The Jordan Harbinger Show - Bonus: How to Stop Falling for Everyone You Date | Stereo Sunday

Episode Date: January 3, 2021

Welcome to Stereo Sunday, a little Stereo app-sponsored experiment we did live in front of a studio audience of you! This time around, we answered questions from listeners. It went a little something like this... Full show notes and resources can be found here: jordanharbinger.com/bonus-stereo-sunday On This Week's Stereo Sunday, We Discuss: You discovered -- and had to break the news -- that your mom's boyfriend was cheating on her, but she married him a few months later anyway. To your dismay, now she's having doubts. What can you do? As someone who's been dating for just a few months after a long-term relationship ended, why do you get attached so easily, and how do you avoid these feelings (at least until it's a mutual exchange)? You and your friend are both struggling with the mental and physical challenges that accompany type two diabetes, but she isn't as careful with her diet as you are and she seems genuinely puzzled that there are consequences. Is there a way to help your friend without being a nagging, self-righteous a-hole? If you've put your all into a business only to have it fail, how do you overcome the sting of this failure and drum up the courage to try again? You know you have the work experience to fill a job opening at your company, but your imposter syndrome kicks in when you read its prerequisites -- in particular, a degree you don't have. How can you make a case for your qualifications even though you don't check all the boxes on paper? What industries and potential side hustles have been positively affected by the COVID-19 pandemic and might be good opportunities for someone looking to pivot? You've been out of the workplace for so long that you're not sure where to even begin now that you're ready to get back into it. What's a good first step?  How do Fiverr, Upwork, and Mechanical Turk compare for freelancers looking to make a buck? Download the Stereo app here! Connect with Jordan on Twitter at @JordanHarbinger and Instagram at @jordanharbinger. Connect with Gabriel on Twitter at @GabeMizrahi. Sign up for Six-Minute Networking -- our free networking and relationship development mini course -- at jordanharbinger.com/course! Like this show? Please leave us a review here -- even one sentence helps! Consider leaving your Twitter handle so we can thank you personally!See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Welcome to the show. I'm Jordan Harbinger. On the Jordan Harbinger show, we decode the stories, secrets, and skills of the world's most fascinating people. If you're new to the show, we have in-depth conversations with people at the top of their game. Astronauts, entrepreneurs, spies, psychologists, even the occasional former jihadi, undercover agent, drug trafficker, arms dealer. Each episode turns our guest's wisdom into practical advice that you can use to build a deeper understanding of how the world works and become a better critical thinker. But today's so we're going to be taking listener questions from you. It's just like an episode of Feedback Friday on the Jordan Harbinger Show,

only it's going to be live here in the Stereo app. This is something we do every single week on the Jordan Harbinger Show on Feedback Fridays. Today it's just a special live show here in the Stereo app. We're opening it up to everyone following along with us today. This is our fifth and final episode of Stereo Sundays. It's a little experiment. We're doing sponsored by the Stereo app for you. It's a little bonus.

You can check out the Stereo app in your app store and follow along live with. and lots of other interesting folks right there inside the app. And if you're a listener to the Jordan Harbinger Show, the podcast itself, if you're wondering how I managed to book all the great authors and thinkers and celebrities every single week, it's because of my network, and I'm teaching you how to build your network for free

over at Jordan Harbinger.com slash course. And most of the guests on the show, they contribute to the course, they subscribe to the course, come join us, and you'll be in smart company. Now again, I see some questions coming in. That's great. In a moment here, we'll start with listener questions directly from you. Submit them right inside the stereo app. Please, if you can write your question out in advance, that'll make it easier for us.

We'll get through them all in a timely fashion. When you write things out, your thinking is clearer. That's why books are better than random internet or radio talk shows in many ways in terms of clarity. There's a button on the chat there with a little speech bubble and a microphone. You can shoot us a brief question about anything that you want. work, life, love, the pandemic, really, anything keeping you up at night these days or follow-up questions about any of the advice that we're giving here today. Happy to help, excited to hear from you. Now, Gabe, why don't we start with an anchor question so we get things kicked off? I already

see questions coming in. That's excellent. I'd love to do an anchor question just so people know the format that we're looking for. Sure. So our first letter comes in and goes like this. Hey guys. Three years ago, my brother and his girlfriend discovered our mom's fiance texting another woman trying to hook up. I was living with my mom at the time and I had to tell her. That's crazy. And then listen to her crying from the basement. She confronted him, but married him a few months later anyway. I hated being around them for a long time after that. Today, she opened up to me saying she feels disconnected from him and she will probably never trust him after what happened. She's having doubts. I feel retrompt.

I was just starting to like the stepdad again, but now I want to hurt him for hurting my mom. So any advice? What would you do? Wow. Damn, that's a, that's a bangor of a question. Bangor of an anchor question. Yeah. So this is some crazy family drams and you find out that your mom's fiancee is cheating.

She marries him anyway, which just like full body cringe. That's just awful because of course you know exactly where this is going to where this is going. Now she's having doubts. Good. I'm glad she's having doubts. It isn't just burying this still. So that's an upside. Meanwhile, we're still sitting there in the middle like I told you so, right?

And having PTSD flashbacks to when she had a breakdown over this guy and you could hear it from the basement. I got the idea that she lives, the writer lives in the basement or maybe went to the basement to play, I don't know, freaking PlayStation. Yeah, that was an interesting ambiguity. Was the mom crying in the basement to try to keep it from everybody or is the person writing in living in the basement and could hear it? through the walls like floating down from upstairs. Either way, I guess if the crying is audible on a different floor of the house, there's some real crying going on. Some's going on, yeah.

