The Kevin Sheehan Show - JD Cleared To Practice; Unlikely For Denver

Episode Date: November 25, 2025

Kevin opened with the news that Jayden Daniels was cleared to practice this week even though he's unlikely to play Sunday night against Denver. Kevin reacted to some of what Dan Quinn said today about Jayden's eventual return. Kevin talked about yesterday's exciting day in the NFL before welcoming Herm Edwards onto the show. Herm talked Jayden Daniels, the NFL and a lot more including his role on one of the most famous plays in NFL history. For all your football betting needs: DCRELOAD at MyBookie for a 50% Deposit Match Want to spruce up your lawn? FastGrowingTrees.com Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it, you don't need it, but you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Sheehan Show, here's Kevin. Hey, Dan, I know you want to focus on what's right now, but with Jayden Daniels, the fourths out, but if you're returning to practice this week, I'm just curious what you can tell about what you'll be able to do this week. Yeah, it has been good. He will be able to return to practice. We had our first session today, but Johnny has not been clear for contacts. that you know probably be unlikely to play but man it's good to get started and get the return

to play going so that's a big deal for us. Dan Quinn earlier today on Jaden Daniels returning to practice, no contact yet and it would appear based on what Quinn said he's not going to go Sunday night against Denver and Landover. But maybe the following week in Minnesota against the Vikings, the show's presenting sponsors is always window nation, 86690 nation, windownation.com if you need new windows. On the show with me today, Herm Edwards. Herm, of course, coached Jaden Daniels at Arizona State. We've had Herm on the show before. We'll get his thoughts on whether or not he thinks Jaden should play

the final portion of the season. Real quickly, by the way, no smell test tonight on the Monday night game. I had mentioned on Friday that I might give Carolina out as one final smell test pick for this weekend, but I am passing on the Panthers tonight. Six, three and one smell test this past weekend. It's ridiculous, honestly, the way the season is gone. Jeff in Fairfax begged me to stop saying a correctionist coming. He writes, You've not only talked me out of playing your picks the last two weeks. I've actually gone against them. Please just own it.

You've been on fire, and it doesn't look like it's going to end anytime soon. Oh, Jeff, it will end. I wish I knew when it would end because then I would just pass. I would take the weekend off, but it will end. But I get it. I know you're not the first person to be annoyed with me the last three or four weeks, five weeks maybe saying, you know, warning, warning, these picks are the picks, but they're going to lose at some point. You know, what it is really for me, I am superstitious. I am superstitious.

Not like OCD superstitious, but as Michael Scott would say, I'm a little stitious. And I've talked so many times over the years about how, you know, our favorite football organization, just under, you know, Dan Snyder, overpromised and underdelivered, you know, over and over again. It was always overpromising in the spring and the summer and constantly under delivering. I like it the other way. I like the Joe Gibbs way. Under promise, over-deliver. Not over-promise, under-deliver. Under-promise, over-deliver.

Overdeliver is what the smell test is done this year. I will concede that. 87, 50, and 10 on the season. So approaching 64%. By the way, in the NFL, going back to Thursday night, underdogs, 9, 3, and 2. The last two weeks, 18, 8, and 3 underdogs are. When you see underdogs covering, that's usually a really good sign for the smell test.

Big day in the NFL yesterday, wild games for the second straight week. I'll go through some of those games in the next segment before Herm Edwards joins the show. So we've got this update from the head coach on Jaden Daniels. He's likely going to be cleared soon, not in time for the Denver game on Sunday night. but I'm guessing the Minnesota game the following week is a decent bet. Quinn also today said that Terry McClorn is getting close, and they announced that they opened up the 21-day practice window for Noah Brown. So there is an increasing possibility, probability that when Jaden's ready to play and he's cleared,

he might have most of, if not all of his guys out there with him. I know some of you don't want to see it. I do. I've taken calls on the radio show. I've read some of your tweets and emails. Some of you don't think that playing games in a season that's lost makes much sense. You think the risk is too high. Look, I've been consistent on this, and I'll just add to it.

I honestly think that that viewpoint is just kind of silly. You know, Jaden Daniels is the franchises. starting quarterback. I don't care if it's his second season, fifth season, 10th season. When you're the starting quarterback and you're the franchise starting quarterback and you're healthy,

you play with five to six games left in your season. Your time for sitting may come, you know, in the final week or two sometimes, but not with 30% plus of the season left. Now, let me be clear about one thing. Tommy and I, I think, talked about this the other day. He's not playing unless he's 100% healthy, 100% cleared. Nobody is saying that he should go out there less than 100%.

Like, yeah, the elbow looks really good. It's his non-throwing elbow. It's not perfect yet, but he should be fine. No, he's only going out there if there's nothing wrong with the elbow, nothing wrong with the knee, nothing wrong with the hamstring. he's Jaden, health-wise, because these games aren't for playoff positioning. But he is the starting quarterback. You know, there are other reasons why he should play.

You know, we've talked about those. He needs the reps. He's a second-year quarterback who's only played five and a half games this year, and he needs the reps. The reason that, you know, other guys are playing, he's the starting quarterback. How do you justify to everybody else in the game? that locker room, hey, you know, he's the only guy that's worth protecting, you know, with five games left in the regular season. You know, those are good reasons, but it starts with he's the

starting quarterback. And assuming he's 100% healthy, he's playing with five games left in the season or four games left in the season because that's what you do. You don't shut down the starting quarterback with nearly a third of the season left. Starting quarterbacks start and play when they're healthy in late November and early and mid-December. If you want him to sit on January 4th in the season finale in Philadelphia, if he's looked good and the offense has performed at a reasonable level for four or five games in a row, sure. By the way, if you get to that point, let Josh Johnson quarterback the game. You know, don't even risk putting Marioada out there for that one. But at Minnesota, at the Giants, Philly, then Dallas at home,

you know, over a four to five, you know, day stretch, Philly on Saturday the 20th, Dallas on Christmas Day. Yeah, it makes no sense from my standpoint why your starting quarterback wouldn't play in those games. I got this from T.J., T. TJ wrote, playing Jaden in games where the final result doesn't mean anything is a waste. It's not really a good evaluation of anything. So I think I know what you're saying, TJ, like if they're mathematically eliminated from, you know, the postseason, the games technically mean nothing. Therefore, you don't think you can assess or evaluate where he or anybody is at that point. Look, I think there is something to be said for that. You know, I think playing in meaningful games is the ultimate measurement when it's

meaningful for you, and by the way, the opponent, that's the ultimate way to measure. That's why before you're mathematically eliminated, every regular season game is a real evaluation. It's certainly, though, not a preseason game if you're mathematically eliminated. It's not that, you know, because you are playing against other starters. And by the way, the motivation for all of these players, especially when you're playing in late November, early to mid-December, is to continue to put your best out there on tape.

