The Kevin Sheehan Show - Coming Soon: More Under Center

Episode Date: February 11, 2026

Kevin and Thom today with lots more on the Super Bowl including the Bad Bunny Halftime Show. Thom had a chance to remember Sonny Jurgensen and did. The boys also reacted to some of what was said during the new "coordinators" press conference that kicked off with Dan Quinn. For all your football betting needs: DCRELOAD at MyBookie for a 50% Deposit Match Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Here's Kevin. Tommy's here. I am here. The show's presenting sponsor, as always, Window Nation, 86690 Nation,

Window Nation.com if you need new windows. I got this from Hal Tommy. He writes, Landman's finale was one of the best chaos finale of a show I've ever seen. Thanks for the two. tip, I was out of breath. Yeah, it was chaos start to finish, but it was very entertaining, and for those that missed it

after I just absolutely torched season two of Landman, that was before the final two episodes. The final two episodes were really good. I enjoyed them. Did you enjoy the Super Bowl? Well, I mean, look,

I recognized how boring it was. I recognize I enjoy parts of it, and I enjoy most football games. A football game has to be really bad. And this wasn't really bad for me not to enjoy it. I enjoyed being right about one of my pregame predictions. What was your pregame prediction? I forget now. You picked Seattle?

I predicted Seattle 24 to 10. 24 to 10. I also predicted three turnovers. for Drake Me. Is that all he had in the game? That's what he had. Three turnovers. Yeah.

So I got the turnovers, right? So that makes me happy, you know, because that's, that's, in the windling world of satisfaction, you work it in there. That's what we live for. Yeah. Right? Well, you too. You like it, too.

Don't, don't bullshit. But here's the difference. When I fail miserably, I highlight that too. For you, it becomes something, you know what? You'd be a great cornerback because you put the last play behind you very quickly unless it's successful. Any sort of bad play does not exist in your world. This is twisting the truth. You don't remember the times, I admit failure, because they're so rare.

Yes, you've said that before. I feel like that was a deja vu moment just then. I've heard that before. I do have to tell you, though, real quickly, before we get back to the Super Bowl, with more Super Bowl follow-up, I guess. And I talked about this on the podcast. So I totally messed up a Super Bowl trivia question, but it was such self-inflicted damage, Tommy,

because it was a question that I asked on Super Bowl trivia week, during Super Bowl trivia week on the show last week. And then for some reason, Because there was a lot of feedback to the question, people liked the question and they were tweeting me the answers. And, you know, some people got the answer right. But more importantly, some people suggested that it was more than the number I had asked for. Let me just tell you what the question was. The question was, name four quarterbacks who played and started games for the Redskins,

but also started in Super Bowls for other teams. well naming the four quarterbacks was inaccurate because there were actually six but I only had four now nobody got the answer or got near the answer and I you know and I ding them for it the person that tried to answer it on the show I don't even think named one of the quarterbacks but people loved that question and they started thinking about it and a lot of people sent in answers and when I started to see the answers and I started to see people saying, you missed one there, Bub. But then on the show that I did Sunday, I said, hey, here was a cool question,

and let me give everybody the answer that was curious. And I gave the wrong answer because I only gave four, and there were six. Let's see, Stan Humphreys, Jeff Hostetler, Brad Johnson. Yeah. Those are three. Hold on for a second. Are you trying to answer this question without knowing the, you don't really know the answer? No, I don't.

Okay. Good job so far. You got three. There are three more. Okay. I'm thinking. I'm thinking. Okay.

I hit a wall already. Well, the first two names you gave, Stan Humphreys and Jeff Hostetler, were the two that I didn't have. have in the answer. And it's like, how did I not get Stan Humphreys in particular? The other three, Rich Gannon, Donovan McNabb, who we did his show that one year. I would have remembered Donovan McNabb. I would not have gotten Rich Gannon. And then the other one, the last one, was the guy that just said,

F it, baby, I'm going deep. Rex Grossman. Rex Grossman. Yeah. Right. Okay. Yeah. So I asked the question as four because I didn't have Stan Humphreys and Jeff Hostel

in my researching of this question. You know this about Super Bowl trivia. I basically put all the questions together on my own. Tim Schovers helps out. Every year it's become a tradition that Tim, who used to work at the station, Tim will send me a bunch of questions, and I incorporate some of those in there. But yeah, so anyway, I came clean on the mistake, but I didn't need to come clean because everybody called me out for it. By the way, the radio show today, if you want to go listen,

I had Joe Gibbs on the show today. Wow. And I also had Will Dawkins, the general manager of the Wizards on the show today. Wow, that's small. Easy. Will Dawkins was actually great. But I'd actually reached out. I may have said this to you. Actually, I wouldn't have said this to you because Sunny passed away after our Thursday show. And I do want you to talk about Sunny in the column that you wrote about Sunny. But I reached out to Joe on Friday and I said, hey, will you come on with me to talk about Sunny? And he said, I can't do it today.

