The Kevin Sheehan Show - Benched!

Episode Date: October 7, 2020

Dwayne Haskins was benched. Kyle Allen will start. Alex Smith is the #2. JP Finlay, Thom Loverro, Chris Cooley all part of the discussion.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheon Show. Here's Kevin. All right, a busy Wednesday podcast here because of the breaking news this morning. Dwayne Haskins has been benched. Kyle Allen's going to be the starting quarterback for Washington against the Rams on Sunday.

And not only has Dwayne been benched, he's the number three quarterback because Alex Smith has been elevated to number two. Tommy's going to be on the show today. Coolie's going to be on the show today. But we're starting this show with J.P. Finley, of course, from NBC Sports, Washington, who covers the team. You know, before we get to now, the distinct possibility that you're going to win $1,000 from me on a $20 to $150 bet that Alex Smith gets an actual start this season, a legitimate start and plays more than a half. Remember, that's part of it, too. I have to ask you, were you surprised at the news just moments ago that was first reported by Ian Rappaport and then confirmed by the team that Dwayne Haskins has been benched? Not surprised by the decision, but surprised maybe by the timing.

I thought this was coming, honestly. I thought it could happen against the Raymins. I wasn't. going to be shocked if Kyle Allen came out against the Ravens, but I thought Dwayne played pretty well against Baltimore. If the turnover parade that was happening in Cleveland continued against Baltimore, I think they would have pulled them. Now, I think the difference here, and I wrote a story about this, is that the next four opponents for Washington are four and 12 combined. And I think Ron's taking it seriously the opportunity to try and win this division. And Kevin, I, I, Our bet aside, I wonder how much this is about Kyle Allen or how much it's about Alex down the road. Because now he's going to be dressed on game day.

I mean, pretty wild, the decision for Dwayne to go from starter to inactive. And that, I think, is going to be lost in the, did Dwayne get enough time and all of these things, which are very valid questions. But no, I'm not surprised. And if you've been listening to Iran, I don't think. anybody should be surprised. He's been hinting at this pretty strongly now for a couple weeks. Yeah, no doubt. I think, I said yesterday on the show, I think that we can come to the conclusion now that he's just not their guy and that they're going to eventually move on from him. And I advocated very strongly. It's now time for, you know, for Dwayne to just go out and

earn it, like go out and ball out and worry about winning games and make them change their mind, not going to get the opportunity to do. But to your point, you know, the messaging started really a week ago with the cutoff, you know, date and, you know, others in the locker room deserving better. But you said something, and I believe this is why there was a quick hook versus maybe a hook that may have come later. And that is, I think, you know, old Ron woke up last Monday and again this Monday and said, wait a minute. This was supposed to be an R&D year, but we're in a terrible division, one that reminds me of a division I was in 2014 in Carolina in the NFC South. We got to try to win the division. I think if the NFC East had two four and O teams at the top in Dallas and Philadelphia, I don't think this would have happened now.

What do you think? I totally agree. I think if Dallas was 4 and O and Philly was 3 and 1 or whatever, this is. scenario is. I think Haskins gets at least through the by week. I do think there was some legitimate that they kept talking about growth and all these

stories centered around. We want to see him progressing. And I think I don't think that was happening. I don't, you know, I listen to Cooley on your show all the time and I trust his eye for this stuff. I don't think he thought it was happening. But I still think he would get through the bye week.

But this is just a different scenario. And that's what Ron kept saying. interesting scenario, interesting circumstance. Right. And I think that's why this has come down. And I mean, the Giants, I think Haskins could have beaten the Giants. I think if Kyle Allen runs this offense a little bit better, I think they could definitely beat the Giants twice.

The Giants have their own quarterback problems. And then Dallas is a mess. If the defense can play well, I don't even think the Rams are 10-point favorites. give me the 10. I like Washington's chances this week. So I, I, it's tough because if the year was about developing Dwayne and seeing what you got, then they absolutely pulled him too fast. But if they think they know what they got and they didn't draft this guy anyway, they're going to try to win the division. Yeah, you know, I think the whole they didn't draft him gets a little bit overstated. There are lots of coaches that inherit teams with quarterbacks that were drafted

by others that make it work and they're thrilled to make it work. It's one of the reasons they took the job. Here's different, obviously. I just think it's something. Like Matt LaFleur is not mad. He didn't know. Exactly. I guess I guess we have to now consider whether or not it's completely over. I think it is. I think the fact that they dropped him to three is pretty much an indication that they have no intention of playing him unless they have to the rest of the way. And that this next upcoming off season, if they don't think Kyle Allen's the guy, is going to be about signing and finding their new quarterback of the future, their new franchise quarterback of the future.

Do you agree with that? Yeah, I mean, I think they're back in the quarterback abyss and looking ahead. And I mean, I just did a story on our website about, you know, some guys to look at for 2021. and obviously Trevor Lawrence is the headliner, but Justin Fields, I don't think Washington is going to be bad enough to be in the Lawrence sweepstakes.

I imagine you agree with me. Well, I think this move is a move to ensure in their own mind that they're not in those sweepstakes. That's a great point. So, yeah, so I don't think they're going to get Trevor.

I think Fields is probably a top five pick, but then you look at the kid from North Dakota State. Yeah, Tray Lance. Yeah, Tray Lance. And then Kyle Trask, what he's doing in Florida, he's got 10 touchdowns in two games. Now it helps that he has probably the best receiver or tight end, whatever you want to call that kid, Kyle Pitts. I think Cam Newton will absolutely be on the table as a free agent signing.

And I mean, you and I have gone back and forth on this Alex thing, but if he comes in and plays and plays well, he's under contract for two more years. I mean, Alex's deal runs through 2022, and at the way QVs are getting paid, if he can play, and maybe that's still a giant if. To me,

I don't know that it is anymore because he's on an active roster. I think we have to stop being shocked and surprised by all things Alex, because he obviously wants to be playing. If he didn't want to be playing, he wouldn't be pushing like this. But, I mean, if Alex can play,

he costs you 20, 23 mil next year and 25 and 22. That'll be a bargain by the time Dax New Deal gets done and whatever, Cam gets paid next year. He'll also be 38, 39 years old. Sure. With the leg that looked like it was attacked by a great white shark. You may, look, this is going to be a good,

you made one hell of a wager, and I was probably a fool for accepting it. And you know me, I will pay my debt if I lose this bet. I just still, even with the news today, and obviously it concerns me a little bit, I just can't believe that Alex Smith is going to step foot on a football field. Keb, I would have thought the same in July, but watching him throughout August, I don't, listen, we may be way premature on that. this Alex stuff. And I may very well lose the 50 bucks, right? Like, I want to be totally clear about that.

Totally worth it. Dude, on Sunday, he's a snap away. He's one snap away from playing. Let's be clear. If he comes in in, he's got to start the game. I know the terms of the bet. Okay. I know I know. Oh my God. This is. What if I call my shot, Kevin? What, if you call the actual game that he's, starts in? That Dallas game, week seven, just seems awfully juicy, man. Well, I don't know. Let's discuss that after we get through some important stuff here. I just think if Kyle struggles, they're not going to, I think if Kyle Allen struggles, I don't think they're going back to Dwayne, and Ron wants to win these games. There's plenty of evidence that Ron wants to win these games.

Contacts could change that, right? Like if Kyle comes in and they lose a couple and they're one in five or one in six, Philadelphia runs off a couple or Dallas runs off a couple, then he may give up on, you know, the NFCE 7-8-1 home playoff game. Why did this happen? Where did it go wrong? Where has it gone wrong? The messaging we've gotten, the leaking we've gotten sort of telegraphed that this was a possibility. I understand that. But what was the issue in your mind beyond the fact that Ron thinks, maybe they've got a chance to win the division. This is not their guy. Not that they didn't draft him.

This has been clear here made clear over the last couple of weeks. They don't like him. He's not their guy moving forward. Why? That's a great question, Ken. And I think it's tough because I don't think he was bad against Baltimore. He just wasn't necessarily good either. I mean, you're going to have Cooley on.

