The Kevin Sheehan Show - More Daniels To DC Chatter

Episode Date: April 9, 2024

Kevin and Thom today with a ton on the Commanders to start including more reporting/suggesting from national guys that Washington is going to select Jayden Daniels in the upcoming NFL Draft. Plenty on Connecticut's national championship win last night over Purdue to cap dominant back to back title runs. Lots more on South Carolina-Iowa and the huge television audience the game attracted. Thom weighed in on Steven Strasburg's career as well. Download the PrizePicks app today and use code Sheehan for a first deposit match up to $100! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Hey guys, I'm really pleased to have a new sponsor to the podcast. Prize picks is the largest daily fantasy sports platform in North America. They're the easiest and the most exciting way to play DFS. It's just you against the numbers rather than you battling thousands of other players, including pros and sharks. Football season's over, but Hoops action is heating up, whether it's tournament season right through the end of this month or the fight for playoff home court advantage heading. into the postseason, there's no shortage of high-stakes basketball moments this time of year. Get in on the excitement with prize picks, America's number one fantasy sports app where you can turn your hoops knowledge into serious cash. Download the app today and use code Sheehan, S-H-E-H-A-N for a first deposit match of up to $100. You don't want it. You don't need it, but you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin show. He is Kevin. Tommy's here. I am here. The show's presenting

sponsor. As always, is Window Nation. Call them at 86690 Nation. We're head to Windonation.com. Mention my name for a free, no obligation estimate. So we've got a lot to talk about today. We have last night's title game.

Wow, Yukon was impressive. We will get to that. Tommy, watch the game as well. Colin Cowherd weighed in yesterday on his show saying that he knows something, and he essentially reported that Washington is going to select Jaden Daniels. We'll get to that. We'll get to Tommy's thoughts on Stephen Strasbourg, the women's college basketball, TV ratings, and a lot more. But I am going to open up the show with an email that I just read before this show began, and it's fascinating. It's really actually quite thoughtful in some ways and just really interesting in others.

It's Isaiah who's writing us, Tommy, from New England. Okay. And the subject is, what's love got to do with it? I think that was a big Tina Turner hit back in the day. Yes, it was. What's love got to do with it? Just take a QB. That's the subject heading in this email.

Dear Kevin, I'm confused as to why I always hear radio podcast. host, journalists, analysts, etc. Say regarding drafting a QB in the first round that if they love a guy, they should take them. In all seriousness, what does love have to do with it? Drafting a quarterback in the first round is like buying a lottery ticket. It doesn't matter if you love or even like the ticket. A chance at hitting the jackpot is a chance at hitting the jackpot.

Many teams didn't love or even like Justin Herbert. so by that logic, they shouldn't have taken him, right? Of course they should have. In 2018, the Browns and Jets loved Mayfield and Darnold more than they liked Josh Allen. So did they do the right thing by taking the guys they loved? My point is that it's impossible to know who's going to hit and who isn't. So it shouldn't matter who a team loved.

It should only matter that they are taking a shot or buying a lottery ticket. Now, does a Caleb Williams lottery ticket have a. a higher chance of winning the jackpot than a J.J. McCarthy ticket does? Yes, it probably does, but both are still just lottery tickets. And now gets into an interesting part of his email. I think the first part was interesting, too. Because so far, we're not off to a great start here. Well, we're not off to a great start in terms of whether or not maybe we agree with him, but I like the angle he took. He writes, I'm born and raised in Boston, so a lifelong Patriots fan. Do I care Elliot Wolf, an unproven GM who's only been there because of his father and Jared Mayo and inexperienced coach and lifelong defensive mind?

Do I care who they love as a QB prospect? No, I couldn't care less because they're probably wrong. But I do want them to draft a quarterback at three just on the chance that whoever they pick, and that could honestly be a name out of a hat, ends up as the next Herbert Allen Strauss. Malma Holmes, Jackson, etc. I would be more confident in Adam Peters's evaluation in who he loves, but would still say it doesn't matter as much as just taking the shot and playing the lottery, as in even if it didn't particularly, even if he doesn't particularly love any of them,

I would still 100% advocate for him to take a chance on a QBA 2. Actually, it's this next paragraph that gets interesting. Anyway, I'm a longtime listener to the show Pod, who's never called or e-mails. mailed in before. I became a Redskins slash Washington football fan several years ago because the Patriot season didn't really start until January. So I needed a team to root for in the regular season. I'm fairly young, so unfortunately never knew the Redskins is anything other than mediocre. And now I'm left with two bad teams to root for. Thanks for all that you do.

and how you do it. I enjoy and appreciate the work so much. I even listen to the segments on the other DC teams and even college basketball, which I truly could not care less about. Thanks and all the best. Well, what? You, the Patriots season didn't really, you had the Patriots as your hometown team, but you became a Redskins fan or a Washington football fan, so you needed, so you had a team to root for in the regular season, bad judgment. Terrible judgment. I got to give him an A for arrogance. My team was so good that I was bored during the regular season. So why not pick the team with the most drama? Well, maybe, but it's not like that team could have provided him with any joy during the regular season, the one that he picked. No, but his joy would be coming. He knew his joy was

that started in January. He wanted a soap opera to keep him interested, and he got one in Washington. I'll give him an A for arrogance on that. That's pretty good. Like, we were so cool good. I didn't have anything else to do, so I figured I'd root for your team.

So he went with General Hospital during the regular season, and then settled for competence in winning in January. Okay. So, Isaiah. Okay, so that was a little bit, overhyped on your part, buddy. A little bit. I'm sure it was. I just, I got a kick out of that last part, which is why I

wanted to read the email. Um, yes. So the draft is not a lottery ticket. The odds are quite different. But I do understand the notion that of like the four guys, we have no idea which two of them, but we do know that two of them will fail, probably miserably, um, and be bus and that nature of it of, you know, what numbers to play when you're playing the lottery. Yeah, it's true. I mean, maybe you love the vision that you woke up with with some set of numbers and you're going to run to the lottery place wherever you play it and play those numbers. Or you're just going to let the machine spit out the numbers.

When I've ever, I've never once, by the way, speaking of lotteries, I've never once picked numbers. I just give them 20 bucks and say, give me the power of all tickets. I do too. Just have a random pick, random select. You know, like I have any kind of special insight as to what the number's going to be. I don't think there are any odds differences. No.

