The Kevin Sheehan Show - Commanders Done Til Training Camp

Episode Date: June 16, 2025

Kevin opened with NBA Playoffs, USOpen, and the Commanders' being done with all off-season activities until training camp. He talked about what we've learned about the team through mini-camps and OTAs and what we still need to find out. Chelsea Janes/Washington Post jumped on to talk about Dave Martinez's comments following the Nats' loss to the Marlins on Saturday. Kevin finished up with the some perhaps, disturbing RFK Stadium news from over the weekend along with a congrats to the DC Defenders winning the UFL Championship.  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it, but you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Here's Kevin. One guest on the show today, Chelsea James from the Washington Post, will join me in the next segment. We'll talk about Dave Martinez's comments after the Nats lost to the Marlins on Saturday. If you didn't hear or read what he said after that game, stay tuned. Chelsea, next segment.

This show's presenting sponsor is always Windonation. 86690 Nation, windonation.com, if you need new windows. This from Ed to start the show, Ed writes, Kevin, first of all, I love that your podcast and radio show are usually different. I listen to both and you do a great job of creating two different listens, but you can't change your opinion from one show to the next. Next, you're doing what the paid pick sites do, and he adds a laughing emoji. Give out both sides of a game so that they can get more business from the 50% of customers that won. You said you thought Oklahoma City would win the NBA finals three weeks ago, but then you picked the Pacers before game four.

What the hell? Still love the show. I didn't do that. I'm almost positive I didn't do that. I did pick Oklahoma City early in the playoffs. If you had said to me, you picked, you know, I forget who I picked in the finals. I think I picked Boston Golden State. I think I, before the playoffs started, I picked Boston and Golden State to get to the finals.

And then early in the postseason, like right after the first round, I said, nope, I've watched enough of the Thunder. I've seen enough. I'm picking them to win the whole thing, even though they don't have the typical experience required to win an NBA championship. But I picked Oklahoma City, yes, starting three plus weeks ago, almost a month ago, and I picked them before the finals to win in five games. And I don't think that I picked the Pacers even to win game four. I know that after game three, what I said was this series is going seven, and it's a bit of a toss-up now. Yeah, I mean, I'd seen three games, and the Pacers have been incredibly impressive. And after they won game three, you know, I basically said, I've seen enough. I know I predicted Oklahoma City in five, but I'm

obviously wrong on that. And I may be wrong on just the notion that they were going to win this thing easily, because Indiana's really good. And I think I just predicted seven games with it, you know, potentially being able to go either way. That's not a big. That's not what you suggested. And that was a funny analogy for those of you like me who are familiar with those businesses that sell picks. People don't buy picks from people, honestly. You know just as much as anybody else does.

I have gone through all, I've made all the mistakes over the years in gambling, many of them when I was much younger and much more naive. But that was funny, Ed, because yeah, those paid pick sites, at least a lot of them, not all of them, will basically give out both sides of a game, and then the 50% of people that won, they'll sell, you know, hopefully a month's worth of picks or a year's worth of picks to. But yeah, no, I did not pick the Pacers. In fact, I don't think I did pick them to win game four. Although, let me just mention, and this will be the NBA talk,

because I am so pumped for tonight's game, Game 5-22 series. Series has been incredible. These have been great NBA playoff games and a great NBA finals, the intensity. I had Scott on the radio show this morning. He was on his way down to Oklahoma City. He said being in both of those venues has been unbelievable in the basketball, so intense, so physical. I think so great.

You know, I'm sick of selling it to those of you who don't want it. It's almost too late, but I mean, hell, it's 2-2 in the NBA finals. We've got game 5 tonight. But real quickly, a couple of things about game 4. I actually thought, and Ed, if they had lost, I would have been here. If Oklahoma City had lost game four, I would have been here on today's show saying it's over, even though Oklahoma City would still be capable of winning three games. They wouldn't be out of it. They would still play games four, five, six, and seven, or games five, six, and seven if necessary.

But I thought during game four on Friday night, there was a moment there where I thought Oklahoma City was done. I thought they looked shot. I thought they looked like they had kind of had it, taken from them. And they had lost their confidence. And Indiana was rolling. They had a 10-point lead. You know, and 10-point leads aren't anything. But, God, man, in that third quarter, it just looked like OKC was dead. And then the fourth quarter came. And Shea Gilgis Alexander, SGA, the league's MVP, took the game over. Scored, what was it? 14 of the team's last 15 points, rallied the team from a big deficit to a seven point win. By the way, a 7.1 at the very end that was a cover for Oklahoma City.

They were six and a half point favorites, and there were a lot of free throws and miss free throws down the stretch that cost anybody that had Indiana in that game. What's interesting is that after that game, and thinking at one point that Oklahoma City was done, it was kind of like game one in that Indiana was kind of done, but this was more about the series being over. They were on the verge of being down 3-1, and they just looked like they didn't have enough answers.