I'm sure he'll break down. just how much of the offensive game plan was centered at the line of scrimmage or within five yards. I think there were some opportunities to go downfield. For me, the question to me is why do you go to inactive? And is that about Dwayne or is that about the other guys? And I think he's been mature and done everything right this offseason. I don't know.

It's a hard one to wrap your head around because, he was out. You know what? It's hard to wrap your head around unless you recognize that Ron wants true competition. And if this wasn't Dwayne Haskins, he was the 15th overall pick last season, if this was just another quarterback, let's say they had signed, who's the Redhead dude, I'm blanking on his name, Dalton. Say they signed Dalton in the offseason.

And so Ron had traded for Kyle Allen and they had Dalton. And Dalton had put up Haskins' performance through four games. I don't think anybody would scream that they then go to Kyle Allen. I just don't think Dwayne's performance has been that good. And I think they believe Kyle Allen knows the offense and can run it at a higher level. And maybe that will mean more scoring. This team is not scoring. And I think that's a huge part of this.

I mean, the last three weeks, they haven't gone over 20. and they have a tough scoring without a turnovers to drive it. I think Duane hasn't been bad, but he hasn't been good, and then they're looking for better. I had Mike Shanahan coincidentally on the show this morning on the radio show, and we talked a lot about Dwayne, and one of the things he said, and he repeated it twice, and I've had some communication with him after the show,

after the news about Dwayne's benching came out. But he said during the show, twice at least. He said, look, if he gets benched, it's not because really what you're seeing on Sunday. It's because the coaches aren't pleased with what they're seeing during the week. He said, ultimately, that's it. He almost appeared to have known something because he repeated it twice about Dwayne. It would be something about how he was preparing or what they were seeing or what he wasn't able to digest and execute in practice. We had the in-game quiz, but he didn't think it was about that necessarily,

the fourth and goal in 13. He said it's all about what was going on during the week. And then I asked him, I said, how do you think that conversation, if it happens, we'll go with Dan. And he said I thought Dan would understand that, you know, Ron's going to get a chance to play his guy. and that leads me to this next thing with you. This is an indication to me, four games into it,

that Dan has no decision-making on this and didn't try to prevent it and wasn't about to try to prevent it. That Ron's, in terms of the decisions with the football team, he's got final say. This is a clear indication of that. Would you agree with that? For now, absolutely.

I think we've seen a lot of examples of Ron being in charge. And I go back to the draft when they made a trade with the Niners. There's no way Dan wants to see Trent Williams go play for Kyle Shanahan. There's just no way. Yeah, good point. But that was the first

real, all right, Ron gets to do what he wants, moment. I think releasing Adrian Peterson is another one of those. And I think this is another one for sure. I think

if Duane had been playing a little bit better, it would be, there would be more pushback. But I also, I mean, I wonder right now, Kevin, the amount of battles Snyder has going. Sure. Not to suggest that the actual football team isn't as much of a priority, but the weighing in on personnel stuff

for how we know he's been in the past, I imagine he's just, he's, listen, Ron, I just hired you to do all this. you're in charge. Like I think he could disagree with the decision but still allow it to be made. And I think in the past, if he disagreed with the decision, it just wasn't going to happen. Your answer to that was for now. So I would follow up with, you know, it may be one of those situations.

Look, I agree with you. I mean, he's got bigger fish to fry right now. I mean, not that he's not involved intimately with his football team, but there's a lot going on with this organization outside the day-to-day football operations. We still have the Beth Wilkinson investigation going on. We still have him involved in all of these lawsuits and discovery motions for, you know, whether or not, um, whether or not Dwight Schar was behind some smear campaign. And we got all that going on. But I also think, 40% of the teams for sale. Right. So I also think, um, your answer to that would, would sort of be

my answer to that as well from this perspective. And that is, you're going to who? Kyle Allen? Well, it better work. I mean, if you really think that there's a division to be had this year and that he gives the team a much better chance than Dwayne does, and Dwayne would be developing while giving us a chance or a similar chance, it better be obvious pretty quickly that Kyle Allen gives him a better chance. So there's that now. Like if Kyle Allen comes in and fails and fails miserably, it's going to look poorly on Ron. Unless that's your vehicle to Alex, which is a move to Dan the Mubbson.

Yeah, but why wouldn't he just wait on that then? I don't know. You know, I actually, so I've been blogging off your show like crazy lately. I thought Cooley was really good, I guess Monday when he said, listen, if you're going to go to Kyle Allen, Kyle Allen better be damn good. And he's not sure Kyle Allen is. So it's a serious. I mean, they call him Riverboat Ron.

Everybody thinks it's about fourth downs, but this is putting your cards on the table and making a big mook. I also, and maybe this is obvious, but I think it really, really sucks that Dwayne's starting chance came this year when there was no offseason, because I think he really could have used the offseason. Clearly, clearly he could have. I feel badly for him, but, you know,

at this point many times over the last couple of weeks because there are things about Duane that I like on the field. But the last week of your story, Rappaport story, you know, the cutoff time, the players deserve better, the indications about how this is a unique situation, the circumstances with the division being in play, the references to 2014, All I could think about is it's much more than this. He's just not a guy they believe in that's going to be the franchise quarterback, period. And by the way, it's their right to feel that way. I mean, they have a lot more information than we do.

They have a lot more information than we as fans do of the team. And, you know, at some point, if you're absolutely convinced he's not the guy, you cut bait. Because you didn't select him. and your owner gave you carte blanche to make that decision, and you are trying to turn around a whole organization culturally and otherwise. If he's not the guy, he's had enough experience in this league Ron Rivera has to know intuitively whether or not he might have a guy or not. If he came to the conclusion through a lot of things like preparation during the week

or the system that he wants to run or the kind of leader that he wants to be, or whatever it is, if he came to the conclusion he's not going to be my guy, why not cut bait now? I have no problem. I mean, I can't blame him for that. Right. I mean, now, I don't think he's going to say any of that. I think he's going to say, I think he's going to say, we still really believe in Dwayne.

We think he can be a good player for us. I think, you know, Ron talks about 5,000 reps as being a really important figure for when a player kind of has their full package ready, and Dwayne's really far from that. But I think you might be right. at the core about what the coach thinks. I mean, think about it, Kevin. Like, for, when he got the job, he really, really questioned Dwayne,

all the way up through the draft, and then it was pretty obvious that Dwayne was their guy, but they still traded for Kyle Allen, wouldn't, didn't commit to Dwayne as the starter until mid, late August. Yeah, I mean, if you look at the totality of it all, there wasn't a huge commitment there really at all. Last one, and I'll let you run and I appreciate you jumping on.

It really is amazing this organization, right? It's always something other than the results on Sunday from everything over the summer to Ron getting cancer for crying out loud to after the Cleveland game, you know, your story and Rappaport story. and it's ironic. I think you and I talked about this off the air. I did this whole thing a week ago today about how, you know what, there is a culture change going on.

We haven't had one leak, not one, all season long, you know? And that came after Ron had publicly talked about cutoff dates and stuff. And I'm like, there's no leaking. There's no what we had going on last year, which I thought was very destructive or could have been destructive to a young quarterback. And then, you know, here we are a week later. It's just always something with this group, and it doesn't matter who the coach is. I mean, I hope it works out.

I hope Kyle Allen plays really well. In fact, now I am really rooting for Kyle Allen to be effective. I don't want Alex anywhere near that for the field. But it really is. I mean, you and I have not only been lifelong fans. We've been covering the team. We've, you know, our careers really have been centered around this team more than anything else. And it just seems like they can't get out of their own way.

