The Kevin Sheehan Show - Cooley Film On Justin Fields

Episode Date: April 12, 2021

Cooley and Kevin today on the Masters to start followed by some NFL Draft talk and Cooley's "Film Breakdown" of Ohio State QB Justin Fields. They also talked the latest on DeShaun Watson. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it, but you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheyenne Show. Here's Kevin. This is an 8-ion. Extremely high, just right in the back. Oh, definitely in the water. There are the ripples.

It hit a wall of wind. Matsuyama is Japan's first Masters champion. Padeki Matsu-Yazu-Yomazer. Yama is the winner at Augusta yesterday, but that followed an opportunity that Xander Shoffley had at 16 that I think he choked a little bit on. More of that coming up here in a moment. Coolie's with me today. He's got a film breakdown of Justin Fields, the quarterback from Ohio State.

If you miss the Trey Lance breakdown from Saturday, just go find it at the Kevin Sheeonshow.com. Or anywhere you're getting the podcast where you can find past episodes. Just a reminder to everybody. that hasn't subscribed, that doesn't cost you anything. It really helps us if you are a subscriber to the podcast, and if you haven't rated or reviewed it, do that as well. That helps us out a lot. I just want to say this, about 16,

when it really appeared as if there was a golf tournament to be had. Matsuyama pretty much controlled the day, and Shafly has four birdies in a row, and at 15, Matsuyama hits it in the water, and Shafly nearly makes Eagle out of the trap. and it goes from a four-shot lead to a two-shot lead, and the pressure for the first time on what was sort of a boring day is on the leader, and Xander Shoffley comes to the 16th T-box,

and I know there's some wind issues there, and he's discussing with his caddy, Cooley, 7 or 8 iron, he pulls out the 8-iron, and he said afterwards that he thought he hit it perfectly, that he had no problem with the shot he hit. And then he's got to hit his third shot from a drop area which was just 148 yards out. That is a rough drop area for a par three after you put it in a drink.

What did you think, Cooley? 148 yards drop area. Just a soft wedge for him. Yeah. Yeah, that he hit. Man, he really factored the wind in on that one, though. Yeah, no, I mentioned to you before we started. This is the epitome of my golf game.

Not going to get mad. the shot hit it where I wanted was a foot short the yard short two club lengths short the extra three inches gives it to you no 16 was a weird hole this is a weird deal but you you just play it to the right because but then there's that ridge like Matsuyama on 16 missed the ridge yeah out up on top of the hole on 16 and then nobody can even go at the hole because the greens are so fast so they got to play that horseshoe put all the way around and then you're like okay, well, no matter what happens here, I'm going to have a six, seven footer coming back.

Right, for par. Yes. You've got to get it up on that. But if Shofly makes... Let it roll down off that ridge. I understand that. But he was going right after the pin it would have appeared. Oh, you're talking about Shafley? Yeah, he was going after the pin. No, I think the mistake he makes here is realizing that it's him and Matsuyama.

And Matsuyama is not a master's champion. This is his first run at it. And even if... If you boge it and you keep it within a couple, he's still got to play 17 and 18. Yeah. You make him play. You put the pressure on him. I don't think you had to go for it right there.

That's hard to say, though, because the dude had birdied four straight. He was on fire. No, I'm going into 16. So I understand the play. It's just you hit the ridge. He's whatever they're saying about the eight iron, if it went caught it to push it left, He's eight yards shorter where he wanted to land. Yeah, I don't know if it was eight yards, but it certainly was a few.

It was enough short and left that he didn't have a chance. I mean, you missed that short and left. You're going to bounce in the water every time. His quote is, quote, I hit a good shot. I committed to it. It turned out bad. I'll be able to sleep tonight. There might be some tossing and turning, but I'll be okay.

I hit a perfect iron. It was 184 yards. I can hit my eight iron, 180 yards out here. I turned it right to left. The wind was into left-to-right. It got smoked and eaten up. You could kind of see it.

The ball hovered there. I was chasing. I was still two back. Kadeki is a great left-to-right iron player. I figured if I hit it close, he was going to hit it right on top. I was in full chase mode, so I have no regrets from that aspect.

I don't think he was in total chase mode at that point. You didn't need to be. You're only two back with three to go, and you've got him thinking for the first time that he might be, he might lose this tournament. You know, and the bottom line is he didn't hit a good shot. He, you know, I mean, I understand what he's saying. I hit it flush in, we've all been there as golfers, not at that level, obviously, but where you feel like, wow, I, I just hit it cleanly.

I hit it well, and it didn't turn out well. Of course, any golfer understands that sentiment. I just thought it never looked like that was a right to left draw. that that thing was going right at, you know, and by the way, he says, I hit a perfect iron, it was 184 yards, I can hit my 8 iron 180 out here. If he can hit it 8, I mean, obviously he's thinking that's going to do, whatever he needs to cover the water and cover, you know, hit it onto the green to the front of the green. I don't know what the number was, but the pin wasn't that far back. If the pin was a buck 84 onto the green was probably right at 180, maybe less, maybe

more than that. I don't know. I just thought it sounded like he was really trying to ease the pain of what was a mistake. And maybe a choke, maybe more of a choke. Because that was also the first. I don't know if it's a, I don't, I don't think it's a choke. I think it's more of an overconfidence issue going into it. Like I, with, with the choke aspect being that he thinks he's chasing. You know, for the, for really after 15, because he nearly eagled 13 and he nearly knocked it in from the trap for Eagle on 15. I mean, he had tap-ins in both situations for birdie. And when Hideki hit it into the water on 15 and, you know, he picked up two shots on 15. That was really for him, even though he had run off four straight birdies in a row.

