The Kevin Sheehan Show - Missed Opportunity

Episode Date: November 7, 2022

Kevin on Washington's 20-17 loss to Minnesota yesterday. He had a detailed game recap and then had Doc Walker and Thom on the show to discuss.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheon Show. Here's Kevin. Protection good and Joseph nails it. Vikings have come from behind to take a three-point lead on the road with 12 seconds to go. And with that, Washington's three-game winning streak was over.

The kick came with 12 seconds to go. Should have been more time left on the clock. I will explain when we get. to my game take. But Washington gave up a 10-point lead in the fourth quarter, and Minnesota beats the black-shirted commanders. Yeah, they were in those alternate jerseys for the second time this year. Oh, and two in those jerseys, 20 to 17, the final in Landover. Doc Walker will be on the show with me, Tom Levero today on the show. Tommy can't do tomorrow, so he's just going to do a quick segment with me today.

And then he'll be back on his normal schedule later in the week on Thursday. I will get to my game take here shortly. But this tweet from Stephen, Stephen tweeted, please, please, please, no more Dan Snyder talk. I care about the football team and the three-game winning streak and the possibility that this team is becoming a good team, Kevin. Playoffs, dot, dot, dot. He just inserted playoffs.

I care about the football team. Talk more about that. Thank you, Stephen. You can tweet me at Kevin She and D.C. You can follow me on Twitter at Kevin Sheen, D.C. The only thing I can say to that is, you know, Stevens' tweet was one of a few that I got. There are a couple of you guys out there that kind of missed the big picture.

If you actually care about the football team, this should be the only story right now that you really care about. Yesterday's game and our discussion about it is ancillary. to the news last week that it looks like the nightmare is on the verge of ending. And that maybe for the first time in a quarter of a century, it will be a normal football operation and organization with a chance maybe to win. So it's the only thing that matters. It's the biggest story DC sports has had since the Nats won the World Series.

You could argue it's even bigger than that or the Stanley Cup because it's the football team. But I'll take championships over an ownership. change, but certainly the prospect that Dan is selling the whole team and that it could be done quickly is not only exciting news, it's the only news. This was Jay Glazer on Fox's pregame show yesterday, as all the pregame shows were talking about the Snyder news from earlier this week. But Jay Glazer is pretty dialed in, you know, to the league, to owners. This is what he said.

Oh, let's just sell everything. Look, we had Jim Hersey a couple weeks ago. say, hey, let's start talking about removing him as an owner, but you're not going to need that, Kurt, because exactly right. It's to sell the entire team. What I'm being told this, the asking price is going to go for about $7 billion. So Strayhan could certainly buy that team. Also, count me out.

Yeah, wouldn't that lot? The other interesting part, there was the timeline. This is not going to be a long, drawn-out process. I'm told that the hope is to have this done within the next six months and actually have it finalized by the NFL owners meeting next March. So three things there from Jay Glazer. One, he's selling the whole team. And I think, you know, this is really what we have sort of felt

and where the tea leaves were leading everybody. He can change his mind. You know, I'm still giving a 10% chance that he could change his mind. This thing isn't over until they go to closing. They sign the docks and the money's wired. But it certainly sounds like this is the intention. Jerry Jones even sort of implied that on Friday on his radio show. it was really about the economic challenges that Dan has with paying off the loan that he took out to pay off his minority shareholders

and then try to simultaneously build a new stadium when nobody wants to help him. But Glazer is saying he's selling the whole team, $7 billion. And then I think the third piece of that, March fast track league meetings could come to an end then. That is a fast-tracked ownership change. Now, they have the benefit of having sort of vetted all of the potential bidders in the Denver sale. But I thought of one thing when I heard March, and that is this. You're right in the middle of NFL free agency. You're a month away from the draft.

What it probably means is that the current staff and the current group that's still here, they're not going anywhere. The new ownership group isn't going to come in in March and bring in a whole new team. They'll probably bring in a big-time consultant, you know, a Bill Pollyan. Well, I don't know, Bill's son, Chris is, you know, when the organization is the director of pro personnel. So bring in somebody to kind of help them navigate this and guide them through a lot of this. But we're probably, I mean, Dan's not going to fire Ron and his staff. And Ron and his staff may not leave.

They may be as excited about the new ownership change as we are. But, you know, the timing of it is fast-tracked, of course, but it probably means that the group we have now has a pretty good chance of sticking around. Still, that was big news from Jay Glazer yesterday on Fox. So, to the suspension of reality in the game and the team that is playing, look, that's a fifth straight week where Washington had a chance to win the game or lose it. They are three and two in those games going back to the Tennessee game. You know, four point loss to Tennessee, five point win over Chicago, two point win over Green Bay, one point win over Indy, and a three point loss to Minnesota. I mean, they have been in five straight games decided by five points or less,

and I think that's really who they are right now. You know, this is what they have become. I mean, we are now more than halfway through the season. God, it flies. Not every team is more than halfway. Washington is having played their ninth game. And I think they are a team that, first of all, is good defensively, excellent defensively against the run. And they have really good players on defense who are young. And those players in that unit is the number one reason more than any other that they've become a competitive NFL team over the last five weeks. They're a middle of the pack NFL team, but in the NFC,

given where, you know, after Philly, Dallas, the Giants, Seattle, and Minnesota, everybody else is basically sub-500 for the most part. I mean, the 49ers are sitting there at 500. You know, you're going to have a lot of teams in the mix for that seven seed. And then in the NFC South, you know, you're going to have three teams probably in the hunt up until, you know, at least early, if not mid to late December for that division. But Washington is in a different situation than they were at one and four. They are a middle of the pack NFL team with a very good defense, especially a good rush defense.

At one and four, it looked like this could potentially go sideways. And it didn't. that's, you know, again, I think where they are. I think these are the games that they're going to play, maybe not against the upper-tier teams that they have on the schedule. Philly's one of them. There are 10.5 point underdog at Philadelphia, the biggest underdog, they'll likely be all year.

I guess they could be as big on Christmas Eve at San Francisco when we get there. But, you know, they're going to play these games against everybody, but maybe Philly, Dallas, and San Francisco. So, you know, five games of their final eight or games in which, you know, the point spread is probably not going to be three points one way or the other. Maybe at New York against the Giants, they might be a bigger than three-point underdog. I mean, San Francisco, Dallas, Philly different,

but the other five games against the Giants twice, Atlanta, Houston, Cleveland, and who am I forgetting right now? for getting somebody. Well, no, that's it. Of the eight games, excuse me, eight games that they have remaining, you know, they've got the Texans, Falcons, giants, twice Browns,

and then they've got games against the Eagles, 49ers, and Cowboys, teams that are clearly better than they are, although you don't know what they'll look like by the time you get to it. But I think what we saw yesterday is what we're going to see the rest of the year. I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing.

I think, you know, the NFL is a little bit different than the NBA, where, you know, tanking, It's hard to do, first of all, and there's no guarantee of anything. It would be better for Washington if they have a higher draft choice going into a year where they're going to be in the quarterback market again, and the draft is going to be loaded with quarterbacks. I get that. You know, I get the whole, you know, the worst place to be is eight and eight and eight or nine or nine and eight. But they're not going to stop trying to get to nine

wins and a potential seven seat for the exchange of having a better draft choice. They're not. Anyway, Washington's second of two primetime games coming up on Monday night, they won the first. By the way, the Bears, after Washington beat them on Thursday night football a few weeks ago and held them to seven points, the Bears have scored 94 points in their last three games. If you want an indication of how good Washington is, has become defensively. They held the Bears to seven, and the Bears have averaged over 31 a game in their last three since that Thursday night game. Incredible defensively what Washington has become, and maybe they get Chase Young back this week. I really think that that's, you know,

a part of what they are right now that's going to keep them in the hunt past Thanksgiving. We'll see. Because as I'm saying, a lot of these games are winnable, they're all loseable too. They could have easily lost all five of these games in which they played much better. And they're three and two in those games. All right, let's get to my game take. Pay attention. Here's Kevin's Game Take.

The things I liked, the things I didn't like, and a few other observations from the 20 to 17 loss to Minnesota. All right, let's start with the things that I liked. John Allen was just incredible. John Allen has become one of the best. defensive lineman in the NFL. Two tackles for loss. Five quarterback pressures, totally unblockable, blew up a screen. He was the best player on the field yesterday, in my opinion. You know, it's one of those things we look at the All-22. Maybe somebody else was just as good. From watching the game on television, John Allen was the best player on the field. Better than Justin Jefferson,

better than his sidekick, Duran Payne, although it was damn close. And Duran is next on the list. A sack, four tackles for loss for Duran Payne, four tackles for loss in one game. Like Allen, dominant, had multiple quarterback pressures. In addition to the sack that he had early in the game, he was incredible in the game. I looked this up earlier on the radio show. Right now, John Allen is third in the league and Duran Payne is tied for fourth in the league in tackles for loss.

That is one of those stats, by the way, as I'm looking at the list of defensive players that lead the league in tackles for loss. There are no scrubs on this list. Max Crosby, Zadarius Smith have the most. Then John Allen, then Matthew Judon, who's having an incredible year for the Patriots, then Duran Payne. who's tied with Judon. Then it's Parsons, Von Miller, DeNeil Hunter, Brian Burns, Grady Jarrett. Okay, Boas is on this list. Cam Jordan's on this list. Christian Wilkins is on this list. Miles Garrett is on this list.