Yeah, I mean, absolutely. This is, I saw a tweet, I think. This will be the 23rd starting quarterback in the last 20 years, I believe. And I think I look at 2021, Kev. I look at Kyle Trask, Trey Lance, Cam Newton, and maybe Alex. It's so funny. The first time I saw Kyle Trask come in, it was a road game. again he came in for Felipe Franks who got hurt Franks is now the quarterback at Arkansas right

oh yeah the Florida yeah and he came in and he and he was really good and then the next week he was good and I told my son because my son reminds me of it has been reminding me of it through the first couple of weeks of the season I go that guy's a pro quarterback their third stringer that just came in for Franks he's going to be a pro quarterback and he's off to you know he's getting a he's having a Heisman trophy start to the season now they've got a little tricky game game Saturday, but we'll see. Anyway. Oh, do I smell a smell tester? Yeah, I looked at that. I saw that last night, I think.

Florida, Florida, that they've been so good defensively in the last couple of years, like as good as anybody defensively. They're actually not as good defensively this year, but they're better offensively. But they're giving a short number at Texas A&M. It's like less than a touchdown. And that guy, Kellan Mond, I think, is terrible. And people have him as like a, you know, a second, third round potential quarterback. I think he's awful. But anyway, yeah, it looks like a tricky spot for them in College Station on Saturday. A&M could be part of a smell test pick, which the smell test has been awful. It's been awful. But anyway.

You and I were texting about that. I don't think either of us are off to hot starts. No, we're not. I had better. I'm now doing like the total square stuff where I'm teasing things. No, don't tease. Don't play teasers. I'm on that. I actually, I came back nicely. I had a seven and five weekend smell test, but I talked about this with Cooley, I think, on the podcast. On Sunday night, there was massive late money, sharp money on Philly. And I just played Philly on the money line.

I played them plus the seven and a half. It came back to seven and a half. And then I played them on the first half money line and first half plus four and a half. So that was a get back. Sunday night result for me after the first three weeks of the season. Thanks for jumping on. Appreciate it. All right. Thank you. All right. J.P. of course, has his own podcast, which you can listen to everywhere you listen to a podcast. I'm sure he'll be having a podcast on this today. And of course, you can follow all of his

work at NBC Sports Washington and follow him on Twitter at J.P. Finley NBCS. Tommy will join us right after this word from one of our sponsors. All right, let's bring in Tommy. Tommy's vacationing again. Coolie's coming up here in a bit, I believe. We're still working on that. But he was going to have his defensive film breakdown ready to go, but we'll focus more on the breaking news about Dwayne Haskins.

But Tommy is vacationing down in the outer banks, which is, I would imagine, just gorgeous this time of year. Oh, it's like today, 70, 8 degrees and not a cloud in the sky. And we're staying at a hotel right on the beach. So it's just, it's, it's, it's, it's just fabulous. Absolutely. You know, it's funny.

I, I posted a picture of me drinking on, on, on, at an outdoor bar, on a pier down here. Yeah. And it got 130 likes on Twitter. Just a picture of me drinking a beer. Okay. Let me look at it. I haven't seen it yet. It's very innocuous.

And why? I'm going to try to explain to you why maybe it got all those likes. I mean, well, first of all, people like you, and they like to see you happy. You know, where is your... Hold on here. But my point is... Where is it? Oh, it's...

Oh, there it is. I see it. Well, you know what? It's a good picture. It's a really nice picture. It's you looking out into the ocean, and it's a pretty picture. Who took the picture? Listed. And, you know, it shows an elderly gentleman having a nice cold beer in a nice relaxing location.

I like the picture. Hold on. I'm going to like it myself. You now have 160 likes. Oh, my God. My point is on Sunday, I wrote a comment. after the Washington game on Sunday about Ron Rivera that I thought was pretty good. Ten likes.

Ten, ten likes. That may say something. Maybe they like you more than they like what you do professionally. No, I'm kidding. I guess. I don't understand the world sometimes. Yeah. It's been turned upside down this morning.

It really has been. You know, I do want to ask you real quickly, we're going to get. to Haskins and everything with Tommy and then with Cooley, hopefully, as well. Were you a Van Halen fan or not? No, that's, I mean, that's the 80s. That's, you know. True, true. I mean, for me, I guess D. Purple and Richie Blackmore were my Van Halen in the 70s.

Okay. You know, something like that. But I recognize what a great guitar part he was and the impact he had on people. And if I grew up in the 80s, I probably would have been a Van Hanlon fan. I didn't dislike them. It's funny because it's not that I was a massive Van Halen fan. I love a lot of Van Halen songs, and I recognize Eddie Van Halen is one of the greatest guitarists, and one of those guitars were when you heard his guitar riffs, you knew it was Van Halen.

You know, just like you know Hendrix when you hear Hendricks, you know Clapton when you hear Clapton, you know Prince when you hear Prince in terms of guitarist. You know the edge. Like there's a certain distinct sound, and you always knew the Van Halfton. Halen sound, but I've had, you know, with my boys, especially two of them who love sports, love music, also really enjoy following politics. There have been a lot of, you know, heated conversations, especially during the pandemic, but through the years. But my son who's a musician, and actually two of my three boys play guitar, and one of them plays guitar and drums and a couple

of other things. But they've always mocked me for liking Van Halen, like if we're in a car, and I've got my Spotify, you know, favorite list or daily mix going and a couple of Van Halen songs make it into it. They've always made fun of me. They're like, Dad, that's cheesy 80s music. I'm like, no, that's Eddie. Like, that's Eddie Van Allen. I mean, you guys are missing this. And then eventually one of my boys came around and he's like, Dad, you're right.

Phenomenal guitarist. I just don't like their music. Whatever. But a couple of things occurred to me. And we're not going to spend a lot of time. We're going to get right back to Askins. I promise. But, you know, Eddie Van Halen is one of the few examples, and you may come up with more of them, and this is why I'm bringing it up, of, you know, Hall of Fame bands that were not known primarily

because of their front person, their lead singer. You know, people knew Van Halen, people knew David Lee Roth and Sammy Hagar. I'm not suggesting that they didn't. But Eddie Van Halen was the star of the band. And he was not the singer. He was not the front man. In many ways, I've always felt that way about Rush, a band that I didn't appreciate a lot when I was younger, but probably 25 years ago, 20 years ago, I became a huge Rush fan. And Neil Pert is really the star of Rush. Gettie Lee is the lead singer and has a very distinct lead singer voice. But Neil Pert, who also just recently passed away and is considered to be one of the greatest drummers of all time and one of the great lyricists, etc. You know, music writers of all time. He was the star. There are very few bands you can say

that about, right? Yeah, there are. There are bands that have been named after a guy who wasn't the star. You know, that's different. Yeah. You know, like Jake Isle's band named after their guitar player. Right. The star was Peter Wolfe, the lead singer. I can't think of any. I can't think of any. where, you know, like a musician was probably bigger. I'm sure there are, than the front man, the vocal guy, in terms of interest. I don't know if you know this story or not, but it's a story that I've sort of read over the last, you know, 12 hours since Eddie Van Halen passed away yesterday at the age of 65. By the way, one of the reasons that Eddie Van Halen was so cool for somebody like me who was in college, during the 80s, during the MTV, you know, generation in the MTV launch is that he was

dating and then married Valerie Bertnelli. I mean, come on. I mean, Valerie Bertonelli. I'm with you on that. Yeah, was awesome. And every, every guy from age eight to 28 loved Valerie Bertnelly in the 70s and the 80s. But, you know, Eddie Van Halen played guitar on Michael Jackson's Thriller album, specifically on the song Beat It. And it's a very interesting story that involves Quincy Jones, who produced that album for Michael Jackson. And by the way, Quincy Jones tweeted out, ripped to the great Eddie Van Halen, even though it took a couple of calls to convince you, it was actually me on the phone. You killed it on Thriller, and your classic solo and beat it will never be matched.

