The Kevin Sheehan Show - Andy & Czabe

Episode Date: January 26, 2025

One more Championship Week show and it's a good one. Kevin is joined by Andy Pollin and Steve Czaban (The Sports Reporters) to start the show. The boys talked a ton about the team, the name, and the game. Then diehard Commanders' fan Tim Legler (ESPN) jumped on to talk about the NFC Championship match-up against the Eagles.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it, but you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheon Show. Here's Kevin. Championship Sunday finally has arrived. Two games today that will determine who plays in Super Bowl 59 two weeks from today in New Orleans. Our team, of course, in a place it is not seen in 33 years against a division rival that is playing in its eighth NFC championship game. just this century.

Washington's dream season is about to become either a truly impossible dream season or it will end and will be disappointed for about an hour and then realize that this was one hell of a beginning to something special.

The show's presenting sponsor, Windonation, as always. 86690 Nation, windownation.com if you need new windows. Mention my name. They'll come out and give you a free in home, no obligation estimate. On this final championship week's show,

Andy Poland and Steve Zabin coming up in about three minutes for 13 years paired together on the best show ever on the team 980. After Zabe and Andy, Tim Legler will be on the show with me. I recorded both of these interviews, these conversations late in the week, so there is some stuff we won't get to and you won't hear mentioned, like the Snyder story from ESPN yesterday,

or any of the news that's broken since Friday. The news yesterday, by the way, Duran Payne has been ruled out of the championship game. He had the finger from the Tampa Bay game. Last week we saw on the injury report knee listed. I don't know if it's the finger. I don't know if it's the knee. It might be both. But Duran Payne is not going to play.

The team elevated Carl Davis from the practice squad. Davis played, if you remember, when John Allen was injured. I know a lot of you don't think that this is a big blow losing Duran for this game. I would bet you that there are people in that locker room, coaches and players alike, that think it's a big blow. But no Duran in the title game in Philadelphia. Three quick emails before I get to Andy and Steve about Cooley's appearance. yesterday on the podcast. This from my guy Seth, Seth writes, Kevin. Cooley was on fire yesterday. I can't

believe how far ahead of everybody else he is as an analyst when he's really pumped about it and preps. This from Perry Z. Cooley has the best football acumen of anybody that talks about our team. And then this from Scotty. Scotty writes, if the Redskins win, I'm not sure I won't be more excited to hear Cooley's preview on the podcast than the game itself. Oh, I think you'll be more excited about the game, Scotty M. Yeah, if you missed a yesterday's show with Cooley, I highly recommend that you listen to it. He's all in on football right now, and he had it all figured out on what Washington needs to do to be successful today. He watched hours of film to get ready and I appreciated it and I think many of you did as well.

All right, let's get to it. The sports reporters with Andy and Zabe was as good as it's ever been on the team 980. 13 years together on sports talk local radio overall. 13 years together and I've got them today for the next 20 to 30 minutes. Boys, we spent all of those years talking about this team and never got close to a moment like this. Can you believe the season they've had and the game they're about to play? Well, all those years that Dave said, let's go have ourselves a season. We got one, right? Exactly.

I said it to Sheehan back in August. And I said, do you think you're going to have a season? And he said, yeah, I do. And I remember thinking of myself, that poor fella. He always falls for this. I don't always fall for it. I don't always fall for it. I fell for it this year because I love the quarterback.

It's okay to fall for it. You're meant to fall for it every August. It's the way you need to be a fan. Every fan has to say this could be a season at least, if not a magical season. I am probably more of a glass-half-empty person. Shocker. I think they're going to win the Super Bowl.

I think they're going to win it. I really do. So do why. You're already two games ahead, Andy. I understand. I understand. Well, I watch the other games. I don't chalk the plays.

I don't have the resources to do that. But just from my eyes, they look like they're playing the best of the 14th. Do they have the best talent? No. But they're playing great right now. And this quarterback, he's Tiger Freakin' Woods. He really is.

We haven't seen anything like this. Dave, your line, let's go have ourselves a season. I mean, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. I can't tell you how many people will call the show and say, you know, Sheehan, as Zab's always said, let's go have ourselves a season. Everybody knows that, and it worked this year. I love that you use it, and I love that the callers say it. I think it embodies really the essence of having hope, which is all. Redskins slash Commander fans have had to eat for 33 years.

It's just the empty hope of, let's go have a season. Because when I say have a season, you know it meant more than just listening to you, Sheehan, go over spreadsheet scenarios. In early December, that would be more and more far-fetched to somehow get into the playoff alone. So this has far exceeded that. I did kind of go through a lot of those scenarios, didn't I? Usually in like late November when they were four and eight. And I said it's not over yet, boys. Right. Yeah. Right. But I love that. You know, that's the way it's got to be. What was the best, what was the best season prior to this? It was what, 2005,

give a second year? And yeah, that's the last time they'd want to playoff game. prior to this one. No, no, no, no, no, no. I think 14 with Kirk. That would be 15. 15. 15 with Kirk. But they lost the Green Bay in the playoffs. The best, most successful. But it was a home play. It was a home playoff game. It was better than RG3, I think. I don't know. It's either 12 or 15. Well, but the 05 was with Mark Brunel. You know how many yards, total net yards he had to ask? 41.