I mean, when you have a lot of tackles for loss, it's because you're just making plays because you're impossible to block. Duran Payne and John Allen are top four in the league in tackles for loss. and Duran Payne had four of them in a game. Benjamin St. Juice has turned into a really good corner. He's on my list. Seemed to me that he was traveling with Justin Jefferson. Jefferson in the slot, Jefferson outside didn't matter.

Seemed St. Juice was with him all day. I don't know if that's true or not. It just seemed like every big catch or every big contested play with Jefferson. It was St. Juice who was there. I'll have to go back and check that, but he's become their best corner. I don't think there's any doubt about that. Even when Justin Jefferson caught balls, Jefferson had 13 targets and only caught seven of them. When he did catch him, they were contested with the exception of the 47-yarder on the third and seven that Kirk threw after getting hit pretty hard by pain.

And that was the only one that there was any real true separation, it seemed like. St. Juice is big. He's long, which is so important. He's got great instincts. You know, the back shoulder throw on the Vikings opening drive was caught, but he was right there. The touchdown passed to Jefferson, he was right there. Although I thought he peaked a little bit, maybe that hurt him a little bit on that one. You know, the interception before halftime was all him, even though, you know, I think there could have been some DPI there. You know, the bottom line is, and then he had the pick six that got overturned.

I've got more on that coming up. But St. Juice is, and he had the sack on Kirk. He's really, really a good young player. They have a lot of good young players. You know, if you consider Allen and Payne still to be young. I think on Duran Payne, the chances of him being on this team next year are better than they were before the season. A lot better. I know that they're going to be challenged with trying to sign all of these players.

and keep them on the defensive line. You know, you still have Montez and Chase. But Duran Payne right now might be their second best defensive player. I mean, it might be their best defensive player. You've got to keep your best players. And for them, it might mean tagging him if they can't get a long-term deal done. The economics aren't going to be easy, but I don't want to see him in another uniform next year.

This guy is incredible. The run defense overall, what can you say? It's number two in the league DVOA against the run. They held the Minnesota Vikings to 56 yards on 22 carries, 2.5 yards per carry. Dalvin Cook, 17 for 47. I mean, you take the Jefferson one yard, third and inches play, where you got 10 on kind of a handoff on a fly sweep, and they were less than two and a half yards per carry.

Washington's just been lights out against the run. They have also been lights out. with their pass rush recently. They don't always get home because some of these quarterbacks are good, and they're decisive, and they understand that they're about to get hit, and they unload it. Kirk got sacked twice, but he was pressured 12 to 13 times yesterday. There were other defenders that stood out to me.

Montez-Swett, Kendall Fuller, Cam, Curled, Jamie Davis were all players that I thought, you know, had good games, made, you know, more than a few good plays. It's possible that the overall entirety of their performance, might be, you know, graded lower, but they stood out to me. On offense, I'm just didn't, I mean, I'm a big Gibson fan. He's just flat out to me, one of their best players on offense, and one of the best weapons they have on offense. He got more snaps, not more touches, but more snaps than Brian Robinson, Jr.

I just think he should get a lot more snaps. It's not that I don't think, you know, Robinson Jr. can be a good player. and I like some of his power. Some of Gibson's best runs yesterday were power runs inside the tackle, where he got two, three, four yards after contact. He's good at that too. And then he had a 45-yard kickoff return. We've been talking about it.

He is dangerous back there on kickoff returns. He's going to break one for a touchdown one of these weeks. He nearly did it yesterday, that 45-yarder to open up the third quarter. Two plays later, and there was a touchdown pass. Kind of lucky, but there was a touchdown pass. Curtis Samuel is on the list of things that I liked. You know, we've talked about his touches. He needs 10, 8 to 10 per game.

He got 10 two weeks ago, and the win over Green Bay got seven last week, 79 valuable yards of offense in each of his last two games. Now, he had 81 yards of offense yesterday, but only on four touches. Now, 49 of those yards came on the touchdown pass from Heineke, where Cam Bynum was about to call for a fair catch until the referee took him out. And somehow Samuel makes an incredible play to make the catch and then roll over into the end zone

without getting touched. I want to see Curtis Samuel. I want to see Antonio Gibson all with more touches, but you're not going to get these guys more touches if you keep going three for ten on third down. You know, 74 snaps against Green Bay is why he got 10 touches in the game. They only had 61 snaps yesterday.

You got to stay on the field if you want Gibson, Samuel, Terry to get more touches. But Curtis Samuel is on the list of things that I liked. Other than the Ridgeway penalty, which I do think was by rule a penalty at the end, I thought the special teams were excellent yesterday. Tressway again, Joey slide didn't miss a field goal or a PAT. Gibson had the 45-yard kickoff return to start the same. second half. I thought Dax Milne did one of the better jobs he's done all year long on punt returns. I think he averaged like eight and a half to nine yards per return. They were great in coverage.

You know, Minnesota's got a very dangerous kickoff returner in Kenai Nguangu, and his one kickoff was a 13-yard return. They nailed them. I do want to just make one observation. Minnesota was really coming after Washington on the punt. I think I've been. I've seen that multiple times this year. I don't think they've had one blocked, but I think that teams see something in their punt protection. Just remember I said this, if they get one blocked, I just sort of have this sense that I've said this before about teams coming after Tressaway to try to block a kick. And Minnesota almost got one yesterday. And they seemed intent on more of a a punt rush situation, than a setup for a return situation. Washington did a really good job against

Rager on his punt returns as well. So that's the list of the things that I liked from the game. Here are the things that I did not like. And I'm going to start with the offense and Taylor Heineke, because they go hand in hand. Now, I've got pass protection on this list, but look, this team is struggling to move the football and score. They're struggling to score. They're 26th in the league in scoring. And, you know, if you didn't have the first two games of the year where you scored 28 and 27 points, they're two biggest outputs of the year, you'd be at the bottom in scoring. They're 26th in the league on third downs offensively. They're five for 22 in the last two weeks. They have sunk further in their third down offense since Heineke took over.

They're 30th right now, an overall DVOA on offense. 30th. They've lost ground from where they were in the last three games. So they are the third worst offensive team in football per the DVOA football outsider's metric. They're just not a very good offense right now. They're not scoring enough offensively. And Taylor Heineke, you know, is a big part of that. So was Carson Wentz. So was Carson Wentz. So was Carson Wentz. So on Heineke yesterday, I know what kind of guy he is and I like him. Some of you don't hear me saying the things that I like about him and the plays that he makes that I think are spectacular. He made a few more yesterday. He's a likable dude. You know, he's a fighter. He's resilient. He's all of those things. He can really make plays off schedule. You know, we could do this

all day until we're blue in the face. We all notice, I think, the things that he does well and the things that make him likable, you know, the underdog, the overachiever, you know, and he's earned some of that with, you know, some of the plays and some of the games that he's had. But we got to be, you know, honest here, too. He's nowhere near good enough. Okay, most of us know this. If your goal is to have a good offense, and that's a goal for you, which it should be, you've got to be much better than Taylor Heineke, a quarterback. Now, he's going to have, you know, next week somebody's going to say,

do you still feel that way after he, you know, has a big fourth quarter and makes a couple of clutch throws and big time dry? He's going to have those. He's going to have those moments. but he's not good enough, period. End of discussion. Actually, I'm not done with the discussion. I don't know why I have to emphasize this for some of you, because it's so GD obvious.

You know, I know he's a cutie, and I know he's a guy that does some things that are really, really, you know, fun to watch, okay? But he's not that good. I think most of you know it. They know it out there. They know he's not the guy. He's too small.

I mean, how many passes got deflected or knocked down at the line of scrimmage? His arm isn't big enough. I mean, not that you have to have a big arm, but the accuracy is inconsistent at best. The decision making is the same. He missed badly to Logan Thomas in the first half. Wide open Logan Thomas. It wasn't even close.

We've seen that a lot. That was on the drive that ended the first half of the field goal. You know, the interception is a backbreaker. But you knew it was, I mean, didn't you kind of sense that it might be coming? I mean, every time he drops back, I think it's probably 50-50. It's either going to be a big play for the good or it's going to be a big play for the bad. I mean, that throw was bad. I mean, they had just gotten that illegal contact penalty.

against Minnesota. The ball way too high. That's his first read. I'm pretty sure Ron said that afterwards. And it's not even close to Logan Thomas. And you know, you got essentially Harrison Smith back there, as Cam Bynum was on the touchdown pass, you know, essentially able to call a fair catch if they want. The ball so high and long and missed so badly. You know, again, he is going to make some really good plays, but he's going to make some really bad plays. And I think what we've seen actually in a weird way compared to last year, because we certainly saw this in the Green Bay first half. And we saw it yesterday at times.

He's a little bit late and a little bit indecisive, especially with pressure, which a lot of quarterbacks are. And he was under pressure yesterday. And I think he doesn't see certain things sometimes, and then other times he does. By the way, I am not advocating going back to Carson Wentz, right now. I don't think they're better off with Wence. I think the pass protection isn't very good, so Heineke's mobility gets him out of trouble more than Wences does. But I do think they're going to go back to Wence when Wence is healthy,

which is potentially the Houston game after the Philly game next week. He is on that list, injured reserve list, through the Philly game. If he is healthy and can play, I think we're going to get Wence against Houston. You know, now, if Taylor goes lights out and beats Philadelphia, which is a long shot, but if he does, you know, I will change my mind a week from today. But I think they want to go back to Wence. I think, you know, the defense now is playing much better than it did earlier in the year. And I think that they feel like they can do more with Wence. I don't know if I agree with them. And with the offensive line being an issue, you know, that's going to be a problem for Wence again.

it's a problem for Heineke too, but he's got enough mobility where every once in a while he can make a play. Now, do I think Scott Turner can do more to help Heineke and play to his strengths a little bit more? I think so, but I'm not at practice. They know what he's comfortable with. They have a better understanding of what he can do and what he can't do. The opponents matter too. You know, Hunter, De Nenele Hunter and Zedarius Smith are edge players.