I'll always smile when I think of our time working together. Eternal love. and props. The story of that is really, and Quincy Jones alluded to it in his tweet, the story of Eddie Van Halen playing on thriller and playing that incredible, remarkable, memorable solo and beat it, is that Quincy Jones wanted Michael Jackson on that thriller album to have a rock song. And, you know, Michael Jackson wasn't so sure. Quincy Jones calls Eddie Van Halen. And Eddie Van Halen thinks it's a prank. And he, he, he, he, he, he, he, he, he, he, he, he, he, he, he, he, he, by the way, Eddie Van Halen had a temper. Eddie Van Halen was very difficult to work with. There are a lot of stories about how difficult that Eddie Van Halen was. But he basically just said, who the fuck are you? And he's going

off in, and, and Quincy Jones goes, Eddie, it's, it's, it's Quincy, Quincy Jones. And he's thinking to sell Quincy, I don't know anybody named Quincy? And then he goes, no, no, Quincy Jones. And then he goes, and then he goes, oh, Quincy Jones. I'm sorry. I'm so sorry. But then he commits to doing it. And he comes into the studio, or Michael Jackson and Quincy Jones walk into his studio. And Eddie took the risk of basically changing part of the song. And he thought Michael Jackson would just say, oh my God, he didn't know what the reaction would be. So he said he warned Michael before Michael listened to it for the first time. He goes, I changed the whole middle part of the song. Eddie Van Halen told the story years ago. He said, and I'm paraphrasing, he said, I thought he's either going to have one of his several

bodyguards kick me out of the studio for butchering his song, or maybe he'll like it. And so he gave it a listen and he said to me, oh my God, thank you for doing that. Thank you for, you know, blazing that solo and thank you for basically having the balls to change something. It means that you really cared about the song. And they used it. And, you know, Quincy Jones over the years, by the way, I did not know this until this morning. Somebody tweeted it to me. Rashida Jones is his daughter. Yes. Yeah, I knew that. I don't think I knew that. I don't think I knew that. Maybe I did, but for whatever reason, when I read it this morning, I didn't know that. Love Rashida Jones, not just from the office, but Parks and Rec and and several other things

that she's been in. But anyway, Quincy Jones has always been, if you've read him here as he's gotten older in life, he is so critical of so many perceived great musicians. You know, he made the comment a few months ago, maybe it was a few years ago now, about, he essentially, you know, know, is very critical of like the Beatles musicianship, you know, and he says people like the guys and brothers Johnson, those are true genius musicians. You know, and he lists some of the people that he thinks are musicians and some of the people that made the list that aren't, you'd be surprised at. But anyway, obviously, he really respected Eddie Van Halen as a guitarist. Anyway, I found myself last night on Spotify after watching the NBA game, you know, and it was late just listening to a bunch of the songs.

It reminds me, Tommy, you know, music is always a memory influencer. And for me, and for me, it was just to me, listening to Van Halen always reminds me of being in college park in the 80s, you know, as a college student, you know, and living in various places and MTV being a big part of that experience and music being a big part of it. 10 years of your life. It was the best five and a half of my life. It was. It certainly was five and a half of more of the more fun years of my life. I've had a lot of fun of my life. But anyway, all right.

So, Dwayne Haskins benched. Not only is he benched. He's the number. He's the number three quarters. He's buried. Not just bench. They buried him. Yeah.

So what do you think? I don't know. A couple of things. there's got to be a lot more going on than what he's done in games. There has to be stuff going on during the weeks in practice, whether it's the way he handles himself,

whether the way he plays, but there's got to be more going on than what we've seen on the football field. That's my first reaction. That said, and I'm not saying this is reason to bench the guy, his failure to throw the ball in the end zone, on Sunday on fourth down was, I mean, it was unbelievable.

It was just unbelievable. What did you make of the endgame quiz? It was almost gutless. What did you make of the coach having an in-game quiz? I know. I don't know what the hell is going on here. But now, Matt, try to think of yourself playing Sanloff football. And your quarterback, the last play of the game, the game's going to end.

and this is the only chance to win. And he makes that throw. Well, what would you do to your... It wasn't the last play in the game and it wasn't a chance to win. I know that. But it was their only way they were going to come back. I mean, you know, they weren't going to come back with the pass that he threw. I mean, it was almost a gutless pass.

It really was. So I don't know. I can't believe that triggered it. But, I mean, that's what I've been waiting to talk about, that ridiculous pass. But now, I mean, there's a lot. There's got to be stuff going on that we don't know about. Yeah, your first reaction, there is no doubt. It's really ironic and coincidental, but I had Mike Shanahan on the radio show this morning.

We spent time talking about Dwayne, and I mentioned to him, and he knew it, that there have been over the last week stories, leaks, of course, again, and words from the head coach that were sort of telegraphing the possibility of him getting. getting benched. Now, I'm shocked it happened this week, although I will just share with you one quick story. At the end of my radio show today, I said to CJ before we disconnected from each other, I said, wouldn't it be interesting, like, you know, given the way the stories have gone, if today being Wednesday, their first day of practice, if we get news that Dwayne's benched and Kyle Allen's starting, and he just goes, yeah, I don't think that's going to happen this week.

And I go, nah, it's not going to happen this week. Anyway, Shanahan said something to me, twice. And I noted in my own mind that he said it twice. And I wondered if he knew anything. But he said, if he gets benched, it's not about what you're seeing on Sundays. It's about things that are happening during the course of the week. It's the little things. You know, the little things being things like preparation, leadership, you know, commitment. Is he getting it? Is he not getting it? It's not what we're seeing on Sundays. It's the, it's during the week, which, you know, Shanahan's always about what's going on during the week. Practice, you know, what's happening in practice.

Absolutely. And so I agree with that. Secondly, to me, this does not happen now without the NFC East being perceived to be winnable. I would agree with that. If Dallas is 3 and 1, Philly's 4 and 0, Dallas is 3 and 1, Dwayne's not getting a quick hook here. He's making it at least until the by week. But Rivera has said it, two weeks running. This is a strange situation we find ourselves in.

It's an interesting situation. It's unique. It reminds me a little bit of 2014 when we won the division at 7, 8, and 1. So the whole idea of competing now with a good defense, and by the way, some skill position players that are better than anybody thought they would be this year, Antonio Gibson being number one on that list, that this, you know, he thinks Kyle Allen gives them a better chance. Now, JP just suggested Kyle Allen could be the bridge to Alex Smith.

So Alex Smith apparently more as a possibility here. Now, so that's the second thing. If not for the division being a terrible division right now, I don't think Dwayne gets the hook here. Next, I think it's over. Like this is not coming back unless, you know, just by necessity, Kyle Allen breaks a leg and Alex isn't ready to go and they bring in some other guy that doesn't work out and they just have to play them to get through the end of the season. This is over with Dwayne.

It's over here in Washington. Now, you're not going to hear Rivera say that. Rivera's not going to say that. But I said yesterday on the podcast and on the radio show and maybe the day before, The thing that's become clear through four weeks, they don't like him. He's not their guy, and it has nothing to do with whether or not they drafted him. Lots of coaches take Matt Lafleur as an example. He's okay inheriting Aaron Rogers.

You know, not every new coach needs to have his own quarterback, but it's about what they're seeing. You know, he's not their guy. They don't want him. They don't like him. It was coming, it was telegraphed that it was coming through the leaking and through the messaging. I didn't think it would come this quick. And I think the division race has a lot to do with that.

But they're moving on from Dwayne. Dwayne's not the franchise quarterback here for the next 10 years. That possibility is over. You would agree with that, right? Well, I would say that if that wasn't the case, he wouldn't be number three on the deathlet chart anymore. Right. He wouldn't have dropped from one to three.

behind a guy with drop foot yes so so yes I mean it would seem like he's trying to bury Dwayne now is he trying to bury Dwayne to make sure the owner does not does not try to pressure him see that was the next thing on my list

very very nicely done on your part look at the chemistry we have you'd think that we may have we worked with each other over the years I was I had this on my list with you especially. This is a clear-cut signal that Ron is calling the football shots, period. Four games, Tommy? A signal to the own.

Oh, I know. Jay Gruden is sitting there thinking, was it this easy? Right. You mean I could have done it too? Yeah. So now part of it could be what you mentioned, you know, a few weeks back, that Dan's got so many other fish, big bigger fish to fry right now. he's not paying attention, but he's paying attention.