Yeah, but it's actually 25 because he took a couple of sacks for 16 yards. I mean, it's remarkable. And even that yard guy anyway. Nope. It's a college thing. Well, Andy's. Whatever. The point is it was low.

41 or 25, it was nothing. And it was Sean Taylor picking up a fumble and returning it for a touchdown. So why do you say that was the best season since this most successful? they want a playoff game. Andy's saying that that's the last time that they want before this year. They won a divisional. They got to a divisional round game. The furthest probe into the postseason, granted. 2012.

2012, Zabe, you're right. 2012, there was a feeling during that season, and we didn't know what a mess it was behind the scenes. But they were up 14 to nothing against Seattle in the playoff game. and they had won seven in a row to get there. Well, and they had the it's quarterback in the league that they were making posters of saying, you know, RG3, like Obama's Hope poster. So there was this feeling of not only is this season magical,

but we got our guy. Exactly. The Thanksgiving game against Dallas, the four touchdown game against Dallas, that was the high watermark. I think that, The day after you were feeling, okay, they got it right this time, and the next 10 years are going to be great.

We didn't know what was brewing behind the scenes. Wasn't there a Dallas game at home after that one? Yeah, to end the season to get to the post season. Yeah, but he was – I think that was hard. He was hard. But he didn't play that game? No, Andy – I think Andy's saying that's when we knew they had gotten it right at quarterback. If we didn't know already.

Oh, right. When he went into Dallas and finally won a Thanksgiving Day game against the Cowboys for the skins and lit them up, you know, four touchdowns in the first half. It was, I mean, we didn't know that they were going to make a big run to the postseason, but it did feel, and I agree with you, Andy, it felt like, oh God, they definitely got it right with him. Right. Little did we know. Yeah. Level did we know. So all of us, the three of us are all lifelong fans. I mean, Zabe, you know, do respect.

you've been the most obvious to sort of check out, but for legitimate reasons. I mean, your show is not here. You do a show in Milwaukee. You do a show for Green Bay Packers fans. But I want to ask both of you, and I'll start, Zay with you first. Do you feel this at all emotionally? Is this impacting you? Are you moved by this at all?

Absolutely not. I said this on my podcast this week. I said it hits different. And it's because me, along with many fans, Andy is not one of those fans, still has a hole in the fabric of the franchise. And in the notion of being a fan, because of every single thing that many of us own

that had the word redskins on it. From every hat, sweater, shirt, bobblehead, mini helmet, football, Christmas ornament, throw rug, sweater, doggy sweater, it all said redskins. Like, that's part of being a fan. Seinfeld said you're root for the laundry. The name and the logo got ripped away from us

for reasons that not only we had nothing to do with, there are bullshit reasons. And there's a gap. So they got an expansion team back. I'm happy for that. I'm happy for you, Kevin. I'm happy for Andy. I am unmoved inside.

I will neither be super-related nor super dejected. based on the outcome of the game. I would like to see some of you in New Orleans, but the state of media is such who's going to, I don't know if anyone's going to get sent. You're going to? Still working on it here. Yeah.

It is the state of media right now. Andy, what about you? It is. I don't think so. No. No, I'm talking about how do you feel? Have you attached yourself to this emotionally? Oh, yeah.

Andy's fully. He's happy. 100%. And I'm in a little bit different stage than you guys are because I have grandchildren that are decked out in commanders gear and rooting for the team. And by the time they

grow up to be old enough to understand the football, they won't have any attachment to Redskins. And, you know, for me, it's a name. I still look at the Burgundy and Gold. And I look at the tradition that this team has had.

And it's, you know, again, just the name. No, maybe we'll all feel better. And I think it's probably heading in this direction. that the W will have a couple of feathers hanging off of it. I believe that when they play a throwback game, that the helmet will have the logo on it. I think it's heading in that direction, too. But the name Redskin is never coming back. And I accept that.

It's okay with me. Yeah, I mean, Zabe, you, I don't think you, I think you nailed the way Andy felt. But there is a hole for me. I mean, I have not, even before the loss of the name, had been emotionally worn down by the losing and by the shenan, by Snyder. I mean, Snyder chased, when you do the math, he chased two-thirds of the fan base away, and I was definitely part of that two-thirds. Now, because of what we do, I root for us, and it's better that they win than lose, much better. But there is no doubt. Redskins is never

coming back. But the emotional attachment to a brand is something that anybody that understands marketing and branding, you take that away. You're risking losing a lot of people. And there are a lot of people who feel this way. I'm not with you where I'm totally checked out, in part, because I really was all in on the quarterback. And like Andy, I've got three boys and two of them are so into this right now. They are incredibly into it. The next question would be, and I'll

start with you, Zabe, because it's really not applicable to Andy, could you ever envision feeling the way you used to if they didn't bring back Redskins, but they brought back, say, football team, the old uniforms, and let's just say

it's the W with the feathers hanging off, but they went to the logo for, you know, a game or two, a C-Eas, No. No, you're still not there. You still can't say the R word. That whole history has been branded racist when it never was, and it's an awkward thing. It's the uncle who's been banished to the island of, you know, improperness that is awkward. It's just awkward. I mean, if the Miami barracudas were in the Super Bowl, and they used to be the dolphins, how would it hit? Or if it was the Pittsburgh roughnecks? I mean, it would be dumb. People root for names and logos and colors and history. And back in the day, this coach and that coach, nobody wants to have to dance around. Oh, God, you know, we don't, we're not called that anymore. We don't use that logo. And NFL films is selectively cropping out any at all

mentions possible. They don't. I haven't seen that. I could be wrong. But, But I haven't seen in my viewing of sort of historical NFL film stuff, them are racing redskins or reducing redskins from mention or appearance. I didn't say a race. I said they dance around it. And it's not just them. It's other media entities. You'll see sometimes the network will show a record for the last time Washington was in the NFC title game was 1993, right? or 91.

