The Jordan Harbinger Show - 297: Eric Thomas | Success Secrets of The Hip Hop Preacher

Episode Date: January 9, 2020

Eric Thomas (@ericthomasbtc) is a motivational speaker, YouTube personality, podcaster, pastor, director of Breathe University, and author of several books, including The Secret to Success: When You Want to Succeed as Bad as You Want to Breathe. What We Discuss with Eric Thomas: How Eric Thomas went from homeless to PhD to become one of the world's top motivational speakers. How and why to get out of our psychological bubbles whether we're broke or millionaires. Why we do not have to accept life as it was given to us. How to break out of patterns and mindsets that no longer serve us. What taking responsibility for our own actions ultimately gives us (and what blaming others takes away). And much more... Full show notes and resources can be found here: https://jordanharbinger.com/297 Sign up for Six-Minute Networking -- our free networking and relationship development mini course -- at jordanharbinger.com/course! Like this show? Please leave us a review here -- even one sentence helps! Consider including your Twitter handle so we can thank you personally!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Welcome to the show. I'm Jordan Harbinger. As always, I'm here with producer Jason DeFilippo. On the Jordan Harbinger show, we decode the stories, secrets, and skills of the world's most brilliant and interesting people and turn their wisdom into practical advice that you can use to impact your own life and those around you. You want to help you see the Matrix when it comes to how these amazing people think and behave, want you to become a better thinker. If you're new to the show, we've got episodes with spies and CEOs, athletes and authors, thinkers and performers, as well as toolboxes for skills like negotiation, public speaking, body language, persuasion, and more. So if you're smart and you like to learn, then you'll be right at home here with us. Today on the show, Dr. Eric Thomas, we call him

E.T. The Hip Hop Preacher. He's a PhD, author, speaker, educator, and a pastor. And as you'll see today, he's really full of energy. This one is from the vault and recorded a few years back, but it's an oldie-buddy goodie. I wanted to bring this one back out again, even though, I'm not normally one for motivational speakers, as you all know, right? I just love Eric's message and delivery, and originally he wanted to do this interview at 7 a.m. in the morning, and we couldn't find a studio that would even be open at that time. That's the kind of hustle I like to see. Today we'll hear, although I will admit I was secretly relieved.

We didn't have to do it at 7. Today we'll hear how he went from homeless to Ph.D. And now one of the top speakers in his industry. He's living proof that it's crucial to escape our cyclical. bubbles, whether you're a broke or a billionaire, and how to take steps towards that, actionable, practical steps. Eric was requested quite a bit by you all, so I hope you enjoy this conversation as much as I did. If you want to know how I managed to book all these great people and manage my relationships

using systems and tiny habits, check out our six-minute networking course, which is free over at jordanharbinger.com slash course. And by the way, most of the guests on the show, they actually subscribe to the course and the newsletter. So come join us and you'll be in great company. Now, here's Dr. Eric Thomas, the hip-hop preacher. I noticed that about programs that actually do work. Yours is getting a lot of acclaim because somebody's coming in and being,

I hate overusing cliches like this, so pardon me, but it's like being real about it. Organic. Organic, yeah. That's a better way to say real. Well, you and I were both living in Michigan. I grew up in Troy, slightly different area than where you were. Yeah, but it's right there, though. It is right there.

They're right there. Tell me about growing up in Chicago. I mean, were you there for most of your childhood or when did you? Yeah, I think about five. My mom moved to Detroit, took a job with Ford Motor Company. That's where my parents worked, too. Oh, yeah. My mom was in Microfilm.

Started school pretty much in Detroit, but my mom so loved Chicago that we literally traveled every weekend for seven years. We went back to Chicago every weekend for seven years straight until she had my little sister. and then, of course, she didn't travel as much. So I spent a lot of summers in Chicago, so kind of like a Detroit-Chicago kid, great experience. The only thing I didn't like about Chicago is they had gangs.

I didn't like that. You know what I said? So funny thing is I came to L.A., I don't know, maybe I started coming here about 15, 20 years ago, and I literally came here wearing red. I didn't know. Oh, well, it depends where you're at. That's not something that I would think about it.

Well, I was in the wrong place, and some guys came up to me and asked me where I was from. I said Detroit. and then pull out my license. Literally, I'm from Detroit. And it's okay for us to wear whatever color we like to wear in Detroit. That's why I didn't like Chicago. Of course, gangs, there's territory.

And so you just can't go wherever you want, where people don't realize Detroit didn't have gangs. Now, we did have, you know, neighborhoods, but it was safe to go wherever you wanted to go. So that was the only thing I didn't like about Chicago. The pizza, home run in, six flags. I loved all of that. Detroit definitely, man, I love that blue-collar mentality.

And when you listen to my work, you'll hear it infused in my work. but I'm really about just that grind, get up, go get it. So that's why I said 730. I think it's the Midwest. Yeah. It's so funny. Coming out here, when you started traveling, did you ever go, wait a minute, not everyone

has a Midwest work ethic. Did that hit you at one point? You're like, what the hell? So to be honest with you, this is what hit me. Industries are different. So when you come to the West Coast, entertainment, Silicon Valley, people make their money in a different way. And so when you make your money away, we make it in Midwest, you get up in seven,

o'clock of the morning. Yeah, if you're lucky. Yeah, right, right, yeah, you go to the plant and you work, you grind. You know, there's three shifts, morning, afternoon, and then there's that graveyard ship. And I noticed that people make their money different on the West Coast down south, and it doesn't really lend to getting up early or having that grind, you know, it's different. Yeah, that's true. I hadn't thought about it being industry specific, but it definitely has something to do with that because my dad was always up at, I don't know, five probably, got in the car. If it's winter, you go out, you start your car. Then you take a shower. Yes, I thought everybody did that. Yeah, I know. 15 minute, let your car warm up.

Yeah. And then, you know, when you get here, you have to really slow down. So like you said, I'm thinking, my wife wanted something this morning. I'm thinking, all right, I'm going to get up, go to a 7-Eleven. I want to go to 7-Eleven at 6 o'clock in the morning and get her what she wants. And it's like, no, that doesn't work like that. And there's a place I've been getting vegan cuisine. and they had the Tempe barbecue sandwich, whatever. My wife was like, I'd love to have one. And I looked them up and it was like, they don't open it to 11, close at 3. I was like, how do you make money?

I was like, Eric, you're not at home. You're on the West Coast. Nobody's probably even eating at the 4 o'clock. They're working out. Exactly. The way they're making money is they just go, hmm, we can work half as much, then we'd have to double the price. And they're like, yeah, that's just double the price.

And everyone's like, oh, okay, it's a $12 sandwich now. Yeah, right, right. Why did you go back every weekend? That's unbelievable. Did you take the train? My mom actually drove. A long drive. It is.

