The Joel Klatt Show: A College Football Podcast - 2023 NFL Combine reaction: Evaluating Bryce Young, Anthony Richardson, CJ Stroud & other Ohio State stars

Episode Date: March 7, 2023

FOX Sports’ lead college football analyst Joel Klatt gives his reactions to the NFL Combine including how much we should take from Anthony Richardson’s record-breaking workout and why Alabama QB Bryce Young’s measurements shouldn’t change our opinion of him. Then, Joel shares his insight from calling C.J. Stroud’s games over the last 2 seasons and what his Ohio State teammate, Jaxon Smith-Njigba, projects to be in the NFL. Finally, Joel shares what makes Texas RB Bijan Robinson so special and how high he should go in the draft. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome back to the Joel Clatt show. I am Joel Clatt and good to be with you. Listen, fun times. NFL combine reaction. So we got to talk about the underwear Olympics here. Some full thoughts on a bunch of different guys, mainly the quarterbacks and thoughts about the whole thing here coming straight up. First though, just remember, subscribe to the show. If you haven't already, share with a friend. Rate, review us and follow us on social media. You can follow the show on any of the social media platforms. at Joel Clat Show. So get out there and we're always releasing all of this content in shorter form on all those social media is all week long. So get out there and make sure to do that. Okay. So here we go. The NFL Combine in general is something that I am not a huge fan of. It's tough for me to get all excited about the Combine. I understand people that do because there's no football to talk about. And so this is what we get to talk about. And I understand that. So I'm not saying, that you shouldn't get excited about the NFL combine. And in fact, if you love it, good for you. I watched a ton of it. I loved the coverage. Obviously, DJ, Daniel Jeremiah was fantastic.

Rich was fantastic. Charles Davis, everybody, Schrager, you know, everybody that was involved with it, I love the insights that you get and some of the interviews that you get. But as a practice, I think that the combine is outdated, quite frankly. And I think the, The way that we view it from the outside looking in is not necessarily where the value is held. Let me just start with this. I'm sick to my stomach when I see guys doing things that have no translation to what they are going to do on the football field and then they get hurt. Namely, I can't stand that we put linemen, interior defensive linemen, even big edge rushers, offensive linemen. through some of these drills that, quite frankly, don't translate at all.

And then we wind up seeing an injury. Andrew Voorhees comes to mind. He's got an ACL injury that pops up. Wanya Morris, the offensive lineman. He looks like he goes down with a hamstring because he's trying to be a sprinter for 40 yards. Come on. Like, that's, like, what are we doing? If you were to change the combine and linemen just ran 10-yard bursts,

I would understand it because I was like, you know, short area quickness. I understand that. Explosiveness. A 40-yard sprint? What are we doing? And do we really care whether he runs a 5-4 or a 5-1? I don't. I don't.

And I don't think any of the savvy decision-makers do either. So things like that are very hard. Having said that, how about the warrior that Andrew Voorhees is, right? Offensive line for USC, tears his ACL comes back, comes back with a brace on, straight legs it lays down on the bench and does more reps of 225 than anybody in the combine 38 I believe they got him he did 39 they took one away because of the he didn't get full extension it's like okay we get it hard oh 38 reps on the 225 how about that so good on Andrew vorhays I love that story going for it the last thing I'll say about about the combine is

now we see these guys and they're getting injured and that impacts their ability to go to the next level and earn a job. It just does. And I immediately think to myself, okay, so you're telling me doing drills in your underwear is more important somehow than actually playing in a bowl game. Because we're all fine with like, oh, we get it, man. Like these players, no way you should play in a bowl game. Oh, but it's fine to roll out there in your underwear as an offensive lineman and sprint for 40 yards and tear your hamstring? Come on. Come on. So I think that some level of a reality check should enter into the equation. What is the combine actually for? Let's not get enamored too much with all these on-field drills,

