The Joel Klatt Show: A College Football Podcast - Will College Coaches keep jumping to the NFL? What NIL really means and more mailbag questions

Episode Date: February 5, 2024

In this mailbag episode, FOX Sports’ lead college football analyst Joel Klatt dives into all sorts of listener-submitted questions including whether the sport is in real danger of losing its best coaches to the NFL due to the challenges within the collegiate game. He discusses Tennessee’s fight with the NCAA and breaks down what NIL payments really look like. Klatt then shifts away from the gridiron to answer the age-old question of “is it a good idea to bring up the idea of a prenup agreement to your fiancé?” He follows that up with his answer for which teams that were left out of the 4-team Playoff could have won the whole thing had there been more spots available. He then wraps up the episode with some advice for young college graduates out there on the job market for the first time. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

We are fully immersed right now, currently in pay-for-play and employee status, essentially. Fully immersed. That's what it is. It is pay-for-play. College football has never been better. Interest has never been higher. Believe that we are at the dawn of the golden age of college football. It was an epic day of college football. It was one of those days where you fall in love with the sport all over again. What's up, everybody? It is another episode here of the Joel Clat Show. I am Joel Clatt and I am so excited for this. We've got a mailbag episode for you here on a Monday.

And so we're going to dive right on. But first, remember to subscribe wherever you're listening to this show. Rate, review us. That always helps everything. Share it with a friend because this show is always better when you can chat about all of these topics with your friends about college football. If you're watching on YouTube, first of all, thank you. Jump in the comments below. I'm sometimes down there as well, commenting on some of your comments. So make sure to get down there and join the conversation. And also make sure to subscribe to the channel as well as we continue to grow here throughout the offseason. And social, we're there. Everywhere you want to be on social media, we're there. So follow us at Joel Clatt. You can follow me on Twitter or X, whatever you want to call it, at Joel Clatt. Here we go. We've got a mailbag episode, and I love mailbag episodes, because we get all sorts of questions and all

types of questions from you people, I'll say, you guys, women, men. I love reading all of these questions. The staff loves reading all of these questions. We get question about marriage, parenting, life, football, all of it. And I'm here for it. Trust me. It's hard to pick them. And so I'm sorry if we don't pick your question, but I think that we've got four to get into some really cool topics today during the course of the show. Let's dive right in, and we're going to start with Andrew. Andrew chimes in on a topic that a lot of people, you know, and it's really the only thing happening in college football.

So here we go. He chimes in. Hi, Joel, love the show. And your opening, you say that this is the dawn of the golden age of college football, and you frequently refer to the problems in the sport as, quote, champagne problems, in quote. I can't remember if I have heard you talk about this, but other big name commentators report that there are coaches out there who are ready to hang it up all because things are getting out of control.

And the chaos is among us. I added that part. If there are coaches out there paid as much as they may be who don't know if they can continue on with college football at this pace, how can these just be, quote, champagne problems? Looking forward to the next show. Andrew, that's an excellent email. There's no doubt. And let me start by saying, I believe that I am right, that this is the dawn of the golden age of college football.

And I also believe that there are massive problems that we need to get right and have to get right in order for that to happen. Okay. Notice how I never said that we are in the golden age of college football, because I do think that this is the done. This is the beginning. But there are things that we've got to correct in order to get there. And the evidence of that is what's going on currently here in the offseason between Tennessee and the NCAA. So let's dive into that. And I thought that talking about that specifically, this back and forth between the NCAA and Tennessee,

really encapsulates what we're talking about, Andrew, in terms of the sport overall. Because it's really about the chaotic nature and finding a way to form guardrails and structure in this chaotic. environment so that the sport can flourish and more so that the individuals, the human beings within the sport can flourish, whether they're coaches, administrators, or players themselves. Okay, so here we go. Let's jump into it. Tennessee and the NCAA. This is getting messy, by the way. I'm sure you've seen it out there. I'm not going to run down the details because you come to here for like the thoughts of it. Okay, so Tennessee is now in a lawsuit with the NCAA. We've seen Jeff Hathley, the head coach at Boston College, leave college football. He's now

the defensive coordinator for Green Bay. We've seen Nick Saban retire. And maybe he would have retired anyways, but there's no doubt that the chaos in college football, I think, sped things up for Nick Saban. We've seen Jim Harbaugh walk back to the NFL. We've seen guys like the coordinators at Michigan, both Mike McDonald wanted to get back to the NFL. Jesse Minner then wanted to get back to the NFL. By the way, congratulations to Mike McDonald on becoming the head coach of the Seattle Seahawks. Nick Holtz, a guy that's now a coordinator in the National Football League that has his roots more in college football. He was a teammate of mine at Colorado. Now he's going to be a coordinator in the league and he's the type of guy that I envision being a college football coach.

