The Kevin Sheehan Show - Czabe at Home

Episode Date: April 7, 2021

Kevin and Czabe today on the podcast. They talked virus, masks, Scherzer, Washington Football, Snyder, Darnold, Watson, had a few Masters picks, and a lot more.   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it, but you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Chean Show. Here's Kevin. Podcast today is part of this disheveled, discombobulated home-and-home thing that Steve Zabin came up with a few weeks ago. I forgot who owes who which a home game, almost like Georgetown in Maryland. I owe you, right?

So this is going to take me off the hook. I don't, yeah, I think. you owe me because you, the last time we did this, I was doing it from that crazy, you know, defense department van that you've got set up over there in an undisclosed location. The surveillance van, exactly. Hey, don't pay any attention to this van. It's not doing anything weird. Yeah. Which, by the way, was fun. And, you know, Zab's going to be on the podcast today. We've got lots of things to talk about. I'm not even sure we have much of a plan here. but I was checking out your website, zabe.com, and you just did a power lunch. Did I do the power lunch with you? Is that what I did with you in Carol?

You just feed you? You did feed me. That was very nice. You had the power lunch. Yeah, that was a power lunch. You did Adrian Dantley. Yeah. I haven't listened to it. I haven't watched it. How was he? He was great. Now, AD is a simple man. He's a very humble guy for having had an epic NBA career. He's one of the 15 greatest players to not have a ring, according to many basketball websites and aficionados. And he has done so many things in his career,

and he's now a crossing guard for the health benefits in Montgomery County, Maryland. Hilarious. He's also a referee in the area. Yes. He just likes to stay busy and stay active, and he's very, very humble about his career. I asked him, I said, how would you evaluate his career? And he kind of paused and said, I had a pretty good career. And I go pretty good. Really? He had an unbelievable career. So this is going to be, I don't know, seven or eight years ago. I'm coaching a game somewhere. I forget where we were. And I didn't really notice it,

until maybe seven, eight minutes into the game. I'm looking at this guy who, to be perfectly honest with you, was not moving very smoothly up and down the court as a referee. But during one of the timeouts, like he walked over, he picked up the ball and he walked over to the scores table, and I was standing there, and I looked at him, and I just said it out loud. I go, you're Adrian Dantley.

And he just smiled and laughed. He's like, yes, I am. He just smiled and laughed. And after the game, you know, I told my kids, like, you know, whatever happened at the end of the game, and we all get together. And I said, I just want you to know that that man over there that just refereed your game is an NBA Hall of Famer. He's one of the greatest basketball players in the history of the league. I mean, he averaged, you know, I don't know how many career points he had, but he was a prolific score for many, many years. And the kids looked at them and they're like, yeah, sure, coach.

Yeah, right. That's pretty funny. And so with that, I did ask him. I said, Adrian, you got a second? And I introduced him and he came over. He was very, very nice. And I said, you know, like you said, he's so humble. He didn't want to be in that position.

And so I quickly sort of, you know, moved on because I could tell he was not comfortable doing that. And I think he would have preferred to have gone unnoticed, in fact. But it's hard. And then over the years, and it's been, you know, because of COVID, I haven't been in a gym watching high school basketball games or, you know, lower level games in a while. But I ran into him a lot of times. In fact, Zabe, there were a lot of really Michael Adams was a big time referee around the area.

Michael was a really good referee, too. Not that Adrian Dantley wasn't. He was good too. But Michael Adams could move. X-Rehip. remember him. He was roughing games for years. It's funny. Great. Yeah. I would think that you would enjoy talking to AD because you're such a basketball fanatic, and he's got a lot of interesting stories. The picture he painted about how the league

was when he was in it was crazy just because he got drafted by the Buffalo Braves, who are now the clippers. And they had two owners at the time, two. And they would alternate coming into town running the team, and then the other guy would leave town to go do whatever he did, you know? And they were, one owner would trade a player while he was running the team, and then the next month the other owner would make another trade. And it was madden. And at one point, they had AD and Moses Malone on the team, but they ended up trading both of those guys away because they had two owners. In Utah. Oh, in Buffalo? Moses Malone was on the team in Buffalo. Interesting. Yeah, in Buffalo, and when he went to Utah, he said what drove him out of Utah, and he liked it there, was that he held out one year.

He was only making $5.50 or something like that a year under a million dollars. He led the league in scoring, and he held out. He ended up, I guess, getting his money, but then Frank Layden, who was the GM and the coach of the time, held a grudge. And so he said, Layton was hell-bent on shipping him out of town because he felt like he lost that negotiation. and I said, sounds exactly like the petty bullshine that used to go on in the league. And, of course, you went to the Pistons and was a great addition to those bad boys teams and was likely to get him over the hump into the finals until he collided with Vinny Johnson's head in game seven at the Boston Garden in the fourth quarter. Yeah, and, you know, I'm just, I just pulled up his basketball reference page because I want to see, you know, how he had multiple.

Look at the number of total three for his career. Oh, it had to be zero. Oh, yeah. 41. Yeah. 41 three-point attempts for his 15-year career, and I think all of them came in the last four years. Yeah, and I was going to free throws because he was always at the free throw line.

