The Jordan B. Peterson Podcast - Draft for Publish on 2024-07-08

Episode Date: July 8, 2024

Hello everybody. I'm talking today to the dread Tommy Robinson. My wife, who's going to join the discussion, she had something to do with this. Tammy and I have been following Tommy for quite a long time, years really, probably nine years, maybe longer than that, wondering just what the hell he's doing and what he's up to, watching his exposure, particularly of the grooming gangs in the UK, which is like the darkest story that the most demented imagination could possibly posit.

So Tammy was going to interview Tommy and I wanted to meet him and then he got arrested in Calgary and I talked to Tammy a bunch about this and we watched his latest documentary silenced together and I felt that it would be more than useful for us to both do the podcast and so that's what we've done. And so what did we talk about? Well, we talked about his arrest in Canada, right? With no charges. And we talked about, well, his past since really since 2009

up to 2018 and what he's been through and why. And we talked about the rally that's going to occur in London on July 27th and much else as well. And so join us for that. So Mr. Robinson, my wife and I have been following you a long time trying to figure out what the hell's going on and what you're up to. And so you've just run into a spot of trouble,

you might say, in Canada. Welcome to Canada. Yeah. Welcome to Justin Trudeau's Canada. Communista. Yeah, yeah. So maybe, why don't you start with what happened in Calgary and what you think happened?

Because no one really knows. So I landed in, I went to Montreal. I spent a week in Montreal. I met Gadzad, I met Nsaf Badawi. I've been in contact with that family for 10 years. Went for dinner there. Then I traveled to Calgary. That's the family of the guy who's trapped in...

So Rafe Badawi, he put a statement online in Saudi Arabia saying, "'Jews, Christians and Muslims are equal." That's what he said. He was prosecuted, he got 10 years in prison, and they kept trying to do him for apostasy. So they were trying to sentence him to death. He was sentenced to a thousand lashes.

Now this was in 2011, 2012, and that was just, let's start my activism, but I was in contact with Rafe and his family. So he had three children, same age as my children. And I've just visited his family. To know that he still hasn't embraced and be able to hug his family still now is insane. And there was a fight for his freedom and Canada gave his family, who at the time, I wasn't contacting

them back then, he gave them refugee status. And so I come to Canada and I went to meet his family. They invited me for dinner. I had a lovely time. Then I come to Calgary. When I landed in Canada, I contacted Ezra Levant, because I used to work for Rebel Media. Said I'm in Canada. He said, great, let's set up a couple of events. And so I landed and then we set up the first event for six days later, which was in Calgary.

So I then traveled to Calgary, gave my first speaking event, talking about my politics, talking about my journalism back home, telling about my story. And as I went to leave the event at the end, four cars pulled up, arrested me, detained me, took me to an immigration center. I wasn't charged. It was quite insane, actually.

It was quite bizarre because- Were you ever charged with anything? Never charged with anything. And so what I found particularly strange about that was that I understand that you were detained for some time at the airport. Is that what you began with? For three or four hours at immigration one.

So they went and I've got a copy of my stamp. So they stamped me with queries. I think because I traveled in on an Irish passport from Denmark and I didn't have a return form. They probably knew who you were too. Yeah, but when they questioned me for three, four hours, they wanted to know who I was seeing, where I was staying.

I gave them all that information. They made phone calls to the people and then they questioned me for the three, four hours, they wanted to know who I was seeing, where I was staying. I gave them all that information, they made phone calls to the people, and then they released me. And then, as I said, when they come, they detained me, they took me to the immigration centre, and then they seemed like they were trying to release me straight away. Which the officers didn't seem like they wanted to be detaining me. They said, Tommy, listen, if you agree to conditions, we can get you out the door. Oh, yeah. If you don't agree to conditions, you're going to be on a flight to Vancouver and you're going to be detained. And that detainment could be for a while.

Yeah. OK. I said, OK. So what do you want me to agree to? They said, agree to not leave Calgary and agree to sign in the police station three times a week. So my next, my event. Did they say why? Well, it's become quite obvious why,

because it was to block my appearance at Edmond. They said, you're not, I said, what about Edmond? And I've got an event sold out tomorrow and you're not allowed to go to Edmond. Okay, okay, got it. And then I said, I'm due to be in Toronto. You're not allowed to go to Toronto. So I said, okay, so that's what this is about then.

I see. And did they say on what grounds you weren't allowed to speak to all the people who'd already paid for you to speak to them? They said that they didn't believe I've been entirely honest with them in my immigration meeting. So we didn't pre-put up any event for sales for a talk in engagement until I was in Canada. When I was in Canada and I spoke to Rebel Media, so once I was through immigration, I spoke to Ezra. Ezra said, right, let's do a couple of speaking engagements. So they said, they believe I knew I was doing

speaking engagements before I come here. But there was no ticket sales, there was nothing before I come here, it was once I got in. But I said, what difference does that make? What difference does that make? I'm in Canada, you've given me six months, I believe, to be here, when you've allowed me in.

What difference does it make whether I'm speaking or not? Then they said, and we had lawyers present for all of this, Ezra hired us the best immigration lawyer. They said that you're only allowed five days, if you're coming and doing a speaking engagement, which is a different visa to what you've got, then you're allowed five days. So you've had your first day in Calgary,

so you can't do Toronto anyway, because it's seven or eight days later. And then the immigration lawyer said, well, that's not true, because you're allowed five separate dates and it doesn't matter if they're over the six months. So they were trying to twist things the whole time. But then they seemed in a very bad situation, which they were trying to... We spent two days of negotiations. So it was...

Was this in Calgary? In Calgary, yeah. In Calgary with lawyers to negotiate my exit from the country. So for them, we had to negotiate when I... Because what they said is, you're not free to leave at the minute. You can't leave. It's my daughter's birthday next week, so I was concerned.

I didn't want to tell them that, but I was concerned that I was going to be held here. Then I was concerned whether they were holding me here till after July 27th, which is my next big event in the UK. So my head started going down all the rabbit holes, trying to work out what they're doing. But I don't think they knew what they were doing, if I'm honest. After speaking- Oh, it is Canada under Justin Trudeau. So that's a fair assumption.

And they didn't want to be doing it. It was very clear. The officers that were doing it- In Calgary. In Calgary- Yeah, I wondered about that. Were so nice. Yeah. Were so nice the whole time. And who picked you up? What was the-

The Canada Border Immigration Agency, CBSA. Right. So it was the federal people. The federal people, yeah. And they said it had come from, because I asked them, I recorded them in the back of the car, saying, who's ordered my detention and what for? And they said for immigration violations. Yeah, I poked around in the Alberta government

to see if there is any involvement there, and I found no evidence that they knew anything about what was going on with you at all, or could find out about anything. And it doesn't make sense, because then now they've just given me back my passport. But they only give me back my passport under the agreement that I've booked my flight

to leave from Toronto. Now, do you have a speaking engagement in Toronto? Today, yeah. Today, when is it? It starts at five o'clock. Right, right, okay, okay, okay. So, okay, so what did you want to come here to speak about? So, I'll be honest, this possibly could be the most important interview I've done of my life, yeah?

I currently face, since leaving the UK, I had a huge event on the 1st of June. Since leaving the UK, I've received no paperwork, but a far left organisation have put out that I'm gonna be in court on July 29th, facing two years in prison for a film that I made four years ago. So I made a film. Why are you being charged for, Tammy and I watched that film last week. You've watched the film.

Yeah, now the only thing I saw about it that was, you know, could be argued to be questionable was the fact that you recorded people who didn't want to talk without them knowing. Now, my sense was that it was perfectly understandable why you did that. But, you know, in terms of looking for malfeasance, say, that seemed to be the most obvious thing. Now, you were investigating something like you have been a lot, as far as I'm concerned, something unspeakably vile. And so it seems

to me that you had a moral obligation as a human being and as a journalist to do exactly that. But like, what the hell? Why are you up on charges for two? So I'm up for contempt because when we talk about the politicization of the judiciary or the weaponization of the judiciary, basically when this story that you've watched, this story went global. It was a global news story, which was a total fabricated story. Yeah, maybe clue people into the story. So there was a Syrian refugee in a school

in the north of England, and he's held down on video by a white English pupil, and he pours a bottle of water over him. Now, the headlines were that Syrian refugee was racially attacked and water boarded. Water boarded. Yeah, so that was the headline. And that went CNN, it went ABC Australia, it went BBC.

It was the biggest news story of the world. And they blew it up. Now, the story the public were told was that it was a racist attack because he was a Syrian and because he was a refugee. And everyone was told that the white English boy was a racist bully. Now, very quickly, very quickly as this blew up,

I think 170,70,000 was donated to the Syrian refugee. Our politicians used it. Everyone used this story for their agenda. So the Home Secretary invited the Syrian refugee to Parliament. Professional Lennox Lewis, world champion boxer, made invites to him. Everyone was supporting the Syrian refugee because of the way the story was portrayed. I very quickly got contacted by mothers and parents at the school and pupils at the school saying that there were allegations that the Syrian refugee had beat up girls, hit attack girls, hit friends and raped girls, and all of these allegations. So I made a video saying to the public, you're being lied to about this event. Okay, this is not the entire story. You've

got a 10 second clip, stop donating your money, and this isn't the truth. From that then I received, we have a celebrity jihadist lawyer who represents all the jihadists. So if you've got a 10 second clip, stop donating your money, and this isn't the truth. From that then I received, we have a celebrity jihadist lawyer who represents all the jihadists. So if you've, yeah, his name's Mohamed Akunji. So he's the man trying to get Shemina Begum back into the UK. That's the girl that went to the ISIS bride. He's been the, he was the lawyer for Michael Adebalejo

who headed Lee Rigby. He is the celebrity jihadist lawyer. He then contacts me and it worked with everyone else. Everyone else that was threatened over this story shut up or retracted their statements, yeah? He contacted me and said, you have to pay 50,000 pounds, make an apology for your defamation because I went online

and said that the Syrian refugee had threatened to stab someone and I said he attacks girls. They said that wasn't true, so they then started legal proceedings to sue me. This is where it starts. So they start legal proceedings to sue me, I then launch into action, investigating, because I know what I've said is true,

because I spoke to parents, pupils, I spoke to everyone at the school. So then I thought, how do I prove... I'm always thinking outside of the court, because there's no jury in this court case. I'm thinking of public opinion. I need to show the public that I have credibility and I haven't lied to you.

In fact, I was the only journalist in Britain who told you the truth about this story. Now, when you see the film, if they can change the entire story, they changed and deceived the entire nation on this story. How many other stories are we seeing daily, which are total- You mean like the story about Biden being competent? Like that story, for example.

Like when they hide it, like the Hunter Biden story, when certain stories... Right, Russian disinformation. 50 intelligence officers swearing to Biden. Swearing it to it. They hide certain stories and then they pump other stories. Now, why did they pump this story? This story was about supporting migration, supporting refugee status, because the reality was the British government at this time, this Syrian refugee was one of 20,000 welcomed in by the conservative government at the height of the ISIS conflict. So if the reality could be told, which was allegations of the boy being a bully, attacking girls, stabbing people, and we can get on to all of this. So if that was the truth, then people might start challenging

the government policy. Now the government very quickly used this story, invited the Syrian refugee, he was on every news show. Once they'd done that, they couldn't go back on it. They had to crush the story. At which point, I then wear a hidden camera and I say, let's go and speak to the teachers. Let's find out what's gone on up in Huddersfield.

The first teacher I go to, there was an Asian gentleman, come out and just said straight away, tell me I took the money. I said, what do you mean you took the money? He said, I took the money. I said, they paid you, who paid you? Kirk Lee's council. Now the leader of Kirk Lee's council was Shabir Pandore,

who was a Muslim. His brother's the lead. Do you remember the school story in Batley where a school teacher tried to talk about Mohammed and that school teacher is still in hiding now. So the man that organized the rally outside that school is a Mufti Pandor. So Shabir Pandor is the leader of the council, his brother is the main radical Imam who organized all the protests.

