The Kevin Sheehan Show - How Long Is Heinicke's Leash?

Episode Date: September 30, 2021

Kevin and Thom opened the show with stories of stolen cars, paper routs, and the worst job in Allentown, PA. The boys discussed Ron Rivera's answer to the question, 'how long is the leash for Taylor Heinicke'? They also discussed Matt Ryan's potential availability and whether or not Ryan Zimmerman's upcoming weekend in Washington will be his last.   Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Chean Show. He is Kevin. Tommy's here today. I'm also here today. Tommy and I were just having a conversation for about 15 minutes about various things.

And I said to him, why are we not recording and doing the show right now and just having this conversation on the air? So we will try to rehash this conversation a little bit. It'll interest some and perhaps others will want to fast forward to some Washington football talk. Where, by the way, Ron Rivera was asked yesterday by Scott Abraham from Channel 7. What kind of leash does Taylor Heineke have? We'll get to all of that coming up and more. But the conversation started with, well, it started with a golf conversation. Thank you to Brian and Chuck.

It was a lot of fun to hang out with Brian Chuck and my friend Jeff yesterday at the beautiful, beautiful new congressional blue course. It is spectacular. It is much different than it used to be. And it's jarring when you walk in and you see the new course with the open sort of link style look to it. But what a fun day we had. But Tommy asked me to retweet a column, and I retweeted apparently the wrong column. but it was a column that I read. And it was this morning's column or yesterday's column about 30 years ago today,

the senators... 50 years ago today. I'm sorry, 50 years ago today. Right, because I've been doing the 30 year on the 1991 team. And so I just got confused there. 50 years ago today was the final Washington Senators game in Washington before they moved to Texas. And Tommy wrote a really good column, and I retweeted it. it. He wanted me to retweet his Chase Young column, which I will, I promise. But we started to have

this conversation, and I said to you, these are my first sports memories. 1971 was the year that George Allen arrived in Washington to coach the Redskins. That's the first season I remember. And that baseball season, I remember as well. And I don't remember that final game. I've seen the film of it many times when the fans run out, you know, on the field and like the seventh inning or whatever against the Yankees and they end up, you know, forfeiting the game because they're ripping up bases and ripping up sod and the whole thing in the final game before they moved to Texas. But I told you that my father used to take me to Senators games and he took me to Senators games probably the year before or two years before that. But that was the first year I really

remember going to Senators' games. And he took me to, and this is the first game I remember, was going to see Denny McLean pitch his first game as a Washington senator. You knew that Denny McLean pitched for the Senators, right? Oh, yeah. In fact, I had Denny McLean as a guest on my Cigars and Curveball podcast. Was he in jail? No, he wasn't in jail this time.

He hasn't been in jail in a while. He's had quite the colorful career, but he did not have good things to say about his time in Washington. He didn't. And then Washington fans didn't have good things to say about him when he was in Washington because he was terrible. His arm was shot by then. He had five years of excellent years in Detroit, but basically pitched his arm off. You know, I didn't know anything, obviously, about Denny McLean, other than, you know, after the fact when I got older and I had more of an interest in looking back to see.

But I just pulled up, you know, his baseball reference stuff. And, you know, he came to Washington in 1971. He was 10 and 22 with a 4.28 ERA in D.C. It's just weird to see 10 and 22, you know, 32 games where a decision went one way or the other. In 1968, and correct me if I'm wrong, but that would have been the World Series champion, Detroit Tiger. in 1968 or did they lose to St. Louis in in 1966? No, that was, no, they beat St. Louis in seven games in 68. He got it. He was 31 and 6.

Yes. With a 1.96 ERA. The last 30 game winner. Oh, he was? Yeah, Denny McLean. Wow. He won back-to-back size. And the year after that, the year after that, he was 24 and 9 in 1969.

Yes, he was. And he pitched 336 in 68, 325 and 69. Okay. His arm was shot. He had pitched basically, yeah, he had basically pitched himself off, his arm off. Yeah. He started 41 games both years. Why did he go to jail again?

I don't remember. Something to do with some kind of fraud thing. some connection to organized crime. It's pretty wild stuff, but he's a great guest. Is he still alive? Yeah. He does card shows, things like that, you know, autograph sessions. You've got to go back to 1968 for the last 30-game winner.

Yeah. Well, you're never going to see another one. Well, of course not. That's it. You barely even see 20 game winners. Yes. God, that's, yeah, and look at the innings he pitched. My God, 336 innings.

You're talking about a war. Well, tell everybody about what happened to you and your dad at one of these centers. Yeah, so Tommy and I were talking before the show. And, like, my first sports memories are of the George Allen Redskins and going to RFK Stadium. We had season tickets. And I would go with my dad and my two uncles, actually. every Sunday and I was the old I was the oldest in my family and then I was also the oldest grandson in the family so it was always my father my two uncles and me going to every game when I was a kid

and those are great memories but my father also took me to a lot of senators games I remember before they moved that year and on one particular night I'll never forget this we came out of the stadium and the car was gone it was It had been stolen while we were in RK Stadium. And, you know, that was part of the issue, you know, in the post-1968 senators' teams. I mean, A, the 69 season with Ted Williams managing them, that was the 500 season that they had, and it was a great season. But if you go back, I did this, I remember a few years ago, they had horrible attendance, just horrible, which is ultimately why Bob Short, right, was the owner, Bob Short?

Yeah. Move them to... Bob Short was the... They had, for that last game, which I wrote about in my call, they had about 15,000 people, and that was about double what their normal attendance was. That's amazing.

