The Kevin Sheehan Show - Caps' Present; Commanders' Future

Episode Date: May 4, 2022

A busy show today includes Greg Wyshinski (ESPN Hockey) jumping on to talk about the Caps' 4-2 Game 1 win in Florida. Steve Sands/NBC-Golf Channel called in to discuss all things DC sports including the Wells Fargo at Avenel this weekend. Kevin also played part his interview with Penn State Wide Receivers Coach Taylor Stubblefield who coached Jahan Dotson the last two years in State College.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it, but you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheyenne Show. Here's Kevin. And about to take game one in this first round on the road. Wow. What an effort from the Washington Capitals over the Panthers. They get the win.

Four to the final. What a win by the Caps last night. Three unanswered goals in the third period. They beat the Panthers, the number one. one seed in the east, the team with the best record in all of hockey, a big time favorite in this series over Washington. And Washington goes in in game one and wins four to two. All four goals scored by players who played on the Stanley Cup championship team in 2018.

They seemed to have Florida rattled and maybe now a little bit tight. It's something we talked about yesterday a little bit, which was just this whole idea of the caps have always been the favored team in this first round series. And they've had a lot of very tight moments, you know, especially before the Stanley Cup title in 2018, you know, how many of those game fives and game sevens with, you know, a lot of expectations to beat the opponent. And there they are in a tough series.

They didn't always come through. Florida may be feeling the same. They're inexperienced in the postseason. Washington, very experienced. They seem to, from my standpoint, and I'm not a hockey guy, and we're going to have a hockey guy on coming up shortly, and that guy will be Greg Wyshinsky, this senior NHL writer for ESPN,

to talk about last night's game and the series the way he sees it moving forward. But it just seemed like the caps, especially in the third period after they tied it up and even got the lead, really started to defend well, really seemed to bottle Florida up as they approached the offensive zone. Caps just seemed prepared for that, especially with the lead. I thought Vtec Vanecichick did a pretty good job behind them defensively. I mean, what do I know?

But it certainly appeared to me as if Florida was getting frustrated in that third period. and now, you know, the pressure is on them to win game two tomorrow night or risk coming back to D.C. down to nothing in this series. It's an interesting situation when you are a big-time favorite and you are an explosive offensive team. And to get bottled up the way they did last night, especially after they fell behind, they looked rattled. Greg Wyshinsky will join us here shortly.

Before Greg joins us, I do want to mention I actually stayed up last night and watched that crazy Rangers Penn's triple overtime game. I'll ask Greg about that as well. I do enjoy the postseason in the NHL, especially games that go to overtime. The NBA games last night, Boston Roll, they really frustrated the hell out of Janus last night. They were running everybody at him, and Boston wins going away to even up that series at a game of piece. But the performance of the night was John Morant's 47 for Memphis, including every big bucket down the stretch to beat Golden State 106-101 to even up that series at a game apiece. I'm not going to spend a lot of time on this, but if you are an NBA guy and you've been watching the postseason, I personally don't think that Dylan Brooks should have been thrown out of the game for the foul on Gary Payton the second,

which, by the way, results in a fractured elbow. At least that's the latest for Gary Payton the second. I didn't think Dylan Brooks was really intentional in that foul. And I know that there was some vulnerability to the position that Gary Payton was in. But I didn't think Draymond should have been thrown out the other. day either. I think this is the NBA playoffs. There isn't an element of physicality. You don't want cheap shots. Steve Kerr thought it was incredibly cheap, the shot by Dylan Brooks. I don't think that I really agree with that. Flagrant 1, definitely, but not a flagrant 2 ejection, which happened

very early in the game, as it did with Draymond in game 1. But John Morant, man, what a star. I really, I loved John Morant coming out in that 2019 NBA draft. He would have been my guy if the Wizards had had a chance in that 2019 draft. But, you know, it was Zion won John Morant 2, and then the Wizards didn't select until, I think it was ninth in that draft. I think it was ninth. And they took Rui Hachamura, and I said at the time, I would have taken Brandon Clark. Brandon Clark went later and went later to Oklahoma City. He's now a part of the team with John Morant in Memphis. That was the Gonzaga player that I preferred.

That was me. I like Chachamara. Don't get me wrong. I think Hachamara's got a big upside. And I think he's extremely talented. It's a shame he missed so much time last year. Hopefully he's fine. But Brandon Clark was just a killer on the court at Gonzag.

and he has been that at the NBA level. But John Morant, my God. You know, it's one of those deals, right, where Zion was the clear-cut number one pick in the 2019 draft coming out of Duke. And there was discussion about who was going to go number two. John Morant. I think it was R.J. Barrett also from Duke.

I think that Darius Garland may have been in that situation. Was that the year that DeAndre Hunter came out from Virginia, maybe. But to me, it was always Morant, and I said at the time, I would consider Morant over Zion. That looks better now, not that Zion can't lose weight, get healthy, and have a massive career in New Orleans or somewhere else. But John Morant is a superstar here in year three, 47, 8, and three steals last night. That's going to be a hell of a series as it moves back. San Francisco. The Nats won last night. Good for them. They have really piled up the runs here. For a team that's been pretty anemic offensively, you now have in their last four games a 14 run

output in a win over San Francisco and 11 win output in the finale against San Francisco. And they got 10 last night against Colorado. So they've scored in double digits runs wise in three of their last four. They've won three out of their last four. Big night last night for Bell, a home run, his third. Soto also with a home run last night, his fifth. And Eric Fetty pitched really well. The Nats have won three out of their last four. We'll see what happens. You know, I'm sure it's exciting for them now, and it would be nice if they got on a little bit of a run here, because if they got on a nice little run here. It means at Tommy's event, Monday night at Shelley's back room. You're all invited. $100 donation goes to a great cause, the D.C. Grays. But it would be nice

to have the Nats on a roll leading up to that because I would expect a few celebrity guests to be at Tommy's event. Monday, May 9th, 6 to 8, Shelley's back room. That's 1331 F Street. Northwest, plenty of parking, great spot. You get three cigars, you get appetizers, you get an auction with lots of sports memorabilia game tickets and other merchandise, including the opportunity

to sit in on a show, a podcast with yours truly and Tom. But it would be nice if the gnats were rolling because in the past, there have been some big-time gnats that have shown up to Tom's event.

Mike Rizzo was there one year. Mike Rizzo and Davy Martinez together were there one year. But go to D.C.grays.com to purchase your tickets. You can also get tickets at the door. Monday night, May 9th. Okay, this coming Monday night, May 9th, 6 to 8 p.m. Shelley's back room at 13th and F. Streets Northwest. But, yeah, it would be better if they were on a roll.

And they have been here recently. So I put my mock schedule out yesterday. and already I know one game that will be wrong. I had Washington hosting Kirk Cousins in Minnesota on Sunday, October 9th. That's not going to happen because Minnesota is playing one of the five international games, one of the three games in London on October 2nd.

They are playing the New Orleans Saints in London. And typically after you play in international, game, you get your buy week the next week. So my guess is that Minnesota plays in London on October 2nd and then October 9th, which I had in my mock schedule, them coming to Washington, they'll be on their by week. By the way, the international games are all out. The NFL putting parts of the schedule out before they release it in its entirety on May 12th, a week from tomorrow night. But the Saints Vikings will be the first London game, 9.30 a.m. Eastern Standard October 2nd. The Packers and the Giants the next week at 9.30 a.m. on a Sunday morning here in the east from London. Jacksonville and Denver on Sunday, October 30th. And then the two other games are the first ever game in Germany between Tampa and Seattle. So Tom Brady will play against the Seahawks in Germany. And then the NFL back in Mexico City.

for a game on Monday night, November 21st, between the Cardinals and the 49ers. So there are two things before we get to Greg Wyshinsky, and then Steve Sands, who will be on this show as well with the Wells Fargo golf tournament in town, although Steve's just going to want to talk about the Skins draft and the Caps game. But Jack Del Rio tweeted something out last night. Jack Del Rio, the defensive coordinator for the Washington, Manders. He tweeted out something, it was part of a retweet of a story from somebody who had written the following. They had tweeted out the following about the latest NFL power rankings

on CBS Sports. They tweeted out, CBS Sports moved Washington from 24 to 12 in their NFL power rankings. Jack Del Rio retweeted that and wrote, that was smart. First of all, CBS Sports's updated NFL power rankings post-draft were done by Pete Prisco. Washington moved up 12 spots, but not to number 12 to 13. Still, you know, playoff territory. They were 25 before. So CBS Sports came out with these updated NFL power rankings and whoa, Washington went from 25 to 13. 13 is about as high as I can remember them in an NFL power rankings in recent years. I think you'd almost have to go back to 2016 or maybe early 2017. Remember when they annihilated the Raiders on Sunday night football and I think they were two and one and headed to Arrowhead? You know, it's possible, I guess,

last year. You could have found them in the middle of the pack of the league after a playoff season, but not 13. It's been, you know, five, six years since I think they've been that high on anybody's power rankings list of NFL teams. But two things on this. One, hey Jack, and I like Jack Del Rio. I love his press conferences, you know, the four to seven word answers, sometimes even shorter. Don't fall into the rut that has been the rut of this organization for so long, which really hasn't been as much with this group. And that is one of my favorite sayings, you know, stop overpromising and underdelivering. The organization has lived on overpromising and died on underdelivering for years.

