The Joe Rogan Experience - JRE MMA Show #121 with Bobby Green

Episode Date: April 13, 2022

Joe is joined by Bobby Green, a mixed martial artist currently competing in the Lightweight division for the UFC.

The Joe Rogan Experience. Train by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day. I've been a fan ever since. That's my preferred method. Now, blunt. What kind of blunt? Well, he was using Swisher Sweets. There we go.

I believe. There we go. I figured you'd say so. And when I first started smoking, I was a Swisher guy. I get the little grape Swishers and little flavors and stuff like that. But as it got more efficient in smoking, I started stepping, taking little steps here and trying this and trying those wraps and trying these things.

Like a chef. Yeah. Like a chef experiments with new spices. So now I'm going to kick you to a backwood, okay? Okay. I've had backwood. Okay. Yeah, you know, there's companies that roll.

Nick from Foundation Cigar sent me some papers. It's like they use like real, that's it right there. Thank you, sir. This stuff right here. This is where you don't have to destroy a cigar. They just give you the actual leaf. Yeah, I know. I see everybody coming out with those now. Because a lot of people, they do it.

They realize that we're not even fucking using the fucking tobacco. I bet that's a giant percentage of the amount of, right? There's another company called Pom Pom, and they came out because Swisher had to create a lower company because no one was smoking their tobacco. They're just taking it and dumping it in the trash. They're like, oh,

well, we're not even going to smoke our tobacco. We're going to put cheaper tobacco in here and sell it for these, for the people that are doing those things,

you know? That makes sense. Why put good tobacco in if 90% of the people are throwing it out? You want to try this? Oh, fuck it,

I'm down. Let's try it. Fuck it. Because I feel like this dude keeps sending me and they're, oh, it's fresh.

Let me see what's going on with over here. Oh my goodness, look at this, look at this. And it's natural. Let me see what's going on with over here. Oh, my goodness. Look at this. Look at this. It's natural? Look at this. I like the natural leaves.

That is the real shit. That's what I don't like about the whole. Oh, see, we need scissors for this. This is a whole lot of leaves. We might need. Holy shit. Oh, my goodness. We might need a knife.

Oh, yeah. He gave you a couple leaves. Look at that. You ever heard of a gaba leaf? Yes. That's what those remind me of, gaba leaves. Oh, that smells so good. Let me check it out.

Let me check it out. Jamie's got a knife. Hold on. Okay, okay. It smells nice to you. It smells like... It does, right? You don't smell nice?

I don't want to even say what it smells like to me. You don't like tobacco smell? I love tobacco smell. I do, too. I do when it burns. Like, for instance, I like these honey blunts. You know, the flavor of the honey. This smells great. I love a good cigar,unts. You know, the flavor of the honey. This smells great.

I love a good cigar, though. I really do. I love the smell. And this is, I don't know if this is the same company that Foundation Cigars uses. It says, they use funky font where you can't really read it. Let me see what's going on here. I think it says Fronto. See, a Fronto, yeah. Fronto King. Yeah, yeaho yeah yeah so that's what reminds me of fronto leaf uh there's frontos there's gabas

oh really yeah so you're uh aficionado that's what i said i was getting oh i was trying to get oh i was like hey trying to find my little lane you know right right right shit i do i i fuck i fight and i smoke a lot of weed. Those are things I do really well. Oh, yeah. Fuck yeah. Luis Gomez can roll a hell of a blunt, too. Gomez.

Gomez is so familiar. It's a real thing, like, to have that skill. I'm not even good at rolling joints. Oh, yeah, brother. I'm so spoiled. I buy too many joints. I get so mad sometimes with some of my friends because I'm like, oh, you're going to fuck it up, you know? Especially these things.

They're like 10 bucks a pack. Right, right. You fuck them oh, you're going to fuck it up, you know? Especially these things. They're like $10 a pack. Right, right. You fuck them up, you're right back at the store. Yep. You know? Spending so much money on that type of shit. So, let's see how this goes. So, Bobby.

I want to talk about the old days. I want to talk about everything. I want to talk about the old days. I'll talk about whatever you want to talk about. You know? But, like, I seen you way back. I don't even know if you remember. I remember we hung out at the Ice House. You remember? Yeah, Pasadena.

Fuck yeah, okay. Bro, that was more than 10 years ago. You fucking remember. You got a great memory. Yeah, we hung out. Yeah, okay. Fun, fun times. So I'm gonna ask you this then. That was like, when was that? That was when I was in Strikeforce. I waited in line to meet you. I'm like, hey, Joe, I'm a big fan.

I'm like, yeah, I'm Bobby Green. You're like, you didn't recognize my face, which nobody does, because I don't know what it is. I just changed my look, and I've got the bolts on my face. When I see fighters, I associate everybody in shorts with no shirt on, with gloves on. That's how I remember you. You don't see a lot of guys out on the street, and then you go, oh, Bobby. That's how I remember you. Like, you don't see a lot of guys, like, out on the street,

and then you go, oh, Bobby! Like, that happens all the time to me. I run into a guy, and I'm like, why do I know this dude? Like, oh, I fucking commentated his fights. Yeah, me and a friend of ours, we would go to all your little shows in the ice house and kind of support. I'm not going to use that leaf for this one.

Okay. Because I don't know how to cut it exactly, and I don't want to fuck him up. No worries. Yeah, that ice house is a great spot. But yeah, no, I remember I was hanging out there. You killed it the first night, brother. That's fun.

You came through, you killed it. You told the story about, I think it's Mark Hunt. And he's stealing a woman. He takes his country girls at a hotel or something. You know what I mean? And another girl's like. No, no, no, Mark Coleman. Mark Coleman.

There we go. Mark Coleman. Yeah, let's not mention that story because I kind of never told anybody it was about Mark. Everybody just assumed. Whoops. Holy shit. So, yeah, growing up in those times, like, I feel like the fighters now these days, they don't know what it was like for us coming up in interesting ways. Like, the different things we had to go through.

Like, for instance, when I got into MMA, it was still like unheard of type of thing you know like you don't have a gym you can just go to and train what year was your first fight i have no fucking idea i was 21 years old i've had a girl i'm 35 so let's do that math 14 14 years yeah 14 years is 22, so fucking 2008? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I think I saw you at the Ice House. It was after that, right?

So it must have been 2010-ish because we were doing the podcast at the Ice House back then, so I think it was 2010. Wow. Damn, that's a long time ago. I have a terrible memory. I spoke too much weed to remember shit like that weed i don't know if that's bad for your memory because my memory is good sometimes that's what's weird in the head a lot one of the two that's an issue i love the sport there's nothing like it the strike force days were interesting

right because it's like it was uh there was elite fighters but it wasn't getting quite the coverage that it deserved yeah you know i mean there was some great fights like it wasn't getting quite the coverage that it deserved. You know, I mean, there was some great fights like, my God, like that was the Nick Diaz era. I was going to say that. That was the real era of the Diaz's where they were really like, do you remember the fucking fight with Mayhem where they fucking got in a fight after the shit? These things happen in MMA. It was going down back in the days, you know. They really set that precedent for like, hey, don't fuck with us, you know?

Yeah. We will set this bitch off. That was a wilder time of fighting. It was, you know, the sponsors were all like Bob's Auto Shop and shit. Yes, yes. Do you remember Shad Smith? Shad Smith. Yeah, I do remember Shad Smith.

That was my first coach. No kidding. First coach. Wow. I didn't know anything about MMA. I saw first coach. No kidding. First coach. Wow. I didn't know anything about MMA. I saw felony fights. You know what felony fights is?

Yes. He was on there. Didn't Shad Smith fight Dwayne Ludwig in King of the Cage? He is fighting everybody, brother. He's fighting everybody from every show. Crazy Horse, Uriah Faber. He's fought in everyone. And so I see felony fights. I see this bald-headed white guy

all tatted up. And I remember when he fought the guy on the show, he had him on the ground, he had him mounted, and he was pounding him, and he just gave up. He's like, bro, the guy's done.

He showed compassion. So I didn't forget that guy. He just had a different character than all the other guys who were doing this. Like, I'm going to smash. I'm going to be a tough guy for YouTube, you know? I saw this one felony fight where this dude KO'd this guy and then just kept dropping knees on his head. And they didn't stop the fight. He was out cold.

And he was out cold, laying on his back. And this dude was just up, hips up in the air. And boom, cold laying on his back and this dude was just up hips up in the air and boom dropping knees on his head boom oh it was awful and so i remember shad from that i should know i'm bumping the shad somewhere and i'm like oh you're the felony fights guy you know so we're training together he i'm a wrestler he hears i'm this little wrestler in the in the in the town so he's like can you help me out with my wrestling? And I'll kind of show you a little bit about jujitsu and fighting. What year is this around?

This... fuck. I'm terrible with the year stuff. You can't ask me that, Joe. I do not keep up with dates. How old were you? I can't even remember my own birth date. Just how old were you back then? Like when did you start? I was 20, 20, 21. So I remember when I first started MMA was because of my son. I met a chick, and within a month she got pregnant.

So I'm working a warehouse job six days a week. On my seventh day, I go all the way out to Mexico. I fight in Mexico and make $800. I come back. I keep the little money, put it in a savings account or put it in a little account for him, and it's just this money I'm having for this kid. I'm scared. I don't know. It's my first child. I And it's just this money I'm having for this kid. I'm scared.

I don't know. It's my first child. I don't know what the fuck I'm going to do. And I'm scared. So I just put all this money away to help save for him. So that was your introduction to fighting. Did you have any striking back then? No striking at all.

Just a wrestler. I had no idea what jiu-jitsu was. I'm going around fighting guys in Mexicoxico who 150 muay thai fights you know oh my god yeah and these are the days where fighting was mostly illegal in california i fought three guys in one night that night three fights the stand-up guy had 150 fights muay thai then i fought a purple belt from henzo gracie school and then i fought a purple belt from Henzo Gracie School. And then I fought a black belt from, I don't remember what school he was from. This is in Mexico? Yeah.

Tijuana? Yeah. Yeah, I knew a lot of guys from Legends Gym back in the day were going down to Tijuana for fights. Mm-hmm. Because it was not that far to go. Brianna is supposed to be from there. Henry Brianna is supposed to be from there. I beat him, too.

I fought him, too. I fought all the who's who's of mexico's you know like i actually became a star in mexico before i actually be uh did anything out here really yeah mexico loved me i get out there and i dance like because i'm from foster care i've been in foster care since i was four years old so i know white people i know black people i know mexican people i even speak a little bit spanish you know so i know like their culture so like they're like they're hating on me when i first come out there they're booing me you know you're not from america from mexico then after the fight they dropped the music i started dancing like cumbias and merengue they're like what he knows

our shit you know fucking after that they love me they fucking love me ever since that's awesome oh yeah so back to shaz smith yeah shaz smith's this tough guy he's the tap out guy we don't know tap out at the time was the biggest thing for MMA. They pushed the beacon. They really pushed that mark to get us out there, out there, going to EC shows and selling shirts and blah, blah, blah. And so I meet Chad. We're working out. We're going great. Everything's going great. I'm in the gym. I'm starting to become this fighter. So one day after practice, Chad doesn't tell me that Chad is gay. I'm like in the gym. I'm starting to become this fighter. So one day after practice, Shad doesn't tell me that Shad is gay. I have no problem with that. What you do is your own thing,

as long as you don't come at me with it. One day we're training, and after training gets over, I take my shirt off. I think we ended a round. I took my shirt off like, are we going to go to the next round? He's like, hey, put your shirt on, bro. Put your shirt on. I can't concentrate. And I was like, my wheels are turning a little bit. I'm like, what is he saying? What does he mean, you know? And then it finally hit me. Oh, fuck. He's talking about this.

He's like, oh, bro, I didn't tell you. Oh, yeah, I'm gay, you know. And I'm like, oh, brother, no problem. As long as you don't call me, I'm not that way. You know, it's cool. So we let it go. Bygones be bygones. We're going to work together.

It's cool. I used to be right in We're going to work together. It's cool. I used to be right in the backseat smoking weed with him and his boyfriend. They're fighting each other, fist fighting and some more. You know, they're crazy. Fist fighting in the backseat. And you have to understand, this is when gay stuff is just really coming around the corner, you know? And so it's still new. I think gay stuff's been around a long time.

But it's getting its momentum. Yeah. It's getting its momentum. Yeah. It's getting its momentum. It's becoming more mainstream accepted, right? Yeah, it's getting the momentum. Yeah. It's crazy that that is in our lifetime. I think that's because of the internet.

And so I'm at this gym. I don't know anybody. I'm working with this really crazy guy. He's fucking nuts. He fights with his boyfriend all the time, but he's a really cool guy. He's really giving. He's fucking nuts. He fights with his boyfriend all the time, but he's a really cool guy.

He's really giving. But the only problem was with Shad is Shad would like to fuck the guys at the gym. Oh, no. So we're sitting outside one day. We're just finished training. We're smoking a blunt. We're all chilling. We're all tired. And one of the guys is like, hey, come here.

Shad wants you. Shad wants you. I fucked this one up, by the way. You fucked up the blunt? I tore it a little bit. Oh, no. But I still make it work. So he's like, Sh chat wants you chat wants you i fucked this one up by the way you fucked up the blunt i tore it a little bit oh no but i still make it work um so he's like chat wants you and um i'm like okay he's snickering he's laughing like watch this watch this so i'm like what's going on you know the guy goes oh what the fuck he comes back running he's like he's fucking somebody in the ass you know and that was my last day of practice. And I'm like, I just can't do it.

That's a little much, you know? So you would turn around the corner and he was there doing it. So he wanted you to see it. Smashing a guy right there. Yeah, yeah. So I'm like, bro, this ain't professional. So he wasn't just fucking the guys in the gym. He was fucking guys inside the gym.

Yes. And he's a great guy, you know? That's a little unprofessional. Yeah, it's a little unprofessional. I can't do that, you know? I just can't. I can't work great guy, you know. That's a little unprofessional. Yeah, it's a little unprofessional. I can't do that, you know. I just can't. I can't work with this, you know. So I left.

I had no idea where to train anymore. I gave up on MMA. I actually fought one amateur fight against a kid. And so I'm like, cool. I'm done with MMA. A couple buddies of mine hit us up. We start talking. And we go to this wrestling tournament.

At this wrestling tournament, I wrestling tournament i do all the wow this thing's like uh i take wwe and i mix it with actual wrestling so people can be entertained you know right because wrestling can be kind of boring if you don't know it's its whole nature and what's going on the average fan they're like what's going on you're like what they're just hugging each other you know right so i would do things like the hurricane rana you know you know what that is like you hugging each other, you know? Right. So I would do things like the Hurricane Rana. You know what that is? Like you jump on a guy and you spin under him and roll him. So, yeah, a guy would shoot on me.

I'd stop his shot. And then while he's down there, I'd jump over his head, literally in midair, hook him, and roll over him. So I'm doing all these crazy suplexes. Pro wrestling moves in a real fight. Yes, fuck yes. What did the dude do? This is a wrestling match. Oh.

This is a freestyle match where older people come by. We graduated from high school. Excuse me. We graduated from high school, and now we can do, like, my buddy's like, let's go hang out. We'll go wrestle together, you know? Right, but it's a real wrestling match. A real wrestling match.

And you're doing pro wrestling shit in a real match. Yes. I'm trying to find. It's funny how jujitsu guys call that, they'll call a match a fight. It really is. It's a match. It's funny how jiu-jitsu guys call a match a fight. It really is. It's a match. It's a match. It's a mess.

It's not a fight. Yeah, you're not hitting each other. It's not a fight. I can't stand that. It's weird, right? They say it. It bothers me. I got friends that go, hey, who do you think is going to win between John Cena and The

Rock in their fight? I'm like. Oh, that's even more ridiculous. Yes. I'm like, bro, you know, they already know who's going to win. Yeah. win yeah they already know who's gonna win the matter of fact he's already got his check and he's counting the money i have to have this conversation with tony hinchcliffe weekly to me i just i love wrestling and but i thought the the interest is you know the fireworks the energy that's the package part now can, can I bring that to MMA?

That's my biggest thing is since the beginning, I used to come out with Santa Claus suits. I used to throw out stuff to the crowd because it's the same along the same lines. I figured if we could bring MMA to WWE, the only problem is that why WWE had to fall was when everyone found it was fake. I believed it was real. And then someone's like, you know that shit's fake, right? You know, like, look at their feet.

And they're going, ugh, ugh. I'm like, what? They're slamming each other. How old were you when you thought it was real? I'd say 12. That's normal. That's normal. I'm like, what?

You can't fake a slam. He just picked that guy and slammed him. I'm like, no, they've actually been trained to break the fall. Right. You know? Yeah, if you think about Santa Claus, like the average age kids find out, what do you think it is, Jamie? Nine?

Hope not. I hope not, but I think it is. Fuck Santa Claus. You think daddy. Daddy got some damn gifts. Yes, you should thank daddy. But people believe in Santa Claus up until probably, I think the average age is probably seven or eight.

But you need a better lighter here. Yeah, yeah. Check this out. Look at you, look at you. Yeah, cigar lighter. I would say that Santa Claus is probably nine. Pro wrestling is probably 11 or 12. A little bit later.

Maybe until nine you're holding out hope that it's still... Yeah, maybe. Everyone's wrong. Maybe. Maybe when you're 9 you're holding out hope. But I'm like, how do you fake the chairs? How do you fake the tables? Oh, they're compressed sawdust. And oh, it's aluminum. You're like, what? It just bursted my whole burble.

Oh, you mean those chairs that they slam on people? Yeah, they slam each other and hitting each other and doing all this stuff. I'm going to clean all this stuff When I'm done sir Don't worry about it man We have people cleaning up I'm not a dirty motherfucker So yeah

So I'm doing these tournaments now Some Mexican guys find me Mexican guys find you Yeah my two Mexican coaches They go hey You should fight Back when I was with The first coach

I had that amateur fight Right There's a guy named Aaron Miller blood-spilled Miller He's fighting for a title. I go I beat that kid in my amateur fight. Maybe I should do fighting So from that moment when I met those two messing guys, I didn't know know them too. Well turns out they're like they're a different type of Gym this gym is, full of gangsters. They train, but they're gangsters.

They smoke weed. We go into Mexico, we're fighting. I was literally in the gym two weeks, literally two weeks at the max, and I had my first fight. Wow. That's crazy. This coach, he's known for, like, he'll just throw anybody in there. He's going to make money.

I'll get $200 off of you. But watch this. I got you a fight. I got you a fight, and you a fight. I made $200 from each five guys. I made $1,000 to pay my rent. Right. That's his thinking.

So he was just throwing people to the wolves. I don't care if you win. I don't care if you lose. I'm going to get paid, you know? Right. Well, that's a lot of the early-day promoters, right? That's what a lot of people are dealing with in the early days. These new kids don't know what it was like to get there. I have to explain it to my younger guys.

I took every opportunity I got to get here. I took every opportunity. I fought on 24 hours notice. I fought on, like, just, I fought three times in one night. I fought, I've done everything, Joe. Well, how many days notice was the Islam fight, the makachev fight 10 10 days 10 days yeah how heavy were you before you took that fight joe it was a mess brother it was a mess because i know like the cut has to be planned out you know if you're going to do it correctly and i love all you can eat sushi all you can eat sushi i'm a fat guy like i'm gonna be fat after my shit yeah when i seen

khabib i was like holy fuck he's not happy to you he's just big he's just not lean anymore yeah but to us in our world you know in our world we should be like we count each other every day if i come to the gym after they call me bob Keough Bobby Burger King green fucking bloated and shit a lot of fighters do that right at the end of their career they get really fat really common look at my Donna yeah yeah oh yeah it's a good example right he's losing weight though apparently he's trying to make a comeback. But I'm like, motherfucker. Like, I've been 155. I left high school at 160. For the last 20 years, I've been the same weight.

I deserve to be fat. I understand. Let me just let it go. You know, just like your hair. Just let it go. Let it go. Let that belly out. You know, let it go.

Patti Pimblitt? That motherfucker gets fat quick. He's fat as fuck right now. I hear that. He's fat as fuck. His face is all round and he shows his belly. He's hilarious. He's hilarious.

You know what I'm saying is, we actually go through depression. You know, a lot of fighters, they don't recognize that. We're kind of like cheerleaders. Right. You look sexy. You look good. You see yourself every day in the mirror for the last four to eight weeks. Shredded.

Shredded. You're looking like, yeah. Ready to go. And then all of a sudden, two days later, not even like a week, two days, you're like, what happened? I was in shape just two days ago. I fought literally three days ago, and I'm now 195 pounds. That happens to everybody if you go off the rails.

There's Patty. Look at him now. There's Dean Thomas. Look at him now. There's Dean Thomas. Look at his face. Look how fat his face gets. He shows his gut before that. Oh, that's great. That's great.

He's already gelling up. And he just fought. He just fought a couple weeks ago. He looks like Chris. He does look like Chris from Family Guy. Somebody got to tell that guy to cut his fucking hair. Shit. No, no, no, no.

He looks like one of the Hanson brothers or something. But that's his shtick. True. That's his shtick, you know? Your shtick is you got a tattooed head and you're cool as fuck, and his shtick is he's silly. Like, his hair's silly. Like, I bet a lot of people underestimated him when they first saw him.

Because you see, look at this nerd. This goofy-ass hair. What are the odds that he can fight? Yeah. He can fucking fight. He can. I'll give him that. He's diving right into the deep end of the pool quick, though.

It's interesting. They gave him two fighters. First guy, I forget who he fought. He's pretty talented. Second guy was pretty talented, too. And now they're talking about Ilya Tuporia. It's like, ooh, I forget who he fought. He's pretty talented. Second guy was pretty talented, too. And now they're talking about, like, you know, Ilya Tuporia. It's like, ooh, that's a big jump. That's not a big jump.

And that's another thing, too. I like that jump. I like it. I feel like. I like it, but it's a big jump. I mean, I think Patty's very good. No, no doubt. I think Patty's very good.

Don't get me wrong. His submission game is very, very tight. But I'll try to explain this. Like, I got a little beef with a, what's the next name? That is the worst blunt anybody's ever wrote. Yeah? It's the worst blunt. Holy shit.

All the part. Oh, yeah, I know. I felt it. I was like, fuck, you're fucking nervous. You're like an idiot on fucking TV. It's all right, man. Whatever you did is way better than what I would have done. I'm terrible at joints and blunts.

I'm going to do it again. I'm going to get high on this show. We're already high. No, this ain't even close. Okay. I smoke 15 of these a day well that's not good and i got the greatest cardio too you know you do have great cardio i just that's the thing about marijuana does not seem to affect cardio like cigarettes do i'm not a doctor or anything i just want to say i'm not a doctor you don't smoke at all in camp that's good you eat up with the ds2 huh yeah i up with the dsuses like they

were giving me high i'm like nate like how long do you still smoke he's like 11 days up to the final what wow no um when you uh when you eat vegan does that help you cut weight is that why you do it that way yeah you gotta understand like uh guys like me they don't think like i'm a big 55 or if you're walking around 195 pounds. Yeah, you look very big. It's like for normal people, they would never imagine you weigh 155 pounds. That's what's crazy about fighting. And I mean I've said this so many times. I risk repeating myself, but I do that a lot anyway.

The big thing that bothers me the most is not like tough fights. It's weight cuts. Yeah. That bothers me the most. Because I just think it's a dumb thing. This is why it bothers me. Guys that know what they're doing, they're professional fighters, they know that they're gonna have a fight

like Hamzat and Gilbert just had, where both guys take crazy damage. Everybody understands that. It's part of the risk of the, but why is there an extra risk? Why is there this extra risk of like starvation and dehydration? What is that? Like that doesn't, that hinders performance.

Fuck yeah. A hundred percent. I mean, think of the amazing performances we've seen in the UFC and we've seen fucking amazing performances. I've got to imagine that some of the people, as elite as we saw them, they're capable of something another level even higher if they weren't dehydrated, if their body was operating on peak efficiency. It's not going to be peak efficiency if you dehydrate yourself down to like,

some of these guys look terrible. That's why I like it on Japan. They force you to do dehydration tests test one FC is doing something along those lines And I know they do it all the guys up they do it in some wrestling tournaments, too They're not doing that dehydration to their bodies man. It just doesn't make sense to me It doesn't make sense and I feel like there's a solution I can see it for some fighters But for us, especially the 55 division, there's that gap. Yeah, that 55 to 70.

That gap. Yeah. Everybody wants that 65, you know, at least. But it leaves those guys in that weird space where I could go 70s like a Benson Henderson, but you're going to notice that difference in those 70 guys. Yeah, they're bigger, man. They are huge. They're big dudes.

So you're in this weird, you got to cut it down, kid. That's the way it goes. That's one of the things about weight classes is there's guys that are really in this gap in between. There's a reason why we differentiate by size because it's a big advantage. It's a giant advantage. And so everybody wants the best advantage. How can I do it and still be healthy? Who does it the best?

I think Usman does it the best because he's big. That guy is a fucking killer. He's big, dude. Anybody's going from 55 to 70, go stand next to him. He's a big super athlete. One time I was at the USCPI and I'm just kind of kicking it, you know, doing a little training and stuff. And I look over and I see Usman there. And he's training like he's trying to cut weight And he's training like he's trying to cut weight.

He's training like he's trying to cut weight. Turns out it's the night of the damn fight. He's going to fight that night. He's fighting Dos Anjos that night. I'm thinking you'd be resting and saving your energy. This guy's out here blowing it all out. Like he was cutting weight. I was like, that's nuts.

And then I saw him go in the fight and just fucking they went in there for five rounds of just hard high pace pushing on each other i'm like fuck that guy's the truth he's the truth and he's the perfect size for 170 you know he's like when you're in these gaps i think from like 170 85, and then 85 to 205 is a big gap. There's guys that would maybe even be champions if there was 10-pound weight classes. I agree. I agree. And it's unfortunate because I just don't think we see the best of them. You know, there's like, if you get a guy who's an elite 55er and he has to fight a guy who's an elite 170 pounder that's a big

difference that's a giant difference in a lot of these guys the fucking 70 pound guys are giant like how much do they really weigh like what do they really weigh they're not really weighing 170 they're only weighing 170 for a little while yes it's crazy so when i meet people and they're actually like well you're a 55 and they look at me and they kind of like put they like size me up against them like i'm just as big as you and you're 220 you know they're like there's no way you can be 155 it's i'm only there for one i'm there for three minutes i literally make the weight i jump on the skills and i'm putting it back on god damn man how much does that take out of you do you think like if you if you had to judge like like, a performance number.