Now, I asked JP this, and JP said, yeah, I agree with you for now. And I think that when he said that, it made me think, well, he clearly told Dan, this is what we're going to do, and this is why we're going to do it. And Dan may have said, yeah, but he was 32 of 45 for 314 yards. But you're not in practice. He's not getting it or whatever the issues are. You know, he's more concerned with his clothing line thing. He's not going to be my guy.

I don't see it in him. I've been in football my entire life. And I'm cutting bait right now. And Dan could have said, Ron, I hired you. I gave, you know, this coach-centric speech. These are your decisions. Go for it. However, you better be right about Kyle Allen, like in this division opportunity that we have.

Because if Kyle Allen's not any better than Dwayne, then what's the point? We could have played Dwayne for the last 12 games and made that decision in the offseason. Unless, of course, Alex Smith is the wild card here. It's hard for me to wrap my head around that. It really is. I just, somebody just sent me a friend of mine

just sent me the picture of the leg from Project 11. And he's like, this guy with this leg is now ahead of Dwayne Haskins. And it really is sort of remarkable. Well, again, you know, it doesn't surprise me that he is ahead of Dwayne Haskins in terms of being able to execute a game plan. Look, remember, this was the thing. This was the thing with Jay. We used to argue about this all the time.

Jay like Colt, sometimes more than Kirk, because Colt ran Jay's game plan the way he wanted it run. It doesn't matter who was better. it mattered that the coach had the guy who did what he wanted him to do. I think he liked Colts Moxie. I think he loved Kirk running the game plan and so did Sean. But I think he liked Colts Moxie.

Well, I think he liked it running. I think he felt that if Colt ran his game plan, that that would empower the coach because the coach would get the credit. This could be a situation too where Ron likes Kyle. because Kyle Allen will run the game the way Ron expects it to be run, not necessarily because he's any good,

but he'll, he knows this offense. He'll run the game plan the way the coach wants it run. Coaches love, unless you've got a super talent, they're probably always going to choose the guy who does what he's told. You know what? Even a youth basketball coach can identify with that to a certain degree. agree. It is true. If you, any of you have coached at any level, there is a comfort level with the

players that are doing what you're telling them to do because you're convinced, you're right. You know, you're convinced that what you're doing. He wouldn't have a job. Right. If you weren't convinced to that. Yes. But you don't do that at the expense of a massive talent difference. No, no, you don't. So it's just the whole thing's interesting. Because I don't know what Rivera is going to say today after practice. I'm sure he's going to be very supportive of Dwayne. That's what he should be publicly. He should say, look, Dwayne's a young guy.

He didn't have the off-season. Kyle's been in the system. There's an opportunity here in the division, and we think we can get more production right now out of Kyle. And then somebody's going to have to ask, well, why is Dwayne then number three? Well, because Alex, you know, we want a veteran as a backup right now. Boy, that conversation alone is going to be worth it because Alex Smith is one snap away from playing on Sunday. I know.

If he's the actual backup against the Rams. Absolutely. But, you know, how many times did we hear from Shanahan? He told us, you know, at some point the locker room knows and you can't fool the locker room. And if you do, you risk losing your team. And I wonder if this was a big part of this. I wonder if the locker room understood. But you see, the locker room, the players elected Dwayne Captain.

Yes, they did. You know, so there's no indication that they don't like him. Right. That'd be pretty quick turnaround. If the players have soured on Dwayne like after four games that quickly. Yeah. So I'm not sure this is a – I agree with you. you know, you can't play a guy, a quarterback that the locker room, you know, clearly doesn't believe in.

But this would be pretty quick to make that kind of move based on that. I don't, I mean, I'll be curious to see what Dwayne's reaction is in the coming weeks and what the Haskins and Haskins reaction is. He's been a pretty stand-up guy so far this year. Yeah, but he's handled everything right. but then his agent this week started spouting off about this. I was going to say, before they made this move. Part of this move being telegraphed to a certain degree in terms of clues was the agent.

Yeah. The agent getting very protective. So obviously he had a sense that this was a possibility. Yeah, you're right. You know, I'm also sitting here. So I'll be curious what Dwayne's reaction is and what we hear leaks-wise from the Haskins and Haskins camp moving forward. I mean, the smart thing for them to do is to button up and be quiet. No doubt.

No doubt. Like, I wanted, you know, after the Sunday, fourth and 13, fourth and goal from the 13 debacle, you know, Cooley said that he didn't pass the quiz, not because he didn't throw the ball in the end zone. He didn't pass the quiz because the answer to the quiz was for him to do what great quarterbacks do in the red zone when eight drop into coverage on fourth and goal. and that is to run around and extend the play and try to make a play. That's the only way you can make a play. You can't throw the ball into the end zone against eight guys off of a three-step drop hitting the back foot and throwing.

It's going to get intercepted. You know, there are eight guys and they're four in the route, so it can't happen. But what the great players do, the Russell Wilson's, the Patrick Mahomes, is the Aaron Rogers. They move around. They extend. They create more time for chaos on the back end. And then there's a chance. And he said, if Dwayne had done some of that, he may have passed the test.

But the whole idea of an in-game test to me was ridiculous anyway. You know, the other thought that I just had as you were talking, and you said something that made me think about this, and that is, you know, Ron Rivera, I mean, you talk about just the mixed messaging over the last couple of weeks on so many things, from timeouts to, you know, the in-game quiz to just all of this different stuff. Like Cooley pointed out, Tommy, the in-game quiz on the fourth and goal from the 13 was followed up on the next drive with a fourth and six at midfield and they punted the ball. Like, how about a retake opportunity?

Hey, you didn't do well on the first one. It's fourth and five from midfield, better chance. We're going to give you, you know, we're going to give you a chance to retake this quiz. Let's go for it. It's 3110 with four minutes to go at midfield and they punt it. I mean, everything about the messaging from the head coach has been disconnected on so many things. So it's hard to really, if his goal is to just confuse everybody and to send everybody in 17 different directions, he's doing a pretty good job of that with one exception.

And that is, once the leaks came out last week, you knew that this was not only a possibility, but a likelihood. I just didn't think it would be this soon. I thought maybe he gets the start against the Rams and then they bring in Kyle Allen against the Giants twice. Because J.P. pointed this out. Their schedule after this week,

I mean, they get the Giants twice, the lions and the Bengals and the Cowboys twice. If you go by record, I think he said it's 4 and 12, the combined record or something like that of the next seven games. So anyway, and you know what, the Rams, they're three and one, but they've beaten three NFC East teams. They've beaten the Cowboys, the Eagles, and the Giants.

So maybe he thinks this game's winnable with Allen. Listen, speaking to the coaches mixed messages, what I wrote on Sunday, you know, I'd ask you to read it, but it's like... No, I can read it now. I have it in front of me. Okay. I suggested that the coach needs to sit down. You're not the first, yeah. He needs to stop for his own thing.

My calm was all about for his own sake. I mean, with the COVID breakout in the NFL right now, with the disease reaching all the way to the White House, with the numbers showing, if anything, you know, going up in this time where people with brains kind of figured they would go up in the wintertime. You know, I think a lot of people thought we would have it under better control by the end of the summer, but they're going to spike up in a wintertime. And, you know, when he undergoes chemo and radiation, I point out in the column, it not only kills the cancer cells,

it kills healthy cells as well, which it hurts your immune system and makes you more vulnerable to infectious disease. What if that's the second part of today? What if what if he made this decision so that it happened while he was still here and then he takes a seat? It takes a leave of absence. Maybe. I mean, like I said, this isn't worth. I mean, this isn't worth. I mean, the team, what he wants to accomplish will still be there when he's done with the treatments and is recovered from them.