It was a three hour, four hour drive. But what I loved about it, we stopped every weekend on our way up to McDonald's and got the big breakfast. I can always look forward to that. But my mom is very close. It was 14 siblings. And my mom is one of the older ones. And so her and her sisters had a very close relationship.

A lot of her best friends were from there. She only moved to Detroit because she married. I wasn't my biological father, but he raised me. She moved there. for a marriage. So her life was in Chicago. Her work and family were in Detroit. But most of her siblings were back in Chicago. So that's kind of why we went back and forth. But it was great. I didn't have any brothers. My sister, younger sister, well, my middle sister is seven years younger. The other one is 14 years younger. So I'm spending time with my cousins every weekend.

They were like my brothers and sisters. So it was a great experience, man. It was like watching something on Showtime. Sure. Yeah. This is like big sitcom family. But then you get to leave before things get to feel. Absolutely. And go home, right? You know, it was crazy because I was always like Oprah Winfrey, color purple. It's like, every time, don't leave me, see me. So I would leave him. My little cousin would run behind me and we're crying and waving. I was like, don't worry about it. I'll see you in another seven days. But yeah, five days. Yeah, just relax. Yeah. That's funny. You ended up moving to Detroit. It's almost like you guys just didn't get the memo moving one dangerous area to another. Thank you, Mom. Come on. Yeah. Mom should have come to the west coast or the south where it was

warmer. But I will say this. I think a lot of people in the, in the, world, not just in the U.S., gravitate toward the message. Because at the end of the day, I think there are more people like the Midwest than it is. Oh, yeah. This is a weird bubble. Whenever I look at election results and people are just shocked, and I'm thinking, you just don't know anyone outside this area. There are people that voted for, depending on where you are, they're like, who voted for Obama? I'm like literally the majority of the country. Most people did. It is easy to get caught up in the bubble. You see it with businesses too, where someone's like, it's a juicer, but it's really expensive, and you can only juice our packets.

You can't put real things. And it's like, this is a terrible idea. And they're like, I'll give you $48 million to start. That's right. For that idea. Yeah, only in California. Yeah. But the bubble goes both ways. You're in the bubble of what's going on here right now is something they see in movies, music videos that they either aspire to or that they think is so far outside their reach, they're never going to get there, so why try? And I think that's why it's important. I'm grateful to be on the podcast today.

I'm grateful to have the opportunity to show kids. You know, when you grew up in Detroit, it is that bubble of Ford, GM, and Chrysler, and I just want to show kids, and it doesn't require a lot to get to the other side, especially now with the different airlines, you know, etc. Like, you can really get to the West Coast and get an experience of this.

You can go down. I was in Miami, and I never stay in Miami. I always stay in Fort Lauderdale. But those are two different worlds, And they're only 30, 40 minutes away from each other. So I tell kids, get your passport, get out of your space and see another part of the world. And you'll be shocked. When you see another human do it, it'll click.

And you'll be like, yo, I can do this. Because I never saw anybody when I was growing up anyway in Detroit. I never saw anybody making money speaking professionally. No. Nobody in my family made money doing what they love. Everybody made money doing what they hated. And that was going, no disrespect to the big three. but, you know, working for a plant wasn't necessarily their dream job.

Nobody's a dream job. But I mean, it made good money, but I'm looking now. It's like, yo, E, you're doing what you love. And I think of my cousins or my uncles or my aunts that were all great orators who never actually did it professionally because they didn't think that it was an option. And I just want kids to know there are way more options than you think. And don't allow the options in your community to be the only options you explore. That's a great point.

And I've mentioned this type of thing before on the show because when you're a kid, you think, doctor, army, police, and firemen, those are the jobs, teacher. Teacher, yeah. Yeah, because that's always on the radar. Then you go to high school and you realize, okay, I have like two more options other than Army teacher and doctor, but not really. Even in college for me, I thought at some point they're going to tell us what we can actually do with all this stuff, right?

Because I'm still thinking teacher, police officer, except now I'm like in a Russian class. What I'm going to do with this? I don't have anything to do with anything. Yeah. So if you grow up in that bubble, whatever bubble you're in, there's probably kids that growing up in Palo Alto that are like, I'm going to be a systems administrator on Facebook. Absolutely. That's what they see every day. And that's why I'm saying, kids, you have to get a passport, which is doable. It's probably the cost of a pair of gym shoes you're wearing. Get a flight, which is probably the cost of two pair of shoes you have and get on the West Coast. You know, come to the beach, you know, go to the Valley. Go Golden Gate Bridge. You know, I was talking to somebody recently at my church and I was like, you know, look, I'm going to take a group of kids to California this year, D.C., Florida.

And it's like, that's a lot. I was like, I know. But back to what you said, I just, when you go to college or go to high school, I just want to make the connection. Because who goes to school for 180 days taking subjects that you don't have the slightest idea what they are and enjoys that. But if you can make a connection, oh, this is why school is important. And again, I'm not an advocate of college. I went to college. I'm not actually a guy that believes you got to go to college to be successful.

But I do tell people by going to college, there are some things that I'm able to do, like analyze, be critical in my thinking, and use it in my profession. So it's not like I'm using critical thinking and do some massive research or something. But, you know, I like to call myself a leader in this generation, especially with the millennials. I can critically think in a way that I couldn't when I had a GED. You know, so I'm not a guy that believes that everybody needs to go to college. But I am saying, if you don't do certain things, you're going to be something. stuck in that bubble. And there's so many bubbles and so many big bubbles that I'm so grateful.

Somebody told me, get out of Detroit. They sent me to Alabama before I went to Michigan State to go to college. And that was the thing that changed my life because I was literally around a group of people who didn't have the same background, didn't think the way I thought, and really made me analyze myself or my gift in a way I had never done before. And then now I look at myself and I'm like, wow, it all started by 18 years old, just getting outside of Michigan for a couple years. Yeah, I think that's a problem that a lot of people have is there's no reason for them to leave that they can see. And they also, you don't know until you leave that you're going to have a different set of eyes on you, giving you a different perspective. Because naturally, as humans,

we all just think the way that I view the world is totally real. This is the only way that you could see things. That is flat. It's flat. It's right. Whatever. Yeah, whatever. Yeah, whatever. Whatever it is. But what did you think you were going to be when you were a kid? You probably weren't thinking, I'm going to be an astronaut. Like, what was going through your mind in your bubble at that time? I'll just be honest. You know, you say you got two options. I really thought for GM Christ. If I could get a job at the plant or make a 20-something dollars an hour. And then the other thing I thought. In the 90s, that's like 50 bucks right now. It's incredible. And I also thought I saw preachers. Like, I didn't go to church much, but I saw preachers. I was thinking, yeah,

maybe I can do that. They speak a lot. Yeah, maybe I can do that. But more like a Dr. Martin King type God, like not necessarily like local, you know, pastor of just like kind of stays in with that congregation. I saw myself more like a Martin King, like somebody that was using their gifts to kind of change the world. And I don't know why, but I was drawn to Mother Teresa even as a teenager. I would look at somebody like Mother Teresa, like, yo, I like that. Like, I don't know that I can do it, but I like what they're doing. They're doing good.