because quite frankly, they're just there to confirm small snippets of what you see, generally speaking, on film. Is a guy as explosive in the combine as he was on film? Check. Okay. We can do that without running through all of these drills. And I personally believe that that should be the way that we should go. So what is the combine for? Well, there is some value and there's some strong value in particular for these franchises. And they fall in the interviews and medical category. You get a chance to sit down with these players and really understand how they operate, how they operate under pressure, what type of people they are, what type of answers that they'll give. Are they somebody that you want in your organization? Those are vital elements of the scouting combine. The medical can be vital elements, and these guys are poked and prodded all week long. That's vital as an information gathering process for these organizations. So I understand why it continues to happen. I just can't stand that we've made it more about the on-field drills, which don't translate.

They just really don't. Some of them do here and there, but when you look at it from an overarching perspective, I just can't stand to see some of those guys get injured doing things that they would never do on the football field. Let's watch their film and evaluate them as football players. Not as, hey, this guy has played football his whole life. Now for three months, he's going to train to jump around and run around in his tights. So there we go. There's me as the old man yelling at the clouds because I know a lot of you guys love this stuff.

And I get it. Listen, I get it. I really do. I just can't stand to see guys get hurt. in that setting. Having said that, let's get to some reaction and talk about some of the players

that we saw over the course of the last week in Indianapolis because there's a lot of chatter about a lot of guys, really. And you can pick, you can do the whole things like winners and losers

and everything. And I'm not going to do that. But I do want to give my observations on the guys that generated the most buzz in Indianapolis. So I'm going to start with the guy that generated what I feel like was the most buzz, which is the Florida quarterback Anthony Richardson.

Now, last week I talked a lot about Anthony Richardson. And so just to review it, if you haven't listened to last week's, first of all, you should. You should go back and listen to last week's episode of the Joel Clashio. But if you didn't, I basically said, like, Anthony Richardson is the guy with the most top-end potential in the draft. He has the potential to be the best player on the field in a couple of years, regardless of who he's playing. So that's enticing, and we understand that.

However, to get to that level, it's like unlocking a Rubik's cube. So if you're looking at Anthony Richardson as a Rubik's cube, then you have to think to yourself, how many turns away is he from being complete? Well, in my estimation, he's quite a few turns. Now, does that mean he can't get there? Absolutely not. I think he can. And by the way, when you look at the development of other quarterbacks around the league

that were considered projects or considered rough around the edges, maybe the trend in modern day football, in particular in the NFL, is that these guys do work out, and the game is trending towards them. So in that regard, will Anthony Richardson complete himself in this Rubik's Cube analogy? Well, if he does, he becomes the best player on the field. That's incredibly enticing for an NFL franchise. Now, not every franchise is going to have the tools to complete him. Not every franchise is going to have the patience to complete him.

And so all of that has to be taken under consideration when you're looking at Anthony Richardson. Having said that, you look at what he was able to do. 4-4-3 in the 40. He set combine records for quarterbacks and broad jump and vert. He now has the second best odds to go number one in the draft, which you can't do that based on the combine. It just doesn't show you anything. Like, was it beautiful the way that he threw the football?

Yeah. Yeah, it was. It was impressive. There are not many guys on the planet that can throw the ball the way he does. But now all of a sudden he's got the second best odds to go number one. Bryce Young at what, minus 167, Anthony Richardson plus 350. C.J. Stroud now falls below Richardson at plus 400. Traits-wise, you know, that's fine. That's fine.

And if the right organization gets him and can unlock him, he's got better upside than any of these players, even Bryce Young, who's up there in that lead category. But should he be getting that love based on his vert and broad jump? No. The next time that we see a quarterback have to, you know, flat foot jump over the offensive line, then I'm like, hey, you know what? I got a guy that's perfect for that. And his name's Anthony Richardson.

But we don't do that. The next time that he's got to go up for a 50-50 ball down the field, and display his vertical jump will be the first. So those things don't necessarily translate. What translates? The explosiveness that you already saw on the film. So what did we actually learn about Anthony Richardson? Nothing.