This is all made more complicated by the fact that your stepdad. You said you're starting to like him, so he doesn't sound like a complete POS, right? Because normally you'd hate the guy forever if he was also a jerk and insensitive and all these other ways. But it sounds like other than that, he's on decent behavior, which is not going to make up for the fact that he cheated on his fiance, of course. But I'm assuming he's redeeming in some ways. And he's got issues of his own, of course,

and those issues are affecting the whole family. It's such a mess. It's obviously tough. If you feel like it, you can support your mom through this. Up to a point, though, only up to a point. Listen to her, talk with her, help her process her thoughts and feelings, but also make her see that she overlooked your stepdad's infidelity once and has helped create this situation for herself.

and at the same time, given how wrapped up in one another's lives you guys are, I would make sure that you're not getting too enmeshed with your mom here. I know that sounds a little callous, but your mom didn't really make a great decision, and she brought a lot of pain onto herself because of this, and now it's going to keep happening, and it's affecting you, right? So your mom needs to be in therapy, ASAP. She clearly has a lot to work on. If she doesn't want to work on herself or the relationship or keeps repeating the same pattern,

then you can let her know where you stand and pull back. It's her life to lead and as painful as it is, you have to accept if she's making terrible decisions, right? Like you have to kind of say, okay, I can't control your behavior. I can no longer go down the tubes with you each time. Does that make sense? Absolutely. Gabe, what do you think about the retramatization and the sort of blowback on the writer? Yeah, that was a heavy word to be using in this situation. But if the person writing in says that, I believe them. I mean, I've talked to a few friends whose families have been torn apart by infidelity and they talk about it being extremely traumatic, very scarring. You know, there's a wound there for sure. And so, yeah, I could see how the mom kind of feeling like she's having all

these doubts and remembering that she swept this under the rug and is now having to confront it all over again. Yeah, that could bring up a lot of old stuff, which could be retramatizing. That sounds intense. I would make sure that you are taking care of yourself and like Jordan said, not getting overly involved in your mom's and your stepdad's lives. This is ultimately their relationship. It is their business to sort out, even if it does have blowback for you. I think it's very important to separate out, you know, how much of this is their stuff that they need to work out and how much of it is stuff that affects you. And if you're not in therapy already, I would get there. It sounds like you need a place to work through your own feelings here,

learn how to handle your mom's drama and your relationship with your step-doubt, all of which sounds pretty complicated. I was going to say complex, and then I was like, it's complicated, and now I just think it's both. Yeah, I think you're right. So I think therapy would be a nice space for you, not just to be able to work through it, but also to figure out, you know, where are those lines? Because those lines, man, I'm getting the vibe from this letter that those lines are very blurry. And that is an issue not just in the context of this whole infidelity thing. I bet it's kind of part of the family ethos, like what mom does and whom she decides to marry and when she gets upset, you know, that might be sort of my responsibility. But then like when I'm upset, it's mom's job

to be, you know, very attuned to that. And so it's like, where are those lines? Whose life is whose, whose, whose business is whose? You know, that's very important stuff to sort out in the bigger picture too. So I think if you do that, take care of yourself, you'll be all right. And after that, you just have to let your mom and your stepdad work through this because because that's their stuff. Good advice. All right. Let's move on. We have tons of We're doing this live in the stereo app. You can grab that in the app store if you're listening in the feed. But I want to go to the questions here. And if you want to leave us a question, use the question button here in the stereo app. Not the call button. We're not doing live calls. We're taking your

questions here in the messaging feature of the app, though. Here we go. Why are you recording not on Sunday? This is kind of weird. Well, yeah. So the episode airs on Sunday is in the Jordan Harbinger Show podcast feed. And of course, we have to record it before that. So hopefully that answers the question. The live part is recorded whenever we feel like it, and the episode airs in the feed on the Jordan Harbinger Show podcast on Sundays. You're welcome. Next. Hey guys. New fan here, but quickly attached to your show, which actually leads to my question. So, I've been single for a few months now after coming out of a relationship. I'm on Tinder right now, just enjoying meeting people. I find that when I chat with girls online, I quickly get attached, probably because I enjoy the attention.

Thing is, not an instant hit with everyone. I started chatting with a girl last night, and we haven't spoken all day, which kind of hurts. So I guess my question is, well, two parts. Why do I get attached so easily, and how do I avoid these feelings? Great. So I love it that he wrote that out,

and you can tell, right, that he wrote it out, and that's why? Because it's concise, and it hits. All right, so this is interesting, and I have to admit that I admire your self-awareness around all of this. It sounds like there are a couple things going on here. First, Gabriel, the thing that sticks out to me is there's the attachment thing.

And this is hard for us to really dig into in one episode, but it sounds like this is a question about relational patterns, basically how you relate to other people, what the emotional template looks like. And I'm not a psychologist, neither are you, but people love talking about attachment theory these days. We're not experts in this. That's the caveat. But it is a very useful model for understanding relationships.

even ones that form over-dating apps. So these types of relational models often change with the internet, but often the internet just sort of puts a magnifying glass on things and gives us a bigger sample size. So according to attachment theory, some people attach to others very securely, and some people attach in a dismissive avoidant way. That phrase here, key phrase, dismissive avoidant,

some people attach in an anxious, preoccupied way, and some people attach in a fearful avoidance. way. So I'm oversimplifying here. All of this goes back to childhood, though, and the early attachments to parents, to caregivers. So if you're having issues with getting attached too quickly, the answer probably is not what sort of like cool pickup artist technique can you use to pretend that you're not attached? The answer is really, where in my pattern growing up did I have a pattern of attachment that's similar? So these templates get created really early on, and they keep playing themselves out over and over and over again. So if you're interested in this and really getting a

breakdown from somebody who really knows what they're talking about when it comes to attachment theory, I've got some books here. We'll link them in the show notes at Jordan Harbinger.com, but also list them here for you. Hold Me Tight by Sue Johnson is a great one. Wired for love by Stan Tatkin, Tatekin, I don't know, T-A-T-K-N, and Attached by Amir Levin and Rachel S-F Heller. Heller. We'll link to all those in the show notes, but Attached, Wired for Love, and Hold Me Tight are the three books. And these go in depth on attachment theory. And you'll basically know more than most people about this, including most therapists at that point, if you plow through these books.

