The Jordan Harbinger Show - 262: Tip "T.I." Harris | ExpediTIously Expressive

Episode Date: October 10, 2019

T.I. (@Tip) is an award-winning rapper, actor, entrepreneur, family man, philanthropist, author, activist, and host of expediTIously on PodcastOne. What We Discuss with T.I.: Why T.I. went from selling candy to selling crack as a teenager, and how he turned away from a life of crime to pursue a life of rhyme. How does an award-winning rapper, actor, entrepreneur, family man, philanthropist, author, activist, and podcast host celebrate a landmark birthday? T.I.'s world-tested secrets to releasing an album and filming an unauthorized music video while serving time in prison. How T.I. walks the line between excess and moderation when it comes to everything from music to jewelry to tequila. Does T.I. feel tension between setting a good example for kids and community, and staying on top of the rap game? And much more... Full show notes and resources can be found here: https://jordanharbinger.com/262 Sign up for Six-Minute Networking -- our free networking and relationship development mini course -- at jordanharbinger.com/course! Join entrepreneur, technology investor, and self-experimenter Kevin Rose as he explores new ways to reach peak personal and professional performance on The Kevin Rose Show -- listen here! Like this show? Please leave us a review here -- even one sentence helps! Consider including your Twitter handle so we can thank you personally!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This episode is sponsored in part by Conspiruality Podcast. You know how I'm always talking about critical thinking and spotting manipulation? Well, there's a podcast that's all about dismantling new age cults, wellness grifters, and conspiracy mad yogis, basically the wild overlap of spirituality and misinformation. It's called the Conspiruality Podcast. The hosts, a journalist, cult researcher, and a philosophical skeptic dive deep into how this stuff spreads, from Project 2025 and the Heritage Foundation's dystopian vision of the future to how former leftists get pulled in. to far-right conspiracies. An interesting episode to check out is called Speaking Truth to Goop, where Jen Gunter breaks down the pseudoscience behind the wellness industry in a way that is super entertaining

and eye-opening. It's sharp, funny, and makes you a lot harder to fool, which if you listen to this show, you know I'm all about that. From exploring cults to analyzing our cultural and political landscape, the Conspiruality podcast will help you stay informed against misinformation and resist fear tactics. Find Conspirality on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and wherever you get your podcasts. role officer must have been like, oh, great, he's got a record deal. All right, he's going to be back at the airport in like a month and a half. You are on thin ice, man. I mean, to be honest, with you, he

didn't find out I wasn't at the airport until I told him. He still thinks he worked at the airport. Like, I see this, this rap guy my kids listen to. He looks familiar. It's like that guy that works at the airport. Where's Harris? Yeah. Look at this Harris file. Welcome to the show. I'm Jordan Harbinger. As always, I'm here with producer Jason DeFilippo. On the Jordan Harbinger show, we decode the stories, secrets and skills of the world's most brilliant and interesting people, and turn their wisdom into practical advice that you can use to impact your own life and those around you. Today, T.I. or Tip Harris has been a staple in the hip-hop and trap game for the past

15 years. He's an acclaimed innovator. Millions of albums sold more than 35 million singles. He's been awarded three Grammys, 11 Billboard, three BETT Awards, two American Music Awards, and more all throughout the years. He's worked with Drake, Beyonce, Ferrell, Rihanna, Jay-Z, Lil Wayne, Robin Thick, M.A., Lady Gaga, among other icons. And today on the show, we explore the tension between setting a good example for kids and community and staying on top and relevant in the rap game. We also dive into TI's past as a drug dealer and his uneasy relationship with the authorities and now his focus on community service and activism.

I wasn't expecting to enjoy this one as much as I did. And I'm glad we made it happen because it was a really good time and an interesting conversation. or maybe that's the tequila talking, you'd be the judge of that. If you want to know how I managed to book all these great folks and manage my relationships using systems and tiny habits in six minutes a day or thereabouts, check out our six minute networking course. It's free. It's over at Jordan Harbinger.com slash course.

And by the way, most of the guests on the show, they subscribe to the course and the newsletter. So come join us. You'll be in great company. Okay, here's TI. Authenticity is big in, like, hip hop culture. Like, that's a whole thing. And I know you've mentioned that.

a bunch actually yourself. But what do you think about hip hop going from a lot of truth, untold stories of the people who perform it and things like that? And now it's like there's a lot of flashy, braggy stuff. I'm not saying, I like the watch. I think it's dope, but there's a lot of guys they only talk about the watch. That's all they got.

Well, I think, for one, hip hop has become so expensive. You know what I mean? It's grown and evolved into an amoeba of things, you know? So I think that there is a place for that, although that place may not be in my particular library of music on a normal basis. But then again, there are sometimes where I feel like that kind of energy would kind of suit the mood of the evening for me. So, I mean, I don't necessarily shun it.

I just know it has to be done. It has to be kind of enjoyed within moderation. Sure. It's not there to lead, direct, and inspire the culture. But it is that entertain. You know, it is there to, I guess, enlighten. It's there for aspiration. Now, if you're talking about a bunch of jury and your jury is fake, however,

that is something I would have a very, very, very genuine disdain for. Although it is very practical. Like that diamond right there, you might want to have a fake one of those just in case somebody lifts that thing. No, I just have insurance on this one. Okay. That's okay. That makes sense, too. I mean, but all of these things, these things are just things.

Yeah. You know what I'm saying? I feel like these things are just things and they're ornaments of sorts. And along the way, I've afforded myself certain items of luxury that most people, from a practicality standpoint, may feel like, yo, this is excessive. And maybe they're right. However, I know people who may not have even made as much money as me who have far more. You know, so I think that I kind of, I tread the line between excessive and moderate.

