The Joe Rogan Experience - JRE MMA Show #128 with Kamaru Usman

Episode Date: September 2, 2022

Joe sits down with the former UFC Welterweight World Champion Kamaru Usman.

the Joe Rogan experience just gotta make sure that you saw the whereabout is up to date is that what you just did I can't believe they woke you up at 530 in the fucking morning oh yeah that's ridiculous they don't care but that's not even not caring.

That's, like, negligent. It's like if you have an athlete and the athlete has to rest and recover and you're waking them up at 5.30 in the morning, you break their sleep cycle. You're affecting their training. You could cause an injury. A lot of shit could be wrong. But I think for them it's, oh, well, we're trying.

Well, I don't know because I'm not them. But, you know, I think some people, fighters feel like, oh, we're going to catch them. It's 530 in the morning. We're going to catch them before they do anything, which is. Well, Ali was saying that it's EPO, that it's like short lasting. So if people take it and they take it at night, it'll be out of their system. By the time you saw the shows up, if they show up at 9am,

then, you know, I wouldn't fucking know. Maybe he was like, Ali, how do you know that information? Does he know? Well,

you know, if you're a manager, you, you're dealing with at least one cheater. Yeah. If you have 50 clients clients there's a guy in there that's doing something funny yeah yeah what percentage of fighters do you think are doing something do I think nowadays I mean it's it's tough it's tough I because I never really I never focused on that I never worried about it but i i did know that you know

yeah some fighters you could just you could see back in the day like hey this is not normal right last year i saw you you didn't look like that right and yeah so i think yeah back in the day back in the day pre-usada oh you could say you could say I would say a good maybe 25% to 30%. I think before you saw it, it was higher than that. I think there was a time where it was, I don't know what the percentage was, but I think it was a lot of fighters. And then it got real squirrely with the testosterone replacement shit. Yeah, I do remember that time. That was the dumbest time ever.

The fact that they didn't think that through and they just let people game the system like that. It's funny to me because I get it all the time now. Of course. Like people accuse me all the time. And I haven't really told the story. So one day I saw people kept tagging me in this video. And it was just some fucking guy, some dumbass that's on YouTube that that swears he can spot people that do, you know, PDs.

Oh, it's probably more plates, more dates. Maybe. Yeah, I don't know. Derek, he's been on the podcast before. Yeah. So he's like, yeah, I know that guy's doing it because I can see the marks on him and stuff like that. And so he starts to point, they, they start pointing out cause I have, uh, like, like five scars on my stomach, like, you know, like burn, like discoloration on my stomach. And it, and he starts starts they start pointing at that and he starts talking

about it and and making up this whole theory and it kind of it kind of hurt my feelings a little bit because it should make you happy i was okay so let's here's the story i was a little self-conscious about it because so this is what happened i was in college this was my I want to say junior year sophomore junior year going into my junior season and actually I think it was after my junior season so I I started getting these I got it like a mole on like my stomach and I got one like on my my hand and I I'm one of those I'm kind of like a clean freak. Like I shower, you know, after practice right away. So I start scratching it and then it starts bleeding.

So I'm like, fuck, that's not a regular. I thought it was like a pimple. That's not a regular like a zit or something like that. So then I, you know, over time it was like maybe it was like five little. It was like tiny. You could barely see them. So I'm like, you know what? I'm going maybe he's like five little was like tiny you could barely see them So I'm like, you know what? I'm gonna ask the doc. We have a team doctor I'm gonna ask him about it. So I went in for a physical and then I went before the season I asked him hey

You know I have this right here. I don't know what they are So he looks at him. He goes. Oh, these are Non cancerous moles. They're just little bitty moles. You know, it's very, very common. I'm like, shit, not for me. I don't know if that's common for me. He's like, yeah, they're very common. I'm like, yeah, well, how can I get rid of them?

I try to scratch them and they bleed. And he's like, yeah, you don't want to do that. What we could do is I can burn them off. And I'm like, okay, fuck it, let's do it. Because, hey, spring break was going to come up. Like, I started. I started. I'm lifting now.

I got a body now. You know, I'm a junior and I look jacked. So I'm like, spring break is coming. I want to look jacked. I want to look good. You know, so I don't get walking around with those. Fuck no. So he's like, I can burn them off. So I want to look good, you know, so I don't walking around with those fuck. No So he's that guy I can burn him off. So he burns him off with that thing nitrogen or something like that. Mm-hmm

So he burns them and then he goes hey Those are gonna fall off in a couple days, you know, just give him time so I'm like, okay, but I was so like I Was still training heavily during the summer because I was just like an addict of wrestling. I wanted to, for me, I wanted to catch up to everybody and I wanted to exceed everybody. So this was my time, the summer, that was my time for me to catch up. So my dumb ass, I go back the next day,

I go to school and back to the school and I go in and I go drill I go wrestle I couldn't stop I was just training all summer so I wrestled and I didn't think anything of it like okay they just burned those but nothing has happened yet and so I wrestled and then later that evening I'm sitting in my I go I get down I get in the, and I'm showering, and all of a sudden, it's just burning down there, and I look down, and I had scraped them off. So as soon as he burned them, he said,

don't do anything, they're going to fall off on their own. But my dumb ass wrestled, and it rubbed up against it, and now they all fell off. So then they scarred it, because now I was out for seven days, putting Neosporin on it just so they could heal, and then they scarred it because now I was like out for like seven days like putting Neosporin on it just so they can heal and then they scarred over. So I have those from just that moment.

So then this fucking guy is like, oh, he's doing PEDs. Look, look, he's got the marks on his stomach and it hurt my feelings. I'm like, I'm like one of those guys

who I'm like, I don't even think about PEDs because my work, even if I don't care, I probably have dealt with someone that was cheating or competed against someone that was cheating. But my work will far exceed all of that. And so when I see idiots online or say, oh, yeah, I know for a fact he's doing PED. I'm like, have you ever been to fucking Africa? Have you been to Africa? There's a lot of Francis Ngannou's walking around.

There's a lot of guys like me just walking around. And because of the work and because of the way that I fight, they're like, oh, no, he's definitely got to be doing something because they can't explain why you are the way you are, why your performance exceeds what their their mind is mentally capable of there's a photo of you We're on top of the cage after one of the victories It looks preposterous like if I didn't know any better I'd be like that motherfuckers on some shit It's genetics are real man. Oh,. Genetics are real.

Everybody did not get the same deck of cards. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that one. Look at that one. Come on, son. If I saw that shit, if someone said, do you think this guy's on the juice? I'm like, highly likely. Yeah, adrenaline.

Everything. And I think this is right after the Masvidal fight. Oh, man. And I just, yeah. Was that your sweetest victory? after the Masvidal fight. Oh, man. And I just, yeah. Was that your sweetest victory? The second Masvidal fight? It's tough. Tough to call. That one was so shocking.

No, I think the first Covington fight was probably the sweetest. Just to stop him? Yeah. yeah probably the sweetest just to stop him yeah and i was dealing like i deal you deal with so much we deal with so much things going into fights before fights and i don't think people care people don't care about but i don't think people understand so to make it to that fight just to get in there to step in there on fight day nowadays i'm so grateful because you deal with so much from family from relationships to to children to injuries to finances all of that and coaching to where by the time you actually step in there it's like like peaceful this is like i'm grateful to be in here

that i actually made it in here so i think um that Covent and Fire was probably the first one was probably the sweetest. It was just too much. There was so much shit talking. He puts people in a crazy state of mind. Yeah. Because he goes dark, man. He goes after your family. He goes after your friends.

He goes after past relationships. He just tries to find Anything that he can light on fire Yeah, there's a there's an art to that. I mean some guys some guys it works for but it's For me what I would love to do is ask And that hopefully in the future. I can do that and just sit down with these guys and Ask them like what how did you feel after that? Like what,

like, are you human? You come, you gotta be human too. You gotta feel something after you go that far. And let's say you don't win. You do lose. How do you feel sitting at home?

Can't be good. That no, you can't like, I know how bad you feel losing. I've lost now twice. So I know how bad you feel losing. I've lost now twice. So I know how bad that feels at home. How do you feel when you got your ass kicked and you did all of this shit talking? All of this and it didn't work.

All negative too. Really negative. Oh, yeah. There's a dark energy and a dark aura that just surrounds that when you do that. Yeah. Yeah. And then when you do lose, people get so happy. Oh, yeah.

When you talk so much shit and you're so mean and nasty and then you lose, people get so happy. Conor. Conor, the first Conor. Khabib, yeah. Oh, my God. Yeah. Oh, man. That was like Khabib, I think.

Khabib went from like maybe two to three million followers to like 12 overnight when he was on top of him pounding on him go let's talk now yeah let's talk now let's talk and he's just punched him in the face he's got khabib's got some savage moments oh man i think one of my favorite i think i don't know if it was it might have been the edson barbosa fight or some other fight where he was he was on top of the guy. He was holding him with one hand, holding his face, and he was beating his face with the other hand. I was like, this is the most savage shit I've ever seen.

Michael Johnson, he did that too. Michael Johnson, that was better sweet for me. That one was hard to watch because Mike was like my training partner at that time. We were really like training together. And Mike was on the upswing because mike had just killed poirier yeah and he was mike was really having a great great run i got very offended when they were talking about poirier and they're like the i

think it was stephen a smith was talking about one like accidental loss I forget how he put it to Michael Johnson. One inexplicable loss to Michael Johnson. I'm like, what the fuck are you talking about? Like Michael Johnson's a savage. Michael, I think is one of the most dangerous lightweights. He's dangerous as fuck, man. When he's on, when he knocked out Poirier, he dinged Khabib too. He had Khabib and a little, a little Rocky for a

second there. And maybe the only guy to ever do it. The weird thing about Michael Johnson is he doesn't look the part. He looks long limbs. They look skinny, but he's got speed and power till this. Well, until Leon, Michael's the only guy that's ever dropped me, sat me down and and well i felt worse after that than i do now after the leon situation really yeah why because he he beat my ass my my beat my ass that's bars it was it was early on i think it was like i was like maybe in the second year of training mma and michael was getting ready for a fight he's in the ufc at this point and he's he was like maybe in the second year of training MMA and Michael was getting ready for a fight He's in the UFC at this point and he's he was like maybe two three weeks out three weeks out and Mike's on Because he's Mike and that's another thing I love about Mike is Mike likes to train

It might not be all the things that he should be training but my gloves to train he loves a spar and so I just I Think was in between my first and second fight. I just came off of my first win. So I had a couple weeks off. So I'm coming in and I'm sparring Michael Johnson. And he's three weeks out from his fight. Mike's on at this point. And we're sparring and sparring.

And, you know, I'm trying to fake it. I'm the bigger guy. So I'm trying to like, you know, I didn't find a groove. I didn't have a groove at this point. I was just a guy who could wrestle and throw punches. And Mike is moving his feet. He's touching me. He's touching me.

He starts slow. He starts slow. Then he starts picking up the pace. And then I was like, I'm gasping for air. And we're fucking two minutes in. And he's still just peppering me. And then now he starts to land shots. And they're getting harder and harder and harder.

Now we're three minutes in. And I'm waiting for the bell to go off. But no, we're still stuck in here. And at that point, I would spar with headgear. So I'm like, no, fuck, this headgear is getting in my way. That's what's causing it. But no, Mike was just beating my ass. So I take the headgear off.

And we're still going. And he just puts a combination on me. Bing, b bing sits me down bing and I fall like on my hand and I roll over and this how fucked up it is Rashad had the whole thing recorded and had it on his phone forever and so I fell and I'm we're home that night Rashad's replaying it and he's showing me how I fell and I'm we're home that night and we're shots replaying it and he's showing me how I fell And I'm like no I just you know I slipped and I thought you know he's like no no use Use down because you fell on your hand and you kind of rolled over like so it wasn't like I was out But it was like he sat me down good. He beat my ass to this day Well until Leon Edwards.

That was the only time I've ever been sat down. And that bothered you more? Yeah, it bothered me more because I didn't have an answer for it. These are the moments that's really haunted me, that have really messed with me, was when there was nothing I could do about it. There's that. The first one was Rashad. Rashad beat me up one time to where I had to rethink what I was doing. So I think I was about a year in my career and this was around similar times. And Rashad was like really traveling a lot.

Rashad was a man. Rashad was traveling, doing shows, commentating, you know, maybe do a movie here and there and I was living with Rashad. So at this time, he had like, he was a stretch.

He was gone for like three weeks and I'm training every day, twice a day. I'm like, this dude's not fucking, he hasn't really been training, hasn't been going to the gym. I know if he comes to wrestling,

I cannot wrestle him. But I'm like, I'm striking now. I'm starting to hit people. Like, no. He comes in, I'm'm gonna put it on him you know so i built this whole experience in my head i'm like i'm gonna put it on rashad let him know little bro is hey little bro's learning some shit and and he hadn't trained three three weeks four weeks and so he comes in town, he comes back and we go to the gym and usually, and he would hate that I'm saying this,

but I had the hardest time waking Rashad up in the morning. He would not leave his room. His room was on the other side of the house. He would not leave his room. We had practice at 10 30. We have a 30 minute drive. He would not come out of his room until after 10 a.m and so i would always i go bang on his door hey you you up you know try to get him out before 10 and he just would not do it

and so i would drive us to the gym you know i'm a little bro i take care of the house when he's not there and you know so i drive us to the gym. And the whole time in my head, I had the experience. I'm like, yeah, I'm going to fuck him up today. He's been gone for three weeks. I'm about to show him all the new ninja shit that I've learned. I'm going to put it on him. And I know he hasn't been training. So we get to the gym, and it just happens to be sparring day.

So I'm smiling. I'm like, yeah, this is going to be the day. I'm going to show him, little bro, learn some shit. And I'm on the other side of the room, and the first couple of rounds, I kind of go with guys that would go at my pace. And so I think it was like maybe the third round. And Rashad, he comes in. He takes his sweet-ass time.

This is when he was at 205. He takes his time, and he gets ready and all this and and then he's going and i'm the whole time i'm eyeballing him on the other side of the gym i'm eyeballing him like yeah i'm gonna go with him today so now it's the third round i'm like yeah rishad let's go let's let's go he's like all right and this was mma gloves and this was back there in the black zillions we we didn't really start using the seven ounce poofy gloves we would use the ufc mma gloves and so rashad had his gloves on and we start moving and we're going we're going and i'm just like um like all right let me try some shit i know now so i throw i throw like a one two or something like that and i just kind of

hit his hands and you know he's moving with me move with me And I'm like, let me ramp it up on him. I know he's not in shape Let me ramp up on him. So I'm picking up the pace I'm picking up the pace and now I couldn't hit him and then he starts hitting me But he was hitting me a little bit like with a little bit more conviction than I anticipated than I thought I was like Why is he and he's hitting me and I can stop it. And now he starts fucking me up. And he's beating on me. And I'm like, no, okay, let me go to my wrestling.

I know I could always get him there. And I shoot for takedowns. He stuffed them all, like two or three of them. He stuffs them. Then he hits me, he starts hitting me again. He has me against the wall and he's just beating on my body. Then he shoots for a takedown. He takes me down.

And I'm just like, fuck. There was nothing i could do i just i didn't have the knowledge to really defend myself and he mounts me and that was one of the worst things at that point 205 rashad on top of you is is is bad because you know you could see it in his fights when he was at 205. Like when he mounts guys, he'll crucify guys. That's like his thing. And he crucified me. He beat my ass so bad. Usually I drive us to practice and I drive us home. He knew he beat my ass that bad.

