The Kevin Sheehan Show - Nats, Dodgers and Colt

Episode Date: October 3, 2019

Thom calls in from Los Angeles where the Nats and Dodgers play Game 1 tonight in the NLDS. The guys preview the series and make picks. Then it's Colt McCoy time. Jay Gruden gave a few clues yesterday that Colt McCoy will be the starter Sunday against the Patriots....the guys react. Kevin has an NFL Smell Test pick tonight too. <p> </p><p>Learn more about your ad choices. Visit <a href="https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices">podcastchoices.com/adchoices</a></p> Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You want it. You need it. It's what everyone's talking about. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Now here's Kevin. You're listening to The Sports Fix. I am here. Aaron Seer, Tommy is calling in from Los Angeles, where he tweeted out his first ever view of Dodger Stadium live yesterday, because you've never been to Dodger Stadium, and you'll be there tonight for game one, and you'll be there tomorrow night for game two. And we will preview that here shortly. But, I know you were, you know, you definitely had some angst over the schedule that you were going to have following Tuesday night's game. Very little sleep, had to catch an early flight. You know, how are you feeling? How did it work out for you? You know, I'm kind of stunned, but I feel pretty good. I mean, it was, it was pretty crazy 24-hour, 36 hours or so. Because let's go back to the wild card game Tuesday night, which was,

unbelievable. From the sixth inning, the sixth inning and the seventh inning, I wrote what I think was a real damn good losing story for the Washington Nationals. Right. Pretty good, probably much better than the winning story. And then in the eighth inning, I had to tear all that up and write a whole new story. And I hadn't done that in a while. I mean, years ago, I used to be used to it.

Sometimes you'd write three stories in a matter of a half an hour. hour before the right one would wind up being the accurate one. But I was able to do that. But while I'm doing that, as the game ends, and everybody in the press box is the same way, you're trying to make airplane arrangements. You're trying to make your flight reservations because you couldn't do it unless you knew you were going. So I'm making my LA arrangements in the middle of writing a story, and it was just

other chaos, but it was a lot of fun. And it's been a lot of fun ever since. What was your deadline Tuesday night? When did you have to have your story written by? Okay. Well, in the new age of what we do, you know, there's the print edition and then there's the online edition. Right.

And the print edition is early. I mean, the game didn't make the print edition. So there is no deadline once that goes. the days of the deadline are over. If you don't make the print edition, it's whenever, whenever you get it in to post on the web. The only deadline is forcing people to stay up late

to read it on the other side, the editor. So there's no deadline anymore. Yeah, but you have, whether it's online or going to be in print or both, you do have an editor that is standing by to read what you've written. I certainly hope you have an editor

because I've seen your first draft. before. It ain't pretty. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Are you kidding me? Somebody asked me once, I mean, look, I don't edit myself. The first thing I write is usually the best thing I'm going to write. But yeah, there's somebody waiting on the other end. And, you know, by that time, it's close to midnight, and they want to go to bed. Right. So what was the first story about the Nats losing the wild card game? Why was it so good? Well, because I had written that this time, there would be no stories to tell your son or your grandson about the meltdown.

There would be no fifth-in-ning disaster. There would be no blowing of leads. There would be no epic failures to recount years from now. They just crawled into the stadium and then they crawled out. And you liked it, huh? was a good one. I think... Oh, what?

I mean, they were losing three to one with three hits. I know. Going into the eighth inning. They were going down with a whimper. Yeah. Don't you think that you are... Look, you know, I love the way you write, and I love the way it's so easy to consume your columns.

And I think you are, by the way, much funnier as a writer than you are as a host. But you're funny as a host. But you can be really... funny as a writer. Like, I have found myself reading your columns and laughing out loud at one-liners before. But don't you think you are better when you are on the attack? Well, you know why? Because I've got so much practice covering Washington sports doing it in a way. I mean, if I, let's say if I was in New England covering Boston sports, I might, you know, it might be totally different. I mean, I haven't had much practice at the other part.

Right. Covering Washington sports teams. Yeah. Well, you know, I mean, who's to say? Yeah. Well, you are right. Like, if they had just come in and crawled out in a whimper in a 3-1 game, you know, it certainly wouldn't compare to, you know, the 6-0-blown lead in 2012 or, you know,

the Drew Storen, you know, in 2014 against the Giants in game two or Scherzer, you know, giving up one home run to Jack Peterson and then getting yanked for five relievers and they're getting crushed, you know, 20 minutes later. And then, of course, the crazy fifth inning against the Cubs in 2017. You wouldn't have had that. You know, Tommy, we had a lot of, we had a long conversation about who the pitcher should have been. And you made a very strong case why Max should be starting that game on Tuesday night. You said that it would really not go over well in the Clubhouse if he didn't start that game. They're lucky that they survived that game.

I mean, when you think about it, they didn't start the right pitcher from a giving them the best chance to win standpoint. Strasbourg would have been that guy. And they needed one of the best closers in the sports to basically gag up a two-run lead with four outs left to avoid what would have been major scrutiny. That would have been, see, if they had lost that game, three to one. To me, there's no getting around the fact that the major takeaway and the major story coming out of that game is that Dave Martinez started the wrong guy. Yes, you're

absolutely right. Even though in a three one, in a three run nine inning game, it's hard to fault the pitchers. But you're right. That would have been the debate. And I might want to point out, people get confused sometimes, so I want to do this one more time. I wasn't saying who I thought. Right. Should be the starting picture. I was saying why they picked who they picked. And you're right. They would have gotten roasted for not starting Strasbourg in that situation, particularly

after Strasbourg came in and was so dominant in relief. So dominant. So you had the evidence right in front of you to see. So, yeah, and I don't think, I mean, right now, you know, the starting rotation is really up in the air chaotic. but I think we're past the idea that Max will be the guy in this postseason. I just think they're going to give the ball to Strasbourg as much as they can. Yeah, that would be a major mistake right now based on what we've seen recently.

Strasbourg should be the starter before Max takes the ball in a start in this series. I don't know if – I think it's going to be tomorrow night, don't you? Probably. It probably will. I mean, I think so. I think it will be. I mean, you know, Dave Martinez was hedging his bets, but he says he could do it if he had to. So I think it'll be Strasbourg.

Do you think if they win tonight, that that changes the way he thinks about tomorrow night? No, I don't think so. I don't think so. But I think if you win tonight, again, in a five-game series, if you win tonight on the road, you're in the driver's seat. I mean, look, and you've got Corbyn going, who's pitched pretty well against the Dodgers tonight. I mean, five-game series, game one is so important, but I don't think it changes.