Yeah. And then they'll have the commander's logo there. That's part of the writing of it. Well, that makes me vomit my mouth. That I agree. I'll tell you this. When they retired Sonny Jurgensen's number, they didn't have any Redskins logos

or anything related to Redskins with it. And with this new agreement with the family of the one who designed the helmet logo back in 196. Wetzel, yeah. they're going to do that. They're going to do that now. And whether that, you know, make some people feel better, obviously it doesn't make you feel better. But if it does, I think that takes it more. And I, whenever I refer to what happened prior to a few years ago, I call them the Redskins. And I like the fact that the new ownership group calls them the Redskins and referring to what they were at the time. I think whitewashing it out from history is ridiculous. But moving forward, to me, this is going to be. be the commanders, and I've accepted that, and I root for a team that's got a great quarterback who's very exciting, and I enjoy now watching the games, which I hadn't done in a long time. Yeah, but someday they won't have a great quarterback, and it won't be good.

Everything goes through that. They'll just be the commanders. Okay, and then they'll get another quarterback, but they don't have the most dysfunctional and wicked owner in the history of sports run the team anymore. They've got good ownership. And that's wonderful. That's relief. And Jane Daniels brings joy. But the continuity in the fabric of this name change has left a permanent wound for many. And for me, I've, luckily I've drained my emotion of the situation five years ago when I started this new job and made this commitment of this is my one lifetime switch of teams. And not only does it coincide with my professional work, but I am moving to the safest haven there is. sports, the onerless miracle child of the NFL, the Green Bay Packers. So I've made peace of it long ago. So this moment in time is not of any torment to me because I've already made that emotional move in my heart.

But look, in a world in which the Braves are still around, the chiefs are still around, the Blackhawks are still around, Florida State Seminoles are still around, you know, the guardians and the commanders. are here. Right. They're the dummies that gave up their identity in a moment in time of insanity in this country. Let me give you my view on this. I wrote something actually in the post about this,

that I'm not going to let Dan Snyder steal this joy away from me. This is too much a part of my life. You're in the post, Danny? You wrote something? Letter to the editor? I flexed that. Yeah, which I was looking for it. It's a while back, but you can look it up online.

Oh, okay. I was going to say, congrats. Thanks. It was a while back. But here's my, here's my bigger point on this. There's just too much joy associated with my life and this team going back to 1966 when I watched the first game with my dad, 1968, when I went to the stadium. My dad worked a lot, you know, and Sundays were days that we would sit and watch the games.

And until 1973, we couldn't even watch the home games. But those were, those are special times. and I'm not going to just throw that away. And, of course, you know, growing up in the 70s. And that's wonderful. And I'd say at least 70% of the fan base has done exactly what you've done, and I'm happy for you. I think it's less than that.

You think it's less than 70? Yeah, I do. I think it's contingent, though, on things like age and how die-hard of a fan you were and how long you've been a die-hard fan up until the last few years. I think they know that. And by they, I mean the team. I think they understand there's a huge chunk of the fan base that's still not bought back in.

And there are some numbers out there that would reflect that. You know, the local television numbers during the course of the regular season were shockingly low. They finished 21st among the 32 NFL markets in local TV ratings. Now, I'm sure the two playoff games killed it. I haven't seen what those local numbers are. but, you know, 21st. It's going to take time. Of course.

Well, all right. Am I wrong, Sheehan, in that they have not been selling out? They didn't sell out. Even a majority of the games. Was there any sellouts this year? Yes, there were. There were a few. I can't tell you which ones right now.

And that's on a reduced number out there. 65 or something like that. 60. I brought that up to Andy. I brought that up to Andy on my pod, Sheet. and he kind of pooh-poohed me going, well, those upper-neck seats are terrible. Nobody wanted it.

With a rookie sensation, a quarterback, and you're seven and two at one point, your four-and-one. Yes. The stadium... They should be filled. With the old name, the stadium is packed, and there's a waiting list for season tickets again, period.

Right, but they're not at that point yet. I'm not at that. I have to remind Andy gently, she and I'm like, there was even more seats than that, and Snyder was selling him. at a premium back in 02 when he was bringing in the old ball coach from college. I don't want to get, I didn't intend for this to turn into

it. He didn't intend to be so net. No, no, on a day that's heading into a weekend that's so uplifting. But just to put a bow on it, I think there are a lot of indications, Zabe and Andy out there that they still understand in that building. Ownership does. their marketing and in advertising people, they still understand this is a major issue that needs to be addressed. And who do they hire as a CEO? The head of Campbell's suit.