They are the best players. that Minnesota has. And Dalvin Tomlinson, their beef in the middle. He was out. So, you know, he's not a drop-back guy. I don't like, you know, seeing him drop back. I don't mind play-action throws, but the play-actions aren't really, for whatever reason,

producing enough. And I think sometimes it's his fault. I think sometimes it's the pass-pro even on the play-action stuff. The pure drop-back stuff, when you have third and seven or longer, he's got to make some of those throws. You have to in the NFL. He's just not his strength. But yesterday, another day, he made some really good plays.

You know, he made an incredible off-schedule throw to Curtis Samuel. It was the third and two on the touchdown drive that ended with the TD pass to Dax Milne, which was another good throw. I actually thought it was a little bit late, but he gunned it out there pretty nicely. Millen really created separation. I thought the read option slash RPO, because it was both on the play where he kept it for nine and a half yards before that third and one, in which they challenged. I loved that. He made a throw to Terry for 15 yards while getting nailed.

That was a phenomenal throw. Made a throw towards Terry at the end of the first half. That was a really good throw. I don't know what to do with him. You know, I know some of you have said it's all Scott Turner's fault. That's not true, in my opinion. I do think that Scott is, you know, I know I'm defending him a little bit here. He's between a rock and a hard place this year because of the O line.

And, but I still, look, the one criticism I had of Scott last year with Taylor is kind of the same criticism I have of him this year. I would definitely use Taylor more as a dual threat quarterback. and really incorporate him much more into the run game. Because I think it's what he does well. Now, are you going to get him hurt? Maybe. But look, he's, I think the formula they have with him, trying to stay balanced, running the football, you know, keeping people a little bit in terms of flux

as are you running the ball here? You go and play action. They did try him on a couple of boots yesterday, on the third, you know, on the fourth downplay. that was a boot where he threw to Terry incomplete. There's so many nice things you can say about him, but we're not here to just focus on the nice-nice and fall in love with a player

without sort of some objectivity to it. He's just not very good. That's the truth. And they're going to be in the market for a quarterback when this season ends. On the list of things I didn't like the past pro again, I thought Lucas looked like he struggled yesterday, especially against DeNeil Hunter.

Keep in mind, this has been a problem for Heineke. It's been a problem for Wentz. And I don't see it changing much. You know, Cosmi could move to guard when he comes back. You know, they could try different things. But, you know, they got Philly, Dallas, and San Francisco. They got Miles Garrett and Cleveland on the schedule. They've got Houston who pressured the shit out of Jalen Hertz in the Thursday night game.

They've got Grady Jarrett and the Falcons. You know, it's not going to be easy for this. And I think, you know, again, is Scott? Turner doing a great job this year? No. I mean, they can't score. They're not, you know, there are a lot of issues. Does he have a problem that's really hard to overcome with that pass protection unit? I think he does. And he has not had the quarterbacking to overcome it. All right. Also on the list of things, let's go through these coaching decisions, okay, because Ron Rivera didn't have a great day in managing the game. You start with,

and a caller pointed this out to me, and I, Stan in New Jersey, pointed this out, and he said, I'm surprised that you didn't have this on your list of sort of coaching clock management gas, and he was right. And I didn't, you know, really, I remembered it, but I didn't have it ready to roll on the radio show this morning. When Washington was moving the ball at the end of the first half down seven to nothing, it was the drive that ended with the 44-yard field goal from Joey Sly. there was a pass completed from Taylor Heineke to Terry McClorn with 57 seconds left to the Minnesota 26 yard line. They called an immediate timeout with 57 seconds to go, and they shouldn't have. They should have, you know, gone hurry up, you know, not super hurry up.

You certainly don't have to clock the ball and waste it down. But you don't want when you, you weren't going to run out of time there by not. calling the timeout with 57 seconds left. They've got three timeouts. And what you want to be sure of is whatever score you have, you don't want to diminish your chances to score a touchdown, which you would not have done, because let's just say the snap happens at 42 seconds. After you get up, you call the play, everybody gets lined up and you snap it with 42 seconds, and the play, whatever it is, ends at 37 seconds. And then maybe if it's an inbound play, you can take a timeout. You know, if you don't get it all the way down, you know, to the five-yard line. But

What you have to be able to do there is, A, don't diminish your chances of scoring a touchdown. That's number one. Number two, don't diminish your chances of kicking a field goal. Number three, you certainly do not want to leave as they did 37 seconds on the clock for the Vikings. The Vikings have been as good as any team in the league this year at the end of halves and at the end of games. and they are going to be aggressive with Kirk and Jefferson in that group. And they were. And they were all the way down to the Washington 21-yard line with still 18 seconds left.

He hit the big one to Hawkinson, hit the deep one to Thielen. And they're at Washington's 21. They're 18 seconds left, and they still have a timeout left. So that's error number one by Rivera. You've got to be cognizant of making sure you have enough time to score the touchdown and that they have as little time as possible. And calling that timeout at 57 seconds was a mistake. Now we go to the second half.

The timeout after the third and two Robinson run, their first timeout of the second half with 540 to go in the third quarter before a fourth and inches play. You had the wrong personnel. You got to be better coached in that. situation. You can't burn a time out. These things are sacred in a 10-7 game and a seven-to-three game. You know, you've got to be aware that you can't burn a time out. I like the decision to go for it, but you end up burning a time out there. That's a problem. And then came the challenge.

The challenge on the Heinekees scramble, where I have to tell you, I thought Heineke had the first down watching it on TV. I was like, whoa, wait a minute, that's a bad spot. but they spotted it short, a yard short, third and one at the Minnesota 47, 10 to 7 Washington leading the football game at that point, and Rivera challenges the spot. I can think watching on TV and you can too, hey, he got the first down. That's not what they have to do. They have to be right. They have to have somebody that calls down and says, challenge the spot, they got it wrong. not throw the red flag he might have gotten the first down.

You've already burned a timeout. You're going to burn a second one on a challenge before a third and one, where by the way, they've got momentum. They've been moving the football. They had a really good play on the third and one. The Armani Rogers taking that ball on the fly sweep, 24 yards. He makes a really good play to avoid Daniel Hunter, who made a near stop on that play.

But that challenge was lost. had a caller this morning say to me, actually Rivera shouldn't have lost that challenge. And he explained to me, he said, the reason was the ball was actually marked closer than it should have been. They should have moved the ball back when you saw it on replay. Can you imagine you're challenging the spot because you think they've got a first down? But actually, what they come back and say is, no, actually, we got to move the ball back further. We got that wrong. But you can keep your challenge flag. You won the challenge. I actually don't know what that rule is, and I talked about it this morning.

Like when you challenge and the result turns out worse for you, do you lose the challenge, even though they changed the spot? You challenged the spot. They moved it back, not forward. Do you lose the challenge? I think you do. Now, if they move it forward and it's still not a first down, you don't lose the challenge. If you're right about the spot being wrong.

But if you're right about the spot being wrong because they marked it too far forward, I don't know what the rule is there. I actually couldn't tell on the replay if they actually got it wrong. I thought they were pretty close to write. Bad challenge from Ron there. Wasted timeout, wasted challenge. Now you're down to one timeout in a 10 to 7 game with a whole quarter plus to go in the game. They scored a touchdown on that drive to take a 17 to 7 lead.

And then we get to the final two and a half minutes. So, as Cooley and I used to say in our discussion of clock management, when you are losing or you're in a tie game and you're using your timeouts on defense because you need the ball back, is it better to have more time or less time? So Rivera blew it when he called, when he didn't call a time out before the two-minute warning as Minnesota was driving for what would eventually be to go ahead field goal in the game when he was. field goal. Minnesota ran a play with 231 to go. It was Dalvin Cook on a second and goal run. Should have taken a timeout immediately after that play. And instead, Washington let the clock roll all the way down to the two-minute warning. See, there's a general rule when you're calling timeouts to get the ball back when you're using them on defense when it comes to the two-minute warning, and that is call them before the two-minute warning rather than after, because you save

the seconds that burn off post-two-minute before calling the timeout. So maybe there's only a difference of five, six seconds, although if you call multiple timeouts before the two-minute warning, if you've got multiple in that situation, then it could be as much as 10 to 12 seconds, more times better than less time. You call them before the two-minute warning with the exception of this condition. And I've mentioned this before in the past. You don't want to call a timeout on defense with like 205, 204, 203, 202, 201 left.

206 left, maybe 207's the cutoff. Because you don't want to give your opponent free license to throw the football without being punished because the clock stops after an incomplete pass, but the clock is going to stop if you, you know, if you stop the clock with 205 left and they decide with 205 left, we're going to throw it and they throw in complete.

It's the two-minute warning anyway. So you have to be careful calling timeouts before the two-minute warning, not to call them so close to the two-minute warning that you give the other team free opportunity, a free opportunity to throw the ball without the consequences of the clock stopping and it hurting them because it's already stopped because it's the two-minute warning. But generally speaking, call your timeouts before the timeouts before the time. two-minute warning, you save more time. So yesterday, Ron Rivera said after the game that he was

relying on the analytics person upstairs, that he's got an analytics guy that told him when to call the timeout and told him to let the clock run down to the two-minute warning and take their final timeout after the two-minute warning. So let me walk through it with you. So after the Dalvin Cook run on second and goal at Washington 6, if Washington hits a timeout, right there at about 224 left in the game. Then you've got a third in goal situation. Washington's used their last timeout. But remember, third and goal in that situation,

Minnesota's not playing for the field goal at that point. There was a point in which they were playing for the field goal, but not at that point. They threw it on first and goal from the six, and cousins threw it away. On third and goal from the four, after you've called a timeout with 224 to go, they're going to try to score the touchdown.

