's got a doctorate shouldn't be a fucking doctor I go back and forth on that one because I have friends who you know have their phds and like i won't you know you you're you kind of you call them doctor and then like when i think i feel like when they email people generally in the signature line it's

you know it's you know joe schmoe phd like they're they're that makes sense yeah it's like they sign things phd in general just to not be a dick about it um but it's like it's i feel like putting doctor blank when you're a ph, it's like, I feel like it can cause some confusion. Like Dr. Laura? What's the deal with Dr. Laura? Is she a doctor? Is it Dr. Phil?

No, Dr. Phil's a doctor. He's just not a psychologist, right? I don't remember which one he was off the top of my head. I feel like there was a doctorate in there somewhere or a PhD or something. But like, there's so many of them that just don't have what they say. It's funny because, what's his face? Dr. Oz, really good cardiothoracic surgeon. Bullshitter

on TV though. Oh, he's so scary. That guy's selling miracle cures for weight loss. It's funny because since Congress told him cut the shit, he's been Fucking Congress. Imagine that. But he's still on TV. He's been less full of shit but still a little full of shit. But how does that work? How do you fill

a 45 minute TV show with complete, like, you know, just peer-reviewed science every day? It's hard. So you start bullshitting. Yeah, but way more than that. That's like shilling for bullshit. Like he's selling miracle cures. Which is so fucked up. And it's like the disappointing thing is like he was, I mean, when I say good, he was an amazingly good cardiothoracic surgeon.

And that's what's disappointing about this is he used that credibility of being such a good doctor to be such a big asshole. It's like, why? Why would you do that to people? We wanted better from you. Just don't do that. Ben Carson, the guy who's like a serious neurosurgeon, right?

Yeah. Didn't he think the earth's 10,000 years old he thinks there's grain in the fucking pyramids grain grain he was like there's grain in the pyramids maybe he's right I haven't been that's not so shocking me that someone would leave some grain behind I mean uh no it's like filled with grain is that what he thinks I think he thought they were silos they were ancient silos like it's not that they're he doesn't mean that there's like an occasional vase full of grain He means like they were silos and that's not not accurate. They were he was a young earther. It's I That might be I don't I haven't looked too much into him. I might have made that up

It's I but I mean it would nothing would surprise me with some of these people There are a lot of people who are extremely smart, but they close off just giant sections of their reasoning and understanding. It's hard to find people that are 100%, you know, very skeptical and very, you know, or critical thinkers and want to be critical thinkers in every field of their life. Like, look, I have this, I'll be really good and really critical thinking about this. But motherfucker, I have this belief and you can't touch it. And like that seems to be the case with a lot of people. I'm like, I just want evidence about things. Show me evidence.

And the big thing is show me where the balance of evidence is. Like if you give me two articles that say this and then 10,000 that say this, I'm like, I'm over here. I'm going there. And I think that's kind of a solid way to evaluate evidence. Like if you've got a lot of them that say this and they seem solid and backed by people who know what they're talking about, it just seems to be a good way to evaluate how you're going to choose your opinions on something. Yeah. I mean, it seems like you just really have to do a lot of research before you form any opinion on anything. Well, that's one of the reasons why I don't blame people when they don't get it right, right away, because do like, and this is something I'll do at some of

my talks. I'll say, you know, take out your phones and Google a term that you're not sure about in health or nutrition, Google GMOs, Google sugar, Google, you know, whatever. And, you know, tell me what the top 10 search results say. And, you know, tell me what the top 10 search results say. And, you know, sometimes like, especially with GMOs for a long time, the top like eight out of 10 search results were like, wow, this is gonna make your dick fall off. And it's like, now like it's changed a little bit because there's been a huge effort by science writers to get out the word this isn't gonna kill you. But like for a while, like how, you know, it's so many of the top search results said they were horrible.

How hard should, you know, just a soccer mom in Iowa have to hunt to figure out if this is going to kill her kids? Like, and I, that's why I really don't blame people when they get it wrong at first, because this is, there's so much bad information out there that it's easy to get the impression that, like I said, the 10,000 articles say it's bad when it's really just, you know, screaming assholes repeating, you know, the one article that say it's bad. Well, if you just Google chiropractic medicine, you're not going to get a lot of fraud articles. If you Google chiropractic is bullshit, you get your article and then you go down a rabbit

hole. And, you know, if you Google chiropractic fraud, you'll find plenty of of stuff on it and then the history of chiropractic medicine is where it really unravels yeah and it's it's hard to it's like when someone just wants to know what's going to fix my back like that's not where they start right well it's a problem i mean back problems are fucking horrible i mean that's that is a part of the problem is like people get desperate. They do not know what to do. Just like when you were saying you were getting those horrible headaches and you're like, I'll fucking try anything. Yeah. I'm going to go vegan. I'm going to go GMO free. I'm going to drink water only. I'm going to. Yeah. I gave up my beloved Diet Coke. Dark times. People

get worried. Oh, yeah. You know, you get worried and you start thinking about different ways you can. And then if someone comes along and says, look, this is the solution. Just stick with it. I need to see you twice a week. This one guy that I was going to was like, you got to come more often, buddy. That's really the way. I go, I got to get you to move my neck more often. The fuck are you doing, really?