Because either you're pitching Strasbourg in game two to put the Dodgers away two-nothing in the series, or you're desperate enough to pitch Strasbourg in game two to make sure you come away with a split on the road. other reason to start Strasbourg in game, too, is that you certainly could get him back by a Wednesday night, fifth and deciding game to be the starter in that one, too. You know, if you wait until Sunday, he's not starting on Wednesday. If you pitch him on Friday, he can start on Wednesday, if need be, in a fifth and deciding game. Back to Tuesday night for a moment. I didn't go to the game. I've been to a lot of those Game 5 disasters. Maybe I should just stay away on bad luck. I said yesterday on the show that

There's nothing better as a fan than that electric, you know, raucous, loud environment. You know, it's so cool to be a part of. And the other night was so special. But the reason it was so special, and I've been to so many of these games like you have, whether any sport, you know, football, basketball, baseball, there's nothing better and nothing that creates a better reaction and a more, you know, emotional and visceral and loud reaction. then when you come from behind at home, when you think it's all over, you know, at three to one or three to nothing,

and then you come back and, you know, the late portions of the game to take the lead, that's when a place gets so super loud and nut so as that place was the other night. What was it like to be there? Oh, it was, you know, the Jason Worth home run was a moment that, like, where the stadium just all of a sudden exploded. You know, in that, in that 8th, as the bases were loaded, you know, were loaded at that point, the anticipation was pretty high. And with Soto at the plate, before he ever took a swing, the place was going nuts at that point. Just anticipating what could happen.

But as a fan, I remember the, and I wasn't at the stadium, but just remember how you could hear it through the TV, the Mets game six. comeback in, you know, in 86 against the Red So it was a comeback. They got like three in the bottom of the 10th or whatever. Yeah, I mean, so that's, you're right, absolutely. The comeback is, is what, what really fires up the crowd. And that crowd was as fired up as any I've heard at Nationals Park. It was a great, crazy night. Yeah, that's awesome. But for, but, but, but for, for about eight innings, again, it was, it was kind of like a game, a game, a game, without a pulse. Yeah. Yeah, well, I mean, because three minutes into it, at 8.11 p.m., it was two to nothing.

And it was, you know, we spent a lot of time talking about, you know, the details of the game the other night, and we'll look forward more here on the podcast. But it was a very interesting game strategically, starting with the fact that Milwaukee decided their best chance was to go away from its personality of taking a lot of pitches and trying to generate a lot of walks by swinging early on Max Scherzer, and it worked out. It totally worked out. And that was an interesting thing as well. All right, what about this series? You were there yesterday.

You're out there. You're going to be here for the first two games. The Dodgers, I just had Dave Shinen on the radio show. I like Dave a lot, by the way. And he said there's just a ton of pressure on these Dodgers. that their lack of winning a World Series with teams that were capable of doing it. They haven't won it since 1988, that there's a lot of pressure and they're feeling the pressure. And this is the first Nat's team.

I don't know if there was a lot of pressure on them against the Cardinals, even though they were the number one seed in 2012. It was their first postseason visit, but that they are sort of, you know, right now without a lot of pressure, without a lot of expectation. What do you think? I think that's pretty accurate. The Dodgers have won 7th Street Division Series. They won two National League pennants in the past two years.

Then to the World Series twice. And this is a town where championships matter. I mean, L.A. I mean, I'm not saying it's a front-running town, but it is a competitive, crazy sports. market here. And the Dodgers have managed to probably claw their way back to the top of that sports market after, you know, 10 or 12 years ago, when the McCorts owned the team and they fell on the disarray. I mean, they drew almost 4 million fans this year at Dodgers

Stadium. But, yeah, I'd say I'd agree with Dave that the pressure is on them, not to go out, at least in the first round, in a division series, to a team that literally has no bullpen. Again, no bullpen. Yeah, which you'll have to use it too in a series where you didn't really have to expose it in a one-game wild card. Yeah, I mean, you're going to see pitchers who are going to make you cover your eyes for the Washington Nationals. And you've got to hope that two things, that their starters go deep enough where that's minimal, and two, that the offense, like they did the other night, you know, in a close game, can still break out in a late inning and overcome any bullpen things.

In other words, they're going to have to bang their way, I think. Starting pitching and offensive hitting is the way and just the bullpen. it's just going to be real interesting. The pressure is on the Dodgers. Did anybody talk to Davy after the game or yesterday? Sean Doolittle, it was made very clear, I think, Tuesday night, that Daniel Hudson is his closer. Because you had a lefty leading off the top of the 9th,

and you could have gone Doolittle just against the lefty if you had wanted to and then brought in Hudson. But he brought in Hudson no matter who was, you know, due up in the brewers lineup. We learned that definitively on Tuesday night, that Hudson's going to be the closer, right? I don't know. I don't know if that's the case.

I think they brought in Hudson because Hudson was up. I mean, they expected Hudson. They knew who was going to lead off the 9th. Why didn't he get Doolittle up? Well, because, I mean, when Hudson was up, they were down three to one. Oh, you're saying that he was up in the 8th. I see what you're saying.

before the rally that gave him the leave. I got it. And so he would have pitched, you know, he would have pitched, you know, he would have pitched, you know, basically they were pitcher from behind at that point. He was the guy who was up. I see what you're saying. That makes, you know what? That makes total sense.

I forgot about when Hudson got up. They didn't have the lead. They weren't thinking about a closing situation in the top of the ninth at that point. Makes total sense. But that still may be, you know, it still may work out the way you're saying. Right. because Doolittle is the only left-hander they've got in the bullpen. Yeah.

So, you know, and they're going to need him maybe in situational moments late in the game. So they may be reluctant to use him as the closer because they'll need that left-handed match-up situation maybe sometime. This will be so interesting. There are a lot of people, first of all, I don't know if you know this, the Nats are a pretty big underdog in this series. I just looked up the latest numbers on the sites that I use. I got the Dodgers at minus 220, Aaron and minus 225. I mean, Vegas is not giving the Nats anywhere near the chance that a lot of the analysts and experts are, because I think a lot of the analysts and experts believe that the winner of this series is going to the World Series,

and that the Nats are the best opponent and the most likely opponent to beat the Dodgers of the other three. national league teams. But, man, Vegas doesn't agree with that. What do you make of it? I agree with Vegas. The doctors are really good. They want 106 games. They can match up with the Nats starting rotation.

They can match up with the Nats offense throughout their lineup. And unlike the Nationals, they do have a bullpen. It hasn't been without its own problems, but not to the massive extent that the nationals have. A lot of things will have to go Washington's way for them to beat the Dodgers in a five-game series. And the Dodgers, not that it matters that much, you know, they have the home field advantage, too. So all that combines 106 wins this year. You know, I would have to agree with Vegas that what you're going to have to have with the Nationals

is what happened in that eighth inning in the wild card game. everything that usually happens to Washington, it's going to have to happen to the opponent. Right. Which, by the way, has happened to them at times themselves over the last, you know, over the last 31 years, you know, between the time that Kirk Gibson hit the game one leadoff to beat the A's and the game one walkoff to beat the A's the last time they won a World Series.

I actually, I don't know, Aaron, I don't know. Aaron, I don't know about you. I just play underdogs in the postseason because you're getting great value, and it's a coin flip in these baseball series more times than not. You know, I looked this up yesterday. The Dodgers lost in the second half of the season three out of five games three times in the second half of the season. You know, some of those three out of five losses included games like against the Marlins, you know? Like it just happens. Like the best teams lose three out of five. That's why. in these baseball playoffs, I don't know why you'd ever bet a favorite personally. But anyway.

I mean, this is why a five-game series is so much more of a craft shoot than a seven-game series. Yeah. This is why I think if the nationals had ever gotten to a seven-game series in any of these times, that they might have fared much better. And like people said to me, like Tuesday night, who's going to win? I said it's one game. They could be playing the Marlins tonight. Yeah, we talked about that the other day.

