The Joe Rogan Experience - JRE MMA Show #122 with Jake Shields

Episode Date: April 19, 2022

Joe sits down with Jake Shields: a veteran mixed martial artist and grappler who competed for multiple organizations, among them the UFC, PFL, and Strikeforce.

the Joe Rogan experience so you know which is everybody keeps hello Jake Shields how's it going Joe great to be on your show no new for like what 15 years fucking time brother and then uh maybe more it might be like yeah right 20 i remember seeing your podcast um when it first started you were like a small little friend show for like uh potheads fight people comedians well i waited until it got real big to bring you on yeah so now no no pressure now so we were talking about this uh what is it called this covid documentary that i think is made by the Russians. It's definitely true, by the way.

Watch the water. Definitely true. So what are they trying to say? Their snake venom? Alright, well, the... I don't know. I've just heard this one, by the way. Joe just broke this one to me. Yeah, someone was saying that it was the mark of the beast. Let me read you the byline, and you tell me what you think we're going to watch.

Okay. The plandemic continues, but its origins are still a nefarious mystery. How did the world get sick? How did COVID really spread? How did the satanic elite tell the world about this bioweapon ahead of time? Tell the world about this bioweapon ahead of time. Watch. This doctor has unveiled a shocking connection between this pandemic and the eternal battle of good and evil which began in the Garden of Eden.

Oh, Jesus. So that's what it is. They were saying that the snake venom. So there's a picture of a snake. Oh, boy. So they're saying it's the mark of the beast. Yeah, because the snake is like, you know, represents Satan. So literally Satan blood.

The crazy thing is they banned this from YouTube. Really? Yeah. At what point in time? Come on. What about fun? Yeah, we should be able to watch things about snake blood and the devil's beast. I want to watch it now.

I mean, even if it's ridiculous, come on. What about fun? Because I think when you pull things like this down from YouTube, it just makes the really nutty people think that there's an even grander conspiracy. Yeah, no, trying to fight it makes it seem like there might really be something there. It doesn't need to be taken down.

Especially this is just so ridiculous. It's like, come on. But the thing is, when you start saying Satan, people start getting real curious like maybe man Maybe yeah, I'd be Satan Satan. What is it? Kaiser so says Phrase the biggest trick the devil played Just outside of this if you've tried to make You know like one of those infomercials from the 90s and say you had some fake product that could cure this and you made a 45 minute version of that and put it on YouTube would they allow that as long as it's not about COVID the thing is like they've they've cracked down so hard on any anything that is against the

COVID narrative that's that's what's yeah it's kind of crazy how they'll ban even stuff that's true I mean stuff like this is obviously probably not true, but things that we now know for a fact are true. Guys like Alex Bernstein, you've had him on your show. Yeah. He got banned for putting stuff that was true just ahead of the curve. 100% true. Ahead of the curve.

If you put it out now, there wouldn't even be a debate about it. Like all the things that he said about masks not working, about how people that are vaccinated can still spread it. The problem is that 75% of all television advertising, 75% of it is from pharmaceutical companies. Yep. And you know who owns Twitter? Pharmaceutical companies and Vanguard and BlackRock. Well, also like the Saudi family, right?

Isn't that like one of the royal families? Because they were tweeting with Elon when Elon was trying to buy it. You see Elon's response? It was like, okay, so what's Saudi's opinion on free speech? I'm pretty sure that was a jab at the journalist they chopped up alive in Turkey. Yeah, Jamal Khashoggi. Yeah, I mean, that's how I thought of it at least. Did you ever see that documentary, The Dissident?

No, I didn't. thought of it at least. Did you ever see that documentary, The Dissident? No, I didn't. Dude, it's dark. It's Brian Fogle, and he's a brilliant documentary guy who also made Icarus. Did you see that? That's the one on the Russians cheating at the Olympics. I heard of it. I know I need to watch it, but I have not seen it. It's amazing.

I hear that's really good, yeah. It's amazing. It's amazing because it shows how the Russian doping program, how deep it goes. Damn. Like it goes. There's a lot of strong Russians I've trained with. Not saying they're doping, just want to be clear about that. But you guys are strong.

Jake, you started MMA and competition jiu-jitsu in the days where rampant steroid use. Yeah, everywhere. I mean, it was everywhere. Like, in the early days of fighting, like, when you were first, like, what year was your first MMA fight? I think 99. 99. Yeah. Surprisingly, we were always in the teams that were always, like, not, like, huge anti, but we were just never doing it.

Right. With Nick, Nate, Gil, all those guys. Right. Those are some of the few guys that didn't. You know, like in the sport, it's true. Most people are doing it. It made it hard not to because, you know, everyone's doing it, cycling off, and it made it so hard.

There's definitely less now, but to me I think there's still some out there. You see some of these guys just looking so jacked, such good shape. I have no idea what they're doing to beat the tests, but it seems like some guys are. Well, I mean, obviously there's some genetic freaks, but I think there's also some things that you can get away with. You know, I think micro dosing testosterone you could probably get away with.

Yeah. There's probably a bunch of different peptides that are still legal that are effective. Well, yeah. Genetics, but then you'll see a team that has like 10 guys that are all jacked. It's like, hmm. Yeah. Not going to say any teams. Well, what's crazy is when USADA came

along, how many people melted? No, exactly, because they melted, but you look at them now, and now they're blown back up. Yeah, they figured it out. They've worked out the cycles. That's kind of what I think, but I have no inside information, so I'm just speculating. Well, the amount of money that's in MMA now is so substantial, and

a lot of these teams are backed by like really wealthy people and they bring in fucking chemists. Yup. That can stay ahead of the, out of the curb. That's what I assumed was going on. But again,

I'm just no idea and I would never accuse anyone of a, of juicing without knowing that's a messed up thing to do. Have you fucked around with anything? Have you tried anything? Not really. No, not really is a weird word. Well,

diuretics. I'm getting older now so i think it might be about time to not competing are you done competing totally i'd still compete jiu-jitsu but most likely fighting i mean if someone offers me a shitload of money for another name guy i'll do it but i'm not gonna fight like some 25 and no russian that no one's ever heard of but they're trying to build up off of me right when was the last time you fought how many years ago like three years ago it's you know retirement was that p. Right. When was the last time you fought? How many years ago? Like three years ago. Three years ago.

It's, you know, retirement is a— Was that PFL? Yeah. Yeah? Yeah. Lost the last fight. How was that competing over there? I mean, it's good.

They pay good, but they just don't have the same kind of promo and attention. Right. It's just, you know, some of these shows pay better than the UFC for most people, but they don't build the hype. So it sucks with fighters sometimes who are looking at, you know, do I take a pay cut and go in the UFC and get less famous? I mean, I had to take a pay cut after I left Strikeforce,

but I wanted to fight GSP. So it's like I wouldn't have been happy with myself if I haven't got it. So it sucks to be in a situation to have to take a pay cut, but it's how it goes sometimes. Yeah. There's a lot of these companies that have to pay a lot of money to get good talent.

But it's still, it's like Bellator is the only one that's getting real attention, but they're not still getting anywhere near the attention of the UFC. Not even close. No. Like I have this guy, I'm going to corner next week. Pat packs,

a patchy mix, absolute savage, you know, like he's a 15 and 0s amateur all submissions, like 15 and one is a pro, like 13, 14 submissions. And like,

no one really knows who he is and he's fighting. He's been a million dollar tournament, so he's getting paid well, but it just sucks that he's not getting the, for how good he is, he's not getting the recognition he deserves. So how does that work? He gets a million bucks if he wins the tournament? Yeah, I think he, and he gets paid on top of it, too, his salary, I believe. Oh, really? So I think it's a million plus, you know, whatever he has for his fights.

Did you see Corey Anderson versus Nemkov this past weekend? I missed that. Oh, my god. It was such a bummer. Because first of all, Nemkov is a beast, but Corey Anderson was working him. Corey Anderson was way ahead in the fight. He was dominating him on the ground. He was taking him down.

He was doing fantastic in the stand-up. And then during the ground and pound, he slipped, like trying to throw an elbow, I believe, or maybe a punch, and they collided heads. Nemkov got a giant gash, and they stopped the fight and made it a no contest. So this is the million-dollar fight. Oh, Jesus.

Oh, that's the— Yeah. That was the final one? Yeah, that's it, because Nemkov's the champion. So are they going to fight again, or what are they going to do? Yes, they have to fight again, but now Nemkov has— Two fights for the million dollars. This is like—here, watch this again.

So we'll just go a little bit before this so you can see. I'm showing it. I was trying to find the slow-mo, or here you go. Yeah, so he was going to throw an elbow, and he got blocked and deflected and clashed heads. And props to Corey, he immediately said, I hit him with my head. See, look. See, it was just like his arms slipped off, and they collided heads. I wouldn't have said anything if I was Corey. Well, Corey's a good

man. Not that you're not, but, you know, he just... But I still wouldn't say anything. He just wanted to be... So, Nemcov's a bad motherfucker, though. He's a beast. I mean, he knocked out Ryan Bader, and Corey just was one of those things, man. I mean, there's nothing you can do.

Yeah, man. Bellator had some great fighters, but. They're doing well. They're doing well, but they never got the same kind of hype that Strikeforce had when it was a real metal thing. Because Strikeforce was the show, other than Pride, that managed to get some real hype. And Elite XC. Remember for a little bit? Yeah, that was, they kind of turned into that.

That's why they didn't mention Elite XC, because Strikeforce bought Elite XC and got their TV deals. Wasn't Elite XC on CBS? Yep, they had CBS. And then Strikeforce got that deal. So I was fighting on all those shows. That was when I was able to get some hype outside the UFC. That was a good time period. That was the sometimes these things happen in MMA,

when the brawl broke out between Mayhem and you guys. Yeah, it was after I beat Henderson. We went out there, and then Mayhem jumped over the cage, started talking crap, and we just beat the hell out of him. In his defense, he never complained about about it took his beating like a man he's crazy but that was just when when gus johnson said sometimes these things happen in mma everybody's like what the fuck are you saying yeah that that brawl was hilarious it was it was hilarious those are the wild days of mma yeah you know it's so funny like uh when you say you competed in 99 because that's like god man you were on the early early days that's six years

after the birth of the ufc damn is it that soon yeah you're right 93. oh yeah yeah the sports i've watched it just changed so much you know i've had fights bare knuckles um my first fight i was actually in the crowd watching the fight, just there to watch. And then someone didn't show up. Like, does anyone want to fight? And my dumb ass is like, yeah, me, me. And they're sitting there.

I'm going up there. They're taping my wrist. And I'm sitting there back there being like, wait, what did I just do? Is this a good idea? I'm a moron. Probably 20, so I was a moron. How long had you been training?

I think like three, four weeks. Oh, that's hilarious. I thought I could beat everyone up. I did win the fight. Wow. But I thought I was unbeatable. Did you have any striking training at all? Oh, no.

I think I got the crap beat out of me by Chuck Liddell one time. One time? I wanted to spar him. We know how Chuck looks, right? Imagine if you'd never seen Chuck. You'd be like, this guy is ridiculous. I'm going to mess this guy up. Really?

Chuck? I didn't really think I was messing him up. I thought I would do well. Then I got in there with him and he just creamed me. And this was when you were 20? Yeah. But he didn't try to knock me out with head shots, but he did with liver shots. Ugh.

Yeah, it was not. Dude, Chuck in the early days, before Chuck was a champion, when people were ducking him, it was hard for him to get fights, like when he fought Babalu. Like, Chuck was a fucking monster. Damn, yeah, I was training with him in that time period. He's the guy that introduced me to fighting, and, man, what a savage. He was kill or be killed.

Like, these young kids that don't know, put some respect on that guy's name. Yeah, dude, that guy's a legend. I mean, I look up to Chuck because he's the guy that got me into the sport. So I always look up to him as like a mentor and a big brother, you know? Yeah, dude, during the early days of MMA, I mean, he was the kill or peak killed guy. He's the guy that motivated me to take it for a career because he started making a little money. And I'm like, a little money, probably like 30K a fight. But I was so broke I was like oh man maybe I can make some money with a sport

and just uh went after it yeah that was such a crazy time right because like Chuck fought Pele in Vale Tudo in Brazil when they had nets under the bottom rope remember so he couldn't slip out caught under the net. It was a play, right? And Chuck was beating the crap out of him. Bare knuckle. Yeah, there it is. Savage.

30-minute fight, I think. Yeah, but look how they have the nets under the bottom rope. That was just so insane. So you couldn't scoot out. Which I kind of like that, actually. Because in Japan, I'd be fighting guys, and they would let the Japanese scoot out, but they wouldn't let us Americans scoot out. Oh, really?

Mm-hmm. Really? They would stop you? Like in judo. Yeah, they'd try to grab us, but they wouldn't let us Americans scoot out. Oh, really? Mm-hmm. Really? They would stop you? Like in Chudo. Yeah, they'd try to grab us, but then sometimes the left-legged guys would take them down and they'd slide right out of the ring and they'd restart you on the feet.

There should... Look at this. Wow. That's Chuck Liddell in Sao Paulo, Brazil. Yeah, that was like... What year was that? Because I was early when I knew Chuck and I remember I was just so pumped when he won that.

If I had it... Let me guess. I'm going to say 2001. I bet it's earlier. I bet it's like 99. Could be, because it was early when I knew Chuck. Does it say? Groin shots were legal.

Headbutts were legal. Kicks to the head on the ground were legal. As anything goes. Groin shots. The fact that groin ground were legal. As anything goes. Yeah. Groin shots. The fact that groin shots were legal is just fucking bonkers. Yeah. Even UFC 1, those weren't, were they?

Yes, they were. Do you remember Keith Hackney and Joe Son? Joe Son, Keith Hackney was on the ground, and Joe Son was hanging on to him, and Keith Hackney was punching him in the nuts over and over and over again that's right and then remember Hoist Gracie grabbed Kimo's hair yeah he's trying to pull him down by his hair yep so the worst was Big Daddy Goodrich versus the Pedro do you remember the Pedro Pedro his oh no the he was the Pedro it was a guy who fought Vale Tudo in Brazil. And Big Daddy Goodrich reached into his shorts and grabbed his balls and crushed his balls with his hand.

That is a savage man. Reached into his fucking shorts in the middle of a fight and grabbed his hog and crushed his nuts. You say this is Big Daddy Goodrich? I'm 99% positive. I'm going to remind myself never to get in a fight with Goodrich. Well, he's most certainly done, but I'm 99% certain that that's who did it. I don't know how I missed that one.

Who would it have been against? The Pedro. Against The Pedro. It was a guy named The Pedro. What year did you start watching fighting? Like really early? I found out about it in 94. It was after the first UFC.

I just moved to LA and I watched the second UFC. I got it from a video store, like a Hollywood video or some shit. And I was like, oh my God, what is this? And then I found out that this was like a thing that they were doing on a regular basis. So I saw it after it had already aired. Like maybe I'd heard about it. Yeah, same with me. I think around 95 or something, my dad rented some and brought it home.

Like, oh my God, this is crazy. Never thought I would do it, obviously. I mean, these guys are nuts. But then when I started fighting, my dad's like, you can't do this. I'm like, Dad, you're the one that brought these videos home, introduced it to me. Did you have any idea of doing something else? Was there something else you wanted to do when you were young? I had no clue what I wanted to do.

I was just a young kid getting in trouble. I thought maybe be a pro snowboarder. Some of my friends were trying to do that, but I didn't really have any ambition. I was going to school, but no idea what I wanted to study. So I caught fighting and just completely fell in love and got addicted and just couldn't help going for it and trying it. It's interesting because people have this idea of what kind of personality gets involved in fighting.

But your personality is kind of the opposite. You're very friendly, real quiet, mostly vegetarian. Yeah, fully vegetarian. Are you fully vegetarian? Not vegan, though, but yeah, vegetarian. Do you eat eggs? I do eat eggs. The veg quiet, mostly vegetarian. Yeah, fully vegetarian. Are you fully vegetarian? Not vegan, though, but yeah, vegetarian. Do you eat eggs? I do eat eggs. The vegans, no eggs.

Right. But you do that mostly for ethical reasons, right? Mostly for ethical reasons, yeah. I grew up vegetarian, so it makes it a lot easier for me. So I never had to cut it out. I don't miss it. So it's just kind of, the few times I've eaten it, I felt nasty and felt weird. And actually physically sick, too. Meat? Yeah. like yeah first time really and yeah it makes my stomach

blowed if I was to eat it I would do like you go hunting or something because the idea of like these factory farms or just I don't know if you watch any of those videos just just disgusting that's why I became a hunter because I watched those I had two choices in my mind I said I was either going to become a vegetarian or I was going to start hunting. And so I started hunting. Yeah, and a lot of my good friends have gotten into hunting, but it's kind of invited me, but I don't want to kill an animal still. Maybe I'll go out with them just for the

backpacking experience, though. Yeah. Well, it's great backpacking experience for sure, but the thing about hunting is that they have to kill those animals. There's so many of them. They have to be hunted, especially, like, deer. Like, when you're around here, around Texas, they're fucking everywhere, man. I mean, when I drive home at night, when I'm getting close to my house, I have to drive slow.

Because these fuckers are jumping out in front of the car all over the place. Yeah, no, I mean, it kind of makes sense. But it's still, like, if I don't eat it to kill something, it would just feel wrong to me. Yeah. But it was still, like, if I don't eat it to kill something, it would just feel wrong to me. Yeah. Well, the only reason why I would kill something and not eat it is that, like, if you have, like, a dangerous situation. Oh, yeah.

That's different. If an animal's coming after me, then definitely. Well, you have predators on your property. They're trying to kill your animals or stalk your dog or something like that. Oh, yeah. That's a totally different situation. But most animals you can eat, you know? You can eat anything. I ate a snake once because we killed that.

So I figured I might as well eat it. What was that like? I don't know. It tasted like chicken, I guess. But you don't eat chicken. So how would you even know that? That's what everyone says. When was the last time you actually had meat?

Probably like 10 years ago. Wow. Because this blows my stomach out. I don't feel good. That's interesting. I guess it's probably your body is like so accustomed to just eating vegetables. Yeah. I read there's like, I think we build enzymes for the meat.

And I think I probably could build it within a couple of days, but I don't have it for never adjusting it. So it would take me a little bit to readjust eating meat. Like what is a standard meal for you? Like what do you eat? Everything. Burritos, salads, you know, lots of fruit. Bean and cheese burritos. Bean and cheese burritos and vegetables,ritos salads you know lots of fruit bean and cheese

burritos and vegetables rice um you know thai food indian food i eat all all kinds of stuff what do you get like as your your for your primary protein source what do you use a lot of beans beans i don't really consume that much protein i probably should consume more protein but i feel like i'm everyone always says i'm strong that trains with me. No, you're very strong. So it's like, you know, I think there's different bodies, man. Some people are allergic to foods. Other people eat them easily. There's some sort of a biodiversity amongst human beings.

There's different people, man. Some people can eat all plants, and some people get sick when they eat all plants. Yeah. No, I'm really curious, too, if I ate meat, how my body would feel. I thought about it at one point in my fighting career to give it a try for a while. My string trainer was trying to get me to, but then I ate it a couple times, and I just felt so weird. And just the fact I never eat it, when I would eat it flesh, it would just be hard for me to put down. Really?

Just like psychologically? Mentally and physically. So it's both. So psychologically, it's hard eating it. And then physically, I would get sick afterwards, too. sick afterwards too so it's like i can't do this if you're gonna do it physically i would tell you to eat a very small portion i would say like have like a four ounce piece of like you know some sort of free range buffalo or something like that that's kind of what i believe from the looking at diet i think the best diet is maybe that with meat like once or twice twice a week small amounts because that's why i always friends being like oh i want to

switch to vegan or vegetarian i'm like hey do it slow you know just cut your meat way back eat it like twice a week yeah well that's the case with almost i mean look your body gets addicted to alcohol which is crazy because it's terrible for you but if you just keep drinking alcohol all the time and then cut off all the alcohol you'll die yeah it's crazy people that try to quit and they just can't get out of bed. They're sick from, from not drinking. It's so weird. Well, that's how weird the body is. The body's getting, body gets so accustomed to consuming certain things. Like if you have a person who eats only one kind of food and then they radically change it, your body's probably like, what the fuck is going on? Yeah. It goes. And then that's kind of how I watch my diet.

How stuff makes me feel. If I eat something and I don't feel good, I know I don't want to eat it. Like if I eat Krispy Kreme, I feel sick. I'm like, you know what? I don't think those are good for me. Yeah, I feel sick, but while I'm eating it, I feel amazing. While I'm chomping down, you get that, the chocolate cream filled ones, those are my favorite. Just melt in your mouth. But as soon as I'm done, I'm so angry at myself. And then I feel like shit for hours. It's like the amount of time you feel like shit versus the amount of time you feel good. Yeah, it's not worth it. You get about 30 seconds of good.

But if you eat a donut, you have to go to this place in Round Rock. Unfortunately, I can't think the name. Just put in donuts in Round Rock. It'll pop up. Probably the best donuts I've ever had. Really? It's worth thriving up there. I'm not going.

Send Jamie. Make Jamie do it. Make him earn his pay. Jamie has to research this snake venom stuff to make sure that Satan is not trying to play a trick on us. I think Satan is. You think so? Yeah. So back to that.

Who do you think comes up with that? You think someone being serious? You think someone trolling? I think there's a lot of variables. It could be like Russians that are like coming up with some nonsense to try to make people fight online. There's definitely a lot of these things that are trolls. There's a lot of these things that are created in whether it's Reddit or all these other places. Like the OK and Signal.

Oh, wait. I might get banned for doing that. No, the OK one was – that's a weird one, right? Because it used to be – there's some sort of game that some dorks play. Oh, yeah, it's the smack game. Where you smack a guy in the nuts if your finger's pointed a certain way. Yeah, I bet if you hit me before, I'd smack him back. I don't understand that game.

I didn't know about that game until Tim Pool told me about it. Did you know? What? Yeah. What is it? How does it work? Made you look. If you look below the leg, if you hold it here and you look, then I get to punch you.

I'm going to try to get you later. What? Made you look. But in the nuts? No, no, no, no. Oh, yeah. Well, it depends. Really, it's just a punch in the arm, but it depends on what kind of friend you got.

But it's also a white power thing. No, that's not real. That's where it became the 4chan troll stuff. 4chan made that up to see how ridiculous they could push things. So you go, let's see if we can get people to believe the OK thing is a white pride thing, and then it bought on. But then it caught on. But then the white power people did start using it.

Because I remember there was this photo of these militia guys, and they had that thing. They were holding their fingers that way. People didn't do it. Yeah. I think it's pretty rare. I saw one. There was a Mexican guy. He was driving through a Black Lives Matter protest, and he had his hands to the guy's- People do it. Yeah. I think it's pretty rare. I saw one. There was a Mexican guy. He was driving through a Black Lives Matter protest, and he had his hands to his window

just chilling there. Oh. And then it got spotted, and it went viral. And he got fired, lost his job. Now he's broke. He's Mexican? And he's Mexican. He's like, how can I be white pride?