Because you know why? More points are better than less points, unless the less points come at the end of the game where you don't have a chance to get the football back. So they're going to throw it anyway, which they did. They threw it to Jefferson. St. Juist was there, broke it up. And then they sent the field goal team out.

So if they'd call the time out with 224 to go, after the fade, the third down play, call it 219 left. Okay. Then after the field goal's made, there's 2.16 left, or right around 2.15, 216 left. Instead, okay, the field goal was kicked on the other side of the two-minute warning with 152 left. Now, the way it played out, there was the Ridgeway penalty. So then they had a play that they would have run before the two-minute warning, okay, at that point. And then you would have had two more plays where they're not trying to score. They're just trying to run the clock down. Although maybe had you gotten to the two-minute warning with second down, 40-40 or 43-43,

you're talking about 86 seconds. You're talking about a minute 26 and you're talking about leaving potentially 30 to 34 left. Maybe they wouldn't have just laid down on the third downplay. They may have tried to score. But the bottom line is after they threw the fade, they would have kicked the field goal. you would have had the penalty. They would have run a first down play. You would have had two more plays. If you look at it in its totality, you would have had you called the timeout before the two-minute warning, roughly 30 seconds with the ball down 20 to 17 versus what they had, which were

12 seconds. Now, one last thing. So he absolutely blew it on not calling the timeout with 224 to go, 223 to go, whatever it was after the Dalvin. Cook run. There's one more thing. So after the Ridgeway penalty, which I do think was a penalty, Minnesota clearly, like if you've watched enough football and you understand how the whole clock management thing works, you knew the Ridgeway penalty was basically the end of the game. Why?

Because, you know, it's a 42nd play clock, and Washington, you know, has one timeout left, so they'll use one of those timeouts left. and then Minnesota can take two knees or they can try to run some clock by running plays. They're not going to try to try to whittle this clock down to where they can whittle it down to, which was 12 seconds and kick the field goal from a very short distance. And then that is their best chance to ice the game. They're not going to try to score a touchdown in that situation. Kevin O'Connell understands this.

So some of you were like, why didn't they let them score? Well, it doesn't matter because Minnesota wasn't going to try to score. They understood the situation. Everybody did that follows this stuff and has a sense of what's going on. Now, what's interesting about this is that it looked like Washington wasn't trying to let them score. there was a Duran Payne tackle on Dalvin Cook on the first down run and he got up and he celebrated like I just stopped him in the backfield like there was no indication that Washington was going to let them score it wasn't

going to work anyway but there was no indication that they were that they were going to let him score James Smith Williams on the second and goal stops I think it was James Smith Williams stops Cook or somebody and they kind of celebrated it a little bit and then you cousins kept the ball and tried to burn some time. Minnesota played it perfectly to get it down to where they got it down to before the field goal attempt with 16 seconds to go. And James Smith Williams kind of celebrated like a sack.

I mean, your only chance at that point is to let them score. Again, Minnesota wasn't going to take advantage of it. But I want to see at least a sign that they're lying down and going to let him Dalvin Cook run into the end zone if he's, you know, if Minnesota is dumb enough. to do it, which they weren't going to be. I don't even think they knew what to do in that position. It wouldn't have worked, okay? But I don't even think based on their celebration of the tackling of Cook and Cousins that that was the direction they got, which should have been the direction they got.

After the Ridgeway penalty, it should have been immediately let them score. Do not tackle anybody. Now, once it became clear Minnesota wasn't going to try to score, then the only thing you can do is go to try and strip the football. That's it. They weren't even trying to do that very well. So that ends the list of things that I didn't like from the game. There you go. A couple of other quick observations from the game.

Number one is I thought Kirk Cousins, in his return to Washington, had a very good game. Not statistically. Okay. 22 of 40, 265, a touchdown and interception. I think the interception was a great throw to Jefferson. I don't think Kevin O'Connell would want anything other than him to give his receiver a chance in the back of the end zone. It was placed perfectly and St. Juice made a good play.

I think he got away with a little bit of DPI, which leads to my second observation. By the way, Cousins just, he took a beating all day from one of the best interior fronts against their weakness, which is their interior offensive line. Plus they lost their starting center during that game. Garrett Bradbury. Cousins did what he's done throughout his career. He hangs in there and he takes a beating and he keeps getting up. He missed a play though.

And that actually helped Washington out because they could have scored a touchdown on that drive. They were at the 11-yard line or 12-yard line. The throw that he made to Jefferson, that 47-yard or on 3rd and 7, that's your ball game right there. And he took a massive hit from pain. I don't know. You guys can say all you want about Kirk. I've watched his career. He's tough as nails. He can make every throw. He's as accurate as any quarterback in the game. He's been, you know, much to the dismay of many of you who have this lazy, inaccurate narrative. With the game on the line more times, many more times than not, he has come through. And he did again yesterday. The throw, the touchdown throw to Cook was spectacular. But what I was going to say is on the DPS, that wasn't called in the end zone on the interception that Danny Johnson made, and I think a couple of other times, the Jerome Boger crew made it clear. They were going to let them be clutchy, grabby, and

hansy all day long, which is why the pick six by St. Juist, I thought was tic-a-tick-tac. I think it was definitely DPI by rule, but they had already set the precedent all day long that they weren't calling that kind of stuff. They were letting them play yesterday. And I think it was an inconsistent job by one of the worst crews in the sport, the Bougar crew, the Jerome Boger crew. That's game over at 24 to 7 against that defense. Being down 10 is one thing.

17 is another. And I just thought they hadn't called that stuff all day long. Now, Minnesota probably had more gripes than Washington on DPI. that didn't get called. Thielen got interfered with, Jefferson got interfered with. Jefferson, by the way, dropped three balls in the game. Thelan dropped one too, which, you know, Washington got fortunate on. But I did not like the call on St. Juice, not because I didn't think it was DPI,

but because they had let that stuff go all day. And if you're going to let that stuff go all day, you stay consistent until the end. Anyway, those are the observations from the game. Let's get to Doc and then Tommy right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Don't forget to rate us and review us, especially on Apple and Spotify from Jason on Apple. There's nothing better than when you and Doc Walker are back together. And it happens on your podcast. And I love it.

Have Doc on more often. Thank you, Jason, very much. I would have him on more often. He's not, you know, he's not always available. he's very busy and he's an important guy. And so it doesn't always happen that way. But I'm thrilled to have my good friend Richard Doc Walker on the show today. He, of course, is doing radio again on Burgundy and Gold today, 12 to 3 on the team 980.

His schedule is usually three or four days a week. Is that about right? Somewhere in that neighborhood, on average? I think so. Jason, first of all. I'm touched. Look, my goal, I've always strived my whole life to make a team to be in the inner circle. And I look up to Cooley, Laverro, save guys who are regulars, and I hope to one day be one as well.

So I'm like to duck in the pond, man. I may look still, but my feet are flying. and I'm just honored to be the feeling. I mean, and whenever somebody can't make it, I'm here for him because I listen to this guy religiously, and I couldn't wait. I said last night in the pregame show, post game show, rather. I knew that he's going to be all over the final two minutes of time, because he is really good at time management.

He can't kill my thunder today because this is one of the few times losing a game that I walked away with a glow. I felt like Schadenheimer. There was a gleam. You know, because I saw and felt Aida Stadium that had a buzz, the defense was on fire. We made some plays, and the potential for us against a six-and-one team, not to fall apart but actually be ahead,

I'm like, wow, jets beat Buffalo, and we should have, would have could have, all words of losers, I get it. But we don't suck. And I'm so happy to at least have a chance. If they can figure it out offensively, we got a chance. And that's better than it's been in the past. Well, I'm going to ask you about that buzz in a moment. But let me just make sure that I share with everybody. And it's kind of funny.

but whenever I ask Doc to come on the show, the reaction is the same every single time and has been for, I don't know, 15 years, whether it was radio or the podcast, but with the podcast, his immediate reaction is, is Cooley okay? Is everything okay with Cooley? Is Tommy okay?

Because I'm always a feeling. I'm never a regular. What's wrong with, what happened? No, actually, on Mondays, No, no, no, no. Call it straight. No, that's it. I am calling it straight.

When I asked you to be on, you're my first choice on the days that I asked you to be on. I'm never your first choice. That's okay. No, it's true. And you are my first choice today. I was born on third base, okay? I was born in the duck out. Oh, let me tell you some.

I was born outside the stadium, hand in. Trying to scalp tickets to people to get in and try to make a buck. where Neil from Rockville is or what Chris Cooley is or Clinton Portis is your favorite. That's okay. I'm at least in the game. I'm in the rotation. Tell me about the buzz. Tell me about the buzz.

What was the buzz about? Why was there a buzz in the stadium yesterday? There was a buzz, and again, because I was honored to be on the pregame show with Julie Donaldson and Christopher Johnson. and they had me on to talk about Dave Butts, which I was honored. And the fans that come there, and a lot of our listeners hang out there. And the last time they had signs up, fire the owner and do all this. Sell the team, yeah. I'm going to people going, what is up?

And they go, we're finally moving forward. They act as if it's a done deal that Dan will have to sell the team. And there was a, that was almost like a celebration of sort from what the people that I spoke to. Because I wanted to know, there's something feeling. I was like Marty Schadenheimer says, the gleam. I felt an energy. Then the defense came out, bawled out. So they had a lot to be optimistic about Viking fan was there.