I think Indiana is a better coach team. I think Rick Carlisle is better than Mark Degnell. I do. Now, Degnalt made the big adjustment that I suggested here before game four. I said they cannot use SGA as the primary ball handler against Indiana's full court pressure. It is wearing him out. they didn't and they rested him more. That was at least a change that I thought was kind of obvious. I mean, to anybody that was paying attention to the series, you had to take him off the ball,

use Williams, use Dort, use Caruso, use some of the bigs against the pressure. You know, this series is very unique in that it's very hard to find in history of the NBA playoffs. games in which both teams are full court pressing. It's crazy. They are full court pressing both teams. They're picking up 90 feet, basically, man to man, and they're trapping a little bit here and there. But I thought a big move from Oklahoma City, as I suggested before the game,

is you've got to handle the pressure differently, and you cannot wear SGA out by asking him to bring the ball up, against Nemhart in particular, who's a phenomenal defender. It wore him out in game three. And they didn't, and he had a lot left in the tank at the end, and he was sensational. I know a lot of you were bitching about the officiating, and yeah, look, Scott Foster games are always interesting, no doubt. And I can't sit here and tell you that there weren't some calls that went Oklahoma City's way that were questionable. But ultimately, they had the same number of fouls called on each team.

Oklahoma City had 26 fouls called against them. Indiana had 27, and Indiana was forced to foul at the end. So if the game had come down to the last possession, Oklahoma City probably would have ended up with more fouls in the game. Great series, intense. SGA was great. I love everything about these NBA finals, and I can't wait for game five tonight. Oklahoma City's a nine and a half point favorite. I don't think that. that any result here over the final three games at this point will surprise me. Before the series began, I certainly thought Oklahoma City would win and would win easily. I thought they were the better team. I thought they were the best defensive team that I had watched in years in the NBA playoffs. Indiana played a weak defensive team in the Knicks. They had played Cleveland, not a very good defensive team. And I just felt like Oklahoma City's D would be too much for Indiana.

over, you know, a best of seven series. I was wrong. Indiana's every bit Oklahoma City's equal, even though the odds makers still really like Oklahoma City. They've got them as nine and a half point favorites tonight in game five. And they have them currently as a, let me just see where it is. My bookie has currently Oklahoma City minus 510. to win the series. Best out of three. I know two games are in Oklahoma. I understand that. Indiana,

one game one, and they kind of stole game one there. I think they can win another game in Oklahoma City. I'm not predicting it. I'm going to predict Oklahoma City wins the series in seven at this point. But man, that is a massive favorite at my bookie.org. Use my promo code, Kevin, DC, for a cash bonus on your initial deposit. wild, man, wild that they are minus 5, 10 favorites to win this series at 2-2. But that's what the odds makers have liked all along. Yeah, this series has been sensational to watch. Those of you who have watched it, no, you know, it's not about market size. It's not about familiarity with teams or players or coaches.

This is, you know, sports at its best when you have fear. competition for a championship and the games themselves have so much importance. It's like we feel during the NFL season, but more importantly, during these one and done NFL playoff games. I mean, I like this part of sports more than anything else. The games and talking about the games, of course, we're going to do some football here in the opening segment where, you know, it's projections and it's hypotheticals and it's it won't. be on the show today, and it usually isn't, a review of some of the mini-camp videos that are coming out. And look, it's an important subject, and it's the team that matters the most. And, you know,

we're at that point in the calendar where we're looking, you know, at 12 weeks until we've got an opener to talk about. Yeah, 12 Sundays from yesterday, opening Sunday, Washington at home against the Giants. So it'll be here before we know it. But man, in the meantime, games that matter and games that are contested the way these games and these NBA finals have been contested, it's great. As was, to a certain degree, the U.S. Open yesterday. Look, I watched a lot of it all weekend long. I'm a golf fan. I love the majors. This U.S. Open was destruction of the golfers by the golf course and the elements that they were playing in. The final round yesterday was, you know, one of those competitions that was riveting at times,

not because of great shot making or unbelievable play, but rather it was a test of wills. It was about surviving rather than thriving. It was, you know, the last man standing is the course. and the weather beat up on everybody. And that last man was JJ Spawn, who Scott told me today on radio is super popular. This was a very popular win by a player that most casual golf fans don't know,

although he was there, you know, mono-a-mono with Rory McElroy at the Players' Championship in March. But this was a guy that was thinking about hanging it up. This was a guy that never believed in himself, but he had a lot of talent. He's played well recently. You know, he had a 64 and a half foot putt on 18 in the driving rain to end it,

but that, of course, was not the shot for him. The shot for him was his drive on 17 in a tournament that was still there to be fought for Robert McIntyre in the clubhouse at one over and spawn going to 17 at 1-1-1. over par as well. And then he hit the drive of his life, drove the green, had an eagle putt, missed that, but made the birdie putt and then had the 64-5 footer, which Victor Hovlin gave him a good read on with the same putt before. But man, who knew for sure that he would get down and two there with the rain being what it was? But he came up big. I mean, he was the only player to finish the tournament under par. That may have been the biggest surprise of the U.S.

open final day. I mean, they were all coming back to the pack. Hell, Scotty Sheffler, you know, finished in the clubhouse at four over par with John Rom before McIntyre got in there at one over par. But they were all backing up in the general direction of Sheffler. Schaeffler missed some puts, man. They just barely missed. He could have easily had a round of, you know, somewhere, you know, two or three shots better and really put the pressure on the rest of the group. But it was, It was survival out there. There was a 96-minute rain delay. It was dark.