Oh, my God. He was just an older dude. Maybe he had a booger on his- I'm sure he doesn't have Twitter. He's ready to flick it. That is crazy they fired him for holding his finger like that and it was sitting outside his car he was just chilling drive driving by and someone photographed it and went viral that is so ridiculous as if he's

signaling to people he's like an older in his 40s family like nice guy probably doesn't go online they fired him for that yeah i can't remember what company it was but but yeah he got fired and i saw an interview recently i think he was like you know lost all his money he was like all bummed out and he's like clearly i'm not a white supremacist i'm mexican that's so fucking stupid i remember there was a video of this lady who was eating outside of a restaurant i think it was in washington dc.C. It might have been in Brooklyn. I forget where it was. But she was eating outside,

and all these Black Lives Matter people came by, and they were telling her that she had to raise her fist in solidarity. And she's like, I'm not doing that. I marched with you guys. I'm not doing that. I'm here eating. And they're screaming and yelling at her. And then some of the organizers were like, white people get in front and yelling at her and then they told like like some of the

Organizers like white people get in front yell at her and white people you know I'm like that was forget the friends Yeah, that was so mad as a funny as I just saw that yesterday So yeah, someone on your show James Lindsay post that I saw it. I'm like what we forget forget How crazy was what a frenzy? Like that whole a post George Floyd time was because it was two things going on it was one people realizing like there's so much police violence it has to end and then there was also these white people that were clamoring to make sure that people don't think they're racist yeah i mean everything was just so polarized and it was crazy if you didn't jump online agree with

them you were racist if you didn't post a black square. Yeah, the black square. I think I had people mad at me. I didn't post a black square. Calling, Jake didn't post a black square. Yeah, I saw some people having a conversation about that. They were like, hey, he didn't even post a black square. I'm like, hey, fuck you.

You can't tell someone they have to post a goddamn black square. Did you not post one either, Joe? I did not post a black square. It's so dumb. That black square is not going to fix anything like and you making someone post a black square is just you exercising power over people getting people to submit that's all it is you're not fixing shit yeah no exactly but i know a lot of people that posted it that didn't want to i talked to him like oh i felt pressure to post it i mean it's their fault for not being stronger but i hold out for a bunch of people particularly girls a lot of times they feel the pressure like I don't want to post this but my friends are texting me and stuff like that well I know guys

have felt that pressure too but it's just like those are scary moments because people are accustomed to telling people what to do and getting people to comply and it becomes this like weird bully thing yeah we're really going through a weird time of that the last couple years you know it was never like that when i grew up but it's gotten pretty crazy like the last five years that people just especially san francisco where i was living yeah well you were diving into the waters of twitter i was like look at jaco because you it seems like you never used it too recently yeah yeah it seemed but it seemed like you had gotten to a point where you're like, fucking enough. Is that accurate? That's exactly what happened.

I think it was the COVID lockdowns were just so extreme in San Francisco. And then the Black Lives Matter riots came and they were letting people just loot and rob people. And I'm like, you know what? I'm going to start fucking speaking my mind. I probably lost about 20,000 followers in the first week tweeting. Did you really? Maybe like 10. Wow.

It took me a while, but I slowly now I'm back above where I was. Different audience. But now when I tweet about fighting, it gets like hardly any, uh, any traction. I'll tweet about politics and it goes crazy. So let's have a different audience. It's kind of hilarious. That's so funny. But if I like go like, so if I start my audience, I picked up, if I start talking crap on Trump

or something, it'll get like no, no likes, no retweets. Yeah. It's the, the, the San Francisco way of handling things might be the worst in the country well it's like the whole pacific northwest it's san francisco portland and seattle they handled that shit worse than anybody it was just unreal you know most of my like half my friends you know middle-class people spent years working their ass off probably more than half of minorities to build businesses up and just got their businesses crushed most of them went under you know restaurants clubs gyms it's just uh they don't realize the damage is done to people

especially the middle class they didn't fucking care because their checks kept coming all those politicians they and i have a friend and his brother works on the COVID board in California. And they were talking about banning outdoor dining. And he said, why would we ban outdoor dining? There's no cases that can be attributed to outdoor dining. This is not a factor. And the woman he was talking to said, it's all about the optics. Like, imagine, you're going to close a fucking restaurant that's been struggling for a year.

They finally get a little bit of money coming in. They're finally rehiring wait staff, rehiring bar staff. Everybody's kind of getting back in work again. Oh, we're going to shut down outdoor dining. Yeah, I think a lot of people just don't realize the devastation it did to people. Maybe they have a tech job or they don't live in those towns. It's a completely different job where they can stay home and get paid, but they don't realize you're completely killing

people's businesses that have spent years, sometimes their lifetime, to build and just kill it over that. Yeah, I think it's just the politicians. I think they don't care because I think they get paid no matter what and they feel oddly disconnected from the people. Well, I think about $4 trillion

went up to the top 1% during this, but I'd say about the same amount got lost from the middle class you mean four trillion dollars extra money got moved from the from the middle bottom to the top yeah i don't think about that too much but that redistribution of wealth thing dude if you keep breathing in the microphone like that i guarantee you people are going to complain oh sorry i didn't realize thanks for letting me know i don't want to uh mess it up. Because your nose is fucked, right? We were talking about that before the podcast. Yeah, I got the deviated septum, so I'm stuck.

I need to get this thing fixed. I got mine fixed. It was the best fucking thing I've ever done. Because mine was broken my whole life. I fell down a flight of stairs when I was like five years old and fucked my nose up. But I could never breathe out of it. It was always useless. Because I probably broke it like a dozen times over my life. know most fighters like like justin gaethje hear him talk he talks like this like it sounds like it sounds like there's like there's no nose like his nose

is completely stuffed up what was the recovery time on that uh fucking nothing i was rolling in six weeks yeah i gotta get that yeah i think i'm just so used to it, I don't realize, but now I'm going to breathe out of my nose. Oh, it changes everything. It's like, look at this. Fresh air. I would go to yoga class, and they would say, breathe out of your nose. I'm like, I can't. I'll die. Like, literally, I'll die.

That's like my friend gave me that thing for breathing out your nose. I'm like, I can't use this. I can't breathe out of my nose. Yeah. I mean, you could probably do it yourself. You could probably stick some sticks in there and pry it open. Really? If you want to be gangster.

I'm going to do a home surgery now. I remember I saw Josh Barnett fix someone's broken nose in a video. There's a video of Josh Barnett. The guy gets his nose broken in training. And Josh Barnett, I think he stuck a pencil in there and popped his nose back into place. Really? Yeah. I'm going to hit up Josh Barnett.

I'm going to get his number from you after we leave. I think it's like right when it breaks, though. I don't think you could do it like with yours. Okay, I guess I'll go to a doctor. What is this? Yeah, see, this dude just got his nose broken. And so Josh – oh, it says Strikeforce Heavyweight. So this is fairly old.

So Josh is manipulating this dude's nose. It all came out and started pumping in the media that there's no... What does it say? I wanted to hear the thing. I think he's just narrating over top of it. What is he saying though? It said smokers are being hospitalized at rates higher than any other demographic.

This is not the same. The truth is that's not the same. I think I got that one running. Rumble video going in the background. That's exactly what it is. I might have that. Looks like he's fixing it. You got another fucking thing running. I think I got that Rumble video going in the background. Oh, that's exactly what it is. You got that fucking snake venom video. Play this, though. You got the wrong one. Well, hold on, then.

I got to find it. You got three different browsers going on. The Rumble video. It is on this. That is definitely it. But, yeah, that's pretty savage. I mean, it makes sense, though. I mean, if you just broke it, you could kind of pop it back in place.

I hate going to the doctor. I would do that. Yeah. Here it goes. Now, here's the thing. Try not to f*** with it. What do you mean? Well, because it's going to itch.

It's going to swell. It's going to a lot of things. And you're going to want to mess with it, and it's going to knock it out. See, it's straight right now. Try not to f*** with it. Yeah, so in the beginning, he used a pencil or a pen, like a ballpoint pen. But here's what's funny. That shit ain't clean.

He didn't sterilize that pen. Just relax. Stuff that thing. You ever hit staff inside your nose? Oh, that would be terrible. Oh, my God, you totally can't. Staff is not good. Have you had staff inside your nose oh that would be terrible oh my god you totally can't good have you had staff yeah i had it like twice it was terrible it's not fun did you did you do the whole uh antibiotic course and everything yeah like in thailand if my leg blew up so big i think i would have like died if i hadn't gone in

it was like yeah in the middle of the night i had like cold sweats i didn't know if i was make it through the night but you don't know how to like, in Thailand, it's not like you just call 911. Right. How do you get antibiotics in Thailand? I took a scooter to the hospital and it was actually great treatment. It was clean, cheap. It put me on an IV. The doctor knew, I'm sure they had a lot of staff there. He knew all about it. Yeah. I guarantee you they do. Right. I was so impressed with the medical in Thailand. It was like 200 bucks. Really? In the US it was like 5,000 and way worse treatment. And it was like, and the medical in Thailand. It was like $200. Really? In the U.S., it was like $5,000 and way worse treatment. It was terrible treatment.

Where were you at? Phuket. Oh, was it Tiger Muay Thai? Tiger Muay Thai, yeah. That's a great camp. Yeah, and I've also been by Mike Swick. I'm sure you know Mike Swick. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

He had a gym right next to it. He lives there now, right? What happened with him? Why did he decide to move to Thailand? I think he just went there and loved it and decided to stay there. It's a pretty nice spot. I mean, have you been out there? I have been to Thailand, but I haven't been to Phuket.

I've been to Chiang Mai. I went with my family on a vacation. It was dope. Yeah. I love the people there. They're so nice. Everyone's so friendly and it's like it's a really beautiful culture and the foods. I love spicy food.

I love Thai food. Yeah. Thai people are just so friendly. I know, right? It's like, isn't it amazing that a culture that developed arguably the best stand-up striking style also is so friendly? Oh, yeah. And the Thai guys that you're sparring with are so nice. They're just chill. They love it when you're training with them. Americans. It's just like the nicest dudes. They're so nice and they're also really good at

not beating people up like one of the things about sparring like you have to be really careful say if you're an amateur and you spar with a professional and you go to certain gyms certain gyms they'll hurt you oh yeah that's that's especially in boxing they try to knock you out yeah the thai guys will play with you unless you go hard on them then they'll try to knock you out. Oh, yeah. 100%. The Thai guys will play with you. Unless you go hard on them, then they'll try to kick your ass, which obviously makes sense. Yeah. Yeah, if you go hard on them. But I remember my first times in a boxing gym, they just tried to kill me. Oh, yeah.

Unless you're really good, you go in a boxing gym, they're going to go out there and literally try to knock you out. That's what they just use people for. But it's crazy how many wars are in boxing gyms. I mean, so many videos of guys just flat out throwing 100% knocking people out, and they'll put that video up on your Instagram. And you're like, hey, man, you shouldn't put that up. You look like a fucking asshole here.

You shouldn't be sparring like this. Yeah, and posting knocking someone out is kind of messed up, too, a little disrespectful. Yeah. Well, it's also, it's the culture of those gyms. It's like there's so much bravado machismo whereas ties they like touch each other like they they spar so light it's really it's really interesting because it's not like it fucks with their timing you know it's like they fight so often that for them to spar and spar hard is ridiculous yeah i think that's why they spar so light because they fight so often so they spar

so they spar super light so it makes sense yeah so if you don't fight all the time you probably want to spar hard occasionally because they fight like every two weeks or something they can go out there and just kind of touch each other when they spar even though shin pads sometimes they'll spar and just be kicking you but not hard yeah no it's kind of it's kind of amazing really it's amazing that they figured out that style because that's the best way to get technical the best way to get technical. The best way to get technical is to not have, like, real consequences to your mistakes. Yeah. So you don't, like, flinch and you're not worried about, like, the counters, you know?

Yeah. No, the guys I train, I try to have them, like, you know, spar hard once a week and, like, medium and then have one time where it's just kind of play sparring where they're touching, moving. So they don't have to worry about getting hit. They can try all their new moves. When a guy gets hurt in the gym, how much time do you tell him to take off? It depends on how hurt. Like a minor concussion, at least a week.

A bigger one, longer. Yeah, but even just a week, even for a minor concussion, and then you're going to get hit in the head again. It's probably not good. Yeah, that's why I said at least a week. I'd say maybe if it was super minor, then maybe go back to drill sparring after that. I wouldn't go back into heavy sparring. Right.

But no, heart concussion, a couple months, I would say. Yeah, at least. And then it's like, how do you know if they're recovered? Do you ask them? Yeah, I've seen a few people get really bad concussions that last for years. Have you ever seen that? Oh, yeah, man. It's kind of scary.

Well, there's a lot of people that were never the same again after a brutal fight you know i mean we all know guys that were in wars and were never the same again yeah it's it's it sucks when you see that i'm lucky going through you know 20 years fighting i feel like um i mostly made it out uh mostly made it out okay not 100 might be a little bit retarded but can i say that word yes you just did what do you you just did. What do you think was your hardest fight, where you took the most damage? I had a lot of hard fights. Henderson dropped me twice in the first round. He hit so fucking hard, too. Yeah.

My last fight was Ray Cooper, a lot of damage, but I just mentally didn't really feel in that fight either. At that point, I don't even know why I was fighting. You were on the way out? Yeah, I lost motivation. And that's after, like, when I got hit in that one, I didn't have any desire to, like, get back up. On Henderson, you get dropped. It's like, I'm going to get up, and I'm going to win this fight.

Right. But when I realized I lost that desire, it's like, wait, why am I here doing this still? Yeah, that's a dangerous thing for a fighter, right? When you stop having that kind of enthusiasm that got you into fighting in the first place. It's such an intense sport. You have to have a hundred percent enthusiasm and motivation to do it. But the problem is a lot of times guys start making money later in their careers and that's the same time they're losing motivation, but then they're finally making the good paydays. So it's, it's tricky. Yeah. How did you find the PFL? Did you enjoy being over there?

Yeah, no, I did. It's like, you know, they don know, like I said, they don't have the same hype as UFC, so that sucks. But they treated me good. You know, they pay well. How are they affording to do what they're doing? Man, good question. Because it's a great show for the up-and-comers because you can go and make a million dollars in, like, what, three, four fights? Yeah. But, you know, for the older guys, they get a lot better contracts, too, the guys that have been around.

So they're paying these people pretty well. Some of the big names are getting paid pretty well on top of the million. Yeah. I mean, they have Kayla Harrison. They have good fighters. Anthony Pettis signed over there. Roy McDonald. Yeah.

They have good fighters. Do they still do that weird thing where they have points and you get a certain amount of points for finishing and it moves you further ahead? That's how they score the bracket because they have two matches and the point system is who you fight next. It's a little weird. Why fuck with that? I don't understand.

I think it's pointless. Why complicate things? Because I tried explaining it to somebody and they were like what i was like yeah i think you get like points if you win in the first round if it goes to a decision if it's a split decision maybe you get less points i don't know i think the reasoning is to take out bias and to be completely fair but i agree with you i don't really like it i think it's kind of weird when you're you're at that stage where you're not fighting anymore, and that's for someone who's fought since 99, that's a complicated stage in your life where you're sort of like,

you have to be all in to be a fighter, and then you realize at a certain point in time that you're not anymore. How do you make that adjustment? That is a good question, and that is extremely difficult, which I think is why a lot of athletes go on like past and they want to be fighting. It becomes like your identity is all I know is I get a fight, you know, and then I like train my ass off for like 10 weeks, fight, take a week off party back to the gym and try to schedule another fight. It's like your identity. And then you're like, Oh, I got to step away. And it's, um, the first, the first year was, was kind of tough, but now I've started getting in the business world.

I've been fortunate to have good mentors around me, like I don't know if you know Tarek Exim. He's my trainer. He's a great guy. He early on was pushing me into business. I wasn't really listening, unfortunately, until later. But then him and another guy I started working with, Derek Moneyberg, he's an extremely rich dude.

He really has business figured out. So I'm like, all right, learning from people that you've got to put energy into something else so you enjoy it. Right. What kind of business are you doing? Oh, man, I'm doing all kinds of stuff. I just launched my clothing company, American Jiu-Jitsu. Americanfight.com is a website. I've been working with High Rollers.

Oh, okay, the BJJ marijuana company. Yeah, one of the owners there now. Oh, you're one of the owners? Yeah, so I think I'm getting a deal on Fight Pass. Have you ever done a competition high? I did once at the High Rollers against Diego. What is it like being barbecued? Terrifying.

How often do you get high, first off? Like once every couple months. Oh, really? It was like, oh, crap, I smoked too much. Well, you're hanging out with the Diaz brothers though. Everybody would assume that you get high every day. Oh yeah, everyone thinks I'm high all the time.

Nick, I think Nick smokes the most by far. Does he? Yeah, Nate's not like, he smokes, but not like Nick. Nick will just put it down. He'll smoke you under the table. I'm sure. Dude, a lot of people smoke me under the table. I've had people on this podcast that, like Mike Tyson the other day, he smoked me under the table.

Oh, you just had Mike Tyson? Yeah. I'll have to watch that one. Snoop Dogg, he smoked me under the table. Wiz Khalifa, Action Bronson, he smoked me under the table. Most people do. Most real solid smokers. I smoke a lot, but I don't smoke a lot for a person who smokes a lot.

Yeah, I'm a lightweight. The best, though, Nick Diaz and Snoop Dogg did an interview, and they're both just sitting there with their own blunts. They didn't want to, like, pass them. I'm like, oh, yeah, that's totally Nick Diaz move. Well, Snoop Dogg rolled and smoked two blunts of his own during the podcast. Yeah, animal. I wouldn't build a top.

Just puts them down, puts it down. But those guys, he's high all the time, though. Did you see the video of him preparing for the Super Bowl? He's in that little Super Bowl set, and he's smoking while he's getting ready to go perform during the Super Bowl halftime. Snoop is smoking. Yeah, that's awesome. And me, I couldn't do it.

Savage. Just super human tolerance for marijuana. But he could just exist high as fuck and be cool. Cool as a cucumber. Like, all day. You see, there was a press conference from Nate's last fight. The press conference was getting super boring, so he just lit up, started smoking, made conference. You could do that now.

He can at least. Yeah. Well, back in the day, marijuana was a real problem because guys would be like six weeks out, and they would be their last smoke and then they would still test positive you know especially when you're cutting a lot of weight and you're you know deleting all that fat from your body and for whatever reason a lot of guys were testing positive that were like and so people were trying like seven eight nine ten weeks out and guys get real irritable it just doesn't it doesn't help you're fighting i don't think like smoking six weeks out or five weeks out i think if you were

high while you're fighting then you're making an argument that it might be helping yeah it means to me i don't think it's ever been banned but uh yeah i don't think it helped me when i was high i think what nick diaz may have fought high during what was the Gomi fight. He did. Then they tried to give him a lifetime ban for weed. God. Well, the craziest one is when he fought Anderson. Because Anderson tested positive for steroids. They banned Anderson for a short amount of time. Nick tested positive for a tiny amount of marijuana.

Tiny amount. And they banned him for fucking two years. Yeah. I think it was five years. Maybe they got it reduced. They gave him a five year. Then he fought it him for fucking two years. Yeah. I think it was five years. Maybe they got reduced. I think they gave him a five year, then he like fought it and reduced it to two. Yeah. Yeah. And I was at that hearing with him in Nevada. It was this girl wanted to ban him for life. And it turned out she was from Stockton. So it had to be some kind of resentment of like, he's from the same town, but bigger than her. You could just tell it was. You think that's what it

was? She just seemed like, I don't know. She just seemed like resentful because he was from Stockton and famous and like, she wanted to be big. I think? I don't know. She just seemed resentful because he was from Stockton and famous and she wanted to be big. I don't know if it's that, but I think there's definitely a power issue with those folks, with people that have. It's like some people just don't make good judges. They're not good at an athletic commission. Some people just should not have the kind of power that they have. 100% agree.

They just abuse it. The judge is a good one. Some of these guys, they know nothing about fighting. Why would you be a judge? Something you don't know about. Yeah. I meant judges in terms of like legal judges. But yeah, judges for fighting too.

Yeah. That's the sore spot. The judges for fighting. God. There's good ones. There's definitely good ones. But my God, there's some bad ones out there too. Did you see the AJ McKee pit bull fight this past weekend?

Yeah, I know. I missed that whole card, unfortunately. Yeah, I watched highlights of it. I'm going to have to go back and watch the whole fight and score it and see what people think because there's a lot of people that think that was a bullshit decision. Yeah, I've heard it was all over the place. I have some friends who are training with AJ. So, he's obviously biased, but he said it was a close fight.

Well, I mean, it was close enough. I mean, it was definitely close. It was a five-round decision. But, you know, he did score takedowns, but Pitbull did almost catch him in a submission. It's like. Yeah, some of them are hard to judge. Kind of like the Sterling one, Sterling on one. That one's like, it basically comes down to who won that first round.

It does, but doesn't... Listen, when Sterling takes your back and has your back for the entire fucking round and comes really close to getting chokes in and is punching you the entire round, complete back control, when is that a 10-8? I want to know when that's a 10-8. Oh, yeah, it's tough.

There's no clear judging criteria. Because I watched him take his back, and first of all, I was stunned at how strong his back control is. I always knew it was good. I mean, it was amazing against Sanhagen when he took Sanhagen's back and strangled him. But to Yon, no one has ever controlled Yon on the ground like that before. No one.

Yeah, if you're a good body triangle rider and you lock it, it's so hard to get out of. He's so good. And I think Yon didn't really know how if you're a good body triangle rider and you lock it, it's so hard to get out of. He's so good. Jan didn't really know how to work to unlock that body triangle. I was so impressed with Aljamain. I was so impressed with his back taking and his back control. I know how good Jan is on the ground. He's a

fucking beast, man. No one's been able to control him on the ground. The fact that Aljamain was able to get him to the ground repeatedly and take his back repeatedly. I was very impressed with that. Yeah, Sterling's an amazing fighter. I just think because the way the last one went, a lot of people didn't really like him. But I have him, he trains at Couture where I'm training people. So I have him spar the 35 pounders I train all the time. And he's definitely the real deal.

Oh, he's the real deal. His jiu-jitsu is off the charts. I think with a situation like that first fight, first of all, it was 100% an illegal blow. 100% he should be disqualified. No ifs, ands, or buts. That was a fucking knee, a hard knee to the face of a downed opponent and he was fucked up from that. That said, I don't think you could win

a title. I think you should be able to lose a title that way. I don't think you should be able to win a title that way. Yeah, no, it made it weird. I even like Sterling, friends with him, but it was one of those things. You watch it, you're like, oh, that's kind of a crappy way to win. Well, win a fight? Maybe. Win a title?

No. Like win by disqualification? Yes, because you get your win bonus? Yeah. Okay. But win a world championship? No, you have to win that. You have to win that.

You have to beat a guy. That's not beating a guy. That's the guy fucking up and losing his title. Yeah, because even though he's a friend of mine, I respect him, I didn't really look at him as a champ until he beat Jan. Now you can say he's a champ. He's a champ now. At least in my eyes.