Yeah. Speaking of moderation, I saw that them lay out tequila and snacks for you out there. And I said, what? You do that for TI and I don't get any snacks. I mean, but did you request any? No. Now it makes sense, right? If you don't get it. Right. Yeah, you don't ask, you don't get it. You get 100% of nothing that you ask for. That's true. Yeah. Yeah. Although I did notice that it's Don Julio. What happened to Petron on Ice? You know what, man? That was actually, Like, at the time I made that, I couldn't really drink. At all. I couldn't drink.

You know, it was part of my pre-release, excuse me. Probation? Yeah, yeah, my pre-sentencing bond restriction. Ah, okay. You know what I mean? Part of that was not drinking. So Petron sounded like just as good of a drink as any, but now that I can drink and I really, really care about, you know, how something tastes.

And if I would like it and the quality of it, I find that I myself prefer 1942 over, a bottle of Blanco Patrol. What time to usually start? Should do one right now. See, that's the thing. Oh yeah, absolutely. Yeah, there's no time limit. Amanda, can we?

Yeah, let's do that. Yeah, absolutely. That's the best thing about not having a boss. You can, you know, you can turn up in any given moment. That's right. Yeah, that's right. I'm making some notes here. I gotta have deeper entourage snacks on deck and Don Julio on it.

This is the thing. You can't just go and take everything gets face value. You know, you gotta dig beneath the surface. See, I do have an entourage. There are several people here with me, but all of them serve the purpose. So you must have a purpose for entourage. Everybody must have an obligation to task or duty or responsibility.

You did? You just have people running around sucking up your budget of expenses for nothing. That makes sense. You know what I mean? So all these guys are ROI positive somehow? Yes, absolutely. What do they do? Like, I mean, they're nice.

I have a photographer there. I have my assistant there. I have my cousin who is also an artist there. I have my co-branding marketing strategist there. I believe is there security end there? There may be a security guy there. They all kind of look like they could be security, though. Yeah, but they're not, though.

There's only one guy designated for security. You know what I'm saying? And even him, if he don't have a firearm, they start shooting. He's going to be running with the rest of us. That's right. Yeah, no kidding. No kidding. Yeah, I feel you there.

I know you actually, you're no stranger to that, though. You dropped out of high school, spent early years as a drug dealer, arrested several times before you turn 14, which actually, to me, is insane. That means that you're not doing that for street credit at age 12, 13, 14 years old. Nah, that was kind of like a means to an end. I was more so a victim of circumstance, a product of my environment at that moment in time. We can do that.

Bring it in. Ice, please. Oh, yeah. All right, so we'll wait for the ice. So you're a victim of circumstance. I mean, I don't want to call, I don't even want to call myself a victim. Let's say a product of circumstance. Product of my environment.

I'm a refugee. of the war on drugs. You know what I'm saying? Refugee, as in like it came to you. Exactly. It was broke to me. You know what I'm saying? I am a survivor of the crack era, you know,

and I feel like anyone who came up when I came up who lived where I lived, like for the most part, 99% of us, we got in the mix because that's what it was for us to do. And I'm not proud of it, but a lot of the principles and values and morals and code of conduct, that I'm praised for today came from those times and those experiences.

Yeah. Yeah. I know you got your birthday coming up. We're the same age. So I remember. I know. I mean, what's your birthday? February 26.

February 26. So you're at the top of the year. That's right. Okay, cool. So you're about to be 39 next year. I'll be 40 next year. 40 this February. That's right.

Good God bless you. Thank you. Yeah, I got that baby face. Amen. That's the thing like on your 39th birthday, right? What the fuck is there to do? None. There's nothing really like, man, I just hold out to next year.

Mm-hmm. You know what I'm saying? There's no need to have a big bash this year. Oh, yeah, you're going to just re, you're going to double down next year. What are you going to do for your 40th birthday? Ah, man, it's going to be extravagant. I don't really like extravagant parties and stuff like that. I've done so many of them.

And I feel like the more you do next year, the more you do. Yeah, you have. And the next year, the more you do. And you get to a point where the bubble bus is like, man, there's nothing else to do. Yeah. So I just kind of gave myself a little minute to kind of humble down and, you know what I mean? Just let it neutral out. So now on my 40th, I'm gonna do something big.

Nice. Usually on my birthdays, I do something private, you know what I'm saying, for me and the people around me. We might go travel. I'm thinking about South of France or something like that. People there must be like what's happening when you roll in with everything, from the entourage, the family, to all your,

people must be like, who is that all the time? Sometimes, and I always get the thing like, you know, the thing that they do, which is funny to me, they'll come up to me and they'll apologize. I'm sorry, I don't know who you. I don't know who you are. That's not your fault. Yeah.

You know what I mean? I actually appreciate that I can go somewhere where you can just, you know, appreciate me for me or whoever you or whatever you think I am. I don't really like, you know what I'm saying, people put on fake faces just because they think that I could be their one-shotted success. Oh, I'm a huge fan. Oh, really? Of what?

And then kind of what people see other people take pictures? Like if a fan come up and say, hey, I love your music, I love your movies. I would love to take a picture and I take a picture with them. with them and then somebody else come up and listen i don't know who you are but can i have a picture too yeah just why do you want a picture because they're gonna put it on instagram and people be like oh that's who that is that lacks authenticity that's why i really i have a i'm discouraged from doing that i know that you i mean you had kind of a weird up and down right because you were supposed to perform at bt hip-hop awards you get popped for like weapons charges and hours before that and a lot

of people go october 13th october 13th 2007 yeah wow you still still remember the date. Yeah. I mean, at some point, people are like, this guy can't get it together. You know, what's going on here? Well, guess what? That present moment in time,

they may have been right. You know what I'm saying? But there are a lot of determining factors that were in play that people don't know about. And some people, unless you're in the know, you still won't know about it. Well, when I heard about that, people go, oh, man, what's this guy doing?