And look, one year he averaged 12 free throw attempts a game and shot 86%. He averaged over 30 points a game four times in his. career. Oh, yeah. You know, remember the lunch with a legend thing that Tommy and I used to do as part of our show. So one of the

ones that I really enjoyed was Morgan Wooten. We did him when he was still alive. And, you know, I grew up going to up Morgan Wooten's basketball camp, which was really like the basketball camp on the East Coast. And kids came from all over. And I was there every

single summer, you know, growing up and right through, you know, right through the beginning of high school. Anyway, you know, one of the things that you always heard from Morgan at camp, when he would talk to the campers before the day or at the end of the day, were just, it was just one Adrian Dantley story after another. And it was very clear that Adrian Dantley, out of all of the great players he's had, was his favorite players. So we asked him in that lunch with a legend. I said, did you have, you know, I know it's hard for coaches to do this, but I think I know who your favorite player that you ever coached was,

will you tell us? And he said, well, I won't do that. We had a lot of great players, and he wouldn't even start to list. And I said, every single day that started camp and every single afternoon when camp ended, you had another Adrian Dantley story about how he would take. He had his own key to the gym that he'd get to school at 6 a.m. And he'd be working on his fundamentals.

and he just smiled and he said, well, Adrian's up there, that's for sure. Because he really described Adrian Dantley as self-made. You know, he wasn't the most gifted player that he ever coached talent-wise, but he was self-made. Absolutely. And, of course, I got into it with Adrian about his game and how it would translate, if at all, to today's NBA because you watch the old highlights of him. And I mean, the league

was a league of slow-moving Macedon, gangly, all knees and elbows and just angles and individual play. And that's what the league was back then. I'm not saying the players that era weren't great. They were great for their era. But today's game is

so much more explosive. It's so more dynamic that I have a hard time believing that a guy like Adrian and Damage could even survive. in today's league. Now, he says he would because he says he's got a good, quick first step, and he knew how to draw contact, and in today's NBA, you can go to the hole, and they're not going to, you know, knock you to the ground like they did it back in the 70s and the 80s, because you'll get fined and suspended. And I thought there was some merit to that.

Yeah, look, I get into this with my, you know, our good friend, Tommy, all the time, and I'm like, You know, in fact, I remember it was probably like a year or two ago on NBA TV. They were running the 1962 NBA finals. As it was broadcast, yeah, 1962, as it was broadcast by, I think it was ABC Sports. By the way, like just some of the things from back then that are hysterical, like when you fouled late in the game, it was one free throw. It wasn't two when you were in the penalty. It was one.

So there was a much bigger benefit to fouling because the most points they could score in the possession was one. And then the NBA thought, okay, we need to overcorrect for that. So the institute is the equally hilarious three to make two. Oh, yeah. Yeah, but at least that was more penal for a foul. The other was like an incentive to foul. Exactly. But the thing about watching that, I remember sitting there watching it, I'm like, oh my God, like, no offense to the greats.

And Elgin Baylor just passed away recently. And Elgin Baylor was in this game and Jerry West was in this game. And Bob Coosie and, you know, Bill Russell. You know, like Russell and Elgin Baylor looked like, you know, major difference makers. I'm sitting there watching, I swear to God, I came and I told Tommy this. I thought he was going to have a heart attack. I said, Jerry West couldn't even dribble with his left hand, Tommy. Like, nobody guarded any of these people.

And I told them, and I swear to God, I believe this to be true, that DeMath's team last year probably would have won a game in these NBA finals in 1962, if not won the series outright. Now, that's a hilarious proposition argument, and it's one that I would sign on. I think you're right. I think they would stun the old mastodon with their speed and explosiveness and these fancy, crazy crossover dribbles and through the legs and the fact that they contested shots in the air.

Like the other thing about old school basketball, the NBA, nobody contested in the air. Nope. They thought if you just faced up against the guy and put your hand up on the defense, that's all you can do. Yeah. Not how it is today in the NBA. No, it's, you know, we all understand evolution when it comes to, you know, diet and training and the athlete of today. You know, LeBron's 6-9 and 260. Jordan was 6-6 and 195.

Like, there's a big difference. But what I'm saying, actually, is that the skill was much different, too. Like, I think I can go to the 80s and say that the skill level, the ball-harmes, handling like Isaiah Thomas is a ball handler and is a scorer and you know that there's there's not that there there's better skill today they're better skilled but the difference between like early 60s and what you see today honestly at the high school level the games played in a in a way in which the NBA level back then wasn't played and I know people are listening to this going you're insane you're talking about no we're not in I don't think so you know what we're we're we're

logical because, as you know, and people that watch sports knows, everything evolves, everything gets better, every iteration, you know, advancement in technology and processes, it's all about iteration. So every kid now playing the game has watched and modeled their game off of better players and better players from back through the generations. And so they're good at a younger age now than kids were a while ago, and they specialized more too now. They play in more high-level competitions in tournaments and the AAU ball. AAU gets, of course, it deserves graft for doing what it does for the college game and recruiting and everything else, but it's high-level competition that these kids are in at a very early age, and that's something you didn't get. If you were the

best kid playing basketball on your schoolyard at your school, in your high school, in your league, whatever, you didn't really see anybody else of similar caliber until you finally got to college. Not anymore. They're seeing it at 13. There is no doubt that what you said is 100% true because it's year-round and there is high-level competition if you seek it out and if you're at that level year-round. Here's the big thing that's been my gripe as somebody who's been coaching on and off for 30 years. The thing that sucks, and I think most coaches at any level would tell you this, is you don't practice anymore. You're just playing games. And I think that ultimately leads to, you know, a simplification of what you're doing on the floor. It's why you see

basically space the floor, you get one ball screen, and it's like, you know, create. Find an open shot. Yeah, there's no more five-man basketball, although we saw it with Gonzaga offensively in the tournament, which was really unique. But I think that basketball IQ and the things that you do, that were done back in the day when you practiced more are just different. I think practice, so many teams that I've coached, you get one practice day a week and then you're playing four games over a weekend. Yeah, I think you're right.