But you see, this is not a lottery. Because we're not dealing with what. We're dealing with human beings. with knowledge and information available about these people. It's more like a horse race than a lottery game. I mean, like, you've got the program with the horse that tells you what they did, you know, how they ran the last race, you know, what their breeding is and stuff, and then you take a shot and make a bet on it.

I mean, you have much more information than you do on a lottery ticket, so it's not a lottery. It's gambling with information. I mean, look, let's face it. Let's go back to 2012, the first two picks, Andrew Luck and Robert Griffin III. If you had all the information you needed to decide which one of them you wanted, that was a no-brainer.

That was Andrew Luck. Okay? So, I mean, there's information available about these guys that we're not privy to that the other. teams are that will certainly help them in their decision-making, and they still could be wrong. Yeah, no, that's true, and it's also just a completely, like, the lottery, you're not going to win. In the NFL draft, there's probably at least a one-and-three chance you're going to hit it. But in terms of the love or, like, to your point, they have information. They should, ultimately,

pick the player that they prefer, whether it's love or preference or whatever it is, their evaluation should lead them to like somebody at least a little bit more than the others. And it's still a projection. It's a projection of how you think they'll perform on a level that they've never performed on before. Right. Agreed. I wanted to read this to you from, and I talked about this, on the podcast yesterday, but it goes to a question you asked me a few weeks ago. You said something to the effect of, do you think Adam Peters will have the final call? And I said, yeah, I think he will, but I think it's a very collaborative process this go-round.

I don't know if you read the John Kime column that had some Dan Quinn quotes in it. But Kime actually wrote, while Peters will make the final call on the selection, this year will mark the first time Quinn has been charged. with helping find a quarterback as a head coach of a team, because Matt Ryan, when he was the head coach, was already there. And then he writes that Quinn will rely. Quinn also has relied on Peters and offensive coordinator Cliff Kingsbury for their insight throughout the draft process. And I just, I mentioned yesterday that reading those lines,

there's the implication here that Quinn's voice matters a lot. In fact, it's almost as if Quinn's voice is the lead voice on this. Quinn has also relied on Peters and offensive coordinator Cliff Kingsbury for their insight throughout the draft process. He writes, John does, while Peters will make the final charge with helping find a quarterback as a head coach of a team. Quinn has been charged with helping find a quarterback as a head coach of a team. what do you make of that?

Well, I mean, look, we're reading too much into everything here. Of course, he's going to rely on their insight, and if their insight is, I like this guy, it's probably going to be the same guy that Adam Peters wants. I mean, Dan Quinn is not going to rely on Adam Peters' insight and say, oh, this guy's all wrong. I'm going with the other guy. So if they're relying on Peters and the offensive coordinator, what's his name?

Cliff Kingsbury is his name. Cliff Kingsbury. It's probably going to be Sympotigo. You know, Dan Quinn will probably come around to. Well, you know, these guys know what they're talking about. They're right unless he puts up a fight. Or for a guy that he's convinced is the guy. And if that's the case, then he wouldn't be relying on their insight.

Yeah, I just, I think Quinn is the seasoned person in the room. He's the one with the experience. Cliff Kingsbury's got a lot of experience. Adam Peters is a first time general manager, not that he hasn't worked in a football organization. It's not that Josh Harris just picked a friend that was, you know, running his hedge fund with him, but he's never been a general manager. Josh Harris has never been an NFL owner.

I think this all goes back to why they hire. Quinn in the first place, why they were looking for somebody like Quinn. They wanted a seasoned experienced voice in the decision-making process, especially considering that the first big decision this franchise is going to make may be the biggest and the most collaborative one they ever make, which is who to draft at number two. I just think that the idea of having a Ben Johnson or a Mike McDonald, someone, a head coach, a first-time head coach, wasn't nearly as appealing as somebody that was seasoned and experienced and respected like Dan Quinn. And I think Quinn's going to be a big part of making this decision.

That may be, but I don't think they had any doubts about Adam Peter's ability to do the job that they would need to bring in a veteran voice as some kind of different philosophy or different viewpoint into this. I'd be surprised if that was their thought process. One thing is a defensive coach. What he knows about offense is trying to stop it. And that's a different viewpoint. Yeah. But a valuable one.

Yes, it is, a valuable one. But I don't know what their process is. I would just, I think it's a little flawed if they, if they, if one of the reasons they pick Quinn was they felt they needed a seasoned voice in the room. I mean, this is not, again, this is not general manager in training. We've come across this before. He's the general manager. He's the guy in charge of it all.

Yeah, and I think that if, I'm not saying that number two and the decision on the quarterback is why Dan Quinn got hired. I think he got hired because they were looking for a leader. They were looking for a really good coach, but they were also looking for somebody who was experienced season, respected and a hell of a leader, which Dan Quinn go on in this first. But I think that part of what was going to go on in this first off season, while I think Adam Peters was consideration. And while I think Adam Peters, not a general manager in training,

a big time general manager, not a general manager in training in worry. That's not what I'm saying. I'm on probationary. Probationary period, that's not what I'm saying. Big one. They may never, season is such a big one. They may never, I mean, hopefully for them,

they may never have a decision like the one, that they're going to have to make on Thursday night, April 25th, when they're on the clock at number two. This is the most important decision other than, I guess, the hiring of Adam Peters and Dan Quinn, but in many ways it's even more important. And I think Quinn, whether it was intended this way or not, I think Quinn's going to be influential in this decision.

I think that they will look to him. him to use his experience in coming up with the right answer on this. He is the one that's the most experienced guy in the room, and he'll be in the room. But would you be shocked if it was dressed dramatically, if it was different from what Adam Peters wanted? No, I think one of the reasons that they, you know, Peters got hired by Harris and then Quinn got hired by Peters and Harris is because of what they've. talked about all along, which is they have this aligned vision and that they feel like they

will collaborate well together. But sometimes the best process is a process where there's disagreement and where there's pushback and challenges among your group. Of course there is. Yeah. Of course there is. But ultimately, there's one guy, one guy who makes the fine. decision. And actually, you could argue in this case, it's the owner. Because if there's a dramatic difference between the coach and a general manager, it may come down to Josh Harris deciding which one he's going to back. That's happened before. Yes, but to your point, I would be surprised if there was, in this particular case, a dramatic difference. I mean, I would remember when they, when everybody got hired and they acted as if quarterback had