And then he did it today. He couldn't do it Friday. He did it today. And it was, you know, it's always good to catch up with Joe. It was very funny because we were talking about. about the Super Bowl, I think, and he said, you know, somebody brought this up to me that our 1991 team, and I knew exactly where he was going with it, but I let him go through the whole thing, is the best Super Bowl team of all time that we were ranked number one and we're the only

one to be ranked number one offense, defense, and special teams. And I said, yeah, that team has often been written about or via the DVOA, you know, stuff that Aaron Shats does. Aaron has had the 91 team is the greatest regular season, postseason team in NFL history. And so I said, you've always been reluctant to say which team was your best team, but you pretty much just said it was the 91 team. And he quickly backtracked. And he said, oh, no, but what? And then he goes into the 82 team and the 87 team.

He goes, I don't like to name the best team. The 91 team was the best. Redskin team of all time. And the fact that it's pretty much... And one of the best teams of all time. And they're probably, you know, according to a lot of different metrics, DVOA in particular, the greatest team of all time.

But one of the reasons that came back up was because Seattle, per DVOA, just completed the fourth greatest season in NFL history. So the 2025 Seahawks are behind the 91 skins, the 85 B, Bears and the 2007 Patriots who did not win the Super Bowl. I think the Seahawks were really good, Tommy.

But one of the things that I said yesterday, I'll just ask you the question, which defense was better? Seattle's defense this year or Philadelphia's defense last year, that also was dominant in their Super Bowl win? I think Seattle's defense. Why? I think this one.

I think this one, I just think this one was more opportunistic. I think that this one made the other team pay the price more than Philadelphia did. Yeah, I actually think it's the opposite. I think Philadelphia's defense was better. I think Philadelphia dominated the competition in a much different way. The Rams, I mean, they had. Seattle's number. I mean, Matt Stafford threw for 831 yards and six touchdowns in two games that were very recent, including the NFC championship game. I mean, nobody did that to Philadelphia,

with the exception, actually, of Jaden Daniels, who in their final two games against Philadelphia, he didn't have Matt Stafford numbers, but he was the only guy and the Washington offense was the only one to really have success against Philadelphia's defense down the stretch. The difference for me, though, more than anything else, is that the Chiefs last year with Patrick Mahomes are not the Patriots with Drake May. The Patriots were playing the game not to lose. You know, they were hoping that Sam Darnold would make the mistake, and they could capitalize on it like they did in the AFC championship game when Jared Stidham had the big turnover deep in their own territory. They would not let Drake May cost them the first. football game until, you know, it didn't matter anymore.

And that's not the way Kansas City approached the game. And Kansas City didn't cross midfield until late in the third quarter of the Super Bowl last year. And they dominated the chiefs last year. Look, Seattle's defense was awesome. We saw it, you know, in early November. I still can't get over what the Rams did to that defense, though. as good as that defense was, it's amazing what the Rams did to it.

You know, you convinced me. You convinced me now. I'm on your side on this. Is it because of the Rams and what they did, or is it because of the chiefs were the opponent? The chiefs were the opponent. Yeah, no, you've convinced me. There you go.

I was wrong. Yeah. That's amazing what just happened. I really, we should stop the show right now. and acknowledged that Tom, he just admitted that he was, well, I mean, you're kind of like, you know, Arthur Fonzarelli. You could never admit that you were wrong, but you just did it. This from Tim. Wait another five years and it'll probably happen again.

This from Tim, Tim writes, Drake May wasn't allowed to be great in the Super Bowl, Kevin, comma. You set it yourself on the show. you were harsh overly after you said that he wasn't allowed to be great. I didn't say he wasn't allowed to be great to me. I said they took the ball out of his hands for the second straight game. That's telling, by the way. That is telling. I said his performance was abysmal.

But I also said that he wasn't the only culpable party on offense. Will Campbell was terrible. Their offensive line struggled. Josh McDaniels didn't come up with any easy answers. They saw the same blitz over and over again, and there was no hot receiver. There was no quick game. Jay was on with us yesterday, talked about some of that stuff. But it's true that he wasn't allowed to go out and sling it around.

But how do you think that would have worked out, Timmy? Seriously. Did you watch him against the Chargers, Texans, and Broncos? before this game. He had objectively one of, if not the worst post-season in the history of the sport for a quarterback. And I still like him, though. I still think he's going to be a very good quarterback. I think he was very good during the regular season. I'll tell you what, Tommy, that would have been some sort of, you know, dilemma. And I know it's a regular season award. But had Drake May eeked out the MVP,

and he was damn close, it would really look silly after the postseason he had. Yes, it would. It certainly would. I don't think I was too harsh on Drake May. If I was too harsh, everybody's been too harsh. He was objectively terrible in the postseason. But I will say what I said going into the postseason, and even after the Houston game, when he fumbled six times, put the ball on the ground, or in those two games against the Chargers in Houston,

fumbled six times lost three of them. I said, this dude can do it. And he's going to be really good. And we're going to have a debate about Drake or Jaden for a while. I like Jaden more for a lot of reasons that I've expressed. By the way, Jay Gruden on the podcast yesterday said, I said, go back and redraft. You've got two years worth of data.

Go back and redraft 2024. He said, Jaden won, Caleb two. he actually put Bo Nix ahead of Drake May and had Drake May 4th. I thought that was surprising. Yeah. I think I would go Jaden 1. I think I'd go Drake May 2, but it'd be close with Caleb. Really close.