He drove. He's like, yeah, let me drive. Let me drive home. So he drove. I was sitting in the passenger seat and I'm just looking at the window. I couldn't make eye contact with him. I'm looking out the window the whole time like, holy shit. And then we get home, and usually when we're home, I'll make lunch or we'll get lunch.

This day we didn't get lunch. I usually sit on the couch and maybe watch old fights or watch something like that in the living room. But no, I was in my room the whole time. I was like, no, i'm not coming out and and he would just randomly come in open the door hey you all right you good i'm like yeah i'm good man i'm good i'm good he's like all right you want something to eat like no i'm okay i'm okay i felt like he purposely knew he beat the out of me and then how he just had to check on me all through the day to make sure that i was okay but it messed with me because i couldn't do anything about it i couldn't defend myself i didn't have the knowledge to yeah and that was what was so hard about my first

professional loss as well as when i got submitted i didn't have the knowledge because i wasn't doing jiu-jitsu like that i didn't know what I and how to defend myself at that point so those were was hard this one not so much because I knew exactly you know where I went wrong and it wasn't like I like Rashad beat my ass there was nothing I could do this one that wasn't the case so you know this is a little easier to deal with you were saying that it's a almost a little bit of a relief yeah yeah it was it's weird it's weird to really explain but it's you get to a certain point to where people start putting expectations on you they start like oh yeah you're gonna do this you're gonna do that yeah you're

you're this you're that to where i didn't get into it for all of that i was never i was never attached to the title now as weird as that sound i didn't i was i was never attached to it it wasn't like oh i'm champion i gotta hold on to this i to hold on to this. I got to hold on to this. I got to hold on to this. No, and I've said it before and I continue to say it. In my head, each and every time I was fighting for that title or defending that belt, I was fighting for the title. I was a contender in my head. I felt like that. I have to go contend for this belt each and every time. So because I feel like when you're defending, you're tight.

Now you're on defense. You're not thinking offense. You just want anything to hold on to this anything to hold on to this I was never really like that so everyone got felt like kind of started putting expectations like yo oh you're about to break this record I didn't know I didn't even know what Anderson Silva's record was until like before last fight where everyone started saying oh yeah you're about to break the Anderson Silva's record or you're about to tie this. Yo, you already broke George St. Pierre's record.

I don't care. I don't give a shit. The last time I cared about the number was when I was 5-1 and I was about to get into the UFC. I was like, yeah, I'm 5-1. Damn, Rashad went on like a 15-fight win streak one time. Damn, I wish I could do something that great. But Rashad even told me at that point, he's like, just take your fight at a time.

As long as you worry about that next fight and that next fight and that next fight, don't add up. And so, yeah, it was almost like a relief of expectations of everyone's pressure. Oh, yeah, you're the GOAT this, you're the GOAT that. That's relative. That's a relative.

Like, it's hard to argue that situation because George St. Pierre was the greatest in his error with what he had to deal with the opposition he had to deal with he was the greatest hands now and You know when George St. Pierre kind of moved aside Woodley was was that guy and kind of moved aside, Woodley was that guy. And then Robbie had a stint there, Robbie was that guy. So, and Pat Miletic had a stint when he was that guy. So did Matt Hughes.

And so to say, oh yeah, that guy's the GOAT, that's relative because styles make fights, you know, and you can never really tell what would transpire if this guy goes with that guy. Styles make fights and it's also guys are building on the work that was done before them. Because if you look at the fighters from 1993, that's the best example. Because it's one of the rare sports where we get to see a stark contrast between the early days of the UFC and the current days.

If you go back and watch basketball in 1993, it's pretty similar to basketball today. There might be better athletes today people are better at everything today but it's still basketball the ufc is almost unrecognizable you watch the way people fought back then versus the way people fight now i mean there's no comparison you got to go to like ufc 12 you see vitor's debut and you go okay well now we're looking at like what a real modern mixed martial artist looks like. And then there's a few guys along the way that were outliers that were much better than everybody else.

And now you have a whole roster filled with people like that. And when you watch the development of fighters, every fighter learns from the people that are in their gym, and they learn from the people that they see fighting. And so everybody of today, you have Tyron Woodley's videos to watch. You have the fights that George St. Pierre had to watch. You had all these different fights that you can watch, and you can learn from all these. The Anderson Silva fights, the Jon Jones fights.

There's so much knowledge that's accumulated in the minds of the athletes now, and that's built on the people that came before them. Yeah, of course, they have to do the work. Yeah, of course, the thing that's most impressive about a person like yourself is that in spite of all this knowledge out there and in spite of all these athletes, you are still dominating. There's so, the level's so high. There's so many great guys. I think the level of your competition was higher than the level of anybody else's competition because I think that everybody's better now. Oh, absolutely. I think when you look at the guys that you faced and you

look at Gilbert and you look at Colby and you look at Masvidal, you look at all these guys that you've paced, man, that's a serious resume of hard-hitting fighters, like really, really talented, really skillful fighters. Yeah, I started, when you start watching, and like I mentioned, I started doing research when I started getting more and more into MMA. And, yeah, I'm like damn Joe had hair Joe was Joe was 20 years ago man that's crazy to me nuts and that's how long you've been in the sport you've been covering well I started in 97 as a post-fight interviewer yeah

I saw that wild that yeah and some of the questions you'd ask, too, was wild. I'm like, damn. And the guys are fresh off the fights and having interviews. But even then, you were on it. You were on the money. And I was like, damn, Joel's been doing this for a minute. Bro, when I used to do it back then, I was on a television show. And they would talk to me like I was out doing porn. They're like, why are you doing that?

That's what it was like. It was like I was involved in something seedy. I know. It felt, I see that. I can see that. I can see how they felt that. I was explaining to them, I'm like, this is the greatest sport in the world. It's going to be the number one sport in the world. They're like, get the fuck out of here.

Like, what are you talking about? I go, it's more exciting than any other sport in the world. Yeah. You just have to watch it. Yeah, and watching the evolution, because it was almost like guys came in with one skill, and they were battling to see which skill would dominate. And then you had the mixture, the guys that would come in now with two skills. Like Marco Julas.

Yeah. And then you have guys like Rashad who come in with like two, three skills who could wrestle, who could box. And can knock you out. And can knock you out. And it's like, wow. And then, you know, you have guys like Chuck, you know, but Chuck just wanted to stand. But he had the wrestling to stop you from taking him down.

Yeah. And then, you know, the sport just kind of starts to shift and change into where guys are just ninja kids. Not just guys, kids are ninjas now. Yeah. Some of these guys coming up, you know, I mean, 10 fights in and you're watching me like, gee, this guy looks like a world champion. They're so good. There's so much talent now. And also the eyes on them, there's so many more eyes. So there's so much more attention. So there's so much more, it's so much more intensity to a lot of these up-and-comers.

Oh, yeah. There's a couple of some young guys that I just watch. I'm just like, holy shit, these guys are going to be a pro. I have one of my training partners named Archie. He was a wrestler at Wyoming. I think he was like a three-time conference champion for Wyoming and then went to national national qualifier and just strong explosive wrestler but he just wants to knock you out he will just stand

and bang with you the whole time until he does knock you out and i watch these guys try i'm like man these guys are going to be the future and we have a young kid it's a young nigerian kid named adamu he trains over at Kill Cliff with Henry Hooft. And I watch, this guy spars with the world champion, and he's green. Spars with the world champion, and he's kicking him in the face, and he's just doing everything.

I'm like, what the f? Yeah, I need to hurry up and get out of this before all these guys get to me, and decide I can't be the butt of their jokes. Like, you don't want to be that guy. Well, we were talking about staying off social media after the loss. Yeah. Like, you can't read them memes.

It's funny to me. The thing is, everyone expected me. I feel like you get to a certain point. It's the weirdest thing to me. It's like I don't understand how people just want to see the demise of someone else. It's like people are fiending for that. They stay and they sit there. Yeah, but that's because you're so much more successful than them. Yeah, that's what I don't understand.

The average person. Yeah. The idea of being the welterweight champion of the world. Yeah, the idea of being the welterweight champion of the world you walk into an arena and you raise your arms and 18,000 people go yeah That's that's alien. Yeah, that's you might as well be living on the moon. That doesn't even make sense to most people Yeah, I see someone like you and you're killing it and you're going on this unbeaten streak and you're dominating everyone. You dominate Tyrone Woodley to win the title. You knock out Masvidal with one punch.

Holy shit. It's wild. So they just want you to fall apart because they can't compare to you. Yeah, and it's, you know, I recognize that. And even after the last time we spoke, I'm not on social media like that. I'll post something here and there. Some days I'll go a few days and not even look at it. Some days I'll,

you know, post. And that's, I guess a good and a bad thing with the, the new algorithm that kind of Instagram has is you don't just see everybody's shit. You know, now it's like maybe like your friends that constantly you talk to,

you see their stuff. And so, you know, I'll get on, my daughter's doing something cute or I feel like it's something cool. I want to share. maybe like your friends that constantly you talk to you see their stuff and so you know I'll get on my daughter's doing something cute or I feel like it's something cool I want to share I'll get on I'll post that and then I'll you know get off but I feel like and it's even making people more upset because they expected me to feel a certain way that I'm not feeling how do you know what they expected? because ice people make fake pages with my It was hilarious to me it was this was the funniest shit to me it was it was a few maybe couple hundreds would make a

Create go out of their way to create a whole page with because when I was knocked out I was like my eyes were open which was the craziest thing to me. You know, now that I've watched the fight over maybe like 10 times and my eyes were open, which is weird. And so people would like screen grab that and make a fake page with that as the avatar and have a page dedicated to that.

Like you got knocked out, you got this, you got, for them to take time out of their day, I'm like, shit shit i'm special like it's but mostly people that don't have a good life it's it's weird if they did have a good life i don't i don't have the time to do that shit how do you have time to do that shit yeah i don't have time to scroll through is that rather than go out of your way to make a page and and just because but they think that that bothers me. But it's funny to me. It was funny.

It made you laugh? Yeah, it made me laugh. Did you see the photo of me interviewing you in the middle of the head kick? I almost posted that yesterday. Oh, shit. I was going to post that. I was like, Joee gotta get that interview that was so rough no it was um what an experience though what do you remember after the head kick oh man this is uh

i was dreading talking about this but uh not in a bad way, but it's funny to me. So the fight is going and there is a zone that I've learned to put myself in. And my coaches can kind of attest to this, like, because I do it even in training. to this like because i do it even in training um there's a way that i train that i practice to where i i try to get myself into the zone which is is as similar to a fight experience as i can be and to where i try not to be bothered by anything that's going on and my body has adjusted and gotten used to this so in the round, the fight's going on, and boom, that situation happens. He hooked my legs, and this is my bad knee.

Well, my not-so-good knee, but both of them aren't the greatest. So I'm like, okay, let me hip him through. So I tried to hip him through, but he just had great position. Kudos to him. And I get taken down. That I probably was more upset about, giving up that takedown. I was like, fuck. I gave up a takedown.

So we get done, and he takes it back, and I'm just chilling and waiting for the bell, and the bell goes off, and I get up. And I didn't realize this until I watched the fight back over I get up and I was kind of smiled You know, I get up and I jog back to my corner But I was I look at it and I'm like, okay. I know that's where I was at at that time I was in that zone to where I'm unbothered by whatever is happening. I Am going to make this be whatever i want it to be and so the next round i just take off and i just start kind of wailing on him and and so by the fifth round i kind of

have him in a spot to where i'm just like i never think okay yeah i've got the fight one let me just coast let me hold on to him and win. I never think that. I want to, if I can get the finish, I'm going to try to get that finished. And I want to do something spectacular. You know, I'm like, okay, we're going to take a risk here. We're going to do something great. And I remember, and this is the great thing about Trevor Whitman, in the training camp, we work on certain techniques to kind of put him where you want him and get him out of there.

Like even in the Masvidal fight, like everyone, oh, the knockout just happened. No, I set him up for the knockout. People didn't realize. I did the same sequence in the first round that I did to finish him. And so I start that with Leon, you know, because I've kind of got Leon in a place now to where I, you know, I could kind of really kind of dictate whatever I wanted to do. And so we get him, I get him up and I think her breaks us from the, from the cage. So we're,

we're moving and I'm trying to set him up and I'm trying to get his feet moving. Uh, I wasn't doing the greatest of job, which was, this is all on me. And, and I'm trying to get his feet moving. You see me changing levels. this is all on me and and i'm trying to get his feet moving you see me changing levels and what i wanted to do is set him up and i was going to throw the punches that he couldn't see and i wanted to sit him down and get him out of there i wanted to throw him with conviction and really like i did with masvidal and get him out of there and so i'm like okay what i'm gonna do is i'm gonna shake left shake right and then i'm gonna let him go but i gotta get him moving first and i didn't do a great job of that and so I'm moving moving I'm like okay I got him

set up all right which I really didn't I shake left I shake right and I'm sitting in the ambulance and they're asking me uh do you know where you're at that's what you remember? You remember waking up in the ambulance? Yeah, I was awake, but I remember it coming to in the ambulance. So you had been awake because you were walking around, but you were still gone. Oh, I was good. Yeah, I was good. I watched the fight over. I'm good. I was talking.

I talked to Trevor. I talked to everyone. Apparently, because you know you go back, and then you go in the medical tent, and they take care of you and all of that. You don't remember any of that and they talked to me I talked to my family I hugged everyone cuz he's on video and everything I Remember sitting it was like Leon gave me like a 20-minute nap

Which was it was I about, and I was laughing hysterically in the hospital because I had to go in just to get scanned and all of that, which everything was fine. So it's like immediately I come to, I'm in the ambulance, they're asking me, do you know where you are? I'm like, yeah, Salt Lake City, UFC 278. They're like, what's your date of birth?

I'm like, I answer, I'm five, you know, and they were like, wow, perfect. I answered everything perfectly like oh we still need to take you to the um to the hospital just to get you scanned and everything like that i was like all right fine so we go to the hospital to get scanned and everything but i was already good i was okay i wasn't i was maybe disappointed that i lost but i wasn't like bummed. Like the first loss that I had in my career,

that one fucked with me. That one beat at me. Is that because you didn't know whether or not you would ever be able to make it? Yeah. It was the uncertainty of the future. Right. And also because there was nothing I could do with that.

I couldn't defend myself because I didn't have the knowledge of it. Right. That was what hurt me the most is I'm like, There was nothing I could do with that. I couldn't defend myself because I didn't have the knowledge of it. That was what hurt me the most. I'm like, because when I was in that position, I could have fought it. Because I was standing up with the guy, a backpack, for almost a minute. And I had no idea what to do. And I wanted to go back to the ground and try to fight it.

But in my head, I said, shit, I don't know what I'm doing down there if I go down there anyways. So now I'm just going to stay up here until I eventually tap. But this one was like, okay, I don't know what I'm doing down there if I go down there anyways, so now I'm just gonna stay up here until I eventually tap And but this one was like okay, I know my mistakes. That's one thing I've said. I'm very very honest with myself I Am honest with myself to where I'm like shit. Okay. He got me. He got me, you know I didn't do a good job of what I wanted to do and He got me. I didn't do a good job of what I wanted to do, and he got me. And I don't like the notion of everyone saying, oh, he got lucky. Yeah, he got lucky.