I mean, just so, you know, the Dodgers have lost four out of seven. twice in the second half of the season. You know, against a stretch of not great teams like the Diamondbacks and the Padres. So it just happens. Like, whatever. I mean, I'm interested in this series because, first of all, it's cool that they're playing the Dodgers

again in the postseason. I like that. But the starting pitching, I mean, you've got stars in this series. You've got Strauss. This is what I wrote, this is what I wrote for today's webcam. Okay. I mean, and I illustrated it by pointing out

that this is, as a side story, you've got this battle of MVP chance going on. Rendon and Bellinger. Yeah, they do the same thing at Dodgers Stadium that they do at Nationals Park whenever Bellinger comes up. And that, in a way, illustrates the star power in this series. I mean, this is the best baseball has to offer right now this five-game series. Right. And no doubt.

I mean, you've got a potential Cy Young winner, unless you think it's DeGrom, in Ryu, who's not even starting game one. They're going with Bueller, who clearly what that says is that they want Bueller for game five. They think he's their true shutdown guy, because he's the one that would be scheduled to pitch twice. I don't know, if they named their game two starters at Rieu or Kershaw? They have not yet, I don't think. But you've got, you know, the Bellinger-Rendon thing, as you mentioned. You've got all the star pitchers.

Yeah, it's really, this is probably the matchup in terms of the most stars in one series of the four division series. Absolutely, absolutely. It'll be good. And you could read my column in the washington times.com, click on sports. I haven't seen this one that you, did you just finish? No, it got posted last night. It's on today's web. All right.

Here it is. I'm on your webpage. I just liked it. I just gave you a big heart and liked it. I can't retweet it during the day because I'm required to retweet other stuff, but I can retweet your column late at night, which I've done many times when you ask me to, which I like doing because I love reading your columns. I'm going to read this one as well.

I wanted to get, so, all right, are we done with Nats Dodgers? By the way, I'm going to pick the Nats in four. I don't know why I think the Dodgers are a choke franchise. guys. They just can't get it done. They're going to come up short, and I think it's going to be in this first series. So I'm going to bet them at plus 185, Aaron, or whatever it is for the series. So I'm going to pick the Nats and four. You're picking the Dodgers in how many games? I'm picking the Dodgers in five games. In five games. Okay.

Again, I just don't see how you can get by with – look, I think they have a better chance. Again, in a five-game series, I just don't see how you can get by without that bullpen. I mean, since the bullpen seems to be so important in postseason baseball. Understood. A quick word about MyBooky.ag. If you want to bet the Nats as a prohibitive underdog in this series, go to MyBooky.orgy. They've got every sort of proposition bet, series game, obviously with football, straight bets, teasers, parlays, halftime lines, in-game action. They've got it all.

I've mentioned this to you many times in the past. for those of you that don't have a place to wager and you want to, first of all, tread lightly, because gambling's not for everybody, but if you want to bet on games, you need to do it with a group and with a site that's reliable, because there are a lot of them out there that aren't. Mybooky.ag is where you bet is very much important and sometimes as important as who or what you're betting on. You want reliability and you want fast payouts with solid fair point spreads. And you get that with my bookie.ag. Now, if you use my code, they will double your first deposit.

Go to my bookie.orgie.orgie today. Enter my promo code, Kevin D.C., that's K-Ev-I-N, D.C. It'll activate the offer and it'll double your first deposit. That's Kevin D.C. after you go to my bookie.ag. You play, you win, you get paid. We'll get to the Redskins shortly and what Jay Gruden said yesterday

because it certainly would appear that we are headed towards a Colt-Livero start on Sunday against the Patriots. But I wanted to ask you about something because I talked about it on the radio show this morning and I didn't see all of this stuff until late yesterday about Tony Kornhizer's comments

about the front page of the sports section in the post yesterday. So let me catch everybody up to speed. The post yesterday, the print edition front page of its sports section, if you didn't see it, they put the Mystics Game 2 lost to Connecticut at the very top of the sports section's top page, front page, with the headline, Deladon Hurt as Sun draws even. Now, for those of you that don't know what that means, that's about the Mystic's best player.

Elena Deladon, she was the league MVP. The Sun is the Connecticut Sun. That's the team that the Mystics are right now playing in the WNBA finals. I'm being specific about that because I think there are a lot of people that actually don't know what's going on in the WNBA finals. But the Mystics are a really good team. The series is dead even at one game apiece. And they played game two on Tuesday night, same night that the Nats were playing the Brewers in the wild card game. And on Wednesday morning, the Post put the Mystics Connecticut game at the top or above the fold. That's what they call it, right Tommy? Above the bold. And for the rest of the front page of the sports section, and probably two-thirds, the remaining two-thirds of that front page was the Nats game, where they had the headline Juan for the money, as in Juan for Juan Soto and his big hit. So Tony had a problem with the choice that I guess the editors make. Tommy, is that the editors? that make these decisions? Yes, they do.

Okay, so on his podcast yesterday, he said, it's insane that the Washington Post stripped that Mystics game across the top. The Nats got the bigger play, and he's saying that they got more of that front page, but you've got to be kidding me. And he said, I mean, you've got to be kidding me. You know, he just didn't think that the mystics deserve that. By the way, he drew a ton of criticism for those comments. including a comment from a reporter at the post, her name is Ava Wallace.

I don't know what she writes. But she responded on Twitter saying, imagine watching the Nats win. This is in response to Tony's response. Imagine watching the Nats win and feeling those beautiful feelings and seeing that giant happy picture on the front page and then thinking, you know what's soured this? The presence of women.

How utterly pathetic is what Ava Wallace, she's a reporter for the post, I think. what she tweeted out. I know Tony pretty well. I can guarantee you that Ava completely missed the point. It had nothing to do with women. It had to do with which one of these two teams deserve the above-the-fold headline positioning. He would have felt the same way had D.C. United been above the fold versus the Nats off of the wild card win being in that spot. In my view, Tommy, he's 100% right. Now, I don't understand the inner workings of this, and this is why I'm going to rely on you to help me here. But from the perspective of being a reader, being a post subscriber, I still get the post delivered.

Now, I don't always read the print edition. I read the online edition probably more. But I love Sunday mornings with my Washington Post sports section, and I get the New York Times delivered on Sunday as well, with coffee and breakfast and a bagel. I like that. I like the print edition. I still get USA Today's Friday edition, because I'm. I like the sports section in USA Today, and I like to spread it out, even though it's been reduced to like two and a half pages. But my perspective is from what my expectations of the post would be.

And that may be, by the way, at complete odds with what makes better business sense, what makes better editorial sense. I don't know. But I would have thought that, well, it's not what I would think. I know that there is a significantly bigger audience for the next. Nats Wild Card game than for the Mystics WNBA championship game. I promise you that there is no chance that the number of people interested in that Mystics game isn't a tiny fraction of the number of people interested in the Nats Brewers game. So I ask you, was that a mistake?

I don't know if it was a mistake. It wouldn't have been, again, it's a judgment call, so I don't think it's a mistake. I mean, Dan Steinberg tweeted something. I thought that was pretty accurate. What did he tweet? I didn't read it. Well, basically, he said, you know, if they made these judgments solely on who would read the stories, then they'd run Dallas Cowboys stories and car crashes in the paper, and that would be it.