I think most people's eyes. Listen, he, without a doubt, had the best performance ever against Jan. And he opened up a lot of people's eyes because a lot of people did not. They looked at Jan as being complete. His ground game's complete, his takedowns, his trips, his striking game is off the charts, and everybody was like, look, this guy's a fucking terror. But Al Jermaine found the kryptonite.

I mean, look at his record. He's fought some savages. I can't remember exactly who, I remember looking at it being like, oh, he's the real deal. Oh, he fucked up a lot of people, man. Like, if you look at what, I mean, if you talk about Piotr Jan, look at how he knocked out Uriah, beat up Jose Aldo.

Like, he's beat the fuck out of some people. He's a fucking bad man. He's a dangerous dude. Yeah, no, it's Ian and Sterling. That's a, 35 is an exciting weight. Fuck yeah. I just signed one of my 35 pounders to the UFC, Javed Bashra. You know him?

No, I don't. He's, I think, 2-0 now. He was the one that got called a terrorist at the, what show was that? Like the Tinder series. Some guy called him a terrorist at weigh-ins, which was stupid, but it went viral because he's Afghan. Oh. So completely stupid, but it made it go viral like in the Middle East and everywhere.

So got him a lot of attention. Well, there you go. And then he beat the crap out of the guy. So you're coaching a lot of guys now? No, just a small group. I'm very selective who I train. How do you decide? Just guys I like that train hard that I want to work with.

So you're in the gym, you're training, and you see guys, and do they come to you and ask you for help? It's generally the guys that ask me. I help a lot of guys a tiny bit, but I wouldn't say I'm their trainer. I might go Francis Ngannou a move, but I'm not his trainer. There's guys like that. There's five or six guys that I put a lot of energy

into. And when you put energy into them, do you have a contract with these guys? I don't. I'm just doing it off word of mouth. If they don't want me, they can get rid of me. And do they pay you? Do they give you a percentage? Yeah. It's not much.

It's small. There's not a ton of money in training. But luckily, that's not my primary method of making money. I do it because I love it. It keeps me involved in the sport. I go out there. When you're cornered, it almost feels like you fight. Right.

The excitement level. You're just attached to these guys. It's like they become like your brothers. When you bleed together, sweat together, it almost feels like you fight. Right, the excitement level. And you're just attached to these guys. It's like they become like your brothers. When you bleed together, sweat together, it's like a brotherhood. I mean, you know just from jiu-jitsu. Imagine when you're out there actually fighting. It's like take that and magnify it by 10. Yeah.

Well, that's what Gary Tonin said. Gary Tonin, when he made the jump from just straight grappling to MMA, he was like the thrill of going out there and knowing that you're putting it all on the line and that you can get yourself knocked out. You can get hurt and embarrassed. People don't think about that. Millions of people might be watching you. If you want to get knocked out, covered in blood

in front of all your friends, fans, it's a lot of stress going in there. So after going back to grapple that, it's funny when you see people nervous at grappling shows, you're like, yeah, try fighting in front of 60,000 people in Toronto. That's right. That's right. Yeah, you fought.

You commentated that one, right? That was wild, right? It was wild being there because I remember it was a giant, it was the Rogers Center, right? Yeah, the Rogers Center. In Toronto. And it was so big that there was a hotel inside of the arena. And so people in their hotel rooms were looking out their windows watching the fights yeah being the main event of that was just wild walking out you

look up you're like what the hell the fucking screens alone were so big and the roars of the fights like when someone would would score a like a knockdown or something like that yeah that was still the wildest moment of my career that was like that was nuts yeah that was nuts is that like what do certain fights stand out when you you think about your career where you're like i can't fucking believe that fight a little bit i mean i had a lot of big like i looked through my record and i'm like holy crap i fought the who's who of m you know yeah back like remember the rumble in the rock tournament I beat like what there was three uh two I fought was it you should

know call me and Carlos Condit in the same night like two just complete savages and won both of those I was just wrecked after my friends are like yeah we're gonna go rage I'm just like oh man I want to go home but all right I guess I'll go out oh. Oh, that's hilarious. Like cuts all over my head, body sore, shin swollen up. You submitted Henderson in his prime. Yeah, I didn't submit him, but I dominated that fight. Oh, that's right. That's right. You didn't submit him.

Who submitted Henderson? Did somebody catch Henderson? I don't know what I can think of. What am I thinking of? Yeah, he's a hard guy to submit. Am I thinking of Robbie Lawler? Did you submit Robbie Lawler to the guillotine? Yes, that's what I was you're thinking that was in Strikeforce yeah that was that one was awesome too that was awesome yeah man you really did

fight the fucking who's who yeah it's I did not have a padded record I wish I had a coach or management manager guy maybe like maybe we should take some easier fights you beat Tyron Woodley by decision you fought George St. Pierre for the title in one of the biggest crowds of all time. Yeah. Damian Maia. That's right. Yeah.

Damn, dude. You had a wild-ass career. Yeah, it's pretty wild. I remember, I don't know, six months ago or something, I went and looked through it. I was looking at the guys I fought, and I'm like, holy crap. I don't think I fought anyone. The worst guy I fought would be like 16-3 or something. No, you had wars, man.

You had fucking wars. You really did. You had a lot of wars. Yeah. Yeah, looking back, it's kind of wild. I'm like, wait, I did this for 20 years. I would go in the cage and try to beat the crap out of some of the best fighters in the world. Does it seem strange now?

You're three years removed. Does it seem like looking back like, whoa. It seems a little wild because when you're doing it, it just seems so natural. But it's still, I mean, part of me misses it, of course. That's why I'm training guys. Just the thrill of it. Yeah, but that's what the training is. When you're courting a fighter, it's very close.

Not quite. Nothing will match it, but it's like you get that same adrenaline because I come so close to these guys I'm training. So you have your business with like your clothing line. And do you think you'll ever open up a gym? I was thinking about it, but it's like a lot of work to run a gym. And it's not a ton of money for having to like sit around. And I would do it, but I would have to have a good partner and other people that help

me teach because I enjoy teaching, but I don't, I'm not like a John Donahue. I want to teach five times a day. Right. He's a weird guy, right? Right. I mean, I mean not like John Donahue I want to teach five times a day right he's a weird guy right right I mean I mean weird yeah best possible way a hundred percent I love John but he's definitely an odd character so odd good luck finding one of those I was talking to Gordon about that I was like good luck finding another one of those you got a guy who is a philosophy professor from Columbia who falls in love with jiu-jitsu

to the point where he lives in the gym, sleeps on the mats, trains all day, and he's not self-obsessed because he's injured. Like, for people who don't know, John Donahue has, like, serious injuries. Like, he had his hip replaced. I think he's going to have his knee replaced. It's just not sure when.

And a lot of that is from rugby before he ever did jujitsu yeah no yeah i was training in new york when he had the hip replacement and the knee and he was just an absolute pain you could tell but he's a stoic guy he would you know limp in with a cane he couldn't show the matches so he would like sit there and point with like a staff yeah make like gary show the moves and then there was a couple month period i think he was going through the pain where sometimes he would just go off on gary i'm like oh poor gary he's showing it wrong wow but man yeah he's a smart guy oh he's a genius it's just very rare to get someone of that intellectual that high level intellectual capacity that gets obsessed with jujitsu and martial arts in general like when i found out that he was gary tonin's striking

coach as well as his jiu-jitsu coach i was like holy fuck that's insane yeah when i started talking to him about striking one day i was in shock he was showing me like different boxers and kickboxers and like showing their offense their defense you're like wow this guy is like an encyclopedia he's uh he knows everything he knew the same thing with wrestlers yeah he'll name like some iranian wrestler and he'll like know what he does. It's like wow. This is just insane. Yeah, his knowledge base is spectacular and They say that's all he does like he'll teach all day and then he'll go watch the videos all night Yep, he would teach in between classes. He'd be watching videos then back to a class. I don't know how he does it

I mean, what are the I mean how many of those guys are out there? There's no one out. I think just one right him I mean other than him you got like for us a hobby who's also a brilliant guy who's also fascinated with the sport and can give you a lot of feedback and Can name a lot of different styles of striking and jiu-jitsu, but Yeah, I know that I mean there's a lot of brilliant guys out there, but there's no one like John They just completely completely dedicate his life. No family. Just all he does is watch tape, train people. How is that possible?

Yeah, it makes no sense. It's intelligence level, too. Right. Like, how is he not bored? Yeah, that's what I'm like. That's what I'm like. Why are you teaching so many classes? You think he would just do the pro team now?

He's rich now or making good money. Right. I mean, it has nothing to do with it. He wears rash cards everywhere. Yeah. The guy, like, I mean, I don't even know if he has a car. Does he have a car? He finally bought one last time I was out here. I was terrified getting in the car with him because he had like three days.

But he drove really well. I guess he's an intelligent guy. I was impressed. I'm like, you want me to drive, John? What kind of car did he get? He got, what was that, a Jeep? I can't think what it was. A Jeep? No, not a Jeep. It's like, dang it, I have a brain freeze. It's like a semi-fancy car, but not super fancy. Oh, so he's just out here.

Yeah, probably a $50,000, $60,000 car. I'm very happy he's out here. I'm very happy he's out here. It adds to Austin. Yeah, so much. I visit Austin a lot regardless, but now I have an excuse to come out and train with him and Gordon and Gary, just the best jiu-jitsu guys. Were you training with them in Puerto Rico at all?

No, I never made it to Puerto Rico. It was terrible out there. Other than Gordon, he loved it, but everyone else thought it was terrible. Why did they think it was terrible? I think there was just nothing to do. They were like a gated community. It's all dudes in their 20s, single, and you're out in a gated community where nothing is going on. Like imagine that. That does not sound too fun.

Yeah. It doesn't sound like a good time unless you're gay. Yeah. Then it'd be the best time. Yeah. That'd be amazing. A lot of dudes. Yeah. A lot of dudes hugging each other. So they were in a gated community. Were they close to the beach at least? I think so. I think it was nice, but it was boring. I think that's what helped lead to the split of the team, which is very unfortunate.

What caused that? Do you know? A little bit, but I don't want to go and air people's dramas. I'm neutral because I'm friends with everyone on both sides. It's a bummer. Yeah, it's a total bummer because I like everyone involved. And I tried talking to them. Hey, is there any way this could be resolved?

And it was just like, no. That's crazy. It's crazy that they're all out here, too. They all came to the same city, and then they split up. Yeah, the B team. The name's hilarious. Very funny. Well, they're funny.

Craig's hilarious. He's a funny motherfucker, you know? And Nicky Rodriguez is a fucking freak athlete. That guy. You see his brother? Yes. Just won the ADCC trials and, like, I think less than a year training, too. It's like, talk about that family.

Amazing. Well, that's real. You know, that's genetics. There are people that are just, they have amazing, and then they'll have a background in something else, like maybe gymnastics or, you know, some other explosive sport, and it translates very easily to MMA or jiu-jitsu. Yeah, no, those guys just, they picked it up so quick. Nicky Rod, I think he trained a year when he took second in Abu Dhabi.

Wow, really? And then his brother won the trials. And the trials now are like 250 people per weight. It was unreal. That really is crazy. But it makes sense because it's such an athletic pursuit, especially no-gi. No-gi is so athletic. As Marcelo Garcia was talking about that,

he was saying the difference between gi and no-gi is that your athletic ability has so much more of an impact on no-gi. Yeah, I think that's why a lot of older people and stuff prefer the gi. It slows down the pace. Sure, definitely. You ever train with a gi or you miss all no-gi?

I train gi and no-gi. You definitely feel like things are – the thing I don't like about the gi is like the weird stuff when people try to choke you with their clothes. Like they try to like wrap their lapel around your neck and like, okay, are we bringing weapons in? Can I choke you with my belt? Because you can, right? Yeah, I think so. I never did much gi, so it was kind of – That's kind of crazy. Yeah. You can choke someone with my belt? Because you can, right? Yeah, I think so. I never did much gi, so it was kind of – That's kind of crazy.

Yeah. You can choke someone with a belt. But what I would do is just do no-gi techniques with the gi. So I use the gi defensively because it made me watch my P's and Q's and make sure anybody doesn't get a deep grab on my collar or something like that. But as far as the techniques that I use, other than very rarely I will pull out a clock collar or something like that. But as far as like the techniques that I use, other than very rarely, I will pull out like a clock choke or something like that. Most of the time I'm using no gi techniques with a gi.

Yeah. Whenever I put a gi on, it's a hundred percent, uh, no gi techniques. Crazy thing is I went and, when I was a purple belt, I was back when the Brazilians were like,

you're not really a purple belt. So I went through it on for like one week and went and won it. They said you were not really a purple belt because you didn't train with you remember that time period right when they were really critical of the note it's not like that's much anymore but i'm sure i'm sure he got a bunch of uh crap for that i'm sure oh yeah they did but he was a black belt under john jock machado like he was a black belt in the gi but there was uh there was a time where there was a ridiculous idea that the only way to learn jujitsu was with the gi it was so and eddie bravo had a great way of putting it.

He's like, if you wanted to get really good at racquetball and they told you to only play tennis, would that make any sense? Yeah, of course not. No, you'd want to play racquetball. Yeah, or to wrestle. Yeah. To wrestle, you got to wear a gi. Exactly.

No, and it made zero sense, but people were adamant about it. But it's like one of those things where people who did the gi were so good at it and they were so technical and it there were so many grips and so many things that they could do with the gi that they couldn't do with no gi and they would get frustrated because they would roll no gi so they would say no you want to learn real jiu-jitsu you got to put the gi on so they'd make people with the gi it's like i would talk to mma fighters and i'd go uh you know how's training oh you know it's been great you know my coach is really making me work hard with the gi I'm like why yeah I encourage MMA fighters not to because it's uh you can do it occasionally but it's not really going to add to your game in

my opinion it's totally unrealistic if I was just doing jiu-jitsu I'd say do both if you have an opportunity but for MMA that's why I never did I was always I wanted to fight right away I was trying to learn jiu-jitsu for fighting, not some stuff where I'm upside down or someone could elbow me in the face or that weird jujitsu game. Oh, there's some weird jujitsu games out there now. There's like so many elaborate and exotic techniques that guys, like I have so many saved on that I find on Instagram and I save them to go back and watch. I'm like, what is he doing?

And then I go back and watch some just like exotic calf slices and some fucking weird way to take the back and like whoa Yeah, it's unreal how technical it is right now, but thanks, but for a self-defense. I think it's gotten pulled away from that Yeah, well yeah, there's so much of it that will work in competition for sure, but You mean you're not gonna do the fucking that kind of roll on the street like this is nonsense but then again there's certain things that you would never do on the street but you can't like you can't deny

the effectiveness of an Imanari roll to inside control and a heel hook right oh yeah you can't deny that you see guys do it it's awesome when it happens Gary Tony can hit him that Ryan Hall these type of guys so it. It's awesome when it happens. Gary Toney can hit him, that Ryan Hall, these type of guys. So many guys. There's so many guys.

There's so many elite level Imanari roll guys now. I see guys doing MMA. Oh, yeah, you see it. But for me, I can't really roll. My neck's too messed up. I can't do that rolling stuff. Oh, really? Is your neck fucked up from jiu-jitsu?

Yeah. It's not like in pain all the time, but it's just so stiff. I can't. If I go roll my head really? Is your neck fucked up from jiu-jitsu? Yeah. It's not like in pain all the time, but it's just so stiff. I can't. If I go roll my head, it's like, ah, it hurts. Have you ever used one of those iron necks? No. You never have? No.

Really? What's that do? Oh, my God. It strengthens your neck, and it gives you great range of motion. I'll give one. Okay. Perfect. They gave me a stack of them to give to people, because I always bring it up to people.

Like, fuck, I forgot what to give one to Mike Tyson. Well, yeah, I definitely want to try one. Yeah, it's my favorite neck training tool of all time for sure. It's the best. Yeah, because in fighting and wrestling, you get a lot of abuse on your neck. Yeah, well, what it does is it allows you to strengthen your neck but use like full rotation but not bending, not like that kind of shit which is fine if you don't do it wrong but that's what it looks like you put that thing on your head

and uh the thing the way it spins left and right there's resistance in it so you can tighten or loosen it depending upon whether or not you want to increase or decrease the resistance and so you're doing that and that's this this guy's got it attached to a cable machine, and I do it that way as well. But most of the time I do it, I attach it to a bungee cord. This is like a 50-pound bungee cord. And so I back it until it's like at full resistance with the bungee cord, and then I do my rotations, and then I'll do,

they call it the Stevie Wonder. You do like this. Ebony and ivory. know like the neck yeah man i'll definitely do it yeah you'll love it and then this one the extension and retraction it's a great move i mean it's a great uh piece of equipment it's just um it's hard to strengthen the neck and that's in my opinion yeah it's hard when you lift weights to use it on anything for your neck it's a hard thing to work but it's one of the most important you know for fighting it's one of the most important things you use did you ever get bulging discs on anything for your neck it's a hard thing to work but it's one of the most important you know for fighting it's one of the most important things you use did you ever

get bulging discs or anything in the neck i think i have a couple bulging discs my neck i got um x-ray like i don't know probably 15 years ago and the doctor's just like oh you need to find a new career you're not gonna you could never fight again and i wasn't too happy i walked out of the office and i was tempted like later to send them world winning world title fights but maybe you need to reconsider a new career i remember you and I talking about this backstage because you had hurt your back and they basically just told you to quit yeah and you know that last couple years my fighting I did have a lot of lower back injuries but I was able to I was able to fix that actually by doing really light deadlifts I was always scared to deadlift I threw it out dead

lifting but a guy talked me into I mean I literally would start with like 15 pounds on there. Now I still only usually put like 135 and just do reps of 20, and I haven't had no back problems since. Well, that is a big issue with people's backs is just that they don't strengthen it enough, and they don't strengthen it correctly and safely. Yeah, I'm a huge believer now. I tell everyone with back problems, like, hey, try the light deadlifts.

Obviously, different injuries are different. I can't say 100%, but I've had multiple people try it. Like, wow, my back's better now. That's awesome. Within a couple weeks a lot of times too. Well, you know, you've got to think all that muscle around. Like when you think about a deadlift, just the actual act of it, it's one of the best exercises ever for full body strength, right?

And if you do it with a light weight, it makes sense that it would strengthen all that core stabilizing muscles, all the muscles attached to your lower back. What happens, a lot of guys try deadlifting with extremely heavy weight and they throw their backs out. So they get scared to do deadlifts. You have to learn that, really learn the technique and form before you go heavy. Yeah. But even, you know, Robert Oberst, you know who he is? No. He's a giant, strong man dude. I mean, he's one of the immense guys whose head is as big as his table.

He's just a fucking complete gorilla. And he discourages people from doing deadlifts. He's like, you shouldn't do it. They're going to fuck you back up. Yeah, I think you can do it if you do it light with proper form. And that's probably why he discourages people because they probably put a ton of weight on and just try ripping it up. Yeah, I do them. I don't do them with heavy weights though and a lot of times i'm doing them with kettlebells a lot of times i'm doing it like

270 pound kettlebells so it's not much weight and i don't you know i just do them for reps and yeah i think that's that's the way to do it yeah i do dead uh straight leg deadlifts too for hamstrings and but i think people like ignore strengthening the back just the the actual back because it's not like a sexy thing to do to do like low back yeah especially low back yeah upper back but the low back no one's like oh i get my lower lower back ripped did you ever use the reverse hyper that thing was great fucking thing but hardly anyone has that money like buy one from my house because like hardly we have one right here yeah i have one here i got it uh from rogue rogue sells it yeah those are amazing but hardly any gyms have them it's so important man

on a gym right over here has one too but it's um having a reverse hyper machine in the gym should be standard every good solid gym should have one. Just for back maintenance and strengthening your core and active decompression. Yeah, every single gym. All the 24 hours, they all should have them. It's unreal to me. Because that's like the most important thing for fixing your low back. It really is. And that's all Louie Simmons.

Shout out to the great and powerful Louie Simmons. Rest in peace. He died? Yeah, he just died recently. What? I didn't know. How long ago? Three weeks ago? He was one of those guys, one of the rare guys that we traveled to go do

a podcast with him. I was like, I need to do a podcast with Louie Simmons. He's the mac daddy of strength training. I was just out with Marcus from Strong Style. You know who that is? He's a steep-based trainer and stuff. That's what he uses a Daddy of strength training. Yeah, I was just out with Marcus from Strong Style. You know who that is? He's a steep-based trainer and stuff, and that's what he uses a lot of his system. And he's like, oh, yeah, next time you're out here, I'll drive you down to his gym,

and we can meet him and stuff. I'm like, oh, that'll be dope. It's terrible to hear this. I never met the guy, but that's just still so sad. Yeah, he was in Columbus. Yeah. We were down there for a show, and I was like, dude, we got to meet Louie. He was just such a character.

He told me that after shoulder surgery, he had his shoulder replaced, and he went to the gym, and they made him max out with bench. I was like, what are you talking about? Why would you do that? He's like, they fucking made me. He's like, what do you mean they made you? You just got your shoulder repaired. Yeah, some trainers are completely clueless.

Well, these guys are all juiced to the tits, too. They're out of their fucking minds. They're all just complete savages just going for numbers. Yeah, you just go to powerlifting gym. Just look at his body. Yeah, that's how I was at a powerlifting gym. That's how they all look. Just juiced out of their minds. Yeah, and also both of his

biceps were gone. Both of his biceps had detached. And he just was all about powerlifting and all about innovation. He was always innovating with new exercise. Yeah, his methods definitely make you strong. You can't deny that. Oh, no denying? Healthy?

Probably not. I mean, he's an example of him dying. I think a lot of those guys die young. How old was he when he died? I think he was like 70. Was he 70 even? 67 maybe? I'm going to guess.

I'm going to guess 70. Jamie will find out. 75. Oh, wow. So, yeah, he's a little older than I thought. Pretty decent age to kick the bucket. Yeah, it's not too bad. I thought he was a lot younger for some reason.

Bro, he's tearing his body apart like most of his life. He has no biceps. His biceps before he died, they weren't attached. Yeah, that's crazy. At that age, he was still lifting, right? Oh, he's an animal. He's an animal. I mean, we met him.

He was 70. Right? It was probably about five years ago. Yeah, that's when he was younger. That's what he looked like? Pretty sure. Dang. Unless it's somebody else.

Boy, that doesn't even look like him. They're all so jacked, it's hard to tell. I guess so. That's what he looked like. Wow. Yeah. Were you out at the Columbus Card, or are you only doing the pay-per-views now? I only do pay-per-views now.

Yeah. I just don't have the time. I only do North American pay-per-views. I don't have the fucking time. Yeah, the schedule. They do a fight like every week with your podcast and comedy. That would make no sense. There was one time a few years ago where I did 22 events a year.