And by the way, try to win the game. I do think, T.J, that if they're playing a team that has something to play for, and they may, when they face Philly twice in Dallas over the final three weeks of the season, and, you know, I think that makes it feel like a legit evaluation. The opportunity and the motivation to say hurt the playoff prospects or the playoff positioning or a division title, that makes it a pretty legit environment for an evaluation.

I know it's the spoiler role, but personally, like the games against Minnesota and the Giants, Minnesota probably won't be eliminated, although they might be. And now it looks like J.J. McCarthy's got a concussion. He may not. He's been awful. But when you get to that Philadelphia game on December 20th, let's just say that they've lost another game or two in Dallas's closing ground, I would love it to put it to Philadelphia in that game. If Dallas is playing for a playoff spot on Christmas Day, if they're playing for their playoff lives in the next to last game of the season, I would love it. to see Jaden go out there with the offense and light them up and eliminate them.

Anyway, starting quarterbacks, when they're healthy, they start games. Maybe not the season finale, but everything else you play. This was Dan Quinn on the importance of seeing Jaden play again this year. I think it's important as Jaden's getting going. learning to play, like, this position at the highest level, competitively, also doing it safely. And those are reps, you know, that you develop as well. It's a skill just like throwing and processing. And so all those things are important.

So Dan Quinn's answer on that question is really, you know, some of the other reasons, not just because he's our starting quarterback, but that, you know, it's a position he's got to get reps at to play it at the highest. level. He also suggested he's got to get reps to learn how to do it safely. Those are reps too, you know, just like throwing and processing. Part of me thinks that, you know, the answer is what I kind of just talked about before playing this soundbite. There's five games left in the season, guys. He's our starting quarterback. He needs to play because you don't get better at playing football, whether you're in year two, year five, or year eight without playing football. But you got that from Quinn. Then he was asked a little bit later on in today's press conference on when he expects

Daniels to return. So he's asked specifically about the return. But the second part of the question is, if the team considered shutting him down, here's what Quinn said. You said Jayden's unlikely to play against Denver. Do you have in mind kind of a calendar or an expectation for when you think you'll see him on the field in a game? And was there at any point any consideration at all to saying let's shut him down? Yeah, the first part, Howard, I'll say I didn't have a long-term space until you got more spots from the doctors, meaning how's the healing coming?

where is that going to go, the extension and flexion of the elbow. So once we knew that was headed in the right direction, then that, you know, it would kind of take care of itself. When, you know, one week, two weeks, three weeks, that part, I don't know, and I still don't have all the answers on that. That's kind of how the player heals and where he's at. And then as far as not, that's not something we really discussed internally. The first part for us, honestly, Howard, was like,

how are we going to get the player better? and let's dig in on that first, not knowing the exact time frame. So that's really where the focus was, you know, right away and right out the bat. We knew we had the buy coming, and then we'd have a chance to regroup and huddle up and, you know, kind of push from there. So the most interesting part of Dan Quinn's answer is answering the part of the question about whether or not they considered shutting Jaden Daniels down. And he said, that's not something we really discussed internally. Now, most of the answer was focused on, you know, these first few weeks post the injury and, you know, making sure that it was headed in the right direction and that he was going to heal and it was going to be okay and that it wasn't serious. We're coming up on the fourth week, you know, this Sunday night when they take the field against Denver, that'll be four weeks since that Seattle game.

You know, they played Seattle, then they played Detroit, then they played Madrid, then they just had the buy week. So it'll be four weeks on Sunday night from the time he got hurt. And there was a lot of conversation. You know, we shared some of it here on the show that it wasn't serious. And they kind of knew that, you know, a few days after the injury and that it was going to end up being somewhere in the neighborhood of a four week or so injury. And that's what it turns out. It's going to be maybe a five week when he actually returns. By the way, speaking of the injury, remember it happened at the end of that Seattle game,

and I think I wasn't the only one who was critical of it. I think basically everybody was critical of having him in the game, but not only having him in the game, but having him in the game, throwing the football, two dropbacks on that final drive before the RPO that was called the play that he got hurt on. I got this from Dave. Dave writes, hey, Kevin, thanks for taking my call. noticing that Matt Stafford is still in the game up by 27 with four minutes left to go. Thoughts on this? I'll hang up and listen. Thank you, Dave, for that.

Yeah, you know what Matt Stafford was doing up 27 with four minutes left to go? Actually, with nine and a half, ten minutes to go in the game, handing the ball off over and over again. Not one pass attempt in the final ten minutes on their final two drives when they were up 34 to 7 last night against Tampa Bay. And I said, as far as the Seattle game goes, if you're going to have him in the game, he hands the ball off. Maybe a quick bubble screen, if that's what you want, down 3814.

But nothing that puts him at risk, and that's not how they handled it. Two totally different situations, Dave. Anyway, but I, to be honest with you, I watched that game until the end last night. I thought they should take them out. Like, what are you doing having Matt Stafford in the game? What if he turns to hand the ball off and the ball's fumbled and he jumps on it and somebody jumps on him? You know, the only way to ensure that up 34-7, your MVP quarterback, and that's what Matt Stafford is right now.

He's probably the MVP of the league on probably the best team in the league, is to take him out. But you see a lot of starting quarterbacks finish out games even when they're up. You know who never came out of a game, Joe Thaisman? And he played in a lot of games in which Washington had a massive lead. But what did they do? They turned and hand the ball off to the running back, which was usually Rigo. But, yeah, a little bit different than I think, Dave, your intention in terms of the way it was playing out over the last nine and a half, ten minutes of that game. Speaking of that game, that game and a lot of others from yesterday's very exciting.

