The Kevin Sheehan Show - Commanders' Coaching Staff Day

Episode Date: February 22, 2024

Kevin and Thom today open with the news on whether or not Thom got a karaoke recording contract in Florida. The boys reacted to all of the Commanders' assistant coaches doing media yesterday which led to Thom's story about Ken Norton Jr.'s father's first encounter with Muhammad Ali. Some big recruiting news for Maryland Basketball and a first-ever for George Mason.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheon Show. He is Kevin. Tommy is with me on this Thursday, February 22nd. George Washington's birthday, by the way. Tommy had his moment last night.

We'll hear about that and whether or not he got a contract from Elwatusi Records. And maybe who knows? An introduction to a Hollywood director as well. The show is presented, as always, by Window Nation. Call them at 86690 Nation or head to windownation.com. Great deal going on right now, 50% off all windows, all styles, with no money down, no payments, and no interest for two full years. All right, buddy, you told me before the show that you were tweeting out some sort of teaser

about last night's, you know, big meet and greet with L. Watusi, Tusi, Records in Sammy Panama. What happened? Well, I wanted to prepare people for the bad news. Okay. You know, I guess maybe I should have saw this coming, but I had stars in my eyes. But when I got to karaoke yesterday at Kenny D's, I saw my buddy Vinny, the guy I met there with the tattoo on his face who had vouched for Sammy. He comes up to me, and he starts to apologize.

He says, you know, I didn't know. I didn't know. I said, what are you talking about? He said, it turns out that Sammy Panama was indeed running a scam. He was running a scam all along the panhandle with this karaoke recording thing and taking money from people. And thank goodness, he didn't take any money from me. But he was busted, arrested by the county sheriff's department,

although I can't find any record of it anywhere online, and that may be for another reason I'll get to. It turns out that, you know, Vinnie told me his real name was Angelo Butterfouca. It was not Sammy Panama. That's not true. No, it is. That was his real name? Yes, that was his name.

And I don't know if he's related to Joey Buttafuoco, the guy who was involved with the Long Island many years ago. But here's the word I hear from walking around Kenny D's last night is that he may have ties to the Lucchasey crime family. This is why maybe there's nothing online about him. He could be a witness protection program guy. Should we not be talking about this on the podcast right now? I think we're okay. I think we're okay.

You think we're okay? I'm starting to wonder now if Sammy Panama, aka, what is it? Andrew Botafo. Angelo Budafuco. That maybe you're building up of this relationship with Sammy Panama on this podcast and on your social media may have led to his arrest. It may have. Well, that's a problem for you. But he was okay with it.

He knew about it. You know, he was happy that I was promoting it. So he's got, I mean, wherever he is, he's got no complaints about that. You know, he may have gotten busted. He was doing this apparently in Mississippi, in Alabama, in Mobile, Alabama. He was running the same scam all along the coast of the Panhandle. He was doing this. And, you know, I don't know exactly what his background is,

but the bigger thing is I was really devastated, you know? No, that's not the bigger thing. That's not the bigger thing. No. I think it is. For your listeners. And no, everybody knew this was, no, all of my listeners, all of your listeners knew this was going to be the result. We just didn't want to tell you.

But in terms of how we got to the result, we certainly didn't know this part of it. That this guy, I mean, you may have somehow revealed some guy. who's in the witness protection program, and now he's arrested, and now whoever's after him, because he was part of the Locasio crime family, I don't like this conversation right now. We should switch it to Sam Hal quickly. No, no, no, the bigger news, the bigger news is I was crushed. That's not the bigger news. Tommy Purify is retiring from the karaoke stage.

You've heard the last from Tommy Purify. Okay. That is a secondary story to the main story here. But I'll address the secondary right now if you'd like me to. You don't quit? All right. You don't bail? There are so many other record companies out there, small labels, indie labels, karaoke labels.

The next guy will be the real guy. You stay at it. This is something that makes you. happy. I can't do it. I'm not happy anymore. I'm sad. You're sad momentarily. You're momentarily sad. I don't think I can do it. I think Tommy Purify is retired. I'm sorry. That's not true. You'll be out there in two weeks. I don't think I can. Sing and twisted and shouting or whatever. It brings back too many bad memories. Here's, okay, the other part of this story is at least you didn't give him a thousand bucks.

Yes. Might cost you more here in the long run, but at least you didn't give him a thousand bucks, and at least you were... I covered the mob. I know that. This is no big deal. But you didn't sniff out mob.

No, I didn't. Yeah. No, I didn't. I thought he was... I thought he was some guy who lived down here in Florida. You know, I was a beach guy with a record company. Mm-hmm. I was wrong.

But I'd like to move on from... from it because it's very painful. Oh, come on. It's a painful time for me. It's not a painful time for you. It is. What were you really expecting? What did you expect old Sammy Panama to show up with?

Some sort of record deal to give you some sort of, you know, cash down and a piece of the action moving forward? I didn't have any financial expectations. But I did have expectations of, of, of stage glory, you know, of the bright lights. Is that more important to you than the actual money? Yeah, at this point, because I knew I wasn't going to make a lot of money. Look, I've read too many stories about great recording artists getting ripped off by their record company, so I know that was always a possibility, but their records still get made.

So, you know. I just pulled up the Locasio. Locacy. Locacy. Not Lucasio. Okay, because Locasio is Gotti and Sammy the Bull Gravano in that group. Locacy. It's L-U-C-H-E-S-E-C-E-S-E.

Oh, got you, gotcha. Okay. Yeah. But, I mean, I'm looking now, right out the window at Kenny Dees, right down on the street where my hopes and dreams were crushed. Yeah. You know, I may have to, we may have to go to another condo next year because the view, I mean, I can't avoid the view of Kennedy's. It's just too difficult.

