The Jordan Harbinger Show - 939: Teen Blackmailed in the Buff Has Suffered Enough | Feedback Friday

Episode Date: January 5, 2024

The high school principal wants your girlfriend's nude photo for his 'investigation' into the hacker who got her to send it. Welcome to Feedback Friday! And in case you didn't already know it, Jordan Harbinger (@JordanHarbinger) and Gabriel Mizrahi (@GabeMizrahi) banter and take your comments and questions for Feedback Friday right here every week! If you want us to answer your question, register your feedback, or tell your story on one of our upcoming weekly Feedback Friday episodes, drop us a line at [e-mail]. Now let's dive in! On This Week's Feedback Friday, We Discuss: Is it odd that the high school principal wants your girlfriend's nude photo for his 'investigation' into the blackmailing hacker who — posing as you — convinced her to send it? [Thanks to attorney Corbin Payne for getting us out of yet another pickle!] You spent four years getting a degree in a field that isn't hiring at the pay rate you're worth. Should you forge the path forward by starting your own business, continue working for peanuts, or just give up and go for a new degree? Your wife doesn't buy your estranged father's attempts to make nice with your family — since his dire medical diagnosis — as anything more than a narcissistic compulsion to regain power in the relationship. Does she have a point, or has Dad really turned over a new leaf? As an entrepreneurial woman building your successful business over the past 10 years, you find that clients seem to expect a level of personal involvement or interest above and beyond the service you're providing. How can you get them to respect your boundaries without sending them to the competition? You don't mean to come off as a closed book when meeting new people, but you have trouble understanding when it's appropriate to share thoughts and details from your personal life or keep them to yourself. How can you strike the right balance? Have any questions, comments, or stories you'd like to share with us? Drop us a line at [e-mail]! Connect with Jordan on Twitter at @JordanHarbinger and Instagram at @jordanharbinger. Connect with Gabriel on Twitter at @GabeMizrahi and Instagram @gabrielmizrahi. Full show notes and resources can be found here: jordanharbinger.com/939 This Episode Is Brought To You By Our Fine Sponsors: jordanharbinger.com/deals Sign up for Six-Minute...See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

This episode is sponsored in part by Conspiruality Podcast. You know how I'm always talking about critical thinking and spotting manipulation? Well, there's a podcast that's all about dismantling new age cults, wellness grifters, and conspiracy mad yogis, basically the wild overlap of spirituality and misinformation. It's called the Conspiruality Podcast. The hosts, a journalist, cult researcher, and a philosophical skeptic, dive deep into how this stuff spreads, from Project 2025 and the Heritage Foundation's dystopian vision of the future to how former leftists get pulled into far-right conspiracies.

An interesting episode to checkout is called Speaking Truth to Goop, where Jen Gunter breaks down the pseudoscience behind the wellness industry in a way that is super entertaining and eye-opening. It's sharp, funny, and makes you a lot harder to fool, which, if you listen to this show, you know I'm all about that. From exploring cults to analyzing our cultural and political landscape, the Conspiratuality Podcast will help you stay informed against misinformation and resist fear tactics.

Find Conspirality on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome to the first Feedback Friday of 2024. Wow. I am your host, Jordan Harbinger. As always, I'm here with Feedback Friday producer, a guy who's literally still shiny from his hot yoga class this morning.

Gabriel Mizrahi. That's accurate. Congrats, by the way. I'm being a total parody of yourself, Gabe, making my job so easy this morning. Yeah, man. You know, I'm just sweating out all those cliches over here. Yeah.

Gonna take more than hot yoga, I'm afraid, to sweat that stuff out. On the Jordan Harbinger show, we decode the stories, secrets, and skills of the world's most fascinating people and turn their wisdom into practical advice that you can use to impact your own life and those around you. Our mission is to help you become a better informed, more critical thinker. During the week, we have long-form conversations with a variety of amazing folks from organized crime figures, jihadis, former jihadis, gold smugglers, hostage negotiators, and astronauts. On Fridays, though, we take listener letters, offer advice, play, obnoxious soundbites,

and roast Gabe for holding weird poses in 110 degree heat for an hour like a total psycho. You're referring to happiness, my happiness? Yes, it's a lifestyle, Jordan. I want to try it. You have to. I need to see what this almost dying while you exercise thing is all about. I can't wait to introduce you to it. It's the greatest form of exercise.

It's amazing. I think I'm going to be miserable, but I'm willing to give it a shot. As always, we've got some fun ones and some doozies, and I can't wait to dive in. Gabe, what's the first thing out of the mailbag? Hey, Jordan and Gabe. My girlfriend and I are juniors in high school and have been dating for almost two years now. We are in what we consider to be an extremely healthy relationship. We communicate about everything and we've set several rules to ensure that no double standards exist in our relationship. One of those rules is no nudes. However, that's such a crucial, however. Yeah, yeah. One of those rules is no nudes. Weird rule to have, but okay, here's the problem. However, early in our relationship, my Instagram account was hacked. The hacker sent messages to all the girls in my DMs asking for nudes. He also went into my chat with my girlfriend and saved

an old, topless picture of her. He then DMed my girlfriend on a new made-up Instagram account demanding that she sent him private videos. If she didn't do this within 24 hours, he threatened to release the photo to the school. Ooh. Okay. So we've heard versions of this story many times over the years. Really stressful. Obviously, really sorry this happened. We immediately told our parents and called the police. Great move, by the way. I'm sure those were very tough conversations to have, but from what we've learned on the show, that is exactly the right thing to do. Yeah, the scammers, first of all, they're counting on your shame and silence. They're in it for quick cash, generally. So mostly,

if you don't play along, it's just not worth their time to keep harassing you. They have a zillion other targets. They're going to give up and move on to an easier one. So he goes on, we were told that there was nothing we could do other than speak to our school and delete our chats. I added two-factor authentication to my account. The hacker never did any harm to us,

apart from major psychological stress on my girlfriend. Yeah, I mean, I'm sure that was awful for her. Just another reminder that you're no nudes policy, which is, again, I've never heard anybody having that as a policy that's a very 21st century policy that you need to have. When I was these people's age, you didn't need a no nudes policy because you would literally have to take photos on like a disposable camera, take them to write aid, have them developed. Like, you're not doing that. You're just not.

It's a good policy to have no nudes. And it's just not worth it in this day and age. Certainly not over social media, text messaging, anything that makes a copy. A secure encrypted messaging app with somebody you're married to, maybe? But still just why risk it? I mean, come on, man. First of all, you got the real thing right in front of you. Do you really need a sterile, digital reminder of it on your phone, too?

I mean, go live your life. That's my old man yelling at the cloud's take on, well, boobs. I second that. I don't fully understand. It's not worth the risk. So he goes on. Now, eight months later, the vice principal of the school has asked my girlfriend's mother to send him the photo, as it's needed in the investigation. Okay.

But my girlfriend and I find it extremely unnecessary for an administrator to have a 16-year-old's nudes. Am I crazy? What can I do in this situation? Signed, about to collapse, perhaps due to this judgment lapse, over my girlfriend's dicey snaps, months after the scandal wrapped. Wow, it just keeps going to go. The sign-up just keeps going. I thought you were going to go with some never-nude thing from arrested development. I'm sorry, I don't even know that reference. Yeah, there we go. Well, I can see. that hot yoga hasn't diminished your rhyming skills. Yeah, still a point in your favor. Actually, I think they've only gotten better since I started hot yoga, so. I don't know.

We can revisit in a few months. I don't think wicked good podcast sign-offs is one of the documented benefits of working out in apocalyptic heat. Yet. Yet. You never know. Maybe that Bickroom guy was onto something, aside from all the speedos and shady sex stuff. And speaking of shady sex stuff, I'm very sorry that this happened to you and your girlfriend. Being hacked, being extorted, it's extremely violating, especially when it involves content like this. I mean, your poor girlfriend, I really do feel for her. So this strikes me as odd as well.