I mean, this has been their mantra. This has been their mode of operation. It's to get you all ginned up, which doesn't work anymore. and then to completely, completely under-deliver. I mean, last year, there was certainly a lot of hype about the defense, a lot of talking. Montez-Swett, Chase Young, remember, you know, Montez-Swett saying we're going to set the NFL sack record?

I mean, would they have, five and a half combined sacks between the two of them? Just stop telling us and show us. It would be so nice if this organization, for the first time, in 22 years, just shut up and went out and won games. It hasn't been that way for all of the Snyder 22 years. The Gibbs years weren't really about over-promising and under-delivering, but there was a lot of that. You know, in free agency, the 2006 free agency year was all about,

look at what we've done in free agency. Let's buy some tickets. We got some tickets to sell. And even back then, they still had some to sell, even though Gibbs was in his third year at that point in Washington. Anyway, they didn't have many to sell, actually. They did pretty well during the Gibbs years in terms of season tickets. There may have actually still in 2006, there may have still been a waiting list.

Not a large one, but maybe a small one. I like Jack Del Rio. I think he's a pretty decent coach. I know not everybody agrees, but he's highly respected in this league as a defensive coordinator. And I think, you know, fully healthy, this could be a really good defensive football team. I just think it's beneath him to retweet, you know, an opinion story on a sports website that shows power rankings for the NFL in May. And Washington jumping all the way up to number 12.

It was actually number 13. But regardless, like, first of all, strive for. for being number one. Secondly, don't tell us. Don't, you know, puff your chest out and say, oh, look what somebody's saying about us. You can feel that way, but just for once, just show us. Don't tell us. It's been this way for years. And I just sort of think of Jack Del Rio is the kind of guy that gets this, that he isn't the kind of guy to, you know, I know he was active on social media politically and has been at times. But with respect to his own team, just go out there and make sure your defense isn't the second worst defense in the NFL on

third down again. The defense and the quarterback this year went and can the defense return to what we thought it could be last year and what it was at times the year before, even though they didn't play, you know, a murderer's row of starting quarterbacks. It just, for whatever reason in this organization, and I know I've said before, they need to market themselves, but not this way. Not this way. Okay. I want you to hear a portion of an interview that I did with Taylor Stubblefield.

Taylor is the wide receivers coach at Penn State. He coached Jahan Dotson. I interviewed him right before the podcast today for the radio show tomorrow, but I'm going to take a piece of it and play it right now. I want you to hear what Taylor Stubblefield, the wide receivers coach at Penn State, told me about what Washington, what we're all getting is Washington fans in Jahan Dotson.

Oh, man, you're getting a lot. You're getting a guy who can go inside, you can play outside. You never know what kind of, what kind of catch. you're going to get. He can make the routine catch. He can make the highlight real catch. He can take a screen to the end zone. He can do quite a bit for the Washington commanders. And so we're fired up for him. He's just going to be a low-maintenance, high-production kind of guy. And you guys should be fired up. We're fired up for him. And great organization as well. When people ask you or when coaches ask you about Jahan Dotson, do you have like a go-to story about him, something that sticks out?

You know what, no. You know how sometimes you coach a player and they maybe were headed down the wrong path and then they just had this aha moment and they snapped into it? That's not Jahan. Jahan, he just trusted the process. And when I say low maintenance, I literally mean low maintenance. He did what he was supposed to do. He was on time for meetings. He was, he communicated if he was going to be potentially late or if he was going to miss something.

He was at treatment when he was supposed to be there. Like there was nothing that made me go like, all right, if this guy could just turn on the switch or just flip the switch, he's going to be a heck of a football player. That wasn't the case. He was dedicated from the get-go. We worked well together. He asked me questions. I asked him to come in and invest a little bit more in terms of film study, and he did it.

He just did it, and it wasn't difficult. We talked about route running. We talked about defensive identification and having the savviness of, understanding what the defense is going to do, so you may have to change your route. And then we challenged him, too. We challenged to get his body right. We challenged him to make the tough catch over the middle

or the big-time contested catch, and he did it. And so he's been an absolute pleasure to coach, and obviously we're going to miss him at Penn State. That was Taylor Stubblefield. Taylor is the wide receivers coach at Penn State. He coached John Dodson. you can hear that interview in its entirety tomorrow morning on my radio show on the Team 980 during the 7 a.m. hour.

There was another 10 to 12 minutes of the interview with Taylor. He was great. Up next, Greg Woshensky will be our guest. Before that, let me just remind you, please rate us and review us on Apple and Spotify. Five stars on Apple, quick one to two sentence review. It really helps. Can the caps win this series? They're up one-nothing. and Greg Wyshinsky will help us on that right after these words from a few of our sponsors. I think they're neutralized. That was Jensen. And now on the stick of Giroux, rank wide, couldn't connect with Verhegey. And now Baxter.

Centers for Osi. He scores. Just like that, Washington takes the lead. Yep, big win for the caps last night in game one at Florida. Four to two over the best team in hockey. during the regular season here to help us with this game, a couple of the other games from the first two nights and maybe a larger outlook on the rest of the playoffs is Greg Wyshinsky, senior NHL writer at ESPN,

former Puck Daddy when we started to have them on many years ago at Wyshinsky, W-S-H-Y-S-K-I on Twitter. So since we didn't talk before last night, just tell me who you had in this series. and how many games you thought it would take? I picked Florida in five. I was very enchanted with what they were able to do in the regular season. Part of that was their ability to rally in games in which they were down,

and I wasn't all that confident in the Capitol goaltending. So, of course, after game one, the Panthers don't rally. Their offense gets short-circuited, and Vitech Vec Vannich was great. So that's how things are going with that prediction. Yeah, I mean, it's crazy because I feel like for, you know, at least a decade, I've had you on typically before the playoffs started or very early in the postseason. And even you as a massive fan, and by the way, someone who's covered this sport for so long, you recognize kind of this incredible unpredictability to this sport that maybe doesn't exist

in others this time of year. so after one game and it appeared as if Florida was a little bit frustrated last night, and maybe even a little bit tight, have you changed your mind on this series? I haven't, but I am concerned that the thing that if it happened, Florida was going to lose the series might be happening. And it's twofold. One is the Capitol's group of concepts. it is the fact that he's got guys on this team that have been through these wars before,

that have a Stanley Cup, and that know what it takes and how to make plays in critical situations. And what we saw in game one was Alex Obeskin make a brilliant defensive play against the Panthers to set up the Kiznetsov goal. And then we saw Nikki Baxter make a great path to T.J. O'Shee. So these are all prime performing players that have done. in the past that are making plays in game one. The other part of it, that has me worried, you know, remember that Will Smith movie where he fights himself?

I feel like it's got to be a little bit of that with the Capitals right now. Like, looking at the Panthers in 2022, like, looking at the Capitals in, like, 2009, right? It's a young gun, running gun, offensive team that may not necessarily know or care enough to play defense when. necessary. And so I'm hoping that's not the case with the Panthers, but this was the first time we've seen where they've not been able to score themselves out of a problem. And so it's going to be very interesting to see what their interim coach, Andrew Brunette, and their leadership do between games one and two to try to keep them on focus, don't change the vibe, and get them

to understand what happened in game one, because, you know, this thing could spot. if it doesn't, if they don't. You know, it's so interesting because I, I, it was talking to Joe B about this yesterday morning and was talking to Ben Raby this morning on radio about this, just about the position that the caps have been in for so many of their playoff seasons during the Ovechkin era, being the prohibitive favorite of having home ice advantage and all of those games, you know, the game five's where it's two, two, or the games sevens where it's three, three, three, and they're at home and you could cut the tension with a knife and there was this expectation that

they were going to blow it and the whole thing. And I'm wondering, you know, Florida doesn't have that kind of history, even though they haven't won a playoff series since 95-96. But do you think that the pressure being off the caps and totally on Florida, this may look stupid in a week having this conversation, but do you think it's one of those things that can kind of snowball into like, you know, a feeling of constriction of super tightness, and it could really impact this series? Oh, absolutely. And I think the pressure's been off the caps since they won.

Like, I feel like that's the most, I mean, you could argue it's been off the cap since they beat the Penguins before they won, is the moment in which the way. Right. In Florida's case, they weren't alone in, in these game ones as far as teams that came into the playoffs with the weight of expectation on them and then not performing. I think Minnesota was tight in their game against the blues and easily frustrated.

I think Florida obviously had their issues against the capitals and certainly didn't look themselves in that third period. I think the Rangers started off their game against the Penguins up to nothing, looking very much like that they were going to be the better team. and then the Penguins just took over the game from that point. And if it's not for 79 saves from Igorich-Chirkin, they're not even in that overtime. So the thing, and I do think there's something there where all of a sudden what you did in the regular season,

what your identity was for 82 games, is no longer what you see yourself as in the playoffs. It can become a real obstacle. And Capitol fans saw it plenty in Ovecans'Emberg's early years, and you wonder if the Panthers are going to go are going to the same thing. You know, you mentioned St. Louis and Washington, you know, pulling off game one upsets. I mean, they're two recent Stanley Cup champions with Stanley Cup pedigree, which may put even more pressure on their opponents in Minnesota and Florida.