even been discussed. That just didn't seem plausible. So I would imagine that they all have a sense of what they're looking for in the quarterback. But you could have a lot of these quarterbacks that have identical traits. And it's a really tough call. I just, I don't think this is new to me. This isn't like I'm surprised if Dan Quinn ends up being a significant voice in the selection of the player. And if he is, I bet you we never even really hear that it was. I hope we don't. I hope we hear that it was handled by the general manager. There was a lot of collaboration. There was a lot of agreement. But Adam made the final call. But I do have a feeling that Quinn's voice is a very, very important voice and one that Adam Peters and Josh Harris are going to rely on a lot over the, and they have

already. And, you know, reading through John's column, it sort of indicates that. So, anyway. Okay. Colin Cowherd on his show yesterday said he's learned that Washington's going to take Jaden Daniels. What do you, you know, we talked about the Adam Schepter stuff from last week. Do you think anybody's got anything or do you, for real on this? Because I kind of have a sense that it'd be tough before these top 30 visits to really get anything that's definitive out of the team? Oh, I think people like to talk, okay?

That they want to talk generally. And, you know, there's more voices that might have the information that you probably need to come to a good conclusion. other than what the general manager has to say. You know, there could be people in those meeting rooms in the process who have an idea how the team's going to do and, you know, talk to their buddy here or another coach there and it winds up, you know, in a reporter's notebook.

I think it's hard to keep people from stop talking, from not talking. in the organization or are you talking about media people in the organization I mean there's I mean don't you think that the assistant do you think the assistant coaches

have an idea like if they were picking today how the team would pick yeah I guess I mean certainly on the offensive side of the ball that's a lot of people then that's a lot of people in on it Adam Schaefter just apparently this afternoon on ESPN once again doubled down saying all signs pointing towards Washington taking Jaden Daniels with the number two pick in the NFL draft.

So that just was tweeted out by several people. And that would please you, right? Yeah. Yeah, I'd be thrilled with it. I'd be really excited about it. I like him a lot. Isaiah, I actually love Jane Daniels.

He would be the guy that I was in love with and I would pick it number two. But like I've said before, Kevin would walk into the 7-Eleven, walk up to the lottery machine and say, give me to Jane Daniels ticket. Yeah, the first, the power ball number or whatever would be five, his jersey number.

No, I think that, like I've said before, that would be my preference, but I also understand what Isaiah wrote, which is who the hell knows? They don't know. And more likely than not, I'll be tearing up that ticket two years after I played those numbers. But you still have to take them. So there you go. You want to talk some hoops?

Yeah, let's talk some hoops. I watched that game last night. I watched the women's game on Sunday. I watched both of them, too. We'll get to that and more right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey, guys, most of us are interested in our mental and physical well-being to a certain degree. And with that in mind, I'd like to welcome and introduce a new sponsor to the podcast. The new sponsor is Unified Healing, Unified spelled UNI-F-Y-D Healing.

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including E.E. system. It is a Yukon Kora National Champions. So impressive was Yukon last night. Pretty good first half, competitive first half, but man, were they a dominant team throughout the tournament for a second straight year? And they pulled away from Purdue pretty quickly in the second half of that game. We will get to thoughts on the national championship win for Yukon last night in a moment. But let me mention that this segment is brought to you by Window Nation. Call them at 86690 Nation or head to WindowNation.com. Mention my name and you'll get a free estimate so you've got nothing to lose.

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86690 Nation, windownation.com. Mention my name. All right. So I've got a lot about this game last night. I just was blown away impressed with Yukon last night and then really throughout this tournament. But I know you watch the game as well, so I'll let you start go. Well, I mean, I'm not as well versed in college basketball as you are, but I knew Yukon. That's who I had actually on my going into the final game.

I had Yukon versus Houston with Yukon winning the whole thing. I knew they were a powerhouse, a very strong defending champion. I knew Dan Hurley was a terrific coach. And I just, you know, I think, I'm not surprised by the outcome. and I'm not surprised with how easily it could seem to come to Connecticut. They play great defense. You know, all five guys on the court usually at any given time are valuable contributors. You know, you're not really losing anything on any of those guys.

Hurley said they had a philosophy where they were going to let Zach Eadie have his way and just keep the rest of the Purdue guys from score and make sure they were no threes, only twos. I'm sad to say that that was a good strategy, but I wasn't surprised by the outcome, and Dan Hurley is right, when he says for the last 25 or 30 years, Yukon has been running college basketball.

Do you like Danny Hurley? Yeah. I mean, I'm looking. I can't believe he was, He pushed his guy out on the court right in front of the referee, and there was arguing with the referee about it. I didn't used to love Danny Hurley. I love him now.

The last year or two, everything about him, I like. He's clearly wired very tightly, but he's got a great story, which we've talked about before. So what Yukon just accomplished is definitely unprecedented in that, I mean, if we talk about the era of 64 teams in a tournament, which started in 1985, I mean, if you want to go back and talk about Wooden's teams, Wooden's greatness is not debated, you know, by anybody. I think anybody that understands college basketball and understands the history of the game, understands Wooden's place in history and understands

what those UCLA teams were, but there were 25 teams in the tournament who was very regional In the era of this huge bracket that we fill out every year, this is the third time we've seen a back-to-back champion. And the first two, Duke and Florida, were two teams that came back largely intact from the year before. Danny Hurley lost five of his top eight scores from last year's national championship team, which the tournament run was an all-time tournament run in terms of, margin of victory. They average 20 points in margin of victory over a six-game stretch last year. He comes back with a completely new roster, and he averages 23 points plus per victory in routing everybody

to a second straight title. I talked about this a little bit this morning on radio, because I thought about this last night. The comp, the sports coaching comp for what Danny Hurley's done the last two years is Joe Gibbs. What do we say about Joe Gibbs? He won the Super Bowl with three different quarterbacks. That was what separated him from so many of the other greatest of all-time coaches. Now, I don't have Gibbs at the top, nor do you. But if you're having a Gibbs versus a Parcells or a Gibbs versus a Walsh or a Gibbs versus a Jimmy Johnson or whatever from that era, Gibbs has something that nobody's ever accomplished.