Now at the time in the city of Huddersfield, it was the biggest grooming scandal, grooming is rape, jihad, gangs of Muslim men who are raping young girls in our country's history. Yeah, this was a perfect news story to change the narrative, which is what they've done. Right, right. So the teacher says he was paid, I say how much, he whispers on camera, 18,000 pounds.

So then he goes on to tell me that the Syrian refugee come up to his classroom to beat up a girl. Remember, my allegation is that he beats up girls. And then we go on to get the school records. Yeah. We have, and just so you can see the deception to the British public, the Syrian refugee was sat on TV and making comments like,

I don't like to break the school rules. Yes, yes. Well, his school records show 117 disciplineries. His school records show that the teaching... He meant he didn't like to break them 150. 150 times. But the public were totally deceived on this. And they donated £180,000 to this child, yeah?

Yeah. And at the same time as this, the English boy was portrayed as a racist bully. Right. Which was a total... They had to move, right? Their house come under attack, there was threats to rape their sisters. Do you know what you don't see in the story?

Do you know that boy lived with me for three years? That boy. I took him over. I took the family home. So they lived four hours away. And didn't they put them in a ratty hotel right next to a brothel? They were putting them in the Islamic...

In an Islamic district. They were putting them in the Islamic district that Mufti Pandor, the man who organized the protests outside the school, controls the main mosque next door. How soon did he show up at the school after the... The next day. The next day. And the story, so people understand, the story wasn't organic.

The story of the bottle of water happens here. Four weeks later, it blows up into international news. Now what happens in that four weeks? The celebrity jihadist lawyers, working with the home office, Four weeks later, it blows up into international news. Now what happens in that four weeks? The celebrity Jihadist lawyers working with the home office, they put in a criminal record check on the Syrian's family. So they're making sure the family are clean before they blow it up.

The criminal record check comes back, say, on the 25th. On the 26th, it's world news. So it wasn't like this story just went online and blew up and everyone started reporting on it. They had four weeks to plan it and they planned it and they planned the entire story. And what you see, the Syrian refugee had a broken arm at the time. He had his arm in a plaster cast. Now what the public were told was that he broke his arm in another racist attack. So when I went to the head teacher's house, after already having a teacher say he was paid £18,000 to prevent him telling the truth about the Syrian, I then go to the head teacher's

house who just said, Tommy, I've never had my chance to talk about this, yeah? I'm not allowed to, okay? I said, so you've been, have you, have you signed a non-disclosure agreement? Did they pay you? And he goes on to say they blackmailed him, they threatened him. So when this went on to World News, they, and when I say who's they, he says, Theresa May, who was our Prime Minister at the time, she spoke about this in the United Nations meeting. She spoke about this story. That's how big this story was.

And then they came into his school, and he said he'd worked there for 25 years, he joined education to help your, I could have done a whole documentary on that head teacher. They closed the school? They closed the school down. Eventually, yeah. So what happened to his arm?

So basically the head teacher says, do you know how he broke his arm? And I did, but I said, no, tell me how he broke his arm. He said he was attacking a pupil four years younger than him. So he was 15, he was attacking an 11 year old boy after racially abusing the boy's mom. So he is attacking the boy and another pupil, because he had a little boy in the headlock, another pupil pushed him off. That's how he broke his arm. But I said, that's not what the whole world was told.

We were told. Yeah, he fell against a curb. He fell against a curb. And that's what the records show from the school. And the head teacher says on camera, I investigated it. I know how he broke his arm. And then I asked the head teacher, well, how come the public were never told any of this? He said, we told the media.

We were telling the media, all of us were. It was never reported. So then the Ted teacher goes on to state that they made him sign a non-disclosure agreement. They then escorted him off the school property and he'd never worked a day since. And part of his agreement, he's not even allowed to talk to other teachers.

So they totally shut this case down. Now whilst they shut this case down, I was a problem. Because I was a journalist with a very large following, telling the public in the world, they're lying to you. So how did they deal with me? They then started legal proceedings.

Now legal proceedings to sue me because they said the allegations I made were lies. Now, so I had to prove. I went to- Who because they said the allegations I made were lies. Now, so I had to prove... Who was they? So the lawyers, the law firm. But then, as a journalist, I can prove everything I reported is what I was told. I had the messages from a mum who sent me pictures of her daughter's face with bite marks. So I went to court first of all and said, well, I'm a journalist.

I reported what I was told. The judge didn't allow that. The judge said, no, you have to prove it is true. So I said, well, I don't have protection as a journalist that I reported what I was told. So why do I have to even, if I was told it and I reported the allegation, but then he- But you had the school records, or did you not have them? No, I didn't have them at this point. I see. I didn't have them at this point. So see. I didn't have them at this point.

So then he said, you have to prove it's true. I said, okay. So then they put me to trial. Now I spent £100,000 on lawyers at the start of this. It was going up to £200,000 for my legal fees. Then it all become very apparent what this was for me very quickly, because we sat down in court and they agreed their legal costs. We're up to £750,000. So then I'm like, okay, so this is what's happening. Law of fear.

Yeah. For me to fight this, and I couldn't afford to fight it, so I couldn't afford the legal teams, but we got into the proven truth. So I had all the recordings. So I went and got seven teachers. One teacher, a female, says on camera, women couldn't speak to this Syrian refugee. He hated women. I say, what was he like? He was aggressive. And I asked the teachers the same questions. What was Jamal like? And what was Bailey, the English racist bully? And whenever I mentioned Bailey's name, they said, oh, what a beautiful boy. Really, right. Really nice kid. Now, some people understand the story of why I couldn't back down anyway, yeah? Is when I went, when this story blew up into national news, international

news, I went to meet the family, the English boy, and I went to a hotel and I met the mum, they were hiding in the hotel, because the police, you're right, were putting them in a hostile Islamic area in some hotel. So when I met the mum, she was crying her eyes out. She said, I've spent all my Christmas money, Tommy, I've got no Christmas money for the kids. I've been here for a week, hiding. We don't know what to do. She had two nine-year-old little girls with her twins, two mixed-race little girls with Bailey's little sisters. Oh yes, right. That's important. Yeah, because they're calling them a racist family. So I said to the family, I said, okay, I've got, come and stay with me, yeah, till we

sort this out. So I come back up the next day and we go to the house. Now, at the time when this blew up onto national news, their address was put out. And when their address was put out, gangs had turned up, which I wear, again, to prove to the public that it's not my allegation of this, I go and knock on the neighbours' doors and say, what was it like? And they say, cars of Muslim men were turning up here saying they're going to rape the sisters, they're raping the mum. And then the family at the time barricaded themselves, so the two little sisters and the mum barricaded themselves inside their door. Now, when I went to move their stuff the next day,

the family wouldn't come back to the house, they were too scared. I said, right, we'll go with men to your property and get you all your belongings I said, well, we'll go with men to your property and get you all your belongings, yeah? Because the Christmas presents were under the tree. So that's what the mum was like, my Christmas presents were under the tree. All the kids' stuff said, when I got there, we couldn't get in the bedroom door.

The bedroom door was only this much open, yeah? Where the family, this is to understand what the family had to go through, they'd had to barricade themselves in as gangs of Muslims were outside, attempting to get in the house because the boy poured a bottle of water over him. to go through, they'd had to barricade themselves in as gangs of Muslims were outside, attempting to get in the house because the boy poured a bottle of water over him. And not just the boy poured a bottle of water over him, but every single, Piers Morgan, Jeremy Vine, the

biggest commentators in our country demanded severe retribution, that's their word, against this child. He was a child. So even if he had to- Ron, you said he'd poured... Wasn't Bailey responding to something that Jamal had done when he poured the water? So what I said originally was that Jamal had threatened to stab Bailey. That was my allegation because that's what Bailey had told me. When we go to the teacher's houses, one that I had her under posh teacher because she spoke very well, she said, you do know, and this is all on the documentary, you do know he threatened to rape Bailey's little nine-year-old sisters, don't you?

So when you see the boy pouring a bottle of water over him in the playground, he doesn't physically beat him up. No. Pours a bottle of water over him. You don't get any backstory. And although all the teachers knew the backstory, one of the teachers, I knocked on her door, and I'm so gutted because of the foot, there was a teacher who knew Bailey,

and when I knocked on her door, she just got an endless crying. Oh dear. She just felt an endless crying. And I. She just felt an anise crying. And I know why she felt an anise crying. That's guilt, yeah? And every one of those teachers, the head teacher had a breakdown. The head teacher's life was a breakdown.

And the sad story was, I spoke to other pupils, because I spoke to so many people. Another pupil who had serious mental health issues, always self-harming. When I met him, he said, you see, if it wasn't for that head teacher, I'd be dead now. I wouldn't have survived my school time

without that head teacher. That head teacher saved my life on many occasions, the fact that I could go and talk to him. So this head teacher was a brilliant man from everyone I spoke to. They threw him under the bus. They closed the school down. So to get rid of this problem, they closed the school. The school was gone. So I still want to know a little bit more about the contempt issue. So the contempt issue is, so I went to court and five pupils who I don't know came to court and testified.

Now one of those pupils got A grade is the best you can get in school. So one of those pupils got 11 A's, a young girl called Charlie. Her life's been destroyed through this as well. This is what I'm so angry about, yeah? This isn't about saying I lied. You've said these children lied, yeah? That's what the judges done. Yeah, right. So what he done, this pupil come to court, she gave testimony that the Syrian boy within a week of being in school beat her up with a hockey stick, yeah? And she still had... Hit her in the back. Hit her in the back with a hockey stick. Another boy come to court and testified that he witnessed

it, yeah? Another girl come to court and testified that he witnessed it, yeah? Another girl come to court and testified that he spat in her face and attacked her. Another boy come to court and said he racially abused her mum. But this is the... If you understand... You said the journalists left.

They left court. Before that happened. So what they... And then the judge said that all those people were lying and said that people have all sorts of reasons to lie. They just make things... So basically, as the Syrian refugee was given evidence, the media was sitting there and headlines were going everywhere about how scared he was with my

video and how he was intimidated and his family were in danger. We find out from the police records there were no threats. And then when it got to the first of our witnesses, which is five pupils, when it got to the witnesses, I mean, I watched the media get up and walk out of court and I sat there looking at the judge. So they walked out of court. So as each one of these witnesses give evidence, they're not one single thing that portrayed to the British public.

So the public were told nothing of what the allegations were. Again. Again. It's a total, and I sat there and I said to the judge, how, where have they gone? There's another news story. I said, so no one's reporting this.

No one's, and then what the judge done where are they gone? There's another news story. I said, so no one's reporting this. And then what the judge done, I then produced seven covert recordings. Now the covert recordings proved that the council, because the head teacher was paid, this teacher was paid, and they all said they were paid. And they all say they were paid to prevent them telling the truth about this situation.

So whilst they're telling everyone I lied, no one was free to tell the truth because they've signed financial non-disclosure agreements. So in the documentary, we put in an application to the local council controlled by Shabir Mufdi Pandore. And we ask, how much have you spent on non-disclosure agreements? They spent 274,000 pounds buying the silence

of their employees. So they, from there- What do you make of the, who's the judge? And what from there... What do you make of it? Who's the judge? And what can you say about what you make of him? Well, I actually should, I am not allowed to say anything. So even though I'm sitting here talking, yeah? I have been bound and gagged, and this film that I made, so when I produced all the covert recordings,

I'm sitting there thinking, your entire case is gone. This was a setup, it was fake, it was fraudulent. It's all a lie. And then on the school records, remember, to find me in defamation, I said he threatened to stab someone. So then I produced a school records from his teacher that says he stabbed someone.