I think the individual state of the art for the individual player has advanced by leaps and balance. I think overall team concept basketball has stagnated, if not regressed a bit. And I think part of it is it's just not worth it. Like the analytics of the game have hacked basketball, like it's hacked every sport, to figure out this is not worth doing. This is not worth doing. Do this and this instead.

It's better to jack up a three, go hard on the rebound, and then try to outpace your opponent if you've got the tech. talent on your side. Forget all this fancy, you know, three passes, backdoor, screen. I mean, it looks pretty and we love it. We're romanticizing it, but it's hard to do. It's easy to disrupt if you've got the physically superior team like we saw with Baylor on Monday night, and it's just not worth it for both teams. Did you like the tournament or not? I did. I like the fact that it happened, as I said afterwards, the Hays and the Barn. Next stop is hopefully full stadiums September in football.

But, you know, it was a hell of an effort to get it done. There was a lot of people in our business, Kevin, that were bizarrely rooting and actively advocating for it not to happen. And it would have been an extinction-level event if the NCAA couldn't have staged a tournament because it's a ton of money. I mean, I don't know anybody in our business. It was actively rooting for it not to happen. I wanted it to happen.

Pat 40, Dan Wolkin, a bunch of other... What were they saying? They were just concerned? No, they were like, we can't. This is dangerous. This is Christine Brennan. Darkest days for the Big Ten when they pushed ahead with football. Oh, yeah, there was quite a few members on Team Virus that just thought this was too dangerous.

And guess how many coaches, how many players ended up even in the hospital, much less anything worse for the virus. Zero, zero, zero. So I'm glad they got it done. The tournament itself wasn't that great because that buzzer-beater by Gonzaga was the first actual buzzer-beater of the tournament. We've had years where there was like six of them by the time we got to the final four. I thought it was, by the way, I totally, when you started ripping off the names, I can totally hear I just didn't, I didn't see it or read it. And I think that the number, those numbers are down. Look, I remember, I remember having, remember prior to free agency and draft talk last

March, how adamant various people were. Adam Schaefter, you know, was very, very, this is, this is not the right decision to move forward with free agency. And I, I had them on the show. And I said, you know, Adam, to be totally honest with you, your perspective, you live in New York, it's a hot spot. I live in D.C. I don't know one person that has gotten this. And the feeling about it in most of the country, other than in Seattle, Washington,

and in a senior home, and in New York in a couple of other spots, is there is some concern and there's some fear. But these things are diversions that probably people need right now. And I just said, I think. But Shepter's complaint for the draft last year was one of optics. It was one of a sort of a sensitivity. Yes. It was like, how can the NFL two?

this. The country is enough evil. I forget what, did he say blood in the streets or something crazy like that? Yes, it was something like that. And I'll accept the fact that him being in New York City, where it was especially rattling would lead to that. But thank God the NFL

pressed ahead. Because, you know, here we are a year and two months later, and we're still neck deepened. I mean, you were talking to be before we came on about how the Nats with their 5,000 fans raised a banner. And your point was, why don't they just effing wait until we can get close to a full stadium to do that? And I couldn't agree more.

Yeah, well, in part because the 5,000 people that they're letting in are season ticket holders. And by the way, I don't know this for a fact. But I'm going to guess that they're among the premier season ticket holders. So, you know, they shouldn't have done it. And how many times are they going to do it? By the way, just speaking of virus-related issues, how about what Max Scherzer said after the game last night? I loved it. He wants the upper deck.

He's willing to go out there, and he's not wrong. I mean, hell, I looked at the Cubs opener in the state of Illinois, which has been pretty darn restrictive on everything, and they had what looked to me to be at least 30 percent, and they had people pretty much sprinkled throughout the stadium. It's nonsense. It's nuts to not have at least some people in the upper deck, but good for Matt for sale of it.

Yeah, I don't, I mean, and by the way, I thought you could hear in sort of the tone. And he said, I'm respecting the virus, but I think he's among those of us. And I think you and I probably think similarly as it relates to this. And by the way, I'm not, you know, I wear a mask. I socially distance. I do all of those things that are respectful to those that really have been living in fear. But more importantly, those that are truly vulnerable to this. Have you been vaccinated?

No, I had COVID back in January. I definitely lost my sense of smell for several days. I got tested. It came back positive. So I'm in no rush to get it. You know, they say that you could lose your immunity after a certain number of months. Others believe that there is T-cell memory for your immune system. I suppose I might get it at some point.

But, yeah. As far as the outdoor stuff, here's the bottom line, outdoor transmission of this virus is extremely rare. That's not my opinion. That's scientific fact. They've done studies on this. In fact, transmission within the home, this is amazing. They said there was only a 17% attack rate of symptomatic people in the home. So in other words, if you have somebody sent in your home, with symptoms, only 17% typically of people sharing that home end up getting infected.