He knows branding better than Campbell. He knows branding. They'll fix this. I still think the name changes is in play. And I've been in favor of going back to Washington football team ever since they changed the name. Me too. Could they, I'm serious. Could they get?

away with the old logo, but not call them the Redskins. There was nothing insensitive about the logo ever. Well, but here's the dumb thing. So you'd have the dignified portrait of the Native American, but you wouldn't have the name. Well, the name, according to many, is racist. Yeah, well. Have fun with that, Andy. That horse left the bar.

10%. The league wouldn't live. I mean, I'm never going to win this one of Andy. It's 10% of the people. But the other thing is, this never would have happened if Snyder didn't try and short his partner's money for the COVID. That was his, that was as he put yourself in the face one more time. Yes. It compounds the tragedy, that is.

Can we just talk about the excitement of this current team and the miracle season? People are going to hear this and be like, fucking Zabin, Packer fan, quote. No, no, no, no, they're not. wanted to shit all over this podcast with Sheehan. What I want to talk about is Adam Peters. That guy's really fucking good. And Dan Quinn is such a breath of fresh air from the fucking phony that used to sit on that sideline. All right.

God, I'm so glad Rivera's not there anymore. Yeah, definitely. Know this, though, Zabe. You're not alone on this. Not even close. All right. Let's take a quick break. And let's come back and talk some football.

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All right, let's continue with Andy and Zabe, and let's talk some football. And Zabe, I'll start with you. your thoughts on this team and the season they've had, and do they have a chance against Philadelphia? I love Quinn. I love the Kingsbury redemption story because he was run out on a rail in Phoenix as this douchebag after posting that photo on draft night in his big-ass Arizona mansion. I remember him tweeting, I'm on a one-way ticket to Thailand right now. So there are second act. He landed in the perfect spot.

Jaden Daniels is unbelievably calm and poised and humble. He is everything I got duped into thinking RG3 was, just because RG3 was good at spitting out a bunch of successories platitudes that are on coffee mugs. Daniels is the real deal. He's a phenom and a joy to watch. The spare parts sort of dynamic of this team is amazing to watch. how it all comes together. I mean, this is just a pick and pluck from Peters in year one to get by

with whatever they could based on the cap space they had and their draft picks. This after flushing all the shitty draft picks from the Marty Party that was deposed in the transition. And they've come together. And they're winning games by hook, by crook, by Miracle, by upright doink. It doesn't matter. It is a wild fucking ride. I hope it continues for another game because nothing, would be, nothing would please me more than to see Philadelphia burn, which I've already said if they lose, Philadelphia's up. It's going. You know that.

They are so cocky in front of this game. They really are. Have you been watching, listening, hearing a... Yeah, to some of the people on the radio, host, the social media people, they are, they're walking into the same fucking track, trap Detroit did. Detroit took this like a, okay, you know, it was, it was Rocky against Drago, where showboating in the warm up like who's this Russian I've never heard of

fucking came back to bite them. Keep that energy up Philly. So yeah. So you think they win? I think they got every chance. I think it could be one of two dynamics. The one dynamic is Fafo, that the Eagles have been faffing

fucking around and not playing good football so far in the postseason, and they're about to find out or foe. Or the dynamic is it's midnight. And the carriage is a pumpkin again, and the slippers fall off that Vangio's defensive scheme had all the answers to Daniels, and they just run the shit out of it, you know, for a victory and easy victory. Could be one of the two.

I want to lean towards the former, because I do think this team, this commander's team has resilience to them, that even when they're down, like they have been many times this year, they do not crumble. You're not just fold and go cry in the corner. So I think I hope it's a good game. I really do. Andy? I think that Jaden Daniels is Tiger Woods. His dad got him a quarterback coach when he was eight years old.

His dad told him, if you want to be a quarterback, you have to study hard and you have to work hard. You just can't rely on your athletic ability. And this guy has otherworldly athletic ability and a work ethic. that's incredible. The only time he talks about showing up at the facility at 5 o'clock in the morning is what he's asked about it. And what he's done this year is incredible, not just what he has done week to week, but how much better he's gotten week to week. If you watch the tape of his opening game, he doesn't look anything like that now. And even the week 16 game against Philadelphia, where they won, true, Jalen Hurts got hurt, but he's better now than he was then. I just think

this is just one of those times where somebody comes along that is so much better than anybody else we've seen before, that it's going to be magical. I may a glass half-full person, but I believe they're going to win this game, and they're going to beat either Buffalo or Kansas City in the Super Bowl. I've never felt this way about this team ever, even when they were really good. Look at the conviction on, Andy. God bless you. I'm all in.

I love it. I love it. I love it. I love it. Jim, Commander's Jersey. Andy? Do you have a big jersey guy? Do you, Andy? I'm waiting until go back to Washington football team and then I'll buy

a jersey. I don't want to have a... Which one of the nine which one of the nine regular jerseys that are in a jersey have? Jersey guy shows up here. I have a sunny jersey and a Darrell Green jersey from the 2002 season when they wore those throwbacks. I got a red... Seriously question. Do you have any commanders gear, a hat, shirt, sweatshirt, whatever? I don't think I do, no.

I got a lot of other stuff. I got a closet full of Redskins stuff. What? Why? I just, well, for the years that Snyder owned the team, I didn't want him to have a dime. And I'm waiting for a logo change, so I don't have something outdated. But I won't buy it yours. Well, you say outdated, I say collector's items.