That was also for him the moment where he's like, oh my God, I'm in this golf. tournament. I've got a chance. I'm two back with three to play. Because at 15, he was four back with four to play. You know, at 14, he was five off the pace or whatever it was at that point. So, you know, it wouldn't have been crazy for him to feel the pressure on 16. Let the leader come to you a little bit. Let the leader come to you maybe. Yeah, I don't know. It was a, it was not a- No, I mean, I get it. He wasn't chase mode going into 15. I think it's 16. He's in the game. I thought so.

And the funny thing is, you know, like you said, Hadeki, you know, hit it on top of the ridge, which made, which brought bogey into play, and he ended up bogeing the hole. The thing about it, too, with Shoffley is if he hits a better shot, you know, from the drop area, you can still make four. You know, you still got to, if you can stick it close, if you can put it up on that ridge and have it come down, you're going to have a chance to make a chance to make. make four, but he hits that over the green. So that's also a bit of feeling the pressure and then it's snowballing because he should have recognized, look, Hadeki's got a chance to make bogey. If I can make bogey here, I'm still two back with two to go. I'm very much in it. If you think about the psychology of it, though, going into 16, again, I don't think he choked by hitting a bad shot. I've watched it 50 times now. Heddecki just hit it in the water on 15.

and he's still got a two-stroke lead. Like, let's say you put it on the pin with your t-shot on 16. Hedekke's not going after that ball. He's still up two on you. He's still going to play it way out to the right. He just went in the water. There is no way that guy's going in the water again. If he goes in the water again and it's over.

That's a good point. I mean, you know, he hit it in the water on 15. He's playing that way. Plus, he's still got a two-shot lead. So you're going to play it conservatively anyway. But when you have a two-shot lead and the other guys, you know, hit it in the water right before you, you're really going to play it conservatively. He wouldn't come in anywhere near that water.

If Shoffley puts it on the green, Hadecki's going to feel a little bit of the pressure, but you're right, he may have put it up top also in trying to steer clear the water. I don't know. Bottom line is it was actually net net. It was sort of a boring masters. I think it's really exciting that he won. I think the emphasis on somehow Matsuyama, you know, the win, turning this into a more global game than it already is. This is as global a game as we have in sports.

I mean, soccer, golf, tennis maybe, well, the individual sports, golf is a super global game. You know, and it's super popular in Asia, period. But I know that this was significant for that country. I have not seen the reaction, but, maybe. the way CBS was talking about it was that like the reaction was going to be like this, you know, like this was a massive significant event for that country, which is cool. I mean, I've always loved Hideki. He's one of those guys that gets hot, man, and he just starts making like five birdies in a row in tournaments.

I've always loved watching him play. I'm really, even though I was rooting for Shafley because I had him in my pool, I didn't want anybody else to win but Hadecki if Shaflea wasn't going to win. Excuse me. But anyway, for the fourth time, just sort of a boring master's. All right, Cooley's film breakdown of Justin Fields right after this word from one of our sponsors. All right, Coollies got a film breakdown of Justin Fields, the quarterback from Ohio State. He did Trey Lance on Saturday.

If you miss that, that's available. All right, what do you think about Justin Fields? Okay, we're going to get to Justin Fields really quick. but if you look at this draft, let's just say Atlanta didn't take a quarterback at four and went ahead and took Kyle Pitts. So you're going to end up with Lawrence, Zach Wilson, I think Mac Jones, the more I think about it at three.

The more you think about it. Now, Atlanta doesn't take a... You think it's Mac Jones. We'll do more Mac Jones later this week. Okay. But I think they don't, they take a quarterback at three, and then Atlanta takes pits, unless someone wants to trade a boatload to get to four,

which would be Washington likely to take Trey Lance, or who else is going to trade Denver to trade up a little bit? Denver, New England. You look at it like Cincinnati's not going to take one, Miami's not going to take one. Detroit's probably not going to take one. I don't know unless they really loved one, but they just got goff. You got to believe in golf a little bit. You do.

probably more than taking unless you loved one one of the dudes there at seven there Carolina is not Denver might Dallas won't New York won't Philly won't

Chargers won't I don't New England's the one at 15 yeah New England's definitely the one at 15 but you could end up having Lance and Fields

fall further than people think here. If Atlanta takes pits at four, which I think definitely is in play, we've already talked about the Matt Ryan situation, they may decide to take a quarterback because of Matt Ryan's cap numbers the next couple of years as well, but Matt Ryan's still a really good quarterback, and he's a known entity for another three years of high-level play minimum, I would think. So if they do take pits, you're right about Cincinnati and Miami. either one of them is taking a quarterback. And then you're going to see, you know, some of the receivers,

you're going to see Sewell and another receiver come off in the next two picks. I think Detroit is a spot to trade up to or Detroit's a team that could take a quarterback. I don't know why you would think that they're convinced that golf is their guy. I know he's young, but, you know, and maybe, you know, maybe they do. I'm not saying him convinced he's their guy, but I'm saying with guys like Jemar Chase on the board and Bonte Smith and some of these dudes, Patrick Certain, that maybe Goff's their guy enough over Fields or Lance. And I think Lance still probably goes before seven.