If, like, you edit 100% is when you're fully healthy. You cut weight and then you rehydrate. I think it's perfect for me. For instance, like, for 55s, I can make it fine, no problem. I think the issue more so is my power. I notice when I'm walking around, like, 170, 175, 78, I'm fucking knocking guys. I'm hitting guys and hurting them.

When I start to cut that away, I lose my pop. So I'm like, I could be knocking guys out at a bigger division, but now you also take the risk of getting your ass knocked out too more. Right. They're hitting harder. Do you think that boxing has it right? Don't get me started on boxing. What do you mean with like boxing has it right don't get me started on boxing but i mean with their weight classes you got 50 weight classes is that too many is there like a comfortable medium

where we don't know all the boxing champions we know every usc champion because they stand out it's only so many right now and so that gives you a little bit more uh notoriety but i don't like the whole idea with boxing like the whole idea like i tried explaining to even i told you earlier about uh sugar sean i mean she got a little back and forth going on and i'm trying to explain it to these younger fighters because i'm the old guy right now i've been through it and i've seen all this the usc are the story writers the same thing with boxing they're story writers they're writing the stories and it's a certain way you know i better know how to play your role if you don't know your role you'll get

eliminated you'll get x'd out not knowing how to play the role right now you're in the great hot seat brother you're in a great seat play it cool shut the fuck up and play your role but they don't know that they that it's this machine that it's a story and they're going oh you're gonna go here you're gonna fight him you're gonna do this and you're gonna they're gonna write it just beautiful there's other guys that don't get that road. Okay. Like Dos Anjos, who's fought in everybody. He's fought in every killer.

He can finally come through. There's another killer. He's fighting him next. And so there's different roles and different stories. And I'm like, Sean, understand. Stop talking shit. Stop. Like, he did the whole basketball drilling on the guy who just got in the UFC.

He just, this is his first fight. And I felt like, don't get me wrong, you got to have the antics. You got to bring the fight. But at the same time, know where you're at. Know what's going on. Don't do that to that kid. This is his first experience. You just shit on a guy who didn't even.

This is his first get down. And you've been fighting. You've been in here. You're talking shit. You're the man. And you've been fighting. You've been in here. You're talking shit. You're the man. And you're going to do that kid like that? And he also had 15 other offers. 15 other offers.

Sean gets to pick his fights. So he's picking between these guys. And he goes and picks this guy who's not even in the division. You know what I'm saying? So it makes it look like he looks really good. Everybody's like, oh, he's talented. He's blah, blah, blah. I'm like, listen, they're writing that story really well.

Same thing with Boston. They never fight nobody. Why we haven't had, why we didn't get Floyd Mayweather and Pacquiao the same at the right time. We didn't get Errol Spence and Crawford. These guys were the best. The UFC does it. And they're going to write, at least they're going to write it at the right time. They let Conor build it.

They wrote his story correctly. And then they wrote this one, and it comes right. At least they make it happen at some point in time. With boxing, it doesn't happen. They're just like, well, he's our star, and we don't want to lose it because in boxing you lose, you're done. You don't have the same. I was a big Broner fan I liked

his antics I liked everything to him but once he lost everybody's like he's done and you see we don't have that why do you think that is like why is the UFC more is it why is it okay to lose yeah in MMA sorry that Bobby Greenweed got me. But why is it okay to lose in MMA? Like, why do you think the MMA community, like some of the greatest stars, have lost a bunch of times? But it's not even okay to lose. In our industry, you know I hear the word I hear all the time? Journeyman. Like Colby Covington and guys say that.

He's a fucking journeyman. When they diss a guy because he got losses. If you've been in this trench long enough, you will get lost. You're going to get a lot of losses if you've been in these trenches long enough. Because there's so many ways to play this. This chessboard. Well, if Colby Covington...

Jesus Christ. Damn this cotton mouth. If Colby Covington wasn't in the Usman era, he'd probably be champion. I mean, the dude is a beast. I agree. I mean, he's a fucking beast. His cardio is off the charts. I mean, it's crazy.

It's really sad. Wrestling is solid. To be honest, he's so talented, and he reminded me of Chell, you know, where he had to use the mouthpiece to get more seen instead of his actual talent you know cause he is a skilled fighter it's sad that he's kinda almost tainted

Chell did it in a great way Chell did it in a great way at first it was little ugh and nobody understood what he was doing but Chell made it funny Chell made it interesting he's giving the I saw him giving the carrot giving the busted carrot you know was doing but chel made it funny chel made it interesting he's giving a cat the right i saw him giving the the carrot right giving a busted carrot you know yeah it puts him it was funny yes

yeah kobe doesn't deliver it the same way it's offensive it's hard to swallow yeah he's playing psychological warfare too you know and the and the hard part about it is like for us the real hardcore fans and i'm i mean not fans i would like to tell them the real g's the nates the khabib's the corjays we look at you like hey you gotta back that up if you're gonna be that type of guy go back that up go stand on it you can't be the guy that you're talking to but then when they approach you you ain't ready with that time. You ain't on that time. If I'm going to be that type of aggression with somebody, then I know what time it is when I'm saying what I'm saying.

And I see that person, I know what time it is. When I see Sean, and the reason I don't like Sean is because of Tekashi69. I don't like 69. So he went and got him tatted. I'm like, oh, yeah? You just jumped in the pool with him. And I don't like you either. And you gotta be able to stand on what you do, because when those people

come and see you, now we're attacking you, Sean. You don't even know why, because you went and butted up with somebody else. You clicked up with him, now you get in that same group. Now you gotta stand on it. Y'all wanna be badasses? Well, stand on that shit. Don't be calling the police. You can't do none of that. You wanna be a badass.

This is what badass shit is. And don't get me wrong, I feel like Jorge snuck him. Jorge snuck him. Ran up, hey, you know? But at the same time, you know what come with this shit. You want to live this life. Stand on that shit. As a professional, though,

don't you think it's a good idea to not get into fistfights in the street i agree i agree as a professional i know i know but that's not but no but as a professional but i know exactly i understand entertainment but hold on a second if you're gonna be professional keep it professional if you want to go low right then it's going low and it's up it's up it's up on site like it's what it is if you want to go that way like with my kids and my wife and bringing all this other information out that really didn't talk shit about me all day brother let's just go we can shoot shits we can talk jokes but now my family and my kids i don't think jorge should have did that though i don't i

don't agree with it at all you know like you like, you had 25 minutes, brother. You had 25 minutes to do anything you needed to do. It was that time. And now you got to go get him out. You had your time, you know, and I don't let it be like that. I don't agree. But at the same time, I don't agree with Kobe either. You want to play that role? Stand on it.

Come with it. You know? Joe had to deal with it. Same thing. Come with it. Go ahead and walk that role. That's why a lot of people don't play that road. That's why people just play the martial arts road.

They shut up, they be cool. But they don't want to get booed. They don't want to get chased, attacked. That's what come with that shit. Yeah, you're not a guy who got in any unnecessary beefs with people. You seem like an easy guy to get along with, generally. I'm chill, brother. I'm chill brother You are

But if you rub me wrong you'll see me You'll see it And there are people that will rub you wrong even if you're nice Even if you're a nice person There's people that are going to rub you wrong Like cowboy I remember the first time I came into this industry It was my first fight

I just beat Jacob Volkman. Volkman was this killer on this role. I just stopped him, and I'm doing my first signing. I'm in the UFC. I'm the new kid. I'm kind of like just figuring out what this is. This is July. We're on the event that they have in Vegas, the Fighter Expo.

You want to say this? You know? And so we're signing autographs, and I'm a cowboy fan. He comes in, and he's a little tipsy, you know, drinking, wild boy. Okay, cool. And so I tell him I'm such a fan, blah, blah, blah. And he tells me some shit like, I'll kick your ass. Like, oh, he finds I'm in his division.

Oh, I'll beat your ass. I'm like, oh, he's aggressive, you know? He thinks, and this industry, it's only two years long. This industry is short. There's so many people that we don't know are UFC fighters that actually came to the show. They did one show and was out. Maybe they did two fights and was out. It's so fast, this short life.

So I felt like he treated me like that. Like, oh, you're not going to be around that long. And he said a lot of underhanded shit that I'm not going to say say on this show he did a lot of funny shit that rubbed me wrong and i never forgave him for that and people go well why you got a problem and i tell them behind closed doors like this is why i don't like you oh and they go okay i can see why and i want my revenge i want my revenge so cowboy is on my shit list but i I never get him. He keeps getting away. He keeps getting out of my fingers. And he's going to retire.

And I'm not going to get my revenge. I've been waiting for this for years. If I tell you the story, I'll tell you off the shit. And it's sweet revenge that needs to happen. I believe it's God's plan. And it's going to happen. And I'm cool. That's what I'm saying.

I just kept it quiet. And I'm like, I'm going to get you back. I'm going to tell you the story. And when you actually hear the story it's so interesting that like so then it pieces all together i finally think i'm gonna get him and i then he slipped through my fingers so cowboy is one of the guys who will get it he will get it and if and i'm not gonna go attack the guy and do nothing crazy but i'm gonna get my revenge he's got it he's at least gotta apologize that's it when i. You at least got to apologize. That's it. When I tell you, at least you got to say sorry

and we can be cool. I'm cool where we can just apologize and be bygones. What your energy is, what my energy is. If you bring aggression, I'll match it. If you bring peace, I'll match it. Whatever you want to bring, brother. So, back to the old days. A lot of these kids don't know. They don't know, Joe, they don't know

what it was like for us, like, I hear Joe, I hear Chael's stories, I listen to all of my OGs, and like, Chael's so mad sometimes when we get, like, about pay, he's like, you know what, I can't, I signed up to fight, if you want to be a fighter, this is what it takes, fuck the price, you signed the contract, this is what you get, don't complain about it because you signed the contract, you know? And I get what he says. I listen to the old guys and I go, okay, I can understand. They were fighting for 500 bucks, you know? And we're complaining.

But look what they went through, you know? They went through the same things. We're going through these growing periods, you know? A lot of the older guys went to the Indian casino period. I was there. That's what Iian casino period i was there that's what i said that's what i'm saying i was there yeah i fought at all the casinos those were the the king of the cage days king of the cage i was the king of case champ that was i had two bells for him that was a big deal like that there was an organization that was able to put on shows

while there was a ban on mma because they were able to do it in these Native American casinos. All the stars came from. There's so many stars came from King of the Cage. Uriah Faber. Rampage. Yeah, Rampage. Joe Stevenson. There's so many guys.

Dwayne Ludwig. You can name a thousand guys, brother, that came from King of the Cage. It was like the tour that the UFC pulled from, one of the organizations that they pulled from. And probably Pride, too, right? Pride. A lot of guys went over to Pride. That was the days when Pride and the UFC were, like,

kind of neck and neck for a while. If you looked at the fights that Pride had, like, with Fedor versus Noguera, Fedor versus Krokop, I mean, they were some of the greatest MMA fights of all time. And it was happening at the same era as the UFC, when the UFC was becoming popular. Those were interesting times, man. Really interesting times.

Fuck. I'm saying, like, brother, I'm telling you, I fought one time where I was in Mexico one day. No, I was in California. I fought a guy named... What the fuck is his name? He was one of Tito's guys. My third fight, I'm fighting on Friday in L.A.

I have another fight already booked Saturday in Mexico. I can't make the weigh-in because you know how you weigh in the day before. So I'm literally fighting that day of the weigh-ins in Mexico. Oh, my God. So the guy weighs in. He doesn't even fucking make weight. He's at 185 pounds. Well, I'm fighting this guy at 55.

Then I go to Mexico the next day to go fight him. I find out he's at 185. I still fight him. Fucking knock him out. It's like, these were the days, guys. You guys got it so good. They don't understand. That's why I'm so thankful for what we got.

Because I'm like the old guys we didn't have none of this you know you guys fought two days in a row two days in a row three times in one night i've done it all joe that's what i'm telling i want to really break the story down for you oh my god and so i met the the messing coaches is that the hardest coaches would let me do this they're like okay so every guy they're doing this with, they're all losers. They all lose. I'm the only guy that they can put a pit bull in there, and he's bringing back the money. They're like, oh, shit, he won.

Normally, that guy gets knocked out because we're getting fed to the wolves, okay? Everybody's already got their stars that they're running at these shows. So he's the main headline. He's going to be the ticket seller, and they're going to find someone for him to bring in to slaughter it's the way the business runs so i happen to be that guy and i come out it's still the show how are they so bad at recognizing that you're good a lot of they thought that you were that guy um because i'm this little street kid and they think oh he don't know shit. Oh. This came later on. Like, I even talked to Big John McCarthy.

My very first fight, I fought his kid. Big John was telling him not to take the fight. He's like, I heard about this kid, that he's got some wrestling, and he can fight. He's like, we told him not to take the fight. Our first fight, Neil Abrams. If you can find this fight, it's fucking like, it's like Forrest Griffin and Stephen Bonner. We just went toe-to-toe, cracking each other for three rounds straight. So, yeah, these are beginning days.

I literally, so now I'm with the Mexican coaches, right? Right. They're taking me from here to there. I'm fighting, like, on a crazy regimen where I've gotten, I think I had like one of these months I had like four or five fights in a month. You know what I'm saying? You know what I'm saying? My regimen is crazy. So I'm so used to that now. I don't fight without some money. I don't train. I won't go in the gym unless there's some money. If not, I'm at my warehouse job working six days a week. And when they call me, oh, we got to fight, then I'll come in and train, you know? And so I train a

little bit. I don't know shit about jujitsu. I don't know shit about striking. I'm a wrestler, and I'm doing this. What's up? Thinking, like, I want to get down so that, they're like, oh, he can fight up here. So they shoot in on me. Now, I know all about wrestling, so I'll just wrestle the guys, pick

them up, slam them, get on top of them, pound them out. I did that a couple times, made it work, you know. I was making it work. So now I'm getting ready to fight Dan LaZahn's little brother. No, Joe LaZahn's little brother, Dan LaZahn. I get the call on 24-hour notice. I'm at a warehouse.

They literally say, hey, we need you to leave, work. You have 30 minutes to get here and be on wait. I'm like, 30 minutes? I go up to the camera at the warehouse. I go, fuck you. I'm out of here. I quit, you know? And this is the point where I made the decision, I'm going to be a fighter from here on out.

They were like, we'll give you $3,000 to show, $3,000 to win, or something like that. No, I think it was $6,000. It was the biggest paycheck I had at the time. So I'm like, $6,000? I'm working this warehouse job for these pennies? I'm out of here I go get on treadmill cut all the way down and I'm fighting Dan Lizon the next day so this

is the issue with me the issue with me is I smoke weed and especially at this time weed is really bad where in fighting like Nate got uh Nick got suspended for years, took a lot of his career away. I was one of them sacrificial lambs, too, where I got suspended a year, six months, a year and a half. I kept getting caught up because they're offering me these short notice fights, and we doesn't get off your system for 30 days. So you're going to piss dirty. This is what it is. So I got the offer on the fight on 24 hours notice. I'm fucking dirty. I'm nervous as shit.

It's affliction. The big affliction show is my biggest show, and I'm going, what am I 24 hours notice. I'm fucking dirty. I'm nervous as shit. It's affliction. The big affliction show is my biggest show. And I'm going, what am I going to do? I'm so scared. My coach at the time, he's like, well, let's go get high. I'm like, what? He's like, yeah. So we go in the car.

We smoke this weed. And it's the most dynamic weed I ever had at the time. I'm high on my fucking mind right before the fight. I'm fighting on my fucking mind. Right before the fight. I'm fighting Dolezal. Um. I have one of the craziest interests ever. I literally started all this like show

shit. I used to bring the show before the fight. I break out the crowd. I'm running up the crowd. I run upstairs. I get them all up. Let's go. They don't even know who I am. I took the fight on 24 hours notice. I'm not even on the name on the card or none of the posters or any promotion. I'm getting them riled up. I run down these stairs, and I run up the next stairs on the other side of the stadium.

Cutter, get up. We're at the Anaheim Pond. Get up. Let's go. Slapping hands and stuff. I'm running back down, and the camera crew stops me. They go, hey, hey, hey. Stop, stop, stop.

We're not recording. Oh, no. I'm like, what, and the camera crew stops me. They go, hey, hey, hey. Stop, stop, stop. We're not recording. Oh, no. I'm like, what? All out of breath. What? Like, that was awesome. What? What do you mean?

They take me back behind the curtains, and they want me to do it again. No. Yeah. I'm like, you can't do it again. It's not the fucking same. Oh, no. It's not the same. It's not going to be like it's supposed to.

So I just come out, do it, or whatever. So now I'm fighting down. Me and Dan are fighting. And Dan doesn't know me. And I can tell Dan's got this fear about me. I'm sorry to say it. I don't want to talk about race like that. But there's some gentlemen, white guys, that don't understand us black guys exactly.

And I've been in all cultures. My dad's white. So I've been in every culture. I know what white guys think. I know what Mexican guys think. I know what black guys exactly you know and and i've been in all cultures like my dad's white so i've been in every culture i know whatever white guys think i know a messing guys thing i know a black guys thing you know because being in the cultures um so i could see it on his face you know he's like i gotta fight this nigga so i'm bringing all the the nigga shit to him they ask me what my style is i tell them hood they're like well what is that you know so I wanted to throw them off personal uh purposely I don't want you to know I'm a boxer because if I'm a boxer then you're going to take me down and do jujitsu if I say a jujitsu you're going to stand up with me so I'm just gonna say

hood it's street street fighting they don't know what it is let them think let them figure it out we fight down we're fighting I'm beating them. And then I give him a low blow. He takes a full five minutes. Full five minutes. Okay, cool. But I'm high as shit that we took three low blows. One of them, I'll give him one. The other two, fake as fuck because Dan doesn't want to fight.

So Tito's the announcer. Tito's like, this guy is fucking, he's fucking acting like a motherfucker. Like literally one of them, my toe touches his hip. Literally his hip. And he falls down. So we took him 15 minutes in the first round. It's been 15 minutes. He takes a whole break. I have no idea where time is.

I'm high as shit. I'm talking to Donald Trump before he's president. I'm talking to Oscar De La Hoya. I'm like, what's up guys? I'm just high as shit. In the middle of the fight. Last fucking 10 seconds, he catches me in a choke. He catches me in the rear naked. Had I known where time was,

I would have fucking pushed it through. But if you don't tap in in MMA, you don't make money. You literally get your suspension. If you go out and go to sleep, you got a six-month suspension. Really? Yes.

That's the way it goes, and people don't understand that. They're always like, go to sleep. Why you ain't go to sleep you got a six month suspension really yes that's the way it goes and people don't understand that like they're always like go to sleep go to why you go to sleep you didn't be tough like no i'm gonna fight tomorrow i got another fight the next week right i can't just let it go i want to be the tough guy and go out and fight it all the way out right but if you do you don't make no more money and i got bills to do that's interesting yeah people don't understand that so to sleep so when got bills to do. That's interesting. Yeah. People don't understand that. Go to sleep. So when people tap, in a way, if you want to fight.

So if you tap, there's no suspension, right? Do you have any suspension? They'll give you a seven day. Seven day. Yeah. If you're fine, the doctor checks you out. Seven days, you're cool. You can go right back to work.

And I'm telling you, even when I got suspended when I actually got popped for weed, I had to fight under a whole new name to make money. I can't be suspended. That's a really good point about tapping out that I never really considered. I didn't really consider that. But that would encourage people to tap out

because there's some guys that probably wouldn't. You got to flip the top of it. Oh, okay. Look at this. You got to give me one of these, Joe. These are fucking awesome. You can have that one. Hell yeah.

You can have it. You're the man. You're the man. It's a cigar. The back part cuts cigars. By the way, I just got to fucking say this real fast. This is on my fucking bucket list, and thank you for having me, sir. This is an honor.

It's a blessing to be in your presence. I've seen you from the beginning, fucking Joe. I've seen you from the beginning. I've seen you, too, man fucking Joe. I've seen you from the beginning to come to where you are. You're a cool guy, Bobby. To come to where you are now, that's fucking amazing, brother. Who would have fucking known you'd be here? Did you think you would predict this? No, no.

You know? No, no one can. And to be honest, you don't even realize so many things that you're doing, that you're touching and doing. For instance, I was're touching and doing. For instance, I was talking to Schwab. I'm like, you took Joe's blueprint.

He took your blueprint. He's running your blueprint. Without being the fighter, but he's running your blueprint where okay, fighting went out the door. What's next for us? What are we going to do next? Joe took your blueprint, I mean, Schwab, and he's running it. He's doing a great job with his shows and stuff, you know? Well, I think everybody is just doing the same thing.

That's all it is. We're all just, you know, having fun, having conversations, fucking around. But who was doing that at Schwab's time? Where did the UFC fighters were going? They were either working for the company or they're unheard of. Schwab was funny. That was the thing. He was always funny. He was always funny.

He was always a fun dude to hang out with. He's silly. He's a big, giant, silly dude. You know, he's a good guy. Good dude. And when I would have him on podcasts, he was so fun to hang with. And I was like, listen, man, you don't have to fight anymore. You can make a living doing this.

I'm talking to him about a show right now I want to do with him. And I want to do some shit called The Sit Down. The Sit Down? I want to take fighters who've had beefs. You know, we take the world's best beefs and see if we can get the two fighters in the same room. You know? Sit them down and let them speak. Let's see if we can call a peace treaty.

And we can get these two men to say, I felt like you were doing this and you said this. And this is why I said this. Oh, we're cool. I't understand where you came from good you know right right right do some shit like that and we go over the the craziest beast and stuff over time you know it's my little show that's not a bad idea and like imagine if we got nate and connor in the room jesus christ you know that's right you know right right nate named like my cousin so i can i think i can get nate to do it but connor i don't know about that do you think triple g and canelo could do you think they could how well do they both speak english could they have like a conversation where they were talking shit about each other? I don't know.

You got to be careful what you say about Canelo. You see what happened when you said, when you say motherfucker around him. He took it like, like you fucked my mother, you know? I think he was just looking for, you know. No, bro. And some of my messians told me that. But he's called people motherfucker too. They actually, like some people take it like a lot of like, we call like Paisa messians and stuff.

Oh, I see. They take it that way. Like, oh, we say motherfucker. You mean like, fuck my mother. Oh, I see. I see. He took it like a lot of what we call paisa meskins and stuff. They take it that way. Oh, we say motherfucker? You mean like fuck my mother. Oh, I see. He took it like that. Oh, don't you say about my mom? And he just flipped.

It's really saying like, okay, you fucker, to us in our communication. Does Canelo speak English very well? You tell me, sir. I don't follow much on that end. Most of the time I see him talking. We're in our realm. I got enough going on in our UFC. We're still trying to build this up.

They're getting millions of dollars. We're still working on that. Fuck those guys. Fuck those guys. How dare you? I'm sorry. It's MMA versus boxing. I'm sorry.

Is it? Because they've been shitting on us for years and disrespecting us. Don't you think that that— And we win all the time. but boxing is a necessary art it's a fast i love it to see it at the highest level like as a person who likes striking my favorite sport is boxing for hands it's like those guys are on such a different level it's when you add all the other stuff like kicking and takedowns like there's it. You're never going to get someone who's as pure a boxer. They're going to be athletic. They're going to be powerful.

But to be able to compete with a guy like Mayweather who's just so tuned into it. They call me the Mayweather of MMA. We have similar styles. You have a very unusual style, Bobby. I really like the way you fight because your shit comes out of nowhere your hands are down a lot and you're super accurate And it's um it's a hard style to gauge because a lot of guys are looking for things that are coming from a high guard I mean, that's it's a good defensive place to be but you've been able to pull it off with movement and and just great timing and that but that style that you have is

it's it's really interesting because fighting is an art it is an art man i wanted you to see it again i call my style poetry in motion i want you to see it and and check this poetry i'm going to do for you like you know you go to a poetry slam and you did a little right snacks and stuff you know watch this you want to do for y'all yeah and I'm in here to the point where I'm in the fight, but I'm in the crowd watching it from here and trying to give you what it is from the outside you want to see. Right. Yeah, so style is big for me.

Style is so big. So you're an entertainer as well as a fighter. I think it's so big. You're entertaining with your style. What product are we selling? I tell all my young fighters that, what product are you selling? We're all selling a product. You're selling podcasts.

And no one is doing it like you. That's why you're the number one. So what product are you selling? What makes you different from the next guy? What makes your podcast different? What makes your fighting style different? So I took all the things that people were saying you can do. You can't put your hands down.

I broke all the rules. And as long as you know the rules set and you know what comes with that, then you can take those risks. Do you remember watching Vitaly Klitschko fight? You ever watch him fight? Klitschko? I get them confused. I don't know which one.

Vladimir is the one. I know they're both really good with that jab, though. Yeah, both really good with the jab. Vladimir had a more traditional style. Vitaly would keep his hands down a lot. he fought a very awkward style but he had big power you know who i got it from i got the hands down from who i uh i take little pieces and stuff like so i got the shoulder roll from floyd mayweather i took the hands down from sergio martinez i don't know if you know that oh yeah for Oh, yeah, for sure. Hands down, you know. Oh, yeah.

Sergio Martinez. He stood out to me. Right away, I'm like, he just stood out to me. He just, it just, I gravitated toward his style. I'm like, that's it right there. Didn't he, he had like a knee injury that eventually kind of fucked him up, right? Yeah, yeah. Because his style was so. He was a soccer player. Yeah.

Well, those guys can fucking move, man. So was Aldo. Yes. When you play that can fucking move, man. So was Aldo. Yes. When you play that, man, that's just a sprinting game. You know, you're just sprinting over there and sprinting over there. Aldo's kick was so fast. I don't, like, you couldn't even stop it. It's like a jab.

Dude, Uriah Favre is one of the toughest fucking human beings that's ever lived. I've been through that. I know what you're talking about. I've been through that. I didn't understand it until I've been through it. I fought Barbosa. Oh, that's ever lived. I've been through that. I know what you're talking about. I've been through that. I didn't understand it until I've been through it. I fought Barbosa. Oh, that's right. He kicked the muscle off of my leg. It literally detached and rolled up, and I didn't know it.