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Down 21-0-0, the Cowboys scored the final 24 points of the game. Jay Gruden hits on another lock of the week. He's now six of his last seven on this podcast. What a football game, not because it was well-played. throughout. Sometimes the most memorable games are games that are a little dirty. This one was one of them. This segment of the show brought to you by MyBooky, if you want to bet on sports, my recommendation, is to do it at My Booky, where they're offering a 50% cash bonus to all of my listeners. New customer, existing customer, doesn't matter. Go to the Kevin Sheeonshow.com slash my bookie and use my promo code, DC, reload and they will either reload your account with a 50% cash bonus or if you're a new

customer, they'll give you a 50% cash bonus. Whatever your deposit size is, take half of that and that's what they're going to add to the account. You deposit 100 bucks, they're going to put another 50 into the account. You'll have 150 to bet with. My bookies got it all, including all of next weekends. Point spreads, Denver right now. a six and a half point favorite over Washington. A little bit surprised that it's not more than a touchdown. I thought it would be. I know that we talked about that number,

and I think it was at seven, seven and a half last week at my bookie. It's down a little bit. I don't know. Seems, I mean, yeah, it seems like it's going to be one of those games that the public lines up on the favorite. And that I'm going to have to give out Washington again. we'll see. We have plenty of time before that one. And man, what a week of NFL football setting up. What a week of sports. This is one of my favorite weeks of the year. You've got so much college basketball here early in the week. Maryland plays UNLV at midnight tonight. Out in Vegas, they play Gonzaga at a moronite. So you get all the great college hoops. And then, obviously, on Thursday, what a triple header in the NFL. NFL with Packers, Lions, followed by Chiefs, Cowboys, which will likely be the most watched

regular season game in NFL history, followed by Cincinnati and Joe Burroughs return on Thanksgiving night against Baltimore. How about the Black Friday? Chicago at Philly, 8 and 3 against 8 and 3. And then we've got a full-fledged Saturday, I mean, college football, Navy plays. on Thanksgiving night. You get Navy playing against Memphis on Thanksgiving night.

That's a huge game in that conference. I think it is, although I don't even know where those standings are. And then you get all the games on Friday, and then, of course, Saturday, Ohio State, Michigan, Iron Bowl, all of the big rivalry games. Truly one of the great sports weekends of the year. This rivals to me NCAA tournament,

first and second round, but it might be better, especially with the holidays and happy Thanksgiving. I'll wish it to you again. I'm sure with Tommy tomorrow and maybe again on Wednesday's show. No Thursday show this week. There will be a Wednesday show and a Friday show. My bookie for all of your sports betting needs. Again, use my promo code, DC Reload. So let's start with Dallas, Philadelphia. You know, I mentioned, not a clean game. I mean, in this game, there were penalties galore, turnovers galore. How about 22 penalties totaling 165 yards of penalty yardage for turnovers? The Cowboys couldn't take advantage of either of Philadelphia's

turnovers. You got the Barclay Fumble. That didn't lead to points. You get the hit on the fumbled punt return, and after a first and goal run to the two or one and a half yard line, they dropped back three times and end up turning the ball over on downs. It was, I thought, really a game in which Dallas defensively own the line of scrimmage. I mean, this Quinn and Williams edition, wow. you know, along with, you know, the linebacker that they got, Logan Wilson from Cincinnati, but, you know, the Kenny Clark and Quinn and Williams' combination, Dallas held Philadelphia to 63 yards rushing, and Hertz had 33 of them.

Sequin Barclay was 10 for 22. I mean, has Dallas's defense gotten back close enough to average? that their very good offense could lead them to a big playoff, you know, run down the stretch. They're 5-5-1. Their schedule is brutal. Chiefs on Thanksgiving. Then the Lions on the road. They do have the Vikings at home, the Chargers at home, and they finish at Washington at Giants.

I would say for Dallas to get a wild card. Look, the division's not out of the realm, but, you know, 8 and 3, 5, 5, and 1. Philly's schedule, pretty rough. as well. I mean, the Eagles have the bears on Black Friday. They play at the Chargers. They have to play at the Bills. But they do have games against the Raiders and Washington twice. I mean, Washington may play a huge role in the NFC East race. But the Cowboys, to me, have to probably get to 10, 6, and 1. They're 5.5 and 1 right now. They probably can afford one more loss. And that's it. And the way I see it, if you're a cowboy fan, and I know that there are several of you

out there, you got the chiefs and the lions in the next two on Thursdays. You need a split to get to 6-6-1, and then Vikings Chargers at home at Washington on Christmas, at Giants to finish. Can you go 4-0 over those last four? You'd probably be favored in all of them to get to 10-6-1. 10-6-1 might get the Cowboys the 7-seat when all is said and done. It's really a fascinating year in the NFL, and it's really a shame Washington's not a part of these playoff stakes games because there are going to be so many of them because there are so many teams in each conference that are in the mix. But what a comeback by Dallas. Their third time in history coming back from 21 down, that's the most for them in franchise history. We remember one of them. Opening day 1999, Rocket Ishmael, 76 yards from Troy Aitman in overtime to beat Washington, 41 to 35.35. They trailed 35, 14, entering the fourth quarter of that game. Yeah. But look, overall, Philadelphia, I thought, got manhandled at the line of scrimmage. I thought Dallas's defensive front, along with George Pickens, they were the stories of the game. Look, Philly,

Jalen Hertz came out and really A.J. Brown, no targets. How about 10 targets and eight catches for 110 yards? DeVante Smith, 11 targets, six catches. 21 targets, 14 receptions for 199 yards for those two. They couldn't run the football against Dallas's front. So we'll see. Crazy game, entertaining game, NFC East rivalry of the day now. I mean, it is Dallas, Philly. I hate that. that about where our team has gotten to. I mean, last year it was great to have those three games against the Eagles. This year, we're taking a year off from any rivalry games, even though we have only played two division games at this point. The other massive game of the day, Kansas City comes back from 11 down in the fourth quarter to beat the Colts, 23 to 20. The Chiefs are more than just

alive. Mahomes was outstanding in the game. What was really interesting about this game was the possession difference. How about this in this particular game? Kansas City, 42 minutes and 35 seconds of possession. The Colts 25 minutes and 28 seconds. 91 snaps offensively for Kansas City in an overtime game. 50 for Indianapolis. 41 more offensive snaps for Kansas City. They had 33 first downs to Indies 10. With that said, I'm impressed with Indy. I was impressed in this game. You know, Daniel Jones didn't get it done down the stretch,

but he didn't kill him like he did the last two weeks. It cost him, you know, certainly against Pittsburgh, not so much against Atlanta in the game in Berlin. But this was a hell of a football game by two really good teams, and the Chiefs really, you know, kind of saved their season with as many teams that are in the hunt in the AFC and sets up this, you know, Kansas City and Dallas, both roaring back from big deficits.

They're going to play Thanksgiving Day at 4.30 and what will be again, they are expecting it to be the most watched regular season game in NFL history. Let's run through the rest of the games. The Bears beat the Steelers, 31 to 28. Pittsburgh missed Aaron Rogers, no matter what you think of Aaron Rogers.