The one thing about Detroit, remember, is the general manager there now, Brad Holmes. He was part of the group with the Rams that picked Goff. I have no idea what, you know, the guy that played your play. position in the NFL for many years, Dan Campbell, who's now the head coach there, what they think of golf. By the way, do you know who the quarterback's coach is in Detroit? I do. Mark Brunel. That's correct. Yeah. Anyway, so if you want to say Detroit takes a receiver there, Carolina just traded for Darnold, I think because they figured that whoever would be left there, they didn't love enough. So that's why they dealt for Darnold. I mean, they're going to pick up

Darnold's option here. You're not going to draft the guy now at eight. And then Denver takes a quarterback for sure. So the trade-up points are Atlanta, Detroit, Carolina. And then for Washington, there's no way if a quarterback or if, you know, false beyond Denver, are you going to be able to deal because it's Dallas, it's Dallas, the Giants, and the Eagles in order. And there's no way they're trading with Washington to allow them to get a quarterback if Fields or Lance dropped. Well, Denver doesn't take a quarterback for sure if only Fields is left on the board. Okay. Well, that might be an indicator of what your film breakdown is going to reveal. But I don't know where Lance goes in this deal. There are teams that are going to really love him

and there are teams that are going to have concerns with Lance. I mean, the lack of to play and some some of the lack of experience as a guy running in an offense is not going to be loved by a lot of people. I would bet you that all five quarterbacks are gone by 10 or 11. Worst case because of Denver sitting there and because of New England's ability to maybe trade up to 10 with Dallas or 11 with the Giants. or 12 with Philadelphia. They're not, and by the way, all of a sudden,

if Trey Lance is there at 12 or Justin Fields is there at 12, a lot of teams then become more interested from below. Obviously, Washington would be one of those. You know, the Bears would certainly be one of those teams. And the Steelers could be interested in moving up. If you got one of those guys that they really love to really drop. No, I think I agree. I will say this. If Washington were to move up to four to get Lance, they're in love with him. Well, of course. I mean, not just the idea, because I'm just proposing to you

that there's a chance if Atlanta doesn't take him or trade the pick to somebody that takes him, that he goes all the way to seven to Detroit. The other thing, and we were talking about, it on the radio show this morning. The other thing just to consider, too, is this idea that, you know, if Washington traded up for Lance or Fields or somebody like that, that they would just sit them behind Ryan Fitzpatrick this year, I just want to remind everybody that doesn't happen anymore. All right? The Patrick Mahomes thing is unique. Dwayne Haskins and Jake Locker, along with Patrick Mahomes, once Haskins went beyond game five, start. He ended up starting, what, in week six at Miami?

He became just the third quarterback in the last 10 years to be a top half of the first round quarterback not to start by week five. And I pointed this out back then. Locker, it turned out it's because he sucked. You know, Mahomes was a complete and utter outlier. They knew how good he was. It's just that Alex Smith started 5 and 0 that year, and the chiefs were really good. I still contend.

Well, that's the other aspect of why most of these guys start right now. They're not. That is true. For really good teams. That is true. Like, Washington is good enough with Fitzpatrick to be a playoff team. Miami was good enough with Fitzpatrick last year to be a playoff team. Guess what they did?

Well, I don't need to guess what they did, but. No, you don't. You remember. You can remember back that far. I have recall of that. Yeah. I mean, I think Miami made a mistake. You think Miami made a mistake in Tungaviloa?

No, no, I'm not going to say that right now. Oh, sitting Fitzpatrick last year. Sitting Fitzpatrick on a hot team. I agree. Well, they weren't super hot. They weren't. To make, to make, I thought Miami had a chance with their defense to make an actual run. Yeah.

I mean, you can debate how far they could have went, but they beat good team soundly throughout the season. Now, some of it was some big time defensive touchdown special. teams place, but they beat some good teams down the stretch. Playoff teams. Good teams. So I think it's a little bit of a mistake to the current players on that team and to everybody involved through that year to say, we have to figure out who this dude is right now. By the way, the Jordan Love, you know, somebody's out there screaming, Jordan, love, Jordan, love.

I understand that. I was talking about through the Haskins draft. I was big on that on Haskins playing because I felt like on a bad team of Askins didn't play early, that would be an indication that he wasn't very good. And we didn't believe, you know, I never once even into the playoffs believed that Washington had a chance to make any kind of a run. Last year you're talking about. Last year.

No, I think there's benefit to getting into the playoffs and having your guys and your organization feel like we're there, we're close, we know what it takes. But I don't, I never thought that they were good enough to make a run. So playing Duane for five games or six. games was the right move yeah well they knew i mean the new the new the new staff came in and they they knew that yeah well then the mistake is that you played him for more than three games no the mistake is that you didn't trade him in the offseason that's the mistake agreed but everybody thinks that you're just going to go ahead and swap a first because you traded a

because you picked him in the first a year ago it wasn't the no no let's be really let's let's be really clear on this Ron Rivera and Scott Turner, if injected with truth serum, would tell you that they knew when they took the job more likely than not, that Dwayne Haskins wasn't going to be the long-term quarterback here. Now, were they holding out some hope? Maybe I would almost bet any amount of money that the owner was doing the thing where he said, I really would love it if you gave Dwayne a chance. I really think he can play. He went to Bullis with my son, and he's really good, and he's a nice kid, and they're like, look, we're not going to be very good this year. Anyway, this is a long-term culture fix.