And when it comes to asymptomatic, it's under 1%, even when you're in the home setting. So being outdoors at a ballgame, even if you are briefly standing in line for a beer or going to the pisser, is not going to make this pandemic explode, not by any measure. And with the other one being almost able to be vaccinated by now, they should be opening stuff up a lot more. I don't, God, man, it's in whatever. some some people listening are going to you know have a conniction I don't I don't really give a shit I I've been I've been on this I've been on this I've been on this I've been on the CDC website you know is recently is like two weeks ago and if you've been fully vaccinated you can be outside or even inside your home without a mask I don't I don't understand why those that are fully vaccinated, other than for optics, you know, as you like to say, I don't really understand why they're wearing a mask if they've been fully vaccinated

and you go to CDC.gov and it says you don't have to wear a mask outdoors if you've been vaccinated. A lot of people are literally now nervous to not wear a mask. I have seen videos of poor young women who are terrified to get off an elevator because somebody in that elevator is not wearing their mask properly and they won't get off before them because there's a lot of people that, you know, we know, but we don't think about it all the time that are living very fragile lives mentally. And I have sympathy for them, Kevin. But if you are already living a fragile life mentally for whatever reason. And now you've had a year of fear-mongering and doom and paranoia. It's not going to sit well with you. And these poor people, it's going to take a long time to

unfuck them mentally. So it's going to be interesting. Well, there are going to be so many, so many impacts. I mean, look, I've got, you know, I've got boys and I've got, I've got, some and still in college. I mean, the experience just in college for young people over the last year I mean, it's not the college experience. Whatever. There are people, look, you know, bottom line is, you know, we're at half a million or 600,000 or whatever it is. I don't know what the number is. I don't watch the tracker all day on various networks.

But it's a lot of people that have died and a lot of people who have been impacted and I'm not insensitive to that at all. I just commonsensically, when the CDC tells you, if you've been vaccinated, you really, unless you're inside in a large, gathering or a medium-sized gathering don't need to wear a mask. I don't know why we are. But then again, I'm sure I'm missing something. I don't know why at this point. I don't know why at this point they can't say, look, assess your own risks. Vaccines are rolling out to almost everybody now. And so if you don't feel comfortable going to a restaurant or a ballgame or the park, don't go to those places and live your life. But we seem to have forgotten that default setting for life that there are risks. people have germs and that you could die by just leaving your house, getting hit by a tire that

flies off of a truck and smash it into your front door. And don't think that doesn't happen. I've seen it on YouTube. All right. Jerry West wasn't very good and we're really upset with those people that have been vaccinated that are still wearing masks. Where are we going next? Where are we going next? Summary, that is not the summary of what we've talked about today, but fine, let's move on. I want to ask you if you have a resounding sense of defeat about the official news that Snyder now owns 100% of the Washington football team. He not only survives, he emerges fully stronger than before. Great T's.

I sign this to be bitter. Great T's. Great teas. We'll both answer that question you just did, but we'll both answer it right after this word from one of our sponsors. Steve Zavin, joining us on the podcast today. If you're still listening, I'll answer the question that Zabe asked me. You know, he's just not, there's clearly nothing in the Wilkinson report that is smoking gun material. If there were, then he would not have been able to purchase the remaining minority share. from Schar and Rothman and Smith with, you know, a debt waiver, which obviously the new TV deal allows him to do some of that. So, you know, I'm disappointed.

Like, if we didn't have all the shit that we had over the summer and the promise of maybe, just maybe there's going to be something that we're going to find out about him that's going to force him to sell the team, you know, we got our hopes up, even though I think it was a long shot hope to begin with. But now they're snuffed out. And you know, Zabe, here's the thing. They hired, they hired, I mean, they have had an emphasis this football franchise has now, going back to last summer. Going back to even really, to be fair to them before that, of hiring as diverse a management team, coaching staff, et cetera, as there is in the NFL. Because they hired today Natalia Durantes, who has some job I've never heard of called coordinator of football programs. Yeah, coordinator of football programs. Like you, I saw that I go, wait, what?

I don't know, I don't even know what that is. It makes me think my dream of being the director of pants and picnic is somehow still attainable. I don't know what that is, but here's the thing. I think that's... You don't know what director of Pants and Picknicks is? No, I know what director of pitch. It's one of my Steve Zabin favorite descriptions of all time.

For those that may not know, they know. Once upon a time, Bruce Allen, brought the yellow pants back from the 70s, which I love, by the way. Yeah, I did too, initially. Underneath the ketchup tops. Oh, he grew tired of them, huh? Yeah, sort of, because I wanted to get back to the championship uniform. Okay, so that was one big Bruce Allen thing.

And then he also instituted this homecoming concept, although they didn't call it homecoming. They called it something else. I forget what it was, but it was basically a bring back. It was alumni weekend. Alumni weekend. Alumni weekend. Yes. Right. Because if you called it Homecoming, you would smack a high school or college, and it would be seen as a potential insult to your opponent that week who would say,

what, we're the homecoming opponent? Fuck you. We're going to beat you. So it was alumni weekend. He brought that back, and I made fun of the fact that he invited back such otherwise nondescript loser, Redskins like Darnarian McCamp. And Andy got into it with me saying, well, you've got to invite him back. You're the former Redskins. No, you don't. No, you don't. It's called an invite. for a reason. You pick and choose. Use some discretion, you know, bring back a decent player or two. He's like, no, you've got to invite everybody if they're a Redskine. I said, okay, what about Hainesworth? And I said, what about Stubby? And that's where Andy was like, ah, ah, yeah. So I joked on that one because he hates those two guys. So I said Bruce Allen was the quote-unquote

director of Panty. It was great. Did you ever, by the way, the all-timer was DeAngelo-Williams, the Carolina Panthers running back in 20, whatever that was, where they came in to FedEx, and it was alumni weekend. And he said, you know, somebody handed out the program for the game before. And basically it was a homecoming program. And he's like, I'm looking around. I'm going, this is the NFL. He's like, homecoming.

