The Joel Klatt Show: A College Football Podcast - Dan Lanning on preparing Oregon for Big Ten & learning from Nick Saban | Big Noon Conversations

Episode Date: July 29, 2024

FOX Sports lead college football analyst Joel Klatt sits down with Oregon Head Coach Dan Lanning to discuss the Ducks move from the Pac-12 to the Big Ten this season. Lanning explains how the team's preparation may be different with playing new opponents. Lanning also shares what he learned from Nick Saban while on his staff and reveals he received his "doctorate of football" at Alabama. Lanning and Klatt discuss the CFB calendar and the difficulties coaches face in constructing a roster. Despite the challenges and many changes happening in college football, Klatt and Lanning agree that the quality of the sport is as good as its ever been. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

For me, I always tell everybody when I went to Alabama, that's when I got my doctorate in football. Coming in, I thought I knew a lot, and I realized how much I didn't know. Learning from Nick every single day was great for me. Most influential people in the sport talking about the sport globally. This time on Big Noon Conversations, I talked with Dan Lanning, head coach of the Oregon Ducks. Dan Lannning, head coach of the Oregon Ducks. Thanks for joining me, man. Yeah, thanks for having me.

I appreciate this. All right, this is the way we've started. it out with everybody. So I imagine this answer could be better. What is the best part about being the head coach for the Oregon Ducks? Well, for me, it hasn't changed. You know, football is football, but my favorite part is, you know, being in the middle of a fight with our guys, you know, out there on the grass. I'm the weird guy that enjoys practice, enjoys development, like seeing these guys in the meeting room grow. So for me, it's being around our players. You know, that part, the love for football, that part hasn't changed. I've got to imagine.

that if you go back to the end of the year, you're a guy that coached with Nick Sabin, you know, you're from that tree in a large sense. When you saw the news that he was stepping away and retiring, what did you think? Well, one, that the goat just retired, right? The best ever do it, you know, and the level of consistency, the way he operated day and day out,

I can't say I wasn't surprised to see him step away, just because of what the game's become and what he did for so long. But yeah, grateful that I got to, you know, learn from him for a little bit. What was that like, you know, as a young guy, you're trying to learn how to be a coach. And I'm sure even when you were there, you realize, like, this is the best that's ever done. And I've said that, too. Yeah. I think Nick's the greatest college football coach that we've ever seen.

Yeah, I don't think there's any question. For me, you know, at the time, I was a full-time coach at Sam Houston State. And it was a step backwards financially. But for me, I always tell everybody when I went to Alabama, that's when I got my dad. doctorate in football. I felt like that was a place where coming in I thought I knew a lot and I realized how much I didn't know whether it's running an organization schematically. The work ethic required, you know, it was a great step for me in my career to see be around some phenomenal coaches on that staff. You had Kirby Smart, Mario Cristobal, Mel Tucker, Billy Napier, Lane Kiffin,

you know, all those guys obviously went on to be head coaches and then learning from Nick every single day was great for me. Is there one trait of his that you either learned the most from or you respected the most? Just his consistency. You know, I always said, you know, when I left there, the sun's going to come up tomorrow at whatever time in Tuscaloosa, Alabama, and at 725, Nick Saban's going to be walking into that office. There's going to be a staff meeting at 730. You know, he already had his oatmeal cream pie and he's going to have a salad. Like just every single day, the consistency that he operated with and what it took. to be excellent was very impressive.

Are there things that you have recognized now that you do that incorporate some of that consistency? Oh, certainly. You know, just the model of, you know, what it looks like for me, I think the schedule, the way that he was able to map out the day, what was important, what wasn't important, his ability to go back and assess anything that we did and then quality control that, you know, how can we make this better next time? And that's where I think you consistently saw the improvement.

You know, the other thing that really stuck out to me about Coach Sabin and even coach smart is their ability to learn from anyone. You know, if somebody had something that can make their program or organization better, they wanted to know it. They wanted to, you know, it didn't mean they'd always incorporate it, but they wanted to know what, you know, what that involved. So, and, you know, you and I texted about this, about that time, because I said and others were saying, well, they're going to come after Dan Lannning.