I'm guessing the investigation involved both the police and your school, and maybe your school has its own process that it needs to go through. So the cops are like, eh, no harm, no file. We don't have time for this. And the school's like, yeah, we still investigate this. I'm not really sure. A lot of schools have what's called a mandatory reporting. statute plus whatever internal procedure that they have to go through to shield themselves

from liability and make sure students aren't being abused or trafficked or whatever. So I guess there's a world where the vice principal needs the evidence for his paperwork, but it does seem very strange for frigging Mr. Tabaleski, the 58-year-old vice principal, to be calling your girlfriend's mom eight months later, like, hey, that naked photo of your 16-year-old daughter. Yeah, can I get a copy of that? You know, I need it for my, my paperwork. Yeah, all my official paperwork for my investigation, a full school year later. I just don't, I'm not sold. Oh my God, you just nailed that guy. That's so funny. What is this like Chicago public school administrator from the 1980s? Right. That was so good. That's like a Ferris Bueller character.

Yeah, yeah, you're right. This is how it strikes me. And it's also weird to get the request in the form of a phone call. Don't you mail letters asking for evidence? I don't know. Maybe I'm overthinking this, but the whole thing is just doesn't quite add up to me. I hear you. But also,

the fact that he's asking the mom for the photo does make it a little less suss to me. It's not like he's asking the girl for the photo. I'm assuming that if he's asking a parent to send something as sensitive as this to him, I mean, that's got to be on the up and up, right? Does it got to be?

I don't know. We don't know what he's doing with it. And I know this is Dark Jordan peeking out a little, but part of me wonders if he's asking the mother to just make it. seem more legit. Like, I can't possibly be doing anything inappropriate. This is all out in the open. I reached out to her mother to ask for copies of her daughter's nudes. Oh, you know, like the old Larry Nasser philosophy, like just keep it in the open and make it seem. Yeah, right. Oh, the parents

were in the room while I abused their kids, so I couldn't have been abusing their kids. It's like a creepy. Creepy C-YA. Yeah, yeah. Okay, it's possible. We don't know what he's doing with this photo, but he could also just be complying with the school's policies, like you said. So I don't know if it's fair to assume the worst about him at this stage. I hear you. It just seems a little clunky and weird. The only thing we know for sure is that investigating an underage nudes scandal puts everyone in a dicey position. Yes.

But we wanted to run all this by an expert, so we reached out to defense attorney, friend of the show, and apparently our newest resident expert on underage nudes, Corbyn Payne. And Corbyn's take was, even giving this vice principal the benefit of the doubt, he's still playing with fire here. Corbyn told us about some school employees in Colorado who were charged some time back with possession of child sexual abuse material and sexual exploitation charges. Serious felonies stuff people get murdered in prison for for viewing nude photos collected during an investigation just like this one. They only avoided prison time when a judge dismissed the charges. We're going to link to an article about that story in the show notes.

Very interesting. I mean, talk about a nightmare. So Corbin's first thought was the vice principal, he really needs to be. careful, especially if this is all on the up-and-up, because it could still blow up in his face. But also, Corbyn felt that you're right to be a little skeptical about this request. He said it could be a legitimate investigation, but he has some concerns. So his advice was, you and or your girlfriend should probably consult with an attorney. Corbin hates to give you even more to worry about, but he said that there's a surge of

minors getting prosecuted for sexual abuse material when they sexed pictures of themselves to other minors. one of the many unfortunate consequences of sharing nudes, especially in states with stricter or older laws. In fact, Corbyn pointed us to another case, this one in Minnesota, where a 14-year-old girl was charged with a felony for sending a photo of herself to a boy that she liked.

And we'll link to that in the show notes as well. I mean, that's, I would like to think, not what the law was designed to prevent and protect against. Now, the good news is that you and your girlfriend are probably in the clear, given that the police seem to have shrug this off, you haven't been charged with anything. But Corbyn's stance is, man,

it's always worth taking extra precautions with stuff like this. Corbin also said that your girlfriend's mom would be well within her rights to request proof of an ongoing investigation in writing from the vice principal before handing over anything, but definitely consult with a lawyer first.

Because now that I even say that out loud, I'm just like, ah, still don't hand it over. And to ask school administrators, by the way, to explain what exactly is going to be done with the photo, who's going to be receiving it, how it'll be stored to ensure her daughter's privacy totally fair, and get that in writing, not like, oh, yeah, no, it'll be fine. I'm going to keep it nice and safe over the phone. I want a document that

shows it's going to be stored and crypted and the only people that have access are the school board members investigator or whatever it is. Right. Like, is this ultimately going to the police and he's just the one collecting it for them? Although that sounds weird to me. I doubt that's how it would work. Or is this purely for the school's purposes? Is it going to be on some hard drive in the principal's office? Is that encrypted? Is it safe? And if so, why?

Yeah, you know what I'm also worried about here is if the police have shrugged this off, the kids are like, oh, God, thank God, that's over. And the school suddenly like, oh, yeah, we're still investigating it and we need evidence. Why? What are you going to do? Are you going to then apply some crazy strict policy to the students retroactively? Like, oh, now we have to expel both of you because something, something trafficking in photos and it goes against this, and the evidence is you sent us the photo. I mean, what is this

going to be used for? If this is essentially over, you giving them evidence to continue investigating, I don't see how this works in your favor at all. They're not going to find the person who hacked your account by getting the photo. Certainly not the school administrators. Right. So they dodged a bullet with the police. So why relight that fire by sending this photo months later? Yes, that's where I'm at with it because I can just kind of, I'm racking my brain and I can only imagine that this is going to be used against him and his girlfriend and not for anything else. And on that note, Corbyn also said that he would ask for the school's policies covering investigations like this. You know, review the handbook, get a handle on the process, how it's supposed to go. Take careful notes on any deviations from

standard procedure. And if you spot any, I would flag that with the administration and or the police or encourage your girlfriend's mother to do that because I think this is more her job. And make sure that this investigation really is proceeding the right way. Yeah, that's sound advice. And again, I'm really sorry this happened to you. This is awful. But as Corbyn said, it sounds like you and your girlfriend have responded very well to all this.

You're standing strong. I commend you for that. But look, if the nude scandal is making it hard for you or your girlfriend to function to keep your grades up, if your mood or outlook has taken a hit, if there are any lasting wounds from this, I would really encourage both of you, but especially her, of course, to talk to a therapist.

To quote Corbin here, This is a violation, and it's also a sex crime. I mean, let's not sugarcoat this. I would understand if it left your girlfriend pretty shaken. And asking for the photo eight months later might just dredge everything up again, which, by the way, is a great excuse for the mom to say, no, thank you. This is already in our past. We're not dredging this up, and he can demand all he wants.

Probably has no power to do that. There is help out there and many, many people who have sadly been through something similar. So I hope she finds the support that she needs. and not to sound like a total old fogey here. I know young people have different feelings about this, but in a world where hackers and especially scammers, because your account really didn't get hacked, somebody just guessed your password or reset it

in a way that was really simple because you didn't have adequate security. Instagram and Facebook don't have amazing security, but it's not the security's fault. It's people not using proper security. Anyway, in a world where hackers and scammers like this can damage your reputation and get you in serious trouble with the law,

don't send nudes. Guys and gals, Seriously, I just don't see how it's worth it. It will always go wrong at some point. We get so many letters about this, more than we take on the show, obviously. It can be illegal to send these photos. It can be illegal to receive these photos. And, by the way, it can be illegal to have them saved anywhere on your computer or phone.

