The Kevin Sheehan Show - Cooley on Skins' Draft, RG3 & More

Episode Date: May 1, 2020

Sixty-plus minutes of Cooley and Kevin today. It's the season of documentaries so they discussed what could be a future DC Sports show documenting the rise and fall of RG3. Plenty of Cooley on the Redskins' draft and his favorite part so far of "The Last Dance". <p> </p><p>Learn more about your ad choices. Visit <a href="https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices">podcastchoices.com/adchoices</a></p> Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You want it. You need it. It's what everyone's talking about. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Now here's Kevin. All right, it's Cooley and Kevin here on a Friday. And we're getting it done late today. We apologize for that. But I didn't want to do a show without my boy today. And he was busy. And I had things to do too. I'm not going to put it all on him. But you've got all weekend. You've got tonight to consume this. You've got Saturday, Sunday. So we've given you all weekend to get caught up. And much of Monday. morning as well if you don't get to it. But I wanted to have Cooley on this week because we're a week removed from the first round of the NFL draft, but we'll talk a lot of draft today with Cooley. But I actually have sort of a, I have sort of two what do you got for you before we get started with football and the Redskins draft. My first what you got is on my way in here just 20 minutes ago, I ate two Pop-Tarts, and I used to be the biggest Pop-Tart fan of all time, but over the last several years, I don't eat Pop-Tarts. You know, they actually are way too filled with sugar.

They're not healthy for you. You know, we know all of that. But in my house, because you know this, that I am basically feeding a house full of basically teenagers and adults, because I've got all three boys plus two girlfriends and a wife and two dogs in the house. And it's amazing the amount of food that we've been going through. But there's just always, especially my older son, like he orders from Peapot, and it's like we get five half gallons of various ice creams, we get pop tarts, we get every cereal in the book. I've been reintroduced to Captain Crunch, which is one of my favorites.

And today, as I was coming back to the studio, as I was coming back to the, studio, I noticed that a delivery had been made and there were three different boxes of Pop-Tarts. Of course, the one that I, it was my all-time favorite, the Samores Pop-Tarts, were not an option. So I grabbed a little package of two, as you know, there are two per package of chocolate fudge pop tarts and just ate both of those. And I don't feel well, but they taste great. What is your favorite pop-tart? Have you ever been a Pop-Tart guy?

Yeah, everyone was a Pop-Tart guy or girl. Do you get them for your kids? On occasion, they make Pop-Tart bites, so they're fucking mini-sized Pop-Tarts. Our kids really like those Pop-Tart bites. They like the Pop-Tarts, too. I think I like just the strawberry ones. Strawberry? Oh, brown sugar.

Brown sugar were my favorite. Brown sugar, top of the list. The brown sugar, yeah, those had to be warmed up. Have to be warmed up. Those needed about 30 seconds. in the microwave or a toast or whatever, but the strawberry ones, I didn't have to be warmed up. Frosted or unfrosted strawberry? There is no unfrosted.

Yes, there is. There's only, no, I mean, not for me. Oh, okay. Yeah. I'm not a, I, if they're not frosted, I'm not doing it. So, I do like Pop-Tarts. I don't buy them too often for my kids. My kids are, my son's obsessed.

It's an addiction, a true addiction to donuts. He wakes up and wants donuts every day. And in this quarantine situation, we see my mom and Maddie's parents. And we've all been quarantine. By the way, I'm about over it. Well, yeah, everybody is. Her dad thinks it's hysterical to bring bags of donuts and sneak them to my son. I guess that's what it, I don't mind.

Well, where are you getting the donuts? Every grocery store is open. Yeah, I understand that. So is Dunkin' Donuts. Duncan Donuts is open, too. Little chocolate covered donuts. Like the brand. Oh, the hostess ones.

The hostess like chocolate covered over sort of that yellow cake donut. Those are pretty good. Yeah. Haven't had those in a long time. Maddie actually made homemade donuts today. They're good. You guys are... We're homemade donut.

You were making... We have a little bit of time, okay? There's a little bit of free time out there. Yeah, you were... You got to have something to do. When you FaceTimeed me last week, you... Maddie had just made, or maybe it was you, you guys had just made homemade ice cream.

Oh, yeah. That's not often. Yeah, that's impressive, though. I mean, I haven't... I remember as a... I remember my father had sort of an ice cream. maker. I haven't made ice cream or seen ice cream made, homemade, since I was maybe a teenager. And we've never done it. So do you have like, what do you have, like the dry ice and the bucket

with the churner thing or whatever where you're turning it? Yeah, that's what it is. You just leave that churner thing in the freezer, but then it takes up a ton of space in the freezer. So I take it out, but then you've got to put it in the freezer for a while before. I don't know, man. We don't make ice cream that often. You eat, you eat ice cream daily, so. I don't eat it daily, but I eat it every other day.

If we're going to have pie or something, we might have ice cream. We don't eat ice cream that often. I like ice cream. Ice cream is definitely my one, more than anything else, the sugar craving that I have more often. And I would say there's ice cream in my house almost all the time. and I am at least once, not every other night, but once every three nights minimum. But I can go like a month without eating it.

Like if I'm really focused and dialed in on not doing things like sodas and ice cream and not eating late, like I was for about a month, the first month of this pandemic, when I lost like 14 pounds. It was no sodas, no sugar really, no ice cream, no eating late. But the last week I've sort of regressed, and hence the Pop-Tarts this afternoon. Well, as long as you don't do the month regression that you usually get into. That can happen. So over this right now.

When are we going to get back to normal? And if my boys should have known better to order, you know, Pop-Tarts without ordering either the brown sugar cinnamon or the samores. I didn't have either one of those as an option. So I think it's July 1. I hope it's sooner than that. Can I just Donald Trump it right now and throw out random non-scientific speculation and say, I think it's a full three-month deal. It's a three-month thing.

And I think it pretty much gets, I think it pretty much gets back to normal by June, but I think by the 1st of July, unless it's a government facility. I think everyone just says, whatever. Let's go get it. If we're going to get it, we're going to get it. Will that require a Clorox injection? Yeah, so what you do, I think you just drink it, and then it pretty much just does a number on the lungs.