That 15,000 was like double their normal attendance. When I went back and looked a few years ago, like there were nights who were like you had three or four thousand people. Well, part of the reason was the team wasn't very good. The other part of the reason is post-1968 riots, you know, people did not come into the city that much. And RFK was not in a great

part of the city. And so my father never cared about any of that stuff. Like he would, you know, he would take me into any neighborhood. It wouldn't, it never bothered him at all. And he was going to games and he was taking his son to games. But that night, I do remember coming out and the car was gone. my father, thank God for the person that stole it, that he didn't come upon that person while they were breaking into it and stealing it because he was a big old Irish dude and there would have been a problem. But the only thing I remember is that being a little bit traumatized and because, you know, he found police and he was reporting into the police and then we got into a cab and went

home. And you asked. What had a car with it? So, yeah, you asked me. I don't know what that car was, but I do remember my father in the 70s, throughout the 70s, having Pontiac Grand Prix, like two or three of them in a row. Yeah. Nice car.

With the bucket seats, which was like the new, you know, 70s phenomena in cars, right? Am I right about that? Yeah. Yeah. Now, did you ever, did you wind up getting your dad's cars? See, I wound up. I bought two of my cars where I bought

from my dad. You know, of the cars I own. And one of them turned out to be a lemon. He ripped me off. The first car I got was my grandmother's car. It was a 77 Pontiac

Catalina. I think Pontiac Catalina. Catalina's and Bonnevilles were Pontiacs. It was either Bonneville or Catalina. And then did I ever get... No, I never got one of my father's cars, I don't think. I've told you the story about buying my first car at 14 years old.

Oh, yeah. You know it again, though. It's a good one. That, by the way, was a 1972 pot. That was the 1972 Pontiac Bonneville. The first one I owned was a, or had, was my grandmother's Catalina. I think it was a Catalina. Anyway, my best friend growing up, Mike Carberry and I, we got ourselves, you know,

into a lot of shenanigans and a lot of, you know, teen issues and troubles, but nothing severe. But we bought a car when we were 14 years old. We paid $10 for the car. $10. Swear to God. The car was like in a heavily wooded area. The guy that was selling us told us the plates or a plate is in the back seat, but the car didn't have a battery. So we needed to replace the battery.

Clearly the car was stolen or there was something very sketchy going on with the car. But we purchased the car for $10. And then we got a friend of ours, Colin Gillespie, who was like a year older. and had a license to drive us to Sears. And he actually, on his parents' credit card, put the new battery on his parents' credit card. We went back. We installed the battery. And for about a month and a half during this summer, we were driving that car everywhere.

Tommy, we drove it to Memorial Stadium one night and went to an Orioles game. Oh, that's great. And then one night, Mike had dropped. a couple of us off and there was a parking lot near his house where he kept the car and he got pulled over by himself when he was pulling into that parking lot couldn't produce a driver's license and the rest is history he actually could not get his real driver's license because of this incident until he was 18 the rest of us had it when we were 16 but uh but we had but the stories that we've told put it this way the stories that we got out of that month and a half

with that car over the years was the best. Now, he and I also delivered our newspapers on a golf cart that we just borrowed from a local country club for about a month, too. And we would use that golf cart until the battery ran out, and then we ditched it somewhere. Wasn't congressional, wasn't it? No, it was not congressional. It was another Bethesda Country Club on River Road, but it was not congressional. and his paper route, his post paper route was right next to mine.

I delivered the post and the star, Tommy. I had two paper routes simultaneously. I would, I would. Wow, you are an enterprising fellow, afternoon and morning. I was. I did the morning, and then when I came home from school, I would deliver the afternoon star. Now, the star on the weekends was a morning delivery.

Right. Now, I was a paper boy, too, but my tenure as a paper boy was not particularly memorable. It wasn't. No, in East Strasbourg, the route you wanted was the Pocono record. That was the hometown paper. Everybody got the Pocono record. You know, but those routes were hard to get. I mean, people used to, like, hand them down to their friends, you know.

They were tough to get. But you could deliver 120 papers. within a couple block radius. Right. You know, I mean, it was, it was a great route. The second best route was the afternoon paper out of Easton, about 30 miles away, called the Eastern Express, a paper I wound up working four years later. And that was good.

They didn't have as many customers as the Pocono record. But it was an afternoon paper. It meant you didn't have to get up early in the morning to deliver it. Right. You know, so that was good. And then the least favorite route was the one I got. And that was the morning call out of Allentown, Pennsylvania, which was a little bit farther away than Easton. And I had about maybe 30 to 35 daily customers.

But the morning call was the only paper that had a Sunday paper. The other two did not come out on Sunday. So on Sundays, I had 150 customers. of Sunday paper, which was like delivering a phone book. Yeah. Well, didn't you have a cart? Or did you have a sack that you threw them in?

Well, at one point, I mean, it was so pathetic. My father started helping me. He started to drive me around. I mean, because they were, I mean, it took me all day. You know, the old way, I was delivering Sunday papers at 4 o'clock in the afternoon. Well, your customers were not very much. very happy with you. No, they weren't.

If they weren't getting it in so forth. They were not very happy. Well, not only that, Tommy, you know, where you were delivering papers. I mean, was there anything worse? For those of you that had paper routes, was there anything worse than when you had to get up and it was frigid outside to deliver papers early in the morning?

And remember the, you know, the warm ink. Like I would stick my hands in the middle of a newspaper to keep them warm, you know, when you were delivering papers. I do remember, you know, speaking of my father, it's very funny because when we moved recently, I found a bunch of stuff, including a lot of different things that I had in boxes from over the years. And a lot of things, by the way, that, like, you and I were a part of, like, different fights or different events, Super Bowls and different things that we got. And I've just always thrown them into boxes.

I usually don't care. But I found something in a box, and I have not given it to them. And I meant to do it last week when I saw them. But in 1979, there was a blizzard. It was called the President's Day blizzard or Washington's birthday blizzard. Because remember, it was Washington's birthday. We've got Washington and Lincoln, and then they combined it into President's Day weekend, if you recall. Yeah, but actually, back then, only Washington's birthday was a holiday.

Lincoln's birthday was not a holiday. Lincoln's birthday, by the way, I believe, looked this up as February 12th. I think that's true. Yes, it is. So on that particular, that particular storm was a very surprise storm. Like the forecast the night before was like, you know, two to four inches, and then we woke up the next morning under two feet of snow. It was an all-time blizzard at that point.