I mean, if you made decisions based on, you know, how many clicks used the online term, but how many eyeballs you get to a story, you know, you're on cowboy stories. Okay, well, that's one piece of this. Like, if you're just in it to draw eyeballs, okay, that's a good answer. But from an editorial standpoint, from an editorial standpoint, I mean, do you really come to the conclusion that the mystics get top billing over the Nats winning a wild card game? No. No, no, you know. Okay.

But, again, it's not. I don't know if there's a right or wrong. It's a judgment call in something like this. Look, I have led the parade against the idea that we have some kind of obligation to cover women's sports because it's the right thing to do. I mean, I've let that. I mean, basically, this is a business. This is not a nonprofit, you know, operation. and, you know, so I'm all, I understand what Tony's saying, and I agree with him to some extent.

There can't be any debate that it's not even close, that what the more significant story is to your readership are the nationals over the mystics, but I don't have as big a problem with the placement as he does. I don't think it's insane, I think. And part of what's going on here is I know what I know what editors think. particularly editors at the post. And they have an agenda that comes through. I've seen it with Olympic coverage. I've seen it before with other coverage.

You know, it's just, I mean, they have a certain feeling that they have some kind of greater duty here in terms. And it makes them look good among their other editors in the business at the New York. York Times and the LA Times, which is all they really compete with in terms of that. So there's a lot going on here. I don't think it's insane. I think it was the wrong decision. But again, it's a judgment call. Aaron, what did you want to say?

I was saying I don't know if it was as much as an editorial decision to put it at top as it was a design decision. With the way they laid that out, and especially with that weird ad across the bottom, which, by the way, I find more offensive than anything. What was the ad? There's like the bottom inch or so was just a big ad across the bottom and took up some space. But the way that they did with like kind of three quarters of it on the Nats and then just kind of that top thing, it seems like the post, especially the post in general, when they have a layout like that, they put the one smaller story up top and then the rest of the page is the one big story.

So I feel like it's almost a design decision more than an editorial decision. Yeah, that may be right. That may be right. And by the way, ads on the front pages of sections, that's only something that's happened in the last 10 or 12 years or so, maybe longer. But, I mean, for years, you would never put an ad on the front page of the sports section. But now, I mean, I'm surprised they don't put them on the front page, period.

I think you would have been, I think you may have been okay with the insane description, had it been like a FIFA qualifier that they put up there. been soccer. You probably would have been more upset. I don't know. I mean, here's the bottom line in this day and age. I don't really care because I don't use the print edition as the primary way. I don't use the post-sport section as a way to really get news anymore. I mean, it's too outdated and even online, with all due respect, because I like a lot of the columnists. I love Barry. I love Dave Shinen. I love Sally. You know, and I like many of their columnists. But, I don't, the Post doesn't break stories. You know, their beat reporters really don't break a lot of

stories when it comes to the teams that I care about. You get more of that from, you know, some of the bloggers and some of the people on Sports Talk Radio or some of the people, you know, that are, you know, beat reporters for Sports Talk radio stations or in town than you do from the Post. But I do like the columns, but I didn't see it before the radio show and before the podcast yesterday, but afterwards I looked at it, and if I'd seen that first thing in the morning, I would have been surprised at that, very surprised. I understand the reaction completely. I mean, it's the, the mystics, Tommy, the game nationally on television did a 0.36 rating nationally. That's barely even a number that registers. I have no idea what it did locally. I don't think they'll release

that number. The Nats game, by the way, because you know, I love this stuff, did an 8.8 local rating on TBS the other night, which actually isn't that, it's lower than I would have thought it would have been. Yeah, same with me. Now, it's TBS. It's TBS. It's not network. You know, there is, you know, a cable versus network. I don't know, I'm not a ratings expert, so I don't know if that's a huge difference anymore. I know it's some difference because there are people in homes without cable television.

so they couldn't see the game on TBS. They would have been able to see the game had it been on Fox as an example. Actually, there's a lot more people now without cable television than there have been and maybe in the past 10 years. People are core cutting. Yeah, they're getting it from all those other places. But anyway, the Nats as a comparison, for Game 5 against the Cardinals in 2012, did a 16.7, did a 10.3 in game five against the Dodgers in 2016.

I couldn't find the Cubs number, but if my memory serves me correctly, it was like a 14 or a 15 in game 5 against the Cubs. So I am surprised that it was in 8.8. I would have thought it would have been a little bit higher. Yeah, no one I. Yeah, but by the way, just also as another sort of, as an aside, you know, I've talked a lot about how,

and we've done this together, about how, you know, the Redskins fan base has been eroding, how the television ratings are awful. And, you know, when I did this this morning, a couple of people tweeted me and said, you know, well, you know, how about the Redskins ratings? Look, when we've ripped the Redskins television ratings, that's in comparison to what the Redskins used to do, not in comparison to what other teams in town do.

Because as bad as the Redskins are, as dysfunctional as they are, as much as their fan base has eroded, they are still by far and away the kings of sports television in this market. The game against the Giants on Sunday, which was a super low, near all-time low rating for the Redskins for a regular season game. And by the way, a bad game that was over early. It still did a 12.3. You know, the Nats playoff game did an 8.8.

So it's still, you know, significantly higher. than anything else. By the way, that 12.3, we didn't talk about this the other day, that 12.3 is what they, seven, eight years ago would do for a preseason game. It's really remarkable. Yeah, exactly. Remarkable. The third preseason, the fourth preseason game. Yeah, I mean, it is so remarkable how far they've fallen, but for those that then will, by extension, will say, well, why do you talk so much Redskins on the podcast, or why do you talk so much Redskins on the radio show. Well, because it's still, by far and away, the thing that appeals to the majority, the significant majority in this city, despite how bad they are.

It's not just the Redskins. It's the NFL. It's the NFL, too. In most cities, I'd be better off. This is the way it operates. To Dan's point, we'd be better off talking about the Cowboys on a daily basis if we were looking for the largest. audience potential, even in this city, then talking about a couple of the other teams, which I just will leave out of the conversation for now. Yes. Steinberg and I have had that discussion for years. What paper would have the guts to start covering the cowboys on a regular basis?

Well, you know, I swear to you, I have, remember we did a couple of times we did, we jokingly did like Ravens at one or Cowboys at One, you know, a couple of those years. I do think, I mean, the Cowboys ratings-wise, television ratings-wise, have now, you know, and the Ravens, too, have outdrawn the Redskins late and regular seasons a couple of times the last few years. You know, people, I'm talking head-to-head, like one o'clock, one o'clock, I know, 425, 425. So I have thought about, with respect to the radio station, which, you know, we've been the rights-holding Redskins, I don't even want to call it a partner because it's been far from a true partnership, as you know, but we've been their flagship. We've been their rights holder in the market

carrying their games for years. And I wonder, you know, if this continues to spiral downward, if it wouldn't be better business carrying cowboy games or Ravens games, I'm serious. No, I would never, if I were the owner of the station or the program director, I would never suggest that. But I bet you that if you really got into it and delved into the deep, granular detail from a business standpoint, could make more sense. Now, I don't know if it makes more sense

from an advertising standpoint, because there are still advertisers locally that want to be affiliated with the Redskins. Obviously. And the Redskins product. But it may not do ratings-wise as well, especially late in the season. But, you know, I've loved being a part of the station that's been the Redskins rights holder and broadcast affiliate

because I got to be a part of that Redskins network for years, and it was a lot of fun. All right. Let's get to the Redskins right after I thank Mama Lucia for bringing in lunch today. They brought in lasagna. It's excellent. You're missing it, Tommy. You're missing it. I'm not going to put it in the refrigerator and save it for you.