I know how much money you make doing that kind of stuff. Not a lot. Pretty smart. I don't know what kind of checks they get, but I did admire. So those were the two things that I kind of thought about. And then when I started going to church with a friend, the pastor mentored me. And even as I sit here now, it's unbelievable. You know, he said to me at 17 when I was in a lot of trouble and a lot of problems, he said to me,

you have a phenomenal gift. You have this charisma. You're going to do great things. And I sit here now saying like, yo, how was that? How important was that to have somebody outside of my bubble looking at me saying, you're going to do great things? And I would never tell anybody when I was a teenager, but I would really walk away from that building thinking to myself,

you know, I'm going to be somebody. This guy said I'm going to be somebody. I don't have a lot positive going on in my life right now. So I'm definitely going to cling on to these positive words. And I look at myself, you know, 20, almost 30 years for the time he spoke that. Well, actually it is 30 years from the time he spoke that. And I'm like, wow, this guy was absolutely right, which is why I do what I do.

Because if somebody can do that for me, I truly believe that I have the power to speak to some kid or even some adult, you know, if they are still coachable and make them see things, like you said, in their bubble that's outside of that they would never see. Right, through a fresh set of eyes. It kind of reminds me that, I think it's Chris Rockbitt, where he's like, if you tell some kid in the suburbs, you can be anything you want to be, he's like, I fucking know that. But do you tell somebody else that? They're like, what are you even talking about right now? And so it is very important to make sure that you have that other set of eyes, but how do you think, especially kids from disadvantaged backgrounds, can break the cycle? Because I think

it's probably pretty hard for kids to take education seriously when they're like in a situation where you were actually homeless for a while. How do you then go, no, really, stay in school. And they're like, are you crazy? I'm abused at home. I got drug dealer brothers and sisters. There's guns in my house. I'm not going to go to school. Are you crazy? What are you talking about? This might be a shock to you. But I actually think it's easier to break the cycle now than it's ever been before. And the reason why I say that is because you talked about it. When I was growing up, that was my bubble. Like I had an uncle who was a heroin addict.

We didn't have like cable TV. So it wasn't like you saw images of yourself on television like that. You know, it was good times. Jefferson's. You know there were heroin addicts and the good times. You know it. You know, so you can watch cable now. You can see anything you want to see.

You can see yourself in any light you want to. You can create, get an app, and they actually have you animated. So I really think it's easier because I couldn't see outside of Detroit. It was hard to see anything outside Motown just because that's where I am. We got local stations. Yo, I'm studying Spanish now and it's crazy. I'm going to Telemundo. That's not something that I could have done 20, 30 years ago.

I got an app that's showing me I'm working with every day that's teaching me the language. And it's like, yo, I didn't have that 30 years ago. So these kids with technology really have a way of saying, yo, this is my uncle. But wow, this is how they living in Cali. Like, this is how they living in Miami. I didn't have that. I didn't see Miami.

If you weren't in Miami, you didn't see Miami. So I think it's easier for kids to say, I have Bill Gates. I've got Warren Buffett. I've got LeBron James. I've got Kobe Bryant. I was studying, I think, a guy, John Chambers yesterday. I didn't even know who this guy was. I'm watching TV, and he's talking about the five things you need to do

to be great in corporate America or a hedge fund. I'm like, what? I didn't even know what a hedge fund. Like, when I was a kid, never even heard that term. So just being honest, I think it's easier to break the cycle because you have way more models, role model. Call it what you want. I think when Barack became President of the United States of America, Chris Rock said,

you said, hey, you can be whatever you want to be. Okay, whatever. But when Barack became President of United States of America, it's like, wow, I even think with Trump being President of the United States of America, I'm probably more encouraged than I was with Barack Obama. like, wow, this guy didn't take the traditional. Anything can happen now. All bets are up. All bets are up, bro. There's absolutely nothing I can't be or do.

I think it's probably easier now. Will they have their aha moment is the question? Will they be in the environment or engaged in the environment? And I think if you're just hanging around the environment, no, you don't see the obvious. But if you get engaged, then whatever. And I tell kids all the time, yo, I hate school. I got a PhD. I hate school.

There was nothing about the PhD process that I enjoy. but it gives me options and I love options. Doors that were closed to me 10 years ago are opening me now because of school, because of the network. My top clients, Dan Gilbert, Michigan State Grad, who owns which wish, Jeff's Michigan State Grab. Oh, that's a Michigan Company? Yeah, no, no. I didn't know it.

He started in Texas. I didn't know. Now I'm working with a group called United Shores, Michigan State Grad. Matt actually played on the 2000 national championship team. You know, so I'm just saying college is not just about a degree. It's a fraternity, if you will, you know, it's networking, if you will. So I tell kids, without college or without an education, it's going to be hard to make your dreams become a reality. We already know what happens when you don't do school.

We already know what happens when you're in gang. We already know what happens when you're dysfunctional. You know, it's jail, dead in life. And so for me, I just tell these kids like, yo, don't look at school as science, social studies, you know, English, whatever. Look at it as Ching-Ching. Look at it as a gateway, a bridge to get from where you are to where you want to be. You're listening to The Jordan Harbinger Show with our guest, Eric Thomas. We'll be right back.

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As always, subscribing to the show is absolutely free. It just means that you get all of the latest episodes downloaded automatically to your podcast player so you don't miss a single thing. And now back to our show with Eric Thomas. You grew up with your biological father, not in the picture. And what age you get male role models that were positive in your life? I'll be honest. They might have been there. I didn't see him.

I went paying attention. Turned it off. Yeah, I turned it off. But in college, when I went to college and saw guys that look like me, everybody talks about Barack Obama. I saw Barack Obama in 1989 when I went to Oklahoma University. I saw Barack Obama in Derrick Green and the Kane brothers. You know, I saw Barack Obama and my boy Skip in Equate. So I went to college, and for the first time of my life, I saw guys who looked like me who weren't gangbangers or who weren't, you know, trying to just play sports.

And there's nothing wrong with sports, but I didn't see myself going to the NBA or to the NFL. I saw regular guys who have phenomenal dreams. And today, Derek Green is a lobbyist and he was a strategist for the governor in Jersey. So he was the lead strategist for this guy. And the guy became governor. And I'm watching Dee. That's what Dee was doing when we were in college. Like that's what he was about.