Like, who do you think we are? And he goes, we were pissed. We were pissed. And I just remember going, how stupid are we? We're creating just an unnecessary incentive for the opponent. almost as dumb as having training camp where you charge money and that allows scouts for other teams to come in or as dumb as having a former bingo caller become your offensive coordinator midway through the season. Lots of dumb things went on.

By the way, I thought that was Kimmy Biakabatuka that's... No, no, no, no. It was definitely DeAngio, Williams. DiGioreuca did have a monster game against us. Yeah, that was a Norve team. Yeah, that was a Norv team. but it was definitely DeAngelo Williams because I've played that drop many times on the show over the years.

But, I mean, remember, other NFL teams actually said they were allowing us in. They were charging, which meant we just had to pay $10 to come in and watch their practices. How stupid could they be? And it allowed other team scouts. There was like this rule that, look, you can't scout other teams training camps as part of the agreement. but as soon as you start charging, well, then we can't stop you from doing it.

I mean, and how much revenue could they have really generated off of training camp practices? By the way, they were charging. Weren't they at Ashburn in Ashburn at Redskin Park initially? Yeah. Yeah, I think they were. Yeah, no, that was the only place they charged for it. And we derisively called it Danny World because it was not just training camp. There was like a bounce house and a churro cards, and there were some other low-level Dan Snyder attractions out there.

And it was supposed to be this thing. And I remember we found out at Redskin Park this diagram of the layout of training camp that they were going to monetize. And I think we somehow got to – they gave it to us. Someone said, you can have that thing. And so I kept it in my office as a placard of Danny World under its original plan. Stupid idea. Oh, God. So anyway.

And so the same guy that's fought that now has 100% control of the team. And I must say, Solie made a great point to me on my podcast on Sunday. He said, how come none of the NFL pundits, all the guys that report on this lead, the Mort, the Schefters, the J. Rappaportz, the Jake Lasers, how come not a one of them said along the way,

you know, Snyder may be allowed to buy out his partners, and he may be in full control. No one had that angle. That was not even a answer on the board. And I said, you're right, Sally. None of these so-called NFL experts had anything about that. Not plural, nobody. Why do you think that is? Well, I don't know if that's true.

I think that there was some discussion. Remember that they... Who reported, though, that he may buy out his partner? I don't know. You might be right about that. I remember having a conversation about his personal financial situation wouldn't with the debt limit criteria in the NFL. Actually, he wasn't in a liquid position from what I was told to buy them out. And so that's why they, you know, use that Baltimore broker to, you know, and they found, you know, this guy, Jose Phil. Liciano in the group out in California, which, by the way, I don't want to forget this thought because I didn't finish it from the last segment. I think that he will, I think there's a really good chance he will bring on a new group of diverse minority investors. Of course. Now that he owns the entire apartment complex, he can sublee to whomever he wants.

Yeah, and the league wants that. The league wants more diversity in ownership. And so This will continue as part of... I look at this as like the league now has their own little laboratory team. That the Faustian bargain that Snyder has made is that he's going to keep the team, but the NFL is going to get to do whatever side hustle they want, side program, he can feel good stories, director of football program, whatever the hey, who that is, that the league is going to just tell Dan, you're going to do this, you're going to do this, you're going to say, no problem.

I mean, no knock on Natalia. I mean, I'm sure she's more than capable and qualified to do something really nice in the organization. But whose place? I believe we're going to have the best football programs in the league, whatever a football program is. I don't even know who had this position before. Like, I've never heard of this title in the organization. But whatever. They're made up.

They may have titles, but look at the diversity. My God, it's fantastic. It's spectacular. It's just what the league wants. It's what the league wants and needs in the faces of stories like Deshawn Watson, which, by the way, today jumped up a notch, as Nike has said, they're suspending their relationship with them, and the league said that they are looking into the matter. Yeah.

Definitely. You know, I was, well, I actually had on my list of things, Deshaun Watson, But this is, I think, actually, one of the more incredible stories in terms of the acceleration from, you know, what's his trade value? Are they going to trade them? Aren't they going to trade them? What, you know, this is all. And now you've got a guy who, you know, everybody claimed was this is the old, you don't know anybody. You know, none of us know what these people are, including their employers.

and this guy is, you know, due process is very important in these situations, but now you have criminal allegations, not just civil, now you've got a major... Are there an actual... Yeah, there's a criminal investigation based on two criminal complaints now. So there are criminal complaints. Yeah, but no indictments yet. Okay. But the invest...

So they have filed complaints with the police saying, out and assaulted. Yeah. And look, some of the, you know, some, look, this is, this isn't, you know, this is hardly revealing to many people listening out there. If you're into therapeutic massage, you don't end up having 22 different women that you've gone to, okay? It's just exhausting explaining to each one that's what needs work on your body. Yeah, this is... My left shoulder blade is this.

I don't think my sense is he's not a monster, but he was... He's a serial. He's a serial rub and tug happy ending guy. He's a guy that didn't understand that as a quarterback in the NFL, you orbit at a higher level in which don't get to get away with certain things. If he was a running back or wide receiver, it'd be roll your eyes and, okay, he's probably going to get Nate Hamer. because he's a quarterback, it's up a whole other level.

Because the league is all about image, and it's a league that's a TV show about quarterback. What was Nike? Do we know what Nike was paying him? I'm just curious what that endorsement deal. Did you read that? I don't know. And I don't know if they have dropped him or just suspended. I think there's a chance they can come back at a later date, obviously.