But really, what they should have done is they should have said, we've evaluated everything, we've talked to everybody that's dealt with him. We can trade him now and get like a fourth rounder or a third rounder or something like that. Or if we play him, we'll end up getting nothing for him. if we want big boy talk now and we want a big boy organization, this is what you do. You cut your losses early, not late. Now, look, I know what I thought, I wanted to see him play last year. I thought I saw something in 2019 that might be decent, but they were the ones that knew. They knew what his work ethic is.

They knew all these issues with, you know, attitude and preference. and even if he was a nice smart kid, that's not the point. They knew that it was a long shot. They should have dealt him. Period. End of discussion. There's no chance that they cut him before this season was over. They cut him before the season was over.

And there's no chance that when they got to August or even, let's just say before the trade deadline, that they didn't know they were going to cut him. You should have traded him. Yeah, just you're right. I'm just suggesting to you that if you're listening to this and you believe that they would have

traded him for a second, you're wrong. Oh, I'm not saying you weren't getting, you weren't getting, you were getting the comp third or fourth before the season started. And that's best case. And that was somebody that really loved him. And when you're trading a guy into his second year,

and it's the second staff that's evaluated him, anybody else looking at it's like, yeah, there's some problem. Yeah, but the second staff can say, look, he's not my guy. Well, you know, the point would be he wasn't Jake Luz guy either. But every aspect to Dwayne was it's not like they were taking a quarterback that is a running quarterback. Like he is sort of the type of quarterback that they've had. Yeah, true.

That's not like he didn't fit a scheme. He fit essentially what scheme they had. I mean, with the trait, with his physical. traits. Yes, I agree. So, you know, maybe, look, I'm not just saying that they took the job. They're like, oh, this guy's not the guy. I'm saying they took the job and said, look, we've evaluated him. He's probably not the guy, but we're not going to be very good in 2020 anyway.

We're in the midst of, by the way, if they were in the midst of just changing the culture, that would have been another reason to get rid of them. But look, I don't want to beat this to death. The bottom line is they missed out on an opportunity to get something. rather than nothing for him. Whatever that something was, it was more than nothing, and they didn't get anything for them last year. And they wasted, you know, time where they could have started Kyle Allen right from

the beginning of the season if that's what they really believed in. But, you know, whatever, they didn't do it. We got caught into this conversation, which means, I promise you, right after this word from one of our sponsors, Cooley will get to his Justin Fields film breakdown. As promised right on time, Cooley's film breakdown of Justin Fields. Have at it. So here's what I've come to conclude

after watching a lot of Ohio State film over the last couple years. Yeah. Quarterback said Ohio State, no decision is ever really the wrong decision. They're so good. They're so good. They just have so much talent at receiver.

They did with Duane. They did with Fields last year. They had an exceptional back. You can make a decision that you'd prefer a different decision, but more times than not, it still ends up working out for them. Right. I think when I say that, though,

I think that's a really hard step forward into the NFL because now a decision that isn't the preferred decision usually becomes the wrong decision. You don't get away with it anymore. And then, a month into playing, you're saying to yourself, why is everyone shitting on me?

Yeah. I can ball. You can, but you're making the wrong decisions here. So with Justin Fields, there's a lot like Duane, there's a high completion percentage. Super high. Super high completion percentage.

You're throwing open receivers a lot. And you're thrown to dudes that can make plays. and he was and he is and that's what it is at Ohio State like it's not hard it is not as hard and it's different because you're playing some big 10 teams that aren't SEC defenses you're playing teams that don't have quite the talent on defenses some of the SEC defenses

where even if you're in Clemson sometimes it can be the wrong decision there's some more speed back there so as I go through this and look at fields start with the positives and I thought this was really funny because I was reading some of the stuff on fields. And Kyle Shanahan, after his workout had a, or before his workout had a quote, like I'm sure when we see him in person, he's going to look like he throws the ball really well

and he's going to be really fast. That's not what you want Kyle Shanahan to be saying. What do you want him to be saying? He's going to look like he can throw the ball and that he's going to look really fast in a workout. I want Kyle Shanahan to go, look, I just want to see. what I've seen on film, which is a incredibly quick decision maker, a process guy, a guy

can work the field, and then I want the traits to back up the mental side of it on the field. So what did he mean when he said, I want to, look, I want to be able to see. I have no idea what he meant. I just, oh. We could probably go through. He's

he's complimenting him. His athletic system. Yeah. All right. Okay. So here's what I saw, right? the positives the dude can make plays let's not doubt that and he make plays that other guys can't make a screenplay breaks down and he can run it for 10

you can't there are no quarterbacks that can run it for 10 on a broken screen that's a busted play dude yeah and he can take off and make something out of that he can make throws like fields can make some throws and it's funny as I go through this I decided there are two kinds of holy shit throws like holy shit he made that throw and then holy shit that's not a good throw like there are two kinds of them but he can make those wow throws and he does and he makes them on the move he makes them in the pocket they're the deep ball stuff

between 30 and 50 yards I think you see some really good throws I think you see some bad ones but there's some stuff to that he can process and he can see things and there's anticipation at times where you go i can see that he understands certain concepts i can see that he sees and understand certain defenses and he doesn't have to wait on it but also we'll get to the negative words there's not a consistency to that talk about a guy i think he's a pocket passer i think he has the ability to stay in the pocket. I don't think that he's always looking to run. I think that he's comfortable back there in trying to read the field, which I like.