Because we weren't in the interviews. We weren't in and don't have access to the medical information. That's what was learned about Anthony Richardson. for those organizations vetting these quarterbacks, doing their due diligence on these quarterbacks, they will learn what is his acumen on the whiteboard? When he talks through football schematically, you know, how does he operate? Take us through your offense. What were you in charge of?

What were you not in charge of as far as protections and so on and so forth? That's what's learned. Did I learn anything watching him vertical jump? No, it just looked cool. It was entertaining. And so if that's what the combine is going to be, great. But the combine really is kind of a lot of, yeah, I know. Yeah, I know.

It's just confirmation of what we already see on film. And for Richardson, I think that that was the same thing. I'm interested to see and talk with some of the GMs and the scouts around the league, and I'll do that in subsequent weeks about what it was like in the interview process and how did it go? Because this kid's physical traits are off the charts. And what they need to learn, what they need to do their due diligence on is, one, how many turns of the cube is he away from being complete? And can that organization complete those turns? Because if they can, like I said, Richardson could be the best player on the field regardless

of who he's playing. So that's some more Richardson thoughts in terms of the combine. Then you get to kind of the other two quarterbacks. And I'll start with Bryce Young because I want to get to a couple of Ohio State players later, Stroud and then Jackson Smith and Jigpa. So, Bryce Young, everyone's like, man, he's small. Yeah, I know. Again, what is the combine about? Yeah, I know. I know Bryce Young is small. I stood next to him. Like, turn on the film. Watch him play. You understand he's small. Does like a quarter of an inch here and there matter to me? Does three or four pounds any direction matter to me? No. Turn on the film.

Turn on the film. What do you see when you turn on the film? A guy that is 100% in charge. He's in total control of what's going on on the field at all times. This is why he is right now considered the best quarterback of the group and odds-on-favorit to be the number one pick. It's because the guy understands how to operate a system, how to control that system, manipulate that system, then control and manipulate the defensive structure. You can see that manifest itself, excuse me, manifest itself on the film.

And it's beautiful to watch. This guy is so intelligent, so intelligent, hyper-accurate, very athletic in the pocket. He manipulates the pocket as well as anybody I've seen in particular for his size. He's also got a quick release that he doesn't actually have to be fully set to unleash. This is one of the things that I've loved about watching him on film, preparing for that game like I did earlier in the year when they played Texas, is that this guy can just be moving chest to the line of scrimmage, and then all of a sudden, ball is out.

Normally, normally, when you watch quarterbacks play, and this is the way I was taught, and when you watch quarterbacks, even with great strong arms, what you'll see is at least a bit of a push the ball back. And what is the push the ball? When you push the ball back, that front shoulder gets to the throw spot. And then you've got torque. You've built up that torque.

And then you can release it. Now, guys can do that very quick. Guys can have very quick, short, compact releases, even with that little push. Bryce doesn't need to do that, which is remarkable for his size. He can just be chest fully exposed to the line of scrimmage. And then the ball is just like, and it's out and it's accurate and it's hyper accurate. He hit some windows, whether it was on red zone throws, in zone throws, that you're just

like, man, that's as good as it gets. That's as good as it gets. So I loved that. And preparing for that game earlier in the year, what I learned about Bryce is that his coaching staff, the Alabama coaching staff, they, well, how do I put this? Like Alabama's coaching staff, they will not blow smoke at you. They're very honest, as they should be. And they will tell you exactly what a player is strong at,

where he maybe where are some of the weaknesses. And when talking to Bill O'Brien, when talking to Nick Saban, they talked about his competitiveness, his leadership, and his acumen. This guy is so smart, so smart when I've been able to talk with him. He is, there's a bit of a savant nature to him in terms of the way he understands football, the way he sees the movement on the field. And I think that manifests in the way that he plays. So what did I really learn about Bryce Young?