But his image is taking a huge chance. He was perceived as the, the very, valiant martyr of a dysfunctional franchise that deserve to get out from under the shadow of their utter incompetence. And boy, has that tune changed given the fact that he was living his life like a reckless dumbass who should have just, you know, been a bit more discreet about, okay, I want to date some Instagram thirsty girls, but I'm not going to do it under the guise of a massage. It's really incredible when you think about it. Now, the only thing that I don't know is was he actually going to strip, you know, shopping centers, or was this happening in, you know, his home?

No. What? Instagram. Instagram. They're all Instagram. So, so, so. Yeah, so, in other words, I think Deshaun Watson treated a massage like a first date or like a dinner. Yeah.

And so he thought if the dinner or massage went well, then they can go to the next phase. Yeah. But if you take a woman out to dinner, then you're on the same. sort of wavelength of, hey, did you enjoy dinner? Okay, you like me? I like you. It's 2021. We have apps like Tinder where people hook up and bang each other on a moment's notice. So let's go, you know, get it on. And then you're not exposing yourself the way he did by this ruse of massages. Yeah. Jesus. Yeah. So, anyway. I'll still take him, though. If he is available, I will take him. but I want them at a discount.

Well, see, I don't... We're only going to have them for eight games this year if we get them. It's funny, my middle son said to me over the weekend, do you think we can get Deshawn Watson now at a major discount? And I'm like, probably not, but let me just explain something to you, son. This organization that's being investigated for years and years of sexual harassment and potentially, you know,

a culture of misogyny. And assault, you know, this is not going to be the organization that regardless of whatever the discount is, we'll end up paying for Deshawn Watson. I think personally no one's going to trade for him. I think this thing has to flush out. This is not a Ruben Foster where, you know, Brucey can get on, it can call up, you know, Ryan Anderson and John Allen and say, what do you think about him? Ah, we did our due diligence. This is much different. You end up trading.

And by the way, he was free. You end up trading two first, two seconds in a player, and this guy ends up getting suspended for a year, or he's got other skeletons in the closet. There could be a lot more. It's just amazing because it really is a you never know. It doesn't matter because he has come off since he was at Clemson. You know, smart, classy, first-rate work ethic. A-plus person. A-plus.

And the first little, you know, sort of chink in the armor was he signs this deal and demands a trade, you know, four months later. And people are like, hey, dude, you just sign that deal. But that's the worst thing that anybody's ever said about him. I know. Anyway. That said, you can recover from it all, though, with time. And he's a quarterback and a really good one. So if I still have a chance to get him, I would go for it.

But it'll pass. I don't think it's going to end up disqualifying him as a player, but still. We'll see what happens. So what was your answer to the Snyder thing? Are you depressed? Do you think? Bitter depression, combined with the fact it looks like the name the football team is starting to harden like cement. I mean, that was a twin blow when those two things came out a week ago.

I couldn't think of a worse outcome of the last 12 months. Lose your iconic team name and logo, replace it with a temporary, supposedly temporary, thing, which sucks and people mock, and then have Dan Snyder go through a scandal that forces him into all these defensive maneuvers, and then he comes out of it stronger with total control of the team. I mean, that's a lifetime thing, you know, that we are only hope is that Dan Snyder somehow gets it as an owner because it's for life. He's very young as an owner.

Yeah. You might be one of the youngest two owners in the league, right? What are the ages of the owners? We're going to look this up right now when you talk. Tepper's younger, right? Same age. I don't know. No, Tepper's not younger.

Tepper's 63. I don't know. Let's see. Oh, hold on a second. Virginia McCasky is 97. Mike Brown is 84. McJaneff McNair, wife of the Texan owner, 84.

Stephen Ross, 80, Kraft, 79, Jerry, 77. Arthur Blanket, 77. And what's Dan, 56? Hold on, I had to click through the list to go here. I'm scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, scrolling, scrolling. Yeah, I see.

So why don't we just list this in the list? Ashadi is 60. The Glaser family is 56. Michael Bidwell, 55, Snyder is 55. Clark Hunt is 55. So in other words, Dan is tied for the youngest owner in the league. And unlike Bidwell and Hunt, he's not a legacy. Yeah, I mean, Bidwell's, Bidwell, by the way, you know, went to Georgetown prep here as a border.

So he's got ties to here. And by the way, one of the glazers, who's, is it Malcolm Glazer who is the owner right now of the Buccaneers? Which, which glazers? There are a couple of sons. Malcolm. He glade. He left it to Joel. Okay.

I may be wrong about this. One of the glazer sons, it might be Joel, lives here too. Really? Yeah. So it would not surprise me if there are three NFL owners that live in the D.C. area. Now, I don't know if Michael Bidwell lives here. He might live in Arizona, but he's back and forth a lot, I know, to this area. And one of the glazers, one of the glazer sons, who obviously has some level, I would imagine, of equity in the Tampa Bay Buccaneers lives here as well.

All right. If you could come real quick. If you could come back, if you could re-encarte, if you go back in time knowing what you know now, and let's say I put you at 10 years old, how furiously would you orient your life academically, business-wise, and everything, to try. try to own an NFL team. Because I would. I would go back to being 10 years old and say, damn it, I'm going to fight like hell to own an NFL team.

Because what a thing to have, man. What a money-making gold mine it is. And how fucking fun would it be? What kind of owner would you be? Shitty. Impulsive. But it would be fun for me. Just like Snyder, it'd be fun for me.

