The Joe Rogan Experience - JRE MMA Show #28 with Georges St-Pierre

Episode Date: May 23, 2018

Joe is joined by Georges St-Pierre discuss fighting and more.

Going to the contender after Freddie Roach. Oh really? Yeah. Nice. Live? Boom. We're live. You want to wear headphones or no? Yeah. It's better like this, right? Do you wear, are your cauliflower ears, they keep you from wearing earbuds? You know those little things that go in your ear? Does I need to wear it? No, I don't need it. You don't need it. You don't have to. I don't have to. Just keep this close to your face and we're good. All right. There we go. What's up, man? How are you? Fantastic. You look good. I feel good. I feel, if it would not be for my ulcer that I had, I would be, I feel better than when I was 25.

What did you have? You had colitis? Yeah, colitis, yeah. What is that? What causes that? We don't really know what caused it, but the best theory is that before my last fight with Michael Bisping, I tried to put on weight, extra weight. So I followed a diet program

that I was eating almost every two hours. And I think your system is like a car. If you do a lot of mileage, it overuses it. So that's what happened with the stress and everything. During my training camp, I had a big problem. I couldn't sleep. I had crazy cramps sometimes. I had blood.

Even when I went to the bathroom at one point I had to go do some tests because I was worried that it was something more like I mean colitis very serious but that it was like cancer or something because I had blood so I did some tests it came out negative and I said to myself I said this fight being delayed, not delayed, but postponed so many times that if I do something, if I say that publicly, what is going on, I'm going to lose the opportunity to fight for the title at 185. So I keep it shut. And I told myself, I said, whatever it is, I'll deal with it after the fight. So I did the fight.

Everything went well. Then after I went to do, it's called a colonoscopy, they put a camera inside of you. And I got diagnosed with ulcerative colitis. That's probably the mix of the stress and also the fact that I was- Constantly eating. I was eating and not only eating, Joe,

I was trying to put on some weight. It was very hard. Sometime I was, I remember many times I was having breakfast but I was regurgitating my breakfast. I was chewing up. Because you were just eating too much food. Yeah, but I had to because I needed to keep myself in a certain weight. And the crazy thing about it is, first now I realize it's a mistake.

I should never have done it. But when I made the weight at 185, the day before the fight, I could not go back up to 190. That's the highest I was going back up. So the day of the fight, I woke up and I had a little breakfast. I threw up my breakfast again. Wow. Yeah, I was really messed up.

Then I went to weigh myself. I was like 190, 190 pounds. Yeah. And what do you think Mike weighed? He felt very strong. I mean, it's not really the weight at this time because the way that you weigh right now, depending what you eat,

you have a lot of stuff inside your intestine and everything, and also water retention. I felt like I had a lot of water retention. Unnecessary weight. Exactly. So it's like that weight. It's like a bag that you carry on your shoulder. So what I should have done, I think, is just stay the same way that I am,

my natural weight. I think the body has a weight that it's best weight to perform an athletic performance, and that's what I should have done. Right. But it was a mistake of my part. It was a big mistake. So you were just thinking that because you're going up to 185 and you're fighting a guy in Bisping that used to fight at 205. Exactly.

He's a pretty big guy. Exactly. I thought that to perform better, I needed to elevate my weight. But by doing that, I create a big problem of health issues. And that colitis didn't exist before that? Not that I got diagnosed for no no and i think that that's what triggered it and so after the fight now that you've gone back to a normal diet has it changed so so after the fight what happened and it's very interesting to i got on medication and i i met a doctor. His name is Jason Fung.

He's in Toronto. People can research. He's an amazing guy. And I met a doctor that treats people with cancer and diabetes with intermittent fasting. So I started doing a program of intermittent fasting and time-restricted eating, and now my symptoms diminish. Like every week, every month, it diminishes. So it's getting better.

It's not 100% now, but it's getting a lot better. A lot better. And I feel a lot better. A lot of people eat like that now. We had Ben Greenfield on yesterday. He's a journalist, does a lot of experimenting with his body. Done a lot of scientific stuff. And scientific research on diet

and restricted eating is a big part of it. He does a lot of that. It's interesting because we're conditioned to think that, oh, I want to gain muscle. I want to get, you know, I need to eat more to accelerate my metabolism. But I never felt better in my life. If it would not be for that particular issue, I feel better now.

I sleep better. Inflammation. And I also did a test. In January, I went to McGill University to do a scan of my weight, my fat percentage, my muscle density, bone density. And in five months months I did it a few days ago like not let not this week the Tuesday of the last week and my my fat percentage has decreased my muscle mass has increased and my weight is at the same hmm then it was in January anything this is all from restricted

eating my my training did not have change. So the only thing that has changed pretty much is the restricted time eating and intermittent fasting, yes. Yeah, that intermittent fasting gives your digestive system a break and it lets your body recuperate better. I think that's what it helped me the most. Yeah, I think that's what it is. I felt like I was, like I said, like a car.

I was putting too much for nothing. And I think as human beings, we're overfed. I'm very interested about paleontology and also history. And I know that human beings in hunter-gatherer time did not eat three meals a day. No. They ate maybe a few times a week but when they eat they eat a lot yeah they need to to do it fast so i think it's more natural for a human being to do so and also i i now i read a lot of stuff and i watch a lot of stuff on the internet about intermittent fasting and time time-restricted eating. And I just wish I knew that before. For so many years, I used to follow the rules,

oh, we need to eat at least three times a day. Right. You know, I don't really care of what I eat, but I've, you know, even though in the morning I was not hungry, I was always forcing myself to eat, which is bad, you know. Yeah. What has changed in your diet? Like, what do you eat?

Like, what's a normal meal for you? I don't really watch what I eat anymore. It's more when I eat. I try to eat healthy, but I don't have a specific diet. Like, for example, like, oh, Tuesday I'm going to eat this, this, this. That's not how it works. I just try to eat healthy, you know this. That's not how it works. I just try to eat healthy. You know, like I try to eat good.

And, of course, I don't look at, oh, this is a dessert. You know, if I want a dessert, a chocolate, I'll get it. I remember that from one of your old videos. Like you were having a glass of wine during training camp. You're like, oh, there's nothing wrong with one glass of wine. Well, if you think about it, Joe, I don't think a glass of wine or anything... Before a fight, we have the tendency to be too much like, oh, what should I eat? What should I do this?

Should I do that? I think it's... Too tense? Too tense, exactly. When I went to Thailand, I met some world champion Thai boxer, and they smoke, they get drunk before the fight. I'm like, you're fighting tomorrow, man.

It's like, oh, it's no problem. But when you think about it, this is an extreme. This is to the other extreme. Yes. But I don't think it has that much of an effect. You know what I used to eat before a fight? My meal of choice, before I got into reading about eating

and stuff like that, I was eating pasta before a fight. Most of my fight, I eat fettuccine Alfredo. That's a lot of carbs. It seems like not bad. It's not bad, but if you talk to, for example, a nutritionist,

he will be like, oh, my God. He will grab his head. He will be like, are you serious? Mike Tyson used to eat that. He used to eat a steak and pasta before his fights. That was my thing. I used to eat pasta all the time, and there's no problem with that for me.

And I felt great. But since I start reading about nutrition and stuff like that, it's like, oh, you need to eat clean, na-na-na. I'm like, it never affects me. I don't think it has that much of a big effect. It's more psychological, I think. Well, it's also you think about how much energy you're burning. I think for the average person, a bowl of pasta is not a good idea.

But for an athlete that's about to fight five five-minute rounds against a world-class fighter you have different energy requirements you know you have different nutrition requirements you can burn off way more fuel you know like i was listening to chad mendez on a podcast the other day and he was talking about how he's so hungry he eats so much that he has to wakes up in the middle of the night and he goes and eats sometimes wow he just can't he can't go a couple hours without eating he just has this crazy metabolism you know what since i discovered time-restricted eating and intermittent fasting now i feel better by training with an empty stomach i feel sharper up here i feel more creative especially in jiu-jitsu i feel better i feel lighter on my feet really

yeah like you do like first jiu-jitsu class in the morning, no food in your stomach? I never have food. I haven't eaten today. The coffee you give me is the first thing I have. So when will you eat? It's 12.24 right now. After this, I'm going to go train with Freddie Roach. And then you'll eat?

Then I'll eat. Wow. And maybe I'll eat another time. I'm a late eater. That's one thing. I'm not too good. I don't like to eat too much early during the day. Yeah. I'm a late eater. That's one thing. I'm not too good. I don't like to eat too much early during the day. I'm not really hungry.

I used to eat because everybody ate. But now I'm like, I'm not going to eat since I've discovered this. I don't eat when I'm not hungry. And the thing is, white people eat is because they're a spike of insulin. So when I started doing intermittent fasting and time-restricted eating, it was hard in the beginning because I was conditioned to eat all the time. But my body acclimated to it. And now it's very easy.

I can eat once a day. It's no problem right now. I could do it. And I think it's good to be hungry in a way. I remember the doctor said something to me. And I think it's good to be hungry in a way. I remember the doctor said something to me. He said, would you rather be like a lion that just had a full belly or an angry lion? I'm like, as a fighter, I'd rather be like an angry lion.

And it makes sense to me. If you look at nature, it makes sense. You know what I mean? It does make sense, especially when you do time-restricted eating. Your body gets used to burning off fat, too, and using fat as fuel. It's true. It's true. That's why I think when I did the test to compare,

my fat percentage diminished. I don't have much fat, but it diminished. And the doctor I met, I says to him, I say, yeah, I gained a lot of weight. He said, don't you think I'm going to lose muscle? He says to me, he believed that the weight that I put on, because now I'm to him, I say, yeah, I gained a lot of weight. He said, don't you think I'm going to lose muscle? He says to me, he believed that the weight that I put on, because now I'm about 185 pounds.

And when I trained for Bisping, I went up to 197. After the weigh-in, I couldn't put back that weight up, so I was 190. He believed that the extra weight that I had was more water retention and residual inside my body. It was not like a solid mass. And it makes sense to me because now I feel much better. And I'm just as strong and even stronger. Like when I do Olympic lifting, much stronger. Gymnastic, much stronger.

Like I feel sharper. Yeah, and you said it reduced your inflammation as well. It does. I have sometimes elbows, you know, much stronger. Like, I feel sharper. Yeah, and you said it reduced your inflammation as well. It does. I have sometimes elbows, you know, like problems. You used to have always that big inflated elbow. Yes. Like a swollen elbow. What was that?

It was a... Bursitis or something like that? It was a bursitis. Bursitis. That was during my fight of Tiago Alves, but I got a surgery to take away the residual, the bone chip inside my elbow. Is that from landing elbows?

I think it's just use. Just using it? But now I don't have any problem anymore. I don't feel like, it used to be a chronic thing that I used to feel once in a while. Sometimes it came and it goes, but since I started this, it didn't come at all. I feel great. I can touch my two shoulders like this. When you came back, it's very interesting because with a lot of people,

they take time off and then they come back and you wonder what they're going to look like. But one of the things that I was very hopeful with you is that you've always been almost a martial artist first and a fighter second, in that you're always learning and you're always been almost a martial artist first and a fighter second, in that you're always learning and you're always practicing. You would always take time in between camps and you would do jiu-jitsu in Brazil or you would be constantly practicing your Muay Thai. You're always trying to learn and improve your game. And I was thinking when you came back, it was like,

you were saying that you were better than ever. I'm like, man, he might be better than ever. Like, you're the one guy that I believed. Because a lot of times guys come back, you're like, man, he's been out of the game a long time. Who knows how hard he's been training? Because a lot of fighters, when they're not in camp, when they're not preparing for a fight, they don't like to train that much. Because the grind of camp almost wears them. You know how you see a lot of fighters after they retire, they get really fat?

Yeah. And you're like, wow, how can he get fat? I was looking at Maidana the other day. There's a picture of Maidana's, Chino Maidana. He's got an Instagram page. He's fat as fuck. He's got a cigar. He's drinking a whiskey.

I mean, he just fought Floyd Mayweather a couple years ago. He was ripped. They retire and they don't give a fuck anymore. They're like, I don't want to do this anymore. But you, I knew you were still training. Because I would see like in the Henzo Gracie, the guys who were training with you there, and I knew you were training with Donaher. I knew you

were constantly training and you looked good. So I was like... When I left off more than four years ago i i i knew i wanted to come back uh because i was not in an happy place had a lot of personal uh problems and i should have even stopped earlier than after my fight with andrew if i would have stopped earlier i would have maybe come back earlier as well. It was, I was, I felt like I was like, kind of a feeling of a claustrophobic feeling, you know, like I couldn't breathe well, I couldn't sleep well,

my mind. Too much pressure? Too much pressure, personal problems, so much stuff. A lot of stuff happened to me that it's still too early in my life, and for the respect of some people, I know I couldn't about it one day i will all mixed together i knew it was a drug issue in the sport i feel i felt it i did feel well and i was trying to perform under those conditions and it was catching up to me yeah and um i did it but the reason why I think I didn't lose the edge is a lot of people, because we do an extreme sport.

It's like what we do is kind of a life and death situation. It's not because there's a referee, but the spirit is the same as a gladiator or a person in a war that goes to war. He thinks he's going to die. It's the same spirit. Even though it's not the same thing, we go there in the same spirit that we're ready to give it all.

It's such an extreme feeling that once you don't have that in your life, life kind of becomes boring. You feel like you're not alive anymore. So that's why when people stop, they retire and they try to come back. A lot of the people, they fall into drugs because they want to catch up to that. They want to feel alive again.

So they need that sensation that they had previously. But they couldn't get it back unless they do drugs or they do something crazy extravagant. The thing with me is I knew I was going to come back. And also I always like to train and keep myself in shape. And I never did drugs. I never did hard drugs. I drink. I drink sometimes.

For my birthday last Saturday, I went out and I was completely wasted. It is what it is. I like to deteriorate myself sometimes. I'm not perfect. Just have a little fun. Exactly. And what's the goal of doing this if you're not enjoying your life?

What's the goal of it? Right. You know, people to fight, they say, no, I don't like to fight. And that is another thing I like to talk to you about. People say, why you do that if you don't like to fight?

It's like because I like my lifestyle, you know, that it gives me. But that's why people, I believe, if we come back to what you say, that's why I think people, they have back to what you say that's why i think people they have a hard time to come back after so many years because they fall into that trap right they need to feel alive so they they find ways to that they make them feel alive but it's they it's deteriorating deteriorate themselves yeah and i didn't do that i did not do that

and i would never will hopefully i can It's not my thing, you know? So when you decided to come back, how far out did you decide? Like, you took four years off. How many years in were you like, I think I'm ready to come back? When I see USAIDA and the drug testing program being implemented, the USADA and the drug testing program being implemented, then I saw a lot of... A lot of people deflate. Yes, a lot of people...

Did you feel vindicated? Huh? Did you feel vindicated when you saw some of these people just... I feel a little bit of... I mean, it feels bad to wish people bad luck to get some kind of recognition, but that's not what I want to do. I don't wish people

bad luck but if you cheat you cheat man and a lot of people got caught and finally a lot of people in the beginning including my own friend they think like I was talking to some of my own friend they say oh you're paranoid you become paranoid you need to take a break you you're going crazy just retire get out you know they you're paranoid because I was retire, get out, you're paranoid. Because I was talking about it a long time before Hendrix, and everybody was disregarding me. But then when it happened, a lot of the champions fell, and a lot of the heroes in the sport,

they got pointed out with their fingers, hey, he's a cheater. So now it became real. So when I saw that happen, it was, for me, a beginning to start. And now it's time to come back, you know, because I'm a guy of, if I said something, you know, I'm going to do it. I don't want to come back when the sport was dirty. That's one of my thing.

And so when I decided to come back, I had a big talk with one of my trainers, John Denard and Firas. They're my two main guys. And they're like my friend, my brother with me. I mean, I'm undefeated with these two guys. You know, they're like, I need them when I fight. That's some serious knowledge between those two men. They mix together.

It's crazy. You know, they're two different persons, very different. They both studied philosophy. They're very interesting people for me to talk with because they have two different mentalities. They see the world in different ways. So I like to have both of their expertise. So John, he told me, he said, listen, he said, you always have three big criticizes when you are fighting.

You just never went up of a weight class. You never, people say that you're kind of boring, you're too much cerebral, technical. You don't want to take unnecessary risks which make the fight boring. And also, you don't finish your opponent. You know, that was one of my big criticizes. So I decided to come back

and we changed the way I was training because the way you train reflects the way you fight. You know, people say, oh, I'm not going to train too hard. I'm going to do this in training, but when it's time to fight, I'm going to step up. There going to train too hard. I'm going to do this and training. But when it's time to fight, I'm going to step up. There is no step up.

You're just going to do what you did every day. So I decided to change a few things and to correct those three things. And that's what happened. I'm happy it worked out well, but that was my goal. I wanted to come back for something that excited me, something that was different something that was unique and rare you know and and i didn't want to come back to do the same thing i was doing before and that's why i decided to come back well when you came back first of all you came back you fought a very tough guy right you fought a big michael bisping at 185 pounds but what was impressive to me is like you you didn't look like you were gone like you like right away you it felt

like you felt right back into the groove again you didn't look out of place you didn't look uncomfortable and you were showing things especially different things with your kicking and your movement that we hadn't seen from you before? It looked like you had improved. I was tested in the training. Even Feras, some of the guys, Feras went to tell them, he whispered to them, if you knock out George and Sparring,

I'll give you money. Really? Yeah, man. He's crazy. Feras is crazy. Feras is my worst enemy in training sometimes. He tells people, if you beat George, if you hurt George, I'm going to glorify you. I'm going to talk about you. We're going to be happy.

That's the opposite of what a lot of people think a training camp should be for a champion. It depends what kind of, you know, we don't train like this every day, but for my hard sparring, when I'm training for a fight, I have two days. For my last training camp, I had two days that it was like hard sparring. We called it shoot box fight, shoot box fighting, which we put the big gloves, the shin pad, and his feet to floor. Once we touch the floor, we stop and we go back up. And that was the area of expertise where

Bisping was the most competent. The striking department. He's going on the floor so I was bringing in a lot of good guys for sparring with me in that particular training.

It's hard to find someone that is exactly like the guy you're going to fight, but you can find a guy that does things better than him in a particular area. I cannot find a replica of Michael Bisping who's complete as much as Michael Bisping, but I can find a guy, for example, I had a guy coming from Spain. His name is Cesar. He's a K-1 fighter, and he's a big guy. He's like 205 pounds, and he's big, and he's a very, very good kickboxer.

So I had him during my training camp. I flew him from Spain. I had a different bunch of guys that I was training with. And all these guys that I was training with, they are not like Michael Bisping, but in a certain area that I was training with them, it could be grappling or shoot box or a different area. They could be just as good or maybe better than Michael Bisping. So that's how I do my training camp. You know, I remember when you brought,

how do you say his last name? Skarbowski? Jean-Charles Skarbowski. Yeah. What a character. What a character indeed. When you brought him to work with you on The Ultimate Fighter and he would be partying all night drunk and show up at the gym the next day and still fuck everybody up. Yeah.