Then I go to the boy's house who he stabbed and get the boy and his mum on camera, covertly, saying that he stabbed him and drew blood. He stabbed five pupils that day, according to these pupils. Five. Five. But he was portrayed to the entire country as a perfect little poor Syrian refugee who had been racially bullied. Now, I'm not having a go at the Syrian refugee here either, because he was 15 years old, he was a child, he'd come from a war zone,

he had his problems. What the problem is here is the total deception to the entire world Because he was 15 years old, he was a child, he'd come from a war zone. He had his problems, yeah? What the problem is here is the total deception to the entire world to push a narrative by a government. The narrative, open border immigration, the narrative, white English racists. They said the school was racist. So even in the documentary, I go and find other Syrian refugees at the school. And I knock on their doors and say, how have you found it living here?

And the girl says, I found it brilliant. Everyone's been so welcoming to us. So it was a total misrepresentation to the public. Now, when I show the judge all of these recordings, what he does is he writes down everything he saw. So every allegation that the women made, so their case was backed by the fact that the mother who went out publicly

and said Jamal attacked her daughter, the mother that sent me pictures of her daughter's injuries, that mother retracted her statement, which she did. I knock on her door with a hidden camera and just say, look, I'm just trying to understand what's going on. And she says, Tommy, they're threatened to rape us.

Yeah. I said, okay. She said, I've got to live here, Tommy, with my daughters, yeah? And this is the city with the biggest Muslim rape gangs. So she's terrified. So I said, okay, I'm not angry with you, because they're ruining my life because of this, because they're saying, they're telling the world

I lied when I didn't. So she says, okay, and I said, but what I need to ask you is just, was Jamal involved in the attack against your daughter? She says, yes, of course he was. So, okay, so it was the truth. So I produced this to the judge to say, you may have a retraction statement,

but here's why you've got a retraction statement, yeah? And here's the school records. In the school records, in minutes from a meeting, yeah? Which they tried to block us getting the school records as well. In the school records from the minutes from the meeting, Jamal's father, his name's Jihad, yeah? I know, I can't believe that. Jamal's father, Jihad, in all the council records, they say that his family were trying to manipulate the situation

for their own benefit. Jamal had his own caseworker who in the emails says Jamal is not the innocent party that's being portrayed here, yeah. That's his own caseworker. There was not one single person that went to court and gave any evidence for Jamal, yeah? It was literally seven teachers, five pupils. The eighth grade pupil, I read out, in her school record, what it says is that she is the only pupil in the school to have zero negatives. Yeah, yep, yep.

She's a perfect grade A student. At the time of this court case, she's at university studying law. Why would she come to court and lie? But the judge listed everything that's in the documentary and then ruled against me, bankrupt me for 1.6 million pounds, which is what this was about. So people understand, I don't know if you know

Katie Hopkins in the UK, they took, I ran Katie before this case, because I knew they took her house, they took her family home, they put her through the courts and they seized her home. And I said, Katie, I'm facing it. She said, Tommy, do an agreement. I'm telling you, you can't win. You cannot win this, yeah? I said, I can't do an agreement.

I can't do it to the kid who was living with me, the English kid, he tried to kill himself as well, tried to commit suicide. I said, I can't say that this is all, I can't do it to the kid who was living with me, the English kid, he tried to kill himself as well, tried to commit suicide. I said, I can't say that this is all, I can't do it. I said, so I can't come to an agreement with them. I can't principally do it when I have reported the truth and I'm not backing down on that. So she said, well, they can do what they want because when they made me bankrupt, when they took my house, my new husband who had savings from his previous marriage, they took that. She said, they're gonna clean you out. So I had that advice very early on,

but I went through and she was 100% right, they could do what they want. And they bankrupt me to the tune of 1.6 million pounds. When they bankrupt me, they then give me an injunction. And when the judge gave me an injunction in court, I said, when he mentioned it, I said, the film's already made, yeah? Because I'd already made the film.

They knew I had a film because I'd put out promos before the court case. The public are going to see the truth of this case. Again, the film is not opinion-based. It's fact-based. It's school records. When are you going to release it? So basically, since I've been here,

the film was played in America two years ago, in a cinema in Florida. General Flynn was there, he gave his account of what he watched. He said, it's unbelievable what I've just watched. Because what people need to understand is, you see what they've done to me, it's exactly the same lawfare that's going on across the whole Western world to anyone who raises their voice. What I managed to do is document every single part of it and show what I call the unholy alliance. The alliance together of the judiciary, of far-left organizations, Muslim organizations, all working together to control the narrative. And I was challenging the narrative

and that's why I had to be punished. But the judge gives an injunction where he listed everything in the film and basically said if the public ever see this, you get two years in jail. So I, and if I'm honest, that's the contempt. And when I come out of court, I failed. I totally failed in myself, in myself as a journalist because since the start of my activism

which I'll get to, it was in 2009, I've said if you worry about consequence, you will never ever bring about change. You won't bring about change. I wouldn't walk out my front door if I were, I wouldn't come to Canada if I was worrying about consequence, getting sort of torn down by a communist government. But if you worry about consequence, you won't bring about change. An incompetent communist government. Communist government.

Better be precise. Yeah, yeah. You should probably throw a bit of malevolence, wounded narcissism malevolence in there too, you know, just for the icing. I should probably throw a bit of malevolence, wounded narcissism, malevolence in there too, just for the icing. But when I come out of court that day with the injunction, I was scared, in all honesty. I've been in prison multiple times to do my work.

I spent a year, I've done a year of solitary confinement, which damaged me, which was totally damaged me. I went into prison one person and come out another. So at that time, and it also damaged my family, so at that time I didn't play the film. Right. So this is interesting I think. I should have played the film. These are adult problems that haven't been dealt with because people aren't allowed to speak, and now children are at the brunt of it.

Do you know, they ruined that whole... So that school was closed down. The collateral damage in the government's lie, because that's what it is, a total lie. Yeah. The collateral damage, that young English kid is still suicidal. Right.

I talk to him every day, yeah. As I said, he lived with me for three years. Right. Think he'd do a podcast? Yeah, yeah, he would. Do you want to ask him? Yeah, he would do it, man. And you know, you've got to hear what he'd done to his life. You've got to see what he'd done to his life. Hey, let's talk to him. Talk to him. Yep. Talk to him. Okay. He's a lovely young man. You know, he had

a difficult upbringing. He had a difficult upbringing and from the background he's from and the upbringing he had of poverty and in a real rough environment, he is a very nice kid. And look, my son's 15. It happened to him when he was 15. The whole world turned on him. The whole world turned on him, man. And even now he's still bearing the brunt of it now because he lived with me until this case. When this case finished, I left the UK. Now when I left the UK, he left living with us and he's gone back up to his home, his hometown where he's still facing problems from this lie. But the thing is I should have played the film. I should have just played the film and I didn't play the film because I, for the first time, worried about

consequence. I should have played the film and man. It's hit me up for years. And the film was never played, but it was played in America two years ago. Yeah. Two years ago, it was played in America. Now they've come for me. Why have they come for me now? I held a rally on the 1st of June. No, I'd come back to...

So I'd stayed out of the UK for a year since with all of this. And I stopped. I wasn't in a great place either. And then I come back, I think Elon Musk, Elon Musk gave me back my account. Now, my activism and my journalism took me in 2015. If I go, I started my activism in 2009.

So I'll give a brief history to my work. Yeah, do that. I was born in, I was born in Luton in 1982. Luton's a town that's 30 miles north of London. When I was born in 1982, there was one mosque. There's now 45 mosques, okay? How big is Luton? It's 200,000 population.

And how many mosques? 45. Okay. 45. Luton was named by the CIA as the epicenter for terrorist activities across Europe. The fertilizer bomb plot was planned in Luton. The 7-7 attacks, they plot was planned in Luton, the 7-7 attacks, they got their bombs in Luton, the Stockholm bomber was radicalized in Luton, terrorist attack after

terrorist attackers orchestrating come from Luton. Now growing up in Luton, as I said when I was born, I've seen all of this. Almas-Ridin, you know, I'm a back three Abu Hamza, their head office, they used to have an organization called Al-Mujreddin, who were not a person, they're now a prescribed terrorist organisation, but they never were. Their head office was in Biscuit Mill in my hometown. So growing up, I had a very life lesson of the influence of Islamist ideology and what it can do to freedom. Also the grooming gangs, which is something we'll get onto.

So my cousin was a victim at 14. She was hooked on heroin and raped. She woke up being raped by gangs of bearded men in the Muslim community. She run naked through the streets. Now what the police done at the time is nothing. So I grew up watching- How old were you when that happened?

I would have been 13. So she was 14. So as all this is happening, and just so people get, Luton is one of the most diverse towns in Great Britain, one of the most diverse towns in Europe, yeah? So white English are a minority, okay? Most of the people I love are not white, because I've been brought up in this community, yeah?

So as I've been brought up, in our school playground, when I went to school, you had the Muslim playground and the non-Muslim playground. Like, so I had a very quick learning. And then when you go into this- Why were they segregated? Well, they segregated themselves. The Muslims did not integrate or assimilate.

So when you go into the school dinner table, just so people can picture it, you'll have whites sitting with blacks, sitting with Indians, sitting with Sikhs, sitting with Hindus, all sitting together. And in the corner, there'll be 10 tables of Muslims. Now I never understood it as a child. It was from when I went to high school, I just knew the Pakistanis are very different. They're quite hostile.

If you mess with one, you've declared war with the whole tribe. There's not a fair fight. There's never a one-on-one fight. It's all gang related. And so I just grew up learning it. But that's not to say, because some of the best people I met in my hometown were Muslim lads, yeah? Some of the people I loved were Muslim lads. But per se, there was a real problem here. And I grew up watching it, learning it.

And Al-Majridin, my first activism was in 2004. I was, what was I then, 20? 2004, I organised a protest. And this group, do you remember the Beslam school massacre? No, so the Beslam school massacre was Chechnyan terrorists had took control of a school and this is coming again, this is going to happen to a Jewish school, I guarantee you.

They took control of a school and I was probably 2019 or so. That was where? This was in Chechnya and Russia. Yeah, okay, I remember the story. And what happened was the parents parents were all outside the school, and all the Muslim jihadists are inside the school with their pupils, with their children. And then they start butchering them and killing them. And I remember watching the parents drop to their knees and they're screaming, yeah?

And I remember watching it thinking, what is this, what has, this isn't one man that's gone in and done this. This is a whole group of people. So what, and then I had to understand what brings someone to do that. And two weeks later, I saw an interview in a chicken shop in my hometown of Luton with a man called Saiful Islam, which translates as Sword of Islam.

He was second in command of Al-Majriddin, the group, yeah, whose head office is in my town. And I saw him saying an attack like that would be justified in a British school. And that was my wake up. I said, who's this man? And I looked him up, who's his group? And I looked up who they were,

and then I looked up Omar Bakri, and then I started understanding their ideology and trying to work out, and then for me, these are a danger. So then I organized and I looked, and they used to have a stall set up, so we have a Don Miller's bakery, a famous, it's like your Tim Hortons, yeah?

We have a bakery chain in Luton town centre. And every Saturday, this terrorist group are there, openly promoting hatred, yeah? Just openly sending people to fight for the Taliban, recruiting people. So the Stockholm bomber, who was an Iraqi Muslim who'd come to university in Luton, was a nice young man till he come to Luton.

Then when you're vulnerable, at your most vulnerability, away from home for the first time in university, they pounce. Yeah, that's typical cult behaviour. So they pounce and they got him and then he went and blew himself up. So these groups have been operating. So I organised a protest called Ban the Luton Taliban. Yeah, well I actually, I gave a presentation at Ban the Luton Taliban. Yeah. Well, I actually, in my present, I gave a presentation at Oxford University. When was that?