So again, there's some stuff on that that I think is really positive. The negatives, or just in general, continuing, he's got this, like, he's a B as far as accuracy goes. he's not incredibly accurate. It's not as bad as what I saw with Dwayne at Ohio State, where he's missing a ton of underneath throws. Fields has got more touch than that. He can throw with different arm angles. He can, you know,

kind of manipulate the ball where he wants to more than I think Dwayne could. But the negative of it, he's still got this long, delayed release that's not a consistent release where sometimes he looks like he's shot putting it. Sometimes it's taking forever off that fifth step or that third step to get the ball out of his hand. and then it's almost like this relative accuracy. Like he's going to throw it relatively close to the receiver more times than not.

So it's in the radius where it's catchable, but it's really not catchable to run with the ball. Does that make sense? Yeah. He's not a precise thrower of the football. I'm surprised that you say that. But continue, I'll save my questions for. No, you can find, no, here's the thing you can do,

and this is the other strange thing with fields. You can find moments and, spans a time in different games where you can find him getting hot. Yeah, definitely. And being more accurate. But you can find too many examples of throwing the back hip on a flat route and a tight end receiver on the flat not being able to turn up. Throwing behind on a bubble screen and that guy not being able to move across or hitting him down on the shin area instead of hitting him up in the chest where he can take him right. There's too many of those.

And then there's way too many, way, way too many bad misses. I could put together a string of 20 plus bad misses. Are they from the Northwestern and Indiana games? They're from multiple games. Okay. There are a lot of games. There's bad misses against Florida Atlantic where you're like, whoa. And maybe in part, some of it is it really looks like a bad miss.

because a lot of times the dude's wide open. There's also deep shots where it's not even close. Like, and what's weird for me is you watch his pro day and that roll left bomb that he's thrown that hits a dot. Kev, he doesn't have an overpowering arm when you watch it in game. And he's loading up. Like he is setting in the pocket like,

I'm going to launch this motherfucker. Here we go. Like, I'm going to let it go. And it's landing at 50. 54 yards. It's effort. And you watch a guy like Aaron Rogers, and fair enough, but that's the strongest arm, I think, one of the strongest arms in the league.

Off balance, flick of the wrist, see ya, 60 yards in the air, no problem. Phil struggles to throw the ball over 50 yards. It's labor. Really? I'm just telling you that I can find more than 20 cuts of him really struggling or underthrowing or losing the ball inside on. some of these things. So I don't think that he's like an explosive arm talent that it's just easy for him. I think it's laborsome for him to really throw the ball down the field. I see a guy that

misses a lot of open receivers and it doesn't take a lot of open throws. And it's funny because I say no decision is the wrong decision. Like I'm watching a play where he starts the set and before he has to move right, he's got a seam route that open down the middle of the field. And he doesn't take it. And he doesn't take it. And then he evades pressure rolls right and he's got great speed and he's got great quicks outside the pocket. And he makes a really good throw on the back shoulder of his receiver on the sideline to let him toe tap it and keep it in bounds. You're like, we're going to nitpick the fact that he missed the wide open receiver in the timing of the play. But then we're also going to compliment the fact that he made an unbelievable off-script play and had good accuracy

to get it to that guy on the side line. You know, there's a throw in the Penn State game where, and this is early in this game, where they have a hitch on the outside and then inside of it, one of those widened seam routes. And that's plays really replaced what everyone called smash where you have a hitch in a corner. Now it's just a hitch and a seam route. And essentially he's reading the cornerback over the hitch. Does the corner come up and hold on that hitch? And if he does, man, you got a big shot on that inside.

scene. He has a big shot on inside seam and I'll throw a hitch. Like, good, six yards. We're taking a completion. I understand it. But shit, you missed the 30 yard throw. And there's too many of these that I see. There's also too much, like, I need to see the route define itself and be open. Like, he needs to see the defense define itself and he needs to see the route to find itself. And if they don't, It's, the picture's not quite there for him. Do I think that with time, he could grow to where it is there? Absolutely. I think he is a smart player.

I'm not, and I'm not going to suggest that he doesn't understand offense. He doesn't understand coverage. I think he does. I think he's just slow with processing right now. It looks, it looks like in the red zone, he's very decisive. Yeah, I think there's moments in the red zone where it, where he can be incredibly decisive. I think he threw a seam route touchdown against Clemson in the red zone

where it's like, bang, kind of sidearm throw, it's in there. And so that's where I'm sitting here going. I know that when things play out the way it's supposed to, his timing's good. I think his timing is disrupted when it's not what he's seen. And that's normal. that's completely that's a guy that hasn't played as much and he played some at Georgia yeah before he transferred but it hasn't been like four years of playing football in it and

in a certain scheme and so it's weird like the traits the physical traits as far as athleticism and is an a as far as arm talent i think arm talent's a b like i do think he can throw the ball i do think he can drive a ball but i and i think he's got some touch on some of these things but it's not ball isn't like zipping out of his hand he's really got to throw it and then one of the other things and this is a thing that i think could be easily fixable i think his drops and his feet are lazy he's slow to get the ball out of his hand at times when it's just like you're in gun and you want to throw a eight yard speed out to the outside to the let's say even say to like to the field it's got to be one two three but ball it can't be one to three but ball it can't be one

one, two, three. And I'm not saying that he's jerking it off back there, but I'm saying it's like, pick up the speed, bro. This has got to be out. And so some of these throws look like they can get undercut, are late. He's laid on a lot of the type of throws that he shouldn't be laid on.