And did that guy influence your idea about just being more relaxed in training and just not worrying about it as much? Yeah, but he's a different, like it's a total different extreme, you know? Like I don't believe in that extreme. But Jean-Charles, yeah. I remember the producer of the show, The Ultimate Fighter, when he was supposed to stay one week, and when he was about to stay, the producer of the show, The Ultimate Fighter, he was supposed to stay one week, and when he was about to stay, the producer was telling me,

hey, can we keep him for the rest of the show? Because it was good TV, you know? So I'm like, I don't know, I'm going to ask him. And at the same time, a lot of the people on my team, they were like, man, okay, that's enough now. We got what we need. And I was like, yeah, I like him, but I need to kind of babysit him at the same time.

But the knowledge that this guy had and he gave us was just a big edge. But yeah, Charlie's a different extreme, Joe. I think there is a center line that you need to keep. That's what I believe. I believe in life, it's not white, it's not black, it's always gray. There's middle zone for everything, I believe.

I think you're right about that. When you have a camp and you set up a camp and you have Donaher and Firas, do they essentially, are they the architects of the whole camp? Do they get together and try to figure out what you're doing and when you're doing it and how is For us the guy who handles like more of the striking aspects of it or putting the grappling and striking together I am a little bit the head guy in a way, you know

I believe as a fighter you need to be the head guy. You're the maestro we have the people that work with you. But you need to know how to use these people good. For instance, I don't know nothing about business, but I have agents that are there to negotiate fight. They know numbers.

They know about investment. I have another guy who knows about fiscality. He's a lawyer and he's good for a tax report. I don't know nothing, but I know how to get the good people to help me for that particular thing. So Feras and John, for me,

are the most competent people that I can have to help me going to fight someone. John, especially in the grappling area, but John is not only in grappling. The difference with John and Feras that makes them very unique as trainers they're not really only trainers

they're teachers and I would say the same thing about Freddie Roach same thing about Freddie Roach they're not only trainers they're teachers the way I structure my training camp there is like a pyramid the first layer, the foundation is physical.

Are you in shape? Are you VO2 max? Are you in shape? Are you in good condition? No injuries? Athletism. Are you an athlete? Are you a good athlete?

This is the physical layer. This is the wider one, that's the bottom one. It's like a pyramid. Then it goes up one layer. The technical layer. Do you know what to do with your knowledge? Do you know a number?

Defense to a triangle choke, how to counter a jab, how do you... You know, technical aspect, in terms of knowledge of fighting. That's where the trainer comes into play also, the physical, the technical. And a lot of the trainers, they don't have the last layer or they only have one of those or two of those,

but they don't have the three layers. That's where Feras, John, and also I would say Freddie in boxing comes into play. But in MMA, especially Feras and John, the tactical layer, which is the last one, that's what separates contenders and champion. There's the physical, the technical, and the tactical. Let's say we're equal. We're the same person. What's going to make the difference between me winning against you

or you winning against me is the tactical. Because we're the same person, we're a complete replica. We're a clone. The difference is the tactical. I will know where I can take you out of your comfort zone and I can bring the fight where I'm the strongest and fight you to eliminate the odds where the fight will

stoop the odds of me winning to my advantage. That's where John and Feras are masters at this and Freddie Roach is masters at this in boxing. That's why I'm so I feel very lucky to have this guy with me in my corner

because they're competent in these three layers, physical, technical, and tactical, which most trainers can have only one, two, or maybe they don't have three. It's very rare to find a trainer who can do these three things. So when you get to the tactical layer, is this something that you all agree on do you discuss it like when you when you're approaching a fight like say michael bisping yeah like what how does how do you uh how do you do it you say this is what i see in his fights and then faraz gives his input and john gives his input and then freddy gives his his input and you start discussing what's the best way to handle it. So coming into that fight with

Michael Bespin, Michael Bespin was very well prepared, he has a very good team with Jason Parello so we were expecting you always have to gauge also to know you and to know your opponent. Sometimes knowing your opponent is easier than knowing yourself. So you have to be realistic about your strengths and weaknesses and how you're going to match up against your opponent.

With Michael Bisping, what messed me up a little bit and all of us, is we were expecting Michael Bisping to come straight at me, try to take me out right away. Instead of that, it was moving, especially more in the second round. So the first round, I was doing well, but in the second round, it started moving away

and instead of coming at me, it was more trying to run away from me. And that's why a lot of people, they said to me, man, because I lost the second round against Michael Bisping. And people was like, man, what happened to you? It seems like you slowed down a little bit.

It's not only that I slowed down, it's also I got hit with a very strong right hand, right on the bottom by a guy who maybe outweighed me 20 pounds, you know? So it slows a man down. It's not that my cardio was bad. My cardio was fine, but we get punched on the bottom. It slowed a man down, and he caught me off guard.

He changed his strategy from round one to round two. He became more like a runner instead of a hunter kind of guy. And so he caught you with a counter shot? What he did is very smart. He couldn't get to me. If you look at the replay of the fight with Michael Bisping, he couldn't get to me straight to my head. He was trying to hit me with his jab, with his strike,

tried to target my head, but I was too fast for him. So I don't know if it's his trainer or him who decided to change. So he decided to be like a runner. So I decided to try to chase him a decided to change. So he decided to be like a runner. So I decided to try to chase him a little bit more. And what happened to me, he jabbed my lead hand, which squared me,

and then he connected me straight on the chin. At the same time, I was trying to throw a leg kick. So it was a perfect timing, beautiful execution. And I don't know if he practiced that, but it was very well done, very smart. Instead of trying to target my head, he jabbed my hand and hit me with the rear hand. And that's what hurt me. It hurt

me. I tried to put a poker face during that fight, but it hurt me. It's one of the strikes that hurt me the most. Even though Michael Bisping is not known as a knockout guy, this shot really hurt me, because the Even though Michael Bisping is not known as a knockout guy, this shot really hurt me because the precision was, the timing was good. Yeah, I've never understood

why people don't think he hits hard. I mean, look what he did to Brockhold. Nah. He hits fucking hard. I think it's, what hurts someone in a fight, I mean, what can put away someone is not necessarily the power,

but it's more precision and timing. And that particular right hand was perfectly timed and with great precision. So that's why I got hurt. And that particular right hand was perfectly timed and with great precision. So that's why I got hurt. And you win the second round. Then I had to make adjustments for the third round. That's when Freddie, John, and Ferraz come into play.

They saw what he was doing. And they say, after the right hand just slipped and come with the hook over the top, and the right hand, that's what I did. And then he knocked him down. But in a fight, whatever your trainer tells you, if you didn't practice it, it's not going to work. I mean, you don't have time to think. It's autopilot.

So I was on autopilot. Sometimes you just need some some kind of guidance That put you back your that put your autopilot in the right direction. That's what happened into that fight a reminder Yes a little reminder. Hey We're not going this way going this way. Okay, then you then it's still the autopilot But it's different direction. The crazy thing about Mike is that he has very poor vision in his right eye. A lot of people might not know about it, but in the Vitor Belfort fight, he damaged his retina very badly. He's had several surgeries, and he's got oil in his eye that's sort of like protecting it. And he'll have it fixed once he's done fighting.

But, you know, if you look at him, one of his eyes is darker than the other eye. That's true. And that's that right eye. And did you particularly target things going to that right side, like things off of your left side? Yeah, it's a lot of things that were drilled on with the left hook. That's why, like, when I hit him with the left hook, that was a lot of— Because he felt he would have a left hook that was a lot of

It does but the thing is with Michael is he adjust himself very well to this, you know Like like it's like a he knows it and probably knows it himself, but the way he fights he adjusted very well You know, he put himself in a position that he cannot get hit Often with this, you know, especially in my fight So I needed almost to wait for him to commit with the right hand to come over the top. And if you look at the fight with Kevin Gastelum, it's the same thing. He missed with the right hand, and then he got countered.

It's always when he missed with the right hand that he got countered. The Kelvin fight, I think, was a mistake. It was a mistake because he was not prepared for this. He didn't... Well, it's also he just got off of a crazy fight with you. It was bad. I think it was a bad mistake from his part.

But look, to his credit, he tried to do something that I do try to do all the time. He tried to do something unique and very special. And if he would have won, we would not have this discussion. We would be saying like, man, what a comeback. It's unbelievable he he lose a title come back straight to fight kelvin gaston what's amazing you know what i mean yeah he took a risk man and i can't blame him for that i took

a risk myself too it's just sometimes you roll the dice you know when you expect things to go your way and it didn't go his way yeah I felt bad, but it is what it is. Even he said that when he came out to that fight, the Kelvin Gaston fight, he just didn't feel like he had. He just didn't feel there. Of course he didn't feel there because he didn't have the time to prepare for this. Like I said, you're not going to go into a fight and improvise everything. You're going to do the same thing you've been doing in training.

What have you been doing in training? You didn't have enough time to prepare for that particular type of body, that particular type of, like I said, physical, technical, and tactical,

which is the most important one. You didn't have the tactical preparation. Physical was not probably 100% as well. And the technical is there because it's his brain but you know

it's like he didn't program his autopilot to react to a certain situation that Kelvin will give him it was he's a lefty

shorter stockier you know different style than me completely different it's like he couldn't have a different a more

different style than me than this guy. But he won the title that way. He won the title on 11 days notice. I agree. It's like it worked for him in the past. It worked for him in the past, but he didn't get knocked down or choked out before he fight Rocco. That messed up your recuperation too, you know what I mean?

He was fresh probably. I don't know. Maybe he wasn't. I don't know. Maybe he wasn't. I don't know personally what he was doing. How many weeks later was it? He was not, maybe not even a month or something like that. Yeah, something like that. He would not have been cleared to fight if he would have been in America.

I don't think he would have been cleared to fight. I think he would not have been cleared to fight. I think he was suspended, I think. I don't think so. I think it would not have been clear to fight. I think it was suspended, I think. I don't think so. I think so. I think because it was in China, it's different.

Three weeks. Wow. Three weeks. Yeah, man. Yeah, that seems pretty close. Yeah. Yeah, because you hurt him with that left hook

and then you choked him unconscious. If it would be me, maybe I'm not as courageous as Michael Bisping, I would not take the fight. Even me, if I win the fight as Michael Bisping, I would not take the fight. Even me, if I win the fight with Michael Bisping, I would not take the fight.

Is that the word, though? Courageous? You're a pretty courageous guy. Is it courageous or is it tactical? Yeah, tactical. I would not have taken that risk. But I'm not in his shoes. I don't know his environment.

Maybe he would have... That toughness has paid off for him, though. I mean, he's one of the toughest Fucking guys in the sport He always has been And that toughness Is the reason why He's like Fuck it I'll fight again

Yeah Let's do it He's just a fucking animal He's a He's a great Example of hard work Yeah Perseverance

And You know like When you say like Everything is possible It is Yeah He's an unbelievable

unbelievable fighter this guy you know and he's courageous and what I like about him too

he stands for the same thing that I stand for against performance enhancing drug and I think it's very important for me

and for me it was like an honor fighting him it was like a lot of guys he lost to it this guy that they would have been cut on performance enhancing drugs and and he's very open he talks about it all the time and you know it's i think it's great great model for the sport yeah i know

i agree i agree and a great model for it's just an example of how you can achieve great things if you work hard. And that's what he's done. He's one of the guys that, like, I hate him when I wasn't training him, but I loved him as well at the same time. I remember at one point we were in a conference in Toronto. And that is an hilarious story. After the conference, we go by kind of the back door of a mall. And there's like, I don't know if it was staged or not.

I mean, I'm not aware if it was staged. I was not aware of it. So there's a camera, like I think it was TMZ or something. It was a camera that follow us. So there is kids following us. They're about to ask us, to ask me to take pictures. And then I see a camera coming towards me, and then I see Michael. That's after the conference.

And Michael says to me, he's like, don't you F put your hand on me again, because na-na-na-na. Then I look in his face, and I'm like, what? I was like, you don't put your hand. And then he creates kind of a buzz for the fight, and we start to shout at each other, and kind of almost push each other,

and then Jason Perreault come, boys, leave it for the fight, boys. Then, so, but it's not staged, it's true, and I'm like, man, what the hell he's doing there? But then after I realized it, it was on TMZ, there were a camera there, then the kids who came to ask me for an autograph, they kind of get intimidating.

They were like, they went back. Then I turn around and say, it's okay, it's finished. Now you can come and go. When they went back to their apartment, I'm like, oh God, what it is, what it is, you know? But that was probably the best promotion of the whole fight,

like that particular incident, you know what I mean? So I hate him and I love him the same way. Michael is kind of a guy that is a pro at boosting the anticipation for a fight. Hype. You want to hate him, but you kind of love him in the same way for the human being that he is. No, he's great at talking shit, for sure. That is a big thing these days, especially after Conor.

Conor McGregor has kind of changed the sport in a lot of ways. That shit-talking is a huge factor now. It is, but sometimes you don't know when it's real, when it's not, because it's not part of my personality. It is, but sometimes you don't know when it's real, when it's not, because it's not part of my personality. Same thing at the ESPN in Boston. Same thing. We do an interview.

We go back and forth, blah, blah, blah, blah, kind of almost insulting each other, so to speak. Then the UFC does everything to separate us from one of each other. I'm like, I don't know if it's real or not. I don't even know if he's trying to push me. I'm going to push him back because I feel threatening. So you don't know if it's real or not. I don't even know if he's trying to push me. I'm going to push him back because I feel threatening. So you don't know if it's hype or if he's really

ready to fight. Because I'm not an instigator. I don't like confrontation, but it is what it is. So I go to the bathroom in between. Who comes next to the bathroom with us?

It's Michael Biss. Then there's the camera that follows us in the bathroom. We're taking a piss next to each other. We're like this. Then I turn around and see Michael Biss and I's the camera that follows us in the bathroom we're taking a piss next to each other we're like this then I turn around

I see Michael Biss I'm like holy shit then the camera then he tell the camera to F out he's like get out then the camera goes out then he look at me

look at him then he start laughing then I start laughing then I told him I said hey you got a Range Rover he's like yeah but now he's in the garage I'm like yeah you need to get rid of it because after a while Then I told him, I said, hey, you got a Range Rover? He's like, yeah.

But now he's in the garage. I'm like, yeah. He's like, you need to get rid of it because after a while, it starts breaking down. He's like, yeah, I know. I was like, okay, game face. See you later. How do you want to hate a guy like this? You know what I mean?

That's hilarious. But I hate him because when we insult each other, we say real insult and real things that we think about each other, but in a way we have the respect. Yeah. So it's real. So that relationship that I have with Bisping was very unique. I didn't have the same relationship with Diaz, for example. Diaz, I didn't know if I meet him even in the street, maybe he hates my guts.

I don't know what he's going to do. I don't know if he wanted to fight in the street today. Maybe he hates my guts. Like, I don't know what he's going to do. I don't know if he wanted to fight me. He might really want to fight you. Like, he's not a hype guy. No, I think he takes it personal. I think he's, man, it's a freaking sport, man. It's more to life than what it is. People say, oh, fighting is my, no, man, fighting is not my life, man.

My life is my family, man, is my friend, the people I love. This is what I do in my life. It's not my life. Fighting is over. It's over. I turn around and do something else. You know what I mean? Like, it's what I do in my life.

It's not my life. You know what I mean? It's not the end of the world, man. It's more to life than fighting. It's not the end of the world, man. It's more to life than fighting. It's funny hearing that from you because you would expect to hear that from someone who isn't considered one of the greatest of all time. But you're considered one of the greatest of all time. So it would be very hard to argue your approach because it's been so successful.

But people think they have to be super obsessed. I'm super obsessed, Joe, but that's why I become crazy and I stopped for four years. And then when I came back, some of my circuit in the brain, then I started to analyze myself. I'm like, why I become crazy? Why did I stop? Because I'm taking this stuff too seriously, man. You have to take it for what it is. It's a world championship fight.

I'm fighting, I was fighting Michael Bismay after four years. People, oh my God. The fight are promoted on drama. Yeah. And like John said,

John Danner, he says, fight are not won on drama. Are won on mundane things that we do every day. Yeah. That's how fights are won. How you program your cruise driver,

your autopilot to win the fight. That's how you... Me, I see it, I fight like an autopilot. So when I fight, when I prepare myself for a fight, especially for the tactical part, program like a computer how i want to react against that specific problem how i'm going to take care of that that specific problem the only way to program it is to do repetition repetition and repetition and repetition and repetition it's like yeah you said at one point eddie bravo he said like said like tying up your shoes.

Yes. Because we've been doing it so many times. You can talk to someone, the same thing. Yes. When I get into a fight, I analyze again and I'm fighting. And I see what pattern he does the most often. So I want to program my computer to react to that pattern that would give me the advantage into the fight. I don't know when that pattern would occur,

but I want to program myself that when it occurs, I have an answer for it right away. I don't have to think about it. I don't think, I just react. And that's my problem when I used to fight and I got a lot of criticism before I was thinking too much. Towards the end of my career, I had so much pressure. I didn't perform as well as I was earlier,

especially my last fight before I stopped for the four years. I was thinking too much, overthinking, putting too much pressure. Like you said, it's too serious. You have to take it for what it is. It's only a fight. In 10 years, you know it sucks if you lose, but, man, it is what it is. You know what I mean?

Don't take it for, don't make it bigger than what it is it's only a fight and sometimes it's something very therapeutic that I like to do before a fight I drive a car when I fight in Vegas for example I drive a car or New York I drive a car

when I used to fight in Vegas, before my fights, I used to be very, very stressed. And one of the very therapeutic things that I like to do is drive my car around and see normal people. Then I go and... Can I explain to you? I drive and I see an old lady

with her grocery store bag. And I'm thinking, she doesn't care if I win the fight Saturday or not. She's not even going to hear about it. Then I look, oh, it's another guy yelling to another guy because whatever problem or this guy is going to the bank to pay his mortgage

stuff. They don't care. They don't care. The effect that I have on the universe is so freaking small. Nobody cares. I'm the only one putting is so freaking small. Nobody cares. I'm the only one putting the pressure on me. Nobody gives a damn about it. So that's why they helped me to perform.

That's how some younger guys, they say, I'm nervous. I heard you don't sleep well the night before. I say, yeah, it's true. I don't sleep well. What is your trick? How do you find a way to sleep well? I was like, I don't really sleep well either nowadays.

They say, but how do you feel better about it? I just know that I'm not going to sleep well, and it's not going to affect the outcome of the competition. It's just a normal thing. You learn how to deal with it better. You're not going to change it. Just accept it. The stress is your friend, man, that's going to make you react.