Now, since then, there have been many, many more that topped that. But that was a memorable storm because there was a, there was some sort of farmers march on the Capitol, and they used those tractors and stuff to clear snow like it was perfect timing. I think I'm remembering that. But anyway, that's not the point of telling the story. The point is, so I had this, you know, the Washington Post paper out. Well, Tommy, for the first three days of the storm, there was not only did I didn't, did I not deliver papers? They weren't getting the papers to any area to deliver.

You couldn't travel. The whole town was shut down for three days. However, with that said, when they started to clear the snow towards the end of the week, you know, it was still really cold and there was lots of snow. I did start to deliver the papers, but I delivered the papers with my father driving in his vehicle with all the papers in the back because there was just no way to push, like the push cart or whatever. So he got up and he helped me deliver the papers and the water. and the Washington Post sent, I'm sure, this to every single paper boy or a person who had a paper

out, a plaque that said, God, I wish I had it in front of me because I don't, I have it in my car actually because I was going to give it to my father. It was a plaque that said, congratulations, you delivered, you know, papers during the President's Day storm of 1979. And we delivered, we delivered for like two days of the week. The other three days or four days during the week, no chance. Like nobody was getting a newspaper for the first four days. But I was going to give him that plaque because really he's the one that earned it. All I did was stay in the car as long as I could with the heat on

and then sprint out and throw it somewhere in the direction of the front door of a house. Anyway. What about collecting for your route? Yeah. How was that for you? That was a pain in the ass, but that's how you got tips too. Yes, it did. Now, eventually what I do recall is you would put, you would attach an envelope, well, like once a month or once a quarter or whatever it was to the paper.

And they would send in the payment and then they would, you know, send. Actually, I don't remember how it worked because part of me thinks that I always got tipped directly by my, by the customers. Well, I had to go house to house with a punch card. Yeah, no. And you would punch, you know. No, we didn't have to do that. They paid. I think what it was, I think what it was is at Christmas time, you would go around and maybe

deliver that months or that quarter's bill. And it was, so it was once a year you would go around and do that. Other than that, they were paying via the mail. I'm pretty sure that's the way I remember it. I don't remember going around and collecting money. from customers for their, you know, for their subscription. And then at some point, as the population shifted and changed, which is part of the problem with newspapers,

more people started to move farther away from the city, which made it more difficult to deliver, which wound up pushing back deadlines, which meant you didn't get as much news as he wanted in the paper. Paper boys became an adult job with cars. Adult job cars where, you know, the guys like, you know, the guys that are delivering newspapers right now probably have, you know, a ridiculous number of accounts and it's a real job. And, you know, it's sort of gone. I think landscaping and cutting lawns has gone sort of the same way over the years.

I mean, those were two big jobs for kids and teenagers were delivering papers and cutting lawns. Yeah. And you don't see that nearly as much anymore. Unless you're a real, you know, entrepreneurial kid and you're, you know, you're opening up your own landscaping company, you know, and hiring people and the whole thing. The one-off kid that's got 10 lawns in the neighborhood, that just, I don't think that that exists anymore. I don't think so either. Anyway, okay.

How long is the leash for Taylor Heineke? That's next, right after these words from a few. of our sponsors. This segment brought to you by MyBooky. Go to MyBooky at MyBooky.orgie. Use my promo code Kevin D.C. And they will match your deposit dollar for dollar. They'll double it.

Put in 500 bucks, you'll end up with $1,000 in your account. Tom Brady's returning to New England for the game of the year Sunday night. They will have plenty of prop bets on that game. They do for every game, including tonight's Jacksonville, Cincinnati game. But My Booky does it right. You can totally be confident that you're getting fair lines, fair pricing. Even if you have another spot where you're wagering right now, if you're taking this seriously and you're doing it the right way,

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But anyway, Scott Abraham asked Ron Rivera about. The Leash on Taylor Heineke. Does Taylor still have a long leash in a sense? If he struggles, maybe, you know, again early in the first half, is there an indication or have you had talks, maybe thinking of Kyle Allen coming in? Have you gotten to that point? No.

I'm not even contemplating that. You know, this first time I thought about it was right here, honestly, was your question. I'll give you my answer, but I want you yours first, Tommy. What did you think of Ron Rivera's answer to Scott Abraham's question? His answer was good. I mean, how much value does the answer have? I mean, would you hold it to him?

Would you hold him to it, you know, 30 seconds later? I wouldn't. Me neither. Okay, so I think his answer was good. Look, I think he does generally a pretty good job in answering these questions. Sometimes he gets himself in a little bit of trouble, but fortunately for him, he doesn't, I mean, There's not a lot of opportunity to basically follow up on these things. So I thought it was a good answer.

And I think it's an absolutely useless answer. I think it is absurd to talk. I mean, even though we talk about it, I mean, you know, you didn't put Taylor hiding as a starter to bench him after one bad game. Okay. So come on. Yeah. Well, here's the thing.

first of all, a coach can't say any more than he said right there. And I'm so glad he kept it to essentially two sentences and didn't start to elaborate on why he's not even contemplating that because it would have probably just opened up several cans of worms. Because, you know, you cannot right now with this particular organization and where they are in this season right now, you can't then add a quarterback controversy on top of it. I mean, you just can't.

You've already got this major dumpster fire with the defense, which is the number one, two, and three reasons that they are one and two and could be O in three. And in fact, Taylor Heineke is the one that's given you a chance. And, well, he was significantly influential in your one win this year. So I love the way he handled it. It's the way to handle it. It's the Belichick way to handle it. I mean, Belichick would have actually had a one-word answer, and he would have said, no, Taylor Heineke's our starting quarterback.

But I don't believe him. I think that they have thought about Kyle Allen. I think that they will think about Kyle Allen, and it won't take a whole hell of a lot for them to actually move to Kyle Allen. Now, we did a segment on the radio show this morning, and I also put out the following Twitter poll. how long does Taylor Heineke hold on to the starting job? And I gave three answers, rest of the season until Fitzpatrick is healthy, replaced by Allen even sooner. And 42.4% say until Fitz is healthy. So he's going to keep the job until Fitz is healthy, which right now is projected to be after the buy week, which would be five more games.