He can't keep it together. And I think if you're 27, 28, whatever it was at the time, and you're buying a bunch of weapons, you probably think that you need them. You're not doing it. Or I've been instructed by people who you put in position for protection that you need.

Yeah. Yeah, I think that's the thing that people don't really understand. Like, you know, I was kind of, I don't want to say, coerced by my security at the time to, you know, upgrade my level of equipment. And every time I upgraded my equipment, he wouldn't have purchased it, but he purchased it for much less than he told me that it would cost.

Oh, right. You know what I mean? So it behooved him to continue to motivate me to buy more equipment. Right. And he said this in his statement, you know what I mean? As I got my discovery and I read through my discovery and kind of just kind of read how the case unfolded, it was really him asking the man at the gun store if he could get the same items for half price under the table. That's what he... Oh, so his side hustle was skimming cash off your defense budget.

Right. So he asked that guy that that guy called the ATF. When the ATF gets to him, he tells the ATF, well, it's not for me. It's for my boss. Right. And I guess the ATF say, oh, hell yeah, that would be a much better headline. Yeah. Oh, I'm going to get promoted now.

Yeah, exactly. And so, you know, here they come to the Walgreens on the day of the awards. What I found interesting, oh, sorry, Amanda. Yeah, please. Yeah. Let's expedite this ice. There you all, sir. Oh, thank you.

Now where I'm from, we do what we call pouring our own troubles. All right. So you basically give yourself the amount, the amount that you need? Yeah. There we go. I don't have to drive. I can't blame me for your debauchery. I don't have to drive, but I am a wimp. Cheers.

All right. I thank you for having me here on your part, man. They told me that you have one of the most kick-ass ones around. They are full of shit. But I appreciate them covering for me. I like that. What I felt interesting about this was you get pop for that, but then there's a plea deal in it's,

hey, I need to stay out of prison for one year because I'm mentoring 58 at-risk children. No, no, no, no. Oh, sorry, at 58 schools. Yeah, see, no, that wasn't necessarily, it wasn't me saying I need to stay out for a year. It was them saying, I tell you what, if you want to earn this downward departure, we will give you one year to complete these tasks while staying completely out of trouble, keeping your nose clean.

At the end of that one year, you will come back for sentencing, and we will grant your downward departure, and you'll have a year and a day. I mean, there's something massively admirable in that you not only completed that, but you didn't go, all right, I'm done with my community service. You're involved in politics and civic life now. I saw that result panel with Candace Owens. That went smoothly. What happened there? Man, Candice is a brilliant, she has a brilliant mind, and she has some formidable concepts. However, I feel that her brilliance has fallen into the wrong hands and is being used for the wrong purpose.

I just think it's incredibly damaging and irresponsible to spew the type of rhetoric that she tossed around. but that does not pin me or place me against Candice specifically. She's still a sister. I still respect her. I still have love for. I just, as I said, I thought she was, you know, she's just on some bullshit at that present moment, you know what I mean? But this is not, that wasn't our first time meeting.

That wasn't our first discussion. It probably won't be at last. I just think that, you know, if she could use her brilliance for something other than covering for the inaccuracies or just the diabolical intentions of the president, the divisiveness of the president. It's not even about the Republican party. I don't have a problem with you being a Republican. I'm not arguing on behalf of the Democratic Party.

I'm not a Democrat. I'm not a Republican. I'm a rich person from the ghetto. So that's kind of like an oxymor. Yeah. Like I have Republican interests. I also have Democrat interests because I come from the place where you're a rich person. where people who depend on Democrats to do what they need to do the service to community.

And if they don't do that, then we end up a situation as like I was in. You know what I mean? And but the Democrats have also done things that put people in the situation that I was in. Okay. However, right now, I'm a man with money. And there are certain fringe benefits, perks and, you know, things that I could benefit from personally from the Republican Party. However, that's not worth my self-respect. Now, that's not worth it.

Yeah, you're the one that has to go to bed. That's not absolutely. And more than I want anything for myself, for my children, even for Candice. I want to be on the right side of history. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? In 25, 30 years from now, when we look back, we're going to remember how horrible things were right now. We're going to remember where everybody stood in this face of adversity.

I just don't want my legacy to be. I just let it happen because it was beneficial for me. Yeah, got a good tax break, didn't look at it again. Yeah, I mean, you've said most black people, at least where I'm from, we don't get to go to college, we go to prison. That's a pretty crappy outlook for somebody growing up in your neighborhood. Mind you. Even though it costs less to send us to college than it does for us to be in prison. You're listening to The Jordan Harbinger Show with our guest, Ti.

We'll be right back. Thanks for listening and supporting the show. And to learn more and get links to all the great discounts you just heard from our amazing sponsors, visit Jordan Harbinger.com slash deals. Don't forget we have a worksheet for today's episode so you can make sure you solidify your understanding of the key takeaways from TI. That link is in the show notes at Jordan Harbinger.com slash podcast. If you like some tips on how to subscribe to the show, just go to Jordan Harbinger.com slash subscribe. Subscribing to the show is absolutely free. It just means that you get all of the latest episodes downloaded automatically to your podcast player so you don't miss a single thing.

And now back to our show with TI. You know, you said just because I fell in something, it doesn't mean. I have to stay down in it. So you've got obviously a lot of upward mobility that you saw within yourself. I mean, when you were that age, were you thinking, oh, I'm just going to sell drugs for a while that I'm going to become a famous musician. Well, to be perfectly a candid with you, that's exactly what I was thinking. Really? At what age is that? I started it, I started rapping at about age eight or nine in third grade. And then I was just doing it like, how? Who was your inspiration back then, actually? L.L. Cool, J. Oh, of course. Yeah. NWA, too short.

the most provocative, the most prolific voices of the time. Sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off. You were saying that was the plan the whole time. That was the plan. I was going to sell drugs until I earned myself the opportunity or found my way to the opportunity to become a musician or an artist. How did you even find out about crack? Like, it's all around you, but somebody must have been like...