Mason Rudolph, a pick and a fumble in the game. tell you where Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh's gotten better in creating plays defensively, and their running backs, Warren and Gainwell are pretty good. But Chicago, man, they just keep winning these close games. They've now won four straight by five, four, two, and three. And they are eight and three atop the NFC North. Meantime, Pittsburgh falls to six and five, Baltimore now, based on tiebreakers, even though they haven't played Pittsburgh yet, with their win over the Jets, and it was not impressive, they are six and five and in first place. The Ravens, look, the Jets were a smell test pick, so I was paying attention to this game.

Let me just say this. Lamar Jackson doesn't look right. He ran yesterday seven times for 11 yards. Here are his rushing totals since coming back, all right, from injury. 5 for 14, 9 for 36, 4 for 10, 7 for 11. He's not right. He's not right physically. And he, three straight games,

58.6% completion percentage, 56%, and then yesterday, 56.5% completion percentage. I don't, I'm not buying the Ravens yet. I know they've won five in a row and they've gone from 1 and 5 to 6 and 5, but they've beaten the last four games, the Dolphins, Vikings, Browns, and Jets. And they haven't looked impressive doing it. And something does not appear to be right with Lamar Jackson.

Patriots got to 10 and 2 with a win over the Bengals entertaining game. Look, Drake May threw a bad pick six. He was high on a couple of his first few throws. He looked off Cincinnati's defense, the worst in modern NFL history, maybe one of the worst. Well, DVOA-wise, Aaron Shats, was on last week with me on radio, said they're the worst defense ever measured. But like I've said about Drake May, this dude is resilient. He's tough. He came back after a slow

start, threw for 294. They kept getting stopped and stopping themselves in the red zone in this particular game. They were in the red zone, 0 for 2. They had fourth and goals they went but they held on 2620. Flacco had them down to the 25-yard line at the end, and they couldn't get it in to pull off what would have been a pretty big upset and would have kept them actually alive in that AFC North. But now they're 3 and 8 Burroughs coming back on Thanksgiving night.

They do play the Ravens twice, so they could certainly impact the race in the AFC North, but New England at 10 and 2. Wow. The giant lion game. The lions don't look right in a couple of spots, but they do look right with Jemir Gibbs, who rushed for 219 yards. Is there a faster running back in the league? I don't think so. Jared Gough got pressured. James Winston, why wasn't he starting at the beginning of the season over Russell Wilson? I'm sure you saw the play, the double pass that he caught, broke a tackle and scored a touchdown. He threw for 366. as well. But again, the Giants blew a double-digit lead and lost in overtime. They fired Shane Bowen their defensive coordinator today. I'll tell you what, that giant job in the offseason, that's going to be a sought-after job. They've got talent. Meantime, I don't know what they're thinking in Minnesota. Look, I was not a J.J. McCarthy guy, but it's too early, way too

early. But he looks terrible. He was concussed yesterday. That was reported earlier today. There was a line on one of the pregame shows that I heard somebody mentioned that Kevin O'Connell last week said that they needed to reinvent J.J. McCarthy's mechanics? What? 12 of 1987 yards, two interceptions for J.J. McCarthy, who does not look the part here among the 24 drafted quarterbacks in the first round. Again, seven starts now. It's way too early. He wasn't my favorite because I just didn't see him as an NFL passer. I saw him as a tough competitor, super smart, but they played at Michigan. He played at Michigan. They ran the ball. They were a run first team. There was that game against Penn State where he didn't throw a pass in the second half, and they won the game. But again, it is early to make any kind of declaration on players. See Emmanuel Forbes, boys and girls. Emmanuel Forbes yesterday, last night in their win over Tampa, the Rams went over Tampa, the highest graded player in the game did not allow

one reception on seven targets faced. He's turned into an excellent player. You can't give up on these guys. I'm not saying the team made a mistake, clearly, or maybe it just wasn't a good fit here. Who knows what the story is? I'm saying as fans, you've got to let it marinate. These draft choices cannot be judged.

Seven, eight games into their rookie season or seven to eight games into their second season. Emmanuel Forbes is turning into a lights-out corner. Great team, great defense. You know, they're in positions where they've got the lead. It's a perfect situation for him. I will say this. I have no issues with any player that Adam Peters is drafted in his first two drafts.

Why? It's my same answer. Stock answer. It's too early. Got to give it three years. I have a bigger problem that a player like Emmanuel Forbes who was in their building, isn't anymore. I have a bigger problem that Zane Gonzalez is kicking his ass off in Atlanta, and Washington's got kicker problems. The Rams, to me, 34-7 last night over the bucks,

Baker Mayfield got hurt, but apparently it's not serious. I think the Rams are the best team in the league. I think Seattle's the second best team. I think we saw last week a matchup between the two best teams. But among those two, give me Stafford over Darnold, give me McVeigh and his staff, over Mike McDonald, great staff, not saying anything other than that. They don't have a weakness. They have one of the best starting past receiving duos in the league in Nakuwa and Adams. Kyron Williams is excellent. Matt Stafford is the MVP right now.

Their defenses lights out. By the way, Cam Curl playing at a super high level. They let him go in free agency before 24. They're the team, and Tampa is struggling right now. and Carolina is tied with the Buccaneers right now. They still have two games left with the Bucks. They could take the first place overall if they were to beat the 49ers tonight. What else from yesterday?

Shadur Sanders. I mean, it wasn't, I didn't watch any of it. I'm just looking at the highlights. I mean, look, he had a week. It wasn't as bad as last week, but it didn't look like it was very good. either. The Raiders are horrible. The Jags beat the Cardinals in overtime. Man, no one wants to kick field goals up three late. They passed on a field goal. They missed on fourth down. The Cardinals forced overtime. What were there? There were three overtime games yesterday, right? We had Giants,

lions in overtime, Colts, Chiefs in overtime, Jags, Cardinals, and overtime. That's a hell of a day. Falcons beat the Saints. Kirk looked really good. I had that game on. I had Philly, Dallas, obviously, in the main screen. It helps when they're running him under center, which they didn't do enough last year. I think he convinced Zach Robinson. We've got to go under center. We've got to get me into more play action.

He looked pretty sharp, and the Falcons beat the Saints 24 to 10. By the way, you know who's playing pretty well? Chase Young is playing pretty well. Speaking of, you know, draft picks that you got to wait on. He had all those injuries. Obviously, that was the big deal here. He had a sack. I think he's got a sack in three of his last four games for the Saints.