It would be through the October 31st Halloween game at Denver. 39.8%. I was just going to say 39.8% said he's going to hold on to it for the rest of the season, and 17.8% said he's going to replace, he's going to be replaced by Kyle Allen sooner. There's a lot of Kool-Aid drink. A lot of Kool-Aid drinkers still out there.

Remember, you heard it here first, was the buy week, was when Kyle Allen takes over. For Fitzpatrick. Yes, for Fitzpatrick. that point at quarterback. I think it's going to happen sooner. I think it'll happen sooner in a by-week. I think it'll happen.

I mean, again, I think Taylor Heineke's going to be exposed, you know, against some of these teams. And, you know, I mean, not that I wish on anyone, but if he's going to feel the pressure to make plays, that puts him more at risk to get hurt. I mean, let's face it, I mean, we like quarterbacks who use their own. legs to make place, but when their legs are holding up a pretty small frame that usually doesn't hold up. Yeah, so you're predicting that he's going to get hurt, which is why Kyle Allen's going to be the starter. No, no, no, no, no, no.

I said that's one possibility. Okay, well, I think, I think, I think, I think it's up. I think performance. Yes. So he's going to be exposed. Okay. Yeah. Um, I, uh, so first of all,

I think that as long as he's upright and healthy and doesn't completely soil himself in like two consecutive games, I think that the coaching staff should give him these next five before the buy. And then we've got seven games of him starting. It's hardly a large enough sample size for a young quarterback. But, you know, he's not a young quarterback. He's just an inexperienced quarterback who wasn't drafted, who was on the scrap heap and picked up by one. team because there was only one team interested. So that's pretty much the chance you get when you're Taylor Heineke. And by the way, that's like an unbelievable chance. You know, the Taylor Heinekees of

the world don't get two seasons to prove it or a full season. They get like, you know, if they're lucky, they get a couple of games. In this case, you know, he may have the chance to give them seven starts with essentially six of them being against teams that had the opportunity to totally prepare for him. I have seen enough where I'd like to see him get the next five games. You know, Fitzpatrick right now, by the way, this is based on the assumption that Fitzpatrick isn't available until the buy week, you know, until early to mid-November. If he's available before then, then it comes down to how well Taylor Heineke's playing. But if Heineke is playing at a level that he's played, which is overwhelmingly more positive than negative, then I hope he gets these next five.

games and we can see him in three road games. We can see him at Atlanta against a bad defensive team and not a real good team at all in a game that Washington really needs to have in a game where they're really going to be counting on him this Sunday to produce, you know, and put up 27 plus points. Hopefully they won't need all of them, but they might. I want to see him against that saint defense a week from Sunday. I want to see him in potentially what could be the only way of winning in some sort of 3831 game against the Chiefs. I want to see how he plays at Lambo. I want to see how he plays against one of the best defenses in the league on the road in Denver.

You know, because even though seven games, seven starts and, you know, the eighth start against Tampa and the other quarters that he played against the Chargers and the Panthers, you know, still isn't a totally fair sample size. It's big enough. It's all I'll need to see. And I think it'll be all Belneed. to see to come to the decision as to whether or not it makes sense to invest any more time in him. And then in terms of whether or not he continues to play after that is Fitzpatrick's availability,

what their record is. Are they still in a playoff hunt? And or, you know, obviously if he's playing well, then, you know, Kyle Allen is less of a possibility. But if he's playing poorly and he plays poorly at Atlanta and at New Orleans and they lose those games because of him, which isn't what happened in Buffalo, then I think you could see Kyle Allen before Fitzpatrick is back and ready to go. But I hope they give him the next five games.

Well, what was interesting, Taylor Heineke's response to the question about being a game manager, and he jumped on it and embraced it. He said, that's me. I want to be a game manager. I mean, let's face it, given the opportunities this guy has had in his career, if they asked him to go out naked behind center and play the game,

he would do it. Okay? If they wanted to be a game manager, whether he's capable of it or not, he'll say, of course, I'll be a game manager. So, I mean, again, like, of course that's going to be his answer to that question. Here's the other thing that could factor in with a Kyle Allen decision. As much as I have been, and I think I've been right,

about this. I think I am right about this. As much as I believe Ron Rivera likes Kyle Allen, I'm not sure that they're looking at these games coming up if they're really honest with themselves and think

they have a much better chance to win with Kyle Allen. Then Taylor Heineke. Yeah. I mean, they're all three. They're the same quarterbacks in some ways. You know, Ryan Fitzpatrick is just Kyle Allen or Taylor Heineke at the end of their careers.

Yeah, but. But they're all the same quarterback. But they don't view, I don't think they viewed Ryan Fitzpatrick as the same quarterback as Taylor Heineke and Kyle Allen. Well, probably not. That's my opinion. Yeah. Right. Right.

That's your opinion. And I do think, by the way, stylistically, there's a lot of similarities between the three. there's definitely similarities between Heineke and Fitzpatrick. But, you know, if Fitzpatrick is healthy, and by the way, that may be a big if, you know, in terms of if he's actually available at any point this year to come back. I don't know that we've heard the, you know, the update on that. But we will at some point, I'm sure. But I'm going to ask Rivera that for the show tomorrow morning.

Tune in to 980 tomorrow morning at 8 a.m. I'm going to ask him. I don't think anybody's asked him recently. Maybe they haven't. I just missed it. How Ryan Fitzpatrick is doing. And is there a projected time table for his return to be able to start practicing again? But I think a lot of it is just, you know, we'll know when we get there because we will have seen Taylor Heineke play well or not play well.

We'll see what their record is and whether or not they're in contention for something or not in contention for something. Here's a question for you. if over the next five games, Taylor Heineke plays fine, but they don't beat, you know, Kansas City, Green Bay, Denver, and New Orleans. And they are sitting there at what would that be at that point? They would be two and six through eight games. And let's just say the Cowboys are six and two. So it's over.