And that is winning three different Super Bowls with three different starting quarterbacks. Danny Hurley just went back to back with two completely different rosters, different teams. Good players, really good players, NBA players on both teams. But it's kind of unbelievable that, first of all, you'd see such dominance from any team on the way to a title. But to get it back-to-back years with two completely different rosters says that Danny Hurley is a great coach. You don't win back-to-back titles in the dominant

fashion that he just and Yukon just did with two completely different rosters if you're not a phenomenal basketball coach? You know, I didn't see much of Yukon this year. Probably the only time I saw him was in the tournament. But this speaks to how great your coaching is. There never seemed a time where that team seemed lost out there. Never. They just never seemed lost. Tommy, this is the kind of basketball you should love. I had Gary Williams on this morning, and he's like, it's just kind of a pleasure to watch them because everybody is constantly on offense in motion. All five guys are touching the ball.

It is a true five-man offense. Honestly, that team, and it was noticeable as the tournament was going on, and I didn't watch a lot of college basketball during the course of the year, for Maryland in the Big Ten. But this was a dominant performance by a team that had it all. They had the talent, they had the size, they had the length, the wingspan, the athleticism, the skill, and the IQ. I mean, the players are smart and the head coach was outstanding.

I mean, that team is so good and so fun to watch. they just wear you out by running amazing offense. They're hard to guard. They're hard to scout, I would imagine. And because they wear you out with their offense, it makes their defense even more effective, which, by the way, it's great to begin with. But the other team gets worn out trying to guard you on one end. And you could see it coming all night.

Like it was a really good first half. It was a well-played first half. both teams played really well in the first half, but you could see how much harder it was for Purdue and how they were starting to kind of wear out, and then you really saw it in the second half. Oh, yeah. And it just...

You could see Eid's body language in the second half of the second half, he was worn down, he was beaten. They just, Purdue was a really good team. team, Tommy, all year. Really well-coached team. Like, I'm a big Matt Painter fan. I thought that he could have done a lot more last night. Surprise that he didn't try different things defensively in particular.

But it's just what Yukon's done throughout the last two tournaments. It's like they just, with amazing offense, they wear you out with smart, relentless defense, with a rim protector. They just guard you so well, and they just wear you down. And eventually, you just don't have enough left. You can't stop them. You can't, you know, generate enough offensively. And the margin just keeps getting wider and wider.

And that's what we saw last night. I thought there were a couple of interesting things. Hurley deciding not to double Zach Eadie. You basically have a couple of choices. You double him or you don't double him. There are other things you can do. But he went basically straight up and decided we're not going to let him, because he is a good passer, kick it out to three-point shooters.

He dominated them early. And at one of the timeouts, Hurley said, yeah, this is unsustainable. We're going to have to try different things. But the truth is they didn't on Eadie. They did when he was out of a little bit of. it when Klingan left the game and they had the backup center in there. They helped a little bit, but they just, they gave up one three point, made three pointer on just seven three point attempts in the game for Purdue.

He got 37. He had 37 points in the game, but they lost by 15. So kudos to Hurley for having a game plan, really believing in it. And early on, probably wondering, as he did with Tracy Wolfson during that interview, I don't know, maybe I'm wrong on this. Maybe we do need to double team them. But they didn't, and they eventually warmed down. And then Matt Painter, I just thought they couldn't guard them for 40 minutes man to man. And you could see in the first half, especially as the first half were on, their guards were getting deep.

They were penetrating too deep, which was giving them easier and better scoring opportunities than Purdue was getting. I just never understand coaches who are hell-bent on playing man-to-man. They don't like zone. They don't want to play zone. But you've got Zach Edie. Zach Edie should not be chasing ball screens out on the perimeter and being away from the basket. I think I would have loved to have seen them try some zone. and mix it up a lot more.

I mean, I think Yukon has an answer for everything, so it's not like I think that would have worked. But, I mean, there was a stretch there when they had the big long guy who was in foul trouble in the game, where they just, they ran, you know, multiple screens, and then they had to pick and roll two back-to-back dunks. And it was like, Purdue can't guard them. They've got no chance to guard this team.

especially now that they're freaking exhausted. And I just thought, as a coach, you got to maybe pack in his own and say, go ahead and shoot threes. You can make them. I know you can, but we're not going to give up. We're not going to wear ourselves out chasing you around the way they did. I'm a big Matt Painter fan. I thought he was out coach last night, but I don't even think it mattered because Yukon,

their players, you know, certainly two through five were better than Purdue's. And Purdue's got good players, really good players, really, really good basketball team. I still think in my college basketball watching Lifetime, the 1990 UNLV team, the 90 and 91 UNLV teams, they beat Duke by 30 and 90. They lost to Duke in the semifinals in 91 when they were an undefeated team. I still think that's the best team I've ever seen with Ogman and Larry Johnson and Greg Anthony, et cetera, with Tark coaching them. But I don't know that we've ever seen a back-to-back performance like what Yukon just did the last two years.

Yeah. I got a question for you. What do you think of a genetic stake man, Donovan? I think he's got to be a top three pick in the draft. Really? Yeah. He's that good defensively? I think so.

I didn't know that, honestly, because I didn't watch a lot this year. And as the tournament went on, and before the final four, I think I said to Denton on Friday, I'm like, I haven't looked at a mock draft, but this guy Klingin's got to be a top five, top ten pick, right? And he's like, I haven't seen him in the top ten. Then we looked, and he was top three at that point. point he had moved up. It's not a great draft, Tommy.

It's not a great lottery this year for trying to find that superstar, which, by the way, in the NBA, sometimes it happens, you know, with Janice or Kauai Leonard in the middle of the first round, and you fail on the top two as well. But, yeah, I like him a lot. I actually like him as a pro more than I like Eady by a lot. He's more athletic. He runs well.

Sporting news has him going ninth in the draft to the Rockets. Okay. I think ESPN... And they talk about his wingspan. Yeah. He's mostly 7-7. He's an elite shot blocker, rebounder. He is definitely an elite shot blocker.

I think it was Jonathan Giovanni, Giovanni on ESPN's latest mock had him going third to Charlotte. They had Washington second taking some guy from Perth, Australia. And the guy that I think is kind of a consensus number one, although it may be in the eye of the beholder this year, because there really isn't an overwhelming number one, is some French guy. So, yeah, I like clinging. I mean, like I could see him, you know,

if you don't shoot threes in today's NBA, even if you're a center, people, you know, knock you down multiple pegs. I think there's a place for an athletic center that's a big-time shot blocker. I mean, there's a place for Rudy Gobert in the league. You know, there are places. You've got the right coach. You certainly can use a 7-foot-2 defensive stud in the middle. Absolutely.