Yeah, it could be. Of all the glorious Washington football team items you could have had that are collectors' items now. Well, I'll buy a Super Bowl sweatshirt if they win. Okay. How's, Sheehan, how's your gear situation? I'm curious. I'm not a gear guy for starters. But a little more than Andy, though.

Get up one thing. Get up a hat. No, I don't. Commanders? Are you out of your mind? Yeah. There's no chance I would ever buy anything. It's hard for me to say it on the air.

So you have no, you have nothing that says command. Not one thing. I do, you know, they did send me. I got actually a cool ski cap with just Washington on it, which is actually something I've worn a couple times. It fits, and it just says Washington, so I don't mind that. The commanders did, so it says Washington doesn't have the co-holder W? No, it doesn't have anything. It just says Washington, but it's burgundy and gold.

And if I had something with just the W on it, I don't think I'd mind. But I'm not a gear guy. I don't collect jerseys. I'm not a jersey guy like you. But you had Redskins gear, didn't you? Not a lot of it. The boys did. I mean, there's like a big box with Santana Moss, Chris Cooley, RG3.

There's a bunch of those jerseys around the house. I know somewhere in a box, but I never owned any of that. I've never, Zabe, I've never owned a jersey as an adult. I hear you. They're not very proud. I'm with you. And they're stupid expensive now for being Chinese knockoffs for the most part. Fanatic has ruined the Juer.

Fanatic has really ruined the collectible, or not the collectible, but the fan gear game, because their stuff is increasingly cheap. But anyway. That guy, that guy Michael Rubin's pretty good on Shark Tank. All right. Speaking of Fanatics. He's a very good shrewd business man. But, I mean, they delivered jerseys to MLB that were see-through.

spring. Yeah. Awful. All right. Well, this was fun. Yeah, it was fun. I hope Sunday's fun as fuck. I hope I see all y'alls

down. They're sending us for the Packer Station to the Super Bowl and the, when we were there in 2001, you recall. 2002, actually, right? This was after post 9-11, right? The one in New Orleans?

Remember? Remember the one in New Orleans? You and I were there? Patriots. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. too.

Yeah, Patriots Rams, you and I were there. And we walked Bourbon Street until the Bourbon Street got interesting. We did a U-turned-in- Okay, we've gone far enough down there. The Packer Station is sending us because the Packers are hosting the draft in the spring, and they have a big promotional set that they want their flagship to be down there, so they're sending us, and that's fine. I'll use my $60 per DM and hopefully get a few free dinners. But nothing would delight me more than to see as many of you guys.

down there, reveling in this improbable run to Super Bowl Sunday. New Orleans is a good Super Bowl week to be down there for. Some of the others over the years were just okay. Thank God the snowstorm. Thank God the snowstorm she had missed by two weeks. Oh, my God. On the one in Dallas was a disaster. Absolutely disaster.

The Dallas was helpful. Yeah, well, this is 10 inches, Andy. This is a new record for New Orleans. Ten inches. I saw a guy snow skiing down Bourbon Street. I saw a guy playing hockey on hockey skates in Center City. It's crazy. I mean, the Dallas thing, I had to act as Leverro's chauffeur the entire week,

driving him everywhere and dropping him off at the front. He couldn't walk from. I remember Leverro saying, it's the city over here. I can't even get warm. You guys are in some weird hotel. Oh, the worst. Oh, God.

On the side of town. terrible. It was by the highway where somebody got shot. Yes. Somebody got shot. The door opened up onto the highway for crying out loud. Yeah. So you were in a motel.

You were in a motel. Yes. A residence where your own door opened to the outside and it was freezing. Right. And Laverro said, this is what it's like to do time. Exactly. Well, do you remember, Andy, we checked into that place and the weather was lovely. It was a Sunday.

the place was a dump and we're like, of course. I mean, you know, chuck things. Hashtag Chuck things. Yeah, hashtag Chuck things. But we go to sleep that Sunday night, wake up, and I remember trying to open the door to my room, and it wouldn't open, the ice was so thick. I mean, I almost felt like we were hostages.

Yeah. All right. That's it. Well, boys. That was fun. Let's do this again soon. Let's do it again soon. Super Bowl preview show.

Yeah, well, let's hope we can do it from down there. Thanks. Thank you to both of you. Appreciate it. Good to talk to you. All right. Take care of. Steve and Andy, everybody, enjoyed that.

Up next, Tim Legler. Nobody's a bigger fan of the team than legs. He'll join me right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey, guys, being healthy is a big part of my life, but I'm not hardcore about it. I just want to incorporate better habits into my life. like getting more protein in my diet. And our next sponsor makes it easy to do just that. That sponsor is Orgaine.

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One last time, for 30% off, head to orgaine.com. That's org-a-in.com slash shean. Use my code, Sheen. This segment of the show is brought to you by my good friends at MyBooky. go to my bookie.ag and use my promo code, and MyBooky will give you a 50% cash bonus on your initial sign-up. If you want to bet these championship games, MyBooky has you covered. Even if you've got a place where you're already wagering,

take the free money. Nobody's giving out this kind of offer this time of year. MyBooky's numbers and pricing are fair across the board. Use them as a place to compare on point spreads, money lines, totals, prop bet pricing, etc. MyBooky.ag, I promise you, you won't go wrong. You've got to use my promo code, though, Kevin, D.C. to get that cash bonus. Right now, Washington remains a six-point underdog against the Eagles, the totals down to 47 and a half.