You know? And I stopped going to him. I was going to this one guy and he had a really good massage therapist. And I was getting the massage therapy. Then I stopped getting the chiropractic adjustment. And then he was like, look, you gotta, you gotta get the chiropractic adjustment too. And I was like, I'm getting one thing is helping me. The other thing, I don't feel anything.

I just, it sounds cool. I like the sound. It's like pop, pop. That crick feels great. It feels good. Like when you do this, that feels good. But that's the same fucking thing that a chiropractor is doing to you. But then they tell you you're not supposed to do that to your fingers.

I'm like, well, why? Well, it can cause arthritis. How the fuck do you know? I've been doing it my whole life. I don't have arthritis. Well, the question is kind of like we're talking about with long-term pesticide exposure. I don't know where that's going to land me when I'm 70. I don't believe it. I don't believe that causes arthritis.

Of course when I'm 70, they're just going to throw some new drug at me and it'll be fine. My point was that you can't have it both ways. If this causes arthritis, how the fuck are you allowed to crack my neck all the time? That's an excellent point. It's one or the other. It's funny. I've had, and one person, it's funny, for all the people who messaged me, because you asked what the feedback was, feedback was it wasn't just you know chiropractors who were really mad i had some people say my parents brought me for chiropractic when i was a kid and now my back is fucked up so i mean and i don't know how many

stories there are like that from people saying you know we started chiropractic when i was a baby and this was not the way to go for me like but god some of the responses to the article baby jesus fucking christ well what is that woman who just died the playboy model or family suing the chiropractor so there are like the sudden very you know kind of violent uh way that they crack a neck in chiropractic can leave you open to uh to severing an artery in your neck now it's not often that it happens but it happens and this is one of those things that I have a really big contention with chiropractic with is that they have all these warnings about how, you know, Western medicine, and it's kind of funny that they call it Western medicine when chiropractic started in the middle of the US. It's like,

you don't get to claim that you made this in China, for fuck's sakes. But like, they'll say that Western medicine is so horrible for you. And it has all these potential side effects. And yeah, it has potential side effects. But they have potential side effects while they actually cure shit. You have potential side effects while you're cracking someone's neck. Right. When you say potential side effects, too, you're talking about 320 million people that are going to the doctor. If you have 100,000 cases of potential side effects across the board from all causes, that's what they're harping on. You're harping on the minority of things that happen and go wrong.

And then, you know, obviously there's some shit like thalidomide and some stuff that people don't use anymore that are horrible and the side effects are... Thalidomide never made it to the U.S. That's something a lot of people don't realize. Really? It was used in other countries? It was other countries. Now, we had one regulator in the U.S. who saw the drug was coming up for approval here, and she said, no, we have to look into this more. And then they saw the cases in Europe of all these infants that were being born with major side effects. And she was like, ah, told you. So that was how they started.

And this is actually what gave us one of the best acts for regulation for safety and efficacy in the U.S. And basically it said that drugs before they make it to market now have to be proven beyond a certain amount to show that they are both safe and effective. And it was basically thalidomide that launched that act, which is kind of like, we're good at learning from our mistakes. I say we like I work for it, but no, it's like, you know, we're good at learning from our mistakes when we have a fuck up like that. So, I mean, I don't know what, and what worries me is that we're going to have eventually another, we can very easily have another drug like that, but it will be something

that we haven't regulated out of the system yet. So I don't know what the next thing will be, but it'll be something that we haven't seen yet. So that's the kind of scary thing. We already know how to test for things in utero. We already know how to test for things that can cause cancer. We already know certain types of testing. But thalidomide, it was so crazy non-toxic, they couldn't get it to kill a rat. How nutty is that? It is pretty crazy what it did to babies.

Yeah, I mean, it's crazy that something that was that sick. What was the purpose of it? It was used for a lot of different things. And the thing that they gave it to mothers for was to stop morning sickness. Now, it's still used in a few treatments just don't get it anywhere near a pregnant woman so that they gave it it was really really good for let me rephrase it it was really effective at stopping morning sickness but just nobody had a clue that it was what it was causing to

you know in utero and it was you know causing you know, limbs to not be formed. It was causing all these crazy things. And tens of thousands of babies were born deformed before they went, yikes, pull the plug. Isn't there also an issue with approving drugs? Isn't there also an issue with biodiversity and that like you have issues that I don't have? And so there's going to be things that affect you that are not going to affect me and vice versa. And this is why after, and this is an interesting that happens. So it's you, you know,

as you happen with, with your neurotrope, nootropics, nootropics. Okay. Sorry. My apologies. So,

so with, so, you know, about phase three clinical trials and all that from, from that. So when you get to phase three, generally you're testing between three and 10,000 people in the population. And you've gotten through a few trials. You know that this is effective for this. So when you get to phase three, generally you're testing between three and 10,000 people in the population.

And you've gotten through a few trials. You know that this is effective for this. You want to see if people have—you're testing for allergic reactions, and you're testing to see where people are going to have issues with the drug so that when you get to market, you know that these people— like this is the percentage of people that have these side effects. This is the percentage with these. If you have these side effects, call your doctor right away. Just continue—that type of stuff. But that's three to ten thousand people you don't know who you're going to give it to that's on x medication that has x disorder on

top of the thing you're treating for that type of stuff or if it could cause someone to die these things can happen and like that's kind of what happened with Vioxx is that you know like they didn't they there were some people in that room who probably Vioxx, which just explains it was causes strokes in some folks. Yeah, it was an anti-arthritis medication. And it was like, I know a guy who got a stroke from that. Oh, wow. Yeah. Holy shit.