It's going to be a draft that produces some really, really good quarterbacks, plural. Not one, but at least two, and probably three. What else from the Super Bowl? You want to talk about Bad Bunny? What did you think of the halftime show? Okay. I enjoyed it. You know, I didn't understand what he was saying,

but I didn't understand what Kendrick Lamar was saying last year either. You know? And I enjoyed this one more. Well, Kendrick Lamar did it in English, though. Yeah, but I didn't understand it. Mm-hmm. Okay. So I enjoyed this.

one more than last year. He got a message across, which I think last year they didn't. And the bottom line is it's not for me. Okay? I mean, I'm 72 years old. Jesus. You know, a halftime show

can't be for me. And it seems to be a smart business decision by the NFL. To the last couple years to do it the way they've done it. They're trying reach new audiences. Well, this was far different than Kendrick Lamar.

I know. Yeah. I know. But this was more of an international thing. Right. It goes with their international push this year. You know, but, well, you know what's funny? I saw the athletic, which becomes more and more pathetic every day, by the way.

What does? What did you say? The athletic. The athletic. The athletic. Oh, is it more pathetic every day. Really? I like the athletic.

But what are you talking about? They posted something on social media, the top 10 Super Bowl halftime shows. None of them were before 2000. Not a one. You know? There was a year where they had a halftime show where 88 piano players were on the field playing the piano at the same time. What year was that? I don't know.

I don't have been 88. Huh? You know? It might have been 88. Okay. But, which is a remarkable show. You know,

Springsteen did a halftime show for crying how loud. Yeah. So, I mean, but so, I mean, I just, so,

I mean, I thought it was an interesting, entertaining show. It's not for me. Okay. And, uh, I think,

I think it had a good message that they got across. And the bottom of, line is, I think it was a great business decision by the NFL. Yeah, I don't know about the business decision. I'll take your word for it. I mean, I think, you know, obviously they're trying to expand the product and they're going to be playing more international games this coming season. And eventually, we're probably going to have 18 weeks or 18 games and 18 international games. Or 16, anyway.

Yeah, look, what you said, it does. definitely was not for me. And I, I tend to be when it comes to music in particular. I'm available for things that I'm not familiar with. I mean, I've, you know, I have a musician's son. I've got two sons who play basically everything. And I've loved some of the shows in recent years where it's not like it was my favorite genre of music. I thought Usher a few years ago was phenomenal. Now, I'm a big Alicia Keys fan. I'm a big her fan. Ludacris was a part of that show, so it was a great show altogether.

But this one for me, you know, I guess it was choreographed well. I didn't understand it. I mean, it was pretty cool that the wedding ceremony was real. Okay. We didn't know that when it was going on. I mean, you know, I do like Lady Gaga, but, you know, what. And maybe the coolest part was the video that they showed on social media of all the people standing up in the bushes and running off the field. Those were all people in those bushes.

That was probably the best thing about the show. What about the music? What about the music? You've already said it. Not for you. Right. Yeah. By the way, it was a genre of music that I'm actually not even really familiar with.

I mean, it didn't turn me off. It didn't turn me off. Right. So, again, I think it was a business decision. I think it worked for them. Certainly wasn't Prince. That's for sure. No.

Well, again, it wasn't Prince. Absolutely. No. It wasn't, you know what? I'm trying to think, was it you and the two of us were at the Who press conference together, right when they played. Yes. They played behind blue eyes.

Yeah. In the press conference, it was so good. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, Townsend and adultery, right? The two of them were up there. Yes. That was really good.

For those that don't know what I'm talking about, during Super Bowl week, the halftime act on Thursday holds a press conference. It's in where it was for many years in the same building where we had radio row and we were doing her show. And Tommy and I, for the Who, literally got up there and sat right in the front row. And they played a small, you know, set, which included, I want to say in addition to behind Blue Eyes, I think they played an acoustic version of Pinball Wizard, right?

I don't remember that. Or won't get fooled again, maybe. I don't know. I just remember behind Blue Eyes was so good. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And then there were a couple of others.

We went for Petty. The Petty halftime was great. The, I remember Katie Perry's halftime show, and we went to the press conference. Was that you and me? At that one? No, it wasn't. No? No, look, I mean, according, and I know this is, you know, people know this already.

Bad Bunny was Spotify's top global artist. Oh, look, that part of it is obvious. This guy just took home multiple Grammys album of the year. He's Spotify's number one streamed artists worldwide. I get that part. I totally get that part. I'm not saying that they shouldn't have. I'm just saying I guess what surprised me about it is that I was open to kind of hoping

that maybe it would be something that I would then this week at some point go listen to some of the music. It's a genre that I'm totally unfamiliar with. And I didn't, because the whole thing was in Spanish, I don't know, maybe it could have been more impactful if it wasn't in Spanish solely. That's not unfair. That's reasonable. If you're going to have, if you're going to take that swing, which doesn't seem like a big swing because of his status worldwide,

it is an American event. It's mostly an American audience. And even though Spanish is a language that many speak as their second language for Americans, there are plenty more that don't speak it and probably, you know, I think it may have impacted the way they received it. It did for me, but anyway. Yeah, the commercials, anything on that? Oh, the commercials were pretty lame except for the Dunkin' Donuts. Yeah, the Dunkin' Duncan Dunn.

