The Kevin Sheehan Show - Deebo News + My Bracket

Episode Date: March 20, 2025

Kevin opened with news regarding Deebo Samuels' contract and then he unveiled his 2025 NCAA Tournament Bracket. Hall of Famer Gary Williams joined Kevin to talk Terps and Tournament along with discussing who had the better freshman season....Joe Smith or Derik Queen. Sam Fortier/Washington Post jumped on to talk about the Commanders' new acquisitions to date.  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Chean Show. Here's Kevin. On the show today, my bracket. That's coming up here in the opening segment. The show's presenting sponsor, as always, is Windonation.

86690 Nation or Windonation.com if you need new windows. I also have Gary Williams on today's show. He'll join me in the next segment to talk Terps, to talk tournament. and then Sam 48 from the Washington Post. We'll jump on. We'll talk some football in the final segment with Sam. Before I get to my bracket, no smell test pick tonight for either of the first four games. My smell test picks really start in earnest tomorrow.

Tommy and I are going to record the podcast tomorrow morning. But if you don't get to it until tomorrow afternoon after the games begin, I am going to tweet out the picks on X, on Twitter. At Kevin Sheen, DC. That is at Kevin Sheen, D.C. So I'll tweet them out. I'll also give them out live on the radio show tomorrow, even though we're only on radio tomorrow for an hour.

I do have a rooting interest tonight. I'm rooting for Dwayne Simpkins and A.U. The only other true local in the field other than Maryland, Dwayne's been a basketball lifer in the DMV, played at Dematha, played at Maryland. He was the starting point guard on Gary's first three NCAA tournament teams at Maryland. And then he's been coaching forever now. He coached at St. Albans.

He coached at Sidwell Friends. He's been an assistant coach at the college level. He got the AU job last year. And in year two, he's got the Eagles in the NCAA tournament. Go Dwayne Simpkins, go A.U tonight against Mount St. Mary's. I know a lot of Mount St. Mary's grad. And the coach at Mount St. Mary's for a few years, not anymore, was a Whitman grad. Dan Engelstadt.

When they went to the tournament, I don't know, two or three years ago, I had him on the show. But I am definitely rooting for American tonight to beat Mount St. Mary's and then get a chance to face Duke in a first round game on Friday. Some Skins news today. All right? Listen to this. Adam Schaefter reported just a little while ago that the team is guaranteeing Debo Samuel's contract and adding incentives to it. I'll read from the story that John Kime wrote on ESPN.com. Washington is guaranteeing $17 million of Debo Samuel's contract in 2025 and adding $3 million worth of incentive.

Before this move, Samuel had no guaranteed money remaining and was scheduled to have a base salary of $16.6 million with a $200,000 workout bonus and a per-game roster bonus of $44,11717 worth up to $750,000 if he had played in all of the games. So look, there's a big takeaway here. and it is an expected big takeaway, and that is that the team is not going to give Debo Samuel a contract extension. He's playing on a one-year deal in 2025. What they did is that because, you know, there's really little to no chance of releasing him before the season starts, because none of the money left on his contract was guaranteed, they've just guaranteed it, and they've added another $3 million in incentives. I have no idea what those incentives are.

We'll learn eventually what they are, but I don't know what they are as of now. But by definition, they've got to be earned. So the $17 million that they're guaranteeing is essentially, you know, $600,000 less than what he was going to make anyway as long as he played all 17 games. So again, this closes the door. for all intents and purposes on any contract extension talk,

which I didn't think would ever happen. You know, they need him to prove it before giving him anything beyond this year. It was a fifth round pick for a guy they know, and they probably believe will be ready for a contract year season. They don't want to take that incentive away from him. meantime, by the way, I don't know if you guys saw this story today. The NFL's considering rules changes, including seeding the playoff teams based on record. The Lions actually proposed an NFL playoff seeding change where the regular season

records would be used to seed the field. Now, that will get looked at and potentially even voted on at the end of the month when the league meetings take place in Palm Beach at the lovely Breakers Hotel at the end of the month. I don't know if they'll pass that or not. They've looked at that previously and decided not to vote on it. This is what I would actually prefer. I've talked about this for years. I would never change how teams qualify for the postseason, but I would cede the field once all of the teams have qualified,

meaning four division winners, even if a division winner is 7 and 10, they qualify as a division winner. And then the three best records after that would be the wild card teams. And I would still have the qualifying teams come via, division winners and three wild cards, I just would seed them based on record once you had the field qualified. So as an example, this year, if the seeding system that Detroit is proposing had been in play, Washington would have been the four seed, and they would have hosted a game in the first round against Green Bay. Detroit would have been the one seed, Philly would have been the two-seed,

Minnesota would have been the three-seed at 12-5. Washington would have been the four-seat. And then Green Bay at 11-6 would have been the five-seat. Tampa would have been the sixth seed, and the Rams would have been the seven-seat. But you don't want a 7-10 or an 8-9 division winner hosting a game against a 14-win wild-card team. You know, this year you had the Rams. they ended up playing it on a neutral field because of the fires in L.A. But they were 10 and 7, you know, scheduled to host Minnesota at 14 and 3.

You know, Washington a few years ago at 7 and 9 as a division winner hosted Tampa. Tampa was 11 and 5. I'd like to see that change. I think that is fair, but doesn't ruin the division emphasis. You know, if you win a division, you're in the postseason, but it doesn't guarantee you a home field. Let's see if that has a shot when we get to the league meetings at the end of the month. By the way, the Lions also proposed something. We've talked about this. Kooley and I have talked about this a lot. A proposal that would eliminate the automatic first down on defensive holding penalties and defensive illegal contact penalties.

I love that. I think there's nothing more frustrating than, you know, your team gets called for an illegal contact penalty on a third and 18 bubble screen that gains six yards. And it's an automatic, you know, first down. The rule would be five yards and you replay the down. If five yards gives you a first down, great. If not, you replay the down. I think that makes sense. We know that there is a proposal from, I think, a couple of teams on a new overtime rule.