When I was commentating on 22 events a year, it was crazy. But it was fucking with my comedy because I couldn't really do a lot of weekends on the road and do clubs

and stuff it was yeah I think you're doing the right thing but I'm glad you're still doing it you're like the

it's crazy you're the one like revolutionized commentary podcast like a top 10 comedian it's uh it's just luck

yeah right it is crazy because you're a smart dude but you're not like an Elon Musk and you've been successful in so many different fields it's amazing it's very bizarre but it's just luck. Yeah, right? It is crazy because you're a smart dude, but you're not like an Elon Musk and you've been successful in so many different fields. It's amazing. It's very bizarre. You have people eat pig dicks, though.

I did have that. I just got lucky that I found things that I enjoy doing that are a career. That's all it is. Yeah, I know. It's definitely partially luck. I mean, obviously, you're really good at what you do, but it's still luck. You're good at what you do, but there is luck involved for sure. Well, first of all, there's luck that there's those careers.

Because at any other era, right? Because imagine, from like 93 to today is a very small window of time. If I had been born in any other era, all of my jobs except being a stand-up comedian would be non-existent. Yeah, you'd have to be doing like a late-night talk show. But I would never. Imagine how terrible that would be. They would never give me one. I guarantee you they would never give me one.

Or you'd have to be like Stephen Colbert. I would never. Not only would I not do, I wouldn't be good at it, I wouldn't enjoy it, and then they would never give me that job because I'm not that guy. There's people that are good late-night talk show hosts. They're great at bringing in the band and all right We'll be right back. I'm not that guy. Yeah, that's those are like

schmoozy, you know fucking Different kind of guy say whatever they want. It's that it's that scene like Stephen Kohlberg's I just think he was funny and seen him now just like it's cringe. It's weird, right? Right like the Vax thing There's like oh my god. This is so hard to watch the vaccine song. Yeah, you saw, right? Right? Like the vax thing. You're just like, oh my God, this is so hard to watch. The vaccine songs. Yeah, you saw that, right? I was like, oh my God. That was strange. Like, I want to be in the meeting when they pitch that.

Like, here's the thing. We're going to go, da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. Vaccine. Right. Like, where's the joke? I'd be like, where's the joke? Are people going to watch this? Yeah, you wonder, is a guy happy like that doing a job?

Or is he just like the money? It's definitely, I guess people get so attached to being famous and getting money, they'll do whatever it takes. I bet it's for sure very lucrative. He gets a lot of money. I bet he enjoys being the star of a show. He enjoys being

on the in. He's in on the in crowd. He can hang out with Obama probably, and Hillary, and all these important people. Have you ever seen the video of him dancing with Chuck Schumer and high-fiving each other? Thank God I have not. Oh, you need to.

You need to see it right now. All right, let's pull that up. There's a video. They're at some sort of party, probably where they're giving everybody Satan snake venom blood and the market's a beast. I just want to go on the record

and say that that's definitely true. It was the reason why they made that In the Water documentary. And Q2. Yes, the QAnon people. But there's this video of Colbert dancing with Chuck Schumer, and they high-five each other. And it's so strange. I think Schumer's even wearing a mask.

Look at him dancing. Give me some volume so I could hear what the fuck Look at this watch this But they're high-fiving And Schumer's dancing outside with a mask on like this is gonna go down in history like this time Where look at all these people outside with masks on. This is like a mask psychosis. But meanwhile, Colbert doesn't have a mask on, which is very odd. Some people are exempt.

He's a risk taker. Look at him. He's a wild man. But he high fives the guy. Yeah, this is just humiliating. Like, what is that? He can't enjoy doing this, I wouldn't think. Well, he might.

Yeah, I guess you never know, right? Like, people are different, man. Yeah, the whole outdoor mask thing was just odd. When I was in San Francisco, I'd be the only person, like Golden Gate Park, walking my dog without a mask. And people would be looking at me like I'm a freak, walking around, turning their backs on me, yelling at me. But I'm like, I'm not going to put a mask on outside.

Dude, I have friends that would yell at people to put masks on. I'm like, bro, what are you doing? Why are you upset at this person? Do you even pay attention attention they say you should wear a mask like no who are they yeah they who the fuck are they do you know those people who say you should wear a mask used to say you shouldn't wear a mask and now again say you don't need to wear a mask yeah no it makes no sense there's been not a single single scientific study showing the help well first of all if you're gonna wear a mask, those N95 masks are the only masks you should wear.

They explain that. What did Osterholm explain to us? There's some sort of a magnetical, what is it? Electromagnetic charge. Electrostatic charge. In the cloth that actually does protect you somewhat. So if you're going to wear a mask, a well-fitted N95 mask is the only kind of mask to wear.

But even then, you shouldn't be wearing it outside. Yeah. And even then, it's 2022, okay? Exactly. We get it now. Everybody was in a frothy panic. Yeah. We're all right.

There was like a two-week period where I got N95 and wore it, like, well, only indoors. Then I'm like, hey, this is ridiculous. I'm just going to, this is ridiculous. I'm just going to walk around maskless and get yelled at all the time instead. It's a weird time for kids, man. They're talking about children's development and the children who grew up during this. There's a large uptick in speech therapists where speech therapists are having to treat kids where, you know, young kids just.

Well, imagine kids trying to look through the mask and figure out what you're saying. That's got to be so difficult. I have a hard time. If someone's wearing a mask, I have a hard time making any kind of a personal relationship with them too. I try to and try to like be empathetic, but it's just so hard for me to communicate something with a mask. I use the facial cues too much. It's brutal when you're trying to talk to someone in a crowded restaurant or something like that, or in someone's talking to you and you really trying to talk to someone in a crowded restaurant or something like that and someone's talking to you and you really have to struggle to listen to what they're saying. Because they're talking like a normal way.

And you're like, I don't know what the fuck you're saying. I'm trying to get through this with you. Yeah, it's tough. The funny one, they have the mask and they pull it down when they talk to you. Doesn't that kind of... Okay, you just killed me. You just killed me. You pulled the mask down. Now we're both dead. It's a weird Doesn't that kind of... Okay, you just killed me. You just killed me. You pulled the mask down. Now we're both dead. This is...

It's just... It's a weird time. But one of the things we were talking about before the podcast, it's so true, is the difference between different kinds of communities, the way they handled it, and the community of fighters and jiu-jitsu people. Nobody gave a fuck.

Yeah, I was so fortunate to be in the best possible community because all my friends... I mean, some of the guys stopped training for a couple weeks, but they were right back at it and just kind of, we're going to get it. Yeah. I guess if you fight people in a cage, you're not really going to be that scared of catching COVID. Right. And you just found out today that you had had it at one time. I'm a survivor.

I didn't know I had COVID, but just found out I'm a COVID survivor. Now you can get some sympathy. Yeah. Found out I'm a COVID survivor. Now you can get some sympathy. Yeah. No one knew. There's a lot of people that got it that didn't know until they get those antibody tests.

Yeah. It was like I had a light. I hardly ever get sick. I had a light cold like once. Stayed home for a couple of days and I was fine. But I guess that must have been COVID. Well, do you take any supplements or is your diet just sufficient enough to? I think my diet.

I mean, I probably should, but I think my diet and just working out, low stress living, you know, not having a boss, you know, do what I want, I think makes me healthy. That's interesting. Not having a boss. I mean, don't you feel a lot healthier because of that? I guess. I haven't had a boss in a long time. Yeah. I guess I still have a boss in the UFC, but.

But like kind of. Sort of. I mean, but you can kind of do what you want. You're kind of exempt. Well, they're pretty easy with me. Anyway, they've always been pretty easy with me. But that's the one place where I still have a boss. Yeah.

You're such a big part of the UFC, they wouldn't want to lose you. I think it would be terrible if they did. I'm not trying to fuck anything up. I mean, I'm trying to do my best. Yeah, that's interesting, though, that having a boss and having like that kind of stress hanging over your head, that isn't, especially your boss is a dickhead. Yeah. I couldn't imagine that. Yeah. But you take it for granted. Like, I mean, having no boss probably like over 20 years, you're probably the same, I would assume. Yeah. It's been a long time. Well, no fear factor. I had a boss then.

That was probably one of the not one of the best shows you did in your opinion or no do you have a nice way of wording that it was a very good show

for me financially yeah it blew you up yeah well it gave me fuck you money you know that was the big part of doing a show like Fear Factor so that I didn't have to think

at all about money anymore yeah and I didn't it made me relaxed in a way that no other show nothing Fear Factor so that I didn't have to think at all about money anymore. Yeah. And I didn't. It made me relaxed in a way that no other show, nothing. So that allowed me to do so many other things, including the podcast, because I started the podcast right after Fear Factor. Yeah. So that was great.

And I remember when you first started cage commentating, like you were a big name. So we were excited, like, oh, Rogan's coming and doing this. It'll help legitimize the sport. So that was probably because from Fear factor right that was actually news radio news radio yeah news radio was when i was doing backstage interviews i guess it was fear factor when i was doing commentary that's what really blew you up right like news radio to the mainstream well i mean fear factor yeah the mainstream people yeah that was the big one yeah nobody knew who i was when i was on news news. I was just a random actor on a –

Yeah, never watched that. One of eight people on a show. Was that worth going back and watching or no? It was a fun show. It was a good show. But there's better shows. I'll try to watch a couple episodes, see if I can get into it. You can see me as a young, cute boy.

Backing, like, oh, look how young I was. So weird, right? It's very strange. And hearing my voice, my voice was different then because my nose was fucked back then. And I also still had a little bit of an accent, still had a little bit of my Boston accent that I hadn't shook off yet. The Boston. Yeah. There's like a-

That's where you grew up? Yeah, sort of. I grew up everywhere. There's cold, angry people in Boston. Oh, they're so angry. Yeah, mean women too. Yeah, right. I was there a couple times.

Everyone's just angry, yelling at everyone. It's freezing. You're like, what is this place? And then you're like, Boston sucks. They get all mad at you. It's the best city in the world. It's the best. I can't wait to go back. Yeah, the people that love it there love it there. But the people that, like, I didn't even know girls were

nice until I moved. I thought they were just going to be mean. They're pretty and mean. You just got to deal with them. Yeah, why isn I thought they were just going to be mean. Like, they were pretty and mean. I just got to deal with them. Yeah, why isn't she yelling at me? Something's wrong. Yelling at you and telling you what to do, and you better fucking call me. Yeah, the guys that stay in those relationships always crack me up.

Well, if that's all you know, you know. I didn't know girls were nice until I moved to California. Yeah. Moved to California. I'm like, you guys are so nice. Like, everyone's so nice. You know?

Like, I don't like, you know, some fighters, like in some, you know, some MMA guys and jiu-jitsu guys, they like,

like, aggressive women who yell at them. They like that. They like those bossy women. Some guys like it. Yeah, no, 100% true. I have some friends like that. They like those bossy women. Some guys like it. Yeah, 100% true. I have some friends like that. I'm the exact opposite. I don't want some girl yelling at me,

bossing me around. I don't like that from my friends. I don't like that from girlfriends. I don't like that from anybody. I don't like anybody in my life that's a control freak that likes bossing me around, telling me what to do. Yeah, my relationship in life is that. No one like that. Cut those people out out it's weird how many guys like that though isn't it i don't think they like it i think sometimes they get just like suckered into

they don't know how to say no they start they start letting the girl boss them around slowly you see them suck their life out of them yeah it fucking happens though like that's the will smith jada pickett smith thing that's what that Yeah, I didn't really know anything about that until the slap, and I started looking that up. You're like, ooh, this is bad. Did you see the video she posted? Yeah. And she posted that, so she thought that would make her look good.

Right. Well, she's annoying the shit out of him. And he's like, hey, this is my social media. That's my bread and butter. She's like, turns the video on herself. Yeah, can you imagine your wife showing up in your house and starting to film you without your permission? Like, it just seems like so...

And put it online? That's like you're living with an enemy. Yeah, it just seems so unimaginable to me. It's so stupid. I can't imagine why he dealt with it as long as he did. You got to get him on the show. Uh-uh. No chance.

I think it'd be great. But it could be a little weird because then you'd have to have some awkward conversations. It would be real weird. I'm just not interested, man. I just – I'm not – I mean I don't – I like actors. Don't get me wrong. I think there's a lot of like really interesting actors like Robert Downey Jr. is very interesting. Ed Norton is very interesting.

There's a lot of very interesting guys that are actors that I would love to talk to, but that world is so fucked. It's so fucked. It's like the fact that they let, they didn't escort him out of there immediately and arrest him. The fact that they let him give

a fucking speech and win an award afterwards shows you how fucked that world is. There's not another industry in the world. Imagine the Nobel Prize. Imagine if there was a fucking guest comedian during the Nobel Prize. Or imagine, you know the White House press correspondence dinner? Have you ever seen that? Yeah.

Where Michelle Wolf did it once and she mocked Trump. Trump could have went and smacked her. Imagine. Imagine if somebody walked up and smacked her in the face. No, it's unreal. And Chris Rock, too, like a legendary comedian, one of the greatest of all time. And you're gonna slap him for a little, I thought harmless joke. Completely harmless.

Yeah, that was just, doesn't set a good precedent, you being a comedian. Great, not just harmless, but like, cute. I mean, he's talking about G.I. Jane, which is a movie where Demi Moore plays a really hot female Navy SEAL. It's not even an insult. Yeah.

It's not like they're making fun of a bad movie that, you know, everybody mocks. Yeah, it was harmless. And he was laughing. And then you see she kind of glanced at him and he runs over. And yeah, he's definitely in an abusive relationship. There's just some relationships that aren't good for you. Yeah. And sometimes you get stuck.

Yeah, you see guys that don't know how to get out, or girls. I'm sure it goes both ways. Oh, yeah, it for sure goes both ways. There's asshole men for sure. My mom was married to one. Yeah. There's just no getting away from it. There's assholes in this world, male and female.

I like nice people. That's no getting away from it. There's assholes in this world, male and female. I like nice people. That's what I like. Yeah, people that aren't going to try to boss you around and completely run your life. I like people that want to be friendly. Yeah. That's one of the things I love about living in Texas. People are so much friendlier here. Yeah, so much.

It's weird. They come talk to you. My friend from New York was here visiting. What the fuck do they want? Why are they talking to me? I'm like, bro, no, it's how they are here. Yeah. It's called being nice. Yeah. I, when I lived in California, that was so rare. Well, California more, more common than New York. Yeah. In California, it got a lot weirder over the last five years. Wouldn't you say like LA and San Francisco at

least? Well, it definitely got really weird over the last two. But before that, I think, you know, there was a lot of weird shit that happened when Trump became president where people got super polarized. And there was so many people that got like really ramped up about politics and really ramped up about the kind of us versus them dynamic that I hate the most about politics, about parties, you know? Yeah. I know a hundred

percent. Cause you know, I'm an independent and I have a ton of friends that I think fighting brings more conservative, but I spent most of my life in San Francisco and New York. So I have a ton of liberal friends and you should be able to sit there and have discussions with them. And with all my friends, I can. But some people get all worked up. They'll start yelling at you. Those are like, it just makes no sense. Well, they want everybody to know that they're on the right side of things. And that's one of the reasons why they get ramped up.

And for me, it's like it was my liberal friends that would be yelling at the conservative friends. Like the liberal ones would be the ones who would be the most ramped up. Yeah, I know. The current liberals have turned really weird. And that's why I don't consider myself conservative friends. Like the liberal ones would be the ones who'd be the most ramped up. And it's like. Yeah, I know. The current liberals have turned really weird. And that's what, I don't consider myself conservative still, but these party,

they do things that I just can't associate with. How they'll just, they seem a lot more intolerant. Yeah. I lived in San Francisco from age seven to 11. And that was like a very formative time of my life. And I always consider myself liberal. My parents were hippies.

Yeah, same. My parents were hippies, so I always grew up since I'm a liberal but not anymore yeah I will it's like it's the dirt there's a difference between what liberal meant then and what it includes now it includes now like a lot of stuff that it didn't like it includes now people that want military action and includes now people that want censorship and includes now people that are Intolerant for other to other people's ideas and people that like think it's fine to insult people and to be like really Aggressive and shitty to people online and physically attack you. Yes. There's a lot of that. Yeah That's why I first started following politics and I was in Berkeley Antifa were there just like

Beating people up over that guy Milo speech. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, that's when I first started following politics when I was in Berkeley. Antifa were there just beating people up over that guy Milo's speech. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, that's also weird, right? It's like then the Antifa, those people got tolerated by people on the left, and they thought of them almost as like they're the thug branch of the left. Like they're going to go clean up all this bullshit with and because people were so upset that trump was president they kind of tolerated a lot of this and i don't think they

would have tolerated in a more rational sane time yeah no i had friends that were sticking up for antifa and that definitely bothered me i mean i wasn't gonna start yelling at them but i was trying to explain these people aren't the good guys i've been at places where they're physically attacking people and had to fight them they attacked me called me a Nazi, but then I beat a couple of them up, and they're like, oh, never mind. They attacked you? For what? Oh, yeah, because some guy was getting beat up in Berkeley, so I pulled the people off him, and then they started swinging on me.

Oh, no. And I dropped one, and all of a sudden someone's like, oh, wait, he's not a Nazi. Oh, he can fight. He's not a Nazi. He's a professional fighter. Yeah. Oh, my God. This whole punch a Nazi thing. I remember I got a conversation with someone like that, like, what's wrong with punching Nazis?

I go, who gets to decide who the Nazi is? Yeah. If you're talking about Hitler, yeah, go punch Hitler. If you're talking about an actual Nazi, yes. But you're not talking about a Nazi. You're talking about someone who might vote for Trump, okay? Like, maybe they're just misinformed. Maybe they have a wrong perspective, and maybe you can give them your perspective, and you

can enhance their perspective. But saying you're going to go punch them is not going to help anybody. Yeah, I know. It's because to them, a Nazi is a Trump supporter now. So it's unreal. I've been, like, a couple places to attack people. I went to my friend Mike Cernovich, had, like, a speaking thing in New York. Some guy got put in the hospital, attacked by Antifa trying to come in.

Jesus Christ. Well, that was the whole thing with the Proud Boys. That was the original idea of the Proud Boys. It was kind of a joke. And then once he got a bunch of guys to join up, he was talking about it on my podcast, and he was saying we're going to go out and punch these antifa people i was like this this doesn't sound like a good idea whenever you have like a gang you're creating

a gang to go fight this other gang like i get the idea that this antifa thing is a problem but the solution i mean what is the solution law enforcement like what intolerance by law enforcement right like law enforcement that can't be tolerant of it, rather. And they are, yeah. Because actually, when Berkeley, after I saved that guy, I pushed him into like, um, to a business. They were gonna knock the business windows out, but they're like, oh, it's minority owned. Don't bust it. Like that makes a difference. So a bunch of Middle Eastern guys saved them. So then I run out, grab the police, try to get, they're still beating other people up to get help. And the cops are just like, oh, we can't go in there. Oh, Jesus Christ. I was in shock.

That's when I'm like, what? Yeah, cops can't do a lot if they're not funded. That's the thing, too, right? All this defund the police thing. That was one of the weird things about lefties is that all of a sudden they wanted to defund the police. I was like, what are you talking about? Yeah, now look at the crime places like San Francisco. It's crazy. You're just getting robbed everywhere.

I have friends getting robbed, cars stolen, jacked with guns. It's unreal there now. It's unreal. It's not just unreal. People leaving the hatch of their car open and leaving their doors unlocked so that people don't smash their windows. People are smashing their windows so much that people are just leaving their doors open. Yeah.

Their windows down in cars. It's just signs everywhere. Please don't smash out my window. Yeah. I'm a single mom. I work two jobs. Please don't steal. And then they'll Please don't smash out my window. Yeah. I'm a single mom. I work two jobs. Please don't steal. And then they'll still knock the window out.

I saw a guy. There was a video of this guy walking through Brooklyn and he had a crowbar and he's just smashing windows. Just walking, smashing windows of people's cars. Yeah. Just randomly. That used to be so rare. If that happened, it was like, what happened?

Some fucking insane person at a crowbar and he walked down the street smashing windows. Now I see it and I'm like, that kind of fits. Yeah, because they know there's no repercussions. Exactly. In San Francisco, the DA will let you out right away. Well, New York too and also L.A. L.A. has got a real problem with that my friend who's a cop in LA was explaining this to me how much the um how much the uh homicides have gone up and how many he sees

you know he was just describing it just the other day all these different people that he saw get shot yeah no the defund was defund the police push by black lives matter it's mostly black people getting shot more now so it's been a complete done the opposite of what they wanted. It was that, but it was also a lot of white liberals. It was a cute thing to say. It wouldn't say defund the police. I'm not saying black people push it. I'm saying that's what it caused to happen.

Because the white liberals are mostly fine. Well, other than getting robbed in San Francisco. They get robbed in Beverly Hills too. Yeah, people getting robbed for their watches. Getting robbed, having brunch. They're robbed for their watches and getting robbed, having brunch. They're trying to sit outside and have brunch. Like you got to realize like those places don't have any security. There's a crazy video that, uh, Coleon Noir, do you know who he is? He's a, he's a lawyer. Who's also a second amendment advocate and a, like a really good one. Oh, I think I may have seen a few minutes of him

on your show. Yeah, he's been on my show a couple times. Very, very good guy to talk to about all things gun-related and all things like problem and crime-related, because he's very rational about it, and he's a lawyer. He sent this video, he put up this video of these gang members who are leaving LA because it's too dangerous.

Too dangerous for the gang members, wow. And I was like, what? And I sent this to a bunch of friends because the guy who was a former gang member who was a very well-respected guy in that community was talking about how he's got to get the fuck out of L.A. because all these people are going to get let out of jail. And as bad as it is now, he goes, it's bad now,

but it's going to get worse. He's like, I'm getting the fuck out of here. Yeah, they're letting people out of jail that don get let out of jail. And as bad as it is now, he goes, like, it's bad now, but it's going to get worse. He's like, I'm getting the fuck out of here. Yeah, they're letting people out of jail that don't belong out of jail. Like I saw yesterday, a guy shot 10 people in, I think it was South Carolina, out in a $25,000 bail. Yeah. Yet Cain Velasquez is sitting in jail with no bail. Now, how is that possible?

How come they don't let him out? I don't get it. Yeah, no, I think maybe he should have charges and have to, you know, deal with it, but he should be out on bail There's no reason why doesn't have a bail. Well, he's he's not out but the guy who raped his child is out Disgusting which is insane. That's insane. Yeah, right that you can let that guy out Because of which would this insanely horrific act that he did Yeah, and then this other guy who responds like if you look I'm not just act that he did. Yeah. And then this other guy who responds like,

if you, look, I'm not justifying what he did. I'm not saying he should be shooting guns randomly, you know, driving down the street trying to shoot out the window at this guy. But everybody, if you're a father. Yeah, I'm a father. I'm a father. I have a daughter, so I get it, yeah.

All of us would say, that's what I would do. Everybody would say, I'd fucking kill him. And Kane actually went out and tried to do it. Yeah, he did what we say we would do. Yeah. I don't know if I actually would or not, but what I would do. Everybody would say I'd fucking kill him. And Cain actually went out and tried to do it. He did what we say we would do. I don't know if I actually would or not, but we all say it. Could you imagine Cain Velasquez chasing you? Oh, my God. Oh, my God.