I wanted to, before we get to the draft stuff, I was going to tell you about this Zayben poll that he put up this afternoon. It's funny because you know this. It's like all of us, a lot of us end up having sort of the same ideas for segments, you know, on the show. And I've been meaning to get to a segment on the radio show for the last week based off of the last dance, the 10, you know, the 10 episode documentary. And the question was going to be simply put, you know, on phone lines. If a 10 episode documentary was going to be made about a DC sports thing, event or whatever, what would it be? and my when CJ and I were talking about it like a week ago he's like isn't just everybody going to say the RG3 thing and in you know early on during that RG3 thing I said that's going to be a 30 for 30 within five years like in 2013 2014 2013 we said he's going to be out of the league and it's going to be a 30 for 30 you know soon enough and and I said yeah I think the majority of people will do that but people will want to know about other things

You know, like what happened here last year with the Haskins thing or, you know, Spurrier's reign, or what happened at the end of Marty Schottenheimer, or, you know, there's a lot of different things. So this afternoon, Zabe put up a poll. Today's poll question of the day, what DC sports episode would you most want to have made into a multi-part documentary in which all of the secrets were brought to the light. And he gave four options. Spurrier's two-year run, Michael Jordan as a wizard, the Mike Shanahan RG3 drama,

or the Georgetown Hoyas of the 1980s. Those are four really good options. You only get four options on a Twitter poll. Those are four good ones. Well, right now, 55.2% of the answers runaway is Shanahan, RG3 drama, which of course you lived through as a player. And then, you know, in that last year, 2013, as your first year as a media member and as a broadcaster on radio doing the show with Zabe and with Galdi. And you, I mean, somebody's going to do that, right?

That's either going to be a documentary or an E60, a 30 for 30. It's going to be, you know, the RG3 rise and fall is going to be a story. and who knows, maybe it's a rise fall and then rise again. You know, he's still in the NFL. But it's going to be a story. Just give me one part of it that you would, if somebody were really doing their homework on this thing, they could come to you or any other player and ask.

That would be really, really intriguing, and there'd be a compelling answer that nobody would know. Well, I think to me the most amazing thing about Robert was the lack of security. that he felt when he was injured and Kirk played the Browns. And I've never seen a player do this. You and I've had this conversation, but I've never seen a player do this.

He wanted to play so bad. And I think he's one, he's competitive and wanted to play, but I just don't think he wanted Kirk to play. That after that Brown's game, he was in every meeting doing rehab. Rehabing through meetings. a guy, you can't just sit on a medicine ball on a rehab doing all kinds of stuff.

And he was so furious that Kirk got to run this special offense that he didn't get to run and that Kirk had the game that he had. That was really the start of the downfall of it. Because honestly, had he taken another week, and I think we would have beat the – we played the Eagles next week. I think Kirk would have beat the Eagles next week. He probably would have gotten back to somewhat normal physical ability. And then he wouldn't have had the next injury.

He didn't need to play in that Eagles game. I'm sure everyone regrets that. Because you look back at the moment where he got hurt in the Seattle game and then he shouldn't went back in the Eagles game. He wasn't ready to play. He was limping around. He couldn't move in that Eagles game. it was not the same guy.

And because of that, he never recovered enough to play by the time we got to the playoffs. That should have been the game he sat. And if it wasn't just that one, it should have been the next one. But his obsession with that and with Kirk throughout all of it was really fascinating to me. It was. And then, honestly, to some extent, Kirk did the same thing with Colt McCoy later on. The way Robert treated Kirk. Kirk treated Colt.

Oh, really? Almost like the way the Celtics treated the pistons, the pistons treated the Bulls. Really? This isn't right, but now this is what we're going to do. Kirk had an animosity towards Colt. Everyone knew that. You're talking about 2014 when Kirk comes in for RG3,

plays great against Jacksonville, plays great against Philadelphia in a loss, and then really starts to go downhill from there and had that terrible first half against the Titans when Colt came in, you know, through the hitch to Pierre, they win the game, and then he goes to Dallas and has one of the incredible all-time relief performances of all time, or, you know, relief quarterback starting appearances, and they beat the Cowboys as a 10-point underdog. But so at that... The odd thing of all of this is, is I think a big part of the animosity in both those situations was that the other quarterback had won over the locker. and more so.

Interesting. A lot of guys liked Robert as a rookie, but I think Kirk was kind of ho-hum, goofing around, having fun, ended up making a lot of good relationships. Surprisingly, ended up being a little bit awkward, especially towards the end of his career, where then everyone gravitated towards Colt. So it wasn't necessarily just the playing time. It was, what is everybody in the locker like this guy? I'm the starting quarterback.

They should like me. Honestly, I like Kirk and Colt a lot, and so there's not a ton of, I want to discuss about why, but they weren't friends. Right. They weren't close. And Kirk and Robert, that was well known. All the way back to the comments that Robert was making in the preseason,

about the two. About the what? Say that again, about the two. The twos. Oh, the twos. Yeah. Yeah. After a preseason game where someone

The guys look good after. He said, yeah, that's the dudes or something. I don't know. He said it. Oh, my God. Well, you know. But, yeah, that was, that was just, it was amazing to me that a guy who's going to win rookie of a year or being the top three for rookie of year.

And it's having this astounding newfound football type of career is now so furious that the backup quarterback ran bootlegs. but the thing was Cleveland was a 4-3 defense that we would have booted with Robert it was a defense that was susceptible to boot they gave up the edge very easily and they played a lot of quarters coverage in the back end

which is great to play action shot so really it had nothing to do with Kurt running the special offense it had as much to do with Cleveland well that's I know you've told me that before and that's so interesting I'll just never forget

when he held that press conference after the game. He hadn't played in the game, and he was angry. He was not happy. The Redskins had put up, you know, 38, you guys put up 38 on the Browns, Kirk threw for 350 or whatever it was, and a couple of touchdowns, and it was a big-time, prolific offensive day, and more importantly, it was a must-win to keep the playoff hopes, the playoff run going. And, you know, Kirk remember it, come in against Baltimore when Robert had gotten hurt, you know, previously the previous week. One in overtime.

And won an overtime. Now, that was set up by, you know, a big punt return by, what was the punt returner's name? Crawford, right? Richard Crawford? I think it was Richard Crawford. Had the punt return that set up the field goal in overtime. But anyway.

And then, you know, Mike has. has told the story with me on the air many times is that the owner prior to the game. Robert's running, you know, doing his pregame workout in Cleveland, and he's telling the owner, I can play, I'm ready to play, go tell Mike I'm ready to play. And Dan said to Mike, Robert says he's ready to play, let's play him. And Mike said, what are you talking about? The doctor has already ruled him out. We listen to the doctor in this situation.