I mean, there were there were people in that room who probably looked at it and said, all right, so there's this risk factor that's that causes you to increase your possible risk factor by X percent. What if somebody has all of these risk factors combined? And, you know, like, well, you shouldn't approve it because there's a chance if you put it on somebody on this who has all of these combined, there's a chance that they're going to have, you know, their chances of getting a stroke or, you know, having an issue with their, what is it, heart attack from it is going to be through the roof. We shouldn't approve it. And it got approved anyway.

And it's one of those drugs that shouldn't have been put through. Was it heart attacks and strokes? I thought it was heart attacks. I know a guy who got a stroke from it. Oh, it's a blood clot. That must have been blood clots. Yeah. But yeah, it's like it shouldn't have been.

Significant issues with some folks. Yeah. And it's like there is a chance when you put any drug through. Now, they try to get through things to minimize this. But because a phase three trial only tests in, you know, a certain amount of the population, can't when you put any drug through. Now, they try to do things to minimize this, but because a phase three trial only tests in a certain amount of the population, they try to get a diverse group. When you get it out, you don't know what the possible effects are going to be on someone else. So you might see new side effects depending on the other drugs someone is on.

Because you're not prescribing these to healthy people. You're prescribing this to a sick person. So yeah, that definitely can happen. So that's why for a certain amount of time after drugs on the market they do post uh the basic though it's kind of phase four clinical trials you're doing uh post-market monitoring so that does go on for a certain amount of time and sometimes drugs are pulled uh based on the amount of side effects the other things and that doesn't happen often um but it can happen based upon you know the amount of side effects, the other things. And that doesn't happen often, but it can happen based upon, you know, the amount of issues that you see after it hits market. What are your thoughts about advertising drugs on television?

Like, ask your doctor about this. Ask your doctor. I have, I would say, mixed feelings, but most of my feelings are that it's a bad thing. And it's the only good thing I see from it. And I mean, most of my feelings about it are are that it's a bad thing. And it's the only good thing I see from it. And I mean, most of my feelings about it are still that it's a bad idea. The only good thing I see about it is that if you have a patient that's got a shitty disease to work with, they get aware that there's a new medication out to treat it. But you know where they should be getting that information? Their doctor. Exactly. So ask your doctor. But you know where they should be getting that information? Their doctor. Exactly. Ask your doctor.

Maybe you know what your doctor is if you're asking them. A drug dealer. But the problem is when they show these people holding hands and spinning around in a field of wheat and having the greatest time of their life and butterflies are flying around and puppies are magnetically drawn to them. I'm not on enough drugs for that. Well, that's the problem. They have beautiful music playing.

They're manipulating you. Yeah. I don't feel well that's the problem is like they they they have beautiful music playing they're manipulating you yeah like and it's i i don't i don't feel like that's like no it's not appropriate and it's like you know i live it's fine i lived in england for a year and when i was over there i realized i'm not like i'm like where where are all the drug advertisements like there's this is not a thing out here it's like where do you guys medicine it's and i mean medicine's free it's different it was it was there were some things that were kind of crazy about that like i landed here. It's like, where do you guys find- Socialized medicine. Medicine's free. It's different. There were some things that were kind of crazy about that. I landed in the hospital overnight once when I was there and I was so like, and I already knew that I had no co-pays when I went to a doctor. I'm like, I'm in the hospital overnight. Fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck. This is going to cost me 10 grand. When I left, they were like, did you take a cab here? I'm like,

no, why? They're like, oh, if you had, we were going to pay for it. I'm like, what? Who are you people? This is, this is, I'm an American. I don't know what to do with myself. What's going on here? Like, it was the nuttiest thing. How was the treatment though?

Is the treatment, is it the same? Like, if you go over there, because I have friends in Canada and they have massive complaints about the medical system in terms of like, if you get injured, it takes a long time. All my relatives are, I have like five relatives in this country. The rest all live in Nova Scotia. And there are, I'd say it's a mixed bag. So if you need urgent care or regular care, like you need to go to the doctor for a checkup, you need your, you know, your annuals or you have a fucking heart attack. You, I would say you have a fucking heart attack. You,

I would say you're better off living in Canada. Um, I had a little cousin that was born with basically no chambers in her heart, um, which is horrifying. Uh, you know, it's like they saw it in utero. Um, and it was like, okay, um, we're going to have to give this child an operation like almost immediately when she was born. Um, and for the next two years out a surgery, almost every like open heart surgery every year on the dot every year as the heart grows. And like we asked, you know why? Yeah, it was. And I mean, they couldn't do all the fixing because they needed to do it as a heart got bigger. And what do they do? How do they do that? It was, and I mean, I, I wish I knew all the technicalities, but you'd have to talk to a heart surgeon chamber. So what