It was cloudy. The rain came and went. The course was soaked. And there was a moment that I thought was pretty bad judgment by those that were the decision-makers on the golf course. Sam Burns, who had the lead going into the final round at four under. He went to 15 with a share of the lead at one over. It hit a good drive, but into a puddle of standing water. and for some reason he was not given relief.

He asked for relief twice, and they denied him on two different occasions. You could see the practice swings. He was hitting out of, you know, standing water in which the ball was borderline floating in. And there were other players who had gotten relief, you know, prior to that. And I thought that was very unfortunate. Burns was still very much in the mix. He had a share of the lead. They didn't give him relief.

He had to hit out of the water. he double-bogied that hole, bogeied the next hole, and it was over. I thought he handled it really well afterwards. He said, you know, I asked an official, then I asked for a second opinion, and they, I voiced disagreement, but, you know, their word was the final word. I had to hit it. I thought it was a terrible, terrible decision. How they, certainly on TV, it looked like he was hitting out of, you know, too much water

to actually be able. to hit a good shot, which he did not. But one under par, J.J. Spahn, the only man under par, two shots better than Robert McIntyre. We barely even saw him during the day. If you didn't listen to my radio show this morning, Scott jumped on in the first hour on his way down to Oklahoma City, and he talked a lot about J.J. Spawn and Rory McElroy. McElroy shot 67, but had some comments on Saturday about his frustration, with media and not talking to media.

He seems to be a little perturbed these days, a little bit immature these days. But I enjoyed the golf yesterday. All right, I want to finish up this opening segment with this. So no more mini-camp days, no more OTA days. I think there was a brief period of time in which there was potentially going to be one more set of OTAs or one more OTA day on like June 20th, but I think that they are now done until training camp,

which we are roughly five weeks away from, five to six weeks away from. And, you know, we have pretty much now the team that more likely than not will play in 2025. Of course, things could happen. Although Trey Hendrickson and the Bengals have resumed talks. That came out. I think it was Jeremy Fowler over the weekend.

And I think, and I felt all along that that's the most likely ending to this, is that Hendrickson ends up getting a deal in staying in Cincinnati. Cincinnati is kind of viewing this season as make or break. They got Higgins and Chase signed. Their defense was terrible last year. It would be even worse without Hendrickson. They've got a chance, certainly if they stay healthy and they improve a little bit on defense to be a playoff team for sure,

if not more, because they're so, so good offensively. But as far as our team goes, you know, we know what it's going to look like, you know, and we've seen some off-season activity, and we've listened to coaches talk and players talk, and sometimes that can be more revealing than anything else, certainly versus, you know, what you're watching without true tackle football going on. No update on Noah Brown, but he was going to have that MRI. If there had been a bad result from the MRI, I think we would have heard. about it. So I'm not super concerned about that. You know, I kind of put together a list of the things

that we know coming out of the offseason, you know, free agency, draft, OTAs, rookie minicamp, veteran mini camp, and a couple of the things that we are unsure of at this point. I'll start with the list of things that we're unsure of, okay? I still don't think we know anything about what the defense will be in 2025. We need it to be improved, but the addition of several new defensive players like Javan Kinlaugh and Eddie Goldman and Dietrich Wise and Will Harris and Jonathan Jones and drafting a guy like Trey Amos and Kane Madrano and the return of hopefully a healthy Jordan McGee and a healthy Marshawn Latimore, it seems like they're in a better position roster wise. and I'll get specific when I get to the things that I think we're sure of. But I think we're still, you know, it is a major TBD on what the defense is going to be in 2025. There's such a massive improvement necessary that some of it may just happen because that's what happens with defense.

It just changes for whatever reason. And sometimes you don't even know what the reason is. It changes year to year. Remember, they finished the year, the 23rd ranked defense in the NFL per DVOA, and the 26th ranked run defense per DVOA. They overcame a lot of games in which they couldn't get teams off the field. They couldn't stop the run. But we know how that happened. It happened because their quarterback and their offense was spectacular for much of the season.

They were able to possess the ball, whether it was moving the ball consistently without having to convert fourth downs, but they converted a lot of fourth downs to stay on the field. They didn't punt much. They scored a lot. They were just a very, very good offensive football team. Finish the season, by the way, per DVOA as the sixth ranked offense in the league. And they overcame a defense that was, for the most part, not good. and at times really bad. They also, we know this, had the benefit of playing some of the teams in the league

that were not necessarily fit offensively at quarterback. You know, week in and week out, you know, they were playing backups or guys who weren't very good. And they were winning some of those games in very close fashion, you know, in comeback fashion. But the thing that we don't know, and we are unsure of, in my opinion, more than anything else, is what will the defense be like when we get to the season opener? Will we learn anything in the preseason? Not really. You know, again, injuries always change perspective, but barring any serious injuries,

we're not going to learn much. They're not going to scheme. They're not going to be schemed against. You're not going to see the starters for very much. much. Some things will be noticeable. Their size up front will be noticeable, but we're not going to know anything about this team defensively until they start to play games. We just know that they've got a lot of new players on defense. Here's another thing that I think I am unsure of as of now. Did they get more dynamic offensively? I'm not sure. I am confident that Debo Samuel entering a contract year