That'll be looked at, and it's really just the extension of overtime, excuse me, to 15 minutes, and it guarantees possession for both teams. It's the playoff rule, although if you get to the end of 15 minutes in the regular season, it's a tie. You wouldn't extend it to a second overtime. I'm for that, and I'm for the Packers proposal to do away with the tush push. They got more specific with their proposal on that, and they would attach a 10-yard penalty to a tush-push play. I am for abolishing the tush-push.

I think it is a rugby-style play. I think it hurts pace of play. I think it's aesthetically not football. And, you know, I've talked about this before, but the Eagles in recent years haven't just used it occasionally on a third and one or a fourth and one or a third and goal or a first and goal or a second in goal at the one. They've used it on third and three and third and two to set up a fourth down, tush push, go for it situation.

So some of the things that came out today on the NFL. By the way, I have a retraction from yesterday's show. The retraction is the entire segment that I did on my NCAA tournament formula, which whittles down from 68 down to a group of teams that can win the tournament based on certain criteria. I had old information on the Ken Palm top 10 offensive efficiency numbers. For whatever reason, when I went in there on Tuesday, I think it was, Tuesday morning to sort of put this together. They had not updated their numbers, and I was looking at old numbers. And someone very kindly let me know that on Twitter.

Thank you, by the way. I think your name was Paul. I appreciate that. I'm not going to go through the process here again, but I will just tell you that five teams made the cut. Florida, Duke, Auburn, Gonzaga, and Kentucky. Based on top 15% scoring teams, top 10 offensive efficiency teams in Ken Palm,

top two of three scores being guards or perimeter players and for a subjective evaluation by yours truly is the team coached well. I have five teams that can win the tournament. Florida, Duke, Auburn, Gonzaga, and Kentucky. That is slightly different from what I gave you yesterday. Sorry about that. All right, let me give you my bracket for the NCAA tournament. Tommy will have his on tomorrow.

Marrow's show. So what I'm going to do, and I'm going to go through this quickly, is I'm just going to give you the upsets, and some of them aren't really upsets, but the lower-seated teams over the higher-seated teams that I have in the first round. And then I'll give you my sweet 16 teams, my elite eight teams, my final four teams, and my national champion. And there is a lot of hope in my bracket, but also a belief that, the team that I'm picking to win the championship can beat anybody in the field. All right, we'll start in the South region where I've got two lower-seated teams winning. I've got Creighton over Louisville, a nine over an eight, and I have New Mexico, a 10 over

Marquette, a 7. That is how I see the first round games in the south. sticking in the South, my Sweet 16 matchups are Creighton against Texas A&M. I've got Creighton upsetting Auburn in the second round, and I've got Ole Miss and Michigan State in a Sweet 16 matchup in the South. The Elite 8 in the South is Texas A&M against Michigan State, and I've got Michigan State in the final four out of the South region. the East region. First round, lower-seededs over higher-seededs. I've got nine Baylor beating eight Mississippi State. I've got VCU and a stunner as an 11 over BYU. And I've got

Vanderbilt over St. Mary's. Vandies at 10. St. Mary's is a 7. I love the St. Mary's coach, Randy Bennett. But I've got Vanderbilt there. The Sweet 16 in the east. I've got Duke facing Oregon, a one versus a five, and I've got chalk. I've got Alabama and Wisconsin, two versus a three. Then in the elite eight, I've got Duke beating Wisconsin and advancing to the final four. So two final four teams so far, Michigan State out of the south, Duke out of the east. Let's move to the Midwest region. First round, lower-seeded, over high. seateds. I've got Utah State, Coolie's alma mater, upsetting UCLA. That's a 10 over a 7. That is the only lower-seated team I have winning in the Midwest region. The Sweet 16 matchups, I've got Houston

against Purdue. That's Chalk, a one versus a four. But then I've got some upsets. I've got Illinois in the Sweet 16 against Utah State who knocks off a two-seed Tennessee. And then I've got Houston beating Illinois in the Elite 8 to get to the final four out of the Midwest region. Now we move to the West region where my Terps are. All right, lower-seated teams over higher-seated teams in the first round. I don't have any. You know, right now, Drake is like one of these major public, you know, lower-seated teams, 11 over a 6. So many players have that.

So many betters have that. So I'm taking Missouri. I actually like Missouri a lot in this tournament. But no lower-seededs over higher-seeds in the first round. Get to the Sweet 16. I've got Florida against Maryland. That's chalk. I've got St. John's against.

Missouri in a Sweet 16 game. And then I have Maryland, upsetting Florida, in the Sweet 16. And I've got Rick Patino and St. John's beating Missouri. Kevin Willard coached for Rick Patino several times. Petino, along with his father, were his mentors. I've got a Maryland St. John's elite eight, a two versus a four in the elite eight, and I've got Maryland going to the final four. So my final four matchups would be Michigan State as a two against Maryland as a four, and Duke is a one against Houston as a one. I've got Duke winning that semi-final. Houston hopefully will be healthier than they were last year when they got beat.

and I've got Maryland advancing to the title game, getting revenge on Michigan State, who beat them at the buzzer with a 60-footer. Maryland as a four against Duke as a one in the national title game on April 7th in San Antonio. And of course, I'm going to pick Maryland to beat Duke. Of course, that is a wishful. thinking bracket, but it's not like Maryland's a six seed or a seven seed or a nine or a ten seed.

They're a four seed. And we've already seen how capable the Terps are. If they play their best, there isn't anybody in this field that they can't beat. I really believe that. If they play their best basketball and we've seen it this year at times, and we've seen it a lot over the last month and a half, two months. They are capable of beating anybody in this field. So yeah, a lot of hope, a lot of wishful thinking, but also a really good basketball team with arguably the best starting five in the field.