And rightly so, like, you're a heck of a football coach. And I've said many times if I had to be. buy stock and one coach in America, you would be that stock. So I knew they would come after you. I'm sure that they called you. And yet, even through our text messages, and I could sense that, like, maybe that's not going to happen. I legitimately thought it was going to until we started to communicate. And I think that the question I have is why. Why didn't that interest you? Well, I think it's more about what exists here. And for me, this is the first time in my career.

I feel like I'm somewhere where I could be for a really, really long time for my family. And that's probably number one, right? I think I told you before, you know, my kids have lived in eight states. I also can never take for granted that Oregon took a chance on me. And that means a lot to me. And there's things that I want to accomplish here that I haven't accomplished yet, that I feel indebted to this program and the people that, you know, support this program that I want to be able to get done and create here.

So I never like leaving a place where I feel like that. there's more left on the table and there's a lot left on the table here at Oregon. And we've also chatted about there's, there is a finite number of places that I think that it's, it's realistic to win a national championship. And people don't love that that's a truth in college football, but it is a truth, right? And I think that to some degree it exists even in the National Football League. If you ask guys in the National Football League every single year, How many organizations can win the Super Bowl? They would be like maybe nine, maybe eight or nine,

just based on where the rosters are at, the level of commitment from the organization. The same can be true in college football, and I think is true. I would argue this is one of those spots, and I think your level of commitment, in particular to this offense, suggests that you believe that this is one of those spots as well.

Yeah, and it's not one of those spots because of me. I mean, there's so many people that have put so much into this place, you know, whether it's our administration, whether it's the student athletes that believe in this place, our fans, they've created an experience here at Oregon that's really unique. And I'm lucky that I get to be a part of that.

I get to kind of help keep the train on the tracks. You know, to accomplish a championship, it's so hard. It takes a lot of things working the right way. But it also takes a level of skill. It takes talent. It takes a team. And I think all those things can exist here.

Is there anything that's difficult? There's difficult. these everywhere. So I want to preface that by saying, yeah, everywhere has every place has something that makes it you know, difficult to win. Yeah. Is there those things here? Well, every place like you said has

limitations. I think one of the harder things here in the Pacific Northwest is I can't go out and throw a football and hit players that can play for us. So we have to have players that are courageous and brave. You know, there's some guys that will win from the Pacific Northwest in the state that can contribute but we can't make an entire team from here. So we have to go, you know, find the guys that are willing to get uncomfortable

and maybe step away from their home to come here and be excellent and be great. But that's also part of what makes this place great. When you walk into the locker room, it's a melting pot of people, right? You'll have guys from the islands all the way to Miami to the DMV, you know, all across the United States that make this, you know, a really special place. I'm interested, too, in this idea, if you will,

that once you're in the locker room, once you're a player here, you realize that, like, everybody else has committed. to that same level. Like you said, like we all want to be here. Is that something that you sense as well? Yeah, I think people come here to sign up for something that's different. They want to sign up for hard. They want to experience something that isn't easily attainable.

And I think that's always one of the hardest things for a student athlete. When they come in, every one of these guys was the best player for their high school team. Every one of these guys was the best player where they're from. And you come here and you have a lot of the best players. And now competition ensues. But within that competition, still having the connection. the family piece that we're able to create here that I think makes it really special. And you guys have recruited incredibly well, in particular from the high school ranks.

I remember preparing for, so I did the Utah game, as you remember last year, and I remember preparing for the game. And I see a lot of great teams, you know, obviously. And I'm looking at your too deep, and I'm just like, man, like the too deep, you were littered with highly recruited at every position. in the two deep, young players. And I thought to myself, even back then, you know, before Bo went to the NFL and I'm like, Oregon's going to be really good in the next couple of years, next year, not only last year,

but in the years to come. So you've done that from a recruiting piece, but then you've also done a great job in the portal. Can you take me into like, what's the secret in being great at both? Because I don't think a lot of teams or organizations are. Well, there's a lot of pieces to it. I think I'll start with, you know, if you look at any championship team over time, the one commonality is these teams have talent. You know, whether it's Michigan last year or it's John Wooden's teams at UCLA,

like every team that wins championships is going to have talent. And so you have to have great talent to create, you know, a winning organization. And for us, we realize quickly that we can do that with developing great high school players, but you can also add to that competition, you know, that consistency throughout your roster with the portal. So it's somewhere we want to be good. But I think it starts with retaining your best players, right? Making sure the best players are still on your team the next season. We've done a really good job of that.