But he's in the NFL. Why? Because you can be a football coach in the NFL. So all of that is speaking to what Andrew was speaking of. And it stems from what's going on at the heart of this Tennessee NCAA issue, this lawsuit, this back and forth. Okay. Rather than banter on and on about the details. of all of those lawsuits. Let's just take a little bit of a 30,000 foot view here and look at this issue. First things first, we are in this moment because the NCAA failed. I think we all kind of understand that, but just so that you know, if you go back to 2014, 15, and 16, there were subcommittees that were basically charged with forming ideas that could be this the framework structures around name, image, and likeness.

Because at the time, the NCAA was going through all of these lawsuits, Obanon and lawsuit and so forth, and they knew that this was coming. So they're like, okay, maybe we can get ahead of this. Now, at the time, people within those groups, those working groups for the NCAA, and I had conversations. I had conversations with these people. I told them at the time that, listen, you can take three steps that you don't want to take right now

in 2017 and 18, or you're going to be forced via court rulings to take 10 steps that you're unprepared to take in 2020 or 2021. That's exactly what happened. So these working groups actually took frameworks and guidelines and proposals back to the NCAA in 2016, 17, and 18. And guess what the NCAA did with them? Nothing. They did nothing. Their failure to act at that moment is why we are at this moment, where there is chaos because they were forced to take 10, 11, 12 steps that everybody is unprepared to take. That's why there's no structure. That's why there's no guidelines. So the NCAA is at fault, ultimately, for the spot that we're in in college football. And I think all of us kind of understand that, right? They're the boogeyman. They're the one that

everyone can blame. And I do it on this show. And everyone does it. And they're an easy punching bag, right? They're a very easy punching back. It should be noted that there are still rules in place around boosters, inducements, and tampering. Okay, those rules go back decades and decades within the NCAA. Okay, so that's important because now you get to this moment where Tennessee and others are being investigated for violations in regards to and in relation to the NIL. and their NIL practices. Tennessee is, I think, rightly wondering why they're being singled out. And I think it's really important to state off the bat.

Both entities here are right. How can that be true? Well, let's lay it out here quickly. Tennessee is asking, why are we being singled out? Because they're not doing anything that everyone else isn't doing. Now, is that really an excuse? No, no, it's not. You can't just say, everybody's doing it.

Guess why? They'll say, get in the car, Frank, right? And no, KFC is not open, if you know what I'm talking about. So it's not an excuse. And yet, they're right. Because of the ambiguity and the lack of structure and guidelines surrounding NIL, they're trying to work in an environment where there is no structure. And yet the NCAA is trying to hang on these rules that were in.

in place before NIL surrounding boosters, inducements, and tampering. So it's a mess. Is the NCAA technically right? Yeah. Yeah, they're trying to hold on to some of these rules that predate NIL, and yet they allowed NIL to enter this chaotic period in which everybody is just Katie bar the door. So you've got to understand that the NCAA is correct, that there are rules. And yet, why are they singling out Tennessee?

Why are they singling out Florida State, Florida, for that matter? Because I can tell you, and I'll explain exactly what's going on and how, if they were actually enforcing rules surrounding tampering, inducements, and boosters, and the involvement in boosters within inducements and recruitment, every single program in the country would be investigated. And every single program in the country would be given. a notice of allegations. Let me just give you an analogy here. You're driving on the highway. Okay? You haven't seen a speed limit sign in miles. Guess what you're going to do? You're going to

drive the exact same speed or similar speed as everybody else around you. That's what you're going to do. That's what you're going to do. If you get pulled over, and you're the only one that gets pulled over, the first thing that you'll ask is like, what's the problem, officer? And if that officer says, well, you were speeding, you're going to be like, I'm sorry, what? Where?

And by how much? What's the speed limit? And he'll be like, oh, you know, it's 55. Where was it posted that it was 55? Oh, 13 miles back. And you're like, what? Why did you pull me over? And you would be rightly incensed about your bad luck that you're the only one pulled over on the side of the road,

while every other car is going 70 to 92 miles an hour. That's essentially what's going on. Okay, so all the cars that are going 70 miles an hour on the highway are complaining about the cars going 92 miles an hour on the highway. And they're like, man, those people are crazy. look at them breaking the law. Can you believe how brash they are with their boosters and their inducements and the tampering? I wish the NCAA would get them. They're going 92 miles an hour. Meanwhile, you're going 70 and it's a 55. And nobody knows it. That's what's going on right now. That's what's going on right now. So is Tennessee correct in being completely irate that they're the ones being investigated for whatever,

everyone else is doing? Yes. Why? Because in their minds, they feel like the NCAA pulled all the speed limit signs. You pulled all the speed limit signs. You didn't post it anywhere. We don't know what to do. And now you're pulling us over and you're trying to give us a ticket? Absolutely not. And so they're rightly fighting back. And yet the NCAA is sitting there and they're like, hold on. These rules have been in for a long time. 13 miles ago, there was a big old sign. So you see the problem here is that we're in this position because of a failure that happened in the past. And now the NCAA is trying to hang on to their power for whatever reason, obviously. You know, they feel like that's their only way to hang around.