I'm watching Puckie, who now is a pastor in Tennessee. And that's what he said he wanted to do. brothers from Bermuda, this literally happened. They said they wanted to be in law. They're from Bermuda. So they went to a university in London. And I remember going to court and he had a wig on his head, a white wig. Yeah, what are you doing? Yeah, not designed for. What are you doing? Right. And he said, you know, it was funny. I was just sitting in there and it was like, all rides. I'm like, I ate ramen noodles with this guy. What do you mean? All right. It's like, all rise. Stand up. For what? That's not your friend anymore. It's a judge. You're in court. So I was around these guys,

man, for years, they became my role models and they pushed me. They were reading a book a week. They were having think tanks. They were going to conferences. We were going to communities and doing activism. So those were my first role models. And then from them, whoever they were reading, their fathers, their brothers became my role models as well. And then I was able to go back to my community and respect my father who, again, wasn't my biological father, but who raised me. I could go back and respect that relationship, which at one point I was just like, yo, you're not my father. Yeah.

Just being real. Like, you can't tell me what to do. I emotionally cut him off. I left home at 13 for the first time, back and forth. And at 16, I left for good. But I was able to go back and realize that those guys that were getting up every day and going to Ford, GM and Chrysler, though, a few women that were doing it. It was like, yo, these were actually role models.

They showed you what consistency looked like. They showed you what grind and hustle looked like. And I was able to draw lessons from. them and use it for these kids today. So what was going on in your life when you left home? Because it sounds like your mom was around. She took you to Chicago. You had great cousins.

Your stepdad seems to have cared about you. And then suddenly it's like, nope, I'm leaving. And now I'm going to be homeless. Like what happened at that point? And then how did you get your aha moment to snap out of it? Well, I think what happened. My mom lied and then tell me who my father was. Oh, shoot.

That was not in the Wikipedia. I try to reserve moms, you know, rep. You know what I'm saying with that one. I'm an adult now. So I get it. I understand my biological father. We started a relationship when I was 30. Weird.

Grew up with him, my whole life, you know, up until maybe 13, 14. I didn't know who he was. My grandma would say he's a friend of the family. So I knew my uncles and my aunts, all my cousins, my grandma, I just didn't know who he was. But it was weird. It was like, yo, he's got pictures with you guys. He's a real close friend. Yeah.

But when I found out at 12, you know, that, yo, this is in my real father, like the loyalty thing. Like, yo, you weren't loyal, mine. Like, you were a liar. And so the relationship at that point, I can say emotionally, everything, I just cut them off. I was like, I'm living here, but you guys are liars, you guys, you know, whatever. And I'm getting in trouble because I'm lying. This is hypocrisy at his finest. And so when I left home at 16 for good, I didn't.

I had an estranged relationship with my mom, pretty much cut my family off, hated to not be able to be there for my sisters. But I cut them off and really got into a dark place. I was around people selling drugs, things of that nature. I never really got into that, but started stealing from the mall and just lifeless, man. It just didn't have a whole lot of life in me. But like I said, a good friend of mine started taking me to church. It wasn't church. Like, that wasn't the thing.

The pastor was a man. He was a military man, took care of his five children, was loved on his wife. I really looked up to this guy. And he became my mentor. And he really helped me to get my life on track, sent me off to college, helped me to get my GED, sent me off to college. And my girlfriend at the time at the church, she went to the same university. I went to and we started a real deep relationship, got married after our freshman year.

We've been married about a little bit over 27 years now. Jeez, you figured out what you wanted early. Yeah, I did. That is highly. And homeless will do that to you. Yeah. When you're homeless in 16 by 19, you're pretty mature by that time. Right.

You're like, okay, two ways to do this. This way sucks. I'm going the other one. That way. Yeah. That is such a crazy experience to have. Because I think a lot of people think that they're going to leave school and do something else. They don't think I'm going to leave homeless.

leave school and sleep outside. I mean, were you homeless, like, eat from dumpster homeless? Yeah, yeah, but I was smart. That didn't last long. I ended up getting a job at McDonald's, and I was smart. So I wasn't school smart, but I was life smart. What I ended up doing was taking a job at a 24-hour McDonald's. And so I worked from 5 p.m. to 5 a. So you're in a safe place at night. Yeah, safe place. Easier to go to somebody's house and act like you just coming over for breakfast. Yeah. And stay the day than it is to go at night, act like you're coming for dinner, leaving. So McDonald's proved to be phenomenal. And I say this, my work ethic was so phenomenal McDonald's, not because I love working, but I knew I could not lose that job. Oh, yeah, man.

Man, let me tell you, I was so good. I could flip burgers. What it would take three people to do, I could do by myself. And then there was a lot of guys that worked with us who were also high school kids. So they were silly, immature. So I was like, I got them beat all day. Like, they're not going going to come on time. They're going to come and play because we were on Finkel in Wyoming, which was a very dangerous but playful. It reminds me of Crenshaw, like everybody Friday night with cars, would line up, people drinking smoke, and that's where I would work.

The manager, we became very close. He'd take me to breakfast after we closed. He knew I was homeless, buy me things, you know, try to help me. I was like a KD. I got drafted at McDonald's. You know what I was, one of the best of the best. You know, so definitely a dark place, man, not really knowing where I was headed.

It's not like from homelessness. Like, that's not really a track to anywhere. I was just kind of like out there, But I tell you, as crazy as it sounds, my mother used to say this all the time. My mother got pregnant with me at 17 years old, finished high school but couldn't go to college because she had to get a job. And my mother always says when we travel together, I didn't know what I wanted to be, but I knew what I didn't want to be.

Oh, interesting. So that's what mom passed to us. It's like, hey, I can't say I'm going to be a doctor, lawyer, whatever. But I know what I don't want to be and I don't want to be homeless anymore. I don't want to eat out of trash because I don't want to work for 12 hours at McDonald's. This check is terrible. You know, I don't want to do this. And so I didn't know what I wanted to do, but I definitely knew I didn't want to do that.

And so there were certain choices I didn't make that other people my age was making because I didn't want to go to prison. I didn't want to die. I just, I didn't want that life forever. So you were playing a few moves ahead even back then. So when you dropped out of high school, did you think now I'm going to be homeless or what were you thinking at that time? When I cussed my mom out, I felt so liberated.

It was a great story. Everybody happened to be out. I got to show out for the neighbors. You know, I was, man, feeling good. Walk to one of the local stores, got me a little something to eat and then the sunset. Right. You know, and if you've ever been homeless, when I said that, you knew exactly like you were filling me right there. Just like, the world stopped.

It was funny. I was walking the other day. It was five degrees in Michigan. And I just stopped and I was so reflective of going to get my haircut. My videographer was like, yo, you good? I'm like, yeah. He was like, like, you just had a moment. What happened?

And I was like, yo, I remember being homeless in this weather. He was like, really? Yeah. He was like, yo, I can't walk from the car to the barbershop. Like, what do you mean? You were homeless? I was like, literally, I was homeless and this, whatever. And for me, it was, E, you got to do something to get out of here.

So left home, acting a fool, went to the grocery store, and afterwards the sunset. And I was like, yo, E, you didn't think this all the way through. Yeah. Like, where do you go from here? Where do you stay? And I end up going back home, not physically going back home, but I went back to my home property because I knew I would be safe. If something happened, I could knock on the door.