Those guys know that these guys are recent Stanley Cup champions. I wanted to ask you those specifically, do you think it's easier if you are a free-flowing, high-octane offensive team like Florida. You compared them to some of those early caps teams 2009, 2010. Remember, they lost to, you know, Halak in Montreal and Game 7 at home in 2010 as the best team in hockey. Is it easier to fight through that as a really good team that relies on lots of goals and lots of offense? Or is it easy to break through that if you're more of a definitely? defensive great team?

Good question. I think it's probably easier when you're an offensive team because, you know, sometimes when you're playing on one of these defensive teams, you just run up against an opponent that knows how to break you down. I'm doing a story this week on teams that tried a repeat as a champion and they couldn't get it done. Talking with Aaron Ward, who used to play with the Detroit Red Wings, and the Red Wings, you know, won two cups in the in the 1990s. They tried to win a third in a row. They went up against the Colorado Avalanche team that was super talented.

And the way he described it was we weren't really doing anything different than what we had done in the past because it wasn't working. And I feel like if you're an offensive team like Florida, you've got a lot of options. You know, if the Barkoff lies and scoring, you're a Hibbertoe line there. If the Hibon-Olines and scoring, you've got Bennett and those guys. And I feel like if you're just a defensive team, it's more of a, a, a, malfunction than it is maybe if you're just a really

good offensive team. How did Ovechkin look to you last night? I didn't see, I tried, I was watching both games. I was actually at MSP for a triple overtime game. So I can't really give him a full assessment, but I mean, I don't think any of us were

surprised that he played. I wrote a story earlier this year about him chasing the Gretti record. I was down in Washington reporting on it, and you know, his teammates, Brian McClellan, everyone I talked to you kind of said the same thing about when it came to his longevity, which is we have no concept of how many times this guy played through serious injuries. You know, he just does it. It's the whole Russian machine trope. So the fact that he took a pretty

wicked spill and looked like he hurt his shoulder, you know, and then comes back and plays in game one and plays as effectively as he did, I don't think it's a surprise. Did you think before last night it should have been Vanichick or Samsonoff? Oh, Vanichick all day. Samsonov has been a below replacement player this season. He has done nothing to earn the start in game one of a series. And Vanichick, without question, gave them the best chance of winning. Vanichick's problem this year, I think, has been wide swings of inconsistency.

But as far as the two goalies, I mean, there's no question to my mind which one deserved to get start in game one and which one we're going to give them the best chance of winning game one. We're talking to Greg Wyshinsky, senior NHL writer for ESPN. So I did end up, I mean, I do enjoy playoff hockey and I think, I'm telling you, I think there should be an app that you can, that lets you know when a playoff game in the NHL has gone to overtime and which network to go watch it on, because I'm not sure there's anything really that matches the suddenness and the excitement and the tension of playoff overtime hockey.

And so I watched that, you know, I watched all three overtimes when the Caps game ended and I was, you know, flipping back and forth between Memphis and Golden State. But I was watching that and it was so dramatic. I need to ask you, the goalie that came in for Pittsburgh, you know, Doming, Louis DeMing early in the second overtime or close to midway through the second overtime, has there ever been a situation where you've had a goaltender change in a lengthy overtime game and then have the guy stop 17 shots over the next overtime period and a half? I thought it was remarkable because when he came in, I'm like, this has to be one of the more difficult spots to enter a game as a

replacement that you can have in sports? Oh, without question. It has happened before, but last night was remarkable. It was remarkable because he comes in. He actually told us after the game that he thought the referees were joking with him that he had to come into the game, and they were like, Smith-Levin. And it was at the point where DeMing was so convinced that he was just going to be a spectator, he scarfed down spicy pork and broccoli. between the first and second overtime, which was supposed to be a post-game meal. He's like, I'm not getting it, I'm going to eat whatever.

So he comes in, as you said, stop 17 shots. And the most remarkable thing was he said he wasn't nervous. And he said he wasn't nervous, one, because the first shot that he said he faced, just hit him in the chest, made the save. From that point on, he was pretty confident. And the other thing, too, is I think he was just living on adrenaline. Like he said, this is every kid's dream to come in and play in a Stanley Cup overtime. and he wasn't really thinking about it.

He was just kind of playing his game and played it effectively. So I wonder what we'll see if he has to play games, too. The penguins are sort of non-committal about whether or not they'd need him, saying that Casey dismissed the starter had a lower body injury, but not really saying what his head was. But that triple overtime came in. He did exactly what you want from the back of goal. He would just to come in,

shake off the run very quickly and get the job done. Yeah, Emily Kaplan did that interview with him. It was great. He said spicy pork and broccoli, you know, in between the first and second overtime, and then he ended up playing. I mean, the goaltender for the Rangers stopped 79 shots, people, all right? There were 83 shots on goal in a game. And Schisturkin, I guess is how you pronounce it. I was watching it last night. That's what it sounded like with Sean McDonough. doing the game, who's, by the way, just phenomenal at everything he does. The dude shot 79, and I read in the game recap story earlier this morning,

that's the second most in playoff history in terms of shot stopped by a goaltender. That's a lot of shots on goal. Yeah, yeah, Jonas Corpastallo has the record. He said it in a game one against the lightning during the bubble playoff where he had 85 saves. And listen, I thought, I thought, I thought Chisholkin was going to set the record last night. I mean, that game did not look like it was going to be over anytime soon, and he did a heck of a job.

He's going to win the best trophy this year, the league's best goalie. But, you know, the game ended on that 83rd shot, and I think overshadowed a little bit by all of the goalie drama was how the Penguins won that game. And how they won that game was, with 250 Crosby assists to Jake Gensel to a race of 2-0 Rangers lead, with a Gettini Malkin pass of Brian Russ off of Chris La Tang Pass that tied the game after Chris Crider short-handed goal.

And then in overtime, the triple overtime, with Malkin tipping home the game-winning goal, I mean, that's the script for the penguin. The script is let your stars be your stars, let them make a difference. And in what it has been called, even by Cindy Crosby, potentially the last run for this group together, a pretty impressive way that they won and maybe not the best sign for the Rangers.

All right. Last one for Greg Wysinski. I mean, we've had game ones in all eight of the first round series. So, you know, who did you pick to win the whole thing? I pick Florida. Who'd you have them beating in the Stanley Cup finals? Oh, to beat Minnesota.

So, again, not the best start. But, you know, of the teams early on, I mean, it's really hard to get a handle all what Colorado is just because they're playing a replacement goalie in Nashville, in Dave Riddick. And it's hard. You know, I like to start the Carolina's had in their series of Boston. But again, hard to get a gate there because they just seem like they've got Boston's number. But one team that really impressed me in their game one was Gowdry.

Limiting the Dallas stars, the 16 shots on goal, keeping what is the, been one of the top three lines in hockey, that Jason Robertson, Joe Pavelski, Rubei Hintz line for Dallas, completely off the board and also didn't get one single high-danger shot attempt in that game. Calgary is a team that can beat you offensively and beat you defensively, and they really flexed that game one in an impressive way. Boy, that crowd was amazing at the beginning of that game. Real quickly, this may be a totally irrelevant question in this sport. But is there a preference for ratings, for interest in terms of a Stanley Cup final when we get to June? Would they prefer to see big market teams like L.A. in New York?

Or would they prefer to see, you know, Ovechkin in the final or Crosby in the final? What's the preference? Like, what would be the ideal Stanley Cup final? Well, I don't know if I can really speak on that, being I'm a right shoulder now. You know, I don't want to speak out of turn on that one, but I will say that traditionally hockey fans gravitate more to the teams that they know versus the players they know. But I also think that in the East, you do have a story that will resonate beyond hockey, which is the league. I mean, anytime you get a team that has a League Cup playoff, a Theta, a Stanley Cup victory,

drought that tracks back to 1967 and is you know a market that has such incredible energy and enthusiasm like Toronto does that I'm playing for a cup you're going to get a lot of casual sports fans that might not otherwise watch the final

be interested in the final just for the history of it all yeah they haven't won the cup since 67 and they haven't won a series since like 2003 or something like that 2004 2004 yeah so So, right, so your deal, and then on top of that, obviously, you've got, you know, one of the biggest stars in the game, and off the Matthews is an American kid. So there's a lot of, there's a lot, I think getting those elites in there would be a real boon for the league, no matter who they play, but I'm sure, like, if the NHL had its brothers, they'd probably want, you know, either a big market, like, you know,

Well, I just say an enthusiastic market in the U.S., like Minnesota or St. Louis, but obviously like a Colorado-Turano final would be like the biggest money series, probably on the table. Yeah. Thank you for doing this as always. It was great. Hope you're well. Yep. Absolutely.

Thanks for having me. Steve Sands next to talk about the Wells Fargo, which is in town at Avonel. But we'll end up talking more, I'm sure, about the draft and about the Caps win last night. That's what he will prefer to talk about. So we will do a lot of that as well. Right after these words from a few of our sponsors. All right. Joining us right now is my good friend Steve Sands with the Golf Channel with NBC.