I couldn't walk for like a week or two, and I was just smoking, getting high, and then finally it just went away, and I was like, all right, cool, let's get the next fight going. just smoking, getting high, and then finally it just went away, and I was like, all right, cool, let's get the next fight going. And so I was getting ready to fight somebody, and I think, no, it wasn't Al. So I'm getting ready to fight somebody, and I'm like, coach, there's a hole in, like, there's this hole in my leg, you know?

And he's like, maybe we should get you, let's go look at it, you know? They go, you need emergency surgery right now. Like, there are things, it's going to, they stuck like that. So they had to literally go and reattach it back down. Kicked it off. Luckily, you got it fixed. Because sometimes people have those big-time hamstring pulls, like rips. I know a dude who had a really badly damaged hamstring, and he didn't get it fixed, and his leg was never the same again.

He could have gotten it fixed right afterwards. He could have got it reattached, but he didn't get it fixed and his leg was never the same again. He could have gotten it fixed right afterwards. He could have got it reattached, but he didn't. He just tried to tough it out or maybe he just thought the surgery wasn't necessary or something like that, but it always fucked with him. So I'm trying to explain to people

the early days where you couldn't just go to a gym and find an MMA gym. It wasn't like that. You find a jujitsu gym here. You find this boxing that. You find a jiu-jitsu gym here. You find this boxing gym. You find these wrestlers over here. You had to piece things together. You just didn't go to a gym and find everything, you know?

And the coaches, the coaches were weird and strange. And you had to go and find out, oh, he's just a car salesman. I had to tell that to some of my fighters. They're a car salesman. They're going to tell you, oh, you look good. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. They're just fucking selling you a car, you know? not actually helping you right right so on a teacher now after the day i was on fight i got choked out and i'm now going i don't know if this coach has got the

best for me well if you get me high before a fight you're probably not gonna be the best for me you know you probably don't got the best you know if we don't get me high before a fight, you're probably not going to be the best for me. You know? You probably don't got the best, you know? If you're going to get me high before a fight. As a general rule. As a general rule. That was it for me. I was like, all right. So then I left.

And that's where I met my dad. And I cock in his gym. I'm going and doing jujitsu. And from the one class, he called me after. He called me and he's like, what are you taking? I'm like, what do you mean? He's like, your supplements. What is supplements?

I don't even know what it was. He's like, you know, BCAs and stuff like that. He brought me a whole care package. And I started seeing this coach had a different love. He actually cared for the fighter. He actually was making sure your health and what are you doing. Like my dad's always told me, it's not what you do in the cage it's what you do out you know he's like you're so talented you do this stuff in the case but I'm worried about what you're doing in the streets if you're gonna get

if you're gonna get locked up if you're gonna get all these different situations you know yeah so I'm trying to walk you down this pathway of me going from coach and figuring out how to do this fighting thing it was hard at first it was rough you know and so when i meet my dad we finally started uh getting some um stability but i'm still a knucklehead i've been with that old coach he'd have to come literally find me i'll be at this girl's house or this girl's house and he go find like i had this saying my mama couldn't find me if she wanted to my mom couldn't find me if she wanted to. My mom couldn't find me if she wanted to. Nobody could find me. Because why?

I'm a foster kid, and I got eight families. I got three Mexican families. I got two white families. I got two black families over here. So I'll just be staying at their house one day. I'll stay at this over here. I'll come over here and fuck with them. And so I'm everywhere, and you can never find me.

But he knew the places, so he'd go by. And next thing you know, knocking on the window and i'd be in bed with some girl like fuck he's hitting me for practice tell him not here come in the room come on let's go to practice and he just forced me to do jiu-jitsu forced me to do jiu-jitsu and i became pretty good and i started liking it a little bit i hate jiu-jitsu but i like it a little bit and so from there i built this bond with this dude i I'm 21 years old. He's teaching me about how to raise a kid and all this different life. And now I got this, like, father figure. Your coach is supposed to be help you not only with in the cage stuff,

but outside the stuff. Like, when I talk to my fighters now, first thing I do, I meet a new guy, I make him spark right away. Right away. I put him in the heat of battle battle in the most heat he could possibly stand why because i want to know about his personality in fighting you get to learn about people's personalities they tell you who they are they're either give up they're gonna quit they're gonna rise to the occasion they're gonna fight back i need to learn about your personality and in that

tells me about everything so i got certain guys guys that'll get hit, and they'll go and start going hard with another guy. I'm like, what's going on? Oh, he hit me. And it's a communication barrier. Some things, oh, he's been through some things. Something that's deep, dark in his past that he's dealing with that he's bringing into MMA. It's, oh, you were trying to, and when we actually break it down,

he felt like you were trying to hurt me. And it's a mechanism he's using to combat that. He's been doing all his life. So fighting shows personalities, you know? So I meet with my dad. He's getting me through all these different mentals and stuff. We're starting to get all this momentum.

We're getting this gym. We're building up. We're getting all these new fighters. I'm getting on this roll. And then he gets locked up. He goes to prison. My dad's never had any offenses, never did anything, never been in any jail time. We were selling a car. No, we were buying a car. We're buying this car.

He's like, hey, I want to buy this Mercedes. Can you drive the truck down? And you'll drive the truck back, and I'll drive the Mercedes. I'm like, cool. He's like, oh, it's in San Diego. Okay, cool. So we go down there. We meet this guy. No, no, we meet this girl. She doesn't even speak English. So he gives her the ID. He gives her a cashier's check and he goes to test drive the car. While he's going to get in the car, the woman takes off. She takes off. And while he gets in the car, he notices the mileage is not the same. So if we're buying a car and it's 10,000 more mileage, that changes the price on things now. So he goes, the girl's gone.

What the fuck, you know? So he's going through the paperwork. He finds the owner, calls the owner. Some guy comes. We talk to him. We explain it to him. He said, we're going to fix it. We go back home.

Maybe three, four weeks go by. The guy's not answering. Doesn't want to give my dad back his money. We gave him back the car. He's kept the car and the money. So next thing you know, my dad's like, fuck. He's ignoring me, blah, blah, blah. We need to go down, and we need to go over here and talk to him.

So I'm like, I can tell where this is going. I'm like, all right, Dad. We're going to go down. We're going to talk to him. But I'm like, I can tell where this is going. I'm like, all right, dad, I'm going out. We're going to talk to him, but we need to be cool tongues. We need to talk with no heat in our tongues. Let's just, because why?

He's already got the car. He's already got the money. You're pretty much fucked. Like, cause you give him a cashier's check. It's just like cash. Right. You can't get it back.

There's, we're already fucked. So let's just try to be cool. So I don't know why i think god made this all happen for some reason so we go down this guy's house it's me my dad and a masking guy and uh we're driving up there by the coincidence like he's in his gated community and so by coincidence somebody else is driving in the gate opens we drive right behind them go in you know we find this house we pull it to the house we're looking at the house he's like right behind them go in you know we find this house we pull it to the

house we're looking at the house he's like right here but he has another gate and cameras and stuff to actually go to his house so um we're like if we ring the doorbell and tell him come he's gonna see us to us and he's not gonna come he's not gonna answer it he's not gonna give us our money he's gonna ignore us so by coincidence the pizza man comes up you know? He's having me pulling up. So we walk up right at the same time the pizza man's coming. Now, coincidentally, I told my dad, have a cool tongue. Be cool about it. But he's been already feeling like this guy's ignoring me. He already knows.

His feeling's up. It's a scheme. This guy's playing me on my money. Somehow they're running some scheme where they sell cars, and they do this little weird thing. This guy's playing me on my money. Somehow they're running some scheme where they sell cars and they do this little weird thing. And so we go in.

We're talking to the people. We're trying to talk it out. All of a sudden, the guy's saying, oh, I don't got the money. I don't know. He don't know anything. They're yelling back and forth. My dad and this guy, they're yelling back and forth. And now I see a situation that's loud.

We're in this white area. I don't already know what's going on gonna get caught so i'm like hey calm it down you know that you know one my dad head busts a guy now it's went and it's getting real serious i'm like holy i'm trying to comments diffuse the situation diffuse it you know hey look we know you got the money we gave you the money just give him his money you got the car let's just go away guys you know hey look we know you got the money we gave you the money just give him his money you got the car let's just go our way guys you know let's just cool it down so he's like all right i got the money it's in the house before he didn't have the money now he's got the money it's in the house but we don't want to go in the house we're like we're going to house it could be it's gonna get it could be sticky but we don't go in the house he's gonna lock the door

and we're stuck outside and we don't get the money house. He's going to lock the door. We're stuck outside. We don't get the money. You can call the police. We're in this weird position. What do you go? You go left or you go right? Fuck it. We're going to go in.

Don't touch anything. Let's just get the money. We're going to go in and go out. We go in. I forgot to mention. There was a kid there. My dad headbutted the kid. The kid was there.

He started crying. The kid doesn't know. He wasn't there at the time but he just hears a yelling so he comes out all he knows is dad went outside for pizza and now he hears a yelling about some money so the kids go to him give you the money i'll give you the money we're like what like like he thinks it's about this so we all want to go inside and diffuse situation we go inside they're going inside we get the money basically it's a lot of other stuff that happens in the house. A lot of crazy stuff. Basically, we find out he's running a scheme. He has my dad's ID. He's looking us up. He finds out that like when we walked right in the house, he closed the laptop and my dad, the only person that caught

it. I'm like, what the, he's like, well, what did you, what were you doing? And I started arguing about that and I'm trying to defuse him against guys. Like, let's just get the money. But when he opened up the laptop, he had my dad's photocopy of his ID. He was looking up his address, looking up his gym and all this different stuff, right? I'm going to tie you into it later on why this is important. And so they're arguing about that. I defuse them. My dad goes and talks to the kid, calms the kid down. Listen, this is what happened. It's okay. So I'm over there with the other guy. I'm george let's just get the money let's get this done we can get it back our way we get the money we leave my dad's gonna go to atlanta and open a gym this is like now a month or two later he goes to atlanta somewhere they they him. A whole bunch of security, I mean not security, cops, helicopters.

He's looking, and he's seeing them come. He's like, whoever they're going to go at, they're in trouble. But he doesn't know that old boy went to the cops about this. We got our money. We shook hands. We're thinking it's okay. Everybody's cool. We're all cool.

We're like, man, we see that you're running some scheme. You can do that. Somebody else don't play us cool but just go away buddy shake your hands we go away two months later he gets arrested now

so he's arrested in Atlanta deals with all this they're trying to give him 157 years or something like that what? yeah kidnapping

so we find out the laws kidnapping is if you make somebody move within 15 feet in fear not even within their own will. Like if I yell at you right now, Joe, fuck you, what's up? I was like, get the fuck out of here.

And I made you go from here 15 feet within your own. That's kidnapping. What? Yeah. So they hit him with a kidnapping charge, assault charge, burglary, robbery. They're stacking the charges up, you know? Is that true everywhere? 15 feet is kidnapping?

Is that like a national thing? You tell me brother We're gonna find out We got Jamie We got the man Jamie over there I just found out Jamie's face to the name Yeah you just pulled up Jamie

He's the fucking man So We're doing that shit I'm now But that sounds crazy i'm going oh fuck they locked him up i get scared of shit i know what's up you're guilty by association i didn't hit that man i didn't want no situation i don't want nothing to do with this i came to defuse the situation and now i'm looked at as an accomplice, you know? To 157 years, I go hiding.

And like I said to you earlier, can't nobody find me, not even my motherfucking mama. Okay? Nobody find me. So my dad's in prison. He's trying to find me. But he can't. He's like, bro, I can't. I got to be out on the streets to get to find him.

You know? He wants me to go and talk to him and work this out. He's got a lawyer and he's got it all out and he's working these things out. They're trying to get him 157 years. I'm scared. I live by the Pirate's Code. Like, we're black people. The Pirate's Code.

Whoever falls behind gets left behind, you know? And so we all running and whoever the police catch, they caught you and you don't tell and we get away. Whoever gets away. If I get caught, I shut the fuck up and that's just what it is. And so I'm not talking to my dad. I had no contact with him. I'm just like trying to stay away from it.

It's been about a year. I've been sleeping nights. The Mexican guy's like, brother, we didn't do anything wrong. We can't keep hiding. We're not working. We can't fight. We can't do anything. We're just scared, you know. And he's like, we got to do what we need to do. We're not working. We can't fight. We can't do anything. Like, we're just scared, you know?

And he's like, we got to do what we need to do. We got to go back to living. So I start talking to his wife, my dad's wife, and getting in contact with him and what's going on. Turns out they were going to give him 157 years, but he hired a private investigator, followed that guy around. Turns out that guy was meeting with the judge and the DA at a golf course to his case. It's a conflict of interest, you know? And so he was able to show that. They gave him two years.

First offense, never did nothing. Never been in prison, jail, nothing like that. And now he's got to go to prison, you know? And he's dealing with a wildlife. I wanted him to tell you the story about all this stuff that he had to go through and where we is that why you brought him here yes yes i thought you okay yeah i wanted him to explain all these different stuff so that's paused our relationship let's pause we'll get him in here okay cool cool yeah i want to hear it we're gonna pause we're

gonna bring him in why don't you introduce your dad? Okay. First of all, I'm going to introduce my dad. He's crazy, but I wouldn't be here without him. I'm so thankful. Loyalty is big for me, and we've been through this crazy journey, and it's so dope to have him here. Jake Benny. Thank you. I appreciate just being a part of your story.

Well, he wanted to bring you in before. He started telling me the story, and then he's like, we've got to bring him in. So you were out there. That's why I messaged you. I was like, can I bring my dad? See, when you said, I thought you meant to the studio. I didn't think you meant on the show. Nah, nah.

We're going to get deep on this motherfucker. Okay. I'm going to give you some real shit, Joe. Okay. Because nobody else is going to give it to you like this. I believe you, Bobby Green. I mean my pop and shit. And he's got this crazy black guy in his gym, you know?

And he, like, the fighters that he had before, they were fighting once, twice a year, you know? Right. Here I come, and I'm like, I just had four fights last month. Like, let's keep it rolling. Like, let's fight. And I wouldn't go to the gym unless he had a fight. Right. He'd always, like, on me me trying to fucking make me stay at the

gym and i'd always this was a battle for us you know you have to come get me and force me so i'm so thankful that like that's why i call him my dad is that a real father somebody that that takes the time to make it better you know right see something in you bring it out of you because i wouldn't i'll be somewhere in the streets working a freaking warehouse job if it wasn't for him it's a hard gig to be a fighter man i finally find someone to have the kind of belief in you to be able to do that that he had that for you at that time must have been like the one of the most special things right it didn't it didn't at that time it didn't feel like it and not at that time it made sense later on you know because i didn't believe it like he would

tell me like you're gonna you're gonna make a lot of money you're gonna you're gonna be this you're gonna make belts you're gonna i'm like so while he was pushing you why were you resisting what were you thinking um i was thinking about money i was thinking short term like hey okay this stuff ain't ain't paying enough i'm working a warehouse job i'm gonna be leveling up in there i'm gonna become a lead and then a manager i'm not gonna be yeah no i'm gonna work up the ladder in the working environment can you imagine if that's how you went you went that way i would not allow all the time he begged me to quit my job. All the time. It's like a lot of coaches go through, you know,

like they have these fighters they develop these intimate relationships with. They talk to their wives about them, their families about them, their kids about them, you know what I mean? Next thing you know, it's just they're part of the family, you know what I mean? And he lived with us for a lot of his fights, you know, and that was really kind of how I was able to keep the reins on him, to be honest with you. For real, like we'd get a fight and I'd have to go find fights, you know, and that was really kind of how I was able to keep the reins on him, to be honest with you. For real, like, we'd get a fight, and I'd have to go find him, you know, and bring him to my house. I told you that he'd have to go find me.

I believe you. I'd take his keys from him, you know what I mean? Take his car keys from him and shit, and that way he'd only ride with me, you know? So we'd just do two a day. Wake me up, make me get up and go to kids' class, after kids' class, then we got adult class, and then we got MMA class. Like, all this stuff. I used to hate it.

But I realized at that point in time, that's where I really honed into my skills. And I realized, oh, this is what it takes. Be really zoned in and really do it. Nothing else but it. Yeah. Yeah. And so eventually, you just gave in. Yeah. Yes. and so eventually you just gave in yeah I'd say it's probably

for instance I used to like he first like with the smoking he was against it you know so you're like well fuck it well at least do this can you give me 20 days clean before you know and I would give you like 15 and then it got to 20 and then I got a little better, I got 25

and I started, oh this is, I saw the results in my fights. Oh you need to be clean. You need your lungs. I just talked to my boy Terrence McKinney and I was just like he's like bro I'm one of your I'm a big fan of you. I'm like I'd like Rashad did it with me. Big brother

to this. Hey give him a little advice. He hit me up and wanted to smoke with me right before the Islam fight. I'm like, Rashad did it with me, big brother to this. Hey, give me a little advice. He hit me up and wanted to smoke with me right before the Islam fight. I'm like, what? You smoke? He's like, yeah. And he just went out there, smoked, and then smoked the guy. I'm like, yeah, I used to do that too, brother. Trust me.

I used to smoke weed and beat guys too. But I realized at this level, you can't do it, big dog. Come here. Don't put that weed down. Focus on your craft. And then after you go party, you party hard, you know? How different do you feel when you do 25 days of no weed? Like, what's the difference?

It's so crazy, brother. I was going to get into that. But how do you feel when you do that? What's the difference? How does he feel? How does everybody else feel? That's what I was going to get into. Is that what the problem is?

Yes. Yeah, you get tense. Detoxing. Yes. I don't know if it's detoxing, man. I think marijuana is medicine for a lot of folks. It's the tobacco. I only smoke tobacco.

I mean, blunts. I don't smoke bongs. Oh, so you became addicted to tobacco, too. So now I'm detoxing. That's heavy tobacco, too. I thought it was the weed at first, you know? And that's when I cut the weed out, and then I realized it's the tobacco on the weed.

That is the thing, man. When I first got introduced to the blunt, I was like, what a brilliant thing. But there's no high like it. No high like it. It's a different high. It's a different high. It's a high high.

Yes. It's not like you, the tobacco is a stimulant, I think. Is that what it is? But, like, tobacco is a stimulant, I think. Is that what it is? It's, I know it's got cognitive benefits. Tobacco enhances your thinking. There's a lot of people that are writers that get addicted to smoking because it just enhances their focus.

It does something to them. Same thing with jiu-jitsu. It makes you creative. Yeah. Them Autumn 10 planning guys. There's a lot of blunts involved in those positions. Get around and move. Yeah.

So now I meet the guy that I'm finding all the success with. Who's this Bobby Green kid? You know, we're killing shit. We got belts. And we're putting our gym on the map. All the fighters are starting to kind of gravitate in. We're getting our momentum. And then he goes to jail.

And so now that he went to prison and i was breaking that down for him pop is yeah so bob was telling us the story and you said like what what what's your version of the story yeah you know one of the things i learned through this process like like he said we didn't talk for a while you know like there was some communication with him but for for the most part, like the first six months, you know, it was like I was hiding. Yeah, you're hiding. So the perspective I got to hear the victim's perspective when I was in court, some of it was correct. Some of it was a lie, flat out lie. And then I got to hear Bobby's perspective eventually and then the other kid's perspective.

And then I lived what my perspective was, you know. And about 80% of it is correct in all the ways, but there's always that 20% that's different. You know, everybody else sees something different. They feel something different, you know. Right. Especially in a time of panic. Yeah. That's the big problem.

You don't see it all the same when we're all, oh, like somebody came shooting and like had a red shirt no he had a red stripes right he had a you know that's a real problem with eyewitness testimony in those big crazy events right yeah and i had to come to terms with the understanding of of that like when it happened to me and i went in and going through that whole process like you're really angry because what's happening is not what should have happened right now pop tell him so are we gonna walk him I want you to tell him the real shit I want you to tell him that shit like the process of you gotta understand what it is for a person who's never been in jail doesn't know the rules of jail does I mean a prison doesn't know anything about that stuff and in the life he went through like he shared a lot of this stuff with me and I

don't know how much he wants to share but just but it's it's it's essentially a story of the legal system gone wrong too in your case because you you got fucked you went to god god gives you money back and then somehow or another you catch a case oh i said that like a rapper i don't think i've ever said catch a case i wasn't even trying hard talking it is that's exactly what it is like how did what the fuck is this like and like how does it keep your faith like how do you how do you get through some something like that where you know you were wronged and somehow or another someone lied and made it look like you did something you didn't. Yeah. That's essentially the story, right? Yeah. It was a scam.

I was able to, during this whole process, we were able to figure out this gentleman had fraud in Indiana. He had fraud in Arizona. So he's a scam artist. Yeah, absolutely. Played basketball at Indiana University. He's a guy 6'9", 290 pounds. And they didn't factor any of this in?

Bro, I'm in the preliminary. No, it's who calls first. Yeah, it's in who calls first. We didn't call the police. We thought we shook hands on a gentleman thing and we're good. Oh, my God. He went and called the police. Oh, my God.

So this guy, everything's documented in the court case, right? So our incident took place. He went to go see his attorney the next day. Then he went to the hospital. And then from the hospital back to his house. Then a police report. And then that police report. Then he goes back to his attorney.

And it's like he's just been coached this whole process. And really what it came down to in my situation was they wanted Bobby. They wanted the nigga. Exactly. The nigga from the IE. And I didn't do shit even in the the court paperwork like they have to write all this stuff down and and they go present it to me i'm reading through all this stuff and it's multiple times in there with we want the african-american guy

the black guy the black kid from san bernardino they're like and they wanted me to give up bobby and this other kid that i had with me to get a better deal. So they come with me all these years, and then they want the black guy. So the stuff that happened inside the house, when we walked into the house, this guy tried to do some sideways shit. Things got all chaotic again in the house, and then I see all this stuff on the computer. And it wasn't just me on the computer. He had a picture of my wife at the time on there my kids schools where they went to school like this fucking guy had so much shit it was like i wanted to just smash this guy right and just go but that's not what happened you know

i mean like for the most part everything was pretty level-headed and that's why i felt like when we when we left the situation it was like okay we're things are gonna be okay you know but you did have that fear you know maybe that's why because you had your information yeah that you felt like that like i stayed at his house for like the next two weeks because we felt like he has his address he has all this information on you know i pull my guns i put my shotgun in here and like that you know what i mean like i don't want to fucking live like that right i mean like it's ridiculous we had no intentions of any type of stuff like this for this situation ever when you just stumbled into a scam artist

yes yeah well that's just it's insane that they can't and San Diego in the way the way it works is they have a 90 it's like Jamie probably 98 think it's 96.8% conviction rate in the city of San Diego. So if you- What does that mean? If they catch you for something, you're going. That means, okay, conviction rate means you're going to prison, not necessarily just county jail, right? So their conviction rate is so high that if you get arrested in San Diego, 96, 97% of the time, you're going to catch a case. We definitely got to Google this.

What's the conviction rate of San Diego? That's crazy if true. I'll file that under crazy if true. That seems real high. Unless they are so careful about arresting people. Think about it like this.

In the paperwork it says they wanted the black guy because they don't want these IE thugs coming down to the great city of San Diego and harassing their residents. Oh, wow. Harassing their thieves? Exactly. They don't want this to become a fad where I'm, like, telling my homies,

hey, we just hit a lick and let's keep going down to San Diego, you know, some stupid shit like that. So the incident takes place outside. And at the time, my understanding is they changed kidnapping in the penal code now. So a few years ago they. I wrote that already down. I wrote the kidnapping shit down. He was telling me that it's 15 feet.

Is that real? I think it's 18 or 23 feet. 23 feet. So if you get someone to walk 23 feet against their will, that's kidnapping. Yeah. And so he gets on the stand at the preliminary hearing and says, I moved 23 feet from the front of my driveway to the front of the house. That's 23 feet. So because he got on the stand and said that,

now the jurors have to hold this law to its highest standard. It took an oath to hold this law to its highest standard it took an oath to hold the law to its highest standard and if they just decide oh no this guy this guy's innocent like this is fucked up situation whatever this this guy's whatever right then the juror gets charged with obstruction of justice that carries two to four years in prison and i believe so what juror is going to stand up for me to not go to prison to say, hey, no, this is wrong. We're giving this guy kidnapping, but this is not kidnapping. But in our penal code, this is what it reads. If your victim was willingly on his own goodwill and says he's in fear for his life more than 18 feet or 23 feet, that's kidnapping.

Don't even have to touch him. So they stack these four charges up because the kid and him. Don't even have to touch them. So they stacked these four charges up because the kid and him. So I had four counts of kidnapping, which was two that carry an NL and then two with the possibility of parole. Jesus Christ. Yeah. And then you start stacking up all these other charges and all these years start adding up.

Right. And then all of a sudden you're facing something that you don't even know how to fight it. You don't know how to fight it. The system's too it just swallows you up you know Wow so show how you felt when you saw that we saw them years man I just brought it was unreal it's like I'm crying down dude you know he said he was crying all over the paperwork that he couldn't even sign it yeah that they had to go print another one out so they brought me this deal right okay so they come to me print another one out. So they brought me this deal, right? Okay, so they come to me. We're going to jury selection.

And they come to me and say, okay, we'll give you 10 years with 85 and a strike if you sign today. And I'm like, what the fuck, man? Like, my attorneys are all telling me to sign this paperwork, right? And I just couldn't get myself to do it, man. Part of the problem here was the main problem. One, I feel like I go in 10 years, I'm never going to get out. I'm a first-termer. I've got to go in.

I've got to put work in. And you're going to catch more time. So it's really hard to get out of the system if you're going to be in there that long. So when all this stuff went down, they bring me the deal. The deal is 10 years at 85. And I'm looking at it and my attorneys are like, you got to sign it, you got to sign it. And I just couldn't, you know, like I couldn't bring myself to say that I was a thief. So they want me to put on paper and document that I'm a thief.

They want me to take a deal robbery, 21 with a strike you know great body injury all this stuff i'm like no i didn't do that that's not my character like i can't say that i'm a thief because i despise thieves you know and i'm it's like like that's part of what broke me you know was here's what i feel like i can stand up for as a man right like you Like, you think, oh, I'll handle myself this way in this situation. I would do it like this, you know? We ain't never been in that situation where you got fucking your whole life changing. And then you face those. Yeah.

You face those things. Like, oh, you're innocent. Fucking go to trial. Yeah, but if you lose. What? Like, they set it up that it's not going to be a victory like that. You know what I mean? And you were saying the percentage was, what was it?