They're polite. They're good fan. I love a healthy rivalry, just like we have with the Giants. When the Giant fan comes, it's just different. You know, you got to be armed for the Eagle fan, and you've got to have Mace for a cowboy fan. But the Giant fan, it's dialogue, it's intelligence. Yeah. That's the same way I felt for Minnesota fan.

It was cool. Hey, man, we're out here going after. It's collegiate-like. I dug that. But the performance, the energy, our special teams play, the fact that we're killing it versus the run. and we just got that last piece of the puzzle to fit in, and that is, I'm dumbfounded by the fact that Taylor's been with this organization,

this group of coaches, damn there decade. And I'm confused because it doesn't seem like they figured out how the best utilize his skill set. It's not about what he doesn't do well. Nobody's perfect. Well, present company with perception, all respect to you,

but there's nobody else being paraded around the internet as Christ. There's nobody even been putting the image that you've been put in. It's all about what he gets to do. What about the things he does well? I'm just saying. So why don't we move the pocket just a little bit? Can we get him out of the five to seven step drop? That's my frustration.

My frustration is that I, and it's not about Turner, I think, has done an outstanding job with a lot of talent. But this is one I'm scratching my ball head till my hands are full of blood. You know it better than everybody. He's been with you forever. Right. Maximize his talent.

Okay, but is there a butt coming? No, plain and simple. But you're limited. He's not Roger Starbott. But you're limited with him. Yeah, but you knew that. He's been on every team you've come. coach. He's not new to you. The only reason he's here is because of Scott Turner. He's the only

coach that's ever saying, I can get something out of him. And he has gotten a lot out of him. He's got a lot out of him. Yeah. But not the seven to five to seven steps. No, I don't want to see him drop back either. Okay, well, why is he doing it? Well, but why does he keep doing it? They had a couple of boots. I mean, they booted on that fourth and inches instead of running the sneak. They had them, they had them on a zone read, read option. RPO, you know, where he kept it for nine yards before they challenged the spot. I like it. Look, if you saw the Tennessee game last night, you saw what I saw.

You need to understand what limited looks like. Yeah, that's limited. That kid's limited. Well, right now, he can run a little bit. Right now, that's all we're talking about. He's got some arm strength. We're talking about Malik Willis. Oh, no, Malik Willey, he's got a gun.

He's got a gun. But it doesn't matter. A lot of guys can throw well. pitchers to hit the gun at 9-9, but they can't the strike zone. Because people are it doesn't matter. What I'm saying is that Derek Henry, my frustration is that the Titans remind me of our 80s teams. Oh, God, I agree with that.

Yes. But you couldn't stop it. Yeah. And we weren't embarrassed to say, this is who we are. We seem to be embarrassed. What is your identity? I'm confused. I don't know as much football as you do.

But I do notice to this point, I have no idea who the hell we are offensively. We got a lot of weapons. We got a lot of tools. My frustration is that I'm going, but the personality, you've got guys that look like the 350 pounds in space on screen. They can't hit moving targets. Put their hand to dirt. Well, you're trying to run the football, which you're trying to create that,

to be part of your identity with Taylor in particular, because you have to be in better down and distance, and they've run the ball a lot in these three games. And they ran it last year during that four-game winning streak. So that is part of what they're trying to do. Not enough. Not enough. They ran it 30 times, something like that or 28 times. By the way, your Tennessee thing, I swear to you a couple of weeks ago, I was talking about the Titans, and I forget if it was on the air off. And I said, you know, that you're always on. That Vrable. I'm always on. That Vrabel, in the way they play, there's so much similarity to the Gibbs teams. Now, the Gibbs teams were better, and they had, you know, they had thighs, and they had the ability to throw the deep ball.

And, you know, but there's so much. They gave way the number one receiving. They traded our month. I know. How far was that? But they, but there's a discipline and a way of playing with intelligence. I mean, they didn't, you know, the fact that they, they were up 17 to 9 last night against a, with Malik Willis at quarterback. He's just not ready. I'm going to be interested to see what he looks like three, four years down the road. I'm not giving up on him.

Oh, no, he may be great. Yeah. But he's not ready to play. Yeah. No, he's not. He's not. But you know who they are. Yeah.

You know who they are. They're not afraid to say, this is who we are. Stop it. We're not trying to trick you. It's not about, we're not versus imagination. We are offensive line, and give trade turn a lot of credit. He has come back from the dead. He's gotten in better shape, and he's given a hell of an effort.

Armani Rogers, I love this kid. Is there any way to get him more? Well, you've got to make third downs. You've got to stay on the field. You can't miss on third down. I know it. Three for ten, it doesn't cut it. And then I said this to our audience last night.

I couldn't wait until 6 a.m. this morning. I knew. And I know they claimed that there's somebody upstairs. First of all, first of all, and this is just me, and I'm probably not on point. But if I was an owner and I'm paying somebody anywhere from $5 to $10 million a year, I don't want to hear them tell me who they're counting on. Because I'm not paying the guy up there. Yeah, right.

$10 million a year. Right. I'm paying you. And I, but that's your department. You nailed it this morning, and it's crazy, but this again, we got beat. So did we win or lose on the sidelines? Yesterday you lost on the sidelines. We lost.

We lost. But although you're not losing with Del Rio's defense on the sidelines. Oh, no, no, no. No, no. No, I do. I do, too. I do. You know why?

He gets results. Yeah. He gets results. And he's not trying to win you over. He's not trying to get you as a follower. I'm telling you right now. No, he doesn't care. He didn't care.

He ain't trying to get you as a follower. I like what we have. I just want to see it maximize this potential. And you got Monday night showboat showcase. Perfect timing. I would like to have gone into it with a four-game win streak, but we blew it. So let's start with a couple of positive things. You listened to me on radio.

and I just did this in the open as well in breaking down the game. And the podcast. Doc, I mean, and you mentioned Dave Butts. And the newsletter. Dave Butts is the greatest defensive tackle in the history of this franchise. Okay, he is.

And God rest his soul. It's sad weekend for Redskin fans and the Redskin family. Joe lost his youngest son, Coy Gibbs in his sleep at 49 years old, three years after losing his oldest son, It's awful. And then Dave Butts passed away. Dave butts passed away.

Same age. Yeah, at 72 years old, just too young. Oh, yeah, the son, same age, 49 years old. So condolence is out to everybody. I was going to talk about that at the end of the show, but it's better than I do it with you. But I'm telling you, Doc, in two or three years, and it might not even take that long, the two best defensive tackles in the history of the franchise might be playing for this team right now. seriously

John Allen is he's he's as good a player as this franchise has had in a long time yep and then Duran as well talk about those two

well just brutal strength and leverage that's John Allen and he was that way at Stone Bridge I was actually a volunteer coach

at Langley High School and we took it We took the kickoff, and we got all the way down to, like, the two-yard line with Coach Howardton's group, and I thought we were going to score against Mighty Stonebridge. He slant it down, he blew up the play, forced to fumble, returned it like 94 yards. Oh, he did? Yeah, he did in high school. And every time I see him, I tell him about that, and we laugh.

he's a monster and he he you just love to have him as a teammate because he's all business and it's about winning for him the kid never about money

you can tell him about money for him it's about winning and then the baby bull next to him and this too this poor kid is so gifted and I've been waiting for him to just fire out and show it

and now he's showing it on a regular basis. We talk about going after the bag. The bag for the hip impaired is money and going to get paid. And it's a beautiful thing because it works for the team. To see the St. Juice emerge, to see Karam Curl emerge in the C-52, Davis going, I'm looking at this group. And I saw sweat making a play, and I'm going, wow.

is right there. And Ronnie said this. Everything is right there. It is. But you've got to make it work to get credit for it. It's not just a roster, it's a production. And I feel this is the best I've ever felt after loss. Because usually we just get steamrolled or something stupid happened.

Not this case, to me. It was a better team with the Vikings, and we punched them in the face. and all we had to do was finish. We had a bad three-minute and ten-second period, and the game flipped, and that happens that we're against good teams. Had we been playing garbage, we might have won, but you didn't play garbage,

and you're going to play late Monday night. So to me, it was a good preview and lets them know that they can hang. Now, what they move on with from moving forward, only you and Ron know, but I'm hopeful. Get it done. You know, last year they struggled on defense.

There was clearly something going on, and they had some, you know, people that weren't doing what they said. And look, they've been telling us that if they do what they're being coached to do, that it could be a good defense. We are seeing, I think they might be one of the top two or three rush defenses in the NFL. But beyond being... Can I say time out for just one second? Yes. Because I got a problem with that. What?

The teacher can't tell the audience that if the students just do their homework, they'll be smart. I know. As a teacher, it's your damn job to make sure they get the subject matter and that they can perform with it. Some people don't test well. Doesn't mean they didn't know it. They just don't test well. That's what I thought for us. We don't test well.

Well, guess what? The test is a game. And if you don't test well, you won't be in the league long. that's all we do in this thing is we're tested and you've got to prove that you got the lesson they're young too they're young too that's a cop-out they're young on defense too i mean i i i look at this team and now with you know the ownership going to hopefully change and maybe there's a new day starting in the spring of 2023 when whomever it is buys the team from dan you've got some really good young players on defense i mean i think we knew john was a good player and we knew

Ron had potential and sweat and hopefully Chase comes back and he's fully healthy. But you already mentioned St. Juice is a good corner. I'm not comparing him to what they have. I'm comparing him to NFL corners. He's going to be a good NFL corner. And their safeties are good. Their safeties are good. Oh, yes.