Golf Channel's got Thursday, Friday, Saturday morning, and Sunday morning coverage of the Wells Fargo Championship, which will be played at Avenel this weekend in Potomac. Steve's in town for it. Of course, this is the last thing he wants. to talk about. He wants to spend time talking about the draft, the caps win last night, which he will probably make fun of me about. But can we just start with golf and then we'll work our way back? First of all, for those that are just tuning in, why is the Wells Fargo being played at Avenel this

weekend? The President's Cup is at Quail Hollow in Charlotte, Kevin, and the President's Cup is in September. So they didn't want to have the event this week. at the same event it's going to be staged in September. They do that periodically, depending on where major championships, Rotter Cups and President's Cups are played later in the year. So they moved the Wells Fargo from Quail Hollow in Charlotte for one year to Potomac, Maryland. They'll go back to the regular schedule next year after the President's Cup is staged at Quail Hollow in Charlotte this September.

Do players still dislike Avanelle like they used to, the old Avanelle, or do they like it more now than they used to back in the day? Those who have played it before like it more now. It does not have the greatest reputation in the world from the PGA Tour standpoint because, as a lot of guys have famously said over the years, it's really difficult to drive past congressional to then play a PGA Tour event. And, you know, it's gotten better over the years. Gilhans, the course designer architect has made.

it better, the improvements have shown. The golf course is tough. I wouldn't call it the most popular venue in the world, but it's certainly not load the way it was in years past. Just out of curiosity because a lot of golfers from the area listen to the podcast. I hear from them quite often, and I understand, and it's the long-running joke about you have to drive by congressional to get to Abenel, and that's the biggest problem. But what is it? about the course that they don't like? Even this newer, you know, and it's not super new anymore, but it's not the old Avonel. What don't they like about it specifically? I mean, I think it's brutal to play for, you know, a mid-to-high handicapper, it's really hard. But what are the

pros hate about it or dislike about it? Well, I think that's the issue. The thing on the PGA tour, you know, the same thing when we're playing too, Kevin. When you hit a good shot, want to be rewarded. When you get a bad shot, it's okay to get punished. Everybody understands that. It seems like in the old days, and it's better now, although it's a very, very difficult golf course. But back in the old days, they didn't get rewarding for good shots enough. They had funky bounces. The greens weren't up to PJTor snuff. It was just too difficult. And when you're trying to, you know, put together a golf course, it's not easy. You know, 51 weeks a year, people like me and you play.

One week a year, the greatest players on the planet play. And it's very difficult for a course designer for the PGA tour, for the people who run PPC-Botomac at Aval. It's just really, really hard to get it right. And they've improved the nuances of it from when it was really, really hated by a lot of the guys on the tour. but it's just hard it's really really hard and it's unrelenting

and again if you hit a good shot you should be rewarded if you had a bad shot you should be punished sometimes at Avenel it doesn't always work out that way you know it's not the greatest field that we see for some of the more popular events

at popular venues but it's not a bad field this week I mean you know Rory's here and and and Webb Simpson and Tony Fee now and Paul Casey and Patrick Reed and Jason Day and, you know, guys like Sergio over here, Max Homas here. There's some really good players.

It's not, you know, a star-studded field, but Rory being here, you know, makes it, you know, feel like a big deal, don't you think? 100%. There are two things that make a PGA tour tournament great. It's the field and it's the date. And, you know, the date, you know, look, the weather's not so great. in D.C. right now, but it could have been 72 and sunny.

You just never know. The field is what makes the fans come out. What is what makes the, you know, the energy rise. And Rory's here for a couple of reasons. One is, you know, he really likes playing in the area. You want a U.S. Open

a congressional down the street from PC Battar. Like, and also is the defending champion of the Wells Fargo. And, you know, almost every single player on the PGA tour honors the commitment of going back to the event, even if it's at a different place. He has a lot of success at Quail Hollow. He had a ton of success there at the Wells Fargo.

They've been very good to him. He's been very good to the tournament, the city of Charlotte, and Quail Hollow, the golf course. So even though it said Avedel this year at TBC Potomac. I keep saying Avedo, but TBC Potomac. That, you know, he wanted to honor that commitment. But, yeah, there's no, no question that a field can make a week. And there are a lot of good players.

in this field. 16 of the top 50 are here. So golf fans in the area should get out and enjoy it. Rory won at Congressional in 2011 with that unbelievable score on a course that was really damp and, you know, humid and the whole thing. I don't know if you've looked at the weather for this weekend. I'm sure you have. I'm actually going to be in state college for my youngest son's graduation from Penn State.

and it's going to be like in the high 40s, low 50s with driving rain on Friday and Saturday. And it's going to be pretty chilly and wet here as well. So we'll see. By the way, you know, for those that, you know, are golfers in the area, I mean, I'm wondering, has Rory played congressional for any event, the Tiger event, or anything like that since the open in 2011? I don't think he has, actually. I was going to look that up the other day, and I forgot to do it. And I got caught up on the NHL, the NBA playoffs, whatever it was,

and I stopped looking at my notes and stuff. But I was thinking about that the other day, and I don't believe he has. Because you know it's a complete, the blue course is a completely redone course. It's a, it's a links course now. Oh, yeah, it's completely different. And now that they, you know, kind of, the USDA, didn't have the U.S. Open come back there in 2026, which was, you know, as a local kid, Kevin, I thought it was an atrocious decision by the U.S.GA to not have the 250-year anniversary of

the country in the nation's capital at Congressional, which is hosted three U.S. opens. Three of them, by the way, memorable U.S. opens. Ernie Else winning was a great one. Rory McElroy winning his first major coming off the debacle of the Masters was tremendous. I know he won by eight shots, but it was still a tremendous U.S. Open. And the Ken Venturi won with the heat stroke. With Raymond Floyd. And the famous one as well. Yeah.

So, you know, to bypass the U.S. Open bypassing 2026 at Congressional, I thought it was a horrific decision. I'm not biased because I'm from here. And they switched over to the PGA of America. They changed the golf course. They're going to have a Ryder Cup there. They're going to have a PGA championship there in years to come. and, you know, it's Congressional. It's a great venue.

It's a story venue. And I don't think Rory has come back to play there. At the top of my head, I don't think he's come back to play there. But it's shame that congressional is not still in the U.S. Open rotation because it belongs there. Well, he's not going to recognize it. Have you played it? I have not played it. But I've heard about all the changes.

And by the way, I laugh when you said about the weather. Like you, You know, all sportscasters are amateur weather forecasters because that's what we do. Before I pack every single week to go on the road, the first thing I do is go to weather.com and check out the app or whatever just to see what the forecast is. So yeah, the forecast this week is not great. Not great at all. Okay.

Let's get to – oh, one more golf-related question. Is Tiger going to play Southern Hills? It certainly would appear that way, right? Yeah, I think he's going to play. think you would have gone there on the reconnaissance mission if he wasn't serious about playing. You went and played there last week. A lot can happen in the next couple of weeks, health was. But I think he just has his heart set on playing the major championships, maybe playing

the memorial Jack Nicholson tournament. You know, two weeks before the U.S. open two weeks after the PGA championship, but that'll be predicated on whether his body is feeling. okay after four days at Southern Hills. And it'll be great to see him there, just like it was at Augusta, but I cannot imagine that he's not going to play there after going to play a practice around there. And will Phil be playing the PGA championship to defend his title at Southern Hills? It's amazing that Phil would be a larger question mark than Tiger at this point. You know, I hope so, Kevin. Look, the guy is a top ten or two.

player in the history of the sport. He became the oldest major champion in the history of the sport last year. And again, it's not like a fluke winner. I'm talking about Phil Mickelson. For him to not receive the love and adulation he deserves as a defending champion of a PGA championship when he gets introduced

on the first year in a couple of weeks of Southern Hills, if he's not there, doesn't receive that, that'd be a shame. I realize what's taking place. I know what he said. You could debate whether or not it was offensive or not. There is no debate that he probably could, he should have kept his mouth shut.

But, you know, whether he said something that was offensive to people or not, you know, that's up to others to decide. I just think when you're Phil Mickelson and did the defending champion, you deserve to receive the love that a defending champion receives, especially at a major championship in a moment like that. And, you know, I haven't spoken to him in a while, and I cannot imagine what's going on his mind and what's going on in his world. but it'd be great if he came back and played.

I think you did this the last time, but for those that didn't hear it, Steve Sands is with us. I'm not sure everybody has kept up to speed as to what the issue with Phil Mickelson is and, you know, what he said related to the Super Golf League, you know, in Saudi. And if you could sum it up for everybody in like 30 to 60 seconds, I think that'd be helpful for people. All right. So Phil Mecholson is one of the faces of this new rival league is called Livgolf, LIV. Most of the money is being funded by the Saudis, and they're trying to create a world tour. And it's going to basically rival the PGA tour, and they're trying to get PGA tour players to play in it. So the rub there is the PGA tour says, no, you can't play.