has a lot to play for. And I am a Debo Samuel fan. If he's in shape, if he's healthy and available, I think Cliff Kingsbury with the quarterback that he has, I think they've added a dynamic weapon. But I'm not sure of that until I see it because he wasn't available and he wasn't healthy enough in San Francisco last year. So that is still to me a question mark. And, you know, I'm not looking at the rest of the roster and saying, well, you know, they added a great offensive lineman, that'll make the offense more dynamic. It might. But in terms of playmakers, I mean, it's very possible a guy like Luke McCaffrey may be the breakout dynamic player on offense. Who knows? Maybe it's Jalen Lane. Who knows? Many of you believe it'll be their

seventh-round draft pick, Jacori Kroski Merritt. But I think another thing that we're unsure of at this point is whether or not they are more dynamic offensively. Lastly, in terms of things that we don't know, let's not forget that last year's team was a team that used four, count them, four kickers. They used last year Austin Seiber in nine games, Zane Gonzalez in six games, Greg Joseph in a game, Kate York in a game, that was in the regular season, and then obviously we got Zane Gonzalez in the postseason. They added Matt Gay. All the other kickers are gone. Matt Gay missed five kicks beyond 50 yards last year. He was just three for nine.

I'm sorry, six kicks beyond 50 yards last year. Are we sure that they're going to be more stable at kicker? They need more stability at kicker. We won't know until the regular season begins. What about what we do know? Well, we do know they've got a really good quarterback. That's a given. I mean, some of you would suggest, I don't know that.

I don't know that he's not going to be a guy that can avoid the sophomore slump. You know, sophomore slump. Did Dan Marino have one? Did Patrick Mahomes have one? I know Mahomes didn't play much his rookie year. But Marino did. I'm not a believer in sophomore slumps for pro quarterbacks. I don't care what C.J. Stroud did.

His offensive line wasn't nearly as good last year. I think we know that they've got a very high-level elite quarterback who's entering his second. year with this offensive coordinator. And I think that that is a known quarterback, good shape. I think the coaching staff is a known. They've got a really good coaching staff. Is it the best in the league? Probably not. But it's a good coaching staff, good head coach, excellent offensive coordinator. Specific to players and position groups, I think we know that the offensive line has improved and should be a better officer. offensive line. Obviously, Laramie Tunsell is the biggest ad of the offseason. It's not

Latimore before the trade deadline. It's not Debo. It's not anybody they drafted. Their biggest addition in the offseason was Laramie Tunsell. He's an elite pass blocking left tackle. He is a plug-in-play, hopefully for 17 games. And this was a group that I think at times overachieved first half of the season and then at times struggled back half of the season. Tunsell's edition, Josh Connerley Jr., even if he isn't ready to go from the beginning, I think there are a lot of people that feel good about that pick and feel like they may have landed in the first round on their right tackle of the future. Brandon Coleman moving to guard means Allegrety is going to sit or at least until he'll play

only until Cosmi's ready, but the future of the offensive line, Biotish, Cosmi, Connerley, on the right side, Coleman Tunsell on the left side. That's what it looks like in its best form, we believe. That's an improved offensive line. They got better up front offensively. They needed to get better up front defensively and offensively. I don't know about defensively, but they got better up front offensively. We know that. We know this about defense. They got bigger defensively. We just don't know whether or not that will manifest itself in the form of more against the run or as pass rushers. They have more size. They have more length than guys like Ken Law, Goldman, and Dietrich Wise. They are bigger. They wanted to, you know, stack up against

Philadelphia's O line, and their O line against Philadelphia's D line. They wanted to be bigger and stronger and better in the trenches. They got that way on offense during the offseason. We're not sure if they got that way on defense in terms of whether or not it'll be better. But we do know that they got bigger than they were last year. I think lastly, what we know is that the cornerback depth chart, it's got to be better than it was last year, right? Sanra's still year two. Latimore, you know, big wild card here, question mark, mystery, but he certainly has

the talent, health, acclamation to a system. I think you go into the season thinking it's better than what they have. had last year with Mike Davis and Benjamin St. Juist. You bring Noah I back. You add Trey Amos in the draft, even though corners typically aren't necessarily ready to produce at a high-level rookie season more times than not. There are exceptions, and San Francisco still was an exception last year. But I think overall, cornerback depth, cornerback, skill level, and talent is something we know has improved. Hopefully it will show itself when the games begin.

I think that's kind of my list of what we know, what we don't know. We'll come up with other things certainly to talk about between now and the beginning of camp. But we did kind of reach at the end of last week this moment of, all right, they're gone and they won't be back until training camp begins. and at that point we are within earshot of joint practices with the Patriots in Foxborough and a preseason game against the Patriots. Oh, one other thing too that I think sort of falls in the category of we're not sure yet. They made the choice to move on from Jeremy Chin and replace him with a cheaper Will Harris.