Gabe, there's another variable here. I'd love for you to speak on, which is he says he's enjoying the attention. And that, there's more stuff in there. There's more stuff in there for sure. Yeah. I thought that was also very interesting that he acknowledged that so openly. I mean, look, let's be real. We all enjoy attention on some level. I mean, that's part of the fun of romance, of dating, at least in the early days of dating, you know, getting attention, giving attention. You know, it's not like this guy is swiping right on people so he doesn't get attention. You know, that's all part of it. So I get it. But that comment did make me wonder if there was maybe some narcissism at play here, you know, if maybe instead of focusing on getting to know the other person that he's chatting with, he's focusing maybe on what they can do for him, which is in this case, maybe. maybe to give him some attention, to give him validation, to stroke his ego a little bit.

And if that need is really driving his interactions on Tinder, then he might be getting a test so quickly because he's drawn. He might even say maybe addicted in some limited non-technical sense, you know, to that attention, you know, drawn to that attention, maybe addicted to that attention, which would also explain why it hurts so much when people withdraw that attention because it feels pretty invalidating to him when people stop, you know, they stop engaging with him, they stop sending. like flirty emoji or chatting with him about whatever their first date, what it's going to look like. And then suddenly he's sort of left with himself. And he's like, well, shit, I was here

because I was getting all his attention. Now it's withdrawn. You know, what does that say about me? And am I even likable? And so that all hooks into that attachment style stuff that you were just talking about. But, you know, if the people you're chatting with online, if they're becoming sources of attention, sources of recognition, rather than genuine relationships, then I think it's very easy to fall into these expectations, fall into these feelings of sort of being withdrawn, abandoned, lost, or just sort of deprived of this source of attention that you want. So I would investigate all of that. I don't mean to beat this horse or anything like that, but ideally do that with a therapist. Lots for you to explore there. Very helpful, I'm sure.

If you want a healthy relationship, if you want a fulfilling relationship, you got to work through this stuff. No shame in it. We've all got our stuff. This just happens to be yours. So I would dig into that. By the way, we're doing this live in the stereo app, for those of you that are listening in the feed, if you are listening to us live, we'd love to hear your question on pretty much anything. As long as it's an actual question, you can use the question button inside the stereo app to ask. We've got a bunch, so I'm going to move right in. How many people that you've taught have actually been successful? I mean, you bring celebrities and authors, but how many times have you brought somebody on that you've taught that has become successful? Not sure what that

really means I don't really teach other than to the audience and I don't really know if I it seems a little self-serving to have somebody on the Jordan Harbinger show where I'm like, I made this person successful. So I would say zero times, but I'm not a consultant or a teacher in the traditional sense. So I guess I don't really think about that. I don't know. Gabe, that seems like about it unless you have something to add. Yep. No, I was going to say the same thing. Yeah. You're listening to the Jordan Harbinger Show. We'll be right back. If you're wondering how I managed to book all these great authors, thinkers, and creators every single week, it's because of my network and I'm teaching you how to build your network

for free over at Jordan Harbinger.com slash course. I know that networking is a cringy gross word these days. I wanted to build a course that would help inspire other people to develop a relationship with you. Not a course that does it in a way where it seems salesy, but in a super easy non-cringe down-to-earthway, nothing awkward, at least nothing too awkward. And it's built for introverts as well. So it's all online. Don't freak out. I'm not going to ask you to go give talks on stages or go to mixers. It just takes a few minutes a day. And many of the guests on the show already subscribe and contribute to the course. So come join us. You'll be in smart company where you belong. You can find the course at Jordanharbinger.com slash course. And now back to the show. Next. Hi, Jordan. I'm a huge fan of the show. I have a question for you. My good friend and I both have type two diabetes and we both struggle with the mental and the physical. challenges of it. We both know that sugar, flour, beer, bread, they're all not good for us.

And we're on that roller coaster of controlling our blood sugar level. My friend relies mostly on her meds to keep her blood sugar down while I try to maintain a really good diet. So this weekend, she told me that she was making banana bread. And then on Monday, she told me that her blood glue close was really high because she didn't get a prescription filled. And I want to say to her, no, don't eat the fucking banana bread. But I didn't. I was supportive. But I guess my question is, how can I be supported of her and help her without being a nagging self-righteous asshole? Thanks, appreciate it. Love the show. Bye. That's tough. Oh, man. That's a tough one. That's really tough. Because I do, I think there's a part of me too that would be like, don't eat the fucking banana bread, right?

But then, of course, I'm going to be all, sorry that you're not feeling well. Oh, man, the pharmacy is so hard to get a prescription. Gotta enjoy life, though, yummy banana bread. Like, right? I would just be, I would, like, tow the line between enabler and supportive, and I know that about myself, because I get it. I don't have diabetes, thank goodness,

because I didn't realize, they didn't even think about the fact that you can't eat all that delicious stuff. So, sorry to hear that. You're a better person than me for maintaining a healthy diet. I think that's amazing. This is especially hard because you're friends with somebody who cannot or doesn't want to take care of herself the way that she should. And you feel, it sounds like she feels partly responsible, right, Gabe?

I'm getting that kind of vibe off this. Definitely. I love how on top of your health you are, how respectful you are and trying to help her be that way to be on top of her health. I don't, like I said, I'd be like, don't eat the freaking banana bread. I really don't have as much tact as you. So I also understand why you don't want to be overbearing. So a couple thoughts here.

First, if your friend is struggling to take care of herself and your gentle reminders aren't working, I would consider being more direct with her. You certainly have license to do so. You've proven that your way of doing things actually works. You've tried to be gentle and respectful. If your friend is putting herself in danger, which she is, by the way, of course,

because you can kill yourself with this stuff as a diabetic from what I understand, then as your friend, yeah, you 100%. have the right to sit her down and say, listen, this isn't going to be fun to hear. I really don't want to be a nagging, self-righteous a-hole, as you put it. But it is very hard to watch my good friend put herself at risk like this, so I want to have an open conversation about it. And then just tell her everything that you're seeing.