He can finish too offensively. He's got good hands. He's got good feet. But, you know, these days it's like if you got Victor Wembegiana, you got Chet Holmgren. I know. It's like that's what they're looking for. I know. But I like Klingin.

I think that he's got a chance to be a good player. A star player? No. Not the kind of player you need to contend, but a guy that's going to be a guy that'll play a lot in the NBA. Zach Eadie's more interesting to me. Like, I'm rooting for him. But I think I don't,

I just don't see where he's anything other than kind of a journeyman spot duty player at the NBA level. I would agree. I would agree with that. He doesn't have enough particular quickness. He has all the offensive skills that you would expect in a guy his size.

But there's nothing particularly unique about him that is going to stand out in the NBA. great college career, all time maybe for Purdue. Sometimes when I watch him, I think he should be a little bit more advanced offensively than he is at the college level. I mean, even last night you saw something. He often will get his feet tangled and not be exactly together, you know, hands, feet, ball.

I mean, he missed a couple of shots in there against clinging. I mean, that's tough. It's 7472. But, yeah. Yukon is just super impressive, Hurley super impressive. The talk about him going to Yukon, I don't see that.

Going to Yukon. Going to Kentucky. I don't see that. Yeah, I don't see that. He's such a northeastern guy. Yeah, he said it was hard to get his wife out of New Jersey as it was. Yeah. I mean, Patino was pretty much a northeastern guy.

too, and he did pretty well in Kentucky and became a horse lover. And so the money may speak. Petino's got a different makeup. I'm sorry. Than Danny Hurley? Yeah. Hurley comes from a different kind of family. Yeah, agreed.

Yeah, I think that's true. But there is something to consider just beyond just money. And that is what's college sports going to look like three or four years from now? What's the Big East's place in that? Kentucky's in the SEC. The SEC and the Big Ten rule college sports. So if you're in one of those leagues, you're good. You should be okay in the Big 12 now.

And I guess you'll be okay in the ACC maybe. But we don't know what this will look like. And the Big East is a basketball only league. and the money is all in the SEC in the Big Ten. Right. You know, those are the things you would consider, but I would imagine he stays at Yukon. By the way, the all too early look ahead to next college basketball season,

almost everybody has Maryland in their top 20. ESPN had them ranked 20th. I've seen them as high as 16, as low as like 23. but the five-star kid Derek Queen, who played really well last week and what they've done in the portal so far has them. Now, they were last year too. They weren't ranked preseason last year.

I was actually surprised at that. But they were picked as high as third in the Big Ten, and they'll be picked in the top three or four in the Big Ten next year as well. You know, the only thing about this tournament that I wish we could have seen, I'm glad we saw Purdue Yukon, but I think Houston would have been the best match

up. A healthy Houston team would have been the best matchup and probably... That's what I had for my final. Yeah, and probably provided the best game for Yukon, because they're just as tough and physical and, you know, athletically gifted on defense in particular. But I think Yukon just is a better offensive team. You know, man. I mean, I don't want to... This isn't fair to ask you because it really shouldn't be either. or or, but it's just the transition to briefly talk about it. What do you enjoy more, the men's game or the women's game? You mean the championship games?

Yes. I think the first quarter of that women's championship game was unbelievable. And so I would probably say the women's championship game, but I actually thought the first half of the game last night was great too. But South Carolina and Yukon were very serious. similar and that they were just much better than anybody else in the field. And for a lot of the same reasons, just physically better, and I think from an IQ and a coaching standpoint, just better, because I think Don Staley does, you know, in the few games that I've

watched, she does a great job too. What about you? No, I'd like the women's game more. I enjoyed it more. But you're right. I mean, what was the point? I mean, the point total, the bench total points, I'm not sure Iowa had any bench points, or if they did it, it was in single-did-in-no.

I think you're right. Yeah. And, I mean, it was just, but that's an example of, you know, Sartreckle. It was just too good, too deep, too talented for Iowa to overcome for four quarters. 37 to nothing bench scoring difference. Oh my God. Yeah. But really that game, and you could tell early, it was rebounding.

Like, Iowa couldn't get a rebound unless it was fumbled out of the hands of an offensive rebounder into their hands. Or if it was like a long rebound that came out to, you know, a guard. They just got absolutely annihilated on the glass. and because of that, they ended up with, you know, a lot more shots and shot attempts. And, yeah, I mean, South Carolina, I didn't like we talked about, you know, the other day or Thursday, I didn't watch other games. I watched Iowa this year when they were on, and I watched Iowa in the tournament. I knew South Carolina was really good.

and obviously they were picked by almost everybody that really did follow the sport. But they were impressive. I mean, they were an impressive team. And I thought, like, just watching the sets they run, watching the way they defend, I was just impressed overall with how good South Carolina was. There was, Don Staley had a line. God, I'm probably going to butcher it, but I'm going to see if I can remember it after the game. I should probably try to find it, but it was about the kind of players that she looks for.

She said basically something to the effect of we look for how kids treat their parents. If they respect their parents, they'll respect us. If they don't respect their parents, we don't have a chance. I don't even know if that's actually true because I do think that sometimes coaches and a sports environment with a coach who's a disciplinarian and not afraid of the kids that they're coaching can handle kids in a way that maybe sometimes parents don't. But beyond that, there's something about Dawn Staley that I actually just like. I didn't know much about her, honestly, but I've watched a couple of interviews with her. I saw her on with Scott the other night. And there's just something about her as like a coach,

a leader of young people that I kind of liked. I would agree. The thing that I wanted to talk to you about, and I kind of saved it for you today, is just 18.1 million viewers. The game peaked at 24 million. I've not seen the numbers yet for the men's game. They should be out here shortly. They might be out while we're still recording this podcast. But this is just incredible.

like even the great Ted Leonsis, who has been at the forefront of investing in women's sports, and the edgiest and the earliest adopter of women's sports investing, in a meeting a year ago could have never said, I see 18 million people watching the women's final, the most watched basketball game, NBA, men's college, or women's college in five years. I mean, it really is remarkable. I said on the podcast...