I think it was 96%. This is the most I could find from 2017. 94. It says 94%. Oh, that's so high. And at my time, it was 96.8 when I went in. Oh, that's so high. Yeah.

It says, oh, San Diego County District Attorney's Office has a felony conviction rate of 94%. There you go. felony conviction rate of 94 there you go well if they were like the best police ever and and everybody was telling the truth at all times bro and there's no mistakes made yes these are perfect i don't know man these guys are so crooked bro oh i want to talk about this i want to get to this but this fits in here do you know that whole story about the staircase? There was like some conviction where the father was convicted of throwing someone. Yeah, it was a documentary. Or the husband, rather, was convicted of pushing the wife down the stairs.

They think now this is a possibility that she might have been attacked by an owl. That was part of the, yeah, that's not new. It isn't? No. Oh. I think that might be the end of the documentary. I was just reading this article about it. It was just out.

I'm pretty sure somebody sent me an old article. I heard about that, yeah. They found microscopic owl hairs, or owl feathers, rather, in her hair. Wow. And they found holes that could have been talon marks I believe I don't want to fuck this up yeah because I was reading it what happened to him is a question 2018 this came out is that it yeah that's it so it's an old story yeah I've been doing times somebody sent to me and I

didn't look at the date but anyway this fucking owl might have killed this lady. The owl hit her head apparently with the talons and she was, apparently she had been out drinking and having a good time and here it is. According to the theory the events of the night unfold like this.

This is just a theory. Kathleen Peterson was outside the couple's home at night while her husband was down by their pool. An owl, likely a barrel owl. Let's say that ten times fast. A barred owl. It's

barred, right? B-A-R-R-E-D. Barred owl swooped down and attacked Kathleen on her head, causing the lacerations police found later. Yes, owls do attack humans. We'll get into that later. Kathleen then ran inside to escape the owl, which had ripped out chunks of her hair. Pine needles were also found in her hands, along with microscopic feathers.

Drops of blood were found on the front steps, and the door had blood smeared on it, indicating that whatever happened it wasn't totally confined to the staircase and continue with the theory kathleen at this point attempted to go upstairs where she slipped and fell toxicology toxicology reports found traces of anti-anxiety medication muscle relaxants and alcohol combined with an owl attack. Getting up a long flight of stairs is far from a straightforward proposal. The theory posits that she slipped and fell, causing the injuries that ultimately led to her death. Wow.

Which is, it sounds like- It's far-fetched. It doesn't sound that far-fetched if there's blood on her hand and she's bleeding in front of the steps and she's got her own blood on the door opening the door she's already been hit yeah something something happened already yeah you may but i thought you said something like did he do time pushed him and that's what i'm trying to find out what happened no not not dad i'm sorry the husband i think that was the guy who got convicted for it right oh and then they got they let him out there was a mistrial i believe that's

the story behind it wow yeah i don't i haven't watched that documentary though so i might be this up yeah that's what imagine if your wife got killed by a owl though that is so crazy but i'm just trying to figure out the husband point of view like they thought it was him oh my god wife got killed by an owl and you get unfairly pegged as the as the killer that's the thing man you realize like that system is not perfect no i've met a lot of a lot of pretty good people in there believe it or not you know like a lot of veterans man yeah a lot of veterans in there a lot of people have drug issues more so you know issues there mentally that are happening could put lansom in prison

you know for, for sure. Drug problems. Yeah, and that's a big part of the homeless problem as well. Drug problems, mental health problems, lack of mental health institutions. That's why you came to Texas, huh? You said, hey, I'm out of here. It's too much. No. The money.

It was the big thing coming to Texas was they don't tell you what to do. There was a thing about California stopping people from doing shows, stopping people from doing stand-up, even outside. They wouldn't let them have outside shows for a while. It didn't make any sense. The Comedy Store was trying to do shows outside. They were like, no, no shows outside.

We don't want any shows. I'm loving Texas, brother. It's nice. It's chill. It's nice. People are friendly. Yes. Even the white guys, you know?

And my coach told me some shit. He was like, Durant, he was like, it's because they got guns on them. They ain't worried about nothing, you know. Back in California, you can't carry it. That's an unfortunate reality, that old expression of well-armed society is a polite society. You know? Really, unfortunately, it's true. Because you know where it could go.

Yeah. It ain't no fight. It's, oh, he's true. Because you know where it could go. Yeah. It ain't no fight. It's, oh, he's going for his gun. Well, a friend of mine once said we were out to dinner with fighters post-UFC, and he was like, dude, I met like 10 fighters from you. He goes, they're all the nicest guys. I'm like, yeah, because they have nothing to prove. They have nothing to prove.

They're not puffing up their chest like a rooster and walking around wanting people to respect them. They don't give a prove. They have nothing to prove. They're not puffing up their chest like a rooster and walking around wanting people to respect them. They don't give a fuck. They're tired from training. They just want to chill and relax. They have no, I need to prove I'm the baddest motherfucker in the room in them. They have zero of it. There you go.

Our egos aren't there. You don't like that. Especially guys who do MMA because there's going gonna be an area where you don't excel okay okay okay so you're hitting on something I have to explain this to a lot of my I hate to say it

but a lot of my a lot of my niggas like when they first want to come to MMA a lot of black dudes got egos and I have to tell them listen

it's different in this world I know in the streets like you feel bad and you could like somebody say something you feel like you could talk but in here we're just going in the streets like you feel bad and you could like somebody say something you feel like you could talk but in here we're just going on the mat

and solve it. Yeah. And it's the difference in the world. If we know who's the big fish and we know who's the small fish we've seen you and you can't hide

behind words we've seen you being your awkward that's what I tell you about earlier about fighting is it shows your personality is we've seen you in your most vulnerable

we've seen you be hurt we've seen you like ugh you gave up we saw you be hurt. We've seen you like, ugh, you gave up. We saw you be tired and have nothing left. Yeah. You're at your most vulnerable. Well, with a lot of young guys that are really tough,

there's a moment where you realize when you start training with people that are on an elite level, they start seeing like, oh, my God, I'm getting lit up. Like you've got to realize who you really are. Like in the food chain. And some guys can accept that, and they become more technical, and they get better. And some guys, they're like, it's too much.

They have to get. They quit. Yeah, to get to where, you know, Dos Anjos, who you talked about earlier, to get to where that guy is. I mean, that guy has been putting in work for a long time i was thinking that while i was watching the mcconnell fight i was like he has been putting in work for a long time yeah way he's a real fighter a real fighter mcconnell called me out did he really yeah and i just want to tell him hey i acknowledge you i hear you

all the guys that called me out like i get a list now now that i'm somebody in somebody's eyes just wait until after this show and they're like calling me out and stuff i'm like hey i just want you guys to know i acknowledge you i hear you and i would love to fight you but again i have bosses they make the fights so whoever they pick is who i fight but i want you to acknowledge you because i felt like before this little bubble, I would call guys out and they wouldn't give you the acknowledgement. You know? Like the first person who ever said my name, and I made this in my book, it's like, I mean, I write it now.

It's like, if you say my name, I'm going to fight you. I'm going to get you. You know? Like Candyman. Yeah, you say my name, I shall appear. You know? And so Tony called my name, but I was number six in the world at the time. Before Tony had his rise and he called, he wanted to fight me.

I'm like, I accept it. I acknowledge. I gave you that opportunity. Now it's flipped. And I'm like, hey, Tony, you wanted that fight. How about that fight? No answer. Crickets.

He's showing me he's seen it, like even messaging him, but he's not answering. Oh, come on now. Don't do that. Give me my acknowledgement, you know? Give me the acknowledgement. Acknowledge me as a man. The only person that acknowledged me and I had to tell him

was the Irish dragon, Felder. Felder. I was like, hey, Felder, I appreciate your acknowledgement. You know, you at least let me know I'm in the room. You see me and you respect me and hey, go do this or do that

or maybe we'll fight. At least acknowledge me. Yes. Felder's a great guy he is a great guy i love doing uh commentary with him this past weekend he's a sweetheart of a guy he's been getting i hated that he's getting like picked on a little bit by some of the guys you know with the commentary like uh it's hard man it's you're thinking in real time you're thinking in the middle of fights they ain't fights they know I'm fucking up to man I fucking up to is there's no way around it man. It's uh

It's a weird Thing you're in the middle of calling something you get excited you get emotional you're you're you're attached You know people you know you you have ideas in your head about how you thought it was gonna be versus how it's actually Happening you know every commentator experiences all of those things You have ideas in your head about how you thought it was going to be versus how it's actually happening. You know, every commentator experiences all of those things. You know, that's all the stuff that I had to go through. So, Pa, I want you to tell him about when the police actually came. You almost have to be animated to do it.

I mean, I want you to tell him. So I'm in Atlanta. I'm in Atlanta. We're getting ready to buy a gym. Yeah. And I did some research out there to see if there was any gyms in the area. We're in Alpharetta, near Cobb County. Right.

And I was buying a house in Canton. And I'm paying the whole house off, basically. Financing like 50 grand. Right. And they're like, oh, we're having problems with your your bureaus right i'm like this is impossible i have like 800 some credit score you know i've got 450 grand right here like what's going on so she's like oh just go get some food and then come back and we'll have it all put together right so i take off hop in this car and driving down the street and i see a jujitsu school and there's like 40 50 kids in this car and driving down the street and I see a jiu-jitsu school. And there's like 40, 50 kids in this school, right?

But I had been online looking and seeing who's in the area and I never saw a school in the area. So I just like crossed over from like two lanes, right? Right into this parking lot. And hop out of my car, run into this jiu-jitsu school real quick and I'm watching this class. and this fucking coach this guy this instructor is golly black belts and certificates all over the wall and everything got like 40 kids and it's 40 guys in this class so I sit down I was just watching I'm like man seems off like some seems off in here you know I'm like looking and this fool starts teaching some shit he's like hold on a second and he runs over to the corner

and he flips through this book and look looking at this book, he runs back and he shows the other half of the move. You know? Teaching from a fucking book. I'm like, that's kind of strange. You know? So afterwards I asked him, I said, hey, who did you get your black belt from? And he goes, oh, from the Gracies. And I say, from who?

And he goes, oh, I did these things where I recorded myself doing these moves. And I sent it in to them. And then they send me back this Gracie Combatives fucking black belt bullshit, right? What? Yeah. No, wait a minute. Hold on a second. Hold on a second. You're saying you can get a black belt online?

This is what this guy tells me. It's a great video. It's called a Gracie Combatives black belt. But that's not real. He's lying, right? No, they really did it. There was a time where I don't know who started it, okay? But you could send in, like you could do these moves, right?

They give you this layout of like here's what your criteria is to be a blue belt, purple belt, a black belt, like all this stuff, right? You could do it online with no formal instruction? I don't know how he did it. How is that possible? That's what we call the posers though, brother. That's what we call the posers. But I brother. That's what we call the posers. I don't think – You've exposed some people.

I never heard that. He had a certificate on his wall that said Gracie's Combative Certificate. But that would be a giant scandal in the MMA and jiu-jitsu community. We call them posers, you know. But I don't think a black belt – is that real? I mean, we have to be real careful about this. I'm being totally serious. You really can get a black belt online?

No, I don't know about – this guy said he did. Oh. This guy said he did. These fake posers, guys. You really can get a black belt? No, I don't know about... This guy said he did. Oh. This guy said he did. Fake posers, guys. You know how that goes. He was trying to tell me that he had a black belt under the Gracies. You're weed, goddammit. Bobby Green. What the fuck have you done to my brain? I'm telling you. Oh, I got... Okay, I was confused.

I'm sorry. I thought you were saying... Okay, got it. So then I realized, like, this guy don't know shit. Right. So I'm fucking pumped, right? I'm thinking, I call his ass. I'm like, bro, we're going to kill it out here, right? So get on the phone. I call my wife.

I'm like, man, I just ended school. They got, like, 40 students in here, and this guy sucks. Like, we're going to kill it, right? And I'm on the phone with her, and all of a sudden I see this big truck come in the parking lot, like, speeding, right? Like, and I'm like, fuck, this is crazy, right crazy right and this other car to the other side and all of a sudden this guy jumps out of the black truck they pull up right on me right like this this guy jumps out and he's like full fucking body armor bro jumps out running at me everybody get out of crowd get out i just turned square up with this guy right square up and he's like

oh like tries to stop. He takes a digger, falls into the fucking curb, into the planter. So I turn around. I'm like looking to fight with this other guy. And then I realize like fucking helicopters, news vans, 23 fucking 25. You have no idea why they're attacking you. I have no clue what's going on. That is fucking crazy.

So they slam me on the ground, start fucking me up, right? Get me all twisted up and shit. And this guy comes over and he's like, we got you, motherfucker. You're going down. You're going down, motherfucker. And I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa. Like, what the hell's going on? I'm like, bro, you guys got the wrong guy. Like, you got the wrong guy, dude.

And this guy puts this picture of me down. And he's like, I don't think so, motherfucker. You're going down. And I'm looking at my picture. I'm like, I said, what am i going down for bro he goes you're going to ever kidnap your bitch and i go kidnapping i don't even have my daughter with me you said that well i had just gone to court a few months prior oh jesus christ so i raised my my daughter my um from 18 months old till she was about six. And I got married about five and a half or so.

So I got married. So I raised her for a handful of years by myself. Mom peeled out to Florida. She's my girl. Love you guys. Brooke Riley, love you guys to death. Shout outs. Yeah, for sure.

My kids are awesome. So you think that someone is saying that you have kidnapped your child? Yeah. And I got all this court documentation saying I can move my kid from California to Atlanta. The secondhand smoke in this room is very potent. You're going to have to keep me on track, too, then. Okay, that's what I'm saying. Stay on track.

Sorry. So I fucking forgot. Where is that now? Oh, I knew it. you're talking about them uh putting the in your face the picture and yeah okay so they have the photo of you and the rest one okay so i get the court kidnapping work to allow me to move my daughter there you know what i mean right so they're telling me oh no you're kidnapping this is what you got and i'm going no no i have court paperwork to prove that that I did not kidnap my daughter.

Like, I've been raising my daughter. And he's like, I don't know. You're going to jail, though, bro. So I go to jail. But everything out there in Atlanta, different area codes and stuff, right? So I get on their phone. I can't call long distance to let anybody know I'm arrested. So now I'm sitting in this holding tank for, like, six days. My wife's trying to figure out where the fuck I'm arrested. So now I'm sitting in this holding tank for like six days.

My wife's trying to figure out where the fuck I'm at. Everybody's trying to figure out where I'm at. And then it starts going down. Everybody starts figuring out, oh, he got arrested. And it was like all these crazy rumors and shit going around, you know. And then it just leads into this whole process of this crazy case right i'm in atlanta i'm there now locked up for about three months or so they extradite me back to california but anything okay extradite back to california not bad right bullshit i look like fucking hannibal lecter dude they fucking

put me in this shit fucking Handcuff shackled walking through the airport like this and I never done anything wrong like I never had a speeding ticket, bro I never had a nothing. I went from sleeping on a $15,000 bed to sleeping on a metal fucking rack You know, I mean with no no pad concrete floor use a milk crate for a milk carton for a pillow, you know I'm like stupid shit you know that's what really trying to get them to understand the audience and stuff is like because I went to Jeff for my first time too and it was such a experience for somebody who's been like as of when I go into jail I had already started getting money and to understand this isn't normal and to be in it's a it's a it's crazy experience that I'm trying to get people to understand.

For people that are the normal, that you ain't been in jail, you don't do bad, and you don't. And then you go in there with the people that this is normal to them. It's a different wave. Yeah, different. Totally different thought processes. So how did you eventually get out? There's so much. He's still got so much out? There's so much. He's still got so much story.

There's so much shit in between there. Yeah, but they said. Am I interrupting the storyline? Yeah, you're missing so much stuff. I'm a fast forward type of dude. How much of it do you want to know, really? No, anything that's interesting. Just tell me what happened.

Oh, my God, dude. So first day. First day in jail. One day I feel like I want to write a book eventually about this whole story, this journey. And I feel like the journey's not justified unless we fight for a world title. That's kind of how I feel. That'll give me the credibility to be able to tell my story. So it's been this journey of grinding, trying to prove that we're good enough to be there.

We're getting there, and then it gets fucking locked up right when we're getting there. I get signed to Strikeforce and all that other stuff right when it gets locked up. Yeah. Basically, they did some sideways shit at King of the Cage in his contract, and I had the contract. Okay.

But I'm locked up, and I don't have access to the contract. It's in my filing system at my school, right? So I have to get access to the contract. It's in my filing system at my school, right? So I have to get access to this contract now, get it to the right people so that we can get him out of his – While you're in jail. Yeah. So I'm on the phone talking to Terry and talking to Shingo and a couple other people, you know, and we're going through this whole thing.

And I'm like, no, that's not in the contract. That's not in the contract. And they're trying to hold on to him and keep him and basically he was supposed to get a rematch with Tim Means so they say okay no you got to beat Dom O'Grady so now we fight Dom O'Grady and this whole time I'm locked up he's fighting these fights I'm I got a phone right so I get a smartphone from awesome CO in there just like blessed me you you know? So I come in, and I'm working on my phone,

and I start scrolling through, and we, okay, now we're fighting Jay-Z Cavalcante. He's doing all the fight work and breaking the fighters down from jail. What they're doing, watching videos on them, their habits. Oh, you had a whole Internet connection and everything? I had a, everything worked. I had, like, the baddest phone that was out at the time. Yeah, he's out of yeah he's a dollar boy yeah how much of that's going on oh tons of it like there's a phone everywhere in there really yeah it's like it's a big business you know like if you think

about it break it down huge money of course for fucking cell phones of course it's already a lot of money on the outs you know so the So the people go on the outside that don't understand how the system works. They're like, oh, how did he get these phones in there? How did he get drugs in there? Well, how the fuck do you think they get in there? Because the fucking COs that work there are making extra money. Don't be ratting them out though, bro. I don't have no names.

I'm not a rat, that's for sure. How many of them are there so we don't have to worry about one of them being obviously them? I would say, honestly, I met maybe 10% of the COs in there are actually really good guys. Oh, that's cool. I knew a guy who worked security at a prison. He was a real nice guy, but he carried it with him. Carried it with him. All those dudes being trapped. He would go to visit them when he worked there and then leave and go home

to his family and be able to drive around. He carried with him like there was like a certain amount of sorrow involved in it. What do you mean by that? Because, you know, he's a prison guard for these folks that don't want to be there. You're trapped in this in this environment that you've been sentenced to. You have to, boom, the door shuts and you're locked in. And this guy was one of the people that was supposed to be in charge of keeping these people in line. And they have this relationship. You get to know each other.

You talk to the COs. Was he a CO or was he what? He was some security guard. I was a kid. I don't know what exactly he was. I was 21 or 20, 21 at the time. And, you know, he would just talk about it. It was hard.

They say that you're doing time with you. Man, that's like, that is not. I'm sure some of them are fucking assholes. Man, here's the thing. I see this. I got to go on the other side of the fence. Do you know what I mean? So in my program, in my academy that I had,

I had a lot of COs come through my academy, had a lot of sheriffs, a lot of cops come through my academy. I always gave them extra shit, like extra help, extra this, extra philosophy. So they knew you were cool. No, but these guys weren't in with me. They're at different institutions, right? So they didn't know that I had not been in the institution yet while I was working with these guys at the time. So I have this understanding of what their personality is like, what their character is like, just from them being in my program, right?

Right. Okay. Then you take that guy and now you put him in an environment. In his environment. Yes. Like he's in our environment, so he's a little more humble. His character's a little bit different. He's getting his ass kicked in the room.

And then you put him in that environment where now he got a badge, he got a billy club. He got. Or he got a whatever. Yeah. And this guy's a different character. Now he's abusing his power. He's fucking with guys. And this is where all the problems occur because nobody in there have a problem with these COs.

They don't have a problem with the cops. They don't have a problem with the cops. They don't have a problem with them. They only have a problem with them if they're fucking with them. So these cops get in there and these COs get in there and some of them train. Man, I'm going to tell you right now, there's a guy that was in there that fucked with me and I found out he trained at a school locally,

not far from our school, and I went to visit the school. I went to go enroll on open mat that day. And he see me, and he took off. But I only say this because, like, if they don't abuse their power, the system is not that bad on the inside. Do you think as a person who's been inside that it is just a natural inclination that some people have to abuse that kind of supreme power? Like the kind of power that a security guard has over a guy who is locked up inside a cell in front of him. Like that's a crazy power.

You could open the door. You could keep it locked. You could give him food or not give him food. Or not. Or give him a phone or not give him a phone. Like it's crazy that kind of power over a human being yeah, like what a super unnatural environment to force upon people and under the guise of Guess punishment, but the idea that you're getting rehabilitated while that's happening. He's not there's no rehabilitation in there

They like the whole programs and everything. They're all bullshit. Just a bunch of bullshit. But what do you do? I mean, how do you know when there's a situation like yours versus a situation where somebody really did rob somebody? Oh, there's a lot of guilty people in there, bro. You know what I mean? And some people change. Some people don't change. You know, like one of my best friends, Richard Vasek, I met in there. And he had done juvenile life for gang killing, right?

So this kid goes into the system. I'll tie this into when I met him, right? So what ends up happening is I get transferred from a level four to a level two. And the politics is much different, the situation is much different, much safer in a level two. But I'm new to all this, right? I want you to tell them the first day if you got in. That's what I want you to tell them. The first day.

Because that's what I'm saying. If you don't understand, there's rules and politics. And if you don't know, you'll run into a roadblock. You'll get caught up with more time, more problems, and so explain. There's just unwritten rules, you know what I mean? Like, there's rules. Like, you can't do this. You can't walk through this area.

You can't say this word. You say punk, you say bitch, you gotta fight. If you don't fight, then you're a bitch, you're a punk. Everybody's gonna come take your shit. So if somebody calls you a bitch or a punk, it's just fire. And you don't know that. You don't know that. I didn't know that.

I used to mess around with all my friends. We'd be joking around, messing around, oh, whatever, bitch. Yeah, it was cool in the streets. And you slip like that in there. It's different. It's on. It's on. Wow. Yeah, I had that problem. I called my friends, oh, bro, you've been that in there. It's different. It's on. It's on. Wow.

Yeah, I had that problem. Like, I called my friends, oh, bro, you've been a little bitch. Like, black guys would be like, hey, because they still got it from jail. They'd be like, hey, they'll look at me like. Check you. Yeah, they'll look at me with that look like, you know, we've been, we got them codes, you know. And I'd be like, you know, it ain't like, you're my fucking brother. I don't mean it like that.

Wow, it just sticks with you. But he would give me that look for a second. Yeah, he still got it in him. So I originally get picked up in Atlanta, right? So I get picked up in Atlanta, take me to Atlanta jail. I go and they put me in this modular, and I go in this modular, and there's black people of all the different races, right? Well, over there, they don't politic like we do in California, right?

So this is my first understanding of how this system works, right? So I go in there, and the only thing that you can't do in that system is you can't eat at the same table with a different race. Besides that, once you're up from the dinner table, I can trade with any race. I could do whatever, talk to them, chop it up. But you have to eat with people of your own race only? Only, yeah. Wow. And they tell you this?

So somebody informs you? yeah oh yeah i got informed when i went so when i when i moved from atlanta to california california politics much different you can't trade you can't trade with with blacks you can't trade with others you can't trade with so you can only do trade with your race and then the whites get along with the the essays so what ended up happening is like so you have others which trade with your race, and then the whites get along with the Estes. So what ended up happening is, like, so you have others, which are any other race besides Mexican, white, or black. And this is a car. It's called a car, right? So everybody has a car, their own race.

So you have woods. You have skinheads. You have paisas. You got Mexicans. You got Crips, Bloods, and others. And the paisas roll with the Mexicans. The skinheads roll with the woods. Yeah.

And if something really pops off, some race shit, then Mexicans and the whites will click up against the blacks. It's always on them against us. It always sucks to be black in them times. I'm telling you, real shit. Hey, but we thump, though. We thump. So we always knock them out anyway.

You start trying to figure out this shit. You get thrown into that fire. You're trying to figure out all these unwritten rules. There's no rule book, law book come in and say, hey, do this, this, this, this. So a guy could really direct you in the wrong way if he wants to. You know what I mean? Tell you some sideways shit and next thing you know you're in a wreck. Ooh.

So I go in. Set you up. So I go in. This you up. So I go in. This was actually my second experience, my first experience in there. But my second experience, I go in, they put me into a psych ward, a psych watch, getting extradited from Atlanta to here. And so I go into this area, and I don't know anything. And this black guy in the psych ward is like yelling in this module you know like anybody want to learn how to play chess anybody want to learn how to play chess you know and i was like hell yeah i want to learn how to play chess right so i walk over i sit down with

this fool and he starts showing me how to play chess but it's a black guy at a black guy table and i'm a white guy so now i just sat down at this black guy table and all the woods and all the skinheads in there are like now against me. Oh, no. But I didn't know. Oh, no. You had no idea. I had no idea. Oh, no.

Right? So now. No, no. Yeah. So now my cell pops and I go to walk to the shower and I walk past the other cell that pops, which is another skinhead in that room. And I go walk past his cell and smack. Right? So now we're fighting.

Wow. You know? So I clean this kid up. Now they move me to another module. So now this kid put a kite out. Like, oh, we got to get this guy. Oh, fun. Yeah.

So I'm moving this other module. At the time, the institution had a lot of skinheads in there, and the skinheads will politic hard. Like, if they have numbers, then they'll push the politics, you know? And I looked like a skinhead when I went in. I had no hair, you know, like a just bald guy going in there, you know what I mean? Right. So they all start treating me like I'm one of them, but I'm not a fucking skinhead.

So this guy come over and he's trying to get me to hide this little shank in my cell. Well, that's weapons manufacturing. It carries two more years. Oh, my God. That's how people start getting hit. You start catching cases, more cases. When you're only putting two, now you're doing ten. It just stacks up, but go ahead.

And then there's intimidation factor right so this guy got a big-ass swastika tattooed on his face right here tears drop lightning bolts everywhere you know I mean like this he's lifer you know right so big shit goes down we end up I end up choking this guy unconscious Oh Jesus Christ drag him out of my cell because he's trying to get me to hold this shake in my cell. I can't, I'm not doing this, bro.

And he come in my cell, it's on. Right. So now we fighting, take this guy out, right? Just choke him out, beat him up, drag him out,

hit him with some elbows, now he's leaking. So drag his ass out into the little modular. So do they know you can fight before you're in here? They don't know. No.