Whoa, he's small. Yeah, I know. Turn on the tape. Watch the guy operate a system because playing the quarterback position is first and foremost about operating your system. You have to be a great operator before you can showcase all of these traits. See, so many times I think that fans and during this process, a lot of fans, what they start to fall in love with is traits because that's all we talk about, because that's all we see.

And it's very hard for a lay fan, right, or someone that doesn't have like schematic football acumen to sit there and watch a guy and be like, oh, I get it. like he's really operating the system. He's a great operator. That doesn't mean he's a system quarterback. It just means what he's given, he maximizes. See, there are guys with great traits that can never maximize the system that they're given. And those are the guys that generally fall short.

Bryce fully maximizes what he's given as a system. And by the way, he was given an offense that did not have anywhere close to the talent that they did the year previous. And he was still a remarkable player this. last year. They had a lot of wide receiver problems. He was under a lot of duress. I don't feel like they ran the ball as well as they should have at times, in particular early in the year, and he was still remarkable. When the game was on the line, he was still great. Think about what it took to beat Bryce Young in a year in which the offense wasn't that great. It took an unbelievable performance from Jalen Hyatt and those guys, Hendon Hooker in Tennessee to beat him. And by the way,

like a knuckle puck kick at Tennessee. Then they threw everything in the rest. And then LSU played the game of their life, a total, by the way, outlier game for LSU, and they still needed to go for two at the end. Like it took all of that to beat what I feel like wasn't of a great even Alabama team because of Bryce Young. He's a great operator. He maximizes what he's given and then some. And that's why he's got the best odds to be the first pick in the draft. Now let's move to C.J. Stroud.

So C.J. Stroud. everyone's like, hey, man, he was accurate. He threw it so well. It was very impressive. Yeah, I know. I know. Watch him play. Watch the tape.

You'll see a guy that's hyper-accurate with the football and doing a lot of the same things that I just discussed about Bryce Young. Now, rather than just give you a big evaluation, I would rather tell you what I know. Not that I don't know his evaluation, I do, but anyone can give you an evaluation. I did eight of his games. And so I know him and that coaching staff fairly well, okay? Fairly well, as well as any broadcaster out there. Let me start with this.

CJ is an incredibly humble guy. I was struck by his quiet demeanor the first time I ever met him. His background is interesting. Obviously, he comes from a house where he didn't have his dad growing up. And his mom did a wonderful job. The guy is respectful. He is certainly someone that understands the gravity of his position. And that's what I wanted to start with, because I've become very aware of the gravity of the starting quarterback role at Ohio State. I know that it's pressure-packed at other places around the country. I don't know if there is a more intense position singularly in college football than the Ohio State quarterback.

You name the program, and I don't think that they get the scrutiny that the Ohio State quarterback gets. That fan base is ruthless. and you know it, Buckeye fans, I know you, I see you, I'm around you all the time. I do all of the games, all the important Ohio State games, I do all the important Michigan games. The Ohio State fan base is really hard on their team. And therefore, if you're in the most prominent position, i.e. the head coach or the quarterback, I think it can be categorized fairly as one of, if not the most pressure, player positions in all of college football, and I thought he dealt with it very well.

Justin Fields leaves. He comes in, and I go into spring practice, and I see him in some of his first spring practices as the quote-unquote starter. And he wasn't throwing it that great. And Coach Day was just like, listen, he's got a lot to work on. He's got to develop. I come back for the next fall, and I'm seeing them early in that season. I get his first start against Minnesota. and in the first half of his first start on the road against Minnesota, he wasn't great. He overthrew some passes, and they came back out in the second half. And I thought they were just going to lean into,

we're better than Minnesota, let's run the ball, let's lean on our defense, which is playing really well, and we'll just go and get the win and get out of here. No, no, no. Ryan Day put the ball in C.J. Stroud's hands, and he answered the bell. That game, more than a lot of the other games, showed me a ton about this kid.

he has some serious guts because like I said, that is a pressure-packed position being the starting quarterback of the Buckeyes. Here he is with all the pressure in the world on him. It's his first start. He's on the road, blustery conditions, by the way, and did not play well in the first half. Minnesota's playing really well. They got a veteran quarterback. They got a veteran running back. And in the second half, man, it was the C.J. Stroud show and the Jackson Smith and Jigba show. and Ryan Day dialed it up for this kid and he was driving the ball down the field. And that showed me a lot, a lot of fortitude for C.J. Stroud. I've done eight of his games as the quarterback of the Buckeyes.