We won't know until we get to the regular season whether or not they made the right call on that. But that goes hand in hand with just the biggest unknown defense, what will it be, the biggest known, the quarterback, and I think we can safely say that their offensive line should be better than it was last year. All right, Chelsea Jane's next after these words from a few of our sponsors. So guys, if you're starting to notice your hair thinning when you look in the mirror, join the club. you're not alone. Life gets busier and busier and you don't have much time to think about it or do something about it.

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Restrictions apply. See website for full details and important safety information. It's never on the coaches. They work hard. The message is clear. All the work is done prior. Sometimes they got to go out there and they got to play the game. It's always been about the players, always.

Nats skipper Davy Martinez on Saturday following the Nats, four to three loss to Miami. In the moment, it was seven straight losses. They lost again yesterday, so they are in the midst of an eight game losing skid. He was asked about the team's recent offensive struggles and how the blame should be apportioned among players and coaches. And he said, it's never on the coaches. We will talk about that answer with Chelsea Janes coming up here in just a moment. This segment of the show is brought to you by Window Nation.

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That's a whole lot of savings and a super smart investment with prices going up. Wind Donations windows come with a lifetime warranty. You'll keep saving long into the future. hurry the sale ends soon. Don't wait to get your free in-home estimate. Call them at 86690 Nation or visit Windonation.com. Joining me right now, Chelsea Jane's longtime reporter for the Washington Post, covered the team forever. She now is the paper's national baseball reporter at Chelsea underscore Janes on X on Twitter. You heard what Davy said on Saturday. and you've just written about it in the post.

You'll get to read that online if you're a post subscriber today in the paper tomorrow, I'm sure. Where did it stem from, do you think? Was it just frustration in the moment after losing a seventh straight game? Or do you think that there is some concern about job security? I think it was largely frustration. But I also think there is a little bit of tension here with, you know, his option on his deal needs to be picked up in July for him to be under contract next year. And, you know, July is coming quickly and results are not, you know, improving.

So I think it's a bunch of things. Obviously, you know, you can't speak for him. But I do think there's a lot of frustration there because I think, like all of us, he's watching these guys do the same stuff over again and kind of wondering, like, what do I have to do to get you to understand that we have to change things? What was the reaction in the clubhouse? and then if you know from Mike Rizzo and ownership. You know, I wasn't in the clubhouse the day after,

but my colleagues who were said that they noticed a lot more front office presence in the clubhouse Sunday morning than normal. Mike Rizzo is not normally in there, certainly not kind of openly talking to players, but he was down there and so were some other front office folks just kind of having conversations that we don't usually see. So what that means, I don't know. you know, maybe they got a new coffee machine, but I doubt it.

I think it's probably related and just kind of hearing from people around the team. It sounds like, you know, Rizwin in there to kind of, you know, clean things up, whatever that means. Everybody's good. They probably are, you know, but we did hear there was frustration from players in the immediate aftermath, kind of just wondering, like, okay, if it's not about us, you know, what are you talking about? Because it certainly seemed like there was a little punt of accountability there from Davy and certainly more of a punt than we've really heard from him before. Chelsea, what kind of job is he doing?

That's a great question. I don't know. You know, I think we, you know, by all sort of measures of a human being, he is a good person, a kind person who cares about the guys, and that does matter. What I don't know is if they are underachieving or overachieving relative to what they should be doing. I mean, they're underachieving relative to what Davy and Riz and others said

they should be doing this year. But I don't, you know, we don't know who these guys are. We don't know who Robert Hassel should be. We don't know what Dylan Cruz should be. We know what they think they are. But, you know, with another manager, would this roster be in the same place? Maybe. Maybe not. You know, it's so hard to say and has been hard to say for such a long time because you're not looking at guarantees in that lineup.

You're looking at people who either have to get better and then the lineup will get better or who are kind of there as placeholders. And so, you know, is Davey the problem? wins is he responsible for? I don't know. And I think that's part of why it's so hard to sort of pull the gnats out of this because there's not one clear problem or one clear thing where you say, you know, Davy's really asleep on the job because I don't think that's the takeaway from this year necessarily at all. You know, it was just a week and a half ago. They were like two or three games below 500. They were scoring a bunch of runs, you know, against Arizona. And I forget

who else during that stretch. They were clearly more explosive from an offensive standpoint than they worked this time last year, and now they're in the midst of an eight-game losing streak with three bad losses to Miami, a bad team. I mean, things change in sports. We understand this, but what were people thinking a week and a half ago? No, I think everyone around the nationals can agree that there was a world in which they would maybe contend for a wild card spot this year. And as a week ago, that world still existed.

It kind of still exists now. You know, if they make a big run, they're back in it. And all of that would be really good. But I think what people know around the team, and certainly everyone who watches them regularly, is they're just not as sure a thing as they should be after this long of a reboot. You know, they should be, we shouldn't be wondering who they are. You know, we shouldn't be kind of living week to week. There should be a team that can be consistent.