That's the only thing that I said. I wish he just pulled him out of the car and beat him to death. If anyone in the whole world chased me, Cain would probably be the last guy I would want. He's just like a scary dude. Scary dude. And doesn't get tired either. Yeah. You know? Doesn't get tired either. Yeah. You know?

Doesn't get tired, yeah. There's guys that I put in that category of like greatest in the division of all time. You know, there's like GSP is a welterweight. Usman is a welterweight. But when you get to heavyweight, man, primetime Kane. Primetime Kane was a motherfucker. I think he might have been the greatest. My only problem was he didn't hold it long enough.

So it's hard to give someone that when you don't hold it for a longer period of time. Didn't hold it long enough and he never fought Fedor. That would have been the fight. Imagine those two in their prime. Oh, that would have been. We almost had it. We almost had it.

The Russians were in negotiation with the UFC. You know, the guys who were managing Fedor. I saw them. They were at a UFC once, and they had conversations with them, and they were trying to make it happen. Damn, that would be amazing. Maybe I didn't see it.

Maybe that's a fake memory. Bellator can do it now after he gets out of jail. A little late, but I'll still watch it. I said I saw him at the UFC, and now I'm going over it in my head. I'm like, I think I might have made that up so long ago. I might have false memories about it. Isn't that weird how that can happen?

It can happen, especially with that. I mean, there's so many events. It's so hard. But those guys that owned Fedor's contract, fuck, man. If they had just made that fucking fight, if they had just brought him over, but they wanted a ton of money and they wanted to be part of the promotion. They knew that Fedor was a legitimate superstar. part of the promotion it's like they knew that Fedor was a legitimate superstar and so they like in terms of like maximizing his amount of money that he can make they they were you know it was

there in their best interest but they were trying to maximize the money and then so then they took him over to Strikeforce and then Verdum got him. Who's another guy that if you want to talk about greatest heavyweights of all time, in my opinion, Fabrizio Verdum has to be in the conversation. Yeah. Has to be. Yeah, he's great too. He submitted everybody. He submitted Fedor, Kane, and Noguera.

Yeah. Come on, son. No, he's definitely one of the greatest. And if you were on top with him, you're in deep shit. You're in deep shit. He's one of the rare guys that if he catches you in a triangle, man, you're fucked. Fabrizio Verdum had a triangle. Oh, my God.

His arm bars, everything off his back. Like when he caught Fedor. Yeah. Caught Fedor with a triangle off his back. And everybody's like, oh. It was just shocked, yeah. Oh. Same thing when he caught Fedor. Yeah. He caught Fedor with a triangle off his back, and everybody was like, oh. It was just shocked, yeah. Oh. Same thing when he beat Kane.

I was live at that one. It was just like shocked watching Kane start to gas. That was a bad one, because Kane really should have been up there way earlier. Yep. We're doing what's smart. Mexico City's extremely high elevation, what, 6,000 feet or something? Plus. When I got there, I went for a run.

I was like dying. Well, not only that, the air quality is really rugged. Like that air quality is rough. I took photos when we were landing. I was looking out the windows and oh my God, look at the fucking smog. Yeah. It's so much worse than LA. Like it's fucking bad there.

At least the days that I was there. And then you have the altitude. You know, Cain went out there like two weeks before, which is not enough. You need like a month. Fabrizio was up there for months. Yeah, it takes a while to adjust. You got to really acclimate.

Like I can't imagine. They say you should do one of two things. Either you should not go there until right before or you should be up there for a long time. But those are the only two. But going there two weeks out actually might fuck you up. Really? That's interesting.

Yeah, it actually might slow you down because your body's like, what the fuck? So your body, you're going through all your training, you're not recovering. Like, it takes a while for your body to get into this high altitude cycle. I was in Boulder once, and our waiter was an endurance athlete, and he told me he had moved to Boulder just so he could train at altitude. He goes, well, it's also beautiful here, but I'm an athlete. And so we were talking to him, and he does bike races. And I was saying, like, how long does it take your body to really acclimate?

He goes, really acclimate? Four years. Jesus. And I was like, what? And he goes, yeah. He goes, it takes a long fucking time to get used to there being no oxygen. And so there's short-term benefits.

But to get the full benefit, he was like, years. I don't know if he's right. Will they hold that for years, probably, too? Or you don't really know? I don't know. I don't think so. I don't think you hold it very long. That's the scary thing. I think when you train at altitude and you come back down to sea level for a couple weeks, I think it all goes away.

Yeah, that's what sucks. See if like Google, how long does it take to maximize the benefits of training at altitude? How many years? Google that. How many years does it take to maximize the benefits of training at altitude? Because I always wanted to look this up because that's one of those things where someone says it to you, you just take it as gospel. Yeah, exactly.

You just believe it without looking it up he was a serious dude though he was like he was a serious like he was serious about all aspects of his training like he was telling us about his recovery how he does this and how he does that and i mean he was like a fucking gung-ho endurance athlete that's a different kind of person man yeah i don't know who would want to do that like those hundred mile runs like yeah oh that's my buddy cam and well my two friends David Goggins too he's an animal he just keeps doing yeah David Goggins did him on destroyed knees to 100 mile ones or a hundred miles well I think Goggins might have done like 20 hundred

miles in a month or something I feel like you got have something wrong with you to do that oh he's got something wrong with him. Or our friend John Joseph, he does all those kind of runs too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He does a lot of those Ironmans. But yeah, Goggins is a lot wrong with him, but it's all right. It's wrong, but it's right. It's not that there's anything wrong. It's just that if you want to compare him to a regular person,

he doesn't give a fuck about pain. he doesn't give a fuck about pain. He doesn't give a fuck about tired. He lives and dies in his own mind. And when he thinks that someone doubts him or that you don't understand how strong he can be, you don't understand how strong his mind can be, if you want to get in a race to the death with that guy. Yeah, I'll pass on that one. Because that's the kind of thing that a guy like Goggins would thrive in, a race to the death with that guy. Yeah, I'll pass on that one. That's the kind of thing that a guy like Goggins would thrive in.

Could you imagine? A race to the death. One of you guys gets murdered after whoever stops. No, you know what it would be? You run till you die. I would just give up right away. I'd be like, I chopped my head off. I'm going to lose this one.

That could be a thing. Like, you know, like they used to have duels. So if a duel was like two guys would agree, like I fucking, you annoy me so much, I'm going to get a gun. And we're going to back to back. We're going to walk 10 feet and shoot at each other. Fuck you. You're ready to die. Maybe you'll shoot me, but I'm going to fucking at least be able to shoot you like a man.

And we're going to go and do this. They agreed to do that. A hundred years ago, I think. Not that long ago. Not that long ago. Well, wasn't at least one of our presidents involved in something like that? I think so, but if I can't remember who or any deals behind it. One of our presidents was in a duel, right, while he was president.

Do you remember who it was? He killed Alexander Hamilton. Really? That was like the whole thing. But was he even president? Hold on. Wait. Hold on.

Alexander Hamilton died in a duel? Hamilton wasn't president. Remember? We talked about him the other day. There's the old drink milk commercial. It was like Aaron Burr. I can't say Aaron Burr. Huh?

There's an old milk commercial from the 90s. It was a guy on a radio call. If you answer this question, you win a million dollars. Right. Who killed Alexander Hamilton? They call it the Alexander Hamilton guy. He's got all this shit in his apartment. Oh. And his mouth is full of a peanut butter jelly He's got all the shit in his apartment. Oh.

And his mouth is full of a peanut butter jelly sandwich. You can't say Aaron Burr. Oh, that's right. That's right. I forgot about that commercial. But as I'm saying it out loud, I feel like he wasn't president. No, he wasn't. We talked about it the other day.

Remember someone brought up that. Who was it that brought that up? That he had gotten blackmailed. Andrew Jackson, maybe? Did he kill him? But he got. But Hamilton gotten blackmailed. Andrew Jackson, maybe? But he got, but Hamilton got blackmailed because he was banging this lady and her and her husband set him up. Remember? Right, right, right.

Yeah, because that's the play. Who talked to us about that? It was real recently. It was one of the recent guests. Who the fuck was it? Omar? Was it? Probably.

Might have been. Sounded like something he would talk about. How many of these, you do what, two or three podcasts a week? Sometimes four. Damn. Sometimes five on a crazy week. Dang, and how much do you do on comedy? This week, four.

Four nights a week. By the way, your show killed it when I was out the last time. Oh, thanks, brother. You, yeah, and all your openers. You had great guys, too. President Andrew Jackson, thank you, May 30th, 1806, future President Andrew Jackson kills a man

who accused him of cheating on a horse race bet and then insulted his wife, Rachel. Wow. I think he had a lot of duels. Oh, he had a lot of duels. Yeah, a few duels, no big deal. More than 100. What? Can you imagine Biden or Trump doing a duel?

What? Not every duel ended in someone dying. Click on that. Of course not. They had terrible guns. Their guns were terrible. 100 duel. That's just insane. That's insane. He was a savage.

I think he even had one where he got shot and survived the shooting to end up shooting that guy back. Whoa! And look at our presidents now. We had guys like that and Teddy Roosevelt. And now what? Did you see the video today of Biden? He starts talking about Afghanistan and Pakistan and an Easter bunny comes and takes him away.

I'm looking that up after the show. I'll show it to you during the show. It's just the funny part of people that can't admit something's wrong with them. Look at this. Hold on. Go right there. Jackson didn't settle a score in 140 characters or less. He challenged his foes to duels, more than 100 of them. One opponent even died, so he only killed one guy.

But that was a guy who insulted his wife. However, for the most part, people would stand and fire their gun in the air, purposefully miss their opponent, making the duel more about a test of courage when one's honor was at stake or their reputation was threatened. Oh, that's interesting. If you back down, then you're a giant pussy. But you don't shoot at each other.

Like, you make a deal. I barely miss. I'm not going to shoot you. Maybe that's what you were hoping. Yeah, that's a fucking... That's quite a risk to take. That's a big risk. Hope Joe doesn't shoot me in our duel.

Yeah, I insulted Rachel. What does it say there again? Scroll up. It says, not every time Jackson lost his cool with a gun in his hand is documented, but here are four that helped give him his reputation as a rage-filled lunatic and a few that left his body rattling like a bag of marbles. Oh, so he had like, that was the thing. If you got shot back then, the velocity

of those little muskets, that is not like getting shot today. I don't think those things are going that fast. You're probably less likely to die. You might be able to catch one. And this is the guy they selected as president. Things have always been crazy, apparently. Yeah, that's a wild

dude. With his pistols. But back then, I feel like gunfights were probably pretty normal, you know? Yeah, someone insults you, go shoot it out. And maybe they will become again. So when did it stop? When they stopped, yeah. Probably like in the 1900s, early 1900s, maybe World War I brought everybody together. But if you think of the United States and you go to the 1800s, what do you think of?

You think of Wild West, think of gunfights. If you think of New York City, you think of the United States and you go to the 1800s what do you think of you think of Wild West thing of gunfights if you think of New York City you think of gangs in New York right here's the one I would I've never reading about this he had gotten shot close to his heart and still had that wherewithal to within a few seconds Dixon fired Dickinson fired putting the first bullet into Jackson's chest next to his heart Jackson put his hand over the wound to staunch the flow of blood. Despite smoke and dust billowing from Jackson's coat and his hand touching his chest, Jackson remained standing, puzzling Dickinson. My God, have I missed him?

The duel's protocol required stated that, oh, protocol required stated that Dickinson to remain in place while Jackson aimed to take his shot. Jackson fired, but the flint hammer stopped half-cocked, not counting as a legitimate shot. Jackson aimed again, ever so carefully, and fired a second time. This time, the shot was good, and the bullet hit Dickinson in the chest, and he dropped to the ground. Reflecting on the duel, the doctor remarked to Jackson, I don't see how you stayed on your feet after that wound. To which Jackson responded, I would have stood up long enough

to kill him if he had put a bullet in my brain. Whoa. It's a hardcore man. That's a president right there. Yeah, right? Things sure have changed. He died later that night. Jackson was not prosecuted for murder,

and Dickinson would be the only man he ever killed in a duel, something that did not prevent him from becoming president in 1829. Wow. People might not have believed the story either, too. How that story maybe not got around. Right, there's no video. Yeah, it's hard. You've got to be accountable to duels today.

I already killed someone. Right. He had more than 100 duels. 100 kills. Yeah, 100 duels. Like, he might be an asshole. Right. Like, how many people is he arguing with

to the point where they're pulling guns out? That's a lot, 100. Right? I think maybe like two or three. Maybe it's them. If it's 100, it's probably you. But he... If he's famous,

he probably was getting challenged a lot too, you know? Right. People drunk at a bar. There's that Andrew Jackson. Yeah, with shitty booze too. Imagine how bad their whiskey tasted. Like, look, there's just a group of guys and they're like, fuck, I'll fucking fight them.

Yeah, they're probably so bored. They'll fight anybody back then. No TV, no internet. Everybody smelled. No soap. Everybody stunk everybody had their teeth were rotting

out their fucking heads oh my god can you imagine living back then everybody must have stunk yeah well things were so bad people would be like

hey let's just try like trucking across to the other part of the country we have no idea in a wagon we might get killed by Indians

bears yeah they would fly or rather sail in from across the ocean not even knowing what's out there yeah no idea probably gonna die but better than staying here that's the difference between people of then and people today people are scared to take a plane flight somewhere when you have absolute video of what's going on over there who the people are

back then man those are different that's a different kind of human that gets on a boat without it even a How do I know for sure no assurance? Yeah? How do I know it's good over there? We're going I'll draw you a picture I could just a completely different kind of world like when they first experienced their first winter in the Northeast They must have been like what the fuck did we do? Yeah. And why didn't they start walking down at that point? Right. Like why would they stay there? They just didn't know. They probably thought the whole continent was like that. Yeah. You know, I mean, if they, they landed in the Bahamas, that's probably when they got the word out. Like, listen, it never gets cold. It's nice. Yeah. Whoever had Florida was like, uh, what are you guys

talking about? It's cold. What? When? It's great over here. When they hit Florida, there's that book about Cabeza de Vaca. What is it? A Strange, Strange? What is it? A Place So Strange? Is that it? I think that's the name of the book, A Place So Strange. But it's about Cabeza de Vaca and the group that came with him that made it across through

Florida and into North America. It's like, what the fuck, man? Like, living back then was insane. Yeah, just wild. Insane. Some wild stuff to read is about the conquistadors when they first came in. I've read some of that.

It's just wild. It's not that long ago, man. Yeah, just so wild. It seems like a long-ass time ago, but, like, I had this bit in my act about when the Constitution, when the country was founded. I'm the found the country was founded in 1776 people live to be a hundred I'm like that's three people ago Jesus that's all

it is like that seems 1776 seems like a long time ago but I'm not even that's not even a trick of numbers it's not that long ago the amount of time, because it's 1542 is when Cabeza de Vaca came through. So, like, take 1776, reverse back the same amount of time from here, from now to 1776, and that was, like, the first person across North America, the Atlantic, to get over here. That's so wild. And now look at this country, like, just how crazy it is, how big, how massive, the massive cities. Yeah. How fast things change. Imagine if you could show that to someone who was a Native American tribal leader in 1820,

who was just conquering the plains, some Comanche tribal chief who had conquered this area. This was all Comanche territory. And you were going to tell them, bro, I got some bad news for you. This shit's about to get crazy. Unrecognizable. Imagine showing him what would... People that hadn't lost to the Europeans yet. The Europeans hadn't come over and given them diseases

and genocide and all that. That hadn't happened yet. Imagine going to one of those people and explaining to them what it's going to be like in 300 years. They would think you were crazy. Kind of like that snake blood in the virus. Yeah.

What the fuck are you talking about? Disney World's going to be here. Disney World. Right here. Right where you're standing. Right where you're standing. People dressed as a mouse. Yeah.

And then in the future, people are going to be mad at them because they're too woke. And their stock's going to go down. Yeah. And then in the future, people are going to be mad at them because they're too woke. And their stock's going to go down. Yeah. Like, stock. Yeah, what is that? Imagine trying to talk to a person in 1720 and telling them, 1720, dude, 300 years from

now, it is going to be fucking crazy. Yeah, it's wild. Think about it. It's only 300 years. 300 years. So where will it be in 300 years? Will it be that big of a change? Hopefully not. I think it's going to years. Where will it be in 300 years? Will it be that big of a change? Hopefully not.

I think it's going to be even bigger. I really do. Yeah. Elon will have those things in our brain. And a hundred percent. There's a funny meme. Somebody put up a funny meme of the difference between the way people look at Elon and people look at other people that propose terrible ideas.

How forward is this to Jamie? All ideas. How forward is this to Jamie? All right. How forward is this to Jamie? I made a screenshot. But it's just any other time when a person is, you know, saying like literally saying, I want to put a fucking chip in your brain. Look at this.

Bill Gates, let's make more vaccines. And then the people are like, no, you will put microchips in our bodies and track us. And then Elon Musk says, I will literally put a microchip in your brain. And the guy says, LMAO. Nice. It's definitely interesting because a lot of truth to that. A hundred percent. Me too, man.

Yeah. That's such a wild dude. I'm going to be in. I'm going to get such a wild dude. I'm going to be in. I'm going to get a Neuralink. I'm going to be the smartest person in my fucking house because they're all going to go second. I'm going to go first because they're all going to go, Dad, don't do it. I'm going to be like, shut up. I'm trying to get smart.

I'm going to be smarter than all of you. What if kids figure out how to hack their parents' Neuralinks? They will. They will. They'll control me. All of a sudden, I'll be telling them they can come home whenever they want. Jamie will be out of a job when you get your Neuralink. Why?

Because he'll be able to do it. Yeah, he'll be able to do it all himself. He's got to connect to my Neuralink. That's right. That's the only way it works. That's right. I'm lazy still. True.

I still need Jamie. I'm not going to be Googling things on the spot. I see dudes doing that. Some podcasts, like dudes have a laptop right in front of them. I'm like, how can you still talk? Yeah, they need to hire an assistant. It's a lot. It's a lot.

The problem is you're not, you're not like fully focused on talking while you're typing. You can't listen and type. It's, I believe me. I've tried. Yeah. It's impossible to be reading and listening at the same time.

You know what the worst is? If you're talking and someone's talking in your ear, that's impossible. Yeah. Oh yeah. I know what you mean. Literally impossible. It's, that is so hard, I know what you mean. Literally impossible. That is so hard.

Because if you're in the middle of talking and someone is talking at you at the same time, it's so hard to just ignore that sound. Yeah, it's not easy. I'm talking about earphones. If you're doing commentary and someone's talking while you're talking, it fucks you up.

Have you ever tried one of those apps where it recreates that? Where you try to tell someone something and you have headphones in and it charbles your speech? Oh, really? So you don't even know what you're saying? It's like this situation right now, but what you're hearing back in your headphones will be your words just messed up.

Oh, so you would hear an amplified version. Even though you're talking, the words are being blah. Oh, so you would hear like an amplified, even though you're talking, the words are being blah, blah, blah. Correct, yeah, yeah. And it plays back for you. I don't know how to talk anymore. Yeah, it's fucked up. Oh, wow.

What is that app called? I'll check it real quick. That sounds like- It's almost like a game, but- Yeah, it sounds like a fun exercise. We've got an app for everything. Literally, man. I mean, there's so many people that are thinking there's too much

already. And you know, we're on the precipice of something like a neural link. There's so many people that are like, I need a flip phone. So many people that are like, I need to disconnect in the metaverse. And the, yeah, it's weird. Uh, I hope, I hope never lived in the metaverse, but unfortunately it might be the future. We're going to, it's going to have to, you know, the thing about the metaverse is like, what if the metaverse existed and you could do jiu-jitsu pain-free? And go do cage fights again. Yeah. I mean, imagine, right, if, like, the problem with biological tissue is it gets damaged and it doesn't heal right,

and then your knees are fucked or your back's fucked or your brain's fucked. But if there was none of that, but all of the sensation mean yeah it'd be pretty cool yeah so i guess they'll probably there'll be some good things but overall it'll be weird it's gonna be weird like guys will just start dating girls in the metaverse oh yeah for sure you won't even know if it's a girl it'd be like some russian general he's pretending to be a girl and you're this is your girlfriend that's your girlfriend yeah and you you make love to each other She look at the metaverse. Yeah, so he looks hot in the metaverse, right? And then the people be like bigoted against like are you trans network?

Like you should like I don't I don't like to make out with people in the metaverse if in real life They're a straight man like fuck you. What's with you bigot yeah that there's our future that's our future people will find things to argue about for sure oh yeah 100 yeah i'm not looking forward to it yeah we'll probably be hiding out in montana trying to resist it i'm worried that what's going to happen is some people are going to control aspects of the metaverse the same way people control social media sites and enforce their own standards, especially when those standards are very biased towards one political party or one ideological. Which, yeah, like Twitter and Facebook and censorship. If that happens in the metaverse, what if that's how it is in the metaverse? What if they dictate very specific styles of life and the way you want to live? You can't live there.

You can't do it that way. They won't let you. They'll find you. They'll hunt you down. The same way they kick you off of YouTube, they'll hunt you down in the metaverse. It's not even real. Yeah. I never even thought about this, but you're probably right.

The same people that are doing that are the same ones running Facebook, Twitter, YouTube, other side of what you can talk about. They could literally be the masters of the world. If you're in control of an actual metaverse, so if they create a virtual reality that is amazing, maybe even more vivid than this reality that we're currently experiencing, but they have absolute control over it you you're they're dictators in this world they can do whatever they want to like yeah that's crazy wild turns like the matrix yes which we're not that far off i don't think it's far off at all i think it's going to sneak up on us the same way phones snuck up on us well internet When we were kids, there was no internet around. And now it's like everything. It snuck up on us. And I think this

virtual reality world that people are inevitably going to enter. Because what's going to happen is they're going to make a version that's simple and easy to use and it's going to be better than real life. That's all that needs to happen. Especially a lot of people that are not social, not that cool, don't have a lot

of friends. So it's different. Like, you know, you have your comedy clubs, your circle, you go out, you get treated great everywhere. A lot of people don't. Right. And they don't enjoy their lives and they don't, you know, they don't like what they look like. They don't like how they feel.

They don't like their past. Though all those things are fixable if the metaverse is real. Yeah. It's understandable. You could see why someone, you know, had things going tough there. They're not like that anymore. Yeah. It would be wild to, you could live other lives.

You could like decide that I'm going to be a sailor. I'm going to sail around the world in the metaverse. You don't have to leave anywhere. No, I'm kind of wanting the metaverse. I'm going to have to try this out. Right? I mean, if you had like, imagine if you can just plug yourself in and all of a sudden you are fucking scuba diving. Like all of a sudden. Like it feels like scuba diving, but you're still in Brooklyn.