The chief's up to two over Buffalo, the total at 48.5. MyBooky.ag promo code, Kevin, D.C. All right now is Tim Legler. We love having Tim on the show, of course, ESPN's Tim Legler, former NBA player, former wizard, former three-point shooting All-Star Weekend champion. But more importantly, for this conversation, a lifelong die-hard skins fan.

And you and I probably haven't talked since, I don't know, I was looking at the text message. It was early in the season, and it was already starting to become clear that Jaden was pretty damn good. But I haven't talked to you since. And I just thought of you, you know, the other day. And I'm like, I've got to call him now. We've got to have him on the show now because we've been through just horrendous years, all of us.

And here we are. What do you make of this incredible season? Yeah, man, first of all. I'm so glad you hit me up because I've been thinking about it throughout this entire run. I'm glad I'm getting a chance to come on, and what better timing as we sit here on the precipice of the NFC championship game. So I can't even believe I'm saying that. You know, first I want to say this. I am not emotionally ready for this.

Does that make sense? I knew Jayden Daniels. It was pretty obvious. We got that right. obviously you know how I thought about the previous coaching regime so that changed the front office changed ownership change like you name it talking about a new stadium like we're all headed the right direction and we got this quarterback that clearly looked like the right one but normally you know when you go through what we've gone through as long as we have and you get to this point

even when you feel like the pieces are in place there is a progression and you sort of build up over a period of maybe two or three seasons, you know, several off seasons, and you're making strides, and then boom, here we go. Okay, now we're going to have this five to eight year period of relevance where we have a chance every year. Like, that's what I thought was coming. This has happened so fast. It's almost impossible for my internal emotions to, like, catch up.

Let me see where they're supposed to be right now. Do you know what I mean? Does that make sense to you? So I'm going to see you down on the couch here for a moment, because you, and I'm going to break the news to you, you are suffering from post-traumatic Snyder disorder. We talked about this yesterday. Leverro and I talked about this yesterday because I've gotten, I can't tell you how many people I've talked to who have said something similar to what you said, or they've said, I don't believe it. Is this actually really happening?

When's the shoe going to drop? You know, when are we going to find out that we were just dreaming? Or, you know, and I mentioned this on yesterday's show, and, you know, it's, I had a lot of responses of people that agreed with this. There are, there's a significant percentage of people out there that aren't able to enjoy it as much as they thought they could because of the complicated name situation. But I think I know you well enough to know that you're not really a name person. don't really care as much about that. So I think it's just that you're suffering from post-traumatic Snyder disorder. Well, listen, a lot of what you're saying is true. I'll say this. It has zero to do with the name issue. Look, I'm as much of a guy as anybody out there that would love to see

the old name reinstated and everything else. But that's not, that's not it. Like, I have at no point, at no point. From the time that he said they were no longer the Redskins to become the Washington football to... You haven't. No, I laughed at the day they announced that name and they went to commanders and I didn't love that either. Not one ounce of me has diminished in my fandom.

Right. I just love of watching the team, rooting for the team, the anxiety I get on game day, the excitement I get when I wake up that night. I know the commanders are playing or that day. from the time I open my eyes, I'm excited if it's a football day for the commanders. That hasn't changed at all for me. You've told me that all along. Yeah, we've talked about this before, and it's never been an issue for you.

But you're right. I think there is some of this hangover from the Dan Snyder's, and it's not just post-Snyder syndrome. It's post-Grudin syndrome. It's post-Rivera syndrome. It's all of that. It's all the ineptitude and all of the stuff that was driving me insane about this franchise. But, you know, look, listen,

Man, like, you know, I had a year to get excited for the buildup of my wedding for the time I proposed. I had nine months to get excited about the birth of my first child and the buildup to that, okay? This, this, like, look, I knew we had improved, but then we hit that losing streak when Jaden was a little bit banged up, but he didn't quite look the same, and we lost those games to get to seven and five. I thought, okay, no matter what happens, man,

we were going in the right direction, and now going forward, you know, each year we're going to start to chip away at this. And that was not that long ago. And now I find myself a game from the Super Bowl against that team of all teams. So it's just, you're right, man, there's no doubt. It's just like normally you build up to something that's this meaningful to you in terms of the anticipation and exclaim it. And it happens so quickly. I haven't really felt that until now because it's this whole week leading up to this game and who we're playing specifically and all of the connections I have to that franchise and all of my friends loving that team and my wife was a cheerleader for that franchise. And like all that stuff going on. My daughter is a fan of the Eagles.

Like I got to go through all this. So now I'll start to feel it. Like the pit of my stomach feels different for the first time all year. even the Detroit game. I didn't feel that going out. I thought, you know what, it's House Money at this point. We beat Tampa Bay. I was at that game, by the way, because it was 20 minutes from my house of Florida. So I went to that game, and then the Detroit game only House Money, man.

I don't think we could stop this team. You know, we might be a 30-31 game. That's fine. We set the tone for next year. Boom, we smoke them. I mean, and here's what's great about that game, Kevin. That took me so much back to those high school years, college years, when this team was great every year.