I do, absolutely. I used to sell candy. So I'm an entrepreneur by nature. I started off in fourth grade, selling candy. Because I used to travel from Atlanta to New York. York to visit my father every summer. The end of every summer, my dad would give me maybe $3,400, you know, and some school clothes sent me back home to live with my mama. My mama lived in the ghetto, Section 8, Food, Stamps, and Welfeld. So I knew that I had to

stretch this $3,400 until Christmas when I'd see my dad again and get another bank road. So what way could I do that? The only thing that I thought, it was a candy lady in my neighborhood, in my apartments, there was a candy lady. It was all, no matter what apartments we moved to, there was always a candy lady. But when I went to school, there was no candy person. So I figured, hey, I take the same principles of the candy lady, and I just go to school, and I make me $20 a day. That'll be $100 a week, and that's $400 a month.

And that ought to stretch me from September to December. $20. It has a lot of candy. It is. It is. And then he saw the margins on crack. I had an operation. By the time I got the sixth grade, my candy operation had evolved to where I had other people

working for me three or four lockers. People selling candy for me on different hallways. And, you know, I might have made $3,400 a week. This business model does sound familiar for anybody who's watched the wire or grew up in your neighborhood. Three, 400, maybe $500 a week. And I'm walking to my bus stop and I see an older gentleman who was probably in high school or something. We used to throw the football around every now and again. So I knew who he was, but I also knew he didn't ride my bus.

So I was questioning like, what you're doing out here right now? And he's like, yo, I'm hustling. And I was like, what do you mean? And that's when he introduced me to crack. He was like, well, he had what you call breakdown dimes. Breakdown dimes is if you buy it for $10, you're supposed to be able to break it in two or three pieces and make $20 or $30 off of $10.

Those profit margins, that's 200% profit. I'm into that. Yeah. So that very day, I took $50 and bought me five breakdown dimes and broke him in half. I made $100 before I got back home. I mean, I can certainly understand the appeal of that. How did you switch from the life of crime

to the life of rhyme? Oh, my God. I hate myself right now. I hate myself right now. Hey, man, no, but it makes perfect sense. As cliche as it may sound, it makes perfect sense. But what happened was I gave my team an ultimatum. I found out my girlfriend at the time was pregnant with my oldest son.

I just gotten out of a case where I escaped with seven years of probation. It was a crack case. Possession would intent to distribute in 1997. The case was resolved in 98. but I found out she was pregnant and I had no real means to kind of support. Can't support a kid on candy sales. Nah. Well, you know, I was a complete lot of school at the time.

However, what I told myself was, okay, so for these eight months, I'm just going to dive into a covert operation, man, go balls to the wall with the game and just knock me up maybe about $30,000, $50,000. And I'd be able to fall back, make sure my child has everything that he needs and get myself somewhere stable and safe to stay. and then I'd be able to follow back and maybe I could figure it out from there. So that was my plan.

Simultaneously, a team that I had assembled, become a part of, I should say, and that team consisted of Jason Jeter, who has been my partner and he was my manager for a long period of time. DJ Toonk, who produced a lot of my initial hits and helped me introduce trap music to the world. And my cousin, Tremel.

And Tremel is no longer with us. God bless his soul. But we were a team. We planned to go in the studio. We had been working on a demo to shop around. And it was phenomenal stuff. But we just hadn't got it in the right person's hands as of yet. And they found out what I was doing because I didn't tell them of my plans.

So they found out what I was doing. So they kind of called me into somewhat of an intervention. And they say, hey, listen, we're investing our time, effort, energy, and resources into you. And you're jeopardizing that investment by taking the risk that you're taking. just giving you on probation, if you get caught doing what you're doing, you're already on seven years of probation. You're going to be gone for seven years and everything's down the drain. I say, yes, but I have a child on the way. And a child ain't going to look up and see my efforts.

He's going to see what we have or what we don't have. So if you could take me somewhere right now where I can have an opportunity to present myself to somebody that could actually give me a record deal, then I'll stop. And so everybody said, well, that's not realistic. That's not how it works. It's not exactly. It's not how it works. And Jason said, I know somewhere. And I say, see, that's why we're on the team again.

So basically he took me to a studio that he interned for us, a studio in Atlanta called Patchwork. In that studio, he just happened to hear over here conversations from the group, PA, it was a part of organized noise, the dungeon family. But they were working on their own project. And they were just like saying that they were looking for new talent. They were looking for new talent. And he called up there. He said, hey, I got somebody who hired an interview.

about of the child or never the child got on your album right now and anybody that you don't seen in recent history and they say we'll bring them up so we pull up we walk in and I look around I'm like damn this it was eerily close to where I sold dope at it was maybe three miles away but I'd never been here and I didn't know about it so when I walk in and look around I'm like god damn right onto your nose the whole time what what how did I not know about this Jason walked me in the room and then immediately I meet Reese and Mello And, you know, they asked me questions, you know, just like, you know, where you're from, what you do, you know, who am I? And what do I represent, so on and so forth.

I guess they called this up, put me on the spot. They said, can you rap to this beat? Oh, no pressure. And very arrogantly, I was like, man, where is the booth? So I go in the booth, I do it, lay it down, maybe like one take, two takes, and everybody go crazy. And then when I walk back into control room, they're like, where have you been? I'm like, man, I ride my bike, like three miles up the road selling crack all day. And so then they kind of gate, they could...