They have to figure, how long before they figure it out? Well, it took a minute. The words are traveling. It took a minute because most of the fighting goes on in the cell or in a shower. You know what I mean? So when the fight actually broke out in the open, when there was multiple people is what happened.

And then all the fucking guards watched. Everybody's watching from their cells. This is a different time. So this whole incident takes place. I beat this guy up, take him out of my cell right now They take him away. They move this guy out of the modular. They get mad at you No, they just come in you know they they don't really care the guards really shit You fuck that dude up is he out cold so does he have a

Conscious do they have to ask him what his story is I I don't give a fuck. But they don't ask you? They just let you go? It's okay? No. Is there a punishment? That's what I'm getting at. They locked me in my cell. I couldn't get in my cell for like two weeks.

Oh, for two weeks? Yeah. Just alone in your cell, constant. Nothing but your cell. They won't pop the door. So what happens is for a certain amount of hours of the day, they got to pop the door and let you into a bigger cell, a bigger room.

You know what I mean? So I just couldn't get into the day room for like two weeks. But the crazy shit of it all is like I'm trying to tell you, I'm trying to learn this system, right? There's new rules. So what happens is this kid, this guy, okay, we talk about the cars and the races, right? So each race has their own car,

which means there's a key holder. The key holder to that car controls the race. So they make decisions for the race. They kind of keep other races out of car wrecks. Like now we've got a feud with the blacks or we've got a feud with the Mexicans or whatever. They call them car wrecks. Yeah.

Well, if we get in a fight with them, the key holder is the guy that can communicate with the other key holders to the races and try and keep peace. They don't go and delegate it. Wow. Yeah. And so I didn't have it happen where we were going to get it communicate with the other key holders to the races and try and keep peace. They don't go and delegate it. Wow. Yeah. And so I didn't have it happen where we were going to get down with the Mexicans

and then our keys would go and they keys and we were going to jump. We were getting ready to jump. And they shake hands. All right, it ain't going. It ain't going. And then it go back down. Wow. Yeah, and you're trying to figure all this out.

So what happened was I beat this fool's ass and now I got the keys. Oh, wow. But I can't have the keys because I'm a first termer so first term is not allowed to have the keys but nobody nobody wanted to try to take the keys from me so in order for them to take the keys from me they got to fight me to take the keys away from me oh boy so so that kind of changed the dynamics of the room because now i'm able to navigate with these other races and have these conversations with these ignorant people that don't understand how to how to really talk you know what i mean like how to communicate and and keep things cool they they misunderstand what this guy says or misinterpret what this guy says the next thing you know it's hot for

everybody you know and it's just misinterpretations yeah yeah because they're dumb mostly these guys are dumb bro like there's like the cars it made me in some ways you're sitting there listening to these guys you're like these guys really think this shit like they're talking about the dumbest shit yeah so of course cities fighting over teams fighting over this is the dumbest shit xbox and playstation and somebody said something wrong and then that escalated into something that was personal yeah that's quick so now they take me from there that incident takes place right and we resolve some of that stuff but now these guys are in different modulars so now they're putting these kites out to try and get me as i'm going to court so what happens they catch a chain with some guys and then we go into these holding tanks, all these different holding tanks,

and you get put in that holding tank with that guy that got a kite that's looking for you. And now it's on, it's cracking. You know what I mean? Whoa. So I'm sitting in my cell, I'm getting ready to go to court and there's two huge ass guys and they're in there talking to each other about trying to get me, but they don't know that it's me. So I'm sitting in there. I'm listening to everything that they're trying to do and how they're going to try and set this shit up. And I'm sitting right in front of them. And they don't even realize it's me. Wow.

And I'm thinking, honestly, I'm like, these are big motherfuckers. I'm thinking, they're going to take me out. Like, there's only so much you can do. You know what I mean? Numbers. So I make it through that whole process and I catch the chain and when I catch the chain they take you from County to to state and I catch the chain with the same asshole that I got into it with I

took the keys from oh my goodness and this is like he's a like been in the system a long time right so now we catch the chain. We go over to Donovan, R.J. Donovan. It's a four-yard level four. Do you know how that works? No. Level four being the highest level, most dangerous criminals. Yeah. The next level is Superdome in San Diego.

So why'd they bring you to a level four? Because my charges. My charges. The kidnapping thing. Because those charges were so intense, they put you in with those people. You know? Yeah. Holy shit.

So I catch the chain, right? I go over there. I catch the chain. And this guy's just like, I'm going to fucking kill you. I'm going to kill you. We're going to get you. You know? And I'm just thinking the whole time, like, if this chain comes off, I i'm gonna rip this guy's ass apart again you know what i mean so i go into reception and we're in a cell block it's

like 360 degrees with a gunner all this stuff some desks and to come check you in and now ourselves like we only we don't get out of our cell now until they intake us right so now i'm in there it's like three months and uh there's this guy next door. We start talking through the vent to each other a little bit, you know. And we're playing chess and shit, like, through the little vent. So we move pieces around and shit. And they call me out to the day, to the thing, talk to the officers. And this guy goes, I don't know this guy in the cell next to me.

Right. And I walk past his cell and I hear him yell, like, through the thing. He's like, hey, bro, kick that cord over to me. I'm like, kick your cord over like that cord right there. Kick that cord over to me when you come by. And and I'm like, what the fuck do you want this cord for? You know, it was connected to this fan. Right. So when I come back, I kick this cord over and I wasn't going to do it, but I was like, fuck it. Right. So I kick this cord over over there and next thing you know in the night i get this fish come through right like it's a like they make a like a string right

with the thing on it let's swing it out into your cell you take this kite and then you can read the information on it or whatever you know so kite it around to everybody and get it to who they needed to get it to right okay so this guy shoots this little sheet kite over to me i open it up and it's a fucking sack of weed dude right and i'm like i'm like that's why this dude wanted that cord he took that cord and he started a wick so he started a fire and he had a bag of weed so now he's smoking weed and the whole cell is like full of weed bro and he shoots it i say bro i can't have this like i try to shoot that shit back to him he's like he's like nah you got to keep it you get coffee with it you get whatever you need you know and i'm like i'm like oh shit okay you know so my other celly that was in there he was like i'll take it and i was like fuck yeah

take that shit so i got a bunch of canteen and shit you know like coffee and stuff for it and uh so this guy like really really was like thankful i did it for him you know like kick this cord so i never seen his face like never seen this guy's face right just hear him talking through the the thing and uh so uh the guy i caught the chain with puts this hit on me like they want to try and try and stab me right so it goes around to the other key holders. The fucking guy next to me was a key holder for the Bloods. He's a black guy.

Because I kicked that cord over to him, he hit me up through the cell. He's like, hey, he says, is your name Beanie? And I was like, fuck, right? I had to go back over to the vent, right? And I said, no. And he goes, oh, good. And I'm like, oh, good. What the fuck is this mean, right?

And I'm like, hey, I said, what if it was? And he goes, well, is it or not, fucker? I go, well, it's not beanie. I go, it's beanie. And he goes, it's the same shit. I go, okay's Bainey. And he goes, it's the same shit. I go, okay, bro. He's like, hey, I'm going to let you know. They're going to pop this door and they're coming for you.

And I was like, really? I was like, what do you mean? He's like, they're going to come and get you when this door pops. You're going to pop this door and you're going to go to shower and they're going to send some guys to come and get you. Oof. My other celly, he he knows already he didn't tell me in order for that to go down they have to tell your celly so your celly can stay out of the fucking way so he knows about it he's known about it and now he tells me through the wall and now i know he knows about it you know what i mean and i'm living in this room with this guy so door pops my celly takes off running out of the cell so i just i just posted up at the back of the cell just waiting you know and sure two guys come flying in one guy

flying in trying to stab me and then we're scrapping wrapping all over the place fall out of the cell we're up the stairs, wrapping all over the place, fall out of the cell. We're up the stairs, fucking push the guy down the stairs. We fall down the stairs. I'm tired as fuck. Like fighting two guys, I'm tired,

I'm lumped up a little bit, and I look over this way and I'm barely breathing, look over this way and all the fucking cops just watching. They're just watching. Oh my God.

So this other guy come over. He's kicking, kicking, kicking. I grab the other guy, drag him on top of me, and I'm just choking him. I'm trying to use him to deflect this guy from getting at me. Right. And then realize this guy's out. He's not even awake. Push him off me, and now it's just me and this guy and everybody in the cells watching

and all the cops watching. So I just tear this fucking guy's ass up. We leave, and this guy and everybody in the cells watching and all the cops watching. So let's tear this fucking guy's ass up. We leave, and this guy never got up. The guy was choking. Never got up. Just eyes full of blood, right? So they send me to another cell block. I go in there, there for a couple days.

Guard comes in. We're going to move you to the gymnasium. So they move me to the gymnasium. Now I'm out of the cell block. I'm in a gym with 300 guys. I can walk around. I get yard access, all this stuff, right? And the cop says,

I really appreciate what you did for us out there. He's like, that was pretty fucking amazing. And I'm just thinking to myself, like, I want to get the fuck out of here. Like, I can't be in here. Like, I'm not going to make it out of this shit. I used to get known to be that guy that's going around. Oh, no. And seeing your skills.

I had a similar thing happen to me. First day in, first weekend. And I had to fight this one guy. Fight that one guy. Beat the shit out of him. And now they're like, now they're like oh okay and now you're getting this people are starting to see it right this name it comes with that and now people want you to teach him and different shit like he's actually was in there working out with guys and teaching guys that's yeah roll you're just trying to survive your time

you know I mean like not let the time do you. How much time did you have to do? I did a little over two years. It was short, you know what I mean? But in the grand scheme of things, it was really long. I did 90 days, okay? And it was the longest time, and I never go back to jail, and I never, ever make those mistakes. And I was driving on a suspended license. I did 90 days.

Imagine two years. Like, fuck, he sent a short time. No, it was a fucking forever. Do you have any legal repercussions for, like? So going back originally to this whole process was when they came in and offered me that deal when I hired that private investigator. Let me figure out all this stuff that's going on. When they dismissed, it wasn't my judge. It was a judge.

But it was my DA. So it was my DA, a judge, and my victim at this country club, we got on surveillance. So when we brought that in as evidence, I'm facing, the deal they gave me was 10 years with 85. And I mean, that's sort of 85% of my 10-year sentence. So the head judge, I don't know what he's called, comes in, and he says, look, young man, this is the deal you're going to get today. If you don't sign it, we're going to jury selection. And it was two years with 85 with a strike.

And I just said, okay. You know, took the deal. Jesus Christ. Took the deal. Really what they wanted, they wanted him. So the 10 years with 85 the 10 years

for 85 when they came to me with another deal the deal was county year which means I go home because I already did six months

so county year is a lit is six months right I go home but I have to give him up and I have to give up my other guy that was with

me so if i give them up he gets two years did they give you any indication why they wanted him black guy they was in it we want the black guy the african-american from from san rodino that's what they kept saying and so how do you get out of this so i've been in hiding you know i mean i've been hiding and i was that's why i wanted him to tell a story so he kind of gets out of it because i don't say shit yes that's that's it that's it that's it so you stay in and you would have had to have said something about him being guilty of something no that's what they want i wanted to call i wanted to call him and my buddy as witnesses so the pizza pizza guy that showed up and him and the other guy were I'm telling my attorney, no, no, no. That's not what happened. I have witnesses. But you're saying they're trying to get you to turn him in.

Yeah, because I'm saying I have witnesses. Right. So I'm saying I'm telling my attorney, I said, hey, I have witnesses. These guys were there. And they said, no, no, no. She goes, that's who they want. Like you can't like if you do that, you do that, we can get a deal. But they will charge them with all the same crimes because they were there. They were there and they didn't call the police, right? So they get charged with all the same shit I got charged with. So if you bring him in as a witness, they were going to charge him. They will charge him right on the stand.

Oh, my goodness. Oh, my goodness. So now I have no witnesses. So it's a trap. Yeah, I have no witnesses. I can't call them. And now I have no witnesses. So it's a trap. Yeah, I have no witnesses. I can't call him. And now I'm fucked. I either have to give him up or, and I can't, you just can't do that.

Like, he came down there to help me, you know what I mean? Like, to look after the situation. Wow. I can't expect him to have to do that time, you know? Jesus Christ. So one time. What a terrible predicament. I'm driving in Fontana

I get pulled over I'm gonna call Bobby Green You know Yeah Professional fighter Like I talk to the officers Cool Give them respect

And yes sir no sir Like okay cool They go back to the car Next you know They came back And they had guns drawn Boom They had drunk

Show me your hands And I was with me and my homie And they're like Show me your hands Show me your hands Show me your hands I'm like what And I already knew what they were doing already knew Because of what the outside to tie it in they are arguing memory

I told you my dad and him are arguing about that laptop. I didn't know what was going on the laptop He was looking up to Jim and on the Jim's website. It's a picture of me Like this Bobby green and I got crosses on my forearms right so i already put it together by somehow god gave it to me and i was like so he's like let me see your hands let me see your hands but he didn't mean it like oh you made maybe you want to make sure you're really bobby green but no but they're looking for tattoos they're looking for a certain bobby green so at the time i had no tattoos nowhere but the crosses on my forearms i But no, but they're looking for tattoos. They're looking for a certain Bobby Green. So I'm showing my hands. At the time, I had no tattoos.

Nowhere but the crosses on my forearms. I peeped it already. So I'm showing them my hands, and I'm going like this. You can't see the crosses. You don't even know I got tattoos. I don't even look like I have tattoos at all without none of that. So you couldn't see the crosses. He's like, okay, the Bobby Green we're looking for has crosses on his hands.

They mistake forearm for hand. Oh, Jesus. he's like okay the Bobby Green we're looking for has crosses on his hands they made they mistake forearm for hand oh Jesus that's the only way I didn't get locked up Wow I drove off and I was like well went back into hiding for a long time again oh I had to fight under ray-green I wasn't Bobby Green and tomorrow's Ray Green. You know? Wow. It was crazy, you know? And so we were building up all this momentum. This guy's winning. This guy's winning.

I'm winning. We're starting to become the gym, the hot spot in Redlands. We're kicking it off and he gets locked up, you know? Ruben had just signed, had a, my first student was Ruben Durant.

With the UFC, Ruben Durant. And he fought, I think you commentated that fight when he fought his first fight against Takeya. I think so. Yeah, I think so. And so Reuben was in the UFC. I'm kind of getting my way up there. Aaron's going to get his way up. And we're getting all this momentum.

We lose our leader. We own five King of the Cage titles. He didn't do nothing wrong it's crazy it's like fuck and so now i'm stuck in a predicament i gotta find a new coach i gotta i made a choice now i'm gonna go back to fighting and so i gotta find a new coach i lost my pop i meet this new coach and i tell him hey my loyalty to this man like when he comes back we're gonna back to what we do but i'll work with you until then. And that's where I met my new coach, Sam Mason, and I started working on my stand-up, where all my stand-up art comes from.

My jiu-jitsu and everything comes from my dad. Did anybody ever try to discourage that style? Because your style is super effective, but most people will tell you that this hands-down approach to fighting is super risky. I felt, to be honest, I felt like you, Daniel Cormier, like you guys, I don't want to say hate. No. I said I don't want to say hate. Definitely know I don't hate you.

No, no, no, no, no. But not hate, but hate on you. I'm not even hating on you. No, he's talking about style. It's not that they hate on him. I heard my critic tell me so long ago, it wouldn't work. It doesn't work. I don't think there's anything that doesn't work.

I heard you guys say it. I don't know why Bobby does that because he's trying to block with his shoulder, and that doesn't work for MMA. It works for boxing. You're the only one that's pulled it off for MMA. Yes. Yeah, you pull it off. I've seen it with you more even lately.

You're better at it now than you even were before. But you're always good at it. I really got with my stand-up instructor when he left and I started to hone those things in. You roll very well with punches too. You're very good at catching it as it's coming at you and getting the shoulders up. I really appreciate that. But those are the things that were costing me. People don't understand it.

But what I was going to say is there's certain guys that can do that. And not only do they do that, they're elite of the elite. Right? Like that hands down approach. Like Michael Venom Page. Yes. Perfect example. He's the elite of the elite.

And the way that guy moves is like, you know, good luck trying to keep up with where these things are coming from. That's one of my dream fights. Just like a fight in Vietnam. You know, because I feel like my style. That crust cyborg skull. Fuck. I mean, I've never seen that. Yeah.

Of all the years of fighting. That was so bad. His skull was like a bowl. That was crazy. Yeah, I know. I know. Those things that make you like, are you sure you want to go fight? It hurt my heart.

Dude. Are you sure you want to go fight? When he KOs you, it's like a scene in a fucking anime. And so people ask me, like, boom. Go ahead. Go ahead. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

No, I have a lot of respect for him. He's very good, you know. But he's still raw. You know, he's still very raw. But he has this skill that I always knew was going to be a big deal. And that's that point fighting style. See, the thing about, like, all these styles is every style has its strengths and every style has its weaknesses.

But one thing that was missing was the ability to blitz. And those karate guys have a blitz. There was these dudes like Billy Blanks back in the day. Stephen Thompson has it. Stephen Thompson has it. Yes. I knew he was going to go for the belt. Yeah, Raymond Daniels is a perfect example.

Because him and Venom Page actually had point fighting matches. Yeah, yeah. I think you can find it online. There's a point fighting match between. That's an elite skill. It's an elite skill. And they don't understand that. So I didn't understand that until I met my stand-up instructor.

And that was one of his main bases was karate. Karate is the first punch. It's about getting that first attack off. It's all like Bruce Lee figured it out about fencing. Bruce Lee realized with fencing that there's this dart-in movement that they got really good at. A really good fencer can cover ground so quickly. I took my guys to go train in fencing, actually, before I went to jail.

There you go. I took them out to Palm Springs. I think that's one of those things. I think there's a few things that you'd almost be better if you started doing them first. Look at these two guys together. This is- Raymond Daniels and Venom? What year is this? Yes. This is, let's say 2009. That's how long they've been doing this. Let me see this. I don't know. I haven't seen this yet. My money's on Raymond Daniels. Let's see. I don't know. They're both elite, man. They're both in this realm, this

point fighting karate realm. It's like that ability to just close the distance and they count it like it's just a touch like that. Yeah, that's a touch. But that's all you have to do to score. That is an attack where I would have knocked your ass with that. But look at this style. This is why it's so weird.

You don't see this style anywhere else. What this style is, it's this sideways stance. Sideways stance almost always. Almost always sideways stance. See, the only problem is when the sideways stance is that you give that leg up, you know? Yep, yep. But this spinning attack thing. So it's like you were hitting to.

Yeah. In every art, there's these things. There's something you take from it. You take every bit of it. Everyone can take something from that. Yes. There's certain ways of moving in that these guys have, these point fighting guys have, that's very deceptive and very hard to deal with and you don't expect from the average person.

Because if you get used to a certain kind of style. That's the thing too, right? Isn't that about sparring in crowded gyms? Because you can't expect from the average person. Because if you get used to a certain kind of style. That's the thing, too, right? Isn't that about sparring in crowded gyms? Because you can't move that much. When you see guys on the mat, and there's like 15, 20 guys sparring next to each other. Yeah, you've got to play that phone box fighting. Because if you're with one of these fellas, these leaping karate fellas, you need some space. You're all over the mat.

Yeah, because Wonderboy, he'll step way to the front. Like the Tyron Woodley fights, those two fights were a perfect example of that. Just control the outside way away, way away, just waiting to... He needs a lot of room to play that game. And you don't take much damage. Right, right.

That's the key thing about us fighting these guys, not taking the damage either. Yeah. Not taking damage where you can keep fighting. I'm going to fight number 45. Yeah. That's crazy. Yeah. To be able to fight fighting. I'm going to fight number 45. Yeah. That's crazy. To be able to fight, and I come out to fight, I'm like, man, I felt great.

I didn't get too hurt. Do you think that defense is the most important aspect of your style? It's underrated. I think, listen, I think it's a bit of a part. It's a beautiful combination. Because why? Listen, you talk about my defense, but I set the record for the most punches landed. That's true, too.

So I'm busy. It says I'm busy. So I'm an attacker, too. But yet I'm a defender. So it's a bit of both. When you take a fight like the Islam fight, which is a big opportunity because many people look at him like one of the most talented guys in the division. I mean, he's a force right now i have to say it i mean it's just it's not negative but it's like that's a tough decision

to make to fight a guy like that without much preparation and that's where it was very gangster of you yeah that's what i said what i did before i did it i'm gonna show y'all some g shit yeah you did you you went in there when a lot of people were avoiding that guy he's right now at the top of the food chain in terms of like top contenders on a short notice like i feel like the results have been a lot different if we had a full camp to train and actually get my timing of my wrestling on and i made one mistake and that was it he capitalized and that was it i tried to go for a front choke on him and gave up my hips that was it from there he was able you can't make one mistake with these guys that's highest level one mistake and that's it he's running his game and that's it i

need to get him more tired i need to get him in deeper rounds where he can make more mistakes you know if you had to do it how much time do you need like for a fight like that is that something you need like are there different styles that you need more prep time for, or is it just a matter of, like, getting in a solid camp for you? I'd just say a solid camp. Just a solid camp. You know, like, for me, I need five weeks. Give me five weeks. Anybody.

Anybody. Anybody. Five weeks. I know you would accept that, but what would you want ideally? Ideally? Ideally. Ideally? Six.

Six weeks? Seven at the most. Seven at the the max at the max um because why you don't want to peak too much no no i got kids brother i get kids and listen i i i learned this from joe stevenson when i fight i don't do anything but fight i don't even see my children i don't do anything but fight you know and and last year i said the record for the most amount of fights is five like in a year for a fighter five i fought four and i passed out making weight for jim miller the fifth so it would have been fifth and so when i'm trying to compete and be that active my kids suffer you know right my kids question their daddy and daddy don't love you i gotta go through that too you

know and i gotta fight with the moms and so that't love you. I got to go through that, too, you know, and I got to fight with the moms. So that's another thing. I got three baby mamas, one black, one white, one Mexican, in three different places. Dude, you're a living rainbow. And I'm trying to be a great daddy, too. So it's a mess, brother. It's a mess. Well, you know.

And he's guided me through this. He's like, hey, you know, you need to do this. You need to do this. Fighting child support and time. And you can only be in three places so many times, you know? Why are the most fun fighters the most wild? Because it's always the case. I heard you say that.

It's always the case. The most fun fighters to watch are the wildest dudes in real life. They're willing to take a risk. They're more risk takers. That's a big part of it, right? Yeah. You know, I tried to explain that to someone about Jon Jones in the opening seconds of the first round against Shogun. Jon, I think, was 22, right?

When he won the title? 22, okay? Only been fighting the UFC for a short amount of time. Opens the fight with a flying knee on a legend. Yeah. On a legend. You got to have some balls. Just balls.

You got to have some balls. John would just make shit up in the middle of a fight. He would just figure out what to do and try some shit out. If you watch his fights, he just has these very dangerous techniques that he uses with his length. Yeah. I haven't got that free yet. I'm working on things in the gym, but haven't like oh i'm running in the actual camp i'm gonna work the things at work you know i haven't got that free where i'm like hey i really

want to show y'all what i've really been working on like you guys see me doing with this what i really work on in the gym is something really nuts you know here it is boom that is so crazy to do opening seconds of the fight at the same time you don't have no fear of the takedown. Well, he wasn't afraid of takedowns, and also he was very proficient at striking. Yeah. He just has one of the best fight IQs ever. But he's not a good striker. But it doesn't matter. He's enough.

He's enough to get on top of you and smash you. It's not that he's— He knows how to use it well. He uses it very well. Yes. It's not like he's knows how to use it well. He uses it very well. It's not like he's a glory kickboxing champion. But if he wanted to be, he could be. You think so? Yes.

Guys that are that good at MMA, that fucking dude could do anything. He's just got a very specific and lethal style. You cannot question the Jon Jones style. So listen, you're trying to say those guys fighting another guy his size, length and reach. Like, what's his name?

Like an Alistair or the guy who beat Alistair for the K-1 belt. You know what I mean? Those strikers, I'm saying, I forgot what his name is. Oh, Badr Hari. Yeah, those guys. You're trying to say he's going to beat those guys? That's a different level of striking. Different level.

But he could be if he started out when they did. He could do anything. Okay, if he started out. I'm not saying he could do it right now. Okay, what I'm saying is a guy who gets that good, he could be that good at fucking tennis. He could be that good at anything he wants. Jon Jones never lost.

You always have to remember that. They took that win away from him in the Matt Hamill fight, but he was putting a ferocious beat down on that guy. There is in no way that is a loss. And it's one of the dumbest rules ever, because it's the downward elbow rule, which is the

dumbest fucking rule. It's not even a harder elbow than a regular elbow. It's just dumb. I've seen people say it's almost like getting stomped and you shouldn't. I feel like wise people who I really respect say that. They say it should be illegal. I'm like, wow. I don't want to take any of your job.

But you're going to soccer kick somebody in the head. I'm not saying that. What I'm saying is in terms of strikers, as I got into the striking realm, and we really respect striking like an easy guy and stuff like that. That's why I don't see it like that i see he's very creative i think this was dope about him like the he created the from the from the uh takedown to the elbow up you know yeah those type of things just makes him where you didn't expect that yep yeah he did a lot of that that's what makes him so dope i don't think it's it's more so like he's got a great jab or he's got a one-two.

Like he does long legs and he can kick you, he can use those legs and his reach. But it's nothing really technical that I feel like that's all I'm saying in terms of that. But in terms of his creativity. But don't you remember he high-kicked DC? It's a high kick. Yeah, but the way he set it up knowing that DC has his tendency to lean to his right. He's not like a striker. Stop.

Come on. Big dog. That's a big victory. You don't think that's a big victory? It is, but it's not like he head kicked fucking. I think what's going down right now is Bobby's talking about the style of it all, the flow of the fight, right? Right.

Where things are flowing, they're smooth. I understand what you're smooth. I understand What I'm saying is that John Jones you have to look at him as a whole You can't just look at him as a striker because his striking is sometimes a means to get his fucking hands on you and smash You yeah, you gotta realize he's a fighter and what I'm saying is if he just wanted to be a kickboxer He would have been elite of the elite at that. What he is is just a fighter. So in fighting form, he's arguably one of the greats. Without doubt.