You're going to be fine. You're going to be fine. This is not, I would hope that this isn't the most adversity you've ever faced in your life. I don't think it is. You'll be fine. You're resilient. You've always bounced back in the past. You know, we had a bad show or two, you know, during our run. And what did we do? The next day, we were right back at it.

So that's the attitude. right back at it. If I were you, I'd pick a new song, and I'd go in there and slay them tonight, or whenever karaoke night is, next Wednesday night, whenever it is. I don't see that happen. I think it's the end of Tommy Purify. Was he really arrested? Do you really think, do you really think witness protection? I'm just speculating here. When they mentioned the Lucacey Crying family, I'm thinking, well, this guy was running some kind of penny-any scam. I mean, really, in the scope of things.

And I've covered, I know guys who have been in a witness protection program who went rogue before and try to make a little bit of money on themselves and get in trouble as a result. The thing is, what they usually do is they usually disappear in the system. They find them a new identity and move them someplace else. So they don't necessarily get in, they don't wind up in jail necessarily. necessarily. Okay? Because the FBI does not want, or whoever, the DEA, whoever was protecting them, does not want to have egg on their face. So they usually find somebody like this,

a new identity, a new location where he can rip off another bunch of Yahoo's. Is Florida a big, I wouldn't think that Florida would be a big witness protection program area that they would move. Well, no, I'm sure he's not supposed to be in Florida. He's probably supposed to be in Kansas, working out of Sinibon. I always didn't know. That was Omaha, I'm pretty sure. Omaha.

I think it was a Sinabon in Omaha. Okay. But, yeah, that's kind of what I think of. That's funny that you went to that image because I went to the same image is just, yeah, either that or where did, where did What's his face? Ray Leota?

Yeah, where'd Ray Leota end up? I don't know. It looked like Arizona, I think. Yeah, because he, the one thing he wanted was warm weather. Henry Hill. Henry Hill. Yeah.

Yeah, but he couldn't get spaghetti. No. Or he couldn't get real tomato sauce or whatever he couldn't get. Yeah, instead he got spaghetti and marinara. Linguini or something like that. The, Henry Hill, you know, for all, remember during those years,

when he was in the witness protection program and he would make appearances on Howard Stern's show? Yeah. All the time? Well, that would be going a little bit rogue. I think Henry Hill went rogue a couple of times. Yeah, but he didn't... Look, I think Sammy the Bull makes appearances now.

Yeah, I think so. ...Carrano who, like, killed 26 guys, supposedly, according to him. Yeah. You know, who turned rat on John Gotti. I mean, I've heard him make me the appearance. For instance, yeah, I mean, there's no Italian mafia with the same kind of power that there used to be when I covered them. You know, there's lots of organized crime in this country, and we love the image of the mafia. We've fallen in love with it in terms of films and books.

But, you know, I would have been, I would have been, I would have more expected maybe the Russian mafia or something like that. Yeah, like in Fargo, season three, which I just finished, which was so good. Oh, my God. I loved season three. It might be my favorite season. Yeah. The guy that plays Varga, you know, was such a great actor. I don't even know where he comes from.

I think Kara told me that he comes from some of the Harry Potter movies. I don't know if that's true. But season three was so good. Tommy last night just finished it. Finished the last three episodes last night. Mary Winstead, Elizabeth Winstead, is outstanding. Ewan McGregor is so good. He plays two people.

He plays the two brothers. And what's her face? I looked up her name, the one that plays Bergel. the police chief who then gets demoted. Carrie Coon, she's excellent. God, that was... She's very good in everything. She has been good in everything.

And it's funny because I went back, like I clearly recognized all those people, but I couldn't place them. But she's been in a number of things, including the leftovers. She was in Gone Girl. She was in something else. Oh, she was in that movie about the Washington Post.

she was in that movie. I think the leftovers. Yeah. That's what I said. She was in the leftovers. Did you like that series? I thought it was okay. I bailed on it.

I will tell you that I bailed on it. I was into it very early on and then I bailed on it. And people have said you should have stuck with it. Why did you like it? I don't know. I tell you why, I thought the season one was absolutely compelling. I mean, I don't think it got better as it went on. I think the whole notion of 20% of the population disappearing

and the leftover reaction to it was absolutely fascinating. Really? So, you know, whatever you would call that, I don't think it would be fantasy. The rapture, I think. Yeah, but what I'm saying is what would be the genre for the show, because God knows you don't want fantasy. You don't want, you know, you don't want science fiction.

Well, they didn't come back as Dragon. I know. I know that. But it would still be, I'm looking at up right now. I'd like to know what the name of that category is. It's probably just drama. Yeah. Yeah, but I thought that idea of what would happen.

Supernatural fiction is the way it was labeled. I've never heard of that genre before. By the way, it was direct. on it. As long as he saw the first season, I don't think Bayonne on it was a mistake. I don't think it got better. It was directed by Peter Berg. Hmm. Didn't know that.

Peter Berg, Friday Night Lights. Peter Berg, who used to be in Chicago, Hope. Yeah. And was somebody that Rigo knew really well. Really? Yeah, when we did the show years and years ago, we had him on the show once or twice

because I think he was a big... Well, why can't he make my movies? Well, I don't know him. I have no idea who he is. But I will say that Fargo, all of you that just kept pushing me and pushing me, I totally appreciate it. You know, you're caught up. Season 4 and season 5 are out there for me. I don't know if I'll get to it right away.

But season 3 was great. And I really thought that Mary Elizabeth Winstead, who played, Nikki Swango in that was she was great and by the way beautiful and I look I did a deep dive on some of the people on this show she ended up marrying Ewan McGregor they met on this show

he was married she had been divorced but he was married essentially left his wife and started to date her and then they got married a couple of years later and had kids because this was 2017 that this came out. But, um, it's very, you know, the Fargo reaction by you, uh, I get that in a way, because I was a latecomer to Fargo as well. I mean, it's been out for a while. Yeah, I know.