And yeah, with young guys, you're going to have inconsistencies, but it just seems like they haven't taken the big leak. You know, you're not sure that they're going to be better this year than last year. And I think, frankly, you know, put in those terms, it's unacceptable given what, you know, Davy, Riz and others said were the expectations for this year. I think, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think, you know, prior to these comments out of, let's just say, frustration on Saturday, the default, most fans would be to blame ownership for not spending enough money, not giving Mike Rizzo enough resources. And, you know, it just seemed rarely did that trickle down to the manager, who, by the way, has a losing record as a manager. I mean, there is 2019 to stand on, obviously, a magical season that ended up in a World Series. But now we're talking about the manager and the

manager's job security. Did that just change because he made these comments Saturday? Or do you think there's still, it's still fair to start with ownership? I think it's always fair to start with ownership. And I think with the Nationals, it's always fair to talk about Mike Rizzo and Davey in the context of what they've been given. I think it would be unfair not to, right? This is not, you know, the last time that they had, you know, that Davey managed the team that had kind of all its stars, and wasn't trying to cut payroll, they won the World Series. Ever since then, you know, they've been trying to trend, and that has shown. I don't think Davey was on the hot seat before this weekend.

I don't know that he's on it now, but I will say that what he did was sort of bring to the surface something that we really hadn't seen. We didn't see anyone getting frustrated. You know, we hadn't seen anyone say, you know, okay, James Wood has been great, but like what the heck else is going on here, you know, what's the direction of this team? And he didn't say that, but he sort of reversed. revealed that, you know, he wishes some things were going different. And players being frustrated by those comments, you know, reveals that they're frustrated

about something and there's a disconnect there. And I think all of that existed. You know, these things don't come out of nowhere. I think obviously Davey had been frustrated for a little while. You know, we just kind of know from being around that there are guys who, you know, they wish would make better progress than there are players who sometimes aren't sure, kind of, you know, where Davey stands. And that exists in every clubhouse.

But I think they kind of just called attention to his own frustrations and therefore kind of reminded everyone that, like, look, this should be probably going differently. You know, you're not frustrated when things are trending the right way. An eight-game losing streak doesn't feel so bad when you kind of know that in the grand scheme of things you're going the right direction. And I just don't think anyone there feels certain that they are anything more than they are right now, you know, without some significant change. You know, without the 2019 World Series, I mean, the record is not good. They've finished basically in Dead Last in the National League three out of the last five years, fourth place, the other two years. You know, in most organizations, he wouldn't be the manager right now, right?

Yeah, I think that's right. And I think, you know, I don't know that that's necessarily, you know, wisdom in that case might not necessarily be wisdom at all. You know, I think we've seen, you know, the pirates and Rockies look pretty silly, scapegoating their managers when the rosters they've built are not good. And, you know, I think at times in the last two years, that would have been all it was if they had decided Dave Martinez was the problem because he, frankly, didn't have anything to work with. Right.

Now, I think there's, there's some... I mean, James Good is... James Wood is really, really good. He's Juan Soto Part 2, and it feels like it doesn't change the equation for them at all. You know, they feel like they're going to win the same number of games maybe as last year. They're just going to look better doing it. And I think that's where the problem comes in. If you look at that guy and say, okay, if everyone kind of comes along and CJ is coming along and James Wood's coming along and McKenzie's leading the league in strikeouts,

this team should be winning or at least closer to it than they are. And they're not. And so I think that's why you can start looking at Dave Martinez and say, okay, there's actual talent here. What's not clicking? And does that mean he's a problem? I don't think there's any one problem. So, but it definitely just kind of makes you look at things with, I think, earned scrutiny.

All right. Let's net it out on Davey here by just asking you, because they play Colorado the next four games. Colorado, for those of you who don't know, is not only the worst team in baseball, there's not a close second. They are 14 and 57 on the season. They are terrible. Is this a big series? Is he in jeopardy if they say, you know, were to lose? three of four? Could that be it by the end of the week or midweek?

You know, I don't know. I would say I think it feels bigger than any series we've had in quite some time for that reason. I think, you know, a bad showing here is going to continue with downward spiral that has escalated pretty quickly, I think. You know, I think those comments mattered in that they just called attention to their mediocrity, kind of. So I think, I don't know how hot the seat is. I don't know how hot it should be, but I do know that if you're losing through four of the Rockies after what they just did this weekend, that it's going to be closer than it's ever been to something changing and probably should be at that point. Is there an obvious replacement on the team somewhere?

I don't think so. Yeah. I don't think so. Sometimes the solution, if it's difficult, sort of tells you where the answer is going to come, even if they lose three out of four. I think that's right. And I think the fact that you don't look around and say, this guy would help in the manager seat probably tells you a lot too, right? But there's just so much more going on because a manager can't make that roster better. You know, he can't hasten the development of hassle and crews and guys that, you know,

they probably need to be better sooner if they're going to win this year, you know. There's other problems. And one of them, the problem that will always be there is that if they're not willing to spend on quality players, they are not going to win because they are not built to do this internally. They're just not built to do it all internally. That was fine, you know, last time around, because they were able to go out and get pieces to supplement what they could do. But if they can't do that, I just don't think they're built to do it themselves.

And that's, you know, that's a huge problem. All right. Let's switch subjects real quickly. Tell us about the calling up of Brady House, where he'll play, what they're expecting from him. No, I think Brady House, it's time. You know, he'd had a really strong season in AAA. He's going to swing and miss a lot.