He's not playing today, no matter what he does, and this workout that he's doing before the game is ridiculous. And the owner then had a problem with Mike, and then Robert held his own press conference afterwards, you know, after the coach and the starting quarterback that day had held his. Here comes Robert with his. I actually don't even remember the order. He may have been first for all I remember.

And then all of the conversation leading up to the Philadelphia game was Mike telling the story of how Philadelphia was a team that they were going to run a bunch of zone read against. And that was going to be a part of the game plan. And Robert was hobbling around in practice and then hobbled around early in the game. And once they threatened to pull him, then all of a sudden he didn't hobble as much. Yeah, that was all interesting. He was hurt, though. Oh, he was definitely, he was definitely hurt. The Baltimore game, back to that game,

you know, Kirk didn't complete it, I don't think he could complete a pass in overtime, but he did throw a big touchdown in the fourth quarter to get that game back in the head. And I think he had a sneak for a two-point, or naked, a naked. Yeah, he had a quarterback draw. He had a touchdown pass to Garsohn. We overcame a first and 20 or a second 20 Like a big step back I think it was Hankerson they had to catch

And then I remember that game really well He had a third down conversion That he threw to Garsohn or something He had a couple big plays in the fourth quarter To get that game back in hand But it was the drive that Holody Nata hurt Griffin on Was the late final fours quarter drive when we were down eight. Kurt came in with, you know, I don't know, it was under two

minutes to go in that game to pick up the drive that Robert had started. And I do remember, like a big third down maybe, and then he threw a touchdown to Pierre maybe, or Hankerson, I forget. And then- Kirk came in for a play, and there was a DPI. And then Robert came back in. Got it. Oh, that's right. Robert came back in. Robert did come back in. Right, by the way, just came right back in without saying anything. He just put himself back in. Yes. I remember looking around it. Like, what the hell is going on? Well, that's when all the controversy about, you know, about Dr. Beanie. Why am I forgetting doctor from Birmingham's name? The orthopedic surgeon.

Dr. James Andrews, that's where, you know, Shanahan claims that basically the doc gave him the go-ahead to go back in, you know, like it thumbs up or something like that. And Dr. Andrews said, I don't think I did that. But Griffin didn't give anybody a chance. He just went back in and told Kirk to get the hell out. There's no clearing a knee after one play. Yeah, exactly. He went for one play and Robert went back in. He was not clear to him in one play.

And then Robert went through and ended up having a grounding or something. And then we called time out and put Kirk back in. Hold on. I just, as we were sitting here talking about. They left Robert in for a few plays. I just pulled up the box. I got the play-by-play right here. Here it is. You ready?

Here's the play-by-play. Griffin scrambles under two minutes to go, all right? Down 28 to 20. So we had the score right, down eight. Robert Griffin scrambles left end for 13 yards, tackled by Helodinata, injured on the play. Redskins are forced to call a timeout after that, or they took a time out because of the injury.

Cousins comes in, and there's a defensive pass interference. It's a third and six that he comes in on with Griffin on the bench. Throw short to Garsohn pass interference first down, and Griffin comes back in the game, throws short to Moss for 15 yards, throws incomplete to Garsohn, throws deep middle to Garsohn for 22 yards down to the Baltimore 16-yard line. They're going no huddle, and Griffin is then injured during that next play on an incomplete pass. First, there's a holding on the play.

I'm sorry, intentional grounding. That's right. Remember, he was about to go down and he just grounded it. Yeah, and he was hurt. He was hurt. And so he comes out, it's first. and 20, with 45 seconds to go. Kirk throws to Hankerson for 15 yards, and then on a third and five throws a touchdown pass to Garsohn, and then on a QB draw, two-point conversion, ties the game 28-28.

The Redskins get the ball and the punt return here. Let's just see if it was Richard Crawford. Yeah, I look Richard Crawford. I remember that. It definitely was. Yeah, Richard Crawford, 64-yard. punt return on a 56-yard punt down to the Baltimore. I think after the game, Robert credited Richard Crawford for winning the game.

Yeah. Richard Crawford and Robert were really good buddy. Well, Richard Crawford was an SMU guy, right? He was... Right, but I think that Robert credited him for winning the game. Right. When Kirk made those two big throws at the end of the game. I would have known if I wasn't playing.

But I remember it being this weird deal. And then we went and beat Cleveland, put up 38. And then that next game, Robert was hurt. That next game against Philly. We played Philly the next game. Well, the way Shanahan tells it is that in the practices leading up early that week, this is the story he told me years ago, and he's reiterated it. few times when he's been on whenever we've talked about it. I don't even know if it's been on the air.

He said, leading up to it, they cleared him. Remember, they cleared him, which by the way, you know, most people didn't think he should have been cleared for that Philadelphia game, which was your point. They're going through, you guys are going in practice, and Robert, before one of the practices, tells Kyle that we need to take Zone Read, we need to take, you know, the Read option stuff. What did you guys call that? I forget what it was called. What was the... Yeah, what did we call?

The 50 series. The 50 series. Take the 50 series out. I can't run that. And they said to him, well, if you can't run that, we're going to have to... Kirk's going to play. And then he got much better at running that.

And then in the Cleveland game, there's a read option where he keeps it, and he hobbles to the sideline. That's an image I'll never be able to shake. He hobbles to the sideline and gets out of bounds, and he says, I can't run it anymore. And they say, well, we're going to put Kirk in. And you better at least look like you can run it the rest of the way.

This is a key against them. And he did. And, you know, you guys won the game. You actually played in that game. You had a catch in that game for eight yards. I'm looking at the box score right now. That was my only catch of the year. Was it really?

Yeah. And it was a lot of the young players because I had not played previous year, and they all cheered for me when I came off on the sideline. By the way, we were also in this strange rotation where Sean was the tight end coach McVeigh, managing who went in and not. They were switching plays as I was running in, and Sean tried to get me off the field so Nile could go in. Oh, really? I was not coming out for that. I knew the play.

Like, no, I'm going to get one catch this year. And you did. And the rest is history. The next week was the Dallas Sunday night game for the division. Morris rushes for 200 yards. Griffin rushes for 63 yards in that game on six carries only through for 100 yards, nine for 18. But Rob Jackson was the hero of that game, having that, you know, getting that late pick on Tony Romo. And then it was the playoff game. And, you know, the funny thing is that playoff game alone, the Seattle playoff game alone, could be a 30 for 30. You wouldn't even need, like the rest of it could be its own 30 for 30, The Seattle playoff game is truly one of the infamous games in Redskins history.