I mean, I think the first episode, the first year was what, 2000, I forget when it was, but it's been out for a while and I was reluctant to watch it because I'm very skeptical of series that have the same name as a movie. Well, how many of them have there been? How many of them have there been? I thought this seems unique to me. Oh, I think there's been lots of TV shows that were take-off of movies. Mm-hmm.

Okay. Because the movie was so great. And I think that's why I was skeptical, too, but continue. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, MASH and the odd couple are the two outliers where the TV show was as good or better than the movie. Got it. But most of the time when you have TV shows with the same title as a movie,

I think they're usually second-rate. So I was skeptical, but I'm glad I watched it because it's so entertaining. It's really entertaining. It's really the dialogue just in these shows. And, of course, just the Minnesota and the North Dakota, you know, they nailed the whole at least perception of the way everybody speaks up there, which, by the way, they do. I spent a lot of time in Minneapolis for a while.

But you told me, I'm pretty sure it was you who told me, that the season with Chris Rock, which is the next season, was great. And so I'm looking forward to that. Yeah. Yeah. I thought so. Yeah. So anyway, really, really good show.

Excellent show. And, you know, the Russian mob was involved. Some part of the Russian mob was involved. All right. Do we have any sports to talk about today? We'll figure it out. I'm sure there's something we'll come up with in the next 30 to 60 seconds, but you're going to have to listen to these sponsors first.

We'll get to the rest of the show following these words from a few of our sponsors. This segment of the show brought to you by MyBooky. Go to MyBooky.orgie. Use my promo code, Kevin D.C., and MyBooky will give you a cash bonus on your initial deposit. March Madness is coming up, and My Booky should be your home for all of the NCAA tournament games. By the way, both men and women. I think this will be a huge women's tournament in terms of the attention paid to it. They've got everything.

They've got contests. They'll have all the games. They'll have prop bets for all of the games. So go to mybooky.org. Use my promo code. And let me just mention because I did get a note from somebody who did not understand. that when you take that cash bonus, that you've got to bet. You can't just take the cash bonus and then close out your account.

There was someone who was pretty upset about not understanding how sports books work. And trust me, I understand for first time bettors, a lot of this is brand new, but there's no way that they're going to give you a big cash bonus. They're just going to put free money into your account and then allow you to just, say, oh, thanks very much, or make one wager, one small wager, and then cash out. There are rules, and they change during the course of the year. We've had some promotions where you've only had to bet your overall account amount one time, and you were eligible to cash out. But every single sports book will, you know, have rules related to when you get a bonus, you're going to have to

bet that bonus amount probably around one or two times minimum. We had a promotion here for a while where you only had to bet around at one time before you were eligible to cash out. You can always cash out from your main balance, whatever you put in, but they're not just handing free money out. They are incenting you with free cash to sign up, which is great because you've got more money to wager with, but you got a wager. That would be a great gig if you could just go sign up at every sportsbook, Tommy. Take the cash bonus and then close the account out. That would be a good business.

Anyway, MyBooky has fairness attached to it in every way, shape, and form when you compare it to a lot that's out there right now. Fair points, spreads, money lines, totals, prop bet numbers, and fair pricing. Go to my bookie.orgie.org, use my promo code, Kevin, D.C. So yesterday, I don't know if you were paying attention to this, but the team, as in the Washington commanders, made a lot of their assistant coaches available for one-on-one interviews, and it was mostly for the beat reporters that were out at the park. And, you know, I noticed this morning, man,

there was a lot of follow-up on all of these assistant coaches, interviews with, you know, not the court, We've already had the press conferences for the coordinators, Kingsbury and Joe Whit, Jr. But I saw conversations with Anthony Lynn and Tevita Pritchard and the offensive one, new offensive line coach, Ken Norton Jr. And it just occurred to me, and maybe I'm completely wrong on this, and I just don't remember it being this way. I don't recall when a new staff has come in before, that all of the assistant coaches were like made available to the media. I mean, look, the staff is important. Don't get me wrong. The overall coaching staff is really

important, but it's like the obsession over every single thing that the team is doing, especially on social media. I'm not saying that most of you are really engaged in this, because my sense is that most of you are not. Most of you are just thinking about free agency and the draft. You're not necessarily really into finding out, you know, how Ken Norton Jr. arrived in Washington to work for Dan Quinn or some assistant coach that you've never heard of until two weeks ago. But is it me or is this kind of new where all of the assistant coaches are doing media appearances? Well, let's think back to when we've had a change in coaching here. And this is just off the cuff.

I mean, this is something I probably would have researched maybe a little bit before I did this. But, you know, last time it was 2020 with Ron Rivera, and it was during COVID. Okay? So I'm not sure that type of thing would have been available. Well, it wasn't during COVID to begin with. He was hired in January of 2020. and the staff was filled out before the world shut down in March of 2020. Yeah, that's true.

Well, we're almost into March. I understand that. But this time, four years ago, no one was walking around with masks and social distancing. Rivera was hired much sooner than Quinn was. His staff was put together even faster than Quinn was. Yeah. I don't know if they did this or not. Brutes never would have done.

it with Jay Gruden because Bruce didn't want anyone talking to anyone. Right. Bruce Allen. So probably, I know it didn't happen with Jay Grum because Bruce, Bruce Allen didn't want anyone talking. Yeah. I'm looking at his staff. I don't know.

I'm looking at Ron's staff from 2020. You know, he hired Jack Del Rio. Obviously, we heard from Del Rio. We heard from Scott Turner, I'm pretty sure. Although, to be honest with you, I don't even remember Scott Turner's introductory press conference, but I'm sure they did one. And then, you know, do you remember Jim Hostler,

the wide receivers coach, or Drew Terrell, or Pete Hainer? I do remember Pete Hainer, but I don't know that he was interviewed. John Matzko, the offensive line coach. No, I don't remember any of that. Meaning they may have done it, but I don't remember it. But I think it's smart.

