The Kevin Sheehan Show - A Giant Trap + Logan Paulsen

Episode Date: September 11, 2024

Kevin opened with a peek ahead to Washington's game against the Giants and why it 'smells' like a trap game. Lots on Jayden Daniels in the opening segment including some follow up on his rushing yardage Sunday in Tampa and why Luke McCaffrey didn't throw/lateral the ball back to Daniels on a perfectly set-up trick play in the 3rd quarter. Logan Paulsen jumped on to give his analysis of the Tampa Bay game and look ahead to the Commanders' home opener Sunday against the Giants.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it, but you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Here's Kevin. Logan Paulson's going to be on the show with me today. I love having Logan on the show. We'll look back to the Tampa game. Get his thoughts on the giant game as well.

The show's presenting sponsor, as always, is Window Nation. Call them at 86690 Nation or head to Windonation.com if you need new windows. This from D.K. to start the show. D.K. writes, Kevin, what's your smell test record on Washington games? Because you are probably going to have the Giants this week. D.K., you know me, you know the smell test. Very well. Yes, more likely than not, as it stands right now,

I am probably going to have the Giants in the smell test. on Friday. And before you roll your eyes and say, so what? On games involving Washington, yes, D.K., I think your instinct was right. I'm 64.5% over the years of doing the smell test with Washington or Washington's opponent in the pick. Last year, I was four and two on games involving Washington and 2 and 0 in games involving Washington and the Giants. I had the Giants twice in the smell test last year against the skins. Both times they were underdogs and both times they won the game outright. They won 14 to 7 in the Meadowlands as a three-point dog. I gave the Giants out that week plus the three. And the three, and the

And when the Giants came to FedEx plus nine, they were getting nine points with Tommy DeVito at quarterback, I gave the Giants out again. And they won that game, 31 to 19. So last year, I was four and two overall in games involving Washington. I had the Giants twice. Both of those were winners. I had Arizona in week one plus seven. And Washington won that game by four. had Washington at Seattle getting seven, they lost by three, and then the two losers were,

I had Washington at Dallas, and they were getting 10 and a half, they got blown out, and then I had them against the Rams in December getting seven, and they lost by eight. But yes, D.K., it is setting up for a Giants smell test pick on Friday. And the reason for that is the line right now at MyBooky, go to MyBooky.orgie. Use my promo code, Kevin, D.C. You'll qualify for a deposit up to $1,000 when you use my promo code, Kevin, D.C. Right now, at MyBooky, the Giants are one-point underdogs. Washington opened as a two and a half point favorite.

They're now just a one point favorite, and that is based on the early information that I am getting. That is massive, sharp money on Daniel Jones and the Giants. Meantime, tons of public money on Washington. I had a feeling there was going to be a lot of public money on Washington, because even though Washington got blown out on Sunday, the Giants are a bigger negative storyline after week one because of the blowout loss to Minnesota at home and the Daniel Jones piece and part in that.

I mean, Daniel Jones right now is being vilified by Giants fans. He's being mocked and memed all over the place by NFL fans. So nobody thinks the Giants with Daniel Jones. starting a quarterback can win a game. And they're like, what? They're only a one-point underdog? Yeah, give me Washington. So I am a little bit concerned

because I'll tell you what, in recent years when I've given out teams against Washington, I haven't been that passionate about it one way or the other, needing to root for the opponent to cover the number. I mean, the Giants were a nine-point underdog. at FedEx last year. So there was certainly a possibility of Washington winning the game

and me still winning the Smell Test pick and my wager as well. I've never had a problem, as you know, betting against Washington when it's made sense. And, you know, I've had Washington many times as the team and the pick in the Smell Test. Last year, basically the six plays, I had three opponents, the Giants twice in Arizona, and then I had Washington three times against Seattle, Dallas, and the Rams. So I went 3 and 0 when I had their opponent, and I went 1 and 2 when I had Washington last year. The Giants totally look like the right side right now. I'm just telling you, it doesn't mean that it's going to hit on Washington games,

64.5% over the years. that means that there is a 35 and a half percent chance, I'll be wrong. And I hope I am, actually. I don't want them to lose this game. I don't want the interest in the team this early in the season to start to wane. It is much more beneficial for me if they are competitive and if they win games. but DK, spot on, the Giants will likely be a smell test selection on Friday. Emmanuel Forbes has a splint on his thumb.

You know, he got pulled from the game a couple of times on Sunday. I think the thought was performance-related, but then there was the report that he had x-rays after the game. So today, their first full practice, in the lead up to the giant game. He had a splint on his thumb. And Dan Quinn said, quote, we got good news. It's not going to knock him out,

but he is going to wear a splint on that hand to help protect that today and we'll work through it the rest of the week. And then he said, and like a manual, like a number of guys, man, we're really working hard to develop him. He said, would he want some plays back? You bet.

but I'd also say this is a young player that we're developing and working with him so he's improving and going to improve. That's where we're at on that. This is just a hunch here on Wednesday. Nothing more. Just a hunch. I bet you that Emmanuel Forbes plays a lot less against the Giants than he did against the Buccaneers. I mean, that is hardly out on a limb, you know, in terms of a hunch or a prediction. but he played 55% of the snaps on Sunday against the Buccaneers.

Noah Igben Ogeny played 44%. We'll just refer to him as Noah I. Igben Ogeny, he played 44% of the snaps. At the very least, I would wager that that's flipped on Sunday, if not much more. I'm not saying that I think he'll be inactive, but would anybody be sure? shocked, if he were. And they have the thumb injury as a reason for that. And you know, you wouldn't say it right now that he's out.

You would wait until the inactives are required on Sunday morning. Let the giant salivate at the idea that they can throw at Forbes on Sunday. Mike Davis, the corner that they signed in free agency, I think he's a possibility. He didn't play one defense. snap in the game against Tampa Bay. Not one. Some Jaden Daniels to discuss here as well in the opening segment, including something Quinn said about him today before practice. Lots of opinions from all of you on Jaden's first NFL game. I kind of got caught up on a lot of the emails and tweets, and so many of them were about Jaden's first game. This came from Bobby.

Bobby wrote. He's exciting Sheehan, but I'd like to see more patience in the pocket. Len wrote, Kevin, he's really skinny. He's not going to make it through the year. From Bleak Outlook, I bet you this one's really optimistic.

Bleak Outlook writes, we have the fastest QB in the league. Hooray! When's the last time a team won a Super Bowl with the fastest quarterback? in the league just saying. Is he the fastest quarterback in the league?

Is Lamar faster than Jaden? I don't know. Jaden might be the fastest quarterback in the league. And to answer that question, yeah, probably the answer is never, right? Has the fastest quarterback? Was Steve Young back in the day the fastest quarterback in the league? I doubt it. He certainly wasn't the fastest.