That's going to be on the edge. Have you ever slept well before a fight never never only one time which fight when i fought matt sarah and i got knocked out and then after that knocked out i got so scared that it happened again it's the most humiliating day of my career i was so so angry. Like I said, I was like putting too much on myself. It started there. It's like,

I didn't even want to go to buy eggs at the grocery store because people, they look, oh, you got knocked out. I thought everybody cares about me. Nobody cares about you. Nobody cares.

It's only a small percentage of population. Nobody gives a damn. And even if they do, what? You make a mistake, you zig when you should have zagged, you get clipped. So what? Everybody makes mistakes. You have to take fight like it is. It's a sporting event. That's why I don't take it personally.

When I have the problem with the diaspora, I have no problem. And that fight is not personal for me. You're in my life now. You won't diaspora, no problem, man. It's a fight. It's not personal for me. You're in my life now. You won't be there in 10 years maybe. Maybe you will. Who knows? It's only like a chunk of life that we share together.

And then after he's gone, no problem with that. That's definitely a better attitude to look at it that way. Yeah, man. That's the way it is. That's how an athlete should think, you know. And that knowledge that I have is with years and years of competition. All the problems I have, the colitis and all that, that's because of that BS that I got.

Like putting too much on me. It's normal. If I fight again, it will go back the same pattern. I will be very stressed, and it's normal to be stressed, but I will accept it. I accept it better now to be stressed, but I will accept it. I accept it better now than I used to do when I was younger. Now, after you won the title, there was thoughts of whether or not you would defend it, if you were going to fight Robert Whitaker, like what you were going to do.

What caused your decision? What made you decide to relinquish the belt? So the reason why I relinquished the belt is I want to do some physical tests to see what is the problem with my health condition. Because during the camp, I knew I had a problem, but I didn't know what it was. I knew it was, you know, the blood test and everything for the cancer, it came negative.

So, after I went to do, like I said, a colonoscopy, it came back that I had a nose sore inside my stomach. Then I asked the doctor, I said, how long it takes to get rid of this? He says, it's all your life. But the symptom can go up, down, depending on people, whatever they do differently. Then I started researching who's the best doctor, how can I do this? And that's when I started reading about the fasting and stuff. and that's when I started reading about the fasting and stuff.

And then I tried it, but I saw that a lot of, you know, in the sport of MMA, a lot of the guys are starving. They're not rich, you know. I'm lucky now I have enough money for the rest of my life. I don't need to fight anymore, you know, if I don't do nothing crazy like buying a private airplane. And I'm not that kind of person or falling into drugs and stuff. Like, I think I'm good, you know, for me, my family and everything.

I think I'm good. However, when I'm looking at the landscape, I see a lot of guys like, for example, Conor McGregor. He holds on to the title for the attention, attention the sponsors that this and that and a lot of people do that that they kind of stole the division and i said to myself i said you know i stand for for the fighters i always did you know and publicly i said why am i gonna keep the title until to see if i feel better or not and defend it because i don't even know if my like my weight was dropping down it's like i i'm not even a 185 i'm more i'm 170 or 155 years i'm not i don't have the size of a 185 years so i'm like i i relinquished it right away you know i don't want to stall the division

and make people wait because of me you know the don't go around me. You know what I mean? So for the respect, I did it. But I didn't know before the fight I was going to do this. It happened like this. People were like, oh, yeah, you know. No, I didn't know it was going. I didn't know I was going to have a colitis and all that stuff. It came up.

I never tried it before. I didn't know what would be the outcome I would feel. I never did it. It was a test and the same time,. I didn't know what would be the outcome I would feel. I never did it. It was a test, but I didn't know. I'm not a perfect man, Joe. I have a lot of negative stuff about me. But one thing that I'm not is that I'm not a coward. This I swear. If I say I'm going to do something I'm going to do, I'm not a coward. And every of my fights, I'm scared was I'm scared. I'm scared. I'm terrified. But whatever I feel, I step and I

I respect my contract and I do it, you know? And I didn't know the colitis and all that. It would be illogical right now if I want to go back when I'm ready to go back 185. I'm not 185, you know, right, right

It would be a stupid move. And so if you're gonna fight again, it would be 170 or 155 Yes, what where were you leaning? Are you leaning towards 55 or 70? I? Don't know I'm Lee. I'm gonna I want to lean were If I want, lane where if I, you know, I've climbed the Everest many times. You know, I've climbed it once. I lose to Matthews. Then I climb it twice.

I lose. Then I got it. Then I lose to Massaro. Then I climb it again. I've done it like three times. I'm 37 years old. I just turned 37 a few days days ago i don't have much left right and for what i have left i want to make the the the big fight the fight that the

fan want to see they want to enjoy um i also want personally for me to achieve something that is unique that is rare that maybe I've never been attempted before. That would be something that excites me. And I'm not only driven by money. It's good to have money. We like money. It drives us all, including myself, but it's not the unique thing that drives me.

It needs to be more than money. It needs to be some kind of achievement, something that comes with it that would exc drive me. It needs to be more than money. It needs to be some kind of achievement that comes with it that would excite me. So what would that be? That would be a 155 pound title. They offer me Nate Diaz now. Yeah.

It was a rumor. They said it was a done deal. It's not a done deal. Not on my part. And I don't think it was on Nate Diaz's part as well, because from what I've heard, his brother, Nick, and even Nate says that's his big brother's fight. It's not his fight. Nate Diaz is an incredible fighter, very well-rounded.

However, if you put yourself in my shoes, there's nothing good that can come out of it, except money, and money is not the only thing that drives me. If I beat Nate Diaz decisively, some people will say, most people will say, oh, he took an easy fight

or whatever. The criticism will say, oh, he's a bully. You fought 155 pounds. Yeah, he fought a smaller guy that competed a smaller, maybe he's not even smaller than me. Maybe we're about,

most, a lot of 155-er guys are bigger than me right now. Nate's a big guy. He's a big guy. He's about the same size as me, but because I compete at 170 for most of my career.

And you won the title at 185. Yes, it will make me look bad. It will make me look like a bully. And this is if I win decisively. For example, if I win, not decisively, if I win like it's a war back and forth, people will say, ah, you suck, you

cannot even, you know what I mean? And if I get beat, oh my God, forget it. It's for my legacy. It's the end of the world. All the work I put in is finished. And I could have a bad day. Something that I discovered too during my career is being the strongest man in the world, that was my dream when I was young.

That's why I did UFC. I wanted to be the stronger man in the world. And I realized over the years, it did not exist. You cannot be the stronger man in the world. This is an illusion. I love the younger guy. They say, oh, the baddest man. No, you're not, man. It doesn't

exist. You would be strong. You would be a better fighter than this guy at that particular day, at that particular location, at that particular moment. Maybe in an hour, if the fight would occur an hour later, an hour before, or maybe in a different place where

the altitude is higher or lower or different scenario, different environment, you will lose that fight. It's always a question of odds. You know what I mean? So being the stronger man in the world, it does, it's style makes fight. Maybe we're three guys. I beat you, you beat him, he beat me. Who's the best guy? There's no best guy. Right. That's MMA math, right? It is like this. That's the way to see it. So there is no stronger man in the world.

You say, oh, I'm the baddest man on the planet because I'm champion. Like, the belting is an illusion, the belting. The belting is a symbol, but it's an illusion. It doesn't exist. You're not the stronger man in the world. I know a lot of people will disagree with me, but it is what it is.

If you ask most experienced fighters, most people will think the same way. Because we realize at one point, like when we're young because of our confidence or maybe the cockiness or confidence, not that it fades, but we see we have more experience, knowledge. We realize it's all BS. It's not true. So the UFC offered you Nate Diaz. Did you consider it at all? Or was it like immediately?

I consider it. I consider it. However, I analyze it. I talk with Feras, with my trainer and everybody. We were all on the same page on that. It's like, it's not worth it. But did the UFC announce it? Did they say

that they were working on it? I think they announced it. I'm not sure. I think they said it was a done deal. Look, it's not the first time it happened.

And I'm not, they have a business to run the UFC. And their biggest fear is someone take the title and run with it. And it's been, I've been doing it two times

with Johnny Hendricks and with Michael Bisping. Right. Like I run. They say I run, but it's for reasons. There's always a reason. And that's their biggest fear.

Sure. And I understand that. They have a business to run. But it's like WWE when Andre the Giant passed the torch to Hulk Hogan. He passed the torch

because it's for the business and he agreed to pass the torch. Yes. But the thing in this sport, we're not in WWE. It's my life on the line here.

Yes. I don't care about the business. I do what is the best for my interest to me. Sure, you have to. I have to. I have to be selfish. And I am selfish.

I say it openly. I say it to the fans, to everybody. I am selfish because it's a sport that I can die, man. You can die in this sport. And this is the truth. You can get, or maybe not die, but it could create your death in the next time to come,

in the next year. Maybe you get a blow that messed up something in your brain because of a trauma that created something else. So it's a very serious sport, man. It's not like you play hockey, you play baseball,

you play football, you don't play fighting. So you do it for yourself. You do what is best for yourself. The organization will do what is best for the organization. They're not your friend. So that's why the relation I have with Dana and some of the guys in UFC,

it's a very special relationship. Maybe one day we'll sit down and we'll talk about the good old days and have a blast, have a laugh. But right now, I'm always on the defensive. When my phone rings, I see Dana now, I'm always on the defensive. When my phone rings, I see that and I'm like, God damn. Then I say what I should say, what I should not say.

No, no, no, no. And I'm completely honest about it. It's like some fighters say, no, man, I just... If you do that, it's because you're an idiot if you do that. If you just take any fight to get... Yeah, oh, yeah, I'll fight. No, it doesn't work like that. The ascension to be champion

is not a straight line. It's this, oh, it's an obstacle. Then you come back. It is what it is. It is what it is. And you need to be surrounded by smart people.

And if you don't have smart people, you need to be smart enough to find those people that are competent that will help you in particular domain that you're not competent to make the job for you and complete your circle you know yeah dana was saying

for a while that you didn't want to fight he was saying george doesn't want to fight he said before i didn't want to fight before i fought bisping you know he said that why do you think he was saying that do you think he was putting pressure on you psychologically like fucking with your head yeah so i'm so my ego will make me okay yeah, okay, I'll show you that I can fight. Bring me this guy. Right, right. Yeah, that's what it is, man. It's a freaking game.

It's all a game. We say it's not a game. It's real now. It's all a game. It's all business. It's all a game. I like Dana. Dana, man, the sport was nowhere.

Yeah. The sport was gone, man. It didn't go nowhere. Because of Dana. We owe Dana my living. I owe it to Dana White. When I do the UFC weigh-ins, when I introduce everybody, I point to him, I say,

Dana White, without him, none of this would be possible. And you're right, 100%. 100%. He's the best pound-for-pound promoter of all time. I don't care about Don King, whoever you... Dana White is the best. for pound promoter of all time I don't care about Don King whoever you Dana White

he's the best he's better than all all sport included I've never seen anything like this he can sell ice to an Eskimo if he want to

he's incredibly good and he's fun and he's good at messing up with my head too because even though I sometimes my ego is like

like Nate Diaz because the stuff he said to in the way they try I don't know if the UFC tried to make him say stuff because some fighters are more like pawned on a chest on a check chessboard and others me I'm not I don't follow when everything analyze I'm thinking I was like why you say that why okay that's bigger so a lot of stuff have been said and my ego is like

man what a mess and I want to say alright you think my schedule is too busy I'll take the point and I'll kick your ass

you know what I mean but I should not do that it's a stupid move if I start acting like this I'm boom and a lot of guys they don't have that

self control and self discipline in them it's all a game man it's all a game, man. It's all a game. It's BS. It's all a game, man. It's all a game.

What did Nate say that fucked with you? Okay. Nate Diaz and Nick is kind of together in a way. They say that I took steroids when I fought his brother. I messed up my rap. I didn't make weight. And what did he say? Oh, yeah, I put something in the IV of his brother.

So he said, if I want to take care of that, like if, I don't know, he said it in his own like word, like in English slang, like, oh, if you want to take care of this, I'm there, you know. He said someone poisoned him yes who was was that for which fight was that is that anderson silver okay i gotta confess joe

i gotta confess i gotta confess okay i was i was so scared during this this fight so we tried to poison i was so scared of fighting nick diaz so we poisoned his ivy but he survived so i was even more terrified you know so all the athletic commission was on my payroll so they tricked away and then i made it and it went through so I was even more terrified. So the alien abducted me and put the gamma ray to increase my strength like the Hulk, like a performance enhancing drug. And the fight was still happening.

So right before I put some glass and cement in my gloves, make sure, and still had a crazy hard fight. So I got to confess with Nick Ma, but it's completely insane. Did he say that was for your fight? He said all that.

He said for my fight that I poisoned his IV, that I was on steroids, that my rap was wrong. And he said also, what did he say? He said, yeah, the weigh-in, like I didn't make weight,

like I tricked the athletic commission or they were on my, like, it's all like, it's just funny. I think he has a, he has a problem

of conspiration, conspiration. Conspiracies, yeah. He think everybody is against him, you know? Paranoia. Yes, I think that's what it is. Conspiracies, yeah. You think everybody is against him, you know? Paranoia.

Yes, I think that's what it is. That might be the weed. It could be. Weed. It's paranoid. You know, I don't want to say

nothing bad about weed. I think... But... Weed, like all things, can be good, but also can be bad. Okay, okay. Food is good for you.

I know you're for the weed stuff. I do enjoy weed. And you're a smart guy. You have much better argument for that kind of- I'm for responsible use, though, of everything, including drinking. I like a drink every now and then. I like pot, but I don't think you should smoke it all day.

Yeah, but I think that's the way it is. I think weed, I don't know if it's the weed, but I think it's maybe weed with social environment and genetic can create some kind of disorder in the brain and make you have the conspiracy problem. You think everybody is against you.

It could happen. It could happen. I've seen a lot of my friends who smoke a lot, they have this problem. Yeah. Sometimes they think they're paranoid.

Yeah, I think it's like all things. You do too much of it, it can fuck with your head. Everything could be good or bad depending on how you use it. So what fight is interesting to you? There's this talk of Khabib at 155, who's the champion now, and Conor. Those are

the two fights that I hear. Right now, right now as we we speak now, I wouldn't want right now to put myself immediately in a training camp because the reason is my symptom is not gone. Your colitis. I feel a little bit. It's not as bad as it was,

not even close. It's much better, but I want to get rid of it before I get into a training camp. Before I put myself into a stress. Because that stress, what it does, it amplifies everything. So if you have little issues, it will amplify it. And at least I need to take care of that.

My health is a pass in front of my performance in sport. This is very important. And when I'm ready, I don't know, I would like like do something like I said unique rear something that is rear that never been done before that would be a 55 pound champion could be 55 which is the first and then in MMA to have the tree title never been done before or it could be maybe by that time it would be another guy maybe I don't know it would be someone will come back and do something great that he will be the man to beat you know what I mean right we talk about the Diaz brother and also I changed

subject a little bit but with with on the same way it's sad for for Nick Diaz that he doesn't fight yeah because stylistically people might think I'm crazy, but stylistically, I think he can beat Tyrone Woodley. I think he can. He's the kind of guy that keep coming at you, keep coming at you, and he's good at taking shots,

surviving, that keep coming, keep coming at you. And I remember when I fought him, it's terrifying because you got tired and this guy keep coming at you and he make you feel like you're claustrophobic and you do things at him and he keep coming and he's very dangerous and then later around like after like three, four rounds, like man, it's like, it's very... He never gets tired. thing also nervous on the nervous system and and the the mental system not only physically so

not not much physically it's it's on the nervous system you come at you and you fake and then and and there's like a reaction time and reset time when you fight you know like like and i i i've studied this with my team when i was fighting guys and and nate diaz he make people tired. He makes the... Nick or Nate? Nick. Nick. Nick, that's why he wins fights.

He's kind of a slow guy, but people get more tired than him quickly, especially in their nervous system. Yeah. There is a guy like BJ Penn, for example. When I fought BJ Penn, I knew that BJ Penn had the best reaction time of all fighters I've seen in UFC,

when he was at his best. I measure... The guy we know, we work with him for us, measure it with the frame. You know a frame, best reaction time of all fighter we have seen in ufc when he was at his best i measure the guy i we know work with me and ferrass measure it with the frame you know a frame like a picture when you throw a punch click click click click bj pan at the best reaction time of all fighters bj pan when he was in his best when i fought him i knew if i go straight at him you have a better reaction time than than me so my goal he had a very good reaction time, but a bad reset time. So his reset time is kind of the endurance for the brain. So he could react, like a sprint, he could react very fast,

but after a while, he got tired very fast. After a lot of faking it and this, I make him guess and stuff. So he was getting very tired fast. So because of that, I could make him guess and stuff. So he was getting very tired fast. So because of that, I could get him because of that. I could fake him and make him tired and lower his reaction time and then get him later.

So Nate Diaz, that's why he's so good. Nick Diaz, sorry, that's why he's so good. And that's sad for him. He doesn't fight. We played his fight yesterday. His best years are now.

He should do now. That's what he should do, man. And he's only 33? Is that what we said? 33 or 34? I mean, he's in his prime. Yeah, he should do it now. He should do it.

Man, he had the opportunity to make a lot of money. He could do it. He could do it. They suspended him for pot after he fought Anderson Silva, and then he had to pay a fine. He never paid the fine. Yeah, because he's Nick Diaz yeah

no but I respect that because in his mind he thinks he's wrong and he don't yeah he has a line he has a code

you know yeah and the same thing I have the code for me for the drug test policy I didn't want to come back unless they do something I say it to Lorenzo

and Dana after my fight my last fight I say it it's my code and I they wouldn't I say it. It's in my code. And they wouldn't have done it. I would not have come back. Did you think Hendricks was on something?

This is a question. I don't have the evidence. I would never have. Like, you don't have the evidence. Like, we talk about fighters that got cut. You don't have the evidence they were there before they got cut. I don't have the evidence. The only thing I can say is

I didn't want to attack one particular individual and I wanted to change the system because if you attack one individual, another one will come. So in that particular case, it was Hendrix and I wanted to change it

and in the beginning, he agreed with me to do it but then he changed his mind and that's when I got very angry so he agreed with you to take he agreed he agreed it was public he agreed when we say you can look you have the evidence that in the interview he said I he agreed to do a test but then he, no, I did not agree because also the UFC told him to not agree. The UFC told him to not. The UFC told him the truth. They told him to not do it

because they had a problem maybe with the VADA. World Anti-Doping Agency. There's VADA that make the guideline but they're VADA

that's VADA that I took they had a problem with them I don't know why was that Victor Conte did he have something to do with that no it was Mara Margaret is it Margaret something

it was a lady but they had a problem so they said to not do with the test not do it period I don't know if it was I think it was because of VADA

because I made a little investigation on that and I got very angry. That's why, like, psychologically, I said to myself, I should not have, if I would have gone back in time, I would not have taken that fight. I would not have taken that fight.