And think about it, it was on a Sunday afternoon at 3 o'clock. Yeah. Yeah, they didn't even put it in prime time. It was not a prime time game. I said on the podcast yesterday, Tommy, that if I were Disney, I'd look at paying her $20 million or whatever the number is to have her come back and play at Iowa.

there's got to be an unbelievable return on investment for paying Caitlin Clark to come back and play one more year at Iowa. I mean, imagine the TV package reworkings, the new package deals with Amazon, with Peacock, with, I mean, it would be an absolute, you know, haul of new money for that sport. think she's going to do it, and I don't think they're going to do it. But I bet you there's some sort of investment they could make in her that would basically create a situation for her where she's generationally wealthy that would pay off in a big way. I think you're right. You know, for all these networks. Yeah. I think you're right.

I think she seems to have exhausted her time at Iowa. And now the question is, will this audience that watched for the first time, clearly, will they follow her to the WNBA and watch the WNBA? Will you go to a mystics game when she's playing? No. No? Would I? Really? Would I?

Yeah, I would. Am I going to seek it out? Like, am I going to be looking for when she's in town? No. Really? I would be. That's fine. By the way, if you get tickets, I'll get the parking. I'll handle the parking. I'm not paying. I'm not paying to go seer.

I'm not paying to go seer. That's not what Levera does. No, Levera doesn't pay for anything. So if you get credentials for it and you can't get parking because they, for whatever reason, don't seem to take care of you as far as parking's concerned. I'll get the parking. But in all seriousness, does this audience transfer to the WNBA?

I say no. I say initially maybe yes for her first few games, but I don't think it ends up being what we've just witnessed. What do you think? Well, what if, what if, look, I think there's a chance it could, What if Clark and Angel Reese turn out to be Bird and Magic of the WNBA? A rivalry. You know what would be really interesting to find out.

Did Bird draw bigger numbers than Magic in 1979? Because Indiana State's games started to be nationally televised. Were they bigger draws or were the Indiana State? games that were on in the tournament, bigger draws than Michigan State's games were? Because in 1979, Larry Bird was the Great White Hope. And a lot of the interest in what Larry Bird was doing was because he was white. And I don't know what the difference. I know this.

I know the college final in 79 in Salt Lake City, Michigan State, Indiana State is still the most watched basketball game. NBA or college of all time. You know, different era, obviously, not as much competition. But if you ever hear the Nolan Richardson, it's on YouTube, Nolan Richardson talk about Larry Bird. Nolan Richardson told this story about driving down the road and he got an Indiana State game on the radio and he kept hearing about Bird to the bass.

and bird this and bird that. He didn't know who Larry Bird was. So, Nolan Richardson said, man, this brother can play. Yeah, and then he found out he was white.

I mean, that was a hunt. Look, Larry Bird turned out to be all that more. But the fascination with Larry Bird was, oh my God, there's this white dude named Bird plays at Indiana State.

And he's just, he's great. And then you had magic at the same time. I remember watching magic at Michigan State and college. He was, we had never seen a point guard who was six foot nine. We hadn't seen it in the NBA either. We had never seen it in college. And it was a show to watch Michigan State teams with him and Greg Kessler. And they dominated Larry Bird's Indiana State team in the final.

But I wonder if there were big ratings differences because clearly Caitlin Clark is the draw here. It's not Angel Reese. It's not South Carolina. It's Caitlin Clark. That's why 18.7 million. Did they say 18.1? 18.7 million people watched and 14.6 million watched on Friday night. You know, the numbers went up from the Angel Reese game as they became more important,

including, as you mentioned, one that wasn't even on in prime time, although it was on network TV on ABC. Yes. It's all about Caitlin Clark. If she comes into that league and starts putting up 40 a game with 15 assists and she's dominating the league, I mean, I'm not going to put it past her to, or the audience that just watched to say, when is the Indiana fever on and what network are they on?

I'll watch it. I think there will be definitely early action on the WNBA for her first few games. But what if she's just a normal player? What if she's just okay? Then it's going to kind of wear off, won't it? Yeah, it will. Yeah, it would wear off. Let me ask you this question.

For me, go ahead. What we just witnessed, which is unmistakable, Caitlin Clark just pulled almost to Tiger Woods, bringing a whole new audience that couldn't care less about women's basketball into her games that she played in. Count me in as one of them. Tiger Woods did the same thing in 1997, brought a whole new audience to golf. and every time he played, it was much, much higher ratings than when he wasn't in the final group or, you know, in contention.

If Caitlin Clark weren't white, would the numbers have been the same over the last month or the last year? Probably not. I don't think so. Now, okay, this is really complicated shit we're going to go down here. but it doesn't necessarily speak to being racist. Okay. Oh, I wasn't suggesting. I know that.

I know you know that. Yeah. I know you know that. But I'm just, we talked about this on a radio before. This is why black people generally tend to root for black quarterbacks because there's a racial identity involved there. You know, people like to see people like them compete.

This is part of the problem in baseball, that there's not enough minority representation. So there's not enough interest in a minority community because they don't see people like them out there in center field or on the mound. So yeah, in basketball now, the way the game has evolved to have a white superstar like that, yes. Of course it's going to attract more attention. Yeah, by the way, the baseball thing really is unfortunate. Yes, it is. It really is. But it's not what we grew up with.

No, it's not. No. I mean, 50 years ago last night, Hank Aaron hit number 715. I think there's actually a lot to it, but I would answer the question the same way, that it would not have attracted as many people had it been a black player instead of a pig-tailed, you know, a ponytail-tailed white Midwest girl. But there's more to it, too. It's the way she does it with these ridiculous long-range shooting threes.

Because it's what Steph Curry brought to, you know, to the NBA game. By the way, it's sort of a comparison to Tiger that's pretty, I think, close to. analogous other than it's flipped the other way because in 1997 we had never seen a player. He brought black people. He brought minorities who had never paid attention to golf. He brought them under the golf tent. Caitlin Clark, there have been some great white players in basketball. It's not like it's that unusual.

But in that sport, maybe it has been. although, you know, I was watching, I don't know enough about the history of the sport, but, you know, I was watching various, actually, haven't all of the superstars in the sport? Not all of them, no. Rebecca, what's her face? Lobo was the announcer on the broadcast. She was a superstar. Cheryl Miller.

Well, Cheryl Miller is black. I'm trying to find white superstar women's college basketball players. I mean, it wasn't that Sue Bird and, The one that plays for the Mystics, who played at Delaware. What's her name? Deladon or whatever, I think. We're terrible talking about women's college basketball history. And I admit it.