And the PGA tour players are saying, wait a second, we're individual. contract just we can play wherever we want. So they're arguing back and forth. Most people have been very quiet about it. Phil, like he always has been, has been open and honest with his opinions, and it got him in a little bit of trouble. He said a lot of things that he shouldn't have said about the PGA tour, that he seemed like he wasn't grateful for the opportunity he's had over the last 30 years.

He made fun of the commissioner, Jay Monaghan. He took a shot at the Saudi government for some of the United States. some of the human rights issues over there. So he tried to play both sides of the fence, and he got himself in trouble. You know, basically put his foot in his mouth, Kevin. It's not like he offended one person or another or one, you know, subject matter or another or one religious aspect or men or women or whatever. He just said a lot of things he probably should have kept to himself.

Yeah, you know, he, as you said, you know, claim the PGA tour wasn't sharing enough of its revenue with the players and then with respect to the new tour he called the Saudi scary, you know, said that they, you know, killed Khashoggi, have a horrible record on human rights, they execute people over there for being gay. And so he was, you know, going after both spots and then a lot of the comments, especially specific to Saudi Arabia, whether you agree with them or not, there were a lot of people that were upset by them and Phil kind of went into hiding. Now, the comments that he made were to Alan, the guy, Alan, what's his name? Alan Shipnuck. Shipnuck. Yeah. Now, they were for this book that Shipnuck is writing, and one of the

answers I forget, and I know you told me this, but did Mickelson think those comments would be made public? I don't think he did. They were on the record, and he's a 51-year-old man. 52 next week. Next month. He's not a rookie. He knew what he was doing. They were on the record. There was no debate on that.

Listen, Kevin, to put it in a gambling parliance, we've all been there. We take one side. We look at it and go, wait a second. The line moved enough. I'm going to try to middle it. He tried the middle both sides of this thing, and he really screwed it up. And he put his foot to his mouth, and he said some things he shouldn't have said. But if you look at what he said in its totality,

you know, he didn't, like, destroy one side or the other, or he didn't say anything that was offensive to anybody, you know, in a religious sense or that kind of thing. And he just talked too much, and he shouldn't have, but he's always been that way, but it's always been part of his charm. In this particular case, he really stepped in it because he kind of alienated himself from the PGA tour. and then he kind of alienated himself from the people who were paying him live golf from his other league and now again there's that middle reference he's kind of

stuck in the middle there and he's got to pick aside and he's kind of gone into hiding since then by the way every one of his sponsors dropped him and that revenue stream has has shut down for him he's got plenty of money and he's made a lot of money over the years but, you know, he's not playing golf and he's not, you know, earning any money from his sponsors. It's a big, big shock to his system. Yeah. Rip the PGA and, you know, went after a country that does have not a great human rights record and certainly not a great history of treating women.

Yeah. No, I know that, but Kevin, you know what? You can make a strong case that you could argue about almost every country. Of course. human rights and it's past and all that stuff. He just shouldn't have set it out loud the way he did it with such conviction. You're a professional golfer. Stay out of the political realm.

Phil's got all the answers. Phil's always had all the answers, right? But he's always been that way. And again, that's part of his charm. But this time it got him in trouble. What's that famous line from Michael Jordan that both Republicans and Democrats by Nike? Yeah, right. You know, it's like, you know, how about staying your own?

on late. Let's put it that one. Yeah. Phil, Phil's pretty confident that he's got all the answers. By the way, the middle of game analogy wasn't exactly spot on, because when you middle a game and you don't hit both sides, all you do is lose juice. He lost a lot more than juice in this particular scenario. Ten years ago, I don't think a sponsor drops him for this, but we're obviously living through different times. I think he'll be, my personal feeling is, he will be welcomed back by the significant majority of golf fans, and they'll be excited to see him play if he defends his PGA title at Southern Hills at the end of this month.

Totally. Totally. Totally. All right. Redskins. Washington Commanders draft. Go ahead. Well, I think I heard you and Ben on the show.

I heard you, you know, go through it, the whole thing the last few days. The Sam Halp thing is the biggest piece of the puzzle. If this kid turns out to be a starting quarterback for the commanders for the next 12, 15 years after the Wendt project is through, whether it's successful or not. Then this draft is not going to matter about Brian Robinson. It's not going to matter about the linemen. It's not going to matter about the receiver from Penn State.

None of it's going to matter. If this kid can play quarterback, that's going to make the draft successful. I thought it was a nice move to go from 11 to 16 and still get one of the guys you really wanted. I know they wanted Drake London, but when Drake was off the board, they got the picks back that they lost in the West Street, which I thought was a good move,

and they got a receiver who they really liked. I happen to think that this kid's going to be a better pro than a lave. Just based on a couple of coaches I know in college, who know both players. And, you know, I think the Robinson pick clearly means that Gibson, A, fumbles too much, or B, isn't getting the yardage that they think he should be getting when he has the ball and doesn't fumble. Even though I like Antonio Gibson, clearly they made a pick for that reason.

The other, the lineman, I forget, is named out from Alabama. Matthews. Clearly, they're not going to sign, right there, you know, Matt. Clearly, they're not going to sign all those guys. It looks like Duran Payne is going to be the odd man out there as far as contracts go. So that seemed like a salary cap thing. I don't know. I thought it was a good drive. I think the house thing, look, man, if that guy can play, Kevin, in the NFL,

I mean, then you just stole a pick with the first pick in the fifth round. I mean, that's the key to the whole thing. You can't win in this league without a quarterback, and they're going to give it a shot with Carson Went. And by the way, how about to start this kid? I'm not trying to say anything bad about Dwayne Haskin, especially after what happened recently, but how about him just going right to 14th?

and not even asking about seven, all right? I mean, that's a good start for Sam Hal. So I like what the skins did. And I trust Rivera. I trust the instincts. I also think the offensive linemen that they just signed, Trey Turner is a big signing for that team. And I think they had a good last couple of weeks.

I think I mentioned this in the open to the show. I'm forgetting because it was all of 25, 30 minutes ago. But I would urge everybody to listen to my interview with Phil Longo. Phil is the offensive coordinator and quarterbacks coach at North Carolina. He coached Sam Howe the last couple of years, and he was just really good in talking about what Howl is as a person and who he believes his comp is. Now, he didn't say that he was Drew Breeze,

but he said that he plays like Drew Breeze when he gets into an NFL system. They didn't have an NFL system at North Carolina, but he feels like he can play the kind of football that Drew Brees played. You know, quick twitch, quick release, excuse me, accurate, can throw the football. And he said what NFL guys are going to realize is, you know, this guy ran for 800 yards last year, but he can really sling it,

and he's got a very quick release and quick processing. Obviously, coach to me a once. Look, Larry Fedora was the coach before Matt Brown in North Carolina. Carolina. I've known later for a long time. You know, Larry coached a lot of great players over the years. I remember when he said Des Bryant was going to be an outstanding NFL wide receiver. And until, you know, what happened to him at the very end, he was. There are a lot of things that Larry Fedora knows about the game, knows about people, personnel,

how they'll fit at the next level. He thinks Sam Howe is going to be a very good quarterback in the NFL. And I trust Larry Fedora. Did you talk to Larry Fedora? Yeah. Yeah, I've known Larry a long time. Did he have Hal as a freshman? Or as a...

I believe it. Because Mac Brown replaced Fedora, right? Mac Brown replaced Fedora. I think Fedora had him. I know he recruited him. Did he have him for one year or two years? I forget with COVID. How many years these guys played?

You know what I mean? I know. Like, I forget. get how many years, but I think that, listen, you know this, Kevin. You can't win in this league without a quarterback, all right? And if this kid can play the way people think that he might be able to, and if he reaches his full potential, then it's one of the great steals that commanders have ever had in the history of the franchise draft-wise, but you have to wait and see. That's why the draft is so, you know, I've been listening to your show every day, but the last

couple days, especially, you know, everybody's right when they say, they can't judge a draft on draft night or draft day, the three days. You've got to wait and see how it plays out over the next three or four years. And, you know, if Hal can play in the NFL, believe me, people will look at the 2022 NFL draft and say Washington got an A. So Hal actually got there after Fedora had gone and Mac Brown was hired. He actually originally committed to Florida State, then flipped to Carolina with the Mac Brown hiring. So he got there, I think, right when Fador left.

I think Fador's last year was maybe 18, and the first year for Mac Brown was 2019. Okay, the Caps got a big win in game one. I know this is such a passion for you, the Capitals. I did watch the whole game start to finish. I also stayed up and watched the Rangers Penguins triple overtime game. That was thrilling, by the way. But you didn't think the Caps had a chance to win this series before last night, did you?

Absolutely, I did. Absolutely. Are you kidding? Listen, that isn't the NBA. Right, it's the NHL playoffs. Of course. Anything can happen. The NBA, by the way, the Caps have a veteran team.

the core of which has won a Stanley Cup. Now, over the last couple of years, it's been bizarre. When they lost the three-one lead and they lost game seven to Carolina after they were defending the Cup, that was a horrific first-round loss and was just like all the other horrific first-round losses they've had over the years. But they got away with it because the Cup was won a year prior. So having said that, Florida can be beat. You know, this team hasn't won a first-round series. Since 1996, Kevin.