Yes. Without doubt. Without doubt. Either he's your number one GOAT or he's number two. It's like Mighty Mouse, Anderson Silva in his prime. Don't forget Anderson in his prime. Yeah. Anderson in his prime was a motherfucker, dude.

There was a period of like a few years where Anderson was lighting everybody on fire. But let's break that down. For me, personally, because I'm like a style guy, I like to pick for style-wise. Like when it comes down to those goats, yeah, but style-wise. Like for me, there's another guy that you didn't mention that will be in those lists is, I think, Dominic Cruz, to me, is a goat.

He's definitely a goat, and he's definitely a pioneer. But as far as greatest of all time. Style-wise. What about Khabib? Entertaining. Khabib is arguably the goat. Yeah, I was going to mention him too, but again, style-wise, that's why the GOAT. Yeah, I was going to mention him too. Beats everybody. Barely loses a round. That's why I wouldn't look at it.

I would put him more a two or three, you know, a four. I'm talking about who did it greatest, who did it the best. But how do you say that he— Anderson would be the number one. Anderson did it amazing. There we go. But how would you say that Khabib didn't do it the best when he retires undefeated? He destroys everybody.

Barely loses a round. I'm not saying that. I'm talking about style points. Style around. I'm not saying I'm Style points I'd love that style that style was smash That's not a style. You don't think that's exciting the Biebs fights the end a couple of the end The end this is what he actually weighs. We're gonna disagree here. Yeah, I think that the Justin Gaethje fight was entertaining bingo That's what I said! Towards the end! Yeah, we're going backwards with this.

From the Conor on, he got exciting. Oh, okay. But before that, and I'll be honest, I believe... You don't think that the Dos Anjos fight was exciting? You don't think that the Edson Barbosa fight was exciting? The Edson Barbosa fight was wild. Because we knew what a good striker Edson Barbosa was. We knew how well he prepared for Khabib.

But there was a moment in that fight where Nurmagomedov had him down and you could see the look in his eyes, that thousand yard stare like, holy shit. He knew that this storm is never going to end. Michael Johnson did that shit to him too, though. He clipped him. Michael Johnson clipped him. Michael Johnson out-wrestled him. Well, not in the end, right?

No, no. I'm talking about Barboza. Oh, oh, Jesus Christ. I thought you were talking about Michael Johnson and-wrestled him. Well, not in the end, right? No, no, I'm talking about Barbosa. Oh, oh, Jesus Christ. I thought you were talking about Michael Johnson and Khabib. No, no, no, no, no, no. I mean, like, Edson, I felt like when we fought Edson, the playbook had not been exposed yet in his style, you know? Right.

And in that fight, I wanted him to go wrestle for a couple of weeks up in Sac with a buddy of mine, a bunch of All-American wrestlers in there from Iowa, you know right and in in that fight i wanted him to go wrestle for a couple of weeks up in sack with a buddy of mine a bunch of all-american wrestlers in there from iowa you know and and he wanted to go to nate's camp and and do some work over there you know i wanted him to to wrestle this kid put him on his back beat him up and let's go home you know and and i felt like we would really win the fight that way and uh that's not the style. You don't get that. This is this argument that you guys were having, or this conversation you guys were having,

not an argument, but a conversation you guys were having, is he wants to be exciting. That's his main objective. It's like, I need the crowd to go, ah. They're not doing that over that like that. And especially, like, Khabib, it got later on when he came. To be honest, I think it was the names that he was fighting that made it like oh my god he's doing it to conor mcgregor right oh my god he's doing it to justin gaethje oh my god you know like what is he doing to these guys more so

than style points when you kick a guy like like vitor pow and drop him nobody else did it like that right nobody else was even thinking about that kick until he did it you, we even had conversations about people being able to KO people with that kick. And I was like, maybe, but it's pretty rare. I didn't think it was even working. He just trimmed it a whole other place. That's what I'm saying is style-wise, you know? The different ways. Like, I would give it up to O'Connor.

The way he was putting guys out. Right. The way he was doing that. The way he mixed Eddie Alvarez up. Oh, my goodness. Oh, my goodness. The style points were so up here with the style points. That's true.

That's what I'm saying. But I don't see it that way. I think smesh. That's just my own personal. Yeah. I think smesh. Personal opinion. I love.

You got to have some style to you. He just shuts down everything. But the thing, I love that style, man. I really do. I love that he can do that. I love that he imposes it on everybody. Drag you into the deep end of the pool. And nobody wants to be there, and they all get sucked into it.

I loved it. So when I fought Islam after the fight, I got him to me as a pitcher, and I'm like, this is me. Hey, you got to get some style, baby. Oh, no. That was great, but you got to get some style, baby. I understand. You're an artist.

Yeah, no. It's an artist. Yeah. You're an artist. Yeah, no. It's an artist. Yeah, you're an artist. Well, you live off the feet of the crowd, right? Yeah, but I want to be able to come to watch your fight. I don't watch those guys' fights. I understand. Personally.

Just personally. I understand. I watch Khabib's end, and I even put a post up saying, sorry, because I always called you boring. Now you're exciting. Well, I'm a big Islam nut rider. I know you are. I know you boring. Now you're exciting. Well, I'm a big Islam nut rider. I know you are. I know you are.

I think he's awesome. And today we came to shut that shit down. His style points in his fucking house. But you're here, man. Your style points in his fucking house. The real G's are in the house today. Listen, you're here because I love you. But the reality is that guy is like, if you're just looking at someone

who can win. Who moved the numbers, Joe? Guys like Nate Diaz. People like you a lot. Guys like Jorge. Guys like Justin Gaethje. Loud, colorful people. Who actually bring the fucking style and what we want to see.

What did we want to see? Would you rather bring- I'm here selling the product. I'm selling it. Would you rather bring style or would you rather win? Listen, that's great. Was it- Style!

Style first? Man. Hands down. Hands down. I've had fights with him. Where I do like guys out of chokes. I'm like, no, that would have been boring if I wasn't like that. Why would I do that? We had a guy in chokes in the first minute and a half of the fight,

and he looked like this at me. I took Barbosa down the first, kick he through. Bam, I took him to ground. All right, I can do that already. Now get up and let's do the dance. I'm going to show everybody else that. I couldn't strike? What's up?

I'm not scared of you? What's up? I'm going to get my gangster points and my style points. That's what that fight was about. It wasn't about winning. It was about testing himself against the best striker in the UFC. And about winning. Barbosa's the best kicker in the UFC.

But the thing is, Barbosa,boza, like, his kicks, like, especially his switch kick, is so fast it doesn't even seem like it's really happening. He would throw that switch kick, and it was just like, I can't believe how fast that is. It was a slap! You would see the look on guys' faces when he would hit him with it, like, whoa!

So after fighting Barboza, now I gotta fight another guy. We were talking about styles earlier. These styles, you're breaking them down. Everybody has these styles, and I don't like the arts. Why? Because they all have holes in them, and you got to be able to use pieces of them to piece your fight together. Bruce Lee style.

So after I fought Barbosa, I now fight the new age kicker, Rafael Fiza. Yeah. You know? Fiza. That was a great fight. That was a great fight. That was a great fucking fight. A great Muay Thai fighter.

And that was a wake-up call to a lot of people about how effective you are against world-class strikers because that was a close-ass fight. And I think a lot of people thought Fiziv is this, you know, he's a trainer at Tiger Muay Thai. He's nasty. I trained with him out there at Tiger. That KO of Moikano. Woo! Dude, he's fucking nasty. And you went pillar to post with him out there at Tiger. That KO of Moikano. Woo. Dude, he's fucking nasty.

And you went pillar to post with him. Yeah. He had his visa troubles, right? Yeah. He had some visa trouble. That's why he couldn't fight, right? He had some visa. I think something's going on, right?

Visa, yeah. Something's going on. You're right. That's why I don't like. I'm going to just say it. I don't like. If you train in Thailand, I'll be kind of suspect about you. Because they can get drugs over the counter like like steroids and shit like that like cough

syrup don't know you saw to visit Thailand I'm not afraid to talk about it. I'm not afraid to talk about it. Well, I'm glad you're here, though. I was going to fight TZiff, and we're getting ready for the walkout. You guys are going to call us out, right? Right. The UFC comes to us and goes, hey, all right, you guys are going to come up there, and you're going to take your shirts off, you know, on the scale, and blah, blah, blah. He looked like he saw the police.

He was like, what? Take our shirt off? Why do I got to take my shirt off? Because he don't want to show that acne back back knee of his you know you know so i'm like oh i caught on to it already and so he didn't take his shirt off i was the only one who took my shirt off i'm like okay when i was how long before the fight is this this is this is the uh the uh weigh-ins that he did that so the day before the fight he's got back, don't you think?

That shit don't go away. Why do you think we be saying that shit? We notice that shit. We see it. It's noticeable in fighters. That shit don't go away. Is that 100% from Royce? They have pictures of guys and they go, it could be. But I can tell you 100% that I know for a fact that they all use them.

How do you know that for a fact? I fucking watched them buy them. How dare you? That's what i'm saying like a lot of you gotta be cheating man so one of my kids okay so what happened was we're in thailand we're training i don't play fair and uh what's the other little kid's name just lost peter yan peter yan peter yeah another thailand guy yeah so hold on are you guys thinking that there's a reason why these guys go to Thailand? Is this the allegation? Oh, absolutely.

Fuck those guys. Really? Man. You don't think this just go there for great Thai training? No. Because there's some of that, right? There's great recovery. There's great Thai training.

Don't get me wrong. There's great recovery. But there's great recovery. They stretch you out. They massage you. You can do all that stuff. Have you been to Phuket? No.

You haven't been to Phuket? No. You haven't been to Phuket? No, I haven't. Oh, you'll love it. I've heard it's awesome. It's gym, CrossFit gym, gym, CrossFit gym, CrossFit gym. Everybody goes there to get jacked. Man. It's wild.

What's his name? Faraz? Faraz Ahabi? Faraz Ahabi. No, no, no. What are you talking about? The kid you fought. Fiza.

Rafael Fiza. Rafael Fiza. Whatever, whatever. He's over 200 pounds, bro. We were out there training with him. He's swole. Rafael Fize. Rafael Fize. Whatever, whatever. He's over 200 pounds, bro. We were out there training with him. He's a big fella. He was huge. Huge.

So one of my guys gets staff over there. So I tell him, I say, hey, just go ask the coach where to get. We didn't know that they sold all this stuff in the pharmacies like that, right? So I say, hey, ask the coach if he could get some stuff. So he goes over and he's like, hey, you know where I can get any stuff at and he's like he's like yeah he's like just go to the pharmacy and he's like he's like okay like he's like what do you want you know he's he's like clenbuterol you want what he's like naming off all this shit whoa and i'm like no no we need some shit for staff bro like that's all we need brother if people are doing that how are they avoiding the the testing

i don't know bro you listen you know when you're gonna fight he knew how long he's gonna fight before he's not taking no short on his fights hey i'm not saying that he was on anything when that fight happened i'm just saying all these guys i'm and listen the the sport muay thai itself it's a it's's a tough man thing. You stand there, I stand there, pow, pow, and we get off. That is so damaging to the body that you need something to get some of that stuff back. You start doing the shin to shin. It's just a breakdown.

And it's like you broke a leg. You need something to keep you strong for that. You got to take some stuff. I can understand it. I can understand it. The thing is, I'm scared of needles. I can't do it. I'm scared of needles.

That's kind of my thing why I talk openly about drugs in the sport or PDs or whatever. We just want to clean the sport up. None of my guys, I've never had any of my guys ever test for anything positive. So do you think that there are specific places that people go because they know USADA is not going to go to them? And this is why they set up camps overseas? I believe so. I believe so.

Wow. I never thought of that. I thought of it the same way. I know about other stuff that happens here. That happens actually here. With guys that you talk about and glorify as the baddest of the baddest. And you know they're doing something dirty. I know for 100% sure.

I was told and I know the person gave it to them. But I'm not going to be a snitch and rat them out. But listen, I know it for a fact. For a fact. So is there a stricter drug protocol in order? Should they figure out a better one? Let's go like this. This is simple.

What is it? You test positive for steroids, lifetime ban. Yeah, but what if somebody taints someone's shit? The problem is people are those fucking saboteurs. I'm not saying that that is definitely happening a lot, but I'm saying it can happen. If I know that Bobby Green can get suspended for life, and I think Bobby's an asshole,

and I decide just to be funny to put some steroids in Bobby Green's yogurt. Oh, yeah. People can do that, man. There's a lot of assholes out there that would do something like that. For sure. I mean, I'm not saying that that's even going to happen. I'm saying you've got to protect. You'd have to give him a lot of steroids for it to stay in the system.

No, it doesn't. No, it's some stuff. There's some stuff that can they can catch you for it anytime peter yan usada see they are they're they're visiting him listen stop it you don't think they're visiting him it's that tiger muay thai they're visiting him right tiger got a lot of money okay now you're this is a baseless conspiracy no no no no yeah yeah I'm not going there I'm not going there I'm just saying this it's very it's very easy to access those things out there when you put that type of stress on your body you need certain things to keep you going in that and those aspects and that's what

it's just what it is you know well until they get caught exactly until they get caught it's a conspiracy okay if guys like TJ can do it and he's here and he gets tested all the time. Yeah, but he didn't do it. He got busted. How many fights do you think he fought before he got caught? I don't know. That's what we're saying. Here's my question.

We don't really know what, if anything, he had done before. We do know that that was an extraordinary moment because he was trying to make 125 pounds. And we do know this, though. We do know this. Fucking what's his name? His other buddy said it and put him out there. He said, TJ showed us how to do this shit a long time before he got

caught. That's hearsay. Oh, yeah. It's true, it is. It's hard to say. It's documented. So what's your feeling on that? What's your feeling on that? How do you clean that area of the fight game up? Well, I think it is a real problem, right? And I think what is allowed and what's not allowed is a real problem.

We have to figure out what seems fair and what also seems foolish to ignore. Like what if they came along and said no more ice baths? The anti-inflammation effect is akin to taking a drug and it's too potent. No more saunas because you're raising up your heat shock proteins and show the reduced inflammation and it seems to be cheating because some people don't have access to saunas. Because if you say something, that's like, there's a real argument in certain levels of performance enhancements you get from a lot of like standardly used things. Yes, yes, yes.

So it's like- I agree. Then you get to steroids and you jack that up way higher. We all agree. There's a lot of stuff you can do that'll help you, but steroids changes you. Definitely. Right? Yeah.

And then, especially if you, like we were talking about the early eras, the wild west of the early 2000s. Like EPO. Right. But people, this is my point, they were on fucking everything. Yeah. There was a lot of people that were bad motherfuckers and they were on everything. So it was a different world then, especially in pride.

Ensign Inouye told me that in capital letters it says in his pride contract, we do not test for steroids. Do it like this, like this. I'll tell you a funny story. We don't even test. I'll tell you a funny story. So we're in, when OSADA first came in, right? And we start handling all these meetings, you know, with OSADA,

and they're telling us the program and how it's all going to lay out and all this stuff, right? And it was all very new, you know? So we go in and they're like, oh, all the coaches have to be at this specific meeting at this time and other coaches at this time, right? So they're setting up these things things introducing us to all the rules and uh there's a group of coaches and teams that are waiting to come into the room after we're done right and everybody's like saying oh this is crazy all this new sort of stuff you know and i see this team very famous team of coaches sitting on this bench and they're listening

to everybody as they're coming out right and so i just tapped my guy and i'm like i'm like hey man this is wild man and he's like he's like what do you mean i said i can't believe they're gonna test coaches too like this and all three of these on the bench like this look at each other and i'm like ah you guys are busted do you remember when uh anderson silva they uh there was something he tested positive for, and then they got a photo of his coach. Did you ever see what Anderson's coach looks like? No.

He's like one of the most jacked humans that's ever lived. He looks like a superhero. But that's back to my point, though. Anderson is what we consider a Muay Thai striker. Yeah, for sure. And those things are damaging on the bones and stuff. Of course, for sure. He broke his leg against Chris Whiteman.

He needed to come back. He got money. He got bills to pay. Pop them fucking steroids. What the fuck you mean? You know what's interesting? It's like watching him box against Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. I'm like, my God, we're looking at a man who's in his 40s.

Like, how good would he have been? Oh, fuck, he's amazing. How good would he have been as a boxer if he was in his 20s? If he just went straight into boxing? Anderson's like hit number one. Did you see him when he fought Chavez?

Style points! You see how he styled on him? He made him look like you don't even belong with me. When he knocked out Tito Ortiz, like Jesus, Anderson can fucking box. Like really, really box. He made him look like you don't even belong with me. When he knocked out Tito Ortiz, like, Jesus. Like, Anderson can fucking box. Like, really, really box.

I see him stand next to him. Chael said Tito faked it. Chael said Tito faked it. Chael said he faked the knockdown. Chael always says some fucking crazy shit. I love Uncle Chael. I love Uncle Chael. I love him, too.

He's important because he's a legit guy. He was a legit but another guy who figured it out and a funny dude yeah figured out how to promote was one of the best ever promoting because he was straight pro wrestling like he would win a fight Anderson Silva you absolutely suck and he would like look around like he was doing pro wrestling promotion it It was pretty awesome. Joe, let me ask you this. How do you feel about the new shit with the UFC giving out crypto? I don't know how I feel about that. But one thing I do want to say, if anybody, I want to say this one more thing about Shale. Go back and watch Shale versus Nate, Nate Marquardt. When Nate Marquardt was in his prime, When Nate Marquardt was a fucking destroyer. I grew up in Strikeforce. I was in Strikeforce.

I saw him in Strikeforce. He knocked out Damian Maia with one punch in the UFC. Tyrone Woodley. Nate Marquardt. Oh, yeah. Tyrone Woodley KO was like a video game. Like a video game KO. Bro, his Strikeforce upcoming was way better.

He was nasty in Strikeforce. I think you're right. He was nasty. I think every fighter has a certain amount of holes that can was nasty in Strikeforce. I think you're right. I think every fighter has a certain amount of holes that can get punched in his ticket. And then after a while, fighters just don't have it anymore.

That's why I go back to defense. Karate, base. It's taking that damage. Nate Marquardt was a goddamn assassin. And Chael Sonnen manhandled him. Chael manhandled him. That was when we got to see how good of a wrestler an MMA chair really is. That's when I knew Chael was the shit.

And I knew, I had my money on Chael beating Anderson, and then he got tapped at the last minute. That's the craziest shit of all time. That was probably an awesome fight. That is the craziest shit of all time, that he got tapped there. Like, wow. In a fight that he 100% would have won

if he just danced around and didn't even engage for three minutes. Yeah. Yes. Yes. What round was it that he got tapped? Was it the fifth? It was the fifth.

And it was how many minutes? 34 seconds or something left. I thought it was a minute left. Something like that. It was close. I think you're right. I think you're right. I think it was like somewhere in the minute range.

Yeah. Jesus Christ. Chael's funny though. Oh my God. He was almost the champ. And he was almost the champ and he was almost a champ of the wec too yeah and paulio filio um he didn't make weight for the second one yeah and when he didn't make weight for the second one so it was no title and so chael won the decision but didn't win the title do you right i absolutely love uncle chael you know i love that guy too and

and the only problem is that is that is that he tainted a little bit with the Deroi stuff too. Dude, he's hilarious about it. You know? You know what though, that's like a, you come out openly, start talking about it like that,

everybody else kind of shuts up about it. Yeah. That's where at least like, I'm so torn about it, like because I'm like this warrior for drug truck clean you know clean do you think that that's why why maybe he didn't achieve those moments who knows man I mean I think a lot of people were on something at one point in

time a lot of people yeah yeah you saw it came along it definitely tightened things up we saw those physique shrink yeah we saw a lot of his lower weight classes, right? But I think there was three factors and one of the first factors was when they stopped TRT replacement Because at that point yeah, what are we doing? We're just letting you take as much as this you want These are looking younger going back shit was like werewolf levels. His hair was going back. He looked like he was 18 years old again.

He looks pretty goddamn good. I remember we were in a hot tub with him, right? Oh, yeah. And this little starts preaching to us. Oh, yeah. Preaching all kinds

of crazy, like, you got to do things right. He was big brother to me. We were in the hot tub and he's telling me like, you know, like because I was playing rap music. Yeah. And he felt like it it was like bad you know in the disrespectful you know sauna um in a hot tub hot tub yeah yeah so we're just sitting there and then his team came

and he's like don't play that music oh jesus don't play that music it's bad you know like just jesus you know and i and i and and I believe in Jesus too so when he had his whole allegation like aim when you put dirt on people tested positive after that yeah yeah and I'm like like how could you preach like that and then behind the screen years well people you can fuck these people's lives up that's the whole my thing about the whole cheating thing you know Cody Cody's awesome guy go Bertbert. Garbert. Garbert.

He's a fucking cool dude, man. And you think about it, his climb to get there was very tough, you know? Yes. And to have those epic fights with TJ and then not get his win bonus. Yep. Not get sponsorship money now. Yep. And TJ take that shit from him the wrong way.

But do you think, okay, so that wasn't a fight where he tested positive, though. But I'm saying he's speculating on the same thing that you do the shit to get caught. I know guys that were on the wrestling team with TJ in college, wrestled with him in college, and this has been an ongoing thing since college. Well, this is just the big accusation show. Oh, fuck yeah. Call it what you want to call it. Conspiracy theorists. I had one of my best friends ran in

the olympics right he's a track they said best they're all on steroids i have a painting of that my big dog tell me this bro those brock make us a painting of that that's dope they told me all this shit before he was even before he fought connor all this so he yeah he like bro he's a fucking genius he predicted all this shit it's crazy like he was trying to tell me the ins and outs the do's the don'ts how everything is don't be like this everybody be doing this yeah they'd be doing this and they do this i'm like what yeah and then she starts seeing it surely there's got to be some people that aren't steroids like bj penn i think he was clean man he's my one of my favorites of all time i think he was someone told me he's the only he's the only usc fighter that was a clean us fighter usc champion somebody told me and i'm like what

i don't know because i looked at that doesn't sound like that makes any sense that blew my that broke my heart and he broke down every fighter that that i was like well what about how does he know what how does he know how does he know because he's in that realm those guys that so well they do this and when this does this you know what they like faking a certain steroid has a certain side effect it blows your nipples up you know like one of them gets those nipple things you know and you got to take the cart the calcium out your idea I don't masticate right different things that guys do we know the recognized signs so they did you say the cartilage out of your nipple I I said calcium.

Oh, calcium. Is that what it is like? No, they're glands. They're lymph glands. I'm not sure. Don't quote me on that. I'm not exactly sure, but this way, someone's breaking this all down to me as he told me every fighter. I'm like, no, not George St. Pierre. That's my guy. George St. Pierre's always been clean. He's like, I have speculations that he

has from this, from this, and this. He's never tested positive for nothing he has from this from this and this You know yeah, and he hasn't just this but he said that everyone's gonna hate they would hate on everybody the most Natural of guys they would think mark hunts on steroids. They would people hate on people they make stuff up. Yeah, I agree I agree There's always a lot of that and so but it just when he did that I'm not saying I believed it But I just started to I didn't say that that's something I'm going off. I'm saying There's always a lot of that. But when he did that, I'm not saying I believed it, but I didn't say that's something I'm going off. I'm saying that's something I just looked at. Like, hmm, it's kind of interesting.

Then Nate told me some things, and it was kind of interesting. And then I started to actually come upon the fact where I know certain people in the industry that help these guys do these things. And I'm like, oh, yeah? He's like, yeah, he came in here. He was this much. He gave him this. I'm like, what? So what do these guys do if things now oh yeah he's like yeah he came in here he was this much he gave him this I'm gonna what so what do these guys do if you saw two shows up they got fake they got fake takes you tell me so it's dudes with the

wasn't a I would imagine it's probably pretty easy to figure out who's all testing I don't fucking know what the geese guys doing and listen I'm not a drug guy I don't I'm not trying to find out what the how to break the rules I don't know saying that I wish I like to find out how to break the rules. I don't know. I'm not saying that. I'm saying, like, how are they getting away with it? I wish I knew the password, the million-dollar question. It seems like if someone was doing that all the time,

it seems like they would get busted today. You would think so. You would think so. But listen, I've been- So what kind of stuff- Okay, okay, Joe, I'm going to keep it 100 with you. Please do. I've been eight, like, what's her name?

I've been eight months without being tested. You can't tell me I couldn't be in on shit? Yeah, but you couldn't because what if you decided to take something today- And they popped up on me. Yeah. That's always the possibility, but they're risking that for millions of dollars now you you called them in we're talking about millions of dollars they come all the time come on gotta come now they come right here come out here and check this come check this you know and if i'm gonna say if i'm gonna be this way i'm gonna say i gotta stand

on it right and so like uh what's her name she was a russian fighter she's like listen i've been from here from and she trained in Thailand, too. I'm from Romania. I was in Thailand. They haven't tested me in a whole year. Oh. You know? I'm like.

But the idea is that if you have a big fight coming up, they could. Yeah. A big fight? They could just show up. Especially if you have a. I've been fighting so they didn't get tested. But if you're on a big card. That's fights that didn't get tested.

Let's give them a chance. Let's test them. That's why they didn't get tested. There's what they didn't get tested? Fights that didn't get tested. I'm sure. Oh, at all? Because I didn't just come.

No. Wait a minute. So they didn't test you the entire camp? Yes. Wow. So how come some guys have like, Cody has like a 50 jacket. Yeah, I'm trying to get my jacket. I'm like, what?

Where my jacket at? I asked them that. I'm like, where my jacket at? I want like, what? Where's my jacket at? How many times have you been tested? I asked them that. I'm like, where's my jacket at? I want my little sticker. I want all that. Here's the problem with that jacket. If you're not testing anybody uniformly, you give people the opportunity to get one of those jackets. Yeah.

Right? Because if they're not testing you at all and they're testing some dude 50 times. He's getting all the. Why is he getting the jacket? Yeah. It's just like because because you persecuted him? Yeah. And it was a clean act, right?

And you're giving him a nice little candy? And now they can walk around and say they're clean. I hear that they're doing something new, too. The fuck are they doing? I want to say, like, they're giving necklaces or something like that now. Oh, boy. They're giving something new. But, yeah.

So, what do you think about the new, I guess it's the fan bonus? I heard some news about that. I did not know about this. The UFC is going to be giving 50 grand away in crypto. UFC to implement fan voted. No, it's not. It's not the same thing. UFC to implement fan voted.