I would probably say I'm actually a bit of a downer. He probably doesn't want to see me because they're actually five and three in those games that I did. So I've done three of his losses. He only lost four games. The only other loss that he had was that great performance against Georgia in the playoff. I did the Oregon loss and both Michigan losses. So seeing this kid mature, I think I've got a unique perspective. The player he was early in a loss against Oregon was a very different player than he was late in his career.

And the guy that I saw play against Georgia with a real warrior's mentality was a guy that really matured from the first time that I saw him to the last time that I saw him. And again, dealing with overwhelming negativity and pressure from that Buckeye fan base, because of those losses to Michigan, and he still showed up and played the way that he did against a Georgia team that was better than Michigan. Good on him. I have a lot of respect for C.J. Stroud, a lot of restrict. He's also topped by Ryan Day, and I think that that makes a lot of sense to GMs and decision makers within the NFL circles. Okay. Now, a guy that didn't play really for the Buckeyes, what was it, like 60 snaps maybe? I believe that Jackson Smith and Jigba played 60, 62 snaps this season.

He's going to be an interesting evaluation. He's going to be an interesting topic as we move through the draft period. So he shows up at the combine, and it's like, well, is, you know, not going to run, but he did some of the quickness drill. So the three cone drill, 20-yard shuttle. Oh, look at that, top time in the group. Yeah, I know. Because that's what the film shows.

he is a tremendous slot receiver. Best slot receiver I've seen in college football in a long time. Long time. In fact, I don't know if I've seen a better one. I would have to think really long and hard about that. This guy was dynamic. He was a weapon, and he was totally indefensible in the middle of the field. So he sets the mark for the wide receiver.

and the three-cone drill and the 20-yard shuttle after only playing these 60 snaps. And it's like, okay, excuse me, the hamstrings healthy. And there's some talk. I know Chris Carter's out there like, hey, he's going to run faster in the pro day than people think. Okay, maybe. Guess what? I don't really care because I know what he is. He's an unbelievable slot receiver.

Now, what does that mean? It probably means that he's not going to be a great number one receiver or a prospect that could be your number one. option as a wide receiver. That's not his skill set. But we're in the era where slot receivers can dominate the league. Look at what Cooper Cup did a couple of years ago. Look at what Amandola was able to do for years and Wes Welker was able to do and Julian Ellumann was able to do. Granted, you know, all of those guys for, you know, Tom Brady and Peyton Manning in West Welker's case. but man, like, slot receivers can get it done. You look through the league and this is the guy that I think could be the best slot receiver

in the league at some point in the next few years. Now, does that mean he's the number one wide receiver for team? I'm not sure. Or the best wide receiver in the NFL? I'm not sure. But he has the traits to absolutely produce. This guy caught 95 pass. for over 1,600 yards last year, went off in the Rose Bowl, 15 catches, 346 yards,

three touchdowns. He is, he's an excellent player. And I want to take you back to that year because his two teammates were Chris Olavé and Garrett Wilson. And those two guys, as all of you know, went to the NFL last year and just played great. Played great. They were two of the best young players in the entire league. When you go back one season and they're all on the same team together, when I would talk to defensive coordinators and I would get ready for those games, the guy they always started with was Jackson Smith and Jigpa. He was not only the key to that offense, but really the best player on that offense. And I think those other guys even knew it. I remember watching interviews talking with these guys.

And I would always say like, all right, you know, like who's the guy? And they would all kind of admit it. They'd be like, you know, Jackson, Jackson's really the guy. He's so smooth. He's got a unique ability to understand the schematics of the middle of the field, which can be hard because they can move and change based on whatever happens post-snap and the rotation of the defense. And he understands how to get open.