That was 2004. So I gave a presentation at Oxford University because I made leaflets. And if you dig up the leaflet, which I'd done for my Oxford University presentation in 2004, my rhetoric has never changed, okay? So the leaflet was put as front page of our local newspaper. And what I said is, whites and blacks

are being religiously and racially targeted in this town. No one's doing anything about it. There's a total two-tier policing operation in this town where they get away with what they want. The Islamic community get away with what they want. The police do not know how to deal with these problems. I went on to say that they use drugs as a weapon against our community to get our children

into pedophilia practices, which is what is now known as grooming. Now when I made this, and I was a young man, and I organised it with my friends, we go to football together. Luton's one of the most, it's voted the roughest town in Great Britain. It's a rough place.

But we went there. What makes it rough? We were hat makers. We were hat makers. What makes you rough? That's all that mercury. That's the history. Oh, maybe, yeah. It's a poverty stricken town with a lot of problems, all that mercury. That's the history. Oh, maybe.

Luton's a, it's a poverty stricken town with a lot of problems, regardless of Islam. Luton has a lot of problems. It's a rough environment. It's the levels of violence are as high as anywhere in the UK. But what you grow up thinking is normal actually isn't normal. You grow up with a level of violence in your school, on your streets, or the way to solve things is through violence. It's a poor town, yeah? So I start, I organized this group. So I start, I organized this group, about 200 of us turned up,

English men, and for the first time it works that the terrorist group weren't there, the Jihadists weren't there that day because we were coming. And the police locked it down. But what happened from that point? The police tell me what they did. No, the police, on this day, the police turned up. We went what happened from that point? The police... Tell me what they did. No, the police, on this day, the police turned up. We went to Don Miller's. The group weren't there. We then stood, held a little protest at our council building,

saying we need to get rid of these terrorists. This was before 7-7. This is before any terrorist attacks in Great Britain. The terrorist attacks we've seen, so 60% of the Muslims in Great Britain's jails are ex-members of this group in Luton. So you actually had put your finger on them. I put my finger on them and I named in the leaflet, what I named in the leaflet was the link between the street drug gangs. We have a gang called the Gambino's, they're not very original, they're a Pakistani group, but they've called themselves the Gambinos. And three or four years later, the national newspaper, so in 2004, I named them in my leaflet

and say we've had enough of the gangs with their heroin, and we've had enough of the jihadists all combining. And what happened after this was I was targeted by the gangs, not by the jihadists, by the street level drug gangs who were drinking alcohol, gambling. They're not religious. They're just out pumping heroin and controlling the streets and prostitution. I was targeted by them. Now years later the national newspapers run a link showing the link between the Gambinos, they name them, and terrorists.

They work alongside each other and at the time the Luton Islamic Center, which is the main mosque of Luton, the main Salafist mosque of Luton, yeah, that's, it's the old synagogue, ironically, before the Jews were driven out. It's the old synagogue, it's now... Oh, really? Yeah, convenient, but Kadir Basque was the leader of this mosque. Now at the time, I then started looking at this mosque, because my friends who were Muslim had said,

bruv, that's the problem. In this town, that's the problem, yeah. So I went on their website and I translated their website. And I found a seven page justification for women to be lashed for adultery, yeah. I found justification for killing apostates. This is on the main mosque, yeah. So I translated it all and then basically I faced a backlash

from the Pakistani gangs and I had problems then. But at this time, I'm being honest, I was part of a Luton football scene. So I used to go football with my friends. The Saturday would be the day that all the English lads would come together for Luton Town Football Club. It was a cultural thing, I guess. I've never claimed to be an angel either. So I was part of a football scene. So we clashed then with the drug gangs, the

Muslim drug gangs. And five years goes past by this point. Do you think you did something wrong there? No, I didn't do anything. I stood up against them. Stood up against them and at times, so I knew those gangs because we're all the same age. I went to school with them. Stood up against them and I remember when they were getting with one of my friend's little sisters and I rang the family and said, do not let her near them. I'm telling you, at the time, don't let her near them. I know what's going to happen. And then I had all the gangs having problems with me then. Saying, what's going on? Because I knew them. What's going on?

I said, you're not doing to her what you do. I know the family. It's not happening, lads. The amount of girls I know who lives have been destroyed through these prostitution drug gangs, and they start off nice with the girls. They get them in, they treat them well, they give them money. These are 13 year old children, yeah? They give them drink, they give them alcohol, they'll drive them around in their sports cars.

Gradually, gradually, bang, they're gone. The girl's gone, yeah? The girl's gone. And as I said, when the family... Is that when you became aware of... Of grooming. Yeah, I became aware because my cousin and all the other girls went to school with. But at the time, we viewed them.

So at school, the English kids, we just viewed the girls ourselves. We viewed them wrong. We viewed them as slags. Because they're off with all the Pakistani men, the older men. Right. We were viewing them as children, just looking, saying, what are they doing with all the taxi drivers? And what... They're going out with all the older Pakistani men, the older men. We were viewing them as children, just looking, saying, what are they doing with all the taxi drivers?

And they're going out with all the older Pakistani men. I watched your video about the woman now who's older who talked about the gangs when she was young and she would get into a car and lay down so that her mom would be safe. And hide when her mom's in the car, yeah. That's what I mean. And so all of these things are going on, yeah.

But by this point, we get to 2009. When did you start to understand that your view of the girls, the view of the girls that you had when you were 15 or thereabouts, when you were treating them like sluts was wrong? Yeah, when did you figure that out? When I become an adult. When I become an adult and started looking, thinking,

and then went up, so 2009, in 2004 I do this protest. We have a backlash from all the Pakistani drug gangs. We carry on, sort of, we get through that. I've grown up, I've then, by this point, got two successful businesses between me and my wife. We had seven properties. We were doing, we were successful. We were doing well in life, yeah. And then 2009, we have a soldiers homecoming parade. So they weren't out there at war. It was a Royal Anglia Regiment, which is our local regiment. Now, Scott Montridge is 26 years old. He's from the estate I grew up in when I was young,

and he died. Michael Swain was 19 and lost his legs. When the soldiers, I turned up on a Tuesday morning with my cousin, and it wasn't well publicized, but we turned up to pay our respects. And when I turned up, I saw about 20 women in full niqabs which is quite a sight when you see them together and then I looked and saw Saiful Islam the leader of this Islamic group, the Sword of Islam. I looked and saw him and

then I started seeing more of them and then I saw police everywhere and I'm thinking no way, yeah, something's gonna go down there. Then I saw the police, I watched this myself, I watched as the police took a group, now what the, because some of our friends got arrested at this event, we got the intelligence, now the police actually on the motorways stopped 360 other Muslims coming into Luton that day, yeah, so there was a full on, there was going to be a full on attack against our armed forces on there as they walked through the town. But as they walked through the town, I watched as the local...

Sorry, these were the armed forces that had come back from... Come back from Afghanistan or Iraq. From Africa. Yeah, training, they were training. They weren't at war there. I see. Okay, okay. So they had the freedom of the city because they've been away.

So then they come to get their march and the public can come out and support them. And it was all downplayed anyway. It was on a Tuesday. It wasn't publicized. We knew it because we know people in the regiment. So we've gone down that day and then I watched the town hall. Now picture this, this is our town hall. Remember, this group have all gone on to be imprisoned for ISIS,

but that's who they were at the time. But no one knows who they are, really. No one has the knowledge of what these men are like. We do because we're born there. I've looked here, I've researched them, I know who they are. I know the danger of this idea. It's 2009, I'm sitting there, standing there, and I watch my police walk them all through the town hall.

They opened up our town hall doors and walked them through. I thought, what's going on there? And then as the soldiers are marching here, then you just hear all commotion. So I go running around the back of the town hall. They've took them through the town hall to stand, as the soldiers walk here, the Muslim group's here, and they're spitting at the soldiers. They're spitting, Scott Mummys who's dead, they're spitting in his mum's face.

They spat in the families and they're shouting... Reynad says salt, just to be straight about it. Just to be straight. Baby killers, butchers of Basra, that's what they're calling the soldiers. Now, my opinion of that war has changed from back then as well, yeah. I believe it was an illegal invasion. I believe it was disgusting what our government's done. But my opinion has changed on the motive of the war. But, and our soldiers don't get to choose the war

they're going to. They swear allegiance to Queen and country and the government send them to war. Now, if these people are upset about the war, take it to the government. But they stood in front of our soldiers. And at this point, I was with my cousin there that day, and there was, I mean, you could have lit a match

and our town would have blown up at this time. That's how we felt. But I'll tell you why we felt that, because I'm a proud Lutonian. Luton is part of the identity of who I am, is where I've been brought up. And the only time you ever hear our hometown mentioned, ever, is to do a terrorist and jihad. I've been brought up. And the only time you ever hear our hometown mentioned ever

is to do a terrorist and jihad. And now our soldiers have been attacked in our town by these jihadists. And not just attacked, but the police walked them through the town hall to do it. So I watched it that day, and then I watched the police's reaction. They didn't turn on the Muslims at all.

They stood with their backs to the Muslims. So the Muslims were all here screaming abuse. They stood with their bans to all the English people who were upset at what they're just allowed to happen. And the facts is the police didn't have to bring them through our town hall. They could have kept them there. How do you think the ordinary rank and file policeman thinks about this sort of thing? I've wondered about that in Canada. The same things are happening. Well they had to change the rank and file police to police these events from this point on,

because Luton police were furious. After this, this went out everywhere, Luton police went in the next day, all of them, and they wore Union Jack badges on their uniform that said, British police support British Armed Forces. Because they were furious. They were told to remove their badges, and we know this from the police, and they said no. And 60 of them said, we're going on a walkout. We are not removing these badges because you have betrayed, you've made it look like, and the police were unhappy with what they've

been made to do. So from this, and for me, as a local lad, like I said to my cousin, we can't allow this. What's next from this? They've just attacked our armed forces. What's next? Turn up at a soldier's funeral. We know who these men are. We know who these groups are. The whole country needs to know who they are. And we were so outraged that the people of Luton had been portrayed as being against their armed forces when really it's the jihadists. And what we found out is that every mosque in Luton was leafleted in the days before it, so we didn't know this. So all the mosques, the entire Islamic community knew, all the Imams knew that our soldiers were gonna come under hostile attack by a jihadist group, you know?

What's now a prescribed terrorist organisation. So then after that, I organised a demonstration called the United People of Luton. But before that, what I'd done is, I went to the council, contacted them, and set up a petition, we got 4,000 signatures. We have laws in the UK which are against, they're called ASBO orders, antisocial behaviour orders. So if

two young kids at our local shops keep causing trouble together, they'll get an ASBO order to prevent them from being together. So what we said is you've got these orders, I don't want my mum to walk through Luton Town centre and have to face these jihadist groups. None of our families should have to see them all together recruiting again. We want them banned. We want them banned from the town. And then we turned up for our first demonstration, which was all of our, I went around the leaflet at everyone and said, on, it was bank holiday Sunday, we're going to show the country that the people of Luton support our armed forces. When we turned up that day, and I knew,

because you know, you've heard of two-tier policing now, yeah, it's now become part of the vocabulary of Great Britain because everyone talks about how we're two-tiered. In the US increasingly too. Everyone's seen the two-tiered policing. I'd seen it my whole life, because I'm from a town that's now 50, 60% Muslim, and I know how we get policed.

I know I've seen it, yeah. So I bought a cameraman. I bought a wedding, he videos weddings. I paid him for the day and said, come and video everything, yeah. As we turned up, the police come up, they stopped us, they made us take our shoes off, they searched us, they put their hands in our pockets.

And as they're doing it, I said, you didn't do this to them. You did not do this to them. I watched the day they attacked our soldiers. You didn't put your hands on them. Why are you putting your hands on us? Why are you searching us? Why are you treating us like this?