It's going to be tough, I know. But you have to tell her how you think it's hurting her, how it's concerning you, what you think she needs to change, which is going to be great, because everyone loves hearing from somebody else what they need to do to change, right? become a better person. Oh my goodness. But while you're doing that, look, you got to keep being kind, you got to keep being supportive and not become an enabler. There's no need to be cruel here. But that's kind of where it ends. I wouldn't mince words because it does sound to me like she needs a bit of a wake-up call. So I would aim for a kind, supportive, but firm and possibly very

blunt wake-up call. And if she does need help doing this, then I would also encourage her to see a therapist. It sounds like she needs help doing this. She really does need to see a therapist, especially one with experience in health issues, maybe see a doctor or a nutritionist as well. I think a nutritionist is probably your good bet because I think a lot of nutritionists, especially ones that specialize in things like type 2 diabetes, might be used to telling people things that they don't want to hear about what they can eat and what they cannot eat. Because for you, it's what you can eat and what you can't eat, not what you should eat and what you shouldn't.

Like I shouldn't bake a whole loaf of banana bread and eat it. you slash her cannot bake a whole loaf of banana bread and eat it because it could literally kill you and it will shorten your lifespan which you know is is much more severe Gabe what happens if she doesn't change her ways after that you know what do you do just kind of say sorry charlie you're gonna die young i mean what do you even do at that point i think if she makes a very good faith effort to intervene and tell her friend exactly what she's saying and how she thinks she needs to change the way you just described then you've done your part and I wouldn't feel responsible for her anymore.

I mean, you know, it doesn't mean that you ditch her or that you run away or that you don't answer her phone calls anymore. But, you know, in terms of how much you need to be on top of her life, yeah, I think that's where your responsibility does end. Because ultimately, her health is up to her. She has to take charge. You can't live her life for her. You can help her see things more clearly, but you can't be on top of her meds all the time. You can't be in her kitchen telling her what she can and cannot bake or whatever. So if she keeps complaining about how she feels after that, if she keeps talking to you about her insulin levels and her medication drama, then you can just say, well, I told you that this would happen. And I think you know that this is what happens. And I told you what I would do. So I'm not sure what else I can tell you. I can remind you that this is what you need to change, but I can't really, you know, make you change. And I'm sorry you're not feeling well, but I hope you know that you can change things tomorrow if you wanted to. And then you just draw that boundary and you hold to it. It is a tough situation to be in to watch someone you

love someone close to you making poor decisions like this, but all you can do is support them up to a point and let them learn their lessons for themselves. For what it's worth, I think you're doing a pretty good job of this already. You sound like a really nice friend. She's lucky to have you in her life. I hope she listens. But beyond that, yeah, you just got to let her do her own thing and figure it out for herself. Good luck. Chris. Love that. I do have some sympathy, though, because I would want to help my friend too, Gabe, but I also, there'd be a point. I would turn to my wife, Jen, or to you and be like, this bitch won't listen to me.

You know, like I would lose my, I would eventually lose my shit and it would put a wedge in my friendship between me and the other person, no matter what. I'd be like, this freaking moron, you know, like won't listen to me. We all have people in our lives that have drama, and then we go,

oh, well, here's this really easy slash not so easy way to make sure this never happens again. And then like a month later, the same drama. And you go, well, did you do A, B, C, or even D? And they're like, man, no, not really. ha ha ha, L-O-L, my life still sucks. And I'm like, okay, at some point you're just doing this for attention. And I don't have, ain't nobody got time for that, right?

Ain't nobody got time for that. Yeah. All right. We're taking your questions in the stereo app. Use the stereo button, the little question button in the stereo app. And if you don't have the stereo app and you're listening in the feed, go grab it from the app store. All right.

Next up. Hey, guys. A couple of years ago, I had a business fail. The business experience with previous employment experience helped me rebound quickly in a new career and catapult me past others who've been there for years. But how do you heal from the sting of failure and get the courage to venture into a new side hustle or venture? That's a really good question. Gabe, what do you think to kick that one off? You want to kick that one off? Well, I'm thinking a lot about your chapter a few years ago when you transitioned from your old

company into this one. I learned a lot from you back then. I'm trying to think about, you know, I mean, every situation is unique, but it sounds like this guy might be struggling a little bit with, know, a little bit of a sting, maybe a wound from whatever happened at the old company and trying to get back on his feet and figure out how to be resilient. I will say that we did a really nice episode recently about resilience, also part of the same Sterey Sunday's series, I should say. And we got into a lot of the science of resilience, how to stick with things when they get tough, you know, what is different about people who are able to absorb a blow like that and keep going, you know, what derails people, what keeps them on the right track. So if you

If you want to dig deep into that, I highly recommend that episode, and we'll go much deeper into that. But I do think it's so much of it is about processing what it is you just went through, figuring out what it means to you, not letting the failure or the sting of what just happened define the experience, but figuring out what it is that you had to learn from it, what it is that you had to confront because of it, you know, what kind of person you've become because you've gone through that experience and using all of that to figure out what your next move is. Because I think a lot of times when you go through an extreme failure, like losing a business or getting kicked out of a company or losing your job or whatever it is, you know, it's just so overwhelming that it sort of just feels like this massive failure that you just want to sweep under the rug or suppress because it's too painful to even think about. But the science on this and a lot of the anecdotal evidence is that people who are resilient, they do the opposite, right? They look at that stuff square in the eye. They try to examine it for what they can learn and figure out what the significance of that failure is as opposed to trying to like, move on from it as quickly as possible because it's just too shameful to even confront. So I would encourage you to go down that route.