And my next door neighbor had these great, what do you call those, patio set. Yeah, like a lounge chair. Yeah, so I took the padding off of that, put it on the ground. There were these bushes that were close to my family's home, the wall and the bushes. And so I slept there for about two or three nights from there, man, found a friend who let me sleep in a car and then from a car to an abandoned building. If you could make it through it, it's a great book. but when I was actually going through it at 16, 17, 18, man, it was, it was scared.

Yeah, you're so vulnerable during that period of time. Yeah, I wasn't thinking. I was just full of anger, you know, whatever. And I'm just telling young people who might be listening to the podcast or adults who might be listening. Like, sometimes for real, you, man, you get so angry that your ability to think to be rational goes down. Anger 10, ability to be rational, zero and just really think through.

My new thing is, then what? I think that came out of my experience. Like, okay, you do this. Then what happens after that? And I think if we can do the then what with the same intensity, we do the anger, I think we put ourselves in a much better place. How do you get people to do that? Because anger is by nature really strong emotion, getting people to go,

I'm going to make a plan and stick to it, not quite the same level of intensity all the way through that. What I love about sports is that they do the stats. They do numbers. You know what I'm saying? Like right now everybody's Cleveland's, whatever. I don't really know what that means. Come finals, come to playoffs. But right now, it's like, yo, Cleveland, you lost.

whatever, whatever, golden state, you write where you're supposed to be. Like, it's numbers. And I think one of the mistakes that we make as humans is we don't measure. When I start saying, okay, Eric, you made this decision and this was the outcome. Like, you got pissed and you're eating out of trash cans. Like, that's not working for you. So I would just say to people, until you get sick and tired of coming up short, sick and tired of losing, you'll keep doing the same thing.

But once you get to a point where you're like, I want to win, you'll start measuring. What I love about measurement is, you know, the numbers don't lie. They don't lie, yeah. But what you're talking about involves some level of personal responsibility first. Because you can measure something and go, yeah, but that was his fault. Because I was there and then he just came and screwed it all up. So how do you get people, especially young people, because I know I wasn't about to try to take personal responsibility for everything. How do you get them to go, all right, this measurement didn't work?

And it's my fault. And I have the power to change it instead of just saying, well, My mom, you know, she lied to me about this five years ago, so I'm a victim. Yeah, you know what? Okay, guys, you've got to hear me, right? This is not going to be deep. I really need you to pay attention, okay? So when I first started doing voiceover work and, you know, that kind of stuff.

When people start using my voice, I was so excited that I didn't know anything about rights. And I started realizing, oh, they make up $5. Yeah. Oh, he made a couple. And I watched the movie Ray and was an aha moment like, yo, you need to own the rights. This whole thing about the American dream is a lot. about not only liberty, but owning your own freedom, your own rights. And that's why I was upset when I left home. It was like, yo, my, you made all these decisions for me that affect my life,

and we never got to sit down and talk about it. Like, you made all of these decisions. Like, you lie, put me in this school, you sent me here. We didn't sit down and say, son, what do you think about? And so for me, that's what I discovered. The only true way to own your own rights is to take responsibility. Because once you give the responsibility, to somebody else. They have all the power. They have all the rights. And I was like, yo, E, I want to own my own right. I want to be able to make decisions for Eric. I don't care. I was never the guy. People say, E, you grew up in Detroit. There's this teacher, never sold dope. I never sold dope because I didn't want to sell dope. And so I wasn't going to get in trouble for you. Like, I wasn't going to stand on the block and give somebody else money. And they don't have to be on the block. And they don't have to get in trouble. But if I get caught, I got to do 20 years. But nobody even know. I'm like, yo, I'm not interested. that. So why did I steal from the mall? Look, this might sound crazy. But I was in control. I was the fastest guy I knew. So they could never catch me. I would steal some. Since I was maybe 10, I would go in stores, steal something. I like to hide. I'm running. And somebody's like,

like, well, Eric, you're stealing. Yeah, but I like the fact that I was betting on me. I didn't have to wait for five other people. And so for me, literally, just to break it down, the reason why I take responsibility is because I own the power when I take responsibility. I choose if this thing changes or if it stays the same. I choose if it gets better or if it gets worse. And I'm going to tell you, that's what I love about Kyrie Irving. You say whatever you want to say. Kyria is saying, yo, if I'm going to make the last minute shot, I want to get full credit for making the last minute shot. Like no disrespect to LeBron James. If I make the last minute shot, the last defensive play, and we win a championship, I want to be able to share

fully in the moment. And I don't know. But when you look at Jordan and Pippen, it was almost like they were one. Right. never really said Jordan without saying Pippin. So for me, I'm like, yo, I feel Kyrie in that. I just want to own the rights. If I work hard, I want credit for it. If I make a mistake, I want to take full responsibility

for it. So that's just how I think. So that young person out there, once you give away, they did it, and they did it. You give away power. You give away how much money you can make, how much happiness you can have. I just don't want to do that. I want to own my rights and get all the rewards. So if you're

going to own the glory, you've got to own the consequences too. And so that seems like it makes a lot of sense. Because I think for a lot of people that they want to own the glory, but that immaturity comes into play when then there's consequences and they go, yeah, okay, I don't want that. I just want to look good when it makes sense. I don't want to look bad when it's also my fault. Yeah, got yin-yang, baby. Got to take them. Yeah. So what made you go into education? Did you just have a desire to teach other people what you were or were not taught? Do what works, not what you want to work. I got up on the microphone and I spoke and guess what happened when I spoke on the mic.

People who hate doing motivational speeches, like they would just be like, yo, can you keep going? When I were going to the classroom, I would shut the classroom down. You know, I would teach, and kids were just like, moms, my son never wanted to read.

He wants to read now. It was the only thing I was good at. I wasn't good at writing. I wasn't good at spelling bees. I wasn't good at standardized tests. I wasn't good at a lot of stuff. The one thing that when I did it, it was magical,

was speaking and teaching. So I figured, hey, that's what you're good at. You need to stick with this. Yeah, okay. So you found a natural talent and you lean into it. Speaking of leaning into something, you're known as the hip-hop preacher. But a lot of hip-hop values don't really mesh with religion. They don't even mesh with positivity at all sometimes.

So why lean into that branding? Because a lot of people associate hip-hop with, like, misogyny, materialism, violence. Why lean into that? New hip-hop. I'm taking it back. You know, that's not the origin of hip-hop. and where it was just, parents just don't understand. Right, yeah.

You know, my radio, that had nothing to do with the violence and some of the egotistic stuff that we see in this generation, no disrespect to this generation hip hop is theirs, they own it, they do whatever they want. But the generation I come up with, Queen Latifah, you and I, T, Y, Y, T, Y, and I, TY, Y, don't call me a B or Hote. Some of these artists give hip-hop a bad name. And so I'm like, yo, I'm taking it back.