Yeah, of course. But luck to me is not what everyone is saying. Luck is when preparation meets opportunity. That's luck to me. You can't tell me that Leon didn't train that kick. Of course he did. I'm not even a southpaw and I trained that kick. I know he trained that kick.

And there's a video. I don't know if that was before the fight or after or whatever that was. But they're like, look, his video of him actually training. Yeah, of course you trained that. That's what a well-rounded, the number one contender, mixed martial arts in the world should do. And they should know how to do it's yeah of course he trained that so yeah he did get lucky he prepared to be able to land a kick like that i presented him with the opportunity and he landed the kick and here we are so you know i people are kind of trying to take away from his way and all he did no he he landed a good kick

you know and he put me out. So other than Michael Johnson, that's the first time you've ever been dropped? Yeah. Wow. Yeah. That's pretty incredible. What about the Gilbert fight? Well, I mean, see, the thing with the Gilbert fight, I wasn't really, you know,

he didn't rock me to where I sat down and I was, you know, buzzed. He just stung you and you had to catch yourself. Yeah, it was just like, boom, that was a heavy shot. Shit. And I even put my hand down and I i could see i knew what was going on like he was coming at me and i put my hand down the brace and tried to you know control the situation you know yeah it was a heavy shot gilbert hits hard it's hard you know but this was yeah this one was like, hey, good night. Yeah. And he gave me a good 20-minute nap. When you watched the fight, where do you think you made an error? I didn't get him to do what I was – everything was perfect.

That's the thing I love. My coaches are amazing. Trevor Whitman, Ben Charrington, George Santiago, and these guys, they do a great job. And my strength and conditioning coaches, Corey Peacock and Aaron, they do a great job of preparing me. They do a great job of what they have to work with,

getting that prepared for battle. And for me, it was executing what I wanted to do. In that moment There was a setup that I was trying to set Leon up and I didn't Execute it the proper way. I didn't move his feet the way that I wanted to move his feet I didn't put him in the position where I wanted to put him in order to be successful with what I I wanted to do And so that was all of me No

It was a great it was a great one and the instructions and I and I tried that based on the instructions that I got from Trevor And it was amazing instructions because Trevor did tell me that hey when you're throwing your right hand You're looping it and he can see it because the South Pole and he's just leaning back and so I was like, oh shit you right so I need to throw it a different way and I was setting him up for that And I didn't execute the way that i wanted to and hey he caught me slick you said something about you get yourself into a mind state a zone where nothing bothers you yeah is that because like you do see moments in fights where things don't go fighters way and you start to see some frustration you start to see

them like lose some of their their focus like they kind of get taken out of their game because things aren't going their way and you see things bothering them so is that something like so if you recognize that you can put yourself in this very specific state of mind where no matter what happens, you are exactly the same way. Yeah. And it took years for me to get to that point because, yeah, I'm human. Yeah. You know, stuff is not going your way.

You start to, you know, the anxiety starts to build and then you start to, you know, start doing things uncharacteristic. For me, I've trained over and over and over to try to be as close to that zone as possible and so we just execute yeah where i just no matter what i don't care what happened like i kicked his i think i kicked his i'll kick this elbow and i kicked the shin a couple of times and if you ever kicked the shin and's not fun I'm sitting here with I have a huge bump on my shin still and it's still swelling up

you know and I didn't care I didn't even didn't even phase me you know cause I was in that zone and I didn't care what I got taken out I don't give a shit if I get beat for 4 rounds of 50 minutes guess what I'm still gonna execute that 10 seconds left I'm gonna execute what I set out to do this

this mindset is this something that have you managed this is this have you written things out is this something that you practice do you meditate like how do you get yourself into that state I mean just years of experience so it's just years of experience trial and error and all of all of the above like you know i started meditating i've grown a lot in the last three years a lot a lot has happened to me in the last three years whole time life you know experiences your father's out of jail now yeah my father being bad how great is that that it's amazing it's amazing for him to be able to witness now everything that's going on in my life and see it firsthand.

You know, that feels great to me. That's one of the joys of where I am now, which I think has kind of ultimately led me to the point where I am because I see things. I'm just more, I'm more grateful for, for things. And that I, I, I see people kind of like, look at me like an alien because if I'm not upset at certain things that don't go my way, or if I don't react a certain way to certain things, people are like, Oh, well, why, why don't you react in this way? Why aren't you,

you should be more upset. Oh, you're not disappointed. You're not hurt. No. And especially about this experience, the biggest, I would say the most hurtful thing for me is I didn't represent. Well, it's not that I didn't represent. I did. I didn't get the result for the amount of work that I put in. The amount of work that my coaches put in with me. Well, you did minus one minute. Exactly. But that's really what it is.

For me, I'm not one of those, oh, you kind of execute. No, I want to execute all the way through. Right. And so, yeah, I'm secure in knowing what I'm capable of. I know what I'm capable of doing to Leon Edwards or to anybody else in the in the world. I Know that and so it's it's funny to me now. Everyone's kind of writing it off like okay They're just talking about yeah, this is a big fight Leon and this guy Leon that guy and I'm sitting like I'm the best in the world. Are you serious? You know?

So that that I would say maybe might be a little irritation for my part but it's not it's it's i didn't feel like i didn't get the victory so i in my head i'm like damn you you didn't execute all the way through but i know what i'm capable of i've always known what i'm capable of i knew that before i fought tyron woodley do you think that this fight can actually elevate you to another level? 1,000%. 1,000%. Everything is a lesson for me.

Everything. Every experience. Every failed relationship, failed business. All of that is a lesson for me. And I got a lot of flag. I saw that Okay, the one moment I have to be honest I did Hit my heart a little bit was

When I was in a hospital With Ali we were in the hospital together when I was getting scanned. I was already back I was watching the video clip of it and he showed me that because I wanted to see how it happened and I was like damn he got me that was a good shot you know I was envious of it like I'm like damn

he set me up good that shit was beautiful you know it's like a form it was just nice you know kudos to Leon and but then they the camera pans into the audience The form was just nice. You know, kudos to Leon. But then the camera pans into the audience, and they showed my daughter. My daughter cried.

And she cried. And it was the weirdest thing. It was like an instant trigger response, like boom. My heart, like I wanted to cry just seeing that for her because as a parent, as a father, that's one of the worst things is we couldn't, and I learned that when my daughter was an infant is when they're sick or something's bothering them, you just feel it, it just hits your heart.

And then when my daughter was crying, that one, it got to me. I was like, oh shit, I don don't i didn't like seeing that yeah and then you know connor i think connor tweeted something and was it was kind of blasting me about it like you know for bringing her to the fight and this and that and and really and yeah like he tweeted some some some mean things and certain things like that and it was just like I'm not low people sometimes but for me it was like

Fuck no Like they don't they don't understand it. They don't understand. They're just in a low level of thinking to where they don't understand like Absolutely, I'm gonna bring her my daughter's not only gonna see when daddy's victorious and daddy just continues to beat everybody and daddy gets to, you know, put her in the best school or whatever she wants to be.

No. You know, because I'm in a weird place, like I'm trying to teach her. She has a work ethic, but it's kind of like, I don't want to do that today or I don't want to go to gymnastics

or I don't want to do that this week. And she's kind of like, doesn't want to do it. Oh, I don't like it anymore. today or I don't want to go to gymnastics or I don't want to do that this week. And she's kind of like, does he want to do it? Oh, I don't like it anymore. I want to quit. And I'm trying to teach her the best way that I can without forcing her to do something of what it takes to work hard. And my daughter has been going to the gym with me ever since she was six months old. So she understands that and she's okay with it.

That's why she can watch my fights. But I'm not only going to bring her because that is victorious i am blessed right now with an opportunity to show my daughter that look you could fall down and look how you can get back up and so it was to see people like and someone like connor who actually does have children, to say something like that, it was like, man, you're missing the mark big time, bro. You're missing it big time because I am blessed with that. I am blessed. How often do you get an opportunity like that to where you can give them an example of how it is to rebound at the highest level? Do you think about your daughter in the audience while you're fighting at all?

No. When you get to the cage, do you think about the fact that she's there or are you just completely focused? No, I try to limit my – this is like fight week. I had to get comfortable with bringing her around fight week because – and I learned this, the first fight she ever went to was a Tyler Woodley fight. And my daughter, we have this bond to her.

My daughter wants to be sweet. She's going to be sweet. She's going to be on me. She's going to rub my face and grab me, just be very affectionate. And I just felt this overwhelming sense of no, because I had, in the coming weeks, I built myself into this ironclad guy,

to this mental state that I want to be in to go to war. And with my daughter, she flips the switch on all that. She turns it off. And I learned that fight, like, okay, I got to limit my moments with her because she softens me up. Right. And so when I see her now, it's like moments. I try to really fight that and stay in that place and not spend too much time with her because she's going to get affectionate.

And I don't want to make her feel weird for being affectionate. But at the same time, I understand what I am feeling in the mental state that I'm in so no by the time I walk into the cage I'm already that person when they come and get you from that back room and they say all right it's your time so I pace back and forth in the backstage before I do the walk and I'm already I'm starting to slowly climb into the Nigerian nightmare when I when I step inside that cage so when I'm there I don't even know Iian nightmare when I when I step inside that cage So when I'm there, I don't even know I don't feel I don't see I don't hear I don't care that they're there I have a task. I have a job to do and that's what I need to do

So the fight is over Time is past What do you do now as far as? Prepare to fight again, and do you go straight to far as prepare to fight again? And do you go straight to a Leon Edwards rematch? That's a good question. I've never been in that situation. So for me, it was always like, all right, well, you know,

I get home and I'm home for like two, three days and I start getting bored. Because it's only so much. Like I drive her to school, I get her ready in the morning, take her to school. Then I come back home because it's only so much like i drive her to school i get her ready in the morning take her to school then i come back home it's like 8 30 and i'm just like sitting there because i can't go back to sleep right 8 30 in the morning i'm sitting there like all right well let's go train and i go usually go back to the gym and you know whether it's just hitting a bag or doing something rolling with ge George. It's something.

But now with this fight, the way it ended, they're like, hey, you can't train for a certain amount of time. You can't hit the bag? Well, they don't want me doing anything to, I guess, cause vibration to my brain or anything like that. So I'm just like, you know what? I'm just going to lay low. Just give it up.

Because very rarely do I have a break. Very rarely do I have someone say, hey, stop. You can't train. Even when I'm in training camp, practice is over. As soon as Trevor leaves the room, my mind is already like, what else can I do today? What else can I do to push, to enhance what I've just learned? And so it's kind of a it's kind of a relief it's kind of a change to where i one time i sat in my movie room for like four

hours just i watched the fight like three times in a row over and over and over and then watch the movie or something that i'm waiting i'm just waiting for my daughter to get out of school i'm like okay she's about to be done. All right, let's get ready to go get her. So I'm already bored and I want to go train. I want to go do something. I feel completely fine. Like I said, it was almost like

Leon gave me a 20-minute nap and I was back. There was no other repercussions? Nothing. I feel nothing except for the bump on my shin for kicking his elbow. And I feel nothing. So the bump on my shin for kicking his elbow and I feel nothing. So I want to go back, but the doctors are like saying, which I have to listen because that's supposed, they're supposed, they're supposed to be experts. And they're like, yeah, even though you might not feel anything, there might be some bruising back there that you don't know that could cause some type of harm later on so so how many weeks i don't know a

few weeks just a few weeks yeah but you know i'm already you know thinking about what i can do push-ups sit-ups to do this or that to just stay in shape because i'm i already feel like you know i'm addicted to that burn of that workout the burn of physical activity i'm a i i can honestly say i'm an addict to that it's i mean you talk openly about this so i could bring it up but it's amazing how well you can fight and how well you can train with your knees the way they are i just go it's it's your mental strength in that regard is really extraordinary because you've got some fucked up knees. Yeah.

But you don't see it when you're fighting. You don't notice it at all. You're throwing kicks. You're wrestling. I get to... I've just been conditioned over time to, when it's time to just compete, we compete. I don't care what's going on. We just – we compete.

Are they getting worse? I don't think so. Stabilized? Yeah. I think they're stabilized because I – over time now I've – usually I could just go into a practice. Like I said said that one day rashad just came in didn't really even warm up and still whip my ass i could usually do that but now it takes me about 45 minutes to warm up to even even if my workout might be 30 minutes takes me

about 45 minutes to warm up and i try to be religiously diligent in that, in knowing that I have to get that in. In order to prolong my ability to stay here, I have to do that. And then after you're done, you got to stretch, you got to cool down, which I'm still much better at, but I'm still working out the kinks of those. It's amazing how many fighters don't stretch. I'm like, you guys are so crazy.

It wasn't, but that's because it wasn't part of the culture. Yeah. We weren't taught that. It was just like, show up, spar, all right, go home, sit on your couch. But in terms of your ability to execute kicks, it makes such a giant difference. It does. Flexible guys kick so much easier. It's like there's less resistance.

Yeah. It's just the mechanics of how they get the leg up there, the technique. It's... Yeah, they are. So you have to wait a few weeks before you can train again, and then once you start training again, then do you get an assessment of, like,

when you'd be able to compete again? No. I mean, I think to compete, think they would you know doctors would sign off in about two months they would say you'd be okay when you get knocked out cold yeah um do you think that the more time off the better in terms of fights i don't know it's weird so remember when manny pacquiao got i know it's weird it i'm asking you got knocked out cold jamie you got knocked out cold well usually when i'm talking to you i'm talking to you in the conversation of like you might be the greatest of all time yeah now we're talking in this conversation about like how do you get back in

there yeah no i think um for me personally, everyone's like, everyone's these experts. Everyone's throwing these things out. Like, no, he needs to wait a month, two months, three months. Oh no. Can he ever, that's the, this was the most, the funniest thing to me that I've been seeing so far on the internet is,

is he ever going to be the same again? How is he going to come back? How is he going to do this? How is he going to do that? Is he going to be gun shy? Is he going to to be the same again? How is he going to come back? How is he going to do this? How is he going to do that? Is he going to be gun shy? Is he going to? Fuck no. I'm fine.

Like right now, I wanted to train last week. I wanted to go in and spar last week. But I knew that probably wasn't the wisest thing to do. There is a thing that happens to fighters. And I'm not saying this is going to happen to you. Yeah. But when they've been knocked out more than once, oftentimes they lose their chin. Yeah. I've definitely seen that. Yeah. And the thing is, I don't feel any different. And I think the good thing about the way that I compete

anyways, is I don't, I try not to take punishment to take punishment you know i i try to use my brain i try to use you know i want to out think the guys when i'm in there fighting and i think i do that pretty well so but i i i'm listening to you know the experts and the guys that have you know that have the knowledge of what this is and they're they're saying, okay, you need to wait a month and not take any hard training or heavy this, yeah, of course, I have nothing but time. I mean, the only logical thing that makes sense is to fight this guy again. Yeah.

Well, that's where the money is, too. Yeah, but for me, it's not necessarily about the money. I don't really care about the money. For me, it's... Don't tell Dana that. I mean, Dana... Dana, he cares about the money. I do care. i don't really care about the money for me don't tell dana that i mean dana he cares about the money of course me and dana talk me and dana we we're here so he knows but for i i do care i like to be of course i want to be rewarded for the time that i put in but for me it's the main thing is representing the work that i put in that's the biggest thing for me

representing the work that I put in. That's the biggest thing for me. I fucking, I give everything for this. Like, I've sacrificed a lot. I sacrifice relationships. I sacrifice time with my daughter. I think this kept, I was gone almost like a six-week stretch. Like, this is time that I won't get back.