You know, I created this thing that eventually I'm going to get to, you know, on the podcast or on the radio show, sort of a list of the most memorable Redskin games in history. And that Seattle playoff game is, you know, a top 10, top 15, all-time memorable Redskins game. You know, and what makes it so memorable is the fact that it really early on not only looked like the Redskins were going to destroy Seattle, you know, as we took a 14 to nothing lead in the first quarter. But that the Redskins in that moment were a legitimate threat to go deep into the postseason. You know, they were going to take care of Seattle. They were going to play Atlanta the next week. They were not a juggernaut to Falcons at all. Winnable game. The 49ers were the one

seed, you know, and I don't think they were better than the 49ers, definitely. But if Griffin's healthy. You know, that may be the closest, and I know you would say maybe the Seattle game after the Tampa win, but offensively in 2012 with a healthy Griffin, and early on in that Seattle game, he looked healthy. That's as close to really making a super deep run as we've been. No, there's no doubt, and I think if Robert would have just that, the silly game, I think he would have been all right. It would have been better. I mean, you never know, Kev. You never know exactly what it is.

But it's just one of those things that it was funny to watch that kind of unfold. And I like young players that want to play. I do. But Philly was like 4 and 10 at that point. It was Nick Foles that was in. And we were going to beat him. Yeah, Kirk proved the week before that, you guys could go and win a game against a bad team. By the way, just real quickly, and then

we will get to the draft. I also want to get your thoughts on the Alex Smith stuff. Well, by the way, go ahead. I was just going to say that that Seattle playoff game, you know, obviously the Robert injury was game changing, but there's one play very early in that game that I think was the critical play of that game, and I think if it doesn't happen, the Redskins win going away. Do you remember? what it was. Yeah, Russell Wilson's scramble or something, a huge play that Wilson made, right? So, 14-0-0, Redskins touchdown drive, Seattle 3-and-out punt,

Redskins-long touchdown drive, 14-0, already into the second quarter, and it's, you know, third and 12. They've yet to pick up a first down, and Russell Wilson scrambles a little bit and find Zach Miller for, a third and 12 conversion. And that, if not, they're punning to us again, and we got a chance to go up by three scores, which is really hard to overcome, you know, on the road. And they went down, they only got a field goal on that drive.

They only got a field goal on that drive, but that was a critical play, critical play in the game. Anyway, that would be a good 30 for 30. that would be a good 10-part documentary. That would be the one thing in Redskins history or in D.C. Sports history that I think would be fascinating to document. Because I know, and you don't even have to say it, I know there would be a lot of stories that people haven't heard about some of the things that were going on that would be wildly entertaining and at the same time probably cringe-worthy. Real quickly, before we get to the Redskins draft. Finally, Trent Williams getting traded.

I just think that he had that I'm not going to play for you mentality that you can't there's nothing you can do about it there were ways for him to get around it it wouldn't have been good for him really Kevin it would have been just as bad for him

to do that and put another year it would have hurt him tremendously it's not the worst case it's not the best case it does seem like there was a little compromise I do think in looking at it again One of the big mistakes that was made was letting him and his agent go out and try to get the deal done for the team. Why? I think that was so weird.

I don't know. I think the team should manage that entirely. Why do they need to go out and try to get a deal done? And then you've got to come back over, come back in and take it over. Trent Williams is worth the first rounder. Okay? We've had this argument, you and I, ten times, on whether or not we believe they were offered a first. don't you do.

No, it's not that I think they're off. But I saw something today that basically he had a meeting with Ron and Ron has this proved yourself theory or mentality or motto and Trent basically said, okay, I'm Trent

Williams. They're asking me to come here and have a prove it here. Right. I can prove myself. Trent Williams. I'll out of it. I'm out of it. So, look, you get a couple picks out of it. San Francisco

wins that, in my opinion, and I think they'll pay Trent and he'll stay. Trent wins. In the press conference. Yeah, well, they win the deal. Now, if you're of the mindset that the Redskins needed to end this and just get something, well, then that's great. But in terms of just assessing objectively who got the better of the deal, getting

Trent Williams at his age, all right, if he's healthy for a, fifth rounder and next year's third is highway robbery. Now, on the contract thing, I thought this was interesting. This is what he said yesterday in his press conference in San Francisco. He said, as it relates to a possible contract extension, he said, quote, obviously there's an incentive for me to play well. They gave up a third rounder next year. They kind of invested in the deal as well.

I think both parties are interested in something long-term. term, I'm more than okay with kind of just getting my feet wet and just playing it out. Now, part of that, this is my belief, okay? My belief is what happened last Friday is that Laramie Tunsell negotiates the largest deal for an offensive lineman in NFL history. He gets $22 million a year, $50 million guaranteed $66 million for three years, negotiated by himself, Cooley style, which was fascinating with Bill O'Brien. I mean, imagine what you could have gotten out of Bill O'Brien. Tunsel did damn well. And I think when he saw that contract, whatever he

had been talking to Minnesota about, because there were reports that they were talking contract extension, and whatever he was talking to San Francisco about, and they have much less cap space, he said, you know what, maybe it's better if I take the $12.5 million this year and try to strike a consul deal next off-season? Well, one, it is better. Nothing's guaranteed, right? And for Trent, for Trent at this point, other than the $12 million, anything can happen, he could end up losing money. But still, it's $12 million,

so he's going to get this shit. $12 million. We're going to put seven in our bank account after taxes. to me I look at that and just say I'm good I got 7 million bucks I mean let's invest this properly

will be fine and anything after that it would be great but yeah I think there's something to do with that but honestly

if there was a real deal out there I think you'd take it right now if there was a real tonsil type deal I think he'd take it. There's not. Right. There's not. There's not

a tonsil-type deal. What I'm suggesting is maybe he thinks, and apparently he's an incredible shape and incredible health, I'm just suggesting that maybe once he proves it to him through four or five games, you know, now in the middle of the season, he can strike a much bigger deal than he could right now.

But keep in mind, he's proven it to Kyle Shanahan and Chris Burrister who know Trent Williams. Yeah, I understand. He's proven it to two people who know him. So, yeah, it might be two, three, four games. It might be through, honestly, it might be through training camp.

And they go, yep, you're the Trent. We know, let's get this thing taken care of. Because if it gets later in the season, do they really want him to start getting frustrated with them? I bet it'll get done early. That's why I thought there should have been some contingency in it, where you get a first if they get a deal done, or you get a second if they get a deal done.