Now, we agree. Remember Barry Milburn? Yeah, 45? Barry is long. When you get these long corners who's agile, let me tell you what, I love this kid. I'm so excited that it sounds ignorant when you say, wait a minute, who are you talking about? I'm talking about what I see on the field. Now, Jack was always right.

It's got to work together as one. You can't freelance. And they're getting better on that discipline side. and, you know, we had a penalty critical on the center. You said that it was legitimate call. If you say it was legit, to me it looked like he was going a little bit on the side. Big Ridge, well, I loved the big boy. But he cheated.

And a lot of people called the postgame show. Didn't they tell him? Yeah, they tell him everything. It doesn't mean they retain it. That's under pressure. And the guy was trying to make a play. He's going to be a hell of a play. for it, but he effed up on that one. But tell me, how do we fix this clock management and red

handkerchief fiasco to see it be happening on a regular basis? I don't know that you're going to, because he thinks he's got somebody up there that knows what he's doing. I don't know anything about the person he's got up there, but they did not call the timeouts properly at the end of the game. They would have had 30 seconds instead of like 12. they managed it properly. And that's a big deal. You know, that's a couple of completions and a chance for a field goal potentially to tie the game.

But anyway, the, I don't know. See, I'm not, this isn't about me, but I'm just going to say this. I don't think Ron Rivera is a terrible coach. I think Ron Rivera is pretty good at what he does. I think Del Rio is pretty good at what he does. I don't think Scott Turner is nearly as bad as everybody thinks they are. Now, when I'm saying that, it's not like I think they're great, but for this program, as you like to call it, for this group, I mean, it's hard with what they've had in ownership, it's been hard to attract much better people. I think Ron, you know, he's not a good clock management guy.

He's not a good game management guy for the most part. You're right about that. I wanted to ask you about Gibson and Robinson again, something we talked about a few weeks ago. I like Gibson. I don't have a problem with Robinson. I've seen some much better rookie running backs, but he went through what he went through, obviously. But Gibson now is getting more of the snaps and getting, you know, an equal or more number. Yeah, so tell me what you're seeing with Gibson right now. No, he's the guy. He really is. And I don't mind softening it up with B. Rob. B. Rob is what he's a downhill power guy. He's a mini-mee of the kid in Tennessee who's a,

a slammer. I thought he would have been, again, we can't reverse it. But in camp, he was hit it towards more the Henry look style of just dominating you. And I see him improvement every week. But you've got to Roll Royce in 24. And if he's holding on to the pill, I am mad at him. What I want us to understand, I say us, our fan base, those that haven't quit, those at heart, that the lions beat the bills.

So don't tell me about The Jets. The lions Beets, I mean, excuse me, jets beat the Bills. The lions won. They beat the Packers. Packers are garbage, but they still beat them. The Giants, the Seahawks, the bears are promising.

The Falcons are promising. We got to be in that category to where you say, it's like George Allen says the future is now. I'm not on a three to five-year plan. I ain't in none of that. I'm into next Sunday. Get it fixed because you got people. Can't blame this on people. You got people. You picked them. You picked them. So get the best out of them. And I'm not making an excuse for Heineke. You know who you. You know better than everybody. Fix it. You got to, can I, I'm going to disagree with you there because you know me, Mr. Playoff scenario over the years. Oh, I know. I know. And I never give up on a season, but I think they need. to have a really good draft pick this year because there are so many quarterbacks in that draft. And you've got to find a quarterback.

Until you find the quarterback and they don't have the quarterback, we know that. Okay. Oh, no, I know that. Yeah, well, I know you know that. But there are people that listen that actually think that the little guy out there is the answer. Well, wait a minute. What do you call the guy in New York? The good little guy in New York just beat the best team that I hear a lot of you experts.

I'm saying that because that's what you say. You always want to, when you're talking about Taylor, when you're talking about, oh, yes, I am. When you, when you talk about Taylor, you'll call, and you've said it on the podcast with me before, you'll be, look, the little guy does it really nice. No, no, I do that all the time. I was doing that for your benefit. No, no, I do not. Oh, you do too. You do too.

No, come on. Come on. Here's what I'm saying. What? No, here's what I'm saying. He's the best you got. I go with whoever I have. I can't make this up.

This is not virtual. I can't morph a person into that life. He's won games for you and can win for you. You kept him. He's on your roster. You're paying him. Then what you're saying is that you don't know how to pick people. Well, he's a good backup.

Well, right, but now he's your starter. Well, yeah. Okay, so he's the starter. You've got to get a quarterback. My overall thing is, until you get the quarterback, you're going to be, like, I think they could be good defensively for the next few years, although I want to see him keep pain. But I don't know if they can do that.

Here's where we don't agree. We're Tennessee. They don't like Tannenhill. But they can win with him. They've had the Chiefs on the ropes. We couldn't have the Chiefs on the Rope. They have one playoff games. They have closer than we are.

All right, who would you want to have right now? They have Derek Kennedy. This team or their team. Our team or Tennessee. Oh, Tennessee's. Okay. All right. So you've got to build it.

You got to work what you have. But part of that is that, part of that is because I take, I take Rable over what we have any day of the week. He's good. Stevie Wonder could see that. But what I'm saying to you is that you're stuck with what you have. I'm saying when was what you have? Yeah, I know.

Okay. So I'll go with you because you know how I am. And the truth is, if they had won yesterday, I think they'd have a really good chance to make the postseason and an NFC where I think 9 and 8 is going to get you the 7th seat. I mean, they're obviously not going to win the division. But losing that game and now going to Philly, you know, 4 and 6, and let me tell you something, Houston's not terrible,

and Atlanta's probably just as good as this team. But where they are, and I said this in the open to the podcast today, they have proven themselves after a horrendous start. And it's primarily because of their defense to be a, solid middle of the pack NFL team. They're not terrible. I mean, they're not good, but their defense gives them a chance, though.

It really does. I agree. That's why I left there thinking, we got a shot. It's going to be ugly. All of our success has been ugly. Who the hell you kid? But who cares? Right. The key is with that defense,

you got a chance. Defense gives you a chant. Special teams play. Man, we had 41 back out there covering. Them kids are flying down. It reminded me at a wild bunch. I'm seeing flashes now that it's developing as a football

team that can win games. If you just judge it by the scoreboard, you never have to get personal. I'm never impersonal about any of it. I just want to win games. And I don't like excuses. You know, because you're not making an excuse when you pick a checkup. Now, if people start

rejecting the big checks they pick up on money, then I'll be more compromising. not in the mood to compromise because they don't compromise you would never advise them not to pick up their check there have been some weeks in the past that i think they should donate it to charity without a doubt i have two but they earned that last day i have two questions because i know you put you you you got a limit with me and you got to you got to go to work i know i got to so i've got me i've got me back in i have two questions i have two questions to finish up okay do you think I'm not asking what you would do, okay,

because you just want to play the best man you want to win. What do you think they will do when Wence comes off injured reserve after the game next week if he's healthy enough to play? Do you think they're going to put Wence back in there? Let me repeat myself to you again on the few times that I'm able to fill in here. I have no idea what they'll do with anything because I don't think like they think and I don't want to think like they think. Right.

So that's asking me a question. I can't answer you. You're asking me to speak a different language. You might as well ask me to speak German or speak French. I don't speak that language. Okay. Then I'll ask it a different way. What would you do when Carson Wentz is ready to play?

I would evaluate where, first of all, I'm not giving India to for him under no circumstances. Right. So he's on a pitch count at best. I do not see him in my future. I see Howell in my future and Heineke in my future and whomever I'm on a draft. But that's based on Heinrich's going to play his way up or down, but he can never be on my roster if this doesn't work out. I've got to move on.

I've seen enough. I know what I'm going to get and what I'm not going to get. If I stay stuck on that, now I'm treating him like a relative. And that just doesn't make any sense to me. I'm not emotionally involved in any of them. I got to win the game. What gives me the best chance to win the game? And from what I've seen, I don't see practice.

But if How old is now probably getting more quality work, that's what I love about Joe Gibbs, but it's not fair to compare anybody to Joe. Anybody that doesn't invest a coach with the backup quarterback in his own field like Joe did, then you brain, you just, it's insane. Because I've got to accelerate his growth every day. I can't wait on him.

I've got to accelerate his progression so that if he gets in the game, I can win with him. Now, all I saw was preseason, but I did get a chance to see it up close. And right now, he's a better athlete with a better arm, everything's better about it. So if I don't beat the Eagles and he's practicing well, I have no other choice. I made a commitment to the rest that defense. I got to give them a chance to win the game. And he might do it for me, and I have to explore it. no future and nobody else long term. I've got to move on because I can't waste this defense.

Yeah, I'm with you on that. But you would not put him out there if he's not ready to be out there, right? No, why would I do that? Okay. I'm just... Now I just retard his growth. Yeah. My last question for you is, what did you think of, what's his name, the quarterback that plays for the other team for the Vikings? Number eight, what did you think of him? Yeah, him. Kirk, Kirk played, like Kirk. Kirk made the plays. He's tough. His ribs might be broken.

We beat him up, but couldn't kill him. And that's who he is. He's a tough dude who gives you a chance. He'll play you in it or out of it, and he's got that freak outside episode of week. See, over the years, we've always bragged about others. At Jefferson, he's a bad man, so is scary, Terry. So our guy's got a chance to see it.