This is a real risk. True story. If you have a topless photo of your high school girlfriend and now you're like 38 and married with two kids and that photo is still on a hard drive somewhere, in the iCloud, congratulations, you're in possession of child sexual abuse material, and you can be prosecuted. So this is really serious stuff. Doesn't matter that you're married now.

Doesn't matter that she's older now. Doesn't matter that she's aged out. Doesn't matter that the photo's old. None of that matters. So we're wishing you both the best. Hope this investigation wraps up quickly and respectfully. And good luck. You know what else, Mr. Tabaleski wants to get his cringy little pause on?

The products and services that support this show. We'll be right back. Thank you for listening to and supporting the show. All the deals, discount codes, and ways to support the podcast are on one page. Jordan Harbinger.com slash deals is where you can find them. The AI chatbot also knows all. So please consider supporting those who support the show. Now, back to Feedback Friday.

Okay, what's next? Hey, Jordan and Gabe. I'm a 24-year-old woman and I'm graduating from college in six months with a bachelor's degree in plant sciences with an emphasis in horticulture and cropping systems. I'm kicking myself for not researching job availability in my field before spending four years getting a degree. Okay, well, look, I hear you, but most people don't do that. Colleges don't help you do that. I mean, they should, but they don't.

But that doesn't have to stop you outside of a few fields. What you major in doesn't matter. What you do with it, how you tell the right story, that's really what matters. Agreed. So she goes on. Needless to say, there aren't many jobs available in my field. Any jobs that are available are jobs that pay horribly and that I would qualify for without a degree. I currently work at the research greenhouse for my university as a research assistant.

I love it, but it doesn't pay great. The man who runs the research program loves me and keeps pushing me to get a master's and do research for him. He's a very successful man in my field and a great connection to have. But I don't have any desire to do research. Well, if you don't have any desire to do research, then definitely, do not get your master's degree. This is not your path. Sometimes that means disappointing somebody that you like and admire, and, you know, that sucks, but you don't owe it to this guy to do grad school if this is not the world you want to be in. My husband and I started a small online business

selling house plants. It was doing okay, and I liked it, but it fizzled out because we were too busy with school. I have also been paid by people a few times to draw up landscape designs for them. I really like creating landscape designs, and I'm good at it. But most people get a, different degree for that. So far, I've drawn them by hand, but that's not sustainable. If I wanted to do more of this, I would have to teach myself the design software that most people learn while getting a degree for landscape design. Okay. So this is clearly where your passion lies, and I think it's really important to pay attention to that. I love that you've already been hired by people to do designs. I think that's great. So exciting. I don't know. I feel like that's her path, but let's see where it's

goes, I'm now approaching a crossroads. I've always wanted to start my own business, something I can call my own, but I'm terrified of failing. Do I stay at my current job part-time and work on restarting my house plant business or design landscapes on the side? Should I just go for it and quit my current job? Do I try and find a job somewhere else, even though it probably won't pay great? Do I completely start over with a new degree? Signed, the hamstrung horticulturist. Great questions. You're struggling with something that so many young people struggle with, people of all ages, actually. And I was excited to read your letter because, oh, there are some ideas in here that will, I think, apply to anyone at any age of their career, trying to make a change

or launch their own thing or rewrite their story. So my general take on breaking into a new field or making a career transition is 80% of it, probably more, is the story that you tell in the relationships that you develop. Obviously, there are certain fields like medicine, engineering, language translation where you need certain degrees or certifications or experience or you just can't actually do it. You can't talk your way into being a doctor unless you're Frank Abagnale, which turned out to be a thing that didn't happen. And you'll always need to bone up in certain departments no matter what. But in your case, if you can tell a compelling narrative about how you started out in horticulture, you discovered your passion for design and landscaping, and now you

want to join an architecture firm or a landscaping practice so you can design people's backyards or whatever, that is enough to pitch yourself and or get jobs in this world. I mean, you're already being paid by people to do this. So you already have work experience. This goal of yours has already been validated. But you need to make a shift from viewing your degree as a liability to viewing it as the first stage in your journey. Sure, if you knew you loved landscaping earlier, maybe you would have done a different degree, but you didn't. You can't go back and you're not ready or excited to do another degree, which, yeah, probably isn't even necessary. So your only option is to start working with what you have and learn how to tell that story.

I mean, I went to law school, right, and I should have gone to broadcasting school or whatever, but I didn't, and I never went, and here we are. And here we are, and that does not stop Jordan from killing it at roasting me every week. So do not let this stop you. I don't think he took that course in law school. No, that was just a pure passion project, really. All right. The story that you want to tell is, I freaking love plants, and I follow that passion into horticulture and cropping systems in school, and I worked in a research lab doing super interesting work with a brilliant guy in the field, and that gave me a real understanding of the science of plants.

But then I realized, I don't really want to do research. I want to be hands-on doing design and making clients happy by doing their landscaping. That story makes perfect sense to me. It's precisely the kind of story a 24-year-old would tell and can tell well. there's zero expectation that you should have it all figured out in advance at your age. I actually think employers and clients will be super moved and intrigued by that story. More intrigued than meeting somebody who had her landscaping career plotted out since she was 12. Look, opportunity and luck will always play a big role in any career transition.

And that's why I'm always banging on about relationship building, because relationships are the most effective and the most reliable way to maximize your opportunities and your luck. It's no coincidence that the luckiest people out there are usually the most connected people out there. What seems or looks like luck or being in the right place at the right time, that's usually a function of being close with people

who show you where those right places are and who open those doors. And you've heard me talk about six minute networking, now over at six minute networking.com, by the way, it's a little easier. You heard me talk about that way too much, so I'll just leave that there. Now, about the design software,

how you have to learn that special software to really take this thing to the next level. I get how that might be daunting. It probably does feel like a roadblock, but just trust me on this. It is not. You can learn any software on your own. Sure, you would have learned it

if you did a landscaping degree, fine, but you didn't. So now you get to learn it in a new way. You can buy super affordable classes online on any topic. We're going to link to one for landscaping design in the show notes just as an example, and you can learn on your own, or you can play around in Google or YouTube questions when you don't know how to do something. It's actually super fun.

This is no different from a musician who has to learn how to use pro tools to produce her own album when she didn't go to art school or, I don't know, an aspiring financial analyst who needs to learn Excel when they didn't go to business school. Or, yeah, a podcaster who has to learn all kinds of random audio software because they went to law school. Don't let software stop you. Most software now is designed to be learnable and easy. you know what, I just thought of this as well.

If you don't know something about a software and it's very specific and you can't find the answer, often you can go on a website like Upwork and find somebody who works with that software as a freelancer and you could hire them instead of doing a project for you freelance to show you how to do things in that software. And they can just do a screen share and teach you, oh, you want to learn how to 3D render a design you made. Yeah, I'll just show you what I'm working on right now. You can create relationships that way with people who really know what they're doing. doing. Usually those people are hired to do a job, you can have them teach you how to do the job they're doing, and often they won't mind doing it because they get paid hourly. I love it. That's a

great tip. So there's a bunch of practical stuff for you. I want to take a moment to talk about your fear. And to me, this is really the heart of your letter. You have found your passion from the sound of it. You know that landscaping is what you really care about. And you want to start something that you can call your own, but you're afraid. So let me start by saying that Nothing, nothing could be more normal than that. Every entrepreneur, every business owner, every artist, every self-starter has this fear. In fact, I think you'd be a little crazy not to be afraid of going all in and taking a chance on yourself. So here are a few questions that I would invite you to explore.