That was good. Yeah. Yeah, that was good. That stood out. rest of them for all the name. It was watching. It was great watching.

The AI commercials were very lame, considering you can do anything you want with AI. And it was, I'll be curious to see what the numbers wind up being. It wasn't a great Super Bowl. The commercials weren't great. You know, the halftime show was probably the biggest draw of the day.

Do you know what? I said there was a commercial on during the Super Bowl. Bowl and I caught the very end of it, but I saw it, it ran last night on something. Christina Applegate has MS. I didn't know that. Did you know that? No. Did you see the ad that they had for the Super Bowl with her? I don't recall seeing it. Anyway, it was basically her talking about having MS and dealing with, you know, the bad parts of it, but also the good parts of it and sort of promoting a way, you know, as a reach-out

to people who have MS. I'm a fan of hers, not just because she's pretty and she's been really good. I became a real fan of hers. Remember, she hosted SNL, I don't know, 15 years ago, and she was great.

Like, she's normal, and then I kind of followed her, watched her get interviewed in a number of things, and she just wasn't what I thought she would be. Totally normal, smart, the whole thing. But that was a really good ad with her.

And, man, I had no idea. I thought she had had cancer at some point, but was healthy again. What do you think? Yeah. What do you think? Did you notice the adventures of Cliff Booth trailer that they put up there?

With Brad Pitt, yes. Yeah. Yeah, I did. But they didn't tell you. They didn't tell you what's coming. I know. But I can't wait for it. That was pretty good.

Yeah, what's it going to be? What's it going to be? David Fincher coming out in 2026. He was so good playing Cliff Booth and once upon a time in Hollywood. That was a great role for Pitt. A phenomenal role. He was so good.

I like that. That was very, very intricate. Yeah. To see that happen. There were a lot of like teases and promotions of upcoming movies. That one was definitely memorable for me for that same reason. All right. Yeah, you know, it's mentioning the numbers,

I would bet it's not going to do a great number, relatively speaking, because blowouts never do. You know, they just typically... On the other hand, it was very cold in most of the... Yeah, it's not like we had a lot of options. Although, you know what, Tommy? it's 43 degrees today. It's the warmest day.

It's the warmest day we've had in two and a half weeks. And it's going to be in the 40s for much of the rest of the week. I'm looking to see it's 43 degrees right now at National. That's the warmest we've been in two and a half weeks. It's going to be 44 tomorrow, 38 Thursday. And then this weekend, I think we're going to get a rainstorm, it looks like, right now. although it could go either way. You know what?

I'm all for rain and 40s and 50s. Get all this stuff away. It's just, it's really become a pain in the ass. All right. I want to hear your thoughts on Sonny Jurgensen. We'll get to those right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey guys, new sponsor on the podcast this week. I want you to pay attention to Mando.

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Before we get started in this segment with Tommy telling us his thoughts about Sunny passing away on Friday, I'm going to pay you a compliment here. Even though you are the last man standing in town, your obituary, which you wrote for the Washington Times on Sonny Jurgensen, the column that you wrote that I think appeared yesterday in the paper. I'm sorry, but even if the other papers sports section did still exist, that's the best stuff you guys are going to get on Sonny Jurgensen. Tommy knew Sunny.

We both had the exposure to Sunny really through the radio station. Tommy as also a columnist for the Washington Times. but if you're going to read anything about Sonny Jorgensen, read Tommy. All right, go to his Twitter account, his ex account, at Tom Levero. That's Tom with an H-T-H-O-M-Livero, and you can link to what he wrote about Sonny. But a phenomenal job in remembering Sonny's life. Well, thank you. Yes.

Thank you. I mean, that's important to me because I want to do him justice. Right. I know. I mean, I want to do his legacy and his memory justice because he was such an important figure in sports in this town. And I always talk about the gifts I've been given

in my job, and one of those gifts I always counted was knowing Sonny Jurgensen. I mean, if I'm thinking of Tom Laverill, the fan, you know, who had never became a sports writer, just shaking Sonny Jurgerson's hands. Like on the street or at a football game, I talk about that for years.

You know, so, so, I mean, I felt very fortunate. And in the obituary, one of the things I was able to do, and one of the things I'm able to do, unfortunately, it's a sad task, but it's an important task, is when there's a passing

of a former redskin, I can usually speak to it very well because I have all the interviews I did for Hail Victory, the book. I have them all transcribed, the oral history I did. So I talked to so many these guys for such a long time.

Sonny, I've got seven pages of an interview. So how long did Sunny sit with you for that book? Well, like I said, seven pages. I know, but what is seven pages, time-wise. Oh, I don't know. 35, 40, 45 minutes. Got it.

Or so? Mm-hmm. You know, I had lots of stuff about Sam when he, when, you know, that I could use when he passed away. And I had stories, you know, that I used both in the obituary. And in the column, the column was about Sonny and Vince Lombardi. And how Sonny always wondered how his, his career might have on. folded if he had been with Vince Lombardi for, you know, after 68 because he loved

the Lombardi so much. And I was able to pull a quote from Len Hart, who was Sunny Center. Right. The whole time he was in Washington. And, you know, Len, Len, from the book I used, I used it in the column, Len said, you know, Sonny was talking to him one day after practice and saying, you know, isn't this great to have Lombardi as the coach? He's kicking our ass, and that's just what we need. You know, he's pushing us to do 110%. And Len Hoss looks at him.