Why? I think, oh, because people get excited about listening to the football coaches, talk about how they're going make their players play hard. That's true. It's pretty much it. It's pretty much it.

That's it. Oh, wow, this guy, he's going to make them run through walls, you know, as opposed to the other coaches who came in and said, don't play so hard, you know? They don't put you don't have to play that hard this time. No, these guys are going to make them play really hard. You know, not like the last group that just said it's okay. Just take a day off here and there. That's what people get excited about.

I mean, look, look how excited we were after hearing Joe Witt in his press conference. I mean, you know, the defensive coordinator. I mean, there's a lot of emotion, and it reaches into you when you hear football guys talking about, look, look, we all know the ultimate guy when it comes to this is Doc Walker. Doc Walker talking about football and that kind of emotion moves you. Okay, so this makes sense. I know, but Doc would be rolling his eyes, you know, on a day like yesterday saying, okay, but, you know, I need to see it first. You know, great.

We're going to get our guys to play really hard. We're going to get our guys to play really physical and fast. Yes. Yes, all the things that the last coach and crew didn't do. Yeah. You know, but I think it's smart. I think this is every day they can trot out something that is a new development and not, you know, I think it's a positive for them, you know, publicity-wise.

I think it's great if I were them. I think that makes sense. Like I don't think it, you know, what you've got to be careful of, of course, is when you have so many people speaking on your coaching staff, you just have to make sure that they're coached up and that all they're talking about is our guys are going to play hard, they're going to play fast, they're going to be finishers, they're going to be physical, you know, we're going to coach them up best we can. Rather than talking about how, oh, yeah, no, I was with Adam Peters the other day. he really likes Jaden Daniels. You've got to make sure that something like that doesn't slip out. Look, these things are so frivolous, like in the larger scheme of things. I'm not saying that their jobs are or their contributions are, but these conversations are.

However, I do think that I agree with you, which is for them to put these guys out there, it's consistently keeping the team top of mind. And, you know, they've probably gotten used to, you know, especially now with Dan gone and more excitement and this big, you know, this last month, which included the hiring of a general manager and the head coach and two coordinators that every time they make people available, it ends up, you know, creating another 24-hour cycle of talking about the team. that they control, that they have dictated.

So, yeah, I think it's smart. I look, as far as preparing them, that's just one, getting them all, you know, that's just one conversation. I mean, you know, just, you know, like you just said, talk about this, talk about football, this football, talk about coaching, you know, if they ask any player about any specific players, just play it off. It's not that hard. I mean, you know, I mean, sometimes guys go out.

off the reservation. That's what you have to be... Yeah, that's what you have to be worried about. Yeah. I mean, I'll tell you what, you watch Cliff Kingsbury in his press conference? That was, without, you know, it wasn't very emotional. Pro.

I mean, it was just the opposite. But the way he just played off when people would bring up players or things, that was a master class right there. Yeah, total pro. Yeah. A lot of people really like Cliff Kingsbury. I've just read a lot about the reaction, especially college people, really think that he is special in terms of a coach and working with quarterbacks in particular. I'm sure you read this, and I talked about it the other day on the show without you, it was confirmed that by Antonio Pierce, actually, the Raiders coach, who said that,

essentially we thought we had Kingsbury, but Magic Johnson basically plucked him from us and sent him to Washington. Now, what I said the other day is I don't really, I certainly hope that Cliff Kingsbury didn't come to Washington because Magic Johnson, you know, like he was hero-worshipping Magic Johnson and was like, oh, Magic, Magic, Magic wants me to go to D.C., I'll go to D.C. I don't think that was it at all. But, you know, having magic available to perhaps reach out to a guy he knows. And I'm not saying that he does know him, but it makes sense that in Southern California, you know, Lincoln Kennedy and Magic and the whole L.A. scene and SC football is a pretty big deal. Maybe he did know Kingsbury and say, you know, wait a minute, maybe you should talk to Washington first. Who knows?

But I think that's the hire that is the most intriguing out of all of the hires they've made over the last month is the Kingsbury hire. I'm actually super intrigued, curious, and kind of excited to see him work with a young quarterback here. I'm thoroughly curious to see how he does because his track record is up and down. I mean, people can paint a negative picture of Cliff Kingsbury if they want to,

but he's also had a lot of success. And that's not a knock on his knowledge. People say he's brilliant, you know? So, yeah, I'm curious as well. Well, what you do? If Magic called you and said, no, don't go work for somebody. else come work for me. What would you do?

Well, I mean, I would probably go work for magic because I would assume that the offer and the opportunity would be much better than working for some big radio company. Yes. That's a given. Now, one of the name that's interesting to me,

but for total non-football reasons, is Ken Norton. I knew you were going to say that. You know what he said about this gig? He said it's where everybody wants to be right now. I know. He said that. And I can see that. I can see that in part because of the publicity that it's gotten. Tommy. Once they got past the bump in the hiring, once Dan Quinn came aboard, then I think it did create some kind of momentum. I think it's play hard. We're going to play physical. We're going to be fast. And this is where everybody wants to be. I think that was part of the message. No, this is a much more desirable place than it's been over the last 20 years, obviously.

Yes. You know, but it's not the most desirable place. You know what it's like? What? It's like taking a tour of an abandoned prison. Okay, like in Philly, you could take a tour of the Eastern State Penitentiary. Okay, it's a tourist attraction now. but before it was hell.