I'm taking hostage. And I do believe that pure hip-hop is, consistent with, you know, the positive stuff that I talk about and there is a lot of positivity in it. And I don't want the legacy to be that it's what it is today. Like I want us to look at the body of work in hip hop. And like I said, in my generation, friends, how many of us have? Oh, yeah. That was positive stuff. So I relate more to the original hip hop in the late 70s, early 80s more than I do the hip hop of 2018. Now there are some great artists, some very positive artists in hip hop. let's make sure that we give them their credit. But to your point, there is absolutely way more negative hip hop than there ever was.

You're listening to The Jordan Harbinger Show with our guest, Eric Thomas. We'll be right back after this. Thank you for listening and supporting the show. Your support of our advertisers really is what keeps us on the air. To learn more and get links to all the great discounts you just heard so you can check out those amazing sponsors, visit Jordan Harbinger.com slash deals. And don't forget the worksheet for today's episode. That link is in the show notes at Jordan.

and Harbinger.com slash podcast. If you're listening to us in the Overcast Player, please click that little star next to the episode. We really appreciate it. And now for the conclusion of our episode with Eric Thomas. So you've got to fight those influences in the kids that you talk to. How do you counter something like that? I mean, if kids see, I don't know anybody, riff, raff or other guys on TV,

he's like the literal world's example of is acting like thugs, how do you come back and say something like, actually, it's cool to keep your promises and work hard and take responsibility for your actions and consequences? Because it's like, well, what track is that in? For me, I was featured on Meekmills album, you know, wins and losses. And so the thing I love is that, you know, Meek said, yo, yo, E represents this generation of hip hop.

You know what I'm saying? Like E is a part of this culture. So I'm going to put E on in his raw state of me being positive. And then as he's rapping or other rappers rap, I just excrapulate the stuff that is congruent with what I'm talking about. talking about. So I don't choose to talk about the murder and the selling the drugs. I talk about Meek Mills is right. Wins and losses. If you are going to be successful in this life, you're going to take some losses. You can't let that get you down. You're going to get some wins. It's just a part of

I think the year Brady went 16 and 0. They lost a Super Bowl. The next year they had a decent schedule and they won a Super Bowl. So wins and losses are a part of life. So I just tend not to focus on the negative. I pull out all the positive and I make kids focus. Now, I also say to kids, let's be honest. Look at the people that you look up to. Let's measure. How many years of success of these guys have? You know what I'm saying?

Like, let's measure it. One hit wonders that they last for three years, five years. So do you want your success to be three years, five years? Look at the people you look up to. Look at their life outside of social media. What's going in their life? Look at some of the decisions they make. Is that where you want to end up?

And if not, while I'm nowhere near perfect, let me be a modern day example of you of what happens when you live positive. You still, whatever these kids call it, have some celebrity status, if you will. I've been married over 27 years, went from GED to Ph.D. My son just graduated from Michigan State. My daughter is at Michigan State. You see the people that I run with in terms of athletes, just everyday people. You see the success that I'm having.

So I'm giving you an option. You could get with this or you could get with that. I'm giving you an option of mom, 17 years old, pregnant, Southside of Chicago, grew up without my biological father. I'm where you're from. These are the choices that I made. This is where I am at 47. Now, let's just be honest. For those kids who watch me, the people who watch me,

I'm not a one-hit wonder. Every year, the depth of the work, the reach of the work is global. So kids are seeing my stories with me and my wife and join ourselves, not divorce. And there's nothing against people who are divorced. Life happens.

But kids are getting to see, yo, ET is doing it this way. Man, I like the results. is getting. This guy, I like the results he's getting, but man, it seemed like it only lasts three years or four years. Again, you could get with this or you can get with that. I'm not telling you what to do. I'm just providing a viable option to kids all over the world and saying, you have choices. If I were you, I would choose the path that's going to take you to sustain success. Sure. So if you zoom out far enough on the timeline, you can see who's making good choices and who's

not. Because nobody's like, my role model is DMX. Right, like that faded at some point after he went to jail. Absolutely. And so the message of like drugs, guns, and money sounds great when you're zoomed in on the music video. Right on wax. Right on wax. Right on wax. And then you zoom out far enough and it's like, oh, yeah, he's broke now.

Oh, remember he got shot and then he went to jail and then they caught him with drugs and then they caught him with drugs again? Like you even look at OJ who was a huge role model for kids in the 90s and then you just think, oh yeah, but nobody's trying to be OJ right now. It's just sad right now. Right now. The story's not over. Right. Not right now. And you can look at the choices that were made like, oh, I didn't mean to kidnap those guys and steal from that.

It's like, oh, man, you just look at that and you go, ouch, you just fell so hard. I think the challenge, though, you talked about that bubble. We have to give kids options and say, hey, yes, this might be the path most travel, and this might be the path least travel, but let's measure it. And let's just see in the long run who has the most success. I look at Martin Luther King and I'm like, wow, just celebrated his birthday a couple of this. This guy's no longer with us in his legacy. I look at Mother Teresa. Every time I'm like, the 100, okay, this is amazing.

All right, forgive me, guys, we're going on this soapbox. This is unbelievable, though. They have, like, people, the top 100 people in the world. I'm like, how does Mother Teresa keep making it? There are people who are alive that are not making this list. Right. Like, I'm not trying to be funny, but there are people who are alive. And even in her death, her numbers, her stats, are still better than people who are alive and active and well and doing what they're doing.

So it's like a Walter Payton. She's like a Walter Payton in her own right in terms of a humanitarian. So again, some of the people that you mentioned, yep, three or four years. But a mother Teresa or Martin Luther King, we look at these people and we still go, wow, what humans they were. And we're still trying to be like them. So I just think in our era, and again, I do not compare myself to those people at all. But in this era, I think kids need to have a couple outliers that they can look to and say, you know, it is possible to come from where I come from and still make it to where I hope to be.

How do you tell people in a disadvantaged situation that they can become successful, point to these outliers or these role models, and then actually get them to believe you? It's really easy to watch TV when you're young and think, I'm going to do that. But then you get older and you kind of, at least I kind of go, I'm not going to be on Beverly Hills, 9-0-210 or whatever. Not that that was ever my dream, but like if it were. It was a good dream if it was. I would have wised up at some point.

But how do you get kids who are in that disadvantaged background to go, okay, so you mean to tell me that even though I'm 15 and I have a kid and my mom had me when she was 15 and I don't know where my boyfriend is, nobody's helping me with this? You're saying that I can not only get out of this, but I could go to college and get a career going. Like, who, what are you talking about? I think that most people who don't think about what they can become, they're on cruise control. I mean, I was on cruise control. My grandfather dropped out. My father dropped out. I was on cruise control.