Maryland over Duke. That's my bracket pick. There are a couple teams, by the way, real quickly, that I like to do well in this tournament. I think Wisconsin's got a really good chance. And I'm talking Big Ten teams because I watched much more of the Big Ten than anybody else. I think Wisconsin's very capable. I don't think Purdue has a chance to make a final four run.

I have them in the Sweet 16, but I could easily see them losing earlier than that. I think Gonzaga's got a shot to beat Georgia and then give Houston a really tough game in round two. I think Missouri, Dennis Gates, does a really good job there. I think they are a fearless, capable team. They can really score in this tournament. They should be watched. I like Creighton.

I just love McDermott. I love the way they play. And I am down on Auburn. And I have been for a while. I have not thought that Auburn is at the same level as Duke, Houston, or even Florida, for that matter. Also, keep an eye on Yale, but they play Texas A&M, and that team's totally. capable as well. So there you go. My bracket, Tommy will have his tomorrow. Rate and review the show if you get a chance, really helpful for us, especially on Apple and Spotify. If you think we deserve

five stars, that's very helpful. A quick one to two sentence review is really all we need. And then follow us on Apple and Spotify as well. Hit the plus button, hit the follow button. All right, Gary Williams next after these words from a few. of our sponsors. I introduced many of you to Goldbelly a few months back, and I want to keep talking about it today because Goldbelly has the most iconic famous foods from restaurants all across the United States, aggregated on one amazing site, and they ship it free to your door anywhere in the country. They'll ship you iconic Chicago deep dish pizza from Lumal Nottis. Had that. They'll ship you New York's best most famous cheesecake from juniors had that delivered. If you're

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Restrictions apply, see website for details, and important safety information. This segment of the show is brought to you by MyBooky. MyBooky's March Madness $100,000 bracket contest is open, and it'll stay open until Thursday at noon. If you want to play, go to MyBooky.ag. First things first, use my promo code, Kevin D.C. bookie will give you a cash bonus on your initial deposit. Each bracket entry costs $20, but my bookie's giving you a free entry for every two you purchase. So you buy two entries,

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promo code, Kevin D.C., to play. All right. Joining me right now, Hall of Fame coach, Gary Williams, March Madness underway with the first four games. Of course, tomorrow, the first round, Friday first round games. Maryland and Grand Canyon on Friday. We'll talk about that. We'll talk about the field in general. But Gary and I were just talking before I started to record, and we were talking about some of the coaches from, you know, ACC days when Gary was first getting it going at Maryland. And I don't even know how we got to this, but I mentioned Herb Sendeck's name. And you said,

totally an underrated coach. Like nobody really understood, including NC State fans, how good of a coach he was. Yeah, he wasn't, you know, he wasn't Valvano. He didn't have that stick with him. Right. You know, and all that. But the guy graduated from Carnegie Mellon. I mean, I want to know how many coaches could get into Carnegie Mellon.

Right. I certainly couldn't, you know, that, and he brought that with him, and that was part of his personality. He was very laid back, very sophisticated, never showed much emotion when he coached, you know, all those things. and I think it hurt him a little bit in NC State because it was always Shishavsky and, you know,

Dean Smith and Lloyd Williams and all that. In you? Yeah. Yeah, you know, and like, he was unbelievable. You know, in terms of what he did, the number of NCAA tournaments he got two and all that. And, of course, I guess, you know,

you got measured against Valvano in terms of winning the national championship, which hurt him a little bit. But, you know, it's, and you're, look at the NC states coaches since her Sindak left and

he's looking a lot better. You know, he's looking a lot better now. And I think that happens in coaching sometimes. You get into a situation where you do everything right, you're a good coach, you win games, you do what is expected of you, but sometimes that's not enough.

It's a perfect segue into something that I wanted to talk to you about because I had John Crispin on radio today. He's, you know, basketball analysts played at Penn State, UCLA, calls games for Westwood 1 ESPN. And somehow we got around to talking about Clemson in this tournament. And I just said to him, I said, man, do you think Brad Brownells is good a coach as I think he is? And he said, absolutely, one of the underrated coaches in the country.

And then we started going through a list of some of the guys that haven't won big, but, you know, are really good coaches. and you really can speak to this. I remember you once told me that some of the best coaching jobs you ever did were teams that barely made the tournament and exited quickly or didn't make the tournament, you know, got ousted, you know, and were on the bubble and ended up on the wrong side of it. Who comes to mind for you of guys that fans don't really know

who coaches know are excellent at what they do? One who unfortunately is no longer with us was Skip Prosser at Wake Forest. You know, he suffered a little bit from the same thing that Herb Sindak did in that Skip was really a good guy. Every coach like Skip Prosser. There was not one coach that ever said anything negative about Skip Prosser, and he was really good. He won a lot of games probably with less talent than some of the other schools in the ACC.

and, you know, he never, I never thought that he got the credit for it. And another guy who has started with me at American You is Fran Duffy. You know, he's never been in a, but he was never in a program with all the bells and whistles. There's always Penn, Temple, or Sal. You know, they're tough places to win. And he did just a phenomenal job. And, you know, even this year, they were competitive when he really didn't have the N.I. own money to be competitive.

By the way, it occurred to me when I mentioned Brad Brownell. He was the coach at UNC Wilmington when Drew Nicholas hit the game winner in the defending championship season of 2003. But, I mean, you got to coach against him a bunch. Well, you coached against him at Wilmington. I'm assuming you coached against him because he's been at Clemson forever now. For a while. Yeah, I guess I did. But Barnes was there for a while.

a couple of other guys, Cliff Ellis at Clemson. I'm sure I did. The thing with that, you know, that Drew Nicholas at the shot to win that game in the incident of late tournament, they probably outplayed us for about 39 minutes and 55 seconds.