Yeah, well, I mean, that's the thing, right? It's like, I've always said, okay, if it were me, I would definitely turn over all the football decision people. I'd give them autonomy. I'd hire the best people. But then on game day, when my coach fucked up a clock management situation, I'd be in there the following week with a headset right into his ear. Now, we can't do that again, Jay. We can't do that again. But anyway, so the Sam Darnel trade? And I did this on the radio show yesterday. So if you could go back, or if, let's just say that Ryan Fitzpatrick wasn't signed,

and I forget what you think about Ryan Fitzpatrick, so I'll ask you about that too. But let's just assume the assumption here is that you were sitting here with Heineke and with Kyle Allen. And you hadn't made the move on the quarterback, and you could have gotten Darnold for a sixth rounder this year and a second and a fourth next year. would you have done it for Washington? Probably not. I don't see it. I don't know what my thought was on darnling coming out of college. I'm not sure I had a firm opinion, but having seen him,

this looks to me like a vacant stared, square-headed dummy. He looks like the kid in Breaking Bad and shots the little guy and a little... Todd. Todd, yeah, the best cooker. How can I help you? You know Jesse Pinkman? Right, well, I'm a friend of his. James Todd.

I'm sorry to bother you so late. It's nice to meet you. He doesn't seem like he's got it to me. And so who wants to be part of a reclamation project? I guess that was the quote that one insider for the Redskins or the football team said about not being in on the Donald thing. I just don't know. When has it ever worked where a high, high quarterback pick

has been shined up and refurbished in the NFL? I can't think of one. Yeah, I kind of liked him, and I think the jet thing is real. I think he was in a terrible thing, and I think for that kind of price, which, by the way, the price was pretty much evaluated by every NFL expert as a great price for the Jets. If you add up all the draft point stuff, you know, the Jimmy Johnson draft chart, you know, if Carolina is good next year, you know, it's basically like equivalent to a second rounder. If they're bad next year, it's basically the equivalent of like a late first rounder, but whatever. I'm comparing him to, to, to, to Todd from Breaking Bad. They actually sort of look alike. That's what he looks like. Yeah. I always thought of it.

Yeah. I think I would have done it. But then again, I'm pleased with Ryan Fitzpatrick. I actually really am excited about it. Well, okay, before we get to Fitzpatrick, and then we'll have to wrap it after this, because I've missed six phone calls. But I love talking to you, and you owe me a home-and-home now after this. who would be the more worthy reclamation project?

Carson Wentz or what's his name for the Jets? Darnold. Yeah, that's a good question. I think maybe Wentz. I think Wentz. I know. All right.

What's a better reclamation project? Wentz, Darnold, or Haskin? Wence. And Haskin? just last in that conversation, clearly. What's a better reclamation project? Darnold, Wendt, Haskins, or Josh Rosen? Wentz followed by Darnold again.

Clearly something's wrong with both Haskins and Rosen. Like they just, they're two people who don't get it. All right, what's a better reclamation project? Darnold, Wens, Haskins, Rosen, or Mitch Trubisky. You know, the Trubisky thing's actually. interesting because I actually think there's something to his game, but the playoff game he had against New Orleans where he flat out quit in the game. Quit, he tapped out in that game. I would never sign him. So it's still Wendst, Darnold.

What's the better reclamation project? Wendt, Darnold, Taskins, Rosen, Trubisky, or Jared Gaw? Same order, Wence Darnold. I mean, I'm not a Goff fan. Really? So wait, you think Goff? I mean, I think golf is still the best of all that bunch right now. I don't.

And the only reason I say that is that a guy like Sean McVay didn't think it. How about Marcus Marietta? I kind of like Marietta, but there's something missing from his overall demeanor, too. He's not a very good passer. I think he's a good runner. He doesn't pass it very well. What about Winston? Winston is going to be the real... A hundred percent Winston won. Winston won over all of those people. So if Winston gets refurbished and is a real-life QB-1 with the Saints, then that'll be the first sort of reclamation job for a high-drafted quarterback on his second team in five years. As I just scroll down the list.

Yeah, Winston to me, he did the right thing, staying in New Orleans with Sean Payton. I think he's got a second act to this already very short career with all the interceptions where he could be truly in that, you know, top 10 level. How come Teddy Bridgewater didn't? I don't think Teddy Bridgewater's ever been right physically after that, you know, horrendous leg injury. Okay, fair enough. What's the status of Geropolo? Can't do it. Can't do it. Can't do it. So handsome, though.

I mean, I would put that in the category of, you know, my stepbrother, Kyle Shanahan. If he knows and he's moving on from a guy, then I trust that he knows that this guy can't do it. Remember when the Browns thought they could refurbish Robert Griffin III? How'd that go? Yeah, it didn't go well. But you know what? Baker Mayfield. field with a new coaching staff was a bit of a refurbishment. There were a lot of people that bail on him. A lot of people that bailed. I do, before you run, I do want just a quick, brief conversation about one of your favorite events and one of mine that starts tomorrow.

The Masters, we'll do that right after this word from one of our sponsors. Master starts tomorrow. I had Sands on the show this morning from Augusta. You know, he's really good over the years at giving me sleeper selections, not, you know, sort of the upper tier odds guys. And he threw out a name that I was thinking about anyway playing in my pool because I haven't used them. He thinks Sergio is perfect for this course this week, playing hard, fast, and he's been playing well. Just tell me real quickly, of the favorites, who do you like? And then of the guys, you know, that are back in the 30 to 1 or longer shots, give me, give me a,

a couple of names there? I don't have the list in front of me. I just called up the winners list, and Danny Willett was a super long shot out of nowhere. Charles Schwartzel in 2011 was another one. Trevor Immelman in 08.