And then one day I said to myself, like, yo, losing doesn't feel good. I want to win. And so I think those individuals who don't do well, it's not that they can't do well. It's just they never reflect. They never think. It's just like, yo, this is the life that was given to me. And I woke up one day and was like, yo, Eve, why are you taking what was given to you? You don't take what's given to you anything else.

If my cousin cared of me, like, yo, he got these shoes I wore for three years, had these. I wouldn't take them. Right. So why am I taking the academic legacy that my father? father gave me. No disrespect to my biological father. We have a relationship now, but he had multiple kids by multiple women. My grandfather, I never met, but he or he had multiple kids by multiple women. I was just like, yo, E, you don't have to, you know how it felt not having your dad in

your life. Like as an adult, I'm 47 years old. It's still painful looking back as a father who was there for everything my son ever did, not having my father in my life. So it's like, yo, E, you know what it feels like to lose. Why are you accepting it? at least try to win. And I just don't think kids who are disadvantaged ever wake up and say, I can live in Beverly Hills. Like, I can be a lawyer. They don't think.

And the day I woke up and realized, yo, E, stop giving what they take you and go out here and make your own. Like, even if you fail, do it on your own term. So I reluctantly studied for the GED and took the GED because my girl was leaving and said, I'm not going to college and dating you if you don't come.

Like, I'm breaking up with you. So I got the GED, and then I got the four-year degree. It took 12 years. And then I got the masters and didn't think I could read or write, you know, enough to get it. And then somebody was like, okay, when you got the math, go get the PhD. Try. If you fail, you try. And I got the PhD.

And it was like, yo, I could do all this if I try. But I think those who are disadvantaged, you are not disadvantaged. Actually, in no disrespect. But I talk about, you know, in my presentation, sometimes people like Tiger Woods, who won his whole life. when he experienced his first defeat, which I thought was his father's death. To me, that was like this guy,

his father had been there his whole life. And when he lost his father, man, it was like devastating. And I just thought him winning his whole life, winning early like that, that I just thought like, you know, Tiger Woods is a great dude. He just doesn't necessarily have the tools

to get back on his feet because he's never really been like down. And so I tell people, my homelessness is the greatest thing ever happened to me. I'm studying for PhD and guys are stressed out. And they're coming to me like, yo, E, we got to take these examples. We got stats. We got these tests.

I'm like, okay, and if you don't pass, you still get to go home. Yeah, yeah. You still get to go to the movie. You still get to eat. Like, what are you stressed out about? But I realized that they had been so successful that they didn't know how to take a loss. And for me, I hit rock bottom at 16. So everything has been up for me.

I remember doing voiceovers. It would take me an hour to do one line. And I was like, all right, E, you could get through this. You get out of trash can. Let's make this happen. Now I'm doing commercials, multiple commercials, regularly. So I really think the disadvantage don't understand. You're not disadvantaged.

Like, you have made it through so much. And if you could just get up and start trying and stop making excuses and stop taking what has been given to you and say, look, I'm about to write my own story. And to those young people who were listening, that's what the PhD was about. It was like, yo, with this PhD, I'm not. I can control my destiny a little bit more. You know what I'm saying? Because it's not like multiple motivational speakers have PhDs. So I'm like, yo, this is going to put me in a category where I can ask for the big bucks,

where I can ask for the first class, where I can ask to stay in the ritz. So I'm willing to go through whatever little pain I got to go through for six years. So for the next 40 years, I can live on my terms. That's what I would say to kid. Get to a place where you're not a victim anymore and you're pointing a finger. live life on your own terms. It's funny you should mention the car service thing because your assistant, I guess,

had told my wife assistant, hey, are we going to get a car service for him? And we were like, how do we explain this without looking like super ghetto that we're like, we'll call him an Uber, but it might be easier if he does it. Yeah, that's right himself. Yeah, absolutely.

I'm like, well, he's from where I'm from, so he might understand that this is not happening. Yeah, I was laughing because I went to the car dealership and they kept telling me, We've got the Q-55, and I'm like, oh, I'm good on that. I want a towel. We don't have any towel. Well, give me an Impala.

But we have a Q40. It's nice. I said, no, no, no, no. I'm sorry. I'm from Detroit. Yeah. I'd like an Impala, please. It's like, I just need to get there.

I don't need to think fancy. I'm not trying to figure out how to use this, like, European system in the car. Not in the car. No. I just try to get from point A to point B. And then Jen's like, do you think he's going to be a diva? I'm like, no, no, no. He's just used to being treated in a certain way because.

Detroit, you'll be fine. Yeah, I was like, he went to Michigan State. He grew up in Detroit. Like, he's going to be fine. No disrespect to that other school, but I went to Michigan State. It's just like real normal people. I went to Michigan and I wish sometimes I'm like, you know, I didn't go to school with a lot of normal people. That's the next level in Michigan.

That's the highest level you could go to. It was funny being there because I remember there were a lot of normal folks from where you and I grew up and there were a lot of, well, first of all, when I went to high school, everybody was white. There was like one black kid and we were like, oh, hi. Hi, how are you? All right, well, see you later. Like, I don't know how to handle the situation. I'm in a class with, there's multiple races in this class. We're talking about issues today.

Weird. Yeah, and I just felt, now retrospect, I just felt so bad for her because I'm like, how awkward is all this? But like, growing up in that environment, going to Michigan, and there's like the Black Law Students Association and Black Students in the Indian and all this. And I remember thinking, I literally never thought about the fact that these other groups exist and have different views and have issues. But what was really strange for me, and I don't know how it was at Michigan State.

I had a lot of friends who went to State, and they seemed a lot more integrated. At Michigan, I can definitely say I had a few friends outside of the norm, and I definitely had classes with a girl from Ghana, and we were pretty tight. But I don't feel like I got more diversity experience really outside of that. I feel like I actually got almost more isolated because I felt like I was outside their world.

and I know they felt like they were outside my world because we grew up so differently. You know, man, all of our schools in Michigan have that makeup. You know what I'm saying? I'm sure. And just being from the African-American community, of course, my lens would be totally different.

But I would say in terms of just being diverse, like state did it from me. And again, I was a part of the basketball program, a part of the football program. Coach Izzo allowed me to come in and do some work. Coach DeAnonio always opens the door. And so, you know, when you're dealing with sports, It's a different beast.

It's more of a camaraderie. It's like the military or something. It is, man. Way different. But I will say, I'll never forget, man. I was in one class. I still, to this day, don't know how I didn't get kicked out of the university. But I had a guy, a white male, young lady had brought some cookies.

And he said, you know, I confront him afterwards. He said he didn't mean any harm. But I never forget, he said to me, give me some cookies, cookie boy. And, bro, when you talk about, yo, I almost choking my man out. I can see. Wow, I can see myself saying something like that and not having any clue that that's effective. And that's what he said. He was like, you know, I didn't mean anything by it.