Tuesday when you're back here, it's too long. But we'll ask them to bring this to you next week. But Mamaluchi is awesome. They take good care of us. They bring us food every Thursday. Their pizzas are great. They've got locations all over town. I go to the location in Bethesda on Elm Street.

They've got a location in Blair Park Shopping Center in Silver Spring. They've got one out in Rockville Pike. Locations all over town. Hillcrest Heights, Fairfax City Mall, et cetera. So check out. out Mamma Luci is great Italian, casual Italian for pizza, pasta, and more. All right, let's get to the Redskins. Jay Gruden spoke yesterday after practice, Tommy. I know you've probably only read the cuts. We'll play some of them. But let me just tell you, you'll hear it in his voice, sarcastic,

tired, frustrated with, you know, the media and the questions, and probably frustrated with a lot more. was Jay Gruden on whether or not he's ready to name a starting quarterback. This was yesterday afternoon. I said, I'm not going to name one right now. We have three, actually. Yeah, but I said, I'm not going to name one right now. It's too early in a week. You know, Kay's still in a boot right now. And obviously, Colt, I got to see what he can do as far as getting a little bit more reps on his and his repertoire and Duane as well. Repetoire. I love that. By the way, real quickly, Colt McCoy was not on the injury list yesterday. So Case Keenham was, Colt McCoy wasn't.

This was Jay Gruden in talking about just the decision process on the starting quarterback. I have to see some things for me to make the decision, and that'll come out here at practice tomorrow, really. Hopefully, after tomorrow's practice, I'll have a good indication who I'm going to play. So, yeah, in my mind, I have a pretty good plan. Contrary to believe. contrary to belief on the plan. So a little bit of sarcasm there.

And he says he's got a plan. And I think by the time some of you listen to this podcast, he may have already announced Colt McCoy is the starting quarterback Sunday against the Patriots. Here's a bigger macro answer as to the quarterback position and the lack of what he says is the lack of consistency since he's been here at the quarterback position. Listen to this one. Well, it is the most important.

position in pro sports without a doubt you would love to have some continuity there some consistency there unfortunately we have not had that luxury here in a while and until we get that luxury until we start to have that it's probably when you'll see some different results but i feel good about all three quarterbacks i'll bring something different to the table we just got to settle on one and get them ready to go and when that guy gets his opportunity they have to take advantage of it and dominate the position and never look back you know i want to just mention real quickly because I've got one more soundbite to play for you, which is more Dwayne Haskins specific, but he had consistency at that position from 2015 to 2017. Now, you can say fairly

that because of the contract situation, that it just was too much in flux as to whether or not he was going to be the long-term guy there. But he was the starter for three years, and he was a good fit for Jay Gruden's West Coast offense. You know, you've got to read defenses, you've got to know where to go with the ball, you've got to get it out quickly, and Kirk was a good fit for Jay Gruden. And by the way, Jay Gruden would admit that. That's one thing that Jay Gruden would admit. There may be things about Kirk he didn't like, like the fact that Kirk, you know, when Sean left and the team made the offer they made, had probably, you know, moved on. And I don't think he loved Kirk's backbone, you know, his but he was a good fit, hence the seven franchise passing records he set with Jay Gruden

on a team that wasn't that good, you know, the terrible defensive team, certainly in 2015 and 2016, and anyway, they had a chance to have some consistency at that position. That was my point. But didn't Jay Gruden tell Patriot reporters on a conference call that when, about what's his plan? for quarterback that he had no plan? Yeah, he was a little bit contradictory there. Okay. So when people say that, they're not making that up. He said that.

Yeah, I think he did say that. I didn't listen to the... Coaches do a conference call with the opponent's reporters. You know, Belichick did it with the Washington reporters on Tuesday. Man, was he complimentary of the Red Soxins. He was so funny.

That was so... He must have been... laughing is at all. I know. And Gruden does, you know, did the same with the New England, you know, beat reporters yesterday. Here's the last soundbite from Gruden that I wanted to play. He talks about Dwayne Haskins and, you know, how you handle a guy like this and that there are multiple ways of handling, you know, a rookie quarterback. I don't think so that's first year. You know, I think, you know, different quarterbacks, you know, throughout the history of the NFL, There's guys that are more ready to play early, and there are guys that may need a year or two.

It's really dependent on the player. It should not hinder his development, whether he gets thrown out there and doesn't perform him up to speed, or whether he sits for a year and learns his system and continues to see how to prepare. You know, it's not the end of the world. If he doesn't play another snap, if he starts every game and doesn't do very well, it's a good experience for him. So you can argue both sides of the coin right here, no matter what we do with him, we're going to be wrong, so it doesn't really matter.

So my view is I got to do what's best for him and what's best for this football team and what I think is best. And we'll decide that here shortly. All right. So I'm going to tell you how I responded this morning and I'm going to do the same here on the podcast and then let you have your piece. First of all, he's clearly frustrated. He's hearing the criticism. The Lewis Riddick thing, I think, blew up in a big way. He's hearing that.

I don't think that Jay Gruden's sabotaging Dwayne Haskins. It's not the way I feel. I don't think that he, you know, that he reeks of an agenda. We know that the football people did not have Dwayne Haskins rated at 15 or higher, but the owner did. So the owner made the pick. It upset the football people. There's no doubt.

I do not think, however, that Jay Gruden stuck Dwayne Haskins out there on Sunday to say, Dan, you picked him, guess what? He sucks, and you're going to see it right now. And put him out there without much preparation or before he was ready. I don't think Jay's doing that with Dwayne Haskins. It's not what I think he's up to here, because I have heard multiple times that unlike Griffin, where everybody couldn't stand Griffin, the adults anyway, the adults in the room, however few of them there were, coaching staff, etc, got to the point where Griffin was so off-putting.

Jay Gruden did that interview with Albert Breer on NFL.com where he threw him under the bus like no coaches ever. thrown a player under the bus in 2014. I've not heard that that's the case with Dwayne. In fact, I've heard the opposite, that he's a really good kid and everybody likes him. You know, Jay may think that he is a long-term project and that he's got a long way to go, but I don't think Jay in the moment the other day with, by the way, Haskins being the only other quarterback that was dressed or could dress the other day, being the backup, putting him in the game after Keenham had missed two long bombs to a wide open Trey Quinn. I don't personally, I didn't view that as sabotage. What I think Jay Gruden wants right now is he wants one last shot with the guy over the last

couple of years anyway that he thinks gives him the best chance to win. I think Tommy he was in many ways giddy going into that Dallas Thanksgiving Day game last year after Alex Smith had gotten hurt four days previously against the Texans. Obviously it was a gruesome injury and nobody wished any of that on Alex Smith. But I think Jay Gruden believed that the offense was going to take off with Colt McCoy. And if you go back and watch that Dallas game, it was much different offensively. Now, he threw some back-back breaking picks in the second half, but they moved the ball at a better pace through the air than they had really with Alex Smith. But again, Colt got injured like he always does, and he didn't get to realize his dream, which was Colt McCoy

leading the Redskins to the playoffs and eventually the Super Bowl. Our dream. Our dream. Well, I would have been so into that. I didn't care who did it. But I think that he's at that point where he realizes his days are numbered. And by the way, whether it's at the end of the year or it's Monday or two weeks from now, he knows he's done. I just think he wants another shot to at least be competitive offensively.