And so they're going to try to go after and like, they're the ones that are going to clean up NIL. Well, news flash, that ain't happening. The NCAA is not going to be the ones to clean up NIL. They're not going to be the ones to clean up the transfer portal. They're not going to be the ones to clean up inducements and tampering. Why? Because they're the ones that put us in this position in the first place. Okay?

So I don't think programs and coaches and anybody within the sport is going to take them seriously. And the reaction of Tennessee to this notice of investigation from the NCAA is exactly what you're going to get from everybody around the country. So that's what we're going on. That's what's going on right now. And this is how it happens. Okay, so coaches are complaining about how this works. And yet, the coaches then participate in how it works. And this is where I get frustrated with coaches.

They'll explain these scenarios to me like, well, you know, we've got this kid and he was committed to us. And, you know, he asked us for, I'm going to throw out, I've had this conversation, but I'm going to change the details. You know, this kid, he asked us for 350 grand up front and within his NIL package. And he verbally committed, but now he's waffling on whether he's going to sign or not. And I'm like, whoa, wait. So you paid him the 300 or 350 grand up front. And yet there's no way that you could go back after that if he doesn't sign his letter of intent with you. And they're like, So we're just kind of sweating it. And then they're the same ones that are like, man, we got to do something about this.

I'm sorry, you're participating in it. Okay? Man, this kid, you know, we paid him the 300 grand, but that school wants to give him a Lambo and 500 grand. So now we got to come up with another 200 grand. I'm like, this is madness. So the thing that you hate, the thing that you despise, you're participating in which perpetuates it. Now, to some extent, I get it because how else do you acquire the talent necessary to win, which is the bottom line? So I understand why they're participating in it,

but they are participating in it and they're perpetuating it, which then, guess what? Nothing's going to change. So that's what's going on. That's what it looks like. Advancements. It's housing payments. It's jobs for relatives. It's cars. All of its inducements, which is technically, against the rules that were posted 13 miles ago. To continue the analogy. The current state, this, what I'm explaining, is totally unsustainable. It's totally unsustainable. And the reason is, is because we won't be honest with what it is.

We won't clearly define it. I think I am a big believer in that you've got to speak truth, right? You just have to. You've got to say what it is or else it's never going to be fixed. just isn't. I believe in that philosophy as a father. I believe in that philosophy as a husband. I believe in that philosophy as an analyst. I don't think I would serve you listening to this podcast, watching this podcast, if I was dancing around subjects. You get my unfiltered opinion. Why? That's the only way I know how to do business. And yet in college athletics, generally speaking,

and much more so in football, college football, we aren't truthful for what with what's going on. We are fully immersed right now, currently in pay for play and employee status, essentially. Fully immersed. That's what it is. It is pay for play. We are in the employment era. We are in the pay for play era. And yet, no one wants to touch those terms. Nobody. Nobody wants to touch those terms. You know, everyone's like, well, you know, I don't know if we can do the whole employee-employer relationship. But that's what it is. already. You gave the kid 300 grand in an advancement. You see the craziness, right? You see the craziness. And when you don't explain what it is, you get an imbalance in the relationship.

Because one entity can take advantage of the other entity or person in this relationship. Okay? And I know that's a grand analogy, right? That's a large analogy. But when you're not honest with what's going on and what the relationship actually is, when it's not defined properly and the ambiguity exists, then one can take advantage of the other. And this is where I found it so interesting to sit down with and talk with Nick Sabin last spring, almost a year ago, in Big Noon conversations. and I asked him specifically about this kind of topic and more specifically the player's role within it. His answer was phenomenal. Here it is.

If you were to start to address some of the issues in college football, where would you start? Well, I think you have to create a balance between how much do you take and how much do you give. Okay. You know, we're giving people, scholarships. We're creating name image and likeness opportunities. But what is their commitment? I mean, there's no place in the world where you don't have a contract. If you're going to receive

benefits, you have a contract and an obligation to do a certain job. So when you can opt out, transfer, do whatever you want, whenever you want, I'm not sure the balance is quite right. I know there's a lot of people out there that are much more qualified. than me that are trying to figure out how do we fix this. But I think we do need to create some balance. Because I think at the end of the day, when you create an atmosphere where somebody's tentatively committed to what they're trying to accomplish, you have to evaluate. Is that really a good thing? Sure. Because we all need to be totally committed to whatever, you know, our goals and aspirations are,

the sense of purpose that we have if we're going to have a chance to be successful. Well, that's exactly right. Well, that's exactly right. And now, we all know that he was speaking more about, like, the player side of that relationship. I was telling you, like, there's going to be one side that takes advantage of the other. Well, in this case, the player can take advantage of the relationship. And the reason is, is because we're not defining it properly. Now, he might be talking about, like, I wish players would be more committed and they aren't, they're tentatively committed.