All these things that I sacrificed. I sacrificed time with friends, you know, like for me, I just live this. You know, I'm in camp and even like my nutritionist, the chef, and she'll make me food. Some days I'll come in and I'll just, I won't even talk. I'll just eat. The food's there ready and I'll just eat. And I know in her head she wants to have a conversation or she's wondering why isn't he you know talking i don't i just want

to eat you know i in my i'm living in my head and i'm going through this experience and maybe that day trevor put me through a workout that was just super tough that i i was fluctuating with dealing dealing with it mentally while i was doing it so i'm reflecting on that the whole time so i might sit there and just stare off into space while i'm eating and and i know she probably wonders like why isn't he talking why isn't he but that's it i sacrifice all of those things for what i am doing right now and so yeah I have to represent that each and every time I step in there I want to represent that to the fullest you know I don't spend as much time with my mom and dad you know my dad's out now and you

know I'm sure he's having a blast you know now seeing where we all are in life but I would love to spend more time with them but I sacrifice all of that to go and try to be great at this so in an ideal timeline when would you like to have a rematch I think what makes more sense is to go to to go to London or go to England somewhere yeah that think that makes sense. That makes sense. I love the idea. I love it. And so I think they're already booked all the way up until January. So I think any time February, March. So that's a good amount of time too. That's a good amount of time to recover.

Yeah, it's perfect. It's almost like it just lines up perfectly. Lines up. Yeah, so I'm going to take the time. I'm going to make sure i i listen to all the experts and take the appropriate time to let it heal if they say oh yeah you're healed now which i already feel fine then hey let's rock and roll yeah that will be bananas oh yeah that fight will be bananas that will be one of the biggest fights in the history of the sport for sure.

I mean, it's going to be epic because it was such a shocking result. It was so unexpected. You know, it came out of nowhere in a fight you were dominating. And the rematch in England. I mean, Leon's a hero over there now. I mean, it's going to be gigantic. Yeah, I think. I'm going to have to go over there for that one it would be it's going to be gigantic yeah i i think i'm gonna have to go over there for that one joe you gotta come i might have to go you got

i'm gonna take that trip this is i mean it's it just lines up like i've i've that's the thing is i'm so grateful for some of the things that i am experiencing in life. I was grateful to be able to fight Tyron Woodley for the bell and win. And I'm grateful to be able to defend. And I always wanted to headline a pay-per-view in Vegas. I did that with Kobe Covington. It's like, wow, that was great to me. It's like all these amazing things. And then it's like, MSG, wow, that would be cool. And then I get the call. It's like, oh, shit, thing then it's like MSG wow that would be cool, then I get the calls like oh shit. I'm gonna do that too. It's grateful for that

Then head now to be a part of potentially headlining a stadium show in England Yeah, they're talking about Wembley right yeah, which is was that 80,000 people something like that that, I... That shit. I gotta go. I have to go. 18,000. Like, I walk out of Salt Lake City,

which is, big shout-out to Salt Lake City. Big shout-out to all the guys that took care of us there. Sean and all those guys. The AG. They did a fantastic job taking care of us. They were very hospitable. And so I'm thinking, you know, I love it because I went to school in Colorado and Iowa and the Midwest. So I'm like, okay, Salt Lake City.

I live in Colorado. I'm like, I don't know what to expect here. And I walk out. I'm walking out. I'm like, holy shit, these people are on top of me. Like they were like right there. They were right there. I'm like, holy shit, these people are on top of me. Like, they were, like, right there. They were right there. It was an intimate arena.

Yeah, it was intimate. They were packed. I was like, wow, this is incredible. And they were hyped up. Oh, yeah. To have a big title fight in Salt Lake like that, they were hyped up. Oh, yeah. I'm hoping they enjoyed the show.

And not the result I wanted, but. Well, you got a great attitude about it, I'll tell you that, yeah. I'm hoping they enjoyed the show. And not the result I wanted, but... Well, you got a great attitude about it, I'll tell you that, man. You know, your attitude about the relief of it is very similar to Matt Hughes' attitude. I remember when I interviewed Matt Hughes after BJ beat him, and he was very honest. Inside the cage, he said, I have to be honest, it's a relief. Like, it's a lot of pressure you know like constantly having these guys like biting at my heels and uh you know i'm gonna go back and hit the gym and regroup and come back stronger yeah i feel like that but i got used to dealing with

to where i wasn't even i didn't even think about the guys anymore you know they were it was always someone they you know as soon before you even get done oh that guy's next that guy's next it was always someone but i got used to that in wrestling because you know the three years division two i was ranked number one going into the national tournament and so i got i kind of made friends with everyone looking at me as that guy the number one guy they were coming after and that was fine for me it was fine i got beat my uh sophomore year and junior year i got beaten the national finals and then senior year i was like no i'm gonna win this thing and i eventually did win it but i i feel like i've just everything in my life leading up to it has just been preparing me for it you know and it's now it's

for it, you know, and it's Now it's I'm just blessed to be able to still be able to do it You know to say that I've and I talked to my my friends I which I consider like big brothers Daniel Cormier and these guys and Daniel's like yo when you stop the shit stops It just stops and you feel it because as an elite athlete You feel that yeah, and I think some of these guys are still chasing that. I mean, Conor is still chasing that. He loves that feeling, which more power to him if he can still get there. The difference between the life of a combat sports athlete

and then regular life when it ends is really hard for people to adjust. It's very crazy because it's all about building up to these moments these extreme moments oh yeah and you know if you have a career that's 40 fights you have 40 of these wild ass moments in your life and then everything other than that is preparing for the next moment it's like celebrating the victory of the moment rebuilding from the defeat of the moment training and getting ready for the next moment. And then no more moments forever. It all goes away. And for some people, that's hard.

Some people find something cool to do, and they find a crazy hobby that they really enjoy, and they find something that really they can focus on. But I think for a guy who chases excellence his whole life, like yourself, it's very difficult to find something to do with that energy. Because what you're doing is you're not just chasing excellence. You're chasing it globally. You're trying to be the most dominant person at 170 pounds on planet Earth. And you're succeeding at it. succeeding at it and you put forth this immense amount of concentration and determination and discipline and effort and thought and and just focus and the process over and over again day in

and day out with incremental improvements and and then you have these moments and then boom you land that right hand on masvidal and he goes to sleep like that kind of moment yeah and then the world cheers but those go away they go away you have to find some sort of funnel for that energy that that's um that's a very good way of putting it because um and i like i said i try to i try to learn from the guys that have done it before and that's one of the things whether you win or lose you're gonna have you're gonna go up and down you're gonna have a come down yeah and there's just you know moments where you feel the depression kind of setting a little bit and obviously worse when you you do lose and and i recognize those and i've been you know over the years now i've been you know trying

to kind of branch out and learn different ways and get into different things to to be able to to do that and you know i've taken up which i would love to have a conversation one day you know hopefully being in the same setting as michael jordan i would love to have a conversation with a guy like that you know and the tiger woods and all these guys and have a conversation with them and just what is it it i love learning yeah what is it like for you guys yeah you know but now i'm just i'm starting to learn i'm branching out i took up tennis i'm starting to learn tennis tennis lessons that seems like it's more fucked up for your knees yeah golf lessons i'm starting to you know take a little bit of lessons there and and even in the business world, I've started to kind of dabble a little bit in that,

which that I've been screwed over a couple of times. Oh, really? Oh, fuck. That's what I'm saying. It's like, it's hard when you're doing something like this because this has to take a lot of my attention. Right. And so even in the business world,

I've been, you know, I've been God a few times, Joe. I was, I mean, God, Joe, I mean, I tell you two quick stories. One, the first time I was God was God by this, some girl in Miami named Lisa, Lisa Anderson or something like that. And she was, I guess, a day trader and, you know, knew Rashad. So this was right, I became champion right at the time with is the first time I'm really made significant money and and everyone you know tells you oh you got you have to invest you have to invest you have to invest my god fuck okay I need to start now you know to invest something and you

know me and Rashad I meet with some advisors and i'm thinking about working with them and that same day after that meeting i i met with rashad me and rashad had lunch and rashad's like oh yeah i know this this girl who does investments and things like that i was like oh okay you know i didn't know how well he knew her he was just like oh i know this girl and i was like oh yeah he's yeah, you should probably holler at her. You know, so Rashad's always, that's like big brother. He's always trying to like help me out in this way and that way. So finally meet the girl, you know, like eventually we connect and she's not bad looking, you know.

That's part of the problem. That's how they get you. It's not bad looking. And she just, you know, I guess games me up over time. And make a long story short, she got me out of like 55 bands, 55,000. Really? Got me. Haven't seen a dime back.

What did she do? How'd she do it? She was a day trader. We signed this contract to where, okay, you invest this amount, and this is the amount of interest that she can incur over time is it in a fund in the fund yeah she had these close these are small funds you know increments about maybe i think maybe half a million or 300 000 and i had different people in the fund and whatever whatever you know i don't know what she did but eventually she she got me for 55 You know I tried to reach out to her to get the money back Nothing and then over time then she had messaged me like maybe a year later like hey, I'm sorry

I lost everything I wanted to reach out to you and blah blah blah I just for me was just like I'm not fucking getting it back So was she just making bad investments or did she swindle it? I have no idea. It's South Florida. Oh, boy. Fucking South Florida. So crazy.

Oh, which leads me to the next one. Oh, my God. So this guy, it's a guy named Pino. Right away I'm nervous. And he's Canadian, you know, from Canada. He owns this franchise, pizza pasta franchise in Canada named Vivo. And I met him through a mutual friend, you know, that I had in Florida. A friend of mine that was, you know, smart guy into business.

And the friend's like, hey, he has this restaurant that already has like five six locations in canada doing well blah blah blah and and i just happened to go to canada maybe 2017 or 2018 and then he was like hey come to these come look at these restaurants and i go look at him amazing i mean crowds people and i have the food it's amazing i'm like okay this is cool but i'm still reluctant like i i don't know any i don't know enough about this and the guy and the way he talks you know as italian guys like hey and he calls me kumar i'm like that's not my name he's like it's like kumar like hey hey we're gonna go here we're gonna eat and we're gonna have a great time i'm telling you this is gonna be the best ever you've ever and i and he talks like that he just it's just something you know you have the intuition right but i just you don't

fucking listen to it and and he he he's like okay i'm coming down i want to basically do the same thing in south florida i'm doing the chain or whatnot and i'm still reluctant because all my advisors and and my accountant says don't get involved in a restaurant business don't do it don't do it you know especially if you don't know what you're doing don't do it yeah so i listen i listen for a while and then i he just somehow uses my friends people around me to get to me so friends people around me to get to me so all in all we get a group the guys of us he gets us for like half a million and you know he sells us the restaurant like one of the business and he got them because they were in for another location so he got them for like over over a million so the one i invested in was a different location and he got us for half a million but he turned around

and sold it to a same time sold it to another couple like Paige and I forget her name Paige and Paul

someone got them for like half a million turns around sells it to another one like this is all like he sells the same restaurant

to like three or four different people oh my god and I remember sometimes he would talk to us and he'd say you know I just

I don't like these people down here in South Florida. They put your scammers, you know I don't like these people and when people talk about scammers. Yeah, chances are they are the scammers, right and and He gets us for that much and he's he's I don't know I think he's sold it to someone else now a different group now and The thing is he's still walking around What like, you know know especially me deal all told he got them for um some of my friends he got them for over a million and then he got us he got our group for another half a million then he got them for another half the other group page and pop for like half a million so a couple million at least

Yeah, oh, he's but who knows how many people he's done that to I mean he's cuz he's got Locations all through Canada. What's the name of the place Vivo Vivo pizza? So what does he do? He sells it to bunch of different Yeah, yeah, I'm sorry and then he's I think he's I don't I don't I don't want to speculate on what he's doing with the money but All I know is he sold us a location that we paid him for. Never was built the time where he said it would be built. Nothing, anything like that.

And then now he's saying he didn't get money from us. While we're like, here's the receipts. He's like, no, I didn't get that much. It's like, what? And he lives in Canada? He lives in Florida and Canada So he's like like I could see him around in Florida He would probably be in a restaurant like he it's a close place where we live So he I could probably see him in a restaurant. He's just sitting there eating probably swindling someone else

I don't know I probably nothing you know the the smart the smart individual that the smarter individual that i am now probably nothing because that's just an opportunity for him to get more money out of me like if i go up and and let's say he decides to i'm gonna get brave and talk reckless to him because he knows he's gonna provoke me and try to get in my face and do this what am i supposed to do right people like that i can't hit him i can't you know like i'm a boy i'm a man at some point i'm gonna want to get physical you know i can't do that because if i do do that it's like yes now i get more money out of him

can you sue him yeah we're i think we're we're in the process of of trying to do that but it's how long has this been going on for a while over a year that's why i don't get involved yeah i don't get involved in anything people ask me to invest in stuff i'm like you're on your own fucker i don't have any time man i know i know i have zero time but these are all lessons these are all things that i'm learning and it's a good attitude yeah that is that is how you have to look at it they really are just lessons yeah and the whole thing with my same thing with my daughter is like now with this loss it's it's she doesn't give a shit that's great like the next day she's like oh i gotta go to school hey can i go to this park and play can i go do this and my daughter doesn't care you know yeah i have to live with it but i'm i'm in a rare i get

a rare opportunity to rebuild to work myself up and show her that look it's not the end of the world like you could still get back to this point you could still do something and so yeah that was it was it was weird to me that you, people would speak on that and negatively about that. And Conor would say something about, yeah, that's why I don't bring my family or I wouldn't bring my family. Well, he's just trying to fuck with you. I think there was a time where he was angling towards a fight with you. Yeah, but that's the thing is I gave him an opportunity to fight me. He didn't take it.

Was this post-Poirier fight when he broke his leg or before that before that oh yeah before that before i gave him an opportunity he didn't want to do it like he broke his leg like i didn't even when he broke his leg i didn't kick him while i was down that's a very tough injury you know i almost felt for him i almost wanted to even send him a message and say hey man you you know heal up you'll be back like i i would do that's just kind of who i am this is sport it's yeah it's sport the end of the day you're still a human being if i saw you on the side of the road and you needed help or something was wrong if i could i would 100 try to help there's a few people that pass right by okay people i hug my'd go Hey good luck Fuckface Yeah maybe

Maybe that guy Now in Florida Yeah fuck Pino Yeah that guy Fuck that dude I'd probably be like Yeah I'd probably walk

Bro you got a flat tire That's it That's it No help I hope your phone Runs out of batteries Fuck outta here You crook

Yeah There's so much Scamming going on In South Florida Oh. Yeah. There's so much scamming going on in South Florida. Oh my God. So much. Because so much partying. So many partiers.