They missed two free throws from a kid that doesn't miss free throw late in that game. We tried to get the ball and bounce to Steve Blake, and we couldn't, so we threw it to Drew Nicholas, and Drew was smart enough just to go with it. You know, and he took it all the way down the sideline in front of our bench and they did the shot. But, you know, they, just for example, they knew we were going to try to get it into Steve Blake.

So they took Blake out of the mix. You know, they just put two guys on them. And, you know, we were very fortunate that we had a great shooter like Drew Nicholson who could make that shot. Oh, my God. That was, you know, that was the last game of the first round. It was very late on a Friday night. Where did you play? Where was that game played again?

I'm forgetting. Wow, that's a good question. I'm not sure. Nashville. It was in Nashville. I just pulled it up. And then we played, I think we played Thadmada and Xavier. Exactly.

A great player that next game. And that got us to that game. Well, we could win that game and got us to the three-16. Yeah, they had David West on that team. David West. Yes, that's who it was. Yeah. And you guys were, we were the actual lower-seeded team,

won that game and then that sweet 16 game against Michigan State wasn't as painful as the Cory Lucius game in 2010 but as the defending champs man there was a lot of heart with that team huh yeah well we missed a jump shot I'll tell you what was Steve Blake who was a great player he was he didn't want a foul obviously and we got the ball in bounds and took it down and we're down one and he's the top of the circle wide open he makes that shot eight out of ten times and just didn't go in or else we would have been playing in the elite eight so yeah it's the way it goes sometimes yeah you know i i don't think i've talked to you maybe i have um since the 60 footer that trey holloman hit for michigan state at the buzzer at exfinity

um what a night that was but i said after that game that you know it part of it is your history with michigan state you know not only did you play Izzo twice three times actually in the tournament or twice in the tournament but you played sometimes you know in New York

I think you played in the garden one year we played in the they used to have the Disney whatever that was called down and we played them down there also in Orlando yeah and yeah and I said after that game I'm like I really

we've never had a rival it's 11 years now in the Big Ten and there's no Nobody that I think the fans would point to and say that's a rivalry. And I don't think there's another school that would point to Maryland in the Big Ten and say they're a big rival. But, man, it would be cool to have something with Michigan State because there's actual history with Michigan State.

Yeah, it's almost like the schools, the original Big Ten schools. They've kind of like circled the wagons. And, you know, as the West Coast teams come in, Nebraska, I guess, was the first expansion team and Maryland Rutgers. They've kept their rivalries. You know, the Michigan, Ohio State thing, that's football also, more so than basketball. But they're Indiana, Purdue, you know, big rival out there.

And it's just Michigan, Michigan State, obviously, when they play. But, you know, nobody, none of the new teams in the Big Ten have created a rivalry yet with an original Big Ten team. No, they haven't. All right, let's talk about our team. How good is Maryland? How far can they go? I really like them.

I mean, the way they played, and believe me, I coach for 42 years, and you finally realized that if the game's tight, there's two good teams, a lot of the end-to-the-game stuff is luck. It's not what any coach did, not great play. It's the ball bouncing a certain way. guy makes a 60-footer like Michigan State. You know, you could give that guy 25 basketballs and put them there with no people in the Xfinity Center and he wouldn't make one of them. You know, and that's basketball.

That's college basketball especially. And so I think our team is really good. They played great the last two months of the season. They're tough. They play good defense. And they have the combination that very few schools do now with two really good inside players and three, four. players that can really all handle the ball and shoot the ball when they're open, and they play very unselfishly, which, you know, it just seems like if I gets open, he gets the ball,

you know, and he shoots. That's a great combination. Did anything about Saturday's loss to Michigan, specifically the rebounding difference concern you? Yes, Michigan shouldn't have rebound us by as much as they did. It was ridiculous. at halftime. I forget what it was, but it was I didn't notice it either, and I was there watching a game that it was that bad. But we have to rebound better than that. You can't

play in the NCAA tournament against a good team and get away with that. So, obviously, Kevin Willard, he knew, and so I'm sure he's done something about that. So, you know, you go from there, and, you know, with Queen and

and Reese, and now it looks like Geronimo is starting to get you know, some quality time when he comes on the court, he gets the ball for you, which is, you know, really big. You know, people always talk about, well, Merrill doesn't have a bench. Well, if you can bring a guy in that's going to rebound and play defense, he doesn't have to score.

We have scoring, you know, on that team. Right. And, you know, going into the NCAA tournament, I know I'm getting off subject a little bit here, but you have to realize the timeouts are longer than three minutes, half times a little longer than 15 minutes, which is normal halftime. And so you're 20 years old.

Come on. You can play. You know, I could, you know, when you're 20 years old, play 20 minutes in a row, you know, you don't have to worry about that. And, you know, I think that's where we are. People, I think this is just an example, people trying to find something wrong. You know, like, what's wrong with Maryland?

Well, they won 24, 25 games. They're pretty good. Well, but their bench isn't very good. And like that gets old to players. You know, they really hate that when, you know, supposedly their fans say things like that. Right. Yeah. And by the way, that group does play hard defensively.

Let me just ask you about one player in particular, Deshaun Harris-Smith, you know, a high recruit out of Paul the 6th. There were high expectations. I mean, does it look on offense to you like it's all confidence right now? I think that's part of it. I didn't see him. I might have seen him play once in high school, and you look at him, and you can see why.

He just overpowered everybody in high school. He was too quick for a big guy to play him. He was too big for a guard to play him in high school. And now all of a sudden he's playing against some pretty good physical guys that are really quick and things like that. And I think his offensive game has really suffered, and it looks like once in a while he lets that. affect his all-around game.

In other words, I was this McDonald's All-American. I should be scoring more. How come I'm not scoring? And that affects his defense. But I think he can be an outstanding defensive player. And once again, coming off the bench, which I'm sure he's not coming in. He was the most heralded player. He didn't get as much attention as queen coming in, but he got a lot of attention.

and he's trying to figure out how come he has this role. Well, you've got to forget that stuff for the NCAA tournament. This is our team. We've got to see how far we can go. If I can give them five great minutes, great, and we'll worry about the other stuff when the season's over. So I think that's where his mindset hopefully is right now. Better freshman season, Joe Smith's or Derek Queens?