And maybe it's processing, maybe its feet need to pick up in the pocket. Maybe it's that long, delayed release. All combined, it's sure all of them. he's an interesting guy to watch. You don't love him, though. No, I just, I don't think that other than his ability to move and run, I don't think that anything's elite. I don't think he does anything great, but he can.

Right? I mean, the thing is, is he can. He can make those elite plays. He can make those elite throws. He can read concepts, but there are way, way too many examples that show me. that he struggles with it. I just... So I think he's, like, other than pure athleticism,

it's like B, B, B, B, B. I just don't get the long ball. I think he throws a really good long ball. You can. I mean, just the Clemson game alone, some of the big shots that he hit on, they're perfectly thrown. No, and it's almost like I'd like to sit down

and put like the 15 of these poorly thrown long ball. all together. Right. And go, explain to me what happened here. Like, and he might say, yeah, coach, you know, I'd tweaked my shoulder that week or dealt with something that no one knew about her. And, you know, like, why is this happening? Can you tell me?

Because if there's a reason, then I understand it. You know, the wind-up thing, I mean, it's not Phillip Rivers. you know, it's not an odd-looking release. It's not, you know, Byron Leftwich. You know, it's not like some of these super long that have been criticized or odd releases. I did go back as you were talking, and I do notice it on deeper balls. He's definitely getting his legs and his body into it to get the ball down field. But I don't find it to look unusual, though.

No, I'm not saying that it looks unusual, but I'm saying that it's, He can't just flip it out there. Does that make sense? Yeah, but I don't, I mean, it looks to me like he can throw the ball deep enough. Like he's got arm strength to let it go deep and be accurate deep. I mean, I think in the games against, I mean, I've watched a lot of the Alabama and Clemson games just to get him, you know, in the two biggest games that he played. And he threw some really good deep balls, really good deep balls. No, I'm with you.

Like the Clemson game, down 14-7, he lets one go to kind of that inside seam and hits his receiver pretty much in stride down to about the five-yard line. Exactly. No, again, this is where this is really interesting because I just, I see some of the excellence. But then, like, the play after that, the Clemson game, he throws a touchdown to the tight end. Yeah. On a whip seven route that should never be thrown. It should have been undercut and picked.

I found five plays in that Clemson game that he got away with that should have been picks. That game could have went a lot differently if a couple of those Clemson DBs just make a play. Yeah. So you like Lance. That's kind of what I'm coming from is like I, like here's the thing. Without the Clemson game, I don't think he goes in the first round. Wow. I also think, much like Haskins, he needs some time.

I think he needs some time in an offense in the NFL, in a system in the NFL, where he's given some time to grow. If not, it's going to be, if not, it's definitely going to be one of those guys that you're going to have to scheme for quite a bit. The Haskins situation, when we go back to you and I, you know, talking about his college career, and neither one of us wanted Washington to draft him, that was your position, that was my position before that draft. I didn't think Askins was that great as a college player.

And I thought the best defensive teams that he faced Michigan State that year, Washington and the Rose Bowl, especially the second half, you know, he didn't handle pressure well. The ball was high. That Michigan State game was an ugly game for him, super ugly against maybe the best defensive team that he faced that year. I do not see the same issues with fields. I think he handles pressure well. Yeah, I don't see a guy that changes, like it doesn't look like he's, he senses or feels pressure in the pocket the same.

It doesn't seem like he senses or feels pressure of the moment the same as to. Like, I think he's better in those aspects. But again, I mean, I don't want to compare him just to Dwayne and say, well, he's a first rounder because Dwayne was a first rounder. Dwayne wasn't, Dwayne should have been a first rounder. He should not have been, yes. We're now in this era. where in all honesty,

six years ago, Trey Lance probably isn't a first rounder. Like Mitchell Tribusky was one of the first guys that was like a one year dude that we're going to take a shot because we just have realized in the NFL that we have to have a quarterback. We just realized.

No, I mean, think about it, though. Do you think Aaron Rogers today would drop as far as he did? Do you think Ben Rostler would drop as far as he did in these drafts? No. No, there's no effing chance. Yeah, but you're going way back now. I am. I realize that, but

the quarterbacks go now. I mean, look, the truth is, and I was reading this right before the show, it's been since 1999 that we've had five quarterbacks taken, like in the top 15, I think it was.

So if we get five quarterbacks, and this has a chance to be an all-timer for first rounders early. Last year we had Burrow, Tungaviloa, Herbert, and then Jordan Love at the end of the first round. And then the year before that was the Murray, Daniel Jones, Haskins. And then the year, but it was a lot of quarterbacks towards the end, or Lamar Jackson was,

Mayfield, Darnold, Alan Rosen Jackson. What was Rosen picked? Here it is. 10th. So you had four in the top 10. Josh Rosen was one. of those guys that when you watch Rosen, like you get five games in and with Rosen, you're like, he's the first pick of the draft.