The first one is when you say that you're afraid of failing, what are you actually afraid will happen to you specifically? What does failing mean to you and what does it look like? and if you did happen to fail in the way that you imagine, what would you do at that point? How would you move through that? How would you process it and pivot to something else or make some adjustments and try again? What could you do now to mitigate your chances of failing?

Good questions, but also what if you succeeded? How would that feel? How can you invest in yourself and your relationships to maximize your chances of succeeding? It's also a really good question because I think a lot of entrepreneurs focus on the worst-case scenario. but it can be even more useful sometimes to think about the best case scenario and then figure out, you know, how do I work backward from there? But also a good question is, what if you fell somewhere

in the middle? You know, what if you succeeded in some ways and you kind of failed in some other ways? What would that look like? And honestly, what would you do then? Would you just keep learning and growing? I think you would. Look, take it from a guy who started a bunch of businesses and works with a lot of entrepreneurs. You can't convince yourself that you're not afraid. The feeling is there. But you can use that fear to protect yourself and come up with a solid place. Most of us, me included at various points, we let our fear paralyze us when we really need to study it and harness it. Yeah, but here's what you have to remember. Not trying at all is also failing.

I would actually argue, yeah, that's the best way to guarantee failure. It's so true. So actually, I wonder if her hesitation about learning the software is also maybe a way to let herself off the hook here. You know, a good excuse to avoid chasing this dream. Because it's easy to go, well, I would have learned this crucial skill if I had done. done the degree I should have done for the job I really want, but I didn't. So, you know, then you have a reason to not chase that dream and to stay safe. But once you go, okay, I care about this field, so I'm going to go learn the software myself so I can do the work I want to do, the dream becomes real.

And now you're on the hook. You're committed. So you might succeed. You might fail. But either way, the stakes are real. And yeah, that can be very scary. For sure. And that's another good question to explore, whether all these questions about what to do are also maybe a way to avoid doing the one thing you have to do, which is just take the next step toward the field that you love. So in terms of whether to quit your job or keep your job or find another job or restart the house plant business, that we can't answer for you. That answer will come if you really sit with all these questions, talk to people you trust and admire your husband, your boss, your peers, and just keep experimenting and playing, the house plant business sounds cool. And if you can make it successful and enjoy doing it,

awesome. If you can design landscapes on the side, wonderful, you have to decide if you really love it enough to put in the work. I can see you doing a couple things to make money while you invest in this landscaping goal. And there's also a nice connection between the house plant business and designing gardens or whatever. So that's something to consider. I agree. But honestly, whatever you do, my advice is to just keep playing. I mean, play with this passion of yours, play with the software, play with your designs, put something out into the world. Maybe you post a free garden designed for people to download on the internet. Maybe you do a proposal on spec for a client.

Maybe you create some cool house plant starter packs and post them on Instagram or whatever it is. See what life throws back at you. In my experience, that's the most reliable way to know what works and what people really want. But I would definitely not pursue a new degree until you are 100% sure that you need it. Agreed. Our generation and the next generation and the previous generation, we're all programmed to think we need college to qualify us for something and it's just not true. more school won't solve all your problems.

Make these moves on your own for a year or two and see where you are. You'd be amazed what relationships plus skills plus experience will do for you. That's better than school every time. Trust me. I love your curiosity. Love your passion. I admire the entrepreneurial spirit. But if your own company is really what you want,

then you're going to have to become a lot friendlier with your fear. So at the risk of sounding like one of those gurus Gabe would probably fall for because they teach such hot good yoga classes, man. I'm going to leave you with the old adage. Courage is not the absence of fear, but acting despite it. And I have no idea who said that. But it doesn't matter. Keep that idea close, and I know it'll lead you to some exciting places.

Good luck. You can reach us Friday at Jordan Harbinger.com. Please keep your emails concise. Use descriptive subject lines. If you're finding dead squirrels in your mailbox, your neighbors are eavesdropping on your therapy sessions through the walls, or you're losing your younger sister to a suspicious commune slash cafe cult, whatever's got you staying up at night lately.

hit us up Friday at Jordan Harbinger.com. We're here to help and we keep every email anonymous. All right. What's next? Hey, Jordan and Gabe. My wife and I have been married for six years. She comes from a very troubled family. Her father was an abusive alcoholic and her mother was a neglectful narcissist. My parents became her metaphorically adoptive parents when she was around 15, which is how we met. And she became very close with them. But she struggles with relationships, involving parental figures. Since our marriage, her relationship with my parents has deteriorated, especially with my father.

I know my dad isn't perfect, and my relationship with him was significantly stressed as well, partly because of my wife's relationship with him, but also because of some personal things between me and my father. Long story short, my wife and my father used to work at the same company, and when my father got promoted to a managerial role, several of the employees began grumbling about how my wife was going to be.

benefit from a lot of favoritism. To quash those rumors, my father publicly said that if anything, he would be harder on my wife because she's family. She left that company a few months later, citing a situation where she felt that she was singled out unfairly. At the time, I did my best to validate that, but also protect their relationship, even going so far as mediating a discussion between them. Fast forward four years, and we hardly go over to see my parents, despite living five minutes down the road, and my wife hardly engages with them outside of pleasantries in person. Afterward, she always has choice words about the get-together. Then, recently, my father got a medical diagnosis that will significantly impact his quality of life. I decided to bury the

hatchet with my father and focus on trying to rebuild our relationship. Since then, my dad has made significant attempts to demonstrate his love toward me and my entire family. He told me he's proud of me several times when he hadn't said those words to me in years. He always tries to make intentional time to talk with us when we visit. He's buying me thoughtful gifts, and he always shows love to our three-year-old son. I really feel like he's turned a corner, but my wife refuses to believe that these changes aren't a narcissistic compulsion to regain power in the relationship, so that he can try to manipulate things again. She started, then stopped, comments about something encouraging my father has said to me and seems indifferent to the affection he offers.

She has to stop herself from saying things when he compliments or encourages me. How do I continue to rebuild the relationship with my father while also encouraging my wife to give him another chance at loving her and our children? Signed, feeling sad that my wife is still mad when I've got this new dad who wants us to be a triad. I take back what I said, Gabe. I think hot yoga might actually be killing some brain cells. Yeah. That sign off honestly did fall off a little bit at the end, so fair. It's not your finest work, but your skin is positively glowing.

So worth the tradeoff, I guess. Wow, so weird to hear those words from your mouth. I don't know why. Yeah, it was a little, a lot of character. This is a tough question, though, Gabe. I'm imagining this situation from each of their perspectives, and I can kind of identify with all of them. Our friend's perspective, of course,

he's caught between his father who does seem to have changed somewhat and his wife, who still has her guard up around her father-in-law slash adoptive father. Man, it's a little confusing when you marry your sister, all right, pal. Then there's his adoptive sister, bet he doesn't introduce her that way. Here's my adopted sister slash wife, Angela. No. Then there's his wife's perspective, right? She has this difficult childhood, an abusive alcoholic father, a narcissistic mother who neglected her. I mean, that's super sad to start. And she clearly feels burned by the father, and I can definitely understand that. And then I also relate to the dad who might have done some not so great things the way he treated his daughter-in-law when they worked together.

Other things he did to our friend here that he didn't really elaborate on, which I find kind of interesting. But the father's older now. He seems to be trying to do better. Maybe the situation where you adopt a girl and then she ends up marrying your son, but then she also works for you. I mean, give the guy a little credit for maybe trying to navigate those waters as well. It's tricky. Yeah. Yeah.

So he probably deserves that chance to do better if he's really, genuine with it. So I can see how this situation developed, and I think there's a lot going on in this story for his wife, especially, much more than is even in this letter. Right. I think we got to start with her. Yeah, let's do that. So she has a past, right? A very painful past. And my sense is that those early relationships with her parents made her extremely vulnerable to being injured by parental figures. Our friend alluded to that, right? Yes. But I think it also made it hard for her to stay consistently connected to those parental figures to be able to express her feelings and work things out with them when things don't go well. Because I'm guessing no one did that for her growing up.