That's why I respect a lot of fighters, they stand up for themselves. I didn't have the courage, I didn't do it when it was time to do it. And I should, I regret it. This is one thing I regret in my career, I should have done it. It's like, you don't want to sign, okay, take your belt, I'm gone.

I should have done that before, maybe I would have come back earlier. So, I wouldn't miss a paycheck, but wouldn't, who, you know, I had enough, I would have enough, you know what I mean? So you don't want to say whether or not you suspect that Johnny Hendricks is doing something, but there was people that were definitely doing something.

Yes. I don't have the evidence. Maybe he did. That's a good way to look at it. I don't want to accuse. A lot of guys, they do it, and I don't want to judge them because a lot of them, they have a family to feed and everything, and this could make the difference between winning a million dollars or not winning at all.

You know what I mean? So everybody has a different reason why they do it. And it's just a system encourages it to do it. That's a problem. Yeah. And especially if there's no testing or the testing is very poor. The testing when you first started your career, basically

you just had to pee after the weigh-in and you were okay. Even now, it's still easy to even now. You think so? Yeah, man. How would someone rig the system? Let's say I have a whereabout on my phone. Now I'm saying it and everybody knows that, especially the cheater, they know that. Look, now, okay, let's say I have a whereabout on my phone, okay? Now I'm saying it and everybody knows that,

especially the cheater, they know that. Look, I thought it true. It's not 100% sure, but let's say I want to have an injection of a product that will last

in my body for two days or one day. So I know that particular day I cannot be tested because if I am, I'm screwed.

Right. So I put in a, I put my tested because if I am, I'm screwed. So I put on my whereabout that I'm traveling to the freaking… Antarctica. Antarctica or anywhere like somewhere that is believable. Yeah. And then I come back in two days after. But that substance will stay in my body for a certain period of time, but the effect of it will last maybe a month. And now we talk about performance enhancing drugs, Joe.

People misunderstand this. They say, oh, yeah, but it still doesn't make the difference. Yes, it does make the difference in an athlete. And the reason is, in the 80s and before, it was giving you more power, more stamina, more endurance. Now, man, with the technology, they have stuff that will change your reaction time, your confidence, your reset time.

And this is a huge, huge application, man. If you play baseball or you're in a fight and you see the things coming, you have your reaction time, you're sharper in the brain. What makes a guy athletic, it's not his muscle. The reason why Usain Bolt is he runs faster. There's many reasons why. But one of the main reasons is because his brain, his nervous system is better. And if you make your nervous system better and more competent, better,

you're a better athlete, man. You're a better fighter. You're a better baseball player. You're a better person in a way. Of course, that effect is limited, but there's still the muscle memory thing that will last. You know, and it could last forever. So now with the technology, man, at one point, the sport, that's why I'm afraid. I'm afraid the sport becomes so messed up

with the gene doping and all that. At one point, it will be off. Sport will be completely messed up. In the future, I don't know. But sport will be... It won't be any normal people competing. It will be all kind of cyborg people. Yeah, cyborgs.

People are really worried about gene doping. Yeah, man. They're already starting to do that in China. But not only gene, even the modern stuff, performance enhancing drug, they do, man. It's very hard to catch up people. So like I said, it's easy to take something. I mean, there is always a chance that you get caught, but if I would do it, that's how I would do. I would pretend I'm going in Antarctica, get an injection, then I come back and I'm good.

pretend I'm going in Antarctica, get an injection, then I come back and I'm good. Novitsky told me that they're starting, well, they have it, and they don't know whether or not people are taking it, but they're taking testosterone that's derived from animals, not from wild yams. Like the way they get testosterone now, if you get like a testosterone injection, they're getting it from wild yams. Yams? Yams, yeah, the fruit, the vegetable. Really?

The tuber, you know. In Jamaica, it's the yam, yeah. Yeah, that's how they're getting testosterone. They're getting it from that. A plant? Really? Yeah, they're plant-based wild yam testosterone. But now they're able to get it from animals.

And the animal testosterone, you don't – like they do carbon isotope tests. Yes. And the carbon isotope tests don't detect the difference between an animal testosterone and human testosterone. But these are current tests. One of the things that they do is they freeze your piss and they freeze your blood for, I think, they're doing it for years and this is how they've caught some of these Russian wrestlers

and they've taken away gold medals from guys that won in the early 2000s for, they've found new tests and with the new tests

they've been able to determine that they were taking steroids. I think it's the same thing when Ben Johnson beat Carl Lewis. Yes. Yeah.

Yeah. Man, Ben Johnson is... Well, he was on some shit but guess what? Carl Lewis was on some shit too. Yeah. Yeah. Man, Ben Johnson is... Well, he was on some shit, but guess what? Carl Lewis was on some shit too. Yeah.

I think nine out of the ten or eight out of the... Like, the guy that finished like eight, like he was a Brazilian guy. Then he got interviewed. He said, yeah, it was just a line fillers

for the main guy. He would have won the gold medal. Right, because everybody else tested. Man, that shit changed your life gold medal. Right, because everybody else tested. Man, that shit changed your life, man. That changed your life, man. It made you a better living, millionaire maybe, sponsorship.

Yeah. That's just so bad. It's crazy. Yeah, man, it's crazy. How about Lance Armstrong? I mean, when you go to the Tour de France, when he won and then they took his title away, all the people that were below him were also guilty.

So you take his title away. What about the number two? He's fucking guilty too. Number three. They said that on one of the years that he won, you had to go back to 18th place to find a guy who's never caught taking anything. That's a dirty sport.

But man, you asked me if I think he was taking. I don't know. But you have your suspicions. I have a suspicion, but it's not right if you don't have the evidence to accuse someone. Yes, I agree with you. And even today, if I think there is some guys, if there is a lot of guys that take steroid and performance enhancing drug, yes. Yes. And I have an idea of who, who, who, who, who, who.

And I'm pretty, like, just from my gut feeling, 99.9% sure. But I don't have the evidence. It's not what you think. It's not what you know is what you can prove. And I don't know. Talking, you know, I'm in a game. I'm talking to a lot of people in between fighters. We know who does who.

There's only a few handful of people who does the whole, the whole team. Yeah. You know, one guy could do this team, this team, this team,

and one other guy can do two teams. The world goes around, man. Especially when you're top elite fighter, world goes, the world goes around, you know,

like the people, they talk to me and they say if I would be interested. I've been offered different offers before and different things, you know. like the people they talk to me and they say if I would be interested. I've been offered different things before. What have you been offered before? I've been offered, man, to sometimes to go train and

some deals, you know, like to go train and do something, being part of, you know, like they take some pool of your blood, they know what is missing, then they put the stuff that is missing, make you, I said,

no, I stay in Montreal, you know, like I, and I don't say Montreal, it could be a lot of cheaters too. Like, that's the thing,

you accuse a gym of cheating, you cannot accuse a gym of cheating because everybody is different, you know. Right, right. There's people cheating everywhere now. You can't say, oh, these people are cheating.

No, man, it doesn't work like that. It works every individual. If you decide to go that path, you have to be ready to face the consequences. If you don't face the consequences during your competition years, maybe you'll face later after you're gone and you retire for your career.

A lot of people I know, including a lot, some of my friends, they were bodybuilders. Now you see their body are messed up, man. Their hormones are all messed up. They got bad problem. I don't want to be like that. I don't want to be like that. I want to be happy. I want to be healthy.

Yeah, they tear their joints apart too. I had Dorian Yates on the podcast. He can't even do push-ups now. I mean, and Dorian Yates was Mr. Olympia. He was a fucking giant guy

but all that, everything just ripped apart. It's like, everything's all fucked up. It just doesn't work right anymore. However, if you ask these people, would you do it again?

Maybe they say, yeah, maybe it was worth it. Maybe it was worth it. Maybe it wasn't. I think it depends on every individual. You know what I mean? But for me, I'm happy with what I have so far.

I could get more maybe in the future, but I don't want to go that path to try to risk everything. What did you think when testosterone replacement therapy was a thing? They were allowing people like Vitor and these people to take testosterone. I was so freaking angry about this I think it was like you know everybody it's a different case for everybody but I believe if you if you need to take the medication to compete performance and medication to compete you shouldn't be allowed shouldn't be

and and Joe I'm not against steroid I'm gonna explain to like people's always I get I'm not medication to compete, you shouldn't be allowed. You shouldn't be competing. And Joe, I'm not against steroid. I'm going to explain to, like people say, oh, he's against, I'm not against like steroid or testosterone.

I'm not against it. If it's for the well-being, if it's an older man who he cannot have sex with his wife and he's like, man, he goes to the doctor,

he's like, man, I lose the edge a little bit. Can you, the doctor will say, yeah, man, I lose the edge a little bit. The doctor will say, yeah, I put the cream that will increase your testosterone. And the guy is happy, or he has sex with his wife. You're talking about competition.

Yes, in terms of competition, if me and you were fighting, and we sign that we're not using any weapon, and I'm talking about biological weapon, and we fight man to man as real martial artists by a code of honor. And you behind or me, I go and inject myself

something to make me stronger or more competent. Could also help my neuron to fire better, to get something to be more to be better, to enhance my performance. Now I'm against that. It's a code of honor.

And if you don't respect that code, man, you should be out of martial arts. What are people taking that makes their reaction time better? It makes their mind work better? I don't know the name, but there is many. If you talk to a guy, there's a lot of things. A lot of things. I know a baseball player, they take stuff for the reaction time,

like the pitcher. Because in baseball, in tennis, and even in fighting, before you throw a punch, there is an indication. The body language, you read something. Before you throw a ball, there's a movement. Before you punch, there's a so you see better, your brain. There's even

medication you can take for exam. You study in school, there's an exam. You have an exam tomorrow, you're going to study the stuff that you need to know, it will increase. Then you There's an exam. You have an exam tomorrow. You're going to study the stuff that you need to know. It will increase. Then you go pass the exam. I know it sounds crazy. Go get it.

It's crazy, man. Well, I know Adderall. Adderall's one. It makes you wise, man. It makes you better in the brain. If you make your brain better, your nervous system better, man, you're a better fighter. It's not only physic physical enhancement it wasn't the 80s now in the 2000 year now now it's neurologic man that's when it's crazy dangerous

and soon it will be like with the gene doping forget it man the athlete will be born athlete you won't be a guy like me or anybody that fight in UFC won't be able to compete in UFC anymore Because they're not super you mean human. You know what I mean? No, I agree that future sport will be so messed up It will be crazy. We're all gonna be gamers play video game. Yeah, right? Yeah, you're probably right We're gonna be gamers this this will be and with this thing that I've been an athlete Will will it's not it's not gonna make any sense in the future. I believe, you know athlete, it's not going to make any sense in the future, I believe. Maybe it will be completely ridiculous. It's like, oh, you're not born.

You're never going to be... You know what I mean? And it will be real because you're not born to be an athlete. You're not bred to be an athlete. Yeah, with gene editing, they're going to be able to change your height, your eye color. They can do it now.

They haven't really shown that they can do it now they can do it now they haven't really shown that they can do it with humans in America at least it's crazy but they're absolutely experimenting with it all over the world the cow and everything, it's insane they're doing a lot of crazy shit I think maybe it's 100 years, maybe it's 50 years

but whatever it is in that amount of time, you're going to be dealing with people that are basically superheroes. Yeah. Sport will be destroyed. When that happens, sport will be destroyed. Yeah. No, I agree with you.

The sport will be finished. Like the 100 meter, can you believe? Right. Like how freaking fast a human being can be to be closer to zero second? Yeah.

Like, do you think we'll pass the bar of nine second one day? It's theoretically not impossible in a way. Like, I mean, at one point there's a line that you can't, like, you know, you can diminish the time, but it's like a curve, you know, like you can't, you know. But if we got that sort of performance enhancing drug, that would be crazy. But there'll probably be some sort of a side effect to it and some sort of a downside to it. They'll probably die younger. Their tissue will diminish faster.

But who knows? Maybe they'll be able to regenerate stuff. If you talk to some doctor that knows, like I know you have done, they said that steroids, like performance enhancing drug, if you do it, if they do it well, some people don't have any side effect of it.

Right, if you don't abuse it. Yes. So, man okay some people don't have any side effect of it right they don't abuse it yes yeah so man maybe it won't have any side effect maybe everybody will be on it maybe it will be like a like an iphone will be like oh that's like right who knows who knows the future who knows you know it's totally possible i mean you might be in a lot of ways one of the last of the natural athletes. Maybe. Maybe it's a few more years before we get there. But, yeah, man. When I think about it, it's going to be finished.

It's going to be, I don't know, maybe we're all going to be video game players or whatever. When you see yourself competing again, how much longer do you think you'll wait out? I mean, you're 37 now. When do you think you'll be healthy enough? When will your colitis feel good enough? Like, do you have a time period?

It's hard to say. Maybe a few weeks. Maybe take a few weeks. Maybe one, two, three months max, maybe maximum. Maybe less than that. Maybe less than that. A little bit of time off. Just a little bit of time.

Yeah, yeah. I want to make sure I get past that because I feel like if I go back into it and it will start all over again, I don't want that. It was bad, Joe. I couldn't sleep at night. I cramped, like bad cramp.

I stayed up all night and had the sparring the next day. Oh, my God, it was crazy, man. It was very bad. I had blood. I had to go in the bathroom. I had blood, man. You feel like you want to go to the bathroom, but then nothing comes out.

Then it's the blood, the blood that comes out, man. You look at the bathroom, you see the blood. You think, it's like, man, what's wrong? You think like the dream catcher, the movie with the... Oh, Steve. That boy. Yeah, you know what I mean?

Like, what the hell? You know what I mean? Oh, yeah. It's crazy, man. You're like, what's happening with me? Am I dying? It's like, it was very,

it was very, I don't want to go back to this. I want to make sure I, I take care of this stuff, you know? So just maybe even a few more months of just taking care of your body. Maybe a month,

week, week. I want to, I want to see when I feel good, I let a little bit time. When I feel like a hundred percent, like I don't feel anything. Like, sometimes I still feel like when I'm going to eat, I feel, I feel like 100%, like I don't feel anything. Sometimes I still feel

when I'm going to eat, I feel not that cramp, not that pain, but I feel inside is something different. But it diminishes every week. Every month, it diminishes.

I see a difference. So if you do go back and you go back to 55, have you tried to make that cut before? I never tried and I won't. I go back to 55 have you tried to make that cut before i never tried and i won't when i explain to you i'm not a fan of weight cutting i think weight cutting should be like a marathon runner a marathon runner when you train for marathon he never does a marathon in this training he does half or maybe a quarter of it at different things.

So it's not healthy to lose your weight. Right. You dehydrate yourself and starving is not that bad, but it's more the dehydration problem. Me, I'm very worried

about health issue and I don't want, this is very important. So when I do it, I go all in. I'll do like the Bisping fight. I never tried to do, to get my weight much. It's different when you go up and go down.

But I said, yes, I do it. And I go and I do it. I like the thrill of it, the excitement of the unknown. It kind of excites me in a way. I don't know if you know. So it's kind of an experimentation. It's live. I cannot mess up.

That's what excites me. It's not the, oh, I know I can't now. I don't know, man. I'm going to do it now. It's happening now. That's what excites me. Well, there's guys that are your size. Like Kevin Lee is your size.

Kevin Lee is about my size. He's a big guy. Khabib is about, I think, close to 200. I saw Tony Ferguson. He was posting pictures. He was 200. I've never been naturally 200. Like when I fought Bisping, at one posting picture, he was 200. I've never been naturally 200. Like when I fought Bisping, at one point I was almost 200.

Like I was like big guy. But I was like, oh, like water retention. I didn't feel right. It was not feeling good, man. Yeah, Kevin is a big guy. And there was an article today I saw somewhere that was saying, you know, that Kevin really wants a 165-pound weight class. Like he can't really make 155

very much longer. I think he will be the best, man, this guy. He's good. If I look at all the new guys that are coming, it's freaking scary, man. I'm 37.

Maybe I have one, maybe one, two, maybe three. I don't know. I do my thing and I get out of here. When do you think you're going to retire?

Do you have an idea? 40? 40? It's impossible that I fight past 40. Impossible. I do my thing and I get out of here. When do you think you're going to retire? Do you have an idea? Oh, I'm never going to. 40? It's impossible that I fight past 40. Impossible. I'm not going to fight in a cage at 40 years old, man. But you're 37. Man, it's like a kid.

What if you feel just as good? It's like a kid that plays. That's Arnosh Rasanagar, what he says to me. It's like a kid that plays with a train. He's two years old, three years old, four years old, five years old. Then you look at the train when he's two years old, three years old, four years old, five years old. Then you look at the train when he gets six years old, he's like, what the hell I'm doing with that train? At 40 years

old, it's finished for me. Fighting in a cage? Are you? I've done it. It's not interesting. At 40 years old, I'm a grown man. I'm not going to fight in a freaking cage at 40 years old. But that's only 36 months from now. You're saying it like it's forever. Yeah, exactly.

So it has to happen fast. It has to happen fast. And if it don't happen, I'm happy. I'm happy too. Well, the comeback alone was like one of the greatest comebacks ever. The comeback after four years, win the title, beat the champion and beat him definitively. Rear naked choke, put him to sleep.

That's why, Joe, it needs to be something that really excites me. Because I'm going to tell you something. One of my friends, CT Fletcher, he says something. I love CT Fletcher. He's amazing. He just had his heart transplant. Yeah, he's doing good now. He's better. Send out some love to CT. CT,

you're the inspiration, man. CT, you're inspiration, man. We love that guy. He says, satisfaction is the death blow. And it's true. Now I'm happy, I'm satisfied. But if I see something... Satisfaction is what, what does he say?

It's death blow, it's finish. If you're satisfied, if you're a champion and you're satisfied, you retire, man. Because you're going down, you finish. You're going to get hurt. Yeah. As an athlete, especially in our game.

Now, everything I do, I go further and further. That's why I didn't want to fight Nate Diaz. Because if I fight Nate Diaz, it's been done before. It's not excited for me. And I would be going into that fight satisfied. And if I do that, it's very dangerous. I want to do something that I'm like

the 155, I'm like, I never did it before, title, or beating a certain guy that is on a freaking rise. Well, that would be Khabib then, because Nate has already beaten Conor. Khabib could be. I don't know if they're a new guy

that do something that is unbeatable. And me, I come back, I'm like, oh, George never gonna beat that. When you say never,

man, I love it. You say never, as crazy as it is, when you said never gonna come back, it excites me. When you say

I cannot do that, it's never been done before, that means if I do it, it will be the first time that excites me. That really turned me on. There's a lot of things that turned me on in life. It's women, dinosaurs, and this, that. People that say, don't, don't, that really

make me going crazy. Why dinosaurs? No, no, it's paleontology. Since I'm a kid, I study paleontology. Wow, that's awesome. I traveled the world during those four years off, by the way. Did you? Yeah, yeah. What did you do during those four years off?