Everything he wants to do will still be there for him to accomplish. The culture ain't changing without him. So it'll all be there. And, you know, I wrote what I thought was a reasonable position based on what we saw on Sunday is, I mean, if you care for this guy, you know, he should sit down for now. I mean, Jack Dale Leo can coach a team to lose 31 to 17. True. Well, I mean, here we are. Four weeks into the season, three weeks into the season, we started to get.

the leaks. By the way, for those of you who continue to like harp on and beat to death, the media is at fault for this. I don't even know what you think you know. I don't give a shit, by the way, what broadcaster or what writer or anybody that thinks that the media is complicit in Dwayne Haskins and all the sudden discussions about him being benched are. You don't understand if Ian Rappaport or J.P.P. Fynnley or somebody has a source, a solid source that says his benching is imminent and that it could happen if he doesn't play well today, meaning last Sunday, why do you think that they shouldn't write that story? They don't work for the team. I mean, I've gotten a lot of that the last couple of days. I'm like, I don't, I guess people just

don't understand how it works, maybe. Maybe they think the media is supposed to have support the team? Because, and I don't want to go down this road. Oh, boy. I shouldn't have even brought it up. Because I'll just go to say one thing and drop it. What? We should. They get mixed messages from some media about what their role is. Well, J.P., just so you know, NBC's, York Washington was the one that broke this story Friday. Did I say a name? No. All right. You said a name, not me. I'm just saying, there's some media. I know who you've picked on recently. There's some media that confuse people about what their role is. Well, no media has confused people more than the team's own media in recent years. Okay?

So we'll start with that. But no, no, no. I mean, just so everybody understands this, when JP has the story on Friday about sources telling him and Ian Rappaport, the sources are the team. Those leaks are coming from the team. The team, by the way, put this announcement out shortly after Rappaport broke it. I don't know why they just didn't. I mean, Rappaport, remember there was that stretch of several years where he got almost everything Washington wrong.

Or certainly, he was hitting about 50% at best. And recently, he's gotten a lot right. So I'm trying to think, like, who's left there other than Dan that would be the provider? There are several people. I mean, I know that there are several people that are holdovers and carryovers. Let me tell you how this works. Yeah. Kyle Smith, who wants to be a general manager in this league someday, maybe with a real organization,

he needs people like Ian Rappapur. I'm not saying he's the leak. I'm just pointing out how this works. There are certain people in front offices who are ambitious, across the league and they need the Adam Schaefters and the Ian Rappaport and people like that. Why do you think they give it to them? Because they're buddies? Yeah, I mean, no, I understand that. I just, I, whatever, I shouldn't care about it. It's just, it's interesting because there are people even in media who think media people, I guess, are, you know, are somehow driving the narrative.

That's the mixed messages I'm talking about. Yeah. You know? Anyway, what else you got? I got nothing else. That was pretty big. And there was a lot going on there. And there'll be a, you know, only the Washington football team could be an interesting one and three team.

You're going to come on tomorrow, right, since you missed Tuesday? All right. So we'll have a lot more information by tomorrow. And a lot of that information will be. from Ron Rivera himself, who was scheduled to speak today after their Wednesday practice in preparation for the Rams. All right. I will talk to you tomorrow.

Enjoy the day at the beach. Get a cold beer. Get another nice seat there. Maybe take another picture and tweet it out because it looked very relaxing. All right. Thanks, Tom. Thanks. All right.

Chris Cooley coming up next right after this word from one of our sponsors. All right. Let's bring in Cooley. And let me just give everybody a heads up. We're not going to do the defensive film breakdown today, not with the breaking news on Dwayne this morning. We're going to spend 10 minutes here talking about Haskins, and then Cooley will join us on Friday, and maybe he'll give us a few grades on some defensive players, but then we'll get into previewing the Rams game. But the breaking news this morning, and I am the one that informed our good friend Christopher Cooley about this news.

He's out in Wyoming, man. He's not paying attention, but the news came down Cooley just about an hour ago that Dwayne Haskins, has been benched and Kyle Allen is going to start against the Rams and not only has Duane been benched but he has been dropped to the number three and inactive role and Alex Smith is ready apparently to be one step away, one play away from playing in an NFL game. He will be the backup as of now to Kyle Allen. This happened pretty quickly. I don't know, I mean, I know what you think and what you've thought in watching the film. But I, I, This was a surprise to me, even though it's been telegraphed over the past week with the leaks and, you know, the cutoff date and the conversation from Rivera, I didn't expect it this soon.

Did you? No, I didn't see it coming this soon. I didn't see it coming until midpoint of the season. And for me, I saw it as you can't operate at all halfway through the year and you want to start installing an offense and grow up. next year. And I didn't even know if that would be the case. It's got to be this idea that they do think that they can win the division, but they don't think they can win the division with the way. I mean, that's as simple as it is. The leaks are a disappointment, I think, just based on a new staff coming in and Rivera talking about culture change and it being same old.

you know that that's that's one of the things that I think so you went from two weeks ago to we have to ignore the noise right the wayne's got to ignore the noise he said he's got to ignore noise to Ian Rappapapur and Finley and and benching immediately it's just it's just the same deal man it's over and over yeah you know the first thing you see said, is to me a big part of this. Like, let me, let me go through my quick list here of thoughts. Number one, I'm surprised because it happened so soon, even though the leaks and the telegraphing, the messaging from the coach indicated that this was a possibility over the last seven days. Number two, I'm really surprised that he's been dropped to number three. I mean,

this says it's over more than the benching itself does. He's not going to. to be the franchise quarterback here in Washington. He just isn't unless Ron Rivera's fired after this year. Number three, Alex Smith being a snap away, that's incredible to me. I guess they could still sign somebody else between now and Sunday. Derek Anderson at 37 years old was a backup in Carolina forever. He's out there. Number four, four games is just not a fair sample size in terms of the games that he got.

But what this indicates is that what we don't see and what we don't know is always in play here. And I had Shanahan on the show this morning, Cooley, and asked him about Dwayne before the news broke. And he said, if he gets benched, it's about what's happening during the week. It's about the little things and the things that the coaches are seeing and coming to the conclusion on during the week. By the way, they have the right to make the call. This is their, this is his team. And if he's already come to the conclusion that Dwayne's not the guy, that's fine by me. I'm just, I just don't think four games is a true measurement, which gets me to this.

If Dallas were 4 and O, and you said this, if Dallas were 4 and O in Philadelphia were 3 and 1, this doesn't happen right now. This goes hand in hand with his comments about this. This is an interesting situation. It's a unique situation we're in with the division. 2014, we went 7, 8, and 1, won the division, won a playoff game. If Dallas were sitting there at 4 and O in Philadelphia at 3 and 1, this doesn't happen now. I think he sees or has come to realize in his own mind anyway, personally, I don't know that they can compete for a division title, but whatever, it's there that he's got an opportunity to win now, and it's not going to be Dwayne that gets in there.

It's going to be Kyle Allen that gives him a better chance. Now, J.P. Finley thinks Allen's a bridge to Alex Smith. I also would add this. Dan doesn't have anything to do with this decision, which is a good thing, that this is Ron's decision, and he's got the ability to make the decision. But him dropping to three, it's over, right? Like, they're not coming back to him unless everybody gets injured again. I think it's fascinating that they drop him to three and don't leave him as the backup. maybe there was a conversation had, like, look, you want to be the backup here?

Or do you want to just do nothing? And maybe they try to trade him as soon as possible. And I don't even know if you have any trade value in Dwayne at this point. A team that had a second round grade on him, because I don't think very many teams had first round grades on him. But dropping him to three is interesting. The other interesting thing is the pitch to Dan is that Kyle Smith could be a bridge to Alex. We think Alex is close to ready. but everybody knows how much Dan loves Alex.

So benching Duane for Alex would actually be okay in Dan's eyes because I think he wants Alex to play anyway, or who would want to see his guy out there. So I think there's a lot of interesting to it. I can't imagine. I just, I don't see Alex Smith playing. I don't either. But he's one snap away on Sunday from playing.

I'm aware. So clearly, clearly. he's ready to play. It's crazy. Clearly, he's, he's ready to roll. It'll be interesting to see if we see Alex Smith. Now, the Alex stuff's hilarious. There was a tweet last night from Dan Orlovsky, a couple that I actually responded to.