Apparently you guys don't buy enough crack, because I'm on the corner selling it. And from that point forward, I never look back. That's amazing. So you literally had to just jump on it? So you're practicing what, in your head while you're selling crack or out loud on the street? I mean, what are you practicing? Man, honestly, man, all I think about it is when we were trapping, it was me and a group of us. And I was the only one who actually knew what I wanted to do.

I actually knew I could visualize where I could see myself. I'd sit down with a pen and pad on like a stoop As everybody else standing up talking shit, Smoking, Rifa. I talked shit, smoked refo and did everything else that everybody else did. But every now and then when the thought came to my head, I sit down, I jopped down whether it was a full page, just an idea for me to remember in the finish later.

And sometimes I would miss money. People would say, man, you just miss $50 sitting down with that pad. You know, and I missed my money. I didn't make as much as everybody all the time, but who's missing money now? Yeah, yeah. Long-term strategy. Dude, this is off topic, but whatever.

Are you teeth real? They're so white. There's no way that those have to be... Sure. What? You got a good DNA, man. Sure. I mean, I have done some significant straightening and some fixing.

There were some chips and things. But they were completely white. Yeah. They match the sign behind you. That comes from high levels of whitening, and I've kind of damaged my enamored in certain places. And sometimes, you know, hot and cold kind of. gets to me, maybe more than yours.

Yeah. You can be stronger than mine, but mine are whiter than yours. That's right. That is, and it will probably always be that way. That's damn sure. While serving 11 months in prison, he releases seventh album No Mercy.

I see this on Wikipedia or wherever I got this from. How do you release music while you're in prison? I mean, I probably shouldn't be surprised Tupac is dead and still releases music, but you're probably the only guy that gets in trouble in prison for working. Well, no, I didn't get in trouble. Oh, they said that you got in trouble for that somehow.

No, I didn't get in trouble for it. No, there's no way for me to get in trouble for it. But the way you release music in prison is you complete it before you turn yourself in. Okay. The judge sentenced me to a year and a day, but he had to, after your sentence, if you're on bond, you don't just go straight to jail. So you wait for a message in the mail where they tell you, this is where you're designated. This is when you should be there. I see what it was.

You filmed an unauthorized music video, whatever that is? That's not when I was in prison. That was another time. That was back in 2004, maybe. Okay, because it says while in prison in Cobb, County, Georgia, he filmed an unauthorized music. That was in prison. That was really like a probation violation. That was county jail.

Because I'm like, who gets in trouble for working? That was in county jail. And, you know, I was allowed and granted permission to come into Fulton County Jail, and I shot a video. I shot a video that was, it was really only supposed to be for the introduction to my show because I was just getting out of jail. I was in work release, but everybody thought I was still locked up. So there was a big show, like an annual radio bash.

Like it was called Birthday Bash. It's on Hot 107-9 in Atlanta. And the biggest thing in the world was everybody knew I was locked up. No one was expecting me to come. But I was on work release, and they were going to allow me to go. I went to Florida County Jail to film, what would be my prelude right before I came out on stage. You work a ton a lot.

Do you think you're kind of a workaholic? I mean, I feel like you, every time I read about you, it's like, wait, that overlaps with that. Wait, that overlaps with that. Like, you're always busy. There's no, like, where's T.I? It's always like, no, he's doing something. Yeah. I mean, I think that I have a lot of creativity just floating around in my head.

I got more troubles. Hey, man, help yourself. My granddad told me you do the job right the first time. You ain't got to do it. Yeah. It sounds like a smart man. But no, so, okay, so I have so many ideas, so many aspirations, so many things that I feel like I want to do and I feel like I have an opportunity to do that it don't allow me to

rest. Like, I wake up with ideas. I write songs in my sleep. I've written songs in my sleep, literally. Like, I'd be sleep and wake up and was like, yo, I got to record that. If you ever go back to the paper trail, there's a song called What's Up, What's Happen' It? I wrote that song in my sleep. That was a song that woke me up out of my sleep

and made me record it. Do you write it down on a pat? You keep paper and shit. If I intend, don't go back to sleep, I do. But if I record it immediately, then I don't. So you'll get up in the middle of the night and just be like, nope, turn on that recording gear. That is the benefit of having an in-home studio.

For sure, yeah, of course. So you just start rapping on no track or you just put it down and then you're like, all right, I'll work on that later. How does it work in your head? Well, at the time, my engineer, because I was on house arrest, and he kind of knew this about me, I mean, he was just about camped out all the time.

Like, you know what I mean? So you had a producer just living in your house because, like, I can't leave. An engineer. We'd have producers send us tracks. And as we end up working, you know, I just flipped through different tracks and figure out, you know, which one was appropriate for whatever mood or whatever perspective I wanted to speak on at the time. That's incredible. You're obviously a very creative guy.

You're not limited to one niche or one vertical. How do you relax now? You have seven kids. So you have a lot you need to. A lot of steam needs to be blown off, I would imagine. I mean, not really. You know what, even though I have seven kids, I've never been in a position where I felt like, damn, what the fuck is all these kids doing here?

You know what I'm saying? It's like, just like I said with my entourage, all my kids seem to have a different purpose that they serve to the family. Okay. They all play different roles. They all have, they all are different parts of meat. So it's not like seven kids doing the same thing at the same time. It's like each and every last one.

One of them has their own platform, their own perspective. They have their own outlook on life. Their questions are different. Their diets are different. Their wardrobe and the way they approach school is different. All of them, they have different, like very different philosophies. Some were born when you weren't doing as well as you are now, right? Well, I'll tell you what.

I told you that when my son's, my oldest son's mother, which is my first bylaw, biological child. When my oldest son mother told me she was pregnant, I was still selling a crack on a bicycle. By the time he was born, I had a record deal, a apartment, a car, and I didn't look back ever.