And if you want to go deeper, I would check out our episode on resilience. Jordan, what do you think? Yeah, that's solid. I would add a couple little extra points here just from my own personal experience. I would say that if you've felt the sting from, say, like business partners screwing you over or feeling like you weren't in control, then make sure that your next side hustle is something that you control exclusively, right? make sure that that is your gig, your logins, your credit cards, everything that you need in order

to pull the plug is within your possession, right? Like, you don't want somebody to be logging you out of your accounts, make sure you're the signer on the bank account, you own the intellectual property. That's a good way to sort of start something else again and come back into a side hustle or business. If you're asking about how to trust other people again in terms of business partners and things like that, I would say start off with little bits of responsibility. A lot of businesses start and it's like two people and they're like, yeah, let's start this thing, 50, 50, yay. That's not a

great idea because you find out you have different work ethics, you have different morals, you have different ideas where the business should go. There should be somebody who maybe has a small part in the business. They might even own equity, but there is no doubt about who is in charge. You don't make all decisions together. You are the boss. You are in control. And once you've done that for a while, you'll feel more comfortable giving other people ownership over the actual product itself, partial ownership. But I would say never really fully relinquished control to somebody else. Otherwise, you're just working for them. And there should never really be a need, especially in the digital age, that you need to do that.

Hey, Jordan. I'm a big fan of the show. I don't really have a question. I just wanted to say I'm still reeling from the kidnap me once, kidnapped me twice. I was captivated the whole time. I don't even know what else to say. Amazing story. So thankful you're still alive.

I love the show. Bye. Yeah, that was one of our earlier episodes previous Stereo Sunday, so a couple of weeks ago. We did a couple of episodes, one of which was my kidnapping story in Mexico, the other one, which was my kidnap story

in Serbia. Both of those happened 16 and 20 years ago, respectively. So spoiler alert, I am still alive. I still made it relatively unscathed to that. And I appreciate you listening to the show. In fact, I appreciate every comment we get. And if you want to reach us, I'm at Jordan Harbinger on Instagram and Twitter. And I answer all my DMs and everything there.

And you can email us, Jordan atjurbaner.com. And if you need to get to Gabe, I will make sure that that happens. All right, what's next? Hey, guys. I've been in my current job for two years as an IT manager. I'm pretty happy here. and there's room for me to move up. But my last employer just posted a director position in the IT field.

This position would oversee a team and I'd get a nice increase in pay. The thing is, my imposter syndrome kicks in when I read the job description. They require a degree that I don't have in three years of experience as a supervisor. I only have two years of supervising on my resume, but at my last job, I was leading teams, training, and managing projects. My former employer paid for several of my certifications as well. I even got a letter from the HR director saying he enjoyed working with me when I left. I know I can do this and have a lot to offer.

So how do I handle not checking off all the boxes? I like this one. Good old imposter syndrome, kind of a favorite topic of mine many times. It tends to kick in for almost anyone whenever they chase an opportunity that is beyond their current capabilities. So this is especially prevalent with high performers, which is kind of ironic, right? So the people that feel the most unqualified or the most nervous about starting something new tend to be the people that do really well in everything, the overachievers, because they know

what they don't know. Or they don't know what they don't know and they also know that, right? So there's a gap between their experience and their capability and they see that. Whereas a lot of other people like high school kids, they have no idea what they don't know and they think they know a lot. So they're really unconsciously incompetent. whereas a lot of high performers are consciously incompetent or uncompetent, actually. So we talk a lot about imposter syndrome on the Jordan Harbinger show.

People write in with questions like this all the time. So before we really dive in, just know that this is 100% normal and extremely common. It's also really important to resolve because if you don't resolve this, imposter syndrome can keep you stuck and it can chase you away from great opportunities. So it sounds to me like you're wrestling with both some healthy imposterism and some not so healthy imposter syndrome. These are two different things. So healthy imposterism is when there really is a gap between where you are now and where

you want to be, like with certain aspects of this job. And you actually have some work to do to catch up and fill in those gaps. That highlights the places you still need to grow. This is totally normal, right? This is normal part of healthy imposterous. apostarism. In other words, the places where you really are a bit of an imposter and you need some catching up and you need to level up in order to perform at a level where everybody's going to be happy with your performance, including yourself. And this is a good thing. This kind of

imposterism visits anybody who's ambitious because you're always reaching beyond your current capabilities. Now, where imposter syndrome kicks in is when you feel like a complete and utter fraud because you you can't imagine yourself deserving the opportunities that are coming your way, right? You don't feel like what you've accomplished actually matters and you sort of feel like everyone's about to find you out in some way. So in a nutshell, imposter syndrome develops when you fail to internalize all of your accomplishments up till now. So you start working really hard to hide the vulnerability beneath those accomplishments. In other words, the more raw, you're trying to hide the raw person inside the high performer who knows that he still has things to

learn, still has places to grow, still has skills to master. And the scary thing about imposter syndrome is that it can hold you back from pursuing things that you are 100% going to be great for, like this opportunity to oversee this big team and get a nice raise. So Gabriel, I'd love to hear what you think are the first couple of steps to separate these two things, you know, get some clarity. Yeah, I do think it's really important to separate those two things out. And I agree. I think healthy imposterism is not just unavoidable, but it can actually be very helpful because it sort points out the areas that you just need to invest and level up, and that's a good thing. I would get very clear on what you're dealing with here. Is it the healthy imposterism or is it the more

malignant imposter syndrome? And are you just becoming aware of those areas where you need to grow into your new role or are you kind of cutting yourself down because you're not even able to value your own accomplishments, right? That's the question. And once you get clear on that, then I do think, you know, there are a handful of principles we can share really quickly just to sort of keep in mind. One of them is, you know, the key to defeating imposter syndrome is to really be able to own your experience, own your expertise, own your talent. Don't discount them. A really good exercise here is to write them down and talk about them with your friends, with your family, maybe with some trusted colleagues. You know, sometimes we forget the story of our lives.