It's a unique place. It definitely is. Yeah. It's like a country, different country in its own. Yeah. Because it's,

and South Florida, it's almost like it's a service industry. Like anything you need serviced, they service it for you in South Florida. That, it's a service industry like anything you need serviced they service it for you in south florida that it's that so a lot of people are posing and and trying to pose and right that they're this and that but it's it's really not that that's a great way to put it like a service engine they're almost talking to you like salespeople yeah everything is everything is a

sale you know whether it's it's whether it's physical mental emotional financial They're almost talking to you like salespeople. Yeah. Everything is a sale. You know, whether it's physical, mental, emotional, financial, everything. They're selling everything. They're selling everything in South Florida. How many girls got rich just scamming rich dudes in Florida? There's a whole industry. Whole industry. You know, the nightlife and the business

and just everything and everyone's moving and shaking and now everyone wants to get involved in NFTs I want to talk to you about NFTs are you into crypto? get you into crypto bro you got a crypto wallet?

you're like huh? I do actually have a crypto wallet? You're like, huh? What? I do actually have a crypto wallet. I have three. Well, there's nothing wrong with crypto. Yeah. But it's the people that get involved in it. Do you have crypto? Yeah, I've got some.

I got some Bitcoin. Yeah, I got some Bitcoin, too. It's the people that get into that that recognize there's a lot of fuckery in NFTs and Bitcoin. It's like, what? NFTs in particular. It's like, what is that like what's going on there i have no i've i've i don't i've had it explained to me a dozen times or more i don't get it i still don't get it but at the same time i'm not ignorant in recognizing that things are moving a certain way yeah I can't, like the whole metaverse thing. Mm-hmm.

It's ridiculous to me. The fact that they're selling real estate in a make, this is a place that's not in a make-believe universe. They're selling, people are actually paying money for this. Is wild to me. I found out from my friend Tim Dillon, he was on a podcast He goes, do you own any virtual real estate?

And I'm like, what? What are you talking about? And then Jamie had to Pull up all the different kinds of Virtual real estate you could buy Companies are buying it They're buying up big swaths Of virtual reality Like what does it even mean?

I guess the idea is Get in early and then if it is very Watts of virtual reality. Like, what does it even mean? Yeah, what is, like... I guess the idea is, like, get in early, and then if it is very valuable, you got in early, so you got this virtual real estate before it, you know, the price skyrocketed. But if it's... Okay, this is the thing.

If it's a virtual real estate, like, there's no end to the possibilities. I don't get it. So then how is it valuable? I don't get it. I don't get it. I mean, I don't get it at all. I Scratch my head and I go I Can't anybody just make virtual real estate? Can you keep making more virtual real estate? Like how controlled is this whole metaverse thing? Is there only going to be one? Is there going to be multiple metaverses?

It's weird the things that we as humans put value on. It's weird, weird to me. And I had an experience with my daughter with this. And actually Ali bought her a pair of shoes one time for a birthday and And it was you know the Balenciaga is like that I be put on like so I did feel like socks some of the most comfortable shoes I've worn and I wouldn't me at that point and yeah, I have enough money to buy him. I wouldn't I wouldn't buy those

They were like $1,100. I'm like, no fucking way I'm going to buy those. And then the kids' size were like $700. No way in hell I'm going to spend $700 for my kid. She's going to grow out of them in a month or a couple of months. So I'm like, no. But Ali wanted to just buy her something. I was like, bro, it was such a thoughtful and special gift.

So I buy it, and he buys it, and I give it to her. And she loves them. And she's like, oh, man, these are great. And I remember I gave it to her, and I said that to her. I said, hey, don't wear this to school because I know when she goes to school, she's just going to play. Recess, they have recess twice a day. She's going to wreck those quickly.

And I'm like, you don't want to wear them to school because you don't want to mess them up. So I said, and I'm going off of the experience that what my parents would tell me. And so I'm gone. I think I go out of town for something. I had to go do a show or something. And I come back the next week and I see the shoes. They were like wrecked. I was like, Samir, you wear your shoes to school?

And instantly I caught myself. I'm like, Iir, did you wear your shoes to school? And I instantly, I caught myself. I'm like, I have to be careful how I approach this with her. I was like, hey, did you wear these to school? And she's like, yeah. I was like, well, did you see how dirty they are? She's like, yeah, but we can just clean them. And, you know, she kind of talks to me like that. Like it's a little smart, smart sass now.

And I'm like i'm like okay yeah we we could clean them so we clean them and she you know she's starting at this point i'm just like fuck who cares she's gonna wear them anyways so she's wearing them then the next week she goes to uh gymnastic practice and i didn't know i was uh i was somewhere i think I was in Denver. And training. And so she calls me. She FaceTimes me. Some random number FaceTimes me. And it was her at gymnastics.

I don't think waiting to be picked up. Her mom was waiting to pick her up. And she was with one of her friends. She calls me and she goes, Hey, Daddy, can you... And we're talking. I'm like, hey, what's up? What's going on? on she's sitting next

to another girl little girl and she goes um my friend i forget her name my friend loves my shoes can you buy her a pair of shoes and uh and i remember in my head and i was just like in my head i'm like fuck what fuck no you. I didn't even buy those for you. You know how much those cost? In my head, I'm thinking this, but then I had to snap into very quickly. I had to catch myself. And I'm just like, she doesn't know

and she doesn't care what those shoes are. We put value on it. We as adults have put a value that those shoes are worth $700 She doesn't give a shit. She doesn't know she doesn't care All she cares about the value that she cares is making her friend feel good For wanting to have the same shoes that she has that's all she cares about And in my head, I'm like those fucking $700. 700 i'm not buying those i didn't even buy you those ones i'm not i'm not doing that but she's just like hey can you buy these for my friends she just wanted to make her friend feel good and i had to catch myself and me

and eddie alvarez we talked about had a conversation about this and i was just like wow so crazy how it's like kids got this shit figured out mentally. They don't care. There's no attachment to that $700 pair of shoes. They don't give a shit. All they care about is the experience and how their friend is going to feel when they give them this gift. And I remember I had caught myself. I was like, holy shit.

I can't. I have to approach certain things differently. Like this little girl is teaching me so much and enhancing me so much, even with my relationships and how I deal with them now and deal with maybe a loss of a relationship or gaining a new one, how you deal with them. I'm learning so much so fast. It's almost like, and I still feel like I felt when I was 12,

but I'm fucking 35. This is probably how we see 60-year-olds that are doing young things, and you're like, at your age, you're 60. No, they just feel a certain way. They still feel the same. Well, we're assuming that when you get to be a certain age, you're going to run out of energy. Yeah.

And you're going to be exhausted, and so you should act your age. Fairly accurate assessment. Yeah, that's what happens with most people. But you can keep that shit going a lot longer than most people do. The problem is most people are lazy. Yeah. And they just don't take care of their body. And you've got to take care of your body the entire time

So if you get to some people and they're like 70 years old and like act your age like why should he yeah? Why should he he's fucking healthy he's out there running around doing shit. That's what you should do if you can oh Yeah, we just also assume that people get broken down by jobs to they've broken down by work and responsibilities And you know you just got to be some boring person who can't be silly about shit can't have fun joe you're living this is i mean i don't i don't live your life so i can't really i can't really you know speak on it but if i i know how i feel when i'm home in my house i don't want to leave and yeah of course now people make it a lot harder for me to even want to be outside to be around people but i don't want to leave i can stay in my house all day and just be there yeah but this setup like here i would never leave

do you have a bed here you don't have a bed here no i'd probably sleep here if i did yeah i would i would i would probably build that's probably one of the things that i built i'd build a room here with a bad comfortable bed and just i would never leave you got your gym here you got your your recovery your therapy your sauna and cold tub and all that here i would never leave i have that shit at home too that's like that shit's important yeah i got that at home too that's why I don't leave my house. People want like what's a great luxury item? A sauna and a cold plunge. Yeah.

If you're an athlete, if you're a person who works out all the time, sauna and a cold plunge. If you're a person who values your immune system, wants your recovery to be better, you want to reduce inflammation in your life, sauna and a cold plunge. Get those two motherfuckers back to back. Do 20 minutes in that sauna and do like three to five minutes in that cold plunge. Get those two motherfuckers back to back. Do 20 minutes in that sauna and do like three to five minutes in that cold plunge. You get out, you're a different human. You're a different human. And then if you do it all the time, your body

has so much more resilience. You bounce back from things so much better. Do you think it's beneficial to go more than three to five minutes? Probably not. Really? Yeah, I don't think so. I did 20 minutes once it wasn't smart yeah me neither i did i did it too i think the most i did i did uh i think 18 minutes yeah you feel fucked up for days yeah you show mental toughness but then for days my body's like

what is wrong everything feels weird i i that's exactly how i felt and i did it was one i would just build it up to it in camp and i would um it was uh maybe the master with all camp that's master ball too i would i would go in cold plunge over with uh rose and pat after we'd work out we'd get in there and i would start i think we started at usually I'd do eight minutes, and then I started 10. 10 is like my thing. 10 minutes, I'd get in there. And then I started, I just kept going. It was like 12 minutes. And then one day I was just, I got into that zone,

what I was talking about, a lot earlier in camp. I got into it like maybe a week or two before I was done with camp. So I was just in there, and I was just like, no. And he was, Pat came out and was like, oh, yeah, that's time. It's okay. All right. Are you using one where they pour the ice in the water? I used to.

At Rose and Pat, we did that one. But now Justin has one that has the filter and the pumps and everything. It's just the water. That shit is cold. That's the shit. That shit is cold. And that's when I did all this camp, and I think I did maybe like eight, ten called and that's the one i did all this camp and i would i think i did maybe like eight ten minutes that's a lot one yeah that's a lot those

are the real ones though that's where you get the real work so like some people brag about the the ice plunge and i'm like stick put a thermometer in that that's just 48 degrees that ain't nothing like it's not that cold just Justin's, this one was fucking cold. Those are the real ones. Like, Morosco Forge, I have one of those at home, and that fucker's at 33, 34 degrees. There's always ice floating in it. And then the one here, the Blue Cube, is 37 degrees,

but it's moving. The water's moving. Yeah, I think that's what Pat had. So it's like you're in a fucking cold river. Well, not Pat, Justin. You're in a 37-degree river. Like not Pat, Justin. You're in a 37 degree river. Like, oh, fuck. Yeah, I got it the first time this time I went in.

And I go in hands too. Because actually the first day I did, my little brother kept telling me, yeah, yeah, put your hands in there. Put your hands. That's the way he tells me. What, you weren't doing the hands? I would go like neck up, but I would put my hand out. Just in case, you know, someone breaks in the house, I need to be able to hop out.

Yeah, I got to get out quick. So that day I just, I think it was maybe my brother telling me to put my hands in was kind of like, no, I'm not putting my hands in. I'm good. I'm good. And I needed it because this is the one I just had surgically repaired i should have put it in that day so i didn't and it was it was cold i mean because you know what hit you hit that wall about two three minutes in yeah and then it's once i get through that that i'm just in there and i'm like okay i can do more i can do more i can do more i can do

more that's where i start pushing the limits of what i can do and and yeah trevor's trevor's been doing it now like he just does it every day him and his wife they'll do it every day and justin is still he has it in his house but i think he's still questionable whether he'll do it or not does he have anything scheduled no I don't think not yet. He's still chilling. He's still taking some time. But he's kind of like me. He'll come in the gym, he'll

watch me train, then he'll punch the bag or hit the other bag. It's kind of fun when we come into our gym at Onyx. We have all the little gadgets and different things that Trevor has and uses to train us. So it's like, for me, it's hard to walk by a speed bag and not punch it. It's very hard.

I'm like, okay, let me just hit it once. Let me see if I got the little pattern. Next thing you know, I'm there five minutes. I'm just running the bag. So Justin's kind of like that. Trevor makes the best fucking equipment. Oh, yeah. His MMA gloves should be adopted by all organizations.

The fact that the UFC and him haven't come to some sort of an agreement doesn't make any sense to me. Because the UFC gloves that they use are so inferior to the gloves that Trevor makes. Those Onyx MMA gloves, I think you would have less eye pokes because they make your hand force your hands yeah force your hand to curve i think we just have less hand breaks because i think it offers better support for your hands yeah he that's the thing with trevor trevor such that his mind is always yeah he builds everything yeah builds everything fixes everything and and that was the biggest thing is is he to, because, you know, fighters, we always hurt our hands. We always break our hands.

And he was like, man, his mind's always going, how can I create something that's better for your hands, that can enhance it and enhance it? And so his gloves, even the big, the 16-ounce, the X-Factor gloves are amazing. They're the shit. And the MMA ones, I think eventually, like, you know, people are just slow. The world is slow like that sometimes. You know, when you tell people, hey, I have this thing that's going to help, people are kind of like, well, we'll see.

But then when someone else adopts it and starts using it, it's like, oh, yeah, we got to do that. We got to do that. So I think it would take a little bit of time. I just think forever. It would be great for him and it would be great for UFC just absolutely just just UFC should just come on and buy it Buy that design. It's the best. It makes sense. Yeah, they should give him the right amount of money It's it me. It's he did the work. He made the best glove

It's the best anybody that I give it to like we had one at the old studio Yeah, I go try this shit on and they put it put it on and they'd be like, oh, fuck. Like, this is better. It makes you want to throw a punch. Yeah. It's better. It's better support for your hand. Yeah.

I mean, and his bag gloves and his sparring gloves, the Velcro ones. Like, Justin told me he doesn't even wear hand wraps. No, Justin. Yeah, they're built to where you don't have to wear hand wraps. Yeah, but that second strap that tightens their down like you really feel like you could just hit things with them yeah i still gotta wear hand wraps now your hand surgery that you had how long did it take you to recover i think the doc said about four months. But then after the four months, because I wanted to right away,

I wanted to start hitting the bag because I wanted to. I was going to try to push myself and fight an international fight weekend. I wanted a headline there. But, yeah, the doc was like, yeah, that's kind of close, too close to comfort. Because I would start punching right away and, you know, God forbid you hit someone's skull right and i don't want to split that back up and just do you know what did they have to do to your hand so i once i i kept feeling pain i was like yo something's wrong with my hand you know because it was like this tendon right here, when you push on this finger, would just kind of give.

And I was like, that's not normal. Because usually I pride myself on my grip. When I grab, it's not going anywhere. But this, I'm having an issue. But it wasn't necessarily a lot of pain, you know, when you hit right away. And so I kept saying it and saying it. So they made me get an mri but i got the mri like this so they couldn't really see it so what happened was i had a cut i had this this

tendon right here that that folds the hand finger up and down split in two this way so when i have my hand straight it's hard to see it but when you go like that it just opens up so I had a hole in it in my hand and I kept punching it was this doctor in uh in California that that was his specialty uh Dr. Shin and and this is what he does and he's like yeah I've dealt with a few boxers and a few uh you know fighters and basketball players to where I know that injury. It's hard to see, but he had a thought of maybe that's what's going on. And then once he went in there, he's like, yep. I come out of surgery, he's like, show me the pictures that he took on his iPhone. He's like, look.

You take it. He's like, yep, just what I thought. And I just had a hole in my hand from that. So he had to go in and stitch it like this together. And so it would heal like that. So now I have function, you know, with it. So it's still a little bit of scar tissue right there compared to this one. But it feels 100%?