I mean, he certainly was one of the most mobile of all time. But the fastest quarterback? No. Michael Vic didn't win a Super Bowl. Pat Mahomes can, he's got some wheels. He can move. I don't think he's the fastest QB in the league. Yeah, I don't know.

Was Russell Wilson fast? He wasn't fast. He was more elusive than anything else, right? There were more on Jaden. This from James. Kevin, I thought your B grade for Jaden Daniels was unfair. A rookie QB not throwing an interception and only taking two sacks against a Todd Bulls defense is at least a B plus. And then from Rennie X, I wish I had you for a teacher.

A B for Jaden was on a major curve. All of his passing yards came late against pre-year. event and the offense had 14 points during the part of the game that mattered nowhere near a B closer to AD. So there was just so much on Jaden Daniels. I could have read another two dozen, which all were, you know, passionate and it was his first game, and let's not forget, it was his first game. You know, a couple of things. You know, it's Wednesday. We're still talking about the previous game. But the idea that not throwing an interception and only taking two sacks against a Todd Bowles defense is at least a B-plus or better. That came from James.

Keep in mind, they barely had the football in the first half. Most of his pass attempts came in the final two drives with the game out of hand and Tampa playing soft coverage with, by the way, reserved players in the game. He had 24 pass attempts, eight of them, so a third of them came on those final two drives. So when the game was still, I don't know if it, that it was in doubt, but when the game was still competitive, he had 16 pass attempts. Sure, you could throw a bunch of picks in 16 past attempts. And it was more dropbacks, you know, because he had all those scrambles, you know, I think roughly out of the 16 carries, which by the way, I'll get to here in a moment, because it was really 14 carries. I'll explain coming up here in a moment. But, you know,

about half of them, seven or eight of them were scrambles. I think eight of them were scrambles. And I would say no less than five of those were scrambles that were necessary. There is something to be said for protecting the football. Don't get me wrong. He did fumble once. off the sack early in the third quarter. He was charged with two other fumbles, but they weren't on the ground in play. They were the backwards lateral to Brian Robinson, Jr. on the first play, and then a play as he was just about out of bounds, the ball sort of came loose, but it was carried with him out of bounds. But I think, you know, giving him a higher grade than a B would be, I don't think that that would be appropriate. Because they're just, you know, he missed throws. He missed the big one

to Terry. He, I think, missed other opportunities. You know, the second Nate, I've talked a lot about the one that he got sacked and fumbled, the Beattish recovery. I think he missed two potential receivers, and he went backwards in the pocket, which was concerning. I can't go higher than a B. I mean, you've got to hit some passes down the field, don't you, to get higher than a B grade? You're a quarterback. But let me just be really clear. I liked the way he played. I think for his first game, it was solid.

You know, and as far as me grading on the curve for Rennie X, no. I mean, you know, to say that the offense had 14 points during the part of the game that mattered, that's true. But they also only had the ball a little bit. In their first six drives, they were in position. to score four times. They had two touchdowns and they missed two field goals. They were actually somewhat

productive. Now the way the production came about, you could debate that. It was a lot of Jaden. It was a lot of scrambles. It was a lot of, you know, the throws that were certainly short and medium range, tops. Nothing deep, even though they missed on the deep shot.

But yeah, I mean, I can't go worse than a B for him because they're just wasn't enough opportunity. By the way, that's another part of the Emanuel Forbes thing and the secondary thing. Just something to keep in mind, they're recalibrating, not rebuilding. Part of that recalibration is to give Jaden a chance here this year to succeed. Have they done everything that they should have or could have done in the offseason? It's debatable in terms of the offensive skill position players, but I want to focus real quickly more on the defense.

You can't, you know, you don't want this season to, and it's one game. I'm not saying that this is going to happen. But, you know, the cornerback situation, if there's a veteran corner out there somewhere that you can sign for the season that's going to be an upgrade to what you have, even though perhaps it's not a developmental player that's going to be around for you when you, have a legit chance to win in 25 or 26. But what you don't want to happen and why you might think about something like that is, you know, Sunday, you basically had four drives for Jaden Daniels with the game within reach. You don't want what happened last year. Look, I was not, you know,

ultimately much of a fan of Sam Howell being the starting quarterback here moving forward. And, even though I thought he had some decent games, and I think he proved that he belongs in the league as a backup at the very least. But he didn't have much of a chance in a lot of those games, and it had less to do with the offensive line, and much more to do with a defense that couldn't get off the field. So you were in lopsided games so often

that you don't want Jaden's rookie year to be, oh my God, if you don't score, you know, if you're not scoring in the upper teens, mid-upper teens by halftime, the game's going to get out of control and your passing yardage is going to come the way it came on Sunday late in the game. You want competitive games. You want to see him score time competitive. You don't want to see things get lopsided. Again, one game. I'm not saying that the secondary is going to be horrible all year longer, that the defense is going to be horrible. But going back to Sunday and the follow-up to Rennie X saying Jaden was closer to a D,

they only had 14 points. Most of his passing yards came late against Prevent. Nothing you said was wrong, but there were reasons for that. And the primary reason was the defense gave up seven scores on eight possessions, and the game got out of hand. And in the first half, they looked. only had the ball three times. They should have had it a fourth time with about 48, 47, 48, 49 seconds left with a chance, but they didn't use their timeout. Just something to think about.

You know, just, you know, is it possible that if the secondary has another rough day or two in the next two weeks, would they go out and look for somebody out there, you know, even if it's a late round pick for somebody who's a veteran that could help them. You just, you don't want his opportunities to be impacted by a terrible defense. Again, I'm not predicting that. I'm predicting a much better defense than the one last year. It's just, you know, we do have this recent impression from Sunday. And by the way, like I said, on Monday, there were things about the defense in the game Sunday

that weren't terrible, like their first down. defense. You know, they got some pass rush pressure at times. They didn't get many sacks. They couldn't get Baker-Mayfield to the ground. We've had that problem before. But their first down defense was exceptional. I mean, I've said, I think on both shows this week. They had them in second and ten, nine times. They had six tackles for loss. So, Jaden ended up with 16 carries for 88 yards in the game, right? That was the statistical line. But, you know, if you go back to that first play of the game, I had somebody call on the show today. We were taking calls about, all right, three days since the game, you've had a chance to settle down. What did you think of Jaden Daniels

in his first NFL game? And somebody, you know, brought up, you know, the first play of the game. You know, that first play of the game was a charged run to Jaden Daniels, a 15-yard loss as a rushing yardage stat, and it was also a fumble for Jaden Daniels. I mean, he hit the trifecta on that first play. That's a backwards lateral to Brian Robinson, Jr. The last person to touch the ball was the quarterback, so he's charged with a fumble, He's charged with lost yardage on a rushing play. And it was 15 yards of lost, you know, yardage. And then he had the kneel down at the end of the first half. That counts as a rushing play as well.