And he believes Colts the guy to give. him that chance. Now, I don't know that he thinks he's going to beat the Patriots, but he certainly believes that Colt McCoy gives him the best chance to be a competitive offensive team, and he wants to see it one more time and have one more shot at it with Colt. That's what I think he wants right now. And I don't think he's not thinking about Dwayne Haskins' future. I just think right now, he's like, how at 0 and 4 do we even have a chance against the Patriots on offense? The only guy that gives us a chance right now is Colt. You know, I agree with you to some extent.

I don't think there was any agenda for Jay putting Dwayne Haskins in the game, like you pointed out. He was the backup quarterback. I mean, if you're not going to put him, if you can't put him in a game, you don't dress them. So, I mean, I don't buy the Lewis Riddick thing. But I think, I think, again, we don't know anything about what Jay's thinking. I think it's possible he could feel, and no matter how good a kid, Dwayne Haskin supposedly is, again, there are forces at work, just like there were forces at work with Griffin, that are around the kid, that are above the kid, that are going to create problems for the kid.

And I think Jay Gruden probably has some resentment, and that particularly after the Lewis Riddick report, thinking that, You know, I mean, this kid has people who are out to get me. I think Jay probably has some resentment with this, with the Dwayne Haskins movement. Yeah. I can see what you're saying. With the Riddick stuff, it sounded like it was coming from somewhere and not just Louis Riddick. Yeah.

And I think, I think Jay is a guy who easily resent. things. I mean, probably takes it very personally and easily resents it. So I think he's got some resentment. That's not necessarily against Dwayne personally, but against this whole notion that he's got to play. And I think he's only going to stick his heels in deeper since he has nothing to lose, but you know, against that. So he's not setting him up, but I think

he thinks he's there, he is not going to let Lewis Riddick or anyone connected with Haskins and Haskins tell him what to do with his quarterback. And I think he's going to dig his heels in on that. You know, I wish the follow-up question to his comments on Haskins where he lays out, you know, sort of the two paths, right? You know, you can sit and learn or you can play and get the, you know, the direct experience and learn too. You know, he suggested that, you know, both of those things can work. I think the follow-up question to that is, well, which of those two do you think best works for Dwayne?

I mean, I think we all know that you can play and get experience or maybe you can sit and somehow learn something, but which is better for Dwayne? Because I do think it would be, you know, you'd learn something from the answer. Look, the bottom line is, and I've mentioned this a million times, over the last 10 years, there have been 24 quarterbacks picked in the top half of the first round of the draft. 20 of them have started their first game before a week five of their rookie year. The other four are Patrick Mahomes, we know that, Christian Ponder, Jake Locker, and so far, Dwayne Haskins, unless he starts Sunday, which I don't think either one of us thinks he will. So the trend here has been for coaches and organizations to determine that it's better that their young guy drafted in the top half of the first round gets experience on the job. rather than experience in the classroom.

So, I mean, I know that you can perhaps grow and get better somehow, but most teams now decide, no, we want to put our guy out there. We want them to learn through experience. And by the way, with Locker and Ponder, perhaps the reason they didn't start by week five and barely played in their rookie seasons is because they stunk, because it turned out they really couldn't play and weren't very good. Neither one of them is in football now. And with Mahomes, we know the Mahomes thing.

The Chiefs started 6-0, and I personally believe that if Mahomes had played his rookie year, maybe the Chiefs would have won a few playoff games rather than getting eliminated in the first round. But that follow-up question wasn't asked. The other thing, too, for me, Tommy, is this. I think Colt McCoy's going to start. I want Dwayne Haskins to start. Absent of the following, hearing the following, which you would never hear publicly. absent of hearing, Kevin, the guy's not putting in the work, the guy's not getting any better, the guy's a major long-term project, if we put him on the field, we can't operate a professional offense. We can't evaluate other people offensively. Not to mention the fact he's going to get himself hurt. And I don't think that they would tell me that. I haven't heard that. I don't think they would say it to you. I don't think they would say it to us.

Now, it doesn't mean that they don't think he's a project, but there's got to be something that Jay Gruden can put out there for Dwayne Haskins to get him live bullet real-game experience over these last three-quarters of the season. There are so many things that can be done with these young quarterbacks. You cut the playbook in half. You know, if reading defenses and getting them in the right protection schemes are so important, they can go with nothing but hot routes. They can move away from Max Protect

and have him throw hot on every throw so he's not literally reading out. Is it cover one? Is it cover two? Is it cover three? There are lots of things that Jay Gruden could do to make him more comfortable and to get him playing time the rest of the way. That's my big problem with this.

Again, if somebody called me up after hearing me say this on radio or hearing me say this on the podcast, from the organization in Sakev off the record. Look, he can't do it. I mean, plus he's not putting in the work. He's not here early, leaving late. He's not putting in all the work.

He's not getting it. He can't function. He's a great kid, but he can't function right now. He's a year away minimum. Unless I heard that, I want him to play. Okay, I'll try to Look, here's Here's a problem that I'm encountering.

You know, I forget my thoughts In between the time you start talking At the time that you're done. You better start writing them down. That's what I do when you're talking. I'm going to have to start writing them down. That's what I do. When you're talking, I write them down.

Look, Aaron, look at all my notes As I'm writing down when Tommy's talking because I won't forget. You've got to have a pad and paper. pen and paper in front of you. Because trust me, you drone on and on too occasionally. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay.

All the quarterbacks that you brought up before, I think this is a difference. There weren't three choices there to be made. There's three choices for Jay Gruden with the Redskins. In other words, if there was no Case Keenum or if there was no Col McCoy, this would be a lot easier. But, I mean, most of the quarterbacks that you brought

up. Like the quarterbacks are usually thrown into play. The coaches don't usually have three choices. There's two choices. So I think that complicates everything. Now, the other thing is, if Jay Gruden starts him against the Patriots, is his agenda to damage the kid? Or if Jay Gruden doesn't start him against Haskins against the Patriots, is his agenda to hold him back? You'll hear people make both cases. You'll hear people say, well, if he starts him against the Patriots, he's putting them out there to get killed.

He's put, like Lewis Riddick said, he's putting them out there to fail. You know, so I mean, I don't know, I mean, Jay can't win. If he starts him, he's gotten an agenda, if he doesn't start him, he has an agenda. And this is drive, and that, and that, and nothing, you know, the kid may have nothing to do

but driving that narrative. But people around him do. And that's what's pissing Jay Gruden off. That makes a lot of sense to me. The whole, you know, he's pissed off because, you know, in that last comment, you know, he's going to be wrong either way is sensitive to the criticism, which, by the way, what you're saying, he probably thinks are coming from people that are close to the kid. And probably people in it.

in his own building. Yeah, and maybe even people in his own building. And for him, he's like, look, I've been a coach forever. I've coached quarterbacks forever. I know what I'm doing. I know how to handle these situations. And he's probably very frustrated. And by the way, I think your point, and I wrote this one down as you were going on and on, I wrote down the three choices thing, because I actually think that's a really good point. I would just say to you what I said to you in the summer, I'd get rid of the third choice, so it's not a temptation. Like, this was a mistake to have a third choice. Yes.