But they're allowed to be tentatively committed because we, won't call it what it is, which is pay for play. We are in the era. It is happening all over the country. Every single school is paying players. They can call it a stipend. They can call it whatever they want. Every school is paying players directly to be football players at their school. Can we please define it as it is? That's the first step. Until we do that, I don't think that we can fix it. All right. But once you do that, now you can start to build some guardrails, right? You can start to build contracts. All of us understand this innately. I certainly understand this. I'm a freelancer, technically. Technically speaking, Fox hires me as a freelancer. Okay. So I am not a staff Fox employee.

I don't get benefits, right? They don't take taxes out of my paycheck. I have to do that because I'm technically self-employed. They hire me as a freelancer. Now, within that, much like an athlete, I agreed to a contract for a term. And within that term, I do not have freedom. So I gave something up to get what they were offering. They pay me a sum of money for me to give them my services. All right. So we have. a contract and that contract cannot be broken. It's binding. It's binding. Well, I'm sorry. That sounds a lot like what we need in college football. But no one wants to like, oh, man, we can't have that because then it's employee-employer relationship. What do you think is going on? What do you think is going on? Until we define it, we will never be able to fix it. Now, at this point, I think that we're getting close to that. I do. Because what needs to happen is that we clearly define what we're doing.

And then we need to start working our way and distancing ourselves away from the NCAA. Now, you might have heard and, you know, it got a little bit of mention that the SEC and the Big Ten have formed kind of a working group and they're starting conversations about what it looks like to kind of, you know, they, they didn't specifically say what it looks like to break away from the NCAA, but that's essentially what they're talking about. Like, hey, how do we fix this? Well, when they say, like, how do we fix this? That means without you, NCAA. All right, because you've put us in this position.

Now you're going to arbitrarily start pulling people over on the highway, and this is unsustainable. So part of this and their working group is going to be, let's clearly define it, let's put up guardrails so that we can enter into official employee-employer relationships. Now, what does that look like exactly? I'm not totally sure. And the one key leverage point that the NCAA is going to have in all of these discussions, right, and all of this is the basketball tournament, which has nothing to do with football. Football does not need the NCAA at all, not one iota. They could break away tomorrow and no one would know the

difference. The NCAA is actually a net hindrance over college football than a net giver to college football. But the one thing that the NCAA does give is the basketball tournament. And the leverage point isn't even necessarily the revenue generated from the basketball tournament, although it's immense, because it still pales in comparison to the revenue you can generate from college football. It's actually the PR nightmare that would exist if these conferences and schools ended up blowing up the relationship and doing away with the NCAA basketball tournament. American sports fans would revolt. And American sports fans in mass would revolt against those that killed their beloved March Madness. That's part of this. That's part of this. Again, 30,000 foot view. That's what's

going on right now. So they're forming working groups and they're talking about like, okay, how do we do this? Maybe it is outsourcing the NCAA to run the basketball tournament. Maybe it's trying to form a basketball tournament outside of the NCAA that can be as good or better. I don't know what it looks like. Okay, I'm not an expert in that space. But they are going to be talking about things and ways to start to put up guidelines and barriers and structures that take away power from the NCAA and give governance back to these conferences and maybe even a centralized governing body for college football. That would be a good thing. That would be a very good thing. Now, what does all this result in? All of this chaos results in where we kind of started this question,

which was the coaches. And this is exactly what Andrew brought up in the question, which was, it seems like these coaches, and I would second what the other commentators that you've heard have said. And I've had these conversations with guys out there. That it's totally unsustainable, and some will jump at the first chance they get to leave college football. We've already seen that, and I've explained some of those guys.

We've also seen guys having to make a very difficult choice to basically dive headfirst into not coaching but becoming a CEO, that would be Ryan Day. So Ryan Day essentially says, okay, listen, I can't be the coordinator, I can't call plays, I'm going to have to go and really take the reins of NIL to raise the money and fundraise in order to accumulate talent so that we can have a roster that can potentially go and beat Michigan, win the Big Ten, and win the national championship. So in order to do the things on the football field that they desire, their head coach has to remove himself from the football field and dive into the business side of the sport.

Those are the decisions they're going to have to make. If you're a head coach, you've either got to dive into the business or you've got to dive into the NFL. Well, I don't like either of those decisions for these guys because it's not why they went into these careers in the first place. They went into these careers to coach football, to impact young men in a positive way. Right? And for me, I want to see them do that because that's what they're experts in. That's what they're experts in. If you're looking at this, there is a role that the program has to fill in changing the structure of how college football is built.