So in actuality, he really had 14 carries for 88 yards. But the other part of that is that first play of the game, if that had been a forward pass incomplete, He would have had 15 carries for 103 yards. You know, I'm factoring in the kneel down as an actual registered carry. He would have rushed for over 100 yards in his first game if that first play had been an incompletion. But it wasn't. It was backwards.

It was a lateral. It was charged negative yardage to Jaden, charged as a fumble. And there you go. But in reality, you take the kneel down, you take that. play out, he actually had 14, you know, legitimate carries. And not that it's that much different than 16. The other thing I would say is, for those that don't want to see him continue to run that much, I'm okay with him running that much. I want to see this quarterback presented as a consistent run threat. This benefits the entire offense. We've known that now, watching football,

for the last, you know, since 2012, that when you've got a quarterback that is a run threat and is posed as a run threat, the running backs eat, the wide receivers have more space because you are, you know, you are putting the defense in conflict. And so I want Reed option to be a part of the offense. I want some designed run. I'm not a big fan of that counter that they ran in the game. I don't like, you know, the quarterback being a running back and running, you know, guard center, you know, guard tackle, pulling counterplays.

But I think we're going to see some of that. But I want him to be a runner and definitely is a scrambler, of course, of course. I wanted to mention two quick things before, actually three quick things before we get to Logan. So I learned two things about two plays that I've talked about this week. The second Nate sack that he fumbled that Tyler Biotis jumped on early in the third quarter, which to me was the most concerning play because he went backwards. You know, he drifted out of the pocket instead of stepping up. And I think if he had stepped up, he had some things open.

And I talked about how Ertz was open and McCaffrey was open. somebody that knows who occasionally listens told me that Echler was actually the primary on a wheel route on that play. And I went back and looked at it, and sure enough, Echler's running a wheel route with Zakias,

kind of setting a bit of a screen. It wasn't very good. But Jaden came off of it pretty quickly. I still think he had an operational. opportunity to get to, I think, the next progression was probably Ertz on the shallow cross. At the very least, though, drifting backwards was not a good idea, and that was confirmed. Not that I needed that confirmed. And the other thing was this. On the third and 18 play that we've talked about, the McCaffrey bubble, then the throwback, which he didn't throw back to Jaden, it was told to me that McAfrey turned and ran with the ball

because he didn't think Jaden was ready to make the catch. And when you go and you look at that play, Jaden very casually gets to that point and turns around to give Luke McCaffrey some hands, give him a target. You know, he's selling the bubble screen, and then he's kind of floating out behind this wall that they've set up. But I guess the bottom line is McCaffrey turned it down because he thought that Jaden wasn't ready to take the pass.

So for what it's worth. By the way, Dan Quinn today, happy birthday. His birthday's on 9-11. And on this 9-11, of course, we remember all of the victims and their family. But I wanted to play this one soundbite from Dan Quinn. So he was asked about the 16 carries the other day, and he said that wasn't really the plan.

That's not really what they want to see. They'd like to see him let it rip a bit more. So there was a question today for Quinn, and the question was basically, if you don't want him running that much, do you want to see him stay in the pocket? more, even if that means, you know, there's a sack, and this is what Quinn said. Yeah, fair question.

And sometimes getting outside the pocket, maybe you also remain a passer, let a route develop or, you know, the option of, you know, checking it down to somebody else. So the great thing about him, I know you guys know this, like, it is our first game. And, like, he's going to be an exceptional player. Are there choices when to go, when to not? Like, you do have to grow and learn into those. and I am 100% certain that he will. But the other part of his game, like there is legs

and when there's times to go and create a first down and get an explosive, it's there. But there's also some times to move outside the pocket, like we're talking about mobile quarterbacks. Now a whole other play can begin. And so I think you'll see that part of our game come to life in the weeks' head as well. Now really it's almost like a dual threat.

It's the drop back. It's the outside the pocket, and then the running portion of it. So as a defensive coach, it creates a headache, one that I am more than happy to be a part of creating. It definitely creates a headache when you've got a quarterback that can play the way he does off schedule. He is right, though. I think that there will be more opportunities and there may have been an opportunity or two on Sunday for him to have kept his eyes down the field and made a throw instead of scrambling. and there was one to Terry that could have been a big play.

He said something else in that answer that he said a couple of times during the presser today. In fact, one of the times he said it, he was talking about Daniel Jones, the quarterback they will face on Sunday that he is coordinated against in Dallas for the last several years. He said that there's also times to move outside the pocket like we've been talking about with mobile quarterbacks. now a whole other play can begin. In one of his earlier answers on this, he said basically they have like something they call the 2.3 play, which is 2.3 seconds for the quarterback on average,

and then a whole new play starts. I haven't heard coaches describe off-scheduled quarterbacking as a whole new play, but it makes sense. You know, you've got what you need to cover, what you need to account for based on the time that the quarterback is going to have. And then all of the sudden, with a mobile quarterback, there is a second part to the play if he escapes the pocket and you've got a new play. And you've got to coach against that play as well. I've never heard a coach describe it that way. I think he mentioned it three or four times

today in talking about Jaden Daniels and talking about Daniel Jones because he described Daniel Jones is a guy that gets to that second play, and you've got to essentially, you know, plan for the first play and the second play all within one play. He also, real quickly, said that he was happy with Jamon Davis's performance on Sunday. He had a TFL. He had one of their six TFLs in the game, and he didn't get a lot of snaps in the game. What were, what were the total snaps for him? 13 snaps, 20% of the snaps. But he said that, you know, like he's been saying about

Jamon Davis, that there's been progress made with him as a three-point stance, hand in the dirt, defensive end, but also suggested that there's a chance that he'll play off the ball as well at linebacker. All right. Logan Paulson will join me right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey guys, I want to welcome a new sponsor. That sponsor is Navaj. Navage makes a nasal care product that works. How do I know that? I use the product. I'm a Navaj customer. I am someone

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and they're soft gels for those days where you're on the run and want a convenient grab-and-go option. Timeline is offering 10% off your first order of Mitopure. Go to timeline.com slash sheen. That's timeline.com slash sheen. This segment of the show brought to you by Windo Nation. call them at 86690 Nation or go to windonation.com if you've been thinking about new windows. And you should mention my name. There are some places where mentioning my name isn't going to help you at all or might even hurt you.