Totally, because here she is. She's very hurt by this guy's father. And I can't tell how warranted that is what exactly happened in that situation where she was supposedly singled out unfairly at work. Yeah, if she was. Right. That's an interesting thing too. I mean, maybe he was just being a decent manager. And by trying not to play favorites, he came down kind of hard on her. once. And maybe, look, who knows, maybe that was appropriate. Maybe he did single her out or maybe she was to blame for whatever happened. What we do know is that she took it unusually hard. And that was amplified by the fact that it was her father-in-law slash her adoptive father from the time she was 15 years old and by the fact that it probably echoed these earlier wounds from her parents.

But it's also possible that he was being kind of a dick or he was appropriately tough on her but didn't communicate that well, and the wires got crossed, and things didn't get repaired back then, and dot, dot, dot, they can't be in the same room together for five minutes. But whether the dad was right or wrong, this is the crux of the issue,

how they are working through all of this. Right, or not working through any of it. You have his wife, who is not going to her father-in-law and saying, you know, you really hurt me when we work together. I feel you singled me out unfairly. I thought we were family.

Then you treated me very differently. Now I'm really angry with you. You know, what the hell was that about? And then you have this father who also is not going, I know you're angry at me, and I'm not entirely sure that that's fair. I had my own pressures as a boss, but I want to make things right. I want to be part of your life. So let's figure this out.

They're both clinging to their feelings and their stories, and no one is really trying to understand the other or invest in a relationship that can survive this injury. Dad, I think, is doing his best by giving gifts and showing love and taking a real interest in their son, which is wonderful. but that's not exactly getting to the root of the problem. But then there's this idea that he's only doing those things to regain power and manipulate the situation again. I don't quite know what that means. Yeah, it's a little abstract.

But if that's true, then, I don't know, is it possible that she has a point? I mean, she might. But again, I wonder if she's transferring some qualities of her own parents onto her father-in-law because her grievances and her fears sound eerily reminiscent. of an abusive father and a neglectful narcissistic mother. I agree. It's like, are you just projecting your bio-dad's negative qualities onto your new father-in-law?

Kind of. When he says or does certain things, she might be interpreting them through the lens of this parental figure is trying to control me, trying to manipulate me, trying to abandon me, whatever that template is. Yes, or I need to abandon him before he can abandon me. Oh, yeah, interesting.

Well, that fits with what our friends said about the parental figures thing. And also with her decision to leave the job and then stay far away from her in-laws, that fits too. Yeah, as opposed to what, like pulling back, looking her wounds, processing her feelings. Yeah. And then going to her husband or her father-in-law and saying, look, I'm really upset. Maybe it's my past. Maybe it's you, probably both, but I want to talk about it. And maybe they do talk and they understand each other better and they repair things. Or she tries to do that and her father-in-law just cannot listen to her or relate to her. And then that confirms that he isn't. really a safe or close parental figure for her, but then she knows for sure. Right. That approach

just isn't in her toolkit. She has the screwdriver, but she's missing the needle nose players. As you can tell, I'm very handy around the house. It's such a good metaphor, and you didn't hesitate at all. It was great. She's going to have to develop that capacity, which, by the way, that is not just a skill. I think that's the product of doing some very deep work on her own past, probably in therapy. And the dad is going to have to do something similar, because my sense, is that he's not the greatest communicator either. He's more of a, let me show you how much I care by giving you gifts and playing with my grandson kind of guy.

But he's not bringing quite as much baggage to their dynamic from the sound of it. Now, there's one other angle we got to talk about here, which is this thing he said about how his wife bites her tongue when his father says something encouraging to him. Right. She has to stop herself from clapping back when he tells him he's proud of him and stuff like that.

That's a little confusing. Like, why rain on his parade? I'm going to make sure you know that those compliments aren't legit. That's weird to me. So that's probably the residual anger and suspicion about her father-in-law's motives. But I wonder if there might also be some envy in the mix here. Yeah, interesting. You mean like, I wish I had a dad who said nice things to me and meant them?

I know she's mad at her father-in-law, but it might also be hard for her to watch her husband have a dad who's being kind and loving now, and hard for her to watch him enjoy that so much. given how different her parents were. You know, I could see that because she could be going, look, I'm not crazy about your dad, but I'm glad you have a nice relationship with him. Just, you know, keep your guard up.

What she's saying instead is I kind of resent that you're eating up as compliments and encouragement, and I kind of want to undercut that when we're alone together so you don't, what, get too high on your horse? Exactly. So you'll have to decide if that fits with what you know of your wife, but it is just, you know, one more possible contour to the situation. Although now that we're talking about it, that might not just be envy, right? It could also be some jealousy. Good point.

Like, she might be competing with her father-in-law for her husband. Yeah, over who gets to have him, so to speak, because this kind of does feel a little bit like a family love triangle. It's a very good point. So when she tries to undercut his dad's praise or remind him what a bad guy he was, that might be her way of keeping her husband in her corner on her side. Yeah, exactly. Or actually, you know, more to the point, not.

losing him because that might be her big fear, the core of those old wounds from the abuse and the neglect and the narcissism, this fear that people will leave or let you down, or that some highly seductive and manipulative parents will somehow take important things away from her, including her relationship with her husband. Yes, and that might be what makes her perceive her father-in-law as a real threat, exactly. And, you know, it just occurred to me by punishing her father-in-law, she might actually be punishing her own parents. Again, to your point, Gabe, by locating parts of them, especially her father, in him. Yes, for sure. And this would also be a really great question for her, whether she struggles not just with

parental figures, but also with people in positions of authority, older people in general, because those templates might follow her around wherever she goes. So how do you continue rebuilding with your dad while also encouraging your wife to give him another shot? Well, I think it starts by accepting that you and your wife have very different experiences of your dad. And I mean that both in terms of you have very different life experiences with him, like she worked with him and you've just been his son, but also you look at your dad through such different lenses because of your pasts. And you might have different opinions about whether he deserves a second chance. Like Jordan said, it's definitely worthwhile to consider whether your wife has some fair point about your father.

That might be a little hard for you to see objectively as his son. But also it's worth asking whether her fears about him are just entirely informed by her own parents. The more you can communicate with her about all of this, why your dad hurt her so badly, why you feel he deserves another chance, why she feels he doesn't, why you're willing to forgive him, whether you're still holding him accountable for some of his mistakes appropriately, the more you guys can talk about all of that together, the better. But this might be a situation where your wife just cannot have a close relationship with your dad. That might be fair, it might be unfair.

and you and your son have a relationship with him, and that's just how it is for a little while. Longer term, the key to encouraging your wife to give him another chance is, well, as you can probably tell, I think you're going to have to rewind the tape a little bit. You're going to have to start by appreciating and helping your wife appreciate

why she has gotten to this point. And that probably means unpacking the childhood stuff and the work drama and her relationships with parental figures in general and why it's difficult for her to believe that they can change. You know, why is she being so, rigid. Why does she believe that he did this thing? Why did she interpret events this way? And helping her explore some of that with you. But you have to approach all of that from a position

of curiosity and compassion, patience, and also a genuine desire to understand where she's coming from. It can't just be, I need you to get over this parents thing so you can be cool with my dad already because I've decided that we need to bury the hatch and that's just the way it's going to be. That is not going to work. Yeah, I totally agree with that, Gabe. But is that really something he can do? I mean, realistically. It's a lot for any partner to take on. And no, it might not be something that she can do with him. And it might not be appropriate for them to do together.