It says, Sonny, that's good for you, but I give 110% all the time. Yeah, right. How do you do that? Yeah, Sonny gave 110% off the field. There was no doubt about that. Yeah. That's funny. So he said, it's fine for you.

you, but I'm already given them everything I got. Right. So there were stuff like that in the column about Lombardi. There are stories in the obituary about, you know,

about when he met Tom Jones at a touchdown club dinner and I think it was Mike Bragg or somebody asked Sonny how does it feel to meet such a celebrity? And Sonny said, well, you'll have to ask

Tom Jones. Yeah, right. So there was a lot of that. And he was an important figure to so many people, just the ones who had encounters with them, the Sunday afternoon, you know, radio broadcast of the game, radio being such maybe the most intimate of all the communication forms, so people really felt connected with Sunny on those Sunday afternoons. And then the ones that were lucky enough to see him play,

to see him, you know, maybe the best passer in our lifetime. So, you know, but we remember we did the lunch with a legend? No, this was the best. It was the best. I mean, it was just so good, you know, he was so comfortable. Yet, you know, he didn't want to do a book. Right. You know, I talked to him about that a couple of times, and he had, for some reason,

He had no interest in doing the book, but he was not like he was reclusive. He would pretty much talk to anybody. He didn't seek it out, but if you wanted to talk, he'd be willing to talk. And he managed to live, to manage to survive all the different, you know, administrations. He managed to survive the Snyder era because he was above it. He was sunny jerks. Yeah, he, that's, yeah. His presence transcended

however however despicable the business was at that time. He transcended that. That's so true about I think about, because Sonny was at the park all the time. And he was close with everybody,

coaches, general managers, front office, you know, Dan during all of those years. But Dan never stuck to Sunny at all because he was sunny he was above it. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, he had his own special place in the universe

and nothing could change that, you know, and nothing could damage it. And it will never be damaged. His place in Washington's sports universe will always exist. Every organization

has somebody like sunny. I mean, every organization has kind of their Mount Rushmore players. I shouldn't say every organization has it. Look, I said the following, and because we haven't talked about this together,

because the last time we did a show was Thursday, I think in terms of just the most beloved Redskins of all time, it's sunny and then Rigo, and they're really close. You know, I

I don't know that they're, you know, Daryl and Art probably are next in line, but they're a notch below in terms of just being adored by this fan base over a long period of time. And would you agree with that, first of all? Yeah, I would agree with that. And the big difference being is sunny gained a whole audience on the radio. Right. That's true. and Rigo was much more, I mean, Rigo was doing his own thing, he was living in New York, he was, you know, before he came back here to do a radio show, which I was a part of. That's why he came back to Washington in 2006, and he's been here ever since, but John's reclusive compared to Sunny, you know, and always has been, you know, I, in that, but there are, there are,

other places, you know, other big markets where there is a version of Sunny, you know, and I'm talking about, like, Sam Huff is that to old-time giant fans. Like, I'm always surprised when, you know, some of my friends who are New York, Connecticut, Jersey guys whose, you know, parents are or whose dads are long-time giant fans. And I've had these conversations before because they, you know, they're sometimes interested in what I do with the Redskins and, you know, what we've been doing here for, you know, a while now. And they'll say, well, Sam Huff, you know, Sam Huff, you know, is, you know, Redskinned, but he's an all-time giant giant. Like Huff and I think Gifford also is revered in that way.

But Huff is really for giant fans, old-time giant fans, almost the sunny equivalent. Am I right about that? I think I am. Yeah, I think you're right. I remember the Giants, those giant teams, they were known for their defense. Right. More than their offense, and Sam Huff was the star. I remember, he was the star of, you know, one of the first sports documentary.

Yeah. When they did the violent world of Sam Huff. Oh, yeah, that one. I thought it was they called pro football. No, it's the violent, yeah. He was on the cover of Life. He was on the cover of Life magazine. Yes.

and this is a guy who grew up Sam, Sam, and now we're talking about Sam. He grew up in a town of maybe 100 people in West Virginia. Yeah, I know. I mean, do you think Roger Stawback is that for longtime cowboy fans? I don't know. I mean, Roger. Sonny was different. Sonny was different, and he talked about this.

You know, Sonny was different because when he played and he's, He even, he bragged about this. You know, he wasn't, he wasn't a Greek god. He had a little belly that, that, that, that came over through his turkey. And he would say, you know, the guy sitting at home could look at him and relate to him. You know, the people could say, that could be me, except for the golden arm. Right, right, yeah. And he always had that quality.

He always had that quality. I'm Roger Stalbach. I mean, he was a third in Vietnam. He went to Naval Academy. You know, he's, no one thinks they can be Roger Stalback, okay? You know? No, I understand that. You're probably intimidated.