So within nine months? Within nine months. You got your shit together. I turned up. Wow. I turned up. Because I was working a job at the airport because I was on probation. I had to have a job for probation. I was working a job at the airport. Quit my job at the airport when I found out that she was pregnant, completely started just, like, head first into the street.

That probably lasted about three or four months, but my probation officer still thought I worked at the airport. So probably about three, four months down the road, that's when they had the intervention. It was about three months into her pregnancy that that intervention took place. And then they took me to see the guys, and probably about three months after that, I was signed. And probably about a month after that, I got my first signing bonus, maybe a month or two. So maybe a month before my son was born, I was straight.

That was really, like, just all faith and hustle. Your parole officer must have been like, oh, great, he's got a record deal. All right, he's going to be back at the airport in like a month and a half. You are on thin ice, man. I mean, to be honest with you, he didn't find out I wasn't at the airport until I told him. still thinks you work at the airport.

Like, I see this rap guy my kids listen to it. He looks familiar. It's like that guy that works at the airport. Where's Harris? Let me look at this Harris file. Oh, it's expired. Hmm, it seems to be doing well. You're listening to the Jordan Harbinger show with our guest, Ti.

We'll be right back after this. Thank you for listening and supporting the show. Your support of our advertisers keeps us on the air. To learn more and get links to all the great discounts you just heard, so you can check out those amazing sponsors, visit jordanharbinger.com slash deals. And don't forget the worksheet for today's episode. That link is in the show notes at Jordan Harbinger.com slash podcast. If you're listening to us in The Overcast Player,

please click that little star next to the episode. We really appreciate it. And now for the conclusion of our episode with Ti. Is there any tension between being a good role model for your kids, being a good role model for the community, and then staying relevant in like, I guess in the rap game? It doesn't always celebrate good behavior, man. Well, I will tell you this.

there's value in honesty. And I never pretended to be perfect for my kids. I'm very honest with them about my past, about my mistakes. I'm very honest with them about the lessons that I've learned and tell stories. Just like I told you this story, I tell them stories about times when my son, you know, he's somewhat of an activist. So he has a, you know, a different, a very conspiracy theorist kind of mentality about himself. Well, he's going to be homies with your boy outside right now. He questions everything, right?

So he always tells me, you know, Dad, you have to. I say, hey, listen, son. When I was in sixth grade, I was suspended and sent home for refusing to stand for the pledge. Really? Yeah. So I was the, and then. You're the original Colin Kaepernick. You did?

And also, he's a vegan. He's a complete vegan now. Wow. And telling me about what I should be eating. I say, son, I stopped eating pork in my family when I was. when I was 10 years old. So can you imagine a young black kid in 1990 telling his grandparents and his mama and everybody in his family, I don't want no pork?

You must say, but you're like, but Louis Farrakhan says no pork? Do you know? Well, it wasn't really Farrakhan at the time. It was my uncle. My uncle had been sent to prison for 10 years. And as he went, he began to study Islam. And he began to funnel the information back to me. Also, he gave me an experiment to do.

It was to take a raw piece of base. They can put it in club soda and set it outside to bear the brunt of the elements and come back in 48 hours or 24 hours and find out what it was. And that were maggots. Well, I don't know if there were maggots of the tritonine worm. And that is what got me off of pork at 10 years old. And my granddad would say, oh, you're going to eat what we cook around here? I said, well, let you don't eat. I'm cool.

And I take my little candy money. I get me some McDonald's and I have my little, you know what I mean? I used to. Don't want worms from the pork. You go to McDonald's. Yeah, I'd rather take my little candy money. I'm going to go and find me my own, some noodles or something that I can eat. And I'm cool.

I traveled down that road at 10 years old. So I tell him, listen, man, you ain't doing nothing new to me. Just all the little games and tricks that, you know, kids will pull quite naturally. I said, man, you suburb kids ain't going to never get one over on meat. You know what I'm saying? Y'all got to get up pretty early in the morning. You think you're going to get one over on pops. Yeah.

Oh, man. Is he, do you still not eat pork? No, not at all. At this point, I don't even eat meat. I don't eat pork. I don't eat beef. I don't eat lamb. I don't eat turkey.

I don't eat chicken. Just seafood. I'm trying to cut out dairy, but cheese and butter. That's the hardest thing. That's the harder than giving up meat. It's tasty. Yeah. When did you first start to feel an obligation towards your neighborhood and community?

Because I would imagine when you get, you're selling crack, you can sign the record deal. Sure. You're supporting your kids. Then you become famous. You become a celebrity. You're getting rich. You're getting famous. Like, there's got to be a period where you go, this is, this is

pretty awesome and then maybe it gets old and you're like, I'm over it. There's got to be something else. Well, I had some experiences in the beginning and experiences along the way that kind of just kind of kept me grounded and focused and I never completely like flew away. Now, I got pretty high up in the sky, but I was always grounded back to something. What kind of experiences? Well, I say, for instance, when my uncle first got out of prison, I told you he was doing 10 years. So I was eight when he went away. When he got out, I was about 18. I just got in my check. And he said, hey, give me $30,000 or something like that. And I'm like, man, I just got this money. Yeah. And so I gave it to him because he said, man, you ain't anything to do that, but fuck it up.

I ain't understand it at the time. But I was like, man, he's been gone 10 years. It's my uncle. You know, he's had just an incredible impact on my life, man. How can I not give it to him? Go ahead. And I gave it to him, never looked back, blew the rest of the money after I got everything I needed to get for my child and his mother. Then I was back on kind of, kind of like check to check, you know, figuring out hustling, figuring I was going to stay off the, at the trap and off the streets. Cut to six months later, I made away for myself. I had gone, and I was doing like $10,000 a show, had show's book maybe seven times,

six times a week, and I was rolling at this point independently. And he put me in a car and he took me riding and we rode through my old neighborhood and he stopped me in front of a house, a house that I was familiar with, but it looked much different. So I looked at it and he said, you see that house? I said, yeah, you just say a crack out of that house. I'm very familiar. What about it? He said, well, ain't no crack in there now. That's what we did. That money you gave me. I put some more money with it. We bought that house. I renovated it. And now I sold it to a family and it's a family living in there. Wow. So he was in prison being like, I'm going to make money responsibly. I'm going to figure this out.