That's exactly how I felt that day watching the game from this standpoint. They rose to the occasion in a magnified moment, and that's what I was used to growing up. You're going to get their best in this moment because the stakes are higher, and I haven't seen any of that for 30 years. It was always shrink under the Thursday night light, shrink under the Sunday night light, shrink under the Monday night light, shrink if you did get to the playoffs, injuries, like whatever.

And then I was watching that game against Detroit. Like, this is exactly what it felt like to be a fan of that team all those years when I was growing up. I was going to ask you, but it sounds like really you don't have an answer to this because you still haven't processed it. But it's a question that I've asked on radio this week, and that is, when did you know? When did you know this season had a chance to be, you know, it's kind of two-part. part would be they're going to win more games than they lose and they might be in the playoffs. But then when did you know if at all? And it sounds like you certainly didn't know until late Saturday night that they actually had a chance to make a deep run. But was there

a moment during the season that you said, wow, this team is probably going to win nine or 10 games and at least be a six or a seven seed? I think for me, one of the biggest moments was the Cincinnati game on Monday night early on. That game and that performance by Jaden Daniels and the way he played that game, that told me there we're probably going to be north of 500. Maybe it's 9 and 8, maybe it's 8 and 8, whatever it may be. But we went four games last year, four games, and we embarrassingly limped to the end of the season.

So to go from that, even thinking you could be possibly above 500, because again, it was a Monday night game and we didn't shrink. It wasn't embarrassing. I mean, I remember even last year going to that game against the Bears at home, and I don't remember if it was a Thursday night game. It was a Thursday night game, yeah. Thursday night game, right? And I took, I took a neighbor from Florida with me. We flew up together because he's a diehard Bears fan. And I thought, yeah, sure, come along and go 0 and 6 next to me. It's fine. I want, you know, we'll have a good time at the game, and we're down like 28-0-0 or something in the first half of that game. So, again, just running from the light, and then here we are, the Cincinnati game,

and at that time, really, you know, Cincinnati ended up have a lot of issues this year, but that was still Cincinnati was regarded as a very good team with a star quarterback, and we go into that game on a Monday night, and on the road, and we played that well, and Jayden Daniels played that well. that's really when I knew we had something special. And when he was struggling a little bit after the rib injury, I was definitely chalking it up to that. But at some part of me it was kind of like, okay, wait a second now.

Let's just make sure we know what we saw earlier in the year is the real thing. And then obviously when he started to feel fully recovered, he went right back to that guy and maybe playing his best football year now as we head into this game with Philadelphia. So I think that would be the answer. that's when I kind of knew we were going to be in a very good place. Like from that point going forward, no matter how long it took us to get there, we were going to have a moment like we're about to have,

playing for the ultimate prize and winning the NFC and then going to the Super Bowl. But I honestly never thought it would be this year. I'm not sure I even thought that it would be this year going into the Detroit game. Well, here's your touchscreen text to me after that game. You want me to read it to you? Yeah, yeah, do it. Here it is late Monday night, 11.50 p.m. Monday night, September 23rd. Wow. Thoughts. One. Daniels has massive upside with that combo of talent and poise.

Two, Echler's been a great addition. Three, the O-line is much improved. Four, play calling, creativity, nerve, feel are much better with this coaching staff. Five, defense is atrocious. Six. St. Juice should never see the field again. He's laughably laughably overmatched. Seven, a win on Monday night, 38 points on Monday night.

I'm euphoric. That's a good... That's a good summary after that game. Holy hell, that's really good. I forgot that I do. I texted you. I forgot all the stuff. That was well done.

You should do this for a living. You're really good as an analyst. I feel pretty much like I hit most of those. You did. For me, it was actually the next week when they beat the Cardinals on a short week after a Monday night game that was emotional. I just thought that that was really kind of a test passed. And I think at that moment it was like becoming obvious how good they were offensively and how good Jaden was and how good he was going to be as a rookie and what that meant in terms of the potential for the team. But most of the people that called in actually agreed with you. They all had Cincinnati as the,

the night that, you know, they started to think that something was possible this year. And then it was just a few weeks later when they got to seven and two where it was, you know, legitimately going to be hard for them to miss the playoffs. Yeah, yeah, I totally agree with that. I will say I got a little bit concerned, like reconcerned, I guess would be the point, would be the better way to put it when the Eagles, the Eagles game up in Philly. Yeah. because they were completely mauled by that defense.

They couldn't do anything with that defense. And again, that was the point when I, because we played Pittsburgh tough, and I wasn't at that game, but, you know, I was, you know, talk about brother-in-law and he was there the whole time, and I was okay, that's a good team. You know, it's a brutal way to lose the game.

And again, my guy St. Juke's heavily involved in that, getting beat deep on that play, which I still wake up in the only night, like I was having PTSD on that. But, okay, so then they lose, after the Pittsburgh game, I think they lost another game, and then it was Philly, or maybe it was Philly then another game. They lost to Dallas.