the heart looked like? It was, I'm not exactly sure. I never saw the pictures technicalities, but you'd have to talk to a heart surgeon. No chamber. So what did the heart look like? It was, I'm not exactly sure. I never saw the pictures of it. But I mean, it's, I'll hunt down my, her father, my cousin's blog that documented it if you want to have a peek. But it was, it's a fairly rare condition. The heart was, I believe when she was born, like it was a little closer to the center of the chest. Like it's a, it was a very, like my mom said that, you know, when she held her when she was first born, like the pulsing even felt a little or sounded a little different than a normal infant's heart. Like it was, but I mean the first, at first they did a surgery that

kind of put a band around the heart to give it a little more structure. And then they formed more chambers. And then when she was three, they put in like full chambers and now she the only thing she can't do is she can't play contact sports and they paid nothing she can't play contact sports because of uh because you know possibility of of causing um i'm not sure exactly what it can do but it's you know there's it can cause a little bit too much trauma to a heart that's already been you know fair through a lot of trauma but that's the only thing that she's been told not to do so don't kick box yeah no kickboxing don't get kicked in the chest. No getting kicked in the chest. But she can run? I believe she can run.

She's a happy active little kid. Looks really healthy. She's about the same she's a twin and she's got about the same height as her brother. Why didn't they just take her to a chiropractor where they could adjust her neck and it would grow her heart better

see if you'd been there to suggest this show she'd be fine they just rubbed the back of your just a little bit of essential oil maybe she needed one of Gwyneth Paltrow's stickers one of them things the credit card just put it under her feet while she's sleeping some energy for her food I went to this one motherfucker who was treating a bunch of fighters

and he was a zone healer do you know what a zone healer is? I've never heard of it, but I'm excited now. He seemed like such a nice guy. He was a chiropractor too. He seemed like, and he probably is a nice guy, but he would press the back of your head, like little spots. And he's like, does this hurt here?

Does this hurt here? Does this hurt here? And then he would press harder. And I go, well, that one was kind of kind of hurts more and he's like well there could be an issue with you know hypothalamus or some shit like that i'm like what and so you know i'm a i'm a pretty skeptical per i've been hoodwinked before but i'm pretty skeptical and when i know that someone's pushing on a part of my head harder and then asking me that part and claiming that they can tell from the fucking skin

on your skull. The skin on your skull. Like, they can tell that this is the area. This is, oh, you've got an issue with your liver. This is the liver area when I squeeze them. It's like, no, this is the liver right there. So, me and this guy

get into it. And so I go, I mean, I'm being being respectful but i'm like what are you doing and he's like well it's called zone healing he's explaining this zone healing thing to me and i'm like what is he doing and like well it can cure all these different diseases he starts talking to me about all these different autoimmune diseases that it can cure and all these different things i go well how's it working it's like well it's just the way that i'm manipulating you in a certain way and the with the frequencies i'm like what so i'm like come on man how the fuck is this working i'm like that doesn't make

any sense and so then we get to it and he's like you understand the placebo effect right and i go yeah well the placebo effect is you give someone a sugar pill you tell them it's medicine and somehow another it magically heals them right and he's like yeah and he's like well this is essentially what we're doing i go so you're bullshitting and you're letting these people's bodies heal themselves he goes i wouldn't put it that way of course you wouldn't put it that way because you're charging money for this i go you're saying that what you're doing doesn't really do anything he goes but it does i go it does he goes if you believe in it it does i go jesus fucking christ i don't have to believe in penicillin okay exactly but that's it was so disturbing to me because I knew a bunch of guys who had gone to them.

And they're like, oh, this guy's fixing my knee. And I was like, what? He's fixing your knee? By adjusting your neck, he's fixing your knee? He's not fixing your knee. Your knee is getting healed because you're taking time off. People heal. You know the body knows how to heal.

I want a reflexologist mechanic for my car. I want someone to start. What's a reflexologist? The same thing as where they say that it's not just that they're messing with your feet. They're giving you a reflexology massage where they tap on certain parts of your feet and they say it's healing

your liver. So give me a reflexologist mechanic so that they're tapping on my tires and it's like, no, no, no, I'm working on your radiator. I want to see that. Okay, I'm not aware of reflexology. I've seen those places where they show like a chart of the feet. And it looks, it might as well be a fucking palm reader. Yeah.

You're walking by and they have one of those neon signs. Oh, yeah. And so they, what do they do? They say that by tapping on certain, like this part, the arch is really your liver and your toes are really. Oh, yeah. Your arch is your liver. I'm not sure. Like, I'm just, but like that's, they think certain parts. So it's the same kind of shit. Oh, is that really? Oh, yeah. Your arch is your liver. I'm not sure. Like, I'm just, but like that's, they think certain parts.

So it's the same kind of shit. Oh, yeah. But like I said, give me, give me like the chiropractic, you know, reflexologist of the mechanic world. I want them to start tapping on my oil tank and say, oh, really? I'm fixing your alternator. Like, like none of, nobody does this shit for cars because you know why your car won't run.