Right? Yeah. Come on. So if the Caps can win this series, if you can get physical with them, which they did last night, even when they were down to one and third, I'm looking at my youngest son, Eric, is the only son we have home because the other two are in college. And he's looking at him, he goes, I don't know, Dad. I go, Eric, I'm telling you, he says, hang in there.

Let's see what happened. And sure enough, you know, Ovechkin makes a great play on defense, of all things. and because that's, you know, again, he buries the puck, and then all of a sudden, Backstrom comes up with incredible pass, which is the reason he's going to go into Hall of Fame, and his number 19 is going to be in the Rafters in a few years at Capital One Arena downtown, because he makes a great pass to T.J.O. She was 77 also might be in the rafters one day,

and he buried that puck for the win. So absolutely the Caps can win this series. It was a great win last night. And for the love of God, I'll never understand. I mean, nobody loves sports as much. Here it comes. Here it comes. I mean,

but, Kapp, you and I've been friends for a couple of decades, man, I've known you a long time, and I love you, truly love you,

and your passion for sports is like mine. You love everything. You love the Bullets Wizard. You love the Nats. You love the everything. You love Maryland, everything.

You don't love the Cavalters? Everything. You don't love the cats? I never have. Enough. What do you want me to say to you? I mean, this was...

You are a war. You're a Washington. By the way, one of the things that's beautiful about our city, Kevin, is that there aren't a lot of people who are born and raised here, all right? We are born and raised here. I think it's an underrated thing about our city. I don't think people understand how many people are lifelong Washingtonians in the city. But it doesn't matter. Here's my answer to this. stayed up to watch the Rangers and Penguins. Two teams we blow. I like playoff hockey. I love playoff hockey. I enjoy the drama of overtime playoff hockey.

I think there should be an app that you download that gives you a heads up. It gives you a little bit of a jingle when an NHL game is going to overtime in the postseason and directs you towards the network that it's running on because that's how much I love overtime hockey. in the NHL playoffs. Look, the Caps came here in 19... But you don't love the home, but you don't love the hometown team? The Caps came here in 1974. I was, I, you know... Is your parents not taking a game when you were a kid? Not once. Not once. What? What's funny is my father loves hockey now, but he never loved it. I was a basketball player.

I was a football player. I played baseball. I played the sports that kids who grew up in the 70s and 80s played, especially if you went to public school. I'm the same age as you are. I didn't have hockey as an option. There wasn't a frozen pond around the corner from my house. And the caps. It's not about that. And the caps during my formative years sucked.

So I never, I just never got into it. What do you want me to tell you? Are you an Orioles fan? Are you an Orioles fan? I told this story at my mother's eulogy three years ago. One of my fondest memories. Look, I grew up in the city, going to public school, and I loved everything. every team in Washington, and I was a big Orioles fan growing up.

Why were you an Orioles fan? You're a Washingtonian. You're a Washingtonian. I'll tell you why. Because my parents, my father especially, because he's from Brooklyn, but my parents took me to a couple of Orioles games as a kid because they wanted us to go to all these different tournament. We went to hockey games as a kid because the caps were our team.

And one of my favorite stories I told, and my mother's eulogy three years ago was when We used to play the Islanders when they were so great, and they were in all those Stanley Coffered, 80s, and they were so great. Billy Smith. Billy Smith. Everybody's yelling at Bossey, and everybody's, Billy Smith, the goalie, the whole thing.

They were screaming at Bobby Nystrom. He had that long, blonde hair, like Golden Richards. Right. The wide receiver for the Cowboys. And everybody in the whole arena at the Capitol Center, Nice drums, a woman, nice drums, a woman. And me and my brothers are sitting there with my dad, and we're like, oh, we better not say that because mom might get mad.

and look to my left, and my mom standing up with a psalm-com, screaming nice from the woman. Same thing. So how could you not love the cats? You're from Washington. That's ridiculous. I can't explain it. I don't know why. It was not, you know, the teams that I'm fans of are the teams really that my father was super into.

My father was, you know, we had red skin season tickets. We had Terps tickets. And I was a massive Bullets fan because I was also into. basketball. I didn't know anything about hockey. I wasn't interested in hockey. Now, did you hear me rattle off Mike Bossy and Billy Smith? I do remember those first playoff teams. I was in college, and those first playoff teams, I remember, you know, listening to Ron Weber call the home games because they weren't on TV. So I was into it briefly, but I just never had the passion for it. Sorry.

I just find that amazing. You can be passionate about playoff hockey. You can be passionate about watching a Penguins Rangers game, which I watched also, by the way. The wrong team won that game. I was hoping New York would win. But I just find it amazing.

When the Nats came to D.C., I took my kids who were just born. I took them to a game at RFC because I wanted them to see and feel what R&A was like because they never got a chance to see it when the skins were getting that place jumping. So I became a Nets fan because if it's in D.C., I'm rooting for it. I can care less about soccer.

Never watched a soccer game in my life. But every once in a while when I see this scroll on the score, and it's on the bottom of ESPN and it says DC United won one-one-nothing, I smile. I go, okay, we want. I don't even, I don't know one person on the team. You care less. Don't even know what the stadium is.

But I just, it's D.C., Kevin. You're a sports guy. Come up, man. Here's, who's the, name one player on the MLS, D.C. United Team for a hundred bucks. Oh, I literally couldn't do it. Yeah. Yohan Kroft. Now I saw Yohan Krofe play in the 70s at RFC Stadium.

I went to a birthday party for, I forget who the kid was now. But the father. The father got tickets to a diplomats game, so I do remember that. But the point is, is like, If you don't know one player you haven't watched one game and you're not really into it, why do you force yourself to be a big fan? So if DC United makes it to the, didn't they win some titles? I think they did along the way.

I have no idea. But Kevin, that's not the point. The point is you just said you love playoff hockey. I do like playoff hockey, but I can't watch it during the regular season. But you don't live in Fargo. You live in D.C. where, by the way, we have a team. Yeah.

Well. By the way, a team that regularly sells out, regularly wins, has the greatest athlete in the history of this city ever. He's surpassing Daryl Green. He's surpassing Sammy Ball. He's surpassing Walter Johnson. Tommy called him a treasonist. He's the greatest team sport athlete in the history of D.C.

By the way, never a contract issue. I'll do my best with the game tomorrow night. By the way, they have two of our four teams that have changed their names for God's sake. The caps have stayed the same. That's true. I mean, I don't know what more you'll want from. I can only, you know what?

It's either in you, it's either in you or it isn't. It's not in me. I don't care if they win or lose. I loved when they won game five. in Vegas. I loved this game seven went over Tampa. To see the Ovechkin joy in particular, the Baxterum Joy, these guys that had 10,000 pound gorillas lifted off their back. As a sports fan, I really could appreciate that. But no, it's not, it's just not for what I can't, I really can't explain it other than I've just never really been into hockey. It's the only sport of the four

major professional sports I've never played. I can barely skate. Actually, I think I could get out on skates and move around. I did that as a kid occasionally. But I don't know. I can't explain it. But I don't know that you're very passionate, you know, presentation and pitch is going to change my mind.

I doubt it will. Well, but here's the thing. You and I are the same age. We're from the same place. We've been born and raised skins at RFK to the core. Born and raised bullets to the core. born and raised turkey to the core. Baseball, but it was the Orioles, and now it's the Nats.

A little bit of a funky deal, but I do love the Nats, and I don't care about the Orioles anymore. I want them to win, but I'd rather have the Nats win. If they played each other in a World Series, I mean, that would be like the eighth one of the world. If they played each other in World Series, I would root for the net. The caps literally are the one constant in our sports life. I talked about that yesterday on the show.

14 out of the last 15 years. True. They're the most, they're really, when you think about it, I mean, obviously the football team has three Lombardi trophies. So, you know, you take that and that's number one. But in terms of a consistent, sustained winner, you know, pre-Ovechkin, I know there were some years there where it didn't happen for them, but they were, you know, they developed that rivalry with Pittsburgh, not during the Ovechkin. Ovechkin years, but before the Ovechkin years. So they are really, you know, in terms of wins and number of playoff seasons, now it's easier

to make the playoffs in the NHL than it is in the NFL, more than half the teams make it. But yeah, no, I get it. I get how successful they are. And as much as, you know, I'm not the biggest Ted Leonces fan, and I think he's gotten a free pass in this town in many ways, as they all have, because Dan Snyder owns the Washington commanders. way he deserves all of the disdain he gets. But the one thing that I would say about Ted, you know, he's a decent owner, not a great owner of the basketball team, but whatever.

But he knows how to deal with customers and he knows how to create a really good customer experience. And he's done that with the hockey games. I go to hockey games. I actually did not go this year and didn't go, I guess, last year. But I usually go to three or four a year and usually a playoff game or two, and I enjoy the atmosphere. I'm just not hardcore rooting for them, that's all. I'd be totally disingenuous if I tried to act like I did. What? What would you give? What would you give to have Abe Poland be alive again to talk some sense into the city and to Snyder

and to get a football stadium back in a city? when A. Poland got the arena built downtown from the capital center and Landover. It changed the city. It changed sports fans. It changed neighborhoods. It changed people's economic outlook in that area. It changed everything. And then Lianz got on board, and he has made it even better than it was as far as a fan experience.