So therapy, hitting the couch extra hard today. Ideally, yes, because she has some profound wounds. And she's probably bringing them, like we said, to a lot of relationships. I think it's just the most pronounced with his father right now. But that doesn't mean that he can't invite his wife to talk about them. He can't be her therapist necessarily, but he can still be a friend and a real source of understanding. and support and hopefully some perspective. For sure, I just think it's going to be hard for her to hear some of this from her husband

who's part of this triangle. Right. Also, couples therapy is a great option because a lot of this is about how you guys relate to each other and work through these disagreements and also how you're raising your kids. The other side of this triangle, of course, is your dad. And I would try talking to him too. Maybe you can encourage him to reflect on that time at the company. Maybe you invite him to reach out to your wife, tell her he wants to work on their relationship,

maybe when the time is right, you can mediate another conversation. This is a process, and it might require some very frank and potentially uncomfortable conversations. But listening to one another, recognizing how you all got here, potentially forgiving and releasing some of the pain, that's really the only way forward. And I'm sorry, really sorry to hear that you're stuck between the two of them. I'm very sorry to hear about your dad's diagnosis. I hope it's not super severe.

It sounds like it might be. This is all just very hard. And it sucks that you can't try to rewrite this relationship with your dad without it coming at your wife's expense. But this is also a great opportunity for everyone in this situation to grow. Whether everybody wants to, that's a different story. And then the question becomes, what kind of relationship do I want to have with my dad apart from my wife? Which I hope we don't get to that. I hope she can hear you out.

And I hope you can return the favor. Start there. Good luck. How about creating your own little love triangle between you, our show, and the amazing sponsors who support it? We'll be right back back. If you like this episode of Feedback Friday and you found our advice valuable, I invite you to do what other smart and considerate listeners do, which is take a moment and support our amazing sponsors.

All the deals, discount codes, and ways to support the show are at Jordan Harbinger.com slash deals. You can also search for any sponsor using the AI chatbot on the website as well. Or email me, Jordan atjurbinger.com. I'm happy to surface a code for you. If you can't find it, can't remember the name. That's how important it is for you to support the sponsors who support the show. Now, back to Feedback Friday.

Okay, what's next? Hi, Jordan and Gabe. I've been running my home maintenance business for 10 years, and we now have a terrific team of eight well-trained staff. We go above and beyond to provide excellent service, and I have a fantastic base of about 150 clients, most of whom have been with us for five or more years. That's so cool.

Yeah, it sounds like an awesome business. Well done. My problem is that I'm exhausted from constantly fighting consumer expectations. I'm a small woman in a male-dominated industry, and a lot of people assume that I will be slower, weaker, and cheaper than my male counterparts. Clients seem to expect a close, friendly relationship with me, but I'm not realistically able to be best friends with all of them. I receive feedback that amounts to, I thought we would have an emotional connection. I hoped you would never send staff and always come personally. Or they'll increase our tasks, but keep our hours the same and then complain about a lower standard of work as we rush around trying to complete everything.

Yeah, I've actually heard the same thing from a bunch of female friends who are also entrepreneurs or business owners that certain people, usually guys, they expect a level of involvement or interest from them above and beyond the service that they're actually providing, which, okay, you could chalk that up to them being interested in you, or it could just be that they're needy and demanding and want to feel cared for, but they're more comfortable asking for that from a woman than a man. They're not going to ask their carpenter Mike to stay and have a cappuccino, but they see Amanda the super bubbly contractor and go, hey, stay, have a scone, look at all 200 of my photos from my trip to Maui or whatever. What a nightmare. But it's weird to me,

very weird to me, that they're expecting that from the person who's doing their home maintenance. I mean, if she were running a babysitting agency or a coaching business or something, I could see clients wanting her to be more emotionally available or whatever, but why do clients want that from the person who's fixing their air conditioning. I don't get that. Yeah, this is not your hairdresser and you're like, we just don't click. I'm just sitting there awkward. No, it's weird. And it's maybe because her business is about people's literal homes, their private space, so that creates a certain intimacy of feeling they want her to be a part of their lives. I don't know. I mean, I had a landscaper and a designer and a builder and I've never seen them since the house.

We're done. We're done here. They're nice, fine, but that's it. We're good. Or to your point, some of these clients are just really needy and inappropriate and they're looking for some form of female attention. It might not even be romantic. It might just be like motherly or nurturing or something. And she just happens to be the person they feel they can get it from. Exactly. It sort of sucks, but it's an interesting challenge for a business owner to deal with creatively. And we'll get to that. All right, carry on. I raised my rates earlier this year, and it's clear that I can't raise them further. Clients are struggling to pay, and our country is in a recession. I've discussed this with a few male friends in our industry, and they have never faced

these issues. They can send their apprentices to jobs without the clients asking where they are, and they're charging significantly more than I do, too. Recently, a client hired us because she felt we would empower her to be more vocal about her needs. Then she fired us shortly after, feeling that we had not done so. Vocal about her needs? Again, I'm so confused by this. Why is a client asking a contractor to help her become more confident? I don't know. It feels like they're bringing a lot personal stuff to her. It's fascinating, isn't it? Again, I wonder if they feel more comfortable bringing some of these demands to a woman, especially if the client is also a woman, like in this case. But I'm with you. She's your HVAC repair person, not your freaking therapist. Part of me's

going, these are the clients you should be happy to lose because they're just too difficult and demanding. Sometimes losing a client is a blessing, but I'm a hold off for a minute. feedback like this is devastating, as I work extremely hard to ensure that I set reasonable expectations and am upfront about how the business operates. I've never encouraged or implied that I am interested in being this present or emotionally close to clients. I'm just a friendly, charismatic person who needs to know a little about their personality in life in order to do a good job. Ah, well, that's an interesting clue, I think, to all this. Yeah, my hunch is that she is amazing and friendly and she's great with people and she's kind and she's present and she takes an interest,

which is great customer service. And then people respond really strongly to her and certain personalities try to take advantage of it. It's a tough bind to be in because the answer can't be, stop being friendly and charismatic, just be cold and boring and they'll leave you alone. Then she's going to lose business. Right. Okay, she goes on. This business is my baby and I'm very invested in doing a good job. But now I'm putting off emails because I feel like there's never any good feedback in there. I'm at the point where I wonder if I care too much to be a good business owner. My resilience has been at an all-time low, and I'm now wondering if I should just quit and work for someone else. Do you have any tips for taking the sting out of unhelpful but persistent feedback? Can you give me a

reframe here? Signed, learning to be defiant with these overly needy clients when they are so damn reliant. Okay. Well, this is fascinating. And something every business owner deals with to some degree. But clearly women more than men, and I totally understand why this is so frustrating. But let's just take a moment to appreciate. Part of the reason you're in this situation is that you've built an incredible business. You're friendly, you're responsive, you're passionate about providing great service. So basically you care, and because you care, people respond strongly to you as they should,

finding people who genuinely care, especially contractors who are notoriously flaky, slash sloppy, slash distance, slash terrible at customer service, it's all very rare. It's a superpower, really. So on one level, this is a champagne problem. But there's a flip side to that, which is when you care, people want a lot from you. And because you care, you feel obligated to satisfy them, even if what they're asking for is unreasonable, which makes it harder to put your foot down. And also because you care, their negative feedback probably hurts so much more. So when they're unhappy, it's not just, oh, Daniel's angry because he wants more than I can give. It hurts and it's demoralizing. And now it's infecting your entire outlook on being a business owner. Honestly, I can relate. When you're the