At that very moment in time, I was like, damn. Because you'd never thought about, obviously you'd I didn't. But at that time, it dawned on me. I've sold crack in about 12 more houses around here. So you should buy all. I got some more work to do. Yeah. So that's when I felt such a sense of redemption at that time, like feeling like I fixed something that I helped to fuck up. Oh, interesting. And that's when I kind of dove into revitalization of the community, acquiring properties and dilapidated pieces of land. and building and developing, and then the market crash, and I say, shit, I got a day job.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, this investing thing was fine. Well, yeah, it was cool when it was good, but I don't have to endure. I don't have to bear the brunt of this. So that part of you wanted to give back because you were selling drugs and maybe not benefiting the community so much back then.

Well, not necessarily that. That part of me wanted to give back because I was once one of those people. Uh-huh, okay. We needed some form of opportunity, some form of an experience, some higher level of education. that I was not receiving.

It's always crazy, right, how I hear the far-right, I guess, Republicans, the far-right Republicans, I'll say that to put it plainly and nicely. They always say, well, all these people want us to do is give, give, give. They never want to work for anything. They never, and the thing is, okay, historically, our people have been the hardest working people, us and other immigrants. Definitely. You know what I mean?

Definitely. And the hardest working people who have helped to build this country. Now, the thing is about our people in particular, maybe it's because we've been here the longest. But every time we get ourselves to a place of independence and prosperity, it's something always done to sabotage us and undercut us and take us right back down to square one. I'll give you an example. 1921, Tulsa, Oklahoma, a black Wall Street. You know what I'm saying? There was a group of black professionals who came together.

There was a lawyer and doctors and just entrepreneurs who came. who came together and they bought hundreds of acres of land and created a town. They had the own airport. They had the own banks. They had their own schools. They even had the own hospital. Okay. And over time, I guess when the people in the surrounding areas, the angry whites came in

and they wanted a piece of what they had going on and they wouldn't sell to them. They wanted to keep their dollar circulating within their community. They wanted to keep the prosperity right there and they bombed them. it to this day is still, not 9-11, it to this day is still the largest, most gruesome domestic attack of terrorism in this country's existence. They'll tell you it's 9-11, but really, if you look it up, it's Tulsa, Oklahoma, Black Wall Street, 19-19-19-40. I'm going to have to look that up when I get home. I've heard of that because I used to be the only white guy at work. Everybody used to be like, you've ever heard of Black Wall Street?

And I'd be like, yes, because it's Tuesday. I've already heard about it 40 times. Yeah. So it's things like that. And also I heard D.L. Hughley say back in the 30s, 40s, 50s, I guess you could say the Renaissance era or whatever, black people had means. We'd worked and we, you know, developed means for ourselves. We bought property. And the property that we bought, D.L. Hughley said that his grandmother owned a house right by the 105 freeway. Okay. But for them to build the 105 freeway, they public domain her property. gave her nothing, she was just expected to start over. Yeah, I'm in a domain, yeah. Excuse me, that public domain, imminent domain, excuse my language. I'm thinking the different intellectual property. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

You've got your IP terms mixed up with your property terms. I apologize. I'm a lawyer, so I know that random shit. The eminent domained her property. Yeah. Okay, gave her nothing, left her to start all the way over. Now imagine if she still had that property, what it would have appreciated to by now.

You see? So it's not that we don't want to work. It's not that we just want people to give us something. It's that every time we get to a certain level, there's always something done systemically that undercuts us, sabotages us, and brings us right back to square one. That is the issue here. How many people really believe that, like,

urban African-American or poor people don't want to work? I've never actually... Well, that's not true. I'm going to tell you. I come from the urban African-American people. There's a lot of motherfuckers there that don't want to work. But it's because... because they have been conditioned to be dependent on a system.

Now, one of the things I tell you, one of the things that Candace got right, you know what I mean? Candace Owens, yeah. Yes, Candace Owens. I'll tell you one of the things that we agreed on. The Democratic Party somewhat incentivized back in the 70s and 80s, incentivized black mothers with welfare, food stamps, Section 8. They incentivized black mothers to cut off ties with the father. Because you get more money for... You get more money.

or you couldn't, you would not be eligible for certain programs if you had a man in the house. But they knew that a woman without a man in the house raising a child, and the woman would, you know what I mean, that child would generally go out into the community in the areas, in the neighborhoods that they lived in, get caught up in the system, end up in prison, and they would be able to have a cycle of recidivism over and over and over again. That's something that, you know, she speaks on and I have the utmost, respect and agree. I agree with it in totality. But these are the types of things that have been done to deconstruct and sabotage our family values and our existence over time. It's been so

much more. But these are the things that come to mind off the top. There's a lot there, but I want to have time to deconstruct all of it. I wish I did. I'll come back and interview you or I'll go on your show and then take over by accident. But how do you stay relevant and not burn out creatively? You were a long timer in the game. A lot of people, they get a couple records, maybe a couple hits done. You never hear about them again. Right.

Over with. You've even said you've got a couple more albums than you're done. Yeah, man, I mean, like, to be honest with you, I don't feel like music at this present moment in time. I don't feel like it utilizes all of my gifts. Yeah, what do you mean? I just feel like I have so much more to offer. I have so much more to awful.

Like, you know, me being an artist has nothing to do with me being an actor. Has nothing to do with me having three clothing lines. has nothing to do with me being a developer. I have a 200 plus unit development in Atlanta, mixed use development that I have that breaks ground in January. It has nothing to do with me opening a museum. I own and have curated. What's the museum?