It's not all just lamenting what the NCAA has caused. And it's not all just lamenting the fact that the calendar is broken and that it's unsustainable for coaches and that they might have to leave. there is a way that the programs can actively in the midst of the chaos, actively within the midst of the chaos, insulate their coaches and become even better and move forward as programs, both football and overall as their athletic departments. Let me explain that for a moment. Even in the NFL, and we've talked about this on this show, even in the NFL, head coaches do not have general manager duties. We have stripped head coaches of other duties above themselves throughout the years in the NFL because it's just bigger than one guy. One guy can't do it. He can't be the ultimate evaluator and the coach and the game planner and all of that.

He can't. He can't be the cap expert and so on and so forth. So because it's run like a business and they define themselves properly, they can build a hierarchy that is proper. In college football, an athletic director, many who are. whom don't have much football background at all, hire a coach for the purpose of the press conference and fundraising. They want to get the excitement of their fan base up and increase it. So they hire a football coach. Then that football coach becomes a mini little dictator. And he hires every other person. So the org chart starts with like non-football guy,

football guy, everybody else. And by the way, that head coach is charged also. with the game plan and everything, evaluating the players, recruiting the players, handling NIL, handling fundraising, doing all of it. Well, that's crazy. That's crazy. I believe that programs need to start building themselves to insulate that position. I believe athletic directors should hire general managers, a president of football operations. The president of football operations should be hiring the head coach. He should be hiring the general manager, the cap expert, in this case, the NIL expert. Those people have a job regardless of the head coach.

You see, the head coach can't just hire everybody because then they all answer to him. But that's not the position that we really want those coaches to have. We want them to be football coaches. So you insulate them from the other areas with an org chart. That org chart exists in the National Football League. This is why the coaches are running to the National Football League. So build it in college football. Keep them there.

Keep them there. This is where the coach's give and take has to come in. Nick Saban talked about it from a player's perspective. I talked about it from a player's perspective. You define the relationship properly so that one entity can not take advantage of the other entity. Well, the same thing can, in a way, be spoken for the coach. The coach needs a little bit of give and take. Guess what?

You can't have all the power in college football. If you're going to lament the calendar, if you're going to lament your schedule, and if you're going to complain about the setting that you're in, then guess what? Guess what? You need to dilute your power. You cannot have all the power in your program. Now, you might make as much money.

I'm not saying that you're going to have to take a pay cut. Maybe you will. I'm not sure. But you can't have ultimate say over everything. If you want to be a football coach, then be a football coach. But that means that you're going to have a GM. It means you're going to have a director of football operations or a president of football operations. There will be a front office within college football.

The fact that we don't have that right now in the midst of a billion dollar industry is crazy. It's crazy. We've allowed ourselves to get to this point and the fixes are right in front of us. And all we have to do is be honest with where we're at, have a little bit of a give and take, just as Nick Saban pointed out. And I think that we can get into a position where coaches are insulated, the calendar is fixed, the relationship is properly yoked between the player and the institution, there are contracts, there are models, and then we can move forward.

And then we will be in the golden age of college football. Long answer to a really good email question. So Andrew, I hope that that's kind of what you were talking about. But that's kind of how I envision it. All right, let's move on here. Next mailbag question, this one was awesome. And so I wanted to just dive in on this one. This one's going to be a little bit lighter.

maybe than the last, but it comes in from and we bleeped out his name for reasons that you're about to find out. And we've also redacted it from the email that you're about to read. But he writes in and he says, Hi, Joel, love watching your show and hearing your insights. I'm sure you're going to love these insights. I have a question about your thoughts on getting a pre-up before marriage. I'm getting married this August and make significantly more than my fiancé.

The reason I am thinking about getting one is in case our relationship goes south 10 plus years from now. I live in California and it is a community property state where things get split 50-50. If our relationship continues strong, then we won't need the pre-up. But it's nice to have protection. Do you think it is necessary slash wise, thanks? Well, here we go. Okay. So, I mean, this is amazing.

So first and foremost, let's just, I want to do two things first with this question. Number one is, let's call it what it is. And let's be honest with this. regardless of the situation, whether you have a lot of money or don't have a lot of money or whether you're asking or being asked, this is not an easy conversation. And this is not just like, you know, the laws in this state happen to be, you know, community property. And, you know, what would you think, babe, about this? Like, do not tiptoe frivolously into this conversation.

Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. Okay. Your fiance deserves better than that. Okay. So that's number one. Do not take this lightly. And don't just be like, hey, I was thinking.