Bitcoin. Yeah, they're giving Bitcoin away. To be paid in Bitcoin. Bitcoin. And it'll be sponsored by Crypto.com, UFC's cryptocurrency partner. The winner will get $30,000 US dollars in Bitcoin. Second place gets $20,000 in Bitcoin. Third place gets $10,000.

Interesting. That's dope. Yeah. So they're giving away cryptocurrency. Yeah, I'm like, that's interesting. So now we're getting into this crypto market. And the fact that they're doing it as a bonus is nice. I like that.

And then the fans can decide. The fans decide on it then. Right. I think it should be. But how do you do that if you have a Gilbert Burns, Hamzat Chumaya fight? How do you not give both of those guys a bonus for that? Dana did. Dana gave Gilbert his win bonus.

The UFC is really good about that. Thank God they are. Yeah. Because in that situation, so the fan bonus. The UFC is really good about that. Thank God they are. Yeah. Because in that situation, like, so like the fan bonus. Like, how do the fans vote there? They should be able to vote in a certain situation. If enough people say yes, they should be able to vote for give it to two people. You know, because it's not just one.

Yeah, it should be given to both fighters. Yeah, both fighters were exemplary. You think it's going to be a bonus that they only give one fighter to? It shouldn't be. It definitely shouldn't. It should go to both guys. It shouldn't go to just Hamzat after the performance that Gilbert put in. I mean, that was an amazing performance.

No, I'm talking about this bonus here with the crypto. When he spun Hamzat's face around with that right hand, I'm like, holy, Hamzat has a fucking chin, man. Because Gilbert cracked him. I still got to go home and study it. Oh, my goodness. What a fight. I haven't got to watch the fight yet. I'm going to be honest.

What a fight. What a fight. And I'm hearing about I still got to go home and study it. Oh, my goodness. What a fight. I haven't got to watch the fight yet. I'm going to be honest. What a fight. What a fight. And I'm hearing about it, you know. And this was a true test for Jermia to really get an eye on him and see how good are you, kid. You know the deal. Gilbert landed more strikes. Gilbert posted it on his Instagram, like the numbers, the breakdowns in the numbers, which, you know, obviously doesn't mean everything because, like, a person could land.

Because I think someone could land many grazing shots and someone plants you with one that one counts way more yeah you know so if someone's that's what i'm saying that's where i'm trying to get to is how do you see fighting that's where we have an issue with judging yeah is it is so but it's so subjective but that's the point some people think a takedown is everything yes Some people think a takedown only means something if you do damage. If the guy gets back up and you took him down, that's something, but you haven't inhibited

him at all. All you've done is taken him down. You haven't hurt him. Because that happens oftentimes, where you see a takedown, and then it's just a positional scramble, and then the person gets up to their feet, and no exchanges no no strikes but he wins around for that which i think it should be worth something if you do damage

something if you threaten for a submission but then less of a thing if nothing happens exactly no ground and pound at all yeah and i think that's where it's subjective because i think we can decide you know what is more effective. Is the guy backing up and catching the counter shots more effective, or is it you coming forward and being aggressive? Because that's the other thing. People say, oh, the aggressor should be awarded more points. Always? Because maybe that guy's just making a tactical error.

If he's making a tactical error, the guy who avoids that error should be rewarded. This is a good conversation between people that understand that. I think the problem that we have is our judges are not educated. Oh, I don't think that's true. I think a lot of them are educated. You think a lot of them train? Yes, I do.

And a lot of them have old backgrounds in martial arts. Yeah, I do. I just don't know how many great ones there are. I think it's a hard fucking job. It's like hardest job, fighter. Second hardest job, referee. Third hardest job, judge. That's what I think.

Yeah, because you're putting a guy's career, you're putting it out there, like the Jan Sterling fight, for instance. Very close fight. You look at it, you go, wow, how do you score this? For sure, Jan the uh fourth and fifth it looked like he won those two championship rounds but damn we got to see that i mean we got to see some phenomenal grappling yeah i mean we got to see al jamae put on a fucking back clinic a back taking clinic and holding i mean that's against a guy who trained to avoid his back.

That's all. I mean, Al Jermaine is the backpack. Everybody knows he's a master at the rear naked choke. So he's a void. That's what he's wanting to avoid. And he gets there anywhere. And once he gets there, he can't get free. The entire round.

He didn't have an escape for the body lock. That's true. But also the entire round, he's just defending that's true, but also the entire round. He's just Defending against being strangled like almost the entire round that's worth a lot The idea that that's a 10-9 is to me crazy Crazy so fan bonuses previous fan bonuses Hamza Chmayev Volkanovski, and Pyotr Yan. Volkanovski.

You want to talk about a dude who's on another level. He was there, too. Holy shit. We trained with him, Peter, and the other guy in Thailand at Tiger. And this kid, Volkanovski, was fucking cool. He was like the only cool one out of that whole fucking group. He's very cool. Very cool. And my God, is he good.

He worked his ass off, too. He was a hard worker. My God, is he good. Yeah. He's so goddamn good this weekend Oh, I was stunned. I was stunned watching that performance because I knew you know everybody knows Korean zombies tough everybody knows that Volkanovski is vicious vicious He's fantastic a ground-and-pound vicious striking

But all that shit was on a totally different level Saturday night. Like all of his footwork and movement, his ability to avoid counters, his timing. It was so precise. The fights with Max, man. You know what I mean? Yeah. You gather so much knowledge in fights like that. You know what I mean?

I think he's even better now. I mean, I think he gets better every time we see him. I think that was the best version of him by far. Not that all the other versions weren't super impressive too, he's just even better than he was before. I mean,

that was a fucking master class. That was a master class in hitting someone and not getting hit. Yeah. And just imposing your will. That's what we try to do. It was incredible.

You were trying to have bonuses there? Was that what already happening? Yeah, that's the fan bonuses, yeah. Oh, snap. Okay.

So that was these past three guys. So say Bitcoin goes up or down, will that 30 Gs change? I don't know. That's a good question, right? No, because it said 10,000. It could be like a millionaire tomorrow if you just go out right now. It might. It said 10,000 of a Bitcoin.

$10 worth of Bitcoin? $10 of a Bitcoin, yeah. Oh, so no matter what, it'll always be $10,000? Is that what they're doing? That's why I read it. Oh, that's dark. So then that means U.S. currency has infected Bitcoin. Man, Bitcoin is everywhere.

Oh, it will. It's huge. Man, they start printing more dollars. Watch what happens, bro. He's a big Bitcoin, like, don't even start with this Bitcoin. He's a big Bitcoin advocate, you know? I love crypto. And then you got this Ethereum stuff coming.

Yeah, all of it is interesting. And I'm so confused. I don't know anything about any, like, it's so new. And I don't, it's a bunch of numbers, so it's hard for me to trust. So they offer you this fight with Islam. They offer it to you on short amount of notice. You take this fight. When they do something like that, do they say to you, like, hey, we really appreciate you doing this.

I know this is kind of a crazy thing to ask for. So if you do this, we'll hook you up next time. Do you guys have those kind of conversations? I wish. I feel like I just do what I'm told. My manager does all the talking. Do you just rather not think about it and just concentrate on the training and the fighting? I let them, like, I don't really, like, I'll hit Sean up every once in a while and just send him some good love.

Hit Dana up, send him some love. But I don't ever talk business or anything like that. That's the manager's job, you know? That's good. Good for you, man. Good for you. I don't want to get on their bad side or anything like that. Well, that's also good.

So they hit me up about it, and I'm like, fuck, Jason, I just got out of a fight. My hands are still swollen. I got some knots from checking kicks, and you want me to go get in there? How many days out have you been removed from your last fight? Three or four. So it was three or four days out from your last fight, then you get this phone call. Yeah. That is so crazy.

Because it's two weeks total. Right. So what is your thought? So you're thinking at this point in time that this isn't wise and that, you know, it's too much to ask. You just kind of had a fight and got banged up. But also there's an amazing opportunity. Like how do you decide? How do I decide? This is how I decide this is like one, I felt like, all right, I got two different pathways.

One is you can do this, and that's all the bad. It's going to be an embarrassment, okay? I know what's coming because you're throwing this shit together. You're not prepared. You're still fucked up. You're barely, you're out of shape. You need to get the weight down, and you only got so much. I realize all these are coming with this.

Right, right. Like, just a media loan for a main event show is fucking nuts, Joe. I didn't know that. Like, how much more is it? Like, what do you have to do? Okay, so for instance, I pull up to the gym. Sam had been calling me and telling me, like, yeah, these guys are calling about doing this. But he didn't let you know that, hey, it's like, they're very invasive.

Very invasive. So I pull up, and there are already cameras on me, and I'm like, what's going on? And had I known, I would have came in my good car. I came in my beat-up car that I use for gas. I'm like, we were filming now? What are you guys filming? I didn't know.

I'm not ready. My hair's not cut. What the? No, they don't care. We're just filming, filming. They want to get in your car and ride everywhere around with you. Oh, no. You can't go to no food without them.

They want to watch you cook They want to I'm just like what and I don't I'm not used to this I don't know what's going on. You don't have a yes or a no you can't say I'm trying to play with the show I'm trying to do right Right and so I hear guys like Nate tell them to fuck off See why because why it gets it gets tiresome against it gets and so that's just one piece to Did they interrupt your training? Do they interrupt your training?

All the time. Really? All the time. Hey, turn the music down. Turn it off. Can you do some shadowboxing for us? Can you do this? Oh, no.

Can you do specific activities? Yeah, yeah. They're going to ask you to do this. What the fuck is that? But we don't want to interrupt your training. They say that, but you are. Wait a minute. So in the middle of a training, they ask you to do specific kinds of exercises that aren't on your program?

Yes, for little things that they need, little bits and stuff that they're, you know. But that's crazy. Like, that should be afterwards. Like, you can't interrupt an actual training session. For the most part, it usually is. Are they engaging with you while you're actually training and talking to you? No, they'll sit back and they'll watch and let you do your thing. They'll let you do your thing from the most point.

But it's just like. So how are they asking you to shadow box and stuff then? They're asking me to shadow box and stuff. Just, oh, but we don't want to stop you. They'll stop me. Hey, can we get a little bit of this for me? We need these things, you know, and kind of explain what they're trying to do. And I'm like, all right, we'll get to that.

We'll get to that. We finish this stuff up. We finish this. Then we give them what they need trying to do and i'm like all right yeah we'll get to that we'll get to that you know we finish this stuff up we finish this then we give them what they need but but it's just it's part of the game but could you imagine them doing that to any other professional athlete could you imagine it's just part of the game like that like i but see does that happen to floyd mayweather do you think no i think there's i think there's different uh what is it different uh levels yeah so you gotta to accept it for just the promotion level. This is great promotion. Like embedded is great promotion.

Yeah, you want to put your promotion, you want to put your stuff out. So you have to accept it. So you just deal with the intrusion. But they should just stay the fuck out of your training. Like film what you film, but don't say shadow box, please. Even your privacy, you know, like me and my coach are doing game planning. But that's crazy. They do that when we go in the back, like we're getting ready to come out to fight.

And the cameras will come in. Hey, can you guys do this and do this? Oh, my God. That's crazy. You can't fuck with the preparation. You can't mix the preparation in with theater. Well, you get his mind in the right mental state. But the show has to go on.

They need this for the show. Yeah, but they need. They need it for the show. No, no't show no no no no no you need to organically catch people hitting pads you know so have someone in there that's filming they can catch you kicking pads and stays out of the way and then you you got footage and then you have someone cut that footage you'll be like everyone I will be doing sparring today and they were like oh well aren't you doing some like strength conditioning? Can you do some runs? I'm like, no, that's not until tomorrow we do those. Well, can you just run and do this for us?

Oh, my God. Or can you, like, today's not striking day. Well, can you, yeah. That's my point. It's like that alone is a problem because no one should be talking to you. If you're getting ready for a big fight your head should be entirely screwed into that not other people telling you and i know it's only one day but it doesn't matter if it's not just one day oh is there a lot yeah the whole the whole the whole and doing that the whole time

talking to you the whole time listen my coach is like my other coach sam he's a really nice guy but he started getting irritated you know like you could see it and Sam does not confrontational but you can just read it because I know him I can read his energy and he's like and I asked him a question and he didn't answer the question like for instance where are you guys going next he doesn't want to go and he doesn't want you guys to film but so he'll be like oh we're not going to be doing anything but then they went around and they asked me oh my god and didn't tell me they asked him so i'm like oh sam didn't tell you we're going to oh no we're going to oh yeah can we come along yeah but uh yeah and next you don't say i'm like so you can say no

they say you can say no but it's just weird you can say no but it's like uh we need our footage and make you feel like well you're not giving us the footage we need this right and then you can't complain about not being promoted and then if it's not good right because that's the thing too right i want it again it's not good enough we need again you know like shit like that like one time i was so tired and so in a bad mood i shot a terrible ass interview i was I was just like, you know? So then they're like, that was shit. I had to do it a whole hour again. Remember that one time Holloway gave an interview, and it was so odd that they didn't want him to fight?

No. Yeah. He had the same thing I had where his eyes looked funny. Everybody was looking at him, are you okay? He was just real tired. One of my eyes was doing the same thing. He was like, I was cutting a lot of weight. I'm doing all this stuff.

Detoxing. Everything's happening at once. And one of my eyes, I kept saying, why is my eye stuck like this? It was like, one was stuck. I look weird. Max had something going on. I don't remember what it was, but it all cleared up. Whatever it was.

Max had something going on, and he was trying to make weight. Something happened. They were concerned that he sounded off. And we never figured out what happened, what it was. Same thing happened with me. I don't know what it happened, but my kidneys shut down, my lungs, one of my lungs collapsed. Oh, Jesus Christ. I failed making weight.

So it's the weight cut thing again. I think that was Max, too. I think that was a short notice fight for him to do that. You know what I think it is, to be honest with you, is they have these infrared photos. But he was fighting at 55 for that fight. I remember that. He was fighting at 55 for that fight, and he asked him to go on. Yeah, he was down there, and he had no idea that he was going to fight.

Tony had fallen, tripped on some wires, and tore his knee apart. And so he had to take that fight on super-duper short notice. Cut that weight. That's what it does to your body. I wonder if that was it, though. I feel like it was another time. Same thing for me. I had the fight on two weeks notice.

But I don't think that was connected. I don't think that was – We never – he never said it. No, no, no. I think we're confusing stories. Yeah? Yeah, because I think there was one, which was the New York State Athletic Commission, I believe, looked at him –

I think he had it twice. Yeah, I think this was one where the New York State Athletic Commission looked at him cutting the weight and they're like, we're going to stop you right here. And he was like, I can still do this. And they were like, no, we're going to stop your weight cut. And then the other one was an interview that he did where he was talking to someone and they felt like he seems too tired. Like he seemed like really tired.

And they were trying to figure out what was wrong with him, but they attributed it to like him being jet lagged or something else. But then since then, had some of his finest performances, like the Calvin Cater fight. So whatever it was. It went away. It went away. Same with me.

They don't know exactly what it is, right? Is that the case? Probably hydration. That's what I believe it is. When you take these short notice and you have to put those things together, what it does is your body has to cut that weight. Those Volkanovski fights were wild. I was so bummed out.

I mean, I wanted to see that third fight. I wanted to see how that plays out. Because Max has never looked better, and then Volkanovski on Saturday night has never looked better. Yeah, that would be an epic trilogy. That's the fight. That's the next fight, I hope. I hope they do that.

It's a fucking crazy matchup. But then Cejudo's talking about coming out of retirement. So if he comes back, say he's going to get back into the testing pool, how long does he have to be in it before they let him in? Max Holloway. I have no idea. So let's hear what he sounds like. Because maybe they exaggerated.

See his eye? Yeah. You're giving me with this emoji. All right. His eye. Yeah. That's when I give the answer. Anyway, listen.

On to the fight. Brian Ortega. Is this the biggest challenge to your title or what? For sure. You know, the next fight is always the biggest fight. His eyes. Ortega is always the biggest fight. Who dies? Ortega is the next guy up. He's got a great team.

He's a great guy, great team behind him. That's why he's here in front of me. I can't wait to go out there. This kid's good. I don't think this seems like there's anything wrong with him. I'm not trying to start anything here, Max, but it seems like Ortega's getting a lot of shine. Obviously, a lot of people are excited about the undefeated fighters.

No, they said, I think you seem tired. Yeah, yeah, yeah, watch as we get to it. Do you feel like you're getting promoted enough leading up to this fight? It is what it is. This show knows that segment. And I feel great, man. It's good. This fight is getting a lot of hype, and I couldn't man you know it's good you know it's getting this fight is getting

a lot of hype and I couldn't ask for more you know I was talking to DC and people were saying DC that that these numbers is going to be high

you know like I said with the Khabib fight we was record record breaking Dana White was saying that UFC 205

was on that timeline to break it. This is weight cut. You don't see his eyes the way it looks? They look off. Well, Max, you say you feel great. Don't be offended when I say this, but you look like you just got out of bed.

Are you tired? What's going on? How's the weight? Are you drained? You look a little sleepy. I'm good, man. I'm good. I'm a little bit tired.

They got me doing a bunch of media stuff. A bunch of media. I'll be fine, man. I can't wait. I can't wait to go out there and do it. Good to know. As I say, no offense, but you just look like you're ready to fall asleep on me. Tired.

His eyes. He's like, how'd you even see that? Trying to cut weight. Yeah, but he's in the middle of cutting weight. Like, that's unfair. Yeah, that's... Man, that's the hard part. Based on that.

Yeah, like these guys start trying to... How can someone look at him based on that and say, yeah, we're going to pull you from the fight? How about stop the weight cutting? So, yeah. How about stop all weight cutting? If anybody wanted to do anything to make MMA better, I mean, more weight classes, less weight cutting.

You're asking about the media. Yeah. I woke up at 9. I didn't get done with media until maybe 3 o'clock. Oh, my God, that's crazy. And then you have to train after that? Yes. I didn't have enough time media until maybe 3 o'clock. Oh, my God, that's crazy. Yes. And then you have to train after that? Yes. I didn't have enough time to really drink water like that

because it was interview after interview after interview after interview after interview. And so it's like you're not hydrating. There's all these little things that you have to take into consideration when you're doing the main events. Here's the statement. Max's team and UFC staff noticed Max was not normal since late last week. This became obvious to many watching his interviews and public appearances the past few days. He was showing concussion-like symptoms before he even started the weight cut

and was rushed to the ER on Monday where they admitted him overnight. Initial scans seemed okay, but he was released Tuesday afternoon, but symptoms still continued. Max fought with his team to continue the fight he showed some improvement over the next day but was still showing obvious symptoms after open workouts he crashed and was very hard to wake up when he did he had flashing vision and slurred speech he's now back in the er for further tests okay so he must have had a concussion probably maybe probably got it in camp. I thought it was two different things.

This was the same day that interview was posted, too. And this is the same day. This is the Khabib fight. And so this is how he got pulled from it. That's when he's fighting at the 55, right? So it wasn't just that he was cutting weight. It seems like it was way more complicated. So that was the narrative, though, that was that they stopped his weight cut.

Yes, exactly. That seems way worse, right? It seems like it was way more complicated. So that was the narrative, though, that was that they stopped his weight cut. Yes. That seems way worse, right? Well, it's like, I mean, there's no getting around head trauma in MMA. It's just a part of the game. It is 100% a part of the game. And a guy like Max Holloway, who's such a good boxer, how do you get to be a good boxer? You do a lot of fucking sparring. Yes.

That's part of it. Look how good Sean Strickland is. And one of the reasons why is he spars a lot. You know Sean? Sean, I grew up with Sean. Did you really? Yes. We were all from the same area.

He started training with me at my academy, well, at my instructor's academy when he was like 12. They're going to do him. Who is he fighting next? I can't remember right off hand. I heard they were trying to do Paulo Costa. No, it's somebody else. Pretty sure it's somebody else.

He kept saying, but they don't want me to fight you. They don't want me to fight you. Alex Pereira. That's who I'm talking about. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is that who they're fighting? It's Alex Pereira. Yes.

I just remembered. Am I right? I'm right? Yes. It's Alex Pereira. Holy shit. That's the fucking fight. Yeah.

UFC finalizing middleweight bout between Sean Strickland, Alex Pereira, and July. That's a good fucking fight right there. Sean's a fucking crazy guy. Strickland has a very interesting way of finding people's faces. He's a very good striker. Who do you think he got it from? Yeah, let me tell you something. Who do you think he got it from?

From Bobby Green? Listen. Who do you think he got it from? I'm not going to take all the credit, okay? His ground game was always a sick ground game. But my coach would make me go over there to go train with him when he was over there. And we would go at it. And I beat the shit out of him.

But I'm a 55er, and he's an 85er. Well, he was 70 at one point in time, right? He dropped down to 70s and then went back up to 85s. But he was originally an 85. Oh, he originally started's an 85 er. Well, he was 70 at one point time, right? He dropped down to 70s and he back up to 85 but he was risen 85 Um, oh he originally started. Yeah, and so then he's at that Academy and he left in and went to millennia So when he went to millennia He John's a fucking ass. Okay. He's a fucking asshole. You seen the Spartan sparring footage. Yes. Come on He wasn't like that at first. He's he wasn't like the buddy. But he's a he's a fucking asshole. You seen his sparring footage? Yes. Come on. He wasn't like that at first.

He wasn't like that, but he's a very aggressive person. I told you, fighting, your personality comes out. Right. So if you do something to Sean that makes him feel, he's going to be dirty or mean. So back when I'm King of the Cage champion, he's kind of still coming up himself. I'm working with him. One time we were with him. This is for the Volkman fight.

This was the Volkman fight. Yeah? Yeah. So I'm working out with him. In between rounds, I'm going, whoa, wow, hyping myself up. Right. Shantae said it's disrespect. Oh, you disrespecting my gym, you know?

He comes at me like some crazy maniac where we're stepping off the mats. He had, like, this cage. It was over. But the way the cage is built is it's a door. It's locked up all these ways, but the door is here. So we kind of went off the door. He's chasing me off the door. One time we bumped into his coach and I

go oh my bad I'm doing that Sean cracked his ass crack me give me a concussion yeah really yeah a few weeks before the book was getting into us was that I like so he got tough just from not just for me but other who so then when he left there we came to he came to another gym. And now, since he's an asshole, none of the white fighters, none of the other fighters, they don't want to fight with him. He's going to go hard. So only the black guys want to fight with him. Only the black guys.

Me, Lorenz Larkin, there's another guy named Johnny Bravo. Johnny Bravo's in the UFC. These are all my big homies they're all bigger than me we all spar together I'm the 50 fiver they're heavyweights they're 205ers Lorenzo's a 205er

when I fought with him I don't know if you're familiar with Lorenzo Arquez oh absolutely then he came down to 85 then he came down to 70 his fight with Neil Magny is one of the most interesting

like clinics I learned to fight from fighting him. Watch him strike, man. He does a lot of really interesting shit. He does an oblique kick to the gut. You know that kick he does?

He leans off to the side and hits you with that heel. He's really good at that kick. Against Magny, he used it multiple times. I was like, whoa, that's hard to fake. High-level striking. That's hard to fake. High-level. Very high-level.

And so I used to get my ass kicked every day by him Lorenzo that's how I learned how to fight was that he kicked the shit out of this leg to it couldn't use this one he kicked the shit out of this one I go home I'd be like coach excuse me the way I met Lorenz and that coach is once he went to jail I didn't have a coach anymore so I'm like go back to the Mexican guys I'm in their gym and I'm like I'm gonna come back and work with you guys and as I'm talking to them they go hey he comes in he's looking for the best wrestler around so Bobby Green's the best wrestler so those Lorenz is this heavyweight I take him down work them you know so from there his coach wants me to start coming in to their gym and start working the wrestling.

So he's a striker. I'm trying to work the wrestling and getting down, understanding wrestling, how to work defense, blah, blah, blah. Right. That's how I ended up meeting my striking coach. But then from there, I'm like, hey, can I come? Can I join the team? Because my coach is gone. Right.

Can I join the team? Yeah. Well, we're going to work it out. And then I ended up joining and working with Lorenz Larkin. I got my striking really good from getting beat up every day. Then Lorenz left there. Sean leaves there. They're now at

Millennia, and I go up there from time to time and work with my guys. Sean got good from working with those guys. Lorenz Larkin, Bobby Green, Joe. Makes sense. Yeah. He used to say, none of the other guys want to go with me. He used to say, you guys. with those guys Lorenz Larkins Bobby Green Joe makes sense yeah he's like he used to say like none of the other guys want to go with me you say he's like you guys I'm like what do you mean you guys he just said you guys he's right now

like you're fucking early guy the top of the division he is he's get up he's up there that fight is a really interesting fight because Pereira will oblige him in the stand-up. Yes. It's going to be like, how does he choose to fight this? I think he needs... I would like to see... And he's a good ground guy. He's got great ground that he's shied away from.

I think that happens to fighters as we go through this transition of being crowd pleasers. Like, for instance, Justin Gaethje started out wrestling and he realized the energy it takes for one, but two, he's having so much more people and the excitement behind the stand-up aspect of it. Yeah, he became a big-time crowd pleaser. Crowd pleaser. Sean wants to be a crowd pleaser.

Even after he won that last fight, he's like, fuck, I'm sorry. Like, I wanted to bring more of a show to you guys. He's a crowd pleaser. He's a real fighter. Sean's real for real. Bring that shit. Let's go. Let's fight. That's why I used to use him. I would take Bobby in to go train with him because Sean was one of those guys, I don't give a fuck who you are. I'm going to come hard.

Everybody in the area was intimidated by Bobby in a lot of ways. They're intimidated by Sean too. We're going to figure out what's going on when those two fight because Pereira is a wicked striker. But Pereira had a good fight in his last fight with, was it Bruno Silva? Was that the guy he fought, the Brazilian cat, who was a really good striker, man.

He caught him with some good shots. Or did he fight after that? No. When was that card? Was that on the New York card? Who was Alex Pereira's last opponent? How many fights he has? Bruno Silva.

Bruno Silva. I just didn't want to fuck it up. Okay, so he fought again. He fought Bruno after he knocked out that one cat. Yeah, I fought in that car with him, yeah. Yeah, so he knocks out that one cat with a flying knee. Yes, I was in that car with him. Bruno Silva.

So that was the Bruno Silva fight was his second. Unanimous decision. Michaelitis. So that was his first two UFC fights. So one decision. But Bruno Silva's fucking real. He's a really good striker. It was a good fight.