Like, we just sort of take it for granted or, you know, we feel like we moved through these experiences like, oh yeah, I had that really cool job where I did that really important thing. But it's just a memory and you can't really remember like what it was like to be there and to be handling all of that responsibility. It just sort of feels like, I don't know, it feels like this vague fiction that doesn't quite exist anymore in your real life. So you have to almost make that story real for yourself once again. And so you can actually make that an exercise by writing it down, talking it out. Hopefully, if you do that enough times or you do it on an ongoing basis, you'll start to see those accomplishments as yours, as things that you have done that have

prepared you for this new role that you really want, and that will make them real for you. But at the same time, and this is getting to Jordan's point, you do want to notice when you're hiding those parts of you that are still in need of development. You know, that could be knowledge, it could be skills, could be emotional intelligence, relationships, you know, management style, whatever is relevant to that job, really. Imposter syndrome, that develops around those, you know, still in development parts of ourselves, those more tender parts of our psyche. So the more you deny them, or the more you try to sweep them out of the rug, or you sort of put on like a front to pretend like, oh yeah, I don't have those weaknesses. I know everything. Like, I can totally handle this. The more that the ego feels

the need to create the imposter, that imposter that you really don't love sitting with, right, to protect those parts of yourself. So that's why it's, that's why you start to feel that fear of like being found out, which is probably the worst part of imposter syndrome. So look, that doesn't mean you need to go around, you know, publicizing all of those weaknesses to everybody all the time, right? You're not going to go into that interview and be like, listen, guys, I really want this job, but I just want you to know that I am not ready. You know, like, that would be a losing strategy. This is a terrible decision you hiring me. I pity you, yeah. Like, definitely take me seriously as a candidate, but if I were you, I would really think twice about putting me in charge of other

human beings. Like, no, that's not a good way to go about this, obviously. But I do think it's helpful to acknowledge those aspects of yourself to yourself and to put in the work to grow them rather than figuring out clever ways of hiding them. And if you do that, then you can start to invest in those areas on your own. That's going to look different for everybody. But for you, I would figure out which skills you need to hone in this new IT management role, build relationships with the people who will help you succeed. It could be colleagues, friends, coaches, counselors, other people who are in similar roles. Put together a little plan, a learning plan, you know, books you'll need to read courses you might want to take, interviews you should read. In other words, kind of develop a

mini crash course for yourself to prepare and to build up those skills before you go into that interview. That's how you can bridge the healthy imposterism by honestly recognizing the places that you really are a quote unquote fraud, but then do the work to become an expert so you don't have to deal with that fraudulence anymore than is absolutely necessary. And then I would go into the interview with all of those parts of yourself. We say this all the time on the show, right? You can be smart, you can be accomplished, you can be qualified, you can be the guy who's gotten to this point and is totally ready to step into this new role, and be the guy who has a little bit of work to do to rise to the occasion. So that's how you short-circuit imposter syndrome by showing up

with both halves of yourself rather than just kind of clinging to the one half that feels very safe, which is never, never works in the long term. It just perpetuates the imposter syndrome. Also, it's worth mentioning that the people you're going to be interviewing with, they're going to respond more strongly to the candidate who comes across as authentic and, you know, natural and personable and just honest, they're going to respond to that guy more than they're going to respond to the person who's working super hard to hide all of his weaknesses and come across as perfect. You know, it's just people can always pick up on that, even if you're doing a decent job of hiding it. So I also, by the way, I highly recommend checking out the article and the deep dive

we did on this topic. We'll link to both of those in the show notes. I think those would be great resources for you. Yeah. If you're listening live right now, just go to Jordan Harbinger.com, search for imposter, and you will find both of those as well. But yeah, I would say if I were this guy, I would definitely go after this opportunity. I wouldn't let the imposter syndrome hold him back. You know, don't pass that up. You got to chase it. The worst thing that could happen, honestly, is that you get some good interviewing experience.

And then the next time you're up for a job like this, you're going to be that much better. But who knows, this might be your next job. And I would hate for you to miss out on that just because you're afraid of that imposter syndrome. So good luck, man. I think you can do it. Nice. Gabe. Great answer.

All right, we're live in the stereo app. We'll link to the stereo app in iOS and Android in the show notes. You're listening to us live in stereo. All right, what's next here? Are there certain avenues and side hustles due to the pandemic and people going into different fields and they thought they might ever before that have gotten far too saturated?

And where do you see the most opportunity for avenues that are not being taken advantage of right now? It's a good question. I don't know about saturated. Gabe, is there anything where you're like, wow, now everyone is an XYZ freelancer. I don't really I haven't really seen anything that stands

out to me that's saturated. Yeah, I mean, I'm trying to think about the obvious ones which I think are super saturated are like mask companies and glove and sanitization, you know, those obvious ones. But like some of the sectors that are absolutely crushing right now are like food delivery

in general. But I can't, I mean, that's saturated too. You're just going to be working for somebody else's company. It's not like you're going to start competing with Uber Eats or Instacart or something like that. Yeah, he's probably thinking smaller, like, hey, I'm a graphic design. Like, hey, should I do graphic design? He's probably a guy that has a lot of skills and is trying to figure out what to apply. And I sympathize with that. Like, it's, am I going to edit audio? Am I going to do voiceover? I would say start doing a few things,

especially if they're small in the startup cost or low. Like, if you're just offering voiceover skills on voice one, two, three, and you're also offering graphic design skills on Fiverr, this is a good thing to test, right? Test it, see where your clients are coming from, see where your revenue is coming from, and see what you like. You know, if your graphic design clients are like screwing you over on invoices and not paying on time and you're like, ugh, I stayed up all night making this, and now they're not answering my email, but then you're doing voiceover for apps and video games and you're killing it and it's fun and you're getting paid on time, or some mix of those positives and negatives, then you'll find out what it is that you actually want to do.

So right now is a great time to test side hustles that you never thought you would have time for, that you, I know people with full-time jobs with companies that are also like, I'm learning Python or C++ on the side because they don't have any commute time, right? So they have like another 90 minutes plus per day to take classes on Skillshare or even do online university, get a graduate degree. I mean, there's all kinds of stuff going on. So definitely use this time. But is there anything that is so saturated that you shouldn't even try it?