I don't know anything about it. But I just think as we were sitting there talking about bird and magic, and you said, what if Caitlin Clark and Angel Reese become magic in bird? I wonder if, I bet you if there was, if there's data for this, I bet you bird got a bigger audience in, guys, definitely in 1979 than Magic did. But Magic was unique too. Angel Reese wasn't, isn't the equivalent to Magic Johnson, because Magic Johnson, like Caitlin Clark shooting 35 foot threes pulling up from logos, that was a big part of the appeal. black or white. A big part of the appeal black or white. But the Magic Johnson in 1979 being a six foot eight inch, six foot nine inch point guard leading the fast break was so weird to watch.

And it was fascinating to watch. But I still bet you Byrd got bigger numbers. Probably. And that final would never have gotten the number it got if it were Magic Johnson against Mark Aguire, who was great for DePaul. Here's part of the appeal from Byrd back then. What? Was Bird play for a college that nobody paid attention to?

True. Indiana State. That's true. You know, he didn't play for UCLA. That's a good point. And people like the Cinderella aspect of it. You know, because he was literally carrying a whole school's program on his back. Yeah, and yes, that's a really good point.

There was this small school, by the way, you know, kind of middle of, you know, farmland, tractor land, America, Hick. You know, now, so was Jerry West, right, coming out of West Virginia. Yes. Yeah, no, no, I agree with you. Like if he had played for UCLA or if he had played for Indiana, If he had played for Bobby Night at Indiana, it wouldn't have been the same thing. Wouldn't have been the same thing. By the way, you mentioned Jerry West.

He just got elected to the basketball Hall fame for the third time. What, coach, general manager, and player? Player, general manager, and now contributor. Contributor? Why did they feel it? I don't know. I don't know. I mean, the NBA, the basketball hall fame,

it's a little bit different than the others. I mean, it's easier to get to. Chaunty Billups got elected to Hall of Fame. I don't quite understand that. But Jerry West just got elected for the third time, three different categories. All right. Let's finish up with your column on Strasbourg. We'll do that right after these words from a few of our sponsors.

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All right, Tommy, tell us about Shelly's. Well, I told you on Sunday I watched the girls' championship game. I watched it at Shelly's back room. I was at Nats Park early. It was a great day for me because I was at Nats Park earlier in the day, and it was a nice day. And, you know, I had an easy column to write because they announced the news that Strasbourg had retired.

So I did my interviews around the clubhouse, wrote my column, and I saw it was 2.30. I didn't have to stay for the game because I wasn't writing about the game. I said I could make it over to Shelly 5'3 for the women's championship game. So that's where I headed. And it's one of my favorite places to watch basketball. They have eight high-definition TVs all around the two rooms at Shelly's. And they have such comfortable seating, great wooden, oak tables and couches, velvet couches.

And what I got, the best part was I got to sit with the master, the owner himself, Bob Matarazzi, and watch the game. He feed you? Bob was there. Did he feed you? No, he didn't feed me. You weren't hungry? You know, no, I wasn't hungry. But Bob knows sports.

Yeah, Bob's a big sports fan. Huge skins fan, yeah. Yeah, so it was great sitting there watching it with him. People were very excited about the game watching it. And that's the kind of atmosphere as Shelley's has. It's the kind of people are passionate at Shelly's. You know, they're passionate about their cigars. They're passionate about their liquor.

They're passionate about their sports. They're passionate about the people they get to meet at Shelley's Backroom. You find out more and find your own passionate at Shelly's. Go to shelley's backroom.com. Okay. Tell me about your Strasbourg column. Well, when the news spoke about Strasbourg, you know, I talked to Sean Doolittle, who's probably known him as certainly knows him longer than anybody on.

that roster, was Doolittle came to the team in the second half of 2017 in a trade. David Martinez didn't get there until 2018. So Doolittle, New Strasbourg longer than anybody, and he talked about, and everybody, and everybody mentioned these words, he talked about, you know, how tough Strasbourg was. You know, how he called, he kept calling him a beast, you know, to go out there and take the ball. in as much pain as he had been on and off throughout his career. And that was big, like, the common thread. Davy Martinez called him a horse.

You know, they both call them a competitor. And my column, these were not the words that first described Stephen Strasbourg in his first few years in the league. Nobody was calling him a beast or competitor. There were a lot worse. I mean, from the 2012 shutdown, where people felt like he didn't meekly fight back against it to 2014 NLDS against the Giants,

where the Giants just made Strasbourg their target from bench jockey. It just said some horrific things about his manhood. Okay, really, really a rough time. He changed all that, and you've talked about this before. You know, the Cubs series in 2016, where supposedly he was going to bow out of the game because he was sick. Yeah.

You know? And all the reports that were coming from inside the organization, questioning his toughness and all that. Yeah. And he went out there and made the start, despite being sick, and put on a brilliant performance. Dominant. You know, and that's when the conversation changed about Strasbourg.

was that game, that series, and since then he became the beast, the horse, the postseason legend that he would become one of the greatest pitchers in the history of postseason. So that's what my calm was about, the transition of Steven Stratt, the perception of Strasbourg. Yeah, it is kind of interesting because ultimately this guy's one of the greatest big game performers. in Major League Baseball postseason history for pitchers. You know, I discussed yesterday. I'd put Rigo 1 on the all-time list of clutch performers in D.C. sports history, but I think Strasbourg's too.

I mean, you know. I think you're right. Walter Johnson, Sammy Baugh, excluded from the conversation. But I found it thrilling, too, to watch him, you know, in 2019. But that game, that was an afternoon game, was cloudy, it was cold, it was gray at Wrigley, they're down two to one. Dusty kind of called him out, borderline embarrassed him, and there was a lot of discussion. Like, if he doesn't come out and pitch with the season on the line, I mean, you know, what was Tony's nickname for him, Orchid? You know,

he was super delicate. Yeah, the Orchid, yeah. And this is what, you're right, this is what his reputation was, and I think that game changed it. You know, no earned runs. struck out 12, dominated the White Sox. Of course, they didn't win game five. And then, you know, everything he did during the postseason, you know, as I was going through, because game six of the World Series is just all-time great. And I reminded everybody of Paul Menhart, and you and I have talked about this before, but I still find it to be so interesting, the conversation that Davy Martinez relayed

after that game that Menhart came to him and said Strasberg's tipping his pitches, giving up two runs on two hits in the first inning, and they actually discussed whether or not they should tell him. I was like, well, what's the option? Yeah. Well, the option was they didn't want to throw him off. They thought he might figure it out himself, but they did tell him, and then he completely dominated the rest of the game.