I traveled a lot of the world on the sight. The sightseeing? Yeah, yeah. That made me realize, too, that I could never be a paleontologist. I don't have the patience to go like, With a toothbrush. For hours. I like to get the knowledge of it, to be on the field, to go like... With a toothbrush. For hours, I would drive me.

I like to get the knowledge of it, to be on the field, to get the knowledge fast. Right. But I don't like to work to get the knowledge. Right. Which makes me not a real paleontologist. The paleontologist is willing to put the work into it. Yeah.

In MMA, I'm willing to put the work into it to become the champion you know but in paleontology that's how I because at one point I thought I liked both equally now I realize no I like the

sport better the problem with the sport of MMA is so exciting and paleontology is probably very exciting once you find like a T-Rex head

or something like that it's the knowledge man the knowledge is exciting I mean I have a thing every month every time they have a thing every month. Every time they have a discovery, it's in my phone. Oh, like an app? Yes.

Every time there's a new discovery or something, like boom. And my friends, they make fun of me. They're like, man, you fight in a cage, you beat up people, you like paleontology, what's wrong with you? Because they make fun of me. I went to Argentina in Patagonia. Because they make fun of me. I went to Argentina in Patagonia.

I was there with paleontologists, biologists, and microbiologists on site. And I had a blast, man. It was amazing. But people were like, George is gone in a freaking bad land, and by him, like, alone, isolated for the rest of the world to do that kind of stuff, you know, so they were making fun. Did you find anything?

I did not find it, but I went on site, I saw eggs, I saw sauropod remains, titanosaurs, these are the... They're still in the ground when you were there?

Yeah. They're finding it, they're excavating it? Yeah, but Drew, it's a long process, man. This, that means it has been covered for at least like 66 million years, man. You talk about like... The place where I was, it was early to Cretaceous.

It was like Cretaceous, but it was like 100 million years. So that means it did not get exposed to oxygen for 100 million years. So that means it did not get exposed to oxygen for 100 million years. That's why you got... So you... It's like a crime scene, man. When you go on these things, it's freaking there, man.

It's like a crime scene that you discover, but like a 100 million years crime scene, man. You see these sauropods, man, these titanosaurs. It's insane, man. Well, it's crazy too that it's not even really a bone anymore. The mineral has replaced the bone,

and you just get the shape of the bone that's sort of been fossilized. Yeah. You know, like, that's why if you see, like, megalodon teeth, they're black. I have in my house the megalodon teeth. Crazy, right? Yeah. It's insane, man.

Megalodon is, like, the strongest bite force ever recorded, man. It's crazy. It's a big fucking animal. It was a huge fish. Yeah. You feed on whales. It's crazy. But this is one of the things that really excited me. So during those four years I was doing, man, I had a blast. I didn't have the time to do it before that. And I felt like it was missing in my life. Really? Paleontology was missing in your life really paleontology yeah man yeah yeah that's fascinating I went to Alberta I went also in in um in Dakota in the United States and I want to go in Egypt uh and then the Egypt and Morocco and there was some site that there were once upon a

time it was like like I'm talking about this probably nobody cares, but I love it They were like three giant apex predator living in the same like a giant crocodile sarcosaurus Sushis car car and autos or and spinosaurus these two live in the same area I wonder what happened like three Alpha freaking predator of living in the same time I wonder if they interact with each other and it must have been a crazy time, man. I have a friend and one of his good friends has a ranch in Montana

and he found something on the ranch and he called this paleontologist and they went to his ranch and they shut the place down. Like, dude, you got a T-Rex here. Really? Yeah. They gave him over a million dollars for it. And, you got a T-Rex here. Really? Yeah. They gave him over a million dollars for it. Yeah.

And they excavated this T-Rex in his ranch. And apparently it was a really good specimen. In Canada, if you find something, it's part of, it belongs to the government. Oh, fucking Canada. Let's say you find a bone in your backyard. It doesn't belong to you. Oh, that's fucked up. Yeah, that sucked, man.

It was very bad. America's got you guys beat for that. When I was young, Joe, I remember I used to live in countryside. I used to try to go to find bones, but I didn't know back then. I was not educated, so I thought maybe I could find dinosaurs. I was spending hours trying to find dinosaurs. Every rock I took, I thought it was a dinosaur. I used to bring it back.

My mom said, yeah, yeah, it's a dinosaur state. Yeah, right there. Because it was kind of a triangular shape. But then I found out that all the place where I come from, it was all erosion. So there's nothing from Cretaceous or Jurassic or Triassic back there. It's all like before that.

So it's all gone. Yeah. So it's just crazy, man. It's been a long time. I it's all gone. So it's just crazy, man. It's been a long time. I was in Montana once and there's this area that used to be the Great Western Inland Sea. And this area, like the ground

is like this mucky ground especially when it rains. It's essentially silt. Like the bottom of a lake, you know, that's silt. Because it was like a sea in between, cutting the America in half. Yeah. Appalachia and La Remedia, the two continent cuts.

Yeah, you know all about that shit. I know this, man. I know as much as MMA with this stuff. Really? Almost, yeah. Wow. Like, maybe not, but I am passionate with this, man, a long time. It's fascinating when you're walking around this area in Montana.

It's called the Missouri Breaks. And because this ground, it does feel like, you know, if you've ever seen a lake bed, if the water recedes, it's got that silty sort of weird mud. This is all, the whole ground is like this. It sticks to your boots. Like it gets heavy and clumps on the bottom of your boots. It's like this muck. Maybe, man, we don't know what the future will look like, man.

Sometimes I'm thinking, Drew, I'm like, you know what people talk about the environment? They say, oh, the pollution will make... We have hot air and ice age. Hot air, it's been going forever. Sometimes I'm thinking, I'm like, yeah, okay, of course, the pollution and the human has an effect

on the climate. But I wonder how much of a, how big we have an effect. Some people say it's debatable. Is it that big or is it not that big? Some says yes, it is bad. Some says, yeah, it's bad, but we don't have that much of

an effect. I don't know about that. I would like to have a clear answer for that. I think we have an effect, but I wonder how... Now we're going in a hot air, the glaciers are melting, but the hot air will go to an ice age. You know that, right?

Because of the current and everything. So I wonder how, you know, how much of an effect and how long it'll take, you know, because we don't have any record,

recent record of how long everything takes. We know a little bit but not that much, you know? It's a fascinating subject. Yeah, man.

It would be, are we going to live through that time? Probably not, but I'm like, you know what I mean? It's like, how long it will take?

I'm very interesting about that. That's why I love this thing. Learning from the past makes you understand sometimes the present and the future. I mean, I think it's really interesting. Yeah, no, I'm very fascinated by it. Are you still interested in aliens?

Yeah, man. Still? So that's the thing. When I first came on your show, you caught me really off guard. Because most people that we talk about aliens, they completely think you're crazy or you're disregarded. It's like, oh, you're going to talk about,

like, you know, most people that I attract with, they, you know, so you feel like ridiculous. Right. And then after I found out, you read a lot about that stuff, like the Sumerian text, the creation tablet, Zechariah's vision and all that stuff. And I do too. I mean, I don't know if there is, like, if there is alien.

Like, I think there would be life form. I don't know if it's intelligence. We don't have evidence for it. Right. And I think our ego as human being want us to believe that the alien came and interacted with us. That's our ego. But if they're that far in advance from us and they come from a different world, maybe they don't want to interact because we have nothing to offer them.

They're not going to kidnap a farmer and ask him what kind of suspension he's wearing. You know what I mean? You know what I mean? But think about what you just said about paleontology. I mean, we're paying attention to stupid fucking lizards that lived 65 million years ago. It's true.

I mean, don't you think they would be curious to this weird monkey with nuclear weapons? Yeah, but we don't communicate with it. We don't interact. We observe, there's ways that it can learn from us without communicating.

I don't know. I mean, it's, I think it's our ego that makes us... We want to feel special. We want to feel that we're different. We're different beings than, for example, a dog. Yeah, we can think because we're smart,

but I don't know how this has been given to us. I don't know. You were talking about it when I was young. We talked about it last time. You said you were talking about the experience. I said, I remember that I remembered, but I can't recall it. When I was young, I don't know if it's a dream. I remember I used to draw a figure of monster. I say, I don't know if it's dream, I remember I used to dry, I used to draw figure of monster.

I say, my mom is the monster. They come get me at night. That's why we talked last time. Right, right. But I was very uncomfortable, and I didn't want to talk about it, because I was like, man, how the hell he knows it? You know everything, man. This guy, he knows everything.

He made research and stuff. So I made the drawing. And then my mom, even now today, said, hey, I want to see the drawing. And I showed the drawing. And then after I remember later, I remember that I remember, but I couldn't remember. You understand what I mean? I remembered that I remember that I remember, but I couldn't remember. You understand what I mean? I remembered that I remembered that something that happened, but now I can't remember what exactly happened.

Right. Could be a nightmare. Could be another sleep paralysis or my imagination. I don't have evidence. You know what I mean? That's why we talked about it last time. And that's what happened to me. And I hope it's nightmare. It's nightmare. You know what I mean? But the thing is, later

on, I saw some documentary on TV. I saw some people that had the similar experience as me. Loss of memory and things like this when they were young. And they claim they get a hypnose and stuff. Then they go back in time and they claim they they get a they get a hypnose and stuff then they they they they go back in time and they they explain they get an abducted by him and then i start to freaked out about it because i said man is that what happened to me and i but there is more a lot more logical explanation you know what i mean but that's why when he brought that back i freaked out i was like how the hell he knows this like how the hell he knows this? I didn't want to talk about it, but then also my agent was there. He's like, hey, we need 10 minutes.

I'm like, we were misinformed. We didn't know the podcast was that long and this. All these things in my head, I didn't know what to make of it. So that's what it was. Yeah. It's entirely possible that we're experiencing something when we're dreaming that we're angry sleeping well we're unconscious that maybe there's dimensions that the consciousness travels to that are non-physical that like this this dimension when we're in right now we

can touch this table move this microphone around these are physical dimensions but it's entirely possible that whatever your spirit is or your consciousness or your mind, when you're thinking of your thoughts and your soul, that as you're sleeping. You said you're a soul. Yeah, whatever that means. You believe is a soul. I don't know what that means. It's a weird word, right? It has religious connotations.

I agree. word right it's a really it has religious connotations but i agree but the the idea of whatever your essence is as a human being there's there's something inside of all of us that makes us conscious and aware and and there and then that something is not there when you're sleeping and so is it dormant is it just recovering which is you know the scientific version of it or is it possible that while you're in this dream state and your body shuts off, that your mind and your consciousness travels to a non-physical dimension that you can only access through the chemicals

that are released in your brain, which we know produce psychedelic experiences. So if you took the chemicals that are released during your brain or inside your brain, like dimethyltryptamine, and there's all sorts of different psychedelic chemicals that are produced by the mind. If you take these outside of the dream state, if you take these drugs, you have these crazy, fantastic experiences. And we know these are produced by the brain. They're produced. They're produced by the brain they produce they produce by the brain also yes they're produced by the brain they're produced by the liver and the

lungs we believe they're produced by your third eye which is your pineal gland they've shown the cottonwood research foundation has shown that this this is done in rats that rats produce dimethyltryptamine in their pineal gland it doesn't necessarily mean that people do but it's logical to imply that people probably, or conclude that people probably do it as well. So those chemicals that are producing these psychedelic experiences are being released by the brain, but we don't know why and we don't know what they're doing.

When you sleep, like you have a guy, Matthew Walker. Yes, it was amazing, right? When you sleep, your guardian, your logic is not there. That part of your brain is gone. Right, yeah. So that's probably the most logical experience. But it's kind of a freaking scary thought of thinking that, man. It makes you wonder sometimes.

Sometimes you're at night alone and you're thinking. And me, I'm a guy that thinks a lot. I'm thinking about all kind of scenario like in a fight I think about all scenario but in life I'm the same way I'm thinking

what if this happened for real or what if like man it's scary talk man it's

it's it's nothing more scary in the world but what is scarier is it scarier to think that when you die you're just gone and nothing happens or Is it scarier to think that when you die, you're just gone and nothing happens? Or is it scarier to think that your consciousness leaves this physical dimension and goes into what's essentially a well of souls?

Just a dimension, a non-physical dimension of consciousness where all consciousness interacts with each other and it's just geometric patterns that don't have a physical being attached to them. It's hard for me to believe the consciousness is not material. Because let's say you would say, sometimes people have, they say, oh, he's a good person, he's a bad person. I don't believe there is good and bad person.

I believe there is no people, no baby born good or bad. I believe it's your environment that no baby born good or bad. I believe it's your environment that makes, that shape you. It has a lot to do with it. Genes have a lot to do with it. So when you say the mind,

let's say I'm a person, I'm a certain way. You know me as a certain way. And it happened to me. I know I have a friend that happened to him. He was my best friend and he's dead now,

unfortunately. He was a certain way but he got a car accident remember after his car accident he changed man he was not the same guy he become a little bit paranoid he had some kind of dementia yeah so the person i knew was kind of dead yes but it was physically the d DNA everything was the same but this this the person is different right so when you say the soul the mind it would be really not material like my materialistic that would not have changed but his personality was completely different mm-hmm he had a

short temper remember he had a girlfriend was extremely jealous he was starting to beat her and stuff. He was a completely different person than you knew before. So if they say the mind, your brain, your brain is materialism, but your mind is not. So if you have an accident like my friend, and you have some sort of dementia or something, that means if it's not materialism, it would not happen.

It's possible, but it's also possible. It's hard to say. And you have the explanation that are subjective and objective. If I pinch you, you say I'm hurt. There is no objective way for me to tell you that you're really hurt. Because even if I go away, I open your brain, I can't see it. The only way I know is because of my experience, but it can't prove it. Who knows?

Who really knows? It's also possible that when you think of consciousness or the soul or what's going on in the mind, that it's expressed through the body. And then when the body is damaged, that consciousness is damaged as well because your consciousness is now being expressed through a lack of certain hormones. Your mind itself, the very brain, might be an antenna or something that uses consciousness in order to move through life, but that consciousness is independent from the brain and that the brain being damaged is just expressing consciousness in

a fucked up way because you've got dementia or Parkinson's or what other neurological disorders that people have, but at the center of it, it's still the same thing. It's one of the things that people say when they have like Muhammad Ali. So you so many let's say you you die you finish the best out of you will You mean will still exist somewhere somewhere out of you, but you independent of the body. These are just theories Okay, but there's there are people that believe that consciousness is non-local and that the body Actually is just like an antenna for your consciousness non-local and that the body actually is just like an antenna for your consciousness now if the body is damaged if your hormonal balance is all fucked up your neurological system is out of whack you like one of the things that muhammad ali said uh when they were talking to him about his parkinson's

is that he's still in there he just can't express himself because his body had been damaged by so many fights and so many hard sparring sessions and so many blows to the head that he wasn't capable of expressing himself, but inside, he was still the same guy. But he was trapped. His consciousness was trapped in a broken body. I see. It's like a prison.

Like a locomotion system. When you think about CTE, like a lot of these football players, like, you know, that Aaron Hernandez guy that was a murderer. Yes. And he was a football player and they examined his brain after he was dead. And like, this is one of the worst cases of CTE we've ever seen. After he killed himself in prison, they examined him. And the idea is that your consciousness is supposed to be expressing itself through a healthy brain, right?

Through healthy hormones, a healthy endocrine system, a healthy neurological system. And that in that way, your brain can, your consciousness can express itself and do so without any physical hindrances. Then there's also psychological hindrances. What is LT? What age are is LT? What age? What age are you LT? The moment you start breathing and living, there's some sort of

change that occurs in your body. What is the LT state? 15, 12, 1 years old? 1 years old, you're not the same person at 15 and 15, you're not the same as 30. 30, you're not the same as 60. I think 15, you're not the same as 30. 30, you're not the same as 60. I think there's no independence.

I think they're all connected. And I think that, you know, the physical vitality of the body is important. The vitality of the mind is important. But I think there's probably something, you know, the first time I saw a real dead body up close was my grandfather. My grandfather died and went to the funeral. They had an open casket. It was very strange. But one thing that I realized when I was standing there, I'm like, he's not even there.

He's not here. He's not here. This body, I mean, this might have been where my grandfather lived. He might have lived in this body, but he's not here anymore. It was a very strange feeling to me because it was like internally I realized something I get the fact that he's dead he's not moving this is his body he's been embalmed and they put makeup on you and all this weird shit but it was also this feeling like he's not there he's gone yeah you know but what is it the body

then is the body a vehicle for whatever you are? Yeah. Maybe one day we'll know. Maybe we won't. It's a really – it's one of those philosophical questions. It's conceptual. It's also people have their ideological reasons for believing one thing or another. There's people that are nihilists that think it's over when it's over. And then you go to black and that's it.

You're done. End of story. Nothing happens when you're dead. Well, you don't know that because you've never died. We can't know. Yeah, it's a real open-ended question. I'm on the same page as you for this. I do not know.

A lot of idea has been presented to me. A lot of the idea I rejected because it didn't make sense to me logically. Like all the, do you believe in free will? Right, that's a good one. If my phone is there and it falls, there's a reason why it falls. The asymmetry of the phone make it fall. Maybe I blow.

There's a reason. I won't say my phone only fell. But if you do something wrong, for example, you kill someone, you just not decide, like kill someone, like there's a reason why you do something. And if you go back,

the reason, there's a reason of the reason of the reason. It's like a domino. Yep. Yep. Sometimes I'm thinking, I'm like,

man, it makes me think like I have no choice. Right. Like, oh, you're world champion, you work for it. I was like, yeah, but I have no choice. So I have no choice right like oh you're world champion you work for it

I was like yeah but I have no choice so I have no no I don't deserve any props because I have no choice right you are the product

of your life experiences to me that's what makes the most sense for me people think I'm crazy but I have an argument with a lot sometimes like a lot of religious people

they say oh yeah this or that but like I I that's how I believe. I believe sometimes. It doesn't mean I don't believe in God. It doesn't mean I'm different in my belief.

But I believe I have no choice. If I do something, I have no choice. But you do have ethics and you do have morals and you do make decisions. So that's where it gets slippery. I don't think I made decisions. No? No. And it was a cause to that decision. There's a

cause to everything. And by definition, there is a cause. There is no free will. Well, it's a good argument. I've heard it. I mean, Sam Harris argued it to me the best and made me really reconsider. And Robert Sapolsky, who is a famous scientist and deals with a lot of the functions of the human brain in terms of our motivations for things, his take was that in the future, it will be – when we look back today at people that burn people for witchcraft and stuff like that, how foolish they are. Yeah. He thinks we will have the same reaction to people judging and punishing people based on their behaviors. I agree 100%. Wow. Just look, go back in time, back in the, I think it's ancient Greek.