I don't, I mean, you may be in awe of Sonny when you hadn't met him, but I don't think you ever, I think this is partly because of the way he was. I don't think you ever felt intimidated. I mean, I think there are different reasons. for a player being all-time, you know, loved by a fan base. Like, in the case of like, I'm just, I was just going through the standings here to try to come up with a comparable for Sunny. The funny thing is you'd have to be a certain age as an NFL fan of another team to say Sunny at this point. Because they, if you're a fan of another team and you haven't lived in the market,

you haven't experienced Sunny as a broadcaster for all of these years. But like in Cleveland, Jim Brown's the all-time greatest brown. There's no doubt about that. But, you know, Bernie Cozar is one of the all-time most beloved Cleveland Browns. Like any Cleveland person will tell you, you know, Bernie's just adored by that fan base. Elway in Denver, has there ever been a Bronco close to Elway? I don't think so. No. The answer would be no, right? I can't imagine there would be.

Yeah. Those are the ones that sort of came to mind. I mean, you know, you've got so many different options in other places. I guess Brady and New England, obviously. Right? Yeah. All right. Who's all time in Philadelphia? Wasn't like Chuck Bednarik for years the guy? and Jaws is certainly a guy that everybody I think Jowarsky. Yeah. Duorsky probably. Because he was,

you know, because Chorke had a second career on ESPN. Yeah. And he was visible, and he always seemed approachable. Right. You know, some guys like Chuck Bednaric,

I'd be afraid to walk up to Chuck Bednerick. Right. Concrete Charlie, you know? So, like, L.T. There's no giant. more revered. The greatest giant in history of the franchise is Lawrence Taylor.

But he's dangerous, okay? Yeah, but... Yeah, I think, you know, when I said Huff and even Gifford, I'm really talking about older giant fans. Lawrence Taylor is not only probably the number one for giant fans, say, under the age of 60. he is for NFL fans a number one all time and he's the one that people would say about the Giants

well of course it's LT just like I think Chicago everybody would say well of course it's Walter Payton and yet you know Dick Butkiss and Gail Sares and Hallis and all you know all these like there's certain organizations that in our organization goes back that far but nobody's going to say Sammy Baugh

you know, because nobody's alive that saw Sammy Ball play. Too far back. Yeah. What about the Lions? It would be Barry Sanders, right? It would probably be Barry Sanders. Yeah.

Absolutely. Have to be. Green Bay, like, the first thing I thought of... There was a time in the 50s and the 60s where it would have been Bobby Lane, who was a great quarterback, who was the last player to lead the Lions to NFL title. in the 50s.

Right. And was an off-the-field character that generated a lot of interest among fans. He was, somebody needs to make a movie about Bobby Lane. Packers. Packers.

Packers is a tough one. Yeah. Because the... Bart's a star comes to mind. Well, for me, I immediately thought of Brett Farve. You see, he put Brett Farve. He diminished himself. He's diminished himself.

Well, he... You know? I think I don't... Well, he's diminished himself post-career for a lot of people that aren't football fans, and maybe for football fans, I don't know if Green Bay fans feel that way. What about Miami? Like, Marino immediately comes to mind, but they didn't win with Marino. They won with...

Well, if Ryan, I mean, Bob Greasy... Yeah. You know, probably Zonka, maybe at some point. Larry Zonka was probably the most beloved dolphin. Yeah. The Hall of Fame, they won two Super Bowls. He was kind of, you know, a blue-collar guy. Bob Greasy was not a blue-collar guy.

No. I mean, I would assume that the Vikings, it would come from Page or Eller, but it also might be Fran Tarkington. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. All right. We could do this for the next 30 minutes.

We won't. I think that the thing that a lot of people of a certain age don't understand is just how much this fan base loved Sonny Jurgensen. And Ernie said this to me, because I had Ernie Bauer on Friday show,

because Ernie was close to Sunny. And he said, the thing about Sonny and Rigo is not only were they great players. And Rigo obviously won at all. I mean, Rigo was a champion. And the first champion for this team, unless you're going to take me back to 1945. But they were guys, guys, and they were characters. And, you know, there was a relatability to, and an entertainment factor involved in both of them. And the truth is we knew this, I think maybe at the time with Rigo, but certainly in the

media, like Redskins report is really an iconic show with George and Sonny and Rigo and Wilbon. And their self-deprecating senses of humor were a big part of their likeability, too, as they, you know, got older. Yes, we were, we were fortunate to be around. Sonny a bunch because of the radio station and it was it was always a pleasure and for me surreal because that's the first sports kind of hero I can remember and it was really driven by my uncle who was the biggest Sonny Jurgensen fan and sunny I remember signed a football that my uncle had before he passed away he signed a football for him and um and uh I mean he was couldn't have been more thrilled

All right. You know, one of the things I did post on social media, like I said, was a column I wrote a few years ago about sitting with Sunny and Billy Gilmer for an inning or two while they were watching a Nationals game. You know, that. Yeah, that was great. That's a moment in my lifetime, you know. And they're asking me questions. They're asking me questions about Dusty Baker. Right.

And the team and stuff. That was just great. Yeah, that's awesome. The two of them. Wow. All right, we got more show to go. We'll get to it right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey, guys, I've talked a lot about chime over the last year.