There's a real problem with people saying they know things that they don't really know. And I think people get really upset by it. And I think it's one of the reasons why it's so important to be honest about what you actually know and what you don't actually know. You know, I think that to me is like the most important currency. Like you should never give up how you honestly feel and what you honestly think and what you honestly know about something. And so as soon as you are a fucking astrologer or a card reader or a palm reader or a psychic, you're a bullshit artist. And the reason you exist is because we can't really read minds. Because if I could know that you don't really know that, if I could see a little turkey tester pop up in your head,

well, I know you're full of shit. Like, oh, your fucking tester popped up, homie. It's like the way you I think if anyone out there, because I'm guessing your audience doesn't have a lot of people who believe in psychics. But if anyone. I'm sure they do. If anyone out there truly believes in a psychic, walk into one. And when they ask you your name, just walk right the fuck back out. Because if they were a real psychic, they would know you were coming and they would know your name yeah maybe they weren't paying attention

maybe they want to check to see if you're lying my name is fred like okay mark just walk right in walk right in give them a false story and see if they check it i have a friend who went to a psychic and he's like dude this guy knew all about my grandma i'm like don't you know about your grandma the fuck are you talking about man like she was she was an old lady and she was grandma like and she cooks things that you like see i know about your grandma too motherfucker well they give you miss they give you these leading questions and then you give them information they're really good at reading do you know banachek is oh yeah it's a i'm friends with the pennanteller oh okay love those guys it's there it's it's funny because i

learned a lot of my writing style kind of from that. And it was funny. There was a night backstage after the show once where I was talking about what I was doing with the SciBabe writing with Teller. And one of the things he said was about getting the script back for the chiropractic episode. And they have to be really careful with how they wrote the episodes of oh bullshit when they did bullshit what a great show that was and it was funny because like i i turned into a skeptic from watching that show uh and it's you've it was just great because like i you know obviously never heard teller talk before i got to you know know that group and it was like that was that was

the first time because i had to chat up with Teller a little bit before because I got to know Penn first. And hearing Teller describe like after I started, you know, doing the Cybabe thing, chit chatting with him about that, I got a little insight into his brain. He's like, yeah, we got the script back from legal. And they said, just call the chiropractors motherfuckers. I was like, I'm like inside. I'm like, I got to keep my composition. But my Lord, that was like hearing Teller say motherfuckers. That's hilarious. That sounds like something Penn would say too.

These motherfuckers. It's, there's basically everything you hear in Penn's tone of voice. You have to hear it in this tone of voice. I love that guy. It's, he's, I've learned a lot about, I've learned a lot about skepticking responsibly from him. And one of the things I've always taken away is don't blame the victim. And that's something I've kept with me and I'll always keep with me.

He's been a big influence on my work and it's been helpful. Yeah. I mean, we've all been hoodwinked. I mean, at some stage of your life, whether it's your parents telling you about Santa Claus or something along the way, we've been tricked. And it's not your fault that you got tricked. Man, sometimes it's not even the fault of the person's tricking you if they're being sincere and they're just misinformed and they don't understand that what they're doing is actually harmful. Yep.

And then they fight for their cause. Like they have this thing that they do, whether it's chiropractic or whether it's being an astrologer or whatever. Then they like they dig in and they defend their turf. Yeah. I apologize for interrupting. You were saying about Banachek. It's if you were about to go into when they fooled people with their fake site, with the fake psychic.

No, how good he is at reading people. We had him on. I did a show called Joe Rogan questions everything. And Banachek was one of the episodes where he was explaining to me how they do cold reading. Oh, yeah. And explaining to me how they lead people into giving him enough information that he can form a reasonable assessment of who they are. And then he would answer certain, ask certain leading questions. And he's like, I've just done this so many times.

I know how to get, and people are shocked and they don't know what to do. And they've just done this so many times i know how to get and people are shocked and they don't know what to do and they've never done this before so you know it's like you can ask them questions and they start giving you information and like your parents were divorced when you were young like how do you know because it's because you said it it's so common first of all and you know you could read certain things from people and i mean he showed us a bunch of shit that he does like the spoon bending thing, he showed us a bunch of shit that he does, like the spoon bending thing. Oh yeah.

You know, a bunch of different things that people want you to think that it's magic. And it's, and it's funny cause there's a big crossover with the magician community and the skeptic community. And it's because they know how easy it is to trick the fuck out of people. And I, I kind of love that.

It's kind of, it's been interesting to see this group of entertainers that people think of as goofballs Be this kind of a little bit of a bastion of intellectualism Because I like that it's hard to get people to pay attention to anything on the internet But if you make it funny and you add a dick joke suddenly people are like I gotta learn about this right Well, that's why Penn and Teller I think are so important because they were the first Magicians who were really adamant that what they're doing is bullshit. Yeah.

They were like, nope, we're tricking you. And they used that word trick, and I like that. Yeah, we're tricking you. We're really good at it. It's still going to be awesome. You're still going to watch it and have a great time. And they were totally up front. They're like, no, there's no magic.

We're motherfucking tricking you. Their shows, god damn, those shows were hilarious. Some of those bullshit shows where they catch people and the nonsense that they're promoting and pushing. One of my favorite ones is there was an episode

where they attacked organic food and they did, and this is this thing where people double down on things. They took a banana, cut it in half, and it was, I believe, a conventionally grown banana and on one plate they'd say it was an organic banana. The other plate half, and it was, I believe, a conventionally grown banana. And on one plate, they'd say it was an organic banana.

The other plate, they'd say it was organic. The other plate, conventionally grown. And have people take a bite out of each one. And people, you know, they'd sit there describing the organic banana as creamy and sweet and tastes like a banana should taste. And the conventionally grown, yeah, it's really bland and it doesn't taste good. And this one girl, after they explained, to quote Penn, it's really bland and it doesn't taste good. And this one girl, after they explained,

to quote Penn, it's the same fucking banana. And this one girl afterwards, she's like, I don't know if it makes me question my opinion of organic versus conventional. It really makes me question the concept of the banana.