I don't know if anything is 100%. Once you get cut into, I don't know if that's. That's not the way God made you, or that's not the way that you were born. So I don't know if I would say 100%, but definitely feels good. Well, that's a very important point about fighters going into fights

is that they're very, very rarely 100%. Oh, yeah. And athletes, you know, when you step into the octagon, you look 100%.% shit look at him he looks amazing so everybody assumes there's nothing wrong but like how many times have you had a fight where you got some shit wrong um now it's if if i'm going into a fight and there's nothing wrong i'm like did i prepare enough did i do enough in this camp i think almost every fight something has been really really wrong to where i could have been like yeah i can't fight and there's evidence

the doctors say yeah i don't recommend you to fight something has definitely been wrong every fight every fight every fight what's the worst thing i don't know you kind of have to pick your poison on that one like before masvidal 2 i didn't throw a punch with my right hand for three weeks until that injury yeah until fight night i didn't throw my right hand until no not masvidal before uh colby Colby too I didn't throw a punch for three weeks until fight night um Masvidal was my I think my leg my knee yeah something happened with my knee I got kicked in the knee boom just went out so I was for like three for like two three weeks leading up to the fight I was just like bro I don't think I could fight and for this last one my hamstring it just popped three four weeks before and I didn't throw a right kick until fight night for this one and

did it limit my mobility maybe but who cares i'm the biggest thing for me is i'm i'm grateful that i've made it there the biggest fight is that weight cut to make the weight tonight that's the biggest one what do you walk around it um now that i'm getting older i'm starting to get up there so i'm like maybe like 95 i would say in between 95 and 200 that's not that bad for 170 yeah but i i'm i'm walking around and maybe six seven percent body fat yeah my fattest so i think like my threshold is like 185 84 85 that's what i'm like really down of all fats then the rest has to be muscle and water. Yeah.

That's painful. George Lockhart was explaining this to me, and he was saying that people with a lot of muscles like yourself, it's actually easier for them to cut weight than skinny people or people that have fat. Yeah. Because like you don't get a lot of water out of fat. He said you're getting the water out of the muscle tissue.

Yeah, I've tried that. And I think think when i fought when i didn't fight actually the most muscular i was was when tyron woodley fought darren till in dallas i i weighed in as an alternate for that for that fight because in my head i was going to be I was going to fight for this title whether Darren Till made the weight or whether Tyron Willie made did whether Darren Till didn't make it or Tyron Willie didn't make it I was going to step in I was prepared to step in and I was that was most muscular in that camp I prepared for two different styles two different guys and I was really muscular and I got 13 off in two hours I think that was that was a video that Will did that was out I did 13 pounds in two hours and I was what are you doing to get 13 13 off in two hours. I think that was that was a video that will did that was out

I did 13 pounds in two hours. I was what are you doing to get 13 pounds off in two hours? Just working Work I over the I used to run on the treadmills, but clearly that doesn't work anymore. So now I'll do elliptical and Asana elliptical and sauna those two and a little bit of work back and forth and back and do elliptical and sauna, elliptical and sauna. Those two and a little bit of work. Just back and forth and back and forth, elliptical and sauna? I probably do an hour on the elliptical. And once I get done with that, I've got a pretty good sweat going. And now I can do the sauna and alternate.

Do some time in the sauna, come out, go back in, come out. But it's almost like my body knows it just knows what we're about to go through right without me telling it knows hey we're gonna cut today we're gonna be do this so it just naturally starts doing it and one time once i'm in that process it just starts coming off and it comes off and it's it shocks me every time because now i can pretty much know i know when to stop what does it feel like when you actually hit 170 though i've never given uh birth to a child but uh I would say, I wanna say those are comparable pains because it's unexplainable because your body is dying.

You know, it's actually dying because the organs require fluids and all of that, and you've just taken all of that out. So it's just slowly dying and you're just there waiting to step on the scale and and you people think oh you made 170 now you're good no it takes take some time for you to start to feel good again when do you feel good again like how many hours i want to say like eight hours after is when i start starting to feel like normal again eight hours after and what is do you have a

protocol that you follow rehydration oh yeah it's um and I've done it every wrong way so but for me the best way is like now or hydration you know knowing when I put in the sodium the magnesium and certain things that you know step by step and that's what you know big shout out to Clint and the guys at the PI. You know, they have a whole protocol and a process to getting those fluids back in you, the electrolytes, you know, the carbohydrates and the certain things back in your body that's going to hold that water. And, you know, it takes a process. It takes some time. And you got the rubber suit on too.

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. That aids in getting it off. And see, at this moment, it's got to hold you up because your body's just wrecked. Yeah, I've watched certain people get on the scale. Yeah. And you see them shuffling to the scale. You know, I can't believe this guy has to fight in a day for me by at this point by the

time I get here it's it's it's my body just it's just an autopilot it knows what to do I could I just stand there and it's just you know I'm not hungry you can see it in your eyes yeah I'm I'm just like, that's the battle. Your eyes are kind of sunken in. Yeah, this is the battle right here. And I just went through that. The fight's a bonus. What do you think about the possibility of eliminating that?

Do you think it's ever possible to eliminate weight cutting? If they had more weight classes, they had hydration tests like they do in college for wrestling. Do you think that they could do that? Or at least make it more safe i mean that's everything is relative like it's it's all an individual choice but if they invented it now see like you could try but people are still going to try to beat the system that's what i'm saying i'm saying like imagine if you just weighed in and what you weighed in and you fought like you weigh 195 fight 195 great

it would be the best right and if someone came along and said i got an idea how about you pretend you're 170 and you get down to 170 you almost get on death's door 24 hours before the fight and then you could rehydrate you'd be like what the fuck are you talking about why would i do that that would weaken me yeah that's like saying why don't you go out and party the night before but you'll rehydrate yeah don't worry we'll just drink some tequila tequila's clean that's the excuse now there's like oh it's plant-based it's plant-based it's good it's plant-based it's plant-based it comes from a plant so it's healthy it's good for you yeah it's i just think it's the dumbest thing.

I think it makes me angry that we haven't come up with a solution. I think it's the culture. It was the culture that— For wrestling, it's the culture. Yeah, so it's— But, yeah, I wouldn't mind. You compete against those guys, and I wrestle with them, and I train with them, and I'm bigger guys to where it's not that big of a problem do you see how much weight alex perjera is uh is

cutting before he fights is he no how big is he i know he's big he was over 220. what yeah over 220 with nine percent body fat I think he weighed 226. 232 a couple weeks ago. Three weeks ago. 232. So he's got three months to cut 47 pounds. 100%. Ask you. You're like, yeah, I can do that shit.

That's a four-day process. He's a big fella. He's very big. Yeah, he's actually, I knew a middleweight that was bigger. You remember Cesar Ferrer? Yeah. Oh, yeah knew a middleweight that was bigger. You remember Caesar Ferrer? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Caesar was a, he looked like a Greek god.

Yeah, Mutante. He's big, looked like a Greek god. He's tall, and he just, he cut a lot of weight. At one point, he got to 170. Oh, my God, that's right, he did. Jesus Christ, look at the abs on that motherfucker. Yeah. Damn.

At one point, he got to 170. I was just like, holy God, that's right, he did. Jesus Christ, look at the abs on that motherfucker. Damn. At one point, he got to 170. I was just like, holy shit, how? Yeah, it's hard to believe. But he does it. He was Vitor's guy, right? Yeah. Yeah, that guy was too big for the weight class. See, there's a point of diminishing returns, right?

Yeah, 100%. When you cut too much weight, and then you never really fight at 100% because you're always weakened by the weight cut. Yeah. Because I know one championship is they've implemented some sort of hydration strategy that apparently didn't go well during the last weigh-ins. There's a bunch of people that missed hydration and missed weight. Oh, and by the way, shout out to Demetrius Mighty Mouse Johnson.

I know. I was going to say that. Still doing it. Still doing it. What a savage. and oh and by the way shout out to demetrius mighty mouse johnson no i was i was gonna say that still doing it still doing it wins the world title over at one i mean he's gotta be how old is mighty mouse at this point in the game 36 i think he is one of the greatest of all time that that guy is so yeah fucking talented so talented and the way he set that knee up the way he hits him with the right hand and there's like a pause not yet not yet boom lands it perfectly he's another fighter that intelligently is one of the best when he was at the top in the flyweight division in the ufc he, you would see guys trying to solve this puzzle

of this guy who's here, and then he teleports to here, and then he's kneeing you in the body, and then he's over here, and then he's got your back. Boom. Perfect timing in that. And then walks off. Just jogs off. See ya. Look at that.

Hits him with the right hand. Bing. I got you. Look how he splits away. Like, I got you. I know that's over. He just knew just by the way the impact is. There's no way you're getting out of that one.

Look at the size difference. Look at how big the other guy was compared to him. They're fighting 135 now. He's never going to fight 125 again. Their flyweight is 135. Their idea is move everybody up 10 pounds move you know

create more weight class opportunities for these people look at how he did this it's just his timing and his awareness i mean and this is the guy who's been at the top of the game for a long time now you know you go back to that first fight that he beat so hudo i mean come on man look at that oh perfect in the air oh he's mighty mouse he's he's one of the greatest you know even clip to me is that when he when he did the ray borg ray borg yeah that was such a ninja move he catches the arm bar in midair in midair while he's slamming him, catches the arm bar. And he said, I practice that all the time. I'm like, can you imagine being his fucking trading partner?

You're getting suplexed and arm barred on the way down. Like, fuck. Could you imagine me doing that? Oh, my God. To a fighter. Well, that was something that DC, here it is. Let's take a look at this. Look, he hooks it as he's going down. I mean, that is incredible.

The timing on that is just pristine. He had so many great fights. The finish was just as good as the celebration. They don't talk about him. They don't bring him up, man. It's just really weird. The UFC doesn't promote him anymore. Now that he's gone, he goes to another organization.

But it's still, the fights that he had in the UFC, when they show that whole... When they play The Who, they have that music and they have that compilation. How the fuck do you not have Mighty Mouse in that? Because he's no longer with the company. What? I think when he's done from over there,

I think they're... Because UFC owns all those intellectual properties. They own all of that. So I think when he's done over there, where he can't give them shine over there anymore, I think they're, because UFC owns all those intellectual properties. They own all of that. So I think when he's done over there, where he can't give them shine over there anymore, I think they'll start to bring it out because he's. Is he not in the Hall of Fame? Not now. Not now. He's fighting for a different organization.

Whatever. It's in politics, but I think when he's done, apps are freaking looting. In my world, that doesn't make any sense. You gotta recognize that. The guy's one of the greatest champions ever. Ever. He's one of the best. When he was at the top, man, he was like untouchable.

It was wild how you'd watch him move. Like his footwork and his positioning was so good. And he could do everything. He could submit you. He could knock you out. He could tune you up on the feet everything he could submit you he could knock you out he could tune you up on the feet he could take you down at will the one time the one time i bet against him was when he fought dodson the first time i think john really because i had known john dodson from season 14 on the ultimate fighter and john donson was like a little ninja he's a physical freak ball of energy and he's got

power in his hand for a guy that size I'm like this guy could probably touch DJ and then I just watched DJ do what he does like yeah I think he was that good he was that good and that's also like one of those examples with um there's a few of those examples. We have this real wizard trainer who has the star pupil. And then you get to see, like, how good that trainer is because there's an athlete that's good enough to represent that guy's understanding of the sport. Yeah. And that's like Matt Hume and him. That's that kind of relationship that they've always had.

Oh, yeah. And there are coaches like that. and him that's that kind of relationship that they've always had oh yeah and there are coaches like that and i think i mean you see the um with trevor and yeah how he's able to handle me and three different guys me justin and rose i mean you know does an amazing job yeah i still to this day i think rose is some of the things that she can do is amazing. What did you think about that last fight? Not her best, obviously. What did she think about that fight?

Like, what did she, I mean, she wrote something apologizing about it, but, like, why did she fight like that? Like, what was that? I don't know. I mean, you never really know, but i think she's for her now i think she's in a place where she's made peace with it to where i'm just i'm over it you know i'm over it i don't even want to think about it i made peace with it you know so i i don't know what she's thinking as far as a future whether she wants to fight again or whether she doesn't want to fight again you know i would be sad if she doesn't fight again because so she may not fight again you think i don't know you never know

what she's thinking i mean she's she's such a she's so talented i mean she can do anything have you ever watched her play the piano yeah i was just gonna bring that up anything she can play the piano she can go back to school and and she's smart and she's intelligent so she they can do and she can do anything that she wants to do. She certainly could. I don't know. I would be bummed if she doesn't fight again. It's got to end sometime, though.

I mean, if it ends now, it sucks that it ends on that fight. That's what sucks because it's not like it ends on the Joanna fight where she KO'd her or when she KO'd Zhang Weili, you know, to lose on that fight where it was so perplexing. Like, it didn't make any sense. Like, no one was engaging. Yeah. It was just weird. I would love to see her get that one back.

But I think they already announced that Carla's fighting. She's going to fight Zhang Weili. Zhang Weili, which is, I mean, that would be sad to watch. Let's say Zhang Weili goes and takes the title from Carla. That would be sad to watch her walk around with the title when Rose has bested her twice. The second fight was close. It was close, yes.

The second fight was a very good fight. The first fight, that head kick was brilliant. God damn, that was beautiful. I didn't even, i didn't even you didn't even see it yeah just even even um what's her name even zhong weili didn't even she thought it was going to be an inside kick zhong weili is no fucking joke that lady is a monster though when you're watching her knock out you wanna like that with a spinning back fest i was like jesus it was tough because uh you know i like you wanna too and you wanna had her and that's the thing this sport changes so

fast so fast i love we forget that yoana went on a run when she was just defending defending defending when she had like what five title defenses or something like that five or six she was just defending the belt and she was the boogie boogie man you know everyone was and when she beat carla when she bloodied up carla and battered her jesus christ she was good yeah she was so good so it was it was a tough one to watch but you know they there's you can just see how deep now the women are getting. You have Jean Whaley. You have Joanna. You have Rose. You have Jessica Andrade.

Those weight classes are getting deeper and deeper. And you have younger girls now that are coming out. Miranda Maverick. You have Macy Barber. You have a couple of these girls that are getting better and better. And some of those fights, like Juliana Pena and Amanda Nunes, that's one of the best title fights I've ever seen in my fucking life. That shit was wild.

Did you see those two little girls? They might have been, I think one was like 19 and the other one was maybe 20. One was Mexican, one was Brazilian. They were both like Jul Julian, I think so. How long ago was this? It was literally like two, three weeks ago. They fought on the card in Vegas. What card was that?

It was that wild one and they had the African kid fight that Nate the Train got oh that wild fight is a back-to-back fight it was the two girls that you said that's right yes I did watch on TV that was a apex yeah yeah and oh man what fights but that's what people want yeah people want to see the blood people want to see that back and forth this guy's hurt they come back and that guy's hurt. And they come back.

But when you're just dominating, people don't want to watch that. People are like, ah. They kind of do too. They like all of it. They like a dominant champion who just kills everybody. And then they like back and forth scraps. Okay. Then look at the Israel fight.

Why does Israel get flagged? Because people are dumb. That's why. This is why. If you want to fight Jared Kananir, you better fight in that way. Because Jared Kananir will knock you into the fucking next dimension. Like, that guy is a

huge 185 who has ruthless knockout power. He was knocking people out at heavy weight, knocking people out at light heavy weight, and knocking people dead at 185. If you want to fight Jared Cannoneer, you got to fight that way. That's my same criticism of people that were saying that Wonderboy, when Tyron Woodley

fought Wonderboy, that he fought him wrong. Like, no, he's the only guy who fought him right. You have to fight him that way. You got to make him come to you and then counter him. You cannot be involved in a chasing down one of the best counterstrikers that's ever competed in the welterweight division. You can't fucking do that. That's a way to lose your title.