Okay. So that's number one. Number two is you're going to have to, I feel like I've got to define my view of marriage first for you, before you can hear my thoughts on this, and then you can take it with a grain of salt. So here's my view of marriage. My view of marriage is the biblical view of marriage,

where the two will become one flesh. Okay? My view of marriage is that marriage is not a partnership. It's a union. And my role within that union is to die to myself daily in order to serve and honor and love, Sarah. That's my role within the relationship. Now, she has the same role in terms of dying to herself to respect and honor me. That's the way I think that this circle works best,

where I'm doing everything I can to love Sarah as completely as possible, all right? In my view, as Christ loved the church. Her role then becomes like, because I'm loving her, she is respecting and honoring me. That's the way like in our almost 20 years of marriage, that's when our marriage is really flourishing. It's really flourishing. So again, I don't view marriage as a as a partnership, which can have contracts and agreements. My view is a union. and my union will only be broken when I'm in the dirt. Okay. So that's my view.

Now, I'm not naive enough to say like, nope, prenups just have no role whatsoever. So I'm going to give you a couple of scenarios where I believe that it's appropriate to discuss in a really soft and loving way the potential of a preempt. Okay. Number one, if one of you is bringing family money that you yourself did not earn, okay, there's a trust. Maybe a grandparent made a bunch of money. Maybe a parent made a bunch of money. I don't know what it is. It's family money. It's not anything that you built, but it's going to be yours. It's in your name. There's a trust. Maybe it's a certain date when you get it. Maybe it's when you turn 40. I don't know. However the trust is set up. that money is not something that you built. All right. And so if your family wants to protect that money, and in particular, the person that built that wealth wants to protect that money from your relationship, then I think that you can talk about that.

And I know people on both sides. I know women that have protected family money, and I know guys that have protected family money. And guess what? Generally speaking, the spouse or the fiancé at the time, while it's still not an easy conversation, they eventually understand. Because remember, you've got to play this thing out.

Regardless of how the instance or the situation arrives, that's not an easy position to be in to have that requested of you. Hey, you know, if this doesn't work out, I'm sorry. Like, what? If this doesn't work out, like, am I supposed to? Do I need a backup plan? Right? Right? So the conversation is not ever easy, not ever. But in the case of family money that wasn't built by the individual, I kind of understand it. The other scenario that I also understand it, if you are a person that built something of significance in terms of a wealth stature and you have children that predate this relationship, I understand asking for a pre-up that protects the wealth full. the children specifically.

I think that that's kind of obvious. I also know couples on both, you know, both directions that have this model. And again, the conversations are not easy, but I understand them. I understand them. And the last thing that I would say is like,

game this out a little bit. So like you sit down. What do you think this is going to look like? Because in your email, you just said, I make significantly more than my fiance. Well, she's your fiance now. And she'll eventually be your wife. In my view, that union, you become one flat.

Like, she is helping you build that career. You might not think of that now. But even if she were to say like, hey, because of our job status, I want to stay home with the children. What? Are you going to be like, well, you know, I make all the money? It doesn't work like that. So just game this out. Imagine what that conversation looks like. Hey, babe. Like, oh my gosh. Oh, my gosh. I just don't think it's a great idea for you.

I don't. Again, I brought up my view of marriage. I brought up the two instances that I understand, at least broaching this horrifically difficult conversation. you seem to be just wanting to tiptoe into it because of the California community property rules in which there's going to be a 50-50 split. Like, yikes, please don't do that. I think that you need to think about this a little bit more. What's the upside? Let me say, there's a good chance.

There's a percentage chance you bring this up. You're not going to walk down the aisle. Do you want your ring thrown back in your face? That's a potential for this conversation. Here's the other potential in this conversation. Here's another scenario. She looks at you and she's like, yeah, that's fine. How do you feel now?

Oh, man. I don't love it. I really don't. Again, I'll just end it like this. I think more people, I wish more people would treat marriage, not as a partnership, but as a union. And that's what I would say. All right, let's move on.

That was a good one, man. I tell you what. Please don't tiptoe into that conversation. Email us back, by the way. Joel Claschow mailbag. Gmail.com. I really want to like, please tell me you're like, hey, I heard the podcast. I did not broach the subject.

And I'd be like, oh, thank goodness. All right. Vinnie V chimes in. He says, hey, Joel, love the show. If the 12-team playoff had existed in the modern era of college football, i.e. since 2007, what teams? would have had the best chance to get in the playoff as a low seed and make a run. Johnny Mansell's 2012 A&M team comes to mind for me.

I think they would have been an eight or nine seed and very well could have won the national championship. Yeah, that's an interesting one. I haven't really gamed it out that low, like low seeds. I don't think there are many low seeds that would have won. And it's hard for me to go back to 07 because the playoff really was only a thing, you know, since 14. So here's what I'm going to modify your question.

And Vinny, this might not be what you want. But I'm going to modify your question. I'm just to say non-playoff teams in the playoff era that I think actually could have or would have won the national championship in those years. You bring up a good one, though. That A&M team, they were 10th in the last AP poll. They had two losses. Season opener against Florida, that was Mansell's first start.