The men that were teaching knowledge to kids in exchange of sexual favor. You know, it happened. Now we call that pedophilia. It's wrong. We put the people in prison. But back in the know, it happened. Now we call that pedophilia. It's wrong. We put the people in prison. But back in the day, it was normal. You know what I mean? Sometimes our conception of good and bad or choice, you know, that I choose.

Like, I don't know, man. I don't believe there is good and bad. I don't believe the choice. I have a hard time to believe I choose something. Well, there's certainly things that you think are more positive than negative, right? Like being kind to people and friendly to people is more positive than being a murderer. Yeah. Let's say you have a gun.

Let's say you want to kill someone. Hey, George, can you borrow me a gun, please? Oh, yeah. I'm nice. Nice gesture. I will give you a gun. But then you go kill someone, it's, hey, George, can you borrow me a gun, please? Oh, yeah, I'm nice. Nice gesture, I will give you a gun, but then you go kill someone. So is my gesture nice or is it not nice? Good, bad, it all depends

on how you see, Joe. It all depends on how you see. Depends on why you're giving the person a gun, right? Oh, hey, this guy raped a little kid. Give me your gun. I'm going to go kill him. It's like, oh, yeah, I'll do a good thing and I'll let you borrow my gun so you can go kill this bad person

okay then my argument is okay you want to go you said George give me your gun I wanna go kill this guy I said okay I go give you the gun

this guy is Adolf Hitler you go kill him it's a good thing or bad thing to certain people will be good to certain people will be bad

it depends what's good or bad yeah so I sometimes I'm thinking like man all this we who knows man we freaking don't know man that's like the interesting thing about life is that there's a lot of things in life that are messy there's not there's not a simple answer yeah yeah so we have choices it's like a pool game. Yeah. If mathematically, I can, like, I had this talk with

Feras, and Feras is very smart. He studied philosophy. He had a degree in philosophy. It's like fighting. You fight a guy. You study his pattern. You know, like when you do this, he do that. When you do this, he do that. So if you do this, you think he will do

that, but maybe he won't because the environment has changed since then. But you know, it's the same thing. So if you play pool, if I can measure the strength that I hit the ball, ricochet on certain ball, if I can measure everything precisely, I will know where all

the balls are ending up on the table. You agree with that, right? Yes. If I know all the data of the universe and I boom, I can predict table. You agree with that, right? Yes. If I know all the data of the universe and I boom, I can predict. Do you agree with that? It would be the same thing with you if I know you by heart. I know your genetic background. I know all the data of the universe.

It's impossible to me. If I would know, I will know specifically what would you do exactly right now. If I do that, you will know, you know what I mean? How you would exactly react or what you're about to say to me. It's impossible. So that's why I don't believe in free will. I believe it could be measurable.

It's impossible to measure. Right, and then when you see people that are doing good things and achieving good things, it motivates you to do good things and achieve things. And that also changes all the people around you and makes them move in a certain direction as well. And if you look at certain cultures that are extremely negative and crime-ridden and fucked up, they produce extremely negative, crime-ridden, fucked up people. Yeah, sure. It's like there's all this going on there.

Is it the fault of those people and that's one of the things that people really criticize and I think rightly so about like Hardcore right-wing people that think everyone should be responsible for their own actions I don't care if you grow up in a crime-ridden neighborhood You stop doing crime and you be a good person and that's not an easy task the brain has no way to know if a if an information is relevant or not if you grew up in in a democrat system with democrat value you'll be if you're smart you'll be a smarter democrat if you grew up in this same but in a republicanism you'll be a smarter republican however maybe there are things in your environment that will make you switch.

Yeah, like maybe you hate your dad. You're like, fuck him, I'm going to be a Democrat. Exactly. We don't know, but your brain has no way.

So sometimes, there's a show on TV like Evil Genius. The guy, how come he's so smart but he's an evil? That comes to what we talk about.

We don't, good, bad, there's no good bad there is no that's why when I fight I fight guys like Nick Diaz or

if and I swear it's true let's say I drive my car and I see he has a problem with his car I will stop to help him like even though he was not nice

or like whoever it is I will do it because for me it's I don't think you know

it's not that I'm nice. It's the way I think. It's who you are. Yeah, exactly. I have no choice to be like I am. It is what it is. I've gotten better at that as I've gotten older, better at forgiving people and not holding grudges and not being upset at people. And if I see someone that I had a problem with in the past, just give them a hug.

I don't care. I think it's not healthy to carry around grudges. And it makes you feel good sometimes, too. Yeah, it feels real good. And it feels real bad to keep that hate and anger inside of you. It festers away. And you think of, well, if he says this, then I'm going to say that. And, hmm, fuck him.

And he shouldn't have done this. Well, I shouldn't have done that. But, yeah, but I only did that because he did this. And you have these little stupid arguments in your head instead of just saying hi and just being friendly or saying you're sorry or saying, hey, man, I don't have a problem with you. There's a guy that a few years ago, I drove my car on the street in Montreal.

It's like in the evening. I see a tall guy coming at me, and he begs for money. Put down my window. This guy, I swear it's true story. He's the guy that used to bully me

in school. Whoa. I say, I don't want to say his name but I say, hey, wait a second, I park my name,

I park my car, park the car, go talk to him. He's like, what the hell you doing here, man? He's like, and he thought

I would be angry because when he see me he saw his record like shoot like now I'm world champion you know like I can beat beat him up you know right back in the day was like three years older than me was bigger he was beating me up in the bus this guy now he see me is I kind of a scare I get out of my car you don't know you don't know if he should run or not I go to him I say say what you do here man it's like it's like you you it's like yeah i know but things doesn't go well for me you know i'm like i was like all right it's like like man

you're a tall guy you're good looking like what you're doing here man it's like i give him what i have left on me you know like i don't remember like like a hundred something or i give him i say get out of here man it's like you're full of potentials, get out of here, man. He's like, you're full of potential. He's like, get out of here, man. When I was young and when I wanted to be like you, you're a tall guy, man. You're good looking. He's like, full of potential.

So I shake his hand. He's like, no problem. Then he say, thank you, George. He get out. Then I don't hear about him. Few weeks, few months later, I go to my apartment house for having dinner. Then my dad say, hey, you know who come to the house a few days ago? This guy.

I'm like, yeah, I met him. He say, yeah, he said you met him in the street. But now he said he came to thank you. He came, he wanted to talk to you, but I said you don't live here, and I didn't want to give you a number. But he said, look, he said, came, he wanted to talk to you, but I said, you don't live here and I didn't want to give you a number. But he said, look, he said, George, he talked to me and he said something, he changed my life.

Now I have a job and I feel good. I just want to say thank you to him. And it feels so good. Just when I met him and I didn't get angry at him, because it was still there. He did very bad stuff to me when I was young, but when I see him, it made me me feel good kind of a relief now yeah and this guy when i was young he was beating me up in the bus all the time he was ridiculing me ridiculize me i had like adidas

pants that you can tight like this it was like taking off so i was like an underwear in front everybody in front the girl he was beating me up all the time and he was stronger than me he was like three four years older than me. He was a tall and strong guy. He was a hockey player back in the day. I couldn't beat him. Even with martial arts, he was always stronger than me. He hurt me a lot back in the day.

My dad, one time, I got beat up in the bus. I told him because I came back with a black eye. One time in my life, I told my dad what happened. I never said anything, but I said to my dad, one time, I got beat up in the bus. I told him, because I came back with a black eye. One time in my life, I told my dad what happened. I never said anything, but I said to my dad, I said, yeah, there's a guy in the bus. He beat me up. I said, I tell him the name of the guy. So my dad, what he did, he found out where,

I'm from countryside, so everybody knows who everybody lives. He goes to the house, he knocked, he talked to the dad. He said, hey, listen, can you tell can talk to the dad, he say, listen, stop, can you tell your son to stop hitting my son in the bus because he need to be

focused on the school and the dad, when my dad came back, he said, hey, I want to talk to his dad, he's gonna stop. So he said,

his dad was like drinking and stuff and he was beating the shit out of his son. So the way this guy learned to communicate through his dad was beating him up. He was drunk and beating him up. That's the way he was communicating with me.

He was beating me up because he learned the same way from his dad to communicate. So I just happened to be at the right right the wrong time at the right time in his life at the perfect you know i was the guy that was getting beat so we say good and bad he was not a bad person to my version of life to from my perspective he was a terrible person back then he was terrible i. I wanted to kill him. Like, man, he made my school time miserable, man. I was humiliated all the time. I was getting beat up. I was a very proud person.

So I used to go fight him all the time because I was proud. And at one point, I fought him so many times, he said, oh, this guy is completely insane. I stopped bothering him because I was never giving up, even though I was getting beat up all the time but to my own eyes he was a bad person

but through his eyes it was a different story and through his father it was a different story to the everybody it was a different story yeah

just to say that when I met him that what we talk about it feels so good just to meet him in the street and make kind of a peace

and give him money like yeah you beat me up you didn't but you know what even though you did that i give you the money and now it made me feel like i'm kind of a revenge better than a revenge it made me feel like yeah man you see without me you wouldn't have nothing maybe to sleep or eat tonight so i give it to you i still give it to you if you do that to me. That make me feel much better than if I would like beat them up. Yeah, and don't you think that maybe that guy

and him doing that to you was one of the reasons why you became a champion? Because you got into martial arts very heavily because of being bullied. Yeah, because I was beating up in school. Maybe it was, but he was not the only guy that was beating me up. All his friends. But he was kind of the guy that was all the girls liked.

And he was like the taller, stronger guy. So he was kind of the alpha guy at the time. Maybe it was an influence. Like I said, I don't believe only one thing influenced me. But it's many things, many causes that make that happen. But maybe it's one of the causes, yes. Yeah, that's crazy. I could be wrong, I could be right,

but that's my philosophy in life. That's how I think. So everybody says, oh, George, you're a true martial artist. You're a good guy. I say, thank you. I don't have the time to explain to them everything I just told you.

Right, right, right. But that's how I think. When they say you're a good guy, I was like, thank you. I'm not a fucking good guy. I'm me. I'm myself. I am the I am. But it makes me happy when people say that.

But you are a good guy. You try to be a good guy. I try to be. Because that's who you are. Yeah, I try to be. Because that's who you are. I try to be a good model, good role model. I think it's important for me

through my value that I've been raised. But it doesn't mean I don't like other guys. The guys that I like the most to watch their fight, they're not the good guys. My favorite fighters to watch

are not the good guys. Charles Sonnen, I like to watch him. Nick Diaz, I like to watch Nick Diaz. I like Conor McGregor when he fights. I like to watch him Nick Diaz I like to watch Nick Diaz I like Conor McGregor when he fights I like him the good guys are boring man

they're boring guys they make me fall asleep I like the drama I like even though I don't act like it I like it people will be

like it I know it's completely contradictory I like I love the Tito Ortiz back in the day he was my favorite man Tito Ortiz man in the day. He was my favorite.

Man, Tito Ortiz, man, he was amazing. Came with his flag like bad guy, man. I loved it, man. Star Wars, I love the Sith Lord. They're much more charismatic than the Jedi. Are you kidding me? Jedi. The new Karate Kid. I watched

the first episode. I'm hoping Daniel San gets beat up all the time. Johnny Lawrence, I hope he smashes his head. He didn't do it. You know what I mean? Does that make me a bad person? No. It's different.

That's how you see things. When you see a lion chasing a gazelle, do you root for the gazelle? I hope the lion catches the gazelle. Yes, exactly. Is that good or bad? a lion chasing a gazelle. Do you root for the gazelle? I hope the lion catches the gazelle. Yes, exactly. Exactly. Yeah. Is that good or bad?

Like, people, oh, and don't eat meat. It's not natural. Right. It's like, what is natural? What is not natural, man? Yeah. It's an interesting conversation.

When you talk about this, people think, oh, St. Pierre is just, you just get hit in the head too many times, but it's just, it's just not. No, my English is good.

I can communicate it through it with you. Like, I mean, like, it's easier. I English is good I can communicate through it with you like I mean like it's easier I feel more comfortable and it is what it is but I that's why I like it

because you're a person too I'm kind of a big fan of you too and I know you I didn't know that in the beginning when I first to know you but now I know that

that you get interested in the same thing that I am interested and what I like about you Joe is you don't give a damn you do whatever you have no boss you do whatever you want

whenever you want with who you want and me I respect that it's kind of a code you have your own code that you do and I respect that I like human being like this

I like to to be with human being like this guys I have no code I don't like this I don't like me my circle of friend is short you know I have a few guy I like I keep the I'm diplomatic with a lot of people but I'm not friend with a lot of people yeah I'm diplomatic because I have to be for the for my work for my business for the person I am and I don't like confrontations I'm diplomatic but there's a mean I like everybody you know well I think your for my work, for my business, for the person I am, and I don't like confrontations. I'm diplomatic.

But it doesn't mean I like everybody, you know? Well, I think your relationships that you have with people, the exchanges you have with people, it's very important to keep only positive, influential, strong people around you because you learn and you grow from those people. They give you fuel. When you're around people who are inspirational or doing interesting things, who live their life by a code, who are ambitious, who succeed, who try hard, difficult things, those are the people that inspire and give you energy.

And I feel better around them. I feel like I get energy from them versus people that are always making excuses and people that are always falling short, people that fail all the time and people that complain all the time. Those people are the opposite. And those people, they take away from you. And you're around them. You're just like, oh, I just got to get away from this guy. However, it doesn't mean that the good people that you have in your life will always be the good people for different situations.

Example, before a fight, my family, I stay the hell away from them. I'm going to explain to you why. It's my family, they care about me. I remember before a fight, before I used to go eat with my parents, my family, it used to be like the last dinner. They eat their soup, they look at me like, are you okay? You feel good? You're not sick, huh?

And before I fight, I need to feel like I'm going to war with my soldier. I need to feel that what I'm doing, it's normal, even though it's not. So when I hang out with my family, they have a normal life. So what I do,

they see me like an outcast. Like, man, this guy is completely insane. He's about to go fight in a cage. He can die. Oh my God. And I feel that, they see me like an outcast. Like, man, this guy is completely insane. He's about to go fight in a cage. He can die. Oh, my God. And I feel that because they love me. So my family, before the fight, I stay away from them.

I stay away from a lot of the people that I love, that are my circle of friends or real people I love, like family. And I bring back closer the people like Fraz, John, the fighters guys. Even guys that are maybe not as much as my friend today. You understand the mentality. Yes. So it makes me feel normal. It makes me feel strong because we go to war.

When you go to war, you don't bring your wife, your kid, your family. You bring the people that you go to war with. You know what I mean it's very important for me so it's depending what's going on

I believe good and bad people you know it's not always good not always bad depending the context you know yeah

no that makes a lot of sense that makes a lot of sense especially them being nervous about your fight like being nervous that energy is contagious bro I'm already nervous like like it is i don't want to be more nervous yeah and i hate i hate like i hate fighting

people's i know you don't i really do and i and i know you maybe a lot of people don't don't believe me but i'm gonna try and explain the best i can in every in every jobs there is no perfect job can. In every job, there is no perfect job. Do you agree? There is no perfect job that you like everything about it. It's impossible. My job as a professional athlete in mixed martial arts, on 365 days, I fight.

Normally, when I was very active, I used to fight twice a year approximately. Not more than that. I never wanted to more than that because I wanted to stretch, especially when you want to stretch when you're a champion because it's better for advertising, also for longevity and everything.

So more time, more money, more business hours and everything and longevity. So about twice a year. In 365 days, there's two days that I hate the most. It's the day that I'm fighting. It's freaking unbearable. The feeling of uncertainty that you don't know if you're going to be humiliated, you're going to be the victor, or you're going to be the loser.

I care so much about it that it is freaking unbearable. As much as I try to dismiss it, it's unbearable. However, I like the fact that I'm a free man. I'm my own boss. I do whatever I have. I have access to certain things

like VIP stuff that most people don't. My quality of life, the money, I didn't have it before. Now I do. I love my job. I'm very happy about my job.

But there is a thing about my job that I hate the most is fighting. I freaking hate. I love the study of fighting. I love the science of it, how I'm, the tactical, the physical. I love to train. I love to walk in a room and feel strong. I know if something happens, I'm the man. Even though it's an illusion because with a bullet,

nobody's faster than this. But I like that lifestyle. I do it for the lifestyle, for what it is. I don't do it for the fight. I freaking hate to fight. I had this talk with Rory McDonald at one point. I was like, hey, why do you like fighting? Oh, I guess I like to fight.

He said, you like to fight? I was like, fuck no, I don't like to fight. He said, you like to fight? I was like, fuck no, I don't like to fight. And everybody in the room turned around, they look at me like I'm crazy. I'm like, you guys are all crazy. You think I like to fight

in a cage in front of a million people, maybe get humiliated, knocked out, or die? Are you crazy? I don't like to fight. Are you nuts? I like to win. When you win,

the feeling is unbelievable it's so good that it's worth this yeah but I hate it man

do you hate the day of the fight up until the fight but once the fight starts how do you feel once it starts

no no no no when it starts it's gone all this is gone all the anticipation's gone. I hate the day. The buildup. The day.

Your day. And the closer I get to the day, I love it, but I start to hate it more. It's like a buildup, a hate that buildup, like a bubble of hate. And by the time that it's time to freaking walk out, like the many second that it's time to freaking walk out, like the many seconds that it's time to walk out, and like Burt Watson used to be the guy,

he used to kick out the door, St. Pierre, you ready? No, he's not there anymore, unfortunately. I used to like Burt. I love that guy. We rolling! We rolling, Bobo! Come on, baby.

So I used, it's like a bubble that built up in my stomach that hate, hate, hate, and I freaking hate. I'm even in the locker room before the fight, and I fucking hate it. My last fight, it's crazy. I saw my friend, Eamon, get knocked out, and I go at the dinner, everybody's like dead people, like this.

And I see something is wrong. I dinner, everybody's like dead people like this. And I see where something is wrong. I say, what's wrong? And they told themselves before I get in the room, don't tell them that Amen lost. Don't tell him it's going to affect him. So I get in the room and my friend Eddie, who wasn't there when they told each other, first thing he says to me is like in the room,

he's like, hey, Amen lost. I'm like, oh, is he okay physically? He's like, yeah, he's okay. And everybody in the room it's like hey amen lost i'm like oh is it okay physically he's like yeah it's okay and everybody's like holy so amen lost i remember joe defy loss uh mickey gall lost so i go in my in my locker room i see one guy with the ice bag the other guy is all up like this and i'm like man all my locker room lose man holy i freaking hate this job man then i'm thinking it's like everybody tried to to make me think like oh it's gonna be good as one of my agents like don't worry it's gonna be fine as i it's like it's okay man don't talk to me like this i choose be here i'm i'm a warrior and i say go go sit now it's gonna be fine like i want to be a warrior i don't want to be like

agents you don't want to talk to them yeah oh it's gonna be fine don I want to be a warrior I don't want to be like agents you don't want to talk to them yeah oh it's gonna be fine don't worry how the fuck do you know they go like this yeah yeah how the fuck do you know like when I found my news

the first time they go like this they grab me like don't worry it's gonna be fine they look at each other like like he's fighting

he slams everybody on his head holy shit I'm feeling like I'm going to like a cemetery like someone just died so I'm in the locker room everybody freaking lose I'm feeling like I'm going to a cemetery. Someone just died. So I'm in the locker room.