Like the true contention is over. Would you play Fitzpatrick at that point if you were healthy enough to play? I think they owe it to him. Why? I think they signed him telling him he'd be the starting quarterback. You made a big deal about saying that they told him he'd be the starter. That's one of the reasons why he signed here. I don't think he wants to sit on the sideline even in a meaningless season.

I think he wants to play. But it's one thing before these games, the 17 game schedule, starts and you're trying to be a competitive team for the second straight year. And that's why you signed him. You think the veteran nature of him and the way he's played the last two years is going to give you a better chance than anybody else that you've got on the roster. It's a different context to two and six in the season being over. You have to do what's best for the future of the organization, which would be why not learn

more about Taylor Heineckee or Kyle Allen at that point? Because Fitzpatrick isn't going to be the starter, the long-term starter. the long-term start. Neither are those two guys. Neither are those two guys. I agree with you, but there's a better chance that one of them could emerge as something than Ryan Fitzpatrick at 38 years old coming off a serious injury. You got Fitzpatrick playing two seasons. Well, that was before he got injured. Well, he didn't lose a leg. Come on. Well, what are you saying? Are you saying that you'd put him in there because maybe they could go six and two, get to eight and eight and get a wild card spot? Or nine in a No, no. I'm not...

Nine and eight and get a wild card spot. No, I, well, I'm not saying what I would do. What I think they'll do is they'll play him again, if they're out of it. I would hate... I would hate for them to make that decision with the sole reason being, well, we promised him. Because things change. You know, they promised he'd be the starter at the beginning of the season, and he'd be the starter for this season. But, you know, you've got to remain upright.

You can't get hurt. and, you know, we can't, you know. Well, he doesn't have a history of getting hurt. No, he doesn't. Except for what he got here. You know, it would actually, the more that I think about it, it would be incredibly telling if he came back at 2 and 6 off the buy week, and he was the starter at that point,

and they really did not have a chance to contend for anything. Now, I say that there would still be more than half the schedule left, nine games left, with, by the way, five division games left. So maybe you could make the case. No, no, no, we're still playing for something. We got more than half the season left. We think Ryan, we think we could go seven and two,

you know, and get to nine and eight and be a wild card team or maybe even be back in this division race. But, you know, if they were truly out of it, you know, let's just say two games later, you know, through 10 games. And they played them at the end of the year. Well, that would be an obvious. tell that they do not think Kyle Allen or Taylor Heineke have any chance to be their starting quarterback moving forward, that the best they could hope for is to be a backup. And you know,

one of the things Tommy, and I thought about this last night, Taylor Heineke is a good backup quarterback. He's not a bad option to have on your team as a backup quarterback because he really is completely unafraid. And he doesn't get rabble. He doesn't get rabble. You know, you can put him in in the fourth quarter of the game. We've already seen them perform under those circumstances as a backup coming in. Well, Kate Daniels has become a multi-millionaire being a backup quarterback in this league. I think Taylor Heineckee can do the same thing. I agree with you.

Yeah. I mean, he seems to be a good student of the game. He seems to put the work in. He doesn't seem like he said. moments don't seem too big for him, you know, in terms of composure. Maybe in terms of ability they are, but not in terms of composure. Right. Well, so you've got Kyle Allen before the bye week and before Ryan Fitzpatrick is ready.

And, you know, I have no idea how he's going to play, but I will make, I'll take the leap here and say he's going to play well enough. you know, this Sunday and over the next five weeks, he's going to have some rough moments for sure like he did in Buffalo. And he's going to have a couple of games like Buffalo, but he will have enough moments where, you know, he impacts the result of these games in a positive way that he's the quarterback for the next five weeks. That's, I'll wager on that.

Just like I thought that Ryan Fitzpatrick would start 17 games. Okay. More on the show next right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey, don't forget to subscribe. If you haven't subscribed to the podcast, it really helps us. It doesn't cost you a thing. Also, rate us and review us wherever you can, especially on Apple, Spotify, and Google.

Rate us five stars. That would be great. And write a one to two sentence review. So many of you have. And I really appreciate it. It's really helpful. There are two Ryan's to finish up the show with. Ryan Zimmerman, which we will get to here shortly,

and Matt Ryan, the quarterback of the Atlanta Falcons, Washington's opponent on Sunday. Before we get to specifically, Tommy, what you wanted to talk about as it relates to Matt Ryan, I did want to mention that I have watched some of the Atlanta stuff from this year and some from the Atlanta Giant Games, specifically from last week. You know, they're more than capable of winning this game.

You know, I said that about the Giants, and a lot of you laughed, and they beat the Giants. They did. They needed an off-sides on a field goal to get it done. The Falcons are more than capable of beating Washington, especially with the way Washington's playing. I think Washington can win this game, and I think the desperation they have and the urgency they should approach this game with gives them an advantage. It's also nowhere near the hostile environment that they were in last weekend. I mean, Atlanta fans are really lukewarm on this team. They're giving away tickets for Sunday.

It won't be a sellout. You know, the Falcons are one and two at this point off of the win over the Giants. But they're capable offensively. You're kidding yourself if you think, you know, Matt Ryan is done. He's over with. Matt Ryan can still do it. He does it differently than Justin Herbert. He does it differently than Daniel Jones.

He does it differently than Josh Allen. But they're getting the ball out of his hands quickly. And they've got playmakers. They have Calvin Ridley. Calvin Ridley is a top 10 to top 12, 15 receiver in the league. I know I just went from 10 to 15, but he's somewhere in that range. Kyle Pitts was everybody's preseason favorite to win the offensive rookie of the year. I think Jamar Chase is the favorite right now.

But Pitts, two catches, 35 yards last week and the win and the meadowlands over the Giants. And then they've got Cordell Patterson, who has been in the league. I don't know how many years Cordell Patterson's been in the league now. It's probably eight or nine, something like that. You know, started with Minnesota, was with the Bears, and is now with the Falcons. He's been one of the great kickoff returners over the last eight to ten years. You know, an incredible kickoff return.