If you want to fight the right way, you fight the way Tyron did, and he beat him twice. Yeah, but people are like, oh, no, that. Because they wanted to see Tyron hurt and him battle back, and then Wonderboy hurt and him battle back. That's how you lose. It's crazy. I feel like people are trying to still keep it a blood sport. Yeah, and then battle back and then wonder boy hurt and him battle back and that's just it's it crazy It's people is I feel like people are trying to still bring keep it a blood sport

Just keep it that way. It's just the casuals man. It's the people that don't understand the actual Events that are taking place when is he setting up Jared up and he's moving and and out pointing him and striking him Look if Jared wanted to get wild and crazy, Izzy probably would have knocked him out. But Jared fought the way he should have fought, and Izzy fought the way he should have fought, and the better man won. And that's what prize fighting is all about. That's what it's about.

Absolutely. If you want to ruin your brain for a bunch of people that don't give a fuck about you when you lose, good luck. Go try that. It's a dumb way to live your life. It's a dumb way to live your life. It's a dumb way to live your life. You're supposed to fight the correct way.

And sometimes it's exciting, like the Polo Costa fight. That shit's exciting. The first Robert Whitaker fight. That shit's exciting. Yeah. But this is the same problem that Anderson Silva had when Anderson was in his prime, is that some guys would fight him in a very cautious way and people would say well he should have pushed the action no that's not what you do yeah you

don't open yourself up just because the other guy's not doing anything or turn into a brawl because people are booing that's dumb Trevor Trevor touches on that and Trevor um and I he said that to me the first between the first time i fought masvidal right after the fight because i remember i was just so mad at myself because i felt that i could have done better i dominated the whole fight you know but i was just like no that guy wasn't as good as i i made it up to be in my head, no way, I want to fight him again. And Trevor, and I was just, I was upset with myself backstage and Trevor was just like,

bro, you're the fucking champion. You have to be the smart one here because it took a lot of work for you to get here to the title and it takes a lot of work to be able to defend this title. You have to be the smarter guy. And I heard every word that he said.

But the dark Kermit, the gangster in me was like, what the fuck? Dark Kermit! The gangster in me was like, no, I got to go again. I need to do what I did that second fight to Masvidal. I got to do that. That's what what i want that's what the people want that's what has to happen and i think this is partially why the first covington fight was the most satisfying one to me and uh it's weird because i actually i like both guys i do like covington and i do like uh masvidal to where i'm

people would be surprised you say you like Covington. After all those. I mean, as a person, I've never hung out with him as a person, so I wouldn't know how he is as a person. I've heard rumors, but, you know, because how he is, his energy is with other people might not be how his energy is towards my energy. So until I experience that, it's hard for me to speak on it. But, you know, as an athlete, as a competitor,

and what he brings to the table, like I'm almost kind of like low-key a fan, not really, you know. But I admire what they're able to do. For you to talk that much shit and get your face broken too and still talk more shit after, like that takes, you know, a different person. Well, it's been brilliant marketing for him. Oh, yeah, for sure. And, you know, you know the whole story.

He created that kind of character when the UFC was pushing him out. They were saying, you're boring. You got to get out of here. And he was like, well, how about I try this? Nothing changed with his fighting style. He was always that dominant. Yeah.

He was always doing that to guys. And it's just now he's got that shtick behind him and it works. So more power to him. And it's just now he's got that shtick behind him. And it works. So more power to him. Greetings, nerds and virgins. You've got to fucking admire it. It's funny, man. I've hung out with him in real life at the comedy store.

Yeah, he came to the comedy store one night. He's a super nice guy. Super nice guy. Polite, real friendly to people. He's just not that guy at all. But he's like, look, I had to do what I had to do. And he was explaining it. And he's like, they were going do what i had to do and he was explaining it and he's like they were gonna cut me they they told me they're gonna cut me and he's like i didn't know what to do it's like i'm just gonna start talking

crazy shit yeah and that's what he did for me though the the difference is is i mean he's a single guy i don't i don't know if he has kids or not but i i do and like for me to have to my daughter now she watches everything she asks questions like for me to have to my daughter now she watches everything she asks questions like for me to have to explain that to her right that is not how daddy really is that i don't think i don't want to do that well it's not your personality anyway it's like you don't and also you don't have to like yeah you don't have to you dominated him despite that it's like you know there's people that they come up with a shtick. And you see, like, shticks are valuable.

I mean, look, Sugar Sean O'Malley is a wild guy to watch fight. He's very talented. But part of why O'Malley is so popular is he's smart about his marketing. He talks a lot of crazy shit. He's got crazy colored hair. He's got all these tattoos. He smokes a lot of crazy shit. He's got crazy colored hair. He's got all these tattoos. He smokes a lot of weed, plays video games all the time. Puts it all out online.

Puts all this content online. So there's way more eyeballs on any of his fights than they would be with a regular guy. Yeah. No, I like him too. And yeah, that's the one thing that I noticed is he was very keen to that early in his career to where he is able to do that. Because there's some killers out there that don't get their shine, like Rokmanov, Shavkat Rokmanov.

That guy's a fucking killer, and nobody's talking about him. But then you've got certain people in that weight class like Hamzat who talks crazy shit. I kill them all. I kill everybody. And everybody wants to pay attention to him. Not bad, right? Yeah, everyone. I mean, there's another tough, what's his name?

Sean Brady. Oh, Sean Brady's a bad motherfucker. Yeah, tough kid in the division. He's an excellent grappler. There's a lot of good guys. Jeff Neal. Oh, yeah. Jeff Neal's back.

Jeff Neal's back. That was big, man. Knocking out Vicente Luque, that was big. Yeah, that was big. That's big. That was hard to watch, too. You know, because I love both guys. You know, I've actually trained with both guys. But Vicente, I trained with for a long time.

Vicente's like a brother to me too i and it's watching that was just that one was really tough it was bittersweet right oh yeah it's also for me it's nice to see jeff neal back in form because i was jeff neal like when he knocked out mike perry i was like that guy is the dark horse of division like he is so technical and so clean and the way he lands his strikes is so efficient. And, like, he's someone to watch. And then he had a rough time of it for a while, where it didn't really... And he had some personal issues,

and it seemed like he kind of lost his focus. But now it looks like it's 100% back. Yeah, and he's calling... Who was he? He called someone out earlier. Was it Covington? Or was it Burns? Or someone? He called someone out. was it Covington or was it Burns or someone

he called someone out I don't know who it was and um I was like yeah that's not a bad fight so is it Gilbert is scheduled to fight someone

right I don't think so why did I hear I know they were he was him and Masvidal was going back and forth that's right

that fight and that is a great fight I think that's a great fight yeah I don't know if that's for sure because I'm hearing now, like all this week, they were saying, oh, Masvidal's pushing to fight Leon Edwards

for the title. I'm like, that doesn't really make sense. If I was Leon, I'd be like, where have you been? You punched me in the face four or five years ago. I haven't heard shit from you. Oh, that's what it was is him

and dc got into it they were going back and forth because i think dc i think he called for the masvidal fight and saying oh he will i think they asked leon would you fight masvidal and leon's like i mean yeah if the opportunity is it but you know i've been wanting to fight this guy for three years and he just ignored me and said that I was a nobody. But now out of the woodwork, he wants to fight me. And then I think DC had commented and said, if I was Leon, I would just completely ignore this guy because that's what he did to you. He ignored you when he could have fought you. You guys were both in a certain situation where you could fight each other.

But now that, you know, you are the champion, he wants another crack at the bell. So of course he wants to fight you now. And so I think that's what Masvidal and his camp got upset with and they started going at DC. And DC did the most savage shit, I think, to do. And he posted a picture of his title stacked up. And he posted a picture of his titles stacked up. I remember saying, I was just like, well, the argument's over.

You can't really say shit to that. I mean, I think he had like seven world titles just all stacked up on the table. And he posted a picture of it. And I was like, yeah, I mean, you can't argue back with that. And he's got his Hall of Fame jacket. You can't argue with that. Those guys that are so close. Yeah. They're so close.

And Masvidal is one of those guys that's so close. Masvidal. So close. Covington. Yep, so close. Wonder Boy. So close. Yep, perfect examples.

There it is. Oh, shit, that's just savage. Those are the old school belts, too. Do you like the old ones or the new ones? New ones. Do you have an old one, too? No. When it was new?

I was the first one to get the new one. Oh, really? Yeah. The first, Walter Way. I think Henry Cejudo was the first guy to get it, and I think I fought after Henry Cejudo. I look at the old one now, and it looks kind of cheesy. Yeah. I used to think the new one, like, what is this?

Yeah, that's exactly how I felt. What is this new thing exactly how i felt but now i look at the new one i'm like that's a better looking belt oh yeah 100 and just the different elements that are in the belt the different things that are in there yeah for each time you defend your title i'm i'm wondering what what are they gonna do when i get the belt back do? Do they give me a new belt? Maybe get one different kind of jewel that's in there. You get one gray jewel. Like, do you want one of those ones? That's a good. Now they're all red.

They're all rubies. Right. You get an opal. Yeah. All rubies and something. Well, this one's kind of fucked up. But because of it, I got better. You know, it's hard for me because I like a lot of guys.

And sometimes two guys I like. Like, I like Leon a lot. He's great. He's a fantastic guy. So it's hard when you watch a guy you like beat another guy you like. It puts you in that weird place. Yeah. You know?

Khabib and Michael Johnson well that was a tough one because mike was my guy i was my training partner but i liked habib too and i like being around him i was there because he thinks you know like he's the same on the same experience like mental how he thinks and how he approaches the fights and i'm just like oh yeah this guy's it's gonna be hard to deal with and then watching him fight michael johnson it's just like oh man that was a tough one to watch habib said he wouldn't even come back for a grappling match did you see that they offered him money to grapple and he's like nope why he's done and i think the fact that we're continuing if he's anything like, the fact that people are continuing to ask him makes it easier for him not to come back. What if, let's go to the what if bucket.

Okay. What if Charles Oliveira beats Islam Makhachev? Yeah. What happens then? Then he fights. What if he submits him? And he calls out Khabib? He calls him out

he makes it easy it makes it easier for khabib to say no first of all i don't think he gets down to 155 ever again really no he's so big right now he's big he's a light heavyweight no way in hell he gets down and he's a solid light heavyweight like he's holding down light heavyweights and submitting them. Really? He's a bear. He's like a short, stocky bear right now. Yeah, there's no way he gets back down to 155. How did he gain so much weight? I think he just let his body grow into it.

You know, you hold it down for so long. Right. And then when you let go, it just grows. Like look at Anthony Johnson. He was making 170. And then he went up to heavyweight yeah and he's knocking people dead yeah he just let it he was solid there too so you know i think it's just you you once you let your body go there how is gross how is rumble doing because i heard

he had a health scare like something health scare and it's it's he has good days and bad days what is he still there after we don't know you know. They're saying maybe from the years of weight cuts and different things. I don't want to speculate on it because I don't know the whole file of everything. But I know he has good days and then some days he has some bad weeks. That motherfucker hits so hard. Anthony Johnson was one of the purest athletes I've ever seen because he had the feet of a lightweight and the power of a heavyweight, and he carried it all the way through.

So I'm praying for him, and I hope he gets better. How long has he been dealing with this? Over a year. Because I know he fought in Bellator, won in Bellator, had that great come-from-behind victory. Yeah, and then it just happened. When he knocked out Glover DeShera with one punch, I was like, God damn.

Did you see the tooth fly? Yes. I mean, that's a scary power. And I had to spar him. I sparred him a few times. I have video of me sparring Anthony a few times. And Anthony is one of those guys that doesn't go soft. He doesn't know how to go soft.

And his big ass would wear 14-ounce gloves, too, at sparring. And it was like, and I remember we'd complain. We'd tell Henry, why the why is he wearing 14 ounce gloves he should be wearing 20s like there's no way he should be wearing 14s but he's like yeah i'm just gonna touch i'm just gonna touch with you get the fuck out of here no he doesn't touch he's got he's touching you with canned hams yeah he's got these oh yeah fucking giant hammers for fists yeah he hit so hard man he was just such a dangerous guy because at any mistake you make it just takes one from him yeah i mean he knocked out everyone he was knocking out

he knocked out gustafsson yep oh my god yeah in sweden in sweden which you know we love to do that we love to go into someone's country. Like England. In silence. Yeah, like England. Is that what you're looking forward to? I'm looking forward to it. It's almost like a new challenge.

It's almost like a new thing now for me to get excited about. Before it was, you know, you got to make up things. Oh, you're fighting Salt Lake City against Leon Edwards. You've already fought. You beat. Okay. How to get excited for it. Now this this one's exciting this is a lot of state now now you're fighting for the belt now you're you're you're in their country which honestly i think i'm gonna have more fans in this country than he will i mean and that's no that's no knock that's no knock on Leon. I like Leon.

I really do. Half of England is Africa. And there's a lot of Nigerians in England, a lot of Nigerians. And he knows that. A lot of Nigerians, a lot of Jamaicans, but I think I will be well represented in England. Do you think there's more Nigerians than there are Jamaicans? I don't know, but I would think so.

I would think there's more West Africans than there are Jamaicans, which Jamaicans are West Africans. Yeah. But also he lives there. Yeah. And he's the first champion that really trained his entire career there. True, but I don't think he's been getting the love

that he should have been getting. Well, yeah, you know, there was that problem with the two years where, you know, during the pandemic and the flight's canceled. You don't think he's getting the love now? He won the title and got to the airport. I think he's maybe, you know, I was told maybe 20 people there. Really?

He should have had a parade. I would have thought there would have been a bigger reception. Exactly. Especially the way he was. Exactly. I would have thought that too. But it was like 20 people there, his family. Really?

Yeah, I would have thought he had a parade. They have to shut down the airport. It should be Leon Edwards Day. It should be. You just got the title from Kamaru Usman. It should be Leon Edwards Day. Yeah. So, you know, I hope he does get it.

But, you know, to do something that he's, to do what he's done, what he just did, to come from where he's come from and stay in England. Yeah. And I don't care how he did it. He did it. Yeah. You know, I would, that's kudos to him. He did it. Yeah.

You know, I would, that's kudos to him. And what he stands for, you know, that victory because he's, now he's intertwined with the inner city and helping kids and, you know, stay out of the gang life and things of that nature. So it's commendable. And I'm glad for him for what that, you know, being able to achieve that. You know, but in my head, it's not like I feel like I'm a loser. No, I know I'm the best in the world. And when given that opportunity again, I will prove that. But I'm glad he's, you know, getting the things and doing what he's doing right now.

That's a great attitude. That's a great attitude. As long as you get that second shot. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, there's no logical fight. What, am I going to beat up Covington again? Right. Masvidal again?

Like, what is, there's no logical other fight for you. No. For him, the only fight that would make any sense marketing-wise, I could see, you could say, the Masvidal fight. Masvidal, yeah. If you couldn't fight in time and they offered him a headliner fight and masvidal took it i kind of could see where that would maybe but i don't think they would risk the rematch even with that i would give it to covington first if we're going to be logical about the order of things right i would give it to but if we just don't give a shit, we don't care, then yeah, that makes sense. I don't think they give a shit.