We're coming out to show support for our armed forces. Then the police drew a baton line. So we wanted to get to the town hall, which is where our memorial is, which is where they let them get, and they blocked it. They blocked it, they kettled us for three hours. My auntie had to urinate in the street because they wouldn't let them out. And I remember saying, no Muslim, my auntie had to urinate in the street because they wouldn't let them out. And I said, I remember saying, no Muslim woman would ever

be forced to urinate in the street. You would never do this to them. And then they batted us. My friend who's a little black lad called Craig, they knocked his teeth out. And there was then clashes with the police. And then, so we were held for three hours, we weren't allowed to get to the war memorial, and all we wanted to do was show support for our armed forces. And they locked us down. And after that, I then said no, and then they raided houses. They went to my mum's house. This is the start. They went to my mum's house, I wasn't there. And everyone they arrested, they went to each estate. So they arrested one person from each estate, this is the intimidation. And then they gave them all bail conditions, preventing them from entering our town centre,

25 hours a day, seven days a week for three months. So then, and I knew they'd been to my mum's, but I wasn't there, so I thought, well, you've done to us what we're asking you to do to them. They're the terrorists. You banned us from our own town. And so then we organised another protest, and I remember contacting the police,

and I don't think you understand the level of frustration here, yeah? This town's gonna blow up, okay? The years of us being trodden down, the years of us being under attack, the crime, the drugs, the prostitution, the grooming, and here you are, you're crushing us. We're trying to have an organised event.

So I said, you need to let us get to the War Memorial, because people are not going to be happy. But on that day, I was obviously wanted. They'd been to my mum's house. The other lads who had conditions not to enter the town centre, we all wanted to go. So when I turned up, I gave everyone masks. I said, when we leave here, no one take the masks off.

When we're getting to the War Memorial today. And 500 young men turned up that day. More, probably a thousand. But we're all from Luton. So the songs we're all singing is about we are Lut that day, more probably a thousand. But we're all from Luton. So the songs we're all singing is about we are Luton town, it's our town. And then they called us all outsiders. They went on the news saying lots of troublemakers from outside of Luton have come into the town. And we got to the War Memorial that day. And this was the start. What I'd done is I went, I videoed it again and I went on all different

football discussion forums around the country and said, Luton stood up today, okay? We've had enough. We've had enough of what's going on. We've had enough of the two-tier policing. We've had enough of the Islamic gangs. So Luton stood up today.

And the video was reminiscent of hundreds and hundreds of young men just saying that. We're not having it anymore. And our banners, our banners made it very clear, okay? Muslim, no problem, extremist Muslim, big problem. When was that? This was 2009. This is the start.

So people know me. So early. Yeah, this is the start of my activism. This is what anyone knows me as. Now I used a fake name, Tommy Robinson. Yeah, tell me about the name. So in 2004, when I didn't use a fake name and I stood outside the town hall when I was 19 or 20

and held a protest, my windows got smashed and my house got attacked. So in 2004, when I didn't use a fake name, and I stood outside the town hall when I was 19 or 20 and held a protest, my windows got smashed and my house got attacked. So come 2009, I'm successful, I've got a family, I've got businesses, but I want to talk. I was the same as every one of the person watching this. I didn't want to lose my house, I didn't want to lose my business,

I wanted to be able to make money and I didn't want to lose my safety. Let me ask you, I want to know where the name came from, but I also want to know, and I don't know the answer to this, this is really a genuine question. Do you think it was a good move, ethically and strategically, to change your name, or would it have been better to keep your name, face the trouble then, and deal with it at that point? So, in all honesty, I didn't want to do this.

I didn't want to be the person. I wanted to make a stand, but I didn't want to. Yeah, okay. I wanted to be successful in business. I wanted to make money. My passion was making money. I was good at it. I was doing well as a family.

But I wanted someone to speak about it. So when it's- Do you know the parable of the rich man? No. What's that? Well, it's a gospel story I'm gonna tell it because I see the problem that you're in well there's a scene in the Gospels where Christ is traveling in a cart and

a rich prince jumps in to accompany him and he tells Christ that He's done everything he should do in his life to be a moral person. He's followed the commandments, he honors his parents and so on, but that he's still dissatisfied deep in his soul. And Christ asks him about his situation. He tells him he's rich, that he has all these concerns going.

And Jesus says to him, I'm afraid you're gonna have to sell everything you own and follow me. And the disciples are like shorted right out by this and they say, well, if that's the cost of salvation, you know, who's gonna pay that? And I was thinking about that in the story of Jonah at the same time when you were talking,

cause Jonah is called upon by God to speak the truth and he just heads in the other direction. It's like, he thinks exactly like you thought. It's like, yeah, I don't think so. And you know, who would do that? Who wants to do that? And so, but that still doesn't quite answer the question. Like you said that you're caught, right?

You're pulled because on the one hand, you wanna have your life and you wanna be successful. And on the other hand, you wanna tell the truth. And so the name was a compromise between that. So- I wore a mask for a year. I wore a mask. truth. And so the name was a compromise between that. So- I wore a mask for a year. I wore a mask. No one knew who I was for a year.

Right. So looking back on that now, do you think that that was a mistake that you made to protect your life and your enterprise? I'm not saying that wasn't justifiable. Or because there's a price, obviously, for anonymity because there's a price obviously for anonymity, there's a price for not being public, right? It breeds suspicion, for example. And so what do you think about that? I think the best thing, the best thing that ever happened is when I got unmasked. The best it was, it was not for me, but I was terrified. So there was a Times newspaper

report called Steven Bird, and I'd been hiding for a year. So I'm talking about all these issues secretly on radios, and I'm giving the name Tommy Robinson. And I'm turning up to demonstrations with a mask on my face, and no one saw my face. So no one knew who I was. So there was lots of confusion, who is this guy? Obviously my friends knew, no one knew.

And then a Times newspaper journalist turned up at my mum's house and said, where's Stephen? And my mum rang me and said, there's a journalist here looking for you. And I knew then, okay, this is it. And I went to meet the journalist. And he said, you're on the front page of the Times newspaper tomorrow, Stephen.

Your life changes tomorrow. And I was terrified, if I'm honest. Absolutely terrified. Now, but in that, because then I was nationally known, at this point, because the English, we set up the United People of Luton. And then after our second protest, where we got to the war memorial,

we put the video online, and this Islamic group of jihadists, they held an Islamic road show in Birmingham, yeah? And they had a big banner that said, Jesus was a Muslim, and there's hundreds of them. And they stop at a young 11-year-old white Christian boy called Sean in the shopping centre, who's with his friend, and they get him him up on stage and they convert him to Islam.

And as they convert him to Islam they're all cheering Allah Akbar. And I watched it then from Luton and said, no, they can't do this. That cannot be allowed to happen in a city centre for a child. So I said, right lads, to the lads from Luton, we're going to Birmingham. We're going to move this from Luton. This isn't a Luton issue. This is a national issue. So we went to Birmingham and we formed the English Defence League. And that's where the name English Defence League come from.

Now, when we went to Birmingham, we went as a group of 50, 50 men from Luton. We got violently battered. OK, the news, and this is where my first awakening to the media come. So there's a picture. this boy wasn't with us, there's a young English boy at a bus stop with a green top on, and gangs and Muslims just come from everywhere, and they battered everyone. And there's a picture in the national newspaper

and they're jumping on this boy's head. And underneath the picture it says, a fascist is attacked by anti-fascists. And I remember looking at him, I remember looking at him, well, I remember I had an awakening to everything. Because I went from working on a building site, to six months later leading the biggest protest movement you'll have seen.

And when we went to Birmingham as a group of 50, we had English Defence League tops on, and it said Luton Division, the name of our town. And these images went everywhere, of English men getting chased and beaten. So this was Birmingham and our first banners said, victims of jihad in Nigeria, we stand with you. Because obviously I was down the rabbit hole.

So I was seeing on Christmas Day, five Christian churches were blown to pieces, didn't make the BBC News. Yeah, I was following all these stories around the world of Christians facing persecution at the hands of jihad, no one caring. So we went to Birmingham before, let's highlight a lot of issues here. Let's make this a point. And we had banners, we had placards, but we got violently, the police had to lock us in a building for two hours because they couldn't control the streets. Then they got buses and put us on the buses to get us out of there and all the windows

were coming in, there was riots going on. So from this, we then went back to Luton, and then we saw a Christian church in Manchester that had been taken over by Muslims, which has been another video go viral just weeks ago, similar situation. It was in the area of Longsight, and they were bulldozing over Christian graves and headstones.

So I was watching it going, like, they can't do this. How come no one's talking about this in the town? Where's the local political voice? Where's the politicians? Now the thing where we, people said, because we took to the streets, now we went from a group of 50 men in Birmingham being violently beaten,

to going on all the messaging boards of English football clubs, then turned up in Manchester. And I was like, when we got there, there was thousands of young Englishmen had come from everywhere. And from the start, because we got there, there was thousands of young Englishmen, had come from everywhere. And from the start, because of the violence in Birmingham, the men had come with an attitude of, no, we're not backing down.

Okay? So that was sort of the start and the birth of the English Defence League, which every city we went to, there was a justified reason for going, yeah? But no one ever spoke about that. And then I realised very quickly that everything I'd seen in Luton, everything I'd talked about in Luton, was happening in every town and city. So then I started meeting families

that their daughters were missing for weeks. And then I started hearing all these stories and it's one thing to read about grooming. And that's why I made a five-part series, the one you've talked about that you watched. Because you don't get to feel the pain. I'm sitting with a mother, a father and a brother whose 13-year-old daughter's been missing for five days

and the police isn't doing nothing. Now, no one, so I remember going on big chat shows in 2009. Jeremy Paxman was the most feared BBC presenter and he had a show called Newsnight. And when I went on, everyone was all our opposition at the time and I was terrified again. And it was the first time my mum, so my family had been crying since the time I started my activism because my

mum was threatened with her job. There was violence, police raids, terrorists attacked, terrorist plots. So my family were begging me and begging me to stop. And I went on this Jeremy Paxman show and I said to him, like, I don't expect you to understand, but I expect you to listen, okay? Our daughters are being taken. They're being groomed, they're being raped, they're being prostituted in every town I see. And he said, you expect us to believe?

And it hasn't aged well for him at all, because in the early days, we were condemned as fabricating stories and making this up. So you understand the level. Well, I met a father from Blackpool. The gang took his daughter, okay, the father and the son would ring his phone and he'd have to listen whilst they were raping his daughter.

These levels, so you understand. And in 2015, so we go across the country and I've done a presentation called The Rape of Britain as well as documentaries. And I go back to us marching through Telford, and now the arrest rates for these crimes, if you do a graph, it goes like this, there's none, yeah? The English Defence League forms in 2009.

By 2010 and 2011, the arrests are going through the roof. Now, we didn't expect any credit for it, or any recognition for it, but the government were then faced with something they knew was going on. Look, my sense was, and this is part of why you're here today, like I've been watching that since then.

I don't know if it's since then, but it wasn't long after that. And it was my sense at the time, and this is something I think that Tammy has observed too, that your work was essentially what called attention to the fact of these grooming gangs. So, Andrew Norfolk is a Times newspaper who finally questioned these gangs. Now, what he says, he says, we saw the emergence of the far right. He's given an interview. I had been made knowledgeable of these gangs for years, but everyone was too scared to touch it because all the men were Pakistani Muslim

and all the girls were young English children. So he'd known about it. So for me, Andrew Norfolk, yeah? Okay, you ended up reporting it in the end, but you was a coward for years. You failed. Well, I also think it's hard for people, what do they say?

Carl Sagan said, extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I talked to Michael Schellenberger about the trans butchery of kids that's going on now, WPATH, and Schellenberger, who's a very brave journalist, told me that he had listened to my interview with either Abigail Schreier or Helen Joyce detailing this out probably two years ago now, and he said he couldn't believe it. It took Schellenberger two years to

contemplate this because he couldn't believe in the magnitude of the crime. And I think it's not merely cowardice, although there's plenty of that. It's also the fact that, look, it's a lot easier to write you off than to admit that there are gangs of people who've been brought into the country who have set out malevolently and with intent to rape thousands of girls.