Yeah. And I just think that the caps that kind of, woven themselves. I know it's the fourth of four sports. Hockey will always be the fourth of four sports. And I don't watch 82 games. I watch all the playoff games. You know, if I'm watching a Caps regular season game, it's because there's really not a lot else going on as far as the whole two and a half hours or two hours and 45 minutes. But I love watching the Caps. They are so entertaining to watch. It is a great fan experience in person. Hockey in person, by the way, is arguably the best sports experience.

I don't disagree with that. I think it's a phenomenal sport to be there live for. It's spectacular. And the arena is great. The fan base is great, too. They make the environment great. Fan base is great. Everything about it's great.

And I don't know. You're such a huge sports fan. You and I share that love of sports and all that stuff. And, you know, look, you're going to go this weekend and you're going to graduate your youngest son from Penn State. And it's going to be one of the great moments. That should anger you more because Scott's not happy about that. The only thing that will anger me about that is if you tell me that I know how great the Penn State experience is on the whiteout.

I would never root for them. Come on. If you rooted for me. My son doesn't even root for them. He's gone to every single Maryland game football or basketball played while he's there while he's been there and he's rooted for Maryland. What? You know what that's called? Good parenting. That's called good parenting. That's what that's called. All right.

I'm done with you. I appreciate the passion. And I'll be watching tomorrow night, and we will definitely talk before Southern Hills in a few weeks. Thanks for doing this. Cats are going to win this series, Kevin. And you're going to be a fan in round two.

Who would they play in round two? The Rangers' Penguins winner? Is that how it works? I guess it depends on how it all plays out, but it would be amazing if it was, I don't want to play them because I hate them, but it'd be amazing. Actually, I think that would be dramatic. I think that would be great for the sport, and to see Caps, penguins again in the postseason would be great. And the last time they played them, correct me, if I'm wrong, was on the way to the Stanley Cup. That was the Cousie goal in overtime, right? With the goal in overtime. My God. There are very few times where I've actually

cried in sports. Oh, come on. Really? Oh, my God. I cried when the Terps won the national championship. I cried the first time. I cried. I think I may have cried when Riggins broke through McNeil's tackle on the fourth and one.

I definitely cried when the caps won the Stanley Cup. I did not cry when the Nats won. I don't know. I love the Nats, but they're not in the DNA just yet. But I did love that moment. But absolutely. That's a good topic. That's a good topic. In just the second round, I'm telling you, I had my head buried in my hand, and I was tearing up.

Whether, you know, for those listening, you outwardly cried or you had a major lump in your throat or you got really emotional. What are the games? I can tell you right now, the two for me. The NFC championship game, you know, after the 82 skins, the January 83 championship. You came against Dallas. Were you at the game? I was at the game. I was at the game, and I remember I could not stop tearing up.

I was like, I just kept crying. I think it's the most excited and emotional I've ever been. It's also, and I've said this probably a thousand times on radio or even on this podcast, it is by far and away, and nothing's a close second. For me, the most unbelievably here. heated, bloodthirsty, electric sports environment I have ever been in. I've been to a Yankee, I've been to a Yankee playoff game, I've been to a Knicks playoff game, I've been to a lot of really good sporting events, as you have had. I've never been into a stadium 45 minutes before

the game started where there wasn't an empty seat in the stadium in unison was chanting, we want Dallas. I don't think I've ever felt that way. And look, Cole gave us a lot of those memories and Xfinities given the other one for me and God Gary and I were having this conversation I think on this podcast recently because it was the 2002

national championship team 20 year anniversary to me the most I was obviously emotional when they won the national championship but the most moved I ever was to the point where my wife was like did they win the championship because she's not much of a sports

fan when she saw my reaction was when they beat Stanford to go to their first final four. Because I had waited my entire life to go to the final four and how many times were we in the mix thought to be a final four team and lost games that we shouldn't have lost on the way to the final four. And that moment when they beat Stanford in Anaheim in 2001 was, that was an incredible, incredible feeling of, you know, and it's funny about college basketball, right? Steve, it's like it's the one sport where the championship obviously is the ultimate, but the final four, making the final four, feels like you accomplished almost the pinnacle in the sport as well. There's no other sport like that. Making the final four is like a, the accomplishment. And then you want to win it once you get there.

Listen, if you think about the way college basketball is structured, Tom is, though, one his only, he won one national championship 22 years ago. But he's been to a thousand final fours, so everybody considers him, you know, a top two, three, four coach, you know, in the last 50 years in the sport. Making the final fours years, when they beat Stanford, Kevin, my God, I was weeping, man. I remember crying like a baby, but there's nothing. Nothing. By the way, I cried like a baby when we won the Stanley Cup in game five. I remember sitting in my chair, and my wife and kids were just like, wow. Like, Dad just sitting there blowing.

Because it's just been a whole lifetime of heartbreak, and it was just an amazing feeling. But there is nothing in the world that will ever replace. Maybe because of the age we were, Kevin, because of the venue, RFK, because it was the first time. The Cowboys. There was nothing like that cowboy game. That cowboy game, man, there was nothing. Ever, ever is going to replace that. Man, that atmosphere was so charged.

I remember driving to the game, and we part, my dad used to park at the Armory, and we used to walk in, just like you said, 45, 60 minutes before the game, there was no messing around, man. There was no tailgated. There was nothing. You were going in, and you were locked in, man. They were playing the arch rival to get to a Super Bowl. Oh, my God.

That place was jumping from the start, man. Never. I mean, we... chills. My eyes are tearing up talking about it. We were the family. We were the family that literally would arrive as Mark Mosley was running up to boot the opening kickoff. Or, you know, or Mike Nelms was waiting for the kickoff deep. We were not a get-there-early family.

But for that game, my father with my brother and I said, we are leaving early, and we were in that stadium an hour before kickoff, and it was just a scene that particular day. I have one last question for you, because I think what makes that also such a special memory for those of us that experienced it was that it was against the Cowboys. And, you know, there are people that are older. I was at this game, but I was a very young child,

but my father and my uncle took me to this game, the 72 championship game. but I don't remember that like the 83 championship game. My question to you is, because it was Dallas, do you feel the same way, and be totally honest here, do you feel the same way about the penguins that you feel about the Cowboys and Duke? Yes.

Really? 100%. Because of Sidney Crosby. Now, when Crosby goes away, you know, after he retired. I mean, an all-time great players. There's no debate on that. But I can't.

I mean, I've been to sports, because I've never met the guy, I can't stand him to the point where it's almost like literally looking at a Dallas cowboy or a Duke Blue Devil. I can't stand the Pittsburgh Penguins. Literally hate them. And I preach to my kids all the time.

Hate anger and jealousy or wasted emotions, except for sport. And in sports, oh, I can't stand the Penguins. I can't stand Crosby. He's a whiting, snivoli baby. There's always just bitching about everything. I can't stand the guy.

Yes. Okay. That's it. Tom Mizzow, by the way, you brought him up. Eight final fours and only one title, but still, eight final fours. Eight of them. And just one title. And by the way, as you said, that supersedes the one title.

people people will say in the same sentence you know one title eight final fours it's the only sport like that nobody ever said uh andy reed one title but six championship games no you know nobody ever said that right it's only in college basketball is it like that i still agree with you on that stanford thing now that i think about it

you know in Atlanta when they won the title was great by the way the game was a it was a tough game to watch right it was a it was not a good game to watch the whole thing. But when they beat Stanford to get to the final four that first time, Mike Montgomery was coaching then. It was a, that was a momentous, momentous occasion for those of us like me and you were, you know, life-born fans. And it was, it was for all of the, you had to have lived through all of those teams that were so good and so capable of winning the whole thing that just always came up short for whatever reason, you know, whether it was left. That's why the caps in 2018, Kevin.

No, I understand. You know what? 100% right. For those that were pained by one, you know, blown 3-1 series loss after another to the Penguins or one game seven loss at home to Montreal or anybody else after another to finally, you know, get that Stanley Cup, it was, you know, those that really paid the price with those emotions

for all of those years, it's emotional. I get it. I mean, that's how I felt when Maryland went to the Final Four for the first time. It's the way I felt when they beat the Cowboys, even though they had gone to a Super Bowl, they had never won one. But there was something about that day in that game. 100%. Yeah, that was amazing.

All right. Listen, man, when we lost to Michigan State, you know, in the last second, when we probably went on to the Final Four. Yeah, Corey Lucius. devastating. Probably would have because the bracket opened up for us and we were going to go to the final four. You know, like, they're devastating losses and then there are memorable wins.

Both can equally make you cry. And it's just, by the way, bring it back to what golf sense, okay, because that's where we started. People need to understand just how hard it is to win. You can be the best team and just not get the right bounce or the right this or right that. You just never know. And, you know, Davis Club, the third one, one major, and that was it.

Fred Couples won one major. That was it. You know, I mean, Justin Thomas won a major five years ago. Has it won one since. Jason Day won one, seven years ago. Has it won one since. It's really hard to win in sports. So when you do win one, of course you look back at all the pain that it took to get there,

all the losses, all the weird things. But cherish them, the thought of the win, man. Because the wins are what get you through. I ask athletes all the time, Kim. I don't know if you ever ask this question. It's one of my favorite questions to ask an athlete. What do you remember more? The wins or the losses?