And then with Rosen, I remember this completely. Like you get halfway through or into the third quarter of the USC game and you go, ooh. What is that? This is not at all what I want to see. And then you kind of start watching, like I started watching Rosen. You're like, the dude cannot get rid of the ball underneath. Like, it's deep shot or bust.

Yeah. All right. No, I, again, I, I like fields. I don't like fields in the top 10. Okay. Would you like fields at 19? I think I would, I think I'd be okay with fields at 19. It doesn't really sound like he's not getting past.

I wouldn't be surprised if he were to get to 15, though, and go to New England. I wouldn't be surprised. Wouldn't blow me away. I want a more definitive final word on Lance versus Fields. Wait, don't give it to me. You'll do it right after this word from one of our sponsors. So just how much higher would you have Lance on your board than Fields? I'd have him one quarterback higher.

If you're asking where you draft him, would I take Lance at four? I don't know. if I was Washington and I loved him and I actually thought I could get away with having Lance not play the first year, yeah, I think I would take him at four. I'm not asking you to be more

sort of demonstrative in your opinion here like you were with Dwayne. You were very, very outspoken that Dwayne Haskin should not be a first round selection before that draft. I mean, you were one of the only people, okay? I remember when you started reviewing that, I said, I want you to watch Askins. I want you to watch Haskins. Because I was not a fan of Haskins at Ohio State.

I am much more of a fan of Fields at Ohio State. Again, I'm not saying that I didn't want to see Haskins after seeing him in his rookie year a little bit and being a little bit more intrigued. I'm talking about how I felt about him at Ohio State. I like Fields much more than Haskins, but he's. He has played some games that have left me wondering, whoa, like the Indiana game and the Northwestern game. It's like, wow, you're capable of playing that poorly at that level with that much talent. Now, Northwestern was an excellent defensive team this year. They really were.

And they had the running back go for 300 and whatever yards in that big 10 title game. But you sound to me, because I know you, that you were. wouldn't really be in a room pushing for fields. You'd be like too many concerns, uh-uh. But you're not saying that. You're saying that you would take him at 19. Whereas with Dwayne, you're like, no, no, no, no, no, no. So what, so here's what I think. I still think that fields right now, the way I see him with as much as he's played, in the relative world of where you would sit on my board would probably be a second rounder. Okay.

But based on necessity, you'd say, okay, we could take this guy in the first round because of the position. Like, I think just that position allows you to draft a guy up a full round. But you think Trey Lance is a first rounder. Yeah, I think Trey Lance has all the qualities

as an athlete that Fields has that you're going to need in the NFL. I think he can run. I think he can move. I think you can do stuff off script with him. I think Lance is to me a better thrower of the football. I think he's a more accurate guy. Although we talked about it the other day. Like I think Lance at times can drive the ball down into the ground.

Right. And the other thing, when you watch Lance run and Fields run, realize like Fields is outrunning division one athletes on a high level. Lance is outrunning Randos. in the FCS. But they're both on teams that are... Sorry, I don't want to put the FCS down, but you just realize

like when Fields shakes somebody, it's different. Yeah. Like, we don't, I don't want to get all hyped up about Lance because, like, he's rolling right and breaking a tackle

of an outside linebacker who's unblocked and then he's making a throw. Like, that's awesome. I love that he can do that, but that outside linebacker, from wherever,

it is not, he doesn't play for Michigan, you know? Yeah, I mean, you just got to look at some of his runs against Bama and Clemson. I mean, you know, Bama, I know was not great defensively this year. I understand that. But they also weren't South Dakota State on defense.

We're James Madison. James Madison's pretty good, though. I know. James Madison beat a lot of Division I won teams. Okay, well, let's not go nuts. I think Maryland blew them. mountain. Did Maryland blow out James Madison?

Recently, I mean, I'd have to find the year. 52 to 7 in 2014, Maryland beat James Madison. I don't think. Yeah, but James Madison the last five years has been really good. It's really hard because I've started doing some of the stuff on Mac Jones, and it's Alabama with Alabama receivers.

Well, you just said the same thing about Ohio State. I know. But that's what, one of Mac Jones's biggest knocks is not his skill set. It's his talent around him. I know. Which is crazy. Right. That on some level has to make it harder to evaluate.

But I mean, you're, you're close to an expert on this. So these quarterbacks that play with exceptional talent, these guys know whether or not he can do it at a, don't they have a pretty good sense of what Mac Jones is going to be with equal talent on a field or not? Yeah, I think you have a good sense. We talked about this on Friday. I think the other thing you have is like if Nick Saban is going to sit here

and tell you Mack Jones operated an offense that had 10, times more plays than we've had in the past, you're going to take him for his word. Right. You got that save and trusting, and they do more on offense than other teams. Who are you doing next? Jones. All right. You'll do Mac Jones.

I think it's, I think you can do Jones, and I think we can do Wilson. We can do Lawrence, but Lawrence is going one. Yeah, what I really, I still want your opinion on Lawrence. I want Wilson Jones, but then I really want the guys that potentially could be there for Washington in the second round. Trask, Jamie Newman, Monde, etc. Like that's what I want from you on those, because that's really more likely than not if they're going to have a chance to draft a quarterback that we're all going to perceive as a potential future starter for the franchise. It's going to come in the first two rounds. I don't know, maybe the third.