Okay? So this is sort of like taking a tour of a former, like taking a tour of Alcatraz. This used to be Alcatraz. Now it's not. Um, yeah. I mean,

it would be more like Chernobyl, I think would be taking a tour of Chernobyl. That's really what it would be about, which by the way, my son did, my oldest son took a tour of Chernobyl in the Ukraine

like 10 years ago not 10 years ago it couldn't have been 10 years ago it was more like 5 years ago it was right before the war started they were in over there

and you know there's only so much that you're allowed to still go near in that tour I never that's another show that I did not watch that documentary

or that that series on HBO on Chernobyl. Yeah, I didn't want. I didn't need to watch. I mean, the whole thing is depressing enough. I didn't need to watch a show about it. Yeah. Let me tell you, I want to share

Ken Norton's senior story with you. Oh, yeah, please. That I'm hoping to share with him at some point. But I'm betting that he doesn't know about it. Well, they're all available right now. You can go out and get them. Yes. Yes, they are.

Yes, they are. You know, I didn't cover him. that's before my time as a sports writer. I was not, I didn't cover, but I became close friends with his trainer, Eddie Futch, who wound up training in Riddick Bo. And I became very close to Eddie and spent hours interviewing Eddie and got some great interviews on tape and stuff. And Eddie was Norton's trainer. Wasn't he Joe Frazier?

Well, Eddie Futch was Frazier's trainer, too. He had 18 world champions. Eddie Fudge did. a trainer, the greatest trainer in the history of boxing. But he told me this story about when Ollie was exiled from boxing, you know, for his position on the draft, he still used to travel around the country to different boxing gyms and do sparring to kind of like stay in semi-shape. And one time at the Hoover Street gym in L.A., where Eddie was trained in Norton,

Ali was sparring with a bunch of heavyweights. And then when he was done, Ali asked if anyone else was up for a sparring session. Ali asked Eddie if his guy who was Norton, who was unknown at the time, was up for sparring. And Eddie said he had been waiting for him to make the suggestion. So he said yes. The gym was filled with people because Ali was, you know,

people heard about Ollie being there. And he told Norton, don't be a smart guy. go in there and try to learn something. Just go along and work with him. Don't try anything cute. But if he tries to take advantage of you, take care of yourself. Okay. Norton did that when he first began sparring.

But the gym started getting more crowded. Ali wanted to put on a show. So before the second round started, Ali yelled, okay, boy, I'm through playing with you. I'm going to put something on you now. So Eddie told Norton, okay, now you can take care of yourself. Ali didn't realize how strong Norton was.

At one point, Ali tried to back Norton in a corner. Norton picked him up and threw him into the corner. And basically, he gave Ali a war. It turned into a war, hard right hands against each other. Now the crowd was really screaming. They went against each other for another minute or so. And then the next day, that was the end of it. The next day, Ali came back to the gym,

I want Norton. I want to spar with him again. And Eddie told him, he said, yesterday you came in looking for a workout. Today, you came in looking for a fight. When this kid fights you, he's going to get paid for him. And he did. A couple of times.

And he did. Three times. The third time, his dad, Kenny Norton, really got screwed. That was the third fight at Yankee Stadium in 76, that he clearly won. Tommy, the first fight was the fight in which he broke Ali's jaw, right? Yes, it was. Yes, and he got the victory in that one.

Yeah, so why, I mean, Ali had to know before fighting him that it was going to be a really good fight. I don't know. Was Norton a known entity when they fought in 73? Not particularly. Uh-huh. Not particularly, but you see, the thing is, Eddie, like, styles make fights. Eddie Futch had Ali's number. And he trained Fraser.

He trained Norton. He knew how to get to Ali. You know, on the other hand, he didn't have George Foreman's number. You know, George Foreman crushed Joe Fraser in two rounds. He crushed Ken Norton in two rounds. So, you know, while Eddie might have been a great trainer, he didn't have what it took to go up against Foreman,

preparing his fighters, which is associated style. house make fight. I just pulled up Norton's career. So I don't, so he, so he beats Ali when he broke Ali's jaw. For those that don't know, Ali literally went the distance with a broken jaw, because he broke that jaw, correct me if I'm wrong, Tommy, very early in the fight, right? Yes, yes. And so he literally fought with a broken jaw, you know, call it 10 rounds or something like that. And he lost a split decision to Norton in that fight. It was March 3rd. 31st, 1973, which means at that point in time, Ali was not a champion. Ali was not a champion.

Forman was the champion. Forman, he had already knocked out Fraser to take the title at that point? Yes. Okay. So then they fought, I mean, this is boxing back then, right? They fought on the last day of March, and then six months later, they're back in the ring against each other at the forum in Inglewood, L.A., and Ali wins a split decision. That is not a fight I know anything about. What was that fight about? Because the Yankee

Stadium fight, I remember as a kid, that my father, who was a big Ali guy, was absolutely convinced that Ali didn't win that fight. That Norton had won that fight. I don't remember much about the second fight. Okay. What's interesting about the third fight is besides the fact that Ali, you know, won a decision he should have won. It was in Yankee Stadium, okay, and outdoor, like back years ago, a lot of fights used to happen in stadiums. Yeah. It didn't happen so much anymore in the United States, but there was a New York police strike going on at the same time. And it was very little, if any, police presence at Yankee Stadium for a heavyweight

title fight. So it was pretty chaotic in the crowd, pretty ugly at times, in the crowd as well, because there were, I don't think there were any cops there. I think they had to hire, you know, security, private security to do the fight. And it was, it was quite a madhouse, as I understand it. But, you know, Ollie, that's a year after Ollie, you know, had the Trilla in Manila, the fight against Fraser, that probably was the point where he should have quit at that point. You know, but he continued fighting until 78 when he fought Leon Spinks twice, and then he came back to fight Holmes in 81. Trevor Bobbock, right? Or 80. Dwayne Bobbick, you know.