Well, we'll see. You know, Joe got us to the Sweet 16, his season. And he was national player of the year. His sophomore year, I guess his freshman year, he's national freshman of the year. And, you know, he was incredible. You know, Joe was, and he was the first player taking in the NBA draft over Kevin Garnett, McDice, people like that, Vince Carter. Joe was the first guy taken. So Joe speaks for himself.

You know, I know I've asked you this before, but not everybody remembers the answer. When did you know back in 1993? When did you know, was it the Georgetown game or before that Joe Smith was going to be the best freshman in America? Well, I don't really be that good, but you could see it in practice. Back then, everybody started October 15th. There was no summer practice like there is now. So you were kind of waiting to get started. and Keith Bruth had the most attention.

He was McDonald's All-American, Dunbar, and Baltimore had won the national championship with Keith's junior year. So Keith had a lot of attention being local coming in, more and more local than Joe from the Tidewater area. And Joe just had that timing thing that you can't teach. You know, he could go up and block a shot when he was completely out of position. He could get a rebound. If he got a hand on it, it was his. he didn't lose it. If they double team him, he would make the right pass out of the coast to the open man

without a coach having to tell him to do that. And he was a team player. He knew how to play and could run incredibly. I think that if you compare Queen to Joe, just in one area, Joe was a much better runner of the court than what Queen is. Right. But what kind of pro? curious, do you think Queen will be?

I think he can play. Once again, you have your doubters, but I think he's got to bulk up a little bit in terms of getting into the weight room, because he's got the size, but he's got to turn some of that size into muscle, and I think he'll do that. And with his knowledge of the game, his ability to pass, there's been very few big men in 6-10 that could ever pass like Queen does. I mean, he's got a left-handed one-hand hook pass that, you know, for a right-handed guy. It's just incredible.

It looks like his shooting is really coming along. He hit a couple of threes the last game, and, you know, it looked natural when he shot him. It didn't look like, you know, he was forcing it or taking a bad shot. So I think he's definitely a pro, you know, and, you know, and a lot of it is, you know, Joe Smith goes in. He stays in the league 16 years, but he never. never really, you know, took that next step into being that all pro or whatever. So you never know. But similarly, both guys are young.

You know, Joe was here left after a sophomore year of Queen Leaves this year. You know, they're young going into the NBA. So hopefully they'll get with a team that really does a great job with their young players. All right. Let's talk about their bracket. How do you see it? What do you know about Grand Canyon? What do you know about a potential matchup in the second round against Memphis?

Colorado State. A lot of people have a Maryland, Florida, Sweet 16 game. What are you envisioning? How do you see it playing out? Well, Grant Canyon, I know very little about, I know Jerry Colancho was a big part of starting that university. It's not an old university, but it's huge now. They do a big nationwide type program where you can get a degree not attending in person. And they've been good. They've been to the NCAA the last couple years. They have NCAA tournament experience, and it won't be a walkover game, but I think

Maryland's just a better basketball team, but, you know, I hope it does go that way. And then I really think Colorado States want to beat Memphis. I think Memphis played in one of the weaker leagues this year, and they didn't exactly blow people away. And they're one guy might be hurt. They're a really good player. I don't know his name, but he might be hurt.

And so I would think you're going to see Colorado State, who I think they lost three of the first four games this year, and all of a sudden, you know, they were up there with 25 wins. And I think you're playing a team that's really on a role if it's Maryland, Colorado State to get to the Sweet 16. And then, of course, Florida, that would be who they would. play, I would think. Florida's very similar to Maryland, and they have two really good inside players and very

good perimeter players all can handle the ball, all can shoot the three. And I think that would be a great game. And obviously, I'd be rooting for Maryland, but that's a tough draw to get to where you would play Florida. You know the fan base and how demanding it is and has been as much as anybody does. And I'm wondering if you have the same sense. that I have, which is getting out of the first weekend is big. It just doesn't happen as frequently as it did when you were the coach. And it's been nine years since the last Sweet 16 trip.

Not that this would be, you know, a big deal for Kevin if he doesn't get to the Sweet 16. He's had a hell of a year winning 25 games and finishing second in the Big Ten. But do you have a sense that there's some pressure to get beyond this first weekend for the program? Well, I think it's big for a couple reasons. Obviously, for Kevin Willard, it's big, but this team deserves to get that second weekend. They've earned it. They've played tough. They've gone through adversity, going out on the West Coast early,

loses Oregon and Washington. You know, it hasn't been easy, and they've worked hard to get here. So, in my mind, they've earned a right to be there in that situation. You know, you know, you go where they're going. You know, you go to Portland, wherever it is. There's Seattle where they're going to play. I mean, how many Maryland fans can make that trip? Right.

You know, not many can. And it's not like the Midwest schools where their whole lives revolve around their school. And, you know, they got that football mentality where, you know, Maryland plays Ohio State and football. There's 10,000 Ohio State people at the football game. And so we don't necessarily need that. But at the same time, I always liked, we won't west at least six times. Right.

I was trying to count the other night. We just seemed like we went all the time. And the thing that does, it really gets that your team tight, you know, because you don't know anybody out there, you know, you're a little uncomfortable out there. And so you look inward. You look to the team and, okay, we've got to stay tough, you know, and we've got to do all this. Where, say, if we played in Providence, which I would have liked, because it would have been a lot easier for the Maryland fans.

However, the distractions of playing in Providence as compared to playing in Seattle are completely different. There's basically none in Seattle other than making the trip out there and, you know, being on the West Coast. So I like where we are, you know, and I think I just would like to see Maryland get there because I think that Florida Maryland game would be a great basketball game. Yeah, I mean, Spokane. Anaheim, Denver. I mean, it seemed... Wichita.