But after that, you know, you're talking about developmental guy. So I do want, I want Trask, I want Mond, Newman, those guys too, because those are possibilities for them in the second and third round. I've seen Mond mocked to Washington twice. I've seen Trask mocked to Washington in the second round. What else do you have? Yeah. I think it's, I think, I don't know, it's just, it's really crazy.

There's definitely a level that you have to cross as a player to get into the first round now. But I don't think it's, I think it's hard to define the difference. Like, there's certain guys that you look at and you're like, okay, this is, this is a dude. Right. But even last year, like a lot of people didn't like Herbert. Right. Herbert was exceptional. And even at that, as good as Herbert was, what do you win, like four or five games?

They lost a bunch of close games. I forget what the record was. You know what I'd do? What? I'd trade for Matt Stafford. Seven and nine. You'd trade for Matt Stafford. Me too.

Yeah. Seriously. What I'd do is trade for Matt Stafford. Right. And in doing that, you know what you're getting. Yeah. The thing that's so weird when you watch this college football stuff right now is how open guys get receivers and all the RPO stuff.

And the completion percentage isn't truly going to indicate what they're going to complete at another level. I just think that you have to parse through a lot of easy throws. while giving credit for making the throw. It's hard, man. I mean, it's why overall, for a long period of time, when you look at these quarterbacks in the first round, basically like one out of four, one out of five hit.

It's a low percentage of hits. Now, last year, you know, Burrow and Herbert look like hits. Tungaviloa, big question mark at this point. Year before, Murray looks okay. Jones and Haskins, and certainly one of them is not. You know, then from 2018, Mayfield's coming around. Donald's a big if. Alan's going to end up being the star.

Rosen's done. Jackson ended up being, you know, 32nd, but, you know, that was a completely different type of quarterback. Trubisky's a backup from 2017. Watson can't, you know, can't get himself out of a rub and tug. And Mahomes, you know, was the all-timer from Andy Reid. We never talked about the Deshaun Watson thing. John. Oh, well, I mean, you know, it's just weird. You know, we'll see. There's just too much smoke there.

I mean, 22 women. Well, I mean, let's just put aside anything, any accusations. The fact that he had 40 different masseuses? 22 at this point, yeah. Well, there's another 18 that are pro him. Right? I don't know if it's, yeah, there are some that are coming out in his defense. So, yeah. A lot. Right. True. So, More than 22. Nobody I've ever met has decided to use a different masseuse every single time they have a massage. Like six years or five years, I had somebody to come to my house. And it was because I thought I was getting a good massage. Right. Like, she was good.

Yeah. So why would I change? Yeah. Not very many guys I knew ever used more than two different massage people. He's a cereal, you know. Massages? Happy ending guy, clearly. That's a weird thing.

During a pandemic, you know, 22 different, I mean, more than that, as you said, on the flip side, there are, you know, another 18 women who say that, you know, it was, it was a, by the way, this is awful. I'd like to see what those other, those 18 look like. Hey, Deshaun, what are you doing today? exactly what you're the picture. I got four massages lined up. I got four massages lined up throughout the day.

We'll see how it goes. Yeah, you know, this picture that you had on Instagram, this isn't the picture that I, that I'm responding to. Take the massage anyways. I'll take the damn massage anyway. Shit. You're here. Yeah, you're here.

It's terrible. But, I mean, come on. There's just the number of therapists, pro or anti. Of course. Is unbelievable. Look, the lawyer has said that any sort of situation there was consensual sex. So they're not denying that sex was a part of some of these massages. It's just really, the whole story is really one of the more remarkable, incredible, incredible stories of the last couple of months in sports.

All we were talking about is. remarkable. It's remarkable in that we went from, oh my God, what are they going to do? Are they going to trade them? Are they not going to trade them? It'll be the biggest, you know, haul in trade history. If they do trade them, why does he want out? Is it this Easter B guy? What the hell's going on here? Why does he want out? And now, and maybe it's because he's got to, maybe he used up all those therapists. Yeah. Maybe he just wants to get to another city. Right now, Houston is sitting there going, would have been like four first. Yeah.

Well, now... If you're sitting there, if you're Houston, you're like, think of what we would have had, and now he might not play anyways. I want to... I'll tell you what. I don't know what the league's going to do,

but let's just say this doesn't get resolved by the season. At this point, I wonder if he'll want to play for Houston. He's not going to get... No one's trading for him now. Not until this stuff is cleared up, one way or the other. And they know what they're getting. Would you call Houston an offer this year's first?

If I'm Washington, just this year's first. We'll give you 19. Oh, that's such a good question now. Yes, I would. I'm sure they wouldn't even let a trade go through right now. They may not. Good point. But we're missing the big point anyway here.

I mean, Washington's the one team more than any other that couldn't do it. They're not going to trade for a guy that has potentially sexually assaulted women. No, that's not going to happen. So would I give up 19 overall for Deshawn Watson? You'd have to obviously know a lot more about what happened. It's not a Ruben Foster situation where you're signing them off waivers. You have to trade something for him. Anyway, thanks for doing the film breakdown today. I appreciate it. You'll be back on Wednesday, Cooley Will, to do Mac Jones, and maybe another quarterback or two before the end of the week. And then we'll work our way towards sort of the group of players that are potentially there at 19, the linemen, the corners, the linebackers, etc., wide receivers. We'll have a lot of film breakdown of players Cooley Will,

between now and draft night, April 29th. All right, have a great day. Back tomorrow with Tommy. Enjoy the rest of the day and evening.