Right. I thought they should have gotten a little more. Would have been a good idea to maybe throw in the direction of Kyle or Ron or somebody. Maybe they didn't think of presenting it that way. All right. Let's get to the draft. They did. They did?

I'm sure they did. Yeah. Okay. Let's get to the draft and actually start, with who they signed after the draft. What did you think of, I mean, I remember a little bit your evaluation, but ultimately is Thadius Moss a guy that makes this roster and fits with what you think they might be trying to do offensively?

I think Thadius Moss was probably a guy who they saw as a tweener. They weren't exactly sure what he was as a receiver. They weren't exactly sure what he was in his tight end. He's probably a bring it in and see, can he block a little bit? can we find a role for him? Because they're thin at the tight-end position, I would assume that he would have a great opportunity to make this team. But I wasn't overwhelmed watching Sadius Moss's film

with exactly what he was anywhere as a football player at LSU. Now, to some extent, that could be LSU, didn't know exactly what they wanted to do with him. And they didn't play him like a tight end very often, and they didn't play him like a true receiver. And so maybe there just wasn't an answer for Moss in that system at that time. I liked him.

I didn't necessarily see him like a lot of people did as the third to seventh best tight end in this draft. I just didn't think he fit my theory of a tight end at that spot. I like his size.

I like his athleticism. I don't love anything about the potential to be a dominant tight end. That doesn't mean he can't be a good player. That doesn't mean he couldn't end up being a great side end. I just didn't see it based on what he had on film.

That was you. Credit to you because when we did the podcast, the pre-draft podcast, I had said to you that Cole Commets not, you know, mocked in anybody's first round. In fact, I've seen him mocked as late as like the Redskins pick in the third round, and you said, well, there's zero chance that he's going to be there for the Redskins pick. And I said, well, what will you commit to? and you said no worse than, you know, early to mid-second. And he went sort of early to mid-second to Chicago, the 11th pick in the second round,

is where Colquemette wet. You know, and then the next one, what was interesting about the tight ends, Cooley, is the guy that, you know, we had talked about going back, you know, three, four months that some people thought would be the second best tight end. I don't think you felt this way. Troutman ended up being the fifth tight end. end taken and Albert O, who you did like, ended up being the seventh tight end that was taken. No, I did. I didn't like that. Oh, I thought you did like Albert O. Your guy, Charlie Warner.

Here, I hated what. Yeah. Yeah, I hated watching Albert O play. Hated it. He was soft. Charlie, then I got that wrong. Charlie Warner, the guy that wasn't, was the only, the first guy picked in the draft on Saturday that when you went online and you clicked on his name didn't have an actual picture of him because they weren't expecting him to get drafted. He got selected in the sixth round. That was your guy in San Francisco. Kyle Shanahan and company saw something in Charlie Warner that you saw. Devin Asi Asiazi, the guy that I actually, in terms of the tight ends after Komet really liked. He was the second guy taken, and he was picked by the Patriots in the third round. I think you liked him too, right?

Devon Asiase was who I thought was the second best tight end in the draft. Yeah, I liked him a lot. I think that Oscei offi he can be a pretty good player. He's got size at 257. I think he's like 6-3, 6-4, pretty natural pass catcher. I thought he had some good speed. He'll fit into their system. That was a really good pick for them. I liked offi offi quite a bit. The other guys I didn't necessarily love,

I'm going to tell you right now that Charlie Warner is the next best player taken. Now, what's funny is, I think he was, like, if you go through the tight end, he was the 10th tight end taken. Most people had him in the 20s to 30s. Yeah. He got up to 10, drafted by the 4th. 49ers, they'll love him. He'll fit that system.

He's zone blocks like a maniac. He's not going to catch a lot of balls for them, obviously, with George Kittle there. But they're going to love him. That's great for him. Troutman was interesting. He played at Dayton. Who did Dayton play? And the film's so bad.

And at times he runs fast. drastically really hold really well. It's just some spastic running, so I don't know, it wasn't a great class. There'll be some guys that end up playing in the league, but it was pretty sparse.

All right, let's talk about what the Redskins got. We've heard your opinion many times that, you know, in Chey Shung, they did the right thing taking Chey Shung. We both think he's going to be really impactful and maybe elite. I'd be really disappointed if he isn't over the next

decade. Antonio Gibson, your thoughts on him. He's your side end. He's an H-back. He's an H-back. He's an H-back. Or a tight end or another running back or a fullback. He's not a running back, and he's not a wide receiver. He's an H-back. I love him.

I love Antonio Gibson. Amazing pick. I think Gibson out of Memphis was a guy that is a hybrid player, which is really weird because defensively you look at these hybrid players and you say, like Isaiah Simmons, he's a hybrid, that's the best thing we can have on defense right now is a hybrid. But on offense, when you have a hybrid-type back or a slash-type receiver or a flat guy,

no one knows how to play them. At least their value in the dress. I think Gibson could have went anywhere from late second, early third to late fourth. You know what is? To me, he's like that slash type of player that I would absolutely love to have on my team. They'll fit the needs that you have or that you got from a guy like Jordan Reed, or it'll be that Christian McCaffrey type of player where you can take your back out of the backfield, or you have that unknown choice route runner who's in varied positions.

he's explosive after the catch. He made big play after big play at Memphis. He's going to be a special player. I really am high on Antenio Gibson. Good pick. That's a Kyle Smith pick all day right there, buddy. So, you know, I did ask Rivera the other day. I said, is he a wide receiver running back or H-back?

And he said, well, tell me what's called. You know, he said, what's the play call? It's interesting. Because Caroline has had a fullback on this. their roster during the Rivera era. And the Redskins don't have a fullback or an H-back on the roster. So it makes sense from that standpoint. They have an added one, and this is what you think this is what they're envisioning for Gibson. Yeah, it's just that I don't know if Gibson is a fullback. Right. Right. That's something that they didn't necessarily play him. I don't know if he's a

guy that will lead block the way you'd actually pullback in the NFL, the lead block. He's essentially listed as weapon. But on some boot action, he's out in the flat wide open. Oh, he can do whatever he wanted him to do as a receiver. He's a really talented route runner. Gibson, he's a very good player. He's a guy that you would say, get the ball in the tan. how do we get the ball in this guy?

Who cares what he is? Let's move him around. Let's create mismatches. Let's get matchups with him. And if they adjust defense the way we don't like the description, then we'll understand what they're running defensively. I think he's a guy that can play a ton this year. I think he's a guy that can make a big impact in your offense very early. Wow. I'm glad we got that from you. Sadiq Charles, the fourth run pick from LSU.