That was a really good team. Won their last five. Went over Alabama. I believe they beat Oklahoma in the Cotton Bowl that year, I want to say. But anyways, all right, the three teams that didn't make the playoff that I think could have or would have won the national championship. 2014 TCU with Trouin-Boykin. That team was incredible. Number two scoring team in the country.

Only loss was by three to Baylor on the road in Waco. There was no Big 12 conference championship game, if you were remembering. So the Big 12 was trying to game this out and basically say co-champions so they could try to get Baylor in who lost to West Virginia on the road. and TCU and the playoff was like, you know what? Bam, you're gone. We're going to take Ohio State with Cardell Jones, who just smoked Wisconsin. Four seed was Ohio State. They won the whole thing, beat Alabama and then beat Oregon.

So that TCU team went to the Peach Bowl, I believe, and just dumped an old miss team. That team could have won the national championship. That team was really, really good. Next up, the very next year, the defending national champion, the 2015 Ohio State Buckeyes. They only lost one game. And I believe it was due to poor coaching. And I've said this, don't worry. Everyone's like, don't tweet Coach Meyer.

I've said it right to his face. If Ezekiel Elliott gets the ball more against Michigan State, they win that game. They lost at home to Connor Cook's Michigan State team and didn't even go to the Big Ten championship game and missed out on the playoff. I think the 2015 Ohio State team, that's the team that definitely could have won the national championship. Lost to Michigan State by three, largely because they tried to run the ball way too much with J.T. Barrett and not with Zecule Elliott. They should have given the ball to Elliot. If they give it to him 20 times, they win that game maybe by one, maybe by seven, and they're in the playoff and maybe win the national championship. And then the last one, and this one's obvious, and I know everyone's going to be like, well, duh.

Last year's Georgia team, 2023, back-to-back defending national champions, 29-game win streak, lose a game to Alabama. in the SEC championship game, get left out of the playoffs, that's a team that absolutely could have won the national championship. In fact, they would have been Michigan's most difficult matchup in the country. But they didn't go and Michigan won the national championship, but they were number one all season.

29 straight wins. That's an easy one. So 2014 TCU, 2015, Ohio State, 2023, Georgia. All right, this one comes in from Joseph Y. He says, hey, Joel and team. This past October, I got my first big boy job at a grad school after job searching for about 12 months. Wow. I received only one job offer.

I hear this story a lot. I was recently laid off after being there for about four months and I'm crushed. I have remained diligent and have already taken time to apply for more jobs. However, I don't feel optimistic anytime soon that I will get one. I'm in the business field and utilizing my connections and resources, but I'm scared. It will take me a long time, again, to get a job. What advice do you have for young people like me that are struggling to find jobs fresh out of college and the best way to handle adversity such as this?

Thank you and roll tied. Joseph, great question. Really great question. Okay. that I would say is as an outlook more broadly, I would try not to attach your self-worth or your joy more specifically to circumstances. And the more you can do that, the better your entire life is going to be. Attaching your joy and your happiness to things outside of your circumstances, I attach mine to my faith. Okay. And that's where I hope my joy is. And my family has a

lot to do with that. So regardless of what's going on at work, regardless of what's going on around me physically and my circumstances, I'm hoping that I can still experience happiness and joy. So that's number one. And I know that's a difficult one and that's a very overarching view. So, Joseph, here's what I would say more specifically about your scenario is that I would be flexible. You're in a really awesome point where you might be, you might be catching a huge break. That's possible. That's possible. I want to give you, and I'm not going to do it justice verbatim, and rather than just read it to you, Has anyone else

heard the The Parable of the Chinese farmer? Parable to Chinese farmer goes something like this. The Chinese farmer I think it starts with eight wild horses show up at his farm. And he has one horse

and then eight wild horses show up. No, the first one is that his horse runs away. His horse runs away. And people come over, his friends and family come over and they're like, oh my gosh, I'm so sorry. Man, what bad luck. And he says, well, maybe. And that horse runs out and finds eight wild horses and makes its way back to the farm.

And so now all of a sudden, the farmer has his horse back and the eight wild horses. And everyone's like, oh, what great luck you have. Now you have nine horses. And he says, well, maybe. And then while trying to break one of the wild horses. horses, his son, falls off the horse, gets bucked off, and breaks his leg. And everyone says, man, that's terrible. Now you don't have your son to help you with all your farming. And he says, well, maybe. Then all of a sudden, the conscription officers come around and start to enroll everybody

in the army. And his son, being of army-going age, is not enrolled because he has a broken leg. And everyone says, man, what great luck you have. And he says, well, maybe. And this is just a parable of the fact that things will happen to you in life. And a lot of what happens to you in life and the result of it has to do with your response to it. Okay, so Urban Meyer, I first heard this with him, and he's gotten this from several other people. But this equation plays out in several locker rooms across the country in college football and above and even below in high school football as well. E plus O, E plus R, excuse me, E plus R equals O. Sorry, I messed that up. E plus R equals O. What does that stand for, Joel? Event plus response equals outcome. Every event is going to be

followed by a response. And then that response to the event is what gives you. the outcome. Okay, so you're going through an event right now, and your response to that event is going to ultimately determine the outcome. My suggestion is be flexible. Be flexible. Don't wallow in your current circumstances, find some joy in your life outside of your current circumstances, and view this as a potential blessing. Because I can tell you this right now. Young people need to be flexible with what they'll try and the jobs they'll take. Let me give you a quick story. The quick story of how I got into this industry, and I'll try to make this fast. I was an econ major out of the University of Colorado.