I think they just try to make the most amount of money. I think so too. What can you sell the most? For sure you and him are the biggest fight. For sure. For sure. In England. Absolutely.

For the title. Because that makes sense legitimately for the title. Yes. Yeah, absolutely. Because that makes sense legitimately for the title. Yes. So, yeah, absolutely. That's the legitimate fight. Yeah. Especially because you're one of the most dominant champions ever. And so for you to lose that way and then to rematch for the title in England, that shit is going to be bonkers.

I'm going over there, bitches. I'm flying to England. You heard him. I told John Hennick I would right after the fight. I'm fucking going. I'm fucking going. We got to go. We have to go to England.

Let's go. Let's go to England. Let's do it back. It's going to be Wembley Stadium. That is going to be wild. God. If not Wembley, some other stadium. Something crazy.

I know Dana said we're looking at all options here. Because people are going to come from all over the world for that fight. I think that might sell out in 15 minutes. Yeah, that might sell out quick. And they'll probably have some big fights on the undercard too because that's going to be a big one. That's a big coming out party for the UK.

Yeah. Big UFC UK fight. Even when Bisping was champion, he lost it on the first defense, wasn't it? Didn't he fight Dan Henderson over there? Yeah, he fought Dan, but I don't think he did. No, I don't think that was for a title because I don't think Dan Henderson's ever fought for a title.

I think he did. Did he? Yeah. I think he beat Henderson for the title. I think that was the rematch, right? Is that true? Manchester, England. Yeah.

Bisping versus Henderson, too, was for October 8, 2016 Manchester Arena but was that after he won the title? I don't think that was for the title I think it was I think he lost

I think he won the title in 2015 if I remember correctly World World yeah it was World Middleweight Championship World Middleweight Championship

yeah so that was for the title. Okay. Because Henderson fought for the title twice because he fought Anderson, too. Remember Anderson? Lit him up like a Christmas tree. He fought Anderson? Really?

Bro, that was prime time. No. Super Ninja Anderson. In the UFC. Yes. Yeah, pull up Anderson versus Dan Henderson. Bro. Where was I for that? Bro. Anderson was on fire. Oh, Henderson. Bro. Where was I for that?

Bro. Anderson was on fire. Wait, how did I miss this? This was when Anderson was in his fucking full prime. Oh, yeah, you could tell. He was so good. That's the thing with Anderson. When he starts doing this bop and this hop.

Yeah, the shuffle and moving back and forth. He was so good. And reckless, too. Oh, my God. He had full regard for his chin, full confidence in his chin. He actually wound up strangling Henderson. He beat his ass, and then when he got him on the ground, he took his back and strangled him.

Yeah. But it's because he hurt him on the feet. Look, he did. Well, he stood right in front of you and let you swing punches at him because he had so much confidence in his ability to take a shot, too. That was Dan Henderson's shot. I know. Dan Henderson was scary.

He was another guy. I mean, he knocked out Fedor. Dan Henderson knocked out Fedor. Who was a fucking heavyweight. Yeah. Which is so crazy. So he gets his back, and then he went like bone of the forearm across the trachea. So he went like gable grip behind the back.

See? Like there. That's how he gets it. Right there. So he wound up finishing it palm to palm like that. Right there. Bam. He got him.

That was prime, Anderson. People forget. People who are fans who didn't become a fan until recently go back and watch the anderson silver era oh yeah because when he knocked out vito with that front kick to the face nobody was front kicking people in the face before that and then it became a thing yeah like he changed mma that and then machida did it yep machida did it with randy couture and then quite a few people done it since. Yep. Machida did it with Randy Couture. Yeah.

And then quite a few people have done it since then. Marlon Vera did it with Frankie Edgar. Marlon. Michael Chandler did it to Ferguson. Oh, that one was crazy. That one was crazy. See the close-up of Ferguson's face. Oh.

Those close-ups of him and Frankie while the foot is on the face. Those are terrible. Don't show those. Yeah. Those are mean. Nobody should show those. Those are mean. Nobody should see those fucking pictures, man. Imagine your kids have to see you looking like some elf. That's the world we live in now.

You know, fucking miserable people are going to, they close up that picture and then save it as their avatar. Oh, they do. And then they text you all day. Oh, yeah. They send you DMs all day with your face

all fucked up. Those motherfuckers. Yeah, yeah. They send you DMs all day with your face all fucked up. These motherfuckers. Yeah, I've gotten a few of those. The funniest meme that I've seen was the Rick James. And remember the Dave Chappelle show? Yeah. When Charlie Murphy story.

Yeah. When he's talking about how he kicked Rick James in the chest. I saw that and they said this was what Leon said to Usman. And I died. I died laughing. It was hilarious. There's some funny people out there, man.

Funny haters. They're quick. They're quick. They're so quick. The night of fights, like that night, the memes are out of control. They're on the computer. They're waiting. They're waiting.

Oh, it's happening. Here we go. Yeah. That kind of energy. But you feel like, I almost feel like I get the fact that you're getting a lot of laughs, but you don't know how talented you are. If you can come up with something like this, you should be like a professional. This should be what you do for a living like you're really funny they're good with it

they're really good scary good well I think with MMA's the highs are so high and the lows are so low and they know the lows are so low yeah they go after you when you down yeah they're like oh he used to be on he used to be shredded on top of the cage flexing yeah now he's out cold oh i can't wait yeah let me brush off my meme fingers and some guys some fat guys in front of his cat like knocking the cheeto dust off but that's the thing is i i would say that biggest the biggest thing that i've learned the way i've grown the most is not being affected by that. That's good. As much.

It's almost impossible to say I'm not going to be affected at all. But with that. The thing is to just avoid it. This is the advice I give to fighters but it's also the advice I give to comedians too. You don't want to be reading mean shit

because you can't even respond to it. Yeah You want to respond like hey fuck you too you want to but you can't so what what are you gonna do? You're gonna read something that you can't respond to for what what information are you getting out of that nothing? Do you don't you know human nature? You know by the time you reach 30 years old don't you fucking understand people kinda? Yeah Well, no that there's gonna be people out there They're just like they're anonymous and they just want to hate on you. Don't take that in. No, I I That's the biggest thing is um It's like you gotta let that's their job. Yeah, that's their job

Yeah That is their job. Your job is to be great. And yes, if you're doing your job, then that's... They're just like, fuck. They don't have shit. What do I do? I'm just waiting. I'm waiting for my moment.

I'm waiting for my moment. You know, and that's all they do. If you're doing their job, then they go after Masvidal. Like when you knocked out Masvidal, then they poke fun at him. Oh, man. They said some...

And I didn't even... Same thing. I didn't really even read the one meme that um well it wasn't really a meme it was well yeah it was a meme it was the one that i i saw and i actually liked is masvidal did this interview where he was like he was saying something to me he was saying like oh uzman just doesn't possess God didn't bless him with the macho-ness to be able to put someone to sleep. And he said that. And while he was saying that, and they had, like, the split screen,

they had the video of me just sleeping him. And that one, I was like, hmm. That was such a clean punch, too. And to land it on a guy like Masvidal Who's such a crafty striker He's so skillful We set him up And that was the thing with Trevor Is such a mastermind

How we set him up And just delivered I did the same thing in the first round That I did in the second The same set up And how I got him there But he was expecting something different in the second. And I just sent the missile to his head

and he didn't even see it based on how I set him up. Such a perfect punch. And I wanted to do that again. Look at that. But Leon Edwards said, nope. So somewhere around February, you think? February, March. Anyway, I don't care.

I'll be ready. I was bored last week. I wanted to. I was so bored. I wanted to train. I wanted to do something. Maybe you could use this as a time to go get them knees shot up with stem cells somewhere. I'm doing it all.

I'm going to get it shot up. When we leave here, I'm going to Paris. Go to Columbia. Go to Bio Accelerator. Go to one of those places where they could do illegal shit. Cell somewhere I'm doing it all I'm gonna get a shot up when we leave here I'm gonna go to Columbia go to like bio accelerator You know go to one of those places where they could do illegal shit. Yeah, well, I don't want illegal shit It's not a you heard him. I didn't say Cheating I mean the amount of stem cells they can pump. Yeah, that's that's what that's yeah, I have gone to Colombia Have you I was yeah, that was maybe four or five years ago i went to oh yeah maybe now maybe get back

there no for sure stem cells for sure i'm gonna do stem cells again um definitely just try to prolong this as much as possible you know and i'm doing everything i can you know i'm trying to spend the time and money on my recovery you know making sure that i'm i'm healthy i'm warmed up before and stretching after and getting some physical therapy some body work done so i'm doing it all and of course it supplements you know as far as the you know turmeric and the ginger and the different things that the natural herbs that you can put in your body to help reduce those inflammations. I'm doing. And, you know, I used to say, oh, man, maybe a couple more fights and I'm done. But, you know, with the newfound hunger that Leon has sparked, it's like, we'll do this for a little bit more.

How long do you think? If you had to guess. I would say, I don't know i would this is this was my roadmap it was what was the roadmap my roadmap was beat leon in the way that i wanted to and go to 205 beat your prosca defend with yon come back down defend with Hamza Jesus and then if Connor wanted to or if Canelo at that point wanted to then do one and just sell off and just say you know what?

Why did you want to go all the way to light heavyweight just because Israel's at 85? Yeah, Israel's at 85 I don't want to you know that I don't take any pleasure in fighting Israel of course but no one else at 85 like if Israel retired yeah Israel retired 100% because 205 is a big jump it's a big jump but I I think I have this style and I have the the the mental ability to be able to handle those guys well not those guys I don't say those guys not everybody there a couple of those guys a couple of those guys and they happen to be the guys that are at the top so I think yeah I think I could I could deal with Yuri and I could deal with the yarn you know not saying

they're not great they're not great. They're scary. They're fucking big, scary guys. Big, scary guys. Which is kind of what makes it also tempting for me because they are scary. It's like you get to a certain point where you're looking for new, scary things to do to kind of, you know, keep you alive, keep you motivated. So now you have a new roadmap, though. Yeah, I have a new roadmap. Now the roadmap. Now, so let's imagine you go back. keep you motivated so now you have a new road map though yeah I have a new road map but it's still similar

now so let's imagine you go back now I gotta run Leon back I gotta run that one back let's imagine that fight takes place

you win the world title back do you think what do you think happens after that well we have to see what happens with Hamza and Nate Diaz

I think Hamza and Nate Diaz I don't know you can't sleep on Nate Diaz no absolutely not you can't but it's justz. No, absolutely not. You can't. But it's just kind of like a fight.

It's a bizarre fight. It's a bizarre fight. It's a bizarre fight that doesn't really make sense. Well, Nate asked for Francis Ngannou. I know. That's more bizarre. That's more bizarre. You know, what if I was Dana?

Okay, you want that? Fine. Francis, you want it? All right, let's do it. Nate, what do you weigh? He weighs 180. He's only given up 80 pounds. What's the big deal?

Yeah, I... Yeah, that's ridiculous. It's bizarre, but hey, we'll see. It's Nate. He's a wild fella. And you can't count him out. But, I mean, even after that, I still think, you know, it's hard to just say hamza you got to jump gilbert burns right you jump masvidal you well he beat gilbert but seeing him versus masvidal

masvidal that now that fight i could get behind more than maybe even the nate fight masvidal versus hamza oh i like that fight a lot I like that fight a lot that's interesting I think what's more interesting is is him versus Covington mmm Hamzat versus Covington think how that's the ultimate yeah yeah because that's your gatekeeper Covington does everything yeah yeah I'm for lack of a better word and note by no disrespect you know with all due respect, I mean no disrespect, Covington. You can say no disrespect because you beat him twice. With respect, I think, yeah, like, it's Covington. You got to get past Covington.

Most people have said before the Leon fight that if it wasn't for you, he would be the champion of the world. I agree. He's that good. Yeah, I think champion. I agree. He's that good Yeah, I I think so. I agree. He's got so much endurance man. It's wild and he weaponizes it Yeah, he pushes a fucking crazy pace and you saw it in the the Woodley fight was one of the best examples Yeah, like he just put it on but even that fight he didn't really push the pace He didn't push as he could do it more. Yeah, with Woodley. Think about Woodley and Robbie Lawler, which I love Robbie too.

But look at the pace that he put on. Yeah. Oh, my God. He threw over. I think he set the record for most punches thrown in that fight. Like, just kept throwing punches, kept taking them down, just kept doing them. DC says he's always been like that. He says he's always had this crazy gas tank.

It's like a genetic thing. Yeah, I've heard. i mean i'm disciplined i think genetic but i think a lot of it goes to the discipline yes you know because a lot of people now they get gas they don't necessarily know they can deal with it yeah in their mind they feel like they can't and they get tired you know because they don't push themselves in a certain way, but I do think it's it's mental how he's Mentally embraced it and pushed and pushed and pushed himself Because for me, that's what it is. I I don't run You know, I do all the different things I roll and I bike and I do what I can to try to get that That same thing, but it's not the same as running

You know, but the running is the ultimate cardio? For me, I love running. Running is so good to where you, there's even a thing called runner's high, you know, and I felt that a few times because I ran cross country when I was in middle school and that's where I really developed a passion for running. You know, running, when you're running and you just get in that zone and you're just going, it's a different feeling.

Maybe when you're done fighting, they'll give you some new knees. Yeah, definitely. Screw in some of them new jammies. I'm definitely getting new ones. If they don't weigh me down for sure, I'm definitely getting new ones. Oh, they're going to have new ones by the time you're done that are probably way better than the ones they even have now. You know, like I told you, Matt Serra just got his knees done.

And you said your mom did and my mom did. She got her knees done. Yeah. Yeah, it's pretty wild now. You're seeing people walk around with fake knees and they have no pain. Bisping, Bisping's got both of his knees done. Really? Yeah, Bisping has two fake knees.

I did not know that. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, he knocks on them like tap, tap, tap. They sound weird. Wow. Yeah, he runs now them like tap, tap, tap. They sound weird. Wow. Yeah, he runs now. Bisping runs. He kicks the bag, everything.

These new knees are wild. Like, I just... It gives me... I know. I cringe just thinking about that. Well, they say they're going to have to replace him in 20 years,

but I mean, but they were going to have to do something new in 20 years anyway if you're going to work out. With the evolution of man, just the way that we're changing things and growing things, yeah, of course.

I think also biologics are going to advance to a point where they're gonna be able to regenerate tissue in a way that they're not gonna have to replace your knee. They're just gonna be able to regenerate all that cartilage tissue, meniscus. Have you seen that printer that is printing anything? Yes. That's wild. That's scary. anything? Yes. That's wild.

Yeah. That's scary. It's crazy. That's super scary. They're going to be able to replace your arm one day. Like you lose an arm in a car accident, they'll just replace your arm. That was like in Star Wars. Yeah.

Yeah. It's coming. Yeah. Hurry up now. Well, listen, Kamaru, you are a fantastic representative of everything. That's excellent about mixed martial arts You really are your character the way you win the way you lose where you discipline yourself the way you fucking you're just always on top of everything man, and I love the way you've handled this the loss and you know

It's like you handle you're a champion in victory just like you're a champion in defeat. You really are. You handled it great. Thank you, Joe. And I can't wait to see that rematch. I can't wait either. It's going to be amazing. Leon, I'll see you soon, boy.

All right. Thank you, brother. Thanks for being here. Bye, everybody. Thank you.