I'm like, oh girl, you're going to waste so much money. I like how you do a dumb girl voice. You can pull that off. Natasha Lugero got money. I like how you do a dumb girl voice. You can pull that off. Natasha Lugero got mad at me yesterday when I did the dumb girl voice. Well, it's a skill. It's one of the skills I bring to the table.

You can get away with it, though. Girls can get away with it. I thought I did an okay impression of Penn, but no. No, it's pretty good. Yeah. Enough yelling! No, it's just good. Oh, yeah. Enough yelling! No, it's just enough attempting to destroy my vocal cords will produce a pen impression almost. Well, I think it's a unique time for exposing bullshit.

You know, because there's enough articles and videos. There's enough, like, you can kind of get a sense. Like, oh, I see a pattern here. There's a lot of people. I think people are tired of not knowing what's real on the Internet. And it's partially like this whole trend with fake news. And like there there's kind of a breaking point, I think, in terms of what people are willing to accept for just shit being spewed on the Internet and being accepted as real. Because there's so much content out there and people want to spend their time reading stuff that's for real and that they can trust.

And they don't want to trust shitty sources, you know, like they want to go, all right, here's a source I can trust. I can keep going back to this website. I can get good information. And they want things explained that they know was researched well. they want things explained that they know was researched well. And I think that this is a valuable good to offer out to people saying, you know, here's something real and here's a dick joke to read while you're reading something real. So I aim for a good dick joke to research ratio. I think that's important as well. Now, when you did this article and, you know, you said it was 4,000 words, it's a particularly long article. What did you have to omit?

I mean, it seems like, I mean, when you're dealing with 4,000 words, I mean, was it just the comprehensive coverage on why chiropractic medicine is bullshit? Or is it just like, like, God damn, I got to keep this thing as tight as I can, but there's so much to talk about. Well, I was going to joke. Well, I do get paid by the word. No. Well, that's true but it wasn't like i never go into it going let's make it as long as i can or make it as short as i can we like um i'm a contributing writer at the outline now um and this is and it's whenever we write a piece it's always let's make it cover the topic in as entertaining and as cohesive of a story as possible.

And we'll go for, let's go, we kind of say, what points do we want to cover in this piece? And sometimes it's, and it's basically to tell a good story. And my goal whenever I write an article on something is, let's write the best, let's write a piece so that I never have to cover this topic again. And with chiropractic, like I could, one thing I would have liked to have covered if somehow we could have made it like either, you know, if somehow we could have condensed it a little

so we could have fit something else in, I would have maybe added in a piece on are there science-based chiropractors? Is that possible? But is it possible to be a science-based card reader? Yeah, I mean, that's the problem. I feel like we tried to present one point of view while still giving a hat to... We included a link on some chiropractors that are showing that they're trying to be science-based. So I think that adding in a whole section on it would have maybe diminished from the point of view of it. So making it good reading and a cohesive point of view is always

important to the article. But let me stop you there. When you say chiropractor science-based, if it was bullshit when it started, if it was something that was created by a magnetic healer, it was a nonsense thing that came from a seance. How does that ever become science-based if the original, the origin, it's not based on medical research where they figured out that if you do this, look, here's all the studies that we've shown. When you do this, this is the immune system response that the body has to your, and there's none of that, right? It doesn't exist. Well, there is, there is some, and it's some minor evidence. But subjective pain relief.

Yeah. And I don't want to diminish. And this is something that I'm sure people are sitting there like with daggers still mad at us for saying, you know, for questioning their their subjective experiences. I don't want to tell people that they did not feel relief from what they because pain is it's really subjective and it's hard to manage. Sure. So I think that there are chiropractors who aim specifically to relieve low back pain. And I mean, I think if you aim just to do that with your chiropractic practice while still telling people, look, I'm just doing this while you go to physical therapy. You should still be going to a physical therapist. This is an adjunctive thing solely to relieve pain. And they try to see how it can just relieve pain

i think it's possible that that can do it but i think that adding that into the article takes away from it a bit because that's that's not part of the article's point of view and it's also not part of my point of view of how it's not a science-based practice so i think that and i mean i've seen some ethical chiropractors. There's Sam Homola. I'm not sure how to pronounce his name. I've never heard it said out loud before. But that was one of the chiropractors who I cited in there who, you know, he's continued to practice while speaking out against the chiropractic, very vocally speaking out against chiropractic as a whole, because he's seen that it can, you know, and there is some evidence.