We haven't lost. We've been fortunate enough to keep, you know, guys that have started for us, made impacts for us. They've stayed here, right? And then we've added to that with developing the guys that are on our current roster and bringing in guys that want to compete to take this thing in the next level. How important is the support that you get here from an NIL perspective in particular in order to do what you just said, which is retain your best players? I think that's what kills rosters faster than anything.

Right. Is when their best players decide to walk out the door, it's like, you can't replace those guys. Right. You know, when you have not just talented players, but like starters and leaders on your team walk out the door, I always think to myself like they're going to be hurting. Yeah, I think it's two things. One, you've got to have players that want to be here, right? So you have to create an environment that they enjoy being a part of. And then two, you have to make sure that they're taking care of and they're able to create opportunities for themselves.

And when I think about why I came to Oregon in the first place, you know, this place has always been on the cutting edge, innovative, never felt like they were operating from behind. They've made a decision to be ahead of the curve. So when that became part of the landscape of college football, I feel like they made the decision, okay, let's figure out how we can do this better than anybody else. And you have to right now to compete at this level.

So you're a guy that I feel like has adapted. And maybe some would argue it's your age, right? You're not an old guy in this business. I'm aging quick. Yeah, I'm sure you're aging quick, but you've only been a head coach for two years, right? And so maybe you're in the perfect spot, like Gladwellian, right, the right place at the right time in order to take advantage of these things that have morphed and shifted in college football. And yet I sense it when I talk with people throughout the industry.

People are either fighting it or they're embracing it. You seem to have embraced what college football is currently and what it could be in the next couple of years because I think we both think it's going to change. Yeah. How important do you think that is in your position? You know, somebody asked me that the other day, like, what's the most important trait for a head coach? And I think right now in today's landscape, it's that it's the ability to adapt. And I think that's changed over time. You know, consistency might have been that approach, you know, 10 years ago or that word, 10 years ago were relentless. And those things still matter.

But you have to be able to adapt with the times and adjust. So I think it's really important, especially here and especially in the landscape that exists right now in college ball. Can you give me an example of how recruiting, is changed now than it was even four years ago. Yeah, one of the hardest things probably to manage right now within your roster is understanding what your roster is going to look like the next season. And especially with as long as the college football season might go,

you may be playing a bowl game, but you're already signing players for the next season. You're trying to, you know, the declaration date for the NFL, you might not know until after the semester's already hit, you know, who's actually going to be on your roster the next season. So trying to figure out exactly what pieces you have to, replace, how can you make your roster better? I think a lot of that's changed over time. Because now you see players that would have been drafted that maybe decide to come back for

another season because now they have the ability to take care of themselves in college football. Obviously, the portal is a big piece of that and how much that's changed. I think the distribution of talent in college football is shifted and it kind of exists in all the corners of the U.S. right now. All teams can go get great talent if they have the ability to pursue it. conversation that we've had, you know, off camera has been and revolved around the calendar and how difficult the calendar is from a coaching perspective. Now, I think when fans hear coaches talk about their hardships, they roll their eyes. I honestly think that.

Because they'll say it to me, like, well, these guys get paid a lot of money and so on. And listen, that's true. You guys make a great living. having said that, you're trying to accomplish something and the calendar and the structure of the sport is directly opposed to that goal. How would you fix the calendar? Well, it's hard.

I think that every time you make a change, you don't realize what are they going to be the unintended consequences that come with change. And I think there's been a lot of that in the last few years of college football. But right now, just a small example, what we just talked about, You know, you're going to be playing your national championship game next year, January 20th.

The semester has already started for the next semester. You've tried to sign high school players. You really don't know where your team's going to be at until after that game's completed. Right. So teams that will be competing in the college football playoff are in the middle of competing for the most important game, you know, of the year. But at the same time, trying to build the roster for the next season and what's, you know, what's ahead. And it's hard to maintain the focus that exists there. Player retention, the portal will be open before that even happens.

So there might be players that are on your current. roster that are looking for a home somewhere else. You know, and it's, you know, the bowl game sequence and where that falls in relation to when your season ends and how you have to build the team for the next season is really difficult. January 15th, players have to declare for the NFL. Yeah, and I think that's something that I... January 20th, we play the national championship game.