The trap music museum. That makes sense. The trap music museum is about the life and lifestyle of the most significant contributors to the culture and the subgenre of trap music. So you can come and you can see the Young Jeezy exhibit, the Guccane exhibit, the Tuchin's exhibit, the T.I. exhibit, the Yogi exhibit, and not to mention the just release, Nipsey Hustle exhibit. I have all of these different attributes and all of these different contributions to the culture that I don't feel like are able to be utilized if I'm only focusing on making music. Do you want to put a bow on the music and then move into something else?

All these other things, I mean? You think you'll keep doing music? I still do music. I go to the studio quite often. And I have, like, an extensive catalog. I can release an album every couple months for at least five years. I'll release music going back to 2007, eight. Wow.

10 plus years. Eight nine. Yeah, so a decade plus of music. Yeah. So why are you doing your new show on Podcast One expeditiously? Because you've had a full career, so why a podcast? Now. Well, to be honest with you, man, because I want to engage the culture and the generation. I want to have healthy dialogue and create a platform where we can have the discussions that

will have the most significant impact and push the culture forward. I like to say, if I had a guy who was in the same position I was in when I was that young kid when they had that intervention before I became TIA. So if that kid can listen to me and our discussions and our discussions And we can navigate him through the journey that he will have to take, going from where he is right now to where he aspires to be. And it can kind of circumvent a lot of obstacles and pitfalls that I went through and get him here faster without as much negative shit to hang over his head, then I feel like it's worth that much and more to do a podcast.

What are you doing to make sure your own kids don't get used to a good life, get a little soft, make sure they work hard? I had a kid seven weeks ago, so I'm like, all right, how do I make sure he realizes that this isn't normal? You don't say yes to everything. You make them work for it. You know what I'm saying? That's what I do. Like, my kids, man, they don't get what they want. They get what they earn.

You know what I'm saying? Yeah. I'll give you an example. Let's say Sweet 16. Yeah. For my oldest daughter, I kind of had to do it to test the waters. You know what I'm saying? So she got a Porsche truck.

Okay, the second person to get a car, he got a Honda. He must have been like, excuse me, hold on a second. My sister said she got a Porsche truck. He got a Honda. You know, at first, he didn't even get a car. He got access to use a car. And the car I designated for him to use was my car. And I said, you could use that car, you know.

What kind of car was it? It was actually a challenger, Dodge Challenge. Yeah, that's good enough to tell you. I'll take it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And he wrecked that. He totaled that out. Yeah, no.

Then he got a Honda. That makes sense. Now you can't drive any of my cars. Yeah. You drive this Honda. He actually fell in love with the Honda. You know what I'm saying? He's like, man, I like this.

He's lucky he didn't get a razor scooter. And he hasn't had an accident since. And he, you know, he's become independent and self-sufficient. And he's now in Georgia State on this sophomore year. And after him was my 18-year-old son. And his first car was like a little beat-up Camaro. Still a good car, though. It was a good car, but it didn't look good.

It was a beat-up Camaro with no hubcaps, you know what I'm saying, real dusty kind of matte-black-looking paint. It didn't start off matte-black, but it looked matte-black. But he never complained about it. He took care of it. And over a couple years' time, you know, after no incidents, he then got another car. This is completely irrelevant, but I'm going to end with this. At what point are you like, I'm going to wear sunglasses indoors everywhere,

even when I'm on camera? Like, it's a personal brand choice, and I approve. I wish I could get away with it. But I'm like, I hadn't even thought I didn't detect. I had them on until you just said something. But you wear them everywhere. You're on the revolt panel with them. They're everywhere.

I mean, man, I think it's at some point, man. It's a cool factor. Definitely. Because in the sun, you know, I don't want to glare in my eyes. Then you have to squint. True. Nobody looks cool, squint. You know what I mean?

So, and as I come in here, nobody said, hey, you're inside now. You can take your glasses off. Nobody said that until now. I'll take them off. That's because you're T-I'd. Like, nobody's like, hey. I mean, I don't even see. I don't even think that, look, there's a lot of bright light right here.

That's true. So, I mean, I don't really think. I think I put my glasses. What kind of glasses are those? These Adidas, actually. I like those. Yeah, thank you. I might have to give myself a band.

I think they're mock ones. I'm going to get a pair of those. Yeah. And then I'm going to wear them inside and people will be like, why you're Yeah, they're mock ones, titaniums. Those are dope. D-I-A, D-I-T-A, D-A, not Adidas. Not Adidas.

Ditas. Ditas. Yeah. All right, we'll link to those in the show notes. Hey, man, thank you very much. Man, thank you so much, man. I enjoyed you. Yeah, this is really a lot of fun.

I see why they said you had a kick-ass podcast. They're good liars, like I said, man. I appreciate it. I'll plug this back up. Right on, brother. Drink enough for your tequila. Cheers. No, man.

Glad to have you. Likewise. Likewise. Right on. Thank you to T.I. That was a lot of fun. He's got a new podcast. It's called Expeditiously with the capital T.I.

in the middle there. I see what you did. Links to his stuff will, of course, be in the show notes, and there's a video of this interview and us doing tequila out of foam cups. The link to that is on our YouTube channel, Jordan Harbinger.com slash YouTube. You can watch us act the fool.

There are also worksheets for each episode. Yes, even for this one with T.I. So you can shore up everything you were supposed to learn from him and I at Jordan Harbinger.com in the show notes. And I'm teaching you how to connect with great people and manage relationships using systems and tiny habits over at our six-minute networking course, which is free. Not enter your credit card free, but free, free. The more people that know this, the better off we all are. That's at Jordan Harbinger.com slash course.

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