Anyway, I think that's it. From the weekend from Saturday, man, Maryland was not close. I was not correct on that. I thought that they would play Michigan tougher. I'm impressed, man, with Notre Dame. I know Syracuse stinks, but I think Notre Dame's legit. and I think they got a chance to win the national championship. It wouldn't surprise me if they are certainly among the final four,

if not the final two. All right, let's get to Herm Edwards. We'll do so right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Have you ever fallen for a scam or know someone who has? Well, the holidays are all about finding the perfect gift. This time of year, however, not every deal is what it seems. Scammers are getting more creative to trick people into sharing their payment information through methods like fake shopping sites and

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think you can beat the offer right now. 50% off everything plus zero percent interest for five years. 86690 Nation, windownation.com. All right, joining me right now, Herm Edwards. Most of you know, Herm from ESPN, he does a phenomenal job as an NFL analyst. Most of you know that he coached Jaden Daniels at Arizona State. Most of you know that Herm was a two-time NFL head coach with the Jets and the Chiefs in the 2000s. And at least some of you know that he was one hell of a player with the Philadelphia Eagles in the 70s into the 80s and was involved in one of the most famous plays in NFL history, the 1978 Miracle in the Meadowlands play. We, may talk about that. We've talked about that play with coach before. Maybe we'll come back to it

at the end. But, you know, it's interesting. I was looking in preparation for talking with you this afternoon at the years in which you were coaching in New York and then in Kansas City. And one of the things that is really interesting about your very first head coaching job in New York with the Jets is it came in the 2001 season. That, of course, was opening day, September 9th, and then two days later, 9-11. And then when you guys came back with the rest of the league after a week off, following 9-11, you faced Tom Brady, Bill Pelichick, and the New England Patriots in that week two,

which actually was week three that year because of 9-11, but that was the year that they ended up winning their first Super Bowl. So I want to ask you about what you thought of the Patriots here in a moment, but what are your recollections about being a first-time head coach and after your first game as a coach, 9-11 happens? Well, I can remember the cancellation of the games, and then obviously our first game back, we were going to play the New England Patriots in New England in Foxborough.

And I can remember visiting with Coach Belichick on the side. sideline in the pregame. We were just sitting there talking, you know, and there were a lot of flags, obviously, opening day at any ballpark, but especially in New England. You know, you can imagine their colors are red, white, and blue as well. So a lot of flags being flown, and we both standing there and looking at each other, and we both looked at each other and said almost the same thing, said, you know, I said, I don't know how my guys are going to play. And he said, I'm the same way. I have no idea what's going to happen. I said, coach, you and just enjoy it. We're back to playing football that says enjoy today.

And we had no idea how we were going to play and how those players were going to play. None. Zero, right? And it was just, we just want to get back to playing football. And when they sang that national anthem, there was not a dry eye in the stadium. It was unbelievable.

I'll never forget it. It's like, wow. And then you just, things like that, you put in your brain and you go, you know what? I mean, the red, white, and blue flag in America, was never more powerful for me growing up. My father was the military man. You know, I saluted the flag every day going up.

I mean, I get it. I get all that. But that day was something special. Yeah. It was emotional everywhere. I mean, I remember the Skins actually played the first Monday night game after 9-11. Marty Schottenheimer was coaching his one and only season here. And the season did not start off well.

I'm trying to think, you probably coached against Marty a couple of times, right? When he was in San Diego, I'm guessing. Yeah, but I'll take it further than that. I was on Marty's staff in Kansas City. Oh, right, of course. Of course. So, yeah, but you're right. Yeah, I coached against him when he was with Chargers and I was with the Jet, yeah.

Yeah, you, in fact, you guys played, I think, a playoff game together that you guys one out there. But, you know, that particular season, and I want to come back to the Patriots in a moment, that particular season, Marty, in his first and only year, under, you know, horrible ownership, as we all know, started off 0 and 5, and Herm, he went 8 and 3 over the final 11 with Tony Banks, a quarterback. And anybody that knew anything about football was like, okay, finally, We're about, you know, as a Redskins fan, we're about to be back.

And then Snyder said that he didn't want it to continue that way anymore. So anyway, back to the Patriots. Did you have any sense early in that season or when you played them later in the season? You played them later in the season and lost by a point at home. Your team was a 10 and 16, went to the postseason, played the Raiders before the Raiders would eventually play the Patriots. in that famous snow game. But did you have a sense at any point that the Patriots were going to make this run that they eventually, you know, made?

No, and it's funny because that was Brady, you were correct? If I recall right? Yeah, well, it was not only Brady, but, you know, it was the season of Brady and Bledsoe. Yeah, and that's, and I know this because when we had played earlier, we knocked Bledso out. In the first game? Yes, in New England. Yeah.

And Bletso is running on the side and we hit him and he lands down by my feet. And I go, I'm hollering for our trainer as well. They come over and get him and then all of a sudden he leaves the game and then comes number 12. And we beat him that day. It was a low-scorer affair. And from that day, Tom Brady became the starter.

He became the starter. and then Bledsoe, remember, got the opportunity briefly in the postseason in the championship game against the Steelers. But, yeah, then Brady ended up coming in and starting the Super Bowl and the rest of history. So did you have any sense of Brady that early? Because you basically got to see him for his first real snaps. Yeah, you know, you know, you watched him. We knew we came out of Michigan, you know, we had got it in, but we didn't need a quarterback. We had Chad Pennington at that point, you know, young quarterback.

And, you know, you just, you didn't know he was going to be Captain America. Right. You know, he was Tom Brady, but you didn't know eventually he was going to be Captain America and win, what, six Super Bowls are how many they want. And so it's just kind of ironic, you know, it's like, you sit there and you go, okay, and here we go. And here he comes in the game. And it was a funky game. I think we won 10 to 6 or something like that.

10 to 3, yeah. And then 10 to 3, okay, and most scoring a fair. And then all of a sudden, the next time they played us at home, I think they beat us. and he was the quarterback and all of a sudden he just watched it grow you watched his you know

his excitement and everything that went along with it but no one that matches I don't even think anyone the Patriot fans didn't imagine what was about to happen you know it's so interesting right because we now

are in this era of like quarterbacks you know that we counted completely out that have resurrected their careers you know we're watching Daniel Jones this year we've seen Baker Mayfield we've seen Sam Darnold, and you coached and you played in an era where these guys were given plenty of time before they ever saw the field.