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yesterday. It was very funny because he called me and he said, so what happened this weekend? And I said, they got absolutely drubbed by the bucks. He's like moving in. He's selling his house. He's building a new house, which isn't ready. And they're literally like living in a trailer right now until their new house is done. They had to move out of their existing house because they had to refurnish it to kind of put it on the market, the whole thing. And he didn't watch any football week one. He doesn't care that much. It's so, you got to know him really well when you were here. He's become a really good friend of mine over the years. And people love when he's on the show with me. But he didn't watch any football. Couldn't it care less. So he called me and I said, yeah, they lost. And I said, are you going to

watch anything? And he said, not for the first week or two. I got to get through this move. he was never a big fan when you played with him, right? Of the football you're saying. Yeah. Like he was, yeah, so he was a guy that, you know, like that story is so him. You know, he was very talented at football, very mentally and physically gifted at it. But, like, you know, it was kind of, when you left was kind of indifferent to it. You know what I mean?

So I think it doesn't surprise me that he's got a million things going on. He's moving houses and, you know, he's not watching a lot of football at the moment. The funny thing is when he got into media and he started to do a talk show, and I did a show with him for close to three years, he loved it and he got into it so much. But he said, you know, I was never a fan of football. I played football, but I wasn't a fan of football. I actually have had a lot of those conversations with players over the years.

And I would bet that, and tell me if you think I'm wrong, half of the guys that play football when you've got free time don't watch football. I'd say probably more than half. Yeah, I'd say it's half to more than half. Because you're around it all the time. It's like kind of your job. I know that's like not a very nice way of talking about it, but it is your job.

And, you know, sometimes you just need a little decompressed time. I get away from thinking about fronts and coverages. And even when you're casually watching it, I find myself like, oh, what formations? It's like, why are they doing that? What's this motion for? And it's like, hey, man, just chill out. Like, you know, it's hard for me to casually watch football,

so sometimes I won't watch unless I'm watching it on the iPad, you know, kind of reviewing the film from the week. So that's kind of my opera, my most upper end I now too. I got this as an Apple review. Rate us and review, especially on Apple and Spotify. It really helps us out. It comes from, you are old. Thank you.

The review is without equal. Kevin's podcast, no hyperbole. Best of any covering the commanders. Episodes that include Jay Gruden, Santana Moss, Logan Paulson, or unfortunately too rarely, Chris Cooley cannot be missed. Thank you for that. By the way, Logan has a podcast. Take Command with Craig Hoffman.

Logan does a lot of work for Washington Commanders, YouTube TV, commanders.com, et cetera. So check them out on all of that stuff as well. So I guess just the first question, and I'll let you get started, is what were your big takeaways from Sunday's loss to Tampa? Yeah, I think my big takeaways, I think you've got to start with the quarterback, and I think the quarterback had a very solid game, but I think when I went back and watched the L-22,

I remember thinking like he seems accelerated. He seems like he's not really letting the concepts breathe. he's not throwing into kind of what I would call NFL open. So it's guys that are, I'm sure to lay people would look covered, but, you know, NFL quarterbacks are expected to make those types of reads and throws. But I think he did a good job with his legs and his athleticism of keeping the offense on schedule. And I think you see why he can be such a special quarterback. And I think when you look at what he did in training camp,

at LTAs, excuse me, you kind of say to yourself, he's a guy that can make these throws. It's just about getting comfortable with the speed. and the nuance of an NFL defense. So I think that's something that was, you know, it was kind of good and bad, like the fact that he missed some of this stuff, but the fact he's, I think he's going to learn from it, and he's shown the ability to get that stuff done.

That was something that I really took away from it. And defensively, I actually was impressed with quite a bit of stuff that they did. Obviously, the score is not something that I'm impressed with, or the coverage bus or any of that stuff. But I think that's a pretty complicated Tampa Bay defense, and I think, you know, the rushing, the rush package in the front, specifically on third down, the process of getting to the quarterback and affecting the quarterback, I appreciated tremendously.

Obviously, they need to finish those rushes and turn those pressures into sacks, but I think that was a really nice bright spot. I think just like the general competitive energy of the front was pretty impressive, obviously, there's a lot of stuff in the back end. And I will say that it's like Benjamin St. Juice was a guy that I thought really went to battle with Mike Evans and, you know, really went toe to toe. and, you know, St. Juice isn't always known as the most physical guy, but he played a really physical brand of football,

so it's nice to see that this coaching staffs may able to get that out of them. So there's a lot of positives, I think a lot of negatives as well, but I don't look at the negatives as negative. I look at them as growing opportunities, because it is still so early in the season, new coaches, you know, new players, young players. It's going to take them a little bit of time to kind of find their feet and get to where I think they can ultimately get to.

All right, I want to come back to the defense at a moment, because I actually think some of what you said is true, even though overall it was a dreadful performance in terms of the results. But I want to go back to something you said about Jaden, and that is that after watching the All-22, there were opportunities for him to kind of let it breathe, and that would have allowed him to get to some things. Do you have a couple of plays in mind that were obvious

where maybe he took off too early, or he didn't get to what you think he should have gotten to. Yeah, and I'm glad he said what I think, because, again, like, I'm still learning Cliff Kingsbury's offense through watching it, right? And we haven't had a lot of opportunities to watch what this looks like. So I'm kind of framing it in the context of the way I coach offense and the way I've learned offense.

So I just have to get that caveat out there. But I think the first example was, I think, on his first scramble, and obviously there's a pressure off the right side. They're running an ET stunt, really beautifully executed, Tampa Bay and there's a little bit of pressure. And there's, oh, well, you have to scramble on that. But the concept is like an Omaha concept or what I would call an Omaha concept. So it's a five-yard speed out by Terry, number one, a five-yard out by number two,

and then it's mirrored on both sides. So there's four kind of five-yard-out routes. And Terry does a really nice job on the route of kind of pushing at a 45-degree angle at the D.B. So it looks like he's running an outside release kind of fade, outside release, stem maybe to a dig. so the corner loses some ground. He actually takes a step away.

And when Jayden hits his top step, Kerry's hitting his top step, and that ball should be out. But for whatever reason, he kind of passed the football, he feels the rush, he gets out of the pocket. And again, this is a good play. It's a positive play for the offense because it ends up being a first down. Great job, Jay and Daniels. But also, like, to me, it's like, why did you bypass this?

Like, this is quick game. You're at your top step. You've made this throw. You can make this throw. Why not let that sucker rip? I think there's another one, you know, like on the B-Rob long catch and run, that ends up being Jane Daniel scores the next play. Obviously, a tremendous football play.