That's right. This is wild. Yeah. Like, what are we doing? I think that's something. I'm hoping that, you know, the NFL recognizes that as well, that that'll be something that can change. in college football? Because obviously that doesn't make sense that you're still currently potentially

playing your season, but your players are trying to make the decision if they want to come back for another season or declare for the NFL. It's obviously something that doesn't fit within the model. And that's just a piece, too, because what you were alluding to, I always just bring up, you know, people hear that description and they're like, oh, yeah, that sounds difficult. And then I just bring up a different sport to them. And I'm like, okay, now imagine that in the NFL playoffs, free agency opened up. And all the sudden, you know, you're the Minnesota Vikings and Kirk Cousins is all a sudden a free agent.

And he's just like, hey, I'm a free agent. In the middle of the playoffs. Everyone would be losing their minds and they'd be like, well, this has to be fixed immediately. And yet that's exactly what we do in college football. And then we do it in the spring right after springball, too. And we do it again. We do it twice.

Yeah. I'm going to throw out an idea and I want you to just react to it. Okay. Why don't we, like every other sport, on the planet, finish our season before we start building our roster for the next season. So I've said this countless times on this show. Why don't we just end the season by January 1st? Own January 1st, like college football has always owned January 1st, crown our champion,

open the transfer portal, sign high school students like we used to in February. And then the calendar all of a sudden works. And everyone would know what's going on. Everyone would be making informed decisions and coaches could actually build a roster. It sounds like it makes too much sense, right? It'd be like almost every other sport, right? Like the events, right, masters, the Triple Crown, all those things exist. Right now, it's kind of fluid in college football.

Like, we play our championship game on a Monday. Yeah. It doesn't align with calendars, especially when you're talking about the breaks of teams. Some teams start their school year in January earlier in the month, some starting later. Yeah, but I think it'd be great if we could wrap the season up before, you know, the next season begins when it comes to, you know, player acquisition. Now, and this is the next part of this conversation, coach, is it's easy to talk about the things that need fixing in college football. Because there are plenty.

There are plenty. What doesn't get enough conversation, though, is how good the sport is right now. And how amazing it can be even moving forward. I've said this, and people will grumble at me in there. They say, you're crazy. It's not the golden age of college football. I think college football is as good as it's ever been. Yeah, I agree. The sports is fun to watch as it's ever been to watch. You know, you've seen a lot of different teams in position to compete at the end of the season now where there wasn't that same consistency before. But I think that's made it. The sports is in good as shape as ever, but certainly there's some pieces that people don't like about it. And that's probably tainting their view of how great, you know, the game really is right now.

when you see in the last two years, TCU play for a national championship against your old squad in Georgia. Washington play for a national championship, a team that you guys went toe to toe with last year twice. And Michigan win the national championship. So three of the last four are not Clemson and Alabama. And these teams that we would just ride in with Penn, you know, six years ago, it's like we knew Alabama was going to play Clemson. We knew Georgia was going to play Alabama. Now it's different. No one saw Washington coming.

No one saw TCU coming. As a head coach, do you find that more motivating? And do you feel like your players are more motivated now than ever? I don't know that the motivations ever changed for us. Just because you're always hungry to play in those games. That being said, the reality of it is probably a lot higher than it used to be. There's a real reality that any team can go competitive. compete to, you know, to go play for one. Yeah. What are the things that you feel like make you,

this team, able to go do that next year? Well, I do think we have a talented team, but I know the talent doesn't win on its own. It can't stand alone. In fact, you'll look, there's been some studies done, whether it's MLS soccer teams or NBA teams. The team with the most talent isn't the team that always goes and wins those games, right? It's the team that, you know, plays well as a team. You know, I think that there's a stat in basketball that they used to or really started using more recently that, like a player on the floor, it's not just about his stats. It's how well the team plays around him when he's on the floor, like what's his plus minus? And I think that exists in football, especially when you're talking about 11 guys on the field at the time and, you know, different sides of the ball and special teams play. So that's one of the greatest things about college football is it takes everyone working in unison and together.

And I think we have a connected team. I think we have a talented team. But the calendar and the speed of that is a lot faster now in college football because you're talking about a lot of new players every season, you know, on a team. And yet the importance of it, I think, is ratcheted up. Because teams are going to be more disconnected than ever because of all of this movement, I think the teams that do find that connective tissue can play as a unit are going to have even more success. I would argue that was the case with Michigan last year. For sure. You know, they were, I've been around a lot of. of teams. They were as unique a group

as I've seen in a long time. And that connective tissue, you could see it play out, whether it was against Alabama in the Rose Bowl or against Washington in the national championship game. If you can get it, you're going to win a lot of games.