But, you know, there were a couple of other games. during that postseason where he was incredible. Obviously, he came in in the Milwaukee Wildcard game in relief and was really good. Then in the NLDS against the Dodgers in game two, he was brilliant when they won four to two, struck out 10, one earned run. Game number three, hold on, I need to pull it up again here because I had it up yesterday. Game three in the National League Championship Series when they swept St. Louis. Now, that series was never, there wasn't a clutch game necessarily in that series because they dominated.

But his performance in game three, here it is. They won eight to one, seven innings, one, no earned runs, 12 strikeouts. And then, of course, the World Series. Domination. Domination. He's got a 1.46 ERA in the postseason. I know. It's a shame we didn't get to see more, but now, and I'm writing about this probably for Thursday's paper, now all of a sudden baseball has decided that they've got a pitching crisis on their hands with all the pitching injuries

that have come up and maybe they're going to, like, do this in-depth study. The time to do it was when Strasbourg first got hurt. This was, people forget that when Strasbourg came up, made his debut, he was really an off-the-charts-hyped superstar. He was maybe the first social media star that baseball ever had. Not that he had anything to do with it, but people kept, I mean, that's when Twitter sort of exploded, and everything he did was all over Twitter, you know, and social media. media, and from its minor league starts to the major leagues, and all of a sudden now this guy's going to have Tommy John surgery. That's what baseball should have said, oh, my God, this kid who has everyone so excited

did last half a season in Major League Baseball, and he's got to have surgery. We need to study this. Now here it is, what, 14 years later, and, you know, they've got a half a dozen guys that, in the past two weeks that require Tommy John surgery. surgery. Now they've decided it's a crisis. They should have did it when Strasbourg went down. Man, remember that debate before that first playoffs in 2012 against Lewis? You know, I remember standing on the field with Rizzo at the All-Star break and saying, Mike, I don't know if you know what's coming, but what you're doing, I'm not saying I don't agree

with you. I said, but what you're doing is you're shutting down a healthy player and a championship run based on what you think might happen. That's never been done before so publicly, as it's going to be done now. That's going to be, that's going to be NBC Nightly News material. It was a big deal. It was so debated. Yes. And, yeah, I mean, who knows? I mean, by the way, it's not like Rizzo was affected by what people said about him. He couldn't have cared less.

Heath really was adamant that, and the organization was, that they were doing the right thing. You know, there's a framed picture of Strasbourg on the cover of Sports Illustrated hanging in Rizzo's office. With an inscription, with an autograph from Strzheimer with the inscription, Mike, thanks for protecting me. Really? Wow. Yes. RG3's got one of those in his office, too, signed by Mike Shannon.

I'm kidding. I'm kidding. Remember, that was the same time. I know. That was the same time almost. What do you mean? It was the same time. It was 2012. Yes.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, their postseason was 2012 and Washington's was in the middle of their regular season. 2012 was, you know, well, it was Harper's debut too. I mean, we had Harper, we had RG3, we had Strasbourg, and we had John Wall as what people thought in that moment were superstars at the very beginning of their careers, basically. And, yeah, well, look, Strasbourg, and we had Ovechkin. We had Ovechkin too. I mean, it was really, in 2012, you had Strasbourg and Harper,

two of the most hyped prospects ever, right? And Washington had gotten them both. You had RG3, who was in the midst of this magical rookie season. You had Alex Ovechkin, who at that point would have been in what, the fourth or fifth year, fourth year of, he was really starting to enter his prime as the best goal score and offensive player in the game. And then John Wall had just been drafted the year before, right? And there was a lot of hope for him as well. But by the way, the, I do not think that Mike Shanahan, as I've said many times,

had the responsibility of doing anything other than listening to what the doctors said. And the doctors said, we didn't do this in January. We didn't do this in January. How did we miss the 10-year anniversary of one of the most infamous games in franchise history doing like a full show on it? But Dr. Beanie and the Peeney and the Peeney and the Peeney, player basically, you know, didn't communicate the truth. Go ahead.

Right. What's your better thing? You know, my guy, Tray Linscombe last night for the Nationals, had three hits and three steals, including stealing home. And Lane Thomas had three hits as well, including the home run. But the Nationals also reported about a half an hour ago that starting pitcher Josiah Gray is on the disabled list with right elbow forearm flex or strain. Oh, geez.

That's bad news. That's too bad because they... Elbow problems is always something to be very concerned about. Yeah, because they had... Yeah, I saw the Lipscomb story early this morning, and I thought of you because you liked him coming out of spring training, and they've also won a couple of games here. Yes. And they dominated the Giants last night and Blake Snell. I mean, they knocked him out after three innings.

They got some good pitching performance from McKenzie Gore on Sunday and Trevor Williams, yes, on Monday. Yeah. So there you go. Soto had a big bomb last night. Yankees are rolling. Well, I miss him. I miss him. What a great guy. Not just a great player, but what a great kid. Yeah, I think he had a,

I'm looking to see if that's how many home runs he has. Oh, that was only his second home run. But he's hitting 357. He's got 10 RBIs and two homers. So he's doing pretty well. He's going to like it there. Yep. Caps have a massive game tonight.

Seriously. A little bit. They play at Detroit. And this is not do or die as far as the playoffs go, but a regulation loss would be really devastating. They got to somehow at least get a point out of this. They're in free fall right now. They've lost six in a row.

Two of those, they've got to point in in overtime losses. But other teams have gotten hot like the penguins and the islanders in particular. And so tonight is a massive game. If you want to see the caps in the postseason this year, they got to go to Detroit at the very least get a point. A regulation loss would be pretty devastating. it would be a big hit to their hopes with just five games left, four games after tonight. All right.

You got anything else? I got nothing else for you, boss. All right, that was fun today. I will be back tomorrow. See you, Tommy. See you. Perhaps we've never seen a final game with two greater individual players than Larry Bird, the player of the year from Indiana State, and the Magic Man from East Lansing,

Urban Johnson. You know, a lot of people were surprised yesterday, Larry, when you mentioned that you played ball with Magic Johnson in the world invitational tournament. Well, you know, Magic played together in that game. And, you know, it's funny because Magic's such a great passer, but he wouldn't give me the ball. You know, and I need the ball. Well, I hope he don't think I'm going to pass a tour in the night either.

But I thought I'll pass him the ball. Maybe he forgot it.