That was the first year, right, when you beat St. Louis and... And UMass. And UMass. We played... They had a farm show arena out there, and it really smelled like the horses and cows were still there. It did. Oh, man, it was incredible. Didn't you play? I think you played Yukon the year in Sweet 16.

That was in San Francisco or Oakland, one of those two. Yeah, we were out there. We played, we won in Salt Lake City. Right. We beat Texas to go to the Sweet 16, yeah. And then we beat Gonzaga in Texas, I guess. Yeah. And then we played in Sacramento against Illinois with

some roosges, Sabooges, Sabooges, Saboogh, Sabozy, Torel Stokes, Le Ron Prophet, those guys. We beat Illinois to go to the Sweet 16th in Sacramento. In Sacramento. In Sacramento. But then the next game was the next game when you lost to Arizona in the Sweet 16, that may have been out west. Yeah, and Arizona got upset right after,

oh, yeah, it was out west. Yeah. And Arizona got upset by whoever after that. Yeah, that was. If you're good, you can handle things like that. You know, you have to be good and you have to have to have the right guys that are mentally tough.

And I think we do. I think Maryland has those people this year. All right. Fingers crossed. Can't wait to watch it. Are you going out there or not? No, no, I'll be watching, obviously, but, you know, you get to, you know, the travel gets tougher as you get older. I know.

Well, happy belated birthday to you. I know you just celebrated a big one. Yeah, the big 80, yeah. I know. You know, that's amazing. You know, you never think about that until you get there. Wow. Well, how do I get here?

Well, you, but you. keep yourself in such great shape, and I'm not, you know, saying this because I'm sitting here talking to you, but everybody has said this about you. You don't look anywhere near 80 years old. I don't know what you look in terms of age, but it's not 80. That's for sure. You better tell my left knee that because I don't think my left knee is aware of that. Well, you know, that probably started years ago. All right, thanks for doing this. Enjoy it. I'll talk to you soon. Thanks, Kevin. Appreciate it. Gary Williams, everybody. We'll talk some football, some commanders football, with Sam Fortier,

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Joining me right now is Sam Fortier from the Washington Post. At Sam 4TR on X on Twitter. Sam has just written a story titled The Commanders Added 10 New Players, Here's How They Fit In. There are certain players, I think, that are obvious like Laramie Tunsell in terms of how they fit in,

but there are some intriguing fits, so I'm interested to get your thoughts on that. But before we start, give me your description of the off-season. If somebody weren't paying attention to anything that was going on, how would you describe Washington's off-season so far? they have made a lot of moves, primarily retaining their own free agents, but of the 28 players that they've brought in, 10 of them are new, and the overarching philosophy on those new players in particular is one, they have to help Jaden Daniels, like Laramie Tunkle, the left tackle, and they have to be big boys. They have to add heft to the trenches. Seven of the 10

are linemen, and they are large people, which I think is a direct response to the Philadelphia Eagles, and their big and talented lines helping lead them to a Super Bowl title. Have they missed on anything that you think they should have gotten? Edge Rusher is still a clear need for this team, and it's something that I know that Adam Peters knows, and they are going to pursue it. But I think when you look at the landscape of what could have happened, if Ronnie Stanley hits the market, for example, and you're able to sign him, and then you have the draft picks where you're able to trade for a premium edge rusher.

You know, Miles Garrett ends up not being available. Trey Hendrickson is a question whether he's actually available. But if you could get an edge rusher, I think that's something they're still focused on. But to me, what they've done so far is still a pretty significant increase. improvement if incremental. All right. Let's talk about the new players. Tunsell, it's obvious what he brings. The question would be

what happens to the offensive line. So where do you think Brandon Coleman lands and what does the starting offensive line opening day, assuming that Sam Cosmy won't be there, what does it look like across the board? It's too early to tell.

Anyone who's saying Brandon Coleman will be the left guard or the right guard or the right tackle. I think we don't know that yet. I don't think they know that yet. I think they probably have an idea. I think, you know, it seems to me that it would be a little likely if he'd move to right tackle, considering, you know, his frame,

considering they'd like him to play tackle. They believe he can play tackle. But it's possible to me totally, especially if there's another injury or if they just say, hey, you know, maybe tackles not his best spot. Let's put him at right guard. You know, then we can make that happen. To me, if I were to guess, left to right, right in week one, sitting here on March, whatever it is,

I would have to say Tunsell, Allegretti, Beiotish, maybe Wiley, maybe Wiley, maybe someone else, and then Coleman. I would say, like, that to me is a fair bet for week one. Coleman, a right tackle. Were you surprised that they went and traded for Laramie Tunsell? No. Well, yes, in the sense that, like,

it surprised me that Laramie Tunsell was available, but it did not surprise me that they were aggressive in pursuing a top flight left tackle. You know, whomever that would have been, like Stanley, I mentioned earlier, if some of those other guys could hit the market, Jackson's from L.A., I think they knew that they needed to boost the protection

for Jaden Daniels. They needed to get some bigger guys. They needed to get some skills, and I think Laramie Tumple checked a lot of the boxes that you need. to elevate your franchise quarterback, and he fits, you know, his skill set, his contract, everything fits with the way that Jane Daniels is playing right now. Yeah, I should have asked that question differently because everybody was surprised Larry Metunzel

was available, but that they were aggressive going after a left tackle and didn't, you know, had already come to the conclusion that Brandon Coleman was not going to be that answer at left tackle, and it sounds to me like you were not surprised that they had determined that. All right, let's go to Debo Samuel. How do you see the fit? Perfect. I think if you look at this offense last year, they had the vertical threats, Terry McClureen,

and then at times others. They had Jayden's ability to scramble. They, like, the passing offense to me was missing an underneath creator, a quote-unquote easy button where even if Clifton called a perfect play, even if Jayden didn't get the perfect read on the coverage, that someone could take an easy path and do something with it. They had guys that could create yards after the catch. Diami, I thought, was actually better than I expected on those screens.