But is he still manipulating backs? He is. But what is going on there? What does that do? whole because he's seen that it can you know and there is some still manipulating back he is but he's what is going on there what is what does that do and that's one of the things where i feel like i'm in a gray area because i don't want to diminish the people who have said that it's helped them have pain relief but i also think these people should be going to um you know to a uh you know to a physical therapist and to a massage therapist. So like, I'm not sure what the I'm not sure what the exact right answer is on that. If someone says, I've been to a physical therapist, I've been to a massage therapist, and this is the only thing that's ever made it feel

better. And I went in one session, what do you say? Like, and I, I don't know where the exact right answer is to that. I don't know either. but if it all started from bullshit, it seems so hard if the foundation is bullshit. I went to a guy that was really good at a bunch of other stuff. He would give you EMS, electrical muscular stimulation, put those pads on, and cold laser. He had really good massage therapists. He provided physical therapy. He had a little gym set up. But at the end of the day, he's still cracking backs. Well, here's a question. What if, and this this is i get it this is completely a hypothetical what if it hadn't been started by this nut job by gndekiller and it was a doctor who said oh this can you know this can help and if it was a just an osteopath who is trying to see if this could help relieve

pain along with physical therapy so i i encourage people if they're if they are looking for a way that manipulation can help, maybe not go to a chiropractor, but seek out in your medical practice an osteopath who can who knows much more about anatomy. And please keep going to a physical therapist and maybe a massage therapist because massages feel fucking great. because massages feel fucking great. Yeah, they do. It's just, it's so hard to say that, you know, there's like science-based ones when it all started out with bullshit. Like, you know, it's going to be, it will be very hard for you to find a, you know,

quote unquote, science-based chiropractor. Please, if you're, you know, if the only thing that's relieving your back pain, and I get it, I have, you know, I have scoliosis, back pain issues are very hard to manage. You know, an osteopath will understand your anatomy much better. They're not going to say you have to come back in three times a week. They're going to send you to a physical therapist and, you know, maybe recommend a massage,

but they'll do it in an ethical fashion and not overstep their reach. But that's, you know, there is some evidence that it helps with lower back pain, but not more than physical therapy or massage. And that's, I think, what people should take away from this. I'm not saying it can't do anything. I'm saying it's not the best thing. And that's also a problem because most chiropractors also incorporate massage. And it's so hard to decide like what what is helping you? Yeah. And I mean, that's like I think it's and I get it like I'm I don't want to. I think the hardest part is telling people that their subjective experience is wrong. That's like you don't I don't want to be that asshole.

I don't think necessarily you're saying it's wrong, but you're saying reevaluate what the root cause. Exactly. Yeah. And it's like I get I mean, it's like if you went to a chiropractor, you're not stupid, you're not wrong, you're not a moron. You're, you know, you're someone who's suffering.

And I, both of us understand that. It's just, you know, make sure you're not being, that the person who's selling to you isn't selling a line. They're not telling you they can fix your immune system and cure your baby to the point where it doesn't need vaccinations. Please don't let someone do that to you.

That's so stunning that they're doing that. Measles is a real thing. So is chicken pox, mumps, polio, all of it. So is whooping cough. And this is kind of a, like, have, did you, it's, have you ever gotten whooping cough? No. I heard it's horrible. I got it as an adult.

Because this is kind of, this is kind of shitty. They do need to make a new whooping cough? No. I've heard it's horrible. I got it as an adult. Because this is kind of shitty. They do need to make a new whooping cough vaccine. That is not a reason not to get it. Please get it. Please re-up it. But the whooping cough vaccine, when they made it, some strains of it wore off faster than was originally expected. Somebody came into my lab. And we were given, you know, along with our

packages working two labs ago at a drug testing lab, we were given health insurance. And it was around the time of the first Obamacare debate, you know, when people were all like, I don't need to buy healthcare. And one of the guys in the lab who was all, why should I get healthcare? I'm healthy. He showed up with whooping cough. And for two weeks, we didn't know he had it. He was just sick. And everyone's like, Craig, go to the doctor. Craig, go to the doctor. Craig, go to the doctor. Five of us got whooping cough. From one guy?

From one guy. Did you ever let him hear the end of it? Fucking Craig. It's fucking Craig, man. Fucking Craig. I was out of work. We all had to stay out of work for five days, all of us who had it. And I'm like, and within the course of a month, and this was just bad luck.

Within the course of a month, I had had hip surgery, tore a, tore a ligament to my hip, running an ultra marathon. Never, don't, don't run an ultra marathon. It's a bad idea. Was hit in a car accident and got whooping cough. Wait, that was six weeks. So I'm like, I had no vacation time left to miss work. And I was out because somebody coughed on me. I have a buddy of mine who runs ultra marathons all the time. I didn't realize at the time that I had a joint disorder. Yeah. Well, don't run them if you have a joint disorder.

Don't run them if you don't build up to them too, right? Oh, no. You need to train. I mean, I trained properly. I just, I didn't realize. I'm like, my hip is hurting. And I went to my surgeon and this is something that chiropractic does yell about in the pain care system and in the medical system that they have a point about. Doctors do throw pills at you haphazardly.

My doctor, and I'm never going to not be mad about this. My doctor, instead of saying we should do a scan with contrast to see what's going on because you're really complaining about this, chucked me a bottle of Vicodin and said go ahead and run. Yeah. Wow. What's your doctor's name? Oh yeah. I'm not going to say, uh, because you know, it's like, it's, there was that part of me that was really happy that I got to do my ultra, but God damn it. If you need Vicodin to run a marathon, don't do it. Dr. Vicodin. Oh yeah. It's, I mean, don't, don't do that. But I mean, it was funny cause after I ran it, I'm like, all right, I don't need to take the medication anymore because I'm not running. And suddenly I realized how fucked up my hip was.