He's got eight touchdowns, eight. And exactly, by the way, I've got it now for you. This is his ninth season. Eight kickoff returns for touchdowns in eight seasons, essentially. That's really incredible. And they get him the ball in so many days. different ways. Cordell Patterson last week in the win over the Giants had seven rushes and six catches and then was also back on kickoff returns. He wears number 84. It's like the same number

he's worn everywhere, I think. Even when he's lined up as a running back, he's number 84. You know, they get it to him on screens, they get it to him on run extension throws. They get it to him as a wide receiver. He's a dangerous player. And so is Calvin Ridley and so is Kyle Pitts. And Matt Ryan, they've got them, you know, a lot of three-step drop, a lot of getting the ball out quickly. Mike Davis is the running back. They were two-to-one pass over run last week. You know, Washington was the same against the Giants. The Giants are a stout rush defense, which is why teams haven't really tried them much here, you know, or at least their last two opponents haven't.

But if you think Washington is, like, going to win this game going away, I totally see it differently. this is a toss-up game going in. Washington's a one-and-a-half-point favorite now. They opened up as a one-point dog. But I think the defense could have another rough day. If it does, it's going to be upsetting to everybody. But Atlanta's not a terrible offensive team, even though they're ranked very poorly, but they're capable. So that's all I would say on that. Now, what did you want to say about Matt Ryan? Well, I mean, I have heard that Matt Ryan once out of Atlanta after this year. that, as has been told to me, he wants to match staff for treatment. You know, he wants to be traded, and he wants to be wooed by teams,

and go play someplace where he can finish his career, and maybe win, who knows, depending on where he goes. Now, the one thing about Matt Ryan, he'll be 37 next year. Yes. And he might, which means he must have been old when he came to the league. He must have been. I think. I think he was 24, he came into BC.

Yeah, he was 24. That's a little bit old to be a rookie quarterback in the NFL. I'm surprised he's going to be 37 next year. That would give me pause. But if Matt Ryan was a valuable... He was 23 as a rookie. Okay. If Matt Ryan was available, you know, for the right deal,

and not obviously as much as Matt Stafford, was that something you'd be interested in for the next two to three years? I like Matt Ryan. I don't know if I'm going to like Matt Ryan at 37 years old. I want to see how he plays this year on a not very good team, but with some decent offensive skill position players, certainly at receiver and tight end. I don't know how I feel about that right now.

I mean, we don't have to have a feeling about that right now until we've watched him, but I've always been a Matt Ryan fan. Matt Ryan's had some phenomenal season. in the NFL. He was the MVP at the league. He's the MVP in the league. That will happen when Kyle Shanahan's your offensive coordinator. I'd rather go back and have Kyle Shanahan as my head coach, and Kurt Cousins is my

quarterback. But that ship sailed. Thank you, Dan. And Bruce, I, the answer, Tommy, probably not. I would agree. But then again. I would agree. Probably not for me either.

But I don't know what the price would be. be. And if he's playing really well at the end of this year and Atlanta decides to take the big dead cap hit or spread it out over two years, because I think it's a lot of money, that, you know, let me say this. Of the older quarterbacks that, let's just say, could be available next year, if Ben Rathasberger didn't retire, I'd take Matt Ryan over Ben Rathesberger right now. Yes, I would. Rathisberger looks done. Matt Ryan does not look done. Not yet anyway.

Yeah. Matt Ryan, so far this year, is completing 71% of his passes. Yeah. He's got four touchdowns and three interceptions so far this year. You're right. They must be getting it out quick for him to be completing so many passes. He doesn't interest me if I was a Washington fan. Atlanta right now.

He's not in Aaron Rogers' territory. Oh, no, no, no. And for me, he's not in Matt Stafford territory. I would have given up anything for Matt Stafford last year, which, you know, seemed to. Well, and that got Matt Stafford. He's out there, huh? Matt Stafford's 33. Yeah.

When you're getting them, too. That's a big difference, too. Huge difference, yeah. I mean, Matt Ryan probably had his MVP season at 33 years old. Yeah. What is he? He's going to be what? He's 37 right now?

He'll be 37 come May. Okay. So he, 2016 would have been his, that's the year they went to the Super Bowl and lost to the Patriots, right? It was to the 2016 season. So he was 30, you know, he was 31 that season. Yeah, I like Matt, like put it this way. If the defense was what we thought the defense was going to be, which was, you know, a good defense. Some thought elite.

I thought it could be a good defense this year. I'd much rather have Matt Ryan being my quarterback right now than Ryan Fitzpatrick. I mean, I think Matt Ryan's a good quarterback. You know, we talked briefly about Matt Ryan in the offseason, but it was never a possibility that Atlanta could unload him. Look, Atlanta, if Atlanta was going to unload Matt Ryan in the next two years, they would have drafted a quarterback at number four overall instead of Kyle Pitts. They're planning on keeping Matt Ryan.

Matt Ryan may want the Matt Stafford treatment, but I don't think he's going to get it. Now, I mean, part of the reason that you would take a Matt Ryan is if you think this team was close to competing. Yes. We make that deal. If this team showed you enough this year, the only problem we're looking at is the quarterback, and so far this hasn't been the case. Yeah, it's not been the case. I mean, you know, if we get to the end of the year and the defense is massively improved and the quarterback play sucks,

and they don't feel like they have a starter next year, but that they could make a move next year. Look, Ron's already said, even though the actions and the offseason sort of contradict this, given that they went with a big offer for Matt Stafford, that, you know, they're building the foundation right now, and they don't want to overspend,

and they don't want to mortgage the future, specifically for a young quarterback in the draft in terms of draft choices. But, you know, and he's even mentioned that Buffalo's sort of what they're modeling, you know, the franchise after. Buffalo, you know, built everything and then went and got the quarterback. You know, I love when, you know, people just say, well, let's build the offensive line and defensive line and build out the secondary and the linebackers and the skill. And then we'll go get the quarterback as if it's just so easy to go get the quarterback.