Nothing really comes to mind other than maybe making masks on Etsy or something like that. It might be a little played at this point. But now's a great time to both develop skill and put skill into action and see what you can monetize. Or teach skills. I mean, that's also a good freelance job. The tutoring industry is pretty good right now. From what I understand, the average hourly rate for tutors, whether it's SAT, tutors, high school classes or just kind of helping out with some, you know, random statistics class or coding or

writing, you know, writing mechanics or anything like that. They're doing quite well right now. I mean, there's always going to be students. Students are still in school, even if it's online. So I think check out tutoring. And if you want to go into the freelance route, you know, I don't know, there are some good freelance marketplaces right now. Upwork, freelancer, fiber. I would see what the rates are there. But yeah, yeah, teaching a skill or tutoring for classes, that's really good. And so is child care by the. the way. I've been reading some articles about this. I mean, that's one thing that just is non-negotiable if you're a parent. It doesn't matter if there's a pandemic going on. People need help with their

families. So I don't know if that's up your alley, but it's another thing you could look into. You're listening to The Jordan Harbinger Show. We'll be right back. If you like this episode of the show, I invite you to do what other smart and considerate listeners do, which is take a moment and support our amazing sponsors. All of the deals, discount codes are all in one place. Jordan Harbinger.com slash deals is where you can find them. You can also use the AI chatbot to find deals and promo codes. Just go to Jordan Harbinger.com, use the AI chatbot and ask it for the promo code. And, well, hopefully we'll come up with our promo code. Thank you so much for supporting those who support us. And now, back to the show.

All right. Next step. What do you think about an app that lets you hire cleaners to come over? And on the flip side, you can also come and clean other people's houses and stuff like that. What do you think about that? Have they done it already? Or is it a, good idea. I would love an app where you actually get to have cleaners come over that are reviewed. And I know that that probably exists in some form, but there is. I've never heard of it. Yeah, it has to, right? Do you have any recommendations for this? No, I can't remember the names of it, but I've read articles about companies that are doing exactly

that, and somebody left marketing materials on my door the other day for that exact app. So, it does exist. Yep. Good. Well, maybe there's room to improve upon it. Maybe they don't have enough cleaners, maybe the payment system doesn't work. You know, a lot of people will look at what's really good for the customer, which is always a really good idea. But really great apps will also look at what is good for the person who sells in the app. So yes, that app may exist, but there's maybe room for a competitor where it's like, oh, yeah,

you know, cleaner app, they don't pay more than once a month. And a lot of these people who are cleaning, they need their money right away. So maybe your app actually cashes them out every single day within 24. hours using PayPal or bank transfer. You know, there are things like that where you can end up with better supply side versus just worrying about like, oh, the app has cool animations and good ratings and reviews and is a good user experience. That stuff's all important, but you can actually end up with more supply by catering better. Like Uber and Lyft, they're competing with one another. Uber is, of course, bigger, but Lyft has a better driver experience. And so they retain drivers more.

they tend to get more, they tend to be rated higher. As far as I understand, there's some fewer incidents because people are happier with the company. It's a whole thing. So look at both sides and don't be discouraged just because your idea may exist in some form already, really. Good luck with it. Hey, boys, thanks for the show.

So I have major imposter syndrome, but it's also not without its reason. I've been unemployed for almost three years now. I won't get into the wise, but half of it had to do with just a tragic state. of things in a major depression. And the other half was getting out of it and going on some kind of spiritual journey of sorts. But now I'm wanting to go back into work. I have about nine years of retail experience and a year of marketing. And I don't really know where to start how to get back into the workplace, both like in actuality, but also just the mind, the attitude, because I've been out of work for such a long time now. And I almost feel like socially incompetent.

like to go back in the workplace and put on that type A personality again. It's just a very strange place for me. Any advice? Gabe, I think the first thing that comes to mind for me here is starting small, right? You know, like if you're coming off a three-year gap, you might not have a choice, but to start small, you could literally sell ice cream socially distanced for a few months and then move on to something else. And if people are like, why are you leaving Coldstone Creamery so quick?

You're like, because it's freaking cold stone creamery and I'm 40, right? You know, I don't want to work here. And you can get back into things and you can, I think rather than you worrying about how am I going to survive in a new job, I think it's more of a fear of, oh my gosh, am I so rusty that I can't handle a job. And I don't think so. I think if you've got nine years of experience, you're going to pop back into shape pretty quickly.

This almost sounds to me, Gabe, like more imposter syndrome, but a different kind in a way. What do you think? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, there's a lot going on in here. I wish we could talk back and forth and get to the root of this, but we only have so much time. But I do get the sense that, you know, there's some hesitation around your story. Like if you spent, you know, this period not doing something traditional, you've been out of the workforce, then, you know, how do I present myself?

Am I even attractive to employers as a candidate? Do I have to hide that? Do I spin it? And suddenly you're like coming up with all these stress. of things that you have to worry about just to convince somebody that you're an attractive candidate. But I think if you get comfortable with the story and just present yourself honestly, authentically, then I don't know if you have as much to be concerned about as you might think. I believe you that it feels very difficult, but I don't know if it needs to be as difficult as it seems to

you right now. I wouldn't try to hide the ball too much in these interviews. You know, by trying to deflect or make excuses, I would be very upfront. but I would also do the work to really fill in any gaps and make sure that whoever you're meeting with knows that you are valuable, that you will bring something to this company. Because at the end of the day, that's the only thing that matters, not whether you were living in an airstream in Joshua Tree for the last nine months. But if they hired you tomorrow, would you be able to help them and bring something to the company? That's what matters the most. And also, as far as the social anxiety goes and feeling a little rusty, I think Jordan is dead on. That's just a matter of reps.