Everybody freaking knows. I'm like, damn. Then I'm like, shake it up. I go in the bathroom by myself. I go look at myself in the mirror. And that's what I do before the fight. I use James Lange theory. James Lange.

They say that the spirit can dictate your mind. They say you're thirsty. Your mind tells I'm thirsty. You grab the water and your spirit can dictate your mind, but your mind can dictate your spirit. So I go in the bathroom. I close the door. People think I go to bathroom to piss or whatever,

but I don't. I close the door and I say, now I see a lot of negative shit. I go in front of the mirror. I say to myself, I say, try to convince myself. Like a kid, you know, like, I'm the greatest. I'm the strongest.

And I think of it looking at me. And I'm this. I'm beautiful. I'm strong. I'm this. And I'm faster. I'm stronger. I'm going to win.

It's like these young guys, they lose. But I'm going to show them the way to do it, you know. Maybe they fail, but I won't. I'm going to show them the way to do it. Maybe they fail, but I won't. I'm going to show everybody how it should be done. So I come back in the gym with the glory to show them that I achieved it and that's how it should be done. They're going to follow me. So I try to boost myself. Open the door, go back.

I still hate my job, but I'm a different person than when I got in the door. So I play with mind games like this with myself all the time. It's stuff that I try to change your attitude. And it's very important for a fighter because the confidence is a key for a fighter. Some guys they do stuff

very basic in a fight but they do it. When they do it, they do it so good and they believe in it. They don't hesitate and you have no room for hesitation in a fight, but they do it. When they do it, they do it so good that they believe in it, they don't hesitate, and you have no room for hesitation in a fight. You go 100%. And when you go 100% with confidence, that's when the magic can happen. You know what I mean?

If you have the skills, but you don't have the confidence, as John says that, you have the skills and you have no confidence, it's like having money and you don't spend it. That's what John Denner told me. But if you have the confidence without the skills, it's not good too. It's like a dream that cannot be achieved. You don't have any way together.

But if you have both, that's when the magic can happen. I remember when John says that to me all the time. So you have the skill and you have the confidence. And confidence is not a choice. Confidence is not a state of mind. It's a choice, man. You can build it in your head. When something bad happens, you build it and work.

Try to work on your person to build it. This is something you can work on yourself, you know? And that's what I've been doing. Yeah, it's like all these other things you're saying. There's no one answer to how all this is done. All those pieces have to come together. All those pieces have to be together in order for you to be able to just go out there and do it. But I love the fact that you say that you don't like it. I freaking hate it, man. I hate it probably. Even in the locker room when I got

there, when I got there that night, like every other night that I'm fighting, ask my agent, ask even Ferraz. I always tell him, I look at him, I was like, so what the hell I'm doing here? What the, I'm so stupid. Oh my God. And we always laugh at it because now it become at the point that I know, I know it. People say, with experience, do you become more courageous?

Do you become, how do you say, do you lose the fear? You don't lose the fear. You never lose the fear. You learn how to deal with it. You accept it. Before, I did not accept it. In my earlier fight, my first time I fought Matthews, man, I was fighting

this monument. Oh, my God. I didn't sleep for the week, man. I came like a freaking zombie. I was like, oh, my God. Even in the start down, I couldn't even look at him. I look up like this. I couldn't imagine myself. I knew I was going to lose.

The confidence was not there. I have the skill, but it's not the confidence. So it's very important, the confidence. For a fighter, confidence is very important. That's why you have guys in the gym that are very good in the confidence. So it's very important the confidence, you know, for a fighter, confidence is very important. That's why you have guys in the gym that are very good in the gym,

they get into a fight, they shitty fighter. They're king in the gym, they go in a fight, all that stuff crush them. You have guys that are normal

in the gym. I've seen guys in UFC, they fight in UFC, they freaking bad. I can't say for the respect, but I spar with them and they suck. When they fight, they do stuff that is amazing. I'm like, I didn't even know that wasn't his repertoire of technique.

That he just did a katagatami or something. I'm like, man, it's amazing. I didn't even know he knew that. Because of confidence, man. And when you have both the skill and the confidence, you see like Jon Jones, man, his magic, man. You go there, pa-pa-pa-pa, spinning freaking elbows and stuff. You don't hesitate, he goes, man.

Yair Rodriguez is amazing. Brr-pa-pa, man, stuff like that. He's just beautiful to watch, you know, and I really like that. The new generation, man, is scary as hell. Oh, my God. Which fight excites you more, Conor or Khabib? Those are the two fights. If I was going to make a fight for you. Right now, it's like the big fight.

The thing is, Khabib called me out. Physically, now, it's not a good time for me. I need to wait a little bit. However, I feel the 155 division now it's Conor he's the champion there's Ferguson but I think Ferguson is out

and there's other guys too but there's the two guys Conor and Khabib but Khabib now I think he's the champion but he need to fight maybe the Conor

or to be the real champion he's the real champion. He's the real champion. I don't like to say the real not champion. Well, it's a problem. And my opinion on the belt is really different than most people think.

I don't even think it should be a belt. I think it should be a fight. But it is what it is. I agree with you on that. Make fun fight. There's no belt. Like I said, you cannot be the strongest man in the world. It's an illusion.

Right. The belt, it claims, it elevates someone like you think he's a god, he's the strongest man. No, he's not. What's a good marketing tool? That eight-rank guy that can beat you, but maybe he cannot beat the seven other in front of you. Yeah. You know what I mean? The six other. So I don't know how it could be done.

It's bad to criticize a system if you don't suggest any alternative. I know it's bad what I do, but it's – Well, the problem is the system's in flux anyway, right? Because Tony was the interim champion, and he didn't do anything to lose it. All he did was fall down while doing press obligations to tear his knee apart. Then you have Conor, who just didn't defend it, and then they stripped him. So you're going to give it to Khabib, but he's

fighting Al Iaquinta, who ordinarily wouldn't be fighting for the title. So why does he have the potential to fight for the title? It doesn't make any sense. They just had to do it for this event, because they had this big event in Brooklyn, and they had to have a champion. So they decided this is how they're going to do gonna do it but you got to be careful when you make

decisions like that yeah because you in many people's eyes in the eyes of the purists you D legitimize they lose value yes I agree 100% he lose value to is especially like what I did make lose value to fight and tricks left the fight best ping left they freaking hate my guts that's why I don't think so though I did make loose value too. Fight Andrix left. Fight Bisping left. They freaking hate my guts. That's why. See, I don't think so though because I think. It's not good for the brand.

It's not good. And I know it's not good. I'm not stupid. I realize it. But I had no choice, man. I go back there and not in condition. You know what I mean?

Yeah, but I think it all worked out. Robbie Lawler won the title and then Robbie Lawler lost the title to Tyrone Woodley. Nobody doesn't think that Tyrone Woodley nobody doesn't think that Tyrone Woodley

is the legitimate champion because you retired no I mean it's a clear path it makes sense no no I understand the same thing

like I said it's not WWE man I have to do what is the best for me and I don't regret my decision I regret that I stayed too long

I should have retired maybe take my first stop after Diaz because Diaz was the fight the big fight that I stayed too long I should have retired maybe take my first stop after Diaz yeah cuz Diaz was the fight a big fight and what you know what I mean it was like the main guy you know to fight then after rush but there's always a guy Joe does a thing there's always another freaking guy that's the way this part you know we always believe that after that wall it would be no wall but now man is always another another another another But no, man, it's always another, another, another, another.

And I realize that. And every fight are more expected than other and are bigger than other. And it is what it is, man. It is what it is. It's a hard, very hard life mentally. Depending on how you're wired, psychologically, for me, it was a lot to take. It's a lot to take for me. I have a theory about that. One of the reasons why it's a lot to take is because you're wired, psychologically, for me, it was a lot to take. Well, I think part of the reason – It's a lot to take for me. I have a theory about that.

One of the reasons why it's a lot to take is because you're smart. I think smart people, they entertain all the possibilities. They think about all the possibilities. They're aware of all the variables. I'm a thinker. I think a lot. Yes. I analyze.

I think a lot. I mean, it's good because it's prepared you very well, and it's made you this incredible martial artist. But it also creates a lot of anxiety because you're aware of all the possibilities. Whereas a person who doesn't think that much, just, I'm just going to go in there and fuck people up, that person might have an easier path to fight, but they might also have a shorter limited potential

because they're not aware of all the possibilities and they're not aware of all their flaws and they're not aware of all their strengths and weaknesses. They just know what they've done that's worked and they just keep doing that and instead of developing this incredibly well-rounded game they have a very very uh limited game but that limited game works on some people i agree it's it's it's this sport the sport in general it's kind it's kind of not fair when you look at it like you look like demetrius Johnson.

He's probably right now the best. Ever. The best ever, yeah. I agree. Man, when I talk about confidence and skills, man, what is the better guy than this? What better guy than this? Dominic Cruz, freaking amazing.

Man, TJ Delechere. That's one fight Look I don't watch every fight Okay I don't watch every fight Because I'm not a fan Of every fighter

But if there's a fight That I will pay My home ticket To sit in front And fly myself Is Dominic Dimitris Johnson

Against TJ Delechere Absolutely Man It has to be done It has to be done Crazy I agree Dominic, uh, uh, Dimitris Johnson against TJ Delachaux. Absolutely. I, man, it has to be done. It has to be done. Crazy. I agree.

I don't, there's always things and factor that we don't know why it doesn't happen. Maybe we don't know everything, unfortunately. And,

um, yeah, like, like back in the day, me and Anderson Silva, it's a lot of things. Why it didn't happen? Is there stuff that people

don't know that, that, that back in the day I thought and then Silva, it's a lot of things. Why it didn't happen? Is there stuff that people don't know that back in the day I taught and I wanted to take care of and it didn't happen? But this fight, man, is just crazy, man. Sometimes it's sad in this sport. You have a fight like Mayweather, Pacquiao, and it did not happen. It sucked, but it is what it is, you know? Well, I think that Demetrius wants TJ Dillashaw to fight once at 125 pounds. Show that he can make the weight.

Especially when he's dealing with this incredibly long win streak. He's defended his title more than any other champion ever. So he doesn't want someone to come along and break his win streak that doesn't even make the weight. I have thought about this because I've been in a similar situation. This is a way to take care of this with the lawyers. You write in the contract that if you don't make weight, there's no fight. And the purse, you make the guy paying you a purse, not the UFC. Dillashaw would take the purse, give the purse.

You know what I mean? Yeah. No, I do. You need to be game enough to do it it's a freaking risk yeah yeah but I think Demetrius

is worried that the UFC will pressure him into fighting TJ even if TJ doesn't make the weight for sure for sure

it will make him look bad in terms of with the fan base and his brand I agree however he can make it through the lawyer through the

if it's that much weight difference there is no fight. Fights, man, Joe, this is something I've learned. Fight can be negotiated the way you want. I can negotiate a fight depending on the laws. Okay, I want you to wear pink Speedos when I fight you. It's in the contract.

You have to wear a pink Speedo. I want you to wear this or any, like, a fifth round. Everything could be done if it's written and by the law agreed. Yeah. It could be worked out. I don't think to me, Tristan. I hope it will be worked out, man. I'm saying this, guys.

Let's do it, man. Let's go. Well, I think right now the rematch is set for Cody Garbrandt versus TJ Dillashaw, and Mighty Mouse just went through shoulder surgery so he's rehabilitating his shoulder that's going to take

quite a while and there's Dominic Cruz doing the mix man he's amazing he's amazing I like to watch him a lot yeah there's a lot of talent there's a lot of talent

in the UFC right now the smaller guy are so much better than the bigger guy I'm telling you the truth if I would have the same size as this guy I don't want to fight this if I would have the same size as this guy,

man, I don't want to fight this guy, man. They would beat the shit out of me. Like, no, man. Well, they don't have gravity

fucking with them. I agree. They don't have the gravity. They don't have the size. Yeah. But, they're so good, man. It's so good to watch them.

Yeah. I'm learning a lot. I watch a lot more of these guys than, in terms of, for learning. Yeah. Man,

how beautiful was that armbar that Demetrius in terms of, for learning, man, how beautiful was that armbar that Demetrius Johnson did? Shit, man, it slammed to it. Slammed to the armbar in the air and he totally practices that.

I practice it now. I've been training. Yeah, I've learned from these guys, man. I learned from a lot of these guys. DJ De La Show, he switch, man,

every time, he's changing angles. That's beautiful. Dominic Cruz, man, his footwork, man, it's insane. Have you ever trained with Dwayne Ludwig? Long time ago, yes. I have a spar.

We trained when I was in Denver, helping Nathan Marquardt for a fight. I sparred, man, it was crazy. I sparred with Dwayne, Nate, Shane Carwin, too. Oh, my God. You sparred with Shane Carwin? Yeah, man, that was not smart, but I did, yeah. Fuck with Shane Carwin yeah man that was not smart but I did yeah

fuck that yeah yeah that was not smart that was back in the day maybe I should have been smarter his hand is as big as your head

thanks god I didn't get hurt but oh my god it was yeah at one point I remember in a training he was in ground and pound with another guy

that is like a light everywhere they knock him out yeah he's a big monster but that was stupid of my part. When you're young, you do stupid shit. I should not have done it.

Yeah. Fuck that, huh? Yeah. What did he weigh back then? He weighs... Me or him? Him. I just say, man, Carwin is maybe like...

270? Yeah, he's a big guy. Fucking huge. No, I know. That was stupid, but I did it. And then, you know... You move, man. You got to fucking move move man You gotta fucking move

You gotta fucking move Yeah man Hit and run man Hit and run Don't try to stand In the pocket with this guy And if you go for a takedown You go in and out

And quick man Holy shit Your timing has to be perfect Yeah Fuck that You only one round? Yeah one round Yeah

Yeah Yeah As far as We went with everybody You know There's this thing Like I You only won round? Yeah, one round. Yeah, yeah, yeah. As far as we went with everybody. There's this thing like when we train with other guys, especially I train with everybody. I train with John Jones. I train with everybody.

It's a good experience. There's guys that spar like it's their life dependent. It's a real fight. There's other guys. Of course, depending if you get ready for a fight or not, and if you know, depending on the situation, but when it's just a sparring for sparring that you're not in training camp or whatever you spar, but there's still guys that I see, younger guys, they

they lose a lot of their their years of fighting in the gym, because they fight in the gym, man. It's not good for your brain, man. Holy shit. I've never been a big fan of this. I feel like even now in my last sparring,

guys, they come hard at me, but I have to go hard because otherwise they're going to hurt me. But that's not because of me. That's because my freaking trainer is telling them, you got to put him away. We're going to praise you. Do you know what I mean?

So why does Feras do that? He's completely crazy, Feras, man. He's insane. I love him to death, but man, he's completely insane. He's my sensei. He's my paime. I call him paime. John, you know John, I call him the emperor.

The emperor John, like Star Wars. They all have nicknames. That's hilarious. Yeah, man. They're tough guys. John is another one. Like, when I'm in training camp, he put me with Gordon Ryan,

Gary Tony, one after Jake Schill. Like, hey, go, go, go, go. Damn, man. I get smashed. I get out like a pretzel. Like, I'm like... Sometimes it's not good for my confidence.

Sometimes it is. Sometimes I'm like, shit, man. It's hard to... I have a hard life, you know? There's a darkness inside John's brain. Yeah, like shit man it's hard to I have a hard life there's a darkness inside John's brain yeah man and it's hard

it's dark he's a hard man I made a lot of good change my last for preparation you know I used to train like on the ground

fight the wing fight round of five minutes you're never going to spend five minutes on the ground when you train for an MMA fight so I did three minute

round with one minute break and starting from scrambling position like for example head and arm control when you're trying for an MMA fight. So I did three-minute round with one-minute break. And starting from scrambling position, like, for example, head and arm control, then go. Or mount position, go. We didn't start, like, shaking.

Because you lose time while you're making. So we start from position control and go. So it makes you more active. And when you fight, it makes you more opportunistic. And now I teach. I try to start 12 February. I do it because I love it, 12 February. And that's how I teach the people now.

No more five-minute round. When you train for an MMA fight, two-minute round. Three-minute round and start from a position. You will never spend the entire five-minute round. And the minute that you're going to spend on the ground, you have to be very economic and very opportunist. When you see something, boom! That's what I get in the fight with Bisping. I see the neck, boom!

I let him stand up, do the leg drag, right away. I probably would not have reacted the same way a few years ago. It would be more taking a position and safe kind of mentality you know what I mean need to learn to yeah but I practice it a lot

because I learned the pattern of this thing that when you do this you like to do this so I predict yeah we've worked on it you know like what I mean like it's stuff that we worry, it wasn't in my, like I said, like my autopilot already in my hard disk. So it's just reaction, you don't have time to think. Which before, when you don't train like this, you train in five minutes, it's slower pace, so you're thinking more.

Jiu-Jitsu is more, it's not much of a dynamic, it's more isometric sport. Sometimes of a dynamic. It's more isometric sport. Sometimes you're dynamic, but it's more isometric and position. So you don't want to be like this for him. You want to be like bang, bang, bang, bang, fast. You know what I mean? Make you more, you know what I mean, more efficient. What kind of training are you doing now?

I mean, you're going to train with Freddie Roach now. Yeah. But how much time are you spending training? I train normally twice a day, every day. Still? Yeah. I don't train hard every day, twice a day. Some days I do once a day.

I try to train at least four days a week that are twice a day and maybe two days that are once a day, depending what I do. For example, I'm only going to train once a day. Today is with Freddie. Tomorrow I do this new thing. Now that really changed my life too. I train in a pool. I don't lift weights.

You don't lift weights? No, man. I don't. I still don't believe in conditioning. You say conditioning. I don't believe. I believe it's an illusion. Everybody has a... It's efficiency. If someone gets tired more than the others because it's more efficient. Because everybody at a certain level is in shape. You know what I mean?

But I train in the pool. I do, for example, I have resistance stuff, equipment, and I train in the pool. So it's like my weight training I do in the pool. Wow. For example, you do flies. So you have protagonist, antagonist muscle that works all the time.

And it's like doing flies, but instead of that, you have protagonist and antagonist. You do a fly and a pool at the same time. Push, pool. And you're doing it with rubber bands? No, no, no. It's a resistance equipment. No, no. Resistance equipment is like a... Shit, I wish I would know you.

Like a cable? No, it's not a cable. It's like a resistance. It's like a handle. It's a new thing. The Russians developed this like in the 80s, a long time ago, where we just start to learn now about it. And the Russians were way more advanced than us.