You know, it's not. It's not easy. It's a total crapshoot. And the only thing that isn't a crapshoot is trading for a known or signing a known. You know, the young quarterback route and the draft is a coin flip. It's not even a coin flip. It's, you know, a one in three chance that you're going to hit on the right guy. Maybe one in four. Smart people, look, smart people get it wrong all the time. Bobby Bessard drafted Ryan Leath. Yeah. So. So that idea of, you know, we're block by block by block, then we'll go get the quarterback. Well, you know, if the going to get the quarterback is somebody in the draft, well, you don't

know if you're going to get the right quarterback. And then, top of it, it'll take a couple of years for that quarterback to be good. I mean, more quarterbacks are like Josh Allen and the quarterbacks we're seeing this year struggle very much than are like Justin Herbert last year. I mean, that's, yeah. This year may be one of those years, Tommy, that we, everybody reevaluates the playing the quarterbacks right away or, you know, the expectations for young quarterbacks right away. because it's for the quarterbacks that have started,

it's 17 interceptions, nine touchdowns, and a one-and-eight aggregate record. And I'm talking about Wilson, Lawrence Jones. And now you've got, you know, fields having started one game and having one of the worst debuts for a starting quarterback ever. You can put some of that on the Chicago coaching staff. But, you know, so far, you know, based on their early, the early results, which you shouldn't judge anything off of,

no one's going to be Justin Herbert this year. It doesn't appear. Justin Herbert is remarkable. I mean, it's amazing. I mean, they may have gotten themselves another Dan Fouts with Justin Herbert. He's that good. I mean, I'm surprised you went Fouts instead of Rivers. Okay.

You're right. I mean, Fouts was phenomenal. I mean, that franchise has had John Hedle, Dan Fouts, Philip Rivers, and now Justin Herbert. I mean, that's a pretty good run of quarterback. It is a pretty good run of quarterback. For a team that hasn't won a Super Bowl. Now, they had several other quarterbacks between Fouts and Rivers. Yes.

Including, by the way, Drew Brees for a year. That's right. You know, a playoff year. You know, with Marty is. the quarterback as the coach, right? Marty was the quarterback for the Drew Brees. The quarterback was the season. Yeah.

Yes, he was. I think that's right. I believe that's right. Yeah, they've had some good ones. Right now, Fouts in his prime or Rivers in his prime? Well, I mean, I'm going to lean more towards Fouts, although he had better weapons. He had remarkable weapons. I mean, John Jefferson, West.

Sandler, Callan Winfellow, John Jefferson. Charlie Joyner. Charlie Joyner. I mean, just remarkable. Chuck Muncie out of the backfield, James Brooks out of the backfield. God, those Charger teams of the early 80s, they were so much fun to watch. Yes, they were. You know, I just pulled up the Chargers history of quarterbacks, and Rivers blows away Fouts

statistically. And they essentially played, I mean, Rivers ended up with, let's see, 28, so 47 more games he played in than Fouts, you know, over the course of the years, 59,000 passing yards for Rivers, but Fouts in a different era, 43,000 passing yards. Pretty damn impressive. Rivers, 397 touchdowns, Fouts, 254, which for the era is sick. Fouts is not in the Hall of Fame, right? I do not believe that Fouts is.

He is in the Hall of Fame. I'll double check. No, he is. I think John Hado. He's in the Hall of Fame. Of course he is. But John Hado is not, I don't think. But should Hadole have been in it?

I don't know. He was considered a great quarterback. Yeah. He wore number 21 as quarterback, right? Yes, he did. And then he went to the Rams. He quarterbacked the Rams in the 70s. Yes, he did.

73 and 74. Yeah. Because they had Harold Jackson, they had some good teams those years with Hedle. And then I think Pat Hayden probably replaced Hedel in L.A. Look, I mean, you know, I don't think Pat Hayden did. Hayden came along later because I remember Hayden took over for Joe Namis. And Amos, I don't think, was a RAM until 77. So, I mean, John Hedell, you know, he comes from an era like Kenny Stabler, he threw more interceptions and touchdowns.

Right. You know, like name it, through more interceptions and touchdowns. Right. Something else. I had 244 touchdowns, 268 interceptions, but he was a four-time NFL All-Star, and he was all-pro in 1973 when he was with the Rams. Jeff. First, I'm just looking to see

who would have replaced Hedel in 74. James Harris was their quarterback, of course. Okay. Of course. James Harris, one of the first black NFL quarterbacks. At the time, it was James

Harris and Joe Gillum in Pittsburgh. You know, because Doug Williams came after those guys. And James Harris had a big arm, and he threw a lot of passes to Jackson. And then Hayden and Farragamo came after Harris. Farragamo actually quarterbacked the Rams to a Super Bowl. Yes, he did.

Ray Malabasey coached Rams. Exactly. Exactly. Okay. What about the other Ryan Zimmerman? Do you think this is his final weekend as a professional baseball? player? I don't think so. Oh, you think he's going to come back and play next year?

Yeah, I think he will. I think he likes playing. It was a relatively easy year for him. He didn't have to be a full-time player. He proved to be fairly productive. 14 home runs drove in almost 50 runs. I mean, you know, it looked still very skilled at first base. I think some of them may have to do with what will be the NAC strategy. for 2020. Everyone assumes it's still going to be a retooling year, as they like to say, with plans to compete the following year.

I think that's misguided. I think every year they waste with Juan Soto on the roster is a crime. So I think they should stock up in the offseason to compete in 2022. And I think if that's the case, you'd see Ryan Zimmerman come back. come back here yes do you think there's a chance that he would play elsewhere next year no absolutely

100% not okay because if it is his final weekend as a nat he is the face the player face of this franchise after it moved from Montreal to Washington yes absolutely drafted in 2005 wanted Jim Bowden's smart moves and wound up coming up with the team

in September So he's been in a major league uniform with the Nationals since they, since their first year here. Absolutely. And he's done nothing, but make you feel proud that Ryan Zimmerman has been on your team. 100%. Yeah. You know, the Nats are going to play a significant role this weekend in the American League wildcard race because they finish with the Red Sox at home. And the, you know, I don't know how closely you're following this.