I mean, there's no debate. There's no argument. You know, it's either one guy or the other. And, I mean, the three choices, particularly one of those choices being Cole McCoy, you know, that piece of candy that Jay Gruden can't ignore, complicates everything. Yeah. All right.

Well, you're not going to be here or be back on the show, until Tuesday. Answer this question. Do you think Colt McCoy will be the starter Sunday? Oh, yes. All right. Absolutely. I absolutely do.

And I can't believe I'm not going to be there for it. Oh, yeah. I can't believe I won't be there for it. It'll be funny because if he survives the game, which, by the way, will get odds on tomorrow as to whether or not he'll actually take every snap in the game, he'll be looking for you in the press conference afterwards. I know. Where's my dad?

Where's Tommy? You know, I forget if we did this together on Tuesday, but can you imagine if he starts Colt McCoy, and McCoy puts up a 290-yard, three touchdown, no-pick day, they score 31, and they're in a game late with a chance to beat the Patriots. Oh, yeah, we talked about this. And we talked about how unbelievable that, I mean, the most unbelievable part is I would miss that. I mean, you know, even, I mean, but, but we both know that that's, you know, like, you know, not all fairy tales.

And it with happy endings. And this one's not going to end with a happy ending for cult, unfortunately. What if Sunday, the Nats win, the Redskins win, and the Mystics win? How do the Washington Times and Washington Post handle their front page? Well, the Redskins are clearly inside on page two. That's the obvious thing. If they beat the Patriots. I'm kidding.

I'm kidding. Which one of them would be on the front page of the paper? Not just the front page of the sports section. If the Redskins beat the Patriots, they're on page one. What if the Nats eliminate the Dodgers Sunday night, and they win the series? Then they're on page one. And then what does the sports section look like? Well, then I don't know.

That's the post-sports section. I don't care about their sports section. Why would I care about their sports? I don't know. I don't know. All right. What else do you have? The Caps won last night.

I actually watched a lot of the game. You know what? I mean, I love Joe B and Locker. They're awesome. It's such a great pairing, and it has been for so long, just like Buck and Phil were. And I enjoy watching them, and you know I don't watch a lot of regular season hockey. But last night, I was watching because, you know, St. Louis had the banner hanging thing from their Stanley Cup. It was a year later from when the Caps did it, you know, last year for their season opener. And I watched a lot of the game.

I mean, the American League game jumped out real quickly with Diaz hitting that home run in the first and then hitting home run in the third, and that game was over early, almost like Milwaukee was over early, except Tampa never made a run back. But I watched it, and I, first of all, and I was saying this to Aaron, and I know you don't care about this stuff, Tommy. The NBC family of networks do such a good job with hockey. It's just perfect, and Doc Emrick is just so awesome to listen to Call the Game. But anyway, they got an overtime win. They got an overtime win. from Verona to win the game. That's all I have on that game. Ovechkin, in watching the game, it seemed to me that the caps dominated the blues, but they went to overtime and won the game

anyway. A lot of people picking the caps, Tommy, to be, you know, a deep into the postseason, if not a Stanley Cup winner. Well. Okay, that's it on that. I mean, come on. I mean, what am I supposed to say? I know. And they went out in the first round. You know, you want to break down their third line? No. They went out in the first round last year when everyone thought they were good to dominate. You know, I mean, so don't talk to me about the Caps. By the way, you'll love this, and I'm going to find it real quickly.

I got one of those tweets from one of those people that didn't like that I said that I'm not a big Caps fan, which I don't know if I said it with you on Tuesday or yesterday on the podcast. Yeah, you did. No, you said it with me on Tuesday. Yeah, I mean, I've said it a million times. Of the four teams, that's the one that I don't have a lot of passion for. I'm not a big hockey guy, and I've just never been a huge Caps fan. Like, I don't sit there and live and die on everything.

So anyway, I'm looking for it, and I can't find it. But basically, I got one of those tweets that said, I heard what you said about the Caps. If you're going to care so little and you're not going to root for the Caps, I'm not going to listen to your show anymore, one of those. Oh, my gosh. I hope you reach out to that person and smooth that over. I did. I basically said, I'm not going to, you know, I'm not, it's, it's, look, you don't have a

rooting interest in any of the local teams. There are other, there are other talk show hosts. I know one on your station that is a 49ers fan, not a Redskins fan. And I, and we've had that at our station before. That's not why people, I mean, I think it is a benefit personally in local sports talk radio to be a fan of the teams and to really have an understanding of the teams, you know, and I am. I do have an understanding of the teams, and I root for every other team very passionately, but for whatever reason, I've just never been a big hockey fan. I love playoff hockey,

but basically I just said, look, I'm not going to fake emotional investment in a team that I don't have it for. You know, they're a good team. I love playoff hockey. I just don't have the same feeling when they lose or win that I do for other teams. And, you know, whatever. He got upset. He said it rubbed him the wrong way. I'm sorry about that. But that's the way I feel. I did watch the game last night, however, and I am amazed by Ovechkin, who at 34 years old and counted out pretty much before the Stanley Cup finals and the Stanley Cup winning season, has probably played some of his best hockey the last two seasons. And it looks like, you know, based on last night,

he may be in line for another great year. He's an all-time great D.C. athlete, right? He's very close to being Mount Rushmore as an all-time D.C. athlete. Oh, I think he is on Mount Rushmore. I mean, he's not the greatest athlete in the history of the town, but he's among the – I think he is a Mount Rushmore, and he is one of the greatest hockey players, certainly of his time. Who is the Mount Rushmore of just athletes, take coaches out of the equation?

Are you going to give me Sammy Ball and Walter Johnson? Yes, yes. Oh, Jesus. How can you not? Sammy Ball, there's no Washington Redskins without Sammy Ball. He won two NFL championships in every list of great NFL players. He's in the top 10, every list. Okay.

And Walter Johnson's only the greatest right-hander. the history of major league baseball pitchers. So you're going to leave them off because they didn't happen before you were born. You know, since you were born before she and they don't count. Well, that's your thing. Before Sheen doesn't count. Okay, fine. Then let's do.

So if it's Sammy Ball, Walter Johnson, and Alex Ovechkin, then we can just, right now, a very quick debate, who would be the fourth and final one on that Mount Rushmore? That's a tough one. that's a bit of a tough It's got to be a player from one of the pro teams Yeah I get that I understand that And it's got to be one of the four major teams

Okay you can't give me Johann Croyfe No I mean look People would say Rigo I think I think people might say Rigo People might say Daryl Green I think people might say Daryl Green There's another one that I

They immediately popped into my head And that is, it's Elvin Hayes. I don't think anyone's going to buy an Elvin. I don't care whether anybody else buys into it. I'm telling you what I think. Elvin Hayes is the greatest NBA player in the history of this city. I get that. But your Mount Rushmore is a pebble if you put Elvin Hayes on.