Trevor Bobbock. Not Trevor Berbik. Burbick, yeah, that guy. Yeah. That was his last fight, I'm pretty sure. Yeah, that was his last fight.

But, you know, so I don't know much about the second, but the third that, and then, you know, he fought, he was named because of the politics of these boxing federations. The WBC,

I think, had stripped I forget who Maybe had stripped Ali or stripped Spinks I forget who the champion was for the World Boxing Council at the time

and they declared the title they declared Norton who was the number one contender as the champion so Norton became a heavyweight champion without having to win the title in the ring and then his first defense

his first defense once against Lackie Harry Holmes, one of the great fights in the history of February championship boxing. And Larry Holmes beat a very close 15-round decision to become heavyweight champion. Split decision. June 9th, 1978, Caesar's Palace, Holmes Norton. Yeah.

Do you know what Norton's final fight was? Was it Cooney? It was. I remember that. He destroyed him. Knocked him out. Remember, he was like in the corner. and he got hit a couple times when he was almost on one knee, if my memory is right on that.

And that was the end. He didn't fight again. And, of course, Cooney went on to fight Holmes in that massively built-up fight and was not really a match for him. Cooney had a devastating left-hand hunt. Yeah, left-hand hook. Okay, absolutely devastating. And although, you know, Holmes pretty much handled him, you know, he was, You could say he was mismanaged or not.

I mean, he had two managers that they called the Gold Dust Twins. I forget their names, but they were – the boxing writers considered him idiots. But they basically carefully orchestrated his career, so he never really had a big challenge. Okay? And he had a trainer, Victor Valle, who was not a – that's really a great trainer. if you had put Jerry Cooney in with a trainer like Angela Dundee or Emmanuel Stewart or Eddie Futch who thought very highly of Cooney

I think Cooney could have been a great fighter as well I mean the Cooney story was about him being the Great White Hope I mean that was everything about Jerry Cooney and I mean I remember the buildup for that fight against Holmes it was huge Huge. Huge.

It was. It was. It was ugly, too. Yeah, I would bet you that that was, that had to be the most built-up heavyweight fight since any fight that Ali was involved in. They fought, I'm looking at it right now in 1982, June of 82. So this is really the beginning of Sugar Ray Leonard, Roberto Duran, Tommy Hearns, and the middle classes really taking over the sport in the 80s. You know, I mean, Tyson came along, but that fight was massive. Was there a fight that had been any bigger?

I mean, I know the build-up to Holmes Ali was big. I mean, that was, you know, a sad night, obviously. But Cooney Holmes was a massive pop culture event. Yes, it was. And the racial overtones were pretty ugly. I remember Sports Illustrated before the fight had put Cooney, I think, on their cover. Not the champion Holmes, but put Cooney on the cover.

You know, the whole fight was about Cooney, you know, and the Great White Hope, and Don King really milked that for all its worth. But they were really scared in Vegas. That was at the outdoor arena, temporary arena, that they would set up on the tennis courts at Caesar's Palace. Right, yeah. And, well, it was in the parking. It was in the parking lot.

Okay. Yeah, because I thought it was in the tennis court. Caesar's Palace and the Mirage over, like, you know, that 20-year period had all, when the Mirage got built, had all of the fights. And the fights, I'm pretty sure, were in the parking lot, like behind, you know, away from the strip. Yeah, behind the arena. Yeah. Okay. Well, the Las Vegas police had snipers on roofs and different places for that fight because they were so scared of what.

could happen in terms of a riot in terms of some kind of bad criminal act that might take place. They were really frightened about what could happen from that fight. And as we know, Holmes gave Cooney a boxing lesson and stopped them, I think, in the 13th round. Yeah. Man, I'm looking at Holmes. He had, he fought a long time. Yeah. His last fight was in 2002 against Butterbee.

He fought butter bean, that's right. Yeah. At the scope in Norfolk, or Norfolk, as they say down there. All right, well, hopefully. I covered a Perdo-Wittaker fight at the scope once. Well, hopefully you'll get a chance after Ken Norton, Jr. tells you how hard they're going to hit and how hard they're going to play and how fast they're going to play and how great it is to be here

and how this is the place everybody wants to be, you'll get a chance to tell that story. You've got a lot of good boxing stories. I mean, you were around a lot of those trainers and fighters during those years. It's pretty cool. Tommy is a Hall of Fame boxing writer as well as, of course, a Hall of Fame baseball writer and Hall of Fame baseball voter, for those of you that didn't know. He is not under contract with Elwatusi Records as of today because I don't think it actually exists. All right, we'll finish up with a few things.

Tommy had a couple of other lefty stories he wanted to tell. And there was a big, unprecedented win for a local team last night. We'll get to that right after these words from a few of our sponsors. All right, Tommy, tell me about Shelly's. Well, you know, whenever I talk about Shelly's here on the podcast, I usually give the address, 1331F Street, Northwest. But I really want to emphasize the people, what a great location that is. in the district.

Phenomenal location. Great, looks. It really is. It's right. It's across the street on F Street from the National Press Club building. Yep. Okay. It's like, I mean, just a couple blocks from all the Smithsonian, you know, museums.

It's a short walk to the White House. I told you before, it's a perfect location to take your family into the, you know, the National Museum of Art, the National Gallery of Art, and then bail on them and say, you'll text me when you're done. I'll be up the road a couple of blocks. Well, that's that's... The National Gallery of Art, you know, like East Wing, that's a bit of a hike. But, yes, that's a good idea.

That's always been your strategy. Yeah. Yes, absolutely. And the other thing is it's a great metro location. You take the Metro Center, Metro Rail Station, and you use the 13th Street Station exit. And you're pretty much right there. You're just a half a block away. So, I mean, you know, even that, I'll tell you why, you can even, and Shelly's post this on their website, shelley's backroom.com.