It was like Bruno Silva tested him. Pereira won and Pereira wobbled him a few times and had him in real big trouble. But it's going to be real interesting with Strickland, because Strickland has a high-volume approach, too. He stays on you. Yeah. And it's going to be interesting to see how he deals with— that's an elite striker in Pereira.

Pereira is a fucking Amazon warrior. I mean, that dude's something real. I dealt with the same dude, So this can be a great question. Is he going to be a tough guy and try to be a tough guy and stand? Or is he going to be humble and try to win? Did you say a Strickland or both guys? I'm talking about Strickland. Strickland.

So what do you think is his path to win? His path to win? His easiest path would be to take him down. He's got a great ground game. Does he? Yeah. Well, maybe we'll see that. I don't know how much he—

He really stands up with everybody. But Pereira's been taken down before. Mikolaj just took him down. But the question is, is Sean going to do it? Right. We haven't seen that lately. He's become more of a striking base. Maybe he'll just test the waters. Maybe he's going to test the waters.

Pereira's got real fucking power, man. Real power. He's got world championship power. And he's the only guy to ever hold two titles consecutively in glory. He was the 85 and the 205 champion. Wow, okay, okay. Yeah, at the same time. So he's like champ, champ.

I just know him as his whole claim to being Izzy, you know? Yeah, well, he did knock out Izzy. But it's also he trains with Glover. And Glover's resurgence, I think, is directly connected. It's the same timeline as Pereira training with I think is directly connected. It's the same timeline as Pereira training with him. It's on the same timeline. It's not that Glover wasn't always elite. He's always

been elite. Glover's one of the best fighters in the world. Maybe added something to him. I think having a fucking straight up assassin. That dude's terrifying. He's a fucking assassin. You zig when you should have zagged with Pereira. It's night night. He makes everybody go to sleep if you watch it some of his fights in glory like holy shit man speaking of glover fucking great animal what oh the best guy the best guy but how

about wins the world title at 42 that's what i'm getting to as an underdog so dope i was screaming on the tv when that happened as an underdog like what when he I'm getting to. So dope. I was screaming on the TV when that happened. As an underdog. Amazing. When he got his back and he got that forearm under the neck, I'm like, no way. No way. You know, everybody's so happy for him. Everybody's so happy for him, you know? You can't be a Glover hater. Yeah.

Everybody's so happy. I went with that moment, you know, where everybody's just like, you deserve it, you know? Yeah. We've seen him. And he'd been up there and kind of failed And came back up there again You know Yeah I mean Jon Jones Yeah Jon Jones Jon Jones fucked his shoulder

Up in that fight too Yes I talk about it all the time That move That overhook He just wrenches it Nobody uses it And that's what

The creativity That's what I'm saying Jon is legendary At that He's creativity Nobody thought about that move Nobody thought about Come from here

To there Nobody thought about these moves See nobody ever Accus from here to there. Nobody thought about these moves. See, nobody ever accused Jon Jones of not being exciting. Nobody ever thought that. Bingo. He's freaking deadly, this guy. How about the Liotta Machida fight where he just drops him, chokes him unconscious, and just lets him go?

Bingo. It's one of the most brutal walk-off strangulations of all time. Because he cinches up the choke, he gets a guillotine on him, cinches up the choke, and then just dumps him. I mean, I think, if I want to say it correctly, I think he did like a high guillotine. Yeah. Is that what he did? Was it a high one?

Was it this one? I think so. Yeah. It was like whatever he did, he shut the lights out. Let's see if we can get a photo. There we go. Watch this. He pins him up against the cage.

There it is. Look. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. See, he pushes up with the other hand. That's what he did. That's right. That's right. I remember.

They never know how to use those limbs like that. And John just held on. He knew he was going to sleep. That's what I hate about rolling with those tall, long guys. I hate rolling with tall, long guys. The way he walked away like that i mean that's john jones in his prime right they can do things that nobody else can do you know well john always has great distance management that's the other thing about him you know he uses his strengths the fact that he's so tall and long he uses that to his advantage i'm just i'm on a judicious aspect have you like

you know when you roll with tall guys you you roll with them. It just sucks. Sometimes I'm in North-South and they'll be able to take their legs and stick them in. You look the hooks in and take your back. You're like, you shouldn't be able to do that. You shouldn't be able to do that.

I roll with somebody down in 10th Planet San Diego, I want to say. It's this long black guy and he's got a little afro and stuff. Man, just his flexibility was just unreal. And he was so long, he could just take his foot and, like, he took it all the way around my back and stuck it around here. This hook went all the way around and went in there. I'm like, this isn't fair.

Yeah, it's an advantage. Yeah, I wonder what the advantage in grappling is I guess shorter limbs you could defend better those guys dig under hooks and yeah short just defend limb stuff you know maybe but maybe but like well some guys are the adverse the scariest guy that was short was Paul Harris right oh god? Oh, God. He was like... That guy. Probably not even 5'7 and 5'7 wide. And would grab a hold of your

fucking leg and not let go. Yes! What happened to him? That guy's fucking nuts. Yeah, he left. The UFC, he's the only guy they ever kicked out for winning. Kicked out for winning and not letting go. Not letting go. They were so upset at him they kicked him off the UFC. And then he went to the PFL and did it to Jake Shields.

Yeah. Okay, I heard that. Caught Jake Shields in a Kimura. Poked him in the eyes and shit. He poked him in the eyes, and he caught him in a Kimura, and he wouldn't let go. And Jake punched him in the face after the fight was over. It was like, did he punch him in the face?

Maybe he pushed him. Something happened, yeah. He did something. Something happened. I forget what he exactly did, but he's furious because he did what he's always done. His eyes were fucked up after that fight. The guy doesn't want to let go, and he cheats in that regard. Okay, okay.

So what happened? Why do you think he's doing that? Why do you think? What's wrong with him? The guy's crazy. Any speculation? I mean, when a guy doesn't want to let go of a heel hook, and the referee's trying to pry your arm off, and you're still wrenching the knee apart, that's nuts. call that i call that roid rage you got some roid it could be it could be

we we can't have that though like there's i'm sure there's guys that have done steroids and let go of heel hooks like i don't think the two are totally connected i think you gotta let go when a guy fucking taps you gotta let go let go. But he's angry about something they said to him or did to him. No, he doesn't want to hurt you. He had a horrible childhood, apparently. The people that I've talked to that knew him from Brazil said he had a— I don't want to speak to it because it's not my business, but it was a horrific, horrific childhood.

I'm talking about the weigh-ins. But that's why— If you said something to him or you did something— He's a predator. He's really mean. And Paul Harris has nasty juj crazy. He's a predator. He's really mean. And Paul Harris has nasty jiu-jitsu. He takes it personal. Like at the weigh-ins, if you give him some type of a reason,

he takes it aggressively into the cage. Oh, yeah, rip your fucking leg off. Rip your legs apart. He was the scariest guy ever when he got a hold of your legs. Nasty. Because he was such a tank. Even if you tapped it, everybody knows. Yep.

Who was that guy? He ended his career. He was good. Mike Pierce. Mike if you tapped it, everybody knows. Yep. Who was that guy? He ended his career. He was good. Mike Pierce. Mike Pierce. Pierce, yeah. Mike Pierce, yeah. He tore his knee apart.

He tore a lot of knees apart, man. But you know, like, you saw Khalil Roundtree's sidekick to the knee? That'll fuck your knee up, too. I like that technique. It's a great technique. Great technique. It's a great technique. Look, if you're allowing heel hooks, can you allow that? Yeah. It's a great technique. Great technique. It's a great technique. Look, if you're allowing heel hooks, can you allow that?

Yeah. That's a good question. It's a good question. I should be able to. It's a good question. If you can tear my limbs apart, you know, I can't tear yours with a strike. That's the thing. It's like if you could tear it apart, why can't you kick it apart?

Yes. Right? You should be able to. It's not that easy to kick apart. Yes. Right? Or if you can knee somebody in the face, why can't you do it on the elbow then? Right.

All those things. You have the ability to check. You in the face, why can't you get on the elbow then? Right. All those things. You have the ability to check. You have the ability to move your leg. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Khalil's, his is so devastating.

Devastating. Because when he lands it, it's like what everybody always thought they would do if they ever got attacked. Right? Yeah. Right? You're always like,

I'll fucking kick your knees out. Someone actually said that to me once. It only takes about 400 pounds or 140 pounds of force to destroy a knee. You know, he's like, I'll fucking kick your knees out. Someone actually said that to me once. It only takes about 400 pounds or 140 pounds of force to destroy a knee. I'm like, try it. Are you good at kicking knees? You're a fucking expert. You don't think I'm going to see you wind up to kick my knee?

You think I'm stupid? Like, how are you going to kick knees? Like, you're not kicking knees. You know, it's like the average person, but Khalil Roundtree can kick the fuck out of your knee. High-level striker. High-level striker. And interesting fight, right, because he fought in a different stance. He fought low in that fight, which is very unusual because, like, when he fought Eric Anders, he came out like this,

like Thai style. Yeah, yeah, more Thai style, yeah. Very Thai style. This fight he was, like, hunkered down. It's interesting. Getting heavier. I think guys are trying to predict certain things. Like, maybe if you want to wrestle more, you know.

Maybe you just want to give people different looks, too. You just use different styles to beat different guys. I noticed. I'll use that for that perspective. Like, when I fought Clay Guida, I switched my stance to southpaw because wrestlers usually are taught to use their southpaw leg. So if I need to wrestle, I'm ready to wrestle. Got it.

But I'm also going to be more of a squatted position to be defensive against the wrestling, you know? Yeah. And did you just shift your hold camp that way? Hold camp. I ran southpaw to hold camp. I knew that was going that way. I still work my other stance too.

I work everything just in case I need it still, you know, to make sure it's sharp. What are you doing for, like, recovery? Do you do ice baths? Do you do saunas? What do you do? I fucking hate ice baths. But they're so dope. They're so good for you.

It's probably the worst thing they do in my camp, you know? I'm thinking about it like, oh, God. But don't you feel good afterwards? It's amazing. I feel so good. But just getting through that, you know? So I figured out little tricks that I'm trying to like, oh, I can do it this way now. Make it a little bit easier.

You just have to get through that first minute. Once you get through that first minute, you're good. I like C-Vac. Have you ever heard of it? I have heard of that, yeah. Have you tried it? I have not tried it. It's fucking awesome.

Explain to people what it is. So C-Vac is this pod. I filmed it on one have not tried it. It's fucking awesome. Explain to people what it is. So CVEC is this pod. I filmed it on one of my UFC things. You get in this pod and a little car, you know, and it seems like it simulates high elevation training. It takes you high up 30,000 feet. It drops you back down low sea level. Man, it does this thing to you.

And what it does is moving the blood around in your body. It's great for inflammation. Ian McCall was into that shit yeah he yeah he's the first guy to told me about it okay yeah see yeah you're getting these pods and and like and so what are you doing stuff about it like i'm here like i hear it helps with with your uh your blood basically we have here diabetics be on insulin and get off of insulin through this stuff. Yeah. Whoa. That's what I've heard.

I'm not going to, don't quote me. That's what the guy who I go through. So. I just want this to be true. Yeah. Yeah. I'm just going to, I'm not even going to research it. I'm just going to believe you.

Guys are having a lot of blood issues. If it does work, the UFC will have it. It says we are specifically interested in showing improvement in condition in those with a history of diabetic peripheral neuropathy. Those with a history of chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, COPD. Those with a history of traumatic brain injury, TBI, and concussion. Interesting. The concussion part.

So that's what he sold me on. He said, listen, all my guys that use this, they never got knocked out. I was like, what? What? Yeah. I was like, oh, okay, what? He's like, yeah. You can still get knocked out I was like what what yeah yeah you can still get knocked out that's great but I'm just saying like they have this look yeah right that's his luck I mean you fighting yeah but he's kind of sold

me on it as in terms of it because I hear that they it helps with brain recovery well I hope it does we need more things that do for sure you know I know that they've had some success with magnet therapy. I know they've done a lot of that with vets and football players and MMA athletes. Kat Zingano did that. They did that down towards San Diego. Interesting. I noticed after a fight, I'm all inflamed.

I'm all busted. I'm going to go in. I just feel... Well, that's why I was so fucking gangster that you fought Makachev on short notice. Not just on short notice, but short notice right after a fight. That's crazy. CVAC, I was using a lot of CVAC to kind of like try to get some of it down. And I'm still bloated.

You know, like, a fighter's go through this whole, like, a cheerleader phase where you go from being in shape to fat, you know? And it's like, I haven't had carbs. That's what I'm going to model cheerleaders, you know? I haven't had carbs. I haven't had salts, you know and it's like i haven't had carbs it doesn't fit like model cheerleaders you know i haven't had carbs i haven't had salts you know like you know chicken breast and broccoli yeah and so you look good and now you're fat and you feel self-conscious you know like i've heard some fighters don't want to get pictures taken when they're like out of camp you know that's why people like rampage i heard rampage is no, don't take pictures of me.

I seem to get mad at some guy before. You know, get pissed. So that's where I'm sitting more. So like you're a cheerleader, and then you come in the gym, all your friends are teasing you. You feel self-conscious. So I'm getting ready to fight. I'm bloated.

I'm super overweight. I jump in this thing, try to see back out, try to get it down, get some of this stuff down. I'm cutting weight. Crazy. I'm putting all these things together. I got to do blood again. And I'm afraid of needles, I told you. Right.

So I'm giving blood, right? And it's an issue. I got three heels. Planes, blood, weight cut. Those are my three heels in the fight. If I can get over those three heels, and detoxing. Okay?

Because I got to get off of fucking weed. Those are my four heels. So first is when it's quitting. And then after I quit and get past the two week of being an asshole to my dad, you know, I'll be mad. I won't even talk to him some days.

We'll just be in the gym. I won't even say nothing to him. I'll just be working out and just angry, you know, because I'm just detoxing right now. You know? And so that's the first heal. Then the second heal is the planes.

And then another heal is the needles. I'm giving blood. I'm giving blood, and I always pass out. No. Always pass out. I thought he was joking the first time it happened. We're down at Kessler's, you know? And I see him.

They go, you got to go do blood in this room, right? So we start walking over there. I look back at this fool. He's sweating. And it's cold as shit outside. I'm like, why are you sweating? He's like, bro, are you going to put a needle in me? And next thing you know, I come in the room. He's on a breathing apparatus and passed out.

Passed out. Dude, we're at like three hours and 40 minutes now. Holy shit. That's how long and 40 minutes now. Holy shit. That's how long I've been talking. Holy shit. I can go all day with this shit. I know. Unfortunately, I got to get out of here.

Yeah, I don't want to stop you. Whatever you want to wrap it up, you can wrap it up. We have to wrap it up, but it was a lot of fun. Thank you very much. Oh, yeah. And I appreciate that there's guys like you out there that are willing to take those big chances and jump in there with a guy like Makachev on such short notice. I always loved you.

You're always a fun guy and a fun fighter to watch. But that shows, like, remarkable courage. Those are my things. I always push inspiration. I always push jumping on the opportunity. I always tell my guys this. Like, you never know when the opportunity's going to come. You never know.

I mean, it's definitely a risk. But I applaud people like yourself that do take those risks. Sometimes you're going to fail. Right. Sometimes you're going to win. Like John Jones, when the Shogun fight, remember, that was supposed to be Rashad, but Rashad got injured and John stepped in. Yeah, stepped in.

I don't think that was a lot of time preparation either, was it? Probably not. I don't know. But he's training with Rashad every day. Yeah. Either way. When you ask me about those same things, this was more important to me. I knew all that stuff and i could lose and i could jeopardize all the stuff i got winning and all i had all this hurrah behind me and then now i'm gonna take that opportunity

but i was willing to do it for my family they're gonna take care of me and make sure that i make some money for my family i'm willing to take that risk well you're a fun guy to watch man people love watching your fight you know that that. Yeah. I try, brother. You do. I mean, that's what you're saying, that you work for showmanship. You clearly do. Yeah, so I do enjoy the shows. And I'm trying to find a fight that's going to be a showman.

Right. You know, I want to fight somebody that's going to come out there and bring at least the numbers. Yeah. Well, I hope they give you something good next. Did they give you any indication of when they would want you to fight again? I was trying to fight in May. Like, I'm a guy that doesn't want to sit around. I want to fight ASAP, you know, as soon as possible, keep them going.

I got places to be and things to do. And I got goals. And hit the goals, and then from there, I'm good. Keep moving. Yeah, so, like, for instance, right now I got two homes that I own, and I'm trying to pay them both off. So that's my goals. Right.

I'm going to hit those goals no matter what. Do they typically let you know, like how far in advance they typically let you know that they would like you to get ready to fight? Typically? Yeah. Like how does it go? Do they say, will you be available in July? What do they do?

Do they propose you a specific fight? 20 of them are short notice. Wow. At least. At least 20. At least 20 of them. At least. That's crazy, Bobby. At least. So people talk about my record, they don't understand. Right. At least 20 of them are short notice. Wow. At least. At least 20. At least 20 of them. Wow. At least. That's crazy, Bobby.

At least. So people talk about my record, they don't understand. Right. At least 20 of them are short notice. I think half your fights in the UFC were short notice. Short notice. I take everything I can get me. Sean knows me.

Sean's the matchmaker. He knows me from Strikeforce. Strikeforce, it would be like this. You two are going to fight each other, right? You guys are going to fight each other. You get hurt, Joe. Have you ever considered not doing it this way? Have you ever considered like that?

I mean, I know that you are that risk taker, and I think there is a lot of balls involved in being that person, but is it always the best move? Have you thought about it? Have you ever thought like maybe I should just only prepare for fights? I believe in failing forward. Failing forward. Yeah.

Make you go forward. Make you go forward make the mistake make the mistake get better along the way we're still going and i'm keeping this momentum going forward we learn from it we keep going forward but we took the risk we learned from the risk and you got another day you know who's a great uh example of someone who had been counted out but came back and became champion is olivera yeah because olivera had some tough fights where guys tapped him guys knocked him out and there was like there's quite a few fights and it's growth a lot of people kind of written him off at one point in time but then slowly but surely you start putting together these wins and then beating top top guys and then

looking like a fucking straight-up killer. Yeah. And to where he is now, it's like- What do you got? Fuck, man. That's a good fight. That's a good fight. What do you got? Gaethje's a terrifying human being.

What do you got? I don't know. I know. I know you don't know. I don't know. I don't want to see. Yeah, but that's one I don't know. I don't know.

I'm taking Gaethje on that. I'm going to go with Gaethje because- Gaethje's a dangerous man. That's my boy. I'm going to go with my dog. You know, he shot me a pair of gloves and they take care of me with the little, what's their, Onyx clothing stuff? Yes.

They make great fucking gear. Trevor Whitman is a wizard when it comes to making gloves. He's got the best MMA glove. Have you ever used his MMA glove? Bro, it's so well designed. Yeah. That Onyx brand, like all of his foam is like super high density foam protects your hands better they're the best gloves i've ever used i've seen the gloves i haven't seen the mma gloves

yeah his mma gloves are the best they're the best design i wish the ufc would adopt them they're so much better yeah they're so much better than the regular ones because they they maintain a curved hand right and the the many people say, you can speak to this, does it feel like it keeps your hand open a little bit, the UFC gloves? Like it's hard to curl it back a little? Yes. That's the main complaint. When I get my gloves, first thing I tell my guy, hey, get those gloves and start rolling them.

Start rolling them. Take them and roll them. Well, Trevor's beat. And break them. He's fixed that. And his has a curve to it. It is a natural curve. So when you put it in, your hands are naturally curved.

So I wonder if, like, over time, using a glove of that design would show an improvement in eye pokes. Because there's so many fucking eye pokes, man. It's horrific when guys are doing that. And what if your hand naturally did this? Naturally. And it was hard to do this. Maybe we could discourage people easier, and then maybe we could actually avoid a bunch of eye pokes.

Yeah. I got this little scar right here from my last one with Nazareth from him getting his finger in my eye. Yeah. Yeah. It's crazy that you fought that fight, and then right after that fought Makachev. It's crazy.

We did that with – I fought fought Kraus James Kraus and then it was like a couple of weeks later we fought Pat Healy and then few like shortly after that was Josh Thompson like 30 days or something after that crazy I'm an active guy you know I get it activity going I get it if you don't strike while the iron's hot yeah forget about you this culture you're gone tomorrow who's still here joe like like yeah they said it what happened to great maynard and well all those guys are gone i'm still here yeah you know that's true especially with 45 fights like my clock should be ticking. Should be. Yeah, yeah. I'm an old man. Yeah.

I'm a grandpa at this game, you know? Yeah. For sure. It's a crazy game, man. And the thing about it is it is literally the evolution of martial arts in front of our eyes. We're looking at it now and it's become normal to us because it's exciting and it's something we watch. We watch the UFC. We watch these other organizations.

It's great to watch MMA. But historically, we're going through an unprecedented time of analysis and effectiveness in martial arts. There's never been anything like it. The jiu-jitsu has never been better than it is now. The striking's never been better. The full MMA game. Yes. Full MMA game's never been better than it is now.

Even the timing. Yeah. Everything. The attacks. Everything. Like, for when I fought Aliquinta. Al Quinta? Al Iaquinta.

Yeah. Thank you. I knew that he was going to be missing that. You haven't been in the field for a while, buddy. Mm-hmm. You know, the speed. It's different now. Actually, we're going through these young guys.

They got me fighting all the young up-and-comers. Mm-hmm. These guys are fast. They're hitting hard. People are just getting better. Yes. You know, the speed. It's different now. These young guys that got me fighting all the young up-and-comers. These guys are fast. They're hitting hard. People are just getting better. Yes. You know? They know the realistic arts to train in at such a young age. Yep.

That, too. But it's also, it's like, so when you watch a guy like Hamzat emerge from the scene, you know, when you watch a guy like Gilbert Burns, you realize, like, these guys are so much better than, like, they're on such a high level. When you watch a guy like Gilbert Burns, you realize these guys are so much better. They're on such a high level. It's a new level. If you look at the top guys of today, it's a new level of excellence. For sure.

They're elite athletes now. From 1993 to now is nothing. That's what's crazy. How fast it grew. It's crazy because it's not that long. It's what's crazy. How fast it grew. It's crazy because it's not that long. It's fucking 30 years. When do you think we'll get to the point where we'll be like other sports? Well, I think it's always going to be too dangerous for most people,

too scary for most people because it's so raw. You see blood all the time. They keep the fights going and blood's leaking out of a giant cut in someone's forehead and the other guy's trying to open that cut up. It's so primal that I think there's going to be a certain amount of people that are always going to avoid it. They don't have the stomach for it. It's not something they're interested in. There's going to be a lot of people like us.

There's going to be a lot of people like us that like it a lot. And I think women like it too, man. I know a lot of women that are the manly mans of the UFC now. Yeah, I'm saying more so like my aunt's. She can't watch it. It's too much. The odor crowd. Yeah, for sure.

There's peaceful people that don't want to have nothing to do with it. So I don't think it's ever going to achieve the level of the number one sport in the world. But as far as relatability, it certainly is. As far as excitement, it certainly is. There's nothing like a crazy prize fight. We're killing boxing. We're killing these other organizations on how they're packaging it. That's true, too.

The UFC has an amazing team behind them, and Dana White is the best president any sports organization has ever had. So then you have all that, and then all the people that work in the UFC are cool as fuck. It's like you've got John Anik, who I think is the best play-by-play guy of all time. He's awesome. He's the best. He's the best at it. The guy's fucking flawless. He's a wizard.

He's so good at that shit. And then you got, you know, DC and Felder and Dominic Cruz. They're all your kids. They're all your kids, Joe. Yeah. You started them. You birthed them. They had to take

a little point from you well I learned a little bit from Jeff Blatnick and you know watching people do it before me fucking Bill Superfoot

Wallace did it Jeff Osborne Jeff Osborne was real good at it who was your who was your person you looked at or gave you

what you're doing or put you in the position like I'm gonna look at it and do it like this nobody that's why I got super lucky I came along or gave you what you're doing or put you in the position like, I'm going to look at it and do it like this. Nobody. You didn't steal anything from anybody? No, that's why I got super lucky.

I came along when no one was doing it. There had only been a couple guys before me. So when I first started doing commentary, I do post-fight interviews in 97. I'm talking about your style. I know, I know. But I'm saying, so my first exposure to the fighting at all is post-fight interviews in 97. So I do that.

And then that's only a couple years after the UFC started. It was four years after the UFC started. It was still relegated to you could only get it on direct TV. It was banned from cable. We were playing these weird places. So I did that for a little while. And then when I came back to do commentary, I only did it for fun. I thought it was I didn't think it was a job I

Really just did it cuz Dana asked me to do it I said I'll do it for fun and I didn't even get paid for like the first 15 shows I remember I said I don't even want any money so I go just get get me tickets You know fly my friends out. Do you remember kidding Jamie Walsh? Sure? Sure. He's a good buddy of mine. Okay. What's he up to now? He's back in California. I've got to reach out to him. But I know Jamie from John Jock Machados and I know Jamie from

he used to teach me kettlebells and he was a strength and conditioning coach. He trained Eddie Bravo when he prepared for Abu Dhabi in Brazil. And so when he had tapped Hoyler Gracie, Jamie Walsh was with him and me, the three of us. He's a great guy.

Yeah, so I met him when I was a blue belt and started training with him on the side pretty much. And then it was right around that Jeremy Williams time. Oh, okay. Oh, the suicide. Yeah, we shot a DVD for them down there, and I got to meet, you know, at that time it was Eddie and a handful of other guys,

you know, and Jamie would take me to the UFC, so you'd leave tickets for him. He'd call me up. Joe, let me see some tickets. Let's go. That's cool. Yeah, I hook a lot of friends up. Yeah.

One of the dopest things about the job. All right, I got to wrap this up. Yes, sir. This is very late. I just looked up at up at the clock thank you thanks for the story and thanks for and uh congratulations on getting out and your experience and you should definitely write a book or something about it and um yeah it's i mean it's it's a wild fucking story bobby thanks for being here it was a lot of fun i enjoyed it thank you sir and best of luck to you sir it's an honor to be here this was on my bucket list to do

I feel like that's amazing scratch that motherfucking I feel like now I can maybe I can retire now I did everything I got everything on my bucket list I think you have more great things to come sir

we're done thank you bye everybody it was an honor to be here Thank you.