That's always been the problem, so he'll kind of fit right in. That doesn't really scare them. He's got a lot of power from the right side. He's a really energetic and competitive guy, so I think that, you know, was only a positive thing. And, you know, I think he'll play as much third as his bat shows he can't. I mean, they would love to hand him the position. I don't know if he'll be totally ready for that, but I think he'll get a shot.

and maybe he'll be kind of an injection of life because, you know, he is a reminder that there are other good young players here. And, you know, if they can just get everybody in the same direction, you know, there's talent to be had there. There's talent to be made something of. Another first round pick has pitched well recently. Will Cade Cavali find his way to the big soon? I think so. They've always been, you know, pretty clear with him, you know, even to the point of joking around in spring training, that they're going to play it slow. they're not going to let him come back until, you know,

midway through the summer so that he doesn't have to handle a ton of innings coming off injury. So I think it always, it was a plan to kind of get to June or July and then bring it back. I think everyone in the organization still has faith that he's, you know, somebody that's going to contribute to the rotation. And, you know, that's something else to look forward to there. That guy coming back, if he's as good as they thought he once loves, then, you know, that'll help a lot too. Is McKenzie Gore

a legitimate Cy Young candidate in the National League? He's definitely close. He's definitely close. I think he will get votes. I don't know if he can keep up with some of the bigger guys out there, although it's been, you know, a little bit of an inconsistent season with some of the guys at the top. But, you know, leading to the weekend Starkouts is no joke. I mean, he's really good. Players think he's really good after they face him. I just think he needs to be a little more dominant, maybe, you know, hold teams down a little bit more than he does to kind of jump. into that conversation seriously, but I also might be harder on him than people who are voting and don't see every start and analyze it, you know, to the minute like we do. Well, Skeens is a heavy favorite right now, but McKenzie Gore is in the mix of like,

you know, fifth or sixth among odds right now, but he, as you mentioned, he leads, not just the National League, but he leads all big leaguers in strikeouts with 119. Last one. Do Gore, Wood, and C.J. Abrams all become all stars this year, all three? I think they should. You know, I don't know how Wood and Gore aren't. I think Abrams might be on the bubble, but probably should make it again. So, you know, I think all three should be all-stars, whether they will be or not is, you know, often a more complicated process than that. Thanks for doing this. Hope you're well. Good to catch up.

Thanks, Chelsea. Yeah, thanks for having me. Chelsea James, everybody. When we come back, we'll finish up with some news over the weekend about the city council's delayed vote potentially on the RFK Stadium Agreement. That and maybe a little bit more after these words from a few of our sponsors. Is the RFK Stadium deal between the city and the team in a bit of trouble? I will get to that here in a moment after I ask a favor of those of you who haven't done it. If you haven't rated and reviewed this podcast and you can spare 30 to 60 seconds to do it,

it would be much appreciated. This is the time of year where we start to put together proposals along with our ad selling partner because we're heading into fall football season, which is the high season for us, the high season for a podcast like this one. and ratings and reviews are really important. Audience size is the most important thing in terms of selling this podcast to advertisers, and we do very well on that front. But ratings and reviews are a reflection of how much you guys like the podcast,

how loyal our listeners are to this podcast, and that's important as well. So a quick rating up to five stars, that would be preferred. That takes literally 10 seconds to do, and if you want to write a quick word, one to two sentence review on Apple, which they allow you to do that. You could just write, love the podcast, love Kevin and Tom, love when coolly comes on, love some of the guests, whatever you want to write. It can be short and sweet, but if you haven't done it and you can spare the minimal amount of time to do it, it's huge for us if you can get it done in the next week or so,

because the next couple of weeks are important for our rest of the year. year. As we enter, by the way, with this podcast, the most exciting football season we've ever had. No doubt that for content providers around DC sports, specifically the football team, this is the most anticipated season we have had, I've had, since I started doing this 20 years ago. All right, there was a story in the post over the weekend that I want to read for. and comment on. It was a story titled, D.C. Council members say stadium approval is likely, but they need more time. It's a story written by Jenny Gathright in the Washington Post. She writes, D.C. Council members are working toward approving a football stadium for the Washington

commanders at the shuttered RFK Stadium site, but probably not by Mayor Muriel Bowser's July deadline. Mayor Bowser said about the vote potentially being delayed by the city council on the $3.7 billion stadium deal that was announced in that very celebratory press conference back on April 28th. She said that the team is, quote, outraged, closed quote, on the prospect of the city council delaying the vote. The term sheet that the mayor and the team came to an agreement on that they were so excited about on April 28th stipulates a vote by July 15th for the purposes of exclusive negotiation. After the 15th, the team can start to negotiate with others. And the city council has said that they want more time. Here's the paragraph from the story.