And this group is going to have a new leader at quarterback and you're going to have to replace some, you know, Powers Jackson in the middle, like some alphas and talented players, who are some of the players that you feel like

can step into those roles and be the leader that forms that connective tissue? Well, it's always hard on the front of the season to predict that because every year somebody's going to reveal themselves that you didn't know about, right? But I do think we have some leadership returning, you know, guys with experience that are returning

that are really talented. I think some guys that can really step up. You know, on defense, Jeff Bossa has been a leader for us. And I think this could be a great year for you know for jeff i think you know winning games on the front on the offensive and defense the line is really big and there's there's you know both of our tackles are guys that have great experience johnny cornelius josh connerly um and then you flip over the other side of the ball you know jordan birch some of our additions on the inside and then our young

edges that kind of played for us last year um you know tatem to iote mattoeo uh you know these guys uh blake purchase are all guys that contributed at a young age so all those pieces have to really come together but you know the thing that excites me is i don't think you look at our team right now and say, okay, where's the weak spot? And I don't know that I see that yet. Now, at some point, we'll probably figure out what our strengths and weaknesses are as the season plays through. But there's not a spot where you're like, okay, that's going to really hurt the ducks next year. Yeah. Two years in, some self-reflection, what do you feel like you've learned the most as a head coach? It's probably the thing that I've caught me off guard when I first took

the job, and that's that your time's not really your time anymore. Some of the things you fell in love with getting to do, you know, as a position coach or as a coordinator, you have to step back from and having that big lens view of it's really important that I spend time on the offensive side of the ball. It's really important that I, you know, move around position rooms, which I really enjoy that aspect, but it removes you a little bit, you know, from what you love as a play caller or, you know, as a guy that's going in and doing all the schematic pieces, for you to be really truly connected as a head coach, which I think is really important in today's day and age, you have to remove yourself from some other pieces.

Is there anything specifically that you have either tried to work on or that you have learned that you have tried to change? Every day. There's a million things that I'm working on. You know, I think being a great communicator is really important. You have an expectation for how you want things done in the organization. But if you don't do a great job of communicating that, don't be disappointed when the results don't look the way you want, right? So learning how to be a great communicator, the rules continue to change in college football with timing, right? this year we'll have new two-minute rules. That's going to be different.

I think that if you look across college football, you'll see a lot of people making mistakes there at the end of the game that may or may not be recognized in the moment. But that's going to be different. That's going to change the game. So how we handle game-time management decisions, I think those will be big things for us stepping forward into this next year of college ball.

Do you like the two-minute warning? I would love if our rules reflected directly to the NFL rules, right? Just across the board. Yeah, timing-wise. I think it makes a lot of sense. It's the game that we're preparing, you know, college players to go play after college ball. I think, you know, right now the clock will stop after a first down and then run on the ready for play. I think with the amount of offensive coaches that there are in college football,

I don't see that rule going anywhere because offensive coaches love the fact that the clock stops after first down, you know, because now it's like an extra time out almost if you're able to run up or hurry up offense. But the more we continue to transition our game to the same rules as the NFL, I think it would create some continuity. So don't even get you started on the lineman downfield, illegal downfield. It's something we've learned to deal with in the game, right? As long as it's called consistently, I think that's the one thing you'll see is you move conference to conference. Some things are called certain ways in some conferences that aren't called in the other.

So the more we can be uniform in the way we call, you know, call a game, you know, from an officiating standpoint, I think the better the game gets. I mean, we should have a national body of officiating. Yeah. Number one, like why are conferences responsible for their, anyways, listen, as I say on the show all the time, I digress. get back to the point. You brought up conferences, your movement conferences, huge shift in college football this year. This is as big of a shift as we've seen, not only with a 12-team playoff, but then just the gigantic movement that we're going to see with major brands, Oklahoma and Texas to the SEC, USC, UCLA, Washington, and Oregon into the Big Ten. Have you done anything different