It happens, but I think trying to go for long shots that the Masters is kind of a waste of time. I like to separate out of the top ten contenders. guys that I just know don't have part of their game to thrive at Augusta, and then I'll sprinkle my money over whatever portion of those top 10 guys are left.

So you want to go through this? Do you have the list in front of, or should I pull it up? No, I've got, yeah, I'll pull it up from a better list here. I mean, I know DJ and Deshambeau are sort of co-favorites with Speeth now, you know, coming behind. I'll pull it up from mine. Does Shambo underperformed in the fall after he thought he might do great after, you know, the win at the U.S. Open? But I don't know about this week. I don't know about this week.

I would fade Jordan's feet. I think he'll finish top 10, top five. I don't think he's going to win. Sergio is an interesting sleeper. Kyle Porter for CBS has that as well. Dustin Johnson is everybody's favorite, obviously. Kepka's got a knee injury. wouldn't jump on him. I love McElroy to death. He's my favorite player. I think he's got a

curse with this place ever since. He came so close and snap hooked it into oblivion on number 10. So I feel bad for that. It could be a sleeper Matthew Fitzpatrick at 60 to 1. John Rom just had a baby. I don't know if people who have babies win majors. Kepka's hurt. Yeah, like I said, Kepka is hurt. Justin Thomas, I think, is a solid pick amongst the top odd guys. And I can't find a lift. This is not a list, people.

Give me a lift. All right. Let me give it to you. And let me just tell everybody that this segment's brought to you by MyBooky, my bookie. MyBooky. I, G. Use my promo code, Kevin D.C., and they'll match your deposit halfway all the way up to $1,000. You can bet the masters in so many different ways.

Yeah. So here's my list. Okay. Dustin Johnson, 9 to 1. Yes, I put a penny on him. Beath, I'm fading just because he won last week. Thomas, hell yeah, I'm in. Deschambo, I'll pass this week.

Rahm at 12 to 1 all pass. Macaroil, I'll pass at 14 to 1. Shockly, I will definitely take a piece of him at 22. Definitely. Can't leave, no thanks. Nice player, not ready. Kepka's hurt, no. Patrick Reed, they won't let him cheat, no.

Morricali, he's been off for him as of late, but I wouldn't, I'd put a penny on him at 30 to 1. Lee West was a good long study. Yeah. That might be the guy this way. By the way, his wife, his fiancé, excuse me, is not on the bag this week. I know. His brother, I think.

His brother is, San said that everybody's disappointed about that. I know, because she's a looker. He hasn't been playing well, though. Well, here's the thing. He can't win. Like, he's had more. That's who I want to win more. than anybody. I want Fee now to win more than anybody else in this field, but you're right. He

just can't get it done. Kind of like Westwood for many years. For a narrative, for a narrative being now winning on the biggest stage when he's had such a bad run of not closing out would be the perfect kind of narrative. So I'd put a penny on that as well. We have not had at the Masters, I'm trying to think an Asian winner ever, have we? Korean, Japanese? I sure he didn't win. I don't know. I don't know the answer to that.

I mean, could it be M's turn? Sung J.M. is a flat baller. And he looks like this nondescript go-boy. Yeah, he can play. So, San said that DeCambeau is a definite fade this week. If I had to bet on one golfer to win this tournament, I would bet on Justin Thomas to win this tournament with the way he's playing. And it sets up perfectly for him, and he's clutch and everything about, you know,

and Dustin, you know, played it to 20 under, which it's not going to play. Obviously, this weekend, it's a different course. Speeth just won. I would... I'll give you a crazy, a crazy super long shot. Christian Bazadenhoot and 100. I don't even know who that is. I know.

He was like in the final match at the match play a couple of years ago. And it's a funny-ass name, Christian Bazaden-Hoot. What's his nationality? Is he... Is he... He's your, is he Danish or? He's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, he's, uh, he's probably, uh, from Norway. Yeah.

Um, look it up for you. I put my phone down. Well, okay. I, I like, there. Oh, he's South African. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. Um, I think Sergio's been playing well the course he knows very well.

He's one here before. Um, it's, you know, he's going to, you're going to have to keep it in a fair way. I like Garcia's chance in terms of, you know, when we're looking at like 30 to 1 or longer shots, it wouldn't surprise me if Webb Simpson plays really well here this weekend. And there was one other from the back of the pack that I was going to throw some money on. Oh, Bubba, just for the hell of it. Just because for whatever reason, you know, this place in him, he can go. And I think Oostezen could play well this weekend. He's pleased. He's had some good weeks.

Yeah, Ous Payson is a good bet as a guy who will come alive during this week. Yeah, what about the young guys? Do you think Hovlin's going to win on the tour soon? He's going to, right? I like him, but I don't like him here, not this week. Yeah. Oh, Casey's the other one. But, you know, like San said to me, he's like, Casey just, he'll have three great rounds,

and then he's going to have, he's going to shoot 74 in another round, and he won't win. but he's all casey is what I like to say about some of my buddies I play golf with at times he lacks resolve so when things go bad

he crumbles when things are going good he's fine but he lacks resolve in my opinion hell of a golfer short little fella weird little Englishman

kind of like a dwarf but yeah I would not bet on him all right I'm up next at your place just telling me when and where and we'll do it via Zoom or phone or, you know, one of those secret under surveillance vans that you have.

Take the surveillance van somewhere and we'll love to do it there. All right, Kevin. Have a good one. All right. Steve Zabin, everybody. That's it for today. Back tomorrow with Tommy.