I had this guy, Cole Kublich, who is great, by the way. You would love this guy. Stanford, Steve, and Scott both said to me, I don't know, it was a month ago we were talking. And they're like, have you a Cole Kubloch on your show yet? And I'm like, no, who's that? And they said he works for the SEC network. He's incredible as an analyst. He played at Auburn, really smart.

He's, you know, an excellent draft analyst. And when they picked him, he texted me and he said, there's your starting left tackle if he can just keep him out of trouble because he's very immature, and it's apparently a little bit more than just maybe, you know, weed. You know, apparently he was always in Ed Orgeron's doghouse. But think of it this way. At LSU, if you're in someone's doghouse, you're in the coach's doghouse, usually they can just say goodbye to you because they've got three others like you.

He must have been really good for them to keep giving him chance after chance. What did you see from him on tape? he's got awesome feet he's as athletic as it gets to the left tackle to me he's actually the closest thing you're going to get to Trent Williams on tape out of this draft

and to me you look at a three years start to LSU who is an awesome football player you just hope he mature it's a lot of the weed stuff it really is

and it's a can you really trust this guy situation. And sometimes it works out, and sometimes it doesn't, and where they drafted him, it's a perfect fit, because if it works out, and by the way, it should. You look at, to me, you look at a guy that can be a starting left tackle tomorrow for the Washington Redskins on the way to making a massive contract, likely within four years, and you would say, geez, like, we got a, we got to have this guy roll,

Hold on one sec, buddy. I got a kid in the room. Take your time. So, yeah, Sadiq Charles should be able to figure it out if he cares about making money moving forward in his career. But athletically and skill set-wise,

he'll be able to do it. And I also like when guys are forced into starting. I think he is going to be your starter. You're forcing him into it. There's a certain onus and a certain responsibility that he'll feel being in a new situation with a bunch of older guys. It should help him grow up pretty quick.

And if it doesn't, you find out right now. But you take him in the fourth round, and he's first, second round, talent, if he's clean character-wise. Are you as excited about this, Antonio Gandy Golden as everybody else's? I love Gandhi-Gold, and it's funny because we just go through the Sidney Charles character thing, and then you'd pick Gandhi-Golden 30-some people,

picks later and you get the pristine perfect smart kid nerd does all the brubic cube stuff is brilliant but i like to be or uh gandy golden's ability to play receiver and even though you only see see it at liberty he stepped up big in big games i think he played big against syracuse gets off the ball really well he's physical you put him wherever you want to put him i think he can put him in a slot a lot and he can move him he gives you some versatility You think it is, see, I was thinking when they were looking at a receiver that they were going to go for an outside guy and it's 6-4-225 or whatever he is, that he's an outside guy. Sims Jr.'s are, you know, is the guy that's going to be in the slot. I think you can put Gandy Golden wherever you want to put him. I think you can put him in the slot if you want to.

I don't see, I don't want to stereotype that position to say that position can't have size. You could put a six-four tight end in the slot, and that's a benefit to that player. Sure. If you can move Jordan Reed in a slot, not just a tight-in, man, he's special. If you can move Travis Kelsey and split him out at wide receiver, man, that's a big sign. Well, yeah, Gandy Golden's a guy that you're going to be able to line up everywhere. It doesn't mean they're going to, but I just saw a guy that can do that. Where does Kelvin Harmon fit into all of this?

I think he fits in right now as a two-wide receiver. who you want in the game because of his blocking skills, as much as his receiving skills. He's got to become more friendly to the football. He's got to make himself more available, more open as a route runner. I like Calvin Harmon a lot. I think he's a big physical kid. He's got to step up.

And maybe it's a confidence, believe in yourself completely things. He'll be an interesting how is his off-season kind of guy. The other four picks, Ishmael Hudson, Curl, Smith Williams. Anything stand out among those 40? You see a guy that's going to be on the final roster, a contributor at some point or not? Yeah, I think Ishmael is a guy that you're going to, you've got another center guard that can play all those inside positions. I don't know.

I don't think he ends up starting. Hudson's a special team guy. Curl's probably going to be a special team guy who you can push and see if he could develop as a free. Williams, I don't know. He's kind of that edge player at NC State that you're like, does he develop?

They drafted the guy like last year at Oklahoma State. That kind of deal. Oh, yeah, that guy. In the seventh round as well. Let's just take a shot. Was there anybody that you, as you were watching the draft, was on the board when their pick

was coming up that you were hoping that they were pick any name that sticks out that you wish they had gotten i wish they would have gotten the tight end well you don't have to answer if you don't have an obvious answer charlie warner yeah i was hoping they would take charlie warner out of georgia i i was truly truly hoping i think he's a starting tight end in the nfl you're going to watch this alick smith documentary tonight or not probably not have you seen the pictures i'm going to watch the jordan stuff on Sunday. Cow, that's good.

Isn't it good? Yeah, I've seen pictures. It's incredible. The Jordan stuff's incredible. Yeah, the Jordan thing's great. What's your favorite part of the Jordan of the last dance so far? Because you're not a big hoops fan, but you were a big, you were a big, were you a Nuggets fan or a jazz fan?

I forget. I was a jazz fan. I think my favorite part, though, is when Kenny Maine said, if you touch, sometime in the future, if you touch your phone in the right places. pizza will show up at your door. It's a great ad. How did they do, though? Those are amazing.

I know. Well, you can see the mouth moving in a weird way. The best thing, yeah. The best thing to me about the Jordan stuff was just how much of a bad-ass competitor want to win, don't give a care about anything else, know how good he is, push people. he's amazing. And here's my other favorite part of this Jordan thing. Are we going to even debate who's the best player in the history of the NBA after this?

Maybe it was LeBron conversation? No, it's not. It's that whole, it's that whole, who do you want on the court if you had to win a game? Pick one. I'd take Jordan and then Kobe. Yeah, they're the killers. That to me, that to me is Jordan's just, Jordan's just an absolute killer. You need him to score 60, he'll score 60.

But I thought some of the Phil Jackson stuff was really, really fascinating as a head coach. And then you look at what Steve, Steve, Steve Kerr has done, and everything that he took almost exactly from Phil Jackson and some of the tribe mentality stuff that Jackson started to initiate into that locker room. the fact that Jordan wasn't going to play for anybody but Phil Jackson. I mean, the love that they had for him as a coach, after Jordan didn't want him to be the coach. Exactly.

How about the fact that they hired Phil Jackson when Collins was Jordan's guy that would never happen today? LeBron picks the coach. They would never hire a guy that LeBron didn't want. No. Never. Never, ever. I mean.