But they missed a true creator who, like, after the catch, Austin Eckler did a little bit, but a true difference maker, a playmaker who could compensate and sort of sometimes spark you out of those long slogging drives and help you really hit explosive play to be more consistent explosively. And I think Debo is just going to elevate what Jane Daniels in this offense is able to do. because he takes pressure off, and I think he's motivated. I think he'll be in shape. I think he'll be healthy. I understand the risks of his style of play.

But to me, Debo Samuel is exactly what this passing offense is missing last year. I totally agree with that. And I think also you're going to get such a motivated player entering a contract year. All right, Javon Kinlaw. Let me hear your explanation of the deal and then the fit. I think these things are very tied. And I'm going to start with my one-liner, which is something that NFL scouts use, like, when they're presenting, if a scout is presenting to the GM or members of the front office, sometimes they'll say a one-liner to help the GM visualize how they see the player.

And to me, Jvonne Kinlaught is a big, disruptive lineman who has a good motor. And though his attacking style can lead to misses against the run and on tackles, the commanders are betting they can maximize his size and passion. rush strength. I think the contract, which was widely paned, one of the most criticized losers of free agency so far, makes a little bit more sense if you look at him more as a pass rusher, rather than, you know, the inside, you know, the nose tackle one technique that he was last year in New York. And I know that that didn't produce the results that he wanted. But I think that the commander's bet makes sense. And I do think it's a bet. I was talking to one scout for another

team and he was like, look, like, yeah, like the cap is going up a lot. the contractor is a little inflated, but that bet, while a little risky, makes sense to me because he can do a lot of different things. You know, I know it's been popular to talk about, you know, they could move him out to end on someplace and play what, quote-unquote, Dan Quinn called the Elephant End, which he used in Seattle, similar framed guy in Red Bryant. I mean, Javon Kinlaw, he's a first-round pick. You're betting on the ethicism.

You're betting that you can get more out of him than has been gotten out of him in the past. Right. Yeah, I mean, I would think that, well, I did think when I saw the money that, A, there must have been competition for him, which nobody was expecting necessarily, and B, that there's more versatility to this player. And he has played a lot of snaps at end. He's played some snaps at nose. So, yeah, but you said something early, which is there's definitely been a thing. theme of big with the players that they've gone out and gotten. Is it just easy to say that Will Harris is just Jeremy Chin's replacement, and they're hoping he's as good, if not better? I think that's possible.

It's not guaranteed, but in an ideal world, I think they would like him to play that role, and I think that they believe he can be even a little better as a center field or as a post-safety than Jeremy Chin was. What about Eddie Goldman? I actually loved Goldman in Chicago when he was a young player. I thought he was on the verge of becoming a really good player, and then COVID hit, and then he retired the whole thing. But how do you think they see him fitting in?

Large, powerful, rotational nose tackle. It was a little spicier than a near space eater, but still will primarily be used to stop the run inside. I went back and watched his performance against the Eagle. when he played them with Atlanta last year, and he handles the double teams well. His size stands up. You know, he made a nice tackle on Seifuan

where he shed a double and, you know, kind of stopping for a one-yard game. So to me, Eddie Goldman is basically better Carl Davis from last year. They're more proactive about addressing that need of having a space heater inside. And his movement ability and his past rushing ability, I think he just gives you a little bit more juice than other guys you could have found at that position.

Dietrich Wise. I had Logan Paulson on the show yesterday, and he was really high on him, and after recording the podcast yesterday, I went and just watched some of Dietrich Wise's highlights. I didn't realize how long he was, you know, kind of that new wave defensive end with the super long arms and the ability to, you know,

to rush the passer. I actually came away much more optimistic about a player I didn't know much about. What do you think of Wise? He has 35 and 5-8-inch arms, which, for context, Kevin, is 96th percentile of all defensive linemen that have been measured at the combine. It's so noticeable. It's really, really obvious. And I think that, like, what he lacks in bend, in speed, he makes up for with

his sabbiness with his big frame, he's 280 pounds. He can set the edge and rush the passer. And to me, the best way that I've heard, you know, when I was talking to some scouts and talking to some evaluators around the league, if someone made the point to me, when you look at adding Dietrich Wise instead of Dante Fowler, or Jonathan Jones instead of Benjamin St. James, the commanders seem to be saying,

we are willing to sacrifice athleticism for reliability. You know, you didn't always get set edges, and you didn't always get sticky coverage with those guys despite their measurables. And to me, wise, Jonathan Jones, they all fit the same prototype of smart, savvy players who are going to do their jobs and are physically capable. Yeah, I'm looking up, as you said that, I didn't know the length of his arms. My God, I mean, that is, you see it when you watch the highlights just how long he is. And, you know, there's kind of, we've seen that, you know, in recent years.

I'm not saying he's going to be DeNeil Hunter, you know, but. But that kind of body type, that kind of long-armed length is what, you know, it seems scouts are looking for. You know, they've got a player on their roster that has, I think, super long arms. And the guy they drafted three years ago, Andre Jones Jr., kind of has that kind of long, gangly build as well. All right. Let's move on to who else did I have here on the list to ask you? Jonathan Jones. So what is his fit in the secondary?

Classic Bill Belichick veteran, whose versatility, tenacity, and IQ have helped him remain competitive, even though his top end speed is fading entering his age 32 season. I think that, like Wise, he's a guy who is going to figure it out. He's super versatile.

He can literally play anything, outside corner slot, box safety, post-safety, you know, like this is a guy who is probably not going to be able to stick on an island, you know, as much as he might have been able to when he was younger, but he's still really capable of getting it done. And when I saw, you know, them behind Will Harris and Jonathan Jones, two guys with a lot of experience and strength in man-to-man coverage, I thought to myself, oh, they are going to get closer to Joe Whit Jr.'s stylistic vision for man-to-man coverage, blitzing, being super aggressive with this defense. I don't know if they're actually going to do that.