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otherwise 1.00% APY applies no mean balance required chime card on time payment history may have a positive impact on your credit score results may vary see chime dot com for details and applicable terms all right Tommy tell us about shelley's well I'm going to give you a little bit of a gift today talking about shelley's back room I'm hungry okay is that the gift uh that's I'm going to me a little bit of gift at Shelley. Look, I could talk about the great selection of cigars that they have, and they do have the best selection in town, but that really wouldn't do much for you because you're not a cigar guy, you know?

I could talk about their great selection of drinks on their drink menu, and that would, that would, that might hit a, hit a note with me. That would pique my interest. That would pique my interest. Yeah. You're like, but I'm going to really the heart of the matter. your stomach. Yeah.

Okay. And it's growling right now. I'm going to talk about their menu, specifically their burgers. And I'm going to read right off their website. You can find out more at shelley's backroom.com. Shelly's burgers are made with, quote, a unique blend of Angus Groundchuck, beef short ribs, and beef brisket, always fresh, never frozen, served on a butter-toasted roll with homemade fries, lettuce, tomato, onions, and a kosher pickle.

I'd take the pickle off, but I love everything else. They have like different choices of burgers. They have the L Diablo burger with pepperjack cheese and grilled jalapal that sounds good. Served with a spicy mayo. Okay, they have the patty melt, one half pound of Shelley's cup. custom blend with caramelized onions and your choice of cheese on a grilled sour bread, sourdough bread, and then they have the blackened and then blue burger.

You know, so they have these, I'm telling you, if you go to Shelly's and you have one in these burgers, you'll say, why didn't I come here before? I'm telling you. That's what you'll say. I want a burger right now so much. Every time you do these burgers from Shelley's, when you incorporate them into your spot, I literally want to get in the car and drop down to Shelly's and have one of those burgers. They're really good.

And you know what? I might even smoke a cigar when I'm down there in a few hours. All right. Shelly's back room at 1331 F Street Northwest in the district. That's a good spot. Great spot. So today was coordinator day, Tommy. The two new coordinators held press conferences.

Dan Quinn kicked it off 28 minutes of Dan Quinn, and then we got Durante Jones, the new defensive coordinator, and then we got David Blow, the new offensive coordinator. So I watched all three. And let me just, I'm going to give you, I think, honestly, the one highlight of basically an hour's worth of press conferences. Quinn was asked about the vision of offense. He was asked about Cliff Kingsbury.

He basically sidestepped almost everything specific to Kingsbury, just saying over and over again, really tough decision. These are the hard decisions you got to make, et cetera, et cetera. He was asked about his vision for the offense under David Blow. And he said, it's going to be an aggressive. balanced attack that will have more under center

than we've had in the past for run action and play passes to generate explosive plays. It'll feature every part of Jaden in ways that makes him unique and special.

And David Blow pretty much repeated that sentiment in terms of his belief that you can generate you know, more opportunities from being under center, especially, and he called out play action and what they call keepers. The Shanahan system, it's always been, bootlegs have always been called QB keepers because they keep it after the fake, even though it's an actual kind of old school description bootleg. That really was, I think, the stuff that was newsworthy, but I think we were

expecting that anyway. I was impressed with Durante Jones and the way he handled himself during the press conference. He is definitely new to this, as is David Blow. David Blow started off the press conference, I thought, a little bit nervous. And then by the end of it, I'm like, yeah, I get it. There's something about him that, you know, I bet is relatable with the players because he was one recently. And he talked about all the influences. He talked about, you know, being obviously in Detroit, being in Minnesota, and was very complimentary of Cliff Kingsbury as well.

Durante Jones talked a lot about Brian Flores, but actually probably dropped Mike Zimmer's name as much as he did Brian Flores' name. Being on that Minnesota staff when Mike Zimmer was not only the head coach, but a defensive head coach. And he mentioned players. You know, he mentioned Louvre, loves Louvoo, and talked about the versatility of San Restill, Kwan Martin, Will Harris, Jordan McGee. David Blow said he sees Bill Kroski Merritt as a number one back, but he also said he's the only back under contract, and there will be, you know, some acquisitions made in that

particular area. But it wasn't any sort of earth-shattering newsday from the coordinators, but I thought they both did a nice job. And I think some of the stuff that you wanted to know

like, why did you move on from Cliff Kingsbury? He really kind of sidestepped anything specific to that. But when he answered the vision of Blau under center more, you know, balance, attack, you know, that's what Quinn wants to go to. That's why he did this, because he sees

Jaden, you know, flourishing in sort of a Shanahan-style attack, certainly with more play-action pass attempts and more under center to get to that than we've seen under Cliff. Okay. Yeah, I mean, that's kind of it. Here's what I don't understand. understand. And it speaks to the politics inside, not just this building, I guess, but any NFL organization. And I don't quite understand it. At some point, during the season, since Cliff Kingsbury worked for Dan Quinn, Quinn could have pulled him in and said, you know why, let's switch up the playbook a little bit. Let's have Jayden under center more. And what's Cliff going to say? No. that's not going to happen?

You know, you... Why doesn't this unfold like that? You've brought this up to me before. It's... This season was an absolute train wreck. They were bringing people off the street. And the people, by the way, on the practice squad, remember, you know, the offensive players that they were pulling off the practice squad

to play had been here since April, you know, and they had learned a system. they were younger players, very inexperienced in some cases. In other cases, not totally inexperienced. But to add to all of the personnel changes, an offensive philosophical change in the middle of a season. It's not an atomic bomb for crying out. Nobody's saying it's an atomic bomb. I'm just saying what would the point have been?