owner, everything is personal. When I get hate mail or even some light criticism, I take it probably way more personally than I should. It's totally normal. So what I want to encourage you to do is hang on to this amazing quality of yours, this great capacity for caring, this pride in your work, but also develop some stronger boundaries and a new lens on the feedback. So first of all, when clients act in ways that are objectively unreasonable or unfair, I think you need to learn how to say some version of, okay, I hear that you're not happy, I'm going to do everything I can to make it right. I can't always be there on site myself. I can't do half hour phone calls with you right now. I do have an amazing team. Jesse's coming out to fix the AC. Lisa's doing the

landscaping. I told them to take great care of you. You are in an amazing hands, hands I personally chose. So talk to me about the new fence, the garden, the heating system, whatever it is you're doing for these clients. Tell me how the project is going. What can I do to make you happy with the job? That kind of thing. And obviously not all at once, but whatever the situation calls for, you can have a diplomatic and positive response that still kind of checks a difficult client. Now, you don't need to be cold or short to make your point. You can be warm and caring. inappropriately available and boundaryed with these clients at the same time. Obviously, I wouldn't say, look, I'm not here to have an emotional connection with you,

you chump. I'm not your therapist. I'm not your girlfriend. You don't have to do that. But that's the subtext when you essentially tell a client, I'm here to make you happy within the appropriate definition of our relationship. I'm expecting you to agree to that definition. Because where this gets dicey is when they ask for something that's inappropriate.

and then you cave because you're afraid to piss them off, which probably then only empowers these exact people to ask for more, or because it's hard to stay kind while you draw a line. And I get it. It's a tough line to walk. And yes, I think it can be harder for women than men to walk this line sometimes. Maybe because women are often taught from a young age to make other people happy sometimes at their own expense, often at their own expense.

So maybe because there's a woman your natural impulse is to be nurturing and which again, those are superpowers in the right amounts. Or maybe it's just because sometimes men can be really freaking uncomfortable to deal with when they're asking you to essentially hang out with them on the job and you got to tell I'm sorry, bud, but I'm great at what I do and I'm super reasonable and you hired a contractor, not a girlfriend. But drawing those boundaries, that's a key skill for any business owner who's dealing with clients, man or women, any niche.

And I've had to do the exact same thing with my clients back in my coaching days. I made friends with a lot of guys who came through my programs during the program, after the program, hanging out, keeping in touch for years, still keep in touch with a bunch of them. But it wasn't because they paid me, and the friendship happened after our professional relationship had pretty much ended. So that's your task right now to learn how to do that without losing your pride and passion for the work. For sure. And also to do it with a certain grace and style that doesn't alienate too many people. The other boundary we need to talk about is the one closer to home, you know, when she gets this difficult feedback from people. Jordan, it was interesting. She called that devastating, and I get it. Getting criticism from a customer when your whole business is about being amazing with people, that really hurts. But for something to be devastating, it has to touch a part of you that is very vulnerable to it. So that's the other side of this equation that you can work on. Not just managing difficult clients so they don't overstep, but figuring out what has to be. happens inside of you when they say stuff like this. Now, we don't know you very well, but to Jordan's

point earlier, you're friendly, you're charismatic, you love making clients happy, and I'm guessing that getting bad feedback makes you feel like you failed somehow, not just at work, but maybe even as a human being. So in my view, part of your job is to start playing with a new idea here, which is customers can be angry with me, they can be disappointed with me, and it might not always be a reflection of me. And also, people could be disappointed and I can still be firm in what I can and cannot offer. And that doesn't make me bad or necessarily put my whole business at risk. Now, that is a little bit of a hard shift to make. So I'm not glossing over that. You might always deal with these personalities. And that's just one of the really tough things about not just being in your

field, but being a woman in this field, especially when clients are demanding and you have to satisfy them. But when I hear you call this business my baby, when you say that you're very invested in doing a good job, when you say that you don't want to look at your inbox because I feel like there's never any good feedback in there and I'm at the point where I wonder if I care too much to be a good business owner and maybe I should leave all of this behind and go work for somebody else. What I'm hearing is a person who is very identified with her business,

who might sometimes equate her self-worth with other people's opinions about her, including people who are objectively annoying, a person who sometimes cares about people at her own expense and whose solution is to go work for somebody else where she won't be in the line of fire anymore rather than on trying to develop a new approach to handle these difficult clients. And that is the sort of person

who can be very wounded by criticism as opposed to say, you know, mildly annoyed or kind of bummed or temporarily worked up, which is appropriate. I'm not saying that emails like this shouldn't bother you As the owner of this business, unhappy customers should bother you, and it is part of your job to deal with them. What I am saying is, let's try to appreciate why they bother you so much. And whether there's a new stance with these clients that might allow for a little bit of a healthy separation

and a greater tolerance also for other people's negative feelings in a way that does not end up tanking your whole outlook on what sounds like an amazing business. Yeah, I would love for her to do that, but also just knowing that there are super, annoying people out there. I also want to give you some permission to let certain clients go if you can't make them happy without bending over backwards. Some people are just never satisfied or they're so demanding that they're simply not worth the money. And that is just a reality of client service. When I was with my last business, a training company of sorts, I always had to balance sales goals with problematic clients or people that I knew were going to be more trouble than they were worth. It's not easy,

especially when it's your money. You know, you see dollar signs and you're like, that's a problem for future me. I don't envy that guy. You know, I want that check now. So maybe the reframe here is your goal isn't to make every customer happy all of the time, but to focus on the clients who allow you to make them as happy as possible in the services that you are willing to offer them. And hey, maybe that means focusing on fewer customers at the rate you currently charge so you can actually make the business more profitable and less stressful. Or providing great service to people you can actually make happy is how she can eventually raise her prices, which would be cool.

That's another interesting subplot here, gave the price thing. She said her male counterparts charge more, and I'm sure that's true. But I also wonder if this impulse to be so accommodating to her customers is also why she finds it hard to say, hey, rates going up, or yeah, we can do these three extra things you ask for outside the scope of work. Here's what it'll cost. It's just another idea to consider. Also, I just want to say one more thing here, which is you have to remember that most

customers only write in when they are angry. It's a really unfortunate reality of customer service, and it can completely distort your view of your business. So when you check your inbox and there are three emails from people yelling at you for refusing to be their emotional support blanket or whatever, stop, take a breath and remind yourself that there are literally dozens and dozens, possibly over 100 customers right now who are thrilled with your service, and they are not writing you an email because there is nothing wrong. Yes. It took me years to remember this. Unhappy people, fire off mean emails, happy people sit at home quietly because there's nothing to complain about and they assume the contractor knows they're awesome. That's why feedback skews negative a lot of the time. Bottom line, everything you're dealing with is very normal and you're doing great work here. You've built an incredible business. That is no accident. But before you bail on it, I would try a new approach with these clients, figure out how to process their feedback in a way that doesn't wound you quite so much. And part of that art, is learning to separate the information from your feelings a bit more,

processing your anger or your sadness or your panic, rather than running away from your inbox or even your whole career. And I know you can do this. We're rooting for you. We hope we were as emotionally available to you in this response as you'd hoped. And if not, you can always leave us a one-star review and ruin our days and make us question our entire calling. Good luck.

All right. What's next? Hi, Jordan and Gabe. I've always been a private person. I've never put a lot of personal things on social media. I sometimes tend not to volunteer information in a conversation if we weren't already talking about a similar topic. In my mind, it makes sense to inform people of the goings on in my life only if it includes or affects them. Otherwise, I'm always happy to answer questions.