You know, he was going to get some cookies. I was just teasing. Like, yeah. And we actually afterwards built somewhat of a relationship because we had to confront each other. And, you know, it was a great dialogue where he got to understand my background and what boy meant. And then here's the craziest thing. I went to Australia. And in Australia, everybody's like, hey, boy, that's my boy.

Yeah. I was like, whoa. I'm talking my boy, Glenn Twitter. like, yo, he's like, yo, mate, we don't need anything about that, mate. Yeah. Like, that's just the word, you know, in our history, boy, that wasn't derogatory term. It wasn't, you know, it stripped you of your manhood. And my man was like, you, I just asked for some cookies.

Like, I wasn't, he was like, I wasn't really, you know, going there. And so, you know, again, like you said, your land, sometimes you could be sensitive. You know, for real, there are times, and I heard a lady said on CNN, you know, that we do have to be cautious because sometimes, based on your experience, you could think something. is racism. When it may not be racist, then she was like, yo, in some instances,

it's blatant racism. But that's what Michigan State taught me is you have to, and I didn't learn this just being honest from my grandparents or whatever, but I learned you have to judge people for who they are in their character.

Like, you can't lump people together and say that everybody in this ethnic background is this way, and you could trust everybody who that grew up on the west side of Detroit with you. Like, that's not it.

And Michigan State, I believe prepared me to be a global phenom. This episode sponsored in part by Michigan State University. Hey! Hey! They had to pay me extra because normally I only rent Michigan. This is what I love about the educational system. Like, your teachers have experienced it all.

That's what I love about teachers. They're great people. They could have been lawyers, doctors, engineers, whatever, and they come back. And I always tell kids, between a counselor, between a teacher, you know, administrator, principal, whatever, you have access to the entire world. You know how many colleges are represented in one high school or one middle school? You have teachers have gone, I mean, to a plethora of schools.

So you talk about touring, they could take you, talk about going out of the country, I'm sure, doing one of their spring breaks. You know, they traveled outside of Florida or California. So they know the process. They can help you get the paperwork done. So anything you need, there's not an excuse. There's a teacher. There is a counselor.

There's an administrator that can work. walk you through it. There's the parent association. There's a coach. You know, coaches travel all over the world. You know, so there are absolutely no excuse. And let's just be honest. With technology, if you have a smartphone, you can probably fill out an application, passport application, or at least get started, you know, right there on your phone. So no excuses, guys, you are not in fear when it comes to the basketball court. You're willing to take anybody on. I don't care how tall you are, how short you are. When it comes to getting on that court or that field, you will take on any body at any time. I'm not saying anything wrong with that. I admire you for doing it. But don't

back down in the classroom. Don't let a math test scare you. Those of you who are in martial arts, whatever. Like, there's a lot of you kids. It's not afraid to fight somebody else. So if you're not afraid to fight another human, don't be afraid to fight biology. Don't be afraid to fight writing. Even if you're not good at it. Like, don't run from it. You face it and you let bullies know. You might fight me and you might win, but you're going to put up so much effort. You don't want to go deal with somebody else. You know, and I tell people, I'm not perfect. I still have my struggles. But the one thing I will not do, I will not back down. I have phenomenal skill, but I have phenomenal will. And if you learn to fight it, you can get through anything,

anything in this world. There's a blueprint. Somebody has written about it. Somebody has left it in a book or some video you can watch on YouTube, but just do me a favor. Stop fighting in sports, stop fighting physically and start fighting mentally and emotionally. This is a great place to wrap, so I don't want to screw that one up. But is there anything I haven't asked you that you are like, oh, we got to talk about this real quick? The only thing is I've been married 27 years, going on 28 this year. If you can find love, guys, find it. I have two beautiful children that I adore.

Money is good. Travel is good. Cars is good. All that stuff is good. but there's nothing like healthy, wholesome relationships. So if you got a buddy you guys are close with, like stay loyal, whatever. I'm just saying relationships. Your parents, go back, show homage to your parents.

But just don't think that it's just about the house, the car, and stuff. If you have to do it alone, I don't think it's as sweet. Me going home and my daughter treated me like I was Michael Jackson when she was five, six years old, that meant the world to me. My son being at Michigan State and being a part of the basketball program and enjoying that experience with my son, he's got an elite eight ring Final Four, you know, the Letterman Jack, like doing it with him. It was so much better than when I just went to Michigan State by myself.

So look, relationships are key. Money has its place. Stuff has its place. But there's nothing like being in healthy, wholesome relationships. So make sure on your journey to success, you don't disrespect, destroy relationships because you're trying to get rich. Take the people with you. It's not lonely at the top if you take people with you.

Big thank you to Eric Thomas. he is just such an energetic guy, as you can tell. Great message, really nice guy to be around. Great conversation as well. There's a video of this interview on our YouTube channel at Jordan Harbinger.com slash YouTube. And also in the show notes, there are worksheets for each episode, including this one, so you can review what you've learned here from Eric Thomas.

We also now have transcripts for each episode, and those can be found in the show notes as well. I'm teaching you how to connect with great people and manage relationships using systems and tiny habits over at our six, networking course, which is free. That's over at Jordan Harbinger.com slash course. Don't wait, don't do it later.

Don't tell yourself you're going to just do it at some point in the future. The number one mistake I see people make is postponing this type of thing, not digging the well before you get thirsty. Once you need relationships, you could be too late. You probably will be too late to make the ones you need in the moment. Procrastination leads to stagnation when it comes to your personal and business relationships. And you know that's true because it rhymes. Definitely no cognitive fallacy there.

These drills are designed to take just a few minutes per day. This is the stuff I wish I knew 20, 30 years ago. It's not fluff. It is crucial. It has been for my business. And just in general. You can find it all for free at Jordan Harbinger.com slash course. By the way, most of the guests on the show, they actually subscribe to the course and the newsletter.

So come join us and you'll be in smart company. In fact, why not reach out to Eric Thomas, tell him you enjoyed this episode of the show. Show guests love hearing from you. and you never know what might shake out of that. And speaking of building relationships, you can always reach out and or follow me on social. I'm at Jordan Harbinger on both Twitter and Instagram. This show is created in association with podcast one,

and this episode was produced by Jen Harbinger, Jason DePhilippo, and our engineer is Jay Sanderson. Show notes and worksheets are by Robert Fogarty, music by Evan Viola. I'm your host, Jordan Harbinger. Our advice and opinions and those of our guests are their own. And yeah, I'm a lawyer, but I'm not your lawyer. So, and by the way, I'm sure as heck not any kind of doctor nor a therapist.

So do your own research before implementing anything you hear on the show. You know, sometimes I barely can hold my own life together, just like everybody else. Remember, we rise by lifting others. The fee for this show is that you share it with friends when you find something useful or interesting, which should be in every episode. So please share the show with those you love and even those you don't. In the meantime, do your best to apply what you hear on the show so you can live what you listen. We'll see you next time.

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