Actually, two nights ago, I watched the Phillies and the Braves game. It's actually a really dramatic ninth inning. They lost again last night to the Braves. So they're done now. They're four and a half back. I don't even know what the Braves magic number is, but it's got to be like one or two at this point. They're four and a half back, and they played 158.

So they only have four games left. So literally they'd have to run the table and the Braves would have to lose, including their makeup game. which they would potentially play the day after the season. So the Braves are going to win the National League East. But in the American League wild card race, it has become amazing how many teams are in it. The Yankees right now have a game lead for the first wild card spot over the Red Sox. The Red Sox come to D.C. tomorrow night to finish up the season with a three-game weekend set.

The Red Sox have a half-game lead on Seattle who's been surging over the last two weeks. and a one-game lead over Toronto. So, you know, this is four teams for two spots coming down to the final, you know, four days of the season. That's really where the drama is in baseball right now, because the National League East now is essentially with the first two going to Atlanta in this series against the Phillies is going to be the Braves. And the Giants do have a two-game lead over the Dodgers. So that's big because you don't want to play the wild card game and have a one-game possibility. The Giants, I think, finish up with San Diego.

And I think the Dodgers finish up with, is it the Rockies? Oh, no, Milwaukee. They've got Milwaukee at home after another game with the Padres tonight. I love this time of year with baseball, and I love starting next week. I think the drama of baseball playoff games is so way up there on my list. things that I enjoy as a sports fan.

Absolutely, because, I mean, you know, the things that maybe drive people crazy during the regular season, in the postseason, it seems like every pitch is a drama in itself. Yeah. You know, almost every single pitch. I'm pulling for Seattle. What's interesting is I'm pulling for Seattle to make it because Manny Acta is a coach on the Mariners. like to see him back in the postseason. He was with the Mets in the postseason of 2006.

And it's funny because his old team, the nationals could have an impact on making the playoffs based on how they played a Red Sox this weekend. Yeah. And the Orioles actually finish up, I think, with Toronto. So they could have a major impact as well. but the Nats, I mean, sort of an odd way to finish up, you know, a weekend set at home against the Red Sox to finish up the season. It's, you know, like, to be honest with you, I think it's poor scheduling for baseball scheduling, because I'm sure there's a point in which you can't accommodate everybody. But the Nats would much prefer to have had the Red Sox at a point where it's not in the middle of football season. on a Saturday and a Sunday for two of the three games. With that said, I would imagine there will be a lot of Red Sox fans in the stadium this weekend, a ton.

I would imagine so. I mean, because when the Red Sox come to Camden Yards, they fill up that place. Yeah, so they'll be at Nat's Park rooting for them to snag that last wild card spot. I'm sure baseball's rooting for a Yankees Red Sox one-night wild card game, which would I think be Tuesday night. I think that's when the American League game is. I think Tuesday night's American League and Wednesday night's the National League wildcard game. And the Cardinals, by the way, Tommy, their 17 game winning straight came to an end yesterday.

But my God, 17 in a row they won. And they'll have a more likely than not, they're going to have a one-game wild card match up with the Dodgers. You know, a team that at the beginning of the year, remember when we talked about this at the beginning of the year, and I shared with you that guys that, you know, really bet baseball were telling me that the Dodgers were one of the biggest preseason and then first week of the season favorites to win a World Series that they had ever seen. Like they were a massive favorite to win the whole thing early in the season. And they started off, if I recall, their season on fire.

And then literally they had like a big time losing streak against, I want to say it was San Diego. They started to lose a bunch of games to the Padres. and they're not going to win their division. I mean, the Giants are. The Giants certainly were not predicted to win the National League West. No, the Giants are a remarkable story, how they've managed to put together a team that never loses. I mean, I think that the Dodgers are on a tremendous streak right now in terms of winning, not necessarily winning every game, but I think their record in the last 20 games is remarkable.

and I think they gained one game on the Giants. Yeah, they're too bad. You know, that would be a division series round. That would be if the Dodgers were to beat the Cardinals, they would play the Giants because the Giants would be the overall best record and the wild card would be playing the team with the best record. So that's what you would get. In essence, unless you think the Brewers are as good as either one of these two teams,

you would get the best two teams in the National League and the divisional round. Well, we're East Coast-centric, obviously. So we talk about the Yankees and the Red Sox. The Giants and the Dodgers is a blood feud that dates back to when they were in New York together. That is a remarkable, remarkable rivalry. Be a hell of a series, too. I mean, just the Dodgers starting pitchers, right? Max, Kirshaw,

Bueller, right, Urius, I mean, they, and seeing Tray Turner out there, that'd be a hell of a series. That'd be best of five, too. Yeah, go ahead, sorry. There's some people I think this is the greatest

Dodgers team ever. Yeah, and they're not going to win. And they're going to win probably a hundred and four hundred and five games and not win the division. Yeah, which is amazing. amazing, considering those Brooklyn Dodger teams had so many Hallfamers on it, but I think you could make the case that this Dodgers team may be the greatest talent, the most talented team they've ever assembled.

All right. What else you got? I got nothing else for you, boss. Oh, well, you know what? You know what this is going on on Saturday? What? Sunday, I mean. No, Saturday.

My high school reunion. Oh, my God. that's this weekend. Yes, it is. Did you find an appropriate venue? Did you get all the... Oh, yeah. No, no.

We're cool. I mean, a guy we went to school with has a great restaurant with a great outdoor seating area. The weather's supposed to be 72 and sunny. So we're looking forward to a great event. That's awesome. All right. On tomorrow's show, very likely, Cooley. Also, we will get you ready for Maryland, Iowa.

tomorrow night. Big game for the Terps. All right, back tomorrow.