But the way I read that or the way I look at that is on the front side, you've got a post by Terry, and they're playing cover six. So they're playing quarters to that side and cover two to the field. And Terry runs a beautiful post and takes both those quarter players out. And then you get Zach and another receiver running across. There's a five-yard crossing route, and then a 15-yard crossing route. And because Terry's clean the coverage out, Zach Earth is wide open with the other safety,

the half-playing safety, running from outside in trying to undercut the route. And Zach takes a beautiful angle out. And so for me, that's one that I've seen him complete a ton in training camp so far, this off season. And he kind of is a little bit too quick through that. I trust the window, throw to grass,

and then check the football down, you know, if you don't love it. And I think ultimately, like, he bypassed that. And to me, that's an open Zach Ertz. and he gets to B-Robb and ends up being an explosive play, but that's one where I'm like, we wouldn't get to be robbed if you hit the thing you were supposed to it, or at least the way I see it, as you're supposed to do. Then there's another one to Terry,

another explosive play where they're running a dig route, right? And I think he ends up scrambling for a first down on this one as well, a dagger concept. Terry's running a through. The outside guy's running a deep in-cut, and they're in what kind of plays is single-high-man coverage. And both the people on Terry's route and the dig are playing in trail techniques.

And so versus that, I've always been taught, again, in the offenses that I've played in, that through or that clear-out route is the defenders and trail man, you throw it. And Terry's got three or four steps on that guy, and the ball should be out. He looks at it and pulls it down. So I think it's just like him getting used to NFL open, him getting used to the throws that he's going to be having to make moving forward. Again, and that ended up being a first down. So all those players that just described while I'm being critical of them, end up being positive plays for the offense.

But instead of being a 15-yard gain, especially this last one, that could have been a 50-yard, 60-yard-thirty-yard touchdown if he makes that completion. So I think those are the things that I look at and say, man, like decent performance, protecting the football. Again, there's the fumble on the reverse, on the lateral,

and then there's the fumble in the pocket. But no, you protect the football, didn't lose the ball, didn't put the ball in harm's way. But I think in order to maximize what this offense, this Cook-Carr-Kingbury offense can be, I think we're going to have to be more aggressive with the football. And again, I think that's another reason I'm not worried about it. I think he'll grow each and every week and get more and more comfortable,

and you'll see a more effective, productive offense and more effective productive Jane Daniels. So one play that I've talked about a lot this week, not a lot, it's only Wednesday. The play that was the most concerning for me after watching the All-22, and you have obviously a much better eye and a much more trained eye for this. But what really bothered me was the way he reacted to the pressure after I thought there were opportunities for him to unload it quickly. And that was that second and eight sacks, you know, on the first drive of the third quarter

where he did fumble and Biotish fell on it. It looked like there was a wheel route for Echler. and then it looked like Ertz and McCaffrey running crosses, running crossers, the shorter crosser, the shallow crosser from Ertz on a second and eight. And what really bothered me is not necessarily that he didn't pull the trigger, but that he backed up out of the pocket, which is a no-no, right? And that kind of gives fodder to those that really fun. focused on this pressure to sack percentage in the offseason, which I thought that there was

a lot of context around that at LSU. But that was the one thing I hated to see more than some of the decisions, as you described, where he could have cut it loose and instead turned a play into a positive, maybe not as big of a positive. What did you think of that play that I'm referring to? Yeah, I think that's a really good example of a young player, kind of sees a big of a positive. being an NFL defense for the first time. And I know he saw, you know, joint practices and, you know,

pre-season games, all that kind of stuff. But that's, I think, a really good example. It's understanding that, like, what's the coverage, what's the pressure? Are we actually picked up? And how, and this is a good example of where I would need to accelerate my process. Like, where is my hot answer versus this pressure look? And I think, I don't think, I think, again, that's where the maturity of the player comes in the focus a little bit for me.

because, like you said, the pocket's actually pretty good initially. It's good enough for him to see, I think, Luke McCaffrey and Zackerich. And so I have to understand, like, they're bringing pressure. We're going to be a little bit. We're not hot, but we're warm, right? Hot would imply there's a free runner, but we're warm, and I can get the ball out here very quickly in this man-to-man coverage look. And so to me, that's where you're just taking a young player,

adding more reps, because I guarantee you you never saw anything like what Todd Bowles ran during his time at LOS. Like all the games I watched, and he's playing against him. Alabama, all these big-time defenses. No one breaks blitzes and creates pressure the way Todd Bulls does in college football. So that's new. And again, this is one where I kind of chalk it up.

I keep the guy that each and every week through the off season got better and learned. And I think these are great experiences for him to say, you know, maybe I can cut this throw loose. And I got to understand that I'm warm here, and the ball can come out quickly. And I can't back up in the pocket. Like, even though I had success earlier in the game,

like this is why people are telling me not to do that. and there's no better teacher than experience. And so I think that's a perfect example of a young player that is needing to grow and mature, and I'm not concerned about it because I think he will grow and mature as a player. And this is part of the learning experience. I think back everyone knows the story about Peyton Manning throwing 20 interceptions. That's part of the growing process for these players. And I think he's definitely doing that.

He's going to have to bumps along the way. But the thing that I want to see is like the next time, they're playing the Giants this Sunday, or does he have the same issue? And I personally don't think he will because he's shown to be that kind of student of football. The last time I had you on, I think it was early August, something like that. You know, I said, what do you expect from the Cliff Kingsbury offense? To me, this was the most intriguing thing heading into the regular season.

And you said even here earlier, you know, you're still trying to figure out. You're still learning what Cliff Kingsbury wants to do, what he wants to get to. So what do you, did you learn anything? Do you have hunches as to what he wants and what he'll get to? I mean, one of the things I've emphasized is they only had the ball three times in the first half. You know, they didn't, they only had really six possessions while the game was still competitive. So they didn't get as many opportunities as you typically get because they couldn't get off the field defensively.

But what did you come away thinking about the Cliff Kingsbury offense after one game? Yeah, I think there was a drive, I want to say, it was either the start of the second half or end of the second quarter. Excuse me. And I thought we saw it was the play that Jayden scored on, and B. Rob had a nice catch-on, catch-and-run. And I think you saw kind of the best version or the version that Cliff is hunting for in this offense. And what I mean by that is they were able to stay,

their first down plays were effective, right? So they got them to second and five, second and six, and then the subsequent second down play was good enough to get them a first down. So they're able to get two first downs and operate, not at a full speed, hurry up cadence, but at a pretty good cadence. So by the time they're on play, you know, six, seven, eight of that drive, you could tell that the Tampa Bay defense is just gassed. They're tired.

They're not pass rushing. you know, on the play where he throws it to be robbed, like this vaunted rush that's been to get it at them all day is basically not moving. And Jaden's able to dissect the coverage very deliberately and get the ball out, right? And I think, and the other thing you see is you're not bringing pressure in that situation because you're moving so quickly

it's hard for the defensive coordinator to get a more advanced defensive call. And so I think when you see that first and second down efficiency, and this is something that, again, is not necessarily specific to clip because every offense is trying to do a version of this, but you see how effective when you get to play 5, 6, 7, 7, 8 of a drive when you're in a little bit of a hurry-up cadence,

how effective it is about regulating the defense. So I think that's what you're looking for. And then in this game, you know, obviously Clifton used a lot of shifts or motions, but I do think he did that, I would assume, because he's trying to make it easier for Jay and Daniels to identify coverage structures and pressure packages from a static picture as opposed to adding movement, which can be challenging for some quarterback.