You're still in your apartment. You're chilling in your apartment. But you have this, you know, fucking 86 terabyte video connection that's allowing you to, you know, the bandwidth is insanity and the processing power is insanity. It's indistinguishable from real life. And you can just plug into it. Yeah, I know. You can see why people would be intrigued. The problem is people aren't going to want to live the real life.

So what's that going to happen? People will probably stop dating, stop going out. Civilization could collapse. It really could. Because, you know, the real life is fine if you look like Nicky Rodriguez I'm sure that guy's living life fine Like six four chiseled jack jack perfect specimen that guy's life is great, right? Yeah, but some short fat guy Yeah, life isn't great. He's not Nicky Rodriguez, right?

Yeah Life isn't great. He's not Nicky Rodriguez. Right. Yeah. So it's like if you wanted to be that guy, and you could be that guy in The Matrix, or you could be Captain fucking Schlub in the real world where nobody likes you. I'll be Nicky Rodriguez. Fuck it. Sign me up. But that's what's going to be weird is when anybody can be Nick Rodriguez

or anybody can be The Rock or anybody can be you. Yeah. Anybody can be a Rock or anybody you know anybody Can be you yeah anybody can be A person that they Wish they were that's when Things are gonna get very strange because if they can Give you a lot if you can be Indiana Fucking Jones and you can literally Be in the Temple of Doom

Stealing the Crystal skull or whatever you could Be that guy like you could live that Like why would you go to regular life you would just do whatever you have to do to make money to live like that yeah i mean even like me my life sounds my life's great but that sounds interesting so it's uh so imagine someone who's not it's going to be exactly to leave it right we detailed how insanely interesting your life has been and now you're willing to give it all away and try. I'm ready to sign up for the metaphor. I wasn't until this conversation, but you sold me. Jake, I think it's

going to be impossible to avoid. I really do. And I don't think it's far away. I don't think it's far away at all. I think it may, it might be maybe 20 at the most, but I think within 20 years, I mean, look, dude, 20 years ago was 2002 we all had flip phones there was no iPhone it didn't even exist then and you know most of the time we didn't even text each other we called each other that was but it still we thought we were crazy we had an internet connection this is crazy I had a website this is crazy well I'm living in the future we didn't even know what the future was yeah we had no idea like, wait, I could just go meet random girls on here. The way that was set up and the way people like lived then, we didn't live like, boy, I can't wait until the internet is on my phone and high speed and,

and I can take 4k video and I can, you know, upload it to Snapchat. We didn't think like that because we didn't know that was a possibility. But now we do. And now we have social media addictions where people are like legitimately addicted to checking their likes on Instagram

and reading Facebook comments and writing things and going back and forth with each other and not even in the real world. Yeah. I had to put a timer on my phone with social media

so it would like shut down. That's good. Yeah, like I'm using this too much. I need to shut this down. What'd you give yourself? Like an hour. That's good. An hour's plenty. An hour's plenty.

An hour's plenty. If I'm at an airport or something, maybe I'll like break the rules, but other than that, I'm like, all right, I can't cheat this. Yeah, an hour's way too much, but you can go through that so quick. It's going to be so addictive, Jake.

Like bring my times up. What if that's in your head, and you can, oh, my flight is not for an hour. Let me go to the Bahamas and chill on the beach for 45 minutes and then come back. Like in your head. You can be on the beach drinking margaritas, feet up, listening to the seagulls. Yeah, why fly to Hawaii?

I got to take an eight and a half hour flight there on Thursday. I could just go there that way. Oh, me and the family went to Hawaii. Did you guys go to Hawaii? Well, not really. But we got the Hawaii program. We bought the app for it. We got the Hawaii program and it was not even half the price of going to Hawaii,

and it was so much better. We stayed at the Four Seasons. And everybody was nice. All it has to do is be better. They can make San Francisco nice again. Yeah, clean up all the poop. Imagine they find out that human shit actually fuels the Matrix. Like, boy, this is amazing.

So San Francisco would be a good place. You could just scoop up all the human shit. fuels the matrix like boy this is amazing so san francisco would be a good place you just scoop up all the human shit yes perfect the app that they had in san francisco that shows where all the bum poop is and most of us not even registered obviously it's like everywhere i mean you used to go there all the time it was a great city i loved it it was great so many good memories there and then then just to watch it decay, it's like, what happened to this place? It happened so fast too, man. Yeah. It just shows you how you don't want to run a city.

Yeah. It happened from 2016 on. Yeah. It was slowly declining a little before that. But I think after 2016, it really started dropping. It just, everyone was so tolerant. It's so tolerant. The thing that did them in was the thing that made them awesome.

Like one of the things that made San Francisco awesome was how tolerant everybody is and open-minded everyone is. It's a very progressive liberal city, which is great until you add bums. Yeah. Well, I think also the fentanyl came in, which is stronger than heroin. And then the meth. I think a lot of them are doing meth instead of crack, which lasts a lot longer. So they're on harder drugs. It's completely strung out. Zero repercussions. They're allowed

to steal. So there's just, it's not compassionate. They should be forced into rehab, not allowed to like OD on the streets. That's Michael Schellenberger's position. He's a guy who's running for governor now. Oh, really? He worked for George Soros. He's like a progressive politician. But after a while he realized these policies are creating these problems and this idea that you can just live in a place for free and get free money and free food and that you just do drugs like yeah it's it's insane it's insane because no one's gonna stop doing that yeah I used to be major pro like all drugs should be legalized but after seeing that I'm okay, there has to be something where there's like forced rehab.

Well, the thing is like I don't think any adult should be able to tell you what you can and can't do. I don't believe that. Yeah. I don't believe like you and I are adults. Yes. I'm a little older than you, but we're both grown ass fucking men with kids. Yes. I shouldn't be able to tell you what to do and you shouldn't be able to tell me

what to do that's crazy if Jamie told us both what to do like when you go home I don't want you eating pineapples like why yeah exactly it makes pineapples fucking illegal they're sacrilegious like what like that's the difference between like someone saying you can't smoke marijuana but someone saying it's okay to drink vodka yeah or sense you can get a prescription for Oxycontin. I think most drugs, a lot of people can use recreationally and be fine, but when you see fentanyl and meth, you're like, okay, those two people don't seem to be able to use recreational.

Yeah, there's not a lot of meth advocates. Not a casual meth smoker. Yeah. The thing about fentanyl is it's really deadly in very small doses. That's the scariest part about it. It's like that stuff does people in. And cheap now. So you just buy it up for cheap Well the amount you ever seen the amount that kills you have you ever seen the image? I know it's like a really small amount, dude You're gonna freak out. It's so small. There's put up the amount of fentanyl that kills you

There's an image of a penny and next next to the penny is, or actually on the penny, I think, is a lethal dose of fentanyl. And it's so small. You're like, that'll kill you? Yeah, it's crazy. And now they're dosing the cocaine with fentanyl. People are ODing on that. I don't know if you've seen that.

Yeah, I have seen that. It's crazy. They're dosing a lot of things. Street Xanax. Street Xanax. I didn't know that was a thing. Yeah, they make fake Xanaxes. As I look this up, I feel like we have to grain of salt maybe

because I remember seeing all the DEA pictures of weed, and they're like, this is $17 million worth of street weed. It's like, no, it's not. Right, that's true. They do the price if you're selling it by a gram. People don't go and sell pounds of weed by the gram. But I think this is the lethal dose, though. And from what I

understand, I think it's accurate. Because they did this study on how much more potent it is than heroin. And it's something crazy. Google that. How much more potent is fentanyl than heroin? Even if it's double that, it's still insane. I think it's way...

Oh yeah, it was double the amount. So yeah,, even if that was off by, like, two times... That's just... It's compared to heroin here. Yeah. Lethal dose of fentanyl relative to a lethal dose... Yeah, see, that's... Wow. Damn, heroin's not a lot.

That's what I mean. I have also... I have a friend that is a nurse, and they said, like, fentanyl's given to people, and... Yeah. They have to be given more than... It has to be used very carefully....17 crumbs worth of fentanyl, given to people and yeah they have to be given more than used very carefully 17 crumbs worth of fentanyl right but it's mixed with other things it's mixed with this but they use a very small amount it's very very very small amount um i don't know why fentanyl was even invented it's not like we don't have heroin yeah well i think for extreme pain

people are in really bad pain but doesn't heroin do the same thing? I think it does. There it is. So that's the size of a lethal dose. Comparison of lethal dose of heroin. What is that word? Which one? Carfentanil.

Carfentanil. Oh, okay. So lethal dose of heroin, carfentanil, and fentanyl. So carfentanil is like, I don't know. I've never heard of it until just now. And there's fentanyl in powder form and fentanyl in pill and crystal form. Ugh. Jesus.

Yeah, it's scary shit, man, because it's coming in from south of the border. Yeah, it's clearly not a good drug. It's making a lot of money, and they're getting the precursors for making these things. They're getting them from China, and it's like, whoa. I think the meth's a lot stronger now, too. Just pictures like this remind me of the DARE program, and I'm like, that fucked me up so much with all the misinformation on drugs. That is true. Does it say the amount?

Because I think it's a crazy amount. It's 100 times more deadly than heroin it's 100 times more deadly than heroin or 100 times more potent than heroin. It says it's generally stated to be 2 milligrams in this article about what the lethal dose was. Does it say what heroin is? Aren't we at like 100,000 ODs a year or something now? Yeah. It's the number one cause of death for young kids between 18 and 49 is fentanyl overdose. Yeah, this is wild.

That's nuts. $100,000 a year. But meanwhile, how much does it take to overdose? What does it say? Anyway. It's not something that people are thinking about as a— This is 200. 200?

As opposed to what? No exact deadly dose to two to 200 you know two milligrams it says no so it is a hundred yeah so it's a hundred yeah hundred times stronger fuck yeah it's wild and like yeah what what's the answers this I don't know what the answer is man because it's so deadly like the problem with that is that's so easy to kill you like if you fuck up you take the wrong shit you you're done. Yeah.

Overall, I have no answer, but I know in San Francisco, they need to arrest the dealers, force the people in rehab. It won't fix it, but it would help a little bit. Again, I don't think adults should be able to tell other adults what to do. The problem with fentanyl is that it's real. Well, they're causing problems. I think that's the exception with them. If you're using fentanyl and you're keeping your life together, then yeah, I shouldn't force what to do. The problem with fentanyl is that it's real. Well, they're causing problems. I think that's the exception with them. If you're using fentanyl and you're keeping your life

together, then yeah, it shouldn't force you to rehab. Which there are functional heroin addicts and whatnot. There's definitely functional heroin addicts. But are there functional fentanyl heads? I have no idea. I guess I don't think people really share the fact that they're using fentanyl. There must be like the OG, the goat.

For sure. They just know how to use it. The goat of fentanyl. There must be like the OG, the goat. For sure. They just know how to use it. The goat of fentanyl. There's probably a few people. There's a few guys that can use small amounts. Don't overdo it. I'm sure it's out there, but it's not the norm. What do you think should be done? Do you think they should make it illegal?

I think with fentanyl they have to. Even most drugs they don't feel that way. I think they almost have to and then go after the dealers and force the people using it into rehab. Or maybe force them in rehab for an infraction. The problem is they let them steal. They let them crap on the street. They let them sleep on the street. Something's got to be done.

I mean, L.A. was the same. You see how out of control it is. I think also the problem is a lot of these people that get forced into rehab, they don't want to be a rehab. Some people do. Some people realize they fucked up. They want to get better. And those people generally do get better.

But the people that you're forcing them in there. And also, who knows what their childhood was like? Are you forcing them in there because their childhood was horrific? Yeah. Maybe isolate them to like an area outside the city where he's given area and they can OD themselves. And it's not ideal, but it's better than... Because right now they just run rampant and terrorize the street, terrorize people.

And that's clearly not the right answer. No. Well, whatever San Francisco is doing, they should do the opposite. Do the opposite, yes. Whatever the opposite is. Yeah, do the opposite of San Francisco is doing. Austin's ran pretty smooth for a liberal city. Well, they definitely cleaned it up

when they got rid of the outdoor camping and they've made it a place where they've put a considerable amount of effort into housing homeless people and getting them shelter and getting them taken care of and getting them counseling. But I talked to the mayor about it.

He was like, there's a problem in Austin, but it's a problem of like 2,000 plus people he's like when it gets to like LA size that's when you can't manage yeah they let San Francisco and LA go so far that you where would you even begin to tackle it I think LA's worse have you been to Skid Row not in years luckily but it was terrible before I haven't been to it since the the Fear Factor days I was filming Fear Factor down there but I have friends that have been recently, and they say,

you can't even imagine what it looks like now. Have you been to Venice Beach in the last couple years? I haven't, but I've been watching videos. It's wild. It's wild. Because I used to be just so nice, probably one of the most popular beaches in the world. I went out there, and I'm just like, what is going on? This is insane.

They let crazy people fucking start camping. There's tents all along the beach now, and people just might clean that up. Did they? Yeah. When did they clean that up? I don't know. I just remember when we were there, I'd ask someone, and they said, like, here, I'll show you. They said, look at the video of live.

It's just live camera. We'll see how long that lasts, though. That's nice. It'll start switching around, too. The camera will switch around? Yeah, it'll show different angles of the boardwalk and whatnot It was there a few months ago and it wasn't cleaned up Was this a place where there was all tents?

Yeah that's right by the skate park I like the main part The tents are more further out Yeah this is more in, the tents are further out What I saw was on the edge of the water I'm just saying I've seen video of this stuff and it's pretty fucking clean.

That's good. It's great that they cleaned it up. I haven't been to Venice. I'm skeptical. I haven't been in quite a while. Oh, that looks pretty good. Hold on. That's just the water. Why don't you Google, have they cleaned up the homeless problem in Venice?

That looks pretty good. There's got to be a bunch of crazy people. It was really bad in the last couple months, so I found it hard to believe they've cleaned it up. Okay, look at that. That was an area that used to be completely covered in tents. Yeah. There's probably still a few random people, but there always has been in Venice.

That's a lot better. That's February. That's months ago in Venice you know that's a lot better so that's February that's months ago mm-hmm so do you think that all those videos that were out and all the talk about it is that a copy that's their scanner audio live venice boy oh interesting look that's pretty good so I wonder where they put them they killed him I'm not gonna ask any fat them to the other homeless people yeah what do they do how do? How do you fix that? I asked Annie because she moved over there. I was like, well, you moved there.

Letterman did? Yeah, I was like, what is it like? She's like, it's fine. I was like, really? Wow. Well, that's good to hear because it was terrible when I was there. If they're able to clean that up, there's some hope for everywhere. They probably pushed them all into Skid Row or something.

The thing about Skid Row is there's so many fucking people there that you can't imagine see if you can find a video of skid row like now um the the horrors schellenberger was talking about that place too like the horrors that you would see there this is actually i think the same day february 11th 2022. yeah that's how it looked when i was there in venice This is downtown. This is crazy. I mean, this is tense. Imagine if that's your business. Yeah, right. That place is right there.

That's what some of my friends' businesses in San Francisco are. That's their business, and the tents are right there in front of it. A market. So you have a market, and right in front of the market, you have basically these tent communities, and some of them are like shacks. They build their own shack. Yeah, there's not.

Look at that. It's not most people down on its luck. It's mostly drug addicts too. Right. Exactly. And why wouldn't they? If they can just live there and then go wherever the fuck they want. You might as well smoke fentanyl if you're leaving there.

Yeah. Like look at these things. These are like shacks. They get tarps and they set up posts. They're like wall tents. It's really wild that they've allowed this to get to this point. And how no one made a course correction like no one said hey um we got to fix this let's put all our resources talking about

fixing it either it seems to be like no uh no plans of changing direction they keep throwing more money at it and the money makes it worse because what they do with the money i think they just people at top steal it oh well we found that from coleon noir too really yeah he was explaining that he went to san francisco and he was talking to this other guy, and he was like, you know, what is it? Is it a budget issue? And the guy was like, no, no, no. No, there's a shitload of money being spent on it, but there's no incentive to fix it

because there's all these people that are working on the homeless problem that are making six figures plus. Damn. So there's people that he was showing people that were working in L.A LA that were making a quarter million dollars a year working on the homeless situation. To fix the homeless, yeah. But the homeless situation is not getting any better, right? It was just getting worse and worse. The numbers were piling up and these people were making beaucoup de narrow. Yes.

They were living fat in a hog. It's a turn in the industry, like the pharmaceutical company is trying to make you healthy. Well, it does become an industry whenever someone can make a living doing something. Like, they have zero incentive to fix it. Because then what are they going to do? I've got to find another job? Yeah. You get paid $250 a year.

Go make $100,000 or something else. I'll pass. I'd be like, slow down, Jake. We don't have to fix all these people. Let's go recruit some. I'd be recruiting homeless people. I'd be selling fentanyl. I'd be like, I need more people out here fucked up.

You'd get a raise. I need money. More money thrown at it. I'm in the homeless business. Business is good. Oh, yeah, it really is turning into a big business in San Francisco and L.A. and these places, and that's the problem. I don't know how they fix it at this point. And I think the amount of time that it took from 2016 to 22, how bad it went in six years, how many years does it take for it to get better?

You would need a hardliner like Rudy Giuliani there. Right. But San Francisco probably wouldn't put something like that in. But that's the only real hope. Someone just hardline with a hardline police force, a DA. They'd have to all be working together. And then they could clean it up quick. But that's the only solution.

Yeah, and then people would get mad. You fascists. Nazis. Fucking Berkeley would not tolerate that. You don't want to be robbed. They'll literally say things there like, oh, he needed it more than you. I've heard that. It's insane. I've heard that. I've heard that argument.

If someone robbed you, it's because they needed it more than you. Like, what? It's because of need it more than you. Like what? What? It's because of income inequality. What? Yeah. What? Or maybe criminals.

Those are always real, right? If you want to get to the source of criminals, I'm all with you. If you want to clean up communities and get people happier and healthier, I'm on board. But you can't just allow it because there's bad stuff in the past Because they're their childhood sucked in their communities where they grew up was crime ridden and gang ridden and drug ridden Because that they became who they are I understand that 100% but you can't just allow them to just do that over and over there because of that you can't that's not That's like the opposite of compassionate like you're just to make it worse. Yeah, no, I agree. I think you need to put like lots of money in those like high

crime areas for education, afterschool programs, stuff like that. And more funding the police, not, not less have the police come in and do boxing programs with the kids. We did a, I did a program in San Francisco for a minute with my friend Tarek. He set it up where it was like, he would get the kids to play football and sports and he'd bring the cops in to interact with the kids in the bad communities. And the kids and cops, I did it with them, they'd be playing along,

playing football, getting along, things like that. You're like, oh, this is what can actually help. That's awesome. Yeah, that's what needs to be done. That's perfect. Yeah, that was one program that I volunteered for. I'm like, wow, this feels like it actually can make a difference. It definitely can for the kids that it impacts, that was one program that I volunteered for. I'm like, wow, this feels like it actually can make a difference. It definitely can for the kids that it impacts, that it touches. It's just there's not enough of that. But if that's what anybody wants to do, like, yeah, that's a great idea.

Yeah, I think more of this stuff could definitely help. Get kids when they're young in the right direction because sometimes kids just need a little push to do something they love. Can you imagine, though, that if you put people in charge of cleaning up a community, but that was a job. The job was the community has to be cleaned up, not the community's clean. So, I mean, the incentive would be for them to not totally fix it, but, you know, keep it. We're doing better. We're making progress, but never, like, really tighten it down because then you'd be out of work again it's like the same thing as a homeless czar have it

where you get a big bonus if you complete your job you get a million dollar bonus right that's how you'd fix it have them so they get a fat paycheck like a big bonus if they fix the homeless problem okay fix it give give them give them 20 million do you know how crazy that would be if you had bids? You know, they have like when Halliburton had no-bid contracts in Iraq. People were outraged, right? Yeah. Because here it is.

You got this guy who's the vice president, Dick Cheney, and he used to be the CEO of Halliburton. Now all of a sudden Halliburton gets these no-bid contracts to clean up shit that he bombed? Yeah, unreal. Like what? This is crazy. But imagine if they had that same sort of a situation in Los Angeles. And they said, listen, this is our homeless problem. The homeless problem costs us a lot of money.

It's a really bad problem for tourism. It's bad for crime. It's public safety, all the EMTs and ambulance and hospitals and overdoses and all this stuff. We want to clean this up, but we're going to give you a bonus. We're going to give you guys, like, if you can fix this by measurable numbers, we'll give you a huge payout. Because think about how much money it costs. Oh, it costs so much money. I think in San Francisco, they spend like, I don't know the exact numbers, but $60,000, $70,000 per homeless person. I think it's more.

Yeah, and it's way more to house the person. But the problem is housing isn't the problem. It's drug addiction. They're trying to act like the problem is not what the actual problem is. Right, that's true. They try to pretend that it's a housing issue. They're the unhoused. No, they're drug addicts.

It's an open-air drug market. They're drug addicts. it's an open air drug market they're drug addicts so like if you could fix like but how would you fix it without any like horrific dystopian

totalitarian solution like how would you fix it without going full Mad Max I think you're gonna have to rest a bunch of them and be hardline and then a lot of them would probably start

leaving other places yeah I mean they'd probably go somewhere else then they'd go to Oakland do you imagine if they allowed them to go to Oakland

but they cleaned up San Francisco I mean I don't like Oakland somewhere else. Then they'd go to Oakland. Do you imagine if they allowed them to go to Oakland, but they cleaned up San Francisco? I mean, I don't like Oakland that much, so I'd be happy. Works for me. Could you fucking imagine if they made money doing that, and then they fixed it? No, that would be a lot more likely to fix it. Yeah. And you just give them yearly bonuses if they're hitting their metrics.

Right, exactly. And you could probably justify it. Because you could say, listen, the homeless situation costs us X amount of billion dollars a year. Okay, let's ask this. Let's just take a guess. How much

does the homeless problem cost San Francisco every year? It has to be hundreds of millions. Hundreds of millions, at least. Jamie, let's look this up. At least. Yeah, for sure hundreds of millions. Jamie, let's look this up. Cost in what way, though? What's the cost of the homeless problem?

So it'll be more than what they put, because also the chased away tourists, the damage is done to place, so you won't really be able to quantify the exact cost, but just what they put in is probably a few hundred million. Right. What is the financial consequences of the homeless problem in San Francisco? How much does homelessness cost San Francisco per year? Got anything? It's a weird question. Yeah, exactly.

What it returns isn't going to give you what you want. Yeah, because it won't quantify the chase-away tourism and all that. I've seen people say the homeless situation has cost San Francisco upwards of X amount of dollars per year. That's probably just the money they throw at it, though. Right. So you add in the scared away tourists and damaged property and theft and all that. Who knows what it is? Yeah.

So let's say it's a billion dollars. If you tell a company, if you can clean this up, we'll give you a billion dollars. You will make $1 billion. So we'll double it, but you will have no problem anymore. You can clean this up. You have a measurable metric. You get you down to about 500 homeless people. That's it.