I do think Harrison Jones are capable of playing zone. They're capable of playing other things. And I don't know how Jones in particular would hold up against man coverage and man coverage for a large volume of snaps. But I do think those guys get them closer to the vision that Joe it has. All right. A couple more, and I'll let you run. I've talked about this recently, and I asked Logan about this yesterday. I think sometimes when we get to a new offseason and start looking to.

towards a new draft. We almost forget about the last draft. I mean, nobody's going to forget about Jaden Daniels. Nobody's going to forget about Mike Sandra still. But of the players that, you know, and I wouldn't include Johnny Newton really in the question that I'm going to ask, but between Senate, McCaffrey, and McGee. And I'd actually throw in John Baptiste, because I know that they liked him last year, and he's back. Who do you think they're expecting to make a significant jump in year two and be a big contributor? I think the correct answer is hopefully all of them, but I'm going to focus on two guys, McCaffrey.

And I think McCaffrey, in particular, with the departure of Alamede Zakias, we don't know what they're going to do in the draft in terms of wide receiver, I think that he will have more opportunities to catch the ball. And I think that when you look at his disappointing production last year, and I know that he was still young playing the position, but I know they wanted more out of him. I think that his ability to step up and contribute is there. And it's up to him to seize it.

I know they believe in the bloodline, they believe in the skill set. So can he go out there and capitalize on that opportunity? And then I would also say about Senate, my big question with him is route running. I know that they like him in motion. I know that, you know, I think he can hold his own as a blocker, but with the return of Earth and Bates,

you're now still the tight end three in an offense that uses some three tight-end sets, but I don't think they're going to do it a lot. And so can you make the most of your opportunities? Can you force your way onto the field and say, hey, Zach Erd, you know, like on early downs or in non-critical situations, I'm going to take some tread off your tires. I'm going to let you, you know, save those things up for a critical moment,

and I'm going to step in and be a route runner and develop a rapport with Jay and Daniels. That's the thing I'm really looking forward to him. and if I wasn't going to ramble too long, I would talk about the geek, because I'm also fascinated by him, but I'm going to leave it there right there for now. All right, let's finish with this. You alluded to it, you know, that in terms of what they still need, and I think, you know, my focus certainly going into the offseason was they had to get better on defense, and maybe, you know, a guy like Wise gives them a lot more than we thought.

Maybe they've got some answers on the roster, but I think everybody agrees. they still have that as a significant need. So how do they get it? Do they get it in a Trey Hendrickson trade? Do you think that that ends up, you know, Cincinnati lowers its price at some point? I actually think the chances Hendrickson goes back to Cincinnati have increased significantly. But what do you think about Hendrickson? And then if not him, tell me, you know, your early thoughts on how they add, you know, an edge rusher.

Maybe you've got another guy in free agency that you've been thinking of. I don't know how they're going to. going to do it right now. And I think it starts with, is Trehendriton truly available? I agree with you that after getting the deals done for their two top wide receivers, the Bengals are definitely going to shift their focus on bringing Trey Henderson back. And so I think the chances of the commanders acquiring him has declined significantly. I know, I thought Joey Bosa was a name that they were going to pursue. Me too. Ultimately, you know, the price gets to be too expensive. And so I would say any free agent left is sort of marginal.

right now, and I don't think that's a guy out there that you're looking forward to saying, like, okay, like, here's our premier player at this position. And so, but can you get that guy at 29? I don't know, and I do think that they're strong candidates to trade down, considering they're going to want more bites the apple. But it is a strong edge rusher class. I think Daniel Jeremiah has, like, nine edge rushers in his top 50. So to me, that's a position that they, when they looked at the market last year,

you know, when they made that Marchion-Ladamor train, they said, hey, we don't love the free agent or draft classes of corners. That's why we're taking a swing on Marshawn. I think inherently, you should have to say to yourself, we feel better about finding an edge rusher there. But can you do it late in the first round or early in the second? I think that's an open question, Kevin. And there's just a lot of options of the table right now,

so I'm not getting married to one prospect or one free agent at this point. I lied. I got one more for you because I asked Logan this, and I suggested to him that this is something that I've been thinking and I've been talking about, and I'm curious if you agree with this. So Debo can take snaps in the backfield. Austin Eccler's back. They tendered Rodriguez, and this is a big-time deep draft at running back,

which they could have a chance even on day three, even though they've got limited picks now from where they were before the Latimore trade. But I think there's a chance that Brian Robinson, Jr. is not on the opening day roster. What do you think? you're saying he's traded or he's cut cut or traded it would surprise me just because I do think he plays the physical

violent style that Dan Quinn likes I think that he's not a bad locker room guy I would be surprised if you were cut but I do think that they would probably like to add a home run hitter and to me like I think

that Chris Rodriguez in a competition or if there's too many running backs, I think he would be the odd man out. And I know that people really wanted him to get more carries last year. But I don't think Brian Robinson's, Brian Robinson did not have his best year, but particularly at the end of the year, I think the running game struggles were more complicated than just Brian having a tough time. And I think that when you look at the offensive line upgrades, in particular what they're

going to continue to do, I think, you know, you give him a better opportunity to have success. I would disagree with you. I think it's unlikely that Brian Robinson is cutter traded, but if everything breaks the right way, if they can get a home run hitter, which I think they want to add regardless of whether Brian is there or not, then I think it's

possible, but just unlikely. Thanks for doing this. You've got some travels coming up. Enjoy those, including the league meetings where there might be some real action on rule changes. We'll see. But thanks for doing this

as always. I'll talk to you soon. Thanks so much for having, Kevin. I always enjoy it. All right, that is it for the day. Back tomorrow with Tommy.