I played with the Detroit Lions in one preseason, got released, had opportunities to go to Europe and Arena League and all this, and thought to myself, you know what? No, I had too many concussions. I don't want to do that. Like, I'm just going to go into the working world. I'm going to be a businessman. So I thought I was going to go into banking, essentially. and I was going to go into REITs, real estate investment trusts.

So I got a job with a great small little reet in the Denver area. And we were doing speculative home building and a lot of different. And I was learning a lot. And this is 2006 and 7. And I loved that job. And I would go into the office. And I thought I was like, this is going to be my life. And Sarah was working.

And we did not have kids at the time. And I was like, man, this is really, these guys are great. They're teaching me this industry. And guess what? The housing market took an absolute dump. That company lost everything. I lost my job. These guys, these four partners called me in and they said, hey, we're really sorry, but today's your last day.

And I walked out of that office and I had no job. Now, in the meantime, I had done some high school football games here and there for Fox Sports Rocky Mountain for like, I don't know, $150, $175.5. a pop just because I thought it was like it was fun and they said hey you're pretty good at this you know might as well do this and and I liked it and it was fun and it was given us some extra spending cash but now I had no job just so happens that my wife the day I lost my job was hired by a pharmaceutical sales company she got a great job that helped cover some of my salary that I was losing and we both decided like, man, I'm never going to have a better opportunity than now to just try this. Try it. Joel, just try to be a broadcaster full time. Like, what's the worst that can happen?

We try it a few months and guess what? We can go and we'll try to find another job and do something else. Okay. Because guess why? I had the freedom to do that. I didn't have kids. Yes, we were married and yes, we had a mortgage and that was trying to tie us down a little bit, but I had the freedom to try new things. So I agreed, thankfully, to a radio job. And I was going to get a radio show in the Denver area on a station that nobody listened to. And I agreed to make $18,000 a year for that radio show. And guess what? They maybe paid me $8,500. Right? It's like they didn't have a lot of sponsors and they would give me like a check for $200. And they'd be like, hey, we'll hopefully get more next week. But I knew that there was something better around the corner for whatever reason,

for whatever reason. Maybe it was the joy I was experiencing outside of my circumstances, but I loved what I was doing and I could see a light at the end of the tunnel. So I tried it and I kept going and I kept going and guess what? I looked up three, four, five, six years later and I was getting an opportunity to call college football games and be on desks for national television. And all of a sudden, one of those people that saw one of those games was the president of Fox Sports. And the president of Fox Sports said, you know what, I want him on our games. And lo and behold, I got an offer to move out to Los Angeles, work for FS1, and call games. And two years later, I got an opportunity to call games next to Gus Johnson.

And all I could think about is, man, I'm really glad I didn't dive right back into the next job in real estate eight years ago when I lost that job. it could be something. Try everything. Don't be tied down to a city. If you've got freedom, be free. Try those things. And guess what? Maybe you're going to find something that you're passionate about.

And that passion will carry you because I found something that doesn't feel like work. I never thought I was going to be in this industry. I never sought out to be in this industry. I have no classical training to be in broadcasting. I didn't study broadcasting. I played college football, learned the sport, and was going in the business. banking and guess what? Here I am. And I love it. I know that's anecdotal and that's just my story. But Joseph, it could be yours as well. You have no idea the blessings and opportunities that are out

there in front of you. Sometimes maybe you just have to open your eyes. Maybe the opportunities aren't where you're physically at. Maybe there's somewhere else. Be open to that. Be open to that. And always be positive. Thanks for listening, everybody. I love these mailbag episodes. We get into so many different things, right? Life, structure, college, football, history, all of that stuff. I really love it. And I can't tell you how appreciative I am of all of you that make this show your home. We'll be back with more podcasts as the offseason rolls on. And as we get closer to the draft, we had the Senior Bowl. I'll be diving into some draft-related topics. But next week, as you know, we got the Super Bowl. So I will not be dropping.

a show next Monday. Just be prepared for that. And the next show that we dropped probably will be my first mock draft getting all ready for the draft this spring. So thanks for listening. Make sure to subscribe to the podcast wherever you're listening. Make sure to subscribe on YouTube, definitely, and leave a comment and I'll dive into those comments during the course of the week. Thanks so much. Enjoy your week. Have a great day.