Yeah, it'd be great. And then you'd have a nice city. Then they'd do it, and then you'd find out three years later what they actually did. They made biscuits. Yeah, exactly. And then they'd start I'll pretend like I didn't see it. Yeah, for sure they would definitely. If you can get some ruthless

company to do it. ODML and fentanyl. Yeah, it would be like that Soylent Green movie. They'd turn them into cookies. Turn people into snacks. This doesn't answer it in the other movie. They turn them into cookies. Turn people into snacks. This doesn't answer it in the other way. They talk about how much money it takes to solve the problem, not how much money they've been spending fixing it.

What does it say to solve the problem? How much does it take? This article from last year says, the tab needed to solve the most persistent problem, a one-time investment of $9.3 billion, according to this new report. That will solve it. What's it do? Give them homes? That's hilarious. If it's a yearly budget,

then you start going down. If you spend the whole budget, you're not going to get that much money next year because you've showed that you fixed the problem. The city will spend the money other ways. Right. So you go just under, so you can get more, whatever. Right. You've juked the numbers. You definitely would never fix it. Right. You've juked the numbers. That's the weird thing with government agencies.

Yeah. You would definitely never fix it. No. Especially if it's your... That's the thing. If you're the government, your incentive is to never fix it. But if you're a private business and this is what you do, you fix cities. This, for instance, says safe parking sites for people that live in their vehicles.

What? Safe parking? Investments into mental health. What does that mean? Increasing safe parking sites. If you can get in it, that means a homeless person can get in it. How is that safe? Yeah, they go through the parking structures and rob everyone.

Yeah. Unless you have armed guards patrolling the parking structures. Shut the fuck up. That's not safe. I think this is me making new parking lots for them to park in and stuff like that. Yeah, but it says increasing safe parking sites for those living in vehicles and upping the investment into mental health and substantive drug abuse programs. So they're saying safe places for people to live in their car to park.

But how many of them live in their car? Yeah, most of them don't have cars. They trade their cars for drugs. Okay, so let's say you have a small amount that live in their car to park. But how many of them live in their car? Yeah, most of them don't have cars. These people- They trade their cars for drugs. Okay, so let's say you have a small amount that live in caravans, right? Those folks that live in those mobile campers. We used to have a lot of them in LA near our old studio. Is that a different type of homeless?

They're also addicted to drugs? Or is that more of a- Yeah, they were the same kind of guys. There was a lot of hard partying dudes. And if you choose to live in a van like that, are you homeless? That's the question. Because this guy was,

the guy who parked in front of ours, it was like, he'd be like sunbathing on a lawn. And we'd be like, hey man, get the fuck out of here. There's like a whole movement of people on YouTube and Instagram that like van life is their thing.

They want to reduce their shit. They want to be able to park in different parking lots and live at Walmart or whatever. I don't know. It's a good question, right? Because if you are that person and you travel around like Tom Green and you're with your dog and you take photos and you post it online, I don't see anything wrong with that. I mean, to the extent where Elon gets shit for like, I don't have a house. I live in my friend's houses.

It's like he's homeless. Richest guy in the world and he's homeless. He's crazy. The difference is he could buy whatever fucking house he wants. He doesn richest guy in the world and he's homeless. He's crazy. The difference is he could buy whatever fucking house he wants. He just doesn't want one.

Yeah, he's just nuts. He's too smart. But you live in a Mercedes Sprinter van that's got all the shower in it. But you can't just park on the street

in a residential neighborhood and like lay on people's lawns. You can. Yeah, you can. Not the lawn. Not the lawn. You can't, yeah.

Right. When you go there, you can't. But you can park on a street. Yeah, you can park on the lawn. Not the lawn. You can't. Yeah. Right. When you go there, you can't. But you can park on a street. Yeah. You can park on some streets, but some streets don't allow overnight parking. So a lot of times they go to like 24-hour grocery stores and they park in those parking lots.

You see them there sometimes. And sometimes they kick them out of those places. It's a weird life. Yeah. Are they homeless? They're not homeless. If you've got a nice Sprinter van, you're not homeless. You just live in a van. You're homeless if you've got a nice Sprinter van, you're not homeless. You just live in a van.

You're homeless if you've got a home, right? Yeah. If you live in a tent, you're homeless. But that's your home, the tent. I would take my van, the nicest weather in the country, which is L.A. and San Francisco. Definitely L.A. San Francisco gets cold, son. Yeah.

San Francisco is not like regular California. Get bored in L.A. Yeah, that's true. You want to mix it up. I'm just saying, are how many more adding to that? Or are they, and then if your van breaks down, next thing you know, you are homeless. Then you're homeless. Then you have a tent.

But if your van breaks down, you're still inside of it. So it's still better than a tent. It's a hard side. Or they towed it while you were gone at work one day. Then you lost it. Now you're homeless. How do they not get robbed in those places? Because everyone steals everything.

How do they not get their cars broken? I'm sure they rob each other too, man. I'm sure there's like a lot of violence in those communities. If you're dealing with people who are on meth and partying, I mean, I've seen videos of them like beating the shit out of each other and doing horrible things to each other. I remember when San Francisco was on full lockdown and COVID, I drove through the tender line and they were having like crackhead block parties. It was, I wish I would have filmed it, but when you film there, the drug dealers

come and yell at you. Oh, that makes sense. Crackhead block parties and, and probably not even remotely worried about COVID. Oh no. That's why I said, I'm like the crackheads are surviving. I'm going to be okay. Where everybody, I was when Chris Christie survived, I was like, geez, I'm going to be fine.

Yeah. If that guy dies, it's embarrassing if I do. Well, if he died, it would be embarrassing if you did. If he didn't, if he, if he rather didn't die. If he didn't die, it would be embarrassing if you did. Yeah. Yeah, when big fat people got it and were fine, I was like, hmm, this is beatable. I think, yeah, I think I'm going to survive it.

Yeah. The Tenderloin, always a sketchy place, but did it get way sketchier during COVID? Well, more of what happened is, yeah, I got a little sketchier there, but just the tenderloin area basically sprawled across the whole city. Cause before, when was the last time you were in San Francisco? It's been a few years. Yeah. So now like there's this tense and like not every neighborhood, but like lots of neighborhoods, there'll be tent cities everywhere. People doing crack, crazy people walking around.

So like the whole city is turning into a tenderloin. Obviously, tenderloin is still worse, but it's like sprawled out everywhere. Why are people still living there though? I moved. Do you think that people are living there just out of hope that it gets better? I think so. You kind of like Stockholm syndrome. You kind of don't realize like how bad it is till you leave.

You kind of get stuck where you're just stuck in a rut and you think, oh, this is normal. It's normal to get my car broken into every month and to worry about getting robbed and not being able to wear my watch out. How did you wind up going to Vegas? Just because I had a lot of friends there in the fight world. It made sense. It was an easy move. I was thinking about here or Vegas. I didn't really know anyone here.

Didn't know there was much going on. I'm like, oh, Vegas, I'll be able to figure out. It'll be easier to figure out business and work. That's true. There's a lot of fight business in Vegas. Yeah. My God. I mean, yeah.

For doing stuff in the fight industry, it all just comes through there. And then also a lot of the cannabis industry comes through here, and I work with high rollers, do a little stuff in the cannabis industry as well. Shout out to high rollers. Yeah. I love that fucking event. I just love the idea behind it, that they get barbecued. Yeah, I think I just got them a deal on UFC Fight Pass.

Really? It isn't finalized yet, but I'm meeting with all the execs and suits. Oh, that would be amazing. I brought them there at the worst time. I walk them into Hyrule. We don't smoke as much anymore. A guy walked out with a blower with a pound in there and just smoked out the whole room. And then you guys had a meeting?

I think I just lost this deal. Oh, no. It took a few months after that to get the meeting oh that's hilarious that's hilarious yeah those guys go too hard with a blower yeah we don't do that anymore because it smoked out the whole room you couldn't breathe when you're competing the highest I have ever been on a podcast was with be real when I did a smoke box smoke box right that's what he calls it? B-Real Smokebox.

He's got a car, and they have a setup inside the car, and there's the cameras in there. And so we got high first. Oh, Jesus. Like barbecued. And then you get in the car, and everyone keeps smoking. And they just keep smoking. I'm like, oh, my God.

Yeah, it happened to me once with Nick and Nate talked me into smoking right before in a hot box car. We just got so lit. I remember they put me in. I'm in the cage, my gloves taped on, headgear taped on, looking across at Nick, and I'm like, wait, I got to fight this guy right now? I got so scared. We're barbecued here.

I'm so high I already stopped smoking. I'm just going, let me off. It's legit in terms of... Yeah, it's crazy how much some people can smoke. Those guys can put it down. Is Nick fighting again? I don't know. For his last fight, obviously,

he wasn't in the best situation mentally and stuff, so I would like to see him fight again, but I'd like to see him do a proper camp. I just saw something yesterday. That's what I was going to ask. Something that said Nick Diaz plans to return. I think he wants to, but I really hope he does a proper camp and does it right. What did he do for the last one?

Not much. Really? I think he was just going through some tough times in his life. I don't want to get into his personal life too much, but I think he was going through a tough time. I don't think I would have liked to have pulled the fight and moved it back personally. Coach, expect Nick Diaz to fight by the end of the year. Coach Cesar Gracie gives an update on his longtime protege, MMA veteran, and fan favorite, Nick Diaz.

Yeah, so people were thinking that he was kind of heavy, and that's why the fight wound up being— They fought at 85, right? I think they moved it to 85, yeah. Which Lawler's a big guy, too, so I'm sure he didn't mind. Oh, he's probably so happy he didn't have to cut, you know? Yeah, I think a lot of it was his motivation. He was kind of, like, pushed into the fight. The fight happened so quick, and he hadn't been training at all.

Then all of a sudden he's, like, fighting in two months. It was this kind of rush. He didn't have a chance to do a camp. But, you know, because Nick's like a brother. I really hope he fights again, but he needs to make sure to properly do a camp. The amount of love that that guy gets is off the charts when they see him you know love him when they introduce him during that fight too the whole audience went crazy yeah he's an absolute legend like everyone loves nick diaz i mean he's a very

important part of uh the mma the history of mma and if people don't realize what a big party is you need to watch him in the Strikeforce days. Because when he was a Strikeforce champion, watch the Frank Shamrock fight. Watch Paul Daly. Paul Daly fight. Wow. That's probably the best one-round fight I've ever seen. Amazing fight. Cyborg.

The Cyborg fight. Gomi. Yes. Watch those days. He's a true legend. He's a legend. That's why everyone loves him. Some people forget how great he was.

Oh, my God. The Paul Daly fight is an insane fight because Daly has one of the best left hands in the history of the sport. Daly was a thunderous striker. He was so dangerous. Yeah, he's tough. Was he one of the— So Henderson hit you hardest?

Probably Henderson, yeah, but he landed clean. Daly didn't land anything too clean. He popped me with a jab that was like, oh, wow, this guy's got some power. I better take him down and tap him out. Yeah, I mean, he knocked out Lorenzo Larkin. He's a savage. Yeah, amazing power. And so Nick just went at him in that fight.

You watched that fight? Oh, yeah. Nick just swarmed him. And just the volume of strikes, like you could see, that kind of fight is where he thrived. You watch that fight? Oh, yeah, Nick just swarmed him and just the volume of strikes like you could see like The that kind of fight is where he thrived When he was nice you got dropped enough. Yep drop came back up and just even we got dropped He's like moving around on the ground avoiding the ground pound gets back up and he talks so much shit to guys Yeah during during during the sparring

They're talking shit Hilarious, that's one of the things that Frank Shamrock said about fighting. You can't believe he's talking shit to you while he's beating you up. Yeah, it just adds humiliation to it. Also, frustration. It's hard to keep your head straight. Yeah, that. The Gomi fight's one of my favorite fights.

That one was amazing. That was incredible when he tapped out Gomi. He got cracked right before that, too. Remember? That was when Gomi was Gomi. Yeah, when he was one of the tapped out Gomi. And he got cracked right before that, too. Remember? Yep. And that was when Gomi was Gomi. You know? Yeah.

Yeah. When he was one of the best in the world. Oh, my God. Gomi was one of those guys from Japan that was so fierce. Sakurai was another one. I fought him. Oh, wow. That was crazy.

That was my first big win. You fought Sakurai, too? Really? I went to Japan. I'd never left the country, never been on a plane, and I flew out to Japan. Whoa. With Nick Diaz. That was wild.

What was the event? Shudo. Oh, wow. Yeah, he was ranked, like, number two in the world at the time. I was completely unknown. That was, like, for me, that's one of my most memorable fights, even though, like, most people in the U.S. didn't watch it. It was, like, such a cool experience. Well, there was a stretch of time where he was the fucking man.

Mm-hmm. I mean, he was the man. Yeah, he was so—some of those Japanese guys were so good. Yeah, he was very good. I mean, that was what was a really interesting time about MMA where there was Valley Tudo Japan, right, in the 90s, and then there was Pride, there was Shudo, Deep, K-1. There was a lot of shit going on over there.

It was massive in Japan. Oh, my God. The fucking pride. When they would have those fights at the Saitama Super Arena, and you would see like 90,000 people for an MMA event. Yeah, that's like bigger than the one in Toronto, right? That's crazy. Yes, like by 40,000 or 30,000 people.

What was Toronto? Toronto 50 or 60? So 30,000 people more. Jesus, that's insane. 30,000. Yeah,000 people. What was Toronto? Toronto 50 or 60? So 30,000 people more. Jesus, that's insane. 30,000! Yeah, that's just madness. That's two MGMs. It's weird how fighting has completely dropped off in Japan.

How is that possible? I think because they had yakuza ties, and once that got exposed, they cut their TV deals and just died out. That makes no sense to me. Because Japan has always been this warrior culture. I mean, Japan is responsible for judo, jujitsu, karate. Like, so many origins of styles came from Japan. Yeah, it's one of the birthplaces of the greatest martial arts. I mean, Aikido.

There was so much that they developed over there. For that to be, for them to be at the top, because they were bigger, it was bigger in Japan than the UFC was in America at the time. Because we're dealing with a time where the UFC had not had the ultimate fighter yet. So from 2005 on, the UFC is a different thing. Because then the UFC became mainstream in America. five on the ufc is a different thing because then the ufc became mainstream in america but in the early days when fedor was the king when no gara was the champ yeah no i went to japan i was like so thrilled i was like oh i made it i'm in japan now and you're having those it was like you know

10 15 000 people with the wasn't pride size shootout but it was still like big arenas they loved it it was like wow this is this unreal they They came to meet me at an event once, and they offered me a job for commentating on Pride. Oh, wow. Yeah. Did you think about it? No. Or you didn't want to backtap the UFC? No chance.

Yeah, that's true. That wouldn't be a good move. Wasn't interested. Not interested. But it was cool. It was cool they wanted me to do it, but I wasn't interested. I'm sure in the back of your head you'd love to, but it would have burned bridge with the UFC. I wasn't interested. I wasn't interested in flying all the way over there. That's a long-ass flight to do it, but I wasn't interested. I'm sure in the back of your head you'd love to, but it would have burned bridge of the UFC. I wasn't interested.

I wasn't interested in flying all the way over there. That's a long flight to do all the time. And they were having those events pretty often. You know, the interesting thing about Pride, too, is they were having events where you wouldn't even know who was fighting until like a week or two weeks before. And then all these fights were

announced. You're like, whoa, he's on the card, too. Just wild cards. They had some insane fights. To this day, I'll go re-watch like Fedor versus Noguera or Fedor versus Crow Cop. Yeah. Was it Shogun and Little Fedor or Little Noguera? Yeah, Shogun and Little Nog. Oh, my God.

That was a war. Oh, my God. How about Nogueira. Yeah. Shogun and Little Nog. Oh, my God. That was a war. Oh, my God. How about Rampage versus Ricardo Arona? That was a battle, yeah. The craziest slam in the history of the sport. Off the triangle, right? Yes. He probably just dipped them.

That was when Rampage was Rampage. You know, when Rampage was in his prime. Yeah. Pride was great. Pride and UFC were, like, equal. It was, like, which one's better was the debate. I think it's the worst knockout I've ever seen in my life. If you think about bad knockouts, you think about head kicks,

and you think about punches. But I think the worst knockout I ever saw was Rampage slams Ricardo Arona. Yeah. Did Arona ever really recover from that in his career? No. I think that might have been kind of a, oh, here it is. Watch this. Oh.

I mean, that is straight insanity. Let me see that again. Look how he picks him up. How strong, oh, here it is. Watch this. I mean, that is straight insanity. Let me see that again. Look how he picks him up. How strong, how straight that is. He's in the triangle, but he slams him and then headbutts him inadvertently on the way down and then punches him in the face a couple of times. But it's the slam itself, the amount of fucking torque. Watch this.

Bam. I mean, dude. Damn. I mean, that has to be so bad for you yeah i don't i don't know if he really did much in his career after that no watch this again bang i mean that's crazy to watch i mean how is he not dead yeah unfortunately i never got to fight in pride i mean that might be i think that is i think that's the worst knockout I've ever seen. Oh, my God.

I mean, that and then the head collides with him too on the way down. I wonder how long he was out for. Oh, my God. Probably a year. Yeah, right. Yeah, you wouldn't want to spar after that. You probably would never be the same again. I mean, that's a kind of car accident type of KO where it's so much force when you're up in the air and then completely slammed out.

At least it was on a ring instead of like, you know, imagine if that was the concrete, you'd probably be dead. Oh my God. You'd be dead if that was the concrete. He'd be dead. Oh my God. Yeah. That's why you don't do a triangle in a street fight.

Yeah. Jesus Christ. Or let go if they stand up. Or you don't fuck with a judo guy in a street fight. You know? Somebody knows judo really well, like Ronda Rousey spiked you on your fucking head. Yeah, that would not be good on the concrete. A street fight with clothes, too, like a winter jacket.

Yeah, I'm not a gi guy. I would hate that. That would probably be the worst thing that could ever happen to you, is someone with a judo background grabs you and you have a winter coat. Just chuck you. They hit you with the earth. Bam. And then pick you up and do it again.

Bam. Yeah, it would not be good. Yeah. Fuck. When you think about the other things about Pride that made it insane was the soccer kicks and the stomps. You know?

Those were fun from a fan's perspective. Remember when Melvin Manhoof fought Sakuraba I'm trying to remember that one he kicked him in the face it was horrific one of the worst most ruthless

I want to say how did that's not he didn't win that he won he won one fight where someone

almost had him out like that but I don't think it was Manhoef. I think Manhoef. This was also Manhoef when he was in the prime. This guy was vicious strikers, absolutely vicious. Oh, my God.

This is probably like, I want to say this is like 2004, 2005. He beats the shit out of him and knees him in the head and soccer kicks him. And this is also Sakuraba, boom, ground and pound. This is like after he fought Vandale. They've been fighting him three times, right? Yeah, Vandale KO'd him real bad. Vandale had KO'd him real bad. And then Pride made him keep fighting him.

That's kind of the end of his career. Yeah. Yeah, why did they make him keep fighting Vandale? That was when Vandale was the axe murderer. I think they wanted him to win it so bad they kept like, oh, try again. Or he pissed somebody off. Melvin was just such a ruthless striker, and he was kill or be killed. Melvin was such a good striker.

Look at that head kick and then hit him with a punch afterwards. Melvin was so good too. Dang. And Melvin was so good that he knocked out Mark Hunt with one punch. Really? Yeah. Was that K-1 or was that a pride? I think it was a pride. I think it was pride. And Melvin was so good that he knocked out Mark Hunt with one punch. Really? Yeah. Was that K-1 or was that a pride?

I think it was a pride. I think it was pride. But Melvin weighed like 190. Yeah. And Mark Hunt was like 260. And Mark Hunt came charging at him. And Mark Hunt is a K-1 Grand Prix champion. And he KO'd him with one shot, which is just nuts.

Yeah, he's not an easy guy to KO. Ooh, should we do that again? Look at this. He comes charging at him. Boom. Ooh, a hook. I mean, just clipped him. Who the fuck does that to Mark Hunt? Nobody.

Nobody. Yeah, he's one of the most devastating strikers. Ever. The fact that he got clipped right here. Watch this. Oh, there it goes. No worries. Here, it's right here.

Boom. Boom. A left hook coming in and a right hand behind it. And he was already done with the left hook. Right there. Like, his body just shuts off. Look at that. The only person other than that who stopped, well, didn't Verdum stop Mark Hunt?

Stop Mark Hunt with a flying knee? I think so. Yes. And Alistair. Alistair KO'd him with a vicious knee. Alistair was a beast beast too, especially in Pride. Oh, man. Back when he was on all the saucy sauce.

Wiggy horse meat. I think he's back. I think he's back at K1. No, excuse me, Glory. Hell yeah. Let's get him giant again. Let's get 300-pound Alistair back. He looks big again.

Yeah, that guy was vicious. They have a photo of him with a mohawk now. He's got saucy face, saucy neck. He looks giant. Yeah, I trained jiu-jitsu with him one time in Abu Dhabi, one of the sheiks. All of a sudden, the guy's, like, elbowing me, and I'm like, oh, this is fun jiu-jitsu. He elbowed you? Look at that.

He's saucy again. Let me see that picture again. Oh, yeah. That's what's up. Jesus. Look at them biceps, yeah. That's what's up. Jesus. Look at them biceps, son. He's back. Was he probably 6'6 or something too?

Is that all that there is to that video or is there more to that video? There's not a lot to this. Is there even two months ago? Bro, sauce. And how tall is he? He's a big fella. Probably 6'6 or something? He's at least 6'5.

He's very big. He's tall and long I mean when Alistair was a light heavyweight he was a bad motherfucker but he was just too thin I mean and he was cutting weight give me that picture again we's wearing that shirt oh you just see it that's good enough show me that again just that one right there yeah that's pretty saucy that's what I liked yeah I liked Alistair when he fought Brock Lesnar. Saucer. And like Mark Coleman. I love that he was jacked. When he was Uberim. But when he won the K1 Grand Prix, too.

I mean, he was jacked then. A little extra at the end. Yeah. Yeah, he looks good. He doesn't look that much bigger, honestly, than his UFC days. But he looks full. Yeah, he gained a little weight. It's also the problem with guys like that when they do, air supplements for so many years and then they get off of them like man your

their natural levels are probably run down their natural levels are fucked like vitor i remember when vitor fought chris weidman and he just deflated he was just vicious for a minute when he was allowed to be on the trt he was just spinning kicking people like yeah dude got a mohawk at like 40 years old that people. Yeah. Dude got a mohawk at like 40 years old. That's how you know you got a lot of stash running in your body.

Yeah, he was buck wild in those days. TRT Vitor is one of the most exciting fighters of all time. Yeah, he was vicious. Yeah. Well, he's on the sauce again, too. He just knocked out

Evander Holyfield. Did you see that? Oh, yeah. That was kind of sad, though, because Holyfield didn't look like he should have been fighting. No. Well, he's 60.

Yeah. No matter who you are, at 60, wrap it up. And it looked like his mental state wasn't 100% clear. Dude, that guy went to war with George Foreman, Mike Tyson, Riddick Bowe. I mean, whew. Yeah, total legend fighting all those guys. Bro, he went to war. Yeah, that's what's sad.