And it was like, oh, my God, I can barely walk. What was wrong with the hip? You tore a ligament? I tore my labrum. Oh, Jesus. Did you have to get that tightened up? I don't even remember. Stitch it up?

All I have are like two little scars because it was such an easy surgery that the day of surgery, it felt less bad than it did the day before. Wow. And it was the week that I turned 29. I'm like, it's turning 29 and already I'm getting hip surgery. I'm like, this was, yeah. So that was my, all of my surgeries have been on. I'm pretty sure my parents dropped me as a baby and just won't admit to it because my headache left side three surgeries on my left shoulder surgery on my left hip i'm like you're right-handed it's i'm i'm right-handed but i'm a little because you're doing everything with

your right side your left side's atrophying kind of ambidextrous i'm sure one of my friends is an archery instructor and i'm learning how to how to shoot bows and arrows you know just in just in case the revolution come no not really uh but it's i's, I'm off. I shoot with my bow hand. My strong hand is my left hand. And I'm like, I'm dominant on my left eye. So you pull back your left eye dominant? Pull back on the, wait, which one gets? You pull back on the left if you're left eye dominant.

Yeah, pull back on the left. And my right arm keeps getting bruised like crazy. And I have to keep explaining to people that I'm not getting hit. Because you're slapping the skin with this string? Yeah, slapping with this one. Yeah, you need better form yeah it's like anna keeps on going why don't you put one of those wrist things on or those

forearm things i have one and it's the worst this is the worst thing that happens because like all i have to do is go like this to get my arm out of the way and instead the couple of this is the worst is when the string catches right here and this giant bruise right there are you using a compound bow or a traditional bow? I think it's a long bow. I don't know off the top. It doesn't have cams in it like these big? No, it's a fairly simple starter bow.

My friend Anna, she knows all the things we're doing. It's like I just kind of show up and I'm like, please let me not kill myself. So it's a thing where it's like, it's a lot of fun and I'm loving the crap out of it. It's great, great workout, especially for your lats and your upper shoulders. But it's like, dear God,

I'm still clueless at what I'm doing. It's funny because like, she's won a few tournaments. She knows what she's doing. I'd gone shooting with her a few times. Then we went out and my boyfriend came with us and like, he's hitting bullseyes right away.

I'm like, I'm like, how are you fucking kidding me? He just naturally great at it. I'm like, but I'm like, I still have meditation. Oh yeah.

It's just, you're just, you're sitting there going, who, who do I want to pretend is in the tartan? But it's like, what'd you do? Really?

No, not at all. I'm not, I'm not an angry person. Like it's, it's funny. I put all my, all of my rage goes into my writing. And like, that's, that's like all of the, really? No, not at all. I'm not an angry person. Like, it's funny. I put all my, all of my rage goes into my writing.

And, like, that's, that's, like, all of the, I'm, like, anger, daddy issues all the times that I didn't, like, why didn't, why didn't this work? God damn it! All the anger goes into the writing. Like, the archery is just meditative. Like, it's relaxing. It's like you're out on an open field. There's, it's like, it's a really nice little archery range up in Glendale. Oh, yeah, I know where that is.

Yeah. Yeah, I feel like it's one of those things where when you're doing it, it requires so much focus. It kind of drains you of distractions. Yeah, you're just funny. Here's my nerdy moments. Whenever we walk from the car to the range, I turn on superhero soundtracks and just walk out there. I'm like, I can feel like a... Superhero soundtracks? It's the to deadpool while we're walking out there i'm like

i'm like now i can i can feel slightly like a badass for five seconds okay before i go back to my life as a writer well thank you for your writing thank you for writing that article on chiropractors being bullshit i'm sorry chiropractors who are listening to this are fuming and angry they're they're gonna hate me it's okay well i mean everything you said is right though the real problem is what you did was you know you expose something it's the one thing and i keep waiting for this there you know there was the one article where somebody called me a sith lord and i'm like they and they gave a bunch of that uh because the article was written by chiropractor i don't remember i think it was somebody who had went to one and they said only a Sith deals in absolutes I'm like I'm like I'm part of the rebellion um but no they uh that's so stupid

it's but they were nerd out I I am a nerd and I'm okay yeah I'm nerd too but that's that's so like that's such a nerd out way to fucking criticize someone. It's, I mean, if you're calling me a Sith Lord, I have that in my Twitter profile now. I'm like a legend Sith Lord, bring it on. You ran with it. It's I'm, I'm like, you know, if you're, I'm like, after all the insults that people have thrown, I found an article written about me once. And this was beautiful that I said that I was, uh, that, that I was on, um, I was a big pharma shill because I admitted to taking medication for my headache.

I'm like, I don't think I'm a shill. I think I'm a customer. They have the relationship backwards. You can't read everything. But no, I can't fight the internet. And you definitely can't talk about everything that you read. You'll go crazy. No.

Thank you. What's the correct pronunciation of your name? Yvette D'Entremont. D'Entremont? D'Entremont. Say it one more time. D'Entremont? D'Entremont. D'Entremont. There you go. Yvette D'Entremont. D'Entremont? D'Entremont. Say it one more time. D'Entremont? D'Entremont.

D'Entremont. There you go. Yvette D'Entremont. No one here is scary. There we go. All right. Thank you so much for having me. My pleasure.

See you guys and girls and non-binary folks.