They lost to Dallas. Dallas game. Those two backtrack, I was a little bit like, man, Jane just doesn't look the same. And so what's going on here? Everything was all his back foot. And I think now I realize it was all attributed to getting hurt, getting hit, not wanting to get hit again, probably feel a little bit something,

but also maybe just a little bit gun-shy, and it just changed the dynamic of his threat level. And that's obviously all restored now. So I'm sitting there watching this, and I'm praying, like, this guy could just stay healthy for us. This is our quarterback for the next, who knows, how long. And this is what we get. And the adoration he is getting just nationwide. Everybody that's now watched him now knows this guy is the real deal.

He is special with his talent and his maturity, his leadership, his poison. Most importantly, the guy absolutely loves the moment that it has to get done here on this play, on this trip, on this drive, and he revels in that. And it's such a rare quality for professional athlete to be your best at that time. we have him. That's our guy. Are you kidding me, man? We got this lucky to end up with Jane. Some of it's great evaluation on the part of the front office

because there were three picks there. All three teams were taking quarterbacks, and all that talk for weeks, that talk went on. And who was it going to be? And thank goodness, the Bears took Caleb Williams, and look, he has a chance to be really good, I guess, down the road. But Jane Daniels, to me clearly, the best of the group, and we got them.

And so because of that, man, he has uplifted this entire franchise to hope the confidence level that everybody has. And then, you know, it also has improvement with the coaching as well. But I think Jane Daniels is where this whole thing begins because everyone that's associated with its organization in terms of the fan base now believes

when you go out onto the field, you have the best player. And, man, oh, man, when's the last time, if ever, we felt that? This has been all about him. You know, however this season ends up, 2024 is going to be remembered for Jaden Daniels having the greatest rookie season in the history of the position, one of the greatest, if not the greatest rookie seasons at any position.

And look, they've got nice players and they've got a great coaching staff and they've got a great vibe, but they have, you know, five losses with him. They'd probably have five wins without him. And let's not be afraid to say it. This guy right now is a top five quarterback in the league. It's really hard to put him any lower than that. No, I agree with that. And they actually were having this debate this morning when I get up. I was at the airport. I was just, I was listening to get up on my phone, and they were having this exact conversation, and they had Dominic Foxworthy on there, they had Jeff Saturday on there. So they were head to football guys debating this, and Greenie, that was his point.

Top five now. The general consensus was, yes, but then there was some debate. Like, well, you're going to put him ahead of Matt Stafford, and I'm trying to think maybe who else got thrown in there, you know, Justin Herbert, like some of these other names, and I'm going, yeah, you can have those guys. Go ahead. Take your pick. Take your pick.

fact, I'm going to tell you right now, I don't care who the hell you bring up. You bring up any quarterback in the NFL. I'm taking Jane Daniels. I am too. I'm taking – if he's this good, this soon, what in the world is this guy going to look like when he – you've got three or four years of seasoning under his belly? Well, how about just a better team around him? And a better team, right, especially starting with the line, like the line.

And, you know, a better – a better, you know, secondary. Better defense. I mean, you can go on. and on. All right, let's wrap it up. You know the Eagles pretty well. You know this matchup. You've been thinking about it. So how does Washington go in there and win the NFC championship and then give me a prediction? Oh, man. Here's how that. Well, first of all, first and foremost, my biggest concern going in is the injury to cause me, right, and Jalen Carter. And I'm worried we're not going to be able to run the ball that effectively. I'm very confident in our ability

to win this game. I'm very confident because I think it actually helps that we know them as well as we do. And I think knowing our team and knowing Jaden is not as much of an advantage because the guy is so talented and his escapeability is so good and his ability to

improv and make plays when he has to make that. I don't know him matters that they know us. It helps, I think, that we know them. I do think that helps a lot playing a division fellow in this situation. Look, it comes down to this. We're going to have to we're going to have to force them into third and more than five yards.

Your Sequin Barclay is obviously a major problem, and I'm worried about that. If you can get them to third and six or more and force Jalen Hertz to be the guy to make the plays to have to beat you, I am extremely confidently win the game. And for me, that's the biggest thing. They cannot be running off chunk plays on first down, second down, particularly first down with a short yard of situations all the time, and Barclay's eating us up, because then Jalen Hertz becomes a much better player. And by the way, I've had some people text me in Philly that are saying, like, they're really concerned about his health.

Like, if you take his read option out of the playbook because he doesn't look right or he's not utilizing that in the first quarter and you know something's going on, that really kind of absolutely hones in what we have to do defensively and the formations we line up in because you're not as worried about him tucking him pulling that out of Sequot. belly and running it around the end. If you take that out of it, that really allows us to deal with Sequant Barkley in a much higher level. So if that's true, and he's hobbling around, and you don't look right, that's going to be a big bonus for us. All right. I feel the same way you do. I actually think that they have, I think they're so unstoppable offensively that I think they've got a chance to win the whole thing going beyond Sunday. But what's your prediction Sunday? I'm going to go 27, 24.

commanders. I'm with you. I feel really good about this. Let's hope we're right. We can do this again in two weeks. Tim is a phenomenal game analyst on ESPN and ABC doing NBA games. He's also with Scott, usually a night or two a week, following games as an in-studio analyst. Thanks for doing this. I appreciate it. We'll talk soon. Appreciate it, Jeff. Take care, man. Tim Legler, everybody. Thanks to Tim. Thanks to Andy and Steve. That wraps up this final show to wrap up Championship Week. And now it's just about the game. I'll be back after it with a recap.