You did? What were the tweets? So he has a tweet that says, Haskins Sunday versus Baltimore. Two misreads. One on a zero blitz pop out by Campbell. one on a protection change poor by him. Two misthrows, one on a checkdown, one on a slant to McLaurin. Then the QB isn't the problem.

So I said, laugh out loud, nice film skimming, four notes from 46 throws and 49 dropbacks. Come on, like two misreads. Please. I mean, so you get this other side of this and the media side of it that's like, oh, the quarterback's not the problem and everyone sees that. Orloskey's super smart. And you're like, golly, this is not the narrative. I mean, anybody who listened to the podcast, we went through it all.

We went through the positives too. Yeah. Right. Look, if this were just about talent, you don't bail after four games. It's about something else. It's about a lot more here. It's even about a lot of stuff that maybe you know and won't say, which is, fine, but I'm not suggesting that you do know, but it's about this stuff we don't see and we don't

know every week. These guys have the right to come in and make their own decisions. And if they don't think he's the quarterback of the future and they're planning on making a change in the offseason and drafting somebody or signing somebody in free agency, and oh, by the way, the division can be had and they think Kyle Allen's better, even if Kyle Allen's not the future, they have the right to do this. I just don't, if you were asking me to, Is it fair based on the four games you've watched him start for this group to bail on him now? I would say no because he's got too much talent to bail on now. And I don't see the same level of talent in the quarterback that they have backing him up.

So I would like to see 16 full games, 12 more. But I don't know what's going on behind the scenes. I don't know whether or not they have just come to the conclusion, in uh-uh, not going to happen. No way. Well, one, I don't, I'm not telling you anything I don't know. I haven't been in the building since January. I know. No, I don't know.

Mike's absolutely right. It's what you see in the week and understanding is your quarterback ready. And to that point, I made the point, I think very clearly yesterday. They went into a game plan where they were going to run 10 screens. and they were going to throw the ball behind the line of scrimmage 14 other times. Right. They went into a game plan, understanding that the guy wasn't ready to get the ball down the field with a complete passing game plan.

They went in knowing that. So when you go in knowing that, it might be that he's okay behind the scenes as a guy. It's just that he's not ready to play right now. Yeah. Which is also okay. I don't know. I just, all of this stuff is, did I? I got trolled last night by everybody after I trolled Dorlowski.

Oh, really? I wasn't following. Oh, yeah, you love your boy, Alex Smith. I'm sitting there. I think I responded to someone like, I don't remember ever grading Alex more than a C-plus. I never liked Alex. Never. Alex was never the answer for me.

Not in one game that he played in D.C. He may be better than Dwayne, but he wasn't the answer for me. Yeah. Let's be clear. on that. I'm reading some of your stuff now. Yeah. Whatever.

You're funny. It's funny because you barely ever are on Twitter, which is smart. But Dan Orlovsky really got to you last night. LOL, nice film skimming, Dan. Four notes from 46 throws and 49 dropbacks. Hashtag super smart.

Did he respond to that? I don't think so. So he had another screen cap of a dropback. And he's like, where could the ball go here? So I responded with multiple options where the ball could go. I'm such an asshole. But here's the thing. Kevin, you know this.

I spent four hours watching this film. Right. And go through play after play after play, drop back after drop back, and try to find reasons to make it okay. that's what everyone I think should understand is that I actually want doing to succeed I know you want the team to succeed and and so I'm going through this very completely trying to find what what the answer is I'm also going through it just so when you watched the game or if you wanted to go back and

rewatch the game you can understand what the answer was the public service look I mean I'm not here to to speak on your behalf you can do that on your own, but you're not going to, you're going to forget to say this if I don't say it for you. You and I both were not fans of Haskins being drafted in the first round in the 2019 draft. We both said long before the skins picked him, we wouldn't take him. There were multiple quarterbacks we both liked and you liked a lot more than Dwayne. But, you know, after watching him, I was much more intrigued last year. I was much more encouraged than discouraged watching him last year.

and you essentially got to be there almost every day with him, and you liked him. I do. I liked him a lot. Yeah. And so, bottom line is there's been some good, but there's been more bad. The last thing you and I talked about in the podcast yesterday, I said to you, you know what's bothered me, and I'm paraphrasing here, is that that urgency and that extend the playability and some of the really trying to make something happen with a. bad team around them last year in some of those games. I haven't seen any of that this year. And why not? And you said, because he's thinking too much. He's trying not to make mistakes.

You know, it's a new system, the whole thing. And look, these guys are bailing quickly. It's the standings. It's that they don't believe in him long term. The fact that they've pushed him to number three, you know, basically if they were going to try to trade him for anything, well, they just hurt their ability to get anything back by benching him for a guy that with a leg that we saw three, four months ago looked like it was, you know, shredded by a great white shark. I mean, I, he's done here, Cooley. I mean, there's always, by the way, Rivera's not going to say that today when he speaks. Hopefully he will take the total encouraging Dwayne's a talent and that, you know, this is a new system, and Kyle's been in the system, and Alex

is a veteran quarterback, and we still believe in Dwayne, he's probably going to say all of those things, which he should say, because they could get something for him maybe after this season is over. You know, you don't want to do what Gruden did to RG3. You don't want to totally publicly humiliate him or bash him. And, you know, in many ways, the in game quiz on the fourth and goal from the 13 was, you know, almost trying to expose him a little bit. I don't know that I like that. But anyway. No, I don't like that either.

I don't like any of, I don't like that they had a quiz for Dwayne Haskins in a critical moment of the game when they shouldn't have been going for it on fourth and 13. That was pure stupidity. Well, we should, duh, she get some points here. No, no, no, no. We need to quiz Dwayne. Tell us about Kyle Allen. So Kyle Allen, I thought, had a couple good games early for Carolina.

I think there was a Monday night game that I thought he played pretty well against the Green Bay Packers last year. As the season progressed, it was that snow game. Yeah, as the season progressed, they were much more advanced offensively because we played Carolina. And so I went through and watched five Carolina games. And for fun, me thinking about coaching and all this stuff. every time we would play another team last year and I would call the game, I would draw up 60 of their plays week in and week out. And so they were more advanced offensively than the Washington offense has been this year.

Sure. I thought Kyle Allen started to struggle as the year went on. And I thought Kyle Allen maybe started to see too much and think too much instead of just playing. Instinctually, when he started, he played and I thought he did a pretty good job making some throws. I don't think the offense will look dynamically different. But I'll bet you there's seven more dropback concepts just based on them thinking Dwayne can't play. They have something to prove on offense. I will say this.

And this is not just the Orlovsky tweet, but this is so many people. The quarterback isn't the problem. Well, the quarterback's not the problem that they're not scoring 30 every week. But you look at this offensive line, and I've graded the offensive line pretty positively in four games. They're not nearly as bad as people have thought they've been. I know. Gibson's become a playmaker and given you some potential. Terry McLaren's a guy that I think could have 10 receptions a game.

They're not talented dynamically. They're not, there's not four guys that you can consistently get the ball to. But Duane has in four games been the problem that they haven't scored more points. It's just, it is what it is. He has been the problem to why they have to have. haven't scored more points. You could debate this with me. Dan Roloski could debate this with me.

I'm going to win this one. That said, the question isn't necessarily for me. Is he the problem through four games? It's more like, can he become the answer through another eight games? I feel like them benching him this early is saying they don't believe he can become the answer in another eight games. Right. because if they thought he's progressed,

then there's something to it. Look, I mean, honestly, I thought his biggest step forward this year was the three interception game. I know you did. That was odd. You also get, like, you also, it's so funny to see when,

like I don't tweet very often, but it's just so funny to see him the response, and it's like, 11 fucking games, Cooley. Would you have benched Peyton Manning for throwing X amount of picks? And I'm like, no, I wouldn't. I actually, my favorite game was when Duane made mistakes throwing the ball down the field because I believed he learned like Peyton Manning learned when he threw picks.

Like I hate when a quarterback thinks I'm going to be, I got to just one read, ball out. Post snap, read the coverage, make the right throws, try to get to the ball where it's supposed to be. I just didn't think that he progressed in any of the three games. that weren't the interception games. Like last week, there was no step forward. You could take any college quarterback and throw screens and dump-offs. Right.