You know why I think juice is good? because he goes up against Samuel and he goes up against Freaky Terry. It goes up against him. We got people now, like everybody else. We're not void of talent. We have talent so you can demand

better results. We're not the bad news bears any longer. So it's inexcusable not to get better results. That's all I'm saying. This was great. This was an honor. I can't tell you how much. It's always an honor.

I can't tell you. When the guy calls you at the last second, it was, hey. Called you on Friday. Cooley, Cooley, Cooley's hunting today. I called you on Friday. Cooley's doing this. Cooley's doing that. It's not true.

Tommy can't do it. He makes this, you make this up all the time. You're so, you're so generous with your time for me, given how sought after you are. It's an honor every time you say yes. Because your son, the rest of them, you won't allow me to get close to. but I got close with Casey. Okay, Corbin, you have personally kept your kids away from me.

That's so not true. They all still love, all my kids love Doc Walker. No. They love them. That's okay. All right. I will. You're doing the job you're doing.

All right. And if you would honor us today. I will. 12 to 3. I'm coming on with you today on radio at 2 o'clock. That's going to be an honor for me as well. Thank you so. Thank you so much.

You all would often every week. Craig Hoffman is the only guy that you'll go on with. What are you talking about? You're always going to offer. Why do you say things like that? Because that's what you do. He asks me. First of all, first of all, that's the pregame show you're talking about.

Because I don't go on his regular show. I guess I did last week for the ownership. Oh, oh. Oh, you remember it now. But I do the pregame show with him and Logan every week. But no, this is the God's honest truth. When I go on the radio show with you today, this will be the first time I've been asked, and it's an honor. Oh, God.

Oh, my God. At Rick Doc Walker on Twitter. Patreon.com backslash Doc Walker for his podcast. I got to go. What? Yeah. Okay. Attorney Neil Jacob.

Yes. What about him? I'm going to hire him because you are, you are, it's a detriment of character. Speaking truth is never a defamation of character. You know what I'm going to do? I'll ask Hoffman today when I see him. Hey man, what do I have to do to get Kevin on with me? I'll call you later.

Appreciate it. All right, let's finish up the show with Tommy right after these words from a few of our sponsors. This segment of the show brought to you by MyBooky. Go to MyBooky.orgie. Use my promo code, Kevin, D.C., and they'll match your first deposit, dollar for dollar all the way up to a thousand bucks take the free money go to my bookie

uh the point spread for next sunday for next monday night is philadelphia minus 10 and a half um that seems about right tonight's line is down to one and a half smell test tommy seven and four so far on the weekend with new Orleans tonight pending but i took them plus three on Friday show because they were two and a half. I hope you took it then because I'm taking the plus three. Go to my bookie.ag, my bookie.com. Use my promo code.

Kevin D.C. They'll take really good care of you. Tommy is on today because he has something he's got to do tomorrow and then we'll be back on schedule with him on Thursday. I've spent a lot of time talking about the game. I did my take on the game.

Doc was on to talk about it. What do you say? written a column about it. What do you say about yesterday's 20 to 17 loss to the Vikings? Well, I was at the game. I was at Ghost Townfield to see it. And, you know, there were, it was about 50-50 in terms of the crowd. Yeah, that's what I heard. You know, but, you know, somehow, here's how things have come. Here's where we fall into. 50-50 is considered acceptable now. Yep. Minnesota fans really travel well.

They do wherever the Vikings go. Yeah, yeah. 50-50 is considered acceptable. Not taking into account that Minneapolis is like 1,500 miles away. It's not up the road from, you know, up by 95 kind of thing. But I tell you what, T.R. Heineke had the Washington Commander fans who were there. He had them revved up, boy, by this, he had them pumped up, as pumped up as I I've seen them all season, as happy as I've seen this fan base all year.

Until they weren't. Until Kirk Cousins stuck a steak right through their heart. Well. You know, it's funny. I had a guy, you know, I wrote a column basically saying that, you know, about Kirk as much as anything. and I had a guy on Facebook say to me, well, Heineke played better than Kirk, and Kirk has a better defense. Oh, my God. I mean, how do you talk to a guy like that?

You can't. You can't. I almost had to tell our good friend Sabah this morning, look, we're going to, I've got to exclude you from the grown-up conversation about the team. Because she actually said the following to me. the coach, Kevin O'Connell, he knew more than the team knew not to give Heineke a final shot at the ball. And that's why they played for the field goal. No, sweetheart. They played for the field goal because they knew they could kick it with 12 seconds to go after Ron bungled the clock and blew all of his timeouts.

They would have done that if, you know, if Malik Willis, if you saw him last night with the quarterback on the other side. If Peeley Harman was the quarterback, they would have done the same thing. look, there are, I talked about this in the open, okay? And I'll just share this with you real quickly. I'm going to net it out. He's cute. I mean, he's a cutie pie, that Taylor Heineke. And there is a lot to like about him.

There really is. He's not that good, period. I'm sorry, he just isn't that good. If you can't see that, people, I can't help you. There's things about him that are 100% lovable, okay? And he does certain things well. And by the way, he's going to do something else great on Monday night because he's a gamer. And he is a resilient SOB.

He's not very good at quarterback. If you want to have a good offense in the NFL, you've got to do a lot better than Taylor Honeykey. They know that. Tommy, I think Wence is going to play in two weeks at Houston. I'm not saying I advocated because I don't think it's going to be much better. You know, I think you were right on it's not going to be any worse. and you're right. And it's actually because of his mobility probably been a little bit better. But I think I think Wents is going to play. I think he's going to play until they're out of it

and they don't want to take the second rounder and give it to Indianapolis instead of the third rounder. But I think he's going to play. I don't think Wentz is going to play unless Taylor Heineke really, really, you know, shits himself Monday night in Philadelphia, which is a possibility. And everything you said about Taylor Heineke is right, but given their limitations across the board, a quarterback right now at that position this season, I still think Taylor Heineke is the better choice. He's not the better choice moving forward. You know, if you have hopes of competing and a permanent solution, a quarterback,

but right now is a temporary solution unless he really turns in another dreadful performance. like he pretty much did, I think, yesterday against Philadelphia. Then I think he stick with him. I think he stick with them. And the whole Sam Howe thing, stop it, everybody, you know? I don't know how good Sam Hal is. Here's what I know. Here's what everybody knows.

Sam Howe was a fifth round draft pick in a wowsy draft for quarterback. So stop with the Sam Howe stuff, too. Well, here's the reason that you say Sam Hal is because at one, point he was the projected number one overall in his in a year before the draft and so he was more of a name than the run of the mill fifth round you know quarterback we went through that all last spring and he's the one on your roster you don't know about and you know that the other two can't be your starting quarterback moving forward so who knows maybe you landed on brady in the fifth round i mean it's not likely i think the issue with him from what i've heard is they just don't see

him being anywhere near ready. And I don't think you can put him out there unless you really feel confident that he can do. You know, I've mentioned this before. This is so funny because I think it was Jay Gruden was on some with maybe it was Chris and Pete last week and I heard this. He's like there's an underrated part of playing quarterback. It's like calling the place. Like you've got to be able to hear it and then spit it out seamlessly and be able to communicate

it seamlessly, get up and then actually run the play. You know, we've heard that before. Remember, we heard that a lot with a certain quarterback who was here for a few years. But, you know, you can't put him out there if he can't get into the huddle and call the play. So I just, but I do understand why, and I feel the same way, that if they did see something from him out there, you know, over the course of the season or going back to the summer, and they're intrigued by some of his abilities, because I'll tell you what, he's got a big arm, you know, and he's mobile. So he's got what Carson Wentz has and what Taylor Heineke has in one body.

I don't know if he's any good. I was not a big fan of Sam Hal. I'm a much bigger fan of the Carolina quarterback this year, Drake May. But I understand why, and at a certain point, I think they should play him to learn something about it. At a certain point, yes. at a certain point, when you raise the white flag in the locker room. Well, I thought it was going to be at one in five if they had lost to the Bears. Well, I mean, that would pretty much be the white flag.

Now, let me tell you about Taylor Heineke, too. You mentioned one of his strengths is his mobility. Well, why don't think, why didn't they use that mobility yesterday? Why do they continuously stick him in the pocket where he's least effective? Well, it's not totally true that they just had them in the pocket the whole game. And Doc... I know. Not the whole time.

But more than they should. So my answer to that is I don't love the way that Scott necessarily uses Taylor. And it goes back to last year, the one criticism I have, I would actually turn him more into a dual-threat quarterback. I would have a lot of design runs. I mean, they ran a quarterback draw yesterday. We haven't seen that a lot with Taylor. Did not work at all. We saw a zone read.

We saw a zone read in an RPO on the same play. We saw a fourth and inches bootleg where he got out on the edge. My answer to you is I think that, you know, the strength of the Minnesota defense, they've got two really good players and they are their edge players, DeNeal Hunter and Zadarius Smith. And so getting, you know, a player out onto the edge right into the other team's strength probably isn't what Scott Turner thought was the best thing to do in passing situations. They also were missing their best player on the interior, Dalvin Tomlinson.

So you were looking at a defense, it's like, okay, we've got to avoid these two players. The problem is from the pocket, when he did have times, Zadaria Smith was double-teamed and he knocked down like two passes because Taylor can't see over the line of scrimmage. But I don't think it's an unfair question. I don't think it's unfair, but I think there's probably reasons that we haven't thought of, and I just gave you one of them. Okay, that's possible. But here's like, I think this is a management philosophy.

Don't manage based on what the other team can do. Manage on what your team can do. Okay? And it doesn't matter how good the edge guys are for the Vikings, you're anticipating, you're not going to be able to, your guy's not going to be able to get around. them, you know, in that situation. Don't do that, because then you've limited your quarterback to the thing that he doesn't do as well, and that stay in the pocket like that.