So it's a hell of a lot easier to write you off as a far-right extremist than it is to even begin to contemplate what that might mean. And that's what he said. He said, when I saw the emergence of the far-right, by far-right he means concerned English fathers. Yeah. Concerned Englishmen who are saying, well, we've had enough of this. If you go back to our videos, we're marching through cities saying, Muslim pedos off our streets, before all this.

Now typical far-right stance. Yeah, 2015 is when the Roverehm Report was released. Now this is when Andrew Norfolk started talking about it. Now Andrew Norfolk starts talking about it, then they do an investigation in the city of Roverehm. And the city of Roverehm has a 3.7% Muslim population. And they find that over 1,400 children have been raped. And they find that the police knew,

social services knew, government knew. So I remember at the time of this, when it blew up, everything we'd said, everything we'd been screaming about, now is in a government report. That was actually one of the things that really alerted me to just exactly how screwy things had become. So that was before I made the videos that made me viral in 2016.

But one of the things I'd been following was that story. And it took me, well, the first way you react when you come across a story like that is, it's something like there's just no way this can possibly be true. And it's far worse than you can ever. Yeah, well, that- It's far worse.

It's far, so when that report come out, and let me think of what name I give her, because I know all these girls and families now, but you're not allowed to use their hidden... So this girl, one girl, her father had rang 999, the emergency number. When they went through to get the history of how many times he'd rung the emergency services for his daughter, it was 200 times. Oh dear. 200 times he'd rang for help. 200 times. Then two fathers got together he'd rang for help. 200 times.

Then two fathers got together, and this is all in the report, it's not my, not Tommy Robinson saying this. Two fathers got together and their two 13-year-old girls were in a house being raped by gangs of Muslim adults, yeah? The two fathers went round to get their daughters back, the police turned up and arrested the fathers. They left the girls in the house. There's another incident in this report.

Five Muslim men have a 12-year-old English girl. They've got her drunk. She's in a derelict house. They're all raping her, yeah? The police turned up. They arrested the 12-year-old girl for being drunk and disorderly. This is the level of one girl, she was 12 years old as well, they got a hot iron rod with the letter M,

and they heated it up and they scolded her bum because she was the property of Mohammed. She was the property of Mohammed. Another girl they got and they nailed her tongue to a table. They used to take these girls out. We're not talking about sexual gratification here. We're talking about total destruction of the most precious thing that we have, which is our daughters. This is not. This is totally something. And when you go through the cases, I've investigated so many of them and looked through the numbers. Robumbach had a 3.7% Muslim population. So for people to understand the scale of this problem, okay, there was 1,400 girls raped.

I then looked and into, and I- How many men do you think were involved? Well, this is, so Telford. Yeah, yeah. In Telford, I'd done an investigation into Telford. And the reason I chose Telford was Telford was one of the gangs where we'd had the report. The police had identified a thousand victims and had identified 200 perpetrators.

So I went and spent 18 months in Telford and I got to know the story like you've seen, yeah? I've done a five-part series called The Rape of Britain. And when I went there, we went there and worked for a year before we let out that we were working there. We got to know the girls, we got to know their families. I spent time interviewing, we had the ones that were willing to go on camera and the ones that weren't. So I got a database and we built a database of names. So I'd interview a girl for three hours, four hours,

five hours, three, four times, hear every bit of her story, we'd then sit down and work through it. Now, when the name, we got the men's names, we had 254 identified, yeah? And when they're identified by more than three girls who do not know each other, that's the green flag for me to go for them in the documentaries. For me, I'm going to now make you famous, yeah? And now the police investigation identified 200 perpetrators,

our investigation identified 254, and independent inquiry has identified over 300. Now there's only 1.7% Muslim population in that town. So how many Muslims is that? It's about three and a half, three to three and a half thousand. So when you get rid of the women and you get rid of the under 16s, we were talking about a thousand men.

A thousand Muslim men are in that town and the police identified 200 of them. Now when they brought them to prosecution, they prosecuted 11. Why? They only prosecuted 11. So when people see these headlines and you're seeing grooming, they're not doing them. They're doing a little...

In each town, they're nicking a few. They're nicking a few. Now what we found in our investigation was that one of the most senior ranking officers was receiving funds and monies from the gangs. The gangs act as a mafia. They're a Pakistani mafia. Their level of violence, their groups that they're linked with, they're all the way to the top, from solicitors to CPS lawyers, to politicians. So in this one town where we've done this big investigation,

and we tried to give the information to the police, they wouldn't take it. So there is still a massive cover-up going on. And I've done this. I've done this five-part series because in 2017, I've always talked about these issues, then they started making arrests. Now, when they started making arrests, all the crimes I'm talking about, the tongue on the table, the hot iron rod, these were coming out of the reporting. Because for the first time, if there's a six-week trial, journalists were sitting in the trials and they're reporting all the horrific details. We get told the words they're using, dirty grass, they use white slag.

It's all racial, it's all religious. They're literally quoting the Quran whilst doing their rapes, yeah? So as this is coming out, finally, all of it's coming out. Then all of a sudden, the reporting stops. Now why's the reporting stopped? They put reporting restrictions on every one of these cases now, yeah?

So what happens, instead of getting the details, what happens is they have a six week trial, and on the final day, you get one day news. 20 men convicted, yeah? So what happens, instead of getting the details, what happens is they have a six week trial, and on the final day, you get one day news. 20 men convicted, yeah? So I went up to, one of these cases was going on. So is that the technical restriction? They can, how's it? They put reporting restrictions and say,

because they're such big trials, they're a group of 10 men, a group of 10 men, a group of 10 men, they're all interlinked, until the end of all the trials. Oh, I see, I see. So hypothetically, so they're not contaminating the trial. Yeah, so what we'll do, I think in America and possibly here, you lock up the jury. Yeah.

We lock up the public. We don't let the public know everything to keep the jury safe. That's what their argument is for you. So there's a case going on in Leeds. Now, at this time, I'm doing journalism. I went to the top Kingsley Napoli lawyers in London. Ezra Levant sent me. I went on a course to understand what I can and can't do around court reporting. So when they have a reporting restriction, the judge has no power over putting any restrictions on any information that's already in the public domain. So I looked at this case, 30 men, and my problem with this was,

which I'd previously been to another case, there was another case in a place called Canterbury. These cases are everywhere, yeah? You've got to, for the public, you have to understand the crimes that are going on and been allowed to go on, facilitated and accommodated to go on, literally handed over our kids.

So in Canterbury, a young girl was drunk, she was 14 or 15, she walked into a kebab shop, a Muslim-owned kebab shop, and asked for directions. She's taken upstairs by all six members of the staff. They find all of their DNA. She's found crying down the road. They've all raped her. They're all on bail.

So I looked at this case. They changed the name of their shop. They're still running the shop. So I went up to the city. I went up to the city and I asked the people who were walking past, are you aware of any allegations against this business? No.

So no one knew, there's kids, I'm watching kids. Same people are running it. Same people running it, they just changed their name. I'm watching kids going in there. Jesus. So I went to the court case the next day, because the man's in court. Now I went to the court case,

and this was before I was aware of the laws. You're not allowed to stand on court property and video yourself. So I stood on court property and said, this is what's happening. Six o'clock in the morning, my door goes through, I'm raided, I'm taken from my home, straight down to Canterbury Court where they've told me, because the judge, obviously, this is embarrassing for the judge, two other people went and leafleted the estate where the men lived. Those people were sent straight to jail. Paul Golding.

He was put straight in prison, yeah, for handing out leaflets to warn the public, this man, and all these men are now convicted, they've got 25 years, but they had their DNA anyway. So why are they out on the street? Why are they still running the business? But this was Canterbury. So then I go for legal training

to make sure what I do is legal and right. So they put these reporting restrictions on. So I stand outside the court case and I report. 30 men are alleged to have made, or alleged, I said alleged, they could be innocent, yeah. These are the crimes they're alleged to have done. And I'm warning the public that these cases are going on in every town and city and you're not being told the reality of the situation here, yeah. And these are the signs and I read the men's names because it was already in the public domain from when they first were charged. So I read everything that was in the public domain, I stood outside court and then the police come over and arrest me. And they arrest me for a breach of the peace. That's on camera.

This video, and as they're arresting me and handcuffing me, I'd only gone to work, I said get me a lawyer. And as I get put in the back of the van, I said thank you, because millions are now going to watch the warning I've just given. I get taken into the judge. The judge sentenced me to 13 months in jail. Straight away. The judge lets the rapists go home. One of them packs his bags and goes to Pakistan. He's still never faced justice.

So they all go home. I'm in jail. I'm the big risk. I've got 13 months in prison. And I remember getting to jail. That happened then. Within two hours. Within two hours.

No court case, no trial. Contempt of court. Bang, 13 months. And I remember standing there going, 13 months, what for? What for? Okay. So, and this is, there's one case where there's no jury. I didn't even get asked to plead guilty or not guilty,

which is the reason they had to release me in the end. So I get 13 months in jail, I get to prison, I didn't even get asked to plead guilty or not guilty, which is the reason they had to release me in the end. So I get 30 months in jail, I get to prison, I ring my wife, I say, I'm in jail. She's like, what? I said, I'm in prison, I've just been sentenced to 13 months in jail. And prison for me, our prisons are literally ISIS training camps, they've taken over control. The same in America, I tried to give these warnings for a long time, they will control your prison system. The most vulnerable and weak in society who have been wronged their whole life are going to be turned against your country. Because that's what they're doing.

The money coming in, most of them are Salafism, they're controlling the prison. So for prison for me is a dangerous place. I land in HMB Hull, which doesn't have many Muslims, so I think great. I'm alright here. So I spend two weeks in there. But what I don't know is when the judge sends me a 13 months in prison, he puts a reporting restriction on anyone knowing I've got 13 months in prison. So I'm in prison, everyone's saying where's Tommy? Rebel media and American journalists have started saying he's in jail because they're not bound by the court's things. So by the

Monday the judge has been forced to release and let people know I'm in prison. At that point, 684,000 people signed a petition demanding my release. Because if you watch the entire reading my video, I just stand and report and I say, listen, they might be innocent, but this is what the alleged crimes are. This is how many victims of English girls there are. This is how many men there are. You need to be aware as parents, this is what's happening. So I make the video and the allegation was that I breached the reporting restriction because they made reporting restrictions on it.

But by law I didn't anyway because the judge has no power to put reporting restriction on the information that's already in the public domain. I was talking about what was in the public domain. But I'm in jail, I'm there, then after two weeks, there's 30,000 people marched on parliament, there's demonstrations in Sydney. This is when? This is 2017-18. This blew my name up, yeah?

It blew up so big. 30,000 people marched on parliament, there was a massive free Tommy, it's called Free Tommy Movement that was built, yeah? And then politicians, Congressman Paul Gossard, he flew to London. Ambassador Brownback, part of Trump's team, contact the government to say, make sure he's safe.

What is going on in the UK? Gert Wilders flew to Britain. Lots of politicians flew to Britain. And it was all blowing up. And I'm in jail, so I don't really know what's going on. I'm in prison. And then after two weeks, they come and move me. And I say, jail so I don't really know what's going on. I'm in prison and then after two weeks they come and move me and I say, where am I going? And they took me to HMP Honneley,

which has the largest Muslim population of any jail in Great Britain. So as I get there, why would you do this? How does this make sense to do this? And then when I got there they said, you're gonna have to self-isolate yourself. So I'm not self-isolating myself. Why have you brought me here?