I don't wanna be harsh, but that's what you could do. And you can credit Scott Turner for giving them a game plan to move the ball, but having the ability to throw accurately within 10 yards is not an overwhelming skill for quarterbacks around the league. And I can be a former tight end to tell you that. Oh, my other point to all this evaluation, like, you're not a quarterback.

Yeah. How many head coaches in the NFL played quarterback? How many offensive coordinators had to be quarterbacks? Like, it's not hard to evaluate football. It's not hard to evaluate offensive scheme. I'm just, I feel really bad for Dwayne, but he wasn't growing the way they wanted him to grow. Right. here's one thing just to keep in mind.

They traded a fifth rounder to Carolina for Kyle Allen. And he did talk about, Rivera talk about, a training camp competition if there were an actual training camp, which there never really was. So it makes me believe now that he was honest about a training camp competition, that if there had been a regular training camp and a regular off-season, that perhaps Alan may have beaten him out even before this season started. Maybe. Does this vindicate Jay in that staff to some extent? I'm not suggesting. In their evaluation of him?

In their evaluation of Duane. Now, obviously, it was not the right move to consistently say to the media, Dwayne can't play. Dwayne hasn't grown. That's not necessarily the right move. But no one wanted to believe that. This is, again, I mean, there's just so many similarities to the Robert situation.

It's just Robert had one amazing year, so there was something there. But this is, again, two staffs that have said it. I'll tell you what it is vindication of. It's vindication of the people in personnel. It's not vindication about anything. The personnel people never wanted Duane. I know. No one in personnel wanted to draft Wayne.

Like, nobody in personnel wanted to take Askins. Yeah. All the, say that again. Say that again so everybody can hear it and let them digest it. Because I don't know that you've ever said it as definitively as you just said it now. Say it again. Okay, let me say it very definitively. No one in personnel wanted to draft Wayne at 15 overall.

That's the other thing that everybody listening needs to understand. You and I didn't want to draft Wayne at 15 overall. I evaluated him as a second or a second or a year. third rounder. You can actually go, if my podcasts are still on the Washington website, I don't know if they are or are not. You could go, it was March or April that I, like, this last game that he played was identical to my evaluation from Ohio State. Right. Like this was so close to my Ohio State evaluation. Okay. Like what they did was so similar, this offense was so similar to Ohio State. They tried to cater it and fit it to what he did at Ohio State.

You and I didn't want to take him at 15 overall, but clearing everything up, no one would have had a problem if it had been 15 in the second round. No one. Okay. That's where people evaluated. Do you want to take players where you evaluate them? But Kevin, no one wanted him at 15 in the building. Yeah. And they were not happy that the owner wanted him.

Hey, you know, it's a real blessing at this point? They at least were able to talk Dan out of trading up to take him. because remember that was a part of the conversation on draft day prior to draft day about no we need to get Dwayne even if we have to trade up and somebody was able to talk him out of trading up for him. Imagine that debacle. By the way, I want to be clear on this too. Nobody's been vindicated. Nobody's been proven right or wrong about anything at this point. He's 22 or 23 years old.

He will get an opportunity somewhere else. and he may develop into a really good quarterback. And this franchise, if they move on from him, may have made a mistake by doing so. You don't think so. And I'm a little bit up in the air as to what I think. I don't, I want to find out more about why, what he is behind the scenes. Because it's always at that position about a combination of talent and everything else. You know, how many times have we heard people who evaluate quarterbacks say, yeah, that workout stuff and that great shape stuff, that's really nice.

But what's more important is that he can walk to the line of scrimmage and identify where he needs to go with the ball right after it snapped. And then he's able to process very quickly, you know, based on post-snap, where to go with it based on what he's seeing. I want to find out why. I'm reading something from Kime's story that he just wrote. There's a quote in here that I haven't seen. It's not from today. It's from before today. From Rivera.

Quote, at one point you want to build and you want to build. And now you're looking at the opportunity to potentially win this. You start thinking along those lines and start thinking, you know what? Maybe we need to do that, closed quote. I am 100% convinced that the division standings are the reason he's gotten the quick hook. he may have eventually gotten the hook for Alan or for Alex Smith. But the reason it's happening now is because they think they can go win this division with this defense. I think it's because they don't believe they're building.

And this division is a great excuse for it. What do you mean? Being in second place in the division by half a game is a great excuse to pull the trigger when ultimately my bet right now is it's too long of a build in their minds. Too long of a build with him? Yes. Okay. How does that, well, that, okay, too long of a build with him is fine,

but the standings are what's driving that. Yeah, no, I think the standings are a facade to that. Maybe it's not. guess, right? You're saying they're using the standings as an excuse to say, hey, we got a chance to go win now, even though they don't believe it, but they're looking at it as this is a way to get out of the Dwayne business right now. They may believe it to some extent, but four games is not a building evaluation.

Four is not a true building evaluation of a guy. Like, that's, I think in part, there may be some substance. to the standings and where you sit in the division, but also in part, do you see yourself as a Super Bowl team this year or a team that's going to win games in the playoffs? Because I don't. I mean, I don't. I mean, you add Tom Brady or Russell Wilson, maybe that's a different scenario. But you're talking about adding a top five or six quarterback, then maybe that's a different situation.

I just think that it's too long of a project. And in the NFL, you don't have. that time. You just don't. I think the last point to make is that there is a big risk in this by this coaching staff. You do have to understand there's a huge risk that they're taking. What's the risk? That's another state.

They're going to get crucified if Kyle Allen goes in and doesn't play well. Okay. Yeah, that's true. I thought you were implying that the risk would be with the owner. No, I'm not suggesting that the risk is with the owner. I think with the owner, there's a suggestion that your guy Alex Smith could play or that we want to win this division or we're in this division. That's a great excuse for him, too.

But if Kyle Allen comes in and throws two or three picks next week, they look terrible. Who did it? Peterman did it in Buffalo a couple years ago. They benched Tyrod Taylor. Yeah, remember that. Peterman threw five picks the next game. Yeah. What is wrong with you, idiots?

Right. You really thought, and that had to be a Peter, Peterman was good in practice kind of deal. I mean, Kyle Allen's played in some football games, but if he goes in and plays very poorly, this looks bad on this staff. Benches the 15th overall pick from a year ago, who's played an 11 total games for an undrafted guy,

you did have to trade for who started some games in the NFL, who now isn't playing well. Wow, you didn't want to find out about Dwayne. You want to really find out. find out. Now, they'll sit there and behind closed doors and say, we found out enough. That's what they're doing. They found out enough if they're willing to make this move

right now. They've seen enough. No doubt. I mean, standings, all of that stuff all played into the timing, but this was coming, and this was coming because they've made up their mind. He's not going to be their franchise quarterback. Not as long

as they're here. Now, the owner, you know, may say at the end of the year, if Kyle Allen performs poorly, and Alex Smith comes in and they get him injured again or something like that. He may come in and say, you know what, we're moving in a different direction. You guys F this whole thing up. It should have been Dwayne. And I'm going to find a guy that's going to come in and coach my guy.

I don't see that happening, but with this owner, anything is possible. He's the guy that went in and made this happen when the personnel people who spent all year long scouting, traveling, evaluating, said no. Not at 15. This is not the right move. And he said, well, I want you to trade up to get him if that's what we need to do to get him. He went to the same high school. My son went to. He's a local. He's going to be great. Urban Meyer loves him. Urban Meyer loves him. Oh, boy. All right. Cooley will be back on Friday with me. We'll preview the Rams game. We'll get much more into Kyle Allen. I'll watch some Kyle Allen for you. I'll go back and I'll watch six or seven games. from last year over the next day. Awesome. We'll do that.

And then maybe you'll have a couple of grades from the defensive film breakdown if anybody cares at that point. Thank you. Thanks to all of you for listening. A crazy day. Breaking News. Glad we got it in on the podcast.