Okay, so, but just you would put him ahead of John Wall, Gilbert, Arenas, and Wes Unseld, wouldn't you? In terms of the greatest... No, I wouldn't put ahead him on West Unseld. West Unseld won an MVP and a rookie... In Baltimore. In Baltimore. Okay. Okay. In Baltimore.

Yeah. I wouldn't put him ahead of West. Okay. So when you do your Baltimore Mount Rushmore, you can put Wes Unsold on there with Cal Ripkin and Johnny Unitas. And I'm sure I can come up with the fourth here if you give me some time. Eddie Murray. But I... Yeah, Rigo and probably... Darrell Green because Darrell Green was probably a better all-time great at his position.

No, they're both equal. Green and Riggo are probably equal. And I know I've mentioned this to you previously. I'm always fascinated why Ken Houston doesn't get his due as one of the all-time great Redskins. He is consistently, when you see the list of the greatest safeties in NFL history, he's in the top five. And there's no other player in Redskins history other than Sammy Baugh that you can say that about.

No, you're right. Absolutely. And I think he played 12 years in the NFL, seven of which were with the Redskins. Yeah, five in Houston. Yeah, he doesn't get his due, absolutely. Yeah. But he's not on Mount Rushmore. Right.

You know what? You're on my route, Mount Rushmore of Radio Sports. No, I'm not. No, I'm not. But you are on my Mount Rushmore of columnists. You are. and sports talk hosts. Yes, you are.

All right, real quickly before we run today. I do have a smell test pick tonight. Tommy, I think I've told you this. Maybe I didn't the other day. The smell test is on a bit of a heater. 38 and 1 over the last three weeks. It's in all... Yeah, it's all time.

I was 12 and 3 last week. 9 and 0, 2 weeks ago, 9, 5, and 1 in between. so that's 38 and 1 over the last 3 weeks, 36, 15 and 1 for the season. So I am helping people pay some bills and a lot more. I like Seattle tonight laying the point in a half at home against the Rams. I don't like, in Aaron, I don't know if you feel the same way. I don't like these Thursday night games. I think they're very unpredictable when it comes to betting them.

But there's a lot of public action on the Rams, and there's super sharp action from what I was told. old late last night on the Seahawks. And it sort of goes hand in hand with what I've been thinking. I pick Seattle to win the division. And I thought the Rams might have a step back year, maybe a playoff year, but not as good as last year. And I think we've seen some chinks in the Rams armor. You know, last week definitely. Tampa Bay, by the way, Tommy, just as a quick aside, oh my God, we didn't do NFL power rankings today. We haven't done NFL power rankings. Cue up the intro. And we're not going to.

Yes, we are. We're not going to. No, I'm not doing it. Why? I'm not doing it. Because I don't feel like doing it. Do you know how hard it is to do this week? I'm not doing it.

Get prepared right now. You're going to do it. I'm not doing it. I'm making you do it. I'm not doing it. Yes, you are. You're going to do it. No, I'm not.

All right, fine. You don't have to do it. I was just going to tell you that I think, you know, after New England and Kansas City, It actually gets very hard this week. It's not as obvious as it's been because the Rams got beat 55 to 40 last week by Tampa Bay. And what I was going to say before, you know, we basically excused ourselves from doing NFL power rankings today is that the buccaneers right now are a Vegas favorite. I mean, the Vegas odds makers love themselves some Tampa Bay Buccaneers. their numbers and futures, their line this week at New Orleans is three.

It's super short. You saw it opened at 5.5.6 and it's down to 3 and a half 3. Yeah. Well, I think that's a couple of weeks ago opening number. No, I'm pretty sure that was Sunday's number. There's no way we had a 9-point move from Sunday. Not 9.3 point move. 5.5.6 to 3 and a half 6 to 3.

Oh, that's right. New Orleans was 6 down to 3. Okay. It's my fault. Yes, so, yeah, that's very possible. I've seen Aaron on some of these sites. They've had some lines from a couple of weeks ago that they've indicated was the opening line. I only want to look at the Sunday, you know, the late Sunday night opening line to see where the movement is, not from a few weeks ago. But anyway, Vegas loves Tampa.

And the Buccaneers, they got some talent. They've got a coach offensively. They've got a defensive coach in Bowls. They go to New Orleans. Your next Washington Redskins head coach, I predict. Yeah, I predicted that too. Thanks for listening to the show. Did you see an offshore?

I think I had that before you. I don't think you did. This is... I think I did. I think you got it for me, but that's okay. You can't remember anything. You've got to write it down. You're off my Mount Rushmoreland.

Good. I don't want to be on yours. Speaking of that, an offshore bull. put up a list for Redskins coach week one of next year. The favorite is a Tampa Bay coach, but it's not Todd Bowles. I know, I know. It's Byron Leftwich. Oh, wow. Interesting.

Yeah. There's not a lot of lists out there that have Bulls on it. Yeah. I, well, the reason I said it and you grabbed onto it and ran with it is because Joe, because Joe Gibbs likes Todd Bowles a lot. And I think we both believe that Dan's got one place to turn when he gets rid of everybody, hopefully, and that's Coach Joe. He just doesn't have many people that he can rely on or go to for a group. You do realize this is not true.

I do realize what? I've been talking about Todd Bowles as the next head coach for a while now. I've been talking about Todd Bowles as the next head coach when he was coaching the Jets. I was talking about Todd Bowles as the defensive coordinator, as a great defensive coordinator and a guy I've loved for, I don't know, four years now, and you definitely, you grabbed onto that trend, which is fine. You do that a lot, right? And I sometimes take some of your ideas. It's okay. I was talking about Todd Bowles at the next head coach when he was still playing for the Redskins. I was talking about Todd Bowles as the next Redskins head coach when they drafted Todd Bowles back in 1986 or whatever year it was. All right, I'm done with you. Anyway, Seattle is a smell test minus one and a half tonight. I'm pretty sure the smell test is going to crash and burn this week, Aaron.

You know why? Because I love the board, and that is probably a kiss of death, the kiss of death for the weekend. But stay tuned tomorrow or tune in tomorrow because I'll have my complete smell test for the weekend. Seattle tonight minus the one and a half. By the way, I'd lean South Alabama as well against Georgia, Georgia Southern. that's not an official smell test pick. Tommy, thank you. Appreciate it. Enjoy tonight. Enjoy tomorrow night. And I will talk. Maybe I'll read your column that you just wrote and everybody read Tommy's columns. Follow them on Twitter and you can link right to the columns from there. But we'll talk together on the show on Tuesday, but I'm sure I'll talk to you before then.

All right, boss. Take care. If you're listening to us on iTunes or Apple Podcasts, rate us, review us. Also subscribe. That helps. It doesn't cost you a thing. And remind people that we'll. like to listen to the podcast that they can listen to it on the Kevin Sheehan Show.com. Also, just a reminder, I'm back on radio on ESPN 980, not ESPN 980, the team 980, all right, which by the way, we're also on FM right now, 99.5, which is an FM signal that some of you will get perfectly, and some of you won't, but I'm on 7 to 10 a.m. In the morning.

Have a great day. Enjoy the Nats game tonight.