I was fine, what's the reason for bringing me here? And then, I said I'm not self-isolating myself. If you put me on that prison wing, I'm gonna come straight out of that prison door. And then I'm gonna be in a position where I have to defend myself, but I am willing to defend myself, yeah? I've done nothing wrong to self-isolate.

What they want you to do when you get to prison is if you ask for protection, you're put with paedophiles. So I've never, I've done nothing wrong to self-harm. What they want you to do when you get to prison is if you ask for protection, you're put with paedophiles. So I've done nothing wrong to warrant myself being in this position. Yes, well it would be very convenient for those who aren't very happy with you to be classified with the paedophiles. Classified with paedophiles or killed. Raid, raid. Those are good alternatives. So six Muslims were sentenced to 30 years for planning to kill me.

They got caught with guns and bombs. Yeah. I get put into Whittle Prison. This is, I'll go back to Onley, but I get put into Whittle Prison. I'm in the prison system. I go onto the first night center, my door opens. It's an ex-paratrooper, British armed military who's now a prison officer.

He said, when they come to get you, do not leave this cell. He said, I'm telling you, your life depends on it. I said, when they come, when who comes? When they come to get you, that's all he said. When they come to get you, I said, what do you it. I said, when they come to get you, that's all he said, when they come to get you, I said, what do you mean? He said, when they come to get you,

don't leave this cell, Tommy, your life depends on it, son. Do not come out of this cell. So I said, all right, two hours later, my door opens, prison officers, he's with them. He said, right, you're going on to A wing. And I said, I'm not going anywhere, mate. And then he, I said, I'm not leaving this cell. I'm not coming out of this cell.

And he said, if you don't leave this cell, I'm going to arrest you and you're going to be put down into solitary confinement. You're going to be arrested. I said, okay. So he said, okay, you're arrested. And then I'm separated. He then comes to see me. He said, you're going on A-wing.

That's where the six Muslims are who are doing 30 years. You're dead. They're handing you to them. You're dead. Yeah. So I said, okay. And then I'm obviously thinking, Jesus. He said, and I write her name. He said, you to them. You're dead. Yeah. So I said, okay. And then I'm obviously thinking, Jesus, the litur...

He said, and I write her a name. He said, the woman would be done for corporate manslaughter, but it's too late for you by that point. So I said, okay. The next day I have a meeting with my lawyer and I go for the meeting with my lawyer. And then there's a waiting room, say like this. And I've had my meeting,

and this is the Viddick's waiting room for illegals. And they opened the door and I walked in, I saw beards. But they was as shocked to see me as I was to see them. So I was like, okay. So I didn't even sit down. They locked, I stood on my back to the wall, they locked the door. And I'm so, as soon as they locked the door,

just boom, I got, I lost my teeth. So I'm getting battered in this little room. But they literally put me in the room with them. So I'm- And who exactly were you in the room with? Muslims, just Muslim prisoners. Muslim prisoners. Muslim prisoners. Because obviously I'm the most outspoken critic of Islam.

The prison system, but the Muslims didn't know I was coming in. If they did, I'd be dead. I'd be dead. They'd have weapons waiting. Because I could see by their faces, they've all looked at each other. I'm looking for you. But there's about eight, nine prisoners in the room. There's only three Muslims, but they just, anyway, what feels like 10 minutes was probably

60 seconds. The prison officers have come in, they've broke it all up. I've lost my front teeth in there. I'm then transferred to another prison. And this is each time I've gone through the prison system. So in this one where I was reporting, I've been put into HMP only. And I said, I'm not locking myself away.

They said, okay, well, you're going to go on solitary confinement. I said, why have you brought me here? You put me in this position now. So they put me on solitary confinement. And this is the sentence where I went into, I'd say I entered jail, one person come out another. So how long were you in solitary? On this one was 12 weeks. But I lost £30. Because your prison is brought to your cell door and it has your name on it. And the Muslims, it's a majority Muslim prison, who run the servery, who are all preparing the food. So I said, I need tinned food. I can't eat food that's been put on my cell

door. So I had five tins of tuna a week. That's what I could afford to buy. So that's all I ate, yeah? And I thought I was all right. But then even little things like, they come to my door and they open the door and said, where's your wife? And in my solitary confinement, they used to transfer me. My wife worked at a school and my kids were at school. So the only time they could get me out, the whole prison would be locked up at lunchtime.

They'd then walk me to have a little exercise in the courtyard on my own and have a shower. And the only time they'd do that is during lunchtime. So my wife's at work, I couldn't even speak to my family. Because usually, people understand the British prison system, you're out of yourself eight hours a day. You've got a job, you're going to work, you're playing football, you're going to the gym. I was totally, you're isolated, you're on 23 and a half hour lock up on your own in a room. And I was upset about it obviously, but then they come and say, where's your wife?

I said, I don't know where my wife is, why? We have intelligence, she's gonna be attacked with acid. And then they just shut the door. And then they just shut the door. And it's like, and I can't even use the phone. But they knocked on my wife's door and my mom's door, the police did, and they give them pieces of paper. And the sad, sick thing about this is,

I don't even believe they probably did have intelligence. I believe that all of this, and it worked, all of this is for pressure, for stress, to make you break, essentially, because they didn't need to put me in HMP only. I was fine in HMP whole, yeah? So they purposely moved me to a majority Muslim custody. Then they used that to put me on solitary confinement.

Then I had this issue with my wife and my mum. And then when I got to ring them, and then they put me where my cell was, literally, my cell's here. And it was so hot that summer. And you can open your window this much. And the building they use as the mosque is there. The building they use as the mosque is there. I was getting shit, like human feces, put through my window. And prisoners at my door every day. So I had all this going on, and then it gets to the Court of Appeal. So what was this doing to you?

At the time, I didn't realise it was doing anything, at the time. At the time, I felt all right. At the time, and I- How come? How could you possibly feel all right? Because I was receiving a lot of mail, which I was reading every day. I had my head on the sentence. But what I mean is, obviously, when I say I felt all right,

obviously I was panicked. I was waiting for them to leave the door open one day. Every time I heard the prison screws, I got by the door ready. Because I thought, if you open that door, I need to be ready for who's coming in that door. So I was totally on edge the whole time. OK, OK. Totally on edge. I was a wreck, probably. Yeah. Totally on edge. I was a wreck probably.

Yeah, yeah. Well the thing is in a situation like that, you answered my question, in a situation like that, your stress response prepares you for action. And so you'll be okay while that's happening. The problem is, is that when you're doing that, your body is hyper aroused physiologically

and it burns up your future resources. That's when I got out though. Yeah, yeah, that's exactly what happens is that, so all those resources that should be saved for the future, you're burning in the moment. Then when you go somewhere and the stress is lessened, then that response will stop and you'll feel the consequences.

So as I said, I thought I was all right. And I'd lost a lot of weight, so I thought I looked all right. And then after 11 weeks, I had no idea. Tinnivore diet. Yeah, well, I... Tinnituna. Yeah. Tinnituna.

But I was in, and then, and then, and then, bang, bang, bang, bang. My door goes, and there's another prisoner. He said, you're going home. You're going home. I said, what are you talking about? He said, you're going home. It's everywhere. It's all over the news. So how can I be going home?

I've got, I've got 13 months. I've been in there three months, yeah. So how can I be going home? I've got 13 months, I've been in there three months. So how can I be going home? And it had gone to the Court of Appeal, but my solicitor didn't tell me. My solicitor, I said, I didn't want to get your hopes up. Everything they'd done was unlawful. Everything they'd done was unlawful. But because of what my lawyers have seen with my cases, we didn't want to tell you you're going to get out. We've looked at it, you didn't get asked to plead guilty or not guilty. No due process was followed in court. But it took them 11 weeks or 12 weeks to get before the judge. So when they got before the judge,

the judge said, let free him. Get him out of prison. So then I remember I had such a dry throat because then they got me up and I was due, it's mad because I always book a holiday a year in advance, which is the problem I've got coming up now as well. I always book a holiday a year in advance, which is the problem I've got coming up now as well. I always book a holiday a year in advance for my children. And we were meant to go on holiday, we were going on holiday to Tenerife the next day.

So when they got me out at lunchtime, obviously it's all over the news, I'm going home. So I said, how long until I leave? They said they're just preparing everything now. So I said, can I use the phone? So I rang my solicitor. I said, what's going on? He said, you're free to go, Tommy. You're free to go. What do you mean I'm free to go? Am I under conditions?

He goes, no, you're free. So then I rang my wife, because the holiday's next day. And I said, tell your mom. That must make you thirsty. Yeah, yeah. I think I better have a drink. Tommy, this is what I'm going to do.

So we're running out of time and we're only at 2018. So I would like to continue this. We'll do this another interview. We'll do it remotely and we'll do part two. Okay. Okay. For now, I think what I'll do is I'll ask you to tell me what you're planning in London on the 27th of July.

So 27th of July, you see in the UK, we've turned a corner with the public. There's been a mass awakening. We meaning? We meaning the British public have been made to feel embarrassed of their identity and their culture for too long. We've felt under attack. Since October 7th, there's been a mass awakening. So all the things we've warned about, like every interview I've gave has aged very well

for me. Every issue I've spoke about has come into fruition. Not because I'm a genius, not because I've got anything special, it's because I was born in a town where I witnessed what mass open border Islamic immigration will do. And you told the truth. That's right. That's the other thing. And you told the truth. I've seen it.

So why did you, no, there's a mystery there still. It's not merely a consequence of where you were born. You know, you grew up with good parents. Yeah. That has really been instrumental in your values, right? Yes, I have a father and mother. And your dedication for telling the truth and finding, and having the courage to do what your convictions are.

You have convictions and you go forward and you want to tell the truth and finding and having the courage to do what your convictions are. You have convictions and you go forward and you want to tell the truth. Where does that come from? Probably I said it probably even if I didn't want to because probably if you meet the people I've met and hear the stories I've heard. Okay, see the other thing that happened to me, you see when I was young, 23, a lot younger than that, I started this when I was 13, I started looking at the worst things I could find, right? I started that when I was 13, the first thing I did that was seriously academic was a report on prison guards in Auschwitz. And I spent the rest of my life investigating that,

looking at the worst things I could find. And the thing about we're looking at the worst things is that that horrifies you so badly that I think what it does is scary as straight. Oh, I know, which I tried to have in these conversations with my now ex-wife. If you think you're worried now, I know what the consequences are.

Yeah, right, exactly. I know what's coming. I've got three beautiful children. If anyone's got a fight, I'll fight. They're not fighting. And what our cowardice is currently doing, we've bred a generation of cowards who care about themselves.

And half my friends were the same, I'm all right. I've got enough money, I'm okay. You can't keep running from this problem. This problem isn't going anywhere. That's right. This problem is gonna explode on October 7th. In fact, the longer you run from it, the larger it will be.

The worse the harder it's gonna get. Absolutely. 100%. And on October 7th, In fact, the longer you run from it, the larger it will be. The worse, the harder it's going to get. Absolutely, 100%. October 7th really woke a lot of people up to see, not what happened in Israel, but to see the level of hate in every university, to see that our institutions have been taken over, to see the level of aggression and the celebration from not just a handful,

we're not talking about handfuls of extremists, we're talking about the mainstream. We're talking about the Democrats. Yeah, the Democrats, the Labour Party, and we've seen a massive, so there's been a real wake up and my messages, if I go through them every day, are full of people who said, I hated you. I thought you was a thug, I thought you was.

And I'm not perfect, yeah, and I've made mistakes because that's human, and what I've done a whole way through my activism and my career and now my journalism is whenever they've tried to stop me talking, I think, no, that's not like, if you tell me not to do something, I will do it. That's wasting my weight. It's my character, yeah? Yeah. And I'm right. And I remember my wife's dad saying, stop, please stop. Like, you don't see the danger here. I said, am I wrong? Am I wrong? Yeah.