So I just think that, I just think if there was really a goat from yesterday, and that's not greatest of all time, that's literally goat, I think it's Scott Turner. I tell you what, the defense, you pointed this out on social, on Twitter, the defense is legit. That's as good at defensive performance I've seen in a while. I mean, I'm looking to see if the DVOA number has been updated because they were number two in rush defense last week. And I want to see where they are this week.

Number one, they have moved to number one. They're the number one rush defense in the NFL. Okay, number one, per the football outsider's DVOA metric. They are legit tough. Absolutely. And, you know, they've got, and the other thing is, got good players now and they're emerging everywhere. You know, Jack Del Rio has done a pretty damn good job with this group and maybe it took getting Jackson out of there.

Maybe, you know, I'm interested to see how he works Chase Young back into it. This defense is going to keep them in, you know, I already talked about this. They got eight games left. Now, the Cowboys, the Eagles, and the 49ers are much better teams, period. The other five, you're going to have games like the last five. Like the last, they could easily be 0 and 5. their last five games. Taylor Heineke threw enough balls to the other team in the Green Bay game that you should have been down by three touchdowns. You certainly could have lost last week down nine

in the fourth quarter. And you did lose yesterday and you did lose to Tennessee, but the game yesterday was winnable. The game against Tennessee was winnable. The game against Chicago was loseable. The game against Green Bay was loseable and the game against Indy was loseable. I think what you'll see as long as they stay healthy because of this defense, you're going to see a lot of the kind of games that we've seen in the last five weeks. Maybe not against Philly. Maybe not against Dallas. If Dallas needs it at the end of the year, maybe not on Christmas Eve against the 49ers, who I think could potentially go to the Super Bowl if they can get totally healthy when they get Debo back. But against the other five teams, the Falcons, the Texans, the Giants twice, and the Browns,

Yeah, I mean, that's why yesterday, Tommy, when I said I'm having this weird hunch that they could be a nine and eight football team, but Sunday's huge. If they were five and four right now, I would tell you, they got a chance to win five games. Now, they could lose all five, but let's just say they're able to win three of those. That gets them to eight, you know, and just need one more, maybe not even one more in this NFC. You might get an eight and nine team as the seven seed this year. It's ugly at the bottom. I know. I know. I agree with you. But you got a long-term view, though?

You got a score. Yeah. Long-term view, though, is it creates the illusion that they're close. No, I know. But we suspend reality on this show, right? I know. But I'm just telling out there to everybody. Yeah. You know, I mean, just because you have this great defense, and you've got weapons. I know it doesn't make sense. You've got a great defense. You've got offensive skill weapons. You've got to be close, right?

Well, if you don't have the quarterback, you're like a canyon away. Yes, that's the point. And as long, you know, but there is light at the end of the tunnel with ownership. That's for sure. Like, here's something, and I know this will surprise you and many others. Washington keeps dropping offensively in rankings, okay, since Taylor came in. They're now, they were 22nd. They're now down to 28th.

in the league DVOA offensively. They're not a good offensive team. Now, with that said, let me be clear. I don't think it would have been any better with Wentz. And in some cases, I think it has been at times better with Taylor. But it's not like significantly better. It's really a fine line. They are the 26th ranked scoring team in the league.

They're 28th now in overall offense. It's not a good football team offensively. with some weapons, but it's also not all been about the quarterback. They have struggled since the opener with pass protection, and they struggled again yesterday, and that's not going to fix itself. So, yeah, I mean, because you've got, I pointed out in the open, you've got Dallas, Philly, and San Francisco, you still have Miles Garrett you got to face. they've got some tough defensive pass rushing guys left on their schedule.

But anyway, yeah, the defense is lights out right now. The rush defense is elite. Absolutely. Absolutely it is. Frank Reich just got fired. That's breaking news. I mean, I got to tell you, I think Frank Reich has been a good football coach. I think he's a good football coach.

They haven't found the quarterback. And when you got Ursa, that's what happens. Have not found the quarterback. Boy, Andrew Luck, Peyton Manning, and then they're here. Looks like Green Bay could be headed for some of that, too. What else? I mean, cousins, you mentioned cousins, and you wrote a lot about them in the column. It's so funny because I said this morning, you know, I said,

if you guys just read box scores, you'll never, and don't watch games, you'll never have a good enough sense about what happened. And I said I thought Kirk Cousins was a B plus a minus. I think Minnesota fans will tell you it was one of his best games. And yet he had his lowest completion percentage of the year. He was 22 of 40 for 265, two touchdowns and interception in the game. The interception is a perfectly thrown ball. It's exactly what Kevin O'Connell, I guarantee you, told Kirk.

Take the shot if it's there, put it in a place where the best receiver or one of the best three receivers in the game can make a play. and he didn't, and St. Juice made a really good play. He took a beating yesterday against this defense. An absolute beating. And again, you know, Jay Gruden talks about one of the most, one of the important things that a quarterback is making sure you can call the play. Here's another one that you can stand up and take the snap.

And this guy, 16 games a year, every year, this guy, is in there, and he took a beating yesterday. He's taking a beating a lot of times in recent years in Minnesota because their offensive line hasn't been great. Now, Darisaw, their left tackle from Virginia Tech is going to be a star, and he's really good. But their interior, plus they lost their center, and they were playing maybe the best combo of defensive tackles in football right now in Allen and Payne. And those guys were immediate and disruptive, and look, I like them. I've always liked them. All of you know I have, and I think, you know, there's been incredibly inaccurate and lazy narratives about him over the years.

You asked anybody that he's played for how tough he is and how he makes the big throws under pressure after getting hit. The throw to Jefferson's the play of the game for them. It's third and seven. It's 17 to 7. And he takes pain, lays him out, you know, knocks the wind out of him. And it's on the money that throw. The touchdown pass to Cook is a beauty. Beauty.

I don't know how good they are, although I'll tell you what, this is something I haven't mentioned on the show. Adding T.J. Hawkinson, wow, nine catches, nine targets. Kirk has not had a tight end in Minnesota, a really good tight end. Rudolph was there, but, you know, towards the end a little bit. He hasn't had a big, big time pass catching tight ends since Jordan Reed, and we know what those two did together. Anyway, anything else on the game? want to ask you about Dusty? No, nothing else on the game.

How excited were you for Dusty Saturday night? Did you watch a lot of his post-game interviews? Very excited. Yes, I did. I watched the whole thing. I was so happy when they blasted that three-run home. When Alvarez hit that three-run homer for them. Let me read to you. This is from Paul Doherty. He was a columnist at the Cincinnati Inquirer for years, an excellent columnist. He grew up around in this area. And, you know, he kind of retired. I don't know if they

retired him or why. But now he's writing on it. Why do I know that name? Why do I know that name? Why have we talked about him recently? I don't think we have, but he's a very good columnist, and now he's writing for substack, which basically means he's writing on his own. Right. You know, and people subscribe to it. And he's very good. Obviously, Cincinnati oriented, very good. But, and he covered Dusty when he was with the Reds. He interviewed David Bell, who he knew, who played for Dusty when Dusty was in San Francisco. And here's what David Bell said. And this explains exactly what Dusty is all about.

He knows what buttons to push, what to say. I got to the point in 2002 when I was really struggling pretty early in the year. He took me into the cage and hit with me for two hours. some of the stuff he said the drills he had me do were exactly what I needed that saved my career he always just knew

that Dusty cared for you he's tough he demands a lot you don't get away with anything but he's in it with you he knows what make guys pick this is it that's that's 90% of the job

is managing people I mean when you talk about the numbers people make the numbers There's no numbers without players and Dusty is better than anybody when it comes to managing players. Yeah. No, you've loved him and you've talked about him

and I think a lot of the people that just focus in on in-game stuff and, you know, mistakes made here with a pitching decision or a pinch hitter decision or whatever it is, they don't realize that it's everything else he's. did that actually is the reason that they're playing in that game and someone else isn't. I wanted to see a seventh game. I wanted to see Bryce have a big game six, but I was so happy for Dusty and some of those interviews with him were priceless. He was so happy and it was just,

it was really, really nice to see that. It was. The other NFL and the other and all the football from the weekend. I'm going to get to on tomorrow's show because we've gone way too long on today's show. I did want to mention that Ron Rivera's already done his Monday presser, and he says that the call on Ridgeway, quote, I don't agree with the call. I went and looked at it and looked at it and looked at it and looked at it. And there was, I mean, he didn't hit him with the shoulder pads and didn't get him, hit him with the helmet. He crossed over and caught him with his hip. He was going into the gap. Okay. I mean, the referee, Walt Anderson, the media contact afterwards said it was definitely a penalty by rule.

I don't know. I mean, you know what? Call the time out before the two-minute warning, and you would have given Taylor 30 seconds to try to go tie the game. Although I was thinking about this, too. If there had been 30 seconds of difference, Minnesota may have thrown the ball on third down or run a more aggressive play to try to score a touchdown.

But anyway. Yeah, it's presuming a lot if they didn't call the penalty. You know? It's presuming a lot of things happened in your, would happen in your favor for you still to win that game. Well, yeah, but the penalty, the penalty was game over pretty much. I know what. Yeah, because if the field goal is good, you've got, you know,

you've got a minute 40 something left. You've got a chance for Taylor to pull off one of those magic acts, which he did last week in Indianapolis. So, anyway, all right. I think that's it for the day. I think that's enough for the day. I'll be back tomorrow. I don't know who will be on the show. Tommy, he'll be back with me Thursday. Thank you. Okay, boss.