And it's Gavin McMillan that made me discover this form of training when I rehabbed my ACL. So he hates weight training. He said weight training, they load up your joint. It damages your joint, you know, depending on how you do it. But when you go heavy, it damages your joint. And it's true. That's why I look young and I feel better at 37 now.

If it wouldn't be for this, my ulcercer i feel better now at 37 that i feel at 25 mark my word is true the only difference is let's say i go out with like my birthday was may 19 last saturday i got completely wasted drunk it take me more days to recuperate because i'm 37 than when i was 25 but strength wise like i feel just more powerful, better. Yeah, man. There's hope for the older man. There's hope that we can last better. We can have a better living. It's kind of crazy that you don't believe in strength and conditioning. I don't.

You think that is the thing that everybody does today. No, I don't. Everybody is involved with strength and conditioning. Because sometimes they mix up their performance and strength conditioning because of the steroid, I believe. up their performance and strength conditioning because of the steroid, I believe. A lot of people,

they say, oh, my new nutrition is because of this, this, or my new training make me be stronger. Look,

I'm a better fighter. Oh man, maybe it's because you're taking something. You know what I mean? Yeah. I believe in UFC, let's say,

I spar with some pro boxer, okay, for example. This right here? Yeah, this one, an example. So you've got,

look, ankle weights on, is that what it is? Yeah. Oh, wow. But they create a resistance on the way up, you see,

so it doesn't load up my joint. And you're just exploding. Yeah, this is like pistol squat, but there's like a hundred, like, exercises like this, like,

I say a hundred, maybe not a hundred, but there's so many. Yeah, man. Wow. There's stuff you can do with your, every part maybe not 100, but there's so many. Yeah, man. There's stuff you can do with every part of your body you can do an exercise.

And this is something the Russians got into. Yes, and also the NFL football player a lot trained with that because it increases your power. It works.

So the thing that you don't have is the stability. But if you want to increase your power, it helps for increasing the power for muscle the fiber of the muscle you know what i mean yeah it won't make you a better fighter but it will longevity wise keep your your car your your your car your vehicle your vehicle healthier that's why i do strength

conditioning i don't do for making me a better fighter. I do it because I want to look good. I want to be muscular. I want to be balanced. I want to have a longer longevity. It's not going to make me hit harder or stronger. Hell no. Freddie Roach might help me hit stronger, for example. You know what I mean?

John Danner will make me be more creative, have better arm bars. And Feras will make me, you know what I mean, like better fighter in terms of giving me knowledge and different things. That's what I believe. Could be wrong, Joe. Like I know we think different ways in that regard. We argued before about this. But that's what I believe. I'm open-minded.

A lot of times when I'm arguing, I'm just playing the devil's advocate. I don't think there's any one way to do these things. Like example, I spar, for example, or you're a jiu-jitsu guy, make an experimentation. Go wrestle with a real wrestler, like a high-level wrestler, pure wrestler. Right. Wrestle with him. You're going to get tired much quicker than him. Right, for sure.

It's not because he's got a better cardio than you you know or maybe he is like depending but then after that go on the ground sit down and shake his hand and start rolling on the ground i guarantee he's gonna get more tired than you because if you never done jujitsu he's gonna spend a lot more energy he's gonna you're gonna be much more efficient than him right even though maybe he has a better cardio than than if you take a VO2 max test, maybe he's going to score better. However, you're more efficient. It's all about efficiency. They try to sell you the product.

They try to sell you the program. It's all freaking advertising. Our life is made of advertising. That's why I was angry, and we talk about intermittent fasting. There's no pills for this. There's nobody that makes money. That's why nobody talks about it.

But it's so efficient. It's the oldest remedy in the world. You know what I mean? In three days, you can rebuild your immune system and your gut. All of it. In three days of fasting, you do it. Take Himalaya salt with the water. You go train.

It's perfect. You go in autophagy phase. It's the best. You know what I mean? But nobody talks about it. It's perfect. You go in autophagy phase, it's the best. You know what I mean? But nobody talks about it. Same thing in cardio and all that. They have to commercialize. Oh, it's the money.

It's all about selling you the thing. Our life, it's all about branding. Everywhere we go, it's freaking commercial. We're surrounded by commercial if we want it. And there's something we don't even realize it because it's so present in our life. So it's not going to make me a better fighter. I do it because I felt good, developed my muscle,

and it's good for me to have muscle for my brand, for me, for advertising, even for myself. I feel good, you know what I mean, Joe? I feel solid, you know what I mean?e feel solid you know what i mean get it yeah that's a real truth it's not gonna make me hit you think this is gonna make me have a better hook no man it's it doesn't transcend like that right timing precision uh forms you know everything it's not if joe lewis had the smallest arm i think the one of the smallest arm, I think, one of the smallest arms, he hit like crazy. Yeah, he did.

You know what I mean? When you look at his build, he wasn't like a Mike Tyson or a Lennox Lewis. My friend, Adonis Stevenson. I mean, he's built. He's an athlete. But man, I sparred with him many times and he hit like a fucking truck.

He's probably the heaviest hitter I've ever seen in my life. You know what I mean? Yeah. And he's not like, he's strong, he's athletic, but there is guys that look stronger than him. Bodybuilder. Yeah,

that's because of his form, the way he transfers his weight, his vector of force, everything, his technique, his timing, his precision, everything is perfect.

It's bone structure too, a little bit too, right? Especially power. Your freaking back kick, man. Like, this is something, it's not because you're there and I said,

the human being that I've hit, that I've produced the highest amount of force that I've ever witnessed in my life is you, man, with your freak. I'm not saying, this is the truth.

I've never seen a human being physically capable of hitting something with that much force than you. It's a perfect example of what we argue. Yeah.

It's not because you're stronger. Yeah, you're a strong guy. You're a good athletic guy. But, you know, like, you're older than me, you know? Like, you know what I mean?

Like, why? Because it's your form, the technique, the vector of force, your technique, everything is all freaking perfect, your technique. Everything is all freaking perfect. Timing.

That's why when you turn and you make that spin, like, I don't care who you are. If you're Francis Ngandu, you hit that shit on the face, you're going to be dead, you know? Not dead, but you're going to be knocked out, man. This is crazy. You know what I mean? When you did that, it was completely insane.

You know what I mean? Yeah, that's the one. I'm still working on it, by the way, but I can't do like you do with my knee coming out. I feel like when I do inspiring, the guys, they see it, and so I have to keep my knee tucked in. Yeah, I think you're just thinking that. Maybe it's because of karate.

I learn in a different way. So my brain is wired so much in a certain way. The problem with karate is that lower knee, the knee down by the other knee versus up by the hip. When you bring it up by the hip, there's much more leverage. There's a tremendous amount of force. And the alignment of your lower leg, the supporting leg, and the kicking leg is better to generate force,

whereas the kicking leg is almost independent of the lower leg, and the kicking leg is better to generate force, whereas the kicking leg is almost independent of the lower leg if you're going up, because they're not moving in the same direction. One leg is going up, the other leg is going forward. So it's like it's all goofy. When the hip is up, when you turn, the hip is up, this

is pushing and this is going forward. It's just boom. That's where the power comes from. However, you come from Taekwondo, is all the Olympic is pushing and this is going forward it's just boom however the power comes from however you you you come from taekwondo yeah is all the olympic athlete like champion they don't do it like that yeah no no they don't no no no exactly that you do it in a different ways right well but man i never seen anybody hit as hard like i don't care if it's a punch like i never see a strike a strike a blow from a human being that hard.

Man, I remember the bag when you were working in, it was a freaking hole almost in the bag. It was like curves in the bag, like with your footprint in it. I'm like, it's completely insane, man. It's a lot of power. I was with Eddie Bravo, and I remember we were freaking out. Then you were going back and forth. Well, you know, we worked together because of Donaher. Yeah. Bravo and I remember we were freaking out then you were going back and forth and I like you

You know we work together because of Donaher Yeah, cuz John came up to me and just asking me because I was a commentator Yeah, he said I need someone to help George with the the fundamentals of his spinning back kick He needs like like a technique refresher. Do you know anybody? I just gotta listen to me. But I have a really good spinning back kick. So that's how you put it out. He's a smart guy. I said, he put it to me just asking if I knew a Taekwondo guy.

He knew. He did know. He knew. He told me he's going to ask if you could work with me. That's funny because he said it to me asking me if I knew somebody. No, but you want to put it this way. Johnny's a smart guy. Johnny's a very smart guy.

If he would have said it, he would have kind of... Because I remember he said that to me and I said, because he's like my son, so he's my... So I said, yeah, yeah, yeah, right. I'm like, and then I was rolling my eyes like, what the fuck is Joe Rogan? I didn't know your background, you know? Like I knew you did some martial arts. That's what I thought he was going to think

he knew because the word gets around that you have a very strong spinning back he somehow told him or he's seen it because he told me then I was like yeah I'll do it when I go train with Freddie Roach

then I couldn't believe it I called him the same night I said what the fuck was that, man? It's like, this should be an illegal, if he ever fights, man, this should be illegal. He can kill someone with this, man.

It's insane, man. What's fucked up is it almost feels like a lie because it was so long ago. It was a different life. Like, I stopped fighting. I'm 50 years old. I stopped fighting when I was 21.

So I haven't fought in forever. So it's just, I keep doing it and training, but I haven fighting when I was 21. So I haven't fought in forever. So it's just I keep doing it and training but I haven't done it so long. So when I tell someone that I can do it, I'm like is that true? Is it true? How many people did you ever light up someone with that particular

video of me when I was 19 from a Taekwondo tournament making a guy fly through the air. Are you serious? It's on YouTube. Yeah, Jamie. Oh my God. Is he okay now? Is he alive?

I don't know. Here it is right here. Are you kidding me, man? Yeah, that's a fucking scratchy VHS video from 1986. Bro, you realize you didn't even cut him. You know we talk about precision. Like, there was like,

like your technique is freaking, but it's so powerful. Like you got him where? On the shoulder? No, no, I caught him on the body. It wasn't in the shoulder. You can see it again. But yeah, that,

it's, okay, okay, okay. It's just his arm, it's underneath his arm. Oh my God. But I saw him coming forward. But to put that guy away is because it's incredibly powerful. A it actually lands but I saw him coming forward but to put that guy away is because

it's incredibly powerful a guy would do the same thing hit him in the same spot it would probably not get put away like that

oh okay okay see as you see like the impact it goes right into his body and then I extend and then when I extended he was

I was kind of like oh yeah okay I see no no that was perfect. And he just sailed through the air. It's just – it's a crazy – it's got so much power. Yeah, man.

It's just a crazy technique. And I was raised in a taekwondo school that came from the old school taekwondo before tournaments. See, General Choi, Choi Hyung-yi, he trained – he was the inventor of taekwondo, the founder of taekwondo before tournaments see general chae chae hyung yi he trained he was the inventor of taekwondo the founder of taekwondo and he trained a small handful of of elite instructors and one of them was jay hun kim who was my instructor so my taekwondo background was old school taekwondo before Olympic it was even a consideration and so everyone trained for power

it was a different thing breaking yeah it was just you had to be able to defend yourself in the street my instructor's idea

was if you couldn't hurt someone with a kick like why even practice it and these taekwondo guys in tournaments they were tapping

each other they were just moving really fast trying to score points and he hated that shit he hated that shit and he felt like Taekwondo guys in tournaments, they were tapping each other. They were just moving really fast, trying to score points. And he hated that shit. He hated that shit. And he felt like you had to load up more.

There had to be more power into those techniques. And it wasn't quite as fast as like the really quick style Olympic point style Taekwondo. But that Olympic point style wouldn't hurt anybody. You couldn't keep them off of you. But the thing is hard for me. Like, I try to practice your ways, but I don't know if it's my hips or the weight. No, no. It's just reps. It's just repetition.

Okay, okay. We'll go over here after we're done. We're done anyway now. Man, it's freaking hard, man. We have this gym here. I'll just give you a refresher. Yeah. But a lot of it comes from the front leg side kick.

Nobody I know. You know, I go back. I went back to karate training because I've done Muay Thai, but I was coming from karate background. We've done it straight, not like you, straight. Then in Muay Thai, then I haven't done it for a kick, like back kick for a long time because they don't really do that much in Muay Thai.

Now I went back to karate, my last fight. And when I start to redo it, I've been taught again with the knee. The knee down. Yeah, but I like the way you do it, man. been taught again with the knee. The knee down. Yeah, but I like the way you do it, man. It's crazy. The knee has to be higher. Yeah, the knee has to be higher to get the full power into it.

I just don't have the same efficiency with it. Yeah, but it can be done. You can learn that efficiency. Shit. 100%. It's freaking nuts, man. Yeah, but it comes from learning first the right way to do the front leg side kick. See, the front leg side kick, you develop that, boom, but it comes from learning first the right way to do the front leg side kick.

See, the front leg side kick, you develop that, boom, that knee comes up, and then, boom, it's all in thrusting that hip and popping it forward. And then once you develop the speed from doing that, then you do it with the turn. Then it's turn, boom. It's the same thing. It's that twist of the hip and the extension of the leg, but then it's also the turn first. So the turn first, boom, and then the extension of the leg. That's where all that power comes from. Shit. It's all in a straight line.

Okay. And then the 360, when the right leg is forward and you step forward and then throw that kick. Yeah, that was – That's like getting hit by a train. That's the one that's the strongest I've ever seen. That shit's crazy. You're running it somewhat. You're not even in your prime now.

No, I'm 50. Shit. But when I was 19, I could do it like a laser beam. It was so fast. You know, like in that video. That's all I did, though. From the time I was 15 to the time I was 21, I didn't do shit. I barely did any homework.

I didn't pay attention in school at all. All I did was fight. That's all I did was do Taekwondo. That's all I did. I just wanted to be in the homework. I didn't pay attention in school at all. All I did was fight. That's all I did was do Taekwondo. That's all I did. I just wanted to be in the Olympics. I wanted to be a Taekwondo champion. Wow. Yeah, that's all I wanted to do.

But then the problem was I started sparring with kickboxers and getting fucked up. And I realized that Taekwondo has no hands. The hand techniques were useless. And when I would be in a boxing ring and I would be sparring with someone, they'd just get me in a corner and start fucking me up. And I was like, oh, I don't know how to do this. Like I need to learn how to box. And so I realized Taekwondo in a lot of situations is not effective. It's not useful.

Like I needed to learn how to box first. And so then I started training that. And then I started training with Muay Thai guys, getting leg kicked. I'm like, ah, fuck. because we were doing like above the waist kick boxing and then I saw Rick Rufus when he fought that uh Thai fighter you know there's a like a really important fight when Rick fought this guy and the guy just chopped his fucking legs out front I'm like ah I saw that fight however you put the put the same fight in the MMA contest. Like, I mean, Rick Rufus beat the shit out of him the first, I think, few minutes.

Yeah. He killed the guy. But the guy used kind of the rules to stand back up. Then, yeah, you okay? Yes. You put that in the MMA context. That's why the striking in MMA, people say, oh, let's say my weather goes into MMA, he'll knock everybody out if they stay standing up. I don't agree with that

at all, man. No, he'll get killed. His legs. Not only the legs, I think even the hand, like Randy Couture beat Victor Belfort, remember with the, how do you say that in English? Uppercut? The boxing, the dirty boxing. Dirty boxing, glitching is

very different. Even the distance, the timing, it'sirty boxing, glitching is very different. Even the distance, the timing. It's just a small glove. It changes everything. Sure, sure. Man, I spar a lot with much better decorated pure wrestler than me in MMA. I put them all down. All of them.

Not because I'm a better wrestler. It's because my timing. I learned from Karate how to close the gap in Karate. But I use that, I use the Karate for the takedown. Some use Karate for

blitzing and like Wonderboy. Yes. Just depend on how you use your tool, you know what I mean? What do you think

about Wonderboy tilt? That's this weekend. Oh, man, I'm going to watch this fight. I think two things can happen. How long are you going to be in town for? That's this weekend. Oh, man, I'm going to watch this fight. I think two things can happen. How long are you going to be in town for?

I leave on Friday. I got to go back on Friday, unfortunately. Fight's on Sunday. It's here? Yeah. No, it's in England, but it's early morning. Oh, yeah, it's true. We're going to do a fight companion.

We're going to come in here and watch it. Yeah, I got to bounce, man. No, seriously, it's because I really got to bounce. But this weekend, I have something bounce, man. I wish I... No, seriously, it's because I really got to bounce. But this weekend, I have something important this weekend. But man, I need to be in Montreal

Saturday. But shit, I would have... Ah, man. The fight's going to be great. We'll do another time for sure. Yeah, let's do it for sure. Normally, I watch fight with people that doesn't

know nothing about fight. It's fucking impressive. Fight companions are fun. We drink a couple beers, watch the fights. My fight companions are different than... You know, most of my friends

are not really fighters. They're like normal guys, geeks or whatever. They think they know, but they don't know nothing about fighting. Is that annoying? I have no idea.

I'm freaking out. And I try to be diplomatic. I'm sitting here and everybody's like, hey, why you didn't do this? Why you didn't do that? I'm like, and I used to

try to correct them. used to but i put so much effort and energy that i just gave up at one point i'm like yeah man why you didn't do this like the fight tyron would live with one of the boy people like i was watching the fight he's like it's so boring i can't believe it it's like dude you just don't understand that if one the boy you go with one the way and you you you't understand that if Wonderboy you go with Wonderboy and you you charge him like this

he would you know what I mean like I don't want to talk about he's my friend and I don't want to talk about for Darren Till

if he listen to this Wonderboy is my is my friend but they just don't freaking get it they don't understand they're not educated about the culture

like it's the same thing on the floor oh yeah why don't you do this like they have a few fights in the street, you know. Yeah. It's funny. They're my boys, man.

I like them. But a lot of them, like, sometimes I listen. Not all of them, but some of them are like, oh, geez, man. What the hell is this? It's frustrating. They think they know, but they don't know, man. A lot of them. They think they know, but they don't know.

I still love you guys but oh my god sometimes it's annoying you know well listen george let's wrap this up man thank you for coming here i really appreciate it brother it's always great to see you thank you man thank you is it the real time that's the real time holy shoot are you serious yeah we did three hours oh my god are you serious yeah you sure no it can't be the real time. It's a time warp in here, man. Dude, that's insane. I need to be to the contender. Let me check.

Where do you got to go? I go to the contender with Freddie Roach. What time are you supposed to be there? Yeah, I'm checking. But you need to train with me. I think I need to be there at 4.30 before. You can leave right now. I think it closed at 4.30. If you leave now, you can be there by 4.30.

Yeah, but I missed the freaking back kick instructional, which I want to do. I'll give you a quick one, real quick. Fuck. Let's fucking do it. You don't mind? Enjoy yourself. No. Bye, everybody.

You don't mind now? Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.