So that's my assumption. I haven't talked to him about that. I'm just kind of saying he's a smart man. he's not doing it for no reason at all. I'm assuming this is why, but I think that one drive is where you see kind of what this offense can be when, again, that first and second down efficiency is there, you can stay on the field for more than three or four plays at a clip. Yeah, if the drive you're talking about was the one that ended with him scoring on the zone

reed keeper to make it 2314, I actually thought one of the more impressive throws of the game for him. We're processed quickly, threw it quickly, and it was the throw to Terry real quickly. No, no, to Ertz. It was the first play of the drive. To Ertz. I'm just looking at my notes. I think the one thing that I took away from what we're going to see a lot of,

and by the way, I'm thrilled, and it's not a surprise, but I'm curious as to what you think, we're clearly going to see him involved in the run game. Presented as a run threat, you know, read option being a big part of what a defense has to account for. Hopefully play action comes off of that. Look, you were there for it, and you know how much it benefits everybody else on the field if you can get into 11-on-11 in the run game, et cetera.

A lot of people don't want to see him that much, involved in the run game. You say what? I think kudos to the offensive staff for kind of, I think, generally keeping him relatively insulated from contact. I think he did a good job of insulating himself. So if he is playing like that where he's aware of the contact, he's not trying to take big hits, he's not trying to hit to hit a home on every play, I think that's a very effective tool. And I think back to watching young Russell Wilson and how effective he was that

picking his moments of witness scramble and how devastating that can be for a defense. So I love that he has that ability. I can't wait to also see kind of how the quarterback run game evolves to kind of fit more of his skill set. You know, they ran a couple of GTs in the game plan, guard, guard tackle pull. Yeah. Like counters. Don't you refer to that as a counter? Yeah, it's a guard tackle counter.

Yeah. Yep. And so, yeah, so obviously, like, I'm a little, I was a little. little surprised by that because I don't think of him as a GT runner. But those plays, especially in college football, can be huge gashes. So what comes off of that, like you're saying, how do we get him to the perimeter more? How do we maximize his skill set? Again, because this is one of those things where we're all learning.

You know, the whole staff is learning what best fits him and what best fits the offense. And so I think that's another thing where, you know, like I've heard I said this a million times this week because everyone keeps asking about it. But, like, it takes a long time, even in the context of a season, to learn what you're effective at offensively, like what this receiver can do, what this offensive lineman feels comfortable with, how this combination is going to hit. And I think we're starting to see them figure it out. Like, you know, I've been – when I was playing, it would take sometimes five weeks to kind of really get a feel for who you were in terms of offensive identity. Sure.

And I think this is all part of the process. I definitely think it's good that it's in the offense. I think it's an important part of the offense. I think just the direction it goes and its final iteration is going to be something that will be very interesting to keep an eye on. So you brought something up. I love him involved in the run game. I love, you know, read option being a big part of it. I think you get into, you know, being able to play action off of that, which, you know, is, as we saw throughout 2012, incredibly effective. it's effective for, you know, lots of Lamar and Jalen and everybody, Jalen hurts, etc. But those counters or QB powers, I don't like those for a quarterback like Chaden

because to me you're now, you know, kind of running between the tackles into piles more often than not for a lack of a better description. And to me, it's their higher risk plays for a quarterback like him. It's one thing if you're going to run Lamar when he's a thicker quarterback or Cam Newton, and we've seen both of those guys in particular over the last 10 years run a lot of quarterback power, quarterback counter, quarterback sweep. You know, true design quarterback runs. I don't love it for him.

I don't know what you thought of those other than the way you described it. What do you think? Yeah, I mean, I think it's all about, this is what I'm talking about also with the counters. I think the setup is really important for a play like that. It's about how do we create space? Because I think when you, again, like I coach high school football, I watch a lot of college football for play ideas for the high school level, and GT is a fantastic play, and it can lead to a lot of space.

And what I mean by that is like sometimes, you run like a jet action or you have the back, offset, running hard to the right, and you end up pulling guys back to the left. The lineback is the defensive line. They have to respect that. And you can create huge creases. to that counter side. Especially if you're reading it, right?

If you're reading off the back and the defensive end up to the running back, and there's a ton of space out there. So I do think, again, that's what I'm talking about. They're kind of figuring out, I still think, the best way to get to some of these runs. Because, like I said, that can be a space play if designed correctly. And I think based on their setup, I think they thought it would be a good space play, because they get in that four-receiver overload away, they have carry-out to the left by himself, they have to push to the right, so you get really good leverages on that front side double team.

But the action in the backfield maybe is a little bit not what they were looking for. Didn't create the draw they were looking for. And that's what I'm talking about. It's like, what can we do to maximize these plays? Because, again, like you said, like I always think of traditionally like those quarterback power, quarterback counterguides, like the Camus and the Jalen Hertz's of the world, right? But you can also make it fit a smaller, more shifty quarterback. Like Lamar, I think they run a couple of those there in Baltimore with him,

but they've been able to create more space. And so I think it's just about kind of going through the process saying, hey, we thought this would create a lot of space, didn't really work the way we thought. How do we kind of evolve this and make it work the way we needed to? So, again, I think this kind of falls in the trial and error bucket of what's going to work with NFL defenses with a running quarterback. But I think that's a great idea.

Get an empty, make them spread out. Hopefully it hits didn't work the way you thought. That doesn't mean it's a bad play. It just means it didn't work exactly the way you were hoping. So I'm keeping an eye on the evolution over the next. couple weeks and see ultimately what they settle on. Is GT a good play at creating space for them? Or do they prefer, you know, more zone-me, read more RPO stuff, more triple option like the Philadelphia Eagles were running a couple years ago where they're reading the end and then they have

a past concept out there. So I think there's a lot of growing that's going to be done in that area. And I'm excited to see the direction that it goes. Yeah, you know, like I think of triple option actually is the pitch being the third option, whereas like, you know, what you just described, I think is more of kind of a combination of read option and RPO, right? Where you've got to get rid of it quickly because you've decided to pull it from the running back's

gut and you've decided to throw it rather than run it, but you've got to do it quickly because if not you got ineligibles downfield. But I hear you on that. I hear you. It'll be interesting because to me those are true, we're running

our quarterback as a running back. This isn't an option. This is, we're going to run him. We're going to pull the guard. We're going to pull the tackle. And we're going old, you know, Gibbs counter tray with the quarterback running it. And we'll see what happens. Let's flip it. Well, oh, one more on him. You know, he was one of them. And we've had this conversation before. He really was one of the best deep ball throwers, if not the best. I think Pennix would have been the other one in college football last year. I think they're going to hit on.

a lot of the deep shots that they had on that first play of the third quarter. But we didn't see another shot like that taken. Just kind of what did you think about that? And then the fact that there wasn't necessarily one of those shots taken the rest of the way. Yeah, I feel like there were, again, that kind of goes back to what I said initially. I think there were opportunities for him to kind of uncorker couple and let him rip down the field. but he just, for whatever reason, didn't feel comfortable taking it again.