And like I said, firmly believe that this guy can be the best slot receiver in the National Football League in the next few years. Whatever that means for his production, I'm not sure. And I will tell you, like, he threw out this comment during the combine and it got everybody, you know, all been out of shape. He's like, yeah, you know, if I play last year, we probably won the national championship. I don't quite see what was wrong with that. did you watch the Georgia game? Because I watched the Georgia game.

Again, all other things being equal, all other things being equal, fine, like, lose to Michigan, still get in. All other things being equal, if Jackson Smith and Jigba is on the field, do they beat Georgia? The answer is yes. And that's not controversial. That's not a what if. anything. I'm not taking anything away from Georgia. Georgia's the best team in college football. Listen to me, SEC fans and Georgia fans. Georgia's the best team in college football. Okay? They are the standard in the sport. It's not Alabama right now. It's Georgia. Kirby is

the standard in the sport. Georgia, the standard in the sport. Having said that, even you'll admit, watching that game, they might not even win if Marvin Harrison stays in. the game, much less Jackson Smith and Jigba, who would have been better than everybody on the field. You know, like, that's what the film suggests. Now, all things being equal, obviously, there's things that could have gone George's way from a health perspective. And I'm not sitting here saying like, Ohio State should have won the national championship. That's not what I'm saying.

I'm evaluating what Jackson Smith and Jigba said. If he's on the field, do they win the national championship? Probably. Probably. Because that's how good he is. That's how good he is. Okay, last one that I want to talk about is Bijon Robinson because I did have a chance to evaluate and get around Bijan during his career, Texas a few times. And one thing that I would just remind everybody about Bejan Robinson is that he's not just the best running back in this draft, but he was also the best running back in the country.

And he did so behind an offensive line that was an absolute work in progress. Absolute work in progress. They were starting a couple of freshmen this last year. You see, when Sark got the job, you know, they were decimated on offensive line. They were not great at the line of scrimmage, not even close, not even average. They were a below average Big 12 offensive line. And Bejohn had to run behind that and produced behind that. When you watch him play, when you watch him and his explosiveness in the cutback, his vision,

his ability to gain yardage, it's pretty remarkable. Were there games that it didn't happen? Yeah, there were games that it didn't happen. Like TCU, shut them down. That defense did a heck of a job against Bejohn Robinson. Is that entirely his fault? Absolutely not. Because the offensive line was a thorough work in progress his entire career.

They're going to have a much better offensive line this next season, and then the season after that. And he will have, when you look back through the history of Texas football, you're going to say like, hey, Bijon was probably one of the best running backs that we ever had. One of, right? not the, but one of the best running backs we ever had. He's in the class of the guys that won Heisman trophies. He's in that Ricky Williams class of players.

There's not a doubt in my mind. And he played behind the worst offensive line of all of them. Okay. So that has to be taken under consideration. If you're going to take under consideration, Willevis' supporting cast, or when Josh Allen was coming out of Wyoming, then you have to do the same thing for Bejohn,

Robinson. So Bejohn Robinson, you know, where would I draft him? Somewhere in the middle of the first round. He's that good. He's a great kid. He's a hard worker. I thoroughly enjoyed every conversation I got to have with Bejan Robinson and somebody's going to become a better franchise when they draft Mr. Bejohn Robinson. Okay, that's going to do it for me this week and a little combine checkup. Chasing down some solid interviews over the next couple of weeks. Stay tuned for that. I will hit you up on social media when and if I get these things actually booked and solidified. But looking at some interviews here in the next couple of weeks. Very much appreciate your support on the show.

Remember, go follow us on social media at Joel Clat Show. You can subscribe to the Joel Clat Show. Please rate, review us, and make sure you subscribe so you know that we when to download new episodes. Thank you for listening today, and we will be back next week with a brand new Joel Clat Show. Thank you.