Right. No doubt. And then now, you know, you draft them, they got to play early. That's part of it because you're pressed and make them do that. And, you know, it's a different league now. I mean, it's the league that I played in and coached in for the most part, it was starting to turn a little bit, but it was still a running league. It was a balanced league offensively, but now it's surpassing league.

There's no doubt about it. I mean, you've got to be able to throw the football to score. I mean, and when you have a guy that can throw it, you know, you build your team that way. You know, you still want to run because you've got to run to win, but you've got to score points. You've got to throw the football because of the way, you know, defense is play anymore. And, you know, you draft that way defensively. You've got to get some guys that play on the perimeter, some edge, you know, some edge rushers, and you've got to get some corners that can cover.

And on offense, you've got to get some. some receivers they can catch it. You've got to have a quarterback, they can throw it, and here you go. You know, I'm just sitting here, and I'm going through some of those teams you had with the Jets and someone who comes on this show with me all the time, and is one of my favorite, you know, former Washington players. You had him as a very young player, and that's Santana Moss. What do you remember about Santana?

Yeah. Trapped him in the first round, you know, and came out of Miami, a lot of hype. And he was, you know, it was, early in his career was too big for him. It was too big for him. And he was a great returner. And, you know, he dropped a lot of balls early in his career. And then he found his way. You know, when he got to Washington, all of a sudden, he became the guy that we thought he was going to become.

It took him a couple of years. A lot of pressure on him, you know, being a first-round pick and being in New York is tough, man. It's just tough. It's just a tough way to be, you know. And to his credit, he found his way and went to Washington. And obviously, you know, had some great days in Washington. There's no doubt about that. All right.

Let's talk about the quarterback here now. Jaden Daniels in the difficult year that not only he's had with injuries, but the team has had. I'll get to the key question that everybody's asking here in a moment. But, you know, you watch this league every Sunday. You coach Jaden at Arizona State so you know the issues that this team's had this year with injuries just across the board. What have you made of, you know, year two of – he's only people. played five and a half games, but as his former coach, what did you see when he was out there? Oh, that obviously, you know, he is your franchise quarterback, and I think the more they're

around him, especially the offensive coordinator, and who basically Cliff Kingsbury is kind of unique. Cliff was on my roster with the Jets. We had one year where we had like five quarterbacks and he actually came on my roster and then you know cliff was in Arizona when I was at Arizona State right he knows jaden very well he watched him play you know so he couldn't have gone to a better organization and to fit the system around him with obviously cliff being the coach so I just think that it's a he's in a good place a great organization I told him that when he got drafted I say man you're the place he got great history now and just understand that and

And this fan base will, they will circle the wagons around you, man, if he do what you got to do. And obviously, they have done that. He's just got to get well again. You know, and he's not an injury guy. I know people, he's a little, I know his time with me, he never missed anything. Never missed practice, never missed the game. So, you know, in high school, he never missed practice, never missed games. So, LSU did miss games, didn't miss practice.

So, you know, it's just unfortunate what happened to him, but he'll get well. them back and they got their quarterback. So he was cleared, you know, to practice, but no contact yet. And earlier today, Dan Quinn said that, you know, he's going to be in practice, but unlikely to play on Sunday night against Denver. But I think most of us now believe he could be ready and cleared to play against the Vikings the following week. How would you handle moving forward? there are fans that, you know, are angst-ridden about him heading back out there in games that don't matter. So where are you on the, he's got to play if he's healthy with four or five games left in the season versus trying to protect him? Well, look, and I understand the fans hesitate to, you know, they don't want him to get hurt again.

They went through that with Robert Griffin and all that. But I will tell you this, and I say this as a not as a coach. I don't say this is a coach about what I'm getting ready to say. When you're a football player, every game matters. They all matter. They do. And it doesn't matter how many you won, how many lost, they matter. Because, you know, your football, when you're a football player, it's not a career.

You can't say, well, I'm going to play for 10 years. No, you play week to week because you can get injured and you can be done. it's over. So it's not a career. It's an opportunity. And most guys that understand that, it doesn't matter how many you want or lost. You just want to play.

Yeah. Jayden wants to play. I know that kid. He wants to play football. That's what, see, I took people all the time. You know what football players do? They play football. Yeah.

That's what they do. When you're a football player, you play football. And it doesn't matter how many you want or lost. You go play football, man. So, you know, I don't, I'm not one to believe that, oh, well, save him for what? He's a football player. That's what you do. So would you as a head coach, you know, let's say that he comes back and they're three and nine with five games left.

They've been mathematically eliminated or close to it. Would you play him in a way that was more protective? Would there be plays that you wouldn't call? How would you treat that? Yeah, I mean, you know, I would play him in a sense of, you know, he wants to play. I want him to play. You know, one thing he doesn't have right now, he doesn't have a lot of professional experience. Right.

How do you get that? You got to play. I tell people a lot of time, but I have no experience. Well, you know why? Because you don't play. If he plays, that's how you get experience. So let him go play. And look, James Smart, I mean, it's just one of those freak accidents.

That's all it just happened. It's not. And I think, you know, did you run him on runs a lot? Probably not. Right, but you're giving some because you're looking at it going, hey, you know, okay. But at the end, I mean, you just let him play. And you tell him like I used to tell him, hey, man, no one, the journey's over and protect yourself. The group that he's had out there and even Marcus Mariotas had out there, I mean, his team's been, you know, decimated by injuries.

They just haven't had a full allotment really since almost week one. But, you know, it's possible he could get back out there with his guys, with Terry McLaurin, with Noah Brown, with, you know, Debo feeling good, and the offensive lines actually come around. But what if he doesn't? What if he's got, you know, these practice squad guys and guys they've pulled off the street, you know, over the last couple of, you know, of months to play NFL football? Does that change your thinking at all? No. And I think you call the game, according to the time. Cliff will call the game that way, like he knows the guys he has, and he's going to try to

design some things to get him open, and, you know, all Jayton can do is throw it to him. They got to catch it. They don't catch it. That's on them, you know, and they know that. But I think, you know, when you sit in Jaydon Daniels, you know, you walk in his shoes, I mean, he has to play. That's how he gains experience. And whether you have, you know, going to the playoffs or not, I mean, those are vital. to him. He's going to be, he'll be much better for it next year, the plan. He will be.

And you know what else will happen? I mean, his team already respects him, but they'll even have higher regard for him now because a lot of guys will say, man, that dude didn't need to play. He's playing. And if you're a fan, I know you're nervous, you don't want to get hurt, but when it all is dead and done, and he plays and he gets through this last stretch of games, you're going to go, man, we really respect this guy. This guy's, you know, he's our quarterback. So have you stayed in touch with him this year? Have you talked to him at all? Every once in a while we text, you know.