So you don't have to go back and fight at 60. I don't know if it's a money thing or probably a money thing, right? Well, I'm sure it helps that there's a lot of money, but I think they love it too. It's hard walking away. Yeah. As a fighter, I know how hard it is to walk away. Sometimes you're like, oh, I could do this again. But I'm like, you know what?

My life's good. I don't need to. Well, you could do a lot of other stuff you know and also you're a pretty analytical guy you'll look at things in terms of like what you should and shouldn't do with your life and your future what's good for your future yeah some guys just go fuck it it's hard you know especially how much else going on or maybe you go and blew all your money weren't smart with it you need money again you're not fighting. It's like, ah, might as well do it. What would you do ideally? Like if there was an ideal gig for you to do,

what would you do other than fighting? Like now or before? Yeah, like right now. I don't know. I'm doing a lot of things I like. You're doing a lot of things you like. The thing about fighters that don't fight anymore is they still train a lot. Yeah, I still train almost every day's that takes up a lot of time like anything you wanted to do some like we were talking about how you know it's hard to train really hard and then

do a podcast because your brain is like still like oh yeah like i've made that mistake before where i've come here after like real hard workout sessions especially after rolling a lot of times a hard jiu-jitsu session you know train with someone like Gordon Ryan like I need a nap after yeah you get fucking exhausted do you get a chance to train with Gordon at all no no I haven't he's amazing great teacher too he I mean obviously he's a really good teacher his videos are fucking sensational but how crazy is that a guy who's 25 years old who's like best in the world best in the world world and the best of all time. Yeah. Like no geek grapplers.

The best of all time at this point. It's hard to say he's not. Yeah. And that's a very like bold statement to say, but I think, you know, he's got to be. He really is. I mean, but what a combination too. Like him and Donaher together and Gary Tonin and all those guys. But the fact that Donaher being like what he calls his cheat code, you like what what are the odds that like a guy was a freak athlete it's a

big giant fuck who is super smart yeah super driven meets the master splinter worked out perfect yeah yeah I think Gary Tony coached him for a while too so he already had him good I remember I met Gordon he was like a purple belt but he was like he was vicious I'm like oh man this kid's gonna get good came back like a year later and like damn damn, this kid's good. Isn't it funny though that something like that requires so much dedication? Those guys train 365 days a year.

Seven days a week. Remember when I was living in New York, they would train Saturday and Sunday. You have to be fully locked in to do that. You have to be fully locked in in terms of your discipline, your goals, your future. That shows you like if you want to be, a lot of people say, oh, you need rest. Oh, you need this. Oh, you need that. Maybe, maybe you do. Or maybe you need to be so fucking dedicated that that is

all of your life, that you're doing it seven days a week. Yeah, no, I agree. You got to be training all the time. I think overtraining is real, but it seven days a week. Yeah, no, I agree. You got to be training all the time. I think overtraining is real, but it's way over-exaggerated. Way more people under-train than over-train. You know, it's always the guys that aren't winning huge fights being like, oh, I don't want to over-train. Most of the champions you walk into, they're grinding their ass off. I think what over-training is, is you never develop the kind of cardio required to train at that level every day. Yeah.

I think you do need lighter days too. Yeah. Like sometimes not all the sessions were hard. Sometimes he would recommend, like, hey, you guys can pick guys that aren't as good and just play around and try new stuff. And that was actually very eye-opening for me because I always wanted to go with the best possible guy I could every round. And then I realized sometimes they just go and just kind of play around,

let guys pass their guard, put them in arm bars, try things. And I'm like, oh, this is a very innovative method of training, different than I've been doing it. Yeah, I think training with people that are fairly new definitely has benefits. And one of the things, it's not good to do all the time, but one of the benefits is that you get to run many numbers on them. So say if you want to tighten up an arm bar, you can hit an arm bar anytime you want if you're rolling with a blue belt.

You can let him think that he's swept you. Exactly. And let him attempt to pass your guard and set up an arm bar. Get him thinking that he's really doing it. You can allow them to get to a five-step process. You allow them to get to step three and then work your way out of it and then try to tap them. Yeah, and that's what I watched Gary and Gordon that always let these guys come in

and do really well with them that they weren't, you know, but they were letting them. These guys afterwards would be like, oh, man, it's just so good with Gordon, and I tapped to do like eight times. So I'm like thinking, hmm, Gordon didn't tap you, huh? Well, it's a thing where they're also exercising their brain because you're controlling your ego and you're controlling this desire that you have to shut everything down

and show this person they can't do anything to you. You're allowing them to have a certain amount of success and even maybe they could be delusional a little bit about it. Yeah, I think that's really hard for athletes to do that. That's why I try to get my guys to some days like, hey, don't worry about it. Let guys put you in bad positions, but it's hard because we're so competitive. We just want to grind and always win everything. Marcelo Garcia said that too.

He said, though, to get better, it's very important that you open up your game in the school. Like at the academy, you have to open up your game. And he was talking about that, like you got to be loose. Yeah, I mean, after Gordon, he's probably like the second greatest of all time yeah right right man when that guy burst on the scene i was there in 2003 when he won abu dhabi and watching him uh choke out shaolin i was like holy shit that one was in brazil right yeah yeah dude his fucking back taking his arm drag to back taking was off the charts. And one of the things about Marcelo that was so fascinating was not just that he was so technical. He was so fast, but also that his legs.

Huge. Huge legs. Everyone always thought he was way smaller than he was because he was heavy because it's all in his legs and ass. Yes. Which is wild because that was an important part of his grappling game. It wasn't like the arms were just to get around your neck. Because he would bounce up so quick. It's almost like he would bounce off his ass and take your back.

I mean, kind of wild. But I mean, I think that's just how he was built, right? It's not like... It's got to be mostly genetic, I think, the way he's built, yeah. It doesn't seem like he did a lot of lifting weights with his legs, did he? I don't think so. I think it's, my guess would be it's probably natural. Because if you look at his upper body, he was never like a big, giant, muscular guy.

Not like a Pablo Popovich. No, that guy was the freakiest. Holy crap. Him and Pablo used to go to war all the time, remember? They were like in the finals of what, like three Abu Dhabis, I think? Yep, yep. Yeah, that guy was like a fucking, he was Aquaman, you know, like the comic book. He was Superman.

Yeah, that guy was just unreal looking. Shredded. But. Another guy's like that is Rodolfo Vieira. Oh, yeah. That guy's ridiculous. Like, whenever he fights in the UFC, first of all, I'm like, how the fuck are you 185 pounds?

Yeah. You're so not 185 pounds. Yeah, right. Some of these guys suck out so much weight. He's so big. That guy's so jacked. And he's such a fucking specimen. You see him at 185.

He's got giant delts and fucking traps. And you're like, wow, you're so big. Look at him. Look at him there. Holy crap. Dude, what the fuck? I mean, Vieira is so big. But when he fought Anthony Hernandez, it's interesting because I think cutting the

amount of weight that that guy cuts really fucks your endurance that guy went and he ended up tapping him too right he did he caught him in a guillotine but Hernandez in his last fight showed insane cardio like that dude's got wild cardio yeah that guy's tough I trained with him by a gym one time I know who he was and trained with him like oh this guy's pretty tough and then i talked to him after he's like oh yeah i'm in the ufc yeah he's tough and he's what i'm really impressed with him is everything is but it's his endurance man the fucking dude breaks people yeah like his endurance is exceptional and that's what how he got viera he just kept putting it on him and then when he got him in a fucking arm in Chiatina, I was like, there's no way. Yeah, right. There's

no way. And then he taps. You're like, what? Yeah, kind of like Jacare getting armbarred. It's crazy seeing some of these jiu-jitsu legends getting tapped out. But worse, that's another guy, Andre Muniz. He's fucking terrifying. Yeah, I don't know much about him, but he's done that

armbar a couple times, right? Dude, he's fucking good. He is good. His jiu-jitsu is nasty. When he broke Jacare's arm, I was like, no fucking way. Yeah, right? It's unreal seeing that. Yeah, right? It was unreal seeing Jacare lose to somebody by submission.

That's insane. Someone like him, though, maybe they focus too much on boxing. I bet his jiu-jitsu was nowhere near what it was when he was winning Abu Dhabi. It has to be, right? You would think, but who knows? But Jacare had fucking striking skills, too. Remember when he knocked out Yushin Okami? You're like, holy shit, Jacare has become a deadly stand-up fighter, too.

As good as he was on the ground, now he's fucking terrifying standing as well. Yeah, scary dude. A lot of good fighters now. The 70-pound division is stacked right now. What did you think of that Hamzat Shamayev-Gilbert Burns fight? That was amazing. It was like a draw. It was a 50-50.

I wouldn't have wanted to be judging it. That was such a war, though. Such a war. Yeah. I mean, real close to, I mean, I'd have to go back and watch it and score it. I went and watched it again. The other night I was working out and I watched it. I was like, oh, my God.

It was crazy. But Hamsat had him in trouble, too. They both had each other in trouble. And Hamsat put a lot of pressure on him, but Gilbert dropped him and had him badly hurt. And Gilbert hit him with more shots, too. When they looked at the overall significant strikes, Gilbert landed what a fight though that was such a fight I couldn't believe everyone's looking past Gilbert Burns like this guy is good crazy he was like four to one or

five I think five to one underdog or something crazy like that we're gonna find out stacked but that's how special Hamzat is oh yeah it showed he's the real deal yeah but the fact that people were looking past Gilbert Burns shows how good Chemaev is or how much people thought of him. Yeah. I think he's great

because Gilbert Burns is really good and he beat him. That's such a tough way right now. He can't fight like that though forever. Like that style

of like seek and destroy. Like that's not you have to be a little bit harder to hit for the elite of the division. Don't you think? Oh yeah. I think he was so used

to steamrolling people that this is kind of a wake-up call but it showed he had heart and stuff because that was my question was does he have heart and cardio and he showed he has both 100 he's a live dog i mean he's that's he's a real dog the way he fights you know when when he got clipped and dropped and immediately dives on the legs like he's he's not looking for a way out no he had fighting him he was he was there ready to go to war. And that's what you don't know until you're in a tough fight. Yeah. What do you think about him and Covington?

I think that's what they're going to try to do. Yeah, that's a good fight. That's a tough one. Maybe Cosmot. Either way, I don't know. Yeah, who knows who's going to win that fight? Who knows? Yeah, and what are they going to do with Bilal Muhammad, I wonder?

Because he just had that win. Amazing. He's super good, too. Amazing. Beat Vicente Luque. And not only did Bilal Muhammad beat Vicente Luque, but he beat Vicente Luque during Ramadan. So he's fasting. Oh, he was fasting? Yes! Yeah, Bilal's like a friend of mine. Not really close, but I'm

cool with him, so I didn't even know he's fast. Crazy. Yeah, he's observing Ramadan. Yeah, because most of my friends, a lot of them do it, but they don't fight during Ramadan. Super impressive. Wow, what a lunatic. I wonder how he does that, how he schedules the training and even the water consumption during the fight. Because the water is the hard part.

Right. Yeah. I think a lot of these guys, what they'll do, they'll train like- At night? Or they'll do a light one, like right before they eat, but not too heavy because they're dehydrated then they'll go right when it gets dark eat and then they'll digest a couple hours then go do like a hard one that makes sense or just one hard one some guys are saying they train at like midnight train to like two or three go and sleep as long as you can during the day so less time to fast that makes sense the thing about the water not being able

to drink any water while it's light out. That's the hardest on a professional athlete. Yeah, I didn't know that was a thing. So my trainer was Afghan, Muslim, Tariq Azim. We'd spar sometimes and he couldn't drink water after. I was like, oh man. A lot of times we would train like late in the day or at least he was going to spar me. That way he could drink after or not too long after. Well, I think they were very clever about that with certain fighters

where if they're observing Ramadan, they don't give them big fights during April. Yeah, most of those guys, they know not to book. Yeah, but I mean for Bilal, kudos to him for accepting a giant fight against a guy who knocked him out in the first encounter to a rematch. He was trying to get it back. And then also it's like a very high stakes fight because he's at the top of the food chain right now yeah he beats Wonderboy and then he beats Vicente Luque I mean there's a two gigantic wins maybe Maya too that's right before that that's right huge streak right now huge streak and I think he's like 10 and 1 on his last 11 fights I think he's it's that high yeah and then he has that one great matchup with, who the fuck did he?

Oh, Leon Edwards. That's right. Leon Edwards poked him in the eye. Oh, yeah. That was in no contest, right? That's right. That's right. So, I imagine Leon Edwards has to be next for title fight, I would think, right?

I believe he is. He has to be. Yeah, I think he is. That's a great fight. Yeah, that's going to be good. How great was that Nate Diaz fight? So good. When Nate cracked him in the last round and pointed at him, like, oh, my God.

I think he didn't realize how hurt he was. I think he thought he was faking it a little bit. Really? And then he realized it, and it was like, you know, he semi-recovered. But that was like, oh, you would have had him if you would have came right at him. He might have. Can you imagine how crazy that bit if Nate would have knocked him out? When he cracked him and rocked him, I remember thinking, oh, my God.

Yeah, that kid's a superstar now Yeah, when you go with him, he just gets swarmed. I mean, it's like well, you know, you know what that's like Yeah, but it's just like holy shit. This is like overwhelming. Is he gonna fight again? Yeah, he wants to he wants to do with you. I do one more. I think wants to do a bunch more He loves it. Really? He wants to keep fighting. Oh, I thought he said one more fight He has one more fight on a contract contract. Oh, on his UFC contract. So he's saying fight me so I can be a free agent or pay me a shitload of money. Well, he did say, I want to be on that Bellator Hawaii card.

He said that. He's a smart kid. He knows he's worth a shitload of money. Well, I hope he gets paid. Are they trying to do Conor and him? Because that's the fight to make. That would be a big fight. That's the fight to make, right?

Conor lost to Dustin, has a broken leg, takes all his time off. Nate lost to Leon, but it was exciting as fuck in that last round. So the lust is still there. That fight would be massive. That would be a massive fight to make right now. I know they could cut the winner in line for a title probably. 100%. If Nate wins, could you imagine if

Nate beats Conor and starts talking shit? Oh yeah, Nate's just so good at getting his name out there. You don't understand how smart these kids are sometimes. Well, that would be the big one for him. If he could put that together, holy fuck. Yeah, that would be a good fight. That's exciting, too.

Even if they're not in line for a title, even if it doesn't make sense. Like if people say, oh, they shouldn't be in line for a title. So what? They're the biggest draws. That's the thing. Like they were talking about like if Conor comes back,

Conor fighting the winner of Oliveira versus Gaethje. And everybody's like, fuck that. And, you know, Islam Makhachev was saying, no, that's my spot. And I'm like, yeah, but. But it sells. I mean, it's definitely not fair. It's not fair. But you could see why Dana would do that

because that's crazy sells. If he came back and said, I want to fight Oliveira, or if Gaethje beats him, it depends on who wins. Yeah. If Gaethje... Who fucking knows, man? Yeah, those are both interesting matchups because, you know. What do you think about him calling out Kamaru Usman, though?

I mean, he's jacked. He stands a shot. I would pick Usman, but, I mean, Conor can potentially knock anyone out in the first, like, two or three minutes. He's just so explosive, so accurate. Never know. But the thing with Usman is he doesn't get tired. Oh, yeah, I would definitely favor Usman on that.

He's so big, too. He's such a big 70. Yeah, he's kind of. A guy like Conor started his career at 45 and then goes to 55. I'm sure he feels great at 70. The natural frame, yeah. Yeah. It's different, man.

How much different do you think the sport would be if there was no weight cutting? It would be great because sometimes you gas out from weight cutting and it's like the most unfortunate part of fighting because you have to. It would be better for their brains too. It would be so much better. For everything. For your ability to take a shot.

It would be better for your endurance, better for your health, better for your organs. If we could find a way to get rid of it, it would be amazing, but we haven't been able to so far. It seems so crazy. They should just make it illegal.

Yeah, but how? How do you monitor it? See, when you make steroids illegal, you bring in USADA. You bring in the fucking water people. They make sure that you have water in your body. Kind of like 1FC is doing? I don't know how 1FC is doing it, but something along those lines. Some sort of a hydration test.

I hear people have ways to cheat that, too. Do they, though? That's what I hear. Not to the same extent. Maybe like 10 pounds versus 20, which that's probably i hear not not to the same extent maybe like 10 pounds versus 20 which that's probably a lot healthier yeah i mean i don't know if they do have well there's got to be a way to find out what a person optimally weighs like get get in shape and find out what you ought if the ufc had a deal and they champions, we're not going to strip your title, but we want to find out what is your actual best walk around fight weight.

And a lot of guys are going to lie, right? They're going to say, oh, 185. And you can put them on a scale. You're 215. Yeah. The fuck are you? Do you fight 170? You're 215.

There's a few of those guys. Oh, yeah. Adolfo Vieira. If you put him on a scale, he's not 185 pounds. No, he's 220 probably5 pounds no he's 220 220 yeah he's jacked he's so big when I stand next to him like how am I how am I heavier than you that makes zero sense there's 55 pounders you get over 200 they do they do these guys are just massive well did you see Aljamain Aljamain posted a picture of his scale he was 176 holy

shit he's almost my size 176 he, he's the 135-pound champ. That's 40 pounds. Damn, that's crazy. That's crazy. But if there's a way to say to a guy, well, Adesanya, I guarantee you, does not get much heavier than 85. I mean, if he gets 200, I'd be shocked. Yeah, because didn't he weigh in super light, I think, under when he fought 205s?

Yeah, I believe when he fought 205, he was under 200. Or in the neighborhood. He was definitely under 205. But the point is, like, he's not a guy who cuts a lot of weight. He's just a guy that's technical and accurate and so good. So he would be an exception because he's not a guy who starves himself to make the weight. But if you found out what he weighed and you said,

Israel, what is your best optimal walk-around fight weight? And he said, it's 195. They go, okay, you're the champ at 195 now. No more weight cutting. Great. And you could do that to a bunch of different guys. Yeah, but you'd probably have more weight.

You'd have more weight. Because there's those 15-pound guys, so you kind of get stuck in the middle. But if you had 10 pounds, you could get people in the range of 10 pounds. If you gave them like six months, if you said, okay, your walk around weight is 180, but we need you to get to 175. Can you get to 175 and you could fight for the title and have like a title every 10 pounds. So you allow people to cut a little bit of weight, but no radical 30 pound

weight cuts, none of that crazy shit where you're shuffling to the scale do you ever see travis luter when he fought anderson he didn't make the weight i'll never forget what he looked like he couldn't lift his legs up man he was shuffling as he was walking his lips were like cracked and just dried out and bleeding i was like holy fuck man yeah and it was brutal like sometimes the weight cuts worse than the fight you know if it's a bad weight cuts and then sometimes your training partners you're trying to get the weight off and you're like oh man this is uh this is not fun this is not healthy hopefully i don't kill this guy in the sauna yeah that's the problem right it was

like you really are getting close to death you push yourself close to death and some of these huge weight cuts and it's uh it's a scary thing do you think it's possible to stop it though do you think it'll always be a part of the sport i don't think it's possible to stop it, though? Do you think it'll always be a part of the sport? I don't think it's possible to stop it. I love what you're saying and the idea, but I think how much money and how much effort and how much rules that would be to make that happen. I think it can be done, man. Really? I think it's almost like saying you can't stop people from taking steroids.

Well, they definitely did. Or at least cut it back. They definitely cut it back. Yes, you could cut back weight cutting. I fully think you could cut it in half, but I don't think you could 100% get rid of it. Well, cutting it in half would be pretty fucking good. Yeah, I think at 1FC, I think they've cut it way back. But some guys are still getting it.

They're doing it a little bit, but they're not cutting those 20, 30-pound cuts. They're doing like 10. Have you gone over there and watched an event live? No, I would like to, but haven't. They're doing them with full crowds now? I think so. Things are so weird in Singapore and Asia still. Who knows? Oh, that's right. Singapore was the one when they were showing on television crowds now? I think so. Things are so weird in Singapore and Asia still. Who knows?

Oh, that's right. Singapore was the one when they were showing on television where they got everybody locked down. I think it's China's lockdown right now. Oh, Shanghai. Shanghai, that's right. Not Singapore. Shanghai, sorry. Yeah, you've seen some of those videos.

That's wild. They're beating people on the streets. Wild. And the people are like, it's all food. People are starving out. They're starting to fight back a little bit. I watched one from Singapore where a guy was fishing with a drone. So he is so hungry.

There's a koi pond below. So he has a drone. It dangles a bait over the water and dips it into the water. A koi grabs a bait. It hooks the koi and then lifts it up in the air and carries it to his apartment. Have you seen it? I haven't. It's so wild. We'll end it with this. You need to air and carries it to his apartment. Have you seen it? I haven't. It's so wild.

We'll end it with this. You need to see this because it's so ridiculous. Yeah, it's definitely, what, two and a half years, and they're still having lockdowns. Wild. I don't even think there's many deaths. I think there's something like three deaths in all of Singapore, and they're doing this.

So is it even about COVID or is it about control? Who knows, right? Who knows? Also, it's like these people that died, how old were they? What was their condition? Like this is the COVID that we're experiencing today. The Omicron is so much milder than what were there unless they have a new strain. So check this out.

Can you give me some volume on this? Look at this. This guy's got a lure. You got to click on the video. That's on the drone. Oh, it has terrible music attached to it. But look at this. That's crazy.

He catches a koi and brings it up to his apartment with a drone. Imagine if that fish fell and it hit someone in the head and killed him. Died by fish. Oh, there's no one on the streets anyway, so you don't have to worry about it. Yeah, I don't think you're allowed on the streets, right? It's like full lockdown. Full lockdown. You have to worry about it. Yeah, I don't think you're allowed on the streets, right? It's like full lockdown. Full lockdown. You have to be trapped in your house.

So this clever fella or woman or non-binary person, look what they do. That's fucking genius shit. If you're hungry, that's pretty clever. Bro, that's genius shit. All right, Jake Shields, I guess we should wrap this up. People want to buy your jiu-jitsu shirts. Americanfight.com. And Jake Shields on Instagram and Twitter.

All those fun places. Now, you know, I got the high rollers. Hopefully that will be on Fight Pass soon. Check that out, I guess. Are you willing to do one of those? Would you get barbecued and do a match? I've done a bunch of them. Have you?

Oh, you barbecued when you did it? I did with the Diego one. It was just like lit. Oh, that's right. We talked about it. Yeah, I was just like so lit. I got like scared right before. But then I calmed down

once I started doing jujitsu with second nature. But for a second, I'm like, oh crap, what did I do? A lot of people say it makes them focus more. I'm one of those people.

I like it. I like rolling when I'm high. Yeah, see, I don't do it often. So for me, I was okay once I got going, but it just took me a second. Well, I'm glad we finally did this. Cool, Joe.

Great talking. Always good to see you, brother. And we'll talk to you soon. All right. Bye, everybody. Bye, everybody. Bye, everybody.