No. So why should I stop? What, because they're threatening us? Because they're trying to intimidate us. So every bit of police threaten this incident in Canada. Well, that doesn't deter me. You lock me up, even if you want to put me in jail. It's not going to deter me. If you're going to put me in prison now for this film, and I can't understand they make the same mistakes every time. Yeah, it's amazing. You lock me up for this film. I hope every single person in the world talks about it.

Yeah, right. I hope you bring more eyes for this film, yeah? I hope every single person in the world talks about it. Yeah, right. I hope you bring more eyes to that film. So I'll go to jail. Jail for me is a terrifying... I might not come out of that prison sentence, and if I do, I'm going to do solitary confinement, which is going to fry my head. But I've gone through 15 years of this, yeah?

And I am committed to it. And I think that when I say they, they have underestimated the human spirit and certainly the British spirit, yeah? And what you saw... I hope so. What you have underestimated the human spirit and certainly the British spirit. And what you saw on the 1st of June was the British spirit. And what you're gonna see on July 27th is the- What are we going to see on July 27th? You're gonna see the largest gathering

of unified British public that they've seen. And when I say unified, they like to separate us and divide us. Like my politics and my, since starting the English Defence League has always been open to everyone. I don't care if you come into Great Britain yesterday, you love this country and you want to protect it, come and join us. And we saw, so whilst they've tried to label us as racist, extremists, it doesn't work. Their monopoly in their power has gone. And we saw that on June the 1st with the different diverse backgrounds

that come up to celebrate British identity, yeah? Which is what being British is about. And we're going to celebrate it on July 27th. Two days later, they believe they're going to lock me up. And the problem they have now, I had a recent court case on 26th of November. You may have seen me arrested in London at the anti-Semitism rally, which the world saw me do nothing wrong, yeah?

They come and tell me I wasn't allowed to report. Now years ago, like when the media got up and walked out of court, they could do that. Now we have citizen journalists. Thank you, John Musk. Thank you, John Musk. Because in my court case, in whatever court case now, there will be a row of the most influential citizen journalists

who will be live to it in every single word. So they can't control the narrative anymore. Not in a minute. Not since people have got platforms and voices again. So on July 27th, you're going to see the largest gathering. We have three of the largest screens in the UK being put up in Trafalgar Square. We know everyone wants us to fail. We knew that on June the 1st.

We didn't fail. It was a total success. July 27th will be a total success. If all I care about, and that's why I said this may be the most important interview I give, is that freedom of press, freedom of speech, freedom of assembly have gone, okay? They're gone.

We have a controlled media, totally controlled media. You challenge any narrative. This isn't just open border immigration. You go against transgenderism. You challenge any of them. Yes, I've noticed. They're coming for you. They're coming for you,

and they wish to seek and control everything. They wish to- I saw the WF're coming for you. They're coming for you. And they wish to seek control everything. They wish to. I saw the WEF put out an ad, I don't exactly know when they released it, telling people not to launder their jeans more than once a month. Right, because yeah, it produces too much carbon dioxide. Right, t-shirts too, by the way.

Which is everything. You can wash your underwear more regularly according to the WEF. Those bastards will seek to control absolutely everything that people do. And all the jigsaw is fitting together, because everything we've spoke about all fits in with this total element of control, yeah?

They want to, and unfortunately, when I was deplatformed for five years off of every single social media, yeah? Every single social media, I made a documentary called Panorama, okay? Now Panorama are the BBC's most investigative journalists hit piece. When they were doing a documentary on me, I sent a girl undercover into them, yeah? And they had no idea, okay? I got them making up sexual allegations against me on covert recording, yeah? I got them, Sir John Sweeney was

the head of Panorama, yeah? I produced this documentary. Their program about me never come out. I produced this documentary. He was put on gardening leave. When I talk about the controlled media, when I got these covert recordings, he was telling, he sat someone down and said, say this about Tommy Robinson, and do we have an agreement? And it was one of my ex-employees, but they didn't know we were recording it. So they were telling them what to say. There was script in the entire programme.

How many other of these programmes have been scripted? There was script in the entire programme. When they other of these programmes have been scripted? There was script in the entire programme. When they come to interview me and I sat down like this, I put a video wall behind me and I said to the panorama, would you ever tell anyone what to say? No, press play. On the wall behind me, the covert recording of him making agreements on what to say.

Sexual allegations. Now, if they would have been successful, my life would have been destroyed. My kids would have had to go to school with their father as a Harvey Weinstein. But I produced this documentary. Within 48 hours of producing that documentary, I was blacklisted of every social media. And I was recharged by the government.

This case that's coming up against me now is the government. It's not the police, it's the government, the attorney general. Now, Facebook and Metta, the entire Metta made me a figure of hate, which meant if you mention my name, you get to lead. And they were so, because you see, again, my investigative documentary work is fabulous. It exposes them and they deleted me. And for five years, I was disappeared.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Until Elon Musk gave me back my voice. Right. In those five years. I think it, I don't know who got back first, you or me. I don't remember. I think I might've got back first, you or me, I don't remember. I think I might've got back first. Means I'm somewhat less controversial than you. So congratulations.

So Tam, do you have, we should wrap up and we will continue. No, I don't have any questions. You don't have any questions. No, I just want to thank you. I really want to thank you for coming. Yeah, so maybe let me ask you a question. I mean, you, I've been following Tommy for quite a while,

but you were quite instrumental in arranging this discussion. So why did you do that? Why? Very long time ago and supporting you as well. Why did I want to do it? Yeah. Yeah. Why do you trust him?

Why do I trust him? I don't know. I had a pretty disagreeable Irish father and he was a smart ass. You know? And I trust Donald Trump. I trusted Donald Trump all along too. I don't know.

I just, I know when... I like men who have values that they'll stand by and they are brave and say what they mean. I think we need men to stand up and I need, we need men to stand up, and we need women to figure out their crap because we're causing a lot of trouble.

And I'm going to try to help with that. I think we need to remember who we are. Well, so one of the things that's, maybe we'll close with this. One of the things that I'm very interested in, this is part of the reason why I was interested in you, is because you are a working class leader. And the working class, when angry,

can go very, very badly wrong. And so, but the working class anger, when it's justified, is absolutely necessary. Because, you know, one of the things I've thought about you and your guys is that when push comes to shove, you'll stand up and that's something. Now the trick is gonna be, and also on July 27th, to keep that managed.

You know, the Canadian truckers did a very good job of that. They kept the spirit of that protest very positive. I don't know how much chance you've had to talk with some of the lead organizers. I met Mara Leach. I've been here, I've met them. Yeah, I've met them. She actually said to say hi to you guys.

I found her story. I found it good. I found myself quite lucky that I'm getting to leave Canada after hearing what they've done to her, Pastor Afa, after hearing what they've done to all of them. So we talked a little bit about the necessity of the working class standing up and making their position known. The danger that that turns into a like a vindictive populism and gets taken over by the psychopathic community. This was something I worried about at the end of the trucker convoy.

They stopped in time, eh? They stopped before the real predators and parasites showed up to take over. And so they did that brilliantly. It was very well-timed, very peaceful, very harmonious. And it ended at the right time. One of the things we're trying to do in the UK and elsewhere is to put together a positive vision for the West, for the future. Because the other danger of that populist uprising

is that it's all reactionary, you know, to use the left wing phrase, that it's all pushing back against and angry instead of putting forward a positive vision. And the thing about working class men is they need a, every man needs a positive vision. And so that's something else we should talk about. If I could send you what we've worked and what we've said is we need a cultural movement in the UK. Yeah.

We need a cultural movement that celebrates identity and celebrates who we are and brings everyone together. Yeah, right. All that feed. Right. We've wrote like a 10 point pledge, a pledge that we want the public to take to be part of the movement. Well, let's talk about that. Let's talk, bring, when we talk again,

let's talk about that pledge. And I can discuss what we're doing with ARC as well. Because that's what we were hoping to launch on the 27th. It was about saying, if we change the culture, we change the politics, okay? Yeah. Let's show them that we control it. Yeah, yeah.

And you're right about this, like for years, people have tried to align themselves and purity comes with time. Our support base now is totally mainstream, totally normal. You'll see the best of British in London. What we have to make sure, people will want us to fail. Yeah, well, and who knows what kind of instigators will be there too.

But we have enough men now that if people turn up wearing all black, wanting to instigate problems, we'll put them in place ourselves. We told the police at last demonstration, stay away. Stay away, let us please ourselves. Because if anyone wants to step out of line, our own people know we'll put them in line.

That's the idea, and the idea is to have fun. We've got a church choir band singing. We're having a celebration. Art is a good idea, to bring art and music into it, because that sets a good tone. I've asked Tomorrow Leech to come and sing as well. Oh yeah, okay. I've asked her to come and sing.

Okay. That's always insane. July 27th, eh? Yeah, hey, if you can be there. Do you know what this is the story of so much now? It's ordinary people trying to do extraordinary things because we shouldn't have to be doing this. We should not, we should be-

Oh no, no, no. We should be doing this. Ordinary people aren't as ordinary as they think. You're a good example of that. You leave that extraordinary stuff to the leaders, you get tyrants. Which is what we've got now. Yeah.

Yeah. And essentially this is across the whole of the West. And that's what I said with men, we need to remember who we are. Yes, that's right. And if we had pride in who we were, we wouldn't have allowed any of these abuses to happen. None of this would have been allowed to happen,

but they've took our pride, they've took our identity, well they did take it. I felt something, I'll end this on, I went to the 100 year anniversary of Polish independence, and when I walked at the front of it, the hundreds of thousands of them, I felt something, I felt the hairs on the back of my neck, I felt an energy that I went home gutted about because they have such, because they were off the map for over 100 years, because they've continually had to fight, it's ingrained in their people to understand the importance of who they are and their identity. And our new generation don't know this, yeah? So I went home pretty upset thinking, where has that gone in Britain?

And I felt it on 1st of June. And I feel it now. And I think the British public are feeling it and feeling the sense of identity, the sense of pride and the sense of coming together to certainly tell the establishment enough's enough here, yeah? We're not sitting by silently anymore. So yeah, exciting times, but scary times. I want to do July 27th and then,

and then I hope that public opinion, they've weaponized, the courts and the judiciary have been weaponized against me. I hope to weaponize the public opinion against them. So if you do want to send me a jail and lock me up for two years, let the world know what it's about. So part of the problem with getting the working class aroused, let's say, in anger, is that that can degenerate into a, like a vengeful response that doesn't have an aim. And so what has to be associated with that is something approximating a positive vision

to make sure that everyone's aligned and upward aligned and to provide the proper replacement to the ethos, let's say that the Islamic fundamentalist psychopaths, and that's not all Muslims by any stretch of the imagination are putting forward. So what are you thinking about with regards to vision? So our vision, so we've got probably 10 of the main influencers in the UK around politics and culture coming together to come to an agreement exactly this in celebrating our identity and how do we stop the erosion of our culture?

What are the 10 principles we can all agree on that we can come together on? We don't have to agree on everything. No one has to agree on everything. We have to agree to defend Great Britain, to defend our culture, to defend our identity. And so that's, we've got an important meeting on the 9th where we come together and the purpose of July 27th was to give the public a vision. So here's our vision. Okay, got it. Well, thank you very much, sir. Thank you, Tammy. Thank you. Thank you for ever so much as well for... It's a good beginning, eh? Yeah.

Yeah. I'll do what I can to be there on the ninth. Thank you. So, okay. And so to everybody watching on YouTube, thank you very much for your time and attention, the film crew here in Toronto. That's much appreciated as well.

To the Daily Wire for putting together the resources to make this possible and to staying the hell out of the way, which they're very, very good at, which is quite the skill. That's much appreciated as well. Thank you, sir. Good to meet you. Thank you, Tapp. Thank you so much.

Thanks. Thank you. Thank you.