Council members argued it was only fair that they take more time to consider a deal that involves more than $1 billion in taxpayer funds, especially since they said they still lacked key information. Bowser said that the delay, quote, sacrifices our exclusive seat at the table and $2.7 billion. in private investment, closed quote. Christina Henderson, and at large member of the city council and independence, said, quote, the mayor thinks that her deal is perfect and that's great for her. I feel like there are areas where we can certainly improve, meaning the deal. Council member Zachary Parker, a Democrat Ward 5, said members talked about keeping the money for the RFK deal in the budget, that would be the 2026 fiscal budget, which this is supposed to be part and parcel

to, while taking out the policy language around the stadium deal so that they could possibly amend it. Quote, it is my belief that the deal will get done. We will safeguard the money and vote on this project sometime this fall, closed quote. Reading from the story again. The voting on the deal in the fall would violate a deadline that Bowser negotiated with the commanders. A term sheet between the two parties set July 15th as a deadline for a council vote and says the team would no longer exclusively negotiate with the city if the council did not vote on the deal by then, or if the council materially changes the deal's terms. Bowser said in an interview on Friday that even if the council voted to approve the capital funds, that would mean little without them also approving the terms of the deal. She said, quote, the team can't take that to the bank, closed quote.

There's more in here from the mayor. The mayor said last week that the commanders have, quote, very, very specific timelines that would be up. upset by a council delay. Quote, I think they feel blindsided by the discussion, closed quote. Meantime in this story, it's written that the commanders said they would be willing to work morning and night with the council to get the deal passed in July. Throughout the process, we've been clear. The commanders need a new home by 2030.

Any delay will make us unable to deliver on that timeline, as well as prevent us from a major concerts, performers, and international events, such as the 2013-1 FIFA Women's World Cup to D.C. Okay. This is sometimes bureaucracy at its worst. Look, I only know what I am reading here. But when you read that the team would be willing to work morning and night with the council to get a deal passed in July.

That is one side of this deal led by very successful business people who have worked in entrepreneurial, do whatever it takes, work weekends and 24 hours a day if that's what's necessary to get the client, to get the deal done. And they're dealing with a bureaucracy, government that has been since April, 28th, we are now a month and a half since the announcement been unable to vote on this thing and now want it delayed when the deadline is still a month from now. You've got to be kidding me. Hey, get together, lock the doors, get it whatever you need in terms of additional information

from the mayor, from the deal, from the term sheet. The term sheet's there. The mayor can explain however she needs to explain how they're going to generate the revenue, what the revenue is going to look like, what the mechanisms for funding the billion dollars plus are. Come on, people. April 28th, July 15th, come on. We're talking about two and a half months. If you had left this up on the other side to Josh Harris and Mark Eind and

Mitch Rails and probably the significant majority of limited partners, they would have had this thing understood, tweaked if necessary to get a better deal, and then voted on within a weekend. Frustration, I would imagine, at a very high level, for people who have worked in environments where, yeah, we're not leaving until we get this done, or we may lose this deal to our competitor.

Whereas the other side is, yeah, and I'm not suggesting that they're not working and that they don't have other priorities. But come on, man, April 28th, the term sheet was right there. They've had two and a half months. Not two and a half months. What am I saying? They've had a month and a half to get all the information and they've got another month. It's two and a half months from April 28th. the term she agreed upon to the deadline.

And the team needs to start on this project. They can't wait until the fall. This was one of the questions that I asked, you know, going back to the announcement of the deal. I had Phil Mendelson, the city council chair on the radio show a couple of days after the announcement. He was talking in terms of this is premature. We need a lot more information. And I'm like, okay, well, you've got plenty of time to get the information and learn everything you need to do to take a vote, right? Well, you know, that's up to the mayor and that's up to this. I mean, Christ, I mean,

get it done already. Like, I can only imagine, as I just said, for people like Josh Harris and Mark I mean, guys that have started companies, companies plural from scratch and the efforts required and just the whatever it takes, you know, we're not into the, you know, multiple weeks of vacation and 17 floating holidays and, you know, as cigarette breaks and two-hour lunches, we're here to work and get it done for the client when they need it done or in advance of that and to get it done right. And dealing with government, dealing with bureaucracy is just sometimes hard for, you know, especially entrepreneurial types like Washington's ownership to deal with. You know, if they don't vote on this by July 15th,

and I still guess, my guess is still that they will. But if they don't vote on it by then, the team should absolutely say, I'm sorry, we can't trust that you guys are going to get this done or even that you recognize the urgency of getting it done. And they should go back to Maryland. You know, from a leverage standpoint, of course, but, you know, if Westmore and Maryland's willing to move faster, they may have to do that. I think it'll get done.

I think the city council will get it together. But getting to this point, look, I want the city to get a better deal. I want the city council to fight for me as a resident of D.C. Trust me. I just want them to do it in a timely manner. There's no reason that this thing shouldn't. be, you know, vetted and voted on in two and a half months, which is what we're talking about by the time we get to July 15th. All right, one more thing before I leave you for the day.

A congratulations to the D.C. Defenders, they beat the Michigan Panthers 58 to 34 in the U.S. championship game over the weekend. Jordan Tejamo, the quarterback, accounted for touchdowns and the 58 points most ever by a UFL team in a game. That's impressive, 58 to 34. DC's first football championship, professional football championship since 1991. Not exactly the one we're all looking for, but still, congratulations to those players. Tommy and I went to a game last year, or was it the year before, when they played Seattle in the playoffs and they won the game and it was a great experience to be at Audi field to watch

the DC defenders. They are the champions of the United Football League. All right, that's it. Speaking of Tommy, I'm back with him tomorrow.