And first of all, you're talking about with Jaden, he barely played. A healthier, a healthier Jaden Daniels, maybe. Would you say? Maybe a healthier Jaden Daniels. Maybe with a healthier Jaden Daniels, maybe some of that would have happened. Maybe Jaden Daniels would have been healthier. Well, who knows he didn't play? I mean, he played in four games start to finish.

But those games, he may not have gotten hurt when he got hurt if they had. had changed the offense. Well, he got hurt in the second game of the year. Did you want him to change the offense after they beat the Giants in the opener? No, but he came back. Then he came back. All I know is that the head coach. Then he came back and played great for two games.

The head coach had to sit there during the season and watch an offense run that he didn't like. That's insane. I'll tell you what, for the head coach, given that he's a defensive head coach, the only thing that worked a little bit on this team this year was the offense. The defense was an absolute garbage. It was a five-alarmor. I mean, don't you think he had a little bit to deal with on that end?

He moved on from his defensive coordinator before Madrid. That probably was more time-consuming for him than worrying about going to his offensive coordinator and saying, change the offense. Yes, that's what you're here for. With Robbie chosen at wide receiver. Yeah, no. I don't see that having much sense. Chris Moore, Robbie chosen, you know, all these different players that were running around out there.

The personnel doesn't do not matter. Yeah, it does. It absolutely matters. Who is in charge? The head coach. And he had to watch an office. defense play, not necessarily just because they were bad, but not the way that he wanted it to play. Well, he should have made that decision in the offseason, because the season had already started.

You can't do that? Well, you can. You can change up your game plan. You can change up the play calling. But if you think all of a sudden we're going to start becoming a zone run team with our quarterback under center, who by the way, isn't available to play. And we've got guys running around there that don't even run the right routes when we call a pass play. And oh, by the way, this is the side of the ball, even with all of the chaos, is much more functional than the other side of the ball.

No, I think he actually, if he thought about going to Cliff to say, let's change it up, thought better of it and said, maybe we just need to get our players healthy and get a few stops on defense. Maybe that's the priority. By the way, they did end up running the ball more. They did take the ball... That did not come up today, did it? I'm sorry?

That didn't come up today, did it? I mean, the one thing you're talking about... From what, one of the three empty chairs? Yeah. No, no. Did it come up from one of the three empty chairs? I don't think... Oh, my God.

Enough already. Enough. Enough. Go ahead. What were you saying? I was just going to say that the one thing that you're talking about is the fact that the coach made it clear he didn't like the way the offense was being called. Well, look, do I think he came to that realization after they, you know, laid one on the chargers on the road?

Or, you know, after they blew out Vegas and the first, I mean, they're rolling up offense and they lose at the end of the game against the Bears? No, I don't think he's thinking that way then. I think it's probably been in the back of his mind, but they were so successful last year. At what point did you want him to go to Cliff? And by the way, I think he went to Cliff a few times and said, you know, remember, he basically said,

you're not running Jaden anymore when he came back for the Minnesota game. There were no zone reads. There were no called, you know, designed runs. So there was some of that. And I think they ran the ball a little bit more as the season went along. I do find this interesting. Washington's balance was like basically top five in the league in terms of their run-pass balance. So a lot of that stuff gets the numbers tell a different story.

But at what point when Jaden was out and Marcus was in, Marcus was so much more comfortable in Cliff's offense than he would have been under center. More so than even Jaden. I just don't know when you would have done that. And with the players that were available to do it with, I just don't think it should have been a priority. So if it was the players and they're going to get new players, why change it? In other words, if the players were the problem, because they didn't have healthy players, and now they're going to have healthy players and some new players, because he doesn't?

Why get rid of Kingsbury and why change the offense? Well, because he works so well the year before. Well, it did work so well the year before, but it's not his preference anymore. He's allowed to change his mind as the head coach. He better be right. Pretty late, apparently. Well, thank God he didn't come to that conclusion during the first year. That's true.

I mean, there's a possibility that, you know, as you're going through that year and Jaden's, you know, taking some shots. Maybe he's like, man, I'd rather see him under center a little bit more. I'd rather see what Kyle ran for me in Atlanta when we went to the Super Bowl. But fortunately, he didn't try to change it up then because it was an elite level offense in 2024. Look, I think he had in his mind at some point, I can't tell you when, you know, I'd like the opportunity to see an offense with Jaden under center more, more play action pass, more run married to play action pass, which by the way is my preference too personally, but Cliff's offense worked very well also. And I think Jaden's going to absolutely kill it in that kind of style of offense.

But they'll still have some cliff elements to the offense. It was very creative. And they'll have some of those elements too. It'll be a happy, you know, Tommy marriage of all of these great offensive minds, all in David Blow's head. He's going to bring it all together, and they're going to be really good next year in offense. You know what? There are people around the league to think he might be.

I know. I know. So. All right. You got anything else? I got nothing else for you. boss. Okay. This was fun. Appreciate it. I'll talk to you on Thursday. Okay. I'll see you on Thursday.