And he's busy, and I leave him alone, you know. I mean, if something's up here, he'll shoot me in a text or something. But I kind of leave him alone, you know, earlier in the season, you know, the preseason I was texting him in and out, you know, messing with him and laughing and, you know, and stuff like that. And when he played the Eagles, you know, I gave him a hard time. I said, I'd be nice to my former team now. Well, they haven't played him yet.

They got two of them at the end of the year. No. Oh, in the championship game, you mean? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. So I'm laughing, you know, stuff like that. Again, it's a very small sample size this year because he's only played five and a half games. But was there anything that you saw that, you know, you thought, okay, well, that's not exactly the way it looked last year?

Yeah, I mean, I think what they've done now, they've designed it to history. strength, and he's probably had some input in it, to knowing what he wants to do and what he likes. And that's what you've got to do. You've got to build the offense around the quarterback. And, you know, you have so many different variables to what you can do with him because you know, the first thing you realize

defensively, he gets your attention because his ability to make an announce play. And you're scared to death of that because it is ability to run. And Jayden's one of those guys, I tell people all the time, I say, look, he's a little bit of a long strider, but when he's running, it ain't for five yards.

All of a sudden, there's 20 yards, and he's down the field, and you're going, man, what? Yeah, he shocks you. You know, it's like, whoa, he just made a 20-yard run. Yeah, 20 yards ain't five. It's 20, and you go, oh, boy. Yeah. And so you're nervous, you know, and you've got to design your defense in the sense that when he goes back to throw, it's like, okay, who's spying the guy? We've got to have a guy on the rush that spying him, or we've got to have a linebacker sitting in that area,

because if he leaves the pocket, we've got to come tackle him, and then the problem is, first of all, the guy spying him. fast enough, you can't catch you. That is true, and we watched that all of last year. All right, real quickly on this crazy year. I mean, it was a crazy Sunday yesterday. I mean, New England, Denver, and

Indy right now at the top of the AFC standings, the Bears lead the NFC North. Carolina is tied for the NFC South before their game tonight. Give me the teams that you really believe in, like true teams that you truly believe can win it all?

Well, the best team right now on the NNC side is the round. Not even close. They're the most complete team right now. Quarterback is just playing out of his mind. He is playing really good. I mean, he's unbelievable. He's going to probably be MVP, but I said that five weeks ago. And they continue to win games.

That's one of the teams. I think, and then everybody else, you look at the NFC side, if you look at the North and you're going, okay, if a Chicago bear is that good, well, we're going to fight. out they're eight and three and every time we say they win another game so look the record indicates who they are now they got a tough schedule in the next the closing the schedule out they play green bay twice um i think they play they play kansas city so they play some playoff teams now we'll find out who they are um eagles you know stubbed their toe um Dallas beat them

but that didn't surprise me the the way they played and got away for the run And hopefully that's a lesson learned. They're not the same team they were last year, the Eagles, by any stretch of imagination. But they're still up a playoff football team. Seattle, obviously, is a good football team. They can stay in games in the fact that they're outstanding on defense. They're really, really good on defense. You know, Green Bay and Detroit, I mean, you know, they got the quarterback.

They got pedigree. You know, when they be getting the playoffs, and all these teams are playoff in contention, we'll see. On the AFC side, no matter what people say, New England, have 10 wins. They are what they are. Buffalo short-handed. Yeah. They got the quarterback. That's what they got.

And he's remarkable. The Ravens, are the Ravens kind of all of a sudden, the Lamar Jackson's going to look like Lamar Jackson. Yeah, he doesn't, does he? Tell me what you've seen. Now, I don't know if he's completely well. It just doesn't look like the same guy right now. Now, he's been out, so maybe he's trying to protect himself. Maybe he's not 100%, but he just, he doesn't look explosive right now to me when he plays.

You know, Pittsburgh is okay. But, you know, you're not afraid of Pittsburgh. The Colts are like, eh, you still don't trust him, right? It's just he, I don't know about the Colts, right? He just worries. Right. Look, Jacksonville Until Trevor Lawrence shows me

He can win some more games Like you did last week I don't trust them Now, the West Interesting in the West Denver Blanc is a good football team They got a really good defense too They don't give you points

They got a young quarterback They got one of the better Play callers in the league John Peyton Chargers are interested And I'm not quite sure yet and the Chiefs aren't dead yet. They just not.

And I think when they were sitting there at five and five hours, they're done. They ain't done yet now. You know, because they have great pedigree as far as playoff experience. I told everybody to the beginning of season, I said, you know what the Chiefs are? They're tired. They've played in so many extra games. They're just tired. Yeah.

The season, they were just, they're a war-out football team. And now they kind of got their sea legs back. So it's going to be interesting to see if they can make a run. yeah you know it's it's funny that you said it that way you know mohomes is having a much better season this year than he did last year and here they are they're fighting for their playoff lives but last year there were times where i said you know some of these close games it feels like it feels like they're bored and they want some close games just to have some excitement um tired maybe the more um you know accurate way of putting it but yeah it'll be interesting i mean we you know it'd be

weird to not see the Kansas City Chiefs come January. That's right. I mean, you know what's great, and you look at the slate of it, there's about nine or ten teams on either side of the slate in the NFC or the AFC that are still in contention. No doubt. And if you're a fan of one of those teams, you're excited the fact that, hey, if we can win 10 games or nine games, we got a shot.

And I tell everybody all the time, I said, look, Ken's the number. I said that two weeks ago. These teams that have five wins or more, it's a race to 10. It's a seven-game season. It's a race to 10. If you can get to 10, put 10 on the board, you're probably going to get in the playoff. Yeah, I actually talked about this already that this is one of those years. I agree with you.

I think the Rams right now, and I think Seattle's the second best team personally. But I trust Matt Stafford a hell of a lot more than Sam Darnold. But the games we've got coming up here over the last third of this season, I mean, just starting on Thursday with the Lions and the Packers and the Chiefs and the Cowboys, it's just going to be, because there are so many teams that aren't that far apart from one another, they're just going to be so many big games. I feel like there's more, you know, there's one team you didn't mention, and I talked about them Friday after they won on Thursday night.

Houston, to me, is a team that if they got in, their defense could carry them a long way. Do you agree or not? No, you're absolutely 100% correct. And they're a hard watch. They're not pleasing to the eye when you're watching. There's nothing like you watch them. I don't want to watch this. And then they win.