I think as he gets more comfortable, that's going to happen. And also, I felt like he was a little, I felt like he was a little juiced up. You know, I think in your first outing in the NFL, like, that makes sense. I think when you watch Taylor Williams and Bow next, you see similar things. You see quarterbacks, those other two guys included,

who are usually pretty accurate, right? And then all of a sudden it's the first game and they're missing throws that they have been making for the last four or five years in college. So I think he's a little excited. think that was a great opportunity, and it just got a little much. And I think, again, this is one of those examples,

as he has more time on task, as he's in more games, as he's getting more experience, like I think those will hit more often than not, because I think that's a skill set that he's not only shown in college, but when you watch training camp, it was every day he did one of those. So I'm not concerned about it. I think it's just going to take a little bit of time for him to settle in,

and I can't wait for to watch the game and he finally does that. Yeah, me too. One other one on offense. I think I said that was the last offensive question. Did Echler look like Echler to you again? I thought so. I mean, I thought, you know, he had that tremendous, you know, conversion.

I think it was a second and eight where they took the ball down to him, and he breaks a couple tackles. Campers forward. I thought he ran the ball hard. You know, they ran a couple kind of counter-power type plays with him from the gun. He's got such good lower-body strength. So I actually thought, you know, when I watched him last year before I realized he was hurt, I was like, oh, man, maybe he's lost a step.

But to me, it looks fully healthy now. I think he's going to be a really valuable weapon for this offense. And again, that's another one to keep an eye on, too, is like how do you use him in the passing game? How do you use him and be robbed together? I think they can create a lot of mismatches offensively for opposing defenses. So, you know, quarterback runs, how you get both those guys on the field to maximize this offense for sure? is something I'm keeping eye on. All right. Let's get to the defense with Logan.

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One discount per household. So real quickly, before we get back to Logan and talk defense from the Tampa game and maybe get a quick thought from Logan on the, upcoming game against the Giants. My ad selling partner, Blue Wire, is giving the listeners of this podcast, all of you, a chance to win a $500 gift card. All you have to do is fill out a survey, a quick survey about you and your podcast listening habits. This survey will help create a better advertising experience for the audience, and in turn,

by the way, help this show. Go to bluewire pods.com slash survey, answer a few simple questions for a chance to win $500. That's bluewirepods.com slash survey. We continue with Logan Paulson. Let's talk some defense. And I thought it was interesting what you said at the beginning, that there was a lot encouraging. And I think, you know, your discussion or your comments about the pass rush and it was close and they just didn't finish with Baker Mayfield kind of.

escaping some of that. I think we all saw that. We also saw them score on seven of their eight drives, score 37 points offensively without the benefit of a super short field because of a turnover or a kick return. I actually mentioned Logan earlier this week in kind of my recap of the game. I thought their first down defense was pretty encouraging. They had Tampa in second and 10 or longer nine times in the game. They had six TFLs in the game. I think you would take that in most cases. But it was a train wreck kind of after first down. And I'm wondering what you saw, especially with respect to coverage and some of the confusion and communication issues they seem to have. Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, definitely when the communication, you know,

with a new group can be challenging. So like, you know, early on there's a, I think the, Well, it was incomplete, but they're in-man, Tempevay comes out in empty, and they're trying to check the cover-to, which is a very common check for empty, like around the NFL. I'm assuming it's covered two. And half the team is playing zone, and half the team is playing man.

And so when that happens, like, and you're not every been on the same page, that's going to be an issue. Obviously, there's the touchdown. I forget, I think it was sometime in the third quarter, you know, where there's a coverage bus between Mike San Francisco and Juan Martin. And I think, you know,

McMillan-in. Yeah, McMillan. They motioned a bunch. Tampa Bay does, and those bunches get a little bit dicey, especially with guys that, you know, are new, our young players, San Francisco's a first-year player, obviously Kwan's a second-year player. And so, like, who's got who coming out of the bunch? And with more experienced secondaries, like, they can handle that kind of stuff because they communicate, they know each other, they know kind of the second level of football IQ.

So I think there was a lot of stuff like that. You know, another thing that came up, you know, I was with London on the broadcast, and he kept talking about the leverages of the dvs and how at certain moments, they don't appear to be playing the correct leverages. And I think that's something that was also very glaring when you kind of rewatch the film. It's like your helps in here,

or this is the down-and-distance, and you don't have help in here, like you should be positioning yourself so that you're forcing the receiver away from this area. And I thought that happened a couple times with Forbes, I hope that happened a couple times with Mike Santer still. And so, again, like young guys kind of, working through first NFL game action, I think is, while it's very frustrating to watch,

I'm sure for the fan base, it's part of the growing process and part of the maturation process. So just like we were talking about with Jane Daniels and how there's some things he can work on, I felt the same way with Mike Santerstil, with Emmanuel Forbes, and some of those of the Kwan Martin, Benjamin St. Jude, who I thought actually played well. You know, I was impressed with him. Maybe he showed me a side of play that I haven't seen from him before, but there's those areas that he can improve. So I think that was kind of the main takeaway.

It's like, where's your help? Where's your lever? What's the ideal leverage? Can we make these throws a little bit more challenging, challenging this based on our pre-snap body position? And again, this is London Fletcher, and he turned me out of this. I think this is really great insight by him, and that's why you should listen to the radio broadcast. But that, to me, was the big takeaway in the secondary. There's a couple assignment.

There's a couple, like, obviously, communication errors and stuff that where Tampa Bay got us with the pen. But there's also times that we're kind of shooting ourselves in the foot because we're not playing the techniques we're supposed to be playing. I'm an idiot, by the way, because once you said that, I'm like, well, of course. And I didn't introduce you that way. Logan is part of the radio broadcast with Bram and London. And you're on the sidelines, correct? So you're, yeah. So I have one quick question, and that is, how hot was it on Sunday there? It was, especially for the first two quarters, it was as advertised, Todd. I think on the field it got it out of like 105 degrees, and, you know, down in Tampa, it's very, very humid.

So it was warm. And so kudos to the guys for fighting through it, make sure you're hydrated. I don't think there was any cramping issues. But, yeah, I mean, it was very, very warm. There was people that were on the sideline before the game who needed to be helped off the field because they were having heat-related issues. So it was, I'm just talking fans, you know what I mean, that were there watching them. the sideline. So it was very, very hot for sure.