If you're so inclined, you can take a bus, Metro Route Bus, Route 52 and 54, will take you right to Shelly. You got the bus route. What's the last time you took a bus? Is that the T4 to the J7? The last time I took a bus? Oh my God. I mean, you're not referring to actual rented-out buses for parties, are you? No, no, I'm talking about city bus.

I mean, I can't remember. I can't remember. But if you need to take a bus to Shelly's, it's easy to do. Shelly's back room, it's a great location, and you can get there all sorts of ways. Right. There's a bus stop, I think, right across the street. It'll drop you off right across the street. Right there. Yeah? So there you go. For those of you wanting to bus it. You know...

I think you ride the bus for free now in the district, don't you? Or I think they actually pay you to ride the bus. Why would you get to ride the bus for free? I think aren't they free bus rides now? I don't know. Why would they be free? I think I read that somewhere. I could be wrong. Really?

We offer for, this city offers totally free transportation via the bus? Maybe not. I think I read that. I think people have talked about doing that. Okay. That seems like a bad business model for the city. You know what is right around the corner from Shelleys is Warner Theater.

and there are lots of really good shows at Warner Theater. I mean, that's literally one block and you take a right, and it's right down there on the left-hand side. Well, and National Theater is just around the corner. The National Theater's right around the corner, too. Yeah. Great location. Great location.

So before you finish up with what you want to finish up, I wanted to mention a couple of things real quickly. George Mason beat Dayton last night, 71 to 67. Dayton is the 6.7. 16th ranked team in the country. That is the first home win over a ranked team in program history for George Mason. Remember, they were a final four team. You know, Jim Laronaga had some really good Mason teams. Here's the thing. They just don't have a lot of ranked teams that come to the Patriot Center to play them. So that's been the issue. But Tommy, in 1980s,

It was Bias as junior or senior year. So it would have been either 85 or 86. Maryland, and Lefty did this. Lefty played everybody in town that wanted to play him. He always did. And that created the big thing with Georgetown and Maryland when Georgetown decided that they were done playing Maryland. But they played Mason all the time. They went and, you know, this was not something Maryland did a lot.

they would play Mason and GW and AU at Cole Fieldhouse. They weren't about to go play GW at the Smith Center. There was just, you know, there was a bigger opportunity at Cole Fieldhouse. They went to the Patriot Center and played Mason. And I think Marilyn was probably ranked 14th or 15th in the country. And they barely won the game. And it was a great game. It was like 83 to 82, something like that.

And I went to that game with a bunch of friends. we were in school in college park at the time. Great environment. I mean, Mason was nothing. Although coaching Mason, Jesus, I've got to look this up now. I wonder who is the coach at George Mason in 1986. Because if it was potentially Joe Harrington, that's why Lefty played him there. Well, he coached for Lefty.

It was Joe Harrington. It was Joe Harrington. Okay. Yeah. So that's why they probably played him there. You know, who else coached at Mason briefly after, I think Rick Barnes was, I got to look up. Oh, okay. Rick Barnes coached at Mason.

I think it was after he had been an assistant briefly with Gary at Ohio State. because Rick Barnes was an assistant for Gary either at Ohio State or Boston College, but I think it was Ohio State. And then I'm looking up Rick Barnes right now. Rick Barnes, Rick Barnes's first job, head coaching job was at George Mason, 1987, 1988. Look at you.

You're walking college basketball history in the DMB. Well, you know what? I'm going to play hard every day. I'm going to play hard. I'm going to play fast. I'm going to bring it. So that was one college basketball story. So congrats to Mason, who's actually having a pretty good season right now. Now, they're not going to be an at-large team, you know, out of the A-10. Dayton's the only ranked team in the A-10. Richmond, I know, is good,

but Mason is 18-8 overall on the season, and that's a big win for them. But I think they'll probably have to win the A-10 tournament to get a bid. Maryland, who lost the other night at Wisconsin, and I don't think I talked about it at all on the podcast yesterday. By the way, if you missed it, John Lucas was great on the podcast yesterday. He was one of my favorite, Tommy, one of my favorite players as a kid, John Lucas was. I was right-handed, but I'd be out at the basketball court in the neighborhood or anybody that had a basketball hoop. I'd be trying to shoot left-handed set shots, just like John Lucas did. not very well left-handed.

But Marilyn lost a heartbreaker to Wisconsin the other night. My God, they've been close in almost every game they've played. I mean, it's been incredible. They are one and eight in games decided by four points or less, which is almost every single one of their losses. Two things. One, Wisconsin is the Duke of the Big Ten, meaning they get the kindest whistle at home of any team in the Big Ten.

And it was like four or five years ago. Marilyn played Wisconsin, and I'm watching the game. I'm like, are you kidding me? This is like Duke treatment that Wisconsin's getting. And I tweeted something out. I'm like, in the three or two or three, four years, whatever it was at the time, we've been in the Big Ten. It would appear to me that Wisconsin's the team that gets the benefit of the whistle at home more than any other school.

And I'm telling you, Tommy, I'll never forget. Every Big Ten fan responded. 100% right makes no sense for years. We've been complaining about the same thing. And it's like, why Wisconsin? Like maybe Indiana, maybe Michigan State, but no, Wisconsin. And they got some just horrendous calls that went their way that really impacted Maryland's chance to win the game. But that's not what I really wanted to get to. What I wanted to get to is this. Maryland yesterday got a commitment from the number 10 player in the country, Derek Queen, five-star player, their first five-star guy since Diamondstone was recruited back by Turgeon in 2015.

But Derek Queen, it came down to Indiana, Kansas, in Maryland, and the Terps got him. And he's from Baltimore, played at Montvertee Prep. He's coming back, and this is a huge get for Kevin Willard. Massive. You know, there's some pressure building on Kevin Willard here in his second season. I think completely unnecessarily so. he needed to sign this kid. Six, nine, versatile, really good hands, which is what I've noticed from watching all of his tape.