Unfortunately, this has caused issues for me, mostly in romantic relationships where this privacy comes off as intentionally keeping someone out of my life, or like I'm hiding something, or as just a lot of, a really odd thing. And I don't realize that I've done it again until someone's feelings are hurt. What can I do to become aware of when I should open myself up? Signed, try not to make people cross when I become a locked box. Great question. First off, kudos to you for noticing this pattern and wanting to work on it. That's fantastic. That's half the battle right there. What I'm hearing in your letter is a real desire to connect with people to have richer relationships. I think that's part of you noticing this pattern too, and that's a great sign. So look, it's perfectly fine to be a somewhat private person. If your privacy is important to you or you just don't feel the need to

disclose a ton of information or you're careful about who you open up to, I wouldn't beat yourself up for that. Where this tendency becomes an issue is when it holds you back from certain experiences, namely the experience of being truly connected to people, being vulnerable, having fulfilling relationships, you have enough data now to know that this is kind of a thing. Being private is sending certain signals. It's apparently hurting some folks. Some people just find it odd, which tells me there's more to this than, you know, oh, I'm just a quiet guy. So my question for you is, actually I have a few questions. What if, and just go with me on this first second year, because I might be totally off. You might disagree. This is an exercise. What if being private

is a way to keep someone out of your life? Or to just keep them at our length a little bit, maybe in ways you're not even aware of. What if you are hiding something, even if it isn't some big, deep, dark secret? Maybe it's something smaller, like how you're truly feeling, or how you showed up in a certain situation, or even how you come across when you talk about yourself. What I'm getting at is this. Is there a part of you? And it might just be a tiny part. That's a little uneasy about other people knowing things about you, even in these kind of mundane ways. That's what I would explore if I were you. write down the answers, challenge yourself to dig underneath this,

oh, I'm just a private person thing, maybe talk it out with a friend if you can stomach opening up about this. I realize that's why you're writing in. Gabe, it's funny, I can relate to this guy because I've definitely been like this at certain points in my life. And it's like, oh, am I shy? Am I private? I don't even know. For sure, me too, definitely. And just like our friend here, I also considered myself a private person.

And I still am sometimes. I thought I wasn't interesting or people didn't need to know everything about me. But then over time, you grow up a little bit and you're like, is that really true? Or am I just a little uneasy about other people knowing me better? Or is it safer in a conversation to not reveal as much information and let the other person do all the talking? Or is it just a little anxiety provoking to take up a little more space, you know? That's exactly it. I think when we hoard information or hide parts of ourselves, it's not just because we're shying away from the spotlight or we think that we're not that interesting.

everybody's interesting. It's just that opening up can be uncomfortable and we're usually self-protecting in some way. Right, or we have some ideas about whether we deserve to open up, you know, whether it's okay. Right, he did say that he's always been a private person, which means this tendency probably does go back a long way. I would be curious to know what his childhood was like.

You know, did his parents take a genuine interest in him? Did they encourage him to open up? What were his other early experiences? Did people validate him when he shared? stuff about his life. Those early messages are hugely impactful. I mean, just look at the wife from question three, the one who's arguing with her father-in-law and had the whole falling out with the family, you know, the one with the difficult parents. It's just fascinating. Like, who your parents are and how they listen to you affects how you show up in these conversations. So depending on the house

he grew up in, I can definitely understand why he might have grown up to become somebody who says, well, I'm just a private person. It's just easier that way. When really underneath that might be a whole massive feelings about why it pays to be quote unquote private. Yes, of course, because being a private person might allow you to control what people know about you. It might help you control how they perceive you or could even help you control what you know about yourself. You might not even be in touch with certain things because you're not sharing them with other people in the first place. I mean, look, being vulnerable, we've talked about this so much on the show. It is hard. It can be uncomfortable, even for people who are more practiced with it. So

being private might also be a way to protect yourself from that very raw feeling of just being kind of exposed. But of course, being exposed in that way is a beautiful thing and it's table stakes for any good intimate relationship. I mean, it is intimacy, literally. So hey, here's an idea. Might be a great exercise for you. The next time you start a new relationship, especially a romantic one, what if you tell the person, all right, here's something about me. I can be kind of private. I can be a little guarded sometimes I don't mean to be. I just don't share a lot about myself naturally. That's hurt some people in the past. It's something I want to work on. So I just wanted to tell you that. And if that ever gets hurtful or weird, please tell me. And I'll try to open up a little bit more. I think just saying that

will go a very long way in avoiding this pattern. I think the other person will really appreciate that. And it'll make it that much easier for them to bring this up if it becomes an issue, which might be how you start to work on this. I love that. And you know what I love about that? Just saying some something like that to somebody, that isn't just saying that he wants to rewrite this pattern. That is rewriting this pattern. Because now he's volunteering an important piece of information about himself, the fact that he doesn't volunteer easily. So taking a chance and saying something like that would be a huge step for him.

For sure, hey, and look, if he does that over time, it will get easier to open up. It just takes some practice and willingness to try things a new way. And look, you can still be judicious about what you share about yourself and with who. There's still a place for privacy. you don't have to do a full 180 to have successful relationships. It's more about playing with different levels of vulnerability and noticing what happens to you and the other person. Do you get closer to them?

Do you get further away? Is it scary? Is it exciting? Do you regret it? Do you enjoy it? Maybe a little bit of both. I'm guessing both. And that's relationships, baby.

So dig into this. Give it a go. You're on your way already. I know it. Good luck. Hope you all enjoyed the show today. I want to thank everybody who wrote in, everybody who listen, thank you so much.

The best things that have happened in my life and business have come through my network, the circle of people I know like and trust. I know we brought it up earlier, six-minute networking.com. It's free. It's not gross. It takes a few minutes a day. I wish I knew it 20 years ago. Dig the well before you get Thursday.

Build relationships before you need them. It's on the think-ific platform at six-minute networking.com. And yes, both the number six and spelled out six-minute networking.com. I got both. Show notes and transcripts at Jordan Harbinger. dot com advertisers discounts and ways to support the show all at jordan harbinger.com slash deals our a i chat box can also point the way you can email me i'll point the way i'm at jordan harbinger on twitter and instagram you can also connect with me on lincoln gabe's over on instagram at gabriel mizrahi or on

twitter at gabe mizrahi this show is created in association with podcast one my team is jen harbinger jays sanderson robert foward i'millio campo and of course gabriel mizrahi our advice and opinions are our and I am a lawyer, but I am not your lawyer. So do your own research before implementing anything you hear on the show. Ditto Corbyn Payne, remember, we've rise by lifting others. Share the show with those you love. If you found this episode useful, please share it with somebody else who could use the advice we gave here today. In the meantime, I hope you apply what you hear on the show so you can live what you learn,

and we'll see you next time. You're about to hear a preview of the Jordan Harbinger Show about how sanctions work and whether or not they're effective. At the base level, a sanction, which is a law. or regulation that is intended to disallow access to the U.S. financial system or to U.S. goods or to services from U.S. citizens is a sanction. People want to hold dollars. They want access to the U.S. system.

They want to list on the New York Stock Exchange, right? These are real elements of power in a global environment where money, power, economic influence is a part of competition and warfare. I often said at the Treasury Department, our job strategically was to make it harder, costlier, and riskier for America's enemies to raise and move money around the world. But that's the essence of this power, and it sits between the talking of diplomacy and the hard power of our military. And that's why people resort to it so often.

But I do think there are going to be challenges fundamentally to U.S. predominance in this space. Challenges to the dollar, challenges to the payment system, and challenges to the notion that this is the safest, most secure place to hold your money, to invest in the most attractive place because of our capital markets, rule of law, et cetera. That's why I think some of these state actors have an interest in undermining the credibility of our institutions. Like it or not, the economic and financial domain is a domain of conflict and competition. Do you want to be legitimate and be able to operate in the global system? To learn how the U.S. wields its financial power against terrorists, rogue states, and global crime syndicates, check out episode 863 on the Jordan Harbinger Show with Juan Zarate.

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