The whole thing, the Dennis Rodman to Vegas mid-season vacation thing is just, you know, you mentioned Phil Jackson. To me, one of the most incredible parts of the two episodes from last week is to think about Dennis Rodman and how teetering on, you know, mental health issues he was and how lucky he was as a young person who had a very dysfunctional upbringing to get Chuck Daly and Phil Jackson. as his professional head coaches. Two people that really understood him. Not to mention, he ended up on two iconic teams, you know,

because he's a great player, Cooley. Dennis Rodman's an all-time great player. He's one of the greatest relentless energy rebounders ever. And, you know, Phil Jackson in the middle of the season, brings Michael Jordan in to say, Dennis wants to take some vacation time. He wants to go to Vegas. It's hysterical.

Jordan's like, he's not coming back. We can't let him go. Jordan then, at that point, they don't involve Jerry Krause in that decision at all. Right. Phil Jackson goes to Michael Jordan instead of going to Krause. And Jordan basically plays GM at that point and says, no, we can't do this. We're not going to get him back. But ultimately says, okay, but understand he's not going to be back and forth.

48 hours. That's not happening. And then he had to go get him out of his hotel room. But you know that so it's really interesting real quickly, and I forget if I mentioned this on the podcast yesterday or Tuesday. But on Monday, I was like, is it clear that he went to Vegas to get him out of the hotel room where Carmen Electra was? And C.J. No, I think he.

No. I don't think he did. No, he didn't. But they implied that he did. And then they came back the next day on Tuesday. and essentially admitted that they sort of misled. He was actually back from Vegas. He was at his apartment across the street from the United Center in Chicago. So Jordan went across the street to get him.

You know, Jordan didn't get onto a plane and go out to, you know, Mandalay Bay or the Venetian to Yancom. But what year was this? 97-9. To the Mirage or the Flamingo Hilton to get him out of his hotel room and bring him back to Chicago. But you're right about Jackson, and it's really interesting to see how much, especially at that level, in that sport in particular, it's about relationships and the way you deal with players as much as it is, if not more so, than X's and O's. Even though the triangle offense in Tex Winter, you know, and Phil Jackson believing in it,

was essentially the reason he got the job. you know, and Collins was ousted. But really, Jackson was so much more than that. No, I think he was absolutely amazing, and in part because that was, he was a little wild. Right, exactly. And that was another cool part about why he understood Dennis Rodman, because I think Dennis reminded him of himself a little bit.

I don't know, the whole thing's amazing. You know, the other thing I was thinking about as I was watching this, And it's just a couple things. The time, the era difference that we're in right now, like what Carmen Elektra said, I really just thought they were on vacation. I didn't know that he was supposed to. Right.

I didn't know yet games. She would have 10 million tweets and Instagram messages and Snapcast and everything that would have been going on saying, like, what are you doing? You're taking Dennis Rodman away from the bowl. Why are doing this? You guys are crazy. Like, everyone in Vegas is a party.

most people in Vegas, he's like, oh, yeah, hey, Dennis Rodman, they must not have a game tonight. No one knew Dennis Rodman wasn't supposed to be in Vegas. He just went and had a hell of a time. His little kamikaze song's funny, too. He's all around funny at that point.

Some of his, he looks bad now, but. Well, I mean, how about that? That was really... The part of it, and I forget who said this, and it may have been somebody who was a guest on my show,

earlier this week. But they said that it was so cool. Oh, it was Wilbon, I think. Wilbon said what's really cool is to see, you know, Scotty Pippin and Michael Jordan and Phil Jackson and Dennis Rodman all watching the video of Jordan, you know, telling the story, you know, and they're all smiling and nodding. And, you know, like, yep, that's what happened. And what you've experienced.

you know, on being, you know, being a part of a team and developing those relationships and that lifelong sort of connection in bond. And when it sort of crosses over into sort of, you know, big audience, sports fans, or pop culture, it's really cool to see that. You know, watching that and watching these guys as older guys in their, you know, mid to upper 50s, you know, sitting there just nodding along in. smiling and remembering it, you know, exactly as it happened. I mean, those are the, you know, I'm sure you with many of your teammates,

college pro, et cetera, that, you know, you get together at some point, you start telling those old stories and it's kind of cool that you have that connection. No, it's amazing the connections that they have, but let's not forget that winning six championships didn't aid in those relationships. True, true. And that spending a good part of a decade together, most of them or a lot of them didn't aid in those relationships. And also, everyone coming in knowing who Mike was and always wanting to please him. And then, like, I didn't have that.

Yeah, fair. I just, yeah. I didn't, I would have loved that. I understand what that would be like. I never had that in sports. And so you do look at it and you would think how much fun that would be. They can do this with the Patriots. 15 years from now, and we can do Kenny Maine

advertisement for that, too, at that point. And that'll be really, really good. But I didn't necessarily have that. So that was amazing. The last thing I was going to say, that I thought that I've just, this was going to be my what do you got? And you had two.

You only got to one to start the show, but. No, I didn't. I got to the, I got to the Zabe thing. That's what the, oh, that was good. You just didn't introduce it to me as that. Oh, sorry. I don't think that my,

Michael, the path that Michael Jordan would have went on, not being on his varsity team as a sophomore, would have made it hard for him to be at Chapel Hill. Like, how did he not went to Howard Garfinkel's five-star basketball camp? He would have never been there. And that was a big part of it. But not having the size, not having the height, whatever it was, his first, early in high school, the way recruiting changed and social media, like the social media thing and the recruiting aspect. North Carolina is getting commits that are in seventh grade right now, and it wouldn't have been Michael Jordan.

Well, so now you're into an area that I really, really remember, you know, because Michael Jordan became a player at Carolina. He was an ACC player, played Maryland two, three times every year, and I remember so many of those great games. Michael Jordan, by the time he was a senior, was a major recruit. I mean, Patrick Ewing was the number one player in America. But Michael Jordan was like in the top five players. He played in one of the most famous Capitol Classic games, which was the high school all-American game that was played at the Capitol Center here in D.C. And it was one of the top two or three games every year.

We don't have it here anymore. But it was, you know, Patrick Ewing and Michael Jordan. And there was another big name player in that game. that I'm forgetting. But anyway, Jordan, by the time he became a senior, was one of the top recruits in the country. So, no, I understand that. It's just funny. And maybe they would have bounced somebody else for Jordan at that time. But no one's offering senior scholarships. It's not that often that your first offer comes your senior year. No, that's true. That's true. I mean, it's new. It's a new thing. And well, yeah, I mean, but back then, you got, you had kids.