I have. And I love that question because most great athletes will tell you. The losses. The losses are seared in them. Yes. They're seared in them. That they expect to win, that they always expect to win because that's how great they are. but the losses are just searing in their brain forever.

Well, making it somewhat relatable but not really. What do you remember more, your big gambling wins or your hideous bad beats? Well, it's the bad beats that you remember the most. How many times, come on, how many times in your life have you shared a story about a blackjack table story? Oh. They shared a blackjack table story. Have you ever in your life told a story when you're on a heater? No.

You tell the story when you get eights on a six, and then you get another eight, and you get a fourth eight, and then you get a two, and you double it to get a ten for twenty. Then you get a three, you double it, get an eight for 19, and you get a six, and you've got to stay. And then the next one, you get a three again, and you double that one again. And then the guy flips over a two, a two, and an eighth for 21, and you're rinsed. You know, those stories never end well. But hold on. You always remember the losses more than the game.

I remember my sports betting losses much more than sports betting wins. The most hurtful being I had Houston plus eight in the NCAA championship in college when Georgetown beat him by nine. And I had far too much money wagered on the game for someone who was 18 years old. But let me just tell you, because I've told this story. Can I give you? No, I do remember one win at the blackjack table. We're out. It's Super Bowl weekend.

It's the Super Bowl where the Bills played the Cowboys. There were like 12 of us out there. You know, we used to always say, we're going to the Super Bowl, and my wife would say, well, it's in New Orleans. Why are you going to Las Vegas? And I'd say, no, well, we're going to the Super Bowl in Las Vegas. Because that's really a better time, Super Bowl-wise, to be in Vegas for it. But that game was in Pasadena the following Sunday morning.

And we had asked our casino marketing host at the time, we were staying at the, I want to say, this was 19, Skins won the Super Bowl, 91, so this was 92 Cowboys. So it would have been January of 93, or February of 93, whenever they played the bills in that Super Bowl. That was the Michael Jackson Super Bowl. We ended up getting there. Here's why we got there. Our casino marketing host said, Kevin, we don't have any tickets left because I had asked her for Super Bowl tickets because some of the guys wanted to jump on a flight and go the next morning. And so we're playing Blackjack and I'm up a bunch of money, Steve.

And it was one of those what you just described, right? I get two eights against the six and split the eights, third eight, split the eighths, fourth eight. And I've got like the most amount of money that I've had on a hand the entire night because I've been on a heater. You know, the first eight, she pulls over a three double down jack. Second one, you know, a two double down ace. Third one, you know, another three double down, you know, ten. The third one, another two double down jack. You know, I've got like three twenty-ones and a twenty.

Dealer flips over, you know, six, ten. and actually, you know, next card is Jack, busts. I win all of those hands, double downs on all of those hands. And as they're, you know, pushing all of the chips in my direction, our casino marketing host, this is a true story, and I've got several friends that will back me up, walks over and hands me an envelope with eight Super Bowl tickets. Now, we were short, we were short a few.

I heard you tell that story. Yeah, we were short a few, so a couple of guys decided not to go, and a couple of guys decided to go and then just figured out when we got there. But we were at that Super Bowl, that Dallas Super Bowl went over Buffalo. By the way, thinking that this is just a year off for us. I mean, we lost a playoff game in San Francisco. We'll be back next year. No, no, we haven't been back since.

All right, per usual. Let me give you one last one, right? Real fast. Yeah. the worst sports loss of my life, gambling-wise. I forget the year. Maybe it's 2001. Yankees and Diamondbacks,

I had three grand. Now, I was making about 21,000. Yeah. I had three grand on the Yankees in game seven. And my only thought was, just get it to Mariana Rivera. And they did, and it's the only World Series loss of his life.

and I had three grand on the Yankees, and he gave up that broken bat nonsense, the Luis Gonzalez, and the Diamondbacks won the World Series. And I had the Yankees for three grand, which was a ton of money at the time, still a ton of money, but there's a ton of money at the time, and had Rivera on the mound.

The only guy who's ever gotten 100% of the vote in the Hall of Fame, and I had three grand on it, And it got to Rivera, and it's a loss. It was the worst sports loss I've ever had in gambling. And I remember thinking at the time, I'm never going to gamble again. It's like a hangover. I'm never going to drink again. You know, I'm never going to gamble again.

And, you know, that obviously doesn't happen. I'm on a role right now of not gambling. I have not placed a wager since the final four. And I don't think I'm going to until football season. Scott and I have talked a lot about this. I forget if we've talked to you about this. but it's everybody's doing it now, and by the way, obnoxiously doing it, you know, betting $5 a game and thinking they've got it all figured out,

it's almost not as fun as it used to be. I thought myself during the tournament wagering on games, I'm like, I don't even feel like wagering on these games. Football season's different and it'll change football season, but I have no interest, haven't had any interest in betting any NBA playoff games. Yeah, I don't ever bet this time of year anyway. I don't ever bet, yeah, we are in the golf. I don't bet any NBA or NHL or baseball.

I just do football and then college hoops, but it's nice to take the time off. But, yeah, I don't find, I've heard you and Scott have this discussion. I've heard you talk about it on your podcast with Tommy and the other guys that I enjoy it as much, but I don't find it as sexy as it was. And maybe that's because everyone's doing it. That's exactly why. David and I. My older brother, David, who listens to your show, you know, religiously every day is a huge fan of yours. He and I talk about it all the time. You know, gambling is, you know, it's a science, you know, and you and I know what this is about.

And most of your audience does too. But now that everyone has dipped their toe in the water, I don't know. You know, it's like, okay, it's not nearly as, uh, as sexy as. Well, it's, it's these, you know, and I've said this a million times, and it's so hypocritical on my part. concede that that that that that is true because we have so many gambling sponsors. I mean, the the legalized sports betting books and even even the illegal sports betting books, they're just throwing so much money after this land grab right now of legalized sports betting. But anyway, and everybody's taking it. And by the way, wouldn't be able to survive right now in some of this sports content without it. But it's the, it's the, you know how many, you know how many reads I'll do as the next four days.

I know, me too. How many reads I will do on points bet? These odds, these odds powered by point bet. Of course. And then I've got to explain to people. The best part is, is all these people, they know that I'm a degenerate, all the producers. So they go, San, you take it. So I have to explain, okay, John Rom is minus 175 right now.

What that means is if you want to win $100, you've got to lay 175 at the window to get back your 100. And by the way, in case you're wondering, you do receive $275 back when you give them the $175. Here I am explaining gambling on television, and I'm thinking of myself, where are we in society that certain things are allowed to be talked about and certain things aren't? And gambling has become so prevalent on national television. But you're smart. You're smart to explain it because even the people that are doing it don't even understand it right now. I've noticed that a lot. And you should understand it, you know, because, you know, you're probably not at this point, you know, laying down money that can be harmful.

but eventually it will lead to that if you're not careful because it always does. But I think worse than the gambling sites because, you know, anybody that can handle things truly in moderation, you're going to be fine. As long as you understand it to be entertainment fun and that you're probably not going to, you know, create a career out of it. In fact, I can guarantee you that you won't. But it's the tout sites that are now coming out of, you know, all back into vogue. We've got all the analytics We've got all the data We've got five star selections

Four star selections No you don't You don't have any more information Or any more chance Of winning on tonight's Buck Celtics game than I do Or my wife does So that's the thing that

I would just urge people to be careful about All right I got to run It's so true I listen to two people I listen to you on the smell test And I listen to Stanford Steve on the daily wager. Steve's really good.

Steve's really good, but the smell test was not great this year. And I was just having this conversation with Van Pelt the other night because he's like, you ended up losing this year, right? And I go, I did. He goes, how did that happen? And I go, because I just, I had every weekend,

I, we all knew what the games were, but I just picked the wrong ones because they all don't win. Personally, personally, I listen to your smell test every week, and I love it. I do. I love it. I think you pick too many games.

Well, actually, I think this year would be, this year I didn't pick it up. When you start picking 11 and 14 games, I'm like, man, that's a lot of it. I think, that's a lot. But you know this. It doesn't change your odds or winning or losing. The issue is that this year, actually, because there were so many, I think maybe if I had picked a mall, I would have had a winning year because I wouldn't have missed on the ones that were right, too. But anyway, we're not going to legislate history here or try to rewrite it because I had a losing season.

Next year, hopefully, I'll try. You did, but I love when you come on on Mondays and explain the smell test that you, in real money, versus the smell test money on Friday. I just love when you do that. I just think it's a brilliant thing. Well, usually the real result, if I lost with the smell test, more times than not, I lost much bigger for real. But anyway, all right. Enjoy the weekend here.

I'll talk to you soon. All right, Kevin, you're the best. All right, that's the show today. Thanks to Steve. Thanks to Greg Wyshinsky. Back tomorrow with Tommy. I am still trying my best to get Cooley on to do some film breakdown of some of the players that Washington drafted. He seems to be interested in doing it.

So we'll try to get him to do that and maybe do that for Fridays. show. All right. That's it for the day. Back tomorrow.