Yeah, your first interview might be a little rocky. Second interview might be a little rusty in the third one. You'll probably do well. Maybe you'll leave and think, oh, I could have handled that question a little bit better, should have had an answer ready for that doozy of a question or whatever. But after two, three, four of these things, which is totally normal, those training wheels will be off and you'll be off to the races. It just takes a few times to get back in the swing of things.

I really, really do believe that. And I say that as somebody who has interviewed dozens and dozens and dozens and dozens of times. and most of those interviews were not, you know, knocking it out of the park. They were just getting those reps in, making mistakes, learning a little bit, and then being like, oh, yeah, when I crushed that one interview and 18 of them, it was because I went through 17 others that really didn't work out. But they were all leading me to that one interview. So try to take that approach a little bit.

I think it'll take a little pressure off. And, yeah, I have faith in you. I think a lot of people are in your boat right now, and it's not going to stop everybody from getting a job. So just keep putting one foot in front of the other. And you'll be okay. Great. All right. Moving right along. I feel like he's qualified for the job.

The job requires three years. He has two years. And most of these job requirements, they don't mean exactly what they state. Just come close to what they're asking for. So he's qualified. I tend to agree. She's talking about the IT role. And I think that's very true. I wonder how many people say something like, yeah, we want somebody with three years of experience. And what they mean is we just don't want somebody who doesn't know how to use the CRM at all. We don't want somebody that's never done basic tasks at a job. So if you come in and you've done all that stuff, nobody would even care if you have 18 months of experience because you don't seem like an average two-year employee or one-year employee who's so green that they don't know how to log in because

they've never been given that responsibility. Right. So if you're coming close, I definitely think there's something to that. All right. Next step. Yeah, what do you think about Upwork versus Fiverr versus like, like mechanical Turk, I think is like an application to, I think I did Mechanical Turk and made like maybe a dollar. Yeah, so Mechanical Turk is from Amazon. I don't know if you know about this, Gabe. You've heard of this? I've heard about it, but I actually don't know much about it. So teach me. Mechanical Turk, weird name. What it means is it's for these tasks where you can bid like five cents and it's like here's a task go and click on all of the links on this web page and make sure that the page loads you know in africa and so someone in africa is like okay

click click click click click click click great done five cents and you know it just sort of verifies that or that's why he made like a dollar especially after there's you take you pay taxes on it or whatever right you just make no money fiver is also for it's it's definitely more money it's definitely a better freelance platform where you can say like, I'll make your podcast show art $25. And it's like, you know, some sort of clip arty type thing or I'll take a photo of you and make it look like a drawing, $25, you know, stuff like that. Upwork is a little bit higher end than those both. You still find discrete tasks like you would on Fiverr, but you also find things like looking

for somebody who can manage a TikTok feed for a media brand. We have all the videos. We just need someone who posts them and make sure there's no specific. bam in the comments. So some of those gigs are more or less ongoing. They're more like jobs, not always, but sometimes. And so I would say in terms of like good money longer term, upwork is there, fivers in the middle and mechanical Turk is at the bottom and you probably shouldn't do it unless you're like about to panhandle for rent money. You may actually make more money panhandling than you would on mechanical Turk. All right. Next. Hey, Moonglow, I think you're

a marketing consultant already. If you've done marketing and any form and you have like a YouTube account. I think basically this app is really good at teaching people how to connect those things. There you go. Yeah. And God knows we've all hired a marketing coordinator for a business here and there and it's been somebody who's done marketing once five years ago. So there is that. Don't lie in your resume though, folks. To the woman that has has fear because of imposter, she said. I think she sounds to me like she's more anxious. She sounds like she's qualified with nine years of experience.

So she can start with a digital company. I mean, they need all the marketing experience they can get. So instead of going to a traditional company, traditional office, speaking with customers, she can just do it on like work for a social media company and do marketing there. That's a good start because she doesn't really have to see people. I don't know. My thought, my opinion. Decent advice.

I think if you apply yourself and you follow up and then, you know, how you present yourself, can get you the job because there's been multiple times where jobs have asked for something and I was still able to get the job without meeting the requirements just because of how you present yourself. Great. All right. Moving right along. Hey, guys. I'm new, so what's up? What's up? As you're the last question, and that's it for an episode of Stereo Sunday here.

I really did enjoy this. Gabe, are we forgetting anything? I feel like we had an outline here and we let it go to questions, which is great. I just want to make sure we're not leaving anything hanging here. No, no, not at all. I mean, if anyone else wants to ask something, we'll take any final questions. But if you guys are good, then that was the show.

Perfect. Live in the stereo app. Love doing things like this Stereo Sunday. You've been listening to Stereo Sundays here with Jordan Harbinger and Gabriel Mizrahi live in the stereo app. Thanks for all your questions. If you're listening in the feed, you can get the stereo app and we'll link it in the show notes.

Love doing the live stuff. Reminds me of my days on Sirius XM Satellite Radio. Hoping we get to do more of these types of things in the future. links to everything that we mentioned, as we said it before, hey, we'll link to these books and everything in the show notes. That's going to all be at Jordan Harbinger.com. I'm at Jordan Harbinger on Twitter and Instagram. You can also hit me on LinkedIn. You can find Gabriel at Gabe Mizrahi on Twitter or at Gabriel Mizrahi on Instagram. I'm teaching you how to connect with great people and manage relationships using systems and tiny habits over at our six-minute networking course. That's free.

That's over at Jordan Harbinger.com slash course. Dig the well. before you get thirsty. Most of the guests on the show, they subscribe to the course, they subscribe to the newsletter. I would love to see some of these people who have been listening on stereo. I would love for you to check out the Jordan Harbinger podcast, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you're listening to podcasts. You can find us in there, H-A-R-B-B-I-N-G-E-R. This show is created in association with Podcast 1. My amazing team is Jen Harbinger, J. Sanderson, Robert Fogart, Ian Baird, Millie O'Campo, Josh Ballard, and Gabriel Mizrahi. Remember, we rise by lifting others. The fee for this show is that you share it with friends when you find something

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