to prepare for now a Big Ten regular season than you did in the Pack? 12? No, I think winning football is winning football in terms of preparation and what you have to do to be successful. I think the biggest thing is getting familiar with the teams in the conference, right? You're going to spend more time studying the opponents that you're going to be playing that you haven't played in the past. So that's the piece that's probably different for us. I don't think that changes the approach to what's going to be successful in college football. You know, I think the toughest team is going to win. I think the team that can make sure they're not being themselves is going to be successful on game day. So all the formula for winning football

still exist. But what you have to get familiar with quick is who are the people you're going to be playing and what are the tendencies that those teams have? How do they play to win? What does that look like for you and your team? I don't know how deep of a dive you've done yet, but what are some of the differences that you see in the league that you just came from and what you're going to see next year?

And in particular, the quarterbacks you saw last year. I mean, last year in the Pac-12, the quarterbacks were insane. That was as good of a quarterback conference as, we're going to see in a long time, actually, in a singular year. What do you think the biggest differences are going to be? I think there's pieces of flavor that are really similar. And I think you just said it. The PAC 12 was as good as any conference last year in college football in a lot of ways.

And you saw one of the best seasons. But we had some teams that played a physical brand of football in Utah and Oregon State that lined up in some unique personnel groups, but certainly Michigan's different with the brand of football they play. I think the weather's going to come into play a little bit more with some of the places that we'll travel in the times a year that we're traveling there. So that'll be something that's different. But you don't necessarily control that, right?

So trying to find moments to go practice in those conditions, even when you don't need to or feel like you need to. You need to take advantage of a bad weather day to make sure you're going to practice in that because you might experience that in this conference. I'm interested here coaches react to the potential of playing 16 games in this lengthy season. And have you done anything different?

this offseason because this is, I think, yeah, champions have now gone 15 and 0 and played 15 games. And everyone has said like, well, it's just one or two more games. It's going to be a massive deal. What have you done differently in preparation? More than anything, just try to pick people's brains that have experienced it. So we visited with some NFL teams and kind of talk to them about how they set up their calendar and some of that's set up because of the rules in the NFL and, you know, player agreement. But, you know, that, for me, that's a big piece of it is, okay, a longer season, how has that play out?

I think the other thing that's distinctly different is the break after your season wraps up and when your next game might be. You know, there's a long break there. There shouldn't be, but there is. But there is. So, you know, that break there, you know, could change the way you operate a little bit too and how do you take advantage of that time. So I think that's a great example of the adaptation that coaches are going to have to go through of making sure their team's healthy at the end of the season. It's when you want to play your best ball. especially with the playoff now, it's not go out there and play one more game.

You might have to go out there and play three more and play really well. Yeah. Well, I certainly think that you guys will be there. I think this is as good a team as any in the country. You know, I've talked about Oregon and I've talked about Ohio State. I've talked about Georgia and Texas as kind of being the premium teams in the country. With that, you know, comes expectations. do you feel that at all?

And is it different than the previous two years? I think you'd be lying if you said you didn't feel the expectations. But I think, you know, you hope that you create expectations with the way that, you know, you're building the team. It's a privilege. It truly is. You know, Kirby used to say pressure is a privilege. And I think there's a lot of truth to that. But, again, you have to go out there and perform.

And the outside noise doesn't dictate the results on the field. That's where the work takes place, right? So, you know, again, I feel great about the team that we have, but you still have to go out there and execute and perform at a really high level. If there was one message that you would want to communicate to the fan of college football about not only, you know, Oregon and this program, but where you think the sport is at, you know, we've talked a lot about just this idea that the sports in a great spot. What would that message be? Well, just that. It's a great time to be a college football fan. I think we are all excited about what the future holds. And whether it's the new EA sports game going out where people can be playing this in the middle of the summer, you know, I know every one of us looks for that moment of when does football start.

And that's an exciting moment, you know, for all of us in our lives, is when our game's going to start being played? And you get a little bit of that in the spring now with the UFL and some of the things that exist. but college football is one of those things that still hold true that, you know, people set their clocks knowing when's the next game in a kickoff. And, you know, with Oregon, you know, one thing that makes this play so special is our fan base. And seeing the excitement that exists right now for our fans this season that's coming up, you know, I'm really excited to get out there and perform for them. Nice. Coach, I appreciate your time, man. Yeah, absolutely.

Thank you, Joel. Thanks for having us up. Yeah, thanks for coming. You got it.