You know, not every big guy, you know, can catch. He's got really, really soft hands, and he's going to be, you know, their class, which was nothing, will jump up into, like, the top 25 with this signing or close to it. And then he's got to be really busy in the portal. He's going to have to add a point guard to replace Jemir Young, who's been sensational. But huge get for the Terps recruiting-wise. Their first five-star guy in nine years. So good for them.

They've got a lot of four-star guys. Tons of four-star guys. You know, Mello Trimble and Anthony Cowan and, you know, Wiggins and sticks. Lots of big-time four-star guys. Deshaun Harris-Smith from last year's class. But this is a big get. All right. You wanted to finish up because you wrote another column with some of the Lefty stories that you hadn't told.

Yeah, I mean, you know, Lefty was, like I said in the column, Lefty was a larger than life figure. So his death should reflect that because he came into contact with so many people in basketball history in this country for the past 50-plus years, 60-plus years. and he told me so many stories when I spent time with him. I just wanted to share some more. One was, he told a lot about Pete Marevich. Pete Marevich was one of, he used to hire Pete Marevich to work at his camp. And he was close to Marevich. And he said this I'd never heard before.

Maybe it's been out there. He said to me, you know, Pete may have been too fit as a pro. When he came up to the pros, people started roughing him up. So he took karate lessons. He got a black belt. These guys would push him, and he would say to them, I'm telling you, I'm going to break your hand. The word got out that he was a black belt. Put your hand on me, and I'll break your wrist, he would tell them.

So they laid off him a little bit. But he had to do that because people were putting hands on him and stuff. Wow. That's pretty wild. Yeah. I would have thought there would have been a lot of respect for him. But he was thin. He was very thin.

Yeah. It's floppy socks, the whole thing. Didn't look the part, I guess. No. All right. Well, read Tommy's column. He's got, you know, one lefty story after another, and they've all been great all week long,

and those that you guys have been sending have been spectacular to read. I've gotten back to a lot of you on some of them. You know, Lucas was so great yesterday, and, you know, he talked about, you know, he reminded me, because I'd forgotten this, that in the early days of lefty at Maryland, when he walked out of the tunnel onto the field at Cole Fieldhouse, they played hail to the chief. I mean, he was so revered, and he had brought something so exciting to College Park.

You know, the one thing that was pretty consistent across the board this week, I had McMillan on the radio show the other day. He was great. Lucas on the podcast yesterday is that, well, two things. One, his players, like you said, with Charlie Scott, who didn't play for him, they were constantly in contact with Lefty throughout his entire life, whether it was them reaching out or Lefty just picking up the phone and calling them. There was a lifelong relationship with his players. He loved his players, and his players loved him. But, you know, Lucas really emphasized, you know, there's all this talk about the Duke Brotherhood and the Carolina Brotherhood.

He said the Maryland Basketball Brotherhood is very, very close. And in his circles, it's because of Lefty. You know, he goes, you know, Buck Williams and Albert King and all of the, they all stay close. And then Gary's players, same thing, you know, from Gary's years. And he said, the thing about Lefty that he doesn't get credit for, you know, he didn't say it quite this way. But I had mentioned, you know, Dean Smith kind of integrated North Carolina basketball by, recruiting Charlie Scott and Dean Smith was always the guy that was sort of labeled as the progressive with the conscience, you know, during that era. And he did. He was an incredible coach and an incredible human being.

But he said, you know, Lefty, after he didn't get Charlie Scott, recruited Mike Malloy, the first black player to play at Davidson. Lefty was the first coach to hire a black assistant coach in George Ravling. He's like, Lefty doesn't get the credit he deserves for being incredibly bold and, you know, he didn't use the word progressive for the time, but that's what he meant. And Dean Smith got all of that credit, but Lefty was just as, you know, kind of at the forefront of all of that. He also told me something I didn't know. He said that Lefty was the first to just let people put their nicknames on the back of the jerseys. You know, he didn't care about that. He was player-friendly.

He wanted players to, you know, be able to express themselves. And so... Yes, he did. So, like, Jim... Another guy who spoke of players expressing their talent. He understood how important it was to players to do that. Yeah. And so the guys had nicknames on the back of their jerseys.

I didn't remember that at all. But, you know, and the other thing that he just said, Like, you know, Lucas was an incredible high school athlete and highly recruited by everybody in the state of North Carolina. He came out of Durham. And I said, well, why did you pick Lefty? He said, well, first of all, Lefty was still friends with my parents. I think he said his father's still alive at 103 years old. And Lefty and his wife, Joyce, when she was alive, would go and visit Lucas's parents, you know, occasionally.

They kept in touch throughout their lives. Lefty, if he walked into your home, coaches used to say, if he gets into the home, it's over, especially if the mother's home. But Lucas said, you know, Dean Smith said, nah, you know, I don't know if you're even going to start as a freshman and no, you can't play tennis.

And Lefty said, if you're my best point guard, you're going to start as a freshman. Lucas was the first freshman to start in the country because it was the first year of first. freshman eligibility, and he started day one. So he actually was the first freshman college basketball player to start an NCAA tournament game, at least according to Lucas. And as far as tennis goes, Lefty said, of course you can play tennis.

You want to play tennis, you play tennis. And Lucas was one of the greatest tennis players in the history of the ACC. Lefty made it player friendly for sure. All right. else? I got nothing else for you. All right. Try to summon up the, you know, the fortitude, the resilience, the toughness to bounce back and get ready for Wednesday night.

You've got to be out there singing something. You can do this. This is the end. This is the end of Tommy Purify. All right. Back tomorrow, everybody. I was gambling in Havana. I took a little rest.

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