And you go, oh, boy, they won another game. You know, because you're right. They got another outstanding defense. Wow. Yeah. They still have the Colts twice. They still play the Colts twice. D'Amico's done a really good job.

and they pride yourself on it, you know, and they're going to be a hard out that they get in because you can't score a lot of points on them. All right. I do want to, you know, have you share your memories of one of the most famous plays in NFL history, The Miracle in the Meadowlands.

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It would bring them seven and five as they won. But a late interception by the Giants will preserve a giant victory. An upset win as the Giants lead 17 to 12 and were inside 30 seconds. The Eagles have no timeouts. Wait a minute. Here's a free fly. I don't believe it. The Eagles picking up and Herman Edwards runs it in for a touchdown.

An incredible development. just doesn't get the snap he just loses the snap doesn't get it and who's right there Herman Edwards picks it up on the dead running goes in for a touchdown the miracle in the meadowlands November 1978 is called by Don creaky and yes that was Sonny Jurgensen who was the game analyst that day on CBS the Giants up 17 to 12 30 seconds to go. They've got a first and 10, and Philly's got no timeouts left, and they ran a play. Joe Pesarchic fumbled trying to hand the ball off to Larry Zonka. The ball bounced right into the hands of Herm Edwards, who ran it back for a touchdown, and in Eagles' victory, 19 to 17.

And that really was the play, right, Herm, that started the victory formation, that started, you know, quarterbacks taking a knee rather than teams and offenses running actual plays when they could run the clock out. Correct. No, it was. And you're right. And everybody used to run that, you know, run a dive or something to try to kill the play. And the one took the knee.

And I can remember when the play took place the next week. Even in Philadelphia, we had the victory formation. We started running the victory formation, and it started popping up all through the league. They put the guy, and say, okay, going to take a knee. We're going to put a guy behind the quarterback, says in case the quarterback screws it up again. Yeah. And, you know, we're going to have a guy at least make the tackle. Because in practice, when we did it the first day of practice,

Rameel said, you go behind the quarterback. We fumbled and you pick it up again. That was kind of a joke, right? Yeah. But it was like that formation became bold. You know, and it's interesting because when I became a coach at Arizona State, you know, after all these years being on television, now I'm back on television, but I went back, and, you know, you put in all that stuff to specialty formations,

and we put the formation in during practice, you know, and we're getting ready to put it in, and we talked about it, and it kind of going on. And I said, and I asked the players because these young kids now, like this thing happened, what, 1978 or something like that? And so I told the kids, I said, you know why this formation is in, ball now and they're all looking oh coach that's what we do i said no do you know why it happened you know why people do this now and they go no so i put the tape on of the play yeah right you know and the kids are looking like oh my god and i said guys i said you see what happened when this team didn't

do this and they go oh my god and then i said who's picking up that ball and they're looking they go oh i don't know and i said that's me they go no coach that ain't you i said no that's me So it's kind of funny Because you know This era of football players They have no idea They just thought of for me Because that's what we do now

Coach I said But you know why this happened And I show them to play This is why this happened That It's kind of interesting Well here's Here's something else

About that season All together That game and that play puts you guys in the playoffs Ultimately It was the difference Between a playoff season And a non-playoff season

because you guys went 9 and 7 and that was the first Dick Vermeal team that made the postseason two years later you guys were in the Super Bowl for the Eagles' first Super Bowl trip. Yeah, it compelled our football team. And that was a game. We're standing around toward the end going,

and we should beat these. We should be. We're sick. I mean, we're flat sick on defense. We're sick. We're going, we don't lost this game. And here's the funny part. And people don't realize it.

Dick Vermil's back was turned away from the play. Oh, he never saw it? No, he had Jaworskin those guys on the sideline saying, we might get the ball back, and he had Harold and all those guys, and if we get the ball back, so what we're going to try to do. And as he was talking, the play happens. And all of a sudden, the players start running on the field, and Dick, he doesn't see the play.

He didn't see it happen. And he grabbed one of the players and where are you guys going? And one of them told him, Coach, Herm just scored a touchdown. And he looked around, I guess, and he thought, me, the end of him. He said, what's happening to this court? Coach, you picked the ball up. It was nuts. The great Larry Zonka involved with Joe Pissarchic, who was, I don't know, was he the starter that year? Maybe he was for the Giants. But the story gets better with Joe P. The next year, Joe P. comes to the Eagles.

Oh, really? The backup quarterback behind your work. To back up Jaws. Interesting. Well, they drafted Sims probably. Sims was probably the next year, yeah. Correct. So we know he's coming, and he's coming from our facilities.

Our locker rooms downstairs, the office were upstairs, and we got the call downstairs that he's coming. He's going to bring in the locker room to the team. So we're all standing in the locker room, and the door is closed, and they've got to open the door for him to come in. The whole team's standing there,

and Jaws are standing with me, and Jaws has the football. And when the door opens, the whole team's looking. and Jaws hollers. Play it again, Sam. He dropped the ball on the ground. I scoop it up and give it to Joe. That's funny. That's funny. The good old days of the NFC East and those were, I mean, think about it really. The Eagles had had a lot of bad years. I mean, the 70s really were about the skins and the cowboys more than anybody else. Correct. It's correct. Yeah. And you make a great point.

tell people all the time, people don't realize that division, the NFC East, and you mentioned it, Cowboys, okay, then it was Washington, then it was the Giants, it was also the Eagles. A lot of Super Bowls were played by teams that came out of NFC.

Oh, yeah. Still, still to this day, more Super Bowl appearances and more Super Bowl wins from NFC East teams. The Cardinals, the Cardinals did not make a Super Bowl appearance as part of the NFC East. They were long, gone into Arizona and part of the

NFC West. But yep, look, people forget, you know, I have to remind my boys, like, the Cardinals were in the NFC East and had some really good teams with Cori-L. Sure, they did. It had the heart, Mel Gray. They had some teams. Terry

Metcalf, yeah. Terry Medcalf, they were really good, boy. I mean, they were really, really good. Yeah, and that playing at Old Bush Stadium. Oh, my God. Yeah. Thanks for doing this. As always, hope you're well. all of your stuff on ESPN and enjoy the rest of the year. Happy Thanksgiving to you. Thank you, my friend. Herm Edwards, everybody. I've heard over and over again from people who have

had the chance to work with Herm, one of the real gentlemen in the business. All right, we are done for the day back tomorrow with Tommy.