I mean, Damon Bailey, early to mid-80s or late 80s, Indiana, was offered as an eighth grader, you know, by Bobby Knight. So, I mean, you had some of that. But, yeah, I mean, I think one of the interesting things of the first two nights of this documentary, and Doc pointed this out on his show, and I think it was so spot on, is that you see Jordan riding around on a bicycle, you know, on Chapel Hill's campus. And he played three years. He was three years in college at the University of North Carolina. And that bond that I was talking... He was going to stay a fourth.

And the bond that I was talking about that, you know, you very... I think you're 100% right, that you didn't have the same thing because you weren't playing with this superstar. Although I could bring it full circle and say, you are going to be a part of the RG330 for 30. You were a part of something that sort of crossed over in a major way. But to watch Jordan as a college student and recognize the experience that that is, you know, LeBron didn't get it, Kobe didn't get it, a lot of the one-and-doneers,

because they're essentially there for a semester. And then the second semester, they're getting ready for the NBA draft. It's a, I think it's so important to, I think it's people like LeBron James and Kobe Bryant and the guys that go one and done, they missed out on something, you know, that Jordan actually got to experience because you weren't in a one-and-done era back then. And it was just very, very rare that you got high school straight to the NBA. And you can see that he's part of the Carolina family. Like he is a North Carolina man, you know, and I think it's important, you know,

to his life, I think, in many ways. But anyway, I think that that's, he had an experience that a lot of guys don't have now, But I think where we've gotten is they can't have that experience anymore. No. They can't see past what they should be doing or what they think they should be doing. And so it's impossible for them to go and enjoy school. Exactly. All right.

It won't ever happen again. I know you got to run. Thanks for doing this. I'll talk to you over the weekend early next week. All right, buddy. Have a good one. All right. Good to catch up with Cooley for over an hour.

on a lot of different things. Just a reminder, and I mentioned this yesterday, if you are able to, and don't kill yourself trying to do this, but if it's easy on Apple or the podcast platform that you're listening on to rate us and review us, and you haven't done that, do that. Rate us really highly and write a nice short review of how much you like the podcast. That actually helps us from an ability to generate revenue. advertising. So again, don't kill yourself if it's easy. It's not available on every podcast

platform. If it is available on the podcast platform you're listening on and you can do that, that would be helpful. Nothing else really, I mean, Chris Thompson signed with Jacksonville. He's going to reunite with Jay Gruden down in Jacksonville. I thought the comments from John Wall yesterday on this All the Smoke podcast with Stephen Jackson and Matt Barnes, recently. said, I'm going to be better than I was before, and that's the scary part. They ain't even got the best of John Wall yet. I'm actually really, I think many of you know this. I'm a huge Redskinned fan.

I'm a huge Maryland basketball, Maryland football fan, but I love the Wizards and the bullets and the history of it and going way back. I'm old enough to remember all the great bullet teams, and I really enjoyed there for a couple of years, Wall and Beal and, you know, Pierce and Erezah and, you know, Gortot and nay, nay, and some of those teams, and that seven-game series with Boston was phenomenal. And I'd love to see them get back to that. And if John Wall really can come back physically better than ever, you know, to combine with a Bradley Beal who's been maturing, you know, as a score since John Wall's been out and an all-around player, I would be excited to see that. Is it championship caliber?

No, but it's certainly playoff caliber. You know, it's certainly, you know, back to a level of being able to get to the postseason and, you know, win a series or two. I'll take that at this point with that franchise. That's the one thing I'm missing. I'm really not missing sports in games right now. I'm really not. You know, the NHL playoffs would have been great. Obviously, I missed the tournament.

The NBA playoffs are not going on right now without the Wizards. I would have been watching it. I would have been staying up and watching a lot of these games. I would have. But ultimately, I think one of the things we're learning from this lockdown, from this stay-at-home stuff is that we can live without sports. I don't think we could do it during the NFL season. I don't, but I think we can definitely do it this time of year.

And I think we're learning that. By the way, real quickly, you know, I saw this quote, from Joe Buck on HBO Real Sports that he suggested basically that if games resume in the fall on time, hopefully they will, with no fans, that broadcast should use old crowd noise recordings. So when you're watching it on TV, even though the stadium's empty, you're hearing the same crowd noises as if they're a laugh track on a TV sitcom. I think that's a bad idea. I don't that. You know, I've mentioned this before, I think, to Tommy, if you watch college football early Saturdays, you know, in the fall, 12 o'clock game or a Wednesday night game, you know, from

the Mac or a 12 noon game on Saturday from the AAC, where it's Tulsa hosting SMU, you see plenty of games with barely anybody there, you know, barely a crowd. You know, as somebody called in this morning and had the idea of some sort of Zoom, you know, answer to, you know, fans, piping in 50,000 Zoom fans watching the game together and reacting together and piping that in to the stadium. I don't know if that can happen, technologically speaking. But anyway, we got a long way to go between now and then who knows what this thing's going look like by the time we get there. But I would not be in favor of that necessarily. Also, one other

thing, somebody sent me a tweet saying, hey, did you see after the draft the Redskins win total went up to six from wherever it was? Where was it? Four and a half, five, five and a half, I can't remember where it was. And that it's not the lowest in the league anymore. Jacksonville and Cincinnati both have lower over under win totals in Vegas next year. Just so you know, it's not because of the results of the draft. That's not factored into the equation at all. What's factored into the equation is the action they're getting. It just means that the Redskins have had a ton of overaction. People have been playing the over, and so they've moved the number accordingly. And maybe there's been very sharp action on the Redskins over. I mentioned

this to you. I like the Redskins winning more than, it was four and a half, right? I think that's what it was, four and a half or five. I liked the Redskins winning more, even though it was not my typical, typical contrarian answer. So that number moving has nothing to do with the draft. Zero to do with the draft. It has to do with where the action has been coming in. By the way, one other quick thing before we run for the day. Saw a story this afternoon. If college football is delayed and there is talk of college football not being played until next spring. Again, who the hell knows how this all unfolds? But that the NFL would play games on Saturdays too. So keep that in mind that if we get to fall and the NFL's playing and colleges aren't because students aren't back on campus,

you would get the NFL to, you know, have part of their contingency plan to play a bunch of games on Saturday. All right, that's it for the day. Have a healthy, safe weekend, and I will talk to you on Monday.