Emmanuel Forbes, is it a confidence issue now as much as anything else, you know, technique, ability, etc.? How would you describe the issues that he's having? Yeah, so obviously anytime, you know, players not playing well, like confidence is a big thing, right? And I'm not saying that's not an issue, but to me, you're not after talking with some of the guys on the former staff, about him and about kind of some of his issues.

They're kind of like he's not overly detailed. And like one of the things about, you know, talking with Fletch, you know, I'm so lucky you get to talk to him all the time with you such smart guy is, you know, like I always think of like, oh, this split on offense is super important. Or look at how the tackles position himself. Like this is exactly what you need to do here to maximize this play. All those things are really important. But it's the same thing for defense.

And so if I'm a corner and I have inside help, I want to be outside leverage. if I don't have inside help, I want to be inside leverage and force this guy out. I don't want to allow a free access into the defense. So those are the types of details that I think you want to see more from him. You want to see him kind of embrace that a little bit more. And again, like you have to talk to Dan and Joe Wood Jr. about the specifics of that. But that's something that I think I would, I know I'm going to start keeping an eye on moving forward with regards to him specifically. Because, again, like St. Juist always, I know I know he's not, you know, maybe a fan favorite,

but he is trying to do the right thing all the time. And Forbes, again, like, can you lock in on some of these details to maximize your performance? So to me, that's kind of where that performance-related thing falls in. It's like, are you giving yourself the best opportunity before the ball snapped to be the best version of yourself on this play? So really interesting stuff. How much time do they give somebody like that before he's got to prove to them? that he's detail-oriented, and he's in the right leverage based on, you know, the defense that's called.

Yeah, I mean, that's a question for, you know, Adam Peters and Dan Quinn, quite honestly. Like, and I, you know, I have thoughts on that, you know, like, as a coach personally, you know, and I don't coach at the NFL level, but as a coach, like I have a very low tolerance or stuff like that personally. But again, that's my own personal opinion, and he's a very athletic, very talented young man who at points during training camp showed that he was willing to invest this way. And this is, again, this is one game. We're not overreacting the one game. We're going to give him the benefit of the doubt. We're going to give him some grace. But I think that's ultimately a Dan and Adam question. By the way, Logan and I briefly talked before we started to record. And we talked about the

whole one game, you know, reaction overreaction, which, you know, Logan brought it up to me. And I'm like, yeah, no, I give the, you know, I give the referendum on one week's speech every year, but it seems like you're a little, you know, you've been in the media now for a while, a few years anyway, but yeah, this fan base, and by the way, I don't think it's just this fan base, I think just NFL fans overreact to what they see in week one across the board, but it frustrates you, doesn't it? It does frustrate me a little bit, because again, like this is the first outing. And, you know, And you've talked about this, and I love that you bring it up.

It's like it takes a couple of weeks for teams to figure out what they're really good at, especially young teams. Like Tampa Bay, you know, they've been together. That coaching staff has been around, obviously, new OC, but he's running the system. They were running the last year. And all those guys are familiar with that terminology. They're all familiar with details of it. And so even on the defense side of the ball, it's been the same defense there for like six years now.

So they're going to have a foothold. They're going to have an advantage. And teams that are newer, it's going to take some. time to establish that identity, and it's just important for fans to remember that, because this is not, this is this team today is going to be drastically different in four weeks. And then after that, you know, eight weeks. So I'm excited to see the growth and maturation and where these guys ultimately end up. All right. Two more. Who played well on defense?

Who played well on defense? That's a great question. I'm going to say a guy that flash a little bit to me was Jamie Davis. I thought he was a good job. He only had 14 snaps, but I thought showed up. I think Duran and John did do. a good job. And people are like, oh, they got gashed on some of these runs. And to me, in a week one matchup from a team that runs a lot of duo, a lot of outside zone, a lot of, like, power runs,

to get a lot of trap and wham in week one was surprising to me. Like, that's not something I would have necessarily prepped those guys for. So I thought outside of those couple of plays, which were probably unscattered for the most part, I thought they did a good job of being physical, aggressive as pass rushers. And

is their area for them to improve? 1,000 percent. But I thought they, I think this defense is going to be very, very good for them. Did they both get trapped equally, or was it just one more than the other? You know, that's so back to give the exact number. But I think they, it was pretty close. Maybe it was like two and four, John and Duran, you know what I'm saying? Or three and four, something like that.

It was pretty close. And, again, usually you're trapping the three techniques. so as ever is playing the three technique in the defense is the guy that's going to get a little bit more. But, yeah, I couldn't tell you if they were like game planning around one guy specifically. First blush on the Giants. First blush on the Giants.

I think this is a much more favorable matchup for this team. And again, that's not necessarily an indictment of any personnel on the Giants. I just think the offensive system is a little bit more straightforward. I think when you look at Tampa Bay, that's about as tough as a week one matchup, as you can ask for, because the amount of motion

they run, the different personnel they run, the way they use cadence, like, the Giants' offense is not at that level just yet. You're going to get much simpler looks to start. And again, are they going to test your bunch rules now, for sure? But it's not going to feel the same way that Tampa felt it because Tampa lives in that stuff.

And I think defensively, like Todd Bowles is a nightmare. And obviously, because the defensive coordinator's in the case of the moment. Shane Bowen. It's Shane Bowen. Something. Shane Bowen, yeah. He's a little bit more bend, but don't break.

He's not going to heat you up. He's not going to bullets the same way. They're going to play softer coverage cells, a little bit more quarters, a little more covered two, a little cover six. And so hopefully that lets Jayden settle in and identify throwing lanes and windows.

Obviously, you've got to deal with Dexter Lawrence in the middle if he is an absolute problem. But I think that's one player as opposed to the entire defense that you're just trying to negotiate. So I think the matchup this week is much more favorable, just from a schematic on paper X as a note standpoint. Thanks for doing this, as always. Love talking to you, learning from you.

Logan, again, is on the radio broadcast with Bram and London on the sidelines in year one of doing it. That's a fun thing to do. Enjoy it. And I will talk to you soon. Yeah, thanks, Kevin. Really appreciate it. Really like Logan Paulson a lot. And one of the things that I love about Logan, and I say this about the people that come on the show,

Tim Legler is my number one example of this. But when you are talking to guys that are really still in the game, even though they're not playing the sport that they played professionally, but in the game as a coach in Logan's coaching high school football, Tim Legler's coached, you know, big-time AAU basketball for years. I think that there's just a perspective from those guys that is up to date and just more insightful than you get from people that aren't necessarily in that world still. Logan's great. All right. We are done for the day. Back tomorrow with Tommy.